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Updated: Nov 1, 2018 336 Comments · by

Tuesday’s TPS Report: A-Line Pleat-Godet Skirt

The Personal Shopper (TPS)

This post may contain affiliate links and Corporette® may earn commissions for purchases made through links in this post. As an Amazon Associate, I earn from qualifying purchases.

Our daily TPS reports suggest one piece of work-appropriate attire in a range of prices. Lafayette 148 New York A-Line Pleat-Godet Skirt I really like this A-line pleat skirt from Lafayette 148 New York. Love the way the pleat seems so daring if you look at it one way (although it's a far cry from Angelina at the Oscars), yet conservative if you look at it another way. The muted color is the perfect counterpart for this kind of duality — I'd keep the rest of the outfit fairly neutral, as well. It was $348, but is now marked to $189 at Last Call by Neiman Marcus (and if you hurry, up until March 13th at 8 AM CT, you can still get an extra 25% off the skirt, bringing it down to $147 or so. Nice!)  Lafayette 148 New York A-Line Pleat-Godet Skirt Seen a great piece you'd like to recommend? Please e-mail tps@corporette.com. (L-2)

Sales of note for 9.19.24

  • Nordstrom – Beauty deals through September, and cardmembers earn 3x the points (ends 9/22)
  • Ann Taylor – Extra 30% off sale
  • Banana Republic Factory – 50% off everything + extra 20% off
  • Boden – 15% off new styles
  • Eloquii – Extra 50% off sale
  • J.Crew – 50% off select styles — and 9/19 only, 50% off the cashmere wrap
  • J.Crew Factory – Up to 60% off everything + 50% off sale with code
  • Lo & Sons – Warehouse sale, up to 70% off
  • M.M.LaFleur – Save 25% sitewide
  • Neiman Marcus – Friends & Family 25% off
  • Rag & Bone – Friends & Family 25% off sitewide
  • Spanx – Lots of workwear on sale, some up to 70% off
  • Talbots – Anniversary event, 25% off your entire purchase — Free shipping, no minimum, 9/19 only
  • Target – Car-seat trade-in event through 9/28 — bring in an old car seat to get a 20% discount on other baby/toddler stuff.
  • Tuckernuck – Friends & Family Sale – get 20%-30% off orders (ends 9/19).
  • White House Black Market – 40% off select styles

And some of our latest threadjacks here at Corporette (reader questions and commentary) — see more here!

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About Kat

Kat Griffin is the founder, publisher, and editor-in-chief of Corporette. You can read more about her here.

Comments

  1. Anonymous

    [first time threadjacker, seeking advice]

    Lets say as a 2L you are traveling to a different state for a summer internship with a solo practitioner. The internship is about 2 days a week, unpaid, and you are also attempting to get a second internship/job while you are in that state for the summer (the solo practitioner is aware and encourages getting a second gig). The first internship was originally agreed upon as unpaid but now the solo practitioner has offered to pay for meals, travel, etc.

    This is the first time I have ever been offered money for an internship (oh hey bad economy) so pardon me if this all seems a bit obvious to everyone else in the hive…

    What is reasonable (or unreasonable) for me to ask him to pay for? I am traveling via plane (I have not yet purchased a ticket) and I plan to sublet an apartment for the summer. There are also the costs of public transportation (since I don’t drive) and food is always expensive. All of of those costs I expected and thus budgeted into my account and am able to pay for. I am a poor law student and would love monetary support but it seems awkward for him to reimburse me when he only wants me to come in and work for him at most 2 days a week (although I will probably also do some work for him on the weekend/evenings out of the office).

    Thoughts/suggestions/advice? I am aware of Nice Girls Don’t Get Corner Office but have not yet read it. Am I falling prey to being a ‘nice’ girl?

    • Kanon

      Ask for airfare reimbursement and then a per diem for each day that you work (estimate how much your meal/commute will cost, then round off). Most employers would prefer to know what their total cost will be, and this will give the solo a clean amount before you start.

      • Anonymous

        Yes, I agree. I’d suggest basing the per diem on the daily meals and incidentals CONUS rate established by the federal government. Rates are posted at http://www.gsa.gov/portal/category/21287. That’s a lot simpler than reimbursing you for each meal and train ticket you buy. I also agree that it’s reasonable for him to pay for your airfare.

        It’s definitely reasonable to ask for a per diem and travel expenses. Don’t feel bad about it. If he says he can’t afford it, then try to negotiate for lunch + incidentals as established by the CONUS rate breakdown.

    • Nevadan

      It’s not just that nice girls don’t get corner office. I would take it a step further – nice girls do not work two days a week for no pay. What kind of internship is that? I think someone is playing aroungd with you. I once had a law intern for several months – no pay. It was a special situation – she was a relative of a relative of my husband’s and was trying to decide whether to go to law school. (She did.) She was wealthy. She happened to live right nearby. She worked beside me five days a week and I involved her in every activity of the law office. I gave her a super education. it took a lot of my time.

      Your situation sound very different from – and less favorable than – what I am describing!

      • rosie

        I don’t really see not getting paid in this situation either. My SO worked for a small firm (1-2 attorneys) after law school, pre-bar admission in the relevant state. His boss billed him out as a paralegal and paid him by the hour.

        Will your boss be billing your time? If so, I would expect to get an hourly rate. If not, I think a stipend for the the time you work for him plus airfare would be about right.

      • momentsofabsurdity

        Agreed. You should be getting paid.

        That being said, many of my friends took unpaid internships. A lot of them got GREAT experience. I was fortunate enough (or unlucky enough) that I *couldn’t* take an unpaid internship, so all my internships were paid.

        If you are contributing something of value to the company, a for profit company should at least be able to kick in minimum wage for you. That being said, I understand it’s a poor economy and sometimes, you have to take what you can get. I think you should definitely ask for a standard per-diem rate for your two days per week, though having him reimburse your 7 day a week lodging for a two day a week commitment seems like too much.

      • Lynnet

        Both of my internships after 1L year were unpaid (although one of them surprised me with a small honorarium at the end of the summer). The economy was bad and if I didn’t do an unpaid internship I was going to either have to go into more debt to take summer classes or work at a completely non law related job for the summer.

          • Lynnet

            One was for a judge, one was for a firm. Guess which one actually gave me valuable experience and which one gave me hours of memories of listening to the bailiffs tell old war stories.

      • Hel-lo

        I think an unpaid internship is fine, if that’s what you want to do. I did plenty of them in law school and college and they were worth it to me.

        Regarding his offer, you might want to ask for airfare, and then a per diem (like a few hundred dollars for every day that you work). The idea of a per diem is that it covers meals and transportation and all your expenses for that day. If he wants to cover your rent, that would be awesome, too.

        This is a negotiation. So I’d send him a list of all your expected expenses, and then let him choose what to cover. If he gives you more than you’d expect, then awesome.

    • Emily I

      If you are not getting pay, can you work something about to get law school credit? Something like an externship? Of course, the trade off would be that you’d not only not be getting paid, but you would also have to pay for the credit hours. On the other hand, you’d be paying for credit hours at some point anyway. Best of both worlds would be to get credit and some money. (I did an internship in college where I got an hourly rate and credit hours.)

      • Lynnet

        At my school you couldn’t get credits if you were getting paid, and you had to pay for full time for all three years of law school anyway, so the only advantage of getting credits for your unpaid summer internship was that you could take fewer classes your last year. It was incredibly expensive, as well.

      • eaopm3

        This might only be an option if the internship is considered a public interest or government internship. (Those were the rules for getting credit hours when I was in law school, anyway.) Just wanted to make the OP aware of that issue.

    • KS

      Let me get this right: you’re paying for airfare to another state, subletting an apartment for the summer, taking on food and transportation expenses, all in order to intern two days a week without pay for a solo practitioner? What are we missing here? Is this person famous? The leader in his field, which is a field you want to go into? Or are you moving closer to home, or to a boyfriend, but not close enough to live with your family/boyfriend? Otherwise, couldn’t you find something more full-time, closer to home, even if it’s also unpaid?

      • Anonymous

        It’s a state that I plan to take the bar/practice in (for various personal reasons) and it is an area of law that I am deeply interested in. My law school doesn’t have a lot of recognition in that state so I am hoping to use this summer to network and make connections in that city.

        • PM

          I think you’re doing great to have figured out a way to get some experience in the location and area of law where you want to practice. I don’t think it’s unusual to be doing this kind of thing unpaid, and now you have good advice from the hive about what is appropriate to ask for in terms of per diem.

          People seem to be appalled that you would have to do this unpaid, but I would say you are really doing this to make yourself a strong job candidate. You’re talking about spending maybe 250 hours working toward a really important goal — a good job after graduation.

          I don’t want you to get taken advantage of, though, so be sure to stick to your own cap of two days a week or 20 hours or whatever. If you stay consistent on that from the first day, it will prevent the expectation that you are there at the practitioner’s beck and call.

          • Anonymous

            This. I’ve worked practically every day of my life since age 16 and Mom and Dad haven’t underwritten anything since then. I understand why you are taking the unpaid internship. That said, protect yourself. If this solo will bill you out, you should get a cut. Don’t work more than the agreement. Get a generic written letter of reference and a linked-in reference on your profile from the solo before you leave. Have solo network, network, network with you in tow so that you meet potential employers. (There are lunches, CLEs, etc. to attend.).

        • Anonymous

          I continue to be baffled at the number of new lawyers flooding the market. We really do need to encourage more women to go into STEM.

          • Gail the Goldfish

            oh, if I could do it all over again, I would… But sadly, law school debt is so high that I’ll never be able to afford that PhD in genetics I really think I should have gotten instead.

          • karenpadi

            As a woman who went into STEM and then escaped to law, this is a big issue that needs more than just “encouragement.” We had a thread on this a few months/a year ago.

          • PollyD

            As someone with a STEM PhD, I have some misgivings about blindly encouraging people to go into these fields Finding academic positions is incredibly difficult, most pharmaceutical companies are cutting their R&D components, and given budget problems at the state level, teaching, even in these fields, is no sure thing. I don’t know so much about the engineering world, maybe things are different there. That said, I do think we need to encourage more scientific and mathematic literacy. Even if most people never work as scientists, there are a lot of important issues we are facing or will be facing that require good scientific literacy (global climate change instantly comes to mind).

            Also, anyone contemplating getting a PhD in a hard science – do not pay for it. Good programs provide tuition waivers and stipends. In my field (a biological science) getting a PhD takes about 5 years, then you have anywhere from 3-8 years as a postdoc at a fairly low salary. Then comes the hunt for an academic position or a job in industry. I’m sure people do take out loans to get a PhD, but I can’t imagine how difficult it would be to pay them back.

          • PharmaGirl

            I have a STEM PhD and would not actively encourage anyone to do the same. I’ll just leave it at that, unless someone wants to discuss in more detail.

          • anon

            PharmaGirl,

            Actually, I’d love to hear more about what degree you have and why you wouldn’t encourage anyone else to go STEM. I bet you’ve got something interesting to contribute that most of us here in the law/business sector might not.

          • Anonymous

            As someone who went to law school over a science PhD that would have been fully paid, I echo PollyD’s thoughts. I don’t regret not getting a STEM degree, not even a little bit. I also bristle a bit when someone says “I can’t do math.”. To me, that is like saying “I can’t read.” Not sure why some are OK with the former, but not the latter. So yes on basic financial and mathematical literacy, but STEM grad degrees are not for everyone (that market is flooded too).

          • PharmaGirl

            Anon:

            Very long story short, 7 years of dead-end research pretty much killed any desire I had to stay in academia. I feel very lucky to have found my niche position in pharma and know that few graduates from my alma mater are doing as well as I am, financially and professionally. It’s a tough path, often with no support or mentoring once you go the non-academic route. I have done well mostly because of my personality and ability to think quickly, not because I have the science smarts.

            Former classmates who have stayed in academia are doing multiple post doctoral fellowships and struggling to find faculty positions. The funding is getting more difficult to obtain for some areas of research and there aren’t enough faculty positions to support the number of graduates.

            My degree is in microbiology so my experience might not compare to someone pursuing an engineerine. That said, I don’t ‘use’ my degree at this point. I work in a completely unrelated field from my thesis research.

          • Cajunqueen

            To PharmaGirl:
            My high-school-junior daughter wants to major in microbiology because she is interested in genetics. It sounds like there are job issues in that field, too, but at least it’s a STEM major and not music or English literature. Can you recommend any colleges/universities for her to apply to — non-Ivy League and east of the Mississippi?

          • Lynnet

            Cajunqueen:

            You might encourage her toward biomedical engineering instead. One of my closest friends is having a lot of success working in genetics in that field (getting his Phd), and all of my other friends with degrees in that field are doing really well.

            If she’s interested, I can see if he’d be willing to talk to her about the field. Email me at Lynnet85@yahoo.com if you/she are interested.

          • PharmaGirl

            If she’s looking at genetics for a future career, I would recommend majoring in biotechnology (which is what I did, at Rochester Institute of Technology) or molecular biology. I don’t know specific schools these days as I went to college in 1994 when the options for this major were still very limited. I could do some research for you if you want. Definitely consider the Boston area for access to potential internship opportunities at the many labs in that area. Practical lab experience is critical.

            There is not much upward mobility without a PhD in the sciences so that would need to be a consideration in the future.

          • PharmaGirl

            I was accepted at U of R as well but they only had a certificate program for biotech and I did not feel that was focused enough for me.

    • EmpLawyer

      If you are traveling to another state for the summer – are you either at a private law school, or a long-term resident of the state in which your law school sits? Be careful that if you are at a state school, you don’t lose the right to in-state tuition (which would make an unpaid internship very very expensive!!)

      Is there any way you can volunteer in your current state/city?

  2. Twilight Zone

    Early threadjack- I am in the process of looking for a new job. My main obstacle in interviews is that my job is dysfunctional in a lot of ways. We don’t have a case management system/central client file, nothing is routine, and the type of hearings I do are a kind of hybrid that most people have trouble understanding. I have this feeling that I come off as totally crazy when I try to explain this to potential future employers. I try to emphasize the fact that I would be able to adapt easily to any situation given my current workplace, but I’m not sure how competent I seem when it takes a lot of explanation just to answer any given question.

    Anyone been in a similar situation? Any advice?

    • anon

      I would recommend not trying to explain anything in too much detail. They don’t need to understand the specifics of your job, just the general type of environment you are used to. If you’ve made any improvements to the system make sure to highlight them. Explaining the type of hearings you do is probably the most important information that potential employers would have to understand, so I would spend some time crafting a 30 second explanation that you can memorize for interviews. Once you’ve figured it out, run it by a friend to make sure it makes sense to someone who isn’t involved in it every day. Other than that, try to keep your explanation brief and let the interviewer ask follow up questions if they want more detail.

      • AnonInfinity

        I agree. Also, make sure that you don’t sound like you’re complaining about your current job or badmouthing your current employer in any way.

    • Hel-lo

      “I think I could really thrive in an environment with training and structure.” Play up the qualities of a job you hope to get; don’t focus on what your last job didn’t have.

      • Flamingo

        I’m going to respectfully disagree with Hel-lo on this one. If I heard that response from a potential employee, it would be a red flag. I would be concerned that this is someone who is going to need a lot of direction or supervision (just being honest here). My suggestion would be that if you are going to mention your current work environment at all in an interview, then spin it a positive way – “I have learned to work in a fast-paced / changing setting”, or ” I can work well in a self-directed environment”.

        To answer Twilight Zone’s original question – it sounds like you want a place with more structure. Your potential employer wants someone who is good at X kind of briefings. Those 2 things are NOT mutually exclusive at all. But I’d suggest focusing your energy on crafting a narrative that appeals to your potential employers needs. If they win, you win. Best of luck!

  3. Selia

    Love the skirt, especially the pleat detail – Lafayette 148 is a great label (generally quite expensive) and when you can find pieces on sale, it is even better!

    • MissJackson

      Agree. Love Lafayette 148. For anyone unfamiliar with the brand: it runs quite large (For reference: I am either an 8 or a 10 in most brands, I take a 6 in Lafayette 148).

    • LawyrChk

      Ditto. I have several Lafayette 148 pieces that are 9-10 years old, and they are still in great condition and are classic enough that they don’t look outdated. I generally size down one size for pants and 2 sizes for dresses (size 4-6 at AT, go for 2-4 in Lafayette 148).

    • Anonymous

      Has anyone found Lafayette 148 jackets to be made only for the “busty”? I bought two online and found that they generally fit, but the chest was entirely too big. I’m a B+.

      • Selia

        I would agree, however, I am an A cup, so pretty much everything is too big in the chest!! The tailor is my friend!

      • AppealingLawyer

        Last Call has a ton of Lafeyette shirts and jackets on sale right now. Definitely worth looking through if you like the label. I bought a ton yesterday.

    • CA Atty

      I love it too! And I’m interested that it runs large. I’m actually very tempted by this skirt even though I really don’t need it or need to spend the money! :-)

    • zora

      this is adorable, and I am always wishing i could find more non-pencil skirts, especially a-line skirts with a non-frumpy line, and nice detail. So, this is exactly the kind of thing I’ve been looking for.. just like all the picks lately have been exactly what I’m looking for…. why are you torturing me, Kat? :o)

    • Bonnie

      You can often buy Lafayette 148 for a low price at sierratradingpost FWIW, their skirts are on the longer side.

  4. OHCFO

    So what do you think of a lumpier size 14/16 type wearing a skirt like that? I struggle with anything but black pencil skirts for fear that things look inapppropriate or unflattering on my pear-ish body type.

    • fortuna

      I think this would be good for a pear shape because the detail is vertical and widest at the knee area rather than the waist. That said, I don’t think 14/16 is “lumpier.”

      Love the skirt. Wish I had the funds.

      • Bluejay

        Oh, I totally know what she means by lumpier. I, too, am lumpy. The blogger at Girl with Curves, for example, is not lumpy.

    • TCFKAG

      I’m in the lower end of this same category — with maybe some lumps myself (:-P) — and I don’t love A-Line skirts because I do think they make me look wider than I already am. That is after years of wearing them almost exclusively, because I thought a pencil skirt would just be too fitted. So…yeah, things evolve. But this particular one is interesting because I think the pleat would trick the eye and bring it lower than the waist — I kind of like it. :-)

      But seriously — try some colors other than black out! At the very least grey or something.

    • AnonInfinity

      I am a lumpy pear shape, and I have a skirt similar to this that is very flattering. The floucy part at the bottom evens out my hips/rump area. I’m sometimes wary of pencil skirts, because I think they frequently veer into “sexy librarian” territory for me.

      • TCFKAG

        If I were a librarian, I’d dress sexy just so I could be a “sexy librarian”. And then I’d flounce.

        • goirishkj

          Had to laugh–during OCI in law school, one of my husband’s professors (husband was prof’s TA in a master’s program) saw me in my suit and said I looked like a provocative librarian. Prof’s wife is a librarian and this was said in front of my husband. Academics are their own special breed. (The suit was a black skirt suit, pink collared shirt and pearls! We think prof meant this as a compliment somehow…)

    • Bluejay

      I’m an apple size 14, and this style makes me look very dowdy. It tends to fall from my widest point and de-emphasize any curves. I think it would be the same on a pear – it would hit your the hips and then just get wider from there. I know some people say that flared skirts are good on pear shapes because it conceals your hips, but really, I have yet to see a pear shape who wouldn’t look better in a fitted skirt.

      • Eleanor

        This makes sense to me. Adding more volume in the region you want to de-emphasize seems like it would be unproductive.

      • Way

        I think it looks not the best on the mannequin. For someone with hips and/or a belly (me on both counts!), I would guess that it would be really unflattering.

      • ELS

        Concur! I’m a moderately lumpy pear-shape size 16, and despite my initial concerns about pencil skirts, they are my BFF at work in the warmer months. I do not EVER wear A-line skirts anymore, because they just make me look and feel like a linebacker.

    • KLG

      I’m not lumpy but I am nothing if not pear-shaped (bottom is 2 sizes bigger…) :) I have a skirt similar to this that I get a ton of compliments on and I think it is because everyone’s eyes shoot to the detail. Maybe it depends on the specific proportions but I think this would look good on pear shaped girls and I’d probably buy it if I wasn’t on a shopping ban :)

    • ELS

      I’m not sure about the shape of this skirt for my particular lumpy pear shape, but I’m about your size and wear things that are similarly fitted regularly to work. Just make sure you have a good fit. And … well, I also put a pair of Spanx or similar under every. single. skirt. i wear to smooth out lumps.

  5. Always a NYer

    I love this skirt – pretty without being too girly! And that the TPS Report is up so early, thank you DLST =p

    Just want to share, I’ve caught the Etsy bug. This could be dangerous, LOL!

    • Bluejay

      What on earth does daylight savings time have to do with it? If anything, it should make the posts come up later rather than earlier.

      I also love Etsy.

      • Always a NYer

        When the clocks got turned back in the fall, the timestamp was an hour ahead. Now that the clocks have gone forward an hour, everything in back in order. Hell, thinking about this I don’t get how the earlier posting has to do with DLST. I’m still drinking my coffee so my brain isn’t fully on yet, oh well ;)

  6. anon

    I have had a stressful couple of months career wise. I thought I was going to make some significant progress and instead I wound up back where I started. It has been a good experience because it has helped me figure out my priorities, but now I’m feeling a little lost. Has anyone worked with a career coach before? I feel like I need an impartial set of eyes to help me look at my career and make a 5 to 10 year plan. I work in higher education in an area that sort of straddles student affairs and administration, and I want my career to move in the student affairs direction. If I’m going to spend the money to meet with someone, I want to be sure that they are really knowledgeable in my area and that their advice will be helpful. If you’ve used a coach before, how did you choose them? Was it a good experience?

    • ss

      I’ve had a couple of useful experiences with coaches before and have directed my staff towards similar programmes. I wouldn’t necessarily prescribe a coach for the circumstances you describe though. It is not realistic to expect to emerge from a single sitting with a 5-year plan in hand – a good coach will use a first sitting to understand the necessary detail about your objectives and may well be reluctant to offer up definitive input of his or her own.

      It sounds like you are already clear about your goals – why not make the next step setting up contacts in the student affairs area ? Who do you know in the roles you are keen on, at your organisation and elsewhere, how did they get there, are they amenable to having a coffee with you to discuss, is there any one to whom you can signal your interest ? Searching for a coach and verifying their authority in your area is likely to require just as much effort and will only just get you to the starting line, whereas information-gathering and networking takes you to the starting line and beyond.

  7. AnonInfinity

    Has anyone ever been to the Women In Law Leadership (WILL) conference by the ABA?

    There’s one this December, and I’m trying to figure out if I want to try to get my firm to send me. For context, I am a 2011 grad, practicing in a large-for-my-area firm. Also very ambitious and generally attempting to be a BAMF.

    • M in CA

      If they want to send you, great!

      If not, don’t be too surprised — ABA events are tons of fun, but tend to draw from its nationwide membership, so it’s not super-great for general networking. I suggest joining your local city and state Women Lawyers orgs and try to get the firm to send you to the shorter and more local events.

  8. SB

    I wanted to thank everyone who replied to my question yesterday about being friends with support staff (my issue was whether I should meet up afterwork to run with someone from another department). I appreciate the feedback and I can certainly see how there could be reporting issues if I ever supervise her work or issues with the partners if they identify me with the support staff oppossed to other attorneys. I’ve decided to go for it… but on the advice of the hive, take it slow and see how things unfold.

    Thanks again!

    • AnonInfinity

      Good luck with your half marathon, and I hope you get a cool new friend out of the deal! (Running buddies are the best)

      • CW

        Same here, generally. I’ve rarely found a pencil skirt that works for me. Actually, the only one in which I truly feel confident is The Skirt.

      • Susan

        Ditto. I’ve only ever found 1 sort-of-pencil skirt that didn’t make me feel like I was very obviously calling attention to my butt. It’s not a good feeling to get up to reach for a file or to get a drink of water and have your skirt practically be screaming: HERE’S MY BUTT! HERE’S MY BUTT! HERE’S MY BUTT!

        If we lived in the Harry Potter world, you know pencil skirts would totally do that, like Howlers.

  10. Houda

    Rant–
    Tomorrow is the official celebration of a big scale project for my company.
    For the past 2.5 years, I have worked through every aspect of this project, from securing investment to the small paperwork for clearances and such.
    My manager was out of the picture for 2 years and then decided to throw this big celebration and has excluded me from it.
    I know she does everything at the last minute and although the ceremony is tomorrow, she still didn’t invite “company” people.
    There is a 95% chance she will forget to invite me.
    Now my dilemma is whether or not to dress for the occasion:
    a- I do not wear formalwear and my manager invites me at the last minute (she did that before), so I am too ashamed to go underdressed.
    b- I come dressed to the nines and as expected my manager does not ask me to join and I spend the rest of the day mortified in my formalwear and pearls while all my colleagues are in jeans at work.
    I feel so hurt from this situation because I just hate how my manager is so disorganized that she dismisses the details that make all the difference (yes I want to go to the launching of my project)

    • springtime

      Why don’t you bring a change of clothes just in case you get the invite?

    • MelD

      Can you talk to other company people who weren’t invited and see if they plan on bringing a change of clothing? If she invites all of you at the last minute, at least you can go in your workwear together and won’t look so out of place.

    • rosie

      I agree with springtime that you can just bring a change of clothes, but I am also wondering if you can just ask your manager about it today. Did she maliciously exclude you, or is she so disorganized that she is effectively excluding you? If the latter (what it sounds like from your post), I would try not to take it personally. I am pretty organized, and a big thing for me has been realizing that what would be definitely a slight for me to do to someone is just how other people behave as a matter of course without any hidden intentions.

    • Houda

      Our admin talked to her and turned out she is so disorganized that she assumed everyone knew they were supposed to go to the launch. The problem is not just me but the senior managers who were booking meetings all day because they never got the memo they are supposed to be somewhere else.
      I know I am very sensitive about this but it’s because my manager keeps forgetting things (like entering my yearly review.. she forgot for six months until I had to call her manager’s manager). Also, I am borderline OCD when it comes to organizing events and I cannot understand why she would wait until the day of the event to tell people to drop by..
      Now the question is what can I wear to an upscale event (ministers – ambassadors – CEOs) that will be held during the day at a Plant?

      • Always a NYer

        So glad to hear you and your colleagues are invited! I’d probably wear wide-leg trousers with a really fancy blouse and closed-toe pumps. There’s a plant on the campus where I work so I know blingy jewelry is frowned upon but I’d bling it up as much as you can without looking gaudy. And I’d make sure my hair and makeup were perfect ;)

        Have fun and let us know how it goes!

      • rosie

        Is the admin in a position to say to her, “oh, I don’t know if everyone knows about the details of this event, so I can send out an email/memo/etc.” While I am really more like you, I accept that some people are not good at planning events and, as long as the admin says it in a nice way (i.e., you look busy, can I help versus you seem incompetent) and your manager isn’t totally anti-delegation, it seems like that could work.

        As for what to wear, it sounded like you have been to these kinds of events before, do you have any ideas from past events? If not, I would talk to colleagues and/or go for business formal, which to me would be a nice suit.

      • Mrs. Piggle Wiggle

        I would wear a sheath dress with a great tweed jacket. Dress it up with some studs or huggies and a long necklace. If the sheath is to your knees (which it should be), be adventurous with some higher heels. Have fun and congratulations!

      • OHCFO

        I hear you. I had a manager that obviously excluded me from things a number of times and it killed my ruminating/ocd-ish self-esteem. For one event, in particular, where it was clear that every.single.manager.but.me. had been invited, I made a passive-aggressive issue out of it. Someone would ask me something about the event, and I would jokingly tell them that I wasn’t cool enough/popular enough/awesome enough to get invited. After a few rounds of that, people learned that if they wanted me somewhere, they needed to ask me themselves because my boss was excluding me continuously.

        Happy ending to this story… she resigned and I took her job. And I am awesome. And inclusive.

    • Bluejay

      Could you ask the manager to clarify whether you’re invited? I would say something like, “Manager, since I have worked so hard on this project for 2.5 years, I thought I would be attending the celebration. I was surprised that you haven’t said anything about it to me yet. Are you planning to ask me to attend, and if so, is there anything you need me to do to help prepare for it?”

      Of course, this depends on the manager’s personality – some may not take this well. But honestly she sounds like a disaster of a manager anyway, sweeping in at the last minute to take credit for your work.

      • Bluejay

        Oops – I was in moderation and now that it’s posted I see the problem is fixed :).

        How hot is it in Morocco right now? Will the plant have air conditioning? If you don’t know, I would wear something that will look appropriate with or without a jacket. I think the suggestion of wide-leg pants and a fitted jacket is good, and I’d wear comfortable heels (because you may be walking on a cement floor).

        As for how to manage your manager generally, wow, she sounds like a complete pain to work with. People who are spacey/flaky really drive me crazy. I don’t have any advice, just sympathy.

        • Houda

          Yes my life has been a nightmare over the past months but I am slowly becoming more assertive.
          The weather should be 23-25°C sunny. We will be inside meeting room in the plant and maybe do a tour of the production line.

          • TCFKAG

            Since none of us know what that means — just kidding — for the Ammmerrricans around here, looks like it’ll be in the 70s.

            Houda, I like the idea of a pants and a structured jacket. I’d also consider a long skirt with some flow to it — but since you may want to wear flats, pants might be best.

          • AppealingLawyer

            If you have to continue to work with this person, I would come up with a plan for dealing with this in the future. I would assume you are invited and say something off hand about it to her like, “Just to confirm, when is X starting” or “What is the attire for X event?” If she wants to tell you that you’re not invited after that, let her.

            I notice that with women lawyers, we sometimes assume that we’re not going to go to court/deposition/client meeting even though we did all the background work because we were “not invited.” I’ve started just assuming I deserve a place at the table and wait for someone to tell me otherwise.

          • Amy H.

            Second what AppealingLawyer said! In situations like this, assume you should be there unless and until you are expressly told otherwise. For this particular type of situation, I might not even bring it up with the disorganized manager in advance but rather just appear, appropriately dressed.

          • Houda

            I talked to my manager and it turned out she “assumed” I am going.
            I still made the point that I was not sure and she said from now on consider that you have to attend all PR events :D
            I’ll keep you posted on what I wear tomorrow

  11. Godzilla

    Ugh, in moderation:

    Yo C0rp0rettes, didn’t you know that the office is the MOST APPROPRIATE place to cut your nails?

    • PharmaGirl

      Huh, and here I thought the commuter train was the MOST APPROPRIATE place. Don’t forget to file your nails down and blow the dust all over your fellow passengers!

  12. Anon 42

    Pretty skirt! I always have trouble finding skirts that hit at the natural waist without a big gap in the back and this looks like it would be really flattering.

  13. AIMS

    So I finally had some time last night to just sit on my couch and look through a bunch of catalogs piled up on my coffee table and to sit with my laptop and do some imaginary online shopping. Wanted to share some things of interest.

    Not sure why the model is hiking this dress up mid-pose, but I’m in love with this dress (would work for work, too):
    http://tinyurl.com/7d9t789

    • AIMS

      Posting separately to avoid delays:

      There have been some comments about leg chaffing, so my PSA for the week, courtesy of teh Jockey catalog — this seems like a brilliant idea, and not just for chaffing — http://tinyurl.com/7krnjlt

      • AIMS

        And last one, I swear. Pretty silk blouse on sale for $30 and it’s washable. Ijust ordered it. If anyone has tried it, let me know what you think. The print is just sweet enough but I don’t think it’s too twee for the office. Wanted to share.
        http://tinyurl.com/6mogmdb

        • TCFKAG

          Ooh…I think the navy version of this was featured here a few weeks ago and I own it and love it. Warning though, it wrinkles when it washes. :-P

        • anon

          If this is like the navy version, it runs large. I ordered a small and had to send it back for an extra small. I usually wear a medium at most other places.

          • Jules

            Agreed, it runs large. I’m a busty 12-14 and the medium fits me (with a safety pin between a couple of buttons to avoid the dreaded gapping). I love it, wish I’d bought the navy before it was gone.

        • SpaceMountain

          I have the polka dot one. I’m 5’2″ and the small is really long on me. I don’t tuck (because short-waisted), but have worn it out with a belt over it. Other that being kind of big, it’s cute and I like it. Haven’t tried washing it yet.

      • Diana Barry

        Not for me – too expensive for what it is. But I am biased against blue prints in general, bc I tend to like neutral to warm colors better.

        • TCFKAG

          True confession time — I have NO idea what warm vs. cold vs. neutral colors are. And I don’t know which flatter me — I just go with what I like. :-P

      • phillygirlruns

        i love the blouse and would probably pick it up if i hadn’t just spent an awful lot of cash on multiple tippi sweaters. $118 is pricey but not astronomical – assuming the quality is up to par (which is a big assumption), this looks like something i’d end up wearing for a few years.

      • Cat

        Cute, but the kind of thing that will likely be on sale in a month – I’d wait.

        • TCFKAG

          I think they e-mailed that top to everyone who is on their email list. And you and I both drooled all over our computers collectively. But I NEED it to go on sale!! Or at least a good discount code — anyone got one???

          • a.

            I’m sure it’ll got on sale eventually…or that they’ll email out a coupon code tomorrow.

          • phillygirlruns

            j.crew just ran a couple of promos – we might be a few weeks off from the next one.

      • MissJackson

        I bought a silk shirt from JCrew in the fall and am really impressed with the quality of the silk (and I say this as someone who refuses to buy JCrew knits thanks to declining quality). On the other hand, might as well wait for a 30% off sale since those seem to occur pretty regularly.

      • Herbie

        TCFKAG, I have been stalking this blouse for weeks but also have not been able to make myself pull the trigger.

        What would you wear it with? I’d probably do blue jeans with a blue, green, purple, or maybe even yellow (?) cardigan at my super-casual office.

        • TCFKAG

          I was just thinking about it this morning. I have the Skirt in grey which it would go well with (with a cream cardigan or maybe a navy jacket or I don’t know yellow WOULD be pretty wouldn’t it in the summer).

          I also have the cobalt Skirt — and think this might go weirdly.

          In the summer, I think this would also go nicely with kind of light tan/beige things I wear.

          Also jeans on the weekend for a slightly dressy affair would be lovely.

          • TCFKAG

            Plus, my go-to interview suit is navy and I think this might go nicely under it when I want to be dressed up but still have some flair. Like for a networking event.

          • AppealingLawyer

            I’m new here so pardon me if this is a dumb question. But what is “the Skirt”? I’ve seen other posters use that too and am assuming it’s a reference to a particular item?

      • AIMS

        Confession time: I love paisley. Not sure that I can be objective here. This is not like my love for leopard where I love some leopard prints and find others tacky. This is serious. I rarely meet a paisley that I do not love.

        That said, I am not sure if such a bold print would work on everyone in this cut – I’m fairly busty and I would be concerned that this would be a bit too much on me. JCrew did a similar paisley print in a button down a few years ago that I liked better. But it’s awfully lovely and if it went on sale I would probably at least try it. I love the little detail on the back,too – totally demure but tres sexy.

      • Supra

        That style blouse (talitha) is my favorite. I have two solid colors and am contemplating the print. I wear the two I have quite often. They are nice silk. There’s a little puffing at the shoulder/sleeve, which I like, buts it’s not for everyone. Some reviews I’ve seen say it makes them look too boxy. I think if you have slender shoulders (in proportion with the rest of you) it is a good fit.

      • AIMS

        I really want to get that dress. But I hate paying full price for FC b/c I feel like their stuff always goes on sale or is eventually available at Lohmanns and the like. But it’s also soooo prettyand would look so cute for spring/summer/fall…. (can you tell I am talking myself into this purchase as I type?)

  14. Anon

    Yay! I input my time from yesterday before going home and feel much less stressed this morning! Now if only I can keep it up for the week.

  15. Hosiery question

    I have a black-tie work event coming up this month. I plan to wear a black cocktail dress that’s on the formal side. I plan to wear black patent pumps and pearl jewelry. The event is in Manhattan. What kind of hose is proper? Sheer black? Sheer nude?

  16. Hosiery question

    I have a black-tie work event coming up this month. I plan to wear a black c*cktail dress that’s on the formal side. I plan to wear black patent pumps and pearl jewelry. The event is in Manhattan. What kind of hose is proper? Sheer black? Sheer nude?

    • Always a NYer

      My personal preference is black hose but go with what you’re more comfortable with. Just wearing sheer hose is formal.

    • Can't wait to quit

      A trick: If you have skinny legs and sheer black hose make your legs look spidery, Hanes has a shade called “barely black”. Looks gray in the package, but once on it looks like sheer black hose but without the spidery effect.

      • AIMS

        Ooh, I love I barely black or off black hose. I actually like it for daytime because I am not a fan of nude on me and I think black black often looks too severe so when tights are not appropriate but I don’t want to do bare legs, that’s my go to.

    • TCFKAG

      TEAM SHEER NUDE IN THE HOUSE!!!!!!!!!!!!!

      I prefer sheer nude for formal events — though I wear sheer black for other things. But I just like nude hose — so don’t listen to me!

  17. Kanye East

    Threadjacky PSA: Today is my one-year Etsyversary, and I’m doing some periodic giveaways over on Tumblr…in case any of you are on Tumblr. (:

  18. Anonymous

    Sorry for the long threadjack but anyone have a sibling that doesn’t seem to have their life in order or is not financially secure and how you help them? I’ve been struggling with this issue for while. We grew up poor and I’ve been working for the past couple years and now I feel financially secure. I’ve worked very hard my whole life and still continue to do so. I’m also pretty frugal and try to save as much as I can though I am generous with money when it comes to loved ones (for example, I bought my sister Tory Burch flats because she needed a pair but I just noticed today that my 5-year old K-mart brand flats are pretty torn up and should probably buy some new ones!) I’ve helped my sister financially for the past few years (I helped pay her rent for 2 years, loan her anywhere from $200 to $1000 every couple months but don’t expect to be paid back) because I love her and I feel like I can. At the time, I figured she was young and trying to figure out her life and she should be able to go for her dreams and not feel like she couldn’t do something because of our financial situation. However, she’s now in her 30s and I just feel like I need to give her a little more tough love, which I have done for the past couple months. But I HATE seeing her struggle. So I have occassionally given her money here and there when she’s in a bind. Now, I’m thinking do I continue with this tough love thing or would it be good to maybe just give her a good sum of money (like $10 to $20K) so that she can use it to figure out what to do with her life in the next year, not worry about money, and hopefully get her act together? I think a part of me just feels guilty for being financially secure while she’s not so I want to help her in the best way I can. However, I don’t want to keep sheltering her by being a crutch for her and at the same time I don’t want to have her suffer/struggle on a daily basis when I can help. Any advice, thoughts or just commiseration would be great. Thanks ladies!

    • TCFKAG

      Hopefully KinNYC will swing by (though she may be traveling) as she always has good insights into this sort of thing — but I think you may be doing more harm than good every time you step in and save your sister. If she has a permanent crutch, it essentially cripples her because she never has to learn to walk on her own. Now — if she came to you with a concrete plan and said “this is what I want to do to fix my life, and I’d love your help” — that would be different, but right now it just sounds like she’s flailing.

      Have you seen a family therapist with her? Have you seen a therapist on your own just to talk about your issues with her? Has SHE seen a therapist? Having a third-party intermediary help work through some of these issues may help, but it won’t fix anything.

      But I’d say from the very highest level, you need to stop giving help with just no strings attached because its enabling her current lifestyle. Talk to her — say you want to see her get her life on track — but that you can’t keep going as you’re going. And be prepared for her to be mad and yell and storm out and maybe not call for awhile, but hopefully, maybe she’ll listen.

      Sorry — this sucks. Wish I could give better, solid advice.

      • AD

        I agree with all the comments below in terms of not continuing the enabling, but I think TCFKAG makes a good point about what you need to do for yourself. If you’re buying your sister Tory Burch flats but you don’t do that for yourself, it seems like there’s some guilt issues that you need to address here as well. Unless you can help yourself here, I would guess it’s going to be difficult to help her in whatever way makes sense.

      • CA Atty

        This. I have a weird family situation that I just typed all out but I’ve decided not to go into. Just sufficed to say that although you think you’re helping, you’re really not. You’re not helping long term. Not to be morbid, but she’s growing dependent on you, if she’s not already. What happens to her if something happens to you? It is stressful to see your sibling make bad choices. On the other hand, these are her choices.

        It drives me CRAZY to see two particular family situations that are like this, one on my side and one on my SOs, but at some point you have to accept there’s nothing you can do to make her grow up and you have to think about your own future as well.

        Maybe she would be amenable to going to a financial counseling or financial class that you can pay for, or maybe she would be willing just to go to therapy that again, you could pay for. But maybe she likes things just the way they are, getting her nice handouts from her nice sister and she’ll be willing to leach from you forever, is that acceptable to you?

        Sorry, almost done. The one thing I would say is DO NOT give her a chunk of money. I’ve seen the most ridiculous things when someone without money comes into a chunk of it. One girl inherited about $200k, was broke within the year. Fabulous concert tickets, a suite in vegas for a couple weeks, new car, down payment on a house (which has since been lost in foreclosure, etc…) One guy inherited about $25k, burned it within a MONTH (and still never paid rent to my friend who he is mooching off of!!!) He bought a new motorcycle (since crashed) flew himself and a friend to Texas to see some football game with great seats, etc… Another was given just $5k to pay off credit cards, pay rent, etc…next thing I know he’s got a $1500 camera…which was stolen within a couple months. It’s just not a good idea. She’ll use it up and be back with her hand out the next week.

      • K in NYC

        you rang? ;)

        Alright… first things first, I want to quote Suze Orman when it comes to giving to someone who is in this type of situation, “Say ‘no’ out of love, not ‘yes’ out of fear.” In other words, don’t give her money because you fear damage to your relationship if you don’t. Tell her no because you love her enough to want her to succeed. Help her to learn the behaviors that made you successful. Don’t get me wrong, don’t try to mold her into another you, but help her to acquire the skills to become a better her. For example, help her to create a great resume/cover letter and to learn interviewing skills. Encourage her to volunteer (or offer to volunteer together) to help her to make friends/build her karma points, etc. Gift her the book of “Young, Fabulous, and Broke” so she can begin to learn and/or watch the video version with her.

        The trouble with money and family is that too often, we believe that one should guarantee the other; that we can always get money from family because they’re family or that we should always give to family because they’re family. Giving with no real guidance only keeps her dependent on you. (Check in with yourself on whether there may be a part of you that enjoys or needs that.) If you truly want her to become strong and independent, teach her to fly and then shove her out of the nest… it seems pretty clear she won’t jump on her own.

        Hoping this helps, even a little bit! (PS Travel is all next week but I’ll try to check in with emails while I’m gone, so feel free to msg me that way as I won’t have the time to scroll through comments: munchkin1616 at juno)

        • K in NYC

          Also, let me reiterate as I read through comments that your sister may not know how to ask for help or may not know what help she needs. Have you ever seen an adult teach a kid to ride a bike? The kid is given a bike on training wheels, full body padding, and is held while she learns to peddle. Then the adult holds the bike up and the kid on the bike while walking alongside it. Then there’s running alongside it. Then there’s some riding by the kid. Then some of the pads come off. Then the training wheels come off.

          THAT is your sister… don’t assume that she’s taking out of laziness or jealousy or anything else until/unless she makes that clear. Build your relationship so that it becomes one of shared activities and joint personal growth, not of giving/taking. Oh, and while you’re teaching her, find something she’s naturally better at than you and do that too, let her be the one who’s better at something who has to help you so it doesn’t feel one-sided.

    • Anonymous

      I can offer commiseration, as I am in a similar situation with my OLDER sister. But I haven’t figured out exactly how to navigate this with her, either. On the one hand, I feel like since I can help, I should. I want her to be happy. And frankly, the fact she is insecure is a stressor for me, too. On the other, she has chosen an “artsy” career that pays nothing so that she never experiences a moment of stress or pain, while I went to law school and do the grind every day, under the thumb and constant criticism/observation of others. Why should I have to plan two retirements? And why should I send her money to buy a new car when I’m still paying for my own, or to avoid eviction when I don’t own a house? The lump sum has occurred to me, too — as a statement that this is it, take it while you can and put it to good use. I don’t really trust her to do that, though. And it has occurred to me to do something like pay her car insurance or health insurance every year as my one annual gift. That has selfish underpinnings, though, as these are the things that stress me out about her financial insecurity, and may not be her priorities. I’m open to advice on this thread, too.

      • Monday

        I just want to offer that “artsy” careers can be absolutely full of stress and pain. Fields like acting, dance, visual art, film etc. are incredibly competitive, and these folks have their work constantly criticized and rejected. Being underpaid or unpaid just adds to it, plus questioning what you’re doing with your life and knowing that many look down on you for it.

        I don’t mean this as an attack, just as an insight from someone with many artistic people dear to me. It is very much a grind in its own right.

        • Anonymous

          I agree. She does have the stress of marketing and running her business. But I am at this point a little frustrated that she (in her 40s) insists on pursuing this career, and no other, when it has proven not lucrative enough for her to meet her very modest needs (I get regular collection calls about student loans and other such things, which I ignore). I don’t mean to belittle her career, and in fact admire that she has now started a business and hustles to get gigs. But there is no question that she can’t actually support herself on this alone, and she refuses to do something like bartend or wait tables or work retail to support herself while she pursues her dreams because it is just “too stressful” to have to answer to someone else. She’s going to age out of performing very soon, I think (and you’re right – it is also physically demanding) and I can’t help but resent feeling like I am going to have to support what could be a forced early retirement. She keeps getting more invested in this one thing, which is only going to make it more difficult for her to get some other kind of job later on. Hopefully, she’ll become a brilliant entrepreneur and prove me wrong.

          • Anonymous

            OP here. In the same situation. I took the practical route and went to law school and became a lawyer and worked in BigLaw (despite having dreams of being a public interest lawyer–granted I am happy with working in BigLaw though). And I’m proud of my sister and glad she is pursuing her dreams but at the same time, I just don’t understand why she just can’t make this financially feasible. We have gotten into tiffs before where I suggest she get a second job for additional income like in retail or fast food (I know that’s not desirable but I think if I were to lose my job today, I would take on any type of job including working at McDonalds to pay my bills if need be). I don’t care if she pursues artistic/entreprenurial goals but she doesn’t really even do it. Instead she focuses on jobs that require good looks (which she has and may fade away) and pay very little. I don’t have a problem with that but at the same time I just don’t get why she can’t focus on her artistic/entreprenurial goals and get a second job as well. I’m thisclose to just telling her to marry someone rich just so she can be somewhat financially secure, which is against everything I have ever believed in. So I totally understand the frustration.

    • Cajunqueen

      I have an older brother who was always a ne’re do well and who hits me up for cash every time I visit him, which is about every three months. This is addition to the food shopping trip I always take him on because he does not drive (he gets friends or a nearby daughter to take him meanwhile). He spends his extra money on beer and cigarettes (he is very much like the Frank Gallagher character is the Showtime series, “Shameless.” I finally told him at one point that, even though I am making decent money (government law job), I have my own family and we have our own expenses, and I cannot afford to support him. I know he will ask me for cash the next time I see him plus want to go shopping, and it makes me not want to visit him very often. He needs to figure out a way to increase his income or reduce his expenses.

    • nona

      You need to wean her off of your money. You can give advice and guidance if she asks for it, but she isn’t learning anything except that you will bail her out. If you want to put aside a lump sum of money to give her IF she gets her act together AND has a plan – going to school, starting a business, that would be very generous of you.

      Michelle Singletary at the Washington Post (Color of Money columns and online discussions) talks a lot about how to do the tough love/money thing with relatives. I suggest you take a look at what she has written for some thoughts on how to help your sister help herself.

    • Dawn

      I have a similar sibling but I choose not to help financially. I feel that we were given the same opportunities, and i worked very hard to get where I am. I am also frugal. You are not teaching your sister anything except how to be a mooch. If you want to help, pay for a financial budgeting class for her.

    • MissJackson

      I’ve been there, although I think you’re a much nicer sister than I :)

      My younger sister can’t get her life together financially, and it makes me want to strangle her. She lives above her means, quit her job to move in with her boyfriend (and then was without work for more than 6 months with no emergency fund, etc), has no savings whatsoever let alone retirement or long term savings, and when my mom (who has very limited means) cut her a ($10k) check to pay off her credit card debt, she went and bought a pricey camera the following month. She finally just got a new job, thank goodness, but she stresses me out.

      So, I totally get where you’re coming from. Here’s the thing: you can’t make your sister change. You can suggest things to her — using Mint, starting an emergency fund, etc. But you can’t make her do it. If she doesn’t want to track her spending, you can’t make her. If she doesn’t want to start saving for emergencies, you can’t make her. I say this as someone who would like to take control of my sister’s finances. You can’t do it. She’s an adult.

      And.. ugh, this is hard, but giving her a lump sum of money is not the answer. Giving her periodic money is also not the answer. I agree with TCFKAG that having a permanent crutch cripples her. A little tough love is probably the right answer here, although that will be hard for you to see. You should have a talk with her so that she understands why you’re not going to give her money any more.

      If you really want to help, consider taking the money that you want to give her and plopping it in an investment account or high interest savings account. Keep it there and in your control, and don’t tell her about it — perhaps someday when she’s standing on her own two feet you can give it to her for a major purchase (downpayment on a home or similar). Or you could set up some sort of incentive program — where you’d “match” her savings? This could get messy, though, because after you give her the money you really don’t have any right to tell her what to do with it (ie keep it in savings).

      • CA Atty

        God that sounds like my brother. Moved to be with his girlfriend, who he kept telling us was going to be our sister in law someday, bought her diamond earrings on his credit card with a very low paying job to apologize for cheating on her, got some money from the grandparents and bought a pricey camera…He also finally got a new job and I’m hoping he’ll start supporting himself instead of continuing to mooch off my parents who aren’t doing that well either!

    • KLG

      At this point it sounds like you’re probably enabling her :( It’s tough to watch a loved one struggle but she has to figure out how to make it on her own. I hate to use this analogy but what if you get hit by a bus tomorrow? She needs to learn to stand on her own two feet. I would offer to help her look for cheaper housing or create a detailed budget or pay for a career counselor or something that will help her figure things out, but I think the handouts have to stop, as painful as it is to watch when you can help.

    • Cautionary tale

      My husband’s aunt (let’s call her “A.”) is 58, unemployed, has no prospects and no skills. She has partied and sunned her way through life and lost numerous job due to her bad attitude, according to my husband. How did she do it? It not-insignificant part, it’s because her sister (the other aunt) married a successful CEO and has given A. financial support over the years – helped with her rent, made “loans,” etc. So she always had a safety net and never *really* had to focus on actually supporting herself, or bettering her job prospects through more education. Now, even after losing her most recent job, she spend more time at the beach than job-hunting and is making poor financial choices. Result – my husband is up at night worrying about her and no one in his family knows what to do.

    • Fiona

      I was in this situation (kind of) as the younger sister when I was in grad school. I was very, very poor, living on a grad student stipend of $13K/year. My older sister certainly helped me out a lot, but never in the form of paying my rent or giving me cash. Rather, she would often give me clothes (framed as “I was at J. Crew and this was on sale, so I got one for both of us!”) and she would pay me an outrageous amount (like $100/hour) to babysit her son for an hour or two while she and her husband went out to dinner. It really helped me at the time — sometimes those clothes were the only new clothes I’d have for an entire semester — but never made me feel dependent or beholden to her and her husband for their help. Typing this all out makes me want to call my sister. =)

    • Anonsensical

      I know what it’s like to not be able to resist being generous with a sister, but you’re definitely not doing her any favors by bailing her out every time she messes up. If you really want to give her a large sum of money, maybe you could set up some kind of trust for her. Meanwhile, help her create a budget and find ways to live within her means. Then, as hard as it will be, stick to the plan and don’t budge so she knows she can’t rely on you for bailouts anymore. I see nothing wrong with continuing to give her generous gifts if that’s what you want to do, but don’t let her use you as her personal overdraft protection plan. In the end, I would think she’d like being able to stand on her own two feet and have more of a co-equal relationship with you. Good luck!

    • SC

      Tough one. I’m an only child, but my mom has a very similar situation with her sister. My mom has been dealing with this for about 30 years, so know that the issue probably won’t go away just by infusing more money into it.

      It sounds like you want to help your sister, so my suggestion would be to start with several frank discussions with her about what her goals are and how she might become more self-sufficient. Once she’s figured that out, give her the money she needs to achieve specific goals and tell her that she must pursue them before you will give her more money. I think this is a form of “tough love” that you could probably follow through with, as your sister would understand your expectations ahead of time.

    • MelD

      My dad has a similar sister and trust me, giving your sister money will just continue to enable her to continue on her current path. My aunt has been asking my dad for money for decades now. She has a minor physical disability but could easily have been retrained to do work that did not require physical labor. Instead of giving my aunt money to help her get additional schooling/training, he just gave her money with no strings attached. Now she’s in her mid-60s and is never going to be able to get any new skills to be self-sufficient or get another job. You need to stop your sister’s behavior now if you don’t want it to continue for the rest of your lives.

      • AppealingLawyer

        I would NOT do the lump sum, as tempting as it may be. Because you invariably will be hit up for another lump sum in a few years.

        The best gift you can give your sis is a visit with a financial planner. She needs to learn how to live in her own means and, if she can’t, then learn how to increase her means.

      • anon

        I have this same situation with my mother. She’s always had a job, but due to difficulty handling stress and some personality issues, she’s never been well paid, nor stayed with an employer for more than a few years. She’s been fired a few times. She’s never “managed” her money — she’s always spent everything she has, and run up huge credit card debt in addition. She’s declared bankruptcy twice. She started drawing on the meager retirement benefits she earned in jobs with the state government as soon as she was eligible at age 50, which of course reduced the benefit she now receives in actual retirement.

        She is now retired with no assets or income other than social security and the tiny remaining pension. I supplement her income substantially every month. I pay her more than I pay into my kids’ college funds, which drives me nuts, but there’s no other option. If I didn’t help, my mother would literally be living on the street.

        I certainly thought for years about how to avoid this situation, but was never able to influence my mom’s behavior. Sometimes it just isn’t possible. In your situation, it might be best to stop giving you sister money on a routine basis just to make things more comfortable for her, but start a savings account to cover any true emergency situation in her life, and potentially to help her in her old age.

    • sibling success story

      I would like to support the decision to go the tough love route. My younger brother has been terrible with money his whole life. My parents tried everything: matching anything he put into savings, making him pay rent during his summer at home to teach him to budget, loans, chores, tough love, safety net… EVERYTHING. The kid just couldn’t figure it out, and my sister and I never understood why he couldn’t get it together. He got married last summer, and I was shocked and so proud to hear that it finally kicked him into gear to be totally on his own. He mentioned that him and his wife (also a spender) started using Mint to track their budget, and that they were denied for a loan for a house because they didn’t have the credit/work/financial means to qualify… and he refused to ask my dad to co-sign. I honestly think that getting denied showed him that he can’t just ride on other people’s money, and being completely cut off from my parents’ money has made him understand that he has to save and be responsible. The safety net during his younger years allowed him to coast along financially, but the cold turkey cash flow end really woke him up. Granted, it took about a year for the wake up, but it seems like he’s finally getting himself together. Long story to say: people can change, but it usually takes a traumatic event to make it happen. Cut your sister off financially, offer to help her budget/plan, but quit “helping” her make irresponsible choices. It’s better in the long-run for both of you!

    • roses

      No advice, but I have a feeling I will be in this situation in a couple of years. My parents are still supporting my older brother, who has a number of mental disabilities that make it difficult (but nowhere near impossible – he is still college educated) for him to hold on to a job. It’s difficult to figure out what’s due to his disabilities and what’s just him not putting forth a lot of effort because my parents are still giving him a roof over his head. My family is not well-off, however, and I feel as though when my parents finally decide to retire, it’s going to fall on me to help him out. While I love him dearly, it’s not something I look forward to.

  19. Tra la la

    Hi all. Requesting some advice. I just learned that my dad was laid off from his job with no warning or notice last week. He has been a good performer and was with his company for almost 15 years. He has survived many previous rounds of layoffs and has been even furloughed for a week or so here and there, but was caught totally off guard by this. There is a chance he may be recalled, but also a good (or maybe a better) chance he may be offered a severance package. My dad is in his early sixties but has the energy and interests of someone much younger. He is awesome. He has said many times before that he never wanted to retire He and my mom are in a good place financially and I’m sure they will be fine as my mom is still working in a very stable and decently paid job. I guess I’m just looking for advice on how to support my dad. He is not a very emotionally expressive person and does not really like to talk about how he is feeling. I already emailed my dad to tell him that whatever he chooses to do, he has lots of skills, knowledge, and energy to contribute. Any other thoughts?

    • Bunkster

      My dad was in the exact same situation about 10 years ago. He’d survived a number of layoffs, in part because he was a controller and usually had to run the numbers.

      At D* (big computer company that was absorbed by an even bigger one), he built the internal Finance website. After he got laid off, he took a number of more advanced web development classes, courtesy of Unemployment and now he builds little websites for small companies. Most of his clients are local, but he also bids on jobs via guru.com.

      I’m not sure what your dad’s skill set is, but you might encourage him to look into something like this. My dad’s background is in accounting and finance, but he made the switch.

    • momentsofabsurdity

      I’m so sorry! That’s unfortunate. If he and your mom are in a good place financially, maybe you can suggest taking this opportunity to do something he’s been wanting to do for a while – for example, my dad ALWAYS talks about writing a book but works too many hours to ever find the time for it.

      I think just letting him know you love him and are there to help with anything they need is the most important thing.

    • SpaceMountain

      My dad left his job a long time ago, and never looked back. He works on his investments, created his own real estate business, consulted, volunteers and does all sorts of things for local charities, etc. Right now he’s really into photography and keeps taking photography courses. Hopefully your dad will get over feeling bummed about this and start looking at all the opportunities available to him now. I don’t know what you can do about it. I pretty much sat back and watched the show, and was happy to have more time to spend with my dad since he wasn’t working or traveling so much.

    • CA Atty

      If it were my dad I would just show up with a bottle of tequila or a couple bottles of red wine and we would sit in the backyard and watch the dogs swim and barbeque and not ever talk about it, but maybe talk about what he’s going to do next. Alternatively, I would buy him (and myself!) tickets to the local baseball team and we’d go have $1 hot dogs and $10 beers and talk about all the players and how they’ve been in the bigs and up and down the state in the littles and recovered from this or that injury. And that would be it!

      Just do something with him, if he wants to talk about it he will, if not he’ll enjoy your company.

    • PM

      If you think he will be applying for new jobs, I recommend a book by Robin Ryan called “Over 40 and You’re Hired!” It’s very upbeat about packaging your strengths for new potential employers. Maybe your dad is not worried, but it’s hard to not feel like the younger prospects are more attractive to potential employers and this book is great for talking about redoing your resume, etc., to emphasize your experience (as well as some pitfalls to avoid).

    • zora

      when this happened to my dad, he didn’t really need me to help him, but my mom helped a lot when she told me that he just needed to hear from me. So, I would call him and email him as much as I could just partly to distract him from being worried about work, and partly to just reinforce that I loved him, and that he has things other than his job to be proud of and make him feel good, like family. Plus, like others said, now he has more free time to talk/spend with you. I would find opportunities to call him during the day when I knew he’d just be home alone, and either talk about shared interests, or just to ask him how things were going and let him vent about job hunting if he wanted to.

    • ss

      So sorry to hear about this. There’s plenty of good advice above but perhaps also anticipate that spending his days and weeks at home may be an initial shock for your dad. Also for your mum if she becomes his main point of human interaction for the day (my parents were constantly on each others’ nerves when my dad first cut back his hours at the office). See if it helps to re-establish a routine eg. logging on for the news each morning, lunch with a regular group every week, perhaps a couple of new activities where he can meet folks.

      Even more practically, is he properly and fully wired up at home ? Getting him a tablet or a smartphone might be a good idea if he doesn’t already have one – if nothing else, he will enjoy figuring out a new toy and these will provide a means for you to quickly and casually swap messages and thoughts with him, if he isn’t the type to communicate by spilling the beans in a big way.

  20. Anon

    Vent…

    How come I always have to wear a size larger in pants than I do in skirts!!?? When I gain a few pounds my pants don’t fit but I have no issues with skirts. It’s so frustrating and I always have apants I can’t fit into at any given time. ARG!!!

    • TCFKAG

      Same goes for me — I think its because I carry a lot of my weight in my thighs (team Thunder Thighs in the HOUSE.)

      • Anonymous NYer

        word. I’m the same way. all hips and thighs. But skirts that sit at the waist are usually totally fine in my somewhat frequent 10lb weight fluctuations.

        • TCFKAG

          I know. I posted this one first and then the other one second. And then I was like…oops…too much housing for one day.

          But seriously, I am on Team Thunder Thighs like woah. And my membership on Team Sheer Hose is well established. So…they are both my houses, I own multiple properties. :-P

    • January

      Also, I think skirts sit a little higher than pants, so if you tend to gain weight in your lower abdomen (like me!), the waist of the skirt might sit above your problem area(s).

    • More J.Lo than Paltrow

      I have the same issue. For me, it’s the price of having a booty.

      • Another J. Lo

        Same here. I have to go up in pants so the fabric on the back isn’t molded to my a**. Of course, then the pant legs are parachutes. Result: I just don’t wear pants.

      • May

        I actually have the exact opposite problem, and my ass could have its own area code. I have to size up a TON in skirts. At BR, I wear an 8-10 in pants, but had to size up to a 14 in skirts so it wasnt painted on.

    • Susan

      I think it’s because too many pants these days are made with butt-hugging styles, so a lot less forgiving of a few pounds, unlike skirts.

  21. anon for this

    I am sorry this is so long. I laid in bed awake for a long time last night wondering what to do, and since ‘others in dire financial straits’ seems to be a common thread theme for today, I would love some hive advice. This is not the type of question I would normally ask here.

    A not-that-close friend sent me a condolence card in the mail regarding a sad event in my life recently. It was a really cute card, and on the back it had a little “stamp” with a symbol – like when you buy something off etsy, and the handle of the seller might be on the back of the card. I really liked the card and after figuring out what the symbol was, decided to google it to see if it was a private card seller. I googled the handle and etsy and while I did NOT find an etsy account, I found a blog.

    Turns out the blog is an anonymous blog that my friend keeps (names changed, but obviously her life). Although publicly accessible, it read like a diary and she didn’t seem to have ‘friends’ on this online site – there were no comments to anything.
    I ended up reading it for about two hours. My friend and her husband have always lived rather modestly, but have had good jobs and have never been in financial trouble. It turns out [and this is the very condensed version] through no fault of their own the small business her husband works for was struggling, and he kept working there while looking for another job, but when they finally went belly up last month he hasn’t been paid in more than four months. She is 9 months pregnant (due any day) and has a 2 year old. They went on WIC and public assistance three months ago, and according to her blog, it’s not actually enough to feed them. They own a small house, and by making payments to keep it from going into foreclosure they are about 8K behind on all their other bills. They have health insurance, but no maternity coverage. Her husband just this week has started another position, but it won’t pay anything extra. Basically in this blog she talks about not having enough food for everyone to eat, how after years of comfortable living she took for granted with two college degrees they would all be okay and now they all sleep on a mattress on the floor, how she sold her wedding ring, they’ve sold furniture, etc. Her last post is about how they are looking to rent a room or basement for the four of them if they can find someone to rent their house and make the payments, to have more money to buy food.

    I can tell her blog is true. There are enough things that are perfectly timed with events I know about (i.e. that she was fired 7 months ago) and she’s not the kind of person to make this stuff up.

    What do I do? The truth is, I think she would be really, really upset that I found this blog. It’s clearly meant to be anonymous, and to be honest it took me decoding the symbol stamp and googling to find it and I don’t think most people would have. I feel like I’ve read something she doesn’t want anyone in her life to know about, but also I don’t want her to have to move into a basement to afford to buy food. If I could write her a check I would, but I can’t without compromising our own ability to pay bills.

    How can I help her? Without letting her know I’ve read what seems to be her diary?

    • anon for this

      I think this is obvious, but just to be clear: I am not asking the hive for financial assistance. I am asking for advice on how to help her when she clearly needs 8K-10K to get over a horrible past 6 months without serious negative consequences, and I do not have 8K to give. There most be something else that I can do.

    • TCFKAG

      I think you have two courses of action:

      (1) You can send her a note from yourself saying “I found this blog — I know its deeply personal and difficult but I want to be there for you as best I can. What can I do for you?” And she may just really need someone to talk to. You might also be able to, for example, help her find a renter for her house (though she sounds like the perfect candidate for an intentional foreclosure to me.)

      (2) You can anonymously send her things — such as gift cards to a grocery store — with a simple note saying its from a “fan” or something. It might creep her out briefly, but in the end she’d probably appreciate it.

      I don’t know, there’s no easy answer.

      • Diana Barry

        I agree with both of these. I might meet with her and say “I heard you were going through a tough time” and see if that helps her to open up, if you don’t want to disclose that you read the blog.

        If you get into a conversation about things, I would suggest that she talk to someone about a short sale or foreclosure – it seems like that would be a partial solution to the $$ woes. She should also talk to a women’s health center about Medicaid coverage for the birth etc.

        If nothing else, I would get her a bunch of stuff when the baby is born, particularly diapers, wipes,diaper cream, baby shampoo, etc., that are necessary for the baby to have but not necessarily cheap if you are buying a lot of them.

        • Coalea

          I think Diana Barry’s idea of providing essential gifts for the baby is a great one. If you want to avoid bringing up the issue of the blog – and I can see why you would – perhaps you could begin helping your friend out in small ways and frame it all as being due to the baby. For example, you could prepare and freeze meals for her and her family because she will be too tired to cook – not because she can’t afford to buy food.

    • SC

      You could try to help her connect to community resources that might be able to help – food banks at local community centers or churches, non-profit job placement resources, etc. I know that the finances of lots of these places are very stretched lately, but you might be able to find some places that could help. It sounds like she might be too overwhelmed to do the leg-work required to find these resources (I would be!). Of course, you’d have to either meet with her and hope she opened up to you or tell her that you found her blog.

      • MD/DC observer

        This. This. People and nonprofits are both hurting in this economy, but it’s still worth looking for help.

        If she’s part of a congregation, ask if she feels comfortable about you contacting the clergy or administrative assistant, confidentially, on her behalf. (I always make it clear that I’m just brainstorming for resources–not trying to browbeat anyone into being religious, espeically during a difficult time!) Many congregations have a “caring committee” to help members with logistical, moral, spiritual, or financial support during medical or financial emergencies. It should be confidential (my opinion here!) but check with the congregation to confirm this. If she’s about to deliver the baby, you could mention the idea of talking to the hospital social worker or maybe having you make the initial contact on her behalf.

        If you ask these questions in writing (email or snail mail) your friend will have some privacy in which to react. If you send snail mail, you could also enclose a modest-amount grocery gift card (say, $30-50–large enough to say “I care” but small enough not to be intimidating). It’s hard for some people to accept moral or financial support–even in extreme circumstances–when they’re accustomed to being self-sufficient. You might address this gently in your note, by reminding her that everybody experiences a time to accept assistance. When her life improves, she can “give back to the universe” or “pay it forward” by helping somebody else, either directly or indirectly.

        If your own schedule and comfort level allow this, you could also offer her some logistical support. Ask if she would like to have a visitor once the baby arrives (don’t stay a long time), or meet you at a nearby park or playground with the baby or with both children. (You can push the toddler on the swings if the mom has to tend to the baby.) Offer to drive her somewhere, or to babysit both children to give her and her husband a chance to get out on their own, even if it’s just for a walk around the block.

        One final thought: You could begin your entire note with a comment to the effect of “Thank you for your recent condolence card. The symbol on the back of your card led me to the blog XYZ, which sounded so much like a description of your life that I want to know how I can help–see ideas below. But if I’ve drawn the wrong conclusion, can you pass on my suggestions and the enclosed gift card to the person described in the blog?” This is clumsily worded, but I think it will make my point. Now I need to go back to work. Good luck. You are trying to do a good deed.

        • anon for this

          Actually, this is what my husband and I have been talking about – asking the caring committee at our church to provide, say, $500, and having it come as a cashier’s check. I just feel very, very awkward asking for the church to give money to a person who is not in the congregation, basically on my word, and to do so anonymously. The only issue is that we came to know each other through an event at my church, and she’d basically know that it was us who were behind it, which I’d rather be able to give anonymously.

    • Always a NYer

      Is it possible that she may have wanted you to find her blog? I mean, my first question is why was that symbol on the back of the card? I overanalyze everything and would have done the same exact thing you did and played detective until I found that symbol and its meaning. This is a difficult situation as she will probably be embarassed that you know so much about her life but it was on the internet for anyone to find.

      My suggestion would be to meet up with her and she very well may bring up this situation on her own. If not, mention it and how you want to help by doing x, y, z. It will be awkward but in the end, you’ll both feel better. Good luck!

    • Bluejay

      Well, I think the best thing is to buy a grocery store or Walmart gift card for $1000 and send it to her anonymously or leave it in her mailbox. But since obviously that’s not possible, I’d suggest giving her small things that she needs but won’t make it immediately obvious that you learned about her financial situation. For instance, you could make casseroles every week and bring them over for her when she has the baby. You could throw her a baby shower so that she can get gifts of baby stuff, and subtly suggest to the guests that they bring practical gifts.

      You also might say something to her like, “You must be really nervous with the new baby coming, especially since you got laid off. How have you been feeling?” and give her a lead to vent her troubles. If she opens up, then you can put together a concrete plan to help her out with the help of other friends. Or, maybe you should just tell her you found the blog. It might be a big relief that she doesn’t have to carry around her worries all alone anymore.

    • Emily I

      If you have friends in common, or know enough of her friends and relatives who might live nearby, you could start a “meal train” for her family when the baby is born. It’s very common in my area for families to take turns bringing dinner for a family who has a new baby. We use a website to schedule, so the recipient knows when to expect a meal, and even what is being brought. It’s a small(er) gestures, but if you could organize something like this so that it lasts as long as possible and encourage people to not only bring dinner but snacks and things for other meals, you could help feed her family. That would be one less thing for her to worry about. Since this is something that is often done, you wouldn’t have to acknowledge her financial situation and potentially embarrass her.

      On the other hand, if she’s posting on an annon blog, she’s probably not confided in a lot of people. It might be a relief for her to know that you know and have someone to talk to.

      • MD/DC observer

        These! These! Short, sweet, and totally inoffensive since it’s all about feeding the family with a new baby rather than “acknowledg[ing] her financial situation and potentially embarass[ing] her.” I also agree with both Emily I and Blluejay in their comments that the friend in distress might be relieved to find a sympathetic listener.

        Brief threadjack: I’m always impressed with the thoughtful responses that the hive provides to questions.Even if I’m not directly expressing my own concerns, I can draw strength from the examples of other smart, strong women doing their best to make or maintain positive movement in their lives.

      • anon for this

        I think the baby supplies, grocery gift cards, and/or meal train for the family would be a great place to start. The baby is literally due any moment, so this might be something to wait a few weeks on. I just feel bad that I can’t do more.

        I didn’t want to make my original post a mile long, but it was really clear from the blog that she would be mortified if anyone knew about her blog. I can’t help but think that she must have thought it is on a private setting. Even with it technically being public, unless the reader already knew her, there wasn’t any personally identifying information.
        I think she is/has been making and selling card packets, and might have used one of those for my card, and only by that coincidence (plus some serious sleuthing to decode on my part) did I find her alternate persona.

        • coco

          I think everyone has come up with amazing ideas.

          If you do reach out to thank her for the note and ask how she’s doing, you could ask where she got the beautiful card she sent. If she says that she made it herself/is selling them, you could try to help her sell them – by letting other friends know or whatever other connections you might have. It would be a way for her to potentially get more income.

    • EC MD

      Putting the “how do I bring this up” aside, which is really thorny, she also needs to talk to the hospital she’s delivering at to get the ball rolling for charity care. Most hospitals would rather write off a delivery than put a family into collections. If they can document their income, whatever it is, the hospital may be able to provide a significant discount, or just pay for it. Also, the hospital social workers are well versed in this kind of crisis situation, and the birth of a child is a time when people can access resources that they may not be able to access another way. She needs to totally break it down to the social workers. I love me some hospital social workers. They can work amazing solutions. It doesn’t solve the big picture, but it may keep them out of crisis for the next few months.

      • Anonynon

        Maybe when you’re talking to your friend you can tell her you heard a story or read an article about a family who had their hospital delivery bill written off and how it restored your faith in humanity or something along those lines.

    • K in NYC

      I would say not to bring up the blog. It’s her personal space to vent or work through things.

      That said, use the info she -has- given you to help. Example, she told you she lost her job, so send her a care package and a note that says you were thinking of her and her recent employment stress and wanted to send something nice. Heck, go to the local goodwill (not to salvation army, they are anti-LGBT) and buy super cheap baby misc. and mail that to her, it doesn’t have to cost a lot.

      Check in with her more, be a friend who meets up with her when you’re able or who makes regular phone chat time with her so she feels supported. She obviously loves you enough to acknowledge a difficult time in your life, return the love.

      And if you’re able to help her financially in other ways, do so in ways that protect her pride… send a larger check or gift along with a card congratulating her on the baby, send a bigger gift card than you would have for her birthday or for some silly holiday reason (even if it’s a fake holiday, use it as an excuse).

    • green elephant

      This really touched me for some reason. I want to help in some way… could you please email me at my linked email? I promise to keep all of this very anonymous.

      • green elephant

        Link didn’t work…. green elephant 61 at gmail . com (without the spaces)

        • K in NYC

          if you’re able, check out the free section of your local craigs list and the freecycle websites… I’d bet there are lots of people with spare bedding or baby items that could be sent to her or dropped off somewhere for free. In addition, if you post there, local folks may know other ways of helping someone local who is in need.

  22. a passion for fashion

    I just bought a house!!!!

    Sorry, I just had to shout it somewhere :)

  23. Kate

    …Question for the hive…

    When a friend has baby my husband always likes to buy the little one a gift with his own alma mater’s logo on it, even if the parents didn’t go to the same university or didn’t go to college at all. I think this is pretentious. My husband thinks it is cute. Husband is very proud of his alma mater and that is fine but this just comes across as do*chy to me. One of the parents receiving this gift has already asked my husband if he can use his connections to get his kid into this particular college. This child is 3.

    Does anyone else think this is weird? Why can’t we just get them a regular outfit?

    • TCFKAG

      I think some of this depends on the school. Does it rhyme with Shmarvard or Kale?

      Seriously though — its a little weird to get alum baby stuff for babies that aren’t yours and aren’t connected to the school by region or sports affiliation (do you life close to the school perhaps?)

        • 30

          Um, yes. That is weird. (Also, I’m not sure if the fact that it’s Michigan and not an Ivy makes it it better or worse).

          • PollyD

            Oh, Michigan likes to call Harvard “The Michigan of the East Coast.” I went there for grad school, and I mostly mean this in jest. Because everyone knows that orange and blue regalia from University of Illinois is the most awesome baby gift ever.

        • TCFKAG

          Okay — this is less weird, because of the sporting association. Its almost like giving a Red Sox onsie, which I’ve done (though generally only when the baby is the child of Red Sox fans).

          :-)

          • Diana Barry

            It’s still kinda d**chey, though!

            I would get the babies another gift with a card that clearly indicates that the “Fichigan” onesie/merch is from your DH and the real gift is from both of you. :)

        • Bluejay

          This is completely d–chey. If the baby was outfitted with the logo of a school rhymes with Rotre Rame, on the other hand, it would be awesome.

          Seriously, though, my friends do this all the time. They especially do it if they went to a rival school and they needle the parents to take a pic of the baby in the rival school’s gear. I sent my niece (who was a preordained Sooner since before she was conceived) an ND cheerleader outfit for her birthday, and damn straight she wanted to wear it, to her father’s chagrin. Can I suggest that maybe you just don’t get college sports, and you should let your husband do what he likes? You could always get a small second gift and say the Mich shirt is from him and the little socks are from you, or something like that.

          • a.

            This. My friends haven’t started popping babies out, but I know from cousins/coworkers/etc. that it’s basically a tradition ’round these parts to try to outfit the little ones in Shmirginia or Shmirginia Tech gear. Bonus points if you can get the bundle of joy into a onesie from whichever school the parents hate.

            So basically, if there’s a football association I think this is totally normal. Fichigan counts. Kale or Shmarvard would not.

          • Kate

            +1

            My dad went to Fitchigan, so maybe I come by this rightly. But I have every intention of gifting some school spirit onsies to pretty much everyone I know — and I did not go to an Ivy or a big state school. I just have an inappropriate amount of love for my university. (‘ray Bucknell!)

            Also, my extended family has a big Fichigan/Fichigan State rivalry which routinely involves gifting the opposite university’s onesie, etc. to the kiddo. Usually met with mock (and/or real) horror at the baby shower/birthday party/whatever. Always a good time :)

          • Shmirginia

            Ha! As someone from Shmirginia who married someone from Shmirginia Tech, we are inundated with clothing/toys/materials from each side of the family with logos.

          • goirishkj

            I may or may not give such onesies as Bluejay suggest to friends for baptism gifts–welcome to the family! Of course, many of my friends either went to Rotre Rame or that school across the street. That said, I think it is a bit strange if there’s no connection at all for the parents.

          • gov anon

            What Bluejay said. And I’ll admit I’d totally give Rotre Rame gear to a baby whose parents went to Fichigan. All in good fun of course. But then I also come from a culture where a Cardinals onsie is considered an acceptable baby gift for a Cubs fan

        • K in NYC

          What Bluejay said. And I’ll admit I’d totally give Rotre Rame gear to a baby whose parents went to Fichigan. All in good fun of course. But then I also come from a culture where a Cardinals onsie is considered an acceptable baby gift for a Cubs fan

    • Anonymous NYer

      I think it’s a little odd. I get the babies of relatives stuff from my alma mater, so, baby cousins, etc. But unrelated people? Strikes me as weird.

    • AnonInfinity

      I live in SEC country, so a lot of people give things from their alma mater as a matter of football spirit. Like, my friend who went to Auburn and is DIE HARD will gleefully give anyone a one-sie with that logo on it. This is often more of a joke than a serious gift.

      It seems like that’s not really the situation from your post, though? This might be my own projection, but I’m imagining that your husband went to an Ivy or similarly respected school in your area and is giving trinkets with that logo as a gift. If that’s the situation, then I definitely think it’s do*chy and pretentious. Also, confusing.

      • AnonInfinity

        Drat. Now I feel mean because everyone used nicer adjectives than I did. I would like to defend myself by saying that I was trying to use the language from your original post.

        • AnonInfinity

          And I do think that Fichigan merch is considerably less pretentious than Schmarvard or Kale (though just as respected, especially “up there”).

          Ok, I’m done now.

    • anon

      Totally with you, it’s pretentious. Surely it has resulted in some big time eye rolls.

    • Anonymous

      I’ve received university-labelled items from relatives currently working at said university (not graduates, just in administration).

      All went straight to Goodwill/freecycle/local parents yahoo group “free stuff.” Sorry.

      Some people are just not good gift-givers. In my book, your DH is one of them. He is thinking about what he would like to receive, not what the recipient would like to receive.

      In the universe of character flaws/bad things, this is pretty minor. White People’s Problems!

      • Just hired

        So you’re saying I should not buy every child in my family a t-shirt bearing the logo of the school I’ll be teaching at in the fall? ;)

          • Just hired

            Thanks! Now my dad, on the other hand, would wear a New School t-shirt every day of the week….

          • zora

            Ha! When I went to New School, they didn’t even MAKE tshirts … cause that would have been all “establishment” and stuff… ;o)

        • Anonymous

          Only if you enclose a note saying “I forgot to buy your new baby a gift, so I went to the school store and picked up this onesie, along with some new pens and a bag of Doritos. Hugs!”

    • Circe

      It’s weird, and makes the gift about the giver rather than the recipient. It seems self-centered of him, and even if he doesn’t mean it that way, that’s how I would see it if I were to receive such a gift. It’s like if someone were to give me a gift card to their favorite steak house, knowing that I’ m a vegetarian. Sure, I can eat a salad there, but wouldn’t it be more thoughtful to get me something more veggie-friendly?

      • Kate

        This is exactly how I feel about it. Although I have already warned my husband that our future little one will not be wearing any Fichigan. Around here you get picked on for wearing the wrong colors. However, I don’t mind Cubs baby gear. Now THAT is cute! :)

    • anon

      maybe I’m weird, because I don’t think this is weird at all! I just think it’s funny! But, I’m from Texas and would happily distribute Longhorn gear to anyone who would take it…

    • Tired Squared

      I’m with your husband on this one–probably because I’m the same way. Most of my close friends don’t have the same school spirit I do, so I always give their new babies an outfit related to my own alma mater, and joke that their baby will get to learn about the wide world of college sports from Auntie Tired Squared. The parents seem to think it’s funny.

      That said, I wouldn’t do it for parents who were obviously into their own alma maters. And I *really* wouldn’t do it for a parent who went to a “rival” school. No need to give a Buckeye parent a conniption because I’m giving the baby a Wolverine pacifier!

      • Tired Squared

        Okay, now that I’ve read that the OP’s husband is in fact a Michigan Wolverine, I’d just like to state for the record that I am NOT a Michigan alum.

      • AD

        Isn’t it BETTER to give the baby of a Buckeye parent a Wolverine pacifer, if you’re a Risconsin alum?

        (Sorry, I guess I seem to hang out with the wrong kind of people, a/k/a sports lovers who hold grudges.)

    • Susan

      Yes, it’s weird of your husband to do that, although I think he means well. That parent seems to like it to the point of asking your husband to use connections for his kid, so the parent sounds like a do*che, so it’s all good.

    • CA Atty

      My uncle does this in two, both somewhat odd, ways. First, he always always always gets us stuff from his alma mater. It’s in a different state, is a state school, and is not a “good” school. He also gets college wear from everywhere. Any time he travels he stops by the local university, for instance “Fichigan” and gets people gifts.

      I think it’s cute. It’s supporting colleges, promoting going to college to the tykes, etc…

      I don’t think it’s do*chy at all.

      • Anne Shirley

        1.) I went to Michigan and live gifting M gear to babies. Go Blue! It’s a sorts thing, not college prep. The weird one is the father wondering if you could get his 3 year old in

        2.) is douchy the slut word for men? What we call people who are confident to put them down because they think they’re all that? Are we really okay with insulting men by comparing them to a superfluous hygiene product?

    • Hel-lo

      Can I just say that I appreciate all our misspellings of schools in this thread?

      It’s entertaining, but I’m not sure I see the point.

      • TCFKAG

        Haha. To be honest — I just did it to Harvard and Yale ironically, but I do enjoy that everyone adopted it. (Also its late…no one will see this).

  24. Anonymous NYer

    Hello Corporetters, another thread-jack for the morning.

    It seems my Chi hair straightener has finally sh*t the bed. I’ve had it about 4-5 years I believe. It now refuses to turn on at all. Honestly, I never loved it, even after spending an absurd amount on it ($100ish – absurd for me, but, the price of beauty, I suppose). I felt that it pulled out my hair more than other straighteners I’ve used. I have long hair thats somewhat wavy. I dry it straight when I want it to look neater. I honestly don’t use a straightener a ton. I will dry my hair straight with just a brush at night, and then run the straightener through in the morning to sort out the overnight sleep-kinks, or if I have a nicer occasion I will straighten in sections as I dry, to give it a more polished look.

    Does anyone have a hair straightener they love? I need one that gets hot enough because my hair tends to be stubborn, and I would also appreciate if it didn’t pull out hairs every time I use it.

    • In House Counsel

      Love my GHD (got it from Sephora). I have thick/coarse wavy hair and use it as a finishing touch.

    • Niktaw

      I’ve had my Hot Tools Helix for several years… 4-5 I think. Bought it at Ulta for about $40 on clearance. For this price, it has interchangeable 1″ and 2″ plates, and also 2 sets of CRIMPING PLATES! Really!
      I have the same hair issues as you, and straighten infrequently. Very happy with the performance.
      I don’t think the model I have is sold anymore, so you’ll probably miss out on the crimping plates; but look into the Hot Tools brand. It’s supposed to be a very good value for the price, especially if you are an occasional user.

      • a passion for fashion

        i second hot tools — i think for the price, its the best you can get. I use mine 3-5 times a week, and have for years. its not quite as good as the more expensive ones, but it does the job well and its only 45 bucks or so.

    • Clueless Summer

      I always order mine directly from my hairstylist. She is an independant, out of her house type, though, so she doesn’t mark it up at all. This time around she ordered me a babyliss professional line – it’s a 1 inch, which is great, with extra long plates, so more of the hair fits into it. Does great curls. It has a temperature gauge where you can go from ~200 degrees to around ~450. I recommend mine – and i find it does NOT pull my hair out like CHI straighteners…those are the worst.

      • May

        I think I have this same one, and I second this. Doesn’t pull hair at all! (Which could be a letdown if you are into that sort of thing….)

    • Remington shine therapy

      Try the Remington shine therapy iron. For reals. I also have a Hai, but this is much better and cheaper. Check the reviews!

    • Anonymous

      I have a RUSK straightener that i love and adore! I believe it came from Ulta on clearance…

  25. Tuesday

    Ladies, I need styling advice. I got a polka-dotted dress last week to wear to a party tonight, and I don’t know what to wear with it. The dress is White House Black Market’s Dot Faux-Wrap Dress. The link is long, but here goes: http://www.whitehouseblackmarket.com/store/browse/product.jsp?maxRec=61&pageId=1&productId=570041920&viewAll=&prd=Dot+FauxWrap+Dress&subCatId=&color=&fromSearch=&inSeam=&posId=5&catId=cat210002&cat=Dresses++Skirts&onSale=&colorFamily=&maxPg=4&size=

    When I got it, the salesperson recommended I wear it with black tights, but it’s going to be 80 degrees today, which is way beyond tights temp for me.

    Ideas?

    Thanks.

    • TCFKAG

      Do you have nude shoes — then I’d wear it with those and bare legs (if you’re comfortable that way) or sheer hose if not. If you have nude shoes, I’d bring some color in with jewelry if you have it, like a nice pop of red or turquoise or something. Or else, if you have bright red shoes, that would also look great (but in which case I might keep the jewelry more neutral).

      Also — a sparkly or bright clutch if you have it!

      • Tuesday

        Thanks. Sadly, my only nude shoes are sandals and too casual. I’m going to run out later & look around, so I’ll check DSW again, and/or Nordstrom Rack for jewelry and a bag. I was stuck on black shoes (because I have umpteen pairs of black shoes), but knew that sounded boring.

        Most people attending the party will be coming from work, so I don’t have to make it too party-ish, but I’m coming from home, and my running errands clothes won’t do.

        • TCFKAG

          With black shoes, I’d definitely look for some brightly colored jewelry to add a pop of color then. BUT, if its a work-type event where many people will be in business casual to business formal attire, I wouldn’t worry about dressing it up too much.

          • Tuesday

            Once upon a time, I had a job & wouldn’t have worried how to dress for this sort of occasion, but I’ve lost the knack after too much time at home. The whole thing is making me nervous. It’s a birthday party at a restaurant, and I’m sure most of the attendees will come straight from work, and most are the type who wear suits to work.

        • PollyD

          Well, as long as you are shopping …. how about yellow shoes? Or green! Turquoise! Purple! Or, in slightly more practical vein, pewter/grey? I would totally put nonblack shoes with this dress.

    • Bluejay

      I think it is nice the way the model is styled – with bare legs and peep toes (maybe don’t stand in peepee stance though). I’d also like it with colorful peep toes, or you could go with a colorful, black or nude pump.

      • Former MidLevel

        Second the idea of colorful shoes. Ann Taylor has some cute bright shoes in their new collection, for just one example.

        • a.

          Colorful shoes or particularly festive black ones all the way. Pick up whatever color you choose (and you could really go with just about anything) in your accessories. Bam. Done.

      • Susan

        “peepee stance” thanks, Bluejay! I nearly snarfed my black tea from reading that. *still chuckling* My cubefarm neighbors already know I’m crazy, so they’re not surprised by these sounds anymore.

    • Tuesday

      So, I’m back from shopping. There were colorful shoes at DSW, but in styles that were waaaaaay beyond me. I got a pair of dark red patent pumps. These are actually my very first pair of red shoes.

      The other colored shoes I saw were generally too high and/or too bright (many were bordering on neon). Or they didn’t fit — I’m between sizes in several brands.

      Thanks for all for the suggestions.

  26. DJ

    Hoping for help from the hive… since I’ve found this site, it really has opened my eyes that I’m not the most fashionably up to date person in the world! lol! And I have a question regarding the *gasp* nude hose issue. I’m a District Attorney in a rural community that reaches 110f in the summertime, and am in court every day for motions, preliminary hearings, etc. So a court day is a ‘normal’ day for me. Our office is strict on the suit-or-jacket policy, but beyond that, you can push the limits a bit. Normally, if I wear hose at all, its something black, with a pattern. In wintertime maybe tights. In summer, usually nothing. In trial, everything changes… I always wear NUDE color hose. In trial, my philosophy is you go as conservative as possible… you want the jury to think about your facts, not your outfit! Plus, in nude hose, if you get a run in the middle of closing argument, its not nearly as noticable! But now, after reading this board, I’m wondering, are the nude hose themselves something of a remarkable fashion faux pas? So my question is, for the fashion forward litigators, what hose do you wear for jury trials?

    • Former MidLevel

      I would always wear nude hose (nice ones, not ones from a drugstore eggshell) for jury trials, interviews, and other formal events where, as you noted, you don’t want the focus to be on your clothes.

      • Former MidLevel

        Full disclosure – I am Team Hose (see above). Discount my opinion as you see appropriate. :)

    • TCFKAG

      DJ — if I was on a jury and saw a DA in nude hose, I wouldn’t think anything of it (presuming you aren’t wearing hose seven shades too dark for your skin tone). But I think you have the right instinct — older members of the jury (aka my mom) would actually be quasi-offended/shocked to see you NOT wearing hose. (I have to presume you live somewhere in the south…though I guess it could be AZ — tends to be maybe more conservative?) Anyway, I would trend towards the things that would shock/offend the least number of people.

      The absolute worst that could happen with nude hose at trial is that there might be ONE fashionista on the panel who thinks you’re behind the times. But w/o hose, the older, lady jurists might ALL decide you “don’t respect the court room” or something.

      Anyway, thats why I would vote nude hose. Or at the very least, don’t worry about it.

      • D. Ct. Clerk

        Have you seen the federal jury pool? Way more grandmas than fashionistas. But seriously, I think even fashionistas know courts are conservative places. An you don’t see male attorneys wondering if they should go sockless or wear super-slim suits to better emulate the models in GQ.

        • TCFKAG

          I have seen the federal jury pool — that’s why I said you were way more likely to offend a grandma than shock a fashionista. :-P

      • TCFKAG

        However, as noted above, I am also on Team Hose — so….yeah. I’m practically proselytizing for hose on here sometimes.

    • Jules

      I think for some serious fashionistas nude hose are a faux pas. I remember reading a quote from Sarah Jessica Parker a few years ago that women should never wear pantyhose, even when it’s freezing, and that sometimes you just have to suffer for fashion. Okay, I do love SJP, but really? And the needs of a corporette are not the same as a fashionista, since by definition we have to deal with the whole looking-professional thing.

      I agree you need to go extra-conservative in a jury trial, and that probably means nude-for-you hose. However, in a long-ish trial — more than several days — I’ve loosened up a bit. I figure the jury has gotten to know me and is no longer judging apperances so much (and I only have so many suits). The last time I had a two-week trial, in the second week I began to wear more pantsuites or unmatched skirts and jackets. If the weather were super-hot, I’d probably go bare legged, as long as the skirt was long enough that it didn’t show too much leg.

        • TCFKAG

          Not that I’m saying she doesn’t look good — just that she’d stand out a bit in a law office. :-P

        • Jules

          Tee hee. Of all the outfits she wears on that site, only about two of them could possibly ever be worn by anyone I know IRL. But it did look like in a few of them she was wearing sheer black HOSE. What gives? Are you telling me that SJP changes her position on issues of fashion? I’m shocked, shocked.

    • Associette

      I am into fashion and always wear hose to court. I think Nude hose for jury trials are good, though I am not afraid of black either.

    • KLG

      I am definitely on Team Nude Hose in Court. I’ve been baffled by the “Kate Middleton is bringing back nude hose” headlines from awhile back. I never knew it was a faux pax because it’s what I’m used to seeing!

    • Anne

      Along the lines of this topic… does anyone have good suggestions for non-drugstore (slightly nicer) nude hose? I am especially interested in something *without* a control top (if that even exists ). TIA!

      • DJ

        I like Hanes Silk Reflections, very smooth and soft feeling, seem pretty sturdy (I usually get more than one wear out of them, which is good for me because I tend to be rough on hose!) and I believe they come in a non-control top style. Macy’s carries them.

        Well, I’m very relieved to know I’m not totally in the dark ages with my nude hose… I missed the whole debate but have seen it referenced in other topics, usually lumped together with blue nailpolish and hair bands on the wrist. ;-) Looks like I’ll be sticking with my nude hose in trial.

        Also think I’ll look for linen suits for summer, thanks, anansensical!

      • Salit-a-gator

        Donna Karen hose is fantastic – very easy to find nude-for-every-skintone colors, comes with or without control top, and they make a petite hose for those of us who are not gifted in the height department – this means that the top does not reach up to your bra line to suffocate you! Very good stuff, and it lasts a long time. I hand wash mine in the sink and then hang to dry.

    • Bonnie

      Am I the only one on Team nude legs? I wear tights in the winter but when it’s warm, I go bare legged. Even in trial. I don’t think a jury’s verdict will change based upon whether I’m wearing hose. I don’t judge others for wearing them, but they’re too much of a hassle for me.

      • DJ

        Prior to ’07, I don’t know where I would have landed in the hose vs. nude legs debate, but now its a non-issue for me… in ’07 I was in an accident and have rather noticible scarring both on my lower legs from a gas fire and on my thighs from the skin graph donar sites. It would be way too distracting to a jury for me to have bare legs. Even on non-trial days I usually wear knee-high boots with suits… probably breaking a few ‘rules’ there, too, but I know all of our judges pretty well and none of them are very judgemental regarding wardrobe details. ;-)

    • anon prosecutor

      I’m a prosecutor in a big west coast city. I hate nude hose, but always, always wear them to court. I practice exclusively in appellate courts, but I imagine it would be even more necessary in front of a jury. I think that older jurors especially might react negatively if you went bare legged. I also think pant suits are fine, and would avoid this whole issue.

  27. Looking for some input

    Looking to blow my paltry bonus (darn economy!) on a new laptop. My company’s corporate discount would bring the higher end 11″ macbook air down to $1127 – thoughts?

    • TCFKAG

      I adore my macbook air. I’ve now had two (see several weeks ago where I spilled on the first one…don’t get me started). I’d at least LOOK at a 13″ — they are so light that you really can get away with a bigger screen.

      But, unless you have a TON of stuff you need to store ON your computer, I’m not sure why you’d need the increased memory of the macbook pro (which feels like a brick compared to the air). Plus the solid state hard drive is awesome. Plus…its just fabulous in every way (and I was a PC girl before this purchase.)

      So yeah….I guess that’s my two cents.

      • OP

        Thanks! I have tomorrow off and may be making a trip to the apple store to peruse…

    • jcb

      I really love my macbook air, so much. I bought it for travel, but have ended up using it more than my macbook pro at home because it’s so much lighter and just easier to deal with. It’s also blisteringly fast. I don’t need it to store anything, though – all of my music and photos are on the pro, so I guess it would depend on how you’re going to use it.

      • jcb

        Also – it is just wonderful how the pro/iphone/air sync. Another plus if you have one of those other apple products.

    • EC MD

      Macbook Air fan as well. I got it to replace my old 500 lb macbook and LURVE it. I carry it everywhere, just drop it in my purse to go to work. I do run out of space on it (perhaps due to the number of TV shows I download…I don’t know) but otherwise, it is perfect.

      • TCFKAG

        Ah, but ECMD, with the new Cloud you should be able to save a good deal of those TV shows off your computer, freeing space. Get the geniuses to tell you how!

    • ks

      If you travel via air at all, you will LOVE the 11 inch screen. The person in front of you can recline their seat all the way and will not impact your screen at all – heaven!

      • ks

        * important for those of us back in steerage trying to get a little work done.

  28. Madeline

    Last December, I wrote asking advice about the Mirena. I wanted to provide a quick follow-up and thank everyone for their advice. Many of you told me you had cramping for several months, but that after 5 months or so, everything was fine and you loved it. So I stuck with it and didn’t ask the GYN to remove it, and now I’m thrilled. After about 5 to 6 months, I have very little cramping, little bleeding, and it’s great not having to be on the pill. Thank you!

    On a different note, I recently bought these ankle boots in brown, but need styling advice. How do I wear them? http://www.amazon.com/dp/B003H9MEZU/ref=pe_175190_21431760_cs_sce_dp_1

    • a.

      I like! Just kind of curious–how bulky is the folded-over bit? I feel like that would play into wearability with pants. I think these would look okay with skirts, though, because of the more finished top. Not always a given with ankle boots.

      As far as colors go, I wear brown with um, everything, including black, so according to me the world is your oyster.

      …argh I feel like that’s all really general. I wear my ankle boots (which tuck into pants) with just about everything I own. I think they look best with skinny jeans, but they also play well with work pants. If I’m feeling edgier I’ll wear them with skirts or dresses and tights. Does this help at all?

    • TCFKAG

      I’m glad Mirena worked out for you — it is really much easier than the pill!

      In terms of the ankle boots, I’ve got nothing. Maybe formal shorts?

      I’m just kidding, I think they’d be great with kind of an edgy dress or skinny jeans. Or as I learned yesterday is a “thing” with jean shorts over tights. :-P

  29. OP

    I am beyond excited now – Thanks for the input ladies, I was waffling a bit but I feel fully justified now!!!

    • OP

      Ugh, that was a response to everyone’s input on the Macbook Air… Reply fail

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