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Frugal Friday’s Workwear Report: Sleeveless Ponte-Knit Sheath Dress

Our daily workwear reports suggest one piece of work-appropriate attire in a range of prices. Old Navy always has this great ponte knit sheath, which is a bestseller — but the trick is finding them when there are enough sizes in stock to recommend them to you guys. In three colors — black, a black/white stripe, and the pictured “botanical green” — there are a bunch of sizes in regular, tall, and petite. The sale colors, which are “flaming orange” and a gray/white stripe, only have lucky sizes available (no petites). There are also a few other options: long-sleeved, short-sleeved, plus-size, and maternity. The pictured style is $36.99 (sale colors $29.97) and comes in XS–XXL. Sleeveless Ponte-Knit Sheath Dress This post contains affiliate links and Corporette® may earn commissions for purchases made through links in this post. For more details see here. Thank you so much for your support! Seen a great piece you’d like to recommend? Please e-mail tps@corporette.com.

Sales of note for 12.5

And some of our latest threadjacks here at Corporette (reader questions and commentary) — see more here!

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346 Comments

  1. If you’ve been through IVF (with or without ICSI), please share your experience! We’ve been through our fertility workups and meet with our doctor next week to discuss results and options – however, given the extremely poor results of my husbands s*men analysis (normal bloodwork though), i am guessing this is the next stop on our journey.

    1. I think there’s quite a few people around here that have experience with IVF/ICSI (it seems that most IVF is in fact ICSI these days as it seems to be a “best practice” at most clinics, although there are some skeptics). You may also want to cross-post to the moms site to get success stories.

      I did 2 egg retrievals and 3 transfers, with success on the third — baby boy is 6 months old. Basically all of our numbers “looked great” so the failure of the first retrieval/two transfers was kind of a surprise. For the third, my protocol involved a whole lot of non-standard treatment, including a whole battery of medications to deal with autoimmune issues that were theorized to be preventing pregnancy (I do not otherwise have diagnosed autoimmune issues). Was pretty out there, but hey – it worked.

      It is both not as hard as you think and really, really hard in ways you might not expect (and that I think doctors don’t always do a good job preparing you for). People tend to treat IVF as a “sure thing” — I had people congratulate me when I mentioned that I was undergoing the procedures, or tell me that they KNEW an embryo transfer would work. It doesn’t always work.

      And “not working” can mean failure at many different parts of the process – failure to respond to the drugs to get enough eggs, failure to fertilize, failure to grow to the necessary stage of development, failure to have the correct number of chromosomes, failure to implant, failure to grow after implantation. Success rates are usually only talking about the last two, and assuming you get viable embryos.

      I don’t say this to be a downer, but just to highlight that by far the worst part of the process was all of the opportunities for it to go wrong, and the waiting and the uncertainty. The shots were no big thing, although a few medications were quite uncomfortable. Egg retrieval caused a few days of discomfort and bloating but nothing extreme (I avoided OHSS). It’s a big time commitment with all the monitoring and scheduling and very uncertain, so it can be tricky with your job.

      I always recommend the reddit infertility sub, and I’ll do it again here – they have great wikis, data on success rates and none of that crappy “baby dust” woo woo you find elsewhere.

      Best of luck – this is really hard.

    2. I’ve done the egg-freezing half, which is the drugs and retrieval portion – what questions do you have?

    5. I’m currently 29 weeks pregnant after IVF due to low sperm count. Happy to answer any specific questions you have.

    6. I am pregnant with our second, both were as a result of IVF with ICSI. It is not a walk in the park, but the success rates are great and it is so worth it. As soon as I had my first baby I knew I would have done it a thousand times over. Be prepared for a billion doctors appointments, constant bloodwork and ultrasounds, a huge box of fertility drugs and accessories in your house, your husband to give you shots possibly every night for weeks, and waiting for results for periods of time that seem unbearable. And keep trying. And then eventually, fingers crossed, rejoice. Good luck!

    7. IVF baby to be born in August. I thought I would have a really hard time injecting myself, but sometimes all you need is proper motivation :). One major logistical issue is that you go to the doctor for monitoring a lot for about 2 weeks while you’re growing eggs (right before retrieval). I was lucky enough that my clinic had 7:30am appointments at a clinic about halfway between my work and home, but definitely think about how you’re going to handle this. Also, the timing of retrieval/ transfer is variable. (I semi-screwed a co-worker when my transfer was 2 days later than I thought it would be.) Ask a lot of questions so you can get a sense of the timing. Also, in my case, at least, there were a lot of ups and downs. We had a lot of follicles, 14 eggs, and 11 fertilized eggs. Then 10 of them died. We ended up with 1 viable fertilized egg, who fortunately implanted and will be born next month. Good luck!

    8. Thanks, all, for the responses!

      If insurance did not cover, what were your costs? My insurance doesnt, but my husband’s does, so i plan to switch at the next open enrollment period.

      Anyone self-inject? My husband would have a hard time with this, and i also travel for work fairly often. Fortunately, i have a good amount of control over when my trips will be so i can schedule around bloodwork, scans, etc, but will need to inject myself on travel.

      Did you give your boss a general heads up? I’m fortunate to work from home so scheduling will be easier, but i want to be sure i’m not unavailable frequently with no explanation.

      1. 15k ish. Nearly everyone self injects it actually isn’t that hard at all. Don’t plan to be traveling though. You need to be in the office frequently for monitoring.

      3. I did self inject and after a few tries, it was fine. I traveled and was able to continue my injections while traveling.

        I did not give my boss a heads up. I was frustrated enough about not being pregnant that I didn’t need someone else asking me when it was going to happen. I also don’t feel that my choice to conceive is any of my boss’s business until it may impact my work.

      4. You need to be in town while you’re on the drugs and being monitored. My monitoring was daily or every other day for 2.5 weeks or so of each cycle (did 3). My doctor’s office was open 6-9am so I didn’t really miss work except for the day of retrieval, which wasn’t known until it’s scheduled a day or two before.

        Cost was about $45k for the 3 cycles, two of which were failed cycles. This is retrieval only – not implantation. I was using a lot of drugs, which was the driver of these costs.

        I self injected everything except the trigger shots, which were intramuscular in my buttocks. You can self inject those but the IM ones freaked me out for some reason. For those, I hired one of the fertility nurses for one ($150) and had a nurse friend do the other for free.

      5. I did all of my own subcutaneous injections for retrieval. The hcg trigger shot to the thigh muscle hurt like heck. I believe for transfer more hcg shots are required. I don’t know that I would do those myself on the daily. Apparently it hurts less in the butt, but I can’t stick myself there!

    9. Been down this path and have twin 9 year olds. With some distance from the experience, it now feels like it was next to nothing. I remember it being emotional at the time. I gave myself the injections and that seemed bad at the time, but worth the outcome. I remember the variability of appointments and needing to be ready to switch up my schedule at a moment’s notice. I also remember a lot of bloating from the drugs – so much so that I needed to buy a few new skirts to get me through. We conceived on the first round. That also brought up the question of what to do with the remaining fertilized eggs.

    10. You will get good information here on the technical issues (which I understand have come a long way since I did IVF almost 10 years ago), but I do want to put in a plug for examining other options as well.

      The Hubs and I looked seriously at adoption (as in: investigated agencies, got the papers and started filling them out, began a profile and started pulling together photos and other materials for it) before trying IVF. It helped me a lot during the IVF process to know that there was another option if IVF did not work out and to know that I had a plan in place when I miscarried.

      And, in retrospect, while I do not regret trying IVF, I probably would go directly to adoption if I could do it over. I do feel that we wasted well over a year and over $20K (my IVF was completely uninsured and note that I took only a fraction of the usual drugs because I was a borderline hyperresponder) for a procedure that was, at best, a 40% chance of becoming parents as opposed to adoption where we had a 100% chance of becoming parents. I also remain concerned about the long-term impacts of IVF on womens’ health (which are somewhat unknown); I have one friend who has had serious issues as a result of IVF procedures, none of which resulted in a live birth.

      YMMV, but I believe in full disclosure so that you can make your best choices.

        1. her point is that if adoption is successful – there is a 100% chance that yes, you will receive a live human.

          all the fertility stuff – no.

      2. Omg it’s not full information to share your paranoid non science based musings about risk. She should talk to her doctor. Sorry you’re bitter.

        1. It’s not “paranoid non science based musings” to say that the long term impacts of IVF are unknown. Do a full search of the medical literature and read it. There are relatively few studies on the long-term effects of ovarian stimulation, most deal with median years since treatment at the five to fifteen year points (which is not that long a term), and many of them involve small samples or otherwise are not rigorous, so that the validity of their conclusions is at issue.

          Scientists do not know. Hence “unknown”.

      3. She has a point about unknown effects.

        For this reason, I didn’t want to be an egg donor even though I give blood all the time.

          1. Right.

            Pumping chemicals into your body in your 20s might have effects when you want to have your own kids later. Or just on you later, kids or not. Donating blood is similar to what guys do when they donate . . . stuff. No lingering effects.

            But the $ paid for eggs is staggering. I really wanted the $ but the what-iffs made me not do it.

        2. I agree to an extent about the unknown side-effects. Everyone must make their own choice, but given the hormones you are pumping into your body for these procedures, I think it’s reasonable to consider what, if any, long term impact there may be.

    11. I’m 21 weeks pregnant with an IVF baby and feel so grateful that it only took one retrieval/FET (we are completely out of pocket – total cost including meds came out to about $20K). I had had one m/c and one chemical pregnancy, and given my age (39 at the time), I didn’t feel up to the less invasive/less $$ options when I knew that IVF with PGS probably gave me my best chance at a live birth with a healthy baby. The shots were no big deal for me, mostly because I had already gone through a round of egg freezing a few years earlier (saving those eggs for #2) and was accustomed to them. I self injected without any trouble. However, I did not have to do the PIO shots (which are in the hip/upper buttocks) which I think would have been harder to do myself (my doc prescribed the suppositories). In the end, I’m grateful that science gave me this opportunity but the money still makes me wince.

    12. You can do it. IVF was a big hurdle for me mentally, but I’m glad I got over it. We have unexplained infertility (though a later test- ERA- found a displaced window of implantation so maybe progesterone resistance?). I was a poor responder, so we ended up doing 5 retrievals- 1 with fresh transfer of 2 blasts (fail), then 4 with freezing and PGS testing. The first frozen transfer worked and I am now entering 3rd trimester with a baby boy – I still have a hard time believing it. We also have 4 genetically normal embryos frozen, which makes me hopeful for #2 (since I will probably be 39-40 when we are ready for that).

      As others have said, the shots and the monitoring appointments you get used to, but it is such an emotional rollercoaster. I was not expecting it to be so tough in that way. I ended up going on Zoloft for the last 2 months prior to this transfer, which helped a lot. Also saw a therapist specializing in infertility.

      This is tough but you can do it. The moment I saw the heartbeat on ultrasound at 6 weeks, I knew it would be worth it.

      Good luck!

    13. Late response, but: We did seven egg retrievals and six embryo transfers (both fresh and frozen, the last 3 PGS tested), and none of them worked. At that point, we decided to throw in the towel, and are considering adoption. It’s not clear why none of the embryos implanted; I suspect it relates to auto-immune issues that I have, but the science in that area is not very well-developed. The emotional impact was much more difficult than any of the physical stuff for me (I did the shots myself, and they weren’t really a big deal) and was ultimately the reason we decided to stop. I don’t share this to discourage you, but only to contribute to the range of experiences.

      1. Even later response to Agent99 – If you want to talk about adoption, I am the second generation in my family to add children that way and happy to connect on or offline.

    14. You can do it! Our 2 and a half year old is an IVF baby. We got lucky on the first round. (Not so lucky trying for a second but it’s much more liveable having one). The shots / medical part are not bad at all. The stress of being uncertain about whether you’ll become a parent was the hardest part.

  2. I have a similar Old Navy dress and considering I bought it for $15, it’s been pretty great. It’s not the most luxurious fabric but the cut is nice and it’s comfy.

    1. I’ve been living in ON ponte dresses all summer. They are perfect summer workhorse dresses.

      Be aware that the dye will run in the wash, though.

      1. Does it fade quickly? I wash everything on cold and I absolutely plan on washing this only with darks, but if I wear it once a week, is it gonna look dark grey in a few months?

        1. I haven’t noticed distinct fading — I wash my darks on delicate, with woolite for darks, no dryer.

          I suspect they just didn’t give the fabric the proper rinsing at the factory before making it into dresses.

        2. Only my burgundy one had dye run in the wash, the other ones were fine. It did turn a few things pink though.

    2. I’ve been living in the ON swing dresses + a thin braided belt. Too hot to wear anything more!

    3. I like this dress a lot. I haven’t shopped at ON much at all in the last few years, but I might start if this is representative.

      Side note: why does their size chart not include hip measurements? That’s a pretty key part of dress sizes!

    4. Is there any chance this dress could work for a pear shape? I could use a few cheap dresses to get me through some weight fluctuation, but without hip measurements I’m shooting in the dark.

      1. The Old Navy swing dresses are good for that! I’ve lost 18 lbs this summer and am still wearing my ON dresses. They’re just swingier through the middle now.

        1. I love the swing dresses for casual, but they don’t quite cut it for work in my case. The shift style looks like I could wear it to the office without getting raised eyebrows!

    5. I wish these worked for me. I am only 5’8″ but they are way too short and just never look good.

    6. I also love Old Navy Ponte (and their jersey swing dresses are perfect for summer). I find the swing dresses long enough for me (5’6, all legs) in a regular size, but do tall in the shifts and the sheaths. Medium works (size 10), even with my hips.

    7. This dress looks promising! I’m going to stop by ON after work. I haven’t shopped there in…a decade? My sister loves ON, but she’s into fast fashion clothes that fall apart. Other than the dye issue, how do these dresses hold up?

      1. ON has creeped back into my wardrobe in the past year after not wearing it since the ’90s. Everything I’ve bought (shorts, chinos, assorted basic shirts, workout clothings) have washed up really well.

    8. I love this dress, and it is very fruegel for work. It also passes my “Frank” test, meaning that he will NOT be able to see anything, which is fine by me! YAY for Fruegel Friday’s!

      I hope the hive has a great weekend. I have been SOOOOOOOOOOOOO busy that I have not gotten my nose out of my computer all day, until now. I totaly missed all p’osts and will have to catch up this weekend. FOOEY! Have a great weekend!

  3. Any recs for a more structured knit top? I’m trying to find a replacement for a super old navy top I have from Banana. It’s roughly a normal tee shape (no peplums or ruffles or anything) but looks more structured as it has princess seams and pretty thick fabric (almost a ponte…might actually be ponte now I think of it).

    1. Banana has a bunch of more structured stuff right now. Search “blouses” and then look for the ponte or boucle shells. I’ll post the link to the one I have in navy/windowpane– I love it.

  4. I love this pic! I recently got some casual summer at Old Navy and was really pleased with the selection.

  5. What exactly does it mean for a moving company to be accredited by the Better Business Bureau and would you choose one that isn’t? We are moving to another apartment on the same floor as our current apartment in the same building. We live in a fairly nice building so I asked our leasing office to suggest a moving company and the company they suggested is not accredited by the BBB, though it is the least expensive quote I received. I’ve moved with professional movers many times, but usually to a new city where the price is a fixed rate as opposed to an hourly rate, where there is no incentive for the movers to be efficient.

    1. Honestly, I’d just to to uHaul where you can buy boxes and rend a dolly / box box on wheels / hand truck and just move things myself, especially if you are part of a “we.”

      1. +1 it seems weird to hire people to walk your stuff down a hallway. You can definitely do that yourself (unless you are disabled in which case just hire the cheapest option because this is a simple as a move gets.)

        1. OP here:bc we have some furniture that needs to be disassembled and reassembled, we have a newborn, I’m recovering from a c section and suffering from PPD. Saying someone shouldn’t hire a mover unless they are disabled seems unnecessary

          1. Not the previous poster.

            I am not going to define your disability status for you – that is for you and your doctor to do – but your situation does not sound that far off from disabled. Mental health problems are not magically less limiting than physical health problems.

            And hug – you are going through a lot.

          2. I would totally hire movers in your situation. I’m a single woman and always hire movers – even for a short move like this. It is so easy to hurt your back. I don’t abuse/use my friends as free labor. I can afford it and it improves my stress level and quality of life.

            Wishing you the best in your move. I hope your suffering improves soon.

      2. I was in a similar situation earlier this year (moving from a one bedroom to a two bedroom on the same floor). I found a moving company that charged per item/distance instead of an hourly rate, so I moved all the small stuff myself and used them just for big pieces of furniture (beds, heavy desks, etc. that I was too weak to move myself). I probably could have gotten by on my own/with my dad and brother’s help, but my husband has weak shoulders and I’m not that strong myself, so it was easier just to pay someone else to do it.

      3. I disagree with this. Hire a company if you want to hire a company. If you have no desire to do this yourself and can afford it, DO IT. My worst move was a short one to the next building over and I did it myself (+ 2 friends) because it looked easy and I wasn’t working at the time. I would never do it again. My time and my energy is worth way more. I would actually get more value out of sitting at a cafe drinking a latte while other people move than saving the money myself. Moving big boxes and furniture is no joke.

        1. +1 – and make sure they understand you really just need labor, not labor + truck.

    2. Oh, and I should add on-topic to your question: I don’t really think the BBB thing means anything. I am way more apt to trust online or friend reviews (with an appropriate grain of salt).

      1. OTOH, you don’t have to be a BBB member or accredited to have BBB complaints so you can check. Or check Angies list.

        My best-rated movers still broke stuff. It’s a move.

        The key thing is: are you doing your own packing for breakables? It isn’t hard to move stuff down a hall but if you pack sloppy, it’s easy to break stuff.

    4. honestly i wouldnt worry about the BBB thing. just make sure they have enough insurance.

    5. BBB means nothing. Look at your local Angie’s list recommended companies, and even Yelp. And talk to your neighbors/friends.

      1. Also check with a realtor you trust, even if you aren’t currently using him/her. They often get feedback from clients on banks, inspectors, movers, etc.

        1. This. My realtor’s recommended movers are not BBB accredited/on Angie’s List and do not have a website. Most of their work comes from referrals from realtors and agents and they serve those people and their clients well. They worked hard for me through three moves.

          My best tip for a local move is that providing McDonald’s sausage biscuits for breakfast, pizzas at the new place for lunch, and all the Diet Mountain Dew the crew can drink all day helps with motivation, as does six packs of Busch that are chilled in a cooler for the crew after they finish (especially if you tell them about the beer while they were loading the truck). Works every time!

          1. If you are in the SEUS: Bojangles is also a good pick for movers. Most of my moves have been chicken-fueled.

          3. I…what?

            No. If I’m hiring movers (and paying them, especially at an hourly rate), I’m not providing food. Water, yes. And a nice tip, sure. But no food or beer.

          4. You don’t have to. BUT your movers may all come in a truck together with your stuff in it. Depending on how hard it is to move from your street / loading doc to get lunch and then get parked again, it may be in your interest to go out and spend $20 to keep things moving. Plus, happy well-fed movers are probably better movers.

            Enlightened self-interest, yo.

      2. Second all this. Also in my area there are movers who specialize in small jobs and you might want to look into something like that for an in-the-same-building move.

  6. What are your guidelines for pant lengths?
    I see all kinds of (IMHO) bad decisions in professional settings. Am I being too judgemental? I was taught that the front of your pant should touch the vamp (front) of the shoe and only a small portion of the heel should be visible in the back. This leads to very limited outfits, in terms of pant-shoe coordination. How to do you ladies solve these types of problems? Am I being too old-fashioned?
    Cropped pants have me completely mystified (so I avoid for professional attire). Should they hit at the center-heel or above the heel? If they are too long, it loos like a pant-misfire, but too short verges on Capri-inappropriateness. Thoughts?

    1. ps – AND, how d0 you pair professional shoes with cropped pants? sorry for typos!

        1. Thank you EG! That is my first intuition – seems most elegant fit (flats & cropped). I see boots with ankle pants sometimes & the sliver of skin between boot & pant leg seems odd, somehow… but I am definitely not “au courant”

    2. One good thing in a pinch that she has done — black suit with slightly cropped pants and heels. Google meghan markle black suit and it should come up.

      Too tight / mid calf is not what you want in a shortened pants leg, esp for work.

    4. I’m mostly in agreement as to how you described regular-length trousers and shoes, though I might go an inch or so higher and be comfortable with it. For cropped or ankle pants, you are totally missing out because in my opinion the best part about them is I don’t have to worry about the shoes AT ALL. Flats? Check. Heels? Check. Loafers? Check. Boots? Check. They’re all the right match because the pant doesn’t even need to touch them. I don’t wear cropped pants generally (they just hit me wrong) but I swear by ankle pants for work.

      1. jwalk, catsocks, & anon,
        Thank you!!! Great thoughts and resources! I hadn’t thought about hem width (via youlookfab)… so much to consider! Great advice!

    5. You’re being way too restrictive in your views of pants. A lot of those “where the break is” rules just apply to menswear. My only rule is that my pants don’t drag on the ground. And I wear whatever shoe I feel like that looks right with my overall outfit.

      1. Scarlett,
        Thank you so much for your thoughtful reply! Many younger colleagues have expressed similar views – my comfort levels are ‘not up to speed’ – I’m delighted to have food for thought. I tend toward more formal fashion, in general.

    6. I just wrote a comment that disappeared entirely, so apologies if this becomes repetitive…

      I mostly agree with you on regular length pants, though I’d probably be comfortable going an inch or so higher. for cropped pants, you are totally missing out because you don’t need to worry about shoe coordination AT ALL. Flats, loafers, heels, boots, etc. all work with them, since they don’t go down far enough to even interact with your shoes. I don’t wear cropped pants, they just hit me wrong, but I swear by ankle pants for work.

      1. Yes, this. All my pants are ankle pants – I think longer pants look kind of strange honestly.

      2. Same here. I have one pair of full length pants and all the rest are ankle pants.

    7. Yes, you are being too judgemental.

      Ankle length pants are very popular now, as opposed to the basic straight leg length hem you refer to. These can range from mid to just above the ankle to much higher. Usually closer to the ankle is a bit more work appropriate, but honestly, what works and look decent varies wildly depending upon your shoe style, heel height, pant cuff width, waist height, body shape (ex pear vs. straight) and more. You will find various “rules” on blogs, but current fashion trends have thrown these to the wind.

      Search for youlookfab recs if you feel like you need some sort of guidepost, but even those are dated and she targets an older audience.

      it sounds like you are quite conservative. I would probably avoid cropped looks…. Agree with the other poster that too short or too tight is not a good work look unless you are in a creative industry, with heels and/or ankle straps, and wider volume fabrics.

      1. Anon,
        Thank you very much for your considered reply, and candor! I do tend to dress conservatively, as office requires. I am 39, if that helps :)

      2. I haven’t worn straight leg pants in three years. I actually packed all of mine away. I never see anyone wearing them at my work; everyone wears ankle pants with flats because we work on a huge office campus that requires lots of walking.

    8. It really probably depends on your office and your personal comfort level. My office is business casual so ankle length pants are totally fine and I wear them pretty much exclusively. The exception is for board meetings, but if I had a nicer pair as part of a suit, it would probably be fine.

      In my office, sleeveless shirts and open toed shoes are also totally fine, but I am not comfortable with it (and not to mention freezing most of the time), so I don’t wear those items to work. But others do and most people look fine and professional for our environment.

      For women, there are (frustratingly, perhaps) many different ways to look professional. But you have to find what works for your comfort level and body type.

      1. Thank you for such great thoughts! Every time I try in ankle pants I feel like I just accidentally shrank my regular pants in the wash :)
        I am quite tall and can’t decide if this is a mental barrier or if they really are fitting me incorrectly. Does it matter where the hem hits your ankle?
        Thanks so much ladies!

        1. Angie at You Look Fab says “If you are going to show your ankle, SHOW your ankle.” So I wear my ankle pants above the ankle.

    9. I’m exactly like you OP. I have never tried ankle pants – and one other wrinkle to throw in … how tapered/contoured to your leg or ankle should they be. I *think* they look better with pointed toes, and I can’t wear them, so I am super at a loss.

  8. I have 5 of these dresses, both the sleeveless and short sleeved. They’re fantastic. I’m going to order this dark green one!

  9. I’m struggling with some friendships lately. I’m in a group that meets regularly because we all share a hobby. Over the last few years, I’ve noticed the group dynamic shifting. The loudest people take over the conversation and it takes on a life of its own. There is a lot of focus on flaunting wealth, brand names, and expensive travel. Also, the focus is more and more on drinking excessively, which to me brings out the worst in everyone. And this group seems really focused on social media, like it matters more how our evening looks on Instagram than how it’s actually playing out!

    Writing this all down I know I need to just take a step back. But it’s hard because many of these people are much better on their own. It’s just something about the group dynamic that is unpleasant. Any advice?

    1. It sounds like they may be performing for each other. This may be too obvious, but do you want to opt out of the group hangs and just initiate plans individually with the people you like?

    2. It sounds like you may be falling victim to the Geek Social Fallacy that everyone must be included in all outings. Can you just invite people out one-on-one?

    3. I’d try to initial smaller activities with subsets of the group to break people out of their existing habits. If you find the loudest people are making it hard for you to enjoy your time together and you all always do the same type of things, schedule a small different activity with a few of the quieter people. If you’re afraid of it being awkward that you aren’t including everyone, make it something that you plausibly thought the larger group wouldn’t enjoy, or that’s difficult to do with more than a few people- Oh, Sally, George, and I decided to go to the candle making class this weekend since we had been talking about how we wanted to get into more crafts lately. Seats were limited, but if you’re interested we’ll pass on the info to you next time!

    4. I would definitely suggest that you get together for more one on ones with these friends, if that interests you, but I’d also note that if these people are otherwise lovely individuals, I think this is a symptom of society today and the impact of social media, particularly on people (and particularly on women) who are either suffering from lower self-esteem or other questioning of their life/life choices/status.

    5. I’ve seen this so many times with friendgroups. Idk what it is about groups. It seems like any time you get more than like 5 people together, toxic stuff starts happening. The drinking especially. Maybe because it’s hard to find stuff to do for a large-ish group that isn’t just hanging out at a bar?

      In addition to the suggestions above, plan some group outings that aren’t so alcohol-centric. There are tons of options in the summer – outdoor movies, plays, yoga in the vineyard, whatever. Bonus points for anything that shuts up the loud people. For nights they just want to drink, I suggest you take up a new exercise routine (you don’t actually have to do it) that requires you to get up early so sorry you turn into a pumpkin at 11 and can’t stay out all night putting up with their drunkenness.

  10. old navy q – I recently ordered two summer dresses and wow, they were both super high-waisted on me even in the tall size. do they generally run that way? I haven’t really shopped there for myself in years. they’ve closed all the stores near me so not really able to go try on.

    1. ON is not the place for consistency in sizing. Some pieces run ridiculously large, some are TTS, and there’s really not a lot of consistency between seasons. Just order a bunch and return the rest.

  11. Because I know how much y’all love deciphering dress codes, here’s a new one I just received for an evening conference event in LA — hot summer casual. Not sure what differentiates regular summer casual from hot summer casual, but it definitely made me laugh!

    Happy Friday!

    2. I specialize in frumpy summer casual. It consists of the shorts I normally wear gardening, a slightly stained tank top, a pony tail and liberal amounts of sweat (with runny mascara if it’s a special day).

    3. Like hot as in temperature or hot as in pretty? Because I find southern california to be chilly at night…

      1. It’s been insanely hot in LA lately. I’m sure it’s referring to the temperature.

        OP, I think this is a gracious way of them saying, “Hey, we know it’s been hot as b@lls lately, so wear what’s comfortable”

      2. I assumed hot as in temperature! I was planning a floral cotton dress and wedges, so it better not be “hot” hot, lol

    4. That would make me want to wear daisy dukes, white heeled sandals, a skimpy tee and red lipstick. I suspect that’s not what they’re after.

  12. Ladies, what do the men in your life do about hairloss? Husband is starting to find a lot of stray hair in the shower and would like to deal with it but is a bit adrift and I know nothing about this. Curious if the good advice this community has for lady concerns extends to male pattern baldness. To the extent it’s relevant, his hairline is receding but is otherwise super thick, so not a “thinning” issue. I think he would rather not take pills. Are any of the new “miracle” cures actually cures or just new B.S. in a different bottle?

        1. I tend to think most guys look better with hair, even a receding hairline. The Rock can definitely pull the shaved head look off, but most guys I know who have done this in real life looked better before they shaved it all off, even if they were quite obviously balding.

        2. My husband does the close crop (dated, but think of the admiral on the JAG TV show). Works and makes a buffer b/w his skin and hats (mandatory, but can have scratchy seems, something we haired people have the privilege of being oblivious to).

          At any rates, he will need different hats for each season and get cold very easily.

          1. My husband has MPB and does the close crop too (electric clippers as close as they get) with a thick beard. It’s soo attractive! :)

          2. My (hot) husband is rocking the same look as Lana’s. And the fact that he can do it at home makes it so simple too. And hot.

      5. Yep. My husband shaves his head every morning in the shower. His younger brother who has a bit more hair left is doing the close crop.

    2. Men in my family go bald very early. According to them, Rogaine is only for baldness that starts with a bald spot in the back. Those with a receding hairline (like my relatives) can take Propecia. The side effects can be pretty serious but I don’t think they’re especially common. If it were me (as a man), I would just go bald with dignity.

      1. Yes! Look at Prince William as an example. He recently shaved his head / got a very close cut.

        Although, TBH, I completely understand the vanity issue.

    3. I wish my husband would do something about his thinning hair, so I’m subscribing. He is too lazy/distracted/fussy to ever use sunscreen, and I know hair loss is going to cause yet one more place he’ll repeatedly burn.

      1. Hats are the answer here. Sunscreen in your thinning hair is….unpleasant. Save your battles..

          1. The husband has red hair that’s thin naturally, but I nail the thinner areas with spray sunscreen if we’re going to be outside. He balked at first, but I told him a severe sunburn on a thin area might keep his hair from growing at all when it peels, so now he requests it. ;)

    4. I have a friend whose hairline was receding noticeably, and it looked like he was starting to go bald like other men in his family. I know he used Rogaine, but I’m not sure what else he may have used (my memory says tribulus and some fairly drastic diet/lifestyle changes along CrossFit/Paleo lines, but I don’t really remember). I thought he just wasn’t going to go down without a fight, but he actually grew a significant amount of his hair back, so something helped.

    5. My husband has a huge bald spot. His hairline first started receding when we were just dating and I was in my early twenties, and it made me sad. I talked to him about it, and he was like there’s nothing that really works that well to prevent it and he didn’t want to go through the hassle. I accepted it and it hasn’t been an issue ever since! As long as men keep their hair cut short most of the time, they can still look great. It’s actually nice to just let something become a non-issue, like maybe we don’t all have to be someone else’s idea of perfect and that’s okay.

  13. Background: I have two management chains. One on-site, one off-site whom I interact with very little.

    My off-site manager called me to ask for assistance on an unrelated issue and casually mentioned that my on-site manager was probably being removed due to complaints. And, I’m just kind of surprisingly devastated. The on-site manager is fairly young (28-32+/-) and really bad at social niceties. If your work is not up to par he will tell you very bluntly. When I was new and first getting up to speed with the team’s very niche work, it stung a little. But, now that I’m at full-performance, I actually really enjoy working for him. He’s bright, freakishly knowledgeable, and has a clear leadership vision. I’ve had so many sh*tty managers in this field: idiots, incompetents, sexists, creeps, managers who’ll undercut you to trap you or simply to feel better about themselves. It breaks my heart that this guy, who’s objectively not-awful may be removed. Off-site manager swore me to secrecy, so there’s nothing I can do. I just feel really sad.

      1. I’m waiting on a start date for a new position, so this won’t really affect me. It’s just sad and unfair if he’s actually removed.

    2. I’m sorry :( I can relate. I was a co-manager with someone like what you described. (Not sure if you are into MBTI at all, but this person was an INTJ – extremely bright, hardworking and able to handle unbelievable amounts of work and stress, but totally blunt, impatient and had no social skills.) After 5 years he left and I miss him so much. Many workplaces favor those who have soft skills over those who are competent, but have “rough elbows” as they say. At my workplace, this manager was universally hated by all of the hourly employees even though he was incredibly competent. It’s mostly because the way he interacted with them made them feel lesser than, even though it was completely unintentional.

    4. Sorry, but “social niceties” are a skill one needs in the workplace, and in some jobs they’re absolutely essential. If you’re only good at half the job, then you’re not actually competent.

      I’m sick of rude jerks getting a pass because they’re good at one thing and expect everybody they work with to accommodate the areas they’re terrible in.

  14. The question yesterday about camping in Morocco got me thinking…anyone have experience/recommendations camping in Petra, Jordan?

    1. Not about camping. Spent a day in Petra and just was astounded. Have you read “Married to a Bedouin” ???? a great book – I ran across it after our trip; would have loved it in advance even more. Heads up – on my kindle there was no table of contents. The glossy of Arabic terms that’s in the back would have saved me time looking things up!

      Have a wonderful time. Would love to hear about it on your return.

    2. I think most of the “camping” in Jordan is in Wadi Rum. I don’t have any specific recommendations unfortunately.

    3. Yes,
      i was a year ago in Jordan and we stay in this one when we were in Wadi-Rum desert, really amazing experience to sleep there watching the stars. (WADI RUM NIGHT CAMP http://www.wadirumnight.com)

      In Petra you cannot camp or stay, you are only allowed inside during visiting hours. But you can stay in a hotel just 1 minute from the main door of the site. (PETRA GUEST HOUSE 4****, Petra http://www.guesthouse-petra.com)

      I recomended you to go inside Petra site as soon as they open in the morning. You will avoid all the tourist crowds and it would be amazing when you arrive “there”.

      Once you have visited all that you planned if you want your “haima” experience there I encourage you to do a bit of hiking to the top of the hill in front of the “Treasure” until to arrive to the first viewpoint. To do that you can go in your own. Only a bit hilly. If you want to go the second viewpoint you have to agreed a fee with a guide. You are not alow to go alone as it is quite dangerous this second part.

  15. Anyone have any recommendations for daily work-outs during pregnancy? I love Jillian Michaels, normally (and am doing it now) and would like a video/app I can do from home/iPad in about a half hour.

    1. Fitness Blender. They don’t have pregnancy specific workouts, but you can search for many different types – HIIT, low impact, strength, etc.

    2. youtube – there are soooo many options out there (and I definitely recommend prenatal specific, because there are a number of things you wouldn’t think are no-no’s or you wouldn’t intuitively know to do but work really well.)

    3. Check out Body fit by Amy on you tube. I think daily burn and beachbody online also have pregnancy programs, but you’d have to subscribe.

  16. Talk to me about pants. I’ve lost some weight and need to get some new work pants. All my current pants are boot cut-ish. (or straight, but wider leg straight than what I’m currently seeing). I’m fairly pear-shaped. I tried on some straight-leg pants yesterday and they all just look wrong. The ankle lengths just looked too short and the ones that were just labeled straight leg looked too tight if I got anywhere close to my size in the waist. Can I still wear wider leg pants without looking horribly out of fashion? Do I just need to get used to how I look in the current narrower straight leg pants? HELP.

    1. Hi Gail!
      I am post-pregnancy and just went through/finishing up extreme cycle of weight gain then loss. The thing I struggled with the most was pants. I wore a lot of skirts while frustrated. The things that worked for me:
      1) hours and hours of shopping to find the ‘go-to’ fit and brand that worked for me as I changed weight (size and shape)
      2) tailoring – getting pants that fit legs and getting them hemmed and waist taken in, for example
      3) Even at my ‘usual weight’ I still struggle with pant length, as an aesthetic choice, to look polished (see my thred above) – pants are difficult until you find your ‘go to’ (even difficult to maintain that ‘go-to’)
      good luck!

    2. Yes, for work pants just wear the style that works best for your body. I am also pear shaped. Yes, wider hems look better on our shape. Feel free to buy some pants with that cut and have them tailored to your shape.

      If you want to throw in in one pair of ankle pants to try this look, check out Loft Julie fit (for curvy shapes) skinny ankle pants. They are a little wider at the ankle, and this is more flattering for us. They are stretchy and forgiving.

      But a tailor is your friend. Not a single pair of pants fits me off the rack. I always must wear a belt, or pay for extensive tailoring at a minimum.

    3. Try the Banana Republic Sloan – they come in talls, too. I look terrible in “straight leg” pants but live in Sloans.

    4. I see a ton of women in my industry (real estate) sporting wide leg pants. These are usually the less trendy, more expensive wardrobe individuals. I think at some point you just wear what looks good on you and forget the trends. (But also – wide legs are back, from what I can tell).

  17. Any advice on how to bounce back from being let go at work? I’m in a legal specialty that doesn’t have that many job openings, so applying to jobs doesn’t take me that long. What else should I be doing? I’m worried about finding another job and money and maintaining my self-esteem and career.

    1. Can you share more details about the circumstances of your departure, if you’re up to it? I think the advice will be different if it’s a reduction-in-force affecting multiple people/performance-based/law firm up-or-out situation. I’m very sorry in any event!

    2. I’m sorry you were fired, it’s definitely an emotional experience! I think the guideline to treat unemployment like a full-time job (so 40+ hours per week) can quickly get frustrating in many fields, especially if you’re in a highly specialized area. I know the last time I was job searching, I was lucky to find one or two positions per week that fit my skillset, geographic location, and pay grade.

      In your position, I would do a daily search for openings (this likely won’t take more than an hour or so per day). I would reach out to anybody within your nextwork whom you think could be helpful in securing your next position (whether it’s somebody who works for your dream company, somebody whose career trajectory is admirable to you, or even somebody in your industry who has recently been unemployed). The caveat to this is that you contact must be sincere and can’t come across in any way as PLEASE GIVE ME A JOB, THANK YOU. I’d also attend relevant networking opportunities in your industry, and look into any workshops or certifications that might be relevant and keep you busy. This won’t make for a full 40 hour week, and THAT’S OKAY, provided you aren’t in a precarious financial position. Far better to do a focused search than to apply to everything and speak to anyone who seems remotely relevant.

      Now for the fun part– what to do with your extra time? Read those books that have been piling up on your nightstand, tackle those projects around your home you’ve been meaning to do, and cultivate some sort of interest that is meaningful to you that has nothing to do with work!

    3. I’m sorry you are going through that. I was laid off from my last job totally unexpectedly and it was a huge blow emotionally. Looking back, I wish I had gone to therapy to deal with it, because I kept ruminating about it for the next two years (even though I found a job within 3.5 months – the pain still lingered). I think because it was so unexpected my mind just kept trying to figure out why it happened and what I had done wrong. They say social rejection causes a reaction in the brain that’s similar to physical pain, and I totally believe that. It’s hard. Anyway, keep your head up and remember that this really is just a blip in your career and won’t be nearly as painful to explain/think about in the future, but it does take time. Lots of people go through things like this.

      Do something positive for yourself every day that you enjoy. I liked to go on long walks and listen to podcasts and go to yoga class. Reach out to your network. Sometimes people are unexpectedly kind and generous, and that can be a huge encouragement, even if just one person helps you in a significant way. I was surprised that people were helpful to me who hardly knew me (like people at church or friends of my husband) giving me job leads and connecting me to influential people. So don’t cut yourself short. Be open to talking to people about your situation and what you are looking for.

      Also, if you are eligible, file for unemployment. That helped me a lot. I also did freelance work, which kept me busy, helped me financially, and boosted my confidence at a time when I really needed it.

      Another idea – make the effort to get out of the house and go to an area of town that makes you feel inspired, even if you just sit at a sidewalk cafe for a while. A change of scene can change your mindset too.

      Good luck!

      1. Ugh I got laid off expectedly almost 3 years ago and I still want to smack the boss that did it.

        I bounced back fine career wise and am better off but the person that did it is such a jerk- and a coward- and didn’t think about what cutting my role would do and it blew up the entire division and…

        Okay so maybe I’m not over it. But I make more money and work less now ;).

    4. Here are some things that, after I got working again, I wish I had done more when I was unemployed:
      – running/working out
      – networking (everything from attending conferences and CLEs to lunches with friends… and who knows which one might lead to a great employment opportunity). Consider groups that have lawyers in them, but not necessarily related to a particular practice group. For example, the Association of Women Lawyers in my area has a book club that also does little trips to the museums and such.
      – being around positive people (rather than other people who were feeling bad, what a mood killer)
      – just getting out of the house generally, whether it was a trip to the library or going for a hike. Sitting on the couch did me no good. Netflix was no bueno. Internet, especially late, at night was even worse.

      I would also recommend signing up with recruiters and legal agencies, such as Axiom.

  18. Has anyone tried Birkenstock shoes? I’m basically living in my Birkenstocks this summer and will need a new commuting shoe slash casual shoe when it gets cooler. I need the arch support right now and my foot shape and size make fitting inserts into shoes undesirable.

    1. Nope — you just need socks.

      Somehow among all my preppy friends, they wore Birks in the summer and Birks with socks when it got cold. Lots of LL Bean rag socks IIRC. I’m thinking of springing for a pair myself now that I have to stand and wait for the school bus with my kids.

    2. Also from the Preppies: birk or LL Bean brand wool felt clogs with socks. They are flat, like birks, not like the high-heel clogs that you see sometimes.

    3. While I’ve rocked socks with Birkenstocks many times (function over form and all), I wouldn’t do it for my commute unless my office were exceedingly casual. Try Danskos or something like that instead.

    4. I have Birk clogs… they’re hideous but I wear them anyway. Birkenstock also sells inserts, which may be something to look into. I’ve been thinking a pair of Dansko or Vionic closed-toe shoes myself.

    5. I have the Birkenstock clogs that I use as slippers in the winter. I can’t say they’re pretty but if i were less vain I’d wear them commuting. They are just as comfortable as the mayaris I wear all summer.

  19. I’ve recently gained some weight, and my weekend wardrobe is not doing me any justice – I feel like I need a whole new weekend wardrobe! I have a cute pair of floral shorts and faded black jean shorts that fit. I need new tops – I have a very large chest, so high necks look terrible on me, and anything loose and flowy makes me look heavier than I am. I also love skirts and dresses. And, while we’re at it, I would like to get some espadrilles.

    Anyone want to do some vicarious shopping for me? Preferably designing a refreshed weekend wardrobe without breaking the budget?

    1. Thredup is great for when you’re between sizes / not ready to invest in a full wardrobe at that size.

      1. Just a PSA that ThredUp now charges a $2 restocking fee each for any item you return if the item is less than $50. Makes it much much more difficult to shop there

        1. I love Poshmark, but since you can’t make returns, shopping can be tough if you’ve recently changed sizes.

    3. Hit an outlet mall! The Loft outlet is my friend, along with the Columbia outlet (I really love their t-shirts).

  20. For those at BigLaw (or even big RegionalLaw), have you ever had your firm tell you that you can’t get involved in a civic issue affecting you b/c it might upset your clients?

    e.g., rezoning on your street (firm not involved in the rezoning), school redistricting, etc.?

    My old firm prided itself on its woke-ness and people frequently were involved in Things in the national news and things of local import. No one seemed to care. My current firm is quieter. My friend’s firm . . . slapped a muzzle on the firm employee (but noted that the spouse was free to be involved as long as there was no mention of the employee spouse).

    Seems loco and would not play well in above the law at all. I guess bad guys count on not getting caught or called out.

    1. In my experience, big firms asking employees not to be public about civic engagement is more typical. I am not familiar with a law firm that prides itself on its “woke-ness,” but I’m in a field that attracts a number of conservative Republicans.

    2. Going anon for this:

      My firm would absolutely 100% have a problem with me becoming involved with certain causes/organizations because those are directly targeting firm clients. And honestly I do not have a problem with that. I cannot adequately represent clients in court while giving time and money to organizations that are actively lobbying against them. It is not just a question of appearances or angering the clients; it is part of my ethical obligation to my client who shares confidential information with me.

      And if one of my corporate clients is trying to build ABC Development, I cannot be seen (directly or indirectly) lobbying against that development. The is just part of being an attorney. You do not have to agree with your clients. You cannot publicly disagree with them. If you cannot do that, find a firm that represents different clients. (Coming from someone who turned down a job opportunity because that firm represented a client that I refused to represent on moral grounds. I do have a line in the sand.)

      1. What if the issue was literally next door to you? Or affected your actual family (kid of owner of firm client drove drunk and injured your family member)? Or someone botched your mother’s surgery and your firm doesn’t want you to help / accompany assist your parent who is suing the doctors, nurses, and hospital?

        Not just theoretical / abstract (e.g., I don’t like guns so I will turn down the job from a firm that does a lot of work in that area; I am opposed to NDAs so I won’t take an employment law offer from an employer-side firm that would make me draft them).

        1. I think the kind of people who care about those things are not the kind of people who work in BigLaw.

        2. Probably too late for you to see this – but the attorney/client privilege still applies even if my client injured a member of my own family (or me). If my mother was suing my client, I might refer her to the best plaintiff attorney in town, but I would not show up at hearings/her deposition to assist her – if for no other reason that the suggestion that I shared privileged information with her attorney would get him disqualified. If the development was next door, my firm would expect me to suck it up and deal. I cannot have access to confidential, privileged information and then use it for my own benefit (or even appear to use it) – no matter how “right” I am. That is how the privilege works.

          Client’s son would be another matter. For that, my professional obligations would not be impacted and my firm would not expect me to take a client’s son’s side over my mother.

  21. I need some advice. I started a new job a few months ago – i was really unhappy in my former job. Even though I loved the work, it was a really toxic environment. Turns out maybe I just don’t like litigation? Even though my new firm seems better, I miss my old firm (which I never thought would happen) and I am not happy doing the work. I am trying and struggling with a complete lack of motivation.

    I can’t even think of other jobs I would like right now, all I know is that I’m not enjoying my current job at all. I just feel like I’m at a loss and I don’t know what to do.

    Any advice? Thanks all.

    1. Hello, are you me? I am in almost the exact same position. I find that I have a lot of Big Ups and Big Downs in my new job, and I wonder how much feeling homesick for my old firm is just part of the adjustment process. I also think I don’t really like litigation after all, ha. I wish I had more advice – just know someone is in almost the exact same position as you.

    2. Perhaps try a therapist who has experience in life coaching and career coaching as well. I actually got a good recommendation right here on this board for someone that I have been working with for 2 years that has helped me a lot. And I hope I am not overstepping when I say this, but consider that while signs may indicate that you have a work issue, there may be a “life issue” too and that working on that will help with your workplace happiness regardless of what firm or field you are in.

    1. Absolutely not. Also in my experience gov’t offices involve a lot more color from whenever it was last fashionable.

    2. No, this is a fantastic color to mix with a neutral palate of white/grey/black/navy etc.. Lovely fall color in particular. Totally fine for government office.

    5. Burgundy and russet are appropriate in all professional environments, particularly with neutrals.

      Of course, I rocked a fuschia double-breasted “Ally McBeal” suit at DOJ in the ’90s, so YMMV.

      2. HAHA I had a fuschia double-breasted suit in the 90s! I did a lot of work for a partner who had a red sofa in his office, and I was not allowed to sit on the red sofa while wearing my fuschia suit!

        Good times, man. Good times.

        1. I did love that suit and even kept the gold metal knot buttons before donating (I put the original like color buttons back on).

          Maybe this is the year to find a replacement, but this time I plan on the skirt being at least three inches longer. And this time I can get pants (absolutely prohibited at the time of the prior suit)!

      3. I just got a fuchsia suit… Wasn’t planning to wear it as a suit though, but I think these are OK again, right?

    6. I hope not. I bought the asymmetric dress and cardigan in that color. I’ve tried them on and the exchanges sizes are on their way to me now. But I’m totally planning to wear them to my conservative office. (Not gov tho)

  23. Has anyone used Care.com for meal prep help? Could you share your experience? Do they work at your house or their own and then drop off? Who purchases the groceries? Do you provide very specific instructions, or have you found the folks to already have a good idea of what to do. Do you have help strictly for meal prep or actual cooking?

    1. On care.com you can hire people to do anything you want. Most typically, they go to your home and cook with the food that is already there. But they can also do the shopping and then cook. Remember, this is a caregiver hiring service…. not a food prep service…. so the focus is having someone at the house to also keep an eye on the person who needs help. They are not trained “chefs”.

      If you need a food prep service for someone that doesn’t need caregiving, well honestly most seniors qualify for free or low cost meals on wheels. I would do that instead.

      The quality of people vary wildly. Some will be good cooks, some less so. You keep it simple…. The more specific the instructions the better, unless you are incredibly lucky and have a gifted, thoughtful, good cook that you can trust. And that is rare.

      And you still have to worry about them being lazy, staring at their phone the whole time, stealing from you etc…. Hiring people to do caregiving for my parents has been the absolutely most stressful part of helping my aging/ill parents.

      And Care.com does not have as good of a reputation anymore. They don’t do careful screening anymore.

      Honestly, if you live in a close community, putting a sign up at community/college/church bulletin boards can often bring more reliable people. Also word of mouth with your friends, especially those who have aging parents.

    2. We found a house cleaner who also does meal prep. The questions you asked are all up to you and the person you select. Care.com is just a platform to connect you with service providers; it doesn’t facilitate all the details of how the work gets done. You’re basically hiring an independent contractor. I’d recommend conducting phone interviews with a number of candidates and going over these questions with them. Definitely specify if you have a preference on any of them.

  24. I had hoped that Nordstrom’s would re-stock some items when the sale opened today, but no luck for the things I wanted that were sold out….

    Anyone recommend a black vegan leather moto style jacket that you bought that you really like? I’m an XS/S on top, pear shape. Looking for something casual for weekend wear.

    1. Some may come back still. I ordered on the first day and will probably receive my box today. I never keep everything.

      1. +1. I’ve only received a couple of the items I ordered during pre-access– and I ordered early. Definitely haven’t had time to return things.

      1. The description says that color may rub onto lighter surfaces. Has it for you? I’m looking at the wine purple color and boy do I want it.

      2. Thank you for this link. I do remember you posting about this before! Would also be curious about the color rubbing off, if you have noticed that? The wine color is just lovely. I might get that instead of black!

  25. Please talk to me about documenting donations of clothing and housewares for tax purposes. Our house is in need of a major cleanout (infant clothes, kids clothes, my clothes, furniture, dishes, etc.). I don’t have receipts for the items. What’s the best way to document for a tax deduction, or in your experience is it not even worth it?

    1. If you already need to itemize your taxes for other reasons (eg because you have very large state tax payments, huge medical bills or significant charitable donations) it’s worth it. If you don’t otherwise itemize, donating a bunch of bags of clothing isn’t going to be a significant enough write-off to make itemizing worth it.

        1. 3rd. I just make a list of the items I donate as I bag them up (like literally, woman’s short sleeve tee 5, mens chino pants 2, etc) and staple it to the receipt goodwill gives me. At tax time I just enter my list into turbo tax. I’ve never had a problem and my deduction for donated items is usually in the $1000 range – 2 adults, 2 kids, and we donate all outgrown or unwanted clothing (no mercari, eBay etc)

          1. Thank you all! This is exactly what I was looking for. We do use TurboTax and I’m glad to know that others are using the estimator without issue.

    3. Use the It’s Deductible app through TurboTax/Intuit. It has an app and a web interface and makes it easy to estimate values.

      1. +1. I’ve never had the IRS challenge my estimate but if they did I would have an itemized list with estimated values that were generated by a 3rd party.

      2. This app is the BEST. You can export from it as well, so if you don’t use turbo tax, it’s still useful. But if you are a turbo tax user you can download directly to your tax return, which is AMAZING.

    4. When you drop a load off at Goodwill they give you a dated, stamped receipt to fill out. I’m not sure how to estimate the value of the load though.

      1. They have a document to estimate, search for “Valuation Guide for Goodwill Donors”

  26. Can only say this on an anonymous board but I am to the point where I am over mom friends. I get that they’re busy, I know their families come first, and between work and family there isn’t much left. And yet if you want to maintain friendships you have to do SOMETHING on your end. I have bent over backwards to be flexible and not take it personally if emails aren’t responded to or plans aren’t made but now with kids that are like 6 and 10 and don’t need mom continuously and you have the whole summer with them, give me a break. And while I’m sure people will say — she’s just not into you — reality is when I do finally get her to respond and we make plans, we end up having a ton of fun, laughing non stop over dinner etc. I just wish moms would realize that it’s not cool to constantly ignore others because . . . kids.

      1. What does one say? You’re not THAT busy and your 10 year old doesn’t need every spare second of your time? Don’t know OPs friend but any hint that any of my mom friends are spending too much time with kids will result in a lecture about how you can’t possibly understand the perils of being a working mom or a mom at all and believe me if there is ever even a dinner invite (likely not), it will not be full of laughter.

        1. Well, not like that obviously. But when you get together you can say to her “I love hanging out with you and we always have so much fun together, but it bums me out that you never initiate plans and that I have to ask you 10 times before we can schedule a dinner. Do you not want to hang out with me or something?”
          I wouldn’t make it about her kids, but you can tell her that you’re tired of doing all the work to maintain the friendship. She may not be aware that she’s letting all the planning fall to you and/or that you’re frustrated by it, and if you communicate that, things may improve.

        2. amen amen amen amen.

          to the point where I’m going out of my way to find women who don’t have kids as friends. because god forbid you leave little Emily for 3 hours with your dumba$$ husband who I hate.

          1. I’m older and childless. My good friends are too. It wasn’t a deliberate plan of action to acquire childless friends, but upon reflection I can see that they are the ones who had the time and interest to invest in building a deep friendship.

        3. Just being real: it’s obvious that you don’t have kids, if you legit think that a 6-year-old and a 10-year-old don’t need their mom a lot. Please employ your intellect and think this through: the kids can’t drive. They can barely do things like make a sandwich at that age. They can’t be left home unsupervised. Also, that’s an age where a lot of kids start to get serious about certain activities and so there are practices/classes sometimes multiple times a week. So what is your friend supposed to do? Leave the kids home with a box of Cheerios and the TV on and say “sorry but mommy has to go?” Maybe her husband works a lot and isn’t available to do childcare. Maybe she can’t really afford or doesn’t want to get a babysitter. Your friend is better off without you in her life if you are going to make her feel guilty about this. Move on and find some other childless people to be friends with who will be just as narcissistic as you are. And P.S., good luck with that.

          2. And the other comments on this thread weren’t? So many of the sad-sack singles on this board think they get a free pass to be as rude as they want on other people’s threads and yet when anyone says anything back to them in the same raw, tell-it-like-it-is manner they use, they turn into fragile little snowflakes who can’t bear to get their delicate petal feelings hurt. Whatever.

          5. Dude, what? All the singles are rude and blunt? Since when? You’re unhinged. Stop being awful and get help.

          6. I am the Anon at 12:58 pm.

            I am not a “sad sack single” – I am engaged to a wonderful man and we will be trying for a family when we marry. I am also the oldest of a lot of siblings and used to watch them for a few days in a row so my parents could have some alone time.

            Yet, I still think that was rude. If I could, at age 23, figure out how to hang with my unmarried childless 23 year old friends at the mini golf place when I had a 7 year old with me, actual mothers can figure it out.

    2. As a counter point, I don’t have any kids myself and my one friend with kids is the one who is constantly trying to plan dinners and other events with friends. She often hosts and puts her kids to bed about an hour after we all arrive. It works well! I, on the other hand, have a super busy job and while I show up to things I am terrrriiibbbleee at planning them.

      #NotAllMoms? haha

      1. Seriously! My two really close friends and I try to plan things, but we’re all stressed to the limit and try to plan things, but then they fall apart because one of us has to work over the weekend or whatever. We keep in touch with group texts and messaging, but haven’t seen each other face to face in weeks, despite the fact that we all work at the same place (although in very different units).

    3. Their kids will always come first and will forever be the excuse maybe until college age when empty nest hits. I definitely pull back once pregnancies are announced for this exact reason — been burned too many times by people that used to be good friends.

      1. This kind of narcissism is staggering to me. Are you suggesting that YOU should come before your friend’s children because…you’re just that awesome, or something? WOW.

        2. No, she’s making friends with people who have time to be her friends. that’s not narcissistic, LOL. You are truly unhinged.

    4. As a mom who plans and takes great pains to maintain friendships, I hear you. You just have to do it. I schedule things at least a month in advance and almost never cancel unless there’s a true issue, like illness.

      But I also know that the time demands of motherhood don’t necessarily let up as the kids grow older. Their activities increase, and there’s a lot of time spent travelling to and from events. And that leads to just being exhausted and tired which means that down time is better spent at home rather than out and about with friends. I’m not making excuses, but your friend may just want to be home because there may not be a lot of that time in her life.

      1. I’m a mom with a 3-year-old, and it works better for me to plan things spontaneously. Unless we’re going out of town, we start planning our weekend on Friday. We wake up on weekend mornings and decide whether to hang out just the 3 of us or to start texting friends and family members. Planning a month in advance is fine, but I may end up canceling because of family obligations (usually, Kiddo is sick, or we end up with a non-optional extended family obligation).

        1. Makes sense. I think that can work well too.

          For me, I don’t cancel unless it’s a necessity- I consider it part of my commitment to maintain friendships and show my friends that they matter too. If my extended family sends an invitation after I’ve made plans, I decline and keep the plans I’ve already made. I know the typical days that we are likely to have a conflict (birthdays and holidays), so I already schedule around them.

          Because I like being home myself, I only plan one event with friends a month (on average) – either a Friday or Saturday night. It really doesn’t take a lot to show people you care. I think that’s part of the frustration showing in some of these comments. Your friends don’t need your constant attention. They just want *some* attention.

          1. This is why most functional adults get into a partnered relationship and/or have children of their own. Because post-childhood, no one is obligated to give you attention, not even your own parents. People are supposed to create lives and families/networks of their own, not rely on their friends for all the contact and validation they need. That’s dysfunctional and toxic, and I don’t blame people for detaching from “friends” who expect someone who has their own life, job, family, etc. to fill in the holes in the friend’s life. The friends in those cases need therapy.

          2. Are you the same Anon who keeps posting awful diatribes to the singletons who you consider pathetic? Why has marriage/partnership and motherhood transformed you into an ogre, going solely by your comments?

          3. Anon at 1:11, this comment is mean. Many people want partners and kids, but don’t have them. It’s also just really cold to say that if you didn’t manage to create a nuclear family for yourself by X age, you’re not a “functional adult.” It’s true that finding good company and people who care is harder for the single and child-free, but that’s a reason to go easy on them (us), not rub salt in the wound.

          4. Anon at 1:11 pm, wow.

            Your H cannot be your entire social and emotional support system. It isn’t healthy for you, him, or your marriage.

          5. Let’s be clear – my friends don’t demand anything. I want to give them some attention to nurture the relationship and keep it healthy, just as I try to do with other relationships in my life. Geez.

    5. Yeah I wish people without kids would realize that it’s not cool to constantly lump all moms together because… we don’t all act like that.

      So many problems with your comment. One: kids who are 6 and 10 do need mom continuously. A 10 year old MIGHT, maybe, possibly, be trusted at home alone for an hour… (depending on the particular child, and depending on your area) but a 10 year old cannot be left alone to babysit a 6 year old. Two: if your friend wanted to prioritize you, she would.

      I have two or three friends who have completely fallen off the radar in the past few years. They have no kids, yet they’ve behaved exactly how you describe: they’re busy, they don’t do anything on their end to maintain our friendship, they don’t respond to emails, they don’t make plans. The fact is they don’t care enough to maintain our friendship. So don’t blame it on “mom friends.” It’s not because they are moms.

        1. Well, it sounds like you also may not empathize sufficiently. You also sounds like a peach….

          I am single, no kids. I totally understand how hard it is for my working Mom friends with kids to maintain our friendships. It still hurts when my friend abruptly ends our brunch to say she’s gotta take the kids to the park. But it is what it is. It is crazy hard for me… a single… to manage a job and taking care of my health/sanity and my single household. Honestly, I have no idea how I would manage if I also had a husband and children and a more complicated household to manage. I’m also an introvert. It makes me want to shoot myself to think about it…

          Yes, it stinks. But you need to grow up a little and find more friends yourself that have the flexibility that you need. I have friends that range in age from 10 years younger to a dear friend in her 80s. I can hear you snickering, but again I say…. grow up. This is life. Friends change. Friends move on. Really good friends can actually leave your life for years…. and then re-materialize decades later.

          You can be bitter and whine online. We all need to do that and I do that too. But until you have children, you can’t truly understand. And every personality is different. I do have a couple AMAZING women friends with kids that manage to maintain some friendships. But they both work part time and also have a very mellow temperament (so their house never gets cleaned, they just let the stress fall off them) or they are so crazy type A that they never sleep and make me feel tired even when I see them. But still I never see them as often as we used to pre-marriage. It will never be the same. But it can still be fulfilling.

          Start volunteering. Get more hobbies. Meet more people.

        2. See, that comment about “most of you” is totally rude. I wouldn’t want to hang out with someone like you whether I had kids or not. I have no dog in this fight, this is my first post on the thread, but the people upthread saying the rudeness is only on one side are clearly wrong.

    6. I’ve had to accept that some friends, even good friends or previously good friends, are not going to put in the same effort I do, or are going to cancel last-minute on 50% of the meetups we schedule, or will text but never call, or will go 6 months without returning contact and then be back to normal, or whatever. Some are moms who spend a lot of time with their kids, some have unpredictable work schedules, some have time-consuming hobbies, some struggle with mental health issues, and some seem to be flaky. I set boundaries I’m comfortable with and don’t take things personally.

      Also, this may not apply to your friend, but at 6 and 10, the kids may be heavily involved in activities. Your friend may not be spending that much time with them, but just chauffeuring them around town. Summers can be even harder because you’re trying to find camps or babysitters during the gap at school. Camps may start late and let out early, so one parent is arriving to work late, and the other is leaving early, and both may be trying to make up time at night (after the kids are chauffeured, of course).

    7. Just because you end up having a ton of fun, laughing non stop over dinner doesn’t mean she prioritizes you. You may be right that she’s prioritizing every moment of her life for her kids and that stinks, but not for you–if that’s the case, move on. But you may be only partly right, what if she’s prioritizing the free time she has for other people who understand her and aren’t so judgmental? Because, as a mom with little free time, trust me when I say we can feel your contempt for our lifestyle choices. And we can prioritize our time with women who aren’t so harsh, and spend less time with you and still have a good time.

      1. Then don’t spend any time with people you consider harsh? Why hang out at all?

        Op chances are she’s one of those people who just wants to be home. Even if she isn’t actively doing anything with a 10 year old all the time, bet she feels better just being around and bad/guilty to take more time after work to go out with friends.

    8. It’s frustrating, I get it. But I think the key with friendships sometimes is to meet them where they are, and accept that this is what your friendship is like at this point in life. If you aren’t comfortable with that, you might just have to move on. I’ve had friends that have cycled in and out of my life for a variety of reasons (kids, health, personal reasons, work, family obligations, geography…). It’s okay.

      Remember middle school? It seemed friend groups changed nearly every year. Somehow, once we become adults, we expect that friendships will remain the same in terms of the people we’re friends with and the intensity of the friendship. I just don’t think that’s true in most cases.

    10. I start to back away once there are kids unless they affirmatively show me they still want to hang out and that means they reach out too — don’t care how tired they are. I’m impressed you’ve done 10 years with this woman. Kid people want to hang with other kid people so the kids can play — they make time for that and not for you or me because we don’t have a child to offer in return.

      1. Or also: despite your efforts not to seem bitter and angry about your life, we know you are, in fact, bitter and angry and you resent us and our happiness. That’s not fun to spend time around. I have had to pull slow fades on a couple of childless friends who tried to mask their bitterness but ultimately could not stop themselves from making cutting little comments about how lonely they were, how I had everything and they had nothing, how I wasn’t empathetic enough for their (self-inflicted) life situation, etc. Fun, right? No thanks. I’d rather spend time with my married-with-kids friends who were able to create a life for themselves that they wanted rather than sit on the sidelines whining.

        1. Is this necessary? You give a whole new lease of life to the term smug marrieds. How truly unpleasant you must be to your spouse and family.

        2. Being single is a self-inflicted life situation? And all I need to do is decide to create a life for myself that I want and it’ll all work out? Gosh, I can’t believe that’s never occurred to me!

          Have a little f*ing empathy. Just because you were lucky enough that it’s worked out the way you want doesn’t mean that single people have done things wrong to end up that way.

        3. Wow, what a classic #smugmarried. You’r friends were right– you’re not empathetic enough. You’re not empathetic at all.

          I mean, you really think that marriage is synonymous with happiness or “creating a life for [yourself] that [you] wanted?” How delusional can you be? Half the posts here are seeking advice about how to handle major issues in a marriage. Or divorce. Hope you have a few friends left over if your marriage goes south!

        4. Wow, Anon@12:50, I’m married and expecting a kid and you sound like poison.

      2. This thread is officially making me paranoid that all my friends are going to dump me as soon as I give birth this November.

        And in response to the comments I’m expecting– no I’m not going to change how much I reach out to friends
        as soon as I become a mom because I was already terrible at that and they’ve stuck with me for the past 18 years of my last minute plans and forgetting to respond to texts. So there!

    11. I don’t think this is a mom thing. Some people are like this. Now they just have what they feel is a legitimate excuse instead of a flakey last minute I can’t be there.

      1. Usually, from the comments on this board it is “I am an introvert, so I bail on my friends all the time.”

    12. I have a kid and lots of friends without kids that I still see regularly.

      If none of your mom friends want to spend time with you, you’re the common denominator – maybe you’re not as much fun to be around as you give yourself credit for.

      1. lots of defensive moms here…

        This is why single/childless people feel like they can’t share their feelings or talk to Mom Friends about ways to connect more. It’s like there’s a total and complete ban on articulating frustration about the situation– even if you empathize with Mom Friends and agree they’re not doing anything wrong by prioritizing their families. Mom Friends are always right and everyone else must be bitter/demanding/a narcissistic/must suck.

        I don’t have kids- I look at it like my friend is moving away. Is she doing something wrong? Of course not. Am I happy for her? of course I am. But I will miss her, so I’m sad about that. I understand we can’t visit every time we’re in each other’s city or skype all the time, but it would be nice to feel the effort goes both ways. This really isn’t complex at all.

    13. I’m a mom and I absolutely agree with you. The only way I see most of my mom friends is by planning or agreeing to something where our kids can play together. Try to get them out for a little one-on-one time without kids has been surprisingly difficult. I don’t have a good answer for you–just wanted to let you know I share the frustration.

  27. What are your favorite hiking-ish sandals? I’ve been comparing Tevas and Chacos but I’m not sure what else to look at. Adjustability is a big plus for me because my feet are kind of wonky, but they don’t need to suited for serious hiking, just a once-yearly moderate/easy hike and a lot of walking. Really I want the aesthetic (don’t judge me) but hopefully something cute enough to wear with a casual skirt?

    1. Have you tried on Chacos? I ordered the cutest pair online and was in love with them when they arrived, but holy high arches, Batman! I’ve never really given my arches much thought (I guess that means they’re normal-ish), but it was like having a tennis ball under my arches, the support was so high. I tried on a second pair in store and yep, same fit.

      (And yes, I too am in search of sporty footwear for weekend wear :) )

      1. Yikes! Thank you for the warning! I haven’t tried any on so I really appreciate it.

      2. I think this is just what wearing shoes with arch support feels like instead of the completely flat women’s shoes that many of us wear day to day. I definitely think the arch support is a pro, not a con!

    2. For actual hiking, i love my Keens. For cute casual sandals that have survived easy hikes and tree climbing and music festivals, I have a pair of strappy Merrells are surprisingly comfy.

      1. +1 to Keens, I live in them on vacations and on the weekend. They offer lots of support and don’t come off your feet.

    3. I’ve had my chacos for years and I adore them. I happen to have high arches anyway, so I didn’t realize this was a feature! My friend’s dog ate the webbing and I had them re-strung or whatever about a year after I bought them and I intend to do it again if they ever break.

    4. I’d look at Merrells. Chacos have never felt comfortable on my feet, but Merrells are much better. The pair I have is a grey suede strappy sandal with enough strategically placed and kind of camouflaged elastic to make it extremely versatile and comfy. I’ve had them for 5 years and worn them as my exclusive travel shoe through 3 walking-intensive countries and they’re still my go-to for anything outdoors.

  28. Is it wrong to come out and say you want some time in between jobs? I know they’ve been looking a while, and I could in theory start in two weeks. Lie about work obligations? What’s the best way to handle this? I haven’t willingly changed jobs in, oh, 17 years.

    1. I don’t think you need to elaborate too much. Just say, “The Tuesday after Labor Day would work best for me if your business needs can accommodate that.”

    2. This is tricky b/c it helps to know your future office, which is hard. You could just say “I would like to start on X date. Does that work for you?” If they say no, you can decide whether you want to push back or just give in. It seems more likely they will say “oh yeah that’s fine.” Or “we want to train you on this date so can you start by then?” IME prospective employers are pretty flexible with this unless they are in the middle of a project they’re hiring you to take over or something. Also, I don’t think it’s reasonable to ask for more than four weeks off between jobs, but that’s just me.

      1. +1. And, I also think it’s fine to say something like I need to give X weeks notice, and then if possible would like X weeks personal time before starting.

    3. Most people take a week or two between jobs, I can’t imagine anyone batting an eye at this.

    4. I am currently taking a few weeks off before I start my new job. When I negotiated for the later start date, I literally said “I need to lose this eye twitch.” They were understanding, though in the end didn’t give me quite as much time as I’d wanted.

    5. Set the start date that works for you. It’s your very first step at setting boundaries with your new job. If they’ve been searching for awhile, then they’ve figured out how to be down one resource for long enough that two more weeks isn’t going to kill them.

  29. If one spouse travels during the week (say one to three nights) do they get a reduced home chores load?

    Reason I ask: H travels, but his only true job at home is mowing/edging our not-big lawn. Many Sundays, though, he plays video games or watches TV and doesn’t do it. Last night (while out of town) he says he will call someone to come out today, so this morning I’m the one out picking up dog s—.

    I don’t get a pass for my responsibilities – what if I just didn’t feel like making sure bills get paid, etc.

    Wondering if I’m being unfair and don’t understand constant work travel. He does not want to outsource this full time because it is his only exercise. He is massively overweight and that probably contributes to the lack of energy for doing it.

    1. I don’t think that work travel necessarily equates to a reduced chores load. As someone with a long commute, I’m not sure that is any less stressful than traveling frequently for work.

      1. Yeah, travel is one consideration but it’s not the only one, and you have to think about time and stress both.

    2. Can you see if maybe there’s another chore he’d prefer? Maybe you all outsource lawn mowing and he tackles weekly laundry, etc.

    3. stop letting your husband bullsh*t you! He can get exercise some other way. Have you posted about him before? I think this guy is so disappointing.

      1. LOL no! Never. Because I know I can’t do anything about him not exercising so not worth crowd-sourcing.

    4. Honestly, I would say you need to redistribute the chore load. One outdoor job does not equal the indoor jobs I assume you must be doing plus paying bills, etc.

    5. He is your husband not your child and you cannot make him do his chores. Maybe he is mentally exhausted from being on the road; maybe he is physically exhausted from the combination of weight and travel; maybe he is being passive aggressive because he think you are nagging him. You can try leaving the yard until natural consequences become apparent or having someone on retainer to come deal with it when he does not. Also, weekly yard work is not exercise – it is an injury waiting to happen.

      And I would suggest as kindly as possible that you need to deal with the real issue, which is your relationship with a man for whom you do not seem to have much respect. Note that I am not suggesting you are in the wrong, but contempt is fatal to relationships and dealing with the root problem might be better in the long run than the fights over the relatively small things.

    6. I think traveling gets you a pass on indoor household chores because you are’t contributing to the mess, but that doesn’t extend to yard work or bill paying because those things have to get done. Can you outsource yard work (and poop scoop duty!) and invest in a treadmill? He’d still have to opportunity to work out, but it’d be any time that works for him.

      I also think it’s fair to ask him to tackle bills or whatever once in a while if you’ve had a stressful week and he hasn’t.

      1. Lol no he doesn’t get a pass on all indoor chores just because he’s not there. Dust still accumulated whether you’re there or not, carpets need to be vacuumed, bathrooms need to be cleaned, etc. He maybe doesn’t have to do dishes or wash sheets/towels but tbh you’re part of a household it’s not just about you, it’s about the team, and you don’t get to sit around playing video games while your teammate toils away all day.

    7. They get an increased chores load when they are home because they are ‘off’ when they are away.

      1. That’s what I think too! OP is doing all the chores while he’s gone, he should have to do at least a majority of the chores when he’s home.
        And I don’t think they get a pass even on stuff like dishes. At least in my household, we generate much more mess on weekends because we do a lot of meal prep for the week. So even if he’s not there M-T, he’s still making plenty of mess.

    8. I work-travel during the week, and on the weekend I shop, meal prep, cook, do laundry, clean, pick up the dog crap, weed, handle finances, organize rides for teens, pet care, and generally do all the things I would do during the week. My non-traveling spouse mows the lawn. I don’t think travel v no travel spouse chores are divided by career choice. In my experience it’s the gender and general activity levels of the spouses that ultimately determine who does what.

        1. Yeah. LOL at this honestly because you are getting the rawest of raw deals. How did this happen? I mean, I could make a guess – over time, he did things poorly or not at all and so you just took over more and more of the responsibilities because it’s easier than fighting. But now look. You’re basically a slave to this guy and his house and his kids. I would start hiring help to do most of this work and take the money out of whatever he puts into the household kitty. You don’t have to live like this. Put a higher price on yourself.

      2. Yes, this is the way it is. It is wonderful being a modern wife who is expected to have an impressive job, earn money, and take care of everything with the house and the kids. My husband thinks he is an enlightened modern man because he doesn’t just support my having a job, he expects it. Yet somehow he believes that all the household chores should happen magically and invisibly the way it did when he was a kid with a SAHM.

        1. That sounds about right, unfortunately. I actually really like the personal assistant suggestion Kat had on this site a couple days ago and will use it soon. I’m so freaking tired of being the only person willing to call around to find a plumber or handyman or vet or whatever. Then, of course, I’m the one taking dog to vet or staying home to let plumber in. I’m not sure he at all acknowledges that this activity is taking place – like he knows the dog went to the vet but it apparently happens by magic. The one and only time he has ever called a plumber was when I was literally giving birth and made him promise that I and baby will not be coming home to $hit floating in the main toilet. Also an enlightened man here who doesn’t believe sexism exists.

    10. Just an observation – the chores that women typically get…grocery, cooking, aspects of child care, etc. …are chores that cannot be ignored. Everyone needs to eat every day. Children need attention every day.

      But a lot of the chores that men typically get (I’m speaking in generalizations)…lawn care, trash duty, car maintenance..can be ignored or delayed for long periods of time. Your law can wait. The oil change can wait.

      It’s so frustrating. I’ve noticed it in my own life, and the only thing that helped was frank conversations with my husband. I’m not going to be the family martyr.

      1. +1 that was pointed out in The Second Shift, and once I read that I was like “oh crap, it’s true!” and got really, really angry. I am not interested in slitting the tasks like that when my boyfriend and I live together.

        It made sense then, how my dude roommate would always take out the trash, jump at the chance to put together a table (when I told him it was mine and I wanted to do it myself) and act all hurt and confused when I declined help with snow shoveling, but acted like dishwashing and laundry were the worst, hardest, most unfair things ever.

    11. I am the traveling spouse and it translates into an increased chore load because I have to prep meals, coordinate extra child care, leave a detailed schedule of what has to get done and who has to be where when, etc. When I’m home I also have to do extra housework and give my spouse and kid extra attention to prove that I still care about them even though I have been off having “fun” on the road (translate: spending up to 12 hours a day on my feet in high heels facilitating meetings full of hostile and obnoxious powerful people, while getting lousy hotel sleep, missing workouts, and eating garbage, then helping my kid with homework via text message all evening).

      1. You didn’t ask, but Anon at 12:19, you seem really frustrated with your situation and I would be too. There are a lot of changes you can make.

        1) Why are you prepping meals that you won’t be there to eat? Your spouse can fix his/her own food.
        2) Stop leaving a detailed schedule. Your spouse can and should figure it out.
        3) Why do you have to do “extra” housework when you are home?
        4) Get some pointed toe flats. Even Rothy’s points have to be more comfortable than heels all day on the road.
        5) Get some earplugs, sleep mask, and a white noise app for hotels. You should be getting great sleep if you have a room all to yourself. Make it happen.
        6) If you are missing workouts, make sure you stay at hotels with a gym. Or, Down Dog is a yoga app where you can do a 15 minute yoga video in your room before you collapse into bed (with your earplugs and sleep mask) at the hotel.
        7) You don’t have to eat garbage on the road. It’s hard but you can make better food choices at almost any fast food place, even. Grilled chicken wrap, etc… it’s not ideal, but you don’t have to eat garbage.

    12. While it’s important to make sure chores are fairly distributed, it’s also important to make sure the two of you have equal amounts of leisure time. The fact that he spends Sundays just relaxing and playing video games when he has yard work to do does rub me the wrong way, but if Sunday was literally the only day he could take some time for himself, I might be inclined to allow it every now and then (unless he had time do to those tasks and then play video games). But if you notice that he’s constantly sitting on his butt while you’re getting stuff done around that house, that’s a real problem.

      Has he actually made the case that he shouldn’t have to do stuff because he travels for work? If that’s the case, I’d remind him that you don’t expect a perfect 50/50 split but it’s his house too, he lives there and he needs to contribute to the upkeep one way or another, and not just when he feels like it. Otherwise, sit down with him (when you’re both home) and talk it out, mention it bothers you that you when he shirks the few responsibilities he has, and come out with a solution, which may be that he needs to pick up other tasks or find a way to get his butt in gear.

      And I wouldn’t necessarily jump to this, but if you need to, remind him of all the daily, mundane tasks that you take care of every evening AND on the weekends, and he just has a couple tasks he can knock off in one afternoon. You’re right, you don’t get to blow off your responsibilities with an “mlehhhh, I don’t wanna,” so it’s not fair that he gets to.

    13. The key is for each partner to have a relatively equal amount of down time. If one partner works a lot more than the other (incl. travel for work) then it wouldn’t be fair to expect them to split chores 50/50 because they’d have zero free time. But they also don’t get out of chores completely, they need to contribute to running the household when they’re around. If he has an entire day to spend playing video games then I assume you also have an entire day to do whatever you want? If not then that needs to change.

    14. Time for you to outsource yard care and poo pick up and your husband can push the grocery cart for exercise. If he can’t be bothered to leave his sofa to do so, then he gets to compile the instacart/grocery delivery order and put it all away when it arrives.

  30. Hive, I need some support. Longtime reader, don’t post much. I’ve been dating my boyfriend for just over a year and a half. It’s good, not great. I’ve hashed it out in therapy and it’s a list of incompatibilities (I wish he were more compassionate, I wish we had more interesting conversations, I wish we didn’t fight over him wanting me to be more “fun” when we go out to bars, I wish the s3x was better).

    I’ve hashed it out in therapy and come to the conclusion that while I want to avoid the discomfort now of a break-up, I know I would be doing a huge disservice to my future self to continue dating someone I can’t see spending the rest of my life with. I’m in my early/mid twenties. Not in a huge rush to get married, but am looking for the right supportive relationship and do want a family one day down the road.

    The come-to-J3sus moment for me was when I started developing somewhat serious crushes on other guys. Guys I’ve known for a while..

    I know I will be better off in the long-term taking a few months to myself and then getting back on the dating scene. But I tend to avoid pain and I’ve never broken up with someone before and I’m really struggling with this.

    1. Oh my goodness. Your list of incompatibilities is a dealbreaker. Maybe a person would be willing to put up with one of those things in an otherwise great relationship, but all 4? Absolutely not. You are 100% doing the right thing.

      Yes, it will suck in the short term. Yes, you might feel lonely and sad at times. But this is an investment in your future self. And, really, a guy who is not compassionate or interesting, and negging you about not being “fun” – you can absolutely find a better partner.

    2. Do it. Do not coast, get stuck in a sunk-cost fallacy, and end up marrying this dude you’re tepid about. Do it.

      (Meant to post here, not below)

    3. I’ve been in your shoes before! I think, that when you sit down with him and say the words, “I don’t want to be in this relationship anymore”, you will feel like a 100 ton weight lifted from your shoulders. It did for me. And what was a revelation for me, and I think may applicable to you too based on what you’ve described, is he felt the same way. Once you’ve decided on this, I recommend doing it ASAP. Don’t wait “for a good time”, there isn’t one. It will literally always seem like bad timing. Do it on the phone if you have to. And then go out and do some yoga, get a mani pedi, meet your friends for a drink, eat a great dinner, or whatevr it is that makes you feel awesome. love yourself.

    4. You sound totally checked out of the relationship, and that’s really unfair to your boyfriend. Suck it up and do it. Yes, it’s painful, but the sooner you do it, the sooner it’s over with. I’ve seen so many people waste years on relationships due to inertia, you’d both be much happier in the long run if you just break up with him.

      1. +1 Do it for yourself, but do it because it is also cruel to your boyfriend to let him think you’re fully invested in this relationship when you’re not.

      2. You must DTMFA and NOW!!!!! — I agree with the other OP’s. He sounds like my EX. Sheketovits was a lush who was demanding and the $ex was awful! FOOEY!

        Sounds very familiar, and you will be better off w/o him, even if you don’t fall into another relationship for a while (I haven’t, but am not moaning about it, either, b/c I keep busy as a partner in a law firm). Just keep in mind that there are ALWAYS men out there if all you are interested in is $ex (tho you should NOT be), and they are a dime a dozen. FOOEY on them. You look for a decent guy who shares your ideals and is good in bed. Once you have that, you will be happy! YAY!!!!

    5. Honestly, if you’re in your 20s and in therapy to try and make a relationship work, that should be the biggest sign that the relationship isn’t working. Definitely true if you’re not married. Probably true at that stage of your life even if you are.

    6. I’m 30 and if a guy told me I needed to be more “fun” when we go out to bars I would end things immediately. I think when you get older you have less tolerance for sh*tty behavior and more clarity on what you want out of a partner. You don’t enjoy dating this guy, so break it off now. Your time is more valuable than being in a relationship that’s not working, and you will find a guy that will think you’re perfectly fun as you are.

    7. Write out a very short, very simple script for breaking up with him and rehearse it in the mirror. Ask him to meet you somewhere (not your house; you want to be able to leave directly instead of him having to leave first). Tell a friend that you are going to break up with him.

      Then go break up with him. It will suck but you will be much, much happier afterwards (even if not immediately afterwards). You can do this!

      1. This this this.

        It’s one hard conversation and then your whole life will be better forever after. (I learned this when I almost had a nervous breakdown over breaking up with my haircutter!)

        And also you will be doing him a kindness by freeing him up to be with somebody who thinks he’s great.

    8. Rip off the bandaid. It sucks but it’s what you all need to do. How much will you regret pushing it off for another year?

  31. My baby is 5 weeks old. It’s my third (and last!). The weight is coming off, but a bit slower and more differently than with my first two.

    Other than yoga pants/t shirt/sneakers (my current uniform), what can I wear that is cheap enough I won’t feel bad about using it past this summer? I’d like to look a little more put together (but not much- shorts + top and not sneakers!) but traditional shorts seem to be out of the question. I tried them on in 1-2 sizes up and the fit is just not right.

    Maxi dresses would be OK, but with what shoes? And they need nursing friendly straps (must be able to cover real bra straps and huge boobs).

    The old navy t shirt dress would work, but it both runs too short for me (5’10”) and also is only crewnexk which isn’t nursing friendly. I don’t need a nursing specific top, but access is important (v neck or generally on the lower or wider cut up top).

    1. I really like Gap Maternity’s “nursing t-shirt dress.” They have it in several colors right now. I’m 5’9 and it comes to just above my knee and has easy nursing access but isn’t super maternity looking (I’m 8 months PP and it looks fine on me). I just ordered another one this week because I find myself reaching for it every weekend. Gap is 40% off right now with the code on their page, so it’s pretty affordable.

      1. I’m really glad you said this because I love the way that dress works but I’m also 5’9″ and I was worried it would be too short on me! Did you also wear it during pregnancy, and how late into pregnancy did it still fit?

    2. I love going to J crew factory for weekend wear (and casual workwear.) They tend to have those cute paperbag waist skirts that you can pair with t-shirts. (For me, separates are best for nursing wear.)

      1. What kind of Capri legging? I have capri yoga pant type leggings but unless I wear with a t shirt/tank and sneakers (which is what I do now), they just look like I’m wearing my gym clothes bc nothing else fits (which is true).

        I have Tory millers and jack Rogers sandals but pairing them with workout wear seems silly. Is there. Less athlesure capri legging I should be looking at?

    4. After my second, my summer nursing uniform was a maxi dress and light cardi. I would do strapless maxis (which you can pull down, vs pull up), and the cardi would cover up the bra straps.
      Shoes – I do the Tory Burch gold Millers. Comfortable and a bit dressier than standard flip flops
      Sleeveless tops from Loft (which you can wear later too) + cheap elastic waist shorts (so you won’t feel bad about tossing) – e.g. https://www.loft.com/floral-cutout-mixed-media-shell/474014?skuId=25574029&defaultColor=2462&catid=catl000011
      Old Navy had a lot of shorts last year, but I looked just now and they only have one style of elastic waist shorts. You could even do maternity shorts with the foldover top as the shirt will cover the top part up.

      1. I can’t do a strapless maxi – my nursing bras all have straps and I def cannot go without one. The bra-strap friendly maxi is a unicorn!

        I have 2 pairs of maternity shorts and they look really dumb- but they are full panel. The majority of the weight I’ve got left (a good 15-20lbs out of 45- but I’m tall) is in my hips so shorts are particularly tricky.

  32. DH (dear husband) travels 2-3 days per week (4-6 hour travel range) + monthly trips abroad. He is also overweight (job stress + poor nutrition/sitting during said travel). He has 3 main chores: lawn care, all kitchen cleaning, & all trash duties. We had several intense & emotional family meetings to get to this agreement (he just didn’t care about chores & did not understand why/how having a clean home affects my mental & physical well-being. We came up with an arrangement: for every 1/2 hour of chores, he gets 1 hour of video games. Once he started this plan & stuck to it, he has gotten into much better shape & also started to appreciate the peace of mind & well being that comes with clean house. Honestly, he is brilliant in so many areas of life, but was such a child in this area. I had to tell him to grow up & be an adult. It was a difficult process but well worth it. He is very proud of his house work now – he sees it as an investment/ownership stake in his property or long-term ROI/resale value.

    1. I am glad this worked for you – but it makes me so happy to be single! It is hard enough for me to parent my child. I cannot imagine having to parent another adult.

      1. Seriously! That is how you get small children to do chores, it shouldn’t be how you get a grown @ss man to contribute to his household.

        1. Yeah this. Good grief. My husband is my best friend, and I expect him to be my partner in all aspects of our life together – from the fun stuff to the mundane like childcare, housework, etc. He expects the same of me. The idea of “rewarding” my husband for taking care of normal adult responsibilities makes my brain hurt. I get people’s relationships are different, but you seem to make a lot of excuses for him all around.

          1. My father is an Ambassador. He would often mention a rule of thumb: if a thought is useful or kind, then its expression will serve both parties well.

    2. I’m the OP from above. How do you explain this without seeming selfish? He somehow doesn’t “see” mess.

      1. My husband is generally much neater than I am. He doesn’t care about whether the tub has been scrubbed but clutter makes him anxious. I literally do not see the clutter or just unconsciously work around it. Like a water bottle left on the counter – I may see it, but I don’t really recognize it as a problem because I just work around it when what I should be doing is putting it in its correct place. Or catalogs – sometimes I put them down on the table and forget to transfer them to recycling, for ages. It’s definitely very unconscious on my part. It’s hard to change!

        It’s ridiculous that your husband thinks that mowing a small lawn 1-2x per month is actual exercise, and that’s not a good enough reason to not hire someone to take care of that chore. He can exercise in some other fashion or not exercise at all. As for other indoor chores, no, he doesn’t get a pass or a reduced chore load. If he’s around on a Saturday, then he can empty the dishwasher. He doesn’t have to do it on the days he’s not around.

      2. Not the OP but dh and I have dealt/are dealing with similar issues. I think first he needs to buy into two things: (i) that his wife’s peace of mind *as such* is important, so mess should matter to him for your sake, and (ii) that “seeing mess” is a learned skill, not an inborn trait, that apparently no one taught him but he still has the capacity to learn. If that’s in place, the two of you have to work together to find a way for you to teach him that isn’t too much like “parenting” for *either of you*, which will probably require a lot of tweaking along the way.

        For me, it made a huge difference to keep in mind that no one taught him! I can clearly remember the first time I noticed the messy coffee table myself and got up to tidy it without being asked, and on the one hand I was a kid! He should get this by now! …but on the other hand, my mother had spent literally years drilling it into me before it finally took. It’s not his fault or a reflection on his character or overall maturity that no one did the same for him, anymore than that no one taught him how to host a dinner party. (It for sure reflects on our society! But I was putting that on him and it wasn’t fair.)

      3. First, agree with Lana. Also, I did use techniques I’d use with a kid: lots of positive reinforcement (praise, critique, praise). Lots of encouragement & smiles when DH did something right. Make it into fun game at first (race, bet, prizes) – I know this sounds juvenile, but DH’s mom NEVER taught him at appropriate age and waited on him hand & foot. It’s like learning a language – start small & build confidence. Also, my DH has some underlying confidence issues that led him to give up easily when he felt I was disappointed in him or unloved by me (really, my opinion of him is his #1 motivator) and if I had a positive attitude a out the process, he was into it (just like parenting). And, honestly, on my worst days & in my worst struggles, he supports me like that, too.

        1. ps – I also travel for work (we both travel) so that does affect chore workload periodically – BUT, he did not value housework as much as I do (differences in how we were raised & socialized). Now, we have learned together how to be a team & readjusted our values to one another (I am less OCD about clutter, DH helps much more, & we outsource some chores)

    3. Holy F. I don’t even know if this is a joke post to make the point that marriage is not some be all end all for happiness and proving you’re a functional adult….

      1. No, this not s fake comment and I am a real person sharing an intimate story in hopes of (perhaps) helping OP in some small manner.
        Thank you for your time.

    4. I am glad you are happy with your DH, but personaly I agree with the OPs who think he is a bit of a child. I would not want to be married to a guy who didn’t know that being fat, sloppy and lazy was a turn off. He seems to have improved, but that should be a GIVEN! FOOEY on that!

      I also am single, but hope for the best in my next relationship. I know I have the power of the HIVE behind me, so I am invincible! YAY!!!!

  33. Do it. Do not coast, get stuck in a sunk-cost fallacy, and end up marrying this dude you’re tepid about. Do it.

  35. Yay teal! I like this shade so much. After Gucci launched in one of their shows last year, it began a trend in our city centre bahrain stores. Not to mention this shade has no found a place in my wardrobe

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