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I never seem to time our Hunts for winter jackets correctly — I always intend to do them, and boom, before you know it it's February and we're down to lucky sizes. Sigh. Next year, guys! But I did just update our Hall of Famers, so I'll post those below.
In the MEANTIME, this gorgeous chevron coat from Ted Baker caught my eye. I love the mix of grays and pink, mixed with a strong stripey pattern. Statement coat, yes please! I think it would look just as cute with jeans and sneakers as it would with a work outfit.
PLUS, I feel like Ted Baker consistently makes amazing, well-made, interesting coats.
It's on a major sale right now — it was $629 but is now marked to $377.
Some of our Hall of Fame coats include these…
Sales of note for 8.30.24
- Nordstrom – Summer Sale, save up to 60%
- Ann Taylor – 30% off full-price purchase; $99 jackets, dresses & shoes; extra 50% off sale
- Banana Republic Factory – 50-70% off everything + extra 20% off
- Bergdorf Goodman – Final Days Designer Sale, up to 75% off; extra 20% off sale
- Boden – 20% off
- Brooks Brothers – Extra 25% off clearance
- Eloquii – Up to 60% off everything; extra 60% off all sale
- J.Crew – 40% off sitewide; extra 60% off sale styles
- J.Crew Factory – Extra 20% off orders $125+; extra 60% off clearance; 60%-70% off 100s of styles
- Lo & Sons – Summer sale, up to 50% off (ends 9/2)
- Madewell – Extra 40% off sale; extra 50% off select denim; 25% off fall essentials
- M.M.LaFleur – Save 25% sitewide
- Rothy's – End of season sale, up to 50% off
- Spanx – Lots of workwear in the big sale, some up to 70% off
- Talbots – 25% off regular-price purchase; 70% off clearance
- White House Black Market – Up to 70% off sale
Sales of note for 8.30.24
- Nordstrom – Summer Sale, save up to 60%
- Ann Taylor – 30% off full-price purchase; $99 jackets, dresses & shoes; extra 50% off sale
- Banana Republic Factory – 50-70% off everything + extra 20% off
- Bergdorf Goodman – Final Days Designer Sale, up to 75% off; extra 20% off sale
- Boden – 20% off
- Brooks Brothers – Extra 25% off clearance
- Eloquii – Up to 60% off everything; extra 60% off all sale
- J.Crew – 40% off sitewide; extra 60% off sale styles
- J.Crew Factory – Extra 20% off orders $125+; extra 60% off clearance; 60%-70% off 100s of styles
- Lo & Sons – Summer sale, up to 50% off (ends 9/2)
- Madewell – Extra 40% off sale; extra 50% off select denim; 25% off fall essentials
- M.M.LaFleur – Save 25% sitewide
- Rothy's – End of season sale, up to 50% off
- Spanx – Lots of workwear in the big sale, some up to 70% off
- Talbots – 25% off regular-price purchase; 70% off clearance
- White House Black Market – Up to 70% off sale
Some of our latest posts here at Corporette…
And some of our latest threadjacks here at Corporette (reader questions and commentary) — see more here!
Some of our latest threadjacks include:
- What to say to friends and family who threaten to not vote?
- What boots do you expect to wear this fall and winter?
- What beauty treatments do you do on a regular basis to look polished?
- Can I skip the annual family event my workplace holds, even if I'm a manager?
- What small steps can I take today to get myself a little more “together” and not feel so frazzled all of the time?
- The oldest daughter is America's social safety net — change my mind…
- What have you lost your taste for as you've aged?
- Tell me about your favorite adventure travels…
Horse Crazy
I just signed up for a Les Mills on Demand membership – what are your favorite classes/workouts/programs? I’m trying to lose a bunch of weight (40ish lbs). I have a mat and dumbbells, but could potentially be talked into buying other equipment. I’m also not very familiar with their program yet, so any advice will be helpful.
Anon
I used to do Body Pump at my gym, and we also used the aerobics step for bench presses, tricep dips, lunges, etc. as well as barbells. You can get the bar bell where you can swap out the weights or there are these things called “body bars” that are at pre-set weights and I find it easier to grab a few of those and that way I can just grab the weight I need during the class way faster than resetting the weight on an adjustable bar.
No Face
Body Pump and Core are my go tos. When I consistently did Body Pump 3-4 times a week, I was in the best shape of my entire life. I dropped multiple dress sizes and I was toned all over.
I have a mat, dumbells, and a resistance band.
No Face
Forgot to mention that the newer videos do a really good job of showing modifications without equipment. There will be someone using dumbbells when the lead instructors are using barbells. I don’t have a step at home (no space) and I don’t miss it.
Anon
I second Body Pump. I was super toned with almost a six pack after doing body pump a couple of times a week mixed in with some cardio. Then the instructor moved to Switzerland…..and I became a soft blob.
Anon
I left a comment but it has been stuck in mod for a while! I used to take the Body Pump classes and in addition to what you mentioned – or even more so, we used the aerobics step and the barbells. I think you will need barbells to do some moves that are different than the dumbbells. You can get an adjustable one or the pre-set body bars – which I like because you can just quickly grab the weight you need instead of changing out plates.
Horse Crazy
I’ve never heard of these body bars before – such a great idea! Can I ask what weight(s) you use in the classes on those bars?
Anon
Yea, sometimes the weight will be a little too light or too heavy since it isn’t customizable, so I usually grabbed three or four of them during class. Clearly, it’s been a while since I’ve been to the gym, but I want to say that I used a 9, 12, 15, and 20. I never really went heavier than that, but i would not consider myself to be in great shape. If I didn’t have the exact right weight for the exercise, I would start out with the heavier and do as many reps as I could and then drop down. I will say, this is tempting me so much to subscribe to these classes, because I loved them so much but could not reliably make it to the classes due to my work schedule so I could never get into a consistent enough routine to see the results, but maybe this is the way to go.
Horse Crazy
Thank you – this is so helpful! I’m really excited to try them. The on demand program seems pretty affordable for what you get.
Anon
Also, to amend what I said – (I’m still not in great shape) but you are doing a lot of reps, that’s the whole point of body pump, so 20 pounds starts to feel heavy fast!!
Good luck with it, and please report back (and further tempt me!)
Horse Crazy
Got it, and I will definitely report back! I’m getting an IUD put in today (lol), so I will probably start in a few days when I’m not feeling like garbage.
EM84
Great! A mat and weights are all you need, no need to buy all the equipment at once, you can always modify. I would recommend to try one workout from all the groups just to see what you enjoy. The best class/workout is the one you will enjoy doing often. I personally like Core/cxwrx (I would say a band is a must have here), Body Pump (remember a set of dumbels is fine for beginners, you can always expand your weights set), Body Combat (no equipment needed), Grit Strength (I modify a lot due to back problems), Stretching (longtime yoga junkie here and this stretching is amazing), and Trip (bike needed). I like oldschool yoga, so do not do their BodyFlow or Barre often, but when I tried them out, I enjoyed them. They have programs designed for specific goals (you will find them in the app). My reco would be a mix of Body Pump 2x week, Body Combat 1-2x week and Cx 1-2x (the frequency needs to be built over time, dont start too, too often, too soon). Also – join the fb group, they are very supportive!
Ribena
I used to take Bodybalance in the gym as well as their barre classes – I really liked the Bodybalance format, and if I wasn’t paying for the Peloton and Melissa Wood Health apps I would be tempted to subscribe for that.
Anon
My old gym was a Les Mills gym. I loved loved loved body pump. I also liked the barre I did there. I also did Grit (I think?) on occasional and liked it but it kicked my a*s.
Anonymous
GRIT is my favorite Les Mills program. BodyPump is also fun. BodyPump and some of the GRIT strength and plyo workouts use a barbell and/or step, but in the beginning stages you can substitute dumbbells and work on the floor or with a chair in place of the step depending on the exercise (dips = chair; most other things = floor).
Horse Crazy
Thank you all! This is so helpful, and I’m so excited to try it!!
anon
Second the recommendation for weighted bars instead of barbell for Bodypump. I ordered a few (10, 15, 25 lbs) when I couldn’t find a barbell I liked, and I actually prefer them. I got mine on Amazon. I also like to have some light hand weights (3 & 5 lbs) for the arm and shoulder exercises.
Elbe
I got it for the Grit class. 30 min high intensity cardio with or without equipment. I also do the Sprint class. It is the only spinning glass I like. I will keep it when I go back to my gym because my schedules doesn’t always align with their class schedule.
Macros
If you’d like to lose weight, I highly recommend the RP Strength app. or something that calculates your macros for you. Food is the biggest factor and while moving and exercise are great for you for so many reasons, body comp. is mostly tied to food.
You’ve got this!
Anon
Am I completely missing the chevrons here?
Horse Crazy
LOL I thought the same thing! This is just stripes…right?
Anonymous
I was thinking it was in the texture of the wool, but I don’t see that in the close-up shot.
NYNY
It’s plaid or I’m crazy.
Tartan if you’re fancy.
Senior Attorney
Agree. It sure is nice in any event.
Anonymous
Yes, it’s plaid, but we’re not supposed to criticize the postings. Witness what happened the other week with the nightgown labeled as a dress.
Of Counsel
(1) The name in the post is what Ted Baker calls it. Which is almost always the case – they are literally duplicating the name from the manufacturer’s website.
(2) “Chevron” wool is the name of the looming pattern used to weave the material. It is a weaving technique. It does not always result in a visible chevron pattern if the weave and weft are the same or similar colors. The chevron weave is a type of twill weave pattern.
Anon
Chevron is not a weaving “technique” (nor is it a weaving pattern, which is the term I think you intended here) and wool is fiber from a sheep and also not a technique. The correct terms would be warp and weft, not weave and weft. Twill is, however, a type of weaving pattern and can be used to create a chevron design (properly called a “point twill”) in the fabric, although this particular coat fabric has been fulled (similarly to felting, but there is a nuanced difference between the two) and the actually weave pattern is thus not apparent even zooming in on the close up photos.
Looming is…not a weaving term, but amusing for those of us who actually weave whenever we hear it applied by people who pretend they know what they are talking about.
Anon
The company that makes it calls it chevron.
Rainbow Hair
ha was also confused! remember for a hot second how everrrrything (on the internet) was chevrons? that was something.
Anon
UGH as a textiles person (knitter, sewist) this stuff drives me nuts way more than it should. Yes, this is a plaid pattern, not a chevron. I also get super irritated when the terms “knit” and “crochet” are used interchangeably, as if anything with holes in it is crocheted, when in reality it is often knit.
We all need hobbies, I guess. Mine is getting annoyed at random internet postings.
Anon
It is a plaid pattern but a chevron weave.
Anon
This was actually my intent in asking the question! I wondered if there was some component to the technique or fabric that was called chevron.
Anon
This is hard to explain in words. It is a variety of twill fabric. For plain twill, you move the yarn under 1 warp yarn, then over 2 warp yarns. For chevron you make a certain number of rows of twill and then reverse to create the arrow pattern. It can be super obvious if the warp and weave are different colors or there are more rows or very subtle. But everyone is focused on the pattern of the fabric – which is obviously not a chevron pattern while I suspect Ted Baker is talking about the type of fabric.
Anon
Thanks. I was looking for that, but before posting I zoomed in on the detail photos and could not see the chevron in the weave at all.
ohsoanon
Following up on the man-child comments over the past couple of days. My soon(ish) to be ex firmly fell into that category. I recently moved out after >20 years of marriage. When I told him I wanted a divorce, he spent weeks telling me all the reasons I was wrong, never acknowledging that I am allowed to have my own feelings or his part in any of it. I am kind of terrified about what they next 6-18 months hold, but am already so much happier. I had been thinking about doing this for years and only got up the nerve when I had proof of how our marriage was modeling destructive patterns to our teenagers. Now, he needs to find a job and learn how to grocery shop and a million other things.
Anonymous
Talk to me about how you determined his bad modeling hurt your teenagers and how you decided it was time to move on anyway. How are your teenagers taking it? Did they see what was happening? I am in a similar situation, but not a man-child, more emotional abuse and extremely controlling. I know it’s bad, but am having a hard time determining what is best for the kids. Disrupt them now as they are about to finish high school and move on? Or wait until they are gone and settled in a new situation in a year or more? Doing tons of research right now and really would appreciate your thought process (and any others who would care to chime in).
Anon
I grew up in a home with an emotionally abusive and extremely controlling father (though no physical violence), and it was massively damaging. My mother felt she had no options because she’d never worked outside the home and we lived in a tiny town, so she dealt with it. I’m almost 40 and still dealing with the fallout. I’ve never felt I was good enough, have only recently been figuring out what my needs are, and have lived with the constant fear that if I’m not “good enough” the people I love will abandon me. It’s so lonely. I’ve been in therapy for years and only just now feel like I’m crawling out of the hole.
I don’t blame my mother, because I understand her lack of options and that she’d been emotionally beaten down by this other person for so long that she couldn’t see any way out. But it was miserable for everyone and has lifelong consequences for the entire family. I’m not saying this to make you feel bad, but you asked for opinions on how it could affect your children, and this is my experience.
Anon
Similar situation here. Grew up in an emotionally and physically abusive home. I don’t blame my mom because I know she truly felt like she had no options. But it really affected me and my brothers. Sadly, one of my brothers has done similar things and I once witnessed him strike his girlfriend during a fight – it was devastating for me to see my baby brother become that. My parents are still not divorced even though we are all long gone from the house. I’m sure leaving will affect your kids, but *this* is also affecting your kids. I always wished my parents would get a divorce. In my opinion, the effects of a divorce are less bad than this.
Anonymous
You already know the answer.
Senior Attorney
Is this what you want your children to learn about relationships and carry with them into post-high-school? Do you want them to grow up thinking men are abusive and controlling and women are supposed to take it? Also, if there is a lot of conflict in the house, ALL the research shows that it’s best to remove them from that high-conflict atmosphere.
Anon
Divorce attorney here. Now. Teenagers are old enough to understand what is going on and will be modeling their relationships after yours. Most teenagers are relieved when their parents finally divorce. They are also old enough to speak up if they are being abused or neglected on the other parent’s time. My advice is difference if it is a small child and you don’t have enough evidence for sole custody and suspect there will be abuse on other parent’s time. That’s not your situation here.
Anon
OTOH, when my sister and her ex got divorced, one kid went to live with dad b/c he is 100% free-range (like dad works at a job where he is fawned over and does that 80 hours/week and then helps out never; stepmom has her own kids to deal with or ignore, so he is a happy kid with a car, a license, and a phone). And by happy, I mean “yearning for college where he can GTFO of their messed up lives.” But also: he lives in a world where he does what he wants and no one has ever told him no without him just bolting. I’m glad he’s not a teen dad or has a drinking problem, but it’s still not likely to end well.
ohsoanon
My older teenager was upset that his girlfriend pushed him into doing something that he didn’t want to do and said”why do we always have to do what she wants? What I want doesn’t matter.” Boom, shot to the heart — because that is what you see at home. I struggled with just waiting until they were out of the house and decided that (1) there will never be a good time and (2) at least now they can support each other. I also realized that nothing was going to change. My husband was not a partner, had no interest in being one, and really only cares about what happens to him. My older one has been taking it hard, despite the fact that he acknowledges that our relationship was not good and that I raised him pretty much alone (his words). I think the support network that they have now is super important and will either not exist or be different once they leave for college. By ending things now, I am showing them that you should not stay in relationships that are not healthy. I hope that at some point they will recognize that. My younger one is more pragmatic and (so far) is adjusting better. If you want to post a burner email, I am happy to connect 1:1. This is hard, but I know it will be better on the other side.
CMS
My parents divorced right after I went to college even though I knew they had been unhappy together for years. I wished they just would have done it earlier. The tension in the house made high school way more stressful than it needed to be.
Anon
CW: death.
My MIL should have left my FIL. He was at the very least incredibly selfish; I believe some of his behaviors constituted emotional abuse. Their (adult) children struggle in various ways due to the impact of their relationship. Money and the “timing” held her back and she never left. She was starting to sock away money when she passed away from fast-moving cancer.
You deserve to be happy.
Anon
I’ll share this quote from Untamed: “My children do not need me to save them. My children need to watch me save myself.”
anonymous
My parents divorced when I was 14-15. I knew things were bad for a while, and really really bad at least from when I was 11 onwards. There was emotional and verbal abuse, alcoholism, and physical abuse (albeit very infrequent). Kids know. Especially if you are in a controlling/emotional abuse type situation…. trust me, they can sense that something is not right. By the time they split my sister and I were pretty self-sufficient. We were focused on school, extra curriculars, friends, boyfriends. Our family was always kind of distant and we didn’t spend much time together so I don’t even remember our routines changing very much after my mom moved out. Except all the sudden no one was doing laundry of cleaning the house or making school lunches. (We definitely helped by that point but our family was very focused on academics and my mom was still clearly doing the bulk of housework.)
I learned some terrible ideas about relationships from them, and did not have a model for good ones. I am still in therapy and none of it is related to the fact of their separation. It is related to how they treated each other, what I observed, and filling in the gaps of what a healthy relationship looks like. The physical separation was a huge relief. It puts a strain on a kid to constantly be in a tense environment where people aren’t happy or at least respectful. Even if they are not the target of the anger or abuse, it’s still pervasive and they still sense it. It’s a huge stressor on your nervous system that can take years to unlearn. I developed a state of constant vigilance, scanning my environment for potential issues, planning ahead to try to prevent or mitigate emotional outbursts or conflict, blaming myself for conflict that wasn’t my fault, extreme people pleasing, issues with self-worth, shame, and never feeling “good enough,” fear of vulnerability, fear of stating my needs, modifying my behavior not around my needs or wants but to maintain a stable home to the extent possible. It’s awful. Deep depression ensued. I was hospitalized for thoughts of suicide. With my first serious college boyfriend, I could be extremely angry, demanding, and mean, even though I loved him. I pushed him away, and had no qualms about screaming at him because that seemed normal. (I feel so, so, so terrible about this now. He is happily married to someone else.) With boyfriends after him, I quit the anger but lived in constant fear of abandonment and reverted to avoiding vulnerability, which doesn’t work either. I should say, not all of this is a direct product of their poor relationship, but it came from their issues with each other, the way they interacted with us, the constant stress and tension and misery in the house.
Anon
“It is related to how they treated each other, what I observed, and filling in the gaps of what a healthy relationship looks like.”
Amen to this. I’ve also had a lot of therapy to learn how to be in a healthy relationship and my parents are still married.
Ellen
Hugs. You hopefully are working your way to get better now, but you were unfortunateley in a bad situation you were powerless to deal with growing up. Having a strong family relationship growing up is so important to establishing ones yourself later on. It does sound like you are aware of the issues due to therapy and are probably in a better position then most women with similar afflictions since you were still abel to attract men interested in becoming your boyfreinds over time. Do not fret to much about your abusive treatment of those boyfreinds as they always had the option of moving on, which some probabley did b/c of your issues, notwithstanding the issues you faced and had to deal with. I wish you the best of luck in trying to establish a more normal social existence with men. I think that even with a good homelife, this is no guarantee as I had it but am still single also. I think it all involves some good luck and skill to land and keep a decent guy. You sound like you still have time to do so, so focus on doing that w/o becoming to needy, as men like a woman who knows which end is up and at our age, they do not want to have to baby sit us mentally. If you keep this in mind, you will also be able to establish yourself in the world and come out of the pandemic as a vibrant woman that men will be attracted to. Keep us informed of your progress!!!! YAY!
anonshmanon
So glad that you managed to take this step!!! Good for you!
Emma
Congrats! When I left my own man-child I had some anxiety about how he would care for himself since I basically handled everything at that point. I did have to handle everything relating to the divorce (he didn’t fight me, he just never bothered to call the bank to close our joint accounts, update benefits coverage, file the tax forms to clarify our status, etc etc). I have no idea how he handles groceries, laundry and cleaning but it is no longer my concern and my life is so much better for it. Wishing you the best, OP.
Anon
Maybe there should be a Drop the Ball 2.0 for dealing with this.
[Oh, that book makes me hungry for Jollof Rice.]
Anon
Good for you! I’m glad you’re taking steps to model healthy behaviors for your kids.
I dated a man-child for about 5 months and had to end it. For one, he was being far less cautious than I about covid (“I’m not gonna live in fear, which is why I need to go out and get wasted with my friends”) while I’m not even indoor dining. He is 40, lives with 3 roommates, and complains he is broke all the time. He took a whopping month off at the holidays (unpaid leave) and flew to see his family. He came back and then traveled again for pleasure with friends (another plane ride). Ummm, what? Seems he was acting like a frat bro half his age. Really nice, fun, friendly, but no. Just no.
Anon
I know #notallmen, but honestly if a dude is 40 and single and living like that it’s a huge red flag. Which I wish my younger self had known.
Anon
I told my story of dating this morning and will just repeat my warning – do not date a man whose living space resembles a frat house.
Your 40 year old seems to live in an actual frat house! Run screaming, don’t look back.
Coach Laura
This is a Seattle-specific article, but it talks about what covid has done to fashion and workwear. https://www.seattletimes.com/life/fashion/farewell-to-bras-hard-pants-and-business-casual-how-covid-19-has-changed-what-we-wear-and-how-we-feel-about-clothing/
Anonymous
I was thinking we might go more formal pretty quickly after Covid. Everyone is cleaning out their closets.
When I did, I mostly kept the good stuff, not the schlubby stuff. And I feel like fashion is a pendulum. Am I the only one?
Anon
I want to think you’re right as that looks so much better. But maybe for 5 minutes to get a picture for insta?
Anon
I think there are going to be people who are excited to dress up again. I’m certainly one of them!
Anon
I think COVID has revealed how little clothing affects your ability to do good work (thinking about very formal law offices and the like). I am happy to never dress up again.
Anon
I never want to wear a real bra or pants that button ever again. I’m loving my fancy tee, long blazer, slim joggers, slippers look.
anon
Not only is formal clothing not helpful, I do much better work when I’m not squirming because I’m cold and uncomfortable in a pencil skirt that’s digging into my belly when I sit and constricting my ability to move my legs, I’m not feeling myself sweating in silk (even though I’m cold!) and mentally translating that into a dry cleaning bill, and my feet aren’t cramping up from heels. Sure business formal is tolerable if you’re a dude and you’re wearing some loose fitting wool pants, long sleeves, and a pair of loafers…
anon
Every word of this.
Anonymous
huh, this is so funny to me. I do my best work when my clothes remind me that I’m “at work”. I’m WFH and have been since last march, but I’m wearing a dress, tights, and booties today. But I’ve been this way (and feeling out of step) since high school at least. No idea why.
Anon
How does one style non-skinny jeans? The spring fashion thread this morning made me realize that I know bootcut/flare jeans are in, but that I have no idea how to wear them.
Anonymous
I think the key is something more fitted on top and at the right waist high. Too big or too long and it can look dumpy. I prefer bootcut styles with a dressier shoe– heel more than flats and never with sneakers, but that may just be me. Anything you would wear with a trouser feels best. I also don’t like the bootcut or wide cut in a cropped style, even though I know that’s what’s “in” with a lot of looks right now.
PolyD
At what LENGTH do we wear the non skinny pants?? I keep seeing article about what shoes to wear with these pants, but no hint for length. I’m okay with pants that are clearly cropped length (at or just above the ankle) but I recently ordered some pants from Loft that were straight cut but too long to be cropped and too short to look like anything except pants that are accidentally too short, or bad 1980s pants that we used to wear with really ugly loafers. I’m 5’3”, so not particularly short or tall, and these pants baffled me. Maybe whoever purchased them for Loft got their measurements wrong.
In my thinking, straight pants should at least hit the top of the shoe (like where laces would be). Flared pants should be a little longer and worn with a bit of a heel. At least, that’s how I think they should be?
Anon
*looks down*
Birks and socks.
Anon
*looks down*
Birkenstock fleece lined slippers
Hive Five!
Anon for this
Need to max out my Roth for 2020 (before taxes) and am privileged enough (via earning it and saving) to have it available now to max it for 2021. Should I put it all in now or is there a different way that is more beneficial?
Anonymous
Just fund it now. Trying to time the market for long-term retirement savings is a fool’s game. As long as it doesn’t hit your emergency fund or anything like that, you’re good to go.
Senior Attorney
Or you could dollar-cost-average and put in 1/12 every month.
Anon
I’d put in 1/12 every month in case for some reason you end up needing the cash for something else.
Anonymous
Dollar cost average hasn’t been shown to do anything in the long-term.
Senior Attorney
Really? Wow, I am behind the times.
MagicUnicorn
I am in a similar situation and didn’t want to drop all of it in at once, so I’m just splitting up the amount I can still contribute over the remaining weeks before the deadline and am transferring that amount over each week. Dollar cost averaging, if you will.
Anon
This isn’t a question, but I’ve been in a mindset lately where I really hate men. I mean, I really hate them all. Nothing seems to be redeeming whatsoever. I guess I’ve reached bitter status.
Anon for this
Men suck and their violence makes the world worse. I truly believe male violence is the most underacknowledged issue we face in the world today. Between sexual assault and domestic violence and terrorism to child abuse, men as a class are terrible to women and we mask it with terms like “intimate partner violence.”
Anon
“I truly believe male violence is the most underacknowledged issue we face in the world today.”
This resonated with me.
Anon for this
Oh, and “sex work is work” is a lie. Prostitution is a massive industrialized crime against women for the benefit of men (although children and men are also affected at times). I make no apologies for this position.
Anon
I don’t disagree, but I feel that the circles I move it would burn me as a heretic of sorts of voicing that. They are very much “it is work.”
When you do some things for $ and not gratis, there is likely a backstory of abuse and/or drug addiction driving why you don’t have any other jobs but that. Maybe these people need help with what drove them to this and not normalizing this (and to me, if it “work,” then give them W-2s, fund their social security, and have some decent employee benefits and get serious about OSHA and workers’ comp).
Anon for this
You can’t make prostitution OSHA-compliant and that’s a huge problem. You can’t protect women from bodily fluids, hazards, and unsafe working conditions – it’s inherent to the system. There are also no other jobs women can perform while unconscious. Nordic Model now.
Anon
I have serious mixed feelings about sex work as work, because I see the points to both arguments. But to your last point, I think that people who want sex work legalized *do* want all of those things for sex workers.
Anonymous
Anyone who calls it “work” is ignoring the power dynamics. It’s exploitation pure and simple. The problem is that we need to punish the “customers” and “bosses” and provide other options for the “workers,” but instead we focus on criminalizing the “workers.”
Anonymous
Yes, Nordic Model now! It’s the only feminist way.
Monday
What gives me pause is the women who work in the industry themselves demanding to have it seen as work. I don’t like being in the position to say “no, you’re mistaken about your own life.” So many legal jobs are dangerous, exploitative, and demeaning anyway- it’s not like the word “work” actually provides any safety or respect in itself.
Anonymous
Monday, what bothers me is the perspective of the small minority of women who claim to really love their “jobs” is being prioritized over all the women who are in utter misery, particularly women in the global South and women with other risk factors for abuse and exploitation. Why is it that we default to the perspectives of the few involved in this “industry” that are able to insulate themselves from the worst degradations, but we’re quick to write off the horrifying stories, the racism, the exploitation, the fact that most women experience disassociation and substance use after just a short time “working?” I am a strong proponent of the Nordic Model too.
Anon
Agree with Monday. I 100% know that there are women being abused, trafficked, and forced into prostitution and we need to help those people get out of that situation (without punishing them). But it also seems that there are some women who want to do that kind of work, and if they do, then I am fine with it, provided there are protections.
Anon for this
Yep, there are a handful of women who claim to like it. They won’t be prosecuted under the Nordic Model. Overall, I choose to prioritize the voices of the majority instead because I believe they are telling us what we don’t want to hear and act on – the ones who are permitted a voice at all, that is. I am simply not comfortable with being selective about which voices I listen to on this issue because that means that I will be ignoring the worst violations and violence. I would also be ignoring mountains of evidence about the physical and mental harms of participating in this “work,“ which exist even among women who have been gaslit.
anon
I agree with you. Or maybe it is work, but it’s certainly hazardous work with zero protections in place for the worker.
Anonymous
Agreed.
Monday
I’m not going to call this irrational or unfair. I’m sure you will be encouraged to look for positive examples, find nuance etc., but that can just feel like one more burden.
When I lived in Brooklyn, a young black man passing me on the street once said “I hate white people” in my direction (I’m white). I didn’t blame him either.
Anon
Right there with you.
Anonymous
I hear you and don’t fault you. Women’s anger has been policed for too long and the pressure we’re under to act like men are great is one massive centuries-long gaslighting event.
anon
Very anon for this, but I’m so with you, and this is a struggle for me because I’m pregnant and expecting a boy. Of course I will do my best to raise him to be a kind and respectful feminist, but after decades of working in a really toxic macho male-dominated bro environment, I find myself wondering “am I putting another one of these into the world?”. I’m ashamed of these thoughts but they’re real.
LaurenB
I have a young adult son and he is the kindest, sweetest, gentlest person you can imagine. He’s one of those that everyone is better off for having known him, and he’s going to make a difference in the world — I don’t mean splashy or high-profile, but in a quiet way (like, the high school teacher that inspires children, that kind of thing). He treats women respectfully and works to make a difference politically as well. It IS possible!
Senior Attorney
I raised one of those, too. It’s possible (although honestly I think people are born with certain characteristics and in a lot of ways I just got lucky.)
That said, I am loathe to respond to the undeniable statement that (white, in particular) men are a source of a lot of problems with “not all men!”
NW Islander
I just want to say that my manipulative, gaslighting, passive aggressive dad was a much-adored and decorated elementary school teacher. He is amazing with kids because kids are so malleable.
But once they start to turn into adults, they are threatening to him and objects to be controlled.
Anon
I get that. But, if I truly need help (like a 911 call), it is likely to be all or mostly men who come to help me even if it at great peril or risk to themselves.
Or not even going that far, my friend lives in a small town besieged by an ice storm. There are workers from near and far-away states climbing wet / icy power poles to get their electricity going again. They are sometimes sleeping in their trucks and going to volunteer-run places for food. They are . . . men.
Anon
Do you recognize that many of the men you have described in the situations above, a lot of them are in those jobs to help them feel powerful; especially over women. The savior complex is real and it’s important to see that is part of the problem.
Anon
IDK — I see them as helping professions. Largely female helping professions (nursing, teaching, child care) and then male ones. They are done by both genders — so maybe these are just the (as Mr. ROdgers said) helpers. Look for the helpers.
Anonymous
That’s their job. They get paid to do those things. Women are more likely to be in the crucial caregiving roles and they’re NOT paid well for it.
Anon
Because culturally, women aren’t steered towards these careers. Women absolutely can do them.
Lots to Learn
Actually, that’s not true. I don’t work in a utility but I do some work for utilities and there are some jobs, like line crew work that women are not as well suited for. They told me about how they’re always trying to get women in but the vast majority of women simply do not have the upper-body strength to do line crew work. I’m all for the idea can do almost anything men can do but it’s not everything and it’s not just because women aren’t steered toward them.
Anon
LOL yeah, there are definitely no women who can do that job.
Anon
I mean if men didn’t do these jobs then women would do them. It’s not like entire industries would die out and we’d all have to live without electricity for the rest of our lives. And interestingly enough, I have worked at power plants before and it is really difficult to find appropriate bras that are flame retardant. Some of my female coworkers accepted the risk that their bras could melt onto their chests.
Shelle
I read a fascinating article on the barriers to women being able to be employed in these kinds of jobs safely and effectively because the equipment are all designed to be physically a good fit for the average male. The circumference of a hammer handle, the weight of a power tool, the shape of body armor, the dimensions of the interior of a construction vehicle, etc. It all effectively excludes many women from these kinds of non-desk jobs.
Shelle
In case anyone wants to read more: http://www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/2019/feb/23/truth-world-built-for-men-car-crashes
Really eye opening about how so many things have been designed for the average male. The part about chemical exposure limits and women’s fat percentage was disturbing.
Anon
I’m married to a man and have a son, so I don’t hate all men, but I get very discouraged about what men get away with routinely. I’m trying to raise my so to be a good man. (but let me tell you, the mansplaining is innate – I battle it with my son all the time)
Anon
Honestly, I am one of the people who just started camping this year and the mainsplaining about anything camping-related is off the chart. I have figured out much more complex things and am OK with making a poor decision and learning on the fly (I haven’t died yet). I’d ask questions here, but camping questions seem to be especially irritating. So: YouTube videos (REI has some good ones). But I’m not asking a guy.
Anon
Same. Well, I don’t have a son, but I live with a man and we’re planning a wedding, and I’m like, this man in particular is fine, but I still think most men suck. He knows I feel this way, and he understands. When we first met he said “garbage men and pickup artists should change job titles” and I know he didn’t come up with that, but oh man, it was one of the reasons I really wanted to see him again.
And I have male friends, and most of them are fine, but waaaay too many men I’ve known turned out to be condescending mansplainers, antagonistic dudes who try to turn everything into a “spirited debate” (can’t believe how much energy I wasted on them), tone police, boundary-pushing dudes who insist on solving problems I never asked for help with, creepy orbiters, or just downright angry, toxic jerks.
Anon for This
While I understand your feelings and you are certainly entitled to them, they are not helpful or healthy. So if this lasts more than a few days, I suggest you either explore them in therapy or at least reflect hard on the validity of hating half the human population – including (if you have them) your father, brothers, husband/boyfriend, sons or future sons and millions of good, kind, decent men who do not make the news because they do not behave badly.
This might just be my life experience talking but my really negative experiences have been much more driven by women than me so I tend to bristle at the narrative that men are evil and women are wonderful. People in positions of power (men and women) often misuse that power. Men are more likely to be in positions of power but I do not believe they are somehow inherently inferior to women. Just as I do not believe that white people are inherently inferior to black people (or obviously vice-versa). There are good people and bad people of all gender identities, race, religion and ethnicity.
anon
Nah she doesn’t need therapy. What she said is accurate, no matter how convenient it might be to ignore it.
Anon
+100
Anon
I’m not a man-hater. OTOH, I have told my children (girls) that if they get lost or are alone and need help, they should find a woman.
Monday
I’d go further and say to both find a woman and avoid men. Nobody wants random men having access to girls who are alone and vulnerable, with good reason.
Anon
Hard same.
Rainbow Hair
Come sit next to me :-)
I discovered today that coincidences have conspired so that my Kiddo is now in a cohort in school that’s all girls. I texted my friends “you can never #banallmen too early!”
Anon
My period started unexpectedly early today, with cramps that sent me running to the bathroom and a headache that required ibuprofen and I was very angry today that men do not have to deal with this disrupting their work day. My husband is at least very sympathetic because he has his own very painful digestive disease but women with that disease have to deal with both, their disease and cramps and the two make the other worse for them. Rawr.
Anonymous
Preach. Men have NO idea how much of a burden (physical, emotional, financial) periods are – and that’s in the U.S. where my culture/religion (or lack thereof) doesn’t specifically shame me for being female and having a female body. I can’t even imagine what it would be like to be banished to a menstrual hut in Nepal.
Anon
I find it bizarre and completely out of place that there are men lurking on this board. Just look at the tagline, “For overachieving chicks.” It’s creepy.
Anon
Where do you see men lurking? I’m the period commenter and I’m a woman.
Anon
The comment you’re responding to does not appear to be a man?
Trixie
It really needs to be changed to “high achieving women.” I said this a few years ago. Why are we overachieving? nonsense. We are being our smart, capable, energetic, amazing selves. and the chicks has to go.
Senior Attorney
Right? I am still SO MAD that I was completely incapacitated by my period as a young girl and it was considered MY problem to deal with rather than a medical problem to be treated and dealt with. My husband was speechless when I told him about it.
anon
On top of the physical discomfort to outright debilitation, there’s the financial cost of having a period that men simply do not not have to deal with. Period Poverty is a thing:
https://www.nursing.upenn.edu/live/news/1545-the-state-of-period-poverty-in-the-us#:~:text=Period%20poverty%2C%20or%20the%20umbrella,imprisoned%20struggle%20with%20period%20poverty.
Anonymous
Right this second, I hate all people. They are irredeemable. But I think it’s just the pandemic.
Lots to Learn
While you’re entitled to feel however you feel, I couldn’t disagree more. I know and work with plenty of men who I completely respect and who are great human beings. I’m not saying that men don’t have privileges or that the system isn’t tilted against women or that some men are pigs, but I think that’s a totally different issue to hate than hating all men. I’m actually pretty shocked that this comment got so much support. I’m pretty liberal and a feminist but this kind of comment really sounds, frankly, absurd. Do you really think or feel like there is nothing redeeming about half of the population?
Anon
Of course there’s somebody here to defend the poor men, but trust me, they don’t need it. Let the woman vent.
onpoint
Of course there’s somebody here to thought police. Trust me, we don’t need it. Let the woman vent.
anon
Yes, clearly a lot of us do. No, it’s not absurd.
BRIDGERTON
Even though it’s not our typical style show, my husband and I loved Bridgerton. It was fun and suspenseful and steamy. We’ve been searching for our next show ever since we finished the season. Multiple websites suggested Outlander, and while I agree there are lots of steamy parts, it is so SO brutally violent. It’s definitely not a feel good show. Does anybody have any alternative suggestions? It doesn’t have to be historical.
Fallen
Losing Alice
Anonymous
Isn’t that a thriller?
emeralds
I haven’t watched it, but Virgin River is another adaptation of a romance series.
Ribena
It’s very un-steamy compared to Bridgerton.
I would recommend Desperate Romantics – kinda hard to find (maybe on Britbox or Acorn??) but very much in the same vein as Bridgerton, except set among the Pre-Raphaelite Brotherhood, so half a century later.
Lilau
Following! I did the same thing. Loved Bridgerton so much and I turned off outlander in the first thirty seconds because it was immediately incredibly gorey and awful.
If I see an awful injury or death on tv it just haunts me. I guess I’m unique in this, but how is that not very upsetting for other people?
Anon
I got really bored with Outlander because the story line was so hokey and drawn out (and how the main female character kept chasing after her man and they both narrowly escaped death all the freaking time) but it is just as “steamy” as Bridgerton. Any time my husband came it he called it my “Scottish p-rn”
Ness
Starting to see Normal people.
Senior Attorney
Not super steamy but we loved The Flight Attendant.
Horse Crazy
So good!!!
anon
OK so it’s a bit left of field but Love & Anarchy is a (1 season so far) netflix show about a strange/awesome romance between a consultant and an IT guy. Swedish.
Anonymous
I’ve heard a lot of really good things from fellow romance novel lovers about the K-drama “Crash Landing On You.” Haven’t seen it though.
also on Netflix — not sure I’d recommend it but uh maybe? — 365 Days. lots and lots and LOTS of sex. mafia trope.
Fallen
Losing Alice
AnonyMich
Has anyone done The Metabolism Makeover program from Megan Kober at Nutrition Addiction? Looking for feedback on the program and (hopefully) eventual success. I like the PHFF eating model (protein, healthy fat, fiber), but wonder if paying the $297 for the seminar is worth it.
anon
After being slammed with work through most of 2020, the beginning of 2021 has been a huge lull. I know I should be grateful for having less to do, but also? It freaks me out a bit. I’m not in danger of losing my job or anything, but I feel super guilty for not being productive or feeling very useful. Now would be a good time to start dreaming up new projects or a new body of work, but what if that new stuff is unsustainable when work picks up again? Also, my creative well is kinda dry and part of me wants to coast a bit. Then I feel guilty for not being a go-getter.
How do you deal with a job that’s very feast or famine? It’s always been this way to some extent, but I seem to be feeling it more during pandemic/WFH times.
Anon
Oh gosh, I am with you. I have been sitting around for the better part of two weeks, when in January I was completely swamped. I have no real advice, other than I try to force myself to coast and enjoy it, because I know I’ll end up slammed again! But the anxiety over billable hours makes it hard to not be as productive as possible!
No Face
I am in litigation and the inherent ebb and flow is what I love. When the work is low, I enjoy it! Sleep extra. Watch TV in the morning and start working at 10am. Work out in the middle of the day. Take my kids to the park in the afternoon. Read a book in my backyard while monitoring emails.
Anon
Is $190/hour an acceptable rate to pay for a CPA to do my taxes? My CPA retired so I am looking for a new one. I’m single, no dependents, and worked at the same job in same state for all of 2020. Based on this, the new CPA quoted me about $300 (and said their hourly rate was $190). This is twice what my old CPA used to charge me, but perhaps he just charged low? I’m in Virginia.
Duchess
I’m also in Virginia and just paid $325, but we have a much more complicated situation. Our CPA charges per document (roughly…). So we had three W-2s and an unemployment form, plus mortgage interest, a ton of healthcare expenses, some weird bonus-type money that my husband got at his old job (incentives really — he’s in sales), student loan interest… So not totally out of line, but I would expect yours to be more than $25 less than ours.
Anon
I’m a CPA in Canada, so rates my vary a lot, but this seems like a normal price for a CPA to do a simple tax return.
Anon
Is there a reason you need a CPA? It sounds simple enough to bang out in 15 minutes on a free file website.
Anon
Can I ask why you don’t just use TurboTax? Your tax return sounds really uncomplicated.
Sunshine
We are in Texas so no state income taxes, but we have several side investments so more documents for our federal return. We usually pay about $400.
Anon for this
I am in a weird place that combines multiple previously discussed things. I am feeling very anti-men lately (specifically cishet white men) for their violence and all of their “all lives matter” “notallmen” stuff. I have also had my last long relationship with a manchild where he was 20 yrs my senior but I was parenting him and gaslit to think it was how we were being equalized since I was being treated like an adult though my age was younger (I was over 30). However, I also would like to find a partner and be married and I happen to be hetero. For a long time, this seemed fine since covid meant no dating anyway, but I am getting closer to vaccinated as are others and I just don’t know how to reconcile the goal of partnership with not wanting another manchild and not wanting to wade through terrible men. On top of that, I am well-educated and almost 40 so statistics are against me. (Luckily for me, I’m childfree, so there’s no clock ticking). Why is there no dating app for activists who have to prove they do the work or excellent pre-vetted non gaslighters who are grown ups?
Am I alone in this?
Anon
Related, there should be a filter on dating apps for men who have been to therapy.
Anon
Yes!
Slightly related: this is why we need more women in tech. Who do you think designs and develops these apps? It’s still mostly men. A LOT of industries within “tech” need more women and POC bringing their ideas to the table, but especially when it comes to dating apps, we really need an app that is predominantly designed and developed by women.
Anon
No guarantees, but do you have interests where you could join clubs and meet like-minded people? One of my friends met her very non-manchild husband in a running club. As soon as they met her and found out she was single, they all started trying to hook her up with this one guy in the club who they all thought was great. And he is… I have to say, he’s not conventionally attractive (feel mean saying this) and probably wouldn’t have done well on a swiping app, but he really is an equal partner and is great to my friend. He wasn’t on any apps at all so she wouldn’t have met him except for the club. They were both just over 40 and child free.
Anonymous
The good men in their 40s and 50s I know are not and never have been on any dating app (or in one case, wasn’t before the pandemic). It is not that fact that makes them “good men,” but it is a commonality. Maybe it is just who I am drawn to, but I also think it is generational. We learned to free-range date in the 80s/90s/aughts, and the sociable ones, for whom that worked, are sometimes resistant to move into online dating. So I would encourage you, when it is safer, to get out into the world. The running club example is a good one, but there are other versions of this.
anon
I could’ve written this comment myself. No advice, just commiseration. <3
Anon for This
I promise I am not being snarky, but if you are anti-men, why do you want to be married? Wouldn’t it be better to be single?