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Splurge Monday’s Workwear Post: ‘Deandra’ Pleated Front Faux Wrap Sheath Dress

Work Dress with Sleeves: Elie Tahari 'Deandra' Pleated Front Faux Wrap Sheath Dress Our daily workwear reports suggest one piece of work-appropriate attire in a range of prices. When we had our discussion about the best workwear for different body shapes, I was intrigued by how many people loved Elie Tahari. This faux wrap sheath dress looks gorgeous in both the blue and the black. Sleeves! A flattering but work appropriate v-neck! Fully lined! It looks a touch too short as styled here, but it’s 39″ long, which I think would be fine on ladies under 5'6″. It's $398 at Nordstrom, available in sizes 0-16. Elie Tahari ‘Deandra' Pleated Front Faux Wrap Sheath Dress Two lower-priced options are here and here, and here's a plus-size alternative. Seen a great piece you'd like to recommend? Please e-mail tps@corporette.com. (L-5)

Sales of note for 12.5

And some of our latest threadjacks here at Corporette (reader questions and commentary) — see more here!

Some of our latest threadjacks include:

257 Comments

  1. After agonizing in front of my closet, I wore my Tahari by ASL dress.
    It’s not a real Elie Tahari but I feel you can’t go wrong with these dresses. No brainer for me.
    I have 3 on rotation.

    1. Yeah, my two fav dresses are Tahari by ASL. Also once I spilled a whole cup of coffee on one of the dresses (medium grey) and paaaaanicked and … magic? No stains. (And I feel like Alicia Florrick when I wear it.) I stalk the sales for those, though.

      1. Me too. I love Tahari ASL dresses for my hourglass/pearish shape. Elie Tahari looks terrible on me.

    2. Tahari is my favorite workwear line. Generally well-made pieces and still lined. I agree that this dress looks too short on the model. The faux wrap would probably look better on someone shorter than pictured as it would hit more at the waist.

    3. Ditto. I’m also a pearish shape (Hugo Boss/Classiques Entier 8s are a bit baggy on top and tight on the bottom.) Somehow Tahari ASL 8s fit perfectly, and the Elie Taharis in 8 or 10 always work. I would guess on non-suit days, I wear a dress with some version of a Tahari label 3-4 days/week.

      A similar Tahari dress (with longer sleeves) is at the Neiman Marcus Last Call website. (Search Korey Tahari — it’s $68 but comes in extra small, small, medium, and large.)

      1. I find the Tahari off shoots, and actual ET to a lesser extent, are a bit baggy up top on me in the shoulder/arm area. I am fairly busty so it’s not the chest, but it just seems like they are cut for someone with broader shoulders than mine.

    4. Also love TahariASL dresses, have one from maybe 8 year ago, going strong, get lots of compliments whenever i wear it

  2. 1) what is your rent/mortgage?
    2) what percentage of your gross and net income does that represent?
    3) where do you live (city/region)?

    1. $9095/mo rent
      21% pre-tax and pre-bonuses
      Manhattan (UWS)

      Also, two kids and rent is high because the schools are really good. I’d pay $45k per kid for tuition if I lived somewhere cheaper with a similar commute.

        1. Classic 6 – 2 real bdrms, living room, dining room and “maids bdrm” or study, 3 full baths. 1800 sq ft?

          Yeah, this is why salaries in NYC aren’t actually that high.

          1. Except they are for you. 21% of your income is really low compared to most households in this country.

          2. I’m guessing her 21% pretax is about 40% after tax with city, state and federal combined.

      4. So, yeah, even in NY, $550K a year is pretty darn good. Just saying.

        When I worked in NY as a paralega in biglaw 15 years ago, my salary was $33K, although I made more like $60K, with overtime.

        1. Yeah, this. NYC housing prices are INSANE, but so is that salary. My in-laws make about a third of that and still have a nice apartment in Manhattan and paid for private K-12 school for two kids. You’re probably in the top 2-3% of earners even in NYC, so actually yeah that salary is pretty high.

    3. $2,100/mo mortgage, inclusive of real estate taxes and insurance escrows
      10% of gross total income (incl. bonus)
      16.5% of salaried gross income
      Suburban Boston (inside 128 loop)

    4. Mortgage is $1400
      10% of gross income
      Washington DC metro area, but 35 miles outside of the city.

      1. Same, except in LCOL area of rural south. Mortgage is a 15 year note, refinanced several years ago from a more traditional mortgage with a $1100 payment.

      2. Mortgage $1,900/month (incl. taxes and insurance)
        10.5% gross income
        close Philadelphia suburbs
        4 bedroom home – pre-WWII

    5. Mortgage is ~1200/month for a two-bed condo in Chicago. It’s about 14% of gross income.

      1. Rent is $980 for a one-bedroom rental condo in Chicago area. 1/2 block from train.

        About 30% of gross income.

    6. I’m in Europe:
      1- 950 €/mo
      2- about 25% of net income (depending on the month), should decrease gradually

    7. Rent is $1,100/mo for a large two-bedroom duplex in a great neighborhood with easy commutes
      Around 20% of take-home, 16% of gross
      Richmond, VA

    8. Mortgage (incl. taxes, insurance) is $2200/mo.
      9% of gross salary.
      Center City Philly.

      2. Very similar stats, except we’re in Ohio, at the border between suburbs and rural.

        Ours is a 3,000 sq ft not very renovated farmhouse, that costs a couple thousand more a year in repairs and would be in the tens of thousands for repairs if we had to pay for it instead of doing it ourselves. The bulk of it is “keep the house from falling down/roof from leaking/heat working” repairs, not upgrade renovations.

      2. 3300 mortgage not including tax and insurance
        16% of gross
        San Francisco (not the Mission)

    11. 1 – $940/month (includes escrow and HOA) for a 2 bedroom, 2 1/2 bath townhouse.
      2 – 18% of takehome
      3 – Indianapolis

    12. 1) $600/month rent
      2) 15% of gross, 30% of net
      3) LCOL area. Most rents are closer to $800-$1,000 for a 1 bedroom apartment. Ultra luxury apartments are probably $1,400 for the nicest apartments in the best area

    13. 1) $2800/month for a 2200 sq ft townhouse
      2) 7% of gross income
      3) DC (in the city)

    14. 1) what is your rent/mortgage? – approx. $3000/month (mortgage, incl. property taxes)
      2) what percentage of your gross and net income does that represent? 12% of gross, 23% of net (and almost 28% of net minus student loans and car loans)
      3) where do you live (city/region)? Suburbs of NYC

      1. $4500/mo. rent for 2BR, 2.5BA FDR and one garage parking space (tandem) in San Francisco.
        That’s thanks to rent control — apt. exactly like ours in the bldg. just rented for $7000/mo.

        15% of gross HH income (me +DH).

    16. Mortgage is $2009, which represents 9% of our gross. We live in a big city in Florida.

    17. Mortgage is $2009, which represents 9% of our gross. We live in a big city in Florida.

    19. $3200/month mortgage for 4,000 sq. foot house (including property tax escrow and insurance)
      14% of gross
      Texas city

    20. $2500/month rent for smallish 2bdrm. About 13% of gross/25% of net (not including bonuses or equity). Close suburb of Boston.

    21. 1) Mortgage: $2300/month (includes escrow, HOA, pool, gym, parking and some utilities), 2/2.5 condo
      2) 11% of gross, 14% of net (although my take-home does not include income taxes)
      3) Atlanta

    22. Just out of curiosity, what is the point of calculating off of gross income? When my husband and I were looking at buying our first home 3 years ago, we wanted monthly payments (including property tax which is high in our state) to be no more than 30% of our net monthly income.

      1. I’ve never understood this either. I only care what percentage of the actual money I see each month is going towards housing. Would love it if someone could explain!

      2. For my own calculations I would always use net, but the OP asked for gross so that’s what I provided.

        1. I did rental applications a few months ago and all of their income requirements were based on gross. It just seems completely illogical to me.

      3. Gross is easier to calculate (I know my gross salary to the digit, I’d have to look up my take-home). And net can be confusing to compare – net of what, exactly? Taxes, or all deductions? If persons A and B have the same salary and the same rent, but A saves 18k a year in her 401k and B saves nothing, A pays a higher percentage of her take-home in rent, but that’s a bit misleading.

        1. Also my take home changes as the year goes on. I finish paying Social Security tax, finish with my 401K contribution (no match) early in the year. After that, I get a $4K raise/month.

        2. I think the opposite: I get a paycheck every two weeks so I know exactly how much goes into my bank account every month. Much easier to calculate what I can afford that way.
          But I have so much taken out from my paycheck – insurance, retirement, metrocard, etc. – that calculating what I can afford based on my gross income would be wildly misleading.

          1. Yeah, this is the perspective I’ve taken. Interesting to hear other perspectives, though!

        3. Same as Sarabeth. I’m on an academic calendar and don’t get paid the same amount every month, plus my salary is raised in the middle of the calendar year, not at the beginning of the tax year. To calculate net income for a given year, I’d have to find all 12 paychecks and add them up. The gross income is the only number I actually know definitively.

    23. $3800 including util. for large 3 bed/2bath
      9.5% of gross income
      Washington DC (in the city)

    24. These replies are killing me.

      Nearly $900/month rent for a tiny studio in a HCOL Canadian city. I think of people paying the same for a house in another city and I weep.

      1. You’re doing better than the guy in the Globe and Mail article over the weekend who was paying $600/month to sleep on a friend’s couch near Simon Fraser.

      2. That is an excellent price for a study in a desirable city.

        Have you seen some of the prices people are paying for desirable US HCOL cities? THAT should make you weep with joy!

      3. That doesn’t seem all that HCOL to me. I just had a friend move into a 400 sq ft (not sure I believe it’s really that big though) studio for $1700 per month.

        I pay $3080 per month for a 1 BR 650 sq ft. ~15% of gross pay.

      4. Canada is really not that expensive, I consider it MCOL. I pay 1000 + electricity in a major city and trendy neighbourhood for a small one bed, 550 sqft.

          1. Major Canadian cities are MCOL especially in comparison to American ones. Toronto and Vancouver are nowhere near as expensive as NYC or SF

          2. I don’t disagree entirely, but I think you’re not factoring in a lot of stuff- food is a lot more expensive here, as are sales taxes and utilities. Comparing just housing costs isn’t really accurate when determining cost of living in a city.

          4. Because people only eat produce, and because we have a year round growing season? Come on. I have a farm share, I only get food from June to October. There are a lot of other months in the year, and the upfront costs are higher, I recognize that I am fortunate to be able to do that. Lots of people only have the grocery store imported options.

            I said I didn’t disagree with your assessment, I just said there are other factors to consider.

          5. I have a farm box too. It amounts to 33/week. I feed 2 adults for about 60/week, the extra 27 supplementing with a few grocery store staples.

        2. That hasn’t been my experience nor my friends’ experiences in Toronto/Vancouver. I find food prices in Ontario to be fairly high compared to other places in Canada.

          Plus I think most Canadians tend to have less disposable income since our taxes rates are so much higher – the net income we’re playing with is a lot less. Ya your health care is covered but as someone relatively young and healthy, it’s not saving you a lot of expenses day-to-day.

          1. But was your education covered too? Because I would take less income and not having to worry about my student loans or how i will pay for my daughter to go to school.

          2. University is cheaper than the US, but by the time I finished undergrad and law school I still had $90k in loans, and our salaries are lower

          3. I don’t know where this idea that education is covered comes from. Its subsidized- its like going to a state university. It’s not free.

            – I have about 200k of med school debt.

      5. But the $900/mo house in my small city is in a sketchy neighbourhood and doesn’t include taxes, insurance, maintenance, or parking downtown. I pay $950 for a 2 brm and walk to work.

    25. Mortgage is 6900/month, includes taxes and insurance
      33% of gross? Depends on bonuses.
      Exurbs of Boston

        2. Outside the 495 belt so far away from Boston.

          We run the vacuum often and have cleaners. House is in good physical shape otherwise!

      3. Somewhat similar but in a 1500 sq ft condo in the middle of Boston city ($6000/month, 30-ish% of take home…much lower % of gross).

        1. Okay, this makes me feel better. We are considering a $3600/month place in Cambridge/Somerville (33% of takehome) but I’m worried it is too high. I’ve never gone higher than 25% before (but also never lived somewhere as HCOL as Boston/Cambridge).

          1. When I lived in Boston, we paid $4500/month in the city for a 2 bed/2 bath in a new, fancy building. Boston is insane.

          2. Yes, it is sticker shock for sure! Esp because we have pets (including a large breed dog) so that limits our available supply to, oh, 5% of what is listed…

          3. Are you renting for 3600 or buying (paying mortgage)? Either way, I think that’s pretty standard for a 2+ bedroom in nicer parts of Cambridge/Somerville. Before we bought, we paid something like $2700 for a 1 bed in a new fancy building in Cambridge.

            I think part of moving to a HCOL area is coming to terms with the fact that you will spend a higher % of your money on housing.

          4. Renting, and it is for a 3 bed 2 bath (with ac, w/d, outdoor space). Somerville, walking distance to red line. So although the $$ is high, I know it is actually a good deal for what it is.

          6. Anyone can write off some of their rent on MA state taxes? Or only if you work from home?

            FWIW, I WILL be working from home full-time (not self-employed, though).

          7. Check most recent tax code but back when we rented (2003- 2008) it was anyone. I think there was a cap on how much you could deduct, not sure if there was/is an income limit, we were making a combined 120k or so at the time.

            It’s state only but hey, 5.5%….

    27. 1) $1200/month mortgage for a single family home
      2) About 10% of gross, 15% of net (net is after taxes and retirement contributions)
      3) Small city/large town in the Midwest

    28. 1) $970 including escrow- 3 bed 3 bath, 1600ish
      2) about 13% of gross
      3) Omaha, Nebraska area

    29. 1) $1950 month (mortgage, escrow, insurance, HOA fees) 3/1, 1450 sqft
      2) 8.5% of my gross, pre-bonus. Excludes SO’s income, and he pays half the mortgage
      3) Boston

    30. 1. $1350 for 2 bed 2 bath apartment , approx 1000 sq
      2. About 16 % net income.
      3. City in South Florida but not Miami

    31. 1. $1240 for PITI, 4 bedroom 3 bathroom house, approximately 1500 sq ft.
      2. 15% of my gross salary, 27% of my net. My husband is self-employed so I don’t count him for this, but obviously it’d be less.
      3. small city in the upper Midwest

    32. 1) $3230 for a 2 bed/2 bath condo, 1000 square ft
      2) 11% of gross income; 15% of net
      3) Downtown DC

    33. 1. $2100 month mortgage inclusive of taxes and insurance (3 bed, 1.5 bath, 2000 sq ft)
      2. 14% of gross pay, not including bonuses
      3. Portland, Oregon

    34. 1. $5,400/month in rent for a 3 bedroom + den / 3 bathroom house
      2. 30% of monthly net income, exclusive of year-end bonuses
      3. Upscale suburb in Southern California

    35. 1. ~$3500/mo mortgage including taxes/insurance
      2. We gross $300-350k/year. Our net operating income is about $16k per month.
      3. Boston burbs

      We could be spending more on housing but are saving for a major Reno & have 2 young kids

    36. 1571 w utilities/parking, 680sq ft 1BR/1BA
      40% of gross (legal aid). Until I was an hour-plus commute from work, wasn’t any cheaper.
      Seattle. Maybe Amazon will go bankrupt unexpectedly. One can hope.

    37. 1) ~3000 (mortgage+HOA on 2BR condo, ~1600 sq ft)
      2) about 10% of my husband and my gross
      3) los angeles, westside

    38. 1. $2600/month including taxes and insurance.
      2. 20% of gross and 29% of net monthly salary, but not including bonuses. If you count my bonuses, figure 10% of gross total compensation.
      3. Small free-standing 2 bedroom home in Seattle with a parking pad.

      By percentage I am doing fine, but I feel horrible about spending so much on housing in real terms.

    39. A little late to this

      $600 a month mortgage (1200 square foot house)
      20% of my gross income
      Rochester, Minnesota

    41. 1. PITI is $1400 (1BR, 1.5 BA condo) + $450 assessments = $1850/month
      2. 6.8% of gross income, excluding bonuses (11% of our take-home pay)
      3. Chicago

    42. 1) $2965 rent/mo (1BR,1BA apartment)
      2) 30% gross income
      3) Silicon Valley

      These threads always make me feel terrible about my life choices.

    43. 1) $1300/month for mortgage + $250/month for HOA fee for a 750 sq ft 1 bd/1ba condo
      2) 1% gross, 30% gross
      3) suburb of Washington DC

    44. 1) $1750 Mortgage – 3000 sq ft, on an acre
      2) 14% gross, around 25% net
      3) close in suburb of Twin Cities (< 10 minutes to St. Paul, where I work)

    45. $2200 mortgage
      9% of gross income (bought 21 yrs ago) for 3/2 that is 1300 square feet
      San Francisco suburb

      Couldn’t afford my neighborhood if I were buying today!

    47. 1. $3850 rent (2 bed, 2 bath, but we also have 3 lofts so it feels very large), I pay $2750 because my sister is living with us right now in one of the lofts.
      2. 35% of my income post-tax, excluding bonuses and my husband’s income, which is negligible. I also have quite a bit of student loan debt which I am still paying off — I usually pay about $3500 per month on loans.
      3. HCOL, NYC, Manhattan

  3. An intl perspective:

    Mortgage is £750 per month for a new two bed main door flat with small garden
    My income is variable, it’s about 35% of husband’s take home pay. On months when I’m working full-time, it’s about 20% of our total.
    Biggish city in the UK

    1. In Melbourne, Australia
      Mortgage is $4660 AUD
      Which is about 11% of gross and 24% of net (excl bonuses). 4 bedroom house on 650sqm, with a big garden. I’d call us just past the inner city. We compromised a bit on location to get a bigger house/block.

    2. £600 pcm mortgage for a decent sized 1 bed flat (no garden) in the centre of a fairly large city in the UK. Just less than 20% of my net pay (13% gross).

  4. $900 for 3bed/2 bath house, including taxes and escrow
    7% of gross income
    Chattanooga, TN

  5. A local org is helping people to get started growing veggies and we’re getting raised beds installed this month. My lavender is doing well and my houseplant game is strong but I’ve never grown veggies before and am super excited about it. Made my first sourdough this weekend and feeling like a bit of a domestic goddess.

    What are you growing? Any pro-tips?

    1. Make sure plants will have full sun.
      Depending on your area of the country, don’t transplant plants outdoors until June.
      If you start plants from seeds, start in Feb.
      Cage your tomato plants, stake your beans.
      Watch for bugs.
      Don’t wash the produce until you are ready to use it (lasts longer)
      Know if your plants can self-pollinate (only need to plant one) or if you’ll need at least two for cross pollination.

    2. Following this thread with a follow-up question – what do you do if bugs (I think they’re aphids) eat all your vegetables? I’ve tried the insecticidal soap for veg gardens but no success (I think you only get the bugs that are on the leaves right then). Any tips?

      1. Talk to a local plant nursery (NOT Home Depot/Lowes/Menards). They’ll have the expertise for your region and bug types.

      2. My crazy wannabe-farmer husband ordered 500 lady bugs off of Amazon (yes, this is a thing).

        No more bugs!

        1. My father totally did this. He grew up with a huge garden and buying lady bugs, praying mantisses (?sp) and earthworms was part of the garden prep.

        2. Wait, this actually worked? The ladybugs arrive alive from Amazon?? I would love this approach if it works!

    4. It’s a little late in the season, but it’s great you are getting raised beds. Good soil is key. If you see leaves starting to get eaten/discolored, clip them off immediately. Use wire fencing to surround the box to keep out squirrels/rabbits or you may arrive one morning and everything is eaten! There are simple home-remedies you can find online if bugs attack…

      We are growing herbs (basil, cilantro, chives, thyme, rosemary, lavender etc..), tomatoes, beets, chard, lettuce, cucumbers. Think about growing some herbs that come back every year on their own – chives, thyme, sometimes rosemary…

      Almost every night we have a salad fresh picked from the garden, steamed greens, and a protein of choice using some fresh herbs.

      We live in an “urban suburb” just on the edge of Chicago.

    5. Don’t plant too much. I have a small raised garden and usually get too excited/ambitious and plant too much, leading to problems especially with tomatoes. Tomatoes, at least in my humid area of the country, need a lot of space or they get fungus. Those yeast I was busy and planted half the number of plants as usual and things are doing great. You can get more out of your space without over crowding by being creative about planting vertical growers next to horizontal spreaders, and succession planting (peas, then beans on same trellis for instance).

      Also, plant zucchini. It’s so hard to screw up (in my region,7a) and it’s nice to have some feeling of success.

    6. The key for me is to put watering on a timer. I use soaker hoses right now, but have done drip irrigation successfully before. I run mine for a half hour every day and never worry about accidentally going two weeks without watering my veggies. You can buy timers in the same areas as garden hoses in most garden centers.

      Also, buy the most industrial tomato cages you can find.

    7. Know your zone, then google accordingly for planting schedules and ways to combat local pests.

  6. Please, please, please give me all your tips for surviving morning sickness. Between constant nausea and fatigue, I don’t know how I’m going to white knuckle through my first trimester at work.

    1. Small snacks, never have an empty stomach! Try to figure out what snacks work for you. For some women it’s salty carbs (saltines) and for others it’s protein (almonds?) and for others, sweets. Some friends swore by cheese. Also try ginger tea/ginger chews/ginger beer. I found very minty peppermint tea and tart lemonade helped too. And icy cold drinks. And just suffering. Ugh, at least it’s time limited?

      1. +1 I was craving hangover foods to be honest and brought single serving bags of chips every day. This sounds strange, but I read somewhere there’s an ingredient in Coca Cola Classic that is similar to the anti nausea medicine you get from the doctor. Pregnant or not, drinking Coke when I’m nauseous helps me.

        1. Oh, that’s really interesting. Fountain Coke is my hangover drink of choice, for sure.

        2. You can get Coca-Cola syrup at some pharmacies for just this purpose. My mom swore by it when she was pregnant – 1 spoon in a little seltzer twice a day worked for her. That said, it contains caffeine, so depending on what you and your OB have decided, it may not be a good choice.

          1. Yes, or just take a spoonful without the fizzy water. I’m not sure carbonation helps.

    2. This is not the time to worry about what you are eating or how early you go to bed. Just do what works to make it through. For me, that meant cold, fizzy water, sour candy, seabands, power naps, lots of small snacks with some protein, and a 7:30pm bedtime. It got better around 13 weeks.

    3. For both pregnancies, I had to drink some caffeine in the morning. I made sure I had a full stomach, and drank either black tea (some herbal teas are not recommended for pregnant women, so make sure to check what you are drinking with your doctor) or a half cup of coffee with lots of milk.

      Echoing the others – full stomach, candy, lots of fizzy water, and LOTS of sleep helped. Time helped the most, and if you need extra help, call your doc. I know there are meds they can prescribe for this time.

    4. Preggo pops. They helped at work during those mouth watering, really bad moments. I spent most of my first trimester (-s – plural) lying on the couch.

      1. Oh, and I took 1/2 a Unisom every night! Whatever ingredient is in it helps with morning sickness. My youngest is 6 so I have no idea if it’s still okay to take while pregnant, but I successfully used it with my kids.

        1. Yes, actually there is a new(ish) prescription drug for morning sickness on the market and it is basically unisom + B6.

          To OP, also consider B6. For me it was salty, salty foods. Hangover foods for me all the way. It’s like 3-4 months of a hangover.

        2. Yup, I’m in first trimester and at my first scan (at 7 weeks) my doctor told me to take unisom and b6. It hasn’t totally made it go away, but it helps. Also don’t be afraid to ask for Zofran or a prescription if the nausea is killing you at work.

    5. I am going through the exact same thing and posted on the mom’s site a couple weeks ago. I’m now in week 8 and it’s starting to get mildly better. What helped:

      – Acupuncture. It worked like magic the first two times (took about 12 hours to work after each treatment). Wasn’t as effective the third time but it still helped.
      – Giving in to cravings. I was a super healthy eater before becoming pregnant; while I ate desserts/junk on occasion and enjoyed it, I never craved that kind of food. Now I just give in because it does make me feel better to eat SOMETHING, and makes it more likely that I can eat something healthier later. (E.g.: Just had a rice krispie treat when I woke up this morning, but that enabled me to choke down a smoothie with spinach an hour later).
      – Naps. Just do it.

      Good luck – we can do this!

      1. How do people manage to take naps during work? I would love to, but don’t drive to work so can’t sleep in my car, and can’t see how else I would swing it.

        1. If your office is large enough to have a nurse’s office, they will let you nap in the cots. If you have a door you can close, you can nap in your office.

      2. I have my own office – the front is glass, but my area doesn’t get a lot of foot traffic. I put my head down on my desk behind my large computer monitor, so someone would only notice that I’m there if they were looking. If you don’t have an office, I think the bathroom is the only way to go.

      1. I think I probably will ask about medication, because I really do need to continue to be productive and service the files I have carriage of, but my first appointment is in 4 weeks so I need stop-gap measures in the mean time!

          1. +1

            MD here

            Call the clinic and ask for call back from doc or nurse. They will call back, and after talking to you will call in meds to pharmacy and/ or give you recs. You do not have to wait for your appointment for this,

            Things like pain and nausea deserve a call.. Do not wait for an appointment.

    7. I threw up a lot. So, I took drugs- Unisom + B6, Reglan, and Zofran. I found that Unisom + B6 actually helped with the nausea and gave a bit a boost. (For me, Zofran was a last resort because of the other side effects.)

      I drank a tea latte every morning. The protein from the milk settled my stomach (as well as the tea). The caffeine gave me a boost, too.

    9. Talk to your doc and see if you can get Zofran. I only had it for a short time but it was LIFE-CHANGING, enabled me to function at work!

      1. You might want to try Diclegis before resorting to Zofran. Fewer potential side effects, from what I have researched.

        1. +1 on Diclegis. Took it and was the only thing that allowed me to eat anything during the first 4 months. Wish I had taken it earlier instead of trying to tough it out.

    10. Jolly ranchers.

      Hot peppermint tea with lots of sugar (great for meetings).

      Cold sprite/7up/ginger ale/coca-cola.

      Chug a protein drink (I loved the svelte ones) first thing in the morning.

      If you start to show signs of serious dehydration, go get IV fluids at urgent care. Will “reset” you.

    11. Ginger ale, never having an empty stomach, tons and tons of water (on top of the 10+ glasses a day I drank normally), giving myself permission to not be Super Woman and just do what I could at work during my sickest part of the day.

    12. I had a hankering for citrus through my pregnancy. I would mix OJ with some type of fizzy drink (either 7UP, sprite or LaCroix). Also, ginger chewy candy helped a little. I avoided anything with tomatoes or tomato sauce like the plague–made me soooooo sick!

    13. The importance of snacks has been mentioned a lot (agreed they are key) but also try keeping them next to your bed, so you can at least try to nibble on a cracker or whatever works before even getting out of bed. My favorite things were fruit hard candies from whole foods and Izze fizzy drinks. I also thought seabands helped. Good luck!

    14. Graham crackers first thing in the morning, ginger chews/tea/beer/chunks, seabands.

    15. Zofran, B6+Unisom at night, ginger beer, sour gummy bears (no idea why that worked, but it did), Izze soda.

    16. +1 for never having an empty stomach! I found I had to eat probably every 1-1.5 hour during the 1st trimester and could not omit a snack before bedtime most days (I’ve just entered the 2nd trimester now and am definitely feeling better!). Low-cal cranberry juice cocktail and low-cal lemonade from Trader Joe’s helped me, as did tart fruit like plums. The morning sickness shifted for me to evening sickness pretty quickly but when it was in the AM, I agree with having a snack at your bedside ready to go, and not getting out of bed too fast when you first wake up. My OB also told me about the Unisom + B6 OTC option (and encouraged me to call if I was really feeling terrible so I could get prescription meds if needed) but I ended up not having to take anything. Hang in there!

  7. My boss wants to meet with me to discuss adding a responsibility to my workload. This responsibility is outside my job description and will add 5-10% to my workload (though not evenly distributed week to week – it clusters at certain times of the year, which I think causes my boss to underestimate how much work it really is). Is it okay to ask for a raise in exchange for taking this on, and if so, how do I decide how much to ask for? What language should I use to bring this up, especially considering I suspect it will be a surprise that I need more money to do this?

    Note that it is fine with me if they decide not to give me this responsibility at all – I am busy as it is and see more room to advance in other areas.

    1. I think the general advice (and usually on Ask a Manager) is to wait and ask for the raise once you have done the additional job duties well. You’ll have a much stronger case once you have metrics to prove how well you’re doing and people have recognized it.

      1. Hmm, I went to a women’s conference last fall and the advice was to negotiate on the front end, which seems presumptuous to me. I’m curious what others say here.

    2. If you were my direct report and asked for a raise, I’d probably tell you I will take it into consideration at year end. If you are excelling at the new responsibilities, it’ll reflect positively and if you are not, it’ll reflect negatively.

      1. Really? More work for more pay makes sense, but you’re asking if I want to do more work for the same pay? With only the promise that you will take it into consideration at year’s end? No thank you! I feel like these kinds of things are what end up screwing women in the salary department. ASK FOR MORE MONEY, GIRL! You’re doing more work!

        1. For what it’s worth, the last time I had this conversation it was with a male direct report. Taking on new and different work is how you advance in my group. I will eventually remove some of your other tasks and delegate to others, but when I’m giving your a period task worth 5-10% of your time, I simply expect you to be more efficient during the time periods where you have to step it up.

          1. Taking on new a different work is how you advance = but that should mean more money right? You don’t just continually take on more work for the same pay? That’s not advancement.

          2. We don’t generally advance people until they prove they can do the work at the next level. It’s why I indicated that my response would be that I would take the request for a raise into consideration at year end.

      2. If you were my direct report, I’d likely try to get you a nominal increase now (or maybe bump up your bonus %), and then take your performance into consideration at year end to try to bump it up more. I believe in paying people fairly for the work they do, I don’t want to pad your resume so you can go somewhere else.

        ASK ASK ASK!

        Just say, “I’m excited to take on more work and add more value to the company, and continue to grow in my career here. Do you know what kind of salary increase it comes with? If not, it sounds like it’ll add 10% to my workload, so would an increase of something like (current salary X 10%, rounded to nearest 1000) make sense?”

        Or if you think it bumps you to a higher grade, you might say “I’ve been hoping to move into (level +1) soon, so I’m excited for the opportunity! Do you know if this moves my job into a higher pay grade (or whatever it is called at your company)? Would that come along with a salary increase as well?”

        1. Oops posted without finishing my comment. Definitely ask, and see that as opening a negotiation. At best case, you get a title and salary bump. At worst, assuming you have a decent manager, you don’t, but you’ve put it into your manager’s mind that you should get a raise soon.

          The men I’ve managed don’t have a problem equating more work with more pay. Women almost NEVER ask, so I’ve had to be more mindful about making sure I go to bat for them to ensure my team doesn’t end up with disparities.

          In this situation, your manager is approaching you. You don’t NEED this to advance or be happy, so I think you’re well within your bounds to make sure this makes sense for you. No decent manager thinks less of a (good, well-performing) person for wanting to increase their salary and/or title when they take on more work, as long as they’re respectful and professional when asking.

      3. If you were my direct report, I’d expect you to tell me it will add 10% to your workload. We will then discuss if I need you to work 110% or if we can delegate other tasks elsewhere to keep you at 100%. And then depending on the work I would comp you at review time (assuming it’s a long term responsibility with growth) or give you a spot bonus (if it’s a big one and done project).

        But have the conversation about workload and don’t assume you need to be working at 110%.

    3. Thanks all for the advice! I’ll ask, but I think its unlikely anything I do currently can be delegated. A few things could just not be done at all, but I will never be promoted without doing them. This new responsibility is more of a chore that someone has to do, but that generally is pretty thankless (and doesn’t come into play for promotions, which is why I lean towards asking for a raise in order to do it).

      Typing this out, it sounds bad all around. Maybe a better question is, is there a graceful way to decline new responsibilities?

  8. Do people usually pay full price for hanky panky underwear, or is there a particularly good place to get them on sale? I’ve looked around and it seems like the discounted options seem very limited.

    1. Never pay full price for anything. ;-) They’re usually part of the NAS. Shopstyle tells me that they’re on sale online at Dillard’s now.

      1. I can usually find them on sale by stalking Last Call and Nordstrom Rack – between the two, they’re on sale at least 2x a month.

        1. This is what I do but I usually have the best luck in actual stores. Last Call, mostly. I think usually $11-13/pair.

    3. I started using a subscription service for my nicer underwear- they carry Cosabella, Natori, etc. They have a promo this month for 1 month free with the 6 or 12 month plan- AUGFUN at underclub.co

  9. I am feeling sassy today with my bright red nail polish, olive green sheath dress, and leopard print D’Orsay heels. That’s all :)

    2. That sounds great! I bought some leopard D’Orsay kitten heels over the weekend and can’t wait to bust them out!

    3. Thanks everyone! It’s been a trying day at work and personally/medically, so here’s to looking fierce when you don’t feel fierce! RAWR.

    4. Sounds like a great way to perk up a Monday. Love wearing anything leopard and red polish on my long nails.

  10. What are your thoughts/beliefs about the relative impact of being smart/naturally gifted or working very hard and being committed, diligent and focused? Do you think a person of (+/-) average intelligence or ability can achieve greatness in your field? Do you think this varies by field? How much of your views on this do you think you picked up from your parents & growing up?

    1. I think it’s a combination of factors but that both groups can achieve the same success. Someone who is born less intelligent can achieve great success, they just may have to study more than someone who has an easier time in school. At the same time, someone who is very intelligent can fail if they are not motivated to achieve success.

    2. I’m in the middle of a book on this exact topic. It’s called Grit by Angela Duckworth. Her TED talk on the same topic was great.

      Personally, I think talent can be developed and hard work is generally more important than “natural gifts.”

      Other interesting books on this topic are The Talent Code by Daniel Coyle and anything by K Anders Ericsson (his newest is called Peak but I haven’t read it yet).

        1. I haven’t finished it yet. I’m about 1/3 of the way in. It has a lot more detail on how she came to study the topic, studies that show related things, etc so far. I just started the section on how to develop grit, which I hope goes into a lot of detail.

    3. So I’m naturally not very smart. While my genius brother never opened a book and never had lower than a 4.0, I barely passed.

      I struggled a lot in school, would spend HOURS studying and was lucky to get Cs. (Once I got to college, my study habits paid off and I suddenly caught up and got As, but it never came easy).

      I always loved to read and write, but was terrible at it. I was dyslexic and was way behind in reading skills than other classmates. But from the time I was 9 on, I kicked my own butt and forced myself to read and write all the time. My parents didn’t realize I had dyslexia, but they threw me into speed reading classes with the hope I could catch up to my classmates.

      I worked really, really hard. I literally made myself schedules with minimum quotas of books I had to read per week and thousands of words I had to write each day. I was hyper-organized and was ridiculously diligent about it.

      I’m a freelancer writer now pushing a six-figure income. I turn away clients because I just don’t have the time. My work has appeared in top magazines. I still deal with imposter syndrome and expect people to figure out that I’m not exactly sure how “R”s are supposed to appear, but forcing myself into a strict routine has tricked people so far!

      1. It almost seems that you equate having dyslexia with not being “naturally” smart. I’m not sure I buy it. One of the greatest lawyers I’ve ever known is dyslexic. And it sounds like you rose to the top of your field too, once you learned to accommodate your reading issue. I hope you are kind to yourself.

    4. After a certain level (generally one standard deviation above the mean, or 115), it’s mostly a matter of how hard people work. We can all point to people with very high test scores who didn’t succeed, due to lack of effort or follow-through. You don’t have to be super smart to get a PhD, just persistent!

      2. As the question was brought up: For success in academia (conventionally measured as being a prof), imo you need the trifecta: intelligence, hard work and luck/contacts that can boost you.

    5. I’m naturally smart, but have a pretty poor work ethic. I don’t like to fail, so I always do as much as I need to to get the result I want, but I am 100% ok with being “good” instead of “amazing.” I got near straight A’s in school without ever working overly hard, and professionally I get by on a combination of soft skills and being a fast learner/having a very good memory for things I’ve heard only once in passing, but I don’t think I could cut it in a field that required a lot of diligence unless I was very interested in the topic beyond just wanting to do well.

      I think either can compensate for the other beyond certain minimums, but of the two I think committed and focused is probably a much bigger factor in achieving greatness. I’m sure my parents had something to say about this, but mostly it’s based on my own observation and experience.

      1. This is me! And law was probably not the way to go. While the school part was great, the practice rewards the hard workers…

      2. This was me, but I managed to push myself through it and learn a work ethic after a long period of unemployment and a last-ditch job that didn’t use any of my natural skills, where I was constantly terrified of being fired for the first six months. After I figured out how to get stuff done in a timely manner, even if the task was awful, boring, or just near impossible, I started getting promoted and quickly rose to the top-tier team. When I left for grad school, they said they’d be willing to hire me back after graduation at a higher level.

        So hard work can be learned, even if you’ve skated on intelligence all your life. You just need to have the fear of God put in you by a terrible job market and a job you’re not naturally suited for.

    6. In my field (research), once you’re smart enough to be capable, additional brilliance really doesn’t do anything more. It’s really a matter of natural aptitude (some people are just a natural at research – different than intelligence) and hard work.

  11. Does anyone have any suggestions as to where to find draft letters of reference for a person you have not actually worked with? US attorney applying for a federal government position.

    For context, I am applying for a position that asks for three letters of reference from barred attorneys at the outset. I am unwilling to ask anyone at my current job, as I’m not willing to disclose that I am looking. I already have two letters, but need a third ASAP (up against a tight USA Jobs deadline). So, I am having a close friend and law school classmate write the third letter. To make it easier for her, I want to provide a draft letter that my friend can use / change / not use as desired.

    Of course, my friend won’t be speaking to my actual work, as we don’t work together. So the letter will focus on my interest in the type of position (of which she has first-hand knowledge) and my general, I don’t know, character and fitness to practice law or whatever. Short and sweet. I need some inspiration for this type of language, though, as I’m much more familiar writing traditional letters of recommendation.

    Thanks in advance!

    1. Can she speak more broadly to her experience with the profession? Like “Alice’s professionalism and collegiality stand out as being the top tier of attorneys in xyz region.”

      I had a law school prof write a reference basically saying that while my grades were average, my attitude/interest/professionalism was outstanding – it helped get me my current job.

  12. Thanks to the person who posted about the 5 minute gratitude journal when I asked about being centered. I’ve been using it for a few weeks now and it’s definitely helped shift my perspective.

  13. Beautiful dress.

    I have a landscaping question (not a euphemism). We are considering smothering the grass in our small (15’x30′) backyard and putting down landscape fabric and gravel (with the thought of maybe experimenting with hardy creeping plants down the line). For various reasons, it’s not a practical space to mow, so we’d rather have it accessible and easy to maintain, which makes the gravel appealing. Has anyone ever done this? Any tips to share?

    We’re both pretty handy gardeners and maintain decorative plantings and produce beds elsewhere on the property, but for some reason the idea of spending time, effort, and money on gravel, not plants, feels a little offputting, so success stories or advice would be appreciated. And before you ask, no, we don’t need a grassy space for future progeny or pets to play.

    1. I just did this. Don’t skimp out on buying landscape fabric. The stuff I purchased was more rubbery than cloth and it has held up like a champ. I was lazily doing the area around my garden boxes, so I put it down over growing grass and covered it up with mulch. Haven’t had any grass peak through as compared to other areas I’ve previously done with cheaper, more cloth like landscape fabric.

      1. Thanks, Walnut! We’d been thinking of doing the full kill-off before putting down fabric (ie vinegar on the grass then smother with heavy black plastic for six weeks). I would really like it to be as low-maintenance as possible in the long run, so the rubber stuff sounds like an excellent resource.

    2. I feel like everyone I know is taking the rocks (used as mulch) OUT of their beds, not putting it in, and replacing with mulch (wood, or other organics). And that’s a pain. Are you talking pea gravel or Class 5 sized rock?

      1. I did gravel in my low-water landscape, and if I had it to do over again I’d have done mulch instead. The gravel gets pretty hot and it ends up feeling pretty post-apocalpytic on a hot summer day.

        1. I took out my grass and put in mulch and plants. I chose mulch because gravel gets hot and it’s actually pretty difficult to maintain. Unless you’re extremely diligent with a leaf blower, you will get dirt and leaves in your gravel and it will be enough for weeds to plant themselves.

          I think it’s much easier to maintain mulch. I put down a thick layer of mulch instead of landscape fabric (it all degrades eventually and weeds grow on top of it, so in my experience landscape fabric helps temporarily and makes it difficult to add plants). Almost no grass survived and the weeds are very manageable.

    3. You should think about whether this will impact resale value, in my area, getting rid of grass for rocks would not be a selling feature.

      1. This is definitely location specific. I’m in the midwest and I have rarely seen nice landscaping in lieu of lawn be a negative on sales price. Outdoor living more or less equals bonus square feet.

        1. +100. I think it depends on context of the neighbourhood. I think you can get away with it in a more urban setting but anywhere close to the sububs and it will stick out life a sore thumb.

    4. We didn’t install it, but we had a gravel pathway at our old house. I did generally like it (aesthetically it was fine where it was and it was relatively low maintenance), but I would suggest having some type of defined border (edging, garden fencing, rock wall) or otherwise you will have serious gravel creep. I feel like we found it everywhere after it rained.

      1. Agree. We use a natural edge but this needs to be redone about every year or so to keep looking sharp and is quite a bit of work. O believe the rubber edging is the easiest to mow around than brick or stone if that is a concern.

      1. Personal preference – I prefer defined, functional spaces to random expanses of yard. I look at lawn and think, “What a waste.”

          1. If it were my space, I’d create a gravel patio with pea gravel and build a fire pit in the middle. Put chairs around the fire pit and add plants around the whole area. Bonus points if you can incorporate a couple small retaining walls, add a pergola, or something else to give the feeling of a room. Garden boxes around two of the sides would also work.

          2. I had setup like this at the house I just left and I loved it so much we’re re-creating it at the Future Marital Residence.

          3. Yep, Walnut’s got it. There’s also a table and chairs for outdoor dining, a grill, and the paths between our raised produce beds. So actually, yes, mowing is *really* non-optimal because the furniture would need to be moved every time. If it were not a full-sun space I would probably be thinking about a moss underlayer (to avoid that post-apocalyptic feel Senior Attorney mentions above), but it seems like for now the best option is pea gravel and, in the future, hardy creeping xeriscaping. Man, if only old Victorian houses came with nice period gardens, too!

            Btw, we’re in a dense East Coast urban area, and when we purchased the house (fairly recently) the yard was entirely crabgrass. No intention to sell basically ever (seriously), but if we did, I think the functional+pretty outdoor space would be appealing–I didn’t mention all the lovely dahlias/peonies/roses blooming around the potential gravel (not all at the same time, obvi), but to my eyes it looks pretty nice!

    6. Please consider using those much larger “beach pebbles” rather than gravel. The gravel will just run away and esp. in rain and snow melt. We have an atrium with a gate that goes out to the driveway. There’s always a trail of gravel onto the driveway.

      We have used the landscape fabric, then the round, smooth grey beach rocks (they are shiny black when wet – lovely look). We edged all the areas with the flexible green fiberglass edging by Vigoro offered at big box hardware stores. They’ve held up for 4 years now.

      Also, you might look into a wood “boardwalk.” It’s good for the walkways. We sussed out a company on line and I can’t remember it. We got a teak one. It’s in sun and lots of rain and so far is just fine. Take solid, precise measurements. They were a super company. Even the cut outs we needed for the gate posts were just perfectly placed. The boardwalk is heavy so it’s a big delivery and maneuvering issue. I think the company actually described them as good for walking paths from a home to the seashore …

      It may or may not be this company; ours looks like what is called a “modular walkway).

      Happy planning — graph paper will be your friend.

      1. Yeah, I used one size up from pea gravel. And in the new place I’m using the smooth rocks anon anon talks about.

  14. I’m having trouble moving on from job applications. There are these jobs that I apply for, put a lot of work into my resume and cover letter, and I know I would be good at the job…and then I don’t hear anything back. How to stop obsessing?

    I’m panicking because my contract is up in a couple weeks and I haven’t found anything else yet. People keep telling me it’s a slow time of year, everyone is on vacation…ugh.

    1. Everyone is SO on vacation. It’s really irritating – super difficult to conduct regular business, let alone interviews. Hang in there!

    2. It is! I’m at a small firm and in my group, all 3 partners are on vacation right now and have been off and on for the last 6 weeks. Not a whole lot is getting done to be honest…

    3. I think that you need to reset your mind regarding applying for jobs. First, you should stop applying to random postings and start applying through friends and contacts that can shepherd your application through. Your hit rate for interviews will go way up. If you are applying via a random internet posting, then you should expect a very low hit rate–15% or so. It sucks. It just is the way it is.

      When I am in jobsearch mode, I try to make goals for the day and for the week. For the day–spend 2 hours online searching, apply to three jobs. For the week, try to have two coffee chats/info interviews. If you need to have a friend be your jobsearch buddy to keep you on track, do that.

      And yes, sadly it is a bad time of year, but that means that you need to up the volume on your search that much more.

      Good luck! You can do this. It’s a numbers game. Tell yourself you just have to throw a lot of darts at the wall.

      1. +1 to this – great advice.

        I use a spreadsheet to keep track of applications, interviews, contacts, etc. It can get hairy quick, especially if you’re sending out dozens of apps in a week.

    4. Just letting you know that you’re not alone. I’ve followed the (very good) advice of the other posters and tried to limit my applications to only jobs where I have an “in” with someone and it’s still a long slog. I can’t believe the time companies expect you to take in filling in out the online background section (so much for just having an updated resume). It is time consuming. Even more so when you actually DO get the interview and you have to prepare for it. It’s a real bummer then to not get the offer. I spent about 5 hours yesterday working on one application (no joke) for a senior job. It’s a great opportunity but sheesh! That’s a long time!!

      1. Yes, we are seeing that the online application process has become a bit more involved to weed out candidates that are just half-heartedly applying. Our in-house metrics show that we are getting better results by asking for more upfront. Just a thought, any way to differentiate yourself is always helpful!

        2. I understand–but it doesn’t make it any less frustrating. I already tailor my resume to the job description so that an electronic search will ensure that I’m hitting the “key words” the company might be using to do an initial screen. To re-enter that data in an electronic form is really rather off-putting (makes me think the company doesn’t value time or efficiency). It’s particularly irritating to go through the process only to learn that the posting was essentially filled internally! Rant over.

      2. Why on earth would you limit your job search to places you have an “in”? I’ve gotten every job I’ve ever had (including an entry-level associate position in Big Law) by applying to a online job ad. I could understand if you only have time to apply to one job/week that you would want to apply to jobs where you have a better chance of getting an interview, but if you’re applying en masse, why rule out a bunch of potentially great jobs just because you don’t have a personal connection?

        1. Anecdata: the only job I’ve gotten where I didn’t have an “in” is my internship at graduate school, where I was applying for a university-subset organization of the university I am attending. Every single other previous internship and job was all at least tangentially connected to me, even if it was just a congregant I met at synagogue sending me his neighbor’s name since his neighbor ran an organization in my field and often hired interns.

        2. I am relatively senior and in a niche area. Thus, the idea of sending out applications “en masse” is not feasible for me as there are very few jobs that come on the open market. When I do see one that is of interest, I always check to see if I know someone who can put my resume in front of the hiring person. Even then (and even with very solid credentials), I still haven’t passed the initial screening for some. My last two jobs were purely the result of a personal connection. My first two jobs in Big Law firms, however, were the results of (i) OCI and (ii) a head hunter sending lots of apps out on my behalf. So while I think that entry level/early job searches may benefit from high quantity applications, my recent experience is that I need a very good quality contact to even get a foot in the door.

    5. Depending on the industry, it may just take a long time for them to get through applications. My (then) dream job called me for an interview 3 months after I had started a new position, and 5 months after I had submitted the application.

      But it’s so frustrating. The only thing that worked for me was to stop obsessing by applying for more jobs. As long as I knew I was doing everything I could do, I could live with it. You’ll get through it. Hugs.

  15. I’m feeling so overwhelmed and stuck at work. I’m in somewhat of a niche area and we aren’t able to relocate due to family health reasons. Does anyone else daydream about just giving notice and going to work in retail or at the library or some other job where you truly leave it at work?

    1. Ugh, I feel like this quite a bit. Everyone tells me that they think I would be bored within a few days, but I don’t know if I would!

    2. Um, yes. Depends on the year/month day, but right now I am pretty down in the dumps and dreaming of taking a year off to spend with my last little one before he starts school. Lots of days when I’m humming “take this job and shove it”–and I don’t like Country. I literally day dream of handing in my notice.

      So, to stay on topic with the post, I’ll share that I’ve started compulsively shopping. I just bought a slew of the Tahari dresses on sale at Nordstrom. They are simply perfection. I never really tried this brand before and am accustomed to having to spend a lot more to get something that works with my apple-shaped body. I will say, though, that the Nordstrom pictures usually show the dresses as FAR shorter than they are in person (and I’m 5’8″ so it’s not like they’re just longer on me because I’m short…I’m not). There are quite a few dresses that I would have been scared off of based on the length shown in the pictures that I took a chance on and they have worked out great!

    3. As someone who works at a traditional library, I think it’s condescending to say that we leave it at work.

      Having said that, I do daydream of a job where there are less stressors.

      1. Not the OP, but my guess is that she meant a job like shelving books at a library or something else where the stereotype is that you can’t do the work outside the office so everyone must leave those jobs clicking their heels as they head out the door at night.

      2. ha! I was thinking the exact same thing. Librarian work is hard, I”m also on the tenure track and on call for nights and weekends every week I’m not on vacation. Unless I’m on a planned, out of town vacation (and not even then sometimes) I can’t leave work at work

      3. And this is why I’m always hesitant to post on this site.

        I am not belittling those with MLS degrees. I just meant shelving books or similar, where I can turn my work brain and work emails off when I leave.

        1. Given that those kinds of jobs are usually the lower paying ones, you would be trading in “leave the job at work” for “how am I going to make ends meet this month”. I guess each has its tradeoffs :)

      4. I don’t think saying you leave your work at work is an insult or implies the job is not prestigious or challenging. I have an interesting, challenging, fairly high-paying job that I enjoy, but I work standard 9-5 hours, almost never think about work outside of those hours and don’t have work email on my phone.

    4. I was recently on vacation at the beach and was really jealous of the lady running the snow cone stand. I thought that would be so nice to stand on the pier by the ocean selling snow cones.

      2. She makes minimum wage and the job is seasonal. Get real. This kind of fantasizing just is so shallow.

        My mom used to walk the beaches in her homeland, braiding tourists hair for money. She would have tourists tell her how nice her life is, walking the beach in the sunshine, braiding people’s hair for a living. The reality is she has no other economic avenues to earn a living in a place where unemployment was close to 20%.

    6. Bartending fantasy. I’d wear a push-up bra for better tips and listen to everybody’s problems.

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