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Thursday’s Workwear Report: Convertible Neckline Cozy Tunic

Our daily workwear reports suggest one piece of work-appropriate attire in a range of prices. This convertible neckline tunic from 1.State looks great for a casual office or a casual day at a more conservative office. It's available in both regular and plus sizes, and they call it convertible because the cowl neck can be changed to a chic, off-the-shoulder look, which is a good option if you're going to a holiday party or something like that — and I think you can play around with it and find ways in between. It's machine washable, too. We're picturing it in the green but it also comes in light pink, navy, black, ecru, and “dark oxblood.” It's $59 at Nordstrom. Convertible Neckline Cozy Tunic This post contains affiliate links and Corporette® may earn commissions for purchases made through links in this post. For more details see here. Thank you so much for your support! Seen a great piece you’d like to recommend? Please e-mail tps@corporette.com.

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270 Comments

  1. Ladies, what are your best White elephant gifts for this year? Our family does a gift exchange (criteria = Under $25, no gift cards, gender-neutral!), and all I can think of is booze and coffee! TIA!

    1. Ours also has to be bought at the RiteAid in our ‘hood (lets our sitter take our kids there on the DL). Or a dollar store. You’d be amazed what these stores carry (in a good and also a hilarious way). Magnetic picture frames were a hit with the grandmothers as they still have magnetic appliances covered in grandchildren and grandpets.

    2. Mugs, socks, umbrella, mouse pad, USB charger, blanket, calendar, Tervis tumbler or Yeti (not sure if they are under $25 though)

    4. I always bring booze. If you don’t want to do that, I’d do something else consumable that will keep. Chocolates, peppermint bark, fancy almonds, etc.

    5. Baggu reusable shopping bags. They’re practically indestructible, easily washable, and fit a ton of heavy stuff. I use them for groceries, hauling dirty clothes to the dry cleaners, wrapping shoes in my suitcase, all sorts of things. It’s something that you might not think to buy yourself, but they’re so amazingly handy. Find on Amazon or Baggu website.

      1. I’ve gotten into reusable produce bags as gifts. I feel like everyone has the grocery bags, so that’s the next step, but no one wants to pay the entry cost.

        1. I would definitely fight people for reusable produce bags at a gift swap.

    7. I brought a set of battery-operated LED string lights that weren’t necessarily Christmas-y for our work potluck and it was one of the few items that got stolen the maximum # of times. I think their ultimate destination is a coworker’s daughter’s stocking (for her dorm room). Others wanted them for their office.

    8. Magic 8 Ball
      Chia Pet
      Tiny bottles of booze
      Go to costco and get one of those giant boxes of assorted cookies

      Container store has great options – multitool, selfie lens, etc.

    9. I found 3D puzzles of dinosaur skeletons this year – ostensibly for kids, but I’m pretty sure anyone would be psyched to get them.

        1. I don’t know why this made me burst out laughing. It made me think about the Kids in the Hall skit about ham.

    11. A blue tooth shower speaker. I got this in a white elephant one year and really enjoy it in the mornings! :)

    13. Last year I bought a combination planter and pen holder – it was surprisingly nice! It was Kikkerland brand and I found it on Am@zon.

  2. I have always been mystified by makeup ads. Not the sort for concealers for imperfections or powders for oiliness or moisturizers/sunscreens — those are all practical. And even things like eyeliners, brow pencils, or lipsticks — all stuff that does a thing. It’s more the wild clubbing looks, that are billed as lasting for 18 hours. As a kid, I thought that that was normal (if you see it in Seventeen and Cosmo, it’s so, no?), at least in the glamorous big city I’d live in someday (if not in college). Well, it turned out that needing wild, last-forever makeup just never seemed to be a think anywhere I have lived or worked (and not for anyone I knew, even peripherally). No need to get all glammed up to have it last well into the next day (who gets up in the morning still looking like they are amped up to go out all night?). And if I were doing a walk of shame, so to speak, I’d rather be invisible (or like I’d got out for a run or the paper) vs looking obviously like I was coming home from the prior night. And yet, I was getting my hair cut yesterday and all of the make up ads seem to be for a vivid 18-hour club look (and I am sure I could get that stuff to smear all over my pillow, no matter how color-tattoo it is billed as).

    Maybe this is a help to synchronized swimmers, who actually need vivid makeup that is durable and won’t sweat/come off easily?

    1. Or dancers? Who I think often need fun colors and designs as part of their costume, and then proceed to do unbelievable things under heavy, heavy spotlights.

      1. Unbelievable things sounds like I’m accusing them of crimes. Oops. I meant that dancing is physically difficult.

    2. Makeup advertising isn’t selling reality or practicality. It’s about grabbing attention, creating brand recognition, and tapping into fantasy and desire. Also, a company will place ads based on the magazine’s demographic. I daresay that if you were reading, say, Martha Stewart’s Living rather than Cosmo, you wouldn’t be seeing ads for 18-hour clubbing makeup.

    3. I don’t need wild colors, but I do appreciate long lasting makeup. If I put on makeup at 6:30 in the morning, then go to work and have a meeting/event after work, I’m happy if my eye makeup is still mostly intact.

    4. I always assume that the “18 hours” or “24 hours” is more about finding a different way to say “long-lasting” then about actually expecting most people to need it for that time. As for the more showy make-up looks, I’ve though the same way – “Oh, I’d wear that someday!” No, no, I would not, and I don’t actually know anyone who would. But it does, even now, get my attention turned towards the ad, which I assume is the main goal.

    5. Yeah, don’t focus on the timeline so much but definitely the “endurance” of it through sweat, dust, etc.
      Also… the Mrs. Maisel show, set in the 1950s, Season 1, shows how women of that era were very well-trained to always have their makeup on – from before their husband wakes up in the morning until after he goes to sleep at night!

      And finally…. I did select a brand of long-lasting lipcolor once because I read in the Wall Street Journal that it was market-tested by women in labor! Not like they purposely put it on women in labor, but that 1 woman who had it then went into labor and thought it looked GREAT for the photos with their new babies the next day! I was impressed. I think it was CoverGirl Outlast or something, like 15 years ago.

      1. LOL that is great. When I see something that claims to “last 24 hours”, to me that means it’ll last all day at work and look good at the end of the day. I certainly don’t sleep with it on, but I want it to look nice for the duration that I wear it.
        And then sometimes that 24 hours eyeliner smudges off in a couple hours… sad day.

        1. I agree. No one wants to wear makeup for 24 hours. FOOEY on that! Even in the rare case where you find yourself having to stay over at some guy’s apartement, you DO want to take your makeup off b/f you finally go to sleep. Besides, b/c you will look like a sloppy mess in the morning anyway (with or w/o makeup) it might as well be w/o makeup rather then haveing yesterday’s makeup all schmeared over your eyes and face. You want to look “natural”, not like a mess. That is why I try to go VERY light on the makeup so that I do NOT look like day/night when I don’t have it on. YAY!!!

      2. There is a fantastic review about an eyeliner (I think Kat Von D) that a girl posted on Amazon. She was in a horrific car accident and ended up bruised and bloodied (you can see dried blood in the photo), eyes red from crying, rest of her makeup gone, and her perfect winged liner stayed put. She posted a selfie from the hospital. I guess that’s who the long lasting makeup is for.

        1. I remember wearing the Benefit “They’re Real” eyeliner through a whole swing dance, sleeping, getting dumped and crying, and taking a shower, over the course of maybe 15 hours? Stuff was barely smudged, man.
          Then again, this is an eyeliner that has its own special cream (sold separately, of course) to remove it, you can take it off with regular stuff but it’s a long, frustrating process.

    6. Haha, I was the same way as a teen. I was a latchkey kid, so what I saw on tv and in magazines HAD to be true/the way real life really worked. I saw a meme once that said something to the effect of, “Growing up, I thought quicksand was going to be much more of an everyday concern than it’s turned out to be.” Ha!

      1. This is so true. I have never once gotten stuck in quicksand (much less seen it) – I feel very ripped off.

        1. I also spent a LOT of time practicing stop, drop and roll. Not once have I caught on fire but if I do I am READY.

    7. Different people have different lifestyles. Some people want/need that functionality. I think we (as humans) make the assumption that others are more like us than they actually are.

    8. I think it’s more applicable now that heavy makeup is in style, especially with respect to false eyelashes and bright color eyeshadow. I never see these heavy makeup looks at work, but see them all the time on sub-30 women going out to a concert, a club, drinks at a hip lounge – and in my humid climate the last all day makeup when you’re out dancing is really helpful.

  3. Has anyone tried using an automatic cat feeder overnight to stop early morning meowing? It’s driving my husband insane in particular. We already try extra playtime before bed and ignoring it once it starts, but the quality of our sleep is interrupted consistently and I’m looking for a new strategy. Would spacing out the evening meal overnight do anything?

    1. I think it’s worth a try. I have a regular dry feeder out at all times but two of my cats still get the morning zoomies. On weekends I get up and feed them and then go back to bed.

      With the automatic feeder, hopefully your cat will get used to expecting the food at a certain time so he doesn’t bug you about it. You could do that in conjunction with spacing out the evening meal.

    2. Our cats have dry food out all the time and we still get the early morning wake up from them. I have noticed weirdly that black out blinds help keep them asleep just like us. They early summer mornings always seemed to wake them up.

    3. I do and it’s helped a lot. My cat would yowl (not cute meows – full on WHY ARE YOU STARVING ME??? yowls – and yes he’s very well fed) for food at all hours of the night and day. After I got the feeder, he kept yowling at me for a little while but eventually transitioned to yowling at the feeder. To his credit, it always works because eventually it feeds him. It’s been about two years now and the yowling has mostly subsided. He knows when he’s going to get fed and he will wait at the feeder (more or less) patiently when it’s close to meal time.

    4. Our solution has been to cut back to once a day feeding, right before we go to bed at night. We still get meowing reminding us it’s meal time, but we are more willing to tolerate it at 9 PM than at 6 AM.

      It probably took two weeks before we all adjusted. Also, are you sure it’s the food that they want rather than just the attention and you being awake with them? We still struggle with that occasionally.

    5. We bought one for my now 10-year-old cat 5+ years ago and it is a lifesaver. It started when we lived in a bachelor-style apartment (no door to the bedroom) and he would drive us insane until we fed him in the morning, but once he figured out that the machine gave him food and not us, he completely stopped. It’s useful for more than just mornings – we can go away for short periods of time/unexpectedly and not worry about having someone come to feed him. I know he can’t actually tell time, but it’s funny how he’ll sit next to the feeder for about 20-30 minutes before it’s scheduled to go off, or he’ll RUN across the house as soon as he hears it.
      We initially bought a cheaper version that he quickly figured out how to break into, but the second one has been going strong for several years with no issues. I believe the brand is Petsafe.

      1. I’m laughing silently at the thought of your kitty waiting at the food feeder :) And I think they can sort of tell time. Not on a clock face, obviously, but mine can definitely remember routines. She gets fed around 6PM every day when we get home from work, but even on the weekends, she won’t start bugging us until 5PM or so. And she gets so upset when the clocks turn back in the winter and she has to wait an extra hour!

        1. When my daughter was a toddler, she would “ask” to put her coat on at her home daycare about 10 minutes before I would get there. I have no idea how she would know what time it was. This was when she was 12-18 months old.

        2. They can totally tell time. And days of the week. My cat gets very anxious if I’m home on a weekday. He keeps checking on me like HELLOOOOO WHY ARE YOU STILL HERE? I HAVE PLANS OF WORLD DOMINATION TO HATCH PLEASE LEAVE NOW THX.

    6. My cat used to yell at me at 4am, so I started feeding him 1/2 a packet of wet food later (8:30ish) at night. He’s older so the extra moisture content is good for him anyways. His always has a little dry food available, but you know cats, fresh crunchies preferred.

    7. I love hearing about everyone else’s crazy cats. We had one that instead of meowing would, starting in the early morning, begin cuddling rather aggressively in bed with us so as to accidentally wake us up, all very innocently on his part. This would then progress to biting our elbows or knees if they were not covered up – he usually did the lick, lick, bite maneuver. That cat loved to eat and weighed about 25 pounds at his heaviest. When we buckled down to work on getting him to loose weight, he would come sit in front of us and stare at us while meowing for a solid three hours before it was time for him to eat. He would also flick his ear back in the direction of the kitchen while doing this, as if to point – he was so good-natured I think he assumed we just didn’t understand the problem. When he died we realized how much clean-up duty he had done – he would lick the bowls, floor, etc clean so there was never any food around. RIP Scooby!

    8. We have an automatic feeder and highly recommend it! It dispenses food at 6 pm and 6 am. Our cat knows we don’t have any control over it so she doesn’t bug us about it.

    9. We have one and it’s great. My cat gets food and 6am and then falls back asleep. She actually didn’t budge this morning when I got up. Warning that we had to upgrade to the more expensive model because kitty figured out that if she stuck her paw in the cheap model, food just came right out, which kind of defeated the purpose.

    11. I anyone can recommend a specific brand, please post. I was looking to buy one of these and the reviews are all over the place.

    12. I always leave some dry food out, and my cats split a can of wet food in the morning and at night. To (largely) avoid them waking me up in the morning, I switched to feeding them right before I leave instead of right when I get up. As a result, I don’t think they associate me getting up with being feed. They will sometimes start meowing if I’m taking a long time getting ready, but I can easily deal with that. Sometimes, but not often, they will try to wake me up when I’m sleeping in on the weekend, but it is pretty rare

    13. I’m embarrassed to admit that I spent as much money on this as I did, but I purchased the PetSafe Smart Feed Automatic Feeder. It’s amazing, reliable, and my cat can’t get into it.

      I use it to feed my cat small meals four times a day starting first thing in the morning and continuing while I’m at work, and then I give my cat a half can of wet food at night. My cat does not wake me up, but instead knows to anticipate her morning meal coming from the feeder (at about the same time that I wake up!).

      It’s also been convenient for going out of town or staying late at work. I can literally feed the cat with a touch of my iPhone, from wherever I am. Between having a calm cat and peace of mind that he’s not going hungry, I can’t recommend this enough.

      2. I’m pretty sure that’s the one we have too. It’s definitely expensive but the cheaper models proved unreliable.

      3. +2. 100% worth it. and they are great at customer service if something happens – I moved and somehow lost an internal piece (that blocks the cat from getting food on her own – yes, I took it apart to clean it, yes, I swear I put it all back together) – and their customer service was fantastic.

    14. When I brought home a new bag of cat food last night, I left it on the table last night, instead of putting it away. Cat slashed it open and chowed down, instead of coming into the bedroom at all overnight…

    15. I did and it helped a lot – until the cat figured out how to move it forward with his paw (it was one of the clamshells with 5-6 meals) and started helping himself. We tried a gravity feeder on a timer, but like Equestrian Attorney’s cat, he figured out how to wiggle his kibble free. The only thing that has helped is giving the cat a bedtime snack and locking him in the spare bedroom. And replacing the lever handle on that room with a round knob so he can’t let himself out.

    16. In my experience, cats judge feeding times by amount of daylight (thus why DST is a giant pain in my household). I’ve found that tightly shutting all blinds and curtains at night to block morning sun helps a little. It gives us maybe 20-30 extra minutes of peace, depending on the time of year and amount of cloud cover.

  4. Is it still worth it to contribute to FSA and Dependent Care accounts in light of the new changes to the tax code? We will no longer be able to itemize deductions with the increased exemption. I know these contribution accounts help reduce taxable income and we are right on the cusp moving up a bracket, so I’m thinking these accounts are still useful for us. However, if it is not going to make much difference, I’d rather have the increased take home pay. I know, I know…we should consult a CPA. I’m just looking for some general/casual advice.

    1. You don’t have to itemize to use FSA and Dependent Care accounts. I’ve never itemized in my life and have used these accounts for years. Definitely do it.

    2. Still worth it. The account is pre-tax money. Say you have a $1000 daycare bill. Option 1 is to earn $1360, pay ~27% tax which brings you down do $1000 and then pay the bill. Option 2 is to earn $1360 and put it in a dependent care account, on which you pay no income tax. You then pay the bill from the dependent care account and have $360 for the next month’s bill.

    3. FSA and Dependent care accounts aren’t deductions. They reduce your W-2 wages so you pay taxes on less income.

    4. What everyone else said, plus – being near a tax bracket does not make a big difference. The higher bracket only applies to the income above the threshold. To simplify, imagine the brackets are 10% for the first $100k and 25% for the income above $100k. If you earn $100k, your tax is $100k*0.10 = $1,000. If you earn $101k, your tax is $100k*0.10 + $1k*0.25 = $10,250. It is not $101k* 0.25 = $25,250.

      1. This. It is a really common misconception that “going up a bracket” equates to “multiply your ENTIRE income by the new bracket percentage.”
        When you’re thinking about the savings that an FSA or HSA can get you, though, I like to think of it as saving me whatever the “bracket” percentage is. We’re in the (enormous) 35% tax bracket, so using FSA money to pay for eligible expenses is basically like getting 1/3 off anything we can use it for!

  5. Tagging onto White Elephant above, for some reason I have a bunch of stocking stuffer/white elephant/gift exchanges with a $5 limit. What are your favorite things to receive in the $5 range. I’ve thought of lottery tickets, tinkle razors, and that’s all I’ve got.

    2. I like nice mini hand sanitizers from Bath and Body Works. Lottery tickets are fun too.

    3. Nail polish, umbrella (Ikea for example regularly has them for like $3.99), travel sizes of nice shampoo/conditioner, sheet mask, a pack of fun colored pens, nice hair ties, basically anything from the end caps in the Target beauty section.

    4. Sheet masks, bath bombs, cute coffee mug.
      I once went to a white elephant where someone brought a roll of wrapping paper and a roll of scotch tape. It was about a week before Christmas so everyone had a bunch of wrapping left to do. It ended up being the most stolen gift of the night!

    8. fun mug from tj maxx or something, water tumbler with straw and lid, starbuck card, dunkin card, hand sanitizer/lotion , fun patterned socks, candy,

    9. If you’re near a Trader Joe’s, I usually get the box of chocolate covered peppermint Joe Joes for that price point. I believe they are $4.

      2. I just put out a whole package of those Trader Joe’s cookies on a cookie tray for students and they were gone in minutes. Inhaled! And they smelled so good.

    10. A good gift I’ve received in that price range is a tiny bottle of Jack Daniels tied to a can of Coke.

  6. Does anyone have them? Recommend? More of a fashion item than primary bad weather winter footwear. Just tired of flats.

    1. I don’t have that exact model (I have the Farah), but I totally wear them in the winter. All the time. I like them. Mine are a little narrow through the toe/ball of the foot, so I only wear thin wool socks but that’s sufficient.

    2. I have some Sorel Chelsea Boots (can’t remember the exact name) and I wear them waaaaay more than I thought they would. So comfortable, so warm, and don’t look like rain/snow boots. My friend said she wore hers on a solo Europe trip and they survived miles and miles of walking comfortably, so that helped me make my decision.

  7. Does anyone have a wind resistant winter running jacket recommendation? I need something for 10-30 degree Fahrenheit days. There’s a good amount of wind in my area. If you have a recommendation, will you also give me an idea of what you wear under it to run in these conditions? Thanks so much in advance.

    1. The one I have is at least 10 years old, but it is a very thin fleece softshell from Nike with a hood. I would wear at least 1 layer under it, possibly 2 at the lower end of that temperature range. I have a thin wicking long-sleeve, a thin grid fleece long sleeve, and an old Duofold polypropylene long underwear top I wear.

    2. I’ve never run in 10 degree weather but regularly run on 20-30 degree days. I have a newish Nike half zip pullover (the waffle fabric is amazingly warm yet light) that is adequate if wear a long sleeved dryfit crew neck under it that is tucked into my running tights. I also like thicker fleece socks, gloves and a fleece headband that covers my ears on cold mornings.

    3. I recommend the North Face ski jackets. They have a removable liner that functions as a second, smaller jacket. I’ve had mine since a church trip in 2009. No one ever guesses that it’s a decade old. I love that it’s multifunctional too. When I lived in Atlanta, I used the outer layer as a rain coat. When I moved to Boston, I wore both layers together on the heavy snow days. Now that I live in D.C., I use either the inner or outer layer to exercise outside, and both layers on our annual couples cabin trip. I have no idea how much it cost (was in high school when I got it), but it is the one article of clothing I have that I wear multiple times every year and it still looks great.

    4. I love the Brooks LSD jacket. I live in Chicago and try to run through all weather. It serves me pretty well, even on the coldest, windiest days if I layer beneath.

    6. I wear a Patagonia windbreaker over a fleece / long sleeved shirt (depending on the temp).

      With a caveat, that I rarely run outside when it is below 30.

    7. If wind is your issue, you’ll want the Patagonia Houdini jacket. It’s tissue thin, so layer underneath, but blocks wind like a total boss. It also folds into its own pocket so it can live in your running kit if you happen to need it.

  8. Tall ladies: What tights do you like? I am so sick of buying tights where the crotch barely makes it past my knees. I have given away so many pairs of ill-fitting tights. Sizing up doesn’t necessarily work, either. Hue is the best I’ve found for length, but they’re cut narrow through the hips, IMO. I’m 5’8,” so not outlandishly tall, but this has been an issue for as long as I can remember! I’m a size 10-12.

    1. Marks & Spencers! You have to ship internationally but I think there is free shipping. I’m 5’7 and a size 10 and wear a large.

      1. <3 M&S make my favourite tights, camisoles and underpants and I either pick them up in the UK or ship them to Canada (and they've updated their shipping policies so there are no more surprise customs charges).

    2. Also 5’8″, and I have good luck with Berkshire tights. I love the fleece lined!

    3. I bought Target’s a new day tights this year and I think they run pretty long and narrow (I’m 5’6). I haven’t thought this of previous years’ tights from Target, so if you have tried them before it may be a good time to give them a second look.

    4. I’m the exact same size as you. If you’re not price sensitive, Wolford tights in size L work perfectly for me. I have the merino ones and the cashmere ones. Both usually last at least 3-4 seasons.

    5. Spanx tights are pretty long. Tights should all mostly stretch upward though, I’ve been rocking a size Q since I was a size 2 12 year old. Don’t be afraid to go up to an even larger size than you might think you need, like a 2x – it’s just a label. JC Penney also sells lengths in some hosiery, most of my hosiery is from there but is pretty old. They used to have an amazing selection of tall sized stuff, but it’s gotten no so great after they began their decline.

      1. +1 to spanx. I’m 5’11” and disproportionately long in the leg. I wear size E and have worn it over a +/- 30lb weight range no problem. I have tights that are close to 10 years old.

        1. +2 to Spank. I’m 5’11, all legs and also wear an E. I like an F if I do their nylons just because they last longer. Their tights have lasted me multiple seasons though!

          1. Bless you. I’m looking at other comments, talking at 5’6-8 LOL

            5’11 here and the crotch of my tights is right now at mid-thigh. I’m dyin!

      2. +3 to Spanx, specifically the “Original Mid-Thigh Shaping Tights.” I’m 5’8″ and a size 12. I’m right on the edge between a C and D. Most of my pairs are a C but I got a D this year. They’re a tiny bit big…but just to the point that the control top isn’t as tight as I’d like. I do have relatively short legs for my height though, so keep that in mind when choosing a size.

      3. Spanx! I bought 6 pairs about 3 years ago and I wear them every day in the winter. The crotches are just now starting to wear out.

    6. I’m 5’9” and a 10/12, I love the Spanx tights (link to follow) in size C. They have a wide waist band so they are really comfortable. They wear amazingly well too, in looking to answer your question, I found the last time I ordered them was in 2016 and they are near daily wear for me in winter.

    7. I’m 6′ tall, size 8-10, and have had my Assets tights (Spanx knockoff from Target) for years. Love them.

      1. +1 I’m 5’10 and these work for me as well. I’ve also found J. Crew’s to be long enough but full disclosure haven’t bought any in 3-4 years, so that may no longer be the case.

    8. I get the ones at Costco. I forget the brand but they only had one kind at my Costco. They’ve held up for 3 years.

    11. I am a very thin, long-legged 5’9″ and wear Commando (black) tights. I buy size small and have never had an issue with them being too short.

    12. I am 5’11” and 135 (size 0-2), and have had the best luck with Nine West tights.

  9. What are y’all wearing with skirts these days? And, for that matter, what are y’all wearing with cowl necks like this one? Just skinny pants?

    I’m wearing a skirt I like a lot with a cowl neck sweater today, and I feel a little dated.

    1. I love cowl necks but feel like all mine are from 4-5 years ago and that yes it is a little dated.
      I am on the frumpy side so I don’t mind but I feel like pussy bow or tie blouses are still more “in”. Cold shoulders on the way out, I hope. Notched collars and lapels seem to be a lot more “in”.

    2. I love this color and I’m plus sized. I think I should just buy it while I can find it, right?

      I think I would wear a sweater like this mostly on the weekends with jeans. I think it probably is slightly outdated worn as a cowl but i don’t want to deal with bra strap issues wearing it as an off the shoulder.

      I would also wear it to the company Christmas lunch with my jingle bell earrings!

    3. The only cowl (yes, from 4-5 years ago) I have left has a more rigid collar and can stand up like a mock neck, so it feels fresh again. I’m very into the mock necks available currently, because I like a higher neck top and turtlenecks that fold down really don’t work on me.

    4. Is this a Miranda Priestly perspective? Cowl necks are everywhere in the stores this season. Does that mean they are passe? If you feel that cowl necks are out of fashion, where are you located? NYC?

      1. Are they? Maybe it’s thsi particular cowl neck, or maybe it’s jsut the cowl neck with the skirt. I don’t know, that’s why I asked. Something about my outfit, and I am not sure what, isn’t working.

        2. How are the proportions of the top to the skirt? Is the skirt a-line or pencil in shape? And what shoes are you wearing? All of that affects whether I feel frumpy.
          Or…is it the color combo? Or your mood? Or the fact that the sweater is wearing out and feels oldish to you? Or that you never liked the skirt? Or you feel off in the shoes? Or that you just came out of a meeting with a coworker who looked pulled together and on-trend? Stuff like that affects me, too!

    6. You can pry cowl-necks out of my cold dead hands. I need something on the back of my neck, so cowl-necks are more open than turtlenecks (I have both in rotation).

    7. I think that cowls that have been worn and/or washed repeatedly start to lose their shape, and the sad stretched-out neck is what looks dated–not the style itself. All of mine are like this, but I’m not willing to put a ton of time and effort into treating my laundry with delicacy.

  10. I need ideas for very, very easy desserts. I have a holiday party coming up and no time or energy for much of anything. I’m vaguely remembering somebody posting about buying pre-made crusts and filling them with ice cream, which sounds about my speed, but I’m not sure I’ll have access to a freezer. Any ideas?

    1. You can fill pre-made crusts with chocolate pudding also. Then you just need to refrigerate or carry in something insulated.

    2. Get a boxed brownie mix, sub the oil for butter, the water for milk, and sprinkle coarse sea salt on top. Voila — fancy homemade-tasting sea salt brownies.

        1. Yep! Melt the same amount of butter as oil you’d use. Or use a flavored olive oil! I have an amazing orange olive oil that would be ridiculously good baked into brownies.

          I am ALL ABOUT hacks like this to make boxed stuff taste good because I’m a terrible baker and need all the help I can get. I have fooled everyone I know into thinking I’m a baking queen.

      3. Boxed brownie mix, sub the water for Bailey’s. It might cook a few minutes faster (or that’s just my wonky oven).

      4. Alternatively Ghirardelli mixes are amazing and everyone thinks they’re homemade, no substitutions required.

      1. There will be a fridge but it will likely be full so I’m not planning on having access.

        Thanks for all the ideas so far!

    4. I would hit the freezer section at your market, get a frozen pie and defrost and bake it. Then make some whip cream.

    5. For the record, at this time of year I’m totally ok with phoning it in and buying something. I think everyone understands how crazy it gets. But if you need a something more homemade, I recommend a cobbler dump cake. Pretty sure I got this from someone else on here a while back. Instructions are:
      Dump 1 large can of peaches (or other fruit of choice) into a 9×13 pan.
      Pour a box of yellow cake mix on top.
      Cut a stick of butter into pieces on top of the cake mix.
      Bake at 350 for 50 minutes.

      1. And if you want to be super fancy, sprinkle the top with chopped nuts before baking.

    6. I once placed Godiva chocolates on silver tray with a paper doilie. I sort of ran out time and had received a nice box as a gift and it all fell into place. I also LOVE the combination of chocolate, blue cheese, pears and walnuts so I think that would be nice on a tray. Maybe with some honey and dessert crackers.

    7. Another boxed brownie trick. Make as directed, but pull them out of the oven 3-4 minutes before they’re done. Lay mints (below) on top and stick the pan back in the oven for the remaining time. When they’re done, spread the mints with a spatula. So good and so easy.

      There are two brands of the mints, either is fine:

      Zachary: https://www.amazon.com/ZACHARY-PEPPERMINT-THIN-MINTS-PACK/dp/B01LYAHF79
      Haviland: https://www.amazon.com/Haviland-Dark-Chocolate-Thin-Candies/dp/B005YEJRZ6

      They’re easiest to find at discount stores like Big Lots or Christmas Tree Shops or Family Dollar.

    8. Google “dump cake recipes.” They are so, so easy. You don’t even mix the ingredients! Just layer and bake and it comes out delicious and festive if you use cherry pie filling. Add a scoop of vanilla ice cream when it’s still warm, and your guest will love it!

    9. My go to easy dessert is “home made” ice cream sandwiches. Buy or bake cookies, spread ice cream in between 2, and done. It also offers options so people could have cookies or ice cream but not both if they didn’t want it.

  11. I need exfoliation help. I have a dry skin around my nose and chin that looks bad under makeup (hello patchy flakes). I used an entire red container of Stridex pads, and I’m currently using Nip and Fab glycolic pads. I also use a gritty scrub in the shower a couple times a week, and I use a hyaluronic serum and a moisturizer, but my skin still isn’t smooth like my forehead. What am I missing?

    1. Ouch!!! That’s a really harsh regime. Try using a gentle toner daily and that it,

    2. Stop scrubbing the crap out of your skin! That’s what’s causing the dry skin. You need to moisturize, not scrub. Never use a physical scrub on your face, they’re way too harsh on facial skin. Only chemical exfoliants.

    3. I would dial it back! Maybe go without the scrub for a week and see what that does? I used those awful awful St. Ives scrubs as a misguided teenager and I regret it. Using a washcloth (gently!) every couple of days is enough physical exfoliation for me.

    4. Moisturize, moisturize, moisturize! And I think a regular washcloth is probably enough exfoliation!

    5. Stridex is REALLY harsh. Do a glycolic pad maybe two or three times a week, max, and focus on repairing your moisture barrier with serum, moisturizer, and maybe something with ceramides. Also try getting a humidifier in your room if you don’t have one already.

    6. It does sound like you need to dial it back a little. For gentle exfoliation, I like the Herbivore Blue Tansy mask (only a couple times a week, max) and the Tatcha Rice Enzyme Foaming Powder (again, only a few times a week). I also put Vaseline on my face every night to help heal any dry skin, especially in winter, and I get very frequent compliments on my skin. Otherwise, just use a gentle foaming cleanser with no exfoliation or beads in it (I like the Caudalie foaming cleanser).

    7. Agree with everyone else that your current regime is too harsh! you need to moisturize more, not exfoliate!

      After you’ve gone a week or two without exfoliation, if you want to do it weekly, I’d suggest something much gentler. Either a chemical peel, or something water-based. I don’t remember off the top of my head what the brand I use is called, but it’s along the lines of “aqua face gel peel”

    8. Second “You need to moisturize, not exfoliate”. Facemasks always help me when I have dry patches like what you describe.

    9. It sounds like you have a compromised moisture barrier. It’s more than just a matter of hydrating and moisturizing. You have to prevent trans epidermal water loss (TEWL), which is the process of water leaving the skin, resulting in loss of hydration. A couple of tips: Sheet masks! My fave budget ones are My Beauty Diary, the hyaluronic acid serum ones or the black pearl ones. Get one of those Daiso silicon sheet mask covers from Amazon and let that thing marinate on your skin, you can leave it on for hours. Don’t rinse it off, tap it in to your skin and cover with moisturizer. Second tip is you probably need an occlusive layer at night. When you wash your face at night, don’t let it dry. Apply your serums and whatnot, slather your wet skin with thick moisturizer, and then apply an occlusive layer such as Aquaphor or Cerave Healing Ointment to prevent moisture from escaping. Third: Put a humidifier in your room and run it while you sleep. Fourth: Check out videos by Dr. Dray on youtube.

    10. You are way, way overdoing exfoliation! Give your skin a break!

      I had tons of skin problems (acne, oily t-zone, flaky skin around the nose, patchiness, redness) until I learned to lay.off.the.exfoliants other than a gentle scrub (I like Acure’s Brilliantly Brightening) twice a week, max. I use a cleanser and then a face oil most nights, some nights I use the TonyMoly banana sleeping pack I learned about here. I would recommend getting the sleeping pack as it is GREAT for skin that is out-of-balance or that has been overly dried out.

      Be gentle to your skin! The more you scrub it the more problems you will have. Try taking Country Life Collagen + C&A vitamins and drinking more water rather than adding more products to your regime. It will take a few weeks for things to even out but the flakiness will go away once your skin has time to heal.

  12. Preface: I’m in a state where recreational marijuana is available legally as of about two weeks ago. With that, can you abuse or be addicted to marijuana? I think the answer is yes, and liken it to alcohol use. There’s recreational and then there’s abusive behavior. Is that fair? I’ve often heard the argument that, unlike “real drugs”, you can’t be addicted to weed, but I’m not sure I buy that.

    I’m trying to support my husband through a significant loss that occurred earlier this year. I believe he is self-medicating underlying depression and extreme grief via abusive behaviors with marijuana. Frequent, secretive use – actually telling me, through tears, he’s glad he was caught last time I stumbled on him using it in this way. Spending money that was otherwise intended to be spent on other things, using it to aid sleep, make him “feel numb” during certain, admittedly very difficult, circumstances related to said loss (going through personal belongings, facing the holiday season, hitting certain personal milestones without the deceased to share in the joy, etc.).

    My initial response was extreme anger due to the lying, my general dislike of weed (still a “drug” in my book, but I have admittedly evolved my thinking on it as it becomes legal/more mainstream), spending money, etc. Now, my anger about weed has morphed into significant concern for him. I’m urging him to seek professional help, which he is willingly in the process of seeking out. What else can I do? Trust has really, really been damaged but part of me thinks he need to work on himself before we can begin to fully repair ourselves (maybe via couples therapy, maybe not..). Thoughts?

    1. And, in case it needs saying: this is the “through sickness and in health” part of our vows as far as I’m concerned. These are generally new behaviors (used to recreationally use which wasn’t my favorite, but I it was ‘price of admission’ so they say) tied to a very specific, very life changing and sad event in our lives. DTMF is not what I’m looking for.

    2. Wow I think you’re being really harsh on him. He’s depressed and grieving and in pain and suffering. He doesn’t need tough love.

      Tell him you’re sorry he is in such pain. Support him getting therapy. Ask him to work with you in marriage counseling to find ways for him to communicate his needs to you and for you to support him.

      You make it sound like he just up and started shooting up!

      1. +1. This is full-on grief and needs patience. Maybe years of patience. It will be up and down. You need to be his port in the storm. Not about the weed use, but about his grief. If there comes a time when you can’t be that place, help him for another place – a support group, a good friend, a therapist.

      2. Whoa, did we read the same post? Depressed, grieving, and in pain are horrible. But they don’t give a person carte blanche to sneak around, break the law, and blow your joint savings. (I’m very pro legalization but it was illegal in her state for most of his use. He put her at major risk by likely having and using drugs in her house. I would lose my job and likely my career if my husband did that and my work found out.)

        OP, you’re likely right that he needs therapy to work on his issues (both the drug use and the depression) first. You likely need therapy to work through your feelings related to this and determine what is a reasonable expectation for you to have once he’s better. And then, after he’s better and you’ve processed your feelings, you’ll likely need couples therapy to work through trust issues and communication.

        1. Where exactly did you read he blew their life savings? She doesn’t mention any legality concerns

      3. IDK — I knew someone who kept unused Oxy pills and then used them to self medicate a hard breakup, found that they were really good at blocking the pain, and that + drinking just spiraled.

        I have worked through some bad things and think that I might not come out on the other side if I had added drugs, bad spending, and hiding things from my spouse into the mix.

        If you love him and he is OK, counseling and a neutral third party won’t harm him. But if he isn’t OK, it may help. Self-medicating can be a form of self-harm that just is slower than something like cutting.

    3. You can be addicted to anything that lets you escape something else. FWIW, secretive use was the biggest red flag for me before I decided to quit drinking.

      There is really not much you can do, other than be supportive of him as he’s getting help. Learn about boundaries. Don’t mommy him. This has nothing to do with you.

      1. Also, grief and addiction are two separate issues. I agree with everyone above that grief is not something he can just snap out of. Getting high is not a healthy way to handle grief, although it is very common.

    4. I’d say yes, you can abuse marijuana, just like you can abuse alcohol or food or medications that have therapeutic value. And it sounds like both you and your husband are growing concerned about his use and dependence on this drug. I don’t think you are being too harsh here to be worried. I think he needs to focus on his underlying depression/grief and working with a professional to find better strategies for managing it and also learning how to sit with and work through those uncomfortable feelings. By doing that, he may find his desire for marijuana as a coping mechanism subsides.

    5. The weed is the symptom. It sounds like the underlying problem isn’t being addressed well enough. Why is he “self-medicating” and not in therapy or under the care of a psychiatrist, or both? Is he getting the support he needs to handle this loss? Once the underlying issue is resolved, I expect the “excessive” use of weed will resolve itself, particularly because you husband seems to acknowledge he would like to use it less. I distinguish between abuse and addiction in this context…. people can abuse anything that provides an escape, including weed. (See also p0rn, food, s3x, video games–ever seen someone drop out of school because they play world of war craft? oy.) But weed is not addictive in the same way that say heroin is so that your body becomes physically dependent on it.

    6. We are probably in the same state. Marijuana isn’t chemically addictive in the sense that he will go through withdrawal if he stops using it. He also can’t overdose on it. But anything can be psychologically addictive, the same as people eating their feelings with sweets (been there). If he is hiding his use, I’d say that’s a problem. But he sounds depressed. I would focus on supporting him there, not on the marijuana. Perhaps couples counseling or medication.

      1. I agree with this and the anon just above. See if your husband can talk to a therapist (unconditional positive regard! you have your own legitimate needs that you bring to a conversation with your husband, but a therapist doesn’t!) about the grief and loss and depression, and I think the weed will take care of itself.

    7. I think they mean your body doesn’t become addicted to weed the way it can be chemically addicted to alcohol or other hard drugs. Quitting cold turkey would still probably suck but it won’t make you shake, sweat, and vomit. You can absolutely develop a psychological addiction to it though, especially if you use it to get through a bad period in your life like your husband is doing, and it also sounds like he’s engaging in a lot of bad behaviors that accompany addiction.
      It sounds like he’s already seeking out counseling, I’d just try to be patient and kind with him. Getting angry and using tough love will probably just cause him to sneak around more.

    8. Yes you can be addicted to MJ, but only in the way that you can be addicted to chewing gum, or biting your nails. MJ is not addictive like cigarettes.

      That being said, his behavior sounds a lot more like the kind of agitated anxious behavior that I get when I am about to have a panic attack. I would recommend therapy and they will probably recommend medication. Perhaps including medical MJ. It does help a lot of people with General anxiety disorder.

      I hope he feels better soon. Anxiety and depression are pretty terrible. However, a guilt trip from you about an activity he enjoys and probably does make him feel better, is not helpful.

  13. What should I bear in mind in choosing a health insurance plan if I’m planning on trying to conceive in early 2019? If it matters, I’m a federal employee (DC). I know there have been threads on this in the past, but I haven’t been able to find them. This is feeling pretty overwhelming — any help would be appreciated!

    1. If you suspect that you may need fertility assistance, there is only one plan that covers any of it (I forget which one, maybe MDIPA?).

    2. This isn’t DC-specific, and I’m not a health insurance expert (just a person who has given birth and had to make these decisions), but there are a few background facts you should take into consideration (besides the fertility assistance that anon a mouse mentioned):
      1) Routine prenatal visits are covered 100% by insurance and don’t count towards your deductible (thank you, Obamacare).
      2) Extra screenings, like extra anatomy scans beyond the standard 20 week one or genetic testing, is not required to be covered by your insurance.
      3) The cost of giving birth is going to be high, but HOW high is not predictable – everything might go 100% according to plan or you might need an emergency C-section or other extra services.

      In addition to the above, you need to think about what your non-pregnancy-related healthcare expenses usually look like. Do you (or your spouse if they are on the same plan) have a chronic health condition that requires frequent doctors’ visits? Or, do you expect (because you’re advanced maternal age, or have a family history of health conditions, etc.) that you will want extra genetic testing? If so, you almost certainly want a low-deductible plan. If not, and you think you probably won’t have many expenses outside the actual giving birth process, you might want to consider a plan that has a moderate deductible but a flat fee for birthing costs.

      2. This is definitely not true. I had to pay for all my prenatal visits until I hit my deductible and then it was only covered 80%. This is different from preventative care, which is covered immediately even if you haven’t met your deductible. The office visits were only $100ish but ultrasounds are expensive, around $500. Also, if you’re AMA insurance will cover genetic testing and many insurance plans now cover it even for younger women (mine did, but again I had to hit my deductible first and hadn’t, so it was essentially out of pocket). It’s not that expensive though, I think it was $600 for me.

        I also think you have to do the math on high-deductible vs low deductible plans. At my employer the low deductible plans just don’t make sense in any situation – whether you expect to spend $0, $5k, $10k or $50k on healthcare, the HDHP are always a better deal. Do the math with different numbers and see what plan is best. If the answer is always the same plan (as it was for me), just pick that one. If the answer varies based on the number, then you might talk to your doctor to get a better sense of estimated costs. As one data point, I had a v-birth with epidural and my out of pocket costs were about $7k. $3500 of that was just meeting my deductible (mostly through office visits, ultrasounds and genetic testing), and then another $3500 was my 20% co-pay on in-network services. I didn’t have anything out of network or not covered.

    3. Same boat as you re TTC early 2019. None of my options cover IVF, but some cover IUI. I also checked out specialist copays and the cost of maternity stays in the hospital.

    4. I’ve been very happy with the BCBS FEP plan. No co-pays for prenatal visits or ultrasounds, and my c sections both cost nothing more than the hospital co-pay (around $150, I think). I’m not sure about fertility coverage, though.

  14. Thinking of a very last minute getaway somewhere in the Caribbean sometime during the last two weeks of December. Am I right that everything will be crazy expensive? We’re ok spending money but are we just too late to plan something?

    Any ideas on where to go? Flying out of DC and would prefer direct flight, two young kids, looking for beautiful beach where water is very warm, prefer a place with a kitchen so condo instead of a hotel. Thanks!

    1. So last minute I’d use a travel agent. Lots of stuff is booked everything will be expensive, use a professional

    2. I agree on the travel agent. I booked for U.S. Virgin Islands in January, and the flights were $570, about double from a few months ago.

    3. It’s going to be crazy expensive. The Caribbean is really popular for the holidays, with both Americans and Europeans.

      I would try the Dominican republic, it’s large enough that there are probably many options.

  15. Pear here: I have only ever had luck with BR Logan cut pants and AT Loft Julie fit (pants, skinny cords, boot-cut cords; the sizes vary wildly but something always works).

    What else works for you all?

    1. The mom board recommended Uniqlo pants to me a few weeks ago and I’m really loving them!

    2. J.crew martie pants. The cotton ones fit me true to size, but I have to size up for the wool ones. Not sure if you are looking for jeans as well, but I have good luck with the 9 inch skinny high rises from madewell.

    3. J Crew High Rise Cameron. (The regular Cameron was ok but I like a high-rise better.)

      Shockingly, the Everlane Work pant also worked for me.

    4. Ann Taylor Factory Signature Fit (oddly, not the Curvy fit). They are more fitted in the thighs, though, so go with the Curvy if you have bigger thighs. I like how the Signature Fit fits through my hips and butt, the Curvy fit was a little big/baggy on me.

      I usually buy Loft Julie Fit, fyi.

  16. PSA to yesterday’s leggings-seeker: The Halogen seamed ponte leggings are on mega-sale at Nordstrom right now. Limited sizes but they go to XXL. On me they fit more like a mid-rise, not a high rise.

  17. I was reading on GFY that Kate Middleton has a long torso. Which to me explains why I think people built like her can wear Boden (and me, with a very short torso, cannot) and other British brands. I love Boden (the catalog at least) but can only wear their shifts. My torso is so short that my tummy is where they think the waist should be (which is no doubt why I think I look pregnant) but the petite length is often too short otherwise. I must be my proportionally-challenged b/c my sister used to have to get long-torso bathing suits and can wear Boden fitted dresses just fine.

    1. I have a long torso and in my experience Boden runs very short-waisted. The waist of any Boden dress hits at the top of my ribcage and the hips of the dress hit around my waist.

      1. Wait, what is the difference between long torso and short waists? All I know is that I have short legs, as evidenced by where my hips fall compared to others my height. Does that make me long torso’d? What about waist?

        2. One can be long or short waisted (longer or shorter distance from bust to waist), and have a short, normal, or long rise (distance from crotch to waist). For example, I am short-waisted with a normal rise, so torso length is somewhat shorter than average. Any waistband at my actual waist is about a finger’s width below my bottom ribs, so I prefer lower waistbands so as not to feel cut in half.

        3. Long torso (or long waisted) and short waisted (short torso) are opposite conditions and really don’t have (much) to do with leg length.

          Short waisted means your natural waist (where you bend if you bend over to the side) is higher (closer to your bust line) than average. And long torso means its lower than average.

          Another way to think about it is if more of your height is from your legs than your torso, you could be short waisted. If more of your height is from your torso than your legs, then you could be long waisted. if your proportions skew one way or the other, basically.

      2. +1 I’m 5’10 and long-torsoed and I own only one Boden lace dress from a few years ago, as most of them I’ve tried are far too short waisted. I think Kate looks amazing in everything because she has a killer metabolism and what isn’t made bespoke for her is most certainly tailored.

      3. I am very short-waisted and Boden fits me like a glove; it’s one of the only brands whose clothes look like they were cut just for my body.

        1. There must be no rhyme or reason to it because I’m a long-waisted petite and they’re a smidge long waisted for me even (or perhaps just not that petite), but a pretty good fit.

  18. Has anyone successfully installed a mesh Wi-Fi network in their home? We have an old house with apparently very solid walls and our cheapie Wi-Fi extenders aren’t cutting it. Any tips or recommendations?

    1. Definitely get one! We have Orbi by Netgear, which works great (but honestly I think any of them are likely fine). There is absolutely no interruption or difference in service throughout the house. Your devices don’t jump on and off.
      It feels like one very powerful wifi network, whereas before the wifi in our bedroom was always hit or miss.

    2. We have the Google mesh wifi and I love it. No more spots in the house where the wifi isn’t strong enough for a device to connect. Has made working from home a lot easier.

  19. I’m looking for shearling mittens for myself. Can anyone recommend some they have personal experience with? I’d prefer something without a giant logo (ugg, I’m looking at you), but otherwise don’t really care how they look. I have small hands if that matters. I’m kind of eyeing some ones at Overland, but I know nothing about that company.

    1. I love the Cadence gloves by La Canadienne. Link to follow. Have had them for 4 years now in Canada.

  20. I’ve been listening to “The Dream” podcasts which has been discussed here and is a deep dive investigation into MLM schemes. I know so many women who have left their jobs (for other reasons), sought meaning and income, and engaged in MLM schemes. They are all highly educated, organized and smart – and they are all over my FB feeds. I was shocked at the statistics on how many people lose money on MLMs…something like 99% of people lose money. All the women on my FB seem so successful and happy. And I know them! They’re not dishonest or anything. The podcast was so eye opening. (To be clear – I believe the podcast.) My question is — are any of you involved in MLMs and do you make money? What has your experience been? I would love to ask my friends, but I think it would be touchy.

    1. I’m a tax accountant and I’ve prepared taxes for a variety of clients who work for MLMs. Not a single one of them makes money. Most of them are supported by their well off husbands. I do think it’s possible to make money in them, but you have to be in the right place at the right time. My aunt is in the upper eschelons of Mary Kay, but she got in in the mid 90s (pre-Sephora), living in a wealthy suburb of an Ohio town filled with well off SAHMs who loved going to her makeup parties, and she was very very successful.

      As far as people looking successful on facebook, that’s the entire point of facebook. No one is going to go on there and say “wow, I sure was bamboozled out of a ton of money because I did something really dumb”. The conventions that these folks go to are very victim blamey, and act like if you’re not successful it’s because you’re not trying hard enough.

      1. I get that people aren’t going to advertise their losses, but I really don’t understand why they are advertising fake success either. Does that make sense? Like, posting a picture of their kids and saying – “ohhhh, little Madison doesn’t have to rot in daycare any more because I make enough money with my MLM to stay at home, she’s my ‘why'”. Like, just don’t say anything. Be a SAHM and enjoy your life. Fade quietly. Nobody is going to ask you about how your MLM is going.

        I’m just so fascinated by all of it. I never paid much attention before the podcast.

        1. I’m guessing it’s because they get the most money when they recruit others to be under them in the pyramid. Selling the product is only a very small portion of what makes money. They have to sell the lifestyle that comes with being successful in the pyramid.

        2. In general, I find that the more people post on FB about how great their lives, relationships, MLMs, etc. are, the less it’s true. They’re trying to convince themselves, like if you post it and tell everyone than it must be true! The people that are actually happy are too busy to bother. And if you notice, everyone that posts like crazy about their MLMs strangely enough stop doing so after about six months….

          Also, definitely agree it’s about selling the lifestyle, and obviously you’re not going to be able to recruit underlings (or even sell product, especially those absurd health/fitness supplements and drinks) if you admit your MLM’s just a massive money pit.

        3. That type of advertising is a feature not a bug. They’re not just selling the product, they are incentivized to get others to join (their “downline”)– hence, the pyramid/ multi-level scheme. That’s the only way to be profitable.

        4. Two reasons: they’re trying to recruit women into joining their downlines, that’s where the real money is, and they’re trying to make their product seem super in-demand to compel people to buy it.

    2. Many of the MLMs actively encourage you to think of your expenses as separate from your sales. So you might get $5000 in sales that month, but you “forget” about the $4900 in expenses to buy the product, print your special business cards, pay for the craft fair booths, pay the credit card fees, give away samples, etc. Plus almost every MLM requires a shockingly huge upfront investment to buy a “Starter Kit” of product, which they promptly encourage you to think about as an investment in your business, and not an actual expense.

      Also, most people aren’t looking to be rich. They just want to make a couple extra hundred a month so they can feel like they’re contributing to the household and accomplishing something, without taking time away from their family. They can’t get a “real” part time job because their priority has to be home – they have to be able to pause for a bit if a kid gets sick or if they go on a vacation or whatever. So they think, yeah I won’t make millions but I can just do it after the kids are in bed, and if I get $200 of spending money, that pays for Son’s basketball camp. But the amount of work, time, and money it takes to even break even is pretty staggering, and that’s why you see so many of your FB friends switch MLMs after six months or so.

      Source: many many many friends and family who do this. We have a lot of pilot and military wives in my family, where it’s really hard for the women to hold a job and maintain the household on their own. MLMs prey very heavily on this exact situation.

      1. Yes, the person I know who got sucked into this the hardest was a military wife, with young kids and a husband who worked a lot and no relatives or support system nearby. They are soo good at making women feel like they have a community, like they have some agency in their lives (if you work hard enough and do x, y, z, you will be a success!), and giving them positive feedback and rah-rah support for their choices. And for people who are already vulnerable to that sort of “if you believe it hard enough you can make it happen” mentality (e.g., evangelical christians), they make it seem like anyone who expresses skepticism for the business plan is a downer who doesn’t believe in your abilities or intelligence, or is even anti-feminist. Like, don’t worry about telling your husband you’re putting thousands of dollars on your new Mary Kay credit card (at 18% interest), because you’ll pay it off right away and he’ll be so impressed with your business acumen!

    3. My brother’s girlfriend does Scentsy (I think she is at Director level) and she goes on a lot of free trips through it. While it’s my understanding that her side-business makes a profit, she does have a full-time job. I respect that she has built it up but I’m also grateful that they have never gifted or tried to sell me any. Not my jam.

    4. I had a close friend who had a full time job as an engineer and got involved with an MLM on the side (one with starter costs of about $3k). I thought it was super weird. She only did it for about 6 months and when we were discussing the reasons for her quitting, I point blank asked her if she had made a profit from it (our group is pretty open about talking about money). She said she had, and told me what they had done with the money. Although she didn’t tell me the dollar amount, based on what they bought with it I got the impression is was just under $1,000. She said the amount of time and effort and stalking people she had put into the business during that 6 months to make that $1,000k was crazy, though.

    5. Years ago I took the deposition of somebody who was very high up in some MLM or other (can’t remember which one now, and yes, I think the lawsuit had to do with everybody losing money at it). He was asked about his (and his wife’s) history with the company, and he said “Well, at first we lost money, but then we figured out we were doing it wrong. The way to make money wasn’t by selling the products. It was recruiting other people to be part of our down-line. So that’s what we concentrated on, and we made a ton of money.”

      Boom. There it was, flat out and in plain English. It blew me away and I never forgot it.

    6. Rant time:

      Modern American society has no forking clue two to distinguish between hobbies, side hustles, and actual jobs that result in enough money to run the house.

      I used to tutor for very, very good money – $70 per hour. People asked me why I didn’t quit my job and do that full-time. I did the math on quitting a high-five figure job with benefits to do a job that can only be done between 3 pm and 8 pm and… blank looks.

      It is willful stupidity. People have been fed this lie that you can have fun and money will rain down from the sky. Or there’s the lie that there’s something wrong and shameful about doing a relatively enjoyable office job, getting a steady paycheck, and moving up the ladder enough to give your kids a nice childhood and help with college.

      That is why the well-educated women “fall” for this – they are the ones who have heard “do what you love and the money will follow” since birth. They are the ones with friends who scrapped and hustled for years and now reap the rewards of their high-powered careers or sexy, intellectual jobs, and they want a piece of the action that their peers have.

      If a woman thinks about a MLM as a way to buy fun products with her employee discount and have an excuse to throw some parties for her friends, power to her. But like any kind of gambling, it is best seen as entertainment with little expectation of actually seeing any of that money again.

      End rant.

  21. To those who recommended the Stila eyeliner earlier this week– you are each a gentlewoman and a scholar, and I salute you. This is the best eyeliner of all time. Thanks for the tip!

    1. I wasn’t the recommender but I have to +1 the stila love.

      If you want a killer there-all-day combo, apply Trish McEvoy eye base essentials first, the liner. My eye makeup looks the same at 8pm as it did at 8am.

  22. Thought I’d come to you wise ladies for a BIRTHDAY gift suggestion for my mom – her b-day is December 31 so I try not to be the person who just doubles up on a Christmas and Birthday combined gift. She’s 60, paralegal at a small law firm. Has had some health issues/surgeries this last year but she enjoys playing I-pad games, listening to piano music on CD, reading local newspapers (seriously, she and my dad subscribe to 10 local papers daily/weekly!). She’s not into wine or fancy food, isn’t tech savvy at all (besides normal functions on I-pad/computer), and generally is a really content person. Budget is $40.

    1. Does she like crossword puzzles? If so, the NYT Crossword subscription (assuming she isn’t otherwise a subscriber) I think has a smart device app.

    2. Someone here a while back recommended the book “How to Listen and Understand Great Music” and I’m really enjoying working my way through the 36-hour audiobook. The CD version is just over $40.

      1. Huh, this sounds like something maybe my MIL would maybe like. She’s not a big reader, but she did play the piano for years so she has an appreciation and ear for music. Plus, she lives alone so having a different distraction than tv could be nice.

    3. I discovered Joseph Thomas crosswords from my local paper and found he has a series of books 100 Fun/Casual/Carefree/Whatever Crosswords. I think they’re quicker and easier than NYT puzzles, and the books are under $10 each — maybe add them to a themed reading/gaming basket with some teas, slippers, blanket, etc.

    4. Get her a tiara. My husband got me a tiara when I was inducted as president of my Rotary Club and I’ve gotten a surprising amount of wear out of it, including, of course, wearing it at my 60th birthday party. We little old ladies love sparkly things.

      1. I bought myself a faux black diamond tiara one year at Charming Charlie’s. I wore it to church the year that Christmas was a Sunday and I can’t tell you how many of my friends threatened to steal it!

  23. Does anyone regularly take three day weekends instead of big blocks of vacation?

    My ~100 person company doesn’t observe any of the lesser holidays, like Columbus Day or Presidents Day, so the only three day weekends we get are Memorial Day and Labor Day. The custom here is pretty much to take a week of vacation in August and a week in December. Thing is, I need more mental breaks throughout the year. Would the optics be terrible of taking those lesser holidays/a three day weekend every 6-8 weeks instead of a big summer vacation? I feel like they’re more noticeable than just being gone for a week.

    1. Disagree that they’re more noticeable, and even if they are, who cares? Use your vacation! I take a ton of three-day weekends!

    2. Yes. My husband takes three day weekends all summer because he has way more vacation days than I do so we only take one full week per year. He loves it. Hadn’t caused him any trouble at work at all. Everyone just knows he’s not going to be there on Fridays.

    3. My boss takes lots of long weekends, more as we get towards the end of the year and he has vacation time to burn. You can use your vacation time whenever you want. I say go for it.

    4. If it’s not the way the rest of the company does it, it might look weird. Such that you might just want to run it by your manager to say “Do you have a problem if do 3-day weekends instead of a couple week-long vacations? That was my plan for 2019 and wanted to makes sure that was okay.”

      I mean, it shouldn’t be weird, but it might be just because it’s different.

    5. I take an extra day or two off over every long weekend and then usually 1 week long trip, so about 6-7 trips per year. Usually I try to schedule my long weekends so I’m not gone the same days a bunch of other people are gone (e.g., I’ll take two days the week after Thanksgiving instead of two days right before). I’ve been doing it for a couple years and it works really well for me.

    6. From an employer/coworker perspective, I don’t think there’s any inherent problem with an employee taking 3-day weekends instead of full weeks.

      YMMV, of course, but I did not have a good experience with long weekends when I took them earlier in my career. The 3-day weekends were actually less noticeable–so unnoticeable that I was often interrupted during my supposed day off. Also, I usually traveled for the long weekend, and I was always exhausted coming back–I’d spent Friday traveling and working, Saturday doing whatever I was there to do, and Sunday traveling. I find it easier to unplug entirely and come back rested with a full week off.

    7. This is a know your workplace sort of thing. When I’ve worked places that didn’t observe Presidents Day, etc., I found a lot of people took those days off anyway. If the kids are off school then someone has to be at home. And a lot of families take vacations then. I think you could easily take off those days and they wouldn’t be as noticeable.

      But in biglaw, at least, I think the three day weekends are almost harder than taking off a full week. I imagine it’s similar anywhere you’re expected to be available on weekends. You’re really taking off 3 days, not 1. Like, no one wants to work on weekends. You can’t exempt yourself from weekend work by taking off Friday every couple of weeks.

    8. I would also consider whether you will actually get a real break with 3-day weekends. I’ve worked a lot of places where taking one business day off just meant that you had to get all of your work for 5 days done in 4. So, I was always worn out before the weekend. In contrast, when you took a full week off, it impacted the amount of work you had to do so that you weren’t overwhelmed leading up to vacation.

      Not everywhere is like this, but it is a factor to consider.

    9. A co-worker at my last job got a hard time because she only used her vacation for long weekends, and never took a full week off. On the one hand, she was an adult and we should respect each other’s choices, on the other hand, they give you vacation time so you can recharge your batteries and come back refreshed, resulting in reduced stress and increased productivity, and it’s kinda tough to fully recharge with just a 3-day weekend unless you do absolutely nothing.
      Case in point, this summer I took a week off to spend time with my family at the beach. Before this trip, I needed at least one extra strength energy shot to get me through the day, most days I had two; after the trip, there were days where I could crush it on no caffeine at all!
      So I think it’s totally valid to use your vacation time to extend weekends for the most part, especially for weekend trips, but I’d urge you to take a longer block of time at least once a year – doesn’t need to be a full week, but maybe you use a few days to take a 5-day weekend.

    10. I think it depends how busy you are– if you’re busy enough you need coverage, people will forget how long you were out but remember that you were “just” out. If it’s quiet enough no one notices, I think that’s a lot easier.

  24. Does anyone have either the Patagonia Better Sweater or the North Face Crescent Jacket? Trying to decide which one to get myself. Also deciding between the full zip vs. the pullover style. Let me know if you have one and how you feel about it. Thanks.

    1. I have the better sweater, full zip. It’s fine, not amazing– it doesn’t do much against the wind, so I often end up still cold when I wear it.

    3. RE: The Patagonia one. I don’t own it, but I have tried on both the full-zip and pullovers. The fabric doesn’t have much give — for that reason, I know a pullover would drive me bonkers. I think you’d have to treat it as a sweater, not a piece of outerwear.

    4. I have the Patagonia better sweater, full zip. Love it. It’s fairly thin for how warm it is, which is good for layering. On really cold ski days, I wear it under a ski jacket. On chilly walks, I throw a puffer vest on top if I need extra warmth. It’s comfy enough to lounge around the house but also looks put together enough for me to wear in the office on the weekend.

  25. I need help finding slim jeans for my flat butt and thick thighs. Preferably something that doesn’t bag out. Everything I try looks horrible…jeggings/skinnies wrinkles galore in the fat under rear/above knee area…straight looks dated/frumpy. Need something in-between. Thanks!

    1. Same body type. I reach for my Talbots Slim Ankle jeans more than any other pair I own. You might also try their jeggings…it’s Talbots, so I can’t imagine they’re super skinny (haven’t tried them myself).

    2. I have the same body type and have lots of struggles finding pants. If you’re willing to try jeggings again, I’ve had good luck with the Liverpool brand. Super comfy. I have a pair that’s two years old that probably needs to be replaced (they’re starting to bag out), but the fact they’ve lasted this long with heavy use is a miracle.

  26. My therapist would like me to try CBD oil for anxiety and insomnia. (I also see a psychiatrist, who is open to this.)

    What are you recommendations on brand and dosage? Do you see relief?

    2. I just started using CBD gummies to help me sleep, and they’ve been working well so far! I just googled around to find a source that seemed reputable.

    3. I would pay no attention to a therapist’s medication suggestion other than to possibly run it by a psychiatrist. Your psychiatrist seems noncommittal — Can you find out if he/she actually recommends this before you proceed?

      1. +1 it seems like there would be medications better tested and safer at this time. Surely if your therapist can point you to CBD, your physician can prescribe something with clinical studies behind it. Even with the preliminary studies for CBD that are published, it sounds more like this might be a veiled attempt to access psychotic drugs legally rather than to treat a specific problem. I would be wary of taking drugs or drug advice from a therapist.

    4. What a bunch of prudes here! You go and take the CBD oil, OP. If it doesn’t make you feel better, I doubt it will make things worse. It’s not like your therapist recommended heroin or meth.

  27. We are doing major construction($250k+, 6-8 months) on our home. It started in October and we have been living in while the construction happens. Our GC gets all the checks and is our main “guy,” and he owns the construction company. The project/site lead is his son (mid 30s) and isnhere every day. There’s another guy who is the son’s right hand guy, who I’d say is here 3x/week.

    I work from home, so I interact with the son and his helper pretty much daily (sometimes it’s greetings, sometimes it’s “hey can you move your car,” or sometimes it’s a project update (excavator is coming tomorrow, don’t park over there or “Heads up I know the kids are home today and we need to do some framing so when is the least bad time to be noisy?”).

    What, if anything, should I do for the two main guys on site for the holidays? They have a little mini office set up in a portion of our basement they are working on. Snacks? I always see them with Dublin Donuts cups- a gift card? If so how much? A holiday cash bonus? That seems…off…as I’d think they would get that from our GC. I also assume I don’t need to get my GC anything because what I’m tying to appreciate is all the on-site hard work in the terrible weather. Our GC (who is lovely!!) just sits fat and happy in his office working specs and coordinating, not lugging steel beams in the freezing rain.

    1. I don’t have an answer, but I’m so relieved that your renovation/contractor story wasn’t a nightmare!

    2. Not cash. I’d get them gift cards for a nice restaurant or steak place ($100ish each?), accompanied by a note about how much you appreciate their hard work, courtesy around the house, etc. I would also put some cookies or nice snacks in their mini-office. If you want to give GC dad a Christmas present, write him an email with great feedback about all of them and the work the company is doing. I used to be in this industry, and his job isn’t necessarily so easy – even for really solid companies who do good work, lots of customers only call to complain (not saying they’re bad people, renovations are stressful!) and don’t say thanks, you did great work until there’s a finished product. It would probably make his day to have someone send him an unexpected, positive email.

    3. You say they have an office set up in your basement…what about buying them their own coffee maker and stocking it with all the fixings? It would go farther than a DD gift card would.

      1. I actually considered just sticking one of our extra ones down there when we made this the little worknsoace (there’s a dump sink over there)- but then they have to clean it/rinse mugs etc and that just seems like more hassle.

  28. Someone asked this yesterday, and I sort of fear this will result in an explosion of judgment and criticism, but I’m genuinely curious: what are you going to give daycare teachers for holiday tips/gifts?

    I’m in a weird situation with brand new teachers (like started on Monday) but perhaps that doesn’t matter?

    Our center is tiny and there’s one staff member who is exclusively on the ‘baby’ side — so she’s never responsible for my kid’s care, or she is like momentarily if another staff member has to go to the bathroom and they need coverage, but basically never. Is it sh*tty to give her less?

    Do you give the director $? What if she sometimes does the same thing as the baby teacher, popping in to cover for other teachers?

    Last year felt so much simpler because everyone kind of bounced around and it was more or less fair to say that each teacher was my kid’s teacher.

    1. I always think of gifts like this is a well to buy goodwill/build a relationship, and less as a reward for past work. For example, when I started in BigLaw in November, I still gave my assistant a gift. And I assume you won’t give a gift to the daycare teachers the December after your kid starts school in September even though the kid was at the daycare for most of the year, so it’s not like it is decided by how much of the year they spent there.

      I can’t speak to the amount, since I don’t have kids. Maybe ask on the moms site. But I wouldn’t think you need to give a gift to people who just pop in to keep the coverage ratios for a few minutes, but don’t have any ongoing responsibilities for your kid’s class.

    2. I don’t give the director anything, s/he’s more like the owner of the business, right? I also don’t give the ‘floaters’ anything, since they’re not with my kid regularly. My daughter’s room has a head teacher, associate teacher and aide. I give $50, $50 and $25 respectively.

      1. We did the same when my kid was in a center. I wouldn’t change it because they are new teachers, as I also ascribe to the “future goodwill” mentality.

    3. I probably go overboard because I am just so thankful for great teachers at my kid’s daycare but I do $100 cash for each of them (2 in the classroom) plus I give $100 towards the pool of floaters for their cash gift. They get paid next to nothing for a job that I am eternally grateful they do well. Aside from my husband, I spent the most on the daycare teachers for individual gift giving.

      1. OK this was approximately what I was planning, so that feels validating. Approx $100 for her main teacher, maybe the same for the brand new teacher, and then something in the $25 range for the floater types.

      2. +1
        The most generous Christmas gifts from us are for the daycare teachers. Couldn’t survive without them and they’ve taught my kid things I wish I was taught when I was little.

    4. Also, re: breakfast and sugar bombs — for tomorrow I’m gonna put together a combo of sugary and healthy and caffeine-y options, so hopefully everyone will enjoy :)

    5. Why would you give the baby teacher anything? That’s weird. A gift of cash to your kids people. That’s it. Don’t make this over complicated.

      1. I guess because there are 4 staff people (and maybe 12 kids?) at the whole center, and one of them is the baby teacher, and my kid knows her? But thanks for the perspective!

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