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Updated: Sep 24, 2020 307 Comments · by

Thursday’s Workwear Report: Kelsey Ponte Knit Trousers

The Personal Shopper (TPS) | ·

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Purple pants for fall? Yes, please. I find this eggplant color to be surprisingly versatile. I would wear these pants with a cozy ivory sweater for an at-home workday or with a gray or navy blazer for an in-office workday.

If purple isn’t your thing, they also come in black, navy, and “cadet blue.”

The pants are $98 full price but are on sale for $68.60, and they’re available in sizes 14W–24W. Kelsey Ponte Knit Trousers

These ponte pants from Vince Camuto (lucky sizes only, alas) are available in regular and petite; here’s another petite option from T Tahari for only $19.97 on sale.

Workwear sales of note for 12.7.23

Our favorites are in bold!

Workwear sales of note for 12.7.23

Our favorites are in bold!

Some of our latest posts here at Corporette…

And some of our latest threadjacks here at Corporette (reader questions and commentary) — see more here!

About Elizabeth

Elizabeth is a 30-something lawyer living on the East Coast. She spent seven years as a Biglaw associate in NYC, three years as a partner at a medium-sized firm, and is now in-house counsel for a large company. She loves Diet Coke, '90s sitcoms, and dresses with pockets.

Comments

  1. anon

    what are some of your favorite tops (shirts & sweaters) that look good on zoom?

    • anon

      I know you said shirts & sweaters, but I have to add in a plug for an h&m blazer (“straight cut blazer”) I just bought – no promo or anything, I just genuinely liked it. Normally don’t buy work things from there, but grabbed it in the burgundy. Shawl collar, 3/4 sleeves, relaxed fit. I do a lot of public facing recrutiment in my role (higher edu) and it’s been the perfect thing to throw over a tee to look polished. It’s comfortable, the shorter sleeves make managing cameras/mouse easy, the color looked nice on screen. Is it the best quality? Nope. But I was pleasantly surprised for the price – $35.

    • anne-on

      I stalk Donna Karan NY on saks off fifth – a lot of her things are washable, but really nice higher quality ponte/jersey.

    • Anon

      So far I like a medium neckline, round not vee, that’s not too high or low, in a shade flattering to me. For me, that’s darker jewel tones. The lighter colors don’t work as well. I don’t have specific brand recs, but your basic work shell. I have mixed the necklaces and have been wearing more of my major earrings.

      I have a lipstick and a travel size hairbrush in my desk drawer. Between those two that’s all I seem to need for zoom calls. YMMV because I do wear glasses, which helps. I also use the “touch up my appearance” option on zoom.

  2. Seeking advice

    Vent/advice needed: my boss is verbally and emotionally abusive. It’s very similar to an abusive intimate relationship in that there are always up and down cycles. It swings from getting praise heaped on me, lots of internal recognition, great bonuses, treated as a confidante, frequent discussions about my path and potential, to being treated like garbage. When his mood flips he gets very abrasive, gives truly unwarranted, mean and not constructive criticism, plays mind games, and the list goes on. After one of these cycles he’ll tell me I just need to trust him, I should know how he feels about me, and he’s only hard on me because he knows how much potential I have, and then the cycle repeats. I have a couple of trusted friends/colleagues that have verified I am not crazy or misinterpreting the situation, and this is indeed happening.

    This is becoming untenable and is wreaking havoc on my mental health. My only options to move away from this dynamic are outside of my organization. I’ve been with my firm for over 10 years and It’s going to be difficult to leave. My challenges are that I’m a SMP in a niche area and 1) I don’t want to move to another firm as the lifestyle and culture is not what I want long term (I’m a consultant), 2) I have limited options outside of consulting as companies generally don’t have in house positions for my subject matter and 3) I have fixed expenses that are tied to a level of compensation that may be difficult to replicate in a non-professional services environment (not biglaw level pay, but generous). I’m single with no current prospects and I assume I’ll need to financially fend for myself for the foreseeable future, and I can’t afford a drastic pay cut.

    I feel hopeless, demoralized, exasperated, scared for the future, paralyzed, stuck, and mostly just very sad. Any advice or experiences of getting yourself out of a similar situation would be very much appreciated right now.

    • Anonymous

      So right now you’re in a place of No. you’ve foreclosed all options, seemingly without trying. Stop trying to solve your entire life at once. What you need now is a) a healthy emergency fund in case you simply have to quit this job, and b) a new job. Both of those are things you can do. For a) take a realistic not anxiety driven look at your finances and see how many months of savings you have and what changes you can make. For b, start actually looking! You have real skills. Network. Talk to people. Get your resume out there. I have no idea what job you’ll find and neither do you! It doesn’t need to be The Perfect Job For the Rest of Your Life it just needs to be better than this one.

      • pugsnbourbon

        +1 to not needing the perfect job. You need to get out of there. If your next job isn’t a good fit you don’t need to stay there, either – but you need to get away from your boss, as soon as possible. I have seen a similar dynamic and it’s incredibly damaging.

      • Senior Attorney

        Yeah. And when I was feeling like I was in that place of No in my bad marriage, the thing that got me going was the thought that at some point HE might decide to leave ME, so I’d better have a plan. And one I had a plan it was a much shorter step to executing it, which of course was the best thing I ever did.

        So, OP, keep in mind that it might not always be up to you, and make a plan.

      • Anon

        Two people I know had a lot of success with setting a deadline. I think promising others and themselves that if they didn’t have another job lined up by X date, they would just quit, was tremendously helpful psychologically. Instead of feeling trapped, they knew they’d be getting out one way or another.

    • RW

      This is a horrible situation to be in, and I am so sorry you are going through it.
      Starting with idea of staying at current company…
      – how long has he been your boss? Is there a likelihood he will move onto a different role in the foreseeable future?
      – to manage day to day while you consider options… When i have had bosses like this I have found it helpful to map out general scenarios that caused me to go into anxiety mode. From there I focused on learning how to de-escalate. I would figure out phrases that seemed to work to end the tirades if they were live in person/on the phone… For me they would be things like… Got it, the pitch didn’t go well. I’ll do some analysis and come back to you with ideas. Some kind of validating, I hear you phrase often helped. If they were emails.. honestly i just skimmed to see if there was any action and I would just respond to the specific action question. I would actually delete the other items out in my email replay to keep it focused. I also would work really hard with these type of people to not overly react to the positive moments. Often times I would find myself being overly grateful and positive when they were positive. For me, that just made the ups and downs feel more chaotic. Some books to try that could provide some coaching (Boundaries by Henry Cloud – only caveat about this book is it’s very Christian… Never split the difference by Chriss Voss, pretty much any of Brene Brown’s books.. I liked Daring Greatly). Also youtube how to de-escalate. Their are different training/tip sharing videos.

      In terms of looking for other jobs… are you sure that none of the other firms could be a good match? Really think through what your requirements are and could they be met elsewhere. I don’t think it hurts to interview, apply, see what’s out there. One idea could be to set your linked in to open to new opportunities. Then it’s more of a passive job hunt and you see what you get approached with.
      Hope that helps. You aren’t alone.

    • Anonymous

      Sending lots of hugs- this is a tough situation.
      I’m an HR professional and sadly I’ve seen this before- dysfunctional manager who abuses staff, yet senior managers cannot or will not address the situation. You will need to get out of this situation eventually- your boss is not going to change and the chances of this improving over time are not good unfortunately.
      What I have seen as the best solution is to take a two-part approach. Part one is managing the situation while you’re in it. Do NOT engage or encourage your manager in these soul-sucking conversations; just nod your head and be like a ‘grey rock’. S/he will eventually tire of you as a target and move on. Do what you can to make the situation tolerable during the workday- take breaks, treat yourself to coffee or lunch, reach out to others, etc. It probably won’t help you to make any formal complaints; almost always the higher-ups are aware of these problem managers already and have decided not to act. You would only make the situation worse for yourself if you complain. You may want to talk with your doctor about possible mild depression too- meds might be helpful for a short time while you work through this nightmare. Part two is to get that job search going ASAP. Yes, we are in a pandemic but companies are hiring especially for the higher level types of jobs which it sounds like you’d be seeking. In some ways a job search now is a little easier for a candidate because everything is virtual. It may take a while- be patient and trust your skills and yourself. I have seen people get out of similar situations and it is totally do-able. Go for it!

      • Anon

        As someone in upper management I challenge this, no we don’t always “know” and depending on your company, we might actually care a lot and not accept that behavior. I wouldn’t write off talking to HR at all. It’s this “of course they know” attitude that keeps had people around. It’s also very hard to do something about problem bosses in the absence of a complaint.

        • Anon

          Your point is valid. And I will also say, as someone else in upper management, I appreciated the candor and reality of advising against going to HR. The advice to avoid HR is consistent with what I have seen over a long career in corporate (not law firm) environments. Good luck, OP.

        • anon

          Adding on, was in a similar situation with a partner at my firm. I was shocked when I did reach out to other partners when I started hitting my wits end as the other partners were aware that the offending partner was difficult to work with but were not aware of the full scope of his behavior. Case and point – I was told that the partners knew that the other partner was really demanding and intense to work with, I had no idea he would call people at 11pm on Saturday night (when unnecessary).

          While it may not be an option for you, I would suggest that you reach out to those in power that you have a relationship with and slowly start talking to them under the guise of “I could use your advice on managing this situation.” This will naturally lead to bringing the situation to light and those with more power than you may be able to help mitigate the situation. You have probably have more allies than you think.

        • OP

          He is a highly respected and very well liked senior partner. No one would ever believe this is going on because he is known to all be to a great supporter of people. However, it’s all very surface level. Unfortunately HR just isn’t an option here.

        • Anon

          I was at a very respective Fortune 50 company, went to HR on five separate occasions about verbal and psychological abuse (things like threatening physically vulnerable members of my family), and I was forced out the door.

          I wish I had mentally prepared for going to HR. They are not your friend; they will only fix your problem when not fixing it causes bigger, immediate messes for them. You go to them to document; you follow up in an email to document the conversation; you expect that they will make excuses.

      • Alex

        I wish I had this advice earlier. I was in a similar situation a couple years ago. I went to HR and it was not a good move. It made the situation worse than it already was and left me feeling more targeted than ever. But I got out, and so can OP – we’re rooting for you. This person doesn’t have to be in your life (making you miserable) forever. Please take care.

    • Betsy

      If this were a romantic relationship that you were trying to disentangle yourself from and move on to a healthier one, everyone would recommend therapy and I think it’s appropriate here, too! Right now you are in this place of not seeing any options out, and that isn’t going to change overnight. A therapist can help you work through the possibilities that you might be shutting down because they seem scary and impossible and help you see what your options actually are. I haven’t had a relationship with a boss that was quite as bad as this one, but I have gone to therapy to process some really tough work situations before and found it really helpful.

      • Anon

        Agreed -was in a work situation that made me question my judgment on what was normal / okay and also my own value as a professional, and therapy was hugely helpful in getting perspective and ability to detach emotionally from the situation.

        • CountC

          +1. I am so sorry you are experiencing this, OP. A toxic work environment made me doubt my entire career, but therapy helped a lot. It also was crucial to manage the distress that followed me to my new job.

      • Ellen

        I agree and cannot add much. The boss is a total doosh, but in this working environment, the best thing you can do today is to speak to a counselor, even a religous one, to help deal with this. I would simultaneously be looking outside for other opportunities, but in this pandemic, don’t go to far b/c this guy could in a huff fire you and you’ll have nothing. I agree with the OP that likens this to a personal relationship and the need to consider it similarly. Hugs as you deal with this mess. I do not envy you, but you will get thru it b/c you have the power of the HIVE behind you! YAY!!!

    • anon

      I would focus on getting a new consulting job with comparable pay, even one that doesn’t seem like a long-term fit in terms of lifestyle and hours. Your current job situation is so dysfunctional that it’s hard to see a positive long-term future. Short-term, you need a new job that gives you the mental space to think about what you want. Don’t take just any new job, because you don’t want to jump to another dysfunctional work place, but it doesn’t have to be “perfect.” From there, you can think about long-term goals, how your skills can be used, and whether to make changes to your fixed expenses.

      You compared your situation to an emotionally abusive intimate relationship. In that situation, your advice would probably be “just move out,” not to wait until there’s a perfect job and perfect house all lined up. Get out, and build from there.

    • Carmen Sandiego

      I am so sorry that you are going through this. I was in this exact situation until January of this year – the things you are saying describe my old boss to a tee. It was terrible, and the impact it had on my mental health cannot be overstated. I had been seeing a counselor for several months and she kept urging me to leave, but, like you, I had a list of reasons why I couldn’t go to another firm (I’m a lawyer), etc. and so I stayed months and months longer than I should have and the abuse just kept escalating. I finally snapped and looked for another job, and a lot of the reasons I told myself I could never leave ended up resolving themselves. (The reality was, I was really qualified, and I got multiple interviews and offers immediately once I started looking. I think sometimes working for a person like that you start to believe all of the bad things they tell you, and you think to yourself, oh I should just be grateful for this job – but that’s part of the manipulation – they make you believe that you have to put up with the abuse because you have no other options.) Eight months later, and I feel like a different person – I feel like the weight of the world has been lifted off of my shoulders, truly. All that to say, you need to start looking for a new job now, and take the best offer that you can get in a reasonable timeframe (that also doesn’t appear to be with a toxic person). The next job doesn’t have to be your forever job, but you are in a house that is on fire, and you need to get out stat and then once you’ve recovered you can regroup and figure out where to go from there.

    • Anon

      DBT skills are great, but my experience has been that therapy, support, etc. are too little, too late when the person treating you this way is your boss and you’re already worn down. My partner had a boss like this, and leaving was absolutely transformative for him and for our marriage. Once the boss was out of his life, he was no longer hopeless, demoralized, scared, paralyzed, or sad (though he was a bit gun shy for a while). He had so much more energy for job hunting and also just for life. It was hard for him to leave because of the psychological effects of the toxic relationship itself that made him feel helpless. But couples therapy, individual therapy, etc. were not what helped; leaving is what helped.

    • anon

      One last comment – if you are in Massachusetts, bullying is actionable.

      I too have been in this dynamic and it took many months post-job to “decompress” from the level of mental stress this type of work dynamic caused. Hugs. It is _HARD_ to deal with the emotional rollercoaster of this.

      Therapy is a band-aid. You need to get out.

    • Anonymous

      Also document these interactions (the highs and lows) contemporaneously in an email to yourself and if you can, one of your friends. It can both help you process the situation and also if you end of being terminated in one of his down cycles.

      Start making a plan to leave. There are options out there that you don’t know about. Do an honest assessment of your skill set including outside your area of expertise. Don’t close down the possibilities before you explore them.

      Get going. This is your life. Don’t spend it working for an abusive boss.

    • Anon

      In addition to all the other advice, work on those expenses. I’m not sure what they are, but if it’s something like housing costs, move somewhere cheaper. Get a roommate if you have to. If that’s what it takes to get out of this job, it’s going to be worth it.

    • Anon for this

      I do not want to make light of the situation, but you don’t happen to work in the White House, do you?

      • Anon

        The sad reality is that one reason the WH has the leadership it does is that this leadership style is common all over the country.

    • OP

      Thank you so very much for all of the kind comments and solid advice. Hearing others getting to the through this and to other side is exactly the kind of motivation I needed today. Therapy is a great idea and something that I could probably use for a few areas of my life. I do have a strong emergency fund in place if I need to pull the plug (or the plug gets pulled on me), so there is a safety net. I hadn’t really considered just getting out even if to another consulting role just to have room to breathe, but it’s great advice. Part of the problem with my job now is that it is so intense and I’m so frequently walking on eggshells/running myself into the ground that I rarely have time to properly reflect/plan/strategize about my career and I suppose if I were almost anywhere but here, that would not necessarily be the case.

      • Anon

        You can do it – and you will feel so so much better. I am the therapy recommending anon above and what I did not mention was that I eventually got the courage to leave that job. It was very hard to tell my boss but a few years later I am incredibly proud for recognizing my worth and standing up for myself. Plus I’m pretty happy at my new job.

    • Anon

      I had a boss like this. She was very abusive, hot and cold. Sometimes she’d heap lavish praise on me, other times she’d literally hide in her office, shut her door, and email me to not disturb her and cancel our meetings…which always happened when we had a deadline that needed her approval. I would try and try yet often felt like there was no pleasing her in those times, and no matter what I did, she would be upset with me. I dreaded work and would wake up and mentally catalog every party of my body to see if I had any physical ailment that might justify a sick day (I have a paranoia about blatantly lying about a sick day and jinxing myself). I was in that job for five years. Finally…I applied for a new job, got an interview, and a job offer. I realize I was fortunate to get offered a job after 1 application, but it was a large salary increase commensurate with my worth, I took it, and never looked back. After about 4 months in the new job, I woke up one day and realized I hadn’t taken any sick time…because I never felt the need to be “sick”.

      I share this because the only answer that I found way to leave. I was a director worried I wouldn’t find another job as good as that one…and I found a much better one. Please, please, please work with a friend to update your resume and start job hunting. That’s how I did it. I sat down with a friend one weekend for moral support and updated my resume and cover letter. It paid off! I wish you the very best. You deserve more. Bosses like this have issues that will not change. You can’t control them, or their toxic behavior, but you can control your own life and career trajectory.

    • ArenKay

      I agree with the consensus that you should just leave. I’m wondering if scheduling a session with a career coach would be helpful for you; they could help you think about job, career, industry possibilities that you might not be considering now because you’re so locked into this perspective. An objective set of eyes might help you identify promising paths. Good luck.

    • Anonymous

      1) Document everything contemporaneously. For example: Thursday 9/24 10am. I handed X report to Bob. He threw the papers back at my face and said “I said to print landscape not portrait you “F”-ing idiot”. Note if anyone else is present to witness. Be specific as possible and do not keep this on your work computer or in your desk.

      2) See a therapist today. You need help to cope now and objective expert corroboration that this is wreaking havoc on your mental health if you decide to take action in the future.

      3) Consider a leave of absence for mental health reasons

      4) After 1 & 2 are in place consider suing for emotional distress.

      You will get through this! You are a tough women to get this far. Internet strangers are routing for you.

  3. Anon

    For those of you with short makeup routines, what do you do?

    I’m team vain but very low maintenance but I’m looking to refresh my makeup look. For years and years all I did was BB Cream, liquid top lid eyeliner and mascara. I could do my makeup in under 2 minutes and it looked fine. I know the discussion on makeup trends was in favor of top lid liner but to be honest I think it ages me.

    This week I’m trying BB Cream, cream eyeshadow pencil, brow gel and mascara. I like the look but don’t love it.

    • Go for it

      I’m low maintenance too
      I use concealer on my upper lid and tiny dots underneath my lower lash line, BB cream in winter only
      brow pencil, mascara …and if I’m ambitious I use a light toned powder eyeshadow because it brightens and opens my eyes

    • Clementine

      My lowest energy version of this is BB cream, benefit rockateur blush (it’s kind of a rose gold and just instantly makes me look ‘refreshed’, mascara and chap stick.

      The slightly longer version of it is foundation, the beloved Rockateur blush, eyebrows filled in with Anastasia brow pencil and spoolie’d, undereye concealer, a taupe eyeshadow to the crease with a slightly darker eyeshadow in the crease (neutrals and they take 30 seconds max), and liquid top liner. It looks like a lot here but by using neutrals and things that can be fixed with blending, it takes maaaybe 4 minutes?

      • Anon

        Oh I think blush/bronzer is probably what I need!

        I have hooded eyes and oily eyelids so struggle what to do besides mascara for the eyes.

        Thanks for these suggestions!

        • anonymous

          Eyeshadow primer helps with my oily lids. Milani primer is a great drugstore option. I found the YouTube channel Risa Does Makeup to have lots of helpful tips for eye makeup for hooded eyes.

        • Anon+Probate+Atty

          Same eyes as mine. Like the other poster, I recommend eyeshadow primer. I love the one from Elf (can’t find at the drugstore anymore but you can order online) and it’s less than $5. I tried to do low maintenance simply eyeshadow primer, swipe of off-white shadow and eyeliner on top lid for years, but I’ve finally found if I actually want to look nice I need to put in more effort. So I bought some nice MAC brushes and an extra eyeshadow pallet for my car. While at stoplights, I apply the primer, off-white shadow all over, and liquid liner on top and bottom 1/2 of lower lid. Next, I add darker shadow in the crease and at outer edges of eye, then blend all with the off-white shadow. Then I do my brows with Elf brow pallet. It takes another 5-6 minutes but I do it all during the commute (and yes, I manage to keep one eye on the road!) or while parked in the lot just before entering the building. It works for me!

    • anne-on

      Team vain as well, but I’ve pared it down a lot over the years. After my skincare (moisturizers plus sunblock daily), I do blush (both on my cheeks and lightly over my eyes), eyeshadow (usually the caviar sticks by Laura Mercier), mascara, and setting powder. Sometimes I’ll do liner if my hair is pulled back – it gives my eyes that little extra ‘oomph’. I will wear foundation if I have a ‘big’ day or my face is extra blotchy but otherwise I just put concealer on spots and move on.

    • Vicky Austin

      BB cream + benefit goof proof brows + mascara, 99% of the time. I used to add lipstick because it balances my face out, but masks. I’ve never bothered to learn how to do my own eyeliner in a way that actually turns out flattering. I should mess with that.

    • Anonymous

      With the disclaimer that I have decent skin, my pre COVID routine was:

      Serum post shower
      Sunscreen plus moisturiser
      Pressed powder
      Lipstick
      Brow powder
      Blush

      The last two were key. I could skip powder but I would not skip blush and brows.

    • Anonymous

      95% of the time that I wear makeup, I just wear brow pencil and lipstick. Takes <5 minutes and makes a huge difference. Have you tried lipstick lately?

      • Anonymous

        What does brow pencil do for you? I can’t wear eye makeup due to allergies. But maybe brow pencil would wake up my eyes?

    • anon

      I do tinted moisturizer (over sunscreen) and a little bit of neutral colored lipstick takes 2 minutes/

    • Anon

      Skincare (currently cleansing, then toner, serum, and oil); then concealer, mascara, blush stick (somehow so much easier than alternative forms), and a lip crayon. Pre-covid, I did primer, foundation, concealer, mascara, liner, blush, and highlight. I’m back in the office now but working from home for a while really underscored how much time I was unnecessarily spending on my morning routine.

    • techgirl

      Working from home I wear concealer and brow gel daily, cream blush sometimes. If I’m going to site or office I’ll put on mascara.
      Sometimes I do a full face cause I fancy it.

    • Anonymous

      Brow gel, gel-pencil eyeliner, and a brighter-than-usual-for-me tinted lip balm. The last is key for me to look more alive on Zoom calls.

    • Anon

      I see a lot of recommendations for adding blush. I have a very quick makeup routine and I find that a sheer cream blush allows me to use blush without taking the time to be exacting and precise with it. My recommendation is Olio e Osso Balm in the color No 2 French Melon. Just smear some on and rub to blend, which takes quite literally about three seconds. I think that color would work to bring a little brightness to almost any color complexion, without being too bright. It also can be used on the lips for a little color but I am more fond of it as a blush than a lip color. I might recommend the color Spring to those with a dark complexion, and Tea Rose to those with a very dark complexion, or to anyone with a light complexion wanting more color.

    • anon

      My routine takes me about 3 minutes. It’s brown eyeliner, close to the lashes with a slight flair out (NYX in dark brown) + mascara (MaxFactor clump defy which I order online as its hard to find, great for building layers) + undereye concealer (covergirl lipstick kind) + blush (glossier cloudpaint) + some kind of lipstick I swipe on and then use my pinky finger to get into the right spots. Done! My makeup routine has been the same for about a decade

    • asdf

      I wear a light foundation (in my t zone), eye primer, eye liner, eye shadow, mascara and blush. It actually takes me about 2 minutes since I’ve been doing it for years. But… for zoom I think lipstick has the absolute biggest impact.

    • kk

      Also very vain, also very low maintenance.
      I like a BB cream or tinted moisturizer, brow pencil, mascara, and a cream stick for lips/cheeks- previously I used a clinique chubby stick, but have been liking the milk makeup version, in color ‘rally’ – it has a similar effect to glossier cloud paint but I like the stick delivery method better.
      Someone had asked about updating makeup to stay current- lately I’ve been skipping top lid liner, even though its been a longtime standard for me. I’ll add concealer if theres something to conceal, but it doesnt always make it on me and that’s been fine. I skip eyeshadow and powder for most days

    • Sloan Sabbith

      My absolute lowest (and therefore what I do almost any day I wear makeup, which isn’t often) is a swipe of a pinkish gold eyeshadow, mascara, and a MLBB lip stain. A step up from there is adding BB cream. I’m lazy AF.

    • Anon

      The best thing I use that is quick is an all over lid color. My lids are a bit pink and it makes my eyes look less tired when I use something nude colored on them. I currently use an eyeshadow primer to do this from Trish McEvoy (eye base essentials) but any liquid eyeshadow should work. I like the TM because it doesn’t crease.

      I also wear BB and I do my brows. I’ve been using a wider eyeshadow stick (mine is Bobbi Brown) at my lash line for a less harsh look than liquid eyeshadow.

      I also wear BB cream and to be honest I used to skip the blush, but I notice it makes a big difference on zoom. If you have a two shade thing, like NARS makes a duo bronzer/blush (Laguna and 0rgasm), it’s better because you get almost a contouring effect from the bronzer and then a little color from the blush on the apples of your cheeks. It really does help on video calls.

      • anne-on

        I really like the hourglass blush for this effect – it’s blush swirled with bronzer? luminzer? something that’s a nice pop of color but also adds a bit of highlighting.

    • ATL

      Tinted moisturizer, bronzer/blush combo on cheekbones/temples, brow powder, tight line upper lash line with brown eyeliner, a touch of highlighter on cheekbones, two different mascaras (one for volume, one for separation). Sounds like kind of a lot, takes minutes.

  4. Anon

    I’m just feeling very blah about thing (nothing crazy – just covid still sucks, I’ve gained weight, starting to question how much I like my job). For those who have been in similar boats – what can I do this weekend to add some pizzaz and “refresh” my life?

    • Anonymous

      Get outdoors! Take a walk or a hike in a place that’s new to you. Rent a kayak or SUP. Go sit in the park and read. Go camping. Have a fire in a backyard firepit.

    • Anon

      Go through your closet and purge.
      Paint your nails.
      Find a park and read a book outside.
      Go for a run along a new or scenic path.
      Make an interesting and complex recipe

    • Anon

      You need to do something that challenges you and takes concentration. Some of my go-tos are out right now due to the pandemic (indoor rock climbing), but how about archery, mountain biking, stand-up paddleboarding, or an epic day hike? The key is something challenging and physical that doesn’t involve screens. 100% of the time, I find that weekends where I plan to “just relax on the couch” leave me worse off than I was before.

    • Mal

      I enjoy gardening – you get outside, it’s physical, and you have something to show for your work when you’re done! I always feel better after. :)

    • Carmen Sandiego

      Maybe try something creative like painting, a craft, or even one of those adult coloring books? I have been trying (with questionable results) to learn painting and when something comes out well I feel some sort of accomplishment, which is a nice change from the days that just drag on forever and blend together.

    • Anonymous

      Rearrange the furniture in your house.
      Paint the room that you spend the most time in.

  5. Paper

    I need to get paper clutter under control! Any suggestions or websites much appreciated l. I’ve read Mari Kondo and really try to get stuff shredded or scanned but am just… bad at it as well as preventing it from happening again. I think I need a system but have no idea what will work for me. Willing to try stuff as it’s my new mini resolution before year end. Anyone who has this figured out, I’m all ears!

    • Go for it

      things they have worked for me

      1) a two drawer file cabinet a must for me
      2) basket on top of the cabinet that all papers go in
      3) weekly calendared the time to process

      I’m doing it steady for 6 months

    • Anonymous

      I simply keep next to no paper. All bills and banking and healthcare is electronic. All catalogues etc I review and throw away outside the house. Magazines I read and discard. Sentimental paper goes in a decorative box.

      • Senior Attorney

        Same here. Really the only paper you need is your passport (at least you did when it was accepted anywhere), your will, and trusts you are invoved with. Real estate deeds, maybe. Other than that, everything is electronic and/or fairly readily replaceable.

    • The original Scarlett

      I went paperless years ago; for personal stuff, I use Dropbox and gmail to organize and store things I need to keep (create PDFs or photos of documents). Same thing for work (but with company file management systems), and two screens so printing something is a rare occurrence. For notes, because I do like to “think in ink,” I use a moleskin notebook, and go through about one a quarter and that’s all my “paper.”

    • techgirl

      Less paper in the house, less to manage.

      Collate all your paper for a month, and then dedicate some time to looking into not receiving it in the first place.
      When paper comes in we either immediately recycle, or immediately put it in the appropriate folder in the filing cabinet.

    • Anon

      Maybe too late to respond, but here goes: I rent a P.O. box at a low volume post office close to my house. All mail comes there, and I stand at the bins and recycle anything that doesn’t require shredding or response. When I arrive home, I feed the “shred” pile directly into the shredder in my garage, so only the “response” pile enters the house.

  6. Camping, wet bags, rain, wet things

    What is a wet bag and do I need one?

    Camping is this weekend (#distancing). It is supposed to rain. Canoeing may occur. Things will probably get wet. My instinct is to hang a wet raincoat in my car on a hanger so that it can dry (and in tent if I had to (yes, prissy to bring hangers on camping trips; I suppose that a binder clip or carabiner would do in a pinch and maybe be more outdoorsy)). Is a dry bag for wet things that can stay wet until you get home (wet pants)? Not for a raincoat that you will still need?

    And can I just use a trash bag or gallon ziplocks since I haven’t got anything properly called a wet bag?

    At some point this year, I think I was scheduled for a backpacking trip, but we are so short-staffed at work I will probably not make it and it may be rescheduled anyway into late spring. On that, maybe wet bag matters more?

    REI was curbside only the last time I tried to go, so not sure that they do sidewalk counseling (more, just pay online for what you know you need and pick up outside of store).

    • Anon

      When canoeing, a dry bag is for things that need to stay dry in the event you capsize (electronics, prescription meds, etc.) When hiking/backpacking in the rain I have never brought a dry bag, but always used either a rain cover for my backpack or lined it with a trash bag, so that my clothes etc will stay dry.

    • cbackson

      I may not be getting exactly what you’re asking, but I’ll give it a shot:

      -For stuff that gets wet during the trip that you don’t need to reuse (like wet socks), any kind of plastic bag is fine. No special “wet bag” is necessary.

      -If something gets wet and you need to use it during the trip, any means of trying to dry it out is fine. If your car is there, just use a hanger and don’t worry about “outdoorsiness.” Nothing wrong with using a product literally designed to hang clothes for the purpose of hanging clothes. You can use it inside the tent too so long as there’s space/something to hang it on; if your tent ceiling is too low for that, then bring clothesline and some clothespins/binder clips (I’m assuming your tent has interior loops for tying up clothesline).

      I have done a ton of backpacking and camping and have never had any kind of special wet bag. Personally, gallon ziplocks are my favorite for managing dirty things while backpacking bc it’s so easy to press all the air out and compress stuff down small.

    • Anon

      I used wet bags when I rafted the Colorado River and they worked fine. Just get the best reviewed stuff. However, I would not bother if you are just going camping and it might rain. If there’s only a slim chance of any canoeing while carrying important items, don’t bother.

    • Ness

      I use a wet bag when I do kayaking/ rafting to put things I need to keep dry when I’m in the watter.
      I use dry bags/sacks when hiking to kep things as my change clothes dry. You can use for this any plastic bag, but I strongly recomend to separate your things in different plastic bags althoug you are using a backpack cover or a cape.

      https://www.gearassistant.com/best-dry-bags-hiking/

    • NY CPA

      I think a wet bag is for wet things to stay wet in until you get home. So like a wet bathing suit. Not something you plan on leaving to dry.
      What everyone else seems to be referring to in the other comments is a DRY bag, which is a waterproof bag that protects things that really can’t get wet if your canoe flipped or whatever (electronics, your wallet).

      • Anon

        Yes, I meant dry bag in my Colorado River comment above. OP said “wet bag” and it got stuck in my head, apparently. You don’t need a dry bag for a casual canoe jaunt from an established campsite. You’re not going to be taking your laptop or sleeping bag out there.

        • Anonymous

          What do you do with wet stuff at a campsite?

          Expecially if it is a rainy weekend? IDK re wet stuff in a tent is good, but you can’t hang it outside to dry, either.

          The SEUS is like that — every day it might rain, or storm, or just be very muddy b/c it has rained or stormed.

          • PNW - very familiar with rainy camping trips

            If you go camping in the rain, you and your stuff will get wet and it may not get dry again until it stops raining or you get home. Here’s what I do when preparing to camp in the rain: bring a raincoat and rain pants. Layer warm clothes underneath (wool base layers, puffy coat, beanie, etc). If it’s really wet, bring some sort of waterproof shoes (goretex hiking boots if you have them, or rain boots). Also bring wool socks- they will stay relatively warm even if they get wet. Bring a tarp and tie its corners around the tree trunks at your campsite so you have some dry space underneath (like if you have a picnic table at your campsite, put the tarp over the table). Your tent should have a rain fly so it will stay dry inside. If something has to stay dry, leave it in the car, the tent, or a waterproof pocket (watch out – some zippers are not waterproof — my partner’s phone died a tragic death in a wet jacket pocket on a long hike once). Bring a thermos so your warm beverages will stay warm. Bring some sort of lantern or headlamp. Bring whiskey – it warms your soul. If the rain gets really unpleasant, drive home early (after the whiskey wears off).

    • Anon

      You probably don’t need dry bags just for this, especially if you’re not likely to use them again. You really only need them for activities on the water, like a dedicated canoe or kayak trip. If you do end up doing some canoeing, just don’t bring all your stuff with you on the canoe.

    • Anonymous

      I use a dry bag in ordinary travel. I use it for dirty laundry that is sweaty, wet, stinky etc – anything that’s going straight in the washer at home, and that I don’t want mixed with my still clean clothes.

      In camping, I’d do the opposite – keep my clean socks and undies dry.

  7. BeenThatGuy

    I just purchased pants in a similar color from Kut from the Cloth and have been surprised how versatile they are. My favorite combos with them are a stripped shirt with a long beige cardigan. Or a chambray button down with a navy blazer. Or a mustard yellow sweater. Or a white tee-shirt with an olive green utility jacket. If you’re on the fence about buying something like this, hesitate no more!

    • Anonymous

      I have an eggplant colored pair of silk pants that was a random pandemic amazing sale price purchase and they have been an easy add to the rotation. Army green was the other surprise easy add, I don’t usually buy it because I don’t want to look like Melania in Africa but these don’t have safari details.

    • Anon

      I think that dress pants in this color as shown in the picture look dated, but that pants in this color in corduroy or denim look classic.

    • Sloan Sabbith

      This color is my favorite and I consider it a neutral. I’ve worn it with pretty much every color. It looks great with yellow, orange/coral, grey, royal blue, patterns, black, white, everything!

      The blog Putting Me Together has a post with 15 ways to wear burgundy pants.

      • Ellen

        I may get these pants b/c the manageing partner says I can stay in the office w/pants any day I do not have to go to court. Previously, it was only on Friday’s that we could wear pants, but now, b/c of the pandemic and its more causal clotheing, pants are now a reality, which is fine by me, b/c who needs for me to show my l’eggs off to people in the office like Frank and Madeline? FOOEY on that! It gets cold here in the winter, and I should only have to wear skirts when I have court cases @ Foley Square! YAY!!!

  8. Anonymous

    Just wanted to thank everyone who gave me advice on how to approach my doctor about mental health. It meant a lot. In the end the first question the PA asked was “are you depressed”, I filled out the checklist, and then my doctor asked me to tell her a bit how I was feeling and gave me an Rx for Wellbutrin. It was easy and I’m glad I did it.

    • Lexapro

      That sounds much more dignified than how I got on Lexapro, which was to walk into my PCP’s office and cry at the PA until she asked me if I had considered medication. But in all seriousness it changed my life and I would encourage anyone considering getting help to take the plunge.

    • anonymous

      That’s great! I’ve noticed the past couple of times when I’ve gone in for my yearly physical that depression screening is part of the standard questions. I’m glad they ask because I’ve been depressed and it’s hard for me to initiate the conversation. If they ask, it’s much easier for me to respond. Hope the medication helps!

    • Anon

      That’s so great! Here’s hoping Wellbutrin works as well for you as it has for me! (And if it isn’t the one for you, there are lots of other options!)

  9. Anonymous

    Talk to me about your age 75+ parents/aunts/uncles/older people in your life. Mainly – do they have hobbies, interests, or a social life (pre pandemic). Do they seem happy? Or is retirement more about sitting on the couch, tv all the time and hoping the kids call? Not saying that second scenario is bad but it’s bad if it makes them unhappy. And for those who have unhappy elders in retirement, do you try to change it, offer ideas etc or have you mostly backed off?

    • anonymous

      My father-in-law is in his 70s and very active. He lives out in the country and has horses and other animals. He’s also a pastor so most of his social life comes from people at his church. He seems happy. He’s not one of those people that I could see just sitting around all day.

      My husband’s parents divorced when the kids were very young and Dad got custody of the kids. My mother-in-law has a vastly different life. She’s been on SSI for years and mostly spends her days at home watching TV and smoking weed. I think she’s happy. I know my husband and his brother have some resentment towards her because she was largely absent during their childhood.

      With both parents, my husband and his siblings leave them to their own devices.

      My parents are in their 60s. My Dad retired years ago and has some health issues that require my mom or in-home health care. My mom still teaches and is doing to remotely for now. I’m happy that they have good neighbors and a group of friends that they used to meet with regularly pre-pandemic. I don’t worry about them being unhappy during retirement.

    • Mrs. Jones

      My parents are 75+ and seem happy, thankfully. They have hobbies, travel (pre-pandemic), and see friends (again, pre-pandemic).

    • Anonymous

      Dad is 80, zero interests and surfs the internet on his I pad ALL day. No friends either because he has never bothered and has zero empathy and zero consideration. Crazy to the point of obsession about exercise and walks 15-20km a day, I don’t know why….especially as he is now just skin and bones. Terrified he will fall and break something.

      Mum is 72, has a decent friends circle and the big issue is her health as she has arthritis. Used to travel to many countries with her friends pre COVID etc. Reads books and watches TV but no real interest apart from this. But she keeps busy.

    • Anon

      All of my older relatives have hobbies and an active social life (especially pre-COVID), but that’s also how they always were. Regular bike rides, bikes/nature walks, yoga/Zumba classes, etc are what they’ve been doing for 50+ years.

    • j

      My parents are in their late 60s but in the past year or so – starting pre-COVID but it’s gotten way worse during – their retirement has turned into exactly what you said – sitting, tv, hoping we call but then not having anything to say when I do, because all they do is sit and watch tv. I’m pretty worried about it but haven’t been sure if/how to approach it, especially during COVID, and well because I have the sort of family where we don’t really talk about things openly. But compared to my 10 years older in-laws, who have hobbies, interests, see friends, etc, my parents just seem… old. Has anyone tackled this with their parents successfully? I struggle with knowing whether it’s really my business.

    • Pep

      My parents are 80 and 78. My dad just retired two years ago! This pandemic is hitting them hard; they were very active prior: season tickets to the Orioles and the Ravens, theatre in DC, and travel. They still enjoy working in the yard and doing projects around the house.

      I worry for them when one of them eventually passes; they operate as a unit and not well as individuals, which I realized when my Dad, then Mom, were hospitalized a few years ago.

    • Anonymous

      Did you watch A Christmas Story?

      My Dad is 80. He reads a LOT and always has a house project (never cleaning! or purging!). Now: battling some animal trying to move into his shed. Is it a fox? A rodent? Intrigue! If I had a bunch of go-pros, I bet I could edit it to make a good reality show of Old Man vs Nature.

      OTOH, there are bears in his area (NJ, go figure), so he has that to contend with, too. They should hibernate soon. Then it is dear season, so he will switch to an all-orange wardrobe (hunters day drink). Dude used to work 80+ hour weeks and travel extensively.

    • anon

      My mom is 75, part of a big boistrous Catholic family (she’s one of 10+ siblings) — generally they are busy happy people as much as health allows. She is more of a introvert than some of her siblings, but she likes traveling and has traveled a lot domestically in the past number of years, mostly to visit her siblings and cousins. She’s very crafty and is always making quilts, ornaments, and doing other sewing projects and working on stuff for her house and fussing over the birds in her increasingly elaborate bird feeder station. She loves going to museums and botanical gardens and to state parks and such, but within the last year tore something in her knee and is a lot less mobile. It’s sad because she was very go-go-go but is slowing down a bit because of it.

    • Anonymous

      My mom is 85, and she has become less active over the past three years. I believe that she just doesn’t have as much energy any more, and has more aches and pains. She walks very slowly, mostly with a cane, so going anywhere is a bit of work, but it doesn’t seem to bother her.

      She doesn’t have hobbies really. She lives in an apartment complex for seniors 65+, and they have dinner together every night. She recently started going to the supermarket once a week in a van outing organized by the place she lives. There is also bible study, bingo, and things like that. She used to go out to eat at least twice a week, but that stopped during the pandemic. I believe she is going out to eat again this week. (Restaurants here have been open since May at 50%, transmission rates are steadily at 1% or less, and they go at off times when there will be few other diners. The senior home shepherds them & tells them to wear their masks, etc.) She reads books on her Kindle that I send her, and watches broadcast TV. She isn’t interested in Netflix or anything, she says she can’t stay awake. She has an Alexa with a screen, and watched all the seasons of Mom, but any other half hour sitcoms we’ve offered she hasn’t enjoyed.

      Since her life is narrow, she doesn’t have much to talk about and does tend to repeat stories. That’s also probably partly due to her age. She does enjoy going to the doctor! She isn’t happy or unhappy, but is sad about not being able to travel to see her grandchildren. I don’t try to change her, I figure she is 85 years old and can make her own decisions. If she needs something like sending her chocolate or wine, she lets me know.

    • LaurenB

      77 yo mother, lives by herself in a 1BR downtown high-rise along the lake (so a beautiful view). Used to take in-person senior learning classes at a university; those have migrated to Zoom so that occupies her two days a week. Does Zoom get-togethers/happy hours with friends. They will meet up once or twice a week for book club (outdoors in someone’s socially distanced backyard) or for a meal (again outdoors – no one is doing indoor restaurants). One thing she does to stay connected is text us (meaning her 2 daughters and her 3 grandchildren) “Inspiration of the Day” every morning where she will give us a funny saying, a pretty landscape, etc. and we hit “like” or “ha ha” back. She is also doing a paint-by-number project (bought pre-pandemic) and catching up on Netflix, Hulu, etc. She’s currently writing letters for the Dems and stays aware of what’s going on politically (I think a little too much — I’ve urged her not to keep the TV on all day as all it does it stir her up!) She recognizes that she’s got it pretty good so yeah, some loneliness but no major complaints. I think the key is coming up with a “thing” to do each day — as you get older, doing a “thing” seems to occupy more of the day than it does when you are younger.

    • Anon

      Consider whether those people were outgoing and active when they were younger. My mom spends ALL DAY online with Hallmark movies on in the background. She has no social life to speak of, though she has a couple (like 2?) friends she’ll talk to on the phone. She’ll putter around the house sometimes and organize this or that, but she has NO hobbies. Her world is really small. But she’s content and happy and that’s fine by me. When I was growing up, she didn’t have a social life either – I have no memory of her ever going out with friends, having people over, etc. Her main interest was keeping a nice house, which she did when she wasn’t working.

    • NY CPA

      I have 2 grandmothers still alive, both in their mid-to-late 80s. Grandma X is completely healthy, active, just stopped working a year or two ago, volunteers regularly at church, etc. On the other hand, Grandma Y has lots of health issues, and splits her days between reading, napping, and watching TV. It’s totally dependent on the person and how their health holds up. I wouldn’t say Grandma Y is unhappy, but I think she’s just tired and not afraid “to go” when her time comes. In the meantime, she enjoys visits and calls from her family. She also enjoys calls from her friends. I’ve made it a point to continue to visit her during the pandemic, because otherwise she’s almost totally isolated, which I think WOULD make her very depressed. Yes, it requires extra sacrifice and care on my part in terms of maintaining strict isolation before seeing her, but its well worth it to me.
      I will say, though, that in her mid-to-late 70s, Grandma Y was still going out and shopping at stores and traveling, and occasionally volunteering. It’s really the past few years that she has slowed way down and rarely leaves the house.

    • New+Here

      My dad is 66 and still works. He also goes clay shooting on the weekends, does a lot of yardwork, hangs out with my uncle, watches football, etc. He does love for me to call because I usually facetime with the baby (first grandkid; my parents are 6 hours away).

      My mom is 63 retired, but she is a former teacher so she substitutes, usually covering maternity leaves. She is depressed, but I don’t think retirement has anything to do with it; she’s had mental health problems for a long time. I think subbing is good for her to get her out of the house (though these days, I’m obviously worried about it).

      FIL is…75? 77? I can’t remember, somewhere around that. He’s been retired for a long time – over 12 years, because he was retired when I met my husband. He had a part-time job for a while, but quit that probably 4 years ago. He has no hobbies – doesn’t exercise, doesn’t read. He sits in his chair and watches TV or goes for drives. I think he’s happy, but who knows.

      My MIL is in her late 60s and retired 3 years ago. She spends her days reading or watching TV. She toyed with the idea of a part-time job, but COVID put a stop to that (nursing).

    • Sloan Sabbith

      My grandparents were very, very active until my grandma’s Alzheimer’s kicked in hard. They went to lunch and dinner with friends, went to indie movies, my grandma was in a book club (wine and dinner club), they traveled, Now, she sits and watches Downton Abbey and plays with my parents’ dog when they take him up there to entertain her. My grandpa is still relatively active, including quite a lot of time doing dangerous things with large power tools and climbing on his flat roof because he won’t let anyone else do it. He is 83. He also reads voraciously, has learned how to use an iPad, and still goes to lunch with his friends once a month when someone is with my grandma.

    • CountC

      My father is in this age group and he definitely has hobbies, and he and my mom are COVID allowing active. He brews his own beer and in the before times, had a group of fellow beer brewing engineers who he gathered with regularly to do taste testing and such. He also volunteers with local schools for STEM activities, such as robotics. He also still plays the piano recreationally.

      My mom, who is also retired but closer to 79, fosters/provides hospice care to various animals, volunteers at the local animal shelter, part-time teaches (not currently), and has dinner and such with her friends.

      Together, they go to dinner and wineries.

    • Anon

      My mom passed away at age 78 recently. She had COPD so she couldn’t do a lot of active hobbies. But toward the end, before she was basically bedridden, she kept herself busy with crossword puzzles, words with friends, Facebook, and TV. It sounds kind of sad, but she was happy.

      The number one thing was that she rented some rooms in her house to friends of her grandson, early 20s guys just looking for a cheap place to live. Their comings and goings kept her interested and occupied – I think she did all of their laundry and cooked for them pretty often – but they also helped her out with trips to the grocery store and rides to the doctor. It was a great stress lifter for my siblings and I that there were other people there to let us know if she was sick. (One of my siblings fell more on the “they’re taking advantage of her” side of the argument, but as long as mom was happy, I was happy.)

    • Duckles

      IME there seems to be kind of a cliff around 80– my grandparents who died in their 70s were still healthy and active; those that made it to mid-to-late 80s have serious health issues now, even if they were working and active into their mid-to-late 70s; and require a lot of assistance and cannot really do much at all.

    • Seventh+Sister

      My mom is a busy volunteer go-getter, decided to run for city council in her small town and won, does church stuff, craft stuff, basically all the things she didn’t do when she was working full-time. She kind of brings my dad along for it, though he’s more social/sociable than I give him credit for sometimes. That said, he’s the one that would probably happily sit there watching Fox News 23+ hours a day if he was all alone. On his own, he does what I think of as Old Man Classic Car stuff, and is a tiny bit Ron Swanson about home improvement. Both of them spent a lot of time visiting/helping my grandmother, who died last year at the age of 104.

      My in-laws…they are constantly “busy busy busy,” but don’t call or email very much because they have a lot of trouble with boundaries and don’t understand how to have a normal social interaction (e.g., a 20 minute phone call instead of a three-hour call in the middle of a workday). They teach at a sketchy online “university,” putter around the house and engage in bizarre home “improvement” projects. They have more health problems than they let on, and in the before times, I’d tell my kids to call 911 if something really did catch on fire at their house or Grandad fell off the roof, etc., because they are all about “doing it themselves” even when it’s dangerous. I wish they had friends or a social network, but they alienate people FAST and it’s just relatives that can stand them long-term. I think they’d have a better quality of life if they moved into a single-floor house or apartment, but they do not believe they are “old.” The only good news is that they are paranoid about getting COVID.

  10. Anon Struggling

    I would love your marriage advice. My marriage has been in a tough place for around 4 years. We just aren’t connecting romantically. We are amazing partners in raising our 2 little kids, we work like a great team, but I have not been attracted to him for a few years. I allowed for postpartum (twice!) some health issues of mine, the effects of birth control and the Zoloft I take for anxiety. I’ve researched and worried and nothing has changed. We’ve been talking all along about our trouble connecting emotionally and physically but while my husband feels bad I feel this way, he’s more likely to be content/complacent because he admits he has no idea what to do, and feels strapped for time and energy with little kids at the moment. He admits he has never thought my sxual satisfaction was his job to bring up when he saw it wasn’t working for me. I know that I have stopped “showing up” for sx because it has been years since I orgsmed. But I don’t want to blame him for that completely either. While I see his side, truly, I’m lonely, I’m empty, and I want him to be able to make some steps toward me too…but also not because I really have no interest in sx with him. This is terrible, isn’t it?

    Ugh I just don’t want to be in this unhappy position anymore and don’t know what to do.

    Any advice is welcome!

    • Anonymous

      Do you have any interest in sx at all? Do you masturbate to organs? Have you discussed this with your doctor as a problem that needs solving?

    • Anon

      Have you been to therapy for yourself? There’s a vagueness to your post (could be just because you’re posting online, could be real) that suggests maybe you don’t know why you feel this way and you don’t feel empowered to change it.

      If you two are “amazing” parents together, I’d urge you to put some time into introspection.

      And please consider a higher dose of antidepressant.

    • Anon

      Take it easy on yourself. It sounds like this is really upsetting you so I definitely recommend talking to your doctor or to a therapist, but I don’t recommend forcing yourself to have sex a certain number of times a week or anything like that. That’s not a respectful option for you at this time (or ever). If you find that your husband is not engaged in helping to find solutions or trying things that will work for you, you might have to consider whether or not you want to continue on this path, but one step at a time.

      • Ellen

        I agree. You have 2 kids together so you did have good s-x then, and there is no reason you can’t go back to great s-x, even if you have enough kids. I would attribute alot of this to the COVID, and once this is behind us, you will be in a position to have s-x again, even resulting in great o’rgasm’s. For now, you have to cope with the reality of COVID, which carries with it alot of negative baggage. In the meantime, explain this to your husband, who should be supportive. I wish you luck and hope you will return to normalcy in the bedroom soon!

    • Anonymous

      Dating again got our spark back. We do a ‘date night’ every Saturday night. We alternate between going out and staying in. Even with the pandemic this is possible. Even grandparents giving the kids dinner while you go out for dinner, or a Saturday afternoon playdate at a friend’s house etc. If we stay in we do something like watch a movie with fancy cocktails or play a strip version of some boardgame.

    • Anonie

      I would make an immediate appointment with your primary care physician to discuss your medication and then schedule individual counseling, couples counseling, or both. Your antidepressant may very well be tanking your drive for “gardening.” Sometimes switching antidepressants can help.

    • anon

      Both of you need to read “come as you are”.

      Have you talked to your anti depressant doctor? Because I could not finish while gardening to save my life on anti depressants, even with extra assistance. I understand that a lot of people have much better luck adding wellbutrin to their anti depressant to get some help in that regard.

      Personally speaking, I also found everything much better after my husband got a v and I got off hormonal birth control.

      • Betsy

        +1 for Come As You Are by Emily Nagoski, and +1 million for both of you reading it.

      • Mal

        I highly, highly recommend that book (for everyone!). It really enlightened me about the true nature of desire for both men and women – we have a lot of myths and misconceptions around it.

    • Anony

      This is so important. But if nothing is working … Can you give yourself a break from worrying about this? Maybe you can tackle it with fresh eyes or see your husband anew after you get away from it for a bit. Probably it’s not a great time for a solo trip, but you could get involved with a solo hobby, escape for a bath every evening, rewatch all your favorite chick flicks, or something. For loneliness, contact your friends, get a massage, snuggle a pet or a pillow.

      Can you convince your husband to care about this through couples counseling or asking him to date you (and perhaps start over with physical affection to build from handholding to sx)? Do you even want to be with him that way … that might be the question you need to resolve for yourself first (individual therapy?)

    • Anon

      I think we need a paradigm shift in these conversations. We change and have different needs over the course of our lives and unless it’s causing significant distress to the individual (which, in this case, it may be), I think we need to stop treating “not wanting to have sex with husband” as an emergent problem that needs fixing. Yes, it can become an issue and it’s perfectly all right to want to “fix” it, but in a lot of the cases that women have posted here (this is certainly not the first post), I’m not seeing a lot of self-empathy or empathy from the husbands about real challenges, like menopause, depression, pelvic pain from childbirth, major life stress, and so on. In my view, it’s okay for sex to wax and wane as long as intimacy remains – hugging, touching, caring, however that looks for you. I do not believe that your partner should prioritize sex over your mental or physical health, or that you should prioritize your partner’s sex drive over your own feelings/need for space/whatever it may be. The path is going to look different for everyone, but I feel bad reading these posts where women seem to be really hard on themselves for something that I view as very natural.

      • Anon

        +1
        Honestly I’m pretty sexually attracted to my husband so I don’t have OP’s problem exactly, but there are times when I don’t feel sexual, period. It’s not about my husband and it doesn’t mean something is wrong with me. It’s natural. In my case (20 years married) it will eventually come roaring back.

        If I had a partner who made me feel like something was wrong with me for this, it wouldn’t feel much like a partnership.

        I’m also offended on your behalf, OP, that your partner thought your sexual pleasure had nothing to do with him. Why would anyone feel entitled to sex with someone when they don’t give a crap about their partner’s experience?

    • Anon

      Unpopular opinion, but sometimes you just gotta do “it” – sometimes therapy and all that adds so.much.pressure and makes something seasonal a big problem. It doesn’t have to be mind blowing.

      • Anon

        Incorrect and cruel opinion.

        I’m not going to speak for women who normally climax and are okay with it being blah, because blah is not the norm. However, as someone who has never climaxed but has had a child, blah sex MAKES THE PROBLEM WORSE. It kills your desire.

        Consider this: if you and your husband normally have healthy, delicious, and satisfying dinners, you don’t mind if you do Burger King or a frozen meal once in a while. Now imagine that every meal your husband gets is delicious and satisfying, but every meal you get is a day-old hamburger. Now picture someone telling you that the solution is to not mind the day-old hamburger and just have the meal, because not every meal has to be great.

        Your advice is terrible and needs to not ever be given to women having trouble climaxing, ever again.

        • Anon

          +1. We need to stop normalizing female discomfort and lack of enjoyment during sex. Having bad sex you don’t want to have is NOT a solution.

          • Anon

            But for some people, once they start having it, their desire comes back. I’m one of those people. It will take me awhile to get into it but I eventually do and then I start wanting it more.

            Also, OP, I’d first see if you can reach your peak on your own. If you can’t, then it is more a biological problem than a relationship problem.

          • Anon

            I don’t think anyone is telling her to have painful or miserable sex. I think sometimes you need to have just ok sex to get back in the groove. I can’t speak for other women, but I don’t really miss sex when I’m not having it. Once I start having it regularly, I start wanting it more. And the sex itself may not even be lackluster – you may not be in the mood, but if you “just do it” you may find out that it ends up being pretty good/satisfying, if not exactly mind blowing. I think that’s what the poster meant, not that women should make themselves miserable for their partners.

          • Anon

            You’re all projecting. When the sex sucks, having it makes it less desirable.

          • Anon

            I think you’re the one projecting. She didn’t say the sex itself sucks. She said she isn’t feeling attracted to him. I love my husband and think he’s very handsome but I’ve definitely gone through periods where I wasn’t really ever in the mood or feeling attracted. Having sex regularly (meaning at regular intervals, not doing it all the time) even when you don’t feel like it can help get out of that rut. If it doesn’t work, it doesn’t work, but I think there’s a good chance it would help. I wouldn’t suggest someone push through pain or subject themselves to something that is upsetting or awful, but if it’s just that sex feels like a chore, well, sometimes you have to do chores. Not the most romantic analogy for sure, but most women I know who’ve been married a while feel that sex can occasionally be something you do less out of your own desire and more out of a need to keep the marriage healthy or make you spouse happy. Of course if you never desire it that’s a problem, which is why people are saying “just do it and see if you start desiring it” not “just do it to keep him happy.” If nothing changes with her desire, then certainly it’s an issue that shouldn’t be ignored.

          • Anon

            I’m someone who has posted on this issue before and got the “just do it” advice. I tried that, and it didn’t work for me or help at all. It didn’t rekindle anything. So maybe it works for some, but for me, it did not.

      • Jess

        Based on what I’ve read, that’s true when the “it” is kissing. Going on dates and making out afterward with their SO with no expectation of s-x has been transformative for a lot of women. Even if it never results in intercourse, there’s more connection and desire.

    • Anon

      Zoloft and birth control would be 100% of the issue for me. I would have to switch to a different med (e.g. bupropion) and non-hormonal BC.

      • Anon

        Or have your husband get snipped. If you want to take on BC, that’s a fine decision, but I’m of the belief that after having a couple of kids and carrying the mental and physical load of BC for years, women are more than entitled to tell their husbands to step up.

  11. Anon

    When you go get your teeth cleaned, does your dental hygienist have the type of MEDICAL (NOT dental) insurance you have up in their EMR and easily accessible?

    • Digby

      Generally, no. The dental office will only have the insurance info you provide to them, and generally they only ask for your dental insurance info. There are a very few dental procedures that are covered by medical insurance, and if you need one of those, your dentist would need your medical insurance info. But generally, they don’t need your medical insurance info, and it seems like there would be very little value to them storing that info for you.

    • Anon

      Mine has both because when I had my wisdom teeth out certain things like anesthesia were charged to medical while other portions of the procedure were dental.

    • Clementine

      Was this by chance in a dental office associated with a large hospital system, Federally Qualified Health Center, or other comprehensive clinic type setting?

      (If so, there’s a whole reason and rationale for this.)

    • Anon

      As far as I know, this is an independent dental practice. My dentist retired and sold the practice to a young woman who has, of course, gone paperless.

      I had to go on Medicaid (but no other assistance) for a time due to falling ill and having a semi-long term complication, and during that time, I got a lot of comments like, “you must have a lot of free time on your hands”…or “what are you doing this summer…I have to work, work, work”…or “that’s a nice x. where did you buy that”. I only got my teeth cleaned and I paid in full with my debit card.

        • Seventh Sister

          If it was the dentist that said that, find another dentist. If it was a staff member, tell the dentist. Everybody needs help sometimes.

      • Anon

        I would not at all make the connection from that to them knowing your insurance status if you have not given them that information.

        • Anon

          I don’t know; these sound like pretty typical “I know you have Medicaid and take issue with that” comments from a HCW to me.

          • Anon

            How can I know for sure…It is so hard nowadays to keep your personal business personal.

            Someday, I may tell them what my issue was, but that would def be TMI and something they don’t want to hear. But it looks like I may have to.

  12. TheElms

    I have the Johnny Was masks but without a nose piece the top edge of the fabric rides up into my eyes. I like how breathable they are and they otherwise fit well (maybe a smidge big). I keep getting ads for the Proper Cloth masks. Has anyone tried them?

    • Ellen

      I bought 5 Johnny Was masks for $25 and they are very good, but yes, the hot air goes up and foggs up my glasses. There is no metal thing that is suposed to be fitted over your nose. I have gotten complements on them so I recommend them highly.

    • Pink

      The JW masks do this for me too and it dries out my eyes. I prefer my Emilia George masks with the nose wire for this reason (but you do have to tie the sides just FYI).

  13. Anon

    I just started wearing capri leggings for the first time and I am wondering if they are supposed to be uncomfortably tight/binding below the knee? They fit otherwise. Any way to loosen that up?

    • Anon

      Are you tall? I have that problem because sometimes legs taper in too early for me. I size up or buy another brand.

    • kk

      Are they capri length- do they stop above your calf muscle? I much prefer cropped and 7/8 length that come below my calf muscle, even almost to my ankle.

    • AnonATL

      Capri leggings for running, I push them up to basically just below my knee. There’s this sweet spot where they aren’t too bunched up and don’t pinch, but it takes some experimenting. I find it more comfortable that way on thicker calves.
      Otherwise, I’m a big fan of the 7/8 length like a pp said, but they can be too hot down here for a good portion of the year.

    • Anon

      Are they actually binding, or is it just a weird sensation? I go through this every year when it gets cold and I go from bike shorts to knickers. The first few rides are just WEIRD with something touching my calf, but after that it’s fine. It would be a different story if there was rubbing, chafing or cutting-in.

  14. Highly irregular

    I just turned 50. Previously I had extremely regular periods but the last 4 months have been very irregular. At first I thought it was stress – my job has gotten a lot more complicated with COVID. I had my hormone levels checked and my doctor confirmed it’s perimenopause. For those of you who have been through this, how long did the irregular periods last? How did you cope? I don’t have hot flashes but I feel like a teenager again with the mood swings. Again, I thought it was in response to all the stress but my doc says it’s probably part of the perimenopause package.

    • Anonymous

      IDK but I am back on the pill b/c I had a period start that never really ended :(

    • anon for this

      Buckle up, it can be a long ride. I had a long stretch of perimenopause that lasted from my late 40s until I finally had my dr up my HRT to make the irregular periods stop earlier this year. And I’ll be 60 in a couple months. I had my periods stop for stretches up to 11 months 3 or 4 times, only to resume like clockwork for several months. Early on, I had a stretch of hot flashes that I resorted to HRT to tame, stopped having hot flashes for a couple years and then they returned with a vengeance and I returned to HRT. My philosophy on the HRT is that I need my sleep to cope and I need to live my life now. Mood swings haven’t been that bad, but they had never been that much of an issue for me. Without a doubt, dryness has been my worst symptom even with HRT and attempts at other treatments; libido is a thing of the past and I grieve these changes daily. Very fortunate to have a sympathetic spouse, but I know it’s difficult for him too. I never thought I’d be that partner who shuts down the intimacy, but here I am. :(

    • Anon

      I had unpredictable and very heavy periods for about a year — at age 52-53 — before I got the help I needed. The diagnosis was fibroids, and I got a hysterectomy. That surgery gave me my life back. Before that I had such heavy flow that I couldn’t attend client meetings without anxiety that I might bleed through the tampon and my clothes.
      Just mentioning this as something to be watchful about. Unpredictable and heavy bleeding may be a sign of fibroids.
      Hang in there!

      • Anonymous

        My mom could have written this. She had no energy b/c of anemia b/c she was bleeding so much from fibroids. She also looked slightly pregnant.

    • Anon

      I’m 55. My periods got very short and close together in my late 40s, then I started skipping periods occasionally, then I went allllllmost a year without one, they started again for a couple of months, then quit for good around age 52.

      I have been having hot flashes since mid 40s. They were at their worst when my periods started getting irregular, but I still get a flash now and then. It’s a unique feeling – you can’t mistake it for anything else. I got some good advice once when I was in a bra shop and got a hot flash. I tried to keep going but the owner told me to sit down and ride it out. Don’t try to power through. Just stop and give yourself a chance to breathe and relax and it will stop sooner. It totally works for me.

      I never had night sweats, fortunately. Those sound awful. I do toss the covers off, then on, then off again pretty frequently, but never wake up in the pool of sweat I’ve read about.

  15. Anon

    Does anyone have a tunic (or just longer length) long or 3/4 sleeve t shirt they like?

  16. no

    Easiest meal planning website? Dealing with a sick parent and just don’t have the brain capacity for making decisions right now. There are too many adults in the house for blue apron, and we’ve already been surviving on takeout for too long. I just need someone to tell me what to buy and make it.

    • Anon

      Budget Bytes is what you need. The recipes are very easy, cheap, and rely on pantry staples in many cases.

    • anon

      I haven’t tried it, but eMeals seems to have what you’re looking for. You tell them how many people are in your family and generally what you want. There are categories for specific diets and dietary preferences and for 30 minutes, budget friendly, kid friendly. They send you a meal plan, or you can browse and swap things in and out. Once you have a plan, the app generates a grocery list, which apparently integrates with several grocery delivery services.

    • Anonymous

      PlateJoy
      It is an app that is very customizable and makes a meal plan plus a shopping list and has an algorithm designed to limit food waste. It can take into account preferences/restrictions and will even consider what you already have in the house. It isn’t free but it is worth it.

    • anon

      You may not have this in you right now, but back in August, my husband and I sat down and came up with about 20 meals that are quick to make and that our family enjoys. Then we made sure we had ingredients listed, even if we don’t use a “recipe” to make that thing. We use an app (Paprika) to store them, but you could use a simple google doc or even index cards. When we meal plan for the week, we go specifically to that limited set of recipes and choose based on what we’re in the mood for and what we have on hand, then throw together the grocery list (easy in the app). It takes about 10 minutes to meal plan and make our grocery list each weekend, and that includes checking the refrigerator and freezer for staples. Over the past couple of months, we’ve added meals when we remember them or try them out on a weekend, so we’re up to 31.

      DH and I used to use Blue Apron, and I’ve tried meal planning apps, but our son is picky about weird things, so they don’t work for us right now.

      • Anon

        I really like the paprika app – learned about it here.

        When I am really being good, I do the meal planning by adding things to the calendar and those recipes to my “basket” so I can use that as a grocery list.

        When I’m not being as organized, I still find it helpful because it’s a repository of all the recipes I come across online that I think look interesting.

        This all sounds like it may be a bit much for you, OP, given your difficult circumstances right now. I suggest sitting down for a moment once or twice a week and planning only the next 2-4 meals, and adding needed items to an online grocery cart (and yes, you should be getting grocery delivery!). On the day of grocery delivery, do yourself a favor and buy a rotisserie chicken and a couple of side salads – you can’t go wrong with potato salad and cole slaw in my house, KFC does that sh1t for a reason – and don’t cook dinner that night.

        My kids also love grocery store sushi. I don’t. I don’t really enjoy it that cold. But it makes them really happy if there are a few containers of grocery store nigiri, California roll, and edamame in the fridge. It’s not your cheapest grocery store option, but it’s cheaper than delivery.

    • RW

      I like “healthy meal plans”. Discovered based on me following Domestic Geek on youtube.

    • Anon

      Just a tip, I have a rotation of meals that get customized. Something like:

      Monday – homemade pizza
      Tuesday – tacos
      Wednesday – pasta
      Thursday – stir fry
      Friday – takeout
      Saturday – casserole
      Sunday – soup

      Just having a template for each night has taken a lot of the mental work out of the equation, but I can customize based on what is seasonal and what I am in the mood for.

      • anon

        I used to use a template like this to meal plan for the entire month. I definitely planned for repeat meals, plus meals where I used the same basic format with different proteins or different flavor profiles, so I didn’t have to come up with 30 different meals. It did take some time, maybe 45 minutes, but only once a month.

        Every month, I would plan a few meals that froze well, so I could cook a large amount and put at least half in the freezer. Every week included one night for pulling out a freezer meal, one night for leftovers, and one “free” night to allow us to shift stuff around for spontaneous social events (back in the day), occasional takeout, or weekend “project” cooking.

        We were on a tight budget at the time, so I would go to Costco and buy meat and pantry items for the month, plus whatever produce would keep for a week or two. Then I’d supplement with weekly trips to the grocery for milk, fresh produce, replacing everyday items, etc. Overall, it saved time, and we saved a bunch of money by repeating/using up ingredients, bulk shopping, and eating freezer meals instead of takeout when we were busy or tired. I was also doing Weight Watchers back then, and it helped that there was always a plan for a healthy meal.

      • Clementine

        Yeah, I have a theme for each night which makes it so much easier.

        Monday – Italian – pasta dishes, pesto chicken, meatballs are all big hits
        Tuesday – Mexican – tacos, many variations on taco salads or burrito bowls
        Wednesday – ‘Whatever’ Wednesday. This rotates – sometimes it’s leftovers or grilled cheese, other times I’ll do a tofu stir fry. This lets me fit in whatever meals we’re in the mood for.
        Thursday – Breakfast for dinner (Most popular meal in my house)
        Friday – Boxed Mac and Cheese or Pizza or Takeout (Easy easy easy)
        Saturday is another swing day.
        Sunday – Sunday Supper – Often a roast chicken or other dish which gives me leftovers to use for the rest of the week.

      • Anon

        Our only weekly must-do’s are taco Tuesday and pizza Friday. Pizza is most often delivered or bought half baked at a couple of local places. But sometimes if I’m feeling very domestic we make it from scratch.

        Weekends are a great time for hamburgers or hot dogs. I don’t think we’re ever going to make it into Bon Appetit but some hamburgers and frozen tater tots bring all the boys to the yard and they’re like, are there any more hamburgers?

    • Anonymous

      Ask each adult to identify 1-2 meals they can cook. Assign 1-2 nights to cook per week. Have take out on one or two days. DH and I trade off – we each cook 3 nights a week, take out on the other night. We each get one ‘easy’ meal like chicken strips/fries/salad or pasta and jar of sauce and we cook proper meals the other two times.

  17. Ribena

    I have a tub of sour cream in the fridge that needs using – does anyone have any particularly good cake recipes that use it? I have all the normal baking ingredients in stock (although not huge amounts of any one type of butter, but that’s fine)

      • Aunt Jamesina

        Yes! The chocolate chip sour cream coffee cake is so good.

        I also use sour cream as a sub for yogurt and buttermilk (if I’m using sour cream instead of buttermilk, I thin it with a bit of water) in a number of dessert recipes.

    • NY CPA

      Take a look at Preppy Kitchen. That guy ALWAYS puts sour cream in his baked goods.

    • Anon

      Smitten Kitchen chocolate stout cake! I never bother with a frosting, though I’m sure it’s good, and any stout or porter I’ve tried is good in it.

    • Anon

      Smitten Kitchen’s blueberry muffins have sour cream (or yogurt in them) and they’re great.

      • Vicky Austin

        My favorite muffin recipe has fresh berries (any kind you like), half flour and half cornmeal, and a half cup of sour cream. They are delicious with a bit of butter.

    • Anon

      Sour cream enchiladas. Many, many recipes online. A Tex mex classic. My family INHALED the entire casserole.

  18. Wondering about others...

    If you’re divorced, how do you feel about getting married again? Why?

    • Anon

      This is pretty broad, but I’m divorced and re-married. I didn’t know if I would re-marry, but I met my husband and we fell in love and decided we wanted to marry and potentially have a child (I already have one elementary-school kid). Every marriage is a gamble (1st, 2nd, 3rd), but I feel a lot of confidence in how we both approach our relationship and our commitment to each other and our family. I actually mentioned this in the thread yesterday, but my divorce was very amicable. My first husband was a good husband too, and I knew I liked being married. That probably made it less scary for me to jump back into matrimony. Dating as a chubby, single mother in her mid-30s on the otherhand was daunting at first, but wasn’t too bad. I met lots of nice people. I actually met my husband in a professional setting before we matched on a dating app.

    • Anonymous

      I’ve been divorced 10 years. At first I did not think I wanted to get married again. I had a 7-year relationship afterwards and we were both in agreement that we didn’t want to live together or get married but there was a 21 year age different between us that might have contributed to that. My divorce was amicable and that 7-year relationship ended when I moved for a job (at his encouragement because he knew it would be good professionally and personally for me). I have currently been dating someone for 11 months who I really click with and that has significantly changed my mind.

    • Explorette

      I’m 15 years divorced now and in a serious relationship for the last 4. I have no desire to get married again, because I see no reason to. Not going to have kids. We have our estate planning done so we have the same protections a married couple has. We own property together, are each other’s beneficiaries, etc. Other than being able to call him my husband instead of my boyfriend (which feels weird at a certain age and sounds more casual than we are), I see no upside to getting married. But, lots of downside if we had to divorce.

    • anon

      I was extremely commitmentphobic for years following my divorce and to be honest the only reason I’m remarrying is because we have recently had a child. And yes, I get that it is highly illogical to be willing to make the massive commitment that is having a child with someone and yet to be nervous and uncomfortable about marrying them. That’s how I know the discomfort is baggage from my divorce rather than a signal about my partner…

    • Divorce is a wonderful institution

      I remarried and I have no regrets, so far at least. I got lucky in finding a good (better) partner, though I suppose anything could happen and that’s just life — we don’t have as much control as we would like. But there’s not a one-size-fits-all solution, and if you don’t want to get married again, you don’t have to. Or if you want to, you can. And if you change your mind, you can change your circumstances accordingly. Hopefully going through a divorce gives you some greater sense of resilience and confidence in your ability to adapt to unplanned circumstances.

  19. Anonymous

    Anyone live life with a husband who has medical anxiety? Now to be 100% fair he DOES have a real medical issue so it’s not like this is coming out of no where, but he sees drs and is on top of his health and even they have told him, you’re in good shape, just live your life. But he’s the type of guy — and even more so as we get into our 40s — who’ll be like, well they tested for x, y, z but what if it’s ABC, what if it’s a false negative, google said etc. Then he will go over this in his mind over and over and over until he can get in with a dr. (which these days is slow) and they can say ABC isn’t an issue for you because of this reason. Rinse and repeat. It’s getting to the point where he’s hurting his own health by doing this – mentally and physically because when he’s this worked up mentally then he falls into not wanting to eat, not working out/saying he can’t work out etc. and thus ends up losing weight/strength.

    He thinks about these things non stop – not just his own health issue but random other issues that COULD happen, wants to talk about it daily, if I don’t talk about it then he just sits and sulks; talking (fighting?) about it with me does make it feel better as if that’s his “therapy.” And now the latest thing is talking to like EVERY family member about it? Oh my cousin whose an anesthesiologist in Asia who he hardly knows, sure let’s call him to discuss; my other cousin who is a shrink in South Carolina, yep we need her two cents. Is there any way to break out of this short of therapy/anxiety meds? What do you recommend for the spouse who is EXHAUSTED (because when he feels like this he can’t do anything around the house so I am doing ALL the cooking, cleaning, shopping, and also working).

    • Anonymous

      Obviously not. He is suffering from anxiety and needs treatment and medication. You need boundaries about what you are willing to listen to, need to tell him you expect him to get the treatment he needs because you cannot continue doing everything for the family, and start thinking about how to leave.

    • Anon

      Therapy sounds indicated for sure!

      I’m finding it hard to imagine what he’s thinking without knowing what the medical issue is. What bad thing does he think will happen if he does some chores?

      Is there possibly something wrong that’s being missed (false negatives are quite common with some conditions and quite rare with others, and doctors don’t always know anything about the sensitivity of their tests)? I’m wondering if something could be compounding the anxiety and hypochondria, or if it’s really just hypochondria and obsession. Does data help reassure (e.g., taking blood pressure, blood glucose, HR, oximeter, etc.), or just provide more to obsess over?

      • Anonymous

        It’s a blood pressure issue but he’s had a ton of underlying testing before they concluded — this is just how your blood pressure is — i.e. testing to rule out underlying causes that need to be fixed. And with that testing drs. have said, you will have issues once in a while but go live your life, we’ll see you back here once a year routinely. The BP monitor at home — it’s another thing to obsess over since he’s such a data guy. When he got like this 2 yrs ago his cardiologist (who is a well respected, experienced university cardiologist so I trust him) explicitly had to tell him, do not take your BP 3 times a day because you’ll drive yourself crazy with variance that naturally happens all day long for everyone. He is also one of those people who MUST hear from an MD or nurse to believe it. Like all of us — me, his mom and dad have been after him to get some exercise, nothing strenuous just some walks because it seems to us like a lot of the aches and pains are from prolonged sitting. He acted like we all don’t know. A just out of school nurse says it and suddenly it makes sense. I am not saying that in disrespect to nurses – who are amazing whether young or old – I am just thinking, dude you happened not to marry and dr or nurse so IDK what to tell you, you can’t have a professional opinion at ALL times re doing leg stretches or whatever.

        • Anon

          Thanks for this context. I feel like this is a common tendency for certain men to have (the data making things worse especially), but it sounds like he has it to an extreme degree!

          Some anxiety meds help with blood pressure; is that a possible approach to getting him connected with support? I also don’t know if the world has changed such that you can’t call up his cardiologist and express these concerns, but that’s what my mom did in the 80s to ensure my dad’s doctor knew about his sleep apnea symptoms, which he never would have reported himself.

    • Anony

      Some ideas:
      I think you’re right that this requires therapy/meds.

      Since he’s comfortable with his doctor, tell (or encourage him to tell his doctor) this has become a problem & is interfering with daily life.

      Let him know you won’t be having these conversations with him anymore as it is not helping/escalating the situation/hurting you. Tell him you’re exhausted and ask him if he can pick up some of the chores … or find a way to manage his anxiety so he can get to a place where he can. If he says talking helps … agree that he should go to therapy :). And perhaps point out that it helps him but hurts you/you as a couple/is keeping you from accomplishing other things including basic needs.

      Let him sulk. Try using “grey rock” techniques to refuse to engage in the fighting. If you take the reward out of these conversations maybe they’ll stop & he’ll have to find another way to manage his emotions. Don’t give him your cousin’s number.

    • Airplane.

      “Is there any way to break out of this short of therapy/anxiety meds”

      No, address it with therapy and meds. That is what they are for.

      “What do you recommend for the spouse who is EXHAUSTED (because when he feels like this he can’t do anything around the house so I am doing ALL the cooking, cleaning, shopping, and also working).”

      I recommend you STOP doing this for him. You’re his wife not his therapist and NOT a never-ending well for him to pour his anxiety into. It’s not OK for him to refuse to seek treatment and sulk all day. Do not enable him to call random family members he doesn’t even talk to and who don’t specialize in his illness so he can find MORE people to push this one.

      STOP doing all the cooking and cleaning. Cook meals for yourself, leave his laundry for him to do. Tell him to call a therapist and let him know you will not be allowing him to take up all your time together with endless rinse and repeat manifestations of his anxiety.

      • Anonymous

        So you are suggesting that she stop cleaning the house and live in filth because her husband is lazy? That punishes her just as much as ti punishes her husband.

    • Anonymous

      I recommend the spouse find a counsellor and book an appointment for both you to attend. Explain at the counselling session that his anxiety is negatively impacting your health and he needs to get treatment.

    • Anon

      Have you posted about this before? If not, there is at least one other person who has posted about this recently. Maybe someone can link to it for you.

  20. Anonymous

    Lately I’ve been trapped in this cycle where I get really depressed/angry/anxious/emotional about whatever is happening in the news/politics cycle, can’t focus on work, and then get really down about myself about getting so behind at work. People in my life are expressing concern that news/politics are affecting me so personally and deeply. They’re right, but I feel like I have no control. Anyone else going through this? Any advice? This has been a hard week.

    • Anon

      You’re definitely not alone. The lines have been getting blurred lately for a lot of people. I just attended a webinar yesterday that included a moment of silence for RBG and for victims of racism, which honestly felt a little out of place on a webinar about a different specialized subject. Later in the webinar, one of the speakers apologized for not being prepared for the presentation and cited the Taylor decision as the reason. I don’t recall seeing this type of thing before 2020.

      Basically, I’m sympathetic to how hard everything has been since I am feeling it too, but personally, I find that I do better when I keep more separation between my professional and personal lives. I love talking politics, but if it happens too much at work or I’m giving in to endless venting sessions, it does impact my productivity negatively. Can you try cutting yourself off from news during working hours or setting time limits for venting/depressed sessions?

    • AnonMPH

      This is me since March. It sucks. Some of it is reacting to the news, but it’s also just all the time. I think honestly the thing most contributing to me being miserable is how bad I feel about not focusing on work, and yet, I continue to avoid/procrastinate. I hate it.

    • Airplane.

      No advice but I’m sorry you’re going through this. It sucks. I go through bouts of this but if people who love you are expressing concern about the cycle maybe it’s time for a break/reset for you. Can you take time off from work to do a little R&R?

    • OP

      OP here, just wanted to add, I’m totally open to therapy/medication if that seems to be a good idea. I’ve always been under the belief that I am reacting appropriately to what I see as a real existential crisis happening, and not clinical anxiety/depression, but people around me are concerned.

      • Anonymous

        I think you’re at the stage where your mental state is interfering with your daily life and multiple people around you are concerned. And that means it is time for therapy.

    • Anon

      I totally understand and you have my sympathy. What helps me is a combination of rigid compartmentalizing and taking action. I take action every week addressing the issues I care about: inequity in my city? I mentor a high school student from a low-income area and we have weekly check-ins. Climate change? I set up monthly donations to organizations who are fighting the good fight. Political insanity? I write letters to voters and contribute to ActBlue, Biden’s campaign, etc.

      I engage with the news on my terms. Absolutely no Facebook or Twitter. No notifications on my phone. Long-form whenever possible, or podcasts while I walk (anxiety is always reduced when I walk, I’ve noticed). Things seem terrible and they are, but also they were kind of always terrible and we just never had this combination of a pandemic (fewer safe distractions), polarized media (the more enraged we are, the more clicks), and social media (everything goes viral and feels urgent, so we are much more aware of things as they are happening without getting the big picture).

      Once I have done everything I can do, I let it go, tune out the news, and focus on work, personal projects, relationships and leisure. This is a long and difficult situation with no clear end in sight, and we need to be able to take care of ourselves to get through it. I can get into these weird thought processes where I feel guilty for doing something mindless like watching RHONYC (as if had I not watched an hour of a stupid show there would somehow be no climate crisis/Trump/pandemic), but honestly, that stuff is sustaining me right now and I do not apologize for occasionally needing to indulge in mindless entertainment once I have put in place my service, donations, and activism. Also, sometimes I just need to laugh when nothing feels funny, so I turn to my favorite books, movies, or TV shows that are guaranteed to make me laugh and it really does help.

      Another poster said above in a different thread that it’s best to do something active and slightly challenging and I agree (I never feel good watching too much Netflix, for example). Reading from an actual book, not a screen, is also good. Anything outside. Supporting a local business by picking up takeout or coffee feels surprisingly good.

      Hang in there. Hugs.

  21. Anonymous

    Does anyone have experiences/recommendations on countertop stand alone ice makers? My husband loves making cocktails and, in Before Times, having cocktail parties with theme menus, etc. and he’s always wanted like a specific ice maker. We have a freezer with ice dispenser, and he has ice molds that do all of the following: make large cube ice, make large sphere ice, make cylinder ice, make perfectly clear ice in several shapes. It’s a dream to one day add a bar with built in ice maker to our house, but that is like a “if we win the lottery” dream since it’s very frivolous.

    I’m thinking ahead to a Christmas gift, and just starting research. He is really not a big gifts person, so he has just about everything he needs/wants.

    • Anonie

      I don’t have experience or shopping advice, but I just wanted to say that this seems like a lovely present that will be an investment in future good times (served with delicious cocktails) rather than a frivolous purchase.

    • Anonymous

      The very privileged woman at cupcakes & cashmere raves about this, fwiw:
      GE Profile Opal Countertop Nugget Ice Maker

  22. Anonie

    I’ll be turning 30 next month and am honestly SO excited about it, pandemic or not. I think I’ve been ready for my 30s for quite a while haha. I would love to hear your favorite and least favorite things about your 30s.

    • Mal

      Turning 30 in October too! Would enjoy others thoughts about their 30s as well. :)
      To be honest, I’m kinda bummed that my usual ways of celebrating are no-gos, but I’m sure I’ll find something special to commemorate the day. Do you have any plans?

      • Anonie

        Ah a fellow incoming member of the 30s club! Happy early birthday! I hope your day is more special than you expected.

        My fiance and I haven’t eaten at a restaurant together since before the pandemic, but we are going to make a one-time exception and eat at our favorite fancy-pants steakhouse that is spacing tables out, limiting guests, and requiring masks when not eating. And then, the next day, we are doing an outdoor tour of a historic site in town that is doing fall/Halloween-themed ghost tours. I also made an appointment to get my hair styled professionally (while masked) before dinner, but I may cancel as I’m nervous about whether or not that adds too much exposure risk.

        I don’t know if you’re looking for Covid-friendly birthday celebration ideas, so feel free to ignore this if it doesn’t apply to your situation :) However, could you get takeout from one your favorite restaurants and bring food and a bottle of wine to a park for a socially-distanced picnic with friends or family? I did this recently and it was a blast even though we were all sitting 6 feet apart. I thought we wouldn’t be able to hear each other talking very well, but it was great.

        • Mal

          Your day sounds great! Excited for you.
          I think I may invite a few folks to come hang out with me & my boyfriend at a family lake house I have access to for the day…that’s the tentative plan. :)

    • Monday

      Happy early birthday! I remember feeling the same way when I turned 30, and now at 38 there’s really nothing that hasn’t been better in this decade compared to my 20s. Enjoy! More Serious Life Things tend to happen in your 30s, but you also tend to feel more comfortable with yourself, more sure of who your people are (and aren’t), and more stable in practical terms like home and finances.

      The only thing I don’t like about getting older so far is that managing my health involves a little more time/effort (and I’m someone who is lucky and has no chronic or serious issues). Looking to the decades ahead, that is also the only thing I’m not into: health problems that come with age.

    • Anony

      Least favorite: Nothing really. Mourning the past at times as I gained more independence (and made some difficult decisions to leave some things/people behind.) Most favorite: Starting over after a bad relationship, saying “yes” to (almost) every invitation or new experience, traveling abroad for the first time, meeting my husband as a result of putting myself out there.

      Embrace adventure, I’m excited for you! What do you envision for your 30s?

      • Anonie

        I like how you framed your 30s as a time to embrace adventure and say “yes” to as many good opportunities as possible. Thanks for posing that question at the end, too. I’m going to think through it over these next few days!

    • Anon

      I’ve become more confident and less tolerant of BS. It’s easier to say no to things I don’t want to do and I’ve also enjoyed trying new things I DO want to do. I’m less fit than I was in my early 20s, partially due to injuries and partially due to just being less flexible, but I’ve tried a lot of new sports and I honestly take some pride in being a woman who is willing to try risky, adventurous things. I’ve also learned more about how I want to spend my free time after wasting WAY too much time in my 20s just hanging around and puttering on the weekends (#regrets). I hope to keep up an adventurous spirit throughout my whole life.

    • Anonymous

      Still in my early 30s, but most favorite is that I’m confident of myself personally and professionally! Least favorite is a slowing metabolism and starting to get some joint aches if I don’t stretch every day.

    • Anon

      I turn 30 in 2 months and am so excited too! Every year since 20 has gotten increasingly better and better in my personal life, but worse and worse in terms of like, the world. I am so ready to leave my 20’s behind. I had big mental plans for a milestone celebration vacation, but whatever, I’ll do it for my 31st!

      • Anonie

        Happy early birthday to you! I hope this next year exceeds your expectations and surprises you in all the best ways :)

    • LSC

      Best: Learning to listen to my instincts about people–usually I am correct. Having more professional confidence. Realizing everyone is faking it to some extent in life and feeling empowered by that knowledge. Seeing life through the eyes of my children. Having more financial security.
      Worst: Coming to terms with the realities of having aging parents. Feeling more responsibility as the family breadwinner.

    • CPA Lady

      Generally my 30s have been awesome so far. I’m 36. I feel like people all have a sort of innate age, and my innate age is 35. Last year was as great as I thought it’d be.

      My favorite thing is a sense of being okay with who I am and being willing to put myself out there without caring what other people think. If someone doesn’t like me, that’s totally fine. Everyone doesn’t have to like everyone. :) I think this comes from both life experience and kind of snapping when it comes to all the ridiculous expectations placed on women. If I want to wear the weird cat sweater, I’ll wear the weird cat sweater. It makes me so happy. I’m also way less afraid to function as an adult than I was in my 20s– paying taxes, buying a house, dealing with my kid’s teacher, etc… Those things don’t seem scary and overwhelming anymore. And I’m way less broke which helps tremendously.

      And the least favorite thing isn’t really bad, but it’s more of an awareness of not being able to abuse my body and bounce back like I did in my 20s. If I stay up too late for a few nights in a row, I am definitely going to get a migraine. I haven’t started holding onto extra weight yet, but I assume that’ll happen soon. How I eat affects how I feel more now — not just indigestion, but mentally too.

    • anon

      Least favorite–there is now an American Girl doll based on my childhood, with her own Molly doll, which is the doll I received for Christmas when I was 6 years old.

      • Anon

        YES! This horrified me when I found out a few days ago. There is a 1980s doll and she’s “historical” and comes with the doll I had as a child? No thank you.

    • Anon

      Less energy. I needed about five to six hours of sleep a night in my 20s and used every second on education, work, politics, you name it. Now, I’m often down for seven hours.

      In your late 30s, less opportunity to change your life. Yes, there are always pep talks about how so-and-so published their first novel at 51; the question is not ability, but difficulty. It is easier to move somewhere new, make new friends, pivot professionally, and get in at the bottom and work your way up when you’re in your 20s.

      However, I really see how much both biology and society conspire to keep 20-something women in a very vulnerable position. Our decisions are questioned, our judgement questioned, and “being mean” (and variants thereof, such as “not giving him a chance”) is about the biggest sin a young woman can commit. At this point, if someone wants to bully me into being “nice,” they find themselves kicked to the curb.

      I’m also a lot better at seeing projection than I used to be. The people who screamed at me that I was lying were, in fact, the ones lying to me. The men who accused me of cheating were themselves cheating. The women who look down on my career are not exactly knocking it out of the park. The people berating me about my life are the ones who don’t have their s—t together.

    • Anon

      Agree with others that it’s been almost all good. In fact, I think one of the things that has made the pandemic so hard for me is that I feel like I’m “losing” one or more of the best years of my life (I turned 35 in the spring during lockdown). If my life weren’t so good right now, I would feel better about having a pause. I have money and a nice house and flexibility at my job and my kid is old enough to be fun to travel and have adventures with, but I still feel very youthful in terms of energy and looks, my kid is little enough that she loves spending time with us, and my parents are still healthy and active so I don’t have to worry about them. I definitely felt like I came into my own in terms of confidence around the time I turned 30. I started giving no f-cks and cutting out people and things who weren’t adding value to my life, which was very refreshing.

    • Anonie

      Follow-up: Thank you all for the lovely and thoughtful comments! I am taking the advice/insight each of you shared to heart.

  23. Anon

    I’m 42, and went through IVF to have my 2-month old daughter. I also have a 6 year old.

    I need to decide what to do with the single viable embryo that the clinic continues to store. I can’t imagine a scenario where my husband and I would choose to attempt having third child, but for some reason I’m having a difficult time making the decision to donate / discard the other embryo.

    For others who have been in my position, what did you consider to reach your decision?

    • Anonymous

      As someone who has NOT been in this position, I don’t think you need to decide at 2 months post partum. I’d wait at least a year to let hormones level out, where you’re more set in your new normal of 2 kids, and maybe can see farther out in your life.

    • anon

      We made this decision pre-IVF, as our clinic required us to. We decided that if we are fortunate to have leftover embroys, we will donate them. We know the pain of infertility and the real fear of not being able to bear children. We decided that if we can help ease the burden for someone else and help them complete their family, we want to. Is it a little odd knowing that potentially our genetic offspring could be out there? Yeah, kind of. But for us, the potential benefit outweighed that.

      • Anonymous

        That’s weird and heavy-handed. As noted above, you aren’t necessarily in a position to make that decision until a year or two after a child is born. I would have balked at working with a clinic that put that kind of pressure on me.

        • Anon

          That’s interesting. We wrestled with the decision and actually surveyed 5 people we trust who had to make the same decision – 2 sisters, cousin and 2 friends. All of us had to decide before starting our protocols. You can revise your responses but the decision was definitely made as part of the intake/authorization paperwork.

        • Anon

          I actually liked that our clinic made us make all of these decisions ahead of time (what to do with “extra” embryos, what happened in the event of my death or my husband’s death or a divorce). It meant we had these conversations up front and went into IVF 100% on the same page.

        • anon

          Out of the three of us that responded with our choices, all three of us made this decision pre-IVF, so I don’t think it’s unusual. It’s also very important to discuss this beforehand in case of death or divorce.

        • Anon

          My IVF didn’t work but we also had to decide before hand. There was a third option that we chose which was research.

    • Anon

      First of all – there’s no wrong decision here. Donate = great. Research = great. Destroy = great. It’s what you’re comfortable with, and no one else gets to make that choice for you or tell you that you made the wrong one

      So our situation is a little different because we had to make our decision pre-IVF, per our clinic’s policy. We decided that any embryos that remain once we’ve completed our family will be destroyed. Factors in our decision = we didn’t want our genetic children to be born to anyone else, and we didn’t trust that using them for research wouldn’t end up with one or more children being born as a result of that research. So it was a natural conclusion for us (emphasis on “for us” – we don’t care what other people decide to do!). Also – and again for us – an embryo is not a baby/fetus/life. It’s a chance. We don’t believe that we are killing anyone by not giving all of these embryos a chance to become a person.

      The embryos are all currently in storage, but there is a high statistical probability that we will have embryos remaining once we complete our family (because we still have 11 euploid embryos and only want 1-2 more children).

    • Anon IVF'er

      We just had to make this decision pre-IVF (I start shots tomorrow). If you don’t feel clear minded enough, and I say this knowing there’s a cost associated with ongoing storage, but consider waiting to make the decision. Get out of the newborn phase, get some rest and see where you are in 10 months when baby is a year.

      There’s no right decision, only a decision that is right for you. But since you asked what we weighed when making the decision: we decided to donate to science. I want to enable further research to help prevent anyone from living through what we’ve had to endure. We weren’t quite comfortable donating them for use/implantation in someone else so this was a happy medium.

    • Anon

      Are you asking donate vs. discard? Or are you asking whether or not you should continue to store the embryo in case you want another kid one day, even if you’re almost sure you won’t?

      If it’s the latter, I’d continue to store the embryo until you are completely, 100% confident that you don’t want any more kids. This isn’t so different that usual questions about ‘should I have another kid or not.’ Difference here is that the single embryo may be your only chance of another biological child, so don’t foreclose that possibility until you’re absolutely sure.

  24. DLC

    If case anyone is thinking of going down to the Supreme Court to pay their respects today- I thought I’d share our experience – we went yesterday and I’m So glad we went. We arrived at 2:45p, stood in line for a little over an hour. All the adults and most of the kids in line were masked. There wasn’t a lot of 6’ distancing but people were very respectful of personal space. There were so many inspiring and creative masks, T-shirts, signs, etc. on display and that was one of the best parts of the experience. As you exit from the viewing, there is a place to leave signs, flowers, letters, etc. definitely stop and look at those- they are a beautiful tribute.
    One thing to note- the line for the the viewing starts behind the Supreme Court Building, on 2nd. There are so many street closures and barricades that it can be a bit of a trek to get to 2nd from the front of the building, so look at a map. I overheard several people who gave up on the line because they couldn’t figure out how to get to 2nd from First. YOu can still see the coffin from First, but you have to stand across the street, and it’s a bit of a zoo with reporters and photographers, and fewer people taking safety precautions.

    • Anon

      i know that RBG wasn’t super religious and i am assuming she said she wanted this as part of her wishes, but as a jewish person it is just so strange for me to see her coffin just sitting out there for so long, since in jewish tradition you are supposed to bury the person asap.

      • Aunt Jamesina

        I’ve always wondered what it would be like to lose someone close to me who was famous. I’d imagine it’s nice to know so many people cared about them, but hard to have to balance you and your families’ wishes and mourning against public perception.

      • Anon

        She was not religiously observant. Let’s be mindful that there are different ways to express one’s faith.

      • Anon

        Some rabbis have discussed this on Twitter and in news articles. There are some exceptions to the immediate burial in certain cases, and one of the exceptions is if the delay is so the person can be honored. It’s not a question of how religious RBG was personally, this is actually very common with prominent Jewish people. They do it in Israel for heads of state, etc. all the time.

  25. Cosmetic surgery newbie

    Wise folks – I have a consultation this weekend with a plastic surgeon to talk about options for addressing my double chin. I have hated it as long as I can remember – even as a teen I was never super skinny and always kind of had a double chin. 35 now and finally decided to address it. I have put together the list of questions, but what should I be asking? I know there are a few different types of procedures to tackle this (lipo, injections, etc.) and so I am going to ask about pros and cons of each, going to ask basic medical questions, recovery timeline (I know – double it). Those of you who have been through this before, please help a newbie out.

  26. Help

    Reposting from last night: a friend needs a family law (divorce) attorney in Taos NM. Any recommendations? Thanks!

    • NM atty

      Pretty sure that the state bar has a lawyer referral service & the district court in Santa Fe sometimes does civil legal aid workshops.

    • Anonymous

      I would see if Terry and deGraauw or Walther will go to Taos. Otherwise, Atkinson and Kelsey. If your friend wants a local attorney, then I would check out Kevin Zangara. I don’t have any experience with him so cannot actually recommend him, but I have seen his name around. Taos is really small and so outside of a very few local practitioners, she probably needs to find someone in Santa Fe or Albuquerque who is willing to travel to Taos.

  27. Anon

    A million thank yous to all the people who have recommended the Down Dog app here. I didn’t realize just how much stress I was carrying in my body and yoga has been so helpful. I much prefer the app to other videos I’ve tried to use before.

    • The Frenchie is my favorite kid

      I LOVE the Down Dog app, too!

      It lets you select: length of practice, whether to have warm up and/or cool down, length of post-yoga meditation (shavausagna? No way I can spell this, sorry!), level, boost (strength, core, back stretch, etc) and more.

      I originally got it for my athlete son to supplement distance learning/sports training and found they have a free trial for students and teachers (and maybe others?) until Jan 2021.

      We both use it and love it! I am very flexible and somewhat advanced and he is not flexible and a beginner.

  28. Anon

    I just bought a pair of pants around this color, though mine are more of a reddish shade.

    Not sure what to wear with them. I have a handful of tops that fall into the millennial pink/blush color that was popular for a while – all of them have prints of some sort. But I’m open to other more creative ideas.

    I’m about the size of the model on today’s pick and tall.

    • Senior Attorney

      Mustard is fabulous with this color. Also gray, leopard (of course), navy/white or black/white stripes, chambray, reptile print, black and white checks…

    • Anonymous

      I love navy with burgundy. I have a pair of burgundy cords and most often wear them with a navy print top and another that is a mix of navy/pink/red. Also black of course. And white and off-white.

    • pugsnbourbon

      Blush, cream, gray and tan all look great with these burgundy/purple colors. Before I lost them in a superglue incident I loved wearing a gray and cream striped sweater with my burgundy pants. A poster above mentioned mustard and olive, too, which may work depending on the different tones in the pants.

  29. Colonoscopy logistics

    Spouse needs to go in for a colonoscopy. It’s overdue for a while. Then COVID hit.

    IIRC, I’d have needed to take the day off of work to drive him there and back b/c he’d be sedated. Usually you’d go in, but maybe now you just wait in the car the whole time (not sure how long — maybe several hours).

    Now: kids are also home from school and it looks like they won’t really go back this year, maybe until fall 2021 (we will have some summer camp weeks this summer where they are at an outdoor camp from 7am-6pm (it was open this summer and should be next summer)).

    And we got a corona-pup that is not 100% reliably house-trained (or more: he is doing well, but b/c everyone is home, is not used to a dog walker and also used to going out a bit, sometimes just to play b/c he is a puppy and also teething). He knows one sitter/tutor who is experienced with dogs.

    Am I right to think that absent getting a day nurse to take us or a full-day sitter who can handle the dog, we will just have to not plan to do this later? Kids can’t stay by themselves yet and certainly can’t handle when the puppy gets nippy (see: puppy/teething). It is a first pet for them and they can get a bit spastic, which the puppy thinks means “more roughhousing!!!”

    • Anon

      I’m having trouble figuring out exactly what you mean, but don’t delay colonoscopies. Seriously, don’t. Find a sitter for the dog and the kids.

    • Anonymous

      You can hire what is called a medical escort to pick him up without you there at all. But my colonoscopy experience was maybe 3 hours start to finish. Ask the endoscopy center how long they need. My husband dropped me off, took my son to a park, and then came back and picked me up – they called him to let him know when I was in the recovery area.

      • Anonymous

        This. Have the dog sitter watch the dog if necessary. Can the kids go to a playdate or something afterschool?

        Do not delay. My grandfather died of colon cancer and my mom only survived it because she was diligent about screening and it was caught early.

      • Anon

        Can’t you just drop him off and pick him up when he’s done? Depending on how far away you are and how old your kids are, it’s not clear this would even require a babysitter- for me, this would be a 10 minute drive each way, but I’m assuming it’s longer for you or you wouldn’t be worried about it. But either way, if he needs it, he should get it, and should probably schedule it now- most facilities are scheduling fewer procedures per day to deal with better cleaning and safety and there’s a backlog from the spring when everything was shut down.

        • Anonymous

          The endoscopy center will require you to sit there in the parking lot the whole time.

          • Anon

            How can they possibly enforce this? That’s ridiculous. I hear all these horror stories about facilities making it so difficult for people to get colonoscopies and then wondering why more people don’t get them. OP, I’m sure there’s a way to make this work, just call and find out what their policy is. The kids can wait in the car with you if they really have to, but seems unlikely to be needed.

          • Anonymous

            This isn’t true. Our hospital doesn’t allow you to wait in the building and requests you not wait in the parking lot due to limited parking. You come back in to meet the patient and basically sign them out that you will be driving them home. Depending on covid levels, they bring the patients to the front entrance and do the sign out there so the visitor person doesn’t enter the hospital.

        • Anon

          Even pre-covid, all of our colonoscopies were drop-off, pick-up. You can do it with kids and pup in your car. The surgery fee yet staff should be willing to walk your husband to the curb when you pick him up.

          (Yes, “all” our colonoscopies. Colon cancer/disease runs in our family so everyone has had colonoscopies, even the kids. I’ve had like seven so far.)

        • The+original+Scarlett

          That’s what I did for my H, they just get your number and call. Could depend on where you go, but this didn’t need to be hard

    • Anonymous

      No you’re wrong. Do not delay medical care for this. Get a sitter or see if you have someone who can drive him back and forth. And train your dog.

    • Cat

      When my husband had his, he got a ride to the hospital (Lyft) and then I came to pick him up when he was done (recovery called me).

      • anon

        When my parents had theirs, the medical center made the escort (me) wait in the waiting room. I couldn’t budge from that room because they wanted to make sure the patients would have a ride home. I’d call and ask for their policies.

        • Anonymous

          I’ve had this before — you could not even walk to a nearby restaurant lest you be hit by a car and not be there to give your person a ride home. Fine if it is 2 hours, but many are longer b/c they have time before and time waking up from anesthesia (and then vomiting, etc., which happens if you don’t tolerate it well).

    • Anon

      If you can’t handle childcare for a planned colonoscopy, think about how you would handle a true medical emergency if (god forbid) both parents had to be out of the house. Neighbor, relative? Find a babysitter who will wear a mask. High school kid who is learning remotely and can take a day off?

    • Anonymous

      I had a colonoscopy last month. My cousin waited in the parking lot for me, just under two hours. I was told not to drive or make any major decisions for the rest of the day. Otherwise, I was fine. We stopped to get food on the way home. The actual procedure was short. I was only under for about 30 minutes.

    • Anonymous

      It shouldn’t be more than 2 -3 hours total. Put puppy in his crate and kids in the back seat of the car with tablets.

    • Ribena

      Everyone has addressed the logistics, I just wanted to mention your use of the word ‘spastic.’ Unless things are very very different where you are (see use upthread of the word knickers to mean 3/4 length sport leggings, which made me do a double-take), that’s really offensive. You may not have known that previously so I assume you don’t do so intentionally, but it’s most likely a word to phase out of your vocabulary if you can.

      • Aunt Jamesina

        This is good to know with an international audience, it is considered much more pejorative in UK English than in American English.

    • Thanks, it has pockets!

      I was my boyfriend’s ride for his colonoscopy, so I went with him to the hospital, waited with him until they took him in to get started, and then left, and they called me when he was almost out so I’d know to come pick him up. I’m wondering if, in your case, you could take the kids with you and crate the dog for both the drop-off and pick-up?

      Unless this hospital is too far away to drive there and back twice, or the hospital requires you to stay for the duration. If you need to drive there and stay the whole time, then yes, get a sitter.

    • Lobbyist

      My boyfriend has stage 4 colon cancer. Get a sitter for the day and take him to the colonoscopy.

    • Anon

      I literally just did this today for my husband. I drove him to the colonoscopy center. I had to go inside briefly to meet the check in person and confirm that I was his ride. I was allowed to sit with him until he was called back but it was not required. After that I could not be in the waiting room but I could stay in other parts of the medical center (random lounges they have) or I could wait in my car or go to a restaurant/my office. They asked that I “stay close.” I think they have three concerns. One, if something happens while they are under, you are their decision maker, two, you could get in a car accident and then be unavailable to pick them up, three, when they are done, they want them out quickly to get the next patient in.

      I spent some time in my car, dropped some stuff off at my office, grabbed a sandwich, ate in my car, and then went up to one of the lounges to work. As soon as I connected to wifi they called and said he’d be ready in 10 minutes. They had me go back to sit there as the doctor went over the results (because he probably won’t remember what the doc said”) and to walk him to the car. I think they would have been accommodating if I couldn’t do that.

      If you had to, you could bring your kids with you for the drop off and pick up.

      As a PI attorney though, I urge you to have some kind of emergency plan. I see a fair number of car accidents where parents are hurt but kids aren’t since they are in the backseat. They aren’t hospitalized but parents are, even for a couple of nights. You need someone you can call.

  30. Anon

    I want to make a plug again for Black Voters Matter. If you still have some resources left and want to do some more rage donation, please donate! Even if Trump gets reelected, BVM efforts can improve lives by increasing black representation at the local level.

    Their key initiative till the Election – Initiative to Include Radio Ads, Digital PSAs, Voter Outreach “Caravan” in 12 Key States Today, Black Voters Matter Fund (BVMF) announced a major voter outreach initiative to educate, engage, and mobilize Black voters ahead of the November election. The initiative, which will span across 12 key Southern and Midwestern states, includes radio advertisements, digital PSAs, and a voter outreach “caravan” that will canvass major metropolitan areas through Election Day.

    I also donated to the Florida Florida Rights Restoration Coalition’s Fines and Fees Campaign. They are paying fees for ex-prisoners so they can vote (up to $1500). They are also looking for lawyers that can volunteer. Personally I like that this effort will help during this election but for future elections.

    • Anon

      Yes, how is everyone doing on their donations? Let’s keep the momentum strong.

    • MKB

      I feel a bit like I have a part-time job unsubscribing from email lists as a result, but have been donating steadily in races that look like they can be flipped.

  31. Aunt Jamesina

    This is good to know with an international audience, it is considered much more pejorative in UK English than in American English.

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