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Updated: May 12, 2023 302 Comments · by

Wednesday’s Workwear Report: Matte Jersey Sheath Dress

The Personal Shopper (TPS) | ·

This post may contain affiliate links and Corporette® may earn commissions for purchases made through links in this post. As an Amazon Associate, I earn from qualifying purchases.

Our daily workwear reports suggest one piece of work-appropriate attire in a range of prices.

Adrianna Papell Plus Size Matte Jersey Sheath Dress

This is such a happy, fun color — while still being a really easy to wear, versatile piece in your wardrobe. Add a neutral like black, white, navy, or gray — or have some fun and weird it with contrasting accent color, like a red necklace or purple heels. The dress is $149 at Zappos, available in sizes 14W-24W Adrianna Papell Plus Size Matte Jersey Sheath Dress

Looking for something similar in regular sizes? This pink cowl dress is $69 on sale, from the same brand, and has a ton of sizes left 0-16; meanwhile this black cowl dress is on sale for $82.

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Sales of note for 10.10.24

  • Nordstrom – Extra 25% off clearance (through 10/14); there's a lot from reader favorites like Boss, FARM Rio, Marc Fisher LTD, AGL, and more. Plus: free 2-day shipping, and cardmembers earn 6x points per dollar (3X the points on beauty).
  • Ann Taylor – Extra 50% off sale (ends 10/12)
  • Banana Republic Factory – Up to 50% off everything plus extra 25% off your $125+ purchase
  • Boden – 10% off new styles with code; free shipping over $75
  • Eloquii – Extra 50% off a lot of sale items, with code
  • J.Crew – 40% off sitewide
  • J.Crew Factory – 50% off entire site, plus extra 25% off orders $150+
  • Lo & Sons – Fall Sale, up to 35% off
  • M.M.LaFleur – Save 25% sitewide
  • Neiman Marcus – Sale on sale, up to 85% off
  • Spanx – Lots of workwear on sale, some up to 70% off
  • Talbots – 50% off 2+ markdowns
  • Target – Circle week, deals on 1000s of items
  • White House Black Market – Buy one, get one – 50% off full price styles

And some of our latest threadjacks here at Corporette (reader questions and commentary) — see more here!

Some of our latest threadjacks include:

About Kat

Kat Griffin is the founder, publisher, and editor-in-chief of Corporette. You can read more about her here.

Comments

    • Anonymous

      I think jersey is a bit casual for an interview, and I’d like to see how the knot looks under a jacket, but I agree that this style looks perfect for day to day.

  2. Equestrian Attorney

    I started a new in-house job 4 months ago, after 4 years in biglaw. It’s an ok job, but not a great long-term fit for various reasons. My initial thought was to stick it out for two years then reassess, but I was approached last week for a really interesting opportunity in Europe (still a legal role, in the specific area of law I want to be in, but overseeing worldwide compliance so maybe more compliance-focused). Is there any way I can justify doing this (assuming this goes through, I would be leaving after about six months at my current job), or is this career suicide? I’m really torn between the safe, conservative me who wants to fund my 401k and buy a house and have a stable career, and the fun me who wants to go live abroad and have an adventure after years of toiling in law school and biglaw.

      • Ellen

        Do it if you dare, but make sure you are aware that health care over there is NOT the same as it is here. Dental care is virtually non-existant in certain countries, so if you value your teeth, think about coming home 2x a year and seeing your dentist and internist for medical condition’s.

        At least two people from the European continent wanted to date (and likeley MARRY) me, but I would have had to go back there to live as a house frau for them b/c they had big banking jobs. I did NOT pursue the matter b/c I would NOT be able to handle liveing over there full time, even tho I would have had a life of leisure.

        You at least would be busy at work, so you would not be as focused on yourself, and your teeth, the way I would have been. FOOEY!

    • Anonymous

      Well, you’d be leaving to go TO something that would be a step up, right? So it’s an opportunity you couldn’t turn down? That’s the sort of thing that makes a short stay more understandable on a resume. Would you expect to be at the next job for more than a year? Even if you didn’t it still wouldn’t be career suicide (that’s a little hyperbolic).

      Take the job (after vetting culture and other things that could make a good thing go sour fast).

    • AIMS

      Do it! It’s so easy to justify as “this once in a lifetime opportunity” that came along. I also think everyone is allowed at least one “mulligan” on their resume so even if you left to do something else, it’d be fine.

    • Anonymous

      do it. (if its an international company, the way to move up is often to go abroad).

    • DCR

      I would totally take the new position if you get an offer.

      And, without knowing your current role, it seems like it would be easy to sell down the road as an interesting growth opportunity that came up and you couldn’t pass on. More responsibility, larger role, and interesting opportunity to live abroad – most attorneys I know would totally understand why you took the job. Frankly, most attorneys I know wish we had lived abroad at some point or for longer (this might be a function of living in DC). I think you would be able to explain it in a job search based on that – an interesting opportunity to work aboard in an international company arose, and I couldn’t pass it up. It provided x, y, and z (ability to focus on x area of the law when gaining experience in y, international experience, an opportunity to live abroad at a time that worked for my personal life, etc.).

    • Not a Short Termer but semi-BTDT

      Do this interview process, accept the job if offered.

      The only this is “not safe” or Not a Good Career Move is if the company is in very much start-up stage, like not yet profitable. But assuming this is a profitable company, even if privately held, this is a GREAT move. I know you are concerned about looking bad stepping away from a job now – but it is unlikely that anyone seriously will hold that 1 time you left a job against you down the line and there are many ways to spin it positively. You won’t face any drawbacks because of it.

    • Torin

      I don’t think you can fully assess whether this is the right move until you have a job offer in hand. I say, pursue the opportunity. Sometimes, IME, being “approached” for an “interesting opportunity” just doesn’t pan out for a ton of reasons. And then sometimes, you get all the way to the job offer stage and you decide the opportunity isn’t right for you right now. But there’s no actual decision to make about quitting your job until you have another job offer, so you might as well see if you can get one if you actually think it’s interesting.

    • Rainbow Hair

      I quit biglaw to chase an adventure and even the huge jerks were shockingly understanding about that choice. Like, “you’re much more likely to regret not doing it than to regret doing it.”

      Do it, and tell us all about it!

    • Anon

      Curious how this opportunity came about? If it’s from a recruiter, I might proceed with caution.

  3. AIMS

    Is anyone here on NextDoor? I typically avoid social media for a whole host of reasons but received an invite in the regular mail and thought it sounded interesting as the local stuff like “we’re giving away X item” or “FYI, someone’s been stealing small dogs tied up at the meter” is the only thing I feel like I miss out on with SM. Is it worth signing up or is it just a bunch of crazy people venting about various nuisances? Or does, maybe, no one use it at all? Thanks!

    • Anonymous

      A friend just told me about this. I lamented that my cat sitter is moving away and I don’t know of another reliable sitter – there are only a couple on Yelp in my area and none of them have responded to calls/emails. She said NextDoor is a good way to find recommendations like that. I haven’t tried it yet but I’m interested in hearing whether people have had a good experience!

    • cat socks

      NextDoor has been helpful for buying/selling a few things. People also sometimes give stuff away for free, but those go fast. People do post about lost pets. We found a pet sitter through recommendations there. There are definitely people venting about stuff and just annoying people in general, but that’s nothing new for any online forum. Overall, I think it’s helpful to keep up with what’s going in the neighborhood.

    • Anonymous

      I think it’s neighborhood dependent. I signed up, mostly for the notifications of free stuff (and to post my own stuff) and to get a sense of the neighborhood.

      There is a lot of grousing about various city initiatives and get-off-my-lawn about cars/fireworks, and complaints about bikes getting stolen and cars being rummaged through (after being left unlock on the street…), and what to feed baby bunnies (I resist the urge to say “don’t”).

      So, do it, but feel free to ignore most of the posts.

    • DCR

      There is some of the venting about nuisances, but I find it useful. In my area, the local government posts updates and lots of organizations post about events. It is a way to learn about events and stuff going on that I wouldn’t otherwise hear about. And it is easy to skim past the venting.

    • Fishie

      My guess is that it would depend on the neighborhood. Ours is quite helpful in terms of finding contractors and stuff like that. I only go on when I need info, it’s not quite as ubiquitous as other social media.

    • Not Legal Counsel

      I use it to keep an eye on what is going on in the neighborhood, though I don’t really post on it myself. It’s good for finding baby(or furbaby)sitters and other services. The downside is that busybodies use it to complain about kids playing, random cars, or any “nonresidents” in our very suburban neighborhood that, in my opinion, tend to be very thinly veiled racism. I would say that it’s the user’s issue, and not the app’s, but I’ve seen several articles online about how the medium basically becomes a posting place for those type of posts.

      • Anon

        I live in Berkeley and unsubscribed next door because someone described a person caught on video stealing packages from her porch as tall, thin, and black and got at least 50 responses calling her racist.

        • Anon

          The Berkeley Nextdoor is insane. I’m no longer living there but it was either people unjustly accusing others of racism or people accusing others of trying so hard not to be racist that they were ignoring basic facts about crimes.

      • Rainbow Hair

        Yeah, my Next Door is fuuuuull of the thinly veiled racism. I pop in maybe once a month when I’m wondering “wtf was going on with those helicopters last night?” (just to read if anyone else has posted) but yeah, it’s generally kinda gross on there.

    • Atlanta Burbs

      I am suburban Atlanta and love social media like Facebook and local news like… TV and newspaper. I am 39, married with 3 kids. I have no time for the crazy people on Facebook and my guilt or perceived obligation towards replying to them and their stupidity. If you are good at ignoring people, you may able to utilize the service. I’m sure there are ways to customize it so that your “neighborhood” is closer and more relevant to you than maybe what my account indicated, but I didn’t spend enough time on there to figure it out and when I did, it led to frustration, so I am still technically a member but have put my alerts/emails on DO NOT EMAIL ME OR ALERT ME OR ANYTHING.

      hope that helps.

    • Anonymous

      I like NextDoor, we use it to swap stuff we don’t need and to get recommendations. When our cat went on the Lam, the community was also really helpful. There are, however, some hilarious posts, like a neighbor wanting to know what to do about a heron in his pond.

    • IHHtown

      Like everyone above said, it’s neighborhood dependent, there are always some petty complaints about neighborhood goings on but 80% is useful. Our local police precinct posts to it regarding dangerous criminals, environmental hazards, warnings about a string of thefts, etc. and is very helpful. I didn’t find out how helpful it could be until Hurricane Harvey and the site was 100% the best information with respect nearby to closed and flooded roads, what shelters were open and goods available, neighbors offering extra rooms to those temporarily displaced, offers to get people home in boats or lifted trucks (because Texas) and it absolutely showed great community spirit.

    • Anon

      I used it a lot in the neighborhood we just moved from. Be warned, it makes you aware of a lot of petty crime you wouldn’t have heard about otherwise. It was really useful for finding moving boxes and curb alerts for the recent move – posted about a free table and it was gone in 10 mins.

      • Lyssa

        Second to that. We’ve had a rash of it lately that I probably wouldn’t know about if not for NextDoor, and I kind of wish that I still didn’t know about it.

    • cbackson

      Nextdoor in my area is like 75% posts like this: “Be on the look out for suspicious person! Black male seen driving car into driveway, approaching front door and opening it ALMOST AS IF HE LIVED THERE. Wearing a suit (probably to avoid suspicion). Vehicle was a BMW (probably stolen).”

      • Anon

        lol. There was a post in my neighborhood about a black guy with a shopping car roaming the streets obviously homeless (they posted a video of him). 1) It’s an urban neighborhood, this is what you get when you choose to not live in a suburb, 2) he was obviously just minding his business walking along, extra old (at least 70) and very thing (probably malnourished), so he wouldn’t have the strength to do anything.

        I’m grateful that at least 30 people commented, for lack of better words “that’s Jeff, our local homeless guy, he takes the cans we leave out for him, chill out).

      • Anonymous

        That must be very neighborhood dependent.

        If nextdoor was like that in my neighborhood, I would have to unenroll. But, luckily, I live in a diverse urban area and don’t have that problem.

        • Torin

          I also live in a diverse urban neighborhood. Diversity just includes racist people sometimes.

        • cbackson

          It’s definitely neighborhood dependent, but I am in a diverse urban neighborhood as well. I don’t think the Nextdoor membership is representative of the broader community when it comes to my neighborhood – seems like a lot of Permit Pattys flock to Nextdoor here.

      • Anonymous

        Yep I live in a Midwestern college town and NextDoor is at least 50% “beware suspicious black male in the neighborhood.”

      • emeralds

        I don’t use NextDoor much, but had to unsubscribe from the recently-starting-to-gentrify neighborhood next to mine because of posts like that. Oh, really, you mean there are three Black males walking down a public sidewalk talking loudly? In the neighborhood where they probably grew up, that you moved into three months ago? OMG, call the cops!!!11 (except please don’t, someone will probably get shot)

        My neighborhood is a lot more chill–mostly lost pets, people looking for sitters, and “take this [free item] out of my alley.” Or more legit items of concern like “got home late, saw people trying car door handles to see what was unlocked.”

      • Rainbow Hair

        Yes, this. Ask me about the time I got kicked out of a similar facebook group for noting the racism when someone posted pics of a black family “stealing” books from their “little free library.” The books are FREE – it’s right in the name! You posted a picture of the clearly middle-school aged CHILD for whom the parents were taking your FREE BOOKS. How on earth is that stealing?!

        I might still be mad.

    • Miss

      I’m on NextDoor and think it’s vaguely useful and pretty entertaining. It’s an easy way to learn about citywide programs (make sure you change the notifications so you don’t get it when anyone posts). In my city, the local governments use it to raise awareness about different issues (roadwork, weather, safety, etc.). I’ve also learned about local events. But mostly it’s people posting about lost pets and stuff they’re getting rid of.

    • JTM

      I joined Nextdoor when we bought our home this year. I expected it to be full of drama based on feedback from friends in other states, but my neighborhood’s Nextdoor is really tame. It’s basically people asking for recs for contractors, selling things or looking for a lost animal. I don’t check it often, maybe once a week or so.

    • ArkAnon

      I like it a lot for buying/selling things. People are tied to their real names and neighborhoods so they aren’t as likely to flake as with something like craigslist. It’s also great for quickly passing around lost and found pet info, and getting good reviews and recommendations for local services and such.

      There’s a decent amount of legitimate safety information like “man with flashlight looking in cars on Maple St” but that’s heavily tempered by all the “black person walking on sidewalk, probably up to no good” posts. Our city and law enforcement officials also post important stuff, like notices that a local hospital is having active shooter drills and not to panic about the sirens.

    • Baconpancakes

      Our next door has been a delightful source of entertainment. There’s a couple of nosy neighbors, a lot of NIMBYs, some thinly veiled racism, and a woman who regularly rounded up people’s outdoor cats FROM THEIR OWN YARDS, posted “lost cat” announcements on NextDoor, and took the cats to the shelter until she was repeatedly asked to stop by the cat owners and the shelter, at which point she created a directory of photos of outdoor cats with their owners’ names, addresses, and personal (unlisted) phone numbers, which she posted to both NextDoor and Facebook. When she posted a slanderous announcement about a neighbor who had a truly stray cat in his yard refusing to take care of “his” cats, the scat hit the fan, and a hilarious flame war filled up my inbox.

      Also I got a great general contractor recommendation from there.

    • Anonymous

      We use nextdoor all the time– buy/sell, garage sale notices, finding out about community events, recommendations for home service providers, etc. In our city/neighborhood it’s really busy. In our previous location we used Craigslist, freecycle, and a neighborhood listserve for the same purpose- nice to have it all together, plus Craigslist and freecycle aren’t very busy where we live now and there isn’t a listserve (plus this way it doesn’t fill up my inbox).

      • Anonymous

        Also at least 1/8 of the postings are of coyote sightings. Um, yes, by now we all know there are coyotes in the neighborhood!

    • GovtMule

      I find it helpful for keeping up with my neighborhood. It does attract a lot of kooky posts. I deal with it by 1) only subscribing to the daily digest (don’t want an email about every post), and 2) muting the crazies. Just like FB you can hit a button and stop seeing posts and comments from certain posters.

  4. Anon

    Can anyone who has dated in SF, Palo Alto, and NY as a straight woman in her 30s tell me which city is better for dating? Curious if Palo Alto and SF are indeed better than NYC for dating.

    • Anonymous

      Not really. I found more people put an effort in to active dating in NYC. Lots of App use. Less in SF/Palo Alto. But in general it was easier to meet people in the Bay Area for me, especially if you like to do outdoor activities. There always people going biking/hiking etc.., friends of friends, clubs etc.. that are very casual and my speed for meeting people.

      But honestly, I didn’t date much in either place!

    • Anonymous

      In the Valley, the odds are good but the goods are odd. There’s a mix of tech and finance guys, in about an 80-20 ratio. In SF, the odds are not very good.

      • Anonymous

        This is true.

        But I am a little on the quirky side too, so am more forgiving, and many of the guys are quite sweet.

        • Anonymous

          In my experience, it wasnt so much that they’re nerdy or whatever, but that it’s a veiled “but I’m a nice guy” yet still sexist in many ways issue. Eg we both work in tech but you should do all the house stuff and plan everything for me.

        • Anonymous

          Sure, maybe finance guys in NYC don’t pretend to be nice. But I just don’t even want to waste my time on someone like that so I’d rather have them not almost hide it til you’re a few months in. But I was just trying to say they’re not odd only in being in tech or being nerdy or not fratty or something like that, but in more shtty ways too.

    • Anonymous

      I only dated in PA and I was in my 20s. The good news is the odds are in your favor. The bad news is there’s a lot of toxic masculinity in tech and I don’t find tech bros appealing. I like shy nerdy science/engineering types but a lot of guys who work in tech have a huge ego and are threatened by smart women or women who make more than they do. I ended up meeting and marrying a Stanford PhD student. He’s a wonderful person but being an academic spouse has its own challenges.

      • Sarabeth

        This was my experience dating in PA 7ish years ago, and I suspect it’s only gotten more pronounced. Lots of tech bros who could not comprehend that I had my own career plans, and that their start-up jobs didn’t impress my pants off. I’m in a non-tech, but extremely competitive, field. The tech bros all thought they were smarter than me and my colleagues. They were wrong.

        I ended up marrying someone I met while doing research abroad, who followed me back to SV and then to the east coast.

    • Anonymous

      Decent people live everywhere and so do assh*les. Both geographies have plenty of both. Live where you want to.

    • MJ

      TL:DR: On balance, probably even. One is not better than the other, they’re just different.

      I’ve lived both places, NYC for 20s, PA/SF for 30s. IME, in NY, it’s much more common do to the quick “let’s meet after work” meetup, whereas in PA/SF, harder due to cars/drunk driving, some people living in the City/some not/weird commute times to deal with insane traffic and weird hours worked by brogrammers. I also found that in the Bay Area, dating sites were overrun with solo programmer types who worked from home and were…lacking in human interaction/basic people skills. There’s just a lot of tech bros. However, the Bay Area also has rad surfer/hiker/skier/windsurfer bros that you don’t really get as much of in NY. NY has more finance bros, and more New York is the center of the universe all other places are completely inferior-types, which is fine…if you want to live in NYC forever, which was not my game plan at the time, as a native Californian.

  5. LawyrChk

    I have a dress in jersey knit identical to this cut, and I love it. Very flattering to hourglass shapes, doesn’t wrinkle, and machine washable. Highly recommend!

  7. Maternity leave

    I’m due in six weeks and I haven’t had a conversation yet with my office about my maternity leave. When I told my supervisors I was pregnant I was told to talk to HR about the policy, which I learned was 12 weeks. I asked if I could take longer and HR said it would depend on my work load and what my supervisors said. I’d like to take at least 4 months and possibly 6 for childcare reasons. Any advice on when/how to address this? For background I’m a sr associate at midsize law firm in medium size city. Mostly males in the office and no other women with small kids or that have taken leave since I’ve been here.

    • L

      You definitely need to go ahead and ask! Time is running out. Get your ducks in a row (like what is your workload, deadlines, who has agreed to take over which client, etc.) and go back to HR and show how it can work for you to be away for 6 months. Congratulations!

    • Not Legal Counsel

      Educate yourself on the policies this morning and have the conversation today. I have had multiple friends who went into labor early, and they were not prepared for the leave. I would highly suggest that you tell them what leave you will be taking, and do not ask their permission. Companies care for themselves. You need to care for yourself and your family. If you ask what you can take, they will not give you near what you want – or what you have the ability to take. I have never heard of maternity leave length depending on the workload or what a supervisor says. Go in, say something like, “Our company allows 12 weeks of paid maternity leave. I will then be using 12 weeks of FMLA to make it a full six months. I have already started building transition documents, which I will keep up-to-date until I have to take off, in order to ensure a smooth transition of work.” You can always go back earlier, if you choose, but you need to take fully advantage of your benefits and time.

      • anon

        I think some companies can opt to have your FMLA and paid leave run concurrently. You don’t get to stack it.

        • L

          Also, if she is at a midsize firm, they may not fall under FMLA. Need 50 employees.

        • KateMiddletown

          I was just going to say, ours definitely does not allow stacking.

          OP – you need to address this yesterday. I’d hop on over to the moms board and get some more advice there, but gently, you may be in for a rude awakening from your supervisor. I don’t know that with 6 weeks notice my firm would allow a planned additional 12 weeks of leave, and even if your small firm is subject to it, FMLA certainly doesn’t require them to hold your job for any longer than 12 weeks.

        • Pretty Primadonna

          I work for state government and this is how maternity leave works here as well.

      • Anonymous

        She’s entitled to 12 weeks. Anything over that she defiantly has to ask- the 12 weeks is what fmla entitles her too

      • Anonymous

        Yeah FMLA runs concurrently with other paid leave. I was able to take 16 weeks but it was because my employer gives 6 weeks of maternity leave, I used 6 weeks of sick leave and then I had 4 weeks of accrued vacation/personal leave. My FMLA time was used up by the first 12 weeks.

    • lawsuited

      You need to have this conversation yesterday. Coverage for a 12 week maternity leave can be and often is cobbled together with existing resources but a 6 month maternity leave probably requires hiring a replacement, which changes the ask quite considerably. Preparing a memo detailing deadlines and attendances that would need to be covered during the time frame of your proposed maternity leave will be important to this discussion, so prepare that this morning and talk to your boss today. Given that your firm has not dealt with a lot of attorneys going on maternity leave, you need to be that much more proactive in your approach.

      • Maternity leave OP

        Thanks everyone. To clarify, I get 8 weeks paid + 4 weeks unpaid to total the 12 weeks I would get from FMLA. I know they are not required to hold my job any longer than that. I’ve been struggling to decide how much I want to take at all and the six month idea is new because we are having trouble finding a spot in daycare until new baby is close to a year old.

        Also I’m not as concerned about finding people to cover my work because to be honest I’m never really that busy. I don’t have a lot of my own clients yet and most of the work I do is one off assignments for other people. My hesitancy to ask for more time would be that they dont really need me at all and may find that after 6 months there isn’t much for me to come back to.

        • Anonymous

          How is a six month leave going to help if you don’t have daycare until your child is one? I’m not trying to snark- I went through a similar situation of not being able to find good childcare and it was really difficult. But unless you can stay home until you have a spot in daycare (or you have a partner who can take leave to fill the rest of the gap) I don’t really see how this is a solution.

        • Sam

          You need to get a nanny through care d o t c o m. Don’t go into a 6 month leave just because of the daycare situation, do it because you want to spend 6 months at home with an infant.
          You can get a good nanny with references and maybe go back part time at first and then scale up.

          • KateMiddletown

            +1. I know how bad this sucks, because I’m about to be in the same situation. We picked our daycare in June for our baby due in October and won’t be off the wait list until September 2019. Family + flex scheduling for both of us + probably a nanny will get us there but damn, it’s not fun.

    • Velma

      Have this conversation today! I would honestly be surprised at this point if you succeed in getting anything beyond 12 weeks. Longer leaves require tremendous planning and goodwill from your supervisor and company, and I think the way your supervisor bumped you to HR and vice versa is not a great sign.

      For what it’s worth, my daughter was born 5 weeks early. I created a coverage/work plan with my director at least 3-4 months in advance. I had counted on 12 weeks of leave + 3 weeks vacation before the birth. Instead I went into labor during my final big meeting (which I completed!), and delivered the baby that afternoon. The rest of my contingency plan I carried out by phone from the hospital. I ended up with 12 weeks of leave + FML for the weeks up to the due date.

      I ask you: What will be the upshot if you go into labor next week? Work now for the best results you can get at this late hour. And also focus on weighing your options for childcare or resigning after your maternity leave if the company will not offer you 4-6 months.

      Congratulations! It’s a wonderful time, after you survive the logistics!

    • Another SrAssocMom

      Is this your first? I understand the desire to take 4 – 6 months, but do understand it comes at a cost to your career. Is dad involved? I would suggest 2 – 3 months your maternity followed by 1 – 2 months DD taking paternity. If you start being the default parent now, it will last forever. Also, you should spread the hits to your careers among you both. I took maternity and I’m all about it, but women who have taken 4 – 6 months on my teams have really let their colleagues down, and then they become default moms and it continues.

      • Maternity leave OP

        This is my second. I was in biglaw for first and got 6 months off and it was so nice to have the time so I guess that’s why I’m thinking about trying to take that long again. My husband gets 10 weeks paid which he will take it as soon as I go back. I totally get the default parent thing but I’m not concerned about that happening in my situation.

      • Anonymous

        Just pushing back on the idea that taking 4-6 months is “letting your team down.” If your employer doesn’t provide appropriate coverage and your colleagues suffer, that’s your employer’s fault. You shouldn’t blame a parent for wanting to take all the leave that’s available to them.
        I fully agree that splitting the leave equally between parents is ideal, but that doesnt’ mean each parent has to take less than 3 months. I was able to take 4 months and then DH took 3 months. It was wonderful for our child to have a parent at home for 7 months and I didn’t become the default parent or suffer any negative career consequences.

    • Anonymous

      Just ask, and do it soon. Have your reasons why you need extra time ready. If you’ve already come back from having one kid, I think they will be less likely to be concerned that you won’t come back after a long leave. Explain your child care issues and that six months is what works for your family because X, Y, and Z.

      FWIW I was a senior associate when I had kids, in a small firm, I worked with all men, I was the first female attorney to have kids, and I got six months of leave. Just because they are men does not mean they won’t understand – some will and some won’t. Most of my leave was unpaid, of course, but it’s not impossible to get. However, don’t go in with the attitude that you are easily replaceable – you’re not, and tell them why. You don’t get what you don’t ask for. The worst they can say is no and then you have to figure out where to go from there.

    • Anon

      IANAL and genuinely curious: how do you expect to take 6 months if HR told you maternity leave is 12 weeks? Unpaid? All your vacation for the next 3 years? Is this a thing people do?

      • Lyssa

        A lot of people take at least some unpaid leave after having a baby, either because they’ve planned and saved, or on credit, or just because they have a spouse with enough income that it’s doable. My husband took almost his full 16 weeks (state law extends FMLA here) unpaid (though in the meantime, I wound up getting a better-paying job and he ultimately became a SAHD). We just planned and saved a lot beforehand.

      • Anonymous

        It’s not unheard of to negotiate for a longer (usually unpaid) leave.

      • Anonymous

        At most employers the 12 weeks is unpaid. In my state by law I get 18 weeks, or 20 if a C-section, and at my employer it is all unpaid except for saved sick leave (minimal because it accrues at 5 days/year), saved PTO, and short term disability. My husband is a teacher so it’s not like he’s unilaterally supporting me. Nonetheless I am planning to take the full leave and we just won’t save anything this fall– my mental health is worth it to me and for me it would be terribly hard to go back after 2-3 months.

        • Anonymous

          Yeah, my 12 weeks was unpaid (except for minimal state disability) AND I had to cover my employer’s normal portion of our now family health insurance during my leave. It sucked.

  8. Weight watchers magic - pls share?!

    I have seen a few posts lately where people highly recommend Weight Watchers. Could you please share how you use your points during the day? And perhaps what you eat typically?

    I started in June, and I’ve gained 2 pounds! I feel like I eat like a normal person but somehow run out of points by 2 or 3 p.m. I need a little bit of carbs in the morning (i.e. piece of toast), eat fruit, and usually have a salad for lunch.

    I also saw a rec for Slim-Fast. Can anyone share a similar a protein shake, but without the chemicals?

    • anon

      Is there any protein in the morning or at lunch? Eggs, lean meat, anything? I don’t do WW, but I like the SkinnyTaste website for lots of WW friendly recipes.

      • Anonymous

        +1

        I don’t see any fat or protein in what you are eating. Your food items will leave you hungry quickly. Fruit and toast are basically just sugar/cabs, and a salad isn’t enough to fill you up.

        Full fat yogurt and/or egg in the morning?

        Do you really “need” carbs (toast) or you are just starving because you aren’t eating enough fat/protein? Could you substitute some slower carbs instead that wont leave you hungry for fruit (sugar) a couple hours later? Like oatmeal…

        Muscle milk light is great for a protein supplement that is low cal. Costco.

    • Anon

      Are you snacking a lot? I am doing WW now and lost 15 pounds in the first month. With what you’re describing (a piece of toast, fruit, salad) you should have plenty of points for dinner, so I’m wondering if there’s extra snacks in there.

      This morning I ate:
      – Two of the crustless turkey bacon and gruyere quiche (in the “Discover Recipes” section of the app under breakfast)
      – Cherries with a tablespoon of extra creamy whip cream
      This breakfast cost 5 points total.

      For lunch I’m having a baked sweet potato stuffed with buffalo chicken and blue cheese coleslaw for 7 points. (Recipe at emilybites dot com. Lot’s of delicious and WW friendly recipes on this site actually.)

      I get a total of 23 points per day so now I will have 11 points left for dinner, which really is a lot, and I can even have wine with that many left.

    • TheElms

      I haven’t done weight watchers in a while but my guess is that your salad actually contains about 1000 calories with dressing and thats why you’re not making progress. Also fruit has a comparatively high level of carbs, which you could be sensitive to.

      I didn’t like the new version of weight watchers, but have done well just counting calories and sticking to 1500 calories a day and trying to ensure I eat 100 grams of protein a day. To make this work and not feel like I’m starving, I pretty much had to cut out all added sugar and limit natural sugars. I have one sugar in my coffee or none if I have 2 coffees, no wine or other alcohol, only occasional fruit and then it is usually berries. My treat is a small square or two of dark salted chocolate. Breakfast is typically an egg or two with an ounce of cheese on half an English muffin. Giving up bananas was hard. Lunch is usually 4-6oz of lean protein with steamed vegetables on the side. I give myself an afternoon snack which is typically yogurt or I like the Think Thin protein bars. Dinner is the same as lunch. So this week I did SkinnyTaste’s deconstructed stuffed cabbage with more vegetables on the side. Also, in the beginning couple of weeks I measured or weighed everything I ate, which sucked. But I did learn my version of portion sizes was off by about a third.

      I’m reasonably active but not crazy (walk the dog, walk to and from public transit, and try to get to the gym once a week and do one day of “exercise” on the weekend like garden for a few hours, take the dog on a hike, go on a bike ride for a couple hours). I’ve been losing roughly a pound a week and am down 15 pounds, have about 25-30 to go. Its definitely hard, but doable.

    • Anon

      The new Weight Watchers formula, which launched last December, focuses wholly on the types of food you eat, not the quantity, so if you have an issue being a volume eater, Weight Watchers may not be for you. In switching to a whole food approach, they slashed available points, so a lot of people started starving if they didn’t mostly stick to the prescribed zero point foods. On WW it is actually possible to eat 2200 calories and only use 5 points because many protein heavy items that are zero points still have high calories, as do starchy fruits and veggies. I left the program with this switch as after months of losing, I started gaining weight on the new program.

      The old WW program will probably work for you and you can follow it with the app “I track bites” which reverse engineered the WW Smart Points Program. And it’s only a one time fee to use (maybe $3).

    • lsw

      I have been finding WW helpful! I eat a lot of lean protein – salmon and chicken breasts – for dinner, with a veggie side and salad. I eat tons of fruit. I love eggs so don’t mind having them for breakfast often, although I also hate oatmeal fairly often. I eat a lot of beans. A go-to quick lunch for me is canned chicken + canned beans + canned tomatoes or some veggies or whatever I have mixed in.

      Can you look at what are your highest point meals? Are there things you could cut down on? (e.g. one piece of toast instead of two but with avocado or eggs?)

      Greek yogurt is also a great zero point food, and if you added that to your fruit you might get a little more staying power.

      The recipes on the app are pretty decent, too!

    • anon a mouse

      “eat like a normal person” = what led to you signing up for WW in the first place. Shift your mindset slightly to remember that you are eating to lose weight.

      I find that I work best when I budget points for the day. I snack a lot so it’s important to me to keep those points set aside. A typical day for me is breakfast 4, lunch 6-7, dinner 8-10, with the remainder for snacks. I usually have about 3-5 points in snacks, a combination of protein shake/jerky/fruits.

      Are you getting enough protein? That will help you feel full longer.

    • WW Anon

      I’ve been on WW since late Mayand am down about 20lbs. I get 23 points a day (I think most women do). What I ate yesterday: breakfast was full fat yogurt (5), berries (0) and coffee with 1tbls of creamer (2) (total=7), lunch was lettuce wraps (0) with deli turkey (2), chopped carrots and cucumber (0) and hummus (2) (total=4), dinner was chicken breasts (0) cooked in the crockpot with salsa (0) and spices over ½ cup of brown rice (3), 1tbls of sour cream (1), 1 100 calorie guac cup (3), shredded lettuce (0) and sautéed peppers and onions (2pts for the oil) (total=9 – it was a lot of food!). I snacked on cherry tomatoes (0), a plum (0), and a Yasso frozen greek yogurt bar for a treat after dinner (3). All drinks were seltzer or water. Getting enough protein, fiber, and water to feel full is so important, as is measuring everything.

    • Veronica Mars

      I’m really enjoying it personally. But I think what works best for me is to consider the free food my “core” diet and eat it mostly for breakfast/lunch. Then I spend my points on dinners and snacks (or something low point to spice up lunch, etc). I’d go ahead and make some low point, high protein snacks for yourself to keep on hand if you’re a snacker (I do a modified deviled egg recipe that’s 2 pts per serving).

    • Anonymous

      I’m one of the frequent WW cheerleaders.

      I eat about every 2 hours, so here’s what my day looks like:

      10 am (yep, I don’t eat until then – I’ve been like this since I was a kid) – a big container of watermelon

      12 pm – a big salad (as in, plain lettuce) with chicken (0 pts), hardboiled eggs (0 pts), or tuna (0 pts), plus other veggies, and a package of skinnypop or 100 calorie nuts (3) OR a deli sandwich (8 pts)

      2 pm – a banana and an apple (0 pts)

      4 pm – my office constantly has catered treats around, so I’ll probably have one of the gourmet cookies (8 pts)

      7 pm – grilled fish (0)/shrimp (0)/chicken (0)/venison (2) plus veggies from our garden (0), maybe some homemade potato salad (4) or rice/quinoa (4-5). If we do tacos, I use low carb tortillas for one point each.

      Dessert – Yasso bar (3-5 pts depending on flavor) or a piece of homemade fruit pie (I don’t bake with much sugar and find my body responds well to homemade vs commercial treats – I’ll save my pts for this and don’t worry about obsessively calculating)

      Are you on Connect? People frequently post what they’re eating and it’s fun to get ideas.

    • Baconpancakes

      I had a HARD time adjusting to WW at first and was super whiny, as some posters here will surely remember. Now, I feel like I have generally figured it out, and I’m averaging a little over 2 lbs of weight loss a month, and the average loss is going up every month. That sounds like almost nothing, but that’s 2 lbs a month I wasn’t losing before, and I’ve happy with how I’ve made it work for me. In some ways, I’m not following the plan – I decided that any lifestyle where I had to track coffee creamer wasn’t for me, so I just don’t track coffee, and on the day before my weigh in, I’m a little lenient on myself. It took me two months before I felt comfortable with the plan. I still eat out more than I should, but less than I did before. I won’t bring fat free turkey dogs to someone’s cookout; I’ll eat the ones they have. That probably makes me lose slower than other people, but it’s a lifestyle I can live with.

      But, you say you eat like “a normal person,” but there’s two things to keep in mind here. 1) You don’t necessarily know what other people eat all the time. This was a huge mind shift for me. When I actually asked my skinny friends what they ate, I found out that they would often skip meals, or eat super healthy at home, and eat “normal” (i.e. high fat, sugar, alcohol, carbs) out with friends. 2) There are people who can eat more than you and have less body fat. This is just the way it is. You can’t worry about them. You have to just think about what works for you.

      For strategies, I eat a lot of seafood and grill a ton, because I love those foods. Right now, because it’s summer, I’m splurging at the farmer’s market and buying bushels of fresh fruits and vegetables and forcing myself to eat them all up every week, which means I’m naturally going low calorie, high nutrient. A favorite salad is a sliced heirloom tomato with a drizzle of balsamic glaze (0 points for 1 tsp), salt, pepper, and ripped basil. I’ve largely stopped snacking, and if I do snack, it’s either a planned indulgence or a food with protein and a little fat. Babybel Light cheeses are a go-to, as are hard boiled eggs with seasoning. I know that salty carbs are my weakness, so I only buy them for special occasions, like a picnic or a party, where everyone else will eat most of them. I plan out my meals for the entire week, and pre-track them. Then I know how many points I have to wiggle with. Good luck!

      • Baconpancakes

        And if it helps, here’s today:

        FF Greek yogurt and sliced peach – 0 points

        Salad with peanut butter/PB2 dressing, hard boiled egg, sunflower seeds, cabbage, and greens – 4 points
        Cold white gazpacho made this weekend – 5 points

        Lambrusco – 4 points
        Mediterranean Eggplant Salad (WW recipe) – 2 servings for 2 points
        Flour tortilla sliced and baked into “chips” – 3 points
        South African Corn and Tomato Soup (WW recipe)- 4 points

    • Anonymous

      Obviously everybody is different, but I’d rethink carbs in the morning. I need to start my morning with some fats and protein to keep me full. If I just eat toast, I’m hungry 90 minutes later and heading down to the snack bar. I think what you need to do is look for foods that are more filling! Sure, you could just eat less of the same things you always eat, but that takes a lot of will power that I sure don’t have and it sounds like you don’t either.

    • WW'er

      Morning: Premiere protein shake (2 pts), banana, eggs

      Work day lunch (either bought or brought): salad with chicken – points only for dressing and any additional toppings I might add (croutons?)

      Dinner: chicken or salmon for 0SP, and sweet potato (1 SP/ounce) or avocado or some other carb or healthy fat.

      In between I’m spending points on string cheese (1SP each), yogurt (2 SP), nuts (varies) or something else to hold me over between meals. I am faithful about not drinking my points, except for wine on weekends if I choose, and I eat a TON of fruit. There is the whole “DON’T EAT TOO MUCH FRUIT!” contingent, but ya know what? Too much fruit isn’t why I have to do WW…. multiple hand fulls of grapes > 1-2 handfulls of chips.

    • OP

      THANK YOU to everyone for your ideas and suggestions! I am going to jot down your meal ideas in my bullet journal. Your posts are immensely helpful and inspiring.

      P.S. When I said “eat like a normal person,” I meant I don’t eat fast food, chips, ice cream, or other “bad stuff”, etc. ;)

      • Anonymous

        I’m late, so I don’t know if you’ll see this, but I’ve lost 15 lbs on WW in the past 3 months.

        Breakfast:
        Premier protein shake (caramel version is best!). 2 pts
        Sometimes I will have a slice of Dave’s Killer Bread 21 grain toast with a little whipped butter. 3 pts

        Morning snack: banana

        Lunch:
        Dole/Taylor Farms chopped salad kit + homemade chicken. I don’t add more than half of the toppings/dressing packet. This one is hard bc the kits don’t separate the nutrition info, but I usually give it 5-7 points, depending on flavor.
        OR
        West End Chicken breast skewers with2 tbsp tzatziki (3 pts) and mini naan (1 pt each, I usually have 3-5). All found at Costco

        Afternoon snack—choose 1-2
        more fruit (watermelon/strawberries/cherries)
        Apple with 1 tbsp whipped PB (3 pts)
        veggies and full fat dip (2 pt for tbsp)
        tea with sugar-free creamer (0 pts) and one sugar (1 pt)
        1 bag smartfood cheddar popcorn (3 pts)
        Kirkland steak strips (1 pt for 1 oz)

        I usually have somewhere around 10 points for dinner, which means I can eat what my family is having: meat, veggies, starch (rice, TJ frozen mashed potatoes, etc).

        Dessert:
        Rasperries with 1 tbsp chocolate chips (3 pts)
        Diet root beer with 3/8 cup vanilla Halo Top (1 pt)

        Good luck!

  9. Anon

    Yesterday my mentor interrupted me during a 1-1 conversation and called me “sweetie” while trying to tell me I was wrong. It was more than a casual interruption; he would not let me finish my sentence and told me I was wrong. He has also never used a sexist term around me, in fact I’ve seen him correct others for using them.
    I was not wrong, and he later acknowledged that, but there was no acknowledgement that the interruption and “sweetie” was wrong. I didn’t think I’d dwell on it but I’ve been in a bad mood since and can’t shake it off. My mentor is 78 and I’ve been impressed with how progressive he is on a variety of issues, including gender. And he’s really the only person I have at the firm that I think is invested in my career. I know people aren’t perfect and I want to shrug it off but it’s really irking me. It seemed like a really condescending interaction, from my work with him I’d never expect it from him. I feel like I just took off my rose tinted glasses and realized everything about this place sucks. I know it’s snowballing and irrational. Maybe it’s because I previously held him on a pedestal? Rambling, but does anyone have any suggestions for how to shrug it off?

    • anon

      I would address it, but not make a huge deal of it. If it were my mentor, I’d be like, “hey, I’ve really appreciated the opportunities you’ve created for me and our working relationship; yesterday when you called me “sweetie” during our 1:1, it seemed dismissive and not something that a man would have to deal with. can you not do that again please?”

    • Anonymous

      Let it go. Seriously. Come on.

      He’s 78. He used sweetie once. You aren’t going to change him. You said he acknowledged his error appropriately. He is otherwise progressive, which is impressive given his age and era. He is not going to remember the sweetie thing. He is your senior and mentor and otherwise has been good, yes?

      You need to get a grip. You are going off the rails….

      • Anon

        This is classic gaslighting: a woman suggests that something may be inappropriate and is told she’s imagining it and needs to get a grip.

        • Anonymous

          Another extreme response. The post didn’t say she was ?imagining it. Even the OP admits she needs to get a grip.

          Go back and read what the OP has written. She has been happy with her progressive and otherwise enlightened mentor who said Sweetie and interrupted her rudely ONCE. Only one complaint in her entire experience with this guy. And now she has realized the entire office sucks? Her words. This is not appropriate. Even she realizes this and says her thoughts are irrational.

          I like the idea of thinking about what to say if this happens again. But for her to go and request/demand an apology for this from her mentor will not reflect well on her.

        • Anonymous

          Gaslighting? A bit extreme, no?

          No one has said she was imagining it. No one has said it wasn’t inappropriate. What we are recommending is tempering her outrage.

          I wonder what magic place you must work, where everyone speaks perfectly all the time, no bosses/mentors ever interrupt their underlings and tell them they are wrong (when they are actually right), and where all 78 year old men never use the word “sweetie” inappropriately.

          If you don’t learn how to survive in the grown-up working world, and when to choose your battles, you will not survive. We are making progress.

        • Anonymous

          +1

          Don’t let it go, OP. Just because he’s an ancient old man doesn’t mean he gets a pass.

    • Green Hat

      Ideally you would have said something in the moment, but I don’t think it’s worth bringing up now. If he’s proven himself to be respectful and progressive in other situations I’d give him the benefit of the doubt. I’m sure there have been times in your life that you’ve said something that you cringe at now (I know I have!) – we all make mistakes. If it happens again I’d call him out – “hey, I really don’t appreciate the ‘sweetie’ – I’m an adult woman.”

      • Monday

        +1. In this situation, I would try to let it go but also have a plan for an immediate response in case it happens again. You were probably so surprised that you couldn’t think in the moment. Hopefully it was a random one-off and you can resume a fully positive rapport with him.

    • Morning Giggles

      I think you really need to balance this one situation vs all the other interactions you have had with this individual. If his condescending tone continues with you then you need to speak up and ask to be referred to in a respectful way. You said you were having a bad day, maybe so was he and it manifested incorrectly. Or maybe there was frustration around a situation and he felt compelled to continue- which you might not let him do otherwise. Only you know the full color of the interactions. That said, I would think about why you only have one person at your firm that is invested in your career/ if there is a mutually beneficial fit for the work and culture.

      • Morning Giggles 1

        It’s a little weird to use the same name someone else is using on today’s thread. I’m the “Morning Giggles” OP below and this reply is not me.

    • possible script a la askamanager

      Is this something you’d feel comfortable asking him about in person – “Hi Don [USED BECAUSE OF MAD MEN, NOT CURRENT PRESIDENT], thanks for the difficult discussion the other day. I’m not sure if you realized you called me “sweetie”?! Of course you’re a great friend and mentor and I appreciate you championing me and making me work harder here, and I love/appreciate that I’ve heard you stomp out sexist comments from others -did you realize you’d said it [THIS IS GIVING HIM AN OUT] or can I understand what you thinking when you said it? It seemed really unlike you so I’m sure you understand where I’m coming from…?”

    • T Swift

      I think you have to just fight through and shake it off. * shake it off * have some drinks, distract yourself, go for a run. I feel for you, in that you thought he was an ally, mentor, etc.

      old white men gonna old white men. you know that.

    • Anonymous

      Totally shrug it off. Everyone has days where they don’t manage to convey their thoughts quite the way they intended. Think how bad it would be if you were judged on every single interaction.

    • Torin

      I would try to shake it off this time, but I actually disagree with others saying it’s not worth addressing because he’s old or white or whatever. You don’t have to put up with people being that way in silence, no matter who is talking to you.

      I think you should shake it off because unfortunately you missed your best window to say something about it. For things like this I find that it’s best to address it immediately with a straightforward, “Please don’t call me sweetie. It’s very unprofessional.” or similar. I get that may have been hard to do on this occasion because it sounds like it caught you off guard, but next time you can be ready to say that. I find that if you wait to say something the person feels you’re overreacting (even though you’re not!) and focuses on that rather than on the fact that they were wrong for being condescending and sexist.

    • anon

      I live in the south, and “sweetie” is not meant to be condescending. That said, I get called “sweetie” more often than I’d like to admit (by women my age!) and it absolutely drives me bonkers. But in this case, I’d say let it go. If it happens again. bring it up in the moment.

    • Anon

      He was clearly trying to tell you he disagreed with you and that you needed to get in line. His use of the word “sweetie” was unfortunate, but that’s not the issue if, as you say, it’s not his pattern. The issue is you were being insubordinate, or he thought so. That’s an entirely different issue that you probably should think about (were you actually being insubordinate? were you actually wrong? as your mentor, is he justified in expecting “allegiance” from you? do you really want to buck your mentor?)

    • Anonymous

      I mean, what do you stand to gain? You do not have to take a stand on principle or to further some kind of cause here.

  10. Morning Giggles

    Shoutout to the coworker who forgot to silence his phone this morning. The repeating “Surprise, m-f-er” ringtone (the full line from Dexter) really cut through the quiet office. Fortunately my boss was in a meeting and didn’t hear it, but the rest of us had a good laugh.

  11. Anonymous

    I have a big presentation next week at work. I will be co-presenting with the VP of my department and two colleagues; our audience is all the managers at our company (about a thousand total; we’re expecting 250+ to attend in person and another 500 to watch on live-stream). The topic is important to managers, and we have information to share that we’re anticipating they may not like (think benefits change, or something that both affects them and that they will have to communicate with their employees). We are anticipating that things could get contentious. These changes are coming down from our corporate parent and we are the messengers in this situation; part of what we want to communicate is – we know this is hard; we want to try to support you as much as possible as these changes roll out.

    So…what should I wear for this? I have plenty to choose from but want to pick something that says “professional” without being too severe or overly formal. Our company is mostly business casual but for presentations and events like this, the presenters usually dress more formally (although only very rarely do women or men ever wear full suits, in any situation). I have a black suit and a beige suit; a couple of sheath dresses (black, navy and camel); navy, cream and red blazers; navy, black and camel skirts; and a couple of other things I could make work. I will have to wear a lavaliere microphone so trying to pick things with pockets. Any suggestions?

    • Velma

      My comfort zone for this kind of thing would be a sheath dress and blazer–choose one that has the lapel/pocket configuration you need for your mic. A color would be nice in one of the pieces. Low heels and nothing around your neck (scarf, necklace) that could tangle in in mic or be too warm if you have bright lights. Remember to breathe, speak fairly slowly, and smile. Godspeed!

    • BB

      Find out the seating arrangements beforehand. If they have you in any kind of high top bar stool type thing, wear pants. If they have you at a table, know that everyone will only be focusing on your top half.

      • BB

        And I should add…if it’s a big production type thing, also find out what will be behind you in terms of colors if you can so you don’t blend in.

      • L

        If you can, do a dress rehearsal – go to the presentation stage and have someone film you in the outfit you will wear (or set up a timer to film yourself).

    • Good luck

      Navy and black sound really harsh in this situation. Keep colors light and soft if possible.

      The Vivienne Files dot com has a lot of “heroine” stories like this. Not sure if that helps.

    • Nesprin

      I would wear black suit trousers with a belt, with your non-matching camel blazer and bright/jewel colored top. You want it to be clear that you’re the speaker so I’d go up in formality but not to full suit. Since you’re wearing a portable mike, the belt and the lapel become important. Chair situations can vary so I’d stay away from skirts esp pencil skirts. No bracelets or necklaces that can make noise.

  12. Your young male intern

    mmmm this milk is so delicious and creamy, let me just… pour it… all over… my cereal

    • Anon

      lol thanks for that reminder of yesterday’s ridiculous post (understanding nothing was wrong with the post, but the OP’s sense of humor was weird)

    • Anonymous

      I think you have too much time on your hands.

      Go take a brisk walk instead outside. You will feel better!

      You’re already irritating us by complaining about this…. again.

      • Anonymous

        Eh, I took it as a joke, not a complaint, and I thought it was funny. I also agreed with the OP yesterday that it’s funny to use the coffee milk in cereal.

      • Anonymous

        Eyeroll – I figured it was someone else, playing off of the post. Not the original poster of the comment.

        Talk about having too much time on your hands.

    • MagicUnicorn

      Is he consuming an obviously larger-than-fair share of the communal milk, leaving others with none? Does his age and gender have relevance? Why are you monitoring the intern’s eating habits so closely?

      • Anonymous

        That’s what got me — why are you obsessing over what the intern is doing?

        I’ll admit that I have a strong reaction when I perceive that people are judging young people *just* for being young. We were all young and experienced once!

    • Anonymous

      How much does your office pay interns? If I was a low-paid summer intern and there was free milk at the office, yeah, I’d use it!

    • Never too many shoes...

      My office has a sign on the fridge specifically stating that milk is for tea and coffee and not for cereal or smoothies. We cannot be the only ones right?

      • Linda from HR

        I guess it’s fair if they’re only able to supply enough for everyone to use a little each day, so everyone’s sufficiently caffeinated. It just seems like a silly thing to police among people. At least your office clarifies it on the sign so people know, because I don’t think you can expect people to “just know” the milk is only for coffee.

  13. Anonymous

    Given that people very rarely wear suits, I would not wear one. Personally, I would go with a sheath dress and a non-matching blazer. The black dress with a red blazer sounds good or the navy and cream.

  14. KateMiddletown

    Does anyone use Hubble for contacts? I am so sick of reinventing the wheel everytime I order (which is admittedly every 2 years or so.) I used to use Vision Direct since they had the best discounts but looks like they’ve gotten bought up. I wear my glasses more frequently now, but I like my options.

    • JS

      They had a 30 day free trial and I haaaated them. They got so dry by the end of the day I had to remove them hours earlier than any other brand. But, they were free so if they still have that promotion maybe give them a try?

      1 800 contacts has been my go to recently for Biotrue Onedays. They offer lots of coupons and discounts on multiple boxes, and they’re on ebates.

    • TorontoNewbie

      They were awful. They use an older style of contact, they made my eyes super dry, and it’s not really a free trial – they tried to pretend I’d signed up for a year and kept charging my credit card. I had to get visa involved for fraud. Do not recommend.

      • anon a mouse

        And they will price match anything else you find, including Costco. Worth the 10 minutes to online-chat with a customer service rep.

    • contacts

      Just reordered my contacts…. Acuvue Trueye
      Costco was $66/box (90 days/one eye) where all of the other retailers I looked at were between $82-86/box.
      I ordered on the weekend and had them by Wednesday.

  15. Costumes

    Realize it’s early, but a fun topic…what’s everyone’s favorite work-appropriate Halloween costumes?

    • Torin

      I’m whatever the Halloween version of a grinch is. I hate being forced to dress up in a costume for work.

      • Anonymous

        Ok, so what is even the point of replying to this comment? It’s not even remotely about anybody forcing you to dress up. It’s not answering OP’s question. Don’t you think there’s enough negativity in the world? Keep it to yourself.

        • Linda from HR

          Right? It stinks being “forced” (i.e. coerced with some BS about being a team player) to dress up for Halloween when you don’t want to be, or worse, having to participate in a really stupid group costume and not having the option of wearing what *you* want, but some people – yes, even mature, responsible adults – enjoy wearing costumes and like to take advantage of the option to wear one to work on Halloween.

          Personally, I can’t think about Halloween right now, but one really easy costume is a Hogwarts robe, plastic wand, and whatever else you may need or want to portray a specific character from the series. The robe is super comfy and warm!

    • Corporate Witch

      I think I got this idea here from a similar thread a while back, but I always do all black with a witch hat. Witch hat goes on desk as evidence that I’m “participating,” holiday gives me an excuse to wear head to toe black without caring how harsh it looks on me. I used to have dangly spiderweb earrings to wear with this ensemble, but they’ve disappeared over the years.

    • Anonymous

      One of my old coworkers always won the costume contest every year by picking something clever and using thoughtful details to seal the deal. Once she was Lisa Simpson; in 2016, she was Hillary Clinton.

    • Anon

      Casual work place: Rosie the Riveter – Jeans and plaid shirt (or jeans with different color chambray) with sleeves rolled up, red bandana or thick headband, red lipstick, call it a day.

      Business Casual to Formal – Black cat ears or headband with cat ears with a black outfit and Halloween themed earrings. You’re in the spirit but put in the minimal amount of effort.

      I think of this like Ugly Christmas Sweater – Pick up anything with a deer, a tree, snowflakes, or vaguely winter themed and go about your day.

    • MagicUnicorn

      Dark rimmed glasses, thinner white button-front shirt with a Superman logo t-shirt underneath.

      That, or getting a group to all dress like one of the C-suite execs (this only works if there is one with a good sense of humor and a quirky-enough dress habit).

      • Rainbow Hair

        Oh I like the Superman idea!

        Last year we all dressed up as the head of our department. That was fun.

      • ANon

        I went for a 70’s look last year (crocheted vest, bell bottom jeans, kind of funky belt), but apparently it was a little too close to my regular style (boot cut jeans, though… never bell bottoms!). Nobody noticed.

    • Horse Crazy

      This year, I’m either going to be Morticia Addams or Carmen Sandiego. Haven’t decided yet.

    • Anon

      I was Janet Yellen last year. Was super easy with a regular suit and a white bob wig.

      This year I shall go as Maxine “Reclaiming My Time” Waters. Just need pearls, my black glasses and a beautiful black lace dress. I am not AA but I don’t think that really matters does it? I am also not Caucasian so… there’s that too.

      • Anonymous

        Last year I wore a white pantsuit and carried a plastic wineglass and told everyone I was Shattered Dreams. This year I’m doing Hidden Figures — 60s dress and a slide rule.

  16. Kate

    I have no idea what to wear for an event this Friday. My husband’s grad school is having an orientation dinner for students and their SOs at a private club (which I think is an odd choice, considering that it was founded in the 19th century and surely was only open to white men, but anyway), and the dress code for the dinner is “dress attire” (??) and “jacket required.” I’ve been googling but am still confused about what “jacket required” translates to for women. I work from home and wear jeans every day. I have some nice tailored pants I could wear, but the dressy tops I have are sleeveless, and I’m not sure if sleeveless would be OK (plus they’re mostly low-cut). The dresses I have are either sweater dresses (which, summer) or casual dresses (like, tie dye) or black-tie-event dresses. My only option in my closet is a navy, sleeveless, low(ish)-cut, knee-length dress with wide straps, from Anthropologie — jersey, maybe (too lazy to go get it). It has kind of a knot/twist in the middle. I know this is not a big deal but I don’t want to stick out when I’m meeting these people.

  17. Marshmallow

    I read a book review in NYT today that genuinely surprised me– I had no idea “The American Plan” ever existed. Has anyone else heard of this? I haven’t read the book yet, obviously, but it sounds fascinating and also horrifying. Nonfiction study of a government program forcing exams on women of suspected, er, “loose morals” and resulting in forced jailing and detention. Link to follow but the title of the book is “The Trials of Nina McCall.” Started out as an undergrad thesis and the author is current a law student at (of course!) Yale.

  18. Horse Crazy

    I’m picking my mom up at SFO on a Sunday, and I want to leave myself a ton of time because last time I picked her up, I was late. So I’d like to get there really early and get some food – can anyone recommend a restaurant within 10ish minutes of SFO? I’m coming from Santa Cruz.

    • Scarlett

      There is really nothing that close, your best bet would be to stop in Burlingame and still give yourself about 30 minutes to get to the airport from there. There’s a bunch of places to get breakfast there, nothing amazing but serviceable and it’s nice to walk around.

    • SFedits

      Maverick Jack’s in Burlingame! It’s on Broadway in Burlingame, right at the train station so very close to freeway.

    • Anonymous

      thai stick is in millbrae and awesomeeeee. get the fried cod dish (dont remember the full name).

    • Anon

      Taqueria Celaya in South San Francisco is really good – probs 10-15 mins from SFO. Honestly though, my go-to SFO stop is the In-N-Out on Millbrae Ave.

    • Anonymous

      I’m pretty sure there’s an In-N-Out nearby, right? I’m half joking, but also I don’t know of anything else close to the airport.

      • SFedits

        In and Out in Millbrae, just off the freeway (Millbrae Ave Exit); there’s a Panera in the same complex, I think.

      • Anonymous

        +1 I always go to the Millbrae In-N-Out before picking people up at SFO. There’s very slim pickings right near the airport.

        • Horse Crazy

          Ugh I know! I wouldn’t mind In-N-Out honestly, since we are cursed with not having one in Santa Cruz :(

    • Nerfmobile

      Max’s in Burlingame (now billed as “Original Max’s” if you want to google it).

  19. Anonymous

    Meeting with an old mentor/friend tonight for drinks. She’s in her early 40s, biglaw partner for 5 years at my old firm. I left 3 years ago and am miserable in my new job. Miserable enough that I don’t even want to discuss it and bring down the whole night, and because we’re friends, we can totally fill up 2 hours talking life, family etc without talking career goals. But part of me is like we only get together 1-3 times a year if we’re lucky, is it a missed opportunity to not talk about work/next steps at all. FWIW going back to the old firm isn’t an option and she’s more of a service partner without her own clients, so it’s not like she can just say – oh x client is looking for in house counsel.

    • Anonymous

      Forgot to ask the question – how would you handle? Bring up work and if so how – I don’t want to ruin her night or mine with a vent session.

    • Anonymous

      I would mention it briefly and see what she has to say. Even if she can’t help you directly find a job, her insight may be helpful.

      If I were you, I would say that you’re not finding your job to be a good fit (for whatever reasons, culture/environment, type of work etc.) and you’re keeping your eyes out for new opportunities and go from there.

      Don’t let yourself vent to her but definitely mention it.

    • anon a mouse

      Mention that you are unhappy and starting to think about next steps, and then maybe suggest that you follow up with an email or another meeting soon? That way you put it on her radar without monopolizing the evening.

    • Anon

      Yeah, I would not vent/complain but I would let her know you’re looking. She might have leads for you and you might want a recommendation. But more than that I think would be too much.

    • Rainbow Hair

      I think you can do it breezily. She says “how’s work going?” You can say “oh actually I’m looking for next steps right now!”

  20. Anonymous

    A few months ago I went to a facialist that has amazing reviews. She added me on linkedin recently and I noticed she’s an Herbalife seller. Not sure if I missed this or if its new. Her website has an entire section dedicated to hawking Herbalife goods. To me getting involved in an MLM shows extremely poor judgment and ruins her credibility as a professional and I don’t plan on returning now. (Yes, its just a facial, but I am skincare obsessed). Overreacting or reasonable?

    • anon

      Way overreacting, unless she’s annoying you by continuing to try to sell you products after you declined once politely.

    • Anonymous

      Shrug – has she tried to sell you anything? Vs just you finding out from her available information? If she hasn’t pushed anything on you, then it seems like an overreaction.

    • too much

      overreacting. No love for MLM shilling from me, but she’s just trying to make a buck. if she starts to shill, I’d shut it down hard.

    • givemyregards

      At the end of the day, it’s your money and you get to decide where to spend it, so if you don’t want to go back, don’t. But to me this would be an overreaction. I’m not asking my facialist to be my nutritionist or financial planner, and I don’t see how selling supplements would impact her ability to clean out my pores. But if you’re going to be sitting there during a facial judging her and cringing, then I think for her sake (and yours) I’d go somewhere else.

    • Anon

      Overreacting. Unless she is crushing the pills, mixing them with liquid and putting them on your face, why do you care? Your facials have nothing to do with her selling Herbalife – you aren’t her boss where across the board judgment may matter, you’re a customer for one specific service. She’s not doing something morally reprehensible like refusing services to people of a certain religion, sex, or ethnicity, she’s selling supplements – chill out.

    • Lana Del Raygun

      A lot of otherwise sensible people have a weird blind spot about MLMs and nutrition woo. Unless she starts trying to sell to you (or use these products on your face) I would let it go.

    • Clementine

      I am not a fan of MLMs. I hate getting hawked by people when I’m visiting social media or having those fake ‘My life is AMAZING thanks to this nonsense that I’m trying to sell you for $$$’ posts.

      That being said, I kind of look at it as I give you one pass to ask me and then you can respect my choice to say, ‘no thank you. I’m not interested and will never be.’ I don’t say, ‘Not today.’ , I say, ‘This product is not for me but I wish you all the best.’ After that, I say ‘No’ and then block them.

      I do the same with people who sell stuff on the side with MLMs. My hairdresser also sells oils. She has some nice aromatherapy going on when I get my hair done and when I complimented it, she said, ‘Oh yeah, it’s blah blah and blah blah. If you ever want some, I also sell MLM oils.’ I said no thanks, I buy my oils at the co-op (true) and she said, ‘Cool!’ and 2 years later she’s never mentioned it again.

      Long winded way of saying, I wouldn’t make it a problem unless she does.

    • Anonymous

      Overreaction. How does her judgment/lack of it regarding MLM affect her skill as a facialist?

    • Anonymous

      IMO, overreacting, but you have the right to choose any criteria you want for services you’re paying for. Personally, I don’t like MLMs either, but it doesn’t change my perception of someone’s ability to professionalism in another area of life.

    • Anonymous

      Overreaction. Did she try to sell you products? If no then complete overreaction. If I stopped using service providers simply because I don’t agree with one aspect of their life, I’d be s*it out of service providers.

    • anon

      Way overreacting. I have no love AT ALL for MLMs, but consider also that the people who are involved with them who are truly showing extremely poor judgment are those who give up their careers for them or depend on them for financial support. Doesn’t sound like that’s what this woman is doing, because she clearly has a profession. If a nurse friend was selling Rodan and Fields in her spare time because she used it and has some people who buy from her, would you say that she’s showing extremely bad judgment and likely not competent to be a nurse?

  21. Tailoring Terms

    I have a question about tailoring men’s slacks. DH has an unusual forward slant to his hips, and everything (literally everything except denim) becomes an instant wedgie. When we shopped for a wedding suit, the charming sales lady and I were able to discuss it bluntly, while standing behind him. She said the slacks just needed to be taken in a little at the sides. Wedding suit still fits great, years later, not too tight, no wedgie.

    But, next time he went suit shopping, he asked them to take the slacks in a little at the sides, and ended up ripping out the seat in court. Both pairs, almost brand new. I mean, we’ve all been humiliated at work, I’ve actually done exactly the same thing, but it’s awful.

    So, he’s visiting the city with the better tailoring. But is there a term for the fact that he doesn’t want them tighter, he just wants them to not ride up his butt?

    • anon

      I have no idea about this. But I’d just take the wedding suit pants with him so the tailor could see what was done to them, and how they fit him.

    • Anonymous

      Where did the ones rip – at the center back seam? in the fabric? Maybe the back center seam just needed to be reinforced?

      Have him bring in the wedding suit pants and say “I like the ways these fit. I want my new pants to fit like this”. Otherwise, just describe the wedgie issue and how the fix happened the first time. It could be that the sales lady said one thing and the tailor did something else.

      • OP

        I think that’s a good idea about taking the wedding slacks in–there probably are marks in the seams and stuff. Thanks

    • Anonymous

      He’s a big boy. He can explain to the nice lady how his butt is too big. Stop treating him like a 5 year old.

      • OP

        Stop being a jerk. I talk to women about tailoring, which is a resource he doesn’t have access to. And it’s actually a body alignment issue, not size. But you are really demonstrating my point about how our society really sees clothing size on a one-dimensional axis–from “good” to “bad”.

        • ANON

          Sure, but this is still something an adult can figure out himself. Does he not have internet access?

      • Anonymous

        Wow, what a treat you must be IRL. You’ve never asked a friend or BF for advise? Or helped another human?

    • lawsuited

      I don’t know if there’s a term for it, but he’s best of explaining the concern specifically and suggesting taking in the sides as a fix that has worked before while being open to whatever advice the tailor might have for him. The cut of men’s suiting has changed pretty significantly in the last 5 years, so the pants of his wedding suit may have been cut very differently from the pants he is buying these days.

    • Anonymous

      I don’t know, but has your husband ever visited a PT for pelvic tilt issues? It seems severe if it’s affecting the way his clothing fits him.

      • Anonymous

        Yeah…he actually had spinal surgery earlier this year. It’s pretty extreme. That’s a whole ‘nother story though. Thank you for the suggestion.

    • MLady

      It sounds like he needs to add more front horizon length from the center seam zipper to the side pockets. Also, if he can get away with it, fabrics with some technical stretch (think a little % of poly/spendex mixed in with wool- BR does this), might be a bit more accommodating.

      Can you compare the wedding pants and his regular “wedgie” pants in measurements for this and see if this is it. That way you can tell tailor what he needs/what to look out for.

  22. SFedits

    DC recommendations needed, please, for custom window treatment place for a condo with some rooms with very large windows? Probably looking for shades that can easily be rolled up or down, or some other “modern” look. This is for 14th St & W St NW area. Thank you so much for your help!

    • Lana Del Raygun

      A casual dress and boat shoes or sneakers, or jeans and a cute top (not a Going Out Top, more like a nice t-shirt with fun stripes).

    • Senior Attorney

      Jeans, heels, cute top. It’s summer so maybe white jeans.

      Or cute maxi dress.

    • Anonymous

      I’d wear a little black dress. At work, it would be with a blazer/jardigan etc.. Then in the evening,take off the blazer, and add some funky jewelry and good shoes.

    • artist

      Speaking as an artist who shows at gallery hop in my city and loves to people watch : look as cool as possible.

  24. Question of the day

    When you need a new item(s) of clothing, do you tend to splurge on the item you love and will wear for years, or save and purchase a similar style at a more affordable price point? This is my constant battle between just buying the item(s) I want from MMLF and getting something similar at Uniqlo, Ann Taylor, Nordstrom Rack, Macys, etc

    • Lana Del Raygun

      I’m also curious how people make this decision! I’ve been consciously not “investing” in clothes for a while because I was in school and didn’t know how my style and needs would change after graduation. Things like shoes and coats I’m theoretically more willing to shell out for, but when I spend more on shoes they don’t really seem to last longer (sole exception: real Chuck Taylors last longer, and are regularly at TJ Maxx for like $25).

    • Clementine

      I look at cost per wear.

      I always splurge on br@s and buy good (not necessarily super expensive but well made all natural materials that can be repaired by a cobbler) shoes. I never regret either of those purchases.

      For trendy items that I’m not sure how often I’ll wear, I go with the less expensive version. Examples of this are anything floral, currently trendy colors, bright colored suits.

      For items that I don’t question I’ll wear a million times (e.g., the replacement of a beloved black sheath dress, a solid navy pencil skirt that I know I’ll wear all the time), I go with the one I actually want.

    • Baconpancakes

      Depends on the piece. My MM LaFleur Annie is down to $18 per wear, and it still looks new, so I’d say it was worth it. For things with particular stretch or cut, go with more expensive. For more basic (Banana Republic boxy rayon top similar to the Didion top), go with the cheaper one.

    • SC

      Maybe in the middle? MMLF is too pricy for me, but I buy from Ann Taylor, Nordstrom, Talbots, etc, and wear those things for about 3 years (usually, once per week or two) before they look worn out.

    • Linda from HR

      Part of it depends on my current financial situation. If I’m trying to tackle some accumulated debt, or I recently had a big expense, or there’s something coming up I want to save for like a trip or a move, I’ll probably want to save even if it’s a basic staple like a black blazer. It may also depend on what else I need at the time. If I just need the one dress I might splurge a little, but my wardrobe ugrades tend to come in waves, and usually I want to get a few things at one time, which means wanting to save on each thing.

    • Marshmallow

      Depends what it is but I’ve been trying hard to buy less quantity, more quality. I tend not to wear very trendy clothes anyway and I’d just rather have nice silk tees and MMLF dresses that will last a few years rather than replace stuff every season. But that’s also a function of my job– I’m often working on the weekend so I have very little reason to wear trendy or “going out” stuff.

      Random trendy thing I’m glad I invested in: blush pink culottes. I’ve worn them to a bunch of showers and daytime parties over the last couple of years and always get compliments, and it’s so easy to pair with a white tee shirt and look like I thought about my outfit.

    • Anonymous

      I used to buy more expensive clothing, but I’ve noticed that my preferences, styles, and fit change so much that it was not worth it – regardless of whether it is a middle of the road or expensive brand, I never seem to get more than 3-4 years of use. Now, I’m thinking about getting pregnant in the next few years and have no idea what shape my body will take, so I’ve been avoiding buying more expensive “investment” pieces

      • Anon

        My main issue is that i am clumsy and spill stuff on my clothes and sometimes the stains don’t come off. This means that buying very expensive items isn’t really worth it for me. I do try to stay away from poor quality clothing and buy in the mid-range but make sure the items can be washed easily and aren’t so fragile that i can’t use stain removers.

    • givemyregards

      I don’t know how helpful this is, but I tend to just get whichever I *really* want, because to me spending $200 on something I love and wear all the time is a better deal than $50 on something I feel meh about and get rid of in a year. I have not found that more expensive clothing options generally last that much longer (or stay in style that much longer), but as Lana Del Raygun points out, it depends on the item.

      Having said that! Online shopping makes this wayyyy harder for me than shopping in real life. In stores, I tend to fall in love with $20 and $120 items equally as often. But online, more expensive options tend to look better (or seem better b/c of brand recognition, web site quality, etc.) and then once they’re home, my decision making is “do I dislike it enough to return it?” vs. “do I like it enough to bring it home?” For this reason, I tend to only buy cheaper things online and save the big purchases for when I’m in an actual store.

      I also have a slightly different calculus for work clothes because they need to be workhorses, so I prioritize comfort and fitting perfectly over everything else.

    • Anon

      Depends on what kind of clothing. For skirts, dresses, or suit type separates I buy the good stuff. I also buy good shoes.

      For tops tops to wear with this stuff I tend not to go expensive, and I buy a lot of Lucky Brand. I get tired of the tops and like to demote them to weekend wear or donate them after a year or two.

      I also buy things from eBay in the top quality brands once I know my size in a particular style.

      • Anonymous

        I start out low and then go high — so if I need a new suit I start at Talbots then work my way up price points until I find what I need, stopping at Lafayette 148. That way I feel like I only spent because I really needed to, but everything is of decent enough quality to last. For shoes I start at Cole Haan and stop at Stuart Weitzman because more spendy shoes are made of really soft leather that shreds when subjected to my travel schedule, and less spendy shoes don’t last as long.

  25. DC Shades

    DC question – can anyone suggest a custom shade place for a condo with large windows in the 14th and W St area (NW)?

  26. Small Firm Newbie

    I’m considering joining a small boutique law firm. There would be 5 other lawyers and approximately 10 or so support staff. I’ve never worked in a small firm before. Any advice on things to look out for and questions to ask during an interview?

    • boutique lawyer

      Two suggestions:

      Ask how they describe the office culture. “Like a family” is not necessarily a good thing. Families can be dysfunctional.

      Find out who among the support staff runs the office.

    • Torin

      I worked at a small firm when I was a baby lawyer. It imploded when work got slow and partners started pointing fingers at each other claiming they weren’t doing enough client development. Frankly, none of them were doing enough. I don’t know what the best way to ask this or figure it out is but I would want to know about the stability of their client base and what their strategies are for bringing in new business.

    • Senior Attorney

      Also find out how long people stay. Some small firms are revolving doors.

      • Anon

        +1 my first job was at a small firm, and I found out after I started that was the 14th new associate within the calendar year. It took me only a couple days to understand why the place was a revolving door. Luckily I was only there for a few months before I got an offer elsewhere but those months were truly miserable.

        Proceed with caution and try to do your homework.

    • Anonymous

      How is work distributed? Are you to be bringing in your own clients? If you’d be joining as an associate, what is the partnership process and have they ever used it before? (Or did all 5 start the firm together as partners?) Billables? What are other publicity /marketing responsibilities and expectations- how many hours/month can you expect to spend presenting cles, networking, etc? I spent 8 years at a small boutique (7 as associate, 1 as partner before making some major life changes and cross country move). Huge expectations for marketing that grew every year. How is firm decision making done?

  27. Anon

    I hope this question doesn’t attract the stone-like types who live under a bridge.

    Where are good places to get lingerie for a honeymoon? I’m not a fan of the overly cute sold at VS (I do not want to wear, and I doubt FH wants to see me in, something with “bride” written across the bum). Looking for classic but not completely unaffordable.

    • Anon

      La Perla for high end.

      Natori for medium.

      Soma intimates has some really good approximations of the Natori at lower prices.

      I’d go for a lace trimmed chemise and a kimono style luxurious robe.

    • Kk

      Check out Journelle- wide variety of prices and styles. If you’re in Chicago or NY, their stores are also excellent.

    • Anon

      I got my favorite honeymoon pieces from Dillard’s. But I also am a huge fan of Frederick’s pieces as well.

    • anonym-mouse

      journelle has a good size, price, and brand range, and the style leans sophisticated rather than VS-style se*y/cute. They have brick and mortar stores in a few lucky cities.

    • Anon

      I would go to Nordstrom or better department store and sample brands. If you online shop, I agree Natori website and its related brands is really good, although I think their stuff runs large. Personally, I was fine with cheap and outrageous for honeymoon (I was never going to want to wear white regularly, preferring black for everyday, so I bought just a few “bride” things from Kohls.) My everyday lingerie is much better quality than what I bought for honeymoon. To me, honeymoon lingeri is a lot like a Halloween costume – I dont’ want to be too trashy, but I don’t kid myself I’ll wear it long term, if that makes sense.

    • nutella

      Try bhldn – really pretty romantic stuff. I got some Flora Nikrooz there that was just so, so pretty (and not itchy or uncomfortable either). They also sell it at N0r ds+r0m but I think bhldn curates there inventory nicely.

    • LAJen

      I second FigLeaves. I also like Asos a lot. Both are great for everyone, but especially if you are an unusual size.

  30. MBAFishOutOfWater

    Has anyone else experienced that therapists (even those that only accept private pay) don’t call new patients back? I’m trying to set up marriage counseling for me and my husband and having a heck of a time getting ANYONE to call me back.

    • Anonymous

      Yes. I assume it meant they weren’t actually taking patients and were therefore not really paying a lot of attention to “unknown numbers” in their voicemail.

    • Anonymous

      its so hard! hang in there- it difficult to work up the nerve to reach out for help and that does make it even harder. we really had to search for ours!

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