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Our daily workwear reports suggest one piece of work-appropriate attire in a range of prices.
‘How absolutely perfect are these pull-on pants from Vince? Pleated pants suffered from bad PR after some unfortunate '80s and '90s iterations, but these are just right. The fabric is lightweight and breathable — perfect for scorching summer commutes.
Add a slouchy blazer and your favorite loafers and you’ll be good to go for any occasion.
The pants are $325 at Nordstrom and Vince and come in sizes XXS–3X.
(Psst: great loafers, aren't they?)
Hunting for something similar but more affordable? Check out Everlane's Dream Pant ($88, sizes XXS–4X).
Sales of note for 8.30.24
- Nordstrom – Summer Sale, save up to 60%
- Ann Taylor – 30% off full-price purchase; $99 jackets, dresses & shoes; extra 50% off sale
- Banana Republic Factory – 50-70% off everything + extra 20% off
- Bergdorf Goodman – Final Days Designer Sale, up to 75% off; extra 20% off sale
- Boden – 20% off
- Brooks Brothers – Extra 25% off clearance
- Eloquii – Up to 60% off everything; extra 60% off all sale
- J.Crew – 40% off sitewide; extra 60% off sale styles
- J.Crew Factory – Extra 20% off orders $125+; extra 60% off clearance; 60%-70% off 100s of styles
- Lo & Sons – Summer sale, up to 50% off (ends 9/2)
- Madewell – Extra 40% off sale; extra 50% off select denim; 25% off fall essentials
- M.M.LaFleur – Save 25% sitewide
- Rothy's – End of season sale, up to 50% off
- Spanx – Lots of workwear in the big sale, some up to 70% off
- Talbots – 25% off regular-price purchase; 70% off clearance
- White House Black Market – Up to 70% off sale
Ellen
I love pleated pants because they generally allow a mild amount of expansion, but these are clearly for the girls who look like a bone, not larger girls like me with shorter legs and a larger tuchus! My sister Rosa has pants like these which she uses when she needs to go out to the Club or even shopping in Downtown Chapaqua. Men seem to love looking at her even more then me now, as being super skinny is coming back in — My Grandma Leyeh calls it the Pandemic Look, which I don’t understand, because women are getting bigger, not smaller. Dad says when he was young, models had to look like little girls, and a model named Twiggy was the biggest sensation, even though she looked very tiny, like a Twig, he says.
Anonymous
TW: body image
I’ve never liked my body, it was always too fat. It felt undisciplined.
I’m working on the emotional side of this, but also want to lean into the things I can do in the physical world to support my efforts. I’ve decided to see what 6 months of putting time and money aimed at this purpose does for me. For instance, I’m going to increase how often I get my hair done instead of stretching it out to 10-12 weeks between appointments. A good haircut and color always makes me feel put together. I’m going to try getting a massage occasionally to see if it also helps. Any other favorite ways you make yourself feel good/better about your physical self?
Second, I want to partially revamp my non-work wardrobe. (I’m an 18, busty, and average height.) Most is old, and I wear it because it fits, not because it’s serving me. Particularly I want to update the pants, which tend to Eileen Fisher “soft pants,” and may be comfortable but make me feel…”messy.” Any tips about the best way to do this? I’m willing to spend $ with a personal stylist, do something like Stitch Fix, etc. I’m in the DC area if you have specific locations to recommend.
Anonymous
I would look into the Kibbe body type concept. It helped me understand why I gravitated towards certain silhouettes and didn’t like others, and validated my rejection of the styles that didn’t suit me. It may also give you some ideas of styles that would look great on you that you might not have thought of.
Also be open to tailoring. Great tailoring can sometimes turn an item that fits just fine into something amazingly flattering. This is an older workwear example, but my tailor suggested adding a slight taper to the bottom of my sheath dresses and pencil skirts and it made the difference between dumpy and polished.
Anon
Ymmv but my relationship with my body changed when I started lifting. I became really impressed with what my body could do, was excited to progress, and loved seeing new muscles emerge. It also changed my relationship with food, as I shifted to eating to fuel myself for my workouts.
I also recently went back to regular gel manicures. I feel so much more put together with my nails done.
A.
Yeah after a lifetime of being allergic to working out (I kid, I kid…but also not really) I’ve fallen in love with a local gym and am now, I daresay, addicted to that place. They mix HIIT with heavy lifting and I’ve seen a huge change in my body. I weigh more now than I did when I started going a year ago, but my relationship with how I look is so much healthier. The culture at my gym celebrates accomplishment, trying/failing/getting back up again, and is super, super supportive. If that is something you’d consider, I highly recommend looking into something like this.
Anon
Agree. I am a lifelong athlete, and it really does help me focus on what my body can do.
As a side effect, even if it doesn’t make you skinny or even leaner, it will change your shape: your body gets former, toned, and the weight often sits more evenly.
Cora
For me its swimming but same idea – using my body to accomplish something physical makes me feel a lot better about it in general + less concerned with aesthetics.
Gel manicures + regular hair cuts help a lot too.
Anonymous
Came here to say this too. I started lifting as part of a weight loss effort this January. Weight loss has been very minimally successful but weight lifting provides so many benefits. Everyday life is easier. The groceries and the kitchen aid are no big deal. My back doesn’t hurt. I sleep better. My arms and legs looks much better, if not smaller. I can carry my seven year old upstairs. All this from a total of three sets of five exercises (four of which only use dumbbells) three days a week. Literally most of my workout is resting. I highly recommend this.
brokentoe
Can you share your routine?
Vicky Austin
Not Anonymous, but I have been following @megsquats with the intention of trying her @beforethebarbell program (go follow that Insta and it literally has everything you need) for over a year (baby). Maybe it will be useful for you!
Anonymous
I do squats or lunges ( not both), chest press, seated back row on the cable machine biceps curls, and triceps pushes. Aim for three sets of six with weights heavy enough that I can’t do more than about six in a row. I rest two minutes btwn each set. I do this thee times a week. I increase the weight if I can do too much more than six in a row. This is completely incomplete and imperfect. But it’s yielding amazing results.
anon
This is my experience too. Lifting makes me feel powerful and energetic, I can’t recommend it enough for body image and general hapiness/mental health improvement.
Anonymous
Taking long walks with my dog always helps me feel better about my physical self even though it doesn’t change how I look, at least not in the short run. A manicure and pedicure also help me feel put together. Lately I have been doing them at home with the Dazzle Dry system, including the ridge filler, with good results. Mascara, eyeliner, and lip gloss on no-makeup days. Cute workout, athleisure, and lounge clothes instead of schlumpy old sweats. Yoga. Drinking water all day from a fancy travel cup or water bottle. A nice bathrobe.
Antoinne Vargas
I agree. When I go walking through the park by myself, I am largely invisible, except to weirdos who want me to do unspeakable things with them. But when I borrow Spott, my neighbor’s Cockapoo for a walk down the same paths, I am invariably stopped and asked by men about Spott, what kind of dog is he, is he friendly, can he be petted, etc. etc., and as a result, I wind up striking up a conversation with these guys. Women remain standoffish, I suppose because they see me as competition for the men who play softball. I do like Spott, but mainly as a magnet for men, though I get many more aerobic steps which is good for my health, as well as Spott’s health. So maybe this is just another way to recommend that the OP get a dog she can walk to lose weight and feel better about herself, even if she does not wind up getting more men to date her.
Anon
… Ellen? is that you?
Anon
Rhymes with felon
Anon
I love this mindset! Good for you!
I read about this styling/color analysis company on another blog years ago, and always thought it could be worth the investment. https://redleopard.co.uk/
They’re in the UK but do virtual appointments.
Anon
I am the same size as you and have similar struggles. I can wear the exact same outfit as a thinner colleague and on her it looks polished and on me it looks sloppy. I don’t get it. Is it just size? Is my perception off? Do I need to wear super tailored clothing?
Anonymous
As counterintuitive as it is, most people who are not rail-thin look better in tailored clothing. Only super thin people generally look good in baggy stuff. On normal people looser silhouettes need to be balanced with a fitted element. Pants with loose legs generally look better fitted in the hip and waist. Loose top with fitted bottom or vice versa. Etc.
Anon
What is a ‘normal’ person???
Anon
Someone who didn’t win the genetic lottery. Not the Anonymous above; I thought her meaning was clear.
Anon
Not the OP, but I took it to mean people who are not fashion models in a photoshoot.
Trish
A normal or average American woman is 5’4” and 170 pounds. Certainly not the models that we see everyday in clothing that might not flatter us. (Now that I googled it, I am astonished that I am her. I am the normal one with these exact measurements, except I wear an A cup).
Anon
Great. Glad to know that I am not considered normal.
Anonymous
Won’t someone PLEASE think of the thin people?!
Moose
My theory is that our (society’s) eye has been trained to see certain body type as “stylish” because that’s what images we see the most. There’s usually only certain types of bodies that clothes are modeled on in most settings. Therefore, if the garment doesn’t look the same way on us (and it’s never gonna), we think it looks off. Also, if we’re subconsciously tuned to the setting that larger = sloppy, a garment that does not maximize conventional figure-flattery (think loose-fitting, breezy garments) will seem not ideal. The same is with anything that does not maximize youthfulness – the fear of frump. Same issue with fitted garments on curvy bodies = more inappropriate/sexual than on thin bodies (think fitted sheath dress in the workplace). Think of most catalogue/runway/whatever models – thin, no major curves, tallish. Anything that is the opposite is going to create tension in the fashion space and on our real-world bodies sometimes.
To be clear I’m not saying this to criticize anyone here, and I’m guilty of it myself. I’ve been larger and curcy since puberty and have had to grapple with it myself.
Anonymous
I really agree with this. Something that’s been helpful to me is following people with different body types to help my brain adjust. Some people I like on Insta are itsamandaroe, tanglesandstarlight, and diana.dares
Moose
Same! I love following all kinds of bodies, as well as shopping on sites like Universal Standard that showcase all clothing on different bodies.
Anonymous
What makes me feel good about my body is using it to do things I live! I’m your size and swimming is great, walking is great, I love dancing. Not at all from a fitness weight loss perspective but from a pleasure perspective.
And I like Ann Taylor a lot, Talbots has some good pieces, Eloquii, JCrew, Lafayette 148.
Anon
So you have good advice on lifting weights etc.
On the clothes side, chuck whatever is old or frayed or has seen better days. Critically examine them for fit. Fit is everything. Wear colours that suit you. Material that drapes and flows. Polished jewelry. Better to have a few good pieces that many mediocre ones.
Tailored blazers. I am curvy size 10 and look best in wovens not knits. Knits make me look lumpy.
V or scoop necks if you’re busty. Get a friend whose style you like to be honest with you.
Anonymous
Throwing money at things isn’t discipline and isn’t going to fix the hole you’re feeling—it might even make you feel worse as it’s just a recipe to keep throwing money and not feeling happy. I would start with therapy.
anon
Therapy is just a different form of throwing money at the problem – no better or worse.
Anon
Yes. I’ve found the money is sometimes better spent on something that concretely directly helps.
Anon
Definitely not. Therapists are trained for specialized mental health care. Seeing a therapist is caring for your mental health the way seeing a dentist is caring for your teeth.
anon
I disagree. She said getting her hair done makes her feel good. Why shouldn’t she get her hair done more often if it makes her feel good?
I like painting my nails- they make me feel polished and are a pretty cheap way to have a slight boost. Do I hate myself when my nails aren’t painted? No, of course not. But is it so terrible to spend some money on something that makes me feel good? I feel similarly when I replace my old ratty underwear or buy some new lipstick.
Trish
“I’m working on the emotional side of this, but also want to lean into the things I can do in the physical world to support my efforts.” Try responding to what people ask for.
Vicky Austin
+1.
Anonymous
Therapy is basically just throwing money at it.
Anon
Or throw $ at things, but in a disciplined way. Don’t try to fix everything at once. Buy outfits and road test them and then decide if it works before buying more. It can be cathartic to walk out of a store with shopping bags and feel like you are “done” but often, you’ve got to live in things for a while to see if things work IRL for you and your life.
Athleta is a good place for casual outfits that work in many settings and may inspire you to be more active.
I left DC and to me, the style there can be very basic (which is good for workwear) but it was hard to find anything wow that wasn’t $$$. So my sympathies there. For casual pieces that aren’t workout wear, Sue Sartor and ShopBuru have really different pieces. Tuckernuck seems to be good inspiration (and IIRC, maybe there are located in DC with a storefront) and I like their athletic pieces but haven’t bought any non-sporty things from there.
Anonymous
Who says she wants to be inspired to be more active or that she isn’t active now?
Athleta is not the place to go for polished work looks
Anon
This is not my experience. When I have been feeling bad about the way I look, changing something about the way I look or treat myself has helped! If I’ve gained some weight and am wearing the same old clothes that don’t fit right or bring me joy, sometimes when I step back, I realize I’m kind of punishing myself. So showing myself love and care by buying new clothes that fit and look great is an act of self love that really does make me feel better.
Anon
I am currently a 16-18, busty, and short. I also have always had a hard relationship with my body. Things that I do to feel put together: cut and color my hair professionally every 4 weeks, manicures every two weeks (I’ve been doing at home gel manicures for 10+ years because I was too poor right out of law school to go to a salon, and I don’t know why, but having my nails done just makes me feel more together), buying clothes that fit and look nice. In that vein, I buy new things when they are starting to look old or just blah. I do Stitch Fix and really have had some great finds for business casual shirts/blazers. I’m too short for most of their pants to work for me. I like Torrid’s selection of pants since they are a much broader size range than most. I also like Talbot’s capris for summer and Hampshire pants for warmer temps. Also, I like to wear nice underwear/bras in pretty patterns. My current favorites are the Embraceable from Soma for underwear and bras from Bare Necessities for bigger busts. Finally, nice costume jewelry from Amazon or Etsy like simply huggie earrings and simple bracelets.
Anonymous
Sounds like a fab plan!
For clothes:
Think about which materials, shapes and styles you know you feel good in, you could even do a pintrest board of looks you are drawn to and would like to copy.
What makes the EF pants sloppy? Is it lack of structure, too loose fit, thin material? Put aside some time to think about style and what that means to you. What do you want to project? Friendly? Competent? Classic? In charge? Relaxed? Lots of small tweaks can be made with color and fabric choices.
Get rid of all the clothes that you know doesn’t serve you. Quarantine them if you prefer. As a busty person, make sure your bras are the best fit you can get and afford. Shape and size make a massive difference in the fit of other clothes. Minimisers are the worst, they push the girls under your pits and broaden your shape. Upwards and forward!
Anonymous
I feel happier in my body when I’m learning a new physical skill. Mostly I discovered this via wanting to keep up with my kids. Things I have enjoyed are learning to ice skate and taking private swimming lessons to feel more confident in deep water.
Anon
Eyebrows and undergarments/bras!
Anonymous
These are good ones!
Anon
I like having a few safety outfits that are pre-set for days when I’m not feeling my best. That helps a lot to have some go-tos that are flattering and I know make me feel confident. I agree with the others that some appearance maintenance like gel manicures make me feel good (but I also chafe at many of the gendered standards for women, like the research showing women who wear ‘natural look’ to medium makeup are rated most competent). On bad days I remember my Nana who was a beautiful person and had similar body struggles to mine, and remember sometimes we inherit the whole package.
Anon
Doing yoga has helped me get stronger, and improved my poor/slouchy posture, which makes you look sloppy no matter what you are wearing. And I’m one who hates exercise…. Yoga has also helped my mental health, and as I’m less anxious, I snack less (I use food a lot for self-soothing).
For my appearance, it makes a big difference when I at least do quick swipe of my brows and color on my lips (my lips, but better). Look people in the eyes. Smile.
I still haven’t figured out the clothes part yet…. yes, tailoring…
Anonymous
This is awesome. There is nothing wrong with loving beauty and personal style. I consider this treating myself well and I live this stuff.
Style is a journey- be thoughtful and intentional but also understand that we all buy things sometimes that don’t work out.
Definitely book a stylist appointment at a big department store and tell them that you’re looking for casual pants. Buy your favorite two or three styles and make sure you have tops and shoes to coordinate. The good stores will tailor and hem them. Building a relationship with a department store stylist is something that the most fashionable women I know do.
I spent years not spending on casual stuff because I thought only my work and going out stuff “mattered.” Not true. I have cute joggers and fresh casual sneakers right now because I want to few good even if it’s just a grocery run. I have a standard lineup of elevated casual outfits for anything more serious than that. (Right now it’s rompers and sundresses very fun flat sandals and big earrings- it will be jeans and great blouses in the fall.)
Also casual style is often enchanted by accessories, whether that’s an earring or bracelet or hat. New glasses or sunglasses if you wear them. Do you have a great (not necessarily expensive but great) handbag? Maybe treat yourself to a new perfume too, if you wear it.
Do you enjoy facials? I find them relaxing and while they’re not Botox (which I also love) they do give me a polished glow for a few days. You might consider reevaluating your makeup and skincare routine. Not a complete overhaul, but a chemical exfoliation treatment and some glowy serum can go far for my confidence. Also do you have your eyebrows under control? Great professionally done eyebrows go far.
This all sounds like a lot but meet yourself where you are. If you don’t wear makeup start with maybe just lipgloss and tinted moisturizer. Don’t trade your comfy flats for heels, trade them for more beautiful flats.
Good luck and have fun!!
Anonymous
I’m about your size as well and here are some things that work for me:
1) Lifting and exercising. Exercising does not particularly change my body shape and it definitely doesn’t make me lose weight – not even running. I’m a slow, fat runner and lifter. But I do it because it makes me FEEL great.
2) Regular, frequent hair appointments – great idea. I also get Botox 3-4 times a year, and have gotten laser hair removal for my stupid mustache and chin hairs. Those are things that make me feel so much more pulled together. I’m not suggesting you have to do this by any means. Just sharing what works for me.
3) Consistent, good makeup. Take yourself to Sephora or the Laura Mercier makeup counter and find a really easy set of products that work for you. For me, it’s a light foundation, concealer, a soft eyeshadow crayon, and lipstick.
4) Nails aren’t a big deal for me but every time I have a manicure I feel like a fancy lady :)
5) On clothes: I highly recommend working with a good friend or a stylist. Mine is Lila Fox and she’s wonderful; I’ve worked with her when i was a size 26 and when I was a size 14 and she’s been lovely and nonjudgmental and helpful every time. Lilafoxstyle.com She can help you put together a few outfits that are real winners, and then you can use those outfits as “guidance” for how to shape more outfits. I find that I feel a lot better if I wear a “good outfit” more times, rather than wearing a lot of different but suboptimal pieces.
6) I’d invest in really good, well-fitting bras, underwear, and shapewear (if you like it – I personally do but YMMV).
7) Massage is a great idea!
I think the key with all of this stuff is to make it part of your regular routine. Schedule the hair appointments in advance, set up a standing massage, etc. It is so much easier when you’re not thinking about all of this and reorganizing your schedule to make it work.
Finally: good luck. I sometimes think about how much energy I’ve wasted feeling bad about my body. I still have the same body, but I now try to spend a lot less time worrying about it and a lot more time focused on what I can DO with my body and that has helped.
Meredith
Someone on here suggested Leslie Hooper and honestly her program that includes exercise, food habits and body image has been life-changing.
Also check out Styled by Sally on Insta for suggestions for simple tailoring that makes things fit better.
Anon
Whitening my teeth (just with Crest White strips, not anything expensive) always makes me feel better about my appearance.
JD
Since having a baby, I’ve never quite felt myself again. I like trying to wear one thing that makes me feel better in my outfits. This may be a forgiving top in a very flattering color, or more easily shoes, a bag or statement jewelry that I really love. You can put a lot of personality into accessories, and they won’t give you bad fit days. I may not be feeling my best, but having a cool pair of shoes on always makes me feel better.
Anonymous
I’m the same size as you basically. Hugs, it is tough. I would say yes to the hair… get some new bras that are comfortable and look good… get some spanx that feels good to you. After that I’d lean into 3-4 neutral outfits that fit you immaculately (tailored for sure) and you can wear repeatedly so that people don’t notice too much.
Anonymous
I am recently postpartum and looking for some casual clothes that aren’t always leggings and tees. I am currently cusp sized and normally carry my weight in my stomach and top half, even when not postpartum. I looked at some regular length shirts recently, and even not cropped, they seem so short!
anon
I’m about 6 months PP and have changed the way I dress. I’m about 15 lbs up from my pre pregnancy weight, but many of my pants still fit and the weight has migrated into my stomach and b*easts.
I’ve sized up in shirts and generally go for baggier cuts now. Talbots, Loft, and some of the wider cuts at TJ Maxx/Marshalls work well on me now. I try to accessorize with earrings or a necklace when at work; those things have to come off around the baby because she grabs everything.
Wrap dresses work well and are generally slimming on the top half. I have so many dresses that I don’t wear now because they aren’t compatible with pumping or b feeding, so consider that if buying a dress.
I’ve also leaned into wearing heels again. They hurt too much in pregnancy but at this point I’ll take anything to feel somewhat normal and not frumpy again.
JD
I haven’t figured this out yet and mostly wear leggings or quasi-legging pants. I think clothing has been very weird the last five years (although maybe that’s just because I’m not the 20’s/early 30’s target. 90s jeans and crop tops are just not flattering to most people.
Anon
I wore a lot of Vuori pants postpartum. They have joggers and other styles of pants besides leggings, though I guess they’re still somewhat legging-adjacent. Current styles of shirts are the worst! So short.
Anonymous
I posted a few weeks ago about suggestions on packing for sleepaway camp since I’ve never been. Daughter (10) leaves next week for a 2 week stay and it looks like it is going to pour rain and be cold (high 40s at night, low 70s and rain during the day) for the entire first week. Any suggestions on things that might make it better? Obviously rain gear. I was thinking maybe a few extra towels and pairs of socks since nothing will have a chance to air-dry, sweatshirt/pants if she needs them to sleep in, and crocs for wearing around when everything is wet? There is no laundry service and she’ll be in the boonies of Maine.
Thank you from this mom and kid who were not nervous until the weather turned ;).
Anonymous
Make sure she has a real outdoor sleeping bag, not an indoor “slumber bag.” A cottony bag will get damp and never dry. Same for clothes–performance fabrics will dry more quickly and keep her more comfortable than cotton.
Anonymous
I would go fleece over sweatshirt she has one. Damp sweatshirts take FOREVER to dry.
Anonymous
Pull-on rainboots.
A.
These are great ideas! Also mosquito repellent and/or a thermacell. Rain can really reactivate those suckers.
Anonymous
I just want to reassure you that it will be okay. I was a camp counselor, and vividly remember the day it rained for 9 days straight in a 2-week session. We were all going slightly crazy but we made it work and the kids had fun. We kept doing outdoor activities (it was a nature camp; it was basically all outside) but also did things like secretly put kids’ stuff in the staff dryer so it would actually dry and had a Pacific NW grunge day (this was in the 90s) to celebrate the weather. Also, it is hard to imagine a weather forecast that is entirely accurate a week in advance. It can’t hurt to pack extra clothes and also to talk to your daughter about conserving dry clothes – e.g., save dry clothes for when she will be able to stay dry like at night, and wear wet/damp clothes when she is going to be outside a lot.
Anon
Hot Hands
Rope (for stringing clotheslines — towels will not dry well in damp wet weather, so she may need some and many camps have these outside and she will need to add to her tent / cabin)
Rain poncho will cover any daypacks vs a raincoat that won’t.
A merino buff (can use as turtleneck or hat)
Long wool socks
Vicky Austin
Consider buying a quick dry microfiber camp towel?
Anonie
Maybe one of those microfiber towel-turbans that have a button for her hair? Putting that on wet hair when she’s in her cabin or tent might feel really good, and it would dry faster than a “real” towel.
Agree with the Crocs, or a pair of plastic flip flops which will pack smaller and probably dry out faster.
A visor or baseball cap for wearing out in the rain – keeping drops off the face helps a lot. Waterproof if possible.
Portable battery powered fan – powering that up and aiming it at wet stuff will help it dry faster.
Anonymous
Our experience with those microfiber towels is that they mildew very quickly in a humid environment.
Anon
Wool socks work really well for this – lightweight ones to wear during the day (they dry quickly and are more comfortable when wet), and then a separate warmer pair for her to save just for sleeping in. Warm dry socks make sleeping in the cold much more comfortable. If she runs cold, a lightweight wool beanie to sleep in would be good, though I wouldn’t usually need one in high-40s. As others have noted, stay away from cotton as much as possible. It’ll be fine – when you’re all running around muddy and soggy in the rain together, it’s a bonding experience!
Anon
How are you tracking your period these days? I used to use an app but deleted it (and the data) based on recommendations following overturn of R vs. W.
Anonymous
I mark the start date on my calendar.
anon2
I still use an app – Flo.
Anonymous
TBH, i went back to the built in Apple iHealth tracker. I figured they would suffer a major reputation loss if they shared that information and it would be well publicized. I found I needed to record it in app form.
anon
I’m in California and have no concerns using the Apple-made period tracking app on my watch. However, I wouldn’t trust most companies with any health information and probably would just use a symbol on a paper calendar if I lived in a state that restricted women’s access to health care.
Anonymous
I print out a one-page annual calendar and X off the days.
anonshmanon
same. Easy peesy.
Cat
I still use an app. Shrug.
anon
I still use the app, P Tracker
Anonymous
+1. I never created an account though.
Anon Clue User
Clue is based on Germany. They already have strict privacy laws, and no incentive to cooperate with nutty US data requests. As a bonus, it’s not overly pink or focused on fertility. You can track a ton of stuff and there’s a paid version with additional features, but I’m only in it to track periods and the free version is great.
Vicky Austin
I also like Clue.
AIMS
I am forever team paper planner and I just put a big red dot on my start date on my paper planner.
Anonymous
I use the tracker that comes with my iPhone. I used to have a separate app, but this works well.
Anonymous
I still just use Clue. I’m perimenopausal so I feel like there are more benefits to keeping track of symptoms than there are to having the Overlords wonder if I’m pregnant.
Anonfor
Relationship query. I caught DH in a white lie about something stupid and inane. Not the first time. I confronted him, he agreed that it was stupid and apologized. I trust that nothing major is going on under the surface (e.g. cheating) but now all alerts are on guard. Honesty is important to me, which he knows, but I think he just sometimes has trouble with telling the whole truth. For you, is this something worth exploring in counseling, just accepting, or dtmf territory?
anon
What?!? No of course you don’t get divorced over a white lie without trying counseling to explore this further.
Anonymous
I don’t even think white lies require counseling. they’re totally normal.
Anon
What is this white lie about? DTMF seems like a very extreme and outsized reaction to catching your spouse drinking straight from the juice container or hiding the shirt he shrunk in the dryer.
If it is truly as benign as that, I think you definitely would benefit from exploring your reaction with the help of outside therapy.
Anon
+1 Important to know what the white lie is. “The whole truth” can be exhausting for both parties; it can feel like being a child again who has to report all goings-on to parents and authority figures.
Antoinne Vargas
I agree that you should get to the root of the problem, but based on what you’ve told us, it is too early to DTMFA, even if he later turns out to be an A.
For now, be on the lookout for telltale signs of infidelity; unexplained time away from home, but not at work, questionable charges on the credit card, but more likely, larger new and unexplained cash withdrawals, tell-tale signs of unexplained food stains on his ties, text messages from numbers you don’t know, prodigious amounts of caked semen in his underpants, lipstick or perfume on his clothing, etc. Once you have a few of these, you can figure out what is going on, and it’s not at all related to Scrabble games.
Anonymous
Pot-stirring alert.
Anonymous
“all alerts are on guard.” What is it about this one white lie that is causing you to go to high-alert level–even to the point of assuring us he isn’t cheating. What did he lie about?
Cat
The fact that you’re calling these white lies seems to indicate that they aren’t a big deal, and so I would just accept it… unless you have more context you didn’t include here that these are lies about something significant, but that would move them out of white lie territory in the first place. You’ve never glossed over *anything* with your spouse?
Vicky Austin
Same. A common conversation:
My husband, who worries a lot about my forgetfulness and also about car safety generally: “Did you get gas?”
Me, who did not remember to get gas: “…Yes.”
Me: *gets gas the next morning*
Cb
Right? My husband is a worrywart and sometimes I tell white lies so he doesn’t worry. When I’m in work city, I definitely don’t go through the Holy Lands after dark and eat 3 square meals.
He is very forgetful though and hasn’t realised that it’s always me who finishes off the bag of tortilla chips :)
Anon
Just happened to me this week:
Husband: Did you remember to go get that chip in your windshield repaired?
Me: Yes.
Also me, minutes later: gets online and makes appointment for chip repair at our neighborhood Jiffy Lube
Anonymous
I honestly find people who demand 100% truth at all times to be annoying pedantic bores. Why are you invested in catching him in a lie? Why even figure that out? If I want to say there was traffic but actually there wasn’t I stopped for an ice cream and didn’t tell you, why do you care so much to not let me have that moment of privacy?
Monday
The fact that you’re considering DTMF suggests (to me!) that you’re more concerned than you let on. As in, you actually do suspect that something major might be going on.
If you know you’re overly anxious and always assume the worst, maybe that’s all it is. Counseling seems like a good idea regardless.
OP
Thanks all, good reality check. The lie involved interactions with a female coworker – so, while I don’t believe it’s a cheating thing that’s what made me react strongly.
No Face
This may take it out of white lie territory.
Monday
+1. Either he uses “white lies” because you have a track record of snooping and being suspicious for no reason, or he’s trying/planning to cover something up. If not in this particular instance, then elsewhere.
Cat
Agree with No Face and Monday.
Anonie
I mean, what was it?
Anon
Oooh. I think this promptly takes it out of “white lie” territory. “Agreeing it was stupid and apologizing” doesn’t really give you an explanation as to why he lied- which I think is the most important part.
NYNY
My husband will lie to me about things he feels sensitive about, or which he worries I will judge him unfavorably. He has insomnia, ADHD, and is a night owl by nature, so he often goes to bed very late. Sometimes he tells me an earlier time if I ask him when he came to bed. I’ve learned not to ask, because I don’t want to put him on the spot. If your husband’s lie is something similar, then you may want to talk to him about the root of the lie and set out terms and expectations around the issue.
If any lies, even harmless ones, are a dealbreaker for you, then you and he probably need counseling to work through your issues and make a plan, but know that you will have to reckon with your own issues, not just his.
Cora
I was struggling with how to word it, but I know I’ve said lies like this in the past. Its completely a me-and-my-ADHD issue, doesn’t have anything to do with cheating or the relationship. Personally, I think what you’re doing around not putting him on the spot is the right strategy.
If he came to you and said “I don’t know why I’m so tired” it would probs make sense to talk about those white lies – but if its only affecting him and not you I’d let it be.
Anonymous
“Not the first time”
He’s lying to you on the regular about minor stuff? That seems off and like a weird dynamic. Maybe counseling?
Anon
While I don’t think white lies as a big deal, my husband and I have a pact not to engage in them. It does undermine the relationship eventually. We’re not perfect at it, but we do pretty immediately confess and have a good laugh about it.
how to be a more visible ally
I’m a mom, and I’ve realized that support for the LGBT community isn’t as robust in my liberal community as I hoped. Most of my activism isn’t visible (giving to campaigns, writing letters, teaching my kids my values, etc).
I figure it might help someone to know that Sally’s mom is really supportive, even if they never want to actually talk with me. How can I best signal that I’m a supportive person to my kids’ friends? Do I put up a progress pride flag in my house? Display a donation thank you from Lambda Legal on my fridge? Is there something I’m missing entirely?
JK
Perhaps there is less support due to ambivalent feelings about the QT? Many progressives are concerned about the h—phobia expressed in the new flag.
Anon
Yup. Support for gay marriage is at an all-time high (77%~) and has been increasing for years. Those gains were hard fought and deserve protection, not erosion from the inside.
anonshmanon
I don’t really understand how inclusion of marginalized groups equals erosion. The general concept seems very gatekeeping to me, whether is was devaluing the concept of marriage by expanding who can marry, or adding some extra colors to a flag.
Anon
Because many gay people resent being told that their homosexuality is exclusionary and hateful, to name just one issue. Rewriting history to erase the role of gay rights pioneers from pivotal moments, such as the creation of Pride, is another. Fred Sargeant, one of the Pride founders, was physically assaulted (at age 74) by the T side at a Pride parade. Is it any wonder many progressives aren’t on board?
Anonymous
Its also erasing history to pretend that all of these groups haven’t been present in the pride movement from the beginning. Or do Marsha P. Johnson and Sylvia Rivera not count?
Anonymous
Pride was created to commemorate stonewall, which, unless someone else is rewriting history, certainly involved trans and queer people, even if the term “transgender” came later. Certainly I am not arguing that lgbtq folks are or ever were a monolith but I think “erasure” could be a problem if you gloss over that.
anonshmanon
I just googled the Fred Sargeant thing. Violence is wrong, period. Without condoning this violent incident, I can also acknowledge that it’s dishonest to portray him as an innocent elderly gay guy who got attacked out of the blue, when he lends his enormous gay rights activist credibility to an organization that advocates broadly for anti-t*s policies (the LGB alliance).
Anon
There’s no justification for attacking him at all. The LGB Alliance advocates for the rights of gay people and there’s nothing wrong with that.
Anon
The best way you can be supportive is by raising kids who are supportive/supported themselves. Kids aren’t going to approach a friend’s parents randomly, but if that friend is supportive and the kid needs adult help, then the kid may reach out to your child.
Carrots
I’ve seen a couple of friend who are wearing small pins that either have the tr@ns flag or the rainbow flag on it as a way to signal their support. It’s something small, but if you start to wear it consistently, the person who needs to see it will see it.
Senior Attorney
I go all out in June — I have a Pride-striped handbag, Pride-striped sunglasses, and Pride-striped sneakers that I wear all month (generally not all at once but occasionally all at once). We are flying the (new) flag at our house this month, too.
The rest of the year I wear a small flag lapel pin and a bracelet with beads representing the colors of the trans flag. I started doing it when I was working at a charity event and ran into a couple of families with lovely trans daughters and it seemed weird to just approach them out of the blue, so I consulted with my daughter and came up with some visible signals of support.
anonymous
Not all heroes wear capes.
AIMS
I think you just try to make a good relationship with your kids and their friends. Ask questions, listen, make your house a safe and no. Judgmental space for them. My mom would not recognize any flag for its meaning but my friends all came to her my whole life with all their issues. They still do. I don’t think anyone is going to approach you because you have a lapel pin if they don’t know you and trust you in the first place.
Anonymous
This. Be genuine and welcoming, not performative.
Anonymous
This is the answer. My mom is currently a huge work mess about her (perhaps over the top) public pride support at her business. But the best thing she ever did (does) is care about young people and accept and treat them with respect. That’s true of her current employees and our friends as kids. I will say that for at least a decade she had a small HR campaign sticker on her car that didn’t go unnoticed- a neighbor of mine who always seemed shy talked to her for an hour after spotting it, for example -so I don’t think those gestures or totally meaningless even if most people here roll their eyes at a pride flag.
Anonymous
I think a pride flag is a lovely way to show support and not performative. Other ways:
Host the playdates, host the Girl Scout troop meetings. Make your home open and welcoming. Drive the carpool. Be present.
Be careful with your own language. Ask about pronouns. When you or the kids talk about “boyfriends,” be neutral about it so that kids can talk about boyfriends or girlfriends.
Tell your kids that you love them no matter what, and mean it.
Tell your kids’ friends that they are fabulous, amazing kids. Be interested in their lives. Listen to them.
I do these things (some better than others, I’m not perfect!) and have had multiple kids come out to me or raise questions/concerns with me.
Anon
The absolute best thing you can do would be to make sure you don’t promote suicidality. Many people have inadvertently failed to follow safe reporting guidelines on suicide or CDC guidance on avoiding copycats. It’s time to get back to “it gets better,” one of the best campaigns for gay youth there ever was, and not “it gets worse and you’re at risk of self-harm.”
JD
Maybe you’re not the neighborhood mom who other kids are going to come to for advice, and there’s nothing wrong with that. Are you the friend who always knows what’s going on across your networks and everyone comes to? If not, that may just not be your personality. If your kid knows your values, they are more likely to mention sticky situations that come up for their friends. Stick some progressive books or signs around and call it a day.
Anon8
Just got broken up with yesterday with a guy I’ve been seeing for about 2.5 months (both late 20s). We’re long distance and just spent what I felt was a great week together in my city. He has been so full on and “in it” since we started seeing each other–said I love you a few weeks in, talking about how he could see us getting married, super communicative and affectionate. I felt like something was off the past few days once he got back to his home city but chalked it up to anxiety because look how invested he seemed!
When he called me to end it it was like talking to a robot–no warmth or tenderness or acknowledgement of how serious we had been. He said his feelings just burned bright and faded out, that he’s been considering ending things since before he came to visit but wanted to see if things felt better in person and they didn’t. It’s hard not to feel like he liked the idea of me when he first met me and that over time I failed to measure up. I really, really, really liked him and saw a future with him–we already had plans for me to move to his city (thankfully nothing had been set in stone yet) and I really felt like I saw my life unfolding and that he was in it with me too and felt the same way. I haven’t had a bad breakup in maybe a decade and it just feels so unbearable.
No Face
This is for the best. Making plans to move, etc is just too much for a guy you barely know.
Cat
I’m sorry. That sounds like love-bombing which is super flattering and exciting to receive, but not so great when it ends. Shots Shots Shots, where are you?
Anon
Agreed. Things moving this fast is a sign that you’re both caught up in the excitement without knowing each other well enough to back up those feelings. I dated a guy who told me after two months that he wanted to marry me…and then after eight months of dating he realized his feelings didn’t develop like he thought they would. It sucks but consider yourself lucky that you didn’t waste more time with this guy. If things escalate this quickly in future consider it a red flag.
Senior Attorney
Agree so much. The only thing worse than this guy breaking up with you, is this guy marrying you.
Ask me how I know…
Anon
Oh I’m sorry that sucks. Your person will show up, it just wasn’t him. Hang in there and be nice to yourself. And don’t cut bangs.
Anon
This is hilarious, but true. Where were you when I needed this advice 20 years ago!?!
Monday
Every single one of my friends had this happen to her at some point, usually in our twenties. People can be intense and emotion-driven without knowing themselves well enough to be consistent partners or even follow through on the things they say. It’s not you, I guarantee.
anon.
My response in currently in mod, but I agree with this. It doesn’t hurt less. But it did cause my wonderful dad (who has been married to my mom for 50 years) to say “WHAT IS WRONG WITH THESE MEN!?”
Anon
Yep, happened to me in my 20s and all my friends too. It hurts like crazy, but it did teach me to be more guarded with my own feelings and not just take words at face value. And to be wary when a guy wanted to move the relationship forward really fast.
Some people (and I have known both women and men to do this) have a tendency to think they’re in love very quickly, and get really exuberant and expressive and say everything they’re thinking, rather than taking it slow and letting the relationship grow more naturally. Over time, I think most of these people figure themselves out and learn to move more cautiously. I am sorry, OP, that you had to have this experience, but it’s not something you brought on yourself, and it’s not uncommon. Better luck next time.
Anon.
You’ll get lots of responses to this that might discount it because of the short timeline, but something very similar happened to me when I was 24. VERY similar. Short timeline (though longer than yours – about 5 months) but strong feelings, and when the abrupt and absolutely not foreseen breakup happened, I was devastated. Maybe not even because of the individual but because of the hopes and dreams and futures we’d already discussed. I know this sounds like it might be overkill, but I *really* recommend some kind of therapy ASAP. That this happened out of nowhere messed me up for a long time – years and years – and I wasn’t able to trust or date long term for maybe 5 years – which I don’t want to happen to anyone else. I wish I’d gotten therapy immediately, which I didn’t because of how short it was in reality I thought I’d just “get over it.”
(FWIW I’m 43 now, married with two kids, and all is well. But it was hard.)
Anon
I agree with this, take the timing out of your analysis. I married my husband 3 months after we met 15 years ago so I’d never discount that wonderful things can happen quickly. What we tend to miss were the little signs of things not being quite right because the rush is so much fun. Don’t let this stop you from having another whirlwind romance – I had these crashes and burns too before meeting the right person.
anon
Completely agree. Something similar happened to me in my mid-20s in law school, when I was convinced I met the person I was going to spend my life with. It was a whirlwind three months and then what felt like out of nowhere, he ended things. I remember him saying something about how he didn’t have “organic love” for me and I was completely stupefied. I did go to therapy after because I was so broken, which helped, but I still think about him sometimes now and feel sad (he ended up marrying another woman at our law school, whom he started dating not long after our breakup). That said, I am also now married with two kids and living a really happy life – so I do know it was for the best. Nothing good could have come of staying with someone who obviously didn’t want to be with me.
anonymous
I commented elsewhere, but this also happened to me in my mid-20s. He was the first person I’d been truly excited about in years. After 4 amazing months, with no warning, instead of taking me out to dinner as we’d planned, he walked into my condo, sat down on my couch and said he couldn’t date me anymore because we didn’t have an emotional connection. I was stunned. It messed me up for a LONG time, until therapy. I can now see the fuller picture, but my initial reaction was to feel Not Good Enough and completely question my perception of reality.
anon
Yeah sorry but you started way too fast.
Anon
Disagree. My now husband and I were talking marriage and baby names within weeks and had solid plans for me to move to his city within two months (although I didn’t actually move until we’d been dating for a year, due to needing to finish school).
It does sound like love-bombing in this instance, but a fast timeline isn’t always a bad thing. I’m a big believer in “when you know you know.”
Anon
Same.
Anon
Sam experience, but my husband is a reserved and thoughtful man. Neither of us are impulsive people. Add in one impulsive person to the mix, and the other person will need to apply the brakes.
Anon
But are you still with him because you genuinely love him, you still have a genuine connection, and you want to be together? Or did you just get married so young that now you’re enmeshed; being married is a habit and you fear what you would lose if you got out of the relationship? Are you one of our posters who complains constantly about their spouse and how much they want a divorce but are defending this decision because you don’t want to admit you made a mistake?
Sorry, but I don’t think saying “well I got married five nanoseconds after we met and it worked out for me” is very responsible. And also sus, because we have sooooo many people complaining about crappy husbands here that I can’t believe there’s not some Venn diagram overlap of the circles “I got married to my husband after three months” and “My husband makes my life miserable.”
Anon at 11:25
Whoa, what a logical leap. Yes we’re still together because love each other and are genuinely very happy. He’s a wonderful husband and the most involved dad I know, who has taken on the ‘primary parent’ role for our kids. He’s not perfect, nor am I, but I’ve never once had the thought that I’d be happier divorced.
We did not get married after five nanoseconds (we had been dating for almost 2 years when we got engaged and more than 3 when we got married) which I think is important. Knowing immediately that you want to marry someone is not the same as actually getting married immediately. I’m not recommending people, especially young people, rush down the aisle immediately and not sure how you got that from my comment. I’m just saying that talking about marriage and a life together very early on is not an automatic red flag to me, because sometimes I think you do just know immediately. And to be honest, in your late 20s I don’t consider several months into a relationship to be terribly early. Most people who are approaching 30 or beyond know what they’re looking for in a partner, and relationships tend to progress more quickly once you’re 30 (or close, as OP is).
Anon
Throwing this out there: one of the problems with marrying quickly is that you often don’t get time to hash out boundaries and expectations.
As much as I advocate “just get married already” if you’ve been dating for >2 years, are an actual adult, and are happy, I think it’s important to have some of the skirmishes happen while dating as opposed to in early marriage. Overbearing family? Friends who think their snotty opinions matter? Differences in how you handle money? Issues of whose career takes precedence (or even if that needs to happen)? Hash it out when you’re dating.
Anon
This is not her fault, and it’s cruel to suggest it is.
Anon
That’s a him problem, not a you problem. I hope you find someone who means those things when he says them.
Anon
Here’s my $.02: Two months into a relationship is too soon to be thinking about moving in with someone, whether you’re long-distance or not, in your 20s or 30s or 40s, etc. Any time conversations are moving that fast, be wary. Some guys like the idea of having a long-term relationship but are not up for the reality of it.
Antoinne Vargas
Welcome to the world of the Super Douche! Goes overboard, seems like 1 in a million, seems to care about you, etc., all to wheedle his way into your va-jay-jay, which he proceeds to do after a week (with me), and after about a few more weeks, where he’s exhausted every position and orifice with you, he drifts away, leaving you feeling that it was your fault in not measuring up. It’s happened to many of us, particularly those of us who have been searching for years for Mr. Right, only to have them use us, abuse us, and then just lose us. Again, he is the A-hole, not you. I have a self-imposed rule not to do anything for the first week in bed, then, if he is on the up and up, and is actually spending money on me, start slowly, giving him conventional sex only 2-3 times a week, MAX. If he is still around after a month of conventional sex, you can open up and trust him to do other stuff you are willing to do, and by doing this in this way, you are protected moreso if he does leave eventually, as many do.
Anon
This is good advice. So many guys are just trying to taste all the flavors and are willing to treat women like ice-cream cones: fun for a minute, but easily discardable if things gets too messy. I don’t believe in waiting three months (or whatever arbitrary timeframe) to garden, necessarily. But every time I gardened with a guy really fast and started engaging in all the “fantasy stuff” early on, it meant he was going to get bored fast and dip. Or, maybe it was that he never had any intention to stick around and the love-bombing got him what he wanted and then he was done.
I think the things you mention: spending his own money; being willing to stick with vanilla gardening until you’re ready to do more at your own pace; etc. are good tips. I also just think time is the tattletale in so many of these situations. It’s so easy for someone to say they’re so in love, so looking forward to the future, etc. in the first few weeks of a relationship. Those are just words. If actions are backing up words three or six months down the line, that’s something different and it’s a little safer to get in your feelings at that point, IMO. I learned the hard way, when I was dating, not to really trust anything a guy said in the first month of the relationship. Because, again – words are easy. Actions and hanging in over the long term are harder.
Anon
Whoa Ellen! You still haven’t found a man yet?
Anon
Honestly, I don’t think he did anything wrong. People get caught up in their emotions and the fun and excitement of a new relationship only to realize it’s not the right fit. It happens. Let not vilify someone for not stringing you along and breaking things off early enough for you to find someone else before you broke your lease and moved to a new city. I’m not saying it doesn’t hurt, but this stuff happens in life and relationships. He might not be such a bad guy. He’s just not the right guy for you. Make plans with friends, cry on the couch and then go on a date with a new guy this weekend!!
anon
I’m sorry. I’ve been where you are and it really hurts. I believe break ups at this point are particularly painful because you’re still in the excitement phase of a new relationship, and you’re still able to fill in the (many, many) blanks about your future with the fantasy version of this person and how your relationship will unfold. What hurts isn’t losing the person, but losing the chance at the future you’re hoping for. You’ve just got to remind yourself that this future wasn’t a guarantee—far, far from it.
Your comment about “failing to measure up” also struck me. Please, please don’t frame this break up as him discovering that you’re not actually “good enough” for him. I used to think that way, too, and it took therapy for me to identify these thought patterns and figure out how much pain they caused in break ups (and in anticipation of break ups). I promise you, it’s not a question of whether you’re “good enough” for this person or anyone else. Please don’t attach your self-worth to this guy.
I also agree with other commenters that this guy got ahead of himself. I hate when men write checks they can’t cash.
ShotsShotsShots
I got you boo. You dodged a bullet. Let’s celebrate!
Anonymous
I am traveling to England from the US, returning home end of Dec 2023. My passport expires first week of July 2024. So I’ll just have 6 months remaining on my passport at the time of my trip, but I also possibly have time to renew it before. Do I renew now or wait until after my trip?
Cat
If your trip is in December just renew now, you have plenty of time. Then if a trip in the spring pops up (Caribbean for spring break?) you won’t be scrambling.
Anon
+1
Moose
Agree with this – get ahead of it while you have plenty of time!
Anon
The processing times are ridiculous now. It took 4 months to process my son’s renewal submitted in February. So proceed with caution if you decide to renew.
Anon
I would definitely pay for expedited service.
anon
The UK only requires your passport be valid for the duration of your trip, so there’s no requirement that you renew beforehand. I just visited on a passport that has only about 60 days left before expiration and it was fine. I had no issues going through customs in either direction.
Anon
Now, but I hate being without a valid passport and I don’t consider a passport valid unless it has more than 6 months left on it, because so many countries require that.
Travelanon
Any recommendations for a 6 hour layover in Seattle with kids (under age 10), assume luggage is already checked through so no heavy bags to carry around. Is there a good location for lunch and kids to run around and work off some steam midweek.
Anon
Are you asking for recs in the airport or are you planning to try to go to downtown Seattle? I think the latter would be tough in that time frame, especially with kids.
Anon
Six hours is more than enough time, you can go straight there on light rail.
Anon
It’s really not. You have to be back at the airport two hours before the flight, and it takes roughly an hour to get off the plane and out of the airport. Assuming the plane is on time (not guaranteed) you’re looking at 3 hours max, even before travel to and from the city. Hardly seems worth it to me.
anon
southcenter mall is close to seatac airport, and there are quite a few restaurants there. Seattle proper is too far, and traffic can be randomly awful for only a 6 hour layover.
Anon
I wouldn’t leave the airport just to go to a mall. Going through security is a hassle even with TSA Precheck. Just eat in the airport. I’m not super familiar with Sea-Tac but it’s a major international airport, I’m sure there are some decent restaurants.
Anon
Seattle person here. SeaTac has a large atrium-like food court with huge picture windows and your kids will like looking outside at the plans taking off. If they are on the younger side, there’s also a kids play area in the airport and easy to access bathrooms connected to the play area.
Anon
+1 Seattlite here, too and agree with this. With a six hour layover, roughly an hour gets lost deboarding and leaving the airport and then you’ll need to arrive about two hours before you leave, so you really only have three hours. It would take 30 to 40 minutes to get from the airport downtown and then returning … you see where I’m going. We have a nicer airport with the food-court that has huge floor to ceiling windows where you can plane/people watch. There are multiple shops, like a small Elliott’s Bay Bookstore. I’d purchase a lounge pass and avoid schlepping to and fro.
anon
What should we see and do and eat with kids in Little Rock for 24 hours?
Anon
Hello! I live in Little Rock, and there is a lot to do here.
What age are the kids? If they’re elementary aged, the Museum of Discovery is great. Loblolly is the resident fun ice cream shop, and it’s not far away! If you want to shop, next door to Loblolly is the Green Corner Store, which has some Arkansas food and little gifts for you to take home if interested. Try the Pink House Alchemy syrup and Onyx coffee. They make their own tea blends, as well, which are yummy.
The best thing about Arkansas is access to nature. You can go for a walk at the River Trail. If you park at the Big Dam Bridge, you can walk over the Arkansas River. It is the longest pedestrian bridge in North America that has never been open to trains or cars. There’s no shade on the bridge, so wear sunscreen. There are paved trails on both sides of the bridge that are easy–not hilly and well maintained. If you have a bit more time, drive out to Pinnacle Mountain. You can climb to the top for excellent views or walk around the base trail. The trails are also well maintained at the mountain, but they are not paved.
If you’re into art, the Arkansas Museum of Fine Arts just reopened after a multi-year renovation project, and it is fantastic!
As for food– we’ve got tons of great places. Fidel & Co has excellent coffee and pastries. It’s also got a cool vibe. The Root is a well-loved spot that feature local produce and meat. It’s especially good for breakfast. It’s quite laid back. My favorite dish is the Bahn-mi (they have a breakfast version and a lunch version). Brood & Barley is in North Little Rock and has good cocktails and relatively nice pub food. El Sur is WONDERFUL and has Honduran food (casual). I recommend the baleada con todo, but you really can’t go wrong with anything there. If you want a nicer option, Ciao Baci is THE PLACE. Everyone is excited because they just brought their appetizer tots back (I know this sounds weird at a nice place, but seriously trust me). The Pantrycrest is another good staple. Be sure to check the hours if you’re in town on a Monday. Lots of places are closed on Monday evenings, but El Sur and Ciao Baci are open those days.
Welcome to Arkansas!
Anon
I would be remiss if I didn’t also mention Heights Taco & Tamale and Camp Taco. Heights Taco calls itself Ark-La-Tex food. They’ve got delta tamales and some really good tacos. I like the pickle fried chicken tacos. Camp Taco is run by the same group, and it’s a little harder to describe. They’ve got Mexican Ramen and also various tacos. Both places have great cocktails and cheese dip.
Also, if you just want pastries one morning, Boulevard has excellent ones. They’re downtown and also in the Heights, depending on where you’re staying. The Heights location is larger and has more variety.
Little Rocker
That’s my city! There’s definitely some great options, but also places to skip (like the sad zoo full of livestock) but I’m happy to make suggestions. How old are the kids? Any restaurant preferences?
Anonymous
I highly recommend going to the Little Rock Central High School National Historic Site. We went two years ago with kids ages 7 and 11, and I think it would be even better with older kids. It really helped my kids understand the history of school desegregation and was important for them.
Anon
Is anyone here a distance trail runner? I would like to start doing longer races but know (at least at first) I’ll have to do a walk / run combo. Not sure if that’s frowned upon (I’ve done it for road half marathons).
I’d like to eventually (over a few years) build up to a 50k.
Mean Coworker
Uh, it’s basically fast hiking plus running. Look at the time limits for races, but my 9 min/mi road 10k jumps to a 12 min/mi trail 10k.
Anon
It is not only not frowned upon, it’s the norm. Lots of trail races involve terrain that isn’t even runnable, so most people walk at some point and for longer races pale have entire strategies about how to use walking (my brother runs ultras regularly and he starts by walking the first 2-3 miles).
Anon
Thanks for the input I was hoping to do a hike / run combo, sounds like I’ll be fine!
anon2
+100!
I am a trail ultra runner and I absolutely walk in every single race. I am far more efficient on hills power hiking than I am running, this is how I both train and run. This is also how all of my trail friends (except the winners, of which I am definitely not!) race ultras.
Also, welcome! It’s such a fun and welcoming community IME
Anonymous
I’m not but DH is. You’re fine doing a walk/run combo. Distance trail running community is pretty laid back and supportive – at least at the recreational level.
Anon
It’s the norm.
Practice/learn to descend quickly and you can make up a good bit of time.
Because there’s so much variation in terrain, training with a heart rate monitor (old-school strap – the optical/wrist ones are crap) can be really helpful.
Anon
What are people wearing to after work networking events these days? Going to my first one in years. SF Bay Area. Not a lawyer.
Anon
Very very casual. Jeans and sneakers these days. Maybe a dash of a work outfit here and there. Basically whatever you want.
Anonymous
Nice work dresses and flats
anon
In DC full-on business casual.
Nesprin
Bay area? I’d be shocked if it isn’t mostly hoodies and jeans.
Ocean City MD recs
Hi all! Help me plan a trip to Ocean City, MD. I’ve lived in DC for 15 years and never been to a beach on the east coast and I figured it’s time. It will be me, my husband, and two kids-5 and 8 years old. How many nights would you suggest staying there and where do you recommend staying? Seems like the beach is super long and there are tons of options. My 8 year old really wants to take surf lessons, so any recs for that and other activities are welcome. Thanks so much, you all have never let me down!
Anon
If you’re not 100% married to OCMD, Id recommend the Delaware beaches.
Cat
Was going to comment the same thing. OCMD seemed kind of run-down to me and that was years ago. Rehoboth or Lewes are cute.
Cat
But if you are married to it, drive down to Assateague for a beach day with the wild horses!
Anonymous
Was also going to say this, times a million. I’m born and raised in MD and would pick Rehoboth over OC any day.
Seventh Sister
Fenwick Island, South Bethany, and Bethany Beach are also really nice. It really depends on what you want – the smaller towns have a reputation for being a bit quieter / low key but some people really like being right in Ocean City. Dewey Beach used to have a real “college kid” rep but not so much anymore.
If I was doing this, I’d rent a house for a week, not necessarily beach-side (because they are $$$) but with beach access (most places will give you a parking pass so you can drive over).
Anon
Endless Summer rents boards and has lessons. Tommy’s on 28th Street for subs one night. We’ve found staying Oceanside in the 40s to work out well with kids. Places to walk for dinner and not too long of a haul to the beach itself. Dh and I have been for a week every year since 1980, except 2020. That’s where our kids learned to swim, ride waves, and love beaches. On the other hand, it’s trashy, loud and not great anymore.
ollie
I used to go to OCMD with my family for a week every year (basically until they bought an NJ beach house). There are a ton of rental condos so I would recommend that over a hotel. Downbeach by the boardwalk has more to do, but it’s very crowded. We would always stay farther uptown (in the 100-blocks) for a quieter and more family-friendly vibe, and it was always easy to drive to dinner, rides, mini golf, etc. at night.
DCJ
We go for a week every year! Stay in North OC/not on the Boardwalk for a much more laid-back scene. My kids love staying at townhouses around 60th-70th street that open up with sand right off the back deck (Beach Place). Most summer rentals are by the week, and you may be a little limited on what you find for this summer at this point. shorepro.com is reputable and (in my opinion) the best option for a weekly condo rental. There are tons of mini golf options around – we like the indoor courses for extra hot days. Crabbing off of the pier at Northside Park is always a hit. Breakfast at Bayside Skillet is also a go-to. Happy to answer specific Qs if you have them.
Courthouse wedding guest attire?
This feels like a perfect question for the hive: ideas on what to wear to my boss’s early fall courthouse wedding? We are lawyers, I will likely be the only woman from the firm attending. Will be at the federal courthouse where we practice regularly. My firm skews very casual, and while in-person court appearances are picking up somewhat they are still rare, so none of my suits are feeling very fresh (though they still fit fine). This feels like a good opportunity to up my game from Macy’s/JCrew suits, and get a new suiting dress and matching jacket and have them perfectly tailored. I am liking the look of this dress from MM LaFleur https://mmlafleur.com/products/dina-black-white But not sure about the quality of their suiting? Also possibly open to a solid color sheath dress and a subtly textured blazer? I would love some suggestions or other ideas. Size 8-10, flat chested pear, would prefer to keep the whole look under $1000.
Anonymous
You’re a wedding guest! Wear a pretty daytime dress not a business suit. And you absolutely don’t need to spend a thousand dollars on this.
NYCer
I agree. I think it would be quite odd if you showed up in a suit honestly.
Anon
This. I’d wear whatever you would wear to a wedding. I think wearing a suit of business clothes takes away from the importance of the day. Wearing something you wouldn’t typically wear to work or the courthouse makes it more festive and special!
anon
I think wearing a suit will look weird and not festive. You aren’t attending as a lawyer, you are a guest. I’d buy a pretty dress.
Anonymous
I LOVE that Dina dress at MM LaFleur. It would be too short for me – MM LaFleur feels like it runs really short – but I’m also 5’9. I have liked the other pieces I’ve purchased from there.
My favorite recent suit, however, is from Ann Taylor. Not fancy. But super comfortable, looks great, and in a fun color.
Cat
This is not the occasion for a suit. Choose something reasonably conservative since it’s office-related but not a suit.
anon
Oh my gosh no don’t wear a suit to a wedding. This is not work. The fact that it’s at a courthouse doesn’t change that- you’re there for a wedding, not a hearing. The I’ve been to weddings on farms; doesn’t mean I dressed like a farmer!
Anon
In your shoes, I would probably wear a short-sleeve or long-sleeved dress or a sheath dress with a cardigan and not a blazer. So, more business casual than business attire. A short sleeved sweater plus a printed skirt would also be appropriate.
Cat
To a wedding? OP didn’t specify but unless this is like, a lunchtime quick wedding, this sounds way too business-y for a celebration.
Senior Attorney
I love that MMLF dress but not for this occasion. I agree with everyone else that you should dress for a wedding, not for court, and that means a pretty dress.
Is it Friday yet?
Chicago recs? Heading to Wisconsin for a wedding this weekend, and I land at O’Hare in the morning, pick up a rental car, and have about 5-6 hours before I have to drive to Lake Geneva. I’ve never actually been to Chicago before (aside from many connections at O’Hare!), so what are the quick and dirty greatest hits?
Cat
I might delay picking up the rental car tbh, traffic between ORD and Chicago is bananas with construction. Get on the El instead and then return that way to grab your car and go. Bonus you don’t have to deal with parking downtown.
Anon
I wouldn’t even bother taking the L to the city. The blue line is too unreliable these days. Pick up your rental car, hit the outlet mall in Rosemont and sit down for a nice lunch nearby, then drive up to Lake Geneva.
Anon
That sounds crazy stressful and not nearly enough time to see anything in Chicago. I’d add on a day at the end of your weekend to explore and otherwise just get to where you need to go and poke around along the way.
Anonymous
+1
Is it Friday yet?
Unfortunately not an option at this point. I was arriving a day early and spending a night in Chicago, but got talked into being in Lake Geneva for dinner that night instead. :( I also have a very late flight out of O’Hare on Sunday so have that afternoon as well though.
Anon
What do you like to do? The weather in June is normally beautiful for outdoor activities. The architectural boat cruises are popular but I personally find them kind of boring. The Bean and the Sears (now Willis) Tower are tourist classics. Walking along the riverfront and lake front are both nice – the river is more unique to Chicago, particularly since you’ll likely see more of Lake Michigan while driving to WI. The Art Institute is downtown if you want a quick museum experience.
For food, Stan’s Donuts and deep dish pizza. I like Lou Malnati’s. There are a lot of touristy brunch places overlooking the river. The food isn’t generally great but the experience can be nice.
I agree driving and parking in downtown Chicago is stressful (particularly for an out of town visitor) and expensive. Any way you can switch your rental car reservation to pick the car up later?
Anon
Best suggestion I have is to swing by the Lincoln Park Zoo on the way up to Lake Geneva. It isn’t the most direct route there, but is roughly on the way. Either that, or just skip trying to do something in Chicago in that short of a time frame and head up to the lake early. There are a lot of cute spots for food, looking at the water, and, if you’re into it, kayaking or hanging out at the beach.
Anon
If you’ll have the car when you head into the city, I agree Lincoln Park is the best bet. The zoo is free and pretty nice (they have lion cubs right now) and Lincoln Park is a cute neighborhood with lots of good food options. And parking is a lot easier than in downtown.
Anon
Really? It’s just kind of a generic cute neighborhood. Chicago is the CITY, the architecture, the lake, the museums, the arts & culture, the diversity, the food. Lincoln Park…. I mean its upper middle class white cute but ?? you can get that anywhere.
Anon
Lincoln Park is a neighborhood in the city of Chicago. It’s not a suburb. I agree there is lots of interesting stuff in other neighborhoods, and it wouldn’t be my top recommendation to someone who had one day in Chicago except for the fact that she’s flying into O’Hare and heading to Wisconsin, and so it’s more convenient geographically than going all the way downtown and (IMO) way more interesting than the northern suburbs and western suburbs. There’s TONS of great food in Lincoln Park, including some Michelin-starred restaurants and great ethnic food. And it’s on the lake and has some great museums so I don’t understand those criticisms. There aren’t really museums right in the downtown area, except the Art Institute.
No Face
Take the blue line from the airport to the loop (maybe Washington station). Wander around Millennium Park and downtown – I like to walk along the lake and the river. Have lunch in a random restaurant. Then take the blue line back to O’Hare and hit the road.
Anon
Agree that this sounds stressful and currently not worth the time to get to experience Chicago. Consider adding a day or so if you want to see the city. By the time you land, get a rental, and get from O’Hare and into the city that could be two hours. Plus figuring out parking. If you’re coming in on Friday that would put you in the start of weekend traffic leaving downtown.
By adding a day you could: walk the Mag Mile and/or Millenium park in the morning while people watching and shopping, catch an architecture boat tour in the afternoon, do dinner somewhere fun, and then catch a flight the next morning home.
JLW
Another Chicagoan here saying don’t bother. I don’t think 5-6 hours is enough time to either drive or take blue line in/out of Chicago….especially on a Friday…traffic and cta will be bad. Like others, I think you should grab your rental car and head towards Lake Geneva. I have visited alot (including 10 days ago) and have a few suggestions that might work (see also https://www.visitlakegeneva.com/) 1) try to get tickets to the mail boat tour or 2) walk the Shore Path if you like walking 3) bring beach gear and hit Riviera Beach 4) lots of shopping downtown.
Is it Friday yet?
I arrive on Thursday, if that changes the traffic calculation? I’m also very used to driving in awful city traffic, and am fine paying for parking for a few hours for the convenience factor. I have all day Friday free in Lake Geneva so will be checking out some of those options for sure though!
Anon
Right now there’s construction on the highway that leads into the city. Driving from O’Hare to downtown is congested to begin with but the construction makes it worse than usual city traffic. They’re shutting down roads in the Loop for that NASCAR nonsense so once you get to the city it might a mess. CTA has been unreliable as well (random 45 minute wait times on the blue line). That’s why you’re getting emphatic feedback to avoid traveling downtown this week.
Anon
If you have extra time to kill, why not check out some of Milwaukee? It’s not nearly as amazing as Chicago, but the convenience factor is huge. It’s a very easy drive from there to Lake Geneva.
I’m biased – I love Wisconsin – don’t discount how much fun the lake can be. Get a nice breakfast, rent a kayak, take the mail boat tour, hit the safari, or go for a walk.
Anonymous
Former Chicagoland resident. I agree, don’t go to Chicago, go to Milwaukee.
anon
Another former Chicago resident echoing the others: go to Wisconsin and enjoy a few hours there, either in Milwaukee’s Historic Third Ward or out by Lake Geneva.
Anon
Well, spend 45-90 minutes getting the car and driving to the downtown loop area. Pay a lot to park in a lot (don’t waste time trying to find a space on the street – use an app like Spot hero). This is probably too short a period of time to take a architectural boat tour but you can try to get one near the State St/Michigan avenue area for convenient access to other places to walk to. Or walk to the Bean/Millenium park near the lakefront and enjoy the outdoor art. Turn around and look at all the great buildings. Walk over to the Art Institute and spend an hour, maybe have a light lunch there? Or choose a pizza place in the loop if you want to try something like classic heavy Chicago deep-dish pizza. I prefer Gino’s East with a cornbread crust, which you can drive to quickly from the Bean/Millenium park (and then pay a lot to park in a nearby lot). Call Gino’s ahead to place your order and start the pizza cooking because it takes 45 minutes. Then drive to Wisconsin.
Anonymous
Not really a Chicago classic, but what I would do would be lunch and a walk around a neighborhood somewhere east of the airport, far northside chicago. (maybe Indian food on Devon, Rogers Park, Andersonville, something like that) then go to the Chicago Botanic Garden for an hour or so. Would avoid most of the traffic of heading down into Chicago and be a nice way to spend some time, even if its not a tourist type experience.
Anon
Traffic between O’Hare and Glencoe (where the botanical garden is) can be awful. 294 is really bad. And if she’s landing on a Friday after about 10 am (which means not getting the rental car until 11-ish), commuting out of the city is likely going to be harder than going into it, because so many people head out around lunchtime for the weekend.
Anonymous
+1, I would skip downtown and take a walk at the Chicago Botanic Garden. It’s a nice way to stretch your legs on a travel day and it’s on the way to Lake Geneva.
Anonymous
As part of my quest to destress my brain, I’m considering checking my email some thing like twice a day. Is there anyway for the iphone to do this so that it holds delivery back except for the times i set, and is it possible to do it by account? for insrance I would check my work accounts more frequently during the day than I would check my personal accounts.
Cat
You can customize what type of alerts mail apps give you. Like does it display the red count of unread mail only, or also give you push notifications on your lock screen? You can have both, one, or neither.
Anonymous
Thanks – should have said I already have notifications off. I’m trying to break the habit of manually checking it all the time. If I know there are no emails there – b/c delivery is set to specific times, I might be able to break the habit!
anon
Switch it to airplane mode and turn wifi off and on? That’s the easiest option though it is a manual one.
Vicky Austin
What about taking your personal mail off your phone entirely?
Also I seem to remember that you can change the push notification settings from “whenever there is a new message” to “twice a day at these specific times,” but I might be thinking of the Gmail settings, which may not help you.
H13
Any recs for a sleeveless bodysuit on Amazon that would work for petites? I need something quickly. Thanks!
Notinstafamous
I would like to do some redecorating, now that the divorce is progressing along and I live alone. What are some reasonably inexpensive ways to make a place “feel” different while I save up for a bigger reno? Two bedroom bungalow style house, current decor is “late 80s rural redneck”. Kitchen was redone last year, I’m going to do the floors (replace vinyl with hardwood/engineered hardwood) and the bathrooms next year.
Currently I’m thinking of repainting (there’s an 80s pink accent wall right now), replacing the light fixtures, and putting in nicer curtains. What am I missing?
I don’t know how to find the aesthetic I want to aim for now that I’m single though. How do you decide what you want it to look like? PNW area.
Moose
Cabinet hardware is an easy and satisfying change! And paint, like you mentioned.
As for your style – post-divorce I’d give yourself the freedom to go for whatever you LOVE. You don’t have to involve anyone else’s opinions now! I love to browse online and save images (yes, I use Pinterest) that I’m attracted to – rooms, colors, furniture. After a while I can see similar themes pop up, which can give you a direction. Also, what items or styles do you have now that your really like? Can be something small. Use that as a guide.
Anon
Houzz is like Pinterest for renovations and decor. They have lots of inspo photos by color and style, plus you can shop through them.
Senior Attorney
+1 to Houzz
Half the rooms in my post-divorce house were copied right from there!
Anon
Congrats to getting through such a difficult time.
Silly suggestion but mentally could have a big impact mentally – replace the linens, sheets, and towels. It can be low cost enough, it’s easy to change in the future, and now you have things you use everyday that are just yours and have been used only by you.
Trips with my mom to Pier 1 and ikea when she first furnished an apartment post-separation are core memories for me. Her method for starting from scratch was to lean into the minimalism that comes with starting over. She went with a decor scheme that had japanese inspiration. Japanese woodblock prints, clean lines on furniture, limited color palette.
Vicky Austin
Ooh, fresh linens is a great idea. Not to mention it can change the whole look of a bathroom or bedroom.
Anonymous
I like to let the house dictate, to some extent. My home now is a minimal farm ranch from the 60s so everything is clean and modern. In my 1900 Victorian things were more ornate. Both had my style of quiet color and clean lines and lots of texture, but I picked what I was drawn to after filtering for the house’s own preference.
Anon
I think you are right about the painting, fixtures, and curtains. That will definitely change how things look. I’m personally not great at interior decorating, so I picked paint colors with the help of someone from the local Sherwin Williams paint store. She came to the house, checked out rooms and light, and we settled on some colors I really liked. For the rest of it, maybe see how the paint and fixtures go, then spend lots of time online looking at things you like. Changing pillows on a couch and getting a new coffee table (different shape from old) make my living room look much different.
Runcible Spoon
Fresh bed linens are fun and relatively inexpensive, for a decorating refresh. Also, pick out a nice piece of art to cherish and admire. It can be an original work of art, or it can be photos that you get professionally framed, or even prints or posters that you have professionally mounted and framed.
ALT
Has anyone tried the body contour line of tops at Express? I just bought some high waisted trousers and tried them on with a fitted sports bra top (not on purpose) and liked the look. I’m thinking the Express tops/bodysuits would be a similar look and more suited to trousers than a sports bra lol.
This would be a look for nights out, not work…
Wondering what sizing is like, washability, etc.
Anon
I can’t speak to Express but I’m happy with my Abercrombie bodysuits. Abercrombie was uncool by the time I hit eighth grade and suddenly a good chunk of my adult wardrobe comes from them.
anonypotamus
I have several body contour line tops from Express and I like them. They are not terribly high quality but tend to last longer with line drying. I like that they are mildly compressive/smoothing, soft fabric, and thick/not see through, even the white. I wear them with high waisted pants and shorts or as a layer under a blazer. I tend to wear the sleeveless ones though, because the fabric make me sweatier since it is a synthetic. I have a few Abercrombie ones and those sometimes have a higher percentage of natural fibers.
anon
What do you do when you want to spice up your marriage? We have a really great relationship but I would like more and better gardening. DH is down too. We are mid 30s and have been married for ~10 years and together for like 15.
Anon
I would see if there is anything that interests you and/or your husband to get you in the mood. For example, I always get extra in the mood when I read romance novels – my husband can always tell when I am reading a book! Sometimes we will watch videos together. For special occasions, I will give him an extra special back rub. Back in the day, I would buy new lingerie and send him pics during the day. Interested to hear other ideas!
Anon
Would love some recos for romance novels that you have enjoyed. Many of the ones I’ve read have terrible writing or weird, unbelievable plotlines.
Anon
I’m a huge fan of romance novels for getting in the mood. But you kind of have to check your expectations at the door as far as the level of writing.
Anonymous
I would go to erotica instead of purer romance novels to try to get in the mood – Katee Roberts is really good. Neon Gods. The mafia romances are usually pretty good too but you have to be ok with the fact that the heroine generally ends up with a psychopath. Nicky the Driver and Mafia Mistress were two I just read and enjoyed.
Anonymous
Okay. I am not going to suggest reading material.
Here are a few ideas:
Ask each other about fantasies. You may not even have to act on them to spice things up, but maybe you can pick one or two to try.
Go to a toy store and pick something, either together or separately. Use them.
Get a game with cards or dice that have you do intimate things with each other
Try a different version of intimacy. Slower/longer or faster/more aggressive than usual.
The next time you are intimate, give instructions or ask to be given instructions and follow them
Exchange papers on which you reveal to each other one thing you’d like the other person to do that you’ve not tried or is not typical.
Spend a day naked or nearly naked
Try an exhilarating new activity with plans to be intimate afterwards.
Get a hotel room or rent an AirBnB or a cabin, even if you don’t really leave town. Perhapsps combine with the exhilarating activity.
Learn massage
Start showering or bathing together if you don’t now
Talk dirty to your partner if you don’t now
Right before you leave for something like a dinner party, make a promise to do something for your partner when you get back; remind them while you are there and can’t take immediate action
Initiate intimacy at a time your partner is not expecting it but could respond affirmatively immediately
Take walks and find secluded spots to be handsy
Take a road trip and surprise your partner with a demand to pull over so you can make out
Anon
On Father’s Day, we had my parents over to my place with my husband and kids. For some reason, my dad went into very long detail on some missteps and questioning choices I made literally decades ago – things like, I never understood why you didn’t pursue the major you always said you would, recapping a car accident I had my freshman year of college, etc. This was in front of my husband who hadn’t heard most of these stories. I have done well in my career and happy with my life. I tried several times to change the subject – I said well everything happens for a reason and I’m good with how things are now. But he kept going and I felt embarrassed. We visit with my parents about once every month or so – I usually don’t talk to my dad much other than small talk and I can’t remember the last time I was actually the focus of a conversation. I have siblings and there is usually lots of other things to talk about. Any thoughts about what to do if this happens again though? At one point I left the table and went upstairs but when I came back down the same conversation was still happening!
Anon
Use your words. Shut it down. It will be uncomfortable for a moment, but who cares? A firm “I’m not talking about this anymore and if you continue to talk about, we will have to leave.”
Moose
Parents can be weird – I think your response will vary based on what kind of relationship you have with him, as well as who else is around. If you’re around people you don’t know super well, or non-family, you can aggressively change the subject to avoid the topic – “say Billy, how is that project your working on…”
In another circumstance, you can be direct an say, “so, everything worked out, and we all make mistakes/certain choices as young people, I’d rather move on from this topic if you don’t mind.”
Or, you can have a one-on-one convo with him about how his approach was hurtful, and that kind of critique around others was painful.
BUT, to make you feel better, my gut feeling is that if he doesn’t normally do this (sounds like my dad) you may have caught him on a off day and it likely won’t happen again any time soon.
Anonymous
“Dad, why are you criticizing things that happened a decade ago? Please move on I’m not interested in having this discussion.” Followed by “wow, ok time for you to go”
Anon
Yet another unrealistic script that would never work in the real world. The vast majority of us could not or would not unceremoniously kick our parents out of our house, in front of our spouse and children, because that would be so weird and also create Emotional World War III in the family.
Seventh Sister
My mom sometimes does this kind of thing. Since she’s pushing 80, I think she just DGAF about offending anyone anymore if she’s interested in talking about something. Being firm with her about stories I find embarrassing helps but isn’t a perfect solution. A few years ago, I kind of guilt-tripped my mom when she was complaining about my shabby house (fair) and said, “I’m sorry I’m such a disappointment to you since I can’t afford a nicer house than the one I own.” It worked – she hasn’t said a word about my floorboards since that conversation.
Don’t worry, it’s not just your parents! My MIL took the opportunity on Father’s Day to talk about how angry and upset she was at my husband that he didn’t study for tests in high school even though he got high grades and a near-perfect SAT score.
Vicky Austin
I am a firm believer that the occasional guilt trip back at a chronic guilt tripper is 100% okay. Sounds like it worked for your mom!
Anonymous
UGH my mom does this too–including complaining about how I could have achieved so much more if I had just applied myself in school–I was a straight A student, went to college with a scholarship (not an Ivy, which is where the disappointment comes from I guess?), and then went to law school and have worked as a lawyer for the past 15 years. I’m not sure why she continues to bring up my high school study habits. I lay on a sarcastic guilt trip sometimes. It’s annoying. She also will bring up things that I did in MIDDLE SCHOOL that looking back were clearly a trauma-response to my parents divorce (stuff like drinking or ditching school). I tell her I have no interest in rehashing that time and have hung up or walked out when she won’t stop.
Anonymous
My husband’s mom does this to him, and I can tell it bugs him. I try to breezily change the subject whenever possible. Solidarity!
Anon
I think I would snap back with “well, what did you expect? I was traumatized by you and dad splitting and all the changes in my life. Now can we move this conversation back to the present?”
Anon
Are there other signs that your father doesn’t see you as a real adult?
NYNY
Is there any chance that your father is in the early stages of dementia? One of the signs can be vivid memories of events long past, paired with trouble recalling recent events. I hope he just was in a mood Sunday, but if I were you, I’d look for other signs that he may be having memory trouble.
Seventh Sister
I think my MIL and mom are *both* having memory problems. I don’t really worry about their safety, but they get fixated on things and can’t remember others. I’m glad my parents moved closer to my sister.
Anon
I would take a different angle than some of the posters. If this is a once in a blue moon type of thing, I think you should just let it go. Sometimes family members are annoying and tell weird stories. Presumably your husband doesn’t think differently of things you did well before you met when you were still a teen. Obviously annoying in the moment, but unless this is something that happens a lot, I think you just roll your eyes, vent to your husband, and move on.
OP
Thank you all for each of these responses!! Appreciate it so much. I have been stewing on it and feeling bad but these responses make me feel so much better – it is so nice to commiserate with y’all!! Will take all of the advice to heart, including the suggestion about early stages dementia – that is something to be mindful of, for sure! And for those who shared similar stories, thank you! Good to feel like I am not alone lol!
Nudibranch
My dad was always critical, but it got much worse as he developed Parkinson’s and his disease progressed. It made it hard to be around him, due to the unprovoked attacks–yes, sometime about issues way in the past. I’m sorry! It’s hard.
It became obvious that the behaviors were part of the Parkinson’s. But it was not fun at the time.
Anonymous
I know this is late but I wanted to throw in to try talking to him about it next time you come by in person (without your husband there). Ask if he remembers the conversation and if not, you’ll have an inkling that it might be early stage dementia as another poster mentioned. If he does, tell him, calmly, that you’re curious about the reason he decided to talk about those things. Explain that if humor was intended, that you noticed people weren’t laughing (if that’s true) and/or that it hurt your feelings. Can he please not bring up stories like this because they feel embarrassing. If that conversation doesn’t work like you want, try talking to your mother and ask her what she thinks was going on. Ask if she will talk to him about it. Hope this helps.
OP
Thank you – appreciate your thoughts! I didn’t want to give examples of the other stories that he brought up but one of them is probably the most painful thing I have experienced – something I am so ashamed of to this day and have only glossed over with my husband. That is a good idea to try to feel him out the next time I see him.
Anon
Homeowners in four season climates, talk to me about outdoor maintenance. We generally don’t feel overwhelmed with home maintenance – we have biweekly cleaners and a handyman we can call for things we can’t or don’t want to do ourselves – but our outdoor spaces are a different story. Mowing the lawn is not a big deal but it seems like no matter how much we work on the yard, we can’t keep the weeds along our fence under control and can’t keep our deck and patio furniture looking nice. We paid $$$ for a small amount of landscaping in our front porch area, but even with the landscapers twice-a-year maintenance plan which we subscribe to, it looks terrible and I’m sure there is more we’re supposed to be doing. I want to hire the equivalent of biweekly cleaners for our outdoor space – someone who will come regularly and cut weeds and maintain the flower beds, but I can’t find anyone to do that – every lawn care company we’ve contacted just wants to come a couple times a year and spray, which we’re really not keen on for environmental reasons and because we have young children who play in the lawn. Thoughts? How do other people handle this? Our yard is not that large, but it just feels like no matter how hard we work we can’t get it looking nice.
Anonymous
You can do it yourself which takes time (like every second weekend) or you can pay someone. You’re not looking for one of those snow n’ mow lawn care companies that just cut grass and spread lime/fertilizer/spray pesticides. Instead, contact your local garden centre (not the one attached to a home depot or lowe’s). They should offer landscaping and landscape maintenance services. They can suggest both changes to make your landscaping lower maintenance and also provide maintenance. It will not be cheap.
Anon
Thanks. As far as I can tell my small-ish (pop. 200k) city only has one garden center that isn’t affiliated with a big box store like Home Depot, and they don’t offer gardening services. Any other thoughts on how to find this?
Anon
A city that size should have landscape supply, nurseries, or greenhouses that are not big-box stores. You could also check for master gardener programs in your area, look up your state’s local extension office, or see if whatever major university is nearest has an ag program. Any of those should be able to give you suggestions on who might provide the type of service you want to hire.
Anonymous
Garden clubs might have some ideas of who to contact. I’d ask around on Facebook, NextDoor, etc.
anon
Check NextDoor for recommendations. We found our current landscaping guy when he was working on the neighbor’s yard. I’ve also gotten a lot of flyers in the mail.
Anon
+1 to next door. Ask others for their recommendations
Anonymous
I’m in a city of 125K and I can think of 4 companies that do this work so I would be shocked if there are not more options in your area. Google florists in your area – many of the bigger florist shops either have their own nurseries or are affiliated with a local nursery. Ask who they recommend for landscape design and maintenance. Even a landscape consult might help you figure out how to set up things in a lower maintenance way.
Is there a botanical garden in your area? Many reputable landscape companies will often be donators to or sponsors of the Local botanical gardens so that’s somewhere else to get names.
Anonymous
Agree. My neighbor has a gorgeous yard with perfectly manicured shrubs and window boxes maintained by the local high end garden center. I called them and the price was through the roof but they didn’t even want the job! The garden center’s team is at my neighbors several times a week. My parents spent hours and hours (happily) doing yard work. I’d rather go to the mall or have drinks on a patio in my rare downtime. I eventually opted for a small yard and hopefully a country club soon.
Anonymous
I have had the same exact issues you have, and made the same request hear about a year ago, and I finally found a landscaping guy that I can just text and he shows up within a few days and I point things out to him or buy plants for him to put in. The company that does my lawn care always needed a lot of lead time and needed to do an estimate and all of that was an impediment to just getting things done. So I would ask around for the “guy” who can be responsive in that way. My yard still is not perfect or done but it looks better than it has in years.
Anonymous
This. You need a “guy” who will charge by the hour or job, not a company. Unfortunately it can be extremely difficult to find a “guy” who is both affordable and competent.
Anon
OP here. Right, it’s not easy to find a guy even if you ignore the affordability piece. I’m also leery of hiring “a guy” for tax and liability reasons. We’ve always had a cleaning service vs ” a cleaning lady” for that reason.
Anonymous
You need a guy who is licensed and insured. This does exist. It doesn’t have to be a franchise.
Anon
You’ll still owe payroll taxes for a household employee if you’re employing an individual person, even if that person is licensed and insured. I realize most people don’t pay these taxes and get away with it, but some of us are in professions where it’s really important that we not get caught committing tax fraud.
anon
You’re being a bit formulaic about this. The college kid who pulls our weeds has an LLC, as do most of the part-time handymen in town. Just because they aren’t a big name company doesn’t mean they aren’t paying taxes. We pay the kid’s LLC with a check or Venmo; it’s not that complicated.
Ask around for a guy. He’ll probably have a simple company structure set up even though that’s not how he advertises. A big tell is if he has a truck with his name on it, since that means his tax plan is sophisticated enough to treat it as a capital expense.
anon
What specifically looks terrible? If you have weeds in your mulch bed, they need to be sprayed with weed killer or pulled regularly.
You can check with smaller, local landscaping companies to see if they will provide mowing and weed removal services.
Use covers on your deck and patio furniture.
Anon
For the landscaped beds in the front, I pull weeds but the mulch gets disrupted by occasional heavy rainfall and looks uneven and messy. The plants also aren’t in great shape and some of them have died or never bloomed leaving unslightly gaps. I think I should be watering more or maybe I’m overwatering – I’m not sure. I have a black thumb! Which is why I want to pay someone to do this.
The backyard fence has tons and tons of weeds near it, some of which are basically trees at this point. We admittedly have neglected this at points, but have been working on it every weekend for the last month or so and it still looks terrible. Even when we cut things down there are still stumps I don’t know how to remove.
We had fancy Sunbrella patio furniture that I got rid of because they got very mildewy and became a place for rodents to build nests (even with covers). I got plastic Adirondack chairs last fall, that I thought would be much lower maintenance because they can be hosed off and don’t have any spaces where rodents can live. But they got very gross over the winter (I think moldy/mildewy) and I can’t get them clean except by scrubbing with bleach, which is time intensive.
It’s not that any of these things is individually insurmountable, it’s more just that it collectively feels likes a lot and requires way more time and effort than we spend maintaining the interior of our house (admittedly with the privilege to hire a cleaner and outsource repairs).
anon
We hired a landscaping company this year to pull out some of the dead bushes, edge the mulch beds and mulch with some good quality mulch. It made a huge difference. In the past we just mulched ourselves with bags we got from Lowes, but the higher end stuff looks better. After you remove the dead stuff, you can re-asses and see if you want to plant anything new.
I don’t water any of the landscaping around the house. Just flowers in planters that I have around the deck.
You could probably get the same landscaping company to do a full on weed removal and then you can maintain it yourselves. If you don’t want to use Round-Up or Weed-B-Gone there may be less toxic options.
We have cast aluminum patio furniture that we leave out year found and cover up in the winter when it’s not in use. Other than getting a little faded, they have held up well. No other maintenance needed.
TL;DR Hire a landscaping company to do the majority of the clean-up work and then it should be a lot less to maintain.
Anonymous
If you have weeds that are basically trees, I’m betting it’s probably privet that escaped from someone’s yard, which is the actual worst and pretty much requires cutting and painting with pesticide (I beg of you, homeowners, STOP PLANTING THIS STUFF). I hired a guy that focuses on getting rid of invasive plants to get rid of mine. You can’t do anything about stumps short of digging them up (or if they’re really big, grinding them down).
Anon
^^ This right here. Stump digging is my upper body workout. Privet, camphor, ileagnes, you name it, I’ve dug it up and out. Comes with the territory of living in an older neighborhood in FL. Lots and lots of invasive species get established if you don’t stay on top of things. Cut the tree to about (your) chest height. Dig a circle around it – a ditch spade is the best tool for this step. Once you’ve done that, start undermining and breaking the roots with a 6-foot digging bar until you can start prying the stump up. You can also use the trunk for leverage – that’s why I recommend cutting it off about chest height rather than at the ground.
Sounds like you don’t have the right plants in the right place, which happens even when you hire pros to do landscape design. Even native plantings take work to get established. Google native plant society for contacts who can help with getting the right plants in the right place. Your local ag extension can help with this, too.
Furniture needs to be put away in the winter if it’s not going to be used and cleaned regularly.
Anon
I see your privet and raise you bamboo
Anon
Unless your patio is covered, I think any patio furniture, even covered will be a problem if left out over the winter. You are going to have bring the furniture inside to really make sure it lasts. That goes for even the ones that say that they can be left outside.
Try searching for “landscaping maintenance” or “flower bed maintenance” rather than “lawn service/maintenance.”
Anon
Our twice-yearly guy will come every week, two weeks or month if we ask him to; we just have to pay him and get on a schedule. My husband doesn’t want to deal with the expense and so we do our basic yard maintenance ourselves, which involves going out once a month on a Saturday morning and spending about an hour and a half pulling weeds, trimming shrubs and performing general cleanup (we don’t have a lawn in the front or the back which makes the job much easier). Then we sit and have an iced tea in our nicely cleaned-up outdoor space.
Totally up to you whether you want to do this yourself or outsource it. I look at it as time I am outdoors and moving instead of sitting inside, which I am always trying to do less of.
Anon
Here is how we handle it: We have our kids go out and pull weeds every couple of weeks during the warmer months when the weeds are out of control. If you don’t have kids, I’m sure your neighborhood has some high school or college age kids who are looking for some extra money. Secondly, we lower our standards. Yes, our lawn and landscaping is never perfect-looking for more than maybe 1 day and it’s okay.
Anonymous
We have always had a gardener, a small company or solo guy who comes by every week, mows, blows the leaves and does a bit of maintenance each visit. We found ours through a neighbor. In Winter he does light snow removal.
Anonymous
We don’t have any interest in spending every weekend maintaining our yard, so we built a big patio out of flagstone and put small, decorative rock over the rest of the yard. We have a couple of easy to maintain plants and we spray for weeds along the sides of the patio once a season. Sometimes I plant flowers in containers but not every year. We leave our outdoor cushions outside most of the year, but bring them in for winter. We replace them every 2 years or so.
An.On.
We handle it by mowing every week or as needed, doing approximately 1-2 weeks of spraying for weeds and then giving up and saying, “We’ll make it nice next year.”
Anon
Ha I read this as “moving every week or as needed” and I thought that seemed a bit excessive ;)
An.On.
Haha, anything to get out of yard work!
Meredith
DH and I are in London in a couple of weeks. We were there about 2months ago in a multi-generation trip so have seen most of the big West-End musicals. However we love live theatre/musicals and are sans stepkids. What else is on right now that we should see?
Anonymous
Don Carlo at the Royal Opera House with Lise Davidsen, one of the world’s best sopranos.
Guys and Dolls at Th Bridge Theatre if you haven’t already seen the fab immersive version.
Romeo and Juliet at The Almeida Theatre (not West End) if you can still get tickets
Patriots at the Noel Coward Theatre for serious live theatre
Crazy for You at the Gillian Lynne Theatre, a summer run so you won’t have seen this two months ago.
Meredith
Thank you!
Taki
Operation Mincemeat has great reviews, and the actual operation Mincemeat was very interesting, so I regret not seeing it when I was in London in May.
txatty
Do y’all have thoughts on Away luggage? My new job is going to include quite a bit of travel and I don’t currently have a carry-on sized bag. I want something that will last; is Away worth it?
txatty
Secondary thought – does anyone have the Solgaard Carry-On Closet and have thoughts on it?
Anonymous
Have the Solgaard – love it for business travel. The version I have works very well for 3-5 days, anything longer and I reach for a bigger suitcase.
ANON
get a rimowa
Runcible Spoon
I like the Travelpro crew luggage (FlightCrew line) that you can only buy from flight attendant/pilot stores (but easy enough to do online), because they are so robust, especially for frequent travel, and relatively inexpensive. They are just complete work horses, and can take a lot of banging around. Briggs and Riley is also a nice brand, with lots of carry-on options.
Anon
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Anon
Nesting fail! This was for the courthouse wedding guest.