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Updated: Oct 30, 2018 193 Comments · by

Frugal Friday’s Workwear Report: Sleeveless Solid Fit and Flare Dress

The Personal Shopper (TPS) |

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Flattering Work Dress: ANGVNS Sleeveless Solid Fit and Flare Dress Our daily workwear reports suggest one piece of work-appropriate attire in a range of prices. Reader L wrote in to recommend this dress, noting, “I'm obsessed with this dress and wanted to recommend it. It's incredibly cheap but super flattering even on my size 14-ish frame, especially since it has vertical AND horizontal darts at the bust and fits perfectly. It's not lined, but the fabric is not too revealing and also not too hot in the summer. I have it in all three colors and hope they come out with more!” Considering it’s $19-$26, eligible for Prime (and for free returns on some size/color combos), machine washable, and available in black, red, and blue (in M-XXL), that’s pretty awesome. ANGVNS Sleeveless Solid Fit and Flare Dress Here's a plus-size option. Seen a great piece you'd like to recommend? Please e-mail tps@corporette.com. (L-3)

Sales of note for 9.19.24

  • Nordstrom – Beauty deals through September, and cardmembers earn 3x the points (ends 9/22)
  • Ann Taylor – Extra 30% off sale
  • Banana Republic Factory – 50% off everything + extra 20% off
  • Boden – 15% off new styles
  • Eloquii – Extra 50% off sale
  • J.Crew – 50% off select styles — and 9/19 only, 50% off the cashmere wrap
  • J.Crew Factory – Up to 60% off everything + 50% off sale with code
  • Lo & Sons – Warehouse sale, up to 70% off
  • M.M.LaFleur – Save 25% sitewide
  • Neiman Marcus – Friends & Family 25% off
  • Rag & Bone – Friends & Family 25% off sitewide
  • Spanx – Lots of workwear on sale, some up to 70% off
  • Talbots – Anniversary event, 25% off your entire purchase — Free shipping, no minimum, 9/19 only
  • Target – Car-seat trade-in event through 9/28 — bring in an old car seat to get a 20% discount on other baby/toddler stuff.
  • Tuckernuck – Friends & Family Sale – get 20%-30% off orders (ends 9/19).
  • White House Black Market – 40% off select styles

And some of our latest threadjacks here at Corporette (reader questions and commentary) — see more here!

Some of our latest threadjacks include:

About Kat

Kat Griffin is the founder, publisher, and editor-in-chief of Corporette. You can read more about her here.

Comments

  1. Anonymous

    Reader L’s comment – “super flattering even on my size 14-ish frame” – makes me feel so sad for her. Reader L, I’m sure you rock this dress and many, many other outfits.

    • anonshmanon

      I am not reader L, but this comes across as odd at best. Because I say “this looks flattering even in my size”, doesn’t mean that I feel perpetually ugly in my body. I acknowledge that certain styles flatter certain body types.

      • mascot

        This was my take as well (and as someone who is close to L in size). Some fit and flare styles really accentuate my hips in a way that isn’t readily apparent from a picture of a slender model wearing the dress.

    • Faye

      I didn’t take it that way at all. Super cheap dresses from Amazon tend to be really hit and miss, and more often miss at the higher sizes. The fact that it’s cheap AND works on a body bigger than a size 4 makes it a unicorn in my book.

    • Reader L

      Sorry I’m late in seeing this! I know I’m foxy :) I am just a little lumpy around the hips and like Faye said, sometimes cheap unlined dresses don’t lay in a way that shows off that area the way I’d like to, but I like the way this dress lays over those areas. I love to wear it with pearls and my hair up and feel like A Lady.

  2. Thoughts on colleague weirdness?

    Ugh, I’m totally overthinking something. This morning my colleague, who has the same title and position I do even though he had five years more experience than me in BigLaw in our previous jobs (and I was mid-level), took it upon himself to invite me to a meeting with a lot of leadership, including our boss. When we got there, she realized it was weird for all three of us there, and said, hey, sorry, probably you should go.

    Rationally I get that this was a misunderstanding, and that my colleague was probably trying to be inclusive. But this isn’t the first time he has sort of sideways created a situation that makes me feel like crap (in this case, getting to be told to leave in front of a room full of executive leadership, while he pulled up a seat at the table). He sometimes subtly tries to assign me things, or to delegate work to me, and it really irritates the fuck out of me. Yes dude, you would be able to do that if we were at a large law firm. But you aged out and now have the same title as this millenial whippersnapper lady.

    • Emmer

      I’ve never been in this exact situation but I am in a very similar position at my law firm: same title as someone who has 5 years more experience, lateraled as a midlevel. I’ve faced similar issues with the “older” attorney. I often defer to her expertise where we are working on an issue that she has seen before and I haven’t, but she ignores my thoughts and thinks she knows better when I disagree on issues that I have ample experience with (and she doesn’t). Fortunately I have been proven right enough times that it’s gotten a bit better, but I share your frustration – it can feel really belittling.

    • ELaw

      Wait your boss asked you to leave a meeting? This seems weird to me, not the fact that your colleague invited you? I’m not clear on why she asked you to leave or how that’s your colleague’s fault.

      I am in-house in a small legal department, where the supervisory structure is flat: it goes GC, and then all of the attorneys are directly under her, even though we have different levels of experience. I am the youngest by several years. We generally defer to each other in terms of areas of expertise rather than based on number of years of experience. Sometimes the other attorneys in our department ask me to do something, but I usually see it as “I’m too busy, do you have time for this?” rather than being delegated to by people who aren’t actually above me. Theoretically I could do the same (ask someone else to work on something I’m asked to do), but I never do because generally I’m the least busy. I’m not sure if your situation is similar but perhaps it might be? Is your colleague truly trying to delegate or he is just saying he doesn’t have time and wants help? You can judge best, you’re there and I’m not–just trying to bring in a different perspective.

      • Anonymous

        I read it as colleague invited her, so now there were 3 attorneys at a client meeting, and the boss decided that was more presence they needed at the table. I’ve seen that in consulting, where the optics of the situation don’t want it to feel like you have uneven sides (more lawyers than clients, for instance).

        • Wildkitten

          I’ve seen that before too – especially if the colleague thought the client would bring more people than they brought, so there’s unexpectedly too many lawyers. It’s awkward, but I wouldn’t dwell on it. (Ok actually I would totally dwell on it, but rationally I don’t think we should.)

          • hoola hoopa

            I read it like ELaw, too, but that would make complete sense.

            And honestly, there are times when it would also make sense for an internal meeting – for example, boss knows you can use the time better doing something else. Rather than disrespecting your input, they are respecting your time.

            I’m guessing this guy just gets under your skin. This alone is really not a huge deal. Annoying yes, but not a sign that he’s intentionally trying to knock you down a notch.

  3. KT

    Can I just say I’m a little horrified that my claim to fame on Corporette is being included on the Threadjacks of Interest with my roach story?

    IT WAS HORRIFYING.

    • Anonymous

      I am sorry you are embarrassed/horrified about being featured in the sidebar, but I want to thank you for all the reptile stories yesterday. They provided some much-needed levity during a really awful day at work for me.

    • Walnut

      I thought your roach story was very relate-able. I pitched a giant lizard to my husband last night to take care of our spider problem.

        • Walnut

          He thought I was joking and then pointed out that our giant breed dog is enough for our household. Apparently he didn’t see the appeal of a giant dog AND a giant lizard.

    • Baconpancakes

      Dude I was cracking up so hard while reading last night my SO came in the room to make sure I was ok. You brought a lot of joy to a lot of our lives yesterday.

    • Mrs. Jones

      I’m glad to hear I’m not the only one who can’t deal with roaches. I can deal with spiders, bees, and wasps all day but not roaches.

  4. Therapy Break?

    A bit of background: I’ve been seeing different therapists on and off since college (I’m in my mid-20s now) mostly due to anxiety, family troubles, putting pressure on myself, the whole gamut.

    I found a great therapist about 2 years ago when I was going through a rough time at work and in my personal life. Fast forward to the past couple of months and although life hasn’t been super easy, I just feel like I’ve been growing a lot, able to look at things more objectively, have a better support system, etc. My ‘aha’ moment was a few days ago when I completely forgot about my appointment (I used to go biweekly and sometimes weekly but now it’s been every 3 weeks or more). I called her and felt horrible, apologized, then rescheduled. But at the same time it made me realize I didn’t really need her as much as I used to.

    I feel okay to take a break for a while and figure myself out on my own in a way while still having her number if I ever need to start seeing her more regularly again. Has anyone else gone through something similar?

    • Bewitched

      Yes? I think you go to therapy when you think it helps or might help, and you stop when you feel better or it isn’t helping. Just let your therapist know you won’t be scheduling regular appointments but you will call her on an as needed basis. This happens ALL the time.

    • anon

      Yes. Therapists like to see you “graduate” from regular, frequent therapy when you don’t need it. You could consider going regularly but lest often (1/month, 1/2 weeks) or calling her as needed.

    • Davis

      I’m in the process of doing this myself. I’ve nearly forgotten about therapy appointments and also just felt like I had nothing to say. I value my therapist and like the idea of having her on-call and being an established patient so I can jump back in if I need it. I’m seeing her monthly at this point, but will likely drop lower. I hope it goes well for you.

    • CPA Lady

      Yep. I went to a therapist for about a year when I was in my mid 20s. At a certain point I didn’t feel like we had anything to talk about anymore, and we decided to call it a day. Totally normal. Then a little over a year ago (I’m in my early 30s) I started going to life coaching, which is kind of like therapy but more forward focused. So there’s nothing to say that just because you quit therapy now and go live your life for a while that you can’t go back to something similar someday, if you feel like you need it.

    • Anon

      +1 I did this. I saw my therapist about once a week for 6 weeks, and then transitioned to once every 2 weeks for a few months. Once I felt better about things, I stopped going but called her a few times on an as needed basis.

      I find it really reassuring to know I can go see her if I need to and I don’t have to go back through the process of finding her and feeling comfortable with her again.

  5. Carrots

    Oh my gosh. I’m listening to the episode of “Wait Wait Don’t Tell Me” from two weeks ago and they’re talking about milking cockroaches and now I’m thinking of KT and the proliferation of cockroach stories this week on this blog…

    • Anonymous

      Roach milk is apparently REALLY good for you! I heard someone say it is going to be the next big health trend. Shudder.

    • Never too many shoes

      I know it is supposed to be so high protein and so enviro and the saviour of humanity blah blah blah….but I will starve to death before I eat bugs. Ugh.

      • Senior Attorney

        Except you would most definitely eat bugs before you’d starve.

        I was in Cambodia a couple of months ago and our group was kind of giggling about the deep-fried cockroaches and worms and sparrows for sale at the snack stand on the side of the road. Until our guide said “In wartime no other food, then after war everybody used to eating these foods so keep it up…”

        • Sydney Bristow

          Tim Ferriss has been trying to make bug snack boxes a thing. I think he’s always talking about some that have grasshoppers. I just can’t do it and hopefully won’t ever have to.

  6. First Year Anon

    Hair cut question:

    I have long (think around6 inches above bra strap), fine, but lots of it, hair (this is what I have been told in the past). I have been getting my hair cut with layers for years because that seems to be what stylists always do. It was never a question. Then I started looking into more blunt cuts and I thought that this is actually what I’ve wanted all of this time- I find that all layering does is take out volume (and I want my hair to appear thicker), and make some of the pieces that are usually hard to grow out (the top layers) shorter so I never achieve the look of the length I want.

    The one time I thought I really liked the look of my hair was when I was growing out my lob, which I know was cut in a more blunt fashion. At that point it was just past my shoulders. But I was hoping to get the same look with longer length.

    Is a blunt cut what I want? Can someone point me to websites that might be helpful if you don’t have any ideas? TIA!

    • KT

      (Caveat–this is from when I still HAD hair)

      I had very long, fine hair, and like you, I always had layers because that’s what all hair dressers do.

      But I never quite liked the outcome. It always looked thin, and because my hair was fine, could look like a mullet very quickly.

      I decided to consult this celebrity hairdresser and saved hundreds for the visit.

      He sat me down and said that with fine hair, layers are the worst. You can’t do much with cut to make fine hair look fuller. The best is to go for very blunt cut, and focus on color for adding dimension and fullness.

      He specifically said “The good news is, you don’t need to pay a lot and you don’t need to see me again. You can get any amateur to cut your hair straight across. But pay good money for a colorist and get low lights AND highlights.”

      And really, he was right. When I got my color done and stuck with blunt cuts, my hair looked completely different.

      Naomi Watts is a great example; look up pictures of her with layered hair and her with blunt hair. She has very fine, long hair, and when she had layers, it looked flat and dull. When she went blunt and added lowlights, it looked a million times better.

      • KT

        Other caveat since Mpls raises a good point–I wore my hair very straight, since waves.curl would turn to fine frizz puffs.

      • First Year Anon

        Oh thank you for validating my feelings on this! I thought people would think I was crazy! I love love my color- it grows out so natural and has lots of dimension, but I don’t think she’s good at haircuts- she always just makes it seem like an afterthought (although, I do care more about color but that’s because I always felt like my haircuts never felt right so I just thought it was my hair, not the cut).

        I think I’m going to try a new stylists for cutting and still go to her for color.

      • Meg Murry

        I’m 50/50 on this one. I also have fine hair, and when it is shorter it has more volume, while when it is longer it tends to drag down and just look blah. So long blunt styles don’t really work well for me – shorter cuts make my hair look like it has lots more volume. Also, having some layers to my hair means that the shorter pieces dry faster and are therefore easier to style. But I’ve never had a super layered cut that was longer – I could see how that wouldn’t work and could look mullet-y fast.

        I also like to be able to pull my hair back into a low ponytail easily, so for me a happy medium to the cut to not be completely blunt, but not to have very drastic layers, and for the cut to be a little shorter as it gets closer to my face. The hair that works for me right now is probably most like when the main character on “Bones” wears her hair straight (mine is naturally closer to her straight look than her wavy look, which I think it her natural state).

      • Erin

        OMG I want to scream reading this after my stylist just uber-layered my LONG (at bra strap) hair! It is SO THIN toward the end and will take at least a year to grow back. Uuuughhhh.

        • First Year Anon

          I’ve left so sad when they chop off a bunch of hair. It happened to me last fall and it was so frustrating.

        • KT

          UGH I had that happen soooooo often.

          I would end up with wisps at my cheekbones and these straggles at the ends :(

    • Mpls

      Do you mean 6 inches below strap? Otherwise that sounds kind of short. :)

      Do you have any sort of texture/curl in your hair? Blunt cut is going to turn into triangle head (or Klingon hair, if you get the reference) I went to short layers and no thinning. So not a lot of length difference between the layers, but more layering than just a chop across. You get the thickness, but still have some movement because everything isn’t exactly the same length.

      • First Year Anon

        Yah, when I googled I saw you can do tiny layers, which is probably what I want. My hair is very straight and I have never seen it do triangle head in my life.

        • Anonymous

          I agree with light layers over an actual blunt cut. I have fine, slightly wavy hair and lots of it. A blunt cut on me is just difficult to style (the ends flip out in different directions) and has no movement, plus I like a bit of layering around my face. I usually get invisible layers throughout my cut to add a little shape.

      • Meg Murry

        Yes, this is what I was trying to recommend – not a lot of difference in layers, but not a completely blunt straight across chop. It’s deceptive because main of the cuts that look completely straight across at a glance that look good often actually have the ends razored for texture.

        • Mindy

          Just got back from my haircut and this is it. I finally have a stylist (and I now (after 10 years of bad cuts) know to say, not “layers” but “a little shaping” at the ends of my one length cut) that understands that layering = crap on me and that I like a plain cut with some shaping at the bottom.

    • H

      I have the same hair type and I’ve had the hardest time since moving back to my homecity a few years ago. Hairdressers always want to do the double layer thing on me, long on the bottom and then a completely separate layer a couple inches higher that is totally disconnected from the bottom layer. Last year I even showed a photo beforehand of what I want and I still got the double layer thing. And side note, I don’t freaking care if you were trained in New York City; that tells me nothing of your ability to cut fine, thick hair.

    • Ning

      I have the same type of hair- very fine but lots of it (or so I’ve been told). I no longer do layers- because I also heat-style my hair, when my ends start to get damaged, the layers cause the entire length of my hair to look a mess. Plus, layers really thin out the bottom portion of my hair. I’ve switched to blunt cuts with some selective shorter layers just around the face, and it’s much better.

      If you’re in NYC- try Daniel at Allure 13. He knows what to do.

  7. Annapolis, MD

    You have a rainy afternoon/evening free in Annapolis. What do you do?

    • Anon

      In the evening, you enjoy small plates and creative beverages (trying to avoid moderation) at Level.

    • Anon

      Walk around the Naval Academy in the afternoon. Have some drinks downtown in the evening…. Pusser’s for a good view of the water.

    • Punctuates

      For dinner, I recommend Iron Rooster. The breakfast Cuban is amazing, as is the chicken and waffles.

  8. ANP

    Love this dress.

    Gang, how do you get control of your schedule at work? I’ve been in my job for a little over a year — senior educational administrator who has 8 direct reports. I’ve learned, by trial and error and talking with my husband about this, that people at this level do a lot more meeting/directing and less paper pushing. (I still have to put pen to paper — or finger to keyboard — but most of that has to happen outside of core work hours so that I have concentrated time to think.)

    I have considered simply blocking off my calendar for some No Meetings Allowed time each week, but how do I ensure that time is spent fruitfully and not simply in addressing the Firedrill of the Moment/email management? My input is often required in order to move projects ahead, and I don’t want to hold things up and at the same time I need to be better at prioritizing my own needs.

    FWIW, I am (newly) scheduled to meet with each direct report 1x/month for an hour. These reports make up two teams; the more established team also has a team meeting (with me present) 1x/month and the less-established group meets as a whole 2x/month. Hubs thinks I should instead meet for a half-hour weekly with every direct report in order to set priorities, but that seems like a TON of meetings. I also get eaten up in meetings that happen outside of my department. HELP.

    • anonanom

      Could you do some sort of standup meeting with each group on Monday? We do a 15 minute check in on Monday with anything important to know for the week, who’s on vacation, what needs to get done. It has helped a lot with making everyone feel like they have a better idea of what’s going on without needing to do an hour every week.

      And yes, some weeks I HAVE to block time. And literally close outlook and focus on the project. Meetings will take over! Depending on how much flexibility you have in your schedule – could you maybe shift time and come in earlier than your teams and get an hour or so of work done before everyone arrives for the day and the meetings start? My most productive time at work is often pre 9am and after 6pm unfortunately due to firedrill issues during the 9-5 period.

    • Meg Murry

      The most effective manager I’ve had blocked off both a concentrated “door closed, head down, working time”, followed by a block of “office hours” which was a time when people who had questions or needed her signature, etc, were encouraged to come in – basically, she pushed us to use her “office hours” time for things that were in the 5-15 minute range, and if someone came in with a problem that was bigger than that she would pretty much just use the office hours time to triage and then schedule a meeting to go into it further or sent the person off with a list of questions/background info to send her so she could investigate it further.

      • ml

        Oh I like this idea. I have one direct report who pops into my office all the time with 5-10 minute stuff that is never as important as what she’s interrupting, and it just drives me bonkers when I’m just getting into a groove and she breaks my concentration. I don’t want to have a closed door policy, but if I could limit her pop-ins to times I’m sort of expecting them, that would help.

        I also do a weekly stand-up for 15ish minutes just so everyone has a broader context for what’s going on. I don’t have standing meetings with each of my direct reports, but meet with all of them regularly on meetings focused on whatever specific project.

    • Anonymous

      My husband has similar issues and insists that he cannot possibly block time on his calendar to get work done, so his solution is to get in to the office 90 minutes earlier than everyone else, every day.

    • attiredattorney

      In a similar role with six direct report, who all lead different teams that are only slightly related.

      I meet weekly with each one for an hour. Well, an hour is what’s blocked on my calendar. It typically ends up being closer to 30 minutes.

      We have a monthly full team meeting, with all of them and me. Each of them meet with their teams weekly, biweekly or monthly as it makes sense to them.

      I block 8-9 and 4-5 on my calendar for office time each day. My assistant knows to respect this, and knows to that only my boss can schedule me during this time. My direct reports and other colleagues know I am in my office during this time if they need me, but this ends up being my time to actually get work done. I like having it at the start and end of each day. I like the idea from Meg about differentiating between head down work time and office hours though!

    • Sydney Bristow

      You might want to check out the book Deep Work by Cal Newport. One of they keys in the book is blocking time for certain things. So schedule your no meeting hard work time but also schedule an hour to do the administrative things. So if your direct reports need your input schedule 12-1 to be the time where you deal with all of those each day. Your reports won’t get an immediate response, but will get an answer each day in time to act on it. Just an example. The book goes into a lot of detail.

      The author is a math professor and publishes a high number of papers each year, which is how he developed his system.

    • anon a mouse

      My boss has a policy that anything that she can answer in less than 5-10 minutes gets answered immediately. Anything else gets answered within a day. She blocks off time on her calendar for important things – sometimes just 15 minutes so she can focus on Project X and move it along. When her calendar is blocked, her door is shut and calls go to VM. She typically blocks the first few hours of the day, which also means that those of us on her team also use that time to concentrate on longer-term projects. It helps if you can get the whole team more or less aligned on a rhythm.

      The important thing here is that she treats her blocked time as sacred so other people respect it too. It’s not treated as fungible that can be moved around.

      As far as meeting with direct reports, I agree that 30-minute meetings (weekly or biweekly) are more productive, unless you know you have an agenda that can fill an entire hour, in which case you can add the time.

  9. (Former) Clueless Summer

    How much do we love the classiques entier ponte dresses? Are they worth the price? I’ve been looking for an olive green sleeved dress and one of them fits the bill, but I’m a little worried about spending CAD$300 on ponte…

    • Anonymous

      More than life itself. They are my favorite things in my wardrobe. I think they are worth every penny at full price but look for them on sale.

      • HSAL

        Wow, this is quite a rec. I’ve had my eye on them for awhile but haven’t pulled the trigger. Maybe I’ll try a couple as my reward for getting back to pre-baby weight.

      • Anonymous

        I agree! I winced at the price, but looking at the cost-per-wear for mine — so worth it!

    • cbackson

      I thought they were great, but just started to see pilling in one I bought last year and haven’t worn that many times…that prompted me to return the olive green one I bought from the NAS.

      • (Former) Clueless Summer

        Looks to me like only the “summer” colours are on sale for $137/$187 – white, light blue, orange, etc. All the olives, burgundy, black are full price which is $300 CAD.

    • Minnie Beebe

      I would look really out of place if I wore one to work (we’re on the casual end of business casual) but tried one on one day at Nordstrom, just for kicks. It was AMAZING. I looked and felt awesome in it, and if I thought I would’ve worn it more than once in the following year, I would’ve plunked down the $300+ for it. I refer to it as my (hypothetical) TED talk dress, as in if I ever did a TED talk, I’d want to be doing it in that dress.

      It was a fitted sheath dress in thick black ponte, with elbow sleeves. Totally a practical item to have in most business wardrobes, just (sadly) not mine.

  10. Anon for this

    I want to thank those of you who took time to answer my question about X and Y yesterday. I have advised X to hire a family lawyer and X will do so. Thank you again for your comments and for making it easier for me to work through the issues myself.

  11. Dating Question

    Dating question for this bunch of smart, thoughtful women:
    I am mid-30s, single, a lawyer for 10+ years, mostly in BigLaw. First dates are usually drinks & apps, occasionally dinner, usually $30-$40/person. If I’m on a date with a guy who is really nice, but just a very bad match for me, I often feel really guilty when he pays. I always reach for my purse, and the guy has always said that he will get it, which is generous, I appreciate it and thank him. My guilt increases as the income disparity increases (with some of these guys, I estimate that I make 2x their salary). I live in a major city in the South, in case that matters.
    1. How often does the guy pay on your first dates?
    2. Do any of you feel as I do and how do you handle?

    • Anonymous

      I always offer, and always let them insist on paying on a first date. I feel zero guilt. It’s one of the only ways in which they have it “harder” financially, and I don’t care at all about the income disparity- I either let them choose a place of pick one that is affordable.

    • Life

      I always split. Especially if it is a bad match. Especially if it is a bad match and I clearly make much more $.

      I’m not in the South. SF/NY/Boston. Always the same.

      I am less likely to split if it’s just coffee/very cheap.

    • TinC

      Move to a major city in the north? Maybe I’m doing it wrong but I’ve been going dutch on coffee dates…

    • ELaw

      Also in a major city in the south. I’m not in big law, but I still make enough that I probably make more than most of my dates, so I feel you on the guilt.

      I reach for my credit card and act like I just assume we’re going to split it. They either go with that impulse, or insist on paying and I acquiesce. I figure, if they’re that insistent, they can surely afford it. And if not, well they shouldn’t have insisted so hard, and it’s not my problem.

      • emeralds

        Yup. I always offered, they almost always insisted, and maybe this makes me an awful feminist but I figured that I put up with enough sh*t as a woman, the very least the patriarchy can do for me is buy me a glass of wine.

    • January

      I do feel as you do, and most of the time I would rather split the check on early dates, so that I feel less “obligated” if I want to say, “Hey, thanks for your time, but I don’t want to see you any more.” (Obviously I don’t phrase it quite like that). I haven’t had a lot of success trying to split the check- few guys have accepted the offer on the first three dates. Sometimes they’ll allow it if we make it past three dates. Sometimes they allow it, but grudgingly (like joking about how they wanted to steal the check and pay while I was in the ladies’ room or something).

      Kate Bolick wrote about this in “Spinster.” I think she also wanted to split the check on dates, but she eventually stopped trying.

    • Anon

      First date I always offer and try not to let guilt get me when they insist on paying. Caveat to that was the guy that wanted to meet sort of late notice, showed up like he hadn’t showered in while nor combed his hair. He didn’t even offer and I consider that 1/2 a bill to be a great price for getting out of there.

    • attiredattorney

      Also in a major city in the South, also usually offer to split the check on the first date, and for the first time (ever) on a first date, a guy actually said “okay” when I offered. I thought that meant it clearly was not a good first date from his end, but he asked for a second. I would never offer to pay unless I meant it, but I confess, I was caught off guard!

    • soaps

      I’ve always paid on the first date, good dates and especially bad dates. I think it comes from a power/control thing.

    • Brunette Elle Woods

      I try to meet for just one drink for first dates. That way it’s only about 25-30 and I figure it is what it is! My dates usually pay, but women make less than men, have to put a lot more time into getting ready for a date, and generally have more expenses as far as make up, clothes, hair, etc.

    • Bensonrabble

      While I understand the sentiment of wanting to hit back at the patriarchy, I always pay my own unless we are in an established relationship. I’m an independent women with my own money and can pay for my food. Lot’s of men use the fact that men are expected to pay as some evidence women are getting over and don’t really want full equality. Ridiculous I know but I don’t want to give them more ammo.

      Plus seeing a date either fight with me or go along with it is a look at his character.

  12. MDMom

    “I’m not the next Usain Bolt or Michael Phelps. I’m the first Simone Biles.”

    That is all.

    • Anononon

      That and the Laurie Hernandez “I got this” are really getting me through this awful week. I hope they can maintain those attitudes well into adulthood.

        • Anonymous

          + 1 million. My 9-year-old’s current heroes are Simone Biles, Laurie Hernandez, and Neil Degrasse Tyson. As a mom this makes me very happy.

          • Anonymous at 11:40

            We put her in gymnastics four afternoons a week and got rid of cable so all she has to watch on television is DVDs of Cosmos. Only half kidding.

  13. Professional Dress for Paragliding

    Here’s a clothing question you don’t hear every day-

    Going to a mountain resort area for a deal closing dinner/celebration. Going with two of my colleagues, meeting up with two counterparty leaders. We are going paragliding and rock climbing, and then dinner that night.

    What on earth do I wear for such an adventurous day with professional contacts? I can’t imagine wearing anything but leggings for rock climbing, but that seems so… unprofessional?

    Help!

    • Maddie Ross

      I think you wear comfortable, activity appropriate clothes in this instance – so if leggings are your thing for rock climbing, then leggings. Or shorts or those lightweight active pants. Whatever you would wear for that activity normally. I would probably keep my midriff covered, but beyond that, IMO there is nothing professional (in the business sense) about rock climbing or paragliding, so all bets for needing to dress professionally are off.

    • ELaw

      Wear leggings. Shorts will ride up with a climbing harness and end up giving you a fearsome wedgie.

      Also agree with poster above that there’s no need to try to be professional if the activity is something so entirely outside the norm as a business activity.

    • H

      I agree with Maddie. If you’re going to be doing outdoorsy things, I think it is appropriate to wear outdoorsy clothes. Just make sure it is somewhat conservative (no cleavage, not too short shorts, midriff covered, maybe even sleeves if you’re worried) and in good shape (no holes, tears, or stains). You can dress up for dinner and show them you clean up well.

      • Baconpancakes

        Note, the REI sizing is a lot smaller than most mainstream fashion, and a lot of their clothes have give but aren’t really “stretchy” per say.

        Signed, Bought Two Pairs On Final Sale And Trying To Lose Weight To Fit Into Them

        • Bonnie

          I generally agree but these pants are very stretchy so are comfortable for hiking, climbing, etc. The waistband is not stretchy though. I did have to get them in the short length.

    • a

      Can I be jealous that this sounds like a much more fun deal closing celebration than a boozy dinner!?! Have fun!

  14. Bonnie

    The past few weeks, my heels have been hurting tremendously to the point that walking was painful. I have primarily been wearing Birkenstocks and sneakers. I noticed today that the pain subsided when I put on heels. Has anyone experienced something like this? Anything I can do to keep the pain away other than wear heels?

    • Maddie Ross

      Did you start wearing Birks in response to the pain, or did they cause it? I can only walk around in Birks for like an hour tops, or my arches kill me. Another possibility is plantar fasciitis, in which case stretching of the arch is the best option. There are also some orthotics specifically for that type of pain, as well as certain brands of shoes that are better (Geox being one).

      • Bonnie

        No, Birks have been a summer staple for me for years. The only thing that changed this summer, is that I’ve been able to dress more casually at work so have not been wearing heels as much.

    • Anon

      I had a similar issue a few years ago while on vacation at WDW. It started off as my foot hurting and then became my foot and knee. Switching to some heeled sandals made all the difference.

      It hasn’t happened since then, but I regularly wear heels during the day and commute in flip flops.

    • First Year Anon

      Depends on where the pain is, but it might be achilles issues- wearing heels alleviates some of the strain on the achilles.

    • X

      Sounds like plantar fasciitis to me. I got it a couple of years ago. My sister-in-law just got it this year and now has to retire her Birks.

      What you’ll probably need to do is get shoes that keep your foot in place. For flip flops, I now wear these:
      https://www.okabashi.com/catalogsearch/result/?q=pacific

      There’s a flash sale going on right now (code FLASHFF) so they’re only $11.99). As soon as I started wearing them, the pain went away. You can also buy them on Amazon. Unfortunately, I broke my ankle in May so no flip flops this summer.

    • Van anon

      It may also be that you simply need more arch support. Foot doc told me that for flat shoes, I should insert my orthotic, but that wedges or heels (no more than two inches is what he suggested) support my arch better–(at least for a few hours– he said I should not walk too long in heels). I now buy naot sandals, as some of the styles have a wedge, and, I walk 10 -15 km I them without pain. Check out the blog barkingdogshoes–a variety of suggestions and looks.

  15. X

    For those of you who wanted to donate to Hillary’s campaign, but don’t want your name on the donation… here’s a solution:
    https://americavoteswithcardsagainsthumanity.com/

    Cards Against Humanity is selling Clinton and Drumpf themed packs and donating all the money to Clinton’s campaign, other groups that oppose Drumpf and campaigns to get out the vote in swing states.

    If you don’t have the Cards Against Humanity game, I’m sure those of us who do would accept one of the theme packs as a gift. I purchased the Clinton pack and then realized the Drumpf pack would probably be a better addition to the game.

    If you’d like to donate in this way and want to give me a gift, I’d be happy to post my email address so you can get my address…

    • Anon

      This is awesome! The email they sent out said “we will be donating all the proceeds to one of the candidates. And that candidate will be Hillary Clinton.”

    • anon

      Is Cards Against Humanity as funny as they make it sound? We’ve never played but we’re looking to add new games to have friends over on weekends. Would love to know, thanks!

      • emeralds

        It’s a know your audience/friend group thing since it’s based around being incredibly inappropriate, but with the right crowd I think it’s the most entertaining party game out there.

      • Anonymous

        It’s a crude and se#ually explicit, very un-PC version of Apples to Apples. So, it depends on if that fits in with your crowd.

        I’ve play a couple times, but I’m not a big fan. To me, it’s kind of funny at first, but the humor gets old quick. Frankly, I’d rather play Apples to Apples.

        • halp

          +1. funny for like 30 mins. I don’t get the people who want to constantly have game nights and play this.

        • anon

          I love this game, BUT I think how funny it is depends on how well you know the group and people’s personal brands of humor. It’s less amusing if people are just going for the grossest or most shocking thing, and much more fun if it’s tailored to people’s individual humor preferences. The better you know each other, the more fun it is. For example, my closest friends and I like to maximize creative social commentary, subversive feminist humor, inside jokes, political humor…

          • Anonymous

            +1 – I think it also works better with a smaller group (like 5 ish) than a bigger group (8 or more), because it goes faster (less card pairs to hear, fewer for the person to pick from as the winner). But I think the same thing for A2A.

  16. Saving v VRI

    Finance question – our income just went up this month, we bought a house last year, my SO is self-employed. My 401k is fully funded, but he just has a half-hearted IRA hes been neglecting since we started saving for/paying for the house. We have a $20k variable rate mortgage on top of our fixed rate mortgage. Student loans are a non-issue. Should we throw the extra cash at the variable rate (our current inclination since all we’re paying is interest we can write off at this point), increase his retirement contributions (and if so, what’s the best way?) or some combination of the two? If we threw all the new income at it, we’d knock off the variable rate by January, so that’s really tempting, and it makes me nervous that the 4% can only go up from here.

    Also, just in general, is there a resource you recommend for the financial/investing advice along these lines? I know the baby step stuff (contribute to the max of of tax-deferred employer plans first), but I’m not sure where to go from here.

    • anon

      I’d get rid of the variable rate since you can do so quickly (and since it could go up). Then, starting in January, throw it all (including the required payments on the variable rate) at his IRA until it’s fully funded.

      • Wildkitten

        Are you sure your new income is enough to pay off $20k in 4 months? The income will be taxed, so if its going up $5k a month it own’t be enough. I always want to spend my new gross income without realizing that I don’t actually get that much take-home.

    • a

      My experience is informed by the fact that I had a variable rate from 2008-2014 that scared the bejeezus out of me … but the rate never actually went up. I recognize that interest rates have to increase eventually, but the increase is unlikely to be very significant in the next year or so.
      I assume your variable rate is tied to prime, so it may go up in the next year, but it probably shouldn’t be that much? I’d split and put some towards retirement, some towards the the variable, with a goal of paying off the variable in the next 10-12 mos.

    • Wildkitten

      I’d pay off the $20k this year, and dump it into the IRA starting in January with catch-up contributions so they count for this year’s taxes. (If I am remembering IRA tax benefits right.)

  17. Ning

    Outfit question! I’m going to the Gwen Stefani concert tomorrow (thank you, free LiveNation tickets). I was a big fan of her back in the “Tragic Kingdom” days… but what does a 30 yr old wear to her concert now?

    We’ll be sitting on a lawn blanket.

    • emeralds

      Casual black dress, booties, an edgy accessory or three, and eyeliner. Enjoy!

    • Sydney Bristow

      No idea what to wear but I’m so jealous! Have fun! I’ve been a No Doubt fan girl for about as long as I can remember.

    • Wanderlust

      Wear a tank top and rhinestone your br@straps! Who says the 90s are over?!?

  18. Anonymous

    My husband and I are first-time homebuyers, and to us our mortgage lender seems, well, borderline criminally inept, but maybe we just need a reality check. Help! Apology in advance for the novel.

    I should say upfront that there have been lots of little problems that, from talking to other homebuyers and reading accounts online, we do think are par for the course: being AWOL for days at a time, losing documents we already sent, losing track of details like how much credit the sellers are offering and which fees the sellers have agreed to pay, etc. Partially as a result, though, the lender has repeatedly screwed up the disclosure forms required by state and federal laws (in particular the federally mandated Loan Estimate), so we have repeatedly had to ask for those disclosures to be corrected. We’re now at ten days since we last requested corrected disclosures and have still not received them.

    Other issues: the broker has twice contacted the sellers’ agent, without notifying us or our agent that she was going to do so, and given him false information. The first one really pissed our agent off, but I think only the second one is worth mentioning here. The background is that we are getting a renovation loan (so, for example, our contractor’s bid is part of the loan application), and the mortgage lender ordered an appraisal of the AFTER-renovations value. The appraisal therefore needed to come in at least the purchase price (X) plus the cost of the renovations (Y). It came in at about $50,000 under X+Y . . . but with the appraiser’s report we got, we had no way to know whether the difference was because X, Y, or both were too high. The appraisal contingency in the contract obviously requires notification of the sellers only if the appraisal comes in under X (the cost/value of the renovations isn’t the sellers’ problem; only the purchase price is their problem). Nevertheless, the broker emailed the sellers’ agent that the property had under appraised. So our agent has been trying to smooth that over while we wait for the as-is appraisal, which leads into the next problem . . .

    The appraisal of the after-renovations value was the only appraisal the broker ordered. Per the appraisal contingency in the contract, if the property under appraises, we go back to the sellers and say the purchase price needs to be lowered, they decide whether they will lower it, if not we decide whether we want to pay the difference out of pocket or walk, etc. So, clearly, we should have ordered an appraisal of the as-is value of the property, not just of the value after renovations, but we didn’t know until the report came in a week before closing that the lender had failed to do that. The lender has now ordered an as-is appraisal, but per the contract, the appraisal was supposed to have been ordered over a month ago, now settlement really does have to be extended while we wait for the as-is appraisal, etc.

    And on yet another related note, our agent was highly critical of the appraiser’s report we did get because of the completely inappropriate comps it relied on — dissimilar houses in completely different neighborhoods and even a different town (five miles away!), a previously foreclosed house bought from the bank, etc. So we have also had to appeal the original appraiser’s report. I wouldn’t think too much of this except that the broker admitted to our agent that she used this appraiser once before and had the same types of problems with the appraiser’s report on that property.

    I am an attorney but not in this field, so I feel both supremely pissed off and helpless. But is this just normal crap that people deal with in buying houses? The property is in Maryland, if it makes any difference.

    • KateMiddletown

      Get a new broker. You have a choice, and they’re making money off of you. Tell your agent first, let them know you’re extremely dissatisfied. Ask your agent for recos and try to get this done as swiftly as possible – you are pretty far along in the process to be switching but if the errors are as egregious as you make it sound I believe you have cause and really no other choice.

      • Anonymous

        This. You’re just adding to your stress now, and later, by staying with this broker. Cut your losses and find someone else.

    • Dulcinea

      I AM in this field and what you are describing is normal for a national/major lender or servicer. Sorry to say it probably won’t get better once you actually get the loan and start making payments- be sure to open your statements and review them carefully every month, even if you are on auto-pay. It’s not unlikely that they will, eg., misplace your proof of homeowners insurance and impose lender placed insurance, which you will then have to fix by having your insurance broker follow up with proof of your own policy and that you had previously sent in said proof in a timely fashion. Or they will miscalculate your escrow payments the first year causing you to have to make higher payments the following year. Or they will change your acount number 3 times within the first 5 months. (All three of these things happened to me in one year; all three and more routinely happen to my clients). Honestly if you can go with a local credit union it might be worth a slightly higher interest rate in order to avoid the horrible customer service of the major national companies and ALSO so there is a physical office you can walk into/bring documents and sit down and discuss any issues with a real live person. If that’s not an opition then be prepared to be vigilent for the next 30 years.

      • Meg Murry

        FWIW, I had similar issues while using a regional bank when trying what you recommended – we hand deliviered a neatly organized pile of all the documents they asked for, even summarized with a spreadsheet, and anytime they asked we were able to walk in and drop off what they wanted quickly, but we still wound up playing the game of telephone with them of underwriter->loan officer->our realtor->my husband->me and back, with them not responding to us for days and then saying “I need page 3 of your bank statement by close of business tonight” – well, we gave you 3 months worth of bank statement for 4 different accounts, so page 3 of *what* exactly?

        In our case, it turned out to be a combo of incompetence by our local loan officer, and him working out of more than one branch (neither of which were the underwriter’s branch), with them trying to fax documents back and forth and pages getting lost along the way. We switched to email and sending pdfs of everything, and that worked slightly better, but the sale still almost didn’t go through due to one of the early miscommunications (somewhere along the line a deadline got interpreted from “end to July” to “July 30th” – but in fact was a hard and fast deadline of July 27th, which wasn’t discovered until the 28th). Luckily we were able to get the agreement extended by 3 days to close, but the sale almost didn’t happen because of that incompetence.

        Unfortunately situations like mine and OPs seem to happen a lot, which means that there is always a fire to put out for someone who’s deadline is today! and that means that further off deadlines get put off until they become a hot emergency. It stinks.

    • Anonymous

      I just recently sold my house and the buyer’s mortgage broker was so incompetent, and borderline fraudulent, that it took threatening to file a lawsuit to get them to move. And what do you know? We closed 24 hours later.

    • anon a mouse

      What you are describing is not normal and you should not proceed with them.

      Find a good local bank and make some calls. Depending on where you are in Maryland, Eagle Bank and Sandy Spring Bank both are highly regarded for quality and efficiency, and they both do renovation loans.

    • OP

      Thanks to everyone for your replies so far. We would LOVE to switch mortgage lenders but don’t see how to get the sellers on board with the further delay of closing that would entail. (Closing was originally set for this past Monday; it’s now technically set for this coming Monday, but that’s obviously not going to happen.) Considering that all the sellers want to do is close, how could we possibly convince them to agree to another, what, minimum 30-day delay?

      • ELaw

        I also dealt with extremely incompetent brokers – you have my sympathy. On the plus side, they sold my mortgage before my first payment was even due, so I didn’t have to deal with them anymore.

        New mortgage servicer is, however, not really better. The whole industry is run by idiots as far as I can tell.

    • Navy Attorney

      I work in this field. The problem with the appraiser’s report is fairly common, but it’s also easy to pick apart an appraisal. I kind of think that appraisals are more of an art form. But the other issues are definitely problems, and demonstrate an incredible inattention to detail. Get a different lender ASAP. In both work and my personal life we use local businesses for all aspects of the deal.

  19. Miz Swizz

    Just got our invitation to our yearly event for my organization. Dress code is “snappy summer casual”. It shouldn’t bug me this much but I hate that the inclusion of a dress code is more confusing than leaving it out.

  20. REAKZJ

    Interview attire question. Is it inappropriate to wear Ferragamo black pumps to an interview? They are plain black with a 2″ heel but have the bow with gold on the top. They would be worn with a black theory dress suit.

    Are these inappropriate and too attention calling? Should I just suck it up and buy a pair of totally plain black pumps for the interview?

    For some background – the interview is not law but finance/accounting (not at a bank or financial institution) in a medium sized east coast city (no NYC, Boston or DC).

    Thoughts?

    • Ning

      I’ve worn black ferragamo pumps to interviews in NYC pre-MBA. As an MBA candidate, I did wear them to company visits (the low heeled ones are useful for walking), but never to interviews.

      Now, I’m working in a southern city in finance for a massive corporation, I wouldn’t hesitate about wearing them to interview again now that I’m re-established in my career. In general, I’ve noticed that MBA hires in my class year have been nicely dressed, wearing pricey (but not super-high) heels and carrying designer bags, but I also think that’s the culture of my particular city.

      In short- go for it! Not sure how relevant my experience is for yours.

    • anon

      Ha, just faced this dilemma. I was wondering whether to wear similar Ferragamos to a Fed Gov interview (attorney) and worried it would be tone deaf. So I wore my less obvious Ferragamos. But I kinda wished I’d worn the others cause they make me feel so polished and shiny.

    • Mindy

      For what it’s worth, I LOVE my ferragamos. However, if you’re not sure of the office culture/dress code, I would hesitate and maybe get some not as identifiable heels. At my old NYC firm the ferragmos would have been out of place and if I’m interviewing, I want to get the job first, then dress snappier. As a lateral, I wore my varas to the interview because I had a walk a few avenues.

  21. Calling road warriors

    I am about to enter the fall travel season for my job, and I need it to be more organized than last year. (Have started an executive MBA program on the side so things are about to get really crazy. )

    How do you all organize your travel reservations? (I’m talking 6 US cities in 2 weeks kind of travel for about 6 weeks straight with trips home every weekend and a few weeknights, so there are a lot of reservations.)

    Some people have mentioned Evernote and I used to use Tripit. I would rather use Evernote because it’s how I organize my personal travel, but how specifically do you do it? One notebook for each week? One notebook for each trip? (That’s a lot of notebooks.) Do you rely on tags and just keep everything in the same notebook?

    How do you handle a significant other when you’re gone this much in a short time period? (Husband is always a problem when I travel — no matter how many times I tell him or give him my flight information, he is constantly texting asking what city I’m in and when I”m coming home.) Since it’s only for a total of about 8 weeks it isn’t horrible but it’s disruptive because we aren’t used to it.

    How do you handle your clothes? Do you just keep packing the same clothes? Or do you swap out the clothes when you get tired of them? Last year I just wore the same clothes over and over but then found i never wanted to wear those clothes again, so I’m thinking of making up two sets of clothes and just trading them out on the weekends.

    And how do you prepare mentally for these types of time periods? I know that there are people who do this all the time, but because I don’t go to the same job sites week after week, I find it hard to feel normal. It seems like I always have that grubby airplane feel, my clothes always feel grungy, my hair is always icky from being on planes, I can never sleep because I’m always in a strange hotel, etc. I know I’m just feeling whiny but I would love any advice on how to prepare for this season so it hopefully goes better than last year and I can be less frazzled.

    • rosie

      On the significant other, can you put your travel on a shared calendar? If he doesn’t need to know all details, you could just put blocks of where you’ll be when, versus entering hotel info, flight details, etc. I actually think putting all the details into a calendar might be kind of useful to have yourself, but don’t have experience with this kind of extensive travel to personally recommend it.

      • Calling road warriors

        Do you use Google calendar? We don’t have a joint calendar but that seems like it would help.

      • Anononononon

        This. My wife works a job that is rotating shift work, with an insanely complex pattern to what days and times she works.

        At the beginning I was always confused about when she was at work and when she wasn’t.

        Google calendar has solved all of this. We put her work schedule on it as well as any events we both need to know about/go to and any work meetings I have that are outside the times of my usual work day.

    • mascot

      For husband- low-tech, a print out/pdf of your itinerary that he can keep at home and on his phone. higher tech- shared calendar or just put it on whatever calendar he uses and mark it private. We also text each other a picture of the phone in the hotel room so we know contact info and room number.
      Can you pack something for the hotel to make it more comfortable? Noise app on your phone, satin pillowcase, candle, etc?

      • Anon

        Texting a photo of the phone in the hotel is a great idea! I always take a photo of the room number on the door so I remember it but I think I’ll just switch to doing that instead and sharing it with him. Thanks!

    • Liz

      Late replying here, but maybe it will still be helpful. I just finished two months of this:

      For clothing, I did two different weeks of clothing I’d swap out. This also allowed me to get some things dry cleaned in between. i.e. I’d travel with week 1 clothes while week 2 clothes were at the dry cleaner. I also stuck to pretty streamlined color palettes so everything mixes and matches. Wanted to eliminate as much decision-making as possible.

      When I’m on the road, I’m big on creating daily habits so I have some sort of routine. For example, I always pick a coffee shop near the hotel and get my coffee there every morning – so I’m a regular for at least a few days and it becomes “my place.” I try to go for a run or walk most mornings even if only a couple of miles – because it’s another “normalizing” thing. (plus it’s a fun way to explore a new place) I carry a few favorite bath products so I can eliminate the gross travel feeling with some familiar scents. And because I’m a big foodie, I use my expense account to treat myself to some extra nice dinners here and there. I consider it part of maintaining my sanity while doing the hard work of being on the road.

  22. anonshmanon

    the reservations issue I would handle with tags. Assuming that you aren’t doing the same city twice, I’d tag all the hotel reservations with R*Chicago and the flights/transportation with two tags so you can find them when you pull up R*Chicago OR R*Dallas.
    Hubby: Shared section of google calendar (or equivalent). Depending how swamped you are, try IMing him a little more during your day to stay connected. Put one or two date nights on the calendar when you are home. Don’t leave the house (you are traveling enough!), but get takeout and just hang out.
    Mentally, I focus on the great opportunity to see places and meet interesting people. But like you, I find it exhausting and am glad when I finally get home.
    Sorry, no helpful idea with the clothes, as this is no issue for me.

    • Calling road warriors

      We don’t have a shared calendar — maybe that would help. And some date nights is a great idea. I’m going to give the tags a try too.

      • Former Road Warrior

        Can he ever join you on the road? If I’m going somewhere fun and will have downtime, I invite hubby along. He can explore the city while I work, and then we meet up for dinner and date time.

  24. Meow

    So I need some leopard-print kitten heels. I found the perfect pair, but they are unfortunately made by Ivanka Trump. Just wanted to vent.

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