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Updated: Dec 2, 2020 411 Comments · by

Wednesday’s Workwear Report: High-Waist Seamed Pencil Skirt

The Personal Shopper (TPS) |

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Forest green has been one of my go-to colors this season. Sort of like olive, it can be a surprisingly versatile almost-neutral when you pair it with other colors.

This skirt would look beautiful with your standard neutrals like ivory, camel, or black (this sweater from Quince comes to mind), but if you’re feeling bolder, it would also look fabulous with some warmer tones like rust-orange, marigold yellow, or burgundy.

The skirt is $98 at Ann Taylor and available in regular sizes 00–18 and petite sizes 00–16. With promo code FAVES, it comes down to only $29.40. High-Waist Seamed Pencil Skirt

This high-waist pencil skirt from Eileen Fisher is $138 and comes in sizes 1X–3X.

Sales of note for 9.30.24

Sales of note for 9.30.24

And some of our latest threadjacks here at Corporette (reader questions and commentary) — see more here!

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About Elizabeth

Elizabeth is a 30-something lawyer living on the East Coast. She spent seven years as a Biglaw associate in NYC, three years as a partner at a medium-sized firm, and is now in-house counsel for a large company. She loves Diet Coke, '90s sitcoms, and dresses with pockets.

Comments

  1. Anon

    Help me feel better. I found out today that I didn’t get the promotion I was expecting. Someone else got the job, for reasons that hurt (she is a native speaker and I’m not, and she has longer tenure at the company).

    I’ve started job hunting, but in the short term I just need to let it go and ensure it doesn’t impact my confidence. So, what is the best, most specific compliment anyone ever gave you on your job performance? Tell me all your good ones, I’ll pretend someone said it to me, and try to muster the confidence to move on.

    • Cb

      Oh I’m sorry, that sucks. I think the best compliment was on my teaching – I taught a brand new course last year and the evaluations really spoke to my best qualities – my enthusiasm for the subject, my commitment to students, and my emphasis on bringing them into the research world. So I was really pleased with that.
      Within my team, someone mentioned someone being really cheerful, and a new member of the team said ‘Oh that’s clearly Cb’. And I thought back to my previous career where I was so mired in a dysfunctional environment and felt good.

    • Ellen

      Hugs! We have all been in this boat, and the good news is that we move on and learn for the next expereince! The best and most specific compliment I ever received on my job performance was given to me by the manageing partner when I showed him how I can write multiple breifs for cleints without haveing to rekey anything. After showing him how I created a shell document and highlighted just the words that need changeing for the next breif, he was amazed how quickly I could go through and dupe the doc and then just find the highlights to change! He said I was “more efficient then his best secretary over the years!” He told me I could still bill each cleint for the full time it would have taken to do the breifs from scratch, thereby allowing me to bill so many more hours then I actually spent doeing the briefs! As a result, I am now the firm’s biggest biller, which really helped me make partner and now get bigger partner bonuses (bonii?) b/c of my efficentcy! YAY!!!

    • Anonie

      I am so very sorry. I sincerely hate that for you.

      When I was right out of college and doing a paid internship before securing a full-time job, sometime told me “You have so much tact.” It was an unusual compliment, but it made me beam. I was only 21 but I decided to really lean into that and become a keenly *tactful person. A few years later, I was able to transition in communications, my field of choice all along. Tactfulness become not just a nice skill, but an absolutely vital one.

      * Admittedly, I am human, so I have my untactful moments, too :)

    • anon

      The right think will come along. Careers are unpredictable.

      The best compliment I ever received was after I’d been at the company for a couple of years and we were recruiting for a similar position. Someone in a meeting asked my boss what kind of candidate he wanted in the new role. He told the whole room what he really wanted on his team was another “me.” The whole room nodded in agreement.

    • anon

      I think some of the most interesting positive feedback I have received calls out how I am different or how I perform differently than peers and that makes me stand out. Emphasis is on the DIFFERENT. And different is not always easy or accepted. You have unique differences and need to find the right environment that appreciates and values those differences and supports you. I know the right opportunity will come along…please put this one in your rear view mirror and keep driving forward….Good Luck to you!!

    • compliments

      Ugh, I’m sorry you didn’t get your promotion :(

      I work in marketing and I’ve been working with developers for the last several years. They are a tough crowd and generally skeptical of marketing people. The best compliments I receive are when I stop them in their tracks because I know things :) Some variation of, “Wow, ok, you really know your stuff” or “At this point, you can probably [give this presentation, ghostwrite this piece, sit on this panel in my place]” or “I’m impressed with your experience in [my topic that I assumed you had never heard of]”.

      The other compliment that I love is when new or struggling employees saying I’m patient, approachable, and positive. My reputation from elementary school through college with friends and family is bossy, opinionated, and domineering, and I’ve really worked hard to not act that way or be perceived that way anymore. Hearing that people think they can come to me with questions and that I’m helpful makes me feel like that work is paying off.

    • Anonymous

      I’ve been in the same group for several years, plugging along at my job and being given more and more responsibilities, but no promotion or new title. Company restructuring led to my grandboss being over several projects, not just the one I was on. He moved me to one of his new projects, to help him get up to speed on it and represent our team’s interests. One of the VP’s blew up over it, and before I had even transitioned asked my grandboss, “What is your plan to replace Anonymous on Project A?!”

    • Vicky Austin

      I’m an accountant and stereotypically not known for my social skills. When my boss called me charismatic and well-spoken I about fell over.

    • emeralds

      I’ve been told multiple times that I’m a master of the scathingly professional “f*ck you and the horse you rode in on” email.

          • emeralds

            Oh man, I can only summon it up when I’m truly pressed! I think it comes down to the precise deployment of white collar professional office language; word choice; and tone. Also the phrases “my understanding” or “as per.”

      • LaurenB

        “She does not suffer fools gladly” was a common phrase in my early-career performance reviews.

        • Anon

          Obvious from your comments here too! (I don’t mean that as a criticism, please preemptively calm down to the person who follows Lauren around defending her.)

    • Formerly Lilly

      A judge who absolutely hated me, screamed at me from the bench regularly, belittled me, and who once quite literally patted me on the head and on one occasion called me “honey” as he entered the courtroom, once said from the bench “If Formerly Lilly tells me it is so, then it is so.”

    • Anne

      A very difficult former-colleague once introduced met to a current superior of his at a networking event as “This is Anne. I tried to oppose her and when I couldn’t I realized I should learn from her instead.” It was the best.

    • PNW

      My current boss is a fussy fussbudget so I try to balance the energy by being as calm and level headed as I can. Last year we had a difficult presentation to a group that was skeptical of our value, which ended up going very well but I really had to lean into this persona to keep from losing it with him. He later called me “unflappable” which pleased me very much :)

    • Giga

      I’m so sorry to hear this :( Being passed up for a promotion is an awful feeling. I have been through it and it was really horrible for me. So I feel you. A lot of people go through it, if that makes you feel any better.
      For what it’s worth, I think not getting a promotion is a good impetus / jumping off point for a serious conversation with your boss about what you want / are looking for, and how you can achieve that in your company. Think about it before you have that convo – don’t go into it angry or confrontational, give yourself some time to calm down and think through it clearly and prepare a “speech” of sorts (diagramming out what direction the convo could go in, and what you might say in each of XYZ scenarios). If you think that might help you be happier at your job, definitely worth trying to have that convo to “set the expectations.”

    • Brunette Elle Woods

      I’m so sorry. I think you can have a pity party tonight and enjoy a bottle of wine and takeout. However, you said someone else got the promotion and she is a native speaker and has been with the company longer so of course she would get the promotion over you. It doesn’t sound like this has anything to do with your skills or qualifications. Seniority matters in most industries and it would reflect very poorly on her if you got the promotion instead. I’m sure you rock and this doesn’t mean you’re not awesome at your job.

    • Senior Attorney

      Oh, I’m sorry! I agree that this is probably more about seniority than anything else and doesn’t reflect badly on you at all.

      This just happened yesterday: I was introduced to a new young intern, who said something like “Please don’t yell at me,” or “please be patient with me” or similar. And everybody else in the room immediately jumped in and said “Oh, you don’t have to worry about that at all! Senior Attorney is always patient and helpful!” That made my day!

      • Sloan Sabbith

        That’s sweet! I feel bad for the intern they felt like they had to say that though.

    • Sloan Sabbith

      My supervisor during law school wrote in a cover letter that I have grit, which I loved. Although honestly the first thing I thought of when I read the question was the time he emailed me that I’d done “kickass work as always, no surprise.”

    • Hugs

      I am so sorry. I hope you do something nice for yourself–whatever that looks like for you!

      A really intimidating partner who is very successful in my field told me she liked me because “I could tell someone where to sit.” It was the nicest vote of confidence!

    • Anon-OP

      These are fabulous compliments—thank you, and thank you for the advice. I will try to put this in my rear view mirror and move on.

  2. Anon

    This is reminiscent of “the skirt” from Nordstrom. Should have featured this while they still had 40% off full price styles over this whole weekend. No one should ever pay full price at Ann Taylor.

    • Kate

      We just noticed that this skirt is now 70% off and have revised the post — looks like Ann Taylor’s sale that started this morning is offering 70% off “winter favorites.”

    • Formerly Lilly

      There’s pants too, and a blazer. I just bought the jacket and pants for $89 plus tax. Hopefully I like the feel of the fabric – other than that I know it’s good to go because AT petite suiting fits me off the rack as if it were tailored for me.

      • pugsnbourbon

        Yeah 70% off puts AT in my price range and there’s like 800 items on sale. Accessories as low as $10 so I might pick up some stocking stuffers.

  3. Anon

    How long is the adjustment period to a new role at new company that has very different culture? I was 10 years at high performance, demanding sales culture at Company A and moved to big tech Company B in same industry for better compensation and career opportunity. Still in sales role but culture is VERY different. Behaviors that drove success at Company A are not valued at Company B. I have been at Company B for 2 years and I’m still adjusting. I have been very successful here but I I miss the high performance culture at Company A. At Company B I find that people are very passive, so I have pulled back on my assertive nature in order to fit in. After 2 years, I’m not a natural fit and still adjusting every day….appreciate any advice from similar experience. Thankful for success in new role but thinking about the next opportunity every day.

    • Anon

      Just continue searching for a role that fits better if you know this isn’t working. But in the meantime, maybe think on what opportunities or things to learn there are with this company that you can take advantage of while still there. Milk all you can out of the role. And keep in mind that in the end, when you find a better fit position, it will be better for you and your coworkers mentally – the way you describe the culture sounds like you’re very intense and competitive so I guarantee it has been just as grating on your more laid back colleagues having you there as it has been for you having to deal with passive less competitive culture.

    • Ellen

      I think we all face similar issues, be it in marketing, school, law or any other profession. Some places are type A, and others are type B. When I was in my first goverment summer law job, everyone was type B, and almost no one did alot of work. In fact, I was penalized for trying to do to much. Then I graduated and became a process server, where we were suposed to be paid based on the number of subpeenies we served. Even tho I served alot, I was NOT properly paid, and was pinched by the manager all the time. I am not sure if that was supposed to be a type A place, but if it was, they were not following through and I was not respected. I was miserable. Then I got my current job, which matched me, b/c they both respected me and paid me for my type A personality. I think you know you prefer the type A place, so the best advise I have is to find a place where you best fit in! YAY!!!

    • Anon

      I’m at 4.5 years and I’m still not adjusted. It’s hard – I say I work at a ‘medium company for medium people,’ but the work-life balance and benefits are unbeatable so it’s worth it for me to stay. But if it’s not a fit and you want to leave, leave! They’re not your people, that’s OK! Find your people. If you want to stay, find fulfillment in hobbies outside of work.

    • AFT

      I feel like 1 year is the adjustment period, and after that there may be a mismatch between your company and your personality/work style. It may be that the gap is worth the benefits/compensation/role, but I do find that the mismatch can be exhausting.

    • anon

      Two years is long enough to know whether something is a fit, and it doesn’t sound like this is. Yes, you can adjust, but fighting your natural personality has to be tiring. Why not start looking around and seeing what’s out there?

    • Anonymous

      I agree with continuing to look, but in the meantime, take the time to understand what makes Company B successful (assuming they are — otherwise you would not have left A). Make sure you are clear on what that is for two reasons — 1) something to focus on learning while you are there and 2) you will be in a position to beat them competitively if you are ever up against them. Good luck.

  4. Anon

    What are your favorite two person board games or card games? Thinking of what I can do while locked down this winter with my roommate

    • Anonymous

      Fog of Love! It’s a mix between a role playing game and a board game, and it’s absolutely wonderful with a lot of replay value (which I like). It’s billed as a rom com, but I’ve played exclusively with platonic friends in pandemic times and we have all had a great time. Highly recommend. Beyond that – Seven Wonders Duel is a lot of fun, and Santorini is also great.

    • AnonATL

      Some of the classics are good for two people: Scrabble, Monopoly, Jenga.
      Risk is possible with two people, but not as fun. I think you can do Catan with 2 people. Also Ticket to Ride which is supposed to be fun with 2 people.
      There’s the aptly named Pandemic, which in the beforetimes was a lot of fun to play, but maybe a bit much now.

    • Ellen

      I do not know if your roommate is a romantic one, but if he is, start with Twister. You can then go to Naked Twister, and after it gets hot and heavy, you can move to the bed and the Horizontal Hora! Otherwise, Scrabble and Yahtsee work and Backgammen is always a fun game. YAY!

    • kag

      Two players only: 7 Wonders Duel, Santorini
      Games for more players that are nice to play with two: Splendor, Azul, Love Letter, The Crew
      Catan and Ticket to Ride are great games, but they don’t shine at the two players count, IMO.

      • anonshmanon

        Catan has a card game version that is made for two players, but it’s not the same as the real thing.

      • kag

        Totally forgot: Jaipur is a nice, easy trading card game for two players. If you’ve already played a few games and/or are not afraid of a bit bigger game with more rules, I highly recommend Everdell and Wingspan.

    • anon a mouse

      Bananagrams is fun and fast. We also like Tsuro, which is a simple but clever tile-laying game.
      For board games, I recently bought Parks to give as a gift to DH – the reviews say it works well for two players, so here’s hoping.

    • Anon

      Here are some that are good for two players, of varying difficulty with the easier ones starting at the top:
      Azul
      Suburbia
      Wingspan
      In the Hall of the Mountain King
      Clans of Caledonia
      Great Western Trails
      Terraforming Mars
      Brass Birmingham

    • Senior Attorney

      We’ve enjoyed the two-player version of Code Names.

      Also it’s fun to do jigsaw puzzles together.

    • Bonnie Kate

      I LOVE Sequence and it’s perfect for two people.

      Yahtzee is also a favorite two person game. My grandpa and dad (they’re in-laws to each other) have played it for years and years after dinner at family events; some of the time someone else will play too but most of the time it’s just the two of them.

      • Bonnie Kate

        Also, get a cool jigsaw puzzle. There are so many good ones right now, so it’s easy to find one to your interests. I did a political button one that was awesome.

  5. Anonymous

    So this is a weirdly specific question. As someone who is watching a LOT of Hallmark Christmas movies this year, I see a lot of the leading men wearing a thick, chunky sweater cardigan type thing that I LOVE. I want to live in this sweater, even if I have to buy it in mens. Does anyone know what I’m talking about and have something similar and can tell me where to find it?

  6. Anon

    Does anyone know what happened to the commenter NOLA? She used to be a regular around here.

  7. Anon

    I’m relatively new to the world of fitness tracking. I have a Garmin watch (vivoactive 4, which I actually don’t love). My activities are a mix of outdoor (biking, hiking, running and seasonal activities such as surfing / kayaking / a little skiing) and indoor (spin bike, strength workouts, HIIT/circuit/boot camp workouts). I don’t have a peleton but I use the peleton app for all of my indoor workouts.

    Two things I’m looking to do here: track my workouts via Strava and track the “distance” biked on my Sunny spin bike.

    I already have a cadence sensor but would like to track “distance” (even if it’s not super accurate – I like concrete goals and metrics and I think that would help).

    A lot of my old teammates from college (a sport none of us do anymore) use Strava and it’s a fun way to stay connected to them and to stay motivated. However, now that it’s winter and more and more of my workouts are indoors I’m struggling with how to best track mileage. It also seems like peleton bike and strength workouts transfer to Strava if you have the bike, but not if you have the app?

    • Anon

      Ugh! How is this in mod for over an hour? I use the Anon handle but with an email address and my other comments today have posted without error

    • anon

      I don’t have an answer to your question, sorry… but I just ordered a Sunny bike that shipped today (yay!!) and am planning to use it with the Peloton app. Any tips for a newbie? (I ordered the “Synergy Pro Magnetic Indoor Cycling Bike” which has the cadence tracking built-in.)

      • OP

        For the price it’s great! I have a lot of friends with actual peletons and as someone who loves metrics, I’ll admit I’m a bit jealous … but the $1600 savings was too important ( I refuse to finance one). The classes are great – I do a bunch of different types (cycling and strength).

        Since you can’t measure resistance, distance, etc make sure you have a heart rate monitor and just do the workouts at heart rate.

    • Coach Laura

      I have an 20year old exercise bike and recently got a Wahoo speed sensor to go with my Wahoo cadence sensor. It is installed via velcro or rubber bungie/rubber bands onto either the hub or axel at the center or on the flywheel itself. They provide instructions and velcro/bands in the package.

      If your bike doesn’t do distance, this would give you relevant metrics to chart progress and aim for goals. My bike has a rudimentary kilometer dial and the Wahoo sensor gave me similar mileage, so I think it’s accurate. I love having the Wahoo sensors. Wahoo has a free app that combines time, cadence and distance to calculate speed etc.

      I don’t use Strava but remember that Wahoo and Strava do communicate. Might be worth it to check it out.

      • Anon

        Thanks!! I use the wahoo app if I’m cycling without doing a class but am not seeing distance.

        Even if it’s not perfect, I like having weekly / monthly mileage goals to try to achieve so would just want a rough estimate. Will look into the speed sensor option

    • Not on Point But

      Doesn’t answer your question, but similar to you and recently got a Whoop band and I am obsessed. Way more helpful in my training that anything else I’ve ever used.

  8. Cb

    I’m waiting on the results of a fellowship interview and they’ve told applicants “hopefully before Christmas” which is very unusual in the UK. We’re moving on Monday so I’ve got that to distract me and I understand it’s a heavily political process but honestly 2 or 3 weeks is a bit cruel. Especially if they tell us right before break, like “happy holidays, hope you get a winning lottery ticket in your stocking, because you’re going to be unemployed!”

    • Ellen

      Dad says to keep a stiff upper lip and you will find out soon! Dad was in the UK, and he said that when he was stationed in Lincolnshire, his commanding officer told him to go down to the local pub to pick up 3 enlisted men who had gotten drunk and disorderly. So he got into his “Willy’s jeep” and when he tried to find them at the pub he couldn’t, but then was able to locate the 3 inside the train station, where the young women had led them. The women had taken their panties off and given them to the solders to encourage them to follow them, but then they took all of their clotheing, leaving them only with their women’s panties to try and cover themself. We should do that to men who try and take advantage of us! Women in the UK are smart and we can learn many lessons from them, Dad says!

    • TheElms

      Hugs from an internet stranger. I’m waiting to find out if I get a significant promotion. In theory, I should find out in about a week. The waiting is so so hard.

    • anonshmanon

      either way it’s bad though. Waiting and hoping will not allow you to relax over the winter break.

  9. Anon

    Can anyone give me a comparison between Quip toothbrushes and Sonicare? We’ve had Sonicare for years. My dentist recently tried to sell my husband on the Quip system and now it’s on his Christmas list. I like that it has no wires, is slim and takes up little space. If I replace his Sonicare with one, I would do the same for myself as I would then clear off a section of our limited counter space.

    Environmentally, I don’t like going back to batteries. Their plan sends you new toothbrush heads and batteries every 3 months I think?

    Anyway, if you’ve tried both, let me know your thoughts.

    • Anonymous

      Cap Hill Style had a very negative review of the Quip a while back. If you decide to go with the Quip, I’d use rechargeable batteries. I like Eneloop.

      • Anon

        Thanks. I’m generally of the mindset “if it ain’t broke, don’t fix it” though we have had our Sonicare system long enough the grips are peeling off. It’s still perfectly functional just not pretty.

      • The original Scarlett

        +1 – I’m surprised at your dentist actually, when I had a bad appointment mine asked if I got sucked into the marketing for quip (yes) and said all his patients with issues had and to go back to sonicare. Quip, at best, is a good travel toothbrush.

    • Ribena

      You can put toothbrush heads on Subscribe & Save through various shops (eg Amazon). I know they stock the Oral B toothbrush heads I use.

    • Ses

      yeah, don’t downgrade. Sonicare is pretty much the gold standard for any high-end dentist I’ve gone to (I have too much dental work and have moved a lot).

    • Anon

      My orthodontist (adult braces, so this is recent info) specifically said to avoid Quip and Sonicare, since the back-and-forth motion can lead to gum recession. Oral-B is best due to the circular motion.

      • holidays

        +1

        Yes – the circular motion is best.

        I’m surprised most dentists don’t tell patients this.

      • Anon

        You can pry my Oral B out of my cold dead hands, but my dead gums will still be perfect.

    • Anon

      My teenage son has a quip and he likes it but it’s nowhere near my OralB in terms of brush action. I’d say get a real electric toothbrush. I have just the entry level OralB.

  10. anon

    My job is officially WFH through spring 2021, and possibly longer. On one hand, I’m glad. It’s given me more time with my kids and overall, life feels less harried and rushed for our whole family. I knew that the back-and-forth was tiring me out but I felt powerless to change much. Not wearing office clothes every day has been amaaaazing.

    On the other hand: that is a lot more time hunkered down with nowhere to go. My team is keeping projects moving, but we were a newer team when the pandemic started, and as the lead, I feel some pressure to make sure everyone is still gelling from afar. I also feel somewhat disconnected from the bigger picture of my workplace and need to figure out a better way to manage that part.

    What is winter/spring looking like for everyone else? Are you setting any specific goals, or is the main goal “just get through this and worry about the rest later”?

    • Anonymous

      For this winter, I think it’s just get through it and worry later. This is such a weird period. I keep likening it to being in WWI or WWII like in the 1940’s – there just can’t be an expectation that anything looks or feels normal.

    • Ribena

      WFH until the spring at least – probably at least 50% WFH after that. (I’m in Scotland where we should all get vaccines by late spring).
      I have just been made perm in my team so the next year is all about prep for a big conference happening next November and working on things that we want to be live by then.

      • anonshmanon

        wow, I’ll be super impressed and jealous if all of Scotland has access to a vaccine by Spring!

    • Bonnie Kate

      Knock on wood, all fingers crossed, we’re moving into our new construction house at the end of the month. It’s been a 2 year process so we plan on spending the rest of winter settling in and hopefully feeling at home. Both DH and I have weird feelings now that the house is actually starting to look like a house and less like a project. Although in reality the winter/spring will be probably full of settling in projects as we very much downsized a few years ago before moving across country a few times and don’t have a lot of things. Although I’m REALLY REALLY REALLY trying to hold back and not order all the online things, because I really like a collected look and that takes time and lots of vintage shopping that isn’t going to be happening soon.

      So I guess my goal is to hopefully move into the house by Christmas, and avoid the trap of filling the house up with easy to obtain boring crap.

    • Anonymous

      we’ve been told we’re WFH until june 2021 and then they’re examining a different set of expectations afterwards, where we may be asked to be in the office 3 days a week but given 2 flex days to wfh. i am ALL for that set up as it would actually be my ideal (saved commute time on 2 days, but with some good human interaction on 3 days!). i too am treating the winter as a continued “take it day by day” situation and trying to just focus on making it through each week as sane and healthy as i can

  11. Anonymous

    We’re starting to have some issues at work regarding microaggressions. A few staff members raised very valid concerns during the height of the Black Lives Matter protests this summer and we had what I think was a pretty good corporate response (which is still ongoing so it’s not “one and done.”) Those issues were important and I’m glad we brought attention to them. However, there are one or two staff members (at my very small company) who now seem to be growing incredibly fixated on perceived microaggressions. For example, one person was upset that our company CEO used the phrase “refugee from [large dysfunctional company in our field]” because he found it offensive to actual refugees. Someone else was upset that our HR coordinator used the words “Secret Santa” rather than “Secret Snowman” to describe our upcoming company gift exchange because Christianity is “colonialist.” This same person was also upset to hear the phrase “junior” to describe her entry-level role at the company because she felt that it was divisive and meant to cut her down to size. Overall, there are about 2-3 people who I would perceive as growing fixated on these issues. One is becoming quite bitter, actually. They are a few years out of college and I’m only 8 years out myself (so I’m kind of in the middle of our org chart).

    I’m not denying that other people may experience things differently than I do and that they have valid feelings about these issues. However, these examples (and others in the same vein) are starting to wear down company morale. I’ve started hearing a lot of grumbling and seeing a lot of eye rolls behind closed doors. It’s starting to feel like people are on the hunt to identify ANY language that COULD be offensive, even if no one present was offended.

    I’m in a position right now (on a newly formed committee) to address issues related to diversity and inclusion and I want to focus on the big stuff, like racism and sexism, but I’m not sure what to do about these microaggressions. I promise I’m not trying to pot-stir and that the examples I gave are 100% real. I want to make things better at my company, but I can’t help feeling like I just want to say “grow a thicker skin!” and I know that isn’t going to be helpful. If I’m honest, I also don’t want to lose my reputation as a sensible person who gets things done without a lot of drama. So, what do I do? Do I make these microaggressions a focus of our committee or just ignore them and focus on the big stuff? Should I talk about it with the people who have complained?

    Also, follow-up: if someone confides in me about a microaggression one-on-one and I don’t really believe it’s significant, how do I respond? I’m kind of torn between not wanting to validate things like Secret Santa outrage and not wanting to dismiss people’s real concerns, including concerns about race that I might not have picked up on as a white person. I do want people to feel comfortable bringing up real issues.

    • Anonymous

      As a committee member, focus on big things. As an individual, if someone reports a micro aggression to you, be guided by your obligations under your companies anti-harassment and discrimination policy. Do not voluntarily involve yourself in this drama.

    • Anonymous

      I think you are focusing on the micro (yes, these are micro, of whatever they are). But I don’t think that they are “aggressions”. I think that things that are lacking in vicious intent ought to be dealt with . . . not at all. These are, at most, “micro negligences.” And as you said, there are actual fish to actually fry.

      But when people come to you, maybe ask them how ideally they would handle this (vs you or a third person handling this).

      The snowman thing seems almost laughable — why should it be a snowMAN? Like fixing one perceived wrong might just open a can of worms.

      • Anon

        We used to jokingly call it the secret non-denominational holiday figure gift exchange once someone complained about Secret Santa. I kind of agree that the term Secret Santa is kind of like saying Kleenex meaning tissue.

        • anonshmanon

          ask a manager had a really good post about this. For me as an absolute lover of Christmas who grew up absolutely secular, it was eye opening. I always thought that because my family’s version of Christmas is very secular, it meant that everyone could experience Christmas in that not-fraught-by-religious-undertones way. The use of Secret Santa as a catch all (like Kleenex) is actually part of the issue, but if you observe Christmas (even if your Christmas, like mine, is not about the nativity, but about lights, family and food), you can still feel included in the default holiday event with Xmas labeling, whereas people of other religions and atheists who don’t observe Christmas won’t necessarily feel included. And some may still feel sufficiently included, knowing the intent was for all colleagues to be addressed (such as when I feel included when a group is addressed as ‘you guys’). But not everyone will feel the same, it’s not unreasonable to feel excluded if a Christmas label is put on events and it’s very easy to come up with a more inclusive label.
          She said it better though https://www.askamanager.org/2019/12/is-it-ok-to-put-up-a-christmas-tree-at-work.html

          • Senior Attorney

            Yes Ask a Manager is spot-on here. I used to think it was possible to have “secular” Christmas, then I married somebody who grew up in a Jewish household, and he opened my eyes in a similar way to this column.

          • Anonymous

            Yes Ask a Manager is spot-on here. I used to think it was possible to have “secular” Christmas, then I married somebody who grew up in a Jewish household, and he opened my eyes in a similar way to this column.

    • Anonymous

      Are you looking for validation that these things are NBD? ‘Cause I don’t agree that they are NBD.

      The ‘refugee’ thing is kinda offensive. DH’s Dad was a WW2 refugee and it is a deeply awful experience and pretty offensive to refer to that kind of experience in a trite way as being analogous to changing jobs. Or the ‘junior’ thing can depend a huge amount on context. Did the person do an awesome powerpoint presentation only to be dismissed as ‘junior’? Not necessarily racism/sexism but a pretty lousy office culture if junior people are not treated respectfully.

      It’s not an either/or. Focus your work on racism/sexism but don’t lose sight of the fact that dealing with microaggressions is dealing with those issues.

      • Anon

        I’m not denying that other people could find the refugee thing offensive, but my own husband is a refugee and neither he nor I find it offensive. I just read this post to him and he thought it sounded silly, honestly. Maybe because he’s used to dealing with bigger problems…

        • Anonymous

          Not really sure what the point of this comment is. It’s like saying my black friend is fine with ABC comment so other black people shouldn’t be hurt by it. FIL is a pretty stoic guy but I’ve seen FIL visibly winch on many occasions when people refer to someone as a ‘refugee of ABC firm’ in casual conversation. It’s a classic microaggression in that it doesn’t seem like a big enough deal to complain about but it still makes the other person feel awful and brings up horrible memories.

        • Senior Attorney

          Right, and if any refugees are going to be hurt by it, isn’t the best practice not to use that word in a casual context?

        • Anon

          Look at the first post of the day- someone didn’t get a promotion and feels her non-native language skills contributed to that. That’s her real, lived experience of xenophobia.

          Just because your husband who is a refugee doesn’t find it offensive, doesn’t mean all refugees share that opinion.

          Xenophobia and racism are real challenges some refugees encounter depending on their national origin, command of the language, religion, etc.

          I would also be uncomfortable with my CEO using refugee when she/he really means transfer or new employee. The power dynamic and challenges refugees are real and not the same as changing companies.

          • Anon

            I just cannot imagine interpreting such a remark in the worst possible light and fixating on it. Do you think the CEO was trying to be snotty towards refugees in a completely unrelated meeting? Does intent matter?

          • Vicky Austin

            I hear you, but did the CEO really mean transfer or new employee? From the context OP gave, I would be WAY more inclined to assume that the CEO was discussing an existing pattern of people fleeing ABC Co.’s undesirable working conditions than popping into HR’s office to ask, “Hey, have all the refugees finished onboarding?”

          • Anon

            Intent doesn’t equal impact. I doubt the CEO was willingly trying to hurt refugees. Nonetheless, words matter. There are plenty of other neutral words to use.

          • Anonymous

            Intent doesn’t equal impact, but neither does perception equal reality.

          • Anonymous

            I don’t think her experience was xenophobia. The OP said the person who got the promotion was a native language speaker AND had been there longer. We don’t have enough facts to say if this was xenophobic or simply the other person was better qualified or experienced.

      • Anon

        I mean a lot of roles have junior in the title. Examples – junior analyst, analyst, senior analyst

        • Anonymous

          Right. Which is why the title is fine but dismissing someone’s actually valuable contribution because ‘Susie’s just a junior analyst’ vs a substantive concern with their work is not a good office culture practice. Not a microaggression, but not a good look either.

    • Anon

      I think part of how you respond depends on if you are from the same background as the person complaining or not. Also, how senior you are and how much of your role involves HR. As a committee, I think it’s fine to note that you only have so much political capital and you don’t want to be the employees who cry wolf. You are going to focus on the more egregious microaggressions and not address things like “junior” that are not universally considered a microaggression.

    • Anon

      so, i think this is a tough spot. I myself am Jewish and would never be offended by a ‘secret santa’ because christianity is ‘colonialist’ (whatever that means), and on some level i feel like the term ‘secret santa’ is almost like how people might say kleenex when they just mean a tissue, regardless of the brand, or scotch tape, even if it is a different brand. it refers to a concept. that being said, it is 2020 and seems like an easy way to make people feel more included by not calling it secret santa. last night we received a package of food items from DH’s company. It was sent directly from his smaller satellite office within his larger company and it contained a lot of pork products…well we don’t eat pork and so while a nice gesture, a part of me also felt like this is 2020, a lot of people don’t eat pork for a variety of reasons, can’t they just send something more universally appealing. i also think there is a huge difference between different generations in terms of what is/isn’t ok to say or do.

      • Anonymous

        OP here and you are right that it is definitely generational right now, but I’m stuck between wanting to push the older generation to move along with the times and the younger generation to get a thicker skin. I agree that for some things, it’s easy to be inclusive like sending boxes that do not include pork, but should I really go inform my committee that it was super offensive that someone was called junior? Honestly, I don’t want to, but I’m trying to make sure that I don’t just use my privilege to check out of this.

        • anon

          I think you can use your discretion about which comments to elevate (like the pork example) and which ones only require a listening ear (“Junior”). But this is a really tough role to play.

      • Anonymous

        Eh I’m a vegan and have been given a holiday ham for like 5 years at my company. I don’t see it as an agression even though they are literally saying they don’t value my morals. I just accept that some people are dense and move on. I can’t imagine getting hung up on things like this, I would never be happy.

        • Anonymous

          I think that’s where I’m falling too. I can get upset at every statement that I thought was off-putting and conclude that all my coworkers are monsters or I can brush it off and be happy with myself. Yes, real issues can and should be addressed, but I think focusing on microaggressions can produce an unhealthy state of rumination.

      • cbackson

        I think on the Secret Santa there’s a difference between the corporate decision around what the program is named (Secret Snowman is a good option to make people feel more included) and how you deal with someone who slips up and calls it Secret Santa. I would definitely support making sure the program has an inclusive name, but I wouldn’t consider someone who accidentally calls it Secret Santa to be in need of reeducation. Nor would I consider that a microaggression.

        • Anonymous

          Totally agree. There’s a huge difference between how a company formally names something vs. people accidentally using the old name.

        • Anonymous

          Actually, that’s exactly what happened – the person organizing the event first called it Secret Snowman and someone else later in the same meeting said “I don’t love White Elephant, I think we should go back to the Secret Santa idea.” There was a complaint about that.

          • Anon

            I feel like that is such a stretch to complain about that!

            Also even tying Santa to Christianity, let alone colonist Christianity is a huge, huge stretch. Christmas has become so mainstream and secularized

          • anonshmanon

            In that case, I would just continue to be mindful in official communications, but not police individuals.

    • No Face

      Those are not even micro-aggressions!!! Just words they don’t like. As a Black woman who has to deal with actual racism and sexism in her career, people like this frustrate me so, so, much. I thought about typing out how I would respond to these specific examples, but it is difficult because I find them so stupid. I would like you to submit this question to Ask a Manager because she is level-headed and gives good advice. Clearly I cannot. (Also, as an aside, the view of Christianity as colonialist irritates me, because it essentially upholds the white supremist version of Christianity as the “real” version, disregards the faith’s roots in the Middle East and Africa, and diminishes the faith of Christian people of color who I believe comprise the majority of believers in the world,)

      • Anonymous

        This. So much this re Christianity. The majority of Christians are non-white.

        • Anon

          Yes, I have strong negative thoughts about missionaries but saying Christianity is colonist is a stretch

      • Anon

        Christianity is ABSOLUTELY a vestige of colonialism. Just because other countries have adopted Christianity doesn’t change the often very brutal history of missionaries that took children from their parents, operated boarding schools where there was lots of abuse, and held literal hearings about whether indigenous people had souls or not. Google Sepulveda v. de las Casa.

        Signed, a WOC and Christian whose ancestors were colonized by Christians/Catholics. I can both practice my faith and recognize my religion is a colonial artifact.

        • No Face

          I think we are on the same page about the harm done in Christianity’s name. For example, white people who identified as Christians enslaved generations of my family and subjected the later generations to a whole host of racist policies, beliefs, and actions. I’m just saying that I refuse to let their “slaveholder religion” (see Frederick Douglass for definition and discussion), or the “colonial religion” practiced against your family, define all of Christianity.

          • Anon

            And that’s your choice. I have family members (we’re POC) who have rejected Christianity due to it’s colonial origins, which are very real.

          • No Face

            Obviously people can choose to follow or not follow religions based on whatever they choose. But Christianity predates European colonization of other parts of the world, by centuries and centuries and centuries. It is not a mere vestige.

          • Anon

            Replying to No Face-
            Christianity may predate colonialism, but it is colonialism that spread Christianity to vast parts of the world and colonialism that was used to (sometimes forcibly) convert native populations in the name of civilizing them. Certainty it was a tool wielded by would-be colonialists with great effect and causing great destruction to native cultures.
            – Signed, a South Asian who studied in Catholic schools and attended mass despite not being christian

        • Anon

          “Christianity is ABSOLUTELY a vestige of colonialism.”

          Putting something wrong in caps means you’re extra-wrong, fyi.

        • Anon

          Christianity is a vestige of colonialism that went hand in hand with very brutal genocide and forced assimilation in the Americas. Better?

    • values

      We addressed this in my company with a broader set of values and guidance around language vs. trying to address every single phrase or word. We’re a global company, so the assumption that everyone could possibly know, understand, and change their language immediately is ridiculous. One of the values is around assuming best intentions, and that a lot of phrases or words have been around for a long time. Thus, if you know someone generally tries to be kind and aware, don’t jump on them for using an outdated phrase. For example, calling a mixed group of people “guys”. We had a big dust-up about that because it excludes women, but a lot of people argued that the fact that “guys” is the default is more proof of the prevalence of s3xism. The guidance was to do your best to use gender-neutral terms like “y’all” or “folks” or “team”, but not to assume bad intentions if someone used “guys”.

      On the flip side, we have a value around being open to education, listening, and the evolution of language. The word “gypped” came up as an example of a widely-used word that had racist origins. A lot of people had no idea it was racist (myself included, I grew up thinking it was spelled “jipped”), but now that I know it’s offensive, I try not to say it anymore.

      It’s definitely hard when people are nitpicking every little thing, so going back to some values and looking at the impact vs. the effort to correct is helpful. And also… what do these employees want you to do? Fire someone? Make them go to training? Publicly call them out? Again, at our company, it’s pretty rare that someone wants anything done, more than just acknowledging that oh hey, I didn’t know that, thanks for the heads up, I’ll try to be better.

    • Anon

      My office has a massive culture issue and very real issues are overlooked and dismissed as complaints of people being overly sensitive. Perhaps someone can approach these people and explain that being the language police detracts from the larger goal

      • anon

        My office also has this problem. Higher ups point to these type of silly complaints as a reason to ignore all complaints, including the very real ones. I wish I could pull people making these type of complaints aside and explain that they are really damaging the cause to get senior management to take real micro aggressions and other cultural issues seriously

        • Anon

          100% happening in my office.

          Graphic sexual comments aren’t addressed bc leadership is tired of dealing with any complaints because there’s a lot of “you called on him first, that’s sexist”

    • Vicky Austin

      Were these coworkers reporting their refugee/Secret Santa/junior concerns to you as a member of the committee, or were they venting/you heard it through the grapevine that they were upset? If the former, I think you have a duty as a committee member to present it neutrally to the rest of the committee, and of course you are entitled to have an opinion during the ensuing discussion. If the latter, I wouldn’t worry about it.

      • Anonymous

        The junior and refugee things were to the committee (through me) and the Secret Santa was through the grapevine.

      • anonyK

        I agree with Vicky Austin, unless you are expected to be a “gatekeeper” to the committee. Otherwise raise these kinds of complaints with the committee and you guys can decide together how to approach.

        When they bring the complaints to you, one thing I would do is probe whether the complainer is feeling otherwise valued and respected in their role at the company. Is this a random pet peeve or are they generally disgruntled with how they are treated and this is symptomatic of that? That will give you more information and also let them feel genuinely heard, even if the committee ultimately decides to do nothing about these complaints.

    • Anon

      Your committee probably has limited resources (time, mental energy to expend on an issue, buy in from leadership/colleagues), so I’d focus on the actual issues. You don’t want to focus on the perceived microaggressions and miss focusing on the larger, more important issues. These microaggressions are likely a distraction from the substantive issues and you don’t want to loose support from someone who could be a good ally in bringing about actual change because they’re put off by complaints about Secret Santas.

      Speaking of Secret Santas – if you’re going to complain about that name, mention that not everyone in the company celebrates Christmas. Don’t take the obscure route of complaining that Christianity is colonialist…

    • Anon

      I’m confused by several of these complaints, but I’m most confused about the junior position comment.

      It’s super common to have levels of a position – ex junior analyst, analyst, senior analyst. You mention that the position/employee is entry level, so referring to it as junior seems appropriate. Even if the terms are changed to being Analyst I, Analyst II, Analyst III or something, the hierarchy and seniority still exist. You need to be able to differentiate between different levels of work; and those levels exist for a reason (pay bands, responsibility, etc).

      Honestly, if someone complained about being a junior analyst when they were in fact entry-level, I’d have to seriously rethink if they fit in at the company.

      Admittedly, I’m a civilian who works with uniformed personnel on the regular – I have to call my boss sir, and the uniformed people I work with have their rank visible right on their shirt and we refer to them by their rank (and sir/ma’am if appropriate) so my view on workplace seniority / hierarchy is a bit different. My office is all civilian, but the rank is still very clear and you’re expected to be deferential to your superiors. But, I’m still a young, liberal snowflake and honestly would tell someone to get a grip if they complained about this benign hierarchy term.

    • Anon

      “Someone else was upset that our HR coordinator used the words “Secret Santa” rather than “Secret Snowman” to describe our upcoming company gift exchange because Christianity is “colonialist.””

      Why is it acceptable for her to insult Christianity that way? A legitimate albeit annoying gripe would be that Santa is associated with Christmas and the gift exchange should be inclusive of all faiths, agnostics, and atheists. It’s not okay for her to insult another religion, full stop. HR needs to sit her down and tell her to keep her little mouth shut and her anti-Christian biases to herself.

    • anon

      It seems like you may need direction defining the role of this committee. Whatever that role is, it is probably not to address individual acts of aggression or microaggression. That’s more of an HR role. (Or is this an HR sub-committee?)

      Assuming this committee does not have an HR function, I would listen to people who confide in you about aggressions or microaggressions. Tell them thank you for letting you know. If it seems warranted, point them to HR. (It does not seem warranted in any of your examples.) If people think they can bring things to you, you’ll have an opportunity to notice patterns, which your committee could address in a broader way. For example, several “microaggressions”–Secret “Santa,” pork products in thank you gifts, not offering a diverse menu at corporate events, badgering about being out of the office for the high holy days–could add up to a non-inclusive environment that doesn’t value diversity.

    • Anonymous

      Thanks everyone. I appreciate the insight and will consider next steps for moving forward. Unfortunately, while this post was up, yet another “incident” was brought to my attention and I’m starting to get concerned about this employee’s mental health. Hopefully we can find a way forward.

    • Anon a Manager

      OK – I am old (mid-50’s) so am going to give my thoughts here as likely reflecting the thoughts of people in senior leadership roles.

      If someone objected to “Secret Santa” as an official name [we do not have an official Secret Santa although some of the support staff usually organize one that everyone is invited to participate in), I would perhaps sigh internally but change the name and acknowledge that non-Christians can justifiably have an issue. If someone complained that another employee referred to it as Secret Santa. I would think they were being ridiculous. If they complained that Secret Santa was colonialist I would think they were being even more ridiculous and would silently hold it against them.

      If someone whose title is “junior” complained about the title – I would absolutely shut them down. I would tell them in no uncertain terms that their contributions are valued but Junior” is an indication of time in role (and in my industry billing rate). What I would not say out loud is if they do not like it they are welcome to find another job. I find dealing with people who obsess over terminology rather than actions tiresome.

      Micro-agressions are a real thing that cause real hurt and have real consequences. And we really need to stop diluting that by complaining about every single thing that some hyper-sensitive 25 year old finds “problematic”. Also, the most sensitive member of every group does not get to define what is offensive for every other member of that group (speaks the person who has listened to several of my Latino/Latina employees and friends rage about Latinx at great length because they really, really hate it and feel like it is being imposed on them by non-Spanish speaking White people).

      • Anon

        It’s not about being hyper sensitive or young. The takeaway is no group is a monolith. There are regional differences, educational differences, differences in lived experience. I have friends who strongly identify as Latinx, who are 40+. I like to ask people what term they prefer to self-identify. If I use the “wrong” or not preferred term, I’ll apologize and ask which they prefer instead of being defensive about it or assuming someone is over sensitive.

        • Anon a Manager

          I am happy to call individuals whatever they want to be called; but from what I have read fewer than 5% of Hispanic/Latino/Latina/Latinx people in the US use that term and a lot of them find it offensive and/or annoying. So the problem is when we need to use a term to refer to a group and are forced by the loudest, mostly young and often on-line voices to use one that a larger percentage within that group find off-putting at best.

          Not being of that heritage myself I am more than happy to defer to the sensibilities of those who are. What I struggle with is how to balance the disagreements within that community. This is a problem in my Southern California workplace where a large percentage of our employees are Hispanic (the term I grew up with and the one I use the most often in conversation).

    • Anonono

      I’m not going to address the specifics of what has been brought to you, but the idea that as the leader of this committee you want to “avoid drama” is, in my strongly held opinion, extremely misguided. This work IS dramatic because it is pushing back against systemic issues that most of the people in power at any given company may prefer not to address. If you just want to check off the box of leading a committee, I suppose it’s fine to pursue the “no drama” approach. But if you want to actually tackle “big” issues, as you claim here, I think you need to embrace the fact that this work will be uncomfortable for you and others and will, by necessity, make waves.

      • Anonymous

        Oh absolutely and I didn’t mean to imply that I want to avoid difficult conversations – we’ve actually had a lot of difficult conversations already and I think they are helping. I meant (and probably should’ve used a less charged word) that I want to avoid turning this into a mess where we get stuck on these really minor phrases at the expense of real progress. I’d rather we focus on racial pay equity than whether an employee should be punished for saying Santa, you know?

        • Anon

          Why not both? Who decides what the focus is? Are POC/marginalized people bringing up these microaggressions? Perhaps what you see as a priority for focus isn’t what others feel needs to be dealt with. Food for thought.

    • Anon

      Coming in late on this but I have a take on it that may be helpful.

      I have experienced similar issues in the past, and I counseled people thusly:
      If you hear something that bothers you, it’s okay to bring it up and say, hey, that language isn’t inclusive/may offend some people, we may want to use different language going forward. That kind of constructive feedback helps people think about language and hopefully make improvements. Constructive dialogue helps us all get better over time.

      When it gets to the point that I feel like someone is A. looking for reasons to be offended, B. fixating on a past mistake that has been brought up an acknowledged, or C. creates a new job for themselves as the Company Language Police and starts letting their work slip, it’s time for a coaching conversation in which I explain, as positively as I can, that the role they are performing is not what they’ve been hired to do. In regard to A., if people look for problems intently they will find them; in regard to B., bring it up and then let it go – if you can’t let it go and move forward, that’s a “you” problem, and in regard to C., the bottom line is you need to do the job we pay you to do and everything else is ancillary. I have also explained that culture changes slowly, and if someone is really invested in changing language or culture within the company, they should join an affinity group, or our diversity committee, or do something to channel their energies in a productive way. Workplaces need to evolve. Businesses need to get business done. That is not an either/or proposition, both can happen at once. Younger (or maybe more sensitive) employees need to understand that constantly policing other people may feel satisfying emotionally but it will not advance their career, and guess who are the people who really get to set the culture and spark change in an organization? It’s the people at the top.

      In 95% of cases where I had to do this coaching, it was with a less-experienced employee who just needed some help understanding their role in the company and how to pick their battles. The remaining 5% of cases, the employee was an intentional rabble-rouser looking to create conflict who also performed poorly, and we were able to manage them out pretty fast.

  12. Covid confession

    My spouse has gotten hooked on Southern Charm. Apartment is too small to escape it when he is watching it (even if the earbuds are in, it is like a telenovela where you can tell even without words what is happening).

    I have also developed a Daily Mail habit, as I am too proud to buy US tabloids at the grocery store when I can stroll the tawdry headlines for free and without being observed.

    How much will my IQ be permanently lowered by all of this?

    • Anonymous

      Yeah, so I read DM for the gossipy royal stuff – even though I know half of it is fake and I definitely watched too much RH stuff which is basically SC. Sometimes your brain needs to reset with junk food. If this is the only thing you’re consuming it will probably make you dumber. Think of it as delicious chocolate. Perfectly fine as long as that’s not the only thing you eat.

      • pugsnbourbon

        Bahaha for some reason I’m obsessed with royals. I recently started following Tatler on Instagram, which is fun.

    • Anonymous

      I can’t speak to the daily mail, but I went through Southern Charm phase and my IQ was definitely lowered. The only good thing about it was the architecture in Charleston.

    • No Face

      My taste in entertainment depends on how difficult/taxing the rest of my life is. Before law school, I was very high-brow. During law school, I got REALLY into Real Housewives of Anywhere because they require no thought or emotion to watch. When work is easy/slow, I love difficult books, documentaries, etc. When I’m busy? All the reality TV.

      FYI, the free version of Peacock has a lot of Bravo reality television for free. It’s 2020. Embrace it.

      • givemyregards

        Same – Bravo shows basically function as white noise to me, so I binge them when I have a bunch of busywork to do. They occupy a small enough sliver of my brain, that I’m able to actually focus on menial stuff for long periods of time.

    • Anon

      This doesn’t answer your question, but the men on Southern Charm are so lazy! Hope they don’t wear off on your husband!

      I enjoy my mindless TV tremendously.

      • Brunette Elle Woods

        Omg the men on that show are all awful! No wonder most of the women left.

        • Anonymous

          They are all actually horrendous. Shep’s toxic alcoholism will catch up to him sooner than he thinks.

          • Brunette Elle Woods

            Didn’t he already have health problems from drinking too much? Also, do they just get all their money from parents and the show? I also wonder if reality TV has made my IQ go down.

    • NYCer

      I love Southern Charm, and I am fairly certain my IQ has not been impacted. To each their own when it comes to mindless TV!

    • Anon

      I’m an avid opera fan who likes Real Housewives. In some ways, they’re not that different. In the ways that they are different, I find that I can still use both sides of my brain perfectly fine.

      So come sit by me if you want to talk about how the Principessa Turandot is not all that, or whether Monique has a point that Candiace started it.

    • Anon

      Eye roll. Humans are complex creatures, you can use a little bit of your brain on things you consider beneath you and you’ll end up just fine.

  13. Cookie Cutters

    We normally make rolled sugar cookies each year because the kids like using the cookie cutters and decorating them, but none of us particularly like the cookies. Does anyone have recommendations for other cookie recipes that we can use cookie cutters for and, ideally, decorate in some way?

    • Anon

      I like the King Arthur sugar cookie recipe with cream cheese in the dough, if you haven’t tried those yet. Other than sugar cookies, you could try gingerbread.

      • anon

        Hmmm, interesting I have made a classic sugar cookie recipe for cutouts for years, and decorated them….have never tried the cream cheese in the dough recipe as that sounds like a softer cookie…more like rugelach….will definitely check it out

      • Cookie Cutters

        I like the idea of gingerbread cookies. Any recipe recommendations for ones that are easy to roll out?

        • techgirl

          If you can handle measuring in weights instead of cups, the BBC (not BBC Good Food) gingerbread men recipe is my go to. Freezes well too.

        • Anon

          Pillsbury sells a roll that you roll out (much like their sugar cookies). I only bake out of the box, so that’s my go to

    • Anonymous

      We use cookie cutters for sandwiches at lunch. And also to cut shapes out of cheese. #bored #OMGmakeitstop

    • Carrots

      If you want something that’s not edible, my mom when I was very younger, did flour cookie ornaments that we then painted to hang on the tree. I was maybe 4 or 5 when we made them, so they’re at least 25 years old now and held up great.

      • anon

        Salt dough ornaments! I remember doing those with my mom and her friend when I was about 6. They did hold up well. My mom no longer puts up a tree, but I bet they’re still in her garage somewhere, 30 years later.

        • Carrots

          Yes! I think she also made some with cinnamon in them that we didn’t paint too, but that still smell amazing!

          • Anon

            Toddler cinnamon handprint ornaments still hang on my tree and my kids are in their 20s.

    • anon

      Rollout gingerbread cookies. There is also an old cutout cookie recipe from Betty Crocker that uses honey in the dough. They have a completely different taste than sugar cookies — almost like a yummier graham cracker. I’ll see if I can dig it up somewhere.

    • anon in brooklyn

      The 101 Cookbooks whole wheat sugar cookie is fantastic. Less sugary, more buttery, a hint of salt. A much more grown up tasting cookie.

  14. Anonymous

    I feel like this is something from LL Bean. I love me some bean, but often shop on eBay / Poshmark b/c their stuff lasts forever.

    • Anon

      A pencil skirt seems kind of formal for LL Bean. I didn’t know they sold things you couldn’t hike in.

      • Anonymous

        Nesting fail — was re Aran sweater from Hallmark movie channel person above.

      • Anonymous

        Haha, I was thinking the same thing. Although I do have a nice summer dress that would be appropriate for lounging by the lake in the summer (or sitting in my backyard pretending there is a lake), so I thought maybe they did skirts sometimes too.

  15. still not April Whittier

    I’m meeting a photographer buddy to take some agented-author-website-listing-back-of-the-book type headshots this weekend. (Outside and socially distanced, obviously.) It’s been so long since I’ve worn anything other than giant oversized sweaters and leggings, and I’ve never taken a good headshot in my life–please help me!

    Current options include: a chambray button-down; a swingy black sweater; a fitted gray sweater; or a sleeveless navy wrap dress. I’d probably be doing a bold red lip and big hoop earrings, but could swap that around for some different jewelry or makeup options. My job’s dress code is casual, so I don’t have any interesting blazers to throw on top of anything. Any thoughts? Suggestions? I hear it’s best to avoid prints and go for jewel tones, but I don’t do jewel tones and I wear a lot of print, which makes this more challenging…

    • Veronica Mars

      I’d go with the fitted gray sweater. You want simple neckline, solid colors, and fitted.

    • Anon

      Definitely the fitted gray sweater. A solid color in a simple outline is best; layers will look too busy.

    • anonshmanon

      Grey sweater sounds like a winner! You’ll likely take a whole bunch of shots for a good long time and then select 5 out of 100 where you like your facial expression. This is how they get one perfect looking picture of a supermodel – they shoot 100 not-perfect ones.
      I’d take a colorful, drapey scarf and a second pair of earrings just to mix it up halfway through. This way you may get two very different looking headshots out of this, which could come in handy.

  16. Anonymous

    I just got asked to take the lead on organizing our virtual holiday party at work. I am brand new at this job, so really want to hit this out of the park! Any ideas for easy and fun office appropriate virtual games? Ideas on how to add something special to distinguish this from our usual virtual meetings? We use Microsoft Teams FWIW. TIA!

    • Veronica Mars

      We did a virtual scavenger hunt which was really fun. Items you had to run around your house to find included things like: t-shirt or sweatshirt from your alma matter, a local food item, a souvenir from traveling, etc. Whoever got the most items (I think there were like 20 items to find and we had like 10-15 minutes) in the timeframe got a giftcard. It was fun!

      • anonyK

        I actually really like this idea. Particularly because it doesn’t require staring at your computer screen that much.

      • anon

        My 5 year old had a Zoom scavenger hunt with his preschool class last spring, and it was the only Zoom event he engaged in at all. It was really fun for both of us to find/suggest different items. You could include some winter-themed things–a pair of mittens, something you would put on a snowman, a warm beverage, etc.

    • Anonymous

      If your team uses Microsoft surfaces (or other similar tablets with pens) you can share screens and draw to play pictionary!

    • Anonymous

      We did Drawphone at my work (like online Telestrations) and even our office curmudgeon (the one besides me, anyway) really enjoyed it.

    • Anonymous

      A virtual escape room
      Murder Mystery (I recently did one, and it was very successful- people dressed up and really got into it!)

  17. In-House in Houston

    Has anyone tried the Dyson hair dryer? I was looking for something on Ulta.com and came across the Dyson
    Airwrap Smooth + Control Styler-For Frizz-Prone Hair. It has a lot of great reviews (but is out of stock right now). I live in the South (Texas) and it’s very humid here. I also have fine hair, with some wave. With all that I spend on hair products, I’m wondering if I should give this a try (it’s $499!) but if it works, would be totally worth it. TIA!

    • Anon

      Not what you asked but I got the Revlon One Step as a verrrrry cheap alternative and I love it!

    • anonyK

      I have the regular dyson air wrap- I can’t tell if this “smooth and control styler for frizz prone hair” is the regular air wrap with a fancy title- it looks the same in the photo. I also have fine hair with some wave that is very frizz prone (I live on the humid east coast). I think it is just ok. The dryer plus the attachments take up a lot of space especially if you keep in the case. It is a pretty fast hair dryer and the hairdryer itself (minus attachments) is small. I’m not enamored of the air wrap feature because it is tedious to do and at best creates an effect similar to hot rollers, except electric hot rollers are way less labor intensive. I usually shower at night so my hair is dry in the morning when I’m styling it, which is another reason I prefer the hot rollers. They smooth out the frizz and the pageant-y type waves fall out within an hour to nice relaxed waves. I have not noticed any magical frizz reducing effects of the air wrap vs regular hair dryer or hot rollers, though it has been a while since I’ve tried any of those because 2020. So I don’t think it’s worth the money, for me. My husband actually got me this as a surprise Christmas gift although I had no interest in it particularly and don’t even blow dry my hair a lot.

    • anon

      I like mine. I don’t think it’s a miracle product, but I do like it. I only use two of the snap on tools: the dryer and the flat brush. It dries my thick hair fairly quickly and the flat brush is what helps to smooth my hair out and keeps it going frizzy… but my hair is such that it may or may not stay that way the next day. Do it if you won’t miss $500, but don’t have too much expectation either.

    • Anonymous

      I don’t have the airwrap but I do have the normal Dyson hairdryer. It was kind of a dumb splurge. I don’t hate it or anything but it is in no way worth the amount they charge. I’ll use mine until it dies but I wouldn’t encourage anybody else to run out and buy one. It is … fine.

    • NY CPA

      I’ve used the regular hair dryer and it was good, but I wouldn’t pay $400 for it. However, if you’re looking at the hair wrap, I would give the Revlon One Step Hairdryer and Volumizer a try. I got it for Christmas last year and love it, and it’s <10% of the price of the Dyson. It's on sale for $35 right now at Bed Bath and Beyond (and you might even be able to take of an extra 20% with a coupon? not sure about that though…)

  18. Anonymous

    my husband and I participate in a gift exchange for an online forum that my husband is part of. This year, the person he got assigned is a woman in her mid 30s who is trans/ a leader and advocate in the trans community [who also has a shared hobby with my husband and an active participant in the Shared Hobby Forum].

    Can anyone suggest a gift that may be a nod to this work she is doing in addition to the other stuff we are putting together? I was thinking about a donation to the organization she leads or several of the groups on which she has a board seat.

    Or I can ignore it all together. But I think it’s such a cool role she has and such a big part of her life that I thought it would be fun to include in the gifts.

    • anon

      IDK, I think this could go sideways pretty easily. I would stick to a less-charged gift.

      • Anonymous

        OP here and that’s what I want to avoid, so we may skip it entirely. I would not at all do something like this EXCEPT that she has info linked to the orgs she runs next to her avatar. And I do think it’s important work so figured there might be a neat way to include it.

    • Anon

      As someone who is a board member for a nonprofit, I feel like we’re always trying to fundraise, and I would greatly appreciate a donation to an organization I’m on the board of!! I think it would be a very thoughtful, nice, and appreciated gift.

  19. Anon

    Any recommendations for a service that transfers 35mm negatives to digital? I thought I might do this myself, but it seems like a hassle and I prefer to pay at this point.

  20. FCPA question

    I have a friend who is very into FCPA work. And very strident, like if Tracy Flick became an FCPA lawyer.

    The way my mind works, if a country does business in country R or country C, I can’t see how it doesn’t have an FCPA problem. It’s just that the way most FCPA program compliance is done, it passes the buck from the top of the org chart (re deniability) to the bottom (some poor low-level employee or assistant bookkeeper) to certify that the “catering” order from the nephew of the city mayor’s catering company is really just for food (etc., etc.). [This is my social governance hat talking, apparently.]

    I know a company can say that it can have a robust FCPA policy and practices, but IRL, I think the fact that they do business in certain countries makes it not pass the laugh test that they are FCPA compliant. [It’s like I don’t care how many signed papers they give me, they have rot somewhere and just want to bury it what they think is deep enough and make some other person the fall guy when the headline risk occurs. If they were so committed to righteousness, they’d get out of dodge.]

    Or can you really do business in some places without paying bribes / employing nephews / buying from some corrupt preferred vendors / etc.?

    • Anon

      I have done a lot of FCPA work in my career, and I do understand your POV with respect to ‘passing the buck’ in certain corporate cultures. If you put the ‘right’ compliance program in, but still pressure mid-level managers ENORMOUSLY to get things done, and when a problem arises you can use the program as a sword to blame the mid-level manager because well…they sat through the training, didn’t they?!

      However, I do not agree that you have to engage in bribes or corruption to do business in Country R or C. This is an overly cynical view. I work for a mid-size global manufacturer. You can absolutely do business in high risk jurisdictions without paying bribes or engaging in corruption. Everything takes longer (like years longer). It takes real short to mid term sacrifice, and a leadership team that is willing to risk business opportunities because they believe in doing things the right way. But the long term success is worth it.

      • Anon

        I especially agree that Country C (if it’s what I think it is) has cleaned things up a bit recently. I used to work for a firm that sent a delegation to that country twice a year for major conferences and then associated meetings on behalf of clients. The first couple of years I was involved in the planning, a large suitcase went along with literally dozens of gifts for officials – things like Mont Blanc pens and LV wallets, so not corporate tokens. Anti corruption reforms were instituted there, and that suitcase is no longer part of the trip planning.

      • Anon

        I have family in Country R or C who are trying to run an above-board business in a very niche area. It’s not easy but it’s possible. But the difficulty in working with people from outside the country who don’t trust anything just because it’s Country R or C makes it very very hard for my family member to expand the business, which produces a product which would have a lot of international appeal. I’m thankful that some companies are starting to work with businesses in these countries (with appropriate compliance practices and safeguards) because hopefully in the long term it will improve the situation for those who are working really hard to build good businesses there. While I certainly agree that more vetting is needed than usual in certain places, It seems like OP is saying that no ethical company should work with anyone in those countries because everyone in those countries is corrupt, and this is just not the case and harmful to many.

  21. An FCPA question

    I have a friend who is very into FCPA work. And very strident, like if Tracy Flick became an FCPA lawyer. Ugh.

    The way my mind works, if a country does business in country R or country C, I can’t see how it doesn’t have an FCPA problem. It’s just that the way most FCPA program compliance is done, it passes the buck from the top of the org chart (re deniability) to the bottom (some poor low-level employee or assistant bookkeeper) to certify that the “catering” order from the nephew of the city mayor’s catering company is really just for food (etc., etc.). [This is my social governance hat talking, apparently.]

    I know a company can say that it can have a robust FCPA policy and practices, but IRL, I think the fact that they do business in certain countries makes it not pass the laugh test that they are FCPA compliant. [It’s like I don’t care how many signed papers they give me, they have rot somewhere and just want to bury it what they think is deep enough and make some other person the fall guy when the headline risk occurs. If they were so committed to righteousness, they’d get out of dodge.]

    Or can you really do business in some places without paying bribes / employing nephews / buying from some corrupt preferred vendors / etc.?

      • LaurenB

        No clue. Had to google it. It must be a microaggression against us non-lawyers. Seriously — why not explain the acronym upfront? This isn’t like, CIA, or FBI, or another acronym in common parlance.

        • anon

          If it makes you feel better, I’m a lawyer and have no idea what she’s talking about. Can’t even figure it out from context. She probably only wants feedback from someone who is familiar enough with the topic so explaining it to those who aren’t familiar wouldn’t really help. I do environmental law which is often described as an alphabet soup. If I’m looking to discuss how agencies/courts are treating Obama era rules on navigable waters -aka the WOTUS rule–someone who is unfamiliar with the acronym WOTUS is not going to be knowledgable enough on the topic to provide useful feedback.

  22. Anonamoose

    I’m in a highly competitive law firm environment that I thought I wanted to escape, but I’m now having second thoughts as I start looking at places to move. For the most part I enjoy the day to day and overall intensity, and from a performance perspective seem to be excelling/thriving, but when it’s bad it’s usually very bad. I also always viewed the environment as unsustainable long term, especially if I want to have a family. As I’ve started interviewing at other places, everything without this intensity level seems boring and unfulfilling. I’ve been characterizing it loosely as intensity which is too broad, but I’m struggling to identify what specifically I’d miss/need. I’ve been watching Industry on HBO Max and their portrayal of a toxic intense finance culture seems awful of course but also kind of thrilling to me. I’m not sure what it is–the sales aspect, the strategy, the self-drive–but there’s something that feels exciting to me. Curious if anyone relates and if so, how they unpacked this for their career ambitions. TIA!

    • Cat

      I mean, if you enjoy Biglaw then by all means stay. I went from “assuming I’d leave after 3 years or so” to “hm, I’m a midlevel with an excellent reputation and like the work, maybe I should stay for good” to “close enough to partnership to see the truth about the pie-eating contest” and left as an 8th year.

      Now in house, the ability to channel that intensity when I need to (I get to “turn it on” for an important deal, etc) BUT to also have more routine days, predictable schedule, and be able to reliably see family, friends, etc and not be worried I’m missing an email? And that I don’t bring my laptop to hair appointments anymore to review deal docs while my highlights are drying? Amazing.

    • Anon

      This sounds like stockholm syndrome. Imagine if your friend were in a relationship and she told you “we fight all the time and he gets so jealous when other men flirt with me, that’s how I know he loves me”, you’d think she was crazy, right? That’s what this is. Intensity does not equal interesting or good. Competition does not equal success. It frankly sounds like really common prestige gaslighting from big law.
      In addition, you may have difficulty understanding what the day to day of another workplace is like, especially in house. In a more laid back firm, you are doing the same work, but with more consideration that you’re a human and thus more reasonable expectations. Unless you are in a very niche area of law, in-house work is substantively very similar to what you might do in a law firm, but more business oriented and practical so, by necessity, less intense. The environment is not a manufactured intensity to keep you in your place but rather driven by business needs. In a way, you are far more useful in that environment.

      I’ve been where you are (former big law) and life is far more pleasant on the other side where you can focus on the substance of your work and less on getting over on a colleague or parading your prestigious firm credentials that no one outside of that small world cares about.

    • CPA Lady

      Oh yeah, I definitely relate. I loved the intensity (and chaotic toxicity – adrenaline rush, anyone?) of the big firm. Then I had a baby. And suddenly my personal life also became very intense. So then I had a very intense job and a very intense personal life. Let me tell you how thrilling it is to have a four month old and be working 70 hours a week and see your baby for one hour a day because the babysitter had already put the kid to bed after husband picked the kid up from daycare and left for his night shift job before you got home from work. What a magical time that was.

      And then when said baby was 15 months old, I cracked and went to one of the boring and unfulfilling small firms. It took me a couple years to get over it, emotionally. But then I actually started to rebuild my life to include things other than work. I joined the board of a nonprofit for a couple of years. I developed multiple hobbies. My marriage improved. My mental health improved. My stress level plummeted. I can actually spend the weekends doing fun things with my family and friends rather than working (or could, pre-covid). Am I always happy about this situation? Nope. Do I sometimes still wish I was at the big intense firm? Yep. But the longer I’ve been at the boring and unfulfilling small firm, the more I’ve had surprising opportunities open up to me. I got promoted. I’m managing a lot of clients mostly on my own. I’m taking on a higher level of responsibility than I would have at this point in my career if I had stayed at the bigger firm. It’s been very interesting and intense in its own way.

  23. Sleeping on your back in pregnancy

    Hi, ladies. So, I have just learned that pregnant women should not sleep on their backs later in the pregnancy. I am 12 weeks, and I was reading through the many papers my OB gave us, and I came across this little piece of information. I have never heard of that before. No friends ever talked about it, etc. We did some research last night, and OMG. This is crazy. My OB’s guidance was to avoid it after 20 weeks. I will speak with her about it at my next appointment, of course. In the meantime, what have been your experiences with this? It seems kind of impossible to guarantee one will never find herself on her back during the night, and it is not feasible to sleep in one position the entire night. Aaaahhh.

    • Anonymous

      Have never been pregnant — but didn’t they used to recommend sewing a tennis ball in the back of the waistband of pajama pants to prevent snoring caused by sleeping on your back. I’m sure there are more recent hacks/suggestions if you google.

    • Anonymous

      This is true, but it’s generally after 20 weeks. My OB told me that if I did in such a way that was harmful to my body, I would almost certainly jolt out of bed or move and to not worry about it much. It’s also not very comfortable once you’re that big. But I bought a body pillow that helped me lie on my side. I’d often wake up halfway on my back but didn’t worry about it and just rolled over again.

    • Cat

      So I am guessing this problem will solve itself because in late pregnancy, all of my friends have become dedicated side sleepers with a pregnancy pillow to support the bump. Laying flat on their backs is not at all comfortable.

    • Westraye

      There are pillows you can buy for sleeping while pregnant (I think they are called body pillows?) which are helpful. I vaguely remember using various sorts of pillows to help with my sleeping position and to stay comfortable lying down. Also, ymmv, but sleeping through the night became difficult the further along I was in my pregnancy, so there will be lots of opportunities to adjust your sleeping position.

    • Anon

      I’m 26 weeks right now, and I wake up at least once a night on my back. Everything I’ve read says it’s really not that big of a deal, just turn onto your side when you wake up. A friend who is also pregnant said her doctor told her not to worry about it.

    • No Face

      If you wake up in the middle of the night on your back, you just roll back over to your side. You don’t need to guarantee that you never wind up on your back.

    • New+Here

      My OB told me to sleep in whatever way allowed me to be comfortable and get the most rest. I’m typically a side/back sleeper. I slept on my side mostly, but did wake up on my back some. She told me my body would wake me up if it needed to.

      I’ve always been big on pillows. one thing I did while on my side was put a long pillow (one of our king-sized ones) against my back. I’d roll back onto it and be “on my back” but still at a bit of angle.

    • Anon

      I don’t think it’s a hard and fast recommendation. Late in my pregnancy I was uncomfortable on my back, but if you’re fine I don’t thing it’s a big deal. Plenty of people sleep on their backs despite this advice.

    • Anon

      The specific issue is that the baby could compress your vena cava. You will know if this happens; it’s unmistakable. I am a lifelong aide sleeper but sometimes rolled onto my back; I woke up feeling like I couldn’t breathe. Some women carry in such a way that the baby does not compress the vena cava, so they don’t have problems being on their backs.

      It is easier to sleep on your left side than your right because of acid reflux.

    • Anonymous

      Caveat that I’m not a doctor and I’ve never been pregnant, but this seems like a crock of bull to me. I’m so tired of pregnant women being needled about every detail of their lives. Sleep in the position that gives you the best quality sleep. Don’t sacrifice good sleep in the name of the latest old wives tale. Btw I’ve also heard that pregnant women shouldn’t sleep on their side because it’ll cause the umbilical cord to wrap around the baby’s neck (also a crock). So I guess pregnant women shouldn’t sleep lying down? Or at all? But also be sure to get 8 hours uninterrupted sleep. The conflicting “advice” is impossible to follow and is manufactured to blame the woman for anything that goes wrong with the pregnancy/baby.

      • LaurenB

        Asked OB husband and he said the same as what’s being said here. Try to avoid actively lying on your back for long periods of time, but there’s no need to fret if you accidentally fall asleep that way during a nap, or you wake in the middle of the night to discover you’re on your back. Roll over and move on (ROAMO?) This will resolve anyway when you are further along and it won’t be comfortable to sleep that way.

      • Anonymous

        There’s no conflicting advice. The consistent advice internationally on this issue for decades is to avoid sleeping on your back when you can. It’s not an absolute prohibition but it does have an actual medical basis. Sleeping in your back is actually quite uncomfortable later in pregnancy when this matters which is biology taking care of us.

    • Anonymous

      It’s not usually a big deal. By the time you’re far enough along for it to be an issue, you’ll probably be using a pregnancy pillow or a couple extra regular pillows to keep you comfy. On my twin pregnancy, I never had to worry about ending up on my back because my belly was so big I could only turn over while awake and using my arms to push myself up and over.

    • Anon

      I didn’t sleep on my back if I could avoid it while pregnant. That advice has been around for quite a while because my kids are now 18 and almost 20.

      If I woke up on my back I just moved to my side.

      Honestly by the end I was so uncomfortable there was only one way I could sleep anyway, and that was fortunately on my side (with the upper leg draped over a body pillow.)

    • JTM

      The guidance is to not sleep completely flat on your back. I slept on my back, but propped up with pillows, through two pregnancies and it was never a problem.

    • Anon

      Currently 20 weeks. Asked my OB about this recently, and her response– “Ideally, we would like you to sleep on your side, but we’ve been a semi-functional society for thousands of years without these recommendations.”

      My personal experience– I was concerned about this because I am a stomach sleeper normally and kept waking up on my back when I tried to sleep on my side. In the past couple weeks, I have noticed that I do not change positions while sleeping as much anymore. Also, if I end up on my back (happens rarely), I can’t breathe very well and wake up quickly due to discomfort.

    • Anon

      Don’t worry too much about it. After a certain point soon after I started showing, sleeping on my side was the only comfortable position. One of those small wedge pillows to put under my bump was an absolute lifesaver.

    • Anonono

      Yeah, you’ll know if you end up on your back and is causing the specific issue doctors recommend avoiding. In the meantime, I think you’d really benefit from the book Expecting Better which walks through all of these recommendations and the research behind them so you don’t have to worry in between appointments!

    • Anonymous

      So I’ve never been a back sleeper, but I found out I did have the problem with the baby compressing my vena cava when I was having laying on my back having my anatomy scan (ultrasound) done around 20 weeks. I started sweating and feeling like I was going to throw up, then faint. It was not something I could ignore, and the tech let me change positions in some way that helped (foggy memories). I then grew paranoid it would be an issue if I was on my back in labor, but it wasn’t, I guess because I was not laying flat. Don’t worry too much; this will be the least of your problems regarding sleeping while pregnant.

    • Anon

      I used to always sleep on my back 100% of the time, but during pregnancy was one of those people that did find laying on my back immediately made me feel short of breath and sick. Never slept in that position–even accidently, as far as I know–because I couldn’t! I’d also say that when your bump is big enough to cause this problem, it’s also big enough that it’s hard to roll over, so I woke up every time I rolled from one side to the other, which I did a lot. Pregnancy pillows help for sure. Good luck!

    • Anon

      Not pregnant and almost never sleep on my back, but I am huge fan of those loopy pregnancy pillow things. I feel like I went from never comfortable to always comfortable since I started using one, even though I use it all different ways.

  24. Betsy

    How much do you prioritize happiness in your job? Do you expect it to feel meaningful? I am putting some thought into what I want from my career, whether it is a happiness negative, neutral or positive, and what lifestyle factors I care about from my career. I expect it will be time for a new job in the next year or so and I want to set myself up for a good fit, but I need to define that for myself. If anyone has recommended reading on those topics, I would love to hear them. A lot of what I’ve seen online doesn’t seem to come from the perspective of someone who needs to provide for their family, which I certainly do. I don’t envision myself making any changes until the world starts going back to normal post pandemic, but I want to start envisioning what my next step should be.

    • Anonymous

      It’s a job. I’ve had enough miserable hourly / retail / “helper” jobs that I started looking at a job as a means to trade time for $ and looked for my identity / fulfillment elsewhere. That didn’t really change with college, but I feel that for a lot of people, their jobs define them. “I’m a lawyer” is thought to have some sort of meaning about who you are, what you value, etc. in a way that is different than “I’m a fry cook / dishwasher / drive a forklift.” Do what doesn’t make you crazy and pays well for the effort you put into it.

      • Senior Attorney

        I agree with this. I need my job to be not-horrible, in the sense that I am not miserable every day and I am not working for an evil cause. Other than that, it’s a living. I find my meaning elsewhere.

    • Anonymous

      Yep, you should read “The Dream Job Is Dead. Long Live The Good Enough Job” on Refinery29.

    • holidays

      Happiness is never something I strongly considered for my job, but yes… I expect it to feel meaningful. I work in health care / medical research.

      My main requirements for a job is that it is meaningful, and allows me to work with smart and interesting people who are also passionate about what they do.

    • anon

      You’re absolutely right that a lot of job advice tends to follow the “do what you love!” mantra, which, I’m sorry, can be very unrealistic for anyone providing for a family. I am 40 and have done a lot of soul-searching over the past three years to figure out what’s most meaningful to me. A decade ago, it would’ve been all about growth opportunities and meaning. In my current stage of life, my job needs are much more pragmatic. Flexibility, pay and benefits, and stability mean more to me now than they did in earlier stages of my career. I want to work with decent people; I have no interest in being part of a cut-throat, competitive environment. Life is challenging enough, work is challenging enough — I do not wish to be part of that culture. I suspect that as I’m less mired in childcare responsibilities, I will eventually shift back to focusing on what feels most meaningful. That isn’t to say I find zero meaning in what I do now, but it’s just not priority #1. Or #5, for that matter. :)

      It’s OK for your mindset about work to ebb and flow, depending on what else is happening in your life. And chuck most of the online advice out the window; so much is from either a male perspective or the perspective of someone who isn’t shouldering as much responsibility as you are.

    • Anon

      For me, it’s very important to do something that I both like and find meaning in – life is too short! Im not someone who could work a job that I dislike or a job that exists to make rich people richer. Luckily, the work that I both like and find meaning in is a very niche subject area that has jobs in both government and NGOs. I’m never going to be rich, but I’d be able to support a family and I have great stability and decent benefits.

      My dad has always hated his blue collar job but stays for the stability and benefits. My friends in consulting, public accounting, and finance all hate their jobs and their terrible work / life balance but only stay for the paycheck. To me, it’s not worth it.

      • blueberry

        I agree with this completely. I think that sometimes you have to put a lot of thought and effort into it, but this is balance is attainable. For example, everyone knows that public accounting is a steady life path, but Anon @ 11:02’s job is not immediately obvious. You spend 2/3 of each and every day of your one precious life at work – I think that’s worth optimizing.

        And this doesn’t mean you have to go into a nonprofit role. My dad, for example, is now at a high corporate position at a company that makes sort-of consumer products. Yes, his day to day work makes the company richer, but the products truly improve people’s lives, he has good colleagues, he gets paid well, he has had a good career path.

        • Anon

          This is anon at 11:02, but yes all of my engineering friends (some in research, some in government, but most are in private sector) all have this same satisfaction from their job – they like the work (or enough of the work) and they are fulfilled because they’re working on projects that benefit people’s lives. My brother is an accountant at a health/fitness company, and he gets the same satisfaction. I have friends who work business jobs for industries that they are interested in/find meaningful (a friend does finance for a health foods company, another friend does business development for a water testing company, and a third friend does marketing for a agricultural company) There are absolutely for-profit jobs that attain this.

          I certainly don’t love every minute of what I do (that’s why they pay me, right?) but overall I like my day to day work, and I love the impact that my industry has, so I’m willing to trade that for a lower (but still very livable) salary.

          I think it depends a lot on what you do, but if you do a job that is kind of needed everywhere (accounting, business development, marketing, communications, project management, etc.) you have a lot of flexibility to choose to work at a company or in an industry that aligns with your life (both something you’re interested in/enjoy, the values you hold, the work/life balance you want).

    • Anonymous

      Above all else. I need to have a meaningful job that makes me happy to motivate myself to actually do work. But also I need to be able to live with myself and contributing to good does that, I couldn’t look in the mirror if I worked for Amazon or another similar company. DH is the same. We both earn pretty good money and can pay the bills with lots to spare, sure we could increase our salaries if we worked for less ethical employers but we won’t ever do that.

      • Anon

        This is exactly how I am! I know few others who have this approach though, and it caused a lot of contention with my family when I was a recent grad looking for jobs.

        I ended up working in humanitarian aid. I love what I do, but I could have an easier life (better work/life balance, more pay, less stress) if I did something else. I really like (most of) my day to day work. I KNOW what I”m doing is having a positive impact and contributes to the greater good. I also could never sell my soul to a job that’s not contributing to the greater good in order to make more money. However, sadly, very few others see things that way.

        Obviously, being a humanitarian is an extreme example. However, I’d bet that most people could find jobs doing similar work to what they already do for ethical employers. Just about everyone has that option.

    • Anon

      I’m struggling with this too, especially since what I do is a practical un-fun version of what could be a creative job (similar to writing dry B2B copy instead of being a novelist). I’m the sole wage earner due to my husband’s illness. I constantly second-guess whether I should be looking for advancement and more competitive pay, or if I should play it safe given the state of the world and try to carve out some breathing room for creativity.

      The older I get, the more my title and pay matters to me, which feels backwards compared to the norm. I’m keenly aware that I need to maximize my career trajectory ASAP, because I’m starting to bump up against age discrimination.

    • Westraye

      I don’t prioritize happiness per se – I look at what I need in a job to keep me looking forward to going to work in the morning. For me that’s 1) My contributions are recognized and valued; and (2) I am generally learning and being challenged in my work.

      I had jobs that did meaningful work and others that did not and found that meaningfulness was not something that affected whether I was happy to go to work in the morning. I don’t have any recommended reading, but think about what you need to thrive. I derive a lot of satisfaction from my work and these two criteria guide whether I stay in my job or move on to others.It took me about a decade to really figure this out. In a perfect world I’d also have a job with good work-life balance, but so far that’s a unicorn.

    • Anonymous

      TBH my criteria are money and not being miserable, which is some combo of a title I deserve, not being taken advantage of and decent coworkers. Meaningfulness or impacting society is no where on my list; if my job meant huge $$$ in tobacco or casinos or whatever, that’d be fine.

    • Anonymous

      I liked Working Identity: Unconventional Strategies for Reinventing Your Career.

    • HangryJo

      My experience has been that this has changed for me throughout my life. When I was in my 20s I was convinced I would never do work that was not completely meaningful for a company that was 100% aligned with my personal values. In my early 30s I compromised working for a company that is probably 75% aligned with my goals but gave me all the opportunity that I was looking for. Now in the pandemic I’m really grateful that I have a job that pays me well and where I can work remotely and that I feel completely supported and valued by my leadership, and that my employer genuinely wants to keep us all healthy and safe. A year ago I never would have thought I would value the things I value now, and I’m sure those things will change as the pandemic wanes. So my takeaway point, I guess, is that you have to evaluate how much work being “meaningful” is balanced against your quality of life. I want to do meaningful work but it doesn’t necessarily mean I’m willing to compromise on pay, benefits, etc.

    • Bonnie Kate

      I have two thoughts that don’t necessarily go together –

      One – DH and I really did quit our jobs, moved across the country to pursue our “dream careers” a couple years ago. One of the big things that I feel is really underestimated is that when you put the pressure of making a living/supporting yourself on the thing that you love to do, it can detract from the enjoyment of the thing you love to do.

      Two – I work as a Senior Sales/Project Manager in a for-profit company in a highly competitive male-dominated industry. I think it’s the type of job that a lot of people would find less meaningful, as I work a lot with spreadsheets and markups and making money. But I find a tremendous amount of meaning in my job – I can see it in how my role builds a company that provides good livings for my coworkers, I can see it in how my strong relationships with my clients leads to them trusting me/my team and providing them with projects/services/products that genuinely solve their problems and make their life and systems better. And I can see that this in turn leads to a greater public good, since my customers provide a pivotal critical infrastructure service. Yes, my role is a little hidden and not front view, but it’s meaningful nonetheless. Looking at a job in the context of a whole system and seeing your role in the bigger picture can really help provide meaning, even though on the day to day some people may just see my role as trying to make all the money/soul crushing.

  25. Giga

    Help! Ladies – are any of you ever just absolutely FREEZING in business meetings?? What to wear?
    I went to a 2 day business meeting in Dallas in August. It was Texas in summer – so I brought 2 sheath dresses and cardigan blazers. To my shock, the conference room was set to 60 degrees — or that’s what it felt like. Even my suited up male colleagues who weigh 2x+ what I weigh felt cold (I’m small though, only 5’2″, so 2x me is just an average male). I was literally shivering the entire 2 days, and would go to the bathroom just to run hot water on my hands to try to unfreeze them. Everyone commented on the cold but no one could find the thermostat.
    What are appropriate female business formal clothes for sitting long-term in a freezer?

    • Anonymous

      I have a super thin wool wrap that I bring with me to meetings at conferences/etc. I can wrap it around me, or lay it across my lap. It is surprisingly warm. Also, with the outfit you described you could probably wear a scoop neck silk undershirt or change your outfit and wear a long-sleeve blouse under a pants suit. That would be my go-to because then I could take off the blazer if it were too hot and add the wrap if too cold — from 1 layer to 3.

    • Cat

      Is this a real question? An in person conference that you traveled to – in August?

      • Anonymous

        Yeah, this is totally fake. “Ladies”? “Business meeting”? Nobody talks like that. Probably the same dude posting from his parents’ basement about other items of women’s clothing.

      • Anon

        If that is a question about whether there were in person meetings in August due to Covid, I find that people in places with real lock-downs (or even that were seriously about WFH requirements) grossly underestimate the extent to which other places were largely business as usual over the summer. Or even the extent to which they are business as usual now, particularly in some industries.

        • Anon

          My former employer is still making senior execs around the country fly in to meetings at their Midwestern HQ.

          It’s a loyalty test of sorts.

          A terrible company through and through.

      • Giga

        Yes…a lot of industries are traveling. Hotels are 30-40% occupied. Military, healthcare, logistics, 3PL, warehousing, pharma industries are all traveling. Someone has to make sure you can get all of your deliveries so you can sit at home nice and safe, by the way.

    • Anon

      I have learned to never, ever wear a dress or skirt to business meetings that take place outside of my office. Pants, always. Kneehighs, not the thin nylon kind, but thin wool or cashmere. Fleece lined tights and 2 packable wool or cashmere wraps in my bag. Tank top under long sleeve top under jacket. I take a quick restroom break once I have assessed the climate, and remove the kneehighs and tank (or long sleeve top) if needed, or exchange the knee highs for fleece lined tights. The two wraps can add extra warmth, tossed over my shoulder or discreetly resting on my lap.This all seems like a lot, but I have it down to a science. Many of my meeting last up to 8 hours, and I am done suffering because I am shivering in a meatlocker of a room, but ready in case it is warmer.

    • Monte

      I always always always have a cashmere wrap for these sorts of meetings. I am often the only woman in business meetings, so I am always colder than other attendees. I also shamelessly drink hot tea at every opportunity.

      • Senior Attorney

        I remember being at a conference in San Diego years ago, and it was so cold in the hotel meeting rooms that there was actually a vendor selling pashminas in the lobby and making serious bank because all the women were FREEZING!

  26. anon

    Best suggestions/ideas for a collage wall to execute in a relative low effort, low cost way? buy a bunch of black frames?

    • Anon

      Yes, I have a gallery wall, and I bought cheap black frames from Ikea, varying sizes. It looks great!

  27. Anon

    I want to start storing sweaters folded up in sweater boxes to prevent sweaters from becoming misshapen and also to protect from pests. The boxes would be stored on an open shelf inside a reach-in closet. I’ve got my eye on two options. The first is a clear bin with separate top (similar to the clear plastic shoe boxes except sweater-sized) and the second is a fabric covered box with drop front. Anyone have experience with both types that can comment on which they prefer?

    • Cat

      If it’s purely for storage then the clear bin is good. If you want to be able to access the sweaters regularly from their shelf location, then unless you’re eager to be constantly taking the bin down, go for the drop front.

      • Anon

        +1

        I keep my sweaters in a drop-front bin on my bookshelf year round (wish I could store them in the summer, but apartment living…) It’s great for ease of access, but for longer-term storage I’d probably want a lid.

  28. Anon

    I’m thinking of applying for a job at Tesla legal but am wary because it seems they always have several open positions. I also think their CEO is crazy. Anyone here have intel they can share?

    • Anon

      Read all the press. I’m not an insider but making his employees show up for work in defiance of stay at home orders was pretty bad. There’s also the stuff about injured employees being treated on-site and ordered to return to work when they were really too injured to do so.

      • OP

        Thanks for all the comments. I was considering applying because I think their products are great and because there are multiple layers between the position I’d apply for and Elon. I was hoping, maybe unrealistically, the feedback would be more mixed and not that bad.

      • pugsnbourbon

        Poop rolls downhill. I was several layers below a narcissistic a-hole CEO and it made every aspect of my work harder.

    • Anon

      I can’t speak to legal, but my sense from talking to a bunch of Tesla employees on the business side is that it’s a ‘burn very hard’ culture. It also seems like decision making is incredibly chaotic, and employees regularly work 90hr/weeks on initiatives only to have them cancelled/restructured without warning. On the plus side, you work with smart people who care about the world. I wish I’d worked for them in my 20s, but am not interested in my 30s.

      • Anon

        I don’t know that I agree with the “care about the world” part . . . More like care about lining their pockets.

    • anomanom

      Well, they would keep you busy. I have worked for a partner of theirs (our employees working in their facilities) in the HR realm not legal, but the employment issues and lawsuits and claims were insane. I think I still get a small tick in my eye when their name is mentioned. The culture at the plants is very much everything is urgent and why can’t we work them 90 hours a week in California? From what I saw that came from the top down. Also, a very aggressive shout to get your point across culture across all levels. That partnership was a major contributor to my leaving my last company.

    • buffybot

      Not sure what kind of law you practice but I must say, every time I read Elon’s twitter I think, “God I’m glad I’m not his securities lawyer”. Honestly, so much of tech is ‘move fast and break things’ and while that may play an important social role, that’s not something as a lawyer that I want to be responsible for. I’d much rather work at a company (and do!) where there was buy-in from the top of the house that compliance with regulatory requirements is the bare minimum.

    • anon

      I’m friends with several folks that work in Legal at Tesla, in corp and securities. Some have left (and are now obscenely wealthy). Some are still there. All of what you read above is true. That’s all I’ll say.

  29. Holiday card

    Etiquette question. I kept my maiden name, my husband and kids share a last name. Let’s say that I am Tammy Jones and my husband is Jack Carey. What do I write on my holiday card?

    The Carey Jones Family?
    The Jones Carey Family?
    The Carey and Jones Family?
    Something else??

    • Vicky Austin

      I would do “The Carey and Jones Family” on the envelope, first names only on the card.

    • BeenThatGuy

      Myself, my partner and my son all have different last names. So our holiday card is signed with our first names only. “Happy Holidays from Ben, Gabbie and Johnny”.

    • LaurenB

      You didn’t create a new last name of Carey-Jones or Jones-Carey (not that there’s anything wrong with that, it’s just not what you did), so “The Carey Jones Family” or “The Jones Carey Family” feel off to me. Why not just Jack, Tammy, Billy, and Mary, or Tammy, Jack, Billy, and Mary?

    • DLC

      We do The [My Last] [His Last] Family. Not sure if this is strictly Emily Post approved, but it’s what feels right to us and what most people in our social circle/family refer to us by. If we get packages or cards addressed to either one or the other last name + Family, it doesn’t bother us – we know what they mean. The order of the last names was mostly because it sounded better that way, not any kind of patriarchal reference. (If you reversed the order of our names, it would sound like a body part.)

    • Anonymous

      For Christmas card purposes only, I assume my husband’s name. Anyone I send to knows it’s not a real last name. This year, it’s “Happy new year from the Smiths. Husband, wife, kid, kid”. We all know I’m a Jones and whatever. I describe myself as a lazy feminist. They only go to friends and family, not business contacts.
      If I felt more strongly about separate games I’d just list out husband, wife, kid, kid

    • Anon

      I do the Smith and Jones Family and it has never been a problem. My husband is fairly delighted every time he accidentally gets called Mr. Smith so this is really not high stakes in our household.

    • Anonymous

      This was my situation growing up, and I always thought of us as “the Jones/Careys”. If it matters, I (an only child) had my mom’s last name as my middle name, so we were

      Mom: Susan Jones
      Dad: Samuel Carey
      Me: Samantha Jones Carey

    • Anonymous

      On the actual card it just says our first name. On the address label it says

      Smith & Jones
      Street
      City

    • Jules

      When i was married (we gave our kind my last name, and H had his own last name), we signed cards with all three first names but would use Carey/Jones on envelopes and the like – no hyphen, since no one used a hyphenated name.

  30. Best Gifts You've Received

    There have been a lot of solicitations for gift suggestions, so I was thinking we could do a thread of the best gifts we’ve received, and maybe for context the occasion and relationship with the giver, as well as any gifts that really stood out (but maybe weren’t the “best you’ve ever received”).

    • OP

      Mine: A set of Diptyque candles from friends as a wedding gift when DH and I eloped. I had never tried these candles but I am known to like bougie things and this was a hit. Also really liked a Mason Pearson brush I received from a family member, if I lost it or it broke I would replace it.

    • anon

      Every year, my mom gives DH and me a box of consumable food items. These range from preserves she’s made herself, to spices she’s picked up at markets on her travels, to specialty food items she’s found at the farmer’s market or specialty grocery stores or online. It’s thoughtful and fun, and we cook a lot and have a large pantry. I like that we think of her when we bring these things out. And it’s meaningful that she thinks of us and collects these items throughout the year, and makes a few things in November/December.

    • Anon

      Bose SoundSport Headphones from a very generous and kind former boss who gave his entire team awesome Christmas gifts ever year. I love them, use them every day and would have never bought them myself – these are components of a fantastic gift.

    • Vicky Austin

      My SIL is an excellent gift-giver, and a few years ago, just as I was really getting into cooking, gave me a lovely recipe box and set of cards for Christmas. It was perfectly timed and so thoughtful. She gets it from her mom, who is also very good at gift-giving, but of all their fantastic choices for me, this one was my favorite.

    • No Problem

      A set of coasters from a former boss for xmas a few years ago. I actually needed some new coasters, so they get a lot of use!

      My mom was gifted a very pretty set of salt and pepper shakers from my cousin that she purchased during a study abroad program. They replaced a much older (and ugly) set that we had been using for ages. I don’t know if my mom considers them the best gift ever, but she does really like them and I do too.

      I also gave my mom a small watercolor I bought on a vacation and we went together to get it matted and framed (I’m kind of the art framing expert in the family). She hung it where she can see it every time she sits at the kitchen table, so I think she likes it!

    • Anon

      I have a friend who is great a gift giving. She is a self described shopaholic so she’s good at finding things on sale and squirreling them away for future gifts. She tends to give mixed “goody bags” at Christmas that I have told her more than once are the nicest gifts I receive all year, which includes gifts from my husband and kids. Things I still cherish from her goody bags are cashmere socks, a real Burberry makeup bag, an insulated wine cup with a lid (I call it Mama’s sippy cup), my absolute favorite coffee mug which is porcelain with my initial, cashmere gloves from J Crew, and gone but not forgotten high-end candles and bottles of wine. She just has a gift for gifting.

      She is very hard to buy for in terms of reciprocating, though!!

      • Anon

        Oh I love this idea. I was taught that it is rude, or at least less than ideal, to give a gift that can’t be returned or exchanged. Do other people feel this way? It seems like here the thoughtfulness of the gift greatly outweighs the inability to return.

  31. Anon

    Talk to me about getting a haircut during the pandemic. Haven’t had one since January, for a variety of reasons including it was low priority and I was enjoying growing it super long. However, now I would really like a haircut. I live in a city that is a hot spot, and the pandemic is the worst it’s ever been. I’m considering doing a trim myself, I have the supplies and watched some youtube videos. But on the other hand, I think getting a haircut in a salon, when everyone is masked, capacity is limited, etc, is relatively safe as far as I know. WWYD, get a haircut at a salon while the pandemic is this bad or cut your own hair?

    • Anon

      I got a cut in the salon, but you may be able to find someone who will come to your house if you want to minimize your risk. We have that service locally.

    • Anokha

      Depending on where you are: I was able to get a haircut outdoors at a salon (on their back patio), and it felt relatively safe to me.

    • LaurenB

      What place isn’t a hot spot, at this stage in the game? This is how I look at it – everything is a risk, and everyone has “risk points” to spend. For me right now, I spend my risk points doing (outdoor, masked/distant) exercise with others, but I haven’t been in a restaurant since March since the benefit isn’t worth it to me. I have gotten my hair cut, I think once or twice since the pandemic began; right now I do “need” a hair cut and color, but I’m not doing so because shortly I will need to physically stay with an elderly relative after an operation so I’d rather lay low and not spend risk points that way. In a month or so I will reevaluate. So I guess what I’m saying is … what are the other risks you are taking in your life, and if you value getting your hair cut, can you pull back on those other risks in the short term? Does that make sense?

    • Ribena

      I had one for the first time since Jan last month – but cases here are lower than they were at the end of September, so YMMV. I knew the salon was spacing out clients and insisting on face coverings so it felt pretty safe.

    • anonyK

      I’ve been cutting my own hair and may never go back to salon! But it very much depends on your hair and the cut you want. I think shorter cuts are much harder to DIY well. Long layered hair is easy peasy (maybe harder if it is very curly- no experience there).

      I say try it yourself first. If it doesn’t turn out acceptably, then go to salon for a fix.

    • Cat

      I’m going to the salon. If you can make a weekday appointment rather than weekend, there will probably be fewer people there to boot.

    • Anon

      I would cut it myself and just try to be kind to myself about any imperfections. After you do it a few times it gets easier and better.

      Just to throw out another option: if you have someone in your pod with you who would be willing (and if you can overlook imperfection) that can work well too.

      You can do this! Why not at least give it a try?

    • Anon

      Also … if you are going to go to the salon, why not wait until there’s a dip in numbers? Maybe trim yourself now and go later if you feel it’s necessary as it may be a few months.

    • Anon

      I wouldn’t do it so I cut my own hair. It wasn’t that hard. I used the pigtail method.

      • Anon with a grown-out pixie

        My wife and I paid a stylist to guide us over FaceTime twice while one of us cut the other’s hair. Between that and YouTube, we have figured out how to cut each other’s hair and haven’t been to a salon since March. YouTube has amazing tutorials. And over zoom it doesn’t matter as much.

  32. Sweatpants recommendations?

    Shopping help:
    I’m looking for sweatpants for my husband as an Xmas gift. He wants a pair that’s thick and warm, with deep pockets that zip. He keeps buying bargain sweats that come apart at the seams after a single wash. Any recommendations?

    • anon

      Still in the budget category, but I bought my DH a pair of Old Navy tech joggers last Christmas and they are holding up great.

    • anonchicago

      No zippered pockets, but the Puma joggers at Costco are great. I bought my husband a few pairs then finally bought myself a pair after not being able to find women’s joggers that were long enough that I liked. They are soooo warm and the pockets hold everything. Seriously, why aren’t women’s clothes made that way?

    • Sweatpants recommendations?

      Thanks, everyone! I’ll check out these options. He’s been buying sweats that are like $6 on Amazon, so all of these sound great.

  33. gift

    I’m a law clerk to a state supreme court judge. He has a secretary who also helps me with filing etc. Should I get her something as a Christmas gift? If so what? My. co-clerk just brought it to my attention.

    • Anonymous

      I clerked at a State Appellate Court. My co-clerk and I did a joint gift. We got her a gift card to her favorite lunch place and a nice holiday card!

    • Anonymous

      Yes and it can be a joint gift with your co-clerk. I suggest a card + flowers (poinsettia?), consumables, or a gift card.

    • Jules

      Something modest, in your position, would be my suggesetion. Fancy tea or coffee, if she likes that kind of thing; a gift card to a coffee house near the courthouse; a mug warmer for her desk; even homemade baked goods if you cook.

  34. Ugly windows

    We have 15 year old vinyl windows on our house that are extremely drafty and don’t look great. A few need to be replaced or fixed but the rest could probably last a few more years, so I’m not sure it’s worth the cost to put in new windows in now. Has anyone replaced windows in their home? Was it worth it?

    • Anonymous

      I would highly highly recommend going for aluminum/steel/wood windows, whichever is appropriate for the architectural style and age of your home so that this isn’t a recurring issue as good windows are designed to last forever. Bonus they look way better and are more environmentally friendly since they aren’t planned obsolescence like vinyl.

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