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Our daily workwear reports suggest one piece of work-appropriate attire in a range of prices.
In the market for a versatile sweater dress to wear for every occasion this winter? Look no further.
This sleeveless mockneck dress from Banana Republic will work for the office (add a long cardigan or a belt and blazer), dinner out (toss on some fun earrings, tights, and booties), or your family get-together (layer a long sleeved white top underneath).
As an added bonus, this dress is machine washable, so no need to add a dry cleaning pickup to your to-do list.
The dress is $140 at Banana Republic and comes in regular sizes XXS–XXL and tall sizes S–XL.
It also comes in red, heather taupe, and dark cherry red.
Sales of note for 9.30.24
- Nordstrom – Beauty deals through September
- Ann Taylor – Extra 30% off sale
- Banana Republic Factory – 50% off everything + extra 20% off
- Boden – 15% off new styles
- Eloquii – Extra 50% off sale
- J.Crew – 50% off select styles
- J.Crew Factory – Up to 60% off everything + 50% off sale with code
- Lo & Sons – Warehouse sale, up to 70% off
- M.M.LaFleur – Save 25% sitewide
- Neiman Marcus – Friends & Family 25% off
- Rag & Bone – Friends & Family 25% off sitewide
- Spanx – Lots of workwear on sale, some up to 70% off
- Talbots – Fall Cyber Monday sale, 40% off sitewide and $5 shipping
- Target – Car-seat trade-in event through 9/28 — bring in an old car seat to get a 20% discount on other baby/toddler stuff.
- White House Black Market – 40% off select styles
AIMS
I can take or leave the sweater dress but I love the coat!
Anonymous
I came here to say exactly this!
No Face
The dress looks good on the model on the website, but I don’t really get sleeveless sweater dresses. I don’t want to wear a sweater over a sweater dress.
AZCPA
I think it’s for us Arizonans, where we want to look wintery and ward off a gentle chill.
Anon
I have a sleeveless sweater dress, and it is a lot less versatile than you would think. It’s hard to find a jacket/blazer/cardigan that looks good on top of it.
REAtty
I’m all about a skinny jersey turtleneck under a sleeveless sweater dress. It makes me feel chic!
Anon
What are your favorite leftover turkey sandwiches? I love Mel’s kitchen cafe turkey cranberry brie panini but looking for others too!
anon
Sorry to be so basic, but mayo and white bread. Unfortunately, not eating either at the moment. Actually, we’re not having turkey either. Oh well!
Anon
Mayo and basic b*tch white bread is amazing. A slice of havarti, maybe toast the bread . . . so delicious. IDK why I don’t have turkey more b/c the leftovers are better than the main event.
Aunt Jamesina
Sub out a leftover homemade roll for the white bread and this is my sandwich of choice.
Nora
I really like the Pret a manger one
I was in Heathrow airport the other day and was entertained to see a very similar sandwich being sold as a “Christmas lunch sandwich”
Anonymous
I like a panini!
Anonymous
I would do a turkey pot pie with any leftovers.
Anonymous
I don’t understand why you need anything other than your favorite. It’s a perfect sandwich. But if variety is your game, the other two answers are (a) turkey BLT and (b) turkey reuben.
Anon
I like to put thin layers of the whole dinner into the sandwich – turkey, stuffing, gravy, cranberry sauce, mashed potatoes, heaven!
Anonymous
Oh Russian dressing and melted Swiss with sauerkraut on rye with a Diet doctors browns black cherry soda. Or Russian dressing with lettuce and tomato on a kaiser roll and Diet Coke.
Anonymous
Add some cole slaw to that sandwich with Russian dressing and I am coming over.
Anonymous
Come over! Bring good pickles and we’ll have a good long chat at the kitchen table!
anon a mouse
Thin smear of mayo, thin smear of leftover stuffing, slice of cranberry sauce from a can, lettuce, turkey, on hearty bread. Literally the only time of year I like mayo on a sandwich, but it really makes it.
Anon
Grrr — I forgot my canned cranberry sauce! I am the only one who likes it, but I do like it.
Anon
Sourdough, Mayo (Best Foods only) Turkey, lots of salt and pepper, cranberry sauce, iceberg lettuce. This is the way.
Anony
Not exactly a sandwich but I make thanksgiving leftover ‘boats’ with puff pastry – cut the puff pastry into rectangles, then layer mashed potatoes/squash, chopped up green bean casserole, turkey, and cranberry sauce; pinch the corners diagonally together, egg-wash, and bake. Any variety of leftovers work and the puff pastry makes it feel ‘fancy’.
Senior Attorney
I am super basic: turkey on a leftover dinner roll with lots of butter and salt and pepper!
Betsy
My basic Fitbit broke and I’m trying to decide if I should replace it with the same, or whether I should splurge and upgrade to an Apple Watch. Any Apple Watch wearers care to sing their praises or express your regret at dropping the money? Hoping I might be able to find a decent Black Friday sale.
Abby
I got an apple watch 3 a few years ago because it was on super sale, and had thought I didn’t want it, but now it’s broken and I’m going to replace it with whatever Black Friday deal I find. Especially if you have an iphone, I love the convenience of having everything on my phone integrated on my watch. I can control Spotify, receive and reply to texts, answer calls (when connected through wifi). Most of all, I love the rings. DH and I think it makes us more active.
Anonymous
Probably the only one. But my Apple watch took forever to charge and I didn’t use any of the features really, so I went back to my fit bit.
Anonymous
The sole benefit of a FitBit over the Apple Watch is the battery life. Otherwise, the Apple Watch is far superior in my mind. It has so many more applications and works seamlessly with so many other things (music, texting, answering calls, find my iPhone, etc.).
Nora
I love my apple watch and miss it if I forget to wear it. I don’t link messages or anything to it, I mainly use it for steps and while I’m swimming, and for google maps directions if I’m driving. The tracking while swimming is definitely my favorite part. I like having a measure of how much I moved during the day though. It’s also convenient to pick up calls on it sometimes, because I don’t always keep my phone on me.
Anonymous
My husband loves his apple watch. In addition to the stuff that I think Fitbit provides (step counting, standing-tracking), he likes that it helps him keep distant from his phone. He can put his phone far away and if a text comes in, just glance at it, but not be distracted by other things.
That being said, I find it infuriating when he keeps it on during dinner. We always put our phones away but it took him a couple of months to realize he needed to put the watch away too!
Meara
I dislike the battery life but constantly use the “make my phone make a noise so I can find it” feature on the watch
Anon
I can’t speak to fitbut, but the Garmin Vivoactive line has this feature, too (and I use it often!). My first generation Vivoactive is still going strong. I think I got it in 2015.
Anon
Oh man I have a Garmin vivoactive and didn’t know that it had this feature. Thanks for letting me know!
Anonymoose
Just coming on to recommend the Vivoactive. It does all the things- tracker, texts, apple wallet- and the battery life is fairly impressive. It’s on pretty big discount on a-zon today too.
Anonymous
Yes this is low-key the best reason to get one!
Is it Friday yet?
Fitbits do this too!
anon
I have a garmin. I found I couldn’t read the apple watch without my reading glasses.
AnonMom
I love my Apple Watch, and would love it more if I could actually use the cell-capability. Didn’t realize when I bought it that in order for that to work, you have to have both your phone and your watch on the same account (not just the same carrier like the description said). Since my phone is through work, I’ve not been able to take advantage of that feature.
Regardless, I like the fitness tracking, the subtle notifications, and the ability to control things like podcasts with just a tap on my wrist while driving.
Anon
Just want to say that I love this blog. I’ve been reading for maybe 10 years now. I check in during my work day when I need a mental break.
What are some of the small things you are thankful for?
Abby
Smart plugs with a timer so my Christmas lights go on everyday at 4:30. It still surprises me every day when I leave my office and makes me smile
Pep
Same! I love pulling into my driveway after a long day and seeing my house all lit up.
Anon
Oh the smart plug is such a good idea! I will put this in my to do list
H13
I’m also incredibly grateful for this space. I’m grateful that I have discovered that I can read romance novels and that it doesn’t make me any less smart. Who knew! Wish it hadn’t taken me 40 years to realize this. SO many great romances out there and there is always a happy ending.
Anon
I feel like that with the Daily Mail and the NY Post.
Aunt Jamesina
I am so grateful for having had my grandmother in my life, who died almost a week ago at age 97. She was an incredible example of strength, generosity, humility, and JOY despite being dealt a pretty rough deal in many ways in her life. She lived long enough to meet my daughter this year, which was amazing. She had dementia and we weren’t sure what she would take away from it, but she was so excited to snuggle and rock her. Best moment of this year by far.
Curious
I love this (and I don’t think I’ve congratulated you on your precious and long-haired daughter. Congratulations:):))
Aunt Jamesina
Thank you!
Curious
omg, long -awaited. What on earth is autocorrect doing to me?!
Aunt Jamesina
Haha, I figured (and kinda love the autocorrect since baby J is pretty bald!)
Anon
Likewise grateful my kids have grandparents in their life.
Grateful my employer actively encourages taking time off and work life balance.
Grateful to all of you on this blog, which I’ve been reading since 2008(!)
Grateful to have felt comfortable enough to attend an orchestral performance recently
Grateful that the Era of Trump might (might?) be nearing its end
Grateful for DH’s 4 years of sobriety
Cb
I’m grateful for my really lovely housemate in work city. I walked in exhausted last night and she was making spaghetti and meatballs and invited me to join her. I think I’d be really lonely if I was living on my own/hoteling while here.
anon
Years ago, we replaced our two-basin drop-in kitchen sink with a single-basin one. Being able to wash big pots easily makes our lives easier. It’s a really small thing, but it makes me happy. (I’m particularly grateful that we were able to find a new one that fit perfectly into the hole from the old sink, so it was simple enough to replace that we did it ourselves!)
Curious
I love this!
Anon
Im grateful I have two young adult kids who still like me and can’t wait to be home for Thanksgiving!
Anon
This is #goals! I’m thankful that my 7 year old, who has been obsessed with increasing independence lately, came to my bed to snuggle after she had a bad dream. Ive been feeling down lately and didn’t realize how much I needed the snuggles!
Curious
We appear to have confirmed that my daughter did not inherit my crossed eyes and does not need toddler glasses! And my in-laws, who really are as good as second parents, arrive today :)
Curious
Oh, also thankful I figured out that the wire brush I use for cast iron is so much better than a sponge for the first pass at anything needing scrubbing. Dishwashing has gotten so much better.
Nonny
do you have a link? Tia! I have been using mesh scrubbies because I do not like sponges but the mesh scrubbies take a long time to remove tough, cooked on food.
Senior Attorney
Most grateful for this community!! Also so grateful for this wonderful time in my life — was just telling my lovely husband this morning that we are so lucky to have everything we need and almost everything we want!
NYNY
To last night’s Anon who was unsure about your kick flare pants, look at Anthropolgie “the Margot” pants for styling ideas. Most of the images show ankle boots, which can be sleek or chunky.
Anon
Thank you so much!! That was me! I wonder if this is a new trend – not sure how long these have been around.
PS If anyone is still wanting a pair, it looks like a lot (but not all) sizes are back in stock.
https://www.jcrew.com/p/womens/categories/clothing/suiting/demi-boot-ponte-pant/BL701
H13
Merino sock recs? I’ve tried Smartwool and they haven’t held up as well as I would like. Do Bombas wear well? Any other recs? Would love to look for sales this weekend. Thanks!
Anon
Would also like to know! Thanks in advance!
Monday
Falke.
NYNY
Falke knee-high SoftMerino socks are my absolute favorites! Cotton inside for softness, merino outside for warmth, and lightweight enough to be appropriate for anything. Love!!
Anon
Darn Tough. I have several pairs of different weights (boot socks to hiking socks) I got when my kid was in K. Kid is almost old enough to drive now. LLBean ones are also long lasting.
Anon
Not exactly sure the material composition but it’s a holiday for my feet every time I wear my Darn Tough socks. I have their thick hiking socks for skiing and cold outdoor days in the city, and wear their no show cushion socks for normal days when my feet are sore or I’ll be walking around a lot.
Betsy
Darn Tough will wear well, but they are also less than 50% wool and the rest is nylon with a little spandex. So they certainly ought to wear well! You aren’t going to find a 100% wool sock because it would practically be a single use product, but I think around 75-80% wool is a more appropriate blend. Bombas are 77% – they don’t last forever but for a wool sock I am happy with them.
Anon
Interesting. Is there a point at which more wool is better or just more itchy?
Betsy
So merino wool is soft and warm, but it isn’t strong, which is why it needs the nylon. A 100% merino sock would be cozy, but it would wear out really fast because it wouldn’t hold up to the friction of rubbing around inside a shoe. Other types of wool are stronger, but they would be too itchy for most people to wear on their feet. The more nylon you add, the stronger it will be, but you lose some of the benefits of the wool. 15-25% nylon is pretty common in sock yarns for knitters, and personally I think that’s a good balance. But if you want your socks to last for many years, a higher percentage of nylon will increase the strength of the fabric.
Anon
I’m a sock knitter too, and agree about the nylon. My sweet spot is a 75% superwash merino, 25% nylon blend.
Anon
My sock drawer is a combination of Darn Tough (received as gifts and really excellent) and these guys from Costco: https://www.costco.com/kirkland-signature-ladies'-extra-fine-merino-wool-blend-crew-sock%2c-4-pair.product.100947807.html
The Costco socks have held up better than Smartwool, and at 1/4 the price.
anonchicago
Agree on the Costco socks. I have some Smartwool socks for hiking but think those Costco ones are my new favorite. They’re so soft too.
PolyD
The Costco socks are the One True Socks.
Nesprin
All hail the Costco socks.
Anon
Bombas are good socks but if you are looking for socks that hold up well, you cannot beat Darn Tough socks. The Darn Tough socks are warm, comfy, and last forever! My husband is super hard on socks and his Darn Tough socks that he got at least five years ago still look new.
anon a mouse
My wool Bombas have held up well, and they have a lifetime guarantee. I’ve had several of their non-wool socks develop holes (like one a year, not that common) and with one quick email to customer service, I’ve received replacements in the mail.
Gail the Goldfish
I buy them at costco because it’s $17 for 4 pairs. Are they fabulous and the perfect sock, no, but for 4 pairs for less than one smartwool pair would cost me, they are warm enough and have lasted at least a full winter.
Anon
Icebreaker. They are more durable than Smartwool. I’m not sure if they still offer a lifetime guarantee, but they always have taken any back that are wearing out and give me a new pair.
Anon
Does anyone know of any really basic finance sites that have a good overview of the FTX crash? My kid is now fascinated by this, but is a middle-schooler, so not getting a FT subscription just for this. Also, kid is a middle-schooler, so a lot of the finance world is uncharted water but for how debit and gift cards work. Kid is really amazed that someone in a hoodie walks away with billions of dollars and no one notices and I totally get that. And yet is willing to read anything on the topic and I want to encourage that b/c it’s not random other junk on the web. Even a YouTube video (“how to avoid having audited financial statements while you use corporate funds to buy stuff on a tropical island”). Interesting that his parents are both law professors (although I guess this proves that lawyers are bad at math / finance / money things or maybe kids just don’t listen, like ever, sometimes).
Ribena
Slate Money podcast is very good – listening rather than reading but an excellent resource for this kind of thing
Anon
Hey! I’m a lawyer who’s great at math. Anyway, all the financial press has covered extensively. If you have apple news, just go to the channel there and good time to get a family upgrade to news plus. NYT also covered, the morning and dealbook newsletters have good summaries.
Anon
+1000 I’m a lawyer who did my undergrad in STEM. There are a lot of us! I hate the “lawyers are bad at math” stereotype.
Anon
I’m a math person who works with lawyers, and it’s the lawyers who perpetuate the stereotype. I cannot tell you how many of them have told me, “I became an attorney so I didn’t have to do math! Hahahah!”
anon
I took several classes from SBF’s dad, so I can confirm that at least one parent was quite good at math. Doesn’t seem to have helped lol.
(I’m also a lawyer who has a math-y (math/econ) degree!)
Anon
Yeah you’re right a lot of it comes from lawyers. I’m just saying I hate when lawyers perpetuate that attitude.
Senior Attorney
Yeah, joke’s on them when it comes time to calculate damages…
tova
youtuber coffeezilla has great videos about this. I *feel* like he doesn’t swear , but don’t quote me.
Jo April
Try https://nymag.com/intelligencer/article/sam-bankman-fried-ftx-bankruptcy-what-happened.html
JTM
Vox has had some really good ELI5 articles on this. I’d start with this one – https://www.vox.com/the-goods/23451761/ftx-sam-bankman-fried-bankrupt-binance-bitcoin-alameda
Anon
The crypto kid went to MIT so I don’t think he has any genetic predisposition to being bad at math. Irresponsible and dumb are different things.
Nesprin
Yeah, this is such a weird take- this new FTX scandal has a lot more in common with Enron or Theranos than a “oopsie the founders are bad at math”. No one would ever say that Bernie Madoff was bad at math.
Anon
OTOH, if my kid’s company was going gangbusters and I found the numbers opaque (or not-existing or not audited — Madoff at least had a CPA in a strip mall somewhere), my antennae would be up. Not an accountant, but had a teacher once say always to flip to the footnotes to the financial statements and start reading there; it would be where the good stuff was. So IDK who put $ into this company (like the not-so-early $) who didn’t get anything in the way of disclosures. That is a head-scratcher.
Anon
End of the day, all the flashy crypto stuff aside, it was a Ponzi scheme. Bankman-Fried stole money depositors had put in the FTX exchange to cover trading losses from bad bets his girlfriend/friend/whatever made at Alameda. The kid is a thief, no different than Bernie Madoff. Slight variation on the theme, but still a crook. He should be in jail right now.
Did anyone else see that they were running the financials for a multibillion-dollar company off an Excel spreadsheet with some notations put in the cells? Stupendous! I have no idea how this company evaded any regulatory oversight and operated in complete isolation with billions of dollars of people’s money for as long as it did without someone blowing the whistle. A teacher’s pension fund in Canada put money into FTX! More controls are definitely needed.
anon
Matt Levine’s Money Stuff newsletter has covered this really well – as a bonus, he is hilarious. https://newsletterhunt.com/newsletters/money-stuff-by-matt-levine
Anon
I can’t speak to the request on this scandal or financial blogs but the money laundering / offshore aspect I can. I recommend the book Moneyland by Oliver Bullough as a good place to start. There was a finance sector scandal with the payment platform Wirecard in Germany that might also interest him – there is even a netflix movie about it (Skandal, bringing down wirecard).
And for other scandals that bring in the offshore element, he might be interested in the Panama Papers, Pandora Papers, FinCen Files.
Anon
The Netflix movie about Wirecard is great! That situation was bananas! Amazing it went on so long before anyone caught on to what was happening.
Anonymous
I’m in a book club. We are creating the list for 2023! We read one book per month. We focus on books written by women, although a few male/nonbinary authors over the years. Any favorite recommendations? We are mostly age 30-50, we’ve read memoirs, novels, nonfiction, graphic novels, you name it. Here are some recent picks to give an idea of scope:
Untamed by Glennon Doyle
The Vanishing Half by Brit Bennett
Everything Beautiful In Its Time by Jenna Bush Hager
Fifty Words for Rain by Asha Lemmie
Still Life by Louise Penny
Such a Fun Age by Kiley Reid
Maybe You Should Talk to Someone by Lori Gottlieb
The Four Winds by Kristin Hannah
A Tree Grows in Brooklyn by Betty Smith
The Dutch House by Ann Patchett
The Lion’s Den by Katherine St. John
Pride by Ibi Zoboi
The Happiness Project by Gretchen Rubin
You by Caroline Kepnes
Crying in H Mart by Michelle Zauner
Wholehearted Faith by Rachel Held Evans
Maid by Stephanie Land
The Song of Achilles by Madeline Miller
People We Meet on Vacation by Emily Henry
Everything Happens for a Reason (And Other Lies I’ve Loved) by Kate Bowler
Great Circle by Maggie Shipstead
The Sentence by Louise Erdrich
I Think You’re Wrong (But I’m Listening) by Sarah Stewart Holland and Beth Silvers
The Pillow Book by Sei Shonagon
Thanks in advance!
Anonymous
Seven Husbands Of Evelyn Hugo by Taylor Jenkins Reid.
Carrots
I will always sing the praises of “the Once and Future Witches” by Alix E. Harrow. Amazing narrative about three sisters.
Anon
Ooh fun. I like a lot of the books on this list.
My 4 and 5 star reads from 2022 so far (almost all female authors) are below. Asterisk for my favorites.
The Crane Wife by CJ Hauser
The Marriage Portrait by Maggie O’Farrell*
Counterfeit by Kristin Chen
Mercury Pictures Presents by Anthony Marra
Finlay Donovan is Killing It by Elle Cosimano
Carrie Soto is Back by Taylor Jenkins Reid
The It Girl by Ruth Ware
Where the Forest Meets the Stars by Glendy Vanderah**
The Latecomer by Jen Hanff Korelitz*
Breathless by Amy McCulloch
This Time Tomorrow by Emma Straub*
Love and Ruin by Paula McLain
Dava Shastri’s Last Day by Kirthana Ramisetti
The Great Believers by Rebecca Makkai*
Disorientation by Elaine Hsieh Chou
The Younger Wife by Sally Hepworth
What Comes After by Joanne Tompkins
Sea of Tranquility by Emily St. John Mandel*
Mercy Street by Jennifer Haigh
The Smash-Up by Ali Benjamin*
One to Watch by Kate Stayman-London
The Whisper Network by Chandler Baker
Migrations by Charlotte McConaghy
State of Terror by Hillary Clinton and Louise Penney
Intimacies by Katie Kitamura
Cb
That’s a great list, can I be in your book club? I’d add the Patricia Lockwood book, and Detransition Baby. What about Sea of Tranquility? Monica Ali’s Love Marriage? Some Zadie Smith?
Anon
My bookclub had a great discussion about Olga Dies Dreaming recently.
Cb
I loved it!
Anon
Having some FOMO. I’m female and a known reader and generally a joiner and no one has ever asked me to be in a book club with them.
Anon
Same here! Although I’m kind of a control freak about what I read so I’m not sure I would actually want to be in a book club. But I would like to be *asked* haha.
Anon
This exactly! I’d like to come over for drinks and some literary or literary-ish chat.
Anon
They often fall apart and no one reads the book. I’ve been in so many and they’re just often hard unless you have the absolute perfect overlap of people you like who share your exact reading taste.
PolyD
My book club has been going for 20+ years. But we are pretty flexible – it is entirely legit to not read the book and come to the meeting anyway just for social reasons. The only rule is people won’t avoid spoilers when talking about the book. And we take turns picking books, although try to choose books that are available in the library system.
I have made some good friends through my bookclub and we socialize outside of the meetings, too, which is nice. We are also flexible about people dropping in and out – some people drop out when they have small kids and then come back, some people move away and then come back and pick up right where they left off.
Is it Friday yet?
I actually think it makes for better discussions when people are split on books – when everyone likes the book there’s just a lot of yeah it was great blah blah. I’ve been in a book club since I moved to my current place in 2015 (found through Meetup!) and we differ a lot on what we end up liking. Griping at each other’s book picks (and sometimes our own!) is part of the fun! We also have a similar policy re not reading, people are welcome to come anyway just beware of spoilers.
PolyD
Yep, we have the same atmosphere that it’s okay to not like the book (although we’re not d*cks about it). I have become known as the person who never likes the books that win awards (Goldfinch, The Elegance of the Hedgehog, etc.)
Curious
PolyD, I sometimes disagree with your takes on things, but in this we are deeply, deeply aligned. See also: What is the point of Jonathan Franzen?
Anon
You should start one if you have other friends who read! Lots of people feel the same way you do. Or libraries and sometimes indie bookstores will also have them that you can join. If you know people who are in book clubs, you can also always ask if they’re taking new members. I’m in one that’s always happy to welcome new people.
Anon
Same! I think my problem is that my in-town friends are moms of my kids’ friends, and we are only friends through our kids.
The friends I’ve met through work live all over the place, but generally a hefty commute from my house and each other, so a book club that meets regularly would be a huge hassle and would probably fizzle.
If my local mom friends have a book club, they certainly haven’t invited me!
Anon
Start one!
Anonymous
Between Two Kingdoms by Suleika Jouoad
Explorette
The Power
Senior Attorney
Loved that one!
Anon
Our Missing Hearts, Celeste Ng
The Farm, Joanne Ramos
Island of Sea Women, Lisa See
Invisible Life of Addie LaRue, VE Schwab
Hamnet, Maggie O’Farrell
Hypatia
Honestly if I had a book club of women I would want to read ‘Women, Race and Class’ by Angela Davis. Make your book club a source of reflection.
Anonymous
The Giver of Stars
Every Summer After
The Late Bloomers’ Club
Nora Goes Off Script
Book Lovers
How to Fail at Flirting
Winter Solstice
Bully Market
Senior Attorney
I loved the last two books I read: The Cartographers by Peng Shepherd, and Our Missing Hearts by Celeste Ng.
anon
How often do you all buy clothes not on sale? I have a *long* list of clothing I have been needing for awhile. Things like coats, knee-high boots, work shirts, new suits, new running gear. And I’m constantly replacing work shoes for some reason. I’m finding things I like, but then I don’t buy them because I’m like, what if there is a sale TOMORROW? So then they just sit in the cart and I’m like gee, I wish I had a coat that covered my butt that didn’t make me look like a marshmallow.
I like fashion, or, I like feeling put together, but I’m really picky and don’t find the shopping experience enjoyable at all (this is probably in part because of my size). I also don’t like owning lots of clothes. So because of that, I’m inclined to throw money at the problem and ignore sales when I find something I like, but I don’t know how ridiculous that is. Does everyone just all buy coats and shoes on sale only? How do you know when the sales are? How do you keep track? What if when the sale comes up they are out of your size or the color you want?
(I feel like I really lack clothing shopping skills in general. My family never did things like back-to-school shopping; my mom loves thrifting and basically bought all of my clothes growing up, and well into adulthood too. I’m still coming to terms with how much clothes of even semi-decent quality should cost.)
(Also sorry, I’m sure this has been asked before…)
Anonymous
I try to not plan around sales. A lot of my most worn clothes are things I loved and bought full price. I’m also picky and waiting for sales means not having the options I want available.
Senior Attorney
Same
Senior Attorney
But coming back to add I am reasonably diligent about getting price adjustments if the item goes on sale soon after I buy it.
Anon
About 50% of the time for kids’ items; less so for me.
I get staples when they are on sale that are consumables (white socks for kids, bras, turtleneck shirts). Other places, I pause b/c I know there will be a sale soon. But for things for me, that I need, I just buy them when I find what I need (suits that fit, shoes that fit, coats) b/c I tend to keep stuff so long that $ per wear is negligible. That said, for BR, LE, ON, I have a sense that if I wait a week or two, I can hit a sale or at least a decent discount.
anon
I like this perspective. None of the stuff on my list is trendy anyways! And a lot of it isn’t that size-dependent either (I’m at a relatively low weight for myself right now and keep anticipating weight gain, which has probably contributed to my lack-of-clothing situation now).
It also helped me in thinking through how much money to spend. I love Burberry’s trench coat, but it would be three grand after tailoring. Even spaced out over ten years, I wouldn’t spend $300 on a coat every single year.
Nora
I do it within reason. If I see something on sale that I know I’ll use, like that coat or work shoes, I will buy it even though I don’t use it right now. I sometimes keep the tags on until I wear that item so that its clear that its new. I also don’t like having too many clothes so I’ve taken to aggressively Marie Kondo-ing and selling clothes that don’t give me joy.
Some stores, like Express or Ann Taylor, are continually or often enough having some type of sale. So if I’m looking for something in particular I just look at a few of those stores. There is also a small outlet mall near me and I’ve taken to buying a lot of things from Banana Republic Factory or Express Factory.
Anne-on
It depends on what the item is, how badly I need it, and how sad I’ll be if it is sold out by the time it goes on sale. Kids clothes I try very hard to buy on sale both because there are frequently sales but also because they grow so quickly! I also tend to shop the same retailers so I ‘know’ their sale frequencies and time my purchases around those – also ask in store! Every store associate I’ve ever asked has been happy to let me know they’ll be running a sale in a few weeks/over the holidays. With very few exceptions almost everything goes on at least a 10-15% discount regularly, but the ‘big’ cuts (30-50%) are usually around back to school, black friday, or last season’s clothing in March/August (great time to snag boots/winter coats in March as the classic styles dont’ change much and bathing suits in August).
Anon
Running gear: buy when I need it. If it’s on sale, I stock up (bought a sports bra and a few pairs of shorts on the Oiselle sale). But sales are hard to find. I buy my sneakers through Fleet Feet because the “spend $150, get $15” deal is unbeatable.
Winter coats: buy the first or second week in January.
Other: depends on the store and item. Shoes are often hard to find on sale. Antonio Melani – buy at end of season. Brooks Brothers – buy on sale. I firmly believe that I am better off “overpaying” for a great item by $20 or so than buying several sub-par items.
ELS
I’m also not a fan of shopping, like having a small(er) wardrobe, and like feeling put together. My mother was also a thrifter, and I wore a ton of fast fashion (often on sale) into my early professional career. This was not the model I wanted for my adult self, which has meant being picky about what I buy, and because of that, caring less about sales than I did in my 20s (I’m 37 now).
I’m sale-conscious, in that I get emails from stores that I like a lot, and I know that major holidays are likely to generate a sale (and that some stores have frequent sales). I’ll look during those times, but I’m not married to a “deal” if it is an item I need/fills a hole, and it is of good quality. I have spending parameters, of course, but they’re not tied to whether an item is discounted (unless I’m splurging on an item and the sale brings it into my price range).
Anonymous
For the shopping skills part, the people here will be able to tell you about sales cycles. When you find an item you like, post here and ask how frequently that retailer has sales, and if it’s worth waiting for a sale. Soon, you’ll get a feel for who runs sales and who doesn’t.
If your main experience with clothes buying is through your mom’s thrifting, it may feel wrong/immoral to you to buy something full price at retail. It’s not. Go ahead and buy what you need when you find it. If it will help you, set a clothing budget, which can give you the freedom to know you’re perfectly allowed to spend $$ for clothes each month or year.
anon
I definitely feel bad buying stuff full-priced! Or, honestly, buying stuff at all. My mom’s guilt doesn’t help haha (she’s normally good about guilting me, with the exception of shopping…).
Anonymous
I used to sale stalk and buy zero things full price. Now if I need/really want something and it’s not on sale, I don’t sweat the $20 or whatever I might have saved. Too many times I’ve thought, ohhh that’s lovely I’ll wait until it’s on sale and then it sells out in my size before the sales start.
Anon
Weirdly I’m convinced I save more money by ignoring sales. I find a sale absolutely will push me over the edge to make a purchase I’m otherwise “meh” about and then end up replacing it later. So for me getting to the mental space of ignoring the sale has been really helpful. I focus on whether I want the item or not at the price it is today. Then I do a search of my emails (I have a filter that has all store emails skip my inbox) to see if I have a coupon or something. If I do, great, found money! But eliminating the sale or not sale aspect has definitely saved me aggregate dollars even though I occasionally buy something that goes on sale a week later.
anon
Interesting! I can see myself doing that as well.
anonshmanon
agree 100%.
Anon
My requirement is that I LOVE the item. Drool over it. Covet it. If not, it dies not get bought.
Anon
Same! And I don’t really look at sale emails or go to the sites often enough to know whether something is on sale a week later. I also just don’t like shopping — if clothes I liked just magically appeared in my closet that would be ideal.
Anonymous
Once a season I inventory what I have and what I and the kids need for the upcoming season. Usually I’ll either buy right away if it’s needed soon or leave it in the shopping cart for a week or so and keep an eye on sales. So like spring, summer, fall, Christmas, winter, vacation prep are like the 6 times a year I shop. I just get too overwhelmed by constantly shopping so I do it in large batches.
Anon
Ha — I was a minimalist, but then my size changed and then my shape changed, so I am in perpetual shopping mode and more waiting for sales than I used to be b/c IDK if this is a permanent change or not or if more size/shape changes are coming, so more likely to buy something today that I can use today but also more likely to buy more on sale b/c I need clothes for all 4 seasons (more like 20 seasons, sometimes two seasons per day) and casual / work clothes and clothes for dog walking / hiking / camping (so not gym clothes, but more washable / sporty than cute casual clothes).
Anon
This is my problem somewhat as I am into bodybuilding so my sizes range from 0-6, so often need more clothes depending on the season and size.
Anon
Oh, I wish. It’s age metabolic slowdown + perimenopause, so I’m bulking up but v. differently. It’s not tragic yet, but I am not sure how many rounds of this I am going to go through and my closet has about 3 sizes and two shapes of clothes in it just in case.
Anon
In the summer of 2021 I literally had no clothes that fit. It was like working in my kitchen + no gym + hitting 45 sent my metabolism into a spiral it never got out of. I actually bought something like a muumuu that I could wear to the office once we reopened and I got childcare back. It was just so humbling, the trying on and nothing fitting. And not knowing how to order pants for current pants shapes (failures, all around). I since re-shaped a bit more, which is just madening b/c I never know what clothes will work for which occasion and if I can’t make something do, IDK if I spend $ on it or just spend as little as possible b/c it may be a one-wear item if I shape-shift yet again.
Oddly, this is when I embraced rufflepuff dresses b/c they seemed to have a wider range of sizes and shapes that they could tolerate before clearly not fitting.
Anon
By any chance do you walk to work in your work shoes? My work shoes live at work and they last so much longer than they used to.
anon
OP–I don’t walk to work but I do walk from the gym to my office! And from my house to the metro, on days I’m not at the gym. So that could be it. It doesn’t feel like a long walk but I just looked it up and it’s half a mile.
Anon
I think if you leave your shoes at work and don’t wear them outside unless you’re going for lunch or to an event or whatever, you’ll find they last a lot longer!
anon
OP–It would probably be better for my feet and limited shoe storage, too! I had this idea that maybe I would want to wear some of my work shoes (like the oxfords) when I wasn’t at work, but that has happened exactly zero times.
Anon
I buy what I like when I need it. If it happens to be on sale, that’s a bonus. I will google for a coupon code but not a dealbreaker if there isn’t one. I think it’s too easy to talk yourself into sale items and tend to view them as rejected items anyway so that method holds no appeal.
Anon
To answer your actual question — I buy on sale if the thing I like happens to be on sale. I enjoy having things I like, but I do not enjoy the hunt of shopping. This means I very rarely have the patience to sort through crowded sale racks with random stuff on them to find the one treasure that’s 50% off. If the whole store is on sale, that is the type of thing that might encourage me to go in, but I just don’t like shuffling through sooooo many options that I know I’ll hate just to find one or two things. I can afford it, and I don’t see the problem with making things easier on myself by getting the thing I truly want or need when I find it.
To address something that might be underlying this post — I say this only because I have had exactly the same attitude, so I can see my old self in this question. I know I used to go through life feeling like I “should” do things a certain way either because that’s how my parents did it or because that’s what others seemed to be saying. I used to feel like I should hunt through sale racks even though I could afford not to because if I didn’t, it would mean that I was ostentatious or shallow or not frugal (gasp!) or something. But that’s not what it means at all. I’ve felt so much better when trying to let go of those sorts of expectations and “values” when they don’t fit my personality or my life. I try to remember that even if I’m not frugal in this way, it’s okay because it’s not affecting anyone but me, and buying the thing I want is affecting me positively by taking off stress or a task I don’t like. I know you didn’t ask that and please skip if it’s not applicable. But it’s how I felt for a very long time so just wanted to give you a bit of encouragement on that front.
anon
OP–I think you are totally right. I do get uncomfortable when my behavior doesn’t match who I see myself as. It was really kind of you to write that out. Thank you for the encouragement!
Anonymous
I use Shopstyle to let me know when things I need go on sale
Anon
I think if you need basics, you want to buy what you love the most and not worry about sale prices.
When you wait for a sale, you’re waiting to buy the items no one else wanted. I learned this lesson the hard way when I started to build my work wardrobe – everything was mismatched, nothing went together, and it was last season’s clothing, so wrong for the weather – and I’ve since then been happy to pay full price to get exactly what I want for my core wardrobe.
Sales are for “extras,” like ooh, that cashmere sweater on clearance in orchid would go with my navy and charcoal pieces.
thankgiving anxiety
Pretty much never. I think it’s easier for me because I wear a smaller than average clothing size and have big feet and my sizes are usually the last ones left. But I don’t mind owning lots of clothes and I buy a lot of stuff I know I’ll use in the future– I bought Hugo Boss suits 80% off during COVID, I buy designer summer dresses during the winter for less than Jcrew/Banana prices, etc. I don’t really shop at mall stores because I can always find way nicer stuff at the same price if I plan ahead. It’s kind of a hobby for me though and I’d definitely spend less if I just bought the bare minimum as I needed it at full price.
The only exception is stuff I know won’t go on sale, like plain black Lululemon aligns. In those situations I’ll still maximize cash back via credit card/rakuten/etc.
Hypatia
Big ticket items I try to buy on sale at black friday or some other holiday sale – for example a canada goose coat that I’ve worn for the last 6 winters, sam edelman combat boots that last 4-5 years, reebok sneakers that last 3-4 years. I buy underwear and bras on sale (basically whenever I find a sale I buy a few) because I have been wearing the same styles for 10 years. I am a creature of habit so I also know what I like and wear often, so it’s fairly easy for me to find what I like slightly used on poshmark (the ann taylor camp shirt that is a workhorse in my wardrobe, another pair of the madewell lace-up boots I loved, pants in the style I wear regularly etc).
The rare cases that I buy things new at full price are the special seasonal items that I am adding to my wardrobe (a white wool coat, printed blouses, a speciality dress, white t shirts)
More than buying on sale is making sure I actually will WEAR the item which means I really try to never go ‘out shopping’ and buy something. I only buy something if I’ve thought about it for a week or so and can actually imagine how it fits into my wardrobe and more important WHERE I would wear it. Maybe 70% of the things I’ve bought on a whim I wind up not really wearing, and selling on poshmark or wherever (but 30% have been gems).
Nina
Okay typical holiday question – what do you say when relatives comment on your weight or say you’ve gained weight etc? I’m going to a big family event Thanksgiving weekend and my family has 0 boundaries, so people are just going to say it. I don’t really care about their comments, I know I look great, but I also don’t know what to say in the moment. What’s the nice version of “mind your own business”? Just change the topic entirely?
Anonymous
“ mind your business”.
busybee
I don’t believe in being nice to mean comments. If someone said “oh it looks like you’ve gained weight” I’d reply either “you too!” Or “thank you!”
Anon
Haha!
anon
To: “It looks like you’ve really put on the pounds!” I go with “Yep, I’m the heaviest I’ve ever been!” with great enthusiasm. This confuses them so much they change the topic themselves.
In a similar vein, if someone says something about how it looks like I’ve lost weight, I say something like “Haha, not at all, I’m the heaviest I’ve ever been!” which likewise confuses them and brings the subject to something other than how I look.
I say this regardless of what is going on with my actual weight.
HFB
I’d be tempted to say in the most sincere voice possible, “thanks! You too!” Or “thanks, I feel great!” To play it off like you think it’s meant to be compliment. Having it reflected back to them may help them understand these kind of comments are impolite.( to be clear I am not saying your weight gain is a bad thing but I gather your relatives will. And I think it’s generally rude to comment on other peoples bodies at all),
But the lowest conflict optio is probably just quick acknowledgement + subject change. EG: them- “wow, looks like you’ve put on some pounds!” You “yep. Anyway have you seen the new knives out movie/did you try aunt Peggy’s artichoke dip/ can you believe Nephew is already starting high school?”
Anonymous
Honestly I’d be tempted to say:”aunt sally, that really hurt my feelings and made me feel badly. Please excuse me.”
It’s taken me forty years to figure out that acting hurt when people are hurtful instead of pretending it’s fine or trying to be clever is ok.
Jo April
Respond as if they were complimenting you. “Thanks, I feel so cute in this dress/sweater/hair style!”
Anon
My grandmother used to say this to me, and I’d just let it hang for a second and not otherwise acknowledge the comment. I’d instead make a very clear and very abrupt change of topic. “Those pants are getting tight” *silence and blinking* “Did you see on the news someone flew a hot air balloon over the Atlantic?” I tried a few times saying, “Wow that was rude,” but it never made a difference either.
Another strategy is saying something like, “I’m not sure why you thought that was a helpful comment.” Or similar.
dear reader
In a similar vein, “That’s a weird thing to say out loud.”
I also think just ignoring the comment entirely is effective. In the wise words of Taylor Swift, “You don’t have to answer Just ’cause they asked you”. :D
Anonymoose
“I figured you were going to say something and there it is! Perfect, now we can move on.”
Senior Attorney
Love this!
Anon
I used to meekly say nothing and be really hurt. Then I tried telling people ti knock it off. Finally, age 40+, my answer is a bright and cheerful “F— you.”
Anonymous
In my South Asian family, it’s common to comment on someone’s weight gain, similar to commenting on someone’s haircut, and not meant to be negative. If someone says to me, “You’ve gained weight!” I would respond with “Yes I did!” with a smile.
Anonymous
I’m South Asian and what?? Just because the aunties are rude enough to say it doesn’t make it not unkind. IDK how you’ve been emotionally blackmailed into thinking it’s ok because it’s common in our culture. Ninety nice percent of the time it’s a criticism. Maybe one percent of the time it’s a compliment if someone was under weight before but even then body commenting in front of a group of others is unnecessary.
Anonymous
My point is that everyone is talking about gaining weight like it’s a bad thing. Why not take it as a compliment, whether or not it was intended that way? “I ate a lot of really good food this year, and shared some delicious meals with people I love.”
Anon
+1 to Anon at 12:37. I’m also South Asian and I think it’s gross that people feel free to comment on others bodies, not just behind their back, which is bad enough, but to their face.
Anon
I’m white but have a lot of Asian friends. My impression is that South Asians (Asians in general, really) are more blunt about weight gain than weight people, but it’s definitely meant to be negative. It’s definitely not a compliment, except maybe in the context of a child.
Anony
“Cool! Would you like to hear what I think about your body?”
Anon
Haha this is a good one.
Anon
I love this!
I usually go with “what a weird thing to say” in a puzzled voice followed by a topic change or just walking away when people make rude comments.
Anon
Yep. “Oh are we talking about people’s bodies? My turn for yours, right?”
Anon
When my gross cousin-in-law said something about my other cousin’s weight gain at Thanksgiving a few years ago, I peered at her forehead and then shook my head and said “I don’t think the Botox is actually working. You might consider going to a different medispa.” When she started sputtering, I said “hey, I thought this was the portion of the conversation where we share honest opinions about each other’s bodies! Did I get that wrong?” She stormed away and didn’t talk to me for the rest of the day (for which I was very grateful). Haven’t seen her since (and again, I am grateful).
Weight, wrinkles/aging, hair color, etc. need to be off the table as conversation topics at gatherings. It’s not “small talk,” it’s just weird and gross. Unless the statement about someone’s appearance is a compliment, it is 100% meant to make someone feel bad and “one-up” them in some way. People have mirrors and camera phones; they know what they look like. I don’t tolerate the snark, whether it’s directed toward me or someone else. There are tons of things to talk about with other human beings besides someone’s appearance.
Ses
I like to sow confusion by intentionally mishearing. Also works with men who are putting you down on purpose.
Q “Did you gain a few pounds?”
A “No, you look good! Don’t worry about it.”
Q “I don’t usually date short girls”
A “What!? I think your height is fine!”
There’s no practical benefit of this over saying MYOB, but I personally find it hilarious to think about later (vs before when I would think about the question or insult and feel bad).
Anonymous
Oh I love this!
Anon
Stealing this
Nonny
love
Anonymous
Thanksgiving annoyance time! It’s our first Thanksgiving in our new house. We moved in last week so we’re still mostly in boxes. My parents offered to come over to see the house and “help” us have a great turkey day; they’ll bring all the sides and DH will smoke the turkey. They live 1.5 hours away but they insist it takes 2 hours. Today they announced that dinner will be at 1 pm so they can get home before dark (they can’t stay over because mom is allergic to kitty). That would require DH to get up at 5 am to start the turkey. When I pointed that out, they suggested we cook the turkey today and have leftovers for our first tgiving in our first SFH. It strikes me as the height of rudeness to come to someone’s house and demand that dinner must be served at lunchtime. I thought perhaps as I approached 40 my parents would stop treating me like a kid they can boss around but apparently not. I’m leaning toward telling them we had planned for 4 pm and we’ll do our best to make it earlier but no promises on 1. Wwyd?
Anon
Is driving in the dark a legit issue for them? If so, I’d prioritize their safety over all else, though I understand that the way they’ve gone about this is frustrating. People should always take priority over a fancy meal.
Anon
+1 I wouldn’t really want my parents doing a 2 hour drive after dark even if they felt comfortable with it. Your parents’ safety is the most important thing! If you really must eat later, offer to get them a hotel.
Also I’m confused about why eating at 1 means you’d have to get up at 5 am! My family does small-ish (<15 lb) turkeys but I don't think they've ever taken more than 3 hours to cook, so even if it takes you an hour to prep you'd have to start at a very reasonable 9 am?
Anonymous
Smoking takes much longer than roasting. Much, much longer.
OP
Whoops I must’ve edited it out when I was working on length – turkey takes 7 hours to smoke. DH is pretty set on smoking the turkey.
OP
They don’t need to eat at 1 to avoid driving in the dark. Sunset is 5:15 tomorrow. It doesn’t take hours and hours for 4 people to eat a meal at home. If they don’t want to drive at night then fine I’ll accommodate but I’m not getting up at 5 am so they can be home 2 hours before sunset.
Also they have no medical conditions that prevent them from driving at night so it’s not a safety issue and certainly not something I should’ve been aware of prior to today. But I’m not going to try to argue with them about their comfort level.
Anon
They don’t have to have a diagnosed medical issue to feel like driving in the dark is harder. Aging eyes is enough. But honestly, darkness aside, having a long dinner beginning at 4 pm, leaving your house around 5:30 or 6 pm at the absolute earliest (it’s Thanksgiving – they’re not going to dine and dash), and then having a ~2 hour drive home sounds pretty unpleasant to me and I’m 37. I think you’re being overly rigid here. They’re the ones going to the time and expense of traveling, not you. You should be accommodating.
Anon
I agree. Especially since I don’t think this requires everybody to be up and active all day starting at 5:00 am.
Anon
Honestly, I’m sure you wanted everyone to side with you, but just from what you’ve posted here, and not knowing your history with your parents, your reaction sounds like a giant overreaction.
Anon
I’m 56, but I noticed diminishing night vision while driving starting around age 40. Don’t get me wrong, I still drive at night, but it’s not my favorite thing.
s in chicago
I’m 48 and it really hit me the other day how much harder it is for me to drive after it’s dark (twilight is actually worse). No one warned me. I also recently was talking with college friends about how we seem to have to choose whether to see better at a distance or be able to read close up. There is no just right anymore regardless of what is happening with eyeglasses (my sweet spot is contacts for driving and mutlifocal for reading. It’s awful.) I’m too young to feel like I have old age eyes already darn it.
Anon
+1. I am 43 and I don’t really like driving at night anymore and actively try to avoid putting my parents in that situation even though they are perfectly healthy.
pugsnbourbon
I’m 36 with astigmatism. LED headlights are the bane of my existence.
Anonymous
I’d say thanks for bringing the sides, prep the turkey tonight, set the alarm and throw it in the oven at 5am. Takes like 10 minutes. Go back to bed. They are coming to you and you just have to do the turkey. Grow up.
anon
This. Our out of town guests are coming for dinner at 1 tomorrow. We are roasting turkey tonight, will cool it overnight, slice and pan in morning with gravy, heat to serve at 1. This is not hard. Anyone can do it.
Anonymous
My mom does this exact same thing but add in showing up at least a half hour early. My husband and I will even joke on holidays without my folks how nice it is to not be eating at lunch time. The discomfort driving at night is a real thing though. Anyway to throw the turkey in and go back to bed? Or order turkey from a restaurant instead? Or go to her house?
Anonymous
Don’t celebrate Thanksgiving so no answer to your precise question but IME that’s how this generation is as they are. It’s all about them. In my family being 40 makes it worse as they try to prove they are still the boss of you knowing very clearly they are not.
Though if the drive takes 2 hours and they want to be home before dark, doesn’t that mean leaving by 230? Are they planning on coming for thanksgiving for 90 min? Why not do your own thanksgiving Thursday and have them over for leftovers Friday? Though may not work if they have no other holiday plans and you’re the daughter that drops them.
Anon
Honestly, I would just have it at 1. If getting up early is a problem, you can spatchcock or good it in the oven.
dear reader
This is what I would do too. anyone else but my parents, I’d say nope the time is 4pm. But my family dynamics are such that we negotiate holiday dinner times all the time. We’re actually eating at 12pm tomorrow because both my sister and I are going to our inlaws thanksgiving later. We planned out the time in a group message about 2 weeks ago.
Anonymous
“The turkey won’t be ready until four but we’re happy to see you whenever you get here!”
Why do they need to be home before dark? In my experience people who can’t drive at night shouldn’t be driving at all. Maybe arrange for a ride?
Anon
My experience is the opposite. Night driving is a lot harder than day driving and I know many older people who won’t do it but are safe drivers otherwise.
Anon
Decreasing night vision among people who are aging is incredibly common, as is seeing halos and other disturbances around bright lights set against darkness (I’m not sure the technical word for this). Many, many, many people drive safely during the day but do not feel as comfortable at night for one reason or another.
For the OP who said there’s no medical issue– this isn’t necessarily like a stroke or whatever that you’d know about. For many (most?) people it’s a standalone thing as their eyes age that comes on gradually. I feel like this might be a pattern of behavior that makes it more annoying. But if they really feel uncomfortable driving at night, they’d need to be done eating by 3:15 to drive 2 hours home, which makes 1 a reasonable time to eat a large holiday meal and hang out with the family. Again, there’s probably a lot more behind this question than we’re getting, but based on these facts alone, their request doesn’t seem so objectionable to me.
Anon
Yes! It’s the halos. It sucks but it’s just part of aging. There is no eyeglass prescription that will fix this for me, and believe me, I’ve tried.
Anon
I’m a perfectly healthy 30-something and I don’t like driving at night. It’s harder with astigmatism. I’m perfectly fine to drive, though.
Anon
+1 I hate driving at night
Anon
+1 from another 30 something who really hates driving at night
Curious
+1 especially at twilight or in rain.
Anonymous
I swear, the advice here sometimes is so out of touch. Yeah, holding it at 4 p.m. solely to hold it then makes a lot more sense as a host than having guests try to anxiously time their leaving–especially when those guests are your own mother who is already bringing all the sides to you (who probably will wake up early to do it) and spending hours in your cat-living house.
And, no, you don’t need to be legally blind to hate driving at night. You just need to be older than 50 or so or someone with allergy eyes. Bonus on both.
She or spouse should either get up or do a different turkey option. That’s not asking much compared to what the mom is doing. Or maybe don’t host if you’re not actually going to act like a host.
Anon
That’s pretty much what everyone said though. So I’m not sure how the advice here is “out of touch.”
LaurenB
This “in my experience people who can’t drive at night shouldn’t be driving at all” is ridiculous. The ability to drive at night DOES diminish with age, but I assure you I am perfectly capable of driving during the day. I think you must be a really, really young person to think this way.
Lily
Can you put them up in a local hotel for the night?
Aunt Jamesina
That sounds so frustrating, but if your husband does all the brining and prep beforehand, then turkey just needs to be popped into the oven and then left alone, so he could go back to sleep, no? The most active part of cooking the turkey is the brine/prep and then again toward the end. The oven part is nice and passive.
I think parents sometimes fall into a weird parental dynamic of demanding things of their grown children without fully realizing the way it comes across. Telling them it doesn’t work for you and that you can host at X o’clock is the way to go if that’s what you need! Although the benefit of hosting a bit earlier is that you have more time to clean up and decompress. Like another commenter, I also wonder if your parents are having a hard time with driving at night and don’t want to come out and say it.
Aunt Jamesina
Oh man, I totally skipped over the fact that you’re smoking the turkey!
Anonymous
DH is dead set on smoking the turkey, which requires hourly babysitting. He’s not going to budge on that at this point. And it’s hard to blame him because he’s been looking forward to this for weeks, and their demand was last minute and unreasonable. I mentioned in another comment, but sunset is at 5:15 and we’re having only 4 people for dinner, they do not need to eat at 1 to get home before dark.
Anon
Can you suggest compromising on 2:30 or something like that? I get not wanting to eat at 1, but eating at 4 when they have a 2 hour drive ahead of them seems kind of unreasonable. I have a small family, but I’ve never known Thanksgiving dinner to take less than one hour and it often takes two. I think there are a lot of older folks that wouldn’t want to be getting home at 8 pm, even if they felt safe to drive in the dark. If you really can’t budge on the dinner timeline, I really think you should offer to get them a hotel.
OP
Yeah I suggested 2:30 and they shot that down. It’s only the 4 of us so it’s not like it will take hours to eat, and if they want to get on the road then they can come early to hang out and leave after dinner.
Anonymous
If sunset is at 5: 15 and they are thinking 2 hours, then they need to be in a car by 3 or even slightly earlier because dusk is harder. How is 2:30 solving that? Even if it’s more like an hour and half (which is not what they think), that’s still not doing anything to resolve.
Anon
Geez, you really sound like you don’t even want them at all. Why not just uninvite them at this point.
Anon
+1
OP you sound like a spoiled brat, frankly. This is not the hill to die on.
Anon
OP’s DH sounds pretty rigid himself.
Anony
+1
Anonymous
Not the op but I do feel like everyone is blowing off her feelings. It’s completely rude to volunteer to help with dinner and then bring up the day before that you can no longer drive at night and the host should have dinner ready at lunch time.
My mil is huge on insisting on “helping” in ways that don’t actually help and and are opportunities for her to be manipulative and call me ungrateful. I had to learn boundaries about this and that’s what the OP needs to do too. That’s what she’s hinting at with the rhetoric about not respecting her as an adult. In my family this kind of confusing power play tends to come up with new homes and babies. Regardless of what happens tomorrow, on the next holiday she’ll have to anticipate possible shenanigans and make expectations really clear more than 1 day out for everyone’s sake. (“Mom we’d love to have you for Xmas Eve but since you can’t drive in the dark and I have work till three maybe Xmas brunch is better, ect.”)
Anon
She said in the post that they moved into this home a week ago; her parents invited themselves; now that they have invited themselves to the box-covered home, they are trying to dictate meal times and refusing compromises.
As the adult child of very overbearing parents, I don’t see how this is an OP problem. A date on a calendar does not give her parents the right to steamroll her and her husband. Sometimes, it just doesn’t work out and that’s okay. Sometimes, the best thing for the relationship is giving up the “picture perfect” holiday and understanding that uncomfortable compromises are required (and that might be the parents getting a hotel near by).
Anon
Yeah it sounds like the DH’s insistence on smoking the turkey is a big part of the problem. They could sleep in, roast a turkey and eat at 1 pm.
Anonymous
You’re picking a method of turkey preparation over the experience of spending time with your parents? I think you really don’t get the purpose of Thanksgiving.
Tell DH to get over himself then get over yourself. FFS.
Anon
+1000
Anon
-1000
If your parents treat you both like children, ignore your needs, and think they should have their way because they are Parents, taking their side over DH’s is a terrible idea. Even if they are delightful, eventually, plans are plans and are not open to constant revision. The plan was to smoke the turkey and eat at 4; that plan was perfectly acceptable until the day before the event. Guess what? That’s the plan.
My manipulative parents are incapable of respecting any plan I make. I finally figures out that the constant undoing of plans is a deliberate attempt to keep me off balance and cause chaos. It also contributes to the idea of “Rachel is a silly person who can’t even make plans.” I can make plans perfectly well – I just can’t make plans that are immune to manipulative last minute monkey wrenches.
Anonymous
I’d accommodate people who aren’t wanting to drive in the dark (which does get more difficult as your eyes age). But, our Thanksgiving dinners are always @1-2p, and it’s not at all uncommon to cook the turkey early and then reheat it the day of with pan juices, to save the work of doing it the day of. It’s not a big deal, and it’s not “leftovers.”
It sounds like you have a version of “our first thanksgiving” that you want to have happen, and that you’re feeling treated badly, so that’s the lens through which you’re experiencing what they’re saying. As an outside, what they’ve saying doesn’t sound automatically offensive to me, and it doesn’t at all sound like they want you to eat leftovers for your first thanksgiving in the house or that they’re treating you like a child.
Anonymous
If I were your parents, it would be difficult to enjoy a big celebratory dinner that started at 4p, when I knew that I had a 1.5 – 2 hour drive waiting for me at the end of it. That sounds really burdensome to me, rather than enjoyable. Especially since, apparently, it’s the second time in the day they’re driving that distance. That all just sounds like zero fun.
Anon
This. OP, your parents are driving four hours roundtrip in one day to visit you! That’s a big sacrifice. You shouldn’t make them eat dinner in the late afternoon and get home at 8 pm.
Anon
Then they should not have invited themselves? If I invite myself to an event, I work around what the people there are doing, not demand they cater to me.
Anon
What in the world? It’s not like OP was having a girlfriend manicure night and mom invited herself. Thanksgiving is a holiday where it seems like OP’s family typically gathers. Negotiating times for holidays like this is very very normal and not always confrontational. I say this as a person who literally doesn’t see my toxic family or celebrate holidays with them anymore. Barring some other inappropriate behavior that is not in OP’s post, this request from aging parents who are driving multiple hours seems reasonable.
OP
Nah they totally invited themselves. We wanted this year to be just us since we’re just moving in. They insisted on “helping”. Then sprung 1 pm on me today and are refusing any other time even like 2 pm.
Anon
I mean, okay, OP.
Thanksgiving is a holiday where families typically assume they’re getting together for a mutually enjoyable meal. Obviously that’s not the case where there’s been a toxic or no-contact situation, but your posts haven’t indicated that’s the case for you. If it is, apologies.
It’s fine not to want guests for any reason. If you are so put out by a reasonable request from them, then you can let them know that they’re not invited or that dinner will be at 4:30, period.
Anon
Also did you tell them in advance you weren’t having dinner with the whole family this year? If so and they insisted, the correct response would have been, “We can’t do that, but let’s get together Saturday” (or whatever your alternate plan was)
Anon
They obviously invited themselves – OP confirmed. OP, let them “refuse.” They do not need to agree to the dinner time.
Anon
You are blaming them for treating you like a child, but you are letting them. If you didn’t want company, you should have told them you’re still exhausted from moving and they can come see the house another time – one of the December holidays? Unless you really don’t want them to visit you in your new house.
Anon
It sounds like you don’t want them to come. Just uninvite them at this point.
Anon
Yeah my parents and in-laws are invited to our house by default on Thanksgiving. I think that’s the case in a lot of families. It’s not like they decided to show up at some random inconvenient time when you had other plans and tried to insert themselves into something else you had going on. It’s normal for them to think they can come to your house for Thanksgiving dinner. They’re not even staying the night!
Anon
Why is it normal for them to think they are invited to Thanksgiving dinner? They have lived in the house for a week, so no prior precedent, and they claim it is a four hour round trip.
Anon
OP – the time for you to be treated like an adult was when your parents said they were coming (and bringing everything for dinner except the turkey). That was the time to say no firmly and clearly. You did not do that and are now furious because you wanted to eat smoked turkey (and make your own sides) in your new house with just your spouse.
That ship has sailed. Your options are to (1) get them a hotel (if possible); (2) have dinner early and your husband either (i) smokes the turkey today or (ii) gets up early or (iii) roasts it; (3) tell them not to come, with the resulting rupture in your relationship and need to make anything you are planning on eating other than turkey; or (4) insist on having dinner at 4 (or 2:30 which makes no practical difference since they will still be driving at night) and leave it up to them to either stay home and eat their sides with last-minute main dish or risk their lives driving on unfamiliar roads at night.
Pick one. But please stop asking the bulk of us to agree you are in the right. And acknowledge your own role in all of this.
Anonymous
If you can get your hands on a fresh or thawed turkey today, or even better just a large turkey breast, I think the easiest answer is to roast a turkey and still smoke the one you have, either tomorrow while your parents are there or the following day if it is important to you/your husband to eat it right out of the smoker. Or you and your husband can save some room and have turkey seconds later in the day.
Anon
“We can move dinner up to 3 pm.”
Anonymous
“That way, you can leave here right as the sun is setting and drive for the full two hours in the dark and my first Thanksgiving in a single-family home (that well-worn rite of passage that everyone reminisces about for all their days) will be nearly as I envisaged and perhaps we won’t have to have this fight about you ruining my idealized life in the future because you may just not make it home. There, settled.”
— Your Dear Daughter
Anon
If it ia that terrible, sounds like her parents should have thought of that befor inviting themselves. O:-)
Anony
We are eating at 1/2ish to accommodate my grandmother who is no longer comfortable driving in the dark. My BIL is also smoking the turkey and is just taking care of it. My family just accommodates one another’s idiosyncrasies. Everyone knows DH and I are always 15 minutes late so I’m pretty sure they say one time and mean another. My grandmother doesn’t like driving in the dark, so we eat early. NBD.
Anonymous
I’m not sure why leftover turkey in your new home is so terrible, but it doesn’t seem to me like your parents are being that rude or inflexible. You all just want different specific things that are mutually exclusive. I would take them at their word that they shouldn’t be driving at night and plan accordingly. My FIL got weird about driving long distances, and driving at night, but we didn’t find our for years that he had macular degeneration and was going blind because he would not tell us. If your husband is inflexible about smoking the turkey, he can get up at early to start it and then take a nap, or choose to roast it and sleep in more. Bottom line – you aren’t going to make everyone happy, pick a compromise you can live with.
Anonymous
Yeah, the irony is that smoking is a preparation designed to make food last longer.
Anon
I’d prioritize their safety if driving after dark is a problem for them. I’m 57 and surprised at how much worse at night driving I’ve become. Aging isn’t for the weak, man
Your husband getting up at 5 AM one day of the year is not a huge sacrifice for your parents’ safety.
Another Anon
Not being comfortable driving at night is definitely a thing for older people, and I would not want someone driving when they are not comfortable. That drive home is also after a long day including the drive there. I’m sure there is a lot of history and my mom gets on my nerves to no end, but I would accommodate your parents who are traveling to you. It seems like smoking the turkey is the main issue? I would do the smoking today, suck it up and do it in the morning, or decide it’s not worth the stress and try to make plans to smoke it next year.
Anonymous
I think you made the mistake of behaving like a child when you let them invite themselves over for Thanksgiving. The solution to this was to say “Actually, your being here on Thanksgiving will not be helpful. Mike and have already planned a meal for two and we really want this first Thanksgiving in our first single-family home to be something shared between just us. Why don’t you plan to come over on Friday or over the weekend? We’d love to have you, we can certainly use some extra hands to unpack or hang and assemble things, and there will be plenty of leftover smoked turkey if you want to bring some leftovers from your dinner to share.”
If you are truly as inflexible as you are coming off in this post, you are also going to need to learn to set boundaries so other people don’t ruin whatever fantasized version of a perfect life you are trying to live.
Anon
+1
LaurenB
“Why is it normal for them to think they are invited to Thanksgiving dinner?”
Because it would be a normal assumption that normal, loving families who aren’t estranged from one another and who live close by one another would be welcomed at a TG dinner. Really now.
Anon Gen X
You asked what we would do so here is my answer: I would either eat at 1:00 so my older parents could count on leaving for home by 3:00 (given how long saying good by and getting on the road can take and the possible need for bathroom breaks) or I would get them a hotel room nearby since they cannot stay at your house and assuming they do not have their own pets to take care of.
Even otherwise perfectly healthy older people with good vision can have issues driving at night – particularly on unfamiliar roads (heck I’m 50 and I need special glasses I only wear at night). You can Google it but there is an actual issue with how much light people need as they age. And I would rather spend Thanksgiving with my family (which to me is the whole point of the holiday) and have them get home safely and without anxiety than either insist on a specific turkey preparation or chose not to get up early.
But I love my parents and think they are great. And as I get older, I am forced to face the cold, hard reality that I will not have them forever and that every holiday is precious. The tone of your post indicates that in your case there are much bigger issues here than the timing of dinner and this is just a flashpoint.
Anon
All of this from an elder Millenial. Friends are starting to lose parents in serious numbers as we approach 40 and my best friend lost both of hers this year. It’s really jarring and makes me appreciate how precious every holiday is.
Cat
Yes, either this, or you needed to take the advice above and say “we’re doing this TG just the two of us but would love to see you another day this weekend” that would accommodate day driving.
I’m late 30’s and husband is early 40’s and we prefer to drive new places in daylight. Last Christmas there were rains at nightfall and our drive home from my parents’ was perhaps the most stressful 40 minutes I’ve ever been on the road – people rushing to get home, people who have been drinking, and horrendous visibility. I’d cut your folks a LOT of slack for wanting to drive in daylight.
Anon
100% this. And if OP wants to be treated as an adult, it’s time to start acting like one and being considerate.
TrixieRuby
Can the turkey be smoked in smaller pieces? Cut it into parts, and smoke it in less time? And driving after dark is harder for old folks…but who wants to eat leftovers? Maybe roast it in the oven instead?
Anon
Catering. Best thing ever. I will never cook another turkey.
LaurenB
I hate to say this – I am 57, still fit, blah blah blah but I don’t like driving in the dark much these days. My night vision really has taken a hit. I can do so, but you may want to think about whether you want to just have them spend the night (and have TG dinner at the time you normally do). That’s what we do with my 80 yo mother.
Anonymous
This is such a random question but. I’m travelling with three nap dresses and they are big and bulky! But I don’t want to use a compression packing cube because they’ll get too wrinkled. Is there like a folding guide for your smocked little house on the prairie dresses?
Anonymous
I roll mine but they still get very wrinkled. I steam or iron it in the hotel room before wearing. I wore it on the plane once and it was surprisingly comfy! I don’t usually do dresses on planes but it worked out fine.
Cat
I fold the straps backwards over the bodice, fold less-precious things like tshirts or swimwear into a rectangle, place those over the bodice, and then fold the skirt (partly over the rectangle of soft stuff) into third like a pizza. I then carefully flip the rectangle bodice over a few times. You essentially make a Nap Dress cinnamon roll with soft stuff in the middle to cushion the sharpest angles.
Ends up so there’s only a few vertical-ish creases in the skirt.
Anonymous
Omg thank you both. I would love to make a nap dress cinnamon roll
thanksgiving anxiety
I would just compress them but I also travel with a mini steamer. Hanging up in the shower is sometimes enough too.
Anon
I thought the lived in / mussed appearance was part of the appeal? How would one effortlessly move from working to napping if wrinkles were frowned upon?
I really don’t understand this nap dress thing.
Anon
I always pack Downy wrinkly releaser. Haven’t specifically tried it on a nap dress but it’s miracle stuff.
Anonymous
The judge in Elizabth Holmes’ case has suggested that she serve her sentence at FPC Bryan outside of Houston. An article described this as a minimum security prison that offers family visitation ans college-level education. So maybe she can get a degree now!!
Panda Bear
Lol!
Anon
IIRC, and I hate that I know this, she is from close to there and her Dad maybe worked at Enron (so, Houston).
Anon
Yes she is and yes he did
Anon
I dunno –do you think the Stanford credits will transfer?
Anonymous
I think she will have plenty of time to finish even if they don’t. And honestly, it doesn’t appear that she was interested in retaining anything that anyone at Stanford was teaching, so maybe starting over is the answer.
Anon
Interesting – I thought they try to put the person in a prison proximal to their home so it’s easier for family to visit? I had heard she was likely going to a minimum security women’s camp in California.
Agree that a really good use of her time in prison would be to get a degree. She’ll be serving enough time to get a couple of them, if she so desires.
Anonymous
How to use up tomatoes? Shopped as fast as possible Monday as the store was getting crowded and entirely unmasked and I wanted to get out. So I was just grabbing things not really paying attention and ended up with too many tomatoes. How to use them up without a major effort like sauce or soup?
We’re vegetarian but not really salad people. DH will make an Indian style potato and tomato dish to use some. Can tomatoes be roasted or sautéed and put over pasta and if so with what other ingredients. Other ideas?
Panda Bear
Great idea to roast/sauté them and put them over pasta! Or over bread, rice, or anything else. In fact, this time of year, I think store-bought tomatoes are going to be much tastier cooked and salted than eaten fresh in salad. And if you really have way too many, you can freeze them whole. Defrosted, they won’t have a good texture for eating raw, but will be just fine for going into soup, sauce, curry, etc.
JTM
You can freeze them now and then use them later for soup, sauce, chili, etc. I just made chili last week with tomatoes I froze earlier this year. When they thaw the skin just slides right off, and it was easy to drop them in my pot of chili & crush them up.
Anonymous
Yes. Roast or saute them in good olive oil and some salt and pepper and put them over pasta dressed in pesto.
anon
I made this lately and it was tasty! https://www.themediterraneandish.com/menemen-recipe/
It is kind of like a cross between shakshuka and Chinese tomatoes and eggs. Both of which are also good ways to use up tomatoes, though I find shakshuka is better canned.
And you can definitely just roast them and put them over pasta. You could also just dice them and use them to top pasta or chili too.
anon
Something like this would probably be my choice, if you have/can get feta: https://www.delish.com/cooking/recipe-ideas/a35421563/baked-feta-pasta-tiktok/
Gail the Goldfish
Absolutely! Roast tomatoes are my favorite way to eat tomatoes. Cut up, toss them in some olive oil and salt and roast away. I use them in pasta with pesto and shrimp a lot but really I’m of the opinion tomatoes go in most pasta dishes well. Or after roasting drizzle them with balsamic vinegar and put on top of bread and brie.
startup lawyer
Tomatoes and eggs
Anon
Marcella Hazan’s tomato sauce. Put the whole tomatoes, half a stick of butter, some salt, and half an onion (left together, not chopped) into a pot and simmer it for hours. It will smell amazing.
When it’s done everything will be very soft. Take out the onion, smush the tomatoes, and taste for salt. You can leave the tomato skins in, pick them out, or run the whole thing through a food mill if you’re very fussy. If it’s too watery for you, let it simmer a bit with the lid off to reduce the water.
This is the best comfort food pasta sauce ever. Cook your pasta until just under Al dente, then transfer it to the simmering sauce and let it finish in there.
It’s also a great sauce to use in a tomatoey risotto.
Anon
Comment in m0d (pls come back for my notes) but I make this with fresh tomatoes all the time
https://www.thekitchn.com/marcella-hazans-amazing-4ingre-144538
Anon
Stuff with herby rice and bake. Slice and serve as the vegetable with steak and potato.
anon
I’ve been seeing this guy (we’re both late twenties) and just learned he’s never been in a relationship during his adult life. I don’t get player or manchild vibes from him so I was very surprised. Do you think guys need at least one “starter girlfriend” before they’re ready for something serious? Or am I overthinking this? I worry that he doesn’t have enough dating experience to have a clear idea of what he wants and needs from a relationship. He may be genuinely interested now, but I’m concerned I’ll invest however much time then eventually he’ll realize he’s looking for something different. Any anecdata or opinions welcome!
Anon
IDK but maybe this is normal now for early 20s? Based on my neighbors’ kids, I don’t see a lot of relationships (more casual hanging out or hookups vs relationships) the way I know we did (I know several people who married people they dated in middle school or high school). But it also seems that at some point, a switch flips one of the older kids on the street is getting married in her 20s (maybe once they start going to weddings, they see how a relationship can be good or at least net you a set of matching towels?). I know that I have heard one kid lament how he needs to couple up to afford a good apartment, which may not be the right motivation but is also probably not wrong if they are DINKing it for a while.
Ribena
I’m a female version of him – I just wasn’t prioritising dating for most of my 20s (and then when I was ready to do so the pandemic hit and I wasn’t allowed to!). I’m sure there are some guys who this is a turn off for – certainly the guy who broke my multi year dry spell was somewhat shocked at how long it had been, and the guy I was seeing all this spring/summer was shocked by how few people I had been with in total. But I don’t think it means I’m a freak, player, or womanchild?
Mouse
Same! Didn’t really date at all until my mid-twenties, and no serious relationships until my husband. Just wasn’t important to me.
Anon for this
Same. Just turned 30 and other than a few short-term “relationships” in college (can you even call them that?), I’ve prioritized my career and friends throughout my 20s. Went on a few first dates awhile ago and then just didnt put effort into it. Now I’m ready to start focusing on dating and worried this will hold me back, but there’s nothing to do about it except go ahead and try to date!
Anon
I read OP’s comments as being about relationship experience and not gardening experience, or lack thereof. You can have lots of the latter without the former!
Anon
I don’t understand this generation. Sounds like it’s probably normal. Date him for a minute if you’re getting along, don’t borrow trouble but don’t be afraid to break up if he doesn’t meet your needs either. I’d say that regardless of relationship status.
Anon
I feel like before it was for very religiously conservative people (so no hookup culture). Now, there is hookup culture and hanging out, so the “no relationship” crowd is likely bigger. Plus, I know several kids who had COVID happen right when they maybe would have wanted a companion or to date vs hang out and it was hard to have happen if, say, you’d left NYC to say with your parents on their farm on the Eastern Shore. So I’d give him a chance — he may be nice and maybe comes with less baggage.
Anon
Anecdata: some of the best men I know were like this – maybe one serious college girlfriend and then no relationships after that. (These days, the college girlfriend doesn’t really happen, so adjust for the times.) One of these men is my husband.
The downside: I feel like I had to explain a lot of “relationship-ing” at the start of our marriage. Painful.
The upside: they are men who are very committed and loyal. They don’t have a lot of baggage or triggers. They have a romantic streak that has not been beaten out of them when someone ran their heart through a blender. (I have been married for four years and my husband still buys me flowers every month. That is not everyone’s cup of tea, but it’s my cup of tea, he knows that, and he enjoys making the gesture.) They take the relationship seriously, because it is not in their nature to be frivolous with someone’s emotions.
All that said, if the guy is not the right one for you and this is what you are glomming on to to explain it, he’s not the right one for you am there is no need to continue dating him.
Anonymous
Weirdly judgy. If he’s a good guy to you he’s a good guy.
embees
My SIL’s now-husband was like this, but in his 30s. He’s amazing (actually like him better than her but whatever), just had some family stuff + social anxiety that meant “serious” dating hadn’t happened. Chances are your guy has non-romantic relationships in his life, right? So things like support and compromise and shared interests etc probably aren’t unknown, and if he’s reasonably self-aware I personally wouldn’t worry about it.
Anon
FWIW, I have been single my whole adult life and have several friends in this boat. I just was never that interested in pursuing dating and then I turned 28 and was suddenly ready for a relationship. So, it doesn’t seem weird to me.
Anon
My partner and I were each other’s first adult relationship. This doesn’t seem to be too unusual among people I know, though we do know a lot of people who spent a lot of time in school who probably had less time for dating early on. In general, there are people who are not into dating even if they still want a relationship; some people are ready for something serious or nothing at all. So I guess I would also wonder the opposite and whether it’s possible he’s not just getting started on dating, but is more likely to be serious than not.
Anonymous
I think it depends on how you define serious. Like I didn’t date much before I was 21 – just very focused on school not relationships. I had one guy that I might have pursued something with but colleges were in different states. When I met DH at 24 I had not had a ‘serious’ relationship but I also knew how well I clicked with DH. It was just clear he was the right person for me and that it was different from other dates/short relationships.
Anon
So I had a very short lived high school boyfriend, and a 2.5 year college situationship and that’s it. I spent my early 20s working a lot and having a lot of fun with my friends when I wasn’t working and had literally no interest in dating, I spent my mid 20s in the pandemic and not wanting to date in those circumstances, and now at 27 I’m just starting to show interest in dating. I only got on the apps in September. I’m more open to dating now but still spend most of my time working, in grad school, with my friends or on my hobbies rather than dating.
I put myself out there but not focus a ton on dating. So I could very easily go until 28 or 29 without a relationship.
Most of my friends are in the same boat. They’re either in very serious relationships from college or consistently single. I have noticed a few perpetually single friends of both genders suddenly ready to date and be in a serious relationship when they turned 28.
TLDR, in my circles both men and women seem to be involved and active in other things and don’t have an interest or time for more casual dating in their early/mid 20s and hold off on dating until they’re ready for something more serious which seems to be happening around 28 or so.
Cb
My lovely husband hadn’t dated at all before me, beyond a few online dates – a combination of a very late autism diagnosis, male-dominated office. And I hadn’t dated since early college. Married 8 years with a kid.
Anne-on
Depending on your industry/social circle this can be pretty common. I knew a lot of ppl (men and women) who didn’t date seriously in college, then had really time/travel intensive jobs (med students, law students, consultants, accountants, finance ppl working crazy hours) or were in grad school/studying for certifications through their early 20s. Then you look up at 28-32 and all of a sudden realize you have more time and energy and want to date. I went from barely having any friends in steady relationships at 23-26 to suddenly everyone pairing off and settling down between 28-34.
Anon
I was my husband’s first girlfriend. (He wasn’t casually hooking up either – he was just shy and didn’t meet a lot of women due to his job in STEM; this was before online dating became ubiquitous.) We met when we were 24. We’re old now – early 40s, so I’m not sure I agree with the comments characterizing this as a generational thing. I wouldn’t break off an otherwise good relationship because of this.
Anon
This was my boyfriend (he was 32 when we started dating). We’re still together 4 years later. There were a few things he needed to learn about being in a serious relationship, like sharing emotions and big things with a partner, but he’s a fantastic partner! If I were you, I’d move forward as long as there are no other concerns with this guy.
Anonymous
Has he not dated at all, or just not had a serious long-term relationship? If the latter, it’s entirely possible he just hasn’t met the right person yet, and maybe that person is you. I dumped a lot of guys in college when they wanted to get serious because they weren’t exactly what I was looking for. My first long-term relationship resulted in marriage because he was the right one.
Seafinch
This was my husband. We are now in our 40s and married for almost 15 years but when we got together he was 24 and had never had a serious relationship. He jokes about this all the time and says, “I never met anyone worth it and as soon as I met her I knew I wanted to marry her”. He’s kind of blowing smoke up my you know what but also kind of not. He’s very practical and he does mean it. He very much prioritized having a family as a life goal but at the time was happy to focus on establishing his military career with the family to be determined, subsequently. There are a few notional down sides but nothing I would be concerned about. Mostly in our case they would have been mitigated by more emotional health established as a kid which made working through early marriage more difficult than it needed to be but it’s multifactoral. We were in a rush due to my age, his parents sucked etc. It could have been easier but I wouldn’t consider the lack of previous girlfriend to be a major factor.
Anon 2.0
I think the dividing line is why he didn’t have a relationship. Was he a good guy who didn’t have time because he was working on a PHd, focused on his career, cared for a parent, etc or was he a bum who lived on his mom’s couch and played video games from sunup til sundown who no one wanted to date? If he isn’t the latter, I don’t see a big issue. Everyone’s timeline is different.
Anon
I just never saw the appeal of casually dating so had no interest in dating until I was ready for something serious, which happened in my late 20s.
I spent my early and mid 20s working long hours to establish my career, in grad school part time and having a blast with my friends. I loved my 20s and how I spent them and wouldn’t have changed it. I was so happy with my life as is that I had no interest in dating.
I was 28 when my first 3 friends got married, and at the time most of my other friends were as single as I was. My group very much seemed to be you marry the person you started dating in college in your late 20s or you stay single until your late 20s and then settle down.
Anon for this
This was me, I’d had 3 long term relationships but was my husband’s first. He was just really good at evaluating first impressions, it turned out. Happily married now for 15 years.
Curious
My husband, whom I’ve been with for 7 years and who was a champ through me having cancer while we had a tiny child, didn’t have any serious relationships before me. He knew what he wanted and couldn’t find it.
OP
OP here- I don’t think a lack of relationship experience means something is wrong with him! I was just surprised. It sounds like this is more common than I realized. I guess I’ve seen too many girlfriends waste time with a guy who didn’t know what he wants. I’m glad to hear that this isn’t always the case. Thanks for the reassurance!
Anonymous
PSA – Rothys is having a pretty good sale today
Anonymous
Some of you had posted that you would pay someone to style your home. I think there might be a niche market for this in my area. For instance, I told my girlfriend I’d style her larger living room book case for her because it’s my idea of a fun afternoon. Im envisioning a service where I show up with some pretty things and arrange them for a flat fee amongst existing stuff. Part of me is thinking, “that’s stupid everyone can do this” but another part of me guesses there are plenty of people like my friend who want a nice look but don’t love creating it. I know pottery barn can do this if you buy all their accessories but I think it’s prettier and more cost effective to use a mix of retailers and vintage.
Anon
I don’t think this is stupid at all. In fact, I’m paying someone to do this very thing for me! She sends me links for stuff to order but also sends pics of stuff when she’s in Target or wherever and sees something I might like, then I pay her back.
anonshmanon
Isn’t there a whole Netflix series based on this?
Anon
Yes, and it is weirdly addictive!
Anon
What’s it called?? Must add to the watch list!!
Nesprin
And the inspirations for said series, pinterest and instagram.
But yes, I would pay money to make things look nicer without having to do it, and follow before and after type shots
Anon
Isn’t this what an interior decorator does (as opposed to an interior designer)? They shop and arrange.
anon
I had this done — look under “home staging” and be prepared to say over and over that it’s not about preparing to sell your house.
There are associations who certify people who do this. I got someone who was training, and really lucked out with her. Unfortunately, I’m in a new house and am looking for someone else now.
Panda Bear
I finally Did The Thing (ordered a real office chair, since my crummy cheap one from wayfair is literally falling apart). I splurged on an Aeron! Here’s hoping its worthwhile, it will be the most expensive chair I’ve ever bought!
Cb
Well done! I finally ordered a reading chair for my office after trying since I started to find one from estates/facilities. The finance office sent me a catalogue of terrible chairs, and I just ordered an IKEA PELLO.
Salty I had to spend my own money, but I’ll be so happy to be able to sit and read documents in the afternoons (lupus pain = a need for a comfy chair)
Anon
I had a very similar chair from Ikea back in 1990! It is comfortable but you might want a footstool or ottoman to go with it.
Anonymous
I know I’ve seen recommendations for time tracking apps/software on here before, but can’t seem to locate it. Any recommendations?
Anon
toggl
Horse Crazy
Well, my husband and I are suddenly by ourselves for Thanksgiving – we were planning to travel, but it didn’t work out. Any ideas for a fun Thanksgiving for two, maybe something a little different than a regular Thanksgiving dinner? We’re kinda bummed we can’t go, so I’d at least like us to have a nice dinner.
I hope everyone has a nice weekend ❤️
Anonymous
I would give serious consideration to a restaurant meal. If you want to do nontraditional, several restaurants in my city are open and serving their regular menus. Might be a nice time to try something a little further from your beaten path or a cuisine you haven’t tried. I easily found restaurants open in my city with a Google search.
Horse Crazy
I can’t find a restaurant that has a table available, except ones that are $90/person pre-fixe menu. We’d really rather not spend that.
Anonymous
I mean that’s a super reasonable price.
It’s tmrw. I’d just book it an enjoy.
Curious
Yeesh, that’s a lot! Whole Foods does delicious catered Thanksgivings — are they still taking orders near you?
Anon
I’m team roasted chicken. So much better than turkey and smells good. Or decadent pasta like carbonara. I’m jealous, I love thanksgiving for two.
anon
Hello, fellow 2-person Thanksgiving! I’m sorry your plans got changed. Of the four Thanksgivings my husband and I have had when we’ve lived together, 3 of them were just the two of us. I don’t know what your life stage is, but my husband and I (younger, childless) look at it as sort of a last shebang type of thing. In the future, we’ll feel way more obligated to spend too much money to travel and try to create some type of tradition, for Thanksgiving but also all holidays. For now, we can do whatever we want. And we do so!
This year, we are going to a restaurant, which we’ve never done before. So are a lot of the other 2-people Thanksgiving groups in my office. But if there isn’t time for a reservation, is there any other Thanksgiving tradition you’d want to do, but don’t feel like your standard crew would want? Maybe a different stuffing recipe, or different entree? Maybe you want to start at 2 instead of 6, or 6 instead of 2? Order take out? Do it! There’s no one to stop you. Or maybe think about whether there is anything you dislike about your standard Thanksgiving–and change it. Make cranberry sauce how you would like it. Put extra marshmallows on the sweet potatoes. Skip the roasted brussel sprouts (though in my opinion you’d be missing out). Add something in you’ve never done before (I suggest sweet potato casserole haha). It’s truly your and your husband’s holiday now, and so make it all about the two of you.
If you feel overwhelmed by cooking lots of dishes, then split it up over the whole weekend! There’s no need to have a nice dinner only on Thursday. We’ve been eating Thanksgiving food all week and will continue to do so until we are tired of it.
Though it doesn’t change that you’ll be sad to miss out on traveling, Thanksgiving with just two people can be a blast.
Gail the Goldfish
I mean, is it “nice”, no, but Waffle House is open on Thanksgiving and chocolate chip waffles are an every occasion food. If you don’t live in the Waffle House zone, I am sorry for your loss (but I assume there is a similar 24/7 diner concept in all parts of the country)
Anon
We live far from family, so we’ve done a lot of two people Thanksgivings. We’re also vegetarian, so traditional food isn’t very appealing, especially since I’m also not a fan of mashed potatoes, cranberry sauce, or most of the other traditional sides (I’ll eat them if someone else makes them, but I won’t bother making them myself). One year, we spent the weekend in Yosemite and brought a cooler of Indian takeout with us to reheat in the hotel microwave when we got back from a day of hiking in the snow, which was fantastic. Other years, we’ve made pizza, veggie lasagna, or a mix of Indian dishes at home. This year, we’re doing a lentil loaf and a fancy veggie and pesto stuffed bread.
Anon
Similar story here. I also want to avoid shopping today at the last minute so shopped my pantry. We are going to have brie and crackers for a starter, then green salad, then a rough puff pastry tart with goat cheese/butternut squash/mushrooms. We’ll find a movie to watch, and spend a nice quiet day.
Cat
I’d take this as permission to make just your few fave dishes and skip the rest! For me that would be turkey (sub in a rotisserie chicken if desired), a spicy cranberry sauce, and stuffing. I couldn’t care less about potatoes, green beans, rolls, or pie!
Anon
Second this, I’m by myself this thanksgiving and I’m just making my faves (brioche sausage stuffing, green bean casserole, sweet potato w marshmallows for dessert)
Anonymous
The supermarket should be open tomorrow morning . Start a new tradition with anything celebratory. Do you like to cook? Turkey tacos and margaritas? peking duck and mai tais? Homemade pizza and some dry Lambrusco?
Anon
I’d make your favorite sides and skip the turkey. Maybe it’s just me but I like the sides the best anyway. You can buy turkey gravy or make some from boxed turkey stock if you want gravy and mashed potatoes.
pugsnbourbon
This is what we do! It’s fun and relaxing.
Anonymous
What are some foods that let you gain good weight? I don’t cook much and just end up eating whatever – lots of cheese quesadillas with salsa, grilled cheese, pasta with vegetables, pasta with tomato sauce, some yogurt. Almost completely vegetarian at home though I’ll grab some take out chicken usually 2 to 4 times per month. It’s fine in the sense that I do prioritize vegetables, only cook in olive oil, so I try to be mindful and am not just eating chips and cookies.
But my dr says I’m underweight and wants me to gain a bit. Ideas on snacks or very easy meals – like prep in the toaster oven – type things? I know who I am so it’s unlikely that I’m just going to start cooking tons of meat at home as that’s an effort for me. Yet I can’t come up with many ideas esp vegetarian – maybe rice and lentils though that isn’t especially calorie heavy.
Anon
Eat more nuts. Add peanut butter to toast or peanut sauce to those veggies and pasta. I’m also a huge pesto fan, which I mostly make myself in big batches and freeze in ice cube trays (remove from tray and store in ziplocs once frozen) so I always have some ready. That’s easy to add to pasta or to sandwiches or pizza or just with veggies. You can make it with pretty much any kind of herb or green veggie and any nut (I usually use walnuts), then add olive oil, a clove or two of garlic, some salt, and parm cheese (I actually do nutritional yeast to make it vegan). It only takes a few minutes to mix up a batch in my mini food processor.
Anonymous
– for your quesadillas, buy guacamole and eat it
– for grilled cheese, add a side of tomato soup with a splash of cream in it
– for pasta, toss in chicpeas and add cheese. Or buy frozen vegetarian meatballs and add those.
Add snacks- nut butter on toast, whole fat yogurt, nothing wrong with a cookie with your afternoon tea.
Notinstafamous
A few thoughts:
Upgrade your yogurt to a full-fat balkan/greek style, add some honey and some granola.
Trail mix – peanuts, almonds, raisins, M&Ms, etc
Peanut butter (with apples, on toast)
Jerky (do you eat fish? Salmon jerky is delicious)
Hummus & pita bread
If you eat fish, tinned tuna/salmon on a salad or in your pasta
olives
Omelets or scrambled eggs on toast
Switch your pasta to whole wheat
Add cheese to your pasta
Baked potato with toppings (cheese, sour cream)
Vegetarian chili
anon
Maybe I’m reading myself into this question, so I apologize about that, but there isn’t really a type of food or recipe (outside of maybe super processed packaged food) will let you gain weight if your mindset isn’t in a weight gain mindset. Do you want to gain weight? Outside of pleasing your doctor, that is. If you aren’t in the weight gain headspace, then snack ideas won’t be as helpful, because you still need to eat them and be comfortable with gaining weight from them. It sounds like you already have incorporated some dense foods (cheese) and some easy-to-eat foods (pasta). You could consider adding in nuts / nut butter (peanut butter toast, for example). But note that if you are eating a lot of vegetables with dense or easy-to-eat foods though, you might be eating less than you realize.
Anonymous
OP here – you’re reading yourself into this. Yes I WANT to gain as I want to feel and look stronger.
anon
That’s great! Glad to hear that.
Anon
Healthy fats. So full fat dairy if you eat dariy. Avocado. Coconut. Nuts and nut butters. A little extra splash of evoo. Eggs. Fatty fish if you eat it. Add some flax seed to your yougurt, oatmeal, or whatever.
Anonymous
+1
This is the way to gain healthily.
Anon
+1 to flax seed, and also hemp hearts. Both of those are easy to sprinkle on on oatmeal, yogurt, etc. and I’ve been doing hemp hearts on pasta (along with garlic powder and nutritional yeast as a vegan parmesan substitute that’s surprisingly good- there’s a very easy recipe on Cookie and Kate).
Anon
If they had to cancel their trip because of Covid restaurants probably aren’t on the table either.
Horse Crazy
We didn’t cancel because of covid or any other illness.
Anon
Oh sorry, I’m not sure how I read that into your post. I know like seven people who’ve canceled trips recently because of Covid so I think my brain just went there haha. Glad you’re not sick!
Horse Crazy
no worries :)
Anon
I live in SF and last night a guy was thrown against a wall by another guy in the movie theater we were watching because he was talking. The guy seemed really hurt. Everyone fled out of the theater and the ambulance was called.
The incident was really scary, and it prompted me to download the Citizen app to check to see if any updates came through. Instead, I saw all the dots showing how that night alone, there were gunshots and robberies and all sorts of things happening within neighborhoods I walk through all the time.
It’s now getting dark around 4:30 pm each night. I wanted to stop walking at night, but this would mean not being able to go to the gym or have to Uber everywhere (I don’t have a car).
My question is: how do those of you living in cities (or anywhere with daily crime) stay safe? Do you not walk at night? Do you carry pepper spray? Are there other things I’m not thinking of? I want to maximize being safe but also don’t want to stay in my house all the time.
I also feel like living in SF has put me a bit on edge. There are lots of things like just people screaming at you or seeing people injecting drugs on the street that aren’t necessarily criminal, but give the sense that the social contract could be ruptured at any moment. But there is also way more about the city that I do love, so I wouldn’t want to leave for at least a few more years.
Anonymous
I live in a small city right outside of Manhattan and there are constant reports of women being followed, men doing various sketchy things, a few stabbing, gun shots, etc. It’s a very different environment from pre-covid. As a result, I’ve changed a few things. I will no longer walk along the cute side streets alone at night. I’ll walk along the Main Street. I won’t walk home if it’s more than a 10 minute walk. I will take Uber or cabs more often or walk with friends. Unfortunately your feelings of the social contact being ruptured are accurate.
Anonymous
You’re not any less safe today than you were yesterday.
Anon
Right. I understand that what OP went through was a scary experience, and I would be scared also. But, the robberies, gunshots, etc. were going on before she checked the app and will continue whether she maintains awareness of them or not. I believe in being informed but I also don’t believe in consuming so much information that it feeds fear to the point that irrational choices start being made.
OP, consider getting/carrying pepper spray, or a siren. Watch some videos and read some articles about situational awareness and self-defense tactics for women. Delete the app, it’s not going to help you feel any better going forward. I am truly sorry you had to witness that violent incident. I totally understand why you are scared. But know that the fear you’re feeling now will ease, and all any of us can do is take reasonable precautions to avoid becoming victims (and even then, absolute safety is never guaranteed).
Anon
I live in Philly which has a high crime rate and recently has had a spike in crime in the downtown areas, on public transportation, etc.
I live and work downtown and am in walking distance to almost all of my friends. No car, parents live in a train accessible suburb. I have a very active social life so am socializing probably 6 nights a week in one way or another, so I’m out after dark often.
I have a few friends who live only 2-3 blocks away so it’s obviously great when I can walk with them, but that’s not always. I walk alone after dark until midnight and then Uber after that (but honestly, I’m rarely out after that).
I carry pepper spray about half of the time. I share my location with several friends and am adamant about everyone texting when they get home. I stay very vigilant when walking alone and do plan my route to be as well lit and populated as I can.
I do live half a block down from a bar so I like knowing that I can duck in there if I need to or that if something happens, there’s probably someone nearby. The bar closes at midnight but is open 7 days a week, hence my cutoff for walking home.
The subways here are not the safest. I take the subway alone until maybe 8 or 9 and would subway with a friend until 10. Exception being if I’m at a sports game or concert at the stadiums, in which case I’ll go later as Im leaving with a huge crowd. The train stations in the city have a large un sheltered population so I stop taking the train at the same time as the subway. I don’t usually take the bus so haven’t developed a rule for that.
Honestly I feel better walking home at midnight on a Saturday than I do at 10:30 on a Tuesday. It all has to do with how many others are out and about.
Honestly I hate paying for Uber and also refuse to stay holed up because of the potential risks. But everyone’s risk calculus is different.
As for shootings, most are either targeted or those hit by stay bullets in a targeted shooting. Truly random shootings are rare here. I know no one is targeting me, and there isn’t much you can do to avoid a stray bullet no matter time of day. In fact, I have an acquaintance who was seriously injured after being shot by a stray bullet while she was in a car in a safe neighborhood at 3pm. After hearing about that, I kind of realized it truly can happen to anyone anywhere. When walking home alone I’m more concerned about being mugged or beat up or r*ped – all of which I obviously want to avoid but are a different risk than a shooting.
Z
I live in Detroit.
My friend lives in a very nice neighborhood (historic houses, brick streets, well lit) and she was carjacked (at gunpoint) by a group of young men (including a minor) in her driveway at 9pm on a weeknight. Cars get stolen all the time here, it just is what it is, but carjacking was much rarer until the last year or so. Everyone has to be hyper aware of their surroundings all the time.
Anonymous
The Citizen app has actually been pretty informative to me about where crime happens in my nearby surroundings. Most incidents are not random and happen in the same places over and over again in my city, mostly because a vast majority of the crime is gang-related/drug-related or domestic. So I am pretty aware of where I can never go at night and where nothing ever seems to happen. But I also do try to stay home or use a car after 9pm, except to just walk my dog quickly on my own quiet street.
anonymous
Gently, but frankly, this is racist. You need to do the work and check your privilege before castigating and othering people like this…
Anonymous
Actually, I see more elements of racism in how you got to this response than in the original post.
Anon
+100 the post didn’t say anything about anyones race. The assumption by this commenter seems to be that crime is only associated with certain races which is racist and disturbing. Please stop perpetuating this stereotype.
startup lawyer
+1
Anon
???? Literally a guy was shot and killed two blocks away from apartment two weeks ago in SF. Both were white. Both of the guys in the movie theater incident were white. They were all men, so I get if that’s a commonality, but I don’t see anything in my post that thinks about race. Also, all of the people screaming or using needles that I’ve seen have been white.
I find it very, very disturbing that you’d equate violence as only being perpetrated by people of color. That strikes me as incredibly racist. I think it is a dangerous path to say that people can’t condemn or fear violence without being ‘racist,’ both because it normalizes violence, minimizes women’s fear of violence, and assumes all perpetrators of violence are non-white (which they absolutely aren’t).
Serafina
???
This is sarcasm, right?
Anon
Also, I’m “othering” the guy in the movie theater because he literally, mid-movie, threw a guy against a wall. The victim proceeded to retch and throw up, groan like he was in unimaginable pain, and beg for help. Every movie-goer flooded out of the theater in terror. I am sorry that castigating a white guy for assaulting another person for talking during a movie is “racist,” but I honestly feel like the victim could have serious traumatic brain injury based on how hard he was hit and how in pain he sounded.
But my apologies – let me not ‘other’ the perpetrator. This behavior is totally normal and I need to work on my privilege in hoping this doesn’t happen to me or anyone else I care about (including that random guy).
Anon
How is this racist? I’m truly asking because I don’t understand.
Anon
I think the idea is that acknowledging crime leads to funding for police, and the police are institutionally or otherwise racist (for which there is evidence in the form of membership in white supremacist organizations or in stats on how different people are treated by police).
I think this is very not smart. Crime and violence disproportionately harm vulnerable people. Police also disproportionately harm vulnerable people (say, the disabled). There are solutions to crime other than policing. So I don’t agree with this reasoning, but I think that’s often what it is.
Anon at 1:37
Ahhh.. Interesting. I agree with a lot of the problems with police forces and individuals and the way those systems have developed in this country.
As a person whose mother was murdered (i.e., a victim of crime), major yikes to the idea that acknowledging that happened is racist.
Anonymous
I am often surprised by how little respect and understanding SJWs have for the people they claim to be advocating for.
Anon Gen X
Yes – there is a whole school of thought (mostly limited to highly educated white people who live in safe areas and post on the internet a lot) that acknowledging that some places have high crime is racist because that is somehow code for racial diversity (a really racist idea on its own) or is otherwise racism and classism. We are all apparently supposed to pretend that higher crime areas do not exist (or that crime does not exist except for violence against women and the LGBT community – I am not clear on that one).
Anon
It’s uncomfortable in my very racially segregated city because white neighborhoods (like mine) get better response times from the police, despite less crime and less serious crime. Criminals target majority minority neighborhoods because they’re relatively neglected by the city.
I don’t think just throwing money at the police will change this dynamic, but it still feels like my demographic is not hearing the people who are asking for more readily accessible emergency services including police showing up promptly when called. I’m supposed to think they’re just wrong about what they are asking for. In reality I am sure people are weighing the odds of a bad police encounter with the odds of a bad “violent criminal encounter” which is a real thing that happens.
And even though I’m in a nice neighborhood and living in comfort, I’m not so sheltered that my life hasn’t repeatedly been affected by violent and predatory crime including multiple murders. It’s painful and feels like a betrayal when the left talks about crime as a made-up non-issue.
Anonymous
Gently, but frankly, please stop.
Anon
This kind of thinking, calling legitimate concerns racist, is how you lose hearts, minds and elections.
Cat
I don’t use Citizen bc I don’t want to know, tbh, but in general I take reasonable precautions when walking alone at night – no earbuds, choose blocks with open retail stores that could be used to duck into if needed, use well-traveled streets rather than the quiet-picturesque side streets I might choose during the day, etc.
Anonymom
I live in SF as well, and until recently lived in a neighborhood with a fair amount of street crime. I never felt like it stopped me from living my life, though I always took precautions. No earbuds while walking at night, stick to well-lit streets, remain mindful of surroundings. No mace or pepper spray. And to me there’s a big difference in walking when it’s dark out at 5 p.m., and walking when it’s dark out at midnight. I’ve never thought twice about the former but wouldn’t do the latter except in very well-traveled areas.
thanksgiving anxiety
I wear headphones but don’t play music. I carry pepper spray and a knife if possible. I also cover up if I’m wearing something s*xier –I live in a warm climate but I’ll put a linen button down on to cover my butt if I’m wearing leggings and a sports bra or a shacket over a going-out outfit if I’m taking the train for a night out. I know it’s giving victim blaming vibes but I really get hassled so much less when I do so.
anon
I don’t live in constant fear but I do take reasonable precautions. That means ubering instead of public transportation or walking after 9pm. Yes it’s an annoying expense but I just consider it the cost of a night out. I avoid walking on side streets after dark and don’t wear headphones or talk on the phone. If I get a weird vibe I make direct eye contact with the guy and cross the street if necessary. You want potential assailants to know that you’re aware of your surroundings so you don’t look like an easy target. You want to look alert and confident.
Anonymous
You just need to move.I have lived all over the country and travel a lot for work and I have had more scary encounters in San Francisco than anywhere else in the United States. Literally any other city will be safer.
Anon
Sephora brand lip stain has been my go to lipstick for ages, but they’ve discontinued it and my old ones are slowly running out. It seems they’ve replaced it with “cream lip stain” which is a much thicker formula. Does anybody know a good dupe for the old formula? It was thinner, but still left good color and lasted forever.
Anon
Black Honey by Clinique maybe?
Anon
Try Poshmark. It’s been a godsend for discontinued cosmetics and may buy you some time while you look for a dupe.
Anon
I’m not sure if it’s a dupe because I never used the Sephora brand, but I like the new lipstains from R.E.M. Beauty. They are very pigmented.
Anon
Any recommendations for the best winter chapstick/balm? Aquaphor? Anything else?
Anonymous
Cortibalm
Anon
Nothing beats aquaphor. Lots of other lip balms have irritating ingredients that may feel good at the time, but long term lead to more dryness.
Anon
I switched from Burt’s bees to aquaphor this year. I think aquaphor works better and I don’t need to reapply as frequently
Anon
Tahoe Bliss Balm, if you can find it. It’s literally the best, best best.