ByKat Hours Updated
Comments 210 Comments

Holiday Weekend Open Thread

This post may contain affiliate links and Corporette® may earn commissions for purchases made through links in this post. As an Amazon Associate, I earn from qualifying purchases.

plush neck and shoulder heating pad with space for a cord

Something on your mind? Chat about it here.

It must have been a few years ago now that I last searched for a neck and shoulder heating pad for myself, because the fact that this one comes with a cord is very exciting.

I have yet to find a microwavable heating pad or pack (of any kind, but especially the ones for the neck!) that gets to a satisfactory temperature and then stays there long enough for relief — but I love all of my plug-in heating pads.

This neck and shoulder heating pad caught my eye in Nordstrom's big Black Friday sale because it's 50% off and looks great. (Doing an Amazon search, I see that this is a fairly common product at this point, but I still feel better buying electronics with heating elements from a more reliable retailer.)

The heating pad was $69.99, but is marked down to $34.99 in the sale.

Psst: Happy Thanksgiving! We'll continue to update sales, probably with a big roundup on Black Friday itself — stay tuned!

Sales of note for 4/17:

  • Nordstrom – Beauty savings event, up to 25% off – nice price on Black Honey
  • Ann Taylor – Cyber Spring! 50% off everything + free shipping
  • Boden – 25% off everything (thru Sun, then 15% off)
  • Brooklinen – 25% off sitewide — we have and love these sateen sheets
  • Evereve – 1000+ items on sale, including lots from Alex Mill, Michael Stars, Sanctuary, Rails, Xirena, and Z-Supply
  • Express – $29 dresses
  • J.Crew – 30% off all dresses
  • J.Crew Factory – Up to 60% off everything, and extra 50% off clearance
  • Lands' End – 50% off full price styles and 60% off all clearance and sale – lots of ponte dresses come down under $25, and this packable raincoat in gingham is too cute
  • Loft – Friends & Family event, 50% off entire purchase + free shipping
  • Macy's – 25% off already reduced prices + 15% off beauty & fragrance
  • M.M.LaFleur – Spring Sale Event – Buy More, save more! 10% off $250+, 15% off $500+, 20% off $750+, 25% off $1000+ (Try code CORPORETTE15 for 15% off if you find any exclusions.)
  • Sephora – Spring sale! 20%, 15%, or 10% off depending on your membership tier; ends 4/20. Here's everything I recommend in the sale!
  • Talbots – Spring sale! 40% off + extra 15% off all markdowns
  • TOCCIN – Use code CORPORETTE15 for 15% off!
  • Vivrelle – Looking to own less stuff but still try trends? Use code CORPORETTE for a free month, and borrow high-end designer clothes and bags!

210 Comments

  1. Thanksgiving drama thread! Who is judging whom, who is going on unhinged political rants, who isn’t doing their fair share of the childcare, who is practicing questionable food safety? Let off steam here on a collapsible thread and save your best self for your family.

    1. I took the nieces to the park, but ultimately they aren’t my kids so no more childcare for me.

    2. Because of a bunch of reasons, it’s just me and my mom having Tday alone tomorrow. No sweat.

      Mom is a near-horder – nothing is dirty, everything is clean, but there are stacks of things along every wall, in every chair, on every surface. It chokes me, but doesn’t bother her. In the midst of all this, Mom has decided that she wants to polish all her silver trays and silverware for tomorrow. They’ve been sitting in the sink for 3 days now. It’s now Tday eve, I’m the one who has to cook tomorrow, and I’ve been BEGGING her for the last 3 hours to please either clean the silver or put it away out of the kitchen until after Tday. We don’t need silver – it’s just the two of us! Just please, please clean up one little spot of the insane mess that is this house. She’s on her phone and says she’ll get to it. I’m getting gray hairs – I can feel them turning.

    3. Now for my own response: my very, very fake SIL has decided to turn on the charm aimed at me and I don’t know why. She either wants a freebie of some sort or is doing a one-woman family closeness performance art piece. I’ve been burned by her too many times to take her enthusiasm at face value.

    4. My in-laws always have the worst food safety practices – they let bean stews sit on the stove for days, and used to let one of their cats live in a kitchen cabinet (and several were allowed on the counters). The main cats died recently and it was the first time I haven’t gotten violently ill while visiting in a while.

      1. My in laws have NO cleaning supplies for the kitchen counters. Just water and a very very dirty rag. They are mystified I insist on using a plate or foil instead of plopping food on the counter where raw meat was sitting moments ago.

    5. We’re going to friendsgiving with our on-again-off-again-relationship friends. Apparently, there was A LOT of drama last week with them, but we were both battling a cold, so we didn’t see them or hear much more than “there’s drama”. I have no idea who else is attending this friendsgiving, but it’s usually quite an eclectic crew, so I imagine there will be all sorts of little dramatic moments throughout the dinner.

      One person in the couple is very into therapy and self-help, so they’re constantly doing the “I feel”, “I hear you and I validate your feelings” language, while the other person tends to be more closed off and conflict avoidant. Depending on where they’re at in their drama, they will either be using all the therapy speak, forcing affection (holding hands, hugging, etc. but at an odd time, like trying to wash dishes while maintaining physical touch), or actively avoiding each other.

    6. Too funny! I am heading to a house full of free range dogs. Last Thanksgiving I thought they would all be let out into the fenced yard to play. No, they formed a pack and started running laps through the house. Working dogs and retrievers. This year I’m recovering from surgery and am worried about not being able to keep my feet.

    7. I don’t know if this rises to sufficient levels of drama. We’re moving overseas in January, and I heard my husband telling his dad on the phone that he should just hold on to his bday gift until we are on the same continent, and can see each other, and also that we don’t want to amass extra things to ship right now. Guess what is currently stuck in the post due to some kind of tariff snafu… People will be peopling.

    8. FIL and MIL missed multiple panicked calls from coddled SIL who lives up the street. When they made contact, FIL agreed to immediately send SIL $5k. No one will explain why she is so desperate the day before Thanksgiving.

    9. We’re at mostly lovely in-laws who have a spoiled late-teen daughter who insists, with her parents’ backup, to not sharing the upstairs bathroom. There are 7 guests, and none of us can use it; we all have to share the two other bathrooms in the house.

      1. This actually seems entirely normal to me – I grew up in a very upstairs = private, downstairs = public house. Plus I’m hosting ten folks w two bathrooms today. But I’m guessing she’s spoiled in other ways and that’s what you’re reacting to.

        1. We have guests use the downstairs bathroom too (eg today, 7 dinner guests) but if they’re staying overnight (which it sounds like these ones are?) then yeah my kids need to share the upstairs bathroom with the guests!

        2. We grew up with the master bathroom being private to the owners of the house, but no kids would be able to declare an upstairs guest bathroom off limits to overnight guests. I’d go so far as to say that would be unheard of.

        3. I think it’s weird not to let overnight guests use the upstairs bathrooms. But if they’re just there for dinner I agree with you.

      2. Two other options seem to mitigate this as a real issue.

        But honestly, a spoiled teen who doesn’t want to share her bathroom? Sounds like a facility no one would really want to be stuck using.

        1. Right — it’s not a “real” issue. It’s a family drama/irritation of mine.

      3. OP here. There are other upstairs bathrooms, so that’s not the issue, and this is about overnight family guests, not a just during dinner thing. This is a jack-and-jill bathroom. Late-teens girl staying in her connected room on one side; my two kids (14 & 11) staying in the connected room the other side. My kids have to use the other bathroom down the hall with their grandparents (who are also guests) rather than the jack-and-jill bathroom, because she doesn’t want to share the space.

        My take (and yes to the person who intuited that she’s really spoiled in other ways): a kid can and should share a bathroom with their cousins for two nights. And parents should expect/teach their kids to be good hosts as well as good guests. She’s neither, and her parents make her very, very comfortable no matter at who’s expense.

        1. You’re not looking good here. A teen can have a private bathroom and isn’t obligated to share with your kids.

          1. Agreed. Jack and Jills are particularly hard to share with guests, since it’s easy to accidentally leave one side locked if both doors are being used. Very reasonable for her privacy for her to lock the guest room side of the bathroom and just treat it as if the door doesn’t exist.

            I think it’s very reasonable for the hosting family to say the hall bathroom is for all the guests, and all the residents of the home retain privacy in their own bathrooms – presumably no one thinks it’s strange that the homeowners aren’t opening up their primary bath for guest use!

          2. Op here. I totally disagree. The idea that a teen can’t share a bathroom with her cousins who have traveled to spend two nights there is the definition of spoiled.

            As far as me “not looking good” — this isn’t about my kids being special. This is about what you do when family comes to visit. No one is getting kicked out of a bedroom or being made to relocate. It’s letting a cousin shower or pee in the middle of the night in a bathroom that isn’t a private master bath (and isn’t private at all, actually).

          3. Just saying that you have no idea whether she is dealing with any of the various reasons a teen girl really doesn’t want to share a bathroom that leads into her room—eating disorders, self harm, sexual trauma, just to name a few, or less dramatically, a stash of birth control pills and lingerie she doesn’t want her little cousins finding. Assuming it’s “the definition of spoiled” reflects a lack of imagination on your end.

            (And before you say “I would know”, the whole point is that you wouldn’t.)

          4. This is nonsense. A teen pays no bills and needs to learn to share when her family is hosting people. She has no “rights” to private space.

    10. I’m currently shopping for flatware and am fascinated by the novelty flatware out there even from the highest quality manufacturers like Liberty (e.g. the owl set). So I have a follow up question about whether anyone served or was served with relevantly or irrelevantly themed flatware this year, or if you have favorites for window shopping!

    11. My BIL and I never got along (much more my fault than his) but we discovered a mutual dislike of my aunt. So our holiday will be spent bonding by politely and passively aggressively dissing her while my sister and mother (the sister of said aunt) look on and try not to laugh.

      And before anyone jumps on me: (1) she is too arrogant to realize what we are doing and (2) as an example of why we cannot stand her, she made nasty remarks about my sister’s weight when she was two months postpartum. The vicious old witch deserves it.

      1. Sorry, but it sounds arrogant if you think she doesn’t know what you’re doing.

        1. You have not met her. Her certainty that she is always right and confidence that she is universally admired is endless.

          And if she does know what we are doing and does not like it, she can either make other plans or stop making nasty remarks about how my sister’s husband is going to leave her if she lets herself go since she married so much better than anyone ever imagined was possible and/or stop talking about what a failure I am because I am not as professionally successful as my BIL or personally successful as my sister, who at least managed to find a husband and have babies (as terribly parented as those babies are).

          1. Congrats on being well on your way to being just as vile as you think she is.

    12. Very thankful my husband has taught me to laugh at my MAHA hypocrite mom bc otherwise I would think I’m the crazy one.

      She always drives from 6 hours away and brings her own food, soap, everything with her bc our stuff has toxins. She doesn’t believe in expiration dates or food safety, so this morning I almost retched as she ate eggs that were clearly rotten. I eat eggs every day and have never smelled this.

      We’re also treated to constant santimony about her health and what’s good/bad for you. She proudly says she doesn’t drink anything besides water anymore for health reasons but has had several glasses of wine or scotch the past two nights. Then on our way home from a turkey trot this morning when DH and I wanted to stop for coffee, she insisted on getting Dunkin Donuts for herself. I’m sure those are toxin free and as healthy as the expired eggs you transported 6 hours in your car.

      Oh, and I also should be consulting her before buying anything for my daughter bc she’s taken care of most of what she’d want to play with or wear already 🙄.

    13. My MIL is probably taking the wrong amounts of her medications at the wrong times to manufacture health crises/declines and upset her adult children. We had to move Thanksgiving to a different house last minute since she was ill (probably for the best but lots of last-minute chances) and I am just OVER the whole scenario.

      2. Oof this sounds dangerous! People die from medicine mixups— unintentional ones or muchausen syndrome. Get her some help!

        1. She’s considered competent under state law (as far as I know) and her spouse is her greatest enabler because he excuses all of her medical noncompliance. There’s not a lot that can be done.

  2. My family never celebrated holidays growing up. As a result, I don’t have the craving or habit to get together with them or others on specific dates. (All born and raised in the U.S., it is not a religious practice, simply never a “thing” for us.) I recently moved to the Midwest. Everyone asks about holiday plans and my vague replies or attempts to say “it’ll be great!” are always met with follow up questions. When folks discover that I am not “going home” or hosting anyone (or have any special plans at all) for Thanksgiving, Christmas, or New Year’s, they seem genuinely alarmed. I have assured them that I will enjoy quiet time on my own, but today I have received half a dozen pleas to join folks at their own homes/family homes for thanksgiving. I am appreciative but genuinely am happy to be alone. Is there a kind way to decline these invites without lying about my plans? I am expecting the same to happen next month so any advice appreciated!

    2. I understand that it may not be a tradition for you and that you enjoy quiet time (so do I), but if I were you, I’d consider accepting an invitation. There are 363 other days in the year for quiet time and it can be very, very fulfilling and loneliness-preventing to get together on Thanksgiving and Christmas. That’s why people are alarmed. Of course, if you truly want to stick to your plan, you should, but consider it’s what you want or what you’re telling yourself you want.

      1. I am big into saying YES to new things and seeing how it goes. As we age, I feel like you can’t have enough random non-family local connections to other humans. You never know where things lead (and that can be confirming that this isn’t your thing).

      2. Yep, this! Take people up on the offer, it’s just a theme party. Go have fun connecting with other people and do them a favor by being someone different there to mix up the scene.

      3. Late reply so OP might not read this, but: post-COVID, I promised myself to try and say “yes” whenever I/my family get/s invited to a life event. 60th birthday dinner for my mentor whom my spouse doesn’t know that well? Yes, we went. Out of town wedding for a grad school friend? Yes, we went. I have *never* regretted this policy. I would say holidays can (CAN — do not always) qualify as a life event. Just something to consider that maybe saying “yes” to hospitality might turn out to be something lovely and fun.

    3. “Our family tradition is to actually spend the day enjoying peace and quiet and curled up with a good book. I’ve already got my new read picked out and a favorite beverage and can’t wait to dive in. What’s your favorite part of the holiday?” Fib about the book part if it’s not true – it sounds better than doomscrolling.

      But yes, this internet poster is alarmed, too.

      1. I was thinking something similar. Even if you don’t celebrate the holiday, do you get time off? If so, I’d tell colleagues something special that you are looking forward to. Could be that book, or crafting, or cooking a fun or special recipe, or going on a hike or outing. As long as you convey that you have something, anything planned that you look forward to, at some point over the break. Or maybe you have to work?

      2. This is a thing in Iceland (and other Nordic countries?) “Christmas book flood.” My parents and I did it one year when my husband and kids were out of town and it was awesome.

      3. I wouldn’t do this, since it’s both a lie and kind of confrontational? Better to pick one or the other.

    4. Can you just say “my family doesn’t celebrate Thanksgiving [or Christmas]”?
      People may assume it’s cultural or religious but that’s ok. Its not quite the same but I’m Jewish so I often tell people I don’t celebrate Christmas and 99% of people just accept that statement ant face value and don’t try to discuss further.

    5. Lie. My situation is similar and I’m lying. It makes a great social lubricant in this case and hurts absolutely no one.

    6. This reminded me of my MIL who genuinely is aghast that “some people just want to sit at home in pajamas all day – on Christmas!!” Ummm like I would do if I didn’t have to rush up here for some turkey and gross 1950s side dishes?

      Seriously, to me Christmas should be a slow morning with my kids and spouse to lounge and enjoy our presents, then gathering with other at like 3pm for an evening dinner. To my in-laws it’s waking up at dawn, rushing through presents, and gathering as a family at noon.

      1. Lol I thought this was on the drama thread, hence my snark. My ILs are truly lovely people…but we have fundamentally different ideas of a “fun holiday”

    7. I fellow traveler. I am the same for various reasons. I am much happier enjoying a quiet day off by myself than being an NPC in others’ holiday extravaganza. This time of year is when I most miss my awesome former coworker who also happened to be Jehovah’s Witness.

    9. Take someone up on their invitation this year. View it like a cultural experience from another culture.
      Since you said it’s not for religious reasons and your grew up in the U.S., I have so many questions…you don’t have to answer but in the spirit of Thanksgiving drama: WHY didn’t you ever celebrate any of those major major holidays? did your parents not socialize? It’s pretty unusual for two families (your moms and dads) to both not celebrate any of those holidays.

      1. In my family, severe mental illness and poverty were a reason holidays weren’t celebrated. Probably things that many on this board cannot wrap their minds around. These are not usually things that you would want to talk about with friends/co-workers/random folks.

        So I guess you lie OP. Or as others suggested, just talk about what you are looking forward to doing for your extra time off.

        1. I always hate the suggestions to ‘just lie’ like my brain is not that creative, I need to either tell the truth or pre-script, improv is not a skill I have.

          1. Clearly we are not telling the OP to learn how to improv lie for all circumstance. This is a well defined problem that she seems unable to navigate. So we are giving her options.

            “I’ll be spending time with friends”.

    10. I understand people encouraging you to join them, but “alarmed”, as repeated here, seems extreme.

      1. Agreed. Maybe it’s because I live in a very diverse place and know MANY who don’t celebrate either holiday, but being “alarmed” about this seems really dramatic.

    11. I’m in the minority I guess, but I don’t think it’s weird or worrisome and I say just keep doing you. I love Thanksgiving but kind of wish we didn’t celebrate because it’s an amazing time of year for travel deal to foreign countries, since most Americans are home with their families instead of flying to Europe. So fwiw if you have any interest in foreign travel, that’s a great time to go.

      1. My kids had a week off of school for Thanksgiving (my fave holiday) this year and we said eff it and went to Europe! I did not miss the actual day at all. Family was super understanding. Just a nudge that you can jet off somewhere if you want to!

    12. If they don’t accept your vague replies, you are under no obligaton to humour their nosiness by being honest. You are under no obligation to accept an invitation that you feel is about them wanting to do a good deed and include “that poor OP”. It’s okay to do what you want with your time.

      It’s also okay to accept, if you think you might enjoy it, from whatever perspective. Friendsgiving is a thing, and some of them might have more of that mindset and want to include you because they’re thinking of you in those terms.

      You do have special plans, though, the plan is indulging yourself! But it’s okay to lie, if you want. Having a phone call with aunt Nora can be “visiting with family” or family plans, if you want. You can talk about something you *do* enjoy, like your favorite holiday is pumpkin season, or something.

    13. My go to in this situation has been just to tell people thank you but I’m already avoiding my own family drama.

      1. Don’t do this. It makes you look unstable and is awkward for the other person who might have been trying to be kind. It’s needlessly attention seeking. Do you really want people asking or wondering why your home life is a mess (especially if not true)? A simple “I’m really looking forward to having a low key day at home” or catching a movie or whatever else true or fabricated is fine.

          1. Needlessly introducing half stories of drama into casual conversation with strangers isn’t human. It’s seeking attention. Don’t be the person mysteriously asking for thoughts and prayers.

          2. Eh, it’s all in the delivery. Many people can make this just funny and pull it off.

    14. I completely understand being genuinely happy to be alone, and please ignore all the other posters telling you to take people up on their invites to their homes for the holidays. It’s okay to be an introvert! It’s okay to love your own company! I have loved ones I spend the holidays with, but part of me wishes there were multiverses so somewhere, I could just wander the streets of NYC alone in a crowd on the holiday.

      What to say – rather than “I’ll be alone,” as a couple others said, focus on what you will do, if anything. “I’m looking forward to having some time to dig into X new Netflix show” “I’m planning on ordering in some really delicious takeout.” “I have a nice bottle of wine I’m looking forward to enjoying.” Whatever – and then quickly pivot back to them: “But it sounds like you’ve got quite a gathering planned! What are you most excited about?”

  3. Recent events (traveling to small town, older people, etc.) have led me to think: Murder, She Wrote. How did this show ever get green-lit: older woman lead and preposterous plot (murder happens everywhere she goes; she has no known family; this could have been SO MUCH DARKER but not in the 1980s?). It seems to have endless episodes, like Law & Order, and is on repeat at the relatives. It’s not upsetting, I’ll give it that. And Angela Lansbury was a hot dish back in the day.

    2. The 70s and 80s were wild for TV. I adore the Muppet Show but how in the hell did a pitch of “A list stars, prime time variety show, but… puppets.” get green-lit?

    4. My grandma loved Murder, She Wrote; it always makes me think of her.

      Apparently the kids these days watch Columbo!

      1. I think it’s everyone’s grandma’s favorite show unless she thought Matlock was a hottie!

    6. I think this is survivor bias. A lot of strange stuff has been produced, and 40 years later, those shows that had something special endure, but many are forgotten.

    7. Actually, I think Murder, She Wrote basically answered that question in its final episode, Death by Demographics! It’s been a few years since I watched that episode, but basically, a show was getting killed off because it was put up against a show that is CLEARLY Friends and it couldn’t stand up to it.

      1. Whoops! Googled it, and actually, I’m blending together Murder Among Friends (also the final season), Death by Demographics, and maybe one more. Time for a rewatch of all the seasons!

    8. I mean, it’s genre TV, which is based on genre fiction. It was green-lit because, like genre fiction, it is endlessly repeatable and appeals to a wide audience.

      Ths idea that she “has no known family” is…such a funny thing to notice.

      1. I missed that in this comment. This person hasn’t watched the show recently! She has SO MUCH known family. Her nephew Grady is accused of murder in like four different episodes! There’s a British cousin named Emma who is an actress and a bit of a tart (also played by Angela Lansbury). There are a ton more examples but those are the two family members who recur the most.

        1. Grady was always getting into jam! Usually a girl was involved. Didn’t he marry another accountant? Will have to re-watch.

          1. Yes, the blonde one! She was in a few episodes. I’m pretty sure she got pregnant later on and they stopped having Grady get arrested, ha.

            Pleasure to meet another person with superb taste!

      2. Everyone around her dies. Explains why she doesn’t have a family (in 2025 because I watch too much Dateline). She killed them.

  4. Policy proposal: first generation immigrant students, where the mother tongue is spoken 100% at home, shouldn’t need to take a foreign language in K-12. They are already bilingual, which is more than what torturing any student for 2-3 years of basic French or Spanish will do. They’re already overwhelmed with life, don’t add foreign grammar rules they’ll never use to it.

    (Watching every one of the children in our adopted refugee family fail their foreign language classes :( )

    1. My husband was placed into beginner Spanish the moment he arrived in the U.S. and didn’t speak a word of English. It was a bit absurd all around.

    2. I would have assumed that academic and formal instruction in their non-English language would have fulfilled the requirement!

    4. Is it actually required? It’s not in my state, and a quick google search brings up a slightly out of date study saying it’s only required for high school graduation in 11 states, and many of those have an exemption for students already fluent in another language. It is required for a lot of colleges, though, which is why students are generally encouraged to take a language, but if that’s not a concern, then they don’t need to take it, or they can look into whether being fluent in another language is sufficient for your state university.

      1. And I just double checked that my state university “expects” two years of foreign language but explicitly says that, if English isn’t your first language, this isn’t necessary.

      2. Is Virginia one of those 11 states? The school is easily 1/4 international students; I can’t imagine them shoving them all through languages if it wasn’t required.

        1. VA colleges had language requirements when I went if you couldn’t place out. And placing out was academic knowledge vs just speaking. Like if you got a 5 on AP Spanish. If not, you had to take 4 semesters of something. (And also PE). Those classes were delightful but having some background from high school was also very helpful with understanding languages generally.

        2. I don’t know where you are, but in Fairfax County, you can test for language credit, which you only need for the advanced diploma, I don’t think you need it just to graduate, though I’m not in VA, so I have no idea what these different types of diplomas are. I’d look up the specifics for your school district, but I’d be shocked if there’s not a similar policy in an immigrant heavy area.

          https://www.fcps.edu/academics/student-tests-assessments/types-student-assessment/credit-by-exam-world-language

      3. Yeah, I’ve never thought of foreign language as a high school graduation requirement. It wasn’t in my high school and isn’t in my kids’ high school. It’s kind of expected for elite colleges, but if you’re bilingual you might have options to demonstrate your proficiency via test.

    5. Disagree. The only class that taught my kids grammar was foreign language classes. This is in a “good” public school in a major US city. In high school. I had much better grammar in middle school in the 1980s in a blue collar public school where most kids were first through third generation Americans and often spoke at least some mother country language at home.

      1. This is not at all responsive to the prompt. There might be some benefit to a native English speaker if you are in a bad school district (which if they don’t teach grammar, it is). But these are people learning English — they have so much more important things to learn right now.

    6. Can they get formal instruction in their non- English first language to document they meet the requirement?

      If this turns out to be an option, and you can’t find a local class, post back as I have some experience figuring out language class options.

    7. My high school had a fairly large first-generation Mexican population (we are a border state) and those kids took entry-level Spanish with the rest of us haha. It was a fairly easy A for most of them (depending on whether they were born here or in Mexico. Even if they spoke Spanish at home, they didn’t necessarily know all the grammar rules.)

    8. Following your argument, why take English at school? Language studies involve grammar, literature, and culture. And just because you speak a language doesn’t mean you can converse, read, and write to level.

      1. Of course, but this is why bilingual students need to be offered these classes in their mother tongue. It’s neglectful not to offer grammar, literature, and writing courses in the language they already know and instead substituting an introductory class in a third language.

    9. This will blow your mind….many people speak more than 2 languages. Just because you speak a language at home doesn’t mean your requirements end there.

      Outside of the U.S. and UK most people speak 2-3 languages. I think the U.S. does a better job of teaching languages compared to the UK but we really need more non English and Spanish language TV available. French TV for children is surprisingly hard to stream as it’s government owned. I have to vpn and it’s a faff.

      1. Just switch the language and subtitles in your Netflix or Disney Plus. Not every show is available but the vast majority are.

        My kids read and write 3 languages but it’s hard AF to keep them up to level in all 3 at the same time. I can’t imagine a refugee family having to deal with the kids learning a third language on top of all the cultural adjustment and residual trauma from fleeing their country of origin. It’s crazy if the requirement cannot be met by taking language classes in their first language so they can get a high level certification with all the proper grammar etc.

        And European high schools are much more divided than in the US. The 2 foreign languages requirement is generally only in the university prep public schools, not in the more practical skills focused high schools. Those generally only require English as a second language. I would be surprised if all schools in Asia, South America and Africa require all kids to learn 3 languages at school.

        1. I think 3 languages is pretty common in Asia. And my friends in South Africa have kids studying three languages – English, Afrikaans and a third one that is either an African language like Sotho or a European language like French. It’s maybe not “all schools” but it’s very widespread in a way it’s definitely not in the US.

    10. I was a first generation immigrant student and it’s been really useful to know both Spanish and my family’s language. So I’m not sure about this.

      1. Were you born in the US? If not, at what age did you learn English? I have mixed feeling about the alleged benefit of forcing kids who are already bilingual to learn a third language. But I think any alleged benefit goes out the window when they are currently just trying to learn English, which I would imagine the vast majority of refugees are.

    11. Not all children who learn a second/third language at home can also read/write it. Hence, it not fulfilling the academic requirements for a second language. (e.g. my friend who was fluent in spoken Mandarin but could not read/write; my husband who is fluent in spoken Croatian but cannot read it above a kindergarten level).

        1. That works if the language spoken at home is reasonably common in the school, enough to fill a class for writing in it. Your average US public school can’t reasonably teach eg. “Writing in Croatian” for a student who happens to speak it at home.

          1. They can and should be obliged to. Many public schools are already outsourcing any course that’s remotely advanced to online instruction, since they can’t attract teachers who are capable enough to teach advanced classes. Why is Croatian any different? I’m so tired of hearing excuses for obvious educational neglect.

    1. 100%. My DH opted for civil service and spent a year after his undergrad as a respite worker for children and adults with disabilities. He learned a lot of empathy and it was so great to have a partner who was not phased by baby puke or diapers and knew how to correctly help me in and out of the bath post surgery later in life.

      Many young people also use it to get career relevant experience like his neighbor who worked as an ambulance driver before applying to med school.

        1. Or are you European and this was compelled? We have this option in the US, too. It’s called Americorps. People can choose to do it if that’s what they desire.

          We pay our EMTs to drive ambulances, and anyone qualified can do that, too.

          1. He’s European. The point is that many people who are not civically minded and would not volunteer for Americorps are exactly the kind of people who would benefit from exposure to a broader swath of society and experiences. It’s one thing to know that it’s hard to get around a city in a wheelchair, it’s another thing to actually experience someone’s challenges with that day in and day out.

            There are hundreds of options for civil service jobs. Civil service is fully paid and they actually had the option for free therapy every week in his job in case they had trouble adjusting to the new experiences.

          2. Civil service is also fully paid here, and people can choose to do it if they want.

            Forcing people into labor they don’t want to do is against our constitution (for a good reason).

          3. Would they benefit from exposure though? Surely some people would take away the lesson that because of people who need wheelchairs, they were forced to do something they don’t want to do. Is that helpful?

            There is a LOT of forced labor in the prison system already.

            I’m not even sure about volunteer work that exposes young people to hardship. Some young people take some strange lessons from it (nothing is more important than not being poor, for one, or that some lives are just less valuable than others if QoL is poor).

        2. In Germany until about a decade ago, young men had to see a doctor at around 18 or 19. If they were not declared unfit for service, they were obliged to either do military service or they could opt to do civil service instead, like described above. So it was an either-or choice, but it wasn’t up to them to opt out.

          1. Ah yes, Germany, historically a consistently wonderful argument for letting the government decide what labor it demands from its residents.

          2. my post was not meant to be a commentary on the pros and cons of this policy, just to explain how it worked, back in the day.

    3. 😬 no. I’m a public servant, protecting the environment is my greatest passion. There is nothing that seems like worse torture to me than the military, it’s so far from my ethics I’m not sure I could survive.

    4. I shudder to imagine how quickly this would become something exploitive and profiteering in USA.

      1. The only “civil service” option under the Trump administration would be ICE.

        1. I don’t think you really believe this. Can parents not require their kids to help do dishes or laundry or prepare food? Can high schools require not that students clean chalkboards or mop floors to look after their community spaces? Usually the idea is that if the person doing chores is also benefited, then it’s just pitching in and not exploitation.

          2. OP just said compulsory service. I never heard FT job.

            I don’t see how it’s worse than compulsory K12; it’s another way to learn life skills.

          4. I didn’t see OP specify an age either. Why couldn’t this be a summer in high school?

          7. Child labor laws that do not REQUIRE children to work!

            Practically speaking, rich kids do spend their summers doing service projects because it looks good on college applications. Poor kids are taking care of younger siblings or elderly relatives, working whatever work they can find that works with their parents’ schedules, etc. Forcing “service hours” makes life no different for rich kids because they’re already doing it and makes it worse for poor kids and their families by removing choice and flexibility.

          8. The exact same argument is made about K12 education (it’s too hard on families that really need kids to pitch in at home / on the farm / in the family business / with caretaking).

            I sympathize since schools waste a lot of kids’ time and I think adolescents need more choice and flexibility in preparing for their future. But since they do waste a lot of time, I’m not sure that they couldn’t swap out some of the watered down academics for service work that would at least teach some life skills.

          9. Or they could improve the education, including by teaching services. (Even a teen who isn’t going into plumbing or electric should be able to snake a drain and change a light fixture).

    5. It would never fly here as the US system is built on poverty forcing people into military service so the wealthy don’t have to risk their children in pointless foreign wars.

      1. I would agree with you if AmeriCorps paid a living wage. Everyone I know who has done it has been subsidized by their parents during their time of service. That’s not feasible for a vast number of Americans.

    8. What a strange batch of responses. I agree with you, OP. We had a draft in the US until 1973 and arguably a lot less division than now. The idea that this would be un-American is actually not supported by most of American history. Having civil service as an option would be a good way to address people who don’t want to do military. But I think everyone benefits from having wider exposure to different people and experiences.

      1. Wait, are you arguing that the draft during the Vietnam era was a good thing?

        1. No, I am saying that we had compulsory military service for most of our history and this was not a bad thing in and of itself. A specific war may be a terrible idea, but that is an entirely different issue from whether there are benefits from everyone being required to “serve their country.”

          1. The US has not had compulsory military service for most of its history. Men have had to register for the draft, but (except for Vietnam) there hasn’t been one. Registering is very different than compulsory service.

          2. @2:06 – the US instituted a peacetime draft in 1940 shortly before it entered WW2, and had selective service for WW1 as well. In WW1, about 70% of the men who fought were conscripted, volunteers were a minority. I don’t know what you base your comment on (the civil war, maybe, where the majority were volunteers?) but for major wars in recent history this is not really accurate.

        2. My dad (who was drafted, but pre-Vietnam -sat in a tank on the border of East/West Germany) was really against an all- volunteer army. He said the surest insurance against military coups was a military made up of people that just wanted to do their four years and go back to their lives, and also that a draft army did expose you to a wide diversity of people that taught you more about the US than just staying in your bubble. He died in a VA nursing home and remained generally positive about military service even though rolling a tank probably gave him Parkinson’s.

          1. How would he have felt about arresting a daycare teacher who had overstayed her visa in front of a bunch of 2 year olds? Because that’s what forced civil service would look like today.

    9. This article seems to describe voluntary (but paid) service. What European countries have mandatory service?

      1. Finland and Greece. I do not know much about Greece but Finland requires all men to report for military service for a relatively brief time period (less than a year) and I think will allow them to serve it in stints (over the summer for example).

        One of the players for a hockey team I follow is Finnish and I recall him reporting late to training camp because he had to complete his compulsory service – which I vaguely recall he did over two successive summers.

        Also, can we at least have an intellectually honest discussion about this? I think the chance of it happening outside of wartime is essentially zero but OP is not suggesting mandatory military service as many responses suggested- only mandatory civil service. And mandatory military service is something that we have had since the founding of the Republic, albeit only for men and with the availability of non-combat roles for people with moral objections to carrying arms.

        1. Talking about compelled service needs to include an acknowledgement of what people would be compelled to do. It’s just wild to go from the regular refrain of “this administration is full of fascists!” to “let’s give this administration 1-2 years of non-negotiable manpower from every young able-bodied person in the country and see what happens!”

        2. I think it’s a lovely idea but not particularly feasible in the US, at least at this time. Also I think there’s a huge nostalgia factor – programs like the CCC or the WPA in the Great Depression were highly criticized in their time and had a relatively short life. I don’t have a particular moral objection to the draft, but I do think it should be coed and genuinely mandatory (no exceptions except for medical issues and moral objections).

        3. The United States has not had mandatory military service. Having to register for a draft is not equivalent to military service. For the vast majority of US history, men have not been forced to actively participate in the military.

          1. My father and stepfather are both of an age where they were definitely subject to mandatory military service.

            Also, I am not sure where people are getting the idea that Vietnam was the first time we had military conscription in the United States.
            The first draft in US history was the Civil War and that was repeated in both World War I and World War II.

          2. I don’t think anyone thinks Vietnam was the first draft. I think we think it is a clearly morally unconscionable one.

          3. Maybe poorly written, but it is true that very few periods of US history have had compulsory military service. For the countries that have that, it exists, regardless of whether they’re on a war time.

      2. Just searched and g00gle says Austria, Cyprus, Croatia, Estonia, Finland, Greece, Latvia, Lithuania, Denmark and Sweden says Austria, Cyprus, Croatia, Denmark (men + women), Estonia, Finland, Greece, Latvia, Lithuania, Norway, Sweden (men +women), Switzerland.

        Period of time varies a lot.

    10. absolutely let’s spread the PTSD and CTE around

      but I do wish the US still paid for college for military volunteers

      1. I mean, we already discovered that forcing spoiled teens to share a bathroom with their visiting family can cause harm, so may as well go all in and have them be of service to their country, since they won’t be made to be of service to their own families.

        1. Yes, the teen in question needs to learn to share because otherwise the two other kids in question will have to *check notes* use a bathroom that is like 20 feet further away, which is just too traumatic for them.

          Honestly, I hope that poster’s relatives recognize her in the comments so they can tell her to get a hotel next time.

          2. I think the fully grown poster who is repeatedly whining about a teenager on the internet is more insufferable than the teenager is.

  6. Can anyone recommend some nice Christmas themed/flavored tea bags where the bags are individually wrapped. I’d like to put an assortment into gift bags but many main brands don’t wrap the teabags. Thanks for any recs!

    2. Here are a few at different price points, all individually wrapped

      Whittard: https://annmarie.com/products/whittard-candy-cane-25-individually-wrapped-teabags?variant=51823353200943&country=US&currency=USD&utm_medium=product_sync&utm_source=google&utm_content=sag_organic&utm_campaign=sag_organic&srsltid=AfmBOopx9GDEEGmqkwh5eUjwcEpw3uwSGXHhLwZoYONzL9m6dMiX6_Ml2Rg
      Twinings: https://www.worldmarket.com/p/twinings-winter-tea-collection-gift-box-60-count-641173.html?ppc=true&camp=ppc%3AGoogle%3AShopping%3AOG_SEM_NB_GOOG_SHOP_PMAX_LOW_NATL_FOOD_NTEST&utm_source=google&utm_medium=cpc&utm_campaign=OG_SEM_NB_GOOG_SHOP_PMAX_LOW_NATL_FOOD_NTEST&gad_source=1&gad_campaignid=19973632558&gbraid=0AAAAADflRlTIdFa2YbR5ezK5-8bcC-foZ&gclid=EAIaIQobChMIj62pkJmTkQMV4iutBh11uCD4EAQYBCABEgL8l_D_BwE
      Tea Forte: https://teaforte.com/products/gourmet-tea-warming-joy-collection-presentation-box-153938?currency=USD&variant=45200552951997&utm_source=google&utm_medium=cpc&utm_campaign=Google%20Shopping&stkn=110ae6be8c12&tw_source=google&tw_adid=&tw_campaign=20355254062&tw_kwdid=&gad_source=1&gad_campaignid=20355254803&gbraid=0AAAAAD_XLO-S1ec5kaJVGxR1VNz9ONiSO&gclid=EAIaIQobChMIzYiuhZmTkQMVOx-tBh1hhyrDEAQYASABEgIsvfD_BwE
      Vahdam: https://www.walmart.com/ip/Christmas-Gift-Set-1×9/7093669530?wmlspartner=wlpa&selectedSellerId=101005460

    3. Twinings has a Christmas collection – you’ll generally find it in a little cardboard set up in the tea aisle. Red, green, and blue boxes. Blue’s my favorite. It’s Winter Holiday or some such. Red I think is Christmas Spirit. I don’t remember what the green is. I also could always find them at Christmas Tree Shops (RIP), so maybe try Ollie’s or similar near you.

    5. do you mean not loose tea, or tea bags that are nicely labeled individually like Tazo? that’s harder. i also wouldn’t put anything minty with other tea bags.

      Republic of Tea and Harney both, AFAIK, make their tea in individual bags but they’re not individually labeled prettily. Republic of Tea does do very small containers of tea (like 5 bags in a very thin tin) that might be doable.

  7. How are you feeling about the sales this year? I’m pretty underwhelmed and there’s nothing I feel like I have to buy. (That said, we aren’t an electronics family, so if that’s where the deals are, it’s not relevant to us.)

    1. I will not be buying much either, and there are no current sales/discounts on the item I need to replace soon (running shoes).

    2. I’m getting an iPad for 20% off and buying some needed clothing. The clothing sale isn’t anything to write home about, basically what you get every other weekend

    3. I’m looking to add a few clothes to get more in line with the business casual at my new job. I’m seeing all the pant shapes. Are flares an office style?

  8. I watched a long video the other day about why boomers are still in office and as a throwaway line he noted that every holiday season is more or less geared for boomers… I’ve been thinking about that a lot as It’s a Wonderful Life is on replay nonstop. What are newer movies or songs that feel more like a younger gen?

    (This was the video if anyone cares, lots of food for thought – Hank Green I guess)
    https://youtu.be/IwgzuSqb7ys?si=QreUhMQNhT9ekg-e

    1. Home alone with Macaulay Culkin. It’s one of a handful of movies my kids love and will watch more than once (see also Harry Potter, Jurassic Park and Paddington movies).

    3. I’m a boomer who despises It’s a Wonderful Life but my kids and nieces and nephews who range from Millennial to Gen Z all love it.

  9. Dining room furniture: where outside of Facebook marketplace can I find a good quality used dining table and chairs?

    I have a low budget of less than $500 for a kitchen/ dining table and 4 chairs. Marketplace has ikea furniture at ikea prices. I’m being picky because I have teens and they are heavy on furniture. I’d like the table to be expanding with in table storage of the leaf. The chairs need to be solid. My son is especially heavy on chairs. I will be nice furniture when they are adults but for now I’m only doing second hand and older. Current table I got from Wayfair for $800 and it’s lasted 14 months before two chairs broke down in the past week.

    I’ve messaged a bunch of people on marketplace over the past month and zero success. I think I’m just in the wrong place. I’m in north Jersey. I really don’t want to go into nyc to pick up a table but will do if I must. I have a Toyota Corolla so getting a table and 4 chairs in there is not easy.

    2. Try APTDECO dot com. Can be very hit or miss, esp. in the NYC area, because some people want basically full price for used West Elm furniture, but you can also find really good deals sometimes, especially on older solid wood styles.

      I’ve actually had good luck with some of the more basic wood pieces from IKEA ( have 4 solid wood chairs going strong after 5 years and with two kids who don’t give a —— about being gentle on furniture), but they have older classic wood sets too. Not sure what style you’re into but some decent ideas:

      https://www.aptdeco.com/catalog/furniture/tables/dining-sets?pr=%24250-500&pr=Under+%24250

    3. I would find one of those companies that does estate sales where they help pack up and sell the entire household when people go into nursing homes or die. We have dozens of them in our area and they all adverstise online about items coming up. Ethan Allen furniture for pennies on the dollar since they price everything to move.

    4. Do you have any Habitat for Humanity ReStores in your area? Honestly, I think many of the best buys there are solid wood dining sets that are not currently fashionable. I bought a solid oak table with extension leaves and 8 chairs for $150 last year, and I have seen many other great values.

    5. The requirement for in-table leaf storage is going to be extremely limiting.

      For online estate sales, try estate sales dot net and ctbids dot com.

      Check also local consignment stores as recommended.

    6. Thank you everyone for your help. I called 3 antique stores and they told me $1000+. I called charity stores and Salvation Army said they were about to take in dining tables from a place doing house clearances. Called the company doing the house clearances and they sold me the table for $137.50 including taxes. They charged me $100 for delivery and stopped by 30min later with the table and chairs. It’s solid, dented which I love so I won’t be upset when the kids destroy it and the chairs are so comfortable. It has an extension inside it to increase the size as needed.

      Thank you for your help. It’s been a tough year and I’m getting through it.

      1. Well good for you! I really thought you’d have to look forever for something older/sturdier/better with an in-table leaf.

    7. Craigslist?

      A lot of people are traveling this weekend; people may be more responsive after the long weekend.

  10. Do you send out holiday cards? What’s your style? Just a handful to close relatives? 200 to everyone whose address you have?

    My hand’s cramping as I’m addressing #40 out of 90, so I’ve got plenty more to go. It’s family, plus dear friends we love.

    1. I used to, but stopped. We sent about 30-40 cards, just family and very close friends (you must be popular if 90 people meet that threshold!). We never got many back and it seemed like fewer each year. I didn’t enjoy it and it wasn’t something my husband or kids cared about so I decided to stop and focus on making magic for them. We still take annual family photos with a professional photographer and I make albums, which the kids love to look at.

    2. Yes … if we did everyone it would be 60 ish, but we usually run out of steam, so prioritize older family members and card-sending people on the list.

    3. I think we have about 60 on our list, mostly old friends. I print the addresses on labels — or directly on envelopes — and don’t personalize our photo cards, so the risk of hand cramping is low. Some years I even use the postage machine at work if I run out of stamps (and reimburse the organization).

    4. Yes, a couple hundred. I think it’s a nice and easy way to connect with people who’ve played a special role in my life. I also use Minted, which addresses the envelopes for you.

    6. I really enjoy doing it, and send about 20. I don’t have the about-us narrative or photo, but I enjoy shopping for pretty cards from MoMA, Hallmark etc. I don’t get many in return, but it doesn’t bother me.

  11. I attend a reformer Pilates studio that opened in June. Small classes. I really like it. Works great with my job.

    I went to a 5 AM class and instructor was a no show. At 5:05 I just went home.

    She was very apologetic next time I saw her. As I am an annual member the class technically is no cost to me. Studio sent a $10 gift card a week later. I don’t know, I just felt this was very underwhelming? Like for 5 AM I feel like flowers are in order? Especially a week later? Thoughts? Studio hasn’t contacted me and owner who I know hasn’t brought it up and I suspect she is not aware. I wouldn’t rat her out bit still. I just feel a bit underwhelmed.

    1. My gym is supposed to open at 5am. It’s not unusual for it to open 10-15min later. I give them grace. It’s a low paid job despite being by ann expensive gym and they are often tired as they are typically working a second job late into the day.

      A $10 gift card is more than I would expect. I would not expect anything and be impressed with a written note offering their apologies.

    2. Yeah, I wouldn’t expect anything. Stuff happens. Most of the time, you don’t get anything even if the “stuff happening” makes the rest of the day inconvenient — especially 5 minutes (ie. I don’t expect or get a refund if the bus is 5 minutes late, or a small business has closed 5 minutes early, or the internet repairperson came 5 minutes – or 5 hours! – after their scheduled window, etc). And I wouldn’t expect them to be extra apologetic about missing a 5am class vs. an 8am class – like you said, the times work for your job, which is why they offer them, so they’re not thinking “oh, 5am is a terrible time and *extra* bad to miss”. If it happens often enough that the studio isn’t worth it to you, you stop doing business with them, but 1x in ~5 months would not be on my radar at all.

    3. I wouldn’t have expected anything. Shit happens, car breakdowns, missed alarms, traffic jams, illness, spilled coffee. Obviously the owner knows, since the gift certificates went out.

    4. I don’t find this underwhelming at all, especially since it didn’t actually cost you anything. If it I happened more than once I would have more of an issue, but 5 am is tough for cancellations – like if the instructor woke up really sick, what is she supposed to do? And not everyone wants flowers.

    6. You think FLOWERS are in order over a single no show where you only waited five minutes? Girl. This has to be rage bait, or you have insane expectations of what your time is worth.

    7. I would be surprised by the $10 and happy to get an apology. Is there nothing at all to do at the studio when there’s no class? Or were the doors locked and you were stuck out in the cold?

      I think the apology acknowledges that the no show was a mistake, and the $10 conveys that they feel particularly bad about it.

      1. Yeah the class is at 5 so the doors are supposed to be open at 4:45. There is no way to get in the building or the studio if no one shows up to open it. So it’s not like you can just go in the gym and work out yourself, you’re just stuck outside. Waiting doesn’t really work as the class won’t start late as that would interfere with the next class.

    9. I wouldn’t expect anything. The $10 was actually above and beyond since it didn’t cost you. I also would suggest meditation if it happens again—maybe think about why a minor annoyance has you fantasizing about taking away a poorly paid worker’s livelihood over one perceived misstep.

    10. Flowers? You expected flowers? Flowers are not cheap, require labor to have sent to you, and typically connote more personal and emotional circumstances than tardiness. Yes, precious. Here’s flowers to soothe the emotional torment you endured.

Comments are closed.