Tuesday’s Workwear Report: Audrey Cashmere Sweater
Our daily workwear reports suggest one piece of work-appropriate attire in a range of prices.
I have a handful of crewneck Talbots sweaters in my closet that have been in my winter rotation for years and years. I was looking to add to my collection this week and came across this gorgeous floral cashmere number that will brighten up even the darkest of winter days. I’m seeing a lot of this grass green color this season, so I’ll probably wear this with some green trousers for a hint of spring on a chilly day.
On a related note, I got to stop at one of the Talbots clearance stores a few weeks ago and grabbed some amazing basics for shockingly low prices (a wool blazer for $20, for example). If you find yourself near one during your holiday travels to Baltimore, Albany, Springfield (VA), or Houston, I highly recommend stopping by!
The sweater is $199-219 at Talbots and comes in sizes XS-XL, P-XLP-, X-3X, and XP-3XP — and today you can take an extra 40% off your purchase. (Select holiday sweaters are also marked $50.)
Some of the classic cashmere sweaters for work (as of 2024) include Nordstrom Cashmere, Quince ($50!), Vince, J.Crew, Naadam, Talbots, Lands' End, and Brooks Brothers. If you're looking for something fancier try TSE, Loro Piana, Akris, Autumn Cashmere, or (more casual) Jenni Kayne.
Sales of note for 12.5
- Nordstrom – Cyber Monday Deals Extended, up to 60% off thousands of new markdowns — great deals on Natori, Vince, Theory, Boss, Cole Haan, Tory Burch, Rothy's, and Weitzman, as well as gift ideas like Barefoot Dreams and Parachute — Dyson is new to sale, 16-23% off, and 3x points on beauty purchases.
- Ann Taylor – up to 50% off everything
- Banana Republic Factory – up to 50% off everything + extra 25% off
- Design Within Reach – 25% off sitewide (including reader-favorite office chairs Herman Miller Aeron and Sayl!) (sale extended)
- Eloquii – up to 60% off select styles
- J.Crew – 1200 styles from $20
- J.Crew Factory – 50-70% off everything + extra 20% off $100+
- Macy's – Extra 30% off the best brands and 15% off beauty
- Spanx – Lots of workwear on sale, some up to 70% off, plus free shipping on everything (and 20% off your first order)
- Steelcase – 25% off sitewide, including reader-favorite office chairs Leap and Gesture (sale extended)
- Talbots – 40% off your entire purchase and free shipping $125+
For the poster that was looking for pretty sheer socks (like me) JCrew has a few marked down as part of their promos this week :)
I cannot figure out when I would wear them, but I am dying to get these:
https://sockcandy.com/products/serpentine-floral-black-sheer-crew-sock
oh, dear. This could be a major distraction for me.
That is going to be dangerous to my budget.
Will you wear them with holiday sandals? Just curious, I’ve only seen them in ads like that
I wanted them for with pointed-toe flats under wide-legged pants for a dressy look. Those younger than I am will probably wear them with fancy heels :)
My teen daughter wants a black dress for orchestra concerts. She wants a midi length dress that she can play in comfortably with a full midi length skirt that ideally is a bit poofy (or she will wear a tulle skirt beneath as a hoop skirt replacement — she is a bit extra). Normally a women’s XS or a 2. Needs to be washable, so polyester is fine. Where do I look for this? I almost think a skirt and top combo might be easier to find but open to options. Not a cello player.
Hill House offers their nap dress in black lace and tulle, though you’ll want a black slip underneath either.
Anthropologie has a few potential options. Depends on sleeve and embellishment requirements, but they have some simpler black options with sleeves
or maybe lulu’s but some of those skew a bit sexier. Not sure how old your daughter is if either of those would be age appropriate. They each have only a handful of more conservative options
She’s in high school, so we do love some LuLu’s, but I’m not sure they hit the right note here :)
Yes take a look at anthro’s sommerset dress or Quince for dupes in different fabrics… I think they’d be ok with a tulle underlayer? Never seen them styled that way I don’t think.
Old Navy has some poofy midi/maxi skirts right now.
The “Pintuck Taffeta Midi Skirt” from Banana Republic Factory could be a good skirt option.
This looks perfect.
https://www.karenmillen.com/us/twill-woven-prom-maxi-skirt/BKK12052.html?color=157
This also looks good. Will be interesting to see how much volume she goes with. I feel like she was born in the wrong fashion decade (or century).
Gap is my go-to for niceish clothes for kids. What about this one?
https://www.gap.com/browse/product.do?pid=619377002&cid=13658&pcid=13658&vid=1&cpos=29&cexp=2859&kcid=CategoryIDs%3D13658&cvar=25416&ctype=Listing&cpid=res24112606325439132901578#pdp-page-content
The Babaton Audition Dress from Aritzia might fit the bill.
Or the Leda ponte dress – which has a fuller skirt.
Degree black dress deodorant, Bumble and Bumble hair care products, and L’Occitane shea butter anything.
Huge fan of this dress: https://www.anntaylor.com/clothing/suits/cata000013/grp_572342_2222.html?priceSort=DES&dwvar_572342_color=2222. Super comfortable and machine washable.
I have these two skirts from Amazon that hold up well:
Pleated: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0CSYZ21K3
Tulle: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B08BNQDNC4
You can get a simple black top from LL Bean (their Pima cotton T-shirts come are high quality smooth cotton in different necklines and sleeve lengths and hold up incredible well).
Something like this?
https://modcloth.com/collections/vintage-dresses/products/dramatic-performance-lace-dress-cb0001
https://www.jcrew.com/p/womens/categories/clothing/dresses-and-jumpsuits/pleated-ballet-dress-in-stretch-cotton-blend/CF797?color_name=black&N=MEDIUM&noPopUp=true&srcCode=Paid_Search%7CShopping_NonBrand%7CGoogle%7CPMG%5EG%5E99107583638_20647336546___m_pla_local_834_9197900&utm_source=Google&utm_medium=paid_search&utm_content=shopping_ads&utm_campaign=JCrew_Shopping_LIA_US_All_X_PMax_X_Google_X&utm_term=&gad_source=1&gbraid=0AAAAADqAteCmeX-PuyMLSkCHstNacC6NM&gclid=Cj0KCQiAgJa6BhCOARIsAMiL7V9AcVQ6QTO6UzS7mjmyzrxKDhO2_aHBXyIFzFxfFJeO6kF7awfg25waAsloEALw_wcB&gclsrc=aw.ds#no_universal_links%23no_universal_links
I feel like this (and many other balletcore dresses) may be hard to wear with a bra without something showing. She may not like back scoop.
This is beautiful, but I don’t think the scoop back is appropriate for the occasion.
This is lovely.
It’s what I would wear if I was 1st chair flute.
Ooh, me, too! So you could see my lovely toned back muscles working as I played my flute…
As a former principal flutist, I endorse this dress.
I bought this for myself and thought the skirt was a little too poofy, so it may be perfect for your daughter: https://tnuck.com/products/black-midi-dress
If I may, this is the perfect thing to buy secondhand. Did you check Mercari?
Isn’t everything the perfect thing to buy second hand? But IMO, if you have a specific need, buying used is like going to an estate sale: maybe it is your lucky day, but likely not. I still go, but it’s not a good way to find something that’s very specific.
Ok grumpy. But searching online where you can easily filter and narrow your search for size, color, and shape is a lot easier than the hit or miss of thrift stores. Which is why I suggested Mercari. This sounds like formalwear or formalwear adjacent, which is the kind of thing that gets worn once (if that) then resold.
As an former violin kid and now an orchestra parent, I think that these can be reused a TON. School orchestra has 3 concerts. Usually you wear all-black, sometimes with a t-shirt saying “XYZ orchestra.” So I’d go for a skirt over a dress. Then there is the all-county orchestra. Then a recital with the teacher. Then all-state or regional orchestra, depending on the state. Summer camp (so may want to switch up the sleeve / fabric on the top). Girls may be full-grown in high school, so their size may not change much (YMMV), so likely not a disposable kid purchase.
If you’re an orchestra kid, you’re going to wear this outfit often. OP, I wish I had more useful suggestions, but I’ve only bought concert blacks for boys! I do feel like this is one of those things that you could find in a local nice department store.
Concert black gets worn over and over again. If you are in school orchestra, youth orchestra, all-county, and all-state, you are looking at at least a dozen concerts and festivals a year, probably quite a few more. Multiply that number by 1.5 if you’re a wind player who is in the school orchestra and wind ensemble.
IDK my kids were both in orchestra for three years of middle school and four of high school, and they both went through many sizes over that time span. It wasn’t a one-and-done for me. I was constantly trying to find the correct orchestra clothing for them. (Girl and a boy, in that order)
I was constantly growing and had to have a new concert black dress every year from freshman year of high school through sophomore year of college when I finally hit my adult size, but I still wore each dress a whole lot during that one year when it fit.
As a former orchestra nom, I like your skirt and top idea. My daughter’s orchestra demanded separates actually – black skirt or pants with a white shirt, then in her senior year, they changed it to a black top, but never said a black dress. She was concertmaster by then so I have lots of pics of her coming up to “tune” the orchestra and I think the black long sleeved tee with black skirt and tights was a better look than what they wore in years prior.
Here’s a skirt that looks like a good possibility.
https://www.mercari.com/us/item/m76291983829?sv=0
Concertmaster — that’s an accomplishment! I was happy to move up to first violin from second. It helped me a lot to have the melody line most of the time.
Concertmaster! That’s amazing.
I have a 10 yr old cellist and it took quite a lot of doing to find a black and white dress that accommodated a cellist. like your daughter, mine is also extra and didn’t want the easy answer of black pants.
I ultimately found an inexpensive “walk through” dress used on ThredUp that is perfect for cellists. Just in case others are reading with a similar niche challenge.
my back up was ballet style dance dresses from Amazon.
Can we do a thread of all time favorite products? Like, the things when you use you just think “wow I love this thing” and would buy again in a heartbeat if you lost them?
Mine are:
Beyond Yoga leggings (indestructible and most comfortable ever. I wear mine rock climbing and they don’t pill)
The ordinary niacinimide serum for hormonal acne
YouTube premium
Moccamaster coffee maker
I don’t have in unit laundry, so I got an “RV style” one that hooks up to my faucet. The best $200 I’ve ever, ever spent.
iPad with keyboard (I got a cheap keyboard off of Amazon). I travel a lot for work and I bring this instead of lugging my personal laptop with me (I can’t use my work stuff for anything personal). It replaces my laptop.+ kindle (I only use my kindle when reading in the sun… I log a lot of beach time), it doesn’t need its own charger, its so small and easy to throw in a bag. I could actually write a whole post on work travel stuff that makes a huge difference for me (including my travel size kettle).
Shark FlexStyle. My hair looks fantastic and it takes 5 minutes. I was just telling my friend that I wish it didn’t take me nearly 30 years to realize what a simple fix this was for my hair.
Adjustable dumbbells and the MAPS 15 min a day plan – now if I don’t have time for a full workout, I can still get a good, quick lift in.
Airfryer. Love it, use it all the time for veggies and fish and for reheating literally anything, and yes… frozen food.
Comfy black booties with a 2′ heel – short enough to be comfy all day, every day but look so much better (on me at least) than flat ones. I always feel very sophisticated wearing them.
I would be very interested in your work travel post!
I would be interested too! I will be doing a lot of international travel starting next year and need to level up my supplies
I also love my iPad for traveling! I barely use my full size MacBook even at home. Also, if you haven’t tried one before, I got a Magic Keyboard on eBay for $100 and it’s AMAZING. Like, I have never been in love with a tech accessory like this. I thought the off brand was fine, but unfortunately the real one is so much better.
What booties do you have? I’ve been searching for the perfect pair forever.
What is the brand/type of travel kettle you use?
I’ve got this one and it’s fantastic.
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B07YRT7WJ9/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_search_asin_title?ie=UTF8&psc=1
I’ve got this same one (based off a rec here) and agree its fantastic. Even if my husband does think I’m a bit extra when I bring the kettle and my milk frother!
This is what I have https://www.amazon.com/sspa/click?ie=UTF8&spc=MTozMjMzNTM0NTgwNTk2NjQ1OjE3MzI2MzUwNjM6c3BfYXRmOjMwMDA5NTc3MzAzNDAwMjo6MDo6&url=%2FElectric-Portable-Temperature-Stainless-Protection%2Fdp%2FB0CFQ7BGPT%2Fref%3Dsr_1_2_sspa%3Fdib%3DeyJ2IjoiMSJ9.QselJhLrwVI1SuDFo9YIxttddG9a21Lj1iYoMmK-wOptsLnFW1bQHFlGDSX2_Zqjmpmju6Ojb9p_04JsXQbxCsbRTqntuXvxxx8LNipllo6uPxlPzRVsfoajJ-cBXBUVIiguGg404xT_XGBtmqZ0gOS2M-WDvpKe8P8GhNjh1re1Hbnqydvag3Rqo5YuIXrNKmQMPRmSxeBTtKB9dLiUxJq51B_00Vzl3wuazRxSvJ1zli20SDv-t9xARBBGWj2KhcXP5ZcMMGn0aYB8SZTjx0gBS5RaFWjD19nACGXAxwI.G2vMhLJRuW_ozuHA8KYF1lXdbjj-nxmcISvpjbQKOBI%26dib_tag%3Dse%26keywords%3Dtravel%2Bkettle%26qid%3D1732635063%26sr%3D8-2-spons%26sp_csd%3Dd2lkZ2V0TmFtZT1zcF9hdGY%26psc%3D1
Okay, here are some of my travel purchases that I’ve loved. FWIW, I usually travel for 2-6 weeks at a time and often cannot stay in extended stay places (they’re authorized, just not often available where I travel to). I’m often in rural areas where the local amenities can really range from “cute tourist town with everything you’d want or need, just happens to be rural” to “the closest Walmart is 4 hours away”. For shorter trips or trips to more developed areas YMMV.
I’m skipping the basics here (work clothes, work supplies, basic toiletries that I’d assume everyone has).
Clothing:
At least a few things that can be “day to night” if I grab dinner with colleagues – many people will completely change but I don’t really bring separate work and after work clothes. So, jeans that I can wear for both, a cute/on-trend but functional button-down, etc). I also don’t bring a ton of clothing – I can do laundry so I’m happy to cycle through the same handful of outfits. I usually bring 3-4 work appropriate pants (including a pair of jeans) and 4-5 work appropriate tops, plus 1-2 things that I wouldn’t wear to work but might wear around the hotel or out to dinner (always a t shirt dress in the warm weather!), a workout outfit, PJs and lounge clothes, and appropriate outerwear. I really like “travel pants” or Brooklyn pants, but YMMV if you can wear those. Work tops include at least 1-2 company polos – not a look I love but easy and very appropriate for what I do. Usually shoes are flat boots, cute sneakers, workout sneakers, and hotel shoes; occasionally I throw in another pair. Everything I bring is good for travel (easy to care for, versatile) and appropriate to be seen in!
A “layer” for throwing on in the hotel when I go out to grab coffee in the morning – I can wear with my PJs or lounge clothes but look presentable enough to run into a colleague. For me this must be: relatively thick so you can’t tell whether or not I’m wearing a bra, not a pullover (sometimes that’s just too much effort lol), and have pockets. I’ve used a cardigan and a shacket for this, both work great.
PJs that don’t look like PJs – for me this is yoga pants + a plain T or tank – maybe even with a built in shelf bra. Fire alarm, running to the front desk for something, etc. and I don’t want to have to change. I like to bring two sets – one as “lounge clothes” one as “PJs”
Slides for my hotel shoes – I prefer Birks so they can double as real shoes in the warmer weather and be worn out to dinner. Or, rubber birks if the hotel has a pool. When its chilly, just wear socks with them and they’re essentially slippers. Slip on sneakers would be another good option.
Packable robe. I like to dry off while wearing a robe, and so few hotels provide them now. I do a satin robe so its small and packable.
Non clothing:
Fleece throw: At home I’m always sitting on my couch or in my chair under a throw blanket, so I like to be able to do so on the road. It packs down quite small, but if you don’t have room its easy to pick up from Walmart for like $5. Make sure it’s not white so it doesn’t get mistaken with hotel linens.
Bowl, plate, cup, mug, and utensils. I eat a lot of meals in my hotel room, so I get a reusable set to travel with. Everything is microwavable and dishwasher safe. I love having a real mug for morning coffee and nighttime tea – feels much cozier and home like. I also usually bring a paring knife so I can slice veggies or something. I also bring a travel mug and a water bottle, but I bring those everywhere.
Embroidery scissors. These come in handy, but are much smaller than a full size set.
Ziplocks (regular and gallon sized). Great for leftovers, packing snacks for the day, and keeping things organized in my luggage or hotel.
Reusable, foldable tote bag – mostly for running errands where I am, but also for staying organized.
Compression packing cubes. They’re awesome and definitely do save space!!
Tupperware. For leftovers, I have a glass pyrex bowl + lid I bring. In a pinch, the lid can be used as a plate or a cutting board. I pack things inside of the pyrex when I pack to save room.
Coffee/tea set up. I bring a travel kettle and a collapsable pour over coffee maker. Pack or buy coffee and tea when I get there, but make sure I get the same stuff I use at home.I’m thinking of buying one of those travel espresso makers, but haven’t done much research yet.
Sponge + blue dawn dish soap for washing dishes. I can also use the dish soap for sink laundry if needed.
Laundry detergent sheets for hotel laundry, quarters, mesh laundry bag, roll of twine for DIY clothesline. Ideally I have hotel laundry and can just use the machines, but I’ve been a few places without laundry so have resulted to sink laundry + clothesline (tied between towel racks in the bathroom). Quarters are also helpful for parking in towns with traditional meters.
Resistance bands, just in case the hotel doesn’t have a gym I can get some sort of workout in.
Belt bag. I don’t bring a purse with me, so this is my only purse. It can also be used as a fanny pack for a workout (I love to hike so try to do that if I can). If I”m flying, helps keep me organized in the airport!
Some sort of entertainment: a knitting project, a crossword book, coloring book + colored pencils, cards, etc. I try to do something “fun” after work each night; usually in my hotel but I”m also prepared if there’s something going on in town I want to check out or if colleagues want to hang out in the lobby (cards). Aforementioned iPad with kindle app / streaming apps / a few games / keyboard so I can iMessage friends more easily.
I always bring ear plugs and an eye mask, but luckily haven’t needed them! I’ve also brought a sleeping bag liner if the hotel options look sketchy.
Many charging options: backup charger, regular chargers, a charging cable with all 3 common chargers (usb c, usb micro or mini – I forget, and lightning). A car charger for my iPhone (luckily both my work phone and personal phone are iPhones!) with a USB and a USBc port – never know what the rental car will have!
Well stocked first aid kit: any meds you might use (ibuprofen, tums, allergy meds, cold meds, etc), vitamins (I swear this helps keep me healthy on the road!), melatonin, bandaids, Neosporin, Covid test, etc.
In addition to the basic toiletries, skincare, and makeup: tweezers, q tips, vaseline (great multitasker), mini water flosser, I like to bring a two in one blush and lipstick to save space. I also like to bring some face masks, eye masks, or a gua sha for “me time”.
SharkFlexstyle – this is a recent addition for me but very much worth it to feel good about how I look.
Umbrella, baseball cap – things I wouldn’t bring (unless the forecast dictates) on a shorter trip, but always bring on a longer trip.
If I’m driving to my destination:
My own pillow + a distinctive pillow case.
A set of dumbbells so I can workout in my hotel room, rather than go to the gym.
Nonperishables (either pack or get when I land): coffee, tea, chia seeds, collagen powder, beef jerky, applesauce pouches, dried fruit, oatmeal, nuts or trail mix (all in single serve bags), chocolate, protein or meal replacement shakes. I aim for 1 serving of fruit/veg for each meal, but depending where I am it can often look like an applesauce pouch or bust, so I try to be prepared with them. I add the collagen to my coffee to ensure I’m starting off with a little protein. Can do oatmeal + chia seeds + collagen for a decently healthy, if not exciting, in room meal.
If I have a hotel fridge I’ll pick up more food; I always get half and half, fruit, some sort of snacky veg + a dip to have on hand. I eat a lot of frozen meals or bagged salad + rotisserie chicken, or healthier canned soups (Amy’s). Might also pick up more food like lunch meat or PB&J supplies, cereal + milk, etc. I’ve tried some “hotel room cooking” and it’s not great but its doable. If I’m driving I might bring my nutribullet or air fryer with me to expand hotel cooking options – if there’s a kitchenette I’m golden!
Oh, I also bring nail concealer or nail veil (kur londontown) + nail polish remover wipes, nail clipper, and nail file with me. The clippers are another thing you don’t think about until you’re there for a month and the nails become talons :) Having my nails done makes me feel good, but I normally have a pretty complicated 4 step nail polish routine at home and I don’t want to bring all of that with me, so I do the concealer or veil because it wears well but also its light enough that when it chips its not as noticeable.
and another thing :)
I haven’t done it yet, but plan on doing it in the future: I have a colleague who packs his Fire stick with him so he can easily access all of his streaming accounts without a) having to re-log in b) remembering to log out before you check out. So far I’ve just watched streaming stuff on my iPad, but this is a good idea too!
I also know people who pack candles or buy flowers for their hotel room to make it a little more homey
Egg-pod, as seen on TV. My grandma gave it to me and I thought it was ridiculous until I tried it. It makes 4 peeled hardboiled eggs with minimal effort in <15 minutes. I keep hardboiled eggs in the fridge constantly now, they are the perfect snack. Especially with a little pesto or brown mustard. mmmm
We’d love a guest post if you’re willing – email me at Kat at Corporette dot com
My Ugg slippers
Ugg snow boots as well. I was deeply disappointed in my Sorels (heavy, hot, dug into my ankles) and have been thrilled since I replaced them with an Ugg pair.
I also love my Ugg winter boots. Agreed that they’re so much better than Sorels.
Kindle – I believe I’m on my fourth. I’ve read to fall asleep since I was in 3rd? grade (my mom used to laugh at how many physical books I would have in my bed), so the kindle under my pillow is clearly much more sustainable. Plus the kindle with built in reading light solved a minor marriage problem of my husband wanting to go to sleep in the dark, me hating book reading clip lights, etc.
Airpods Pros. I use them alllll the time for talking on the phone for work. Plus the noise cancellation is amazing when I’m mowing the lawn.
Bombas socks. I’ve worn them for 10+ years. Every time I try a different brand pair I am annoyed.
Apple MacBooks and the external display. My old Thunderbolt Display broke in September after many many years, and I immediately purchased a new one. My MacBooks take many hours of daily use and last forever.
Starbucks non-dairy coffee creamer, the caramel flavor
Revlon one step hair dryer brush- I relied on airdyring before because I could never get the hang of regular hair dryers, this gives me great blow outs.
The ordinary squalene serum
Spotify premium
Airpods are a good one – when I thought I lost mine I immediately went out and bought another pair! (Then I found the original pair, lol.)
Hahaha same. And now I have 3 pairs of airpods.
When your Revlon breaks, I highly recommend the Shark FlexStyle (I’m the one who posted about it above). I used the Revlon for years, but didn’t use it every day for a few reasons (I didn’t like having to use my hairdryer to rough dry my hair and then switch appliances, I could smell it frying my hair, it took a little too long (I’m too low maintenance), and it was too hard to get it on the cool setting to set my hair). I got a Shark FlexStyle about a year ago and I find it very worth the money! 90% of the time I just use the round brush attachment (I havent put enough effort in to learning the curling or how to best style my hair with the flat brush).
I can go from rough dried / semi air dried hair to fully styled in 5 minutes, and can go from sopping wet just out of the shower to fully dried and styled in less than 10. My hair is fine, but I have a LOT of it so overall its thick. I love that its so easy to switch from regular hair dryer to the attachments, and the regular hair dryer is very good (I have heard that’s not the case with the Dyson).
I love having control over the airflow and the temp (each has 3 levels) – I start at full blast on both and then when I set my hair, I turn off all heat and go to the medium air setting. Even when I am full tilt highest heat setting, it doesn’t fry my hair. I, of course, use a heat protectant but I never noticed overly dried or fried hair and I never smell the burnt hair.
My hair looks absolutely fantastic every day and it only takes 5 minutes, I am absolutely OBSESSED with my FlexStyle.
+1 to all of this. My only regret is not dumping the revelon styler sooner. I also tried a friend’s Dyson on vacation and disliked it, the shark was much gentler on my hair.
I bought the Shark when it was on sale at Costco almost a year ago and have yet to use it. Any tips on tutorials to get started? I’m really bad at styling my hair so I need something for dummies.
Split your hair up into sections. Start pretty small, and as you get better at it, you will see the right size to use. Once I finish a layer, I tie it in a loose ponytail and tuck it into my shirt to keep it out of the way while I work on the next section. Understand that the shark round brush is going to give you some volume and curl, and embrace that. I tend to twist the sections to give them a little curl at the end. I also like to do it at night and sleep on my hair, it has less volume in the morning. But I have a LOT of hair. You can also “re-set” your hair the next morning by re-blowing it with heat.
Just Google shark tutorials and a bunch will come up, it’s really simple once you see how to use it. TikTok has the best short tutorials.
I’m considering buying a FlexStyle with the Ulta gift cards I’m expecting to get this Christmas. This review has me pretty much sold!
I bought this one during the Nordstrom sale and I’m obsessed. My hair is done so quickly with this thing. It’s straight but not too straight and still has volume. I love it so much. This is the only hair dryer I would actually consider good enough to pack and take with me on a trip.
https://www.nordstrom.com/s/7561803?color=900&size=one%20size
I’m fascinated to see all the love for the Shark here because I don’t like mine! It’s smaller around than the Revlon so I feel like it takes longer. It’s so long overall that it’s unwieldy. And if my hair slips below the brush head it gets caught and pulls in the gap where the brush head snaps in. I agree that the Revlon gets too hot though. I’m interested in the T3 someone mentioned and might look into that.
I will plug my favorite new hair tool. I just got a Babyliss pro nano titanium thermal compact paddle brush and I love it! It’s perfect for smoothing out frizzies and weird kinks in second day hair around my face and it’s small and light so it’ll be easy to pack.
I’ve read that the DryBar version of the Revlon brush doesn’t get as hot.
Kindle (I’m on my 2nd, upgraded for dark mode!) for me, too. I resisted an e-reader for a long time, but it was clutch when my kids were tiny because it was so much easier to read one-handed while holding a sleeping baby, and now I read in the dark in their shared bedroom at bedtime to enforce peace and quiet, and in the dark in my own bed so my husband doesn’t have to suffer for my poor choices about “just one more chapter” until way too late.
Also my Bose sport earbuds, and electric kettle.
Bose headphones- the over tge ear ones. Blocks neighbor noise like a charm, and great sound.
I love these! They are also the only way I can sleep in the same room as a snorer.
I held out for years and they make flying on a plane so much better.
TruSkin Vitamin C serum
Arm & Hammer HE liquid detergent
OPI Nail Envy nail strengthening polish
Whistling Kettle Buckingham Palace Earl Gray black tea
iPad mini: I mostly use it as an ereader with the kindle app, but I like it better than my old kindle because I can also read online or watch a movie on the same device
Patagonia nanopuff: I have two sizes so I can fit more layers in colder weather, but despite being 10-15 years old, they both look almost new, are incredibly lightweight and comfortable and easy to pack.
Smartwool socks: summer or winter, merino wool is the way to go to keep my feet warm and dry (I swear they’re also cooler in the summer than cotton or even bare feet, which just feel dirty and sweaty to me).
Pyrex glass containers: I have a million of these and they’re so convenient for batch cooking.
Measuring spoons from King Arthur Flour: I love their spice measuring spoons that actually fit into small jars and odd size ones like 2 tablespoons. They’re so much nicer than the flimsy cheap ones.
I have three Patagonia fleeces (1 better sweater, 2 synchilla snap Ts) that are over a decade old – two are from high school and one is from sophomore year of college and I am 30 years old. IIRC, they’re from 2009 or 2010, 2012, and 2014. All three get LOTS of wear (two were ordered as team gear…that’s why I have so many) and look fantastic.
My aunt gave me my first one in 2010 and it was a big deal since they’re expensive and now she sees me wearing it about 15 years later and can never believe its the same fleece – it looks brand new!
+1B to the iPad mini
My fish spatula.
Love this one. I love mine too. Just used it yesterday!
Tumi carryon, backpack, and sling bag
Byredo perfume
Cartier panther ring
Oribe hair products
Mine are:
– L’Oréal Paris Age Perfect Midnight Night Face Cream
– Purilens Preservative-Free Contact Solution (for rinsing only)
– Sol de Janiero Bum Bum Cream
– Le Creuset Dutch Oven
– Mackenzie Childs Kettle
+1 to the Bum Bum Cream. The Sol de Janiero perfume is also my favorite.
Oxo Grid Vegetable Chopper. I threw it on my wedding registry on a whim and I have ended up using it all the time. Awesome for onions and bell peppers.
I just got a mandoline with a chopper attachment and I LOVE IT
Lake pajamas
Weezie signature robe
Left on Friday field day sweatshirt (soooo soft)
Manta sleep mask
Kindle
A high quality espresso machine (enjoyed a Gaggia for many years, just got the Profitec Go)
My kindle (my third one, I think, used mainly for reading)
The pull-out drawers my SO installed in all my lower kitchen cabinets, plus smaller ones for spices in an upper cabinet. I tel him how much I love them pretty much every single time I pull something out – everything is so easy to see and reach, and so orderly.
Bablyiss compact hair straightening brush – it lives in my suitcase and is smaller and nicer than the cheap one from Amazon that stays at home (and which is still pretty good, actually)
Maybelline SuperStay Matte Ink lipstick – this stuff simply does not come off. The dental hygienist asked me about it the last time I had my teeth cleaned, she was amazed that it was still on after she finished.
Trader Joe’s sunscreen/moisturizer
Who Gives a Crap bamboo toilet paper – good quality, tree-free TP that is delivered to my house on an automated schedule, from a company that builds toilets in the developing world
Kindle for sure!
Dough whisk: https://www.amazon.com/TEEVEA-Danish-Dough-Whisk-Traditional/dp/B0D5QQWNT5/
FLEECE TIGHTS!
This reveals me to be a total princess, but baby wipes warmer for my makeup remover wipes
Dyson hair dryer (I would never have spent the money, but my husband bought it for me a few years ago for Christmas and it was a game-changer)
Ray ban aviators
Vuori leggings – wear them practically every day
Birkenstocks
AirPods
Allll my skincare (retin A, salicylic acids etc)
The Ordinary serums
AltaMD clear sunscreen for face
IT Cosmetics full coverage bb cream
“Stocking stuffer” sized gift ideas for a friend who has started traveling a lot for work + loves the color pink? I know she already has a portable charger. She is very into skincare so I don’t want to buy anything related to that since she has her favorites. I always find more small bags helpful when packing, maybe a nice toiletry bag.
Does she have a travelling pill case? I just got one that has a couple of different compartments from Amazon in pink and it’s been great – the one I have comes in two sizes as well. I use the smaller one for medicine and then I got the bigger one to carry in my work bag for little things handy to have (paper clips, bandaids, safety pins, etc.)
Also while I’m asking for gift ideas, christmas/engagement/housewarming gift that can be easily carried on a plane? So nothing too large – otherwise I would get something for the house.
Personalized address stamp. Etsy has great options, but you will have to place your order soon in order to receive it by Christmas.
Another idea is a DoorDash gift card.
Small monogrammed jewelry case?
Good idea.
I’ve personally given this one a couple of times and the recipients have loved it.
https://cuyana.com/products/travel-jewelry-case
+1 to Cuyana’s travel cases. They’re so beautiful and you can get them monogrammed.
I’ve tried every kind of travel jewelry case and the one I love the most (no tangling) is this one. It’s super cheap but amazingly functional and it comes in pink: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0CQSYJ698/ref=twister_B0BNLC1DDR?_encoding=UTF8&th=1
Nice hand lotion, hand sanitizer
packing cubes, nice reusable <3oz containers
Microfiber hair turban and a wet bag?
I’m the traveling poster above (I’ll post my recs in a minute), but a few things I like: a charging cord with all 3 major ports on it (usb C, usb mini, lightening), a pouch set for packing, compression packing cubes, hotel room slippers or slide sandals, reusable utensil set, fancy hand sanitizer or hand cream.
Lily Pulitzer has a travel accessories section:
https://www.lillypulitzer.com/travel-accessories/
Lots of pink!
There is a bluetooth adapter that would allow her to use wireless headphones to watch tv/movies on the plane tvs.
The Target / DVF collab had coin purse keychains in the shape of pink lips
Yeti has two new pink collections (sandstone and peach, in addition to preexisting pinks – so you can get her the shade she likes. Personally, I like the sandstone). I am not really a yeti person but I love my yeti travel mug with the hotshot lid. Two reasons I like this design: their traditional travel mugs are too big for me to hold comfortably and this has a leak proof but easily drinkable lid (so I can throw it in a bag or backpack’s water bottle holder without worrying about spilling, but also don’t have to unscrew a cap every time to take a drink – good for the car cupholder).
It can also be thrown in the dishwasher; I refuse to buy travel mugs that aren’t dishwasher safe.
I bought a little tourist souvenir tray and I love it for travel… it keeps my makeup and toiletries organized on the hotel bathroom counter and it doesn’t take up much space. Mine is a thin metal so no problem with breaking (although it does get picked up at airport x-ray machines sometimes). How about something like that in a pretty pink?
Thanks for the reminder, there’s a Talbots factory store near where we will be visiting for the holidays.
Sorry, but this is something my husband’s late grandmother would have worn. I get that a lot of us are middle aged now, but I refuse to look like an octogenarian church lady. Maybe it’s the styling and there’s a fresh, modern way to style this but as someone already struggling with looking frumpy, this sweater would not do me ANY favors.
Yes this sweater is grandma for sure!!
Maybe your husband‘s grandmother had excellent style?
But seriously – There are a number of styles that I do not like to wear because I associate them with my grandmother, who was a polished professional woman in a time when there were not a lot of those. That does not make them frumpy or unstylish. It just means that I see them as “grandmother”.
I mean, I’m in my 20s and always enjoyed dressing like a grandma for work. Grandma clothes are generally comfortable and colorful, while still being a little more polished than my typical wear.
Heh I have this sweater in three prints and I am old enough to be a grandma so I guess I’m proving your point. I have a black one with red roses that I wear with a matching satin full midi skirt for dress up, a peacock print one that I wear with jeans and a puffer vest (we have peacocks living in our neighborhood so that was a no-brainer!), and a fall colors floral one that I am planning to wear for Thanksgiving with some kind of casual pants and probably a striped shirt underneath.
I definitely wouldn’t wear that exact print featured above, though. Too grandma-y even for me.
I kind of love this one, but that may be because the colors are exactly right for my coloring (summer). I have a smallish wardrobe, though, and this print is so vivid that I’d probably wear it mayyybe once a month at most, and as such wouldn’t make a space for it in my my very limited closet. IDGAF if it’s “grandma” if I like it. I just want something I’d wear enough to make the purchase price make sense.
I like the Audrey in solid colors – have a few of them in navy, black, camel – but this pattern is def what I’d expect to see on someone in an entire Talbots display mannequin outfit.
FWIW, I bought the merino sweater dress featured here recently and it is great. Not at all itchy. I love a sweater dress but so many are shapeless. The Talbots one worked!
suggestions! gift between $10-$25, good for man or woman related to a beach vacation…..
I love either the real GlowScreen or the e.l.f dupe
I love either the real GlowScreen or the e.l.f dupe
Jack Black lip balm with SPF.
A slim can koozie
A mesh beach bag – I like mine because the sand falls out easily
Portable personal fan
Mini bluetooth speaker
I’m shopping for this right now! Sunscreen, bronzing drops, highlighter, Sol de Janeiro products, Mario Badescu facial spray, travel-sized shampoo, conditioner, body wash, toothpaste/travel toothbrush, lip balm with SPF.
Get the reef-safe sunscreen. A lot of places are requring it now.
Snorkel set off Amazon
Coola reef-safe travel-sized sunscreen sprays (I love them)
Waterproof phone case
Hello! DD was accepted as a transfer student to BU and GW. Her major will be sustainability and her particular interest is mass transit.
What should she take into account? Cost isn’t the primary issue; we’re focused more on the opportunities she’d have during school and as a graduate. We live in the DMV but child LOVES Boston and has lived there as a student.
Thank you!
One thing to consider is that she’ll probably need her masters in Urban/City/Regional planning. I have quite a few friends (I work elsewhere in city government but have friends across the local government) who work in mass transit / transportation and they all have this, or a very similar, masters.
congratulations. BU is a more competitive college overall. for me, personally (and my kid i suspect) that would be a factor to consider.
BU all the way based on ranking and reputation.
Really? I went to BU and live in the greater Boston area now and I would consider it a toss up for a hiring standpoint. Meaning, a kid applying. to work for me straight out of either would have an equal chance in my book.
For the OP, would your daughter prefer to work in the Boston area or in DMV after graduating? Housing is probably $$$ in Boston, it’s the worst. Also it’s cold here. But the Celtics are great ;).
I’m from Boston and this is my perception as well. But outside of the area (and especially in DC) and with transplants, BU is thought of very highly. They have very aggressively gamed the rankings game, apparently quite successfully.
I’m in California and know what BU stands for, not sure what GW is. Just for reference, we hire mostly people who went to UCs and Cal States.
Also from Boston and same. I would actually think GW is a bit better, just has not played the rankings game quite as aggressively.
Where does she want to live long-term? If this is leading to a job in local government, I’d factor in the ability to network and do internships in her preferred location, and demonstrate interest in being there long-term.
LOL, I went to law school at GW and my SO went to undergrad – and played football – at BU! We probably would have a spirited discussion about this choice.
Has anyone heard of the brand “Geometry” for kitchen stuff?
I have! I have one of their dish towels and really like it. I’ve gifted them before too.
Same experience, I like the one I got. It’s more microfiber-y than other kitchen towels but it’s absorbent, soft and pretty. Its held the bright colors I got pretty well, maybe a bit of fading with about once weekly washes amongst other kitchen towels.
Geometry’s prints are SO CUTE, but I haven’t tried them. I have sort of a love/hate relationship with microfiber.
The towels are… fine, I guess? I like that they are larger than most dish towels, so great for spreading out as a layer under a cutting board, etc. But they don’t seem as absorbent as my cotton bar towels. I got them on sale and I wouldn’t pay full price.
I love my Geometry kitchen towels! They have the best prints and wash very well.
I’ve seen them at Target recently. Kind of glad I saw them in person because I had thought of buying some because i liked all the print options, but they’re pretty thin. Not necessarily bad but different than I expected.
We have two teens: 14 and 16, both of whom need new passports (and this will be the last time it’s my task!). On the state department website, you do different things for a 16YO. But we still have a 14YO, so I think we still need both parents to go and need an appointment. I haven’t done this since before COVID. We aren’t in a rush. Can someone walk me through what we need to do currently for renewals like I’m 5?
You really need to rely on the state dept website over the advice from random internet ppl.
Both parents don’t need to go. I just renewed for my kid and my husband signed something giving me permission. Had to be notarized.
This. The form is on the website.
This is an option. But unless you work somewhere with a notary, it’s probably as much hassle both going in person.
Getting a form notarized is as much of a pain as just going to the passport office.
I did this last weekend for my 16 year old. You have to electronically fill out the DS-11 form for them. Make an appointment at your local post office or passport office. Bring their old passport, the paperwork and a check for the Govt. Only 1 parent needs to be present. For the 14 year old, it’s a different form and both parents need to be there, unless you have documentation of the other parent’s approval. I don’t know what that looks like because I’ve always renewed my son’s passport with his father (ex husband) present.
Look up the process on the Department of State website to make sure you are getting the most up-to-date information and procedures. They are very good at explaining the entire process as if you were a five year old, which would be faster and more accurate than reading through well-meaning tips on this site. Good luck!
Lots of gift threads here.
To maybe piggyback and overlap a little. I have two family members, maybe three, that are going to buy me things from Amazon no matter what. I need things in the $40 range that I can put on my wishlist. Can’t be groceries. I put darn tough socks and smart wool socks on there based on the discussion the other day.
I think I would like an updated world atlas so any suggestions there would be great.
What $20-$50ish things would you like from Amazon that are practical items you’d put on your wishlist if you were me?
Love my electric blanket – https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0D83GX9JM?ref=ppx_yo2ov_dt_b_fed_asin_title&th=1
a charging cord with all 3 major ports on it (usb C, usb mini, lightening) as mentioned above
small party games like monikers
a thermos if there is one that you use
you can really get a lot of things on amazon. just stick with ones with lots of good reviews
Or weighted blankets are around that price
Some nice skin stuff – that face soap wirecutter was just raving about is $30
3 audible credits?
There are a lot of beauty brands on Amazon – check to see if any of the makeup or hair products you use are available.
Beauty things on Amazon are too risky IMO.
I don’t buy from unknown sellers, but I do buy from the brand’s Amazon store – also, since I know the products I don’t worry as much because if something was off I’d notice (packaging, consistency, smell, etc)
Unfortunately I’ve gotten obvious counterfeits buying from the brand’s Amazon store (though like you said I know this because it was obvious).
They often store items from various sellers together in the warehouse, so different vendor’s items get mixed. So you can’t rely on the seller’s authenticity anymore because you could get “the same” item from any seller.
Physical books – currently into Travel Guides to destinations I am interested in. Trying to reduce screen time. I like to read up on places, and then can always confirm up to date details on ticketing etc online after.
I filled out my Amazon Wish List with things from Oprah’s Favorite Things and The Strategist gift guides
I buy most things from Amazon, you can really get anything there. I don’t know your interests, but here are some things I might add in that price range:
Nice nail polish (I like kur londontown nail veil)
Books, card or board games. Records if you have a record player.
Cute planter, vase, throw blanket
Nice slippers
Nice candle
Yeti travel mug
Paint by numbers or other craft kit
Yoga block/strap/mat or other workout supplies (dumbbells or kettlebell, sliders)
New knife
Gooder sunglasses
Something super practical but not very exciting: smart plugs or lightbulbs, humidifier, Swedish dishtowels, decorative /seasonal dishtowels or coasters or paper napkins
I just got a mandoline / chopper from Amazon and love it
I would actually avoid darn tough and smartwool on Amazon because there are a lot of fakes and the Amazon inventory system mixes products.
Stufff I’ve bought from Amazon on Black Friday sales: books, Anker charging cords, yaktrax, handwarmers, kitchen stuff, Graf Lantz wool coasters (I bought a set on prime day and liked them so much I want another)
Graf Lantz is having a 30% off sale right now.
I like my earrings from Pavoi and have a few pairs on my wish list this year.
Kitchen gadgets and utensils. I chucked my black plastic stovetop utensils recently and replaced them with stainless steel Cuisinart ones; those are well within your price range.
This is super specific, but if you bake, a dough whisk is a game-changer (yes, I know I posted it already upthread): https://www.amazon.com/TEEVEA-Danish-Dough-Whisk-Traditional/dp/B0D5QQWNT5/
jig saw puzzles — flame tree gift and springbok are reliable brands
small (8 to 10-inch) nonstick frying pan
any book by Erik Larson
a set of sheets from Poppy & Fritz
A set of coasters that is made from material that absorbs condensation of cool drinks
Stanley mug
So here’s a fun post. Yesterday I saw a story about a woman who went to Home Depot in search of a guy to date. So my question is, what store would you go to to find a man if you were single? My answer is Orvis – outdoorsy but likes to look nice.
https://nypost.com/2024/11/07/lifestyle/tiktoker-finds-love-after-shopping-for-a-man-at-home-depot/
I go to local hardware stores to get extra grandparents. For a romantic interest, I’m going to the local climbing gym or outdoors/sporting goods store.
The problem is we have made it so people don’t like to talk to strangers (the nerve of a man who approaches a woman he doesn’t know in a store! or that chain here a few weeks back about the poster who wanted to ask out her doctor). makes it difficult.
Let’s not conflate the doctor situation with being out in public. Two very different things.
I’m very autistic and even I know how inappropriate asking out a doctor from a medical facility your recieved care at is. Let’s not pretend social rules are ‘don’t like to talk to strangers’.
I think that there is a sense that it is inappropriate for a man to approach a woman in a public space other than maybe a bar.
A man can say hello. He can try to start a conversation. If she’s not interested, she can end the conversation. What he shouldn’t do, then, is follow her, harass her, call her names, become physically threatening, etc. This seems to be hard for a lot of men to understand.
I am young millennial, and I do think there was a bit of a cultural shift in my generation with a higher level of caution+ thoughtfulness around asking a woman out in “non dating contexts” (like at work or someone on your rec league soccer team) – not that it’s absolutely off limits, but there’s a sense of “she’s here to play soccer, not find a bf, and I don’t want to make her uncomfortable”. Dating apps kind of bridge the gap too – I know several couples that knew each other at least peripherally from activities, but started dating when they saw each other on the apps – same purpose as “ask her friend if she’s open to being asked out” might have filled for past generations?
Lol, no we haven’t. We haven’t made polite interaction illegal. What society has done is made it slightly less acceptable to be a creep.
I hope so. I feel like I’d respond better to being approached at a store if I hadn’t had so many experiences of being approached by men so much older than me pretty much since sixth grade.
I guess it’s true that creeps make things harder for other men, but kind of sad if that is what makes someone start caring about the problem!
That’s what you think you did but what you really did was make men afraid to say hello for fear of being deemed a creep.
@12:53 thank you so much for singlehandedly defending all men.
They’re still not going to pick you.
Aren’t you clever. I’ve been married for 20 years kid and remember when people talked to each other and didn’t stereotype.
Fine, I’d take not getting picked up in Home Depot at all over dealing with creeps any day. I bet a lot of women would feel the same.
Not a store but I’d go to my local music venue and clean up. So many good options
Library fundraiser
As a rower, I’d say the boathouse but my current club has no eligible bachelors!!
I’m, of course, biased but rowers tend to be good people plus they’re fit and disciplined
I was on my university’s crew team and a large portion of the towers were covert intellectuals.
I got asked out at Trader Joe’s a couple of weeks ago, so that could be a good spot. Lots of products marketed to people cooking for one. Sometimes adventurous choices. In my city, tends to be a more liberal crowd.
plant nursery!
Bergdorf Goodman, because really I want a lavender marriage to a cute 30-something gay guy in finance.
My favorite coffee shop, local bookstore, plant shop. Music night at the best little pub town. My favorite hiking trail or backcountry haunt. Basically, somewhere I like to be.
Lol, this is great.
LL Bean, since I’m secretly still wishing for an LL Bean boyfriend.
(I read lots of romance novels around the topic of career city girl moving to small rural town falling for the bearded hunk who works a rough physical job – needless to say I am happily married to an academic who does not fit that bill at all, hahaha.)
Ha, this cracks me up as I was at LL Bean recently (the flagship in Freeport) and I swear the entire store was over the age of 70.
I’ve been asked out at Whole Foods a number of times. If I was actively searching, I’d go to a rock gym. Lots of kind, attractive and often shirtless dudes with good jobs there.
To meet a guy, I would do a bike group or maybe a climbing gym, but only because I wish I had the time to do those activities anyways!
For a store, Barnes and nobles.
I actually asked my boyfriend that question when we started to date: where did you hang out on weekends when you wanted to get out of the house? Answers: Guitar Center or MicroCenter. I was looking for him at Barnes & Noble! He’s not a reader, though.
How much food do you bring with you to an Airbnb – especially for a long holiday weekend where stores may be closed?
If I’m driving, I have a 55qt cooler for all of the cold food and put everything else in those giant Ikea bags.
I would mentally plan meals and go from there…
We usually bring things that can keep in the car, and then stop at a store for anything cold. Stores will be open just about any time. We only need stuff for breakfast the next morning, maybe some cheese, crackers, and wine for the night we arrive, and then we’ll deal with subsequent meals once we get there. Our habit is to find a place to go out to lunch every day and then to cook dinner or graze at the rental in the evenings & have toast and yogurt and fruit for breakfasts.
I know there are a few other Feds here – since its open season – what healthcare plan do you get? There are just so many options, its hard to parse through them all. I’ve traditionally done FEP Basic but it’s getting so pricey.
I like the MHBP high deductible plan. The actual insurance card says Aetna and it uses their administration and network. Pricing has stayed relatively steady over the past few years. I had no issues with paying for cancer treatments, stitches, specialists (derm), etc.
My family has BCBS Basic. I agree it’s getting pricey but I have always been very happy with the coverage. I need yearly MRIs and my daughter uses a very expensive biologic medication. We have not had any issues with approval and I am afraid to take my chances with another carrier.
I found my mom a cute pair of pajamas for Christmas but would like to pair something with them. Any ideas? She already has slippers and couldn’t care less about eye masks or fancy bath things.
Fancy tea (blooming teas?) or hot cocoa?
Harney teas are nice because they come in a tin.
I’m a big tea drinker and I like to get Tea Forte as a gift. It feels very special.
F&M tea. Carried at WS.
my fuzzy slippers wear through in a year or two – maybe she wouldn’t mind a new pair?
My late mom used to buy me Dearfoam bootie slippers every Christmas and it was a nice tradition. Maybe start something like that for your mom?
DVD or cozy paperback book for a night in?
Nice socks – they wear out much faster than slippers. Or a good book.
I have several robes – some warm, some great to put on after a shower when you are wet, some light and figure hugging. But my favorite right now is this cozy, incredibly reasonably priced robe from – Costco. Love it.
https://www.costco.com/carole-hochman-ladies-plush-robe.product.4000139172.html
Gut-check on whether I’m just being An Old: I have a nearly-new grad on my team, and their expense reports are walking right up to the line of being a bit ridiculous. On one hand, if you stay in policy and finance doesn’t kick it back to me, why should I care? On the other hand, the money comes out of my team travel budget, so if you’re constantly spending every cent allowed by policy on your meals, flights, etc., it reduces my budget.
Some examples that irk me, but I don’t feel like they would be unreasonable if I wasn’t already annoyed by some other minor performance issues:
Breakfast on a travel day, where everyone else gets coffee and a breakfast sandwich, and this person gets a sit-down breakfast with an extra pastry to go and hits the meal limit.
Our office provides lunch, and everyone else just eats at the office on their travel day before heading out. This person goes out for lunch and hits the meal limit.
We have a budget for entertainment for people to get together, since many of us work remotely. This person goes into one of our offices multiple times per week, but has submitted 3 reimbursement requests for the remote entertainment budget to hang out with only one other employee (not the same employee each time, but still).
So, do I need to say something specific to them about this, or am I just being grumpy?
Breakfast is totally fine, they’re not at fault for having different meal preferences than you are.
I think that the other two are in a gray area, but your company needs to specify in policy if those aren’t going to be allowed. I honestly don’t know why you don’t have policies for traveling when meals are provided as part of the day and especially why there aren’t guidelines on what entertainment guidelines are!
I’ve only ever worked in government (all levels) or NGOs, so we very much have to stick to the government established lodging and M&IE limits (which does state you’re not eligible for the lunch money if you are being provided lunch; when I worked for the state you couldn’t get the breakfast $ if your hotel had breakfast) but obviously all resources are pretty limited in those settings. Even so, my DH’s F50 company has really strict rules about meals ($75 limit per day, regardless of where you are (I, not infrequently, make out better than he does), no meals if the conference provides them, cannot uber or rent a car if there is public transit, even if it’s not great, not only must you use a travel card to pay for things but you also cannot keep any points – they all go to the company) – honestly I think his company is stingy given its revenue and profits.
Honestly, I think you’re being grumpy. Seems like he’s operating within the rules and not going over budget. I think your annoyance with other things is clouding this issue (which, fair, but he’s not really doing anything wrong, per se).
it’s the company’s fault for not having clearer policies, but you shouldn’t begrudge him for taking all of his allowance.
+1
+ another one. None of this would annoy me at all. And good for your employee for figuring out not to leave money on the table.
+1 If there’s a budget and they’re within it, I think you’re being grumpy.
As long as everything is under the limit, I would not say anything.
I think if you work for a giant consulting firm, tech company or similar using the travel budget is fair game, at an NGO or government though the behavior is inappropriate.
This is where I come from as an NGO employee. Our allowances are actually quite far (rare in this field!) but I try not get to my limits because it takes money away from the mission.
I briefly had one, miserable, awful, terrible private sector job and they were very stingy with our travel allotments and it was terrible – the CEO was a billionaire, company had record setting profits, and they were nickel and diming everything.
I’m admittedly an anticapitalist but given the free lunch and entertainment budget, your company seems like it has plenty of money. There’s a good chance that this employee’s salary or benefits or work life balance aren’t as good as they could be (capitalism…) so why shouldn’t he try to make it up via the travel allowance?
I would also be kind of grumpy about that, although I work in a charity and I expect my team to be mindful that we’re spending money that originates from either the public or our member organisations (also charities and nobody in them is spending big on expenses). Which is a bit different than corporate. How do you allocate your team travel budget and what do your team understand about that? If there’s a real possibility you’re going to have to say no to other members of the team using ‘normal’ expenses by the end of the year because this guy bought a lot of lunches instead of eating the free food in the office I think it’s more than reasonable to set some local policies you communicate to the whole team. But if you have plenty and he’s in policy you can’t really bring it up (although I think it’s telling you something about his ability to both notice and fit in with your team culture).
Also an old and I’d consider it a kindness to have a chat with this person about ‘team norms’. I’m in consulting and stuff I didn’t know when I started was all around the ‘airport test’ (is this someone I can hang out with if my flight is delayed without issue). I’d keep it as a quick/brief – ‘hey, here’s some general guidance on our team norms’ and allow for some leeway (I can see maybe wanting to eat lunch out before travel to have some solo time or doing the remote entertainment thing 1-2x/month).
I clearly remember when My Big4 office was pushing all these ‘wellness’ benefits during tax season. I didn’t get that it was more of a ‘take a break while you’re working 12 hour days’, not ‘skip meetings to do yoga and socialize so employee morale is good’ and my boss had to correct me.
+1 that it’s a kindness to have a chat about team norms. There was all sorts of stuff I didn’t understand at first. I spent a ton of time (a lot on here!) trying to understand norms. My boss kindly giving me advice was most welcome.
FWIW, I wasn’t first gen college, but I was first gen very fancy college and first gen in the sorts of roles that disproportionately go to recent graduates of very fancy colleges. I think I probably “passed” as if I could have been like my elder colleagues’ kids, but I really didn’t have anyone to teach me these things IRL outside the office.
“Tradwick, I don’t think you want to be remembered as the new hire that made it necessary to re-issue and tighten up our policies on this, but . . .”
Yes, he is within the letter of the rules. But not within the spirit. He may be the person who will go up to the line as it is written and OMG I do not have the desire to spend a life and my limited energy managing someone with this few clues.
Give him this one gift and see what he does with it.
+1
Our own Tradwick was a very entitled new hire who branded himself as very anti- team player. The rest of the group (including his boss) would have continental breakfast, eat the conference venue’s provided lunch, and then pool their per diem to go out for a nice dinner and drinks to debrief after a long day, while he would max out his meal allowance by going offsite for every meal. He would throw fits when he wasn’t in the loop on team plans or strategy and complain about being excluded b/c he didn’t understand the in-group jokes. Allowed by policy, yes, but he didn’t engender himself to the group by refusing to socialize. He was not promoted on the timeframe he thought he deserved, and no one misses him now that he has left.
Agree with all this.
One of the things that is hard for people to understand: sometimes, you aren’t supposed to push to the max on everything. You can have generous limits on each meal, which is intended to let people choose what matters to them in a day, not so he can hit the limit on all of them. If that system is abused, it will get tightened up.
Honestly, I think you’re being a little grumpy and probably projecting your other frustrations onto this situation. Do you really want to have a conversation where you tell someone they ordered more food than you think they “should have” needed for breakfast? Maybe they get hypoglycemic and know they won’t have a chance to grab a snack later.
It sounds like your policy is out of sync with the office norms, so I’d either work on changing the policy (if it’s really a problem and not just a stand-in for your frustrations with this person’s performance) or at a minimum give it some time to see if your new person picks up on the office norms and assimilates. This is part of the “invisible furniture” that inevitably comes with being at a new job, and I think it’s unfair to hold it against new people when they unknowingly walk into it.
+1 he might just have a bigger appetite? Are you really going to police that…
Yeah, the fact that they’re a new grad gives you leeway to give a gentle “you’re not doing anything wrong, but be aware of how it reads, too many deviations from the office norms tends to not be good for career/promotion aspects if that is something you care about” talk. I’d probably try to bring up as many “norms” as possible in a single conversation and leave it there. If you have already had a conversation about office norms, having another one is probably not a good idea.
For the entertainment/team event stuff, are there no policy guidelines about how this stuff is organized/who can approve an event/frequency/eligibility for in-office workers, etc?
For the meals, it sounds like it’s within policy. I’d be weirded out if my boss told me the meal limit is $X but there’s actually this secret rule you should spend $<x. Part of business travel is paying for convenience.
Address the performance issue though!
Agree with all this!
Devil’s advocate: the meal limit might be $X, which is the same regardless of location. Maybe it’s generous enough to feed people in NYC, but should not be what you’re spending in Knoxville.
Some companies change the limit depending on the city you’re travelling to. Higher limit for cities like NYC, DC, LA, SF, etc, lower limit everywhere else.
Some companies do; others don’t.
heh, I worked for a company with primary offices in both NYC and Knoxville and now I am wondering if you were there too….
No, although that could have been neat! Just chose two cities at opposite ends of the spectrum.
You need to say something because you are applying an unwritten rule here. The expectation is fair, in my opinion, but they can’t read your mind. In a lot of places going up to the limit would be the expectation. If your policy has a generic sentence about keeping costs reasonable, you could cite that. Otherwise I would just say – please be aware that our team’s travel budget is limited, and you seem to be actively trying to reach the maximum allowable amounts frequently, which leaves less budget for other team members. We need to make sure that costs are reasonable and related to doing our jobs. Let me know what you think.
I like this. Make it clear that his strategy is obvious and spell out the ramifications. If you deplete your travel fund and management reviews expense reports his will jump out as an abuse of the budget.
If it helps you reframe, a lot of funding in school was “use it or lose it” and student clubs specifically set the aim of spending the money that is available.
I would stay very far away from the topic of how much people eat.
You’re being grumpy. If they’re not going over the limit who cares. Move on.
OP here, this is a helpful gut-check. As long as they’re in policy, then I’ll let it go.
One counter-point: when I was a very junior associate, I had a partner tell me the unwritten rules of expensing meals. Basically, read the room: don’t order $25 sushi (even when that was within policy) when everyone else is getting a $12 salad. In your case, if the impact to the team’s travel budget is material, I’d have a similar conversation. I was so grateful to be told, because I assumed I was fine if all my expenses were technically permissible.
+1 on this. It would be a kindness to explain the facts of life along the lines of some of the other comments (i.e., the big boss might get irked, even if the expenses are technically within policy). Part of learning how to be a successful employee is learning the unwritten rules of office politics.
OP again, since there’s a few more replies to the thread. Two humorous observations: everyone assumes this person is a man, even though I didn’t specify a gender. Lots of commenters seem to think that I’m saying they eat too much or more than someone should eat, when the reality is that I tend to be one of the biggest eaters in the team.
This is part of why I asked for the gut-check, and the breakfast example is perfect because in normal life, I would probably put in a similar order as this person. So it’s less that the order is unreasonable for one person to order, and more that it’s so out of sync from everyone else’s behavior. When one report consistently comes back substantially higher than everyone else’s, particularly from a junior person on the team, I notice it. This just came up because we traveled as a team, so all the expense reports came in at once, so it was particularly obvious within the last month.
I think the gender assumption is because of the audacity, which is typically gendered.
I’d say this is more of a “read the room” problem than a “your expenses are too high” problem.
It’s like ordering the most expensive menu item (e.g. steak with shrimp) for lunch with senior management when everybody else is keeping it modest. Dietary requirements aside, this would stand out in a negative way.
I think many junior employees have this perception that corporations pay for everything and that they can somehow up their lifestyle maxing out their budget every time, even if it is formally within policy.
When I was an intern, I was there myself when we got meal vouchers for the company cafeteria, and would max out the amount on them by buying cookies and drinks on top of the actual meal. There was probably an overall budget for this intern program so being too frugal would have likely cut that budget in the next year, so I still think it was fine.
You could also have a conversation with the team about your travel budget, so that they gain insights into how the money is spent, and where flexibility is.
The only caveat I would share is from personal experience. With dietary restrictions I will normally eat a huge breakfast when traveling because I know it is food I can eat. If you know this person has dietary restrictions, I would soften the speech but still include a read the room component.
The travel policy everywhere I’ve worked only counted entertainment when entertaining people outside the company. Not hanging out with fellow employees.
I had an employee who was pretty flashy with his expense account, and my ow boss commented that this basically entry level employee was expensing more than he did, so I just passed along that comment along with my own comment that this was not something you want to stick out on, and to be “reasonable.” He reined it in after that. The firm had a round of layoffs a few months after that and my boss mentioned his name, still upset about the expenses. Thankfully, I was able to point out that his last couple of months of expenses were much more in line with other employees’, and that got him off the chopping block. These things really do matter!
You are being grumpy. This is a new hire who is new to work travel and also probably doesn’t make anywhere near your salary. Let her/him enjoy wine or a sit down breakfast on the company dollar if it’s in bounds of the travel policy. Be glad they are willing to travel at all.
Re your budget, I can’t imagine this makes a real impact on your budget. Last minute flight changes at the whim of the customer are what kills mine!!
If these activities are sanctioned by the policy, you can either change the policy, or say nothing. If not in violation of policy, you’re in a hard spot to say something without seeming unreasonable.
I think it’s kind to have the conversation about norms.
What’s odd here is that travel meals aren’t a per diem. I worked at a nonprofit and now work at a university, and both places just gave the federal per diem. No one should be policing how others eat during travel.
I think you need to clarify that the budget is a limit, not a goal. It is generous because you might get caught in a situation where you need the outer limit, and no one wants anyone new going hungry or eating unhealthful food on travel, but they should not be making an effort to max out every meal.
+1 on this, although be prepared for the employee not to understand what you are saying.
Do these expenses get passed through and billed to clients? Is the expectation that you will discount them when drafting or reviewing the invoice that goes to clients and write them off and pay out of your budget? If it’s not your company that pays these expenses, but a billed client, you can have a conversation (guided by HR advice, if necessary) about the “optics” of appearing to take advantage of generous expense policies. But otherwise, if this is your company’s police, and she’s hitting the maximum allowances, I would let it go.
You’re being grumpy.
am i the only one who doesn’t want any of the stuff that we are talking about and would honestly prefer to not have to get or give presents?
I’m with you, but that gets you labeled a Grinch. I have enough stuff, I don’t want more. Whenever I do buy something I make sure it’s perfect, so gifts are always just wasteful clutter. But rules dictate you must put on a smile and pollute the planet for social cohesion.
No, I completely agree. I have gradually stopped doing Christmas gifts for everyone, including my kids. If they need something, I will buy it. But when I ask them what they want, they never have any suggestions.
How old are your kids? How do they communicate something they need? What about wants?
i’m the original anon not the one about not getting gifts for my kids but mine are a freshman and a senior in HS and they will both get something that they “want” and don’t need (like fancy sneakers or an expensive sweatshirt or concert tickets) and that’s it. i’ve stopped buying things just to wrap them…. we are very fortunate that my kids get what they need as we go (like if they need a blazer or a new winter coat we get it when they need it, i don’t back those things into the holidays)
This must be a family difference – I grew up in a frugal family so a) needs were scrutinized, as most are actually wants and b) getting new jeans because you outgrew them meant getting them from Old Navy, if you wanted nicer or cooler jeans they were either a gift or something you could buy on your own. And you only needed one pair at a time (went to Catholic school so had a uniform, jeans were only for weekends).
Christmas and birthdays were pretty big, but there was always a LOT we wanted because non-holiday shopping was so limited.
This is how our family does it. Our daughter had an allowance in high school and now has a job in college, and is responsible for buying all her own clothes, sports equipment, school supplies, toiletries, etc. Expensive things like a cell phone, her Apple watch, the long down coat she needed for college in the frozen north, her ski helmet, etc. have been Christmas and birthday gifts because it’s hard for her to afford them on her own.
Your kids don’t get presents on Christmas?
this. this is the problem. my kids don’t need to unwrap pajamas and chargers and books they won’t read just to have something under the tree.
Ok, so get them something they want and need? You’re their mom, you don’t know?
I think this is pretty cool. If you’re raising kids to appreciate what they have and you (seem?) take care of their needs and reasonable wants, then it’s fine to not have wasteful presents under the tree. You’re raising them to be better people. I get it.
+1 this is so Grinchy… surely there’s something they’d want?
yes. and they get that, a few things or one big. but this “i’m buying pajamas and slippers and a sleep mask” or mugs and fancy coffee…. i just don’t want it or need it.
the anon above is either not a mother or a mother of small children. the average affluent high school student does not have a list of things they want or need. not just mine, my nieces and nepphews, my friends kids….
“The average affluent high school student does not have a list of things they want or need.” What on earth? My high schooler always wanted something that she couldn’t afford or didn’t want to prioritize spending her allowance and job money on. Uggs, new water bottle, new charging cables, perfume, ski pants to replace the ones she’d outgrown, new video game, Lego kit, books, theater tickets … Are you all just giving your kids unlimited access to your credit cards so they can go buy whatever they want whenever they want it?
my mother said when she downsized from the house my siblings and i grew up in that almost all the stuff she had to get rid of was things that had been bought so we had presents (stuffed animals, and earring trees….)
Not the anon you are replying to, but we have always kept holiday and birthday gifts minimal. They almost always consist of things that, while not strictly needs, are items we would have bought anyway (clothes to replace worn or outgrown ones, the next book in a beloved series, refills on consumable hobby supplies, family board games). Not all of those at each holiday, just whatever items we would have been purchasing anyway. Sometimes we have a larger purchase that takes the place of the holiday gifts (new appliance that replaces the dying one we have all been annoyed with, or a major car repair). Holidays for us are more about all being home and spending time together than they are about stuff.
you’d replace a family appliance or car repair as a holiday gift to kids?!? that’s bonkers to me
Money isn’t unlimited. Sometimes you need to prioritize what actually benefits the family.
Yep, me too. For some reason, gift giving for the holidays feels very tr*nsactional. I enjoy the holiday season and spending time with family and friends, but I just don’t want more stuff. I prefer gift cards are great and I don’t find them impersonal at all.
I don’t like to make up things to give or get and mostly dislike gift giving holidays and parties. But if I buy myself something, I honestly don’t feel the same way about it as when it’s a gift from someone. I think of it in terms of my budget and whether I made the right choice. But with gifts, every single time I use certain things in the kitchen, I think of the person who gave them to me, even if it was a gift exchange and a wishlist situation or a registry, and it completely turns off the part of my brain that feels responsible for the purchase as a household manager.
Sort of, except I enjoy the ritual of gifting: picking something out, creating a little bit of suspense, then unwrapping, and getting a fuzzy moment of ‘yay they like it’ or ‘yay they picked out this thing for me’. What I don’t like is the materialism, and the pressure. That can be solved with wishlists, appreciating practical gifts, homemade gifts, things from the thrift store, experiences and consumable gifts equally to traditional gifts, and regardless of the price tag, not expecting reciprocity when it comes to gift value. My dad would genuinely appreciate expensive concert tickets or a box of homemade cookies in equal measure.
I’m trying to get away from extended family gifts, but we do a pretty big Christmas morning with my parents and sister and I don’t want to give that up. My sister and I are in our 20s and single, so if we got rid of this there wouldn’t be gifts. We’re also still getting established so gifts really are helpful.
I’m the eldest, and I’m (at 29) just now starting to own most of what I need (or the useful wants, like kitchen appliances). I’d like to upgrade a bit – pretty much all of my kitchen stuff, furniture, decor, etc. is hand me downs (my cousin got marrried and I got her pots and pans… that she got from our other cousin) and I’m starting to want to upgrade to nicer or newer stuff. My mom is so frugal she doesn’t understand upgrades or things that are nice to have but not necessary (I want a mandoline slicer / chopper and she’s like you have a knife and a cutting board why do you need this) so our current struggle is I’ll put a few nicer but still reasonably priced upgrades on my list and she’ll ignore it (I put a sweater from Banana Republic on it, she gets me one that’s a little similar but really not that close from TJ Maxx). I very, very much do not want random crap but I do want what I want and its annoying when that gets ignored.
there are these boomer mom videos on instagram that cover this. honestly i always thought it was just my mom
My mom also has no brand loyalty, she just buys what’s on sale. I try to send links to “this is the mascara I use”, but she ignores that too and picks up whatever at CVS (which annoys me because CVS is overpriced – whose the frugal one now?!)
FWIW, 85% of my skincare and makeup is e.l.f. It’s not like I’m sending her spendy stuff.
Even things like we always get the classic toothbrush or toothpaste or whatever in our stockings, I don’t want the Crest you got in a mega pack and put in everyone’s stocking
I’m admittedly very particular and I will return a shirt because I don’t like the color thread they used on the hem or the placement of a button or something. My family is not so particular. I give detailed lists that get ignored, then everyone judges me for returning what they got me for something I actually like.
My parents buy each other things that the other doesn’t like – my mom is cranky about it, my dad donates it immediately. I’m like hello lists solve all of these problems.
And then my brother is extremely laid back and doesn’t care.
I give very specific lists to try and circumvent returns but people will buy ‘similar’ items which don’t meet my needs. I hate donating stuff because thrifts stores are already overflowing with cr@p. It’s not charitable to make my junk someone else’s problem.
That Banana Republic sweater is 40% off right now, if that would persuade her to get you what you actually want.
+1
I have a small house by American standards and it’s lovely if and only if I limit the number of possessions I have. I limit my gift giving to spouse + kids, and even then, it’s really limited compared to what I grew up with. I like getting a present from my spouse and, if my kids make something at school, from them too.
Gifting for no reason annoys me immensely. Think Secret Santa at the office or with the neighbors. I like you – I can’t stand whatever generic stuff will be involved in this gift swap. How about you keep your $20 and I keep mine? But I participate because you’re my friend and gifting is what you like.
DH and I have perfected gift giving. We each give just a couple things to each other – things we genuinely believe the other will like and use. For him, that’s manly soap and Costco’s whiskey sampler. It’s rare to spend over $150.
Gifting for the point of gifting is so wasteful, especially when there are so many Angel Trees out there with needy children or other people in need.
Gift giving is my love language, but I don’t give junky crap like another mug or a cheap hand lotion or whatever. I put a lot of thought and effort into the gifts I give because I genuinely enjoy it.
See, but I think everybody thinks they’re not giving junk, but obviously lots are.
Same here. People who are into gifts also tend to have good taste. It’s the obligatory purchases that cause the angst seen here.
I like giving gifts but I really don’t want to get *stuff* at all. I would like fancy consumables that I otherwise would never buy for myself.
I am the same way, and I think it’s weird when adults have wish lists. That said, I would never skip gifts for kids like the poster above.
Clearly you are not the only one, but you are (in my experience) very very much in the minority. And you can certainly opt out of gift giving except for the semi-mandatory ones for people who work for you (but those tend to be cash so not really “presents”). You just have to be prepared for the fall-out.
I love to get and give gifts. The stuff that I can use and enjoy, I do. The stuff that is not for me I appreciate the thought and re-gift. I give a lot of consumables and if the recipient does not like them (assuming I have put even minimal thought into it; I do not give candles to a teenage boy or alcohol to a Mormon) they are easy to pass along and I hope they appreciate the thought.
The only gifts I really resent are the ones for the people I work with. They tend to cost a ridiculous amount of money for the six people I have to buy for, but an actual physical gift (not money) is my office norm and I follow it because I like my job and need my staff to not hate me.
You’re quite honestly going to have to get over it. People buy each other gifts this time of year, they’re going to ask for suggestions on here, and you’re not going to be able to singlehandedly change the world.
This is a well-off person comment. A lot of people do not ever get things beyond the essentials outside of holiday gift giving.
Ah yes, the answer to income disparity and some people not having nice things is for the wealthy people to exchange gifts they don’t actually want or need
No. It is appropriate, though, that those who have or can afford everything they want and need to not compound the disparity by denigrating the act of giving as a general proposition.
And while we are on the subject, why don’t those who do not want gifts make a request that gifts be made in your name to a favorite charity, or in the form of gift cards that you can then give to a favorite charity or to people you know who would appreciate them (assuming you know anyone who doesn’t have everything they need and have a relationship with them as opposed to disdain.for them).
I don’t think someone saying that they don’t like giving or receiving gifts is denigrating the act of gift giving…
That said, great suggestion on your second paragraph. I do this with people who push back on my no gift preference and it does bring joy to getting gifts for me so highly recommend.
I’ve said it before here, I tried this and my mom doesn’t care. I am a mid-40s woman who buys nearly everything I want when I want it because I am paid a stupid amount of money to not work very hard. I also donate to charity FWIW. However, my mother, who generally also has whatever she wants, insists that I have to have a present to open on Xmas morning. I hate it.
SNORT!
Nope. I do find it silly how worked up people who enjoy getting and giving gifts get about hearing this perspective. I’m a physical touch person but I don’t go around trying to convince people that don’t like hugs that they should enjoy hugs and let me hug them
Not one person on here is getting you a gift. You can calm down.
I’m perfectly calm. I apparently didn’t convey it but when I said I find it silly, i meant that I genuinely find it silly and amusing how worked up people get when someone says they don’t like gifts.
You sound like you could use a hug though :)
Not the prior poster, but what I get worked up about is the underlying attitude for many, which seems to be “The people who give me gifts do not understand what is nice and what is worth of me. They have bad taste and should not be permitted to bring items that are beneath me into my world, suggesting that I am at their level when I in fact am better than they are. And I need them to accept and acknowledge that. I keep reminding them, but they never hear me.”
Speaking only for myself that’s not the attitude at all. I don’t like stuff and am extremely picky. It would be the equivalent of telling someone I really don’t like mushrooms and every time they invite me over they serve me mushrooms. I don’t think you have bad taste for liking mushrooms but I am annoyed that I’ve conveyed I don’t like/enjoy something and you keep pushing.
For what it’s worth, I don’t enjoy giving gifts either but I have some close friends who love gift giving and I take time to get them gifts because I know it’s meaningful to them. They also know I don’t like stuff but love giving gifts so usually get me some fancy consumables, which I can either enjoy or share.
+1 to 2:29. I see this attitude over on the moms’ page as well. “How dare my parents buy my child anything that I have not carefully curated to meet my aesthetic standards and parenting philosophy.” It’s not about not wanting things; it’s about wanting total control of everything.
Anon at 2:43 I’m not offended if someone buys my kid something. They should also not be offended when we donate the toy that doesn’t fit our parenting philosophy. My kids have everything they need and more. I’m personally super grateful both sets of grandparents understand that and gift our kids experiences (often times with a small souvenir). My oldest still talks about going to the zoo with grandma three years ago. She has no idea who gave her which one of her million stuffies or toys. For myself, I really appreciate people who donate in my name to the nonprofit whose board I sit on instead of buying me something.
As a counter, I rarely got to see my niece and nephew, but I bought them memorable gifts so that they would have a reminder of my presence in their life. I got my two-year-old niece a gigantic teddy bear and then did not see her for close to a year. When I did see her again, she took a long look at me, then another, and then went in her room and dragged that teddy bear out.
I love giving gifts and receiving them, but I recognize it’s not for everyone. My family is big on gifts, and we do wishlists. My ex-husband didn’t like giving/receiving gifts, and would put a few charities on his list, and if people wanted to buy him something, they’d donate to the charity. This worked great for us.
My favorite gifts are homemade/free/cheap. My SIL always divides up her plants and gifts them on nice planters. I love homemade spices, coffee, and books from the (giant) little free library. I ask the kids/DH for plants, bird seed & bulbs, and to replace worn things (towels, this year I’m getting a new beach chair, etc).
I’ve tried to “save” things for my ILs to get my kids. They ILs send us fruit and buy my kids ski gear, plus a gift card and a book/toy/outfit (kids are tweens on up).
FWIW we are upper class and I am over high consumption holidays; my mom is the absolute worst at this. Her focus to us all typically go right to the donate pile because she ignores lists and MUST GIFT LOTS!
Related but maybe this is an appropriate thread for this: I am always surprised by how many F’ing pajamas people seem to think they need! 2-3 are plenty, and am still using mine from 10+ years ago.
Oh. I could not disagree more. Clean pajamas daily is a small indulgence that I give myself. I need at least 8 pairs to be happy. But I don’t buy anything expensive – maybe $50 a set, less if I can, and then I wear for a long time.
Same girl same. Wearing the same PJs for more than one night is gross and they do not last a decade, I’m sorry but yuck.
I feel like each year I have one really good gift idea that I’m excited to give, and then it’s a struggle to figure out what to get for everyone else. I wish I could give people presents every 3-4 years when I have inspiration. I certainly don’t want obligatory gifts, and would rather get fewer things less often, but have them be just right. (This year, my good idea is a sealing wax kit with a custom monogram for my sister. I am 98% sure she will think it’s awesome and everyone get wax-sealed birthday cards from her forever.)
Can you guys talk to me about marriage counseling? Did it help your relationship? How did you go about finding somebody you both liked or at least tolerated?
I’m feeling so sad this week about the state of my marriage. I really don’t want it to end but it’s hard to see from here the path to making it better.
It did not help mine because my now ex manipulated the therapist. His sole aim of attending at all was to prove that I was wrong and that he was right. If you already know that one of you is not open to fixing things via compromise of any sort, I think it’s too little too late. The therapy was mostly frustrating for me for this reason, but it did finally help me realize that asking for the bare minimum was not asking too much.
I think like any therapy they can help if you find a good one, gives you a safe and neutral space. that said you both have to be open to making it work and wanting to go…..
test subthread 3
We did pre-marital counseling, which gave us some helpful tools and language going forward. When we’ve had serious disagreements or struggles, we went back to those tools. Namely, us vs. the problem, not us vs. each other.
I think the big question is whether you know the root cause of the problem, and whether that’s fixable.
In our case, the root cause was quite clear, it was just the action to fix it that was really hard. For us, we were already making some hard choices to compromise, but it wasn’t working, so why not substitute one hard thing for another?
But if you don’t actually know the issue or your spouse is unwilling to put in the work to find and fix the issue, that’s more difficult. A counselor is supposed to be more of a neutral third-party to help you navigate your feelings and conversations, but they don’t have answers if someone isn’t willing to show up in good faith.
Personally I think it is the last stop on the way to divorcetown and I’d only bother if it was necessary to make that process go smoothly. You either get along or you don’t. You fight fair or you don’t. Your relationship works or it doesn’t.
This makes me even more sad because if this is true then I will never be in a serious relationship that lasts.
Why do you say this?
I don’t know about this. People can definitely learn to fight fair, or start getting along better when some external stressor is removed.
wow. you either get along or you don’t. that’s a wildly simplisitic take on relationships.
Is it really? I think people in relationships understand whether they get along or if everything is a battle.
Relationships should be simple and easy. When they’re hard they’re not the right one.
I think this is pretty simplistic but there’s also a grain of trugh here. When I was in a really bad marriage I actually enrolled in grad school for marriage and family therapy, at least in part to figure out what was going on in my own relationship. I vividly remember asking one of the professors why, in the case studies in the books, the techniques (“share your feelings,” “be open to one another,” etc.) work so well, when in my own experience they didn’t work at all. She replied, “Well, the cases in the book are the best-case scenarios. You have to have two parties who are open and willing to participate in good faith.”
And I was all, “well if I had two parties who were open and willing to participate in good faith, I wouldn’t need counseling, would I?”
So. If you’re married to an abuser (emotional or otherwise), or somebody who isn’t open to changing their behavior, it’s not likely to help. If you’ve got two well-intentioned partners who are acting in good faith but are in a rough spot (money troubles, young kids, everybody too tired and busy, or whatever), then it can really help.
My husband and I did counseling and I was very helpful. Our relationship is doing really well. I don’t think it is always the last resort, it really depends on the people involved. Like with physical medical problems, if you go get help early when you have time, it will help but if you wait for too long to start addressing the issue it will be too late.
My husband and I both wanted to see if we could address our issues. We wanted to try because we both valued our relationship and didn’t want to give up on our marriage before trying counseling. I would say tell your partner, “I love you, this relationship is important to me and I want to use all the tools available to make it work. I am struggling with x, y and z. Would you be open to counseling?” I would also make sure to communicate that you realize you are half of the relationship, you are not saying he is the problem. You will also be open to working on yourself.
I am not a believer in staying in an unhappy marriage just because, and I am supportive of people wanting to divorce to improve their lives BUT I do think that unless there are issues like abuse, it is worth trying counseling if you are married since you did think the person was worth you spending your life with.
Thank you for this. I totally understand the other perspectives in this thread, but I think the problems in my own marriage are smaller in scale. But we also keep running into the same patterns of conflict so if it’s truly “you get along or you don’t” then I guess we’re SOL.
I can’t speak from experience, but from observation most people start couples therapy far too late, after the relationship is already dead. It’s more helpful the sooner you can get to it.
test sublevel 3
test sublevel 3
test sublevel 3
asdfasfd