Suit of the Week: UNTTLD

127 Comments

1. I have a video therapy appointment tomorrow with a therapist I’ve never seen. I’ve only ever seen one other therapist who I did not like and only had 1 appointment with, and that was years ago. I’m not sure how to prepare for this appointment – I’m having a lot of feelings about things, and am somewhat overwhelmed by them, and I feel like I could just word vomit all over the place, but is that constructive? Should I make notes ahead of time? Sorry for the rambling post…perhaps I need therapy lol.

   1. I think therapists are pretty used to word vomit. But to make good use of your time, I think making notes about what your goals from therapy are would be helpful. And then I think you can say — “I made this list to avoid word vomit, because I have identified at least 10 issues that I struggle with/I think are underlying my concerns. I will take your lead on how we should proceed.” And have a list of those issues, but be prepared for that list to change in the course of therapy because part of what the therapist does is help you see things you don’t.

      1. +1, this is something I worried about, this is exactly what I did, and it was really helpful.

      2. Yup. I’ve done this before. And it was actually helpful for me, not just her, because it allowed me to sort through some of my crap in advance and really hone in on what’s bothering me. I brought a little post-it to my appointment with my list of three things I wanted to be sure to mention in our getting to know you appointment.

   2. I think your therapist will be used to word vomit and experienced at how to guide you to what you want to work on, but it can’t help to think about what specific issues have motivated you to pursue therapy.

      1. *can’t hurt, I mean!

2. I am at my wits end with apartment and city living specifically elevators. They are CONSTANTLY full now as my building is doing construction, people are coming and going all day with their dogs and coffee and friends; no longer can you get your own elevator even if you’re willing to wait — you might have to let 15 of them pass which gets old with heavy groceries as I still shop to stock up. I wear a mask and most people do but some don’t and as these things go the elevator always stops someplace on the way down and an unmasked person gets on. A few times I’ve gotten off and waited on that floor — and then left with the feeling of — no way did we pass 6 ft apart as I got off and he got on as the elevator doors aren’t that wide. And then once I ended up having to ride with a maskless guy who was carrying his mask and wouldn’t put it on even when I said something.

   I’m sure everyone in NYC is dealing with this as people relax (as well as DC, Boston) but how much does it “bother” you? Like if you end up in an elevator with an unmasked person or someone stands RIGHT next to you at self checkout and the most distance you can give yourself is a foot. Do you stew over it or is it like — eh it was 2 min, I wasn’t sitting down to dinner with them for an hour.

   Like I’m over it like ready to buy a house today even though I don’t want a house, nor can I survive an hour+ long suburban commute (I know we aren’t going back to normal anytime soon but I suspect we will even if it takes a year or 2 — I cannot see myself doing LIRR or NJT for the long haul but I also know that you can’t buy a house today and then sell it when your job requires you back in the office FT in 2022 because you will lose $ esp given that houses in the suburbs right now are going for all cash over asking). Please tell me I’m being over anxious here??

   1. Does it help if you try to remember that “close contact” is not just within 6 feet, but also for an extended amount of time (10 mins)?

      1. This. I think of it as a spectrum. 6ft is best but 1 or 1.5 ft is still better than nothing. 2 min of contact is better than 10 min or 1 hour. You being masked is better than no one being masked. 2-3 people in the elevator is better than 5 people in the elevator.

         And for grocery stores I’ve seen people lean/turning their back a bit and now I do it too. I’m not saying it’s perfect but lean 6 inches away and suddenly you have 6 inches of distance.

   2. It doesn’t bother me. I wear a mask, it’s a short ride.

   3. Deep breath. Maybe think about renting a house but your instinct is right — don’t buy a house if you don’t want a house for at least the medium term (5ish years). Besides the fact that houses outside of NYC are selling for a lot more than what they’re worth right now, also consider that the housing stock is old esp in the towns that give you NJT or LIRR access, so guaranteed you buy the house and within 6 mos you’re stuck with a bill for thousands for something that urgently must be replaced like a roof; things can pass inspection (which may even be waived now due to pandemic and speed of market) and still end up costing you a lot. Now normally I don’t think of that as a deterrence to buying a house, but I do think it is a deterrence esp when you say you don’t want a house nor that type of 90+ min commute even 1-2 years from now.

   4. I’m going to repost my response from this morning.

      Gently, you do seem over-anxious about this elevator thing. I’ve seen you post this question or variations on it several times now. I don’t blame you – we’re all dealing with a ton of stress and we latch onto strange things, but you have to find a way to deal with this. Wear your mask, practice some phrases like “do you mind waiting for the next elevator so we can maintain distancing? If you’re in a rush, I’ll wait” when you see an unmasked person getting on, and otherwise, let it go. Can you take the stairs sometimes?

      1. And on that note, AAM had a post with some phrases meant for use in a job interview, but they’re worth adapting:

         “Could you back up a few feet to give us both more space?”
         “I’m going to move my chair over here so there’s more space between us.”
         “Before we go on, would you mind adjusting your mask so it’s covering your nose as well? I’m trying to be really careful.”
         “Before we start, would you mind wearing a mask? I’m high-risk/live with someone who’s high-risk/trying to be really careful. I’ll of course keep one on myself too.”

   5. I responded on your earlier thread. Looks like it just now got posted. (Just in case you didn’t see it.)

   6. Can you time your trips out to less busy times? In my building no one is in the elevator early except the die-hard runners, and no one is in the elevator Sunday morning except dog walkers.

   7. I just responded on the previous thread. I don’t think it’s productive to view 6 feet as a safe distance or 4 feet as an unsafe distance. It’s somewhat arbitrary and obviously the time and activity spent together makes a difference.

   8. I mean, it would annoy me but I wouldn’t stew over it.

   9. Can you shift your thinking? I practice social distancing and wear a mask to keep the virus from spreading, not because I live in constant fear of getting sick. If someone walks past me without a mask, I just shrug it off and wash my hands. I don’t decide that person is a villain and call up building management like I’ve been assaulted. You’ve posted about this a lot and I seriously think you’re suffering from anxiety here.

      1. Some of us are actually trying to protect ourselves as well as others, though. I don’t want to get the virus, and I have a right to expect that others will contain their own respiratory droplets with a mask and will keep their distance from me, just as I am doing for them.

         1. Ok bro. But this poster needs to stop being an anxious disaster about her elevator.

            1. +1 yes there is some risk but evidence is that most cases are transmitted by close contact indoors for more than 10 minutes. Yes we should all be wearing masks but short encounters with non mask wearers are really not such a huge risk. Call the building manager and ask if they can make mask wearing mandatory, post signs, send reminders, etc but this isn’t going away anytime soon and having an anxiety attack every time you see someone without a mask walk by you for the next year or two isn’t going to decrease your risk of getting this and is definitely going to lead to mental health issues.

         2. I mean, I agree you have a right to expect it, but realistically and unfortunately, not everyone will comply. Given your concerns, it makes sense to use the elevators at off hours, even though it is annoying to go shopping at 7 am or whatever.

            I don’t know where it ends. If I wear a high quality mask, but someone else wears a thin bandanna, do I have a right to expect them to wear a better mask? I don’t know what my rights are in this case, but I am pretty sure I can’t enforce others’ behavior other than asking the building manager to get involved, etc. Do you want them to be fined? Kicked out of the building? Arrested? I doubt management will do much more than post more signs and reminders.

      2. Your response to OP is incredibly rude. “Call up building management like I’ve been ASSAULTED.” Really?!?

         Honestly, if my building weren’t making it mandatory to wear masks in the elevator, I would see if that could get changed. If that didn’t seem likely or didn’t feel like a fight I’d want to take up, I’d move somewhere with a better situation. Either another apartment that had a better set up ( lower floor or fewer people to elevator ratio or a mask policy) or maybe even renting somewhere out of the city. I personally like to grab a few hours to work outside if I can, so having somewhere with some outdoor space would mean a lot to me. Even just the hassle factor of timing coming and going to avoid crowded elevators would probably be a deciding factor to rent elsewhere.

      3. Isn’t it possible that more than one poster is concerned about elevators?

   10. Can you get a really good mask? I’m high risk (current immune system lowering cancer treatment + over 60) and I got a P95 mask (not suitable for med people). It fits so snugly that breathing in causes a suction effect so I know particles are unlikely to get in. Read medical articles about mask fitting for nurses, doctors. I think cloth masks are more risky because they don’t seal around the sides and nose, which is why the experts say they protect others, not the wearer.

       If you can’t get a 95 mask, I read an article that said that a second layer over a cloth mask would decrease the permeability to 90-98. The article said to use a pair of tights or pantyhose, which I thought looked very stupid. But before I got my P95 I used a “buff” or stretchy gaiter. I got 6 for $10 on amazon but you can get them at REI or outdoor stores. I also wear the gaiter while biking or hiking when I pass too close to anyone unmasked.

       Hang in there.

       1. I left out a few words. Wear the tights or buff over the cloth mask. The extra layer creates an all around seal against the face, keeping virus particles from entering on the sides or beside the nose.

          1. I don’t think you’re wrong that another layer is going to increase protection, but cloth masks, even two, are not going to stop “virus particles.”

             1. Well, according to this NPR article, you are wrong. The reason cloth masks don’t work is two things – holes bigger than the virus/virus particles and air seepage around the sides and nose portion of the cloth masks.

                NPR says that cloth mask + hose overlayer goes from 75% small particle blockage to 90% blockage, very close to the 95% of an N95 respirator.

                I love the way you disdain my choice of the words”stop virus particles” but I like that I was correct in my understanding of the article, which is a very useful article. For some reason, people often knock down my comments, in which I am trying to be both helpful and accurate. https://www.npr.org/sections/goatsandsoda/2020/04/22/840146830/adding-a-nylon-stocking-layer-could-boost-protection-from-cloth-masks-study-find

3. Follow-up question from the morning. Teachers and spouses of teachers, do teachers’ unions have any voice at all in planning for school reopenings? I don’t see any evidence in our local media, in conversations with teachers in our district, or in the discussions here that unions are taking any position whatsoever. Are they advocating to protect their members against infection? To ensure that distance learning, smaller class sizes, and disinfection don’t add to members’ workload? Other measures?

   1. Of course they do and they’re loudly advocating for their members.

      1. What are they advocating for specifically?

         1. Look it up. But in my area for lots of work from home and no evaluations and no recording lessons.

         2. To protect jobs at all costs. There is a big concern that online learning will (1) require way more of teachers in terms of hours and will be challenging to in WFH environments, and maybe even leave the less-tech-savvy teachers behind, and (2) reduce headcount as one teacher can feasibly produce content for an entire fifth grade vs 1 teacher per 25 kids. There are counter points being argued vehemently, but nevertheless, the union is quietly loud (not often talked about) and very much driving the bus in our districts’ negotiations.

         3. Go to your local union’s FB page/website and see. Or check your school board meeting minutes.

         4. Why not recording of lessons?

            I have two kids and often their things are in outright timing conflict with each other. Other times, especially with math, they need to go back over the teaching. I don’t understand this — it would be really helpful to parents and students.

   2. I worked in a super red state’s legislature and even those lawmakers were deferential to the teachers’ unions.

      Just because you don’t see them doing things publicly doesn’t mean they aren’t talking with lawmakers.

   3. I’m the educator from MA who posted earlier. Here is the commissioner’s tentative reopening guidelines. Note that 6’ has become 3’. While I am largely supportive/agree with the fact that children’s (and parents’) mental health has suffered during lockdown and that distance learning was a failure for many, I’m very concerned for the over 50-contingent of educators. My sense is that even if we do attend for a bit this fall, I anticipate there will be school closures once again during the winter. Also, who will be a substitute teacher now? I don’t know-I’m feeling very depressed the last few days. Fearful about my and my children’s health and also really wanting to go back to work/have them be back in school.
      http://www.doe.mass.edu/covid19/return-to-school/guidance.docx

      1. young people will be subs. maybe this will cause some long tenured people to retire.

      2. I keep seeing comments re teachers over 50 and I’m genuinely curious about this. My mom is in this category and she’s itching to go back to teaching in person. She’s far less concerned about interacting with her students than living with my cousin who is living with them right now but working at a restaurant doing takeout. And I tend to think she’s right. The data seems to show that kids are far less likely to get this and far less likely to spread it. Especially younger kids. And with older kids, they can wear masks and teacher desks can have plexiglass installed/be moved further from students. Honestly I think being in a classroom with the same set of 25 students every day would be safer than going to my office with a bunch of young 20 year olds who are going to bars, etc.

         Also to answer OPs question, of course teachers unions are involved in these discussions.

   4. Good grief teachers’ unions are such villains here. I really can’t imagine collecting a teacher’s salary (100k here) and pension for sitting on my couch and not actually teaching in person. I mean, sweet job when you never have to spend time with the kids and the parents do all the work, right? I want to be a firefighter, but virtually, and I’d like my pension please!

      1. Uh no

      2. Right? We had salary cuts and even more work.

      3. My husband is a teacher and hated remote teaching this spring. In person was way easier. He had more than the usual amount of grading to do, it was impossible to get students motivated – and he takes the actual job of making students learn seriously, and he was cut off from the thing he actually enjoys about his job – interacting with students. I’m not sure why you think teaching is such a cushy job, but it isn’t. It is the only job I know of where you can have a PhD, 20 years of experience, and never ever ever be treated like a professional. Also, we are in NYC, which has a very strong union, and he does not make 100K, even with a PhD and many years of experience. A lot of teachers died here. The union is rightly concerned about protecting its members. That is their job. We have a child and homeschool was awful for us too, so we’re all for in-person learning, but there are no easy answers here.

         To answer OP’s question, in NYC the UFT is definitely involved. A friend who is the union rep at her school said they were basically pushing to be 100% remote (which she is against as she also has 2 young kids to try to homeschool while teaching her class), probably because they don’t believe the DOE can protect teachers otherwise. From what I have heard, a hybrid approach is more likely though.

      4. Whoa, where do teachers make 100k? My mom taught for 30 years and made 60k max when she retired a few years ago. This is SEUS.

         1. Only (possibly) in fancy areas of NY and California where parents expect their kids to receive a very advanced education and where the cost of living is sky high and six-figures is still a below-average wage for the area.

            1. Plenty of districts in MN are $80k, more if you have national licensure,coach, or do other teacher “side gigs” plus pension at the top of the pay schedule. Not to count holidays, sick days, vacation/PTO days, sabbatical rights, 180-185 scheduled work days annually and so on. And in MN there is a “teachers don’t pay for health insurance” union mantra , so many are close to free or nearly single health coverage. Versus $700 a month health for single coverage at a corporate job with a similar salary, less time off and working 260 days a year with no pension. All in total teacher compensation is $100k at the high end of the scale. Don’t get me wrong it’s a HARD job, but it’s also a difficult argument to make that teachers making that much are under compensated.

         2. Fancy school district on Long Island. A friend’s brother is teaching gym remotely at over six figures. He’s 30, so it’s not like he’s on the high end here. Also, even when he worked at the school, it was only nine months a year. Look, it’s basically not a crazy salary for a HCOL but it seems like a job no one should do remotely. I’ve never considered voting against a school budget before but I’m pretty disgusted at the way they’re taking advantage of the situation at the expense of our kids.

      5. Hello, I taught for 12 years before moving into administration in a very well resourced (i.e. top paying) high school in suburban Chicago. After 12 years and 2.5 Master’s degrees, I was making 89k, and would’ve easily been paid less in the majority of districts in the Chicago area. A 100k teaching salary is an outlier in most parts of the country outside of HCOL areas (and great teaching takes a good deal of experience and education, which we should be willing to pay for).

         We have also been BUSTING A$$ the past few months. I’ve never seen so much scrambling in my life in education, and while the results weren’t great (because it’s never been done before and we had almost zero time to prepare), it’s not at all for a lack of working hard. The switch meant throwing out (or at least seriously reworking) almost every lesson, assessment, and instructional tool we’ve worked to develop over the years. I would like to remind people that direct (video conferencing) instruction is only one very small piece of the puzzle, even though it’s what many seem to think is the bulk of our teaching.

         1. Oh, and thinking back, about $4-5k of that 89k was from doing extracurricular activities, not salary.

      6. L O L

4. I don’t like the detachable collar any more than I like the detachable tops from that other brand. Both feel like attempts to lock you into the brand.

5. Sort of a survey … if your employer offered a discount for employees using childcare at facilities run by a ubiquitous provider, how good of a benefit would that feel like? If it ended up with you paying, effectively, about 1/2 of market rate, would that feel like strong employer support for families?

   1. Yes definitely

   2. Yes, this would be amazing.

   3. My prior employer had that, as well as a certain number of free days at a backup childcare facility. I appreciated it, it was convenient at times, but I knew the message was “work as much as possible.”

      What would have meant more to me was flexible hours and work from home when necessary.

      But a lot of this was because my employer was known as a very difficult place to work, rightly so, and we all knew that they were doing this things to try to stem the tide of people quitting, without actually addressing why it was such a difficult place to work. (Culture and massive understaffing)

      1. Ah, thank you, that’s an interesting read! The goal is definitely to support employees in a way that communicates, especially to women, “we understand that you have a life outside of work, and we want to support your balancing that with your professional development.”

         I assume it would read better if it was coupled with, say, a strong “absolutely go pick your sick kid up from school, I’ll cover this call!” or “sorry, this meeting has to end in time for daycare pickup” culture?

         It would likely be an expensive program to implement, if we are to provide a really meaningful subsidy, but if it helps us attract and retain the right employees… I’ve never had access to that kind of program (and now Kiddo has aged out) so it’s hard for me to think about whether I’d use it and how I’d feel about it.

         What else would you like to see, do you think, to support parents?

         1. I was one of the only managers at my old company to really support work-life balance for all employees, not just parents. I was also the only female manager. Coincidence?

            Flexible work hours and working from home (during normal times) benefit us all. One guy who was single with no kids came up to me years later and told me being able to work from home 1/2 time had changed his life. He literally said that.

            Those are the accomplishments I carry around with me now. Not the fact that I got that study that should have taken 3 months out in 1 month by killing myself 24/7 to get it done.

            It’s a message from the top that we know you have a life outside of work that means the most to all employees, not just moms/parents.

         2. My employer had (until yesterday) a crisis care reimbursement option that meant that we were reimbursed part of the cost of child care in our home. This meant that I could hire my own nanny, whom I vetted, and have part of the costs covered while daycare was closed. We have a high-risk family member and it was the best way we could balance the risks without losing our minds.

            That has ended now that daycares are open. We now have a subsidy to go to a national chain but I’m not going to use it. I wish they would bring back the old subsidy. Yes, I completely understand that the goal was to make it possible for more people to work more, but guess what – it worked!

   4. No. If I couldn’t get a spot at the subsidized chain, or the care was not as good as what I could find elsewhere, or the chain wasn’t a good fit for my child or family for whatever reason, I’d be incredibly resentful that colleagues were getting subsidized care when I wasn’t.

      When I was in law school, I was extremely fortunate to get a spot for my daughter at the low-cost, high-quality university day care center. There was a ton of resentment among faculty, staff, and students about how difficult it was to get a spot and how expensive the private alternatives were. Any employer-subsidized program is likely to face the same issue, and it could easily lead to reduced job satisfaction and difficulties in retention as compared with a more flexible child care subsidy.

      1. Yeah I def. have trepidation about the availability of space at the selected chain, but also there are 3920483298 within a stone’s throw of the office…

         What alternative do you think would be better?

         1. A per-child payment or voucher that parents could use for any type of care. The equity issue there would be how to deal with stay-home spouses. Do those families still get the subsidy?

            1. And to me, that would look more like a straight up payment, which childless people might roll their eyes at.

            2. If people without kids don’t get the subsidy then I don’t think it makes sense to give it to people that don’t have paid childcare. Maybe pair it with a subsidy at a doggy daycare for other employees? (Half joking but I know there is always push back anytime there is a benefit available “just” to parents.)

            3. The company could contribute to a dependent care FSA for employees.

      2. The part about being a good fit isn’t relevant. What about people who don’t have kids or who have kids with special needs, etc. Of course they can’t participate in these programs. It’s like family medical coverage if you don’t have dependents – do you resent those who cover their families?

         1. It is relevant, though. What if there’s no discounted center near my home? Then I lose out on the benefit. Or what if the center is full of bullies, like one preschool my kid attended, and we have to move the kid? Everyone can participate in the health plan, but not all families will be able to participate in the child care benefit.

            1. But not everyone – not even all parents- can use the benefit to begin with. I don’t really understand this logic that just because this benefit isn’t applicable to everyone, it can’t be given. My kids go to a university daycare that has a years-long waiting list too, and yeah it was sad for us that we couldn’t get into it until my oldest was 1.5, but I was never “resentful” of others for having access to it when I didn’t. It seems really self-centered to want your colleagues to lose out on a benefit because it might work slightly better for them than for you.

   5. It would feel like a good benefit. It could feel like part of employer support for families, but only as part of an overall culture of support for families. For example, if the employer-provided daycare closed at 5:30, and all my colleagues rolled their eyes at 5:15, and my bosses questioned my commitment to work because they couldn’t find me at 5:30 (nevermind that they rolled into the office at 10:30), it’s still not a supportive environment.

      1. I’m really lucky in that we already have a ridiculously enthusiastic “out of the office at 5PM” culture (clearly not Big Law) so that’s not something I worry about.

   6. Sort of? It would be valuable to me — exactly as valuable as the amount of the discount. Without a supportive office culture, I would basically treat it like extra pay for how I thought about moving to a different job. I were applying there I would consider it a probably marker of a supportive culture but not decisive.

      1. Thanks for this comment — it helps me make a distinction: there’s the actual $ value, and then there’s the communicative value… we’ve had a sort of parallel benefit that employees have told me “I knew I wouldn’t be utilizing [thing] but the fact that it was there showed me you were the kind of employer I wanted to work for!” Hm.

   7. Is this Bright Horizons? Our family found their program to be overpriced and of middling quality at best.

      1. Ha, that’s been my read on BH too, TBH. It’s something along those lines, but not them.

   8. One thing to consider–any child care benefit will alienate the segment of the childless or SAH spouse employee population who also happen to be a-holes, creating further backlash against parents. All the parents in my very non-family-friendly office work longer hours than the non-parents, and the non-parents still gripe that we get special privileges.

      1. Part of creating a better culture probably includes not giving credence to the baseless gripes of anti-kid people, and I say this as a non-parent who obviously wouldn’t have any need for this kind of benefit. You shouldn’t let people feel like it’s a legitimate thing to complain about.

         1. +1 million.

   9. Yes, definitely – especially if it was good quality childcare, which it usually is (at least in my anecdotal experience).

   10. i don’t know exactly how employer subsidized daycares work, like does the employer pay $ to the chain daycare, is there a group rate, etc. if this actually costs the employer $ I’d rather be given $ to choose my own childcare.

       1. The outline, I gather, would be something like: market rate is $1000; parent pays $500 to provider; employer pays $400 to provider; remaining $100 is borne by the provider because employer has sent so many families that way.

          1. To me this type of arrangement is off-putting. The employer is negotiating a volume discount to encourage employees to use a particular provider. That’s kind of like making an HMO the only health plan offering.

             1. My (very minimal) understanding is that the employer has to pick one facility. It can’t just be a voucher otherwise those are taxable benefits.

             2. Actually, maybe that’s not true. I just recall there being some specificity about subsidizing one provider vs a voucher.

   11. Yes, that would definitely be a huge selling point for me. I would usually say that a better benefit would be priority admissions rather than a modest discount since getting into childcare with the lead time of a typical pregnancy+mat leave is challenging in my city, but for half off, I change my tune.

   12. Historically I would have said that I actually prefer the employer focus on subsidizing and securing backup care – in big cities employers can get contracts with nanny agencies where you have basically a credit to use, which is hugely helpful for random school holidays or when your primary childcare is closed. A specific subsidized childcare isn’t that helpful because it’s probably Bright Horizons or similar, which isn’t that great, and because most 2-parent families need childcare near their home so they can split drop-off and pick-up duties (would be a crazy commute from one parents office to childcare by other parents office and then to home).
       HOWEVER in these COVID times there will likely be a mass closure of childcare facilities and it will be really hard to get spots. So if the employer could get some sort of preference or guarantee, that would be a huge deal.

       1. Huge +1 that this has a lot more impact in Covid times than in normal times. My daughter’s daycare has spots for 98 kids and normally has about 60 kids on the waiting list. It’s currently 500-something, thanks to all the Covid closures in our community. Bright Horizons and KinderCare may not be the gold standard in childcare but they are reputable, pretty much guaranteed to be decent quality and safe, which can’t be said for a lot of places. I know people (women, lets be real) who’ve had to quit their jobs this summer because they couldn’t find any childcare that met basic quality standards. They would have give their left arm for a spot at a BH.

   13. Late to reply, but if you’re still gathering info I’ll share my experience. My employer does not directly offer a discount at a childcare center/chain, but while we were with a particular PEO we had a whole host of discounts. If I remember correctly, there were a few daycare chains on the list, as well as a discount with a backup care agency for in-home childcare. We only needed to use the daycare for a few weeks while a family member recovered from an injury, and didn’t even know about the discount until I had to fill out my employer info on the application at the center. The discount was not a huge percent, but it certainly made me feel good about my employer then – and stuck with me in the years since! My employer didn’t emphasize the discount program as helpful to parents, but if they had been inclined to assess what they were doing to support working parents, this should have been high on the list. The discounts, overall, were the best part of the PEO arrangement. I believe there are other discount programs for employers out there, sometimes through a payroll provider or other benefits administrator, not just through PEOs.

       Two key takeaways from my experience:

       1) The discount didn’t need to be huge to elicit positive response and a sense that the company had done something to help me.
       2) Because the childcare discounts were part of this larger program, it also didn’t seem like working parents were prioritized over any other category of person. Cell service discounts, for example, were widely appreciated.

   14. My employer does this and it is so incredibly helpful. It has also really brought the office closer together because so many of our kids are in the same daycare and are friends and now meet up on weekends for play dates.

       Additionally, and this was not immediately obvious to me, but I really think it has helped gender issues, because it is so affordable that many men enroll their children and end up doing at least half the pick ups and drop offs, since the center is right next to our work. The last place I worked that did not have this, the default for my male colleagues seemed to be to pick a daycare that was convenient to the house or the wife’s work and have her do most of the pick ups. It is so refreshing at my current job to routinely have male colleagues cut late afternoon meetings short to make it to pick up before daycare closes.

6. After missing a few days of posts, just catching up here and noticed the fantasy project thread-y’all – I really want to make and sell nerd jewellery. Like simple beautiful everyday fine jewellery like aurate, mejuri aesthetic with a math-y twist. Or maybe a physics twist.. or both
   I took a goldsmithing class and made ONE ring for DH and realized that the unit economics are wrecked- ‘d have to charge more than david yurman to make money doing it the way i do (classes, buyin metal in retail, hobbyist prices) , its okay for what i made since i have just one husband and he looves it :P
   I have a few more pieces i’d like to make but this is a really expensive hobby- so i’d like to make it a side project.. but at this time it remains a fantasy.. partly because i dont know if anyone would actually want to buy it

   1. Why don’t you start off with the goal of making things for friends and family instead of immediately trying to turn it into a side hustle?

   2. I just started a sorta expensive hobby (not as expensive as gold tho!) and I’m making things but they’re not sell-able yet and maybe not even gift-able. But I consider the cost of the supplies to be an expense for my mental health, amusement during this pandemic, a project to share with Kiddo, etc. It makes me happy — I look forward to starting my next piece after work every day! So (assuming it won’t be ruinous to you or anything like that) if you feel it can be self-care, self-fulfillment, if it’ll give you joy, I vote do it just for that… let the money come later, if it comes.

   3. In better economic times I would have been a market for spare non-cutesy math and physics related jewelry. In fact, I had a bangle that was a Moebius strip but not marketed as such (marketed as a twist bangle) and I always wanted a real gold version.

      I have a David Yurman budget, at least on the lower end, but it feels a lot more fun to buy from an artist than a mass retailer.

      Don’t sell yourself short. There may indeed be a market for your stuff. Just keep making what you love, and bonus, you get to keep it if it doesn’t sell.

   4. This sounds awesome! I would want to buy…

      1. Same! There’s a market for all kinds of nerdy stuff.

7. I made a casual agreement to work on two creative projects with someone I recently met, one mine and one his. No exchange of money or similar goods intended. I’ve just done a deep dive on their social media and I’m not comfortable with some of the things I’ve seen written, over a year ago, especially around race and gender. (He is white, I am not.) He has my number, we work in a shared space. What’s a good text to get out of both agreements? Is it better to approach face-to-face or over email? Thank you!

   1. I’d back out. Come up with an excuse about why you’re too busy.

   2. If it’s a “casual agreement,” can you just try not contacting him and see if he drops the ball? If he does contact you, you can say something vague about how you can’t do it anymore. But you may not even have to do that.

8. Inspired by yesterday’s family compound poster, does anyone have good recs for a realtor inEastern NC (little Washington, chocowinity, new bern, Edenton)? Since I am working remotely for g-d knows how long and also homeschooling, might as well start looking. My extended family is all in the area or in DC/Charlotte. Mom may stay there permanently in a couple of years. I just want waterfront (lots of rivers and bays in that area, LCOL or VLCOL). I love visiting but need helpful local to talk me through boat / dock / sea wall options and issues.

   1. Oceanaire Realty. Doug Yopp covers the eastern beach side of their area; his brother Brandon was my realtor in the Triangle (and he was a friend before that). It’s a family agency that started out near New Bern. The Yopp brothers grew up in Snead’s Ferry.

9. It usually doesn’t even phase me but lately I find that young (white) males are man-splaning more than ever and just assuming that I couldn’t possibly know something. Water pressure in my apt has been low since last week. I figured there was some construction nearby or whatever. But given that it had been over a week and we’re approaching a long (hot) weekend and it was getting harder to wash hands, I figure let me call someone. Call downstairs and the 23 year old frat bro who is nice enough but never helpful responds to every question with IDK. Are others having this problem IDK? Are there any notices from the county re construction for which they’re re routing water pipes/decreasing pressure? IDK. I’m on the 9th floor since that’s less than the middle of the building, I’m not on the high pressure pumps to bring water up right, IDK. Yet despite this proceeds to tell me he’ll ask his colleagues but there’s nothing I should do.

   So then I call the county just to ask if there are issues being reported in my area. Get another guy who is like oh yeah there’s a valve repairing happening but that can’t possibly be it, it’s no where near you; it’s only affecting the 70 houses for which we’ve turned off water. Um ok but I’m not 50 miles from it, I’m 1.5 miles from it and if there’s a break in the system, it’s possible you’re pushing less water thru. He tells me “to have one of the guys call him” — hmm what guys — oh the building guys. Aw shucks ok I mean all the lady could tell him was that it was taking a long time to fill up the spaghetti pot. Saw online that that valve repair was to be completed by 2 pm so I was like let’s just wait and see — lo and behold at 3 pm, change in water pressure. Guranteed the water dept guy was just customer service and didn’t understand how a repair in one place affects another place.

   The only person who acted like I was an adult with some reasonable understanding of water, physics, and gravity was a maintenance guy I just ran into in the garage and told him what was up and he was like — oh yeah whenever the county works on one section, they tend to turn down the pressure on the system because it’s easier to get it done but it affects the whole system but if they can’t type in your specific address and have it on a list of the houses that are RIGHT where the repair is, they tell you nothing is going on. Interestingly this man who talked to me like a grown up is a 50+ yr old Hispanic gentlemen who knows more about tools and engineering than I ever will. Interesting the the under qualified 20 something bros were the dismissive ones.

   1. That first example doesn’t seem like he explained anything to you at all. The third example was someone actually explaining it to you. It seems to me that you are complaining about a lack of competence.

      1. Yeah, this isn’t man-splaining (is it)? It just seems like the first two guys were dismissive of you (probably because you were female). this happens to me ALL the time (with the property management company for my condo community and other service people). i have accepted it as part of being a woman. i usually research issues heavily before calling in a complaint so that I can sound as intelligent as possible. But you are right, it does suck that people automatically assume you don’t know anything based on your gender, and that they can get away with dismissing your concerns.

   2. Uh, how do you know these guys are white … customer service is terrible everywhere these days … some people say “guys” as a casual/friendly means of indicating both guys and gals (as in “hey you guys”) … and surely you are more long-winded than anybody

   3. I hate the term mansplaining – partly for this reason and partly because my own personal experience is that women do it just as often as men (the number of female associates in my firm who think they know more with their 1 year of legal experience than I do with 20 is astounding).

      I mean – we see it on this website all the time.

      1. Mansplaining is a real thing, this just isn’t it.

10. In this morning’s post, someone mentioned doing Let’s Make Art watercolor kits as a COVID hobby. Does anyone have other recommendations for things like this? I’m certain that I’d be happier without my only hobbies being reading novels, obsessing over news, etc and I’d love a more creative, non-screen hobby. But, I’m not super creative (hence not having the hobby already) and I’m not sure where to start – what’s a good, not too expensive, low barrier to entry crafty hobby that you would recommend?

    1. Hand-lettering or knitting.

    2. Pepin “Artist’s Coloring Books”! The designs are sophisticated and the paper is high quality. You can use whatever you want on it.

    3. I have a friend who does the grown-up version of paint by number – think really detailed, really fiddly, and a really good way to get into a flow for a few hours.
       I’m planning to buy her this “paint by shadow” kit for her birthday, but you might like it too! https://www.thegrommet.com/products/twostick-shadows-by-chirpwood-painting-by-shadows-kit

       1. +1 to paint by numbers. There are plenty of options on Amazon. Diamond painting was also pretty soothing and fun. My BF really liked doing a diamond painting with me but he was super intimidated by the itty bitty spots in the paint by number.

          1. There’s also a sticker-by-number book! Still kinda fiddly but maybe less intimidating.

    4. I’ve recently jumped into card-making with stamps etc. Startup costs were pretty minor ($100 or so) but its easy to get sucked into buying lots of little things for $5-15 each which can really add up. I am part of a facebook group where people send each other birthday cards, so I have an outlet for all of the cards I make, beyond immediate friends and family. Mail is slow due to Covid, but a nice way to stay connected remotely.

    5. We ordered some paint by number kits off Amazon. They are actually really relaxing because you don’t have the decision of what color to use, you just go along with the numbers. The canvas seems good quality and the paints seem decent. I am not otherwise an artist so I don’t know how to judge these things. But it’s fun!

    6. the Art Assignment is a youtube show that has creative prompts. Maybe that’s something to try?

11. My apologies if the hive has answered this–any recommendations for a ring light for zoom? My desk lamp is really not cutting it or very flattering…

    1. Might take a minute to get through moderation, but I got this one off Amazon – three different colors of lights (daylight, regular, warm) and different light settings. Seems to work pretty well:

       https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B07Z1DZ1HD/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_search_asin_title?ie=UTF8&psc=1

12. How often do you all have to shave or remove calluses from your heels? I’m just learning the trick to do it for myself – sandpaper – and I’m spending a lot of time barefoot now, but I feel like I have to do them every four or five days to look presentable.

    1. Never – because I Baby Foot every couple of months!

       1. I did baby foot for the first time – I am OP – and it really didn’t do anything this

    2. Pedi glass from ulta

    3. Look presentable? Who is looking at your heels?

    4. I have a really good callus scraper that is almost like a Microplane (in fact, it may be that brand) and it is so good that I have to be careful not to go too far.

       In terms of frequency, less in the winter, more in the summer when I’m wearing open shoes. I put lotion and then socks on my feet at bed time every night (guarantee I kick the socks off within an hour, but it keeps the bulk of the lotion off the sheets) so I make note of whether I’m starting to get thick calluses then. If so, I use the scraper tool the next morning. If I let a think callus develop, I’m for sure going to get a cracked heel.

       By the way, this particular tool works better when my feet are dry, whereas a lot of other tools say to use right out of the shower. I’ll try to find a link.

       1. Yep, I found it. This is the one I have. I will never use a different one.

          https://www.amazon.com/Microplane-XL-Pro-Buffer-System-colour/dp/B0143N489I?ref_=ast_sto_dp

13. People with connections, and even those that don’t, please help spread this story about Socrates the dog that is about to be deported to Africa where he will be euthanized. He came to the US through the correct channels with his Peace Corp volunteer owner but gov’t officials don’t believe that his documents from Africa are legit and want to deny him entry. His owner was told he was being quarantined initially but now they are going to send him back, possibly without further notice to her. The goal is to keep him in the US, re-vaccinated if they are so suspicious and even quarantined but not deported. Other people are offering to pay her flight back to Africa with him and then back to the US again but there is no guarantee that the US will trust the paperwork when she comes back again (probably already flagged) and he might be deported without her before she can arrange a flight with him. Make your voices heard!

    https://twitter.com/bigfluffydogs/status/1278377368206352384?s=20

    1. I love dogs, I really do, but I have so many more important things I need to “be heard” about.

       1. Why would you reply like this? Why not just scroll on by rather than try and make someone else feel small for caring about this dog. It doesn’t cost more to be kind.

       2. +1

    2. This seems like a complete scam

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