ByElizabeth Hours Updated
Comments 254 Comments

Frugal Friday’s Workwear Report: Shell Tank

A woman wearing a white sleeveless top with off-white pants and a matching belt

Our daily workwear reports suggest one piece of work-appropriate attire in a range of prices.

Looking for a perfect summer shell? We’ve got you. This crewneck top from Banana Republic Factory is a perfect summer basic. Layer it under a blazer in a formal office or let your arms fly free in a more casual setting.

I can never have enough white tops, so this “snow white” color was added to my cart, but it also comes in six other colorways.

The top is $36–$42 at Banana Republic Factory — with an extra 20% off at checkout — and comes in sizes XXS–XXL.

Sales of note for 12.5

254 Comments

  1. Yay! Fruegal Friday’s! I love Fruegal Friday’s and this cute shell tank from Banana Repubic. Great pick, Elizabeth! I forgot to tell the hive that Rosa and Ed are in marrage counseling b/c Ed wants to move from Meril Lynch to small group where he would be much more responsible for admin tasks as a partner then he is now, since Merril Lynch has many people to do that stuff. Ed wants to “run his own ship” while Rosa wants to keep telling people Ed is a manageing director at Merril Lynch. Personally, I sympathize with Ed and agree with his outlook. You only get big when you go smaller. That is why I never joined the Goverment when I worked in DC — too bueaucratic for my tastes. Good lesson for all of us! Have a great weekend, Elizabeth and Kat!!!! YAY!!

  2. I know this is probably a question no one can answer, but how do you know if therapy is working? I’ve started therapy earlier this year for working through childhood trauma and the way it impacts my life now. And I feel like I’m feeling all these feelings that have stayed below the surface most of my life but am not sure if/how it’s really helping me improve or how I would know.

    2. It took about a year of therapy for me to see an improvement. Things were hard for that year, but the subsequent years have been better. But yeah, ask your therapist too.

    3. I went to therapy for anxiety, so my experience may be different, but for me, I’ve noticed that my ruminative thoughts aren’t as disruptive or frequent, and I’ve also started using coping mechanisms when I feel anxiety or irritability is overwhelming me. It’s only been three months, so I don’t think I can expect a huge improvement just yet. But it is definitely better. I’ve also paired it with a new SSRI and I think the effect of both together has made a big difference.

    4. As someone who has had to discuss past trauma in therapy, I think the beginning is insanely hard. It’s like you’ve buried all of these things over time, and now here you are dredging them up and taking a long, hard look. It’s uncomfortable to say the least. I agree with the other poster who said to give it a year. At some point it starts to feel less painful and just like another part of your life, in my experience.

    5. I think it’s like a home remodeling project: the house looks mostly OK, and then you start opening walls and realize that the plumbing and electric needs to be replaced too, and some of the beams are unstable, etc. etc. There’s a long stretch where things are torn up, trash and building supplies and dust are everywhere. It looks like you made things worse, not better.

    6. I know some people who ended up switching from generic talk therapy or insight oriented to EMDR or somatic therapies, but not really until the “insights” were already gained. But I don’t think there’s a way around the feeling all the feelings stage no matter what approach is used.

      1. +1
        that has been my experience in addressing childhood trauma as well. I also am attending ACA meetings both live and on zoom, and the insights are profound. The meetings have had a significant impact as being seen and heard by others whom have had childhood trauma helps to ameliorate the “aloneness” of the adult impacts of the trauma.

        sending good wishes to you :)

    7. I know everyone here always recommends therapy and I’m sure it’s probably life saving in many cases. In my experience therapy did not really help. I know everyone is different though. Talking about it all just dredged it up again and not in a good way.

      3. another +1 – I did talk therapy for 6 years and was just so bored by the end talking about my problems. I’m depressed because of my family situation (disabled child), which isn’t going to change any time soon, so I just don’t think there’s any amount of reframing it that will help.

        but thanks to some comments here we are looking into family counseling, which might help all of us be better together, so thanks for that reccommendation.

        1. What helped me the most, in your situation, was finding my support group of other family members in the same situation. It was much, much more effective venting and learning from other people in the same situation. And even better, sometimes we learned about local resources, doctors/therapists etc.. from others.

          What an individual therapist can sometimes do is help you figure out when an anti-depressant/happy light/sleep aids/exercise etc.. might help.

    8. I went to therapy to work through some more recent traumatic events, so I’m not sure if this would work the same way for childhood trauma, but for me it felt like I was clicking when I realized I was able to think about those events without having a stress reaction. I still feel sadness when I think about them – I think on some level I always will, they’re painful things and that seems very reasonable – but my heart doesn’t race, I don’t immediately focus on them to exclusion of whatever else I’m doing at the time, and if I do find myself going in that direction, I’m able to redirect my brain.

    9. For me,therapy is working when I feel more centered and aligned in my life and when the things I went to therapy for aren’t making a materially, observably negative different in my mood, habits, and relationships. Like you I also went to therapy for childhood trauma (twice, about 8 years apart, and in the middle did a ton of work on my own (the book ‘mother hunger’ changed my life)).
      I think as we grow and age there can be new things to process – for example, my first time in therapy was that Things Actually Weren’t OK/What Even Is a Feeling? and the second time was more like Can We Let This Go Already?/These Feelings Are Running My Life. As some other posters have said, talk therapy is often most useful with body based therapies. Somatic experiencing/somatic healing did help me somewhat, esp the in-the-moment tools like tapping the sternum. Talk therapy gave me a supportive witness – it also game me strategies like re-scripting past events (moving the child me to my safe space) which I found immensely helpful.
      The biggest shift for me came in seeing therapy – whatever the kind of intervention – as a way to live with my life as it is, instead of trying to change it. Do you know that image of the grief jar? That the ball in the jar doesn’t get smaller, but the jar gets bigger? I think that’s a good analogy for what therapy can achieve for childhood trauma and the feeling you might have when you are ‘feeling progress’.

  3. Who has wide-leg full length white linen pants that they like? Please recommend to me – ISO some for this summer. Thanks! :)

    1. I’ve not tried the wide-leg version, but I have tapered linen pants and shorts from Old Navy and I’m happy with the quality.

    2. Adding on to the earlier comment, I have both the tapered and wide-leg linen-blend Old Navy pants in several colors, including white. Mine have been machine-washed and line dried at least 20 times and they look great. These are definitely casual pants, but I wear them lots during the warmer months.

    4. Another vote for old navy. I have the drawstring wide leg ones in black and they are great. They were only $30. A bit long for my short legs. I also throw them in the drier and the are FINE! Amazing.

  4. DH constantly is pacing around the house all day when he’s home, like he has a lot of pent up energy and just needs to let it out. It has led to some real communication issues. When I enter a room to ask him a question he may give a short answer and then immediately bolt from the room, which means I have to follow him around the house just to have a conversation. Sometimes he may come to a room that I am in to say something, but then immediately turn around and leave the room before I have a chance to respond. I think the constant pacing around is an ADHD thing, but it also feels like talking to me is uncomfortable for him, even when the topic is mundane. I’m a quiet introvert so not a huge talker, but even I need some adult interaction. We sometimes talk over dinner, but they are usually short and interrupted by our toddler. He is a good dad but we don’t communicate well at all. We’ve talked about this in couples therapy but there hasn’t been a change in his behavior. Anyone else dealt with a partner like this?

    1. Has he tried an ADHD executive function coach specifically for strategies to stay in one room talking to you? Seems well worth a try.

      1. Not the OP, but would like to know more about this. How do you find these people? Is it a specialized type of OT or psychologist or LCSW?

        1. I think you can just google executive function coach near me and try to go with someone well reviewed? I know someone who found a few sessions helpful for a specific situation like that.

        2. I bet it’s anybody who slaps the label “Executive Function Coach” on themselves and starts an instagram account.

    2. What’s his physical activity routine like? DH benefits from a 15 minute morning walk (with dog now), and a fast run at lunchtime. He’s WFH so usually gets dressed in his workout clothes in the morning and showers after his run. Sometimes he adds a half hour on the spin bike before bed.

      I can see the difference in how unsettled his body is and how unfocused his conversations are on the days he misses a run.

      1. I’m a lot like this. I struggle on days when I don’t get a lot of exercise. Yesterday I was actually just dancing around the kitchen because I’d been sitting at my desk for several hours – even though I’d also gotten a morning Peloton ride. Things that help during the day are pacing while on calls without video and a standing desk. I’ve looked into a tread desk, but the setup doesn’t look like it would work for me.

      2. Wow, are we married to the same guy?

        If my husband doesn’t walk the dogs (he usually takes them about 2 miles) in the morning, he’s super-restless and unfocused for the rest of the day. Something about that early-morning exercise helps tamp down whatever’s kicking around in his brain and gets the neurochemicals in alignment so he can proceed with his day and communicate like a reasonable person.

    3. My hubs is kind of like this – I send a lot of texts sort of as a shot across the bow as well as to make sure he’s got it in writing.

      With both of us (both wfh for 8 years now) I feel like we may be mid-deep thought for work or other even if it seems like we’re in a common space in the house, so weird interactions during the day are to be expected.

    4. Have you tried talking walks or hikes outdoors together? Maybe you could have intentional walk and talk settings?

      1. Yeah, if I wanted to have a Talk with him, I’d invite him to go for a walk. (Although I totally get that may not always be pracitcal.)

    5. Can you meet him where he is as opposed to trying to fix him? That feeling of needing to move constantly is part of ADHD, exacerbated by lack of exercise or sleep or stress, and if you’re in the middle of the toddler years, I’d bet he’s dealing with all three.

      Go for a walk with him around the block with kiddo in a stroller and see if he can focus enough to talk. See if an exercise bike or treadmill or knitting project helps keep him anchored?

      I think you’re also internalizing and resenting the feeling of being unimportant, instead of recognizing that this is a part of neurodiversity.

  5. Has anyone here followed the Jordanian Royal Wedding? Royal things are my guilty pleasure, and I had high hopes for both dresses after the fantastic henna party dress. But man, they did the bride so wrong. That D&G dress looked cheap and tacky and the styling with gloves and hairstyle didn’t do anything to enhance the bride’s natural beauty!

    1. I loved the ceremony dress. I see what she was going for with the reception dress but it was just not working. Thought Beatrice looked lovely and Princess Elisabeth had my favorite evening look. And I want Kate to stop wearing the same tiara all the time and stop buying identical evening dresses. I don’t mind the repeats for day but that Jenny packham was boring in green and isn’t improved by being inspid pink.

      1. I love that tiara, though. If I owned it and had occasions to wear it, I too would wear it everywhere. (I also liked the bride’s tiara)

        1. Agreed I loved the bride’s tiara. I like the lovers knot but there are so many other options!

        2. I haven’t seen a clear picture of the bride’s tiara, but I love the idea of it.

          I feel like Kate must like her tiara b/c she reaches for it often, but I kinda want her to use other pretty tiaras that exist but are not seen often. [She is like me b/c I have some workhorse dresses in multiple colors.]

          3. Maybe it is the one she doesn’t have to ask permission to wear That would be motivating for me.

          4. That tiara was associated with Princess Diana, so that may be another reason she wears it so often.

      2. I love that green Jenny Packham, but I agree it is less successful in pink, especially compared to her gorgeous ceremony dress.

        I didn’t love the bride’s ceremony dress (I thought the separate parts didn’t all gel together), but I liked it more in comparison to that horrible reception dress.

        I didn’t realize how close the Jordanians are with Kate and Will – I enjoyed Will and Hussein’s bro hug in the reception line, and apparently Kate’s mom, sister, and brother in law were spotted at the larger reception. I also didn’t know how close the Jordanians are with the Bidens, who apparently spent a lot of time with Hussein when he was at Georgetown.

        1. I think Kate’s family lived in Jordan for a year or two when growing up and they have vacationed there a few times with their own kids.

        2. Don’t forget that England colonized much of the Middle East, including what is now Israel, well into the 20th Century. During that time, England was closer to the Arab countries and their agendas than to Jews and their agendas (to the point of preventing European Jews fleeing Hitler from entering Mandatory Palestine).

          One nice thing about the Princess of Wales is that she has demonstrated interest in Holocaust history — meeting with survivors on numerous occasions and photographing portraits of them and their families — and that helps American Jews square our cognitive dissonance about England (England is our ally in all things democracy but also has a nasty history of antisemitism).

      3. I’d love to see her in a new tiara, but I don’t think this was the right occasion to debut one.

      4. I liked both Kate’s reception dress (Elie Saab) and the JP gown/tiara. She looked fantastic. Especially considering how some of her more conservative looks lately (understandably) have been feeling so frumpy. Maybe it’s because I am about the same age and work in a very conservative job but I’ve been very mindful of how at 41, some of the more staid stuff can read a bit dowdy while some of the younger stuff feels not quite appropriate. I thought she walked the line with both dresses perfectly.

        I thought the bride’s ceremony dress (also Elie Saab? ) was beautiful. Agree that the reception dress was not great. It looked like a badly decorated cake to my eye. I like Rania’s dress too thought maybe black at your son’s wedding is not the most festive note to strike.

        1. I liked the ceremony dress until I saw her seated. The pleated layers moved up and it looked very strange IMO.
          Something flowy would have worked much better for both dresses.

          And yes to the cake comparison.

        2. I just think that dusty pink isn’t a great color on Kate. A baby blue would have been much better IMO if the dark green of the Jenny Packham dress was not right for the season or event. Great dress on her. And she never looks like her shoes are bothering her, which for me would be quite a feat to pull off.

        3. +1
          I think the JP dress and tiara combo was lovely.

          Theres something about the placement that makes me think this is a tiara that works well with some extra travel hair, an added high quality hairpiece to make sure the hair is perfect and well-behaved.

        4. I actually really liked the “cake” reception dress. It seemed really festive to me!

        1. Beatrice York wast wearing the same dress that other lady in the wedding (ooops). I’m seeing it in Vogue and Bazaar.

    3. I also loved Maxima’s and CP Mary’s ceremony looks, and thought CP Amalia of the Netherlands looked fantastic at the reception.

      1. Crown Princess Mary looked amazing! But I’m a big fan of hers tbh. I love her story – nice Australian girl meets some guy in a bar that turns out to be the Crown Prince of Denmark.

        Related: there is also a very funny video of all her kids roasting her for her Danish (even though apparently she’s worked super hard to learn a tough language).

    5. The d&g dress was super tacky and I didn’t like her jewellery either.

      I actually liked Ivanka’s dress a lot but I can’t stand her !

    7. I’m loving all the clothes. I actually liked her 2nd dress (cake frosting). I was meh about her first dress, but understand the need for coverage probably put a restriction on designer’s creativity. (I don’t think the designer handled that neckline well, but that’s me.)
      I also loved her henna party dress.

      1. P.S. Thought Kate looked extremely frumpy and overly decorated. I much prefer Leticia and Mary’s restraint. I even prefer Maxima’s outfit (I can tell she has a sense of humor from the way she dresses).

  6. Where can I recycle cloth? I have a torn bedsheet that I’d prefer not to put in a trashcan, but I’m failing on where to take it to he recycled somehow.
    please don’t suggest making it a rag. I had my own rags and I just inherited my mom’s when she passed last year. I have enough rags to last for my lifetime.

    2. What about those random sheds in parking lots that are clothing donation bins? I think I’ve heard they just recycle what goes in those.

      1. Yeah, I think those just end up in landfills in poorer countries, unfortunately.

        OP could try to find a place that truly does recycle textiles, but I think most of the options will just lead to it becoming trash.

    4. If it’s 100% cotton, check with your local wildlife rehabber. Cotton sheets and t-shirts are useful for baby animal bedding because the weave/loops are too small for tiny claws to get stuck.

      3. I’ve had to come to this realization also – some things are just trash unless you’ve got a lot and want to take them to a particular recycler. I feel like every city should have a biannual event where all the various recyclers are in one spot.

      4. Agree, some things are just trash. OP, no one wants your old torn bedsheet. That’s just the truth. If you can’t make use of it yourself, into the trash it goes.

        1. Well, as you can see there are places these things can go.

          I also like to throw away as little as possible, especially if something is potentially useful.

        2. I don’t think OP was asking ‘who wants her torn sheet’. Recycling and upcycling are often confused. Cotton and wood scraps could e.g. be broken down and recycled into paper products, minimizing the need to cut down more trees. (And it’s not just cutting down the trees, there are so many knock on effects, like heavy commercial foresting vehicles compressing the forest floor, and impacting trees’ root systems’ natural ability to withstand drought periods). I know we are used to an infinite supply of materials and not worrying where do they come from where do they go…

    6. Look up fabric recycling in your area. NYC has official places and you can even ask to have the department of sanitation put one in your building. H&M also recycles fabric as do some (all?) Nordstroms. You can check online.

    7. I have not received it yet, but I just ordered a recycle bag from a company “For Days”. For $20 you can order a bag, I can fill it with used clothing and textiles (ex. sheets, decor fabric, sewing scraps), etc, and then send it back in. Once received, you get a $20 credit in their store. I haven’t received the bag “yet” but if this is weighing on you how to recycle, might be something to look into.

    8. My county has a website with info about recycling various items. I’d check there and Google “textile recycling” with your zip code.

    9. There is lots of recycling of fabrics now–google it in your area and you will find some pick up or drop off boxes.

  7. Any fans of Carve Designs here? Their swimsuits look great and I need a new one. But I am a pear, so IDK how this brand runs IRL and on people who aren’t models. And the shorts look cute, but bottoms are hard for me to get right, even in brands I often shop at (Athleta, BR, ON, JCF) — the advent of elastic backs in many 2023 pants is a total game changer now that curvy fits seem to have disappeared along with skinny jeans.

    1. I am a rectangle and find that the bottoms run large. I have to size down in the bottoms.

    2. I have a shirt I like but haven’t tried the swimwear. Shirt runs true to size. REI sells them, so if you have an REI near you, check there to try on in person.

    3. I love Carve but I haven’t found one that works well for my pear-shaped body. If it fits on the bottom, it’s too baggy on top. And, many of their bottoms are just way too low-cut on me. I don’t need high rise, but if I’m in danger of exposing crack, there is a problem. If you’re willing to wear a bikini, you’ll probably have more luck. But I’m strictly a tankini or 1-piece person, and they sadly didn’t work.

  8. I didn’t get to reply back yesterday but just wanted to say a very heartfelt thank you to everyone who responded to my biopsy question. I am still exceedingly nervous but it helps to know that others got thru the experience. This is the kind of thing I really cherish about this place. Thank you.

    1. OH, and to the poster going thru this too: I will be thinking of you and sending you all the good vibes. Enjoy your vacation and good luck!

  9. My company’s mandatory staff retreat has a working lunch, where we do not have a caterered lunch, we have to pay our own way. To make it even more cringe we’re encouraged to bake cookies for the executives. Ugh, we peons are already underpaid this is such BS.

    1. This is so cringe. (Also, I realize the pandemic isn’t where it was, but are we really at the “mandatory staff retreat” stage yet?)

      1. My company had one, but took real precautions to make it safe for me (high risk). The venue was completely open to the outside all day with good airflow. I think I could’ve skipped if I had really needed to, but it was definitely best to attend. My husband’s company had a non-mandatory retreat around the same time and it resulted in a mini outbreak.

      2. We are at that stage. I have a retreat next week. I am not the original poster but my office once had a mandatory breakfast meeting where each person was required to pay their own way, and then they ran out of food. The cookie thing is right there.

      3. I’m in a liberal east coast city, and I don’t know anyone taking Covid precautions anymore. I never seen anyone on the subway with a mask on anymore and can’t remember the last time I saw someone wearing a mask in store. Like it or not, we have reached the point where most people are not taking covid precautions anymore and consider the pandemic over

        1. Really? I’m in a liberal west coast city and I still see about 10-20% masking. I was on a flight between two liberal west coast cities and it was probably 25% N95 masking.

          1. Yeah I’m in a red state and no one masks here, and the masking is noticeable to me when we travel to liberal coastal cities. I’d say it’s more like 10% than 25% but definitely still some people.

          2. Bay Area here. I have COVID. It’s not over folks. I feel like not garbage. 0/10 do not recommend.

          3. When you see 80-90% not masking anymore, you can not really make an argument that “people” still take precautions.

        2. Your local epidemiologist had a stat last week that 40% of people are still masking but I do think it’s heavily contingent on community. I wfh but still mask at the grocery store; we avoid indoor events if we can help it.

          2. When I saw the YLE statistic, I LOLed. I am cautious within my circle and I haven’t worn a mask in a few months, and rarely see anyone else in a mask (maybe 1/100 on the train or in the grocery store? Some but few servers/librarians at work?)
            Not sure where those 40% of people are masking, but I think it’s very inflated.
            To the original question, my co is regularly having fly-in retreats and I’m not seeing much/any masking at those or in or around the office, so yes we’re there.

          3. We still mask indoors for the most part, although we’re not perfectly consistent about it (we see friends indoors without masks, my kids are mask-free at school and activities because we think that’s important, and we have done limited indoor swimming and indoor dining without masks). We see a lot of my elderly parents, who have never had Covid and are extremely cautious, and I don’t want to be the one to give them Covid if we can help it. Wearing a mask at the grocery store or on a plane is not a burden to me, so even if it mitigates the risk to my parents by only a tiny amount I’m happy to do it. But I agree it’s nowhere near 40% of people masking. For air travel, it’s maybe 10-20% of people, especially in more liberal areas, but airplanes and airports are really the only place I see significant masking these days.

        3. Midwest here and Covid precautions are not a thing anymore. I flew to the east coast about a month ago and masks were few and far between in the airport and there was MAYBE 10 people between all 4 legs of my flights masking.

          So, yes, not only are we at mandatory staff retreat stage, most of us have been there for well over a year now.

        5. At this point almost everyone has had their first exposure to Covid, via vaccination or infection. Statistically, we’re at less risk now.

          1. Definitely risk of acute hospitalization / dying of ARDS / cytokine storms is lowered.

            Risk of long COVID is also lowered, but more studies have come out showing that people who didn’t get long COVID from their first infection can still get it from subsequent infections, so there are a lot of questions about whether this cohort is growing faster than it’s shrinking.

            I haven’t seen that mortality from post-COVID cardiac complications has fallen much, though the most recent data also isn’t out yet. Omicron was rough in cardiovascular terms, even when it wasn’t as hard on the lungs.

          2. So there was a very interesting article in the NYT this week about Covid lung damage. They showed lung scans of 3 people who had gotten Covid. All were unvaccinated: two got Covid before vaccines came out; the third had gotten it in the summer of 2021 before he had the chance to get vaccinated.

            The scans, images, stories and outcomes were fascinating. One woman spent a MONTH on ECMO and she is still on medication but no longer needs supplemental oxygen. Another man, who did not get nearly as sick, is still on oxygen, is seriously compromised in activities of daily life and may need a lung transplant. The third still needs supplemental oxygen but is living a mostly-normal life.

            I would encourage both the super-cautious and the super-nonchalant to go read the article (I am pasting in a gift link below so it should not be paywalled). It was great to have some case-study information about what really goes on with people’s lungs when they get Covid. One quote from the article:

            “Today, with coronavirus vaccines, antiviral treatments and other developments, doctors say they encounter few patients who are so severely afflicted. But they worry about those who wrestle with Covid’s enduring effects.”

            If you are a die-hard believer that Covid is the end of the world, I don’t think this will change your mind; if you are a die-hard believer that Covid was never a big deal, I don’t think it will change your mind. I do think for those of us who took precautions but are fully vaccinated and wondering how cautious we need to be now, it was helpful for me to read these stories and see the expert commentary and realize that vaccination really does work and it was worth doing, and since I am 4x vaccinated I probably need to let go of some of my fears of severe disease, because it doesn’t seem to be prevalent among the vaccinated.

            https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2023/05/31/health/covid-lung-damage.html?unlocked_article_code=Bo8sqaeyy0zuWR6_CdDu_732up1NJoJI-HxN-EG174ip_q0nV93lkor-3fVGSIL-utmDXBQd88dIYc8BZhAirKySzC1jEDwpBp-yru0xVekJyOU3e5nuqLTNj3xluOv_Vdh6JGq-9TqP07YccUQREX4BatsFW3qqDKyPDvJiGEs7h5P6D4JJ73TAbI8z_lc66CGDsMsfunaWIwYoHGstmuIvKHIerNFCUl8_l1s6uFL9eIa8yEcmOIZk9IkHH84cI1ntjX9Z8zHJt6uWMeZyYN8yR_iJiyfbOpWq1TaSVhjmzx5AbjZpIiFgGt9q66z9ykfZ9P88ZKom7FGCj6D5DJB206M1WRwOKX0&smid=url-share

      4. I have a three-day mandatory conference at the end of the year. I have been able to avoid each one since covid due to my high risk but no more. I was directed in no uncertain terms that I must attend. The conference has had no precautions in the last two years. Last ear, nearly half of those who attended were out sick the following week. And seeing the news this week that 181 people caught covid at the annual CDC conference is not comforting. I guess can only avoid it for so long.

        1. * bivalent booster 3 weeks before
          * N95 or N100 at all times
          * Enovid (can’t hurt, seems to help)
          * pre-filled Paxlovid prescription
          * test each morning (so you can start the Paxlovid ASAP)

      5. It is over. You cannot pandemic forever. And if you want any prayer of people doing anything for the next one, you have to let it go.

        1. This. If you would like to continue wearing a mask absolutely feel free to do so. Expecting everyone else to be taking precautions now just makes you seem unhinged.

          1. Well, I hope that you don’t think all people still wearing masked are unhinged!

            Lots of the seniors I know still wear them when in crowded places and so do my friends who are younger but immunocompromised. Those are great reasons to still wear masks, although even they admit they aren’t as strict as they once were. Even I will wear a mask in certain scenarios – always when on an airplane, and if I know I have a visit coming up with my elderly family, I will be cautious / mask more the week before.

            I have to admit, I love not getting sick. I haven’t even had a cold since before COVID! Maybe it’s just that I wash my hands more, and also that people are better about staying home when they are sick? I don’t have kids obviously (!)

            I think for folks who are still nervous now, the nice thing is that if you are fully vaccinated chances are much much lower of having any severe complications from getting COVID now. And if you need to be safe, just wear an N95. Doctors who wear their N95s don’t get sick when they are around very sick patients all day, who don’t wear masks. So it is a much safer place for all of us.

            I do wish everyone would get vaccinated though. That would decrease the viral load in the population, open up more hospital beds (since the unvaccinated getting COVID are still more likely to get sicker) etc..

        2. +1 that there’s a big aspect of the cost-benefit analysis on the impacts of what we do now on the next pandemic or other major disaster.

        3. Agree 100%.

          Once the U.S. government and the WHO said the emergency is over, it’s really really (really) over. We’ve been having mandatory in-person meetings for a year and a half at my job and the only thing that’s happened is that people passed a nasty cold (definitively not Covid; people tested) around after our January onsite. No different than anything that would have happened in pre-pandemic times.

          As far as the cookies thing: I would do nothing, and if asked by some suck-up toady why I didn’t bake cookies for the execs, I would look at the person with a puzzled expression on my face and say “why on earth would I do that?” Because that request is ridiculous.

          1. The WHO in specifically said while the international coordination enabled by the state of emergency is no longer warranted, that no nation should make the mistake of lowering precautions.

          2. Anon at 12:15, please, by all means, continue living in whatever elaborate mental bubble you’ve constructed for yourself that is reinforcing your view that it’s okay to continue sheltering from the world and keeping yourself separate from others. The pandemic restrictions apparently met a deep-seated psychological need for you to disengage from normal life and isolate yourself from others, and I understand that can be difficult to let go of. And, you apparently have neither the desire to let go of it or the desire to consider whether or not letting go of it is an appropriate action. But the rest of us are moving on, and you need to accept that. Continuing to try to convince people here that they still need to live in desperate fear of Covid is not working. It has not been working for a long time. It would be a better use of your precious time and energy to do something else.

          3. Anon at 1:00 PM, I’m going to continue to listen to my entire university research hospital medical team; I think they probably have a better handle on the current situation than you do. No one with any relevant qualifications is advising me that I’m good to go out and eat lunch at a staff retreat.

        4. I think it’s fine to say that it’s over for you, but I do regret that we are at the stage where we are sneering even at high-risk people for continuing to take precautions. There used to be a time when it was more of a kind-hearted “you do you.” Now it’s making fun of anyone who continues masking, even when they ask nothing of you. It sucks.

          1. I don’t care if people wear masks – I don’t see masks a lot, but I still see them – and I haven’t seen anyone in my area getting harassed or commented on for wearing masks. I haven’t seen it in New York, L.A., Dallas, Phoenix, or any of the other cities I’ve spent time in this year, either. If you’re experiencing this, I’m truly sorry. I hope you’re not trying to say your anecdata constitutes actual data or some kind of pervasive trend.

          2. The absolute ableism of commenters on this board has never been more evident than this discussion.

            So sorry that all us high risk people didn’t die off like y’all wanted.

          3. I don’t think anyone here is making fun of people for still masking? They are just saying most people aren’t, which is a fact. Fwiw I still mask indoors in many situations. I’m one of the unicorns who’s never had Covid (even though it was in my household) and I’d like to keep it that way for as long as possible, even though I’m aware I’ll eventually get it.

          4. As a regular commenter who has worked in a lab with Sars #1 and other biosafety level 3 organisms which require hazmat suits and a respirator, I can just say: Many researchers in the field are still masking in crowds and not doing indoor dining etc. Go figure.

            There are hundreds of papers out there about cumulative effects of Covid infections on the cardiovascular system, increased risks of strokes, pulmonary embolisms, heart attacks, and other more “mild” effects that might manifest themselves months or years after the actual infection. A new study from the UK puts long covid rates at 10%, and increasing for subsequent infections. “We have the tools, so we don’t need precuations” – wrong. Vaccinations don’t work well anymore against the curret strains, new vaccines will not get buy-in or funding, Paxlovid has limited efficacy. Masks and air quality improvements would help, but noone is investing large scale in this, also at a policy level.

            The information is out there, but most people don’t want to research it, read it or get any insights any more even from people like me, because it is inconvenient to think about it and derive conclusions for their own behavior.

            So, thank you very much, I’m keeping my mask on. I do not understand what is so difficult about wearing a well-fitting mask. I do not give a F anymore as to what anybody thinks about me.

          5. Nothing makes me less sympathetic to people
            Concerned than being accused of wanting y’all to die off for acknowledging reality. Just makes you sound full on insane and not worth listening to.

          6. I think most people, except the rednecks still stuck in March 2020, don’t care when other people mask. At all.

          7. “It’s over, you can’t pandemic forever” – I hear comments in that vein very very frequently now. They imply that anyone taking precautions for their own health is crazy and paranoid, that they LIKE this reality. I find it deeply unkind.

          8. Anon at 12:15: I think there’s ableism in the belief that some have expressed that they basically don’t want to live if they get long Covid, and that any compromising of their current abilities is such a fear for them that they’d rather keep masking/avoiding indoor activities forever than take the slightest risk of getting Covid. That’s kind of a slap in the face to people like my brother, who got meningitis as a teenager and as a result has to use a cane when he walks and lost most of his hearing, so he has to wear hearing aids. I guess people would rather be dead than have to do something like that, or be on supplemental oxygen, etc.? How is that not ableist?

          9. 1:07pm, your take is bizarre. I wear my masks still BECAUSE of the post-viral neurodegenerative illness (MS) my partner has. It’s not ableism to want to avoid a preventable illness.

          10. Plus 1 to anon at 11:53. I live in the red outside the blue of a state capitol, I have been to three different parts of Florida this year, Austin, DC, NoVA, New Hampshire, to name a few places and I have seen some masking in all of these places and seen or heard no harassment or denigrating comments. So I believe you if you say it has happened to you, but I do not think it is as widespread as you think it is based on your own personal experience.

          11. 1:07, that is one of the strangest leaps of logic I’ve ever read. It is absolutely not ableist not to intentionally expose oneself to disability. On the contrary–what is ableist is to expect everyone to run around maskless as if it were 2019.

      7. My office is at the mandatory staff retreat stage, and after flying people in and spending months emphasizing how important in-person time was, our executive director got covid the night before (but not until they schmoozed at a happy hour with some staff). So we’re both at that stage and covid’s definitely still around.

    2. I’m in a Boston suburb. Masks are around, but they seem to be more worn by those with colds vs those trying to keep germs out. My 3rd grader had a nasty cold this week and wanted to play a board game with siblings after she stayed home all day and added “I’ll go grab a mask in case I cough!” Which is actually pretty awesome.

      1. Yup, I definitely know a lot of people who aren’t masking in general but will put one on if they’re sick, which I think is great.

    3. I’m bummed this turned into a covid thread instead of us talking about the cookie expectation! Like, wtf!?

      1. Me too. The cookie thing was way more interesting. I would love more details about that, please! Like, is this a company tradition or something? Who’s driving this? Is it HR or the admin assistants? My guess it HAS to be one of those groups!

        1. I’m not sure whose idea it was to bring cookies, just that it’s a ‘competition’. I’m so mad about it through, executives should be paying for our lunch and making us cookies. I did not expect this to turn into a big COVID conversation. I was upset about the class disparity.

          1. I completely agree about the class thing. It is so gross to set up this “hey, servile serfs, let’s bring you to an event where you can grovel and scrape before the high and mighty lords of our company, and thank them for their generosity in paying you for your labor by baking them cookies!”

            This is seriously something out of the 1950s! So bizarre. It’s like some people get up every day in a completely different universe than the one the rest of us are living in.

          2. Are the executives mainly men and the putative bakers mainly women? It’s bad to start with but you could throw some weird gender dynamics into the mix!

          3. All the executives except one are women. The male exec is my boss and this was definitely not his idea, so idk, I would call all the execs mean girls for sure.

      3. I am here for the cookies (and so us soon about Joe anyone thought that the staff should be baking cookies).

        Are men asked to bake cookies? What departments are involved, as bakers and recipients? Is this their way of providing a potluck dessert?

      4. Same! I don’t bake cookies for myself or anyone else in my social circles since every time I try they come out inedible, why would I try to do that for upper management?
        Also completely bonkers that you ahve to pay for lunch yourself – if it’s a mandatory staff retreat, the employer should be at least catering lunch, if not lunch AND snacks.

  10. I’m sure this question was asked her before, but what are your recommended resources for learning about perimenopause and menopause?

    Soon to be 41, dealing with some male pattern hairloss (widows peak, responding to minoxidil), and notice my cycles are now down to 25 days from 28/29. Is this perimenopause?

    4. It could be, but it’s worth a visit to the gyno to discuss. My symptoms started in earnest at 43 and I felt like that was young, but you can be in perimenopause for 10 years prior to your periods stopping, and a lot of people have their periods stop around age 51…so…

      I recommend the book The Menopause Manifesto for learning everything you wanted to learn and more about this stage of life.

    6. Yes at 43 and I am wildly frustrated by my PCP (who is an expensive concierge MD!!) and my gyno’s responses to my symptoms. Wildly frustrated!!!

      1. Is your frustration related to every symptom you have being attributed to perimenopause? Because I’m frustrated by that. My headaches, joint pain, stomach troubles, abdominal cramps, night sweats/trouble sleeping and fatigue are all perimenopause, no need to investigate any other causes! You’re old, dontcha know, and this is what happens to old ladies! That’s the vibe. At this point I think I could walk into my doctor’s office with my hand amputated at the wrist and she’d be like, “oh, what a shame perimenopause has done this to you. Do you want an antidepressant?”

        1. As someone who’s already been through it, I see both sides – it really, really sucks that doctors in general don’t try to get the bottom of women’s health issues, but on the other side, there’s the whole “when you hear hooves, think horses not zebras” in medicine, and honestly, every single one of those symptoms is one of menopause/peri. I do think it can help to keep specific records of issues so that you can give your doc a better idea of frequency, etc. so that they can better tell when your issue is an anomaly.

          1. The problem with “think horses, not zebras” is that it’s also true that “rare disease is common.” (There are so many different rare diseases that statistically, it’s not actually rare to have one of them! And most physicians should expect to encounter them routinely.)

        2. No, my frustration is that no one believes that it’s perimenopause and the only actual consideration that it might be was a month of one type of oral bc pill which made all of my symptoms worse, gave me new symptoms, and where the end result of that was it can’t be perimenopause bc the BC didn’t fix you. Screams into the void

      1. I found the Period Repair Manual really helpful, but haven’t read the Hormone Repair Manual yet. I have every intention of pursuing the latest and best in HRT as soon as it’s indicated though!

    8. My cycles got really short during perimenopause too. For three or more years they were every three weeks and very heavy, but lasted only a few days.

      Then I stopped having periods for 6+ months, and suddenly started again. After another year of that nonsense, they disappeared altogether.

      I did have significant hair loss – my hair is just never going to be as thick as it used to be, luckily I started with thick hair – and a lot of it landed on my face and decided to sprout there! Fun!!!

      I’ve been tested for everything under the sun as I had a cancer scare that turned out to be autoimmune in my early 50s. My symptoms described above were just menopause. Hope that makes you feel better.

  11. I’m a 1099 employee at a company I like. I just got an offer to convert to w2. The pay is HALF what I’m making. I don’t want to come across as arrogant but…are they kidding? How do I address this? Is it dumb to ask them to kind of line item out what it will cost them to take me on as an employee?

    1. That seems steep, though healthcare and employee taxes are costs. I think you could ask for the line by line to see if you have negotiating power or are being exploited.

    2. I’m sure there are tax lawyers here, but–

      Do you know your tax burden as a 1099? Did you already pay taxes on income for a year in this position? When you’re a W2 employee, they’re taxed on your wages at the levels 1099s are stuck paying themselves. This is why mis-classifying people as 1099s is so rampant: employers shifting tax burdens onto workers. (You calling yourself an “employee” makes me wonder if you’re misclassified too–you should be acting as a contractor, not an employee.)

      Your idea is not “dumb,” and you may still deserve more money as a W2. But you will come out ahead at a wage lower than you think.

    3. I would anticipate it being 2/3 of your current pay. Decent benefits are very expensive. I think the approach isn’t asking them for info, it’s asking for the comp you want to take the offer.

      1. Yes, the back of the envelope calculation is that employee benefits are about 30% of the total comp value. 50% is a big cut, but perhaps you just negotiated well. Do you know how the offer compares to market? There’s other factors like stability and growth opportunity to consider when evaluating your options.

    4. With my employer, benefits cost out at just about 40% of salary. That plus the employer’s share of employment taxes would take it within a few percent of the 50% that OP was offered. My employer’s benefit costs are high, so I agree with others that it’s worth asking about the line breakdown.

    5. No, they are not kidding. And they’ve probably figured out their contractor spend is too high. My guess would be they’re planning to cut contract work. You should negotiate but I wouldn’t view yourself as coming from a place with strong leverage. A line item ask is kind of obnoxious, I’d take a value based approach to ask for more, but keep your ask in line with market based pay.

      1. +1 To that being a terrible ask. Not sure if OP was just venting or actually is planning to ask that, but it would show a real lack of professional judgment imo.

    6. You need to compare apples to apples here. From your 1099 pay, deduct your cost for health care, taxes, and any other related expenses (like computers). Now compare that number to their offer.

      DH got a similar offer, and because he already has health insurance through my job, it did not make sense to convert to W2. But if you were someone who was paying $$$$ for family insurance, it might be a good deal.

      1. Don’t forget to include paid holidays and other paid time off into the calculation.

    7. Do your working hours deviate substantially from a 40 hour week in either direction? If you’re working extra hours, they may think you’re taking too long on tasks and converting you to an exempt employee would rein in the costs. If you’re working fewer hours, you might be a calculating the conversion to permanent/salaried differently than they are.

    8. I’m a freelance 1099 and I used to hire a lot of 1099s. They are not kidding. My guess is you get your benefits through a spouse? At my former company the benefit load is 30-40% on top of salary so for an employee with a salary of $100k and a 10k bonus, my budget line item was often $150k. Also, there is a premium price for contractors because you can cut them loose at any time. Hiring a 1099 on as a W2 is very often a cost savings for a company as long as they want to keep that resource long term.

      You should also expect your work to potentially change- there are legal hoops to jump through to be counted as 1099 and once you are W2 you may be treated more like an employee than a contractor.

      As a 1099 myself now, I charge $250-$300/hr, often in a per diem. If I were to take a 1099 job I’d be looking at roles in the $250k range, maybe $300. But I would get laughed out the door expecting roles paying a salary of $500k.

    9. Personally, I would evaluate the impact on my take home pay not the expense to the company. Once you account for the lower tax burden of being an employee instead of a contractor who has to pay the employer share of taxes, any health insurance costs you have now, and any other benefits that are valuable to you such as 401k contributions by the company, I would expect the difference isn’t that much.

    10. These have all been thoughtful responses – thank you. Update: I spoke to HR and she said “oh I based your offer off our initial conversation about salary” which is to say she took a number I threw out a six months ago, before we had discussed scope of work, job title, or anything concrete about the job. I countered and she said she will see what they can do. The company appears to be struggling (they had a round of surprise layoffs two weeks ago) so I’m not hopeful I get to my number. Now I have to decide whether to remain 1099 and risk being laid off, or take the 50% pay cut. This job was billed as data entry but I’m running an entire project (planning and execution) by myself. So I think asking for more (my ask is well within market rate) is reasonable. I know I’m very privileged to even be in this position.

        1. Yup. Contractors are the first to go. She might be trying today Ave your job.

          In your shoes I’d accept whatever they come up with and then start job hunting.

        2. Totally. I work with distressed companies and usually people do NOT want to take on the burden of new employees – they’d prefer everyone be contractors! So it’s weird they’re doing the reverse.

    11. I’m self employed and pay employer taxes as well as employee taxes. In no way should the salary be HALF. That is ridiculous.

  12. This seems like a silly question, but what shoes do I wear with straight leg or wide leg pants in the summer besides open toe sandals? My vejas seem frumpy with a wide leg pant

    1. Pointy toe wedge espadrille? A chunky two strap slide sandal, either a flatform or a chunky block heel?

    2. Heeled sandals or platform sandals. I am short and can’t really pull off wide leg without some height.

  13. Is St. Lucia nice? Thinking of 4 nights in July. (I know it’s not the right season but it’s the time I’ve got!)

    1. St Lucia is very nice. July is hurricane season though not peak season. It’ll probably be ok but be prepared for disruptions. Insurance is probably a good idea.

    2. Book it! I was looking there for a July trip as well and google tells me only 14 hurricanes are confirmed to have come within 60 miles of the island in the last 170 years. I wound up booking Antigua instead.

    3. It’s so nice: I vote you do it! I got married on the beach in St Lucia in the peak of hurricane season but we were young and poor and we lucked out. I would buy trip insurance.

    4. If you’re really concerned about hurricanes, the ABC islands (Aruba, Bonaire and Curacao) are outside the hurricane belt. But St. Lucia is nicer than those islands.

  14. Very low stakes a question but are cut outs on evening dresses now appropriate for weddings? Trying to find a dress for a wedding and everything has tons and tons of cut outs. Are we just not worrying about erring on the conservative side for weddings anymore?

    1. I see plenty of cut-outs at weddings, even for black tie dress codes. If the ceremony is in a house of worship then bring a wrap or jacket.

      1. I love being in Old San Juan. Just so much to do, delicious food options everywhere. Also, Vieques, which is a separate, smaller island.

  15. If you’ve been to Puerto Rico, where’s your favorite part of the island to visit?

    1. I love being in Old San Juan. Just so much to do, delicious food options everywhere. Also, Vieques, which is a separate, smaller island.

    2. I love the smaller islands – Culebra and Vieques. They both have beautiful beaches, fewer people, less traffic, less hustle and bustle, etc., which is something I look for on vacations.

      1. cosign–they are sleeply, but magical and the beaches are unreal–some of the prettiest I’ve ever been to (and I grew up in SoCal, have been all over Greece, and spend a lot of time in Hawaii).

      2. I will say that I would do the rainforest if I stayed on the big island but hiking and being in nature is always on my vacation to do list vs. historic attractions. I did really like Old San Juan too, but a day of it was enough for me. YMMV!

      3. If you want to hit Vieques, highly recommend Finca Victoria for at least a night! I stayed in one of the Baez treehouses and it was amazing.

    3. Culebra and Vieques. Mainland Puerto Rico is really not that great IMO. The bio bay is cool but that’s the only thing about mainland PR that stands out to me.

      1. And if it’s a full or otherwise bright moon, prepare to be disappointed by the bio bay.

  16. Our entire family (me, spouse, and three kids age 8-13) are invited to a family wedding this summer. It will be in DC in July (so, HOT — although ceremony and reception are both indoors) and attire for adults is cocktail. Where can I find an appropriately upscale dress for a size 7 little girl without breaking the bank?

    2. Mercari or another second hand store. I’d put her in a cute Lily dress that you buy secondhand. Signed, mom of 3 girls that has done the family wedding circuit.

    3. Poshmark? But I also think kids get a lot of leeway here – I’m seeing plenty of girls’ dresses on the Old Navy website I wouldn’t be surprised to see on a kid at a wedding, even a more formal one.

    6. I think a kid who wears a size 7 (so presumably, a fairly young girl) gets quite a bit of leeway at weddings. You could probably even find something that would work at Target in their Cat and Jack line or H&M. For slightly nicer, you could also check Mayoral, Janie and Jack, Maisonette or Boden.

    7. I was recently at a wedding where a couple brought along their uninvited kids (child free wedding!) and the little boy was in a football jersey. So something better than that!

      When my kids were that age, I got their formal leaning stuff at Nordstrom. But honestly it’s just in nice dress territory for the little ones. They don’t really have “evening” styles for the little ones, and no one expects it.

      My daughter’s favorite part was getting new patent leather flats and a tiny little handbag that matched, just for fun.

  17. This is technically a Moms question, but I think many of you are sleep away camp veterans that might have some insight too!

    My daughter (10) is going to a 2 week sleepaway camp for the first time this summer. Her best friend went last summer, to a different camp, for 8 weeks. I have the camp’s packing list and it has a lot of “optional” things- sports equipment, musical instruments, rain boots, costumes (i assume for theme days of some kind?), watch, bathrobe, “disposable camera”, etc are all on the list. It also has the typical no-electronics/no food policy.

    1) what of the optional stuff is important? My kid is sporty and can easily bring her tennis racquet, lax stick and a softball glove but….is that necessary? Do they actually use their own equipment or is it just another thing to lose?Rain boots? That seems extra but also I wouldn’t want her to get wet feet if everyone else is dry.
    2) any idea if a fitbit is too electronic? It’s her watch, and I was thinking of sending it fully charged and be done with it.
    3) Camera- she has an instax camera and could bring that. We also have an old digital camera (circa 2004). Which, if either, of those would be better? Usually she takes pics on an old iphone but I know that’s not allowed. And absent that, are disposable cameras still even a thing?!
    4) anything else you’d suggest she pack that was fun to have but a first-time-to-sleepaway-camp family might not think of?

    1. I have a 10 yo also and we’re similarly packing up this weekend for camp. She has been the last two summers already.
      I personally wouldn’t bring any of my own sports equipment. Sometimes there is downtime where they could use it, but the camp my daughter went to has equipment available. Plus, I can’t imagine taking a lax stick by yourself would be useful (wouldn’t others need to have them?). I would check out the materials to see if there are special days while your child is there, because some of the dress up stuff does make it more fun. Bathrobes, rain boots, and watches are all totally optional – if your kid uses, take them, but I wouldn’t go buy them. With the cameras, I’ve sent disposable in past years and understand that they specifically want something that (a) can’t break and (b) is not electronic at all. Disposable ones are still sold at drugstores/wal-mart or amazon.

      I’d send some cards that she can send – I pre-address and stamp. She may not want to, but it can be something to do during downtime. My kid also takes a journal/sketchbook.

    2. Veteran of 8 week overnight camps here. I laughed at rain boots, they’re totally unnecessary. She can live without a watch but buy cheap waterproof digital one if she insists. Skip the bathrobe. If she has a shower inside her cabin then a regular towel is fine. If she has to walk outside to access a shower house then get one of those towels with the velcro elastic top instead. Sporting and musical equipment depends on the camp. Generally if a particular activity is mandatory you do need to bring your own gear but equipment is provided for optional activities. Costumes are a thing but I can’t imagine she needs much for two weeks. Focus on smaller accessories instead of a full outfit.

    3. It’s been many years but I was both a camper and counselor for a long time at a girl’s camp in WV. I agree most of the optional stuff isn’t necessary – I wouldn’t send her with any of her own sports or musical equipment, the camp will have tennis racquets, etc. My camp had theme events and performances but they changed every time so I wouldn’t bring a specific costume (unless there’s something she really likes – our longtime campers would bring things like sparkly capes or something and they usually found a creative way to use it during the summer). Bathrobe isn’t necessary, towel is fine to walk to and from showers. (The number of 10 year olds I saw just throw the towel over their shoulder and wander through our all girl’s camp is too many to count). I would buy a cheap watch over a fitbit, we definitely had stuff get lost, float away in the river during tubing, etc. Not sure about the cameras but the teens and tweens I know do find disposable cameras cool and retro, so maybe the digital camera and a disposable one? Our camp store used to sell disposable cameras but this was a pre-iphone age. You could post on a local listserv or forum for more specific tips about the camp.

      I would pack letters from you and any other family members for her to find, but please de-emphasize how much you’ll miss her and emphasize how excited you are to hear all of her stories from camp in two weeks. I was generally with 10 and 11 year olds, and it would surprise you how much the most self assured, teen-like 10 year old can fall deep into homesickness their first few nights away from their family. And send mail every day – I think most camps can print out emails from parents now but if its mail make sure to send your mail a few days in advance so she has something on day 1. (Also make sure she knows how to shower – so many parents sent their kids to camp who did not know the basics of what to do in the shower that we often had to institute “bubble checks” where we had the kids stick their head out of the curtain to show they shampooed, and then again to show that they washed it out.) Send her with books, cards, fun spray fans, etc – our campers definitely made friends by showing off and sharing entertainment.

      I loved my camp so much, and loved even more getting to watch my campers grow so much in the time we had them. She’ll have a great time without all the optional stuff listed, and she’ll have a sense of what activities there are and what she wants to bring next year.

      1. Thanks! She’s very independent and it helps that her bestie was away all last summer and has been giving her tips. She for sure can shower, do her hair, etc.

    4. Know your kid, but for a 10 year old, I think I would go pretty minimal. My son couldn’t “find” certain stuff we packed when he went to camp for the first time last year at age 10, and I’m convinced he just wore whatever was on top of his pile of stuff (as he does at home). In photos it looked like he was in his bathing suit most of the time. Whatever you send is pretty likely to get trashed. I would skip the fitbit – she won’t need to know what time it is and will need to charge it. I would send the instax and only send sporting gear if she is really into the idea of using it there. My son’s camp is more low-key and artsy fartsy and has no sports other than weird group games. I would not send rain boots if she has waterproof sandals, flip flops, or crocs or something else she is more likely to wear in warm, wet weather.

    5. I would send a bathrobe because it makes the shower situation a lot easier. Also shower shoes. No to sports equipment unless it’s for a sport that you know they will play regularly at camp. Definite no to musical instruments unless it’s a music camp. Rainboots are a good idea to keep her regular shoes from getting muddy, unless she has waterproof hiking shoes. I would only send costumes if you know ahead of time that they will be used for a theme day, costume party, etc. A small activity she can share with friends, like Uno or a deck of cards or Mad Libs or a string for cat’s cradle, is fun if they are permitted any downtime. Depending on the lighting situation, one of the tiny flashlights that converts to a lantern may be useful. (I went to a camp with no lights in the bathrooms and this was very necessary.) A small fan may also be good if permitted.

      In general, don’t send anything that you are not willing to have lost or destroyed. Less is more because they tend to keep their stuff in disarray and don’t use 90% of what they take. I would not bother with stationery.

    6. Send your daughter with some sort of portable pack of mini laundry detergents and teach her how to use them in a sink.

    2. I’ve been to Fiji but it was years and years ago. I went specifically to scuba dive and stayed on Castaway Island and had a life-changing experience. Absolutely incredible. But getting there and back was quite challenging.

  19. Super dumb question. If you go to the Taylor swift concert, does one have to be there for the opener act? I am not a concert person…

    1. I mean, no, but yes? I typically always skip the opener, but with T.Swift, the whole experience, opener included, was so worth it. I didn’t love Phoebe Bridgers (still don’t), but I got there early, got food and a drink, got situated, took a gazillion pics, traded bracelets, etc.

      1. I love that you traded bracelets! My daughter and her bestie are going in July. J will make sure she knows about the bracelets. She was an enthusiastic friendship bracelet maker back in the day, and in fact she always wished she’d had more friends to trade them with. Hers are really pretty! She works hard on making them have interesting designs.

        (For me as an Old, they’re basically tiny macrame)

          1. We did all kinds, not just beaded! My daughters made some old school floss friendship ones, too!

    2. You don’t have to, but try to be there if you can! The openers have been really fun. And it can take a LOT longer to get in than you think (traffic, parking, security lines, huge lines for merch/drinks/bathroom, etc.) so if you planned to come in around 7:15/7:30 you risk missing part of Taylor’s show. I arrived at 6:45 and still wasn’t in my seat for an hour (at one of the Philly shows).

    3. I was just at one of the MetLife concerts and don’t have any interest in the openers but got to the stadium around 5:15 – it took a while to get to our seats, then we went to go get food, find the bathroom, take pics, the fun teenagers behind us gave us bracelets, etc. If you want to buy merch I would get there even earlier, those lines were insane. (Or you could buy merch during the show, we left during the last song to try to make the train before the crowds and there were no lines for merch.) The openers were more background music to the excitement of the event. Have fun, it was the best concert I’ve ever been to by far.

  20. Question for moms of older kids: can you recommend any great sleepaway camps? We’re nonreligious in the Midwest so a lot of people don’t really do this, but I feel like my eldest could benefit from 2 weeks away. Just not sure where to look for specifics. He’s not sporty and definitely hates competitive sports, smart/nerdy in that D&D way.

    1. He might like Camp Stomping Ground, near Saratoga Springs, which my son went to for the first time last summer and is going back to this year. It is very inclusive and progressive and they have D&D. Every evening they do wacky “night games,” which are kind of like LARPing meets capture the flag. It seems to have a fairly racially and ethnically diverse staff and camper base as well. My son would also mention that they offer dessert every night as a major selling point.

      1. PS – I also recommend the camp I used to attend and work at, Burgundy Center for Wildlife Studies, in WV. It is tiny and lovely but best for kids that are into nature/animals/the outdoors. I would still probably send my son there if it were closer to us.

    2. For that kind of kid, I’d look at local university camps for bright/gifted kids. In my area at least, they cater to the top 10% or so of the class, you don’t have to test as off the charts gifted or anything. These camps let kids explore academic interests they might not get exposed to in regular school, like coding, creative writing, classics, astronomy, etc. but without the pressure of grades. And the ability to meet and bond with other nerdy kids is a huge gift. I did several years of this kind of camp and it was a wonderful experience for me, as a non-sporty, non-outdoorsy person who would have hated traditional camp.

      Space Camp was also awesome, but very expensive.

      1. Commented before I saw this, but CTD is this – it requires test scores that are in the 90%+ or grades, I think, but it’s not just kids who are at 99%ile.

    3. not typical summer camp, but the Center for Talent Development (CTD) at Northwestern is an option for kids who are more brainy than outdoorsy/sporty. THey have a residential option that involves staying in the dorms.

    4. I would love for a camp that bills itself as “cooperative.” It’s not geographically convenient for you, but check out Gwynn Valley to get a sense of what I mean. It’s a traditional outdoor camp, but with lots of nerdy stuff too.

    5. Cheley in Colorado. There are both boys’ camps and girls’ camps. The ones where they stay in wagons are especially great.

    6. Kennolyn! In the Santa Cruz mountains. They do a Sunday morning assembly-like thing in the Redwoods. I tuned out whatever Christian component there might have been and luxuriated in the splendor of Nature.

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