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Thursday’s Workwear Report: Pull-On Relaxed Taper High-Rise Pant

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A woman wearing a denim button-front shirt, white top, and brown high waist trousers

Our daily workwear reports suggest one piece of work-appropriate attire in a range of prices.

I don’t think this pair made the cut for our roundup of the best pull-on pants for the office, but I think they’d be a worthy addition. They’re machine washable, wrinkle resistant, and come in a whole bunch of great colors.

I would pair this mushroomy-brown color with a black turtleneck for as long as it’s still chilly out and swap over to some brighter colors when spring finally arrives.

The pants are on sale for $42 (marked down from $79) at Torrid and come in sizes equivalent to 10–30.

Athleta has an option in a wider range of sizes (0–26) for $46.97–$109.

Sales of note for 3/26/25:

  • Nordstrom – 15% off beauty (ends 3/30) + Nordy Club members earn 3X the points!
  • Ann Taylor – Extra 50% off sale + additional 20% off + 30% off your purchase
  • Banana Republic Factory – Friends & Family Event: 50% off purchase + extra 20% off
  • Eloquii – 50% off select styles + extra 50% off all sale
  • J.Crew – 30% off tops, tees, dresses, accessories, sale styles + warm-weather styles
  • J.Crew Factory – Shorts under $30 + extra 60% off clearance + up to 60% off everything
  • M.M.LaFleur – 25% off travel favorites + use code CORPORETTE15 for 15% off
  • Spanx – Lots of workwear on sale, some up to 70% off
  • Talbots – $64.50 spring cardigans + BOGO 50% off everything else

303 Comments

  1. I have long suspected that I may have ASD, ADHD or something else. I am very awkward in nearly every social situation, though I do like being around people. It takes a long time for me to pick up on certain social norms. How can I find out if I have one of these? And if I do, is there anything that can be done about it? I know there are meds for ADHD but not sure about ASD.

    1. A psychologist or psychiatrist can diagnose either (or both, as my daughter has). There are strategies you can learn to manage (not cure or heal) both ADHD and Autism. Find a therapist that has experience or specializes on adults with the conditions to help you explore those strategies and learn what works for you.

    2. My son is autistic so I’m in a lot of groups with autistic adults — self-diagnosis is considered valid there, and people seem to like this quiz: https://rdos.net/eng/Aspie-quiz.php

      What can be done about it – medication can manage anxiety symptoms and ADHD symptoms, both of which are very comorbid. Once you’re in the community you may realize a lot of things that have annoyed you are not things NTs care about, and in the ASD world people have various tricks and tips (for example, if showers are hard, turn off the lights) and it’s normalized to need ear defenders for daily things, tagless clothes, same foods, etc.

      Highly recommend the FB groups Autistic Allies and Autism Inclusivity; Twitter account @1Schoolhouse has a lot of interesting threads where she collects tips.

      1. Thank you for this. That quiz is great.

        I have a sibling that we have always suspected was high functioning ASD, and never discussed it with him. His relationships and marriage (which is cross cultural) have suffered some because of confusion about his tendencies. Honestly, I never felt it was my place to discuss it with him.

        He’s middle aged. Successful at work/managing logistics of life. Less successful in social/personal life.

        Part of me wishes I could talk to him about it, and send him this quiz, but I don’t want to offend him. I do wonder if he realizes/understands how people are sometimes hurt by him, and also worry about what he is really thinking and if he is hurt by how people have treated him.

    3. You’d typically have to see a neuropsychologist for an assessment. A complete assessment checks for ASD, ADHD, as well as more obscure LDs that can show up (for example, NVLD can cause awkwardness in social situations too).

      There are some pros and cons to consider when deciding whether you even want a formal diagnosis.

      As for what to do about it, some speech therapists offer speech pragmatics (basically just explicitly teaching the social norms).

      There are no meds for ASD, but some people have medical comorbidities that benefit from treatment. Some of this stuff can be controversial because ASD patients aren’t exactly medicine’s top priority (“soon we’ll have a prenatal test and there won’t be any ASD patients anyway!” is the explicit view of too many people in medicine), and because alternative providers swoop in whenever medicine neglects a patient cohort, but some people take things like NAC or methylcobalamin if they have certain issues and there is research behind that.

      1. Wait, what?! Are there actually people in the medical field who believe we should be testing for ASD and aborting fetuses that test for it? (I’m strongly pro-choice, this isn’t an anti-abortion screed.)

        1. I think there are certainly researchers who are working to develop tests so that parents can make that choice, as they do for Down’s Syndrome now.

          1. since we don’t have the foggiest understanding of what causes autism (despite a ton on research), much less how it would be detectable in a fetus, I think this is highly unlikely. And, if it were, it would probably only be for severe autism, which I think is often forgotten about in modern discussions. Like my friend’s 10 year old who is nonverbal, screams for hours a day, and is that way despite 2 parents and 4 grandparents throwing every resource possible towards improving things.

        2. I’ve had two people in medical careers say that to me, so there are at least some! It’s a controversial topic because some of the money donated to ASD research is also spent on this rather than on anything that might help people living with ASD.

        3. I have absolutely no problem saying that if I could take a test that would identify severe autism in a fetus, I would do it and I would use that information to inform a termination. It’s not all quirky geniuses out there. Some kids are profoundly impaired and unable to live anything resembling a normal life. Some are violent against their parents and siblings.

          1. This. Whatever the genetic component that is part of this clearly runs in my family and while myself and many of my cousins have adapted to living with mild to moderate ADHD or ASD, my cousin with severe ASD is non verbal, incontinent and violent with caregivers. His parents have spent their entire lives and life savings trying to keep him safe and happy. It is an unending soul destroying journey to watch your child suffer in pain that doesn’t seem to have an answer.

          2. I have a cousin with severe autism. He would have been called “retarded” in another era. He’s not a quirky genius who can’t look you in the eye. He’s completely unable to live independently.

            He can only do manual labor jobs, like sweeping mopping, nothing more complex such as fixing things or mechanics. He can’t be on his own because he will be taken advantage of by anyone with even the slightest ill will grifters, freeloaders, you name it.

            It has been very very hard for his parents, who are now elderly, and his older siblings, who are now expected to care for him. He will never be an independent adult.

          3. Yes…. be careful in this thread.

            There are some awful profoundly impaired genetic disorders that include autistic like behaviors in the midst of other terrible impairments. Rarely, these are due to a mutation in one gene that can be tested. Those disease are often under intense study as some of them are more common than we realize, are devastating to the person and family. And the hope is that by studying one of the very few that has a clear “simple” genetic cause, we will learn a lot of the biology of what causes autistic like traits. And single gene mutations are the type of genetic disorders that we are starting to learn how to treat by actually correcting the genetic disorder. But it is extremely difficult, crazy expensive, so it is unclear how the future of this treatment will evolve.

            Look up Rhett’s syndrome.

            There is no genetic “test” for autism. Autism is not one “disease” or disorder. It is a generalized descriptive term for an array of behaviors / tendencies that varies dramatically from individual to individual and is likely due to a combination of genes (many genes) and environmental influences in development. There are many contributors, many genes, many treatments/interventions. We will never have a genetic test for “autism” for pre-natal screening.

            Might we one day have a test for Rhett’s syndrome that couples doing IVF might use for pre-screening embryos before choosing which one to implant? Maybe…. especially if the male sperm donor is “geriatric” (that seems to be a risk factor for Rhett’s syndrome).

            Please don’t spread misinformation on this site.

          4. OR here, and I get it. I guess I was thinking of the quirky geniuses. Sorry if I caused offense to you or your other responder.

          5. I think so many people do forget that ASD isn’t just the romanticized “quirky Sheldon” and tiktoks and hashtags ‘neurodivergence’ that is all over social media…

        4. I mean, the stated mission of Autism Speaks was to “cure autism” until very recently (last 10 years)? All of the research $$ has been going to genetic research, which amounts to eugenics.

          1. Not at all.

            To understand what causes a disease, you ultimately have to identify the molecules that are disrupted in people who have the disease. One major way you find them is looking for people/families who have the disease, and look for what genes are mutated in the person/family that seem to correlate with having the disease. Then you start to understand what the molecular pathways are that underlie what causes the disease. And then you can select targets for treatment….. By either targeting the mutated molecule or other molecules in the pathway.

            You can’t work on treatments until you understand the problem/molecules/genes you are trying to treat.

          2. Or genetic therapies or research into epigenetics (ways we can change gene expression). “Eugenics” is thrown around constantly but that’s very reductive.

        5. I will shock you sober.

          During Covid we moved to Europe. That great little Scandinavian country called Denmark that has the best marketing in the world.

          They started a conversation with me about sterilizing my autistic daughter. She is brilliant but has PTSD as a result of insufficient support at school in the U.S. I pushed back and the doctor told me they have the right to force sterilization if they believe it’s in the best interests of the child.

          I’m all for using hormones like the pill to reduce or stop periods for a profoundly disabled female who isn’t able to toilet themselves, but sterilization?!? I was speechless at both the suggestion and the push back. When I spoke to a couple of Danes in the family they said the doctors know what they are doing and said I should follow their recommendations.

          I was firmly in the twilight zone. Blew my mind. My personal belief is that this is akin to aborting.

          https://www.edf-feph.org/why-is-forced-sterilisation-still-legal-in-the-eu/

          2. I’m not surprised or shocked by this. I know a few people who believe that forced and coerced sterilization is a good thing…

    4. There are online quizzes you can take to gauge where you trend on the autism spectrum, but realize they’re not a formal diagnosis until you see a doctor. I’m borderline, where I have some sensory issues but nothing dramatic. And like you I miss out on social cues and norms. To mitigate, I’ve given some deliberate thoughts on certain social situations and memorize a few stock expressions as to be appropriate in said situations: e.g. “I’m pregnant!” Oh how wonderful, congratulations (put on a happy face). “My dog passed away last night.” I’m so sorry to hear that (put on sad face). Yes, it sounds like a robot trying to emulate being human, but with enough practice it’ll come more naturally. I still have a hard time sometimes knowing when people are joking as I tend to take words at face value but it hasn’t caused much grief.

    6. My kid has ASD and I suspect I probably do as well. If you want an actual diagnosis, then you will have to see a specialist. There are no meds for ASD, treatment is learning coping strategies for the things that are difficult. There are hundreds (thousands?) of books on the subject, you could probably find some at your library. Tony Attwood is good, Temple Grandin is another. You’ll come across proponents of ‘cures’ and horrific ‘treatments’ so beware of that.
      If you don’t want an actual diagnosis, just read as much as you can and go forward from there…

    7. Tiktok – seriously — very cool community of folks explaining and affirming their needs.

    8. A neuropsychological assessment will determine if there is any neurodivergence. It’s not cheap and I highly recommend using a provider in network.

      ASd in girls looks very different to the male profile and social communication anxiety/disorder is very common. It’s also very common with ADD. There is a lot you can do therapy wise to help ASD. For social communication issues, my daughter has done very well with organized activities where the plan is shared ahead of time, which helps lower her anxiety a little bit. She has a coping mechanism where doesn’t talk much at all for the first 3-4 sessions. She purposely lets people come to her.

    9. Welcome to the family! I was diagnosed with ADHD at age 30 and it’s one of the best things that ever happened to me.

      Whether you seek a formal diagnosis or self-identify, you’re starting a really valuable journey of self-discovery. The lived experience of ADHD/Autism/etc is so different from how they’re described by clinicians, so I really recommend spending time in ADHD or Autistic communities (Twitter and Tiktok count!) and seeing what resonates with you. There is medication available for ADHD but not for Autism, but for both, there’s a lot you can do outside of taking meds to feel better and make your life easier. The important thing is to get outside the frame of “why don’t I fit in and how can I force myself to fit,” and start learning more about yourself and your needs so that you can accommodate them.

      A few recommendations that I haven’t seen so far in this thread: Devon Price is one of my favorite thought leaders around autism and other forms of neurodiversity. I can’t recommend their books “Laziness Does Not Exist” and “Unmasking Autism” highly enough. They also have a Substack with a ton of free and extremely high-quality essays on various aspects of living as an Autistic person in a world that isn’t designed for us. I also highly recommend the Substack “Sluggish” by Jesse Meadows, who approaches similar ideas with a more ADHD-focused angle.

      Neither of these are “how to get organized,” productivity hacks, or anything like that, which is such a breath of fresh air when most ADHD content is around how to force yourself to be a better cog in the capitalist machine. They speak more directly to the lived experience of ADHD or Autism, and all the anxiety and trauma that build up after years of struggling in work or relationships. Once you understand exactly why you’ve been struggling, you can start taking actions to heal and build a better life.

      A final note: A lot of people don’t understand or respect ADHD, Autism, or neurodiversity in general. You’ll hear a lot of “just use a planner,” “just stop being lazy,” “everyone feels that way,” “back in my day we just hit kids until they behaved,” and so on. It’s especially hard for folks like us to hear this kind of stuff because we’ve been conditioned to believe that we can’t trust ourselves, and we tend to take rejection and invalidation harder than others do. I don’t have a solution for that – just a heads up that this can be a particularly painful part of the process. But overall, it’s so worth it, and I wish you the best!

  2. I paid off my student loans this week! I’m 10 years out of school, had only gov’t loans, and now my only debt is my car (I owe about 15k). It hasn’t really set in yet but I am starting to feel a huge weight lifted. I rent, so I don’t want to take on a ton of debt again right away, but I plan to start thoughtfully considering a house!

    4. CONGRATULATIONS! I will never forget that feeling when I paid off all of my student loans. I hope you are able to do something fun this weekend to celebrate.

    6. Congratulations on owning all your knowledge outright!

      Seriously, that’s a huge milestone and I hope you bask in your achievement this weekend. Treat Yo Self!

    8. Congratulations!

      I finally paid mine off a couple of months ago and the relief is palpable!

    13. Congrats!! It’ll sink in more when you don’t have to make the monthly payment! Seriously though, the best feeling.

  3. I know this gets discussed a lot, but my search efforts have failed. I’m considering getting the copper IUD and would appreciate some advise/guidance. 15ish years ago I had a very painful attempt at inserting the Mirena IUD. Ultimately, it did not insert correctly, and I wasn’t interested in trying again. I’m not interested in doing any type of hormonal birth control, so that leaves either the copper IUD or getting my tubes tied. Should I be asking for meds beforehand knowing that the prior process was very painful? What meds? I’ve read that periods can become very heavy. Has anyone regretted the copper IUD?

    1. I have a copper IUD, inserted by a nurse who did them all day, every day, which I think helped. I’d previously found PAP smears painful, but it wasn’t horrible. I’d ask for medication just in case though.
      I’m 6 years in, and about to have mine removed. My periods are much heavier than they were previously and longer, but I’m not sure that’s normal ageing. They are also very erratic (from 26 to 38 day cycles), but again, I’m nudging 40.

    2. I’ve had two copper IUDs. Insertions were painful both times. Taking ibuprofen before and after the procedure helped with the second (wish they’d recommended this with the first). You could also ask for something to calm you generally. With the second, I also allowed myself a day of laying on the couch and watching movies and eating whatever as I was achy — kind of similar to cramps but different. Periods were heavier at times, but nothing too crazy (at least until I hit perimenopause and had some crime scenes). The pain was worth it for ten years of not having to think about birth control, but YMMV.

    3. I had the copper iud for about 6 months. Insertion was painless but I’ve also had two children. I had the Mirena pre-kids and remember that insertion being more painful but not intolerable. I absolutely hated the copper iud. I got it because I also wanted to try and reduce the hormones. Birth control pills had caused hormone-induced headaches. The copper iud made my periods so heavy and long (at least a week each). Literally felt like I was having a miscarriage every time I went to the bathroom and looked in the toilet. I even bled through clothing on the first couple days of my periods almost each month. That had never happened to me before in 20+ years of having periods. I then got the Skyla iud which is relatively low hormone compared to mirena. I still get periods but they are lighter and only 3 days or so. I love it so far (it’s been about 6 months). When I had the mirena, my periods stopped completely but I also had headaches.

    4. You might have your reasons for not listing them, but condoms are another option.

      1. +1 I read this post and thought condoms were an obvious option you were overlooking. I’ve successfully avoided pregnancy using only condoms for decades and conceived two kids easily when we stopped using them, so no fertility issues.

      2. I always respect people’s choices of contraception, so I don’t want to push anything that doesn’t work for someone… but highly underrated IMHO. Zero side effects, reversible, inexpensive, did I mention no hormonal side effects?

        1. Yup. We did this for years. I never found a BC method that didn’t have a significant drawback. Also, I had ZERO libido while on anything with hormones. Having a wife who actually wanted to have s3x made my DH more than okay with using condoms.

          But the best birth control of all is a vasectomy. ;)

        1. There is the 13 number, based on typical use(includes not using a condom every time or not the whole time), and there is also 2 in 100, for perfect use. IUDs still perform better but I wanted to point this out for those who don’t click on the link.

        2. I know these stats but I know definitively two IUD babies (confirmed by parents) and have heard of a few others in our circle. Maybe parents of pill babies / condom babies are more quiet about it, but I’ve always wondered if there’s some risk with an IUD that you can’t know if it’s misplaced whereas with a pill or a condom you are more aware if something went wrong (broke, missed a day, etc) and could adjust accordingly.

      4. With the current attacks on women’s reproductive rights I don’t blame anyone who wants semi-permanent birth control that doesn’t rely on a man’s compliance to use.

        1. It turned out to be a good screening tool, where my now-husband had no qualms using condoms and is also a respectful and considerate partner in many other ways.

          2. This. DH had no issue when I insisted on hormonal BC plus condoms until we were married. I wanted as close to zero as possible chance of a baby until I was done my education.

        2. +1000000000000000

          I have a (hopefully) permanent and monogamous partner but still wanted to take birth control into my own hands in a state that doesn’t allow for abortion in the case of rape.

    5. I had a series of copper IUDs for virtually all of my reproductive years. In my experience, insertion was fine but removal was painful. Some of my providers gave me pain relievers to take a couple hours in advance and after and a few days of proactive antibiotics. Yes, my periods were heavier, but it was well worth it for the extremely high efficacy rate (condoms are not even comparable).

    6. No experience with copper IUD, but I’ve had 3 Mirena insertions, including 2 bad ones and 1 okay one. Meds I would (now) ask for include: a fast acting anti-anxiety drug to take shortly before the appt. They will want you to have a way of getting home that isn’t self-drive. I would also ask for local numbing/anesthetic, which they can apparently do, although applying it also hurts a tiny bit.

      According to my most recent doc, these are reasonably standard requests nowadays, and won’t raise eyebrows. Especially if you have never had children (thus, generally, a tighter cervix.)

      1. +1, I had a nightmare IUD insertion 5-10 years ago but may be trying the copper IUD since I’m not interested in going back on hormonal BC. I told my doctor about my horrible experience with Mirena and she said I could have “as many drugs as I wanted” (direct quote) if I did opt to give the copper IUD a shot. Options she mentioned were some combination of an anti-anxiety drug, a cervical softener, and a local anesthetic. I’m still not sure if I’m going to do it, but if I do I will be drugged to the eyeballs.

        FWIW, currently using condoms.

      2. I’ve had two with Kylena. Second one was much better than the first with the differences being – (1) doc was really good at talking me through breathing during the process – like its not drugs, but shocking how well it worked, dude had a talent for it as a high risk OBGYN; (2) nurse immediately had a heating pad ready to go post insertion and made me sit still for 15 minutes.

    7. I love my copper IUD. I’ve had it for ten years, about to get it out next month, and I’m going to get another. My periods were heavier for a while, but then mellowed out to normal. The insertion was painful, and I had cramps for a day, but it was worth it for ten years of not worrying about pregnancy and not dealing with hormonal bc.

      1. +1 Adding, OP, did the Dr advise you to have it inserted on the 1st or 2nd day of your period? This is advised because your cervix is open thus making it less painful.

    8. I hate how local anesthesia or mild sedation is not standardly offered for IUD insertion. If it was men, it would 100% be offered every time as shown by the fact that’s offered for contraceptive gel for men insertion.

          1. But doesn’t the numbing shot hurt just as much? Also, a lot of the pain is actually past the cervix from the measurement they take for placement, and I wonder whether numbing the cervix would really help with that.

          3. I mean, a lot of women are saying it’s effective, so it probably is! Not sure why you can’t or won’t believe women who talk about their own personal levels of pain.

      2. Not IUD insertion but I have a vasovagal response to having my cervix touched/maniuplated. I had to have a colposcopy and that was pretty bad. Then I had to go back for an intrauterine biopsy, which is similar to how they place an IUD. I was really worried about how I would react (vomiting) to that. So I talked to my OB about my concerns.

        She then gave me a prescription for two Valium pills. I was to take one I think 20 minutes before arriving at the office for the procedure. It made a huge, huge difference. I don’t know why they don’t routinely do this. I didn’t even need the second pill.

    9. There are a couple choices that are hormonal IUD s but not mirena. Have you talked to your doctor about those? I chose the mirena over copper because of the risk of heavier periods on copper. With the mirena I’ve had no periods.

      Insertion of the mirena for me was a non-event, but I’ve also had two kids and also don’t have low pain tolerance.

      1. She says she’s not interested in hormonal options, so I think the copper iud is the only choice of that device.

    10. I had the copper IUD and have mixed feelings about it. I loved that it was non-hormonal and I didn’t have to worry about taking a pill or condoms (which have frequently given me rashes in the past, still not sure what ingredient that’s from). The copper IUD definitely did make my periods heavier, however. But I didn’t notice any other side effects, compared to friends who have experienced headaches or weight gain on hormonal birth control. I will say the insertion was bad (I felt very faint, immediately had to run to the bathroom, and then did end up passing out in the lobby). The removal was also bad – the strings had fallen off somehow, so they had to get an ultrasound tech and have someone pressing really hard on my uterus while my OB fished around for the IUD with essentially tongs. Shoutout to the person here who told me to “get over it” when I said I was nervous about having it taken out. Both times I had my doctor prescribe Lorazepam beforehand which did help slightly. I have no idea what I’m going to do after I give birth next week.

    12. Hi – I just got one put in last July after having my kid. (Had a first attempt 6 weeks PP that ended in disaster because I had zero natural lubrication, thank you breastfeeding.) The successful insertion was no worse than a Pap smear. I needed some Tylenol for the rest of the day and then I was fine. My sister had a similar experience, but she has a super low pain tolerance so she took Tylenol before going in for her procedure and thinks that made a difference.

      It took another six months for my periods to come back (again, thank you breastfeeding), but so far I have noticed that my periods are a bit heavier, a bit shorter, and my cramps are a bit different – almost like nerve pain, and I can feel them all up and down my whole body. Not sure what that’s about (and if anyone knows from experience that that’s a post-baby change and not related to the copper IUD, please weigh in!). I don’t regret it, though – I specifically wanted a non-hormonal option due to a family history of breast cancer and not wanting to add another ingredient to the postpartum cocktail, and it’s been the perfect option. Other than the changes to my period I haven’t noticed it’s even there.

    13. The problem with asking this kind of question is that anecdotal evidence is – well – anecdotal. (And you get people suggesting condoms as if every woman in America does not know that is an option and as if only men sometimes don’t like them.) Try it. Take some ibuprofen in advance; if you are really worried talk to your doctor about something stronger (Valium?) If you find the side effects bothersome, have it removed. Just for the love of heaven, don’t forget to check your strings regularly.

      And everyone observe a moment of silence for the USA’s IUD market where there is only one non-hormonal IUD available and five total in comparison to the 20+ in Europe.

    14. I’m on my second. First insertion was super painful. Second wasn’t as bad. If you ask your doc about pain meds, they may have suggestions. I just took the max dose of ibuprofen before my second. My periods are a little heavier and I used to get pretty bad cramps, but those seem to have mostly gone away as I’ve aged. The heavier periods aren’t ideal, but worth it to me to not have to think about birth control and non-hormonal. And I actually got my second one about a year earlier than it was due to be replaced because I didn’t trust my Republican state legislature to not pull any shenanigans.

    15. I had a rough time with my copper IUD but found it was better than the alternatives- insertion was incredibly painful (like the most painful experience of my life) and the thing broke on the way out (and I still have a centimeter of plastic and copper in my uterine wall). Despite all that, It was the best choice for me- I hated how I felt on hormonal BC and I’m allergic to latex- my options were not great. If I had to do it again, I would have done the same.

      Providers can provide stronger pain relief or sedation for IUD insertion, but typically don’t because gynecology is barbaric sometimes. Ask if your provider can do a cervical block and sedatives + stronger pain meds, given that your past insertion was a failure, and if not, look for a different provider.

    16. I’ve had three IUD insertions and they were all awful. The most recent one was with an OB/GYN who is a pain specialist, and he told me he had The Best Way to manage pain – a “cocktail” of medications beforehand which turned out to be Tylenon, gabapentin and misoprostol, and a pericervical block before the insertion, which was just a series of local anesthetic injections. It didn’t help at all, and was still insanely painful.

      I’ve recently learned that some providers will do an IUD insertion under sedation, and honestly, that’s probably the best solution. Unfortunately, it’s probably pretty expensive…

  4. What would you wear to a dinner at a nice steakhouse where it’s you and a man 20 years your senior that is not a date (friend of my dad’s, in my Midwest state, his business could theoretically utilize my firm but it’s less business development and more friendly catch up). We’re both unmarried, no idea if he’s with someone, I’m single.

      1. Seriously? I’m 50 y/o and this seems like such a weird dated take on things. So because it’s not a date, two adults of different genders can’t have dinner? If this was a female would people even think twice?

      2. Why yikes? Are we really reverting to a place where a man and a woman cannot get dinner together? Alright there Mike Pence.

      3. I feel exhausted by both the post and this response.
        Wear business casual clothes and don’t come on to him.

      4. I’m not Mike Pence, but it’s possible (and in my experience, likely) that this guy may think this is a date, or may lead to a date, even if you dress conservatively. Older men are not great at reading signals. You should still meet with him, but I would move this meeting to lunch if possible to make it seem less like a date.

    4. Just the two of you? Is dinner whenever this family friend is in town a norm in your relationship with the guy? If the answers are yes and no, this sounds like red flags galore.

    5. I would wear a trouser (over a dress) and some kind of flat shoe to make sure you’re setting the ‘not a date’ tone.

      1. +1. Unless it’s a school teacher vibe dress? (Which isn’t to dis school teachers, just that they know how to dress for their audience).

        1. Me, too! I envisioned how the Duggars and other fundies would sometimes wear long sleeve shirts with tank tops on top and thought ‘Now we’re saying that skirts need pants as well?”I guess because this post already seems to have taken such an odd turn.

          (And, no, I don’t think you need to avoid a dress so no one is overtaken by your femininity.)

    7. A forgettable/neutral work appropriate dress or similar outfit (pants + sweater/blouse). It isn’t a date, and it doesn’t sound like you’re interested in sending mixed messages on this, so nothing too low cut (you’ll be sitting most of the time) or form hugging (for the walk to/from the table).

    8. Whatever I wanted, I wouldn’t overthink it. And while I know there’s differing opinions on age gaps, I might have a “you never know” mentality going into it.

    10. I’ve done this all the time when traveling for deals and it was just me and the partner getting dinner after negotiations – just wear what you’d wear to work. If a waiter thinks it’s a date, laugh about it.

    11. Just anything you’d wear to work. Don’t make it weird, you’re just meeting a friend of your dad’s. That’s such a normal thing to do.

    14. Dinner with a family friend does not have to be this weird.
      Wear something that would be considered business casual and have a nice evening. If people might think you’re dating that’s a them problem.

    15. Maybe it’s because I have worked in a male dominated field for my entire life, but I am so saddened and surprised by the recent posts here about how to handle having a meal with a member of the opposite sex. I have lunch or dinner with male friends and colleagues all the time. I could not even count how many times. It’s just a normal part of my life. It’s not a date. It’s just a meal. How have we reverted back to the Victorian era here?

      2. Yes, I agree, but with a few caveats. I also work in a male dominated industry and have dinner with colleagues one on one sometimes (mostly lunch, but sometimes dinner while traveling). I am careful to convey the not-dateness of it, though, especially for dinners. I dress somewhat conservatively (or wear whatever I was wearing at the office which shouldn’t be too revealing), I’m friendly but not too friendly, and now that I’m married I make sure to mention my husband in passing. I also don’t have more than one glass of wine. I hate the Mike Pence rule and agree that it sets women back, but I also think it’s a reality that we sometimes have to tread carefully on this stuff. OP, I would go, but wear slacks and an elegant but not tight or revealing top or sweater, and discrete make-up. Also come in your own car/transportation. My most awkward dinner was with an older client in the middle of the English countryside. He had picked up from the train station and was going to drive me back but (1) he was completely wasted and (2) he was getting a little too friendly, so I got the restaurant owner to call me a cab and it was a little awkward because he was very insistent he would drive me back to my hotel.

        1. I’m the Midwest Anon right below you, and I do agree with parts of this. I cannot think of a situation where I have ever ridden in a car to/from an outing with the contact, and I don’t drink more than two beverages at any one outing, regardless of whether I’m meeting a man or a woman. I’m often dressing for weather :), but over the years, I’ve refined my style to be polished but nothing that is too fancy or revealing, both of which would be out of place in my area anyway. I usually open the conversation by discussing my husband and children at a very high level – no complaining, just matter of fact, and project warmth, confidence and professionalism. It’s worked well so far.

          1. Seriously what is wrong with both of you. 12:42 and 1:05. It’s work. You don’t have to bring up your husband constantly. How about talking about professional topics? How about being seen as a professional capable of having a work related chat without brining up the family?

            Seriously.

          2. Who said anything about “constantly”? Not the Anons above. I wear a wedding ring and mention when appropriate. Think, “Yes, I’ve been at Acme Corp for five years… before that, I was at an outfit in DC… why did I move here? Husband is in oil and gas.”

      3. +1. I also live in a smaller suburb in the Midwest, and am an attorney. My dad is also an attorney who is relatively “well known” in our small town (i.e., has served on all the local boards, held elected positions in our local city government, etc.). We practice different types of law, and work at different firms, and I regularly, regularly, regularly am referred business by him and meet his same aged male colleagues/business contacts for lunch, dinner, drinks, etc. in one on one settings. I’ve never thought twice about it, and if I refused to meet these guys, I’d have lost a ton of business I’ve pulled into my firm. I’m honestly flabbergasted by the responses, as I’ve become a rainmaker in my firm in part due to the connections I’ve made in these meetings. Yes, I have been hit on by one of his colleagues, but he literally hit on me when I was sitting in his office at like 3PM — so creeps gonna creep, and I just walked out of that situation, just like I’d walk out of a lunch, dinner, or drink if it took a weird turn.

        1. No one is saying that OP shouldn’t meet with the guy! She just wants to avoid any potential misunderstanding and awkwardness.

    16. To answer OP’s question: The same thing I would wear to have dinner with my Dad at a nice steakhouse.

      I would be curious about the age of the people who are so concerned that there is something potentially inappropriate about a man and a woman having dinner together. I am not trying to start the generation wars (which I think are mostly a media creation) but when I started practicing law (30 years ago – gulp) I had dinners with men ALL THE TIME because the overwhelming majority of clients and people in positions of power were men. I very, very rarely had issues. But then when I received an expression of interest from someone I was not interested in, I just made a polite excuse (usually a variation of the warning against fishing off the company pier) and moved on. I did not view it as threatening, either personally or professionally.

      Between this board and our most recent anti-harassment training, it feels like people are just more worried about it. And I find that concerning, both for finding a mentor and business development.

      1. I tend to agree. I worked in labs back in the 1990s and would go out for lunch with male coworkers all the time. Not dinner very often because we had no money.

        I have had my share of having a meal with a male coworker or friend and having them make a comment indicating an interest in dating. I would just politely decline and we’d move on. I’m happy that people are more aware of and calling out sexual harassment, but I just don’t consider it harassment if a guy says, Hey, you want to go out sometime, and I say, No, sorry, I don’t think that would be a good idea, and we both move on.

        I don’t even know how people date these days if interactions like that are forbidden. But I am old.

        1. I commented above and agree it goes too far sometimes. Someone who I consider an exceptional mentor started at a new (very large and well known) company recently and set up 1:1 lunches with all of his new team (male/female) to get to know them. He was completely shut down by HR and had to cancel them all. I get the potential for harassment but these people will be missing out on a great mentorship opportunity.
          The only time I was harassed in an office, there was no lunch involved, the guy just would call me into his office and proceed to do various inappropriate things (nothing super awful, but he had this round table we would sit at to “review contracts” together and he would brush up against my arms and thighs, comment on my perfume, ask if my boyfriend was jealous of all the time we were spending together, etc… it was an open secret that he did this will all younger females at the firm). I just made it my business to be busy with other people’s work so I could turn him down. He’s still around as far as I know though I ended up leaving that firm.

    17. Well, the OP made a point of pointing out her dinner plans is with someone single, and that she is single. I wondered… why did you do that OP? Are you interested? So clearly the discussion was triggered by what she was poking. Why would she even ask this question, if she did not think there was something at risk (or of interest…) here? She’s in her 50’s, a lawyer. She has life experience.

      I would just wear my work clothes, if this was a weeknight dinner at a nice restaurant and you think it might be a work contact in the future. Not date night clothes. No dress/suggestive.

      But when I reached the OP’s age, I was hit on a lot by men in my father’s age group. Sad, but true. Many of them are actually more disinhibited as they age, so it wasn’t pretty…

      1. The OP never says she is 50, that is someone else, who is flabbergasted by the concern. I seriously doubt OP is 50. This is not how we roll. And part of the negative response to the post is triggered by the inclusion of their martial statuses, signaling that for OP there is an assumption that that is relevant when nothing suggests it should be.

  5. We are starting the college process for my son, who has a serious physical disability and uses a wheelchair. For those of you with physical disabilities – or those with kids who have physical disabilities who have gone to college – what advice do you have on looking at schools? If any of you are willing to say where you/kid went and how the experience was I would be most grateful. He would prefer a blue state (particularly with the threat of the ACA being overturned if the elephants return to power).

    1. Check in with the disability services office at each school both in advance and while you visit. They will have information about the physical layout of the campus/classrooms/dorms etc and also can tell you about available programming accommodations and how to request them. They are overworked these days, so reach out early.

    2. Assuming he uses a wheelchair for most/all aspects of daily living, the most critical thing is finding a housing arrangement that is accessible and classrooms that are accessible. All other things being equal, I would look for schools that have robust on campus housing for students, ideally with lots of newer construction, as well as a school that has lots of newer buildings, at least in the subject areas that he likely wants to pursue. It’s one thing to retrofit accessibility into an old, beautiful building with tons of stairs and floors on slightly different levels, and another thing entirely to have a modern building that incorporated accessibility requirements from the get go.

      Reaching out to accessibility services to gauge their responsiveness is a good idea. In my experience, they mainly deal with non-physical disabilities, so someone else’s positive experience getting extra tie to write a test, etc. may have little implication for your son.

      Obviously, if he has his heart set on someplace that doesn’t meet those criteria he can make it work, but it will obviously be harder.

      1. Yes, definitely. I’ve not had the experience in the US, but I’ve gone from one of Scotland’s “ancient” universities to one of its newer ones, and the difference in experience for students with limited mobility is night and day. It’s a big campus, but it is so much more accessible.

      2. As a professor, I agree with this and I want to emphasize that disability services, while obviously required to accommodate students with physical disabilities, is mostly dealing with students with other types of disabilities, so getting feedback on the office generally isn’t necessarily going to be helpful- you’re really going to want to try to get information on dealing with physical disabilities specifically (and try to hear from students if you can, not just the staff). I’ve had many students with disabilities in my classes, but not a single one in a wheelchair and I almost never see any on my campus, which I don’t feel is very disability friendly. I have a chronic illness, so I have personal experience with disability, but my accessibility issues are quite different than wheelchair accessibility and it wasn’t as disabling when I was a student, so I didn’t deal with official accommodations.

    3. Does he need PCAs? If so, how hard/easy will they be to hire at target school (cost of living, size of the surrounding town? Does the school have a nursing program? (My sister mostly hired PCAs from the school’s nursing students and it worked out really really well – she felt more integrated, the school is had less paperwork to get them access to the dorms, they lived close by and had weird student schedules so it was easier to find someone who could take eg a 2 hour shift “get ready in the morning” shift.

      In terms of “vibes” – they genuinely wanted her there, and discussing accommodations felt like real people having a normal human conversation about how to make something work, not like their lawyer was reviewing everything.

      1. It’s 20+ years ago, but I seem to recall that University of Illinois in Champaign had a whole program/system for people with disabilities to be paired up with students who wanted to go into physical therapy, occupational therapy, etc. There might have been a designated dorm.

        Again, this was 20+ years ago and it was something I heard about, not something I directly experienced.

        1. Yes, and we still do! Its a great place for students with disabilities and is famous for it’s wheelchair athletics programs and athletes. An alumni of my grad program went to the Tokyo Paraolympics for the marathon and did quite well. There is a dorm dedicated to students with disabilities who need nearly full time or live in care (Beckwith Hall), and many of the other housing options on campus are wheelchair accessible. Since Champaign is completely flat (seriously, the steepest hill is under the train tracks or over the interstate) this makes it very easy for anyone to get around on wheels. Campus facilities does an excellent job keeping the sidewalks clear when it does snow here. Every building on campus has been made fully wheelchair accessible, and I see students in all kinds of wheelchairs on campus every day. This is also a great university for many areas of study and a wonderful place to live. I’ve studied/lived/worked here for 15 plus years and will talk about it to anyone who wants to post a burner email

    4. I love my blue state (MN) but the winters are no joke and it’s very very challenging for anyone who uses a mobility device to get around during the long long winter with all of the ice / snow on the sidewalks. There are indoor walkways and tunnels connecting some buildings and complexes (such as on the U of M campus), but I would not recommend MN (or a similarly wintery state) for a kid who wants to express their independence – too limiting, for too many months of the year, to get around. They’d likely by fine on a campus, but challenged to go anywhere else.

      1. This. I live in MA and went to school in CT. While main buildings/streets are cleared the sidewalks, parking lots, and intersections are often not promptly cleared OR there are huge slush puddles which I can only imagine would be a huge problem.

      2. This, and I would avoid very hilly campuses or large, sprawling campuses.

        Might also want to figure out his options for getting around. Do you want a city environment wherein he can take public transit? Do you want a smaller, more rural environment wherein he can have a car freshman year (assuming he can drive)?

    5. Apologies if this is obvious but I’d take weather into account. States like VT/MA/NH/CT have serious snow and ice for a good portion of the year and even if the campus itself is accessible, the local towns may not be great at clearing curbs/ramps/sidewalks.

      1. You can’t rule out entire states that have some of the best schools because the town sidewalk might be slushy one day. OP, I beg you to keep his options open. Let him decide. He’s old enough to figure out his priorities.

        1. OP here. We live in a snowy state and have learned ways of dealing with that, so weather wouldn’t rule out a school for us. We know to talk to disability centers and have reviewed all of the various rankings for this too. Really looking for actual experiences. As some posters have indicated, some schools are more welcoming and accommodating than others (regardless of how old buildings are, etc.). If possible, I’d like to help him narrow the options. In part this is because visiting campuses will be difficult. As one commenter mentioned, air travel is not something wheelchair users take lightly — we’re probably looking at a long road trip instead. We will likely move with him so staying close to home isn’t an issue either, and our local schools are not very good fits for a variety of reasons.

          1. I think forums are going to be your best bet. I’m not sure if your son is in any online forums for others with his disability but I would ask there. I would look at things like reddit (college subreddits and ones related to his disability/wheelchair users) and college confidential as well.

          2. I was a graduate student at Emory. I don’t use a wheelchair, but knew several students who did. They also seemed to manage really well. Georgia isn’t a blue state, but Atlanta is a progressive city.

        2. Agreed. I went to school in Eastern Canada and there were multiple wheelchair users. I’m not saying they didn’t have their challenges, they absolutely did, but don’t rule out an otherwise good option purely based on the weather.

          1. Especially in the age of climate change – my family north of Boston used to have snow on the ground every year and they’ve barely had 2 inches this year.

        3. Actually, I would probably prefer to go to a state that knows how to handle winter weather on a regular basis over one that might get a random snowstorm (like Texas in 2021) and be completely flummoxed, both on an infrastructure/government level and as a society full of people navigating said weather.

    6. I would approach this as any college search, making a list of institutions that meet son’s area of interest, academic credentials, location, etc., going for a fairly big list. Then I would investigate the list from a mobility and disability services perspective. There are resources that rate campuses such as https://newmobility.com/wheels-on-campus-profiles-top-20-wheelchair-friendly-colleges/ and probably reddit threads etc on the issue. And, of course, an in person visit prior to matriculation, of not application, will be key.

      1. +1

        These are the best ideas.

        Is being close to a major medical center / rehab program needed?

        We have a family member with a spinal cord injury / wheelchair user, and I’ve known several young people in chairs. It is so common to develop certain medical complications in college due to changes in routine, so being close to care can be key for some problems. But maybe this is not your situation and it is primarily accessibility, so just ignore in that case.

    7. Also since you asked for specific places – she went to University of Portland. Staying local was a big factor for emergency management (like “within an hour drive of family, but doesn’t feel like you never left your hometown”), so ymmv. SLAC with a strong honors program.

    8. I knew someone who used a wheelchair at Yale and he didn’t let us stop him from anything. He traveled every single weekend to tournaments in his chosen activity. He must’ve tested every single campus in the Northeast for wheelchair accessibility. It was fine and he had gone into it assuming he was fine. Don’t invent trouble – if there’s trouble, he’ll find it and deal with it then. Good luck!

    10. A consideration as someone whose roommate in college was disabled (dwarfism and mostly wheelchair bound)- consider how your child will get to/from campus. My roommate chose somewhere that didn’t require air travel because, while possible, air travel is 300x the hassle for her.

      My college modified everything else for her. She had the same dorm room all four years because it was essentially custom built for her (we were roommates but it was a 2-room double; our sophomore year on she got both rooms!).

    12. A friend and an in-law went to Wake Forest. One has a wheelchair and a PCA. The other has limited mobility due to CP. One was Phi Beta Kappa. Wake has a med school, so it may be easier than other college towns for finding PCAs. Both live on their own now and have had successful careers. DC’s metro regularly transports riders in wheelchairs and there are many newer elevator apartments that are metro-accessible, so that may help in your search or for later.

    13. Would recommend well-funded smaller liberal arts colleges as they have a much smaller campus scale and generally housing mixed right in with academic buildings.

      I went to a tiny college (~2k undergrads) and there were quite a few folks with physical accommodations in the dorms.

      1. University of Richmond. It’s been a minute since I was on campus but a good friend was wheelchair bound. He did great. The norm is to live on campus all 4 years too. Older buildings but retrofitted sufficiently from what I heard and recall.

      2. Eh, my UC was much more used to students with physical mobility needs, and had more space + resources available, to the point that they rebuilt a dorm room for a wheelchair user classmate.

    14. Consider meeting with someone from the Office of the Registrar at his final choice schools. The Registrar’s Office makes classroom assignments in conjunction with each department. Historic buildings can’t always be retrofitted but class sections can typically be moved to an accessible building and the sooner the class is moved, the easier.

    15. A friend who uses a wheelchair and had a number of accommodation needs had a really positive experience at Wash U in St Louis

  6. Looking for some pro bono/community support ideas in Houston. Two of my neighbors are elderly sisters in generally poor health – I know this because they post on Nextdoor a lot asking for prayers while one of them is in and out of the hospital and because one of my friends is an EMT and has made frequent visits to their house. They’re nice enough when I walk my dog past their house, but probably weren’t in a condition to take care of a house on their own any longer. Apparently they’ve been evicted and all of their belongings, as well as their dog and cat, are currently on their front lawn. I drove by this morning and it was pretty devastating to see, especially with the dog just lying on the front lawn. I have no idea what happened with regard to the eviction and am not in a position to take in their animals, but feel like I can’t just sit there and see this happen. Any suggestions for resources in the community?

    1. If you have the space, I would volunteer to keep their most precious belongings safe and climate controlled while they figure out what to do. Obviously you can’t take everything, but if you could hold a box of treasured letters or some jewelry for them, it might really make a difference to piece of mind.

    2. Jesus that’s awful. Can you post on ND/your neighborhood FB to let people know there are animals in need?

    3. Yeah call an animal rescue immediately. The dog and cat are just lying there?! Post to ND where there are local people to help, not here.

    4. Call 2-1-1 for local resources. That’s really terrible. For the animals, I’d reach out to a shelter vs animal control and ask if they can take the pets. For the belongings, maybe try a local church or your local LOVE INC. to see if they can help.

      Those women need a social worker stat!

    5. Try Interfaith Ministries as well, they should be able to help get connected to many resources in Houston.

    6. If the dog has any breed resemblance, search for “[breed] rescue” to see if there is an organization. My dog’s breed has a nationally active rescue group that will leap to help with this type of situation. They typically help with all the household animals, too.

  7. Advice needed: a little over a week ago I emailed my boss asking her to address a coworker’s foul language, which was far beyond the line. She handled it incredibly well, IMHO, and he got an official writeup for sxl harassment. In the 3 workdays since their meeting, he has had a terrible temper, including using the specific cuss word he was told not to use (but much less often). He also makes daily “jokes” about self-harm.

    Should I email my boss again about the fallout, or does that have the appearance of nagging/tattling?

      1. +1. You’re documenting his behavior. If I were your boss I’d add this to my “let’s fire this guy” files and send them to HR.

    3. Is he testing to see if you’re the one who got him written up or is any of this witnessed by others? If it’s the latter, I would bring HR in again without a second pause. If it’s the former, I would try to make sure interactions happen in front of witnesses and then bring HR in again. Shouldn’t it have to be this way? Of course not. But it will make your life much easier if there is a third party present to corroborate.

    4. I wouldn’t follow up this quickly. I’d give it a week or so and send a note thanking her for intervening, and noting the above. Would do this once ~1 week after the intervention, then again ~3 weeks later (so a month after intervention) if still happening. Would ideally have one of those two follow ups come from someone who isn’t you who is also impacted if you have a colleague who feels similarly.

        2. I’m the poster who suggested waiting. Seems like my suggestion is out of line with everyone else so I guess off base, but was coming from the angle of trying to prevent the complainer from being viewed as the problem. No matter how legitimate the claims, even a reasonable and well intentioned boss seems like at some point they could start to just be inured or annoyed by the same person continually raising the same problem. That was the rationale behind batching the updates: still provide the info but not on such a frequent basis.

          1. I understand this point of view and is probably how I would lean, too, but I’m awfully risk-averse.

          2. I also get this perspective. It depends on your level of comfort with your supervisors, but I think it’s good advice to consider. (I wouldn’t wait in my current job, but I definitely would have in my former job).

    6. Yes. Describe the facts. You’re creating the paper trail. Sorry you’re dealing with it.

    8. At the very least, call out the “jokes”. “That is not funny. Here’s a hotline number, I hope you call if you need help.”

    9. The “jokes” about self-harm are threats of violence. That on the surface he’s directing them to himself makes no difference – plenty of workplace violence ends with the perpetrator harming themselves in the end. Tell your boss about this immediately.
      It’s not “nagging/tattling”, whatever that means, this is a workplace.

      1. Guess I’d better unalive myself if I cant’ call a c— a c— anymore…. that kind of stuff? I’d report it immediately.

  8. If you knew of a small group of in-house attorneys, led by a general counsel, where one was titled “Associate General Counsel” and the rest were “Assistant General Counsel,” where would you think the Associate GC fit in, in terms of seniority/hierarchy? Would it make a difference if you saw the Associate GC was the only woman?

    If you don’t think it’s obvious that the Associate GC is a more senior position, how can the Assoc make it more clear to people who might not know the group well that it actually is a serious step up (changing the title name won’t happen for bureaucratic reasons).

    1. There’s usually fewer people with senior titles than junior, so that would be my clue that Associate is higher than Assistant in this case, though I agree it’s not the clearest naming convention.

      Why does Associate need to make it obvious as to her rank?

    2. In my company, Associate GC is senior to Assistant GC, and by design there are less of them. I think that’s standard corporate titling and it’s not internally confusing about who’s the boss. The gender is irrelevant other than sounds like that company has a woman in a senior role.

      1. Also how it works in academia; you start off as an assistant professor, love to associate, and then to full. (If your own institution differs, let me know.)

    4. Oh, good, I feel much better now. I was worried this could be interpreted as some sort of side/contract/part-time type job, but I guess it is a common set-up I just hadn’t seen. Thanks!

      1. That’s how it works, typically the titling is GC, Deputy GC, Associate GC, Assistant GC, Senior Counsel, Counsel.

      2. It’s also very common outside of law for “associate x” job titles to be senior to “assistant x” so I don’t think there will be any confusion.

      3. Are there specific reasons you need to underscore the hierarchy (eg making it easier for the business to understand escalation)?

    6. This question is very confusing. All in house legal teams are lead by a general counsel. Associate GC is senior to assistant. That is a standard title, so it wouldn’t change. Why does the gender matter? If you are the attorney, it should become obvious because of your role in how matters are staffed and communicated to the business team.

      1. Nope–many legal teams are led by CLOs :)

        Barker Gilmore, the Lawyer Whisperer Blog, TechGC, ACC, Legal.io, Robert Half all have salary surveys that set out experience by levels pretty clearly. Some of the above are paywalled to members only.

    8. Assistant GCs are senior to associate GCs in my very large in-house dept but there are very few assistant GCs (and they also have VP in their title which helps show seniority), and more associate GCs without the VP title.

    10. Associate is senior. Assistant is junior and that should be apparent as the implication is they are only assisting (not high level decision-making). Caveat: this wouldn’t have been obvious to me until I went in-house, so I get the question.

  9. Any button down recommendations for larger chests? I like button down shirts but have written them off because they don’t fit nicely over the chest. The thing is I want them to fit my chest but still narrow down and have a waist and not be huge.

    1. I find silky button downs for this better than cotton ones. Ann Taylor used to have “utility” blouses that fit nicely.

    2. I only get popover blouses now. They look business casual on top but turn into a shirt after 3 buttons.

  10. The copper IUD question above got me thinking. My husband had testicular cancer twice, so I never had to worry about birth control. Now I’m in my 40’s and my periods are getting erratic and coming really close together. Cycles range from 18 to 24 days. I have migraines and I get one the first day of every period and it is absolutely miserable. My experiences with different types of birth control before I met my husband were not great. Is there a reason not to jump to a surgical solution since I absolutely will not be having children? Obviously will be discussing with my doctor but curious what others have done.

    1. Surgery is no joke, BUT… they no longer “tie” tubes, they just remove them, which lowers your chance of ovarian cancer by 50 %, per my gynecologist (she is a phenomenal doctor and I trust her, so I saw no need to “do my own research”).

    2. I got my tubes tied two years ago and cannot be happier with the decision. You can also get a uterine ablation at the same time to stop your periods. My doc said that theoretically the uterine lining could grow back, but at 39, I was close enough to menopause that it was very very unlikely I’d ever have another period.

      I knew I didn’t want any children and I live in a deep red state that’s headed down the Alabama wormhole. Never having to worry about pregnancy has been a large burden lifted for me.

      1. I am not OP but I would love to hear more about an ablation. I had my tubes removed four years ago and perimenopause is still managing to kick my ass. Did it help with just period related issues, or more generally?

        1. My sister had an ablation after her last pregnancy due to fibroids. She loved it. Only issue was that she went into somewhat early menopause (not related to the ablation) but didn’t know it due to not having periods, or not knowing she was missing periods.

    3. I got my tubes tied a while back and am really happy with it, but it doesn’t affect my periods (it’s just like no birth control). I don’t know much about the ablation, but that might be an option.

      For anyone who knows, does the ablation also take away your mid-cycle ovulation time? I’ve really enjoyed having that since being off the pill (though I hate going back to normal periods!)

    4. I went straight to surgery at 44 and my only regret is that I didn’t do it the second I had good health insurance.
      I ended up having a total hysterectomy and oophrectomy, but the recovery was still no biggie. Everyone is different, but my life is so much better now.

    5. It may be worth discussing hormone replacement therapy and/or low dose birth control (often prescribed in perimenopause before HRT) with your doctor. I know you said you didn’t like hormonal bc before, but it may affect you differently (and you may take different drugs) now that your own hormones are different. That is, if they’re an option given that you get migraines. If you do get a hysterectomy, your doctor would likely recommend HRT anyway as it can be important for your long term health. A hysterectomy might be a good choice for you, but it may be worth considering that you may still have hormonal medication in your life even if you do go down that path.

      1. I’m the earlier poster who had a hysterectomy and am on HRT. I had bad experiences with hormonal contraception and the HRT doesn’t feel anything like it. I really like the HRT because I feel the same all the time since there are no hormonal peaks and troughs. I love the consistency.

    6. So, both my mother and my aunt had their tubes tied as young women after their youngest children were born and still had periods and went through to menopause like the typical woman not on any birth control.
      I think if you are looking for a solution to migraines and other perimenopause symptoms, that’s what you should ask your doctor about.

      1. Yeah I was confused by that too. I had a tubal ligation when I was 39 and went though years more of periods and normal menopause at 52 or so.

      2. OP here. You’re right. I already do all of the things to treat the migraines (botox, Emgality, lifestyle stuff) but I am tired of my very frequent and erratic periods (and the accompanying migraine that happens every single time). I want to stop getting periods. I’m not really having any other noticeable perimenopause symptoms.

        1. You’d have to get rid of your ovaries – make sure you know that means a lifetime of hormone replacement. Getting rid of your uterus or fallopian tubes is not going to stop the hormonal fluctuations that are associated with periods. My migraines are mostly hormonal so I get it. Just make sure you know what you mean when you say “surgical solution.”

        2. Completely anecdotal but my aunt’s migraines went away after she got a hysterectomy (for different reasons)

  11. I’m curious if anyone else has experienced this and if they have a solve.

    It’s very hard for me to get up in the morning. It’s extra hard if I get up before 7 – I am groggy and grumpy and I often need a nap in the morning to recover otherwise it doesn’t really go away until later in the afternoon. It’s a physical and mental grogginess/slowness. This is a problem because I have an early rising toddler and my husband leaves for work early so I have to get up.

    Adjusting my bedtime has not helped – I started going to bed at 8:30/9 for about 6 months when my toddler was waking up between 5-6 and I felt the same way.

    This started about 10 years ago when two things happened – I started working in a job (lawyer) with a lot of late nights, so I was working 10am-1am roughly, and I moved in with my husband who uses blackout shades. Before that time, I was basically a morning person.

    I felt like the most obvious solve was “go to bed earlier” which just…never helped. In typing this out I am wondering if it’s food related, as I feel sort of nauseous getting up that early and don’t usually eat breakfast until around 9 as a result.

    Any suggestions?

    1. Have you had a sleep evaluation? Wondering if you have something like sleep apnea. I would talk to a doctor for sure and see about running some evaluations. I’ve found when I am low in vitamin D i can be a lot more groggy, slow like you describe.

    2. Drinking a cold glass of water when I first wake up helps me. I keep a thermos by my bed so I don’t even have to get out of bed.

    3. I find my afternoon routine and my diet impact the likelihood I will feel refreshed when getting up early, more so than my bedtime itself. I also find a morning shower first thing to be useful in setting the expectation for myself that it is awake time and not sleep time.

      For me, this means no caffeine after lunch, no energy drinks (at all, really), avoid having highly processed or deep fried foods for dinner, and don’t work out right before bed (although an hour or two before bed actually helps me get more fulfilling sleep). Avoiding alcohol and sugary beverages also helps.

    4. A sunrise alarm clock could help you wake up more slowly. If you live where it’s dark, 20 minutes with a mood lamp might also help.

      1. Yes to the sunrise alarm to wake more gradually. I am not naturally and early riser, and being awakened early in a blackout blinds room would be awful for me.

      2. Plus one. I am super groggy waking up at 6:30 in the winter when it’s dark; today fine in the summer when it’s light. An alarm that slowly lights up 10 minutes before wake up helped a ton. (If you want to be fancy there are also smart blinds that can open the blackout curtains at dawn but they’re more expensive)

    5. Get a sleep study. I had a rough time waking up my entire life. It was sleep apnea. Problem completely solved with a CPAP machine.

    6. Blackout shades make it hard for me to wake up in the morning because I need the sunrise to help wake me up. Maybe one of those sunrise alarms may help regulate your circadian rhythms or whatever the reasoning is?

    7. Get rid of the blackout shades and get an eye mask for your husband — I have a great one for when I sleep in, but that tiny bit of light in the morning really helps me wake up. We have regular shades pulled down at night. If you drink coffee, stop, at least for a while. Drink a glass of water as soon as you wake up, and brush your teeth (in either order).

    9. We have black out shades and I hate them. I find waking up in a dark room to be very jarring. Mr. AIMS was recently away and I slept with the shades open and I slept and woke up much better. So my advice would be to try either a wake up clock or leaving the shades up.

    10. I would bring toddler into the bed with me and watch teletubbies while I drank coffee and tell toddler that mommy needs quiet time. You don’t have to get up and dressed and busy. By age three, my son was asking if I had my coffee yet.

    11. I lost this feeling when I quit drinking coffee for other reasons. As a lifelong happy coffee lover, I felt very confident that coffee was not causing any issues with sleeping. But after fully quitting (switched to one cup of tea, so I’m not totally caffeine free), I have noticed a remarkable shift in my daytime alertness and in my sleep quality. I no longer get that afternoon slump, and I am waking up with natural alertness much earlier in the morning, without the twilight zone half-awake pre-coffee grogginess.

      1. I’m living a decaf lifestyle right now. Nespresso Vertuo decaf pods are surprisingly good. Yes, I bought the whole machine! I haven’t liked other decaf coffee I’ve tried.

        I think decaf coffee has to have around 2-3% of the caffeine level of regular coffee to be labeled decaf. That small amount hasn’t bothered me, and even a cup of regular tea was bothering me.

    13. The single best thing I ever did for my sleep and energy was a Whole 30 diet. I concluded that for my body, sugar (and dairy) have a huge and detrimental impact on my energy. If you’re up for it, doing the Whole 30 elimination diet might be a good way to test whether food is involved – it’s a 30 day commitment, so not your whole life. If you don’t want to do the full thing, which cuts out grains, legumes, dairy, sugar, alcohol, and probably some other stuff, you could try just cutting sugar. That had the biggest impact for me.

    14. When you get up in the morning, get sunlight in your eyes as soon as you can.
      You need to get out of that blackout room and get light exposure.

      If you can’t….
      Get a happy light from Costco.
      Use it for 20-40min every morning. Sit next to it while you have your coffee, or once you start your work days if the toddler keeps you on your feet until you get to work.

      Change jobs….?

    15. try taking a spoonful of peanut butter before bed and see if it helps – i read somewhere that if you’re groggy in the morning it’s because your blood sugar drops over night so you sleep poorly because you’re basically hangry.

  12. A very dear friend of mine is having a bachelorette weekend in May at an inn on the Oregon coast. There will be 10 attendees, all in our mid-30s, most of whom I’ve met a few times but don’t know well. When I got married 10 years ago, my bridesmaids made/brought a bunch of stuff to the bachelorette weekend (which was just at a hotel with a pool near my house) such as glasses with our names on them, screen printed tote bags, etc. I don’t necessarily think we need all that stuff now, but I wanted to get a sense of what’s expected/what would be fun and appreciated for me to bring. Thanks!

    1. It’s completely friend group and bride dependent. I’d ask the others who are going.

    3. If there is a main “planner” of the party she will probably bring that stuff. I wouldn’t offer.

    4. I recently went to a low key bachelorette party (early 40s), and no one brought any of that stuff. We just all brought alcohol and fun snacks! If there are any other participants, I’d feel it out with them.

    5. Personally I haaaate all that stuff. It is junk, and I don’t want it taking up space in my house. If you were to do anything, maybe a fun themed oversized t-shirt that could also be worn as a sleep shirt or cover up. I feel like more appreciated at this age would be decent wine/booze and an easygoing/up for whatever attitude.

    7. No plastic junk. Just pay your share timely, be responsive to the organizer, and you’re good.

    9. I would much rather someone bring one or two bottles of Veuve than a bunch of random stuff.

    10. Ask the MOH/planner. If you’re driving but others are flying I would imagine you might get tapped to do more. I enjoy fun party but still useful things like tote bags, bottle stoppers/openers, fancy custom cookies.

    11. I agree with all of these comments, but they’re also making me a little bit sad — even though I have never liked themed party items. Maybe as a wink at matching outfits you might have worn in your 20s, you could bring everyone those brightly colored, inexpensive, stretchy yarn gloves to wear for walks on the beach? (I was freezing the whole time I was on the Oregon coast in August.) They’re easy to pack and reusable (or a useful donation).

      Organize a playlist by requesting that every guest share 5 songs that most remind them of the bride?

      If you’re driving and the Inn has a firepit, bring deluxe smores fixings?

    12. No comments on trinkets but I will so I’m so so jealous that you get to go to the Oregon Coast. I’m originally from the PNW and don’t get back to visit nearly enough. Oregon coast is such a uniquely special and beautiful place. Have the best time – bring waterproof shoes for a walk (as it’s mostly likely to rain for at least part of the time you are there).

    13. Oregon coast is amazing. Agree on no plastic junk. BUT there are some really beautiful temporary tattoos now – those or sheet masks or a bunch of fun nail polish to share could be a nice thing to bring and won’t take up a lot of space for anyone in luggage

  13. Soliciting travel ideas for spring break with 2 elementary age kids in April. Still waiting on passport renewal so needs to be domestic. Would love to go somewhere with reliably good weather, not FL, flying from NYC, and not crazy crowded or insanely overpriced (tough ask at this point, I know).

    3. What kinds of things do you want to be doing? The only places in the country with reliably good weather is like San Diego. Could also consider places in Arizona. Not nec good weather but depending on what you are looking for- Charleston or New Orleans could be fun

    4. Phoenix or L.A. or San Diego are all great options for elementary age kids. If you go to Phoenix, I recommend going up to Sedona and taking the pink jeep tour. In L.A., there’s the beach and Disneyland and Universal Studios. If your kids are younger, they’ll like Legoland in San Diego.

    5. We took my 5 year old to Phoenix for a long weekend last year and were surprised how much we enjoyed it and how much stuff there is to do in Phoenix-Scottsdale with kids that age. We went in January, so it was pleasant for being outdoors but not really swimming weather, but April would be much hotter.

    6. Palm Springs is great and more reliable weather-wise than most of California in the spring, especially this year.

      My kids have always loved Carlsbad and San Diego and Santa Barbara and Pismo Beach, weather permitting

    7. San Diego would be great and we’ve done it for many spring breaks. It’s not going to be reliably warm enough for beach swimming, but there’s a ton to do and the beach is fun even if you don’t spend the whole time in the water.

  14. I can’t tell anyone this in real life. I’ve commiserated with folks here before about being a high l*b*do woman married to a LL man. We’re at maybe once a month when I initiate, which means I tentatively feel out his mood to see if he’s receptive so I don’t get rejected (again). I was frustrated for a while but I’ve grown to accept it. He fills so many other needs for me, and we do cuddle a lot so I’m not touch starved, I can take care of this one thing by myself. We’ve been TTC which put even more pressure on this. I’m starting IVF this cycle so we can’t have unprotected sX. We both hate cndms I don’t think we even have any. I figured meh whatever it’s not like we’re active anyway nbd. Well of course now that we “can’t” he’s all about it, let’s just do it anyway we haven’t gotten PG all this time it’s not like it would happen now. And when I say sorry doctor’s orders, he gets pretty dejected. I know that feeling, I’ve lived it a lot.

    I’m having some complex feelings about this. This isn’t the first time I’ve left him alone about intimacy; we’ve taken it off the table completely, we’ve gone months in a row without me initiating or talking about it, it never helped. And at this point I no longer see him as a potential source of gratification in that way. He’s my cuddly guy not my throw me up against a wall guy. I have a bit of whiplash from this sudden change in attitude. And if I’m honest, it feels like a bit of a gut punch that he seems so down about this when I was dealing with those feelings for years but he was too embarrassed or prideful to really comfort me. And I’m “rejecting” him for a solid easy to identify medical reason – not some vague “idk I just don’t feel like it” that leaves me wondering if something’s wrong with me. I’ve had so much therapy about this I’m therapied out, I know I just need to have some grace with both of us during this very emotional time. Idk that I’m asking for anything but thanks for listening if you got this far.

    1. Maybe he needs therapy, to find out why he is not receptive to a willing woman but is turned on by an unwilling woman.

    2. Sorry for my ignorance, but why does IVF require you to refrain from unprotected sx? If you get pregnant unexpectedly while doing ivf treatment, isn’t that a win? Also, can you do other things besides piv to feel close and satisfy each other’s desires?

      1. Because IVF stimulates egg production and you run the risk of fertilizing many eggs simultaneously (which would end up either a very high-risk pregnancy or in miscarriage).

      2. Yes it’s standard for IVF to require no unprotected s3x. Your ovaries are hyperstimulated so the chance of getting multiples (twins, triplets or even more) is high and this is a risky outcome that most doctors want to avoid.

      3. It has to do with the timing of the meds in relation to your cycle. They usually put people on BCP but my body doesn’t tolerate the pill well and I don’t want to preemptively mess up my system before I even start the hormonal treatments.

        As far as doing other things, my efforts in the past have been pretty unsuccessful but you’re right, this might be a good time to revisit that. Thanks for the suggestion!

    3. I’d take a longer term view- PIV is off the table but that still leaves lots of stuff available. I’d explore that because if you do get pregnant – depending on how high risk you are, PIV might be off the table in the future at some point temporarily so good to explore options while he is motivated.

      1. I agree with this. We don’t do PIV every time and it’s great for me – I get all the fun (other activities work better for my pleasure) and none of the risks.

    4. big hugs from this internet stranger. if you can, you should ask him why he is suddenly in the mood, not sure if he would be open to self-introspection ?

    5. I’m wondering if, on a physical level, the change could be due to all the new/amounts of hormones? Your body could be putting out very “attractive” signals right now, which is accounting for the change in his attitude. This is in no way blaming you for the past or disagreeing that he needs to have some patience! But body chemicals are so powerful (and poorly understood) that I’m thinking this new super-ovulation situation has something to do with it (it is documented that partners are most attracted to each other during ovulation)

      1. One of my favorite studies was on strippers’ tips as a proxy for the effect of pheromones in humans. The tips were pretty consistently low for folks who were having their periods, high during ovulation for folks off hormonal BC, and flat month-round for folks on BC. The hormones are real.

    6. Dear OP, I was married to a man like this. Nothing I can say will be anything you want to hear, but it will not get better. I am in a different relationship (for 13 years now) where I feel wanted everyday. You deserve the same thing. I became numb and practically dead inside while in the situation you are in.

      I am not a therapist. What I know from lived experience is that my ex-husband used s*x withholding as control. Your husband is using both s*x withholding (when you want it) and demanding (when you can’t) as … what? Just please think and take care of yourself.

      1. I definitely appreciate this perspective, it’s taken a lot of work to get here. I don’t think it’s a control thing at all, I think he’s just very LL. I suspect the difference is that now the pressure is completely 100% off, not just, OP says it’s off the table but will she change her mind I know she’s unhappy about this. In fairness I wouldn’t be surprised if he thought I had some golden retriever energy during those months-long breaks, which is why “off the table” became necessary for me. Like I’m not going to initiate but if it seems like he’s initiating or things are moving in that direction then I’m VERY EXCITED YAY WALKIES. Which is probably not that enticing.

        1. OP, again, maybe too much in this forum, but is he really LL or using p*rn as a replacement instead (men can be very, very good at hiding this if it something not used within your personal relationship)?

          And tbf what you describe still sounds like some kind of control on his part. That’s not always as obvious as something like dominant male personality/energy. “Kind” and “good partners” who cook dinner and take out the trash without you asking can be controlling in other ways.

    7. Yup. I’d be super annoyed. I have no other advice or anything to offer, but I’d be annoyed and would probably tell him so. But…that’s how I roll.

    8. Ugh I’m sorry that sounds so frustrating! Can you talk about it at all? I know this stuff is so tricky but can you say something along the lines of “hey, I’m feeling a lot of pressure with this and there’s a solid medical reason not to do this, so I love the enthusiasm but can you save it for later?”.

      1. Yeah, if you can set aside the weirdness of his attitude – why not seize the moment and have lots of protected sx while you can?

    10. I feel you on this – my DH is also very LL, and also seems to initiate at times when I can’t possibly say yes (like when his parents are over for dinner. Or when we’re running late to catch a flight. Or, like you, mid-IVF.) I think he hates being labelled the ‘problem’ in our s e x life so he does make a point to initiate sometimes, but again, only during times when I can’t say yes so he can preserve the ability to argue that we ‘both’ say no a lot.

      I wish I had answers about why he’s like this, or what we could do to change the dynamic. He’s a very supportive partner and great dad so it’s not a DTMFA situation – but he’s got weird s e x hang-ups. Price of admission is still worth it to me but that’s a call everyone has to make for themselves.

      1. That’s manipulative. You have to take the time to talk about it, and not in the moment. He’s testing you. Don’t let it slide.

      2. When women turn down gardening, they usually just say no.

        Men have a whole variety of passive aggressive ways to do it. Make it bad for their wives/partners, initiate as she’s falling asleep, initiate when it’s nearly impossible. Biologically, it’s a situation wherein he’s guaranteed a good time, albeit quickly, and the woman is almost guaranteed a bad time.

      3. Having a LL is fine, the crappy little games where he pretends he’s initiating are not. I hope you’re calling him out on that when he pretends you “both say no a lot”. Will he do therapy?

    11. Two separate issues here. First is, he is trying to pressure into not using protections for his own pleasure at huge risk to your body and health. Explain to him why it’s so high risk to engage without protection during IVF and that it feels like a lack of care about your body and health to disregard that. It’s disrespectful and callous, even if he doesn’t intend it to be.

      Second issue is mismatch in drive. No one is entitled to gardening from another person, but a good relationship requires both people to try to meet one another’s needs. What does he need to be in the mood for gardening? Have you told him it’s important to you? I’m LL, but I take maca supplements and work to get in the mood so that I can connect with my partner, and I always wind up enjoying it. He needs to at least try, which it sounds like he isn’t. Talk to him about it.

    12. You’re in therapy, but what about counseling for him or you both? This isn’t golden retriever energy, something is wrong here where he’s LL except when he’s told that’s off the table and suddenly he’s interested. AND, critically, there’s a serious reason that you have to refrain yet he wants to roll the dice with YOUR BODY anyway.

    2. Nope, I never heard of that. It was “dress like a book character” day at my kid’s school but she’s home sick.

    4. Had to look it up and I’ve never even heard of the TV show that google says that’s from, lol.

  16. What is a good night cream or moisturizer to use at night for dry or combination skin? I use tretinoin at night so I prefer something that doesn’t include exfoliants. What is your holy grail?

    1. I’m really liking a couple of beauty pie products right now (Shinkai and Happy Face, if you’re interested) and I also use Rx tretinoin at night.

      Before Beauty Pie, I used Vanicream moisturizer, which is very plain vanilla and non-irritating. I also had good luck with Drunk Elephant Protini moisturizer at night, but it’s $$$. No exfoliants – just peptides.

      1. there’s eucalyptus in this cream and can be an irritant. i don’t have especially sensitive skin but still i couldn’t use it.

        1. I have sensitive skin and had slight stinging with the First Aid moisturizer. It went in the trash, which was too bad because I had one of those big tubs of it.

    3. I’ve been using Laneige water bank cream this winter and I really like it. It’s not specifically a night cream, but it’s fairly thick so it feels like a night cream to me.

    4. i mix my tretinoin with cerave PM if i’m feeling dry — but primarily i have switch up my daily moisturizer to be much richer. i also like that coxRX thing with snail mucin in it.

      1. I’d prefer a hydrating layer under the tretinoin, like a hyaluronic acid serum – then a heavier moisturizer like CeraVe over the tretinoin once it’s had a few minutes to set. The heavier texture of CeraVe could interfere with effectiveness of the tret.

    5. I was going to post this exactly. I am 50 and just now staring to do any routine skincare. I guess my skin is purging and irritated from glycolic acid and I now need a night cream for a bit to ease the irritation. I took a flyer and ordered Cerave and something from Mario Badescu, both of which arrive later today.

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