Thursday’s Workwear Report: Lace-Sleeve Polo Sweater
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Our daily workwear reports suggest one piece of work-appropriate attire in a range of prices.
This lace-sleeved blouse from Cece is a fun, feminine twist on the classic polo shirt. We’ve talked before about whether it’s appropriate to wear lace to the office, and I think this follows Kat’s advice perfectly: 1) this is clearly not meant to be lingerie, and 2) it’s an accent that is meant to be seen.
I would pair this with dark denim for a super casual Friday (know your office!) or wear it tucked into a skirt for a more dressed-up look.
The shirt is $79 at Nordstrom and comes in sizes XS-XXL.
Sales of note for 3/10/25:
- Nordstrom – Spring sale, up to 50% off
- Ann Taylor – 40% off everything + free shipping
- Banana Republic Factory – 40% off everything + 20% off
- Eloquii – Extra 50% off all sale and select styles with code
- J.Crew – 40% off everything + extra 20% off when you buy 3+ styles
- J.Crew Factory – 50% off all pants & sweaters; extra 50% off clearance
- M.M.LaFleur – Friends and family sale, 20% off with code; use code CORPORETTE15 for 15% off
- Spanx – Lots of workwear on sale, some up to 70% off
- Talbots – Flash sale until midday 3/14: $50 off every $200 – combineable with other offers, including 40% off one item and 30% off everything else
Veronica Beard sizing?
TTS and consistent.
TTS designer size, not vanity size. While there is a good amount of stretch typically, I’d suggest sizing up on pants if you work out a lot.
+1 – their pants are slim cut so I usually go up 2 sizes from my mall brand size and tailor the waist.
Agree.
DH’s 401k up to this point has been pretax dollars, but we recently decided to split the contributions between pretax and Roth. He talked to someone from Fidelity who set it up…we assumed it’d be a second account, but it appears to be the same account, with no clear differentiation that we can see on the balances or positions tab or statements. Is this odd? I’m wondering how they will track the Roth growth for future tax-free withdrawals vs the rest of the pot.
I know the best answer is to have him call, but looking for thoughts in the meantime (somewhere else to look in the account?) since that call is not his priority right now
Can you call?
Have you searched Fidelity’s help or support section?
It shouldn’t be a separate account, but it should be clearly delineated within the account. That’s how it is for us, also Fidelity.
I found these instructions online. Does this work?
Your employee Roth and pre-tax 401(k) contributions will, by nature, collectively go into one 401(k). From here, you can easily determine the source group of your retirement plan on Netbenefits.com. For clarification, a source group is a collection (group) of sources that move in unison. Examples of source groups include pre-tax money and after-tax money. To find this info, follow the steps below after logging into Netbenefits.com:
From the “Home” page, select your retirement plan and then the “Summary” tab
Scroll halfway down the page to the “Your Investments” section and click on the “Show Details” link in the “Sources” column
Here, you can see the allocation and current balance of your employee Roth and Pre-tax 401(k).
That said, we recommend contacting our Workplace Investing team directly if you would like help reviewing your plan. Representatives are available Monday – Friday from 8:30 a.m. – 12 midnight ET. Please say “401(k)” when prompted by the automated system to be connected to the right group.
Are you sure the change has taken effect? At my employer, it can take a couple pay periods for contribution changes to take effect.
My 401k is with Fidelity, I also have some pre-tax and some post-tax, and, it’s all in one account…. I agree that it’s harder to track what’s going on.
Same. it’s annoying.
You can call and they can give you an accounting but it’s not clear via the web/app.
So, i have my 401k also split between roth and pretax and it’s fidelity. There is no separate tab that i have ever seen. They auto make the allocations for investments apply to both types of contributions exactly the same. If i look at my statement details, i can see the actual breakout of account balance broken out by pre-tax, roth, company match, etc.. I don’t see those statements in the fidelity app, but they are on my 401k webpage and in the fidelity desktop view.
Thanks! I will try looking there. And glad to hear this is standard…I figured Fidelity would not make a mistake on something that is literally their daily business, but I am a “trust, but verify” person. (DH is “trust and don’t give it a second thought” and it has led to some scrapes that are only funny far, far down the road)
If you’re one of the many people who was concern trolling here about university protests, I hope you’re happy! The president acted on your fears about “antisemitism on campus” and disappeared a permanent resident and had him whisked off to Louisiana to be deported. If you think people protesting the coming Muslim ban, abortion restrictions and crackdown on LGBT Americans won’t be next, you’re delusional. Bravo!
Hear hear. This is a terrifying, precipitous event.
It is simultaneously possible to believe that Jewish students should not be accosted on campus or prevented from accessing their classes, or that protestors should not be allowed to occupy and damage campus facilities, or that chanting anti-Jewish slogans is no more acceptable that chanting anti-Black slogans AND to believe that a legal resident should not be arrested and detained because of his speech when there is essentially no evidence he did anything illegal.
Your language and attitude are not helping your cause.
Thank you.
Yes, this.
Agreed. I am also entirely unconvinced that this attempted deportation–and any of the administration’s other retaliatory actions against universities, really–are a genuine, good faith attempt to address anti-Semitism on campus.
They are a whole-hearted attempt to appease certain donors, as are most of to virtually all of the campus crackdowns.
Not just that (and I certainty don’t think it’s just a whole-hearted attempt to appease Jewish donors, if that’s what you meant by “certain”). It’s part of the broader culture war conservatives are waging. It’s to feed the narrative that universities are bastions of destructive, extreme, anti-American liberalism, and not to be trusted….education and thinking are bad!
+1 million
Trigger warning – s-word ideation (please scroll on by!)
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If you have seriously contemplated self-offing because life became impossible to live, what helped you break free of these thoughts? Was it the samaritans, therapy, the thoughts of friends and family? Or something else?
Severe physical and neurological disability and immigration difficulties has made it impossible for me to sustain a living (about to become homeless and not eligible for welfare) and I have no family or friends (I mean it) to think of or reach out to. Therapy and samaritans hasn’t helped. I’m wondering what has helped others break out of this despair so I can explore these options.
Once again, apologies for being a downer. Please feel free to report this thread if it is indeed triggering and I will absolutely understand. Many thanks for reading
I do not know how to help, but I couldn’t read this and not respond. Please call a suicide hotline – 1-800-273-8255 for the National Suicide Prevention Hotline, or text HOME (I know that seems ironic) to 741741. I wish I could do more, but please know that there are people who care and someone who can help.
Medication and white-knuckling to a better place in life where I could take care of myself.
Please seek professional assistance
Can you share country and state /town you are located? sometimes there are resources that are a little harder to find
Thank you, I am in the UK. I know/knew of an acquaintance who was sectioned/placed on a psychiatric hold after raising the alarm to her GP. The experience was so dehumanising (worse than a psych ward) and she was SA’ed as well by other parents. She then took that final measure. Therefore quite keen to avoid ending up in psych hold.
Are you in or can get to London? You can self-refer to The Listening Place https://listeningplace.org.uk/ I volunteered here for a while (I stopped when I moved cities) and it’s a fantastic service.
Hey, I’m an immigrant in the UK too and had my own expensive and bureaucracy-filled immigration journey. You have my sympathy for that struggle (and your others).
I know the NHS isn’t perfect, but 111 and/or your GP still deserve a shot. I broke down in my GPs office and just told her I was overwhelmed and couldn’t handle everything and she started me on medication that day. (But I wasn’t in danger of self-harm, so I understand why you’d worry about being at greater risk of being sectioned.)
Please hang in there. It gets better.
Medication really, really helped me. I also spent a night in a mental hospital and did an outpatient day treatment program at the hospital, which gave me some structure, support, and distraction while the medication worked. At the time, I was uninsured, in school with minimal income, and qualified for charity care, and as it was a public hospital I paid nothing or almost nothing (can’t remember). Is there a psychiatric emergency room in your area?
Thank you, we have a non-emergency medical (NHS) number and ask for options such as medication or a visit to a ward (non-sectioned type if they exist). This is giving me a bit of hope, thank you!
Sorry, there’s a missing clause – a number I can call to ask for options etc
We are in the U.S. but this worked for my sister also. She was (still is) bipolar and was in extreme depression and made several decisions that put her into an even deeper hole of despair. She did 3 weeks inpatient then 3 months outpatient treatment. Part of it was getting the meds to kick in, and part of it was having people show her there is a way out, providing structure and support.
OP, I am wishing you all the best and want to let you know you are stronger than you think. I have lost two friends over the years and know how hard it can be.
+1 my brother in law did a day program here in the US, called a partial hospitalization program I believe. He didn’t spend the night there. It was very helpful to get his meds adjusted and attend the support groups. Thinking of you OP. We need you here! You have online friends!
Connecting to a higher power has been helpful in times of despair and isolation. Leaning in to spirituality has helped me feel just grounded enough to survive the crisis periods. Sending good thoughts, virtual hugs, and lots of empathy to you.
What I have seen and experienced helping is extreme therapy – outpatient or inpatient daily care. Outpatient therapy here in the US is 9am – 3pm or so, includes lunch so you get nutrition, and is usually a lecture about your condition, and 2 intensive group therapy sessions a day, every day, for as long as it takes or until insurance runs out. This includes psychiatrist and medication adjustments, also. Everyone is here – assault victims and anxiety and depression and mourners and hopers and yes poor folks too. It sucks – the bathrooms are all plastic and the stalls don’t lock so you can’t hurt yourself there. But — please please don’t hurt yourself. These places help. Please see if there is one or two near you. The Scientologists will tell you not to go but please go
If you are at this point, you really should go to the ER for medical attention. You will see a psychiatrist and social worker. Please go.
Yes, please do this.
Medication, therapy, and working really, really hard to change the circumstances that were contributing. Head down, embracing that it will suck for a while, powering through and hoping for the best. It worked. With physical and neurological disabilities, I strongly suggest getting yourself as much professional support as possible.
It DOES get better. Please take care of yourself.
When I was feeling a similar way I got lucky in that a big life change came along. I moved to a new city and started over and it was like a reset button. I haven’t experienced that hopelessness since. That was 30+ years ago. I hope you can find the solution that works for you. These feelings are often temporary, and sometimes you just need to find your way past the crisis. I hope you find your way.
I hope that you are able to build on the small bits of hope you mentioned in your replies to some of the other comments. Human service organizations can seem overwhelmingly bureacratic, but the vast majority of people who work in them or live in the surrounding society are kind-hearted and do not want to see others choose the s-word because at the time life seems to have no other choices. Please remember that internet strangers are typing here because they care about you and believe that your life has meaning because you exist, period. Best wishes in pulling through your current despair. (P.S. Depression and despair are lying when they claim that there are no good choices.) At some point in the future, may you be able to share your solution and your hope with other people. Sending you healing thoughts and encouragement from my side of the Atlantic.
Just wanted to say please hang in there and cheering you on. Take it day by day. One step in front of the other and things will start to get better. Dealing with this medical need is first. As you get support there, it will be easier to work toward stability in housing. That stability will give safety and less panic. And once those needs are met more doors will start to open. It may not feel like it in this moment, but a chain of better is just waiting for you to take one step and then a few other first few steps. And you are stronger than you realize. You WILL get to a much better place, I promise.
OP, I hope you can at least count us as your internet friends! this community can be toxic at times but it can also be amazing. Please check in with us – we are here, rooting for you.
My experience is my sibling’s, not my own, so take that for what it is worth. However, he was once in a similar place and after an unsuccessful (thank g-d), got on medication. For him that was the key to unlock what he needed. He also then did things like therapy, etc. but none of that would/did work until he found the right meds.
You didn’t mention trying them so I assume you haven’t. In case that’s due to any shame, please try to let that feeling go! mental health is health, and some of our brains need that treatment just like any other parts of our body. My brother is still on those meds years later & now living a very full and happy life.
Just from how you wrote, I can tell you’re smart and kind. You matter, and have value, and we need as many good people in this world as possible.
I am late 30s, petite (barely above 5’ and barely above 100lbs), am GC at a 300-person company. Our dress code is business/business casual. I am surrounded by men and it is a male dominated industry (think construction finance or sports betting – finance but specific to one field). Due to the attention I get when I dress more like my friends/female peers at other places, I have stopped wearing anything remotely close to my size, any heel over 2”. Today I am in wide leg Athleta pants, a boxy ponte tee, and Cole Haan sneakers. I would like to wear a nice shirt dress and heels, but I would likely get 3-5 comments about my waist or calves or some other body descriptor. Example, wore a leather Allsaints jacket last year and got “biker babe!” comments. I feel I have avoided this issue by changing how I dress. I like my body but do not want attention on my clothes or body at work. But then I get a little sad when I see the outfit ideas here or when I go to lunch with peers elsewhere. Is this normal? Do I need to dress how I want and start correcting anyone who comments (“stop talking about what I wear”) or just keep dressing in figure-obscuring clothes? I am not worried about getting fired, but it feels exhausting to deal with the comments or have to extinguish them.
I don’t know how to fix this, but I don’t think this is normal. I’ve worked with a lot of men, and I’m small, too, and I’ve never felt like I have to hide my figure (beyond the bounds and of professionalism). I wouldn’t see “biker babe” as an issue; to me that would just be funny, but I cannot imagine most of the guys I’ve worked with making comments about my waist or calves.
“Biker babe” is not appropriate at all imo. That would bother me. (It’s the “babe” not the biker part)
I completely understand dressing more moderately in such an environment. But to wear boxy clothes too big for you is another level. I would start with wearing at least normally fitted clothes, maybe sticking with pants for now, and shutting down any comments.
I think there is a middle ground here. First, a congrats! General counsel in your 30s is a great achievement, and especially in a male dominated industry. What you described today sounds like work out gear, not business casual. I’d skip leather and shirt dresses. But that doesn’t mean you can’t dress nice or put together nice outfits. I think avoiding very body conscious things and high heels makes sense, but look for wedges, flats, low heels. Look for patterns, layering with blazers, etc. it sounds like you may be dressing very young. Also as the GC , you have the responsibility to stop those comments about body parts. No one should be commenting about anyone’s waist.
This is a major cultural issue that is not normal and not okay. If you’re getting these comments as GC, what are lower level women at the company dealing with?
Ugh why are men?
You know your office – would an incredulous “the fck did you just say?” fly?
This
:)
So you are surrounded by jerks and you absolutely need to shut the comments down. I am mid thirties, 5’2, 100 pounds, and wear sheath dresses, blazers, and heels or flats almost exclusively. I have never received comments like those, other than benign “I love your dress!” type things.
First of all, this is not normal behavior from your male coworkers and I’m sorry (been there). I worked in a pretty “Mad Men” environment before switching to the law, and I am also both quite small (5’3, weight in low 100s) and curvaceous. No matter what I wore, I got comments and one time, clearly inappropriate waist touching (!). It was terrible, and also not my fault, just like this behavior is 100% not your fault. It shouldn’t be our job to fix this stuff. But I noticed that not wearing “clingy” knit tops or skirts shorter than right above the knee really helped. I pretty much only wore shift or A-line dresses/skirts that had a roomier fit. I used giant cardigans as a layer a lot. Now I also use longer-cut blazers as a “skimming” layer. Fortunately there are more options now for looser pants than there were back then (I was pretty much stuck in skinny pants), but I only go as big as a trouser cut or wide-leg crop because anything else tends to overwhelm me. I stuck to flats and low heels because my commute involved a lot of walking.
Basically, my advice is to look for clothing that is not oversized, but “skims” over the body instead of tightly fitting on it. Roomier fits are in style right now and should be in stores. Kitten heels are also great, and very on-trend. These things might not stop the comments, but I hope they make you feel more comfortable in your own skin. I’m sorry you’re going through this. Sending hugs!
The comments are inappropriate, full stop.
That said, men can interpret women’s clothing differently than women do. A shirt dress plus heels reads… casual (because it’s a SHIRT, says the male brain) but not (because heels = more formal).
Think midi dress plus wedges.
As for the LJ: without knowing what it looks like, I can’t tell you exactly what’s going on. I have a leather jacket that elicits zero comments from men. It’s medium brown, no buckles, no studs, slim cut. A different jacket might read differently, and if you’re short, might easily overwhelm your frame. (I’m 5’8.)
Men read shirt dresses as shirts without pants.
That’s exactly it. I was trying to be delicate, and maybe that lead to confusion.
I personally love shirt dresses! It isn’t shade on them. It’s shade on dumb men who don’t understand that in this scenario, “shirt” is an adjective and “dress” is the noun.
Eeekk, multiple comments: the other problem with shirt dresses is that you kind of have to be the exact right height for them. If you’re too tall, they often aren’t long enough. No bueno. If you’re short, they might look long enough in a “of course that shirt goes down to her knees – she’s so tiny” way.
I understand dealing with these comments is exhausting, but kindly, isn’t your job as GC to manage risk at the company? I promise you if men at the company are making inappropriate comments about the general counsel’s body, it does not stop there. The question shouldn’t be how to dress so you don’t have to deal with this. The question is how do you shut these comments down so these bros are not saying worse things to other women at the company.
These things are cultural. If you’re getting comments on your legs, your waist, and being called “Biker Babe”, I can almost promise you 1) you aren’t the only one; and 2) others are experiencing worse, probably actual harassment.
+1 if the GC is experiencing this sort of harassment, imagine what regular workers are experiencing.
I work in a very old school, masculine culture (I’m the only woman on my team, only one who is not a veteran, and the youngest by at least 15 years. Basically it’s a bunch of retired infantry and artillery NCOs (from the days when women were not in those branches) and they all act and talk like they’re still in Iraq.
That being said they would never discuss my body or my fashion ever. I certainly don’t always love the conversations in the office, but they’re never disrespectful to or about me.
All this to say, the sexual harassment you’re experiencing is NOT normal and should be reported.
General counsel, 44, manufacturing.
You just ignore it. You don’t condone it. You don’t smile or laugh or encourage it in any way. Just you wear what you want, grit your teeth and ignore the comments. Eventually, they will stop. I’m sorry. Do not spend political capital correcting them. It’s not your fault/job to do that, and it won’t help your career. (As GC, your job duties will require you to advocate for others, I view that separate and part from this.)
If it isn’t a general counsel’s job to shut this kind of thing down, whose job is it?
If I was a woman at this company and I saw the GC putting up with this, it would send a strong message that I also have to tolerate it.
I didn’t get to where I was without being self preserving. I will put my neck out to protect employees, that’s part of my job. But when I’m the victim, I get to choose. I have chosen not to react because it hurts my career. This is not on me, it’s on them.
But isn’t it your job to protect the company against risk? These dudes are creating risk.
Not every risk every single time. I’m not magical.
What? They’re not going to eventually stop on their own.
I have bad news for you. They’re not going to stop, period.
I am also a GC and a lot depends on exactly you are dealing with. Line workers (aka people who do not supervise anyone else), “that is biker general counsel to you” + “remind me to schedule another sexual harassment workshop” the first time; a private conversation about how that is not appropriate (with or without HR depending on your company) the second time, formal write-up the third and potentially termination the fourth. Anyone who supervises anyone else, skip the first step and actually do sign them up for a sexual harassment training. Depending on the person, you can get a long way with “look – I do not want you to get into trouble when you say something like that to someone looking for an excuse to sue the company – and sue you personally.”
Your C-suite? Definitely private conversation with a polite and tactful, “that kind of thing can get the company sued” and a mention that it undercuts your authority.
A lot of the responses here are from people who either have zero real-world experience or do not care if they get fired (or frozen out to an extent that it makes it impossible to do the job). But also, you cannot waste political capital on small things. And I am going to be honest here – in most male dominated workplaces, “biker babe” is not with fighting (while comments about your body would be).
I would potentially respond to “biker babe” with “That’s exactly why you’re glad I’m the attorney for this company!”
This is great advice
I work in a heavily male-dominated environment in one of those traditionally unhospitable industries (think oil and gas) and this is not normal. Do your colleagues otherwise respect you and your work product? My guess is there is an underlying issue that they simply don’t respect you and whatever clothes you wear won’t fix this.
I’m in commercial real estate, and a niche of CRE that’s even more hyper male. This is not typical. Are there one or two bad actors I can reliably expect to make some ridiculous comment at times? Sure. But every time I or a colleague wears something? no. And, I always retort their obnoxious comments with equally “obnoxious” comments.. many such responses you’ve already received as suggestions on this thread.
I had a colleague with a wonderful way of shutting down inappropriate comments. He’d just state outright in an almost too serious voice that something was “inappropriate and inconsistent with company standards.” It worked because he was serious and shutting it down and but whomever he speaking to was allowed to think he was speaking on behalf of the company and not himself so he couldn’t be accused of not taking a joke or being a bad sport. I’ve stolen it and it works like a charm. It might be worth a try.
I’d get a new job. There’s no way I could work in an environment like that.
Can we talk about your experiences with how your family treated alcohol growing up, and how you think that worked out? Was it taboo, did they let you drink, was it available and did you sneak it, or what? And do you think whatever happened was good for you or should have been different?
For mine, it was not a big thing – not taboo, but rarely around. We weren’t well off, my dad had some cheap beer sometimes (which he might let us taste and make wild faces about how gross it was) and once in a great while they would mix a (bottom shelf) drink. A couple bottom barrel bottles were in the back of the pantry; I thought about trying one once but didn’t really get more than a whiff I think. I didn’t drink in high school but had a lot of fun with it, but was reasonably sensible, in college. So it worked well for me.
But that won’t be the same for my kids -mainly due to us being a different social class and older parents -we had a pretty good cocktail hobby before kids and have had drinks around regularly, as do most people we know. A friend of mine has been letting her 13 year old drink some when we get together, and says that her family would let her have beer freely as long as she kept her grades up. I’m uncomfortable with that (and worried about how it plays out when my kids get a couple years older). (And my friend does OK, but I’m not sure her relationship with alcohol is ideal.) So I’m trying to get some thoughts.
I don’t see any problem with parents drinking responsibly at home. Personally I wouldn’t be giving a 13yo that much freedom, though (growing up, I was only allowed a glass of wine on special occasions as a teen).
I wouldn’t worry as much if it were a special dinner type thing, but it’s more like “join the grown ups drinking and playing cards,” so there’s a little more of a “drink to drink” aspect to it.
Yeah, this seems different from a small amount to accompany a fancy meal.
In US culture I think this is not recommended (https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/31750959/)
+1 to recommending a read of this study
This study influenced me. There was also a similar study on UK binge drinking which showed a relationship between age of first drink and later bingeing behaviours.
Treat alcohol as something to be savored like food. We talk to the kids about why certain wines pair with certain foods. And they watch when we are making a cocktail on occasion (colour change with Empress gin is popular), or they are there when we have lunch at a microbrewery. They know that too much makes you quite sick and you can’t drink until you are older because even small amounts can be bad for your brain. They do take communion.
DH and I make a point of not having a drink every day. At some point we were watching episodes of a netflix series each night and having a drink. Just one but it was becoming daily. So we dialed it back to weekend nights and one week night. We don’t stock a lot at the house but do have some liquors, beer in the garage and wine in the basement.
My 13 year old is absolutely not allowed to drink (except communion wine). I’ve expressly told her to stick to beer if she does try anything at parties underage and to always open it herself and never leave it unattended. I also told her that we will do a wine tour in Italy for her 18th birthday. We will probably relax the rules around beer or wine and allow a half glass at Christmas or Easter dinner when she’s 16.
To clarify, she’s not currently going out to parties. It was in relation to high school parties down the road.
I have a complicated relationship with alcohol because I think my father is borderline alcoholic. He has untreated anxiety and uses it to self-medicate. He’s always kept his usage under control as far as I can tell – maybe a drink every night and then a six-pack in a day on the weekend – but his relationship with alcohol doesn’t seem healthy. And there is some evidence that he may have dementia that could be alcohol-related. My mother enjoys a glass of wine when they go out to eat, but isn’t a huge drinker. I have 2 brothers – as far as I can tell, my older brother doesn’t drink at all now, although he did when he was younger. I’ve never talked about it with him, but I think this is related to my dad. I never learned to like the taste of alcohol and gave up trying in my early 20s, so I don’t drink at all. My younger brother is a bit more into craft beers and mixed drinks, so I think he drinks socially and some at home. But he and his wife are also pretty health-conscious. My husband grew up in a small town in the deep south where there was nothing to do but drink; I think he got a lot of that out of his system before he even went to college. He enjoys wine but can’t drink much due to medication he takes, so he very rarely has a drink now.
Giving your 13 year old child drinks is not normal or healthy. Our son is 12, and I would NEVER consider this! I think my parents let me taste a sip of beer when I was little, knowing I would hate it–that never changed–but this sounds more like she has made her child her drinking buddy, which is nuts.
Having your 13-year-old as your drinking buddy reminds of an anecdote in Britney Spears’ memoir – she said her mom would make her White Russians and they would drink together. I cannot even imagine.
This. My dad had two beers per night and ended up with alcohol related dementia. I am like your brother and basically don’t drink at all-maybe one drink a month. I personally don’t want to spend my old age wearing diapers and being in memory care all because I wanted a drink every night. It wasn’t pretty to watch, cost a small fortune, and we were left mourning him as gone before he even had died.
I find this fascinating. This is a bit of a tension in my marriage and think it reflects what was normal in our childhood home.
My upbringing was a mirror of yours. My parents each had an alcoholic parent, and drank pretty sparingly – rare nights out, occasional wine cooler (it was the 80s) or beer with Mexican food. My husband grew up in the UK, and came from a posher background, and wine with dinner was the norm, a habit he continued into adulthood (and probably exceeded that most evenings). He drinks less now because of health concerns, and also because he knows it makes me deeply uncomfortable. But our son (7) knows that daddy likes Islay whisky and white whine, and mummy occasionally has a cocktail.
I wouldn’t let my 13 year old drink at home, maybe 16 (legal is 18 here) but 13 is way too young!
My parents drank responsibly when I was growing up, wine with dinner, sometimes got a little tipsy on holiday dinners, nothing crazy. They let me try alcohol in the safety of their home when I was a teenager. As a result I never felt like it was something forbidden/taboo that I had to sneak or binge drink when I was out with friends.
This is probably controversial but I was allowed to drink in high school. There were parameters: must have a DD or sleep over, do it at a friend’s house but don’t have underage people drinking at our home, and they wouldn’t buy me alcohol. It worked because my friends and I were responsible. No one ever needed medical attention, we weren’t attending parties that attracted cops, and it wasn’t every weekend. My parents modeled reasonable drinking (one beer or a fancy mixed drink with dinner on weekends) and let me taste their drinks so it wasn’t forbidden fruit. This approach obviously wouldn’t work with every teenager but they would rather know that I was having Captain Morgan in Friend X’s basement and sleeping over than chugging too much vodka in secret and being afraid to call for help.
I had two rules from the parents about drinking: First, never drink and drive; Second, don’t drink and make an ass of yourself in public. The two rules translated over to adulthood nicely. I spent my first year of college watching many kids from teetotaller fundamentalist homes stay blitzed out of their minds any chance they got.
I met a lot of kids in college who had zero experience with alcohol and same thing – total overdrinking into near-oblivion. As it was a women’s college, there were plenty of people who would skip dinner before drinking which made it even worse.
While I try not to be paranoid, I do wonder sometimes if the younger moms I meet judge me for drinking at all. I don’t drink at kid activities or to excess, FWIW.
My parents would have a drink with dinner maybe 1x a week and then more on weekends, whether that was at home or going out with friends. They mostly just drink beer and wine, but had a fully stocked home bar for entertaining.
My brother and I drank here and there in high school (but neither ever got caught) and then both fully enjoyed our college’s social scenes. We were not allowed to drink at all in high school and very sparingly until 21.
I think it’s important that if you have a kid who will drink in college they should have gotten drunk before they go to college. I drank in high school but the first time I was drunk (not super drunk, but more than tipsy) was night 2 of college. Nothing bad happened, I’m still friends with some of the kids I went out with that night and now know they’d be helpful and safe if anything did happen but at the time – I didn’t know them from Adam. Could be a really dangerous situation.
I grew up about the same as you and also feel it worked out fine.
My parents usually had beer in the house but I’ve never seen either of them drink more than one; we would go to the local bar for dinner pretty often (rural midwest, this is normal) and they would usually split a beer or old fashioned (too expensive to each order one!) and let us have a taste if we were curious.
I did drink in college but in the wine with dinner, beer at a baseball game way.
Now I could take it or leave it – I love a good cocktail but don’t sleep well after even one drink so usually just have a sip of whatever my husband is drinking. He likes to have “a little something” after work while he’s making dinner but his “little something” could equally be a beer, a kombucha, or a Lacroix, so I’m optimistic that our kids will have the same healthy exposure I did.
There is plenty of solid research on this. Allowing teenagers to drink at home is a strong risk factor for those same kids developing problems with alcohol.
+1. I understand why it sounds appealing to many families but we won’t be doing it in our house.
I suspect the studies are really skewed here because of how taboo drinking is in the US. Most families that let their kids have half a glass of champagne on NYE would not self report that they “allow drinking” at home.
I think modeling a healthy attitude and behaviors toward alcohol is critical in teaching your kids how to interact with alcohol when they leave home. Letting 16+ year olds have a glass of wine on special occasions seems to me to recognize they’re become young adults and to guide them to engage in adult activities in a responsible way. I also think the parents’ relationship with alcohol has a lot more impact on kids than most people like to admit.
This is an assumption that is common (and I agree seems logical!) but it doesn’t stand up in the research. Here’s one explanation of the multiple studies on this which are large and control for other variables:
https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/think-act-be/202005/should-parents-let-kids-drink?amp
Non-US parents perspective. Never raised with alcohol as something taboo. We were never allowed to freely drink in high school – e.g., no grabbing beers out of the fridge on our own – but, were allowed to have a sip of the wine with big family dinners or half a glass of champagne. Parents allowed us to freely drink after 18 as they disagreed with the US drinking age. Biggest rule was no drinking beyond one drink and driving. Still enforced, as grown adults, which has resulted in comical events with childhood thirty-something friends sleeping on an air mattress at my parents house or my parents driving them back to their parents house (I suspect this is an ongoing joke between the parents).
Growing up, my dad drank beer with dinner. Than he got into making his own fruit wines and he’d drink that with dinner. When he was younger, he drank really high proof rice wines when he was with friends. My mom would have half a beer every now and then with dinner.
Beer and wine were offered to me as a kid, but I didn’t find them appealing. I tried getting into wine in my early 20s bc it seemed like an adult thing to do, but it didn’t last.
Now I will occasionally have a little wine on social occasions.
I do not keep alcohol in the house, though after some days at work, I really wish I did, hah. I intentionally avoid drinking because there is no health benefit from alcohol, and it increases risk for several health issues.
My family owns a small winery so I definitely grew up in a wine drinking family but also a family where being drunk was looked down on. So wine with dinner several nights a week, an occasional cocktail, beer for my dad in summer, but never in excess and never more than one when driving (if I had a dollar for every time I heard one of my parents say “no thank you, I am driving” when offered a second drink I would be rich.) They were both big on “moderation in all things” and had a lot to say about drinking culture where people drink to get drunk or deal with their problems. I only saw one of them impaired by alcohol on one occasion (the margaritas were horrifically strong so one was enough) and she was horrified and embarrassed beyond all measure the next day, even though she was really only mildly drunk.
In my teens, I would get a half-glass with dinner for special occasions and would periodically be invited to taste an adult’s wine, especially at larger gatherings when there was more than one bottle open so I could taste the difference between wines and vintages. My mother would have skinned me alive if she caught me in the alcohol cabinet on my own or drinking at a party in high school so I never even thought about it. I did not drink except with family until I was in college and I inherited my family’s horror of being out of control.
I raised my own now-adult daughter the same way. The only difference was that I set her up with an Uber account and told her to use it if she needed to get home safely for any reason and I would never ask why. She never used it when she was driving while in high school. It saw more use when she was in college but I had also told her she could use it for any reason after dark so I am not sure how much of that was alcohol related. It seems to have worked well except that she is a complete wine snob!
I and my family abstain for cultural and religious reasons. Unfortunately, the only family members who do drink do so in excess. (And I don’t say this in a “any drink is excessive” judgey way, they have crashed cars, trashed houses, and lost jobs due to their drinking habits.) I imagine having good examples and discussions about where the limits are, how to determine then, etc. would be very beneficial in avoiding developing a damaging relationship to alcohol consumption, emphasis on having conversations about it instead of just expecting them to pick things up through osmosis. I wish we could do that for our family members who have chosen to drink, but I’m not about to pick up a drinking habit in the hopes that I can do it responsibly and then teach them how.
Letting your kids drink at 13 is idiotic. You never know who will get triggered into an issue. Why damage your child’s brain to make you feel good about alcohol?
My high school kids have gotten a sip of wine if they have communion at church but not otherwise. They don’t get what the fuss is about.
That you know of …
I grew up with a functioning alcoholic father, and my DH has parents who will bristle if you have more than two drinks as an adult, so, very different backgrounds and neither ideal! My husband definitely snuck around as a teenager and still feels like he can’t have a normal conversation referencing alcohol with his parents. I didn’t really drink until college, but I think it’s detrimental to see your parent drink every night, even if it’s just one. That makes it seems like too much a normal, expected part of every day life.
DH and I don’t drink M-Th, have 1-2 beers on Fri and then sit and have a cocktail together on Sat and Sun evening. There are some exceptions for holidays or gatherings or if we have an open bottle of wine from the weekend we want to use up.
Our kids see us making and enjoying drinks, but it’s almost always together. It enhances our life and our relationship, but it has a certain, limited place. And I would never give a 13yo a drink. It is too much in the vein of “we are cool, hip friends instead of parents and giving you something risque”. Rather than remove temptation, I think it actually puts it further on a pedestal, since clearly most other 13yos are not allowed to have it and you’ve just made it an object of focus due to its rarity
I grew up in a conservative religious household where alcohol was demonized. Even being around other adults drinking in a public situation felt incredibly uncomfortable because my mom was so vocal and judgmental about alcohol. My high school boyfriend’s family would have a beer or a glass of wine with dinner, and when we all went out, I was mortified when they ordered alcohol at dinner and my mom was terse the whole dinner. I was generally scared of alcohol and while I drank in college, I was pretty militant about what I consumed to make sure I was safe.
As adults, me and my siblings drink and have a healthy relationship with alcohol, largely because we’re all pretty health conscious. My brother likes a nice glass of whiskey, my sister and I enjoy wine and fancy cocktails. None of us drink daily and we rarely drink to excess.
My husband grew up in a similarly strict environment and went the opposite way. He’s had issues with alcohol since freshman of college, would regularly drink to excess into his late 20s, has been in and out of AA over the years, and it causes problems in our relationship.
We don’t have kids, but I think that it’s smarter to discuss alcohol in more measured terms. You also shouldn’t eat loads of sugar because it’s bad for your health. You also shouldn’t stay up all night because it’s bad for your health. These aren’t treated as sinful or completely forbidden-you’re-a-terrible-person activities, but most people try to have good habits around sweets and sleeping. This is more of my attitude around drinking. I genuinely enjoy the taste of some drinks, but it hurts my performance in other areas, so I don’t consume it all the time.
My parents are big beer drinkers, and my grandparents were the cocktail people but with scotch and soda, Brandy alexander, grasshopper, etc. None of that was appealing to me as a kid, so I didn’t have my first real drink until around age 20.
The Cosmo craze happened as I turned 21, but I still drank pretty rarely until about 29, when I got into a lot of heavy (binge) drinking thanks to a lot of good friends from law school and the firm drinking like that. It’s been a struggle for the last 20 years, with probably about 15 drinks per week. My husband and I are both big drinkers and we feed off each other. I’m trying to get into MJ more.
My 13yo is allowed a half glass of wine at holidays and we’ll give him sips of our drinks, but I think he’s seen us stupid drunk often enough that he isn’t overly tempted. We haven’t had big talks about any of it yet.
There is a strong history of alcoholism in my family. My mom regularly had a G&T (or more) at night as I was growing up. I’m not sure exactly when it changed, or if my own awareness is what changed, but she now drinks 2 bottles of wine in 2-3 nights. My now ex-husband is an alcoholic, which has negatively impacted our children and which limits the time that he spends with them. I talk openly with my children about alcohol and other substances. I do not drink, and I have explained to them my reasons for my behavior. If they do engage in drinking before they leave for college, I will not respond lightly. I highly recommend the book, “The Addiction Inoculation” for well-researched guidance on this topic.
Late GenX with boomer parents. My parents were social drinkers, mostly on weekends and never to obvious excess. One set of grandparents/extended family were the “cocktails every day at 4pm” sort, the other side were generally teetotalers. My maternal grandmother was incredibly anxious and upset if anyone was drinking alcohol and never had it in the house. My paternal grandfather was like, come here kid, let’s show you how to make Manhattans.
I didn’t drink recreationally in high school, mostly for lack of access or true interest (I was a real nerd and wouldn’t have stolen my parent’s booze). My parents were fine with us trying alcohol and let us have wine or cocktails on vacation and at holidays. I’ve let my teens try wine or a cocktail if we’re having them, but neither has too much interest. I drink a lot less than I did in my 20s, but was never more than a fairly moderate/light drinker (it makes me sleepy). Moderation seems to have worked out okay so far in my life.
I’m starting to realize I have no idea how an adult human body functions. All the comments re insulin resistance and A1C are just blurry concepts and the idea of prediabetes is pretty scary. Is there a good “how your body works and how to understand warning signs” for general health? I feel that these books exist for pregnancy and maybe some specific conditions. But I feel like if I knew more, I’d likely be a better patient when something inevitably happens (either for me or my partner). Like I had one parent who had murky symptoms of something that could have been a variety of things, delayed seeking care over COVID, and had a cancer that may not have been fatal had it been caught sooner. Stuff like that. Plus, as a woman, I feel that we just get dismissed a lot. What good resources for laymen are out there? My basic knowledge is what blood pressure and cholesterol numbers are good but I know that just from giving blood regularly.
CDC tends to have good resources for general preventive care.
When I was growing up, families used the Merck manual. I actually don’t know if that’s still what parents use.
It’s okay to outsource a lot of this if you want to though; your insurance company may have a nurse line or a telehealth consult option if you have general health questions (“is this a symptom?” type questions and “do I need to see someone about it, and if so who?” type questions).
I grew up reading the Tuesday Science Times in the NYT so I now have close to 40 years of science and health news stories in my head that do a pretty good job of filling in things to be aware of. The Atlantic also has pretty good science and heath coverage (I’m a scientist in a non-health field, so I feel like I can give a decent evaluation). I’d just start by reading popular sources like that regularly and then check places like the Mayo Clinic and CDC when you have specific issues.
Look into getting a college level human physiology textbook for “how your body works.”
For “how to understand warning signs,” I would just make sure you have a good relationship with you PCP and check in with them more frequently. You should be able to some education from your pcp and then read up on the specifics after.
Honestly, I recommend a good primary care doctor, and as you get older, a good GYN with an interest in perimenopause.
I subscribed to the Harvard Women’s Health newsletters. Come out once a month. Also got my Dad a subscription after my Mom died. He was one of the rare males that appreciated and read them.
Oh Harvard Health is a good one. I really think those newsletters have made a difference for people I know who take them seriously.
How Not to Die by Greger is a decent tutorial on disease prevention. I found the explanations of the mechanisms of various diseases quite helpful. Be forewarned that he’s a vegan and kind of thinks you should be one, too…but the book itself is not overly forceful on that, other than when it comes to super processed meats.
My doctor recommends this one (even though he doesn’t think I or all that many people should be vegan, but he thinks it’s a good overview).
After all that complaining about Ukraine, Russia has refused a ceasefire so they announced 200% tariff on EU alcohol to distract. He’s so clearly terrified of Putin. If Russia had agreed to a ceasefire and Ukraine refused, Trump would have lost it. Instead it’s not even mentioned.
I’m so tired of this timeline.
Sure, because he’s a Russian asset. That’s been well known for a long time. And yet, this is what people voted for…
I get that, I just assumed that they were pushing Ukraine so hard for a ceasefire because it was what Putin wanted so he would have accepted it. All that wasted energy and time only for fighting to continue.
I think it was to drum up an excuse to cut Ukraine off. It was indeed wasted time and energy for the Ukrainians, since none of it was done in good faith.
It sucks and frankly, it’s evil.
Makes me wonder if Putin’s real goal was to kill the US military industrial complex by teaching the EU/NATO that they can’t trust US armaments.
@1:07 Can you explain what you mean? I feel like I missed a news story about US armaments being unreliable. Genuinely curious.
EU just announced almost a trillion dollars in new defense spending. It’s the ;largest new initiative in a generation. I’d be surprised if much of that, if any, goes to US armament makers.
USA as an unreliable military partner is being widely discussed in EU, Australian and Canadian media. Difference in F35 vs F14 in terms of long term dependence on US making the F35 undesirably as US is unreliable is widely discussed with suggestions that Canada should back out of the F35 order and the reason that the Indians waiting on domestic stealth jets vs F35s. And French/Italian missiles used to bring down a Russian jet in Ukraine generating discussion on production time acceleration to match Patriot timelines vs traditional discussion about cost effectiveness to develop domestically vs purchase from US.
That there is currently a French nuclear attack submarine in Halifax harbour doing ‘Cold water drills’ that no one heard of until recently. Canada doesn’t trust the US and France/EU doesn’t trust the US. French have the only western non-US dependent nuclear program. A month ago, almost no one knew that and now it’s everyday conversation. Australian news is full of the debate around switching to US subs over French subs as the wrong decision.
No one trusts the US. It’s not the isolationism for EU/NATO, it’s the fact that the changes are done so quickly as to be detrimental to EU defense which makes US look untrustworthy, and combined with discussions of Canada invasion, makes it look like US cannot be trusted to respect international law.
Armaments themselves are functional but no one wants to buy them. Or if they have no choice because of their current systems to buy them currently, they are actively discussing how to develop alternate systems.
That is literally a hoax that has been disproven.
Good try Vlad.
How was this disproven? His public actions are all helpful to Putin.
Like the Russian attack on Kursk right after the US stopped intelligence sharing with Ukraine.
Everything Trump is doing is helpful to Putin. Even aluminum tariffs. Once there’s a US pressured ceasefire, he’ll unsanction Russia and the price of aluminum is already inflated because of tariffs. Russia needs high metal prices to recover its economy after the war. As the International Trade Commission proved last time he tariffed in Trump 1 it raises prices of metals overall because of how tariffs impact market pricing.
Fine dining recs for 3 nights in Chicago? Is Alinea worth it if we can get a reservation? Other ideas? We don’t drink so wine pairings aren’t a factor.
Alinea is honestly such a fun spectacle. It’s entertainment and food, and you should go in with that expectation. I had a blast. Anywhere in Fulton Market is going to be pretty tasty, there’s lots of options depending on what your tastes are.
John’s Food and Wine in Lincoln Park has outstanding food in a small, unstuffy restaurant. They don’t accept reservations but it should fine if you don’t walk in at prime time.
Chicago person here. Alinea is worth it if you can get the reservation!
Do you enjoy Alinea-type fine dining? It’s creative, and out of the box, but some of the courses were actually BAD tasting and I didn’t like the performative aspect of it. The service was mediocre as well. We went a few years ago and I was underwhelmed to be honest. I think it’s overhyped.
10 years ago we lived in the Bay Area and loved going to fine dining restaurants in SF and Napa. We visited a few *** Michelin restaurants that we loved, including The French Laundry. That said, I know Alinea is kind of different with the molecular gastronomy, and that technique was not big in the bay area at the time we lived there. There was one restaurant that was kind of famous for it but we never made it there. So I’m not really sure.
Alinea and its sister restaurant Next are both amazing. Next does 3 menus a year, and the current menu is “Alinea Year 1.” Both are worth it if you can swing it, and with flexibility in timing (e.g., willing to do a 8:30-9 pm reservation) it’s likely you can.
Curtis Duffy’s restaurant Ever is the fine dining restaurant featured in The Bear. Sadly, no Olivia Colman hiding in the kitchen, but it is an amazing experience. Duffy is also a fascinating person (read the Chicago Trib article “His Saving Grace”) and was chef de cuisine at Alinea for several years. Ever is actually more expensive than Alinea, I think, but was a really cool experience that is perhaps underhyped slightly compared to Alinea/Next.
FWIW I’ve been to Alinea 2x and Next… maybe 6? (including one year of a season pass). I’ve never had service short of exceptional, and the food has always been somewhere between “very good” and “best thing I’ve eaten this year.”
For original OP: I will order the non-alcoholic pairing sometimes, and that can be delish. Typically my husband and I split one NA pairing now as I find the juices to be very filling and impact my experience of the meal (i.e., I fill up on juice).
Unfortunately we will be there in mid-May and Next appears to be on its pause between menus. We’ll have to catch it next time (pun intended, ha). We live a couple hours away and are in the city a lot but usually with kids. Hoping we can make kid-free trips a more regular occurrence.
I went to Ever last year and it was quite an experience. Never been to Alinea but I’ve been to other Michelin stars.
Maybe not the style you’re looking for, but Gibson’s Italia and Bavette’s/Gilt Bar are a lot of fun, as is Monteverde if you can luck into a reservation.
Other options besides Alinea i like.. RPM italian, ba mar by jose andres (amazing seafood), topolobampo (high end mexican by rick bayless), the RL restaurant
Topolobampo all the way.
If you are feeling carnivorous, Bazaar Meats above Bar Mar is an experience!
There is an annual awards dinner for work scheduled the same night as your son’s last game of sportsball. Your son is a high school senior, just a regular athlete (no college career ahead) and this is the last game he’ll ever play as a high schooler. You’ve always tried to go to as many of his games as possible. You’re a VP and there are people from your division receiving awards at the dinner.
Which do you go to and why?
Sportsball. No question.
100% this. Not even a question for me.
Same. Your colleagues will not remember 5 years from now that you didn’t see them receive their award (obviously congratulate them later), your son will never forget if you miss this game. If I were your colleague and you told me you were missing that game to be at the dinner, I honestly would think less of you.
Not colleagues, reports. I actually bet they will remember. Not that I’m saying it outweigh’s family in any way, but I don’t think it has zero impact on her professional relationships.
There are a lot of variables in how colleagues might react. How they already view the VP (it would amplify existing dislike if they view her as callous/out of touch, but probably be endearing if she has been supportive of work-life balance choices among her reports) whether they have their own children, and how the VP messages her absence and tries to “make up” for it or not.
I go.to.the work dinner, make a big deal of attending the next two last sports all game and send kid’s father and siblings to that, then meet the family after awards dinner for a full download and celebration in whatever fashion suits your family. I’m Gen X, played three sports for four years, and recall no one ever making any fuss about my last anything and I lived to tell about it just fine. If my mother had been VP anything with an awards dinner for Big Jim’s accomplishments or whatever, I would have been perplexed why she skipped it for a high school meet.
This, exactly.
This, unless last game is also senior night.
Agree. But also talk to son about the situation so he understands OP’s predicament.
Is it important to your son that you’re there? If so I would go but personally celebrate the award-winners in another way (take them out to lunch?) Is there any option to go to the dinner for drinks then leave for the sportsball?
Senior Night is essentially an awards night and a graduation for your son all rolled into one. You can’t miss it.
Last game isn’t necessarily Senior Night (imo, it’s often “last regular season Home game). I wouldn’t skip senior night for anything at work though.
The game.
Is your son’s father going? Other family? How does your son feel generally and the sport, and you there? Are there parent / child recognitions?
In our area, hockey and football do a big thing on the last senior home game recognizing all the players and parents. For soccer, they get the town youth soccer teams out to do a “senior scream tunnel” and have a poster for each senior; girls get flowers at the game and a pic with parents. Basketball is similar to soccer.
If you and your son have a good relationship, I’d ask him. Say you have a conflict, it’s important but can be skipped, is it important to him that you go? Or actually, have Dad have this convo so son doesn’t feel like he’s letting you down.
Absolutely sportsball and listen to Harry Chapin’s “Cat’s in the Cradle” every time this kind of question might come up for ya.
This, yes.
If you pick work, you are picking celebrating your colleagues over your son.
No shade in that deciding but that’s what you are saying. I think your adult colleagues will be less hurt than your teen son. Your colleagues would also likely skip receiving the award for a big enough family event (not saying this is it).
That’s not what she is saying by deciding to go to the work event. Part of raising children is making money. Give me a break.
For real. OP doesn’t have a vanity job and things like being seen at important work events matter. I played tons of sports and have no memory of whether my parents were there or not. By the time I was a senior in HS, I didn’t care if mommy was watching me.
I’m going to gently push back on this. I think it’s very important for people in senior positions to model prioritizing their family. YMMV, but I’d rather work for someone who recognizes that we’re all humans outside of work, and sometimes your mom or your child has to come first.
Disagree. Family doesn’t always get to win the day at work. Sometimes you have to make a hard choice. And model doing that.
Going to an awards night is not a prerequisite for keeping a job or making enough money to support a family. Whenever I’m faced with optional work things versus something that’s important to a family member, my family wins every time.
Making money helps with the raising of children, sure, but I would seriously side-eye the priorities of a colleague who chose to attend a routine awards dinner where they were just another audience member rather than their son’s last sportsball game.
Maybe not if the colleague was receiving a Big Award, like an industry lifetime achievement thing and not just annual company kudos. But as described here, attendance at this doesn’t actually seem to be about “making money” for raising the kid.
Except you all are naive, it very much is. If you are always missing the work extras for sportsball or whatever else you prioritize, it is noticed and not in a good way. There’s plenty of time to spend with family today, work is a thousand percent more flexible than it was twenty years ago, but you cannot pretend facetime doesn’t matter.
“There’s plenty of time to spend with family today”. What?!
I would be willing to bet that 1:16 does not have children, and still has living parents and grandparents/other important family members.
Also, the fact that the OP posted this question makes me think that she is not one of the people always missing work extras.
Sportsball.
If I were your kid, I wouldn’t give a *&$t if you were there, but I would be pretty annoyed if I were your employee who had to go to this event and my boss didn’t bother to show up. You should probably ask your actual kid and employees instead of me, though.
Should definitely ask, because I wouldn’t care if my parent was at my sportsball game or my supervisor/boss attended an award event where I got an award. Might not be a big deal at all and you can decide whatever you would prefer.
Sports night. 100%
Is the awards dinner optional for your staff? I was recently voluntold to go to a work event which made my work day 16 hours long only to discover my VP was not there. I was so mad especially because I was tired and everything hurt.
The game. Not even close.
I mean, this depends on your kid. I love my parents but honestly preferred when they did NOT come to my high school activities.
I skipped an important client dinner for Senior Night.
It depends on how your child feels about it. I would not have cared.
IDK what you do, but I have become friends (but not close friends) with other parents my kids do activities with and I enjoy seeing them (adult friends) at every kid activity and catch up with them vs hovering over my kid at them. I am a big sad that when my kids go off to college, I will likely lose a bit of my friendly acquaintance circle of people (unless, I guess, we graduate to friends before then). It’s usually the fellow harried working moms I’d love to know better (and now that the older kids can drive, maybe we all get freed up in life and get to have some more hanging out time).
If I missed the kid activity, I’d miss seeing MY friends from there (kiddo would likely not care — I have missed a ton of life events because of Sandwich Generation things where we often divide and conquer as a family). I also miss a ton of work events for the same reason, so I could see both being equally valid to go to.
Obviously his game. Anything else is unacceptable
The game and I wouldn’t even hesitate
Sportsball, precisely because he’s not playing in college.
My father missed my last ever track meet, for the reason that he was coaching a baseball team in their state tournament on the same day. Truly unavoidable. He quietly got my bib and hip number off my uniform and had them framed for me.
Work event? Damn that would have sucked.
Sportsball and you personally congratulate / make a big deal about the people in your division receiving awards before the event. They are adults and do not depend on you at all in the same way your child does. There will be other awards dinners.
This is how I would do it, too. Make sure to let your team members know you are proud of them and the awards are well deserved, and also make it clear you have a family commitment that prevents you from attending the dinner. Then go to sportsball.
+1
This, and make sure everyone knows exactly why you are missing the event. It’s important for leaders to model work-life balance and healthy priorities.
The game, no question. Won’t there be senior recognition at his last game? I can’t imagine missing that unless I had, like, a parent or sibling in the hospital in a different state.
I can’t believe this is even a question. Obviously your son’s game
The fact that there are multiple answers means that there is nuance to sift through.
First: What does my son think? Is he really hoping his mom shows up for this last game or is he embarrassed at the idea that anyone even knows he has a mom?
Second: where’s his other parent?
Sports ball, no question. but make a point to celebrate the people in your division receiving the awards and explain why you can’t make the dinner.
I’d go to the happy hour portion of the awards dinner, say congrats/best wishes as appropriate to the recipients, and then go to the sports thing.
I would seriously side-eye an exec who told me they skipped their kid’s last time playing a sport competitively for an annual awards dinner.
As others said, congratulate the winners in your division and take them to lunch if appropriate.
sports.
make it very clear to your reports why you won’t be there & find another way to celebrate them. I don’t have kids but have always had the utmost respect for leaders that make it clear how/when they prioritize their family.
(assuming you are a good boss that also would let your report skip a similar event for similar reasons & have a track record of this)
I’ve been watching Season 8 of Love is Blind (set in Minnesota). Usually, this is an escape from the real world, but (SPOILER) differences in politics ended up being the reason two of the couples didn’t get married. As a single women looking for a partner, it struck me how much this was a parallel to my own dating life…. I myself am pretty liberal and looking for a partner who I’m on the same page as for the big stuff. When I was younger, differences in politics meant differing views on geopolitics or taxes, now it feels much larger. The number of men I have come across who call themselves apolitical or moderate only to end up being hardcore MAGA is way too high. But homophobia, anti-choice views, etc. are dealbreakers for me. They are politicized issues in today’s America, but to me they are fundamental values (as it seems they were on the show). I’ve also seen articles about the widening political gap with men moving more right and women moving (or staying?) left and what that means for lower marriage rates/dating. I normally watch this stuff as fun fluff, but man this time it felt too real. Would love to hear thoughts for anyone else who watched the season and how it resonated with you (or didn’t).
I love how explicit the ‘we are not getting married because of your views’ part was. I feel like a lot of media sort of side steps around that stuff to appease MAGAts, but LIB put it on full display. There should be consequences for having repugnant views.
The very best delivery was Virginia’s “He didn’t want to discuss his views on camera and I respect that, but let me be unwaveringly clear about mine….”. Chef kiss.
Yes, I loved that segment too. People complaining that it’s throwing Devin under the bus or implying he’s not tolerant…. he was present, he could have chosen to clarify his view. If that’s what he believes, he shouldn’t act ashamed of it. And Virginia (and other women like her and I) can make informed decisions of the men we let into our lives. The “be tolerant of my intolerance!” whining gets old very quickly.
I don’t watch the show, but I am dating, and always assume anyone who puts moderate or apolitical on their profile is a republican who wants to widen their dating pool. This isn’t even from experiencing dating someone with that on their profile, just an assumption.
Yup, it’s a well known phenomenon that guys on dating apps put moderate/apolitical when they mean right-wing nut job because they know they won’t get dates if they’re honest.
Which is ridiculous. If they’re that right wing do they really think they will like dating a liberal woman?
Exactly, I find that confusing too. I heard a friend say that it’s tied to traditional gender views too… if a guy sees himself as head of the family or higher in whatever hierarchy than a female partner, it doesn’t matter to him as much if she feels differently as long as he’s actually the decisionmaker/the one with the power. Idk how I feel about that explanation but it does track with how the last closet MAGA guy I came across on the dating apps acted when I ended it after finding out his views.
Unfortunately I think for some men, there is a thrill in bending an independent woman to their will. As Trevor Noah said –
The way my mother always explained it, the traditional man wants a woman to be subservient, but he never falls in love with subservient women. He’s attracted to independent women. “He’s like an exotic bird collector,” she said. “He only wants a woman who is free because his dream is to put her in a cage.
They only care about getting laid ime.
They want to fck liberal women. They want to marry a conservative woman. And they will tell liberal women they’re looking for marriage just to get in her pants.
They also want to be able to tell their right wing friends that they got rejected by a crazy liberal woman.
My experience dating in a blue city/state was moderate=MAGA. I went on several dates with men who tried converting me to “just listen” and see how great Joe Rogan or Jordan Peterson are.
My husband’s MAGA friend did this. I get that lots of men are just trying to hook up, but he really wanted a long term relationship. What is the end game here? I can’t imagine anyone is meeting someone, finding out about incompatible values that someone failed to disclose and then just being fine with it.
They think that they are so correct and right that a woman will see the error of her ways and become MAGA once they talk to her. She’s probably just been talking to dumb liberal dudes so once she talks to a MAGA guy she’ll know better. And if she doesn’t at least he got to F her.
No they definitely don’t think they’re ‘correct’ they take pleasure in harming women and tricking a liberal woman is the ultimate thrill
I was more referencing the Husband’s friend who she says actually wants a relationship.
There are a few different charitable interpretations:
He’s a Trump Democrat. There are a lot of them. (Political realignment is real.) The usual pattern is Obama 08; maybe Obama 2012, maybe stay home; Bernie in the 2016 primaries, maybe Trump in the general, maybe stay home; Trump 2020 and 2024. Midterms and special elections? Stays home or votes D. He might even split his vote (consider that Trump outperformed GOP Senators in several swing states). So to him, he is actually moderate.
Second interpretation: he votes, watches the news, but doesn’t love and breathe politics.
Third, related interpretation: online dating can cause people to reject potential matches whom they would have gotten along very well with in person. He’s not opposed to dating and marrying a liberal woman who stays liberal, and therefore, he doesn’t see politics as a deal breaker.
Men with gross views don’t need woman to give them charitable interpretations.
“He’s not opposed to dating and marrying a woman who stays liberal” — as long as she doesn’t know upfront about his political views and isn’t empowered to reject him accordingly. What else is he going to hide from her to keep her from making informed decisions and get what he wants?
Honestly thanks for thinking on this for me! I think with regard to this person it is number #3. He’s from an area of the tri state that was maga before maga if that makes sense. He’s a professional who can pronounce words that begin with “th” correctly so I think his thinking is that large swaths of women will tolerate maga politics if he doesn’t have a trump flag on a pick up truck. It’s a weird quirk of my area. He’s probably missing the point that it’s not an aesthetic deal breaker; it’s a values mismatch. Like buddy you want to criminalize abortion and end democracy; no one cares if youre a Staten Island kind of republican or a Connecticut kind of republican anymore.
The end game is figuring once she gets attached to him she’ll put up with his politics.
Because to men like your husband’s friend, women aren’t people like he is, with complex thoughts and ideas of their own.
Pragmatically, it means that liberal women will have a harder time finding like minded men.
That likely means being very compromising about superficial things (he’s two inches shorter than you; he’s bald; he’s a gamer; he’s waaay too into mountain biking) when evaluating men for the first couple of dates.
After the first couple of dates, absolutely, end it if attraction isn’t there! But if he’s liberal, smart enough for you, healthy enough so that you could be attracted to him, and kind, go on the date. Literally, nothing else matters for the first date.
I don’t think you’re wrong. I realized that a few traits I find attractive in a man are easier to find in right leaning men (one ex: being handy with cars/around the home) compared to the men aligned with my politics/values. I’m embarrassingly bad at those sorts of tasks, but the left leaning men I’ve dated are even less familiar with how to use a drill or screwdriver.
But I’d rather date and marry a man who shares my values & view of the world and lacks that trait than vice versa. I’ll learn to be the handy one as long as he treats me like an equal and isn’t intimidated by me making more $ than him.
You’re actually describing one of my best friends: liberal, unfailingly kind, repairs cars, redid his bathroom, helped me fix my Vitamix over text. Unfortunately, dating apps are a hellscape for him.
lol based on what you said, I’d be asking for an introduction if we knew each other IRL
Heck, I don’t know you and want an introduction if he is in the general DC area
I loved it, I wish they’d gone further. I’m so tired of these reality dating shows like MAFS and 90 day sidestepping political issues. It is THE issue facing singles today.
I wish they’d done more to take down conservative men’s appeal to tOLeRaNcE. We can agree to disagree about taxes. We can’t agree to disagree about whether I’m a human being who deserves to make my own healthcare decisions.
The guy who insisted that he “votes his conscience” and implied that she must not vote with God in mind because she’s liberal had me seeing red. I wish they’d gotten into that on the reunion. If your god tells you to vote for women to die of sepsis in the hospital, we must worship different gods.
What format do the lawyers here use for their resumes? I have about 10 years of experience, with the last 6 being in-house.
My resume is still the “traditional” chronological format. I am seeing some recommendations, however, to switch to the more “modern” resume style, with a colorful area at the top, a concise description of what I do, add a skills section, etc.
What do you all think? Are you keeping the traditional resume format or did you update yours?
Internal Legal Recruiter here. Please for the love of everything keep it traditional, no color, no skills. You can add a description of what you do but you don’t have to because your resume should show that.
Currently inhouse and have gone through hiring process a few times in the last decade. My resume is traditional with a short “career summary” (~2 sentences) at the top of the resume. No color, no cute formatting, and no skills.
As the recruiters for in-house are often not super familiar with what lawyers do, I like the Summary to provide them with a short way to pitch me to their internal clients.
+1. Fifteen years in-house, three years at law firm. I have a short summary up top highlighting skills that match the job description. I’ve held many roles with my current employer, some of which better align with the job description in question, so I want to highlight those. I’m casually interviewing and in the three interactions I’ve had so far, the internal recruiters aren’t legal recruiters so I think this summary is helpful (I’m 3 out of 3 for making it to substantive interviews, FWIW).
Just did an intensive search and used a traditional format. The only modernization I did was to put bullet points under each job, which a recruiter suggested and then others said they loved once I did it.
I’m in-house counsel and currently recruiting. Traditional is my preference. I am not a bird or child attracted to bright colors. Lawyering skills should be apparent from your experience and a list of soft-skills you’ve assigned to yourself doesn’t give me any useful info. A concise description of what you do might be useful if your experience/specialty is somewhat unusual, or if your role is more integrated into business functions (for example, our M&A lawyer does a ton of work with our business development team that isn’t strictly legal) than typical and it’s relevant to te role. If it’s just linkedin-speak about being a business-minded strategic advisor working with cross-functional teams to deliver results I’m going to look right past it and depending on how bad it is, maybe roll my eyes.
I need some pronunciation help. Is it FATima or faTEEEma? Can it be either?
never guess. if this is so you can pronounce it correctly when speaking to a real person, i would ask… “I want to make sure that I am pronouncing your name properly.. ” who can argue with that?/
unrelated, but a company I interviewed with recently included in their scheduling tool a field for you to write the pronunciation of your name and an option to submit an audio clip of you saying it. As someone whose surname is mispronounced 90% of the time, I really appreciated it!
The latter, normally. My daughter has gone to school with 3 Fatimas and they all pronounced it that way. But yes ask the person in question.
I’ve only heard FATima
But that’s in English. If it’s another language background, all bets are off (think DA-vid vs. da-VID).
FA-tima is the classical Arabic pronunciation. Fatima was a wife of the prophet.
gah, daughter, sorry
This, I’ve only ever heard FA-tima.
Same, but I would still politely confirm with Fatima the actual person.
FA-tima is also a traditional Portuguese pronunciation. You’ll need to ask.
+1 I know several Portuguese Fatimas.
The latter is more typical, but is there a way to ask the person directly? (And regardless of the name or its origins, it’s good practice to do this anyway. I once emceed an event where someone was listed as Stephen. Pronounced STEEV-en, right? Nope, it was STEF-un.)
I live in Ottawa, Canada, and I’ve only ever heard people self-introduce as FAT-ima here.
I love that you specified Ottawa is in Canada despite it being the nation’s capital.
Like in the movie “Canadian Bacon” where they invade Toronto and then decide to go to the capital, Montreal.
Stef Curry?
In my experience if it’s Catholic it’s FATima and if it’s Muslim it’s Fateema.
If it comes up in other Christian contexts, I’d go with FATima but it’s unlikely to (I’m Episcopalian and all but one Marian apparition was after the split)
This is interesting. I have heard it both ways but this explains 99% of it. Thank you!
It can be either.
Going to Mexico City next month with a 6 year old and 10 year old. Recommendations? We are staying in Roma Norte. Do I need reservations for stuff like the Frida Kahlo museum or the river boats?
You need reservations for the Frieda Kahlo museum and it fills up quickly, so book in advance. Other than that, beautiful city and wonderful food!
For a spectacular show see Ballet Folklorico at Palacio de Bellas Artes. You will have to purchase the tickets at the door with cash. I believe the shows are on Wednesday and Sunday nights. If your kids are not terribly picky eaters then try a food tour through Eat Like A Local. Book an English-speaking tour guide to take you through the Anthropology museum – it’s not to be missed! And look into watching a puppet show at Zocalo. Also check out Chapultepec castle and the many craft markets. Love Mexico City!
What are we wearing over tops at work (now that the weather is warming up and the AC is about to kick back on)? I just made shareholder at my firm so I want to look presentable but I’m 5 ft 2 and cardigans read frumpy on me.
Blazers.
Short lady jacket. And congrats!
Knit blazers.
I’ve found some of the cropped, boxy cardigans actually hit just below the waist on my short self, which I think can be flattering and a bit more lady jacket-like. If you haven’t tried a cardigan on lately, maybe give it a go.
The Ever Eve dot com linen blazer. I bought one last year and wore far more than I thought I would and just bought another color for this year.
The Jcrew double breasted linen blazer. It’s more structured and dressier, but can work with jeans or pants.
I have an Aritzia bomber from the Babaton line that is short and works well with dresses/skirts or wider pants. It’s a casual style but it suiting fabric, so reads really modern.
I am not as short as you, but close, and these do not overwhelm my frame, despite having a more modern oversized shape.
Seersucker blazer gets a disproportionate amount of use.
Blazers, not knit and not lady jackets.