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– Very interesting article in the Village Voice about this former Citibank employee, who alleges that Citibank fired her because she looked too sexy in her clothes. (Two notes. First, in the slide show of her wearing normal business clothes, we are thrown off by the water glass — we get the point of showing her sitting, making copies, etc. — but standing around drinking a glass of water? Second, we have a reader request: can anyone identify the white dress pictured here? It looks like Black Halo or the like to us, but we can't find it online.)
– AmLaw's The Careerist wonders if the work/life balancers are attacking Elena Kagan and throwing everyone into a panic.
– The WSJ investigates where an employee's “breaking point” is.
– DC ladies, get ready: Seersucker Thursday is coming up. (We're SO adding that to our calendar.)
– Finally: Today is the last day to enter Ann Taylor's Wear-to-Work Chic Sweepstakes — win a chance to win a $500 Ann Taylor wardrobe, InStyle mags and books, and a career/life/whatEVER consultation with me!
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MPC
They’re still doing Seersucker Thursday! I thought that ended when Trent Lott left office.
Res Ipsa
Yeah, I’d just like to clarify for those new to DC, that Seersucker Day is only on the Hill; don’t try it out at your firm or elsewhere in the city.
K
As with everything, it depends on your office. I’m in DC and one of my male colleagues busted his seersucker suit out yesterday and asked when I was going to debut mine (he knows from previous summers that I have one). We take some heat from our colleagues who are mainly from the northeast but it’s all in good fun and not because they actually think it’s inappropriate for the office. I don’t wear it if I’m going to see clients but otherwise it’s fine as long as I can handle everyone asking where my sweet tea is :)
AnneCatherine
I’m intrigued by the mention of not wearing seersucker to go see clients. Would that be inappropriate where you are (DC)? I see it everywhere in my city. Saw a guy yesterday in court with a double-breasted blue seersucker suit (it’s not every day you see double-breasted seersucker, and honestly, it was one of the few seersucker suits I haven’t liked). Where I am, it’s common to see women and men, though especially men, wear seersucker from May to say September, almost everywhere (I think up to and including Federal trial court, though likely not Federal appeals court–but I’m not ruling it out). I broke down and ordered– while I could get free shipping–the Talbots suit in seersucker to replace my dearly departed BB suit.
KelliJ
Where do you live? I don’t think I have ever seen a man wearing seersucker in Massachusetts or Rhode Island. I don’t know a man who would wear it.
Anonymous
Miami.
AnneCatherine
Whoops, Miami.
AIMS
KelliJ: I am in NY & I see seer sucker on both men & women (though mostly men) fairly regularly.
In fact, at my prior job, there was one guy who owned 3 different one (coral, blue, and tan) and would rotate them throughout the week in the summer. That was a bit much, I’ll admit. But I have seen them everywhere, inc. court., so I have always assumed (perhaps wrongly) that they’re not limited to just DC & the South.
AL
I love Seersucker Thursday in DC; my previous office on Capitol Hill always had seersucker days during the summer. Now, I’m the only person in my current office who wears seersucker (although I’m also the only one from the South who appreciates/enjoys the tradition).
Anonymous
Without commenting on the merit of her hostile environment/retaliation claims, if the outfits pictured in the slide show were in fact what she was wearing to work, I think she was dressing waaaay inappropriately. Four-inch snakeskin stilettos in a bank? A cami under a fitted jacket? She’d benefit from reading this blog.
CL
Really? Hmm…I thought most of her outfits (the ones that were taken to show her normal work clothes) weren’t bad. There were a few individual items here and there (such as the snakeskin stilettos) that I thought were pushing the envelope a bit but otherwise it looked fine. She’s an attractive woman with a knockout figure and there’s really limits to what she can do to conceal that. What’s most upsetting to me is the way that her male co-worker’s handled it. I don’t think that giving her a list of items that she was individually barred from wearing to the office was appropriate at all.
Erin
Sorry, the anonymous at 2:58 was me – the Name field wasn’t pre-populated on my work computer.
I think most of her shirts are too low cut for the office – the consensus on here has been pretty clear about never wearing a cami or anything that could be mistaken for lingerie under a jacket or cardigan. The dress she wore to her job interview is pretty low-cut too. All of her heels are too high. I personally wouldn’t feel comfortable with showing as much bare leg as she shows, although possibly it looks like more than it is because of the heels. She’s attractive, but she seems to fall into the trap of dressing like professional women do on TV instead of like professional women dress in real life. That’s to be expected of an intern, not of a 30-something professional.
I agree that if her allegations are true, her coworkers and supervisors behaved inappropriately and illegally. But I also think that if someone at my office dressed like she does, they’d be asked by HR to tone it down and if they didn’t it’d be grounds for discipline.
I also question the wisdom of a woman who’s trying to succeed in a sexual harassment suit posing for pinup photos, but I guess she probably needs the money. Hard to imagine it wouldn’t prejudice a jury, though.
Cat
It’s hard to judge a few of the looks because of her hairstyle — but unless the camisoles were low-cut, I think the three outfits in which she was wearing a jacket were perfectly appropriate. Higher heels than I’d wear every day (esp. the snakeskin and peep toe pairs) but to each her own. The wrap dress and turtleneck looks were tight, but nothing to call HR about (and the way she was posed was emphasizing the curves).
The only outfit that made me think “oh, no no no” was the gray top with the drawstring sleeves / super tight pencil skirt. When people on here mention that a skirt should fall pretty much straight down (or close to straight down) from the outermost point on your rear, that’s why…
Erin
Oh really? I thought that outfit was fine – the skirt was long enough, and I guess I feel like she can’t help having a butt that looks good in an otherwise appropriate pencil skirt, but she can help wearing a low-cut top or too-high heels. The skirt didn’t seem that tight to me.
Anon
If your butt looks like that in a skirt, it is because you (1) have a nice butt and (2) are wearing a tight skirt. All she needed to be office-appropriate was a slightly larger skirt!! “I have a nice figure” is not an excuse for dressing like the office harlot.
AnneCatherine
“That’s to be expected of an intern, not of a 30-something professional.”
That’s sort of what I thought . . . which was emphasized by her statement that “I shop at Zara–just like everyone else!” DOES everyone shop at Zara? I honestly don’t know. It’s a store name I haven’t heard in close to 10 years, when all the young women I went to law school with loved it, shopped there, etc. But, for instance, I never see it cited on this blog as a place to buy workwear. So that had me thinking her perception of workwear was influenced by movies/TV, and not by mentors/role models. For instance, I found it odd that her “interview dress” was, well, a dress. Why not a suit? Oh well, she certainly has a lovely figure, and more power to her. There is only so much she can do to “tone it down” (to the extent that it is her responsibility–if only to herself, for her own career advancement–to do so), but her clothes didn’t seem designed to tone it down.
Erin
There’s a Zara about three blocks from my office. I once asked my coworkers if they ever went in there, and one responded that she’d bought going out clothes there once. No one had ever shopped there for work. So, no, I guess “everyone” doesn’t shop at Zara – it certainly doesn’t strike me as a workwear store.
SUCL 3L
I recently discovered a Zara in my city. I can’t imagine buying work clothes there. Ever. It looks like a slightly better quality Forever 21.
And the article says she has 5 closets full of high-end designer items, but she says she shops at Zara?? I’m calling bullsh*t on that one.
MelD
Zara is one of those stores that can vary dramatically from one branch to another. The one in my area of FL is ultra trashy (I assume you’re thinking about the same one SUCL) and there is nothing work appropriate there, but my sister got a few nice, work appropriate pieces from one of the London branches.
divaliscious11
Zara in Europe, Spain in particular, carries a much broader Woman line, and there are definitely more professional pieces, but I have found the products in the US stores to be of significantly cheaper quality and the lines much narrower. I have several work pieces purchased in Barcelona, Madrid and Las Palmas, but I wouldn’t buy anything in the US stores…
a.
my understanding from the article was that her attorney took the photos to use at arbitration… not that she posed for pinup photos.
Cat
I think Erin was referring to the pics with the white dress in question, and the champagne-colored silky blouse/white skirt outfit. At least, I hope those weren’t part of the same “this is my work look” shoot!
Erin
Yes, what Cat said – I certainly hope the attorney did not take the lingerie/cleavage photos for use at arbitration.
ES
That was my thought exactly – she looked like an attorney on Law & Order, which as far as I know isn’t what most attorneys or other professionals dress like. Or maybe I just watch too many hours of Law & Order marathons.
Rachel
I didn’t think they were horribly inappropriate for the level at which she worked. It looked like everything was covered that needed to be and the clothes fit well. She is not THAT hot, but she looks like she takes care of herself and sounds like she’s awfully proud of it.
Something seems rather off about the story to me. She’s having difficulty in one office with a skeevy boss, gets transferred to another office where everything is fine but requests to be moved again and then has more trouble “because of her appearance.” There’s no question that her boss(es) is/are El Loser(s), but … as much as I hate to say it, it sounds like she’s enjoying the attention. Her comments about how she would love to be less attractive if it meant she could just walk down the street in peace? B**ch, please.
My gut tells me that her bosses hit on her (and she’s used to that happening or goes for it in some way), and she turned them down (as she should). And then this particular boss tried to retaliate for the rejection (I’ve been there too – it doesn’t mean you’re super hot) and actually went through with it. So the suit has merit. But posing for pictures like she’s modeling in the early frames of a fashion shoot isn’t going to help her quest to be perceived as a serious businesswoman, fair or not.
Ru
So agree. And there are definite holes in this story.
K3L
Citibank Employee: Don’t know the dress, but am I the only one who thinks that, specifically because of her curves, if she’d gone up a size and had her clothing tailored that a lot of what she was wearing would be acceptable, but instead all you can see are the [magnificent] curves she has everywhere?
Anon
Yes yes yes agree! I am very tired of people saying well, she has a knockout figure and there’s not much she can do to conceal that. I’m not trying to toot my own horn, but I think I have a pretty damn good figure, but I still dress with class and dignity, and the only person who could sketch the outline of my body is my boyfriend – my coworkers are not treated to all of that. Just because you have size [] b**bs or a nice behind doesn’t mean you can’t find anything but skintight clothing to wear. It’s a bs argument, frankly.
Rachel
I’m built much the same way and its easy to look dumpy. Very, very easy to look either dumpy, in fact. It’s looking pulled together that takes some skill. So she could easily go up a size or have a couple of things changed (like a blazer over the black wrap dress, shoes that are more comfortable and a little lower-heeled and far less expensive, and skirts one size bigger – and her bosses would have to find another reason to jump on her case.
anon
I totally agree with you. I am all T&A. I end up looking totally dumpy most days because I don’t want to overemphasize my curves, like I did 10 or 15 years ago, mainly because society says it’s not right for a lawyer to look good.
Lawgirl
Virtually all of the clothes in the article are too tight. Period. She makes Armani look like BeBe. smh
jelodi97
First of all, I think all claims of sexual harassment should be taken seriously without any victim blaming, but I’m calling bs on this woman’s claims. Something just doesn’t seem right about being “I’m so beautiful, men acted like horny clowns and therefore I was an interruption to productivity.” But some of her statements strike me as a tad, well, weird:
“She says her love of fine clothes is a result of her growing up poor—she recalls running a high school marathon barefoot because she couldn’t afford sneakers.” 26.2 miles in high school barefoot?? O RLY? Her coaches and school administrators took that liability risk?
“They said, ‘Deb, we need to talk to you about your work attire. . . . Your pants are too tight.’ I said, ‘I’m sorry, my pants are not too tight! If you want to talk about inappropriate clothes, go downstairs and look at some of the tellers!’ ” Slut-shaming your co-workers=never a good defense.
and,
“Other female employees “were able to wear such clothing because they were short, overweight, and they didn’t draw much attention,” she later wrote in a letter describing the meeting to Human Resources, “but since I was five-foot-six, 125 pounds, with a figure, it wasn’t ‘appropriate.’ ” She was also furious. “Are you saying that just because I look this way genetically, that this should be a curse for me?” umm, yeah, your beauty is a curse, and all us us uglies are just jealous.
And how does a single mother in NY afford 5 closets (5 closets?! In NY?!) full of five closets full of Burberry, Hermès, Louis Vuitton, and Roberto Cavalli. Doesn’t add up.
RR
Agreed with all of this. IF she is telling the truth, then she was wronged. None of the work outfits, even if questionable, are THAT far gone. However, a lot of it was a little suspicious to me, not the least of which was running a MARATHON in bare feet. Is that even doable outside of the original marathoner who died?
Anon
I know someone who ran a marathon barefoot. The runner finished the marathon (in surprisingly fast time) but had insane blood blisters on the bottom of both feet and had difficulty walking for some time afterwards.
RR
That sounds like an interesting story….but glad to know it can be done. Maybe we should give Ms. Citibank more credit? :)
L
it’s actually done a surprising amount. there is a growing trend of barefoot running thanks to the book born to run
jojo
“And how does a single mother in NY afford 5 closets (5 closets?! In NY?!) full of five closets full of Burberry, Hermès, Louis Vuitton, and Roberto Cavalli. Doesn’t add up.”
Well, she worked at Citibank, for one thing….
AnneCatherine
I believe the Village Voice article said she made $75K a year (at one point)? Please correct me if I am wrong . . . I had originally assumed she was, in fact, a “banker,” with all that word connotes, at least to me (i.e. Goldman Sachs, investment banker, finance degree, whatever). But, the VV article indicated she did not have a finance, or any, college (or post-graduate) degree, and, though her business card did say “banker,” the job as described made it sound much more like customer services representative at a bank, whose job was to sign up new account holders or issue debit cards (or not, as the case may be). Which is why I think, in large part, her outfits were fine for the job she had, but maybe not for the job one or two positions up the rung, i.e., the job she’d (presumably) like to have.
AnneCatherine
Actually this is the part I meant . . . “She says she loved to work, and eventually was earning close to $70,000 a year.” But, she did also say she was a “shopaholic,” so maybe she didn’t save money (hmm, bad for a banker) and kept her clothes for years.
K3L
Business bankers are typically rainmakers for the bank. They don’t necessarily sell/give/offer financial information or advice, but instead bring in new customers, set up new accounts, schmooze, etc. They’re a lot of the people you see sitting behind desks on the floor, and they’re very important to the banks. That said, $70k in NY seems low. I made $50k my first year as a financial advisor (broke records, but still) as an art major in a low-cost mid Atlantic city.
SUCL 3L
It sounded like her job was maybe somewhere in between? There was mention that she would go out of the office to “drum up business”.
Looking at the pictures (with the exception of 2-3 photos not taken at her lawyer’s office), everything that needs to be covered seems to be covered. But I’d say it still borders on being too sexy (I’m think in a Joan Holloway from Mad Men sort of way). Though her bosses still pretty much sounded like schmucks just the same.
As for freaking out about paying her rent and not being able to buy Christmas presents after loosing her job – I would bet that her 5 closets full of designer clothes and shoes had something to do with it…
jelodi97
It was the actual number of closets that was the red flag. Who in NY has five closets?
KZ
article also mentions she was married once. Maybe the ex-husband had a lot of money?
Anon
“And how does a single mother in NY afford 5 closets (5 closets?! In NY?!) full of five closets full of Burberry, Hermès, Louis Vuitton, and Roberto Cavalli. Doesn’t add up.”
Welcome to America, land of credit-card debt…
stc
Too tight, sheer, too much butt and boob. I wouldn’t wear things that are that low-cut and I’m an A. But, crappy way to treat her.
Clerky
She’s gorgeous, but I agree that some of her work clothes are on the border of being inappropriate because they are too fitted and low cut. I probably would have worn a cami underneath that Armani dress. Not that I can afford Armani! No idea how she affords her wardrobe. I also thought her comments about “spiks” and the Heights were really derogatory and inappropriate.
Ru
I agree – she is definitely not getting on anyone’s good side with her photo shoots and comments.
v
I wonder if she’s gunning for a reality show.
Anon
Or a Pl*yboy cover.
dee
I think I have a very similar figure to this woman (we are the same height and weight and I’m also curvy) and it can be difficult to dress appropriately to work. There are some things (like high-waisted pencil skirts) that you just cannot wear. That said, having a figure is not an excuse – no one is telling her to hide it, but not everyone in the office has to know exactly what her waist-to-butt ratio is.
From reading this article, I think her bosses acted inappropriately (they should have had a woman talk to her) but she reacted very defensively – if someone commented on how I dressed, I wouldn’t retort that the secretaries dress worse than I do. This is basically what she did when she started talking about how the tellers dressed.
Kathryn
My main th0ught after seeing her on the television news last night is that she really needs to buy bigger jackets. I have a similar issue with having athletic shoulders and a bit of chest, but I just buy the next size up on the jacket and have the sleeves done.
kandi
“I have heard with admiring submission the experience of the lady who declared that the sense of being perfectly well-dressed gives a feeling of inward tranquillity which religion is powerless to bestow.”
—Ralph Waldo Emerson
J
Hi – I read this post weeks ago and I, too, wanted to know where that white dress in the picture was from…. well I stumbled across it today in a daily internet sale – but unfortunately it was sold out already – its D&G