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This double layer necklace caught my eye when I was perusing the sales, and I like it because it strikes me as simple but substantial. Unlike a lot of the “statement necklaces” of yore this one isn't fussy or comically large or the cause of noisy jangling. But imagine it with a solid colored black t-shirt, blouse, or sweater with a boatneck or crewneck, or a dress with those cuts — this necklace would make a substantial impact. It's available in both gold and silver tones at Talbots, where it was $60 but is now marked to $14.99. Double Layer Necklace
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Sales of note for 9.16.24
- Nordstrom – Summer Sale, save up to 60%
- Ann Taylor – Extra 30% off sale
- Banana Republic Factory – 50% off everything + extra 20% off
- Boden – 15% off new styles
- Eloquii – Extra 50% off sale
- J.Crew – 30% off wear-now styles
- J.Crew Factory – (ends 9/16 PM): 40% off everything + extra 70% off sale with code
- Lo & Sons – Warehouse sale, up to 70% off
- M.M.LaFleur – Save 25% sitewide
- Spanx – Lots of workwear on sale, some up to 70% off
- Talbots – Extra 25% off all tops + markdowns
- Target – Car-seat trade-in event through 9/28 — bring in an old car seat to get a 20% discount on other baby/toddler stuff.
- White House Black Market – 40% off select styles
Some of our latest posts here at Corporette…
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And some of our latest threadjacks here at Corporette (reader questions and commentary) — see more here!
Some of our latest threadjacks include:
- What to say to friends and family who threaten to not vote?
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- What small steps can I take today to get myself a little more “together” and not feel so frazzled all of the time?
- The oldest daughter is America's social safety net — change my mind…
- What have you lost your taste for as you've aged?
- Tell me about your favorite adventure travels…
Anon
I love things like this in theory but they turn on me immediately. I guess I have that kind of skin. I always wish I could afford larger scale jewelry like this in real gold.
I guess that’s why I gravitate toward pearls instead.
Ellen
Me too. I do NOT like metal against my neck. It kind of reminds me of primitive living and slavery (I know that sounds wild), but I prefer to limit the kind of jewelry I own to FUNCTIONAL jewelery, such as a watch or a FITBIT and stuff that is USEFUL to me. Otherwise, I feel weighed down with chains and bracelets that do nothing for me. But when I get MARRIED, I WILL wear a wedding ring. YAY!!!!
Dress me please!
Hello! First comment back from maternity leave (thankfully didn’t spend much time on my laptop!) I would LOVE you ladies to dress me. Now that I’m post-partum and my body has changed (and my feet), I’m in need of new clothes and shoes, and would love to find a ‘style’ again. I’m an in-house attorney in a major entertainment company. My office is generally casual, and my boss wears khakis and t-shirts and branded hoodies most days, however, the most senior attorney under him does dress business casual, so that has been where I’ve taken my direction from. Other attorney in my dept is a straight up and down body type with hipster style, which wouldn’t work for me at all. I tend to wear skinny pants and flowy tops with ballet slippers or 2″ wedges, but that was more out of comfort and default than active decision. When I worked at a firm it was a lot of wrap dresses, but those don’t really look right here. I’m finally at a place where I want to invest a little in my clothes and find more ‘joy’ in them (I’m not Marie Kondo-ing, but I like the idea when it comes to new pieces). I’m 5’7″, size 12-14, a little chubby. Blonde and super pale. I’ve liked to describe myself as classic with a little edge. If you could wear anything in this biz-casual/casual environment, what would it be?? Outfits and shoes! Any dream characters I should look at for inspiration?
ANP
I’m no style maven, but…what about Boden? When I think about your work environment and how you describe yourself, I like the idea of a colored skinny pant (or something with pattern) and a structured top. I love Boden’s stuff and think you could definitely find pieces there that are “classic with an edge.”
Anonymous
Boden has exactly zero edge.
Anonymous
I’m also a size 12-14, in-house at a business casual Fortune 500 company. With a brand new baby at home, I would try to do a mix and match “uniform” so that you don’t have to spend too much time on your “look” but will still look put together. Pick one or two neutral colors and three accent colors, then buy pieces of all kinds in those colors – solids and prints. Voila! Lots of possible combinations!
My current “uniform” is a black pencil skirt, black opaque tights, black Tory Burch 2″ wedge heels, generally with a print sleeveless top and a cardigan (my favorites are from J. Crew, the “Tippi” cardigan). Add a nice bag and coat. For spring/summer, swap out the tights for a spray tan and swap the wool cardigan for a cotton one. Or just do a dress – it’s cooler and less to think about. Congratulations on your new baby!!
booties
This would be a great time to get some motorcycle boots that could edge up an outfit.
Personally, I’ve been eyeing these:
https://shop.nordstrom.com/s/vionic-logan-bootie-women/4727156?origin=coordinating-4727156-0-2-FTR-recbot-recently_viewed_snowplow_mvp&recs_placement=FTR&recs_strategy=recently_viewed_snowplow_mvp&recs_source=recbot&recs_page_type=category&recs_seed=0
Anon
I don’t know your body shape but I’d say you could do a lot with wrap tops (since you liked wrap dresses) and dark jeans. And maybe a leather jacket or moto style non leather jacket. You could do booties that lean “tough” if you want edge, or pretty feminine shoes if you want to up the va va voom in your figure.
lh
I will be in New York City solo in the beginning of March.
I’d love to go to dinner and a show solo on Friday night! Any recommendations for a dinner location {ideally bar seating} close to the theatre district? Also, any show recommendations for newbies? I’ve already eliminated Wicked and Phantom of the Opera. Maybe Book of Mormon or Waitress?
I am so excited for this trip. Will be in town for a surprise birthday Saturday night so I plan on exploring and shopping during the day Friday and Saturday!
TIA!
Anon
I do what you do all the time when I travel to NYC for business. What I usually do is stand in line at TKTS and decide based on what’s available. I usually go around 5 pm. Then I have dinner and go to the show from there. In terms of specific recommendations I don’t have any, really. I choose a place close by that can seat me, and all the restaurants around there are accustomed to getting you out of there in time for the show, so no worries. Last time I ate at a sushi bar that was decent – i will try to find the name for you and post as a comment.
Anon
I just googled. It was Haru sushi in 43rd. It wasn’t knock your socks off, but I’m used to good sushi (I’m from the Bay Area) and it was fine. Staff was really nice and super serious about show times.
Gail the Goldfish
Why have you eliminated Phantom and Wicked, as that will impact my opinion on recommendations. Personally, I didn’t love Book of Mormon. It was moderately funny, but I didn’t think it lived up to the hype. I thought Avenue Q (which is now on Off-Broadway), for example, was much funnier. Though I should have realized going into it I might feel this way as I’m also not a huge South Park fan. I’m a fan of the Lion King, and the costumes are very interesting. And of course, if you have lots of money or are lucky enough to win the ticket lottery, Hamilton truly is amazing.
K
Mean Girls is super fun too. Chicago is also classic and you should be able to get good seats for cheap at the TKTS booth.
I loved BOM, but I’m a big South Park fan.
It may sound cheesy but Aladdin was really awesome. The sets are elaborate and the magic carpet effect is awe-inspiring.
Also worth trying is the TodayTix app, they have cheap seats available for performances within the next 2 weeks, and you don’t have to stand in line.
Never too many shoes...
Book of Mormon is amazing – have seen it three times in different cities, but it is not for the easily offended.
Shameless feel good Canadian plug, Come From Away.
Anon
I’m 0% offended but I just don’t think it’s HILARIOUS. Like at all. I’m literally bored by it.
Mpls
+1 – the first half of the show (or at least the soundtrack) was funny. And…then the jokes got old. Shrug. Not my tastes, but plenty of people enjoy it.
SC
I agree. My husband and I are big fans of dark, inappropriate humor. We were bored by Book of Mormon and didn’t return after intermission. We did see a touring show, and the performers were not that good. They sang well enough, but their comedic timing seemed off. The show might have been funnier with a better cast.
Anon
Same same. Not offended, but didn’t find it funny at all.
Senior Attorney
Come From Away is fabulous!
Original Moonstone
Come From Away is so great that I literally flew back to NYC to see it again last weekend. I had seen it the first time in 2018. Also, it’s a great show to see by yourself because it’s moving but life-affirming. Full disclosure, though, there is a touring production so it might be coming to your city later in 2019.
Anon
I have no recommendations for this OP, but Gail, I am so, so happy there is another person who is meh on Book of Mormon with me. I didn’t dislike it but don’t find it that funny. My friends see it every time it comes touring to our city and think I’m nuts that once was enough. I detest South Park.
Gail the Goldfish
Yep. It wasn’t that I thought it was bad, I just didn’t find it as awesome or memorable as a lot of people did and probably wouldn’t see it again. And I’m not easily offended (clearly, if I like Avenue Q).
anon
Same. Maybe it was the tour I saw, but I just wasn’t that into it.
Anonymous
Seconding the rec for TodayTix. If you are not wedded to musicals, there are a lot of fantastic plays on Broadway right now. I really want to see The Ferryman (not sure when it closes).
christineispink
I saw the play adaptation of To Kill a Mockingbird and found it fantastic. Trying to go see it again (currently open run). It’s a little heavy though, so maybe not my first recommendation for a “yay fun solo trip!”. But maybe you’re in a contemplative place right now – if so, absolutely recommend!
Anonymous
I heard from friends that Waitress is good, and I loved The Ferryman and Come from Away. True West is supposed to be great, too. Warning that Ferryman is long (3 hours).
ND
Global Entry should partner up with Nexus (Canadian version) to speed up Canadian customs. Not 100% sure of the mechanics because I’m Canadian but I’m surprised no one has mentioned this .
Anonymous
Check out Sen Sakana, esp. if you like sushi and, if not, check out the menu anyway and see. The location is perfect for seeing a show.
Anon
I saw Waitress and Beautiful. Both were great and I got inexpensive tickets on the app TodayTix. For food, I love Esca and Aldo Sohm Wine Bar.
Anon
I see about five Broadway shows a year and Mean Girls surpassed my expectations. Waitress is very good too.
For dining, I’ve liked Tolache and Don Antonio (both are casual). On the other end of the spectrum Le Bernardin has bar seating and it may be a way to dine there without the ridiculous reservation system.
Enjoy! This sounds lovely!
anon
Please tell me about Global Entry. I don’t have it….I just have TSA PreCheck and now will be traveling to and from the Northeast US to Toronto. Does Global Entry expedite any security checks in Toronto or just speed up customs when I arrive in the Northeast (Baltimore)? How slow is customs without Global Entry? I don’t need to renew my PreCheck for another 2 years – should I do it now and get Global Entry or just wait? All input much appreciated……
Anon
I think the global entry website is pretty clear about where it works and where it doesn’t. I wouldn’t want to tell you based on my experience from three years ago. That said, we loved it. We zoomed through security/customs at all of our points in the British Isles and coming home to the US. It was awesome. If you have one trip planned where you can use it, it is totally worth it.
Pompom
Not sure you’ll get the best use of it in that scenario, honestly. It will speed things up slightly. It’s really best for when your first point of entry into the US is not your final destination (ie, flying from LHR to JFK, where you’ll need to go through customs and re-do security, then fly onto, say, Nashville). THAT’S why I pay for it.
Pompom
Also, to be clearest, it only helps you get through US Customs. I am sure you know that. But I see a lot of people wondering why they have to wait in line in, like Cancun, or Oslo, or wherever.
Anon
It totally helped me entering the UK.
BabyAssociate
How?
anon
op here…interesting…OK, thank you
anne-on
Are you generally flying business or first class? If so, I’ve found their ‘expedited passenger’ slips or whatever it is they give you speeds up the process through customs enough to not really bother me too much for every now and again international travel. It also looks like global entry members can use their version of pre-check in Toronto, which would be enough to make me start the process. It took about 2-3 months to get ‘conditionally approved’ and I’m opting to do the interview on the way back into the country as the wait times to get an appointment to be approved are bonkers long.
anon
OP here, thank you – that sounds good….using it for pre-check in Toronto. Did you already have TSA precheck before you applied for GLobal Entry? I also like the idea of doing the interview on way back in….may I ask which airport you are flying back through?
DCR
I’ve never gotten an expedited passenger slip with I fly business or even heard of them. Is that common?
Anon
I have Global Entry, but I don’t think it’s really worth much. Customs has electronic kiosks now and they are much, much faster than when you used to have to wait in the line to see the agent. I’ve done regular a few times traveling with my husband and I’ve never had to wait long. I would expect that you can clear US customs in Toronto before arriving home so when you arrive you can just walk off the plane and go.
anon
OP here…thank you that’s super helpful….I have flown alot domestically, never flown into Canada, always drove….how do the kiosks work and what ID do you need for those? Your US passport? I also just learned that the passport card that I have does not work for air travel, only for land travel and you need your official passport for air travel to Canada.
Anon
You scan your passport, select some options on a touchscreen, it takes your picture, and then you get a receipt that you take to the agent (so you still have to see them, but you don’t do the whole process with them). Unless you have some weird declaration you move along pretty quickly.
anon
ok, that’s easy…no weird declarations here! Thank you!
Anon
Ditto to customs in Toronto being super fast now. You need a passport.
anon
Great to hear that! Thank you – how is Uber in Toronto? Is it an Uber town?
Anon
I don’t live there anymore but it has Uber and Lyft afaik. And the subway of course.
waffles
Yes, we even have uber to the airport now (it’s a pretty recent thing)
anon8
You may want to go to https://travel.state.gov/content/travel.html to make sure your passport card will work for arriving by air in Canada.
As mentioned above, the kiosk process is fairly straightforward and easy. When you fly from Toronto to your US city, you just enter the airport as normal.
anon
You may want to go to https://travel.state.gov/content/travel.html to make sure your passport card will work for arriving by air in Canada.
As mentioned above, the kiosk process is fairly straightforward and easy. When you fly from Toronto to your US city, you just enter the airport as normal.
Anon
You need your passport. They do give you a card, but it all gets linked through your passport and the card is pretty worthless.
So, one thing to note is that if you’re close enough to a Canadian boarder crossing that does interviews, you may want to check into getting NEXUS. It’s only $50 and gives you all the benefits of Pre-Check, Global Entry and expedited Canadian crossing. When I got Global Entry a couple years ago, I ended up not being able to get an interview at my local airport for several months out and was flying sooner. I ended up going on a long weekend up North and driving to the Canadian boarder crossing as a part of that to do my interview, and then kicked myself that I could have saved $50. If you have an AmEx, you may get the $100 reimbursed, though.
I think Global Entry is worth it, most recently when I flew through Atlanta home from Europe, my friend got stuck in the long line and I went through the global entry line in minutes. I was able to chill at the gate for an hour and got dinner for both of us, and she made it through and to the gate just as our connection was starting to board.
Coach Laura
+1 for NEXUS. Cheaper and lasts longer plus it does more for the frequenct US/Canada border crossings.
anon
OP here….good to know about NEXUS – I will look into that….thank you!
Shananana.
I have global entry and was just back and forth to Toronto last month. Into Toronto you get to use the slightly quicker line, but unless you are there during a super heavy arrival time I think it saved me about 5-10 minutes compared to traveling companions. Leaving Toronto, there is a shorter easier security line for global entry similar to prechk. You still need to take liquids and laptops out but can leave on shoes. You go through customs outbound in Toronto if flying direct back to the US, so similar to arrivals, I think it saved me about 10 minutes over colleagues on the outbound to get to use that line (a little more than inbound). I live close enough to the border on another part to have made it worth it to get nexxus for land border crossings, so got global entry as part and parcel with that. I don’t 100% know that I would have otherwise, but it saves a little stress here and there.
BabyAssociate
Global Entry will not help you flying into Toronto as it is for US Customs. However, if you’re flying out of YYZ you’ll do US preclearance there (not in Baltimore) and you can use Global Entry there. In my experience, it makes a huge difference. If you have time before your trip, definitely get Global Entry.
Anonymous
It helps leaving the US and coming back into the US. Some countries also have some sort of partnership with TSA that I don’t fully understand. For example, in Dublin you go through US customs in Dublin before you get on the plane, not in the US when you get off the plane. So you have to go through two sets of security – Dublin’s and then the US’s. Global entry saved me a lot of time on the second set.
Anon
It helped us a ton in Dublin. The non-GE lines were so long.
Anon
Global Entry saved me 90 minutes to 2 hours when I was coming home after 25 hours of international travel. It was the most glorious moment ever to spend 60 seconds in the Global Entry line versus joining the hot, frustrated hordes in the main line. I find it to be well worth it for a very reasonable price (you get it for five years, almost six if you get it directly after your birthday) for less than many here spend on one pair of shoes. Do it!
NY CPA
I know my response is pretty late, but in case you’re still checking this:
What you want is called Nexus. It expedites customs and immigration on both sides of the US/Canada border. It’s applicable both at airports, and when you drive across the border (it can literally save hours if the driving backup is really long, e.g. during a holiday weekend).
If you’re only planning to fly to Canada, definitely not worth it, because you have to go to an in-person interview at a border crossing or at some airports. But if you plan to travel frequently, it’s really worth it.
BTW, Global Entry is also included with Nexus, so if you travel to Europe for example, you’ll save the time coming back. But Nexus allows you to save time on both sides of the border if you’re traveling to Canada.
Don’t take nuts
Not a direct answer, but don’t take any nuts with you (or granola bars with nuts, which was my problem) or you’ll have to declare them on your way in and then it takes more time.
Eyeshadow
I have fair/cool skin, green eyes, and dark blonde hair. I’m looking for either an eyeshadow palette that would have neutral colors I could use for daytime as well as some options for a nighttime look or for a few single colors that would fir the same criteria. Any suggestions?
Casper
Urban decay naked 2 palette
Anonymous
I have similar coloring, although hair has some red. My go-to for day and evening is Chanel Les 4 Ombres in TISSÉ VÉNITIEN.
Anonymous
I love the Dior 5-color eyeshadow palette in Touch Matte for daytime. Neutral, subtle, not too plain.
waffles
I have red hair, fair skin, and green eyes. I tried the Maybelline colour tattoo in “bad to the bronze” on the recommendations of this s*te and I absolutely love it.
CostAccountant
Plus one. My coloring is the same as the OP and Bad to the Bronze looks great on me.
Anon
Same! I love that Maybelline eyeshadow. I am also pale with green eyes, but dark hair.
Sunshine
Yes – fair/cool, blue, brown here. The Maybelline Color Tattoo bronze is great. I also use the Creamy Beige. My preference is a cream eye shadow and these deliver color plus staying power. The Chocolate Suede makes a great outer-corner color to do a smoky eye.
Anon 2.0
Any recommendations for birthstone jewelry? I’d really like a ring or necklace with my family’s birthstones but want something high quality/classic and most of them online seem cheesy or not good quality.
Anonymous
This seems like a great thing to get custom made by a local jeweler or your favorite Etsy seller. I’d recommend looking for mixed stone designs to give your jeweler an idea of your style and what you’re looking for. I love pretty much everything from Bario Neal.
Mpls
Check Gemvara? I’ve gotten some of the Gemma Gray items with birthstones (March) and have been happy with them. If you sign up for the mailing list, there’s usually a 10-15% sale every couple of months.
Anonymous
I would search for rings with whatever your birthstone is… although I am sure some stones are more popular than others.
One consideration for a ring, however, is how hard the stone is if it is a ring you want for daily wear. For example, if your birthstone was pearl, you’d probably want to consider a necklace or earrings.
pearls
I recently inherited a pearl necklace that’s been hanging out in a safe deposit box since 1975 or so. It’s very yellowed. I know that cleaning pearls is best done with a mild soap and water and a soft cloth. This necklace isn’t really responding to that. Can my jeweler help with this? Should I keep trying? Am I in permanent possession of a yellowed pearl necklace?
Anon
I would take it to the jeweler
Vicky Austin
Let your jeweler have a try!
Anon
It may just be yellowed permanently. I’d create a profile on pearl-guide dot com and ask the very knowledgeable people in the forums what they think. They know all. Try to take a pic in natural light on a white background. A white paper towel is optimal.
Anon
Ps sorry to say, your typical healer knows little to nothing about pearls. And this is coming from someone who adores her neighborhood jeweler. I just go to a pearl-only specialist for pearl jewelry.
Anon
*healer = jeweler
boldgold
Some pearls are naturally yellow, so the color may be intrinsic to the pearls. (Pearl colors go in and out of style.) I’d head to a jeweler anyway. If they’ve been sitting around that long you may want them restrung before wearing them out in the wild.
Anonymous
Resources on improving conversation with and for someone with ADHD? BF was diagnosed as a child but was never really treated. He has some definite conversational quirks that range from annoying to downright hurtful depending on the topic. He frequently interrupts, derails the conversation to talk about something adjacent at best, and then fixates on the barely-related thing he’s talking about. When I ask him to stop because he’s being hurtful, he panics and gets defensive, then doubles down on why his unrelated topic is actually relevant to what I’m saying (… so he continues to derail/interrupt rather than respecting my request to let me finish talking). Sometimes this happens over text and I will say, “I am going to stop responding now because I am frustrated and I need to cool down. Please reread our texts tomorrow so you can see what you’re doing and why I’m upset. I will talk to you tomorrow.” He always says he gets it, but then he does it again. Is there anything I can do here? I’ve encouraged him to seek counseling for this but he doesn’t seem interested.
Anonymous
Yes omg yes there’s something you can do you break up with a guy who is repeatedly mean and rude and not interested in seeking help for that.
Anonymous
This.
anon8
I’m sorry. That sounds rough. Honestly though if he is not interested in getting counseling, I would consider whether it is worth it being in the relationship.
anon
I’m sorry to hear this – you seem to be a very patient person. I would not be able to tolerate this for very long. Respectful communication is critical to a good relationship….good luck.
ADHD
The thing with ADHD is if you don’t talk about the new topic now, you will forget. So, what I do with my husband (I’m the one with ADHD) which I’m sure is still annoying, but less annoying then a total derail, is I either write down what I want to say or if I don’t have paper near me, I interrupt to tell him the topic and let him continue.
Ex: Husband talking about his day at work. Me: Sorry, that just reminded me I had my review last week and forgot to tell you about it. Please remind me when you are done talking. So, what did Susie do next?”
Maybe this would work for him?
mascot
Having heated conversations over text rarely ends well in my experience. You can’t read tone, it’s hard to respond in an organized fashion or have any real back and forth. Even with my friends, it leads off to tangents and then someone inevitably misses a question/remark. When you talk to him in person, can you gently stop him when he interrupts and ask him to let you finish? Touching him or making eye contact might help too if such a thing brings him back into the present conversation. Some of the articles on ADDitude might have tricks and exercises that you/he can work on.
OP
Just to clarify, our conversations are normally in person. No, he does not stop interrupting when I ask him to stop. He does not stop when I touch him, or hold up a hand, or get up and leave the room (he follows me and continues to talk).
Oddly enough, I’ve actually found the text conversations helpful in pointing out what he’s doing, at least for the derailing part. But otherwise I totally agree that arguing over text is a no go. When he derails over text I ask him to stop once, and when he doesn’t, I end the conversation and ask to talk tomorrow after he’s reread our messages.
Anonymous
Why are you dating him? Break up. Explore why any part of you tolerated this at all.
Anon
So I’m married to someone with ADHD. I will start by saying in my experience, this won’t entirely go away and is incredibly frustrating, so I feel you. If you want to be in this relationship, you will need to reshape your expectations a bit and develop your own coping strategies. That being said, some things that have worked for me: (1) call him out calmly but firmly – ie “you are fixating on a point that is not the point I am trying to discuss and you know it”. Refuse to engage on side-issue and redirect to main issue. (2) Give him time to process. It sounds like you already do this to some extent, and it sucks, but if I leave the room and give him time to think it over, he almost always backs down and apologizes. I think part of ADHD is getting complete sensory overload emotionally charged situations, which causes this defensive panic you identified. My DH does medication and therapy, and it has made him more aware of the fact that he does this and it’s not the norm, but it has never entirely gone away. He is otherwise a great guy and I won’t leave him over this, but going to lie, it makes my life a lot harder sometimes. I feel like we have the most random and unproductive arguments.
Anon
Outside any other description of this guy, I wonder why you are with him. ADD/ADHD is no excuse for rudeness. My daughter has ADD and if I say “honey, focus” she will focus, apologize, and listen harder to what I’m saying. Getting defensive and digging in is not a sign of ADD. It’s a sign of putting himself before you.
Anon
No, I think you either have to like him as-is or break up.
anon
I’m a parent of a child with ADHD, and yes, these are common quirks/problems. But here’s the deal — you can’t fix this. It will be an uphill battle in this relationship if your BF refuses treatment (whether through medication, therapy, or ideally both).
Honestly, it burns my biscuits that people think it’s OK to refuse to treat a child’s ADHD and just hope that he or she outgrows it. That’s not how it works; it’s a lifelong neurological condition that manifests itself in certain behaviors. Plenty of people go on to have healthy relationships, but when the negative behavioral patterns are allowed to continue without treatment, boys with ADHD can become adults who are very unpleasant to be around.
Much as it pains me to say, I would not stay with this guy if he refuses to acknowledge the obvious.
Anonymous
He probably can’t help the initial interruption, but he shouldn’t be defending something that bothers you.
I’m not sure everyone in this thread knows that many ADHD people interrupt one another back and forth and don’t experience it as rude or hurtful; it’s just normal, and waiting for someone to finish talking can feel awkward in comparison. People who don’t have ADHD have social deficits in ADHD-majority contexts, so I think what’s rude/polite is relative here.
I bring this up partly because, though he definitely shouldn’t be defending himself, I’m not sure why he’s defending the topics he brings up as “relevant” when the issue is that you’re hurt. The topics he brings up are probably relevant in his mind; his mind works differently and draws more connections between things. I don’t think there’s any point to appealing to objective relevance or irrelevance. It’s natural that he’ll feel defensive if it’s “me and objective standards of relevance and approved conversational patterns vs. your defective mind”, and he’s probably very sensitive to that common way of thinking. If he’s not a jerk, can you try asking for what you need on a subjective basis? If he’s really saying “you shouldn’t be hurt, and here’s why,” that’s not cool, but it sounds more like “if you’re only hurt because you think the topic isn’t relevant, you’ll stop being hurt when I show that it really is relevant, which I can easily do [blah blah everything is relevant in hyperconnected ADHD thinking].”
OP
I totally relate to this. I’ve started doing what you describe in your last paragraph – I tell him, I understand why you think this topic is relevant. That’s not the point. The point is you are changing the subject when I’m trying to talk to you about Super Hard Thing (like say my mom’s recent health scare) and you are digging in when I ask you to stop. I do not care about that article you read 15 years ago that has long-outdated information about something sort of but not really related to my mom’s health issue. I understand why you would have thought of it during this conversation. But it is hurtful that you are interrupting me and insisting on talking about it – after you’ve been asked to stop repeatedly – when I’m talking about how scared I am for my mom.
Anonymous
Break up. Immediately.
Anonymous
Okay. I chimed in re. ADHD thinking because the community on this site (which is so helpful as regards fashion and wedding etiquette and so many other things) can tend towards “normal is good; normal is obligatory; what kind of barbarian doesn’t wear pants at home,” and so on, and I wanted to speak from the ADHD household perspective.
I can ask myself if the panic spiral is itself an emotional dysregulation issue, and I can additionally wonder if he has some theory of mind differences or autistic traits (I’m not sure whether he needs to process his thoughts aloud, but it definitely sounds like he’s using the common autistic “I can empathize by sharing my story about that topic!!” conversational tactic).
But I’m still not understanding the resistance when it sounds like you are being super communicative and explicit about what in the conversation isn’t working for you. It sounds like you’re doing all the right things, so I guess I don’t know what’s his deal. Maybe he’s in denial about some of this? Maybe he has boundary issues and doesn’t respect women? Maybe he’s beating himself up about the habit and thereby counter productively ensuring he does it again? Maybe he’s desperate to be understood and doesn’t know how else to connect with people? Maybe his executive function is taking a hike when this happens and he has no perspective until later?
I don’t really know. I like the idea the married commenter suggested of leaving the room though. Aside from breaking the cycle and giving him a chance to process, it’s a clear way to convey that you’re just not going to let this happen anymore (even if he never stops doing it, you never have to stay around for it again!). I’m assuming he listens more successfully later and that this is a “some of the time” problem.
Anonymous
Or, he’s a rude jerk.
Career Advice Needed
I am a very junior (2nd year) BigLaw associate, and I dread coming to work every day. I made the switch back into BigLaw (from a litigation boutique) in July because I felt I should just bite the bullet and deal with the hours so that I could pay off my law school debt more quickly and it seemed like the culture of this BigLaw firm would be more in line with my values, but it is not, and the hours are affecting my mental and physical health so negatively that I regret the move. Since joining the new firm, I have had a major depressive episode and have been prescribed anti-depressants to ‘help me get through’, however I haven’t taken them because I don’t want to be medicated for something that is clearly circumstantial (I never had any of the anxiety and depression that I have now before I became a lawyer). I recently had my performance review, and it was extremely (and in my opinion, unfairly) negative – it seems only my mistakes have registered with the partners here, despite the fact that I have been literally sacrificing my health to work the long hours required of me in this high stress environment. I feel very defeated due to this review coming after months of billing insane hours and thinking I was doing well here. I also feel stuck, because I have only been here a short time, which would be reflected on my resume if I were to leave, and I also obviously wouldn’t get a good reference from this very reputable firm, but I think perhaps an in-house position would be less in conflict with my values and thus less harmful to my health (and I might actually be able to excel there). Any thoughts/advice extremely welcome!!
Anonymous
Start looking – to the extent you can find the time and energy to do so. Reality of biglaw is that once there is a bad review at the junior associate level, they WILL get rid of you. May not be right now, but my firm there were major cuts in the 3rd and 4th year as they pretty much decided who they wanted for the long(er) haul into midlevel/senior years and who they didn’t. And yes that’s how reviews are — unfair — because the nature of the profession is to ONLY find your mistakes and shortcomings and never your good things or your effort. Some firms are worse about this than others but often it is just to “build the case” that you can’t hack it (not my opinion but firm opinion) so they can push you out as a third year. Any chance you could go back to the boutique — any strong relationships there where you could call them and frame it as, I made a mistake? I know in house is what you want, but it’s what every lawyer wants and generally speaking it takes FOREVER. You don’t have forever – because of your own health and because of the fact that this firm may be trying to push you out.
anon
OK, what is going on that is not in line with your values? What is causing the stress and depression? Are you having to do something that you find compromising or unfair? Or is it just purely long hours and you disagree with their work ethic/workaholic nature? What is the nature of the mistakes? As a very junior professional, I too made mistakes that were called to my attention…painful at the time, but this helped me improve. Is it just feedback or do you feel that your job is at risk?
Career Advice Needed
It’s the hours, constant stress, and expectations that I feel I will never be able to reach because I will never put my job before all else. I value my health (both mental and physical), which means I need time for physical activity, healthy eating, as well as activities that feed my soul such as reading and spending time outdoors. I also value my family, and am tired of constantly having to compromise the time I set aside to spend with my family because I got an email that requires me to do urgent work. I think the source of the anxiety is the high-stress constant urgency tone, as well as the fact that every single thing I turn in/do seems to be wrong, while the source of the depression is the fact that I can no longer do the things that I need to be happy because all of my time is spent working and the little time that isn’t, I’m exhausted from working. Just really feeling as though I am not cut out to be a lawyer, despite having a very impressive resume and landing this job in the first place. I don’t think my job is at risk, but I think that it will be if I can’t somehow improve my performance.
anon
I am a biglaw refuge. Unfortunately, this is many biglaw firms. Prioritizing the client, the culture, the work over family, rest, and health is just part and parcel of it. Unless those are your values too, then yes, it sounds like there will always be an incompatibility. That’s okay!! It doesn’t sound like it’s for you, but it doesn’t have to be. It’s not for everyone– only a small percentage of people can get through it (however that’s defined) and an even smaller number of people can truly succeed or thrive in it. The question is how you face the reality of your time there. Decide what you want to get out of it, and pursue that goal. Want to pay down your loans? Then focus on just making it for 3-4 years and living frugally. Want to get training in a specific area to create in house opportunities? Then aim to get to know a partner who does that and form a relationship with him or her, get work in that area, do CLEs in that area, network in that area. And don’t worry that Tax Partner down the hall doesn’t think you’re the bees knees. Who cares? You don’t want to be a tax partner. If you know you want to leave, then don’t stress as much about whether Important Client wants you staffed in its deals or that Important Partner wants to be your sponsor. Partnership’s not your goal, so who cares? Focus on developing good relationships with your core partners who can keep you busy and help you learn skills for x years before you escape. Want to just leave ASAP? Then start looking and focus on only on billing your hours and keeping your work solid so you’re not asked to leave. Devote your mental resources to the goals that matter to you and let the others slide (within reason of course).
And, there’s no reason not to take meds for this if you need their help. Your dopamine/serotonin levels don’t care that it’s situational. It’s real. Meds are tools to help you take actions to improve your situation.
Please don’t think you’re not cut out to be a lawyer. This environment can truly bring out the worst in its attorneys and make even the best feel like failures. Good luck to you.
Anonymous
Biglaw pays big money to buy all your time. If you aren’t interested in selling all your time, look to get out. But meanwhile take your meds!
Career Advice Needed
Oh and the nature of the mistakes is attention to detail stuff and they say that I need to take more ownership of my work and express more commitment, but to me, I have already been doing that to the best of my ability!
anon
OK, for the mistakes and attention to detail – this is common in one’s “junior years” and takes practice and focus to overcome. I am in big tech, which I think is similar to big law in that we work long hours, it can be demanding, there is a heightened sense of urgency at all times and on top of that, our industry changes every 6 months! But, we are rewarded significantly for bearing these challenges….yes, high risk=high reward. Sounds like you need to evaluate whether the short term sacrifices are worth the longer term rewards (higher compensation).
A colleague who is a very solid manager once said to me “anyone can do anything for 6 months” …so if you are committed to big law, can you look at the next 3-6 months and work on improving your attention to detail and demonstrating more ownership for your work? Ask for another review to get feedback at that time (shows you are proactive and that you care) . Then see how you feel about the job then….and by the way, there is another way to look at getting an Urgent email – it means that you are in demand and have a responsibility to your employer, customer, or stakeholder. That’s a good thing, not a bad thing…
Anon
Keep in mind that missing attention to detail can definitely be a symptom of depression. When I was suffering from the same thing, I’d miss details not only at work but at home (forgetting small items, lapses in memory, not being able to plan things because my brain was cloudy). The medication will help. And please don’t doubt your ability to be a good lawyer. There are soooo many people feeling the same way with respect to hours and stress. It’s not that you won’t be a good lawyer, but that this lifestyle may not be for you. There is a reason there is a significant drop off of people going in different career directions around years three and four. There are so many ways to practice law – rest assured that you will find the style that is right for you. I suggest 1) taking your medication which will get your brain back to functioning without the depressive symptoms getting in your way and 2) start talking to alums and your network about different areas of law, types of law, and different firms. There are slower areas of practice, scheduled areas of practice (so not so go go as deal dependent practices), there are firms with lower hours requirements, firms with smaller less demanding clients (ex. start-up and mid-size company clients), there is in-house and government. You have several decades to figure out your path. Right now you just need to get back to operational level of mental health.
anon
good point….and the missing attention to detail can also be attributed to information overload….I recall this happening to me many years ago in the first 90 days of a new job, when you are “drinking from a fire hose”…..cut yourself a break….you are just starting out and you are only human
Anonymous
Dust off the resume and start looking ASAP. I wouldn’t worry about not getting a good reference; it’s pretty normal to ask your prospective new employer to not contact your current employer. Can you go back to the boutique firm you just left? I think your reasons for leaving and coming back are good – you left because you wanted to make a dent in the student loans but the hours aren’t worth it and you miss your old firm/life.
Anon
+1 especially based on the additional information you posted. Biglaw is always going to request a lot of sacrifice of your time. As a senior associate in biglaw, I suspect the negative reviews were mostly based on actual or perceived resistance to working nights/weekends – it’s what the people you work for expect you to do without complaint. At the junior levels, I’d say like 90% of review is based on attitude/availability. It sounds like this just isn’t a great fit. I’d see if you can return to your old firm. Having one short job stay on your resume isn’t really that big of a deal so long as it’s just one and you can explain it (it just wasn’t a good fit, I missed the old firm/work). Oh and take your meds in the interim to help you get through this season. Hugs.
Anonymous
Omg take your meds!!! What are you thinking?!?
Anon
+1 million You need to be able to function while you extract yourself from this situation.
Coach Laura
Ditto
Anon
I agree in general about not medicating a lifestyle issue; however, the medication can be what helps you to get out of your own way enough to fix the underlying problems.
mascot
Depression lies. Try the medication and re-evaluate. They don’t have to be forever, but right now, you need to get back to baseline where you can clearly see what is or isn’t working. A couple of sessions of therapy to talk through your options will help too, but for right now, I think you need to address this with multiple resources. I had PPD/PPA after my child was born (working in biglaw) so I’ve dealt with “circumstantial” mental health issues. 6 months of anti-depressants made things so much better. It was as if I had been trapped under water just below the surface. Meds helped me get back to the surface and find all of my coping skills again.
Leatty
My advice (as someone whose anxiety really only manifested itself in law school) is to take the medicine. You don’t have to be on it forever, but it sounds like your doctor believes it would help you. If you had any other medical condition in the short term, I imagine you might be more open to taking medication to help. Don’t treat your mental health any differently.
Also, it’s normal to make mistakes, especially as a junior attorney. Be kind to yourself, and focus on learning from your mistakes.
Been there
Assuming you’re at the typical age of a big law second year (mid to late 20s) I wouldn’t assume you have anxiety and depression from a lifestyle issue. Depression and anxiety can emerge at any point in life but late teens to late 20s is an especially vulnerable age for them to present themselves. I thought the same and didn’t medicate, switched jobs to something much more bearable, and the mental health issues stayed. And even if it is a lifestyle issue, you should take the medication to help you get through until you can get into a better situation. You clearly are not functioning well right now and generally you need counseling and medication if you are not functioning well (i.e. depression and anxiety are affecting your ability to do everyday tasks like working). Life is hard and there is no pride in bear knuckling your way through it, especially for temporary but tough situations. Take the medication, see how you feel once its had time to kick in and see if you can stick with it for a while (life gets a little easier at firms with time as well). Only then should you make drastic moves like leaving a second job within two years.
People not in big law will blast this, but those in big law understand that yes, of course your mental health comes first, but you need to try to manage our mental health as best you can in big law first to get the training to get you to that in-house job after a few years. If you can’t manage your mental health, then is when you leave, but don’t leave before really trying (like taking the medication that will help you and you can wean off of later) because law is an unforgiving profession. Of course you will be able to continue working as an attorney in some capacity, but your ability to pay off your loans quickly and move into a stable well paying in-house position is strongly affected by your training. I highly advise you to get into counseling and take the medication – your reputation at the firm as a junior attorney is not kaput because of one negative review and you can come back from this, especially once your performance is not being negatively affected by depression and anxiety.
ER
Your current firm does not sound like a good fit for you. You need the medicine to help you improve your performance at this firm and to kick-start your job search process. When you look back at this stage of your life a few decades from now, I hope you see this as a small blip in your career trajectory and mental health!
Anon
I guess I’m in in the minority, but I wouldn’t take medicine just so I could function at an awful job that was making me depressed. I was depressed for about a year when I worked at a very toxic small law firm. I’ve always had a bit of an anxious personality, as I think many Type A people do, but it was manageable and not something I felt ever interfered with my work performance or general health and happiness. This firm was so awful (long story, but it was a lot more than just long hours) that it made me depressed. I didn’t recognize it at the time or I might have taken meds, but in hindsight it was clearly situational depression. It affected everything from my job performance to my relationship to my friendships. I got out and life has been SO MUCH BETTER. I don’t believe I needed medicine – I needed to get away from that work situation and it sounds like you do too.
Anonymous
I would see a functional MD to come up with a supplement plan (on the logic that stress burns through vitamins, and most of us don’t eat or digest well when we’re stressed, but it’s better not to just down Emergen-C without any supervision or testing).
But my perspective was shaped when they had me try an SSRI when I needed vitamin D, magnesium, B12, and a thyroid dose adjustment. No fun to have to go through discontinuation syndrome without ever benefiting from the meds. One thing they did do was stop me from feeling any emotions or caring about my own life or time, so I guess if you want just to be numb and emotionally checked out while you survive this job, they would have worked beautifully for that purpose for me.
Anon
100 percent- I work in high stress high pressure and accountability role – I take Vitamin D3, Magnesium, Vitamin C and I workout at least 5 times per week very actively…I rarely drink and prioritize sleep….without these things my mental and physical health would suffer. I would avoid the meds and go natural
The original Scarlett
The best advice I got as a junior lawyer in big law was to look at it as the legal equivalent of a medical residency. The time is going to be grueling, long hours and little praise, but you are getting the training and stamp on your resume to go in-house and get the job you’d rather have once it’s done. Once I put it in perspective like that, it got a lot easier to deal with. And I second take your meds, the environment can trigger depression and why operate with one arm tied behind your back. Good luck.
Anonymous
No advice, because I’m only about a year ahead of you (February bar passer, so 2.6 years licensed) or less and in the same place. I traded a small soul sucking boutique law firm job for a medium and possibly more soul sucking insurance job. I got a very positive review in my first 3 months but I’ve started looking around since I’m expecting a terrible ass review this time around. Made two procedural mistakes that I doubt any law firm would actually tolerate and am not a star biller, despite scrounging around the entire office for hours from everywhere. They are nice enough here that I could tolerate working here through a prolonged job search (whereas the last place had the partners literally yelling about us being useless), but it’s not for me.
If possible though, consider taking your meds or supplement equivalent and sticking it out at the Biglaw place to the extent possible. Prestige is everything in law and in-house places look highly upon big law training.
Anonymous
Disney tips? Specifically favorite drinks at Epcot?
Dealtwiththis
Avacado margarita or Jalapeno margarita at La Cava in the Mexico Pavillion. This is the tequila bar located inside, not the sugary margaritas at the stations outside!
Venture to the Polynesian to get drinks at Trader Sam’s. Different things happen in the room based on what drink you order. It seems hokey but it is so much fun!
Dealtwiththis
Also, please ignore my misspelling of avocado!
SC
+1. La Cava and Trader Sam’s are the best bars at Disney. It’s probably not a coincidence that neither is operated by Disney.
I like the orange slush (grand marnier, grey goose, sugar) at the French Pavilion, especially if it’s hot outside. Of course, this depends on your tolerance for sweet drinks.
There’s a sake bar in the big “department store” in the Japanese pavilion and a wine bar in the Italian pavilion. The store in the German pavilion sells samples of wine, but I’ve never found them to be that good.
Rebecca
For the world section: grand marnier slush in france, beer flight in Germany, tangier’s breeze in morocco, margarita in mexico. If you are just doing the world section, many people don’t know you can take a boat straight there from the boardwalk. The my Disney experience app is your friend. You can get fast passes, see show-times, etc.
anon30
I am turning 30 next month and have some friends flying to my city to celebrate. Looking for a fun going-out outfit to wear (dressy casual, but not too dressy)– has anyone seen a dress (or pants and a top– it may be cold!) that they love recently? Looking for fantastic heels, too. Suggestions welcome. Prefer less than $200 for the outfit (not a hard ceiling).
Anonymous
Check out Reformation. Not too expensive, but on-trend and decent quality. Plus they have some super cute, flirty tops and dresses that are perfect for a bday night out.
christineispink
Depending on your weather, for my 30th I wore a red jumpsuit from Rent the Runway. It was so impractical for day-to-day wear but it was fun and affordable for a special bday.
Anonymous
I know there have been threads about leaving Catholicism to try different local churches — but has anyone done any self study or following anyone on social media or other writings (books, whatever) that you’ve found good? I’d like to teach my child a) miracles/faith/belief in God, b) morality (including accepting all people no matter their faith/sexual orientation, staying out of other people’s bodily decisions, respecting your elders, etc) and c) Bible as literature/historical arguing point – wars were started because of X passage, Shakespeare refers to Y passage, etc.
Do I need a local church or can I do it on my own? Thoughts?
Anonymous
For miracles and faith, I think church makes sense. Because if you believe in a Christian god who does miracles and the Bible, there is just an inherent tension with simply never going to church. I’d skip all the attempts to do it on your own and just start going to an Episcopalian church!
Momofboys
+1000
Fringe
I agree with Anon 5:57 that there is an inherent tension in believing in a Christian God, but not going to church. But I would urge you to consider why you want your child to believe in a religion which, in my interpretations of scripture, strongly recommends (to the point of near-requirement) that a person should go to church, if you yourself aren’t fully sold on the idea of church. Is that a belief you actually believe or is it something you see as being a nice thing for your child to have in their life? Because in an ideal world, that would be lovely to have a child that holds similar values as you, but if you’re not fully on-board with what a church is teaching then you’re likely to create some rifts between you and your child if they, being raised in that environment, completely buy in to all of it. Even if you go out of your way to find a church that teaches love/acceptance, so many claim to, but then don’t. Still, it only takes one misguided sunday school teacher at a church that does actually teach love/acceptance to negatively influence a child, and the church may not even be aware of it.
Honestly, it sounds like you want the moral/social benefits of religion, but are wary of the potential downsides, and if a person isn’t ready to buy in hook, line, and sinker for *all* of a church’s beliefs, they’re usually quick to be ostracized. As a kid that grew up in multiple churches as a result of this, had really bad experiences at churches, and was really confused by hearing pastors and sunday school teachers conflict with what I was taught at home, I wouldn’t recommend that for any kid, in my opinion.
Anonymous
I guess that’s the question – I believe in God/a higher power than myself and am thankful to my Catholic upbringing for that framing of the issue. (My husband was not raised with religion and sees only science and doubts a higher power; I believe the two are connected (the science is the expression of the higher power, maybe).
Jesus I’m not sure about. But I don’t think I’m Buddhist or Jewish or other religions like that… but I’m just not sure.
Going to church isn’t important to me at all. Hence the “self study” question.
Anonymous
Does anyone have any experience with switching firms in Biglaw during the first trimester? I am a midlevel transactional associate, and my husband and I would like to relocate from our current area in the PNW to the South to be closer to family. Has anyone been able to negotiate maternity leave before the 1 year mark at the offer stage? Have you had any issues building your reputation in the new firm if you went on maternity leave so early within joining the firm? I’m wondering if we just wait to move until our LO is 1…
Anonymous
I think you wait to leave until you’re on maternity leave and then look.
tesyaa
I need a reality check… five years ago I lost 7 pounds, and it’s back. I don’t think I have the mental fortitude to do it again. I’m turning 53 this year, and because I wear dresses and skirts (no pants), my clothes basically all fit. I do try to eat healthily, but due to stress I don’t really enjoy depriving myself of snacks here and there.
I am not underweight or overweight, but I am short, and I have an image of myself as petite and skinny, but I don’t think I’m actually skinny anymore.
Is it giving up to say I’m not going to stress about it? Is it the slippery slope to old age and not caring? I’m not quite ready to not care at all.
Anon
If you’re not unhealthy more power to you.
Anon Lawyer
It’s seven lbs; relax and stop trying to micromanage every aspect of your life.
Anon
I feel you! Menopause oh menopause :/
How about this, if it’s weighing on you~no pun intended~ perhaps give up any white foods(rice,pasta, bread, sugar) a few days a week and live the rest of the time. You may not lose anything yet will be overlaying new habits. It’s working for me insofar as no further lbs have found their way to my thighs.
Anonymous
Nope. It’s called being normal.
slim is fine, too
It sounds like you’re feeling great and enjoying your life and body at the size you are now, with no current worries. So what it boils down to, might be how you feel about the next seven pounds? With no particular changes, there’s a reasonable expectation that in five years time, there might be seven more pounds. If you find that idea very stressful in terms of your self image, or you think that might tip you into unhealthy territory in terms of visceral fat, e.g., you can try to make small adjustments that stall the trend, instead of fighting to reverse it?
Like you I used to be skinny, now I’m slim. I can tell by photos that slim looks better on me, but I don’t feel as good in the “upper” ranges of slim, so when my bras cups run a bit too full, I have a think and readjust. Usually I’ve been low on sleep and high on convenience treats to keep me going for a while, so adjusting feels more like self-care and self-treating than stress.