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Updated: Apr 14, 2021 354 Comments · by

Wednesday’s Workwear Report: Pleated Sweater Skirt

The Personal Shopper (TPS)

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Our daily workwear reports suggest one piece of work-appropriate attire in a range of prices.

This sweater skirt is a great choice for early spring and will transition nicely to warmer weather. While it’s still a little chilly, I would wear this with a black turtleneck.

Once it warms up a bit, I would wear it with a bright, short-sleeved sweater, like this green one, also from Banana Republic.

The skirt is $119 full price, but Banana Republic is currently offering 50% off everything, which brings it down to $59.50. It's available in sizes XXS–XXL and also comes in blue. Pleated Sweater Skirt 

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Sales of note for 9.30.24

And some of our latest threadjacks here at Corporette (reader questions and commentary) — see more here!

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About Elizabeth

Elizabeth is a 30-something lawyer living on the East Coast. She spent seven years as a Biglaw associate in NYC, three years as a partner at a medium-sized firm, and is now in-house counsel for a large company. She loves Diet Coke, '90s sitcoms, and dresses with pockets.

Comments

  1. Good Morning!

    Yesterday was an election in Wisconsin but the results won’t be available until next week. Thanks to everyone who votes!

    In other politics news, presumptive challenger Amy McGrath outraised incumbent Senate Majority Leader Mitch McConnell last quarter. That’s good news!

    In news of the weird, a bunch of unusual designs appeared on a beach outside a woman’s house. Due to quarantine nobody was supposed to be on the beach (article in Spanish, with pictures). https://www.elimparcial.com/amp/espectaculos/Impacta-a-Lila-Deneken-extrano-mensaje-en-playa-de-Rosarito-20200407-0098.html

    Here’s an article on “moral fatigue”: “Whether it’s trying to decide if you should visit a sick family member, order delivery, take public transit, or take a trip to the grocery store, we now have to think through the potential implications of many of our totally normal, everyday actions and decisions in a way we never had to before, because of how they could affect others.” https://www.rollingstone.com/culture/culture-features/corona-exhausted-moral-fatigue-974311/

    and a little snark https://reductress.com/post/i-think-this-is-all-a-blessing-in-disguise-says-woman-who-has-been-too-high-to-read-the-news

    How are you doing today? I found a local bakery that will bring me cupcakes and I am REALLY looking forward to that!

    • lsw

      One of my favorite donut bakeries that is in another county partnered with a coffee shop that’s much closer and I’m headed there to pick up some contact-free donuts on Saturday. We miss donuts! Also very much looking forward to coffee we didn’t make ourselves. There’s just something about it.

    • anon

      So, my husband is coping with all of this by being a little like that ‘blessing in disguise’ woman, and I’m trying to roll with it (we all need to be indulged in our non-harmful coping mechanisms right now, I think). It’s really grating on me, though, and as I get increasingly sad and irritable it’s harder and harder to let it go. Anyway, not really asking anything, just wanted to vent and say that the reductress article resonated with me in an unexpected way!

      • Anonymous

        Consider that you two might be feeding off each other. I’ve noticed that when I’m around people who are oozing sadness and anxiety, I instinctively bring in the more rational and positive to counteract the wall of negativity, irrationality, and darkness that is coming at me. I’m pretty sure that, were I your husband, the more sad and irritable you got, the more determined I’d get not to get trapped in that myself, and the more positive I got, the more sad and irritable you’d get in order to shut me down. We’d probably escalate in bad ways if we were shut in together.

        Maybe talk to him and see if this dynamic is happening for you guys?

        • AnonATL

          I do this too. Even before all this, my husband deals with anxiety that causes some minor depressive episodes. I used to try to overcompensate with cheeriness thinking that it would help lift him up somehow. Spoiler alert: it did not.
          I now know we both need boundaries at tough times like this. Simply ask if there’s anything you can do to help, and then go about normal life. At least that works in our household. Sometimes it ends in nights where we isolate to different parts of the house because his sadness is too much for me, and he needs to process it in a way that I can’t help with. We aren’t perfect by any means, but it helped to have a conversation where I said I want to help and I feel like I can’t. I needed to hear him give me permission not to fix it.

    • No Longer Anon

      I’m really sad. I live alone. I’m high risk. I haven’t seen anyone for more than a minute or two but the two people who work at the coffee shop by my apartment for weeks. Although it was a risk for everyone, I had been planning to visit family this weekend and we decided yesterday that the risk was too much until maybe Mother’s Day. I’m lonely. And we have almost another month of shelter in place. I talk with my family a lot, I talk with my friends, I talk with colleagues but I want a hug, and my mom, and just generally human interaction of people I know.

      This all sucks.

    • Anon

      The callouses are starting to peel off my feet. I don’t wear ridiculous shoes to work, low heels at most, but apparently all my feet want to wear are slippers. After 3+ weeks of nothing but slippers, they are reverting to their natural babyfeet state.

    • Anon

      I’m not doing well. My husband is a very anxious person and I’ve run out of patience with him. He worries that someone is going steal some of the 100+ cans of food in our garage, he thinks we need to stay 50 feet away from anyone while we’re running with masks, he freaks out at the thought of take out food or, god forbid, walking into a bakery to buy a baguette. I feel like I either have to acquiesce to his unreasonable (to me) demands, or get into a screaming match about why I think he’s over-reactiing. I am so worn down by everything.

      The article about moral fatigue was so helpful to put a name to this decision making. I’ll ask him to read it.

      How do you deal with an unreasonably anxious person? If you are the anxious person, what helps you get a grip?

      • No Longer Anon

        My (critical care/pulmonologist) doctor (in seattle!) told me everyone is probably going to get it at some point. Also, he told me that he is pretty sure I won’t die. While neither of those things were reassuring at the time, his very blunt delivery helped me realize that he’s not worried about me as long as I‘m careful. I have a chronic lung disease, so being careful is a bit of a higher burden for me but he said it was fine to get coffee and takeout, food delivery, take walks as long as I don’t come within 6-8 feet of people when at all possible, etc. Mental health is important here too and he wants his patients, probably all of whom are anxious, to protect our mental health as well as physical health. And part of that is going outside and existing in the world right now while taking reasonable precautions.

      • Anonanonanon

        I think some of his worries are reasonable and some are not.
        I am high risk (immunocompromised) so I am not risking delivery or going into businesses right now. I have asked my husband to only eat “home food” as well for the next few weeks. Yes, everyone will probably get it eventually, but I would like to stall it as long as possible until there are hopefully antivirals or at least more ventilators.
        Being worried about someone stealing cans from your garage seems like a worry that is entering into the unreasonable territory. Also, do you have to run together? Can you run separately? Then, he can take the precautions that make him feel comfortable, without burdening you with them. Is he ok if YOU walk into a bakery? If so, don’t make him if he’s not comfortable! Otherwise, do you, get your baguette, and he doesn’t have to eat any!

      • Senior Attorney

        OMG I was married to somebody like this and it’s really hard. Hard not to get caught up in the anxiety, hard not to get annoyed with him even though it’s not his fault. Sad to say I never did figure it out but hugs to you.

    • Senior Attorney

      We had a big grocery delivery yesterday, which I’d scheduled more than a week ago and been waiting for with bated breath, and I remembered to include a bag of Cadbury Mini Eggs so plainly that was the highlight of the week, if not the month. Wildly overtipped the guy and he was very happy, which made me happy.

      In other news, I already had that bright green BR top so of course I had to order today’s featured skirt.

      • Anon

        What is wildly over tipping? I’ve been giving anyone who delivers a $20 and now I’m worrying I’m being cheap.

        • Senior Attorney

          I originally did $20 on the app when I thought the order would be in the $150 range. Then after adding things all week I handed him another $20 in cash at the door (which is what made him happy — he’ll probably be REALLY happy when he sees the app). Then I discovered I could increase the tip in the app so I raised the tip in the app to $55, I think. So it ended up being about 25% on a $300 order. Maybe not, on sober second thought, wildly overtipping at all given that he put himself at risk to bring me food.

    • anon

      Good Morning – I love you but I really wish your morning salute would remain non-political. Politics during this is just annoying, not supportive.

  2. Velma

    I feel vaguely depressed every time I see cute work clothes, like this skirt or the majority of my closet. I’ve packed away most of the clothes I exclusively wear to the office (part of a seasonal shift anyway, so not that big a deal–although who knows when the bag for the dry cleaner will get there)–and demoted my pumps and heels. Loafers, sneakers, and comfortable pants are front and center now.

    No wonder Banana Republic is running a “rare sale.” Beyond the need to focus on essential shopping only, I can hardly bear the thought of adding more to what now feels like excess.

    • AnonATL

      When I first started working from home fulltime years ago, I mourned all my pretty clothes and shoes that I no longer had a reason to wear. They are still mostly in storage bins in my closet for the occasional client meeting or event, but I sure do miss them. There’s something incredibly powerful about wearing *that* outfit that makes you feel beautiful and strong. Shopping isn’t nearly as fun when all you really wear is tshirts and jeans..
      It feels extra hard now with this going on. I usually wouldn’t second guess treating myself to a pretty top or dress for the occasional date night from sales like this. Now I’ve got our wallets buttoned up so tight, I even debate the necessity of some of our grocery purchases like ice cream.
      It’s tough to see it now, but we will have occasion to wear our favorite clothes again. I’m just imagining how amazing everyone is going to look at their first day back in the office after dreaming up outfits for a few months.

    • Anonymous

      I’d like for sleeved t-shirts that look good on camera but are just better cut/quality but still can go in the washer and dryer.

        • Good Morning!

          >why do Americans not wear this look as much?!?

          Because it looks like a kindergarten teacher????!!!???

          • Good Morning!

            I can’t edit my comment but I feel sort of bad about posting it. Dresses and leggings are awesome, they are comfortable, and as someone who went to high school in the 80s I’m all about leggings and flats etc. I got triggered by the tone of “dumb Americans never thought of this obvious solution”.

          • pugsnbourbon

            I’m straight up wearing overalls today and I have three video calls. In fairness, I was once a preschool teacher.

          • Good Morning!

            PnB, I got dressed AFTER posting my comment because I was still in my bedclothes, haha. Overalls sound awesome!

          • Anon

            It actually really screams to me “Hippie” or “retiree” – it’s just not business casual. But I embrace the Hippie look when wearing tunics + leggings and rock it several times a month. Especially as someone with certain bodily insecurities it is a life saver.

          • anne-on

            Ha, I have to run around after/with a smallish child and a dog most days. I am totally ok looking like a kindergarten teachers while I WFH, as it is still a MASSIVE step up from our managing partners rocking baseball hats and sweatshirts on our all hands zoom calls.

          • Ellen

            Yes, I agree. I would LOVE to be able to wear an a-line skirt, especially pleated, but the manageing partner perfers that I wear sheathe dresses and one’s that are much tighter, so that people can appreciate that I am both smart and feminine.

        • Anon

          The Boden link kind of looks like a dress to me. Not a fan of it with jeans or leggings.

          • anne-on

            It would be VERY short as a dress. Solidly mid-thigh on me (5’4). I prefer leggings personally (see above re dog/child) but I could see a younger person wearing it with tights!

        • small town girl

          I don’t like that with jeans. Unless it’s way shorter than it looks, I would wear this with black tights for a winter outfit

        • Anon

          I love the look and I wear a lot of dresses with leggings despite most people here hating on the look.

        • Worried

          I look at my pretty clothes now and they remind me of pre pandemic times, but at the same time I know it’s trivial too— if that makes sense.
          I wear dresses and tights for work 90% of the time though most colleagues dress casually in jeans and athleisure. I teach seniors in high school and I got a kick out of the kindergarten teacher comment. Whenever I used to go shopping, I would ask my mom or husband if the outfit looks like a kindergarten teacher:) I do wear dresses and black cotton leggings on weekends when I’m out and about, as I’m just more comfy in dresses.

          I miss my work clothes, but I realize it’s not that important for me now, and when I go out to walk around the neighbourhood I Wear one of the same three sweater and stretch jeans/leggings/ skirts that I’ve been rotating and washing.

          Right now I just wear my house clothes as I am working from home. I always change when I come home— been doing that forever. If there is a meeting with camera, I will wear a nice top. I wonder if moving forward, what I will buy for work, or if I will veer towards other styles. Right now I can’t tell.

        • Anonanonanon

          Because in most workplaces that would not be acceptable business casual, a lot of workplaces actually ban leggings in the dress code. Totally comfortable and cute for home, but would scream “therapist” in the workplace IMO.

      • pugsnbourbon

        Sorry anon @ 9:22, none of us actually gave you any shirt suggestions. I find that the Target brand Universal Thread t-shirts are really nice. Some Old Navy ones are nice as well. I have a couple 3/4 sleeve striped tops from them that have held up really nicely after a year of regular wear. I wash on delicate, dry on low.

    • Anon

      I’m having mixed feelings about my shopping and my existing wardrobe too. If I can be 100% shallow for a minute, I feel like I don’t know what’s going to be in vogue after we come out of this. Will short, structured haircuts be in because we were all stuck at home growing our hair out? Or will the wild, hippie styles we reemerge with be what’s chic? Will this be the demise or the ultimate victory of the bushy brow?

      • annienomous

        Hm, well, turns out that what I needed to lift my spirits was to think shallowly for a moment. I’ve been feeling really down all morning but, somehow, contemplating whether this will be the demise or ultimate victory of the bushy brow genuinely cheered me up.

      • anonymous

        I wonder too if things are going to go in a completely opposite direction where everyone is sick of athleisure and now wants to get dressed up for every day wear. Are we going to embrace a more natural look (e.g. brows, nails) or run back to the salon immediately to get fixed up?

        • Never too many shoes...

          As someone who dyed her hair from a box yesterday for the first time in 20 plus years and will likely cry later today when clipping her very long manicured nails down, I will be at all the salons and spas just as soon as they open. I have like less than zero interest in embracing a more unenhanced aesthetic.

          • PolyD

            I don’t do manicures but I can’t wait to get my hair cut. And will be making a big effort to wear clothing I might have shied away from for being too fancy or formal for work (essentially no dress code in my office). Carpe fancy!

      • Anonanonanon

        Saaame. I have a rent the runway membership I need to pause because we don’t even have video calls so truly what’s the point. For the first time in over a decade I have just… stopped caring what I’m wearing for the most part. I don’t know if it’s because I’m veering into depression or because I have a heavy response role so am the busiest I will probably ever be in my career.
        I have been wondering what fashion will come out of this, too. Will we all wake up and realize fashion is a silly and shallow obsession and lean into being more utilitarian with our clothes? Will we relish the opportunity to express ourselves with fashion and embrace it as an art form that allows us to make a statement to the strangers we’ll be seeing for the first time in months? Which brands will survive and which will fold?

    • Anon

      I have a beautiful and expensive work wardrobe that I just moved to the hall closet and populated my main closet with casual to business casual clothes.

      But it turns out I’m only wearing things from my dresser drawers, the same few things over and over. I love the Levi stretchy jeans and black pants, so I wear those with some sort of tee or top and one of three seen-better-days long cashmere cardigans.

      All my shoes are in the closets too, ranging from dress shoes down to sneakers. But all I’m wearing are my Birkenstock clog slippers.

      I haven’t even opened either closet in at least a week.

      • Anon

        Same. One of the things I love about the house we moved into a couple of years ago is that I have a big, beautiful walk-in closet with a window. I loved going in there and seeing all my work clothes nicely and neatly organized – previously I’d had a teeny tiny closet and it was always messy. Now, the only reason I go in there is to put dirty clothes in the hamper or get the dirty laundry to put in the wash. Everything I wear now is in my dresser, I don’t even need to gather hangers to hang my clothes when the wash is done. All my lovely things are just sitting in there with no place to go, including the white bag I bought thinking I would be going places and looking sharp this spring. I actually get sad looking at it. I realize there are much bigger problems in the world right now but I love clothes, and this is one thing I am sad about.

        • Anonanonanon

          I think that makes perfect sense. Some of us bought items with a picture in our minds of what this spring/summer would look like for us, the places we would be going, the people we would be doing things with, the occasions we would celebrate, etc. Seeing those bags, clothes, shoes, whatever is a physical reminder of what we had planned for ourselves and how different reality is now.

          • PolyD

            I feel like this, too, but one thing that has helped a little is to realize that I often have items I don’t get to wear in their natural season (as I shamefacedly admit I ave way too much clothing), even in the absence of a pandemic. So they get their turn next time that season comes around. Granted, I am not super stylish so none of these things will look particularly dated in a year.

            I do wonder about the wide crop pants, though. I bought a black pair that I really like, just before we all started working from home. They might be a bit heavy for summer, but hopefully the style will hold on until fall. I didn’t really like this style at first, but now I kind of do. In fact, I ordered a pair of stretchy pants from Amazon that are the wide crop style, and they are very comfortable and I like how flowy they look.

          • No Longer Anon

            I bought a pair of wide leg crop pants on sale from Uniqlo a couple summers ago and I am shocked how much I wear them and how versatile they are. I wear them probably once a week from May to September (both to work and on the weekends) and I’ve also worn them to multiple dressy events with heels and a cropped blazer. I love them. I am really considering buying a very similar pair but with a laser-cut pattern around the hem from betabrand on Poshmark but they’re expensive. :/

    • Peanut

      Some might flame me for this, but I bought a sale ($55) very soft cashmere tunic, no-button cozy style in a gorgeous soft denim blue color to wear to WFH. This was after wearing a zip up athletic jacket every day for a week. I’m wearing it today. I miss my work clothes that make me happy and this cashmere tunic makes me happy in the same way. And the tunic won’t be just a WFH purchase, I can wear it on the weekends or to visit friends, sob, when we are allowed to do that again.

      • Anonanonanon

        That sounds lovely!
        I ordered some midi skirts from Lou & Grey. Jeans and non-work pants hurt an old surgery scar if I wear them all day sitting (like I do for WFH), and all of my work pants/skirts are too formal for home. I’m looking forward to having them to wear when I walk around the block with my kids. I’m not ashamed that I spent some money on clothes. People can’t complain the economy is going down in flames and then be upset that we put a bit of money into it!

  3. UHU

    Hello! I’ve been diagnosed with a frozen shoulder and using virtual physical therapy, exercises, and ice/heat as treatment. Anyone who’s gone through this with stories and tips they’d like to share would be appreciated. I’m rather nervous at maintaining this immobile state for years. Thanks!

    • Mrs. Jones

      I didn’t but my husband had one. It released after 2 months (incl PT, exercise etc.), if I recall correctly.

      • Junior Associate

        Same for my father, who was otherwise super healthy and muscular. It took a lot of everyday therapy and diligent stretching, but he hasn’t had an issue since.

    • Anonymous

      Frozen shoulder survivor here…I feel you. One of the most painful things I have ever experienced. I tried everything…physical therapy, acupuncture, massage, chiro, etc. What finally cured me was a friend telling me what cured her…pilates, one on one, with a really good pilates trainer. It took maybe a year and it was not cheap, but I was so limited in my movement, and generally in so much pain, it turned my life around.

    • Beaglelover

      A cortisone injection relieved the pain enough for me to do the physical therapy, but yes, it took awhile.

    • Anon

      Experienced twice, in the same shoulder. For both times, physical therapy of several months while continuing the pilates with modifications I was doing already. Very challenging mentally but with the grind of the physical work, it got back to full range of motion. Stick with the work even when you don’t want to. You can overcome!

  4. Anonymous

    im pretty sad about the death of John Prine. If anyone likes folk music/Americana I would wholeheartedly recommend his music. It’s haunting and real and sometimes silly.

  5. Homeschooling

    I work FT. 2 kids. Spouse works FT.

    Could someone please tell the teachers at my kids’ school that if they send out Zoom meetings, they are sending them to the parent (elementary school aged kids). I can’t log two kids in at one time because we have one home computer . And if you put a password on your Zoom meeting, you need to *send* that out to parents or at least be responsive when the parent asks you to send it?

    I am about to call a gap year for them.

    • Anon

      This doesn’t solve your teacher problem but you can zoom from your phone too. If both kids need to be on at the same time could you have one be on the phone? My district gave kids Chrome Books to use at home and Comcast made sure there is internet in every house yet they still aren’t doing live classes online. It’s a huge debacle on my town Facebook page. Half the parents think they should be (and I guess those parents think the kids will just dutifully sit in front of their laptops to partake in live class while the parents work) and the other half think participating in live class is too stressful right now for the kids.

    • Anonymous

      Teachers don’t have any experience in remote meetings, as I’m finding out quickly! But they are learning. Try and be patient. Remember the first time you tried to learn WebEx? I definitely remember trying to figure out how to schedule an Outlook meeting and also how to deal with sending the toll free number (back in the day when it mattered).

      Our district is offering loaner Chromebooks. Is that an option for you guys? And/or do they have ipads or kindle fires or even an old cell phone you can hook up as wifi only? You can access Zoom from all of those. If you are in an area that is closed until summer and it is in the budget, you could spring for a Kindle Fire. A Kindle Fire 7 is $50 on Amazon right now and your kids can Zoom from it. We bought one of the kids ones for $70 for my kids to do their Zooming on and deleted all the games and stuff.

      • Anonymous

        In my city public schools don’t give out chrome books except for middle and high school students. Nothing for K-5. I think for the older kids they should have gotten them but can understand why for K-2 you would be happy with just having them do reading and some math.

    • Anon

      You guys need to get a chrome book for the kids. One home computer is not going to cut it during these times.

      • Anon

        Yes, this is one of those problems you can throw money at to make it go away. FYI for those with Costco memberships, Costco has laptops that would be very appropriate for kids for between $300-$500 right now. If you’re a member, the laptop comes with free tech support through Costco.

        OP, if you can’t afford to buy something, contact your kids’ school/school district as ours has taken all the laptops they can find and reinstalled them so they can be given to families who need them. Our mayor has also said if people contact City Hall they will help people find equipment to use.

        • Anon

          I bought one. You can’t custom order anything and expect to receive it any time soon, but look for what’s in stock at a place like Best Buy and order, or do curbside pickup, or like the poster above, brave Costco.

          • Anon

            I ordered online from Costco and the computer took about 10 days to ship, but it got here. My personal laptop’s hard drive crashed completely, unresurrectable, and I don’t want to do my personal business (banking, health portal logins, posting on Corporette) on my work laptop.

    • anon

      Our district made devices available to any family that didn’t have one device per kid available. Did you email the teacher? I asked DD’s teachers to turn on google classroom guardians and they were super receptive.

  6. Anonymous

    In this difficult time let us all spare a minute for that dude obsessed with button down shirts who loves posting on here. Today’s casual mood must pain him.

  7. First 5 things back game

    Here are my nominees for the first 5 things we get back:
    1. Shoe stores (right now, walmart and target are the only game in town, but my kids have growing oddly shaped growing feet and we love the shoe measurers at the good shoe stores). You can’t really fake it with shoes that fit poorly. Seems to be a lower-foot-traffic kind of a place.
    2. Tennis courts. If golf is OK, why not tennis? My city parks often have them and I played with my kids, we wouldn’t be adding to our germ spread. Gatherings of <=5 are still OK in my state. Even a doubles game should be OK.
    3. Outdoor seating at bars and restaurants. Make the fire marshal limits 1/4 of usual. See if it works.
    4. Car dealerships. Service is open. Dealership floors and lots are huge. Not seeing an issue with crowds here.
    5. Museums and galleries. Not usually crowded. You can distance and if that's an issue, limit attendees.

    And I wish: barber and haircutting places. My kids have straight hair and I don't dare try to cut it. And I will eventually need a trim.

    • Anonymous

      1- passive use parks

      2- retail stores with occupancy limits

      3- we all get permission to stop social distancing with 2 or 3 people

      4- the ok to hire in home service people including nannies, babysitters, and cleaners

      5- offices

    • Lily

      The problem with all of your suggestions (except maybe tennis and shoe store) is that people use restrooms while they are there, and unless you’re telling me that someone will be disinfecting the restroom after every use, the virus will spread quickly that way. Also, restaurant tables – will someone be disinfecting the table/chairs after every use, and will all dishes/glasses/silverware be washed at temperatures high enough to kill the virus?

      • Anon

        I didn’t take this to mean that all these should be open now, just a fun thought experiment about what to open up first. The world will reopen one day (and I’m not a person who says social distancing is worse than letting the disease run its course), and it’s kind of fun to daydream about what could realistically open again at some point!

        I dream about going into a small, cozy store and just wandering around and touching things…

        • Anonymous

          I don’t know about the five things that *should* re-open first from a logic perspective, but the five things I *want* are: coffee shops, my hairstylist, greenhouse… Actually I don’t need five. Just those three, and I’ll be happy. I’d also go for outdoor trails with their normal usage, not this new over-usage that rivals the first week in January.

      • Anonymous

        My dad owns a restaurant, and honestly, I’m not sure he’d reopen if it’s 1/4 capacity. Maybe half. They tried doing take out only for a few days but ultimately, it was more expensive to keep it running than to shut it down. But yea, I really miss sitting down in a restaurant, even like, Panera or McDonalds. I can’t believe how many dishes two people go through when you’re making/eating all your meals at home.

        • Anonymous

          +1 my mom closed her ice cream store. It has no indoor seating but it will not be profitable without foot traffic.

        • Anony

          For the two of us, I’m running the dishwasher every 3 days AND DH is handwashing pots, pans, etc… not to mention, he’s gone all day – self-employed, essential service – SO.MANY.DISHES!!

          • Peanut

            We’re running the dishwasher every day and it’s just two of us eating every meal here. I’m stress-baking cookies, pies and gourmet meals since we can’t eat out.

        • Senior Attorney

          And of course our dishwasher decided to stop drying the dishes yesterday. Gah.

      • Anonymous

        People can wash their hands though. If there is soap and paper towels I think they are fine.

        And I’ve never had to go at the hair salon so maybe that can come back sooner (because I don’t want people to be so desperate as to go underground and possibly get sicker or lose their licenses).

    • Anonymous

      Adding: stuff won’t ever be no-risk. But if Home Depot is still open and also Target, I don’t see the huge risk of other stores like nurseries and shoe stores and maybe things like clothing stores. Kids grow. My size may be larger as well. I can mail order stuff but that is so burdened that I’d rather save that for high risk people.

      • Anon

        Home Depot and Target aren’t open bc they’re low risk operations. They’re open because they sell essential goods.

          • anon

            because no one will die, starve, or have ill health effects if shoe stores are closed for a month or two.

            for the handful of parents of kids who desperately need new shoes during shelter in place, they can order online.

          • Anon

            You also can get shoes from places that are open. Shoe stores are specialty stores. Shoes are still available.

  8. Anon

    Any ladies with larger chests have suggestions for lounge bras? I am a 34G and have the Cosabella Curvy Sweetie, which I like, but am hoping to find something that isn’t lace.

        • Monday

          I ‘m a 32F and busty size 1 works for me in the non-triangle styles. (Triangle styles are too small despite being the same size.) Busty size 2 might work for you.

      • FFS

        I’m a 36J and highly recommend these. They include the conversion kit with the bras and they are amazing. I’m still wearing mine that I got almost two years ago even though I stopped nursing last summer. I’m honestly considering buying more because I haven’t found anything comparable, but they’ve changed the sizing a bit and I’m not sure what I need (and not inclined to buy and return things right now).

        • Peanut

          How does the conversion kit work? The description doesn’t say that a kit is available so I’m skeptical but it looks like a good item.

          • FFS

            I honestly haven’t tried it – I don’t even think about them being nursing and the clips aren’t a problem. Mayve they changed the style and don’t offer it with the conversion clips anymore.

    • Anon

      The coobie full size. Take out the pads. Not a huge ton of support – I wouldn’t go running in it, but perfect for work from home or yoga.

    • Housecounsel

      True & Co. bras in the “full cup” version are decent. Make sure you get the D-DD version and not the regular. I am a 32F and wear the Small. There is a really pretty blue color at Nordstrom.

      • AZCPA

        I second the True & Co – I have several styles and they are super comfy and I don’t feel like I’m adjusting all day (30E and I wear an XS).

    • Ms B

      Not a lounge bra, but I have a number of Anita sports bras (both underwire and tank style) for working out and they are SOOO comfy. Available on Bare Necessities and Title IX. Totally worth the cost.

    • Worried

      Not sure if you would want to order from the uk, but I wear the sleep bra from bravissimo without the padding. Fits very comfy, and they are amazing at fittings over the phone. I’m in Canada, and it takes a couple of weeks to,ship, though right now I have a couple and won’t be ordering for a while.

    • Finally Made a Name

      Not sure if you would want to order from the uk, but I wear the sleep bra from bravissimo without the padding. Fits very comfy, and they are amazing at fittings over the phone. I’m in Canada, and it takes a couple of weeks to,ship, though right now I have a couple and won’t be ordering for a while.

      • Finally Made a Name

        Note, I don’t wear a 3X clothing size. I wear an 18. I guessed off of past reviews who said to order a couple sizes up, and I was mostly concerned about cup coverage. I always have the problem with wirefree bra cups not coming up high enough.

  9. Anonymous

    I’m not sleeping. I practice labor and employment and I’m quickly becoming a layoff lawyer. I don’t know what to do. Melatonin isn’t an option (I grind my teeth and get awful headaches). This has been a month. My mind isn’t racing at night but I am working 13-16 hour days from home alone so I admittedly don’t have a good routine. Anyone else figure this out through a stressful work period? I’m expecting another 2-3 weeks.

    • lsw

      Is this something your doctor an assist in the short term with Ativan or something like that? I have found that that really helps me slow my mind down to get me to sleep.

      • sleep

        That is a really dangerous drug to use for sleep if you are not followed closely by a psychiatrist. Very habit forming, way overkill. And it may leave you sleepy the next day, especially if you are not sleeping enough.

        OP – have you ever tried and simple relaxation techniques with an App on your phone and having a tiny tiny night-time routine to help slow you down? Warm drink/stop screens/quick warm shower/deep breathing mindfulness App for 2 minutes etc..

        This sounds very rough for you. Good luck.

        • lsw

          OK, well, fine, I am not telling her to buy it on the street. It’s what my doctor first prescribed and my psychiatrist has renewed for me to use in combo with Wellbutrin. I take it about twice a month. Sometimes all the self-care in the world isn’t enough.

    • Anon

      If you want to see a doctor about this, it may be possible with telemedicine. When I had a sleep study, it was done at a hospital. But for my husband, who had fewer issues to check, they just mailed a sleep study kit to our house.

      I can tell you what my sleep neurologist said, though obviously this advice was meant for me! She told me to establish a consistent wake time and get at least 10 minutes of the most direct sunlight that weather will allow at the same time every morning, ideally combined with some activity. I guess it’s a lot easier to force wakefulness than sleep, but getting the circadian rhythm set for the day can help with sleep later on? No caffeine after noon. No blue lights after sundown (she said to use a filter on all screens, or wear sunglasses). She said not to take more than 0.3 mg of melatonin if trying melatonin.

    • mascot

      As a lawyer dealing with some similar issues for clients, you have my sympathies. It’s hard to have those conversations all day and not take on some of that stress yourself.
      Agree with the above advice to find some fresh air and sunlight to help your circadian rhythms. Have you tried a night guard for the teeth grinding? Even an OTC one can help although I’d suggest getting one from the dentist when this all lets up. I clench my teeth at night and my custom fit nightguard really helps.

      • Anonymous

        And they’re on the list of essential businesses, at least in some states (thanks WA!)

    • Pure Imagination

      I haven’t tried it personally, but at least four family members have reported good success with a 10-minute meditation before bed. One recommended free meditations on Prime, two have Headspace, and one has the Calm app. It’s supposed to help with racing thoughts and I might actually try it myself too. Good luck.

      • Junior Associate

        I have similar issues with sleeping when I am working long stressful days, and have had some luck with:

        1) taking small breaks for 10-15 minute yoga sessions (Yoga with Adriene on Youtube is good, as is the Down Dog app where you can select the # of minutes – start with Yoga for Beginners and then go for Full Practice or Sun Salutation series to keep things light)

        2) taking small breaks for meditation (Headspace, or free resources on Dartmouth / Berkeley / Harvard student mental health services are good too – yoi can download Visualozation, Loving Kindness, Breathing, and Body Scan foe Sleep in most of these sites)

        3) bedtime routine (even reading my favorite essays or watching an episode of How I Met Your Mother on low light helps)

        4) a 10-20 minute walk in the sun (if permitted) after lunch

        5) having light meals of salad, hummus, salmon/chicken breast (the pre-cooked, pre-packaged kind), avocado, tomatoes, and ricotta cheese + whole wheat toast. Going high protein, high veggies, moderate fruit, and lower (but not zero) carbs.

        6) regular supplements of probiotics, omega 3, 3000 mgs of vitamin C in the morning (no later than 2 pm), vitamin B, vitamin D, magnesium, selenium, and zinc. I burn through the elements when I’m stressed which then messes with my sleep.

        7) trying to be in bed by 1 am and getting up by 8 am (even if I’m used to working late into the night).

        8) sleep meds, but only those I’ve previously tried (I was afraid of sleepwalking as I live alone), and in smaller doses than prescribed.

        I know not all these are feasible when you are working 13-16 hour days. Is it an option to enlist some more help from slower parts of your firm?

    • CHL

      I’ve actually really been enjoying Brene Brown’s new podcast. Very soothing and very into acknowledging that where we are just sucks.

    • Anonymous

      No coffee after 4 pm. Pick a regular time to do a workout that will burn stress— anything cardio does it for me. If you have a bathtub, I find a hot bath at night right before going to bed helps. If you have anything lavender scented, try it on you or your bedding. I have been slathering on lavender lotion at night, since I don’t have my usual lavender bath salts or pillow spray.

      • Anon

        Cutting out caffeine completely alleviated most all of my sleep issues (over time).

    • anon

      I also get insomnia when I’m stressed. Here are my tips:
      – Listen to words as a fall asleep. Podcast or audiobook. Listening to someone talk is the only thing that can override my internal monologue about work. For me, this is literally the most important thing.
      – Reduce caffeine. I do one or two cups of coffee first thing in the morning. No caffeine whatsoever the rest of the day.
      – No real screentime at least an hour before bed. Time to read a book, color, take a bath, etc.
      -Rigorous exercise multiple times a week. If you’re swamped for time, finding some free HIIT videos online would be good.

      Good luck!

          • Anon

            Got it. Looks like ZZZquil medicinal is a preparation of benadryl, which I can believe would be drowsiness inducing.

      • Anon

        I definitely take a child’s dose of Nyquil when I have trouble falling asleep. Works wonders.

        Long-term sleep deprivation messes with you. There was a study out of, I think Harvard, that showed people who got 4 hours of sleep a night for two weeks straight had the cognitive function of someone who had pulled an all-nighter, but they did not notice the decline in cognition.

    • op

      Thank you everyone – I skimmed and will look tonight in more detail – I so appreciate the ideas. I know I need a routine and I haven’t tried any of these apps (prematurely wrote off as ‘not for me’ but desperate so will try). Thank you again!

    • Finally Made a Name

      Trazadone or cannabis edibles (but recreational dispensaries are closed in my state)

  10. Anon

    [Note: We thought this amazing comment deserved its own post — and the anonymous reader gave us permission to reprint it! Here it is: https://corporette.com/ideal-woman-coronavirus. –Kate]

    The Ideal COVID-19 Quarantine Woman

    She lives alone. Unless she has children. Then they live with her. But she doesn’t take them out. They magically entertain themselves so she can go out for essential trips. No more than once every two weeks. For essential groceries. She doesn’t need toilet paper. She stocked up weeks ago. But her supply is safe since she installed a bidet last week. She has a fully stocked basement of anything she or her family may need for six months.

    Actually she never leaves her house because she only orders groceries by contactless delivery. She tips generously so it’s ok for the delivery person to be at risk.

    She’s overcome with guilt from having someone delivery her groceries so she decides to pick them up herself. At the grocery store, she shops alone. Never with children. She has a husband who watches them. Or if she doesn’t have a husband she utilizes an elaborately and meticulously researched system to ensure her children never go out in public. She shops from a list, with haste and with gloves and a mask. She has backup items for each item on her list in case the store is out. She has backup items for her backup items. She would never complain about a shortage because her planning has made any shortage impossible to affect her. The mask is naturally homemade because any surgical or N95 masks she has she donated to the local hospital last month, obviously. She hasn’t touched her face in years.

    She considers self quarantining after each trip to the grocery store to keep her family safe but that’d be impractical so instead she settles for an elaborate 2 hour post/shopping trip routine involving removing all non perishable items to her garage after wiping them down. She naturally has a car and a garage and extra cleaning supplies. She leaves them in the garage for three days before touching them to be safe. She wipes down and then thoroughly washes everything else. She removes her clothes and homemade mask immediately upon walking into her home. She puts the gloves in her newly installed coronavirus incinerator to be sure the virus has been killed. She has installed a shower and moved her laundry machine right next to the garage because it’s the responsible thing to do. She washes the clothes and mask in hot (obviously) water and eco friendly laundry detergent that she made herself because ordering something online at times like this is basically torturing parcel workers. Except she ordered the supplies on the phone from an organic sustainably sourced small business owner who delivers because she supports small businesses. She even told them she had no issue if her shipment was delayed because she cares about other people’s safety. She showers (again with hot water and homemade soap). She puts the washed groceries away.

    She orders takeout once a week to support a local restaurant. But because it’s unsafe and unfair to expose the workers at the restaurant, she actually just sends the restaurant a check for the amount of the meal with a request that they continue to pay workers but don’t have them come in. But since mail workers aren’t adequately protected in delivering the mail, she wires the money directly instead.

    Her husband, if she has one, does precisely 50% of all childcare, housework, cooking and meal planning. He goes to the grocery store every other time. So she goes out only once a month and he goes out once a month. If he did anything less she of course would have DTMF years ago and handles all of this herself with ease and without complaint.

    She has a job that allows her to work from home. She continues to perform all that is requested from her. She volunteers to organize virtual happy hours. But not with zoom because of the hackers. Some other service that has no ethical or privacy hours. It only took her 7 hours of research to find. You should look into it.

    She looks professional for video conferencing but not “done” because that’d be a bit much. She wears makeup but precisely the right amount so you can’t tell she’s wearing makeup. She exercises daily. Indoors of course. Social distancing and all that. Once a week for a treat, she goes on a jog in her neighborhood trails. She never runs into anyone but always wears a (homemade) mask. To be considerate.

    She colors her hair at home to ensure she looks mature enough to be trusted by clients but not old because her male clients don’t want to look at an aging women. It’s not sexist for her boss to request this, it’s just giving the client what he wants. Besides she doesn’t mind it.

    She’s homeschooling her kids. One is ready to skip a grade. She’s learned new math. She’s mastered google classroom. She’s still breastfeeding her infant. The baby only needs to be fed when she isn’t scheduled for a call. It’d be unprofessional to explain she couldn’t attend a video conference due to breastfeeding or simply dial in without explanation so she’s trained the baby to not be hungry when clients want to talk.

    If she doesn’t have kids, she has picked up twelve new hobbies and volunteers to virtually babysit her friends kids. Of course she’s not lonely, that’d be selfish.

    She counts her blessings daily, but to herself. When she expresses gratitude, it’s in a manner that never makes anyone feel as though they have less.

    She’s not having her cleaning service or nanny come by but is paying them both. Her house looks spotless and her children are healthy and happy and coping perfectly and never having play dates. She donates half her salary to charity.

    She votes. By absentee ballot.

    She has never been called a Karen. She has never called anyone a Karen. She doesn’t know what a Karen is.

    She is the model of a quarantine women. Or is she? I’m sure someone can find room for improvement.

    • RR

      It’s so easy to be the perfect woman. I don’t know why so many selfish women don’t just rise to the occasion.

    • Abby

      “She hasn’t touched her face in years” and “One is ready to skip a grade” made me laugh out loud. This is the 2020 version of Handsmaid’s Tale

    • Pure Imagination

      Honestly, you spent way too much time on this and there’s a very cruel flavor to it. Can you do a case study for me though? Can you look at yesterday’s Refinery29 Rocky Mountain money diary and tell me if the critics, which include myself, are all just a bunch of haters who want to tear down women who are just trying their oh so very best?

      • Anonymous

        pure imagination your comment is really mean and unnecessary. Her post was funny and lighthearted. Please give yourself some time not online.

      • Anon

        It’s meant to be funny, something I think we can all use. I also suspect it’s a copy paste from somewhere else, although if she did write the whole thing mad props from me at least.

        • anon

          OP here – thanks for the mad props! Writing has always been a hobby of mine and I’ve always enjoyed satire/sarcasm. We all have our hobbies, I enjoy writing, and if I can make someone laugh in these trying times all the better.

          Some of the posts recently reminded me so much of the criticisms and double standards women generally face and I was reminded of the New Yorker piece a few years back about the perfect woman candidate for president. So I reread it and it inspired this. If you’re offended, please just scroll on by.

          • Anon

            I loved it, particularly because you grabbed so many topics of debate from this page in particular.

          • Anon

            (I’m Anon at 9:58) Ah, sorry to under assume about you not writing it! I have just gotten so bombarded with memes and stuff on social media & in my texts that come from who-knows-what-origin but none of my friends sharing obviously wrote/made, I assumed that was the case here but shows what happens when you assume.
            Nice!

          • AFT

            This was amazing and I’ve shared it to three friends and facebook group with a link back here. McSweeney’s should find you and pay you for this. Thanks for doing this – it’s good to laugh at the situation we find ourselves in!

          • Pure Imagination

            Sorry OP. Some of it wasn’t for me, but I should have been nicer about it. These times are tough and I find myself getting defensive more often (as I’m sure others have as well – it feels like a lifetime since anything was normal and truly funny). I shouldn’t have jumped on your piece just because some satire isn’t funny these days and I truly did enjoy “She counts her blessings daily, but to herself. When she expresses gratitude, it’s in a manner that never makes anyone feel as though they have less.” Keep on writing.

          • Anon

            OP, you made my day with this. You should post this elsewhere so it gets picked up across the interwebs. It perfectly captures the our current moment.

            Anyone who has a problem with the original post, it’s because deep down inside you feel guilty for shaming people who didn’t deserve to be shamed. You know doing that is wrong and not an expression of your best self, regardless of how you may try to defend your judging, blaming and shaming here and elsewhere. Introspection and vowing to be better is your answer. Not calling out the OP for writing what she did.

        • Pure Imagination

          If it’s meant to be funny, that’s not how it’s coming off to me. It reads as a harsh dig at women who have expressed anxiety and fear over “imperfect” behavior like entire families going shopping as a get-out-of-the-house outing. I hope that wasn’t the intent – if it was, that’s what I was getting at when I said it read as cruel. I am, however, glad if OP hasn’t had to experience that extra layer of stress that comes with communities that aren’t social distancing very well. It’s quite hard.

          • anon

            OP here – dude I live in NYC, please don’t assume I am not stressed/anxious about the situation. We all cope in our own ways.

          • Anonymous

            It obviously obviously was not the intent as everyone other than you understood. I’m sorry you’re feeling vulnerable and defensive about this. I highly encourage you to take some time to be less online.

          • Anon

            Pure Imagination, I mean this with good intentions: your anxiety is not everyone else’s problem. If your way of coping with anxiety is to obsessively observe others’ behavior and then post criticisms of it online, I would suggest that maybe that is not healthy or productive and you need to examine other ways of coping. No shade and no backhanded criticism intended with this: one of my friends did a telemedicine visit with her doctor and got a prescription for anti-anxiety medication and is doing a lot better. She wasn’t sleeping and was reading obsessively online and was not in a good place. I think this situation is tailor-made for situational use of anti-anxiety/antidepressant medication. It’s a tool and it can be used to good purpose to get people through tough times. You might want to think about it.

          • Pure Imagination

            No need for snarky armchair diagnoses, Anon at 11:21. I apologized to the OP.

          • Anon

            “No need for snarky armchair diagnoses, Anon at 11:21. I apologized to the OP.”

            Awesome, good for you. Next step in the evolution, don’t post things like that in the first place. I know you can do it.

          • Anon

            People asking you not to harsh the whole world’s mellow because you’re anxious is not being snarky. Just log off for a day.

          • Anon

            Why are you all going out of your way to be SO nasty to a poster who apologized for being rude? This site sometimes, man.

          • Peanut

            It was a good piece, in an ironic and sardonic way. I agree that the tone was off a bit. I wondered, why was it ok that she stocked up on supplies? I thought we were to be chastised for “hoarding”? But yeah, women can’t win so I liked that aspect of the piece.

      • small town girl

        NO, eff that. I’m one too and I stand by it. Go pick up coffee and take out daily and I won’t say anything. Grocery shop 5 times a week and I’ll judge in my head but I’ll keep my mouth shut. But if you have KNOWN COVID-19 exposure and decide that your comfort and happiness is more important than the health of the low-wage grocery store workers, their families and all the other shoppers who you are putting at risk, then you’re a piece of sh!t.

        • small town girl

          Sorry this was in response to the mention of R29’s Rocky Mountain Money Diary

          • Housecounsel

            That diary was disgusting on multiple levels. Let’s not let the performative parenting get lost in the COVID-19 irresponsibility.

        • AnonATL

          Yeah I was reading that and was like ok cool about most of it, and then she said she popped by the grocery store for like 5 random things after being in a presumed positive household. You lost me there…
          I can even excuse trail running and skiing if they occur in remote areas where you don’t use a public toilet or interact with people.
          The whole thing just read a little tone-deaf in the current environment.

      • Anon

        Pure Imagination – what a useless and irritating reaction. The OP wrote a satirical essay. It’s not our problem if you have no sense of humor.

        • Anon

          Also, EVERYBODY is anxious. Please stop dumping your anxiety on all of us and trying to make it OUR problem. Learn how to deal with it on your own, please, we’ll all be much happier.

    • anne-on

      You win the internet today. And I am friends with a lot of these types of moms normally. Watching the group chats devolve quickly into more real ‘today my children ate pancakes in their pjs watching cartoons and finger painted on the walls with syrup’ has been hilarious and endearing.

      • Cb

        Right? I suspect I am one of these moms – I’ve lucked out with an easy kid and a husband who pulls his weight, but sometimes I need the reminder that we’re not broken, it’s the system that’s broken.

    • UHU

      The New Yorker needs to print this asap! Now, how can I get my washing machine moved….

    • anon

      so I’m really not trying to be dense here. Where are people feeling they’re getting all this judgment from? Like, I feel like I definitely do “not-ideal” things, but where i expect to be judged I don’t advertise it, and I guess when it happens I ignore it? I just don’t really feel that much judgment, and when I think someone might be judging I usually assume it’s dumb and move on. Not sure if I’m just not being judged that much and don’t get where it comes from, or if I’m being super judged and am just oblivious/don’t care.

      I guess I just feel like I’m going to do whta works best for me while being as responsible a citizen/parent/employee etc as I can, and screw the rest. Like, why should I have feelings about it? What am I missing?

      • Anon

        I mean, just to add a simple comment but at least some of this could be a direct satire/response to some of the absolutely nuts debates in my Nextdoor feed, that if you tried to take at face value or tried to do what some of the folks on there think, you would be literally running in circles. Like the debates about what kind of mask & when (oh but if you have a mask did you take one that could have gone to a HC worker!), if delivery is a savior or makes you the worst, etc. etc.

        I’m not saying I run in circles trying to make these folks happy. But in this time in stress I’ll be d@mned if when I’m doing some of it, there’s not a little voice in my head wondering “who is seeing me do this (perfectly legal, in line with suggestions thing) and secretly hating on me?”. (Yes, I am stepping away from Nextdoor after coming to this realization).

      • Good Morning!

        This site is “for overachieving chicks” so you’re addressing people who are used to optimizing, doing research, best practices, etc. That means being informed and striving to do your best in every area of life. That means inevitably coming across other people trying to work out what is “best” and they may have different opinions.

        If you can just ignore that, great. Most of us take others’ opinions into account. Sometimes that leads to feelings of frustration or inadequacy. It’s nice to be reminded that we don’t have to be perfect or our best selves constantly.

        • anon

          yeah, I mean of course I research and optimize, and then I do what’s best based on my own assessment. I legit do not care about others’ opinions unless there’s a good argument for how I should adapt my behavior. I think it’s ok for us to choose not to care about the opinons of others and free ourselves from that burden to the extent that we’re able to. Easier said than done, so this isn’t so much an instruction to those who are struggling as a suggestion to give oneself permission to just not give a sh*t about anything else but what they think is best given the circumstances.

          • Good Morning!

            I mean good for you but surely you can understand why you’re an outlier? And acting baffled that anyone would feel judged in a time where Google is openly partnering with the government to track your movement (and oh by the way give us your vital signs too) is just a tiny bit disingenuous. Going to the grocery store is a moral hazard. Combine that with people who honestly really try to do the right thing and I hope you can see why that might lead to a little uncertainty in our stride.

          • anon

            Honestly, I don’t get it. I mean I understand that I am an outlier. I just don’t get it. Maybe I should feel judged and I just am not that perceptive, or maybe I’m just not as exposed to it, so I’m not sure what’s different. I do honestly try to do the right thing and I am open to having my mind changed. but I’m not open to the rampant feelings of others and nasty behavior. i just don’t get why anyone cares?

        • Anonymous

          By “research” I think people mean “what on the fist page of google results reflects what I already believe.”

      • Anon

        I think maybe the people who are feeling judged spend too much time on the internet/social media (easy to do right now) and are taking the conversations they see there to heart. I have very much tried to limit internet time for this reason.

      • Anonymous

        I’ve actually been yelled at multiple times in public! Twice for wearing a mask (before the guidance changed) and twice for grocery shopping during hours for immune compromised shoppers. I’m in my early 30s and have cancer, so I’m seriously immune compromised and I’ve been wearing a mask in crowded places since before COVID 19 even existed. I guess my wig is amazing, so people assume I’m a healthy, entitled, irresponsible millennial and feel its their responsibility to publicly shame me for following my doctor’s recommendations.

        • anon

          Sorry to hear that on all counts. People suck. All the more reason to ignore them :) Seriously there are so many “them-problems” here.

        • Anon

          I’m really sorry this happened to you. My boss is actively undergoing cancer treatment but doesn’t “look sick” (whatever that means) and she said she got yelled at the other day for shopping during the special hours at her grocery store. I wish people would extend a little bit more grace to everyone right now. I hope you are feeling okay.

          • No Longer Anon

            I have never gotten as much support as when I “looked sick.” Even when I was literally on IV antibiotics, carrying a bag of saline with a central line sticking out of my chest, I didn’t look sick enough for some people (by that I mean the people who wouldn’t let me sit on the bus….). But the moment I was deathly thin, vampire pale? I apparently fit their narrative of what a sick person looked like (also, their dream of what they want to look like, apparently, for how many people told me they wish they could be as thin as I was. OK, well, all it took was four months of nonstop nausea, you too can be malnourished!)

        • No Longer Anon

          The yelling at people wearing masks/people who don’t look sick/etc thing is so f-ing annoying. I wear masks on planes because it’s recommended for me and good lord, the Karens hate it. One time a woman on a plane refused to sit next to me because I was going to “get her sick.” I told her it was because she was a risk to me, not because I was a risk to her. She still was throwing a fit. The flight attendant told her she was welcome to take the next flight that was available, or she could sit down and stop causing drama. If I hadn’t been so absolutely mortified I would have loved it, but I pretty much cried the entire flight I was so embarrassed and angry.

          I kind of want to write “I’m high risk, F OFF” on my mask but I think the sharpie fumes would give me a headache.

      • LaurenB

        I think there are people who are constitutionally made to “feel” a lot of implied criticism from others, and people who are constitutionally able to brush it off / not really care as long as they are satisfied with their own choices. Look at the pressure on women to breastfeed, or attachment parent, or work / not work, or whatever.

    • Marie

      This is absolutely a funny, tongue-in-cheek commentary on how it is impossible to be “perfect,” yet somehow women are expected to be anyway, even in the wake of a pandemic.

    • Veronica Mars

      Nominating this for Comment of the Year. The winner should get fleece tights, a Jardigan and an OG in their choice of color (but never pink).

    • Anonymous

      Love it! There is so much judgment floating in the air, even in the middle of a disaster. Thanks for the laugh.

    • Junior Associate

      You win the internet, OP. This made me laugh so hard I nearly fell off my chair.

    • Anonymous

      Thigh gap? Because if she isn’t also doing all the fitness and baking bread and sewing masks, she is doing it wrong. Honestly, I’m just glad she isn’t a Karen.

    • anon

      OP here – wow, thank you all for the love on this. I literally wrote this as a note on my phone last night waiting for my associate to turn comments on a document so I couldn’t go to sleep and thought you all would appreciate.

      Stay safe out there and try to give each other the benefit of the doubt. I know there are some people out there who are not (looking at you Money Diaries writer that someone posted about below) but I do think the vast vast majority of people are really truly trying to do their best. This is such an insane time to be living in and I hope we can all get through this together as healthy and sane as possible.

      Oh and wash your damn hands :)

    • LaurenB

      I absolutely love this. Well done! Can people copy and put on Facebook? What attribution would you like?

    • Jules

      You win the internet! I did not read it is mean-spirited, I read it has pointing all of the double-standards and contradicdtions and moral fatigue most of us are coping with right now. I shared it on my Facebook, thank you so much for the laughs.

  11. Anonymous

    My family hails from Great Plains country although I moved a few years ago to a large Midwest metro. I didn’t start hearing of anxiety – the crippling, consuming kind – until a few years ago (I’m in my 30s). I have several friends who are gripped by waves of anxiety or even panic attacks that have gotten worse/more frequent due to covid. They don’t want to Zoom but do tell me they’re anxious and don’t want to talk.

    How can I better understand anxiety? How can I learn to support them? Many, like me, are white collar professionals and I realize I just don’t understand what that’s like or what causes it. I know that I’m inclined to dismiss it (maybe because of where I grew up?) but do want to learn more. Panic attacks sound painful and scary but I still don’t “get it.”

    • Anonymous

      I think step one is accepting that it doesn’t matter at all whether you get it. You accept their experiences and support them.

      • pugsnbourbon

        +1. What causes it? In most cases, a combination of genes + environment.

        What can you do? You check in on them if they’ve expressed that they’re worried. “Hey, was thinking about you today and hoping you’re feeling a bit better. I’m free at x:00 if you feel like talking.”

    • Anon

      Is there anything that makes you feel a little anxious (not Anxious as in Anxiety, but the emotion anxious)? Maybe like giving a big presentation? Think of how you feel right before – maybe a little nauseous, maybe a little on edge, maybe like you wish you could go for a quick jog before the presentation starts to get some of the nervous energy out? Anxiety is a bit like that, except you feel that way most or all the time (for generalized anxiety – other types might be tied to specific occasions). Presentation or no. At random times, like when you’re watching TV or wake up in the middle of the night. There’s nothing acute causing it, no presentation that will eventually be over. You just feel like this most of the time.

      For me, a panic attack feels a lot like when you’re on a roller coaster and you’ve just started to zoom down the big hill. Your heart is racing, your stomach dropped, you’re not in control. On a roller coaster, that’s a positive thrill. If it happens “just because” or while you’re watching CNN, it doesn’t have the positive filter that we have on a roller coaster. It’s “just” the physical and emotional symptoms. Similar to how you’re not able to do math or write an essay while you’re on the first hill of a roller coaster, you’re similarly limited in function while a panic attack is happening. Panic attacks usually last about half an hour.

      If the above resonates with anyone, know that anxiety is treatable! Often we find that we were self-managing anxiety until something external that we have no control over pushes us over the edge. If that’s you, now is a great time to reach out to your doctor (electronically) to discuss options and/or get a referral to a therapist.

    • Anon

      “Born Standing Up” by Steve Martin. It’s a fun book about his comedy, but he discloses he experienced panic attacks and describes them quite well:

      “In the car on the way to the theatre, I felt my mind being torn from its present location and lifted into the ether. My discomfort intensified, and I experienced an eerie distancing from my own self that crystallized into morbid doom. I mutely waited for the feeling to pass. It didn’t, and I finally said, “I feel strange.” We got out of the car, and John, George, and Carole walked me along Sunset Boulevard in the night. I decided to go into the theatre, thinking it might be distracting. During the film, I sat in stoic silence as my heart began to race above two hundred beats per minute and the saliva drained from my mouth so completely that I could not move my tongue. I assumed this was the heart attack I had been waiting for, though I wasn’t feeling pain. I was, however, experiencing extreme fear; I thought I was dying, and I can’t explain to you why I just sat there. After the movie, I considered checking myself in to a hospital. But if I went to the hospital, I would miss work the next day, which might make me expendable at CBS, where my career was just launching. My friends walked me along Sunset again, and I remember humming, “Whenever I feel afraid, I hold my head erect and whistle a happy tune” from The King and I. I spent the night on George and Carole’s couch in absolute terror. I kept wondering, “Am I dying?” but was more concerned with the question “Do I have to quit my job?”
      …
      I discovered there was a name for what was happening to me. Reading medical and psychology books, I found my symptoms exactly described and named as an anxiety attack. I felt a sense of relief from the simple understanding that I was not alone. I read that these panic attacks were not dangerous, just gravely unpleasant. The symptoms were comparable to the biological changes the body experiences when put in danger, as if you were standing in front of an object of fear, such as an unleashed lion. In an anxiety attack you have all the symptoms of fear, yet there is no lion. I could not let self-doubt or lack of talent cause me to fail at this new writing job—this lion—which was the gateway to my next life as an entertainer. I carefully buried this fear; I was in over my head, but my conscious mind wouldn’t allow that thought to exist, and my body rebelled that night at the movie theatre. At least this is my ten-cent diagnosis. I continued to suffer the attacks while I went on with my work, refusing to let this inner nightmare affect my performing or writing career. Though panic attacks are gone from my life now—they receded as slowly as the ice around Greenland—they were woven throughout two decades of my life. When I think of the moments of elation I have experienced over some of my successes, I am astounded at the number of times they have been accompanied by elation’s hellish opposite.”

    • Anon

      I have anxiety and for awhile it was absolutely horrible, panic attacks almost daily could barely function. Was also depressed and vaguely suicidal. I read Turtles All the Way Down (yes, the YA book by John Green) and it made my anxiety feel understood. I also got part of the way through “On Edge: A Journey through Anxiety,” and also identified with a lot of what the author discussed. So, if reading is a way you understand things, I’d recommend those!

      Also: It’s nice of you to try to figure this out. So many well meaning people just didn’t understand when I was struggling and their way of showing support sometimes made it worse. It didn’t feel real, just like they were trying to stop the anxiety. I needed people I could be with without feeling like they were judging me.

      One of the best supports I got was a mentor saying “I don’t have experience with what you’re going through and I can’t say I understand it, but I do have experience needing support from people and I do know that it can be so hard to ask. I want you to know you can call or text me any time, for any reason. I mean it- middle of the night, weekend, middle of the work day. I’m on Team Anon, and I want you to stick around.” I knew they meant it. I never needed it, and honestly I probably wouldn’t have even if I did because I wanted them to think well of me, but I knew that if I called them they would pick up. That unwavering support helped. They were the only person in my life who said it so upfront: They didn’t get it. But I could call them. They would pick up. They met me where I was.

    • LaurenB

      Respectfully – what does hailing from Great Plains country have to do with it? Anxiety, like COVID, doesn’t really care about state or urban/rural boundaries.

      • Anon

        Yeah, anxiety isn’t something that only happens to you if you’re not from a flyover state.

      • anonchicago

        My family is from the south and doesn’t understand or accept things like anxiety or depression, and having dealt with both I’ve learned not to discuss it with them. It’s not that anxiety doesn’t exist in the Great Plains; it’s that people are embarrassed to talk about it and/or self medicate when those feelings arise.

        • Anon

          Yes, this. There’s a “sunshine everywhere” mentality that feels oppressive.

        • LaurenB

          Godalmighty. These states complain that the more sophisticated states laugh at them. Well, this is why. What sort of hicks from the sticks don’t “believe” In depression or anxiety?

    • cbackson

      It might also be helpful to think about it this way – anxiety and depression (which are flipsides of the same coin) exist in all communities, including where you grew up. They just may not go by those names or present in the same ways. For some people, anxiety manifests as extreme irritability, for example – maybe you knew people like that growing up? My grandma in rural TX would have periods where she slept a lot in the daytime and drank a little bit too much. She worried a lot that we were going to hell bc my parents left their fundamentalist church – she’d call my dad and want to go through the Bible for hours. She was depressed, in retrospect. Anxiety attacks and panic attacks are aspects of those illnesses, but not everyone who has anxiety or depression experiences them.

      • Anon

        Yup. Just because it wasn’t named where you grew up, or you weren’t aware of it, doesn’t mean it didn’t exist.

      • anne-on

        Yup. Ditto for my grandma and a lot of other women in that time period I suspect. I think it was captured pretty well in the film (and book) secrets of the Ya Ya sisterhood.

    • op anon

      RE: book recommendations and personal stories – I appreciate it. I know this was around me in some ways growing up but we definitely didn’t talk about feelings and no one told me about feeling this way or even spread rumors about people paralyzed with sadness, fear of unknown, etc. I know anxiety is more than that, but it seems really different for everyone. So appreciate the helpful comments and resources as I learn more and support!

    • Anjie

      Hm. Okay, this is going to be a bit different because my experience of anxiety is different, but there were two main components to my experience with anxiety. The first was just always being on edge. Presumably you get nervous sometimes, like right before giving a big presentation. Imagine that, but literally all the time. If you’re thinking “that sounds exhausting, how would you go through life that way”, a) yes it was, b) what else was I going to do?

      The second part was when it flared up. I never had classic panic attacks, with the difficulty breathing and the like, but I did have periods of time where I was consumed by a nameless, faceless terror. That one’s really hard to describe in a way that makes sense. Basically, it was… being really scared, but without being able to identify anything that was scaring me. It would last hours, sometimes days. I’d be so scared that I couldn’t stop crying, or I was throwing up, and there was nothing I could really do about it because all the usual ways to deal with fear assume you’ve at least got some idea what you’re afraid of. Sometimes I’d keep thinking about ways to kill myself.

      For things that helped… these were mostly for the flares, I didn’t find anything that worked to tame the normal everyday stuff until I got on medication, but I did manage to get somewhere with distraction techniques. If I could find something else to focus on, that could at least get things under control temporarily. If possible, talking to someone helped a lot.

      Good luck. I hope you and them both do okay through this.

  12. A Pandemic Exercise Question

    A quesiton for the runners out there – is there a new runners program for the already relatively fit? Before this, I did a ton of group classes – Orange Theory, Spinning, Barre, etc, but now, if I want cardio, my only real option is running outside. When I google, I find a lot of programs for beginner-beginner runners, but not someone who’s moderately fit, but just switching to running. When I went and ran on my own, I found I could sustain an 11-12 minute mile for almost an hour with little soreness the next day, but I’d love to follow a program to go faster/longer/farther, whatever.

    Any recommendations? Or general tips? I’ve found I actually enjoy running so hopefully this is a hobby I can stick with even after this is over (and even with new shoes, is way way cheaper than my old ones).

      • emeralds

        Yes, that Runner’s World schedule is a good one for someone coming in with a good cardio/fitness base. Do that, or a similar variation that starts out with 20-30 minutes of running on alternating days.

        Do not keep running for an hour right now. Your cardiovascular system may support it with no problem, but your musculoskeletal system needs time to ramp up to new forms of impact and usage, especially since I’m seeing a lot of lower-impact classes on your list. Starting out with an hour of running is a recipe for injury, which is the last thing any active person wants to be dealing with right now. There are plenty of good HIIT workouts on YouTube or other streaming services if you want some additional cardio while you (slowly and intentionally) ramp up your mileage.

        I’m glad you’re enjoying running–it has been one of things helping me stay stable. So you want to be thoughtful about it now, so you don’t lose it in a couple of weeks.

    • Anonymous

      Look up the Hal Higdon plan for training. It is a good calendar for training for a variety of races that you can download. It tells you what to do and how much for each day, including some cross-training (stretching, yoga, etc.).

    • Anon

      The beginner programs are entirely appropriate for you, just do them at whatever pace is comfortable for you. That’s the beauty of a good beginner program – they tend to be more time-on-your-feet based, rather than pace or intensity.

    • Anon

      Try the Hal Higdon plans. Although, you can follow any training and modify it to suit you. If it’s one with walk/run intervals, do jog/run faster intervals instead.

    • Anything with chocolate

      Try darebee dot com. On the menu there is a running section and several sections on starting running, sprinting, run faster, run longer, etc. I like it.

    • Anonymous

      If you use an app such as the Nike Run Club App, there are coaches and training plans built in. I used the training plan and participated in a running challenge through the App to prep for the Chicago Marathon. I think I came in 3rd place in the running challenge and won a gift card too! It also provide great data for your runs/ pace/ mileage etc. And if you run a few days in a row, and skip a few days, it will “check” on you…which is nice and a little annoying…but mostly nice.

  13. Anonymous

    Do you ever just have a case that feels cursed? I admittedly made on error in handling this case. Months ago. And I figured out a solution and it was resolved and the client doesn’t care. But now every time anything happens on the case everyone is mad at me and the partner is super passive aggressive and I’m just giving it my absolute best and documenting everything but I wish they’d just take me off the case. Sorry just feeling down today and needed to share.

    • Anon

      We’ve all had that case where everything that could go wrong somehow did, so empathy here. My “perfect storm” cases that I would throw into a black hole if I could usual involve all of the following: (1) difficult/unresponsive clients; (2) contentious opposing counsel that want to fight about everything down standard case management deadlines and discovery requests; (3) a Complaint with an necessary number of counts and parties; (4) extremely dense discovery. Luckily, I only get one or two of these every year or so. Hopefully that is the case, for you and the rest of your cases aren’t causing you this level of stress.

    • CPA Lady

      Yes. I have been working on most of the same tax returns for five tax seasons now, and without fail, the handful where I make dumb mistakes or they get a notice or something like that are the same ones every year. It’s like they’re cursed or something. I can do 98% of everything right, but there are a couple that something always seems to go wrong on, and I would not blame them for finding another accountant.

      Last year I had a tax return where in the letter we mailed with the return it said “enclosed are your original documents”. The client had to call and tell us we forgot to mail back her original documents. SAME RETURN THIS YEAR…. SAME THING HAPPENED. WHY. WHY. WHYYYYYYY. Yes, I left myself a note. Did I read my note? No. I did not. Gah. Drives me crazy.

    • Anon

      A client who already didn’t like me, and who let me know they didn’t like me every single time we spoke did not become a bigger fan of mine when he realized that I wrote his social security number wrong on every page of a form we had to fill out. Because I misread my own writing.
      And then I found out yesterday we lost the case. Through no fault of my own, it was an objective finding by an independent examiner that determined the case. But I’m sure this isn’t going to go over well even though there is literally nothing I could do to change the outcome.

    • Senior Attorney

      Yes, of course! When I was a young lawyer we called them Effed Up Bad Karma Cases. I feel your pain, OP. Everybody has them!

  14. Anonymous

    Recommendations request – Since I am home all the time now with 4 humans in the house, plus it’s springtime in Charlotte and every.thing. is covered in a layer of neon yellow green pollen, combined with the fact that we are no longer having our cleaning crew coming, I feel like I am cleaning a lot of the time I’m not working and have determined that I no longer really like our vacuum (a bissell bagless upright). While it works fine on standard wall to wall carpet in bedrooms (which we had in our last house) it doesn’t work as well in our new home set up, which is all wood floors plus lower pile area rugs. And the attachments on my current vacuum no longer seem to have suction power. So, what are recommended vacuums that work on low pile carpet and hardwoods, and has some attachments (or just the ability) to vacuum between couch cushions (hello, husband leaving pistachio shells everywhere on the couch….). The cordless Dyson vacuums are intriguing, but I am unsure if those stand the test of time. Thanks!

    • Anonanonanon

      I’ve had my cordless dyson for 5 or 6 years and it is amazing. At the time I had to go down quite the rabbit hole to get a good hard floor attachment but I’m sure it’s easier now. Highly, highly recommend. I vacuum at least once a day. Something about not having to bend over to plug/unplug it as I move around the house and the fact it’s lightweight makes it so much less of a chore. If cost is an issue, you can probably find one on the QVC website and do their interest-free payment plan (I wouldn’t normally recommend that, but these are not normal times)

      • AnonInHouse

        +1. I’ve only had my cordless Dyson for maybe 3 years, but I actually said yesterday, “I love this vacuum.” It gets a disgusting amount of dirt/dust out of the area rugs and is great on hardwood floors. The only downside is that the charge only lasts ~20 min, which is usually not enough time to vacuum the our whole two-story house. Still worth it, to me.

      • lsw

        LOVE my cordless Dyson. We got a new one a while ago because there was some sort of electrical issue with the charger on our old one. It charged but only if you kept plugging and unplugging it. It was over a decade old and the suction still worked so we gave it away and that person really enjoys using it still. I have to say our new one is way better than that one, though! Probably because it is a newer model. I LOVE it. Great for stairs and rugs, good on the hardwood in our kitchen. Now that we are all home and eating three meals a day I am vacuuming with it multiple times a day. We do still use a Dyson upright for our top two floors which are carpeted.

      • anon

        FWIW ours is really loud. We turn it on as we are getting in to bed, watching TV but not fully asleep. It bumps into things and when it’s closest to the staircase with sound traveling easily upstairs it has more than once woken me up. That all said, I frigging love my roomba and highly recommend.

      • Anon

        I’m in love with my roombas but I can’t run them while I sleep.

        I grab my roomba and let it run in my bedroom while I shower and get ready. It keeps me in the habit of keeping everything picked up in the bedroom.

        Similarly l run my other roomba in the kitchen and dining room after we do the dishes and clean the counters every night.

        Other rooms get roombaed when we notice they’re dirty – probably twice a week as we have two cats. In all cases, I just run a microfiber cloth over tables, lampshades etc to knock down the dust before the roomba picks it up.

        We vacuum with the roomba much much more often than they would if we had to haul out a real vacuum cleaner every time.

    • Anon New Yorker

      I have a Miele with a 10 year warranty and it’s amazing. If you assume your vaccuum will permanently break a year after the warranty expires, the Miele is cheaper on a per year basis than anything else you can get. There is a repair store near my home, so I may be biased.

      • Amelia Pond

        I love my Miele vacuum–but you have to buy it from a dealer (not online) so you get the warranty. It does great on wood floors and rugs so long as you get the one with the power head attachment and the dealer I bought it from gives you a free once yearly tune up.

      • Eliza

        +1 to Miele. They’re well-built machines that perform really well on carpet and hardwood. Check out the reviews on Wirecutter.

      • BB

        +1 on Miele too. I have an upright version, which is also amazing if you’re not into their traditional models.

    • anne-on

      I just got the cordless Dyson v10 and I freaking love it. Is is downright scary how much dust I got out of sofas/rugs that our cleaners had been vacuuming on a weekly basis. It can’t do our entire house in one go, but obviously you vacuum last, so I usually dust/vacuum the bottom floor and then recharge it and it is usually ready to go for the top floor by the time I’m done with the rest of the cleaning up there.
      Dyson’s website had the best price + extras package available, I’d buy from them directly.

    • Anon

      Happy to help. Signed, prospective LLM student whose employer is still sending her to the US next year and who is not willing to walk away from the $70k bonus it represents.

      • Anon

        (70k in tuition paid, that is. So for everyone else that would be a minus 70k in salary)

  16. Anonymous

    In anticipation (or maybe wishful thinking) of a beach vacation at some point this summer, can anyone help me find a bathing suit that has good support on top? My bikini days are over, but I’m a 34/36 G and have a hard time finding one-piece or even tankini bathing suits that are supportive enough. Any ideas?

  17. Ann Taylor

    It looks like Ann Taylor has removed customer reviews from its website. Does anyone know any backdoor way to see customer reviews that were previously available on the site?

  18. Anonanonanon

    I hope Ellen is OK. I want her thoughts on the pandemic. How do the partners feel about people teleworking in sweatpants? I’m sure they don’t like it but FOOEY

    • FFS

      So I recently looked back at older posts (honestly because I’m petty and wanted to look at the usernames of the people who mocked the posters wanting to prepare for lockdowns back in January/February) and it looks like her posts get held in m0d and are let through much later. So check posts from a few days ago!

    • AIMS

      I assume she is too depressed about her tuchus getting bigger from being home on the couch for three weeks and just doesn’t have the energy to comment.

    • Anonymous

      I can’t with any of this. As one of the commenters on R29 said, major Arielle Charnas vibes.

    • Pure Imagination

      It was so aggravating to read that. Going skiing and grocery shopping while three people with COVID-19 are in your house? Letting the sick kids cuddle you and kiss you before going to sleep in the guest bedroom? I almost wonder if the whole thing was a tro11 post to drive clicks to Refinery29.

    • KS IT Chick

      My mouth just dropped open at the level of deliberate cluelessness about what we are dealing with. I get feeling cabin fever with quarantine. Get in the car and drive around. Don’t get out. Don’t put others in jeopardy. This isn’t rocket science!

    • Anon

      It really looks like she thinks she’s following the rules, but she’s (mindlessly) following the social physical distancing rules. It looks like she missed the memo that once someone in your household has tested positive, quarantine rules apply. I know she’s not the only one who doesn’t understand the difference. I’ve talked to people who think that six feet separation isn’t needed if a group is under 10 people, and people who think that six feet separation is enough for a dinner party out on the lawn.

  20. Amelia Bedelia

    We are stockpiling savings because we are about to buy a house. (of course, not sure on that timing with COVID.)
    Anyway, I just realized that we have too much savings in one bank – i.e., above 250k – and want to open an online savings account. Any recommendation for the best one? Is ING still wonderful?

    Thanks!

    • Pure Imagination

      I’ve been fine with Ally, although keep an eye on the interest rates. They drop them within seconds of the Fed cutting rates, but never raise them as quickly. I like the user interface though.

      • Senior Attorney

        I like them, too, but it bugs me that they put a hold on funds when I deposit my husband’s paper paycheck every. single. time. for years now.

    • Monte

      Don’t know where you are located, but in the US ING is now Capital One. I have had the same account since the ING days and have had no issues, but it really has just been emergency savings for me.

    • anon

      Also double check who is named on the accounts – the limit is per depositer (and value is split in half for joint accounts), if I remember correctly.

    • anonnn

      We’ve been at Amex Personal Savings for years, they don’t seem to drop as quickly. But are sometimes a little behind Ally.

  21. anonymous

    Has anyone had to cancel travel due to coronavirus?

    We had to cancel a trip to Jamaica for next week. As per American Airlines rules, I received a credit for the airfare to use up until December 31, 2020. But now when I checked the AA website, I’m seeing new rules about re-booking travel, which is rather confusing. (Link to follow) I don’t want to be locked into traveling through the end of the year because I have no idea what things will be like. The tickets are worth around $650.

    I booked through Chase Sapphire Reserve so I guess I’ll just have to bite the bullet and get on the phone with them to get the updated rules.

    • Anon

      I’m supposed to be on the wine train in Napa Valley right now. :(

      We got the voucher that you describe (though Delta, not AA, but it sounds the same). I don’t love being locked in like that, but I do assume that if we can’t reasonably plan a vacation before, say, fall, they’ll extend it. That, or the whole system will fall apart and the airlines will all go bankrupt! Who knows!

      We’re looking at a family beach trip for July-ish now. If it doesn’t happen, it doesn’t happen, but at some point, it’s going to be possible, right? (Please tell me that’s right?)

      • anonymous

        I’m hopeful travel will be possible at some point! Right now, we are looking at re-booking our Jamaican trip for next spring sometime. I could pick somewhere else to travel later this year, but I wouldn’t even be looking at booking until the fall. I wish the verbiage on the site was more clear, because I’d like to avoid calling into figure out exactly how these new rules apply.

    • small town girl

      I’m supposed to be leaving for Portugal in a month and two days. I can’t imagine we are going but we haven’t canceled yet mostly because I keep hoping the airlines will cancel the flights and so I won’t be stuck with credits.

    • Cat

      Yes. Once voluntarily (AA was still going to fly) and once – for a few weeks from now – where AA modified the flights.

      For our voluntary cancellation, we received a credit per their online terms. The “deal” is that there isn’t a change fee, not that you get your money back for otherwise-nonrefundable-tickets, or the ability to fly other dates for the same fare you already paid.

      For the flights AA modified, we got our cash back to our credit card after calling them. Having a pandemic doesn’t exempt them from the rules about airline-initiated schedule changes.

    • Anon

      I had to cancel a trip booked through Chase on Delta. This was in January before the rest of the country understood COVID. I had what appeared to be the flu but tested negative. My doc wrote a note that I had the flu regardless. Chase said I had to try to cancel through Delta first even though they were non-refundable tickets. If I got a denial from Delta I could submit to Chase for a refund. I submitted to Delta and since I had a doctor’s note that I was contagious they gave us credit to be used within a year of when we originally booked the tickets. Hope that helps!

    • LaurenB

      We had a trip planned (a long time ago) for this coming weekend with American Airlines, booked through Amex. We were told – if AA cancels, we get full refund; if we cancel (which we can do up to 24 hours before flight), we get the face value of the tickets, which was $479 apiece. They actually had changed our flight from a non-stop to a one-stop, which husband tried to argue was cancelling our flight, but got nowhere :-) In any case, though, with the ticket numbers, we have $479 worth of credit on AA til something like February of 2021, and it doesn’t have to be the same destination.

    • Small Law Partner

      I had to cancel three trips – two for work, and one for a vacation to Hawaii for both me and my husband. So now we have almost 5k in United electronic travel certificates that currently have to be used by April 2021. Assuming we can get back to normal at any point in 2020, I am pretty sure I’ll use all that easily. If not, we may see more relief from the airlines, who knows.

  22. Non-Covid topic

    I am soon going to meet my boyfriend’s two tween daughters. We waited until they requested to meet me, which they have now started doing consistently. I have no kids and no close relationships with kids in this age group. What should I know? Dos and don’ts?

      • Anonymous

        Yes assuming this is once we are allowed to socialize, I think you treat this like meeting your good friend’s good friends. Assume they are great, be friendly and pleasant, and don’t go too deep.

      • Anon

        Sigh. Really? I think we all know people aren’t supposed to be meeting in person right now.

        Did posting this make you feel better about yourself? If not, why do it?

    • Anony

      As someone who has also met a boyfriend’s tween daughter at 13, who is now 19 – best advice, treat them like your friend’s children at first. Let them set the relationship tone, unless they will be living with you and your BF which is totally different. Be willing to be the grown-up they need you to be – role model, friend, teacher, shoulder-to-cry-on, etc. That’s what I did and I still have a great relationship with her that has evolved over time. I reach out periodically to check-in and she reaches out when she needs me. I see myself as filling the gap and being the adult that she needs. So just go with the flow – don’t be a parent, be an adult that they will respect and one that they know is in their corner. Also brush up on tween pop culture and current fads/music/fashion – that always helps!

    • lsw

      Ask them about themselves. Talk to them like adults, not kids. Listen to what they say. Don’t be patronizing. You can do this!

  23. Anon

    I’m supposed to be on the wine train in Napa Valley right now. :(

    We got the voucher that you describe (though Delta, not AA, but it sounds the same). I don’t love being locked in like that, but I do assume that if we can’t reasonably plan a vacation before, say, fall, they’ll extend it. That, or the whole system will fall apart and the airlines will all go bankrupt! Who knows!

    We’re looking at a family beach trip for July-ish now. If it doesn’t happen, it doesn’t happen, but at some point, it’s going to be possible, right? (Please tell me that’s right?)

  24. Casper

    Using my boss’s office to cry today. Hope he doesn’t mind. He’s not using it; he’s working from home

  25. Friend living alone...

    Have a very dear friend who lives alone in a distant city. She is doing everything she can to avoid getting sick, but am trying to help her brainstorm what to do if she does get sick. Parent/sibs likely not available, but young adult son lives in same town. Telling her to stock up on CDC required stuff (liquids, thermometer, tylenol) ; make sure son knows how to get in touch with her doc; what the signs are that she needs to get to hospital. What I’ve been looking for, with no luck, is a detailed recap of how to actually care for someone while they are sick. The essay by the woman in Brooklyn whose husband got supersick is most helpful thing I have seen, b/c she describes when and how she cleans the bathroom and prepares his food, etc. The son is a little clueless; I’d like to find a pretty detailed recap on how to prepare and get food to the sick person; what protective gear to wear themself when interacting; should they strip and change when they come out of her room etc. Any ideas on this?

    • Anonymous

      I think she’s already good! Her son will figure it out if he has to. She doesn’t need a 14 step playbook now when she isn’t sick. Many people are basically fine.

    • Anon

      Generally you go to the hospital when you have trouble breathing. I wouldn’t worry, if the son is a functional adult he can figure it out.

    • Anon

      I live alone, and figure I’m on my own if I should get sick. If it’s really bad, I go to the hospital. Otherwise, I make some canned soup or frozen food and struggle through my own.

    • Anon

      I hope it doesn’t come to this, but she does have a health care proxy in place… right?

    • LaurenB

      Honestly, if she’s sick, the son should NOT move in with her and try to care for her if he’s not already in the same household. She’s just going to have to eat crackers, soup, etc and let the housekeeping go to hell, and he just needs to check in with her to verify that she isn’t so sick that she needs the hospital. And if she does, call 9-1-1 and let the trained responders take her to hospital.

      • Anon

        I agree with this. Hospital nurses are in the best position to care for someone unless they already live together. Also, as far as a healthcare proxy, under normal circumstances that’s important, but I don’t think anyone will really have the option to make any decisions especially if ventilators are in short supply.

    • Jules

      I agree that this is unneceesary. But also if I recall correctly the WSJ just posted something like this in the last couple of days.

  26. Airplane.

    Paging quarantine couple poster – did you get out of that guys’s apartment and go to your place, your mom’s place or brother’s place? I hope so. And I hope you’re doing ok.

  27. lsw

    My Kitchen Aid mixer’s bolt that connects the foot and the … head? has come out totally and I’m really having trouble threading it back in. The mixer is so heavy that it doesn’t help. It seems like I need to have it aligned at the very exact correct angle. I have had no luck so far and I’m getting frustrated. Any suggestions?

    It’s a super-old model, my mom bought it for me when I graduated college. The old tilt-up style, not the bowl tilting type.

    • anon

      I had a similar problem with mine (the bolt didn’t come all the way out, but it was very loose) and found helpful videos on YouTube.

      • lsw

        Thanks! I should have thought to look on there. I guess I assumed it was a weird issue and not that common!

        • Senior Attorney

          Haha in my experience there will be a YouTube video even if it is a weird issue!

    • anon

      No real advice except that you do have to hold it at the precise angle and kind of wiggle it in there. And then keep a close eye on it because once it comes out it is more likely to come out again.

    • Good Morning!

      Very common issue! Once you get it back in, keep checking on it because it will always come out again.

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