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Anon for this
Philly girl here looking for a new idea for Mother’s Day brunch this year. My mom likes a fancier experience. She loves a seafood tower, perfect omel3tt3 and indulgent pastries.
Already have done-
-XIX (Nineteen at the Bellevue)
-Parc
-Devon
-Rouge
-a kitchen
-Bistrot la Min3tt3
-The Love
-Urban Farmer
-Aware of Lacroix but at $150pp it’s too expensive
-Would do Talula’s Garden but it’s already booked up
Anything I’m overlooking based on this wish list?
Anon
Fork?
Anon
I loved Fork!
London (formerly NY) CPA
Maybe Capital Grille?
Anon
Harp and Crown. It’s my answer for everything but their brunch buffet is incredible.
Royal Boucherie? I’ve only been for dinner but their menu for brunch looks good.
Aquimero? I’ve only been for drinks, but their brunch looks good too (a la carte and prix fixe option)
Anonymous
Forsythia or Harp and Crown? I’ve never been to Forsythia, but just saw they are doing brunch again. Harp and Crown was great for a brunch buffet, although I haven’t been for brunch since pre-covid, so its been awhile.
It seems like you have done all the obvious places. Maybe your mom would want to repeat one of her favorites from the past?
Anon
I went to H&C brunch last winter (2022) and it was still fantastic!
Anon
Suraya?
Anon for this
OP of the thread here- thanks all! Somehow I’ve never been to Harp & Crown so might end up there.
You also reminded me we want to go back to Kalaya, but mom’s not big on Thai flavors so not a good choice for that occasion.
Anon for this
Um, and Suraya, which I completely mixed up in my head while responding :)
MJ
I’m not a Philly girl, but I go to Parc every time I’m in town, and it is an absolutely perfect dining experience. Don’t mess with perfection, IMHO.
Annony
What about the restaurant at the Four Seasons?
Artemis
Founding Farmer, but it’s in KOP
Bud & Marilyn’s in the city for a funkier vibe
Anonymous
Does anyone recommend a particular software for organization within a legal practice group to manage tasks and deadlines among multiple individuals? I head the estate administration practice group at my firm which is comprised of several attorneys, four paralegals and various administrative assistants that provide us with support across three different offices. Each estate can take between six months and two years, depending on the complexity. Once condition is that my firm’s security policies do not permit us to use any cloud-based software.
Anon
I think you’re going to struggle with the cloud restriction.
anon
Can echo this. I work in a space with high cybersecurity requirements and finding on-prem software is a PITA.
F in SF
Jira on-prem
Anon
This.
I’m a litigator who was seconded to a project for several years, and now that i’m back to litigation i want to be able to assign Jiras to my admin staff so that things don’t get missed!
Anon
I’m disturbed by some of the justifications for mass shootings of children that I’m seeing in my circles, including arguments that shooting is an understandable (if regrettable) action to take when you’ve been rejected by your parents or community or when you have experienced trauma. I’ve seen what are essentially justifications/”what did you expect” type of arguments from progressives I know, although they are quick to add “but of course it’s a tragedy.” What can we do to teach kids/teens/young adults, especially boys, that it is NOT understandable, that it is NOT OK, that you’re responsible for working through life’s challenges in a way that doesn’t harm others, that part of life is dealing with people letting you down, sometimes in very hurtful ways, and that your mental health is your responsibility even if it’s not your fault? I never, ever would’ve thought that young people needed to be taught that shooting kids is wrong, but apparently it is needed, and now it’s also needed for young women when previously, school shootings were almost 100% male.
People seem to have no appetite for gun control, but is there a way that we can interrupt this link between “I’m traumatized/angry” and “I’m going to kill kids” in the minds of these people? My first thought is that we need to push back on pundits who argue that shooting is understandable or that violence is a logical response to pain. Social contagion and copycat crimes are very, very real, especially among teens, and maybe there’s some way we can get a critical mass of troubled teens to view school shootings as completely unacceptable or the worst possible way to make a statement. I don’t claim to have all the answers and this won’t stop all gun violence, but can we ever get back to pre-1999 when school shootings essentially didn’t happen, even though society faced major challenges?
Anonymous
1000+. There is NO justification for this.
anon
I too am disturbed that your circle is justifying school shootings! I have not heard anything like this from anyone I am connected to – mostly liberals, but also a few conservatives.
Anon
I feel like it would really help if one of the school shooters who survived and is doing life in prison would be willing to speak publicly about how this ruined his life – he didn’t get the fame, glory, etc that he wanted, and more he’s rotting in jail, mostly forgotten, and living with what he’s done. That would depend on finding a shooter who survived, accepts the horror of his actions, and is willing to speak – but I think that would help reach some of the young people (mostly men) who believe that this will give them the sense of power and fame that they want.
And yeah, I’ve actually seen people in my circles make arguments that extremely close to blaming the victims (bc they live in a tr*ns-unfriendly state, bc it was a Christian school, etc) or excusing the shooter (bc as a tr*ns person they were oppressed). It’s not okay. At all.
Anon
From what I’ve read, it’s not a Christian school (like something that de-values education, handles snakes, and is straight out of Footloose), but a school established by a main line Presbyterian church in an area like Bethesda in Nashville (but even if it were a country church with fewer resources and not a mainline denomination, since when do you shoot 9YOs or anyone?!). My kids went to a daycare run by a church– they celebrated Christmas and had chapel where they read very sanitized Bible stories, but it was nothing over the top and otherwise it was no different than their secular daycares prior to it. IIRC, Presbyterians ordain women (at least, the list d be longer), so this is pretty vanilla among Protestant denominations.
anon
This just plays into the whole problem. Why are you arguing that the church was not too churchy? If it were, would it make a difference? Seriously.
Anon
Agreed. It shouldn’t matter. The shooter made the choice to kill. Plenty of people go through straight up conversion therapy and don’t kill anyone. There is no excuse.
Anon
Exactly this. It should not matter at all. Millions of people go through extreme trauma every single day and don’t shoot up schools. Arguments like this are exactly the problem referenced in this post.
Anon
I’ve said it before and I will continue to say it: as a survivor of child abuse, whose abuser was never abused themselves (and was born into an educated, upper middle class family, wow this really makes me mad. Some people are just pieces of crap despite being given every advantage in the world, and huge numbers of their victims manage to be decent human beings.
Anonymous
Idk why you would say it isn’t a Christian school. It is. Not all Christian schools are crazy.
Anon
Yeah, “it’s not crazy and anti-intellectual so it’s not Christian” is pretty bigoted. Let us just forget about the innumerable universities and hospitals founded by Christians.
Maudie Atkinson
I am emphatically NOT defending the shooter, but as a point of information, Covenant is a PCA church and school, not PCUSA. The PCUSA does ordain women and is LGBTQ-affirming. The PCA does not ordain women and professes that homosexual practice is a sin.
Anonymous
And? The commenter here said it wasn’t a Christian school which is blatantly false.
Mau
If the point you’re making is that the PCA is a Christian denomination, I do not disagree.
As others have pointed out, there are many different Christian denominations, and they are not equivalent. But, again, nothing makes this defensible.
Maudie Atkinson
If the point you’re making is that the PCA is a Christian denomination, I do not disagree.
As others have pointed out, there are many different Christian denominations, and they are not equivalent. But, again, nothing makes this defensible.
Anon
This comment (9:24) is offensive to me as a Christian and a southerner. The vast majority of Christians believe in education and not in snake-handling. And as a southerner…are you surprised that there are leafy, affluent suburbs with an educated populace? Do you expect that we all live in trailers and chew tobacco? Please, try stepping away from your stereotypes for just a moment. Doing so would reflect well on the education you purport to value.
Anon
<3
Anon
I am fairly anti-religious and it offend me as well.
Anonymous
I feel like that was literally the point she was making? That both exist and she sent her own kids to one that seemed normal? Forgive me if I get this wrong- I’m from a part of the count where we have Catholics and everyone else so I really struggle with the particulars of protestant Christianity- but I don’t think she was saying that Presbyterians or whatever aren’t Christian.
Anon
It was a Christian school.
Exactly how many schools do you think are out there that handle snakes?
waffles
I was raised Christian, went to a Christian school up to grade 8. This is in Canada, not the US, so mayyybe – if I’m being super generous – I can acknowledge there are some cultural difference. But I genuinely have NO CLUE what is this ‘snake handling’ thing that the commenter at 9:24 is alluding to.
Anonymous
Snake handling is a pretty rare practice in some fundamentalist churches
Anon
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Snake_handling_in_Christianity
Anon
9:24, according to NPR, there are an estimated 125 churches in North America that practice snake-handling, each with only two dozen or so members. You’ve judged over 200 million Americans based on the habits of a few thousand.
https://www.npr.org/2013/10/04/226838383/snake-handling-preachers-open-up-about-takin-up-serpents
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christianity_in_the_United_States
Anon
I’m not sure it matters really, but this was not a mainline Presbyterian church (Presbyterian Church USA). It belongs to the Presbyterian Church of America, which is quite conservative. It opposes ordination of women, among other things. Fundamentalists with a bit of polish, if you will.
anonshmanon
those justifications are truly horrifying.
In my ideal world, we would make the move from guns being a ubiquitous part of life to something that is not normal. Not just the availability of the actual thing itself, but how present it is in culture. That would mean don’t buy your nieces nerf guns, have a conversation with your teen about playing first person shooter games, better awareness for how cop shows and action movies glorify guns and desensitize the audience to violence, fewer armed guards, or armed cops in public places, which should be reserved for rare urgent situations. There may also be a greater context of dehumanizing ‘the other side’ in the language used in this country’s public discourse, but I have no idea how to roll that back.
But bottom line, there are distraught individuals in every part of the world, it’s just not as easy for them to obtain assault weapons as it is in the land of the free.
Trish
Cruz survived and there was a whole trial explaining his life story and how he got to the point that he killed 17 people. Dr. James Garbarino wrote “The Lost Boys” regarding his interviews with hundreds of young killers. That said, we know that early childhood intervention, later school starts, access to the arts, and mentorship can change the trajectory of the life of a child who is born into dysfunction and extreme poverty or deprivation. Unfortunately, as long as we just call it evil and separate ourselves from the killer and call them monsters in order for US TO JUSTIFY their execution, we will never ever lesson the violence. Gun control alone won’t stop the cycles of trauma, violence and abuse.
Maudie Atkinson
Gun control would do a hell of a lot, and much more quickly and efficiently than just about any other solution.
But separating ourselves from shooters and dehumanizing them–however monstrous, inexplicable, and indefensible their behavior–certainly does not improve things.
anonymous
Maudie, what specific “gun control” proposals would do a hell of a lot? Full scale national confiscation of all assaults rifles? All firearms? Even assuming away the political and legal impediments to those approach, I’m afraid measures short of this (e.g., “assault weapons ban” on purchases new assault weapons) won’t make a meaningful dent on gun violence.
Anonymous
Let’s just try though. Let’s start with the assault weapons and see happens. Let’s explore laws where your family and neighbors need to sign off on your gun purchase. Let’s require a six week training class and a full psychological evaluation and before you even get a hunting rifle. Let’s put gun owners on something like a s*x offender registry so that if my kid kicks a ball over to some neighbors house I know it’s not worth it. I wholeheartedly believe the trade offs here are 100% worth it. The stats are clear that people with guns in their homes for self defense are more likely to kill a loved one or themselves than fend off an intruder. Let’s talk about the violent fantasy of murdering a “bad guy” and evaluate people who cherish it for violent tendencies. Let’s talk about strict liability for retailers, manufacturers and gun owners. Let’s discuss gun insurance. Let’s make every “responsible” gun owner do jail time when their gun ends up in the hands of a child or in the hands or someone who shoots a child. Let’s seriously question why anyone needs more than one gun, let alone a collection. Let’s have random yearly gun inspections to make sure you’re keeping yours “responsibly” and that the serial number isnt missing. Let’s make guns as socially unacceptable as they ought to be.
What were your ideas?
Maudie Atkinson
We’ll agree to disagree re: assault (and other high capacity) weapons. The ability to fire so many rounds so quickly is part of what makes them so dangerous in a mass shooting situation, and I think that would be a meaningful dent.
pugsnbourbon
+1 million to 1:41.
Anon
We had an assaults weapon ban. I think it did make a dent. Not sure why we got rid of it!
Anon
Agreed, Maudie.
Why are people so against it?
Anon
THANK YOU Anon at 1:41.
Anon
Gun control would mean a hella fewer children dead, I can’t believe you’d argue against it.
Anonymous
You just need different friends. Zero people I know have said anything of the sort. At some point who you choose to spend time with reflects on you.
busybee
This. If I had friends making these justifications I would no longer be friends with them, and they would know exactly why. I have never heard these sentiments expressed so I’m wondering what kind of echo chamber OP lives in.
Anon
Who said anything about friends?
busybee
I mean OP said it’s in her “circles” so it’s reasonable to assume she means friends and acquaintances
Anonymous
You’re literally the only person I’ve heard say any of this.
Anon
Same
Anon
Then I’m glad to raise awareness of an important issue for you.
Anon
Or creating a problem that doesn’t really exist…
Anonymous
This.
Anon
I think you’re just not paying attention. After the Half Moon Bay shooter killed coworkers and their relatives, newspapers immediately jumped to all the slights he had experienced and the terrible conditions farm workers live in in that area. The Monterey Park shooter was constantly referenced in the context of rising levels of anti-Asian hate. There are countless more examples, and we need to have a conversation about media coverage and copycat crimes and normalization of violent reactions. No one is making you participate if you don’t want to. You always have a choice to step away.
Anonymous
Not the person you’re referring to but no. I’m not stepping away from anyone trying to make school shootings about anything but lack of gun control. That is the conversation we need to be having. That is the conversation we need to keep having until something is done. Shame on you for blaming anything but the guns and the jerks waving them around as a symbol of anything but suffering and violence.
Anon
She is not creating a problem that doesn’t exist. I am in Tennessee and surrounded by parents with school age children who oppose any form of gun control. “Guns don’t kill people, people kill people”. But you can kill more people faster with an assault type rifle you morons. Gah.
Anon
I think there’s misinterpretation here. I’m not saying school shootings and guns are not a problem. I”m saying OP’s “everyone is justifying mass shootings by talking about the shooter’s trauma” is a problem that doesn’t exist. Based on the responses here a lot of people are saying that everyone around them is talking about how guns and only guns are the problem, and it seems like OP is trying to stir the pot by acting like everyone is fixated on the shooter’s alleged traumas when in reality everyone (especially on the left) is fixated on guns – as they should be.
Anonymous
Thanks for clarifying 258. I read this like you were the op saying media coverage was the problem. I’m understanding now that you were telling the op to walk away from the weird straw man conversation she reported hearing. I apologize.
Anon
Yup. I have some very conservative relatives and they’re just as horrified after every mad shooting (especially ones in schools) as the rest of us.
In fact it “radicalized” my aunt to become a moderate because she was so concerned her kids would become victims of a school shooting.
Anon
You are lucky. The conservatives I know say it’s all psyops!
Anon
If they think it’s psyops they aren’t conservatives, they are cult members (QAnon)
Anon
Same. I think she’s just projecting a reading on it. No progressives I’ve heard would say this. Troll maybe?
anon2653548
“I’ve never heard or seen it so it must be in OP’s head.”
Nora
I have heard and seen this online not as a justification, but as like an explanation.
“There was a history of abuse at the school”. “They must have been doing it because of something that happened to them” etc etc
I don’t think any of that matters, nothing justifies killing people especially little kids, but it is a train of thought for some people.
Anon
Ignore the damn manifestos. Ignore their social media accounts. Stop putting an analysis of their tortured psyches up for review. Try to break the link between school shootings and suicide by cop. Focus on the victims.
I am convinced that some of the reason there were no copycat marathon bombings (so far, and God willing, never again) is that the focus was on the victims. We all know the names of the four people who died. There are memorials to them. One SOB was run over by his brother and the other SOB is on death row.
Cl
Yeah there should be reporting rules for media (as they have for suicide reporting) to avoid contagion.
Anon
Completely agree. I’m very conflicted about publishing Hale’s manifesto for that reason.
Anon
I’m not conflicted. Just because people can do something doesn’t mean they should, and the manifesto should be ignored by the public at large.
Anon
Do all this + gun control.
anon
I 100% agree with you.
And, concurrently, f*ck the gun nuts in this country. Nobody needs an assault rifle.
Anon
There’s no valid justification for this situation. That said this particular m&ss sh0oting just shattered the stereotype in some ways of the people that are capable of performing these atrocities AND there is, to my knowledge, the first time an institution with religious ties has been targeted. What you may be seeing is people working thru these increasingly complex and variety of people’s lived experiences and choices leading up to an effing tragic and unjustifiable event. I suspect this particular mass shooting event is going to be very polarizing based on the gender of the shooter, the institution targeted, and the public’s possible waning ability to deal with the collective trauma of a m@ss sho0ting event. Note that google search says this has happened over 120 times in 2023 so far.
Anne-on
Uh, first time an organization with religious ties has been targeted? Do you mean the first time a christian organization has been targeted? Because the people who send their kids to Jewish schools/daycares have been dealing with these threats for a long, long time, to say nothing of those who have kids in other non-mainstream faith based schools/after school programs.
Monday
There was also the black church in South Carolina shot up by a white supremacist.
pugsnbourbon
Yeah, it’s definitely not the first time a religious org has been targeted. The Charleston church shooting comes to mind, in addition to the numerous attacks on synagogues, mosques, etc.
Anon
Thank you, also Jewish and the idea that someone thinks this is the first time a religious institution was targeted is horrifying to me. Way to show yourself as someone who pays no attention to the disturbingly increasing hate crimes against Jews, including a mass shooting at a synagogue less then 5 years ago.
Anon
Tell that to the Sikhs.
Anonymous
It’s not true that this is the first time a religious school has been targeted. If you’re hearing people say that they’re ignorant. West Nickel Mines.
Anon
Lots of Christian churches and synagogues and religious institutions of other faiths have been targeted.
Anon
So religious = Christian and white?
anonshmanon
as others have said, this is far from being the first religious organization being the scene of a mass shooting in recent memory. But this comment shows maybe two things: 1. how constant the stream of such events is so that it’s easy to forget or entirely miss any given one. Let’s say you are in an intense work week – something else will push Nashville out of the headlines when you get back to reading the news in a week.
2. How we collectively do all kinds of mental gymnastics to define each of those incidents as unique. That can be through analyzing the shooter, the location, the victims, and any history between them. Focusing on the particulars is oh so helpful to convince ourselves that we are still safe, because there were all these special circumstances. This is a natural thinking pattern but it doesn’t serve us. It distracts us from the bigger picture and prevents us from holding leaders accountable.
Monday
I agree with this.
Anon
No y’all are right. I’m sorry I was wrong to say first time an institution (meaning school) with religious ties involved. Thanks for setting me straight. Hate crimes against any religious group and hate crimes in general are not acceptable.
Anonymous
I think the comment about not fetishizing guns is a big part of this. I heard/read somewhere that there was a restriction on advertisements for cigarettes put into place where you couldn’t actually show the cigarettes in the ad. I think something akin to this would be extraordinarily helpful – but I have no idea what form it would take or how to implement it. But the less you see/hear about guns, I think the better.,
anonshmanon
oh yeah, I forgot to mention that. We can shift the tide of cultural conversation, it’s happened before. I am not sure about the historic factors around cigarettes (was there prohibition-style pressure on the entertainment industry in that case?), but the depiction of women, people of color, disabled people, diversity in se#ual orientation, consent in plotlines, have changed just as dramatically, and in many cases through an organic interaction of avant garde (activist?) storytellers and the public demanding more woke depictions from media in turn. You could do that for violence/gun violence/mature ways of conflict resolution. I am just not sure that it will be faster than the effect of regulating guns.
Anon
Apparently my city pays a lot of tax money just to keep gun shows out of its conference centers every year. They think it’s worth doing.
Anon
I’m also for less feeling, as well as seeing/hearing. Our country doesn’t need assault weapons.
Monday
I have never heard anyone I know speak this way about shootings being understandable in any way. However, I don’t find it hard to believe your report.
I think we’re in a state of moral incoherence and crisis right now, due to lots of different factors. There is almost no consensus on right and wrong that I can see. So you have amoral actions, possibly triggered by amoral social influences, and then endlessly multiplying amoral takes on those actions. This is not the first mass shooter to gain apologists/defenders; Kyle Rittenhouse was spontaneously offered internships with numerous GOP lawmakers.
anon
I am a progressive in a progressive circle and I have seen NOTHING like that. I do live in Texas, and some conservative people have said disturbing things about trans people in wake of this but I am ignoring them to the best of my ability.
Anon
I mean, in a society where anyone can be a parent and parents/school/health care are not universally good, there are going to be children and adults that grow up with issues. You throw in widespread problems like abuse, social media, bullying etc… it creates more unstable individuals. You add in the randomness of genetics that puts any of us at risk for an assortment of personality/behavioral trait or mental illness that fill a bell curve, and treatment in many cases is not available/known to be needed/wanted…. and there are going to be conflicts. And then you add a society filled with unsecured, minimally restricted guns……
Most people are a product of their genetics and environment. Many mental illnesses include a component where people do not even understand they are sick, and believe they are the victim/at risk. Answers are never simple or easy to implement. It all comes down to what a society values (ie. who deserves good education/healthcare/?parents), and what “freedoms” are more important than others.
Owning a gun unfortunately appears to be valued much higher in this country than I would hope.
As a scientist, and the more I learn how the brain works, I truly wonder how much free will we have without an assortment of interventions. That’s why as a society, we have to decide where we want to draw the lines.
Trish
There is a huge difference between justification and mitigation. Mitigation is a way of explaining how a person gets to the point in their life that commit mass murder. We really need to understand trauma and how to address young people who are at risk if we are going to lesson the violence in our society. We must deal with gun control and mental health/trauma. Building more prisons and executing more killers will not stop the violence. We know that early childhood intervention, later school starts, access to the arts, and mentorship can change the trajectory of the life of a child who is born into dysfunction and extreme poverty or deprivation.
Anon
Plenty of school shooters grew up in what appeared to be stable, supportive households and went to great schools. Obviously one can never be sure of what goes on behind closed doors, but if trauma alone caused school shootings, then everyone in the world would be dead. Something is missing in this explanation.
Anonymous
Right. It’s the guns. It’s the ”my right to carry a gun is worth your life” attitude. It’s “hey isn’t it cute to meet reasonable conversations about gun control with threats of murder to the people having them attitude.”
Trish
Trauma does not “cause” school shootings and one said that it did. But it is a huge factor and many people react to trauma with drug addiction or self-harm rather than violence. Another factor is our society and its infatuation with guns and violence as well as the availability of guns. Other people who grew up with trauma also had what we call “protective” factors. I am wondering, however, which school shooter grew up in a stable home and went to great schools and how you know this? All I do is represent people who murdered others and I never met a single one where we were not able to discuss traumatic events in their life. The concrete-thinking prosecutors often use the argument that my clients have siblings who did not kill anyone. Of course, I can always find an explanation for that. In some cases, the sibling had a mentor in their life. In other cases, the siblings turned their trauma inward. Just because a family appears middle class to you does not mean there was not sexual or physical abuse or neglect. I highly suggest that you read Dr. Garbarino’s book, The Lost Boys, before commenting further. In the meantime, if you want to stop the cycle, find a child to mentor.
Anon
In general it’s good to remember that great schools can still be hell on earth if they’re inescapable, compulsory attendance environments (though I think this explains suicide better than murder).
But not every killer has trauma. Some people are radicalized, and trauma isn’t necessary to be vulnerable to radicalization. Some people have loving families and dedicated mentors and still become threats to the people in their lives.
It may be that every malefactor comes up with a story if they think it will win them sympathy. And maybe it’s even best to always treat this as though it’s true, but I know people also lie.
anon
But plenty of people experience trauma, and do not kill other people. What makes your clients different? Why couldn’t they “turn their trauma inward” instead of harming others?
Trish
In my experience working with murderers, they are much more likely to cover up their trauma than disclose it to their lawyers or a psychologist. We often have to work for months or years with the killers family and the killer to get anyone to disclose what went on in the home. You are watching too many prime time crime shows.
Anon
Anon at 1:21: everyone respondes to trauma differently depending on epigentics, the environment in which they grew up, their role models, their peers, their schooling, and whether they had any protective factors. I understand that you want to otherize the monster but that is not helpful. There are many books that you can read on this subject. That said, if you want to stop violence in your community, lobby for access to the arts and early childhood interventions, and find a child to mentor. What are you doing to stop violence today?
Anon
Then I believe you about your experience! I think someone who finds it hard to talk about something traumatic that happened is really different from someone who leads with a story specifically to explain away past acts of violence and win sympathy, which is what I more often encounter in the community. I think I’m probably thinking of entirely different people when it comes to radicalization into hate groups.
Trish
Anon at 2:37: As a lawyer, I start by looking at brain functioning and childhood experiences. That doesn’t mean the defendants are doing that!
It occurred to me that it took a team of lawyers and mental health experts to convince 3 people that Cruz should not be executed for his crimes. What is frustrating for me is we spend so much time and money on the backend with trials and prison rather than focusing on prevention and intervention.
Anon
“What is frustrating for me is we spend so much time and money on the backend with trials and prison rather than focusing on prevention and intervention.”
This is the whole problem.
roxie
This sounds like an absolute straw man. No one is arguing this.
“People seem to have no appetite for gun control,” – flat out wrong as noted by everyone public opinion poll.
I’m questioning your underlying motives here.
Anonymous
Also questioning op’s motives. Questioning the motives of anyone who think is this isn’t about guns and gun culture. If your congressman puts guns in the hands of his children on his Christmas card I promise you he loves guns more than children. I can’t believe good people don’t get that.
Senior Attorney
Amen.
Anon
I see that you are familiar with Andy Ogles’ Christmas card. Nothing says “I love Jesus and celebrate his birth” than kids with guns in their hands on the family Christmas card, right. GOP gerrymandered Nashville and that is the reason this piece of excrement was elected. He represents part of Nashville, God help us all.
Anon
OP here and I should have clarified that there isn’t much appetite for gun control LEGISLATION. If only there were. President Biden himself said (this week) that he has done all he can on the executive said and that he cannot do more without legislation. That feels unattainable to me in this Congress and it’s a tragedy, but I don’t want to use it as an excuse to feel helpless.
Anonymous
There are angry messed-up young men all over the world. The difference is that in the US they have access to assault rifles.
Anon
Is this correct? Are there lots of school shootings in other countries that aren’t as bad because they only had access to regular guns? Or lots of incidents of people attacking with other weapons?
kag
As a European, any attack in school is very very rare and a huge news.
Anon
This is what I thought. I get that these attacks can be much less deadly with different weapons. But it sounds wrong to me to say that everywhere in the world has this problem all aside from access to one specific type of weapon.
Anon
Yes it’s correct.
anonshmanon
In the last two days there was a knife attack in Lisbon, Portugal, 2 people dead, and another one in Sao Paulo, Brazil, 1 person dead.
Australia tightened restrictions 2 weeks after a horrendous mass shooting in 1996 and has not had any since then. New Zealand did it after Christchurch. Germany and Switzerland tighten restrictions when mass shootings occur. Sweden and Norway have very high gun ownership rates, but also strict regulations resulting in hardly any deaths from legal guns.
anonshmanon
I would go so far as to say the US is one of the only places where anyone can legally buy an AR15, so obviously if we were to ban those the manufacturers would be in trouble.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Overview_of_gun_laws_by_nation There is a table halfway down, showing that most countries completely prohibit or limit people from buying automatic weapons.
Anon
Yes. Australia changed our gun laws after a mass shooting in the 90s.
There’s no such thing as school shootings here.
Anon
Hi. I’m from Nashville and live near the shooting. A lot of the information about the shooter’s motivation that is being discussed here is… outdated.
Yes, the school is a Christian school in a well-to-do area. The governor’s wife was friends with one of the victims. It is very common here to send kids to private school, regardless of religious affiliation. The school is elementary school only. The shooter went to the school for elementary school and then went to an art school after that. The shooter did not begin identifying as trans until the past few months (so did not identify as trans while at this elementary school). The police have also revealed that per the shooter’s writings, the shooter had considered targeting a nearby mall and another high school. (There is a large public high school down the road, which is across the street from the mall.) The shooter appears to have chosen this school because she was familiar with the building… not because of any motivation about being anti-trans, etc. The shooter appears to have been doing some version of suicide by cop.
I want to make it clear that I don’t believe the shooter’s actions would have been excused by any motivation he could have had… I am just clarifying that the police have not found any motive.
The shooter’s parents seem to have been doing what they thought was the right thing– they were seeking mental health treatment for the shooter. In addition, they sold the firearms in their home. The shooter was still able to get guns on his own. There is nothing to point to here as a culprit except loose gun laws.
roxie
Thank you for this information and context. I’m very sorry your community has experienced this.
Anon
Doesn’t “suicide by cop” require cops that will reliably kill people?
Trish
Welp. We have that for sure, especially if the suspect is African American.
Auburn
Thank you for this update – I’ve been avoiding the news. +1000000000 to your last sentence.
Anon
But why, in a setting where we don’t have any good gun control, are some teens and young adults who shoot children? I don’t need laws controlling my gun access to know that that is morally abhorrent and not the answer to life’s problems. Someone could put assault weapons into my hands and I would still never pull the trigger. Yes, we need gun control, but what the hell is going on with these people?
Anon
There’s always going to be mentally ill people. It’s a lot easier to limit gun access than to fix mental illness. Every other country has mentally ill people and people who want to murder others. The difference is they almost never commit mass shootings because they don’t have such easy access to guns, especially assault rifles.
Anon
Yes, you are right. Lots of mental health problems in Australia but our gun laws mean there’s no school shootings.
Anon
I honestly don’t believe this. I think something is messed up with the culture here besides the guns. Does every country have a bunch of copycat threats all over the country whenever this happens?
Anonymous
It’s guns. It’s guns and gun culture. When you elect a man to congress who gives guns to his children to pose with like they’re puppies, you can’t shock people by carrying them threatening harm to yourself or others . You only get that from senseless killings of people who least deserve it. Get rid of the guns. You’ll stop tons of suicide and murder by family members and also mass shootings. Everyone would be better off.
Anonymous
On her own.
Anon
Wow. My circle skews heavily liberal — VERY liberal, as we are the small blue area in an extremely red state — and I’ve never heard any argument like this regarding school shootings.
Anon
Any good 2023 recommendations for my unicorn: executive-ish (vs schoolgirl) Mary Janes or shoes that are D’orsay with a buckle strap? My foot is triangular after crushing some toes, so I need something with a strap to keep wider shoes on my narrow-otherwise feet. But it can’t look like I’m 7 or, often for adult shoes, 107. I have a pair from 2017 on their last legs and some Swedish Hasbeens (wearable in a casual office most days). I’m thinking of something like a ballroom dance shoe, but I just can’t with the putty color and they often look costumey. Help! Some heel is fine; flats are fine; 3″ heels are a no.
NotInstaFamous
What about the Stuart Weitzman slingback flat? Not quite a D’Orsay but might fit the brief?
NotIntsaFamous
Ooops forgot the link:https://www.stuartweitzman.com/products/stuart-sleek-slingback-flat/SE688.html
Anonymous
M Gemi has or had some nice ones – both flats and a block heel.
Anon
SJP makes a pointed toe mary jane that’s lovely. It also comes in a higher height that I personally prefer.
https://sjpbysarahjessicaparker.com/collections/pumps/products/nirvana_70_black-patent_23260
Anne-on
I like to stalk Kate Spade and Boden for this as I often walk about of my shoes (duck feet with narrow heels). These in navy are cute:
https://www.bodenusa.com/en-us/pointed-toe-mary-jane-shoes-navy/sty-a1407-nav?cat=C1_S2_G11
These are a bit more fun:
https://www.bodenusa.com/en-us/patent-leather-block-heels-black/sty-a1439-blk?cat=C1_S2_G11
These a a bit higher than you might like but I find denim a surprisingly versatile fabric for spring:
https://www.anntaylor.com/shoes/all-shoes/cata000020/608150.html?priceSort=DES
anon
These are all so cute. Alas, my duck feet hate pointed toes. Can’t anyone give me these styles in a good almond toe? That extra space would make all the difference.
pugsnbourbon
Here are a couple from a Zappos search that might work:
Gray snakeskin – I have boots in this print and they go with everything: https://www.zappos.com/p/dansko-lilly-grey-snake/product/9741842/color/1847
Black and navy leather – these look pretty “grown-up” to me: https://www.zappos.com/p/sam-edelman-michaela-black-leather/product/9609940/color/72
Anonymous
Sarah Flint, Boden, etc
try Anne Klein Fabulist, been around for years
anon a mouse
Does it have to be a Mary Jane or have a strap? Those skew younger by design. How do you feel about a heeled brogue?
One option for an almond toe with an ankle strap is the JCrew Maisie, but it looks like it’s sold out. If you have an outlet store near you it might be worth a try.
Anon
I just bought these from Vagabond – the first time I wore them they gave me blisters, but I bought black no show socks and now they wear great. I feel like they’re very grown up and on trend:
https://www.vagabond.com/us/delia-5307-401-20/
Anonymous
Character shoes, which are probably like your ballroom shoes, often come in black. That’s what I used to use when we needed heeled shoes in my jazz classes. You might search on that term.
Anon
Paul Green is always my answer: https://www.schuhe-lueke.com/paul-green-womens-shoes-3807-013-2220060098.aspx . Available in black and tan. The shipping charge to the US is 35 Euros for any number of items. I have ordered from this website.
Startup lawyer
Le Monde Beryl
Mm
Sale alert because one of you turned me on to Kojima Pearl – they have a great sale on if you buy two pieces. Now trying to decide if I really need a pearl bracelet in my life.
Anon
I so wish that there were options other than yellow gold. I would be seriously spending. I guess the good news is that the absence of white gold and sterling options means that I just save thousands of dollars.
Panda Bear
I bet they would restring something for you with white gold or silver hardware, if you asked! Of course, in some cases it might not be possible if the pearls are already drilled with gold hardware. It might be worth checking if there is something you really love. I’ve always had great customer service (and received unusual, high quality pearls) with Kojima.
Anon
I’m sure Sarah would make something for you in white gold or sterling. Seriously, just write to her.
How to wear a ring
I just inherited a ring that I would like to wear, but I’ve never worn rings before and I’m terrified I’ll lose it. Any tips?
Cat
I have been wearing rings since middle school and have never lost one, but the important thing is to make sure it’s the right size for the finger you’ll wear it on!
If it’s a soft stone you’ll want to avoid wearing it where you might bang it up. For not losing it when you’re NOT wearing it, always keep it in the same place, whether jewelry box or ring dish.
anonshmanon
do you typically lose other items? If it’s correctly sized, it shouldn’t slip off your finger unnoticed.
anon
The only ring I have ever lost is one that was too big and it flung off my hand when I was gesturing wildly (found it years later when my friends moved!). Make sure the ring is sized properly and always take it off and put it on in the same place in the house. If I must take a ring off outside the house, I zip it into my wallet coin section or into a zippered pocket in my purse then set a reminder on my phone to remember to take it out and put it back in the jewelry box when I get hone.
rings a bell
At some point I expect I will lose my wedding ring permanently, but so far I have only misplaced it. Things I have started to do to put off losing it as long as possible:
– ring holders by sinks I regularly use so that I can take it off and have a place to put it (kitchen sink when washing dishes or kneading dough, bathroom sink when showering or doing other stuff.)
– don’t wear it when I know I’ll be doing activities where it is more likely to get lost and be gone forever (fishing, swimming, scuba diving). I have a silicone ring I wear on these occasions, though you could also just not wear it.
– a portable ring holder for if you’re wearing it when out and about or traveling and you need to take it off. I have two a lion latch which I just got and looks promising, and a little zipper pouch which came with my silicone ring.
Trish
I never ever wear my ring when I am home.
Anon
If you want to build up a ring wearing habit. Also keeping ring dishes/bowls around your home is key.
I never take put my rings anywhere unless it’s a specific place for rings. I keep ring dishes in the bathroom, bedroom and by the kitchen sink. If I misplaced a ring, I only want to look in 3 places and know it’s guaranteed to be in one of those spots.
Anon
I was the same as you.
I wore mine on the figure where it was least likely to fall off. I worried a lot about it at first, but after weeks was more comfortable with it. Then I misplaced it once after taking it off to bake (!) and had a heart attack when I couldn’t find it. And then finally, someone hassled me on the subway about it and I realized how close I came to being mugged.
So now I only wear it for special occasions, on the tightest finger and keep it turned around if I am not in an exposed situation.
I live in a major city with a huge public transportation system. I have had family members have gold chains ripped off their necks on the subway/subway platform. It is what it is.
Jewelry
Get it appraised and insured.
Seeking NOVA friends
I’m 41, living in NOVA, and have no friends. I’ve signed up for various groups of like-minded peopke, but I’m looking for suggestions for community or service or volunteer groups that people have used to meet others. I find I do better with some activity or common goal
Carrots
Also in NOVA – what kind of activities are you interested in? I do a lot with community theatre, so if you’re interested in arts, there’s a bunch of ways to connect there!
Katie
I’m 39 in NOVA and also needing friends. Following with interest! If you post a burner I’d be very happy to meet for coffee!
Anon
Any chance you were in a sorority? I joined my sorority’s alumni chapter when I lived in DC and met quite a few people.
Anonymous
I’m not in NoVa anymore, but when I lived in Tysons in my late 30s, I made some friends through a continuing ed class. For me, it was creative writing, but any continuing ed class on a topic you’re interested in should bring together like-minded people. We ranged in age from 30-50 and met up regularly for writing brunches for several years after the class ended.
MoCo Mom
I’m a similar boat, but in MD. Anyone interested in a DMV meet up?
Anonymous
If you do this I may try to send my sister. She’s 44 and lives in MD (nearer to Baltimore than DC though). She’s fascinated by history, one of the most independent people I know and willing to try most things (ask her about her sci fi convention days). We were just commiserating that our social lives really took a hit in the last few years.
Anonymous
MoCo mom #2 here. I would be happy to meet up!
Anon
You could start at your local ethical humanist society. They are a good hub for a lot of community service or volunteer group stuff, and are generally a nice group of people. Every city may be different as to what they do, who goes but it is a start.
https://noves.org/
NOVA Friends
Following – maybe someone on this thread can post a burner email and we can all meet up?
Anon
Do you go to an office? I’ve always made friends at work.
Anon
+1 almost every new friend I’ve met after age 25 was through work
KP
Visit liberal Episcopal churches. Go to the main service and then to coffee hour after. Talk to people. The thing about a church is you get to know people of all ages, not just your age cohort. Don’t worry that you’re using them to get friends. That’s what they are there for (among other things).
Cb
Reporting back on my grown up sneaker quest.
I hated the vionics, they felt really bulky and I felt like I was wearing boxes.
I tried on a bunch of Skechers which were comfortable but they felt like grandma shoes
And a bunch of athletic brands, settling on new balance 520s.
I think I’d like to find something with a sole but a mesh/unstructured upper but these will do for now.
They make my size 8.5 feet look huge to my converse/barefoot runner eyes…but hopefully I’ll adapt.
Anonymous
Clarks have good mesh upper options and I promise your converse didn’t look as cute as you think
Anonymous
I promise that your feet look normal. Mine are size 11 ;).
Anne-on
I picked up a Nike “DBreak SE” sneaker their website since it was half off and I’m surprised by how great they are! They’re low profile, super supportive, and not too bulky. These are a pretty decent dupe for the Loewe flow sneaker I was drooling over:
https://www.nike.com/t/dbreak-premium-womens-shoes-61jl9b/DR5377-200
Anne-on
Ugh, stuck in mod but check out the Nike “DBreak” SE and Premium – the Premium ones in tan leather are really cute!
anon
If you are struggling making the switch to supportive shoes, I would not look at brands like Clarks or Sketchers which are not stylish and are favored by a slightly older crowd. Get a pair or Nikes, on clouds, new balance etc that are actually in fashion and you will feel much better. Go to fashion jackson’s blog. She wears sneakers all the time and looks good.
Cat
+1 to all these suggestions.
anon
I highly recommend New Balance for that combination of stylish and supportive. I just cannot with Skechers and Clarks.
Lots of people in the 30s and 40s crowd are wearing On Clouds, which also are attractive, imo.
anon
Posting with a link. I have something similar to these, and they have the mesh upper. Mine are light gray.
https://www.newbalance.com/pd/fresh-foam-cruzv1-reissue/WCRZRV1-28347.html?dwvar_WCRZRV1-28347_style=WCRZRRB
Anon
Yup. There are SO MANY fashionable and supportive sneakers. Of course the Sketchers weren’t cute, they’re sketchers.
Curious
Gotta say, I get compliments on my Skechers. #pnw?
Anon
There are lots of Skechers that look like any other fashion sneaker. They’re not just dad shoes!
anon
I was curious and went on the sketchers website and would not buy a single pair. They are not cute or fashionable. They may be super comfortable and great for your particular feet, in which it’s totally fine if you want to wear them. But trying to convince OP that those shoes are going to be attractive to a person who barely wants to even wear supportive footwear is not going to work.
Anon
I have been looking for the unicorn and keep coming back to Sketchers. It is what it is.
Anonymous
I’m a Converse fan who is also having problems finding shoes that look OK compared to converse. AllBirds and Kiziks are crazy comfortable. Another option is to buy Chucks a size up and put really good insoles in them, like Aetrex (which can be nearly $100 by themselves).
Anona
I like Mizunos, and I think a lot of their styles have a mesh upper, or at least a slimmer/ lower profile.
Anon
I also have big feet and hate the bulky/leather/heavy/white shoe look. Just doesn’t work for me.
I went to the Nike website, and filtered for what I wanted, including the color. I bought an option with a mesh upper, solid comfortable sole (I like support) and they are light as a feather… which is what I want in a sneaker.
New Balance is another good option for the support. Those are still Grandpa shoes to me, because they are literally what I used to take Grandpa to buy.
PolyD
Maybe Taos or Sofft? Not super fashionable, but not too dowdy, I don’t think. I admit, I don’t love the chunky white sneaker look, but I think it’s possible to look current in a sneaker or sneaker-adjacent shoe that isn’t big and white.
Anonymous
What are your fave no-show socks? Bonus points if you have big feet and can recommend them :).
Also, what color is better for mostly black sneaks? Black or white?
anon
With black sneakers, I wear black socks. Following with interest b/c I have yet to find no-show socks that actually stay on my feet. If they do stay on, they are so tight that they scrunch my toes. I’ve given up and just wear my shoes without socks.
Cat
I just wear the lowest ankle socks I can find. I like Zella’s. Actual no-show socks are a disaster. They slide off my heel in 10 seconds flat.
anon
Smartwool makes no-show socks! And they come in different sizes to accommodate those of us with big feet. I also like Ondo with my dress shoes.
PolyD
Co-sign SmartWool. They make the only no show socks I’ve found that don’t slide around. Of course, the lower the profile/smaller the sock, the more likely that it won’t stay in place.
I’ve gotten pretty good deals on the SmartWool ones on Amazon and at Nordstrom Rack.
Anon
Contra: SmartWool no show socks slide down into my shoes very quickly. I hate this and they are pricey to have the same issue that cheapie socks present.
Anon
Lululemon, they’re the only ones that stay up.
DeepSouth
Ondo! they are great and really do stay on.
Anon
Lululemon were my favourite until I discovered Gap’s athletic no-show socks. They’re much cheaper and stay up.
Anony4
The thin no show bombas are really comfortable, but if I’m wearing my vejas I need something even more low profile and go for the Zella no shows. Both have rubberized backing and I haven’t had a problem with slippage.
Anon
I’ve had a terrible time falling asleep the last couple of weeks, I’m tired all day but can’t fall asleep at night. I’m doing all the good sleep hygiene things (exercise, sunlight, limiting screens, etc.), but they’re not helping enough. Is there anything OTC I can take just for one night to try to kick myself back into the right sleep cycle? I don’t have this problem often, thankfully, so I don’t know what the best option is for this. Obviously will talk to a doctor if this continues.
anon
I take CBD gummies regularly, which help me stay asleep, but I find THC gummies really knock me out. I just take about a half or less of one and I am out. I get mine from CBD MD.
Anonymous
Unisom
Curious
+1
Anon
Sure, there are OTC sleeping pills or melatonin. Gravol knocks me out too.
Anon
Melatonin helps me a lot. Start small, 1 mg or less. You can increase the doseage if you’re not getting enough effect but 1 mg works for me and I’m big for a woman.
Anon
+1
JD
Also I can’t take melatonin multiple nights in a row. It doesn’t seem to work the second night, so I’ve only taken it every other night when I’m having a bad streak.
Anon
Have you tried melatonin yet?
phillyanon
I have had success with unisom for exactly that. I’ll take it for a few nights to break a poor sleep cycle.
Anon
Another rec for melatonin. Buy the kid’s gummies (1 mg per gummy), because the adult versions often have too much. Take a second gummy if you need it.
anon
+1 to this. You need 3 mg of melatonin MAX.
Anonymous
Yes! People think more is better, but because melatonin is a hormone, I guess, there’s some paradoxical effect at high doses. 1mg is where you want to start and be.
Rainbow Hair
On the other hand, on the advice of my doc, I take a bunch – like two 5mg tablets, not like, an absurd amount. I had read all the stuff about paradoxical effects and was taking just a tiny bit and it didn’t do anything, but if i’m having trouble settling to sleep, the two tabs work great. Bodies are bizarre things.
Anon
For some people. But others need a high dose. It just depends. But anyone taking it for the first time should start small and work up.
Curious
How funny, Rainbow Hair! When I was on chemo, 3 mg literally made me high, like my body was melting. I can’t imagine 10mg! I did sleep, though.
anon
Melatonin may help you get back on track. The time change really messed with my sleep schedule, and after a week on melatonin, things are fine again.
go for it
Sleepy time extra tea or the tincture of it’s most effective ingredient, valerian.
test the valerian as a 1/2 dose- it does taste a bit like tree bark!
Anonymous
Naturally Calm magnesium powder I prefer the unflavored kind). I mix it into hot water and treat it like a tea. Don’t take too much, as it will potentially cause diarrhea. It doesn’t make me feel groggy on the morning like melatonin or unisom.
Anon
CBD, CBN or melatonin
waffles
I have been taking magnesium citrate supplements and had to move them to bedtime because they knock me out. Apparently some doctors suggest them as sleep aid.
In-House in Houston
I take 1/2 of this pill every night. I fall asleep within 30 minutes and don’t wake up with any kind of hangover. I buy it at Costco and it’s less than $20 for 2×90 pills.
KIRKLAND SIGNATURE Sleep Aid Doxylamine Succinate 25 Mg X Tabs (53201812) No Flavor 96 Count
PolyD
I use those, too. I actually break them into approximate thirds, I find that doesn’t leave me groggy in the morning. But if I’m really tired and really have had trouble sleeping, I use about half.
I believe Amazon also has them, if you don’t have a Costco membership.
Curious
I think this is the same as Unisom, or at least belongs to the same class (first-gen antihistamines). I may be making this up, so worth checking.
Mpls
I guess the question is, why aren’t you falling asleep?
If its an issue with your brain not shutting off, then my go-tos are chamomile tea just before bed or an audio book or the audio of a TV show that I’ve watched before (on a sleep timer). Both do enough to interrupt the brain monologue to let my body shift into sleep mode.
anon
Are you feeling well? I’ve been having this issue for a week too and I finally realized (last night because it got bad enough) that I have a cold. No cough but mucus and stuffy nose and sinus headache. It’s been waking me up in the night and keeping me from getting good sleep.
anon a mouse
Melatonin – you may have to play with the dosage. 1mg does it for me but DH needs 5mg.
I find that an epsom salt bath before bed really helps too – love the scented Dr. Teals ones, and the magnesium in it really relaxes my muscles.
Have you tried a meditation app to listen to something as you drift off?
Anon
melatonin. You’ll take it (1-3 mg) and about 45 min later you’ll get sleepy. It’s important to therefore already be pretty relaxed when the urge to sleep hits, otherwise it’s fairly easy (at least for me who deals with the same tired then wired experience you identify) to just push through and then it fades. So take it, and read or listen to a light podcast in bed waiting for it to take effect.
towelie
weed if melatonin doesn’t do it
anon
This probably isn’t your issue . . . but I had serious trouble sleeping for the first time in my life when I started menopause. I’m on HRT now, which 100% solved that problem.
Anon
I don’t think melatonin is the answer. She’s already doing all the things that do what taking melatonin does for you.
Anon
That is just not true. Many people (especially elderly people, but it can be true of younger people too) don’t naturally produce enough melatonin. Low dose melatonin is generally the #1 thing recommended by doctors for people who have made lifestyle changes and are still struggling to fall asleep. It’s seen by many doctors safer than other sleep aids, including other over-the-counter products like Benadryl.
Anon
I used to have luck breaking a bad sleep cycle with unisom, or some Advil or Tylenol PM. A few weeks is a long time though. I went through about two months of being unable to sleep through the night and had to go see my doctor because it was inhibiting my mental health and ability to work; turns out that at 37 I had entered peri menopause, and so I am taking Trazodone to get consistent sleep. (My doc immediately diagnosed me as a busy lawyer mom with depression and anxiety, which annoyed me to no end, but thankfully was willing to order a blood test when i insisted i thought it was something else, and a simple blood test confirmed peri menopause, which commonly causes insomnia and is often misdiagnosed as anxiety / depression because it wreaks havoc on sleep and mood regulation.) All that to say – if you continue to find you cannot sleep without meds to help it may be worth a visit to your GP.
Anon
I posted a question about sleeping above, and this is a related but separate question. I’ve been struggling with a depression/anxiety flare up for the past two weeks but the physical symptoms have been worse and not typical for me. It’s like my body is freaking out and can’t fully calm itself down. I’ve done all the things I can think of to calm myself (exercise, meditation, nature, breathing exercises, a day off work) but they’re not doing enough. Has anyone been through this? What helped? Is this why people take xanax?
Anonymous
This was me in January. Honestly, going back on medication (just Lexapro). It’s also helping with sleep, but I got a script for Ambien for the first 10 days since I knew the Lexapro would take some time to kick in. Hugs to you, physical symptoms of anxiety and insomnia are so miserable (and weird)!
Anon
It can be very difficult with symptoms like this to tell whether they are primarily psychological (and the physical symptoms are secondary to anxiety) or primarily physical (and the psychiatric symptoms are secondary to something going wrong medically).
So for me, when I had iron anemia, iron helped. When I had orthostatic intolerance, compression garments helped. When I had magnesium deficiency, magnesium helped. When I had hyperthyroidism, a lower thyroid dose helped. And so on.
Curious
+1. When I had calcium deficiency, calcium helped. It was close to the worst depression of my life.
Anon
Cold water plunge and/or solo gardening. HIIT workouts can also do the trick for me when my nervous system is stuck in a loop of frenzy. Good luck, I know how awful this feels!
Anon
So it sounds like you have known anxiety and are being treated with by a doctor? This is when you call them. You have tried conservative measures and they have failed.
Are you on a medicine already? Sometimes this signals you need a change. If you aren’t on a medicine, you need to talk with your doctor about whether it is time to start. If you are resistant to a medicine change, you need to talk with the doctor who knows you well what your options are.
Xanax is a terrible drug to start taking when you are having daily symptoms of anxiety. Any doctor that gives you a prescription for Xanax without careful instructions how to take it for very rare/specific situations with close follow-up (within days or a few weeks) doesn’t know what they are doing. Unfortunately, it is sometimes given by primary care doctors who are sloppy, if there isn’t a psychiatrist involved. It is a drug that can bring down the anxiety response dramatically but it is very short acting, and highly addictive. So it works great for people who are having isolated episodes – fear of having an MRI scan or flying – to help you get through the event. Or in case of an emergency – like a panic attack. But if you are having symptoms daily, you need to have a strategy/treatment that you can do or take daily. Or else you become quickly addicted to Xanax. Withdrawl from Xanax and similar medicines can also give you seizures and worsening anxiety.
Anon
I take Xanax for presentations (really, even in my 30s I’m such a nervous presenter!) and presentations only. It absolutely works. But Xanax is like turning the volume off a TV program with no closed captioning. It’s not ideal for daily life if you can manage with other things. I have had good luck with valerian – 500-1000mg per day.
But I agree with the posters that physical manifestation symptoms of anxiety can have a medical cause. I’d start by taking magnesium, which we are all deficient in, vitamin B complex and vitamin D for two weeks and see if your symptoms improve. If not, checking your levels could help.
L
Anon
Just be aware, magnesium interacts with a lot of other vitamins (calcium, iron) and medications, and can interfere with their absorption. It can also cause diarrhea.
Cora
What is the oldest you would date? I’m 28 and get guys from age 23 – 40 matching with me on dating apps . . guess I’m in that middle age where both work.
Anon
For flings/casual dating I don’t think it really matters.
For serious relationships where you’re thinking you’ll be with this person forever, at most 10 years and I’d prefer 5 or less. As has been discussed here several times, age differences become a bigger deal near the end of your lives.
Anon
I’m also 28 and my parameters on Hinge are from 25-32 but I usually only swipe on people 26-31.
anon
If I were 28 again? Nobody over 35. At some point, the life experiences become too different if you’re looking for a relationship.
Anon
Ideally up to 32. Will make exceptions for up to 34. If they are 35 or above they better be a unicorn.
Anon
+1
Anon
Depends on what you’re looking for. If you want kids, focus on men who want kids, period. Ignore the ones who want kids “someday.” This matters in context of age because of the extreme ends: most 23 year old guys think they have at least a decade before they start thinking about kids. The older men have a radical split: the commitment phobes/serial monogamists who will happily date a young woman for a few years before dumping her, and then there are the men who want to be married yesterday.
Anon
Sorry, coffee hasn’t kicked in, so I should have added this: when I was 30, I went on one date with a man who was 45. He was a physician, so I wasn’t shocked that he had been too focused on med school and work to find someone. When he said he wanted kids “someday,” I all but bolted. Someday? SOMEDAY? So you’re going to chase women 2/3ds of your age, burn through her fertile years, and then deign to maybe have kids? No no no. That is not a game I play.
Anon
That was a very good decision.
anon
Ugh, that’s infuriating. What are you waiting for, dude?
Cornellian
Oh, yeah, the number of men who want them “someday” is wild. It’s one thing if you’re 22. I used to think that they were lying about wanting kids “someday” to sleep with women, but I think most of them are genuinely not aware of their aging process, ha.
No Face
My max was 15 years older than me, but I always liked older men. Married a guy 12 years older than me when I was in my 20s. We are still solid a decade later.
There are definitely differences as we age, but the benefits have far outweighed the risks. Ironically, I had a bad run of health problems for a few years so he had to take care of my physically more often even though I’m the younger one.
Anon
My personal range was very narrow- I was looking for a partner who I could live my life in step with. My husband is 1.5 years older than I am. I think I was +/- 5 years on the apps.
NYCer
I am 39 and married, but if I were you, I would stick to guys from age 27-33. Assuming you’re looking for a relationship – if not, it doesn’t really matter.
Nina
Yeah looking for a relationship, not necessarily for kids.
I was also trying to decide what was too young, thinking 26/27 is probably the youngest.
Anon
When I was younger I went same age to 10 years up, give or take. I ended up marrying exactly my age and have really enjoyed having a shared cultural experience (including that we both love the same music from our high school days and go see reunion concerts now, ie. The Cure) that connects us even though we didn’t meet until well into adulthood. As I aged though, my parameters got wider on both ends. I think age can be too limiting of a lens and an unnecessary dealbreaker.
Anonymous
44 and I set my range from 44-54. I went on a lot of first dates with men in their 50s before deciding they seemed too old for me. A lot of it had to do with kids, so might not be a consideration for all (mine are in elementary, theirs were HS/college so they were in a more flexible life stage). I found myself to be most compatible with the 44-48 year olds, but I wouldn’t not give someone older a chance.
Anon
I’m also 28, dating, and live downtown in a big city. My ideal timeline (obviously anything may happen, this is very flexible) would be married in 5 years or less, with kids to follow (ideally by 35?) and a suburban house to follow after kids (probably shooting for mid to late 30s).
I set my dating app age limits to 3 years in either direction.
I figure beyond that I don’t have all that much in common with the men (I truly could not imagine dating a 23 year old!) and also beyond that range were probably on different timeline. An older guy who actually wants marriage and kids likely wants it sooner than I do. A younger guy likely isn’t ready for that kind of commitment yet (I wasn’t at 24 either!)
My friends who are dating guys in their early-mid 30s are taking steps I don’t want to take yet (moving to the suburbs, buying houses, getting pets as a precursor to kids). None of my friends are dating younger guys, but I was talking with one for a little and realized we both wanted to “settle down” in our early 30s… except his early 30s was my mid to late 30s which complicates having children.
Anon
Serious question: if your ideal timeline involves being married in “five years or less,” and you want “kids” by 35, are you planning on a honeymoon baby and essentially back-to-back pregnancies?
Trust me, you’re far better off spending time as a married couple than having a long dating life, with pregnancy happening a hot second after the wedding. It’s bad for your marriage, and it’s bad for your career. (Getting pregnant shortly after your wedding sends professional and social signals that are often wildly inaccurate.)
Anon
I don’t think this is fair at all. 6 years after meeting my husband (when I was 30), we now have 2 kids, a rock solid marriage and 2 thriving careers. There’s not one perfect timeline and I respect if this wouldn’t work for you, but it works for us and it could work for OP.
Anon
I don’t agree with this at all. Most of my close friends got married in their early 30s and were pregnant pretty soon after their weddings (several had a baby before their first wedding anniversary), and no one thought it was weird. They all have 2-3 kids now, married for 10+ years and still happy.
Not that it really matters what others think, but I think age is a much bigger factor in how people will perceive a quick pregnancy. 32 year old woman getting pregnant on the honeymoon is seen as normal, 22 year old woman getting pregnant on the honeymoon would be seen as much more baffling (at least in my highly educated, career-motivated circles).
My husband and I were married for five years before having a baby (married at 27, baby at 32) and it was seen as *very* unusual among our friends, families and colleagues, to the point that dozens people from close friends to casual acquaintances assumed incorrectly we didn’t want kids or had fertility struggles.
Anon
“It’s bad for your marriage, and it’s bad for your career. (Getting pregnant shortly after your wedding sends professional and social signals that are often wildly inaccurate.)”
Absolutely love when people make blanket statements like this without even deigning to state it’s their completely unsupported opinion.
Anon at 12:23: ignore this person. I have known plenty of people who dated for a few years, then got married and were either pregnant at their wedding or got pregnant shortly thereafter. It’s so commonplace now. I imagine Anon at 1:26 may be one of our older posters who came of age in the 1980s workplace and believes those norms are still relevant to today’s world. They are probably still wearing those little bow-tie blouses to work. The way you described your timeline is what I have seen in my own friends and coworkers, over and over.
Anon
Now who is buying into a sterotype?
Anon
I got married at 38 and got pregnant 4 months later. People saw me as a baby factory. I got comments at work about when I was going to quit to stay home, when #2 was coming along (medical complications made that a poor idea), when is #2 coming along, no seriously when are you having another and quitting work?
It also meant that we had very little time to be a married couple before being in pregnancy hell and the thick of parenting. 0/10 do not recommend.
Anon
Unfortunately pregnancy discrimination at work is very real and can happen regardless of the timing or how long you’ve been married. I had a baby in my early 30s after being married for almost a decade, I still got mommy-tracked. And anyone who only has one kid gets asked endlessly about #2 at least until they’re 45+ and aging out of being able to conceive.
Anon
Uhhh, nearly everyone who has a child gets those questions. I was married 8 years when I had my son and that was all people asked me, over and over: when are you having number 2? Have you thought about having #2 yet? Surely you want to give your child a sibling, right? (We did not. One and done was fine for us). I also got lots of comments about “have you ever considered staying home?” The main problem is that I was in an organization with rampant overt sexism that was toxic for working moms. No matter when I had a baby, those questions were going to happen. No one should alter their life timeline because (GASP) other people might ask rude questions. People are going to ask rude, intrusive, clueless questions no matter what you do.
Anon
Anon 12:28 here. I’m 28 and I’d like 2-3 kids and every woman in my family has had high risk pregnancies or serious complications or trouble getting / staying pregnant.
I’m very, very single right now (but very active on the apps).
Im just being realistic about my timeline… I don’t want to rush into marriage just ti be married so by the time I find someone and am ready to get married, I’m likely not going to have a lot of time to wait on kids, especially since I want more than one.
Good for you if you had the luxury of time, but I don’t.
Anon
At 28, I wouldn’t date under 25 or over 38.
Anon
No younger. I would target men up to 12 years older. Realizing that the older you go, the never-partnered men are more likely to have some serious flaw, otherwise they’d be married by now, so you may want to look for divorcees who weren’t the problem.
Anon
Part vent part asking for advice.
So since having kids I have had really heavy periods to the point it significantly interferes with my life. After finally getting an appointment the doctor is like you have fibroids, let’s put you on birth control. My h is snipped, which she knows, so I’m pretty frustrated that her immediate suggestion was birth control or an IUD. I was on birth control for years pre kids and really have no desire to go back on it, especially since my understanding is that it may not help the symptoms and definitely isn’t going to fix the underlying issue. I really don’t want to be on birth control until menopause.
Any advice or suggestions?
Nylongirl
Yes! If you are done with having kids, I highly recommend a uterine ablation. Out-patient surgery, hardly any cramping, no noticeable periods now. Best thing I e ever done. Wish I did it 10 years earlier!
Anon
I understand your thoughts. I was also on birth control for many years for the same issue. I didn’t need to be on birth control either, so it was a little annoying. But for me, it actually was ok because I felt fine and it helped my adult acne.
As a contrast, my mother’s fibroids/bleeding were so bad that she decided to have a hysterectomy. That would be considered way too aggressive now.
There are other surgical interventions you can try that include ablation of the uterine wall. So ask your GYN about other options if you really do something more definitive.
Everyone’s different. For me, I was more wary of the surgical interventions and they weren’t even offered to me at that time. Now I am perimenopausal and off birth control (I did bleed a lot more though…..) but my perimenopausal symptoms are terrible and now I wish I was still on it!!
Anon
Same but I never went off BC and you may need to pry it out of my cold dead hands. I don’t love it but the alternative for me was periods without end and anemia is awful. I get why it is recommended — it is the least invasive thing if it works.
Anonymous
What magic solution do you want here? Your doctors advice is correct. Do you want a uterine ablation or a hysterectomy? Most doctors won’t suggest that without you trying cheap noninvasive birth control. If your periods suck, don’t have them.
Also anon
That sucks. Did you ask her if she had any non-BC options to recommend, or could you do that at another appointment? I totally understand why you wouldn’t want to use BC any more and need alternatives, so I hope your doc finds alternatives for you. I also see from the other side why it would be something a physician would recommend: I’ve used Mirena IUDs for 15 years and love that it has essentially ended my periods+ cramps with no other side effects. I think it’s also helping to ease my transition into menopause with the localized hormones. BUT: That “many women” find an IUD or other BC perfect for precisely these purposes does not at all mean they are the right thing for the specific patient in front of your doc!
anon
I hate how doctors throw birth control at every single problem. I would be asking whether you’re a good candidate for uterine ablation or fibroid removal. You will need an ultrasound to see how big the fibroids are (and they can increase in size surprisingly quickly). That’s really going to determine your options here.
Anonymous
It’s literally a problem with hormones and your uterus that hormonal birth control can solve what are you even talking about.
anon
From personal experience, BC did not help my issues, it only complicated them. Got a hysterectomy last year. No regrets.
Anon
Useful to know. BC is still the appropriate first thing to try/offer. Standard care for this problem.
No Face
I really dislike doctors that recommend BC for everything.
Fribroids are common in my family. I hear good things about ablation, but everyone eventually gets a hysterectomy.
anon
Just got mine a few months ago! It has changed my life for the better.
Anonymous
This is a condition it is appropriate to treat with birth control.
Anonymous
I don’t k ow if this medication is contra indicated with fibroids, but after finding no cancer or other obvious cause for heavy periods, etc my doctor put me on tranexamic acid pills for extremely heavy periods and it is seriously life changing. I take it about 2-4 days a month and went from going through a super plus tampon and pad every hour or two to a very manageable level and bonus, no more anemia. Could be worth asking about!
Anon
I was in the same boat and I shared your feelings, but doctors usually don’t just jump straight to surgical options. Try BC first and see if helps. For many, BC can solve the issue. I know Mirena works for a lot of peoe—I wish it had worked for me. Unfortunately, it did not and I am scheduling a hysterectomy. In the meantime, I tried several meds to slow/stop the insane bleeding and norethindrone helped the most. Good luck!
Anon
No ablation for you?
anon
If the fibroids are too large, you won’t be a candidate for ablation.
Anonymous
I had a myomectomy. It was outpatient and a recovery of a few days (although I was on birth control for a few months to make sure I didn’t get pregnant while healing). They were able to do it hysteroscopically in my case (or, in engineering terms, they used the existing access port). My situation was a little different from yours: the location of the fibroids I had were preventing me from getting pregnant which I wanted to do. At least one new fibroid grew in during pregnancy so I’m not sure if it’s a permanent fix. Worth looking into though!
Anon
BC is the least invasive option for treating fibroids. It is readily available, works for a significant percentage of people with troublesome symptoms, and can be taken long-term with minimal risks. It seems like best-practice for your doctor to suggest that as an option first, unless you have a contraindication. Did you tell your doctor that you don’t want to go on BC? If not, I suggest starting with that step.
There are other options but not all may be applicable for you. Some non-hormonal, medication-based options can only be taken for a short time due to cumulative side effects and any results are likely to be temporary. Depending on the size, location, quantity, and growth rate of your fibroids, ablation may not be able to access your fibroids, embolization may not be practical if you have a lot of little ones, and a myomectomy may not be permanent. Hysterectomy is major surgery so doctors typically recommend less invasive and risky treatments first.
If your doctor refuses to discuss whether these options may be relevant for your specific situation, definitely find another doctor. But if you just assume your doctor is aware of your feelings about BC and you haven’t actually articulated them, you need to start there.
Anon
I’m not the OP, but I’m so done being gaslit about BC by gynecologists.
OOO
After 38 years I am finally going to embrace my hair texture. I am getting a DevaCurl dry haircut in a couple weeks. Where can I get tips on styling and updos for 3B curls?
Perimenopause ultrasound?
Has anyone had a vaginal ultrasound as part of a routine menopausal transition? I’m 49 and having irregular periods, but no heavy bleeding, no hot flushes, no night sweats, no complaints and my gyn prescribed an FSH level and the ultrasound. I see literature suggesting FSH is of some value but nothing for the ultrasound. She didn’t explain its purpose other than to image everything and, fresh off a pelvic exam, I wasn’t in the mood to advocate for myself. Thanks!
Cat
I’ve had several of them, they’re useful for spotting fibroids etc. No big deal, just be prepared for the wand.
anon
Yup. It’s a simple process and will give you answers about fibroids and such pretty much immediately.
Anon
Yes I had one.
Just FYI – it cost me $3000. $3000. After insurance. I have a high deductible plan. I was really upset as the hospital told me before hand it would cost about $550. I had it done at the outpatient clinic adjacent to a major teaching hospital.
The exam took about 10 minutes. Not a word was said to me by the tech. Her portion of the bill was about $150. The doctor who read the scan got paid even less. About $100. The remaining thousands went to the hospital.
I had it for the exact same issue, after going to my new GYN and talking to me about perimenopause/menopause. She didn’t explain anything to me or ask me any helpful questions other than my 2 sentences about my symptoms. She handed me a pamphlet, and ordered the FSH and ultrasound. Both showed I was likely perimenopausal and no cancer
Honestly, it is a bit of an overkill for most woman, as part of the symptoms of perimenopause is irregular bleeding. You are at an appropriate age for perimenopause. And not everyone has hot flashes (and mine came mostly after I stopped bleeding).
But since uterine cancer doesn’t have a lot of symptoms outside of…. irregular bleeding… which pretty much every woman will have at least some time in their life (and almost guaranteed at perimenopause), yes…. a GYN being extremely thorough can ask you to have this test and your insurance will pay. You COULD do the FSH first, and see if it looks like you are at a level that is perimenopausal and then ask her to decide whether your bleeding issues are appropriate for this stage of perimenopause. And you could ask – should you wait to see if the bleeding continues before jumping to an ultrasound. Unfortunately, many of us can have irregular bleeding as part of perimenopause for months to years.
So if money is no object to you, yes do the ultrasound.
I’ll be curious if the women on this board who are perimenopausal are all getting transvag ultrasounds now?
Cat
FWIW I had mine done at a hospital and it was $350 under my HDHP. That was within $20 of what my insurance estimator widget said it would cost. $3K?!
Anon
Are a physician? Are you the OPs physician? If you are not, then you are in no position to tell her what is and what is not an appropriate workup. If you have not examined her, know her full medical history, her full family history, no have completed medical school no residency you really should not be offering medical advice. It is dangerous.
pugsnbourbon
It’s pretty unusual for ultrasounds to cost that much after insurance – could it have been coded incorrectly? I had one for ovarian cysts and the bill was like a grand – turns out they coded it as “infertility treatment” and that’s why the bill was so high.
OP – I’ve had a couple TV ultrasounds for cysts and to check the placement of an IUD after the strings fell off. I’d classify it as uncomfortable but not painful, and it didn’t take very long.
Anon
If you have a high deductible plan you normally pay all costs until you’ve met your deductible so you wouldn’t really be paying the “after insurance” price.
Signed, I have a $15k deductible (family plan but still) and it suuuuuuuucks.
pugsnbourbon
I’m probably remembering wrong – all I know is that when they changed the code, the price “magically” dropped. Insurance is a sh!t show.
Anonymous
The pricing/insurance system with healthcare in America is so infuriating. That is all.
Anon
For sure. I’m the person with the $15k deductible above.
Anon
It’s SO infuriating. I said this on the mom’s page the other day, but at our pediatrician if you raise any questions or concerns at the annual well checks it gets coded non-preventative and we have to pay $200 (vs $0 for the preventative well-check, thanks to Obama). What kind of health system is that where people can’t open their mouth around doctors lest they get hit with a big bill? Ugh.
Anon
I thought it was fibroids based on family history but I actually had a polyp. US got to the bottom of this quickly.
Ginger
+1 I was perimenopausal and had intermittent bleeding and spotting due to uterine polyps. My gyn watched them over a couple of years, did a few ultrasounds and couple of uterine biopses. Finally, she said let’s do a D&C. The bleeding stopped and what I thought were periods stopped as well. I wish I had the D&C done earlier.
Anonymous
It’s pretty common and a sign your doctor wants to be thorough. Not sure what advocating for yourself means here, but this is good practice.
OP
Thanks. She wouldn’t answer when I asked twice what the exam was for. The impression she gave was it was routine for perimenopause. She’s new-to-me. She also wants me to come in for annual pelvic exams (not general well woman exams), which is not the ACOG recommendations or based on my personal history.
Anon
Just chiming in here because I’m very curious about this difference. I’m a US citizen living in a Europe for a long time. Are typical gyn exams in the US still done manually? So a gyn simply uses their hands? It is standard care in my current country that all gyn exams are transv ultrasounds (and there is no cost, every room is equipped with them). Hands are never, ever used internally.
Anonymous
Gyn exams aren’t necessarily every year unless you have an irregular pap smear or HPV. Ultrasounds are not routine though. From what I can tell they most look through a speculum and use that to do a pap smear, and then feel around with 2 fingers internally and a hand on your abdomen.
Anon
Gyn exams should be yearly even if you don’t need a pap. They do other stuff like breast exams and palpitate your organs to check for cysts.
pugsnbourbon
In my experience the pelvic exam does include briefly feeling like a hand puppet.
Anon
Wow- no speculum? Sounds like the dream
Anon
Speculum only for a pap, which isn’t suggested every year here. A well-woman exam is suggested every year and includes the TVU (the ultrasound screen is turned to you during the exam and the gyn narrates everything they are seeing and checking), breast check, overall check-in. The TVU here is not large, hardly more width than a tampon, completely straight wand, so it does not feel uncomfortable.
Anon
Yes, all yearly or routine typical gyn exams are with your hands/tools. They are one of the few types of exams in the US that is supposed to be covered by your insurance and paid for 100%. Almost nothing in the US is covered 100% by insurance except for a small group of preventative medicine tests/exams.
Ultrasounds are done if there is concern – that is assigned a medical code. You usually have to come back at another time/visit and they are typically done by a technician – not a doctor – and a doctor looks at the images later and writes a report. They would not be done for a routine gyn exam. They can be several hundred dollars to thousands, if they are transvagina1. How much you pay depends on your insurance plan and varies wildly.
Anon
Yes in the US a manual (finger) exam is standard every year. Pap smears (done with a speculum) are less frequent; I only get them every 5 years but the exact frequency depends on your health history and HPV status (I’m negative and have never had an abnormal pap). I have never gotten a vaginal ultrasound except in early pregnancy to determine my due date. Personally I found the vag ultrasound extremely uncomfortable bordering on excruciating, way way worse than a manual exam or a Pap smear, but I know pregnancy makes you more sensitive down there.
Anon
My GYN did a pelvic ultrasound to check for fibroids and she also had the tech look for active egg follicles that would indicate if I was still ovulating – and they found some, along with a luteal cyst that indicated I had ovulated recently. I have a Mirena IUD, so no periods, so hard to tell what was going on because my hormonal symptoms had gotten so erratic. I was definitely still ovulating so needed to get an IUD replacement (which I had planned on anyway).
Fibroids become a major issue at our age, for a lot of women – they can grow fast and cause problems – so it’s a pretty good idea to do the ultrasound, just so you know what’s going on in there. I will also say I have known some women who were having symptoms they attributed to menopause, went for a pelvic ultrasound, and found out they had either hormone-producing cysts on their ovaries, a malignancy, or something else that they needed to deal with. It’s pretty low-stakes procedure that gives a lot of good information.
Anonymous
I would ask the informed consent questions:
-Why are you recommending this test?
-What are the risks and benefits of the test?
-What are the risks and benefits of not doing the test?
-What if we wait?
Anonymous
I’m 46. My gynecologist did one quickly in her office when I said I was having some irregular bleeding at my exam last year. She didn’t tell me what she was looking for but said everything looked normal so that it was probably just due to hormone levels. It was NBD at all for me but I can see why it would be annoying to make a second trip for it.
Towelie
If you’re asking about the procedure itself, the wand thing doesn’t go inside of you that much so it’s not nearly as uncomfortable as a pap. I’m getting them every other day right now for egg freezing.
Anon
Depends. For something like this I’d imagine they’d want a good view of your ovaries (at least the first time for a baseline) and if you have a tilted uterus, the wand has to really get up in there to get a good view and it can be damn uncomfortable. Ask me how I know. Egg freezing may be different because they’re not investigating a potential problem.
Anon
I am team “get all the information you can.” Usually the complaints are the opposite, that doctors are brushing off concerns. I’ve had a number of U/S for nebulous symptoms (turned out to be cysts) and also had an MRI when it was offered! Gynecological cancers are so insidious, I want everything checked out.
AI
Any thoughts on Microsoft’s recent announcement to put AI in its programs? It will be called Co-Pilot. I didn’t care for Clippy, either.
Anonymous
What I want to know is whether MS is spying on all my work to train its AI algorithm. My gut says yes.
anon
+1
Anon8
I really wish they called this clippy 2.0! I’ll believe it’s actually helpful when I see it. All the other “assistant” tools Microsoft has rolled out have never been helpful at all to me personally.
AI
This one seems more evil than Clippy because it is collecting your data as you type/work in your document.
anon
My analyst may have just observed a teams message I sent to my peer about his performance. He happened to be at her desk looking at something when I sent. He knows he’s in the hot seat, but he didn’t need to read what I sent.
FWIW – just learned for the first time there’s a toggle to make messages not actually show the text, so def switching that.
Tell me this is fine? Just act like nothing happened? Not anything to address with him? I’m a very professional person (please believe me, despite this blunder) but this is coming to a major head and I was venting something to my partner. Sigh.
Anon
I mean it’s unfortunate he might have saw but sending a message like that is not at all unprofessional. I think you’re overthinking.
OP
Thank you. We’re all just very stressed and it’s just one more thing. I wrote that “Big Boss incorrectly recalled his performance review was ‘good’. The hellit was.”
And he knows it wasn’t a good review. So it’s not tragic. Unfortunate is the right word.
Sigh. Thank you for talking me down.
Anon
Sending a message “venting” about someone is not unprofessional? I mean, I don’t think OP needs to continue beating herself up about it because what’s done is done, but it does sound kind of unprofessional to me.
pugsnbourbon
Eh, something like “I’m so frustrated with this brief Trad just sent over. This is the third time he’s sent work I’ve had to redo” is vastly different from something like “Trad’s so dumb, how on earth does he button his shirts in the morning.”
Anon
You really should not be sharing performance issues with peers unless there is a valid reason.
Anon
It is human. Let she who has not gossiped about another employee cast the first stone.
Anon
Agree, it is human and I didn’t say or imply otherwise. I’m pushing back on the commenter who said it’s not unprofessional. It is – humans are unprofessional sometimes.
Anon
If it makes you feel better, my former boss has done worse things (made a disparaging comment about a different department in a chat group which contained said department, rather than in a private teams chat to me). Way worse incidents have been caught over video chat (self gardening in a school board meeting for example). It’s ok. Learn from it and move on!
Anon
Is anyone else laddering CDs? I heard about this years ago but now that CD rates are like 5% for 18 months, considering doing this each month to park some cash in. Only debt is a mortgage right now.
Anon
I’m not right now and did it years ago and was happy with it. I did a 3 month ladder and just had to set reminders on my calendar to deal with it. If you are doing monthly, then it should be easy to remember every month when you pay bills.
Anon
Not laddering specifically (I don’t think? I’m not 100% sure what that is) but I just put $10k into an Ally 5% 18 month CD. We’ve decided to cut back a bit on funding retirement accounts and put more money in savings accounts and short term CDs. The main reason is that my husband has variable income and make take a significant pay cut in summer 2025, so we want to build up a good nest egg in the next two years, but the high interest rates for CDs and savings accounts right now certainly made that decision easier. I also have a Capital One performance savings account at I think 3.6% and a Capital One CD at 5%.
Cat
laddering is putting X in per month for CDs of the same duration, so then in a year a portion of your cash is freed up one month at a time. We use this for emergency fund money so that it’s not all tied up for a year as opposed to a chunk being accessible each month.
Yes, putting more in this year given the rate increase.
Anon
I am. Doing the Cap One 5% CDs, over 3 months. I’ll need some of the money next year, but will figure out what to do with the rest then.
Anon
No. We’re getting 4.75% for no penalty CDs at Ally and I’d much prefer to have instant access to my money than deal with laddering for a tiny amount more in interest. Moving is a possibility within the next year, so we have pretty significant cash savings right now.
Anonymous
Yes, I did it through my brokerage account, they have access to third party CDs, and an online ladder tool to make the process easier.
Anon
Not really laddering, we just moved some money that had been in a money-market account into a 13-month CD as we can get a 3.75% interest rate right now. If in 13 months we don’t see a need for the money (it’s being set aside for a potential bathroom remodel), we’ll roll the money into a new CD.
It angers me that regular savings account interest rates are still so low when base interest rates have gone up so much. CDs are giving much higher rates of return and I think we’ll continue to use them until banks do something about rates for regular savings accounts.
Anon
I gave $5k is a CD at 5% for 11 months. Can I leave it in longer? Do I have to open a new CD? This is my first time opening a CD.
Anon
You can’t leave it in longer, but there will either be an option to roll it over into a new one (at whatever the current interest rate is) or deposit it back into your checking or savings. You can usually pick whichever you prefer at the end of the term.
Anon
It will automatically mature at 11 month. You can either just take the cash, or there’s usually an option to roll it over into a new CD but it will be at whatever the current interest rate is at that time.
Anon
I see the 5% CDs as a sign we are probably coming out of the recession within the year. Laddering in the stock market instead.
Anonymous
Any tips on dealing with failure or rejection or just being bad at something? I traditionally struggle with feelings of ineptitude and worthlessness. It’s bad enough in a professional context, but it’s also a problem from me in things that should be fun. Currently I’m struggling because I am taking an online class in an area that’s a hobby for me (for fun-no grades) and the professor directed me (and only me) to rework my assignment. I’m embarrassed and feel stupid for even trying. In the past, while attempting to learn various sports I mostly ended up in tears just from pure anger at my own inability (embarrassingly even as an adult.) my parents and husband say I “put too much pressure on myself” but they’re also quick tease me about things I’m bad at. My therapist wasn’t helpful. Does anyone have a helpful mantra or mindset that could keep me going forward without the shame and frustration?
Rainbow Hair
For me, failing a lot in a lot of different ways over and over has been most effective. Like, the first 1934932 times failing was the worrrrst, and I still can’t handle it in things I Should Be Good At, but I’ve convinced myself that there are things that don’t fall into that category, so it’s OK if I fail at those. Like I would never beat myself up for not knowing sports trivia, because it’s not my thing and I’ve never tried to know it, so it falls squarely in that “ok if I am bad at it” box. But skills and creative things can go in there too!
It has been a good thing about being older, too, like, I took some circus classes with college students and I would like, fall off the lyra on the reg, but yeah, I’m 40, they’re 20, it’s OK that they’re better at it than me. I sew in my (very rare!) spare time on a machine crammed in the garage, it’s OK that my stuff isn’t as good as the folks who are professional sewing bloggers. That’s what I tell myself, a bit about why it’s OK – this is my first time, this is something outside of my skillset, I’ve prioritized getting good at other things, etc. And then I congratulate myself (a lot) for trying anyway.
(Sorry, that’s a lot of words for a mantra, but it is my approach anyway.)
Anon
+1 to getting practice failing!! I’m actually now at a point where I love to try new things that I know I’m not going to be immediately good at. Once you’re able to be okay with being bad at something (which took me a while!) seeing yourself improve at something is so satisfying.
Anon
It takes practice to suck productively at things. I’m not being flip when I say that, it really does.
If it’s a hobby or field with a large/deep body of knowledge, it doesn’t get easier, but you do get better/faster/more efficient.
Messing up is part of the learning process.
In classes there is a LOT of bluffing amongst your classmates. They aren’t as competent as you think.
Your parents and husband suck for needling your about something they KNOW you struggle with and are trying to work through. They’re not the ones putting themselves out there and getting out of their comfort zone, so they can STFU. They need to can it.
When you get frustrated, take a walk and come back later. I struggle with this. I want to stay dug in until I figure it out, but that’s not always the best, both for getting the thing done and for your own sanity.
anon
I had to work through this in therapy.
anon
If you’re not willing to try a different therapist, I suggest the what if questioning line (which is what my therapist did).
Okay, so what if you do fail at X? Then push yourself to eventually get to the answer of nothing terrible will happen if you fail at art class, or a sport, or whatever. Really. Nothing terrible will happen. Life will continue and you family is correct, no one cares about your failures as much as you do.
Anon
Failure is a part of life and a part of being good at something. The people who get good at something are willing to work through the suck.
I was an outstanding runner. Multiple injuries sidelined me for over a decade. It took a lot of courage an fortitude to get back out there and build up from scratch. My times were laughable compared to what I had done. Some people expressed that they thought I was lying when I told them my times from back in the day. Years later, I’m back at it and (at least amongst the middle aged runners in my small city), a force to be reckoned with. I’m thankful every single day for the grit of being willing to suck at it.
And tell your husband and family to knock it off. If it’s not funny to you, it’s not funny and needs to stop.
OOO
Every mistake is a learning opportunity. In order to get good at anything you will make many mistakes and have many failures along the way. Read any book by any successful person ever and it will be all about the million mistakes they made along their path to greatness.
Anon
Mistakes are how you learn. Why would you even bother taking a class if you didn’t want to get better at something? The only way to do that is to get things wrong and try again to do it better. If you only do things you’re good at, you’ll be a boring and limited person.
Anonymous
For me it’s helped to change my relationship to failure. I’m also an educator & tell students that failure is a teacher. We don’t analyze our successes like we do our failures. I also had a boss that told me if you are aren’t failing at least sometimes it’s because you are never taking any risks. Last year I had a very big, public and embarrassing failure. While it was uncomfortable at the time, it led me to make some changes in my professional life that I’m extremely happy about and I’m in a better place now. In fact, now I see that failure as a very good thing. What I focus on with others is not their failures but their ability to manage their failures with grace. It’s human to fail but it’s how you handle it that is the difference maker.
here she goes
not really a mantra, but I have a great song for this – “such a loser” by Garfunkel and Oates. it manages to hit the feeling of losing perfectly, while being encouraging.
here she goes
oh, it is explicit. Just a warning if that matters to you or your office!
Anon
I have bouts of these feelings periodically. They seem to come on at random occasionally, but also when sh*t hits the fan.
I just went through a period at work where a major flaw in our process what pointed out, and I spent two weeks flustered and scrambling to pull together reporting that showed despite the major flaw, there are no errors in the final product. I felt so stupid and embarrassed for my own part in this and felt terrible at my job, like I let down my coworkers and our team.
I also have a hobby that I enjoy, but it can bring these feelings on when my skill at the hobby falls short of my expectations. Why am I bothering? How could I ever think I’m good at this? I can’t even do this one thing well? I must be an idiot, I’m selfish for spending money on this hobby etc etc
I think this is where I’m seeing the benefits of meditation and mindfulness come in. I have these thoughts and feelings, and I truly feel like I’m a failure. But now a (tiny) part of my brain is able to say in the moment ,’Hey, this is a feeling we’re feeling right now, and it’s okay to feel it.’ It doesn’t make the feeling of failure or embarrassment disappear, but helps remind me that feelings arn’t necessarily reality.
If it’s making you feel bad, put it down and walk a way for a while. Feel the feelings for a while. And then tell yourself ‘Okay, that was a mess. It didn’t go the way I wanted to, but I want to try again.’ (Like when a kid learns to ride a bike, you fall or wobble but mom or dad pulls you back up and makes you try again. Be mom or dad to yourself.) And then before you go back to whatever it is, work, hobby, a sport, decide what’s the thing you want to do differently this time. If you don’t think you can do the whole thing perfectly, what’s the part you want to have come out better this time? What steps or order are you going to tackle it in to get to that result? Have a plan or an idea of how you want to proceed. Have a snack and some water and a nap, And then you go back to it and try again.
Anon
Can anyone speak to normal/typical requirements for parents to spend money on science project supplies at home for a 5th grader? I don’t have kids of my own, and so I don’t know what’s expected.
I’m the woman helping out a refugee family. In this semester, their 5th grader has come home once a month (Jan, Feb, Mar) with a project that’s required the parents to go out and purchase about $12 in supplies for each project – poster board, construction paper, paints, markers, etc, etc. (Of course each project has needed different items.) The kids attend a Title 1 school that is populated by refugees, immigrants, and working class (78% eligible for free and reduced lunch). Yesterday, the 5th grader came home and said he needed a color printer to print out pictures of sea life for his ocean life project – the family doesn’t have a computer or printer at home. (The teacher only sent home the grading rubric, no directions, so I don’t know what she said vs. what the boy heard or invented for himself.)
Since he’s a kid, he doesn’t think anything of asking for supplies, but $12 per month when you don’t have two nickels to rub together is hard. It’s interesting to me because they have 3 other children in school and none of them have come home with any such projects. The parents of course would be embarrassed to say anything to the teacher, but I don’t have any qualms about reaching out, especially since the older and younger kids haven’t had any such assignments – maybe it’s just this one teacher? Thoughts? I’m not just worried about this family, but all the other struggling families that are being tasked with buying supplies every month.
(The school knows me, so this wouldn’t be me overstepping. I’m the family’s emergency contact, I met all of the administrators when we registered the kids, I’ve met some of the teachers in passing, I’ve chatted with the parent liaison several times about things when there’s been a language or cultural barrier, and I get the kids off the bus on days when the mom is in English class. So it’d be ok for me to gently inquire about this, and I would definitely lead with whether the boy is misunderstanding the task.)
Anon
SNAFU is the norm in my kids’ schools. My whole city is urban and poor, so it’s novel that I’m not. The asks are often crazy and communicated with no notice or consideration whether the family has money, the family has a car, the family has time to run to Target with no notice and dinner’s not in the oven when the kid gets off the bus, baby isn’t napping/nursing. Is is a bit crazy. But I’m in year 9 of it with 2 kids who have been to 5 total schools.
No one cares. For a 5th grader, you or a parent could (I feel) confidently send in a note: “Joao came home with a note requesting A and B; I had him look through the supplies we have on hand and he had to make do with C and D, which was the best we can do. If this is a problem or there is a better way to keep on top of his needs for class, please let me know and we will try to accommodate this.” It is nonsense. But better to be nice and polite and firmly note that you are TRYING here.
Anonymous
This is completely normal. And he doesn’t need to own a color printer just get access to one.
Anonymous
I have a 4th grader in a very wealthy, largely white, Boston suburb. There is an optional science fair this spring and that is the only time she’s had to do anything in terms of posters etc. When registering for the science fair, there was a note about who to contact if you need assistance with supplies.
I think any project that uses basic coloring tools (crayons OR markers OR colored penciles), tape/glue, or paper is fair game as these are, IMO, household staples for homes with children. But mandating, say, a tri-fold display or that things are done in a certain color cardstock or whatever seems beyond. At our science fair, a lot of kids do the tri-folds but I am both lazy (didn’t want to drive around looking for one) and cheap so my kids did their project (which was on recycling) on a cardboard box.
In terms of how to approach the school, could you come to the table with a solution, such as either materials that work for the population, a fund to help pay for them, or perhaps fund raise for a closet that contains materials for those that need them?
ARGHHGHGH
Parent w three kids in public schools and yes, this is common, and yes, some teachers are more guilty than others. The area I’m in has pretty high income, but it is terrible that teachers just assume EVERY kid in the class can purchase “only” $10-15 in supplies for various projects. This peaked in 3-5th grade for us, with just a few guilty middle school teachers. Has not happened (to us) at the high school level. (Projects moved online)I totally support your idea to reach out to the school and let them know that some teachers are asking this of families, and not all families can supply the things. PTAs can raise money for this, teachers can tell students supplies are available at the office, etc etc. Our PTA regularly asks parents to donate an extra set of XYZ to the school to make discreet assistance available, and those of us with the higher incomes are more than happy to buy some extra stuff.
FYSA – our area has public libraries with color printers. Sadly, each page is about 10 cents to print out. The school should have color printers available for students too, either in the library or office, upon request. SHOULD. Another thing you can ask the principal to do.
Anonymous
My 5th grader doesn’t have elaborate projects he has to do at home – his homework in general is minimal. Title 1 school in NYC. But I think our school is generally on the low homework spectrum and it varies a lot school to school. Does the school have a parent coordinator or someone with a similar job? They might be able to advise on whether there are resources available to cover these kinds of expenses.
anon
This was totally normal in the solidly upper middle class school I went to.
In my kids’ Title I school, we have yet to experience this. During lockdown, materials were provided to take home.
At my kids’ school, I would say, definitely ask–I’d be shocked if there wasn’t help available–probably in the form of picking up the needed supplies right from school and using a school printers. However, despite being Title I, there are many well-off families who give generously to funds so that all kids can go on field trips, get a yearbook, etc. I don’t know if communities with less money have this kind of support available.
Cat
This type of thing was so typical in my and my siblings’ childhood that my mom started buying posterboard by the 10-pack to avoid having to do an errand midweek to go get it.
Anon
Yup. Not only was it frequent but it was always night before last minute. This was in a wealthy suburban district though.
Anon
so this is the norm in many schools, but seems tone deaf to me for this school given its population.
Anonymous
When you talk to the teacher, I would not lead with whether the boy is misunderstanding the task. Go by what’s on the written assignment or rubric. Don’t imply that the kid is to blame.
These assignments are extremely common in elementary school. Instead of writing a book report, make a t-shirt about the book. Put together a box full of items that represent concepts related to the history lesson. Etc. It is super annoying and a waste of time and money.
Anon
Can you survey your friends for magazines that the kids can cut up? That’s what we did for “sea life” or pictures for whatever we had to report on. My mom kept a bin of old magazines for cutting up.
Anon
I swear, if I could have had a second kid with the certainty of more science projects, my son would not be an only child. They are the worst part of school for all the reasons.
Anon
Hoping to be talked down/hear from anyone who’s had a similar experience. My husband and I are planning to start TTC…so I made an appointment to have my IUD removed. I was nervous because I haven’t been able to feel my strings since September, but figured my gyno would have better luck. Well, she didn’t. After 15 minutes of poking around up there with various tools, I had to schedule a follow-up appointment next month with an ultrasound tech.
I am SO nervous. I had a really painful insertion and ended up fainting in the lobby when I originally got my IUD. My gyno said she can give a numbing injection in my cervix for this next appt, although the shot does hurt… but if she’s going to be “digging around in my cervix” it was probably worth it. Has this happened to anyone else? I’m also scared/nervous that this is supposed to be the “easy” part of TTC and I’m already running into complications and delays… SOS
Anon
Yeah, I’ve an IUD expel and then got another one, which embedded in my uterine wall. They were able to remove the second one in-office under u/s guidance, but it hurt a lot. Definitely get the cervical numbing shot, and take the day off in case you’re in rough shape after.
Anonymous
So my IUD came out without me even feeling it, and the transvaginal ultrasound that verified this was completely painless. The wand is like a really boring d*ldo. Is the doctor pretty sure it still in there, or do they think it may have come out? The latter is very rare but not unheard of. Do you use a menstrual cup? That can catch the strings and pull it out.
Removal of my other IUD, which came out when the doctor pulled the strings, was painless as far as I remember – nothing like insertion at all!
Curious
Congratulations on getting ready to TTC! We might end up on the same timeline :)
This happened to my friend. She was mad at her doctor, who had ignored her when she said the insertion didn’t go right, but on the whole it ended up okay. No perforation and she went on to have a baby who is 2.5 now.
Your doctor may be planning to give you lidocaine in your cervix. Lidocaine can sting a little going in, but it’s wonderfully effective at numbing.
Are you menstruating regularly? Your cervix is likely to be most soft and open at your most fertile time, which would be about 10-14 days before your expected period. It may be worth trying to schedule for that time.
Anon
Hey there! This happened to me when I had to get my first IUD removed – they couldn’t grab the strings and I had to get it removed via implements.
They gave me both misoprostol (which softens your cervix) and Xanax to take before the appointment, so I would be relaxed. This was when I figured out that Xanax does not change much for me other than I care about absolutely nothing whatsoever that’s going on around me. Like, if I was on a plane and the plane was crashing but I was on Xanax? I would be like “cool, man, that’s neat” and just keep vibin’.
When they took me back for the removal, they used an abdominal ultrasound machine to locate the IUD in my uterus and then they used some kinda-scary looking instruments to grab it and pull it out. I really did not feel any pain because my cervix was dilated; it was just kind of uncomfortable. It took a couple of minutes for them to get a firm enough hold on the IUD and get it out, but again – thanks to the Xanax, I honestly could not have given less of a sh!t about what was going on. They got the IUD out and sent me on my merry way.
So, moral of the story, ask for some misoprostol and some kind of sedative before the procedure. I hope it goes smoothly for you. In the end, all will be well. Good luck!
anon
I’m late to commenting but…
Ask for some pain medication to take after the procedure. Sure, the lidocaine will help during the process but not once it wears off. When I had mine inserted, I was in terrible pain the rest of the day.
I second the xanax or something else similar. I didn’t use mine (I always have it for as-needed use) and really wish I had. I was a mess. Prepare yourself for after with hot water bottles/heating pad/heating patches and take the day off.
My insertion was the most excruciating pain I’ve ever experienced (never been pregnant) and I have a reasonably high pain threshold.
MoH dress
I’m looking for a maid of honor dress and have had no luck with Macy’s, Nordstroms, Dillards, Saks, Anthropologie. I’m looking for something classic yet different than the gauzy Azzie style. Any online recs for stores? I will also be in NYC this weekend. budget around $500. thanks!
pugsnbourbon
What’s the length and color you’re looking for? Any silhouettes you want to avoid?
pugsnbourbon
Have you checked Bloomingdales? It looks like they have a lot of long dresses in the $200-$500 range.
I assume you like the bride, but on the off chance you want to steal the show, you should get this one: https://www.bloomingdales.com/shop/product/bronx-banco-florence-one-shoulder-gown?ID=4546112&CategoryID=1005210
OP
Looking for floor length, pink or red ideally, and with some sort of sleeve. The sleeve preference can lead to more mother of the bride or modest styling than I prefer
Anon
There’s actually a lot of evening dresses with sleeves right now, I think it’s The Look at the moment. So I think you’ll be able to find something that’s not too MOB-y! I’ve just gone through a hunt for pink evening dresses and I would check Saks, Neiman Marcus, and Revolve.
here she goes
I’m assuming one shoulder is out? There’s a sleeve on one side! :) LOL Just asking since Nordstroms has a bunch of really pretty one shoulder red floor length dresses
here she goes
I know you said you checked Nordstrom but it seems like there are legit options there? It would be helpful to know what isn’t right about some of these, to figure out what other criteria we’re looking for.
Okay I’m posting ones that I wouldn’t describe as “modest” –
Red, deep plunge – https://www.nordstrom.com/s/mac-duggal-v-neck-keyhole-long-sleeve-jersey-gown/6483304?origin=category-personalizedsort&breadcrumb=Home%2FWomen%2FClothing%2FDresses&fashioncolor=Pink&color=600
Probably not this, but…. https://www.nordstrom.com/s/ruched-cutout-sheer-long-sleeve-gown/7204868?origin=coordinating-7204868-0-1-PDP_1-recbot-also_viewed_graph&recs_placement=PDP_1&recs_strategy=also_viewed_graph&recs_source=recbot&recs_page_type=product&recs_seed=6815109&color=BERRY
Red, high slit – https://www.nordstrom.com/s/ruched-jersey-long-sleeve-column-gown/6632253?origin=category-personalizedsort&breadcrumb=Home%2FWomen%2FClothing%2FDresses&fashioncolor=Pink&color=600
pugsnbourbon
Okay I’m on my lunch break and found a few at Saks:
Epitome of classic: https://www.saksfifthavenue.com/product/kay-unger-margerite-pleated-column-gown-0400018448666.html?dwvar_0400018448666_color=PINK%20MAUVE
Has sleeves but def NOT mother of the bride: https://www.saksfifthavenue.com/product/theia-sienna-off-the-shoulder-gown-0400014853945.html?dwvar_0400014853945_color=POMEGRANATE
Is it pink? is it red? It’s raspberry! https://www.saksfifthavenue.com/product/mac-duggal-v-neck-flutter-sleeve-satin-gown-0400017770353.html?dwvar_0400017770353_color=RASPBERRY
The color on this is just phenomenal: saksfifthavenue.com/product/teri-jon-by-rickie-freeman-scuba-long-sleeve-gown-0400016505484.html?dwvar_0400016505484_color=HOT%20PINK
anonypotamus
what about something like this? https://www.nordstrom.com/s/long-sleeve-empire-waist-chiffon-gown/6790536?origin=category-personalizedsort&breadcrumb=Home%2FWomen%2FClothing%2FDresses%2FFormal&fashioncolor=Red&color=613
or
https://www.nordstrom.com/s/pleated-long-sleeve-satin-a-line-gown/6413864?origin=category-personalizedsort&breadcrumb=Home%2FWomen%2FClothing%2FDresses%2FFormal&fashioncolor=Pink&color=661