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Our daily workwear reports suggest one piece of work-appropriate attire in a range of prices.
I’m not ashamed to admit that I occasionally dip a toe into the reality TV world. This summer, I’m super into The Real Housewives of New York, featuring former J.Crew head honcho Jenna Lyons. In the first episode, she invites the other ladies over for a casual hang with a dress code: “black, metallic, gold or khaki” only.
I guess what I’m saying is that a classic camel turtleneck, like this silk-blend version from Ralph Lauren, is a fantastic wardrobe basic to have on hand, not only because it looks gorgeous with a wide variety of other basics, but because you never know when an oddly specific dress code might present itself, and a girl has to be prepared.
The sweater is $125 and comes in plus sizes 1X–3X, straight sizes XXS–XXL, and petite sizes XSP–LP.
Sales of note for 10.10.24
- Nordstrom – Extra 25% off clearance (through 10/14); there's a lot from reader favorites like Boss, FARM Rio, Marc Fisher LTD, AGL, and more. Plus: free 2-day shipping, and cardmembers earn 6x points per dollar (3X the points on beauty).
- Ann Taylor – Extra 50% off sale (ends 10/12)
- Banana Republic Factory – Up to 50% off everything plus extra 25% off your $125+ purchase
- Boden – 10% off new styles with code; free shipping over $75
- Eloquii – Extra 50% off a lot of sale items, with code
- J.Crew – 40% off sitewide
- J.Crew Factory – 50% off entire site, plus extra 25% off orders $150+
- Lo & Sons – Fall Sale, up to 35% off
- M.M.LaFleur – Save 25% sitewide
- Neiman Marcus – Sale on sale, up to 85% off
- Spanx – Lots of workwear on sale, some up to 70% off
- Talbots – 50% off 2+ markdowns
- Target – Circle week, deals on 1000s of items
- White House Black Market – Buy one, get one – 50% off full price styles
Eye Advice
The skin right at the outside corner of both eyes has become a little irritated and hurts a bit to rub. Been going on for maybe 2 to 3 weeks. No change in any product that touches skin or hair, so don’t think it is related to irritation from a new product.
Normal sign of aging or something I need to look into (hitting my mid 60’s)? Feels too minor to book a derm about (and they are so hard to get into) – anyone have an idea?
Anon
Allergies?
Once in a while I get what seems to be a yeast-like reaction right around my eyes, on the waterline and in the corners. My PCP gave me the okay to use OTC anti-fungal cream there and that knocks it down within a day or two. I only put it on at night, though, because while it does not irritate my eyes it does make them feel a little filmy.
Anonymous
I usually get this in the winter, I think it’s from some combination of temperature change, dry heat indoors, cold outdoors, sweating at night, and probably a dozen things I’m not thinking of. I’m really not sure of the exact cause, though. When I first start noticing it, I slap on a ton of eye cream at night, but if it’s already red and cracked then I’d put a bit of neosporin on it to prevent infection.
Anon
It may just be some dry skin or skin that is thinner now (definitely part of the aging process) that is becoming more easily irritated. I’d slap some Aquaphor on it for a few nights to see if that made any difference. But if your skin is becoming thinner, some of your products may be too much for your skin now even if they weren’t in the past.
Anne-on
+1 to this – aquaphor and then making sure your retinols/acids didn’t get too close to your eyes by accident. Making sure your pillowcase/washcloths/towels are washed in fragrance free detergents without bleach may also help.
Anon
Also read a little about blepharitis, which becomes more common as we get older. If you notice it spreads and certainly if your eye gets more involved see your eye doctor.
Try some warm compresses, and I like the idea of a touch of aquafor.
Anon
I often see “love languages” referenced on this page as part of relationship advice. I didn’t realize until yesterday that the book was written by a pastor without any therapy background, and the “physical touch” language was included to justify women providing s3x when they might not want to. Am I the last person on earth to learn this fact?? Oh and the author is an anti-LGBTQ bigot.
Anon
You would be shocked at how much evangelical marriage advice is aimed at getting women to provide s-x, even if it isn’t any good for them or they do t want to, and not at husbands learning to make it good for their wives.
Anon
+ a million. In fact, sex is something women shouldn’t really enjoy but just give to their husband as a sacrifice. If she enjoys it, there’s something wrong with her.
Anonymous
Sources? I’m not surprised at the anti LGBTQ – but I am surprised at the physical touch piece. I read the book ages ago and recall the vast majority was focused on non-s*- touching, like a hand squeeze or sitting close when next to one another on a couch.
Anonymous
That was my understanding of physical touch too. Some people are really touchy feely people and some people are really… not. If you are a touchy person then it’s hard to understand why someone wouldn’t want closeness and it’s very hurtful when your partner recoils from your hugs. If you’re not a touchy person it’s hard to understand why someone would like to be smothered and you get the ick when you feel like your partner is always pawing at you. I understood “physical touch” to be helpful at identifying these very different perspectives without assigning blame or hurt feelings to something that’s just intrinsic to each individual.
Sunshine
DH is a huge cuddler with a not very high gardening drive. Non-gardening physical touch is far and away what I can do for him to make him feel loved. I haven’t read the book so I don’t know what the aim of the book is. But my personal experience shows gardening and physical touch are not the same for some people when it comes to feeling loved.
anon
I’m aware that it was written from a religious perspective. Outside of that, I think the concept is still valid. I think there are certain actions that make an individual person feel loved/appreciated I’m definitely an “acts of service” person. I don’t care about physical touch or gift giving.
Cat
I was aware, but the general concept – that people have preferred ways of showing and receiving affection – seems to resonate with many as having truth to it regardless of the untrained source.
AIMS
This. I don’t really read self help books because I find them super repetitive but I appreciate the general concept you can glean from some of them (children behave better when you set standards, have your cake and cheese but limit portion size, etc.) and this always struck me as a useful shorthand for the very obvious fact that people have different ways of communicating and showing affection and we should not assume that because we show affection in X way, everyone else is exactly the same.
And all sorts of odious people can have good ideas. You don’t need to throw out the baby with the bath water.
Cerulean
Nearly every self-help book should be a pamphlet.
Winter
Truly!
Cora
I’ve taken the concept and run with it. Fundamentally, I agree that people have different ways in which they show they love others and in which they feel loved. For my family, its spending a lot of time together. The joke about “asian parents cutting fruit” is a love language. Dad reminding you 10X to get new winter tires is his way of showing love.
I think its helpful to identify how people are showing their love especially if its different from what you would do. I don’t think it only applies to romantic relationships at all, I think its relevant everywhere. There are so many situations where people don’t understand how someone else feels because it is expressed in a different way.
Anon
I was aware of that. I don’t have a problem taking the parts that make sense to me and work for my relationships and rejecting the parts I disagree with.
BeenThatGuy
This. And frankly, I do this with the bible too.
No Face
This is my approach to all kinds of ideas and it serves me well.
anon
Agreed.
Also, honestly, on s*x – as a now long-married woman, there have been many occasions when I wasn’t particularly interested in it (just disinterested at that moment – vs actively not wanting it) and my husband has initiated. My general philosophy is to go along with it unless I am actively not wanting it, because it is an important way of showing and feeling love for him, and I virtually always really enjoy it and am happy that I did so. Based on conversations (here and IRL) that is really common, and in my view, not unhealthy.
(I have been in a relationship – before my husband – where I felt like I had to go along when I actively didn’t want to, because I didn’t feel I could say no, and that is different and was NOT good.)
Anonymous
Right, and my husband actually puts a lot of emphasis on making it good for me, so it’s not a him problem. I just don’t want it a lot of the time (ugh) but I can’t let that part of our relationship go. And I often end up feeling good about it afterwards. Btw, t his may shock you, but we’re both strong Christians.
Anon
Eh, not my experience and that of several of my friends. It isn’t a spontaneous/responsive desire issue; it’s a “the s*x is bad and unfulfilling for the wife” issue.
Anon
Genuinely curious, how does one wind up married to a person where the “the s*x is bad and unfulfilling for the wife”? S*x is super important for me and I married someone who fulfills me. That was a choice. There were plenty that didn’t and the relationship(s) ended.
Anon
Same. I’ve never read the book and wouldn’t, but the ideas have been valuable to me.
Anon
My favorite thing is people bashing books they’ve never read.
Anon
*your love language
bird in flight
I just learned about this background from a podcast (We Can Do Hard Things Epi 151) a couple months ago! I was surprised too since I see it referenced and recommended quite a bit. That podcast does a quite good job of discussing the book/background and then takes the idea beyond the original to a more useful place.
Anon
FWIW, I don’t think the *book* gets recommended a lot, but the ideas do.
bird in flight
good point – you’re right.
Senior Attorney
There’s also a good episode about the book on the Podcase If Books Could Kill.
Senior Attorney
PodcasT.
anon
It’s a useful framework to begin the discussion on how you interact with people. Much like Encanto is a stepping stone for talking about generational trauma. Neither is a textbook on relationships, but rather something accessible that gets people talking. Perfect, no. Good enough, yes.
Anon
A lot of society goes by “the golden rule” (do unto others as you would have them do unto you) without recognizing that people are wildly different from each other. This is just one form of pushback to the idea that “if you would appreciate something, someone else will too.” It doesn’t surprise me that this would be especially needed in conformist evangelical culture.
AIMS
I think the golden rule is less about doing what you would appreciate, and much more about NOT doing what you wouldn’t.
No Face
I always heard the golden rule as “treat others the way you want to be treated.”
Anonymous
Yes, that’s the traditional definition. But really, it should be “treat others the way that *they* want to be treated”.
Anon
It really means don’t be an asshole.
Anon
From a Christian perspective, the golden rule comes from Matthew 7:12, “In everything, do to others what you would have them do to you,” or from Mark 12:30-31, “Love the Lord your God with all your heart and all your soul and all your mind and all your strength. The second is this: love your neighbour as yourself.”
If you take the Matthew verse too literally, you would end up with people treating each other poorly. Let’s say that Barbie loves peanut butter and Ken is allergic to it. Would Barbie give Ken a Reese’s PB cup because she would be delighted to receive Reese’s? The problem with that is obvious; she wouldn’t want to receive food that she’s allergic to.
The more appropriate level of abstraction, then, is “give Ken food that he enjoys,” not “give Ken food that Barbie enjoys.” This also aligns with the Luke verse – you wouldn’t give yourself food that you’re allergic to (hopefully), so you shouldn’t give someone else food they are allergic to.
AIMS
Yes, but I can’t know everything you would want whereas I can reasonably predict most big things that you would not want. So yes, don’t be an a**hole is basically the gist of it. Whether or not you want text messages throughout the day is a matter of communication and it’s helpful to have something that reminds people that just because you think text messages throughout the day are crucial doesn’t mean that someone who doesn’t know that and doesn’t text message a lot just doesn’t care. I don’t see how this is a pushback against the golden rule but maybe other people are taking the golden rule in ways that I am just not.
Anon
I didn’t really mean to start a debate on interpreting the gospel of Luke, but I assume Jesus could have said “don’t do unto others what you would not have them do unto you” if he had wanted!
Explorette
I learned by reading that book that my love language is physical touch, and it has nothing to do with gardening. That chapter certainly does not read as pressuring women to garden with their husbands even though they don’t want to. I might not agree with the authors personal values, but that book was really helpful for me to figure out what I need.
eertmeert
As it is so often, the text is different from a second or third hand interpretation.
Anon
Try reading the book. The ideas in it are useful. As others have mentioned, the physical touch chapter makes it clear that it’s not talking just about s*x.
Anon
We’ve had some gift terrorists on here lately, I’m sure there are people who use their love language of touch in the same way – you must accept my love language!!
Anonymous
yikes – did not know that. it’s spoken of as if it’s the gospel here.
Anon from last week
I’m the anon who was questioning when it’s time to leave the firm recently. Thanks to everyone who gave their wisdom. You are right: It’s time. I am now planning my exit strategy, and I have a new opportunity waiting that makes me feel excited about my career for the first time in way too long.
Now: Any advice for planning an exit? I’m a partner in a small firm, so it’s going to be hard on everyone. Not because I’m that important, but just because I’m leaving a bigger share of overhead for everyone else to absorb. I feel bad about it, but I’m finally accepting that I can’t make that my problem. I can give all the notice they need — my new job will wait. But now that I’m mentally out, I need to wind it down. I have a handful of cases I need to resolve because they’ll be conflicts with my new spot. I have a few clients I want to take with me, most of which I don’t think the firm will mind because no one here has the time or expertise to handle them anyway. A couple I think will cause some consternation. If you’ve been through this, any advice on when to tell what to whom? Do I have The Talk with key clients first, or is it right to tell my partners I’m leaving first? I’m looking out for me here, but I also want to treat my partners right. I wish them well, and it’s too small a town for bad blood.
Anon
I don’t have advice on your exit, but congratulations on finding a new opportunity!
Anonymous
Check your ethics rules on how to exit. And your partnership agreement.
bird in flight
I can’t give advice specific to the law firm + clients side, but on all the notice – my husband left a company he was in a leadership role for and allowed a very long leave time (like a year, it was dumb) and that was a bad idea. Decide exactly how much you are willing to give them and when your last day will be, and tell them that when you tell your partners. Do not leave it open ended or for your partners to decide.
Anon
+1, and anything over a month is problematic, in my small firm experience. You will still be assigned new matters because there isn’t bandwidth to give it elsewhere, and your soon to be former partners/associates will resent you anyway bc they know they’ll still have to pick it up when you leave. You need to leave exactly enough time to wind down matters, period. Two weeks feels fast (bc we all know how quickly two weeks goes when you are just chugging along), but is generally enough time to rip the transition band aid off.
anon
Don’t talk to key clients first unless you want to potentially lose your license. Time to brush up on the ethical rules about leaving a law partnership.
Anon
This.
Anonymous
Right. Note that this rule mostly applies to women and partners with smaller books. The big swinging dick*s absolutely do this but you really can’t.
Anon from last week
So at least in my state, there’s no hard line rule about this. There’s a recent formal ethics opinion saying the client needs to be notified, but both the firm and the departing lawyer have the right (and obligation) to notify them, ideally jointly or at least close in time, but there’s no rule against one or the other getting the notice out first. The client has to be given the choice of going with the lawyer, staying with the firm, or finding someone else.
Trixie
Don’t give too much notice–in my experience, it backfires. Give the amount of notice that is typical to your firm, having done your own homework to leave memos etc. as needed. Then, just go.
Anonymous
I would not have been able to continue to work on a client if I would be in a conflict in my new role. Be very careful. Consult a lawyer with appropriate expertise if this is not your field.
Anon
Banana Republic used to sell a cotton/silk blend crewneck sweater every year. They are total workhorses in my closet, I probably have 10 of them, but they’re looking extremely worn and pilled and BR doesn’t seem to make them anymore. Does anyone have a recommendation for a good alternative that does not contain any wool and fits up to size 16/18? 100% cotton is fine too.
Anon
J Crew Factory has a cotton/modal crewneck with a slight puff sleeve right now. The price point is excellent too.
Anon
I feel like BR may have “drops” starting after Labor Day that include items like this. It’s worth a few rechecks. I’m doing that now for another beloved item.
Emma
I don’t know any dupes, but I also have a ton of those sweaters from back when I worked in a semi-formal office, they were a great mix of comfortable and polished with nice pants or a skirt, and even under a jacket in cold weather. Mine are also super worn (and realistically too small post-baby). I don’t really have a need for them in this season of life, but they were great and I’m sad BR doesn’t make them anymore.
Anon
Sadly all of BR’s sweaters now seem to be ridiculously overpriced merino wool or cashmere!
Cat
Check Quince?
anon
I miss these so much. They worked so well, and the ones I have are looking worn out (and too small).
Anne-on
Brooks Brothers and LLBean both have all cotton sweaters or Brooks Brothers has a silk/cashmere blend shawl collar sweater that I adore and have in multiple colors (size up, it’s a bit fitted).
TheElms
Jcrew factory has one (called the Teddie) that is currently sold out in most sizes and colors but they have restocked in the past so I hope they do this fall.
Anon
It might still be too early for sweaters (or for the full line of sweaters) to be released.
texasanon
I am wearing one of these sweaters right now to my office which is kept cold enough to comfortably house arctic animals. I really hope BR brings a few colors out in the fall.
South american girl
Intimissimi, the Italian lingerie brand, has this constantly on sale.
Anon
I bet you could find a few of the BR ones on Poshmark.
Anonymous
I’m a young partner at a small law firm. Structure is very eat what you kill. For the first year since I made partner, I am absolutely crushing my revenue goals. It has taken a major toll on my body and time with family. I plan to wrap up 3 major projects by the end of September. I should have exceeded all required and goal-level numbers by that time. Is it a bad idea to take 2-4 weeks off or “easy”? I’m thinking, work mornings three days a week to delegate actual client emergencies, but otherwise, catch up at home, read books, visit my grandma for a day, type of October.
Anon
This is the advantage of that model. I’d do it without a second thought. The work will be there when you dive back in.
Anon
Absolutely do it.
Anonymous
Do it but don’t tell anyone at work.
Senior Attorney
+1
Anonymous
Do it. No need to tell anyone that’s what you are doing.
Anon
+1
Enjoy. Well done!
Anon
Do it and tell no one (other than your mentees when they make partner)
Anon
I have an elbow area hood in a workhorse cashmere cardigan. Do people patch them with elbow patches or is that for tweed blazers and just done as costumes in the movies for “professor” vs IRL? If done well IRl, please send me good sources for patches. Sweater is camel-colored. I tried to mend and did a poor but permanent job.
IL
That kind of hole is hard to fix, and expensive. The loose threads need to be tied off under the patch or the whole thing will unravel. I know this place specializes in it: https://www.withoutatrace.com/
My understanding is that the patches you see aren’t to fix holes but to prevent them from forming by offering a more durable surface at the point where wear accumulates when you lean on your elbows. I think by the time the hole has formed it’s too late.
Anonymous
Thank you for this recommendation! I live in the burbs and inherited a beautiful cashmere coat with a small hole in it. This will add years of use to it.
Anon
Elbow area HOLE. Sheesh.
ALT
You can take it to a reweaver to see if they can fix the hole or you can try darning it yourself (“visible mending” is the catchy term for this at the moment, specifically using contrasting colored fibers but same principle).
I take knits to my local reweaver all the time and it’s fairly reasonable cost-wise.
Anon
I would take it to a tailor/seamstress – I had a hole repaired in a cashmere sweater once. It wasn’t perfect, but you couldn’t tell if you didn’t look too closely.
Anon
I knit and love fixing this sort of thing. If you can find the right color and weight of yarn, the mend will be invisible. It isn’t difficult but depending on how big the hole is it can be time consuming and tedious.
If the hole is caused by wear and not a snag, you probably want to reinforce the other elbow at the same time before it develops a hole.
Anon
Also a knitter and agree. I can’t imagine a cashmere cardigan sturdy enough to support an elbow patch. “Reweaving” or actually re-knitting is the way to go.
Anon
I kind of like the elbow patch look and think that cognac-colored leather patches would look nice on a camel cardigan. But it would depend on the cardigan’s structure – patches would look better on a thicker, sturdier piece than a light or flowy one.
Cat
+1, but also consider the effect of a leather patch on cleaning. My dry cleaners charges extra for leather (all of them have) – less important for an infrequent item like a jacket but for a sweater…
Anon
One option people haven’t mentioned yet is needle felting, which will create a firmer patch around the area and turn the stretchy knit into a felted patch, but it’s very durable and will lock the unraveled threads into the felt so they can never come undone. I’ve done this with contrasting and matching colors and it gets pretty good results! Easy enough to DIY as long as you don’t stab yourself with a felting needle.
Office Shoes
I have a drawer at work of office shoes (heels and flats). It’s a hot mess. Has anyone found any organizer that brought order to chaos.
Anon
I just have a regular ol bamboo shoe rack under my desk.
H13
Looking for resources in the Loveland, CO area. A family member needs a care coordinator or medical advocate. Any leads or ideas for resources?
parents
To start, call the local Department of Aging for the County.
https://www.larimer.gov/humanservices/aging/ooa
Tell them you have an elderly relative that lives in Loveland and you want to explore the resources available to them. In our area, they send a social worker out to meet with your family member and figure out everything they qualify for. Can be things like subsidized rides to medical appointments, meals on wheels, assistance in the home for cleaning…
You can try asking them for information about Care Coordinators that have a good reputation in their area. I would look for someone who has previously been a nurse and has medical experience, but some may be social workers and some will have no formal training. Unfortunately, the government offices are often terrible sources of referrals. They just send you “lists”, which are often outdated, and they wont tell you the good/bad people for concerns about liability. Sometimes you can say…. “If this was your mother, who would you call….”, but only rarely did I get a good recommendations. Sometimes you can try calling local (nice) independent/assisted living facilities, pretend like you are gathering info for your loved one in case they want to move in )!), and ask their head customer service person if they know of any good care coordinators that can help with these difficult “transition periods”.
Are you looking for someone who can essentially keep track of all appointments/go to appointments/take notes of doctor’s recs/coordinate medicine changes and care etc… ? This is incredibly difficult to find, to get a good quality reliable person, and very expensive if you do. You may have more luck if you loved one is pretty healthy/independent, and doesn’t need a lot of care. Or is cognitively intact and just needs assistance due to mobility issues. I was never able to find someone who could provide everything we needed for my parent, so I ultimately moved closer to them to assist.
In the end, it is almost always family that must step in to this role. But it certainly is worth a try.
If you get referrals for care coordinators, read up on their websites (although many wont have websites), “interview” them on the phone, and ask to speak to references if possible – other families they have worked with.
Ideally, set this up when you are there in person, so you can meet the Dept of Aging person and the Care Coordinator you try to hire in person.
Good luck.
H13
Thank you so much for this. The family member is in her 50s so not elderly but can’t drive and needs assistance medication management, doctor’s visits, coordination between doctor visits, household help, etc. Far from family so we are trying to find a workable solution. I really appreciate your response!
Anon
Of course. Considering your family members needs, I would strongly recommend looking at assisted living places. Even if financially that seems hard, sometimes in smaller towns/rural areas, they are more affordable and some states even have financial assistance if you are disabled/low income. If they need all this help in their 50s, it sounds like they have a disability and/or significant limitations that could really use more daily help. And if you think that their disability is requiring all of this assistance, you may want to look into applying for social security disability benefits if that is needed. Could also be something to ask the Department of Aging about. 50s is a little young for the Department of Aging, but they will know where to refer you.
Anon
Curious if any of you have sterling flatware/china/crystal that you either inherited or purchased? If so, what are the patterns and do you use it?
I have my grandmother’s Reed & Barton Francis the First silverware and blue willow dishes. If I could, I’d trade it for Giorgio pattern by Wallace.Sold the Spode china that belonged to her because it was a pattern I found unappealing with a gold rim.
Most of my peers have more modern dishes like East Fork, but I suppose I like the slightly fussy old-fashioned look?
As an aside, besides sentimental value, are there really any physical objects (furniture, jewelry, china/flatware) that have significant monetary value anymore or are they mostly destined for Goodwill?
Anne-on
Much to the dismay of my boomer parents very little of the mass produced furniture/china/glassware they bought from department stores or local places is truly ‘heirloom quality’. If your parents filled the house with Stickley, Moser, Eames, etc. furniture or true antiques then they (and you) will likely be able to resell them for a profit. You’d also (likely) know it’s valuable – families who buy antiques/expensive art/heirloom pottery tend to talk about their finds and educate their kids in what quality looks like. Ditto for jewelry – even if the pieces aren’t to your style high quality gold/stones will hold value and you can expect to recoup some money there.
Anonymous
OMG so true. I am your parent. Nobody wants high quality beautifully made brown (i.e. stained wood) furniture. Solid wood, no particle board on any drawer or the back, hand made sometimes, antique, all unwanted. It’s shocking to this old boomer. You either hope to get rid of it for free on Facebook or pay to have it taken away.
anon
I have a holiday set of plates from my grandmother that we ate holiday meals on at her house. I use them for when I host the holidays. A side benefit as they are from the 1940s is that it is nearly impossible to eat yourself silly at Thanksgiving on the smaller sized dinner plates – full yes, but not beached on the sofa. My husband would say the other benefit is that everything needs to be hand washed so he can hide in the kitchen for a good hour and recharge his introvert batteries. We also have some silver from my husband’s side that I mean to use but never do.
Anon
Probably to the dismay of many, I put fine china and real silver in the dishwasher and have converted it all to every day use. I like using pretty things. This doesn’t help your husband though!
anon
I’m the anon above – grandma put those plates in the dishwasher for years. Hubs is steadfast in his kitchen hiding time.
Anon
My inherited silver also goes in the dishwasher. My grandmother is dead. What she doesn’t know won’t hurt her.
Emma
I do this too. They don’t go in the dishwasher because they are gold plated, but they make a holiday table look nice and special. And as a fellow introvert, being able to retreat into the kitchen to wash the fancy china is the best! But they wouldn’t work for everyday use. It’s a Limoges porcelain set that was a wedding gift to my grandparents in 1958 and they look brand new.
Anon
I love Francis I. I inherited Chantilly place setting but bought Francis I serving pieces. When I was single I used it daily. My spouse / kids put so many spoons in the garbage disposal that now I used just for special times. But I do use it. I don’t have china though — my life needs plates to go in the microwave and dishwasher.
Anon
I use China as my everyday plates because it was cheaper to buy China at goodwill than even the basic plates at IKEA.
I have my grandmother’s China (currently in my parents’ attic) and will eventually inherit my other grandmother’s silver (currently inherited by and used by my parents; my parents also have their own silver and my other grandparents’ silver but it’s all engraved with our last initial so my brother will get that (and our parents’ China) eventually).
None of this has any monetary value anymore, Goodwill is literally over run with it.
I plan on using my grandmothers’ stuff regularly in the future; it’s sentimental and what’s the purpose of having this stuff if we don’t use it?
Parents use the silver pretty often but still only use China or crystal for special occasions. It’s because the silver can go in the dishwasher but the China and crystal cannot. Purely utilitarian reasons.
We also have my great grandmother’s China dessert plates. Over 100 years old. Used every time my mom serves dessert (so holidays, birthdays , and dinner parties; not used for dessert on a normal night). Some people can’t believe she uses it so regularly but what’s the point of storing it if you dont use ut?
Anon
I love fussy old china, especially floral patterns. I’d use it exclusively if I wasn’t worried about lead poisoning. I have some mix and match from a local resale shop but I rarely actually use it.
Anon
I don’t think there’s lead in anything relatively recent, like 1920s on, I’d use it!
Anonymous
This is not true! Definitely research what you are eating off of
Anon
Eh, if it’s chipped or cracked or the glaze isn’t holding up, don’t use it. Otherwise it’s fine.
Seventh Sister
My grandmother had the fussiest, most floral Noritake china that just makes me sad to look at – she loved it so much, it was probably the most expensive thing she ever owned, and it is SO unattractive to me. I’m glad somebody loves this stuff, because my GenX self just can’t get into it.
Cerulean
I’m definitely way more into this stuff than I think most millennials. I don’t thing any of it will have much value in the future unless you’re lucky to get something truly rare and sought after, although sterling will at least have value in the silver itself. That doesn’t bother me, I get what I like and *use it* without caring about the possibility of resale. I don’t want a display collection and I don’t buy more than we actually use.
I have a set of 1950s china that I scored at an estate sale for $100. I love it because it’s clearly vintage by the proportions, but isn’t at all fussy (no florals for me, thank you!). It’s a soft blue with a platinum rim and very simple lines. I use it for holidays and formal dinners a few times per year. Our everyday dishes are plain white bone china, which I like because it’s easy to match with different serving pieces (mostly vintage and vacation finds) and is durable without being too heavy. I will likely get our family’s sterling flatware set one day and it’s super ornate. It’s a cool piece of family history since it’s been in the family for around 100 years, but I probably won’t use it much.
My in-laws accumulated a lot of collectible china, figurines, and ornate furniture thinking they would be able to get good money for all of it one day and were shocked when they tried to sell some while downsizing last year. None of their children want it– it’s all huge, heavy, dark furniture and things like Hummels and fussy china and crystal.
ALT
We are kindred spirits!
Anon
I don’t know about significant monetary value, but they are still collectors items so they go to Replacements (if it’s dinnerware). If you’re asking about furniture produced today, I think a lot of people are spending a lot less than our grandparents did on their lasting value pieces?
Anon
Anecdotally, my Macys couches were around 10 years old and not holding up well. Last year my mother moved out of her house and I took her 50 year old living room couches that had been lightly used (we were allowed to sit on them growing up, but the living room didn’t get much use compared to the family room). We’re using them fully in my house and I can really feel the difference in sturdiness between 1970s furniture and 2010s.
anonshmanon
I think you’re right. Lower quality for lower prices is much more conducive to making home wares a question of trends, and calling 10 year old kitchens dated. If you try to resist the fashion argument, they get you on the fact that the cabinets are falling apart!
Anonymous
Good point – planned obsolescence
Anonymous
I looked into purchasing Francis 1 and it was not cheap! I love it and my house is otherwise modern Scandinavian minimalist but it’s so beautiful just use it and enjoy.
Anon
I have a set of silverware from DH’s grandma and the wooden box is just the right height to elevate the computer monitor in our WFH office. I hate the tarnished patina silver gets if you dishwasher it and have no interest in handwashing them, so they live in that box under the monitor. I have no idea what brand or pattern they are. Very art-deco style and definitely not something I would pick out myself. DH has no memories of his family using them. They got dumped on him when grandma moved to a home. We felt bad about just dropping them at Goodwill so at least the box is of use to us now.
Anon
Silver only tarnishes in the dishwasher if it’s washed with flatware. If it’s all silver it’s fine in the dishwasher.
Anon
That’s a big Midwest yeah, no. I am definitely not running an extra dishwasher load just for silver flatware.
Anon
That’s not the takeaway. The lesson is get more silver to fill up a load. Serving trays, pitchers, etc. ;)
Anon
Anon at 10:54 here. Let me clarify: you can wash plates, bowls, platters, cups, mugs etc in the dishwasher with the silver. It doesn’t need to be its own load. Just don’t mix silver and flatware.
We don’t do a separate flatware load either. We only use the silver when we’re hosting so there’s plenty to fill the dishwasher. Leave the flatware (which if we’re using silver we usually don’t have any flatware to wash, but if we do) in the sink, load it into the dishwasher for the next load (which if we’re hosting might very well be later that night, or the next day).
Anon
Why is that? I had originally heard not to b/c of something in the dishwasher detergent. I wasn’t sure of the chemistry of this or of what interacts between sterling silver and stainless steel (b/c if I handwash, do I also need to separate)? I need a chemistry tutorial or something here.
Also, to complicate things, some of my serving pieces I think have stainless knives and a sterling handle (some knives, a pie server).
Anon
I don’t know why, but my family has been doing this for generations, my entire extended family does it, and none of us have had issues.
Nudibranch
I don’t know why, but it works. We do it too.
Anonymous
I use silver serving trays all the time. I bring my silver service to wineries when a pregnant friend is joining us so I can serve her tea out of and into something pretty. We go to a couple of picnics in the spring/summer, some with a little competition for the best setup, and I love to break out the silver and china and crystal and such (I’ve never won the competition fwiw).
I inherited a ton of Rose Medallion but I feel a little uncomfortable using it, I’m concerned someone might see it as problematic.
Anon
Doesn’t seem problematic to me
Senior Attorney
I can see why you might think that (I might feel the same), but oh my Lord it is so beautiful!
Anon
Wait why would it be problematic?
Anon
I think Chinoiserie sometimes gets lumped in with colonialist/imperialist decor depicting subjugated people?
I honestly don’t know whether that’s fair or whether it’s associated with the “century of humiliation” or anything like that by anyone! I’ve read that it was designed for export, but I don’t know if it was exclusively for export. I’ve read that it depicts fantasy landscapes and not any real time or place, which seems really different from the “British surveying their conquests” genre of art to me.
It’s really beautiful, but I can see feeling awkward about the pieces that specifically have people on them. As a white person, I am not always sure that whitewashing is the right answer though (it would also seem awkward in another way if I exclusively had white people style decors and depictions of only white people around my home!).
Anonymous
We have my mom’s silver, and some glasses from my grandmother, that we pair with our early 90s wedding china. It gets used a couple of times a month, when we have people over. We hand wash the silver but everything else goes in the dishwasher on the china setting.
Anonymous
I have a set that I got for my wedding. It’s a basic Lenox pattern (white with a silver band). I have young kids so we don’t use it all the time but we use it any time we have houseguests/large gatherings.
I also have my grandmothers 1930s china and crystal and silverware which comes out on holidays. Between my set and hers I have dishes for 24 which is about what I need.
Anon
Antiques will come back into fashion at some point. Since a lot of people are sh!tting on that style at the moment it’s a great time to buy. Meanwhile, those who don’t chase trends may well be happily living with inherited or purchase antique furniture and eating off of inherited or purchased china, silver flatware, and crystal. I happen to love what Julia Reed referred to as “big, brown furniture” and have happily accepted family antique pieces that others turned their nose up at.
I have both grandmothers’ china and my mother’s best china and second best china, as well as her sterling silver. Also have my mother’s and one grandmother’s crystal. I’ve purchased silver plate place settings at bargain basement prices for everyday use. I kitted out my vacation property kitchen with one set of the grandmother’s china and my mother’s sterling flatware and crystal, and use them daily when I’m there. It wasn’t to be fancy but just because it’s what I had and I didn’t have to spend anything. And I like it.
Cerulean
I think a lot of the “big, brown” furniture people refer to isn’t antique, it’s mid-range 1990s and early 2000s stuff trying to look antique.
Anne-on
Or mid-range 1980s. My parents have a ton of large brown furniture that is solid but definitely not ‘antique’ quality – think Broyhill/Lee/Ashley back when it was more solidly made. I’d happily take it if I was younger and furnishing from scratch but I don’t need or want it now that I have my own furniture and it isn’t really ‘heirloom quality’ stuff.
Anon
We have a lot of actually antique (80-120 years old) big brown furniture in my family. It’s not my style but I still keep some for sentiment!
Anon at 11:02
What Julia Reed was referring to as big, brown furniture is moderate to fine antiques, not reproduction, made of dark wood, and large enough to have a certain presence.
Anonymous
Antiques are in style enough that the prices have soared over the last decade, even for the mid-range early to mid 20th century stuff…
Anonymous
My dishes are an iconic french set from the 80s which I carefully hunted down on FB marketplace. I’m not really into fussy china, but I do like intentionally designed items. Most of my furniture is real antiques because I just can’t with pressboard/MDF etc. I want solid wood.
ALT
I have a set of brass flatware from my grandparents that I use for special occasions. It’s really unique and special to me, and it has classic MCM clean lines so it doesn’t look fussy. I’m sure the monetary value is minimal but the sentimental value is priceless.
I am working on collecting vintage china as well. My preferred style is Johnson Brothers Athena but I do love a fancier floral pattern to mix with my modern plain white dishes. My mom has multiple sets of china and I am prepared that I will be the child who inherits all of them…and I am looking forward to it!
Anonymous
I bought an early 20th century Limoges dish set about a decade ago that doesn’t get as much use as I’d like, as well as an inherited silver flatware set that also doesn’t see much use.
On top of that, we buy most of our furniture second-hand because we prefer solid wood. My dining room furniture was made in the 30’s.
texasanon
I am the only girl on my mother’s side from her 2 siblings and from all the kids and grandkids from my grandparent’s combined 5 siblings so I am inheriting 3 sets of sterling and 9 china including some holiday china and an absolute ton of crystal and glassware.
I have one set of sterling, 2 sets of china and a set and a half of crystal so far. I use the crystal daily, even just as water glasses.
None of my cousins are interesting in any of it so it is all coming to me. I know I like 1 or 2 sets a lot but most will have to be sold/given away because it would take over my whole house if I kept it all.
Anon
Oh wow! Fun. What patterns?
Gail the Goldfish
The local antique store was selling what I swear is the same twist-leg side table I inherited from my grandmother for like $800, so yes, some of it has monetary value. We have some holiday china we got from an aunt that was downsizing and another set (I don’t know the pattern) we bought from a neighbor for super cheap as they were also downsizing. We use it on special occasions because it’s handwash. Though I’m tempted to throw the set from the neighbor in the dishwasher because I think it might be fine (the christmas set has a metallic rim and I know the dishwasher will ruin that).
Senior Attorney
I love this topic!!
We have SO MUCH of this stuff:
My mom’s Rosenthal Moss Rose china from her wedding
My mom’s Towle Rambler Rose sterling silver from her wedding
My Fitz & Floyd Classique d’Or china from my first wedding
My Tuttle Beauvoir sterling silver from my first wedding
Hubby’s Noritake Marywood china from his first wedding
Hubby’s Wallace Sonata silver plate flatware from his first wedding
An antique set of Eastern European transferware that I got at an antique store during my first marriage (looks similar to this https://www.replacements.com/china-jyoto-jyo2-dinner-plate/p/8214351? )
Set of 80s Christmas plates and glasses that we take out every year and use for the whole month of December
Small set of Fitz & Floyd Christmas Holly china that we use for parties during the holidays
My mom’s set of Fostoria crystal dessert plates
My mom’s Fostoria punch bowl and matching punch cups (these featured prominently in many a baby and bridal shower when I was growing up!)
Various Fostoria serving pieces and candlesticks from my mom and my first mother-in-law
We use it all regularly for entertaining and especially like to mix and match. And we put it all in the dishwasher. We also have several sets of more modern dishes (white Fiestaware, black Magnolia from Target, a few sets of 4 random pattern everyday plates) that are in everyday rotation.
As to your second question, at this point I think the only value any of the above has is the actual metal value of the sterling silver. We do happen to have a few pieces of Eames and Stickley furniture that we are hoping will hold its value but we are not holding our breath. (My daugher is a psychotherapist and we joke that whe we’re gone the two black Eames lounge chairs will be for her clients, and the white one will be for her.)
ALT
Can you write me into your will for some of these?! Amazing
Anonymous
Amazing, I want all of your entertaining tips if you are entertaining this often!
Senior Attorney
Biggest tip: Keep the menu simple. You don’t need fancy appetizers. These days I am basically down to one small dish each of roasted almonds, some kind of “bar trash” (mixed crackers or whatever), and wasabi peas. It’s fun to have a special signature cocktail for the evening and I’ll often make a big pitcher of whatever it is before the guests arrive. It’s also fun to have a theme for the whole evening: Greek night, movie night, pizza night, or whatever. We even had our book club dinner meeting once to discuss “The Day the World Came to Town” (about the 9/11 airplane landings in Newfoundland) and had a theme with airplane snacks (including mini liquor bottles) and Canadian food and it was super fun.
Generally do the plating in the kitchen. Serving plates clutter up the dinner table and increase the risk of spills, also increase the risk of running out of food before you run out of guests. If I want to be less formal, I will set up a buffet on the island in the kitchen and let people serve themselves (we’ve done this on Thanksgiving and it works well). And again, keep the food as simple as possible and try to avoid any last-minute preparation beyond tossing the salad. You don’t need as many courses as you think. As long as the plate looks pretty and there is a protein and a starch and something green/orange/purple that was once growing in the ground, you’re good to go.
Senior Attorney
Ugh hate that a certain prefix always goes to mod! Trying again:
I love this topic!!
We have SO MUCH of this stuff:
My mom’s Rosenthal Moss Rose china from her wedding
My mom’s Towle Rambler Rose sterling silver from her wedding
My Fitz & Floyd Classique d’Or china from my first wedding
My Tuttle Beauvoir sterling silver from my first wedding
Hubby’s Noritake Marywood china from his first wedding
Hubby’s Wallace Sonata silver plate flatware from his first wedding
An antique set of Eastern European xferware that I got at an antique store during my first marriage (looks similar to this https://www.replacements.com/china-jyoto-jyo2-dinner-plate/p/8214351? )
Set of 80s Christmas plates and glasses that we take out every year and use for the whole month of December
Small set of Fitz & Floyd Christmas Holly china that we use for parties during the holidays
My mom’s set of Fostoria crystal dessert plates
My mom’s Fostoria punch bowl and matching punch cups (these featured prominently in many a baby and bridal shower when I was growing up!)
Various Fostoria serving pieces and candlesticks from my mom and my first mother-in-law
We use it all regularly for entertaining and especially like to mix and match. And we put it all in the dishwasher. We also have several sets of more modern dishes (white Fiestaware, black Magnolia from Target, a few sets of 4 random pattern everyday plates) that are in everyday rotation.
As to your second question, at this point I think the only value any of the above has is the actual metal value of the sterling silver. We do happen to have a few pieces of Eames and Stickley furniture that we are hoping will hold its value but we are not holding our breath. (My daugher is a psychotherapist and we joke that whe we’re gone the two black Eames lounge chairs will be for her clients, and the white one will be for her.)
Anon
So fun! Love this. Inspires me to break out my linen tablecloth and napkins to gussy up my table.
Senior Attorney
My husband is the Resident Artistic Napkin Folder in our house. It’s very fun.
Anon
I have my own wedding china (early 2000s white with a platinum band) and will inherit my mom’s 70s wedding china (a short-lived spin-off of their classic Eternal pattern – bone china, platinum band, and avocado(!!) leaves along the rim 😂).
My grandmother’s sterling went to a different branch. I have silverplate from other relatives. Nothing as ornate as Francis I, but if I had Francis, you bet I’d use it!
And I have the most beautiful 1940s crystal with a simple laurel leaf band from my grandmother’s best friend. It’s Fostoria but I don’t know the pattern.
I love to host and use it all frequently. My hosting is always less formal than the stuffy sit-down dinners I grew up with. I do heavy hors d’oeuvres on silver platters on the dining room table – usually with a fun, bold tablecloth underneath to break up the formality. I use china and glass (crystal) salad plates for people to serve themselves. Pour your own wine into the Fostoria in another area. And I use real linen napkins! (Except the annual Christmas party when there’s 80+ people coming through the house – my tolerance for starching little napkins has limits!)
As far as actual antiques (pre-1930), they have value, though certainly not as much as they once did. Early 19th century tall case clocks (“grandfather clocks” in everyday parlance) seem to hold their value well, much to our dismay as we’d love to pick up one for less than $2500. Dining chairs and tables, no – in part because people were smaller then and they aren’t as comfortable to us now. Chests of drawers can be had for just a few hundred dollars and the quality beats the pants off IKEA, often for the same price. I’ve picked up side tables from the first half of the 19th century at thrift stores for under $20 twice.
I don’t have blue willow, but my walls are decorated with brown transferware.
Own your style, whatever it is. Use Pinterest and IG if you feel like you want more ideas of how to incorporate older pieces.
Senior Attorney
Pro tip: One year I held a dinner party every week for a whole year (managed 46 parties out of 52 weeks) and the first thing I learned was “send the linens out to be cleaned!”
Anon
I tried to one year, and my dry cleaner wanted $7 to clean and press each napkin!! Even the clerk was surprised when they saw what the computer said.
Anon
I have a set of grocery store china my mom collected one plate at a time with a stamp book. I wouldn’t trade it for the world.
I also have a made in England set of Spode Christmas Tree that I bought most of off Craigslist, from someone who was selling her mother’s china. We use it all of December.
anon
The resale value on true fine china (like Herend, not Spode) is actually really high, provided the pieces are in good condition. A full set, used can run you well into the five figures. Resale value on sterling flatware varies heavily by pattern, including whether the pattern is still made. My pattern is discontinued and so it resells at a lower price since getting replacement pieces will presumably be harder in the future. A full used set of Francis I is $$$$$.
Seventh Sister
My understanding is that sterling has value based on its weight, ditto gold jewelry for the most part. My in-laws are convinced they are sitting on a goldmine of low-quality brown furniture, Wedgwood china, and Port Meirion dinnerware. I’m skeptical. My MIL intimates that her wedding diamond is a three-carat investment account, but I’m fairly sure there is a large flaw and the color looks off even to my untrained eye. My grandmother’s “heirloom” diamond pendant turned out to be glass. Not even paste. Glass.
Runcible Spoon
I inherited my Grandmother’s Blue Danube and use it every day, and put it in the dishwasher. I’ve mixed in some cobalt blue salad-size plates from Crate and Barrel. I bought for myself a knock-off version of the Goreham Fairfax silver pattern in stainless (don’t know the name of the pattern, but I got this flatware at Ross-Simons online 20 years ago), and also in silverplate (called Gorham Fairview, now discontinued) (which is kept in an anti-tarnish cloth-lined box in a drawer, and is used at Thanksgiving if I remember to take it out). I anticipate inheriting some Goreham Fairfax sterling flatware from family, as this was the family pattern for generations. I also inherited my Great Aunt’s china (pink flowers, can’t remember the name of the pattern); I use that for special occasions when I won’t mind handwashing. When I was going through a sets of china phase, I bought a bunch of sets of dishware and then later downsized them to my relatives, but I kept the unusual gold/cream patterned lily-of-the-valley set of china (again, can’t remember the name of the pattern) that I picked up at a thrift shop/antique store because lily-of-the-valley is my birth flower. (When I moved to Asia for a temporary, but years-long, assignment, I left my Blue Danube in storage and brought the lily-of-the-valley, because the kitchen in Asia didn’t have a dishwasher, so why not use all the hand-wash china every day?) I picked up some fostoria etched glassware from Replacements dot com when I felt like I needed to fancy up my glassware. Oh, and I just replaced a beloved cream/gold English teapot that I inherited from my Great Aunt after I broke the lid — I sourced the replacement on Etsy, and it was shipped from England. The new to me teapot is slightly smaller than the older, inherited teapot, but the lid fits perfectly! My wine glasses are boxes and boxes of mass-produced wine glasses from Linens N Things or Bed Bath and Beyond that live in their boxes (other than a core set in the cabinet for every day use), and are brought out and unboxed for entertaining, then boxed back up again and stored when the fun is over.
Anon
Since getting promoted earlier this year, I’m getting marketing emails from salespeople every day. They look personalized, and these sales people follow up multiple times. So far, I’ve been ignoring them and sometimes blocking the sender. Is that rude? Should I reply to explain I’m not interested?
Anecdata
Nah, just block them. 99% of the time, they’re guessing your email (and the “personalized” parts) from your linkedin.
Carol
I’ve been having the same issue and I’ve been ignoring them. They do get personal and kinda mean, with subject lines like “Guess you don’t want to talk to me”. Yeah I DON’T.
bird in flight
This is wild. Like who does that work for? I’m never going to talk to someone who sends me a subject line like that – you are now on my blacklist.
Anon
Whoever came up with this tactic probably also thinks negging is a good way to attract women.
anon
Yup. I literally get ones that are like “I have followed up five times to attempt to get time on your calendar” and I’m like…you do not know me and are trying to sell me something; I do not owe you time on my calendar.
Anon
I get that one too, as well as the “guess you don’t want to take the time to talk to me”. It’s so entitled.
Anon
I ignore & delete one-time sales emails. Ones that follow up or reach out repeatedly, I delete and block.
The only time I respond is when the sender is egregiously rude (i.e., the one time a guy got snarky about me not responding to his weekly irrelevant cold calls & emails, seemed to think it was a valid sales tactic to send me an email saying I was stuck up for not responding? I dug up info for his company, tracked down the CEO’s contact info, and told them what I really thought.)
I guess I have responded to a few poor souls who seem like real, sincere humans who are just misguided. Like the entry-level marketing intern working at a firm with which we have a major contract who kept trying to sell me those same services. I let him know we work with his great-great-great grandboss already and are quite happy to provide a reference should any new clients ask for one, but please focus your energy on finding new clients, not current ones.
bird in flight
I am both in sales and get sold to (project management). I ignore unsolicited emails and requests (like on Linked In) from anyone who I haven’t met or had a phone conversation with or there’s not a specific project context. For example, if a sales person emails me about a specific project I’m working on that they know about, know that I am a decision maker, and want to be a part of the project – that I will respond to. But if that sales person emails me generally just wanting to talk without a specific purpose? I’m ignoring that.
bird in flight
Random other thought 1: In the world of phishing emails looking so real, I double down even harder on the I only respond to emails from people who I know AND the email needs to make sense that I received it. I have received extremely real looking emails from real colleagues with quotes that I didn’t request, so I called them and it was a phishing hack email situation. So random email from someone I don’t even know at all? Absolutely not engaging with that.
Random other thought 2: My email inbox gets the forwarded messages from several past employees at our company, and get personalized sales emails for people who haven’t worked at the company for 5+ years. Once I started getting those, the personalized nature of emails started becoming way less effective.
Cat
I ignore them. They’re cold emails based on guessing your org’s email format. Some people get really pushy and rude with the follow-up and I’m not sure why they think that’s effective because then I go from ‘not relevant, ignore’ to ‘wow I really wouldn’t want to do business with you.’
Anon
Lol no it’s not rude to block spam.
anon
Sometimes, reaching out spurs them on because they know they’ve gotten your attention.. and if you’re willing to respond at all, that’s an inroad. I used to try to be polite and either say I couldn’t discuss or didn’t have a need for x service right now, but all that did was spawn months-long attempts to call me, email me, and “get on my calendar.”
It’s not rude. You owe these people nothing. I mean, I would *hate* to have a job where I email blasted and cold called people and got hung up on all day, but this is a position that they presumably voluntarily accepted and knew what it entailed.
Anon
I get tons of these messages on LinkedIn, and I agree that sometimes they can be aggressive. I block those, and sometimes message others that I’m not interested. It is super annoying, and I don’t see how anyone would say “yes” to a random sales pitch…but someone must if they keep doing it!
Anonymous
SO glad i’m not the only one getting this garbage! half the time they don’t even tell me what they want to talk to me about in the follow up emails, so then if I were to actually care i’d have to go hunting to find the original stupid email. how much of this is AI these days, i wonder.
Anon
What are “Home Counties” around London? Just suburbs or is there an understood meaning of this term. A snooty colleague used it today and I am clearly not the cool kid who knows this term despite watching lots of Hyacinth Bucket.
Anonymous
That’s pronounced “Bouquet”! Your post inspired me to look it up. Wikipedia says it’s the counties immediately surrounding London including Buckingham and Surrey. The list is a bit fluid depending on how far out you think shoud be included.
Anon
Kinda like “the Bay Area” which people who live the farthest from SF perceive as larger than those of us who live closest do.
The only official definition I’ve seen is like the home counties – the county is supposed to be adjacent to San Francisco county.
TheElms
Yes, its the counties immediately around London. To me its like the ex-burbs of a major US city but even bigger in georgraphic scope. I think there are 7 and they are: Berkshire, Buckinghamshire, Essex, Hertfordshire, Kent, Surrey and Middlesex.
Anonymous
It’s where people have homes who commute into London.
Anon
They are just the counties nearest London e.g. Surrey, Kent, Essex, Hertfordshire, Buckinghamshire, Berkshire and maybe Sussex. It almost certainly does have reasonably classist or at least very London-centric origins originally probably to do with MPs or judicial circuits, but is pretty commonly used today in the UK to describe the wider London commuter belt (like tri-state area?).
They’re not quite suburbs. The home counties tend to be a bit greener and more village-y than the immediate London suburbs thanks to planning regulations that insist on “green belt” land. There are major towns and cities within the home counties beyond just London itself e.g. Reading, Guilford, St Albans.
anon
I lived in London for a few years–I’m American. It’s most often used when describing an accent belt or to show that someone was wealthy enough to grow up near London in somewhere relatively posh. Home counties are mostly considered posh with Essex being the exception (it’s its own deal/see reality TV for explanation on that).
Anonymous
The other day there was a discussion about what college is going to look like in 10-15+ years. One poster commented in the replies that their spouse was a professor and he sees the collapse coming. If that poster is reading today, I am curious as to what type of school your spouse works at (R-1 university, ivy, SLAC, smaller state Uni, etc.) and what he is seeing that shows signs of a collapse.
Anon
I’m the one who posted the comment that person was responding to and I also work at a university. I don’t see the signs of it at my university because even though it’s a non flagship state school, it’s in a growing city in a growing state and is only getting bigger (for now). But I absolutely see this happening already at public universities in the parts of the country that are aging and losing population (the northeast and parts of the midwest) and small private schools all over the country. As someone who has done a lot of academic job searching over the last decade, it’s very clear where jobs are and where they are not, which is directly related to how well those types of schools are doing. If you read any of the higher ed news coverage, it’s constantly covering schools closing or merging or trying to figure out how to stay viable.
Anon
Not academic, but from what I hear from parents of high school kids, SEC schools that the parents grew up thinking of as party schools or safety schools are now hard to get into because of 1) local population growth in states like TN, GA, SC, VA, 2) regional population growth in the SEUS in general, and 3) every other school being shockingly more expensive. Like kids who are reasonably well-prepared and with decent grades are (per the parents) not getting in anymore.
So if this is happening here, IDK how it is in places like Maine, NH, some SUNY campuses, some UMASS campuses, etc.
Anon
Maine in particular is having trouble, as is PA, though that may be partially because they have a strangely large number of small public universities that just don’t seem to be viable anymore.
Anon
And in PA our small public universities are not good. They’re cheap but bad.
Anon
The Midwest R1 my husband and I work at has growing enrollment, and has kept tuition very low even by public university standards. Nothing seems like it’s collapsing here except the lack of tuition increases has led to disgruntled faculty and staff who think they should be paid more ;)
I do think there may be some kind of bubble with the hideously expensive private schools (although there will always be plenty of rich people who can pay, and a lot of kids get need-based aid at elite private schools), but do I think higher ed as a whole is going to collapse, no way.
No Face
Not in that field, but the collapse is absolutely happening at small private colleges already. A friend of mine is a tenured college professor and his college will longer exist in a few months. Unfathomable when he got tenure 20 years ago.
Anon
Why won’t it exist? Too expensive? To expensive relative to perceived value (so people who might want to go to third-tier SLAC at $60/year are happy to go to whatever State U they can get into for far less — like UNC-Asheville or Penn State – Harrisburg)?
I’m guessing that the Miami-Ohio or Haverfords or Bates colleges are going to be OK. Only Oberlin can I think of as a school that won’t be around due to very other considerations. I can’t recall if Sweet Briar still exists or has been resurrected, but maybe there isn’t enough of a market for that type of school?
Anonymous
This is a lot of anxiety to repeatedly be dumping on the rest of us.
Many colleges and universities in this country are not 70k a year! Many have next to no endowments. You’re obsessed with a small small tier of schools.
Anon
The rack rate is always high. It’s like a used car lot though. Who knows how many people actually pay that? It is a turnoff for sure.
Anon
There are a lot of private colleges though and tuition isn’t lower if you go to a less competitive one. At a certain scale (small # of students), things cost what they cost. Room & board seems more dependent on location and IMO is never discounted, so the all-in cost is often much more than any state-supported school’s in-state tuition. But even that is pricey (NC State for engineering, 5 years ago, was > 25K a year in state (the all-in cost) and at a couple of state schools, kids of friends couldn’t finish in 4 years due to not being able to get needed classes or student teaching, so budgeting for that is hard (like where do you get a lease for just one semester?)).
IDK how people do it except to work a couple of more years just to help their kids finish without loans (and then you are retired for fewer years, so possibly a win-win on the math-of-retirement front if you’re not exhausted and didn’t have kids late).
Lola
IME it was possible to rent student housing by the semester. The landlords knew who buttered their bread and adjusted accordingly.
And “the way people do it” is either a) financial aid packages offered by SLACs which are a mix of scholarships and loans b) paying from savings or c) kids take out loans.
It sounds like you’re looking for a magic bullet, which doesn’t exist. The system is deeply flawed and unfortunately we have to navigate it.
Anon
Pretty much this. And I’ve lost track of Sweet Briar… I know it was resurrected, but can’t remember if it worked or not. Women’s colleges are facing their own issues these days, and once a school looks vulnerable, it’s much harder to attract students, staff, and faculty and goes into a death spiral that’s hard to get of.
Seventh Sister
My understanding is that the resurrection of Sweet Briar is pretty OK, at least so far.
The women’s colleges that are the most vulnerable are the ones that don’t have much name recognition – places like Wellesley and Smith have plenty of applicants, places like Meredith College or Cottey College, not so much. None of these places have the huge endowments of Harvard or Yale, partially because of their small size, but also because they mostly don’t have graduate schools. While the controversy over whether to be a women’s college or a historically women’s college or to admit men pops up, I really think that the cost issue is the bigger danger to most women’s colleges.
Anonymous
Sweet Briar has been resurrected for now but I would never send a kid there for fear it would go out of business. Why do you think Oberlin is going down? When I was in college a couple of decades ago it had one of the best conservatories in the country and was home to the top teacher on my instrument.
Anon
https://www.insidehighered.com/news/2019/04/18/amid-budget-deficits-and-unfavorable-demographics-oberlin-pushes-do-more-less
This was the top hit when I searched, but I’ve seen a number of articles about Oberlin’s financial issues over the years.
Anon
But I should add, I doubt it’s closing any time soon, just making the point that even the very top SLACs are facing financial pressures
Anon
Wait, where is Oberlin going?
Anonymous
Part of this is the demographic cliff issue–there will just be a smaller population pool to enroll in the same number of colleges, so some are inevitably going to fold. https://www.bestcolleges.com/news/analysis/looming-enrollment-cliff-poses-serious-threat-to-colleges/#:~:text=What%20Is%20the%20Enrollment%20Cliff,when%20most%20kids%20start%20college.
Anon
My spouse is an ABD PhD at a small private college and tenure means nothing these days. A number of similar schools have let their tenured profs go and are replacing them with people like my spouse. I don’t expect to see these schools in existence a decade from now.
Anon
Wait… so your husband is still a grad student and they fired a tenured professor and hired him?
Wow… I mean…. Wow. And they are doing this to all tenured professors?
Or do you mean he completed a Masters, and now he took a job that used to be tenure track (PhD filled)? So he is an adjunct, or does he have a full time income/benefits at least? And then they get away with paying your husband much less, I’m sure….
Wow….
Anon
The first scenario, yes. That is exactly what is happening. And no benefits, and yes, very little pay for the work because “he doesn’t even have a PhD” as they like to remind him.
Anon
Tenure is not meaningless. Maybe at certain schools no one has heard of. But Harvard or USC or Michigan is not going to cease to exist in our lifetimes.
Anon
But that’s like 1% of faculty positions. Already most professors aren’t tenured and most students are learning from non tenure track professors.
Anon
I think way more than 1% of tenured faculty are at stable schools that won’t collapse in the next 50 years.
Getting a tenured position is definitely very hard.
Anonymous
Most schools, even very good ones, are moving to have more courses taught by adjuncts and to have fewer tenure-track professors.
Anon
“Most schools, even very good ones, are moving to have more courses taught by adjuncts and to have fewer tenure-track professors.”
But this affects hiring of junior faculty, not faculty who are already on the tenure-track, let alone tenured. I don’t think anyone is disputing that tenure-track jobs are very hard to come by and increasingly so. But once you have tenure, you have very good job security at most schools.
Anon
You realize the schools you list are not small private schools as referenced here, right? And some people – many, even – have heard of places other than these behemoths?
Anonymous
ABD is not a PhD.
Anon
I think that’s the point she is making.
Her husband, that doesn’t have a PhD, is now filling the job that was previously filled by a tenured PhD.
The same thing that is happening throughout many industries. Fire the older, experienced, more expensive workers (esp > 50). Hire younger/less qualified people for less money/fewer benefits/cheaper health care costs. It is just startling to hear that in academia the amazing security of tenure is likely on the decline….
My friend is a vocalist for arguably the best Symphony Orchestra/Chorus in the country, and one of the best in the world. Her union is struggling to maintain any tenure, and ANY salary. The contract proposed was one that removed all income for members of the Chorus. They work for free. They are trying to push back, but the same thing has happened in other Orchestras.
Because there are people willing to work for free, to have the job on their CV. Especially young people. And many people in the arts already have to work multiple jobs to survive anyway, right? We are now accepting as a country that people should have “side-gigs” and talk about it like this is a good thing!
Anonymous
ABD = All But Dissertation.Not a PHD but still could be a good teacher.
Anon
Yes we know what it means.
Anon
Correct. Which particularly rankles (very understandably!) the tenured PhD prof they fired in order to hire my ABD spouse. Don’t get me wrong, I’m glad he found a job and that my income carries us, because I cannot imagine how his single-income classmates are going to make it in this environment, nor how colleges will provide meaningful education once they drive out all the experienced people.
In-House Anon
I’ve heard the same from faculty at a couple of the small private schools near Seattle…they are tenured but don’t expect the schools to exist in current form in the near future.
Anon
My nephew’s large state U is considering closing the department he’s majoring in due to too few students to support too many professors. That would be bad for professors and really bad for students who need to find another major and get the credits to graduate on time; it wouldn’t likely matter to the school’s overall enrollment, but a musical theater professor can’t retool to become an accounting professor.
It’s like there will be professors of, say, Spanish but not a different language (Italian?) unless there is a national security like justification for having that program. I can see a lot of obscure majors going by the wayside (ones that I would love to take a class or two in but wouldn’t major in).
Anon8
My sister worked at a small private college in admin and said all they ever talked about was their horrific financial situation. From what I understand, all the other small private colleges in the area (northeast) are also on the brink of financial collapse. One college nearby closed already, leaving current students to have to transfer schools.
Seventh Sister
I know it would be devastating to a student to have to leave their college because it was closing, but don’t they usually try to do a “teach out” so that current students can graduate from a single institution? I
Related: I cannot imagine penalizing someone about that in an interview or a grad school application – how was a teenager supposed to know that their college was in such bad financial health?
Anne-on
Question to the hive – what is your daily level of pain? On average I would say 2-3 is my usual and expected, 4-5 is annoying but workable, 6-8 is a sick day, and 8+ is when I see someone. I’ll caveat that I’ll see a doctor if I’m feverish as I don’t want to transmit contagious illnesses but my even with a bad flu/covid/pneumonia my pain is still usually at a 3-4 plus some additional aches, mental fog, tiredness. I am never at a ‘0’ and my friends with similar disabilities/illnesses agree.
Is most of the population truly walking around pain free…daily? Truly? To be honest I can’t even really wrap my brain around that. It would be amazing to have access to the energy that other people seem to have (is that the secret – they’re not all dealing with a baseline of 3?!?)
Cat
Sorry you’re dealing with a regular level of irritation! I would say 0-2 depending on time of the month or season. 0 being I feel normal and decently rested. Example of a 1 would be a mild seasonal allergies, 2 would be cramps (after a steady stream of Advil, without would be a 5 lol) or a random backache from doing something unusual, 4-5 would be a bad cold.
anonshmanon
Hi Anne-on, yes my daily level of pain is 0. I’m aware that I’m lucky.
Anon
+1. Definitely baseline of 0.
Anon
I am mostly 0 on pain, but sometimes 2 on sleep deprived, bleary and low energy, unable to concentrate.
I know it’s different, but the effect on being able to work or parent is not dissimilar.
Anon
Definitely a mode of 0 for me.
Anonymous
I mean, maybe a .5? If you count a crock in my neck from sleeping funny?
My pain scale is a bit different.
0- nothing
1- mild annoying requiring no medication
2-3- discomfort requiring medication or if bothers me all day (headache, period cramps).
4-5- pain that doesn’t go away despite medication, disruptive to my life (have to lay down to sleep off a migraine). Something like the flu would be a 5/6.
6- requires seeing a doctor and/or narcotics
7- same as 6 but more constant
8- extremely disruptive to life, cannot work, requires medical intervention immediately.
9/10- unbearable pain, hospitalized
Anon
This is a pretty good pain scale, I think! And honestly, the scale they use with children is often even better when you use it with adults.
https://wongbakerfaces.org/instructions-use/
When someone complains of 7+ pain it really is an emergency in my book. But unfortunately everyone has their own version of the scale, people abuse the scale, doctors have become desensitized to the scale. I have seen people tell me they were having 10/10 pain, while sitting calmly in an Emergency Room.
When my father was critically injured and in the hospital for weeks he was literally screaming in pain and horror. 9-10/10 pain and wanted to die. They had to put him under general anesthesia.
Was the 10/10 pain patient in the ER lying? Maybe not. Maybe for them that is the worst pain they had every had, they were worried about being taken seriously, so they called it 10/10.
With pain… everything is relative.
And we definitely undertreat it.
Not only pain meds, but stretching/PT/yoga/meditation/distraction/aggressive treatment of mood/acupuncture and even some limited chiropractic care can be very effective for chronic pain. Everyone with chronic pain should use multiple modalities to treat it.
Anonymous
Yes. I have one kid who I s10/10 all the time, for a stubbed tie. She deeply feels it is the worst pain she’s ever felt. Another one of my kids could have her toe literally chopped off, report 9/10 pain scale (“could always be worse right??”) and be cool as a cucumber.
No Face
0!!! I was between 6-9 for different medical issues and injuries for years and it was so draining. I am very appreciative of the current state of my body.
Anonymous
My daily level of pain is zero. I’m so sorry you are in pain daily!
Anon
I’m a 2-4 most days, but I have chronic mi*graine. That’s with a lot of medication and lifestyle modification (used to be 5-6 most of the time and still is on bad days). I can barely remember what it’s like to not be in pain, so I’m with you on having a hard time knowing what’s normal and what I should actually get concerned enough to actually see a doctor for. Mostly I just try to ignore it.
Anon
If the scale is 0-8, I would say I am at a 4 on any given day. I have arthritis in my spine and it is a chronic low-level pain that just never goes away. Working around it is doable, some days it spikes and is more like a 6-7.
Anonymous
My baseline is 0-1. I do sometimes feel a 2-3 following a workout or a heavy walking trip. I would not seek medical attention until about a 7. unless it continued for a long time at 5 or so. I am 49.
Anon
This changed as I got older (mid-50’s now). It used to be zero, but now it is 3-5 every day.
Anon
+1
Same. I have a type of generalized osteoarthritis, which there is no treatment for and just progresses in all of my joints with time. My pain ranges from almost nothing to 5ish most days. Occasionally spikes in a joint to higher numbers, so then I need to stop, sit/rest.
Yes, the majority of people have no pain every day. And they have no idea what a gift this is!
I’m not sure what you mean by pain though, and that is the tricky part because there isn’t any objective measure of pain. I would never consider how I feel (achey) with infections as being “pain”.
It’s nothing like when I broken my leg or was in a car accident or when my knee gives out. And my pain of 5 might be your 8 or someone else’s 2. Because all of us have different genetics/experience/distractions/modifiers that affect their perception of pain.
We have migraines that run in my family. The women, in particular, have pretty terrible ones and have them more frequently. A few of the men have them, but very rarely. The men all have gone to the Emergency Room when they have had them, and describe them as the most painful thing they have ever experienced. The women, shake their heads a little…..and chuckle.
I do think women tolerate pain better… because we are accustomed to. Because pain, sadly, is part of our anatomy. And unfortunately, because it is so common it is generally dismissed by doctors as “normal”. Menstruation. Pregnancy. Giving birth. Pains of perimenopause. More osteoporosis/fractures/osteoarthritis etc.. Of course it varies from person to person, and sadly even women are not often sensitive to other women’s pain! Interestingly, there is some evidence that estrogen levels are somewhat protective in pain perceptive. We still have pain, but estrogen in our brain can essential trick us into tolerating it better. You can appreciate why evolutionarily that is a good thing, or else women may never have a second baby(!).
And sadly, as a species, we are not very sensitive to other people’s pain. We assume everyone is like us, feels pain as we do. We can’t see their pain on the outside, like a broken leg. Pain can worsen depression (understandably…), which then worsens pain, and we still aren’t empathic enough to folks with that difficult combination. Now we shame any person who has chronic pain that needs opioids to function, when they can be a wonderful salvation allowing many people to function.
Anonymous
I’m 46 and I definitely agree that it’s gotten worse as I’ve gotten older. I have a pretty high pain threshold but I’d say I’m at a low level 1 or 2 with some sort of complaint on a daily basis. (At the moment, my neck, my shoulder, my hip, my back, my dry eyes, etc.). I DO seek help for a lot of these low aches just to rule out something worse or an easy fix – 99% of the time it’s just arthritis. I find that my pain level is more intense if I don’t know what the pain is, almost like it’s an off note being played in my head or something.
Anon
If we are including lethargy in this scale, a 1 or 2 is average for me. 2 if my back is bothering me. 2 days I try to take the motion is medicine approach after learning from experience that my back hurts more if I dont get enough movement. Cramp days, or two days a month are 7 or 8s.
I get up and am moderately active every day, and mentally highly active escpecially at work and hobbies. But I feel like Im constantly, always fighting a deep physical and mental lethargy – starting since around puberty ( a gravitational pull? Inherent need to lay on the ground and never move again? a leaky battery? existentially dripping faucet of the soul?) I call it just being tired when I explain it to people because idk how to explain otherwise
Anne-on
Wow, all the people operating at a 0 is eye-opening. I feel like the mental shift here is similar to a kid who gets glasses and realizes the rest of the world doesn’t think tree=blobby green thing because they can see leaves for the first time.
Anon
Yeah I’ve never been a zero! A doctor told me once he didn’t think I should worry about hypermobility syndrome because I’m not in pain. I agreed that I wasn’t in pain. And then I thought about how I open doors, how I unzip bags, how I put my shoes on, and a hundred other tasks I adjust to minimize pain, and realized that I just wasn’t counting it as pain.
(No, I’m not evidently one of the EDS people; it ended up being an entirely different genetic condition when I finally communicated to doctors that there was a problem and got testing.)
Anon
I exist in pain. While I have learned to consciously screen it out of my awareness, the fact is that it leaves me fatigued. It also interferes a great deal with sleep. On your scale I’d say it varies from 2, which I easily ignore, to the occasional 8, which does not allow for focus on other things. Normal is in the moderate range. It is never 0. I stood up from counsel table in court the other day and it hit so hard that I think my eyes bugged out for a few moments. My regular judges know my condition and that if I seem to check out on them in court to just wait a few moments and I’ll be back in the game.
Anon
I have RA and most of my problem is in my feet. I’m on a first name basis with my podistrist. I’m currently wearing a brace on one foot and a boot on the other. I’d say my baseline is a 3-4.
Oh so anon
I would say probably a 5. I have chronic pain, including chronic migraine and neck injury. You learn to live with it over the years. I only take a sick day if my stomach is seriously upset, otherwise I just deal with it. It is what it is. This is my cross to bear. I am however. perpetually in awe of people who have lots of energy for sports, hobbies, outings, et cetera. Like, 8 hours of work and a trip to the grocery store and I am ready for a nap!
Anon
I’m at zero but sometimes (not every day) at the end of the day I find myself at a 1 or 2 from poor posture and stress tension (esp around my eyes and shoulders). I’m sorry you and many others are experiencing a constant higher baseline.
Anon
Tips to brush my cat’s teeth? My vet has recommended I brush both my senior cat teeth. I tried and my cat was hopeless. She hissed, tried to bite me, and ran away. I was using a gel that I put on my finger to rub on her teeth and gums, but I was too scare to get any in her mouth.
Anonymous
Vets have a lot of crazy ideas.
Anne-on
+1. I’d avoid this and alert the vet if the cat’s eating habits change – it may need to have teeth pulled. I’ve known many senior cats with very few teeth doing just fine with vet food for their last few years.
anon
My kitty had bad dental issues in the last 5 years of his life. He had a number of teeth pulled. I lost count of how many. Was still eating wet food happily and easily up until the last day.
Cb
Ours recommended an asthma inhaler…absolutely not.
Anonymous
The vet’s office can do a cleaning, but they have to sedate the cat. She might have to go fully under if she’s biting. I got my cat’s teeth cleaned when he was under anesthesia for something else.
I know they make chew toys for dogs that are supposed to clean their teeth, but idk if your kitty would be interested in something like that.
Anon
They’re often not willing to do the sedation for older cats just for a teeth cleaning (there are some risks that increase with age).
Anon
IDK, but my toddler absolutely hates getting her teeth brush and my husband said “well, at least she’s not a cat!” after finishing the other night.
Anonymous
Lol that’s cute. I’d just carry on. Don’t torment your senior kitty.
Senior Attorney
+1
LawDawg
There are treats (Feline Greenies dental, not the regular) and some drops to put in water that are approved by some veterinary dental group to help keep tartar at bay. Not as good as brushing, but it is way easier to give my cats a treat than brush their teeth. For the water additives, that only works if they drink out of a bowl. My cats have a fountain with a filter and that would interfere.
Anon
We never managed to brush our cat’s teeth, but he LOVES his dental snacks. Jury’s still out on whether they are actually working but at least he enjoy them.
Anonymous
+1, our cat liked the green treats.
Anon
My working philosophy is that if treatment is needed, the cat’s opinion of it is not the deciding factor. I would (and have) burrito the cat in an old towel and just brush the teeth around the biting. But I learned from prior animal dental discussions here that I am in the minority. From first hand experience, it is much easier to brush a reticent cat’s teeth than a large, angry dog’s teeth, but the impact on the quality of life means teeth are worth maintaining.
Anon
It’s not as easy when a cat also has other, more serious conditions that can flare up from stress.
anon
Until the cat bites you and infection becomes a very real risk. LOL that all cats are going to take to the burrito treatment.
Anon
My cat bit though my thumbnail when I tried the burrito method.
That was a definite no on his part. He’s usually the purriest cat I’ve ever had, but doesn’t like to be held down in any way, and he’s STRONG.
Anon
My cat apparently needs a dental cleaning under sedation. This recommendation came along at the same time my veterinary office added a full time dentist, but I’m sure it’s just a coincidence!
That was 18 months ago and he’s still fine. I think I’ll find a new vet next time he needs his shots. He’s 13. I’m not putting him under general for something like this.
Anon
Does anyone have the Jillian dress from MM Lafleur? I love the colors but not sure on the drapey style…matronly? also the below knee length…for comparison, I love the Rachel dress which is a completely different cut. LMK if you have any feedback on this style please…
anon
I love it- I’m hourglassy and 5′ 2″ and it really works for me. It nips at the waist and drapes over my rear nicely so I feel s*xy in it.
Anon
Are there good discount programs or ways to rent a car for less? I am needing to visit an elderly parent regularly and the car rental prices are killing me (flights are a fraction of the car cost). AARP (which I think I’m old enough to get at 50)? Miles programs? Get a credit card from a car rental co? If I am spending $800 a visit on cars, it might make sense to just buy a used car for the 12-24 months I may need to do this and park it (for free — small airport) at the airport.
Anon
What do you need the car for? Is it a long drive from the airport to your parent’s house? Or do you just need it when you’re there and you could rent a car from somewhere away from the airport if that’s cheaper? Can you really park at the airport for weeks at a time if you buy a car?
Anon
OP here — it’s over an hour drive to a rural area that is car-dependent and I will need to help take relative to medical appointments. Relative has a car but isn’t comfortable with non-local trips (and TBH it is 15+ years old, so not sure I’d trust it much beyond local trips).
Leatty
How long is each trip? If you are there for several weeks, could you do a one day one way rental for the days you travel to/from the airport? Then you could use family member’s car for all of the local medical appointments.
Anon
If the car is only being driven by elderly relative taking short, infrequent trips, then I’m sure it’s just fine.
Anon
I would just buy a car, frankly. But I would double check that you could leave your car long term at the airport for free. Even at a small one, I doubt they’ll let you do it.
Cat
Book with the ability to cancel – not sure if it will work at a small airport but we cancelled a $700 reservation and replaced it with a $350 reservation – same type of vehicle, same agency – when checking prices 2 days prior to a trip.
Does parent still have a car? Could a neighbor pick you up from the airport in it? Or could you take a taxi or car service to their house?
Anon
I think you can get decent deals on rental cars thru Costco.
Anon
Autoslash . com has helped me save money. AAA discounts. And if you have CLEAR they recently did a partnership with AVIS that saved me a ton.
Anon
https://turo.com/
Betsy
The thing about Turo is that the insurance on it only covers the minimum state requirements, which are laughably low most of the time. Because Turo isn’t a real car rental, your personal insurance and any credit card car rental insurance benefits might not cover it. I would check with both of them about coverage before renting through Turo.
Anon
Rental car prices have skyrocketed since the pandemic because of a shortage. Rental companies sold a lot of their stock during covid due to lack of demand. Does your parent have a car? Could you take a taxi or uber to their house to get the car, if so?
I would be concerned my car might get towed if it’s sitting and not moving in a small airport parking lot.
anon
Can you book a car service to/from her house and use relative’s car while you’re there? MIL lives an hour+ outside of Birmingham in RURAL Alabama, and we can book a car service to take us there and back to the airport. It’s not cheap but def cheaper than $800/trip.
Anon
I always rent through Costco Travel. Rates are usually better than on the travel websites or rental agency websites. It might be worth joining Costco if you’re not a member to save on rentals.
Anon
I got a good deal on a rental car booking through Walmart+. It’s through Avis (not Walmart), but it got me a good deal.
Anon
Can you just take a Lyft, in this rural area, to your parent’s place, and then just use your parent’s car? It will be a pricey Lyft, but no where near $400.
Is it time to talk to your elderly parent….. about moving? Closer to you?
Anon
Or maybe you could pay a neighbor of your parent’s to come pick you up when you visit.
Anon
If you work for a large employer or government, check if they have a contract for car rental that also includes leisure use. Those rates are often much, much better than anything you can get on your own.
ollie
+1 my large company’s rates are half the cost of Costco.
Anonie
Does your parent have a local contact (or contact of a contact) who would be able to pick you up and drive you to the airport? It seems a shame to get a rental car or buy one when your relative has a car at home. If not a personal connection who would do them a favor, maybe someone through a church or community group who would volunteer to do this, or someone through your parent’s medical provider? Could you find a local group for the area on Facebook and post a request for someone to help with this? Yes, it’s a risk, but to save $800 a trip seems worth it.
Anonie
Edit: I’m assuming Uber isn’t an option for some reason, but if it is, even a one hour Uber ride tends to be only about $80-100, which x2 is still far cheaper than $800.
Anonymous
I would purchase a car and sell it when you no longer need it.
Anon
$800 is bananas. I’d buy or lease a cheap car and leave it there, assuming you actually can park at the airport. Or if you arrange a car service or even a Lyft each way of that’s available would be cheaper. If your relative is involved in a church or any sort of civic organization, you could probably also ask around and find someone who would pick you up from and return you to the airport for like $25 an hour.
Anon
I have my first colonoscopy scheduled for next month and I am so nervous about the prep! I know there were some threads on this – can someone link to one? I tried searching yesterday but nothing was coming up.
For the day before when you can only have clear liquids, is yellow Gatorade ok? Also for chicken broth, is there a good brand out there? I am not a cook so I am guessing I can get a bouillon cube or something to put in hot water? TIA!
Anon
Bone broth is a good one, as it is high in protein so more filing then just chicken broth.
Anonymous
Check with your doctor as they have slightly different rules, but generally Gatorade and other translucent beverages that are not red or maybe orange is fine. Drinking calories is key to not being starving IMO. I would not enjoy broth but did soda and gatorade.
Anon
I got a list from my doctor’s office of clear liquids I could have and there were some pre-made drinks that have protein on it. I think I opted for ensure clear apple. It wasn’t bad, I wasn’t hungry, and I also don’t cook. Maybe check with your doctor to see if that is an option for you (I had to order from amazon to find them). I also have a serious gag reflex and the prep made me gag. My doctor recommended drinking it through a straw to the back of my throat and that completely worked. Honestly, the entire thing, including prep, was not nearly as bad as I expected it to be.
Anonymous
This. Just drink the prep super cold through a straw to the back of your throat and it will be fine.
Prep isn’t that big a deal.
Anon
Good for you for taking preventative measures for your health!! I did it last summer and it truly was not that bad. I was very strict about following the pre-procedure diet about a week beforehand (no nuts, no seeds, no whole grains, etc). I think that helped make the prep not that bad. For the prep, I couldn’t tolerate the giant 4L jug of foul liquid so I did the Miralax and Gatorade prep instead. So it was just like drinking Gatorade and it was no big deal at all. I bought white Gatorade (I think the flavour was cherry).
In terms of liquids, I mostly drank water, I don’t really like sugary drinks and the thought of drinking just plain broth kind of made me gag. I think yellow Gatorade was on the approved list but make sure you follow the instructions your doctor sends you.
The worst part by far was fasting the whole day beforehand – I have never been so hungry in my life. I chewed gum to help with hunger pains.
Traveler
Yes yellow Gatorade should be ok…. anything but red or purple.
Also note that jello and gummy bears count as clear liquids. Again, no red!
I found drinking the prep the worst part. If you do suprep ensure it is cold and drink with a straw far back in your mouth. Then you won’t have to taste it so much!!
Anonymous
Check with what your doctor allows but two things really got me through prep. Better than bouillon (way better tasting than other broths) and frozen lemon Italian ice.
Anon
Yes to gatorade that isn’t read, and any kind of broth. I personally find the Campbells beef consomme most filling and satisfying. It has a teeeeeeeennnny tiny amount of tomato paste in it apparently, but I’ve always had whistle-clean results according to my doc. I’ve had…. maybe 5-7 colonoscopies? Family history. I’m on the high frequency schedule.
Anon
* red not read
Runcible Spoon
I did the Miralax prep, dumping the entire jar of powder into 2 quarts of home-brewed sugarless iced tea, and it just tasted like I was drinking iced tea. I also at some sugarless lemon and lime jello, and dissolved a teaspoon of better than bullion chicken broth into a small mug of boiling water, but then I got nervous about the chicken broth having too much solidy-type stuff floating in it, so I didn’t drink any more of that. I checked with the nurse first, and she said coffee and tea were ok, without milk. In retrospect, I probably could have drunk iced tea with sugar and eaten lemon and lime jello with sugar, for the calories, but I didn’t really feel hungry.
Anonymous
I’ve had two. Order pho or ramen broth from a restaurant if you have one nearby.
Anonymous
Why are men so bad at pooping. Whyyyyyy
Anon
I’m curious/scared to know what you mean???
Anonymous
Not OP, but my guess she’s had an aarrgh-not-again moment from somebody who’s either chronically constipated or bad at cleaning after themselves.
Anonymous
They aren’t?
I’m sorry you’re dealing with whatever caused this post!
Anonymous
When directing male guests to the bathroom I always inform them of the poop candle, they don’t always light it though.
Anon
After a hospitalization, mine found out he’d had Crohn’s these past 15+ years. I feel bad now that I felt this way the whole time!
Anon
I hope he is doing better now that he has a diagnosis! I’m a celiac. My DH went gluten free when we moved in together, and he found all his gut-related issues disappeared. DH thought it was within the range of normal human experience to have all of his symptoms (?), and he hates going to the doctor, so he just ignored it.
Anon
Yes, he’s responded really well to meds and it looks like he won’t need surgery any time soon. (I’m grateful to some people here who offered encouragement!).
They say Celiac is very underdiagnosed (let alone other sorts of gluten intolerance) and also that a surprising number of patients initially complain of other symptoms and don’t mention GI symptoms. I think normalizing a lot of GI distress and discomfort probably contributes to that!
Anon
Oh god, I’m sorry but this made me LOL for real.
Anon
OMG I know.
College Q
We have a HHI of about $300K; should I bother with the FAFSA for my Senior in HS?
Senior Attorney
My understanding is that it’s required even for non-need-based aid at some schools, so you might as well give it a shot.
Anonymous
This.
Presumably at this level of HHI your child’s school provides a college counselor or you are able to hire your own. That would be a good idea. The process is so much more complicated than it was when our generation applied.
LawDawg
The answer to the question that you don’t ask is always no. It won’t hurt to fill out the FAFSA and maybe something will come of it. If not, it’s a half hour of your life.
Anon
Assuming you’re not sitting on millions in non-retirement savings or own tons of real estate, I would fill it out, yes. Seems like there’s very little cost to doing so and potentially a big cost to not doing it. My parents had a lower income than you (although it was also 20+ years ago, so might be comparable in today’s dollars) and didn’t bother, and I think they actually would have gotten significant aid at my elite private college. There’s way more aid for upper middle class families than most people think.
https://www.nytimes.com/2020/10/03/your-money/college-tuition-financial-aid.html
Anon
We make too much for our student to get need-based aid but the FAFSA got them merit-based aid that covers half of the tuition costs for all four years.
Anon
I need help with a situation that I’m frankly embarrassed about to discuss in real life. I appreciate any feedback on what to do. Just put up a boundary and say I won’t engage in these conversations? Consider him a lost cause?
My brother (early 30s) is seeing a therapist in his 80s who seems to be giving questionable advice. My brother has started calling me up very upset wanting to vent. I try to listen and be supportive, but I am concerned at him repeatedly saying what I perceive as s3xist reductive comments: boys and girls have different needs due to gender, moms can’t understand boys, and boys (unlike girls) have crazy hormones (the term he used was “roid raging”) during puberty- energy which only a dad can direct. He’s never spoken like this. My family is very liberal and he didn’t hear these stereotypes growing up.
Our parents divorced when he was 7 and I was 15, and our father chose to move across the country to start a new family with his online affair partner who became his 3rd wife.
When I try asking more about why he thinks “boys are like this, girls are like that”, and suggest nothing is so black and white, he tells me I’m gaslighting him (another phrase he has learned) and will never understand because I’m a woman. My husband, also a child of divorce, tried talking to him, which hasn’t been productive either.
He’s never been like this, and it is becoming very disruptive in my family. He is channeling anger at our dad onto our mom (which also seems misplaced). I’ve kindly suggested he consider another therapist, but he thinks this man walks on water. The therapist also doesn’t seem to be giving him any tools to deal with this childhood anger. I suggested journaling and breathing exercises, which he laughed off as childish. When I ask what they do in therapy, my brother said he talks and the therapist listens…and that’s it.
Anon
Wow… I would be concerned too.
Does your brother spend a lot of time on the internet?
Is he single/having trouble with relationships with women?
It is true that your brother suffered differently than you for not having grown up with his father nearby. I can imagine that it very well has serious repercussions on his mental health. And if he somehow idealizes his father, despite their distant relationship, he unfortunately may also lean towards behaviors that mirror his father’s.
I would also be unhappy, and suspicious of this therapist.
Sorry… I have no good advice.
Anon
Sadly, yes and yes. He’s only had 1 girlfriend of about 2 years. They met gaming online, which is his favorite activity as an introvert.
You hit the nail on the head. I’m worried he will continue developing negative opinions of women, which clearly is already hurting his family and won’t help him with personal or professional relationships with women either. Yet the therapist seems to be either validating or promoting these gendered stereotypes.
Anon
The only thing that I might explore sometimes is……. “Is that really how you think about me? Mom? Your girlfriend?” Sometimes when you force people to look at the people close to them, that they know, they sometimes will step back a little. That’s great your husband can be a more positive foil.
I would push back a little and be like “Wow…. I’m really hurt to hear you say that.”
And you need to speak up when he does / says something inappropriate. Tell him to go. Hang up the phone. He needs to really know how you feel. And you can’t let him hurt your family.
This is really hard on your Mom, for sure, and sadly it will be ongoing….. Maybe do more family gatherings that are active… going somewhere/doing something/outside…. because too much dead time/hanging out time leads to more conflict.
Anon
I’ll try these suggestions! Thank you!
Cerulean
Kinda sounds like he’s fallen into a red pill or incel rabbit hole and has a crappy therapist who might be further encouraging those beliefs. I’m really sorry.
I wish you could calmly tell him he’s being too emotional when he calls and let him know he can call back when his hormones have leveled out, but that’s obviously not going to be effective :-)
Anon
LOL that reply gave me a much needed chuckle! Yes, I told my husband he is sounding like Andrew Tate! It’s scary.
Cerulean
On a more serious note, I think asking him what he’s looking for from you (venting? advice?) and going from there can be helpful, and shutting down any anti-women rhetoric with a calm statement like “I don’t think this is a productive conversation” or “I’m clearly not the right person for you to talk about this topic with” and then ending the call if necessary. If he’s saying you can’t understand because you’re a woman, then let him know that he then shouldn’t call you for advice.
Anon
I’ll try these responses on him! Unfortunately for him, he is the only boy in a large family of girls (probably another slight LOL) although he doesn’t try venting to his several brother in laws.
Anonymous
Any chance he’s discovered Andrew Tate? Because that’s what this sounds like.
Anonie
Yea, to me, if your brother calls and “wants to vent,” that’s something that you don’t need to indulge and can put up a boundary around. Did you all talk on the phone regularly before he started acting like this? If not, then he’s basically using you as a sounding board for his disgusting ideas – which by the way are personally insulting to you as a woman. It sounds like you’ve made reasonable efforts to try to redirect him, and he’s not biting.
Now I think your next step has to be whatever best protects you and your peace and mental health, regardless of what may be best for your brother and certainly regardless of what he may prefer.
Anon
We have an 8 year gap and haven’t ever been that close. It’s new that he wants to vent. I’ve tried listening to be supportive because I’m glad he started therapy and is working on himself. That’s commendable, and I want to support. But you’re right – it’s personally insulting to me, and I don’t like hearing it.
Anon
Agree with everyone else that he sounds like he’s red pilled, or on the way. You don’t have to be his punching bag, you know. He’s an adult, he will find plenty of company online to vent to, and it sounds like he’s very online already.
Next thing you know, you’ll be talking about having enjoyed the Barbie movie and he’ll be raging at you about how you should have seen Sound of Freedom instead. (Please don’t)
Anonymous
Dublin for one night – tomorrow – please give me pub and restaurant ideas!!
From SF – but just spent 2 weeks in Spain…
Thank you!!
Runcible Spoon
Where did you go in Spain? How did you enjoy the visit? Was it beastly hot?
Anon
has anyone ever heard of or done the ‘safe and sound protocol’? i’m cross posting from the mom’s page to perhaps get more insight. my daughter’s OT suggested it and while we generally love her, I’m a bit skeptical of this intervention, though I don’t think it can be harmful
Anon
As someone who had vagal nerve dysfunction (from a medical condition) as a child, I’m annoyed by the whole polyvagal theory. But a lot of protocols work better than the underlying theory would suggest and I don’t know much about the actual protocol.
Anon
Sounds like the basic goal of this – improve self-soothing/decreasing anxiety/improving focus and attention – is a good one. It is something that any person can benefit from actually. Learning mindfulness meditation/yoga etc.. may be too much for many people and kids, but is essentially the same thing. It seems like the prescription price is high for what it is. But if the OT recommends it – and you love her, and she knows your daughter well, I would totally try it for a few months. Especially if she is continuing OT, and the therapist can follow along and see her progress, and give suggestions as well.
Anonymous
We haven’t done this with our OT, but it’s a very very common idea with ND kids that safety is truly an issue, that the kids misbehave when they don’t feel safe – Beyond Behaviors is a big one on this. My son has so many sensitivities to lights, sound, etc, I can see how he might be jumpy and on edge in ways that might feel to him like a lack of safety.