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Wednesday’s Workwear Report: Stretch-Cotton Pleated-Waist Top

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A woman wearing a beige button-front blouse and medium blue jeans

Our daily workwear reports suggest one piece of work-appropriate attire in a range of prices.

This top from Banana Republic seems like a fun option if you’re looking for a not-so-basic white shirt. I like the shape and the buckle at the back. It feels a little bit safari-inspired and reminds me of some of the earliest Banana Republic designs. (Sometimes I take a look at the old catalogs on eBay for fun.) The closest I’ve come to a safari lately is driving my SUV through the Adirondacks while herds of deer flank me on either side, but I still like the vibe.  

The shirt is $120 at Banana Republic and comes in sizes XXS-XXL. It also comes in navy, chickpea tan, and olive green. 

Sales of note for 8/10:

166 Comments

  1. A friend who is preppy said that her dad never drank anything but white liquor in the summer (e.g., gin and tonics). It seemed a bit like I always intuited this, like an Old Fashioned is just too heavy of a drink when it’s 95 and humid outside. A margarita would be better IMO. I grew up in a family that didn’t really drink much and then had a canned beer budget for a long time. But for having a summer party, this is the way to go, no? Will still have cold beer though :)

    1. WASPs do drink a wild amount, yes. It’s actually unbelievable how much they can put away and still function.

      1. I’m from NYC and BIG spreads of food (a truly absurb amount of food) was/is the standard at weddings. After the first WASP wedding which was gorgeous, but had almost no food I learned to bring snacks in my purse!
        Conversely, some of these people were at our wedding and were shocked at the heavy cocktail hour AND a 3-course seated meal (they might have keeled over if I did a Viennese hour!)

        1. lol! The WASP way to eat is a meat, a potato and a veggie and you only get one pork chop! Other cultures seem to do more one big pot meals and there is ALWAYS enough for everyone and whoever stops by.

    2. Idk maybe my palate is unrefined but I’ve never subscribed to the concept of broad beverage categories and whether they are appropriate. Some specific pairings are of course super good (like that particular red with that particular cheese, or that stout beer in front of a fireplace). But often I very much enjoy something that breaks some which-drink-when rule.

    3. I wouldn’t host a party with mostly liquor, and I grew up pretty preppy. Just not willing to encourage that level of liability. Beer is a much safer choice.

      1. But the light vs dark liquor in the summer. What of that? Is this where light vs dark rum matters (IDK what dark rum is like but have seen it; grew up thinking it was just another white liquor).

        Corn liquor is white, no? Kidding. Don’t do that.

          1. A lot of people drink Dark and Stormys at my aunt’s New England yacht club in the summer. The club makes a really good one too.

      2. I’m just curious and I’m trying to pose this without judgment, but I’m probably failing. A friend of mine has a daughter in a large university and she is upset that the daughter has been lying about her location, which the mother tracks using Life360, and she says she is worried about the daughter being trafficked from meeting people late night at McDonald’s or whatever that aren’t well known to her. Is this where the average parent is nowadays? I did some horrifying things in hindsight during college, but I cannot imagine my parents tracking where I am and being upset about this.

        1. I have a college kid and I have never tracked her location, not even when she was in high school. At this point I have to trust that I’ve raised her to be aware of her surroundings and to make good decisions.

          I don’t think college girls are generally the target of traffickers. It’s vulnerable youth who seem to be the targets in the media accounts I’ve read. And I don’t think traffickers tend to grab girls out of McDonald’s–the story usually seems to be that the trafficker wins the girl’s trust and she initially goes with him voluntarily because she thinks she is getting a job or a stable living situation.

        2. My college-age daughter and I both have iPhones and I can see her phone’s location using an app, but I rarely use it.

          She’s going to a big university and while I’ll probably check her location sometimes since I will miss her, I’m not that worried about her safety. She’s a big nerd, is fairly responsible, and trafficking doesn’t happen because someone leaves a twist tie on your car at Target or goes to McDonald’s at 11pm. I’m probably on the more permissive end but your friend seems pretty extreme.

        3. Our family shares location of phones and while I do sometimes peek in to see what my college kid is up to, it’s more so I can see whether she is driving or in class before I reach out to her for something. I would only ask about my college kid’s location if something very unusual happened, like she’s suddenly showing up in a far flung location without any notice, or if I got an out of character message.

          Part of letting kids grow up is to stop trying to control and monitor whether or not they go to McDonalds at weird hours, whether they sleep in their dorm building or someone else’s, and cease quizzing them about where they are and what they are doing. Your friend is going to drive her daughter away if she’s grilling her presumably adult child about this.

    5. Some people stick to their preferred drink no matter what, but I drink more white wine in summer than red. For a party, I would have beer, some surf sides, wine, and a cocktail like gin and tonic or a pitcher of margaritas with lime slices for garnish. Another summer type drink is mojitos with fresh mint.

    6. It’s about the heaviness v. lightness of the drink. I think of a mint julep as a summer drink because it’s cold and minty.

    7. I agree- just like I don’t want a hearty beef stew in the summer, I don’t want a heavier / richer tasting drink.

      Personally I prefer tequila-soda with lime or Palomas to margs – margs go over-sugary so easily.

      1. I get this sentiment, but my wanting of a hearty stew is absolutely tied to mood and not to temperature.

    8. I see this as a rule based on tradition and it carries the same weight as the rule about not wearing white before Memorial Day nor after Labor Day. Depending on your circle it may be a social faux pas to break the rules, but practically they don’t really matter. If you offer up a pitcher of peach bourbon smash at your summer BBQ, I’ll happily enjoy it and not judge.

      Personally, I love a good oatmeal stout in the summer and do get teased about it being a winter beverage. Same with IPAs being more suitable for summer.

    9. I think the ways bourbon is used are just different in warm weather: more mint julep and mules versus an old fashioned. Otherwise, yes, I think you’re right that people drink more spritz type drinks, rose, white wine, etc in summer than a darker liquor.

    10. Preppy or not, I think a lighter drink appeals to more people on a hot summer day or evening. My favorite is a vodka tonic with a big wedge of pink grapefruit for the squeeze.

    11. It depends on your crowd. I would offer a non-fizzy option like white wine or rose.

    12. My WASPy grandparents were whiskey in the winter and gin in the summer.

      I don’t drink liquor, but I drink different beers and wines depending on the season.

  2. Can a resident lesbian share any tea on why Brandi Carlile has postponed her tour?

    1. oh no! I am supposed to see her next week. I am not a lesbian but i will look into it and post here if i gind anything useful.

      1. phew, its only the European tour shes postponing. Shes still on at Tanglewood next week. Anybody else on this board going to be there and want to meet up for a drink?

    2. I always say I’m a bad gay because I don’t partake in a lot of gay culture (not in a repressed self hating way! I didn’t know I was gay til I was 30 so my cultural preferences were already set) so sadly I’m the wrong resident lesbian here!

      2. Haha, I’m a straight lady but I’ve been seeing the tiktok trend of “finding a wife at a Brandi Carlile concert” and I’m sort of reconsidering my straight-ness now. Maybe I do want to find a wife at a Brandi Carlile concert.

        1. Sameeeeee. I don’t have time to date. I just want a lesbian to find me and convert me.

  3. I’m a parent to a high school senior. I understand that we will need to do a CSS form in October to be eligible for all internal scholarships at the private colleges my kid is applying to (like for merit aid; we are not needy). Since I am self-employed and inherited a sliver of a family farm, I imagine that it will be complicated for me. But since we aren’t looking for any need-based aid, can we just be approximate and use Zillow for house and farmland value? My sibling and cousins won’t want to get up in their business over getting any official appraisal or worrying about whether the lease or insurance are market or not (the land is leased because no one wants to get bought out or can really afford it).

    Our high school won’t open for a few more weeks and the ratios are something like 250:1, so you all are at least likely to be both responsible and not wrong (so I’d buy you a white or dark liquor drink of your choice if this were real life). I’m just trying to get a sense of what I need and the fourth quarter is always a hot mess at work. Kid is trying to get all applications in for early action, which will put that going in before my form goes in.

        1. I think we have a lot of parents going through college application process, as you know, and many have questions. OP’s question is very reasonable.

    2. You fill it out based on info you have. The CSS does not require you to get professional appraisals of real estate done.

    3. I used Zillow for our home value on the CSS. I have never heard of anyone getting a property appraised just for financial aid forms.

      You will also have to complete the FAFSA annually. Don’t count yourself out for need-based aid if your family income is in the low six figures. The private colleges’ internal need formulas are incredibly opaque and may come out nothing like the FAFSA SAI or the on-line calculators.

        1. It is crazy, but some schools are like this. Not all, but I think it is more for ones with big endowments, not ones happy to have a really high-stats kid.

    5. This is a question for ChatGPT or r3ddit, considering you’re not looking for a legally binding answer.

    6. If you want the official answer, call the financial aid offices at the schools to which your kid is applying.

      But I’ve never heard of anyone getting an actual appraisal for financial aid forms. I think Zillow estimates are fine

      1. What do you do if you are a part owner of a business? Ian how they handle things like that (like you have a t-shirt company or something that’s bigger than a side hustle / Etsy seller)?

        1. Presumably at some point you’ve worked with a financial planner in order to map out your tax strategy and succession / retirement planning in the past two to three years. That planning would have included an estimate of the current value of the business which can then be recycled into any other financial forms that arise.

          1. I am not sure that all small business owners, especially those who just do consulting work, actually keep up with this.

  5. I ask this question from curiosity, not judgement, as I’ve personally struggled with feeling like having Google in my pocket at all times has worsened my memory and concentration. I never memorize anything anymore because I know I can look it up again any time I need to and it’s become a bit disconcerting. For those of you who are heavy AI users (and I know there are some from prior conversations), have you noticed any changes, positive or negative, to your cognition, memory, etc.? I remember some posts here discussing things like lightening the mental load by having ChatGPT do a grocery list, which seems beneficial, but we know from other sources that using AI to write or do research leads to little knowledge retention. Anyone have any anecdata to share about your perceptions of its impact on your brain?

    1. I like the feeling of thinking. Whether it’s doing the NYT Pips domino logic, reading a Rick Steves book to prep for a new city, or making a shopping list and organizing it by where my brain knows the items are located in the grocery store. Using AI feels like it deprives me of the fun part of planning.

    2. As someone who is not a heavy AI user (and minimizes all interactions with it to the extent that I can), but who interacts with other people who have become heavy AI users, I can tell you that it is very apparent the negative impact such heavy AI use has on those individuals and their ability to remember, to think critically, and to come up with creative ideas on their own. It’s an addiction and they are junkies.

    3. Also not an AI user, but I google plenty and consume more social media than is probably healthy. I’ve recently started memorizing things to reactivate that part of my brain. I memorize poems, Bible passages, etc. It is definitely harder than it was when I was a kid, but it feels good to exercise that skill.

      1. OP here and I’ve been starting to do the same, actually. An old song I loved from the 90s came on one of my playlists and I could still remember every word easily (just like with poems I memorized back then) – I’d like to feel like I could harness that again.

    4. My work experience has totally turned me off from using AI generally… What I see over and over is that it is giving the cohort of superusers this idea that they’re being profound when they’re being… just… wrong? Like, to a nonsensical portion.

      For example – Our policy is that X facilities get Y payments for items A-C. In the guidance, it includes historical language about how (previously) they treated items H-K; however, those items are no longer covered and we haven’t paid for them since 1996. LLM (incorrectly) picked up in its summary that we pay for items A-K and provided substantive language applying current program logic to something that doesn’t exist anymore and hasn’t in 30 years… High AI user is ADAMANT that we are doing something WRONG because we shouldn’t pay Item J. We don’t, we reply. We demonstrate that this shows zero. High AI user tells us we’re wrong because policy says X. And on and on and on… The amount of time it takes to prove that something is impossible is… So much.

      1. This tracks with my experience. I’ve stopped engaging with our AI afficionados and put it back on them to bring me concrete examples of the “problem” for troubleshooting. Until they do, the problem does not exist. Their dependence on AI does not mean they get to assign me the busy work of proving AI is dumb.

    5. Honest question: what do you do for work meetings? They are what keep me sharp, not online games.

      We have junior colleagues who thought they could look things up in lieu of preparing for the meeting, but what happens in practice is that others respond with the answer while they are trying to search for the information and the conversation moves on without them. After a few months of this, the smart ones get it and start prepping for meetings so they can respond to follow up questions in real time.

    6. I’m both a user of AI and a skeptic. I’m not sure if it’s negatively impacting my cognition overall, but I definitely get into a bad habit if I’m using it a lot I start to lean on it for the dumbest, most mundane things. In fact, noticing how I was coming to rely on it was creeping me out, and I have ethical concerns with it overall, so I have drastically cut back my use and am considering deleting my accounts.

    7. No I don’t think it lessens my mental capacity. I read about 50 books a year and I read several news sites daily. This argument is akin to did a calculator make me bad at math thinking.

      Can people use any kind of technology to be lazy is really the question people are circling around. And the answer is obviously yes. You can’t prevent people from taking shortcuts if shortcuts are available.

      That being said, I use AI every day to aggregate research I want to consume, I ask it to do a critical analysis of arguments I’ve made and sharpen them but keep them at a certain reading level for my audience, and sometimes I just ask it to draft an initial draft because blank page stress is a real thing that prevents people from writing.

      2. Calculators don’t have the cheating/replacement of thought potential as AI, though. AI bots are now taking entire online courses for students, Princeton has done away entirely with non-proctored exams for the first time in its history, entire papers are being fabricated, most students cheat on essays…

        1. But the point to your argument is still, will some people cheat if they are given the option? Yes. Is that an AI issue or a cheating issue? Just because people can use something to cheat doesn’t mean all people will. It also isn’t true that everyone who use AI is failing to use their brains in other concrete ways.

    8. I have never touched AI in my personal life and have no intention of doing so, but my boss is all-in on AI and it’s basically one of the only tools I was given in my new job. So I’m using it a lot during the workday. I know I am actively getting worse at the minutia of my job and that this will likely come back to bite. But I also don’t care enough about my job for that to bother me personally. My boss told me to ask AI to explain projects before asking him, and there have been many times that the AI lead me astray and I wasted a couple of days of work before my boss had time to review and correct my misunderstanding. I intentionally schedule time to do things the slow way to make sure my skills don’t atrophy too much, but I’ve also done similarly in real life – I try to avoid using google maps after my second time visiting somewhere, and accept getting lost or taking a more roundabout route when I’m trying to figure it out myself.

      1. Yes, it has been shown that your brain changes and you begin to loose spatial memory skills by using Google maps. Similarly, studies are showing that typing while you take notes instead of consolidating information in your mind and writing abbreviated notes by hand is also associated with poorer memory and understanding of the material. And as the OP is worrying, yes – purposefully memorizing material less and relying on digital devices to be your portable brain will make it more difficult with time to memorize similar new material.

        You know what they say. Use it or lose it. But the question will remain – can you still function well enough that it doesn’t matter for your life?

        Sadly, most children no longer read novels, write in depth essays, play outside daily, engage in creative independent play with other children. The world changes.

        2. It’s so alarming that most kids spend less than 10 minutes in unstructured outside play each day but up to 7 hours on screens.

    1. I do a latte first thing in the morning followed by an Americano a few hours later. I’ll occasionally have more but not often these days. I’d gladly take a cup of decaf in the afternoon but I’m too lazy to clean the caffeinated beans out of the hopper.

    3. Usually just one. What it is depends on the day and where I am. At home, a latte or an aeropress. At work, a keurig or a nespresso, unless I stop somewhere to buy a latte. I occasionally have a decaf in the afternoon, but not often.

    4. Two shots of espresso worth per day, sometimes as straight espresso, more often as an Americano or brewed over ice. Sometimes as a latte.

    5. Usually two — one right away when I get up, and another later in the morning. Sometimes I’ll have a small one in the afternoon, and it’s almost always a decision I regret.

    6. At home, one fairly large cup of drip coffee with cream and sugar. When traveling, one large (160z) latte, and sometimes a coke zero/diet coke for the afternoon slump. I cut down my coffee consumption a TON in my 30s and I’m trying not to let it creep back up in my 40s as I face increasing exhaustion/brain fog.
      If I’m getting a migraine I will also add in a full sugar coke or a coke slush for medicinal reasons.

    8. 3 12 oz mugs. But generally I end up dumping about a quarter to a third of the 2nd and 3rd ones.

    10. I bring two 16 oz mugs with me every day, but I don’t usually finish them both. I’m trying to cut back. Sort of.

    11. about 12 oz to 14 oz. I fill the water somewhere between the 2 and 4 on my maker.

      The last third of a mug usually gets poured out or forgotten about.

    13. Tell me your secrets! Do you have to work up a tolerance?! Does it affect your sleep? I want to drink more coffee, but I am sad to say that I now notice the difference in my sleep when I even have a few ounces of cold brew or coffee in the morning. Decaf doesn’t hit the same way.

      1. I love drip coffee so much. I now drink decaf and nothing after 12pm. When I have full caff, I get jittery, which I didn’t until I was about 45.

      3. OP here! I drink 2-3 large mugs at home over the course of the morning or 1 cup and 1 tumbler travel mug on office days. I’m late 30s and have been drinking coffee since my teens. I guess a tolerance was built up? I get headaches if I skip it. It doesn’t impact my sleep at this point, but I rarely drink it after 2 pm (only at weddings/reception type events).

    14. 4-5. I feel like I need to chime in because the overall average described is so low. I’ve been drinking coffee since I was about 13. I have a hard stop at noon though. After noon, I drink only water or green tea when it’s cold out.

    15. One 12 oz French press every morning and that’s it. I used to drink way more but the last year I’ve been very cognisant of the impacts of my lifestyle decisions and making better decisions

    16. Two or sometimes three. It used to be more but a couple of years ago, around when I turned forty, my no coffee after 3pm rule had to become no coffee after 1pm and that makes it hard to fit more in. If I drink coffee too late I get an unpleasant kind of difficulty sleeping where I’m too awake to sleep but not awake enough to do anything like read and just have to lie down with my eyes closed, it feels the outside of my brain is asleep but the inside isn’t. My coffee process of choice is a V60, sometimes with freshly ground beans and sometimes with bought ground, and a lot of milk. I usually have a green tea in the morning and several fruit or herbal teas in the afternoon.

    17. 6-8 oz of brewed coffee in bed to get started. A latte (double shot of espresso) at 9:30 and another around 2:00. If I have high-energy stuff going on in the evening, sometimes I’ll have a third latte at 5:00 p.m. to keep me going until 11:00.

    18. At one point was an all-day coffee drinker–two full coffee pots over the course of the day. Eventually I cut back to one cup/day, and after temporarily giving up caffeine for unrelated reasons I realized what a huge impact caffeine has on my baseline anxiety level (unfortunately for me, since I love coffee). Now I normally don’t drink any, but will get a decaf if I’m out at a cafe as a treat.

    19. Usually 2 lattes…a 3rd cup is often appealing but I usually feel jittery/nauseous if I actually drink it. I often have a cup of tea in the afternoon as well.

    20. 1.5-2 mugs in the morning (about 20-24 oz total), then typically nothing caffeinated the rest of the day. Occasionally a Coke Zero if I need an afternoon boost.

    21. 1 latte with a double shot of espresso in the morning before I leave for work. If I’m particularly tired or have to stay up late, I might drink black tea if I remember before 3:00 pm. This is pretty rare for me.

    23. 6-7 espresso with a dash of oat milk. I like the taste, the pause that I get while waiting for the machine. I am also not sensitive to caffeine, never was (I actually have an espresso before I had for night-time shower).

  7. Rant ahead: My friend is constantly talking about how busy she and her kids are and how much money they spend on various kid activities. She was like this before kids, and now she has funneled her kids into expensive travel sports, and she’s constantly throwing her hands up about how busy it makes them and how expensive it is.

    I’m like… you chose this?! You do not have to do these activities. She acts like it’s the only way to raise kids in her town (and maybe it is). I find it so annoying. Just accept that you have agency over this and you are actively making choices that make you spend your money and time this way! I hate the whole “woe is me” charade, especially because she clearly thinks this is a status symbol.

      1. Not necessarily. I go through periods of thinking my friends are insufferable and annoying.

        1. Did you read her post? She says she’s “constantly” “annoying” — does that sounds like OP likes her?

          1. No, she says she’s “constantly” talking about this issue, which is annoying, not that she’s constantly annoying. You misrepresented OP, likely intentionally. You understand that people often exaggerate in normal conversation and that not every word is to be taken literally, right? You know that? Like OP doesn’t mean that her friend is literally, constantly, talking about this issue. So presumably she has other attributes and things to say that are likable. You can like a person and find something that they do annoying. I mean, wouldn’t most of us say that about close family members? You’re being purposely obtuse. Stop it.

      2. OP didn’t say that she didn’t like her. Why bother commenting if you’re just going to misrepresent what people are saying?

    2. I’m sympathetic to how hard schedules are and how little “casual sports” opportunities are now available for kids but I agree – you CAN opt out. Maybe you have good reasons not to but if it’s making you miserable as a parent, you can stop.

      1. Even casual sports have stupid schedules.

        My first kid swims two days a week and we have to apply for practice slots in May for practices starting in September. We find out next week what we got in the practice lotto. There’s a good chance I’ll have to leave work early to get her to practice, but don’t know yet.

        My other kid also does rec soccer. We find out the practice schedule the day before practices start.

        Once I have that info, I have to frantically try to move around piano lessons to make things fit.

        Kids aren’t doing anything fancy, but it’s stupid to schedule. And even once scheduled, things move around and change constantly.

        1. It’s very complex in my area too, even for rec sports. Softball and basketball both meet 3+ times per week between practices and games. For basketball, you can at least submit recurring conflicts and hopefully get scheduled around those times. But softball schedules are all over the map and you get no say in when it happens. My kid isn’t crazy over-scheduled, at least compared to many around us, but she has piano lessons, Hebrew school and a rec dance class weekly and Scouts biweekly. During softball season we end up skipping both softball and other stuff fairly often, and I’m not sure how much longer we can get away with that. Even at the rec level it doesn’t feel fair to the team to be absent so much. But I also hate to make her give up softball or give up everything else in order to attend softball consistently. And all of this is with one kid.

    3. Honestly, just call it out: “this is the circus you chose” or “I don’t care enough about this topic to commiserate with you.”

        3. I do talk this way to people, and more often than not they just laugh and change the subject.

          2. Maybe, but at least I don’t have to spend time listening to truly dumb laments. You aren’t being a good friend by letting people wallow in their made up misery.

          3. Yeah. I often laugh and change the subject when people are alarming rude. But I don’t stay friends with them.

          4. Same, and I get the same reaction. I’m not the repository for those types of humble brags, and people who are not completely vapid quickly learn that the complaints are not impressing me the way they wanted them to.

          1. The original conversation (by that I assume you mean OP’s friend’s complaints) isn’t socially awkward, it’s annoying. Do you truly not understand the difference between making a socially awkward comment about your friend’s behavior – to your friend – that would likely make them uncomfortable or feel hurt, and annoying whining? And how is “fight fire with fire” possibly a reasonable approach to take w/r/t talking to a friend. Good grief.

          2. Why coddle them? If their feelings being hurt for ten seconds makes them less annoying, generally, it’s a win.

          3. Yeah that’s not how friendship or normal human interaction works for a lot of people. Being respectful of someone’s feelings isn’t “coddling” them. People aren’t improvement projects. Hurting someone’s feelings to improve them is a really disgusting attitude. OP could consider a different approach to addressing this with her friend, but the statements above (which I presume would be delivered bluntly and without a lick of kindness) are not likely to be taken well. It’s not going to be 10 seconds of hurt feelings, it’s going to be OP’s friend feeling crappy because she realizes she’s been annoying OP and who knows how many people for who knows how long. Or, friend no longer wants to be friends with OP because she now realizes OP is dismissive, rude af, and doesn’t care about her feelings. You seem to have very little insight into healthy communication or friendship.

          4. People aren’t MY improvement projects, but everyone on this earth should be their own improvement project, perpetually.

    4. Opting out can cause a lot of harm to your kids social standing and make adult networking very hard. My ultra wealthy parents opted out of all that stuff and by highschool I had basically no friends because my peers lived entirely different lives.

      1. Yep, this is a real point and a concern for parents who may want to opt out. Once you have kids, your choices impact them and you have to consider that. OP, try talking to your friend and understanding her point of view, it may be more complex than you think.

        1. Agree.

          For my kids, even having a working mom put them on the outs with some kids as early as elementary school because we couldn’t manage to do non-scheduled hangouts after school because I had to have a plan or care for them (that often a friend could not spontaneously join or transportation or siblings were issues).

          If you don’t do what others do, they live on without you and don’t remember you for non-sports things like birthday parties or just hanging out.

          It’s rotten and it wasn’t like this growing up.

          1. As a child of two working parents in an affluent town, it absolutely was like this when I grew up (90s).

      2. This was my experience. I wasn’t particularly wealthy but by the time I got to middle school I was completely shut out of most friend groups, certainly the friend groups with college bound athletic kids. It’s the reason that opting out isn’t easy. I’m not a joiner or spender by nature but it breaks my brain how important sports are to kids in my area.

      3. Shockingly, there ARE plenty of people who don’t opt in to that lifestyle. Just because the parents’ social circle is so limited they don’t have exposure to anyone who doesn’t participate in the game doesn’t mean everyone plays.

    5. I would be annoyed too. I live in a town where some people believe everyone does certain intense kid activities related to academics. Some people do, but it’s only “everyone” if you hang out in limited circles.

      I try to limit my time with these folks before I say something I shouldn’t.

    6. If she’s really a friend, then you can just say “well, are you planning to drop something this fall to get some breathing room?” You also have agency here!!

    7. I have friends who vent endlessly about all kinds of things they chose and have control over – spouses and boyfriends, high pressure jobs where they make bank but have no time, demands of their volunteer work, etc. I have friends who complain endlessly about their long-gone exes (and to be clear not people with whom they share children). I have a friend who runs marathons and loves to complain about the demands of training. Some people like to vent.

      That does not obligate you to listen to them forever and there is something to be said for calling it out, although the scripts some people are suggesting would cause me to stop being your friend. I usually find asking “are you just venting or are you looking for solutions?” is often enough to call it out. Especially when it is followed with “still just venting?” the next time it comes up.

  8. Anyone have a recommendation for a great front-load washer I can buy at Costco that doesn’t have a bunch of AI/smart features? I just want something basic that isn’t going to have more fancy crap to break.

    1. We bought the Kitchenaid KDFE104HPS several years ago and have been happy with it. The cycle is a teeny bit long, but it gets the job done.

    2. Costco usually only has a few options. You’ll have a short list.

      I just got a new washer and absolutely love that it auto dispenses detergent, but that’s probably a bell you don’t want.

    3. I don’t know about Costco, but I’m happy with my Miele washer and heat-pump dryer after a few annoyances with some early problems. The brand has a reputation for lasting.

    4. I wish appliance manufacturers would stop with all the smart features. I don’t need my toaster to connect to the internet.

      We have one generation back from this (bought 3 years ago – no AI advertised). At the same time, we got my mom the LG wash tower (the permanently stacked W/D). The models are sisters. 5/5 would recommend. If you plan to stack yours, the wash tower having controls in the middle is awesome.

      https://www.costco.com/.product.4000110151.html

    5. FYI – many of the larger electronic devices will have smart features. But you don’t have to use them. I never hook up those parts of the device. Then no data is collected, and there is no chance they can try to suck you into paying monthly fees in the future for continued access.

      We have a whole house generator that we purchased right before they started adding the “smart” feature. Every year when I have the monthly service done, they try to convince me to add on the “smart” feature to my device for “easy access to software updates via Wifi”. They neglect to tell you that there will be a monthly service charge ongoing. When I buy something, I want to own it – not rent it. So I say no thank you. And ask them to bring any software updates with them if needed at the yearly service, as they are supposed to be doing.

  10. How much time do you estimate that you spend on personal hygiene and grooming per day? An hour in total?

    In typing that out, even an hour seems too much given everything else that needs to be done in a day. I don’t know how you can shorten that though. 20min in the morning, 40min in the evening.

    1. 5 minute shower in the morning, five minutes at night, and maybe 10 minutes total for my teeth. Another minute to moisturize. I don’t wear makeup. Ten minutes a week to trim and file nails. An hour each week total for hair washing and leg shaving.

    2. 20 minutes in the morning, 20 minutes in the evening, add 15 minutes any day that fully washing/drying my hair is involved (as opposed to just a little wetting for pre-styling purposes). On Sundays, I do “spa treatment” stuff (nails, exfoliating, and such-like) so that’s extra time each week. I think of myself as pretty low maintenance, but you’re right, when you type it all out it seems like way too much time out of my life.

    4. Shower + hair + dressing is 20 minutes in the morning and I spend no time on it in the evening. If I really need to, I can cut that down to 10 minutes if I do a super speed shower and don’t think too hard about my outfit. However, I do need to get a haircut every 2 months – I keep a pixie cut. The time savings is the primary reason I’ve stuck with it so long (over a decade at this point) – hair upkeep just takes so much time!

    5. If I have to the office, then it’s about 1/2 hour in the morning to deal with my hair and put on makeup. If not, then it’s just brushing my teeth in the am.

      I tend to shower at night, and then if it’s a business shower (shaving) then like 10-15 minutes, plus lotion and face moisturizer. Brush teeth.

      So per day, anywhere from 10 minutes to 45 minutes.

    6. 15 minutes in the morning to shower and put on casual WFH clothes; my hair dries naturally, I don’t wear makeup, and I did laser hair removal for everything years ago. Another 10 minutes at night to do my teeth and skin care.

    7. How are you spending 40 minutes in the evening???

      Showering, brushing teeth, applying makeup in morning – 20 minutes, maybe 30 if I’m shaving. I let my hair air dry.

      Evening – wash face, brush teeth. Under 10 minutes.

      1. Ugh maybe it’s the puttering. I scroll through the news and pick out a podcast or audiobook for the shower. I walk around and sit down etc. Y’all’s times are aspirational. I need to get my times down.

    8. Probably less than 30 mins.

      3-10 mins in a shower, approx 6 mins total brushing/flossing, approx 5 mins total on skincare and about 3 minutes on makeup.

      I layout my clothes for the week on Sunday. I don’t change my jewelry. I air dry my hair. My hair is just above my shoulder and wavy. I wash/condition it every day but it takes no time.

      Basic skincare (moisturizer AM/PM, sunscreen AM, retinol PM) and makeup (skin tint, mascara, blush, tinted chapstick).

      I do get 2 massages a month and get monthly pedicures in the summer but that’s more hobby/self care.

    9. Does working out count? If not, then 15 minutes max daily, with an additional 1.5 hours for a haircut every 3 months. I guess that takes my number to 16 minutes per day maximum.

    10. These numbers seem so low! I take quick showers, but no way can I clean my entire body and hair in 3 minutes unless I’m in a desperate rush. My shower takes 4 minutes just to heat up!

      For in-office days, I spend 10 minutes shower, 15 minutes for lotion/makeup/blowdry, 5-10 minutes to pick an outfit and dress. At night, about 10-15 minutes to remove clothes and jewelry, then do my face wash and lotion and teeth routine.

    11. I spend 30-40 minutes in the bathroom each morning to shower, apply whatever lotions and creams I want, get dressed, and make my hair presentable before breakfast. Another 2 or 3 minutes to brush my teeth after breakfast.

      I brush my teeth again in the evening but don’t really do anything else other than put on PJs.

    12. I would say about an hour a day, though some of my evening time is spent multi-tasking (i.e., I do skincare and nail care while watching TV or talking on the phone). I take a decently long shower daily, twice if I work out in the evening, and need to dry my hair and put on a quick makeup face most days, even though I WFH. I have gotten a WFH uniform now, which has helped me save some time and consternation.and should also save some $$.
      I have aspirations of bleaching my teeth and using my laser hair remover a few times a week, which would add even more time. I am a monthly pedicure and long hair appointment every 10 weeks person, as well. And I do not look high maintenance. At all. I envy those who can look more put together in less time.

  11. How often do you feel “I’m starving and need to eat right this moment” hungry? I’m wondering if i need to eat bigger meals or something. And I go from slightly hungry to this very quickly and then it feels like an emergency.

    1. It’s just blood sugar. I keep drinkable yogurts and protein shakes on hand for this, and try to eat more fats and protein to minimize instances.

    2. Those 100 calorie packs of nuts are good for when you feel the hangry coming on. I used to keep them in my car back when I had a long evening commute and would arrive home a monster if I hadn’t eaten something.

    4. Almost never. You are probably not eating enough satiating fat, protein, and slower carbs during your meals. Are they carb heavy, with lots of simple sugars? I eat relatively low carb, balanced meals and never feel like I’m starving normal. Heavy exercise needs sufficient calories of course.

    6. This is how low blood sugar starts out for me. I don’t experience it nearly so often as I used to, probably because I now eat smaller amounts more frequently as opposed to larger meals spaced too far apart.

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