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Wednesday’s Workwear Report: Crinkle Chiffon Smocked Top

A woman wearing a yellow-print blouse, blue jeans, and a black belt

Our daily workwear reports suggest one piece of work-appropriate attire in a range of prices.

J.Crew has been absolutely knocking it out of the park with their prints lately, and this gorgeous chiffon top is one of the best so far. The light blue / goldenrod yellow combination is really something special.

I would wear this with a navy suit on a day when I wanted to feel like the best, most professional version of myself, or tucked into a pair of dark jeans for a fun weekend out. 

The top is $138 at J.Crew and comes in sizes XXS-3X. It also comes in two sale colors: navy polka dot and solid black. 

Sales of note for 12.5

345 Comments

  1. I need some CLE hours. Are there any good wills and estate related ones where the speakers were just excellent? Bonus if they feature a panel with a family therapist or psychologist to discuss the dynamics of how boilerplate (to spouse or kids) often doesn’t mesh with oral statements of wishes or when parents help one kid a lot during their lifetime, often without a spouse knowing. I have a PLI membership but would pay for something really good if there are good speakers out there.

    1. I cannot speak to any of the estate planning courses specifically, but I have found that Massachusetts CLE courses are all excellent. Ironically, because there is no mandatory CLE for MA-barred attorneys, the courses need to be high quality to attract attorneys.

      1. +1. I haven’t run across any CLEs similar to what you describe, but maybe one that focuses on the ethics of T&E representation? Usually pitfalls to watch out for when you have issues like older clients with questionable competency, etc., but they might have one with that kind of emotional/therapeutic component.

  2. Hosting a dinner Friday night for seven friends from college, all from out of town. Normally, I’d be brimming with ideas, but at pretty wiped after an intense two weeks. Menu ideas? No ideas of allergies or preferences, so I need variety. I’ll have one other person to help me cook, but don’t want to be in the kitchen for hours. It’s cooled off where I am, so summer menus don’t feel perfect, but also not ready for butternut squash or soup recipes. Help!

    1. Do you have a grill? If the weather is nice enough for that, I’d marinate some hangar steak and chicken and grill and slice so people can take a bit of each. Serve with a great fall salad, crusty bread, and grilled veggies.

    2. I love parchment fish for entertaining, easy to assemble and fun to crack open.

    3. This calls for a giant salad and some kind of savory pie/ tart, whatever your choice (tortilla espanola, mushroom tart, etc.)

    4. What about making a big salad and dessert and ordering pizza? There are a couple of fancy pizza places in my town that are a step up from the usual chain restaurants.

    5. Lasagna, arugula salad and lots of red wine.
      For the lasagna, I would do the Ina Garten roasted vegetable lasagna recipe; her portobello mushroom one in white sauce is also great.

    6. For groups like that, I like to have a few things that work as a main to cover a range of allergies and preferences. So a simple meat like steak or chicken thighs (grilled if you have one), pasta with pesto, and a substantial salad. Maybe corn on the cob if I’m feeling extra. With this, you have vegetarian, keto, and gluten-free covered. If anyone is vegan, they may struggle, but I hope if anyone were vegan they would have said so when accepting the invitation. Also, it’s pretty minimal prep, and you can buy apps and dessert.

    7. I just made figs and goat cheese wrapped in prosciutto. It was delicious and would make a great appetizer. I would just go with something easy like a taco bar or chili and chips with sour cream, jalapeños, cheese, etc. For something more involved, I love homemade pasta, mini chicken pot pies, or rack of lamb.

    8. Last time I had that many people over I made two big spinach and ricotta lasagnas. A big salad on the side and crusty bread from a local bakery. There were nuts and olives and cheese and crackers and fruit out when everyone arrived. For dessert there was birthday cake and ice cream, because that’s why we got together.

    9. What was the regional dish from where you went to college? Doughboys? Cold Cheese Pizza? Taylor Ham? Is there any way you can center the meal around that?

    10. I would make a nice cheese plate and a salad and figure out somewhere to buy the rest. if you’re worn out and want to enjoy your friends instead of cooking, buy the meal.

  3. (Probably overthinking) etiquette question: I met my boyfriend’s parents for the first time this past weekend, when we stayed at their house in Vermont. His parents cooked two meals for us and insisted on paying for the meals we ate out together, and were generally totally gracious hosts. I want to send them a thank you card that basically says it was lovely to meet you, thank you for hosting me, I had a great time and felt very warmly welcomed.

    That’s nice and not weird, right? I was married to my high school sweetheart until last year, so the last time I met a bf’s parents I was 16, haha. Also I’m from a working class family and he is from the type where his parents’ wedding was in the NYTimes and both of them have wikipedia pages. I’d ask my boyfriend but he would say “no, of course you don’t need to!”

    3. Yes, send a nice note. It doesn’t need to be a letter but that is the polite thing to do and it only takes a few minutes.

    4. Not weird at all! A lovely idea, in my view. Maybe confirm it with your partner, but if he doesn’t think they will find it odd, I’d go to for it!

      1. Honestly, even if they find it overly formal, a thank you note does nothing but reflect well on you. Do it.

    5. I don’t know, if my potential DIL thought she had to write a paper thank you note to me, I’d feel like I’d failed at making her feel welcome. If you’re just casually dating, then maybe this is appropriate, but if you’re thinking of becoming family, this seems overly formal. Ask your boyfriend about her preferences on this kind of thing.

      1. No, this is way over overthinking it. Just write a quick nice note and be done with it. It will not stand out negatively in any way.

      3. This is a weird take and I’m not a person who writes or expects handwritten thank you notes.

      4. I mean, she says her boyfriend would tell her not to send it. Is that because he’s clueless or because he knows his parents like to appear informal and make everyone part of the family? In the first case, I’d send the note (though I think effusive in person thanks when leaving would have been plenty), in the second, I wouldn’t, but I don’t know these people, he does.

        1. I don’t think it has to be cluelessness; it may be polite to profess being low maintenance and easy going and decline any kind of special treatment or social obligation even where it would be appreciated!

          But it doesn’t have to be expected or obliged to be a nice thing to do! I think it’s also polite when anyone’s parents host you to thank them directly since it’s something they did for their child but also for you.

        2. Yeah, not to totally lean into cliches, but I wouldn’t trust a guy to know exactly what his mother would like to receive. I’m sure some really know, but I would think a lot just wouldn’t be aware of it.

          I don’t know who would mind getting a short, breezy note on a cute card or paper. Don’t use wedding level paper goods here :)

    7. Just send flowers. It’s pretty and appropriate and the note can be short and sweet!

      1. This is what I’d do. My family is NYT fancy and this would go over quite well. So would a note.

      5. Exactly, having the flowers there takes off the pressure to write a long, thoughtful note. I feel weird about sending a thank you card unless the note is at least a paragraph and eloquent, but if you send flowers the note can be as simple as “Thanks so much for your hospitality. I loved getting to know you!” or something like that. Plus flowers are pretty.

    8. If you thanked them profusely in person, you are not obligated to send a note. If you are moved to send a note to share additional thoughts, go for it.

    9. A sincere well written note is never out of place, in my opinion. Maybe I’m old fashioned but I love these little moments of connection that we can forge- I’m always delighted to get mail and genuine sentiments of gratitude.

    10. Unpopular opinion, but the backlash against thank-you notes is misplaced. They’re courteous, many people appreciate them greatly, they take less than 10 minutes including the time to mail them, and they’re a truly thoughtful gesture in a world of tweets and texts and soundbites (I’ve had people say to me YEARS later “you wrote such a nice note after ____”). I really don’t understand the depth of the “I NEVER send thank you notes!!1” or “no, that’s just weird” position.

      1. This. I write a lot of notes/cards and have never gotten anything but positive feedback. Even if it isn’t your thing does anyone honestly look at a piece of handwritten mail and think ‘ugh, I hate getting kind notes’.
        I don’t get the people that bemoan the lack of social connections in society at the same time thinking that thoughtful gestures/kind sentiments/showing up for others is ‘weird’ or unncessary.

        1. That thread was not about you sending cards. It was about you looking down at people for not doing the same when you’ve been thanked in other ways.

      2. I will add to this – Don’t limit yourself to thank you notes with your friends. I am always shocked by how positively people react to cards in the mail. One year, I sent everyone silly valentines (like the ones kids give at school) to my friend group and it was a crazy success. Same for the much maligned Christmas card.

      3. Thank you notes do not take less than 10 minutes. Hahahaha, it’s a full ordeal to pre-draft the message on the computer then carefully hand write it onto the card, don’t forget addressing it correctly. There are so many opportunities for gaffes (in the eye of the recipient) that sending cards is an activity of perfectly orchestrated perfection.

          1. Or if you don’t have nice handwriting. Writing a note longhand that’s legible usually takes me several attempts, especially since I rarely write.

          2. You clearly haven’t had the elder ladies ice you out because your thank you letter was only two sentences.

        2. I am wondering how old you are – is it seriously that difficult to address an envelope correctly? Are people not taught how to do this anymore?

          I think thank you notes, and any kind of paper mail, are delightful. During the pandemic a group of my friends took to sending each other post cards. It was a nice way to stay connected and it was fun to get mail. No lengthy tomes, just a quick, Found this post card (I think we were all cleaning out closets and drawers) and it made me think of you.

          It was very nice.

          1. I can address regular mail no problem, easy peasy. But I truly have a list for which aunt likes to be addressed as “Mrs. Uncle” vs their own names, vs some joint combination thereof. The whole thing is bonkers to me because everyone misaddresses my mail and idgaf, but I know rules for thee.

        3. I am so sorry life is this hard for you and that educators failed you in teaching handwriting.

        4. That’s a lot of anxiety over something that we expect children to be able to do. Therapy stat. I don’t mean this harshly.

    11. Yes, you need to send a thank-you note. That generation expects it, will be charmed if you send one, and will probably notice if you don’t.

      1. That’s pretty much it in a nutshell. I have to admit I wouldn’t expect a written thank you note but I would love receiving one and would probably notice the absence of one.

    13. It’s never wrong to send a thank you note, and especially nice if it is heartfelt. Go ahead and send it.

    14. I would love receiving a note like that! Not necessary but very thoughtful.

    15. I am terrible at thank you notes but this would warm my heart if my son’s new girlfriend did that.

    16. I’m probably an outlier on this, but I have a friend who will send a thank you note after we have her over for dinner or similar. Frankly, it makes me a little sad because, um, I thought we were friends. Friends have each other over do not send formal thank you notes. From a friend or family member, all I want to see is a text after the fact saying they had a great time.

      1. Kindly, you are an outlier and you are most definitely friends. I send thank you notes to my friends and they send thank you notes to me. And if it really bugs you, maybe tell her? “It’s a ‘me’ thing, but honestly there’s no need for notes. A text is fine, really!”

  4. This top looks like something that I would be sending to Goodwill. Shapeless and a dated looking print. Reminds me of the tops you used to see at JCPenney.

    2. Oof, please, anywhere but Goodwill. Donations have way more meaning to local thrift shops or via local buy-nothing groups.

  5. Styling advice needed. I am attending a Bat Mitzvah in mid October, upscale synagogue in NJ. I’m thinking of wearing an MMLF dress I own, I forget the exact name, but it’s knee-length, short sleeve, conservative cleavage. I like it because it’s a pretty conservative cut and fits well but it’s Kelly green, so less boring than my other black and navy office-appropriate dresses. Now I’m wondering if the color is too summery for that time of year? I have a nice camel wool jacket, I feel like maybe I could make it work but not sure what to do for shoes, accessories, some kind of sweater or blazer, etc. Not to mention I will probably need tights, and I feel like neutral hose is outdated and other colors will clash. Please help, or feel free to tell me this is a bad idea and I should just wear a navy dress instead.

    1. As an initial matter, this dress may not be conservative enough depending on which synagogue you are going to (care to share? I’m also in NJ). The cleavage is particular may be an issue, but perhaps consider a wrap of some kind and you should be covered (literally and figuratively). In terms of the color, Kelly green is a bit spring-y for this time of year, but I think you can style any green to work in the autumn. Think about layering in autumnal colors – either the basic blacks, browns, tans, or go for some of the fall-like jewel tone colors – and that should help get you to a place of seasonality.

      1. Anon OP – I think it’s conservative enough based on my attendance of similar events, but I will definitely carry a pashmina or other wrap to make sure I’m covered up enough.

    2. Kelly green, like Christmas green? Or St Pattys day? Not too summery for Oct. (My points of reference here are Christian holidays but I’m Jewish.). Is it a luncheon at the synagogue? If you can wear to office, then should be fine for synagogue. Plus in Oct, weather is unpredictable enough that you may want a couple options so you make a last minute decision based on the weather.

      1. I would say lighter than a Christmas green – more like prairie green? More vibrant and less limey than the average Saint Pattys day green. There is a reception and dancing at night, which I will change for. But I need something for the synagogue, and my usual rule is that if I can wear it to the office, I can wear it to synagogue (side note: I’m not Jewish but my husband is, so I’ve attended several events in synagogues over the years). It’s a high neck with a slight v, so I’m not concerned about the cleavage. I have plenty of other options, but I like this dress and feel like I don’t wear it enough because I can’t quite figure out the styling. I will definitely bring some sort of acceptable back-up in a neutral color.

    3. What not to pair with it: black or white. Red and other colors directly opposite on the color wheel.

      Your camel jacket is a great starting point. Choose other muted or muddy colors that match the camel in intensity, and that work with the undertones of the green. Warm muddy grey, muddy teal, soft burgundy, soft gold and brass, soft aubergine, tan, conjac, muddy lilac… colors that have less intensity than the green.

      Golden accessories. Gold shoes would be better than black.

  6. Please remind me how to search Corporette for past discussions. Thanks.

    1. You put site:corporette dot com in google, along with your search to limit hits to this domain.

    5. The method everyone is saying is correct, but it has not been working for me at all lately. It’s even worse on the mom’s page. I can look for an exact phrase that I know I asked about and it won’t turn up any results.

      2. Search engines are currently in the process of trying to self-destruct via AI involvement.

        Maybe try using quotation marks around the search term?

        1. Why is the internet getting worse intead of better? And by the way, the new adobe acrobat is awful.

    7. Good luck! If you know the date range, I’ve had way more luck opening every single post and searching for keywords than I have had with the search engine method.

    8. Thanks all. The search bar at the top of the website is definitely missing lots of results, so I will try the other suggestions.

  7. I need a headshot on short notice for a professional function I’m attending that has requested one. I have something I could use but this will there for posterity and am thinking that I should just get something done for the occasion. I have about 10 days to get this done. In NYC area. Is there somewhere I can go for this? I basically just want someone to take a professional picture and edit it lightly to make me look my nicest – no flyaways, etc. Is there an of outsourcing app for this sort of thing?

    1. I am in a similar boat and called an event photographer to do this. I am stopping by her house next week on the way to work and am paying $75 for a few options inside and outside. I think she was happy to have weekday morning work. See if your professional development department has any photographer recs, and if not – call around for any local photographer. Most should be able to handle this.

      1. Airbnb experiences might be a good shout for photographers. On my last trip, I noticed there were people offering city photos.

    2. Look on the knot dot com for wedding photographers near you. Then click through to their website and see who does head shots. You might strike out a couple times based on availability, but most photographers do this – and enjoy doing it. I’ve also done this to find photographers for quick holiday photos and florists to drop off an arrangement.

  8. I got a walking pad to use while I work, but every time I try it I get quite dizzy. I want to be one of those people that walks and walks while they send emails and attend boring meetings. Is there a trick to not getting dizzy?

    1. Can you read in the car without getting dizzy or sick? If you have motion sickness issues, it’s probably the same problem. It might help to increase font size to make reading easier, though.

    2. Is this an issue when you go for similar length walks outside? If so, have you discussed with a doctor? This sounds more likely to be (minor) medical than specific to the trackpad.

    3. Slow down the pace. Way down, like as low as it will go. Get used to the motion first, then you can increase speed gradually.

    4. After trying out walking pads at work I realized that I can’t use them and read anything at the same time. Video meetings where I’m listen only is fine but that’s it. I am on calls/reading emails/multi-tasking all day long and walking pads just don’t work during business hours for that reason. I do have terrible motion sickness so this shouldn’t have come as a surprise in retrospect. I miss the days of phone only conference calls pre-pandemic, I took so many walks (or even just paced) while on the phone.

    5. Is it while you’re walking or for a minute after you get off? After indoor exercise – walking pad, treadmill, elliptical – always need a second for my head to recalibrate.

    6. Are you a migraineur? If so, you may not be able to overcome this. It makes us prone to motion sickness.

  9. Favorite family-friendly places to stay in north Lake Tahoe in February/March for a two-night trip? We’re expecting a baby in the fall and want to drive up for two nights once we’re comfortable traveling. We don’t have a place we love staying so I’d appreciate recs. We might try to trade off skiing but more likely would want to do some snowy walks with the baby and just enjoy the atmosphere. TIA!

    1. How long would the drive be for you? Be aware that if your baby takes a while to eat, the drive may take up to twice as long given stopping to feed the baby. My first was like this and it made traveling a nightmare for the first year. If it is a short drive, it will be easier :-)

      1. It’s doable for us! We go up for day trips normally and know it will take longer with a baby. We have stops in mind.

        1. Depends on the baby. My babies when they were brand new wouldn’t take breast or bottle unless being held, which would mean stopping the car.

          They poop when they eat when they’re tiny, so that means stopping the car for a diaper change anyway. So I guess it depends on how young baby will be at the time of the trip. Anyway I think a lot of parenting babies is accepting that lots of things now take longer than they used to!

          1. I mis nested my answer. This was supposed to be in response to giving baby a bottle while the car is going.

          2. Sounds like the baby could potentially be 4-5 months old by the time of the trip. They don’t poop constantly at that age.

          1. Ha! Not even necessarily equality in parenting though… if dad is driving, mom would be the one to give the bottle.

          2. This wouldn’t have worked with my kids – they could sense if I was there and wouldn’t take the bottle then!!!

    3. We’ve had good experiences at the Hyatt in Incline Village. It’s right on the lake, which I love – but I’m also not a skiier.

  10. We are redoing our kitchen by knocking down a wall and expanding into the currently unused dining room, which will create a large L-shaped kitchen with a long 5-person dry island (power only, no water). This is a real upgrade from our tiny U-shaped kitchen with 3 cabinets of countertop space. We are working with a design firm, and I think we have a 95% design I love, but what kitchen upgrades have you all recently put in that I should be considering? We are moving to a 36″ induction cooktop and oven, trying to use drawer style cabinets where possible, but we aren’t looking for built-in / cabinet covered fridge and dishwasher.

    1. FWIW I renoed my Victorian home and I ‘upgraded’ my stove from a 30″ to a 36″ and I hate it, the thing is just a waste of space. I got it because of pressure to fit in but I wish I got the small stove I actually wanted.

      2. I’d rather have the counter space. Really happy with my slide-in 30” GE gas range with convection oven.

      3. One of the reasons I’m good with a 36″ is because I had to give up the double oven to get the layout I wanted, and I love baking. Hoping to fit two sheet pans in side by side in the 36″.

        1. My 30″ GE gas range has a double oven — gas main size oven, and electric oven drawer. Some models (when I bought it ten years ago) had only a warming drawer, but I preferred the “Thanksgiving sides” oven at the bottom. Works great! This would allow 6 more inches of counter space, plus storage in cabinets underneath.

    2. I would love a tall skinny cabinet or drawer with vertical slots for cookie sheets and large cutting boards. Behind a door, not an open slot. A shelf for cookbooks (again, behind a door). And ceiling height upper cabinets, none of this open gap nonsense that compels people to put faky ivy and ceramic chickens in the space up there.

      1. OP here – Yes! I added a slotted cookie sheet and cutting board cabinet that’s hidden and designated a space for cookbooks. At this point I believe we will have crown upper molding (is this what it’s called?) to hide the gap.

        1. Personally, I would rather the useable cabinet space go all the way to the ceiling (even if crown molding covers the joint itself). Then there is more room inside the cabinet to store things, rather than having a false ceiling inside the cabinet with dead space above.

        2. I converted an over-the-fridge cabinet to hold both the large roasting pan on a horizontal shelf on one side, and then my contractor installed the horizontal shelf vertically, along with other dividers on the other side, for trays, muffin tins, and sheet pans. Works great, and is an argument for cabinetry that gives the look of a built-in fridge surround.

    3. I got a tall narrow counter depth fridge with freezer drawers on the bottom and I love it! So organized, so sleek! I never realized how squatty regular fridges are but they’re hideous.

      1. Is it big enough for your family? Worried about giving up cubic footage in the fridge for our family of 4 :)

        1. Yes it’s plenty big enough, the only thing it can’t do is a whole pizza box, but I actually prefer it because it forces the pizza to be put away properly.

    4. Depends on what you like and what kind of cooking you do. I would have a kitchen table over an island, but realize I’m in the minority on that one.
      Design and pay for excellent ventilation to the outside.
      Make sure surfaces are easy to clean. Lots of expensive, beautiful kitchens aren’t made for heavy cooking.
      A friend had a slot built in her kitchen for a vertical freezer (as opposed to a chest freezer in the basement). It made their frozen stuff so much more accessible, and therefore more likely to get used and rotated out while it was still good.

      1. My fugly, poorly remodeled, open concept 70s kitchen had an odd gap at the end of the counter run. Based on the hints from outlets, flooring, and cabinetry, we think it is where the fridge originally lived. The gap is too far from the cooking surfaces and sink for the fridge to make sense there, but it is conveniently sized for our upright freezer and having it so close is AMAZING. No basement or garage runs just to access the big freezer.

      2. We also have a kitchen table off the short side of the L: banquette seating with storage where our current bay window is – keeping the window, just adding the bench for kids on that side and chairs for adults on the other.

    5. Every day I curse that I don’t have custom drawers for Ziplocs, tin foil, etc. And space for tupperware containers.

    6. One thing I love is having a coffee/tea station that is separate from my kitchen counter space.

      1. Yes! I have designated a space for this. I did a quick audit of “things that live on our countertops that drive me crazy because we have no space” and the coffee + toaster will have their own countertop area which isn’t a food prep / cooking area.

        1. That’s such a good approach. The encroachment of counterspace is the thing I have resented in every kitchen I’ve ever cooked in, and I cook a lot.

    7. Double wall ovens
      Pantry with pocket doors and microwave in pantry.
      No uppers.
      Counter depth fridge

      Measure everything and double check all details. First our contractor told us the double wall ovens and the fridge couldn’t go where we wanted them and that we couldn’t do a pocket door instead of a regular door for the pantry because of where everything was located. We spent a lot of time measuring and taping things out. Then the kitchen designer told us we could do two but not three drawers under the induction cooktop. Both were wrong based on the specific appliances we picked.

      1. Here’s a thing I just read about double wall ovens. Apparently, they’re not as standard sized as other appliances so if you get one that fits the space you build for it now and it works for a while it’s all great.

        But then when you need to replace the ovens after they break/wear out, replacements won’t fit your space and then you end up having to redo cabinetry or wall space or whatever to fit the new one. I would hesitate because of that alone.

        1. There’s enough variety in double walls ovens that I don’t think this really comes up as an issue. They are pretty common in my neighborhood and I grew up with one. I don’t recall anyone mentioning replacement issues. Like fridges, you have to check the specific measurements of each model. So you might not be able to replace with the exact same ovens but I can’t imagine there aren’t any ovens that fit the space.

          1. you can’t imagne but that’s exactly what the article was about.

            This is a caveat emptor situation.

          2. Do you have a link to the article? I didn’t see anything about this when I was reno’ing my kitchen.

          3. Oh refrigerators have this issue too, it’s a very common appliance problem. If you haven’t lived it, count your blessings.

        2. We had to replace our double wall oven, and the new unit is a little shorter than the old one. There’s about a 3/4 inch gap above and below the wall oven, and we covered it with a piece of metal trim that matches the wall oven and its surround. It’s fine. In fairness, though, my home is pretty average–built in the 1980s, in the suburbs in the SEUS, renovated with an addition in the 2000s, 2700 sq ft. This is not remotely the worst thing about our house, or even our kitchen. If you have a $2M home, that issue might lead you to completely gut the cabinets.

          Anon@12:19 may be right that this may not be an issue when there’s a standard selection of wall ovens on the market. Our previous oven went out because of a post-Hurricane-Ida power surge in the fall of 2021, right in the middle of supply chain shortages. There weren’t many appliances in stock, and it took 9 months to get a replacement that had the features we wanted and was in our price range.

          1. Pandemic appliance replacement was a pretty unique situation though. Tons of appliances and furniture took months longer than normal. I wouldn’t design a kitchen to avoid possible future pandemic supply chain issues.

        3. My tale of woe: my house had a double wall oven when I bought it. Years later, the oven died and I needed to replace it. Literally the only oven I could find with workable dimensions cost over $7,000. My only alternative was to literally knock down brick walls, replace counters and likely replace the floor. I bought the oven and I will be sure to move before it needs to be replaced.

      2. I empathize with this. Our designer told us we couldn’t have the sink on the short L because they couldn’t figure out how to fit both a fridge and stove on the long side of the L. However, a 3-window bank looking out to our backyard is my dream. I figured out where things would ‘work’ and sent the revision back to our designer.

        We now have the 3-bank window with no uppers and the sink on the short L, but, the rest of the L needs to have the uppers so we have enough room :). We have a space under the stairwell (standard Colonial house with the stairwell in the center) that is currently an overflow and general storage area. We intend to keep the space as overflow pantry, but unfortunately, don’t have room to put in a walk in.

        What do you love most about your counter depth fridge? It wasn’t on my radar before now.

        1. It makes the floor plan more open because it doesn’t stick out as much and eat floor space in front of the pantry access. We were tight on the budget at the end so we had the cabinet built for a specific french door fridge we wanted that was taller than our existing standard depth fridge freezer on top fridge and used our existing fridge for another year. Cabinet maker installed a removable panel so there wasn’t a big gap above the existing fridge. The counter depth model we picked was taller than our old standard depth so we didn’t lose much fridge space.

        2. Counter depth fridge is the difference between flow and a giant metal block sticking out into the room.

        1. We use ours frequently as well but with 3 kids under 12, I hated having one over the cooktop in the pre reno kitchen because they couldn’t reach it. And I didn’t want a counter top one. Pantry door is open a lot so it’s almost like an extension of the kitchen but I love that I can close it when entertaining and the look is much cleaner.

          1. The microwave over the cooktop isn’t really a thing in new kitchens in SFH anymore anyways. Most of them are now below the counter in the main kitchen area.

        2. Microwave over the range was a mistake when I renovated the kitchen. It should be a drawer-type microwave, next to the fridge, as that’s where most of the food to be microwaved comes from. Also, using the microwave while cooking on the stove top can get tricky, dodging steam and general heat rising from the burners.

    8. I love the idea of an appliance garage. Something to hide a toaster or other counter appliances. I also recently saw someone installed a drawer with a charging station built into it to help hide phones or tablets while they are charging.

    9. I love my cabinets with pull-out drawers for pots and pans and one with revolving shelves for baking tins. Also a deep, not full-width, drawer for small items used in baking).
      I wish I had a hutch for the large (Kenwood made for the USA power supply but more powerful than American ones) mixer, Soda Stream, weighing scales ( i.e. items that I do not use everyday but don’t want have to lift out to use). I wanted the hutch when our kitchen was renovated but lost the battle.

      1. And, the size of refrigerators increases in imperceptible half-inch increments so that in the future when eventually a replacement is necessary the built-in space replacement will be too small!

    10. Does anyone have a Kitchenaid lift? I think it will end up living in our dry island and I’m debating a mixer lift but worried about “requiring” that the KA live in that space (and whether the lift will hold up – I’ve noticed that my mixer will “walk” when I use it).

      1. Heh my husband is my Kitchenaid lift. I wanted it out on the counter at all times and he doesn’t like clutter on the counter, so we copromised with him agreeing to get it out and put it away any time I wanted. Eight years later, the deal is still holding up.

      2. My parents have a Kitchenaid lift in their kitchen and it’s really heavy and awkward to use. Easier to just keep the mixer on the counter all the time.

        1. I just finally moved my kitchenaid mixer to the backers rack in my pantry that holds my Le Creuset pots. I’m so much happier having the counter space back. I do use the mixer, but not as often as I otherwise use the counterspace it used to occupy.

      3. I have one and I love it. My husband purchased it and installed it in one of my cupboards. It’s pretty easy to raise up and down, and I love that I don’t need to store the mixer on my counter all the time.

      4. My KitchenAid lives in the reach-in floor-ceiling pantry cabinet on a reinforced roll-out rimmed shelf that also holds the Cuisinart and blender. When I need to use it, I pull out the drawer to its limit (about halfway open), pick it up gently from the waist-high drawer/shelf, and pivot behind me to the countertop and place it there. The proximity of the storage location the the countertop where it is used is key. (I don’t have a regular “human KitchenAid lift” handy!)

      5. Days late but if you are checking back. I had a counter installed in my “closet pantry” with an outlet so I can just use it there. Love never having to move the whole thing and I can close the door and not see it.

    11. We have a built-in warming drawer and love it and use it every single day for warming plates and it’s also great for proofing baked goods. Also if you host much at all, a double oven is great. Also we have one of those flexible sprayer things (like you see in a restaurant dishwashing station) in our sink and I love it. And vertical storage for cookie sheets and the like is great.

      1. My double oven GE range has the electric oven drawer at the bottom. It is a genuine oven, but can also be used as a warming drawer. Comes in handy at Thanksgiving, for cooking the sides, and for other uses, too.

    12. I’ve got a pantry-style cabinet with reinforced shelves for small kitchen appliances (instapot, toaster, stand mixer etc) because I hate losing counterspace to appliances I’m not using.

    13. If you like to cook, an undercabinet cookbook holder is fantastic! My dad is a woodworker and designed ones that he has since installed in every one of our family kitchens, basically a spring-loaded, hinged music stand-thing that pulls down from under an upper cabinet near the main prep area. Heavy duty enough that it can hold a hefty cookbook or an ipad, with a ledge at the bottom to keep things from sliding off. I have a big rubberband around mine so I can keep cookbook pages open.

    14. Five years post-reno, the surprise kitchen heroes for me are: undercounter microwave drawer, double-decker utensil drawer, and choosing the same material for both the backsplash and counter. All help keep visual clutter manageable even when it needs a good cleaning.

      1. I looked at a double utensil drawer and had a visceral “no” reaction (not sure why!) so I’m surprised to hear it’s a hero for you! What do you love about it? I also love hiding clutter, but I guess I didn’t see the need for a double decker drawer. What do you put in the “underneath”?

        Micro drawer (which I don’t love visually, but seems super helpful) will be in the dry island, across from the fridge location. Easy access for our elementary aged kiddos. Viva la chicken nuggets.

        1. The top rack of the double-decker utensil drawer holds all our everyday forks, knives, spoons, etc. The bottom rack is great for steak knives and frequently used serving utensils. For me, having everything in one drawer makes it really easy for kids to help with setting the table and emptying the dishwasher.

    15. Soft close cabinets and drawers. Pull-out drawers in all lower cabinets and the pantry. Make the silverware drawer wider than you think you need. No glass front upper cabinets unless they’re away from your dishwasher and stove- they only look nice if you store pretty bar glasses in them. If you have a big peninsula or countertop you should be able to wipe the entire thing clean without standing on a chair to reach the center.

    16. Knife drawer, foil/ziplock drawer, spice drawer, sliding/disappearing oven door, induction hob with individual timers, napkin drawer, oven circuit breaker guard, good lighting, roomy recycling cupboard, real pantry, silent big appliances (less than 42 decibel), room for a roomba to roam, small appliance cupboard, twin sinks, heat resistant counter tops, tall faucet, lower countertop for comfortable cutting, comfortable seat for guests.

      1. Always wanted a sliding/disappearing oven door like on Great British Baking Show!! I’ll look into it :)

    17. You probably will need more counter space than you think. I was about to approve an on-counter cabinet (like an appliance garage type thing), but first researched online the linear feet of countertop that kitchen designers recommend and discovered that with that on-counter cabinet, I would not have the minimum recommended length of counter top. So I nixed that appliance garage. I also found that I do the majority of prep (chopping, whisking eggs) on the countertop that sits above the double trash pull-out (garbage + recycling bins), given the convenience of sweeping or dropping peelings and eggshells into the trash bin. The trash/recycling pullout is located between the fridge and the sink, to the side of the dishwasher, for plate-scraping purposes. Also, if you are right-handed, you want your dishwasher placed to the LEFT of your kitchen sink, for ergonomic reasons. Finally, you’ll need a place to store your broom, mop, and step stool, plus hooks somewhere (inside pantry doors?) to hang aprons. A double carousel cabinet in the corner provides excellent accessible storage. For a deep pantry cabinet, that typically has just shelving on the top half, you can get an extra-large lazy susan-type carousel for more accessible storage. I also have some shallow baskets that fit the depth perfectly and act as sort of drawers on those high shelves. Good luck!

      1. Just coming back to say thanks! I read through this and it’s interesting – we can’t swing relocating the dishwasher to the left of the sink, but the pull out trash is right next to it and there is counter space for chopping above. I’ll look into the linear feet of counter space; I haven’t calculated our layout yet. (Anything is better than we have now…)

  11. Here’s a problem I didn’t expect-my 5th grade daughter is in a group of cooler kids. I don’t think she is actively mean to anyone. How do I help make sure she includes others and is kind to all. Not sure what I’m asking, this just seems like a sensitive age where mean girl stuff starts.

    1. Mine is in first and we’re experiencing the same dynamic. I feel like she was just learning to walk. How did we get here?! [sidebar: I struggle with the word “cooler” at this age/stage but that’s the lingo I was raised on in the 90s so I’m going with it, in case any one takes issue with relative coolness of elementary kids…]

      I will say that at home, absent some Specific Event that needs head-on addressing, we talk about kindness, including everyone, and other related themes. I don’t sit her down and lecture her on the topics day in and day out, but when she’s recounting the day’s recess events I always ask how two specific girls are / what they’re doing / asking if she offered to play with them because I know they are outside this core group of girls and have felt as much, per their mothers who I’m friends with. There was one instance where DD talked about another one of her buddies “spying” on one of these two girls, so we hit that more head on.

    2. I think being generally kind is the goal here. Spending time with people out of pitty isn’t a kindness, the nerdy kids know when they’re the pitty friend/invite. However just generally being nice, saying hi in the hallway, being an equally contributing member in group projects etc should be what you aim for.

    3. Don’t invent a solution for a problem that doesn’t yet exist. Also, it’s really important for kids to navigate their own social lives. Parents shouldn’t step in unless it’s absolutely required.

    4. I’m going through the same thing – my daughter is the popular girl in her class, and I was the opposite. So far I focus on encouraging her to play with everyone in her class/at aftercare. We attend every birthday party that she’s invited to, and I encourage playdates with different kids in her class. We also talk about being a good friend, and having our own opinions/being a leader instead of a follower.

    5. Caveat: I had “be nice” rammed down my throat so hard that I’ve spent a small fortune in therapy to learn to establish boundaries. Ultimately, it comes down to the fact that people are ultimately responsible for their own behaviour, not someone else’s behaviour. Being “nice” to people who were horrific to me wouldn’t inspire them to be kinder (“keep being nice to people and they will eventually be nice to you”); it made me a doormat who was somehow to blame for other people’s bad behaviour. Nothing I did could fix my parents’ wounds from their own nastiness towards their classmates.

      With that in mind: I would talk to her about how she’s in charge of how she treats other people and what it means to be kind or mean. Peer pressure isn’t an excuse for being mean. She doesn’t have to be nice to people who are mean to her or mean to other people. She’s in charge of how she reacts to tough situations. Boundaries aren’t mean; nastiness is mean. Her circumstances shouldn’t dictate her integrity, whether that being part of the in crowd or the out crowd, rich or poor when she grows up, successful or not.

        1. I think no matter the circumstance, this is a worthwhile conversation to have with kids.

    6. Thanks for asking this question – you are a good mom! I have a daughter who is currently in 5th grade, and all of our neighbors suddenly became “cool” this year. For a random variety of reasons, my child is “not” in this group, and according to my daughter, kids in this group seem to fit into three categories — kids who actively and intentionally ice out kids who are not in the group; kids who will be nice to you but seem to be looking over your kids’ shoulder and drop you if another cooler kid surfaces; and kids who are firmly in the group, but equally and happily will engage with you. Teach your daughter to be the third kid — remind her that everyone has value, and that she should remain friendly to everyone.

      also, check in with your daughter a bit — my daughter stopped hanging with these kids she’s known all her life because she always felt like her “friends” might drop her, or she was worried about someone talking about her when she walked away. She told me she didn’t feel like “herself” around them – that she was worried, and so I encouraged her to spend more time with other kids, which she has done. I think the imagery that you should not spend time with people who dim your light to make their own shine brighter really resonated with her.

      1. +1 to the first paragraph. There was a girl at my daughter’s school who was the “third kid” and everyone noticed–other kids, parents, teachers. It served her well as she was probably the most well-liked kid in school, was elected to every leadership position she ran for, and won a bunch of the little community scholarships handed out at graduation.

    7. Same age, same dynamic. I do things like schedule a team dinner/lunch after their sports practice and email all the parents and offer rides to anyone that doesn’t have one- so all the girls are invited and can go.

      I also spend a lot of time trying to be aware of the general social dynamics. I volunteer in the school, know most of her friends’ parents.

      1. +1 to this – my kid is not a “cool” kid, but I know the kids who are and I genuinely love the ones who have good moms. There are “cool kid” moms who ice me out, and “cool kid” moms who are just lovely and inclusive and frankly, it tends to be emulated by their kids. Be that mom.

    8. Mean girls have mean mommies. Their mothers comment when Aunt Linda gains 10 pounds or cousin Debbie’s shorts are too short. They post about the “people of Walmart” and feel the need to comment on crazy or terrible outfits when they are out and about.

      2. My daughter’s bully had the sweetest mom on planet Earth. I would hang out with that mom every day if I could. The problem, as far as I could tell, was that her daughter had no boundaries. Mom was a pushover in way too many ways.

    9. Honestly, I wouldn’t do anything in particular because it could change real fast in middle school. Encourage her to be nice to others and not exclude people, and maybe (if she’s willing) invite a big crowd for parties. I’ve always been pretty hands-off about my kids’ social lives and it’s worked out OK so far.

  12. I really like Boden dresses but the prints this year are too mumsy for my very conservative office (and I already have plenty of solid navy/hunter/black dresses). I wasn’t happy with the look and fit of MMLaFleur when I looked earlier this year. Where else should I look for similar style and price point? I got overwhelmed looking at Nordstrom’s site, would prefer a single brand if possible.

    1. Reiss, Hobbs, and The Fold are my favorites. I’m trying to stop myself from buying all of the hunter green and burgundy dresses at the Fold right now as those are my best colors by far and they’re often hard to find.

  13. My new job has a field work component – what are your favorite boots to wear when you’re on your feet on a variety of terrain for 12 hours a day? Could easily put in 10 miles a day when in the field.

    Terrain is mostly paved or gravel roads or mostly grass, but can also be concrete warehouse floors or totally off road (overgrown, bushwhacking, rocks, mud).

    This will be year round in the Northeast so show, ice, rain, mud, and dry weather. Hot and cold.

    Happy to get a few pairs of boots – likely to do one waterproof pair, one insulated pair, and one regular pair.

    Also looking for pants recommendations. And really any gear (favorite coats)? I’ll mostly be wearing company polos on top, layering as needed.

    Obviously this is casual wear, but I’ll be meeting with partners and the public so need to look presentable.

      1. I know it’s late, but Lowa Renegade GTX have worked great for me over the years. Lots of walking/standing on concrete, asphalt, and gravel, both indoor and outdoor work sites.

    2. I like Kuhl hiking pants for actual outdoorsy things, and sometimes also wear mine in the office on casual Fridays.

    3. My Redwings haven’t steered me wrong yet in over a decade of wearing them through similar terrain you’re describing. I don’t think the style I have is available anymore, unfortunately. For pants, I’ve worn Uniqlo’s heat tech leggings or tights under jeans and their heattech socks in the freezing sleeting winter and it works well for me since I’m allergic to wool.

    4. I ride horses and wear Dubarry boots – they are very popular with equestrians. Waterproof, warm, and good treads. They are expensive but last years.

    5. I’m not a big fan of boots unless absolutely necessary. I just find them too clunky and heavy, especially when I’m on my feet all day. For most things, I prefer trail running or hiking shoes. Keen or Merrell fit my feet well, but ymmv. I only wear real boots when I’m in water or snow, on really rocky terrain, carrying a lot of weight, or somewhere where steel toes are required.

    6. I have a pair of La Canadienne chelsea boots that I wear for fancier field work days (like walking an elected official around a site), and I have bigger boots with vibram soles that I wear on a day-to-day basis, they are so comfortable, I love them. Having a variety of socks also helps – I use a mix of quick-dry cycling socks, big wool socks, and thin smartwool socks, depending on the weather.

      For pants, I like the way the Everlane barrel pants hit the tops of my boot, and again for fancier days I have some straight-cut trousers from Theory that do well. Buying pants that are cropped helps eliminate bunching or excess fabric at the tops of the boots. Look for jackets with lots of big and sturdy pockets (large enough for phone, wallet, small notebook at least) so that you don’t always have to carry a bag with you.

    7. I love my Keen hiking boots. They are light, very comfortable, with good cleats on the soles and with ankle support. They are not fashionable!

    8. I rotate through 3 pairs of boots:

      Merrell Moab hiking boots, Blundstones, and Red Wings.

      The Red Wings are the most durable, but for me the least comfortable. They don’t come in half sizes, so they don’t fit me right (even though I was fitted in a Red Wing store).

      The Merrells and Blundstones are insanely comfortable. I actually had to wear the Blundstones like the day after I got them for a 14 hour day of walking and standing in concrete. I was shocked at how comfortable they were. If I don’t need ankle support or great traction, I prefer the blundstones. They’re also easiest for me to walk in.

      Moab’s are also insanely comfortable. If I need ankle support or traction, these are my go to. They’re a little bulky on me, so not as easy to walk in.

      I do post- disaster survivor assistance; I’m usually on my feet 12 hours a day 6 or 7 days a week – either more or less stationary indoors (concrete or gym floors) or out in the field walking all day (in a wide variety of conditions – sometimes sidewalks and sometimes hiking off road and everything in between).

      In the warmer months, I wear lighter weight hiking pants. I like the Columbia Saturday Trail Pantd as an affordable option and Prana Halle pants as a more exieisuvr option. When it’s cold, lined jeans or canvas work pants (LL Bean, Duluth, or Carhartt). Or, later with merino leggings and shirt under normal clothes.

      1. +1 for Merrell Moabs, both hiking boots and hiking shoes. They offer waterproofed models.

    9. I think you’re going to just have to try on a bunch and see what you like. You might want something lighter weight for the days you’ll be mostly on paved roads or in a warehouse, but a stronger boot for the offroad stuff and in colder/inclement weather. I have never regretted wearing my hiking boots when out and about in 1-3 inches of snow or when there’s puddles or mud everywhere. You can also pull out the inserts and add your own if you need more cushioning or different support.

      For pants, I don’t have any specific suggestions but hiking pants could be good for warmer weather because they’re so light weight and dry quickly. Also, cargo pockets are really nice so you can carry all of your absolutely essential gear without a pack.

    10. I find Duluth Trading Post work pants very comfortable – and the lined ones are very warm.

    11. Ariat Terriain boots are my go-to. I’ve worn out 3 pairs in the last 30 years and packed the waterproof version on a trip to Scotland last year. Super comfortable and reasonably priced.

  14. My SIL texted me today that she bought Christmas outfits for all 3 of my kids (toddler/preschool age). This irks me so much and I can’t put my finger on why exactly.
    It’s not a “take a photo and be done with it” situation; we will be with her on Christmas and it’ll be expected that the kids wear these outfits. She has no kids of her own and I guess wants to play dress up with mine. But like- I want to dress my own kids, especially for a major holiday. Pretty sure MIL already bought their Halloween costumes too…

    1. If SIL is hosting Christmas I would probably give her some grace, otherwise dress your kids how you want.

    2. “I can’t put my finger on why exactly.”

      Actually, you did put your finger on it, exactly: you want to dress your own kids, thank you very much, and you feel like she’s taking over your territory.

      You can:
      Forgive her for not restraining herself out of understanding how much ownership the kids’ mother feels, and for letting her enthusiasm about cute kids and Christmas run away with her.

      Decide whether your kids will wear her outfits at Christmas or not. “Oh, that sounds so cute! We’ll have our own outfits that they’ll be wearing around Christmas, but I’m sure they’ll love wearing those when we go look at lights, and i”ll be sure to send you a picture.” (Use the same script for your MIL and her halloween outfits.)

      1. This. I buy my nephew holiday outfits all the time. I don’t expect him to wear them on any particular day. Just introduce the idea that you get to decide what they wear politely like this, and then do it. Same for MIL.

    3. I don’t celebrate Christmas, but I can see how it’s overbearing if she expects them to wear the outfits on that day. However just giving your kids Christmas-themed attire that they could wear at any point in the holiday season isn’t weird imo.

      MIL buying the Halloween costume without consulting you seems even worse. Don’t your kids have opinions about what they want to be? Mine did, starting at like…2.

    4. I would thank her and not use them. If she asks/pouts on Christmas, just shrug and say the kids wanted to wear something else instead, you know how kids always want to dress themselves, haha.

      1. Okay, but in this scenario OP is dressing them instead and then lying to SIL about it. That just seems unnecessarily mean. Like the excellent advice in the potential mean girls thread above says, you can set a boundary without being nasty about it.

    5. If she’s open to suggestions, would you suggest matching holiday pajamas instead of dress up outfits? Holiday PJs are great for a cute pic and they’d much more practical. The kids are usually happy to wear them. In fact my kids wore the snot out of holiday pjs close to year round at that age. I have two kids and they got matching sets to each other, but didn’t necessarily wear them on the same day as each other most of the time.

      1. In fact, my two kids are early 20s now, and there’s a fiance on the scene as well, so I have three kids who expect and would be very disappointed not to receive new Christmas pajamas on Thanksgiving weekend every year.

        Future son in law was just wearing his 2023 snowman pajama pants this weekend.

    6. If they are cute and comfortable outfits, I’d have your kids wear them. Having engaged, loving aunts is SO valuable, and I still have really fond memories of the times my aunts showed me (sometimes overbearing) maternal love and adoration. A lot of relatives are checked out of the little ones’ lives!

    7. It irks you because it’s an overstep of your parenting and your children’s autonomy.

      Kids aren’t dress-up dolls. I give my four year old choices in what to wear (within reason): he picks his underwear (we have animal varieties), his shirt, his hat, and, if applicable, shorts or pants.

    8. Potential reframe: our culture is getting more and more isolated, with viewer connections outside the nuclear family. I have a lot of friends with young kids who live far from family (or have checked out siblings), who really don’t have anyone totally in love with them except their parents. It sounds like SIL and MIL totally adore your children, and are giving them gifts as a reflection of that. They may have fewer boundaries than you’re used to (this can vary so much family to family) but the intention behind it sounds like they love your kids and want to celebrate them.

      1. This is an interesting take and as a kid whose aunts, uncles and grandparents did not love them, you’ve given me a lot to think about! Thank you.

      2. I agree with this take. I would rather put up with minor annoyances from extended family than have an unengaged extended family.

        1. Me too. I see a lot of people lament any annoyance posed by family members, but no one is perfect. Yes, it cleaner/easier to have rigid walls in place, but then you see so many articles (or posts on here) about how isolated we are…

      3. Completely agree with this. I think society as a whole has swung a little too far towards “you must set HARD boundaries and then hold them” every time relatives do something that’s a little annoying. If it truly makes you really upset, then don’t put your kids in the clothes, but otherwise? It sounds like she’s given a gift that will make a fun festive atmosphere and now your kids have free clothes.

      4. Same! I think it’s a huge leap from “SIL is excited to buy holiday outfits for your kids” to “she’s evilly trying to usurp your parental authority and your children’s autonomy.”

        1. +1

          As the childless aunt, who loves my brother’s kids…. oh my goodness. I am not trying to steal your children.

      5. yes, this is likely their love language. i have a friend with a MIL like this who literally lives 5 min away, but cannot come over without something for my friend, her grandkids, etc. i once went to visit and the MIL even gave me something! that does not mean you have to put your kid in the outfits if you don’t want to, but they likely aren’t doing it to be controlling, especially if these are the only grandkids. granted, you know them better than i do. if you really don’t want them to wear this outfit for actual christmas, you could say “thanks so much for thinking of them! we are excited to celebrate with you. i actually already have something for them to wear that day, but would love to put them in it for X event.”

      6. OP here and yes, you’re totally right. I will reframe this in my head and focus on the fact that my children are fortunate to have a very loving extended family. Boundaries are quite different in my own family so this is something I’ll just have to get used to and think about differently.

        1. …and OP, the kids don’t have to wear them on Christmas. I come from a large, loving and extremely overbearing family. I have learned that I can accept the love and be grateful for it but still set (inward facing) boundaries so I don’t resent them. If it were me, I would say thank you, ooh and awe over the gift, have the kids wear it at least once (and take a pic!) but not stress to much about whether they wear it on any particular day.

          2. +2. You can still be grateful for the loving extended family, but just put them in something else on Christmas if you want to.

    9. Any chance you’re misunderstanding about the expectation that they wear them on Christmas day and this could be just a gift of an outfit to be worn at some point during the holiday season? Maybe even put the kids in the outfits on another day and text her a photo of them – “so cute, thank you so much!”

    10. My mom is like your SIL. I addressed it by putting them in her outfits for Christmas day lunch at their house. For Christmas eve church, our family picture in front of our tree at our house and for Christmas pyjamas, I use what I selected.

      For Halloween, I’ve usually dealt with it by asking kid what they want to be, letting them be that but also saying that the gifted costume is super cute and will get lots of use in the dress up box. If they are in daycare and not really neighborhood trick or treat age, you can put them in your costume for daycare and MIL’s costume if they do a trick or treat visit to MIL’s house.

      Also, feel free to rave about something but mention that you already bought/ordered x item. I’ve used that little white lie on multiple occasions to moderate expectations. I try to avoid the topic until closer to the date so there isn’t a lot of opportunity to complain.

      Plus with infant/toddlers there’s always a chance of a messy disaster so you may need an extra outfit.

      1. +1 I care more about dressing my kids for things like the picture and church, when they will be “seen”. I’m actually fairly lax about what they wear on the actual holiday to hang out with family. If your SIL bought them, then she will think they look adorable. And before you know it, your 8yo will be wearing a holiday-themed Minecraft Creeper T-shirt to Christmas dinner… (he wore a green plaid button-down for the card photo and church!)

        But I do get the initial frustration and don’t want to dismiss your feelings. Choosing holiday outfits can be fun. But I have four kids now and in my head dressing them for holidays is better than actually shopping and finding coordinating things that they will agree to wear.

    11. I have a best friend who similarity likes picking out outfits for my daughter, although she has at least always asked. The balance I’ve struck is that she can pick out outfits for secondary events (like going to see Christmas lights or a Christmas show) and secondary holidays/events (like the Super Bowl party, Memorial Day).

      Are you doing anything else with your SIL around the holidays where you can wear the outfits? Such as a Christmas concert or going to see lights. If not, just have the kids wear them another day. But don’t deprive yourself of the fun of picking out Christmas clothing for your kids just to keep your SIL happy. Same for Halloween. Wear your MIL outfits on the weekend before the holiday, but you pick out the outfits for the actual holiday.

  15. Does anyone use and like a particular habit tracker? I get terrible SAD and in addition to a sun lamp/meds I’m trying to be better at doing things that generally help my mental health (lots of water, walks, time outside, calls with friends, etc.).
    It’s best for me to have a list/reminders because when I’m depressed everything feels like a slog and I cannot remember what a difference small actions have on my mood. I also want to be able to have a list of ‘things you like’ in a ‘if you’re depressed try A/B/C’ (again – when I’m depressed I legitimately cannot remember what things bring me joy).

  16. we are first time home owners and have owned our home for almost 3 years. in the past week we needed to get a new washing machine, now we need a new roof and today turns out a leak in one of the kids’ rooms (not from the roof) that is going to require pulling out and redoing the drywall for a whole wall. i know this stuff is normal and we’re lucky we haven’t had serious problems until now, but i could use some reassurance

    1. Totally normal. Homeownership isn’t a steady flow of costs; it comes in fits and starts.

    2. Haha welcome to homeownership. I’m in the Bay Area and my homeowners insurance just got non renewed for wildfire risk. I’m in the flats not near any brush or parkland. Fun times.

    3. It happens unfortuantely, and seems to come in waves. The nature of home ownership. In the space of two months, had to replace both washer and dryer, central air conditioning unit, window air conditioner elsewhere in the house, pool filter motor, and 20 storm/screen windows due to rot. Am waiting on roofer to repair leak. I walk around the house and tell it “no more toys for you until 2026!”

    4. If you went three years without a major disaster I’d say you were past due! As my husband and I are fond of saying, “it’s always some damn thing!”

    6. What can I say? Owning a house is constant maintenance, but it’s nice having a place to live.

    7. This is why they say budget 2% of home value for maintenance per year (1% if newer/condo or other factors, 3-4% if older/ historic/ previously poorly maintained)
      It’s normal. And it’s lumpy – you’ll get three things this year then nothing next. Just bank the budget.

      1. That rule seems out of date in this COVID era. I can’t imagine that the average 4 bedroom suburban home needs $15,000 of maintenance a year, you know?

        1. I don’t know, I believe it. Because when big ticket items hit, they could be WELL above that, so it averages out to that much a year. A roof is often more than 15K, appliances can run several thousand each, and if you need or want to do any sort of big reno project (I’m the poster with the destroyed bathroom subfloors!) it could be 30K+.

          Plus the steady stream of people coming to do yearly maintenance (furnace, well), regular pest control, etc. and the one-off things that always pop up (blown wire in your HVAC system, a tree falls in a storm and other trees need trimming, etc)

    8. The first day living in our new house, I turned on the washing machine and water poured out onto the floor (yes, it had been tested during the inspection and seemed fine!) Then one month later we found a bathroom leak into the entryway and discovered the subfloor of both upstairs bathrooms are trashed and we are living on borrowed time while we save to renovate them. And that’s the unknowns — we had already replaced the original boiler and the tiny drop in kitchen stove, and were installing main floor AC (1960s house).

      But the bones are good, the basement is water proofed, the roof and driveway are good, the attic is well insulated, the windows are all updated, etc. Point is, there are SO MANY systems and features in a house that need maintenance, and as long as it doesn’t all come due at once, you cycle through updates and repairs through the years. They say to budget at least 1% of house value for repairs every year; some years you can save a little more, and some you spend. You are investing in a place to live and make memories.

    9. Normal.

      You’re lucky if this is all you’ve had to replace in 3 years.

      Stuff will keep happening.

  17. what is everyone paying for dog grooming these days? any dos/don’ts for small dogs? new dog owner (puppy) so i’m learning… thank you!

    1. Uh we don’t? We have a chihuahua mix and they don’t shed a lot, but we don’t pay for any grooming. We bathe every couple months or when she gets particularly dirty.

    2. Don’t neglect teeth and nails. Dogs should not have stinky breath. Acclimate your puppy to having its teeth cleaned regularly and your dog’s overall health and well-being will be much better throughout its life. Bonus side effect: your dog won’t bowl people over with bad breath if you keep up on that.

    3. What kind of dog? Not all of them really need professional grooming. And yeah- get the dog used to you pulling at its paws to trim nails and putting your hands in its mouth to brush teeth.

    4. Try looking up “cooperative care” and see if you get a head start on helping your puppy feel comfortable with all the handling that grooming entails. Some dog groomers are truly dog whisperers, but the less anxiety surrounding the process the better!

    5. We have a 90lb lab and pay anywhere from $80-$100 including a tip for grooming in a VHCOL area. We bathe him about every 6-8 weeks but brush much more frequently. For dogs that get crust eyes/gunky ears I’d make sure you get the puppy used to having you clean those areas regularly. Ditto with teeth/paws – the groomers don’t want to deal with a reactive dog either!

    7. I occasionally pay around $70 plus tip for a “deluxe bath” that includes a nail trim and anal gland expression. My vet would charge me over $100 for the latter.

      Otherwise, he gets washed at home in the laundry sink more or less weekly, and that’s it.

      1. Your vet really charges that much for gland expression????? Mine charges $12!! More than $100 is beyond bananas, especially since the techs can do it in about 45 seconds.

        1. That sounds like the price set by a vet that has way better things to do with their limited time and thinks the owner should be able to handle it themselves (which, it really is a gross task).

          1. The vet charges for an office visit. Unfortunately they don’t do it ala carte.

            My last several vet visits have been more than my own doctors visits, before insurance.

            Vets are incredibly expensive now.

          2. Yes, that was my point. They will do it but they will charge what their time is worth. Not based on how easy it is.

          3. That makes sense that the vet is pricing so high to avoid people scheduling those services. Mine needs hers expressed very 3 weeks, and the groomers in the area don’t do it internally, but the vet techs do. I’m very very glad to pay the $12 instead of doing that task myself.

    10. $120 in San Francisco for a small dog, once a month. If your dog has “hair” that grows, they will definitely need regular grooms.

    12. we pay ~$60+ tip for a groom (nail trim, bath, brush, trim paw pads, ears, tail) for our 20lb. mix. He doesn’t technically? need to be groomed but his long toe fur bugs him & he’ll start tripping on his tail otherwise lol. If we just did nails i think it’s around $10 – money well spent, he has black nails so I prefer letting the pros do it.

      Biggest tip, especially if you have a breed that will need haircuts, get them started early & often so they’re used to handling.

  18. In the thread above about thank-you notes, several of you mentioned that your families are NYT fancy or similar. Can you share more about what it was like growing up in a family like that? I am fascinated by this kind of elite childhood that is so different from my own.

    Did you ever get to a point in your adult life where it hit you that you were elite/different from everyone else? Do most of your friends and relationships come from a similar social class? How much of it is about class and connections and how much is about true wealth?

      1. People who have wedding announcements in the NYT. The groom is completing a writer’s workshop at this esteemed one in Iowa. The bride works at a fashion boutique/boutique finance firm. The bride’s mother founded General Electric and the groom’s father is a former ambassador to Lithuania and bronze medalist in skeet shooting. Beyonce and Margaret Thatcher attended the small wedding.

    2. I don’t think having your wedding announcement in the NYT makes you that fancy. My parents’ was, and they were pretty normal middle-upper middle class people who were frugal and drove old cars and had a pretty small house. At least in their day (maybe still?) it was more about education than money, so if you went to good colleges and/or had advanced degrees you could have your announcement in the Times pretty easily. It didn’t take serious money or social connections. My parents paid for my private college in full, which was a huge gift I’m very grateful for, but otherwise I had a very typical Midwest suburban childhood and went I went to an elite coastal college I was substantially less fancy and socially connected than most.

      1. yea i know A LOT of people who’ve had wedding announcements in the NYT. anyone can submit.

      2. Yeah, I like reading the wedding announcements and I think they’ve been making an effort to be more inclusive with “regular” people.

      3. Also, self-promotion is SO not a thing in my WASPy world, that a NYT wedding announcement would be seen as crass

        1. My grandparents’ wedding is actually profiled in an etiquette book; however, it’s embarrassing to pitch yourself to a newspaper…

    3. My family is old money. My childhood was normal as heck, honestly the biggest tell that we weren’t normal was the food. We ate a variety of global foods. I had the realization we were different in first grade when I brought in left over pierogies for lunch. Travel was another thing that was different. I don’t have access to the family money, my job is all about doing good.

      All my really good friends are exactly like me they all come from dysfunctional really wealthy families but have to fend for themselves. We all have weird cheap apartments with fancy antiques we’ve thrifted.

      1. Oh the nannies too! Except we never called them nannies, we called them babysitters. My parents didn’t raise me, my babysitter did! She’s a doctor now and I’m very happy for her.

      2. Adding again! Our family summer house is a log cabin that’s like 109 years old and basically off grid. Most of the cottages/hunt cabins/lodges I went to were the same. Large old log buildings with very nice furniture. Modern glass cottages with all the gadgets aren’t really a thing.

        1. Yes! I had the long post below (12:50 anon) and my family’s vacation house is an 1895 Victorian in a beach town. Gorgeous house (wrap around porch, original hardwood floors and stained glass windows), but it’s old and not updated and it’s meant to be lived in!

          Sandy feet are expected. It’s also expected that everyone is out of the house doing things all day. The yacht club is sadly changing but my childhood (and my mom’s, and my grandmother’s) was old school: rustic facilities, very limited staff (members expected to put in the work), chock full of activities for kids of all ages and adults): sailing, tennis, swimming, social activities.

          Sure everyone there owns a several million dollar beach house, but if the clubhouse needs to be painted or the dock needs some boards replaced, of course it’s going to be done by the club members during a work weekend.

    4. there is such a wide range with this and also regional differences. i was with a friend the other week who has a 7th grader. he was invited to weekend at a family’s friend’s estate. they asked if my friend was ok with the nanny/security guard driving them to the estate and flying home on their plane. my friend said that the kid is actually pretty nice and that the mom seems down to earth, until statements like that come out of her mouth.

    5. I’m the OP of the thank you note thread, and while the other poster is probably right that lots of regular-ish people’s weddings are in the NYT, my bf’s family is the kind of old-money fancy I think you’re referring to. We’ve talked about our vastly different upbringings a bunch, and here were the differences that were most interesting to me:
      – He had a live-in nanny who he was closer with than his mom. His nanny went to parent-teacher conferences, made all their food, and generally did most of the parenting. The nanny’s partner also lived with them.
      – He went to a “hill school” (super fancy private school) in nyc. We drove past recently when we were in town, and it was huge and SO much nicer than even my private college.
      – The way he describes the social scene in high school closely resembles gossip girl.
      – He went to summer camp all summer every summer.
      – He speaks three languages. Everyone in his family speaks at least two.
      – His family lives relatively modestly–they drive Hondas and live in normal-looking houses.
      – His dad had a privilege talk with him in high school, wherein his dad basically said “you’re one of the luckiest people to have ever been born.” Before that he thought they were upper-middle-class.
      – He’s made a point to be friends with people from all walks of life, and has close friends from vastly different backgrounds from him. He’s said that about half of his girlfriends have been from backgrounds similar to him. All of his adulthood friends are non-rich people.
      – Honestly the biggest difference I’ve noticed when meeting his family and childhood friends is that they’re exceptionally good hosts and conversationalists.

      And in case you’re wondering (because I know I would be) we met on Tinder, haha.

      1. oh! and like the poster above said, he also refers to his nanny as his “babysitter.”

    6. I grew up in a family that was WASPy and at one time wealthy, though my parents were both teachers so I did not grow up wealthy but we were still culturally WASPy and my extended family was wealthy.

      Quite literally no one in at least 3 generations (depending on the side of the family) went to public school. We all went to private prep school from preK through college. While I knew public school was the default, I’m still surprised with how popular it is with wealthy people. Also, it’s a culture where education is valued above all else so the concept of having the money for private school and not sending a kid there is unfathomable because even if you only have two pennies to rub together, of course you’re using one of those pennies to send your kids to a better school. Scholarships to these schools are plentiful, you just have to know where to look.

      Just little things about public school are foreign to me (and it’s not that they don’t require uniforms or chapel or Latin class), like class sizes! I grew up in a school where lower school was 2 sections of 15-16, middle school was 80 kids per grade and each class was 12-15, and upper school was similar class sizes but a grade of 110. I knew our grades were smaller than public school, but I was surprised to learn how big public school classes are, even in good districts. I expected the curriculum to be different, but I’m still a little surprised when friends (from good districts) had assigned reading in high school that we had in 7th grade. My school was also really focused on character development, the school’s mission statement and publicly posted values both focused on character development and were referenced, discussed, and taught constantly. There was no tolerance for misbehavior or not following these values. It was a rigorous, challenging but also very supportive environment. I’m still in awe at the way out teachers could really push us and how hard they could be on us, but also how loving and supportive they were.

      I knew that most people don’t grow up playing tennis, golf, sailing, and skiing but I’m still surprised when someone who grew up well off can’t play tennis – a cheap racquet costs $20 and there are free public courts. The other sports have high costs, but tennis is virtually free. I have a friend, who I love but is a bit snobby, and she never played tennis til we were roommates in our 20s. I’m like how can you be snobby if you never learned to play tennis?! I never even competed in any of those sports, but they’re just seen as a life skill that everyone should be able to hold their own in. We also all took cotillion classes, I have attended exactly one non-wedding black tie event and I felt perfectly comfortable in that setting (embarrassingly, my date did my know what to do and a few women in my group didn’t know the correct etiquette when wearing white gloves… they attend these events annually, I had to buy gloves specifically for the event and yet I knew when to remove them and they did not…).

      I rowed in high school and college, and where I’m from it’s a popular sport so almost all schools (public, private, and parochial) have teams. People act like it’s a very wealthy sport, and they’re shocked that I explain that my boathouse dues as an adult are $300 / year – it’s cheaper than a gym!

      I think people are often surprised about how diverse my background is. I found that private school was super diverse socioeconomically – we had the extremely wealthy, the middle class kids like me, and a lot of really impoverished families. When I was a student it wasn’t super racially diverse (but honestly more racially diverse than the school district I did live in!), but now it is. I know way more about world religions than probably any of my non-high school friends. We had several units, two whole semesters (one in history and one in religion) on it, and also chapel services on world religions.

      I think a lot of people assume folks will be spoiled based on their background, but IME there’s a huge focus on not having spoiled kids: sure, every kid had a car in high school but not a single kid in my 40k a year school had a new car. Everyone was raised with the understanding that working hard was the most important trait, always doing the right thing was the expectation (and the school and parents came down hard if that wasn’t the case), and that you’re not better than anyone else. It was very much a “to whom much is given, much will be expected” situation. My school was really focused on character development, it was just as important as the formal education we were getting. Also, if you can’t tell from here I have a great love for my school. I went there for 14 years and was the 3rd generation in my family to go there. It was as instrumental in molding me to be the person I am today as my family was. I’m also really proud that so many of my classmates went into helping professions. Of course, there are people chasing the $$$$ in ibanking and PE, but quite a lot are teachers (so many teachers, actually), in healthcare, in research, or public service. I am sure it’s partially because so many came from family money that they are less worried about making a lot themselves, but a lot I think took the “to whom much is given, much will be expected” to heart.

      My family is very warm and very close, even though my grandmother’s picture is probably in the dictionary next to the word WASP. I think we’re very normal – some of my relatives are absurdly wealthy and some are barely making ends meet even though we were all pretty much raised the same way. We joke and tease each other and enjoy spending time together. We just don’t share emotions :) (kidding, but barely)

      1. Oh also – my friends are from all states of life and all walks of life. My 2 best friends from high school include a woman who grew up on an estate and a woman who grew up across the street from a burnt out drug den.

        I have quite a few college friends who grew up way wealthier than I did, but who had the normal public school no country club lifestyle and they wear cocktail attire to black tie weddings. I also have friends from college who only went to college because they got full rides due to demonstrated need and / or Pell Grants.

        Adult friends are similarly a grab bag.

        J work in government and have a level of public interaction. I truly feel just as comfortable with the most underserved communities and with a visiting member of Congress – and there are days when I’m spending my morning figuring out how to get services for a member of the public who is illiterate and has had all utilities shut off and in the afternoon I’m briefing the mayor or a Congressional delegation.

      2. I went to a similar private school and I remember being surprised when I started university, taking English lit classes and was assigned the same books I’d already read in the ninth grade.

        1. Yes! My high school friends and I all agreed that college was academically easier than high school. Everyone says college teaches you how to think and how to write, but we had already been through that.

      3. Are you from the mid-Atlantic? This reads like Philadelphia WASP culture, not Boston WASP culture.

        1. I love that we can identify subcultures of WASP culture. But yes, you’re correct.

      4. I really love this kind of school culture. I know different kids have different needs, but this is the amount of structure, support, and engagement that works for me.

        1. I’ve said it before on this board that I’m crushed that I won’t be able to send my kid to the type of school that I went to and that even really good public schools don’t compare and got a lot of flack for it, but it’s just not the same

    7. I grew up in a wealthy, WASPy family and went to an elite prep school.

      Both my family (and the families around mine) and my school were dedicated on instilling me to be of good moral standing, to have a strong work ethic, and to value education.

      Though it’s apocryphal, I do think there’s a lot of truth in the saying that “the battle of Waterloo was won on the playing fields of Eton”. For better or worse, an elite school is just a different environment: the expectations are high but you’re also set up to meet them, you learn a lot of “intangibles”, there is very little tolerance for not meeting expectations (academically or behaviorally).

      While my school was, I’m sure, way less exacting than Eton in the 1800s, it was still quite exacting both academically and in terms of our character and comportment.

    8. Fascinating, from someone who’s family was ‘nyt fancy’ like 3 and 4 generations ago. I think the cousins-in-law would classify still? or the next tier below that.

      My grandmother thought she was still nyt fancy: she was raised by nannies and spent summers at her grandmothers upstate ny mansion, private country clubs, Private schools, and 1 year of small women’s college before getting her mrs. degree. I’m pretty sure she and her sister had society debuts. One of her children married back into that kind of family. They have the lake house and boat, summer house, extravagant vacations, country clubs and golf club memberships, luxury cars for the kids and parents still bankroll their lifestyles and give them the foot in the door.

      We’re the poor side of the fam by comparison, upper class that married into a solidly working class family. Public schools, Ford cars that got used until they fell apart, vacation was road trips (usually when the family car fell apart). I have a very comfortable lifestyle now and proud of having my career and the life I do – even if I don’t holiday on an island villa.

    9. I’m the formal rural hick with super wealthy friends. I think it was because I went to a private college that gave me a full financial aid package with zero parent contribution, and that was my only ticket out of the sticks. That college let in lots of rich kids who didn’t otherwise have the gpa/test scores to get into the top universities, but as long as their parents paid the tuition and made a nice donation, they could attend.

      One of my wealthiest friends married a guy from her same social class and she has been a housewife since day one. Not like a tradwife. She doesn’t do any housework. She has kids, and they are absolutely great kids, but they also each have their own nanny.

      Despite all of this, she is one of the dearest people I know.

  19. How do you intervene when an older kid is playing a little too rough with your young kid?

    2. Who is the older kid? Like a stranger at a kids’ museum? A neighbor? A friend? What do you mean “a little too rough?” Is it objectively bad behavior, or just something your kid doesn’t like? Depends a lot on the context, I think.

      1. I don’t think there’s a post or today on the moms page. Or if there is, it went up really late.

      3. It’s almost like 80% of women in this site’s target demographic have children! Crazy!

        2. Lady, chill out. It is different from normal today and that’s why I asked. And lo and behold, there is a reason why! I’m not trying to attack you.

          1. Ok. No one is attacking you either, so maybe you’re the one who could use some chill.

  20. Has anyone ever given up on their marriage without getting divorced? How did it go? Husband is a good dad, a good partner in managing the household, and a pleasant roommate. He is totally checked out and disconnected as a husband – no gardening for 6+ years, no hugs, kisses, cuddles, compliments, kind words, etc. He will do date nights if I initiate and plan everything. He’s not particularly interested in watching TV together on the couch with me after the kids are in bed or any other low key joint activities. I’ve tried to talk to him about it on many occasions. He says he’s sorry. He has no explanation. Nothing ever changes. He was completely different before the kids. I’d like to drop my end of this rope – stop trying to find ways to connect, stop hoping he will ever change. Is this a recipe for misery or is there a way to compartmentalize? I don’t want to be consumed by resentment, but I really don’t want to get a divorce and upend my kids lives either.

    1. i think if that is what you decide you want to do, you can. and a good therapist will be able to help you with this. if you have a daughter, what would you tell her to do in this situation? or what would you tell a friend? however i will say i have a number of friends whose parents got divorced once their youngest was in college and while in some ways it was easier for them on a day to day basis, it was also hard bc they felt like they didnt see it coming and then didn’t really have a home they were accustomed to. any chance your husband is depressed or something? how old are your kids? there is such a thing as post partum depression in men

      1. Kids are early elementary and late elementary aged. Husband could be depressed but I don’t think he would ever get screened/treated. Year ago, I tried to get him to go talk to a therapist after he experienced a traumatic event, and he wouldn’t.

    2. Are you sure your husband is straight? It seems awfully cruel to deny yourself love and human connection. You deserve more.

        1. I didn’t accuse him of cheating! Your story sounds very familiar to my BFF, turns out she was a non-consenting beard.

          1. Oh, I know! I was just covering my bases. I have wondered, honestly. Not because of any particular signs but in wracking my brain for some explanation for our situation. He was very enthusiastic about me in the beginning though, so I don’t know.

        2. Been there, and also wondered. Still don’t really know. Mine also refused counseling of any kind. But was a terrific partner, otherwise. We had a lot of fun together. He was also enthusiastic in the beginning.

          I guess life is just tricky. I’m sorry you’re navigating this.

          1. I read somewhere that if it occurs to you that your husband is gay, he probably is. I’m still pretty sure my first husband was/is, although he never came out even to himself that I know of.

        3. There are also medical conditions that tank testosterone and that medicine misses on a normal annual check up especially with men who downplay symptoms or who would never admit to relevant ones.

          1. Ok, so why is it OP’s burden to figure out whether that’s why her husband has decided to effectively end their relationship? She has communicated to him several times, he says “I’m sorry” and that’s it. I think she should believe him that he will do nothing to change it.

          2. I didn’t say it was OP’s burden? I just thought it was a huge leap to imagine that he’s just gay now.

    3. I got divorced and considered the same thing you’re considering before pulling the trigger on divorce. I think my ex would have gone for it. Separated but cohabitating.

      I am SO GLAD I got divorced! Being free is worth a lot, and living with someone who doesn’t really like you is daily torture. You deserve better, OP.

      1. Sounds like your husband quiet quit the marriage a long time ago. You deserve to be happy, so think about whether what you’re describing would make you happy or just make you less annoyed that you’re trying and he isn’t. If it were me, I think opting out would help for a little while, but would ultimately make me sadder.

        If he is all the things you said – a good father, good partner for managing the household, good roommate – then it sounds like he has the potential to be an excellent ex-husband.

    4. Don’t teach your kids that this is an acceptable relationship! Also, you as a human being deserve better.

    5. I’m not married and don’t have kids but I would suggest couples therapy and if he’s not open to that, I’d hire a divorce attorney. I couldn’t imagine living like that for 6 years and I think this does more damage to the kids than you realize. I think it’s good for kids to see an example of a healthy marriage where the couple is affectionate and prioritizes each other and if that is not the situation, they do the healthy thing and get divorced. I’m sure your kids notice something is up with your marriage already. I’m not saying it’s easy and I recognize that I’m not married and don’t have kids but most adults I’ve spoken to knew their parents marriage was over long before they told them.

    6. You can get divorced without upending the kids lives- amicable co-parenting is a thing that is possible. But figuring out how that would work will take a good therapist and possibly good lawyers/mediators.

    7. Oh, girl. I’ve been there. Get the divorce. The other side is so much better, and it sounds like you could probably manage to get a divorce and stay friends in this situation. That’s what we did, and everyone is truly happier than they were before the divorce. I’m not saying it is easy. Divorce is very sad, but it doesn’t have to be some sort of Greek tragedy. You wouldn’t want your kids to stay, so don’t teach them that they should.

    8. I am in pretty much the same situation as OP. Though in my marriage I am the one who fell out of love with my husband, no interest in gardening with him and cringes whenever he touches me, so he doesn’t anymore. We are friends/roommates. He was a terrible husband during the eight years before we had our kid. I should have left him then but felt I couldn’t due to family expectations, etc. Through couples therapy he is starting to understand the pain he caused and he has stepped up in doing house chores and childcare. He is a great dad and I am glad to have him step in whenever I need a break. I could leave him now but I don’t think solo parenting would improve my quality of life. So I go through the motions, plan date nights and pretend we are a happy couple, but it will take a long time for me to get to a place where I can forgive him for the past.

    9. I tried to do this for years and OMG it was such a relief to drop the rope and get on with my life. Your kids will get over it — if he’s a good dad now, he’ll be a good divorced dad so you have that going for you at least.

    10. I got divorced after 16 years from a man I viewed as a roommate/friend. We didn’t have kids so it was more straightforward. It was hard but it was one of the best decisions of my life. We had a good marriage for much of the time so I don’t regret that but we drifted apart. Divorcing gave us both a chance to pursue our own happiness. I understand not wanting to upend your kids’ lives but they deserve to have happy parents. I do research in this area and can tell you that kids sense when their parents’ marriage is not on firm footing. Only you can make the best decision for you and a therapist can help with this.

    11. please get divorced.
      there’s no way you want to stay married once the kids are grown up/out of the house right? It’s so much better to rip the bandaid off now. I grew up in a house like you’re describing and it took SO much work to unlearn & relearn what a healthy, loving, affectionate relationship can & should be. Obviously I can’t say what having two households in high school would’ve been like, but the ‘you’re an adult on your own now plus your parents are divorcing and selling your childhood home’ is pretty untethering.

  21. Re: Thank you notes

    I read this book https://www.amazon.com/Simple-Act-Gratitude-Learning-Changed-ebook/dp/B007FSHMO2/ref=sr_1_1?dib=eyJ2IjoiMSJ9.Bcvwo5aeVBgs-lm72dHhhKORbjDavh5dZDryLk1xrU70KFQByNJXbp2xcvjfS7Ib.3FGrAd-7I8xL2gwyVWAJzbTdyXzVxGYYykGgsAuW_zU&dib_tag=se&hvadid=695299765820&hvdev=c&hvexpln=67&hvlocphy=9007818&hvnetw=g&hvocijid=17225328734455333559–&hvqmt=e&hvrand=17225328734455333559&hvtargid=kwd-330558985181&hydadcr=22569_13493349&keywords=365+thank+yous+by+john+kralik&qid=1725467584&sr=8-1 several years ago and it inspired me to start writing hand written notes to people I knew. I didn’t write thank you notes, neccessarily, but some were, and some were just breezey “thinking of you after all these years” type things. Lots of people I never heard back from, but it did put me back in touch on a more consistent basis with my high school French teacher (one of the most glamourous women I know), a former college roommate, a high school friend, and one of my cousins. I also heard back from at least a dozen more people. I didn’t write 365 notes, I probably wrote 50 or so. It’s a practice I try to keep up, although this past few years it’s been more like 10 a year or so. It’s been interesting, I need to have no expectation of how my notes are received or if I will even every know it was received at all. But it’s been a blessing in my life.

    2. A family member is really good about this and it genuinely makes me feel more connected to her when I otherwise might not. It also reminds me of how many relationships from my childhood revolved around handwritten notes – long update notes between camp friends, gushing love letters exchanged with long distance (and sometimes local) boyfriends, genuine thank you notes and holiday cards to grandparents, notes passed between friends in the school hallways, etc.

    3. I got a box of pretty postcards and when i think of fondly of a friend, see something they would like, or after meeting up with them I send little “thinking of you” notes in the mail. I think people really love it and it makes me feel happy too! Eg a friend and I both like reading so if i finish a book i think she would like i pop the name/author on a postcard rather than a text. Happy mail is fun!

      1. I like your framing of happy mail. I’m the person who said I wouldn’t want a thank you note, even though I also like to send and receive birthday cards and just because notes, and it just clicked for me that it’s because I think of them as the opposite of happy mail. I just can’t shake the association with being forced to send them as a child or to people I’m forced to suck up to as an adult. Anyone I’m genuinely thankful to gets told in person, text or phone call, so I think of notes as formal obligations to people I don’t really like for things I’m not really very thankful for, not for someone I actually like (with the exception of formal occasions).

  22. I’m looking for a way to electronically organize and keep track of recipes I’m making. Ideally, I’d be able to write down the recipe and notes and mark days I’ve made it, perhaps add photos. Perhaps use it for meal planning as well. And search/catalog recipes I’ve made. Sort of like a private, easy to set up food blog? Does something like this exist? Do you keep track of what you’re cooking in any way?

    1. I use Paprika to store recipes from the internet. I can use the meal planner feature to list which meals I’m having which days, and when I go to a recipe it tells me the last time I used it. I admit I mostly use the app for storing recipes, but sometimes I’m “good” about recording meals.

      I mainly use the meal planning feature to populate a shopping list, so when I’m not that organized, I tend to skip it.

      1. And you can add your own pics to recipes if you like. I’ve mainly only done that when there isn’t already a pic on the internet recipe, or when I just enter my own recipe.

      2. I LOVE Paprika. It’s one of the few apps I pay for and it’s worth every penny.

    2. My sister made us one of those photo books with family recipes along with photos from the holidays. If the recipe is for stuffing, the photos are from Thanksgiving. It’s really nice to use the book to cook for holidays and see old photos of my family when we were kids.

    3. I use an app called Recipe Keeper. Allows import of recipes from web , photo, or you can type in. Allows you to add a picture and notes, tag multiple categories for each recipe, and scale the recipe up/down. It also has a meal planner and shopping list. Syncs across my laptop and phone. My mom and sister also use it and we can easily share recipes when we’re together.

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