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Splurge Monday’s Workwear Report: Hybrid Denim & Knit Pants

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A woman wearing pants that are black fabric on top and black denim on the bottom

Our daily workwear reports suggest one piece of work-appropriate attire in a range of prices.

OK, I know that denim isn’t appropriate for every office, but other than that, these pants are absolutely perfect. It’s giving athleisure meets skater meets sensible dad belt. What more could you ask for?

Pick your favorite midriff-baring top and you might be lucky enough to have a very confusing, awkward conversation with your favorite HR folks.

The pants are $1,080 at Nordstrom and comes in sizes 0–8.

Sales of note for 3/10/25:

  • Nordstrom – Spring sale, up to 50% off
  • Ann Taylor – 40% off everything + free shipping
  • Banana Republic Factory – 40% off everything + 20% off
  • Eloquii – Extra 50% off all sale and select styles with code
  • J.Crew – 40% off everything + extra 20% off when you buy 3+ styles
  • J.Crew Factory – 50% off all pants & sweaters; extra 50% off clearance
  • M.M.LaFleur – Friends and family sale, 20% off with code; use code CORPORETTE15 for 15% off
  • Spanx – Lots of workwear on sale, some up to 70% off
  • Talbots – Flash sale until midday 3/14: $50 off every $200 – combineable with other offers, including 40% off one item and 30% off everything else

216 Comments

    1. I saw these pants IRL last week in Florence Italy! My husband and I laughed but not in her face, of course!

      1. Oh my. I’d have so many questions for the wearer, but I guess it all boils down to WHYYYYYY?????

    3. Apparently I cannot get over these pants. The description: “…these innovative pants that showcase the French design duo’s technical wizardry”.

      Is anything wrong with pants that have the legs attached to a normal crotch of the same material? Are leg belts innovative?

      Thinking about it, maybe the leg belts can be useful when I want to strap my VERY PROFESSIONAL WATER BOTTLE to my legs and be hands free. Ha!

  2. 1. Spot on pick. Would wear while listening to Cowboy Carter.

    2. Help me pick out new patio furniture. Live in the Northeast, have a large patio in a quiet backyard. We have kids but our most frequent use is having neighbors/friends just stop over and hang out while refereeing child chaos in the backyard. We’ve had a table with 2 benches that husband built – more functional than fashionable – and a patio set I think I got for $200 on wayfair. Both have lived at least 10 years but are on their last legs.

    We have Adirondack chairs which go around a fire and can be moved for the aforementioned refereeing; however, do we want: a big table (Polywood maybe?) with a bench and chairs which will seat 8-ish, a conversation set, a round table which seats our family of 5 and to send kids to the kids table if we have guests, or some other option.

    Already checked Costco, not loving what they have.

    1. We have Tropitone pieces we bought in the 90s that have been literally indestructible.

    2. We have a cast aluminum chair and tables that have lasted over 10 years. In the midwest and we keep them out year round, but do cover them in the winter. Home Depot and Lowes are places to check. I have also seen sets at Macy’s furniture stores.

    3. Last spring, we bought some cushioned teak chairs for our patio that I absolutely love from CB2. More comfortable than our couch. I spend so much time sitting outside in them — and I rarely sat outside before getting them. Link to follow.

    5. Do you know whether they have these in navy/indigo? I don’t wear black.

      I like that this pick solves my problem of not being able to choose between skinny vs wide legs.

    6. My recommendation is to go to Home Depot or another home-improvement store near you and sit in their floor models. Things I ordered online, turned out to be uncomfortable and very difficult to return.

      You want to be able to sit outside for good long periods of time. You need to find something in person that is the most comfortable thing you’ve ever sat in

    7. If you get pieces with cushions, make sure you get Sunbrella fabric. It’s stupidly expensive but anything else will fade and wear out really fast.

      1. I’ve found Sunbrella scratchy and mildew prone, and spot cleaning left water marks, but maybe I picked a bad option.

    8. I suggest you get a picnic table with attached benches to serve as the “kids’ table” or larger table to seat more than five diners. Then get a nice traditional filligreed metal patio set of round dining table (with room for umbrella), plus arm chairs to place around the round dining table. I concur with the suggestion to go to Home Depot and try out the seating, as outdoor furniture often looks fetchiung but hurts to sit on for too long!

  3. I do not know why this one is so hard for me to crack, but please pass along your best recs for what to wear on the airplane. For context, looking for nicer athleisure – joggers rather than leggings, full zip sweatshirt or jacket over t shirt is my jam. I am looking for that unicorn material that is soft but provides warmth (chronically freezing, especially on planes) and enough heft that it does not cling. I have one pair of Vuoris and love how soft they are, but too thin/clingy for me for this. I keep seeing pics of folks who look so effortlessly cool and put together on the plane and while I am that way in one or two areas of my life, I feel like a complete misfit when it comes to a great travel outfit. Not too worried about cost. Brand recommendations highly appreciated.

    1. I believe there are thicker Vuori joggers. I also bought boot cut Vuoris and they seem much more like “real pants” than my regular joggers.

      1. Vuori used to make thicker joggers in an athletic material but I haven’t seen them come back in a few years. I have an older pair that I love and do in fact wear on the plane, haha.

    2. Try Beyond Yoga joggers; for lighter materials, take a look at Athleta. All three places have long-sleeved t-shirts (try black, navy, or gray).

    4. I just wear stretchy boyfriend jeans – Kut from the Kloth Catherine, specifically – as they’re just as comfortable as joggers but don’t make me feel schlubby on arrival.

      1. I also wear stretchy jeans and either a sweater or quarter zip (with a T-shirt underneath) on top. I like Kut from the Kloth and AG jeans.

    5. I just wear cotton leggings; I feel less frumpy in fitted leggings than joggers or sweatpants.

    6. The one time I really felt very put together on an airplane I wore fitted by not tight ponte trousers and a merino sweater, plus a big pashmina scarf. The pants were stretchy enough to feel like pajamas, but the material was substantial and warm, did not wrinkle, and did not cling. The sweater, worn over a HeatTech long sleeve tee, kept me cozy and also didn’t wrinkle. The scarf kept my neck warm and also helped conceal my habit of wearing a very minimal bra on planes for comfort, and removing it as soon as I can get to the bathroom to strip it off. I added a pair of wooly socks in flight when I took my (clean, new, not smelly) shoes off.

      1. How uncomfortable are bras? I’m smaller busted and wear a lined light support bra or even a UW one with no issues. My only annoyance is strap slippage on some models if I move around a lot. Not sure how I avoided bad bras.

        1. Because you are small busted. Can you not grasp that the infrastructure in a bra for a large busted women is completely different in terms of comfort?

          1. Nah, I’m about as large busted as they come (36K UK sizing) and it’s about finding a bra that fits you. I have never understood the “rip my bra off as soon as I am able” people. I don’t even think about the fact that I’m wearing a bra other than putting it on when getting dressed in the morning and taking it off before I go to bed.

            For airplanes I’m on team ponte trousers and a sweater or jeans with some stretch and a Bombas merino long sleeve tee. It’s as close as I can get to athleisure before it feels like there’s no saving it from looking sloppy.

        2. I’m big busted, and I don’t get all the complaints about bras either. I’ve always preferred underwire bras, and one of my biggest complaints about pumping was that the bra selections sucked.

          I’m guessing that it’s just an issue that different people have different bodies. Underwires have never poked me in the side, but it seems that’s common for others

          1. Bras never bothered me until after I had kids. I’m a similar size as pre-pregnancy but I cannot find a comfortable underwire bra despite many fittings.

    7. You can’t compare yourself to staged photos. That way madness lies. (And a lot of unsatisfactory purchases.)

    8. I wear black cotton pants with some stretch and a t shirt. Add fleece jacket if needed or pashmina.

    9. It’s okay to be a “misfit” sometimes. Nothing wrong with wanting to look nice, but if you’re spending a lot of time struggling with this (“this one is so hard for me to crack”), you might be better off just wearing jeans, a sweater, and moving on.

      1. Agree with this. I don’t aim to look cute on a plane; there is no point. I’m not trying to impress anyone. If I need to change in the bathroom at the arrival airport, I’ll do that. Otherwise, it’s North Face pants or skirt, a long sleeved t-shirt from a race that is in reasonable condition, and sneakers.

    10. I love my Popflex Active hoodies. The half zip is my favorite. I wear Athleta joggers with them.

    12. Based on my recent flights, nobody’s looking that great, even in athleisure. I’d wear what’s comfortable and move on.

      2. Yeah unless you’re flying with your boss or something, it wouldn’t occur to me to try to look nice for a flight. Even in first class people look pretty schlubby these days.

    14. My advice is that it’s not the outfit that matters but everything else. If you have two people in the exact same pair of joggers and on trend sneakers/sweater/jacket, and one has their hair done, light makeup on, nails done, and is there early enough that they aren’t rushing around frantically, and the other one threw their hair in a pony tail, skipped makeup and is running through the airport to catch their flight, the former will always look more put together.

      To be clear, I know this because I am always the latter person, and I regularly see people wearing almost identical outfits to mine and I know I look worse, haha.

      So I would wear what you are comfortable in and call it a day!

    15. Have you looked at Athleta? Also what is your shape? Lots of the images of people in expensive athleisure are tall and willowy young women – if you are short or curvy or a pear it’s going to look different which doesn’t mean it can’t look great, you may just need to make different picks that will suit your body better.

    16. I fly to long haul fairly regularly and often arrive too early to check in. That means I am walking around Paris, Rome, etc. in whatever I wore on the plane and I do not want to look like the clueless American tourist. I have come up with a plane uniform – variations depending on weather:
      (1) Pants – I wear compression socks (Bombas) on long flights and the means no ankle baring pants. I have an old pair of Betabrand pants I have been wearing for years but I have a new pair of the Spanx Air Essentials I am trying out later this month. I hear good things about the Athleta Brooklyn pant but the the regular is too long for me and the petite is too short.
      (2) I bring an extra pair or socks and undies to change in the airport bathroom on arrival unless I am arriving late enough I can check into my hotel right away.
      (3) A short or long sleeve cotton t-shirt depending on weather, usually black or striped. Right now that is J Crew or Banana Republic.
      (4) A longish cardigan – usually light cashmere but cotton blend if I am going someplace warmer. If I am otherwise wearing black, this is camel. Otherwise I have a couple of black and plum ones.
      (5) A pashima for the plane. I usually create a tent over my head because I hate eye masks and it helps me sleep even fir I do not wear it at all during the trip.
      (6) My bulkiest shoes (usually my black Addidas Gazelles unless it is going to be wet in which case I wear my Blonde booties).

      Hair in a pony tail. No make up on the plane but I bring the bare minimum to put on when I arrive. (I have a tiny bag of disposable face cleaning clothes (which I do not usually use but they are perfect for travel) , deodorant, toothbrush, floss, etc. to freshen up; I just put on sunscreen, concealer, mascara and lipstick and call it good enough).

      None of this applies if I am going someplace tropical! In that case I throw fashion out the window and wear a light cotton maxi dress with leggings and socks and light sneakers. Add the cardigan and pashima for the plane. That way I can take the leggings and socks off at my destination and not be dying in 80+ degree humidity.

      I hope you have a great trip.

      1. ETA: “even if” I do not wear it on during the trip. I swear I can spell.

        Also, Wardrobe Oxygen did a great round up of size inclusive black travel pants last month that is worth checking out for ideas. She excluded a bunch of brands based on sizing and inseam length but it is still a great resource.

    17. l have a travel uniform:

      Stretchy jeans (I like to wear jeans on the plane because they are heavy and bulky in my suitcase) — agree Kut from the Kloth is good
      Long sleeve striped tee (generally I wear a rash guard from Lands End for this)
      Navy lightweight travel blazer from Eddie Bauer a couple of seasons ago (it’s sold out except for lucky sizes in black, but here it is — it runs small: https://www.eddiebauer.com/p/21101682/womens-departure-blazer?sp=1&color=Black&size=8&sizeType=Regular&ch=pla&utm_medium=organicsrch-pla&utm_source=g&utm_campaign=free_shopping_ads&utm_content=21101682&utm_term=0111608100001008)
      Colorful scarf or bandana
      Sneakers – I like New Balance for travel
      I have am awesome navy fleece poncho/cape from Ugg that fits in my carry-on that I can wear or use as a blanket on the plane because I run cold. It’s not available any more but this is similar: https://tnuck.com//products/black-high-neck-poncho?variant=43632730996958&gad_source=1&gclid=CjwKCAjwtqmwBhBVEiwAL-WAYW_R9uY8MnmSSz3wn3U0jyAF78N9HM0yJoyrOGGTOA6dBSiMim8WHBoCpzIQAvD_BwE

    18. I recommend Duluth Trading “Noga” cotton pants in black. They are thick and stretchy, but not clingy, with a comfortable waist. I usually wear a 3/4-length (bracelet length) cotton knit v-neck t-shirt, with a dense pattern to help conceal any stains for “when” (not “if”) I spill some of my in-flight meals down my front. I bring an extrad patterned cotton-knit v-neck t-shirt to change into, in case too much food/drink dribbles during the flight, plus extra undies, bras, swimsuit, flip-flops, and other essentials in my carry-on, in case my checked bag is delayed in arrival. I top it all off with a quarter-zip dark colored sweatshirt, or long black cardigan, or short black cardigan if it will also coordiante with other outfits during the trip. I bring a huge square silk scarf to cover my hair if it is raining upon arrival (in case of deplaning via stairs while carrying hand luggage, which makes using an umbrella a bit of a challenge) (plus there dare those occasional airports where security staff have decided umbrellas are like weapons and have confiscated them from me in the past). I pack in my hand luggage a hat and gloves if necessary on either end of the flight. On occasion, for short flights, I’ll wear a dress or skirt and top, plus cardigan, so I can walk off and jump into action at the destination. A pashmina or similar wrap can cover up bare legs for the duration of a short flight, if it’s chilly.

    19. Can you just wear… clothes? Jeans have a lot of stretch these days. A cozy layered to of some kind. Not everyone needs to travel in glorified PJ’s.

      1. I bloat terribly on planes…and most of my flights are long haul. I would love to wear pants/ jeans, but even in pants two sizes too large, or with stretch, something about the waistband or button feels awful with bloating. I have worn leggings one a plan jersey dress, but because I wear compression socks, I can’t seem to make this look as good. I’m thinking of purchasing bootcut leggings/ ‘pants’ from lululemon, which I have never owned to wear on the plane. Would these look ok on the train from Heathrow with my luggage in tow?

    20. I hate that “athleisure for the airplane” is now something we’ve been tricked in to consuming for.

      1. Thank you for this. Last time I flew, I noticed that women from young girls to old ladies were in some kind of coordinated athleisure including sneakers. I have two trips this month and you just knocked me out to the consumer trance and saved me a trip to the Athleta store. I do own jeggings, tees and jardigans already!

    21. I’m on a flight today wearing a pair of Ayr black ponte (I think?) pants and they are super comfortable, pretty thick, and look good.

    22. I love Athleta joggers but I also have coordinated sets from target or Walmart that are comfortable for long flights. I think a matching set does make a difference. Otherwise it’s black girlfriend joggers and a long sleeve t with cardigan or a sweatshirt. I don’t personally wear jeans unless it’s a short flight. But I also wear leggings every day.

  4. Can anyone recommend a good restaurant in or near MIT in Cambridge that we can get to by walking or by taking the T? We would like to eat somewhere with delicious food that’s not too fancy or expensive. Thanks.

    1. The Row 34 by Kendall is good. You could also walk a little and go to the Helmand (Afghani food) by the Cambridgeside mall.

      1. I used to eat at Helmand 20 years ago. I’m so happy it’s still around and still a recommendation!

      1. It closed. Sad face.

        Area Four is delicious. Fancy delicious pizza. It’s not crazy adventurous, but I have kids and know how they can be. If your kids are cheese and only cheese pizza types, prob not the best choice. But so good.

    3. Wanted to add that I will be with my 3 teenagers, so anyplace that’s popular with college kids is probably a good bet.

      1. …or a terrible choice because they want to look cool to the college kids, and being with parents is much less cool to younger teens than to those in college.

      2. I don’t think MIT students eat at area restaurants that much tbh. I live fairly close by and just don’t see kids hanging out. If the food is your priority, in addition to prior suggestions, I recommend checking out Boston Eater’s recommendations for Central Square. If you try the Helmand, save room for ice cream at Toscanini’s down the block.

        1. Tosci’s was popular when I was at MIT 20 years ago. Also Anna’s Taqueria and Bertuccis but I think those both closed. Harvard Square was popular for a bigger night out but again all the restaurants I frequented are closed.

  5. any one recommend (or not recommend) kiziks? do they run wide or narrow or big or small? they’re sneakers you supposedly can just step into…. debating getting a pair for a trip to japan where, i understand, i will be taking my shoes on and off.

    1. I don’t have any experience with Kiziks, but I can endorse On Cloud walking shoes. They have some no-tie models you can step in and out of. I have the Cloud 5 sneakers and love them .

    2. I tried Kiziks before my trip to Japan! Sadly, they were too wide around the heel for me, so they slipped up and down – I returned them. That said, I also found that I took my shoes off much less than I had expected to. The only places I needed to remove them were temples (to go inside the building, not just walk through the grounds), and sentos/onsens. At the temples there was always ample space and time to sit to remove shoes and put them back on, so the “step in” design wasn’t absolutely necessary, and plenty of people were stopping to take off and put on sneakers. At sentos/onsens, you take your shoes off as soon as you enter, and put them in a little locker. Again, there is space and time do to this comfortably.

    3. I have three pairs of Kiziks and wear them almost exclusively during European travel (easy at the airport, very comfortable for my feet during days where we are walking all over the place, prettier than an athletic sneaker).

      I have a narrow heel and borderline wide toe box, and have found the regular width to fit well, and they are otherwise TTS on me. I also have a pair in wide that are also a good fit on me.

    4. Absolutely love my Kizik’s. They are my favorite sneaker. Easy to slip on and SO comfortable. I have normal feet and they seem to fit normally.

  6. Best current Athleta pics that could work in a casual office? I have a gift card and enough athleisure; need 2024 work items because my pre-Covid clothes just all look off or are too small. Pear shaped, 5-4, don’t wear petite bottoms but sometimes need petite tops and jackets.

      1. I’ve had the older / longer version as at home wear. I have a feeling shorter is better. But what is with 5-7 of the color offerings these days not being even colors? It’s like “mist” and “oatmeal” and “vapor” and “cloud” are pretty much the same thing. Not just on this item but everywhere.

        1. Yeah, I’m getting really tired of all neutrals, plus warm colors that look hideous on me.

  7. I had a good weekend with lots of events with family and friends for the Easter holiday, but I am TIRED today. And this is despite going to bed early last night. I am struggling hard with my energy levels lately, especially if I do anything extra, and it’s bumming me out. It doesn’t help that when I’m tired, everything else goes to crap: meal planning, any self-control around sweets, morning exercise. Hoping this is an unusual lull.

    1. I think it’s totally normal to be tired after you do “more” than you usually do… isn’t that the way the body works? when i’m dragging I Drink a lot of water and eat clean, lots of protein for a day or two. Maybe some light exercise and get out in the sun?

    2. I am always tired the Monday after Easter. It’s my favorite holiday but I see a lot of people and do a lot of things. I think that’s normal!

      I have a crockpot meal going today.

    3. Try iron supplements if you are typically low iron but not enough to be anemic. Makes a world of difference for me in my energy levels.

  8. I’m wearing the dress linked below to a Beverly Hills Hotel gala. Any recs for shoes or earrings?

  9. The best part of the April Fool’s Day post is always the price tag on whatever ridiculous item Kat has managed to find.

    1. Absolutely! Was looking forward to today’s post and you delivered on a great one for April Fool’s Day! Thanks for adding a smile to my Monday!!

  10. I’m getting to the stage of life where my friends are dispersing from all living downtown. I’m having trouble figuring out my priorities and determining where I want to live moving forward. How did you decide to stay in the center of the city or move to a further out city neighborhood?

    30, single, work downtown 2x a week. I’m torn between wanting to stay in my current location without amenities or moving further out for amenities like parking and in unit laundry. I don’t drive to work, but hobbies and visiting family and some friends requires parking. All neighborhoods I’m considering are walkable and have transit – some are more walkable than others but all have bars, restaurants, and parks I can walk to.

    Friends (in different groups) are really spread out all over. 2 friends here, 3 friends there, so no one area has a majority or anything. The friends I see the most are in a neighborhood I don’t like and won’t to. I’m single but dating, so location of friends matters as that’s my main form of socializing.

    1. If you are renting, I would go with what is affordable so you can save up for other goals like buying a home, traveling or retirement. All your friends are spread out so either way you’ll be traveling to see them. Also this is the age where friends start to get married (all those bachelorette parties $$$), have kids and move out to the suburbs so live where you truly want to live.

      1. Unfortunately costs of living in the neighborhoods are pretty much equal (one neighborhood I’m looking at is slightly cheaper but the difference would be made up by having to Uber home from going out and taking transit to work – I currently walk to / from work, bars, friends’ houses, etc).

        There are things I like a lot about all of the neighborhoods I’m considering, though they’re very different. I love how my current area is the most walkable place I’ve ever lived. Other areas have better access to nature which I love, but would require driving to run errands.

    2. I would do (and have done) a lot of things to get parking and laundry. Especially if you are only going in 2x a week.

    3. I made the unorthodox choice to move to a leafy suburb. It was walkable and had easy access to the train into the city. The amenities were top notch: talking trails, parks, all that. Extremely safe area which was very nice.

      It was the days in which people put addresses on resumes, and it unexpectedly helped me: people took me seriously (“that’s a mature choice”) and it helped me network. “Oh you live right down the road – let’s meet up for coffee.”

      1. “that’s a mature choice” would be so wildly inappropriate for someone to say???

        1. Like it or not, that’s the sort of atmospheric intangible that often is incorporated into these decisions.

          2. Decisions by hiring managers, people who are considering putting you on a (working, not large dollar donation based) board of directors, people who meet you and are wondering if they should pass your name along to their friend in your industry….

          3. Wow. WILDLY inappropriate to make the jump that 20s in the burbs is more mature than 20s in the city. If someone is deciding if they should hire or network with me based off of that, I don’t want to work with them!

            I don’t understand what makes suburbs = mature choice and city = immature?

        2. In context, it wasn’t all that inappropriate; it was said by someone at an alumni event who also lived in the town, is about 15 years older than I am, and, after we had been chatting for a while, asked why I chose to live there. The only other late-20-somethings in that area were living with their parents.

          As Runcible Spoon said, like it or not, those intangibles do change people’s opinions.

          1. I feel like there’s no way to appropriately judge someone’s choice of where to live as mature or not.

            There are so many factors that go into someone’s choice of where to live, random business contacts should butt out.

    4. I’m in the same situation and I’ve decided to buy an apartment in a Brooklyn neighborhood I like with good public transportation. Since my friends are so spread out it doesn’t make sense to try and live somewhere where a lot of them live, and I don’t want to live in Manhattan. I still go into Manhattan very often, for dates etc so I’d rather live in an area I like.

    5. I stayed put living in my city (SF) despite my friends moving to the burbs in my 30s. It was much easier to date and both my husband and I are city people. No kids. It’s very easy to commute to our downtown jobs and I like being able to easily take advantage of restaurants, shows, museums, etc without it requiring any real planning. And walking to just about everything is great too. In my 40s now and no plans to move ever, it’s easier to age in a city. As for seeing friends, they disappear for a while when they have kids but are more likely to be up for a night out in the city, or I just go out to them occasionally too.

    6. I would absolutely move for parking and laundry but stay somewhere walkable becausey quality of life is way better when I’m not driving daily

    7. I lived in the city (SF) for years and finally moved to Berkeley to start my family. Most of my city friends did similar moves, and my last City friend just moved last year.

      Maintaining your social life is about making the effort to go meet up with your friends. I have friends in Marin, Sonoma, the east east bay, the South Bay, the peninsula, and right here in the Berkeley / Oakland area. Wherever you move, you can’t expect everyone to come to you, so you get your butt on a train or in your car and go see them. :)

      Live where you will enjoy life!

    8. We bought a home in the burbs with the good schools when my our son was in school. Blech! Moved to a different city as empty nesters and we have a house 15-20 minutes from downtown. Its an older neighborhood where every house has some issues and no closet space. We just paid to have new pipe pur in the ground. But I see the tickytack houses when I drive anywhere and they made me want to cry.

    9. Thanks all for the advice thus far! A few things to add:
      – I’m very social; I have plans to meet up with friends or a scheduled thing (like a rec league soccer game) 4-6 nights a week. This is all centered around the downtown neighborhood I currently live in. If I moved, I’d see my more far flung friends more but would see my downtown friends less. My downtown friends are by nature more social than my other friends so I do think I’d socialize less if moved.
      – I would still plan on going out downtown with my friends who live downtown. I could grab happy hour with them after work on my two office days, take the train in on the weekend, or plan ahead and do something. Currently this group does impromptu hangs which would be less feasible. My friends in the other neighborhoods I’m looking at are much more make plans well in advance people.
      – about half of my friends are planning to remain childfree. Only one friend is thinking about trying in the near future. People will have kids eventually and that will change things, but it’s far enough away that I don’t think it will matter for this move.
      – at this point I have zero desire to move to the suburbs. If / when I eventually make that move, it will be a walkable inner ring suburb but that’s still 5+ years away for me.

      I don’t live in DC anymore, but it’s probably a better example than my current city. Let’s say I live in Dupont Circle. A group has moved to Columbia Heights but I am not interested in living there. I could stay in Dupont which I like (walkable, vibrant area) but I can’t afford laundry / parking here. I also have friends in Courthouse (walkable but less vibrant, metro to work but could afford a better apartment), Navy Yard (ditto), or move to Woodley Park (no friends here, but closer to Columbia Heights and much greener. Could get a nicer apartment. Still walkable but less vibrant. Metro).

      1. I don’t know anything about DC, so the comparisons aren’t useful to me, but based on what you’ve described about your lifestyle, I would keep living downtown.

      2. I had a big group of friends that got together frequently, allegedly had no plans to settle down soon…and within a couple months most of those friends went AWOL after getting into a serious relationship, moved further from downtown to get a bigger place, or moved out of state. If you’re late twenties or early thirties things can shift quickly, so you can’t necessarily bank on your downtown friends sticking around. In my younger days I was happy to sacrifice space, amenities, and conveniences to live near the action. After several years I decided that loving my apartment and not dealing with daily logistical hassles was more important.

      3. I live in a smaller metro area and moved from downtown to a more suburban neighborhood because I fell in love with a house there, wanted outdoor space, more room. It was only a ten minute drive from downtown, I told myself I would still go coworking downtown, meet up with friends, etc. I very very rarely did. It’s SO much harder when you don’t live within walking distance to those things. I recently moved back to the city following a breakup and I’m so incredibly happy being here. It makes such a difference to my quality of life to be where cool things are happening, I’m way more plugged in to what’s going on in the city, and I’m within walking distance to all the “good” restaurants and coffee shops, not just the “only” coffee shop within walking distance.

        So my vote is stay downtown!

      4. If the distances are comparable to the DC neighborhoods, I would pick Woolley park. It’s still very easy to get to DuPont for an impromptu hang out, and Columbia heights is also relatively close.

      5. Might help to just say what city you’re actually in. From SF I just cannot envision moving to a neighborhood because my friends were there, it’s all accessible in the city limits. The things I considered before I bought my place were rent and what was available.

      6. Another vote for stay downtown. We are DINKs that put a high value on being able to walk to grab coffee on a Saturday morning / out to dinner on a random weeknight, having our gym close by and generally only filing up our gas tank once a month, so I might be a bit biased. But, with that said, the day I didn’t have to go to the laundry mat was an absolutely glorious life changing day.

      7. Do you have to move? It sounds like the only reason to move is laundry but keep in mind, moving can be very expensive when you factor in supplies, movers, and a realtor fee which is pretty difficult to avoid.

    10. Thanks all! I think you confirmed that I’m not ready to leave downtown!

      I’m a huge hiker / trail runner / mountain biker so I had been excited at the possibility of being closer to trails, but I just don’t think I’m ready to leave downtown just yet.

  11. Posting to reach more people than my weekend post did, the Sephora sun safety kit is available for the year. Sephora donates money to the Sloan Kettering Cancer Center for every kit purchased.

    My niece just had a malignant melanoma removed from her collar bone area a week or two ago, so please take care in the sun. This kit is a good way experiment with sun blocks.

    1. Melanoma is so scary. My dad and both grandpas have had it. Thankfully, in all cases, it was contained enough that it was treatable but my dad still has to get scans every 6 months to make sure it hasn’t returned. Skin cancer is not something to mess around with.

    2. Putting in a plug for sunshirts. They’ve been a total gamechanger for me and I live in them in the spring and summer. I have the Patagonia capilene cool hoodies and they’re so lightweight, wash well, and have held up to heavy use and abuse in the outdoors. They eliminate the need to put sunscreen on my chest, arms, and neck (if I wear the hoody).

    3. Thank you! I just bought it! I’m very diligent about sunscreen and seeing the dermatologist annually.

      1. +1 to annual screening. Our dermatologist found a “funny” spot on my husband at one of his annual visits that turned out to be melanoma in situ.

        Thankfully a couple of rounds of Mohs surgery +a deep scar got it all, but it was nothing either of us would ever have noticed – thank goodness for the annual skin check & the derm catching it before it got worse / noticeable.

      2. Yes, thank you! I am very un-diligent about sunscreen and trying to find a product to help me do better!

    5. Thanks! I tried to wait for the Sephora sale to buy last year’s kit, but it sold out before it got to my turn to shop the sale. I went ahead and ordered this year’s yesterday.

      I have a few Asian sunscreens I prefer so I mainly wear those day to day, but I love the kit of minis to keep in the car, in my handbag, and to travel with.

      1. Yea the review this year are bad because it’s not very high end products. I actually love to have sample sized sunscreen on me at all times so it works for me.

  12. Finding out my dream job was promised as one thing and was actually something else, ranging from passive management allowing problems to run rampant for years to expectations of working without pay as being part of the “Everyone chips in when needed” culture. It took 8 years to get a job in my field. I am trying to teach myself how to just lean way out because it’s not my job to care and if I slow down my email responses, maybe they’ll ask someone else for free labor at least some of the time. Trying to learn how to, to paraphrase Hamilton, “care less, smile more.”

    Any tips from Type-A’ers who have had to go from driving in the fast lane to basically putting it in neutral? If I don’t, I’ll either end up doing double my paid work for no extra pay (already underpaid) or looking like a poor fit here (which I see but don’t need them to see).

    1. I’d focus more on finding another job than trying to change who you fundamentally are.

    3. Try to choose extra work which is highly visible or a resume builder and actively avoid the extra work that is solely administrative or support in nature – the stuff no one remembers at review time and won’t build your resume. Since this job is in your field, try and get to all the conferences, join and participate in professional organizations – especially anything the company will pay for you to attend or join. Turn this position into the stepping stone for the next. Being genuinely busy doing work activity (resume building tasks, your conferences, representing the firm at events, etc.) makes it easier to decline someone else’s busy work. Good luck.

    4. I’m not totally following this free work angle, it sounds like you either picked a low paying field or a low paying job in your field. Either way, I’d focus on changing that. There’s literally no prizes or kudos to be gained by being a martyr. Start looking for something that compensates you well even if it means giving up the “dream.” If you make money, you can always donate to your cause.

  13. I have a sit stand desk at work and a couple of shelves, but no desk drawers where I can store snacks and personal effects. The shelves are attached to the top of my cubicle walls and are designed to be book shelves, and I don’t love the idea that anyone stopping by my office would be staring straight at my lotion and things. I do have a file cabinet that is mostly unused and I wonder if there is some kind of organizer I can put in there to store all the things that clutter my desktop currently? Any ideas? The cabinets are deep and don’t have much height on the sides. TIA!

    1. Can you get a pretty box or basket to put all of that stuff in? I have woven baskets that hold snacks and stuff on my office shelves.

      I also keep stuff like tampons and extra pens that I don’t want out in my file cabinets since I don’t do a lot of paper files. I have some trays and dividers to corral things but it’s mostly overflow so it doesn’t need to be too terribly organized.

      1. I’ll do this… good idea, thank you! I just needed someone else to come up with this for some reason.

    2. I suggest putting baskets or bins on the shelves, and storing supplies in there. As for the file cabinet, try to find some layered storage bins with two levels so you can make use of the space.

  14. I have been binging Girls5eva on Netflix and it’s been nostalgic and wonderful. I didn’t realize it’s been out for years on Peacock. Does anyone have recommendations for similar shows that I might also be sleeping on???!!

    2. Similar vibes are any of the Tina Fey shows – Unbreakable Kimmy Schmidt and Great News (I liked Great News more), and the Saved by the Bell reboot (by Tracey Wigfield who also created Great News and worked on 30 Rock – it’s better than you’d think).

      Another show that most people haven’t seen that is wonderful and involves a girl band is We Are Lady Parts.

    3. If you have young kids, the first season or so of Working Moms is incredibly funny (then it gets kind of weird). I liked Class of ’07 (apocalypse but funny and nostalgic).

  15. please help me adult.

    I just found out that my uncle died unexpectedly yesterday. He was 80. Growing up, I was really close to my cousins, one of which is slated to get married this fall. I’d like to reach out to both his daughters/my cousins, who are grown and in their late 30s/40s. What do I say? “Sorry for your loss” isn’t enough.

    Also, I’d like to reach out to my aunt, from whom he was divorced late in life but it was very friendly and they continued to somewhat share living quarters (a duplex; she lived there with her girlfriend, he lived upstairs.) My aunt was the one that found him. Is this a phone call? A text?

    I’m thinking somethign like maybe “we are all so sorry to hear about [uncle]. Sending our love to your entire family.” Does that sound right? Too formal? I AM SO BAD AT THIS. Do I send flowers to the immediate family?

    Ugh, this is the 3rd death in as many months for my extended family and my kids are going to be funeral experts :(.

    1. Also, I am not local. What about food? Do I send food to my aunt and her girlfriend, who are the most immediate family/handling everything? And maybe my one cousin who is semi local to my aunt? The other one lives across the country with young children.

    2. In the immediate aftermath, I would send cards to all adults individually (don’t send one to your aunt that is also for your adult cousins) and flowers to the funeral home.

      Go to the funeral if at all possible. Reach out after the funeral to offer condolences, good memories, and ask if there is anything they need.

    3. What you suggested sounds great. Sending flowers and/or a card would be lovely. I always err on the side of reaching out when deaths happen because you’d be surprised how many people do not. Any thoughtfulness is appreciated.

      1. And a sidenote – I grew up going to MANY funerals as a kid/teen, and I think it was an overall positive thing for me. I had much more experience and comfort in those events than a lot of my peers. It’s also helpful that many of the funerals were for older folks who had lived long lives, or for people I didn’t know personally. Made the hard funerals that happened later easier to manage.

    4. I’m so sorry about your uncle and love that you want to be a connected and loving family member. For your cousins, I’d send a text now, maybe call in a few days, and send a card. You don’t have to say a lot for it to be meaningful. I’ve totally used the Hallmark website or others that pop up when I search “condolence card messages”. The general tips are: be sincere, don’t make it about you, share a warm memory or compliment of your uncle, offer help if you are nearby and can provide it.

      As for your aunt, a text could be fine for now and offer that you’d like to talk when she’s up for it.

      I would save any flowers for a memorial service/funeral.

    5. Call each of them, and send flowers to your aunt. Maybe start by calling the one you’re closest with first, and feel out when/how to reach out to the others based on that? And if you can, it would be nice to add in a little memory of your uncle, even just a “Uncle Greg was always the life of the party, he had the best laugh” or something like that.

    6. Here’s my tip, having been the bereaved way too often.

      Don’t let perfection stand in the way of good enough. Reach out soon. Tell them how sorry you are. Say that you loved him, or that you know they loved him a lot. Say that you’re thinking of them and feeling awful for their loss. Sharing a small happy memory of your uncle would also be good.

      Do not say “he’s in a better place” or “god wanted him home” unless you are absolutely sure they hold religious beliefs where that would be welcome – even then it’s a gamble I wouldn’t take.

      Sorry for your loss, OP.

      1. Thanks, and thanks for the reminder on the “not to say”s. I would never…but having been on the receiving end of such thoughts…I completely agree. also “it’s all gods plan” or whatever.

      2. +1
        There’s no magic words when someone is bereaved and the method of reaching out is less important than that you do.

      3. +1. I’d encourage you to share memories in your notes. Or share one now, and write another round of notes in 6 months with more memories. The memories are all that’s left.
        If the family members live near one another and see each other regularly, then I think one note addressed to multiple people is just fine. When my dad died, people sent cards addressed to my mom and me because they knew we are together a lot. She read the cards when they arrived at her house and passed them to me.

    7. Your text sounds fine to me, both for your cousins and aunt. A call is nice, but not necessary. I would do what you find most comfortable. I’m never sure what to do when it comes to flowers. I typically make a donation to a charity in memory of the deceased.

    8. I always felt this way too — what to say??? Having now lost a parent, I learned that 1) I didn’t really care what people said, it was just helpful to be reminded of the fact that I had a community to support me, so any form of reaching out and any message was well-received. and 2) +1 to sending warm memories – I loved hearing all the ways my parent had touched others’ lives, or just little memories that captured a piece of them. Again, doesn’t have to be an amazing story or well-written, was just nice to hear any kind of memory.

    9. You’ve gotten a lot of great suggestions–one other thing I’d add is that when someone passes away at this age, it’s a different kind of bereavement. My last grandparent to pass away with my paternal grandmother at 89–she died peacefully, having lived a full and happy life filled with family, so the bereavement was less sad and more somber. Any “I’m sorry for your loss” message is always appreciated, but I’d try to cite a memory of two that you have of him when speaking to your cousins and aunt–focus on the life he led and the impact he’s leaving behind. I’d acknowledge to your cousin that it will be hard not to have him there on her wedding day as well.

      I’d start off with a text so they can answer when they’re ready. If any of them are chatty over text or seem like they want to talk more, follow up with a call in a day or two.

    10. To me, the text sounds way too generic. This is what you say to a co-worker you barely know who had a family member die. Make it more personal since you know and care about these people. Mention something that you miss/remember about him. I would probably call, especially the aunt since she is older and likely more used to phone communication. Phone is also more personal.

    11. To me, that text is way too generic. That is what you say to a coworker you barely know who had a family member die, not to someone you know and care about. Say something you miss/remember about your uncle, and make it more personal. I lean towards calling, especially your Aunt, since she is older and may be more comfortable with phone calls. Calls are also way more personal.

    12. I’m so sorry. “Sorry for your loss” always feels like it isn’t enough because nothing short of bringing that person back could ever be “enough” to relieve their grief. The important thing is to reach out and show up. I always like to share a nice memory you have of the deceased. You sound like a thoughtful relative!

    13. Reach out soon. Be sure to write a note (or text or email, but note is great if you just do it) that includes a personal memory or anecdote involving your uncle. My uncle died last week and I included some of my earliest memories of my uncle babysitting the kids in my family, which happened to be hilarious and capture my uncle at the same time.

      1. I agree with a number of the previous replies. Having lost my father recently, my uncle, and all of my grandparents and several great uncles, I very much agree that even the simplest of notes or calls will be appreciated. Knowing someone remembered you in your grief, and the specifics of the person who died, in a shared memory is a great comfort. The fact that you are considering the best ways to reach out says wonderful things about you. Whether you decide on flowers now or at a funeral/memorial service, either I suspect will be appreciated. Sorry for your loss.

      1. These? *snort*
        https://www.target.com/p/women-39-s-calista-boots-with-memory-foam-insole-wild-fable-8482-blue-denim-5-5/-/A-89258350?sid=&ref=tgt_adv_xsp&AFID=google&fndsrc=tgtao&DFA=71700000012577559&CPNG=PLA_Shoes_Priority%2BShopping%7CShoes_Ecomm_AA&adgroup=Shoes_Priority+TCINs&LID=700000001170770pgs&LNM=PRODUCT_GROUP&network=g&device=c&location=9031104&targetid=aud-554348709499:pla-895684727215&ds_rl=1241788&ds_rl=1246978&gad_source=1&gclid=CjwKCAjwtqmwBhBVEiwAL-WAYVFYsbfHZcJGejCwS2ENsvY_hbUSx1s3GSoWZL517qLmz5YcBrGY2xoC6pcQAvD_BwE&gclsrc=aw.ds

  17. How do you deal with the guilt of needing to take a break from an old friend for your own sanity even when theyre going through a hard time?

    I’ve known this person nearly half my life (mid 30s) and I’m pretty sure the chaos and instability of her life since our 20s is likely due to some form of borderline personality disorder. When her life is going well shes a great friend and the outside she “has it all”: wealthy, very impressive job, owns a gorgeous home. But when her life isnt going the way she wants, her anger and resentment is palpable and her relationships are incredibly unstable and toxic with constant drama (if they are toxic and causing drama, she is). I have talked to her about it but I ended up playing a therapist and it was very exhausting. It took going to therapy myself to realize a few years ago that I needed to step back.

    Her chaotic cycle is starting again and I realized that I just dont have it in me to be more than causal friends with her at this point in my life. How do I come to peace with this? I’ve grown apart from several friends throughout my life and I know its natural but this feels so much heavier and heartbreaking to me because I dont want to step away when someone is struggling especially if its due to something they cant quite control…

    1. There’s no real answer, ultimately it’s a personal decision but i think you just take a break. Pull back, are less available, don’t respond to texts or take calls….. unless you really want to “break up” in which case I guess you could say something but i tend to do the fade out…

    2. I posted not too long ago about a friendship problem I was having with a friend who had basically all but ditched me when things were going well for her, but when she went through something awful (and it was truly awful) was really leaning heavily on me for support.

      My issue was how one-sided it was, and I didn’t enjoy one second of our time together. She never asked how I was doing nor did she show any interest in me at all.

      The commentariat here mostly said to reduce the amount of time I spent with her. Instead of dinner maybe a walk.

      So this weekend I saw her briefly, I didn’t agree to a restaurant meal, but we met for a stroll in the park for a while, and it wasn’t awful. The flowers are blooming and everything was pretty. However, as a bit of a test I talked about myself briefly – maybe a couple of minutes on a major change in my life – and then she said she was tired and wanted to leave. Which was fine! But I guess I needed more proof that she didn’t really care about me, and that was it. I don’t feel bad at all about putting her off now.

    3. One thing that helps me when dealing with this is the idea that one’s mental health isn’t their fault, but it is their responsibility. I acknowledge some struggles can be harder than others to treat, but it’s not your responsibility to be her therapist, and it’s probably not helpful for anyone in the long run!

      You also have to put your own oxygen mask on first. I’ve sometimes taken a step back from friends like this and we will reconnect when we’re both in a space to be good for each other.

    4. It’s okay to step back. I’ve had friends who could never ask me questions about my life or show interest in my family because they ALWAYS had some kind of drama or crisis going on. It got too one-sided on a permanent basis for me to continue investing the time to be helpful during challenging mental health times.

    5. Take a step back and have some scripts ready for her. If she’s in a good job and owns a gorgeous home, she can afford therapy.

      I would frame it as “Therapy can give you a lot of tools to help navigate these situations. I am simply not equipped to help you, but a trained therapist can. Those tools don’t make the chaos disappear entirely; it gives you the ability to not be buffeted around quite so much.”

      Throwing this out there: I have an incredibly chaotic life, despite that being not in line with my personality. The root cause is a almost sociopathically dysfunctional family of origin. Those people turn non-issues into explosive arguments. Responding to them calmly and rationally is a sure fire way to be met with black out rage fury and condescension; the goal is subjugation, not harmony. One “fun” side effect is that I struggle to remain level headed in tense situations because I so expect violent rage. I would hope that my friends don’t look down on me for that.

    6. If you think it is Borderline Personality Disorder, the only thing that really works is going no contact.

    7. If you like Jay Shetty – he recently did a podcast episode about choosing which friendships to invest in.
      I liked it, but if you don’t like his stuff, skip it and move on.

  18. Does anyone have a travel-sized hair curling iron or hair straightener they love?

    2. https://www.nordstrom.com/s/singlepass-compact-0-8-inch-travel-straightening-styling-flat-iron/4283332?color=NO+COLOR&size=one+size&utm_content=34014207779&utm_term=pla-259409015704&utm_channel=low_nd_shopping_standard&utm_source=google&utm_campaign=662927185&adpos=&creative=145518892984&device=c&matchtype=&network=g&acctid=21700000001689570&dskeywordid=92700049880460703&lid=92700049880460703&ds_s_kwgid=58700005465924755&ds_s_inventory_feed_id=97700000007631122&dsproductgroupid=259409015704&product_id=93671835&merchid=1243147&prodctry=US&prodlang=en&channel=online&storeid=&locationid=9007768&targetid=pla-259409015704&campaignid=662927185&adgroupid=34014207779&gad_source=1&gclid=CjwKCAjwtqmwBhBVEiwAL-WAYbz-sgHaWiW_WYhX6ru1tqFYks3OgwfSBKr9YM2cF2l_r54y2tr3OBoCvKsQAvD_BwE&gclsrc=aw.ds

      1. I have it in red and it is beautiful but not light weight….fall through early spring yes, but it is not for warm weather

  20. Anyone want to shop for me? I’m hunting for an outfit to wear for family photos. The details: outside in June, summery light vibe. I’m 5’2 and size 0, fair skin and blond/brown hair. 6 month old twins and a 2.5 year old, so something that can have me bending and leaning down as needed. I have a generally preppy aesthetic and still love 2008 fashion but I know I need to be in this decade. Nap dresses look cute on others but overpower me. Budget up to maybe 150ish?

    1. i would not buy something special for this. What’s your favorite casual top? wear jeans or white pants.

      1. Oh hard disagree, this is exactly what you buy something new for. Jeans also look terrible in photos. OP, have you looked at options on tuckernuck? I’d get one of their preppy dresses. Also look at Julia Armory for pretty summer dresses, too.

    2. even if you don’t want to go full matchy i would think about picking something that’s the same tones as what your kids are wearing. Like last time we did pictures everyone was in blue, it;s a little cohesive.

      1. I don’t know what size the babies will be so their outfits will come last. Same with toddler. It’s far easier for me to find cute kids clothes than my clothes, so they’re going to dress around whatever I end up wearing.
        And yes, I don’t have to buy anything new but I want to, since the last time I bought clothes other than maternity wear and nursing shirts was in 2020.

    3. I’d wear white cuffed boyfriend jeans and a tailored knit top (Breton stripe or a solid color, nothing busy) that coordinates with your family’s outfits.

    4. Genuine question: Exactly what fashion from 2008 do you still love, and what do you love about it? If you can identify what it is, then we might be able to help you look for the 2024 version of it.

    5. I read your first line too quickly the first time and thought you were asking for a “hunting oufit” and I was so confused why you posted here haha. I think it is out of your budget but the Ro’s Garden dresses could be lovely for this. They sell the line at Tuckernuck, which could be a good place to look for something in general.

    7. I’d go to a cheaper store like Target or Old Navy, pick something in a solid color that flatters you and coordinates with the family color scheme. It’s so hard to find things that fit postpartum that I’d shop in person and call it a day at good enough. If you’ve liked wearing pants, pick a nice shirt. If you can’t bear pants right now, look for a dress. Some dresses still have defined waists. I’m giving the midi columns a pass as those only highlighted the parts I didn’t want to highlight.

    8. Don’t forget jewelry and a lipstick you love too
      I think at this age the focus will be on the kids so you don’t need to look like the star instead go for happy busy mom look
      Not sure if that helps

    9. My sister is a pro maternity, infant, and family photographer that does “lifestyle” photos, and she has a rack of mostly Free People, Anthropologie and Pink Blush gowns–flowy, embroidered, maxi dresses with bell sleeves, things like that. It really makes a dynamic and beautiful timeless photo to have a big dress billowing in the wind, swishing around baby in arms, flowing out on the grass behind you, and so on. Many people do skinny jeans and a chunky sweater, but I admit these dramatic almost medieval gowns look stunning in the pictures.

  21. My husband and I are contemplating selling our first home, which we turned into a rental a little over a year ago. We have a lot of equity in the house and are looking forward to having assets that are more liquid than real estate, so we can focus on improvements to the home we live in and saving in a different way. Also, our tenant was unstable and it was generally not a good experience (so glad we have a management company!). She is about to move out, so the timing is good for us to sell. We have spoken to two different agents in our area and they both have different impressions of the market right now for this type of home (small/starter home). Agent A says that buyers are timid and doing a lot of looking but not a lot of offering, and many are still waiting for rates to come down. Agent B says that there is a big pent-up demand because so many buyers waited for lower rates last year, are tired of waiting, and are ready to buy and get on with their lives. Anyone have your own impressions or ideas that might differ? Would you get the house ready for sale in May and hope there’s pent-up demand, or rent it for another year with the idea that the market will be hotter next spring? We live in a mid-size PNW city with generally a higher cost of living than you might expect. We’d probably list the house for around 425-450k.

    1. If it were me, I’d go ahead and sell now, while it’s vacant. (Actually I’d hang on to it, but that’s a whole other story.)

      And if you’re in Portland, I had a conversation with a realtor there not long ago and she said the market was good for sellers, with low inventory and high demand. So take that for what it’s worth.

        1. Not SA, but a real estate family in SoCal, so I’ll bite on the pros and cons of selling/holding:

          Pros of selling:
          * you can invest the money elsewhere
          * investing the money elsewhere allows you to diversify your holdings
          * you don’t have to deal with tenants/rental market vagaries
          * you have liquid assets in case you have to flee (you can’t take real estate with you)

          Pros of holding/renting:
          * depending on your market, long-term you are likely to outperform stocks
          * steady cash flow
          * you can borrow against it in an emergency

        2. Me personally, I am holding on to my former house. I considered selling it when I married my current husband and moved into his house, but I didn’t really have a better place to put the money, and I already had a significant amount of money in the stock/bond market, so to me it makes sense to be diversified and have a good amount in real estate. So far the cash flow has been positive and the tenants have been reasonable, and the value of the house has doubled since I bought it ten years ago so I’m happy with how it’s going.

          And in addition to Anon at 1:34’s list of “pros of keeping,” I’d add “you can sell it to pay for end of life care.”

          1. But you also may be on the hook for a ton of taxes, if it’s an investment property and not your primary residence. Seems simpler to sell it and invest the money now

          2. Certainly if you sell eventually you’ll have to pay capital gains on the gain, just like with any investment. But if you can manage to hold on until you die without selling, your heirs will get a stepped-up basis so that’s the upside.

      2. Yea it definitely seems like a sellers market. I would also sell as being a landlord sounds like a part time job and a headache I don’t want.

    2. Look at Zillow for your town to see how quickly local homes are selling and for how much over asking. In most of the country it’s still a sellers market, especially for starter homes because there’s a lot of pent up demand in millennials looking for their first home. I’d sell now. I believe “professional opinion” is the market will start to soften, making it less favorable to sellers in the next couple years (as far as anyone can predict)

    3. I don’t know what the PNW market is like, but in my midwest locality houses on the starter-end of the range still create bidding wars and are often under contract within days (if not hours) of being listed. It is unfathomable to me just how wild the market is.

      1. Also in the Midwest and same. There simply aren’t many houses at all remotely within the range of middle class families.

        1. Same. Midwest, a house in my area between 400 and 550 will sell within a day, if it is in preferred neighborhood, and semi decent condition.

    4. I would think that the answer is you list it for sale when vacant, and if it doesn’t sell within a reasonable amount of time for the amount of money you want for it, you go back to renting it out.

    5. This is very location dependent, but as a LL your best time to sell is when the place is vacant. I would market it now, worst case you don’t get what you want and lose a few months rent.

    6. I’m on the East Coast, just listed my house for 449k, got multiple offers and accepted one for 475k with waived inspections after three days on the market. This is in a midsize city with relatively low cost of living, and March, so just about the ugliest the property can look. According to my real estate agent and my experience, at least over here, it’s very much a seller’s market.

  22. Borderline osteoporosis here, and trying to listen to the advice on weight bearing exercise. Have never had a lot of luck with simply lifting weights, either by myself or in a class setting. Wonder if anyone has tried, or has an opinion on, these places popping up around the country and promising to deliver strength training in just a couple of short segments a week? I know that if it seems too good to be true, it generally is, but SM is throwing three options at me nonstop: The Exercise Coach, Discover Strength, and OsteoStrong are all nearby. Not cheap, but worth if it they work. Has anyone used any of these franchises and if so, how has your experience and results been?

    https://try.exercisecoach.com/brand/minnetonka-mn?gad_source=1&gclid=EAIaIQobChMIyr75rsWhhQMVTHRHAR0HTADREAAYASAAEgK7GfD_BwE

    https://www.discoverstrength.com/

    https://osteostrongmn.com/

    1. I have a good friend who has bone loss in her mid 40s, and she’s doing a combo of rucking (walking with a weighted backpack) and Osteostrong. She’s been a consistent runner and weight lifter for years before her diagnosis, and she finds Osteostrong to be challenging and fun. She goes twice a week and has had a good experience. I don’t think she’s gotten another bone scan yet, so I don’t know the physical results.

    2. No experience on any of the links. However, upon a dx of osteoporosis in my 40s, I was placed on medication and referred to PT. The PT has me literally stomping my feet when I walk. (I already lift weights and get a ton of weightbearing exercising through weekly hiking and three runs per week). Not sure whether it was the drugs, the stomping, or some combination thereof, but bone density significantly improved after 18 months of meds and stomping. Maybe ask for a PT referral? It helped me. And they offered my regular PT check-ins to make sure I stayed on track with my crazy stomping.

      1. Can you more fully describe the stomping? Do you walk more slowly, and stomp as you go? How hard do you stomp? This has been recommended to me as well.

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