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Happy Monday! This photograph almost looks like bad Photoshopping — but I think it's just the super flattering colorblocking on the dress. Sign me up! I like the blaze/straw/black color combos, and the neckline and hemline look great for work. The dress is $398 at Bloomingdale's. Rachel Roy Color Blocked Sleeveless Dress Seen a great piece you'd like to recommend? Please e-mail [email protected]. (L-2) P.S. I'm praying that we get the tech problems worked out asap this morning. Thank you guys for your patience.Sales of note for 8.30.24
- Nordstrom – Summer Sale, save up to 60%
- Ann Taylor – 30% off full-price purchase; $99 jackets, dresses & shoes; extra 50% off sale
- Banana Republic Factory – 50-70% off everything + extra 20% off
- Bergdorf Goodman – Final Days Designer Sale, up to 75% off; extra 20% off sale
- Boden – 20% off
- Brooks Brothers – Extra 25% off clearance
- Eloquii – Up to 60% off everything; extra 60% off all sale
- J.Crew – 40% off sitewide; extra 60% off sale styles
- J.Crew Factory – Extra 20% off orders $125+; extra 60% off clearance; 60%-70% off 100s of styles
- Lo & Sons – Summer sale, up to 50% off (ends 9/2)
- Madewell – Extra 40% off sale; extra 50% off select denim; 25% off fall essentials
- M.M.LaFleur – Save 25% sitewide
- Rothy's – End of season sale, up to 50% off
- Spanx – Lots of workwear in the big sale, some up to 70% off
- Talbots – 25% off regular-price purchase; 70% off clearance
- White House Black Market – Up to 70% off sale
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- What to say to friends and family who threaten to not vote?
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- Can I skip the annual family event my workplace holds, even if I'm a manager?
- What small steps can I take today to get myself a little more “together” and not feel so frazzled all of the time?
- The oldest daughter is America's social safety net — change my mind…
- What have you lost your taste for as you've aged?
- Tell me about your favorite adventure travels…
Anon
Hi, Kat. I’m viewing the site with Firefox 21.0 on an old computer, and the site looks fine.
hmmn
I’m viewing on IE. I don’t see any comments until I click “Leave a message” and then I see the one from 9:18.
Fiona
I’m viewing on IE. I don’t see any comments until I click “Leave a message” and then I see the one from 9:18.
darjeeling
be still my heart! That is a seriously gorgeous dress.
NOLA
This posting didn’t show up for me until I click refresh several times. I’m on Firefox 21.0.
A Nonny Moose
Similarly, the post shows up on the homepage for me, with a lower number of comments than there are. Opening this post’s individual page shows a higher number of comments but still lower than there actually are. I have to refresh several times to get all comments to show.
Mac, Chrome.
Olivia Pope
This post appeared perfectly in my feedly and Chrome browser. Comments and all.
Miss Behaved
Same for me
preg anon
Same for me on Chrome.
Anonymous
The site looks fine (if slightly slower than usual) to me, Kat — using Chrome 27.0.1453.116
Cat
The post itself showed up fine. However, just as before the switch, I have to refresh the home page in order to see the comment count update since the last time I refreshed the page, and then once I click into a post to see the comments, I have to again refresh for the new comments to display. Using Chrome.
Anonymous
Do u bring anything to an engagement dinner? All the guests are paying their own way
mascot
Only if you want to. There isn’t usually a gift obligation for engagement parties. A card or bottle of bubbly would be nice.
downstream
Disagree that there isn’t usually a gift obligation at engagement parties, but agree that in this event – with guests paying their own way – there is no need to bring a gift. Otherwise, an engagement party hosted (i.e., paid for) by the engaged couple (or their parents), and to which you receive an invitation in the mail, deserves a gift.
Mpls
This is a little guest rage breaking through here – but ‘gift obligation’ is a contradiction in terms. You are never obligated to give a gift. Period. Full Stop.
There are gift giving occasions, yes, like a wedding, or wedding shower, where a gift is traditionally given. But even in those instances, a gift is not required. If it was required, it would be an entrance fee.
Also, I’m tired of the gift creep. I am more than happy to come celebrate this occasion you are having. But every freaking occasion does not require me to buy and wrap something. So, no I wouldn’t bring a gift to an engagement party, even if the guests weren’t paying their own way.
Harumph.
preg anon
Agreed!!! Especially as someone who has had every one of those milestones, it makes me feel guilty. People don’t need to buy me something at every occasion.
Batgirl
Preach! I’m so sick of the wedding gift creep! A party to celebrate your wedding is called your wedding–it’s not an engagement party. I don’t believe in getting a couple an engagement gift, a bridal shower gift, and a wedding gift…especially when there’s travel and hotel stays involved (often more than one night now)…and not to mention bachelorettes/bachelor parties.
downstream
While I can understand that you’re annoyed at constantly having to buy and give gifts, you’re in the wrong here. You’re right that technically “gift obligation” is an oxymoron and you don’t ever “have” to give one. Just like you don’t “have” to tip the service industry (restaurant, taxis, haircutters, etc.). But it’s a social convention and people do it and if you don’t do it you are generating bad karma and people are going to judge you and be annoyed at you. Now, maybe you don’t care, and that’s fine. But if you show up to a wedding without a gift, you should know that people are going to think you’re a social boor.
You can give according to your means of course but my rule is if I am getting an invitation in the mail and a meal out of the ordeal, I’m giving a gift. For my wedding one of my best friends got me a $25 item off my registry. It was all she could afford and I was happy she made the gesture. If she had gotten me nothing, I don’t think I would have ever forgotten that.
Anonymous
It’s not about having to constantly buy gifts. I like being able to find meaningful and personal gifts. I like being able to get something special for someone to commemorate an occasion. I don’t like having to get something just to check it off of some “supposed to do” list. Otherwise an invitation is just a request for me to buy you something and that seems a bit rude in my book.
Even if it is social convention, it is still not an obligation. It’s a way of doing thing that often can vary by region/socio-economic status/culture/etc. And it’s still gift-creep to have “social convention” expect me to gift you something every time you feel like throwing a party to celebrate yourself. Either invite me because you genuinely want me there to celebrate with you, regardless of whether I get you a gift, or don’t invite me. And I guess I would find that karma pretty quick if I don’t give a gift, eh? Shrug – no skin off my nose.
Like I said before, harumph.
Mpls
That was me, btw.
Anne Shirley
I’d just bring a card.
big dipper
+1 This is the type of occasion I bring a card. I’d compare it to a birthday dinner for a friend or acquaintance (we don’t do gifts in my circle of friends) so I bring my presence and a fun card.
Away Game
Know your friends and guess what they might expect for these events, and decide what you’re willing to do. I have no idea who did or did not give me gifts at my wedding a decade ago. I worked my way through my stack of thank you notes, but didn’t kept track of who gave what – other than “I love the blue swirly colors in the vase!” on the note- or who was invited/came but didn’t give a gift. I cannot imagine going through the invite list and mentally assigning figures for how much folks gave, but if you have friends who do, and you want to stay friends, you might want to take that into account. (Or, dump ’em!)
anon4
I wonder if we’re going to the same one! Is yours tonight?
Anonymous
I hope everyone had a good weekend and was not affected by or hurt in the two transit-related tragedies of the weekend. They hit closer to home for me than I expected, since I am from the Bay originally, and drove up to Quebec this weekend.
A friend’s tip for plane crashes — she said to always count how many seats you are away from an emergency exit. In a crash, if the plane is filled with smoke, you may not be able to see the exit but you will probably be able to feel for the number of seats before you get to it.
ac
I got the same tips from book called “The Survivors Club.”. Other tips included wearing flat, closed toe shoes and paying attention (eg not reading, watching videos) on takeoff and landing as that’s the most common time for survivable crashes.
NoExit
So I need to start looking for a new job. I’ve been practicing patent prosecution and the old exit strategy of in house pharma doesn’t seem to exist anymore. Pipe dream is academia but I’m trying to be realistic, what other fields are out there? I frankly tried to stay away from patents originally but lousy economy plus lousy law school career services made it hard to determine what else I was really qualified for with a scientific background and now I’m afraid I’m pigeonholed into patent pros. I know some of you ‘r e t t e s are in a similar field so I’d really appreciate hearing any outside the box suggestions you’ve come across!
Me2
I have no advice, but I sympathize. I got into patent lit with a similar lack of intent. I’ve been regretting not going into patent prosecution because of the higher number of in house positions in that field than in lit… I knew going in to BigLaw that it was a dead end job, but I guess I figured that I’d have my next step figured out by now.
Scully
Can you transition into soft IP for a change? I know a few burnt-out former patent pros. attorneys that got into trademark by picking up a case at a time.
NoExit
Unfortunately at my current firm I won’t be able to get any experience in other IP areas and I’m not sure a soft IP firm would hire without any.
k-padi
Can you try going in-house in a software/e-commerce company? They tend to look for smart people regardless of technical background. Legal background tends to be more important than technical background as long as you can demonstrate familiarity with e-commerce (aka do lots of online shopping). Post-Myriad, Justice Scalia really wants to shut down e-commerce patents too.
Would joining a firm where you can work from home and/or go part-time be an option?
Network, network, network. Many of my biotech buddies got their in-house pharma jobs by word-of-mouth. They are out there.
Anonymous
In addition to looking into govt work that might overlap (legal and tech background, usajobs.gov search cant hurt), also consider looking at legal departments and research departments of colleges and universities? Your patent prosecution background would likely be helpful at places that have robust research and regularly deal with patent licensing, MATs, etc. You could try the trademark prosecution side, but being a former biglaw trademark pros and patent litigator, the trademark prosecution market is even more niche than patents and it’s not a profitable area — I suspect that most places would really want someone with lots of trademark prosecution and litigation experience, and I saw a trend in most of my former clients to moving a lot of that stuff inhouse awhile ago. Also, good luck! I transitioned into government last year and I remember how people kept telling me that it would be easy to get a job and I was like “how? All I’m good at is biglaw patent litigation” so it will take time. From my experience, try to be prepared to leave for a new job as quickly as possible so you can take opportunities that may arise without being hampered by transitioning from your old position.
NoExit
Thanks for all the suggestions! Gov or university work sounds interesting, Ill start looking into those
springtime
Consulting? I know that would take you out of law, but it’s definitely an option.
Also, I’ve seen lots of IP litigators go in house to pharma, so I don’t know if it’s a regional thing or not.
Plan B
I’m not an IP lawyer, but I see a fair number of in-house pharma postings – are you sure that isn’t a viable option?
TCFKAG
I want this dress! What I like about it is that they’re using color-blocking for what it SHOULD be used for, to make the dress more flattering, rather than what its usually used for – to make a “statement” that 99% of the time makes the dress dated quickly AND less flattering all in one go.
(Also – for anyone was wondering – I’m back from being on vacation AND sick – and posted to the blog last night. Check it out. And submit new questions if you have them. ;-)
Technological jobs Q
There is a much-photographed dress (Stella McCartney?) that uses color blocking to slim and create curves at the same time. The color blocking here would probably make me (scrawny, but with a tucchus) look almost sharp, in a bad way.
TCFKAG
I think that’s the Stella McCartney Octavia Dress you mean (Kate Winslet wears it all the time) and I love that one – and it was what I was thinking of when I saw this dress. I wonder what it would look like me (kind of with a belly and thighs but not so much with the tucchus OR the boobs…if that makes sense whatsoever.)
Bonnie
Beautiful dress. It’s sold at a few online retailers so I hope I can successfully stalk it. Feel better TCFKAG.
anon
Agreed, this one’s a real heart-stopper. Big problem for me, though–that red zipper down the back! Sexy and understated, sure, maybe. But am I crazy, or does this very much fall in the “very young petite new associate cannot pull this off” camp? Zip looks like it might even be too long for a blazer.
Exposed zippers have been around for a few years, so maybe I’m just a stodge and they’re already common in BigLaw?
k-padi
The red zipper is very much know-your-office. In my office, I would definitely wear it and rock the red zipper (but I’ve been here 4+ years). I would counsel a first year to wait until year 2 or 3 to wear something like this without a blazer/jacket/cardigan unless she is normally very fashion forward.
zora
totally agree! I don’t even like red, but I would so wear this dress. gah!
NOLA
Hey TCFKAG, glad you’re back! I sent an email to your gmail address (I think?). Not sure if you’re still using that address.
anonypotamus
Hi! I hope you had a good vacation, and I hope you are feeling better! I loved your Jackie O blog post! And I submitted a question (I hope it’s ok that it is less work-related and more specific event related).
Aria
Poll: Do you guys think you can remain friends with an ex you loved? If so, is it something that can happen immediately or do you typically have a sort of “mourning” period where you cut off contact? And if you remain friends, how do you handle it when your ex starts to move on before you’re ready to?
EC MD
I think it depends. I dated a guy through med school who I would have married had he asked (though it would have been a HUGE mistake). We broke up but remained entangled for another 18 months. I moved across the country and we continued to talk very frequently though I was the one who always initiated the contact (which was typical of our relationship the whole time). Once I started dating my future husband I stopped calling as much and he still didn’t call me much. We are now Facebook friends and I have warm thoughts about him but we aren’t friends.
For me, the friendship had all the same dysfunction as the original relationship and once I was in a happier more fulfilling relationship the dysfunction was glaringly obvious and not worth continuing. I’m sure in other situations it would be more successful but it wasn’t for me.
Anon
Oh, I am very familiar with this. In my experience, if it was a serious relationship, at least one party will need a mourning period (typically the person who didn’t end the relationship). Even then, sometimes one or the other of you will still be hoping for more than a friendship (again, typically the person who didn’t end the relationship). I’ve found that the longer the relationship was, the less likely it is that you can be “just friends.” As for handling them moving on, if I’m not ready to see my ex with someone else, I’m probably not ready to be just friends.
TO Lawyer
I personally don’t believe you can stay friends with exes that you loved/were in a serious relationship with. Or at least, not close friends. I think you can have a friendly relationship but not actually be friends. If you are trying to be friends, I think you definitely need a mourning period where you cut off contact – otherwise, you’re still using your ex for the same type of emotional support as when you were dating. There needs to be a clear transition and that will happen once you’re past all the immediate hurt and pain of a breakup.
Diana Barry
+1
I am not friends with *any* of my exes. I am only FB friends with two of them (HS boyfriend and law school BF, both of whom I only dated for 5 months).
Lyssa
I agree with this. Friendly – sure. You can go to the same group events and say hi and chit-chat a little, that sort of thing. But real friends, if it happens at all, needs some distance from the relationship, if the relationship was serious.
Sitcoms lie about this stuff like crazy. I love How I Met Your Mother, but the idea that Ted and Robin are supposed to remain close enough friends that his teenage kids think of her as an aunt after all of their relationship woes drives me nuts. (This may be my own personal pet peeve.)
Anonymous
Agree. I think it can happen, but rarely. I have a few friends who say they are “friends with their ex” which means they exchange emails twice a year. To me that’s not actually being friends that is being friendly with an ex, which is definately possible ( but kind of pointless- I prefer being civil. As in I would say hi and be warm if I bumped into them but not “catch up” but that’s me) I also think you can be actual friends with an ex if it wasn’t serious. But I don’t think it can work when there was love there, which is rather ironic since you loved that person at one point. But I think it’s extremely rare to be able to do so, and when I have seen it happen it’s only until one or the other becomes serious with someone else.
Ellen
I agree here 100%. My ex was a drunk, and I cannot be freind’s with a drunk. FOOEY! He also was bad in bed b/c of the boooze, but enough about him!
My weekend on LI was very interesting. We all went out boating with the manageing partner and Margie, and the manageing partner’s brother and Harold went also b/c they live nearby. I had NOT seen Harold for a while, and he seem’s to be looseing even more of his hair even tho he can NOT be even 25 or so. FOOEY! He will be bald as an egg in 3 year’s and once he has a paunchy stomack like his dad, he will be GROSS!
Anyway, Harold smacked me on the tuchus as I got into the boat, like it was NOTHING. He made it seem to his dad (and everyone else) like he had done this (and ALOT MORE) with me physiceally. I said why did he do that? I wanted everyone to be sure that I had not done ANYTHING with him physical, NOR did I ever want to!!!! FOOEY!
Harold’s DAD kept oogleing me the whole time I was on the boat. I do not know where his wife was. Lucky I brought my Nautica coverup — it was helpful to prevent him from stareing at my breast’s, b/c the batheing suit was still a little to tight and my tuchus was showeing a littel to much for comfort around HIM. I do not need another bald guy ooogeleing me! Doubel Fooey! Especialy b/c he is older then my dad.
Dad talked alot about the firm to the manageing partner, and I think the manageing partner is goeing to make me a partner, but with a guareanteed MIMINUM salary. Dad says that I will get at least $75,000 per year irregardeless of the profit’s of the firm, but then get to participate with all of the same right’s and priviledges as other partner’s at the firm. This way, I get the benefit’s of the up-side, dad say’s, without all the risk’s of the downside’s. I still will be responsible for partnership debit’s but ONLEY those that are incurred after I join and vote on (even if I vote against them).
I will NOT have to contribute to all of the acrued liabilitie’s to date, and can join as early as 9/30. Yay!!!! I will be able now to meet a guy and say I am a partner, and can get him to MARRY me!!!!! Dad did all this negoteaiting for ME b/c he is lookeing out for me and he said he want’s me to be MARRIED already, just like ROSA! I do NOT think he had do do any of this with Ed’s family or employer b/c Rosa had alot of bargeaining power — she was young, beautiful and fertile and wanted kid’s right away! YAY for me and Rosa!
Now I JUST need to find the right guy. But now, where is this guy when I need him?
Young Consultant
I have stayed friends with two of my somewhat serious (although we were young) exs, both of whom I definitely loved. One of them, we stayed friendly but did not hang out much in person for about a year or two after the break up (we kept in touch via texts, emails, or would spend time together with mutual friends). It became clear as we both got older that our lives would have been very incompatible and one of us would have ended up miserable if we had stayed together, and I believe this has allowed us to be very good friends now, about 6 years later, because both parties really have moved on and see that we would not have been a good fit.
My most recent ex and I flowed into friendship rather easily, mostly because of the circumstances of our breakup. We broke up more due to circumstance than not loving each other anymore. Neither of us wanted to cut off contact, and we still talk about twice a month, and text intermittently. As time went on, it just felt more and more platonic, and I think we will be friends for a long time.
I think in terms of people moving on, this really depends on you. I am not a jealous person, and I know that my exs dating other people doesn’t really diminish how much they loved me. I normally get out and start dating pretty quickly, and I try my best to feel happy when they do the same. There is a reason you broke up, so keep that in mind when you have those feelings of jealously. What is really difficult is when they first start being serious with someone else (you see pictures of the new girlfriend with his family and friends on facebook…), but if you really care about them and want to remain friends, then you have to cultivate friendly feelings about this (like being happy for them) rather than the natural jealous feelings we have about our exs. If you can’t do this over time, friendship is probably not going to work out.
momentsofabsurdity
I think you can remain friends with an ex but not in the same way you can be friends with someone you never dated at all. And I think when you start seeing someone new, the friendship necessarily has to be dialed back, out of respect to the person you are dating.
I’m close friends with one of my exes, and reasonably good friends with another. It took time in both cases, and there were definitely some growing pains. That said, I’m glad both of them are in my life and I can see them much more clearly now that we are friends and my view of them isn’t colored by romantic interest. Both of them are good people, who I think highly of – but both of them are not people I’d ever want to date again, even for the relationship where I was the “dumpee” not the “dumper.” I can see that much better now than I could at the time. I think there does need to be a mourning period before you can get to that point.
I would say there probably is tension, in some way, there between the relationship with both of these exes – but I’d also say that I don’t think I’ve ever had a friendship with a member of the opposite sex where there wasn’t some undercurrent of tension. This is a different sort, but I’m not sure that it’s a worse sort.
My mom is still friends with the guy she dated seriously before my dad. They don’t talk nightly, or anything, but he and his wife will go out to dinner with my mom and my dad when they’re in town, they’ll occasionally send emails about new career opportunities, or notifications of life milestones (like his son’s wedding, to which we were invited). It seems fine, my dad is okay with it, my mom’s ex’s wife is okay with it, we grew up knowing who they were and what the relationship was, but never feeling insecure about my parents’ marriage. I don’t think they’d ever go off and hang out alone, however, which probably would have been weird.
S
I think it can work, but is tricky and definitely needs a low contact period. In people I know, honestly, it’s worked best when one party ended up being gay and the relationship was hetero.
Anne Shirley
I’m still friends with the guy I dated all through law school. We talk about job stuff, since we had the whole search process in common, hang out once a month or so, and even offer each other dating advice. It works because I’m 100% never ever ever getting back together, and he’s adjusted to that.
AnnonFoo
I cut off all contact (email/txt/gchat/phone) with the most recent ex after a serious relationship of almost 4 years which eventually did not work out due to circumstances (we were long distance in the end after layoff/job changes). He got married immediately in a month or two after the break up (his was an arranged marriage scenario so such short time frame is normal). He started popping up in my fb newsfeed with his engagement/wedding/honeymoon pictures, it was so utterly painful as I was still upset. It would totally ruin my day and I would cry for hours so I finally blocked him and his fiance/wife from fb. After that cutoff, it was much more doable to carry on with my life and try to put him behind me. At least I did not have to see his smiling “moved-on” face with his new wife on the same couch that we had picked up together years ago, assembled for hours and carried down 3 flights of stairs when moving. He was one of my closest friends and I miss the friendship, but it was too painful to see his new life so having no contact has definitely helped me the most. I don’t think I can ever resume any contact in the future even if I have completely moved on.
magpie
Yes but tricky. Both parties need to be good at compartmentalizing and/or feeling excessively generous to the other, esp the one to have been broken up with. Also easier if you can point to an intervening factor–distance is a good one–even if just an excuse. (And obviously, absolutely no FWB stuff allowed or the friend part just goes off the rails.) I’m still ‘distant-close’ with an on/off ex of four years (last dated three years ago, and happening again never): We talk a few times a year, meet up if we’re in town, holla at each others’ sig Os, and generally have each other’s backs from opposite sides of the country. At first it was emotional work; now it’s easy, at least for me. I think it pays off–night before my 25th I was feeling emo and called this dude out of the blue, and despite our having only the most superficial conversation, he made me feel better where my current bf couldn’t–I think it has to do with not feeling like the failed relationships are “dead to you” or “lost years” in a way. But then, I’m a wack job about committed monogamous relationships and would be lost without my close platonic guy friends, so I try to hang on. I’m also stupid sentimental. If you’re the type who can see a future where all your major sources of happiness can be wrapped up in a nuclear family/believe in all-encompassing romantic love, I might not bother with the mess…
Bee
“And if you remain friends, how do you handle it when your ex starts to move on before you’re ready to?”
If you have to ask this question, then you cannot be friends with this person right now. If you get to the point that you can genuinely be happy for your ex if he finds love, and not feel the that-could-have-been-me pang, then you can be friends.
Bee
That should have been *then MAYBE you can be friends.
Book Suggestion Follow-up
Huge thanks to everyone who responded to my request for motivational book suggestions last week. I went with “The Defining Decade” because it seemed extremely relevant to my current situation (26, single, not sure whether to stay on my current career path, constantly feel like I’m waiting for real life to start, etc.), and it was exactly what I needed to read. Looking forward to reading some of the others, too.
Thanks, again!
Technological jobs Q
My husband has a computer / networking / not sure exactly what he does job for over a decade. The company has gone through a merger and the job is starting to drift. He asked me for help updating his resume but I am in a completely different field. He wants to do this before talking to a recruiter and putting up a Linked In profile (also delayed b/c he says he wants a good headshot, which I think is not a need-to-have item at all). Are resumes that important to someone with a lot of work experience that you can’t even call a recruiter (who was referred to him, so I’d think you’d want to return that call sooner since people seem to be doing him a favor) without one? I don’t want to give him the wrong advice, but I’d think that the talk / connect / document order would serve him best (and you could work on your resume forever).
goldribbons
I think the recruiter will take him more seriously if he has a resume ready to go. Hopefully the recruiter will have a suggestion or two on the resume, so your DH shouldn’t feel it has to be absolutely perfect, but starting a job search without a resume seems like you’re not serious about starting a job search. YMMV.
Technological jobs Q
Thanks! I’ve always had one (or could always update it quickly, plus I’m in a field where much of that would be on the web, in something I’ve published or spoken at, or already on Linked In), so I was thinking it would be OK to call and send them the resume once you go home and can send from your non-work computer and non-work e-mail (so overnight grace period). But good to have more input — do not want to be often-wrong-never-in-doubt.
KLG
I agree with this. The headshot is unimportant, but I can’t see starting a job search without a resume. He can always continue to refine the resume and provide the recruiter with an updated version. I’m not in a technological field, but I assume the first thing a recruiter is going to ask for will be his resume.
zora
he does NOT need to wait to have a resume before putting up a Linked In profile, however! You can start with just your basic info and start connecting with people. And then over time go back in and add information. And you don’t need a photo right away, it is not a necessity. The most important part is going to be him starting to see who he has connections to, and getting the word out to them that he is looking for a job. Also, I’ve found that filling out my Linked In profile sections helped me in fleshing out my resume, so that might actually help him.
Trixie
I would suggest starting on the Linked In profile ASAP to build connections. I wouldn’t say it’s a “red flag” to only have a few connections, but I would definitely notice if I looked up a candidate and he had very few connections.
EB0220
Can anyone recommend a good website or software for fertility tracking and analysis? So far, I have tried mymonthlycycles dot com, and the TCOYF software. They are ok for recording things, but none of them really offer anything in the way of analyis or graphs (cycle length distribution, luteal phase length distribution, etc.). I am a data/statistics person and this drives me crazy! I would appreciate a recommendation.
anon
Have you tried fertilityfriend? It tracks a ton of statistics for you and has a free app you can use on your phone as well. I think the more advanced statistics require a monthly fee, but I can’t remember what it is off-hand.
Anonforthis
I recently downloaded the Fertility Friend android app and it gives you the “VIP” enhanced membership free for 30 days so I would definitely recommend checking that one out and seeing if it’s worth your while to pay for the enhanced features. I did not, but I mainly wanted something to record my cycle/what the ovulation predictor said/when we had lady garden parties/etc., as opposed to doing any analysis or graphs.
EB0220
I’ll check it out! I have a neglected free membership already, so I’ll try the android app and check out the free trial!
A Nonny Moose
KINDARA. All the way. It’s awesome.
EB0220
“Advanced analytics”….they’re speaking my language. :) Thanks for the rec!
anon
I think this dress, at least on a pale skinned woman, would look like you’re wearing a dress with a cartoon of a dress on it. Kinda like those big baggy t-shirts with an attractive scantily clad body on it.
goldribbons
Agreed.
basil
#can’tunsee
FP Angie
D’oh. I might have bought this dress but now that’s ALL I SEE.
Anonymous
For those of you that are minorities- how do you feel about being called “exotic”? A friend and I were talking, and commenting on how pretty everyone was looking at an event, and she said “you just always look exotic pretty”. I felt insulted, but I didn’t say anything, and I don’t know whether I should be insulted?
momentsofabsurdity
As a minority – it bothers me.
There is a “Sh*t White Girls Say to Indian Girls” youtube video which a) is hysterical and b) heavily features the word “exotic.” I get a lot of “gosh you are so beautiful and exotic” or “Indian girls are just so exotic” or “No wonder so and so likes you – he’s got some kind of exotic fever! His last three girlfriends were Asian!”
I don’t think anyone means it in an offensive way, but it does strike me as offensive. It bothers me for the same reason it bothers me when people say things like, “Oh gosh, have you met my friend Manmeet? You guys would so get along, you are both Indian!” — you wouldn’t say that to someone who was white.
Maybe I’d be more comfortable with it if I actually felt exotic – like if I had lived in 2-3 different countries, had an accent, etc, or there was something unusual about me besides my skin color. But really, what’s exotic about being born, and growing up entirely in the United States? “Exotic” to me always has an undercurrent of “I want to compliment you, but I can’t compliment you in the same way I would a white person, so here’s another word for you.”
bananagram
“‘Oh gosh, have you met my friend Manmeet? You guys would so get along, you are both Indian!’ — you wouldn’t say that to someone who was white. ”
Eh. All people, including white people, get this in different forms. When someone knows someone ‘perfect for’ my overweight friend what they mean is that they have an obese single friend (according to my buddy). As a tech person, I was once set up with a math guy 21 years my senior. Since we’re both technical people it doesn’t matter that he’s closer to my fathers age than mine.
momentsofabsurdity
I think people do get it in different forms – but it feels different when it is functionally based on the color of your skin. I’ve been set up on crappy dates because “you guys would totally get along – he is an English major too!” or things like that and that sucks, but it sucks in a different way.
I don’t know how to explain it, except to say that I would never tell a friend “Oh you should go out with that guy, he’s white too!” but I’ve gotten plenty of comments like that about Indian guys, and I’ve had other (African American friends) get comments like that about black guys.
SoCalAtty
I used to get it being Jewish. “Oh, my friend so and so is a Jew too!”
Awesome.
bananagram
Fair point, and I didn’t mean to be dismissive. I just meant that it’s an extreme form of something that already goes on, not a set up phenomena wholy limited to minority races.
TO Lawyer
+1
Also infuriating when people ask me where I’m from. Similarly to MOA, I’m born and raised Canadian and it drives me nuts that people ask that question when I am just as Canadian as they are.
Equity's Darling
Oh, I love the following conversation, which I have had…oh, at least once a month my entire adult life. It goes as follows -> “where are you from” ->”X City in Canada” ->”no, but where are you FROM”-> “yes, I was born and grew up there”-> “oh….then where are your parents from?”
…ah, therein lies the REAL question. I feel like the people who ask that question are always trying to figure out what box I fit into, not that they’re actually trying to get to know me.
momentsofabsurdity
This one bugs me too – I almost would rather they come out and ask “what are you?” since that’s pretty much always what they mean.
Tom Haverford
…I’m from South Carolina.
Anonymous
I always respond with, “are you asking me what my ethnic background is?” I both want people to lay off the euphemisms and ask what they’re asking straight-up, and I want to point out that they are asking a very targeted question that in real terms is quite delicate. A lot of times they respond with, “well, yes, I guess so, yeah.” Alright then, ask that. And I will be happy to answer it (or not).
Sydney Bristow
There was a really funny video making the rounds on Facebook recently about this question. I think this is it, but I can’t watch it right now to make sure. http://www.upworthy.com/a-perfect-answer-to-a-super-duper-annoying-question-2
Frugal doc..
That was really good. Thanks Sydney.
Anon
As someone who might say this (especially after a few drinks), I am sure your friend didn’t mean anything beyond being complimentary of your beautiful skin tone and other beautiful, desirable traits common to your ethnicity (For example, I am always jealous of my Asian friends who have that thick, beautiful, straight hair). But, if you didn’t feel comfortable with it, you should have told her, because I would like to know that this made my friend uncomfortable and know not to say something similar again.
Houston Attny
I agree. I would say that and mean it in a “you really are beautiful” way. I’m glad OP brought this to my attention so I can be more sensitive. It didn’t occur to me it could be taken as a negative.
(Do y’all remember how Claudia Kishi was always described as ‘exotic’ in the Baby-Sitters Club books? Oh, yes, I’m a real-life nerd.)
Anonymous
Nothing to add, but I love Claudia Kishi and the Baby-Sitters Club books! I’m pretty sure my sister and I read all of them (and then left them in my parents’ basement).
WCEC
but OP didn’t exactly know how to express why she felt uncomfortable and was second-guessing if she felt comfortable with feeling uncomfortable. Having a gut reaction to something does not always merit an explanation, and if the gut reaction is unnecessarily inflammatory without reasonable ground, calling out the friend and explaining something that should just be checked could make the situation worse.
to OP: as a minority, yes I definitely feel insulted. Echo everything MOA said (I, too, was born in, raised in, and have spent very little time outside the States). but, as Anon suggested, I also do point this out to my friends who do this and explain why it’s offensive to me, preferably when I can articulate it in a reasoned way.
OP
Oh, I 100% know that my friend meant nothing but a compliment by saying it, she’s a great friend and a good person, but that doesn’t change the fact that I felt uncomfortable, and I didn’t quite know why. I felt very othered, I guess, even though I was born and raised here, just like her.
Boring pretty
People usually mean they love the beautiful skin tones and bone structures and fantastic hair of “exotic” women, but it does dehumanize the actual individuals of different ethnicities in creating the “Other,” and she should be discouraged from this particular phrase. If it happens again, maybe say something like “Really? Huh, I never thought of watching netflix and drinking wine with friends (or whatever your two favorite pastimes are) as particularly exotic. The term “exotic” makes me uncomfortable. You mean you think I’m pretty?”
But hey, at least you’ll never get described as looking like a Barbie doll!
momentsofabsurdity
Ha! I have a friend whose favorite term for me is “Indian Barbie.” So I guess the moral of the story is – you just can’t win!
Honestly, I agree that it should bother you, and I also agree that your friends are certainly well meaning and you should tell them that it does bother you.
zora
+ a million, you should bring it up and tell them it bothers you. It’s hard to talk about sometimes, and awkward, and it sucks that you, as the POC still have the responsibility to ‘teach’ your friends about casual/hidden racism. But this is a good opening to try to have a serious but non-angry/defensive conversation about how even subtle things that seem innocuous are part of a larger system of racism and how it makes people feel horrible to be singled out by their skin color/looks, even when it’s meant to be a compliment. It won’t be easy for either of you, but I have been on both sides of this conversation even recently, because I forget and let something slip, and the only way to fight racism is to keep checking ourselves and keep talking about it.
You could also just send them this; http://jezebel.com/5905291/a-complete-guide-to-hipster-racism
It makes my stomach hurt just reading this, because I see where I have stepped over the line sometimes, even though I try so hard to be anti-racist. But it is so important to keep talking about.
ML
This. It’s not only inappropriate, it’s racist. I know it’s “well intended” – a lot of racism does not have bad intent. It’s ignorance + institutional privilege. Calling someone is exotic is a way of otherizing them, whether you “mean” it that way or not. Exotic literally means from another place, i.e. not belonging here. It is also loaded with s*xual connotation that makes me, personally, uncomfortable. (how often do you hear men described that way?).
If you are one of those uses that word to describe people, I think it would be better to be specific about what exactly you are complimenting: “you have beautiful skin/lovely hair” etc. Those types of compliments would, I think, be welcomed by most anyone.
L
Not a minority (though sometimes mistaken for one) and I think it’s rude. People who are pretty or beautiful are just that; no classification needed. To add another modifier to me comes off as wow you’re so pretty even though you aren’t [insert stereotype here].
And frankly, unless you’re from Antarctica, the chances of you actually meeting the definition of “exotic” is highly unlikely. I mean we’re a nation full of diverse people, it’s time we stop allowing people to act as though its the 1700s.
Anon
In a lot of places in America, there’s very little diversity.
L
It’s no excuse. We have TV, the internet, etc.; it’s not like we live in the dark ages. Excusing people’s ignorant behavior because they’re old, they live in X part of the country, they go to Y church is unacceptable. Excusing people’s bad behavior does nothing except make us feel better because then we can somehow justify it. I’d rather call it out, deal with it, and move on.
Marise
After years of hearing the “exotic” thing, I’ve decided to just go with it–cause I am! I take pride my ethnic heritage and the fact that I don’t look like everyone else. Plus, I like the fact that people can’t figure out my ethnicity. It makes me unique.
Anonymous
I feel very little connection to the “ethnic” portion of my heritage. I was raised in a suburban area, and was generally not exposed to anything other than the dominant culture in my area. And what about for those minorities that are adopted by a caucasian family and have no link to their heritage?
It’s difficult to be proud of something you’re not really connected to.
Humdilly
Is it offensive to ask someone their ethnicity? Not out of the blue, but in a conversational way? I am white and a U.S. native but my “ethnicity” is German, Irish, Cherokee… I find that background interesting but would not want to offend someone by asking that.
Equity's Darling
I’m biracial, so it’s not always obvious what I “am”.
I think the way in which the question is asked really matters. I’ve had it done in ways that doesn’t bother me, but I think I can almost always tell the intention behind it – sometimes it’s truly just curiosity, or interest, and then I’m cool with it, but sometimes it’s very much so that I can be pinned down. I find it frequently more annoying when it’s a question within the first 10 minutes of meeting me, then it very much comes across like the person is trying to stereotype me in some way.
NOLA
My SO gets that so often. In fact, he said that one of the guys at his house last week asked him that very thing. I guess it’s because there are so many light-skinned black Creoles in Louisiana that people often assume that he is biracial. He is, in fact, Puerto Rican and Sicilian, but he tans easily and gets pretty dark at times. He just laughs about it.
ML
Yes. also bi (multi) racial and get this question in various forms all the time. When it’s a close friend or close-ish friend asking in an interested way, it’s not that bad. When it’s a total stranger on the street who doesn’t even know my name (and doesn’t bother to ask) its an invasion of privacy. I usually say “none of your business” but what I’d really love to respond with “i’m xyz. And how much do you weigh?” I agree with Equity that it matters what the intent is. I would think about your motivations for asking- that might help you decide whether it’s appropriate.
Divaliscious11
Random stranger to my niece – “What color ARE you?”
5 year old niece – “Beige”
And yes, exotic falls into that class of offensive compliments, such as “so articulate” or “so well-spoken” as if it really is a surprise when the person is of color….
magpie
This story made my day.
And also kind of broke it. Dear god, people suck sometimes.
Susie
How about that it is assumed that white people have no diversity/culture/background, you’re just “white”? Different European countries do in fact have different traditions and identities! I am from a specific Eastern European country and am very proud of/identify closely with my heritage but it doesn’t seem to count because I’m “just white”. I live in America, but if anyone were to ask I would say I am Hungarian.
Equity's Darling
Is this a complaint? I’m sort of confused by the way in which you phrased your comment.
And regardless, I don’t really agree with you that “white people” have no culture- my city has a very strong Ukranian heritage, and I love going to the Ukranian festivals here (such delicious food!) , and my mom, is white, but Irish, so I learned to make soda bread from my great-grandmothers recipe…my mom has a heritage, even if she’s a pale litle blonde lady, and doesn’t look it.
Just because it’s not obvious, doesn’t mean I assume people have no heritage, everyone comes from somewhere. I just generally don’t feel the need to interrogate someone on their heritage, probably because I don’t usually love when it happens to me. Plus, if I actually become friends with someone, it usually comes out organically at some point.
Susie
I guess what I’m trying to say is I feel like my background is discounted because it is not exotic enough. I think that every culture is unique and should be celebrated – there is too much emphasis on race and not enough on ethnicity.
TCFKAG
I think the difference between European ethnic background and the ethnic background’s of people of color is that when we talk about “where our families are from” there is an implied sense of belonging that isn’t there for POC. So if someone asked you “Where are you from?” in conversation – especially someone you didn’t know that well – you could say – oh Hungary – because there would be an underlying assumption of Americaness shared by you both (unless you have an accent.)
On the flip-side, for many people of color, even those whose families have been here for generations (not that it actually matters how long there families have been here) – there is a perceived entitlement by random strangers on subways or people in bars or just whomever to ask “Where are you from?” And its not the friendly “oh tell me about your family’s background” question it is for you (or at least – it isn’t always) – because there isn’t an assumption of shared identity there the question can easily be more aggressive.
So I guess what I’m saying is this – its not that your background is discounted. You have as much right as any other person to celebrate your Hungariness (yeah sorry, that’s probably wrong), and to tell people about it and learn to cook Hungarian food, and whatever. But what’s also not discounted is your Americaness. Unfortunately, for many people of color, when they are out on the street, while their ethnic identity is recognized, their Americaness is ignored. Both aren’t great – but only one of them can be pretty dangerous.
Anon
Following what TCFKAG said, if someone asked where you were from and you replied, “Cleveland,” everyone would take that as your answer. As people above have noted, lots of people of color are interrogated about where they’re “from” – it’s assumed that because they aren’t white, they can’t be American (or Canadian). So while it may be unpleasant that people assume that you don’t have a non-American culture, it’s not at all the same to what people are talking about here.
TCFKAG
Can I just add (as a whitey von-whitenstein) – if you’re white and have trouble understanding what’s wrong with the “exotic” or the “I love Asian xyz” or whatever compliments – it took me until I was in college to realize that, as a compliment, it presumes that whiteness is the default and that therefore the basis of the compliment is the difference from the presumed norm. Yeah – its nice to be told you’re beautiful – but not so nice to be called different in the same sentence. Especially since, in the end, what makes everyone beautiful is their difference (lets be honest – every blonde hair blue eyed model looks just as different from me as my Pakistani or Indian or Dominican friends).
Anyway, does that make sense?
P
I think this is really well stated – the issue is that it implies an “otherness”, with white being the default, of course.
Also, whitey von whitenstein made me snort.
Anonymous Poser
+1
Yes, it makes sense.
Anonymous
I understand your point, but while I probably wouldn’t ever make the comment OP was objecting to, I’ve often thought of women of other races as exotic and only in a complementary manner – as in, growing up I always felt my straight blonde hair and ghostly pale skin were incredibly borrring and would have loved to have had what I considered to be more interesting features (in the same way that everyone with curly hair seems to want straight and the other way around). I’m also not sure that noticing a difference should be assumed to connote some sort of negative value judgment. I think it’s really just that we are more likely to notice people with features different than our own (and really, if I told my doppleganger she was beautiful, wouldn’t that be just a bit narcissistic?). When I studied abroad, I got plenty of looks/comments because I stood out like a sore thumb but I never assumed that there was any malice behind it.
Aonymama
I am not insulted, but I do feel weird about it. It is definitely drawing attention to what is different about you, and to me seems to indicate that in someone else’s internal categories that they put you in, “exotic person” is more prominent in their heads than just “person,” or “friend” or whatever. Like, you look at me and see “exotic anonymama” instead of just “anonymama”. My mother-in-law, who I love dearly, does this and it makes me cringe, but I know it is not meant harmfully. Making someone feel different is usually pretty uncomfortable, even if it is in a positive way, or about a generally positive feature.
Anonymous
Can anyone recommend a moving company in NOVA? Thanks in advance!
A Nonny Moose
Can anyone recommend a moving company in NOVA? Thanks in advance!
A Nonny Moose
http://mytruckbuddy.com/
DC Wonkette
I loved Bookstore Movers (name dot com) – on time, friendly, fast, not creepy, wrapped stuff well.
In-House Optimist
Suburban Solutions. We’ve used them twice (and are about to use them for a third time because we can’t seem to stay put).
locomotive
I used two marines moving and had a good experience.
Heart Rate Monitors/Pedometers
I’m in the market for a heart rate monitor that will also tell calories burned/steps taken. I know a lot of people here are fans of the FitBit, but it looks like more than I need (I’m using another software to track my calories) and I’m not sure about the wireless syncing. Anyone have any recommendations or use the fitbit zip and want to talk me into it?
Thanks!
AT
I just got a FitBit One and like it, but none of the FitBits are actually heart rate monitors. They do record “high activity” periods, but if you’re wanting to actually monitor heart rate, etc., I would look elsewhere. Sorry I don’t have any suggestions… I have an expensive Garmin GPS heart rate monitor (that I never use), and never looked further until the FitBit came along.
curious
Totally unscientific poll: What percentage of people do you think are happily married? And what percentage of the people you know?
AIMS
I think it really varies with where you are in life. Right now, most of my friends have just gotten married and so I would assume they are more or less “happily” so. I am sure that will change for some of them as the years progress.
My mom and I recently had this conversation and between the two of us we were able to name exactly 3 long term “happy” marriages where everyone was still in-love after many years. Two of those three couples never had kids.
J
I tend to think that at least a majority of married people are happily married, considering that divorce is such a viable option today, generally speaking.
Personally? I’m happily married and most of the people I know who are married seem to be happy from how it looks and what they say… but I certainly know a few that don’t seem happy, as well.
eek
Hard to say….in some situations, things are never what they seem. For example, in my marriage it looked like things were probably happy, but I was very very very miserable.
Anonymous
I’m late 30s, most of my friends a bit younger. Most of my friends are unmarried, but all of the married couples (6) broke up in the last year over infidelity (some admitted and some denied, but true in all cases).
TCFKAG
That’s pretty hard to define. First, usually people only present their “happy” faces to the outside world – so you might only know if your best friend or really good friends were unhappily married. And second, lots of people go through periods (weeks, months, days, whatever) where you might not call them “happily” married – I mean – they might be sick, or one person loses their job, or they have financial troubles, or whatever. Does that mean their marriage isn’t happy? Probably not – marriages survive that sort of trouble all the time. So classifying marriages by “happy” vs. “unhappy” seems both impossible and possibly too simplistic anyway.
Divaliscious11
I think it depends on what ‘happily married” means. Everything is perfect? – Very very few. Going through the normal challenges of being in a relationship, but glad to be going through them with their guy/gal? Pretty high….
Frugal doc..
I think it is actually much lower then you think.
All of my friends but 1 couple that married in their 20’s are now divorced. That is 7 couples, that divorced within 10 years, and several are now on their second marriages. The ones that married in their 30’s are more stable.
Of the older couples I know (in their 50’s+), I have been surprised how many actually have “settled” and have more acceptance then real “happiness”. It is rare to find that fairy tale family. Several have a decent friendship, but no great love/sex for many years. Several have significant tension with poor communication, but deal with it by living separate lives. Financially, divorce is also quite hard right now, and still, many couples stay together for the children and other pressures.
Of course, this may vary considerably depending upon where you live and what sort of social circles you run with.
Baconpancakes
BTW, Kat, I’m viewing on IE 9, and the navigation (next post, last post) are obscured by ads.
Bonnie
I’m really upset with myself. I carelessly bumped something with my car this weekend and while it looked like there was no damage, it appears that there was. So now I’m just waiting to see how much I will have to pay. I know it’s completely my fault but has put a damper on an otherwise great long weekend.
Miss Behaved
Stop beating yourself up. You weren’t hurt. And it’s only money.
If it makes you feel better, everybody I talked to had a great weekend, up until the last day.
Yesterday my family dog died and I had to handle the whole situation because my parents just freaked out.
My co-worker fell asleep at the wheel, totaled his car and broke his arm.
Treat yourself. I’m going to buy myself flowers.
Bonnie
Thanks for the perspective Miss Behaved
Ms. Basil E. Frankweiler
Love the dress, but I am starting to get over colorblocking.
So, some background, during third year when I was really hurting, a professor mentor offered me a job as the assistant for a class in the area I want to practice in. Even though I did not have to, when I got my permanent job, I gave one semester notice (as opposed to 2 weeks or just leaving). After a lot of prodding, my boss finally chose a replacement for me and then promptly left for her annual vacation. Last week, my boss came back into town to handle some business and was very surpised that the new person had not contacted me, she was under the impression that I’d been walking her through the process all summer.
I am at the time when I would normally start prepping for next semester, but if I do that, I’m worried that my boss may interpret that as she can take another semester to find my replacement, but I can’t take these 13+ hour days anymore. How do I convey to her, without burning any bridges, that I will not start prepping for the new semester?
Thanks in advance.
TBK
I’m confused. You quit, right? So why would you be prepping for a job you don’t have anymore?
Ms. Basil E. Frankweiler
Because I don’t like to/can’t leave people in a lurch. If I don’t prep for next semester, there will be no clients and the students will all have to find a new class because it will be cancelled.
Anne Shirley
You aren’t leaving anyone in the lurch. You quit. You gave notice. That’s all you need to do. Stop being a push over and let this professor, who is paid for this, handle things.
Marilla
What is the new person doing in the middle of all this? Have they started working yet? And are you still working, or just keeping in touch by email? I would suggest you offer to spend a day or half-day with the new person, show them existing material and how you would have prepped for each semester. Then walk away – it is now up to them and their supervisor (the professor). I think many of us have a tendency to think we are indispensable and stuff MUST get done, and we MUST be the ones to do it… but this professor and the class survived before you, and the professor will have to figure it out after you. Just send an email to the new person, ccing the prof, suggesting “great to hear you’ll be taking over the course assistantship this semester – let’s meet for orientation/training!”
Ms. Basil E. Frankweiler
The new person has not contacted me at all and my boss told me that she was almost through the process in the middle of May.
goldribbons
You mentioned the boss hired another person for your position, right? You should decline to do any tasks involved with planning for the future — only work on tasks that will impact the remainder of your time in this job. I have a lot of mixed feelings about this so I fear I won’t be articulate; please bear with me.
First, I think you should have reached out either to your boss or to the new person to be more clear about how to transition your responsibilities.
Second, I think you should absolutely stop taking initiative on things. It is no longer your responsiblity. Your responsibility is to transition your job either back to your boss (e.g., by making her aware of how much you’re doing and what exactly you do during your 13+ hour days) or to the new person (e.g., by getting her involved as much as you can).
I’m unclear on how exactly your employment is set up, when your last day is, whether you work with the new person, whether the new person has started yet, etc., but hopefully these suggestions help. It’s not buring bridges to get your boss set up to function without you. It’s burning bridges to drop everything and leave. Good luck.
MerrilyWeRoll
Hey all. I went off hormonal bc pill a little over a month ago (to see if it was causing my migraines…no luck so far), but an unintended side effect was losing a bit of weight. Like 1 cup size, 1-2 dress sizes. My body fluctuates a little, but never like this, and I spend about 15 minutes staring into my closet every morning bemoaning my lack of clothes that fit correctly now. For anyone who’s had this happen, did the weight come back after a few months? Or do I need to invest in a new wardrobe? I haven’t incorporated any other changes – no diet/exercise changes.
goldribbons
That sounds like a huge amount of weight — 5 lbs is pretty normal, but this sounds more like 10+ lbs. Have you talked to your doctor about this?
SFBayA
This happened to me when I went off hormonal bc about a year ago. I dropped a bra size and a clothing size with no other changes. I’m small to begin with, so dropping ~7lbs is a size change. The weight just fell off. After about four months of bemoaning having nothing to wear, I took most of my clothes to the tailor. She explained that most of the clothes would cost more to alter than they originally cost, so I had her alter a few of my very favorites, and put the rest of my wardrobe in storage for when I am bigger again. I had to buy a lot of new clothes.
Frugal doc..
Totally sympathize… I also dropped a similar amount of weight on my small frame recently due to combination of hormones/stress, and it similarly destroyed my wardrobe. You’ve got the right approach – alter the very favorites, store the rest, build slowly and with only quality things that can be standards.
Then I have hit my favorite consignment stores for a few pants/shirts to wear so I don’t feel like I am wearing the same thing every day.
It stinks. As I also sometimes also fluctuates 10 lbs more then my “average weight”, I literally keep 4 different sizes of clothing.
Marilla
I just went off hormonal BC a few weeks ago, and I think (although I haven’t weighed myself yet) that I’m dropping the weight I put on when I went on the pill (also 5-10 pounds). I certainly hope it doesn’t come back after a few months (except in terms of other weight which is the intended goal of going off the pill in the first place). I know everyone has different reactions to going on/off the pill but I’ve read other women post here that they also lost the pill weight without blinking when they went off. So I wouldn’t rush to go shopping in case it changes in the next few weeks, but you may need to buy some new clothes. How long were you on? I was on only for 2 years so I’m hoping I can temporarily at least wear those clothes again soon.
Anonymous
This is so disappointing. I went off about a month ago after being on for 10 years and I have neither lost a lb. nor had any crazy increase in s*x drive, as also has been reported on here. Everyone is different is true, but I was really hoping for some increased libido and a svelter bod!
MerrilyWeRoll
I had been on the pill since I was 13 (for excruciating cramps initially, for obvious reasons after), and I’m 25, so I had assumed my body would have balanced itself out in that time! Apparently not! I’m “happy” with my new body, but it was really fine to start with, and I don’t exactly have the budget to replace everything! (She says as she pulls up her pants for the 118th time today). I was actually hoping for the libido increase…I would definitely trade!!
Anonymous
Same here. I went off 3 months ago… maybe my body is still adjusting and these magical changes will kick in soon? So far all I’ve gotten is horrible bacne.
anoon
yep. all that happened to me was a ton of my hair falling out.
Nonny
Hi ladies:
I really need some help as I’ve been faced with a situation this weekend that I’ve never had to deal with before and I don’t know what I should do, or even if there is anything I can do. I’m really at a loss. Apologies in advance – I think this is going to be a long one.
As you know, I’m pregnant (now 14 weeks). We went to my hometown over the weekend and while we were there, announced the pregnancy to my family. We told my parents on Friday night. As you can imagine, they were thrilled (first grandchild). On Saturday morning my mom and I went to my sister’s house to tell her. It did not go well.
Background: My sister and her husband got married about 5 years ago. They have always really wanted children and my sister would be a fabulous mom. They have had some trouble conceiving and went to a fertility specialist a while back. It turns out my sister has a hormonal issue that makes conceiving difficult. However, with treatment they were able to become pregnant two years ago. Sadly, my sister miscarried.
Since then, we haven’t heard a thing about whether they are still trying, whether they are still seeing a specialist, what they might have been told, etc. I knew that my sister would have mixed feelings when I told her of my pregnancy – in fact, I was kind of worried about telling her. But I also knew that I had to tell her and couldn’t put it off. I thought she would be sad because of her own situation, but happy for me, and able to express that happiness. What actually happened was that she threw me and my mom out of her house, and has now told the family that she won’t be coming to any family events ever again. (And in fact we had a completely unrelated family event the following day, and she and her husband did not show up.)
Later that day, my sister’s husband called my mom. He is usually a calm, laid-back guy but seemed uncharacteristically stressed on the phone call. He explained that pregnancy/children was a very sensitive subject for them right now, and that they recently had to leave a friend’s wedding because my sister couldn’t handle seeing all the young children, etc. My sister then called back a few minutes later and yelled and swore at my mom, blaming the announcement on her, which is totally unfair, and then hung up.
I knew that my sister wouldn’t talk to me if I phoned her, so I texted her and apologized for upsetting her. I told her that if I had known it would be so difficult for her, I would have made my announcement in a different way. I also said that I knew she really wanted children, but it seemed like there was something else going on. I expressed a desire to help her but said that if I didn’t know what was wrong, I couldn’t be much help. She texted back saying that she hoped I was happy and healthy and wished me well.
More background: My sister and I have a pretty good relationship (now that we are adults!), but she has always been a bit volatile. In family arguments, I generally end up being the peacemaker. She is six years younger than me.
The issue: I want my sister to be part of my life. I didn’t know things were going so badly for her. She hasn’t shared what’s going on with any of us. I have never really had to deal with infertility issues and I don’t know how to help her, or even if I can. I really think that if this is affecting her relationships with her friends and family, she should be getting help, but I can’t suggest that to her and neither can my mom – it won’t go over well. For all I know, she is already seeing a counsellor. I was really looking forward to sharing this experience with my sister and I don’t want to push it on her if she can’t deal with it, but I don’t know what to do.
RJ
Your sister’s reaction sounds over the top and irrational, but these are the kinds of emotions that typically sound people experience when dealing with infertility (speaking from experience), so if your sister was already prone to being volatile it makes sense that her reaction would be stronger. This is going to sound harsh but you are not going to be able to “share the experience” with your sister. People that get pregnant with no issues or have never experienced pregnancy loss likely cannot fathom the pain associated with these events, particularly when someone has experienced infertility coupled with loss. Hopefully your sister can get counseling (it sounds like it might be possible to speak with her husband about this), but until she works through her grief and pain I would recommend just letting her know you love her and are there for her and accept her feelings.
Anonymous
I think you need to back way up. I’m really surprised u went over to announce with no warning. You should’ve sent her a note In writing first to allow her time to process. I would start the mending by sending an apology email saying you are sorry for springing it on her. Then I would drop your preconceived notions about how she should feel ( ie jealous but happy for you) and look to others for support. Even without her history, she couldn’t have “shared it” with you, but ideally sure she would be a source of support and sounding board. But I would instead use your mother for that
Nonny
But this is the thing. How was I to know that I even needed to give her a warning? Before now she’s given us no reason to believe this was such a sensitive subject. Of course if I had known I would have done it differently….but I didn’t. I did apologize already in my text.
RR
Don’t beat yourself up. You didn’t know. You couldn’t know. Hopefully, you never know. Your sister knows that.
Anonymous
Umm she had a miscarriage. It’s common sense
Anon
I disagree. I think it varies from person to person, and you don’t necessarily know what any one person will want. If I were Nonny’s sister, I would have been more upset if she’d told me via email/letter/text. It was going to be hurtful no matter what (the information, not the delivery) – at least don’t make it impersonal, too.
Anonymous
While it may be common sense that it’s possible she’d find the news upsetting, it’s certainly not common sense that her sister would have reacted by throwing her out of the house.
Anonymous
I don’t think it is common sense that someone who doesn’t/can’t have something would wish that no one else ever have that thing.
AIMS
It’s hardly common sense. Everyone would react differently and like Anon @ 1:36, I would have been more hurt to think that my sister wouldn’t tell me in person.
Nonny, I think you need to cut your sister all the slack in the world about this and don’t expect her to want to participate in this pregnancy experience with you (no expectation of baby shower, no sharing sonograms unless she asks, etc.), but I don’t think you need to feel bad about being pregnant either. You apologized for any hurt she felt, be forgiving in the future, and just give it time.
Anon
I disagree – personally, I’m thrilled for happiness of others I love when I’m doing badly. It makes me feel like at least there is good in the world.
Mpls
Her reaction sucks. But I agree that backing off for a bit is a good idea. Maybe call her in a couple weeks to talk about everything except the pregnancy? She knows you are pregnant now and if she wants to ask questions about it she can. But now you know its a sore topic for her, so you back off until she brings it up in a civil manner.
I think it is hard to predict how people will react to an infertility issue, and it’s unfortunate for you (and her) that she’s this one area is ruling her interactions with the rest of the world, but there isn’t anything YOU can do to make it better. It has to come from her.
Equity's Darling
I have no advice, but I offer hugs and sympathies, to both you and your sister- I can’t imagine how hard it must be for her, but I also don’t know what I would do in your situation. I hope that she just needs space for a while to process?
Anne Shirley
For now, let her be. Accept that you aren’t going to be sharing this experience with her. She behaved poorly, but it sounds like she is taking steps to handle thingsbetter, so I’d stuck with maybe emails? Calls? To discuss things other than pregnancy.
RR
This is so tough. Obviously, your sister is behaving unfairly to you, but just as obviously she’s going through some real difficulty. My husband and I struggled with infertility for seven years before conceiving our first children. During that time, I watched friends and family members get pregnant, have children, get pregnant with second children, have those children, and even get pregnant with third children. Seriously. People who should be having kids, and people who shouldn’t. I went to a dozen baby showers and probably skipped another dozen. I occasionally ranted to my husband unfairly about so and so who should SO not be having a baby and yet was. It’s an extraordinarily isolating experience. It’s one of those things that is very difficult to understand if you haven’t been through it. And it’s very, very easy to say totally the wrong thing with the best of intentions. I had a close friend tell me that she didn’t think I was handling infertility well–that she would have handled it better. I love her; she’s still a close friend; but 12 years later that sticks with me. Because how the hell would she know? With her two beautiful children and no fertility issues? How would she know what it’s like to confront the possibility of never having your own biological children? In retrospect, I should have been in counseling. But I couldn’t see that at the time at all. Infertility is like grieving a death. Except without the death and the certainty of death and the societal understanding of grieving a death. So it’s all the pain without a reference point for dealing with it. And with a lot of cruel, false hope.
All that said, I hope I was always positive and portrayed happiness to my pregnant friends. And generally I was happy–just so, so jealous. It’s totally unfair to you that your sister is taking your happy announcement and making it about her. It probably doesn’t help that unfairness, but she probably just can’t help it. If it were me, I would respond well to something like the following: Tell your sister that you love her and that you know she is in a lot of pain that you can’t begin to understand. Tell her that you will do whatever she needs. If she wants you to not talk about your pregnancy, then you will not talk about your pregnancy. If she needs to avoid your baby shower, you understand. You love her regardless, and you will do anything you can to help and make it easier.
Chances are very good that she will come around, that she already knows she’s being unreasonable and unfair. Give her a safe bubble to admit that.
I could cry for both of you right now (of course, I’m pregnant again myself, so I just cry). It will work out. Even before my husband and I finally conceived via IVF, I was in a better place. There’s a cycle to it, and she sounds like she’s in the worst of it.
Houston Attny
Your story made me tear up. Goodness. You are right – the pain is something I simply do not know and for ladies who really want children, I can’t imagine how completely heartbreaking. Thank you for sharing your story.
RR
Aw, thanks! I try to share whenever I can because it was so isolating. I want other people to not have some of the same interactions I had because they don’t understand what their friends are going through, and I want other people going through infertility to realize that their feelings are not wrong. I’m way past the hard parts–pregnant with my third child at this point–but you remember how it feels. I wouldn’t wish it on anyone.
That said, as a pregnant woman, I wouldn’t wish for any other pregnant woman to feel bad about being pregnant!! Nonny should be able to be happy and excited about her pregnancy without feeling guilty. I think it’s great that you are working so hard to understand where your sister is coming from. Just the fact that you asked how to deal with it makes you awesome in my book. So many people are just dismissive of their friends with fertility issues.
roses
Even though it is obvious that you care about your sister and want to approach this sensitive issue in the best way you can, perhaps she took it the wrong way when you offered help. In her mind, it could have come off as insincere or shallow; you have a baby on the way, she doesn’t – how are you supposed to help?
Instead, perhaps see if you can call her and reiterate that you are sorry that you upset her and that you recognize this is really difficult for her, but you’d like to do whatever you can to keep your close relationship because it means a lot to you. The ball is then in her court to open up and let you know what you can do to help or how she wants you to behave around her. Of course, this doesn’t mean you need to go along with unreasonable demands/requests, but at least hopefully it will get the conversation started.
TBK
It sounds like you approached sharing the news with a certain amount of sensitivity, and it sounds like your sister’s response was completely irrational. But now I think you just need to let it lie and leave it up to her to re-open your relationship. Speaking from some experience (but without having suffered a miscarriage, which must just be heart-breaking), there are some people for whom I am only happy when I hear they’re pregnant. I’m a little sad for myself, but thoroughly glad for them and completely able to engage with them by talking about it, buying gifts for the baby, looking at nursery furniture, etc. There are a handful of other people whose news has just upset me and I’ve withdrawn completely because I just feel like I have enough to deal with without also pretending to be happy whenever we talk about their babies. These are often people I’ve been competitive with in the past (no, babies are a competition, and, yes, this kind of feeling is not helpful, but geez there is nothing on earth as irrational as the feelings surrounding fertility). I don’t have sisters, but it seems to me that the sister relationship could be just exactly the kind to spark the withdraw rather than engage response. I’m sorry. And I’m really sorry for your sister. I hope she’s getting help, and I hope you two can repair your relationship in the future.
Anon
Honestly, I think your sister is way out of line. I can understand her being sad because she has not been able to get pregnant, but she should be happy and supportive of you.
Nonny
Thank you to all of you. This all makes me very sad for my sister. And to anon for this @ 2:01 – yes, I *am* completely clueless about what my sister has been going through. I have no idea. That’s part of the problem. In the past 24 hours I’ve done a fair bit of internet reading about the emotional effects of infertility – but reading about it can’t possibly be the same as going through it.
I think I will wait a day or two and then e-mail her along the lines of what you all have suggested. I want to be supportive but it sounds like I need to wait for my sister to tell me how.
Love and hugs to you all.
Anonymous
Sometimes when emotions are running high, it’s best and easiest to apologize, even if you don’t think you’re in the wrong. No long-winded, soul-searching conversation is required. Just a “Hey, I’m sorry if I wasn’t sensitive to you and your feelings were hurt. You mean a lot to me and I don’t want this to disrupt our relationship.” Hopefully that’s enough and that’s the end of it. Obviously you would have to tread carefully in the future, however, lest old wounds be reopened. At the same time, she’s going to have to come to grips with the fact that you’re going to have a child. Whether she does is ultimately up to her.
Given the large size of the problem, I think a phone call is in order rather than something more impersonal like a text or email. If you get voicemail, leave a message saying you want to talk — don’t put the whole apology on voicemail.
Anonforthis
Your sister is out of line, but honestly, I get where she is coming from. My sister and I are very close in age and very close. We get along well. At Christmas I told her my husband and I were planning to TTC in July. The only reason we were waiting is because I had just started a new job. We ended up moving that timeframe up a few months and right when we were about to start trying, she called to say she was 5 weeks pregnant and had gotten pregnant on the second month of trying. Since then, I have yet to get pregnant and each month I go through a massive “it’s not fair” pity party, even though I intellectually I know that it takes most people 6-8 months of trying. We both visited my parents last weekend and I found myself thinking “Ha! She has fat face now!” I am so jealous and envious. I have a stepdaughter that I love very very much but at every turn, it is made clear to me that she is not “mine” and I worry I will never have a kid that is mine. Every new baby picture on facebook or we’re pregnant announcements has me falling into a depression (which I am working through with a therapist). It’s just that most of my friends have had/are trying for kid #2 and I’ve been ready to get this show on the road for a long time.
I absolutely love my sister and have outwardly been supportive and happy and I even emailed her this morning to remind her that she needs to hurry up and pick a date for her baby shower. But to say that her pregnancy isn’t really frustrating/demoralizing/upsetting would be a big fat lie and for all I know, we don’t even have fertility problems.
Blonde Lawyer
Nonny, I just want to say that you are an amazing sister for asking for advice here, feeling bad, and wanting to fix the relationship. I am a much less charitable person and when I read what you wrote, my mouth fell open and I thought WTF! How in the world are you supposed to know where your sister is emotionally, two years after her loss, if she has never shared with you that she is having a bad time? There is no excuse, in my book, for her throwing you out of the house. I am in the minority here, so I don’t recommend you follow my advice, but if I were you, I’d be waiting for an apology from her, not apologizing to her. NO amount of crazy, however excusable, justifies throwing your own sister out of your house when she comes to you to say she is pregnant, no matter what you have been through. You didn’t announce it at her wedding or at a funeral or something. You did it, in private, at her house. You didn’t do anything wrong. If you want to take the high road and try to mend this, go for it but in my book, she owes you the apology.
Nonny
Blonde Lawyer – to be frank, that was my initial thought process on Saturday. But then I came to the conclusion that, having never been through infertility issues myself, I didn’t know what she was dealing with and I needed to be more compassionate. Thank you for voicing what initially went through my head!
Nonny
PS Also, while I do feel a lot of sympathy for her situation, in my heart of hearts my sympathy kind of fails when people start taking their difficulties out on family members. But I’m trying to be the better person and I will take the high road because that’s what I think is needed here….
anon for this
Ok, I’ll be frank. You have now described your sister as “volatile” and yourself as “the peacemaker” and “the better person” who “will take the high road.” We have no way of knowing whether your characterizations are accurate or whether your description of what happened at her house is correct. Maybe your sister is a total piece of work, maybe you’re exaggerating; there always is another side to the story. Either way, it doesn’t sound like you consider her your equal or that you take her perspective seriously. Which may well be justified.
What I think you have to ask yourself is what relationship you really have with your sister, and (realistically) where you want to go from here. Sad as it may be, your posts make me wonder if you are just not very close. They also make me wonder if you are truly interested in fixing that.
anon for this
On a lighter note, I should add that I am the oldest of three sisters, and I have a tendency to view myself as the “reasonable” one. I suspect, though, that my sisters view things differently. Needless to say, they’re wrong. :)
Anon
Your sister’s reaction may have been extreme but understand that she is probably in a lot of pain. We have been battling infertility for years now and I cannot subject myself to baby events; it just hurts too much. That does not mean that I don’t love my friends and family who get pregnant or that I somehow wish them ill. So I do not go to baby showers or delve into the details of their pregnancies. I hope your sister does come around but please do not expect her to share this experience with you.
Anonnnn
Can’t help but think of the whole “life is 10% what happens to you and 90% how you respond to it” thing. I’m very sorry that your sister is having a difficult time, but lashing out at everyone in her life is only going to make things worse for her in the long run. I realize that infertility is an extremely difficult thing for anyone to face, and she has every right to be upset about it, and every right to want to distance herself from others if it helps to lessen the pain. But there’s a line. And, IMO, she crossed it.
anon for this
To add to the other posters: you sound well-intentioned and sweet but I also get the impression you are completely clueless about what your sister has been going through. Your sister’s reaction sounds disproportionate to me, but does that matter? As someone who struggles with an unfulfilled child wish, I am genuinely happy for pregnant family members and friends but these announcements also confront me with what is missing from my life. Finding out about other people’s pregnancies often leads me to shed a few tears, especially when the person is close to me.
I should say that being an aunt to my sisters’ children is the best thing that could have happened to me, short of having my own child. While it isn’t always easy to see my sisters with their children, I am quite close to my sisters’ children and having them in my life has made me much more at peace with not having my own. However, unlike your sister I have not always dreamed of having children and I feel that my life is quite fulfilling without them.
For what it’s worth, my advice is to give your sister a few days and if you don’t hear from her, reach out again. Write from your heart and don’t focus on the way you handled the announcement. Instead, tell her you love her, that she is immensely important to you, and that you want to have her in your life and in your child’s life. If this is how you feel, you may want to write that you feel terrible you didn’t realize how difficult and lonely the past few years must have been for her, and apologize for not having been much support. Either way, the next time you meet up with her, listen. Be there. Leave it up to her whether she wants to talk about your pregnancy. And if she does, don’t feel like you need to downplay the experience but do watch her carefully for signs that she may have heard enough.
Hugs to both of you. I really hope you can work this out.
Gus
I think it’s unfair to Nonny to criticize her for being “completely clueless” about what her sister’s been going through. Her sister has chosen not to share it with her, which is of course completely the sister’s right. Lots of people keep their fertility struggles, and their feelings about it, very private, and the appropriate thing to do is to respect that. You also can’t say, well, Nonny should have realized what her sister was going through because she knew the sister had a miscarriage and still doesn’t have a baby. But this would presume that all women cope with these issues the same way. I have friends who have been devastated by miscarriages, and others who have been sad for a period of time and largely put it behind them (their words, not mine).
The sister will either come around to dealing with Nonny’s pregnancy or she won’t, but that’s really the sister’s issue to work through. I just don’t see why Nonny should have to apologize for not being much support when the sister wasn’t keeping her in the loop or reaching out to her in any way.
Anonymous
I am surprised at how many people seem willing to completely excuse what just comes down to bad behaviour. My sister announced she was pregnant shortly after I suffered a miscarriage (that my family didn’t know about) and as difficult as it was to be happy for her, I would never ever scream at her or throw her out of my house. It’s one thing to not be able to jump for joy, but it’s another entirely to treat someone so terribly. I don’t see why the fact that someone is grieving gives them license to be mean/hateful towards other people (I’m assuming, of course, that there is no underlying psychological problem that is preventing the sister from responding in a more appropriate manner). Sad is one thing, but lashing out is another entirely.
anon for this
@Gus: I take your point about some people being private, although I still think the onus isn’t entirely on the person who is going through hard times to reach out to others (especially to family members and close friends).
I do want to note that I did not say Nonny should apologize. Nonny asked for advice on how to deal with this situation and I offered a suggestion. I made very clear that it was something she might write if it reflects her feelings. The larger point is to move away from The Announcement and let her sister know she’s open up for discussing the larger issues — hopefully without pointing fingers at each other.
Nonny
I appreciate everyone’s feedback and differing points of view. I do agree that it is a good idea to move away from The Announcement and deal with the larger issues.
There was a suggestion made above that I don’t see my sister as my equal or take her perspective seriously. I really do take her seriously and we are definitely equals. Like many sisters, we have very different personalities and my comments on her volatility and my role in family conflicts is just based on the differences in how we deal with stress/conflict situations – that is all. My desire to take her concerns seriously is what prompted this entire discussion – I needed to figure out how to respond to something that clearly upset her very much, for which I had no reference point.
We are six years apart so maybe we aren’t as close as some other sisters. But we have a good relationship (usually!) and I one that I really value.
Thanks everyone, again, for your input.
TO Lawyer
Just another thought – I’m not condoning your sister’s behavior at all but there is a chance she reacted the way she did because you can often misbehave with your family and they’ll still love you. It could be that she had been reaching her boiling point with all her friends getting pregnant and then when it was her sister, it just hit too close to home and she couldn’t deal.
I think you’re dealing with it the same way I would and hope it all goes well!
Anon for this
Nonny, I have a feeling you and your sister will work things out. I really, really hope that your sister will love being an aunt as soon as she holds your baby in her arms — that’s pretty much what happened to me.
I hope my posts didn’t strike you as harsh; they weren’t intended as such.
Lastly, and most importantly: Congratulations on your pregnancy!