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Updated: Apr 14, 2021 447 Comments · by

Splurge Monday’s Workwear Report: Houndstooth Jacquard Sheath Dress

The Personal Shopper (TPS)

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Our daily workwear reports suggest one piece of work-appropriate attire in a range of prices.

Are any of the other WFH ladies going into their closets and staring longingly at their sheath dresses and blazers? This houndstooth sheath has beautiful, classic tailoring, but the combination of cobalt and black is a little more fresh-looking. I would wear this with the cobalt blazer I’ve had my eye on for a while, or with black tights and boots when the weather gets cooler.

The dress is $1,595 and available in sizes 2–10. Houndstooth Jacquard Sheath Dress

Two more affordable options are from Lafayette 148 New York ($224 on sale, sizes 20W and 22W still in stock) and Max Mara ($626 on sale, sizes 2–14); two even lower-priced alternatives are this black/cream houndstooth sheath from Calvin Klein ($52–$105, sizes 2–16) and this ModCloth dress ($74 on sale, lucky sizes XL–4X only). 

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About Elizabeth

Elizabeth is a 30-something lawyer living on the East Coast. She spent seven years as a Biglaw associate in NYC, three years as a partner at a medium-sized firm, and is now in-house counsel for a large company. She loves Diet Coke, '90s sitcoms, and dresses with pockets.

Comments

  1. I have no consistent handle here

    I bought two new work dresses (ON ponte sheaths with short sleeves and pockets, I think it was a rec here) in March. They arrived the last week I was in-office and I wore one of them the very last day I was in-office. The other one still has the tags on and it makes me SO SAD.
    Must physically appear at a work mtg today (it really isn’t doable at a distance). First time I’ve put on a “real bra” in 6 weeks. Am also going to go to the grocery store for the first time in 6 weeks.
    Was job searching at the beginning of the year. Had great leads and lots of interest. But this is an industry that has been hard hit and is unlikely to bounce back quickly/
    sustainably so i am coming to terms with the need to swallow my frustrations and deal with current boss.
    Or, cashing it all in and moving to the mountains.

    • In-House in Houston

      Could you post a link to the ponte sheath’s you mentioned above? Did you like them? TIA!

      • Anonymous

        It’s this one although I also got it in a jade green kind of color. Short legged apple and they fit great, the ponte is juust thick enough but not too heavy for spring/summer (ha). Pockets are big enough for my iphone S. And they were cheap enough that if they pill up etc I might not be heartbroken. Actually they could easily be weekend dresses with sandals, so they probably have a long life for me regardless.

    • Ellen

      Don’t worry. If this dress looked pretty on you then, it will look even nicer on you once we are beyond this virus. You sound like you have your stuff together, so hang in there and the HIVE will get all of us through it! I hope that Nordstrom can weather the storm as there simply is no other place b/c even Saks is running into trouble with this virus, and so is Macy’s. FOOEY on this virus for messing with all of our lifes!

  2. Anonymous

    Good morning all! My city is reopening some parks today and I’m thrilled. Only the largest ones, only for passive use, masks required and available at the entrances, City employees on hand for education re social distancing. I’m just really happy to see a) some reopening with b) a lot of caution

    • Anon

      That’s wonderful. It’s what my city has done all along and has worked well. The parking lots are a bit more crowded, there are more new users, but they don’t venture very far, so it’s easy to stay well away from others, and the local mountain bike association has done a great job of education re: “Don’t ride on wet trails!”

      • AnonATL

        I am so glad our county re-opened parks. They were closed for about a month which really bummed me out. If you aren’t an idiot, it’s not that hard to maintain social distancing at a passive park (hiking, biking, and walking trails). I realize the trails are narrow, so passing people is a bit risky, but it’s minimal imo.
        We have a local park that is mountain biking and hiking, and I’ve definitely noticed more families and novices there, but everyone has been polite and keeps their distance except from their own household members.
        Does the soul some good to be back out in nature.

        • Anonymous

          I’m glad parks are open but it is difficult for some of us to social distance because runners and bikers come up too quickly behind you & you don’t have the chance too move. It’s really frustrating because I live near a very wide walkway where they could easily go around you but … they just don’t :(. You don’t have too be an idiot in order to have someone run up and breathe on you.

          • Anonymous

            Yes but also there’s no evidence that passing contact is sufficient for transmission. When they do contact tracing they don’t even ask about this. A running right next to you for a while is an issue. Passing you on a path is probably not, and if you’re wearing a mask, even lower. If you’re truly worried about this you can definitely stay home but many of us with a more rational approach to the risk are ready to get out.

            And with parks closed, our streets got even more crowded!

          • AnonATL

            Right, so I’m certain there are places in the US that are dangerously crowded particularly in urban areas with limited green space.
            In my area, there are a lot of parks and sidewalks that are not crowded even on great weather days. I’m extra vigilant because I hike and walk alone so I always have ears and eyes open and step off the path if someone needs to pass and it’s a tight area.
            It should also be runner/biker etiquette to alert you of their passing. It’s pretty common here so slower traffic doesn’t get knocked over.
            My frustration was that there are plenty of ways for people to get exercise at these parks safely to prevent them from being closed, particularly in my not densely populated area. Just because that’s the case at my park, doesn’t mean it is at other parks.

          • anonshmanon

            I am a runner, and most of my route is a super wide trail (12 feet or so), so it’s easy to keep a distance even if groups pass each other. I see that most people try to be really mindful and compactify when they notice us approaching, and DH and I squeeze together or pass in single file, as needed. There are however, those hikers that will just amble along the path smack dab in the middle, leaving limited space on either side. It would be so much easier if they could pick a lane (unless they are distancing from the trees!). But the thing is, these few instances (one or two per run, versus 5-10 well distanced encounters) just get me exasperated by a disproportionate amount. I need to remind myself that the majority of people is mindful and doing their best.

    • Cb

      Our parks have remained open and I think it’s been really helpful. We have a small garden but it’s nice to just let my son run or cycle. Everyone has been very sensible about social distancing, with able-bodied folks walking on the grass, leaving the paths to those who are less stable on their feet or have buggies etc.

  3. anononon

    Gorgeous.

    If you felt you were in a good place financially and wanted to help out the economy, what would you do? I’ve given money to charity, and will probably give some more, and I’ve bought a few small gift cards to restaurants. I worry that I will buy a gift card to a restaurant that won’t reopen, but I guess that’s the risk I have to take. Should I shop? I don’t really want to buy stocks right now. Buy from local stores? Big stores?

    • Anonymous

      I wouldn’t. You acting alone cannot help the economy out of this. I would instead focus on helping people. For me that would mean supporting food banks primarily, and also my fave local businesses, not because you’ll be able to save them, but because it is a kindness.

    • Cb

      We’re weirdly better off during lockdown than at normal times – no giant nursery bill. I’m trying to bolster our emergency funds but also divert the money we typically spend on life out and about (lunches and coffees, museum entries, random stuff) to small, local businesses which are struggling. I’ve been placing orders at indie bookshops, the local tea and coffee shop, and a restaurant which has rejigged to do home deliveries of prepared meals, meat, and produce. We’re also doing all our shopping at the little natural foods shop – more expensive than the big stores but I like keeping them in business and really feel confident in their safety protocols.
      My local school has kept a school lunch programme + food pantry up and running and I’m trying to supplement. I swore off Amazon this year but had to relent as all the DIY shops etc are closed. As penance, I order a box of granola bars, porridge sachets etc with every order.
      I hope this will be a permanent change as a result of the crisis – those businesses have really suffered and I’m looking forward to going and spending money in them once this happens.

      • Anonymous

        Sadly, in my city, it hard for mom and pops to re-tool and get the word out. They don’t have a big IT budget or media spend and are depending on local TV news stories and their own facebook sites. I am rooting for them, but I think that the younger crowd just does amazon and door dash on autopilot (which is ruinous for small restaurants) based on the delivery drivers buzzing around our complex at mealtime and the boxes in the recycling area.

        • anon

          Just FYI for people reading, we use Door Dash and Seamless to find what we’d like to eat and then just google the restaurant and order directly from them. So that’s an option if you are ordering takeout.

        • Anonymous

          This may be different because of where I live (midsize suburban town outside of Boston, predominately large single family homes with the average adult age in the 40s) but the local business network has done an amazing job of utilizing facebook (where all the adults in town look for info) to get the word out. Most of our still-open stores are restaurants that have re-tooled and our chamber of commerce keeps weekly list of which ones are still open and if you should order direct/via an app (people want to do what’s best for the business but some businesses prefer it). There is also a companion page that shows what stores are offering: limited menu, new family style offerings, regular menu, take-and-bakes, etc.

          Our local art shops have done a great job of “to go” kits and bags, as have local bakeries. My favorite is our local kids indoor playspace – nobody is going there for a LONG time- has started doing weekly art kits you can subscribe to ($20 for a kit of activities for the week), an online youtube channel to watch, birthday-parties-to-go ($100 for a birthday kit in a box delivered to your door), and character visits (character comes to visit outside, drops off a little gift, does a little song and dance). It’s probably not equal to their income when open as a playspace but they are waitlist-only and expanding every week.

      • Nonny Mouse

        Don’t underestimate the difficulties those museums (and zoos, nature centers, etc) are facing as well. A great deal of their budgets come from vision fees and program registrations, which have dried up. And most workers there make barely enough to survive.

    • Anonymous

      I had your same internal gift card debate and decided that it is a no-strings loan if the business survives and a bit of $ to pay employees and suppliers and other bills to kick the can down the road a bit even if it ultimately doesn’t make it.

      Our breweries, largely built for on-premises consumption, are open but only with to-go service. I waited in a distanced line (I was glad to see that there was a line!) at two this weekend and bought one growler at each, a gift card, and tipped generously on the whole balance. Today I can do this. Tomorrow I might not. But for all of these businesses, their “tomorrow” is here today.

      Formerly, one evening out would have been at least as much for a good sitter alone, never mind any evening activities.

    • Anon

      Many of our small, local stores are doing online order/curbside pickup and I’ve been buying things from them. Most of these are owner owned and operated and the owner is the only one running the place and fulfilling orders. The little plant store I love is doing curbside pickup so I’ve bought a couple of plants. I bought $60 worth of vinyl albums from the local music shop for my husband’s birthday and the owner was so incredibly grateful that I wished I had spent more. We are getting takeout from different local restaurants once a week. It doesn’t take a large transaction to make a difference for some of these folks. For some of them, if they get 8-10 $50 transactions per day that might make the difference between staying open and closing down permanently.

    • Ribena

      I’ve been doing my grocery shopping at a local independent grocery rather than a big chain, spending £17 on a bottle of wine from a deli instead of £9 in a supermarket (tastier too!), getting takeaway more often than usual, that kind of thing. Books hand delivered from the local bookshops too.

      • Houda

        What book shops hand deliver books? I am in central London and have been trying to get my hands on some

        • Ribena

          I’m in Edinburgh so I don’t know what the London indies are doing, sorry – I’d work down a list of them and check each of their social media posts to see what they’re up to? If you can’t find any, both Golden Hare and Lighthouse in Edinburgh will post out to you!

    • Anon

      Money to food banks is so, SO important, and shopping and dining from small, mom-and-pop businesses as often as possible.

      I’ve tried, too, to be more conscious of the size of stores I’m buying from. Just a tiny example, but I needed more athleisure (aka, workwear ;) ), so I placed a large order this weekend from my favorite regional department store instead of Amazon or Target. Heaven knows those behemoths are doing just fine, but a brick and mortar regional department store might not fare so well. (And if you need cozy lounge tops, Belk has tons of options on clearance for $10!)

      • Anon

        Oh, look to Etsy for things if you can! Masks, candles, bath bombs, etc. I ordered two candle samplers from a tiny shop. (Clearly the quarantine finally got to me this weekend – online shopping binge…in the name of helping the economy, of course ;))

    • Pure Imagination

      I’m doing money to a food bank in the town I grew up in a few hours away. The area has high poverty despite being adjacent to extreme Bay Area wealth. I also plan to support a local food bank as well.

    • Anonymous

      I gave to my two local food banks and a local nature non-profit. I deliberately chose smaller, local charities as that is immediate cash for them, as opposed to waiting for money to dribble down from larger organizations. We are ordering pickup from local restaurants, as Door Dash etc. are horrible, and I tip at least $20 for every order. I’ve bought $100 gift cards at my local coffee shop, and when it gets down to about $20, I add another $100. I drop a $5 in the tip jar for a cup of coffee, and I get a SoBol lunch once a week, and tip $5.

      Our local New Balance stores are family owned, which I discovered on Facebook. I emailed with the owner, and he shipped me a pair of shoes, no charge for shipping. I might have paid a few dollars more than at Zappos. I really needed some underwear, so I ordered it from Kohl’s. Kohl’s is a medium-biggish company, but they’ve been working hard to survive, and they employ a lot of people locally.

      Maybe to sum it up, I am spending more time and maybe a little bit more money to seek out companies that are owned locally, or at least employ people locally. I do cash or a cash equivalent as much as possible as that’s faster and eliminates any processing fees.

    • anon.

      We both have jobs. We do well (not as well as many on this board, but I’m saying the number so you understand it was a sacrifice) – our total income with two children in daycare is about $150K. We gave $1000 to our local foodbank. It was a stretch for us but we wanted to feel it.

      • Anonymous

        Out of complete noisy curiosity, how much does daycare cost? On face value 1,0000 out of 150,000 pretax doesn’t seem painful. Generous, but hard to contextualize based on the provided information

        • Anonattorney

          Speaking for myself, daycare for two kids is $35k a year. It’s EXPENSIVE.

        • anon

          I’m the one who posted that. We already give about 10% of our income (about $15K a year to various charities we care about), preplanned. Our daycare costs right now are about $32K total. So the additional $1K hurt, but we wanted it to if that makes sense. I am on a few non-profit boards and we say we want our board to ‘feel it.’ It isn’t always easy but it’s very important to me and my husband.

    • The original Scarlett

      We’ve redirected our giving to small businesses and people we love and hope survive this in whatever form they’re accepting, whether that’s go-fund-mes, purchases, direct gifts to venmo, gift certificates, etc. I’d rather give directly to the people I love and support than wind it through charities.

    • LawDawg

      A local homeless shelter is housing people throughout the shelter is place period. That includes feeding people in hotel rooms and in a larger group. They are doing this with restaurant deliveries and sign up online to order a meal. If there is something like this near you, you can support a local restaurant and a local charity simultaneously.

    • Nina

      Honestly, donate the max to Biden. That’s going to have the most impact to help the most people long-term. Being really real here.

    • NOLA

      My church is doing a big push to restock the food pantry as demand has been extremely high. They are taking monetary donations, but apparently have been having a hard time convincing stores to let them buy in bulk. I tried to place an order for pickup with Sam’s so I could buy larger quantities of canned meat and tuna, but every single thing I tried to buy at the local store was out of stock. I ended up just buying peanut butter, Vienna sausages, and tuna at my local independent grocery store and dropping it off at the church. I think a lot of people did that because they announced at the online church service that they had received thousands of pounds of food in the past week.

    • No Longer Anon

      Food banks are absolutely slammed right now, so been donating to there.

      But I’m also donating to small, local legal aid organizations who are not funded by LSC, especially as the number of callers they have skyrocket. We have an Unemployment Law Project in Washington that has not only been getting a record number of calls, but also training other legal aid agencies, law students, and pro bono staff to take unemployment cases or advise claimants who are denied.

    • Mal

      If you’ve never made jam, preserves, or pickles, it’s so fun! I would start here…a great resource/how-to guide:
      https://foodinjars.com/
      Also, pretty much any jam you make doesn’t have to be canned – you can just pop it in the fridge.

  4. Ribena

    Foodies, any projects over the weekend? I baked my first loaf of sourdough yesterday and it was actually okay – I overproofed it and couldn’t get it into any sort of shape so just baked it in a loaf tin, but it tastes good and has some bubbles. And last night I made a courgette galette from a Gail Simmons recipe – I’d never made proper pastry like that so I’m chuffed out how delicious it was.

    • KS IT Chick

      Peanut butter-oatmeal no-bake cookies. Easy, but so good and comforting.

      • givemyregards

        Oh god – the last time I made these (plus chocolate chips) I basically ate two pounds of cookie dough by myself in two days (and this was in the before times). So, so good.

        • KS IT Chick

          I am allergic to chocolate, so I can’t add the chips. My husband asked for these, and I made them with the agreement that we wouldn’t eat all of them in one night!

        • KS IT Chick

          1/2 cup butter
          1/2 cup milk
          2 cups granulated sugar
          1/2 cup peanut butter
          3 1/2 cups quick cooking oats
          1 tablespoon vanilla extract

          Heat the butter, milk and sugar over medium heat to a rolling boil, whisking or stirring constantly boil for one minute, continuing to stir.

          Meanwhile, put the remaining ingredients in a large heat resistant bowl. Pour the hot mixture over the cold, stirring in till everything is combined.

          Line a baking sheet with waxed paper or parchment paper. Got tablespoons of the cookie dough onto the baking sheet.

          Allow the cookies to set up on the counter or in the fridge for two hours.

    • FFS

      Dinner rolls and cornbread. The dinner rolls were a first, but I was really pleased with how they turned out. The cornbread I’ve made before but have started to experiment with – I used coarsely ground cornmeal this time, which gave it a nice bite, and a swapped out some of the white sugar for brown. Super delicious.

      I’m looking for a really decadent new cookie to try – probably something with chocolate and/or caramel if anyone has suggestions.

    • Cb

      Sourdough here – but I’ve been baking it for about 6 months. It came out really nicely. I find the long fridge rise to be more effective. I also made burrito bowls and apple and rhubarb crumble. The weather was so nice that we ate outside on Saturday PM.

        • Pure Imagination

          I used the Smitten Kitchen version with the shorter lemon layer and my husband said they were the “best ever.” I thought they were great too, but might consider using one regular lemon in addition to the Meyers to pump up the citrus flavor a tiny bit. Enjoy!

        • Celia

          King Arthur’s Cookie Cookbook has a terrific recipe for lemon bars. I cut back slightly on the sugar and skip dusting powdered sugar when it’s cooled. Don’t miss it.

    • Anonymous

      I made the Chicago-style deep dish pizza from Sally’s Baking Addiction. It was delicious. The recipe makes it look like much more work than it really is. But do not take the author’s suggestion of using a hand mixer unless you want to scrape dough out of your mixer with a toothpick. If you don’t have a stand mixer, just mix and knead by hand.

    • Too much Great British Baking Show

      I made a riff on Mary Berry’s meringue roulade and added some strawberries in with the lemon curd and whipped cream filling. Big split down the middle, so Paul would’ve taken points off, but it tasted incredible.

    • Ses

      spanish tortilla! & homemade pico de gallo because the veg box people are giving us too many tomatoes.

      • anon

        Nice! Where do you live that tomatoes are coming in? In the Northeast here and they won’t be here until July.

    • dawgs

      I read this as “cougarette gallet” and thought it was some sort of meal to lure the young men. :)

    • CountC

      I made fresh pesto and I am obsessed with it! I also made a crushed chickpea salad to counterbalance the pizza I ate all weekend after ordering from a local shop on Friday.

    • Senior Attorney

      Made baguettes for the third time and they actually turned out well this time! Yay!

      Opened the WaPo online yesterday morning and saw “avocado toast pizza,” and lo and behold I had all the ingredients so that’s what we had for brunch after a 6-mile walk. It was delish.

      Yesterday was my dad’s 94th birthday so I made a batch of Doubletree Hotel chocolate chip cookies and took them to him. Had to drop them off outside the assisted living facility but he called to say he got them and liked them.

      Tonight I’m making Nini’s masa ball soup from Top Chef.

    • anon

      Made two bon appetit recipes over the weekend from their baking series.. the sour cream and onion biscuits… these were great. Easy recipe to follow, would try again with different flavor combos. I am freezing some of the unbaked biscuits to bake later, so we will see how they do. and the pistachio carrot cardamom cake. This recipe was a bit fussy, but overall good result and nice change to a traditional carrot cake.

    • Thanks, It Has Pockets!

      I made hot honey chicken in my slow cooker last night, using the recipe on the Mike’s Hot Honey website. I added a bit of pepper to balance out the sweetness, and it came out fabulous! Served with mead that’d been made with hot peppers and had a little kick to it.

    • NOLA

      We made skirt steak tacos on Friday night and they were so incredibly good. I don’t know how, but the skirt steak came out perfectly. I also bought corn on the cob, which went on the grill, and dude made fresh pico de gallo and added avocado and grated cheese. So fresh and delicious. I didn’t cook or bake at all this weekend. Had a somewhat serious bike accident (nope, not posting about my bike) so I laid low and let him wait on me hand and foot yesterday. He put together a pretty delicious spinach and artichoke dip and I just sat on the sofa working on a work project, eating crackers and dip, then a peanut M&M chocolate bar because he ate all of the good desserts on the one night I wasn’t there.

    • Mal

      If you’ve never made jam, preserves, or pickles, it’s so fun! I would start here…a great resource/how-to guide:
      https://foodinjars.com/
      Also, pretty much any jam you make doesn’t have to be canned – you can just pop it in the fridge, which saves fuss.

  5. Fear and loathing

    I am dreading the day I try on any clothing item of mine with a fixed waist.

    To get in an 8+ hour day is now taking >12 hours with stopping to get kids’ lunches and dinners and the endless zoom calls (and my work calls that are “crisis management” or “let’s get this alert out” vs billable stuff). So the idea of using the free weights that I’ve used sporadically for decades is just getting a bitter chuckle these days.

    I will trade them for a chicken in the not-too-distant future I’m guessing. And in the my world is now Mad Max (the one with Tina Turner), I suspect that I am not getting cast as the Tina Turner character (#goals though — one day I may grow up to have legs like that).

    • anon

      I totally hear you, I’m in the same boat. One thing that I’ve been doing is I put light free weights in the entrance to my kitchen. Every time I go into the kitchen I do 2-3 minutes of lifting. It’s barely noticeable in terms of time it takes up but I figure over the course of the day I get at least 15 minutes of some activity.

    • Anonymous

      The non-billable calls/videoconference are killing me. And that doesn’t even include all the non-mandatory catch-up calls with everyone I’ve started skipping. Like, I know people are slow and want to publish 8 million things, but I’ve still got billable work I’m trying to do (sadly I’m an associate and can’t say “No, I won’t help you, partner, with your client alert”)

  6. Anon

    Anyone have a rev for a place in the US where I can order scones to be shipped to the DC area for Mother’s Day?

  7. Paging 'Rette who suggested Dip Night

    My manager said he had “Dip Night” at his house this weekend. Thank you!
    (This was in the thread about kid-friendly recipes.)

  8. anon

    I was travelling domestically 50% of the time prior to pandemic – lots of flights, meetings and conferences. Ironically, I was musing to DH that I wanted to travel less and spend more time with him (we are empty nesters). 8 weeks WFH with no travel and I am well rested, physically stronger and exercising much more outside, getting to do things I hadn’t been doing in a year – cooking healthy meals, reading, more outdoors time. Careful what you wish for I suppose…..definitely beats hours on a cramped air plane East to West coast time zone changes, lost sleep, hurrying from one task to the next and always feeling behind. I want to retain many of these benefits and wondering if things will stay this way or if I will have to make a conscious effort?

    • Anon

      I didn’t travel quite so much – I averaged probably fifteen 2-3 day trips per year (US and Canada). I don’t think there is any way I go back to that frequency. I think companies are 1) figuring out how few meetings have to be in-person, 2) going to be reeling economically for a long time, and T&E is easy to cut, and 3) hopefully going to be wary about exposing more employees than necessary to the increased exposure possibilities inherent in travel.

      On a personal level, I’m pregnant and expecting in October, so there’s no way I’m traveling for work any time soon.

      • Anonymous

        I’m not in a business travel industry, but my husband words for a large bank that hires a lot of consultants. We were talking about consultant travel this weekend and how we think it’s going to change in the future (if at all). We both think that it is, mostly because the client won’t want to be the one asking people/consultants to get on a plan to travel to them more often than is necessary. Also, are the consulting firms really going to ask people to get back on planes traveling at the frequency they were before? So I think it’s likely mostly going to be that the client doesn’t want to be the one responsible for the risk (maybe like 45%), a small amount (maybe 40%) that the consulting firm doesn’t want to ask it’s employees to do that and the balance is that you’ll have employees who, now that they’re not traveling all the time, want to travel less.

        • anonchicago

          Consultant here.

          I agree that clients won’t want consultants in their offices immediately, especially since consultants are usually flying through LGA, ORD, etc. with more opportunities for exposure. My firm management is planning for this especially for travel in the coming months. I would like to see the consultant team room concept of 6 people crammed in a tiny office or conference room go away as a result of COVID, but I think that’s unlikely.

          That said, I think many partners are eagerly awaiting the time where they can put everyone back on a plane M-Th. It’s harder to sell projects remotely, especially follow on opportunities for additional sales and expansions of the team. Even though consultants are all tech savvy and able to work well remotely, leadership can be very old school around wanting people on site and visible.

    • Veronica Mars

      I think for the corporate traveler, things won’t return to normal for a long, long time.

      • anon

        OP here….thanks Veronica Mars and Anon….I feel physically and mentally so much better that this 8 weeks of 100% WFH has shown me that the travel was taking a toll. A bit of a test that I didn’t sign up for:) and I love the results! Prior to the pandemic, I think I was like many road warriors that may not have wanted to admit that they wanted to stop traveling. Business travel is seductive….makes you feel like you are working hard, so productive, in demand. So much to learn from this…..

        • Anon

          I feel like I could have written this post word for word. I’m so happy not to be traveling. I traveled every week in February and while that was a bit more than average for me, it wasn’t the first time. Usually 50% travel. I don’t seem to miss it at all!!

      • Anon

        I hope this is true. I spent a lot of time ping-ponging back and forth between our home office and a satellite office in another state and I really hope our management, and the management at the satellite office, have figured out that there is absolutely no reason to have people attend meetings in person out at the satellite office just to be there physically. It was a lot of money and wasted time spent on travel when virtual meetings work just as well (or better). However, I predict within a few months of the lockdowns lifting rationality and common sense will depart and we’ll be back to traveling two days to attend one two-hour meeting.

        • Pure Imagination

          I agree that there was a lot of money, time, and carbon emissions wasted on travel. I’m hopeful that in my industry, there will be more of a permanent shift to Zoom because it really makes zero difference to the work quality.

          • anon

            I disagree that Zoom is a perfect substitute but agree that a LOT of business travel is really unnecessary and could be cut down significantly. Sometimes in person meetings really are necessary or much more productive but hopefully this situation shifts the default from “we should meet in person” to “we should do this via zoom unless there’s a good reason to meet in person”.

          • Pure Imagination

            Anon at 10:01, I agree completely – that says it better than I did. It would be great to reserve the in-person stuff for what counts (which in my industry is site visits, although even some of those can be done remotely) and skip the “fly four people to DC to chat with client for one hour” type of meetings.

        • anon

          OP here….I love the support for this change in the way we work….TBH I haven’t talked to anyone who wants to go back to the level of business travel they were doing previously!

        • anonymous

          I can’t believe your company would make you travel just to attend a two hour meeting. I work with people in India and across various US time zones so we always have online meetings. I hope more companies move towards virtual meetings.

          • anon

            OP here….oh yes, fly in to another city for a 1 hour meeting and you aren’t even the speaker.

          • Anon

            Yes, it is patently ridiculous. We used to be able to do an out-and-back day (leave at 6:30a, return at 7:30p) if our physical presence was required. Then airline schedules changed and you pretty much have to spend the night and leave for home at 6:00 the next morning – and you are expected, after your flight lands, to go directly to the office and work a full day. Even though we have to get up at 4a to make the 6a flight. If you couldn’t tell, I’m pretty over it. Those of us at the home office have agreed we will lobby hard not to resume the travel to the satellite office. Things are running just fine doing everything over Skype and email.

    • Anonymous

      I can’t see frequent business travel resuming any time soon. Even if your company allows (or forces) travel, it’s likely that other meeting participants won’t be willing to travel or participate in large gatherings, either for safety reasons or for financial reasons.

    • Pure Imagination

      I am in a similar boat. Although I really miss my physical outdoor hobbies, dropping my 2.5-3 hour round trip commute temporarily has been so great for adding time back into my day for exercise and my indoor hobbies. I also work more productively from home, am healthier, and am better able to manage my chronic health condition I am in treatment for. It’s going to be hard to go back.

      • Anonymous

        I wonder if people will start living 3 hours from work now on the thought that “I can just work remotely” is something to tell your employer.

        • anon

          Yes, that will be interesting. I work for a technology company that expects 100% remote workers…..your location doesn’t matter. We travel to office and to customer locations, conferences as needed. Wondering if this will become more accepted by other industries and companies….

          • Anonymous

            IDK — for on-the-job training (a lot of law for the first few years, teachers, medical things), it can’t happen now. We know two students who can’t complete their training to even do their jobs b/c that has to be done on-site, in-person. Some supervisors can work remotely, but how to you student teach remotely? A lot of health professions are essential, but their trainees aren’t getting trained b/c practices are shut down except for ERs, OB essentials, some chemo (but not biopsies). People are getting laid off so training isn’t a priority.

        • Thanks, It Has Pockets!

          I don’t know if it’ll be quite that extreme, but I am hoping that more companies open up to the idea of remote workers (or at least contractors) during the pandemic, since everyone’s at home anyway, and then once things have steadily gone back to normal, seriously consider if they need to ditch the remote workers for more local talent or if keeping the remote workforce might work long-term.

        • anne-on

          In the last two large multinationals I worked at you can indeed work from home where ever that may be, BUT your pay band was tied to your location. So, I had a co-worker at my last job move from San Fran to Boston and they took a pay cut due to the band being lower as the COL is still high, but not AS high. Geographically though, the bands “stretched” pretty far in areas with commutable suburbs (you got paid DC rates if you lived in MD/VA), NYC rates if you lived in NJ/CT, etc.

    • Anonymous

      Last year was the first year post-kids that I had status. Now, I am grounded. I am in a flyover state and my competitors are in big cities (where my clients are), so I am feeling weak and exposed, like everything I’ve worked hard to build will just crumble and fade away and there is nothing I can really do about it.

      • anon

        OP here…..I hear you. Everything has changed and we had no vote in this and no control over the situation….

    • The original Scarlett

      I think zoom/video will be the forcing factor to limit a lot of unnecessary business travel. I don’t think all of it will go away. I predict a slow return with more thoughtful trips that include more of a networking component (hard to get on zoom) than just going to meet all together.

  9. Anonymous

    Posted late day last week so not many saw it, hope people don’t mind a repost — if you are higher risk (or maybe share a home with a higher risk person), would that “prevent” you from switching jobs in a few months — say anytime between July and next spring? I’m in a situation where I really do not like my job substantively but I will give them credit — they shut it down early, aren’t rushing the return, and it’s not the type of place where you’d be pressured to do something risky. I see value in that as I know from friends that there are managing partners etc out there eye rolling and the day the state opens you’re back or else watch out for a lay-off. So I see value in how my employer is doing this esp as someone who is “only” 40 but has another condition that adds risk. But the thought of doing what I do for 2+ more years (or even 6 more months) because it’s safe makes me want to cry. Would you pursue another opportunity if you could get it (big if given the economy)? Would you directly ask said opportunity how they handle covid/telework? Basically WWYD.

    • Ribena

      I’m in a vaguely similar position where I’m on a secondment at the moment that comes to an end in December and I need to decide what to do next. My firm have been amazing through this, just as they were when my grandad passed two years ago. I’d probably look through my LinkedIn to see if I knew anyone else employed by my new prospective employer and reach out and ask them how that firm has been handling things.

    • Anonymous

      I think you’re borrowing trouble. First, find a job. Then, get an offer. Then, ask them about their covid-19 response. Reality is it might take you a year to get another job offer and the questions you’ll be needing to ask by then are likely completely different.

      • anon

        +1 I see no issue job searching right now. Once you have an offer in hand, then you can ask all of these questions but there’s no reason to decide now whether or not you’d take a non-existent job offer.

    • Anonymous

      I’m in NYC, am very high risk right now and will remain very high risk for six months at which point I will be medically “cleared” for regular life again. I am starting a new job in two weeks. I waited until I got the offer, asked about their response, and explained I may need an accommodation to work remotely for six months even if restrictions were lifted. They did not care at all. It’s obviously a little different because my condition is temporary but I think most (reasonable) employers get it.

  10. Anonymous

    When life first paused, for the first 4-5 I was quite content. Took a while to realize it was because everyone was home and not out to brunch or parties with friends or walking hand in hand with their boyfriends or their kids every time I went it. For the first time, me not having a life wasn’t in my face. Well life must be returning to normal because in the last 4 days, I’ve learned of a former associate’s promotion to partner, attended a virtual wedding, and woke up to a string of texts that another had a baby. Yay other people. Life is returning to normal as they find joy even in these times and I’m still sitting here with no life.

    • Anonymous

      not to be rude, but if you were unhappy before you will be unhappy now. not preaching at you, i am realizing i filled up my unhappiness with a bunch of things that i can’t do anymore (shopping, brunches. partying etc.). Cliche but we have to create our own happiness, whatever that looks like.

      • cbackson

        Agreed. OP, I was basically married to my job for most of my 30s. I watched my friends date, get married, and have kids. I danced at weddings and threw baby showers and a sometimes I did go home and sob because it felt like none of this would ever happen for me. I had friends, but not big groups of them, so I was never at brunch with tons of people or off on a girls weekend with a bunch of single friends. I spent a lot of time with my parents and sometimes felt like a super lame failure for that reason. I did solo New Year’s Eve trips, because otherwise I would have just been sitting in my apartment.

        But at the same time, I wasn’t unhappy. In fact, I was actually pretty happy most of the time, because at a certain point I realized sobbing in my shower about my singleness and wondering why I didn’t have a huge network of girlfriends and feeling like I “had no life” was only making things worse. A great deal of happiness is not in your circumstances, but in your mindset.

        • Anon

          Once your circumstances hit a certain point, it is about your mindset. Being unemployed, radically underemployed, or in debt will make your life miserable. Truly not having friends is challenging. Not having family, or having dysfunctional family, is miserable. When you have a reasonable job, can pay your bills, have a workable relationship with your family, and have some friends, you are in a place wherein you can choose to be happy.

          A lot of the time, happiness is understanding that you’re doing okay in one or two areas and killing it in many others, so overall, life is good.

        • Anon

          I had (and have) a great life outside of relationships, but for a very long time what I wanted, or needed really, was to love and be loved. No amount of magical thinking BS was going to change that. I really struggled to admit that, because I thought I should be enough to make myself happy. And now, that I am lucky enough to have that, I can still feel the unhappiness creep back in certain situations, like right now when my pandemic has my partner and I doing long distance for the foreseeable future.

        • cbackson

          For clarity, I’m not suggesting that circumstances = perspective. There are all manner of circumstances that are objectively awful, and your attitude will not change the existence of those circumstances. But it will, in a lot of ways, change how you feel about living through them. For me, getting to a place where I could accept and acknowledge my situation and feelings (I’m single after a shattering surprise divorce, I feel incredibly alone, I desperately want a family and don’t have one and may never have one, and all of this makes me sad, scared, disappointed, and angry) meant first that I wasn’t miserable, and eventually that I was happy, even though aspects of my circumstances continued to be something I didn’t want. IDK how to explain it better than that.

    • Anon

      “Life is returning to normal as they find joy even in these times and I’m still sitting here with no life.”

      I will get roasted for saying this and not just patting you on the head and commiserating, but going to say it anyway: having “no life” is something you are in control of. If you aren’t happy with your life, and where you are professionally or romantically or personally, you can do things to change that condition. If this time has brought into focus that your life is not what you want it to be, look at that revelation as a gift and think about what you would change if you could. Finding a partner is a lot about luck so you may not have control over that. Having a child is something you can do on your own if you want. You can also find meaningful ways to be involved in a child’s life that don’t involve being a parent. If your job/career path is unsatisfying, you have control over that. When you see people who are living their best life, please know it is not just because they got some golden light shining on them from above that made everything come together the way they wanted. Choice, intention and work are involved as well. You can look at other people and be salty about what they have that you don’t, or you can make a different choice that is probably going to be more satisfying in the long run.

      • Anonymous

        Honestly the job thing is that only thing that can maybe be changed for most — OP doesn’t say what industry and in some industries the training time was so long, you’re locked in. As you say partners are often about luck. Kids sure it’s great if you want one solo, but if you don’t/can’t the whole “be in a child’s life” stuff is BS. Sure you can find a child to take to the movies or bake with once a month, but guess what said child is with their parents now, not the aunty down the street who sneaks them chocolate.

        • Karen

          You could do Big Brother Big Sister or other mentorship programs like that. Even if kids have to stay with mom and dad they appreciate having an aunty to reach out to and to get a different adult perspective from.

        • Anon

          I really hope that my new baby will have a meaningful relationship with my friends as he grows up. They are already asking if they can be aunts, which is great, considering that my sisters are awful people and not a part of my life anymore.

        • Pure Imagination

          +1. OP, don’t judge your life against your friends’ highlight reels. Work on developing your own hobbies, interests, and passions and you’ll get to a place where you feel like you “have a life” – although you already do! You’re living and a person and therefore you have a life, even if it’s not the one you want right now. The good news is that you can change that.

          • Is it Friday yet?

            Also, none of these external markers of “success” mean these people are actually happy. For example, I’d rather be single than living in separate bedrooms with a husband that hasn’t shown me any affection in months (i.e. the specific situation a close friends groupchat is currently blowing up with – and believe me, her life looks AMAZING on instagram). Once you scratch the surface, lots of people are secretly miserable about something – and no one is going to swoop in and fix it for any of us.

      • Vicky Austin

        I have to agree here too; this is the thing that stuck out to me most about your post, OP. You assume that your life has no joy just because it’s not exactly like your friends’ lives. There’s lots of joy out there; there is enough for you.

    • Anonymous

      I feel you. Though I get my share from FB parents whining 24-7 about their kids. We get it, it’s hard. You chose to have kids. Did you assume it’d never be hard?

      • Anonymous

        Eff you. Nobody chose to have kids in lockdown.

        And to OP, suck it up, buttercup. My family is planning a Zoom funeral for my MIL, who died of COVID-19. Y’all can quit complaining and keep social distancing so no one else has to die just because you are lonely.

        • Anonymous

          Huh? Did you even read? OP wants social distancing to continue abc life NOT to normalize.

      • Anonymous

        You chose not to have kids. We get it, it’s lonely. Did you assume it’d never be lonely?

        • Anonymous

          It’s not lonely. I’m loving this and honestly hoping it doesn’t go back to regular life for a while. See how that works? Thought thru the choices.

          • Anonymous

            Ummm she’s responding to someone complaining she is lonely. Not asserting all single people must be.

          • Anon

            Based on this response, I would imagine that you are alone because you are a distasteful person who is difficult to spend time with. It likely has little to do with your choices.

          • Anonymous

            I’m not the OP — I’m married, no kids and honestly I’m fine with the staying home with husband set up. Sorry you’re not enjoying it.

        • Anon

          I desperately want a family, I always have. It’s not a choice I made to be alone right now.

      • Anonymous

        I don’t get this — did any of us sign up for coronavirus lockdowns?

        And most of the people I know who chose to homeschool are SAH moms, so not FT working moms. Even the SAH moms I know who usually send their kids to schools are not loving this b/c they have all 3 of their kids being told to be on zoom calls at the same time and trying to do school via glitchy non-road-tested technology. Even retirees are missing out on the life events they have waited forever for — yes, you can go on a cruise later, but your kids get married (at least for the first time) once and it would really make me sad to miss any grandkids, especially when they change so much when they are little and you may want to help out your children especially then. People who have businesses are watching them circle the drain. Like who is “oh, as I expected”?

        • Nina

          Haha @ “oh, as, I expected”. Global pandemic in my 34th year, right on schedule! Well said.

      • anon

        Ugh, I’m so over these comments. Parents didn’t sign up to have their kids home 24/7 with no childcare while working full time.

        Same way that people who chose to live alone didn’t sign up to have no human to human contact for weeks on end.

        Same way that people who chose to open a restaurant took on a risk in opening their business but didn’t sign up for forced closures.

        No one signed up for this. It’s hard for pretty much everyone.

        • Anonymous

          So you never thought anything would go wrong in life? People don’t open businesses with planning for what happens if I don’t have income for 4-6 months, how will I float? That’s your own lack of planning. No one thought THIS would go wrong but people really don’t plan for anything ever going wrong? No wonder they are so beside themselves.

          • Anon

            This is a silly comment. No one is crying because they thought nothing in life could go wrong and something has. People are responding in this way because this event, at this scale and of this duration, is unprecedented in our history.

          • anon

            This comment makes no sense. What exactly did you do to prepare for a global pandemic?

            Many people (and a lot of posters on this board in particular) have substantial emergency funds, backup plans on backup plans on backup plans but this isn’t really something that anyone expected or could have prepared for.

          • LaurenB

            “So you never thought anything would go wrong in life? People don’t open businesses with planning for what happens if I don’t have income for 4-6 months, how will I float? That’s your own lack of planning. No one thought THIS would go wrong but people really don’t plan for anything ever going wrong? ”

            As my 100 yo grandmother who just passed (and no one could attend her funeral, either – I just have pictures that the funeral home kindly sent) would have said: “What a piece of work.” No, no one “planned” for a pandemic. My children are grown and so I don’t have child care issues, but my friends who do — it’s just dumb luck, not superiority of planning, that some of them had au pairs who are able to continue child care as normal and others used daycare centers which are now closed and so they are scrambling.

      • CPA Lady

        I’m not who you’re addressing, since I try not to whine about much on fb….

        It’s hard every day and it was hard before covid. Yes, we all knew that going in. But being trapped in my house for six weeks straight with who knows how many months ahead while having two parents trying to work full time while keeping a five year old (who also did not sign up for this) busy is … yeah, I actually did assume it would never be THIS hard. Which was reasonable, since a global pandemic and social distancing of this magnitude has not happened in 100 years. And when I signed up to be a working parent, daycare and school was something that existed. And I have it a lot easier than a lot of people (e.g. literally anyone who has kids younger than my daughter is def struggling way harder).

        ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ So. no. I didn’t sign up for this. But here we are and I just gotta try to make the best of it and get through it the best I can.

      • Anon

        Tht is harsh. I am usually here for all manner of mocking “you can’t understand how hard it is!!!”, because the sanctimommies are so full of themselves. (I am a mom and firmly believe that no one wants a 24/7 account of how perfect or perfectly difficult motherhood is.) But this is hard on everyone in different ways and grace is in order.

    • Anonymous

      A virtual wedding in no way is a return to normal! They couldn’t celebrate a major life event with the people they loved! Giving birth in a pandemic isn’t normal! They may not even be able to introduce babykins to grandparents.

      Im single too. And it is very sad. But I truly feel better about my life when I am empathetic to the struggles of others.

    • Anonymous

      Agree with others re creating happiness etc but OP why on earth do you feel that just because everyone is out to brunch with 10 friends while you take your order to go or is walking hand in hand with a guy holding shopping bags, they are happy? Maybe they are, maybe not. Spent all of my 20-30s in NYC doing the brunch with friends thing. If you saw our table, you’d assume happy. For me it was a lot of — IDK if I even like these people anymore, I don’t want to face the week because I hate my job, let’s go drink that away.

      • anon

        This is a really good point. I also did a lot of this in my early 20s and suppose my life looked fun/happy/awesome because I was out to brunch with groups of girlfriends or dancing in bars. In reality, I didn’t really like any of those people, it was just a way to pass time and distract from my unhappiness. I’m much happier now although my life looks a lot less awesome from the outside I’m sure.

      • Anonymous

        Same. Lots of groups of superficial friends out there. If you simply want that (I suspect you don’t), you can find that. Heck there are even meetup brunch and happy hour groups; there are college alumni groups out there doing things. These aren’t the best of friends, these are people who decide they don’t want to sit home alone. Nothing wrong with doing that post stay home; you get out to some restaurants, maybe you meet friends, maybe you don’t but it’s at least plans.

      • Anon

        Yeah, very much agree with this. You know how hard it is to have a big group of 10 girls who go to brunch? Hard – if they all have even remotely demanding jobs, you’re probably getting 10/20 invited. How many of those people are actually close? Not all of them do, I can assure you. Some of them would rather be home in sweats or picking up takeout with you.

    • Airplane.

      Nowhere in this comment do you express any desrie to take the reins of your own life to make changes. I’ll never understand this. You have autonomy. Use it.

    • anon

      A wedding, a baby, and promotion to partnership were all in the works long before covid-19. The fact that a baby was born is in no way a return to normal. I understand that you are hurting and I understand the urge to hide from it. I’ve been there. The only solution is to put in the work to build the life you want. The whole “oh you can do it all by yourself, have a kid alone if you want” is lame advice– no, it’s not the same as having a kid with a partner and people should not try to pretend that that’s a viable or desirable substitute. But you can add more joy and meaning into your life and you can go after the things that you do want. You may not get them (as people have pointed out, finding a partner involves lots of luck) but you definitely won’t if you don’t try.

      • Anonymous

        “The whole “oh you can do it all by yourself, have a kid alone if you want” is lame advice– no, it’s not the same as having a kid with a partner and people should not try to pretend that that’s a viable or desirable substitute.”

        Here’s a wake-up call for you and all the other folks out there bemoaning what they see as a lesser alternative to getting exactly what they want: life is not fair, and sometimes we do not get exactly what we want, but we can end up with an alternative that makes us just as happy as the ideal would have made us. I am old and have old friends and I can say with authority: the women who had kids without partners are 1000x happier with their lives than the women who wanted kids and never had them because they kept waiting for the right person to come along. It is not easy, being a single parent, but guess what? 50% of the women who got married when I did ended up as single parents anyway, through divorce or death of their spouse. I also know people who got married to have kids with a partner and are so unhappy they would probably push their spouse off a cliff if they got the opportunity. As cbackson says above, happiness is largely about mindset. I also think that for people who are educated, employed and have some level of resources at their disposal, happiness is a choice. If someone really wants to be a mother, as a mother I say go for it, and I will also say there is nothing in the world that could have served as a substitute for having a child, for me. It is not an experience for everyone but for those of us who want it, the opportunity is out there.

        • anon

          Did you even read what I actually wrote as a whole or did you just find one sentence and pounce because you were so eager for the chance to brow-beat someone? Good lord.

          All I meant was that it is pretty dismissive to act like being sad that you won’t get to experience having children with a loving partner is not valid because you can “just” have a baby by yourself. It’s not the same thing, as you acknowledge. It’s annoying af to have to explain every teensy tiny caveat to the sentences you write lest someone find some way to attack you for it. Hope you feel better for having jumped down someone’s throat this morning.

          • Anon

            Yikes, Anonymous’s reaction is wayyy over the top. anon, you were totally clear in your original comment. I got what you were saying.

        • anon

          +1, I agree with this. Before I met my DH, I was almost certain I was going to be an SMBC because of my age. I was very, very fortunate and things moved quickly with my DH and we have a healthy child and another one on the way. But there are still moments I wonder if the SMBC route would have been better for me because I am not great at compromise and have very strong ideas on how I want to raise my children. I spent a lot of time on SMBC forums and the resounding theme was that while you have your entire life to find a life partner, you have a very finite amount of time to have biological children.

          • Anon

            Any chance you could share which SMBC forums you find the most helpful? I’ll need to make this choice in the next couple years. Thanks!

    • Anonymous

      Your friends are definitely having brunch, getting married, getting promoted, and having babies just to rub in your face how much of a loser you are.

    • anon

      So in the last four days, you were important enough to at least two friends to be included in their virtual wedding and notified of their new baby. Is there a reason you did not attend brunches or parties before quarantine? I’m not saying finding a life partner is easy, but you can make friends and do things with friends if you want to. Take the bull by the horns. Take this time to think about and appreciate the things you have to offer the world and other people so that when it ends, you can hit the ground running.

    • Anonymous

      Just wanted to chime in with commiseration and support. You’ll get through this.

    • Thanks, It Has Pockets!

      I’m so sorry, that’s gotta feel rough. And it probably feels unfair, all that stuff seems to just come to others so easily while you have to work at it and nothing has happened for you yet. But I’m going to encourage you to keep at it. I know it’s hard right now, when you can’t go out and see people, but try reaching out and asking people how they’re doing. Try hosting some virtual hangouts! You do have friends if they’re including you in these big events, but I also know the pang of seeing pictures of parties and brunches and wondering why you weren’t included in those – you can take the initiative to plan those things once this is over! And you can branch out, make new friends when you are invited to parties, take up new hobbies and find a community that way.

    • JB

      I have a lot of sympathy for this poster. I had THREE friends tell me that they were pregnant in the last 10 days. It can definitely create a spiral of despair, especially when it feels like in quarantine that you can’t progress against your family goals (if single). I have been there (am still there at times).
      While I agree that you have to try to create the life you want – be the one that reaches out and organizes the brunches. F-it and throw a big birthday party – that’s not going to work right now. What helps me is to really dig into that panic. Why am I upset about not having children? Is it social/ family/ friend expectations? Is it the cuddling and joy? Is it the person to take care of me when I’m old? Then I go into what is the worst case scenario of not having children and try to think about what I can do to compensate. Build broader cross-generational relationships. Maintain close ties with my friends kids. Compensate with hobbies and travel to find alternative areas of focus.
      I don’t know what a therapist would say, but this approach helps temper the panic for me.

      This is hard for many people in many different flavors.

  11. Shananana

    A commentor on the weekend thread happened to hit on a topic that has been coming up a lot for me during this quarantine. I am 37, single, usually pretty happy that way, no desire for kids, have a 12 year old dog I credit with much of my mental sanity. When I turned 30, I set three goals for my 30s, after spending my twenties feeling like I was flailing. Complete my MBA, break 6 figures in income (at the time I was making 50K), and buy a house. I threw myself into it and had completed all three goals by 35, and with my latest job have hit 150k/year. And yet now I feel stuck suddenly. I threw myself into my career really hard for the the last 7 years, and I am so proud of what I’ve done, but now that I am at a point I am happy with my career, I can’t seem to turn that work is #1 drive off. I am 100% sure I could still be good at my job and well compensated and not feel like it always has to be my top priority, but I can’t seem to actually figure out how to do that. I wouldn’t say I sacrificed my personal life, I have great relationships with girlfriends and family, but dating and making any new friends definitely took like 4th place in the priority list, which means it never really got prioritized at all. I come from strong blue collar working poor roots, and so all I know in being successful is to put your head down and work hard.

    I guess what I’m looking for is, if some of you out there have gone through similar things, how do you start setting those boundaries and making your personal life a priority? I feel like I am good with boundaries in other areas, but the idea of trying to meet people for drinks on a work night causes me anxiety of the well what if I can’t leave work on time. But my role is such that rarely am I really in a position of not being able to leave when I want to. I do have plans to also start working through this in therapy, but I find that hearing from people who have really lived it and come out the other side helps me a lot more to get my mind right than just theories (even when those theories work).

    • anonymous

      I’m like you, except a few years younger. Your last bit about boundaries really resonated with me– especially being afraid that I can’t leave work on time even if there’s really nothing actually preventing me from leaving except for the vague sense of dread that I have an endless pile of work to get through. Been working through this in therapy. Apparently, being intentional in how I spend my time is the key. For example, make a decision to leave work at 6:30 and stick with it, even if I don’t have specific plans. I have to be prepared that I’ll feel uncomfortable with having time to kill when “I could be working,” but I need to reset my mindset so that I’m not prioritizing working all the time and squeezing in little bits of social life only where work allows. I’ve done this successfully in the past with prioritizing time consuming hobbies. It’s uncomfortable at first, but I generally find that once I get into the routine and get positive feed back (read: happiness) from participating in that hobby and see that the world won’t collapse if I take a half day on the weekend to do it, it’s easier to prioritize than some vague notion of “having a life.”

      The other thing that’s been helping is reminding me that even though I like my coworkers and we are all very social, work is not my boyfriend. Guess who has been emotionally supportive during the pandemic? The guy I started dating at the beginning of the year. Not the people I work for.

    • Airplane.

      Can you join a morning running group? A lot of people with high level jobs can’t choose when to leave the office but they can choose when to start their day. Get up early and find people who also have time then for a shared hobby. A lunch meet up to deepen existing friendship? Weekend meetups for hobbies or volunteering or a neighborhood activity? I understand the issue of drawing boundaries at work (these days I feel like I just half work the entire day and night instead of 8-9 hours of straight focus then go home and just have leisure time to socialize/exercise)

    • Mal

      I don’t necessarily have specific personal experience with your exact situation, but reading your post had me thinking…why don’t you apply some of the goal-setting skills your clearly have to this part of your life? You were able to achieve so much (MBA/income/house) because of your ability to focus and goal-set. I feel you could use these skills to work toward the non-work part of your life as well – think of this time as you optimizing your life outside of work. Set specific goals and timelines (don’t have to be huge changes), and see what happens!
      Also, might be helpful to see these goals as something that it helpful/beneficial to your work life – not a negative. In the long run, the individuals who are able to have a little more balance in their lives, I think, are able to have more effectiveness and longevity at work. Best of luck!

  12. North Korea

    Is anyone following this? I am having weird flashbacks to my childhood and TV news noting “no one has seen the leader of the USSR in X days”.

    To the extent that there is news, what is a reliable source for getting news out of a country like North Korea.

    • Anonymous

      What is the significance of the train? I keep hearing the train is moving/has moved? Does that require KJ be on it, can’t they move it empty to show that he’s fine and headed to the vacation home or whatever? Is there something more to it?

      • Anonymous

        The whole thing is so strange — he is dead/brain-dead/on vacation (see, look at the train!). They seem to know that every country that can tracks that train. What is in the train, who knows? I am not a doctor, but I bet I’d have a huge case of the yips if I had had to operate on that guy. Dude blew up his uncle with a missile.

    • Anonymous

      Well South Korea is insisting he is fine and they’ve got a pretty good finger on the pulse of things.

      • Anonymous

        Where is he then? It is Dictator 101 that you don’t miss major dictatorship celebrating media events.

      • Anon

        I think South Korea is not unbiased here. Their currency plummeted on the news he was seriously ill. I trust the reports out of Japan the most (since China is also not unbiased).

    • Anonymous

      DH and I saw different sources over the weekend – i saw that there were no reports of South Korean or Japanese medical teams therefore he was fine. DH saw a very different report that basically suggested he was in a vegetative state. Any kids? Neither of us could recall any clear line of succession except possibly his sister?

      • Anonymous

        IIRC he has at least one kid, but that kid is <5. Wife does not seem to be cut from Cersei Lannister cloth.

    • Senior Attorney

      I don’t know but I follow Molly Jong-Fast on Twitter and she has been doing hilarious posts about how she is next in line to be dictator of North Korea.

    • Anonymous

      It’s called Weekend at Bernie’s. Original was pretty funny albeit stupid. Assume this one will be too…

  13. Estate Planning - MA

    Is anyone willing to share how much they’d expect to pay a lawyer to put together a will and possibly related documents in MA? Most important to us is appointing legal guardians for our child and making sure all of our assets go into a trust or some other format that can be used to cover child-related expenses the guardians would incur. Our assets are not complicated – equity in a home and some retirement, brokerage and savings accounts.

    Also, any referrals are appreciated!

    • Anon

      We just did this in the first quarter. We’re pretty uncomplicated. After reviewing all of our assets and liabilities with the attorney, we decided to set up trusts, in addition to all of the standard will, POA and guardianship paperwork. The final bill was $2,250. We used Bartlett Law in downtown Boston. Super small practice but strongly recommended to us, and I would in turn recommend them to you.

    • Diana Barry

      For a plan including trusts for both spouses, wills, POAs, HCPs, I usually run $4K if plan is simple (midsize firm). I won’t recommend myself though! ;)

    • Anonymous

      We got a quote for $2,300 but didn’t end up getting it done until after we left MA.

    • Anon

      A few thousand. Will, living trust, advance medical care directive, durable power of attorney. Know who your executor will be, and your child’s guardian plus a backup, and who will have your durable power of attorney and medical authorization if your spouse can’t do it.

    • Nuthatch

      We just completed this process in the DC area. Cost us $2,000 for everything. We also have simple assets. Did everything, including trust, guardianship, POAs, etc., including a sort of “permission slip” that outlines who would watch our kids if we were temporarily indisposed. Received many copies of that last document and distributed (notarized) originals to the folks on our temporary guardianship list. Highly recommend this for peace of mind.

  14. Question - authority

    During my yearly evaluation, my manager told me that while I am well-liked and that everyone enjoy working with me, I do not project authority and should be more assertive.
    I was a little bit surprised. I’m 40 and work as a project manager. I have been at this company for the decade and in this position for the past 6 years. All my projects have been successful/well executed. I work well in a team and I favor a collaborative approach.

    When I asked my manager to provide me with specific examples where I do not project authority, she shrugged and said that when I speak I should be more directive.

    I now to have to write a developmental plan on how I will be more assertive in my role. Do you have any tips for me? Books/websites I should consult to help me? I think this is a little bit over the top but I like my job and will play the game for now.

    • anon

      Random, but somethings I’ve run across in my male centric work place: Are your email and verbal communications littered with pleases and thanks you and “could yous”? Are the email and verbal communications of the men or women who you admire, who are also in similar positions of authority to yours worded the same? If so, carry on. If not, you may want to consider changing your communications to emulate theirs: example might be make the comms down to the point, and hold the thank you till the end.
      I try to be REALLY direct but also thorough at work: I need This from you, for these reasons (if applicable) at this time. Let me know if you can’t do this or have concerns or questions. I appreciate your help.Thanks – Anon
      In my company this sort of email will often entail a lot of following up, it’s a large place and people don’t know me from Adam…
      YMMV. I may be too brusk.I will say I’m not in a managerial position of authority but I can get people moving when I start emailing and calling people. It’s what the men do though (without even the thanks at the end) so…when in Rome..

    • Anon

      Being more directive could be as simple as framing tasks as statements, not questions. “Chris, please send me that report by COB” vs “Chris, could you please send me that report by COB?”

      And are you sure you’re making decisions quickly with your team? Do you try to do too much consensus-building? E.g., “Hi all, I’m thinking the project should go this way – what do you think?” and then letting that open-ended brainstorming phase go on too long.

      I’m seeing this play out in front of me right now as my husband’s “chain of command” at work is four levels of women, all of whom are incredibly well-educated and intelligent, but who spend WAY too much time being “nice” and letting everyone share their thoughts/suggestions and not enough time being managers who say, “Ok, thanks for that idea. Let’s get started on Option 3 and circle back at the end of the week to see if that’s working.” Taking too much time to build consensus and make everybody happy can frustrate employees whose job involves completing concrete tasks – they can’t do anything until a path forward is decided.

    • Anonymous

      This is gendered nonsense. If you start using more “direct” language in emails etc., what do you want to bet that your review next year will say you’re abrupt and unapproachable? Play the game, by all means, but know that this is not about you at all.

      • Amber

        Agree – it doesn’t sound like you actually have a problem with the teams that you work with if the situation is as you described. It sounds like your boss is the problem so maybe focus more on how you communicate with her. That is too bad that she couldn’t give you examples. Do you think she was saying that just for the sake of having some criticism to give in your review? Good luck!

    • Anonymous

      I worked with a speaking coach a couple of times, once to get rid of my Valley Girl accent and another time when I had a big presentation coming up and felt rusty. You might suggest you try something similar.

      • Anon Probate Atty

        I’ve been wanting to do this forever. Do you have a recommendation for a voice coach – hopefully someone who can meet over the phone or Zoom?

    • Question - authority

      Thank you all for your input. I think that it is not all about me and that Amber might be right : my manager might have gave me those criticism to put something to improve in my review. She did made a big deal out of it but when I asked for examples she had none. She is usually not shy about speaking her mind usually so this was a strange.

      I will write this development plan and give a little bit more examples on how to be more directive. I usually am good/quick at taking decision but it is also true that I sometimes ask people of my team for their opinions in order to have a consensus. I will see if I can shorten the delay that may rise for those discussions. I will also try to be more directive in my approach of delegating. We will see.

  15. Anon

    Currently working about 90hrs a week (normally work 38), in the office as an essential employee.

    I live alone so minor cleaning, laundry, etc is all on me.

    Normally I know the answer is to outsource, but that’s not an option right now. I’ve wayyyy relaxed my standards but some bare minimum things still need to get done.

    How do you manage crazy hours, keeping things running at home and keeping your sanity?

    • Anonymous

      If you’re gone 90 hours a week, is your home even that messy. I’d get paper plates etc so you don’t have to wash dishes and let dusting, vacuuming go. Personally I’d focus on laundry as the must do task.

      • Anon

        I’ve been lazy and instead of unpacking my bag or putting things away that night, I just dump it all and deal with it later

        • AnonInfinity

          When I go through periods of working a ton, I will make myself set a timer for 15 minutes before I go to bed and tidy up for that time period. I can get a surprising amount done in that time. I usually prioritize dishes so the house doesn’t smell and then any visible clutter, like putting things away that were sitting on the table or unpacking a bag, etc. When the timer goes off, I stop. Like I literally stop in the middle of folding a load of laundry. The stopping part is important for me because I prove to myself that I truly only have to do 15 minutes per day.

          • AnonInfinity

            Also, by “dishes”, I mean the mixing bowl and fork I used for the bagged salad I ate for dinner. I do not try to make elaborate meals during these times. The points about streamlining your routine so you have less to do are really good as well.

    • anon

      The thing that would help me most is to realize that (a) this is temporary, and nobody expects it to be sustainable in the long run, and (b) the most important “extra” to focus on is your mental health (whatever that looks like for you).

      Practically, I’d just eat frozen meals and switch to paper plates and plastic utensils. I’d wear only washable items and buy enough underwear to only have to do laundry every 2 weeks. I’d pick out a work “uniform” and take a few minutes to move those items to the front of my closet so they were easily reachable. Basically, I’d streamline my routine so that I had to make as few decisions as possible.

  16. Equipment Clothing - Sizing

    Can anyone at the upper end of straight sizing (10-14) tell me how Equipment clothing fits? I have never tried on this brand and see some conflicting information, but I find “size down” often doesn’t apply at the upper end.
    Thanks!

    • Notinstafamous

      Size 10 here, normal keep the standard sizing. I like their wrap dresses but find their shirts are very straight cut and aren’t great if you’re well endowed. Slightly short on my long torso. For some reason the dresses are great but I find that my ample butt is too much for their pants regardless of size.

    • editrix

      True to size to generous in blouses. I wear a 10 or 12 on top, somewhat busty with broad shoulders; I could get away with a M but a L is more comfortable. Love the prints!

  17. Gardening

    DH has expressed unhappiness with our “gardening” relationship. He travels during the week (Pre Covid), we both have busy jobs (and I tend to be exhausted by Friday), so we usually garden on one weekend morning each week. I think my gardening drive has always been fairly low, and I’m on an anti depressant which likely doesn’t help. I enjoy it once we get going, but am not good about initiating, especially when I’m tired or stressed with other things. We don’t have kids, early 30s, been together since high school.

    This issue comes up every few years between us. Any advice (besides the obvious of just initiating more)?

    • Pure Imagination

      My advice? Only initiate more if you actually want to garden more. It doesn’t sound like you are unhappy with the frequency, although perhaps there’s more context that we’re not seeing. DH can express his thoughts and preferences and as a good partner, you should listen, but (and I know that some will disagree), I do not think that you should ever do it when you don’t want to (no exceptions). Being “meh but maybe interested” is different from “no, I’m not in the mood but DH clearly wants to.” Make sure that whatever you decide, it’s based on what YOU want, not just what he wants.

      • Anonymous

        I take the opposite view. If you made a commitment to a life long exclusive intimate relationship you have an obligation to try to make it satisfying for both of you. Which to me means if, like this poster, you do enjoy it once it starts, and your partner would like you to initiate more, you try out thing like setting calendar alerts to initiate and see how it goes instead of just sitting back doing nothing and letting your partner suffer.

        • Pure Imagination

          I don’t know how much “suffering” is going on when they already garden once a week, but in either case, I agree that OP can try initiating more IF, and only if, she wants to. Her partner is well within his rights to bring up the issue, but a preference is not a demand or an obligation.

          • Anon

            She said she enjoys it once they get going. I don’t think anyone is suggesting she do something that makes her miserable or physically uncomfortable just for the sake of keeping a partner happy. But if you know you enjoy it once it gets going and you’re just feeling too tired to initiate, then yeah you should absolutely make an effort to initiate more. I don’t agree that once/week is a normal gardening frequency for a childless couple in their early 30s. Now, being outside the norm for frequency is 100% fine if both partners are satisfied with it. But he isn’t and is telling her what he needs, and part of marriage is doing what you can to meet your partner’s needs.

          • anon

            Wow, what a judgmental way to start that post. For a lot of people, 1x/week isn’t enough. It’s totally reasonable to characterize that as suffering, especially if the person who wants to garden more is also feeling rejected or not desired. If he’s traveling during the week, he may be feeling a lack of intimacy and connection overall.

          • Anonymous

            He doesn’t sounds like he’s demanding anything. Just that he’s shared that he’s unhappy. And she wants to fix this!

          • Pure Imagination

            Yikes, where are you getting those ideas about what’s “normal” gardening frequency? Every couple is different.

            OP, only you know what’s right for you. IMO, every relationship should default to the person with the lower drive because the alternative is the lower drive person having sex when he/she doesn’t want to. The higher drive partner can leave if he/she is unable to respect that or live with it – harsh outcome, but that’s their right. At the same time, it’s important for every couple to communicate, make time for each other, share intimate moments of all kinds, etc. There are a lot of ways to demonstrate your love and commitment to your partner besides having sex. What can your husband do to show that to you as well?

          • Anonymous

            Pure Imagination you are the yikes poster here. You’ve taken a reasonable question about how to manage a difference and painted her husband as a demon with no basis. Not productive.

          • anonymous

            I commented below but if we defaulted to the person who has the lower drive, we would probably never do it. So I initiate even if I don’t feel like it. Physical intimacy is something that’s important to my husband, so I will compromise even if I don’t feel like it. I’m sure my husband also compromises in other ways for me. It’s not a black and white issue for me and that’s what works for our relationship.

            To be blunt, guys just need to get off sometimes. It’s just a physical need and sometimes he does it on his own and other times I’ll participate.

          • Pure Imagination

            The OP asked for advice (wasn’t just venting) and I told her what I would do (and have done, successfully – my marriage has never been better). Saying I implied the husband is a demon is putting words in my mouth. I’m sure she can figure out if she wants to look into it or ask more questions or go a different direction.

          • Anon

            There are studies about normal frequency and most of us also have anecdotal evidence about it. The normal frequency matters because if he said he needed it twice a day, I think we’d all be rolling our eyes and saying he was the problem. But saying he’d like it twice a week is a lot more reasonable. It doesn’t mean OP has to do it if she doesn’t want to, but the reasonableness of his request (as defined by how far outside the norm it is) is relevant to the discussion.

            Pure Imagination, are you married? how long have you been married? Because I’ve been married for almost 20 years, and a big part of making a marriage work is listening to your partner’s needs and doing your best to meet them, within reason. As discussed above, him wanting to garden more than once/week is pretty reasonable, and since she enjoys it once she gets going, initiating more than she currently does is something she can do to meet his needs without sacrificing her own well-being. Absolutely, if gardening is unpleasant for her, she shouldn’t suffer in silence. But that’s not what her OP said.

        • Anon

          What if you really hate it and you have no drive because you know it’s going to be miserable? Husbands really ought to get it through their heads that if it isn’t good for us, we don’t want it, and perhaps before whining about their unmet needs, ought to consider that they are getting more satisfaction than we are.

          • Anon

            That wasn’t at all what she said in her OP, and the responses would have been very different if the question was framed that way. This is a straw man and you know it.

          • Anon

            Based on the nesting, it is clear that I was responding to Anonymous at 11:04, and was doing so because it is actually my marriage. Have a muffin and return to commenting once you’ve gotten over Monday morning.

          • Anon

            But the person you were responding to was giving advice to OP, who made it clear she enjoys gardening once it gets going. It was advice to her, not general advice for every situation. I literally just ate two banana chocolate chip muffins but thanks! :)

          • Ellen

            I think that gardening is a mutual thing. If the OP does not want to do so with the frequency of the husband, she should NOT have to increase frequency just to keep him happy. Right now she is in a place in her life that she should not have to be an orifice more often then she is comfortable doing. Perhaps they could get to the root of the issue with a pastor or marrage counselor, and from there, they can work it out. If on the other hand there are other issues that can NOT be resolved, then it does not make sense to commit the OP now to start having s-x on his terms.

          • Anon

            There was no need for you to attack me, and you know it. That comment attracted plenty of other follow on comments that were not directly related to the OP. That is now internet discussions work. Bye bye now.

          • Airplane.

            “Husbands really ought to get it through their heads that if it isn’t good for us, we don’t want it”

            No, CLEARLY not all women feel this way. As evidenced by this board – a lot of women like it once it has started, just don’t want to initiate, and some women are willing to engage in gardening even if it’s more satisfying for the husband or because it’s the husband’s love language and the husband also provides love in the wife’s preferred language.

        • Anon

          So wait, if her idea of a perfect partner is one that wants intimacy once per week, does she get to bring that up? Why it is always the woman who needs to change?

          • Anon

            They’re both changing. Even if they increase the frequency somewhat, he’ll still be gardening less than he would like, and she’ll be gardening more than she would have otherwise. It’s called compromise, and it’s kind of a fundamental part of marriage. All partners with different libidos should meet in the middle, regardless of the genders of the people involved.

            Also, I’d point out that most marriage counselors consider sex a really important part of a healthy marriage, and people almost never end marriages because they’re having too much sex. But they end marriages all the time because they’re not having as much sex as they would like to be having. So if the low libido partner really wants to remain married, it would be in their interests to at least move in the direction of what the high libido partner wants. This again has absolutely nothing to do with the genders of the people involved. I would say the exact same thing to the man if he was the one with the low libido.

          • Anon

            But if sex is bad, it is due to other problems that are not solved by having more sex. If your spouse does not want to have sex with you, that is a huge massive red flag with an attached bullhorn that there are problems in the marriage. More sex is not fixing that.

          • Anon

            @Anon at 12:36, I don’t think that is true at all. People have different libido levels, and wanting sex less frequently than your partner doesn’t imply sex is “bad” at all. Some of us can be very attracted to someone, and very in love, and still satisfied with weekly (or less) gardening. External forces also play a role – I want to garden way more on vacation (well, back when we could take vacations) and it’s not because I was suddenly more attracted to my spouse or that there were problems in my marriage that vacation fixed. It’s because I didn’t have any of the stresses of daily life (work, bills, chores, etc.) so I could focus more on my spouse. My understanding is that this is incredibly common.

      • Gardening

        From OP: I’m happy with once a week, but he is not, and I do want to takes steps to improve our relationship. He seems to see it as an indication I’m not as into the relationship, and as it has been a recurring issue, I’d like to work on it. But I’m not entirely sure how (or if anyone else has been in a similar situation, with one partner’s drive higher than the others). Appreciate all your input.

        • anonymous

          I’ve been married 20 years and have a low drive. Just do it. Just initiate even if you don’t feel like it. Reach over and start rubbing his leg or kiss him or whatever would get things started. Honestly it feels like a chore sometimes for me, but I’m happy once it’s done. Sometimes I’ll fake my way through it. That’s the truth. If we only did when I wanted to, it would probably be never.

          Sounds like this is a love language thing for him. He feels loved by physical intimacy. You probably have different ways of feeling loved and hopefully he is meeting those needs for you.

        • Anonymous

          I’ve had success with identifying what does put me in the mood and deliberately doing that. I like a Sunday afternoon half nap reading saucy literature in bed. He likes when I go do that and then call him to join.

          • Anon

            +1 My relationship has had the same issue as OP’s, and this has really helped.

          • Anonymous

            Yes. I have perimenopausal changing hormones and my drive goes up and down a lot more than it used to. I have found “saucy literature” to be a big help when I am not really feeling it but want to initiate – or even be more enthusiastic when he does.

        • anonymous

          How about increasing touching and physical intimacy that doesn’t *necessarily* lead to gardening? It sounds like he is interpreting the frequency of gardening as negative commentary on the relationship, which means that there’s an emotional component and underlying insecurity which is probably what’s causing the bulk of his stress. Anyone can get themselves off. But gardening is about intimacy, connection, feeling desired, desiring your partner, feeling loved, feeling valued. There are other ways to do that without all the “effort” of gardening (because let’s be real, sometimes it is effort). IME, once you start increasing touch, that naturally leads to more gardening. Hugs, cuddling in bed/on the couch, arms around each other when you walk, when you walk into the kitchen and he’s making coffee, put your arms around him and kiss his neck and then go on your merry way to get orange juice. Caress his back lightly when you walk by. Put your hand on his thigh when you’re driving together. Just speaking for myself, little gestures like this make me feel wanted and desired and cared for. If you have a more responsive desire, you might find that it’s easier to increase touch like this (which in turn could lead to you feeling more desire) rather than jumping right into something more explicit (and less sustainable) like surprising him with lingerie and a strip tease (initiating that way would be my personal nightmare, and I’m someone who would garden 5x/week). Good luck!

          • Ellen

            I think that gardening is a mutual thing. If the OP does not want to do so with the frequency of the husband, she should NOT have to increase frequency just to keep him happy. Right now she is in a place in her life that she should not have to be an orifice more often then she is comfortable doing. Perhaps they could get to the root of the issue with a pastor or marrage counselor, and from there, they can work it out. If on the other hand there are other issues that can NOT be resolved, then it does not make sense to commit the OP now to start having s-x on his terms.

        • Never too many shoes...

          I have two suggestions, OP.
          The first is to suggest that you self pleasure more often – often, having more orgasms leads to wanting more, so it might help with your libido.
          Second, it seems like when you say “garden” (shudder, I hate this) you are talking about penetrative sex. Maybe initiate something less intensive for you – have yet to meet a man in my life that would turn down a bj. Win/win. And for many women, this is a big turn on in itself.

    • Anon

      If you are responsive (not much inherent drive but need to get started to want it), then HE should initiate more, maybe once on a weeknight early in the week when you aren’t exhausted, and see how that works.

      • Anonymous

        Eh I’m not sure about this. 1. If the issue is that he doesn’t feel wanted, then him initiating more doesn’t fix that. 2. Given that this is a recurring issue over many years, I’m guessing he’s tried to initiate and has been shot down a lot. It can be hard to keep putting yourself out there. And if you’re a reasonably considerate person, you don’t want to pester or pressure your partner.

        • Anon

          1. He has to understand her sexuality to understand why mapping his onto hers does not work. In his world, he feels unwanted because when he is attracted to his wife, he affirmatively wants to garden. In the world of responsive people,when you are attracted to someone, you are willing to once your partner initiates and you get going.

          (Side note: I thought this was a feminist bl0g. There seem to be a lot of male-centric views of human sexuality on this thread, and it’s distressing. We aren’t defective men, and just as it is incumbent upon us to understand how our husbands work, it’s incumbent upon them to understand how we work.)

          2. Assuming facts not in evidence.

          2a. See #1. Understand how responsive sexuality works.

          • Airplane.

            This is a really good point. If she’s willing to compromise to up it from 1x a week (she enjoys it when it starts, doesn’t need more than 1x a week but wants to address his need for higher frequency) then he can also compromise by initiating more times.

    • Anon for this

      We have a similar problem, especially lately with pandemic stress. I think it’s been pre-apocalypse since we gardened. We talked about it the other day and both said no pressure till things calm down.
      Anyhow, when we’ve had conversations before about this during normal times, we both agreed on a goal of X times per Y period. Maybe that is twice a week for you. Outside of that, we both committed to other forms of physical closeness to help us feel like romantic partners again. Instead of sitting on opposite ends of the couch watching tv, we cuddled. Extra physical intimacy without the explicit intent of leading to gardening helped a lot.
      We also implicitly agreed to just go along with it if the other person initiated. We are both of the enjoy it while it’s happening camp, but are slow to initiate. If one partner strongly objected, that would be different, but I agree sometimes you just need to fake it till you get going.
      I know there are certain things that help me feel more relaxed and in the mood, so I would try to do those more frequently if you can.
      A mismatched drive is a much more common relationship issue than I think anyone admits. Especially when tv and movies act like everyone is getting it on all the time, it puts extra pressure on those of us with lower drive.

    • Knope

      It’s really normal for women to enjoy sex when it gets going but not to feel so strong of a drive as to want to initiate it yourself. If that is your issue, and NOT that you do not enjoy sex (which is a separate issue for which I’d have different advice), I think you can approach it in one of two ways:
      1) Just remind yourself to try to initiate sometimes even if you don’t feel strongly about it, with the thought that you will enjoy it when you get going, or
      2) Tell you husband that you really enjoy it when you get going but are having a hard time initiating. You can tell him what you need to feel excited about doing it more often – e.g., a massage, a romantic or even explicit movie, compliments, etc.

      • Gardening

        From OP: I do enjoy it once we get going. When we first gardened many years ago, it was very painful for me (he is big, I am small, and it being painful the first several times really messed with my head until I went to a doctor and started using lube and did some other things to finally start working). It has not been painful for me in years, but I think that might be some of it as well.

    • Bee

      I recently read “Come As You Are” by Emily Nagoski and found it–while technical in some parts and sort of cheesy in others–to be a really interesting way of looking at specifically how women approach gardening. It’s not a cure-all but gave me a lot to think about. I’m in a similar situation–low gardening desire 99% of the time, I like it once we get going but I have to make an effort to initiate.

      • Mal

        I was just about to suggest this! I think it is really helpful in understanding sex “drive” and really gives specific information and science/research-based help. It really helped clear up a lot a mixed messages I think we get about the sexual dynamics of both men and women, and I think it would be helpful for your situation.

    • Anonymous

      I’m (always) the higher drive partner in my relationships. Here are some things I wish my partners would do:
      1. Be aware of how often you’re turning me down when I try to initiate. Ime it’s a nonevent for the person saying no, but it feels like a big rejection to the person being turned down repeatedly. You shouldn’t do it if you don’t want to, but remember to make some effort the next time you feel open to it. Reciprocating interest is really important.
      2. Understand that I want it way more than I’m trying to initiate. I don’t want to pester or pressure you, so I’m not going to initiate unless I think you’ll be into it. Some partners assume that if I haven’t tried to initiate for a week then it’s because I didn’t want it so everything’s ok and they don’t need to make an effort. Like no I wanted it but it was clear you didn’t so I was being a considerate human. Still super horny though.
      3. It doesn’t have to be mind blowing every time. Sometimes sex is like going to the gym. It’s a chore that you know is good for you so you do it and you’re always happy you did.
      4. Initiate more non sexual touching. It helps me to feel wanted and cared for if you show that you want to be near me, even if we’re not doing it.
      5. Maybe this is a bigger issue with men – but be open to sex meaning more than penetration. Use toys, watch me, etc. If you’re not feeling up to piv then we can do something else that makes us both feel good!

      • Anon

        1 is so true.

        My husband has rejected me, and honestly it has made me so, so reluctant to initiate again because of the ego blow.
        He’s well within his right, but it does have quite an impact.

      • Anon

        “It doesn’t have to be mind blowing every time. Sometimes sex is like going to the gym. It’s a chore that you know is good for you so you do it and you’re always happy you did.”

        No no no no no. You need to check in with the other person on this one. I hate sex and kept trying to make it work. It was not until I told my husband that I would rather be punched in the face than have sex that he figured out that we have actual problems.

        People talk about libido as if it is fixed and completely disconnected from the quality of the experience. That is not true.

        • Airplane.

          Whattt? How does this help OP. This is way out there and Anon’s point at 1:34 is still valid. You feel like having sex with your husband was like getting punched in the face? That’s totally different than something that feels like a chore at first but then you feel glad and happy that you did it afterward. Getting punched in the face is having violent.

        • Knope

          There is a huge difference between “I don’t feel like doing it sometimes but I don’t really mind it that much, so I’ll do it for my partner,” and “I’d rather be punched in the face than have sex!” We’re advising the OP for the former. The latter is a way bigger issue that needs to be approached differently.

        • Anon

          Hopefully there’s a huge difference in unpleasantness between going to the gym and getting punched in the face. I completely agree with the poster at 1:34 that it’s ok (sometimes) for sex to be something you do mostly to make the other person happy. Doing something you’re not initially that enthusiastic about, or choosing sex over a TV when you’d secretly rather be watching the TV show, isn’t even in the same ballpark as subjecting yourself to something like getting punched in the face.

          Also you keep making these sweeping statements that libido and wanting your partner are the same thing. Maybe that was your experience, but it’s absolutely not a universal thing. I love my husband and am wildly attracted to him. My intimate life with him is way better than I’ve ever had with any partner, and I’m not inexperienced. When it’s just us, alone without any distractions, we’re like rabbits. But normal life is filled with stressors and distractions and there’s plenty of times I’m emotionally and physically spent after a long day at work and dealing with kids and I just want to sleep or unwind with TV/books. I know many women in the same boat. And I’m pretty sure there’s a boatload of scientific research out there that sex is a more basic physical thing for men and often much more emotional for women, which explains why many men are keen to get down on weeknights after a long day of work but many women would prefer to save it for weekends when they’re in a more relaxed frame of mind. There are also plenty of other reasons for low libido that aren’t partner-specific, although perhaps none of them apply here (medicine, loss of a loved one, etc.) It’s incredibly damaging and false to suggest that wanting sex less frequently than your partner means you’re not attracted to them or you have deep emotional problems in your marriage.

        • Anon

          The poster above was the one who made the sweeping statement: all people are always happy at the end. This is patently untrue and needs to be called out.

    • Anon

      Mentioning my experience because I’m of a similar mindset with this and maybe it’ll be helpful: we use the fertility awareness method as our “birth control” so I track my cycle and we don’t garden when I’m fertile. That ends up being about 2-3 weeks of no gardening at all and 2 weeks of lots of gardening. I appreciate the break from expectations for those first couple weeks, and then the “scarcity mindset” makes it easier for me to initiate the second two weeks. We probably have more gardening now than we did before FAM, it’s just grouped together.

      • anon

        Genuinely curious as how you arrived at 2-3 weeks as the no gardening window. As someone who used the reverse to get pregnant (trying to garden more during fertile windows) and I feel like every resource we looked at was basically like 1 week on the high end of fertility and realistically you’re only fertile like 3-5 days a month (which was super frustrating as it seemed like that window frequently fell when one of us was traveling).

        • Anon

          Yes, sperm live for a week at the very max, but when trying to avoid pregnancy you have to be extra conservative. In the method I use, we begin abstaining on the earliest ovulation day of the last six cycles minus six days – so, if the earliest I’ve ovulated is cycle day 16, we begin abstaining on cycle day 10. However I typically don’t peak until day 18 or later, and then we abstain through the peak day + 4. So that has us abstaining from about day 10 through day 22+…the exact days shift each cycle, but my complete “potential fertile period” is 2-3 weeks (my actual fertile period is much less, but I only know that in retrospect).

          I use the ClearBlue monitor and the Marquette Method protocol, if youre curious. It sounds complicated as I typed it out, but truly I love it – I have became so familiar with my cycle and learned a lot about fertility ( and it speaks to the science nerd in me!).

  18. Anonymous

    My friend (and, let’s face it, secret crush) is a doctor in a hard-hit hospital in NYC, where we live. Our mode of communication lately has been an email back and forth once or twice a week (he doesn’t like texting except for immediate info). In his last email, he told me he had Covid and had been very ill for a week but thought he was starting to get better.

    I haven’t heard back to the response I sent, and it’s been a week now. I can’t help worrying about him even though I realize it’s likely that the reason is that I’m understandably not at the top of his priority list to reassure that he’s okay. I think it would be overkill to send him any other messages…it’s not like he didn’t get my email.

    I realize I’m over-obsessing about this because I’ve been such an emotional mess overall…it has been so hard, being alone and feeling under siege. I just want to be okay myself and for him to be okay.

    • Anonymous

      Text him! It is okay! “Jim just checking in to make sure you are okay.”

    • Anonymous

      I’d text. Even if he wasn’t a crush and just a friend, it’s natural to want to know a friend is ok ESP after they said they’re ill with Covid.

    • Lily

      Instead of sending him an email, why not send him a funny article or cartoon or something else that might make him laugh (and added benefit, he might respond and reassure you he’s ok!).

      • Anonymous

        Actually I think this seems desperate and is less likely to get a response. If he’s not up to responding to his regular email, he’s even less likely to respond to junk/fluff.

    • Anonymous

      I don’t think it’s overkill to send a quick email after a week saying that you’re just checking in and hoping he’s feeling better.

    • Anon

      I don’t really think you can check in too much on a person who has COVID-19. Even if he does think it’s weird, he’ll probably be like “wow, she’s really paranoid about the virus” not “wow, she has a crush on me.”

      • Anon

        She’s not “paranoid about the virus” if she’s checking in on a friend with a confirmed diagnosis. I don’t think he’d assume “she has a crush on me” but that she cares for a friend with a serious illness – especially since way too many doctors and nurses who were otherwise healthy have been killed. They contact each other EVERY WEEK – that is a relatively close friend. I really hope you aren’t prevented from checking on your friends because of some weird paranoia judgment, that’s a weird reason to be distant.

        • Anon

          You’re illiterate. I said she check in on him. I said IF he thinks you’re checking in on him too much, he would think it’s paranoia about the virus, not a crush.

    • Thanks, It Has Pockets!

      Definitely check in with him and ask if he’s okay! He won’t think much of it! But also try not to panic if he doesn’t respond, I know a few people who’ve recovered and when they were in the thick of it, things like email and social media had to take a backseat for a while because they were in really bad shape.

  19. Distantly visiting

    I shouted at friends twice since Friday and it was awesome! One friend I spied from my car en route to allergy shots and pulled over to yell-chat. The other was planned and also awesome. I feel like I have recharged.

    I am not a planner (ENTP) and have relied on meeting people in the familiar places and spaces and activities. Now I have to plan to shout at people. New skills!

    • Anon

      This is a way I’ve visited friends and family during all of this. I visited my Grandma over Easter by standing at the end of her driveway with a mask on and catching up and spending a weekend with my parents 20 ft apart on their patio and regularly do a knock by on my dog’s walk with a neighborhood friend (ring the doorbell back away 10+ ft and chat for 10 minutes). We couldn’t touch but being in their presence safely helped a lot.

    • NOLA

      One of my friends threw a drive-by car parade 30th birthday for this husband a few weeks ago. It was a surprise party so we all lined up our cars at a nearby church. We all got out of our cars and yell-visited at each other from sidewalk to car, etc. My best friend brought her dog and they came up and visited from the sidewalk while we stayed at the car (convertible so we could talk) and one of my friends was wearing one of those giant cat head masks so it was hard to visit but absolutely hilarious. It was killing us not to be able to hug and visit, but so wonderful to see everybody, even at a distance!

      • Anonymous

        I thought these gatherings were a great idea until I participated in one. People were getting way too close for comfort. A stranger came right up to within two feet of me to pet my dog without asking, then followed me when I tried to retreat. It was horribly stressful. Having observed the parking-lot preparations for a couple of similar gatherings, I’d say that no one participating in these gatherings is staying anywhere near six feet apart.

        • NOLA

          Interesting! We mostly all knew each other. This was weeks ago, so well before there were recommendations for wearing masks in public, although my friend’s daughter wore one and one couple showed up in hazmat suits for effect. I was trying to get my friend’s dog to come visit but she wouldn’t and I wasn’t going to get closer to my friend (she is over 70 and at risk). We were all pretty careful!

  20. Anon

    I’ve become incredibly intrigued with the idea of commuting by bike a few days a week. I plan to start by taking the bus in the morning so that I’m just riding home after work. Does anyone have any tips to get started or anything that you wish you knew at the outset?

    • Pure Imagination

      Buy a lot of lights. When you think you have enough, buy some more. I have front and rear lights, spoke lights, a helmet clip light thing, and a safety vest and I have STILL had cars “not see me” (i.e., not look, but at least I know I did all I could).

      • cbackson

        This, and use them in daylight, not just in the evening or early morning hours. At least your rear light should be flashing (I run flashers front and back in the daytime).

          • Anonymous

            lmao i love this way of describing it. i wear a hi vis vest, have lights on my bike front/back and also clip a back light to my backpack. i was hit by a car on my bike in my early 20’s (only partially the driver’s fault, i was young and an absolute idiot about not checking around me) so i am extremely cautious now

    • Ribena

      Assuming your cycle infrastructure is as terrible as ours and you’ll be on the road with motor vehicles – don’t let them bully you. You’re much safer taking the lane with a car behind you leaning on their horn than you are at the side of the lane with that same car squeezing past you.

    • PDX

      Over trousers and a good waterproof if it’s likely to rain. Map out your route ahead of time (ideally your city has a bike map to show you what are easy roads for cyclists and where problem intersections are). Do you have space to safely store bike at work? Or clothes/toiletries? I ride with a waterproof bag and take in a couple days of clothes at a time, and keep a full extra set of deodorant/etc in my locker in the gym at the office and while it took a while to get into a routine, I now miss my bike commute more than almost anything from the Before Times. I’d say good bag, rechargeable lights (front and back) and figure out what you need as you go.

      • pugsnbourbon

        Dry shampoo and body wipes are good to have on hand if you sweat more than you expected on a given day.
        When my wife bike-commuted she found fenders to be really helpful in wet weather, esp. since our city has issues with storm drainage.
        Bike nerds love to get more folks riding. Our local bike shop is staffed by smart, super-enthusiastic and helpful folks.

        • PDX

          Oh yeah! I should have mentioned fenders, but being in Portland, I assume anyone who gets a bike will be strongly encouraged to get them anyway. Fenders are great!

    • Anon

      Ride your route at least once when there’s minimal traffic. Take the lane. Ribena is 100% correct. If you’re in front of the car, you are much more visible and they must make the conscious decision to cross the center line to go around you. Make sure your bike fits and is comfortable. Wear a helmet. I should remember my rear blinkie light more often than I do. Don’t be me. Get a blinkie light and keep it charged.
      Riding in real life (as opposed to group rides on country roads or multi-use trails) is the best thing you can do to become a better bike handler, but it does take practice to get confident.

      • Ribena

        The extra thing about taking the lane is that if they DO squeeze last you, at least you have space to move into.

    • Cb

      Some bike organisations have a bike commuter training. Obviously not helpful in the short-term but something to look out for. They’ll do your commute with you (on an off time) to help you figure out how to best navigate through the city safely.

  21. Anon

    I don’t think it’s terribly likely, but would rather prepare for the worst and hope for the best.

    What do you keep on hand at your desk / in your car if you’re anticipating pulling an all nighter or two at work?

    I already have a well stocked “pharmacy” in my desk (Advil, toiletries, etc), as well as a change of clothes (pj’s and work outfits).

    • Anon

      Just because I’ve been burned before, whatever feminine hygiene product you need as a back up. Also tooth paste, deodorant, dry shampoo if your hair works for it. Socks to wear at night.

    • go for it

      I keep these in my car as well as my desk except as noted:

      Empty peanut butter jar with serving of protein powder in it,
      water bottles to fill said jar.
      Bag of almonds
      chocolate…because it is one of my food groups (car only)
      Set of silverware + napkins for take out salads.
      Phone charger and headphones.
      Travel blanket.
      Bath towel (car only)
      Old sneakers & pair of socks (car only)

    • Airplane.

      heating pad (or hot water bottle if your facilies manager is crazy strict) for your feet when it’s freezing because it’s late at night and they don’t heat the building that well during off hours. Also good if you have surprise cramps or sore muscles.

      Similarly, a reusable ice pack or those frizen eye depuffing things to put in freezer in case you get a headache.

      Tide to go stick, deordorant, dry shampoo, lipstick.

      Mints, protein bars, bone broth (they come in juice boxes) or some sort of instant soup.

    • anon

      I’ve always kept in my desk drawer a bag of OTC meds, one bag of essential toiletries, a bag of “extra” makeup (samples, duplicates, etc), a bag of feminine hygiene products, a warm scarf/wrap, and an extra pair of glasses. I keep a phone charger on my desk. I keep a blazer on my door all the time, just in case, and an extra coat during the winter (I’m always forgetting my coat). I keep casual clothes to change into after-hours if I’m working really late/all night, plus a pair of flats for after hours but also in case I need to walk. (I’m on a high floor, and a couple of times, we’ve had to walk down 50 flights of stairs.)

      My office provides snacks, coffee, and sodas and pays for take-out during late nights and all-nighters. If I’m working long hours, I like to purchase some apples or oranges for healthier snack options.

    • Anon

      I refuse to do that, if something is so urgent I’ll take it home or leave and come back.

  22. Ann

    What mementos of your life / achievements do you keep in your home or apartment?

    I’ve taken to making “art projects” of different periods of my life. Like in college I made a collage of studying abroad (it’s in storage somewhere now), framed photos I had bought there (still have them), a shadow box of my high school, college, and grad school tassels, an autograph from a public figure I worked for framed for safekeeping, some other trinkets from the time working for them, etc

    I made most of these things as a way to preserve or store the items, not necessarily to show off. My diplomas are in my parents house, some framed some not. I don’t mind if the answer is “that’s too showy, put it away”. But do you put up any things like this, particularly education or career related in your house or office?

    • Ribena

      On my mantelpiece in my bedroom I have a vintage travel guide to my university city. Other than that, all I can think of is my bookcase, which naturally reflects my areas of academic and then professional interest. That is, books first about Nazism and then about the climate crisis. I don’t choose light subjects!

    • Anonymous

      I tend to see these things most in home offices, mostly those belonging to older men.

      • Ann

        Haha fair. Maybe I’ll leave most of this in storage. But if the older men like to brag or show off these things, why shouldn’t we?

        • anon at 10:57

          Just pointing out that it reads as dated to me. But definitely display your memorabilia if it gives you joy! That’s what KonMari says to do.

    • Vicky Austin

      My office art is my diploma, a picture of me and my husband, and the transit map of the town where I studied abroad.

    • Anonymous

      Most of the art in my house are pieces we have bought on vacations or that have some connection to a life milestone (like we have a framed prints of the historic hotel where we got married and of landmarks that symbolize our undergrad and law schools). We also have a display cabinet in the dining room with items of significance or from various trips/milestones. In my office, I have my diplomas, framed pictures I took on trips, and a few mementos of trips.

    • Senior Attorney

      I have the gold medal I won for drama in high school as part of the gallery wall in my family room. A few framed family photos here and there including a candid wedding shot, not in the formal living or dining rooms.

      I have a lot more of that stuff in my office at work, including my law school diploma, various professional and Rotary awards, and a good number of family photos including a photo wall calendar.

      • Senior Attorney

        Oh, and yes — several of the art pieces in our home are mementos from vacations we’ve taken.

    • Anon

      I have an industry specific certification that is very hard to get and our firm pride’s itself on having a lot of certificate holders. Most of my colleagues that have this have these specific certificates up in their offices, so I do too, in a pretty frame. We are kind of an older demographic business though, fwiw.

      I can’t think of anyone in my office offhand that has their school diplomas hanging in their work offices. I would only maybe hang mine at home, and even then only if I had a dedicated home office.

      Otherwise I personally have always kept a shoebox sized “memory box” under my bed my whole life that I throw in mementos like the tassles you mention. When one fills up, I simply store that one and start a new one. Not to display any of it or organize, as I would never get around to doing that, but just in case I ever want to revisit some memories. There’s some fun stuff in them.

    • Anon

      I have one box of college momentoes and one box of military momentoes in the basement. My diplomas are framed and hanging in my office. I really dislike “stuff” though and don’t put much value on it, so my answer probably isn’t all that helpful. I do display photos – a vintage one of my grandmother as a newlywed, a wedding photo, etc.

    • Anon

      I have my framed professional certificates in my home office. (I’m an actuary, it took me 10 years to get them, you bet I’m hanging them up!) plus some deal bricks from large transactions I worked on, plus a couple of sentimental things like a thank you plaque from a place where I volunteer/donate, and a beautiful piece of framed embroidery someone did for my parents’ wedding day that I unearthed when my mother died a couple of years ago.

    • Anonymous

      Inspired by something I saw in an acquaintances apartment, we have shelving in one of our hallways with “tacky” frames with photos from life/vacation. So a picture of me graduating high school in a frame in my hometown’s colors, a picture of my husband graduating grad school in a frame with the university’s logo printed all over it, photos from vacations in fun frames we bought on vacation, a picture of us on the day we adopted our dog in a dog-themed frame, etc. We get a lot of compliments!

      I also have some shoeboxes of mementos as described above.

      • Ribena

        Some family friends of my parents have all of these photos in their downstairs toilet. I love it!

  23. ArenKay

    This dress is GORGEOUS. Thank god I clicked the link to see exposed back zipper, to remove temptation.

    • Anon

      Ugh, I HATE exposed zippers. (Not on other people, if I see it on someone else I don’t care, but in my own closet it would be a pet peeve).

  24. Elementary schooling -- online charters

    Is anyone with an elementary school aged kid getting live instruction? Our school district is just sending worksheets to do online (with new material, but no instruction). We go to public school and for the first time, I think that that was a mistake. My friends with kids in private schools (~$25K/year) are getting some live instruction for a couple of hours a day. I used to think that this was sort of a class divide but now I am thinking that our public schools are such a sh*tshow and it may not be better in the fall.

    Our state has a legit online public charter school that I feel like we might as well do since they were used to this environment before (so no cost to us). I know families who have done this in another state for high school, but not my state (NC). This is for the fall, if this continues as how we learn. Not worried about reading, but good remote learning hygiene and if my kids forget the math they have struggled hard to learn.

    • Anon

      I don’t have kids, but from what I’ve seen in the news, Fairfax County, VA’s attempts at live instruction have been the sh1tshow to end all sh1tshows. Like, law firms are involved to sue Blackboard, a 20-year school employee stepped down, etc, etc. And Fairfax County is super wealthy, so it’s not a monetary issue.

      https://www.washingtonpost.com/local/education/top-technology-official-out-at-fairfax-schools-as-fallout-continues-from-online-learning-disaster/2020/04/22/ad22f84a-84fe-11ea-ae26-989cfce1c7c7_story.html

    • Anon

      Just to directly answer your question, we are in a large urban area in a public school and our kindergartner is getting multiple zoom “classes” a week, both from his teacher and once a week from the more specialized teachers like PE. They are only about half an hour each.

      Sorry to hear that this is your experience. I can’t weigh in on an online school for elementary schools. I would be a little worried about making a rash decision in light of an unprecedented environment that teachers were not normally made for. And maybe if this does continue into the Fall, the appropriate folks at your school can put a little bit more effort into getting it together over the Summer when they have time to breathe?

    • Anon

      I wonder if one of the reasons public schools aren’t doing things online has to do with equity? I live in a nice suburb but according to greatschools, 25% of my elementary school’s kids are low income. That’s a pretty big group of kids who may not have access to WiFi, have a computer they can use, etc (especially because low income parents are more likely to have lost their jobs so who is paying for internet).

          • Anonymous

            That’s the approach our district is taking. Default to the lowest common denominator. Which makes zero sense, as it’s a mostly affluent district where it would not be that difficult to provide individualized help to the handful of families that would need it. The district has literally thousands of laptops locked up in schools right now.

      • Anon

        I’ve been impressed with our low-income school district. Got laptops for all the kids, lunch for all the kids, and school busses equipped with mobile hotspots drive around and park at different spots in the district so kids have good connectivity.

        • Anon

          Same. I’m poster at 11:58 and my urban district has very large income disparity & is very very concerned about equity all of the time, & we are still doing the zoom etc. classes. I’m not sure how exactly they made it work for the lower income families, but yes I think they got laptops out at the very least. That school bus thing is cool!

    • Anon

      I think this kind of snuck up on everyone and schools were completely unprepared. I’m willing to bet that with summer break, there’ll be more time to properly plan for virtual learning and it won’t be such a mess next time. Private schools are much smaller and it’s much easier for them to deal with the logistics with short notice.

      • Anonymous

        +1, although I’m less optimistic about summer being a cure-all as teachers do not necessarily have to work over the summer. My husband is an NYC public high school teacher. They had about 3 days to plan, prepare, and begin launching online instruction. Both students and teachers do not necessarily have the technology in place to teach online. Teachers don’t know how to use the software; my husband (PhD in engineering and as tech savvy as anyone I know) spent half the morning screaming at the computer because Google classroom kept deleting grades he entered. The DOE keeps changing policies about which software can be used (e.g., Zoom was banned after the first couple of weeks due to security concerns). Many families have more than one child in school and have working parents and can’t guarantee that kids can view remote lessons at specific times if they are staggering computer usage or parent supervision. There are a lot of reasons live online instruction is problematic and can lead to inequities. No, the answer is not to make sure no one learns but if half the kids don’t learn, then teachers are going to have to reteach everything in the fall to catch half the class up. We have a friend who has a child in a private/charter school–BASIS–that is doing live online instruction, but apparently they schedule classes at the same time. So you have to pick if you kid is going to Mandarin or Math. This is a shitshow for everyone. You know how you are barely functioning at your job due to competing demands? So are your child’s teachers.

    • Anonymous

      I’m in MA. How young are your kids? My kindergartener has done a few “all class” zooms and they are bonkers nuts. Now they are doing weekly 1:1s with the teacher (30 minutes) and weekly “group chats” where they meet in groups of 4 with the teacher and talk about remotely educational things and get to see their friends. Teacher uploads a “morning meeting” which is a prerecorded 5 minute video saying good morning, going over the date and the plan for the day. Then there are worksheets and printables and videos etc. We have a weekly math unit that is prerecorded videos, clickable videos/ you tube stuff, and worksheets.

      I think it’s fine. My kid is doing a lot of reading, but I know not all K kids can read at her level.

    • Anonymous

      As far as the online charter schools go, research has shown no benefit over face to face, and in several studies a detriment. With regards to the current quality of instruction, most schools had very little notice to switch over, and teaching online is a very different skill set than you use teaching in the classroom. Double for younger grades.

    • Anonymous

      We are in a large school district with wide income disparity. Our state in general in a poor, largely rural state, though our school district is in an urban area. Our kids get live lessons for one hour every day. (3rd and 5th grade). Then they have to do 30 minutes of language arts and math on a website and I have them do an additional 30 minutes of reading everyday. They also have a “special” everyday (rotating throughout the week. So art one day, music the next, etc) where the counselor, art, music, library, and PE teacher each upload a video with an assignment. These take between 15 minutes to an hour. Our district got chromebooks handed out to students who did not have a laptop, paid for internet for those who did not have it, and have continued doing free lunch for pick up at the schools for those who need it. It’s been ok, but not great.

    • Seventh Sister

      My elementary school age kid is getting some Zoom time, but it’s not live instruction of new material. It’s mostly enrichment (class discussion, story hour) and going over stuff they have done offline. It’s a public school that is a little bit too well-off to be a Title 1 school. They’ve done Chromebook distributions, distribute grab and go lunches, help people get Internet access if they don’t have it at home, etc. Apparently 18 out of his 22 classmates have been participating since they stopped in-school instruction, which is pretty much the best opt-in rate for a classroom in the district.

      My friends who have kids in private school are getting live instruction, but several have complained to me that it’s actually not that great (technical difficulties, very long days). I get wanting more instruction, but honestly, we only have 7? more weeks of school so I’m not very interested in seeking out more school. He’ll get into Yale (or not) with or without extra lessons at this point.

      In my kid’s case, he’d probably be OK if he didn’t pick up a book between now and the start of the next school year in terms of actual academics. Per his teacher, he’s apparently learned all of the stuff he’s supposed to know for the grade standards. I just don’t want him to get the impression that school is entirely optional.

  25. go for it

    I keep these in my car as well as my desk except as noted:

    Empty peanut butter jar with serving of protein powder in it,
    water bottles to fill said jar.
    Bag of almonds
    chocolate…because it is one of my food groups (car only)
    Set of silverware + napkins for take out salads.
    Phone charger and headphones.
    Travel blanket.
    Bath towel (car only)
    Old sneakers & pair of socks (car only)

  26. Housecounsel

    Unpaid product endorsement: I bought a Shark Rocket PetPro stick vacuum and it is awesome.

    • cat socks

      Thanks for the recommendation! I have a corded Dyson and it works great, but I would live a cordless vac for quick clean ups. And with five cats, the battle with hair is endless. Price point looks reasonable too!

    • Anon

      And this is exactly why that we cannot fully “reopen” the economy until we have *close to* no confirmed cases — and a massive ability to test-and-trace when new outbreaks do pop up.

      I’m tired of people calling this “fear mongering.” It is not. It is realism. People who don’t realize this are in denial because they can’t stomach the idea of social distancing for another 3-4 months. They are the ones who are afraid.

      Over the weekend, someone said that we’re not going to have 40,000-person concerts, so it’s fine to start easing social distancing. But this virus spread exponentially long after mass gatherings had been cancelled in most parts of the U.S., which was in the beginning of March. Remember, *most* of this virus is spread through family members, close friends, and other intimate contacts. Once people start seeing their friends again, the R-naught will be greater than 1, and the virus will spread exponentially again. This is just math.

      Believe me, I wish I were wrong.

      • Anon

        But there’s no indication cases will go to zero within 3 months or even 12 months and we can’t stay locked down for years – we won’t have a society to go back to. Taking steps like canceling large events, and having everyone who can work from home *will* slow (but not stop) the spread. We need to accept this virus will spread, and have localized temporary shutdowns in cities when the spread starts to become rapid.

        • Anon

          If people stay committed to social distancing, and local governments continue to enforce it, there’s a good reason to think we can get close to zero within the next 3 months. Look at New Zealand, just by way of one example. The problem is that it’s a self-fulfilling prophecy — if we think we can’t, then we won’t.

          • Anon

            New Zealand is a unique country because it’s isolated and has a small population. It’s not realistic for most places.

      • Anonymous

        Have you seen photographs of hundreds of cars waiting in line at food banks? Do you know that some stores have policemen in them now because tensions are so high, customers are freaking out? Are you aware that people are stealing copper from wires because they are that desperate?

        It is incredibly tone deaf and privileged to sit here posting on the internet that people need to stay safe at homes to quell your anxiety. I prefer to go out as smart and safely as I can as opposed to seeing our neighbors and fellow citizens starve in the streets. But hey, you do you.

        • Anon

          Your comment is unbelievable. No, I obviously have no idea that many people are suffering tremendously right now, that never occurred to me. *Sarcasm.*

          What do you not understand about second wave? And how things will be worse for the very people you purport to care about if society re-opens to early? Do you really think that just because things are bad now, they can’t get worse? That’s the whole point of the Bulkwark article — the economy *can’t* come back if society re-opens too early, thus hurting the most vulnerable people.

          Stop pretending that your frustration with staying at home is concern for the poor. I’m really tired of people throwing around the concept of “privilege” to conveniently support whatever they happen to believe.

    • Anonymous

      This is just common sense. The problem is that the people who haven’t already figured it out on their own don’t listen when it is explained to them.

      • PolyD

        John Ioannidis is considered a fairly incompetent hack by most epidemiologists. So take what he publishes with a huge grain of salt.

        I’m not going to read the Bulwark article, because I know it will just stress me out. But I have a question for the we-can’t-open people (to be clear, I am not expecting normalcy in any short amount of time, but am on board with the idea of phased opening based on lowered, but not zero risk. Remember, this virus still is only hospitalization-level serious for maybe 10% of people who get it, and that’s probably a high estimate because we are missing a lot of mild and asymptomatic cases): How do you expect people to cope with indefinite or years-long social distancing/closing of society? What happens to small business owners who rely on in-person customers, like restaurants, bars, hairdressers, theaters, etc.? I mean, sure, I guess we don’t strictly need those things, but what happens to those people? Do they all become grocery check out clerks? UPS delivery people? What happens to movie theaters? Street festivals? Kids sports?

        And less frivolous, is online only education viable long term, especially considering the vast disparities in technology and internet access across the country? Do we just write off those kids for the duration?

        I see a lot of really very mean and nasty comments aimed at people who are finding social distancing and staying in to be difficult. I see much fewer thoughtful comments on how to cope (beyond Zoom or FaceTime) and on how to rationally manage a drastically changed society and economy, if the stay-at-home for years people prevail.

        • Anonymous

          Nobody is saying that we should never reopen. But it’s naive to think that people are going to be willing to eat in restaurants or get manicures or gamble in Las Vegas without an effective vaccine or a robust program of testing and contact tracing that allows us to keep the virus in check. Even if some people are willing to take the risk, it won’t be enough to keep those businesses going. If we want an economic recovery, we have to take on the virus first.

        • Airplane.

          No one has a good answer for this. The people who are calling for long term – 4 months, 6 months of shelter in place, lockdown, quarantine don’t have an answer for this.

          • anon

            Yes. I’m very worried about longer term shelter in place and it is decidedly not because I miss brunch. People ignore the very thoughtful points above because it’s easy to pile on to someone like the poster over the weekend who broke down and grabbed a cocktail at a friend’s apartment. It’s a lot harder to advocate for longer shelter in place once you start digging into all of the points above, unless of course you’re hyper privileged like a lot of the posters on this board and aren’t personally affected by these issues so you just ignore them and pretend that anyone opposing shelter in place long term just wants to go to boozy brunch and get a haircut.

    • Monday

      Thanks for posting the link. I think a lot of people’s resistance is really just incredulity at how bad this situation is, how long it could go on, and how much we still don’t know. It is all genuinely hard to fathom, even when I’m at my calmest and most accepting.

  28. Anon

    I hope people will indulge me in a survey since we all live in different areas. Could you say where you are and are you seeing hand soap, hand sanitizer, wipes, and/or disinfecting sprays return to the shelves — and what type of stores (Target or regional or small stores)?

    I stocked up early and find I’m not really using up the sanitizer or wipes; kind of using the sprays and OMG the soap usage is out of control; I go thru a ton of soap even before this and had stocked up in early March but will need to buy again in the next few weeks. Not sure how store shelves are looking (and this is stuff I can’t easily get shipped as Target, Walmart etc. all tell me they don’t ship to my area though they’re sold out anyway).

    I follow a supermarket chain in the southern NJ area where I’m from and they are posting — we have wipes or sanitizer or store brand spray. Obviously not tons and it sells out, but I’m seeing more and more of those posts with people saying — I found x. I’m in Arlington VA though and IDK that it’s like that here — IDK if it’s the population density or if product just isn’t rolling down here yet.

    FWIW I had read that some of the components that make wipes come from Asia and that is hopefully starting to go up as they reopen, so there’s an expectation that we see a lot more wipes on our shelves by July/Aug — once they have a full amount of components coming in, full production here (assuming the issues here improve too), and consumer demand is satisfied so 1 shipment of wipes isn’t sold in a half hour.

    • cat socks

      I live in the midwest and shop at Meijer. A couple of weeks ago I was able to buy bleach and disinfectant spray. I think Clorox wipes were still out of stock. I bought soap from Bath and Body works.

      • LaurenB

        Spouse bought bleach at Costco. I was able to find some disinfectant wipes at either Walgreen’s or CVS (which BTW never ran out of toilet paper, though it may not be “preferred brand”). We’re using the wipes sparingly, because when we are at home, we don’t really need them – I only use them in the car once I’ve gotten into my car after shopping at a grocery store.

    • Anon in Triangle, NC

      I just came back from Target and they had disinfecting wipes, Clorox clean up, and toilet paper. But, my husband and I had gone to another Target over the weekend that had none of those items, so it’s very hit or miss. My local grocery store has also had disinfecting products, but not toilet paper.

    • Anon

      I haven’t bought disinfecting wipes, I guess I don’t really see the point unless someone in my house was ill. Soap is in stock in our grocery stores, but unavailable for pickup, which is annoying since we’ve been getting most of our groceries via the curbside pickup. Midwest.

    • Anon

      Rural VA – Food Lion, Dollar General, and Wal-Mart. No TP and no bottled water (most people are on wells here, and not everyone’s is in good shape, so there’s lots of demand for water right now – limit 2 gallons per shopper). Less popular hand soap fragrances are available. Cleansers are pretty available generally, though you’ll see a spot on the shelves where an item used to be and was sold out. Food is really well stocked.

      Our experience here is really different than what cities are going through. There are only 204 cases in our region (11 counties), and 65% of those are in one county that had a bad outbreak. There are only a couple cases in our county and people are good about social distancing and wearing masks, but there’s not a sense of fear like in the cities.

    • Anonymous

      we had a hard time finding liquid soap initially locally but i just switched to bar soap (dr bronners) which was extremely easy to find and i have actually liked it more because my hands do not dry out as much. i’ve heard that clorox wipes are still hard to find but we found spray clorox easily and use it at home.

    • anon a mouse

      Also in NoVA near you. We haven’t seen disinfecting wipes in 2 months. Randomly I bought a 4-pack of wipes and Lysol sprays at Costco in January so we are good for a while, but it’s disconcerting that they are out everywhere. Same with hand sanitizer. We have had luck buying hand soap and bar soap from Target online, 3-4 at a time, but have had to change our regular brands/scents. It’s an adventure!
      I get the sense that our grocery stores generally are not rebounding as quickly as other areas, and I have no idea why, but it’s frustrating. Still no yeast or flour anywhere.

      • Anon

        Seeing how the regional NJ chain is handling it, I feel like they’re being aggressive; if they can’t get goods from one distributor, they’re getting them from another. And because they are doing it, Target etc. that is their competition is also stocking those products or else they’ll lose business. People there will post pics of Target shelves with a new shipment of germ x or whatever. Grocery stores in Arlington seem to be taking the approach of — we don’t have it, we don’t know if we’ll ever get it, good luck. I think this area is fine on food but the 3-4 things I mentioned.

        I’m good on soap etc. for another 3 weeks. After that I’m hoping the situation improves both in terms of more places peaking and store shelves getting a little more stocked. If they don’t though, I’m half contemplating driving up to NJ to do a shopping trip there or maybe driving south of us into a smaller city. Sounds insane. I wouldn’t go see my family in NJ as they’re older, I’d literally drive 2+ hours, fill up, and drive back.

    • anon

      I am in SoCal and it’s been hit or miss for most of those products. I woke up super early one day a few weeks ago and stood in line at Costco – managed to get 30 rolls of TP, 12 rolls of paper towels, and 5 cans of lysol spray, so we are set on all of those. But have not been able to get disinfecting wipes. Luckily I had a few bottles of clorox bleach cleaning spray so I can basically make them with that plus paper towels to wipe down doorknobs, faucets, etc. As for hand sanitizer, I got lucky and got four 8 oz bottles from office max last month, and also bought 10 of the small pocketbac ones from bath and body works pre-pandemic. But have not seen hand sanitizer anywhere recently. An employee at Target told me to get sanitizer or wipes, you need to stand in line early in the am and even then it’s dependent on whether they got a shipment in.

    • Anon

      I’m in the SEUS and still not seeing much of any of this in stores (although we do have paper products again!). I was lucky enough to have some on hand before, so I’m making it last by sticking to sprays&cloth wipes for items and soap&water for hands in the house. Disposable wipes and hand sanitizer are in the car to use between stops or after unavoidable direct contact.

      • Anon

        Hmm so maybe this is a north to south thing since people are reporting NJ is improving but Virginia/SEUS aren’t?

      • Anon

        Also in SEUS. Toilet paper was spotted at Sam’s Club but not anywhere else last I checked. Still no Lysol wipes anywhere. I had already bought bleach and hand soap in mid March so haven’t been checking for those. My sibbling in the bay area said they got TP after visits to three different stores. The aisle was cordoned off and you had to ask the staff to bring it to you.

      • Anonymous

        SEUS here. Our stores have no paper products, no disinfectant, no meat, limited dairy.

    • Anon

      I ordered cleaning supplies from target, Kleenex and toilet paper from amazon (I checked every day and one day they suddenly had some in stock! But then it got lost for a couple of days, and now they suddenly say it is coming today – we shall see), and am prepared to make more cleaning supplies from vinegar or bleach.

      But the big thing I’m having trouble getting is flour and yeast. I solved the yeast thing by making a sourdough starter (she is amazing!) but the flour is a continued problem. I ask for it every week in my instant cart but have only received it once, and even then it was apparently flour from the store’s bakery shoveled into those crinkly plastic bags, which ripped immediately. RIP bakery flour all over my kitchen floor and counters.

    • PolyD

      I ordered some Mrs. Meyers cleaners and Scrubbing Bubbles cleaners from Target last week, and I got them. Never been so excited to see a couple of cans of Scrubbing Bubbles fall out of the package.

    • Thanks, It Has Pockets!

      I live in Boston. I’m able to get some cleaning supplies at my local Whole Foods, but I have to get most of our paper products from our neighborhood corner stores, but I try to do most of our surface cleaning with reusable microfiber cloths to make those rolls of paper towels last. I get my hand soap from Bath and Body Works and I stocked up like crazy during the semi-annual sale, but I needed to order a few more bottles which wasn’t hard.

    • Anonymous

      I’m in NC and my grocery store had pretty much everything (except maybe hand sanitizer) this week. I went in the morning, which I think is key. They had chlorox wipes, paper goods, meat was well-stocked, etc. And I don’t think we ever really had a shortage of soap, other than maybe the first week of panic-buying. Bar easier than liquid, but I’ve seen liquid. Flour is still a bit short–I made a cake this weekend and needed cake flour, which they were out of, but then I discovered White Lily all-purpose flour has basically the same protein content as other brand’s cake flour, and they did have that (I also learned a lot about flour this weekend… Quarantine knowledge.)

    • Small Law Partner

      I’m in SoCal and our regular grocery store has all of these items except for wipes. But I do go at 7:30am on a weekday.

    • Anon

      I live in the pacific northwest. There’s plenty of soap, both in grocery stores and in Target type stores. I’v seen bleach periodically. Toilet paper seems to be back in stock pretty regularly.

      I haven’t seen disinfecting wipes or hand sanitizer in any store since early March.

    • Anon

      In NYC. Everything is available in the grocery stores and pharmacies with the exception of Clorox wipes, yeast and good quality TP. (but the grocery store had Cottenelle yesterday!) Try hardware stores for cleaning products too.

  29. anon

    Are you all still going to the grocery store? How often? I am in DC and trying to decide if I should physically go to the store or get stuff delivered. In regular times, I would go to Trader Joe’s every couple of weeks and they do not deliver.

    • cat socks

      I’ve never done grocery delivery so I’m still going into the store every couple of weeks. I wear a mask and wash my hands thoroughly when I get home. I wash produce but I’m not wiping down every package.

    • Anon

      I’m able bodied and not at any higher risk than any other healthy person, so I go to the store. Lately that’s been approximately every other week. Asking someone else to assume my risk (especially for all the more shoppers get paid) doesn’t sit right with me.

      • Anon New Yorker

        +1. I’m low risk and suspect I already had a mild version of it two months ago (minimal symptoms and not tested). I go every 6-8 days. My produce doesn’t really last longer than that, plus I don’t have a car so I can’t carry more than that. I don’t wipe down my groceries but most of what I buy is produce which gets washed before cooking/eating anyway.

    • Anon

      Anecdotally, I know 4 people who have gotten sick (2 in DC, 2 in NJ) only from trips to the grocery store.

      • Anon

        But honestly what choice is there? IDK about everyone else, but I have not gotten a grocery delivery spot once in 6 weeks in Arlington.

        • anonymous

          3 out of the 4 tested positive. The fourth doesn’t know if she had it, had all the symptoms, but recovered quickly.

          • anon

            I think she was asking how they knew where they got it from. Given number of asymptomatic cases, I think it’s hard to say definitively where people got it unless they were literally living alone and caught it more than 14 days after seeing anyone else other than a grocery store.

    • Anon

      In Arlington Va and yes. At first I was going once in 8-10 days. But skipped a few times because I was stocked up — so now it’s been 1x in 3 weeks. Same as the poster above — mask, wash hands, not wiping down packages; though when I get home I only put away cold items and the rest just sits in bags until I get to it which is 3+ days later. IDK if that does anything but mentally feels better. And then I go overboard — all clothes go in the laundry when I get home and I shower. It’s an exhausting, stressful production.

      I know everyone says shop online. But honestly I have never found time slots and I know myself — I’m not going to be up at 1 am to find a slot. I realize that going to the store is exposure, but I also do not feel 100% comfortable with someone else beyond everyone else in the supply chain touching all of my stuff.

    • Senior Attorney

      I haven’t set foot in the grocery store since the lockdown started and am getting delivery instead. Couple of reasons but mostly because I refuse to stand in line for groceries.

      • Anonymous

        +1, I live in Chicago and have been getting grocery delivery since the lockdown started. I miss Trader Joe’s and Costco though.

    • Anon

      I go to the store because grocery delivery is limited, and I want to leave slots open for people who are not 30-something marathoners without a single health issue. I know that I’m not invincible, but think that I should do what I can to ensure that people at markedly higher risk are able to access what they need.

      • CountC

        +1 I go once a week. Masks are now required in my state, and I wash my hands and produce when I get home.

        • Another anon

          Same. Masks aren’t required here, but I do wear one. I have a flexible work schedule, so I try to go mid-morning on Tuesdays or Wednesdays when there aren’t many people.

    • Vicky Austin

      I’m doing every two weeks rather than every week, wearing a mask and sanitizing my hands and cart. I too would rather leave delivery/pickup slots open for people who definitely shouldn’t go into the store, especially since I live in a super rural area with limited slots per hour.

      • pugsnbourbon

        This is my line of thinking as well. We are going once every 10-12 days.

    • Ribena

      Yes, once a week (or, three trips in a two week period, maybe). I don’t have a car, so I’m limited to the amount I can carry, hence the occasional extra top-up on top of a big weekly Saturday shop. I am going only to the neighbourhood convenience grocery stores, as mentioned above, so generally don’t have to queue to get in, and it just feels safer and less frantic than going to a big store. This week is my first veg box delivery, which will hopefully make my weekly shops easier (Saturday’s was half fresh veg, which doesn’t leave much room in the tote bag for other essentials like beer!).
      I’m in a smallish city which seems not to have been too badly hit.

    • Veronica Mars

      We aren’t using delivery services like Instacart, and instead are going grocery shopping once every 2 weeks. But between blue apron, our local CSA produce delivery, and Target drive ups for non-perishables, we wouldn’t have to actually go to a grocery store for months if it were truly dire (assuming those services were still running). But both DH and I are healthy so we don’t mind going and getting groceries ourselves, however.

    • KS IT Chick

      Still going to the store once a week. I did delivery one time and decided that the problems I had weren’t worth it. Yesterday was the first time I had a mask, which was a little weird, but my anxiety about potential contact didn’t spike, either. I am healthy so I can leave the delivery options for individuals who need lower contact methods to get food.

      I am seeing prices starting to rise a bit. I would have expected the total to be about 15% less than it was.

    • LaurenB

      I go about once every 10 days to a grocery store. Our Trader Joe’s always has long lines, so I go to Fresh Thyme or Pete’s, neither of which have been too crowded for my taste. I figure I should leave delivery for those who need delivery (elderly people, etc.).

    • Anonymous

      We’re in Brooklyn and go to the grocery store or a smaller food store about 2x a week. We go through milk fast and don’t have that much storage being in an apartment. Delivery is really hard to come by around here – everything is booked – and there is no curbside pickup option anywhere we shop.

    • BeenThatGuy

      In North Jersey, I haven’t been able to secure a grocery delivery in 6 weeks. Not a single service or store has available time slots. So, I send my partner about every 10 days, as I am high risk due to an autoimmune disease. He follows all the precautions but we do not wipe down items. Crazy thing is, I used to do all my grocery shopping online prior to the pandemic, so this has been a hard adjustment for our family. (And yes, “hard” is a relative term; I understand my privilege)

    • Anon

      Instant cart only. I have to be very flexible about delivery times, have to try to get one first thing in the morning, and have to tip well of course, but I haven’t stepped foot in a grocery store in over a month.

    • Anonymous

      I go every 10-14 days, one trip (to Wegmans). I like getting out, and I like doing my own shopping and I frankly would prefer one less person touching my groceries. My family is also low risk and I don’t like the idea of taking the slot from other people.

      I drop about $400-500 per trip which is way less than my previous annual food/household expense budget.

      • Vicky Austin

        I feel like our budget is also really benefiting from this! Weird how that works.

    • Thanks, It Has Pockets!

      I go once a week. I’d love to order groceries but all the delivery services near me have you reserve a time slot before you fill your cart, and those time slots get taken fast, so it’s really hard to get delivery and I’m trying to leave those slots for people who really need them.

    • Gail the Goldfish

      We’re going about every 2, 2 and a half weeks. My husband and I both go and split the list and get two carts because it turns out two weeks worth of food for us is somehow more than will fit in one grocery cart. (Cloth) masks, wipe the carts, but no gloves. I’m just going to the local Publix, which doesn’t usually have a line to let people in, as opposed to smaller places like Trader Joe’s (but oh I miss my Trader Joe’s trips). I looked at instacart once, but there weren’t any slots available until a week out and I figured I might as well leave the spots for people who are higher risk.

    • Small Law Partner

      I go once a week, on a weekday right at the end of senior hours in the morning. I feel like my area may be different than may other areas of even my city (LA) – there is never a line at that time, the store is very uncrowded (not hard to distance – I only saw two other people in the produce section the entire time I was getting my produce last week), and the store is well stocked with everything I could want except disinfecting wipes. I may not be able to get the exact brand I want or the exact packing I like (I like flour in resealable bags instead of paper sacks), but that is not a big deal to me.

    • anon

      Yes, we are going once every 7-10 days. However, I’ve become picky about where I’ll go. The big regional supermarket chain and Trader Joe’s are doing a great job disinfecting things and following safety protocols. I will not set foot in Target until this is over — way too many people not following the rules, shopping in groups, etc.

  31. Anon

    That blazer looks way too casual for this dress. And doesn’t really look like the kind of blazer to wear over a dress anyway, it’s too long. This dress doesn’t need a blazer.

  32. Anon

    my boss has 5 adult children and just had all of them and the spouses of those who are married over for dinner on Friday for a dinner party of close to 20 people when we live in an area with a stay at home order. i am very anxious for when we can return to the office bc she doesn’t seem to get or care about social distancing measures

  33. Moonstone

    I like this article very much because it is making the distinction between businesses being open (movie theaters and casinos) and whether most people will find it fun to go there. That’s why the phrase “reopen the economy” is not accurate — even when businesses open, they are likely to see only a fraction of the customers. (This is a separate discussion from the public health issues around, say, restaurants reopening.)

    • Anonymous

      It’s only day 1 so who knows but various news stations have people posted at different bar grills, Waffle House etc. in Georgia and are doing interviews with the owners who are saying, we’ve had 0 or 2-4 dine in customers. And this isn’t just Atlanta, it’s outlying areas too. So at least people aren’t flocking back. Though Tybee Island said 6000 cars went thru on Saturday and pics on the beach didn’t look socially distanced to me, but I think people just feel safer around crowds outdoors than indoors now.

  34. Life Insurance

    I may be a little late in the day, but I’ll try anyway: Has anyone investigated or used some of these instant/easy/etc online life insurance providers that have been advertising on TV recently? The one that comes to mind is ladder, but I know there is another.
    Is it really as easy as claimed? How can the rates possibly be competitive to traditional methods that require medical checks?
    I need and want life insurance with a baby on the way, but I am not in a big hurry to get my medical check for it with Corona. Pregnancy also makes a lot of my numbers look bad on paper. For example, my BMI is in the overweight category now, my blood pressure is higher than recommended, and so on. If these new services are garbage, has anyone gotten life insurance while pregnant and have recommendations? Should I just wait till postpartum when my body re-adjusts?

    • Celia

      You can try the Auto Club, if you already have car insurance there. Or Aflac.

  35. Anonymous

    We have a stairway from the basement/ground floor that opens into our family room, which has a hardwood floor and an area rug on it. We want to put a runner on the stairs. How do we do this so that it doesn’t look weird in the family room? Does the runner end on the top step?

    I have done some searching and only see images of runners where at the top there is an “integrated” hallway type runner. Since we don’t have a hallway but rather that open room, how should it work?

  36. Emma

    Does anyone have advice on divorcing your spouse when you are the primary breadwinner? My husband has been physically and emotionally abusive for years. He never worked while I made my way up to Biglaw partner (also never contributing to household chores/cooking and we have no kids), but he spent all the money I made, mostly buying sports cars. Finally left him and he and his lawyers are making the divorce hell and I have to pay for everything, all the experts and attorneys fees (that they are driving up of course). It feels so unfair but so far the judge has decided already in his favor once that instead of selling a sports car to pay for divorce expenses, I should just pay for all expenses of the divorce out of pocket, while still paying temporary support and the mortgage for the house he is living in still, along with my own living expenses. At this point my savings are gone and I’m living paycheck to paycheck (it’s a large paycheck but it still goes out to pay lawyers, experts, and two households’ expenses). I know divorce is no-fault in most states (including mine) but how can it be that someone who abused me now gets to financially ruin me (all while still sitting at home not Working)? It feels so unjust. Any advice for someone who knows how to successfully combat this? I do believe my lawyer is doing the best she can but I feel so defeated and like the system is rigged against women who are breadwinners. I’m also very worried the final hearing will be pushed off by COVID and this will drag out even longer. Really hoping someone has an answer out there, or at least something I can advocate for change in the laws going forward for others.

    • Anon

      repost in the afternoon thread or tomorrow because hopefully someone has some ideas

    • Senior Attorney

      Alas, this is the unintended consequence of the laws that were intended to protect women who gave up their careers to stay home support their breadwinning husbands. I have no answers for you but all the love and sympathy in the world!

      • Senior Attorney

        And also, this is something that helped me get through:

        Q: Why is divorce so expensive?
        A: Because it’s worth it!

      • Emma

        Agreed–I am wondering how to fix the laws. I don’t want to hurt women who gave up their careers, but abusive husbands who refused to work and didn’t contribute to the household should not get the benefit of it. I keep hearing more and more stories like mine and it drives me crazy.

        And thanks for the quote below!

        • Senior Attorney

          Right? It makes me crazy, too. Let me know when you figure it out!

    • Anon

      Not a family/divorce law expert at all (tax lawyer here!), but worth considering whether this could be reframed as financial abuse (and continuation of prior abuse now that you are separated). Perhaps that would allow you to effectively circumvent the no-fault divorce piece? There was a recent NYTimes article about an academic being harassed through her university’s anti-harassment system and talks about how she and her wife were able to reframe the situation and start fighting back. Hugs to you!

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