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Sales of note for 9.19.24
- Nordstrom – Beauty deals through September, and cardmembers earn 3x the points (ends 9/22)
- Ann Taylor – Extra 30% off sale
- Banana Republic Factory – 50% off everything + extra 20% off
- Boden – 15% off new styles
- Eloquii – Extra 50% off sale
- J.Crew – 50% off select styles — and 9/19 only, 50% off the cashmere wrap
- J.Crew Factory – Up to 60% off everything + 50% off sale with code
- Lo & Sons – Warehouse sale, up to 70% off
- M.M.LaFleur – Save 25% sitewide
- Neiman Marcus – Friends & Family 25% off
- Rag & Bone – Friends & Family 25% off sitewide
- Spanx – Lots of workwear on sale, some up to 70% off
- Talbots – Anniversary event, 25% off your entire purchase — Free shipping, no minimum, 9/19 only
- Target – Car-seat trade-in event through 9/28 — bring in an old car seat to get a 20% discount on other baby/toddler stuff.
- Tuckernuck – Friends & Family Sale – get 20%-30% off orders (ends 9/19).
- White House Black Market – 40% off select styles
Some of our latest posts here at Corporette…
And some of our latest threadjacks here at Corporette (reader questions and commentary) — see more here!
Some of our latest threadjacks include:
- What to say to friends and family who threaten to not vote?
- What boots do you expect to wear this fall and winter?
- What beauty treatments do you do on a regular basis to look polished?
- Can I skip the annual family event my workplace holds, even if I'm a manager?
- What small steps can I take today to get myself a little more “together” and not feel so frazzled all of the time?
- The oldest daughter is America's social safety net — change my mind…
- What have you lost your taste for as you've aged?
- Tell me about your favorite adventure travels…
Anon
I’m going to be in NY next week–staying near Grand Central. If I have a couple hours to do any shopping, what would be the best recommendations in that area? I literally may only be able to carve out an hour or two in the evenings, but I will feel like a failure if I go to NYC and buy nothing!
fresh jd
All along 42nd St. starting at Lex and walking down till 5th you will find Kenneth Cole, Banana Republic, Loft, Sephora, H&M, and Zara (then turn down Madison Ave or 5th Ave at 42nd and walk up some of the fanciest shopping streets in the city). You can also go to Bloomingdales on 59th and Lex. I work in this area, so I know it all too well (unfortunately – so crowded)!
E
What price point are you looking for? High end boutiqes? Chains? Dept stores? Local discount chains?
Anon
All of the above!
E
Agree 100% with fresh JD.
Century 21 is all the way downtown if you feel like an adventure some night. Always recommended.
This is one I haven’t mentioned or seen mentioned here before but figured I’d bring it up since you’ll be super close (store on Lexington Ave between 43rd and 44th) and it has some real hidden gems. It’s a local chain called De Janeiro that sells heavily discounted stuff – some of it is super cheap brands with very poor quality that you won’t want to touch and some is branded (chain) stuff on which you can get a steal. Oftentimes decent selection of workout clothes, etc. (got my favorite sports bra here for $5). They also have a small but very nicely assorted and generally very well priced shoe selection in the back. I have SUCH a hard time with shoes – most of the time I can spend an hour at DSW and walk out empty handed but I’ve had tons of success at De Janeiro finding comfortable, reasonably priced, attractive shoes that I can wear at work or to commute – and the selection is so small (maybe 50-60 different styles) that it only take a few minutes to browse through it all!
Anon
2nd the DeJaneiro suggestion. Used to stop in there when lived in NYC, always stop in when visiting now. There is one on Mad or Lex near GCS.
South of Houston
The flagship Saks is also fairly nearby, 49th and 5th. If you haven’t been before it could be fun, though even their ‘contemporary’ lines are pretty pricey if you’re looking to do serious shopping…
M in CA
I love browsing Henri Bendel, especially the first floor with fragrances, cosmetics, and some accessories. I always feels particularly New York-ey when I go there.
Ru
If you’re into jewelry and other accessories, I’d say walk around the fashion district – up and down Bway and 6th Ave, between 23rd and 34th Streets. You’ll get costume jewelry, purses, belts, belly dancing outfits (in case you were curious), jewelry storage, beads, buttons, etc., at wholesale prices. Walking out with bags of stuff for less than the retail price of one item always makes me giddy.
SF Bay Associate
Through my alumni association, I volunteered to talk with a student about my career (attorney). I was assigned an undergrad freshman PoliSci major and we are trying to figure out when/how to meet. I want to be helpful to her, but I also am not usually inclined to sugarcoat anything – how honest should I be on my career? Focus on the inspirational “interesting work (sometimes), helping people, etc,” or include reality checks like “long hours with no control over my schedule. lots of debt. few law graduates get the high paying jobs, and mostly I work for Goliath, not David.” She’s only 19 and thus a long way from law school. I don’t want to destroy her dreams, but I am not sure how much reality is fair to inflict on her, or hide from her. Any thoughts?
Aria
I sort of feel like it’s my duty to be honest with college kids about the realities of being a lawyer, since I didn’t have anyone in my life to tell me the truth about what being a lawyer really meant. I try to make sure I give a balanced answer when asked about being a lawyer — meaning, I don’t hide the long hours, the boring work, the Goliath-aspect or the harsh realities of debt. But I also do try to point out the things I don’t hate — interesting projects I’ve worked on, the status of being a female professional, (ok, I was going to put more things I didn’t hate, but I ran out of ideas).
Em
I think you can point out the trade-offs – it’s totally possible to be a “David” lawyer, but you can expect to do that and make good money, and it may be impossible to do that and pay off debt. That’s good info to know without being unduly negative.
2L
I will say that while it’s important to *really* emphasize the competitiveness of the market and the potential for crushing debt, I think it’s also important to note that IBR/LRAP programs at really good schools are a way to be a public interest lawyer and not default on loans. This option isn’t available at a lot of schools, but if she is really set on going to law school and not working at a firm, she should be aware that she should either strive for a school with such programs or go to a lower ranked school on a scholarship.
Herbie
Just to play devil’s advocate… LRAP programs are great. But it’s not a golden ticket out of debt. The amount of debt the program will pay depends on your salary, and your salary must be really *really* low to take fullest advantage of the program. Additionally, if you’re married, some LRAP programs will count your spouses salary in addition to yours in determining the amount of debt the program will pay. This often will result in you making too much money to qualify for debt repayment.
2L
How low your salary has to be depends on the school’s program (at mine it’s 80K- hardly *really* low). FWIW, I know this isn’t the norm, but she should know at the very least that this is something she should consider when looking at schools.
Herbie
@2L – you’re right; the salary requirements vary. At my school, the salary cap was around $40k. Most married people, because their spouse’s income was counted as their own, couldn’t qualify as a result. LRAP is definitely something to be knowledgeable about, but like I said, it’s not a golden ticket out of debt.
Sal
Additionally, students considering public interest work after law school should also be made aware of the federal IBR on any federal loans, which lowers payments and forgives any unpaid debt after 10 years of payments made while employed in public interest or government work. Grad Plus loans have taken the place of private student loans for the most part and are included in the federal IBR repayment plan. To my knowledge, entering the federal IBR plan doesn’t disqualify you from using a law school’s LRAP, so it would make the money go farther and could be a huge help for public interest lawyers.
Anon
What I tell ‘want to go to law school’ younguns is this: the question may not be whether you’d like practicing law (and that’s a whole long conversation) but rather will you be able to get a law job. The market glut is strong and the saturated so without an air tight plan and luck you may not be able to get hired. Then, you might hate it. I think honesty is better. I run into at least a person a week wanting to go without a clue. Was one of them 12 years ago. Met a kid on a plane yesterday who is a music major and wants to be a lawyer because he thinks it’ll be fun… ay, yay yay.
sittininla
Also fair to note, as a public interest attorney right now about to end a 2 year fellowship. There are hardly ANY jobs for public interest attorneys. Even if you are willing to make under 50K it is super hard to find the jobs available. Right now I am willing to take a lower salary but cannot find any jobs in the public interest field who are willing to hire someone without substantial experience.
TCFKAG
I also think its helpful to talk to her about things she should do to help her make an informed decision about law school. I always recommend to college students that they look for legal related internships or jobs right out of college.
I think honesty is essential. Its sort of like how, as soon as women get pregnant, they begin hearing horror stories about pregnancy…its something they could have used BEFORE (just kidding…sort of).
Lyssa
I think Aria’s right about mentioning things that you like and dislike. That said, I think that a few people tried to tell me non-sugar-coaty things before law school, and I didn’t listen at all. Or, rather, I guess I listened but wasn’t dissuaded- the idea of working long and boring hours for Goliath didn’t bother me too much. (And it still doesn’t, so I guess there’s that.)
Of course, if someone had managed to tell me: “Hey, the economy’s going to collapse spectacularly during your second year and you won’t be able to find a decent job even if you’re in the top 10% of your class,” well, that might have convinced me. So, some realism about the market, in particular that it’s not quite the meritocracy that she might be expecting, might be in order.
summer in illinois
Law student here: Inspiration is fantastic but I hope you’ll also share enough details of the career and how to get there with her that she’ll have the tools to make a smart decision. I think it’s important to encourage her to base her vision of what being an attorney is like on the actual work, not some TV version of a lawyer’s life.
You could give her a realistic picture of your work demands (including how much time you spend at the office, any semi-mandatory social events, and your average turn-around time on projects) and the life decisions that help people become attorneys (in a positive way, as part of the cool power attorneys have in society, you might want to mention character & fitness and the intensive reporting requirements on some law school apps so she has some perspective on college peer pressure). Both of those topics would be useful for her in evaluating whether it might be a career fit for her, and you’d be giving her information that she might not be able to find as easily elsewhere.
cbackson
My dad is a poli sci prof, and so I field a lot of questions from his students about careers in law. I feel like the best thing I can do for them is foreground the economic realities, especially surrounding debt and salaries. It’s also very hard for a college student to understand what a working lawyer’s life – especially a transactional lawyer’s life – is like, and I feel like that’s an important thing to share as well.
I can’t tell you how many students tell me that they want to go to law school because they “love the law”, for example – someone needs to tell them (gently!) that (i) they probably have no idea whether or not they love they law, regardless of how much they enjoyed an undergrad con law class; (ii) what really matters is whether they’ll love life as a lawyer.
Paige
This is the kind of advice I wish someone would have given me before law school. I don’t necessarily regret going to law school, but I believe I could have found something I liked just as much without the debt burden. I also second the advice given by another commenter about taking a year off- I do regret not taking time off between undergad and law school.
kz
tell her both sides, especially the economic realities right now. I asked questions before I started law school and I still don’t think I really got how much of a burden loans were (of course, I was expecting to get a firm job and for the economy to not completely melt down, as was everyone I talked to before law school).
Me too
I do the same sort of mentoring through my alumni association. I mentor two college students, both who are very interested in law school. I have been extremely positive about my experience as an attorney because I truly love my job (law clerk and former Big Law attorney, going back to Big Law next year). I wouldn’t sugar coat it though if there are things that you don’t like about the job because that’s not being fair to your mentees. I told them very honestly that I work long hours but the work itself is very challenging and interesting. I have also told them REPEATEDLY that they should take time off between college and law school because it may turn out that they aren’t interested in the law after all, and it’s important to come to that decision before embarking on a very expensive and time consuming graduate school experience.
Anonymous
I think we, as a society, should stop providing student loans for new lawyers at this point. If someone gets a scholarship, great, then he or she has a chance at getting a job down the road.
E
Huh? So your suggestion is that all students who should become lawyers are either the extremely bright who qualify for scholarships (some of which might no longer be available if there are fewer paying students) or have the private resources to afford law school? I don’t think that’s such a great way of accomplishing the goal of getting fewer people to go to law school.
Anonymous
Why do we fund it? What need is being met by giving out loans for more lawyers? If a person has the resources, great, go for it. No one is stopping them. But it is not a good investment and we need to start facing that.
E
That’s a much bigger issue than law school. Why are loans made available for music majors? For advanced degrees in other fields where high paying jobs are scarce? Our society values education and equal access; if you took away big categories of student loans for degree programs that are deemed not to be a good investment for the prospective student, I think there will be lots more societal harm than the benefit of not having underemployed law students saddled with debt. There are far more egalitarian ways to keep class sizes down.
Also, I think you’re overreaching in complaining that “we” fund student loans. Student loans are not dischargeable in bankruptcy, are often provided by private lenders with no government guarantee, and typically represent a good return to those providing the funding.
Almost-Lawyer
Student loans are not free money provided by society. They are some of the highest interest loans on the market that we will be paying back at an 8% interest rate.
Plus, those people who “we” would stop “funding” by taking away the availability of student loans may be the same people who could be fighting for your constitutional rights, but because they could not get any loans they are instead sucking up resources elsewhere.
Herbie
I wouldn’t agonize over it too much, to be honest. Studies have shown that people entering law school are unduly optimistic (read: delusional) regarding their chances of succeeding (in this case defined as a big law job starting at $160k), even when they are objectively aware of the odds against them. So I’d be honest without making it sound like you absolutely hate life and then assume that when it comes time for her to make her career choice, in all likelihood, she’ll discard the negative things you said anyway.
Another Sarah
This is exactly what I thought. I had a similar discussion with one of my good friends about going to law school/being a lawyer. I tried to reason with her about her dreams/goals about law school/being a lawyer (she was going to be the next Jack McCoy, only for businesses, and only in the Supreme Court), and she told me, point blank, that she and I are different and that her law school experience will be different than mine because she’s more mature starting law school than I was. True, she is a different person that I am, and her law school experiences are different than mine (sort of). But hubris can carry a person a looong way.
Eponine
I hope that she was not just more mature when starting law school, but starting law school at Yale with her summa cum laude Princeton BA in hand. :)
Double Ivy League-er
Believe me, as easy as you think it might be for those of us with dual Ivy degrees, it’s not. We’re having just as hard a time getting jobs as the rest of the world and are graduating with just as much debt and unemployment. Even having two Ivy degrees is no degree of wild/stereotypically thought-of success.
Double Ivy League-er
Sorry, I meant to say: havign two Ivy degrees is no assurance of wild/conventional success. Ugh. Maybe my inability to write coherently is keeping me from said wild success. :P
Anonymous
That made me giggle! thanks!
Eponine
@DoubleIvy – oh, I don’t think it’s easy for you. I just think it’s next to impossible to become a superstar Supreme Court litigator without having double Ivy degrees (and not just any Ivies, but Princeton/Harvard/Yale/maybe Columbia).
Another Sarah
Alas, the only Ivy we saw covers the outfield wall at Wrigley. :-D
2L Summer
Ted Olson has no Ivy degrees…and he’s a pretty good Supreme Court litigator :-) (not necessarily that I agree with everything he litigates…, but smart guy)
I think it is probably extremely difficult to get ON the Supreme Court without any Ivy degrees.
found a peanut
I agree. You can someone that only the top 10% of the class will get a job, and 99 times out of 100 that person will be convinced that s/he will be in that top 10%. If you tell that person that 99% of people think they’ll be in the top 10%, he’ll just feel bad for all those people who are deluding themselves. You can try telling them that they’re not that smart or special and see how that works. I haven’t tried it yet but I’d be interested to know the results :D.
Another Sarah
It doesn’t work. See post, supra. :-D
Lyssa
Heh, somewhat ironically, I relied on the idea that 90% of the law class got good jobs (per the school- yeah, I was dumb) and thought: Hey, I can rely on the fact that I’m not likely to be in the bottom 10%. Never thought that I would be in the top 10%, but I was. Turned out that even that didn’t help me all that much on the job front.
Be sure to let her know that there’s a lot more to it than grades, in this economy.
Double Ivy League-er
I agree. I think these days especially, the stereotypical things that people assume will make it easy (being in the top percentage of your class, working for the most prestigious firms, getting Ivy degrees/etc.) don’t make it easy any more. I got ONE job offer in 9 months of hunting, despite my educational background, previous jobs, and all that. I was rejected from hundreds. I know friends who are still hunting. It’s tough for everybody and there are seriously no assurances of anything these days. All you can do is your best and hope it’s good enough.
MelD
I think you should be honest, but also encourage her to talk to several attorneys in different practice areas/sectors to see what they think as well. There are some people who go to law school who want the high-paying jobs but others do not. I really hated my jobs prior to law school and am happy with my decision, even though my current financial situation is worse than it would have been if I stayed in my old career.
Herbie mentioned that students are unduly optimistic about their prospects despite objectively knowing the odds are stacked against them. I don’t think that’s really the case. Many people do spend their time researching job prospects, but most schools lie through their teeth about median salary and employment at graduation. She’d be much better off talking to recent grads about their experiences than trying to go through the school’s admissions office.
Makeup Junkie
What are the reasons your mentee has for going to law school? That will probably make a difference in what advice you give her.
Anonymous
I think you should discuss both sides. And I don’t think that as a rising sophomore she really is “a long way from law school.” She is probably making a lot of decisions about internships, class selections, plans for taking the LSAT, etc. based on her expectation that she will go to law school. And her vision of her future is probably pinned to that idea, but maybe should be broadened. College is the time to explore, but often kids pigeon-hole themselves.
I’d just encourage her to spend some time now identifying what about the law is appealing to her, and then identifying various jobs, including lawyer, that have that component. Then she can figure out whether there is a better day-to-day fit for her, or if being a lawyer is her true calling. I’m generally happy as a lawyer, but I wish I had considered this. I would probably be a lobbyist, non-profit/NGO advocate, bureaucrat or think tanker instead. On a daily basis, I think I’d get more of what I enjoy about the law and less of what I dislike.
Elysian
In law school now –
One of my professors said something along the lines of “Why doesn’t anyone become a lawyer because they love to read and write? That’s basically all lawyers do.”
If that’s as true in practice as it seems to be from my end, I think that would have been something I wanted to know up front. Not that it makes me unhappy, I do in fact like to read and write, but it was a surprise. If you hate reading or writing, and you should know that that’s what you’re getting yourself into.
Eponine
This is a great point – I love research, reading and writing, but I too had no idea this is what lawyers do all day until I was in law school. People who become lawyers because they like debate or rhetoric or politics or whatever are the ones who end up unhappy.
Another Sarah
This is true. I don’t mind reading and writing, but I went to law school because I love debate and public speaking (appellate arguments, NOT trial work). Had I known, to get to the “great arguments” required months upon months of paperwork, and that everything turns on the brief anyway, I may have given it a second thought. But then I was also a victim of my own hubris, so maybe not. :-)
Miriam
I think you should be honest. It’s not crushing her dreams; it’s giving her a dose of reality. It’s better to let her know that being a lawyer isn’t what you see on t.v. or in the movies. Now is when she has the chance to change her mind. Give her the proper information and let her make the decision whether law school is something she is still interested in pursuing.
jaded
Um, tell them to imagine having to pay a house payment every month for the next 30 years….but NO F-ING HOUSE, just student loans, and offered 60K annual salaries. Even a college kid can figure out that you can’t afford 2 houses on that salary.
E
Anyone with an iPad 2 have a great cover to recommend? Thanks!
ADL
A great cover? I recommend getting the smart cover, built for the iPad 2. It also acts as a stand (flat or upright).
E
The one Apple sells? I’m actually using that now, and while it’s super sleek, has very cool functionality with the magnets, and the stands are at good angles, it’s more a “cover” and less a “case.” I realize I asked for a cover but I really meant case!
I want the back and sides to be reasonably well protected in case of a drop and from bumps and scratches inside my bag. Another priority for me is keeping it slim and lightweight. I’d also like something attractive if at all possible. :)
I’ve checked out reviews on amazon, and while there are a few that sound pretty good, there are pros and cons with each.
AL
Got it. My purse has a compartment just big enough for the ipad so with the cover, mine stays well protected.
spacegeek
If you want something fun, try etsy.com and search on ipad case. I have a really nice one that I’m happy with (for now). Plus etsy items are so often on the less-expensive side, so if you get bored, you can swap for a new one without feeling regrets!
Jenn
I have one from Rogue Theory on Etsy, and it fits the iPad with the smart cover on. I like that I can still use the smart cover, but keep it protected while it bangs around in my bag. I would love some of the gorgeous ones (like a Chanel one I saw once), but the plain-Jane cloth cover will do!
DBG
This is one of the nicest ones I have seen … I have it and love it!
http://www.booqbags.com/laptop-backpacks-laptop-bags/booqpad-iPad-2-agenda
The Online Shopper
This is a fun and quirky ipad cover: http://www.katespade.com/designer-cell-phone-and-laptop-cases/designer-iphone-cases/ipad-newspaper-print/01957-0,default,pd.html?dwvar_01957-0_color=005&start=8&cgid=phone-cases-iphone-and-ipad
kz
I posted this earlier in the week and didn’t have any takers, so I thought I’d try one more time before it goes up on ebay.
I bought this dress: http://www.talbots.com/online/browse/product_details.jsp?id=prdi25693&rootCategory=cat400044&catId=cat80018&sortKey=Default§ion=Outlet&conceptIdUnderSale=cat400044
in black on final sale from Talbots in a 4P, and it’s a bit too roomy for me in the top. Before I put it on Ebay, I thought I’d see if anyone here wanted it. I’d be happy to sell it to you for what I paid ($25) plus shipping, or if you happen to be in the new york area, I can just meet you somewhere rather than shipping it. As for the fabric, it’s sort of a boiled wool, if that makes sense (kind of like a cross between fleece and what most winter coats are made of)–good for winter. I’m 5’6″ and it hits just above the knee on me, and a 32B and it’s a tad big in the chest. So if you’re really normally a petite 4, it should fit (I can’t for the life of me figure out my size in talbot’s dresses). If you want it, send me an email at corporetteclothesswap@gmail.com
Read more: https://corporette.com/2011/05/17/tuesdays-tps-report-button-down-dress-with-belt/#ixzz1Mus9r4d3
Feeling Whiny
I’m just having a little pity party for myself right now. My three-year relationship just seems to be petering out, but on my end only. He seems fine with the status quo, while I’ve gone from wanting to get engaged/married (as of a few months ago) to just wanting to be alone (the last few weeks).
I’m still waiting it out, to see if this is just a slump or something more permanent. But I can’t help but feel like an idiot for still not being able to get this right! And a bit of a mid-30s, pre-birthday panic just tops it all off.
I can’t really talk to any of my friends about it — they are all happily married and just give me the ‘oh poor you’ look, or are single and think I should just be happy I have a boyfriend. Plus I’m just sick of over-analyzing it all.
I’m burnt out at work, and it’s only going to get worse, as the work keeps coming in and we just don’t have enough people around to do it. Everyone is swamped, so I can’t even say ‘help me’!
My solo mini-break is a month away — just trying to stay on top of everything until then.
Lydia
Sorry to hear you are unhappy and are unable to share with friends. Hope the solo break gives you some clarity.
TX Attny
I’m sorry, Feeling Whiny, to hear this. I once read a quote along the lines of “sometimes you realize you’re running a race you don’t really want to win.” I understand the feeling of having doubts about the future of a long-term relationship, but then not being sure if they are doubts brought on by the relationship or work or being tired or other stuff, and then thinking that if they are doubts and you ignore them and get married, can this/how will this work? Yep, over-analyzing for sure.
Hold on until your mini-break when you get some time to think and reflect on your own. And maybe try to find some time to do something special for yourself in the meantime (a nice tea, nice lotion, facial, etc). You deserve it!
Anon
I had this issue also. My longstanding boyfriend absolutely refused to commit, and after a lot of prodding and pleading, he finally agreed that we would get married in a year. But then he got cold feet about 6 months in and I got so tired of it, I just said NO MAS.
Then I felt bad, and he felt bad so we made up, but without the marriage commitment hanging over us. He was again happy to come over, eat, sleep over and then leave, and I got sick of being his home away from home. Besides that, I was the one cooking, cleaning and buying the food and beer he consumed whenever he came over. So I said good bye again, but this time for good.
Do I miss him? Yes, but I could not have the opportunity to find a real man with him over all of the time when he wanted to, and then not coming over when he had something else going on.
So figure out what it is that you want, and if it’s him, make him commit, and if he won’t show him to the door.
Anon
I was in the same situation a few years ago. 4 years of dating, 2 years of waiting for engagement, finally got him to pop the question, then he wanted to postpone the wedding indefinitely. Breaking up with him was the hardest, and best thing I’ve done.
But as for the OP, if you both want different things, maybe it’s best to cut your losses? It sounds like you already see the right path, but that you’re hestitant because of how difficult/painful it will be. It sucks, and sucks bad, for a while, but then the sun comes out again.
To quote from You’ve Got Mail —
Frank – “is there someone else?”
Kathleen Kelly – “No. No, but… but there’s the dream of someone else.”
Anon
You are so right. I agree. Let’s get our heads out of the sand with these guys. I say never waste your time again, and give yourself to someone who is just interested in coming over for booty calls. Any guy who just wants to come for a booty call should be dumped immediately. We do not get anything out of a booty call except some smelly panting slob who musses us all up and then leaves the place in shambles as he burps and walks out the door. No thank you. No more of that type of schlepp for me. I am better than all that. I deserve a guy who respects me, takes me out, and asks me for my opinion, and values it. He wants to be with me even as I do mundane stuff like laundry and food shopping, and he will come with me as I go clothes shopping or on other errands. That is the kind of guy I want. Bring that guy to me! That is my prayer.
Orange Oprah
Burn out. I have been there, too. Three months ago I was cleaning the apartment I shared with my “long-term but not interested in marriage” boyfriend when I found another woman’s Spanx. Four years down the toilet.
In retrospect, I felt like our relationship had run out of gas long before. I thought that like everything else in my life, if I just worked harder at it, the relationship would be successful. But it takes two to tango and not everyone is capable of being the person you need them to be.
As overachieving women, I feel like we put so much pressure on ourselves in general. Regarding just about everything. From the way we look to how “happy” we are supposed to be.
Bottom line, don’t judge yourself as a finished product. You are a work-in-progress, just like everybody else, until the day you die. Just try to learn and grow to a place where you getting your real needs meet.
At least this is what I tell myself…
Laura S
Spanx? He cheated on you with a spanx wearer?
I would have dumped his sorry arse faster than you can say Jack Offa! Believe me you are not missing anything with that twerp!
I will never give my self sexually to any man who will not commit to a relationship leading to marriage. Otherwise, all I get out of it is a pile of useless trinkets and the chance of an unwanted pregnancy. No spanks!
Reg poster, anon for sex talk
I know that you’re going to get reamed for suggesting that one should use caution about entering into sexual relationships, so I’ll just jump the gun and say that that’s how I approached dating/sex (as in, I restricted actual sex to someone I was in a relationship leading to marriage with), and I’m really glad that I did. This really has nothing to do with the original post or any others that came after it, but sex is a big deal, and it drives me nuts when people pretend it’s not.
Different anon-for-this
You know, it’s really nice to read comments from other professional women with this outlook. I know sex isn’t a huge deal (or initiating a sexual relationship isn’t) for a lot of women, and I don’t judge that, but for me, it is, and sometimes I feel like a huge freak for that in this culture.
Anon V
Thanks for posting this comment, I totally agree about sex being a big deal. I posted a while back about being a 25 year old professional woman who’s still a virgin. It has nothing to do with religion or being a prude, just not wanting to be with more than one man in such an intimate way. In college I did feel like a bit of a freak but at this point I really don’t care. I’m still amazed at how other women are judgmental of me when I never judge them. Why can’t woman support each other regardless of differing outlooks? Maybe this was a bit of a rant on my part but I had to get it off my chest. Thanks for listening and would love to hear any comments.
Anon VI.
So many anons!
I’m a 23 year old (becoming) professional woman who’s still a virgin, and I’m pretty sure I’ll continue being one for at least another few years, until I find myself ready to think about marriage. Despite that shocking fact, I’ve managed to find myself in a serious relationship with a great, handsome, and successful guy who is everything poster #47 describes.
I’ve never understood how or when so many women apparently just agreed that having sex is a prerequisite to snagging a man, and that they have to hide it if they think sex is meaningful or serious. If a man can’t or won’t respect what you feel, why stress yourself out trying to be with him?
Eponine
Not to rain on the chastity parade here, but Laura S is a troll.
And on a related topic, I agree with you too.
2L Summer
Hmm, I feel like I don’t need to be anonymous for this (although, I guess my regular name is so anonymous as to make it a moot point) — but I am in a long term committed relationship where we are planning to get married, but I don’t wish to have sex before we actually get married. It’s not for religious reasons — and I’ve been really happy with my set up (not that there is anything wrong with it being for religious reasons). So +1 for being a soon-to-be professional woman in this situation.
Like a Virgin
until I was 26. And that was the man I married. Happy to say I’ve only had intercourse with one man. Media plays that sex is no big deal, which it usually has a lot of emotional heart ties for women.
Hel-lo
“A spanx wearer?”
Can we please not judge other women for wearing Spanxx? We’ve had lots of discussion on this site about Spanxx (and Assets or whatever). Let’s not judge each other for wearing it.
Eponine
Laura S is Ellen.
Unsub
I don’t think that Spanx is the issue here. Substitute thong, g-string, granny panties, hiphuggers, etc and the guy is still an a$$hole.
Cat
although suspecting Laura is less than genuine given the comment history, the comment on “all I get out of it” reminded me of one of my favorite lines from Gone With The Wind (book) – Rhett suggests something about Scarlett being his mistress, and she replies something like “Mistress! What would I get out of that but a passel of brats??” He then scolds her for not being indignant about the concept itself in the first place :)
Kit
Your post doesn’t really say that he doesn’t want to get married, but other comments have made this assumption. If this is true, don’t waste any more of your time with him. If marriage is important to you and the guy you are with doesn’t want to get married, the relationship isn’t a good fit and it’s time to move on. You can’t force a guy to propose or give him an ultimatum… if you need to do this, he’s just not that into you and you’ll expend a lot of worry and heartache for nothing only to separate in the end. Someone else will be a good match for you, but you will never know if you stay in an ill fitting relationship. Hugs. You’ll get through this.
anon
ditto this. i made many compromises with my husband regarding big issues (including whether or not to get married), and it has only led to more problems. although i’m generally a fan of the mantra “don’t let the perfect be the enemy of the good,” i think that it should not apply to finding the person you will presumably spend the rest of your life with. if you are struggling with a fundamental issue like commitment, then you should not feel bad at all about moving on from this relationship.
graduating myself...
i’m so sorry. thats a tough spot to be in. it sounds like you feel the shift is in you, not in him? if you can be objective about it, and nothing about him or his behavior has changed, then personally, i really would try to stick it out at least until that minibreak. it sounds like work has gotten you really burnt out, and one of the symptoms of burn out is emotional disengagement. and/or there might be a little bit of situational depression–i went through a phase of working long hours and feeling isolated from my friends because no one else was in the same life-relationship phase, and it sucked.
it may be that you two have truly grown apart. but you cared for him a lot and wanted to be with him until recently, and you don’t say that he’s done anything to hurt you or changed in any way. hopefully this will pass.
Feeling Whiny
Thanks so much, everyone…I felt weird just blabbing this out here — but it felt safer than anywhere else I could think of.
The marriage thing — he’s not opposed — sometimes — he brings it up (what kind of ring would I like, who would we invite to a wedding) and talks as though we’ll be together forever. Then other times he puts words into my mouth — that I’m just after getting married and having kids.
Which, I know in my heart isn’t true — I figure if anyone would have done, I would have been a bit more pro-active about it years ago and would have picked someone a lot less complicated than him!
But then sometimes I wonder if it is something on that list of ‘accomplishments’ that I need to check off.
We’ve hit a slump in our relationship — we’re not as consistently nice and affectionate to each other as we used to be, he rarely talks about anything other than work – since he’s been working a lot too, and I’ve just run out of things to talk about, since talking about work is almost as bad as being at work.
Yes, I am a left-brained, type-A, over-analyzing control freak. Not knowing what’s going to happen, or even really what I want, drives me up the wall.
And now I think I’m going to shut down my computer and go shopping. ;-)
Ballerina girl
For whatever it’s worth, I think all you can really do is listen to your heart–and be really honest about what it’s telling you. I’m a similar type of control freak and it’s hard to not have a way to verify that your decision is right, but just go with what your gut is telling you.
Miriam
I feel like he is talking about marriage almost to keep you on the hook. Is he talking about marriage in the next year or two or is he talking about it as something in the distant future? Unless you have a ring, he’s not serious about marriage at this point. I think he just mentions it to keep you from moving on.
Feeling Whiney
Heh — I’m more and more convinced that’s why he was talking about it. It’s obviously too complicated to summarize, and my view would really be one-sided — but I am convinced his big hang up is that I’m not willing to change who I am to mold to his expectations — and my career is one of those things.
We just had a huge blowout fight –and when I said that I wasn’t sure I wanted to marry him or have kids with him (things he’s not sure of himself, it seems) he got upset. The details are irrelevant really — but I did leave his place — not permanently, but thinking about it. I just told him I needed some time to think.
Feeling both very relieved and very sad. And not like doing the work I should be doing.
Lydia
Just wanted to thank everyone who suggested wedges as commuting shoes. I wore 4 inche wedges on my walk to work today and was so amazed at how comfortable they were. Nice to have an option other than flip flops this summer.
Coach Laura
Yay! It’s Friday.
Anonymous
Yay! It’s Friday.
cbackson
You guys! I am going on my first post-divorce date this weekend. At this point, it has been eight years since I dated, and so I’m a little freaked out…but also excited. And of course, trying to figure out what to wear – it’s a casual drinks date, so I’m assuming jean + cute top is the way to go?
Me too
Have fun! I would just focus on keeping it casual and having a good time and not putting any sort of undue pressure on yourself. I think if you consider it just as an opportunity to meet someone new (as opposed to a future partner), you’ll have a more relaxing time. Jeans and cute top is what I would do as well. Dress would seem too dressed up.
Cat
jeans + cute top is always a safe bet. depending on where you’re meeting, a swingy dress with flats or wedges (espadrilles?) and a cardi could also look good and sufficiently low-maintenance but still feminine.
C2
Hooray! I just want to say how much I enjoy hearing from you just as an anonymous internet commenter, so I am sure you will charm the pants (ahem) off of him. I hope he is a worthy match, or at least a nice distraction. You really have had such a constructive, thoughtful attitude when discussing your divorce, and you deserve some light-hearted fun.
As for the wardrobe, I think you can’t go wrong with jeans, a cute top, and some sexy-but-walkable wedges. Have a wonderful time and let us know how it goes!
Bonnie
I think this is a great excuse to get a pair of jeans that makes you feel like a million bucks.
Anon
Putting in a plug for DL1961 jeans. Extremely flattering and comfortable.
Anon
http://dl1961.com/
Valleygirl
have fun! whatever you end up wearing – just make sure it’s something comfortable – so you don’t end up figiting, etc. with it all evening. I’d suggest jeans, heels, cute/sexy top and a blazer with the sleeves pushed up… sorta constructed but fun too. Also my go to for dates was to wear sexy/cute/matching/power underwear – even if I had know intention of anyone seeing it but me – it gave me a boost for the date.
Valleygirl
*no intention – ahh friday.
cbackson
I am actually a big fan of having my pretty undies on, even if it’s just in preparation for a tough day at work!
src
It may make things easier to imagine a few things to talk about before hand. They can be really boiler-plate (seen any good movies recently?) but, for me at least, they can help get the ball rolling.
Bunkster
How about the Arnold Schwarzenegger scandal? I can’t get enough of it.
Oneanon
I can’t be the only one whose first reaction to the photos of his baby mama was “Her? Really?”
Said with Arrested Development intonation.
Ses
Bunkster, you and I should start a speakerphone-hating Red Line riding club. I just had an oddly long conversation with a clerk at Trader Joes about that scandal and the various aspects and sins of Arnold.
Bunkster
Totally. Can we have drinks, too?
Ses
Yes, drinks are now mandatory in the Boston chapter of the Speakerphone hating Red Line riding club!
Bunkster
Excellent. I’m toasting the club with a glass of wine as we speak. I wish we’d started our chapter back in January, when the commute was particularly difficult.
Perhaps we need to discuss the peccadilloes (and hubris!) of politicians and celebrities over drinks at the quarterly meeting. I’ll add it to the agenda.
cbackson
Better that than this week’s other big scandal. I just fielded questions about Dominique Strauss-Kahn and American criminal procedure from my students (all foreign law students) for two hours. Not fun!
Lynnet
This is the one I’m interested in. The Arnold one, well, frankly, it’s just gossip. The Dominique Strauss-Kahn trial is news, with all of the repercussions it’s having throughout the world. I’m also seeing a lot less victim blaming than I expected (although perhaps I’ve just been lucky enough to miss it) which I find heartening.
M in CA
Oooh, congratulations, and have fun! Report back and fill us in. :)
Annie
Yeah! Have fun. Jeans and a cute top sounds perfect.
Francie Nolan
Have fun! You will be great!
Miriam
That’s awesome! For casual drinks I think nice jeans, a cute/sexy top, and heels work well. Don’t want to look like you are trying too hard or not trying at all. Just have fun. Try to relax and don’t drink too much. (Not that you would, but the nerves sometimes get the best of us/me!)
cbackson
Oh gosh, I’m a total lightweight, so I definitely have to restrict myself to one (slowly consumed) drink under pretty much all circumstances! Especially when I am nervous.
SF Bay Associate
Jeans and cute top, yes. Have fun! And since no one has said it yet, I will remind you: safety first. Make sure that a trusted friend knows where you are going, who you are going to be with, his contact information if you have it, and what time you’ve agreed to check in with her with a safeword to make sure all is well.
I know it sounds elaborate, but I did it every time I went out on a date with a new person. It’s really no big deal to tell your bff “the starbucks on main and 1st street. 6pm. joe smith – 555-5555, joesmith@aol.fake, link to online profile on match/eharmony if applicable. i will check in by 9pm with tonight’s safeword “edamame.” And if we changed locations, I texted bff where we were going and said when I was going to check in next. I felt more confident knowing that someone who cared about me knew where I was.
Annie
This is a really good idea. I am just coming to terms with the idea of dating again and will totally use this when I’m ready.
cbackson
Oh, this is a really good idea. I had been worried about that, esp. because my family doesn’t live in this city with me.
First Post-Divorce Date
Don’t be surprised if you have reactions on or after the date that you’re not expecting and that don’t seem “like you.” My first post divorce date, the guy put his hand not-inappropriately on my jeans-clad knee for 2 seconds. I freaked out, told him to remove it and insisted he drive me home immediately. My reaction was an over-reaction and not at all like me. I didn’t date again for a loo-oo-oong time. You never know how you might feel, and that’s OK.
And I agree with SF Bay Associate: tell a friend where you are going and when you will be back and what to do if you’re not.
Enjoy!
cbackson
Thanks for this – I definitely feel a lot of mixed emotions; there’s a part of me that feels a strange guilt about seeing other men. As if I were in some way cheating. And the whole…physical aspect of it freaks me out quite a bit. I have no idea how I’m going to feel about kissing someone (not that I really expect that to happen this weekend, but…well, I guess it could), much less anything beyond that.
Circe
Best wishes for an awesome date! Please tell us how it goes.
AN
Good luck!
Miriam
How did the date go, cbackson? Just curious and excited for you!
Anon
I love the look, but I only fear that with my stomach and tush, people will think I am expecting, and I am not. Round stomachs and tushes run in my family and it is way too early in the season for me to start wearing this kind of loose fitting top, because I also have not spent enough time at the gym exercising my abdominal and glut muscles. Maybe when it is August, I will have dropped the 8 lbs I need to (again, mostly in the stomach and tush) and then can buy this top on sale. By then, the Labor Day sales should have it at $18 or so and I will be also able to save money too!
Yay! :)))))
Valleygirl
Forgive me as I write a book…
I just wanted to update on the yucky boss/situation I was in… I’m the researcher/coordinator in the health gov/NPO sector and was in the leaning towards hostile work environment with a boss who didn’t handle sexual harassment-y coworker (who outranked me) correctly along with some other issues. I was mostly trying to get out of my job – since my job is grant funded and I’m not in a “switch to another department” situation.
Anyway in the last six months I’ve literally been second choice for 8 jobs. Not just making it to the final round of interviews – but I’ve been told – I was the second choice. Also, was offered a job coordinating a major national multi-year research study (yes!) only to have the funding for it put on pause due to fed gov budget issues (crap!).
In tandem with this – my HR person spoke to my boss (and the org’s lawyer) – and my original fear was that my boss would freak out, get defensive, etc. (he doesn’t always take criticism well) – but they had the talk a little over a month ago and he seemed to take it and move on. And my work life has actually really improved. It’s been gradual – but issues I had before (getting pulled in to do damage control for things that could have been avoided and criticized for not mind reading to fix them in the first place) are being resolved and overall I feel like I’m getting a lot more respect and feel valued at work. The co-worker who was doing the harassing has been formally put on notice to improve that and some other behavior that was impacting my and other’s work – or he gets the can…
So I guess the message is that while six months ago I was almost in free-fall trying to find any other work because I was so stressed/depressed/anxious about my job – it’s did get better (and the better rippled out to other parts of my life too – less fighting with husband and feeling ok taking “me” time). The first step was doing the HR meeting which was scary, honestly, but the system worked. So for those who are in similar situations – here’s a little hope things will work out.
TX Attny
Valleygirl, I’m so pleased to hear this! Sounds like the jerk colleague was a jerk to all his colleagues, and I’m glad someone told him to stop it right now. It’s good when the system works! I hope you are able to continue to de-stress and feel more comfortable at work.
ks
Yay Valleygirl! Thanks for the update. What an important lesson to remind us all about – I can find myself so wrapped up in the present *crap* that the future is incomprehensible and unimaginable. That everything must be resolved *NOW* and that I must control all the little moving pieces. Taking a deep breath, doing the things I can (in your case, the scary HR meeting), and pushing ahead into the future with some measure of optimism can really work out in the end. Thanks for the reminder!
Francie Nolan
I have an outfit question…I am going back home for a graduation at the high school I went to, needless to say, I want to look casually polished…Any suggestions? It is on the football field so bleachers….
Cat
Almost anything goes at graduations — when I went to my younger sibling’s HS graduation from my alma mater, I wore a sleeveless dress, a sweater tied over my shoulders and kitten heels. People’s dress ran the gamut from shapeless Chico’s-y type outfits to grandmothers in little suits, so I felt fine.
But for bleachers, I’d probably wear flats and pants (gray pants, which would show the least dust and dirt), a silky shell and a cami (if it’s a cool enough day), otherwise a lightweight sweater set with the sweater part tied around my shoulders. My style leans classic/preppy though, so YMMV.
Cat
*cardi, not cami. Good thing it’s Friday.
Francie Nolan
I like that idea I feel your friday fogginess. I am so done !
Annie
Wrap dress with chic sandals and a great piece of jewelry.
Annie
Like this:
http://shop.nordstrom.com/s/kate-spade-new-york-aubrey-wrap-dress/3155232?origin=keywordsearch&resultback=3762
http://www.anthropologie.com/anthro/catalog/productdetail.jsp?navAction=jump&id=20367728&parentid=SEARCH_RESULTS&color=089
with these:
http://www.jcrew.com/womens_category/shoes/wedges/PRDOVR~33068/33068.jsp
http://piperlime.gap.com/browse/product.do?cid=65939&vid=1&pid=853598&scid=853598002
Hat
I have been sunburned during too many outdoor graduation ceremonies. Wear a great hat!
pjbhawaii
If it’s in the daytime, don’t forget a hat and sunglasses. My son’s high school graduation was brutal — of course it was at the start of summer in Hawaii. Other states may be much cooler.
To Fly the Coup or Not?
I am currently the lone associate in a 3 attorney firm. I hate how the office is run but enjoy the work and the attorneys I work for (other than their inability to run an office). I have been seriously considering joining a couple of other attorneys and forming a new firm, doing the same type of work. I have been doing research about office space, health insurance, malpractice insurance, etc. and now I am getting terrified. I seriously wonder how I going to make this work. Anyone have similar experiences or words of wisdom?
associate
Do you or the attorney you’re thinking about working with have an existing book of business or a track record of bringing in new files? If only one of you do, is this going to be a partnership situation? This would be my main concern with flying the coup.
Leaving
I’m about to leave my government job and start a solo practice. I started talking to other solo practitioners in my town… and I was overwhelmed with the support I found. Once I opened my eyes, there were people everywhere willing to help.
One of them lent me this book: http://www.amazon.com/Start-Practice-Career-American-Association/dp/1590312473/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1305928667&sr=8-1
It was an incredible help.
I also read Lois Frankel’s book, Nice Girls Don’t Get Rich. It talks about how women are less likely to take risks in business, but more likely to have their business succeed.
You can totally do it. You need some initial monetary investment, and some planning, but it’s doable. Everyone I talked to who had gone out on their own in the last year loved it, and highly recommended it.
Go for it! :)
Anon
I’ve worked at a few different types and sizes of law firms, and they were all run terribly. Seriously, it almost felt like they were disorganized on purpose sometimes. This was the case at the small/mid firm where I first worked, and then at the high-end firm that was medium in size but treated itself and its employees like biglaw. At both places, everyone was always running around in a panic. I concluded that it was just part of the job, and that if my high-end firm was run like this, it was likely that most other places were run like this also.
Then again, I hated practicing law. It was not a good fit. If you enjoy the work and the attorneys you work for, that can be a rare and precious thing and might be worth putting up with the fact that the firm is poorly-run.
On the other hand, I’ve had the opportunity to be part of a new-and-growing business the last few years, which means I get to create the organization infrastructure from the ground up (yay!). The best thing I’ve done is to create a system of filing and keeping track of things, and stick to it.
Good luck with your decision!
mille
I believe your head and heart are leaning towards leaving, and you will probably not be happy where you are unless you are going to be able to become a partner and take over office management responsibilities. Is that a possibility?
You just have to know if you are the type of person that can handle the stress and risk of running your own practice. Some people are not cut out for big law and some are not cut out for solo practice. I think it is a good sign that you are terrified– I very vaguely remember hearing an interview with a stuntman or a quote from a movie or something where the stuntman said if he wasn’t a little bit scared, he would stop doing the job, because he’d be too cocky and take too many risks. Going in with eyes wide open is important.
Keep your current job until you save up enough to afford a few months of paying your insurance and office space. Or, see if you can “manage up” and make some changes to how your current office is run. Good luck!
Cat
Question on LinkedIn for all you firm lawyers. I’m a young midlevel. There are a few clients (both business and legal team members) that I’ve gotten to know fairly well while working on deals, etc, but I’m feeling odd about initiating on LinkedIn. When do you find it appropriate to connect w/ a client contact?
Laura S
It’s OK so long as you make it clear it is for business. I had a middle-aged male client (I guess about 45) misinterpret my invite for Linked In as some sort of romantic come-on.
Can you imagine? What an oaf! I don’t know how he could have possibly missed the fact that I already have over 293 people I was already Linked to?!? Could this dufus seriously think I was carrying on with all of the men I was already linked to (about 1/2 of my profile)? Puh-lease!
What a loser he turned out to be. I have therefore learned not to ask just anyone to link to, because of this faux pas, which was not my fault. From now on, I have to have at least a minimal nexus to the person before I asked to be linked.
On the other side of the coin, I will not link to just anyone who is asking me, either. The same minimal nexus rule applies. All too many of these invites turned out to lead to non-genuine propositions to get me to do something for or buy something from, these people (who I didn’t even know!)….
Thank GAWD for the weekend! !!!!!!
Running out of cute screen names
Hi Ellen!
meme
No way. Ellen could never correctly spell that many consecutive words.
pjbhawaii
It’s totally possible that Ellen deliberately misspelled words as part of her persona.
Anonymous
Just so you get a real answer to your question: go ahead and ask. If you’re feeling awkward about it, do it as soon as the deal is over so that you won’t be embarrassed if they ignore or decline your request, but they probably won’t. Just be sure to do it while they still remember you. Plus it’s a good way to remind yourself to keep in touch with them after the deal is over.
Ses
I think it’s often appropriate to connect in this way. In my view, that’s kind of what LinkedIn is for — “we’re not friends (facebook) but we have a business relationship and I’d like to stay passively in touch.”
I’ve linked with vendors, consultants, and acquaintances who I don’t directly work with but wanted to keep in my network.
Caveat – I’m in finance, not law.
Scully
So I’m taking the bar for two states this summer. I signed up for Barbri for one state, but balked on the second due to the overall price. I figured I could self-study for the second because I’ve never taken any prep courses for anything in my life and have done fine. Any recs for a state-specific, self-study bar review materials? Or should I just suck it up and pay several hundred more?
Another Sarah
The Bar is not like any other test you’ve taken in your life. But it depends on the second state. Is it like NJ, where the only other subject you have to know is NJ Civ Pro? Or are you taking TN/VA, where you probably have to know two entire bodies of law? If it’s like NJ, you could maaaayyybeee get away with self-study. But if it’s like TN/VA, self-study is not recommended.
Scully
It’s NJ.
kz
are you doing NJ/NY? I didn’t take both, but I do remember seeing on the barbri schedule that they only had one or two days where they recommended the NJ takers study the NJ-specific stuff, which leads me to believe you probably don’t actually need barbri. Just see if you can find some of the books on ebay or from a friend that didn’t turn them in.
Scully
PA/NJ. Barbri schedules NJ for one day a week.
anon
Maybe 10 of my friends did PA/NJ. I’d say 9 of them studied Barbri’s NJ-specific materials for no more than two to three days. All of them passed NJ. One of them even failed PA but passed NJ even though he didn’t even look at the NJ material. I am not suggesting that these are model study plans, but I am saying that self-studying from last year’s materials should be more than enough.
I also passed PA on about 3 weeks of full-time studying — it’s a manageable bar. You will be fine, good luck!
meme
I think you will be just fine if you review the NJ state-specific materials. I took 2 completely unrelated states a year apart, and I didn’t pay Barbri the second time around. I just asked around and borrowed the second-state-specific books. No problem.
lucky07
If it is anything like NY/NJ, which was what I did, absolutely do not pay for full NJ prep. NJ is just the MBE subjects, plus some NJ Civ Pro. I focused on NY/multistate, spent maybe a day or two looking at a NJ Civ Pro outline, and passed. If you are ready for the multistate, you will be ready for NJ. I heard similar things from people who have taken CT, although I think they studied corporations too. I don’t know anyone who took the PA bar, so I can’t offer any useful advice there. Good luck!
And one more piece of advice: Even if you don’t take a bar trip, plan to do something fun a week or so after the bar exam. It really helps to be able to look forward to something fun.
Lynnet
Jeans question:
The other day I put on a pair of Levi’s a friend had given me (so, pre-worn). When I put them on in the morning they were skin tight, almost inappropriate. By the end of the day, they had stretched so much I looked like I’d bought them a couple of sizes too big. This happens to me with pretty much every pair of jeans I own, although sometimes not as fast. Is there anything I can do to keep this from happening or slow down the rate of stretchiness?
Laura S
Be like me. Don’t buy jeans until you are at the weight you want to be at. Then you will look stunning all of the time and won’t have a pair of baggy carpenter’s style jeans that are only sexy to a carpenter!
another anon
Look at the label–I am guessing that these jeans have a lot of “stretch” in them. I was having this problem until I started specifically looking for jeans with less spandex in them (it is hard to find any without any spandex at all anymore). They still stretch a bit, but they go back to the way they were after washing/drying.
ADS
You’ve got it backwards. The point of spandex in jeans is to retain their shape – cotton stretches out and doesn’t return to shape until you wash and dry. Jeans with spandex will stretch, but not as much as all cotton jeans, because the spandex springs back, unlike cotton.
Hel-lo
I don’t have this experience in one day… but after a few weeks of wearing jeans, they’ll stretch out.
It usually helps to wash them. The dryer does the trick.
TKA
Interesting – I have the opposite problem of another anon. If a pair of jeans has less than 2% spandex, I don’t buy them. The cotton stretches out/sags, and I have the worst time! Definitely check the label – I would guess that Levi’s are 100% cottong.
Anonymous
Is Laura S. the new Ellen?
Anonymous
Are you the new jerk?
Ses
LOL.
EC
I was wondering whether Laura S. was a new troll as well…so if Anonymous is a jerk, I guess I am too.
Cat
thinking yes – every single comment has to do with sex / male attention. Pass!
anon
question: does anyone have recommendations for getting over an ex-boyfriend that you see on a daily basis? i made the (admittedly stupid) mistake of dating someone in my office. my usual m.o. after a break up is to just avoid the person (thereby avoiding thinking about him) until i am over the break-up; however, i walk by this guy’s office every day and find it very difficult to avoid thinking about him/it. although i probably don’t garner any sympathy because i broke the cardinal rule against intraoffice dating, any help would be really appreciated.
Laura S
Find a guy outside of the office to date. And do it Fast!
As soon as you start dating another guy, the pain of breaking up with this man will fade, even if you see him @ the office. Also, make sure you get rid of anything you have of his in your house. My ex-BF used to leave his clothes at my place because I lived closer to the train station, and he stayed over a lot on weekends. Once we broke up, he did not come by right away to pick up his stuff, including his clothes that had his scent on them. I told him he had to get them that week or I would dump them or donate them all to GoodWill, so he came back to get them. I put all of them in a big Hefty Trash bag and left them outside the door so that I did not have to see him.
Once you have a new BF, the old guy will be like a bad memory. Trust me, I know.
Diana Barry
Fake it till you make it. I once dated a guy (as a fellow summer associate) and then he turned up in my twice-a-week activity a year later. Although I was already in another relationship by then, it felt awkward to me. BUT I just treated him casually, like any old acquaintance, and after a while it still felt weird, but I was used to how to act around him, if that makes any sense. Good luck! Time will help. :)
Miriam
Try to remember why you broke up. That could help you realize that it was the best decision and make it easier to get over.
LawyrChk
I’ve got a close friend whose daughter has first communion tomorrow. I’ve been invited to the ceremony and after-party and wanted to bring a small gift on the $10-20 range. I’m not Catholic.
Any suggestions of what to bring? I was thinking a cute set of jewelry or headbands or something(maybe a gift card to claire’s?) but need some good ideas.
Thanks in advance!
CC
A cute set of jewelry or headband actually sounds like a good idea, if the daughter is a “girly” type girl. Otherwise… bookstore gift certificate? (I’d do this over Claire’s, only because I think that store has gotten worse) Cute set of crafty-type stuff?
Catholic
A religious gift is appropriate – not accessories or something like that. First Communion a very solemn and holy event of incredible importance to Catholics. I personally would be upset if my child was given a bunch of presents to celebrate, because her first Communion is supposed to be about her receiving Jesus, not about her getting presents. If you know of a Catholic bookstore, they’ll have a huge selection of first Communion gifts that you can choose from.
If you aren’t comfortable getting a religious gift, I would suggest a nice photo frame. Her parents will definitely be commemorating the day with photos and that would be a lovely and thoughtful gift. You may even be able to find a religiously-themed one at a regular (non-religous) store.
One other thing you might want to know, in conversation tomorrow – the “ceremony” is called Mass.
Yikes
You’d personally be upset if your child was given a bunch of presents from your non-Catholic friends? It’s a milestone, and gifts the child can use in other areas of her life (not just in advancing her relationship with Jesus…) would certainly be welcome and appropriate in my circle. No, it’s not intended as a big toy fest but I think a couple nice headbands are completely in the right spirit.
Suggesting the gift really ought to come from a Catholic bookstore to me sounds like suggesting that a graduation gift really ought to come from the Hallmark store and say Class of ’11.
Bunkster
As a lapsed Catholic who did have her first communion, I’d have been upset to receive all religious gifts. I think the only one I did receive was a cross pendant.
A headband or jewelry sounds lovely and appropriate.
Catholic
You’d have been upset because you wanted it to be all about you instead of all about Christ. Which is exactly my point.
Bunkster
Jesus (and yes I stated that on purpose). If you want to dictate what your child receives as a gift, then you probably should only invite like-minded people.
Also, there’s no need to criticize me for having an opposing view.
MelD
I agree with Bunkster. If a person is inviting non-Catholics to a first communion, she’s probably going to be open minded about what gifts her son/daughter receives. To be quite frank, no non-Catholic or even a Catholic with a different approach to first communion is going to want to attend your child’s first Communion if she knows that you’re going to be so judgmental about everything.
Scully
Maybe a set of C.S.Lewis books. The child won’t be able to read them for a few years, but the Chronicles of Narnia are classics (with bonus vague religious overtones). I’m not religious myself, but I still read and enjoyed the books as a kid.
Your suggestions sound fine to me. Typical gifts are rosaries and wall crosses, but really, how many of those can the child actually use?
If you are comfortable with giving religious jewelry, a small cross would be appropriate. If the child has a saint’s name (Joseph, Christopher, Mary, Bernadette, etc), you can get a patron saint necklace, or ask your friend if she has a saint who has a special meaning to her.
Anonymous
I thought you got First Communion when you were 8? Isn’t that the perfect age to read the Narnia books? (I read them at 10, but that’s because I was busy reading other books, not because they were too hard.)
LinLondon
I absolutely don’t intend to minimize Catholic’s feelings on the matter, but to present an alternate Catholic’s opinion- I think a gift certificate for a bookstore is a great idea, it’s something nice, but not frivolous, which I think will accommodate a wide range of parental preferences.
I do not think you should feel any obligation to buy a religious gift. I don’t think any 9 year old has any idea what transubstantiation is and, frankly, it’s likely that she’ll be looking at this as an excuse to wear a pretty dress and have cake.
goirishkj
This, unfortunately. I say “unfortunately” because really I thought that’s what my First Communion was about. I got to wear a big girl dress that I picked out with my grandma (I looked like a lace monster vomited all over me), my big girl pearls from my grandma and I had cake. I didn’t appreciate the solemnity of it all.
I think a lot depends on the parents and how they would view a non-religious gift, but I think a non-religious gift would be appropriate. You can give a non-religious gift that still reflects the fact that this is a religious and solemn occasion. To some degree, it is also a bit of a rite of passage, so something that a “big girl” might use could be appropriate. I like the bookstore gift certificate as well as other “grown-up” type gifts–maybe a nice stationery set?
FWIW and to give some background on my gift-giving views, I give non-religious gifts (and I am Catholic) for baptisms and such. Most of my friends with kids are Notre Dame grads so I give ND onesies with a card about “welcome to the family”. I gave my goddaugther the Anne of Green Gables boxed set with a card about how her family now included her church family and how we will ALWAYS be there for her no matter where life takes her.
Bonnie
I received an initial pendant for my communion and still wear it many years later.
Another Sarah
For my First Communion, I got a few cross/crucifix wall pendants, some rosaries (and those were from grandparents and godparents), a necklace and bracelet of pearls (from parents), and then tons of envelopes with cash in them. It may not have been “tons of envelopes,” but I was 8. I was all into the “receiving Jesus” part of it, but I definitely remember thinking, “I only have four walls in my bedroom, I hope I don’t get another cross to hang on the wall. And saying my prayers is going to take for-EVER if I get ANOTHER rosary!” and then being grateful that I didn’t. Again, I was 8.
FWIW, I don’t have the wall pendants anymore, but I’m pretty positive my first communion money is now my IRA.
clueless summer associate
Advice is needed…I made what could be a very poor choice in getting involved with another summer at my firm (yes, it’s only been two weeks). It isn’t just a hook-up, we genuinely like each other and I think it could really go somewhere more long-term, but am I absolutely screwing myself over by doing this? We’re being very discreet and plan to continue to be and I think we can both be calm and mature enough to deal with things at work no matter how the personal stuff turns out. Is there anyone who did this successfully, whether as a summer or associate?
SF Bay Associate
*facepalm* I absolutely think you could be screwing yourself over with this – very discreet my left foot. People will pick up on it and gossip about it, and there’s nothing more that boring attorneys with settled jobs and relationships love more than gossip from/about the summers (myself included). A relationship is the last thing you want them discussing at your end-of-summer eval, instead of your great work product and professionalism. At the very least, even if you do get an offer, you will be establishing a reputation with your future colleagues, whom you plan to spend several years with after the Bar, as The Girl That Hooked Up With Her Summer Classmate. And you will be judged more harshly and suffer more of a reputation hit than he will (isn’t it always that way with men and women? sigh.). Do not be That Girl.
And “I think we can both be calm and mature enough to deal with things at work no matter how the personal stuff turns out.” Really? You just met the (likely very nice) guy. People and things get ugly very quickly, even if they weren’t before. I’m afraid that you are not nearly as good an actress as you hope you are. No one is.
The summer program is what, 10 weeks? If you genuinely like each other, then you will be able to pick up your relationship 8 weeks from now, after the summer program is over, and then mazel tov to you both. For now, my two cents is to cool it.
summer in illinois
One of my friends from college got no-offered after dating a fellow 2L summer associate because he handled their relationship tensions in a way that made her look bad. They felt their interactions were fairly subtle, from what I understood (they remained friends for years), but the firm decided they could only hire one of them given the likelihood of their relationship changing over the next year. You’re risking a lot more than the guy is, most likely. If he’s a good companion for a legal career I think he should be able to understand if you cool it for 8 weeks…
Anonymous
Yep. You don’t know who you’re with until there’s a problem, then watch out.
You’re gambling your career, reputation, and so much more on a stranger.
soulfusion
I’ll offer a different perspective. I managed to date a class mate (first year associate rather than summer) for about a year off and on and not even my closest friends knew. When things moved up a notch from friendship we both agreed neither of us could tell a sole at the office because we didn’t want to be gossip. It worked.
Also, I’ve heard the gossip of summers hooking up and even seen a couple who kept their relationship low key successfully with no negative effect. As long as it doesn’t spill into your work in any way, I don’t think it should impact your summer. Just be smart, professional and don’t let it be anyone else’s business.
Eponine
I have a totally different perspective – so long as you act like a mature adult it wouldn’t affect your employability at my workplace at all. The only relationships that are problematic at my workplace are ones between people at different levels. You wouldn’t need to sneak around although you would, of course, need to keep the personal separate from the professional. If that’s what you mean by very discreet, and if you really do like each other, go for it.
Keep in mind that Barack and Michelle Obama met when he was a summer (and she was his mentor!) at Sidley Austin.
anon
This. We have seen lots of relationships in the summer classes, and between summers and associates. Know the policies of your firm (I have been at two firms with two very different policies, one didnt have one, one had a strict no fraternization policy) and be discreet. If you are and still get dinged, then that says something about then firm, despite the economy, do you want to work somewhere as petty as that?
Stop
Stop immediately. Concentrate on your work and your reputation at the firm to make sure you get an offer. If it’s real, it will still be there in the Fall. Perception is reality. Everyone will know. And they will wonder why you are pretending to be interested in becoming a partner at their firm when apparently all you care about is hooking up.
They may think the same thing about him, but it’s less likely to affect his chances of getting an offer. Not fair. But that’s what happens.
Zealously guard your future ability to earn income. Stop now!
Lana Lang
Sometimes it works out, sometimes it doesn’t. I don’t really have any magical advice on whether or not to do it as it depends so much on the individuals and the firm. Some firms even have policies that employees aren’t allowed to date or have to tell HR if they are in a relationship so they don’t end up working closely together. Not sure this would apply to summers, but certainly to associates, if there was such a policy.
That said, there are a whole bunch of couples in my firm some who have some even gotten married (although I believe currently there are no married couples still working there, one or the other has moved on to another job). So it can work, especially in a big firm where you are highly unlikely to see each other all the time. I share an apartment with a girl at my firm and we hardly ever run into each other at work unless we plan it (500+ employees). I think it is probably pretty important to keep your work life separate from your love life in this situation, especially as you will both essentially be up for the same job – e.g. if one of you got a job and the other didn’t, that could cause issues (even though for the long-term prospects of your relationship it is probably a good thing).
But I would also point you to the post above by the person who dated someone at the office and now has to see them every day – if you both get offers and accept, this could be you in a couple of years.
Sorry if that sounds negative, it’s not meant to, it’s more intended to provide food for thought. I have dated someone at work (pre-law, not very serious) and it didn’t end that well, but we hardly ever saw each other around the office so it could have been a lot worse.
Diana Barry
Hmm. I (as above) had a relationship with a fellow summer associate – started in the summer and lasted about 6 months. Firm people didn’t mind (although the people involved with the summer program may have gossiped, I don’t know). We both got offers (different departments).
Coach Laura
I don’t have legal experience but plenty of life experience. As others have pointed out, some of your co-workers may be able to find out your secret via body language, intuition, chance encounters etc. You can control how you react but the big variables that you can’t control are how your guy will react, how your higher ups will react. You say that this guy is discreet but even “rational” people can go berserk at a break-up and that a risk. In the end it is your choice but I think it does have uncertainty and unfortunately the higher costs are usually born by the woman.
clueless summer associate
Thanks for all of the advice. I’m not sure at the moment what I’m going to do about it. There is no firm policy on this issue at all – and the impression I get is that it would not “officially” matter but obviously if things go wrong, I know that as the woman, I’m probably out, not him.
We work on different floors and don’t run into each other except obviously as summer associate events, but even then we have different groups, I guess.
But ya, this is just me thinking out loud at this point. Thanks everyone.
Westraye
FWIW – I dated someone in the office my summer, but even though there were no problems (ended on good terms, diff departments etc), I still feel as though it was part of my reputation for a couple of years after the summer. Don’t do it – as a woman, it’s just not worth it. Coach Laura is spot on – people will find out.
Anon
I think you should hold the sex until after the summer. There are plenty of men who should be willing to wait for you to have sex with them.
Anonymous
Let me join the chorus of women who are trying to dissuade you here. For whatever reason, the summers are a really intense time of scrutiny and at the end of the summer, I wrote long reviews on the summer associates where I judged everything about them in a form that was put into their files. A lot of my views of them were based on their judgment (or lack thereof), and not just their written work-product. People are forming snap judgments of you everyday and you only have one time to make a good impression to your partners. It’s totally unfair, but when people see the two of you eating lunch together, they will think you need privacy and not join you (or worse, wonder whether you are going to be charging that meal to the firm).
Herbie
Oy vey. You already like the guy, so this is going to be hard. I would put this on hold for multiple reasons.
1. Do you go to law school in the same geographic area? LD relationships are very difficult. What if it doesn’t work out? Do you really want to have to work with an ex-boyfriend (especially if it ends poorly)?
2. Whether it’s their business or not, people will judge you. This is a summer-long interview. Also, at my firm, women are judged more harshly for this type of conduct than men. It really sucks and it’s sexist, but it’s true.
3. People at your firm will not forget that you dated someone in your summer associate class. They will, however, forget the details. Dating becomes hooking up or just sleeping with. That’ll stick with you for a long time.
Good luck.
NYC
Just to add one more perspective, my husband and I met as summer associates. But we did not start dating until the end of the summer and it was a huge class (over 100 summers). All of the advice here is sound, but sometimes matters of the heart don’t respond to logic!
If you do continue things, I would avoid each other entirely at summer events.
Chris
How do you guys deal with disappointment/rejection?
I applied to my dream job, and haven’t heard anything back from them. I emailed a contact to make sure they had my application/check up on it, and all they told me was that they’d “ask for more information if needed.” I don’t think they’re interested. I guess I could wait for an actual rejection letter, but I don’t even think they send those (It’s a small, rather busy NGO). I just feel discouraged.
What makes it worse is that I have a decent job, and I know that i should be thankful for having it, but it’s just NOT what I want to be doing, and therefore I have a hard time caring about it. And I keep getting rejected from opportunities to do what I want to and should be doing, even though I think I’m pretty qualified. I’m scared of getting locked into what I’m doing now, just because I can’t get out of it.
Sigh.
Anonymous
Don’t take it personally, try to get feedback if possible, and just keep trying.
And realize that you need to have other things in your life that make you happy.
I truly wish you the best of luck.
Just a though
My friend had breast cancer and had her head shaved before the hair fell out. They were very careful when they did it and used the hair to make a wig. It didn’t cover the top of her head (you necessarily lose a little bit of the length of the hair) so she could only wear that wig with a hat but it gave her a weekend look that actually WAS her hair and made her feel more like herself.
She then had another wig that she bought that was cut to look like her hair but slightly different. People who didn’t know she was sick just thought she got a hair cut.
I’m not sure where you would find someone who makes the wigs (she is near la and found someone who makes wigs for hollywood to do it) but I would imagine there might be a wigmaker somewhere near where you live (especially if you are near nyc). It might be something you want to look into for a second option
Just a thought
sorry this should have been in response to soulfusion!
soulfusion
Thanks, I actually cut my hair short a few weeks ago and donated it to Locks of Love – it gave me a sense of control over the process and made me feel like I am doing something good in the process. But I think this is a great idea if I hadn’t gone that route.
soulfusion
Hi ladies, just wanted to check in and thank everyone once again for all of your advice and support a few weeks ago when I first got my breast cancer diagnosis. Things are moving along rather quickly and after finishing a round of successful fertility treatments (23 eggs retrieved and frozen for my cancer free future!), I am starting chemotherapy on Thursday. I have been told I will definitely lose all my hair within a month. I’ve been stocking up on bandanas, scarves and hats and have looked at wigs.
Here is my question, what are your thoughts on the type of head covering I should wear to work? I am going to buy one nice wig even though I am really not that comfortable with the idea of wearing one since I feel like people will just wonder why my hair looks weird/different/fake. I figure I should have one for times I don’t want to be too conspicuous. What would be your reaction to someone just being open about it and wearing a variety of other head coverings to the office?
Thanks!
Anonymous
I’d say see how it goes. There’s no shame in rocking your bare skull if your office is OK with it.
There are some great wigs out there though.
Good luck.
houda
At my company, a senior manager had chemotherapy and she would wear tiny squares (like bandanas but with less pattern).
Then after some weeks, she started wearing a turban-like scraf on her head.
And when she started growing hair back (about half an inch), she simply stopped wearing any type of head covering.
Honestly, none of us thought anything of her head covering. We were just happy that she could be among us at work.
Good luck and remember to do only what makes you comfortable. No one has the right to judge you.
Anonymous
Wear whatever head covering you like. People will understand. Good luck!
E
Posting again due to moderation of earlier post (this time going with the far less risque “att*tude!”):
Thanks for checking in! I am so inspired by the positive, self-assured att*tude that comes through in your posts. (Please don’t interpret that as pressure to ever put on a game face for us ‘rettes though!) Glad to hear about the successful egg retrieval.
A woman in my business casual finance office worked through her breast cancer treatments and did wear a wig until her hair came back in. I don’t think it looked weird or fake, for what that’s worth. At the same time, I think you should absolutely wear your head in whatever manner makes you most comfortable – physically and emotionally.
Keeping you in my thoughts and will be sending extra positive thoughts your way on Thursday!
Denver
Dude, you’ve got cancer. If anyone criticizes your head covering (or none at all), they’re a jerk! Do what makes you feel best. :)
Scully
My mom only wore wigs when she was going to be around strangers and didn’t want the extra attention. She found soft hats and scarves more comfortable and wore them the majority of the time. Going bald was too cold for her.
Also, a well-constructed wig will not look fake to other people. When you look in the mirror, it will seem really weird and different because you are so used to your own hair. But I swear most people couldn’t tell.
Cat
My mother (in full remission now) felt the same way re: a wig (like it would be obvious, unattractive, etc), but wanted to wear one to avoid having to talk about cancer all the time as she was going about her business. I went wig shopping with her at a nice (well, as nice as they get) wig store and we picked the one that was the closest to her normal haircut (short and layered). I then went to her hairstylist with her, who put the wig on her head and cut it to be a pretty great replica.
We were out shopping with her wearing it and ran into acquaintances, who complimented her haircut!
So if you’d prefer to have a wig to avoid having the conversation sometimes, it can look great and natural. Not meant to say you can’t rock a scarf!
Marie
One of my cousins had breast cancer…I hadn’t seen her in ages, so I wouldn’t have picked up on a sudden change in hairstyle, but I had absolutely *no* idea that she was wearing a wig until she said something about it. That was after a multi-day family get-together where I saw her a few days in a row, too…a good wig can be totally undetectable. I had actually noticed her hair too, because it was a great swingy cut…I just thought she had great highlights and a great cut.
Pish
Wear what you like. My cousin had cancer and chose to wear a wig with a stretchy headband sewn in on front (because generally a wig won’t stay on a bald head without slipping). That might be a good option if you want a wig. I actually would recommend against invsting in a nice wig until you’ve actually lost your hair, because you’re going to want to make sure you get one that fits well and will stay on your bare head.
Otherwise, I’ve seen a few women just wear their head bare, but you might get cold doing this. A knit cap would be totally appropriate if you’re cold in the office. Or, of course, you can wear a pretty scarf. A silk one might slip somewhat, but a cotton one should stay on ok.
Take care of yourself. I hope you have a strong support system. And please let us know how you’re doing!
anon
You might check http://www.headcovers.com, I bought a couple of soft turbans for my sister (who is now just finishing up chemo for ovarian cancer) to wear in the hospital, she wanted something lightweight that she didn’t have to figure out how to tie. But they also have a wide variety of scarves. She also got a beautiful wig, it really looks like her hair, and its synthetic, which surprised me, but it definitely looks real. However, sometimes she’d rather wear a scarf or hat, just more comfortable I guess, and she looks fine either way. I think you can wear whatever feels more comfortable to you. Good luck with your treatment!
Just a thought
Meant this as a reply to you:
My friend had breast cancer and had her head shaved before the hair fell out. They were very careful when they did it and used the hair to make a wig. It didn’t cover the top of her head (you necessarily lose a little bit of the length of the hair) so she could only wear that wig with a hat but it gave her a weekend look that actually WAS her hair and made her feel more like herself.
She then had another wig that she bought that was cut to look like her hair but slightly different. People who didn’t know she was sick just thought she got a hair cut.
I’m not sure where you would find someone who makes the wigs (she is near la and found someone who makes wigs for hollywood to do it) but I would imagine there might be a wigmaker somewhere near where you live (especially if you are near nyc). It might be something you want to look into for a second option
Coach Laura
First, congratulations on the egg retrieval and your positive outlook.
I recently had a co-worker with this issue. She did have a wig for those times when she wanted to be dressier (e.g. important client meetings, presentations) so if you have court appearances or big meetings that might be what you choose so, as you said, you are less conspicuous. Other times she wore turbans or scarves or, in the winter, hats. And for much of the time, she wore nothing. No one objected or commented. I hope you have a good experience and can wear whatever makes you happy.
AN
My 32 year old friend rocked her bare skull at our biz casual office. She looked like sinead o’ Connor. Do what is best for you. There’s no right or wrong.
Good luck and god bless.
soulfusion
Thank you everyone for your helpful comments and continued support. I agree with the comments that if people have a problem with chemo induced baldness they have a personal problem. That being said, I have noticed as I disclose my situation to people, they often have a more difficult time hearing the news than I do because they just don’t know how to react. I have an excellent support network with family (though far away), friends and those who know at work so far have been amazing. I just want to avoid awkwardness, to be honest.
That being said, I am strongly leaning toward getting a wig (already tried some on last week and will go back for final selection and fitting once I shave it all off, in a couple of weeks). The one I have tentative selected is a nice quality synthetic one for lower maintence and I’ve been told it shouldn’t blow off in the wind. But for day to day I think scarves, bandanas and hats will be my habit.
Again, thanks for everyone’s warm wishes. This is a fantastic community!
Canadian
PSA: The Brooks Brothers Outlet nearest to me (Niagara falls NY) is having 40% off entire store all weekend. This may be because the store is near the Canadian border, and it is our Victoria day long weekend for us (the store was advertising it is its Victoria Day sale – lots of cross border shoppers). Anyways, I bought a stretch cotton shift dress – virtually identical to the one Cat featured in Wednesday’s TPS- for 40% off of $79. I looove the dress. I am 5’9 and it is plenty long enough to be office appropriate.
Paige
BB Outlets in the US will be running the 40% off your entire purchase promotion next weekend for Memorial Day (Thurs. the 26th- Monday the 30th).
Anonymous
Does anyone have creative ideas for a housewarming gift? My niece and her husband just bought their first house. They’re in their late 20’s and got all the kitchen-type stuff as wedding gifts. My first inclination is a Home Depot gift card, which surely would come in very handy, but I’d like to do something that would sort of mark the occasion. Any thoughts appreciated!
Miriam
What about a wine rack or nice wine glasses? Those seem celebratory.
Help!
How about a doormat with an initial or name on it? A coworker and I bought a wrought iron doormat for a fellow coworker as a combo wedding/housewarming present. Check Frontgate.com for lots of options.
Eponine
The gift card is honestly a great idea. You could accompany it with a small item like a welcome mat or a key hook rack that goes by the door? Something personalized that will make them think of you every time they come home would be nice.
TK1
HD gift card is great! I swear I’ve been keeping that company open single handedly since I’ve become a homeowner. If you want to add a little festivity include a bottle of wine with it.
Running out of cute screen names
Someone gave us a door knocker w/ our last name on it.
K
So, this is a rather awkward question, but I’m just going to come right out and ask it: How do you gracefully (yet firmly) deal with clients coming on to you?
Background: I’m young (early twenties) and very attractive (I hate the way that sounds, but it’s true). I’m also in financial services, so I’m in a very male-dominated environment, and the majority of my clients are men (usually at least a decade older than I am). I recently got a promotion where I’m doing a lot more client-facing work than I was previously.
I’m finishing up my first conference in this new role and I have been dealing with a lot of unwanted male attention since I arrived. I was really not prepared to receive this level of attention (and been rather shocked at how blatant it is). It’s been everything from mild (comments on my appearance – calling me beautiful, attractive, etc.) to the much more overt (giving me hotel room numbers).
I have really been struggling with how to handle this, since these people are clients and some of them do a lot of business with my firm. If it was a coworker, I’d feel much more comfortable putting them in line or going to HR. My tactic as of late has been to change the subject or say a quick thank you if the comment is not too out of line and steer the converation back to business, but I’m wondering if anyone else has any suggestions. I’m also the only young, single female in my department, so there’s not many examples for me to follow in how to handle this. At this rate, I’m contemplating getting a fake engagement ring for my next conference (which I really do not like the idea of, but it may deter some of it).
Miriam
I was given the advice to ask them about their wife, g/f, or children if applicable. I’m assuming you are single, otherwise I would suggest wearing a ring and when they mention anything just point to it. If neither of these apply, maybe just say something about how you like to keep your professional and personal lives separate.
Anonymous
I wore a fake ring for a while — I just get a different class of creep hitting on me.
I’d advise “taking control” of it, not cowering and hoping it goes away.
Something along the lines of, “I’m flattered but that would put me in an awkward situation. You wouldn’t want to put me through that now would you? Great, lets put this behind us and carry on.”
Good luck.
Eponine
In my experience, it’s best to shut the down firmly without being rude. In repsonse to a comment, just reply firmly “that’s inappropriate” and don’t say anything more on the subject. Most guys will be embarrassed and apologize; if they do, say “apology accepted” and then change the subject back to work.
Pretending you’re married or pretending you’re flattered but it would be awkward, as the above commenters suggest, won’t help. Those responses imply that the guy’s behavior is fine, but the situation is impossible. You need to make it clear that their behavior is not fine and their comment is unwelcome, without being rude. A simple “that’s inappropriate” and then never bringing it up again accomplishes that without harming your business relationship.
Eponine knows men? Oy!
I agree. You must tell off these losers.
I question Eponine’s experience in this area, however. According to Les Miserables, Eponine “wears dirty and tattered clothing that consists of a chemise and a skirt. She also has missing teeth, mangled hair, bony shoulders, heavy brooding drooping eyes, and a premature-aging face with only a trace of beauty lingering.”
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/%C3%89ponine
If someone like this has extensive experience with men, then we can all name ourselves as experts!
Eponine
Not to mention that I only ever fell in love once, and it was completely unrequited, so I just kind of hung around creepily and spied on him and his girlfriend. The world is full of happiness that I will never know!
Silly
As a total music geek this just made my day.
Hel-lo
Ha! Love you ladies. :)
anon
there was recently an article on pyp about this: http://www.prettyyoungprofessional.com/advance/how-to-cut-out-the-unwanted-come-ons.html
St. Pauli Girl
HELP! So, I finally followed advice and got fitted for a bra at Soma – after 12 years of slipping straps and gaping cups and switching unsuccessfully between 32A, 32B, and 34A, I just couldn’t take it anymore. The measurer told me I’m a 30B, but that even a 30 might be too big. Unfortunately, Soma doesn’t carry a size 30 (and neither does anyone else, as far as I can tell).
I went to Macy’s, and the saleswoman kept trying to jam me into a 32A strapless (to “solve” the slipping straps) or her one size 30, which was a lace-up black dominatrix thing with so much padding it could double as a trampoline. I walked out without buying anything, and called several other lingerie stores in town. One woman talked with me on the phone for quite a while, and said she was “dubious” that I was a 30B and that I should wear a 32A…which she would then have a seamstress cut down so it would fit without slipping (for an extra $10 charge, of course).
For background, I’m 5’1″, 115 lbs, very small on top (usually an XS or size 0, altered to fit), with a larger hips and butt.
What to do? Do I order some size 30Bs online, or go to the boutique and buy 32As and have them tailored? I think I’ve run out of local stores, and my friends were clueless about local places (heard v. bad things about our Nordstroms though). I just want a bra that I don’t have to tinker with every fifteen minutes…*so frustrated*
Bonnie
Have you looked online? A quick search showed herroom.com has a wide selection of your size. You can order a bunch and return what you don’t like.
Eponine
I had a really bad experience with returns at HerRoom. I wouldn’t recommend this site unless you want your money to be stolen.
Pish
There are a number of sites that sell your size – Lulalu, Itty Bitty Bra Company, Figleaves, Bare Necessities. Or order online from Nordstrom if you’ve heard bad things about your local one and then return in-store if it doesn’t work out?
Robin
Try another boutique. Some boutiques will also alter bras for you.
Anonymous
Agree with Robin. If you’re in NY, Ripplu (on Madison) specializes in smaller sizes and will alter on the spot for free. Your size is out there, don’t give up!
Ses
I have to second (third?) the online shopping recommendations. I prefer to find a brick and mortar store and use their online shopping. This way you can usually do returns without paying shipping (call to find out first – Ann Taylor just bit me on this one) and they have more of a stake in their customer service reputation. Most stores carry more sizes online than they do in-store.
AN
I think bravissimo carries 28. Not sure.
ANP
Ladies, this speech (the 2011 Barnard Commencement address) is positively amazing — totally worth the read. Although I think of myself as a savvy business leader, I totally recognized some of my not-so-savvy qualities here. Great food for thought.
http://www.businessinsider.com/facebook-coo-sandberg-the-women-of-my-generation-blew-it-so-equality-is-up-to-you-graduates-2011-5?utm_source=twbutton&utm_medium=social&utm_term=&utm_content=&utm_campaign=sai
Bunkster
Wow. That’s amazing and so inspiring. I went to Barnard. Thanks for the link.
Coach Laura
Kat –
So, is it your last week at the law firm? Or later this month?
Congratulations -the next phase of your career/entrepreneurial business is here!
Kat
I’ve been at a non-profit for almost two years — one of my big duties was planning and overseeing this conference (which just happened). So my last day was Friday! Excited to have the time to focus on the blog.
Coach Laura
Sorry, yes now I remember that it wasn’t a law firm. But you finished there – wow! Big changes are exciting!
AnonInfinity
I am now officially AnonInfinity, JD!
Watch out, world!
E
Congrats!!! Good luck with bar studying!
Sydney Bristow
Congratulations!
Coach Laura
Congratulations! Very exciting.
houda
congrats!
PollyD
Checking in after the Philly trip: Farmer’s Cabinet was AWESOME! I really want to go back. I had a fried quail “sandwich” – a fried whole quail on sourdough with onion jam, spring pea and beet soup, and some kind of strange yet tasty cocktail. Kanella also was delicious – halloumi!
The Boden sale was pretty good. It was chaotic, but a friendly chaotic with women giving each other advice and offering their discards to someone nearby who looked about the same size. Skirts and tops were $20 (except cashmere which was $30), dresses were $30, shoes were $40. There wasn’t a lot in the way of jackets or coats, which was a little disappointing. I thought most of the shoes looked really cheap, like the leather looked more like rubber or pleather, but my friend got a pair of suede t-straps that were pretty cute. I think Boden is having a couple more clearance sales (Harrisburg and Pitson PA, maybe? Not sure I have the names right). I got some nice things, it was hard not to get too carried away with the thrill of getting things that sell for closer to $100 for $20 or $30, but I didn’t go too nuts. A couple of skirts, a couple of dresses, 3 shirts.
Anon!
I’m so glad you liked Farmer’s Cabinet! I can’t wait to go back. :)
mille
I wanted to share with you all that I have given my resignation at my current job and will be finishing up there by the first week of June. My decision came relatively quickly. I had a meeting with the partners today (saturday), to discuss my future at the firm. I hadn’t been making hours and honestly had no desire to keep trying to make hours. (Some of you will remember all the problems I had at this job). We were talking about having me work part time for awhile until hours picked up, and it occurred to me that it would be better for my mental health and general well-being if I didn’t work there anymore. The way we left it, I have bar dues, professional liability insurance and health insurance paid for the next few months, and am leaving on very good terms. I am transitioning my workload to another attorney who also wasn’t making hours, and both partners expressed an (I believe) honest regret that I was leaving, and an invitation to return to work there in the future.
I have savings for a little while so am not going to have to worry about finances just yet, which helps. I am taking a month or so off to spend time with my family and take an inexpensive vacation. After that, I am going to start as a solo practitioner unless something else comes up. I feel a little empty, and will miss the people at work, but I am also feeling good about finally making a decision and starting something new. I was so frustrated to be working only on the partners files and not having clients of my own. I am so looking forward to being my own boss.
Lynnet
I’m glad you’ve been able to come up with a plan that works for you. Good luck!
Eponine
Your job really sounded miserable. Congrats on making the decision, and I’m sure you’ll succeed as a solo!
houda
Congrats for starting a new page in your life. Take the time to rest before tackling this new chapter. I am sure you will be OK, big hugs from Morocco.
mille
I posted this question earlier but can’t remember what post I put it in, so am asking again– I am dying to buy these shoes http://www.scarpasa.com/product/buy/1888/c/
and am wondering if anyone has any experience with the Cantini & Cantini brand?
Anon for this one
Hi ladies — big question for those of you in Management. I oversee a staff of six people, two of whom I’m friends with outside of work. “A” is actually my husband’s best friend (they’ve been close for 10+ years) but I’m close with A’s fiancee and will be standing up in their wedding this summer. When I hired A, we had a frank, honest talk about our personal vs. professional relationship and so far it’s been great (we’ve worked together exactly a year).
However, since I came into this job 14 months ago, I also hired “B,” a less-close friend but someone I used to work with. We definitely had a relationship outside the office — my daughter’s favorite blanket is one that B’s grandma made, B and I exchange birthday gifts, etc. B has been in this job since November but after getting off to a strong start, she totally went off the rails — not delivering good work product, and taking advantage of our relationship (my fault — I made a lot of accommodations for her bc I knew she was good at what she did). We had multiple conversations about this, and a final “I need you to improve or decide whether you really want to be here” talk before I went on a 3-week medical leave.
So now I’m back from leave, she didn’t deliver, and so I sent her a very direct email on Thursday (as she was working from home) saying we had to meet on Monday bc I was disappointed with how things went while I was out and we had to formulate a plan and task list for the next 30 days. I was out of the office on Friday but she called my cell and basically gave her notice, saying June 30th would be her last day and she wanted to spend more time with her daughter (a sentiment she had expressed to me in past conversations).
My question is: any tips on handling a friend’s resignation? Should I even care all that much about salvaging our relationship? I believe that I’m a pretty good/fair boss (evidenced by, among other things, the fact that I supervise another close friend successfully), and I do feel as though most of this is Her Problem. I would appreciate some help on how to extract both of ourselves from this situation and also some wisdom on whether or not I should care as much asni do about saving “us.” thanks, gals.
Eponine
I don’t think this will necessarily harm your friendship. Since she resigned for family reasons, it seems fairly evident that her work went downhill because she was unhappy/distracted with a situation at home. As a boss, although you might care personally, you can’t make special accomodations for an employee’s personal problems. As a friend, now that she’s no longer your employee, you can be caring and helpful again.
I’d talk to her outside work and express that you’re almost relieved that she resigned, because now you can start being a friend again and stop being a boss. Find out if she needs anything that you can help her with. Just be a friend like the work episode never happened.
Anon for this one
Thanks, EP. You’re probably right. Not to sound juvenile, but I happened to do a quick search of my friends on Facebook yesterday and (as I suspected) B has unfriended me. This leads me to believe that it’s more than just family stuff — but again, this leads me back to the conclusion that the situation is more Her Problem. Sigh.
Eponine
In that case it sounds like she’s just immature and holding a grudge against you for being a boss. Probably she thinks you should have asked her what’s wrong and coddled her. At any rate, hopefully once you’re no longer her boss you can have a heart-to-heart conversation with her and be friends again. If not, it’s her problem, but it’s a shame because it’ll probably hurt your daughters too.
ADS
It’s also possible that she’s embarrassed about falling down on the job and doesn’t want you to see some things she’s posting, or that she’s realized that mixing personal and professional relationships is sticky, and wants to take a step back. Or maybe she needs a Facebook break in general, and it’s not about you.
Don’t jump to conclusions, and if you want to stay friends, be there for her as a friend would, and try to leave the professional stuff out of it.
Janie
Keep in mind that someone can “deactivate” their facebook, which makes them disappear from your friends list and everything else unless and until they “reactivate”. I do this when I’m having a stressful time and need a push away from wasting time on the computer, so the disappearance might not be personal.
Hel-lo
Or she might have defriended you when you became her boss… I’m friends on fb with lots of people in my office, but not anyone I directly supervise (i.e., my secretary), and not anyone that supervises me.
MelD
It sounds like she may be having some personal problems at home she didn’t feel comfortable discussing with you when you were her boss. Some people work well in situations where they have a friend as a boss and others really need to separate work from their personal lives. It sounds like this friend may be of the latter type. My guess is that after some time goes by, she may be ready to go back into “friend” mode, but it’s probably not going to happen immediately.
MJ
Listen, if you had an “I need you to improve” talk and she didn’t step it up, this isn’t on you. Think about it–you even cut her extra slack because you were friends. There’s no good excuse for her taking advantage of your goodwill as a friend. You need to be clinical about this. It is likely that you hold yourself to a higher standard at work, and it is not OK that she essentially used you to get hired, didn’t try too hard once hired, and then left you in the lurch to hire a replacement. It’s unfortunate that she may be immature about your friendship, but this was not about anything you did except hold her to a minimum standard. If this is a recurring issue with other employees, as in, you do not communicate goals and expectatIons clearly on a regular basis, then I would look in the mirror and reevaluate your own mgmt style. But that’s not what’s going on here. Your friend is a flake, and she blaming you for it. End of story.
Anon for this one
Thanks guys — I appreciate all of this feedback. I totally agree with each of you on some level: that I need to be clinical on this, that I need to separate the work relationship from the friendship, that I shouldn’t overanalyze the Facebook stuff, etc. I’m not a super-frequent poster but I AM an all-the-time lurker and this is why I totally love this community of women. Y’all are appreciated!
E
Reading your post, I was worried you were going to ask what to do if you gave her another warning and things still didn’t improve. Imagine how much worse this could have been if you had to fire her!! As unfortunate as it is that things didn’t work out, it’s absolutely not your fault and I think the outcome here is probably one of the best you could have hoped for given the circumstances.
LawyrChk
Thanks for all the ideas. I ended up getting her a kids jewelry making set, which she really liked. I think the winner as far as thoughtful non-religious gifts was a $5 gift certificate to the Stardoll website, which is geared to preteens and lets them basically and accessorize electronic “paperdolls.”
Most of the family got her religious gifts, and the friends got her growing-up secular gifts.
Oh, help....
Hey ladies,
Post-break-up sex[ual relations] are a bad idea, right? right????
It’s been three weeks. It was a mutual break-up (we were going nowhere fast) and about as amicable as it could be after 2.5 years. I don’t want to date him again. But I would like to wake up next to him one last time….
Bad idea, right? right????
Anon
You obviously do not want to break up with him, at least physically. It won’t be one last time. If all you want is physical sex — all the joys of orgasm without the commitment, you can go for it, but I warn you, you will not be in a position to find a man who will be more than a live dildo. I suggest you suck it up and stay away from this guy while you look for something more. You will regret it 3 years from now if all you do is hook up with this guy. You will be 3 years older, and that much less likely to find a worthy guy. Split now and find a better man.
theirway11
Bad idea. Focus on meeting new guys if you’re interested in waking up next to someone. He will only bring up feelings and memories, and you run the risk of making it far less amicable. You also might get some misunderstandings as to dating again.
Laura #2
Well, I wouldn’t ever call it a good idea…
Here’s what I have told friends in this situation: he no longer has any obligations of fidelity, etc. to you. If you can tell me that you would not be bothered by him sleeping with you, then sleeping with someone else the night after–basically, if you’re comfortable with the fact that you’re both using each other for sex at this point–then go do it.
It’s not about love at this point, it’s about missing the feeling of having someone next to you. As long as you realize he’s probably in the same situation, fine, but don’t fool yourself into thinking that one night together is necessarily going to mean anything special to him. I think people tell themselves they won’t be bothered, then get really upset when they realize they still care. You’re more likely to be hurt than not.
Miriam
Bad idea. If you didn’t have feelings for him, you wouldn’t be interested. You would want to date another guy and (eventually) sleep with him. It certainly can’t lead to anything good unless you really think the break up was a mistake. You said you don’t want to date him again, but you want to wake up next to him again. That is almost more intimate than sleeping together. Just be careful! I think it will only hurt you.
Anon
I would go a step further. No sex with anyone at all for a month. In your case, you don’t want rebound sex which will not work, and will lead to pain when the next guy dumps you after having his fill of sex.
I think we should all have a week of denying sex to all men who will not commit to us. Let’s call it the women’s week of freedom. No need to wash the sheets every morning after a slob shoots his wad and walks away. No need for worrying about unplanned pregnancies. No need to wonder will he call today or not? No need for any of this for a week!
That’s why it’s the week of freedom. I do it and I feel great!
Hel-lo
This blog really helped me a lot when I was going through a bad breakup last fall: http://www.baggagereclaim.co.uk/
I think after a bad breakup, you should cut of all contact with your ex. It’s important to give yourself the space to move on…
AK
For everyone who was asking about alterations/tailor/seamstresses… There is a post at http://www.extrapetite.com dated 5/19 about this subject, with some links at the bottom to related posts. It is about high-risk/low-risk alterations, how to decide if a garment is “worth it” etc.
I have no relationship with this blog, but do find some very nice styling suggestions there. And, good information about alterations.
Anonymous
On the topic of OTHER blogs, Lisa has a great post this weekend.
http://amidprivilege.com/2011/05/writing-sand-saturday-morning-752am/
EG
I ran into the GAP today to pick up a pair of shorts and found this great black dress! I paid $69.95, which is more than the price on-line. The v-neck a little deep, but I will wear this with a summer sweater and scarf anyways. The quality is better than what I’ve been seeing at Banana Republic lately.
http://www.gap.com/browse/product.do?cid=13658&vid=1&pid=834097
Anonymous
Agree about the banana’s quality being off lately. Maybe they think we won’t notice or don’t know better.
Batgirl
Ugh, I broke up with my ex about five weeks ago and while I’m completely sure it was the right thing to do (it just wasn’t clicking for me–and I gave it several months but still just wouldn’t click), he keeps contacting me every two weeks or so to tell me he wants me back and to see if I’ve changed my mind.
I’ve been as clear as I can be — keep telling him that while I care about him, it’s over and that’s not going to change. What more can I do at this point? I don’t want to be cruel by not picking up the phone, but I also don’t want to lead him to believe that there’s a future there. Any advice?
AnonInfinity
I don’t think it would be cruel at all to stop picking up the phone. He might feel that your talking to him is an indication that there might be some small chance in there somewhere that you might get back. I’d break off all contact until it seems like he’s moved on a bit. I had to do this with an ex in college. Every time I would answer the phone or agree to have coffee, it would seem to make him think there was something still there. I eventually cut of all communication. It only took a couple of times of my not answering for him to understand and he stopped trying. We’re friends now, and he’s getting married (to someone else) this winter!
Hel-lo
I agree. I’ve been in his position, and he’s calling you because he misses you, and each time you talk to him, that’s a possibility of getting back together.
And it wouldn’t be “cruel” to stop answering. It would be honest. It doesn’t help either of you to stay in contact right now.
jaded
I’m about SEVEN WEEKS post wedding..tried on my dress, and was really disturbed about those tiny “rolls” between the boobs and the arms–I’ve nver really had these before (that I’ve noticed), and have been doing more upper body lifting lately. I’m kind of stressed out about this!
any tips for arm-toning that will take effect within 7 weeks!?
jaded
Obviously, I mean pre-wedding! Holy cow, losing my mind!
Pish
Pushups. Try the training course at hundredpushups.com. You’ll be much more toned in 6 weeks.
MelD
Are you wearing a strapless dress? If you are talking about the armpit area and it’s not something you’ve noticed before, it’s probably your bra or undergarment that is causing the extra rolls. If you’ve been working out, your bra size may have changed since you purchased the bra, or you purchased the wrong size initially.