This post may contain affiliate links and Corporette® may earn commissions for purchases made through links in this post. As an Amazon Associate, I earn from qualifying purchases.
Our daily workwear reports suggest one piece of work-appropriate attire in a range of prices.
This fun, asymmetrical-neck dress is from Brooks Brothers. I like the navy, and I like that the dress has an interesting neckline that's still work appropriate. It looks like an easy thing to just throw on and have your look made. It's also machine washable. The dress is $148 and comes in sizes XS–XL. Asymmetrical-Neck Jersey Sheath Dress
A plus-size option is at Eloquii.
Seen a great piece you’d like to recommend? Please e-mail tps@corporette.com.
Sales of note for 10.10.24
- Nordstrom – Extra 25% off clearance (through 10/14); there's a lot from reader favorites like Boss, FARM Rio, Marc Fisher LTD, AGL, and more. Plus: free 2-day shipping, and cardmembers earn 6x points per dollar (3X the points on beauty).
- Ann Taylor – Extra 50% off sale (ends 10/12)
- Banana Republic Factory – Up to 50% off everything plus extra 25% off your $125+ purchase
- Boden – 10% off new styles with code; free shipping over $75
- Eloquii – Extra 50% off a lot of sale items, with code
- J.Crew – 40% off sitewide
- J.Crew Factory – 50% off entire site, plus extra 25% off orders $150+
- Lo & Sons – Fall Sale, up to 35% off
- M.M.LaFleur – Save 25% sitewide
- Neiman Marcus – Sale on sale, up to 85% off
- Spanx – Lots of workwear on sale, some up to 70% off
- Talbots – 50% off 2+ markdowns
- Target – Circle week, deals on 1000s of items
- White House Black Market – Buy one, get one – 50% off full price styles
And some of our latest threadjacks here at Corporette (reader questions and commentary) — see more here!
Some of our latest threadjacks include:
- What to say to friends and family who threaten to not vote?
- What boots do you expect to wear this fall and winter?
- What beauty treatments do you do on a regular basis to look polished?
- Can I skip the annual family event my workplace holds, even if I'm a manager?
- What small steps can I take today to get myself a little more “together” and not feel so frazzled all of the time?
- The oldest daughter is America's social safety net — change my mind…
- What have you lost your taste for as you've aged?
- Tell me about your favorite adventure travels…
Anon
The “figure-flattering ruched sides” would be a lot easier to see if the model wasn’t crossing her arms in the only picture of them…
Anon
I agree, and this seems to be a trend.
Anonymous
Ruching is occasionally well done, but too often feels like a cheap shortcut to actual tailoring.
Pretty Primadonna
I hate ruching. It does nothing for me and I particularly hate it when it accompanies an interesting neckline like on this dress.
Ellen
I love Brook’s Brothers, but am not a fan either of Ruching. I do applaud Brooks Brothers for putting in a pretty woman here, tho I cant see the Ruching either. FOOEY!
Anonymous
I’ve found ruching actually makes me look larger…
cake batter
+1 why is it so popular to pose models in ridiculous ways that hide actual views of the clothes? It also drives me batty when the only photos of a top are tucked in or under a blazer. How am I supposed to see how long it is or how it’s shaped?!
SFlawyer
+100000000
US undergrad schools question
All
When applying to undergrad school in the US, assuming my child has spent >5 years studying a foreign language, does it matter which language it is? I.e. do US schools give greater weightage to Spanish vs French or German?
I would think not, but we don’t live in the US and I wanted to get a feel for this.
Thanks in advance,
AIMS
I don’t think so but most US students take either Spanish or French so I should think German would be given a preference, if anything.
US undergrad schools question
Thanks. I had heard that Spanish was preferred. My Son will most likely opt for French though and study it for 7 years and that’s why I asked.
Anonymous
Too bad…. Spanish is by far the most useful here.
Signed,
Why the heck did I take French. I am a doctor and I would take care of my patients so much better if I spoke Spanish….
S in Chicago
Be glad you didn’t take Latin!
French major
Yes, Spanish is WAY more useful. I took years and years of French in high school and undergrad and the only time I’ve ever used it is when traveling in France.
Senior Attorney
Yes my son is job hunting and he would have a HUGE advantage if he spoke Spanish.
Anon
Spanish is the most generally useful language besides English in the US, and will therefore impress employers more. But it’s a commonly offered language (i.e., even weak schools offer it, so it’s not, on its own, a sign of a rigorous high school education). It’s also sometimes perceived by students as “easy” or even grade-inflated in comparison to other languages (I don’t know if admissions shares that view). I am sure prejudice also plays a role in preventing Spanish from being viewed as a “prestige” language in the US. So there are many excellent reasons to take Spanish, but I would not recommend Spanish only to impress admissions.
Token Millennial
My impression is that it would only really matter if the language directly relates to the child’s intended field of study (i.e., the intended French major who comes in with AP French credits). Some admissions departments may give kudos to students who studied languages like Arabic or Chinese, especially if they’ve done extremely well in the language. For the languages you listed, I don’t think most schools care which one the kid studied. They care more about how well they did in the language, whether they’re bringing college credit, and how well they score on the placement test.
Blonde Lawyer
I’d also consider the intended major and region the child hopes to end up in (I know that is hard to say so early) to decide what is most beneficial. I was a criminal justice undergrad and some of the service learning or internship opportunities had a Spanish bilingual preference. I got my certificate in Spanish (my school’s version of a minor) but I am not even conversational in it anymore because I haven’t used it in many years. While I was in school though, I was able to get into a service learning opportunity with a Spanish GED program in a jail that I could not have otherwise worked if I wasn’t studying Spanish. I not only had to re-learn fractions to work in it, I had to learn how to explain it all in Spanish!
Marillenbaum
Hi! Former college admissions rep here. It doesn’t matter what the language is. Mostly, we’re looking for completion of whatever the expected number of years of study is.
Anonymous
Hi, if I may ask, what do you do now? I’m currently in admissions and having a hard time transitioning to something else. Thanks!
Pesh
One of my closest friends transitioned into admissions program software sales. She travels to schools interested in the software and demonstrates how to use it, how they can customize it to the school’s needs, etc. Someone else closes the sale, but she gets bonuses based on sales. It’s a very lucrative position, she makes a lot of money. From what I understand, they only hire former admissions professionals for these types of positions because of the background knowledge of the field and to be authentic to their potential customers. Hope that helps!
BC
As a former French minor in college… if your child intends to stay in the US as an adult, I would encourage him to study Spanish, which is much more useful in the US than French ever is.
anne-on
+1 – Spanish is spoken in SO many places in the US, especially big cities, and I’ve always found it extremely useful to have at least a passing knowledge of Spanish. Really, I find it especially handy when traveling in the US as many chambermaids/taxi drivers/food service people speak it and I can speak it with them to get my basic needs across.
Anonymous
Out of curiosity, wouldn’t you be able to do so as an English speaker?
anne-on
Ha – in Miami, I wouldn’t be able to tell my uber drivers to turn left, then right, then stop here when trying to get to my weirdly located office park location. It’s also just easier to ask the housekeeper for more shampoo/towels/soap in Spanish instead of having to call down to the front desk, or ask them to swap out a hairdryer for example.
Baconpancakes
I’m going to assume good intentions here and answer your question in a straightforward manner: no. Many, if not most low-paid jobs in the United States are performed by immigrants, often from Spanish-speaking countries. Many of them have enough English to get through their jobs, but not enough to converse, and if you have any particular questions or requests, Spanish can only aid in your communication. The US doesn’t actually have an official language, and there are a number of green card holders and even American citizens who don’t speak English, particularly in the Southwest.
If you were asking to be pointedly rude, don’t.
Anonymous
@Baconpancakes that’s one negative way to look at it. I speak no Spanish at all and get by just fine even with the many Spanish speaking immigrants doing low paying work I interact with because they try really hard to understand and so do I! Saying I don’t need Spanish isn’t because I feel entitled to only speak English and am ignorant of our immigration but because I respect the hard work our immigrants do to pick up enough English to get by even if it takes a little longer.
Anonymous
Bacon pancakes: I’m not sure why you felt the need to be rude. I’ve pointed out I don’t live in the US and it was a genuine question.
Baconpancakes
Anonymous at 11:44, you realize you’re posting as anonymous, right? There’s no way for anyone to know you don’t live in the US. I was trying to assume good intentions (thus my caveat), but an American asking that question would be trolling. Immigration is a hot-button topic in the US right now, and there are a lot of American, all the way up to our President, who are being viciously cruel to immigrants.
And to the Anonymous at 11:10, it’s fine to not have any Spanish, but I find it helps me be understood!
Blonde Lawyer
I’ve always been afraid to use my Spanish in these situations. I’m afraid it would seem rude like I was assuming they don’t speak English. I have used it before when a client was stuck on a word or two and I knew the Spanish word for it.
jwalk
French major here and I agree. French has been extremely helpful for me when traveling, but at home in the US, Spanish would be more useful on a day to day basis. I studied it for a couple years but had to drop it and I wish I had kept up with it.
Anon
There’s so much misinformation out there. Everyone thinks there’s these cute little tricks that will give their kid an edge.
To the extent that it matters, it’s unpredictable, as in, the only way it matters is if there are way more students intending to be Spanish majors than normal, so admissions might lean towards admitting the French speakers or people generally not interested in a foreign language. But that rarely happens and when it does, is just random and will even vary between schools.
Have your kid do the one she enjoys. She’ll get better grades and, you know, be happier.
Anonymous
Nope. If your child is passionate about learning something that is what they should learn. Honestly as, it sounds like, a foreign student the big issue will be paying for it. Lots of aid is not available to foreigners.
Former Admissions Officer
Nope. We gave it zero weight, even for “exotic” languages like Arabic. Just looked at how long they had studied the language and of course, as with all subjects, grades.
CX
This might be out of date advice now, but I was told in the early 2000s that one of the advantages to studying Latin was that most prestigious colleges and universities feel the need to maintain a Classics department, but it’s often a low-interest major. So, if you studied Latin, and stated you intended to major in Classics, it could potentially make your application more attractive.
Anonymous
That’s silly. Urban legend.
clancularia
I don’t know that it has anything to do with an admissions advantage, but Classics departments are definitely still under-enrolled; I graduated in 2015 as a Classics major and there were more Classics professors than Classics majors at my school (which is one of the best for Classics!)
…I just typed Classics so many times
unpopular opinion
I took French not latin, but a vote in favor of latin is that there’s a sort of unofficial tracking that happens in a lot of the top middle and high schools, at least in the Northeast, where the strongest students go into Latin/Greek, the strong students into French, and the weaker students into Spanish. A lot of the spanish classes at my middle school were much more unruly and “fun” focused than the french classes which were much more focused on competency, and judging from the experiences of my friends this pattern is fairly pervasive. I don’t think that’s enough of a reason to choose your kids’ language for him or her, but just an anecdote. There were tons of former-latin-takers at my ivy league college 5 years ago with relatively fewer than expected former-spanish-takers. I do not think this was created by the admissions office, but I do think the students who were more excited about learning opted into those languages at age 12 or 15 .
Anonymous
+1. This happened at my Midwestern public high school too. We did not have Latin but the honors students all took French or German. Basically no honors students took Spanish, and the classes had a reputation as easy playtime as opposed to serious language study like French and German. I took French for that reason even though I was well aware that Spanish would have been more useful. I will say that in hindsight I’m not sure college admissions officers were aware of this or would have cared, but I really didn’t want to be the only good student in a goof-off class.
Edna Mazur
My midwest public high school was the opposite. Spanish was considered the most rigorous and were the only option in which you could get college credit (not AP, actual college class through big state public U taught in the school). French was fine too, just no college or AP, and the German learners had a lot of fun.
Anonymous
My Midwest public high school also did not have this issue. This was an issue with your particular school. Spanish was the most popular (and had the most teachers), and had the opportunity for college credit your senior year or an AP test, if you wanted.
(And that college credit was how I got out of having to take any language classes in college).
Anonymous
I mean again, this is just you not a rule. At my elite northeast high school only the kids with learning disabilities who couldn’t figure out a spoken language took Latin.
Anon
Okay, I will bite: that’s crap. Latin is the hardest if those three languages to learn, even without speaking it.
Sorry Anonymous Internet person, I do not think you are being truthful.
Anonymous
I mean I literally am reporting a fact.
Anon
Yeah, I’m not sure about a distinction between French/Spanish/German – I think that might vary a lot based on school and location – but I went to an Ivy League undergrad and Latin was universally seen as the hardest/most prestigious language to take in high school. Almost everyone I knew in undergrad who had the option of taking Latin in high school did. Obviously lots of people including me were still admitted without taking Latin, but it was usually because our school didn’t offer it.
Anonymama
I think it has more to do with Latin being a prestige thing, and offered more at elite ivy-feeder schools, than with the languages themselves.
Anon
Huh. I went to a great public high school in the northeast. I took 7+ years of Spanish, up therough senior ear when I took AP.
I also took 3 years of Latin, also through AP. Latin for the first 2 years was way easier and most kids that didn’t do well in middle school Spanish ornfrench switched to Latin or Italian or German once those because options in HS to fulfill their 2 year language requirement. The upper years of Latin and AP Spanish and AP French were all filled with the top-college travels kids. Just a matter of which you liked/what teachers you had/how much you hated history and found AP Latin more interesting (me).
Pretty Primadonna
One time for Latin scholars! I took four years of high school Latin and two semesters in college.
Anon
There may be something to this. When I applied to college in the mid-90s, I said I wanted to be a French major and got recruited very hard by the school I eventually went to (including receiving a merit scholarship offered to only a handful of people). They only had 1-2 French majors per year. Of course, I ended up majoring in something different, but maybe putting French down made a difference!
Anonymous
I took Spanish and Latin in HS. Went to HYP. Got the equivalent of a minor in Spanish, which is very useful as I also studied abroad and am now fluent in Spanish. I’d suggest that any high school student study Spanish. At my firm, almost half of us are bi- or multi-lingual, and we get a stipend. We have staff fluent in about 6 or 7 languages, but no one speaks German and only 1 speaks French-and he’s an immigrant from a French speaking African country.
I’m not an alumni interviewer, and at least for my school, all the applicants say they want to study engineering. Wanting to study Latin would not be a boost or tip factor.
Anonymous
I’m NOW an alumni interviewer*
Anon.
Interesting – can we also talk about the classist nature of classics? It’s US prep schools that are far and away more likely to offer – and mandate often – latin study. This means, presence of latin on a transcript is sometimes a flag of socioeconomic status. This still influences admissions decisions as universities seek to maintain/expand/tailor their culture/student body. For elitist schools I think latin, tennis, whatever, are often taken as indicators of family status.
Anonymous
+1. I went to public school in a wealthy district in MA. We had Latin, and very few other public schools did. We also had Spanish, French, and Portuguese due to the large Portuguese immigrant population in the region.
Anonymama
Yes.
Anonymous
I think this is true, but it’s also true that Latin is one of the cheaper and easier flags of socioeconomic status to acquire. Undergraduate Classics departments also have the resources and the incentive (if not always the know-how) to be very supportive of first-gen students. Even the field’s problematic and old-fashioned culture of meritocracy can cut both ways (the “scholarship student” in Greek or Latin has been a trope for generations). It’s an interesting mix.
Seventh Sister
In my not-that-great exurban high school, no one who wanted to go to a 4-year college took Spanish because the teacher routinely flunked everyone in the class. The only exception was my headstrong sister, who reasonably expected to get a decent grade for hard work then had to get my parents to fight the school about it.
I really wanted to take Spanish – I took German and I think I have an undiagnosed language processing disability which boiled down to years of struggle culminating in having to transfer out of an intermediate college German class because I was in so deep.
Biglawanon
Agree with others Spanish is most useful if those choices. But does he have an option to learn Chinese or Arabic?
Token Millennial
I have very little patience for “group work” scenarios at work and need to get better. My office updated to a new system this year and in spite of multiple trainings, there are certain things that we have yet to fully figure out. When one of these issues comes to a head, it usually means that 3 or 4 of us are crammed into an office or cubicle trying to brainstorm the correct way to do something and arguing over where we should click the mouse next. I absolutely hate this process, as it’s a good way to kill 3 hours without accomplishing anything, but as the most junior person in the department I don’t have much room to push back. What are your best tips for gritting your teeth and smiling through situations like this? Thanks!
Anonymous
Remembering they pay me to do this and it isn’t coal mining.
Anonymous
I love this advice. I can see myself thinking, “I am currently not developing black lung! No canaries are dying! All is well!”
Anonymous
This resonates. I am going adopt the mantra “I am currently not developing black lung! No canaries are dying! All is well!” Thank you. I went to a college (not in the US) with a high proportion of people studying various aspects of mining engineering, including some with actual previous “down the mine” experience. I have never forgotten them.
Former Retail
This. On my worst day, I’m at least not working at the mall on a Saturday night. Sometimes I think everyone needs a cr*p job in their background – and not just a high school summer job – for this very reason.
Exactly!
The director of an academic cancer center said that he decided to work hard in college after spending the summer after high school graduation in a night shift Southern, non-union textile mill in the mid – 1960’s. “Everyone should have that experience.”
Anonymous
Having a job where I hired undergraduates for work study jobs, I always looked for those who had previously had fast food jobs. They turned up on time whenever they were scheduled to work.
lawsuited
+1 I worked for a forestry company planting hundreds of seedlings per day in frozen ground (for pennies per seedling). Every job I have had since that has seemed really awesome by comparison.
Betty
THIS.
I honestly think that if everyone was required to wait tables or work a terrible retail job the world would be a kinder more compassionate place.
I actually think this should be a HS grad requirement instead of volunteering.
Gives everyone a much better sense of the world.
Anonymous
Volunteering can be a total joke. The kids in my area won’t volunteer to empty bedpans or pick up trash in the park. They “volunteer” to start a charity b/c college applications are such a thing with them. Everyone’s a general. No one is a private in the infantry.
Anonymous
Or just work any retail job (doesn’t have to be terrible, just your average mall job). A customer service job of any sort really.
Token Millennial
Thanks for this advice! I guess I needed a reminder that I’m happy to be done serving cheese fries and finally working in an industry I love (most days).
Betterandbetter
My Dad was a cop. His version of this was “Did anyone shoot at you today? No? Then count your blessings.” Trouble was my snotty teenage self was thinking “Well at least that would have been interesting.” As an adult it’s better motivation though.
Blonde Lawyer
Ha! Former corrections officer here. Even on my worst day in a firm, I’m still not wrestling anybody so it doesn’t rise to the level of emergency in my head as my former job. It really helped in law school too. People were crying in the bathroom over not getting an answer right when they were called on. Instead of worrying about getting called on, I was thinking this is way better than worrying about getting jumped.
Fishie
As my friend says, “that’s why they call them jobs and not funs.”
Anon
Thank you for this.
Rainbow Hair
This! I frequently find myself saying, “if it was all fun, they wouldn’t have to pay someone to do it!” (I also say this when people are trying to shirk things under the ‘well I don’t waaaaanna’ umbrella. Duh you don’t want to. It’s *work*)
lawsuited
I remind myself that I really like my paycheck. If your organization really to pay you to sit around for 3 hours, that’s their deal.
Maudie Atkinson
Anytime I have do something I’m frustrated by, I think about the episode of Mad Men in which Don, in response to Peggy’s frustration about not being thanked for her contributions, says, “That’s what the money’s for!”
Torin
John Hamm’s delivery of that line was amazing.
Anonymous
It was. I still remember it vividly.
pugsnbourbon
SO good.
Anonymous
Same! This was especially true when I was at a law firm. This scene is perfection.
Elegant Giraffe
1) Like others say, remember that there is a reason they pay you to do the job. It’s not supposed to be fun.
2) I find situations like that annoying as well. Decide which points you really care about in the group conversation. And then care only about those. Somebody else wants to do X on Y date, when you think Z would probably be better but it doesn’t really matter that much? Don’t say anything and let the Y date happen.
C2
Late to the party but I’m currently reading the Radium Girls. I’m thanking the lord that as annoying as my job can be sometimes, isn’t going to give me radiation poisoning which makes my jaw fall off and then kills me.
Seeking Moving Advice
Looking for advice about interstate moves. Can anyone recommend a moving company? I have experience with northAmerican (they were great when we moved in 2014), so I’ve requested a quote. Would like one or two more quotes from reputable, full-service movers (pack up the house, load truck, drive to new house several states away, unload and put back together all furniture, maybe unload boxes).
Also, this move (from the Midwest back to the East Coast) is for a new job. This employer offers funds for reimbursement when we show receipts. Last time, the employer took care of everything for us (they outsourced relo to a company that managed all aspects of the move for us). That means I’ve never negotiated a contract with a moving company or figured out the details of the services offered. For those of you with experience with the “reimbursement for expenses incurred” approach, what is your advice? Our first step is getting movers’ estimates so that we can assess whether the amount offered is sufficient to move our family of 6. (It’s $30K.) We need to think of all the costs that should be part of that: moving our second car, insurance, temporary housing, closing costs, brokers fee,… What else should be included?
Last time we unpacked boxes ourselves. For those who have had boxes unpacked at destination, how did that work? Did you have to stand around telling them where to put things? Did you have to rearrange everything later? Curious because we have not used that service in the past.
I am so excited about this move!!
CDA
I did a move where they unpacked. In my experience, it wasn’t super helpful because while they could put things in the right general location (dishes go in the kitchen, books go on bookshelves, clothes go in closets), there is no way for them to know where, exactly, you want any given dish, book, or jacket to go unless you are there pointing… and you can’t be everywhere at once. As a practical matter, this meant I just had them put the boxes of books near the bookcases and unpack the dishes onto the counter, because I realized I was just going to have to rearrange everything later anyway. So, as long as the movers are willing to bring the boxes into the house and put them in the right room, that’s really where I would say the usefulness ended for me on the boxes.
I did have them ‘unpack’ the furniture; that is where I spent my time pointing and, even then, we did a lot of rearranging later. It was just nice to have them do the heavy/initial work so they could take that packing material away.
Anon
Hello, military wife checking in. 11 moves in 15 years. Here’s the big info: moving companies are mostly franchises, so the service you get at one location is no guarantee of service at another location. (If you look at the trucks you see going down the highway, it’ll say Coleman’s North American or whatever on the cab or the back doors… It’s Mr. Coleman’s franchise.) I’ve had great service with Company A in one town and lousy service a couple years later with Company A in another location. So check your local Yelp and go from there. The one exception to this I can think of is Graebel Van Lines. Mr. Graebel owns every truck and the service is the most amazing I’ve ever had.
I cannot recommend the unpacking service highly enough. I can have my house 95% assembled within 3 days of arriving somewhere. How? You get the movers to unpack for you. For the unpacking service, they will put all the boxes in whatever room you tell them to, then they’ll unpack everything and put it on the nearest surface. In the kitchen, this means your dishes and silverware are on the counters; your towels are placed in the bathtub; decorative accessories are crowded on the coffee table. But the beautiful part is this: they take all the boxes and all the paper and recycle them for you. So when they leave, the ONLY thing you have is your belongings. No guessing what box something is hiding in because you can plainly see it all. No tripping over the chaos of half-unpacked boxes and loose paper.
For unpacking, it’s best if you can get to the house a day early and clean your cabinets / do drawer liner / whatever your thing is. Then as they’re unpacking, you can often be putting stuff straight where it belongs.
Anonymous
Sadly, I believe Graebel Van Lines closed last year.
Anonymous
I used Gentle Giant for a Boston -> DC move. I packed most of it myself, but they packed the kitchen, and on arrival they put all the big furniture back together and put the boxes in the right rooms, but I unpacked the boxes myself. They come back in a couple of days to pick up your boxes, so you don’t have to worry about carrying huge stacks to the recycling. I had to write a pretty detailed list of everything that I wanted moved, and then they gave me an estimate and I had to put down a few thousand dollars for the deposit, the parking permits, and the time and materials for the packing. Then, after they’d packed the truck, they weighed it, and after they delivered it I owed the rest of the balance, which was something like $.41/pound. It did encourage me to give things like my cast iron pans to the Salvation Army, rather than have them moved! At the time they were packing, I could also list the high-value items that I wanted extra insurance on.
CHS
One thing to check is how the expenses will be taxed – if the employer handles it internally and pays for everything, then I think you don’t get dinged for it. But if you are given an allocation to spend, then that gets taxed. (I’m not exactly sure how it works, but is worth checking into – we had a bit of a surprise at the end of our last move with that one.)
AnoninNY
I’m not an accountant, but I believe that taxation of moving reimbursements was changed in the new tax law and, now, regardless of structure, moving reimbursements are taxed as income (except for military personnel).
Minnie Beebe
Yes, this– if your employer will be reimbursing you, ask if they’ll gross up to cover the additional tax burden. It’s fairly standard, but worth knowing about ahead of time.
Also, my recommendation– don’t choose a mover just because it’s the cheapest. Choose a reputable company, with insurance, and ask how they handle breakages, etc. I prefer to have movers do the packing if possible. It’ll be packed well, with all the correct padding, etc. Be sure you’re around while the packing is going on though, and clear out anything you don’t want packed beforehand. You’ll want to know what’s going into each of the boxes (generally speaking) and you’ll be able to label them for the room they will be moved to at the new home.
When you arrive at the new place, clean everything as soon as you can, and then label the rooms (index cards and painters tape) and review with the foreman when the truck arrives. They should be able to deposit things in the correct rooms without you needing to monitor the movement of each and every box.
I personally don’t mind unpacking, so I usually do that myself. I get it done quickly, in a couple of days. My recent moves have all been within my city, so I’ve rented the plastic moving boxes. It’s awesome because not only are you not using a bunch of cardboard, but you need to turn them in relatively quickly. It’s a great motivator to getting things unpacked ASAP.
Good luck and congratulations!
BigLaw -- lifers?
For those of you in BigLaw (or similar professions), how old is the most senior woman you work with? And if she has children, how old are they?
I am thinking that I need to hear stories of women with children that aren’t newborns or still in daycare, but in high school or college or out working. These unicorn ladies exist somewhere? What are their secrets?
Or is this something where the writing is on the wall that I probably have 5 years post-diapers, max?
Anon
I’ve worked at thee law firms and a gov’t agency. Sorry, no good stories here.
Firm 1: One female partner, but it was a second career for her (she went to law school after he kids were 10+)
Firm 2: One female partner, divorced and w/o primary custody, had her kids with her e/o weekend
Firm 3: No female partners, all female associates (including me) left after kids
Gov’t Agency: Among those in director roles, I’m the only woman with a preschool-aged kid, the other directors are men with SAH wives, or men/women without kids.
Anonymous
42. Kids are 6 and 9. Idk what it matters that they aren’t in HS or college; they will be soon enough and she isn’t going anywhere.
Anonymous
In my experience, the older they get, the more ferrying around after school you’re expected to do/arrange.
Anonymous
It’s probably true that middle schoolers need more ferrying than elementary schoolers, but she asked about high school/college and at that point they are driving themselves and should be WAY more independent. And even middle schoolers are easier in some ways than elementary – they can be at home alone etc.
BigLaw -- lifers?
I was thinking just of tenure in the job — most people here seem to quit before their kids can even read. I really can’t imagine having kids who can fix their own dinner.
Anonymous
Yes but even in my LCOL non-big law life, that’s pretty solveable with an afterschool nanny. Most families with two working parents and 2-3 kids have an afterschool nanny that ferries between activities, and usually does some meal prep/folding kid laundry depending on the schedule.
Seventh Sister
I think this varies – my kid’s school in a big city has a lot of afterschool activities that are right on campus and not very expensive. Even the SAHMs use them for their kids. My eldest has one afterschool class that is off-campus, which is a little tricky but solveable with an afterschool babysitter. As she gets older, I’ll probably have her take a kid-branded-Uber-type thing there and then pick her up. I have generally encouraged activities without weekday practices, but we could make it work (I don’t have real sporty kids).
I do have at least one acquaintance who’s told herself that her kids aren’t going to get into Princeton if she isn’t ferrying them hither and yon at least seven days a week @ 8yo, but I went to a Very Elite Women’s College and my dual-income UMCish working parents generally refused to drive me to activities.
Tetra
There are two female partners in my office with 2-3 middle/high school aged kids. They are in their mid- to late-40s. Both of them have husbands with government jobs with set hours. They seem to make it all work just fine. Neither of them have to do a ton of travel, but they do have busy practices which they seem to love.
Boston Legal Eagle
Not in Biglaw anymore but in a large corporation. There are very few women at the top here, especially those with children. Honestly, I think the “secret” is to really love your work and to be ok with not seeing your kids that much. I think that is true for men too, it’s just more socially acceptable for them to do that.
Anonymous
+1 to your last two sentences. Making it in Biglaw or similarly intense industries requires making peace with decisions you make about how you spend your time. It doesn’t mean you never see your kids — I feel like I had plenty of time with my dad, who billed ~3000 hours/year when I was a kid– but you need to accept limitations and make sacrifices in other areas (like sleep).
My former Biglaw firm had “lots” (in quotes because it wasn’t close to 50%) of women partners with kids in all different areas of practice, including the Firm chair.
Just focusing on my group (M&A/corp/securities) in my office of ~20 partners, we had solid role models.
The year I started as a lateral associate, we had 4 women partners with kids ranging in age from 2 to 28. Now, 10 years later, one of those women retired at 60, 2 lateraled to other firms where they work full time with elementary/middle school aged kids and 1 is still with the firm with high school aged kids. In the meantime, there were 3 women elected to partner (out of ~6 total elected partners for that group/office), each of whom had 2 or more school aged kids and a spouse who also worked full time.
My two cents is that a nanny is almost essential to make it work. Parents who rely on daycare in the early years have a harder time while the kids are in daycare because they don’t have flexibility to stay late/they have to deal with taking time off with a sick kid, but another big hit comes when the kids hit school age because the switch to an after school babysitter is too hard for the parents to face (emotionally and logistically). They seem to think they can scrape by relying on after school programs, then the kids are missing out on organized sports or music lessons, etc. that their peers with stay at home parents (or babysitters) are able to go to. The guilt piles up and kids are unhappy and not getting exposed to as many fun things. My friends and coworkers who have had the easiest time had a full time nanny when the kids were babies/preschoolers and kept those nannies on as the kids got older, paying the nannies for hours they didn’t usually work (which helped with school cancellations for snow or teacher in service days, etc.) and having the nanny take on more housekeeper-like tasks (e.g., shopping for groceries or light cleaning). Care like this is expensive, but that’s why Biglaw pays so much. Buy a cheaper house.
the yellow one is the sun
Thanks for this. We both work, have our third on the way and have mostly decided on switching to a nanny from our current situation where our school-aged child is in the after-school program (after being a daycare kid since 9 weeks old) and younger is at daycare – but I still have moments of anxiety about whether it’s the best decision. The associated sickness and lack of flexibility with daycare has mostly been outweighed by our kids flourishing in that environment and having wonderful teachers who really love them. And it’s all we know! But your comment is reassuring. My older child already complains sometimes about being in after-school and is only in kindergarten. I hadn’t really considered the opportunity cost of that program, missing out on other activities as they get older, and I LOVE the idea of maintaining the nanny’s hours to cover more household management once the babies age out of her all-day care. And of course I know it will be easier on me to get out of the house in the morning and home in the afternoon without all the schlepping, but my convenience doesn’t carry as much weight as it probably should given that care arrangements are for a short time and I feel committed to my career for a lot of reasons.
Anyway – thanks again for this perspective!
Senior Attorney
I agree. I always said that the people who are really successful at BigLaw and similar are the people who have WORK right smack in the middle of the Venn diagram of their lives. So everything flowed from that — their friends were clients and they socialized and played golf with them, their vacations were work conferences, they did a bunch of Bar stuff and firm stuff, and family was kind of around the edges.
And yes, lots and lots and LOTS of household help.
KateMiddletown
This is such a great visual. If “work” and “family” and “exercise/caring for myself” are all circles in my diagram, is “fulfillment” the middle one?
Anonymous
I’m almost 40, a big law partner in a mid-size market. My kids are 5 and 7 and my husband is also a partner in big law (thankfully, a different firm). There are three women in my office that fit what you are describing, so it is possible. Only one is considered one of the big heavy hitters and she is always working and only has one child. The other two work less and were/are very hands on in their kids lives. It all comes out in the end in compensation, but everyone seems to make it work. Obviously, that’s not to say its easy. From my perspective, it is incredibly difficult and increasingly so as our parents age and I’m thrust into a whole new caretaker role.
Anonymous
Well the current president of the ABA is a biglaw partner with kids. Idk their ages. She’s been a lawyer for over 30 years so I’m guessing she’s in her 50s. I saw her speak on a panel and she said her trick is outsourcing.
Anecdotally, I know way more high-powered men with SAHWs than high-powered women with SAHHs, so it can’t be that one partner just does all the work; they have to actually hire people. Idk anything about how they divide the emotional labor of managing the household staff though. I’d be interested to know.
Also, and this seems to be unspoken (so far) among these women (at least publicly), I get the impression that they have a pretty thick skin. All that BS about being a woman who doesn’t do X for her family… you have to let it roll off your back or it’ll drive you crazy.
Anonymous
Eff the ABA. I was a leader in my section and putting together and planning for three meetings / year just for CLEs and arranging speakers is just A Lot of Work. I gave it up after my first kid and haven’t been back. It was so valuable to me as a younger lawyer to do that but no way in hell can I justify that sort of optional burden on my practice, my clients, my associates, or my family. I travel for vacations and billable / client work only now and it has improved my QOL.
Anononon
My current biglaw firm has two women in their late 40s/early 50s with kids finishing high school or in college in my department (a very boys’ club area of law) and the firm has a number of women in other departments in the same boat. We’ve definitely got a gap of women with kids in the 4-8 range; a lot of the senior associate types have left after kid number 2, but those who hang in through the tough years seem to come out the other side.
My mom is also a biglaw partner. Produced three kids all now fully launched into their own careers, and she’s still working full time at age 62. My dad worked full time growing up as well, but with a more flexible job (i.e. if there was a mid-day emergency, he usually covered). As a kid I could definitely tell that parenting + working was a hard juggle, but I think what made it work for us was paying for help (nannies, after school activities, house cleaner), my mom having a good support system around her, and the fact that she really loved her work.
BigLaw -- lifers?
TELL ME MORE ABOUT YOUR MOTHER — what are your secrets? And you saw the inside of the sausage factory and still chose it . . .
Ms B
Yes, more about your parents (not just mom). Would love to get tips on making it work besides outsourcing.
SSC
Thirded!
Anonymous
I may work with your mom!
At our biglaw firm (500 in NYC):
2 senior women partners in my practice group (kids all out of college now, but they were growing up while the women were in the thick of things, one of the children is in law now)
There are at least other 5 women partners at the firm have children in elementary and high school (I think each partner has max of 2 children) and older children as well. Many of them had children after making partner.
Anononon
Aw, guys.
First off, we had a big head start. Upper middle class family in New England, plus my mom’s parents were both professionals (dentist and professor) so she knew what was up. (Side note: My grandmother got her PhD and became a leading expert in her field while raising *4* kids, so I guess it’s also in the genes?)
I know people are touchy about nannies, but I cannot stress enough how that made it possible for us. We had live-in nannies for years and it meant that there was never the “oh shit, I have to find a babysitter”. Some nannies were great, some were ok, but they were 100% necessary until we were all able to get ourselves around without an older person to drive.
Oldest kid at home cooked dinner. Mom left instructions on a white board on our fridge and whoever got home in time to get dinner on the table did it. We could all cook competently by the time we were old enough to use the stove without supervision. That meant that by the time mom and dad walked in the door from work at the end of the day, we could all sit down and eat.
Quality time happened at the ends of the days. Dad did wake-up/breakfast duty so that my mom could get out the door to work early. She took the 6:55 AM train for most of my childhood so she could be home at 7:00/7:30. She is naturally a night owl, so this was something she prioritized so she could see us. After dinner, Dad did bedtime stories with little kids, Mom talked through homework with whoever was old enough to have homework while she did the dishes. My parents split most chores around the house. I can’t say that the split was always equitable, but both of them were committed to doing it so that there was some semblance of balance.
My dad worked at an office that was very understanding of family commitments. Take your daughter to work day there was awesome because they were so into everyone’s kids (they were in a science field, so it always included going into the lab, dipping things in dry ice, and smashing them, which I thought was great). He lucked out with a series of managers who never gave him any trouble for saying “gotta go, kid needs to go to the doctor”.
We also had a village. My mom’s secretary knew all of us, handled lots of little issues so they didn’t even get to my mom, and scheduled all dr appointments, parent-teacher conferences, etc. She was so involved with us growing up that she was one of the first people I told when I got engaged. We also had a big community of adults that we knew and had good relationships with, so there were always people available if coverage was needed for something. On the flip side, we didn’t cover a lot of things. Neither of my parents came to a lot of school plays, recitals, etc. because they were all scheduled for mid-afternoon. If another one of our adults could come, they did, but in general I was the parentless kid at the end of soccer games. My family went for quality over quantity on time together. Don’t know if it’s cause or effect, but we kids are all very independent and supportive of each other. If one of us needs something, we are as likely to call one of our siblings first as we are to call our parents.
In terms of work, my mom is a fighter. She was woman #9 at her firm. She got told as a first year associate that she scared the boys a little. She worked really, really hard to make a name for herself, bring in clients, and get into positions of power at the firm. Diversity committee, comp committee, executive committee, etc. Her practice was never the biggest in the firm, but she made sure her client relationships were really hers and that they sent her a steady stream of work. She also FOUGHT people on credit for those clients to make sure she always got paid for work she brought in, and referred to people she knew would refer back to her rather than to one of the boys. She was also strategic about kids. She got pregnant with me (oldest) after she made non-equity partner, and with kid #2 after she made equity partner. She was never up for a vote while she was pregnant because she was too worried to do that in the 80s. By the time I have real memories of what her work was like, she was already an equity partner, so I don’t know as much about the early years. I think really loving her work got her through the tough years.
That turned into a very long summary. In short, my parents are bomb, they supported each other, and had a whole bunch of other support. We are exceedingly lucky.
GG
Thank you so much for posting this. What an inspiration.
Senior Attorney
Wow, that’s amazing! Give your mom a hug for me next time you see her!
Sam
I am getting a little teary reading this. I am not a lawyer, but I hope one day when my kids are grown they are able to write something similar about me. Just that they are not resentful that I didn’t attend soccer games and that they feel they got enough of my time and attention and are better for it.
KateMiddletown
This is inspiring! Also would love the recipes that you and your siblings were able to cook at a young age – I made hamburger helper all the time.
Anononon
Lots of chicken! Baked chicken with paprika, chicken parm, chicken in wine sauce. I know it’s dorky, but the recipes in a basic Betty Crocker cookbook are idiot-proof (or, in our case, child-proof). Also anything in a casserole that could just be popped into the oven. We always did just simple steamed, sauteed, or roast veggies. Not the most exciting of meals, but it got the job done.
My childhood specialty, “Chicken and Three Peppers”, as an example:
Boneless skinless chicken breasts (scaled for your family size)
Equal amounts of red, yellow, and orange peppers (probably 1 pepper per person or so)
salt, pepper, oil, flour, sherry
Cut peppers and chicken into one inch squares and cubes, respectively
Dredge chicken pieces in salt/pepper/flour
Saute chicken in oil over medium high heat until cooked through most of the way
Add peppers to pan, continue cooking until chicken is cooked and peppers are slightly soft
Splash some sherry into the pan, stir until it mostly evaporates
Serve over pasta
Gail the Goldfish
My firm actually has quite a few older female partners with kids. I’m in what I would call regional biglaw and both my office managing partner and our firm managing partner have kids in high school and college. I think they’re probably in their 50s?. The most senior woman I work with is actually 70 and just went to part-time last year. She has at least one kid I know of who’s a doctor and I think has another as well, as as far as I know worked full time when they were growing up. My firm is not as intense as BigLaw, but it’s still a big firm with lots of offices. I think it helps to not be a NYC-based firm. Our concept of work-life balance is better than NYC.
anon
I knew a partner with middle school-age kids at my old firm. She had been on a reduced schedule for many years. I didn’t work much with her, but my impression was that she was awesome, in an important specialty for the firm, and was at the firm a long time before kids (maybe already partner?). I think just one nanny at the time I worked at the firm.
SAHM Made a Dif?
I’ve always felt that being raised by two working parents who made it work with little to no hired help (and being raised in a large family of middle class family members where every family was dual income) allowed me to see that a child is not deprived because a parent can’t pick them up from school everyday or go to every game, or do everything for them, and, in turn, makes me feel less guilty about working a more than full time job with kids. The kids will be alright.
Do you think having a SAHM burdened the women who leaned out a bit with higher expectations of parenting than the ones that stuck it out?
Anonymous
I actually know a lot of working women who leaned in because they saw what life was like for their SAHMs after all the kids were grown and they didn’t want that for themselves. And my mom worked full-time in a really demanding career and I’ve chosen to go part-time so I have more time with my kids. So anecdotally, no.
Anonymous
My mom didn’t work as a teacher from when she was pregnant with me until my sister started school.
She stayed home b/c my dad had a crazy job and teaching is OK with leaning out. She was pretty hands off — we were some of the last free-range kids who was not intensely parented and just let loose in the neighborhood. She drove us to Y and violin and otherwise liked to read and visit with her friends (one of whom didn’t work and one ran the office of her electrician husband).
I have a friend who won’t stop instragramming her kid (who is 7) and I think he’s going to be so sick of “OMG Ralphie is so super superb and a savant at long division and he is a Special Enrichment Class”. THAT sh*t is toxic, yo.
Anon
I don’t work in law, but I have a good friend who is a single (divorced, deadbeat dad) mother to two kids, ages high school and middle school, and she’s a big law partner. She’s also dating a great guy. She’s wonder woman for sure. She’s very very organized and leaves the office most (not all) nights at a fairly reasonable time, but does a lot of work from home. She is happy and has made it work. No family in the area. Nannies are key. But it’s not like that awful stereotype of the nanny raising the kids. She is really close to her kids and I’m always seeing videos she took at their recitals, games, etc.
Anon for this
Midlaw partner here, 50, one early grade schooler. I am the senior female partner at my firm. The firm’s first female partner retired from our corporate department last year and she had one toddler and one infant when she started with the firm in the 1980s; both of her kids were out of college and married with kids when she retired.
I do commercial and related litigation in the Midwest. The most senior women I know in my field are in their late 50s/early 60s and none of them have kids unless they are in government jobs.
My city has a strong women lawyer’s group where I have been able to meet women in other practice areas that are senior to me and have kids. Very few of them (as in count on one hand) do litigation or quasi-litigation (e.g. bankruptcy) in private practice at any level outside of family law and plaintiff’s side employment.
A decent number of senior women attorneys in my area (including Biglaw) have transactional practices such as real estate, development/tax credit, ERISA, and estate planning. Many of them have kids and most of them will tell you that either they were “tracked” into their areas by their firms or they chose their practice areas because they were more family friendly.
It does appear that this is changing, but slooooowly. The challenge in my view is making it through the early years with kids, overcoming continued biases against women (especially women who are parenting) in the workplace, and having enough will and energy to mentor and advocate for the next generation.
January
Just keep in mind that at the most senior level there is also a pipeline issue. Women whose children are fully grown were of a generation where they had fewer opportunities to enter the legal profession in the first place.
Anonymous
IDK — I don’t even see women past their mid-30s. My law school class was 50% women and I am in my 40s. And alone, so alone . . .
There isn’t even an older woman here in her late 40s to talk to. Or 50s. Or 60s.
The women here don’t remember the space shuttle. Or Friends being in prime time.
Anonymous
If you’re talking about grandmothers, yes, but not really if you consider “fully grown” to mean graduated high school or college. Law schools have been well over 40% women since the early 1990s, which was almost 30 years ago now. Women who are in their 50s shouldn’t have faced real barriers to entering the profession.
Anon
This is correct. I graduated law school in the late ’80s and women made up 40% or more of the class regularly at my T10 school. Women had plenty of opportunities to pick any practice group at any firm we wanted. I’m still at a Biglaw firm in my 50s and felt there were no barriers –except that it’s a brutally hard profession for both men and women. I stayed because I love my job, practice in a more “family friendly” area, had only one child and had enough support from nannies and others.
cbackson
There are a lot of senior women in my firm. The most senior women in my particular practice group has kids who are in or just out of college. The managing partner of my office, who’s in her fifties, has kids in high school.
Anon
60. Oldest children are my age (30). There was a partner who worked here who was 88, but I didn’t work with her.
Artemis
Attorney in mid-fifties here. I’m a manager so I can’t “hang out” with the 20-something attorneys who work for me. Are there “Senior Female Attorney” social groups/Facebook groups/ IRL clubs?
SSJD
This dress is awesome. Nice pick.
Anon
How does Brooks Brothers run for pears? Knit fabric plus sheath cut sometimes equals accentuating my rear in a non-office appropriate way.
Anon
I’m more of an hourglass than a pear, but I love Brooks Brothers.
Anonymous
I’m a pear and wear a lot of Brooks Brothers; the fits are classic, not body con.
Different anon
Another pear here. How accurate are the size charts?
Midtown ATL Attorney
I am a longtime Brooks Brothers fan (and most of my closet is still Brooks Brothers, including coats and shoes). In the past, the size charts very accurately reflected the sizing and fit of the clothing, but it has been getting less accurate over time, especially since they started working with Zac Posen. I still get a lot of my clothing there, but for the last 2 or 3 seasons, it has become essential for me to try on their clothing to assess the fit because it varies so much from item to item. Before, I was consistently a certain size in Brooks Brothers (and one size up from that in their Red Fleece line), but now I consider that size just a starting point, and will often need to size up or down depending on the item.
Anon
Can we talk paying on dates? I am dating on several apps. I’m surprised by how often we end up splitting the bill when the guy asks me out. I always thought whoever asks, pays—and I always pay when I ask (guys seem surprised but they let me). Also, it’s usually like a $4 coffee or a $6 beer, so it’s not like these dates are breaking the bank.
Obviously I can afford it and I pay my half, but it’s more about dating feeling special and different from grabbing coffee with a friend.
Is splitting the norm now? FWIW, I am mid-30s in a major city.
Anonymous
Splitting is the norm for meeting up for a coffee or drink for the first time. Though, I always appreciate when the guy pays.
Anonymous
I think splitting is common, especially for a coffee. That’s just not a special date. For me, on a first date I love it when a guy offers and let him, after that I split. But I don’t hold splitting on a first date against him either.
Anonymous
I’m late 20s and I lean to insisting on splitting if I know I’m not going to initiate a second date. I look it as we demand equality and this is part of it. I don’t know if it’s the norm, but I’ve only had one guy recently push back on not letting me pay my half and we’ve ended up going on a few dates (but that’s correlation, not causation).
Anonymous
I think splitting is pretty common for online dates. Once you’ve matched on the app, it’s a little artificial to say the guy asked you out even if he was the one who suggested a meet-up. I think it’s different if you meet a guy at a bar or something and he gets your number and calls for a date.
Anon
Yes.
Anonymous
I don’t think most men have ever heard of the rule, whoever asks pays. Most men seem to think the man always pays, they have a chip on their shoulder about it, and they ding you pretty hard if you don’t at least reach for your wallet even if he grabs the check first and clearly intends to pay the whole thing.
January
Yeah, I’m surprised she’s had so much success splitting the check. Maybe it’s regional.
Anon
I’m newly single and just started dating again. I’ve been on maybe 5-10 first dates and I have never paid. I’m in NYC if it matters. Also, I feel a bit elitist saying this, but I’ll only date men who are educated with a decent job. I think Men should generally pay on a first date. sometimes I will do the reach for my wallet but if they let me pay on a first date there won’t be a second.
Anonymous
If it’s online dating, then it’s less of a formal asking out; it’s pretty mutual. I’d expect to split or take turns getting rounds. If it’s something really cheap like a single coffee, then I’d expect both people to make a motion to pay for all of it, and it wouldn’t matter who ‘wins’ because it’s so inconsequential.
BeenThatGuy
My boyfriend tells me that if a man requests to split the check on a 1st date, he’s not interested. Take that for what it’s worth.
anon
Ugh gross no men aren’t buying women’s affections anymore.
Rainbow Hair
I always insisted on splitting so that when I hooked up with the person, I could be a little bit more sure it was because I wanted to, not because of the dinner they bought me.
(Check Lori McKenna’s Halfway Home for thoughts.)
Anonymous
That’s nonsense. My now-husband and plenty of other interested guys were happy to split the tab (and this was pre-online dating, where splitting is even more common).
Anon
Men who request to split the check aren’t interested.
Men who accept the offer to split may very well be interested.
anon
OH thank god we’ve finally learned a hard and fast rule that’s applicable to all men in all situations so that we can assess their behavior. Thank you for gracing us with this gift.
Anon
Been on some 35 or so first dates and most of my friends are men.
If you want women to waste their time because you want to be a nasty human, that’s your deal. But I think it’s worth noting that people often behave in predictable ways.
anon
I assure you, I’ve been on more dates than that (which you’ll probably just use as proof that I’m an unlovable nasty human). I’ve been doing internet dating for a while now. People often behave in predictable ways, but not always. Men, like women, are individuals. Situations are unique. Your problem is that you created some universal pronouncement which is not true. Source: experience. Not sure why you think what I’m saying will lead women to waste their time. Also not sure why you needed to attack me personally.
Women, if you are curious to know if a man feels about you, engage with him and ask him out rather than waste your time trying to decipher clues. You know what I really don’t want women to do? Assume a guy isn’t interested in her because of something like this and despair, and potentially miss out.
Anon
My husband totally suggested we split the check, and he was obviously interested enough that we ended up getting married. He’s a big feminist and just doesn’t believe in men treating women, especially when both people are in similar stages of life. His egalitarian ways are one of the things I like most about him!
Anon
Unless you are certain that you do not want kids and are indifferent to marriage, your time is more valuable than his is. Feminism doesn’t make you easily and naturally fertile into your 50s, nor does it change the fact that there are a lot more single women at age 40 than single men.
Your time is more valuable, period.
Anon
For something casual like a first online date where you’re just feeling out a stranger, you’re just meeting for a drink to see if you like this human being even a little bit. It makes sense to pay for yourself. For me, paying for someone is an act of caring for them, so that comes later in a relationship.
Linda from HR
I agree that ideally yes, the asker should pay. However, I always go prepared to pay my own way, or at least ready to pay for a second part of the date if there is one. I always worry that if I let the guy pay for everything, he might expect certain things to happen, and then feel cheated if things don’t go his way. Whether I like it or not, money is power, and the more someone pays, the more “in charge” they are (or the more in charge they think they are), so by splitting the bill I ensure we’re on even ground so to speak.
But I also agree that having one person cover a cost for both people does make it feel more like a date, you feel like a “unit” with that person, even if it’s just for a night.
IHHtown
Eh, I don’t think it’s the norm, particularly for coffee or drink first dates where the cost is very minimal. I think it makes more sense to split for a full dinner or expensive outing as a first date. To me, if a guy won’t cover $10 worth of drinks on a first date or a $5 coffee, it’s not a good sign regarding how he may treat you in the future (assuming fairly equal or not low income).
But I’m from a large Southern city, so expectations may be different by region. A woman paying on a first date is just not typically done down here (again, by women raised in and living in this area).
Baconpancakes
Can someone send me the first week’s clothing challenge email thing? I signed up on Monday, and asked Kat to send the first week’s email, but no response. BPcorpore t t e at the google mail.
TIA!
Sloan Sabbith
Sent!
Baconpancakes
Thank you!
lsw
Me too? l s w re t te at the same!
Sloan Sabbith
Sent!
Fishie
Derp me three? I never signed up…is it too late?
ellengriswoldisonvacation at the mail with g dot com
tz
sent!
Paging nutella
You posted recently about being fluent in 3-4 languages. Can you share your learning methods and what languages you speak? How do you maintain fluency? I am barely maintaining Spanish fluency and it takes a lot of effort (I don’t speak it at work or with family, so I have to seek out opportunities). Would love to hear how you do it.
Elegant Giraffe
I’m not Nutella (obviously), but my sister is fluent (or at least proficient) in several languages. For one thing, she seems to be naturally good at it – just like some people are naturally good at math or music or… She keeps up with Rosetta Stone and some app on her phone – duolingo, I think? She goes to meet ups for those languages. And, the lucky duck that she is, she travels internationally at least once a year and takes full advantage on those trips. Also, some of her languages overlap – like Spanish and Italian.
French speaker
Not Nutella, but I’m mostly fluent in French and have moderate abilities in Spanish.
For me, it’s about the slow but steady trickle of exposure. I listen to podcasts in French, watch dubbed TV shows in French with English subtitles, attend a weekly conversation class where we discuss current events in French, read the newspaper and books in French, collect idioms and other fun phrases, seek out French conversation Meetups, travel to France, and text a lot with friends (these last two I understand are more of an advantage).
It’s even just keeping a daily calendar with a French phrase that I can glance at. I find it’s not one method but a whole bunch. Hope this helps!
Houda
It’s easier for some backgrounds. I’m Moroccan so I speak Darija (mother tongue), I studied classical Arabic (equivalent of Latin for european languages) so I understand most dialects from North Africa to the Arabian peninsula. I studied French at school and then English in high school.
How I maintain my skills: Darija is my mother tongue so can’t forget, classical Arabic by watching some channels every now and then, French by watching the livestream of France 24 on youtube, and English is my working language.
BTW some channels like France 24 and national geographic have an English, Arabic and French version so even if you struggle on some topics, you can rewatch them in your native language
Biglawanon
Agree it is easier for some backgrounds. I grew up speaking Arabic, Urdu, and a regional language at home. My school was taught in Russian. So I spoke four languages as a little girl. I didn’t learn English until I was a teenager, and it is the hardest for me and my weakest language, unfortunately.
Anonymous
Also not nutella, but I’m fluent in Spanish and Portuguese and proficient in Haitian Creole. I can read French since its similar to Creole, which has come in handy traveling.
I suggest trying to immerse yourself on a regular basis-watching tv, reading a newspaper, listening to music. I regularly listen to music in Creole because that’s my weakest language. I’ll sing along and learn vocab through context clues.
I also make a point to speak these languages whenever I can. People will not be insulted and will appreciate you trying. If I mess it up, I say “thank you for practicing with me!”
nutella
Oh yes, how could I forget music!!! Songs are great not just for exposure but for slang and pronunciation, too.
nutella
Hi!
For starters, I grew up in a home that spoke two languages. I definitely think that you have an ‘ear’ for languages when you learn them at a young age, because languages have just always come easily to me. My parents also enrolled me in night/weekend school for that language, so I had formal schooling with it, too. My grade school offered Spanish from first grade, so I took Spanish all through 1-8 and then again all through high school. My high school had a foreign language requirement (so I continued Spanish) as well as a separate Latin and Ancient Greek requirement. (I didn’t count Latin/Ancient Greek in my fluency, though, because it isn’t really spoken but I can read and write it.) I took AP Spanish as a junior and so my high school created AP Spanish literature for a few of us that had already taken AP Spanish. I took both exams and tested out of the languages requirement in college, but decided to take more Spanish. I studied abroad in Spain and then started to take Italian classes for fun. Growing up bilingual, as well as Spanish from an early age and then Latin made Italian very easy. I would say I’m almost fluent in Italian, but not quite yet, in part because there’s less exposure. I can understand a lot of French that I read (as a tourist), too, but not really write or speak it – again, the Latin base helps. In Brazil and Portugal, I noticed I can understand Portuguese pretty OK too. I used to keep up better with Spanish and my home language with more formal stuff (i.e. newspapers), but now you’d be surprised at how much I keep up with it through FB friends who write in their native language, p0dcasts, subtitles, etc. I also will occasionally read some favorite Spanish lit, but when I started in biglaw my reading for pleasure generally decreased. I also turn on captions and watch Spanish films pretty often, too. I sometimes do duolingo for fun when I am on a conference call, especially with Italian as I have the least exposure to that. When I was single and signed up for anything and everything that interested me, I did a lot of meetups, too. Languages just make sense to me and I think it’s because I spoke two at home from an early age, then learned a third at an early age, and have mostly stayed in languages that build upon each other (Latin-Spanish-Italian).
My husband did not have nearly the same educational opportunities or rigor that I did and grew up in an English-only home, so he has a vague recollection of Spanish 101 nouns and that’s it. We would like to raise our kids to be conversational in my family language as well as Spanish, but it’s definitely a challenge when only one of you speaks it, even though he tries to pick up some words here and there. He recognizes that it has been a huge advantage to me and how crucial those early years are.
OP
Thank you! This is really helpful. I really struggled when trying to add Italian a few years ago— not because Italian was difficult (it came very easily to me because of its similarities with Spanish) but because I kind of had to stop my Spanish practice while learning Italian or I kept confusing the two. I’d like to get to the point where I have flash cards that are one side in Spanish and one side in Italian to reinforce the differences between them, but I’m not there yet.
Love that you spoke two languages at home and were trilingual by middle school. That’s impressive! Also like the reminder to watch movies. I listen to a lot of podcasts and try to attend meetups when I can, but I always forget about movies.
Thanks for sharing all your language learning history and tips!
Blonde Lawyer
For people trying to keep up with Spanish that were fans of Breaking Bad, there is a Spanish version that is awesome.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Met%C3%A1stasis
It’s been awhile but I think that’s the one and I put on the English subtitles while watching it.
Bleak Midwinter Funk
Is anyone in the thick of the late January blahs with me? I’ve blown off all of the habits that I have in place precisely to keep myself from getting to this place (you know, exercising, not mindlessly browsing social media, going to bed on time, etc. etc.) and I just can’t seem to care enough to bust out of it. I know it’s just the grind sinking back in after holidays and snow days and everything, and I’ll be fine and back to normal in a week or two. But right now I’m just not feeling it! How do you ladies get through this?
Anon
It’s hard! It helps me to think that making better choices will actually make me feel better overall, even if in the moment eating vegetables does not seem as appealing as stuffing my face with bread.
Every little bit counts. Doing a 15-min workout video at home is better than nothing (and I’m consistently surprised by how good even 15 minutes makes me feel for the rest of the day).
Citrus and tropical fruits remind me that it’s warm somewhere. I really like making smoothies with frozen mango chunks and orange juice even when it’s cold out.
Getting enough sleep makes everything better. Commit to going to bed 30 or 69 minutes earlier.
Can you book a massage or mani/pedi? I like paying extra attention to self-care during these bleak months. Even if no one sees my pedi but me, it’s worth it!
Good luck!
TO Lawyer
This is really good advice. I’m there too – January is hard.
Bleak Midwinter Funk
This is great advice – thanks Anon! Scheduling a pedi and looking up some 15 minute workouts right now
Anokha
The only way I manage workouts is prepaying for group classes — if I’ve paid for it, I’ll show up because I don’t want to waste money. And If its a group class, I’ll stay for the entire thing out of shame for leaving early.
Anon for this
I’ve recently realized that some people that I have a close relationship with and should be able to be honest with me, just tell me what I want to hear (like something is a good idea, they want to do it) with no intention of actually following through or when the exact opposite is true. I know sometimes that advice is given here when someone has line crossing overbearing parents or something – like just say “yes, mom” but do what you want to do anyway, but I don’t think I argue or become defensive if my friends are just honest with me. Maybe it is a way to avoid being confrontational? If it was just one time I would think they just changed their mind but the most recent thing that happened with a co-worker has left me scratching my head if I need to change something about myself so people will just be honest with me. I’ll give you an example.
My coworker (who, in a way, I supervise) is on medical leave. We had lunch. She told me how much she wants to be back at work, she needs her pay, she’s sick of fighting with the disability company and she’s worried if her work is getting done correctly while she’s out. My job involves relying on work that she has done first so I can’t wait for her to come back. She shared (without me asking) that the only reason she isn’t back yet is she has to do some things that require a sterile environment that can’t be done in a work bathroom but other than that she’s just twiddling her thumbs. This is likely to go on a month or two and she’s at her wits end.
My role is allowed to work remotely, hers is not. I shared that it sounded like the perfect situation for remote work and that the office should be required to offer it as a disability accommodation. She sounded thrilled. Since I rely on her work I’m part of the team that is coordinating with the office manager to see it gets done. I’m also one of the people in the group that reviews accommodation issues at work. I asked her if she’d like me to recommend to the office manager remote work be offered to her. She agreed that would be great. At no time did she express a single concern. Also, she’s the one that suggested lunch to get out of the house so I wasn’t intruding on her leave by having lunch with her.
I tell the office manager and the office manager says she offered it to her weeks ago and she turned it down but she will reach out again since things might be different now. She reaches out again and she again turns it down saying she doesn’t want to mess up her disability payments. Why didn’t she just say that to me? In our conversation she was clear she wanted her regular pay back and wanted to get off her disability payments.
We’ve worked closely together for 6 years now. I’m hurt that she couldn’t just be honest with me that my idea didn’t work for her for some reason. Particularly when she agreed I should recommend her for accommodation to the office manager I can’t fathom why she didn’t say “no, don’t.”
Let’s not derail this with her obligation to get off disability if she can. My question is more about why people aren’t just being honest with me (she’s not the first to do this) rather than just agreeing to what I suggest with zero intention of ever following through. If anyone reading here does that, (just tells people what they want to hear) do you do it to everyone rather than saying no to anyone or do you just do it to people who you think would debate with you or something? I’m trying to be introspective here and see if there is something I should change.
I don’t feel like I’ll get the truth if I just ask her and I don’t think it would be appropriate to ask her. Thanks.
Veronica Mars
Don’t think the worst of your coworker. Maybe she got excited when you mentioned it, and after going home and thinking it over, decided it wasn’t worth risking her benefits. Or maybe when reading the fine print that the manager sent over, realized she wasn’t actually ready to return at that level.
Anonymous
+1. I think you’re overreacting. people change their minds or agree to something in the moment and then decide they don’t want to do it when they think about it more carefully.
Anonymous
This. Sounds like you were positive about it and she got excited but went home and re-thought about it or spoke to someone who raises concerns. For example, if they accomodate by alowing WFH then they may have no obligation to provide a sterile space at work for her medical needs so then she’s permanent working at home.
It’s one thing to chose to work at home because that’s what you want. But knowing that you HAVE to work at home and cannot medically go back with your colleagues? I definitely wouldn’t chose that if I could hold out for an accommodation that would allow me back in the office. I hate WFH and I’m not good at it, I need to be around people to be productive.
I can certainly understand her being wary of taking an arrangement that wouldn’t work for her long term because she spent so long getting her disability payments in place so she wouldn’t want to mess with that unless she knew the back to work plan was feasbile. Also, there may be aspects of her medical care/needs that she was not comfortable discussing with you.
Anonymous
I think you need to recalibrate your definition of honest. She may very well honestly really want to come back to work, which she shared with you, and honestly not be ready yet, which she told office manager.
When I tell a friend “yes I’d love to go skiing” that is true. When she follows up and I have to decline because skiing is expensive, that is also true.
Your post reads as feeling that you are entitled to 100% black and white honesty, but most people’s lives are shades of gray. It’s not something they are doing at you.
Anonymous
People are socialized to avoid being disagreeable and to avoid conflict (which is perceived as the same thing). Idk how I missed the memo on that but I clearly did. It sounds like that’s what’s happening here – your friend just didn’t want to tell you that your idea didn’t work for her.
Another example of this: I’ll say something that I believe is correct but the person I’m talking to knows is wrong, but they won’t correct me. Like, I’ll say, I have to go to the store, a blizzard is coming tonight. But they know that’s wrong, in fact they’re an expert on blizzards and they know 100% that no weather report says there’s a storm coming. But they’ll just sort of smile and nod instead of correcting me. Idk why. If it were me I’d say, you must’ve misremembered, there’s not a blizzard coming, save yourself the trip to the store. But I guess that’s bad?
Anon for this
This is 100% it. I am like you and missed that social conditioning.
Anon
That social conditioning is very real and very insidious. People with daughters take note! (Although I am not sure how we overcome it.)
I posted about this when we were talking about the Aziz Ansari situation (and I am NOT trying to re-start that conversation) but one of my take-aways was that the woman in question was trying to be “nice” and agreeable and avoid conflict. Given how many women spoke up about being in similar situations, I suspect this is very widespread. Perhaps the firsts step in stopping it is identifying it.
Anonymous
I am like you and this drives me CRAZY. I think there’s a middle ground between blunt honesty and total avoidance, and it’s called tact.
Anon for this
All,
Thanks for the replies. I only asked for advice because I’ve noticed this with multiple different people in my life. I only gave one example. I think you are right though. I also think, sometimes, white lies are part of the social contract. A second example was two friends having to cancel at a birthday dinner for lack of a sitter but one saying she’d watch the other’s kid so they didn’t both have to cancel on me and she could reciprocate for a future event. I passed along the kind offer, my friend sounded really excited, but never reached back out to the other friend to make it happen. I’d rather she just tell me she wasn’t comfortable with the idea or realized she really just needed the night home with her kid rather than saying she was going to do it and not follow through.
You are right though. None of these are major and they probably aren’t about me. I just wanted to make sure I wasn’t someone that people felt they couldn’t disagree with.
Anonymous
To your last sentence – I’ve often wondered that about myself too. It’s good to have enough insight to know that maybe you come off a little strident sometimes. Being a better listener is a lifelong challenge. No clue if this applies to you, just speaking from personal experience.
I’ve also been thinking a lot lately about how “no” is a taboo word in our society. I read an article about the Aziz situation, maybe it was recommended here?, that explained that people don’t just say NO to a social invitation. They say things like, maybe next time, and that’s understood to be a refusal. It’s why saying NO is so hard for people – we’re taught that it’s rude and hurtful.
anon
W/r/t attending events- sometimes people genuinely do want to attend, but also genuinely don’t want to for other reasons- child care issues, timing issues, not really wanting to do [event] but still wanting to see friend, or just needing down time. Not say that you do this, but I’ve found that friends will pressure me to go out of I try to offer the real reason, or just dismiss things like needing downtime. (“Oh come on!!!!!!!!! It’ll be funnnnnnnnnnnnnnn I haven’t seen you in foreverrrrrrrrrrrrr.) I’m susceptible to peer pressure and FOMO, just like any of us. I don’t like disappointing my friends. I don’t want to be a sourpuss who no longer gets invited places because I gave off the impression that I’d rather lay in bed and eat a whole jar of green olives than go to some event. Rather than dealing with that or having to be the wet blanket who says “no really I’m just over being around people right now,” it’s simpler to just say something that makes it a hard no. FWIW, I’m notoriously blunt and straightforward and well known for giving people honest opinions and not sugar coating.
Anonymous
This example is a classic example of….. “Oh! Great idea!…” in the moment, but then your friend probably thought about it later and realized it didn’t work for her. Maybe she felt guilty asking the friend. Maybe she felt guilty leaving her kid. Maybe she couldn’t afford the birthday dinner and was embarrassed saying that.
We are not perfect, as humans. I cannot always answer perfectly, in the moment, when someone is staring at me wanting an answer. I tend to say yes a lot, to keep things comfortable/happy/easy in the moment. It is hard for me to say no. That’s me.
If your expectations of people are too high… that they answer perfectly to you all the time… you may also make them a little (fearful?) of answering otherwise. There may be a little of that here, perhaps?
Anonymous
In that scenario, it’s totally not surprised that she’s would avail of the babysitter idea. There’s a million different reasons that she thought it would be great and then realized kid has a fever, or DH doesn’t like idea of friend he doesn’t know sitting, or kids hate new babysitters until they had a daytime playdate first (mine), etc. etc.
Not everything that someone thinks is a great idea in the moment turns into something that works out. That’s just life. Maybe try to hear those comments as ‘Great idea! Will look into it to see if it works.”
Anonymous
I was thinking about this recently. Often, when I say no to something, and give a reason, I don’t want my friends to try to negotiate with me or find a solution. but its really harsh/not socially acceptable to say “no, i’ve made my decision and it is final” so I say “oh thats a good thought, let me look into it” or something similar and just don’t follow through (bc my decision was final at the outset).
Anon
You expect too much of the people in your life. Nobody owes you an explanation for their decisions and you shouldn’t push for one. When things like this happen, build a bridge and get over it, as my dad would say.
lawsuited
So, reading this and your additional information, I think you are the common denominator but not in the way you think. I don’t think people are intentionally misleading you because they’re afraid of confrontation with you (phew!), rather I think you are interpreting positive feedback as definitive decision making. Perhaps you are a definitive, action-oriented person so assume that the decision is made and things are moving forward after one conversation, whereas others are using you as a sounding board and sharing ideas but plan to weigh their options and decide later. Especially because communication is so quick, easy and constant now, a lot of people see decisions or plans as in flux for much longer because we have more ability to change plans on a dime.
Anon for this
Thanks!
Sam
I agree with this. You are taking things to the “problem solving” stage and you shouldn’t be.
Example 1 – when friend discussed disability with you, you went into thinking about possible solutions (WFH?) and then (based on limited head nodding and smiling from her) into suggesting ways to kick this into action. Friend did not want this. She wanted tea and sympathy (I understand! It must be so frustrating being at home!) and not problem solving.
Example 2 – Friend couldnt make it to event, you thought about a solution (babysitting!) and then implementation (shall I ask other friend on your behalf?). Friend did not want this. Decision was final. She wanted only tea and sympathy (“too bad you are missing party, lets grab coffee some other time”).
The common factor is you going into solving problems. Assume that a lot of the time (unless someone actively asks you for help or advice e.g. “what should I do/ how can I make it work / do you have any ideas / can you help me figure out “) you should stay out of it and only sympathize.
Anon
I thought I’d start a thread on today’s challenge, which is different shades of one color. Are any of you doing this?
I dress this way all the time so it’s a no brainer for me. I think I will do shades of blue today since I’m more often in different shades of black or gray or beige.
Not Legal Counsel
I am enjoying the challenge! My friend and I have been texting each other pictures of our challenge outfits (waves at her). I do not usually wear all of one color, so this is a different one for me. The challenge has been stretching me to get out of my current uniform of ankle pants, top, and boyfriend cardigan. I am looking forward to next week’s challenge. I will definitely plan ahead and pick everything out on Sunday this time.
Anon
I accidentally did this earlier this week and unexpectedly loved it. While running out the door I thought I grabbed a gray cardigan but it turned out to be a lavender one. I was wearing a dark purple blouse and a gray skirt and the lavender brightened up the whole thing really nicely but I would never have thought I could pull off wearing different shades of purple together.
Anon
I love lavender with purple. I should look for a lavender cardigan.
Anon
Mine is the Lands End Supima Cotton cardigan in Lavender Pearl Heather.
Ms B
Good rec. Ordering in the other lavender color to perk up all my charcoal pants/skirts/dresses.
Baconpancakes
Today’s is hard for me to contemplate because my winter work wardrobe is almost exclusively black, navy, tan, and green. If I wear a faded black top with new black pants, does that count?
Anon
hahaha
I’m doing the navy thing but wearing a lighter blue blouse, and the navies are slightly different shades, which would have driven me nuts just a few years ago.
Two Cents
I did it today and I love it. Emerald green skirt and green sweater with a bib necklace. Black tights and black shoes though. It’s a lot of green but this color looks really good on me and I feel very put together. I have wanted to do this one in the past but felt that it was too much, but I don’t feel that way today.
I’m really loving these challenges. I’ve decided to put a stop to online shopping for a while now and doing these challenges gives me the motivation to come up with different outfits, like the one today.
Anon
I’ve actually felt the same way. Discovering new Looks in my closet
Anonymous
+
Sloan Sabbith
I love these challenges so far! They’re pushing me to put outfits together in new ways. I don’t have a uniform, but I do tend to wear something every day that’s neutral/neutral or print/pop of color that matches everything. I wear a lot of colored blazer or cardigan/printed shirts/neutral pants or printed or bright pants/neutral top or sweater/neutral blazer.
Today’s challenge outfit is: Purple/ burgundy tweed blazer from BR factory (on sale right now, FYI- I love it), pink split neck short sleeve top from Gap (used to be white and I dyed it pink on accident, but liked it better than I did white….), burgundy skirt, black tights, burgundy Trolley booties from BP. Burgundy and orange beaded choker necklace and dark bronze earrings.
Nerfmobile
Today I am wearing olive pants and cardigan (they are really close to matching, but I didn’t buy them to match) and a sea-foam green sleeveless knit shell. I wouldn’t normally have paired all of these greens together, but it works quite well! I did pass on trying to find green shoes – I have on dark grey suede ballet flats.
Anon
I am having a great time with the challenge! It’s really making me think about what I normally wear (bright or printed blouse, black pants, pop of color cardigan or neutral dress, pop of color cardigan) and how I have fallen into a rut. Today I’m wearing a chocolate brown dress, caramel brown cardigan, leopard print belt & heels, gold hoops and gold necklace. I felt super put together when I left the house – and for someone who normally LOVES color, it’s a nice change to feel good about an all-neutral outfit!
I’ve been doing the challenge with one of my work friends and we text each other photos of our outfits in the morning, although I love sharing them here, too … and reading all of yours. Sloan, I am very inspired by your outfit, it sounds lovely!
Two Cents
I LOVE your outfit! Sounds beautiful.
Senior Attorney
I’m also have a great time! It’s forcing me to mix things up in ways I’m not used to!
Today’s challenge was unexpectedly difficult for me. I could easily do it with blue but I wore a shades-of-blue outfit very recently and didn’t want to repeat this soon. For some reason I don’t have the pieces to do many other colors head to toe so I ended up with foresty/tealy green ankle pants with a slightly darker Tippi sweater and olive green jacket, which sounds weird but looks good. I have a scarf with both colors that ties it together. Pewtery/bronzey heeled loafers and gray leopard-print bag that kind of picks up the feeling of the scarf. Not something I would have ever put together left to my own devices but I think it works!
Anonymous
Loving it. Grey Talbots pants and long sleeved T-shirt, grey short cardigan with a small pattern of other grays, simple pewter-colored necklace, black socks (and big Boots – its snowing again!).
Anon
I am so comfortable today. Matchy is my happy place.
Alanna of Trebond
I am really pleased about today’s challenge. I wore a blush pantsuit with a pink blouse and a brighter pink versace-type scarf.
Sicky
I have a fairly severe case of the flu, but I work in BigLaw and have a couple projects I need to power through today (working from home). What are your tips for working through the misery and actually being able to focus/think coherently?
Anonymous
Rest. The flu is no joke and if you have a ‘severe’ case, your body needs sleep and rest to heal. Let people know you’re seriously ill and your firm will find a way to get your projects done. Big Law associates have died because they couldn’t say no to work – you need to look out for your own health first and foremost.
Anon
DayQuil Severe. And then rest. You’ve heard that this is the deadliest flu in years and that perfectly healthy people have been dying from the flu without warning, right?
Sicky
I actually hadn’t heard that. Good to know.
Anonymous
I agree OP should rest, but a lot of the worry about this years flu is due to media sensationalism. Many healthy people die from the flu every year and the season has come pretty early this year but that doesn’t mean the flu is actually deadlier or more people will be dead total at the end of the season. And even the articles that sensationalize this with quotes about “the deadliest flu season in years” all acknowledge that it is the deadliest so far since….2014-15. For something that happens every year, being the deadliest in three years is not terribly significant. This is not a once-in-a-generation flu.
Scarlett
You don’t. You go to bed and sleep and get better. Powering through will only make you sicker longer. I have never pushed through when sick (even in my big law days) and never suffered career-wise for it. You are the only person who will care about you and you need to do that. Glad you’re at least home and not infecting others, so now take care of you.
Anon
Rest. Stop working. Your health comes before projects and you actually will become sicker if you don’t insist on taking the time you need.
SC
I agree with Anonymous@10:12, but if you insist on working, drink tons of water. If you don’t feel like eating, drink juice or Gatorade or something that will keep you hydrated and give you a few calories.
Of Counsel
If you actually have influenza (fever, chills, body aching, etc.) and not just a bad cold, you need to rest. My suggestions would be to be specific in telling your supervisor your symptoms (e.g. “I have a fever of 102 and can hardly move”) and take the time off. This year’s influenza virus is not a joke and frankly your ability to concentrate is shot past the point where you should be billing your time. This virtually guarantees mistakes. Unless it is due to the court today (in which case someone from your office should either handle or ask for an extension), this is one of those times you just say “I cannot work”.
If by “flu” you mean you have a generalized whole body illness but without the high fever, etc., drink a lot of hot, non caffeinated tea with lemon and honey, max out on the prescribed dose of whatever you can take that does not put you to sleep and treats your symptoms and do the absolute minimum that has to be done today.
Sloan Sabbith
I agree with everyone else. Rest. If you have influenza, it’s also dehydrating. Focus on pushing Gatorade or Pedialyte, sleeping, and getting better. Think of it this way: if you have the severe flu now and don’t let your body do its thing and heal, the next stop will be the ER or even admitted to the hospital. That will seriously impact your ability to work.
Also, call your doctor and ask for Tamiflu. They may make you come in for a flu swab, but it is so worth it, it shortens the duration significantly.
You’ll still be contagious for a week after your last fever, so…plan to work from home.
Sicky
I started Tamiflu last night, as I have a complicating factor that makes the flu more dangerous for me (and I have a textbook case of influenza). I told the partner I needed some help or some time. I’m going to do the minimum I need to do and rest.
Thanks for the feedback, all.
Sloan Sabbith
I also have a complicating factor that makes it more dangerous, so I’m glad to hear you’re taking it seriously. Do the minimum you need to do, take time until you’re feeling better. I didn’t leave my apartment for a week (this week, actually…) last year I was so sick.
Anonymous
Do not try to power through and work. If you do, your colleagues will think you are fine and expect you to be performing at 100%. You will get no appreciation for your heroic efforts to keep working through the flu, only criticism for not working more.
Anon
THIS. Tell the people above you what is going on and they can find more resources. I “powered through” at trial a few months ago because I thought I had to (partially based on advice here), even though I had a 104+ fever and severe bronchitis. Turned to pneumonia, I ended up passing out and getting a severe concussion, and I ended up hospitalized for weeks. This was NOT expected of me-the senior attorneys were absolutely horrified I powered through when I was legitimately ill and I basically had to promise to never do that again.
Anonymous
I “powered through” in the fall on a day with deadlines when I was similarly ill. Since then, I’ve traced a few mistakes (nothing major, but could have been avoided) to that exact day.
Blonde Lawyer
Three weeks ago, I had what the doc thought was the flu but tested negative. I’m still not sure that test was accurate. What I did was log onto my computer just long enough to delegate. I have a lot of my own cases though so it’s not the usual partner/associate situation. I emailed opposing counsel for mediation/depositions that would have to be rescheduled and cc’d an assistant. I asked her to follow up and make sure the messages were received. I got another associate to finalize a complaint that was on the statute of limitation and make sure it was signed and delivered to the court on time. Luckily I had written it already and was just waiting on client changes. I asked a partner to re-assign something that involved court in a few days because I wasn’t likely going to be back by then and I hadn’t started working on it anyway so there was no double billing concern.
I then went back to bed. I checked my email maybe twice throughout the day, forwarding anything that needed attention to someone else. I also had an out of office up that I was out sick and not checking email.
It is the first time I’ve been out and really unable to work from home. Honestly, I could barely shower. You need to take care of yourself! When I came back, there was no push back at all and in fact, people were asking if I was sure I was ready to be back and if I wanted to do a day or two from home first. Including the weekend, that I was hoping to work to catch up but couldn’t, I was out five days.
Sloan Sabbith
What are the things you do to make your morning better? Not necessarily easier, but better. For me, it’s getting up at 6 so I have time to do what I need to do without a huge rush. I make my bed, make my macchiato and breakfast, sit down and read while I eat (fiction usually), and I’ve added five minutes of Headspace meditation that I really like. I also do a Two Minute Morning journal entry in Day One. I also take my dog for as long of a walk as we can.
I find that all of this sets me up for a better day- if I have a rushed, late, stressful morning I’ll gave a rushed, late, stressful day.
Anonymous
One of my alarms is the song 9 to 5 which makes me happy.
I ease into things by reading on on my phone in bed for a bit – insta, Reddit, blogs.
I prep as much as possible the night before – outfit, bag, lunch – so I’m not rushed.
Pompom
Similar here. Alarms (I have two…three if you count the sunrise with radio clock alarm…I’m uh not a morning person…) are to Paul Simon’s Obvious Child and the Karate Kid song. Ease into my morning with a quick check of social media in bed for a few minutes. Basically don’t plan to think about anything all morning because taken care of night before.
Anonymous
I have 5 alarms that go off from 6:45 to 7:45. I have problems.
Pompom
You have solutions, my dear fellow non-morning person!
Sloan Sabbith
I have four. Fitbit at 5:55, Alexa at 6, Alarmy af 6:03 that makes me scan the barcode of the vanilla syrup I put in my coffee, phone at 6:05 just in case.
BeenThatGuy
I have always been a person that has needed/wanted more sleep. So I push that envelope in the morning. In order to not feel stressed, I prep everything I need the night before. My outfit is picked out (down to the undergarments/shoes) and ironed if needed. My coffee cup is sitting under my Keurig ready for the button to be hit. My gym bag is packed, and at the door, or already in my car. My son’s lunch is packed and book-bag is at the door. His clothes are picked out too. I’ll even go as far as putting out plates/bowls and any non-perishable items that we are using for breakfast. Coats and such are also ready at the door waiting to run out.
It might seem like overkill in order to sleep an extra 15 minutes but this is what works for me.
Anonymous
+1 Idk what is it about mornings, but I move so. slowly. Getting packed takes much less time at night.
NOLA
That’s what I’ve done, too. I get to work at 8 and it takes me about 10 min to get there, but I realized that I am not a rush-around in the morning kind of person. I need some time to chill. I set my alarm for 5:50 to give myself 10 minutes to look at mostly mindless stuff on my phone (I turn off notifications at night, so sometimes there is something that was sent after I went to sleep), then I make sure I actually get up at 6 or shortly after. It takes me about 30 minutes to shower and do my hair and makeup, then I get breakfast for me and kitties and coffee for me (they’re too young to drink coffee), and usually take my coffee back to my bedroom to watch a little TV, chat with a friend online, or just look at stuff on the internet and chill until I have to get dressed and leave.
Anonymous
My alarm goes off 45 minutes before I actually need to get up, and it’s Morning Edition on my local NPR station. If I’m really tired I sleep through the talking, and get the extra rest; if the news is depressing I get up and work out; and otherwise I just lie there and relax and learn about all sorts of things. This morning I learned that Ursula LeGuin had stopped writing fiction a decade ago and was writing lots of poetry instead!
Pompom
Same radio here–I woke up this morning and learned about permafrost!
Anonymous
Icebergs in the perma frost!
Sloan Sabbith
That was such a cool story, the grass!
Anonymous
Yeah, I loved the astonishment in the reporter’s voice when she saw the grass was green!
Baconpancakes
For everyone who gets up earlier to have a better morning routine, how do you negotiate having a sleeping partner? My SO doesn’t go into work until 9:30, and he has a very stereotypical dude’s 10 minute morning routine, so he’ll usually wake up half an hour after I leave. When my alarm goes off, it disrupts his sleep, and although he tells me it’s no big deal, I know he generally doesn’t sleep well and I feel guilty disrupting the sleep he does get. I already lay out my clothes in the bathroom the night before, but frequently realize the weather calls for different shoes or I forgot to grab my watch, so I sneak back into the bedroom, disturbing him further. It seems like any solution I come up with is suboptimal for one of us.
jwalk
In the past, my SO and I just tried to minimize disruption and accepted the fact that he’s a night owl, I’m a… not quite early bird, just normal? sleeper, so he was going to disrupt me at night and I was going to disrupt him in the morning. That’s just how it is.
Recently, though, we started working out together in the mornings, and it gets us up together and we do most of our morning routine together now. It’s really nice and has gotten us on the same sleep schedule for one of only a handful of times in almost ten years!
Torin
My alarm is on my phone. It’s set to vibrate and I put it under my pillow by the edge furthest away from him. I think the action of me getting up still wakes him up a little, but he’s not actually hearing an alarm.
Sloan Sabbith
Fitbit alarm on your wrist if that gets you up. It only vaguely starts to wake me up, sort of, but other people who are not dead-asleep may have different experiences.
Gail the Goldfish
If you’ve got the space, separate bedrooms. People find this somewhat odd, but I really, really love sleep and SO and I are both light sleepers and he snores. So separate bedrooms and it’s awesome.
Baconpancakes
We’ve talked about it, but he’s against it as “unromantic,” and I love having a little bit of cuddle as we’re falling asleep or early in the morning. And it admittedly doesn’t work with our LGP schedule. Eventually we’re going to try a king-sized bed with separate duvets, but there isn’t enough space right now. I also really love sleep, but I’m a deep enough sleeper that I’m mostly worried about him getting enough sleep.
APP123
You should do separate duvets even in a non-king bed. Separate bedding was a 100% game changer for my husband & me. That and a noise machine–now we very rarely disturb one another when we are on different schedules. He goes to bed much later than me most nights, and I often don’t hear him come in at all, or if I do, I am able to go right back to sleep.
My version
I finally trained myself to get up at 4:35 or 5:00 AM (depends on the day) to exercise. I then prepare breakfast, pack lunches, unload the dishwasher. The whole eating breakfast together thing is important to my husband but now that I get up earlier, I actually enjoy sitting with him and our daughter for 10-15 minutes before showering and dressing for work.
CPA Lady
I don’t do anything fun or relaxing in the morning, typically, but what I’ve found helps is having a routine and leaving the house looking the way I want to see it when I return home from work (made bed, clean kitchen).
I shower every other morning, and this is how my routine goes:
-(shower if I’m going to, leave hair in towel, get semi-dressed)
– put my phone in my purse, and don’t take it out til I’m at work
– unload dishwasher. the sound of that typically wakes up my 3 year old
– make smoothie for us (she eats breakfast at daycare)
– put smoothie blender and any stragglers from last night into now empty dishwasher
– fix myself a tumbler of iced coffee
– get kid dressed, including shoes, park her in front of the TV for the next 10-15 minutes while she finishes her smoothie
– make bed
– get self rest of the way dressed, put on makeup, (blow dry hair if necessary)
– collect coffee and purse and child and leave for work/daycare
This whole process takes about an hour. I typically wake up at 6:45 and leave the house at 7:45.
The non negotiable items are unloading the dishwasher, making my bed, and getting my kid ready before I get myself ready. That way if I’m dawdling with my makeup or whatever, I only have myself to blame for being late getting out the door and I don’t do any unnecessary or unfair yelling at her to hurry up.
CPA Lady
My husband travels a ton for work, so he’s frequently not here. If he’s here he usually takes over getting kid ready.
Senior Attorney
Lovely Husband and I play Jeopardy! with Alexa every morning over breakfast. It injects some fun into our morning routine!
Jo March
For me, it’s been having breakfast as soon as I wake up. If I wait until after I’m ready, it’s easy to hit snooze and then skip breakfast that morning in order to get to work on time. Having breakfast first thing makes me wake up at the same time on a daily basis and make sure that I’m leaving enough time to get fully ready by the time I need to leave.
I am also in the process of reorganizing my closet/accessories so that they are easier to get to in the morning. What’s the point of having multiple beautiful blazers and scarves if I don’t get the fun of wearing them more often?
Anonymous
+1 I now wash my face, etc. and then have breakfast. It’s been a total game changer to move it up to the beginning of my morning routine.
Grumpy post baby
Post baby my partner is detatched and grumpy. We both really wanted to have the baby and were so happy and loving before so I’m very confused and as a result getting more and more stressed and depressed. He snaps a lot so makes starting a conversation difficult especially as I’ve started to be super emotional because of it. Is there such a thing as PPD for the non-birthing partner?
Anonymous
Men can definitely have PPD. Encourage him to talk to someone.
Anonymous
Absolutely, https://www.parents.com/parenting/dads/sad-dads/
Anonymous
Yes men can have PPD. But how old is the baby? It could just be sleep deprivation and/or the realization that babies are a lot harder than they imagined. A new baby is hard on even the best of marriages. I found that it took 4-6 months for things to shake out. We definitely argued more than we did before, but it was mostly due to exhaustion.
Biglawanon
Yeah, this. Sleep deprivation is terrible.
Anon
How old is the baby? Are you on maternity leave? How do you handle night feedings? Are you gardening again? If so, how has it changed?
Be patient
I tell people that my husband was generally annoyed with me the first year of our daughter’s life. We had been married nine years when she was born and although he was on board with having a child, it significantly changed our lifestyle and drew much of my attention away from him. He was not an infant person while I was really blissed out with our long awaited baby. (i.e. “She doesn’t do anything.”) The second she started smiling at him, talking to him, running after him, etc, he was totally on board. Fifteen years later, he is a huge part of her life and her go to person for many things.
Try to be patient. Having a baby is a huge lifestyle change for sure!
OP
Prior to baby–who is 14 months old–we gardened a few times a week. Postpartum, waited until week 6/7 and only twice. Then about month three we tried again, it was o-kay. But the grumpiness had started around 9/10 weeks. Baby is a dream–sleeps well, cries only when the diaper MUST be changed. Plays well alone & with others.
Myself, while I had experienced bouts of depression when younger, didn’t have ppd. I tried to keep positive and nurturing to both the baby and partner in the last year, but partner is just getting more and more withdrawn.
cbackson
I have a close friend whose husband had severe PPD. Part of it was just the life change, and part was related to the fact that as the sole support of the family (my friend is a SAHM), he was even further locked into a much-hated job. It got really bad before he got help, but they’re on the other side now and he’s a good father and an even-better partner to my friend than he was pre-marriage. Counseling and meds helped; he’s off medication now but he will have a check-in with a therapist about every 6 weeks for another 6 months or so.
Wayfair Returns?
I’m THISCLOSE to buying a rug on Wayfair. I’m usually a “must see, must touch” before buying person, but I did get a small 3×3 carpet sample and I’m feeling it.
Does anyone have experience returning a rug to them? I’d be buying a 7.5 x 9.5 rug, so it’s not small. Free shipping to me, but shipping it back could be tricky and/or expensive. Anyone have a clue as to what the return shipping might run? I know. How could anyone.. I think I just need to trust my gut and pull the trigger.
FWIW, this is it, for a nursery. Sample is a bit more bold than the colors on the s!te show, which I was pleasantly surprised to see.
https://www.wayfair.com/rugs/pdp/world-menagerie-maastricht-bluered-area-rug-wdmg5737.html?piid=19346629
AnonZ
Sadly I do not have any experience returning rugs to them, but I have purchased two large rugs from them and love them! They are bright and cheerful. If you like the 3×3 sample I think you should go for it.
Anon
Really pretty. I don’t like most rugs people post but I really like this one and would be stealing your idea if I were in the market for another rug.
Senior Attorney
OMG love! Do it!
Anon
Oh good! That’s the validation I needed ;) Purchase made! Thanks, all.
Ruganon
I purchased a rug on wayfair and, fortunately, loved it. However, had I not loved it it would have been impossible to return because it was shipped rolled up into a plastic sleeve, not a box. Had to tear open the plastic sleeve to get it out, so I have no idea how I could have returned it.
Micromanagers Anon
Good morning, hive. Any former micromanagers been called out and found ways to let the little stuff go? A colleague on a (non-job-related) staff committee let me know by email that “a lot of your comments come off as controlling”. I searched my (hurt) feelings and I know it to be true. Seeking advice to be a better colleague. Telling myself to “let it go” is helpful, but looking for before-and-after success stories of loosening up and practical advice on how to not sweat the small stuff.
Flats Only
Try to remember that “there’s more than one way to skin a cat”. I wish my manager realized this. Instead she wastes oodles of her executive time directing me what to do/say/write in minute, step by step detail, for tasks I am already an expert at.
AnonZ
When I feel the urge to offer very specific feedback, my mantra in my head is, “You hired them for a reason.” For colleagues who you don’t manage, you could change it to, “They were hired for a reason.”
I use this mantra to remind myself of several things:
– I have a team of people because it is unrealistic and infeasible for me to do all the work myself. For our team to be as efficient and productive as possible, I cannot be involved in every detail.
– I believe that my team members are generally smart and capable people, and I need to trust that they will do things well, even if it is not exactly how I would do them. (If, for some reason, my trust in them has deteriorated to a point that I no longer think this, that is a much larger issue than whatever thing I’m nitpicking about.)
– I believe I have good team members and want them to be happy and satisfied with their work. I ask myself, what is more important? To have a team member who feels trusted and capable of working independently, or whatever feedback I’m about to send?
Sometimes I think through all these things and decide that I still need to say something/offer feedback/make a correction. But this filter has eliminated about 75% of the nitpicky feedback I give, and also taught me things like, oh, the world doesn’t end if we send out an internal document in a font I don’t like.
Senior Attorney
Years ago when I was twisting and turning over some decisions (it had to do with remodeling my house), my therapist said “whatever you decide will be right.” And it turns out that’s true in most situations.
Can you tell yourself this about your team? “Whatever they decided will be right.”
I repeat this to myself a lot in all kinds of contexts and it’s brought me a lot of peace over the years.
Sloan Sabbith
One thing I think has helped out supervisors/others who have this is “Do I want this person to become better or do I want them to turn into me?” Usually, you want people you work with to grow and develop and have a positive working relationship; they likely want the same for you and the same relationship with you. One way to do this is to trust them- empower them with the skills and knowledge to do what’s required, and then let them do it. They’ll make mistakes, and that’s fine. It may not be the exact way you want it to, but either a) it isn’t that big of a deal or b) they’ll do better next time. There are very few things where not doing it the exact same way as you would like will be a disaster (I say this as someone who can also be micro-manage-y…) and the things where it will be a disaster will likely have oversight to catch those issues.
Micromanagers Anon
Thank you, everyone, for the practical advice! I’m printing these suggestions and keeping them by my computer the next time I get the urge to micromanage.
Anonymous
Long story – many years ago (12?) DH and I agreed that if/when there were kids, he be a stay home dad for the first 5-6 yrs. I was a junior associate at the time, really wanting to pursue partnership and knew that’d be impossible if I could travel, had to stay home for school holidays etc. He gladly agreed in large part bc he wasn’t tied to his job at all. Plan was after the kids were in school f/t, we’d get a nanny so he’d be able to go back to work plus I’d be more helpful (which I am bc I control my schedule more now).
Fast forward 10 yrs, he’s STILL home. Every time I’ve gently brought it up in the last 2-3 yrs, it’s always – kids are so young, maybe in 6 months. Thing is kids are 4th grade and older now – out of the house all day, often 1-2 hrs of soccer after school, they don’t want to (and don’t) sit home with him all summer as they want to go to some camps with friends etc.
So we had a long talk last night and he says — well I don’t want to deal with bosses, deadlines and the BS of work. Um?? Bc I solely WANT to deal with bosses, deadlines, the mortgage, all retirement and college savings etc?? His argument is it doesn’t matter bc whatever he’d make is a drop in the bucket compared to my salary. But how is it my fault that he had 10 yrs post college where he was working jobs but not establishing any kind of career? He was working in the hotel space (a good business in the touristy LA area) but honestly didn’t want to hustle, work weekends, switch jobs etc — which is what you do when you’re young in that industry if you ultimately want to be a GM in your 30s-40s. I was/am livid. What would you say? We’ll be discussing it again – tabled it last night so as not to say anything we’d regret.
Anonymous
You’re livid? This is what you signed up for. When you make the massive sacrifice of agreeing with your partner to leave the workforce to care for your children, it’s hard to get back in. You’re bringing up now his “failures” before you had kids? You knew that going into this and we’re happy to get the upside of a house husband.
Sure. Discuss it. Keep talking. I agree with you, it may be time for him to start getting back to a job. But you’ve got a ton of resentment and entitlement going on and that won’t help the situation.
Anonymous
To clarify – I’m not livid about how hard it is to get back in. If he’s out there applying/networking and it takes 3 yrs or he never gets back in — I will understand that bc as you say, it’s really really hard to re enter. I’m livid that he doesn’t think he has to try bc he doesn’t want to deal with work BS and I can handle it financially. Why is it ok for one partner to never deal with work BS while the other deals with all of it? When the kids were babies, he was working HARD. Now -eh? They’re gone almost 8 hours a day – he naps, games, and watches movies/sports all day.
Anonymous
Because when you decide to marry someone getting up on your high livid horse isn’t a legitimate way to solve a problem. It’s not the underlying desire that is problematic it’s your attitude about it.
Anonymous
Come on?? All you ladies are picking on the OP but would you be thrilled if your DH was watching TV 40 hrs a week while you were headed to Louisville to take your 900th depo? It’s about fairness to each other – one person carrying all the load while the other chills? Not in my home.
Anonymous
Not at all! But she wants to stay married right? Just yelling won’t help!
Anonymous
Honestly this would infuriate me so much I would be going to couples therapy.
Everyone would love to stay home and watch TV all day but that’s not how life works.
anon
I’d like to challenge the idea that OP’s husband is watching TV 40 hours a week. OP didn’t say that’s what he’s doing. I was unemployed for 6 months with a child in daycare full-time, and I worked really hard. There’s a lot of advice on this board to “outsource” the stuff that SAH spouses do–cooking, cleaning, shopping, errands, yard work, fixing stuff around the house. FWIW, it wasn’t for me, and I am happy to be back at work–but I relax much more now than I did when I was home.
Anon
The OP is entitled to her emotions and you don’t get to police them.
What no one is entitled to do is to act out on their emotions in any way they choose, regardless of the consequences.
OP, I think you ought to communicate that getting out of bed every single day and going to work is tough. Also communicate that it’s about *effort* and not results.
If this were me, I would talk about how rotten women were made to feel when they didn’t earn as much as their husbands, and I would never do that to a man. So even if he’s earning a tenth of what you earn, he’s out there working and it’s a valuable contribution to the household that is respected just as much as a six-figure job.
But just letting you be the *only* one who shoulders the burden of work is not fair.
Anonymous
Omg. No one is policing her.
Anonymous
Yes, what happened above with the first comment was absolutely policing. I’m getting pretty sick of the little game some people seem to get playing on the board, where seemingly the first person to jump in with a sn0tty or sn@rky comment wins some kind of emotional prize. It’s gotten really bad lately.
Anonymous
The first comment was substantive and full of legitimate advice.
Anon
Yes I agree with anonymous at 12:07. I have seen it a lot lately – kind of a mean girl gang. One person is out of the gate with a mean, judgmental comment and then a bunch of others take up the same theme. It happened to me when I sincerely asked for advice recently and I really felt kicked when I was already down.
Anon
The response to the OP was definitely mean girl, as is your own comment for being upset that someone pointed it out.
AnonNone
You say it’s not your fault he didn’t hustle those ten years between college and kids and it’s not. BUT, had he hustled, he still would have been out of the workforce for 5-6 years per your agreement, so he wouldn’t be a GM anyway. And my guess is that as hard s it is for SAH mothers to get back into a career, it’s as hard if not more so, for men, because of cultural expectations.
So maybe reframe it to see if there is something he would like to do, some new career (coding, nursing, etc.) that he can retrain for, so he isn’t just taking whatever comes his way.
And be kind to each other. You made this decision for him to stay home together, for the benefit of your career, so don’t dump all over him now that you’re feeling the pressure financially.
Anonymous
Right. Talk sensibly about it. Why is it a problem? Do you have financial goals you have agreed to you aren’t meeting? Do you want a backup in case you lose your job? Do you want him to have an interest outside the home? All of this is totally valid, but you need to think it through calmly and rationally.
Tetra
+1. I have friends in a similar situation, though their kid is still a toddler. Wife is in biglaw, Husband was in the restaurant industry and quit to take care of the baby, and now is going back to school to become a teacher.
Anonymous
Right. Because when your rich wife can pay all the bills, you really going to work nights at a hotel check in counter? Really?
Anonymous
+1. Is he only thinking about hoteling? Because that may be daunting to him, as it’s on your feet kind of work and he may be thinking that at 40 he’d be starting over and he can’t keep up with the 24 year olds. Make sure he realizes that you care that he does something but you don’t care if it’s the prior industry or something new.
anon
Oh my god. This would drive me insane. Don’t want to deal with BS because of work? Grow up. None of us do.
He needs to think about 1) what would happen if you don’t always have your high paying job, which could happen for dozens of reasons; 2) whether he intends to do nothing for the rest of his life, and how that will affect his mental health and happiness; 3) why he assumes he will never ever make a significant amount of money; 4) why he assumes you should take on all the burden of working BS to support his lazy @ss.
Is he not bored? Restless? He’s in a lucky position of being able to pursue something he might actually be interested in if you make a salary that is more than enough. He should consider himself lucky and reframe this not as a question of being forced to go back to any old job he doesn’t care about, but rather as an opportunity to engage in his life and provide for his family.
Anonymous
This.
Never too many shoes...
Completely agree to all of the above.
I feel you, OP. I would be really irritated by this.
Anonymous
OP – Differing viewpoints on a major issue like would be a good situation to have a mediator/counselor who’s professional trained. You may not be getting the feedback you’d want from a forum of folks who have only their personal experiences, however well-intended they may be, to offer.
IHHtown
I think being livid is a reasonable response. Yes, you all decided to have him stay at home the first 5 to 6 yrs, but he broke that agreement four years ago, and now the main excuse is, let’s be honest, in summary he is too lazy to go back to work.
Even still, it might help to discuss with him what he wants to do, and help him think through the steps to achieve that, and a timeline for pursuing certain actions for that goal.
Anon
I totally sympathize with how you are feeling and it is completely ok that you don’t want to be the sole breadwinner any more.
My husband stayed home for 3 years not because of a pre-planned agreement but because he lost his job in a recession and it wasn’t that easy to find another. By the time our youngest started preschool I wanted him to find a job and start working again. I really had to push him to do it, but once he did it was good for both of us. He still complains about work (probably more than the average desk jockey) but he also feels better to be contributing financially and to have a career he is proud of. It’s not a drop in the bucket, it is 1/4 of what I make, but it makes a difference to the family budget.
We all get to decide what our deal breakers are, and if this is yours, that’s your decision. Unfortunately you are going to be in the position of paying alimony if you break up, of course not to mention how difficult that would be on all of you, so do keep working with him to get him job hunting. If you still have a loving relationship, listen to his insecurities about finding a job, but don’t back down on what you need too. This is important to you, and that counts too.
Anonymous
Sounds like laziness honestly but there could be some male ego in there as well. Having no professional career to go back to, he may be thinking — I’m going to be bringing in 45k while she brings in $1mil or 500k or whatever — and her job will always be the important one — no thanks, I’d rather play my video games.
Anon
+1
Not that it makes his behavior acceptable. At all.
Torin
I both get it, and wonder a bit about how you’re phrasing the thing you’re mad about. It doesn’t sound like you’re upset about him not pulling his weight financially so much as having a less stressful life than you do. I don’t think wanting him to also deal with stress is really the right way to frame this. It might feel unfair to you, but it’s also not a helpful way to frame the problem here, which, as I see it, is that you feel the distribution of work in the marriage is unfair (which it does sound like it is).
Anonymous
I was on your side until I got to this – “he had 10 yrs post college where he was working jobs but not establishing any kind of career? He was working in the hotel space (a good business in the touristy LA area) but honestly didn’t want to hustle, work weekends, switch jobs etc”
It sounds like he approaches work as a job, not a career. I’d encourage you to consider what you’re expecting from him and whether that’s reasonable for him. Do you want him to have a PT job working the front desk at a hotel? Great. But it sounds like you’re expecting him to want to have a Successful Career – like being a GM of a hotel – and that’s just not who he is. You both need to find a middle ground here – he needs to stop thinking that he’s entitled to sit around doing nothing, and you need to stop thinking that after years out of the work force he’s suddenly going to ramp up to having the kind of position he never wanted even when he was still working.
Betty
I will have to say that you and he should think about what job he goes back to.
Starting over at a hotel will have TERRIBLE hours. Lots of nights, weekends, and holidays. Do you really want that?
My husband switched to a medical specialty that he really loves (and is very well paying) but he now has to take in hospital call all the time. We talked a lot about this before he took the job and but I am surprised by just how much I seriously hate his hours.
They make holiday travel impossible to see family (because even if he’s off the day of the holiday lots of time he will have to work the day before and/or the day after.)
If his career profession was in say teaching, I think this could be a very different conversation.
I'd be completely annoyed
I understand how you feel and will go as far as to say parts of it would have annoyed me even when the children were very young. I work with a woman who says that her husband works from home but it does not sound like there is any real work. (i.e. she does not know what a 1099 or estimated tax payments are) Fwiw, she seems extremely resentful.
Could your husband teach an online course or get a master’s degree that qualifies him to become a school teacher? That way, he would have summers off and a similar schedule to your children’s. I feel like you two will be able to reach a compromise that does not involve his former industry but helps take some of the financial burden off you.
Anon
FWIW, plenty of people work (either full- or part-time) from home and don’t have to deal with 1099s or estimated tax payments. My husband worked as a programmer part-time from home for a while and even though he was paid based on the number of hours he spent on project, he was a W-2 employee and his tax situation was no different than mine (I work full-time in an office).
Anon
I know 4th graders are much more hands-off than babies or preschoolers, but there’s still a lot of value in him being a SAHD right? You say you’d planned to hire a nanny when he went back to work full-time. I’m guessing the nanny’s salary (especially if you pay on the books) would be comparable to what he would earn in an entry-level job in the hospitality industry. To say nothing of the intangible value of having a parent who is around a lot and can be there for the kids – a lot of moms here and on the moms s!te have expressed the feeling that their elementary school and older kids actually need their parents as much or more than they did when they were younger, just in different ways. I understand your frustration that he has 40 hours or so per week to watch TV, etc. when the kids are at school, but I also think you need to think about the benefits he provides to the family and the costs of replacing him.
I agree you should talk about what he might like to do as a career and be supportive of him going back to get more education if necessary. It sounds like he isn’t interested in what he was doing before, and that’s fair, but it also doesn’t mean he gets to opt out of the workforce forever.
Anonymous
Y’all need couples therapy. In my experience, it’s the only way to get past an impassable marital issue. My husband and I are pretty solid but when we run into things we can’t discuss reasonably together and get to a consensus, we take it to our couples therapist.
Anonymous
One of the reasons I work is that my husband feels the same way about SAHMs that you feel about SAHDs–they are lazy parasites. My staying home would destroy our marriage.
That said, I think your expectations may be out of line here. It sounds as if you are a partner in a law firm and earning a gazillion dollars. You actually need your husband to be home with the kids, even if the youngest is in fourth grade. My kids actually need me at home more now that they are older and need to be chauffeured all over, helped with math homework, and talked through tween dramas. If your husband returns to his previous line of work, he won’t be there to pick up the slack when you have to work late or on the weekend. You will need to spend a ton of money on backup child care and will be constantly stressed.
If you just resent the fact that he has free time from 8:00 to 3:00 every day, then there needs to be a discussion of how he’s spending that time. It is reasonable to expect that he is volunteering at the school, getting all the housework done, paying the bills, planning and cooking meals, etc., not sitting around playing video games. If he’s truly doing all of that, I have a hard time imagining that he’s got a lot of downtime during the day.
anon
+1 to the second paragraph, especially.
I don’t see huge benefit to him returning to be a front desk clerk at a hotel if that requires him to give up actual contributions to your household that facilitate you working partner hours. Financially it doesn’t make sense and I can’t see that improving anyone’s morale.
Lana Del Raygun
Yes, this! My mother was a SAHM and she was ALWAYS busy.
Flats Only
This second paragraph is brilliant. When DH and I have been unemployed for various stretches whoever is not working takes over all that household grunt work, and it’s amazing how much less stressful working is when you know you’re coming home to a clean house and a hot dinner on the table.
Anonymous
Op here – thanks all. I don’t have any opinions re him returning to hoteling. If he wanted to, I’d support that. If he didn’t because nights/holidays aren’t for him, that’s fine too.
Not sure where anyone is getting the idea that he’s cooking and cleaning all day. We have a cleaning lady. He does feed the kids but it’s take out/Whole Foods prepped food 5 days/wk. On weekends, I’ll cook. He literally is sleeping and gaming most weekdays with a ton of movies thrown in.
Anon
I’d have dumped his lazy a55 a long time ago. You are a far more patient person that i am!
Pretty Primadonna
This right here.
Anon
Yup. DTMFA.
Anonymous
Oh well that changes this a lot for me. But before you blow it up call a lawyer and see what you’re going to owe in alimony
Anon
+1 He’s the smart one in this relationship
Anonymous
I think the idea is that he ought to be cooking and cleaning all day and handling all the stuff with the kids, and if he isn’t then he should be pushed to do that stuff rather than getting a dead-end job. Being a SAHD/SAHM is a full-time job and should be treated as such.
Biglawanon
Yeah, this.
Betty
I think that is your conversation then.
I’d frame it more as talking about his contributions to the household overall than having a career.
I think it’s very fair to expect him to contribute more to the family overall either through paid work or unpaid work.
Both couples should be doing their part in terms of proving for the family monetary and physical well-being.
I think adding in comments like what sort of work he did ten years ago is not helpful and will just serve to distract the conversation from your very valid point.
I am a big believer in couples therapy and would suggest it here. It’s really helped my marriage.
anon
I commented above, pushing back on the idea that your husband is doing nothing all day. With this information, I wonder if he’s depressed. You say he sleeps and games most of the day, and he feels like going back to work is pointless. I’d say your anger is justified, but there may be deeper issues than him being lazy.
anon
That’s what I immediately thought. Sometimes depression/inertia can creep up and then reinforce each other.
Was he always this way? It doesn’t seem like he was ever as career oriented as you–which is totally fine and not necessary to make a relationship work. But I’m having a hard time imagining how you two were ever compatible unless he displayed other characteristics like being intellectually engaged in life, motivated to do life, passionate/ambitious about something…
Anon
Most SAHMs I know have cleaning ladies too, fwiw. A professional deep clean every 2-4 weeks doesn’t eliminate the need for a lot of light cleaning on a daily basis. Even if he gets a lot of take-out for dinner, doesn’t he prep breakfast and snacks? What about laundry? Pet care? Paying bills? Handyman-type tasks? Prepping school lunches? Chaperoning school field trips? Helping kids with homework? Unless he freely admits he spends literally all day on the couch with video games/movies, I think he is probably doing more than you realize and it may be a nasty surprise if he goes back to work and you have to divide all this stuff up or outsource it.
Anonymous
OMG, in what world do you live where SAHMs have cleaning ladies? We are a two-career couple and we still don’t have a cleaning lady.
Anon
I can’t figure out why you’re bending yourself into a pretzel to defend this guy. This is a reach!
I sense that some people are piling on OP because she probably makes a lot of money and they feel like she has it easy and should be grateful.
Let’s not forget she worked her rear off to get there, and it’s what most of us ascribe to.
Anon at 1:01
I definitely don’t think any BigLaw partner “has it easy,” regardless of how much money she makes, although I don’t know that it’s what everyone here aspires to. It certainly isn’t something I aspire to.
Maybe her husband really is sitting on his rear all day, but I am close to several stay at home moms and dads, including some whose children are all in school from 8:30-3:30, and none of them are eating bon-bons or playing video games all day. They all work really hard and their hard work enables the spouse who works outside the home to really lean into their career. There are several reasons why I wouldn’t personally choose to stay home (not wanting to be financially dependent on my spouse being the big one), but I think for a lot of families it’s the right balance and staying home can be valuable and important work, even when the kids aren’t in diapers anymore. People here tend to be a bit dismissive of stay at home parents, so I was just pointing out some of the unseen work he probably does. If he’s really not doing most of that stuff, then I agree it’s a problem.
Anonymous
+1 million
Senior Attorney
At the risk of being labeled a big ol’ sexist, I have seen this a million times. SAHMs do all the work and keep the house and the kids in perfect shape and cook and clean and volunteer. And SAHD’s often (not always but often) let things slide and play video games and outsource a ton of the work.
No, thanks. This is one of many reasons I think every adult in the household should have a paying job.
Moonstone
Yup. My sister was in the same position as the OP except she does not make the big bucks. Twenty years later, her husband has never worked outside the home despite them revisiting the topic every 6 months. The guy doesn’t want to work and he’s figured out she won’t divorce him.
Anonymous
Oh yeah, then never mind about how you may need to think about this differently. You’re thinking about it exactly right. I’m still going to recommend couples therapy as an alternative to just booting his @ss out onto the sidewalk, which would negatively impact your kids. But he needs to get some kind of plan in place for moving forward with his life. If for no other reason than, if you die, I doubt he’ll find another sugar mama who will let him sit around playing video games all day.
Anonymous
I feel you, OP. I would be livid, too. No one likes going to work! Maybe he’s scared and feels his skills are outdated. I would recommend a therapist to help sort this out. If your kids are heading into middle school, before you know it they’ll be high schoolers driving. He needs to plan his next steps. Stay at home dad won’t always be an option.
dental woes
I’m having a dental implant placed this afternoon (joy) and super anxious about it.
I just got off the phone with the dentist’s office (relatively new to the practice, under <1 year there, changed offices after my old dentist left) and they are giving me the run-around with basically everything. I asked for a couple tabs of Zofran because I historically get really nauseous from all the gunk that runs down my throat during a procedure, they asked me to go get it from my GP (???) who told me to, you know, ask the doctor who is doing the procedure. Now they're telling me they have to research it. I called about this first on Monday, so it's not like it's a last-minute ask on my part.
And apparently they want to give me pain meds but won't give me the scripts until I get there. The last thing I want to do after a procedure I'm extremely anxious about is going to be to go to the freaking pharmacy with my face half-numb and wait for meds.
Am I being unreasonable? I kind of want to call back and ask them to call the scripts in so I can pick them up on the way. I'm usually not passive and I work in a public-facing role but I am so anxious about this it's clouding my judgement.
Elegant Giraffe
I don’t think you’re being unreasonable. Perhaps call back and ask to speak to a nurse/hygienist/other medical professional rather than the front desk who is probably just stating their standard policy. Or specifically ask the person on the phone to take your requests to the dentist and then call you back with his/her answers.
Anonymous
I appreciate your anxiety about this, but actually what the dentist is doing is reasonable. He would be medically liable if he did otherwise.
Zofran is actually a drug that can have serious side effects for some, and some drug plans require prior authorization. Most dentists are not capable for doing prior authorizations for medications, and do not know your medical history or can examine you appropriately enough to prescribe this considering possible side effects. That is fair.
With regard to pain meds, they absolutely should not prescribe it for you before the procedure. Pain med scripts are being carefully monitored now, and many dentists would never write a script for pain meds now anyway and never never never before the procedure…. because what if you don’t come? You could just be collecting scripts from multiple dentists….. who knows? It doesn’t matter who you are. That is reasonable.
If you are this anxious, just postpone the appointment until you can talk to your primary care doctor about the zofran. Or buy some over the counter anti-nausea medicine, and trust your dentist…. they will give you a pain script after the appointment. It’s easy to get that filled after the appointment.
It will be ok. But it is too late to push this through now with your dentist. Maybe your PCP, if they know you well, will call in the zofran to the same pharmacy where you will pick up the pain meds. But if you push the dentist now, it may be a red flag to them that you are drug seeking (wanting that pain med script early….). That’s just the way it is.
Anonymous
I’m sitting here with a half-numb face and bloody gauze shoved in my mouth waiting for my meds. I wasn’t playing them for a two day supply of Tylenol with codeine and two Zofran.
My GP told me to get the meds from the doctor performing the procedure or to bring in a note to that effect, which is fair and unnecessary paperwork I don’t have time for. I don’t even like to take Advil if it’s not absolutely necessary, if the dentist thinks I’m drug-seeking for wanting to pick up scripts before a major, expensive in-office procedure so I could have gone home and crashed after they shouldn’t continue to treat me as a patient.
+1 for everything wrong with healthcare in America.
Anonymous
No, this is your responsibility. You didn’t plan ahead.
And your expectations…. though logical in your mind… are still not appropriate. If you wanted all of this done ahead of time, you shouldn’t have waited until two days before the procedure. Zofran is not typically prescribed by dentists. It just isn’t. And doctors and dentists will not give you pain meds before a procedure. This is a legal risk for them.
If you had a great relationship with your primary care doctor… or your psychiatrist…. you could have seen them ahead of time and worked all of this out. If you are this anxious, then your psychiatrist may be able to work with your primary care doctor to help you get what you need in the future. But you have to plan ahead.
And you need to see your doctor again about addressing your anxiety. Sounds like a stressful and awful day for you, and it shouldn’t have been so bad. It can be better….
Biglawanon
What on earth did you have done that it is so severe?! I had four teeth extracted, five hour procedure, definitely no Zofran and I got my pain meds script after, which I never filled although I recognize some people would and it would have been no issue to do so. If this was as severe as you make it seem, you should have been admitted.
darthbb
Was this more than one implant or are you in the beginning stage where they remove the remaining tooth/teeth to prepare for the abutment? I’ve had a single tooth implanted and at no point during the process did I experience this outside of the work to remove the original tooth. I was back at work right after all the procedures with little to no pain minus the first round. I’m not trying to invalidate your experience but this doesn’t sound right. I also don’t know of any practitioner that will give you a prescription before care so I think your expectations might be misplaced here.
Anonymous
Through a stroke of luck I am getting free botox next week (BIL is a doctor, there is a clinic for residents, he will be doing it personally). I’m 31 and don’t have any deep wrinkles. From your own experience, what should I ask for? I’m thinking just a touch in my forehead near my nose/eyebrows. Can you give me a sense of how many units is considered “light”? Also, is there downtime? And what is like the worst case scenario if BIL does a bad job (I’m sure he won’t but still….). I don’t mean if I suffer some rare complication and die, I just mean cosmetically – has anyone gotten a bad job before?
Anonymous
Look closely at your face under bright light. You’ll see where the lines are starting to form. Mine are between the eyes and I have a weird one on one side, high up on my forehead. Also, ask your BIL what he thinks.
Anon
I don’t know the answer on the units but a light Botox used to cost me about $300 so maybe you can back into the pricing.
My friend had a bad outcome she called Spock Eye. One eyebrow actually drooped a bit and it made her other eyebrow appear arched. It bothered her a lot but most of us didn’t notice until she pointed it out. Of course it wore off. In hindsight, her esthetician said she should have come back because they could have fixed it with more Botox, but instead my fried just waited it out. The root cause was injections for horizontal lines across the forehead. Injections for vertical lines between the eyebrows (the elevens) don’t cause this.
In terms of where to inject, look at yourself in sunlight making all kinds of facial expressions. You’ll see where the lines are
GG
I had botox in my forehead from a very well-regarded dermatologist and it caused my eyebrows to droop down in the middle. People told me it wasn’t noticeable, but I felt like I looked like an angry neanderthal – similar to the “Iron forehead, low brow” discussed here: http://narcissista.me/2012/10/21/bad-botox-what-it-looks-like-how-to-fix-it/
Anon
Help me decide on a condo in DC, please! We’re 2 professionals planning for kids soon. Would you pick: a small-ish condo in Adams Morgan, not a lot of storage, but a big kitchen and walkable to lots of things, and at the low end of the budget; or a larger condo with more storage but smaller kitchen in Columbia Heights/Park View area that’s farther from grocery/restaurants and would be $400/mo month more for us, but doable in our budget. Both are recently renovated and very nice inside. Assume both would give us about 30-40 minute commutes to jobs.
Anon
Moving is a pain and is expensive. Are you buying or renting? If buying, buy one step ahead at the top of your budget to save you a move in the future.
If renting, do the opposite.
January
Do you want to raise your kid(s) in the condo, or do you want to keep the condo as an investment property and possibly rent it once you’ve outgrown it?
Anon
Or sell it.
blueberries
Small and walkable! But, depends on your temperament and your kids—my spouse and I (and our kids) need to get out of the house a lot. Even in the tiny newborn phase. Being in a neighborhood that wasn’t walkable would have been awful for us and our car-hating kids.
Anon in DC
Well Columbia Heights/ Park View is still walkable. There’s just less stuff immediately around than in Adams Morgan. I recently decided to move to a more residential neighborhood in DC and don’t regret it. But it’s really about personal preferences.
Cookie
I’d go for the slightly larger place. We are minimalists, but we still need quite a bit of storage for our one-year-old.
Sleep
I need more sleep. I know I need more sleep. Sleeping later is not an option, and the advice that is commonly given is to get to bed earlier. My schedule would easily allow going to bed earlier, but any time I try, I end up tossing and turning for that hour or so that was supposed to be my extra sleep. I am exhausted, but I have a very hard time falling asleep, and end up just getting frustrated when I do try to go to bed earlier. Is there something to this that I’m missing? Are people really able to just fall asleep whenever they decide they want to? I usually fall asleep between 10:30 and 11:30. I would LOVE to go to bed at 9:00 and actually sleep, but it isn’t working for me. Help?
Anonymous
Try moving to to 10pm first. I have the same issue with falling asleep. I need to have my last coffee at least 7 hours before bedtime and no more than three coffees total per day. No other caffeine. Hot shower before bed and reading a book I like helps. I go with one that I read before but find interesting to re-read. That way I don’t go into ‘read all night’ mode because I want to see what happens.
Anonymous
Force yourself to get up early, way earlier than you want to. (Phone/alarm in the kitchen/across the room, whatever tricks you need) Then when the night comes around, you’re ready to crash early. I am convinced it is the only way.
Hot shower also helps!
Sleep
I already wake up at 4:45. The thought of getting up any earlier makes me want to cry.
Anon
4:45 may just be too early for your body. That’s pretty out of sync with when most humans are programmed to get up.
Lana Del Raygun
You don’t mention “sleep hygiene”—are you winding down before you go to bed? Disconnecting from your phone/computer/TV around 8? Watching your afternoon caffeine? Those should help. I also sleep better when I have a relaxed bedtime routine (PJs, slippers, brush my hair, wash my face, read for a while, etc) than when I just do daytime things until 8:50 and then jump up and go to bed.
Anonymous
I try and re-frame lying in bed not sleeping as “resting”. I remind myself that sleep is best, but resting is better than nothing. Otherwise I get anxious and frustrated as well. I don’t think it will happen overnight, but if you focus on “resting” it may get better. If I am tossing and turning over a worry, I get up and write it down, or write down a plan to address that worry.
Anonymous
Start taking a tiny dose of melatonin with dinner for a week. 1mg-1.5mg is plenty.
Still go into bed the ideal time you want to fall asleep, and do quiet things (read etc.. but NO CELLPHONE!!!!). Then do a mindfulness activity using an App on your phone.
It may take several days/weeks, but you will eventually shift.
Anonymous
i need to do this too. things I found help me get to sleep (but don’t always do):
-exercise some time during the day;
-there’s a meditation for sleep on insight timer (free). I do the 20 min one that is highly rated and I usually don’t have to replay because I’ll be asleep;
-color meditation;
-sleepy teas (doesn’t always work);
-audiobook until I fall asleep (reading a really good book will have me up till 4); audible has a sleep timer, so I will set it to play for 15 minutes
Scarlett
Try taking melatonin an hour to an hour and a half before you want to fall asleep. I got that advice for business trips & it’s pretty amazing. Not sure of the precise science, but my understanding is it helps your body clock reset and get tired when it’s time to sleep.
Jules
Melatonin helps me sleep through the night, or go back to sleep more easily if I get up to pee or whatever. (I first used it when the pediatrician recommended it for my insomniac/night owl DS when he was a young teenager.) I have found that the sublingual liquid form works best.
https://smile.amazon.com/gp/product/B001GCTVEM/ref=oh_aui_search_detailpage?ie=UTF8&psc=1
Anon
My friend posted this quote on FB today and I had a giggle
“Gardening is not a rational act. What matters is the immersion of the hands in the earth, that ancient ceremony of which the Pope kissing the tarmac is merely a pallid vestigial remnant. In the spring, at the end of the day, you should smell like dirt.”
Margaret Atwood
Senior Attorney
*snort*
Anon
I’m trying to figure out what the P0pe kissing the tarmac means ;)
Senior Attorney
HAHAHAHA!!!
Gym bag
What’s a good bag for the gym? I go from home, and typically shower and dress there but since I WFH, I’m putting on jeans, not a suit, and rarely makeup. I either run errands or go home and work after.
I need to carry toiletries, a towel, brush, water bottle, occasionally a bathing suit (then a wet bathing suit home), a change of clothes and maybe a change of shoes.
I have been using an old tote bag and it’s just not cutting it. The cheaper the better, no more than $50.
Bonus points- sometimes I have a kid or two with me and might need extra space for their stuff. If not, I will keep using a second kid bag.
Annony
I have this gym bag and I really like it … super simple, very lightweight, has a laundry bag. (I’d test it out before using it for a wet bathing suit though)
https://www.amazon.com/Under-Armour-Womens-Works-Black/dp/B00YO5SXOC/ref=sr_1_12?s=apparel&ie=UTF8&qid=1516824678&sr=1-12&nodeID=9479199011&psd=1&keywords=under+armour+bag
Vespa lady
Lesportsacs are perfect for this. Lightweight and washable. Often can find them cheap at tjmaxx, but sometimes online at 6pm/amazon for around $50
https://www.6pm.com/p/lesportsac-luggage-large-on-the-go-tote-classic-red/product/8806782/color/62316
https://www.6pm.com/p/lesportsac-luggage-large-on-the-go-tote-lestripe-travel/product/8806782/color/662622
U.S. long weekend getaway
Friend is on the east coast, I’m on the west coast, and we’re looking for ideas for places to go for a long weekend getaway next winter. Ideally somewhere that is a similar flight for each of us, and that is not freezing cold (would prefer not to have to wear anything more than a light jacket). We’d want good food/wine, ability to go on walks (in a city) or hikes (if not in a city) and generally spend time outdoors getting some exercise, catching up, relaxing.
Ideas?
Anon.
New Orleans or Austin – there are probably direct flights and what you want I think.
Anonymous
Basically Austin Texas is it.
Anonymous
This question has been asked and answered so many times, and there are so few options that meet your criteria. There aren’t many places in the middle of the country that would require only a light jacket in the middle of winter. Austin would probably be your best bet. Nashville or New Orleans maybe, but that’s a longer flight for you.
Elegant Giraffe
Look at the Travaasa resort in Austin – it’s closed for renovations right now but would be open by next winter. I’ve been there, I love it and think it will be even more amazing once it reopens. Austin in general might be perfect for this – plenty of city stuff and easy to find hiking outside the city.
Anonymous
Every time someone posts this question I have a laugh — it’s like they’re expecting a new city to appear that they’ve never heard of! Literally the only city that fits your criteria is Austin, and with the way weather trends are going, you can’t count on it to be warm at all.
Anon
New Orleans totally fits her criteria.