ByElizabeth Hours Updated
Comments 279 Comments

Thursday’s Workwear Report: Taren Lightweight Cashmere Cardigan

This post may contain affiliate links and Corporette® may earn commissions for purchases made through links in this post. As an Amazon Associate, I earn from qualifying purchases.

A woman wearing a black cardigan and tan pants

Our daily workwear reports suggest one piece of work-appropriate attire in a range of prices.

I’m absolutely swooning over this cashmere cardigan from Banana Republic. For work, I would wear it over a moody floral blouse with some camel trousers for a cozy business casual look, or layered over a dark sheath for something a little more formal.

The sweater is $180 at Banana Republic and comes in sizes XXS-XXL. It also comes in ivory.

Sales of note for 3/15/25:

  • Nordstrom – Spring sale, up to 50% off
  • Ann Taylor – 40% off everything + free shipping
  • Banana Republic Factory – 40% off everything + extra 20% off
  • Eloquii – 50% off select styles + extra 50% off sale
  • J.Crew – Extra 30% off women's styles + spring break styles on sale
  • J.Crew Factory – 40% off everything + extra 20% off 3 styles + 50% off clearance
  • M.M.LaFleur – Friends and family sale, 20% off with code; use code CORPORETTE15 for 15% off
  • Spanx – Lots of workwear on sale, some up to 70% off
  • Talbots – 40% off 1 item + 30% off everything else (includes markdowns, already 25% off)

279 Comments

  1. Hi,

    I have a thin black leather briefcase. Should I take that on my upcoming interviews, or are they now out of style? Should I buy a black leather tote instead?

    TIA

    1. It has been forever since I’ve seen a briefcase, so if I were the interviewer I might note it, but I also wouldn’t hold it against you or anything.

        1. I think this is industry dependent, if you’re in law or finance, it’s fine. Tech, I’d probably dump the briefcase. If you’re over 50 (and I’m close so take this from a peer), I’d spend more time on obvious aging signs, I’d color my hair and get some Botox and an up to date interview outfit.

          1. Thanks, its banking. Got the Botox and hair color done. My one suit is classic but hits below the knee. I’m wondering if that’s too long.

          2. Are you seriously suggesting getting botox and coloring your hair for an interview? Wow.

            I must be out of touch with the market.
            I always assumed that it’s clear from my resume, listing 15-20 years of experience, that I’m not in my 20s or 30s anymore.

          3. Yes I am. I live in the real world. People want experience but they don’t want people who look like they have it. No one wants to report to their mom or be the boss of their grandmother. Harsh, shouldn’t be, but is.

          4. Not the person who originally suggested it but as someone who was recently laid off and encountered a lot of age discrimination in my job hunt, I would absolutely recommend doing anything reasonably possible to look younger if you are job hunting in your 50s. I did not get Botox but I made sure my hair was colored and my general style was up-to-date when I had interviews (and I seriously considered the Botox option and probably would have done it if my unemployment had gone on any longer). And yes – they obviously can figure out how old I am based on my bar admission but take a long hard look at women in positions of power/influence who are in their 50s or older and notice how few are overweigh, have greying hair, etc. compared to the men in the same age bracket.

            It is not right. It is not fair. And I hate having to think that way. But the third or fourth time I was told I was “overqualified” led me to make changes and I got a very different reception when I made an effort to look younger. It is one of the reasons I call out the casual ageism here when I see it; because it is real and insidious and much worse for women than men.

          5. I’m 50 and I definitely watched root growth when interviewing before landing my role last spring. It’s a lot more competitive for senior-level positions and ageism is real. Whatever you can do to get an edge is what you do. Society is harder on. women, but I advised my husband (older than me) to ditch his extra-long trench for the same reason when he had a big pitch meeting with prospects a few years ago.

          6. The younger generation has extreme aggression against older workers from what I have noticed on social media. It is ironic that the last generation to have so much resentment against older folks were the Boomers when they were teens and in college.

          8. “The younger generation has extreme aggression against older workers from what I have noticed on social media.”

            Maybe because boomers have insisted on calling every generation that has come behind them lazy, entitled, spoiled, fragile, etc. Sounds like chickens coming home to roost, to me – you can’t denigrate entire generations of people for decades and not expect some pushback at some point.

            In any case, the boomers/late GenXers are now the past; the future is with Gen Z, and I say that as a GenXer. Gen Z wants real change to our economy, our social and political structures, etc. and they are agitating for it, which is probably very frightening to old people who have benefited tremendously from the current status quo, and have deep fear of losing social position and influence to younger people. Which is happening anyway, whether they like or not. Nothing new about any of the above, BTW.

          9. In my mid-40s, I look 10 years younger than my real age and plan to continue doing whatever I can – hair color, Botox, expensive skincare, current clothing, etc. – to keep it that way. I live in the real world, not the world I would objectively like to live in. And since I can get laid off at any time and be thrust into the job market without any notice against my will, I want to stay looking younger so I can fight ageism head-on, if it comes to it.

          10. Wait – has the entire “since the pandemic, I’ve realized that I look more distinguished with my grey hair” thing been kicked to the door?

          11. “since the pandemic, I’ve realized that I look more distinguished with my grey hair”

            This was never a thing outside of like tenured academia or doctors with their own practices.

          12. Yes, of course it has been kicked to the door. Many more women post on doing more maintenance than natural aging on this website than going grey by far. The women who are going grey lean towards the fortunate women with stable good employment (and partners!), and are the minority.

            Hair dying, increased botox/retinoid use, more body hair removal, body maintenance/exercise norms have only gotten more demanding with time. And as more women learn about treatments for symptoms of rough perimenopause (and discover that HRT is anti-aging), the use of HRT will likely soar.

            We think about pressures lightening for women as times evolve, but now that abortion rights are getting thrown out, in my world they are only getting much worse.

            I was just in a daytime exercise class in my near city area of upper middle class folks. Most participating were older women, as I think the younger women often go in the morning. Not a single woman had grey hair…. even the ones old enough to be my mother.

            You bet I will dye my hair when I apply for new jobs.

          13. 12:33 Let’s not try to justify ageism. It’s just as gross as sexism or racism or any other awful way of painting everyone with one brush. It’s also particularly disgusting when it’s in a reply to someone late Gen X who is feeling vulnerable and simply wanted fashion advice. Maybe you need some self-reflection here.

            If this were a black person trying to “fit in” and you basically came back saying they deserved not to because of the wrongs of others like them maybe you would see how truly off your supposed advice is. More wrongs don’t make things right. Yes, Gen Z deserves respect––as well as all other generations. Knock it off with trying to justify discrimination.

          14. Anon at 12:33. Lol. You may have one foot in the grave but I am at the peak of my career and have no intentions during the next decade. Clearly, I am not in the past. Stick up for the whiners who are mad that their boss asked them for help with something on the computer. If computer skills were the only important skills, the world would be run by teenagers.

  2. I have direct reports in a country where flights are notoriously expensive and completely out of reach for a typical person. Since my company is US based these flights are expensive but doable for us.
    I’m trying to figure out a professional development budget for my team. The proposal I got from my boss was $200 / person / year, to be used for any type of class/course/book/conference/etc. That’s more than enough for the actual activity. However, if its an actual conference the flights & hotel can be $500+

    There are a lot of positives to these conferences and we do send people. Right now though its a bit uneven and if someone never asked to go for example they might not go as often. So I’d rather have a set budget for each person to use as they wish. But I’m unsure whether I should try to make it like $700/person to cover flights (seems unlikely) or $100/person + flights for one conference.

    1. If you can’t give a higher budget, could you give the option to rollover? So they could get $250/year but then accumulate so they could do the $500 conference every second year. That would be my preference.

      3. Not the OP, but I can’t imagine an accounting group that would sign off on this.

        I’m guessing boss just threw a number out because he doesn’t have time to research this. I would go back the boss with a specific proposal for a conference or course you foresee benefiting your team, and then come up with a quick figure for what that would cost. It doesn’t matter what the cost of flights is for a typical non-employee, so I would cut that part from your analysis. The question is, if you identify something that has a benefit you can point to, what would that cost? Then work from there. I would not lock yourself into that plan but explain that a comparable activity should cost around the same point in order to be an alternative.

        2. If you’re an accountant then you know you handle this with an accrual. It’s not that complex.

      1. Right? I’ve worked with offshore teams in India where last minute flights to the east coast of US were $7k. I’m not sure what country this could be outside of Mexico or Canada.

      3. Nothing about this is physically in the US. The people aren’t in the US, the conferences aren’t in the US. The company is American so that’s why the values are in USD. It is not in Mexico or Canada, continents outside of North America and Europe exist.
        I just . . . . why do people have to nit pick.

        1. I think you mentioning it being a U.S. company led people to believe that employees were traveling to the U.S. for the conferences. I work for a large MNC with offices on 6 continents and most travel for employees based outside of the U.S. involves them coming to the U.S. these are all local hires who are natives of the country in which they work. It wasn’t a crazy assumption for people to make that travel was to the US.

    3. I cannot imagine anyone using that, most of the expenses would be personal. I would set a budget for the whole department that covers the entire cost including travel and vet requests against it. Also, depending on where you are, these may be business expenses you’re obligated to pay so the $250 or whatever wouldn’t cut it.

    4. At $200 they might as well not offer anything, it just shines a spotlight on the fact that the company isn’t supporting professional development. I recommend either a reasonable individual budget or a department wide budget and have people apply for funding at the beginning of the fiscal year.

      My last firm gave associates a $500/yr marketing budget. The firm used it as an excuse to deny funding for conference attendance. You can’t attend a non-local conference for $500, that’s ridiculous. If you don’t want to support people’s individual development then just say that, don’t advertise to potential laterals that the firm provides all these resources to promote associate business development when that’s not true.

    5. I have to attend 1 to 2 conferences per year within the US for my required professional development. I don’t know where you’re coming up with $200 with no flight or $500 with, but the registration alone is in the $1000 range for every conference I’ve attended. The years I’ve attended 2 it’s because I’ve managed to get myself invited to speak, so registration is reduced or waived, but expenses are still over $500 if I have to fly and stay overnight.

      1. Y’all are missing the part where this is all in a much different country where 1) $500 USD is a lot of money and 2) conferences don’t cost $1000. $1000 would be a decent 1 month salary.

        1. I think we all read this as your employees were traveling to the US to attend conferences there. At least, that’s how I read it. I through the the flights were expensive because they were international flights from your country to the US (hence the comments that $500 is cheap for a flight / $200 is cheap for a conference).

          That being said – however you budget it just remember that flights aren’t the only travel expense for conferences; remember to include hotel and oer diem expenses too.

          1. The conferences are not in the US. They are geographically close by, but just difficult to get to. Flights within this country/continent are thought to be expensive. The distance is similar to NYC -> Chicago, which is currently going for ~$180 according to Google flights. I’m pretty sure this particular conference is free to register, and others have fees <$100.

            Yes I literally mentioned hotels. That includes per diems etc.

        2. We’re not missing it – it just wasn’t obvious from the original post. :)

          For the actual question – I think it’s a good idea to set “attending useful conference X” as a professional development goal, but with the expectation that it’s not every year.

          So lets say you manage 6 people. Maybe you have the budget to send 3 people each year – then send 3 people each year, only different people each year. Talk to them individually about developement, maybe somebody rather would go to conference Y, or maybe go on 5 smaller courses with no flights. But think in terms of a 3-year-plan, or 2-year, not 1 year.

      2. Usually the conferences in my industry are no cost or low cost but flights or trains, hotels, and per diem is going to be way more than $500. I’m usually in the ball park of 2k per conference on travel costs alone.

      3. The flight numbers seem bananas. Flights are so expensive these days with limited exception. I’d look at this benefit offering and laugh.

        OP, get specific with your boss. Map out 2-3 specific examples of what it would cost to go to different conferences/meetings. What exact conferences do you think people would go to? What’s that registration cost? What do those flights cost today? What about meals and other ancillary travel expenses? Look at online courses – what do those cost? You have to be really concrete to get what your team actually needs or just don’t offer this.

    6. Tangentially related, but if you are setting this up for the first time, consider what the policy is about whether this development can/should happen during work time/after hours and who gets to deny/approve. I’ve seen many cases where there was such a fund, plus numerous workshops offered internally, but individual supervisors were more interested in cranking out the next milestone and didn’t allow employees to make use of the available opportunities. That’s bad for morale.

  3. I need to get a memory foam mattress topper for my twin bed at my mom’s house (so will need something I can get shipped). There are OMG so many, often from brands I’ve never seen before. And I guess new sheets deep enough to handle an aging mattress plus a topper. If it matters, it is for a daybed and not a mattress on box springs or a platform. What is a good one? Price isn’t an issue and this will be easier than having her deal with a mail order matttress and disposing of the old one.

    1. Just a thought: if one purchases a mattress online, I know that companies like Saatva include removal of the old mattress as part of the delivery service.

    2. I just bought a twin size memory foam mattress topper from Amazon! I got a 2 inch one and I think it will work fine for what I need it for (extra sleeping area for sleepovers for my young son – planning to put a sleeping bag over it), but I think the 3 inch one would be more comfy. If I had it to do over, I would get the 3 inch but not worth the return hassle for me since it is for a limited purpose.

    3. Wire topper has a recommendation. I tend to be happy with their picks. For sheets, lands end is surprisingly great.

    4. I just got the 4″ topper for my college kid’s dorm bed from Walmart and am considering the same version for my own bed. If money is not a concern, I would get something more than 2″ thick.

      1. I think it’s personal preference, I find thicker then 2 inches to be very uncomfortable

    8. I’m incredibly happy with my Tempurpedic topper. I purchased it for a similar reason 4 years ago.
      Costco has 800 count sheets that I prefer over my sheets that cost 3 times as much. I need to order another set for our guest room.

  4. Cross-post. I’m looking for a solid wood twin bed with built-in drawers for a kid’s bedroom. There is one from IKEA (the Hemnes), but I don’t necessarily love the white painted look and would prefer natural wood. Any other recommendations? The drawers are a must for storage and to prevent midnight cat attacks from under the bed and I would prefer built-ins – after-market drawers never tend to look tidy. TIA!

    1. Check out the options from Harriet Bee on Wayfair. I find they had cute kids stuff at non Pottery Barn prices. Or PB on sale if you can wait.

      1. Or PB on FBMP. We found a pair of PB twins with underbed drawers for a tiny fraction of their new price and they looked new!

      2. Does PB have solid wood options? I have heard mixed reviews of their particleboard, especially for the price…

    2. If your partner looked down on you for your profession, in exactly the way that you look down on him, do you believe that this would be a situation where you could build a future together?

  5. Continuing today’s impromptu theme: I am looking for a metal, king size bed frame (to which a headboard could be attached) that is high enough off the floor that there is clearance for shallow storage containers. Any suggestions?

      2. I know that Amazon sells bed frames, but these seem low to the ground. I am specifically looking for one with enough clearance to slide bins underneath. If you have a recommendation, that would be great.

        1. Yep, there is a decent amount of room under there, would easily fit storage containers

  6. Does anyone have a blue collar partner, and grew up learning to ‘look down’ on blue collar work? How do you get over yourself and your own ego in this scenario?

    My partner of just under a year is wonderful in all respects but I cannot shake that his job title is what it is. I recognize this is shallow and terrible and am trying to get over myself.

    1. Is there more going on here? Is his job causing you to have to consider compromising aspects of your life that you actually don’t want to? Does it cause you to have incompatible world views, like a divergence on paying for education for your kids? On its face I think people will say “get over it, you’re being snobby” but I would find it challenging to be in a life long relationship (and I’m guessing that’s what you’re looking for if this has been a year already) with someone who has a very different background and perspective. You are allowed to break up over fundamental differences even with someone “wonderful.” But if it’s just a status thing, I’d examine that. I know lots of people who have these relationships and are very happy.

      1. I love this answer.
        Focusing as to how his job would influence your life, the life of your family, and big decisions like paying for education.
        I would also add to that his views on personal and family finances – e.g. does your partner have access to benefits, how does he plan for retirement and life-changing situations that affect income, like disability or illness. These are very important considerations if work requires strenous physical labor – in my experience, landscapers, handymen and cleaners work their bodies in way that many have serious issues starting in their 40s or 50s, like back and knee problems, skin cancer for those working outdoors etc.

        Additionally, is there a large difference in income? Any expectations that you will be supporting him longterm? And on top, what is his view on supporting his family if they are also blue collar, possibly low income? (Note that blue collar does not always equal low income/no wealth. One of the longstanding local family plumbing businesses where I live owns the biggest house in the well-off neighborhodd, gives huge personal donations to the community etc.)

      2. I agree with a lot of this. I also think it depends on what kind of “blue collar” work you are talking about. Some electricians and construction workers (usually who own their businesses) make bank and have a lot of control over their lives. You need to have a lot going on upstairs to do those jobs. Or are you talking about an assembly line worker who has never been promoted and will never earn more than a working class salary?

        Do you think he’s intelligent?

        Does he bring things to the table that will help you a lot if you built a life with him? I know several men who literally built their houses (not log cabins – they could sell their homes for low seven figures), do all their own home repairs, and do all of their car repairs. There are men with amazingly flexible schedules that enable you to really launch your career into the stratosphere. Those things are all valuable and improve your quality of life.

      3. Allllll of this. I found that the differences go way beyond jobs. What type of area do you want to live in long term? What size house do you want? What sacrifices are you willing to make, if any, for your kids to attend good schools? Would you let your parents move in with you? Will you eventually resent him if his income never rises? In addition to all this, I realized we’re never truly comfortable around the other person’s friends and family. I felt like his circle thought I’m snobby- I don’t know if it was true or just paranoia but it sucked either way. He felt like he was putting on a show for my circle. You can’t build a life on that.

        1. Amen to your last five sentences. My exH thought my wealthy extended family wasn’t nice to him (spoiler alert: they are like the nicest human beings on the planet). I asked him to mention an example or articulate why he thought that. He could not. He finally admitted that he felt intimidated being around trust fund, multiple vacation houses, private school kind of people. I asked him why he was judging them when they weren’t judging him and he said he just couldn’t help it.

      4. We don’t have or want kids.

        We have similar politics and worldviews. There are times when he maybe could have more of a sense of occasion eg. dress up for something but I sometimes chalk that up to class differences, and that isn’t as important to me. It’s more his job title and the fact that he spends time working with his hands and not on broader societal issues, etc.

        1. “It’s more his job title and the fact that he spends time working with his hands and not on broader societal issues, etc.”

          We need his work more than we need yours – you know that right? Go ahead and try to solve “broader societal issues” without working plumbing or the ability to move food from the farm to the store.

          1. Thank you!

            I hate to get political but I feel like this is where elitism and politics come into play.

            There is just an element of being out of touch that is grating.

        3. I’m in finance and about as white collar as it goes. I do not work on “broader societal issues”; I make rich people richer (it is what it is, shrug).

        4. This is a bit confusing: “It’s more his job title and the fact that he spends time working with his hands and not on broader societal issues, etc.”

          Unless you’re a doctor, social worker, educator, climate change activitist or work in an area of law making sure underprivileged people are not disadvantaged, what broader societal issues do you mean?
          I don’t know that most jobs with big titles and salaries are doing much for society, and I’m in management.
          Without construction workers, car assembly line workers, janitors, food workers, truckers and people stocking shelves at supermarkets or warehouses, society would collapse.

          I think you should examine closely your looking down on such jobs and privilege.

        6. It really sounds that no matter what happens with this relationship, you have some thinking to do on the contributions made to society by different kinds of work… and it’s good that you’re already thinking about this!

          I’m not sure what your title or job description is, but if you feel that you do work on broader societal issues, you may want to consider whether there’s some insecurity or defensiveness at play, since often hands-on work is helping in much more concrete and verifiable ways?

          Do you know any people who actually switched from college educated career paths to hands-on skilled labor? That could be another perspective worth hearing that might help you assess whether this is more about the value of his work or about the value of yours.

    2. It’s been a year. If you’re still looking down on him break up and give him his life back.

    3. Honestly, I think one of the most important things is simply keeping your views to yourself. It may be hard to completely get rid of them, but don’t make the mistake of thinking it’s important for others to hear them. I have had friends who have felt that it is so important to tell me things about my personality or choices that they don’t like or that they judge and it really was not.

        1. I agree with this, but I don’t really think that’s the problem here. Even if she never says anything, she should not be with someone she looks down on.

          2. +10000. Not possible to have a successful relationship with a person you don’t respect, and it won’t be possible to keep the disrespect a secret even if criticism is never overt.

          3. I normally agree with this, but I think it’s also worth a try to challenge thoughts that you know are wrong and that you don’t want to have. Sometimes it can be successful.

          4. Agree. This will manifest itself as contempt, which Gottman refers to as one of the Four Horsemen.

          5. This right here is what I struggle with. I think I might look down on his choice of profession and I don’t want to resent him for it.

          6. This. He deserves better. He also deserves an in law family that’s not looking down on him, too.

    4. Can you reframe it for yourself as blue collar work being more respectable for various reasons, and therefore something to be really proud of? To answer your question, I did not grow up looking down on blue collar work and actually grew up with pretty much the opposite view point. For example, my daily life is much cushier working from home in tech. I have flexibility and money that my blue collar family could never have dreamed of growing up. I have more respect for my family member who does hard, physical labor in a warehouse in his sixties than I do for the work I do that allows me to throw laundry around and read this board.
      All that being said, I hear you. It is a pride thing and it is real.

    5. I can’t say I’ve figured this out, since while my partner’s job title doesn’t bother me at all, our outlooks sometimes conflict in other ways. But reading a lot about blind spots and shortcomings of “PMC” (professional managerial class) culture, as well as reading more blue collar and working class perspectives has helped me at least identify where the differences arise.

    6. I think it’s therapy for yourself and I hope you have chosen a very patient partner. At the end of the day this is values. You seem to value something very different than his work. Is it appearances? Is it education? Etc. See if what you value matters, and if not do the work to try and make changes to your belief system.

      1. He is educated, which is the best part of all this. It is literally just his choice to work in this field that I’m struggling with.

        1. I’m sorry if this comes off as piling on, but I am really confused that you have an issue with an educated person who makes a choice to do a job he loves. Do you see all of the posts on here about people not being fulfilled in their jobs? Wanting to make a change to make them happier, even if it means a pay cut? You found someone who has already made a choice that I assume he is happy with. If you can’t embrace that, you need to let him find someone who will.

        2. Our contractor has a 4 year degree from Boston College. He makes over a million dollars a year. He inherited his dad’s business. His wife has some academic job.

          1. Contractors do very well! I don’t think mine has a college degree but I’m confident he earns more than me (law degree and additional grad degree).

    7. One perspective on this is that if, after dating someone almost a year who is “wonderful in all respects” you are bothered by his job title, you should let him go find someone who respects him. If you can’t stomach that idea, then yes, this is a job for dismantling snobbery. Start learning more about all kinds of work, and develop an appreciation for how complex and impactful blue collar jobs can be. For “getting over” the cachet of one’s own white collar job, I recommend Bullsh!t Jobs by David Graeber.

      My partner has a few college credits, where I have 2 advanced degrees. He works in health care (direct service) like me, which was a very important commonality that we built on when we met. He’s brilliant, worldly wise, and treats me like gold. I don’t know how many men like this exist, from any socioeconomic niche, but if you have one and want to keep him, do whatever you need to do to shake the elitism.

      1. Mine is also brilliant, worldly, wise and treats me like gold. I am heartbroken that I am even posting this, I think he deserves someone that appreciates what he does. I think therapy for me is the answer.

        1. Absolutely not. Don’t be browbeaten by what you see here. You like what you like. Embrace that. There is nothing wrong with you.

          1. There is absolutely something wrong with people who automatically see people in blue-collar jobs as “less-than.” And it’s admirable OP wants to work on that. Some people, you know, actually can acknowledge they have faults or need to change a perspective and then they do actually go work on themselves. Not everyone is stuck in the delusion they are perfect the way they are.

          2. Except she’s unhappy with somebody who is great and it’s her fault. She doesn’t need therapy, but she might want it if she wants to be partnered.

    8. Do you mean like plumber or electrician? Because marry that dude. As a lawyer with a husband with a PhD in hard science, I have never been happier since he started a new project area that involved him learning more about plumbing and electricity. SO handy when the water heater goes in the middle of the night or the contractor is trying to argue with you about rangehood placement or double oven wiring and the electrical panel. The water is the kids bathroom warms up like a million times faster now because he figured out a way to have the plumbers reroute the pipes to a more direct route from the water heater to the kids bathroom when we had the house replumbed. That extra couple mins is so helpful when trying to get 3 kids through 3 baths and into bed.

      And honestly, one of the happiest marriages I know is a doctor married to a guy who works retail at an outdoors sports store and runs ultra marathons on the side. He handles all the household stuff including cooking and travel planning. He’s the most supportive laid back guy. They’ve moved like 4 times to support her career and he’s so chill about it. Just makes new friends and gets involved with the running community wherever they are.

      As a lawyer who is the daughter of a lawyer and married to someone with a hard science PhD, I have NO idea why any of these jobs are better than someone with a skilled trade or who is a supportive partner who centers their life around their wife’s career.

      2. Yes, it’s one of those two. Money is not an issue, nor is education. He is obviously very talented at what he does.

        He does come from a lower class background than myself but it does not usually affect our day to day. I’m not sure what gives me pause.

        1. This is an off the wall suggestion but I’ve talked before about how I renovated some properties with my cousin, who is a contractor and who studied architecture. There is a podcast called “modern craftsman.” My cousin loves it. On it skilled craftsman talk about their trades, industries and businesses. I think it might give you better perspective on your partner’s work. If you have any appreciation for beautiful spaces it’s fascinating.

        2. Just taking a wild guess, because another poster mentioned this recently – do you get any dismissive/anti-intellectual vibes from him or his family about your job/education? Just wondering if there is another piece to the dynamic that makes you feel defensive. Because on the face of it, I don’t get what your problem is. Plumbers and electricians (together with HVAC techs) are so, so key to the broader societal issue of climate change. Without them, we will NEVER manage the energy transition. I cannot overstate how important they are to this issue. Thousands of PhD climate scientists and policy makers alone will not fix it.

          1. This. Scientists tell us the problem and blue collar workers help implement the solutions.

        3. Let him go. He deserves better. I’m getting vibes of my maternal grandmother who somehow thought she was better than my paternal grandmother because her family had more money and was more generations removed from blue collar jobs. Meanwhile there was tons of issues with cursing/drinking/snobbery on her side and I literally had strangers stop and tell me what a lady my paternal grandmother was after she passed.

          Table manners and dress codes can be taught. A warm, gracious and accepting attitude is much harder to cultivate and is evidence of true class. You should work on the later because you clearly didn’t learn it from your parents who taught you to be snobbish about blue collar jobs.

          1. I totally agree!!!

            If the OP can’t see how bringing electricity and clean running water to homes or businesses IS contributing to greater society (probably way more directly her job…) , then I just really don’t think this is a relationship of mutual respect.

            I’m not trying to be rude, but OP has a lot of self work to do here.

    9. Is it a title thing, or an income thing? What is your partner’s family like?

      My brother is an auto mechanic. He scraped by in high school (drugs, depression). Never attempted college, did a quick stunt in jail for too many DUIs. Then…grew up. Got a job, became a trusted #2 at a local shop and now makes a very decent income.
      He met and married a woman that is a PhD and an Ivy League professor with a very highly regarded research lab. I don’t know exactly what she makes but their incomes are about equal and they live a not lavish but very comfortable life in the coastal suburbs.

      He’s just as smart is she is. They have a lot of common interests, largely outdoors and music, and are both involved in local politics. My parents both went to college and had white collar jobs, though my grandfather was a laborer.

      I have never once ever seen his blue collar job be an issue. If anything, she and her friends rely on my brothers for all their fix-it type work and highly respected him for it.

        1. It seems obvious that a prestigious job is important to you. Good to recognize this (it is what it is), and also to recognize that you and your partner are not compatible, regardless of however wonderful he is otherwise. Let him go.

    10. Therapy might help you reframe some of your thinking. But ultimately, he deserves someone who loves and respects all of him — can you be that person? If you were to have children, would you want them to grow up thinking that his job is “less than”?

      I grew up in a household that overemphasized college, and while I have done very well, every time I struggle to get a reliable plumber or navigate car repairs I am reminded that we need people in a lot of different jobs to form a society, and we probably need a lot more blue-collar workers than we have.

      1. This.

        I have just spent 2 days and 15 phone calls finding an appliance repair service for our fridge (and yes, we will have it repaired instead of buying a new one, even though it’s past warranty). The few local companies were either overbooked, just serving existing or commercial customers, in the process of closing shop because they couldn’t find workers, or just a sales business with no interest in service even though that’s what they call themselves. Same with tree care, plumbing, deck building, concrete or foundation work… It is a struggle and I think someone skilled could really build a business quick.

      2. Regarding needing more blue collar workers: the cobbler near me is past retirement age and taking in money because it’s either throw out your La Canadiennes or pay whatever price he charges to get the heel fixed. There aren’t young people to take his place.

    11. My blue collar DH would be much more valuable that I would be in a zombie apocalypse. The fact that my skill set is more highly compensated than his is luck of the draw. Different cultures value different things, but that doesn’t make them right. All work has dignity. All people have value. No one is intrinsically better than anyone else simply by virtue of their skill set.

    12. This reminds me of the Frasier plot when Roz dates the trash man.

      What is it about his job that gives you pause? Is it the pay, the title, stereotypes, etc? Identifying exactly what bothers you will help you to either get over it or recognize that it is a deal breaker for you and move on.

    14. What’s the job title? Plumber? Janitor?

      The part of me that is outraged by what you said wants me to tell you to leave him and let him find someone who appreciates him.

      But the kinder part of me wants to remind you that blue collar people make the world go around. I move numbers around on a spreadsheet all day. I am not at all convinced I am doing more for the world than the guy who comes to fix my sink.

      Couples therapy if you’re serious about a long term relationship. Just realize this is a you problem, not a him problem. He does not need to go get a degree and a white collar job to make him a worthy person.

      2. Probably not gonna go over well to say “Sweetie, I want you go to go couples therapy with me because I look down on you.”

    15. I grew up poor. My dad was not blue collar, he just had low self esteem and a dead end job. My partner also grew up poor: his parents are just terrible with money. One thing we really bonded over in early adulthood was not wanting to be poor. My partner had an opportunity to be a tradesman, but he gave it up to join the military. Then he went to law school. For us, it was really more about escaping our families and our trashy hometown. Tl;dr – is it about the job title or the lifestyle? If it’s the former, you can work to get over it. If it’s the latter, you should probably let him go.

    16. i’m sure i will be attacked for saying this, but i understand where you are coming from. I was raised with such a strong value placed on education and a college degree, that i don’t know if i would’ve entered into a relationship with someone without one to begin with. i was not raised being told to look down on blue collar work in that blue collar work just wasn’t discussed though no one said anything bad about it. do i realize there are many smart, intelligent, kind, hardworking people who do not have college degrees – of course! do i know if we’d have had enough in common to make a relationship work, i dont know because i met my husband in college. i’m also from a religion/culture where education is valued and it was and still is important to me to be with someone who shares my religion and the shared values that come with that. i have two daughters and if one brought home someone with a blue collar job admittedly would probably not be thrilled at first, but once i learned more about them and saw how they interacted with my daughter, our family, etc. and learned about them as a person I hope i wouldn’t care

      1. I am not trying to attack you but I just don’t understand this. Just because someone works a blue collar job, it doesn’t mean they don’t value education. Due to life circumstances, it’s likely that entering a trade was the best option for them.

        I graduated from a top university but my husband is a skilled blue collar worker.

        In all honesty, and this is not directed at you, I think too much emphasis is put on an elite education today. As if earning a multiple degrees entitles someone to a better life, more money, more respect, etc.

        I think people need to create value and contribute to society. That is done in many ways, and not all PhDs are contributing to society in a meaningful way.

        1. I think some of this is a generational thing. My mom and MIL (early boomers) both act like this, and expressed a huge amount of relief when my 40-something brother-in-law (my sister’s husband, so not the son of either) got a BA a few years ago.

          My BIL is pretty much the opposite of a slacker. He had dropped out of German university in his early 20s (before he moved to the US), and had been gainfully employed by a big German company for years and years. He really only did the BA because he wanted to switch fields entirely, but they acted like he’d finally become An Actual Middle-Class Adult because he finally had a degree.

          My MIL also once took me out to lunch to try and convince me to make my husband finish up his PhD. He had no interest – had gotten half-way through a self-funded PhD program when he realized he would be better off abandoning ship. It’s silly and old-fashioned and frankly snobby.

    17. I work in finance. My boyfriend is a bartender. He went to college but didn’t really take it seriously. He’s very intelligent but wasn’t a fan of school. He is wonderful—we have interesting conversations, he has a fantastic personality, he’s very knowledgeable about what goes into crafting a cocktail and all the mix of flavors and whatever that you want, he will be the greatest dad…I initially thought “bartender? No” but once I got to know him as a person I could not be happier with him.

      If it’s been a year and you’re still hung up on his blue collar job, break up. You don’t seem to be able to get past that to see what HE is like as a person.

      As an aside, my commute takes me through the ritzy neighborhood in my city and I constantly admire the landscaping and homes. All of that work (planting, mowing, pruning, building, cleaning, maintenance, etc.) is done by blue collar workers. I think blue collar workers are far more skilled in some areas than us white collar workers—would you know how to build a house and finish it so it looks nice? I sure wouldn’t.

    18. So, when I got together with my husband, he did not have a defined career path and he was considering going into a blue-collar job (becoming an electrician). He ended up going into IT, then into programming, then into managing teams of programmers. It’s well-compensated work and he is good at it and feels generally good about his job and his career. But there are times where I wish he had become an electrician, because in all honesty, I think he would be happier going into buildings and tinkering with wiring and figuring out problems with people’s electricity than he is dealing with people problems all day long. He is not a “people person” and really is happiest when he’s able to work solo, figuring out tough problems. He still gets to do that in his job, but he also has to deal with being a manager and all the attenuated BS that goes along with it.

      About 10 years ago, when he was in his early 40s, we discussed him making a pivot, but he felt like it was too late for him. So now, he has 10 more years to work doing this stuff he doesn’t really like. If I had our lives to live over again, knowing what I know now, I would tell him “don’t go into IT; be an electrician” because electricians make plenty of money, there’s plenty of job security, and I think he’d be generally happier doing that.

      For me, what mattered about my partner and his career was:
      – Is he willing to work steadily and work hard, when it’s called for;
      – Does he understand the need for both of us to work and work hard, to provide the kind of lifestyle we want to live;
      – Is he going to take his job seriously and understand that once we start relying on an income, and benefits, he can’t just then up and quit the job if he has a bad day, or whatever.

      Your own mileage on this may vary, but let me tell you – I would take being married to a successful electrician who is kind, honest, faithful, hardworking, a good father, and is loving toward me any day of the week, over some high-powered executive who works all the time, treats me like a maid, cheats on me on business trips, ignores our kids (or treats them like an annoyance) and generally always puts himself first over the family.

    19. How to get over yourself = be realistic about what you are bringing to the table. If your preference is for a man with a more prestigious or society-changing job, you nonetheless haven’t been able to attract that man at this point (who also has other qualities that you want). If you think you can attract that man, and would be happier doing so, break up with your current man and go for it. If you don’t think you can, recognize that your current partner is the best you can do and appreciate him accordingly.

      1. This is an excellent point and I’m going to think a lot more about this. I have tried to find and date “professionals” but many (all) have not had the qualities I am looking for in a partner.

      2. Wow. This devalues her partner so much. “The best you can do” implies there’s something wrong with him. There isn’t.

    20. If your partner looked down on you for your profession, in exactly the way that you look down on him, do you believe that this would be a situation where you could build a future together?

    21. Based on OP’s comments, I think she should let this guy go while she works on her prejudice issues.

      But my PSA to other singles: GET A BLUE COLLAR PARTNER. It is amazing! I point at parts of my house and they are magically fixed. I have custom furniture built from scratch. My husband built a swing set for our kids during the pandemic. I could go on.

      Plus blue collar guys are friends with other blue collar guys, and they all love being handy. My driveway looks bad so my husband and his buddies are redoing it this weekend. When my AC broke in 100 weather, his HVAC buddy was at our house replacing parts in the hour.

      Plus blue collar workers can own their own business and be profitable much easier than white collar workers because their skill set is actually necessary to society. I know so many blue collar workers who started their own business and they make multiple times what I do as a lawyer. My husband and I used to be close in income, and now my law firm salary is nothing compared to his because his business is doing well.

      1. Do you face any differences in your relationship?

        I am not going to let him go, I am actively trying to work on myself and become a better person.

        1. We both love our kids, value hard work, save our money, etc. We also don’t care much about impressing others. It’s also great to have entirely different careers because there is no competition.

      2. The point about owning your own business is so true and powerful. I’m cracking up now because I met another lawyer mom at my kid’s very fancy school. Her husband is a plumber. His dad was a plumber. The family owns a very large business and it’s very nice to visit their fancy house and fancy beach house. It’s very clear her healthy salary is not primarily responsible for their bills. I literally forgot the guy was a plumber until now.

        Op I’m wondering if you’re not American or are maybe from an immigrant background. I feel like blue collar work, especially when it becomes lucrative enough to pay as much as or more than professional white collar work is really something people really value here. Im not the richest person but my I went to an expensive college, I live in a wealthy area, grew up at a country club, ect. I’ve met really, really, few people in life who weren’t less than a few generations removed from blue collar work and almost none who value job titles like you do. I think your mindset is pretty unusual in this issue.

        1. My family, on both sides, is at least three or four generations removed from blue collar work. I DGAF about titles or look down on people who do that; in many ways, I know that we need them more than they need us.

    22. Hard agree with other commenters that this is an OP problem, not a him problem, and she should let him go. I graduated from a top 5 law school and my husband is a blue collar worker with little more than a high school degree. We started dating when I was 18 and we’re now about 40.
      He is still the most interesting person I know, and often more well-read than I am. If anything, I am proud to show him off — unlike a lot of my friends’ husbands with advanced degrees and white collar jobs, he is extremely well rounded, capable, and sexy in a very fundamental way, not in a boring gym rat way. We talk about current events together and appreciate art (stories, music, etc.) together.
      We also complement each other very well. I handle most administrative household tasks because I’m good at that, and conversely, I have never had to call or wait for any household or vehicle maintenance task to be dealt with. Literally anything that has ever popped up, he can diagnose and fix himself, cheaply and quickly. He has been a great stay-at-home parent at times, is a great cook, and has basically built our house. He also just has a lot of general physical stamina, is open to trying many different things, and is extremely good at handling emergency situations.
      I have a really hard time imagining being married to a different kind of man at this point — like the kinds of men I went to law school with — that basically sounds like living a 2-dimensional life instead of a 3-dimensional life. The main differences between where I and my husband landed, educationally and professionally, has to do with the timing of our life circumstances and parental support, not inherent differences in intelligence or aptitude. If you can’t see that in your current partner, move on to the dime-a-dozen dudes in your same professional cohort.

    23. My parents were both the first in their families to go to college so I grew up understanding the importance of college but also appreciating a blue collar career as that was my entire extended family.

      Yesterday’s The Daily podcast talked about the value of college and how the college graduate wealth gap is essentially a coin flip for those born in the 80s or later. Have to say that’s been the case in my family – I look at some cousins who have gone to college and floundered and others who have leveraged their construction skills and people savvy to have successful careers with no debt and largely set their own schedules.

      As a homeowner and working parent now I feel like it would be so nice to have friends that just fix your house for you like one commenter described. My aunt hasn’t dealt with a car repair in 50 years for example because her husband largely fixes cars for the family and what he can’t do in his garage anymore due to computer chips, he knows how to get only that piece done quickly and cheaply. Another family member has a beautifully manicured yard including a fence and shed they built on their own while meanwhile I’m over here considering how many more years we get out of our fence and do we kick the can down the road on having that backyard oasis for weekend and evening relaxation.

      At the end of the day, he deserves a partner and in laws that respect him. If that’s not you, set him free to someone who will.

    24. I am a lawyer with a blue collar husband. He comes from a blue collar family.

      We don’t have issues related to this because I recognize that he works harder than me most days, and his work is very important to society. I see above yours is an electrician or plumber, and I’m just really not sure why you don’t think those professions are real, concrete contributions to the wellbeing of your community.

      Sometimes he won’t dress up as much as I’d like for an event. So I just tell him I think others will be wearing X. So then he changes bc he doesn’t want to feel underdressed.

      All of my friends love him. He is well read, educated, sweet, and loves me to pieces. And I do for him! It breaks my heart a little to think about someone like him wasting a precious year of his life doting on someone who looks down on him. I’m not trying to pile on, but honestly think about it from his side.

      As for what you can do about it— I’m not sure how to teach someone empathy or to truly value others. Therapy is probably a good start.

    25. I never could get over it. The lack of education was real and apparent. There were references and things he just didn’t understand. His friends were the same. I did not want blue collar children. In the end I found someone just as nice who I had more in common with. We both have graduate degrees in the same field. His friends are smart and successful. I want to give my children the best chance in life.

      1. The only way that would work is if they didn’t have a snob for a mom. If you’re instilling elitist values in your kids – sorry, Mom, you failed.

    26. You are hearing a little voice in your head that’s telling you that you can do better. Listen to it.

  7. What would you do?

    I’m a finalist for three different jobs. (This is confirmed by the three orgs; tomorrow I have final presentations to two of them.)

    Org A is my top choice. Orgs B and C are kind of a toss-up. Org C just asked me to fly out to them for a final meeting — but it’s not until the week after next. They want me to buy tickets and they’ll reimburse me. (I trust them on this, they’re a legit org.) I should probably buy now so they don’t go up too much in cost.

    But it’s a very distinct possibility that I’ll get an offer from Org A or B early next week. What do I do if I’ve already bought my tickets for Org C? I’d be out $. Do I just go anyway and have a free trip to a nice city? Do I tell them now that I might be getting an offer next week and see if that changes things? (I feel like that’s a NO, but I’m just running through my options here.) Do I simply wait and not buy any tickets and risk it?

    After my final presentations tomorrow with Orgs A and B I will definitely ask for clarity on their timelines, so it’s also potentially a decision I can wait on until tomorrow. I’m just all the over the place right now.

    1. Continue in the process until you have an offer in hand. It may be that the offer from A never comes through for whatever reason and then if you have an offer from both B and C you may be able to negotiate on salary or other factors like PTO or moving allowance (in the case of C).

    2. That’s a lot of balls in the air, so don’t feel bad for being all over the place. In your situation, I would book a refundable ticket to go to the Org C meeting. It will cost more, but if you get the nod from Org A before then, you can opt out with no cost to anyone.

      Good luck, you’ve got this!

      1. Assuming that you travel some for personal reasons, I would do one of the tickets that you can cancel to get airline credits instead of a refundable ticket. The ones that permit you to cancel for airline credits are only a little cheaper (like $50ish), when I’ve always seen refundable tickets at double the price or more.

        2. Yeah if you buy anything but basic economy, the ticket should be refundable for credit (at least in the US). And you shouldn’t buy basic economy for many reasons.

    3. Carry on until you’re really actually going to a different company. The timing here is so close that it’s actually unlikely to all resolve before C happens. C stands out to me in that you’d have to fly there, do you actually want to move? If they’re interviewing you for a remote or satellite position, those are more career limiting than local jobs. I would assess whether you’d actually go through with it since you have two other likely viable options and obviously are pretty good at interviewing and getting into the process.

      1. It’s a remote position, just headquartered in another city!

        Thank you everyone for these tips/thoughts! And for the luck. It’s been a rough summer (lots of interviews, no offer) and I’m feeling really positive about these three options — just wild that they’re all happening on basically the exact same timeframe!

        1. I don’t think it’s that unexpected. In my org, not a lot happens over the summer. Fall is when things get done in terms of interviews/hires. Also usually a lull in December/January and picks up again April – June.

    4. You’ve gotten good advice already, just want to say GOOD LUCK! It’s a challenging but good position to be in. I hope you get the offer you’re hoping for.

  8. I like it but when I try to wear v-neck cardigans as part of a work outfit, the necklines always seem wrong. Do they only work with v-neck blouses or dresses? I don’t have a lot of office-appropriate v-neck apparel.

    1. I wore this type of look a lot in my early career with ‘the skirt’ or slacks – I generally went with a square necked top or more of a u-neck cami (like the ‘stretch cami’ from Ann Taylor). I personally would find it hard to wear over a button down blouse but I think a silk t-shirt (like the Quince ones) would also work well with this.

  9. Has anyone been in Paris recently? Would a canvas crossbody Le Pliage look terribly dated?

    1. I was there last week. And no (at least if you are travelling for fun; I cannot advise on what people are wearing for business).

    3. The beauty and curse of Paris is that it’s SUCH a tourist town that you can wear anything and someone will for certain stand out more than you. See: dining at extremely nice restaurant and couple next to us in sweats and track suits. That rings true of many major cities, but for whatever reason really stood out in Paris.

      If you want to blend in with Parisians, that’s another story, but no, I wouldn’t go get another bag just for tourist trip.

      1. Oh I’m not! My old every day bag is worn out, I’m getting a new bag for life in general and also want it to be acceptable for vacation.

  10. Posted late yesterday afternoon and would love some more responses but suspect I just need to let this go.

    When do you complain about a cleaning service? I had a “deep clean” done and feel like the person the service sent kind of slacked. For example, the cleaning includes cleaning the refrigerator and while this person wiped the fridge, it was not well done and I can see crumbs/veggie bits in lots of places. I also asked her to do some things that she didn’t do which admittedly aren’t officially part of the service but that she had time for because so many of the things that normally would be required weren’t necessary. I say she had time for because she left at least 90 min early.

    We normally use this service for a regular weekly clean and I guess what is bothering me is that I paid double to have someone do the same regular weekly clean while hastily wiping down the fridge and windows and not much else. In the past they have done a tremendous job on deep cleans – like refolded all my towels in the bathroom to be neatly rolled, etc.

    I probably would also be less bothered if this was my regular cleaning person from the service so I could feel like okay maybe I paid her more for this than it was worth but it all evens out, but this was someone new who I am not going to see again but maybe that’s an unfair consideration. I think this is probably on me for not having confirmed with the service ahead of time what I was expecting and getting but I just feel like I got a really crappy deal and it’s bugging me. Would you say anything? I honestly don’t even know that I expect anything if I do complain, I just feel like I want to say something for the record, as it were.

    1. For a business owner, ‘saying something for the record’ is the worst. It’s like telling a business you’re unhappy but you don’t want us to do anything. You just want us to know you’re unhappy? If you have an issue, what do you want as a solution or are you looking for us to propose a solution or are you just letting us know that an employee needs to improve her work, to have a more specific list of tasks laid out for a deep clean vs regular clean, to guarantee that you get your regular cleaner?

    2. Same thing just happened to me. I just let it go and hired a professional post construction dust removal company to do a deep clean. I still use the other service regularly and my brand isn’t complaining over a few bucks.

    3. I would call the company and let them know a similar version of what you posted here. You paid double, but the only extra you received was a hasty wipedown of the fridge and windows. A good company would send someone back out to finish the job. Do it quickly though, because the more time passes the more likely it looks that you’re trying to get an extra cleaning for free.

      2. I agree with this. I commented early this morning on the other post. I would ask them to send someone else to finish the job. If it wasn’t incomplete enough to warrant another job then I probably wouldn’t say anything, though I might confirm that I’m going to keep my normal cleaning person (or hire her directly if you can) and they’re not trying to switch me to the new person.

    4. The tricky bit will be that your complaint in part relates to her doing things/not doing things that you say are not normally part of the service. It doesn’t seem like you and the company had an understand of what task are/are not part of a clean and confusion over if you are buying the completion of a list of tasks or a set number of cleaning hours.

  11. Tips for getting sunscreen stains out of your car? I am constantly staining the interior of my car with sunscreen, as well as getting sunscreen fingerprint stains on the outside of my car from shutting my doors (I’m never buying a black car again!). Multiple carwash attempts are not removing the stains from the exterior. I also haven’t had luck getting the sunscreen stains out from the inside of the car after multiple attempts washing with warm water and also using Ameral car cleaner.

    1. I’ve not tried this with sunscreen, but I would take the car to be detailed somewhere where they will use a carpet cleaner on the seats. I once had a growler of beer break all over my car’s backseat. Unsurprisingly, it’s stained and stunk. Getting it detailed completely took away the stain and smell. I can’t remember what side it was on, and there is no way to tell by looking at the backseat.

    2. Please tell us what kind of sunscreen it is so we can avoid it! And wash your hands after you put on sunscreen. A professional detailer should be able steam/buff away stains like that.

      1. I use multiple brands, and it doesn’t seem to happen more with one over the other. I guess I’m just messy?! Cerave face lotion with sunscreen is one I use frequently.

    3. Prevention is the answer. Apply sunscreen long enough before getting in the car that it has time to dry, and wipe the excess off your hands. For mineral sunscreen stains, I have had luck with Dawn. If you are getting the yellow stains from chemical sunscreen on your upholstery, you may need rust remover, but I don’t know how to use it safely on upholstery.

    4. My very pale family has this problem too. I don’t know that this will work for the car interiors but I’ve been impressed with how well rubbing alcohol gets my kid’s mineral sunscreen stains out of their black stroller seat.

      1. Good to know! Yes, we have this problem with our stroller and diaper bag too. Anything we have on the go gets sunscreen stains. Why on earth I bought myself a black belt bag from Lululemon, I have no idea.

    5. baby wipes have worked well for me on the inside, but not sure if it would work for outside

    6. Thanks, all. I have the habit of applying sunscreen in the car before heading out to something (since I want to see myself in the mirror to make sure it’s rubbed in), and then I end up with all these smudges in the car. My seats are fine, but I have white stains in the plastic detailing on the inside of the car (on the inside of the door and by the dash). And then the finger smudges on the outside of the door too. I guess the answer is to remember to apply it before leave the house and to wash my hands after.

      1. Or keep a washcloth or bandanna in the car to use to handle the interior after applying the sunscreen and before getting out of the car?

  12. Anyone made a career change later in life and have positive stories to share? How did you do it?

    I suspect I am having a midlife crisis related to my career and would love some advice from you wise women.

    My career is interesting, allowed me to save a lot, and has decent work-life balance. I get to work with smart people and solve interesting problems. I’m paid well and there are some nice perks. But now I am about halfway between college and retirement and I find myself asking, “Is this it?”

    I’ve saved enough that I can make a change and don’t have to maintain such a high salary, but I’m wary of romanticizing other types of careers, only to end up making half as much and dealing with the same b s.

    I know this: I don’t have the “oomph” it takes to be a corporate leader. I don’t do well in intense, cutthroat atmospheres. I like being able to really sink my teeth into a place, stay for a while, get to know people and build relationships. But in the current climate, it’s pretty typical to job hop (or wait around until you get laid off!), and many places are up or out, which I hate.

    Friends are in academia, teaching, non-profit management, or hardcore corporate, and everyone seems to deal with similar struggles, but at least the ones in jobs who know their work makes a positive difference can be content with that at the end of the day… my work isn’t hurting anyone, but it also isn’t exactly solving the world’s problems, you know?

    I find myself wishing I had pursued something else that I was more passionate about, but I guess there’s no guarantee that would have worked. And then I might have ended up this age wishing I had pursued a corporate career and regretting having no savings!

    Anyway, would be great to hear from others who feel similarly and got through it, and/or are currently dealing with similar struggles!

    1. “My career is interesting, allowed me to save a lot, and has decent work-life balance. I get to work with smart people and solve interesting problems. I’m paid well and there are some nice perks. But now I am about halfway between college and retirement and I find myself asking, “Is this it?””

      In your shoes, I’d be inclined to stay in your job. Most people don’t have big passion for their career and you’d be giving up a lot.

      But to answer your question, I made a big career change in my 30s. There were a variety of factors, but probably the biggest one was that I wanted a family and my first career wasn’t compatible with how I wanted to parent. I don’t have regrets. I don’t have any particular passion for what I do now, but I earn enough for the lifestyle I want and have terrific work-life balance.

    2. I am considering doing the same. I have a job I very much enjoy that is demanding and interesting, but I am just done with the politics and it’s like a balloon has deflated during the pandemic as far as my interest in continuing in that kind of environment. I have a nonprofit opportunity that has been very interesting and I’m considering whether making a switch makes sense. It would also be like a 75% pay cut, which I can certainly do but I don’t know if my ego is ready for.

    3. Two thoughts:
      – could you get a new job in the same field that allows you to do more of the work you really like?
      – do you volunteer? If you do, could you amp it up – take on a more time-intensive commitment?

    4. I’m not quite at midlife, at least I don’t consider mid 30s to be quite there yet! But I am in the midst of a big career change. I really dislike my job and I found something else that I am passionate about. I’m getting a completely unrelated masters degree part time while I continue working my current job. It’s hard, but I’m almost done and while I haven’t made the full transition yet, I can already say it’s absolutely worth it.

    5. This: “My career is interesting, allowed me to save a lot, and has decent work-life balance. I get to work with smart people and solve interesting problems. I’m paid well and there are some nice perks. But now I am about halfway between college and retirement and I find myself asking, “Is this it?””

      And this: “I don’t have the “oomph” it takes to be a corporate leader. I don’t do well in intense, cutthroat atmospheres. I like being able to really sink my teeth into a place, stay for a while, get to know people and build relationships.”

      Are at odds with one another. You have a great job. You say yourself that you aren’t cut out for higher levels. So I think this is a job for a hobby! Can you find something you’re passionate about outside of work to get involved with? I’m really passionate about Afghan refugees and helping them overcome the #$%@$ %^%$# way our government abandoned their country, our promises, and dropped thousands of them here with only 3 months’ financial support. “Welcome! Have fun! We know we dropped you in a city where a studio costs $2k/month and minimum wage is $10/hr and you have a family of 7, but you’re here, what else could you ask for? Tata!” So I happily do my work tasks that give me time to be a warrior for these families. Something else can give you a sense of meaning and purpose.

      1. Please tell me about the volunteer work you do. Is it done via a charity and if so which one? At some point I want to do work like this.

  13. I WFH full time in a spare bedroom used by guests 2-3 times per year. A ceiling fan with a large light is currently the only “permanent” light fixture, but I’m not wild about how it makes the center of the room bright and the corners pretty dark. Would can lights and removing the fan fix this issue? Is there another lighting solution to make the room brighter or more pleasant to work in? I do have a big lovely window, but it doesn’t fix the dark corners issue. Thanks in advance!

    1. Possibly dumb question – could you do floor lamps?
      I am Anti Big-Light so I usually have lots of lamps around.

      2. Down with the big light. If all the bulbs in big light blew tomorrow, I wouldn’t replace them. And that’s as a Californian in the grey and dark north. Give me a table light and some candles everyday.

    3. I don’t think can lights would fix this problem. What you need is a light source in the corner – could you get some floor lamps or table lamps for the corners of the room where you want light?

    4. Lamps! I almost never use my big light, it’s lamps all the way! That combined with any natural light you have, and maybe a ring light for video calls, and you should be good to go.

    5. Babes let us introduce you to the miracle that is the floor lamp and the table lamp and the desk lamp.

    6. Cans are the worst, they’re ugly and hard to change the bulbs. If you want to hardwire lighting, add sconces to dark corners. Otherwise lamps. Also consider replacing the fan with a multilight chandelier for more brightness.

    7. Lamps. This is what lamps are for. All overhead lighting – cans, fans, flush mounts, it doesn’t matter – is awful for anything other than tasks or cleaning.

    8. Apparently I’m an outlier there but we just did LED recessed lighting throughout our house an I’m obsessed. The only light we had in bedrooms was exactly as you describe. We put them in a certain layout at the recommendation of our electrician and put them on dimmer, and I’m in love. Highly recommend.

    9. Going against the grain here. I love can lights. I want to walk into a room, flip one switch, and have the whole thing evenly illuminated. Dim or uneven lighting drives me crazy.

        1. I like the option of a well lit room, but this approach to lighting a room gives me a headache before too long, so I really can’t comfortably socialize or relax in this setting.

        2. I absolutely cannot stand overhead lighting of any form except in the kitchen as task lighting and the chandelier over the dining room table. Can lights are unflattering and hideous to boot.

    10. Maybe take a look at the posts on Maria Killam’s website about how almost no room has enough lamps? She’s very absolutist about it, and very against can lights, which is why I recommend this — you’ll know from looking at the photos if you agree with her or if can lights are the way to go for you.

    11. Lights in any room should be layered in some combination of ceiling lights, floor lamps, regular lamps, or desk lamps. I hate ceiling lights so have table lamps at different height levels and with different degrees of brightness. My kitchen has ceiling lights, under counter lights, and a three way switch small lamp on a counter. Lighting options in that room range from the beach in Florida at noon to a very soft glow. Lamps are how you get rid of dim spots. And you know those salt globe lamps that they sell in hippie grocery stores? Perfect to light your face softly in an otherwise well-lit room on a zoom call. Place it to the side and slightly back of your computer and enjoy not looking like a corpse.

  14. If you were going to buy 5 new clothing items this fall, what would they be? Can be specific or general. Just looking for some inspiration to update things a bit!

    1. Ooh, I like this. I just bought a new pair of corduroys – they’re my favorite casual winter pants. I’m looking for a couple cute fall shirts to wear with them – my “casual cute” tops are really lacking these days.

    2. I WFH and do a lot of yoga, so my new Beyond Yoga set in sage green is getting a lot of wear rn! I got flare bottoms instead of straight leggings, which are more current and also more comfortable.

      Other things I’ve bought/on my wishlist:
      – A bright red or pink oversized cardigan from Sezane
      – Black straight leg jeans
      – Schutz ballet flats (these are an updated silhouette and super comfy. I also lust after Leoffler Randall flats)
      – A block print quilted jacket from Etsy

    3. Boots, sweater dress, knit casual dress, sweater vest. Still looking for jeans. Hate most of the styles right now.

    4. I really want (fake) leather pants or coated jeans. I’d love a suede moto jacket. For work, I want JCF’s sweatshirt blazer. Probably another pair of straight leg jeans. A sweater or fun top.

    5. I bought a pair of cords that have a sort of 70s vibe, a lightweight black sweater dress for my dining outside in Winter collection, and a new pair of more modern looking loafers than what I have.

    7. Olive green booties to go with midwash jeans. Jacket that’s warm enough for October and November but doesn’t look wintery. Date tops that aren’t black. Black leather mini skirt. And the eternal hunt for a flattering sweater dress I can wear with booties.

    8. Fun topic! I would go with a pair of demi flares (or bootcut) jeans in a dark wash, straight leg jeans in a midtone or light wash, booties or boots that fit your personal style (chunky, moto, knee high, etc. – all boots seem to be back in a big way), a cozy cardigan or oversized blazer, a dressy blouse or sweater, and a sweater dress.

    10. Lug sole loafers/boots, purse (i feel like cross-bodys are kind of going out of style a bit, so looking for something more on trend), leather belt (i see more people belting trousers so want to give it a try), some kind of vest, pleated or silk/satin midi-skirt

    11. I keep a list on my phone of items I’m on the hunt for, and these are my top 5 right now:

      – full-length wide leg jeans in a medium to dark wash
      – cropped boxy cardigan to go with high-waist pants & skirts in a not-black neutral
      – oversized blazer, probably in a menswear print like windowpane or houndstooth
      – block-heel oxfords, preferably in oxblood
      – silk shell in a good plum or burgundy shade

    12. 1. A new wool topcoat, but I want something so particular I doubt it exists. 2. Black suede ankle boots with a good tread, ideally side-zip, very light, solid 3 inch heel. 3. New bras (already purchased), 4. A new blackwatch plaid shirt that won’t get fuzzy like my 2022 Uniqlo buttondown, 5. Something luxurious in butter yellow (eyeing the short coat shaket at COS).

    13. I’ve been getting a couple of new to me cashmere and wool jumpers already, and have new winter boots on the list. (-25 Celcius boots).

      I think check/plaid is current, and would like to find a teal and pink check in a light wool. Maybe a cord shirt dress. For more formal, some nice wool trousers that work with shoes worn with socks.

  15. Travel assistance – I am looking for a spring break location for next year… first week of April. We have one kid (4). We’re potentially going with another family who has 3 kids (4,2.5, and 1). We’d like to do a beach location, and at that time of year, the only place warm enough is the Caribbean or Mexico. Ideally, we’re looking for a professionally managed house to rent that has its own pool and hotel-esque amenities like daily housekeeping. Does such a thing exist? If so —- Where do you find such a place? I have truly terrible luck with VRBO and air b and b, so I avoid those sites like the plague. Maybe it doesn’t exist, but figured I’d ask.

    1. Budget dependent but look for a resort that offers villas as part of its lodging options? Round Hill Jamaica is the first one that comes to mind.

      1. +1 to Round Hill. You could also check if Le Collectionist or Kid and Coe have houses in the Caribbean.

    2. Haven’t stayed there but when we were planning a similar vacation, the Turks and Caicos were one of our top choices. Seemed to be a number of hotels that had 2-3 bedroom condos on the resorts at a reasonable price. If you are open to another time of year in the future, Martinhal in Portugal has exactly this kind of thing.

    3. Yes! A friend does this annually with another group of kids/families in Mexico. Airbnb (which I know you said…) has staffed villas. They’ve had excellent experiences.

    4. South and even central Florida is plenty warm for a beach vacation in April. I love the Caribbean, but just something to keep in mind in case weather is the main reason you’re going there.

  16. I had a birthday a few weeks ago and something’s still bothering me.

    I got two “Happy Birthday, haven’t talked to you in so long, how are you” messages from two people I was close with once but haven’t spoken to in several years.

    At first I thought it was really nice and sweet for them to reach out, but both were just looking for a way to tell me they’re pregnant. It’s really made me feel some type of way. They know relatively little about my life now. For all they know I’m TTC and it’s going poorly.

    It’s not like I reached out to them, or was snooping on their lives. I was minding my own business and…metaphorically glitter bombed?

    1. I mean, how else would you like people to tell you this? I understand what you’re saying, but to me, you’re just looking for a reason to be upset.

    2. Here’s an alternative option: they both realized it was your birthday. They realized they hadn’t talked to you in a long time, and wanted to reach out. It felt weird to reach out and not mention the pregnancy. They thought you’d think it was super strange if you found out later from social media and realized they’d never mentioned it.

      You can choose to view this negatively, or you can choose to view it positively.

      1. Agreed, I might have done this while pregnant and really didn’t mean anything by it. It mostly went “Hey Jane, happy birthday, hope you’re doing well!” “Oh thanks, how are you doing?” “All good, DH and I are expecting in October”. I didn’t reach out with that purpose in mind, I genuinely just wanted to wish a happy birthday but then it came up organically and it seemed weird not to mention it and then have them see it on social media. Is it possible that’s how it played out?

    3. just an observation, why are you saying they reached out “just” to tell you they were pregnant? isn’t it possible that they thought of you on your birthday and happen to be pregnant? wouldn’t it have been worse if they reached out, didn’t tell you they were pregnant and then in 3 months when you hear second hand that they had a baby wouldn’t you think “wow it’s so weird they didn’t mention it?” i’m not always so good at it but i try to “assume positive intent” with people in situations like this.

      1. This. Social media (even if you are rarely active) will generally prompt birthday reminders. Even if you haven’t put birthday info in, lots of times people who are active will post messages. So yes, I’m going to ignore the reminder about the guy I had a summer job with 20 yrs ago when I was adding everyone to FB but I’m probably going to pop a quick 2 line message to my law school friend who I still see in person every 3-5 years.

        Pregnancy is a big life event like a wedding or a new job. It’s almost weird not to mention it in passing if you have contact with someone else. People are not living their life at you. If they had a great new job and you hated your job, would you find it strange they told you that they had a new job.

      2. also not to pile on but even if you were ttc and it was going poorly i don’t think it logically follows that you should be protected from knowing that other people are having babies. life just doesn’t work like that.

        1. +1, and I think it’s more polite to give you a heads up over text vs getting surprised with a photo on social media.

    4. I don’t know, maybe they just wanted to get back in touch with someone they hadn’t talked to in a while. And once you’re talking, it would be extremely weird not to mention the biggest news in their lives. Either they stay in touch with this kind of thing or you fall out of contact. If you actually like these people, I’ll always argue for interpreting things kindly and maintaining a friendship. Life is long and you never know when those friends might come back into your life again.

    5. It’s a big life step. Fleeting exchanges are often when people discuss marriages or divorces or cancer battles or the like, not just pregnancy. They still see you as a friend even if time has passed. I’d try to keep in mind they aren’t getting pregnant at you, just filling you in on a huge change. As much as it feels like a sting, you can’t expect folks around you not to live life. There will be times where it’s not glitter bombs but tear bombs. Frankly, I’d rather have glitter.

    7. I think you should examine why this is bothering you. You haven’t spoken to these people in years but you’re presumably still fond of each other. You weren’t part of the initial announcement because you’re not in regular contact. You popped into their heads because they got a notification about your birthday. So they reached out to share their good news. I don’t think most people perceive sharing good news out of the blue as a faux pas in the way that sharing bad news would be. Like if you’re minding your own business and someone says, happy birth my mom just died, that would feel very intrusive. Something like, happy birthday I got a new job, seems a bit self centered but good for you. I think happy birthday I’m pg is more like the latter than the former. I get what you’re saying about TTC, I am currently, but everyone has to run their own race and it’s not really fair to expect that other people will dampen their good news just because you’re not there yet.

  17. In search of tops to wear under blazers/sweater jackets/etc. I have a full stock of plain stretchy cotton t-shirts/long sleeves and several button ups, but looking for a basic, crew neck “fancy” t-shirt. The BR factory “essential” top is great, but I need one that also comes in white. I like the idea of silk, but realistically don’t want dry clean only. Taking suggestions!

    1. I have gorgeous, comfortable, and flattering silk short sleeve shirts from Amour Vert that I machine wash and line dry. They get a little wrinkly, so requiring steaming/ironing if you care about that (I don’t).

      1. +1 – I cold delicate machine wash (usually in a mesh bag) all my silk, and then lay flat to dry. Even the stuff that says dry clean only. Steam out the wrinkles (or let your body heat release them), rather than ironing. Who’s got time to do the dry clean route?

        If it makes you feel better – look for stuff that is advertised as washable silk. There *are* some silk finishes that won’t look the same after wet washing, and you might end up with some shrinkage if it’s labeled dry clean only, but anything marketed as washable silk is intended to be wet-laundered.

    2. you can delicate / hand wash a lot of silk! I used to take all my silk blouses to the dry cleaners but, frustrated with paying like $10, gave delicate cycle + mesh bag a try on my least favorite. It worked GREAT and I can’t believe how much money I’ve wasted. That said I do not mind ironing or steaming so if you do, YMMV.

    4. I have the Quince silk tee and always machine wash it (on cold, in a lingerie bag) and hang dry. But it wrinkles horribly and I hate steaming/ironing so I end up not wearing it as much. I have another silk tee that I bought used from somewhere else that looks fine after air drying. I’d love to find more like this.

  18. Brunch buffets in Las Vegas – I have a fun memory of going to one 15+ years ago – are they still as great post-COVID, and if so, which one is worth going to?

    We have a group of women who love their food, and lean vegetarian so not having a ton of premium meat options is fine.

    1. The bottomless brunch at LAVO is super fun and feels more upscale than some of the casino brunch buffets. It’s table service, not buffet, but you pay a flat rate and can order as much as you want off the menu (+an additional charge for bottomless drinks). It’s a bit more expensive than the casino buffets, but nothing crazy. Other than that, the brunch buffet at the Bellagio is “the” one to go to, in my experience.

    2. I was really disappointed by Bacchanal when I went post-COVID, even though it is still rated the top buffet. I am going to give The Buffet at Wynn a try in November because I am an optimist.

      1. I was disappointed by Bacchanal even before Covid. I think it’s so overpriced for the quality. My favorite buffet in Vegas is the Cosmo buffet, but I haven’t been to Vegas post-Covid.

  19. I need new jeans and am having a time of it. I am a size 10, maybe a size 12, and 5’10”. I carry a lot of weight in my hips/thighs.

    Every pair of bootcut jeans I try on fits like skinny jeans through my thighs and even a little snug on my calf (depends on brand), then opens at the bottom. I tried a pair of “wide” jeans and they were sort of snug on my butt and looked otherwise terrible. I don’t really want flared jeans (i did that in the 90s) though those seem to fit better.

    Over a decade ago I had some “boyfriend” jeans that were wide in the thigh but current “boyfriend” styles don’t seem to be cutting it- or my legs are thicker (very likely).

    Ideas? Search terms to use or brands to try?

    1. I’m a size 10 and have a larger tummy and the Zara Marine Straight jeans are SO flattering on me. They’re really high waisted and fitted through the hip area but just are cut wide and straight through the legs. They look massively wide when they’re not on, but once they’re on they feel super flattering and sexy.

      I also like a normal straight leg—I have some from Habitat that I got at Marshall’s and they’re a true straight leg and very comfy.

    3. I’m a different shape, but have a different brand to recommend because I just found it and I don’t think they get enough hype – Good American. I recently tried Good American jeans and love them a lot a lot. Like I bought the straight leg pair of dark wash jeans in the store the day I tried them since I needed them for work. They are really, really excellent. Then a couple weeks later bought their Palazzo wide leg jeans in a medium wash. I also really like the website and the branding and just overall really impressed.

  20. Would anyone like to purchase a store credit from me? I purchased one of the styles they are retiring in error and was only able to get store credit. The reason I returned the item was because I am petite and so nothing in my order of five items fit me and so I doubt anything else will fit me either.

  21. Awkward situation- I just realized one of the moms of a novice on my daughter’s crew team is a former client of mine. I filed a Chapter 7 bankruptcy case for her 11-12 years ago. I remember her crying at one of our meetings; the bankruptcy process was hard for her. The crew season just started and my daughter drives herself to and from practice now, so I have not seen the other mom in person yet. What is the best way to approach her when I do? (Of course, I would not say anything confidential around other people.) I feel like not saying anything would make it even more awkward but I don’t want to dredge up bad memores for her.

      1. I guess my bigger concern is that if I do that, and she does not recognize me, then what? This was fairly a long time ago.

        1. On second thought, I’d pretend you don’t know her. Either she doesn’t remember you (and very likely doesn’t want to know why you know her); or she does and hopes you don’t remember/are maintaining the polite fiction that you don’t or she can correct you if she wants to.

        2. If you all are 1:1, I’d go with Hi Jane nice to see you, and if she doesn’t remember, say, oh I remember handling a matter for you as your attorney a really long time ago, but it was so long ago I’m not surprised you don’t remember!

          If you’re with other people, I disagree with PP and don’t think you should indicate you know each other at all.

        3. Don’t remember her. It was a long time ago. You presumably have hundreds of clients. If she ever brings it up tell her “oh, you looked familiar but I couldn’t place it. hope you are well!” The end.

          2. Yeah,+1 with the added “you’re Gargamel’s mom, right? I’m Smurfette’s mom.” To re-ground you in your current roles

    2. Don’t say anything. Only awkward if you make it awkward. Sounds like a very emotionally charged situation, so doubtful she’d want to discuss it.

    3. I would probably just smile and say hi but not greet her by name, so as to leave it open to interpretation whether you remember her or you’re just being friendly.

    4. Others may feel differently, but if I were in her shoes, I would want you to pretend like we had no background and act like you were meeting any other mom on the team. Take her lead if she puts two and two together, but do not bring it up yourself or act like you know her unless she makes the connection.

      1. Ethically, as a lawyer (and if you were a doctor), you are not supposed to disclose the fact that she was your client (patient), at least not unless/until she does. That is confidential information, and you are bound to keep it confidential unless she consents otherwise. So, encounter on the street, no acknowledgement unless she initiates. Encounter at a crew parents’ event, small talk as you would with any other parent you only know through your child’s crew activity, as described in one of the comments below.

    6. Can you regard her as you would any other parent you vaguely know from seeing around school? Ie, hello, good to see you, how is this school year going? lovely weather we’ve been having, etc. Honestly, this is how I approach most fellow parents I’ve seen around because either a) I don’t remember if I’ve actually met them or just seen them and b) I don’t want to embarrass them if they don’t remember me from that field trip 4 years ago.

      That’s what I’d want if my doctor or lawyer was a parent at my child’s school, doubly so if they helped me through something sensitive.

    7. Just out of curiosity, because I’ve never gone through a bankruptcy but imagine it would be incredibly hard to go through, do most of your clients NOT cry at some point? Seems to me this would be an extremely common reaction, but maybe I’m wrong.

      1. Yeah, it was pretty common. I have not done that many, though. I started doing BK after moving to a new state, and decided to eliminate the practice area several years ago in an effort to streamline.

Comments are closed.