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Wednesday’s Workwear Report: Merino Wool Pleated Sweater Dress

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A woman wearing a long-sleeved burgundy dress with leopard print flats

Our daily workwear reports suggest one piece of work-appropriate attire in a range of prices.

A-line, office-appropriate dresses can be hard to find, but this sweater dress from Talbots is a real winner. The shape is feminine, but not constricting, and the V-neck will look lovely with lots of different accessory options.

The rich burgundy color would look fantastic with a tortoiseshell shoe or some dark brown boots when the weather gets a little chillier. 

The dress is $179-$199 at Talbots and comes in sizes XS-XL, P-XLP, and X-3X. It also comes in black.

P.S. Happy Diwali to those who celebrate!

Sales of note for 5/27/25:

248 Comments

  1. ISO black sweater (for midi skirts) – NOT wool, I can’t tolerate it, chunkier knit, oversized and cropped-ish, cheaper, size 6 in BR, M/L in Zara – anyone want to shop for me? :)

    2. Take a look at the Gap. Their cashsoft line is cotton & nylon and comes in several styles that may work for you. The turleneck has an off-white blanket stitch trim that’s really cute, and I think the boatneck would be really flattering on a lot of people.

      1. Yay! It had been awhile since I’d seen the cotton/silk blend fabric. I have an oldie but goodie cardigan in this fabric and I love it so much. Might have to get myself the blue crewneck!

    4. Quince has some. Lands End Women’s Petite Drifter Easy Fit Sweater looks promising.

  2. To be filed under things I should probably already know… I received a lump sum as the result of selling my house earlier this year. I want to max out my 401k contributions for the year using that money, is the way to do that adjusting the percentage of my contribution through the end of the year so that I contribute up to the limit? I can’t say, transfer the full amount from my savings account, it has to come from my paycheck, right?

    1. It has to come from your paycheck. Divide number of paychecks left this year by amount left to contribute. Most programs will allow you to do a set dollar amount, rather than a percentage. If you get it wrong, don’t worry. Once you max out, they won’t take any more from your paycheck.

      1. Check your corporate match rules. I once lost out because I front loaded my contribution but my employer match was monthly.

        2. Wouldn’t that matter more for front loading instead of back loading due to a windfall?

          She can’t change the match that she’s already gotten in the first ten months. The only thing she can do is to max out her 401k through the rest of the year. She might miss out on a small match by slightly overdoing it until the very last paycheck, but it’s not going to be much money.

    2. It has to come from your paycheck and make sure you know quickly how your employer processes changes in paycheck deductions if you’re trying to get this handled by the end of the year. For example, I get paid monthly, but my December paycheck is always treated as a next year paycheck when it comes to deductions for insurance, taxes, etc. (I think it technically processes on Jan 1), so I only have one more paycheck that I could change this year and any changes in retirement contributions have to be submitted by early November to go into effect. You also can’t contribute more than a certain percentage of your paycheck because of taxes and insurance, so employer rules vary on what they allow you to contribute and even if technically you should be able to contribute one entire paycheck, they may or may not actually let you do that.

      2. Your December paycheck should count for 2024 contributions, even if it hits your bank account in January. But yeah it can take awhile to change your withholdings. My employer is slow but if I changed now I’d definitely miss the November 30 paycheck.

    3. Threadjack: my employer uses fidelity for administering our 401k. I don’t see any way to set my contributions to be a fixed dollar amount each paycheck. Instead, I have to select a percentage of my pay, which means the contribution will increase if I get a mid-year raise. Anyone know how I can pick a dollar amount with fidelity?

      1. I also have Fidelity and it’s percentage based for me too. I don’t think it’s a big deal. If your salary increases mid-year, 1) you can adjust it at that time, and 2) if you don’t adjust your contributions will increase slightly, meaning you’d hit your contribution limit a bit earlier than December 31. Your employer stops contributing when you hit the IRS limit, so there’s no real downside to contributing a bit more than necessary each month. I actually like to do this, so then I get a bigger than expected paycheck in December, which helps offset all the holiday spending.

      2. It depends on your plan setup and it sounds like your plan only allows percentage election. That is the same for my plan. I just elect the percentage that is closest to the dollar amount I want to elect.

      3. If you don’t get an answer, I would call the number on their website. It should be easy for them to tell you how to do it.

  3. I’m attending a big conference next week and looking for some advice. My big boss is giving a keynote and I was invited along with the free entry. I’m not normally tapped for these and this will be my first conference of this type I’ve attended for my company. I won’t know anyone there, though I’m being hit up by vendors on LinkedIn this week looking to meet.

    Any tips to make the most of the time?

    1. This isn’t quite what you asked but wear comfortable shoes! I went to a conference recently and got blisters. Put extra bandaids in your bag in case you do too.

    2. A lot of this will depend on your industry and role, but think about what you want to get out of the conference. Are you looking to network? Do you want to learn more about how others have managed challenges your team is facing? Are you in a position, officially or unofficially, to recommend vendors for your company?

      Before leaving for a conference, I always spend time going through the schedule to prioritize presentations I want to attend, which gives me a framework for my time. I also note who the speakers are to see if there’s anyone I know or want to meet, and try to leave a gap after their session to enable a chat.

      Not knowing anyone may feel intimidating, but it’s very easy to meet people at conferences because of all the group activities. Just chat with the people near you before sessions and during meal breaks. And bring business cards if you have them, because this is 100% the place for them. If you don’t, make sure your LinkedIn is up to date and share that.

    3. Take advantage of professional development opportunities (eg, women in X dinner/cocktail hour, mentorship meet and greet), attend talks or presentations that are relevant to your current role or future career aspirations, if you’re in a sales/client facing role meet with potential clients, use the vendor hall to identify any useful services for your org.

    4. If there’s one panel on a topic where you are genuinely well-informed, ask a thoughtful, non-controversial question during Q and A — then folks can strike up conversation with you about that for the rest of the conference.

    5. Ok, so the OP says she won’t know anyone at the conference, so my best guidance is to go to the conference with the intent of meeting new people and making connections. Sessions are fine, but it’s really about the connections. I second the advice to look for small breakfasts, lunches, etc. for specific groups, and to take some of the vendors up on their offers to meet if their product could help you.

      For other folks who attend conferences and are looking to maximize their time – look at this as an opportunity for all of the folks in your industry to be in one place at one time. Is there anyone who you work with at a distance who you’d like to meet (or OP, perhaps someone you would LIKE to know)? Ask them to grab a coffee, lunch, or dinner. When I go to conferences, I first try to fill my time with meetings. There is so much benefit to breaking bread, which is why vendors are trying to meet with you. I recommend trying to do the same, but with the people YOU want to talk to. Just send them a message and say, “I see you’ll be in Houston next week, what’s your schedule like and are you free for lunch?” Then I usually look at the schedule and see if there are any talks I am interested in listening to, and kind of fill in around the meetings, but I also try to get back to my room to relax a bit. FWIW, I am an attorney who does a lot of business development, and this is my strategy, but I know it works for others too, because my husband, who does zero BD in his role, does the same thing, although he gets invited to meetings and isn’t necessarily setting them himself. In fact, sometimes he doesn’t even register for the conference because he knows he won’t attend any of the sessions and is just there because all of his vendors and connections are there.

      1. Advice for meeting people – if there’s a breakout session you’re interested in, by all means go to that. But when you don’t have plans, look for less well attended breakout sessions – perhaps on less popular topics. That will give you a better chance of connecting with the speaker after the presentation, or a better chance of asking a question, or getting to know your fellow attendees.

        “Is this seat taken? Hi, I’m Anon.”

  4. What type of clothes are most amenable to looking good, if for various reasons your weight keeps changing because of bloat and other reasons by say 10 pounds over time?

    1. Dresses, sweater, ponte, jersey if it is not too form-fitting. There are some wrap dress deniers here but they’re great for those of us who fluctuate in weight.

    2. Goodness, this must be challenging for you. I just want to give you permission if you need it to keep a couple sizes of things on hand. Poshmark is a great place to look if you have an item you love but need to size up or down in it. Good luck.

      1. +1 to different sizes. I’ve bought my favorite pairs of pants in the two sizes I fluctuate between and it’s so nice to just have something I know I like and have it fit. Worth the investment for your tried and trues.

    3. I buy things on the big side so there’s room to go up and down. I think they look better anyway when fabric isn’t pulling.

    4. In 2018, I managed this with shift dresses, since they were popular then. More recently, I’ve used pants with elastic waists (the new Athleta Pinnacle trouser is really stretchy and flattering on my body) and boxier tops.

    5. Assuming this is for work purposes, not socializing: stretch pants and synthetic knit faux-wrap dresses. Brightly-colored solid knit long-sleeved crew-neck tops are good for Teams/Zoom calls. And a knit lady-jacket/sweater, worn unbuttoned, always looks professional.

    6. Pants that are narrow in the leg (for me, that’s straight legs) and a shirt or sweater that isn’t cropped. My bloat is all in my belly area so this helps. Straight vertical lines help camouflage a midsection, so a sweater/jacket/blazer worn open can really help.

    8. I happen to be partial to a set like a cropped straight leg silk pant + a matching tunic (basically the “fancy pajamas” vibe), the tunic (or long top) can hide an elastic waist and the overall loose (or looseR) on loose is very forgiving but still chic.

  5. Why on earth is the senile old man campaigning for Harris? Does he just do what he wants so the Harris campaign can’t get him to stay home? Because we really needed a Hillary Clinton deplorables moment to take the attention off Trump. Thanks Joe.

    2. Are they trying to get the olds who don’t like Harris to turn out and vote?

    3. I agree this is a bad distraction. But just want to clarify that he did not call Trump supporters garbage or deplorable. Read the transcript. He was talking about the comedian’s racist remarks as being garbage. Here’s the transcript:

      “The only garbage I see floating out there is [Trump’s] supporter’s… his demonisation of Latinos is unconscionable, and it’s un-American.”

      1. That comma was added in the 2nd version of the transcript.

        I think Jill is orchestrating it.

        1. Huh? It matches exactly. Whether you add an apostrophe or not changes the meaning. Are you saying that the listener and not the speaker decides whether there’s an apostrophe?

    4. Firstly, I believe the Harris campaign is being expertly run, and if Joe Biden is doing some campaigning, it’s because the campaign sees some benefit.

      Secondly, President Biden has dedicated his career to serving our country. He’s not been perfect, but of course neither are we. President Biden has experienced personal tragedy that most of us will never face, and has managed to do so with grace. One of the things I watched is how the Harris campaign treats President Biden, and I would be very displeased and note if they were disrespectful of him.

      Calling our President a “senile old man” who shouldn’t campaign because you don’t like it is ageism at its worst and says a lot about what kind of person you are.

      1. Totally agree. He’s the freaking President (which some people seem to have forgotten), of course he’s going to campaign for Kamala.

      2. Agree agree agree.

        He’s been a fantastic president and a fantastic person who has been through so much. Show some respect

      4. Biden also garnered a lot more of the black male voters, and Kamala is not polling as well with that group. Perhaps there is a valid reason that the campaign believes he will be helpful (even if you personally don’t want him out there?)

    5. There are some theories floating around that Biden is furious at being pushed out, and is taking it out on Kamala’s campaign.

      1. “There are some theories out there.” What does that even mean? If you read this somewhere, cite your source so we can evaluate it. If you don’t have a source, and aren’t acquainted with Presidential Biden, you are just gossiping and pot stirring. I suspect the latter.

        1. I am more than well acquainted with President Biden. Please stop with this “anyone who disagrees with me is ignorant” foolishness; it just makes you look bad.

          Meghan McCain, who has a close relationship with Joe Biden, tweeted this today:
          https://x.com/meghanmccain/status/1851602727450599861?s=46

          The NY Post:
          “Biden sabotaging Kamala Harris’ presidential campaign after being forced to drop re-election bid, pundits say

          By Doree Lewak and Rich Calder
          Published Oct. 12, 2024”

          Scroll down to about the halfway point and find Hank Sheinkopf’a comments. He’s a Democratic strategist, and I found his take to be thoughtful and balanced.

          Today, the Washington Examiner published a list of four times that Biden undermined Harris on the campaign trail. He’s far too much of a veteran of these things (six US Senate campaigns, two VP campaigns, one and a half Presidential campaigns) to not know what he’s doing.

          1. It seems like a big leap to assume it’s intentionally aimed at undermining Harris – all politicians make gaffes, Biden’s always been a particularly gaffe-prone politician, and in the last year or two he’s gotten even more likely to mess up (a big part of why he’s dropping out!). You could just add easily find examples of stupid stuff he said before dropping out

          2. The NY Post and Washington Examiner are part of the right wing media and will have nothing good to say about President Biden and Vice President Harris. Tell me you’re a Republican without telling me you’re a Republican.

      2. ^^^^ This.

        Also the comma in the word supporters was added the 2nd time the wording was released.

        1. Do you mean the apostrophe? The context really suggests that an apostrophe was intended.

          1. Not the way it was spoken by Biden. There is a pause there and then he catches on and tries to change the meaning. The same way he did it with the lock him up comment

      3. This seems ridiculous to me. Biden has always been prone to misspeaking, and it’s clear what he intended to say here. It also obviously wasn’t calculated to help or hurt any campaign when he started rambling incoherently about incest at the debate, which we all saw happen before he dropped out!

    6. So….calling people who cheer on racism “garbage” is unforgivable, but actually saying and supporting racist things is just…locker room talk?

      I hate how we seem to be normalizing all this both sides crap, that calling out people who support truly reprehensible ideas and policies is just as bad as actually supporting those ideas and policies.

      1. Do you not live in reality? In the last nine years the DJT camp can say absolutely anything they want and it’s fine within a day. The Democrats on the other hand – ANYTHING they say will be scrutinized for days and days including by liberal media. Given the the tight race, it’s just not what Harris needed. She cleaned it up decently well just now though saying she strongly disagreed. For once she didn’t defend the old man too much besides just saying – he’s clarified his comments but I strong disagree with criticism of people based on who they vote for. I’ll be a president for all etc.

        Honestly IDK why everyone here is so in love with Joe. Man is a disaster. Just because DJT is a fascist doesn’t mean that Biden isn’t a disaster. Harris should have distanced her self a lot more right off the bat but I imagine it was fear of losing the senior citizen vote.

        1. Aren’t you one of the people scrutinizing it though, and giving it energy? Politicians say stupid things all the time. Some also say vile things. The Harris campaign has been remarkable in her avoiding missteps. (I don’t know if this is good or bad, it just is.) Seems to me that the way to not call a lot of attention to unimportant things is to stop doing so, and just wait for the next comment from the Trump campaign to fill the space.

          This is the second comment this morning about “olds” and seniors voting. If Harris is going to be everyone’s President, doesn’t that include people 65+? You realize that a person who is 65 today may very well live until 90, and vote in four more presidential elections? I live in a state where everyone receives mail in ballots, and so far, the largest number of ballots returned in my county is from women over 60. Harris cannot win unless she gets votes from people of all ages, including the “olds.”

    7. Hi Sergei. Did you get demoted from creating content for X and are back to slumming it with us here? Go away.

      1. I understand you’re trying to make a joke here, but can you please not use names of actual people?

        1. JFC! It’s not like someone gave a full name. Calling an obvious troll Sergei is like no different than calling someone a Debbie downer. Or can we not do that ahymire eithrr?

          1. The history of racialized prejudice against Slavic people generally makes it different. (And while I thought that was a thing of the past, I’ve encountered plenty of Americans reviving old prejudicial tropes to denigrate both Ukrainians and Russians since the invasion.)

          2. Implication it is a Russion bot.

            And, no, I don’t think it’s all that different than saying John or Karen if it were a US bot.

          4. I’m taking a quick look at all of the polling, and it appears to be quite a tight race. Plenty of men are voting for Harris/Walz, and plenty of women are voting for Trump/Vance.

            Why the assumption that *anyone* who disagrees with you is a Russian bot?

          5. A huge amount of “information” on Twitter originates in Russian North Korean, and Iranian bot farms. While I agree that there are me who will vote for Harris and women who will vote for Trump, a ton of the crazy stuff we are seeing is from bots.

    8. I feel like I’ve heard this tone in a lot of political posts here lately and frankly you sound really angry and unwell. I literally think trump will end our democracy and I can’t muster the vitriolic tone you spew daily towards the people trying to prevent that. It must be frustrating to think you’re smarter than everyone else but I assure you your arrogance is misplaced. Plenty of reasonable people think racists should be called garbage. I’m one of them. You can express disagreement, fear and concern without all the name calling and sarcasm, you know? I hope you don’t talk like this in real life.

      1. So let’s not call people names, except that we should call every last Trump supporter racist garbage? I wasn’t sympathizing with OP until now.

        1. Interesting how you internalized “racists” to Trump supporters. You kinda said the quiet part out loud there.

        3. Okay, they aren’t racist, but they are fine with using racism to get their tax cuts. So much better.

          1. Lie down with dogs, wake up with fleas. Aligning yourself with the virulent racism of the Trump campaign makes you a racist by association.

          2. Ugh. Spineless non-racist djt supporters, who support racist supporters, have entered the chat.

        4. This is the weird logic that has never worked. The f your feelings crowd is not sad about being called garbage. They call us that and worse every day. They only act outraged because they think that kind of rhetoric is unacceptable to liberals and it will divide us. And the op is happy to help.

          Fascism appeals to them because they always seen kindness as weakness. Frank language about unacceptable behavior is vital. I’m frustrated that we all dance around the bad faith but clear motivations of maga voters and pretend like if we just tried to understand them we’d see they are kind hurt people who only resort to racism because it’s some kind of salve to their tender wounded hearts. That is not what happened. They want to preserve hierarchical structures that they feel benefit them and overt and implicit bigotry is a crucial component in this.

  6. Gen X -er needing a pep talk or maybe just a reality check. My boss, who is wonderful, has told me I am next in line for a big promotion. I believe him, but I also believe he can’t give me a firm date, and my employer tends to move at a glacial pace. My best guess is that the promotion would be in about six months. The boss checks in with me often, concerned because a peer of mine with a very similar resume was just picked off by a competitor.

    I was not looking at all, but a different competitor just reached out through a headhunter, and based on the compensation range suggested – way above my current – I have agreed to meet with them. Someone please tell me that it is neither normal nor rational to be overcome with guilt, or to think of telling my boss that I am being recruited in hopes that he will escalate the promotion if he can.

    1. I think it’s actually pretty normal/common to think that – but probably not a good idea to do it!

      Take the interview, don’t tell your boss for now.

    2. Definitely don’t tell your boss you’re being recruited. Trying to use that kind of leverage can backfire.

      You have no idea if this promotion will ever happen. You need to do what’s best for you.

    3. If your company wanted to promote you, they would. Moving at a glacial pace is just an indication of what they think of their employees. If they were truly concerned that people were getting recruited away, they’d give you a pay to stay bonus. Take the interview and move on.

      1. This is absolutely false. If I listened to this advice I’d have a career filled with lateral moves instead of upward promotions. They do take time in many large companies. While I think OP should take the meeting with a recruiter, I would think long and hard about moving. Starting over and rebuilding political capital is a lot harder than you think it is.

        1. OP is talking about taking another job that would be a promotion, though, not a lateral move. A bird in hand …

        2. I meant move on from the guilt feelings. You accept or refuse jobs based on merits. But still, if a company wants to promote you, they will.

          1. I stand by my advice, OP should really make sure she knows what she’s giving up and actually understands the promotion time lines. It’s not like dating where if he wanted to propose he would. There are internal constraints that may make a six month or sometime this year timeline extremely reasonable and normal. And with moving for a promotion, you might do that. You might also find yourself stuck there and never moving again because you don’t have the relationships to climb. Seriously assess what you’re leaving behind and don’t let a platitude get in the way of making a smart decision.

          2. Different Anon. I agree with weighing value of staying a bit more. I’m 50. Things like stability start to weigh in just as much if not more than a company’s promotion potential. Before jumping ship, I’d want to make sure it was 100% worth sacrificing the reputation (and presumably security) I had built up, especially if a promotion was indeed likely to be soon. The last thing you want is to do is jump over a few thousand dollars and then wind up part of cuts at the new place shortly after. It’s way harder to land new gigs the older and more senior you become, and I’m starting to see peers where it’s becoming career ending when they jump ship and discover it isn’t not what they were promised. Advice to someone in their 30s would be much different–at that phase of career, it’s all about growing your network and new skills and raising salary as fast as you can. Industry also is going to play a big role in weighing the stay or go decision.

      2. Yep, I work somewhere that does promotions at a glacial pace, then they did the paperwork to promote the charming cis het white guy in a matter of days. I have a hunch they’re keeping the promotion a secret and I’m not supposed to know.

        1. At my last job every time I was up for a promotion or wanted to promote one of my staff the organization was “revamping the promotion process so you will have to be patient.” Then inevitably people far behind me or the person I wanted to promote in terms of seniority, responsibilities, and qualifications would get promoted at the same time or shortly after the promotion that I had fought months or years for. The worst was the time I had actually been doing the job the next level up for years and was six months over the amount of seniority required for the promotion. When the process was finally updated they had knocked two years off the seniority requirement and actually announced my promotion and the promotion of someone with two years’ less seniority at the same time.

          Management was shocked when I left.

          2. “Do the next level job for a while, then we’ll give you the title.”

            Don’t believe it.

    4. Do you have any reality-based reason to think that a company that moves at a glacial pace is going to put through your promotion in 6 months? (e.g., are promotions given within a few months of a new budget going into effect, and your boss is creating a department budget that has your promotion in it?)

      1. I am not OP, but I have previously been in a similar situation. I genuinely had no idea my boss was lying to me, it sounds naive but my boss was otherwise a good person, gave me credit for my work etc, so the lying really was a shock. Especially as someone who doesn’t have the capability to casually lie and manipulate someone to their face, it didn’t occur to me.

    5. Take the interview and don’t say anything to your boss. While it’s nice that your company values you and your boss is great most companies will never go out of their way to give you a raise/promotion to well above what you are currently making now – it just isn’t in their best interests.

    6. Please think about taking the money and leaving. I’m learning that offers with big pay bumps are rare in life and I wish I’d taken them.

    7. Take the interview without notifying your boss. It’s always good to see what’s out there. You may decide it’s not a good fit and terminate the discussions. Your current employer need never know the positions you turn down, and sometimes they will overreact and hold it against you if they learn you have been looking. But if your interview leads to more fruitful discussions, you would be the best judge on whether to leverage a solid offer from the competitor with your current employer, seeking a match in terms of salary and promotion level, or even a raise above what the competitor is offering. Be prepared to accept the offer if your current employer wishes you well. Depending on your industry, review any non-compete terms of employment at your current company. Good luck!

    8. I left my company after 12 years and struggled with guilt but the flip side of that is that careers are long and industries can be small. I’m probably an asset to my boss as an industry contact at this point in a way that I wasn’t as a direct report. Maybe I’ll never be in the position to hire her but I have contacts and insight and knowledge that she doesn’t now. We keep in touch because this relationship remains mutually beneficial even if I’m at a competitor.

    9. By all means, move at a glacial pace. You know how that thrills me.

      (Couldn’t help it)

    10. Wait to say anything until you have an offer.

      I had a former boss who wanted better for us once tell a couple of us on our team about an opening in our very niche field. I received the offer and they negotiated for me to stay at a much higher rate. My peer was offered it after I declined and she left. Both of us went on to have much better careers because of the opportunity being out there. To this day, I realize he was the best boss I’ll ever have.

      Just be prepared that you will need to go if you tell about the offer. They may or may not counter. But you need to think of what’s right for you in all of this, and that may or may not be patience in getting a raise or accepting thatt perhaps it may not come. A lot of things are probably outside of boss’s control and who knows what the next 6 months could mean to your business as a whole–election fallout, pandemic resurgence, recession, new competitor in the market, etc. etc. The only sure thing is a raise in hand.

    11. Appreciating you are a Gen X-er. I found it MUCH more difficult to get my last job at 50. Ageism is real. At this stage of career, it’s not just about promotions–it’s long-term stability and happiness. Nothing is ever guaranteed, and I wouldn’t let it stop me from seeing what else is out there. But I also might tolerate a longer wait for a promotion if I were pretty confident it was going to come. You build up a lot of capital in a career, and I’d hate to walk away from some of that and start fresh where I might be more vulnerable to future lay offs. The equation of picking up new skills vs. the stability of not being the last hired shifts quite a bit at this stretch of a long career. I only mention that because I suspect a lot on this site are younger and still very much in a different earlier or mid-career mind-set and market.

    12. OP, I’ve thought about your question some more, and have a more thoughtful answer. It is normal to feel anxious and even a bit guilty — you feel disloyal! It’s not rational to be overcome with guilt though, because you aren’t doing anything wrong.

      You should interview, and do your best, which includes finding out as much as you can about the job and company. During the process, you’ll discover that you really like each other, aren’t a good fit at all, or are somewhere in between. Either end of the spectrum makes a decision easy, the in between may then rely more on your current job. But, these things take time and if you check in with your boss in three months and nothing has changed, that’s a data point.

      I view interviews as not just an opportunity for a job, but to also learn about how I stack up in the market, and what I want. I interviewed for a role where everyone in my management line had more patents than I will ever have. I realized that wasn’t going to change, would likely be a problem, and didn’t really pursue the job. A colleague did take the job, and it was a problem, and she didn’t last there long. So, good to know.

      I worked with a guy who was very good, well thought of, great performance rankings, quite loyal, and on a promotional path. But, these promotions came slowly. He interviewed with a competitor with zero intention of ever leaving our company, he was that loyal. He came back from the interview glowing, knew he wanted the job, and went through the process and got it. He’s now having a great career. You never know.

    13. There’s no point in feeling guilty over business decisions. Your company has decided that it’s best for them to have a glacial promotion process, and you need to respond accordingly. Similarly, while it’s nice that your boss seems concerned about retaining others, it sounds as if he should be? I’d definitely take the meeting with the recruiter. I wouldn’t tell him you are being recruited (he should already know that), but I might explore whether an escalation is possible after actually having an offer from the competitor in hand.

    14. I’m going to respond to the specific question about being overcome with guilt. I’d say you are reacting like a human being — this is not only normal, it’s part of how we evolved (whether physically or culturally), when the fabric of community was stronger and more important to survival.

      It sounds like you have a good relationship with your wonderful boss! Without taking away from that, please consider that your relationship to your boss is not the same as your relationship to the company. Your boss may genuinely be championing you, but they could leave or be hit by a truck tomorrow. To whatever degree the company is benefitting from your very human guilt, they are trading on your very human relationship with your wonderful boss.

      If your boss is really as wonderful as you see them, they will be happy for you to do what makes sense for your career. (But I agree, don’t tell until you have an offer in writing, because there’s nothing to tell yet, and your boss does have a duty to the company if you tell prematurely.)

      Good luck! You are many steps away from making a decision, but I hope that you enjoy the process of discovering your value, not just to your company but to others as well…

      1. I am the original anon. I appreciate all of the many thoughtful responses and especially this advice about my relationship to my boss not being the same as my relationship with the company. Thank you! This really gives me food for thought.

  7. I need help solving a mystery. My off white cotton canvas jacket mysteriously developed orange stains on the outside of the sleeves. It started as a faint orange cast on just one sleeve, and it has now spread to the other sleeve and a couple spots on the torso. I didn’t worry too much initially – I figured I brushed up against something and that it would wash out. I’ve now washed twice with various combos of pretreat stain, hot water, borax, vinegar, and laundress whitener. if anything the stains look more prominent. Any ideas on what caused this and what might get it out?

    4. I had this happen with a white denim jacket from sunscreen that contained oxybenzone. A rust remover laundry additive fixed it.

    6. We’ve had this exact thing happen on various pieces of clothing. After significant research, we also determined it was sunscreen. It seemed to mainly affect my partner, and may be related to his body chemistry, or something. We were unable to figure out how to remove the stains after LOTS of soaking, options, etc. In the end we had to get rid of the clothing – very disappointing. Rust remover did not work for us, FYI.

  9. This is a pretty specific question for parents of older kids where both parents have big jobs – how do you navigate after school activities once your kids are old enough they don’t really need a nanny? Right now, we have a nanny who picks them up after school at 3PM, and drives them to their various activities. They’re elementary age, and cannot be alone, and the nanny helps us with laundry and tidying up as well. I was pondering what life might look like in a few years, when the kids don’t need childcare so much as a chauffeur. Curious how others in that place have set themselves up. I don’t see either of us scaling back in our jobs, although I have had a few people suggest to me recently that it just gets harder and harder as they get older, which is wild to me because it has just started feeling like it’s getting easier as we emerge our of the daycare years.

    1. If you have a good nanny, I’d keep her because the transportation complexity IMO only goes up. And she can life manage vs kid manage, help with household stuff, etc.

      1. Same. Also I feel like older kids can get into more trouble than younger kids and a little supervision couldn’t hurt.

        1. + 1 million to this. Having an adult present in the house is a moderating factor on behavior, especially in the age of social media.

        2. +1

          I feel a HUGE pull to be around as much as possible with my teenage kid. Even if he’s in the other room, I want to be around, present and available.

          1. My daughter needs me much more as a teen than she ever did in elementary school. It just always seems to be after 11:00 p.m.

      1. This is the way to go. The driving nanny will have become part of the family by then, and hopefully is agreeable to evolving her role in the passage of time and in the interests of retaining stable, well-paid employment, and to retain consistency in supervision for your children, too. A responsible and trustworthy driving nanny is worth her weight in gold! It gets harder because as your children get older, their lives become more complex and their emotional needs mature. If you like the nanny, pay her well! To manage your children’s feelings about still having a “nanny” at an older age, you can just call her “Jane,” or “Miss Jane,” and avoid the “N” word.

        1. On the lives getting more complex, this is particularly true if you have multiple kids. And you’ll need carpool or some family help on some days in addition to the nanny. Carpool opportunities get easier at that age as well.

      3. +1. The few couples I know where both have big jobs kept their nanny until their youngest kid was 16. In addition to driving the kids around, the nanny did some housework and house management.

      4. +1. We have a ‘driving nanny’ and intend to keep her until our kids go to college. There are just SO many logistics that get harder as kids get older with sports, study groups, volunteer work, etc. Plus our nanny doesn’t do as much kid stuff so will also run minor errands (take back returns, grocery trips, dry-cleaning, let the dog out, etc.). It is expensive but there doesn’t seem to be a good way to get around it as a family with 2 big jobs and travel.

    3. It gets soooo much harder – and more fun. What we ended up doing is that I took a unicorn job that was a step up, remote, and allows me to set my own hours. I miss working in an office, but the flexibility is more important right now. My husband has stayed in a non-fulfilling job because he can flex his hours. If I were in your shoes and could swing it financially I’d keep the nanny until they were driving.

      1. I am staying in the less-than-fulfilling job because it works for me at this point in my life. Having middle school and high school kids is logistically very complicated at times. Elementary school really is the golden age.

        1. For me day care was the golden age. In elementary school you have to deal with summer day camps, aftercare, extracurriculars, etc.

          1. +1

            Golden age for childcare was the 1-4 years when daycare was 9-5 all year long. There were other challenges of course at those ages but the childcare part was much easier.

          2. Yes — 2 in diapers was the easy time for me — day care is always open. Every day is the same. The car goes to daycare, work, and home. Rinse and repeat. Now, every day is a different day, each kid is in different activities, only one is old enough to have a learner’s permit (so needs a parent in the car for hours and hours of driving practice and night driving practice), and their great summer Y nature camp ended at age 12.

    4. My parents just sort of abandoned us at around the age of 11, stopped hiring help and we were to take the bus or walk to any activities/medical appointments and cook our own food. I don’t recommend this option but it exists.

      1. This only works if you live in a storybook town where kids can walk or take the bus. Not many of those exist.

        1. It was not a story book town, I had to walk about 2 miles along a high way, I got picked up so many times, it’s a miracle I’m alive.

          1. I am an Old and I vividly remember walking along the freaking RAILROAD TRACKS (at about age 11) to get to my piano lesson. Do not recommend.

    5. You either keep the driving nanny or one of you goes part time. I went part time (70%) and my parents help out a bit which helps them stay active.

      It can actually be a good fit for grandparents. They may be able to pick up a 13 year old at home and drop her to the barn and watch her riding lesson whereas taking a 4 year old to a swim lesson and help them dry off and get changed etc would have been too much.

    6. So we had this forced on us when our long-time nanny needed to take another job – she was only after-school at that point but it still ended up being 30 hours a week (one late night) and we were paying her for 40 equivalent. What happened was I am an equity partner now so I can do whatever I want in terms of flexibility, and DH also works for himself so same, and we do all the driving now. It is NUTS, but OTOH it is a very short time until our oldest will be driving, and then another very short time until all of them are out of the house. We also have grandparents close by who can do driving in a pinch. So I am trying to embrace the NUTS and run with it!

      1. Same. I could not find a replacement on-the-books PT driving nanny for even 35/hour for love or money (plenty needed FT hours for the hours we actually needed help. So I am .5 FTE but my oldest just turned old enough to drive BUT might get a parking spot at her school as a senior, so nothing is really changing soon for us. And I like seeing them more. In only 2 years the older one leaves for school :(

    7. If your nanny is already driving them after school now, and filling her other time with around-the-house things like laundry, tidying, etc., could that not just continue? It sounds like you already have exactly what you need. Unless of course the nanny is hankering to get back to a household with tiny kids and you need to help her find a new job.

      1. this is kind of our plan and I don’t have a big job. DH has a big job with a bunch of travel, and I work part time, but we have no local family or even family we can have fly in to help us out. i am very grateful we can afford the nanny. I could see this maybe changing if we do private school for middle school which is common in our area just bc of the financials. growing up we had the same nanny for 8 years until we moved and then she worked for her next family for 19 years until she stopped working. if you can afford to keep her on, and you like her, you keep her. my dad still touches base with my former nanny (who at this point hasn’t worked for my family in almost 32 years)

      2. Yes, keep her on because a nanny willing to work part-time hours is hard to find. Can she do things like start getting dinner ready and homework supervision?

      3. No, I think you’re right. I guess it hadn’t previously occurred to me that we’d need the nanny for so long. I was riding high on the fact that both my kids can articulate their needs, loosely follow directions, don’t have to be watched at all times, read a book quietly in their room, etc. etc. and then this week, with all with weird Halloween school parties and days off (no school Thurs AND Fri) happened and I was reminded it is impossible to get to everything and be a full time (plus) working parent and that’s not going to change, which led me to thinking about our lovely nanny and now after this conversation, hoping she’ll stick around long term.

        1. With big jobs part of the reason they pay you the big bucks is so you can afford a SAH spouse or a nanny + housekeeper so you are available 24/7.

      4. We also noticed a big uptick in laundry in the late elementary and teen years. Bigger clothes, more sports clothes, more practices and more stuff that needs to be washed immediately. They can be taught to wash it themselves, but you also need someone coordinating things otherwise they’ll all do a load of their stuff after their activity instead of combining loads.

        1. We have to do all the family laundry together because our gigantic HE washer and dryer take so long to run a load that even running it all together takes 12 hours on Saturday. If we made each person do separate loads of dark colors, light colors, sports clothes with special detergent, etc., the laundry would be running 24/7.

          1. We do all the sheets/bedding on Saturdays, all the regular clothes for the week on Sundays and pick out outfits but we still have to run a quick wash or an activewear load almost every night of the week. More if the dog rolls in mud and needs a bath. I’m obsessed with the auto dispense detergent function on my washer. Take the worry out of the kids using too much or not enough detergent.

    8. At last, this is finally the stage when having children in NYC pays off – they take the subway by themselves.

    9. Someone scales back a job. Two big jobs and kids isn’t practical unless you want a nanny to raise them.

    11. Parent of 11.5 and 14 year old: You need an adult able to take the kids where they need to go after school for these activities. For us, it’s my DH who has a remote and flexible job or me on the couple days a week that I work remotely. For other friends, it’s aggressive carpool usage (sometimes “I will never be able to take the kids to this but will be forever in your debt, SAHM friend”), grandparents, etc. For some (although few I can think of in my upper middle class suburban circle) it’s saying “no” to activities that meet between 3-5:30 on weekdays.
      A little silver lining? The non-school activities tend to go later as kids get older. So I no longer have to deal with a 5pm dance class/soccer practice… instead it’s 7:30-9pm
      In some neighborhoods and the past, having the kid bike or walk would work. Not everyone lives in those neighborhoods now, and the number of “driving distance” extracurriculars that your average kid now does compared to decades ago is very different.

    12. Adults who don’t drive hire drivers for standing appointments; I guess kids who aren’t old enough to drive need the same? Assuming no adequate public transit.

      1. Actually I think a lot of adults who can’t drive just impose on the people around them. My dad has never driven and has hired a driver only a handful of times in his life, mainly for getting to and from airports. For daily life he relies on my mom and other family members and occasionally friends.

          1. Less of an option now that there are graduated licensing laws that restrict the number of passengers a new driver can have.

    13. When I had a big job that was 75% travel I hired a morning nanny to get them up, dressed, breakfasted, and to school. She made their lunches too. It worked out really well. She worked two hours a day, or I paid her for two hours a day and she worked about 1, and she went to her full time job immediately after the school drop off. She needed the extra money, so she was happy. She’s a family friend now.

      We paid her hourly rate plus the IRS reimbursement for miles, which should contemplate gas, wear and tear, and insurance. We calculated her commute to our house, back and forth to school (two schools once my eldest was in middle school) and her commute back home. Rounded up. She was happy with that.

    14. So, you need to evaluate all sides and do what’s best for your family as a whole.

      I will say driving the carpool is invaluable.

      Kids seem much more willing to open up and chat when they’re in the car with you.

      By driving carpool you get to know the kids there friends with and do activities with much better. You also get to know the parents better and save up some goodwill for when you need to call in a favor.

      I am far from a helicopter mom and give my kids space to do their own thing, but I’ve found carpool to be beneficial.

      We’re also a close family and I attribute that to lots of time spent doing the mundane together

    15. At my kids school, school is from 7:15-2:15. Activities and some sports are immediately after school. Field hockey practices from 5-7. WTF?! Are all of those kids only children with a SAHM?

      1. 5-7 seems more convenient, actually. Kids can ride home on the school bus, parent can leave work a bit early to get them to practice or send them in a carpool and then drive the carpool home at 7.

        It’s the after school activities from like 2:15-3:15 that get me, because what parent can leave work at 3 pm? But the kid going home on the school bus is no longer an option.

          1. Eat a light dinner or heavy snack before, and something like cereal or a sandwich or yogurt after. It is not that big of a deal.

    16. I think a lot of kids switch to doing primarily activities through the school. My kid is in elementary and I schlep her all over town for various sports and art classes, but by middle school it seems like most kids have switched to school sports, school music (band/orchestra/choir) and school theater programs.

      Also carpooling and using public tr*nsit – I live in a suburban area but we do have a decent bus system and I know some middle and high schoolers who rely on the buses to get places. I rode the (city) bus to middle school every day when I was a kid.

      1. We had the opposite experience with lots of interest in recreational school sports in early elementary but now only one activity that is school based (choir). Everything else is outside of school (figure skating, karate, higher level choir, scouts, swim, theatre, music lessons).

        1. Yeah, I was a competitive figure skater myself so I know some sports aren’t offered through school (though parents can say no to that), but at least in my area the number of school based activities increases tremendously in middle school. Our K-3 elementary school does not offer any after school activities beyond the generic aftercare program and the 4-6 school only offers music as an after school option. You can’t do any sports or things like theater and debate through the school until 7th grade.

        2. My kid dropped all non-school extracurriculars in high school to focus on school-based activities. She was usually at school until 6:00 p.m. for practices or rehearsals. On the rare day when she wasn’t, she rode the bus home. Her music lessons were on the weekend so I could take her.

          Some kids still play club sports in addition to school sports, take dance, or participate in youth orchestra or non-school theatre, but some or most of those activities will be after 5:00. When my daughter was a club gymnast in middle school practice was from 5:00 to 8:30 p.m. I think our local youth orchestra rehearses something like 5:30 to 7:30. The high school division at our ballet school mostly has classes in the evening. Still not really compatible with both parents’ having 80-hour-a-week jobs where they have to be immediately available, but some parents with big jobs seemed to be able to dip out to drop the kids off at stuff.

    17. re: “it just gets harder and harder as they get older,” my perspective is that it gets harder in a different way. Daycare years are physically exhausting but the older years (especially tween and teen years) are more emotionally exhausting. And it’s harder to outsource care for older children. 3 year olds will generally accept any loving caregiver, but 13 year olds really want their parents there (even if they may not act like it!). Also I found that, beginning around pre-k or K, the older they got, the more I wanted to be there. I didn’t particularly enjoy having toddlers and felt zero guilt about sending them to daycare, but once they got into elementary school it was a different ballgame and that feeling only intensified as they got older and more independent.

    18. The families I know that can afford it and have someone who works well for their family keep the nanny, for driving, for just having someone home for emergencies (even for older kids), and as the kids need less hands on time might take on some “household admin” stuff.

      When keeping a permanent nanny isn’t perfectly practical, I’ve seen a mix of:
      – moving closer to the school or to a more walkable/bikeable/transit friendly neighborhood
      – Picking kids’ activities partly based on schedule and transportation — doesn’t mean your kids don’t get to do anything, but families might eg. have their kids pick a sport run through their school with on campus practice, and not make a private travel league an option at all
      – Getting older kids a car on condition that they drive for younger kids
      – Paying for ubers (technically not allowed for unaccompanied kids, but people certainly do it); or dedicated kid transport companies (only seen these in big cities)
      – Stitching together carpool from family, other kids in activities, parents (doing an after school run and then going back to work). Works best with big but flexible jobs, where your seniority gives you some control over schedule

    19. The driving nanny is a unicorn solution, you’re incredibly lucky to have one. Keep them, pay them what they’re worth plus a little extra, be grateful you have the help. What would be the reason not to keep the nanny, to save a little bit of money? You have big jobs, you can afford it for the peace of mind and convenience.

  10. I’ve lost close to 50 lbs recently and simultaneously have had a varicose vein (I’m assuming?) pop up around my knee cap on my right leg. It’s really ugly, running top to bottom, pretty pronounced. I’m 40. Is this just life/genetics or is there something I can do? I’m guessing it was always there but the weight loss now has it showing up. New territory for me. TIA.

    1. See a vascular surgeon. Maybe they can do sclerotherapy. I had a vein stripped. It was not a big deal. Very simple out patient procedure. You dont have to live with it.

      1. My mom had extensive varicose veins that she was embarrassed of for years and she got them removed and is thrilled. It was outpatient and local anesthesia.

      2. Vein surgeon – there are lots of ‘vein clinic’ type places that do this. I am finishing up my sclerotherapy now and while it isn’t fun it is also a quick outpatient procedure though the aftercare with the compression stockings is kind of a pain.

    2. Congratulations on your weight loss! I’ve lost a similar amount over the last two years and no new varicose veins. There are lots of causes, but one major one is being overweight. The biggest one is heredity.

      So I agree with others to talk to your doc about getting it reduced or removed.

  11. Need some shopping advice. I am at a loss for what to wear on date nights with my husband. Bored with black jeans and going out top. Would like a more feminine look, like maybe a cute dress or skirt and nice top. I’m 55 so a don’t want anything too mini or revealing but not too frumpy either. I’m petite so big maxi skirts make me look lost. What stores even have something like this. Does it exist? TIA.

    2. Look at Boden for this. They have a lot of fun, feminine things, and the styles are fairly “modest” for lack of a better term. Their petite sizing is a bit limited, but their dresses tend to run short-waisted, so I at 5’1″ am often able to just get the skirt hemmed, as the waist hits in the right place already without alterations (and I am fairly short-waisted to begin with).

    3. A silky midi skirt (JCrew Gwyneth is one example) and a slouchy sweater is my current fave alternative.

      In summer, I most often went with dressy shorts (like a floral pattern, eyelet, etc) and a silky top – currently trying to find the winter equivalent of that in pants!

    4. I am a big fan of my tulle skirt(s). I have this one from Anthropologie and it’s surprisingly versatile: https://www.anthropologie.com/shop/hybrid/the-cheri-ruffled-tulle-midi-skirt-by-anthropologie?color=065&inventoryCountry=US&countryCode=US&utm_medium=paid_search&utm_source=Google&utm_campaign=US+-+Shopping+-+PMAX+-+Apparel+-+Icons+%26+Push&utm_content=&utm_term=&creative=&device=c&matchtype=&network=x&utm_kxconfid=vx6rd81ts&gad_source=1&gclid=Cj0KCQjwsoe5BhDiARIsAOXVoUuGy_VbgoU9IlzRqM2XlyehRl3N2ZMilTjocvkmY9eWRwLCKVb3OJ0aAn_GEALw_wcB&gclsrc=aw.ds&type=STANDARD&quantity=1

    5. Try a jumpsuit! I bought two this summer and I love them. They can be dressed up with fancier shoes and jewelry or more casual with lower key accessories.

      One of mine is a cheap one from Old Navy, but it has a very nice drape and in black, it looks not so cheap. If you need a gateway jumpsuit.

      And, it’s really not that hard to go to the bathroom in them. I never thought I would like jumpsuits, but I’m really glad I gave them a try. It’s easier in some ways than trying to match pants and a top, and a nice change from dresses.

    6. I’ve been really liking all the faux leather pants out there, sometimes paired with a more feminine look. I just wore some cropped kick flares that I got at Ann Taylor last year along with a deep V top and statement red earrings.

  12. My 12 yo told me he ‘sort of’ likes Trump, and I’m shocked. He doesn’t get it from me or his father (my ex, but we have always been aligned politically). I don’t understand how this could happen. We have gay people in our family, I am a daughter of South Asian immigrants. I’ve been walking around shell shocked. We are having long discussions about news event, I showed him the Op-Ed in the NYT, but still…I’m not getting through.

    1. He’s probably watching right wing stuff on social media, you should check his social media usage and watch history, unfortunately I think it will be illuminating.

      2. +1. I keep a close eye on my son’s social media usage because this right wing stuff is everywhere – it was on a video game channel recently. We talked about it and he’s aware of how/why these folks are targeting younger people.
        This is all part of media literacy along with the use of airbrushing/filters on social media, that all the ‘stuff’ they see influencers with may not be owned, etc.

        1. +1 – there was just a guy talking about how these charismatic right wingers have infiltrated pretty much every young men’s hobby, whether it’s gaming, working out, bird watching, whatever. age 10 to 30, he said, they’re getting a right wing perspective. not Q-anon right, but center-to-MAGA.

          i’m super liberal and i’ve also had conversations with my 13yo about why it’s bad to say “all lives matter,” and “if equality is the goal why do women get special treatment?” and so forth. it’s very, very depressing.

      3. Even if he doesn’t watch it, his friends do and they share. Even Barstool Sports or something leans very heavily white bro-y Trump fan right now.

    2. Wait but…did you hear him out on what he likes about him? That would be step one.

      1. yeah this was going to be my first suggestion. I’m no fan (already voted for Harris) but the best way to get into someone’s head is to listen to them!

      2. Yes, but he has not articulated it yet. I’m very anti-Trump, so I think he is a little embarrassed to share it with me. I have made it clear that the kids have the right to their own opinions about things, I’ve never gotten angry or pushed my own views. I know he feels safe with me, but he also doesn’t want to disappoint me.

        1. This is great! Emphasize that you are proud of him for talking to you even though he is worried about disappointing you. I would focus on having him define his own values, separate from candidates and then talk about which candidates line up with his views. You can talk about your own views as an example.

          It’s also a good teaching moment for deciding how to vote when he can vote in 6 years. The fact that candidates are not always going to match up with all of our views so we have to think about who is the best fit overall for yourself and for others.

          I also like to talk about how I consider not just what is best for me individually but also what is best for my values. Like I recently voted for a town candidate who was suggesting to raise taxes on homes over a certain value and put the money into building affordable housing. Would their plan cost me a bit more money? Yes. But do I think people who didn’t have parents with enough money to help them buy a house, also deserve housing. Absolutely.

          Take him with you to vote. My kids have gone with me to every voting opportunity since they were babies.

          Learning about non-Democratic Party supporters of Harris like Liz Cheney might help him consider his views as well.

          2. Please don’t jump down my throat for saying this: I wouldn’t ever try to get a young man on board with the Democrats by highlighting either of the Cheneys.

            Young men are deeply concerned about getting sent off to a useless, endless war, and they (for very solid reasons) see Harris and the Cheney family as the people who are going to do it.

            Scream “Trump is going to start WWIII” at me all you want. You’re missing the point – socially shaming me or any other grown woman won’t change the minds of young men.

          3. 12:10 – I’m not going to respond to the ‘substance’ of your comment. It’s clearly based on misinformation. Better luck with fear mongering and catastrophizing elsewhere.

            Talking about GOP party members who are supporting Harris is a great way to talk about how you can agree with the general ideas of a party but not necessarily chose to support a certain candidates. The classic do you vote for the party or the candidate conundrum which is an important conversation to have with young people in any era regardless of who the candidates are.

        2. He probably likes Trump because you don’t and he’s 13 and feeling contrarian. He is establishing his own opinions by contradicting yours. The more you try to force your ideas onto him instead of really making space for him to think this through himself, the more entrenched he’ll become.

          1. Also, showing him the op-ed is pushing your views. Asking him to show you what he is consuming and then having him explain to you what’s cool about it would be “not pushing your views.”

          2. Oh, I see showing the op-ed was kind of incidental! I stand by the position that 13 year olds LIVE to challenge whatever they perceive as their parents’ most deeply held beliefs.

          3. That was my thought. I “loved” George Bush in high school and it was 100% about p1ssing off my parents, lol.

          4. I had so many hot takes about religion because my parents were religious, haha. I was a jerk! And it was completely developmentally normal!

          5. @12:28 during that whole WMD fiasco way back when, I pointed out all the issues to my little sister, who was a budding Young Republican. She said “I don’t care. He’s my choice, right or wrong.”

            I wanted to wring her neck.

            She has come way, way around and would not vote for Trump in a million years, thankfully. I think she’s still a registered Republican, but hasn’t voted for a republican in years, and actually campaigned for Beto!

    3. Trump epitomizes school yard politics (a bully who also mocks, undermines, and defies institutional authorities that are perceived as scolding). Before I’d talk about politics I’d talk about how he feels about his own life and whether he feels like he has agency and direction vs. feeling frustrated or controlled (keeping in mind that twelve year old perspectives aren’t always reasonable!).

    4. Have you asked him to articulate what he ‘sort of’ likes about him, and work backwards from there? That might be the best place to start.

      It strikes me that there are people voting in this election who were your son’s age or even younger when Trump first slithered onto the scene. It’s scary to think that they’ve grown up thinking that this kind of behavior is … the way things are.

        1. That’s nice, when did he actually wind up running for president and behaving this way in that setting? Which is what I obviously was referring to.

      2. This is what I find really hard. My 10 year old boys were ages 2 to 6 during the Trump presidency. Trump and Biden are the only presidents they can remember.

    5. Have him sit through a 2-hour rambling Trump speech and see if the shine doesn’t wear off. Anyone can look good in a sound bite. I remember as a tacky bankrupt developer from way back. So hard pass and I’m a republican.

    6. He may also be experiencing social pressure at school depending on the dynamics. I would approach it by asking him about what he likes in an open manner.

      He’s clearly trying to figure himself out and coming to you about that which is a good sign. I would really try to focus on keeping the lines of communication open.

      You can also talk about what you like. Keep it personal and connect your values to people he knows and how Trump is not consistent with those values.

      For example, ‘I remember when Uncle Bob and Uncle Joe couldn’t get married. They were really sad when all their friends were able to get married, but they couldn’t. I think it’s important to support leaders who want to let people marry who they love.” Or how his grandparents have worked hard since coming to the US and you don’t like leaders who talk about immigrants like they are lazy or taking advantage of the US. Or that you value respect and you think it’s important that leaders treat others with respect and Trump doesn’t show respect towards women like you.

    7. Have you asked what it is he likes? This sounds like time for you to take a step back and have an actual conversation with your kid. Try to be non-judgmental and approach it from the perspective of wanting to understand him and his thought process and not shut him down. It may be horrifying, but helping your kid learn to explore and critically examine issues important to him as he becomes old enough to form his own opinion is a huge task. “Getting through” that he is wrong isn’t necessarily equipping him to think through things on his own in the future.

      As an aside, NYT op-eds are not necessarily how 12 year olds are processing information these days…

      1. Lol, fair point. We were carving pumpkins, and I laid down the Sunday NYT. The front page of the opinion section was right there.

        1. FWIW, it has been shocking to learn just how much of our daily conversation my objectively smart and engaged now-college kid managed to tune out or forget. It is great that you are having these conversations regularly, but please don’t beat yourself up if yours does not seem to be taking up things that seem obvious to you. It takes time, and he is at the age where he is getting more and more input from other sources. Help him learn to navigate them and evaluate their merits, and keep being a safe place for him to raise questions.

    8. Would your parents be open to talking to him about the political situation in their South Asian country? Sometimes understand the broader picture of how political views within and between countries vary is helpful. What are their values that lead them to come to the US? What did they hope for here? And then maybe how that matches with the kind of America Trump wants.

    10. Your 12 year old probably likes him because he’s a cartoony character, not a serious adult seeming person like Kamala. You can talk to him about how cartoony is one thing, but his candidacy is actually a serious threat to a lot of things we hold near and dear, like democracy.

      Show him what Arnold Schwarzenegger said, linked below.

    1. The segment of the world who’d cancel him is not relevant to his market. Like at all.

    2. I truly do not understand. He’s always been a disgusting creep but sentiments have changed over the years.

    2. It’s a good statement, but saying that both parties don’t care about deficits is a little… disingenuous … when the last few Democratic Presidents made serious progress in reducing the deficits.

      And if a Republican Congress gets their way, well, I don’t know why people still think that party is such a bastion of fiscal responsibility.

      1. The deficit spiked in 2020 due to COVID; it hasn’t exactly been amazing under Biden’s watch.

      2. It’s true that the national debt has only increased under Republican presidents for a very long time. They like to shepherd through popular tax cuts, especially for wealthy taxpayers, but they don’t really match it with spending cuts. Then they can say “it’s not my fault democrats don’t want to cut spending” and the debt increases forever.

    3. I agree but at this point, what will convince voters to vote and vote for Kamala? I think anyone who has decided to vote for Trump is set in their decision.

      1. Isn’t the hope that GOP leaning voters who were going to sit it out because they dislike Trump might be convinced to vote for Harris?

  15. I love Howard Stern. Please listen to his long interviews, especially with Bruce Springsteen.

  16. I am the original anon. I appreciate all of the many thoughtful responses and especially this advice about my relationship to my boss not being the same as my relationship with the company. Thank you! This really gives me food for thought.

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