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Thursday’s Workwear Report: Lola Rib & Faux-Leather Midi Dress

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A woman wearing a maroon long sleeve turtleneck top and maroon leather skirt with red heels

Our daily workwear reports suggest one piece of work-appropriate attire in a range of prices.

This two-piece midi dress from City Chic looks like it’s better suited for winter, but I love the bordeaux color so much that I might be willing to grab it and stash it away until December. The bow belt is removable, but I think it’s the best part of the look.

If the deep red color isn’t for you, it also comes in black, but lucky sizes only. 

The dress is $90.99, marked down from $129, at Nordstrom, and comes in sizes equivalent to 12W-24W. 

Sales of note for 4/21/25:

  • Nordstrom – 5,263 new markdowns for women!
  • Ann Taylor – 25% off tops & sweaters + extra 40% off sale
  • Banana Republic Factory – 50%-70% off everything + extra 20% off
  • Boden – 10% off new womenswear styles
  • Brooks Brothers – Friends & Family Sale: 30% off sitewide
  • The Fold – 25% off selected lines
  • Eloquii – $29+ select styles + extra 40% off all sale
  • Everlane – Spring sale, up to 70% off
  • J.Crew – Spring Event: 40% off sitewide + extra 50% off sale styles + 50% swim & coverups
  • J.Crew Factory – 40%-70% off everything + extra 70% off clearance
  • Kule – Lots of sweaters up to 50% off
  • M.M.LaFleur – Earth Day Sale: Take 25% off eco-conscious fabrics. Try code CORPORETTE15 for 15% off
  • Madewell – Extra 30% off sale + 50% off sale jeans
  • Rothy's – Final Few: Up to 50% off last chance styles; new favorites added
  • Spanx – Lots of workwear on sale, some up to 70% off
  • Talbots – 30% off entire purchase w/Talbots card

237 Comments

  1. Has anyone watched Adolescence? What I really wonder if once a kid or young adult has started going down that pipeline how do you bring them back. Has anyone here dealt with this? What worked/didnt?

    2. I am skeptical that a kid from a good family with involved parents who modeled good values would really get that far down that path. I have a daughter in high school, and all the awful kids seem to get it from their awful parents. All of the decent parents have kids who are basically also decent. It really goes back to the basic values of respect for all humans that you teach them beginning in preschool. You can’t raise them as spoiled selfish brats until age 13 and then suddenly expect them to be respectful, compassionate humans. The few exceptions seem to be kids from good families who are unfortunately born with diagnosable disorders where you really cannot teach them respect and compassion. Those parents have a really hard time.

      1. I haven’t watched the show, but I do think it’s possible for kids with involved parents to become “radicalized” through media and peer groups. For an extreme example, read A Mother’s Reckoning by Sue Klebold. Dylan probably did have a diagnosable mental health issue, but most people who have diagnosable mental health issues are not violent…

      2. I have a teen on the spectrum who has been bullied to terribly that s/he is very susceptible to love bombing (or even just “positive attention bombing”) from manipulative kids. It can be so toxic, like trying to pull them out of a cult. For school, they have to have phones, but every night I review everything and it’s exhausting. Because there are no “good” kids interacting with my kid, the bad ones can slip in unchallenged by a kid who stands up and knows what’s going on and what’s clearly right and wrong.

          1. I don’t think so for all cases. A lot of kids were broken by the pandemic. Add in the normal divorce, toxic relationships, toxic friendships, inadequate mental health, and someone will break. Often with girls they do things that hurt themselves more than others, but not always.

          2. Wow. To hold such a simplistic view of a very complicated cultural phenomenon must be…liberating.

            Social belonging is one of the primary drivers of adolescent behavior. If you’re lucky, you are able to “belong” among positive influences. But if you’re not, the desire to belong is still there, and there are unfortunately some bad actors who will prey on that.

          3. I feel like you need to watch some cult documentaries. Not even to find compassion for others, but to protect yourself. ‘It can only happen to others’ is such a textbook vulnerability!!!

          4. I’m incredibly anti-manosphere and I don’t think this is true. Teenagers are still exploring the world around them and are highly susceptible to peer pressure. Unless they’ve actively engaged with and learned to identify the inherent misogyny (which is sometimes subtle!) before coming across these ideas spoken by people they look up to and which explain things to them in a way that is emotionally compelling and sounds intellectual, they may not feel that internal resistance or questioning that leads someone to reject it. For example, the idea that women be the primary caretakers of young children by default because they’re “better at it,” without realizing that this is due to socialization and/or the fact that they have simply been the ones caring for their baby so they learned how. I don’t know that I expect a teenage boy to assess this unless he’s been intentionally exposed to the opposite idea.

          5. I think it is remarkably narcissistic and naive to think “that’ll never be my kid.”

        2. Not just men. I think it’s any teen with any sort of issues. The sort of things that separate a teen from the herd makes them vulnerable in all sorts of bad ways. Predatory grooming, radicalizing, etc. You’ve read about teen girls who go become Isis brides. My guess is that something was wrong before something was wronger.

      4. Both these examples reinforce the point. The parent with the vulnerable child is monitoring and countering. It’s exhausting but she is aware of what’s going on. And Klebold had something seriously wrong with him.

        1. What was wrong with Dylan Kleibold? I know how the story ended but not how it began. Is there a short version of that someone could type out here?

          1. He was probably depressed. Based on diary entries, etc, one of the investigators/analysts put it that Dylan wanted to die and didn’t care if he killed, Eric wanted to kill and didn’t care if he died. Eric was supposedly the driving force and Dylan didn’t resist.

          2. I’m his age, so I remember this as a childhood thing, but wasn’t he one of those 90s kids who had a genuine obsession w/N4zis?

          3. Yikes. My kid is the troubled kid and has acquired a Very Bad Friend. They share my kid’s favorite class at school that I can’t imagine my kid agreeing to drop. I pray that they are not at the same college. Actively praying. I’m not a person who prays. And I want to slowly smother this tie but worry about teen bolting if I act directly versus covertly.

      5. I really disagree with this. I’ve known plenty of people who were perfectly fine parents and had terrible kids. I grew up with a bunch of awful bullies whose parents maybe could’ve been more involved but were nice enough people who were doing their best. One was a widow, super kind person, had her kids in therapy since their dad passed. One couple owned a successful local business and were always working but made as much time for their kids as they could. I once dated a guy with a kid with oppositional defiant disorder — a diagnosis I’d never even heard of — really caring person but holy heck was that kid a terror at times.

        1. Yeah this honestly feels like typical mom blaming.

          And parents honestly only have so much influence over what’s happening at school.

          1. Let’s say you have a troubled kid. Often, they self-harm. I know someone who has a kid with a lot of MH challenges who is also a cutter. There are very few MH resources when you have parents who struggle to cooperate, who both work, who are poor. Inpatient treatment is not really available and often incomplete. Community mental health resources are limited even if you have only one kid, a SAH parent, and unlimited time and funds. And if their harm isn’t self-directed, what can you do? You legally have to send that kid to school. You can’t lock them up. Seriously, how would you propose being able to stop something like this assuming you know who will do it, what they will do, and where/when it will happen?

        2. Yeah, my brother and I had the same upbringing and he’s the unstable addict, he’s always been a terrible person and it would not shock me if he killed someone. I related to the family dynamic in Adolescence a lot.

      6. You are not accounting for mental illness. By all accounts Louis Mangione came from a great family, for example.

        1. Whether or not you agree with vigilantism as a choice, Mangione seems like he came from a great family and doesn’t seem mentally ill.

          I know there are at least temporary considerations with certain kinds of brain injury or even brain tumor, but mental illness isn’t typically a risk factor for violence unless there’s the kind of psychosis that would directly explain it (like misperceiving family as threats).

          1. I know someone who seems to have some early dementia and it’s concerning how he acts. He is 40-50ish. And someone who is bipolar in his 20s. You can’t force people to seek treatment and they are generally lucid and rational. And it scary when they have episodes where they aren’t. Police just did a welfare check on the younger one and people in the apartment building were trrrfied they’d be shot in a suicide by cop misfiring of a brandished weapon. Can’t say I blame them.

      7. I really disagree. My kids are younger but I have seen several teens from “good” families have severe issues. You seems like the type of person who blames all of a child’s issues on the parents (let’s be real, on the mom), but SO much of it is genetics/personality. I’m of the mind that bad parents can easily f–k up a kid who would otherwise be normal/well-behaved, but it’s hard for good parents to create a “good” kid (don’t love that phrasing but don’t really know how else to say it) out of a kid that naturally has a personality that gravitates towards things like addiction, self-harm, eating disorders, etc.

      8. This is a way to blame the parents, often moms, for the outcomes of their children. It is also a way to insulate yourself from the possibility of a child being radicalized. The logic is that “I am a good person,” and therefore my child will be a good person, and good people are not radicalized. It is a simplistic approach. That is like saying “I would never fall for a cult,” when that is just not what happens. No one signs up to be a member of a cult, the indoctrination process is slow, often imperceptible to those around the person until they take an outward step that matches their already existent internal indoctrination. Highly recommend the work by Steven Hasan.

      9. This is such a myopic take, and not fair to parents. I know of two families, opposite coasts, where the families are loving and kind and inclusive and model strong values. One goes to religious services every week; the other is actively involved in community building. The families lean liberal but are not radical or overly politically active. Both have boys, now in college, who got good grades, were respectful teens. Both boys are now deep into MAGA lore and are seeking to break ties with their parents. The parents are heartbroken and don’t know what to do. (Yes, I know that I don’t have the full story as a friend, but from my view I honestly don’t know what else they could have done.)

    3. I just started it last night, and had to cut myself off at one episode or I might have been watching all night. It was gripping to watch.

    4. I’m pregnant with a boy and it was terrifying to me. I’ve read some articles about it. One suggested that having community outside of your nuclear family is a good way to defend against these harmful ideas. Another is to not censor kids speech but confront it head on. Idk how you do that with teens who don’t actually talk to you though.

      My husband meanwhile found the show impossibly boring (!). He has a military background so he’s definitely familiar with hyper-masculine atmospheres. He thinks this is nothing new and it’s just something young men have to grapple with as they grow up. Which definitely didn’t make me feel any better!

      1. I think there is a lot of value to having adults in your kids life other than their parents. As you said kids don’t always talk to their parents but they may be more open with a “cool uncle”.

        It’s not just hyper masculine. Military environment isn’t putting down women and telling you things like the 80/20 thing right?

        1. There’s really no one “the military” culture. It’s hyperlocal, and a person’s experience especially if they’re junior enlisted, is largely driven by their unit. Your squad and platoon will define your experience a lot more than attempts to influence culture and training from higher up. All this to say, the military is a cross section of the US, and these things absolutely exist.

        2. I didn’t mean to suggest that the military is full of incels. I didn’t even use the term toxic masculinity. I called it hyper masculine because I’m not aware of any other sector where you could work for 20 years and never have a female coworker, which was DH’s experience.

          1. I was military and there was definitely a rapey nasty element in my unit (well before “incels” were a thing). In the era of dont ask don’t tell, the gay guys were the safe ones to be around. Even among the married folks, the wives looked at us with suspicion, so there weren’t many welcoming women to become friends with. It was a tough time, and I hope things have improved somewhat.
            I worry that this administration will embolden the worst of it and negate any improvements.

          2. I’m curious what his job was… infantry? I am a veteran and I’d say my units (intelligence) were at least 20% women.

          3. Possible in some STEM sectors (especially startups) to never have a female coworker, especially if you exclude admin assistants and marketing/PR.

      2. I remember how during the parenting meeting for one of my tween’s activities, the leader talked about how a protective factor for kids is having relationships with at least two trusted caring adults other than the parents.

      3. I have a 12 year old boy and it’s wild, honestly. He was such a sweet, sensitive kid, and I feel like middle school and adolescence broke him in some ways. I’m still trying and I’m still optimistic he’ll turn into a respectful, smart, upstanding young man, but hooooo it’s hard! Kids that age have such strong feelings, and so much righteous indignation, and so deeply want to feel powerful and important. It really needs to be channeled constructively… right when the kids get less inclined to engage with their parents and more concerned about their social status among peers, and when they have their school time divided among many teachers who have a much larger pool of students, so they don’t feel as deep of connection to adults at school, either. Add in the Internet, and it’s just scary how easily kids can get swept up in questionable or downright alarming ideas. Sports is a haven, until it’s not.

        Adolescence has always been adolescence, there were just fewer ways to go off the rails in the past.

        1. And the algorithmic rabbit hole is so so strong. Teen boys have always been at risk for some strands of toxic masculinity but the speed at which you can get from a 13 year old who suddenly cares about that girl in math class googling how to use hair gel to wildly violent incel content is new.

    5. I teach politics at university level and I’ve never seen anything like it in 12 years of teaching. Really scary far-right views, very misogynistic, it sometimes manifest in aggression towards female students and staff.

      I’m currently on the train home from doing a talk at my friend’s school and it was terrifying. We’re in the UK, but I’m American so they were asking me questions and seemed offended I was very critical of Trump.

    6. It’s so scary. And so hard to keep up with the monitoring. Our school gives out Chrome books in grade 7 and kids are expected to have them in class every day. Plus there are iphones, ipads, and usually a personal laptop or chrome book. Two kids means checking like 8 devices each day and three kids is 12 devices. It’s untenable to monitor it all. We don’t. There’s content limits and time limits to the extent realistic and then spot checking and requirements to use devices in semi-public spaces or bedrooms only with the door open.

      BIL is a high school chemistry teacher and I remember him talking ten years ago about the stories his students would tell about the tech workarounds they had to avoid their parents, I’m sure it’s only gotten worse since then.

    7. Yes, I represent children who have been charged as adults for violent crimes. If you dig deep enough, you will nearly always find that there are secrets in seemingly good families. But even children who are raised with love and support are vulnerable once they hit puberty and they are more apt to take risks that are fatal or violent. Boys between the ages of 15-19 are at risk of dying from doing things like jumping off a roof to impress the others. Most violent children grow out of the behavior and that scientific fact is why the USSC said we cannot sentence children to LWOP in Graham v Florida and Miller v Alabama. A good resource is a book by James Garbarino.
      https://www.amazon.com/Lost-Boys-Sons-Turn-Violent/dp/0385499329

  2. Tell me about your credit card rewards that you love. Everyone I know seems to have Chase Sapphire Preferred. Is it the best? I pay off my balance every month and have excellent credit. I’ve never had a card with an annual fee, but I wonder if it would be worth it considering all the perks…

    1. I got Chase Sapphire Preferred this year. This is the first time I’ve paid for a credit card. I travel for work, and have gotten good benefits from the lounges. I also have used my $300 travel credit and will use the DoorDash subscription once it’s available. I also paid off my first years cost with points. So far it seems worth it.

    2. You want the Chase Sapphire Reserve, not the preferred. It has way more perks. The annual fee is steep, but there’s almost no chance you won’t make it all back and then some, with the annual travel credit and all the perks (by way of example, $5 monthly door cash credit, airport lounges, etc.). Totally worth it, in my opinion.

    3. I was raised that you never ever pay for credit cards because there are so many free options, but now I have a bunch of cards with a fee, including the Chase Sapphire Preferred (for free Doordash membership) and several airline cards. Most of them are pretty cheap (annual fee $100 or so) but I do have one $600 airline card that gets me lounge access.
      I’m a big fan of an airline card if you travel frequently. It’s really hard to get airline status without a credit card these days, and the status perks (economy plus seats, free checked bags, occasional free upgrades, better treatment in case of disruption/cancellation) are worth a lot to me.

    4. I am a frequent traveler, and almost always fly American as my home airport is one of their hubs, so the AA Executive World Elite has been well, well worth the (hefty) annual fee. I find the “while traveling” benefits pretty much cover the cost on their own, and then you add reimbursement for Global Entry and other per-month credits, it’s def a win.

      1. Echoing this. I’m also in a hub city and prefer American anyway, and I love this card.

      2. Is that what I keep getting mailers for? I finally got to Level 4 (the special gate) after years with the card. I was OK paying the $100 (make it back on free checked bags, which I do on family trips; work travel is tiny wheelie roalaboard only). I think with college / trips / parental and family leisure travel (hopefully), I am curious but hesitant. In Charlotte, so vaguely aware that other airlines even exist.

        1. The World Elite one is $600 and includes Admirals Club access. American has much cheaper cards that don’t come with lounge access but still let you rack up loyalty points. I wouldn’t get the World Elite unless you think you’ll make good use of the lounge (I would say at least 15-20 visits per year, because I don’t think a single visit is worth that much).

        2. If you travel infrequently enough that it took you years to get Group 4 boarding then I don’t think it’s worth it for you.

          1. I think that moving up is more based on spend vs travel. I take about one plane trip a month (direct same-time-zone flights, so not in the airport long enough to need a lounge IMO). But if it’s a work trip, it has to go on a work card, so I may get FF miles but I’m not racking up the big points you get from something like charging college tuition (a friend did that and how has the highest status).

    5. I sometimes wonder if this is a right brain/left brain conversation. I just don’t have the mental fortitude to deal with the thinking this requires. Plus I’d just spend more money and cook less if I had a door dash subscription.

      1. Kinda similar. We don’t really play the points game but have been happy with Amex Gold. Easy to redeem for gift card rewards. Good promotional offers on brands we buy.

      2. It doesn’t take much mental fortitude. You read 1-2 articles about the cards, pick one that offers appealing benefits, and then use it like any other card. Spending the short amount of time has earned me thousands and thousands of dollars in points – very “worth it.”

        1. I think the mental fortitude is keeping track of your points and optimizing them. I have the Chase Sapphire Preferred (not the Reserve, which has way better benefits) and do not think it’s worthwhile for me. I do better with cash back cards.

      3. My suggestion – you don’t have to be excellent at it. I rack up points over time, using a card that lets me cash the points in for what I actually want…airfare…and kind of leave the rest of it alone. After years of this, I am vaguely interested in understanding which cards will help me get into airport lounges. I do use the doordash feature, but only because chase made a point of telling me about it and automatically connecting my account…and only for work lunches, which I would buy anyways.

      4. Similar opinion here. I only have no-fee cards that offer cash back. We don’t travel much beyond camping road trips, don’t use door dash, and I’m not entranced by the concept of “saving” by spending more than I would have without a special card. Maybe that’s my lifestyle choice more than right or left brain.

        I do get several hundred dollars cash back each year by using cash back credit cards for purchases we would make anyhow, and I’m content with that.

        1. same, I think my spending levels are lower than what I see from others who talk about optimizing points that way. I don’t travel that much and we’re a small household, so I think it’s just a different situation.
          My small potatoes points accumulate on a free cc, and I wait until they have a points sale of the gift card I would use always (home Depot), then buy a bunch.

      5. I mean ultimately this *is* the credit card rewards brain game. They hope you get a card because ‘XYZ is supposed to be good’ then your spending habits change to ‘max’ the benefits. But you wouldn’t have otherwise spent that money.

        The best route is to seriously look at what you currently spend money on, then research a card based off that.

        1. I posted below but the only thing I’ve changed is how I pay, not what I pay for. There’s no need to increase your spending and that never enters the equation. But if there’s a choice between paying on the card (and then I just immediately pay the card charge) and writing a check, I’m getting the points every time.

          2. It helps me decide between equally good options. I could use any of the food delivery apps, but I get certain fees waived with door dash because of my chase sapphire preferred card, so I use door dash. Or, I’m agnostic as between teleflora or proflowers when I’m ordering flowers somewhere I don’t know a local florist, but I use teleflora because my Amex gives me cash back for it.

    6. It’s totally worth it. We charge absolutely everything we can can to it (never carry a balance, it’s for convenience and points) and take at least one free vacation a year. If you’re charging anyway, I don’t under why you wouldn’t get one of these. The benefits also cover the fee. It’s a no-brainer.

      1. Tell me more about what you mean by “free vacation” please!! Does it cover your airfare AND lodging? I kind of do the same right now for airfare only with a southwest visa – we earn enough points that combined with companion pass we can cover airfare for two family vacations/year at peak travel times…but we pay for everything else out of pocket. I’ve been curious if I could do better with another card, and especially one that provides lounge access.

        1. Yeah, airfare and hotels, a week or longer. We are high earners but I will charge literally everything I can to the card (basically unless the fee to use the CC makes it not worth it) like insurance, tuition, etc. so it adds up fast. Chase has a travel center you book through with discounted hotels and airfare. We also usually fly first. I just seriously do not understand why everyone doesn’t do this.

          2. Because not everyone is rich. If you don’t spend a lot of money, especially on travel, it doesn’t actually make sense.

          3. You don’t need to be rich, the fee is literally covered by things you’d buy anyway if you ever travel. Maybe you don’t get an annual trip but the points add up and don’t expire. You’re giving money away if you’re not doing this or similar.

          4. I love to travel and have several fee-based travel cards, but virtually all credit cards come with reward programs. You’re not leaving money on the table by not getting a Chase travel card and traveling with the points. If you have a different kind of card, you just get the points as cash back or spend them on other things. There’s no difference from a financial standpoint.

            And the Chase travel portal is NOT discounted for hotels and airfare. It’s usually the same or even more expensive than booking direct, and you should always book airfare directly because if the flights get delayed or canceled the airline won’t be able to help you as much if you’ve booked third party.

          5. I said “or similar” – of course it’s not the only option. And ymmv, I’ve gotten discounted and better classes of rooms and rewards at hotels through Chase than by booking direct and have never had a problem with flight rebooking.

      2. Totally a no-brainer. I have a friend who wants to travel more but refuses to get a new card with points (instead opting for some Macy’s guide she opened when she was 19) because it’s “too much research.” Apparently watching me travel to Europe for free isn’t enough incentive to spend the 20 minutes.

      3. It’s only true if you travel a lot. There are lots of years I don’t get on a plane at all, I don’t use DoorDash or Lyft, and don’t care about any other travel related benefits. I’d much rather have no fee cards with 1-5% cash back. You should get a card that matches your spending, but I’d avoid cards with fees unless you spend a lot on the things they’re best suited for.

        1. Same. If you are similar OP, I’d find a card with a flat 2% back on everything. Then, if you’re willing to devote a little more brain space, get another that has rotating 5% categories each quarter (things like grocery stores, gas and restaurants) and use them strategically. BoA also has a card that lets you choose what categories you want for 3% and 2% back. (I chose online shopping at 3% .)

          1. Fidelity 2% cashback on everything and deposits monthly into a brokerage account. Easy peasy.

    8. DH and I have 3 main credit cards we rotate between.
      – Fidelity credit card. It’s free for account holders and gives you 2% cash back on everything. The cash back is automatically deposited into any account you choose and provides a nice fund for activities or something special on vacation. We use this card for the majority of our spending–bills, home and car repairs, health care expenses not covered by our HSA, retail purchases. If I wanted to keep life simple and go down to one card, I’d keep this one.
      – AmEx Blue Cash Preferred. Costs $95 and gives you 6% back on groceries (up to $6000 spending on groceries), 3% back on gas, and some percentages on subscriptions.
      – Chase Sapphire Preferred. Costs $95 and gives 3% on travel, 3% on dining, and some percentages on subscriptions. It has great rental car protection too. I’m thinking about upgrading to the Chase Sapphire Reserved this year because we’re going to be taking a few large trips.

      I travel for work but use a corporate credit card so never get credit card points for work travel. I don’t bother with specific airline cards because my city’s airport is too small for me to bother with airline loyalty or lounges. I have thought about getting a Marriott card, but I’ve read it’s better to get the Chase Sapphire Reserve and transfer points to Marriott.

    9. I have the Southwest Rapid Rewards Priority card. The annual fee ($149) is way lower than the Chase cards and the miles cover all of our domestic flights for non-work trips. It works for me because I don’t value airport lounge access, I already have Delta status from work travel, and all the peripheral benefits (Ubers, streaming subscriptions, Saks Fifth Avenue credits) aren’t things I would use. I have sat down and calculated it and I would struggle to recoup the $600 annual fee.

      But … I do think you should take the plunge and find a rewards card that works for you. As long as you sit down and really look at what each card gives you, you’ll find the one that’s “best” for your spending patterns.

      1. I was in an airport lounge once and it was fine but I like to actually be at my gate and also to people watch. What am I missing about a lounge?

        1. The lounges vary, but generally there’s some free food (ranging from mediocre to good, rarely great), free booze, free coffee, work stations, kids play rooms. Sometimes showers and quiet places to lie down but that’s less common. The staff there will assist you with flight delays/cancellations if anything happens, and generally treat you more like a first class/elite status passenger even if you’re flying coach with no status. Unless you fly very frequently (20+ trips per year on the same airline), you probably don’t come out ahead financially on a club membership vs. buying food in the airport and finding a quiet gate to sit at, but I like the familiarity and the idea of paying upfront and then being able to eat and drink (coffee, I don’t drink alcohol) whatever I want without paying anything more. Same reason people like all-inclusive resorts, I guess. The people-watching in lounges is better than at the gate, I’ve seen B/C list celebrities several times (I guess A list celebs fly private, lol).
          Fwiw I’ve been in all three major airport lounges and I think Delta Sky Clubs > United Clubs > Admirals Clubs, but they’re all fairly similar.

          1. The real benefit of the lounge is immediate access to a live customer service human who can help you in a mass meltdown situation like afternoon thunderstorms in Atlanta or the CrowdStrike thing that happened last summer. In those situations lounges will be at capacity and they will stop selling day passes.

          2. That’s interesting. My life is such that I can work from anywhere, so I don’t have a burning Need to get home on time if there is some travel drama (which is fine — I can let those with needs go and I will probably arrive a bit later or just need to rent a car). Maybe overseas I’d feel differently, but in my time zone, I’m able to just be patient and wait.

          3. It’s not just about how fast you get home. I’ve seen situations where there are 2 hour lines at the regular customer service desks for hotel and meal vouchers, and 5 minute lines for those things in the lounge. I don’t usually desperately need to get home either, but I don’t want to spend 2 hours waiting in line for a hotel voucher at midnight, especially if I’ve been automatically rebooked on an early morning flight the next day.

          4. Being patient would have caused me to wait three days to get home during CrowdStrike. Being patient and not advocating for himself caused my husband to spend a miserable sleepless night in an airport.

    10. There are also a couple of experts in this area that I follow on IG or FB – the pointsguy is one (can’t remember the other right now). I’ve learned a ton just by reading their posts. I also follow a group for Delta Skymiles (I carry the reserve – expensive but worth it for us) on FB and have similarly learned a lot. I have never sat down and researched cards and points per se, but have absorbed a lot of knowledge from scrolling I would do otherwise.

      1. I just saw a notification that chase sapphire is currently offering a 100k miles sign up bonus. Good deal!

    11. Does anyone still have an AmEx platinum? I got it back when the rewards were superior to chase sapphire reserve – I already had a preferred – but I think they’ve shuffled rewards since then and I just haven’t kept track. I’ve kept the preferred because of door dash and peloton. Amex has some deal with uber eats, but uber eats is terrible in my area.

      1. I have it for lounge access. If you value that at $50 per visit, I make up the annual fee.

        And I just booked a RT to Tahiti on points + $61 so I find playing the game worthwhile. I have a Delta AmEx Gold because I fly Delta a lot. I use that for restaurants, groceries and Delta travel, which is enough for me to get a $200 voucher that makes up for the $150 annual fee. I have a Costco Visa I use for Costco purchases and gas, an Amazon Chase I use for Amazon (5% back), and the Platinum I use for basically everything else for membership points that I redeem for travel.

        What I have stopped doing is chasing airline status. Not worth it any more.

  3. A friend is having a milestone birthday party with about 50-60 guests at a casual venue. Would gifts be expected or not? I assume a card with gift card is a safe bet, right?

    1. I give a card with a bottle of wine or a nice box of chocolates for something like that.

      1. Unless I know that the person really likes a particular retail store, I’d go with a box of nice chocolate.

    2. If a friend is hosting a party outside their home I would bring a gift. Either a bottle of wine or liquor, a gift card to a restaurant I know they love, or a salon/spa gift card if I know where they like to get massages or their nails done.

        1. Lol, it’s not a strange answer. Lots of people would rather skip an iffy social event than get something wrong. The invitor, presumably an adult, should spell out “no gifts” on the invitation.

    4. I find gift cards a little trsactional for friends and peers. I’d get a nice card and a consumable, and then watch other people entering the venue to see if they’re carrying gifts or not. If not, leave the consumable stashed away and give the card!

      1. This is such a personal thing, though, and I don’t think you can assume the recipient feels the same way about gifts as you do. You don’t need to dump your own hangups on your friends.

        1. I think it depends on the type of gift card — I’ve gotten my brother and sister-in-law gift cards to nice restaurants and that’s gone over well.

    5. As the host I would not want 30 bottles of wine or boxes of chocolate. I vote no gift, just a card.

      1. I hosted this party for my husband. A few people brought gifts, a few more brought cards, and most brought nothing. Cards with personal messages were appreciated, but nothing was expected. The gifts were mostly the kind of stuff you’d expect when people are struggling to think of a gift but think one is required. I’d skip the gift unless you think of something particularly funny or perfectly tailored to your friend’s interests.

        1. +1 on skipping the gift
          A thoughtful card is lovely, but really just showing up for your friend at their party is the best gift.

      2. As a frequent host of events at home, I would absolutely welcome 30 bottles of wine! Means I don’t have to buy alcohol for my next few parties.

    6. Depending on how well you know the person, I would go with:
      – something consumable, sourced locally. Thinking chocolates/coffee/tea/candles/bath soaps from a local shop
      – a piece of small jewelry from a local shop. In my city, we have a gallery that sells local crafts, and I’ve bought small jewelry items (think interesting earrings) there for several friends
      – nice card or small piece of art, again can be from a local artist.
      – gift card to a restaurant/wine store/spa
      – bottle of high-end champagne or adult beverage of choice

    7. I’d expect people will give gift cards to nice restaurants and bottles of wine or scotch. Some folks will bring just a card. All will be welcome; none will be necessary. People throw parties because they value your company. Have fun!

  4. What do you say to your boss when work travel is required and you’re expected to share a room? I do not want to share a room for many reasons, but I technically could (no disability accommodation, etc.) It’s not like our budget isn’t tight, but this seems uncomfortable for everyone involved.

    2. I’d ask about the possibility of having single rooms. I might say something like – I prefer to have my own room, is that a possibility?

      If it’s a no go and I feel really strongly, I’d pay for my own room. (Or the difference, if that works out logically).

    3. I would have no problem sharing a room with a female coworker and have done that before. Of course I prefer a private room, but I don’t think sharing with a same sex coworker is a disaster.

      I am in the minority I guess but I would never use my own money for work travel, and would refuse a trip before I’d pay out of my own pocket for work travel.

    4. Offer to pay the difference between a double and a single? I would hate room sharing, too, OP.

    5. It is mind boggling and gross to me that this is still a thing. Longtime employment lawyer here and this is a recipe for disaster on so many fronts. Don’t ask, tell. “I’m not comfortable sharing a room with a co-worker; what are the options.”

      2. In my industry, where going to a conference is a perk not a requirement, this would result in not being allowed to go. But if you do not want to attend, I suppose this would work.

    7. Yikes, I’m surprised any company does that. I’d tell your boss that you’re not comfortable sharing a room – if the budget is that tight, maybe everyone doesn’t need to go.

    8. You say no, you will not be able to attend a meeting where you have to share a room. If it helps, reframe it: it’s your job to communicate with your employer that you are not comfortable with this.

      Source: have done this in the past when a mixed-gender AirBnB was proposed for a work trip. I said no and we got separate hotel rooms instead.

      1. That’s interesting. What was wrong with the mixed gender AirBnB? That seems separate enough (assuming locking bedroom and bathroom doors).

        1. First of all, I don’t think most airbnbs have true locks on bedroom doors. They might have the privacy locks that most residential homes have, but that’s not a secure lock, it’s easy to even accidentally break those.

          Second, bathrooms. Most airbnbs don’t have an en-suite for every room. I’m not sharing shower facilities with coworkers of either gender unless there is a secure lock involved (my old office had a single shower, which was fine).

          Third, even if you can control for all of that, you’re still behind closed doors in a more relaxed homey space with a coworker. It’s rife for harassment issues.

          1. I’m now feeling like we expect a lot of teens on sports teams and in travel clubs and college students who live in dorms and crowd into apartments (often sharing a bedroom even off campus). IDK if parent chaperones share rooms (I thought they usually did to help stay in budget, but didn’t bed share like the kids do).

    9. We expect teens (who are the size of adults) to share beds on trips. IDK what magically happens at 18 or when you are an employee, but if it’s so bad for adult workers, why are we sharing intimate spaces ever outside of families and friends chosing to do so?

        1. IDK we expect teen girls to change with boys in their locker rooms and have them rooming with them in school and activity trips if they identify as a girl. How are adult women so precious if we expect teen girls to just shut up and deal with it?

          1. Please show me evidence that teen girls are expected to change in front of biological boys.

          2. OMG really? This has been going on for years in my city where people hate it but dare not speak up. Never mind college sports like swimming where it has been well-publicized in the news, also for years.

          6. Whoever posted the link above–I actually live in Deerfield, IL and my stepson went to the middle school referenced. The locker rooms have private changing areas. No one is forcing anyone to change in front of each other. Anyone living here knows this.

            That’s a parent looking to push a political agenda because she discovered a child doesn’t match gender and the result is both children are now victims of this. I find it absolutely disgusting how folks tried to make this a national story when it is a complete nothing burger. And it only made me more aware of how desperate some people are to make trans some sort of bogeyman that we must hunt down or something. Just because someone files a lawsuit doesn’t mean it has merit. A quick Google backs me up:

            https://abc7chicago.com/post/shepard-middle-school-student-deerfield-claims-she-had-change-front-transgender-classmate-officials-say-untrue/16053192/

            Disgusting bully looking to make the news.

        2. It’s really not. It’s worth evaluating what we object to, societally, and making sure we’re consistent with everyone not able to make their own choices. Not one set of norms for me and a different, conflicting set of norms for you.

          1. But they’re not adults?

            We’d never round up a bunch of adults and send them to school each day on threat of truancy either.

          2. Think of college students who are teens then. Hall bathrooms. If you have a suite bathroom, it locks on the inside of the bathroom but not to keep people from coming in from the shared suite bath. I had someone come into my room from the en-suite bath. Drunken guy who hooked up with my suitemate. Could have ended very poorly.

      3. You don’t see a difference in the relationship between teenagers who are teammates/classmates and two co-workers?

        1. I can see a difference where there is seniority, but often high schools have 19YO seniors due to red-shirting. A big teen boy can be >200 pounds and a small 14YO freshman can be <100. And in a room of 4 teens sharing 2 beds . . . I put my money on that being easily more potentially abusive than with two co-workers sharing a room but not beds.

          It may all be bad. But why do we make it bad for kids, who really rely on adults to protect them? See the troubled teen post above. It matters.

      4. Because size isn’t the core consideration?

        Asking teens to share a bed on a trip that’s optional (meaning a vacation or camp situation) is very different than adults who work together for reasons other than “size”.

        Also I’ve never been on a trip with other girls my age where I had to share a bed, so even this assertion that “we” ask teens to share a bed odd.

        1. Big city public school parent here. On all of my kids’ middle school field trips where the whole grade goes, the kids were 4 to a room. IDK any budget or other hotel with 4 beds in a room. My guess is that it was 2 queen beds.

          We don’t do travel sports though. But for kids who do that, those trips seem to be mandatory for playing time or staying on any sort of competitive team.

          1. Hotels often have two beds and a sofa bed. If one person desperately doesn’t want to share a bad with others they could bring a sleeping bag and sleep on the floor. I agree it’s common for same sex teens to bed share on school trips, but I think it’s avoidable if it’s a really big hang-up for someone.

      5. This is such a weird take. Legal adulthood and being an employee make all the difference from liability standpoints (at the very least). It has nothing to do with body size.

    10. Unless you’re a grad student traveling to a conference on a grant, room-sharing is not a workplace norm. I would push back. I would not pay for a single room but would skip the trip if asked to share.

      1. Even in grad school, I don’t think it’s the norm. My husband is a professor and has had at least two male grad students for most of the last decade and to my knowledge they’ve never shared a room at conferences. A lot of conferences have dorm-type housing where the room is really only designed for one adult ,so it eliminates the issue.

        He does do a lot of hosting and staying in the homes of out of town collaborators when they or he visits to work on research, which is kind of annoying to me as the spouse who gets the hosting thrust upon them, but I do’nt think it’s inappropriate. Everyone has separate bedrooms. And someone could get a hotel if they wanted – they usually just choose to do this because it saves grant money.

        1. Yes, we always shared rooms at conferences as grad students, and most of the post-docs did as well.

          The conferences we went to in the biological sciences or in medical research fields were huge international conferences. You stayed in hotels and we often put as many people in a room as possible to save $, as we had a small stipend that had to cover everything (plane ticket/registration/housing/food/taxis or transport etc..).

          The example you are giving is a very unique, small conference, and not the typical graduate student experience. Those are rarely attended by typical graduate students in the sciences.

  5. Years ago, one of you recommended the Maybelline Color Tattoo eyeshadow and I’ve been a fan ever since. It is a solid that I can easily apply with a fingertip, goes on evenly, never creases, stays all day. Sadly I think they are discontinuing this. Does anyone have a similar product they love? My skin is on the oily side and most other eyeshadows I’ve tried are hard to apply evenly and then crease within hours. Thanks!

    2. Maybe the Mac paint pot?

      I have oily eyelids and have accepted that I have to wear eyelid primer for my shadows to have any lasting power.

    3. I like the Laura Mercier eyeshadow crayons for this and Wirecutter just suggested the Elf eye shadow sticks for a cheaper version.

      1. I have the Bobbi brown once which I love and stays on all day (it is often the last makeup left on my face). I tried the ELF one (twice, in case I got a bad batch) and it was not good (tugged badly and rubbed off quickly).

    4. I like the NYX eyeshadow crayons. They hold up better for me than Laura Mercier or Bobbi Brown.

    5. I’m north of 50 and started using Estrogen on my face (google it) and it’s made such a difference. My skin feels more dewy and glowy.

  6. Ladies 40+ – what’s the biggest thing you’ve done to level up your skincare? Already daily with my sunscreen use.

    2. I have the acne-type of rosacea, so getting that treated. I think my skin is an oily visible-pore and acne scar mess that is just ruddy (and doesn’t wrinkle, but the lower face sag bothers me a bit). A neighbor who is maybe 15 years younger than me (and may have been drinking) cornered me at a gathering to tell me how great my skin works, so also: we are our own worse critics sometimes.

      1. I think Botox would make me look older.

        Retinal and a urea based moisturizer is what I’m using currently.

        1. Don’t get your face frozen like a reality TV person. I’ve been getting it for years and no one notices but me. I also have veneers but they’re not that unnatural white you see on TV, they just look like nice even toned straight teeth.

          1. I have no doubt that it can be done well, but my skin looks okay as far as wrinkles go, and I worry more that sometimes I look tired.

      2. Botox isn’t for everyone. I’m mid-30s and I don’t suit having a frozen face (I’ve tried botox – even very small amounts). It makes me look older when I have less expression.

    5. OTC differin daily, lasers to address melasma/pigmentation, RF microneedling, and a red light mask.

    7. Haven’t done it in forever, but IPL laser completely helped my skin texture. I get Botox now. And I also think vitamin C every once in a while is a game changer. The biggest thing though was learning to double wash–I use Ponds followed by Vanicream soap. I didn’t realize for way too many years that my adult acne was likely due to not having my face completely clean from makeup. Truly an oil based is not enough nor a soap. Both together are the magic that keeps my skin perfect now. I also use Merit face oil under my foundation. I’ve gotten compliments on my skin–it leaves it like glass.

    8. Lasers: broad band light for redness, sun spots and stimulating collagen, MOXI for gently resurfacing.

    9. Red light mask. Already religious about sunblock, so next to that, I’ve found that it does help. I have sensitive skin so use retinol instead of prescription Tretinoin, and don’t do Botox or lasers. I use mine every day. I use the Omnilux: https://omniluxled.com

  7. I spent a year being the meat in the sandwich generation, which reduced my exercising to the bare minimum (walks). I’ve only gained <5 pounds, but my shape has rounded to the point where now that it's time to flip my closet and the 2024 clothes technically fit but not well (dresses) or strain and are uncomfortable (pants). I've rebought pants. Weight seems to be in my stomach.
    Should I only have hanging in the closet what fits today (and re-try-on a month from now)? I am wanting to put winter (mostly all new pants for those temps) items away but either need many more bins because those bins have not-fitting warmer weather items in them.
    Some fit-and-flare and rufflepuff dresses are about the only things that have made it through this.
    This year, one parent has died and the other has moved to my city, so I'm a bit optimistic that my activity levels will go back as they were (hopefully with size to follow — if not just vanity, I actually liked those items).

    1. I love your handle and feel the same way. My condolences on the loss of a parent, sounds like you have been through a lot. After hitting my fifties I have found it a lot harder to lose weight and it has gathered around my middle (Wanda Sykes has a funny bit about this). I’ve kept clothes thinking I would get back into them but unless I pack them away seeing them makes me sad. Ultimately, I decided to purge and focus on buying things that fit better. So I suggest having only things that fit today. There’s a stylist I follow (Jennifer Mackey Mary – Every Day Style) who says that your closet should reflect who you are today and not be a museum of who you used to be and I agree with that.

      1. +1 to Jennifer and the everyday style school. Another thing she has said is that it’s not you…it’s the pants!

    2. I would say yes to only keeping items in the closet that fits, but I find it hard (especially if something is close to fitting). Is there a way you could whittle it down to only one or two new bins, instead of a bunch?

    3. I am generally someone who doesn’t keep anything I do not use. However, if you have clothing that you like and would wear again and considering how you’ve described the last year of your life, I would keep the clothing that doesn’t currently fit. If it still doesn’t fit in a year, then it goes. In a year, you’ll know where your body is settling for this life stage and can make decisions.

    4. Surely the Trump voters here are smart enough to see that today is a Very Bad Day, right? When every economist agrees this is an idiotic move? Unless you are the .5% who will be buying up everything on sale, I guess…

      I can objectively understand how he duped people to think he’d be good for the economy, and elections are always about the pocketbook. But now it has to be clear the emperor has no clothes, manufacturing is never coming back other than perhaps with robots, and this is certainly not the way to improve an economy? At least for people of above average IQ and any level of critical thinking skills.

      Seriously not trying to excoriate anyone for their vote, you did what you thought best (I will charitably believe). But surely this is not it?!?!?

  8. Any recommendations for nitpicking/lice removal services in the DMV? Preferably Virginia.

      1. I don’t have kids but recently learned from a colleague with kids that this is, indeed, a thing. Apparently a good provider of this service is very effective and valuable.

      2. Yes, it seems like lice have evolved to withstand the drugstore shampoos. They can now be challenging to get rid of.

      3. Yes. My sister has someone come to the house whenever her kids infect the household. It takes forever and costs about a thousand dollars for her household.

    2. Have not used any personally, but recent recommendations in my town’s mom’s group include:
      – Lice Clinics of America (expensive but very effective; Herndon and Falls Church)
      – Lice Removal Nova (Falls Church)
      – Lice Happens
      – Lice Stoppers (licestoppers.net)
      Good luck!

      1. Lice Ladies is good in suburban Georgia

        Way back in late 80s or early 90s, a sibling came home from sleep away camp and our whole house got lice. I remember such a sense of shame – you said it in a whisper, and tried not to say it. Nowadays the parents talk about it on social media, in the classroom parent groups “Jane has lice so everyone with long hair should wear hair in braids” or “oh the 1st graders still have it, I hope it cleared the 3rd graders”

        I prefer it this way! Just deal with it publicly, this too shall pass

  9. I am in a real slump. I hate my job, I’m looking for a new one but it’s been so hard and feels hopeless. I’m unhappy all the time and have no energy. I see a therapist regularly but tbh I feel like therapy just makes me feel worse because it’s an hour of dwelling on my problems. I already take anti-depressants. I wish I could afford to quit my job, but I can’t. I don’t know what I’m asking for here…I haven’t told anyone IRL how depressed I am and I’m really looking at faking that I’m fine. Taking time off hasn’t helped.

    2. Hugs. In addition to reexamining therapy and meds can you also try to squeeze in nutrients food, outdoor walks, sleep and connection with people? I don’t pretend to know what will help you but when I commit to these basics it really helps dark clouds part.

    3. Switch therapists! Do several consultations before picking one — you deserve for your help to help.

    4. I feel this way too—depressed and hate my job, struggling to find a new one. Talk to a friend or family member about how you feel. Even hearing just a few words of encouragement from someone who knows and loves you is a relief. Build some weekly anchors into your life that uplift you and hopefully surrounds you with positive, kind people. To me, that’s church, but it could a yoga class or a walk with a friend. You won’t necessarily feel like going but try it anyway. Also, think of some mantras to say after negative thoughts. After thinking “I hate my life” you could think, “everyone struggles sometimes.”

  10. Surely the Trump voters here are smart enough to see that today is a Very Bad Day, right? When every economist agrees this is an idiotic move? Unless you are the .5% who will be buying up everything on sale, I guess…

    I can objectively understand how he duped people to think he’d be good for the economy, and elections are always about the pocketbook. But now it has to be clear the emperor has no clothes, manufacturing is never coming back other than perhaps with robots, and this is certainly not the way to improve an economy? At least for people of above average IQ and any level of critical thinking skills.

    Seriously not trying to excoriate anyone for their vote, you did what you thought best (I will charitably believe). But surely this is not it?!?!?

    1. Maybe they never believed he would do anything beneficial, but they were caught up in the feeling of belonging as described in the Adolescence discussion above.

    2. I’ve said this before but it bears repeating: most people, even highly educated ones, do not have a good grasp of every law, tax, mechanic and interaction that goes into our government and the economy. Instead, we put our trust in our elected leaders to achieve broader goals without necessarily involving ourselves in the specifics of how it’s done. That goes for voters on both sides. At this point, Trump still has the trust of his voters that his techniques whatever they are, will get the results they’re looking for. Trump will not lose that trust until there is something more concrete than an economist on “biased media” arguing differently. And we’re not going to see any pivot from Republicans until this hurts his base. Buckle up.

    3. I have them in my network. They are happy and believe this is all still a good thing. Comments I heard.. short term pain for long term gain.. they believe the numbers he put on that chart that are just bonkers wrong.

    4. No, they’re literally brainwashed. Trump could take a sh*t on their mothers’ heads and they’d find a way to justify it. They also like seeing other people in pain.

      1. This is how the ones I cannot avoid seem to operate. They salivate about him enacting vengeance against everyone else (who they seemingly hate for the sole reason that they are not just like them). They seem to think that any moment they will witness some glorious comeuppance for all those Others, and that the pain they themselves are experiencing will magically evaporate.

      2. I totally believe that for most MAGAs (I’ve fallen into a bad habit of reading Fox News comments…) but I was hoping the people with actual economic knowledge and 401ks might be different. Eg, the people who know Trump is a lying liar but still voted for him for whatever reason, but now see he’s not bluffing.

        (Side note, all the headlines about analysts et al being “suprised” at the extent of the tariffs…seriously?? This administration’s mascot is a chainsaw. Of course they were going to be absurd.)

        1. Guess what, those people still want to see other people in pain. The cruelty is the point, as they say. There’s nothing more complicated to it than that.

  11. I could use some help on disconnecting from and protecting oneself when your spouse is a slug and in a downward spiral. I’ve made a ton of progress but some things have happened and it’s getting to me this week, so I realize I need to disengage further but also want to stay married.

    Background: Had a baby in late 2022. DH always wanted to be a dad, was super excited, etc., but I think has struggled to adjust to parenthood. I had awful PPD which I realize isn’t an excuse, but acknowledge I was a terrible person to live with in 2023 and my return to work after maternity leave was incredibly difficult due to some factors at work. I almost committed suicide twice in late 2023/early 2024 and was literally contemplating it on a day to day basis. DH knew this but continued to pile on and in the meantime his drinking ramped up.

    In early 2024, with the help of therapy and some deep work on my part, I realized there was no one in my life who cared about me for me and not what I’m going to do for them that day. DH agreed, saying he needs me around to take care of our daughter. I decided my daughter is the only person who really needs me and she deserves a healthy, present mother. I put better boundaries in place at work, got more aggressive about working out, eating healthy, and drinking less, and I feel have generally been in a better place. Been reading a lot about managing emotions in the moment and not controlling others which has helped me mentally and I think at work as well.

    Meanwhile, DH’s drinking has ramped up and his tech company has been going through reorgs which I get is stressful. I’m sick of fighting with him about getting off his GD phone to have a conversation, take a shower, etc., but daily I hear he doesn’t have time to work out, his job is so stressful, woe is me the world is against me I deserve better, everyone and everything is working against him, I’m the fun police, blah blah blah. It’s hard to hear about his daily work stress and him refusing to change anything (maybe go to bed earlier and don’t drink during the week so you’re able to focus on a 9am call)?

    Also, his job is legitimately less stressful than mine – I wfh a few days a week and he exclusively wfh so I see it, he definitely doesn’t work 40 hours most weeks and with the cutbacks in tech I’ve told him he has it very good and would have a hard time finding a job that’s going to pay $300k+ with RSUs if he loses this one. My base + bonus is higher so we depend on my income to pay the bills.

    Being a mom is it’s own thing, it’s tough but I’m two years in and I’m committed to being the best mom I can be for our daughter. However, I’ve realized I look forward to work and working out these days.

    DH says I don’t enjoy spending time with him and it’s true, we had a date last night to a game and he was a constant fountain of complaints about traffic, parking, the other fans, etc., that left me wondering why I bothered to gift him with tickets. He threatens me with divorce every few weeks and says he’ll leave me when DD is older and now I’m like, just go for it, I don’t care. My parents divorced when I was young and I don’t want that for DD, plus when I was in my PPD hell my mom said if we divorce she’ll support my husband and not talk to me, so that doesn’t help.

    I know many will say I need to just file for separation and I don’t want to do that. Even if that’s where we’re headed I don’t want to be the one to do it. I think I’m looking for advice on how to compartmentalize and live in the same house while maintaining my sanity and improving my own mental health.

    1. You mentioned that you were in therapy and that it helped. Are you still getting support?

    2. I’m so sorry that you are going through this; it sounds so tough. First, I am glad that you decided to stay here. You matter to people, including your daughter. There can be better days ahead. Second, I hear that you are not ready to take the step to move forward with divorce/separation. I want you to know that it is not the act of divorce itself that messes with kids, it is how parents conduct themselves through it. So absolutely keep working on yourself and building your strength, so that when you are ready, you can be the bulwark against negativity for your daughter. It sounds like you do not have much support from your husband or your own mom. That sucks and I get it. Here are some resources that were instrumental to me in lifting my head above the waves to see what was really going on: Lundy Bancroft’s book, “Why Does He Do That.” I cannot see whether your husband, or your parent, is abusive, but this book is eye opening and worth the read. Melody Beatty’s work was huge for me in separating my own well-being from that of my now ex-husband. The blog Captain Awkward introduced me to the idea of “if everything stays exactly as it is, right now, how long would you be willing to stay?” Great blog for learning boundaries. Finally, know that there is light down the line. Stay here. Stay with us. You can handle one step at a time.

    4. This is a really hard season of life and you have every right to feel frustrated and alone. I don’t know if it’ll get better but I do think sometimes marriage requires a degree of grinning and bearing it. I don’t think you’re wrong to not want a divorce immediately. So what can you do:
      – Dates that involve some activity and not conversation. Think a glassblowing class not wine tasting. When one or both partners are stuck in complaining-as-conversation, you need to find a way to have fun together and feel positive about each other — and dates where you’re staring at each other across a table are not it.
      – tell him he’s complaining too much. Set a timer and give him 20 minutes or whatever to vent, then he has to stop and say something positive about life. It could be that it was a nice day outside, or we’re getting that rain we really needed, but it has to be positive.
      – go to bed when he starts drinking. You won’t have to be around it or deal with him.
      – you say no one cares about you – where are your friends? If you don’t have close friendships then invest in the acquaintances you’d like to know better and use your workout time to try to make more friends. Maybe suggest a happy hour for parents of kids at daycare?

      1. I agree. I tried to compartmentalize and lived with it for more than ten years, and it never worked and I was never anything but miserable. Leaving was hard but ultimately being on my own (even as a single mom, which i have also done) was so much better than being in a bad marriage.

      3. +1 I was in a similar place and when my kid was 2.5 I finally called it quits and it’s SO MUCH BETTER I CANT EVEN TELL YOU.

    6. Have you ever heard the phrase “it’s better to be from a broken home than to live in one”? Your feelings are understandable, but you won’t help your daughter by staying in this marriage.

    7. I’d work on exploring why you don’t want to be the one to do what needs to happen. Is it shame, grief, anger at all of your work and him not doing enough? A feeling of failure? Something else? You have family trauma about divorce, but surely this partnership isn’t what you want your child to emulate?

    8. “Even if that’s where we’re headed I don’t want to be the one to do it.”
      Please explain.

    9. i’m sorry, but for lack of a better word, your mom sucks. Why would she support your husbdand?!? also, PPD is a thing for dads too. Or it can be. It sounds like he could potentially have been suffering from untreated PPD.

    10. “plus when I was in my PPD hell my mom said if we divorce she’ll support my husband and not talk to me, so that doesn’t help.”

      Wild guess: you married someone who treats you like your mother treats you.

      Divorce is better than this, I promise.

    11. If he doesn’t want to improve your relationship ASAP, you need to divorce ASAP. If you know how to fight nice, you have a sit down conversation about how the day has gone most days, and a once a week strategy meeting. If you don’t know how to have a reasonable conversation about how to better support each other anymore, divorce.
      I’ve got a toddler and my husband and I pretty much never fought before the kid, but there’s just less time and space and higher expectations of support from each other. It’s hard when you still love each other but are playing into the gendered division of labor, I can only imagine how hard your situation is.

    12. I can’t figure out the logic in having a date night together. It just reinforces that you don’t like each other, at all. So I would stop scheduling more date nights.

      I realize you are venting and we all do that, but I would try cutting out the name calling and swearing (“slug” “GD phone”) in your thoughts and writing so that they don’t bleed out into your tone and what you say. Kids can pick up on the tension even if you never slip up. Plus there’s the risk that she overhears more than you realize.

      Other than that, if you aren’t ready to move out, then it’s time for separate bedrooms.

    13. First off, huge hugs for overcoming PPD in such a healthy way and I’m so grateful you’re still here with us.

      To answer your question, from the situation you’re describing, nothing that your DH is doing sounds insurmountable. From your description, he’s depressed and drinks too much, and complains about his life without doing anything about it. Lots of people stay with people like that, and lots of other people who exhibit those attributes manage to have an awakening and overcome them. If your stated goal is to stay with him, and to try to improve things, there’s hope there.

      The first step is finding out from him if he actually wants to work on things. That would require couples therapy and individual therapy for both of you. It sounds like you’ve spiraled into mutual contempt for one another, so I do think you may have to look at your own role in how you’re communicating with him if you actually want to stay together. In a calm, neutral context, say “I love you, I want this to work, but neither of us are taking steps to make it a longlasting and loving relationship. Would you be open to couples therapy? I’m sorry for my role in this and I want us both to get better.” It can’t be: “You’re a slug who won’t get his act together and you complain constantly and I can’t with you, get help.” It sounds like there has been a lot of mistreatment from both of you, and he may still harbor resentments and be assuming a defensive posture. It also sounds like you may be exhibiting a lot of contempt toward him presently, which is a recipe for a relationship falling apart. If you truly want to work on it and get better, you’ll have to own up to your own role in things and choose to create the kind of relationship you want. This all sounds fixable, but you both have to want to fix it more than you want to fight with each other and punish each other.

  12. Anyone been on a Norwegian fjord cruise and have thoughts or advice to share? We’re thinking about one for next summer but not sure it will really appeal to our kid. We have one elementary schooler who isn’t particularly outdoorsy and doesn’t appreciate scenery but generally goes along with things she finds boring, especially if there’s a treat or an activity she enjoys more afterwards. She’s been on one cruise and really liked it, but I’m a little apprehensive about her being bored on the boat if swimming is not an option due to the weather, which seems like a real possibility. I mainly care about scenery. DH would enjoy doing some light hiking as a family if that’s available (I’d be fine with him going off on his own to do more intense hiking but he doesn’t want to do that). I know an Alaska cruise is probably more kid-centric, but DH and I had a spectacular multi-week trip there shortly before our kid was born (a cruise, plus a bunch of land-based stuff) and aren’t very interested in going back. The Norway cruises we’re looking at also go out of Amsterdam, which is appealing since it’s one of the few major European cities I haven’t been to.

    1. Decades ago, I went on a cruise + train trip called “Norway in a Nutshell.” I was 22 and on a tight budget, so it was only a few days, but I’m sure there are nicer versions. Gorgeous country, we encountered some really lovely local people (I was traveling with a friend of Norwegian heritage and we stopped in a town the same as her last name, she was scouting churchyards for ancestors and people invited us to their homes), and I really enjoyed the whole thing. We spent extra time in Oslo and Bergen, and there were opportunities along the way for light hiking/exploring. I would definitely recommend it! but I do remember Norway being very expensive in general.

    2. I did a two week solo road trip of Norway a few years ago. It was a great trip with some beautiful hikes. I think your kiddo could enjoy a trip to Norway that includes some fjord cruises, but might not enjoy a trip that’s focused around the cruise. Oslo has a beautiful park with a big lake with ducks, you could probably feed the ducks? I’m sure there’s kid focused stuff to do. The train in Flam was fun – gorgeous scenery and there were a lot of kids on it. Bergen was very cute and has a tram that goes to the top of a mountain where there is a little park, a lot of kids there too. I’m sure you can do all these things with a cruise ship but then you’re stuck with a mass of people everywhere you go. It’s much more fun to get to explore at your own pace. And then you can spend more time doing stuff your kid finds interesting.

      1. There are loads of nice parks in Oslo, but you’ll find that the city council asks that people don’t feed the ducks, so please don’t!

      1. I read her sometimes too. I will say her kids had an extremely high tolerance for wandering around, shopping, and restaurant meals, if blogs are to be believed!

      2. Thanks, I read her too but had forgotten they went there. I agree on her kids (being portrayed as) having an unusual tolerance for things that aren’t typically kid-friendly, and those things don’t really interest anyone in our family anyway.

    4. Yes, we did this last year on MSC in Yacht Club sailing out of Hamburg, the Copenhagen and three days in the fjords. We had plenty of time on our day trips to do light hiking as well as the usual recommended tourist spots in each place. We sailed in early June, so weather is transitional for sure. Some days lovely, others raining, a brief snow shower in Flam, that sort of thing. The other consideration is cruising in the North Sea is no joke. As an example, the indoor pool was practically surfable one evening. My family was just fine (husband+three kids) but most of our travel companions had a good bit of sea sickness. The people utilizing patches early and often were able to continue on as usual.

      Feel free to post a burner email and I can answer any questions you have.

  13. I need to put myself out there more for a job hunt. I’m in a niche enough and senior enough level that my next job isn’t likely going to be posted on linkedin. It’ll be word of mouth and retained searches. I have the retained search side pretty well covered, but the networking is where I need help.

    I have many professional contacts from my former role (one I’d like to get back in to) that I’d like to let know that I’m on the job market. How do I go about telling them I’m on the hunt? We are perfectly friendly but don’t have a lot of overlapping business needs today. I feel like a one-hour coffee with each feels like overkill but maybe that’s just what I have to do. Thoughts or suggestions? If I saw these people enough I’d just mention it in passing, but I don’t, unfortunately.

    1. This is where a quick linked in or email message is your friend. it feels awkward at first, but you get used to it. The trick is to offer to treat them to coffee to catch up and mention at the same time that you’re looking for a new opportunity, and to please let you know if they’re aware of anything that might be a good fit.

  14. My confession of the day is that I’m envious of my spouse. Two years ago, he switched careers and managed to get a unicorn of a job that was created for him. He’s super happy at work and in his daily life. Perhaps relevantly, we used to be in the same large public organization, though not in the same department and our roles never overlapped. While he needed to leave (bad boss, workload that had gotten out of control), I miss having him as a work comrade. If I had frustrations, he understood it on some level even if he wasn’t experiencing the same thing.

    I am super unhappy in my job and have been for a long time. I feel overworked and underappreciated. And stuck. The salary would be hard to replace (trust me, I’ve looked). I also need the flexibility that I’ve earned, especially in my current life stage. I have also spent nearly my entire career in this organization, which means my professional network is very insular. It feels nearly impossible to tip anyone off that I’m looking without outing myself. I did it to myself, I guess, but this situation worked well enough until it didn’t.

    The market is awful right now. There’s not much to even apply for (small market), and I’m concerned about getting into an even worse situation without the perks I enjoy now. So I soldier on, unhappily.

    Anyway, when it comes to talking about our day, DH has so many positive things to say about his. And I’m happy for him, truly! But when he asks me about my day, I don’t say much anymore other than “it was fine” because I don’t want to be the complaining, venting spouse. He knows I’m not happy, but he doesn’t need to hear about it every day.

    I keep telling myself that work happiness is cyclical. But I am envious that my DH comes home cheerful (the man literally whistles as he walks in the door), while I feel completely burned out.

    1. You need to talk to him. That’s how you grow apart if you don’t. You might be surprised and find that he’s still the work friend too and he’s got a network you can also tap.

      1. Yeah, don’t just not tell him what you’re feeling because you assume he doesn’t want to hear it.

    2. One thing my husband and I have learned is that it’s much easier to carry the other person’s burden than our own. The stuff that is heavy for him is usually much lighter for me and visa versa.

      And your spouse should be a safe place for venting and talking about ways to solve things! Don’t hide your feelings from your husband, you should be partners and you should be able to talk to him about your frustration.

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