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Thursday’s Workwear Report: Long-Sleeve Twist Poplin Shirt

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A woman wearing a White House Black Market dark blue top and denim pants

Our daily workwear reports suggest one piece of work-appropriate attire in a range of prices.

This twist-front shirt from White House Black Market is a fun take on a traditional button-up blouse. It also comes in white, but I particularly like the look of the navy color. I’d wear it with a charcoal suit for a look that’s formal, but not too stuffy.

The shirt is on sale for $62.30 (marked down from $89) at White House Black Market and comes in regular sizes 00-18 and petite sizes 00-12. 

Sales of note for 5/21/25:

263 Comments

    1. thAt sPrinG bReaK ’98 cAtaloG is fiRe!

      For real, I’d still wear half that stuff if I still looked that cute, young and fresh. I couldn’t afford deLia’s in 1998 so I was forever looking for the look for less. Now I could afford it!

    2. One of my most prized possessions is a powder blue corduroy jean jacket with faux shearling lining I got from the Delia’s catalog in high school. Pre-pregnancy I could still rock it, so we’ll see what happens post partum.

  2. My kids want to learn how to ski (8 and 7). I am a first generation American and have never went skiing. Does anyone have any tips as to what ski gear I should get for them? I can figure out the basics by searching around (ski jacket, ski pants, etc.), but I am willing to get more than basics so they can be comfortable and this can be an enjoyable experience for them. For example, things like foot warmers get left out of basic lists, but I hear that is a nice thing to have when skiing. I don’t mind spending the money even if they never ski again, but I don’t know anyone that skis and don’t have personal experience! Any tips would be appreciated!

    1. The single most important piece of gear is a good fitting ski helmet. You can buy or rent at the mountain. I had a head injury while skiing as a kid in the time before helmets became popular, and trust me when I say you do not want to go through that. Especially when they’re learning, they’re going to be falling all the time–you want that head protected! Plus they keep your head nice and warm.

      Other things that would be good: wool ski socks (can also get use out of these whether skiing or not), thermal long underwear, fleece neck warmer/balaclava, good ski gloves or mittens, eventually ski goggles. If they’re just learning to ski and the temp is not below zero, foot and hand warmers aren’t really necessary, but they’re cheap and disposable if you want to get them. I rarely use them and find the foot ones uncomfortable.

      1. The falling all the time is why I wouldn’t rent a helmet. Most rental helmets are in poor condition and aren’t treated well. A new helmet isn’t that expensive.

        1. This. It only takes a few days to break even on a helmet purchase v. rental, cost-wise.

    3. Ski boots do not have room for foot warmers. You want the thinnest tall sock you can find. Otherwise, they really only need a jacket, pants, gloves and maybe a thin hat to go under the helmet. Make sure the ski area rents helmets with the skis and boots. If not, another shop in the ski town may rent helmets, but you definitely want them wearing helmets. And don’t worry that they will be too cold; you warm up a lot skiing. If it is crazy cold, like below 0, maybe some of the disposable hand warmers for the gloves.
      My first-time tip: learn to ski first. Learn to snowboard later.
      I did not grow up skiing, either, and decided my family should learn when my youngest son was about 14. He is now 20, loves to ski and is very good at it. I love that I was able to set him up for a lifetime activity. I was terrible at it and now just go to hang out and feed everyone, but I love that, too.

    4. Where are they learning? Gear for Colorado is different vs East coast (ice coast) and Vermont is diffeeent than mid Atlantic.
      I have kids 5-10 and we all ski.

      Rent skis and boots seasonally because they will outgrow them. Get good gloves (recs based on where you live). Shop used for everything except helmets, which they should own and get new. I’d also recommend a boot bag; we got 2 of our 3 used. Get an adult sized one because the youth ones only fit boots up to ~kids size 3.

    5. Don’t bother with foot warmers. We have Hand warmers in our bag for emergencies only. My 10 year old has fantastic mittens (as good as mine); if she or I still needs hand warmers it’s like 0 degrees.

      For my younger kids (5.5, almost 8), I’d they are using handwarmers it’s too cold for them to ski happily. They only ski when it’s above 25 at the base and sunny ;).

      My kids – all girls- wear base layers of leggings + an under armour heat tech Nick turtleneck. If my 10 year old is with me on a cold day she has matching heattech pants or hot chilis.

      Smartwool socks for everyone.

    6. Oh, and a balaclava. Keeps the wind out. I’d maybe wait til next season for this unless you go on a windy day. You need them when you ski top to bottom and fast, which they probably won’t be doing this year.

    7. I am here for this question! If you are talking about this season, which is sadly almost over, just borrow from friends. Rent skis at the mountain for a day and see how they like it. You can rent boots, skis, helmet and poles (if needed). Then for next year, buy a helmet and googles and rent the skis and boots for the season. Pick a day with nice weather. Pick a mountain with good snacks for the first few trips; they will be spending a lot of time in the lodge.

      Source: taught all 3 of my kids to ski; they are now 5-10 and very comfortable on all east coast mountains. My 10 year old is an excellent skier who can ski literally anything (looking at you, double black moguls of Stowe) but I won’t let her in double black glades because I don’t want to go myself and I don’t want her alone :). She will also grumble about waking up before 10am on any weekend day unless it is a ski day in which case her butt is up, dressed, and in the car at 6am.

      1. Heck no the season isn’t almost over! I’ve had some of my best ski days in March and April and I hope to ski in June this year. Get after it, OP!

        1. It depends where you live. In the Midwest there isn’t really skiing after about late February or early March. Obviously a different story if you’re talking about the Rocky Mountains.

    8. we just took our kids skiing for the first time. here is what we brought with us:
      – long underwear (one day it was very cold, so they actually wore two pairs)
      – ski pants
      – ski jacket
      – ski gloves (get ones that stay on properly, my daughters’ kept falling off), if it is super cold you can put liners under the gloves. the warmers are hard to actually ski with
      – ski socks (smartwool are good)
      – goggles
      – balaclava (someone recommended the brand turtle fur to me, they ended up not wearing them, but i see how they
      can be useful)
      – sunscreen
      We rented:
      – skis
      – ski boots
      – helmet

    9. my family has done this in the last couple years, with me being the parent who never skied.
      we dress warmly but didn’t buy much beyond our normal Midwest winter outdoor wear – warm water proof jacket, snow pants, gloves + a hat and long socks. we rent at the mountain skis/boots/poles and helmets. don’t buy ski gear until you confirm if you actually like it (candidly, I didn’t! but husband really enjoyed getting back into it and is now looking to get his own set of skis, and kids will continue to rent until they stop growing).

    10. MIPS helmet, goggles, fleece gaiter, two pairs of waterproof ski gloves or mittens with wrist leashes (mittens are warmer; two pairs because even waterproof ones get soaked in wet conditions), non-cotton socks and baselayers.

    11. honestly I am laughing at “my small children want to try an expensive sport, here are all the things i should buy.”
      Wild.

      1. You’ll notice that the people who are skiing are not the people who post here complaining about the winter blues. Some things are worth the money.

        Sneering at a first-generation American who wants to try a new sport with her family is also a really bad look.

          1. Get on a plane if it’s something you want to try! That’s what many people do. If you don’t want to try it, then why bother posting on this thread? People are so weird.

        2. I don’t think she’s sneering at a first generation American wanting to try something new, but rather at the idea that someone needs to go skiing just because her young kids want to. And I kind of agree – I have kids and of course we do our best to take their interests into account when planning vacations and weekend activities. But I would not drop $10k+ on a ski vacation just because they mentioned wanting to ski. We’re upper middle class but we don’t spend that kind of money on things unless everyone in the family is going to enjoy it.
          And there are plenty of ways to survive winter besides skiing. I don’t find winter intolerable at all and don’t ski.

          1. People are reading too much into it. OP didn’t say she felt like she “had” to do this because her kids said so – she said she wants to do this and is OK spending money. You can also ski for a hell of a lot less than $10K (I do it every year!). I think it sounds awesome and fun and that teaching kids to ski young is an amazing lifelong gift. Totally cool if it’s not your thing, but that’s not a reason for OP to change her plans.

          2. Well slow clap for the perfect parent. Sometimes, our kids want to try something, and we want to provide the opportunity. I’m sure there are other indulgences you give to your kids. She asked a simple question. How does it devolves into…this.

          3. lol what? She didn’t say she was flying them all to Aspen for this. We don’t know where OP lives, there are plenty of places in the US where smaller mountains/hills are with driving distance for an easy and low cost day trip. It’s generally a pricey sport but so are some other sports, and there’s literally no other way than to try it than with all the gear. People are offering reasonable renting suggestions. It’s one of the few sports your kid can do that in IMHO reap benefits of knowing how for basically a lifetime depending on where they end up living.
            Finally, to Roxie, 7 and 8 isn’t necessarily “small” in the world of kids learning to ski, that’s actually a great age to get them started when they still have relatively low fear. 4 would be “small” (but even then doable).

          4. This is just such a comment in a silo. I live in the upper midwest, nowhere near any mountains, but near some nice big glacial hills where people ski all the time. Folks buy and sell used kids’ ski equipment on facebook, next door, at Play It Again Sports – none of that stuff fits kids for very long. Lift tickets for a day aren’t cheap, but they’re not $$$$ (and certainly not $10K). Plenty of normal folks take their kids skiing without it being a big thing.

      2. I’m Indian-American. I’ve always wanted to try skiing, but have been too intimidated. I have children now, and the thought often comes up. I would like them to have these experiences. I found the thread to be incredibly helpful. But yes, laugh at first generation Americans for trying to explore things for their children. It’s a fantastic look.

        1. FWIW, I’m in the Bay Area and I see tons of Indian Americans on the slopes in Tahoe! The sport is far more diverse here than it once was.

          2. You can totally do it. I think one of the best ways to start is with a first timer package at a smaller resort. That way you can get the lift ticket, the rentals, and a lesson for a very good price.

      3. Way back in the 1980s, my parents took me and my brother and sister skiing for the first time in Wisconsin (I think they won some lift tickets off a radio show). We all loved it, but I especially did because for the first time (I was 12-13 years old), here was a sport I could do. I’d been pegged as the bookworm and avoided physical activity because I couldn’t catch or throw. But I could ski!

        That’s when, for family vacations, we started going skiing instead of to warm places (none of us enjoys the heat!). We’d rent a cabin at a ski place up in the UP and ski for a few days. We’d buy groceries and make our own meals, so it certainly wasn’t fancy.

        We were lucky to be able to do this, but we were not rich and fancy by any means! Remember the conversation yesterday about priorities? My parents decided that taking us skiing was a priority over beach vacations or Disney or whatever.

        I think it’s great to expose kids to new things when you can.

        1. Wisconsinite here as well, and I posted above. There was even a ski club at my very middle-class high school.

      4. A lot of people on this board have the money to afford expensive sports. Stop bashing them for it or move to another blog. I’ve never skied nor do I have any interest but I’m not trashing others for their interest.

    12. You can rent skis, helmets and boots.
      Buy base layers, fleece mid layers and ski jackets. Also neck gaiters.

  3. My kids want to learn how to ski (8 and 7). I am a first generation American and have never went skiing. Does anyone have any tips as to what ski gear I should get for them? I can figure out the basics by searching around (ski jacket, ski pants, etc.), but I am willing to get more than basics so they can be comfortable and this can be an enjoyable experience for them. For example, things like foot warmers get left out of basic lists, but I hear that is a nice thing to have when skiing. I don’t mind spending the money even if they never ski again, but I don’t know anyone that skis and don’t have personal experience! Any tips would be appreciated!

    1. Darn Tough socks are really good! It’s nice to have a buff for wearing around your neck, although I personally prefer a face mask under my helmet because I run cold. If your kids wear glasses, you can get “over the glasses” goggles that get the job done.

      Another thing to keep in mind (if money isn’t the biggest issue) is safety. Get a MIPS helmet for each kid and buy gloves that don’t contain PFAS chemicals. They are being phased out of a lot of outerwear due to new legislation. Gloves are especially important because kids tend to suck on them, even older kids.

      It’s so great you want to do this! My husband immigrated here and started skiing at age 25 and it’s been so damn fun to do together.

    2. Check out Play it Again Sports if there’s one near you – you may find some good stuff secondhand.

    3. Long time skier here. This is our clothing gear for cold ski days. First layer is a base layer (long underwear). I prefer ones that are made of wool or natural fibers but there are some performance fabrics that work too. Definitely ski socks that go up the calf. I thought Darn Tough were more of ankle socks? We like Smart Wool socks but again, many options. On really cold days, we wear two pairs of long underwear. Over that goes insulated ski pants. There are some ski pants without insulation (“shells”) but I like ones that have insulation as they are warmer. On top, I wear a thin jacket or sweater. Insulator jackets are great. Ski coat on top. For my hands, I like mittens vs gloves (warmer). You can get hand warmers to put inside your mittens and they keep things toasty. I like a ski buff or face mask that covers my neck and can be pulled up around my nose. Turtle Fur is a good brand for kids. Goggles are 100% essential, and you need a helmet as others have said. Many ski shops rent ski packages for kids for the season, which is great since they are growing and you don’t really want to buy them new stuff every year. In my area, you can get a season equipment rental (boots, poles and skis) for under $200 for the season. A boot bag is good to pack all your stuff in at the end of the day-boots, gloves, goggles, helmet will all fit in there and then the kids can be responsible for their own stuff. A ski bag is only really needed if you travel. Have fun, it’s a great sport!

    4. You’ve gotten great tips. The only things I’ll add if they haven’t been mentioned:
      For the pants, jacket and mittens you want as water repellent/waterproof as you can find/afford. Water resistant is not the same thing. Matters if it is actively snowing when they are skiing and/or they fall down a lot. People definitely ski in water resistant and it’s fine, especially if you get a bluebird day, but you asked how to make them the most comfortable so….

      A few people mentioned gloves but fwiw we all do mittens. I think your body heat from your fingers all together keeps you warmer. Plus gloves are harder to fit little hands.

      For ski, boot, and helmet rental this will be very location dependent but in some cases renting on mountain morning of is a miserable experience (long lines etc). Unless there is a compelling reason to do the rental with your lesson, I highly recommend renting off mountain the day before for the weekend if you can. (Or somewhere for the whole season if you need that). (A compelling reason to do on mountain may be: at some Tahoe resorts you drop your kid off at the ski school and they take it from there including figuring out all the rentals from their own ski school supply, definitely do that if that is the set up).

      Agreed with others we never do toe warmers and honestly rarely do hand warmers although I don’t think there is downside to doing so for hands, we just forget.

      Fwiw at least in the Bay Area there is a store called sports basement that rents not only skis but the whole outfit, might be worth seeing if there is something like that where you live. I actually find getting this stuff secondhand difficult. While it doesn’t get worn out, it is all so expensive that I feel like it is the one category of kid stuff people make an effort to pass down to family or friends, and the competition for anything posted on a marketplace type of website is fierce.

      Hope they have fun! We love skiing.

  4. Colorado in the Summer

    We’re taking a family vacation to Colorado in August. We’ll spend a few nights in Colorado Springs for Garden of the Gods and the Zoo, and are trying to decide where to spend the next 4-5 nights. I’m debating between Breckenridge and Aspen based on online searches, but open to other places! We like alpine slides, short hikes, short bike rides, and generally walking around and grabbing a bite to eat, and scenic views (kids are preschool / early elementary so we’re not looking for long or complex hiking or biking trails). Any recs for a particular city or even a particular hotel?

    1. Granby or Grand Lake are near Rocky Mountain National Park. Snow Mountain Ranch is at the southern edge of Granby and could be great, or more upscale, Devil’s Thumb in the next town over, Tabernash.

      1. Highly recommend Snow Mountain Ranch for lots of stuff to do with kids — trails, swimming pool, miniature golf, tubing hill, climbing wall, horse-back riding. Lots of places to eat and cute shops in the local towns: Winter Park, Grandy, and Grand Lake. Swimming, boating, etc. available at Grand Lake. Easy to do a day trip to Breckenridge if you’d like.

    2. I was in Aspen this past fall with a 5 year old, and would not recommend it for little kids. There’s really nothing for kids to do and the town is crazy expensive. I’ve heard good things about Breckenridge.

      1. i love Aspen and went on a family vacation there, but my sister and I were old enough to bike ride down Maroon Bells. Otherwise I agree that Breckenridge or Vail are fun

    3. You can also check out Winter Park and Grand Lake. Winter Park I think has a big alpine slide.

      1. The alpine slide is SO fun. We had a blast. There’s also a ropes climbing course for kids and a cute shopping area.

    4. We highly recommend the YMCA family camp in Estes Park. We visited in 2021 and had a fabulous time with our children. There was mini golf, an escape room, ax throwing, arts and crafts, archery, horses, indoor pool, and more. We did this after spending several nights in Colorado Springs. I had such a wonderful time at the YMCA, I kept plotting how we could return. We rented was a small cabin for 5 of us–rustic, comfortable, private, with kitchen. (Note that we are not Christi@n, this is not a plug for YMCA from that angle.)

      1. I spent a week there with my family and some family friends as a teenager, and YMCA of the Rockies was fantastic. I’m glad to hear it’s still around. I’ve been to a couple of YMCA camps and, like the health clubs, don’t find them to be religious at all.

    5. We did Vail a few years ago with a 10 and 15 year old and really enjoyed it. The village is super cute and there are tons of things to do (hikes, playgrounds, the Betty Ford Garden) – even the local library was great and had a ton of stuff (they have a huge comics collection which our boys LOVED). There are tons of apartments you can rent out, we stayed at the Solaris which was (at the time) bookable via the Chase Sapphire rewards site.

    6. Breckinridge is great and is much closer to Colorado Springs. The town of Aspen doesn’t have a ton for kids, but Snowmass, the nearby ski resort area does. The Aspen/Snowmass area is probably the most beautiful place in Colorado, and that is saying a lot!

      1. I’d go to Breckenridge too. There’s tons of options along that part of I-70. Vail is more upscale and also farther. Rocky Mountain National Park is amazing, but it’s a real drive if you’re down in Colorado Springs. I would save that for another trip personally. Golden and Boulder are both fun pit stops in the summer.

    7. You should check out Glenwood Springs. There are pools if you enjoy swimming/relaxing. There is also an amusement park with roller coasters and lower key attractions for younger kids. The park has fun cave tours that are not too taxing.

    8. You want to go to the Children’s Museum in Denver if you can–it’s fantastic!

  5. Is there somewhere that has a list of good-paying jobs that don’t require a college degree and yet aren’t a construction-type trade? Asking for my step-sister. She is bright and autistic and thinks that the party culture of college won’t be a good fit for her. Also, she is knows that a lot of what I do at my office job is learning by osmosis and not by training, so she thinks that something that isn’t an office job (or that is, but is much more structured) would be something to explore (and maybe do that while starting at the community college). She is leaning towards health care — she got CPR/AED certified recently and she can walk to a two big hospitals that are also walkable to community college (and often they give free college to workers, like surgery techs, etc.). She is also starting a program that explores careers with area employers (I think that the scout program runs it for older kids, but it’s not at all camping related). At any rate, I think she is very smart to think about this in high school (current sophomore — next year she could shift entirely to community college with a dual-enrolment program that they have). She IS smart, but she knows maybe more than other kids her age that she will be running her own race (and yet still be really good, especially if she acquires skills and avoids school debt).

    1. Not all colleges have a party culture…? What is with all these fake limits here lately?

      1. +1 and even if the college does have a party culture, you can find a social group that doesn’t party. That’s the beauty of college, pretty much anyone can fit in and find their people. And you go to college to get a degree, not to make friends, so even if she thinks it will be a bad social experience for her she should still go. Such a bizarre take.

      2. Yes, if that is the only thing holding her back from considering college, what about a commuter school where most students live at home/off-campus, or one that focuses more on adults changing careers? There are so many options. She’s very young to be limiting her choices.

    2. She’s a sophomore in high school. Please stop limiting her like this.

      My family of origin was perpetually stuffing me in boxes that were comfortable for them: “You aren’t like this, this isn’t for you, blah blah blah.” As an adult, all I can say is that I’m glad to have that toxicity out of my life.

      Find a college that isn’t a party scene. That can be anything from top liberal arts schools to regional comprehensives with a dry campus. Adjust as needed for her abilities and family finances.

      Why wouldn’t she study engineering, which is a great career for people who are literal, explicit, and don’t enjoy the mind games of office politics? Explore military careers?

      1. It’s so toxic. So, so toxic. I’m honestly sick of seeing stuff like this here on a site that’s supposed to be for “overachievers.” If you want to post about how to plan to under-achieve, the best place for that is Ask a Manager.

      2. I know that autism is very much on the DL in the military. IIRC, an official DX eliminates you from service academies, and likely a lot of jobs (if it’s not an outright prohibition). I think that is due to a lot of stigma around autism and I have no doubt that a lot of autistic people have served and are serving. In a lot of small towns, you might be quirky and when I was a kid, probably only kids who are ASD-2 or ASD-3 now would be identified.

        1. Yeah, my BIL has autism and is a West Point grad, but he was not diagnosed until a few years ago (at age 55). In the 1980s, he was just considered an oddball.

    3. I want to challenge some of her assumptions about college since if she’s a teenager she may not know much about this. Has she considered a college that doesn’t have much of a party culture? If she’s bright she could probably get in to the kind of nerdy, nurturing SLAC that has no frats and live in a no-substance dorm while she’s there. Maybe that still isn’t what she wants to do, but I don’t want her to have a mistaken impression of what college is like if she’s imagining sports and drinking and not something more like a Whit Stillman movie. Maybe she would hate that too, and maybe it would be too expensive. I do think starting at community college and then transferring to a four year can be a smart move for minimizing debt, and dual enrollment programs can be a great alternative to spinning wheels in high school. But it’s not obvious to me that community college is a better fit if she hasn’t fully explored a four year route and is bright in school.

      1. +1. I work at a nerdy, nurturing SLAC and we have many, many students on the spectrum, and they’ve found a place where they can thrive. It’s worth checking out.

      2. I went to a Big Ten school in the Midwest that has plenty of partying to be found. And yet that wasn’t my scene, and it was fine. Great, even! I had my group of people and still managed to thrive and do well. I had a social life that didn’t revolve around drinking. That’s the beauty of college; there is a place for almost anyone.

      3. +1 my dear friend was diagnosed with autism a week after graduating from it, but loved the SLAC they went to. Nerdy and nurturing is exactly how they would describe it.

    4. Here’s a random one: Check out water and wastewater system operators. Huge need, structured job, not an office job. In my state you can get into it via tech schools (uncommon) or getting a job at a water or wastewater plant and studying/taking the tests (common). It’s a field that is super unadvertised and generally forgotten about, but very needed.

      My new little obsession is National Park Rangers…if she’s at all inclined to the outdoors/physical activity, it just looks like the best job.

        3. And my cousin wanted to be a park ranger and they are highly desired positions by many and hard to get, despite the low pay. He could get one, and he gave up and is becoming a lawyer instead!

      2. My sister and BIL are NPS rangers and it is hard to get a permanent job with benefits, they are always worried about getting furloughed when we can’t pass a budget or that their jobs at the post where they live and are trying to raise a family will get eliminated, and yea they are low paying. Trust me, not every NPS Ranger job is the “glamorous” Yellowstone type deal and even those people burn out of and when you want to change jobs within the service, you will likely have to move (again). I can’t imagine dealing with the public on a regular basis.

    5. If her autism doesn’t negatively affect her ability/desire to interact with strangers, and you say she’s interested in healthcare, every community college has various nurse’s aide programs that are 6-12 weeks long. Perhaps being a certified medication aide (often works in nursing homes, which are structured environments) would suit her.

      1. But if she is smart and enjoys health care, why wouldn’t she go to college and become an RN or a PA or an NP or an MD and make a salary she could live on?

    6. My son is autistic and graduated college with a humanities major, not knowing what field he was interested in, and is now back in grad school for a master in dietetics, aiming to become an RD. He lives at home but will be independent in the future (drives, does his own chores, shopping, and laundry, etc). I think most good paying jobs require a BA and maybe more; if she’s bright there’s no reason she can’t go to college while living at home. If she won’t be able to drive, there are services that transport people with disabilities.

    7. yes there is partying in college but there are also kids that opt out of that scene altogether. The ratio of partying to opt-out varies by school but why write off the whole possibility on that assumption??

      1. I think it’s hard for some kids. In my city-suburban area school, the big partying kids in high school are also the ones in the IB program and taking AP classes, so it’s hard to imagine what you aren’t seeing. I know that there are sober dorms, but those are often for people in recovery (vs people who just don’t partake). They may both be doing sober college, but I suspect that they aren’t the same populations with the same needs. I do get the perception of college as a 4- or 5-year Rumspringa. There are private apartments near our city’s big university that have advertisements like it’s perpetual spring break over there, with a lazy river, social events, etc. I get that social isolation is bad, but not everyone needs or wants the same thing for socializing with others.

        1. Sober dorms are often for people in recovery vs. people who don’t partake? Please go read Princeton Review and get to know the variety of college cultures out there. At my college, the no-substance dorms were full of people who simply didn’t have any interest in drinking, people who preferred weed, and people who drank but didn’t want any drinking happening in their own dorm where they sleep and study. I am not aware that a single person in my dorm was in recovery, but if so, it didn’t change the atmosphere from studious and sedate.

        3. My college (little Ivy) had sober dorms, and zero people who chose them were in recovery. It was mostly people who didn’t want to party or didn’t want to be around drunk people.

          It’s quiet at 3 am. You don’t wake up for your 8 am chemical physics class to find vomit all over the bathroom floor. 10/10 would recommend.

      2. She could go to the biggest party school in the country and I’m sure she could still find her niche.

    8. She could be a tech for an optometrist or ophthalmologist office. Using DH’s practice for reference, hourly pay ranges from $18-30+, they train employees when they start, and offer additional education in order to increase pay.

    9. She should go to college. In a hospital with no degree she can take out trash, clean, transport patients, and work in food services. With a degree she can do all sorts of meaningful interesting work. Focus on letting her see not all colleges are about partying and supporting her learning not pigeonholding her in menial work.

      1. It sounds like OP’s sister can do both — maybe PT college (maybe can start in high school) and working somewhere would help her gain confidence and still expand academic and job horizons. I’m sure a hospital would love to hire, say, an accountant who had worked there in various other departments while in school and was familiar with the work setting.

    10. I’m sure there are plenty of options in healthcare, but it seems sad to rule out college based on party culture if she otherwise might enjoy it. My college had a party culture, I think, but it was also a place where a lot of sweetly nerdy smart kids found their people. I didn’t party much, and university was a time of incredible intellectual stimulation. I’m happy I didn’t skip it because I was concerned I wouldn’t fit in!

    11. Are you the same person who asked this question a few weeks ago? Autism does not automatically mean a person cannot attend college. Why are you and your parents trying to limit her? Many, many highly intelligent people with autism successfully graduate from college and live independently with professional careers. Maybe a generic “office job” (I don’t even know what that means now that we no longer have secretaries and receptionists and assistants and professionals do all our own admin work) is beneath her and she would be a great pharmacist, computer programmer, data scientist…

      1. Yes, this sounds very familiar. OP and her parents need to let the sister live her life. In 5 years OP will be writing about why her sister doesn’t speak to her anymore.

    12. Has she taken a Youscience aptitude test? A lot of schools offer it for free, but it’s cheap and can be done independently of the school. It will produce a very specific list of potential career matches that can be sorted by level of education required. Its results were spot-on for my 2 who did it. I don’t know how well it would work for someone with autism. (I do know that it does not work well for someone whose English is not great-he did not understand all of the questions, and his results were all over the place).

    13. Take a look at some colleges with more of a commuter culture — there are plenty of schools where lots of students either live at home with their parents or are older/alternative students who have families, etc.

      1. At a commuter school she will be socially isolated. At a SLAC she will live in a dorm with other students of all kinds, some of whom will also have autism and be very open about it.

    14. I honestly don’t think party culture is an important factor – and I say this as someone who went to a “party school.” She can simply just not party? At a large school there are going to be thousands of students who aren’t partying. I think it’s important that you explain that to her. Maybe you could interest her in a nerdier degree like computer science or IT.
      She’s going to have more options with a degree, and if she does well at school it seems silly to limit herself.

      If she doesn’t actually want to go to college though, one of my cousins is a surgical tech and seems to like it. She went to a trade school and makes a living at it.

      1. Yep, I went to a huge infamous party school and graduated with my nerd cred intact.

        I think it’s very good advice to consider all schooling options and not to put people in boxes. My parents weren’t as bad as the poster at 9:49 describes, but going to college definitely let me become the person I wanted to be vs. the person everyone was telling me I was.

        That said, it is good to consider what kind of skills and work environments one prefers.

    15. What kind of nonsense is your family feeding this poor child? Not all colleges are Animal House and Legally Blonde. She should look at SLACs. The slightly lower-ranked but still excellent ones even offer academic scholarships. Many have excellent first-year experience programs that support students in the transition to college academics, and are very accommodating to students with disabilities.

    16. My mom doesn’t have a college degree and works for a construction company in an office- I know that’s exactly what you didn’t ask for, but I’m assuming you meant the labor part. My mom is ADHD and other things and this work suits her well because it’s only like 15% in-office. The rest she’s off meeting at job sites, running to towns to pull permits, collecting samples at tile stores, etc. She works for a pretty big builder and makes ~75k/year with good benefits. Physical jobs like EMT, firefighter. She could learn healthcare type stuff like coding…those jobs are in super high demand but are also easily outsourced. That said, it’s an industry I know well and a lot of coders whose jobs have been outsourced go to work for tech companies building automation…and none of them have 4 year degrees but they all have “butt in seat” experience.

      Other ideas: real estate (in a good area), working retail (somewhere reasonable, like a store open 10-5pm), restaurant management type work- my neighbor dropped out of college and owns a big restaurant chain.

      My sister went to state college and is a physical therapist which works well for her. It was heavy on the practical stuff.

    17. Is she interested in STEM? Engineering colleges tend not to have a huge party culture and have lots of people who are on the spectrum or at least in that direction. (Said with judgment – I went to an engineering school and loved it). And job prospects will be very good.

      Fwiw I have a cousin who is autistic and she had no issues getting into and succeeding at college. She went to a top SLAC and graduated with a 4.0. She ran into problems post-college though, because she couldn’t successfully interview for jobs. I wouldn’t necessarily assume college will be a huge hurdle if she does well on high school.

      2. I think that this is a legit fear — doing OK in school =/= doing OK at a job (not all jobs are alike though!). IMO, the “college for all” attitude is great but IMO does a disservice to what a kid ultimately wants to do in this world and doesn’t adequately prepare them to explore options or deal with interviewing. It’s too bad that people don’t use Career Services in college or prior (if high schools do that these days), b/c when a kid says “I feel nervous about this and have concerns,” they should be taken seriously and helped and not just told to go to college and figure it out there. College is $$$ and people should feel more confident in their choices going in, not hopeful that it will all work out OK. No one wants to have a degree, debt, and no plan for what comes next or how to make it happen.

        1. College is not for everyone. College is for smart kids and especially for smart kids with autism who can function in the world.

      3. Yes, this is the real issue. College is much more accommodating to disabilities than workplaces, so the issue is less that she can’t succeed in college but whether it’s worth the cost. I think the types of jobs you can get with a college degree will often be more accommodating and pay enough more to buy her some flexibility in life, but it’s definitely worth thinking carefully about this in light of her specific strengths and weaknesses and the types of jobs she might be interested in.

      4. LOL, at my university the engineers were the biggest partiers, they were notorious.

    18. What about starting with a CNA? She can work in the health care setting and see if she likes it and then if she wants to pursue something beyond that like nursing.

    19. Why are you and your parents trying to sabotage this girl’s future by convincing her she isn’t college material? Do your parents just want to avoid paying tuition? Do they not understand how financial aid works?

    20. You’ve posted about this before and absolutely everyone told you (and your family) to back off on these limiting assumptions and actually support your sister to go to college and have the best chance of a future. How many more responses do you need? All teens have angst – your job as an adult isn’t to say “oh you’re right, parties DO sound like a good reason not to go to college.” You show her the way forward.

      1. + a million to this, do you understand that the better way to support her is to offer scaffolding and accomodations not to just take options off the table entirely? Also unless there is something you’re not saying here (severely disabled not just ASD-1) there is no reason she can’t succeed in school.

    21. Sounds like OP is trying to sabotage her stepsister because the stepsister is more intelligent and OP is envious or because OP wants a larger share of the college $ for herself.

      2. I’m the Anon at 9:49 am with the family of origin who loved pigeonholing me. Speaking from my own experience, it was narcissism, not jealousy.

        Even as a kid, I knew something was off. I am a classic introvert (in the Susan Cain “Quiet” way), and I had the “anti social” label slapped on me by age 8. It wasn’t like I didn’t have friends – in fact, I’m still close to my friends from K-12! I was studious, so they said I was a “future professional student” who “would never make it in the real world and was going to still be in school at 40.”

        It’s a total lack of empathy, which makes people who are any different (from them!) into non-persons, defective, objects of pity, etc.

        I’m not going to apply that to the OP; she knows herself and knows the situation. I am saying that the “pigeonhole kids” routine isn’t healthy or helpful.

        1. I’m really sorry you had to grow up like that. What you’ve just said here is so important, something that I hope if anyone recognizes that they’re doing it to their kid, they need to stop.

    22. So, this is a weird thread.

      We don’t know your step sister, and I hope that you do and are just trying to think outside the box for her.

      There are excellent jobs in healthcare that she can start/do via community college. CNA (certified nursing assistant) is a hard low-paying job, and would only recommend that (simple, short, community college) training as a stepping stone/job on the side to make money while continuing training for better long term options. Radiology technicians of all types are great jobs, and it can be quite competitive to get into the programs.

      She should definitely explore the healthcare options in high school if she is interested already, but shifting entirely to community college if she is bright… just, be careful if it will limit her choices. Then again, some nursing programs, radiology programs, and nurse practitioner programs are offered by some excellent community colleges and honestly, provide excellent career options with incredible job flexibility and great pay. I mean, this board leans towards people who are rich, but most of us are not and have good lives with good paying jobs. With the incredible high cost of going to medical school, low pay of residency, the stress of that training route (college/med school/residency/fellowship), I discourage becoming a doctor these days. I’m a doctor.

      Also wonderful jobs are physical, occupational, speech/swallow therapy, particularly if she has good interpersonal skills and an athletic bent/interes.

      At this point in her life, the best thing you can do is try to giver her exposure to things. I started volunteering at a local hospital, and started talking to people who worked in health care to hear what their path/life was like, and shadowed them at work, if that was possible.

      1. I tend to agree about medical debt. Medical school also requires an interview process which can be tough for autistic kids. I posted above about my autistic cousin who did great academically in high school and college but struggled in the real world, and she originally wanted to go to medical school but had problems with the interview process and didn’t get in anywhere despite having stellar grades and test scores. She ended up eventually going to a different grad program that didn’t require an interview. Of course not all autistic people are alike and some may interview fine, but it’s something to keep in mind.

    23. My AUDHD 19 year old is a sophomore in college and just opts out of the party scene. They chose a small, experiential-focused school and lives a quiet life that makes her happy. They were diagnosed the spring of their first year after struggling with their classes. After working with a therapist on coping strategies, they were on Dean’s List last semester. I don’t know of any HS sophomore that truly gets what college is like, but narrowing her options now, before she has an opportunity to visit and talk to other students won’t benefit her in any way.

    24. RNs are in high demand, and that’s a community college program. My state has made it free due to the nursing shortage. From what I’ve heard of nursing school, it’s the opposite of partying-very intense curriculum, and you can make low 6 figures. Note, some big hospitals in wealther/highly educated communities won’t hire a nurse with “just” a 2 year RN degree, preferring a BSN degree…but the majority will gladly do so.

    25. This poor kid. Just let her pick a college. All this kvetching over what she can’t do is infuriating! Everyone has to grow up and find their own way. FWIW I went to a big party school and never partied, and loved it there.

      1. I am so late to this but want to piggyback here to say that as someone who taught at a giant state school with a robust social scene, another thing that school had was robust disability support services. Sister is federally entitled to receive accommodations and especially once she chooses a minor can have a small liberal-arts college like experience with supportive faculty and students even at a 50k+-population campus. And she will be in classes with other students who are on the spectrum! You just have to be willing to show her several options. Is the issue that she can’t do college or that you don’t know enough to advise her well?

  6. The winter doldrums are hitting me hard, even though this has been a relatively mild winter. I am so sick of everything looking dead and brown. I feel like I need a small fun project to keep me going until I can go on vacation in mid-March.

    1. I always feel the mid-february doldrums. I tend to start my spring/summer clothing audit and wish list. It helps me look forward to the days when it won’t be dark when I leave the house in the morning.

    2. I promise I don’t work for them, but check out The Woobles. Their crochet animal kits are adorable and fun. My teenager loves them for a pick-me-up project.

    3. Do you like making art? I find the act of creating something really fulfilling, especially during the cold, dark months. There are tons of fun tutorials online for simple, quick projects that also feel like accomplishments. I like some of the watercolor tutorials and just use my kids crayola set. Diamond painting is also dead easy and satisfying. Cleaning is also a good outlet for me. Again, the sense of accomplishment and something I can enjoy the fruits of. I like getting those weird places clean – tops of cabinets, vents, etc. Hang in there. You aren’t alone!

      1. Its been really mild in a lot of the US this year, even northern Michigan and Minnesota don’t have snow on the ground. And if they do its melting quickly. Honestly its more depressing than if there was constantly snow.

        1. OP here, and this. It is so depressing. We had a couple of weeks of snow in January, and not a thing since then. It’s dead and brown, and there is not much outdoor fun to be had.

    5. I totally hear you. If there is a botanic garden with an indoor portion or a greenhouse near you, plan a trip – it’s very rejuvenating to see lush plants and be in the humidity in the winter

    6. I’m doing a really colorful cross stitch of flowers and houses that I got from Etsy (“bloomy trees”) and the bright colors are very fun and cheerful and it’s a nice indoor activity that isn’t staring at a screen.

    7. UGH SAME SAME SAME! I contemplated starting a post. I went into winter strong with a good attitude and good warm clothes/boots (key to good attitude :)) and I’m so sick of all of it. I’m tired of being cold. And people. I cannot people. blah blah blah I know it’s February and I’m just tired of having to effort to fix my attitude every day (which I do anyway).

      Here’s what I have planned:
      Nail appt this week/hair appt next week
      This weekend going to a candlelight hike event at a local park
      Next weekend real woo-woo event, and then a different special meditation event
      Hanging a wall of art that I’ve been collecting for quite a while
      Maybe I’ll finally paint our laundry room….I have the paint….

      2. Nah, even in the Midwest we usually get a few days with temperatures above 60 in February (especially recently). It’s much better than January.

        1. I wouldn’t say that’s common for the “Midwest”. Maybe your state, but not the Midwest as a whole, which includes Minnesota and Wisconsin. The 50-degree days Minnesota has had this year are *highly* unusual.

          Lat Jan/Early Feb is usually when we Upper Midwesterns see our bitterest temps (subzero highs), and is getting to be month 3 of dealing with snow cover.

  7. For the first time in my life, I hate all my clothes AND everything at the mall. My office is officially business casual. Men mostly dress like a finance version of REI ads (long pants, LS shirt, vest, Cole haan shoes or lace up leather boots that are not meant for timing). I can’t find pants I like. I feel super weird wearing jeans to the office. I am stuck wearing black dress pants which means the rest of my outfit is a full step or two up in formality. The female associates are wearing ribbed sweaters, belts, and 90s jeans (literally, I saw an acid wash pair this week). The older female partners are wearing flowy, Cabi/Eileen Fisher separates and scarves (they have worn this general look for years- They look great!) I feel like I’m the lost middle age band, wearing blah boring pants and struggling to find tops I like, let alone a third piece. I have some dresses but stick out as very overdressed even when paired with more casual pieces. Has anyone mastered casual/business casual in an office environment? I’m 39, size XS/S, average height.

    1. I’m no help, but I want you to know you are not alone. I guess the pandemic broke me – I never had so much trouble dressing myself before!

      I walked around my local mall this weekend and it was not inspiring. I don’t understand why women’s clothing is all neutral! How many beige and navy and black things do they think we need? Granted I saw a little color at J Jill and White House Black Market, and this is not the time of year for me as spring colors don’t look good on me and I don’t like them.

      I’m trying to focus on finding pants that I like, and shoes that go with them – and both in slightly more current styles, so no skinny pants (although I do like straight ones, flowy pants tend to be difficult for me). Maybe a cardigan that is more cropped, although this is challenging since everything is made out of acrylic, which is just nasty. I have found some pants I like at Loft and J Crew Factory, but I’ve also ordered stacks and stacks of pants from Old Navy, J Jill, and Talbots, and returned them all.

      1. > I don’t understand why women’s clothing is all neutral

        The Kardashians. That’s why. I swear.

    2. I can totally relate! Men at my office dress similarly and for women it’s all over the map.

      I like to do something like a blazer with Athleta Brooklyn pants and then a cute sneaker. Or if I wear jeans, I wear a lighter wash and looser fit with boots and a half-zip sweater (try Zara or Everlane) which feels more current.

      Men definitely have it easier with that “uniform.” At times, I envy their ease of getting dressed.

    3. Our offices and personal stats sound pretty similar. What’s not working for you about pants right now? Pants are having a moment, so there are a ton of options other than acid washed jeans, black dress pants, and Eileen Fisher. Have you looked at Madewell? They had great non-denim pants the last time I was in one, that would sit solidly in that middle zone of formality–cords, some crepe options in younger silhouettes than Eileen Fisher tends toward, some twill-type fabrics.

      Approaching this from another angle, what do you like to wear?

      FWIW, I’m wearing black dress pants today with a fitted turtleneck tucked in, lug-soled boots, and current jewelry (smaller gold hoops, a couple of chunky rings, and a Cuban link bracelet). Yesterday it was slim black cords, a tucked-in button-down with an artsy print, and nice sneakers.

      1. I think there are almost too many options! And many require different shoes or hemming, different styles of tops, tucked vs. untucked. It was much easier when everything was a slim ankle pants cut – worked with just about any shoes and the style was to just wear an untucked top.

        I’m really not saying this in a, Darn kids these days and their wacky styles! Just musing on how style has evolved and how it seems a little trickier these days to put things together. And that’s on top of many of us not having to go to the office for a while, so we are out of practice with dressing ourselves.

        1. It was even easier in the 80s and 90s when we had to “dress for success” in skirt suits with tie-neck blouses, but it was kind of miserable, too. I like having options.

          1. That’s fair. I spent the 1990s and early 2000s in the lab, so I missed the very strict office dressing.

            I like options, too, but sometimes it’s overwhelming!

        2. I’m also having trouble adapting to the newer silhouettes. So many choices, and yet so many are … kinda ugly?

          1. THIS! It feels like the fashion equivalent of “you can have gross oily peanut butter on stale toast; you can have jelly on soggy bread; or you can have slimy bologna on wilted lettuce. Options!”

        3. Valid. This is more general musing than anything that I think will be helpful to the OP, but I guess that since starting work in a professional setting after undergrad, I’ve tried to idiotproof my wardrobe as much as possible (*the idiot is me)–I pick a silhouette and commit, so it stays as straightforward as possible, and everything more or less mix-and-matches. I did this when it was slim cut ankle pants and a flowing shirt, too, so for me at least, I don’t think it’s harder now. Maybe that means I should excuse myself from this thread, lol.

          I’ve been back in the office on a hybrid schedule for a few years now, so maybe I’ve just had enough time to work it out for myself. It was definitely more of a struggle when I first started back. I also work at a university so I see more current trends on my students every day, and can decide what I want to play around with. Maybe that helped retrain my eye faster when the slim cut ankle pant look was phasing out? Or maybe I’m just lucky that the high-waisted wide-legged look works well with my proportions? I dunno.

          1. “the idiot is me” I FEEL that. The trouble with me is that I also want color and variation.

          2. I think going to the office for a longer time probably has helped you. I only have to go in once a week, so I’m really out of practice.

            What I need to do is go through my closet and try things on, both to come up with combinations I find appealing and also to get rid of the stuff that just doesn’t work anymore.

            First I need to find the motivation to do that…

        4. I work in a super super male dominated environment, where at 32 folks are still calling me Young Lady (barf) and one of its few redeeming characteristics is… If my hem doesn’t match my shoes, they all just assume I’m doing something stylish that they don’t understand anyway. It’s a nice perk

    5. My answer to this problem is black jeans and a blazer, both in current cuts. Jo-Lynne Shane just did a feature on denim trends for middle-aged women this week.

    6. Omg yes. I will link a few options that have worked for me for as to pants, and then recommend Zara for some cool tops that feel a little more modern

      1. https://factory.jcrew.com/p/womens/categories/clothing/pants/jamie/jamie-pant/BS995?color_name=black&N=10&noPopUp=true&srcCode=Paid_Search%7CShopping_Pmax%7CGoogle%7CPMG%5EG%5E99107082378_20396427020___m_pla_online__9007813&utm_source=Google&utm_medium=cpc&utm_content=shopping_ads&utm_campaign=PX_ACQ_XPROD_BOTTOMSXXXXXX_EVG_ROAS_XXX_COUSA_EN_EN_A_FACT_GO_SH_PMX_xxxxxxxxxx&utm_term=&gad_source=1&gclid=CjwKCAiAibeuBhAAEiwAiXBoJOXYKugmDKp59LIhoxQES4w_OaKWaoWJ5McalzpmvHU5_aZ8PRjW3xoCbIIQAvD_BwE&gclsrc=aw.ds

    7. You can wear black dress pants but dress down the top half of your look. This is something that I feel like Abercrombie is nailing these days—a trouser with a (nice) tee and a structured cardigan or trousers with a more casual sweater. Shoes can be nice sneakers, a current loafer, or a flat. Or wear a ribbed sweater with your black dress pants—old navy had some cute ribbed mock neck sweater tanks the other day.

    9. Ponte pants, top and knit blazer are my go-to for the office for dressy business casual. I’m comfortable but appropriate. I’m a petite hourglass so I do need to get pants altered to fit correctly (hem and waist taken in) but it’s worth it. So many knit blazers – the traditional blazer, lady jackets, etc.

      1. Have you tried the Abercrombie Curve Love pants (and jeans), available in short and extra short (not all styles and colors, but there are a bunch)? These work for my short, curvy (as in waist to hip ratio) self.

    10. Don’t know if this helps you, OP, but I’m about your age and have tried to keep it simple and not go for too much of anything. My formula is straight leg pants with either a sweater or cute top + soft blazer. On more casual days, I’ll swap a nice t-shirt for the sweater or top. Dress up or down with on-trend shoes.

    11. I’ve been there, often. Right now my style sense is like a JM McLaughlin catalog, but a lot of it comes from Talbots, Fatface, and J Crew. I wear a lot of cords in winter and my summer pants are either white jeans or linen pants. It fits right in at my work where the full-on 90s reboot would not be accepted.

      So my advice is, go look at catalogs and avoid the mall. I don’t think women are age are expected to have time to shop in person, sadly, so the brands that cater to us aren’t in the big shopping malls and, if they are, they don’t carry the business casual items in store.

    12. Try the Anthropologie Colette pants! You can pair with slightly cropped sweaters, a thin T-shirt with a leather jacket, blouses, and flats (a current style of ballet flats or loafers are good options).

      2. I wanted to love the Colette pants so bad, but they are so high waisted! On me the waist band was just an inch or two away from my bra strap. Sad because they seemed great otherwise.

    13. I’m the same age and size as you. Right now, I am wearing a sleeveless silk blouse, a jcrew wool blazer, wide leg jeans in a dark wash, and sneakers. The sneakers were a last minute switch from ballet flats. Yesterday I wore dark flared wash jeans, a flowy blouse, and a black ponte blazer. The day before I wore silk wide leg pants (H&M) and a brightly colored silk blouse. I really dislike the “mom jeans” trend, but here to tell you that there are SO many other options. Every store has a bunch of nice flares and wide leg pants, and switching to those has made a bunch of my tops and blazers look updated. I love banana republic’s wool wide legs and the collette pants from anthro. Yeah, you have to tailor the pants again, but we did that ten years ago, and it was all fine. I stay away from the oversized blazers as they don’t look good on me either. As I have aged, I have looked more towards clothes that play with color and make a statement, in a professional adult way, and I feel that it has helped me in my career and in how others perceive me. I wear a lot of blazers + dark jeans. I am otherwise pretty young looking and am constantly thinking about how to not look 27 (um at least from afar. If you got up close, you would know that no 27 year old has these wrinkles and grays!!!).

    14. I think part of my problem with current fashion is it’s all so casual. I don’t want to be casual all the time! I like dressing well for work. I think that’s part of the reason workwear fashion seems to be stuck where it was pre-pandemic. (At least from what I’ve seen at every conference I’ve been at recently.)

    15. My mom dressed in “creative business casual” for years and her go-to was 1940s movie star style trousers. High waisted, pleated, cuffed, wide legged, pretty, unusual colors or a soft glen plaid. She paired that with fitted ribbed sweaters or a button down blouse tucked in, maybe a vest over that, or a slouchy fine-knit (like silk knit) cowl neck sweater. Almost always a belt, and a watch. Then she’d add oxford shoes, or loafers + trouser socks, and some fun antique or vintage jewelry and go. She is very slender, so she could throw a tweed blazer on top for warmth without looking bulky, and at a size XS I assume you could as well. This was for colder weather. Sometimes she’d mix it up with a bias-cut midi skirt in a wool plaid and a belted slouchy sweater overtop + knee high boots.

      For warmer, she did a kind of 1920’s inspired version: wide legged maybe sailor-detail inspired linen pants, short sleeved or 3/4 sleeved Breton striped tees, a scarf, and lightweight flexible loafers or boat shoes.

      It’s not THE most stylish, trendy, modern look but it’s flattering and looks polished but not stuffy.

      I also have the maybe too-strict opinion that black pants and a top is “I give up” land for 30 something women and drags the look and credibility down (unless it’s like…The Row or something!) Black only goes with black, gray, white, denim, and other neutrals–it sucks the life out of color and looks harsh and dated with jewel tones IMHO.

      If you want a pair of go-to pants/slacks I suggest a charcoal or navy–just that one switch might bring some life and vitality back to the wardrobe and will make your combinations look much more sophisticated and up to date.

      1. I do agree that color goes better with navy or charcoal (navy in particular) than if does with black.

        Your mom sounds fabulous but I take your point that some of this is easier to wear for an XS.

      2. I recently got some chocolate brown pants, and I’m loving those as an alternative to my grey. It goes with far more colors than I realized when I bought them too.

  8. Hello, everyone,

    I’m a school district administrator. I had my second child last summer, and I opted to take an unpaid year-long maternity leave (2023-24 school year). This option is common among teachers. In my 10 years at my district, I’m the first admin to have a baby, so there are no maternity leave precedents there. However, a year-long unpaid leave is a benefit offered in all administrator contracts.

    I’m returning to work this summer, and typically contacts are signed in March, so I’m trying to be proactive here.

    My question for you all: What would be a reasonable salary to negotiate upon my return? Here are some details:

    * Admins get annual salary increases based on the previous year’s CPI, with a floor of 3.5% and a ceiling of 5.5%. In other words, the 2023-24 raises were 5.5% (because CPI in 2022 was 6.5%) and 2024-25 raises will be 3.5% (because CPI in 2023 was 3.4%).
    * Teachers have salary schedules for each year, based on years of service, education, and the current year. So, teachers who took a year-long leave would return with a salary that included a 3% increase for 2023-24 and a 3% increase for 2024-25. 3% is the base annual teacher increase, without even accounting for increased years of service.
    * Compared to market rate, my last salary is low. When I tried to negotiate a market rate salary in 2022 (while armed with comparable salary and experience data), I was told I was being inappropriate, as salaries are entirely based on CPI and there is no room for negotiation.

    Based on the above info, what salary increase would be appropriate? I’m trying to prepare myself, and want to be reasonable and fair with expectations.

    Thanks in advance!

    1. Based on your 1st and 3rd bullets and an analogy from your 2nd, I would expect your salary to be adjusted for CPI as of both years – as in, you don’t lose out on one of the CPI adjustments because you were on leave.

      Whether you have standing to ask for more based on market analysis is iffy.

      1. Yeah, I don’t see why you think you can negotiate a higher salary from a government employer especially when returning from leave.

        1. I’m not looking to negotiate a higher salary than appropriate. I’m wondering if I should expect just one 3.5% increase to my 22-23 salary, or if I should expect a 5.5%+3.5% increase, or something different.

          1. You should expect both increases. Otherwise, you are functionally taking a pay cut: that’s how inflation works.

    2. What exactly is your negotiating power, having been on leave for a year? I’m not trying to discourage you, just pointing out that your salary seems fixed and they have no reason to give you more on top of whichever CPI increase is consistent with your administrator contract.

      1. Should I expect a 3.5% increase over my last salary or a 5.5+3.5% increase? Or something different? I wasn’t suggesting a bigger increase… I just want to be prepared because I wouldn’t be surprised if they offer only a 3.5% over my last salary, and I’m trying to determine if that would be fair.

        2. It may be fair, but I think you should ask for both increases. You just want your salary to effectively stay where it was, not take a pay cut

  9. Tips for getting the most money for a house sale? I have a very good real estate agent who is giving guidance as well, but want to make sure I’m doing everything I can to maximize the selling price. For instance, how important do you think staging, etc. is? This is in a small metro area, relatively low COL, I’ve owned it for seven years and the home prices in my area haven’t risen as much as they have in big cities.

    1. I can’t imagine we know more than your local realtor about what is valuable in your market.

    2. Get a good realtor.

      Other than that, I’d say make sure you ask the realtor how to be competitive. When we sold ours for a LAUGHINGLY HIGH amount of money, our realtor encouraged us to get it on the market as fast as possible before there was other inventory to compete against. We put all our stuff in storage and listed it the weekend a blizzard was going to hit so the photos were terrible. We were the only open house in town within $100k of our price range for an entire week and we had a bidding war between 5 people. We listed for $450k and sold for $550k. About two months later the market was filled with houses like ours, houses that are direct comps to ours sold for $475-500k.

      1. +1. I listed mine during a snowstorm, had one day of showings, and got multiple offers. We decluttered A TON and moved some furniture to the basement, but we did not pay for staging. In the past few years, we repainted the exterior and replaced some appliances as needed, which I think also helped.

    3. Second the above post, but you also want a quick and seamless sale, so start de-cluttering now. IMO that is as good as staging: few key things in a room, no clutter, a few vague aesthetic items (vs pictures of you and your family). Get the yard looking nice. Caulk and freshen the paint.

      1. +1 to decluttering and depersonalizing. I think that will get you nearly the same benefits as staging unless you’re talking about a very expensive house.

    4. Decluttering is more important than staging, and it costs next to nothing. Curb appeal. Etc.

    5. I recently sold my mother’s house in a similar market – low COL, small metro. It was an older home but was maintained well. I didn’t stage it, and the house was completely empty. We ended up with multiple offers all above asking and had the house sold in 3 days.

    6. Resist your realtor’s advice to make pricey upgrades or repairs. Her goal is a quick sale; your goal is to get the most money. Your goals align somewhat, but not entirely. I’ve sold 4 houses and disregarded advice from my realtor every single time to make pricey upgrades, offer significant seller concessions, accept a low offer or lower my asking price, and I’ve been right all 4 times to the tune of many tens of thousands of dollars. Stand your ground.

      1. Agree — making pre-sale upgrades turns you into a bad amateur house flipper and costs you $ that you may never recoup.

      2. Also agree, as someone looking to buy. The last thing I want is to pay more for shoddy work that’s not to my taste (so many places I look at on Zillow are hideous and make me want to pay less, not more). The only exception would be basic painting or replacing carpets in a place that’s otherwise in excellent shape.

        2. I’ll never forget the house with a brand new kitchen that the sellers insisted they had to get top dollar for. It was a huge space but it was clearly designed by someone who had never cooked. The sink was tiny and shallow; it was probably meant to be a bathroom sink not a kitchen sink. The cabinet that supported it was also tiny, so to get a bigger sink you’d need to replace the cabinets. The built in oven wasn’t big enough for a whole chicken nevertheless a turkey. The fridge was also tiny. But the island was huge! It was bizarre. I’m not sure who is looking for a 5 BR house with a huge eat in kitchen that has a sink too shallow to wash more than one dish at a time and an oven that can’t fit a standard sized baking sheet but it did eventually sell (for less than we offered).

    7. Look on Redfin (or zillow or whatever) for houses in your area that have recently sold at or above listing. Are they fully staged? Or just clean and de-cluttered? The high-end homes in our current market ($2M+) are all staged, but below that, I’m seeing the owners’ stuff.
      We’ve bought and sold several homes in various markets over the past several years, and have never formally staged our home. We de-cluttered, tidied all kid stuff, spruced up the porch with flowers, etc. Make sure your place is clean in addition to tidied – use a magic eraser to remove scuffs, do paint touch-ups as needed, and wash your windows so the home is as bright as possible. Good luck!

    8. I think staging matters a lot for photos; people find houses on Zillow or wherever and those photos mean a lot to them because it’s how they show the places they’re looking at to friends and family who will never see the place in person. Filling the place with light for showings can help (get rid of curtains or have them fully open, empty closets and shelves so it looks like there is a ton of space for people to put all their own things, vs. seeing spaces that are stuffed full of your things).

      1. Looking out of boredom vs looking when actually shopping IMO are not the same. When actually shopping, I’d go to anything in my desired area and price range and house size even without pictures.

    9. +1 to all the decluttering advice – we literally moved 50% of our stuff into storage, and we bought some new furniture pieces that fit the space better (to replace bigger clunkier pieces we moved into storage). Have at least one vase of flowers when the pictures are taken and encourage the photographer to move the flowers around so they’re in each shot. (Most people won’t notice it’s the same vase in every shot.) Make sure it looks bright and airy, this might involve painting. Finally make sure that whoever measures the space is as generous as possible on square footage, but that’s a lot later in the process IIRC.

    11. Adjust your expectations. It’ll sell for what it sells for if your market is a soft one. As long as it’s in good shape – no obvious half-a**ed work, clean, maintained systems, and solid construction it’ll sell for what the market will bear. The ones that sit are the obvious crappily done flips, failing systems or were shoddily built from the start.

    12. Decluttered and superclean. Think like take half the clothes out if your closet will make your closet look bigger. Nothing on kitchen counters. Gut your cupboards as people will look in the cupboards to judge storage space.

      Every personal picture out of the house. Repaint any rooms that are crazy colours. You can people to imagine themselves living there.

      1. Yes. Literally every surface should be clear. We’re talking even appliances off the counters, as much as you can. Pack up half your stuff right now. Get some flowers or plants for a touch of greenery. Our realtors helped us stage slightly, by lending us a rug, some throw pillows, etc. Thoroughly CLEAN before an open house.

        I agree with not making upgrades, other than perhaps paint. We touched up white trim and marks on walls so it didn’t look so lived in. If you have a really loud wall color somewhere, you might considering painting it neutral.

        1. Adding: in a hot market with a generally comparable house, maybe these things matter less. We were in a hot market but with a quirky house (railroad style bedrooms, no first floor toilet, no garage) and still sold for $40K above asking, very quickly, because we made our little shoebox as neat and clean and neutral as possible

    14. Many of you mention making small changes – “like paint, cleaning marks off walls etc…”. Well, do all of you guys live in perfect, relatively newer houses?

      I am in a small, older (> 100 years old), quirky house. Just painting the entire house wood, resurfacing stucco/paint, painting inside (ugh… moving everything first I guess…) is a big project and easily will cost 50k. On a house that is only worth 350k is a lot. And contractors here are very very busy and … not cheap.

      I am getting ready to hire a realtor, but wanted to slowly do repairs etc.. before selling in 1 year.

      1. Unless your walls are flaking apart or painted orange, I don’t think you need to repaint everything! I’m one of the posters above who suggested these touch ups and our house was nearly 80 years old, with plaster walls, so definitely not new. We did all the painting ourselves, in the course of a few days spread out over a few weeks. Nothing was an “upgrade” per se, mainly touching up existing colors.

        The main thing is you want your house to look well taken care of – so whatever that means to you. If something is falling apart or looks neglected, spruce that up. Clean any visible dirt. But you don’t need to make the house look new.

      2. Just wash your painted woodwork. Use a mixture of about a teaspoon of liquid dish soap and a quarter cup of white vinegar to a gallon of hot water. Wipe it down with an ordinary kitchen sponge. If your woodwork isn’t painted, use whatever cleaning method is best suited for its finish. The last time I washed all the woodwork in an old house people argued with me about whether or not I’d repainted.

        And otherwise, strip your house of stuff. Rent a storage unit. Then declutter. Then take out even more. Take out all the clothing that you can, such as out of season stuff. Remove incidental pieces of furniture unless you actually need them for daily living. Leave one thing hung on one wall of any room – the other walls are blank. Mantels are empty and other flat surfaces have nothing but lamps as needed. If it will work at all with your decor, throw some fluffy white bedding, four fluffy pillows, and no decorative pillows on your beds. Target stuff is fine. Nothing, not a damn thing, on the bathroom counters. As close as you can get to that for the kitchen counters. The whole house super clean and especially so for the bathrooms and kitchen.

    15. A couple of years ago, a woman here described how she was a bit extra and went to town on staging her home: pristine fluffy white comforters and gorgeous pillows on all the beds, just the right number of beautiful clothes in the closets (hung on slim velvet hangers), bottles of Perrier in the fridge like it was a hotel, massive massive declutter. She said it seemed to help the sale quite a bit.

    16. Take down all hour clutter and store it. In particular take out very personal things like photos – potential buyers want to imagine themselves living in your home, not imagine the people who live there now. It should be a blank slate. Even if you have to rent some storage space, it’s totally worth it. And while you’re at it, take out some of your furniture and leave more space.

  10. I saw an interesting thread on Twitter about signs you have a great leader — what are some of the best leaders you’ve known and admired? What traits have you tried to build in yourself in order to be a great leader?

    Looking back, I think some of the best leaders I loved were people at the top who didn’t just have the 30,000 foot view but also knew the 100,000 ft view as well as the 30ft view. They knew their team and who excelled at what. They were great listeners, and were curious. They also could make authoritative, informed decisions seemingly on the fly.

    Some of the worst bosses I’ve worked with seemed to be in a defensive mode all the time, and every interaction felt panicked or cynical.

    1. My favorite boss was above all else a truly kind person. No matter how dire something was he’d ask someone to take a seat and check in with them before talking work. He’s give 110 percent credit when you were successful and take all the blame when you weren’t. He was also brilliant, humble, curious and very funny and just great to be around. I think he genuinely enjoyed practicing law which I mostly do not. He got promoted into the higher ranks so I don’t get to work with him anymore but I would probably quit any job to work directly for him.

    2. A great leader is focused on making sure her team has everything they need to be able to do their jobs well. A great leader lets the team in on the big picture. A great leader or teacher is, as one of the best conductors I’ve ever worked with put it, “cheerfully demanding”: she expects excellence but does not browbeat people in order to get it. A great leader understands that organizational culture and values are not established through team-building seminars or happy hours but through the work environment itself. Above all, a great leader understands that it’s not about herself but about her people and the mission.

    3. Having a healthy and fulfilling lives outside of work. I think that those types of leaders tend to be more often ruthlessly efficient and organized while on the clock, because they genuinely value off-the-clock life. They are also more grounded, more likely to relate to their subordinates as people, and less likely to view workplace successes and setbacks emotionally.

      I also admire people who have a natural facility for decisionmaking. When they need more information, they’re good at quickly coming up with a process that will get them what they need. But they’re also good at doing just the appropriate amount of deliberation — and when necessary, reaching decisions quickly and with confidence and acceptance of the consequences. My favorite boss ever was like that. He could walk into an absolute mess, grasp it instantly, ask all of the right questions, and then come up with a plan.

  11. I’ve been having a migraine almost daily for the past week or so. It’s been more of a spotty vision type of migraine rather than an actual headache.

    Obviously I need to go to the doctor, but should I go to my PCP or should I go to my ophthalmologist? Or should I see if I can get into a neurologist and skip the PCP? I haven’t ever been diagnosed with migraine so I’m not sure where to start, especially since mine is more vision related.

    1. See your PCP and you could also try to make an ophthalmologist appointment if you want. Unless you’re a VIP or sick enough to go to the ER, you’re not getting a neurologist appointment without a referral, at least not for a few months (even with a referral it will probably take months in most places).

    2. FWIW, when I started getting headaches with dramatic vision issues out of the blue, it was triggered by too much caffeine. I had gone to my eye doctor and PCP who found nothing life-threatening, and my PCP told me to keep a life journal (food, sleep, exercise, headaches). I quickly made the association to coffee. You might try a few days of journaling before heading to a doc.

    3. when I had ocular migraines my PCP told me to take magnesium supplements – that has helped!

    4. That may not be a migraine. Call an ophthalmologist. They may be able to get you in. Don’t ignore it.

      1. +1. DH has a similar issue and ophthalmologist saw him within hours. They will get you in quickly to make sure that it is isn’t something else (don’t start googling) that needs to be addressed ASAP.

        1. My husband did just last week – his visual spots were actually from a tear in his retina which required laser surgery.

    5. I had to start with my PCP and get a referral to a neurologist.
      An opthamologust is only going to be able to help you if the problem is in your eyes.

    6. You could be experiencing a migraine with aura. Call your PCP because they can start all of the things that are required to rule out other things for a migraine diagnosis like stroke. You also want to find a neurologist that knows migraines, not all do. As a long sufferer, they are going to ask you to attempt to track your triggers if you have migraine so pay attention to if it’s stress, diet, weather, hormones, etc. Every person is different. You should get an updated eye exam because you might be having vision issues that are triggering severe headaches (like tension headaches) that aren’t migraines. But from my understanding, any other type of migraine — hemaplegic, ocular, cluster, etc. is going to be treated by a neurologist.

    7. Definitely see your PCP as soon as you can.

      But you have an ophthalmologist? Why? Most healthy young people may see an optometrist occasionally for the glasses prescription, but not a more specialized (expensive….) ophthalmologist. If you have an ophtho already, definitely call them and ask for an urgent appointment, especially if you can’t get in to see your PCP right away. Ophtho often will squeeze you in quickly, as eye emergencies are no joke, although the likelihood that this is something bad is low.

      It is often very hard to get in to see a headache Neurologist….. like most good ones are booked up for many months. But if you have a family history of migraine, and history of headaches prior to this, that is probably your best bet long term. So I would ask for a referral for this if other causes are ruled out and get on the wait lists.

      Meanwhile, have you tried any over the counter things? Have you had headaches with these sort of eye symptoms before? I do take magnesium daily to help migraine prevention, but it wouldn’t really help once you already have one. But try to sleep/eat/hydrate well.

    8. I recently went through similar. First step was PCP referral to an ophthalmologist who identified a significant issue that required brain imaging as a next step. The ophthalmologist referred me to a neurologist and the first available appointment was 5 months away. At that point, my PCP was able to get me scheduled for an MRI. After the MRI identified an issue, I was offered a same day neurologist appointment. After more imaging and a procedure, I now have a diagnosis and treatment plan for a serious condition with risk of vision loss.
      This is a long way of saying that there are neurological issues that can be picked up by the ophthalmologist and path to resolution may be indirect and involve coordination among multiple doctors. And neurologist appts are hard to get for headaches but may open up when specific issues are identified.

  12. curly girls – how much hair is normal to fall out, do you think? i only wash (and accordingly only comb/brush) my hair once a week and i get big clumps of hair – it seems like a lot but maybe because i’m only doing it once a week? i still have very full hair. late 40s, well past postpartum.

    1. I’m not curly but I’ve started only washing every 5-7 days and it feels like a ton is falling out, but I asked my hairdresser and she said my hair still seemed very full. It’s just because I’m only doing it once a week and so I’m getting the whole clump at a time.

    2. Yeah, if you aren’t washing it more than once a week, that wash will loosen/wash out all the hair that would have come out over the course of the week. I have curly hair and generally wash daily (works for me, don’t judge) and only a little falls out. If I wash Thursday morning for work, work from home on Friday and don’t wash it over the weekend (so 3 days without a wash) a lot comes out. Plus I’m sure whatever products you’re using to preserve your curls for a whole week cause loose hairs to “stick” to the others and not fall out.

    3. As long as your hair doesn’t look thinner over time, you’re good. I have kinky-curly hair. When I wear my natural texture and wash once a week, a decent amount comes out. My hair keeps getting longer and fuller though.

    5. Definitely more falls out when/if you wash etc.. more often. But the question really is… is this an increase compared to what was typical for you? Because you are at an age where other hormonal etc.. causes can contribute to more hair loss.

      I also had very thick hair… but straight. And suddenly started loosing a lot in the shower. It turned out I had a couple new things going on – worse anemia (so I had to start iron – which helped some). And perimenopause started causing me to loose hair.
      We have baldness on one side of the family, and it unfortunately it affects female hair loss too especially when you reach perimenopause. And I had an undiagnosed autoimmune disease that started not long after (triggered by perimenopause) that caused me to more hair (and my eyebrows and eyelashes started thinning too because of this).

      So any sudden change in hair loss is important. If that happened to you, start with your PCP for some basic lab tests, and if it continues and cause is unclear, look for a dermatologist who specializes in hair.

    6. The last two clauses about late 40’s and post-partum? You could be a poster child for hair loss. The post-partum part will work itself out within a year, and then you can reassess.

  13. i’m apparently incompetent, but i seem to have misplaced my airpods in my house. i have the case, but no buds. how do i use the ‘find my’ feature to locate them. i obviously looked this up online, but it doesn’t seem to be working properly.

    1. is it possible you have to be walking around with your phone, like you’re playing a game of warmer/colder? some of our air tags work like that.

    2. are they not showing up in Find My / Devices / Anon’s Airpods? They may be out of battery out of the case?

    3. I typically tear apart the house, give up, buy a new pair, then find the old pair in an obvious place I swore I’d looked after the return period for the new ones has passed…

    4. I gave up looking for a few weeks and went back to my standby plug in ear buds.
      I switched bags for work last week anf what do you know. there thwy were in the convient side pocket of the backpack I was switching into.

      Getting new ones guarantees the lost one will show up. Works with debit cards too.

  15. Tomorrow I turn 50.
    I was planning to go to NZ this year to celebrate it, but, the day before my vacation started, I was in a car accident. I’m fine (I’m alive!!), just a broken bone and some back damage. My doctors say I could be back to normal in a couple of months. But, tomorrow I don’t know what to do with myself. It’s a weekday for everyone (I’m single by choice) and I’ll be meeting up with family over the weekend. And I can’t move much. Under other circumstances, I would have gone on a hike in the nearby mountains. I feel like having a normal day and “postponing” my own birthday to summer.

    1. Happy birthday! Sounds like a a pretty lousy few weeks. I hereby grant you full stranger on the internet permission to have a normal delay and postpone. Wishing you a pleasant but ordinary friday and a fast heal.

    3. Oh, so sorry!

      Definitely postpone the big celebration, enjoy your family on the weekend, and on your birthday treat yourself to the most decadent/favorite food or other treats you love. Even just take out to enjoy at home.

      I’m single and a little older than you and have never had birthday celebrations really, and I do this every year and really look forward to it.

    4. Happy Birthday!!
      I’m all for postponing until you feel ready for a bigger celebration. I’m a single person without close family and these are some things that might make it a fun day, if you’d like that, since it seems like you might just need a special day to treat yourself:
      *Breakfast out / waffles
      *Walk in a nice spot that’s maybe pretty or different, like a local park!
      *A physical treat, like manicure if your body isn’t ready for a massage
      Wishing you a good day of your choosing!

    3. Did I pass? Did you count my one blue nail against me? What about my water bottle?

      Seriously though, this is one of my favorite places. If third places can be virtual, this is one of mine.

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