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I’ve talked about my love for The Shirt by Rochelle Behrens before. These button-down shirts have been workhorses in my wardrobe for years — they are just the right length for me to be able to tuck into pants or skirts, and manage to button perfectly without peek-a-boo gapping.
I was perusing their new arrivals and this ruffled version caught my eye immediately. The combination of delicate ruffles with the Swiss dot fabric is really lovely. While it’s slightly sheer, it does come with a matching cami for more coverage.
I would wear this tucked into a pencil skirt for an office day and with a pair of high-waisted jeans for the weekend.
The shirt is $99 and comes in sizes XS–XXL. Do note that it’s slim-fitting, so if you’re in between sizes, you may want to size up.
An option in sizes 14–28 is this top from Eloquii; it's on sale for $39.99 (from $79.95), and with code GOFORIT, you can get it for only $19.99.
Sales of note for 9.10.24
- Nordstrom – Summer Sale, save up to 60%
- Ann Taylor – 30% off your purchase
- Banana Republic Factory – Up to 50% off everything + extra 20% off
- Bergdorf Goodman – Save up to 40% on new markdowns
- Boden – 15% off new styles
- Eloquii – $29 and up select styles; up to 50% off everything else
- J.Crew – Up to 50% off wear-to-work styles; extra 30% off sale styles
- J.Crew Factory – 40-60% off everything; extra 60% off clearance
- Lo & Sons – Warehouse sale, up to 70% off
- M.M.LaFleur – Save 25% sitewide
- Spanx – Lots of workwear on sale, some up to 70% off
- Talbots – BOGO 50% everything, includes markdowns
- White House Black Market – 30% off new arrivals
Sales of note for 9.10.24
- Nordstrom – Summer Sale, save up to 60%
- Ann Taylor – 30% off your purchase
- Banana Republic Factory – Up to 50% off everything + extra 20% off
- Bergdorf Goodman – Save up to 40% on new markdowns
- Boden – 15% off new styles
- Eloquii – $29 and up select styles; up to 50% off everything else
- J.Crew – Up to 50% off wear-to-work styles; extra 30% off sale styles
- J.Crew Factory – 40-60% off everything; extra 60% off clearance
- Lo & Sons – Warehouse sale, up to 70% off
- M.M.LaFleur – Save 25% sitewide
- Spanx – Lots of workwear on sale, some up to 70% off
- Talbots – BOGO 50% everything, includes markdowns
- White House Black Market – 30% off new arrivals
Some of our latest posts here at Corporette…
And some of our latest threadjacks here at Corporette (reader questions and commentary) — see more here!
Some of our latest threadjacks include:
- What to say to friends and family who threaten to not vote?
- What boots do you expect to wear this fall and winter?
- What beauty treatments do you do on a regular basis to look polished?
- Can I skip the annual family event my workplace holds, even if I'm a manager?
- What small steps can I take today to get myself a little more “together” and not feel so frazzled all of the time?
- The oldest daughter is America's social safety net — change my mind…
- What have you lost your taste for as you've aged?
- Tell me about your favorite adventure travels…
Ribena
I’ve woken up today feeling a bit under the weather (was woken at 3.30am by shouting in the street….) and have spent the rest of the morning (it’s lunchtime here) worrying about whether I feel unwell because I slept badly or because I’m stressed or because I’m actually unwell, or if those things happened in a different order, or, or, or…?
At what point does nearly a year of worrying about the pandemic/ the whole situation start to take a toll on the body?
Not sure if I’m asking for advice or sympathy or just asking if anyone else ends up in that same worry-loop…
Ellen
Hugs! This is natural. It has been almost a year since the pandemic hit in NYC, so it is understandable. Go to your kitchen, boil a pot of water, and make yourself a big cup of Chai Latte for yourself. This also helps with digestion, b/c I know you probably could be constipated with all of the sitting around. Grandma Trudy does this and after 3 cups of tea, other than for peeing, she is virutually cleaned out for the entire day!
Cb
I feel like it is just getting harder. The dreich days, the lack of social contact, the feeling that a reprieve is a long way off. I had a call with my team yesterday and everyone just looks knackered, no one is sleeping well.
anon
Yep. Nobody I’ve talked to is doing that well right now. :(
Anonymous
dreich is such a useful Scottish-ism, I feel like I may have to adopt that one.
Hildy J.
Agreed. Hugs and solidarity… but no good ideas other than what gets discussed here often.
Rach
My go-to on those sort of funky mornings is a short stretching session and a glass of ice cold water. Might not work for you, but might be worth a try!
Ribena
I did a low impact peloton ride which helped a bit! Have been mainlining hot drinks ever since, too
Curious
These both sound lovely.
anonshmanon
Oh, I absolutely get stuck in these worry roundabouts! PMS is another factor for me, both making me feel sickly and strengthening my worrying powers. By now, I feel it’s easier to ignore by realizing the spiral, remembering that it was nothing last time, so it’s probably nothing this time.
Anon
Ugh — the people who are the 3:30 am shouters in the street, if they aren’t living their best lives right now, are living their same-as-2019 lives right now. This is giving me some weird FOMO, like that is not my crowd but why am I grounded for a year while no one else seems to be???
anon
This week is hard, because we spent so much time mentally on “let’s put 2020 behind us” and then for many looking forward to inauguration day. Now, its 2021, he is no longer president and we are still wearing masks and at home.
Flats Only
This, plus travel restrictions just got tighter. I was looking forward to planning an overseas trip which looked completely possible for late Spring. Then on Jan 4th the destination added in a 14 day quarantine requirement, and now the US requires a test to return! I know these steps are for the good, but I just didn’t anticipate the travel picture getting worse in the new year instead of better. I got so close to beginning to do something I would enjoy (the planning) and it was snatched away. Boooo hooooo.
Anon
I normally only need allergy meds 8ish months of the year but I’ve taken them year round since last January. If I’m feeling meh, I want no doubt in my mind if it’s from allergies it if I’m sick.
I’m generally dealing with the pandemic pretty well, but I’m also not sleeping very well. And, for every month of good days I have, I have one day of non stop sobbing because the pandemic and everything else really just hit me hard that day.
Anonymous
Yes, 2021 has been worse for me than 2020. Work is very busy but my body clock is really off. I can’t seem.to make it to the gym. I want to get back in the office to get back on track, but i’ve had 3 co-workers test positive this year so had multiple weeks of anxious worry that I might, too, and more reason to stay at home. One piece of good news is that my vulnerable co-worker (cancer) was able to skip the line and get vaccinated early, so we all have a bit less fear that one of us will end up killing her. (Another friend with auto-immune disorder was also able to skip the line, making me very confused about distribution but grateful these two got shots.)
anonymous
Agree with this. Overall I was doing really well with the pandemic in 2020 compared with many. But now I don’t know what’s changed … I just feel so f’ing over it. I feel disengaged with work even though I’ve got a lot of work on my plate and it’s actually stuff I like to do. In normal times I’d be really into these projects and striving to do a good job and billing a ton. Now I just feel like molasses trying to get myself to work and while I’m not doing the bare minimum, I’m not really shining. My body clock just seems wrong too, I can’t get my schedule right, have totally slacked on yoga. I’ve felt all sorts of weird physical symptoms (for lack of a better word) – stomach cramps, aches, stiffness, tired, lightheaded, always hungry, just feeling blah. I want to be back in the office more so but we’ve also had multiple people test positive for Covid. All of the work that one has to do to drag oneself into the office just seems so overwhelming now and makes me wonder if it’s actually a more effective use of time.
Senior Attorney
Fortunately I am not worried about having COVID at this exact second, but I’m not sleeping well at all because I’m on prednisone for something else. Sending sympathy from “that one time when I got shingles in the middle of a pandemic.” And they say stress can bring it on, so…
Daffodil
Commiseration. The last two weeks have been tough for me for no particular reason. I’m exhausted, can’t get up the motivation to be productive, and just want to sleep all day. I think it’s the weight of working from home and being in quarantine for so long, plus colder weather and knowing that it’s going to be this way for months before I can get the vaccine.
Anonymous
Let’s have a gratitude thread. We all love a good vent but what are you wise women grateful for today?
I’ll go first I’m working on something really cool and important today. I’m grateful that I have a job which allows me to make a positive impact.
Anon
I’m grateful for my new higher-paying job that allows me to move into a better apartment! I put in my appliation and I’m going to see it today and hopefully it all works out. I’m already decorating in my head!
anon
Congrats! Hoping for many pleasing pieces of decor in your future!
Ribena
The same as you! And that I have someone to send a Valentine’s card to this year. (International post is a nightmare so I need to send it this weekend, ugh)
Vicky Austin
Honestly, the boring basics: my husband, my dog, it’s payday tomorrow, it’s getting lighter in the mornings.
Curious
I, too, adore payday.
Anon
Third payday in January! I budget for two paydays a month, and the months with three paydays are joy.
Anon
You were paid on January 1? A holiday? Sweet!
Cb
The birds that I can see through my home office doors. I’ve become weirdly obsessed with identifying each of them and seeing them flying around definitely cheers me up. My husband who always makes sure I have a fresh cup of tea.
anon
I am really grateful that I make a lot of money and have built a lot of wealth. I grew up in poverty and I reflect on how much my life has changed often and am so deeply grateful, especially when it comes to things like knowing that if my parents needed anything I could take care of it no problem. It also feels really good to be in control of my own life and path in a way that I never thought I could be.
Anon
I am the same and for me I think about it even when I can buy name brand batteries that will actually power things properly.
Anonymous
Same here! Buying good bread, instead of the kind of cardboard-y store brand bread, makes me feel like I have made it!
Anon for this
I started taking Zoloft this week. I’m still adjusting and realized I need to take it at night after a groggy day yesterday, but I can already feel the clouds lifting some.
I’m really thankful for the support from DH who encouraged me to go see my doctor about it.
Anon
Good for you! And if it doesn’t work, please go back and see your doctor – there are tons of antidepressants to try, sometimes you just need to find the right one for you.
emeralds
I’m grateful that we got a sugar-dusting of snow last night!
anonshmanon
Number of vaccines administered will overtake number of diagnosed cases, either today or tomorrow. I’m grateful that we’re moving in the right direction.
I’m grateful that my relatives are recovering from covid.
Curious
Woot!!
busybee
I’m grateful that I finally have a job I love! I took a pay cut but am so much happier. I’m also grateful that I was financially able to take that pay cut.
Abby
I’m grateful for the sun whenever it decides to come out in Michigan, and for covid to push me to run and try curly girl method. Running has been a mood booster for me the past few months, and I have also never loved my natural hair more, with the bonus of it being at its healthiest!
Anon.
Yeah from a fellow curly/wavy whose hair has never looked better!
Anonymous
I am grateful that every time I misplace something, I’m only moderately worried because I know the object has to be in the house — I haven’t gone anywhere!
Anon
Please tell that to my scissors, which somehow I have completely misplaced and cannot be found in my tiny apartment.
anon
I keep 4 pairs of scissors–one in my laundry room, one in my kitchen, one in my desk, and one in my wrapping supplies. Except I can never find a pair of scissors when I need one. I did a big cleanup over the holidays, and I found all 4 pairs, plus an extra, and it was an honest to God Christmas miracle.
No Face
I just bought a pack of scissors at Costco and it has improved my life tremendously. No more wandering all over the house when I need to cut open something!
pugsnbourbon
Scissors do not follow the conventional laws of space and time. The number of pairs of scissors I have simply lost is unnerving.
Cornellian
I am so glad I am not the only one with this problem. My assistant used to make fun of me because I would request a new pair of scissors every 4 months. I don’t know where they go!
Anonymous
This!
anon
Cliche, but I’m grateful for a warm, safe home to cocoon in during these very dark days.
Curious
I’m grateful to be almost 9 weeks pregnant after a loss. Still no guarantees but this one seems sticky. Also grateful to be able to work from home during this time.
Grateful for this board.
Anon
Congratulations!!!
Curious
Thanks :)
anon
I have a lot to be grateful for, and right now I’m particularly grateful that my husband and I were able to do a strict two-week quarantine, and then make a no-stops-over-10-minutes very long drive with our two cats to my dad’s house. We’re staying with them for a few weeks before driving home, and so I’m grateful that for a little while at least we have other people around, and I can give my dad and stepmother as many hugs as I want (which is quite a lot as it turns out). Also grateful that the pandemic caused us to bring our cats (because it’s such a long visit and we had to drive) – it’s great to see them with my family, and I think good for all of us.
Anon
I’m so glad this worked out; it’s something I would do in a heartbeat if I could get pieces to fall into place.
Anon
My office culture is misogynistic and generally toxic, if you’re not in with a group of very immature and problematic men then you’re out.
As much as that sucks, there’s a group of really supportive women (+ like two men). We lift each other up, speak up in support of one another, and listen to each other’s vents. I could not get through the work day without these friends and their support and it’s a great little group we have going.
franklina
Got my 2nd shot yesterday! (I feel like the flu today and will be taking the afternoon off. Also, they are not kidding about the arm pain, I already had an annoyed rotator cuff but this is wicked.)
Saw this story: https://www.washingtonpost.com/nation/2021/01/28/oregon-snowstorm-vaccine-traffic-covid/ and I teared up a bit.
School started this week, and I am very behind already, and I somehow signed up for an 8 week calc 2 session, but I am on my way to the Next Step!
I was able to buy a car over the summer. The rate is atrocious and it has a long payment period, but it is safe and functional and relatively up to date, and I was able to pay for new brakes without having to not buy groceries thanks to the job I just started in April. (The boss of which seems to be solidly in my corner)
Anon
I’m grateful that for the first time the RI Supreme Court has a majority of women!!
Pompom
Woot woot, lil Rhody! Finally!
Is it Friday yet?
I’m grateful that despite having salary raises and bonuses frozen system-wide this year because COVID cost us a bunch of money, my boss went to the system CEO and got me a raise anyway, because he’s so happy with my work and wants to keep increasing my salary year-to-year. I can’t even complain that it’s much smaller than past raises, because I’m the only one that got anything! This was just the other day – it was really good to hear that my boss went out of his way and makes me feel appreciated. :)
Anonymous
My ninth-grader who was struggling with on-line school and lockdown has gotten her $hit together and started acting like a normal self-sufficient young adult and is feeling great about herself.
Curious
I remember you worrying about her :) So glad to hear this!
Anonymous
Thank you!
Anon
So, so grateful for my unicorn job – interesting, fun, low stress, fabulous colleagues, and high-paying. A particularly persistent recruiter reached out to me twice last week, so I wrote him back and told him, “To borrow a phrase from my grandmother, I wouldn’t leave for all the tea in China.”
My wonderful husband – it’s a second marriage for both of us, and we’ve been married three years and are STILL excited to see each other every day, still randomly holler “I love you” down the hall. We each spent a decade in less than great marriages, and we feel like we can’t possibly adequately express to each other the, well, RELIEF that comes with happiness.
Daffodil
Your marriage gives me hope that I’ll be able to find that kind of second husband one day. Thanks for posting!
Anonymous
I’ve been interviewing a host of 2L summer associate candidates this week. I am grateful that when summer associates ask me what I like about my firm and why I’ve stayed, I’m able to answer honestly and speak proudly of the work that we do and the culture our office has. On some of these virtual interviews, when we interview female candidates, we try to have an “all women interviewers” panel in their lineup so that women candidates can ask questions about “women in big law” that they might not otherwise want to ask in a different setting. I’m grateful on these panels that I can talk about how supported I feel, about the kick butt women partners we have at our firm who are at the top of their fields (and who support other women), and how our management team has big goals for getting more women and minorities into (and staying in) partnership and leadership positions. I’m grateful that I get to speak about all of this as truth, and the real experience I have, and not some lip service.
Calico
Grateful I was able to secure vaccination appointments for my father and stepmother on Saturday.
Anon.
I am thankful my employer takes Covid seriously, and I’m able to work from home, not commuting. Also grateful for flexible schedules as a homeschooling parent of a preschooler.
LifeScienceMBA
Thankful for sunshine today. Also, on a neighborhood walk a couple of days ago, I saw two bald eagles at our pond. Amazing.
Diana Barry
I am grateful that I am an equity partner and on my firm’s management committee and that I have the opportunity to drive REAL CHANGE.
Senior Attorney
Grateful for my lovely home and lovely husband.
Grateful that my son has gotten the first vaccine dose and is having the second in about a week.
Grateful for silly Felix and Oscar, our pandemic rescue kitties who still won’t let us touch them but will hang out with us in a socially-distanced way from time to time, which is gigantic progress since we brought them home in November.
Anonymous
Ooh, please post an extended update on the Odd Couple if you have time!
Senior Attorney
Haha they are hilarious, if elusive! They are still mostly hanging out in our guest room, where they have the under-the-box-spring hammocks they made for themselves, along with their six-foot-tall cat condo (The Tower) and a shorter cat bed (The Turret) that I put by the window so they can nap and look outside. I’ve moved their food and water into the hallway and they will venture out to eat and drink, but not if we are in sight. Per the kitty cams, they are the best best of friends and wrestle and cuddle with each other, and enjoy curling up together in The Turret for nice long naps. Other times it’ll be one napping on top of The Tower and one napping in The Turret.
At first they would scramble under the best the minute one of us poked our head in, but now they will usually stand their ground and say hi, as long as we say a properly social-distanced six feet or so away. Occasionally Felix will poke his head into the doorway to the living room to say hi when we are sitting by the fire with our books, and that’s always big doin’s.
At night they are very adventurous. They have a routine where the minute we turn off our lights and settle down to sleep, they are right outside our bedroom door, crunch-crunch-crunching on the dry food in the hall. I am sure they are coming into our room at night because a couple of times I have surprised them by getting up when they weren’t expecting it — and then it’s like a Roadrunner vs. Coyote cartoon mad dash back to their own room!
The other morning we woke up and discovered that overnight in their travels they had knocked over an air purifier thing we’d set up by the fireplace because it gets a little smokey when we have a fire, and they had knocked off the panel on the unit that was holding the filter in place. Hubby was a little salty about it until he realized that the air filter was still encased in plastic from the factory, so it hadn’t been doing one single thing the whole time we’d been using it! So Felix and Oscar did us a favor!!
Finally, on weekends I sit myself down in the hallway with a toy somebody gave me and they sit in the doorway to their room and look at me and exert all the self-control they have to keep from jumping on that toy. One of these days they are going to succumb…
Anyway we are so happy to have them — it gives us something to think about during this Groundhog Day Every Day season of pandemic life! Thanks for asking!
Senior Attorney
OMG this was a novel! Haha!
Curious
I love this so much :)
Anonymous
This made my afternoon.
Not that Anne, the other Anne.
Grateful to have gotten a bonus just in time to have to remodel the kitchen due to a pipe leaking.
Grateful to have a secure job I love which gave me a raise and a bonus even in a pandemic.
Grateful to have a house that is warm and comfy and soon to be home to a more functional kitchen.
Grateful for my adorable furballs who are currently curled up in their self-heating bed together in a pile of orange fuzz.
Anon
Grateful that I happened to open the scheduling email at the right time and got my grandmother her first dose this week.
Anon
I’m grateful for Georgia and Stacey Abrams and all of the grassroots organizers who worked so hard for two years to get us the majority in the senate.
But you can have Marjorie Taylor Greene back, Georgia.
Horse Crazy
Grateful to have a job with wonderfully supportive coworkers who understand that I live in the rural mountains and frequently lose power/internet in the winter. And grateful for my incredible fiancee who worked so hard to prepare us, our kitties, and our house for the massive storm we’re having right now – we live in a burn area and the risk of mudslides is real. He is incredibly attentive to detail, and did everything he possibly could to keep us safe, and we have been so far.
Anonymous
After years of doctors appointments with doctors in varying specialties I finally found someone who is actually doing something about my persistent cough. No one, not my PCP nor the four specialists I saw, evinced any interest in actually solving my problem, and one was a poor diagnostician who gave me an incorrect diagnosis. After that I gave up and coughed for two years straight without any help. I bit the bullet, went to a concierge practice, and had additional testing done and treatment arranged following two visits. I can’t tell you how amazing it is to follow the new protocol and see improvement!
ohsoanon
I am grateful that I finally told my husband I wanted a divorce. The next steps are going to be so, so hard, but standing up for my needs was such a big step. I am beyond grateful for the love and support of my dear friends.
Anon
Congratulations! Been there, done that, and here to tell you it gets so much better!
Senior Attorney
You can do this! And just think — this time next year everything will be SO MUCH BETTER!
Anonimoose
I’m looking to expand my recipe catalog! I recently signed up for Paprika and have committed myself to meal planning for health and budget purposes. So if you please, send me links to your favorite at least decently healthy meals! I eat everything, although I’m trying to reduce my meat consumption at least a few days a week.
Clementine
Bengali Red Lentil Soup https://portlandsampler.com/televised-soup-swap-party/
We’ve also been big on making salsa chicken in the crockpot and then using it for burrito bowls and tacos for the kids and such. I just dump some chicken breasts and a jar of salsa in and then shred when it’s ready.
Cb
Ooh, I have a meal plan spreadsheet with about 70 recipes. We’ve veggie. If you post an email, I can share it with you.
Anonimoose
YES PLEASE. Thank you so much! Here’s the email: anonimoosemidwest@gmail.com
Anonimoose
OP here. CB, this list is PURE GOLD. Thank you so much for being willing to share!
Jules
Ooh, me too, please? jcolleen318@gmail
Horse Crazy
Hi, Cb!! Can you share it with me, please? horsecrazyrette@gmail.com. Thank you!!
Anonymous
Omg, me three please! officeisland@yahoo.com :)
Anon
I would love that too! My email is kp015802@gmail.com
Anonymous K
I would love it as well! corporettelove@gmail.com
emeralds
I was just organizing my bookmarked recipe folder so I’ve got lots at my fingertips :) Not posting links to try to stay out of mod, but you should be able to copy and paste these into google pretty easily. Check out Budget Bytes’ Sweet Potato Tortilla Soup, Rosemary Garlic White Bean Soup, and Veggie Fried Rice; Cookie and Kate’s Spicy Black Bean Soup; the Kitchn’s 3-ingredient sheet pan gnocchi roundups; Bon Appetit’s Spaghetti Aglio e Olio with kale; Fork Knife Swoon’s Lemony Kale and White Bean Soup; and Smitten Kitchen’s pasta with garlicky broccoli rabe. These are all easy, mostly healthy, and mostly veggie.
Also, I made the Gimme Some Oven Best Butternut Squash Soup in the crockpot yesterday, and it will be joining the winter soup rotation.
NY CPA
I absolutely love this turkey and veggie breakfast hash. I double the amount of apples and use 2 large zucchinis, instead of 2 small. I also like using 2 shallots instead of an onion sometimes. I meal prep this on Sundays and then have it throughout the week. I usually do a scoop or two of this and top with a sunny side up egg. Yum! http://fedandfulfilled.com/turkey-apple-breakfast-hash/
Ribena
I am working my way through Ella Risbridger’s Midnight Chicken to provide some structure to my meal planning – I made her five-a-day sweet potato hash at the weekend and it was incredible.
Anon
This is a great book. I bought it from a recommendation here. The green harissa in particular gets made pretty much every week around here and used on everything to give it a punch of fresh flavor.
Anonymous
Cookie and Kate’s red curry; America’s test kitchen vegetable lasagna; hungry girl’s vegetarian chili; NYT crispy gnocchi with Brussels sprouts
AnonMPH
Very specific question, but has anyone been able to get “Family Sync” working on Paprika for iOS? Theoretically I should be able to use it to meal shop and make grocery lists, but I cannot for the life of me figure out how to get my husband to see my info on his phone. Help!
Anon
I like recipes online from the New York Times. It might be worth it to buy the $40ish annual subscription and download a bunch of them to your paprika app. I did that and still use them all. I really like anything by Melissa Clark.
My favorite cookbook author is Molly Stevens, hands down.
And my favorite all purpose cookbook is Joy of Cooking. Every kitchen needs a copy, and they just updated in 2000, adding a bunch of vegan recipes but not losing any of the oldies but goodies.
Anon
I was recently chatting with friends about things big and small we wished adults had told us when we were younger. This brought up a a weird memory for me: very dark, visible marks on the backs of my calf’s, knees, and lower thighs in early puberty. I initially thought I had bruised my legs, and then when they never went away I determined the only option was to never show my legs again. I didn’t wear shorts for something like 8 years.
At sometime in adulthood I realized the dark marks were stretch marks, not some weird skin mutation, that lots of people have them, and that there were things that could help them heal over time.
Does anyone else have stories of big or small things they just wish someone had explained to them?
Ribena
Blow-drying or heat styling hair. I never understood how the ‘shiny girls’ at my high school had those glossy curtains of perfect hair that ended in a straight line across their backs.
Anon
I didn’t learn about flat irons until after college. I was so mad that I spent years walking around frizzy for no reason.
Two decades later, I do CGM, and refuse to use any heat on my hair ever, so ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
Anon.
Ha, same girl, same!
Anon
Similar to this, I have super curly hair that my mom (bless her) had no idea how to manage, so until I was something like 14 I just had puffy frizzy hair. It was really as simple as finally figuring out that if you have curly hair you can’t brush it when it’s dry, but that’s so pervasive in culture that that’s something you can do all day, young me took awhile (probably a fashion magazine) to figure out.
Now my daughter has super curly hair and I obviously know how to deal with it. I see her beautiful curls and think, ha, I wonder if this was what my hair was supposed to look like in all my frizzy elementary school pics?
anne-on
Omg same. It is a minor miracle my hair still retains any curl/wave after the 90s ear straightening irons I subjected it to. And my middle school pictures are tragic because my mom would not accept that brushing wavy/curly hair (while wet!!) was not the best way to manage it. I SO identified with Anne Hathaway’s hair in the first Princess Diaries pre-makeover.
Pompom
Yes, same, Ribena! When I was younger, I had big, frizzy, curly thick hair, and my mother–bless her–wouldn’t let me do anything to it because her hair was fundamentally the opposite. She’d just say “people would kill for what you’ve got.” Like, thanks, Mom, appreciate it, but this is an effing rat’s nest, lay off with the brush, k?
To this day, when I get a blowout (and when I used to get keratin treatments), I call the results “popular girl hair.”
Anon
Yes! I had stick-straight hair cut very short until I hit puberty. Then it got very frizzy and wavy… and I still had it cut too short to be in a ponytail. It had no shape at all– just frizz. At some point in high school, a very b$$chy gay guy made a comment in front of a group that I looked like I needed a straightener. I didn’t even know what a straightener was but promptly made my mom take me to Target to find one.
Clementine
That taking time to do your hair, file your nails, and do skincare with anything more than a plain bar of soap is not ‘vanity’.
Also, nobody notices your feet! Wear the correct sized and more comfortable shoes. Nobody notices if you’re wearing an 8.5 or a 9. Wear the ones that are more comfortable.
Vicky Austin
Hard same on the vanity thing, although I think my mom tried! My BFF recently told me that she saw me brush my wet hair (shudder) when she slept over once and really wanted to say something and didn’t. How I wish she had!
Also this: https://www.boredpanda.com/im-not-like-other-girls-comic-juliehangart/?utm_source=google&utm_medium=organic&utm_campaign=organic
Anon
Apparently, I’m clueless. Why is it bad to brush your hair when it’s wet?
Vicky Austin
With a regular hairbrush, it will break. I had incredible breakage for years, did this regularly, and never connected the dots. Use a comb.
Anon
I am confused too. The above comment says not to brush curly hair dry. And this comment says not to brush curly hair wet. When do I brush my daughter’s curly hair?
ANON
You don’t. You can comb it with a wide toothed comb when it’s wet.
anon
Same. I grew up getting the message that appearance didn’t matter and putting effort into your appearance other than basic hygiene was vanity, frivolity, showed you were superficial, and was a total waste of money. But I also envied the girls who had cute hair and cute clothes. It just seemed out of reach for me and I just assumed that they were naturally “more attractive” than I was which generated some self-esteem issues. I didn’t wear makeup, do my hair, or pluck my eyebrows until late college. I was like a cartoon character who had one outfit. I was conventionally attractive so I think that I “got away with it” to an extent, but ugh. I still find I have to consciously choose to disengage with these attitudes, do not know how to put together a non-work outfit, have very limited hair/makeup skills, and get deep anxiety whenever I spend money on something appearance-oriented that isn’t “necessary.”
Anon
I didn’t know that p(ubic hair would grow on your undercarriage and butt, not just on the front. I thought there was something wrong with me!
NYC
Yes!
anon
I could have used just any kind of information about my down south region– that the way it looked was normal, that the natural monthly changes in moisture level were normal, etc. Basically a combination of the info in “our bodies ourselves” and “taking charge of your fertility”.
Also I was a very thin child and when I started going through puberty, my hip bones jutted out and I didn’t know what they were and thought I was dying. Haha. It took me an embarrassingly long time to realize they were bones not weird lumps that shouldn’t be there.
Children also need to be shown how much soap/shampoo to use when they begin taking over bathing themselves. For some reason my mom never thought to show me or my sister, and while I figured it out, my sister was trying to wash her long, very thick, oily hair with a tiny bit of shampoo and as a result it always looked dirty.
anne-on
Ha! Yes, I had to show this to my son in the last month or so. Turns out he was using about a palmful of shampoo and blew through a bottle in like 3 weeks. We showed him he only needed about a quarter sized amount for his short hair.
I also wish there had been more guidance & acceptance in my parent’s house for grooming/personal care guidance in general – I have my dad’s textured hair and my mom had NO clue what to do with it and balked at buying conditioner/gel/etc. Same with acne products/reasonable makeup/etc. My girlfriends/sleep away camp really showed me how to blow dry my hair/style it/apply makeup/etc. My dad just giving me pocket money privately was the only way I got to buy anything ‘frivolous’.
Lilau
Ooof! I feel you on the hair! My mom would rip through mine with a brush, yelling at me for the tangles and call my hair a “rats nest.” Friends, it’s curly. She shouldn’t have been brushing it in the first place. Good grief mom!
Anon
Oh my god, same.
Anon
Ha, I just read this after posting above about y mom also not knowing not to brush my curly hair!
Anon
OMG yes. I have a kid who is technically washing her hair, but it is oily by nature and her washing is hopelessly inadequate. I do the shampoo part maybe 1/3 of the time and it is just not catching on with her. Use shampoo with abandon! And concentrate on the top of your head and temples. The ends are more in need of conditioning than shampooing! We have $$$ for shampoo — no reason to skimp!
anne-on
Have you seen the hair scrubbers on amazon? I think they’re called a scalp massager, or shampoo brush? It really helps get at the scalp – my kid has very thick straight hair, and this helped him when his hand/finger strength was still not really up to shampooing on his own.
Anonymous
I wonder if you might suggest that she use shampoo twice? If the hair is really oily and dirty, it makes a big difference. And two inadequate washes is probably better than one?
anon for this
Check out the V*gina Bible by Dr. Jen Gunter. It’s what you want! She also has a new book out about menopause which I am creeping into the target audience for.
Monday
Neither of my parents took s3xual harassment seriously at all, even when it was adult men targeting me as a minor. I felt totally alone in the reaction that it was sick and damaging, and it made me mistrust them on lots of other issues too. When young girls and women mention it to me today, I make a major point of validating their anger about it and not pretending it’s ok.
Anonymous
Oh man I feel that one so hard I was assaulted so many times as a young woman and I just lived through the panic attacks they caused and moved on with life.
Anonymous
I agree with this. I think that women who grew up in the 90s and early 2000s are probably the last generation growing up with absolutely no attention paid to all the issues raised during the MeToo movement. My parents did not have a fucking clue.
anon
Oh, this is truth. Looking back, some of the attention I received from boys in high school was straight-up harassment.
Anon
I don’t really have a solution (I’m not a fan of ‘zero tolerance’ or policing), but in retrospect, it’s incredible to me what we were asked to put up with at school compared to the kind of work environment we provide for adults when we ask them to learn or produce. I guess it’s just privileges that not everyone has, but I would never give them up now.
Monday
My male peers, but also male teachers, behaved in ways that are totally unacceptable. I suddenly started hating school and resisting all authority around age 13, and I think this is a major reason. I was being offended or violated on a daily basis, and none of the adults in my life really cared. Before that, I loved school and learning, and that is my real baseline (to which I returned at an all-female college).
Ugh same
Jeeeeeeeez, me too, 90s high school kid here. I haven’t thought about it in awhile, but recalling specific incidents still makes me viscerally shudder. Where were the adults?! Sometimes they were involved, other times they were just clueless, and still other times when I asked for help it’s like they were appalled at ME, for talking about such a horrible thing [that someone had just said or done, to me, AT SCHOOL!]
Sorry for the rant.
Anon
I was born in 1985 so a teen during the 00s. I went to an all-girls school and every year they would bring in a guy to teach us about safety from rapists and serial killers (think the “street smarts” guy from John Mulaney). But it scared us, didn’t empower us.
Ribena
We had a similar thing – I was born 9 years later but otherwise that sounds very familiar. At one point they asked everyone who walked to school to come to a meeting to be warned about a creepy man and they asked us all to put the local police non emergency number in our phones… and then there was the year when all the graduating students were given r a pe alarms when they left for university…
Monday
Good point about the generation–that’s me. The thing is, my mom did have a clue. The same things had all happened to her. She just didn’t think there was anything to be done, and basically excused it as just the way men act. Including my Dad (though not toward me).
Help
Siiince you mentioned it… I have a 3 year old with very fine, and wavy hair. I imagine as she matures and the hair lengthens/fills in it will become less wavy as it becomes heavier, but possibly not I suppose. I have no idea what to do with it! It’s a rat’s next after every bath so it needs combing but I’m also keenly aware of the fact that just combing curly hair isn’t right. It’s def strongly wavy vs. tight curls, but far more texture than I’ve ever had to deal with myself. Frankly, I’m jealous.
Help a straight-haired, clueless mom out. What do I do with it!? Is combing it ok at this point since she’s so little?
Clementine
A post bath detangling (using probably a wide toothed comb) is 100% necessary. I would probably add something like a detangling spray and think of it as ‘moisturize and detangle’ not straight haired ‘comb’.
Pompom
And get her involved in the combing process, when her motor skills are up for it. She can control the pressure and the pull herself. Teach her to start by detangling the ends first–comb out any knots there to “make way” for the knots/tangles above it–then work on the middle part of the hair, then comb from the root down last.
My mother had no idea, and yanked that comb/brush right through…she sincerely thought she was helping, but I could feel the frustration with every brush!
anne-on
You want to use a wide toothed comb/detangler and conditioner every time you wash (my mother doesn’t use conditioner and didn’t understand how necessary it is for wavy/curly hair). If that’s too much for you to wash out, then a detangler/leave in conditioner may work for now. As she gets older her hair likely won’t need shampooing daily – look into the co-wash method. Washing too frequently will dry her hair out (but I also understand if you’re still in the washing food out of her hair daily phase!).
Anon
Agreed with above. For my curly haired daughter I just follow what I do which is after bath put in a leave in conditioner (I have just used my adult one on her from an early age) which basically acts like a detangler. Then comb with a wide toothed comb while wet to reset the tangles out. Don’t touch with a comb or brush after even sort of dry.
Even if she’s just wavy, I don’t see why you couldn’t follow the same script to really embrace the waves.
Is combing okay at this point since she’s so little? If you mean once it’s dry, I mean sure b/c no one really cares what a 3 year old’s hair looks like, but I don’t see why you need to. Might as well not.
broken toe
With my wavy/curly haired daughter’s long hair, we found that braiding it at night into a single braid after her bath made enormous difference in avoiding the “rat’s nest” in the morning.
Anon.
Check out the CGM (curly girl method) on Reddit. There are threads regarding hair care for kids.
Anon
It’s overwhelming to me how big of a problem we would have if we actually took this seriously.
Monday
+1. It’s hard to even get your head around. I think that’s why so many people just shrug it off–doing otherwise, you don’t even know where to start.
Anon
Per the Resource Center for Adolescent Pregnancy Prevention: in 49% of pregnancies in 15 to 17-year-old girls, the father is 20 or older.
But let’s keep ranting about abstinence and girls needing to “keep their legs shut” instead of talking about male predators.
Vicky Austin
Pretty sure there’s a LOT of women my age in my hometown who wish someone had told them this. I will go to my grave banging pots and pans about older boyfriends NOT BEING COOL.
Anon
Yup. In my hometown, it was often the same guy too. They knew just the right lies to tell.
Anonymous
At my middle school, it was not uncommon for adult men to literally cruise by when the bell rang at 3 pm to pick up their girlfriends. NO ONE ever put a stop to it, but they did shake their heads and say “too bad” when a girl got pregnant via statutory rape when she was 13.
Mal
This is makes me SO MAD. All of this. Any of it. Here to commiserate with y’all.
Anon
This one hits so close to home.
Emma
+1. My parents were apparently very amused that their divorced friend (in his 40s) kept bringing me gifts (including a bikini, some make-up, and perfume) and telling me what a pretty girl I was (at 15). Nothing bad happened and my parents are lovely people otherwise, but if someone ever did that to my kid they would never set foot in my home again.
Monday
Fumes. They wouldn’t even be allowed to communicate with my daughter in any format.
Alana
Wow. I am over 40, and after my mom’s best friend’s husband propositioned me, I told my family and they support me in avoiding him as much as possible.
Anon
Agree on this.
Anon
Make-up takes practice. You actually have to sit down in your spare time and attempt it, over and over. You can’t just throw it on in a panic and run out the door, expecting it to magically apply itself correctly.
My mother has never worn a speck of cosmetics, and I grew up in the early 80s. There were unfortunate clownish looks in my learning curve. I would have killed for YouTube tutorials back then.
pugsnbourbon
Another zero-makeup mom here. I learned from my fellow seventh graders with predictably awful results.
anne-on
Same. I recall using ‘skin toned’ eyeshadow as concealer because I had no clue. It looked about as awesome as you’d imagine. I would have killed for a youtube makeup tutorial.
Emma
+1 on this to. So much shiny blue eye shadow, improperly applied.
Anon
When I asked to wear makeup, my mom took me to a makeup store (pre-Sephora) and had a woman there pick out makeup for me and show me how to put it on correctly. I am forever thankful.
anne-on
Omg 12 year old me is SO JEALOUS. Your mom is awesome.
Anon
That my parents threatening to send me off to the home for troubled youth was them venting some frustration (I was not into drugs, staying out late or any other troublesome issues, was an excellent student and in fact, only the authorities/DJJ could place kids there). I was terrified of being sent away and it didn’t dawn on me they might not have been serious until I was >40.
Anon
Dude, that’s not okay they threatened you like that.
Anon
Yeah, well, it was pretty much constant, and I probably should have realized a lot sooner that it was just their effed-up way of venting their frustration. I was naive in a lot of ways and thought they had their stuff together a lot more than they did.
anon
OMG, my parents did the same thing. Even at the time, I sort of knew they were bluffing, but it really hurt my feelings.
Anon
Any time my dad got mad at me, he threatened to report my boyfriend to the police, but dating him was fine when my dad was in a good mood.
BF and I were 13 months apart in age, so he turned 18 when I was an old 16. My parents were farther apart in age than that and had also dated in high school, but when I pointed that out, I was punished for my “smart mouth”.
Anon
Love frequently ends. You will survive and thrive.
Curious
Yes, this. Also friendships end. You are going to be okay.
Anon
I wish someone had explained to my parents, not to me, that it was not OK to criticize my weight constantly, that they should have found out whether or not I had an eating disorder, which I did, that it was not OK for men to ogle me and for boys to be boys, and that it was not okay to push me towards being a nurse instead of a doctor.
Monday
+++++. I assume you’re a doctor today :)
Anon
No, but I found the path that was better for me anyway (no thanks to them). They somehow thought my brother, who got Fs in high school because he didn’t “apply himself,”would make a better doctor than me, the valedictorian. I’m happy with where I ended up, but I resent their negative influence.
Monday
Oh, I wish I could hug you. My parents gave my brother a car and money for lunch every day, while he almost failed out of high school, because they thought it would help. I got straight As and had to walk or ride the bus, and pay for lunch on my own. I also ended up just fine, but I have never forgotten this.
Anon
Aw, thanks Monday. It sounds like our experiences were similar in some ways, right down to my parents giving my brother a car and eventually saying they would give me money for a car and then…not. I ultimately figured out that I can be a much happier person if I pursue independence as a choice and in the end, what I went through helped me achieve that. It’s hard though!
Anon
Monday, have you talked to your brother about this?
I ask because my husband and his brother did not find out until literally their mid-forties that their mother had been pitting them against each other when they lived at home. Each was told separately that the other sibling got free car insurance and spending money, but that they would have to make their own way. Both thought the other was the “golden child”just because MIL was a b!tch who liked to play mind games.
Not saying that’s your situation (since of course a car is obvious), but discussing it as adults may provide useful insight nonetheless.
Monday
Good question, anon. I am fairly close with my brother now, and I wouldn’t say I’ve ever sat down and talked to him about this, but I have mentioned it with annoyance around him. He has never defended it or offered any other perspective. I know that he felt overshadowed by my success in school, but he does not really dispute that my parents were more permissive and generous with him than with me. He also went on to be academically and professionally successful/responsible as an adult. For a while there, I really wondered, but he’s fine now.
anon
I wish someone had taught me how to dress in a way that flattered my body instead of hiding it. I kid you not, I was probably 21 before I realized that I did not need to wear a men’s XL t-shirt when I was actually a women’s size 10. My mom is slight and petite, and I am tall and curvy, and she was just clueless on how to help me. But it makes me sad, looking back on old pictures of myself, never really enjoying the body I was in.
My parents were so, so bad at teaching me how to deal with emotions. Like any emotion other than happiness was wrong. I don’t believe my emotional education started until I was in my thirties and was suffering from anxiety and panic attacks.
Anon
Omg I could have written your last paragraph. Every emotion I had that wasn’t happiness or gratefulness was invalidated. (And still is!) Thank god for good therapists.
Anonymous
Same for me, to this day, about any emotion other than happiness or gratitude. Still learning the value of recognizing and naming when I feel anger, frustration, etc.
Anonymous
Oof. Same here. I’m grateful that therapy was accepted in my family growing up, but my ability to FEEL feelings, instead of think or talk about them, didn’t start until about 6 years ago.
Anonymous
Being good at something and liking something are not the same thing. My parents really reinforced that I should pursue things I was good at, I don’t think they realized I did not actually enjoy math it was just easy and fast. I eventually figured it out on my own, but I spent a long time studying something which I didn’t enjoy.
anon
This is something I am just realizing now at age 38! Unfortunately, at this stage in life, I’m also having a tough time distinguishing between the two, at least when it comes to my career direction. My parents were big on not quitting and keeping commitments, for example not quitting a sport mid-season, which generally I think is a good value. But, I internalized that into an identity of “I am not a quitter” that kept me in a seriously toxic job straight out of college for way too long. I don’t blame them at all — of course they wouldn’t have wanted me to “stick it out” at that job, but it took me a long time to realize that quitting something unhealthy didn’t mean that I was a “quitter.” I still struggle with this and it’s definitely intertwined with the distinction between being good at something and liking something.
I have my own kids now and writing this out makes me think I will need to be more explicit with them about learning to trust themselves and that sometimes it’s ok to nope out of a situation that isn’t working for them. I think as parents we sometimes don’t trust our kids to understand nuance, so we present them with kind of black-and-white guideposts for life. Hoping I can get it right!
Curious
I wish my mom taught me to shave earlier.
I agree on the idea that grooming is not vanity — I still struggle with this.
That it would be okay to get a B in order to take care of my mental health.
Anon
What is “earlier”? Asking because we started lockdown with a little kid who is now fully into puberty and if I were she, I’d probably want to be taught re shaving now to be ready for the summer. [I have fair skin and a lot of dark brown hair that grows long on my arms and legs and in an area where most people do not seem to have this problem. I did lazer my moustache / legs / bikini area in my 30s and did about 50% reduction on my arms and it was really life-changing in the best way.] I get that this is all cultural, but I think it is what it is and I don’t want my kid to be teased or ostracized over something she can’t help. It is also bad that many of her girl peers and about all of the boys are barely starting puberty and they boys are also about a head shorter than she is, so she really sticks out and is noticeable absent this.
Curious
I was your kid. I was so tall and so early (period in 5th grade). I got the most looks for my hairy legs in 8th, so maybe 7th? Not sure exactly when the brown hairs came in, but they + capris were not an accepted look.
There were some good scripts here a while back about “some people like to keep their hair and some people like to remove it. If you want to experiment, I would be happy to get you a razor and show you how to do it.”
Mal
I think this is the right way to go! Tell her that it’s her choice, and you’ll be happy to help her if she wants. THEN, don’t comment on which choice she makes. Appreciate all y’alls thoughtful parenting.
BeenThatGuy
I wish someone explained to me that my father didn’t hate me. In fact, he hates EVERYONE. Sadly, it wasn’t until I was over 40 that I realized this when I saw him completely unable/unwilling to hug my child who so desperately wanted to snuggle with his grandpa. To think, I spent 40 years thinking I was un-loveable.
Curious
This sucks. My heart goes out to you.
Anonymous
Stopping an activity you don’t like doesn’t make you a quitter, and trying out a variety of hobbies doesn’t mean you’re flaky. I can’t tell you how much guilt I felt for stopping (sometimes expensive!) hobbies that I hated. Any time I wanted to try a new hobby my parents said, why would you even try when you’re just going to quit like you do everything. Even as an adult it’s made me hesitant to try new things and I’ve ended up paralyzed about having any hobbies. I feel guilty looking at my Cricut gathering dust, my adult coloring books, my camera that I only ever use on vacation, etc. One of the best things about college was having an excuse to take, ie, a pottery class for a semester so I got to try it and had an excuse to stop.
anon
Yes, I posted something similar above! But it’s probably affected me more in my job life than hobbies — I’ve always been more accountable to what others may think than to myself. It’s hard to shake the notion that once you’re in on something, you have to be all-in and stick it out or else you’re a quitter. It became pretty ingrained as part of my self-identity and I’m still working on separating it from my notion of “who I am.” I can’t entirely blame my parents because I think the underlying value of pushing through hard things is a good one, but there needs to be nuance and balance.
anon
My parents still say this! In my defense I actually didn’t get to try out anything in my childhood so as an adult I want to do everything, and naturally found that I don’t love certain things along the way, so I quit and try other things. But how would I know if I hadn’t tried? We say to give people a fair chance in dating. I say the same should apply for hobbies.
Shelle
I wish someone had told me that my teenage body wasn’t out of whack, I’m just a petite pear. None of the clothes available at the local suburban mall fit me so I wore things that were just all wrong. I learned about proper sizing and tailoring from online blogs/stores in my mid to late twenties that simply didn’t exist when I was growing up. Internet shopping has a big carbon footprint, but it’s the only way I’m able to obtain clothing that fits me.
anon
Fellow pear, here, and I want to give you a hug. I understand this completely. Teen clothes were not made for our figures, and it made US feel like we were wrong when really, it was just the clothes. I really wish fashion blogs had existed in the late ’90s!
Shelle
Yes to all this, and hugs and commiseration right back at you!
Anonanonanon
I wasn’t a petite pear but a petite apple. But I feel this comment so much!
Shelle
Solidarity!!
Mal
I struggled with this too – just the fact that tween/teen clothing back in the day was not geared toward a more womanly body. I was shopping in the women’s dept. in middle school, and really hated that I wasn’t a cute petite girl like my peers.
mascot
Yes, petite hourglass who went through puberty early. Guess what else wasn’t made for kids with boobs and hips? School uniforms. They were miserable and I looked terrible.
Anonymous
1) Small talk is a skill that can be practised and learned, not a natural gift only non-shy people can have.
2) It is not necessary for small talk to be interesting for it to be successful.
PolyD
I was way too old when I figured this out. Also, it’s okay to “lie” in small talk. Like if someone says, Isn’t it a nice day, and you are having a bad one, it’s okay to just say, Yes, it certainly is, instead of feeling like you to to bare your deepest darkest thoughts to a stranger.
Also shy and introverted are not exactly the same thing.
Thanks, it has pockets!
Friendships are easy(ish) in high school because you see each other every day. They will get harder to form and maintain when you no longer have that one school building keeping everyone in one spot; if you enjoy someone’s company, make the effort, reach out, catch up, make plans. I hate how proactive I was with guys I wanted to bone but not when it came to awesome ladies I just wanted to hang with.
It’s possible you’ll marry your high school sweetheart, but very unlikely. And stressful relationships are rarely worth it; if you’re not happy, then move on.
(I only say possible because while my sister’s high school sweetheart did dump her before college, they reunited like five years later and now they live together, in their mid 20’s, with two dogs, they very likely will get married, so it does happen sometimes, but ughh I’m glad I didn’t marry mine)
OTC acne products don’t work for everyone, but if you find a really good dermatologist, they’ll give you the right stuff to clear up your skin.
anon
How do you help a mentee (post-MBA level, so we’re in our 30s and have had other jobs before) understand that work is not school, and you aren’t going to get hand holding at every step of the process for everything that you do, and you just need to take a stab at doing your job and ask for help where you need it as opposed to showing up being like, what do I do now? She thinks she’s been struggling because people haven’t spent enough time teaching her the basics, when in fact she’s expecting hours upon hours of her manager’s time every day to be walked through things that are simple enough and she should be able to at least try herself. Anyway, we’ve had this conversation a few times and I think it makes sense to her in the abstract but I don’t know how to help her make the mindset shift she will need to be successful in this role (or any professional role that requires independent work.
She’s been in this role for 2 years and everyone else in her class is in the promotion window, so she’s frustrated and I think is hooked on the narrative that she isn’t getting the opportunities to develop, when in fact she just isn’t taking responsibility to do things she should be doing. Anyway, any help would be appreciated here!
Rach
I don’t have any solutions, but wanted to send commiserations. I have a colleague who is just a year or so younger than me that absolutely refuses to do anything without a triple check from other employees. We are technically above her in the non-existent org chart, so it’s not absurd to ask us, but the demands on us are such that we really do not have time to nanny someone who has been in their role far too long to be so needy about tasks they routinely perform.
Anonymous
Honestly there is no way of teaching independence, I don’t think, I tried really hard. I had a MBA as an intern, they were super salty to be reporting to someone with only a BSc *gasp* but the intern could not figure out the most basic tasks. I had asked the intern to mail out a bunch of documents, one of the addresses lacked a zip code so I stead of googling it to find out they just never sent it. I have hundreds of stories like that, the I intern simply did not understand problem solving which became even more evident when I learned that their parents did all their chores for them too…
annette
This is a good way to put it. I’ve been frustrated at the past at people not taking the least bit of initiative, or not taking responsibility for their own careers, but I knew we were wired differently and maybe its just that you can’t teach independence.
Now how do you teach kids independence. My imaginary future kids better never be like that.
BB
This sounds like a “radical candor” opportunity. Have you “had conversations” or have you told her point blank what you wrote above + the effect it’s having on her promotion window? Specific examples are always useful as well “you were offered X opportunity and you didn’t step up to take it.”
But other than that…you’ve helped her as much as you can. Lead a horse to water and all that.
anon OP
Yes. I am nothing if not candid and we had this conversation last night (again) in fact. She’s heard about the impact on her performance and promotion window and all that. I think the problem is manifesting to others as her not being good at the hard skills (which may also be true) but I think the root of her inability to learn is not trying and thinking that someone will come along and teach her.
You’re right though. There’s not really anything else I can do. She’s receptive to what I have to say and probably assumes that I’m right. I think she just doesn’t totally understand the idea.
TheElms
Do you think she is potentially afraid of making a mistake? I can be like this when I think I’ll do something wrong and cause a bigger issue down the road (when my work product is incorporated into something else). Could you ask her to do it on her own with the caveat that you’ll go over it together before its considered final? It’s annoying for sure, but it might get her going and if she manages to do the work, go through the review, and sees that she makes no mistakes, or mistakes that she can learn not to do in the future (hence its still a learning experience), that might be all she needs to be a bit more independent.
A.
Yeah when I read this I definitely thought “fear of failure” right away. I bet she’s scared of messing up! Doesn’t excuse the behavior but if this is the root cause you might be able to figure out some ways to address it.
Piper Dreamer
I have the same issue with one of the juniors too. I haven’t found a good solution. In my case, after we finished the assignment, I scheduled a call to do a recap with her and tried to help her understand that I was not going to give her a step-by-step manual and she needed to at least try. But the first sentence that came out of her mouth was “I feel like you are not giving me enough guidance and that is why I failed at the task.” Ugh…
Not proud of this but I pretty much decided to avoid working with her since then.
Ellen
This sounds familiar with my ex-associate Mason. Not all professionals work out. He graduated law school, but could not pass the bar. In addition, he never did an assignment to fruition, but left it for me to fix. He was focused mainly on the fact that he could call himself an attorney b/c he had a JD, and used it to get Lynn to be his girlfreind, who wanted to have an attorney as a boyfreind. We had to let him go when he never passed the bar and used the conference room table for haveing s-x with Lynn. I think that was the final straw for the manageing partner.
anne-on
Have you given her a checklist? Like, before you come to me, I expect you to do steps A,B,C. I am happy to help you if you run into roadblocks, but at your level, and with your experience with the company, the expectation is that you will be able to do these initial tasks solo. I had a manager give me that talk when I was only a few years into the workplace (and she gave me a set 15 minute window to speak with her every morning/late afternoon) and it made a HUGE difference in my confidence and her overall happiness with my work product.
If you’ve done that, and she STILL isn’t getting it, I think it’s time for a serious counseling session where you lay our expectations concretely and how she is falling short. ‘Jane, we have discussed weekly (document dates/emails) how you need to do tasks a/b/c independently as a part of your responsibilities. You are still not following that direction, which indicates to us that you are not ready for promotion, and may need (training, PIP, whatever).’
go for it
Ahh, I have had one of these staffers….
Thought that she will not like: make her take notes for every step, then next time she asks a question
reply with “what do your notes indicate?”
My experience has been to cut the cord and make the person take responsibility for the work. As her peer or even superior, handholding does not get a staff member to take ownership.
Anonymous
I would have her come up with plans and checklists for herself. At first you may have to ask a series of leading questions to get her to formulate the plan (e.g., what pieces of information do you need to complete the task? where would you get that information? how would you find out where to get that information?), and you will need to review the plans for a while. This independence-building strategy has worked with my teenager and with allegedly adult employees.
anonshmanon
If she’s frustrated about not being in the promotion window, maybe point out that the people on the next level are the people giving the guidance, doing the training, coming up with the answers to questions such as hers. She needs to mentally put herself on a road to get there from where she is now.
is it safe to fail?
I’ll take a slightly different approach than the other commenters and ask if it’s actually safe to try and/or fail at the company? Because if she gets her hand slapped every time she makes a suggestion or nitpicked every time she takes a different first step, then the org might have trained her that she needs to ask permission for every little thing. I’ve always been pretty bold, take charge, I’ll figure it out, but one of my companies made me slightly terrified to try anything without getting documented approval. I was in charge of ordering the company shirts, and employees were allowed to have 2 new shirts every other quarter (they were required to wear them every day at the job, so 4 freaking shirts per year was pretty stingy). A new shipment came into the warehouse so of course the warehouse receivers opened it and called me down. They were SO EXCITED to have new shirts and asked if they could take them right then. Knowing the limits, I gave them each 2 shirts. Wrong move. The President of that company was a complete jerk and came to find me the next day to yell at me that I shouldn’t give out shirts unless he said so, he wanted to dole them out, etc. etc. And that is how I came to never order, receive, or give out swag for the rest of my tenure without asking for permission a million times. It took my next manager a solid 6 months to convince me that I should make my own decisions, I didn’t need to get permission for every little thing, she’d have my back if something happened, etc. I know it’s not quite the same situation, but making sure people have space to try a different approach or make mistakes so they can learn is important. I agree that it’s super frustrating when someone won’t take a first step or needs hand-holding, it’s surprising that she still needs this after getting an MBA and working for a while.
Flats Only
This is an excellent take. I have gone through a similar situation and several years later am still trying to resurrect my former, take charge, get it done self. You mention she’s had jobs before – I bet one of them was heavy on the micromanaging and scolding.
Anon
This is my current company. Leadership complains that people just pass the bucks in circles, yet anyone who takes ownership of a decision goes down in flames. A new-ish project manager was just fired for standing up to a VP, who wanted to do something dodgy regarding selling to a country with incredibly strict import regulations.
Anon
I had to fire someone like this as a manager. She kept saying she hadn’t been “trained on” certain tasks, as if adding a new column and a few new rows to a spreadsheet to expand the scope of an existing project was something that someone should have written a manual for. She had zero critical thinking skills and seemed to think her job was pushing a series of buttons in a certain order.
I would let this person sink by herself. Some people are just in the wrong jobs.
Anon
I’d like to try investing in stocks for “fun.“ I’m already set on my retirement contributions and other investments and I’d like to put a small amount of money into the stock market to see if I can make any money there. What would be a good platform for doing this in small amounts? Most of my investments are through Vanguard, but I usually think of that as a place for mutual funds or retirement savings. I’m not looking for advice on whether this is advisable, just for tips on which platforms would be best with low fees. Is Robinhood the go-to one these days?
Note: this has nothing to do with GameStop, lol.
Flats Only
Fidelity has “stock slices” where you can buy a partial share of stocks. So you could buy $50 of Google, even though their price per share is more than that. You get the amusement of following the market without having to put in a lot of money.
Anonymous
I use the Stash app for my “fun money stocks” so basically money I can afford to lose if the stock market crashes. I have about $1.5k of various stocks in there, ranging from a fraction of a fraction of a fraction of Amazon, one entire share of Target, a few ETFs, a bunch of random things to play around with diversifying.
The fee is probably a bit high at $1/mo for most users but it works for me.
Anon
I have done the same with a small amount of money. I already had a HYSA at Ally, so I use their investment platform because that was easy for me to transfer money back and forth.
anon
I play on Robinhood. Seriously small dollars. I made a good buy (but only 1 share!! UGH!) of Peloton last March. It’s been fun to see how things work and to get my feet wet, so to speak.
Booties
Just buy them through Vanguard. That’s what I do. I have a retirement account / IRA at Vanguard, and just opened another Brokerage account as well. Takes a couple minutes online, or just call them and they’ll walk you through it. Why make it more complicated?
In my brokerage account, most of my money is in the VTI total stock market mutual fund, but then I use a smaller amount of $ to buy individual stocks. I go into it stock buying this way – I only use smaller amounts of $ I can afford to loose completely. And I invest in companies that I believe in, make good products, that are innovative, and are future focused, and ideally have good ethics. My goal is to invest and hold for the long term, and not play the market.
And GameStop adventures totally makes me smile – go REDDIT little guys – and I almost bought some GameStop this morning just to support them.
I truly believe many Hedgefunds/stock market amusement park antics are evil, and should not be allowed. It is truly disgusting the way some rich investors can manipulate the market and make money in ways no normal person can contemplate. And regulators no it, and do nothing. And these same rich investors vote against the poor having access to benefits for a basic survival.
Anon
I know you said you’re not talking about Gamestop, but Robinhood has suspended trading on Gamestop and AMC at the moment. Personally, I would not use a platform that is clearly demonstrating their willingness to manipulate the market in favor of hedge funds. Either they get away with this, which is terrible, or they go under investigation, which is good but is another reason not to use them.
I use and like Interactive Brokers.
Anonymous
How are the fees on that? I’m also interested in trying out some trading and have the same qualms you do about platforms manipulating the market in an unfair way.
Anon
Interactive Brokers is doing the same thing as Robinhood though?
Anon
You are correct, I just tested it. So I retract my recommendation.
Social media is saying that all Citadel and Apex platforms are doing this.
Anon
Dang, now I need to find a new brokerage! I hope people are tracking who is pulling this, so consumers can vote with their dollars. There’s a lot of research in my future.
IIRC, Fidelity is owned by customers, so I might start looking there.
Anonymous
Robinhood was only letting people sell GME and not buy- to me, that is insane. Isn’t that considered market manipulation as well by a platform? I was using Schwab for brokerage trading (same idea as you, very little money, I considered it a fun hobby because if I lost all the money it wouldn’t matter at all) but they froze ALL trading on GME. That means they’re essentially holding my money hostage, as I can’t sell and withdraw, or buy more. It’s actually enough that after this I am closing my brokerage account with Schwab and ending that relationship. I only have 2 shares of GME so I don’t care about the money but the principle of it is enraging.
Ahem – so I would suggest not using Robinhood or Schwab. I’m considering switching over to Vanguard and opening a brokerage account there.
Anon
I have Vanguard for my IRAs and 401k, and really like their platform. Can’t speak to individual stocks, though.
Anon
Yes, it is indeed market manipulation. Everyone who is trying to buy but cannot is being encouraged to make a report to the SEC. Almost everyone in the US is now unable to use their own money they way they want to. Europe and Asia is starting to rally in response.
Lilau
Just read the comment on yesterday’s thread about becoming pregnant during a pandemic being a selfish move and wanted to respond.
I do agree with the point that no one should feel bad for me to the extent that I have conflicting concerns re: vaccination. (It’s a moot point as no one is close to offering me a vaccine and I don’t imagine that changes before my due date.) Also, I agree that having a kid is always sort of a selfish act, at least to some extent. ( I can promise you that I was not picturing my future child wiping the rear ends of elderly strangers fifty years from now when I made this decision.)
But what on earth are people talking about with TTC “culture”? I’m all too familiar with the cultural expectations about motherhood, but this seems different. Are you taking about people who talk too much about their bedroom activities? Or people who have to have medical intervention to have children? Picking on the latter group just seems needlessly cruel and I want to push back on that, but maybe I’m missing something. Sorry if this is pot stirring, but it’s come up more than once and I’ve never seen it outside of this board.
Anonymous
I think what people mean by “TTC culture” is the way many affluent goal-oriented women become entirely consumed by TTC and doing everything perfectly. Instead of just deciding to have a baby and letting it happen when and if it happens, we want to take charge of the process (reflected in the title of one popular book). There are “research” and charting and message boards and vitamins and all kinds of prohibitions and restrictions. Some women treat TTC the way that others treat “lifestyles” like veganism, Whole30, keto, Peloton, etc.–they adhere obsessively to the “rules,” talk about it constantly, and openly judge others who don’t follow the same “rules.”
Anonymous
I don’t think TTC culture is predicated on the rules so much as it is a reinforcement that a woman’s one true duty is baby making and anything else a woman does is not nearly to that level of importance. It’s turning smart women into incubators.
Anonymous
I disagree. There’s nothing wrong with wanting to be a mom. That doesn’t mean you think it’s your duty to procreate or you’re nothing more than an incubator. Let’s have some compassion for women who are struggling with the frustration and anxiety of TTC for years on end.
Anon
I agree with that to a degree. It’s more like TTC culture is like if you’re not doing absolutely everything you can to try to conceive and buying into the lifestyle then you must not want to have a baby or you’re a failure as a woman.
busybee
I’m not sure what TTC culture is. I’ve struggled with infertility for more than two years and have had two miscarriages, including one after IVF. Infertility-related message boards have been a huge source of knowledge and support for me. If that’s “TTC culture” then I can say it’s been a major benefit to me. Anyone complaining that some women extensively research supplements, etc has never experienced infertility and is coming from a very privileged position.
Anonymous
That is a very strained application of “privilege.”
busybee
No, anon at 11:04, it’s not. It is a privilege to be able to have a child. Not everyone can, despite costly and painful medical interventions. Not everyone can adopt either.
anonshmanon
privilege comes in many forms, I don’t think it’s straining to point it out in a place where you didn’t expect it.
Anon
I think it’s a stretch as well. Women being the sex that can gestate children has negative consequences on their life outcomes. It’s the source of women’s oppression over history and in every culture, including for women who are infertile because they are still perceived as being part of the gestating class. To make it more practical for today, I don’t think you would say that a woman who accidentally becomes pregnant as the result of rape is so privileged because she didn’t experience infertility. This is an issue that requires nuance rather than privilege callouts.
Anonymous
I have never met anyone who does not come from a lot of privilege describe having children as a “privilege.” For many, it is a burden.
Anonymous
I think the privilege is having the option to participate in TTC culture and dedicate so much time and resources to having a child. That is completely a function of living in this modern era in a wealthy nation in which you are at the top of the socioeconomic ladder and without burdens that distract you from this pursuit.
Anon
* the ABILITY to have children. There, is that sufficiently worded? Jesus. The wordsmithing is just beyond…..
If you would like to experience what I have in my infertility battle, to wear the shoes of someone who does view the ability to have children as “a privilege”, please, be my god damn guest. Where is the compassion or the desire to understand another’s perspective? I don’t think of it as privilege in the same context as White Privilege, but the word still applies.
Busybee, I’m wholly with you. The ONLY reason I am able to make my horrendous experience a little less insufferable is because I researched the bejesus out of my diagnosis, thanks to this apparently criticized and now defined ‘TTC Culture’.
Anon
I’m with you BusyBee. To be able to willingly get pregnant without intervention is a lucky position to be in.
Anonymous
Actually, Anon at 11:43, I think you are with me. Lucky is an accurate descriptor. To me, “privilege” in the way it is being used today in the context of politics and sociology, implies some social construct that grants someone who is lucky an extra boost in society and access to additional benefits denied to others because of that particular brand of luck. That is not true in the context of fertility.
None of this is intended to deny the pain that busybee feels around infertility. I am sure that is real. But I don’t think fertility is a privilege in the way being white and a man is.
Anonymous
I am not wordsmithing Anon @11:35. I am hard disagreeing.
That does not mean I don’t sympathize that you are having a difficult time because you are being denied something you want and that other people seem to just get without effort.
Anon
As someone who conceived remarkably easily at almost-40, I know I am very fortunate to have been able to have my kid. We had s3x one month and I promptly got pregnant. No IVF, no miscarriages, no crying every month for two years when I got my period.
“You are lucky to have met your wonderful husband in college.”
“Child brides exist. I can’t believe you are so repressive go think that is a good thing.”
anon
When I was TTC my second kid and having problems conceiving, there was sort of this implication that if we weren’t pulling out ALL the stops, we weren’t trying hard enough. OPKs were just becoming a thing. With our first kid, we just had s3x around ovulation time and it happened within three months. That was not the case for subsequent pregnancies (thanks, undiagnosed endometriosis). DH and I were not on board with using hard-core fertility treatments, for a number of reasons that were personal and specific to us, and that decision was definitely looked upon poorly, both in real life and in online forums. It was a very lonely, isolating time.
Maybe I was naive or just lucky when I conceived my first in 2009, but it seems like the TTC did ramp up a LOT in the years following that. Just … stay away from the pregnancy and conception sites as much as you can, is the advice I’d give anyone TTC. They sort of warped my brain for awhile.
No Face
I don’t think this is fair. I was able to decide to have babies and “let it happen” because my husband and I are incredibly fertile, as it turns out. If you want to have a biological child and have fertility issues, it takes a lot of work. And there are so many different potential fertility issues, what works for some won’t work for others. With the internet, women can discuss these issues openly with one another with the internet in a way they couldn’t before. So now the rest of us can see just how much work they are doing, instead of being treated as a shameful secret.
I would never criticize women going through that process. They are taking medications I never had to take, experiencing losses that I largely never had to experience, and feeling hurt that I never had to feel.
Anonymous
This is how I understand it too – that TTC is another thing for high-achieving women to be the best at.
Alana
My take is that there is a difference between TTC because you are trying to have a child at the “perfect” time as a high-achieving woman, and TTC because you have fertility problems.
Anon
^This exactly and it shows up on this site ALL the time. Also, it is wrapped up in a constant martyrhood (“so and so at work got pregnant just by looking at her partner and I feel jealous–am I a bad person?” Then everyone chimes in with “no, TTC is so hard. you’re good and it will happen for you!” It is the late 30’s equivalent of the teenaged skinny girl asking her friends if she is fat so they will reassure her she is not.) And I second the commenter below that out of context with anything else going on in the woman’s life, it is a sole and singular focus on motherhood. I don’t think there’s anything wrong with being a mom, but reducing your purpose to just that, is not healthy.
Anon
Yikes, this is pretty unkind. I was lucky in that both times my husband and I wanted to have a baby we stopped using birth control and were pregnant 4 weeks later and 8 weeks later respectively. If you made the decision “hey, we both want children, time is right” and you’re now 2 years into that with no luck and that desire to have kids has increased over time, no I don’t think it’s reducing your purpose to having a sole and singular focus on motherhood. The reality is that if you aren’t naturally fertile, you have to do some work to have kids (whether that’s seeking fertility treatment or adopting). It’s not fair and I everyone I know that’s wound up in that position is by no means someone who I’d describe as having a “sole and singular focus on motherhood”. They by and large are women with fulfilling careers and relationships and are heartbroken that they couldn’t just pull the goalie and have a kid.
Curious
I actually asked the same question (back in early January I think). Was just totally floored. But I also think I might feel the same if i was still in the Midwest, where I felt extraordinary pressure to marry, learn to brew beer at home, watch sports, and procreate. Sending good energy to you and baby bump :)
Airplane.
Wow, the things you describe you felt pressure to do while in the Midwest sound like the stuff of my nightmares. I’m glad you got out.
Curious
Yeah, tech in Seattle suits me much better :). I guess that’s another thing to be grateful for (see thread above). I fit in so much better here.
Lilau
Thanks so much!
Btw your description of the Midwest brings to mind an old quote that I’m probably misremembering about Texas: it’s heaven for men and dogs but hell for women and horses!*
* no offense meant to all our sports and homebrew loving ‘rettes.
Curious
Lol this cracks me up. I really want to know what they do to the horses…
Mal
This Dallasite wouldn’t know, as there aren’t horses for miles…ha! But mostly, ride em’.
Cat
I think TTC culture is also a bit like – if you want to have a baby, you *will* dedicate all of your resources into achieving that goal. If you don’t conceive within a few months of “pulling the goalie” then of course you should be charting, taking all the vitamins, doing acupuncture, abstaining from alcohol, etc. And if you decide to proceed with *some* fertility treatments, deciding to stop at less-invasive treatment (vs proceeding to IVF, surrogacy, etc) is kind of unheard of. Only if you’ve tried everything are you allowed to admit “defeat.” It’s like deciding “well, we would have been happy parents, but we can also be happy childfree” isn’t something people can absorb.
Friday
I feel so seen. FWIW, I live in TX – I think TTC is closely tied to culture. Not having kids just isn’t a thing here. Our families treat us with a mixture of pity and disdain (my MIL once asked me if DH and I had tried having sex). Friends all have two or more kids, which is hard because we started TTC several years before most of them. Many of my friends have experienced difficulty getting pregnant or miscarriage, so they’re empathetic. I’m also thankful these issues are less taboo than they used to be. There are a few friends or acquaintances though who send either overt or subtle messages that “If you’re not willing to do IVF you obviously don’t want it badly enough.” or “Well if you would just do what *I* did, it would work.” It’s honestly so isolating. I’m thankful for this board.
Anon
This this this. My BFF is on her 4th? attempt at IVF and I’m feeling like I didn’t try hard enough when I stopped at 1 IVF.
anonshmanon
If TTC culture is a thing, I have mostly managed to ignore it, but yes to your last sentence. I can envision a fulfilled life either way, for me. I sometimes wonder why I don’t lean more strongly one way or the other.
Anonymous
TTC culture is frustrating and so is the hate it gets. I’m currently TTC but I haven’t been at it very long. If I mention TTC at all then I’m accused of feeding into TTC culture. If I don’t follow exacting rules then I’m also judged by people who are TTC. It’s very isolating, which I think is what TTC boards intended to address in the first place. The result is silencing women who are struggling.
Anonymous
TTC culture is frustrating and so is the hate it gets. I’m currently TTC but I haven’t been at it very long. If I mention TTC at all then I’m accused of feeding into TTC culture. If I don’t follow exacting rules then I’m also judged by people who are TTC. It’s very isolating, which I think is what TTC boards intended to address in the first place. The result is silencing women who are struggling.
anon
+1 obviously you should have known a global pandemic was going to happen, it’s your fault for not TTC sooner /sarcasm
cbackson
I had a baby last year, which required some medical intervention, and I still have no idea what “TTC culture” is. Is this one of those things that largely exists/is generated by internet message boards? Because I know many women in real life who have struggled to have kids but I’ve still never seen the type of behavior that’s described in this thread…
cbackson
(But I also did not participate in any message boards/groups/etc. relating to TTC or infertility.)
Anon
Yes, I think so.
Anonymous
I think it’s generally online, but I’ve known women like this irl. I think it’s a personality type – their sadness turns into judginess of others. I had one friend who had been TTC for over a year. Anytime anyone mentioned they were TTC she would become SO judgy of everything they did. She would tell average weight friends to lose weight (friend was overweight), eat better (I never saw friend eat a vegetable), never drink – all things friend was struggling with. It was like she saw every women who was TTC as an opportunity to externalize her internal dialogue. She became a very sad and bitter person over time.
Anon
For me it’s also sometimes the investment in future plans. It’s not bad to have plans or expectations or to be prepared, but some people come across as though they’ll really be crushed if their child doesn’t want to play the sport, attend the college, etc., that’s all laid out for them. Probably these are pressures that they themselves feel in their communities, but combined with the TTC part, family planning can start to look like a status thing or like it’s about what the parents want and need.
I have infertility and do understand that TTC isn’t simple or easy. But I remember that one of the doctors I saw in the fertility treatment world seemed very… slick. And the whole clinic was also very luxe in a way that felt strange for medicine (though maybe it would be good if medical clinics were generally more comfortable, or maybe they were trying to calm and reassure patients going through something difficult). But I didn’t like the feeling that I was a customer getting customer service treatment.
Curious
Yuck. And I’m sorry you have infertility.
Anon
I’m sorry that you are going through this. And agree that a RE practice (or similar) should not have a Nip/Tuck vibe (one in our city does; as someone who got married at 37 and wanted kids, I feared I’d wind up there).
Anon
I’m in the very thick of a multiple years long fertility treatment regimen for female-factor diagnosis. We have one daughter through successful intervention 3 years ago. Getting pregnant with #2 is proving to be incredibly challenging. Even still, I don’t know what “TTC culture” refers to. In fact, I think talking about it is extraordinarily healthy. I wish someone had told me about all sorts of things much younger or at least made me feel like I could talk/ask people about it. With any level of awareness whatsoever I would have recognized my PCOS symptoms at a MUCH younger age, sought diagnosis and support, and planned our own TTC a lot more strategically than we did. (I have other issues, too, fwiw – not just PCOS). Instead, I’m now 37 and might never have a second child despite the fact that I very sincerely want one more than anything.
And, for the naysayers, I also have a high powered, high earning career. “TTC Culture” hasn’t reduced the way I think of myself to just a producer of children, regardless of how very badly I want one. I also won’t throw endless resources at it despite the fact that I am lucky to have more resources than most. The mental toll this round is taking on me is incalculable and, candidly, I’m approaching my limit.
Anonanonanon
I’m still lost too on this focus on TTC culture. I was on infertility boards when I went through infertility and those boards did distinguish from the more cutesy TTC boards and focused on science-based commiseration and advice. So in my mind TTC culture, to the extent it exists, and infertility are separate things. I feel like we lose the fact that infertility is a medical condition. I would push back on both lumping TTC with infertility and any shaming based on what’s really a medical diagnosis, and not one limited to women either. I am not articulating my feelings well, but it just seems unnecessarily mean spirited. But I may also be missing the culture people are actually referring to.
busybee
Seriously. If “TTC culture” is wrong then I don’t want to be right. Through online infertility boards, I learned so much about my diagnosis and certain potential treatment options for me. It made me a much more educated patient and better able to advocate for myself. Not to mention, they helped me feel much less alone which significantly helps the emotional and mental side of this. People who don’t struggle in this area just don’t understand. Which is fine I guess- I’m just glad I have that outlet. Sorry not sorry other people are apparently bothered by it.
Also yes it’s possible to have a medical condition, spend time working to treat that condition, and still have a career and life.
Anon
Thanks, busybee. I commented above in support of your position on this, and I’ll do it again here. Spot on.
Anonymous
I think there’s a difference between “TTC culture” and supportive communities for women facing similar challenges. TTC culture is an ostentatious, self-righteous competition about who is best at TTC. It’s people who ask questions like “we want to TTC soon–should my husband turn down the COVID vaccine?” Yes, that was a real question on the moms’ page.
cbackson
I thought that was a silly non-logical question but it wasn’t ostentatious or self-righteous.
Anon
This exactly.
anon
I think that’s a silly question (obviously get the vaccine) but what about that is ostentatious or self-righteous? Especially on a board for parents?
Anonymous
It is ostentatious and self-righteous because the only reason she asked such a silly, illogical question was to humble brag that she and hubby are thinking deeply about every single decision they make in the context of TTC, to the point of endangering their health in the name of BEBE.
Anon
I think “TTC culture” is just a manifestation of fandom/obsession/anxiety (whatever you want to call it – it’s not necessarily a bad thing but more of a fixation for better or worse) of a particular topic. The internet has made it really easy to have tons of info available and tons of people to chat about that info with, for better or worse. Some people take it over the top but many don’t and it is nice that there is a place to get information and support.
That said, that comment was ridiculous. There’s nothing wrong with getting pregnant now if you want and nothing wrong with seeking medical attention for a medical issue.
Anon
Getting pregnant intentionally in the middle of a global pandemic seriously stretching medical resources is wrong. Hard disagree.
Anon
I just had a baby (was pregnant when pandemic started so I guess I’m not “wrong” according to you…eyeroll), the resources for pregnant woman are completely different than the resources for people needing COVID treatment. I assure you OBs and midwives are not and were not working in COVID units, including at the height of the pandemic in NYC when things were very scary . Fertility specialists certainly were not doing anything COVID related. Nor were maternity wards being used to treat COVID patients – doctors and nurses are not completely fungible. It’s not like if people stop getting pregnant that frees up doctors and nurses. Actually it just means those doctors and nurses are out of work. This is just another excuse to punish women for every choice they make. There is nothing selfish or wrong about getting pregnant during a pandemic – as noted above, that idea is just a way to shame women for not having kids sooner.
Anon
There’s the overly-cute aspect of it (I never want to hear intercourse referred to as “baby dance” again). The other issue is caught up in the demand for women to procreate.
I faced this from a different side: long story, my kiddo is almost a year old, I’ve been married for two years, and we’re done. I “could” have another, but I’m turning 40 next month, the pregnancy was hell, the years before the pregnancy were their own hell for other reasons, and I’m f—ing exhausted. I am finally able to take my foot off the accelerator, which is good for me, my husband, our marriage, and our baby. The pressure to crap out more kids started last winter and has hit fever pitch.
I have had to explain to people that having another baby 4 months after a C-section could literally kill me. “5% risk of a ruptured uterus, high risk of a low birth weight baby, high risk of placental abruption (already had that with my first), high risk of placenta accreta. Please explain to me why you think this is something I should do.” Then people give me the sad bunny rabbit look for destroying their fantasies that you can just pop out babies in rapid succession with no risk to you or the child.
There is no explaining to some people that just because you “can” have more kids (naturally, with interventions, with IVF, etc. etc.) that you SHOULD have more kids. This comes over into some TTC, wherein people just don’t understand that you might be done putting your body, mind, marriage, and bank account through the wringer.
AnonMPH
This discussion is confusing to me to no end, and feels really mean? I am TTC, and each month that you wish to be pregnant but find out after 30 days that you are not is a challenging emotional rollercoaster. Using OPKs, taking my temperature, and charting are small tasks that give me some control over a situation that is otherwise out of my control. People saying that women who use these tools are trying to one up them seem like they are falling into the trap of thinking that others are doing something “at” you. Just because the testing and tracking and charting helps me preserve some semblance of sanity during a time that is frustrating and sometimes heartbreaking doesn’t mean I’m doing anything to you. My husband and I definitely want children and will pursue as much assistive reproductive technology as is available to us. That’s our choice though, and if you’re not going to then that’s your choice. For the people who are railing against this purported culture, has it ever taken you more than 2 months to get pregnant? If you had any idea how it feels to get your period month after month when you don’t want to, I think you’d shut up about this fake cultural problem.
anon
This is very well said. And hugs to you from an internet stranger.
Anonymous
Well said. Hugs.
Anonymous
You are not using OPKs and charting “at” other people, but there are definitely people out there who do those things “at” others. Same with BFing, and BLW, and SAHMs. Some people make these choices because they are best for their families. Then there is my relative who very pointedly tells me she’s so blessed because her husband makes lots of money and she can be a SAHM, and she couldn’t imagine sending her precious child to day care. Right in front of my kid who went to day care. She is definitely SAHM’ing “at” other people.
Anon
Prime example of the martyrdom complex right here. The underlying assumption is that the commenter deserves to be a mom and that nature owes it to her somehow. She is soliciting sympathy from others here (and got it). This performativeness happens a lot around here, on a fashion blog.
Anon
Anon at 5:59, what a weird, mean, and un-empathetic take on this. Being sad at struggling to become pregnant is not “performative” and is not “soliciting sympathy.” It’s an emotion – sadness (or frustration, or anger, etc.). People are not robots. People have feelings and sometimes want to talk about their experiences – it’s human. Further, it is entirely natural for a person with a uterus to want to become pregnant, and it is heartless to act like there is something wrong with a person for wanting to become pregnant. [Side note- I do not mean to say that there aren’t other entirely valid/positive/fulfilling ways of becoming a parent/mother (or not, if you don’t want to be!)].
Anon
Also fashion blog? Why don’t you rail on the people talking about work or COVID or whatever else if this is just a fashion blog? We are all here for the variety and quality of the comments. If you only want to talk fashion, then collapse all the non-fashion thread (which is most of them).
Calculus redo?
I want to learn Calculus but I am not sure where to start. I was unfortunate to have poor teachers for this subject in University, and now as an adult I want to learn for application purposes e.g. modelling especialy combined with programming languages such as Python or R. I know there are a ton of MOOCs on this subject. Is it better to choose something that goes straight into applications or does a lot of theory. In uni the lecturers I had focused on theory and proofs and ultimately I got lost and disinterested because I could not understand why we were learning any of it i.e. what is the real world use of all that stuff? I am now many years out of school but picking some new skills since I have some free time. If you have suggestions or tips would love to hear them. Thank you.
Anon
I love her to pieces, but I would start with Danica McKellar’s books for girls for more basic math and see if your basics are solid and then work up from there. She has a great FB/IG and probably twitter presence and a website. Before I became a quant, I heard her on NPR and a light went off in my head that math is such a gift. I have a phenomenal teacher in a basic public school in middle school and now I can look back and see how life-changing that was.
Also, I like ViHart on YouTube — even my kids love watching her movies about math things.
Finally, I was a philosophy major but had always aced programming courses and symbolic logic was a helpful class for thinking through how to write code (if/and, if/not, and boolian logic).
Anonymous
Your desire not to understand “theory and proofs” and to focus on “applications” is a red flag that modeling is not for you. I am an applied researcher. It is absolutely vital for me to understand the math and the assumptions underlying a model. If the assumptions are violated, my results will be misleading. If policy or business decisions are made on the basis of a faulty model, actual people in the real world will be harmed. A MOOC is not going to teach you how to ensure that assumptions are not violated, and it’s not going to teach you how to interpret the results of a model.
A smart, motivated person can teach herself the data wrangling part of data science, and you could refresh your calculus knowledge with a MOOC. But it’s a long way from first-semester calculus to being able to build and interpret sophisticated models. Like a master’s degree or a PhD from a reputable program with actual instructor interaction.
Curious
Hard disagree about “theory”. There’s a difference between deriving what integrals mean from the continuity of the real number space and tying your model’s mathematical shape to underlying assumptions about how the world works. I heard OP being concerned about the former.
I do agree there’s more math to be learned for modeling than just univariate differential calculus :)
Anonymous
Maybe I am an outlier, but I don’t believe you can truly grasp a mathematical concept without understanding the derivation. With a good instructor, that shouldn’t be boring at all.
Curious
I wonder if we are starting from different levels of abstraction? Like I get that you need to understand what a limit is and how tiny little changes accumulate to understand calculus, but I don’t think you need to understand continuity of the real number system. But you also are probably better at math than me :)
anon at 10:09
No, I think you are better at math than me! My read was that OP is defining “theory” as understanding limits, etc. She doesn’t want to understand how any of it works, she just wants to memorize formulas and plug and chug. That’s what I’m pushing back against.
Maybe I am just a weirdo. I was the only one in my introductory econometrics class who found it useful when the instructor derived stuff. Everyone else complained “this is supposed to be an applied program!”
Curious
Oh gosh that sounds awful. I think we are aligned.
Anon
I’m also a person who understands it better when she takes the time to go through the derivation. I stopped math after complex analysis, FWIW.
Calculus redo?
OP here: I don’t know why you interpreted my comment about proofs and theory as a “desire not to understand”. At the time I was interested in the subject however most times no explanations were given for any of the proofs, we were simply instructed to take notes and read them at home. This made it hard to learn.
I have a PhD in the sciences from a US university. I get your point about the underlying assumptions of a model, in my research I don’t do any modelling, but have had to interact with people that do. Hence my interest in picking up these skills even if I may not be the one doing the actual modelling.
Anonymous
+1 theory is so important I get the most offensively incorrect models from people who don’t understand WHY they’re doing the math and what it means.
Curious
I would just learn the practical methods. We all took our math in the engineering department for the same reason you described. Very few of us had adequate preparation for proof-based teaching, and the math department’s classes were impossible. 10 years later, I still don’t regret it.
Anon
I don’t have super specific advice, but based on what you say I’d try to find a course that does as much application as possible. I had a fabulous AP Calculus teacher in high school and I was so glad I took it there instead of in college where the teaching would been much worse (and faster paced- I had a whole year to learn it instead of a semester, which I think really helped). It also really helped that I was taking physics at the time and even though high school physics wasn’t calculus based, the two topics were so clearly intertwined, I think that a calculus class designed to teach both would be great, especially if it directly ties to any of the modelling applications you’re interested in.
Anon
If you have the scheduling flexibility to go to a class, sign up at your local community college. I didn’t take calc until I was nearly 40. If your trig/algebra is rusty, I recommend either taking a class to knock the rust off or if you’re really disciplined, dedicate some time to plowing through algebra and trig in Khan academy.
Calculus I isn’t a hard course, conceptually. Where students hit a wall is their foundations in algebra and trig. The chain rule will trip you up a little bit at first, and derivatives are a bit of a grab bag of rules that you just have to memorize, but those are the only actual calculus things that trip people up. The rest is algebra.
Calculus redo?
Thanks for this tip, I really enjoyed algebra and trig but have not used them in years. Will start by brushing up from there.
Anon
I jumped back in with a class in trig before taking calc, which exercised my rusty algebra muscles (with Khan academy to help the stuff I really blanked on). My really applying myself in that class made Calc I an easy A… and it intuitively made sense.
Calc 2 is a bear no matter what – it’s really where a lot of things come together, and integrals require a bit different and larger playbook. Again, being comfortable in your algebra skin means you can concentrate on the calculus.
Anon
With COVID, your local community college classes may be online and asynchronous too (more similar to a MOOC) but with a small class size and an engaged instructor. I took Calc at a community college and loved it. I ended up doing graduate level statistics (which is where I learned modeling).
anon
I found Khan Academy really useful for math learning as an adult, maybe give that a shot.
Anon
If you want to return to the theory, Spivak’s Calculus is a classic text that starts with number theory and builds from there. I’ve seen it recommended for people who want to pick up calculus again after taking it in school. Professors are also always uploading copies of it to their university sites, so you’ll probably find one if you search.
Coach Laura
I love the “Painless” series, now published by Barrons written by Lynette Long PhD. Painless Algebra taught my son algebra when he was young and we loved the series. There’s Painless Geometry and a few others. They had a Painless Calculus but the new version is coming out in June and amazon doesn’t list the current version but you may be able to get it used online somewhere else or at the library.
Anon
I have reached the part of dog walking during the pandemic where I am actively making up stories about how this business or this family must be laundering $ (who has 5 new suburbans and range rovers and a new beach house and no family $ and didn’t successfully flip game stop? who hires a decorator and opens a bespoke jewelry store and art advisory during a pandemic in an out-of-the-way spot?). It’s like the dog goes out a lot, has a set route, moves slowly, and over a year I feel like I am living my own mix of Rear Window mixed with Ozark.
Anonymous
Eh, whatever. Every time we walk the dog my husband asks me how people in our neighborhood could possibly afford a Porsche or home renovations. I am constantly explaining that we could also technically “afford” those things, it’s just that we are plowing $$$ into retirement and college savings and don’t like debt.
Cat
yeah same. We could definitely be making multiple $$$ lease payments as well as a second mortgage if we were willing to live paycheck-to-paycheck. But I get the desire to be nosy and wonder how it is people are financing their lives!
Vicky Austin
“Afford” is such a malleable word!
Pompom
This is the exact conversation me and DH have, too. Like, we have Porsche money, but it’s for later…and for, like, food and clothing and shelter when we’re retired. So back into my 11 year old Camry I get, quite happily.
AnonATL
There is a G class Mercedes that drives through our neighborhood regularly. I always wonder about it. We live in a nice enough middle class suburban neighborhood, but not $150k car kind of place.
My husband gets tired of my stories about things I notice on walks. Like oh such and such house around the corner got a new roof today or it looks like that brick house is getting a kitchen remodel.
These are the things that entertain me now…
Anon
Same! Like make do on a 36″ stove (came with house; my dad is from a family of 6 that had a 30″ stove that only 3 burners worked on) but apparently no one else can survive without a 48″ stove (always visible from the window; keep the red knobs so the world knows it is a Wolf). Do these people even cook? I am amazed at what is basic b*tch for my area.
Also, I did not know that when people hire a person to do their interiors, it’s not like they look and measure and give you a shopping list but more like you give them 50K-100K and they source and place it all from their vendors / warehouse. Like to me, I just can’t imagine that; so much $$$.
And I hear you on the G-wagon. I’ve seen some with undergrad parking stickers on them (mind blown).
The list goes on. I feel like I live in a place where I must be the only person who has $ from a job (and my family is very poor and not-college by background) funding their life and must just walk around with my jaw hanging down.
Anon
I have a 30” stove! And I cook all the time. I am know as the good cook in both my family and my friend groups. I do not feel deprived at all.
Anon
There is a gentleman in my neighborhood of $175-200,000 cars who has an Acura NSX. Beautiful car. He is a doctor at the nearby hospital and his house is the original house in the neighborhood, from which all the land is subdivided, but it’s still no mansion. I always wave when he’s out and resist the temptation to offer to car-sit if he ever goes out of town :-)
Anon
Oh geez… that should have been $175-200,000 HOUSES. He’s the only one with a $175,000 car and boy is it gorgeous. I don’t even feel jealous – I just like to admire it when I see him out and about.
Anon
Dude down the street got a Porsche (why? street is littered with speed bumps) and growls around on it all day as if he wants us to notice him in it. And yet, people a few houses down drive normal cars and send two kids to boarding school, which is like buying 1.5 Porsches a year, but more of a whisper than a look-at-me (and they don’t have giant Exeter or Groton or whatever stickers all over their cars or are always in school gear).
Lilau
My uncle is that guy. He lives in a perfectly lovely neighborhood in a very not fancy zip code near the train station. His wife is a “station girl” so they’re never leaving. (Is this an east coast/Long Island thing? Where your identity is completely tied to what small part of a town you live in? Because it’s a thing here.)
He’s an insurance executive who’s done well. He has more luxury cars than I have pairs of shoes. I’m sure the neighbors think he’s bonkers.
A
Ha, me too
I have always said as the dog walker, no one notices you but you can see everything in the ‘hood
Also, I don’t get how my husband doesn’t notice the same things?? It amuses me to no end
Senior Attorney
Well, we’re doing some remodeling with the money we would normally have spent on vacations. So there’s that.
A.
Us too! But you can’t see the projects from the street, just that we’ve had trucks/a dumpster in the driveway forever.
anonshmanon
Yesterday I saw two headlines side by side on my twitter feed: billionaires have increased their wealth by 3.7 trillion last year, and workers have lost 3.9 trillion last year. There is no reason not to open art advisory and jewelry businesses now. While I am not a billionaire, my income has been stable and spending is down, so I’ve gotten richer, too.
Airplane.
This sounds fun, I just listen to podcasts on my dog walks. Yours sounds much more imaginative and like my childhood hero Harriet the Spy.
Anon
Yes! Harriet the Spy. That is what it feels like. Like moving slowly through the same ‘hood multiple times a day is like being on a stakeout or some weird spinoff of The Americans. Nothing gets past dog walkers, I have a feeling. Like if the people on either side of Jesse Pinkman had had dogs, Breaking Bad would only have been one season.
Anone
Ha ha, love it
anne-on
Ha, at some point last spring I seriously pondered leaving notes in people’s mailboxes telling them how much I was enjoying their gardens/landscaping efforts on my daily walks. Seriously – noticing which flowers were blooming, the birds hopping around (first robin!) was a big event then/now in a way that surprised me in how much joy it brought me.
Anon
Right? Like recently there has been a lot of dog poop on sidewalks on two blocks, so IDK if we have a new dog, kids starting to walk dogs, a stray or what. But it was NOT like that before and it gets nasty on wet days, so I am hoping that it will resolve or vanish. But it is like SCANNING . . . ANOMALITY IS NOTED . . . SCANNING . . .
What I need is a dog-walking buddy, but I guess that won’t happen in a pandemic.
anon
I take a lot of pride in keeping up our landscaping and gardens. If someone left me that note, it would make my day/week/month/year.
Senior Attorney
Agree! You should do it!
anonypotamus
My mom has been doing this sometimes for houses she sees on her daily walks in the neighborhood. She usually leaves her email address and has made quite a few pen pal neighbor friends that way that she otherwise would not have ever met. I’m sure they would love to hear that you enjoy their yard/flowers/christmas decor, etc.
Anon
Someone did that to me once and it made my day/month/year. Do it!!
Pay Cuts - Did you get your $ back?
For those of you who experienced a temporary pay reduction during the first round of the pandemic, did your firm or company end up repaying all or part of it?
My firm undertook a rather serious pay cut (more than 25%) for approximately 5 months, but the firm seems to have recovered. The information has been a bit unclear, beyond statements that we are in great/better shape. I’m curious to know if you got all or part of it back. I understand the need to shore up cash reserves during this time… but if the firm’s finances have recovered, shouldn’t associates get at least a part of that pay cut back?
I would also be interested in thoughts on how much financial disclosure you get at your firm (mid-size). I think it’s reasonable at least to get more information (than the vague statements so far) on the firm’s financial outlook given the cuts that had to be made…
Anon
My husband took a 25% paycut at the beginning of the pandemic, and the company has since paid it back. His company has done fairly well since then and has given other smaller financial bonuses/incentives to the employees to make up for the fact that they took a temporary cut.
Cat
My husband had to take a 10% pay cut for 6 months. We (and his coworkers) were just… glad when it was lifted. No one that I know is expecting retroactive true-ups.
Anonymous
My law firm (amlaw 100) paid us back after 6 months-ish of a pay cut. I think they’ve done a pretty good job all along with pandemic stuff, and really appreciated it.
Anonanonanon
Same.
Anon
We have an indefinite pay cut (1 year minimum, possibly longer), 0% chance of repayment. I’m in local government.
It was a small pay cut, but we’re already paid poorly and we all busted our butts working on the pandemic.
Anon
I work at a large (80k employees), international, publicly-traded company that does a lot of healthcare-related business. In March the entire company took a pay cut. 5%-25% depending on your level (upper management got a higher %). Our merit raises were also held. Luckily we had just gotten out bonuses. This was based on what was happening to our business in China. As things evolved and we adapted we actually grew at a faster than anticipated rate. After a few months, they rescinded the pay cut and started the merit raises and this summer we got back pay for both. Then at one point, we got a $500-1000 based on our results. In December everyone received an extra 2 weeks of pay because of our overall results. Our upper management (CEO) has been very transparent throughout.
Anonymous
My firm restored salaries back to pre-cut levels (mostly 10% cuts) and did pay back some of what had been cut (it wasn’t standard, so some got all back, others did not)
Back to the office
For those of you who had been working from home but have returned to the office, has your firm or company changed its policies about being in the office? We will be returning but management has indicated they are considering hybrid options (hopefully some flexibility to telecommute – before the pandemic telecommuting was not allowed). I was curious about what others are doing…
Anon
Yes, I actually just started a new job and in my contract it states that when we eventually go back to the office we will continue to work from home part-time because it’s been so popular with everyone.
Any
Can we talk biglaw salaries for a minute? Specifically when you are no longer on the lockstep scale based on class year but don’t have enough years to be up for partner yet. Did you still get some sort of yearly raise? did your billing rate continue to increase?
NYC
How does that happen? The scale typically goes to 8th or 9th year, which is when most associates in biglaw are eligible for partner.
anon
Many biglaw firms have extended the partnership track to ten or eleven (or more!) years without updating the scale. Or they haven’t formally extended the track but it’s unheard of for someone with the minimum years of seniority to make it.
Anon
This shirt is beautiful and 100% up my alley.
Kelsey
I am in my 40s and I have a wiggly adult tooth that’s not painful but probably not going to get better. It is wiggly because of bone reabsorption around the base of it plus short roots (bad genes). My dentist says that I’ll need to extract it and get a implant, but I can wait for awhile. anyone have any experience with a similar situation? Did yo wait and see or just go ahead with the extraction? It’s one of my bottom molars.
pugsnbourbon
I have crappy teeth and haven’t found that “wait and see” gets me anything other than more hassle. :(
Senior Attorney
Yup. Just pick a convenient time and git ‘er done.
Anon
I got a single tooth implant in the early aughts, and it was a long process. First the tooth was removed and the area allowed to heal for a few months. Then the titanium post was placed, and allowed to heal for a few months with a temporary glued-on cap. Then the final porcelain cap was placed. Overall it took about 14-16 months, though some of that was scheduling issues due to my being away at college.
I suggest researching the types of implant and post your dentist wants to use. There is some controversy regarding the use of hydroxyapatite coatings, and some people claim the screw-on type are superior to press-fit.
The implant I got is no longer used due to bad reviews and early failures, something to do with the angle and size of the base making it so the bone doesn’t want to adhere to it. Knock on wood, mine is holding up, but I have had a LOT of gum tissue loss around it. You can see the post below the porcelain now.
The tooth I lost was the front center tooth on the bottom. In hindsight, I would probably have been better off to skip the implant and just get braces to pull the remaining teeth together. My bite is already so wonky that the teeth around the implant are strangely worn, while the implant does not wear and sits much higher. Since yours is a molar, be aware that grinding can really mess up your natural teeth. Consider sleeping in night guards if that’s an issue for you.
Anon
I live in the sad Land of Reabsorption. My dentist tells me that it is 100% nothing to do with my dental hygiene, so at least I don’t blame myself. He is an excellent dentist, teaches at the dental school, delivers lectures worldwide, and I trust him. I am have now had the same issue with 4 teeth and have 4 implants. It costs an absolute fortune, and the percentage paid by dental insurance is small. You have all of the commiseration from me.
Anon
I live in this land, too. It’s so expensive. OP: I’m not a dentist, and please talk to yours about this instead of relying on this: My dentists and surgeons have advised that when a tooth is in this state, bone quality deteriorates over time, which eventually may make it harder for an implant to “succeed.” Just another point for you to consider. There may be a cost to waiting. However, at the same time, for back molars, people sometimes don’t bother getting the implant after extraction because the gap is not noticeable and doesn’t bother them. Good luck!
franklina
So I have some accounts in collections. Let us leave aside the ‘why’ of that. I sent letters to the last-known holders at the beginning of December. Basically, it said, ‘please send me something that says you’re allowed to collect on this, here’s a potential payment plan, either agree or send me something else.’ All I’ve gotten back is a letter from Company A saying ‘we don’t own this, ask Company B’ and a letter from Company B saying ‘we don’t own this, ask Company A’ (in reference to the same account.)
So I’ll have to send another round out. I really, really, want a paper trail. Do I try generic emails/contact forms? Do I have to call and get an email? Any other tactics? Help me help you by telling me how to pay you, people! (Also, is there any way to find out if a debt has been forgiven/cancelled– the thing where you have to report to the IRS– without waiting for the form to come in the mail?)
I also got a weird mailer from a random credit-saving-company (I don’t know what you call them) saying ‘hey! someone’s suing you! give us money and we’ll be a middle man!’ which I ignored. Instead I went into our case search (it’s public) and figured out who it was– companies I’d sent letters to in December– and emailed them to request more information. Annoying.
(I’m trying to get my sh^t together in a big way, if we ever get social lives again I’d like to be able to date and marry and have kids before 40, plus going back to school for an advanced degree.)
No Face
I would keep the letters stating that they do not own the debt. Maybe send copies to the credit bureaus to remove them from your credit report. Then I would be done. I would not hound down companies to pay them money that they said I don’t owe them.
anon
Hey there,
First of all, please do not shame yourself. Second of all, I totally understand where you are coming from. I would look at your credit report and see who last reported the debt. If no one has, just wait it out. Save money for settlements (the more you can offer up front, the more you are likely to achieve a good resolution). It’s unlikely anyone has “forgiven” the debt without letting you know. If anything, they’ve written it off and then sold it for pennies on the dollar to a debt purchasing firm. In that case, the debt buyer owns the debt and you should be able to negotiate a ton because they are not collecting on a contingency or fee % basis from the original owner. Also, the more you contact these people, the longer you’re putting off any Statute of Limitations they have on filing any suits. Waiting it out, unless it’s reported on your credit file, is a smart decision. They likely wouldn’t file until they’ve contacted you to attempt to collect. What’s likely happened is that the debt was removed from the collections firm by the owner of the debt and resold to a debt purchases for pennies on the dollar (as mentioned above) and the debt hasn’t been fully integrated into their systems yet. I would honestly wait until they contact you and then you can set about the whole paper trail thing. Never agree to anything without getting it in writing and verifying the debt. Whatever the mailer is, toss it. It’s junk. If you’re to be sued, you’ll receive a complaint and summons. You’ll get through this. It feels so good when you pay even just the smallest one off. I also recommend working with The Financial Gym. They’ll be able to help you manage both debt payoff and saving at the same time. They’ve helped me a ton!
No Face
This is sound advice.
Consumer Atty
write them what is called a debt validation letter. tell them you dispute the debt & under the provisions of the Fair Dent Collection Practices Act, you are requesting that they validate the debt. If they don‘t, which is more than likely, you are good.
fallen
Does anyone else feel like now w/the pandemic, work is such a constant thing? I feel like I am constantly working. I think a big part of the issue is that I have a really hard time letting things sit on my to-do list (even if there’s no deadline), so I feel like it’s easy to let work slip into the weekends and nights when it doesn’t need to be that way
Anonymous
No, but only because I maintain my boundaries even when other people in my office do not. A lot of people there are doing what you describe – letting work creep into the weekend, “I’ll just do it at 9 pm since I’m not doing anything anyway,” and things like that. They can do whatever they want, but my work-life balance is extremely important to me and I close my laptop on the dot every day and do not check email or work on weekends at all.
Anon
Ugh, THIS. There are people I work with who are very clearly using work as a way to avoid being alone with themselves or their families…
Anon
+1. I also feel like this every time one of my coworkers jokes about not taking days off right now because “what would they do but work anyway”. Sorry, but I’ll take those days off. Even if it just means I get to sleep in, binge watch more TV, take a rare daytime hike, whatever. It’s not working.
fallen, can you reevaluate where in your house you work? I realize this will not be possible for the majority, but I work in our basement. I don’t love the atmosphere, but the big benefit is once I’m done for the day I’m really done b/c I just don’t happen to go in my basement when I’m not working & see my laptop sitting there tempting me to do just one more thing like it does the rare times I work in our main living area.
anon
No. Having a quit time is pretty necessary for my sanity right now. I could easily work longer hours, but I just don’t.
franklina
Yes, there’s no good boundaries between the times or places. And I’m definitely guilty of time gaps here or there that I end up covering on “non work hours”
Booties
Attention poster whose Nanny recently became pregnant, but didn’t have health insurance….. Biden just re-opened the Obamacare / ACA marketplace. She can sign up for insurance now. No questions asked. Open to all.
She may need some help navigating the choices, especially if she has a specific doctor/hospital she wants to keep, PPO vs HMO etc…. And in general, a high deductible plan (Bronze) has really high deductibles and will be expensive in the long run (all doctor visits/blood tests/hospitalization etc…) If her income is very low, she might qualify for a cost sharing subsidy (lower deductible and help with co-insurance payments) in a Silver plan that might be more expensive per month, but will wind up being cheaper in the long run if she needs a lot of care.
Unfortunately, in many states the Obamacare choices are limited. In my area, there are very few companies offering PPO plans. And not a single plan is accepted by the “good” hospitals in my area. So when I signed up last year, I lost my preferred hospital and doctors. Also, the cheaper plans (maybe all plans?) have really terrible drug coverage. Like, generic drugs might have a reasonable price, but if I need a name brand drug or a non-preferred generic, I have to pay 50% of the cost. Every state is different, every plan is different….
Motivation
Lots of commenters lately on feeling completely unmotivated. Article in Korn Ferry today about how to motivate yourself in this Covid winter – may be helpful for someone. Will link in comments.
Horse Crazy
My partner was recently diagnosed with very high cholesterol, and we are shifting to eating a mostly seafood and plant-based diet. I’ve been trying to do this for a while anyway, and I’m a pretty capable home cook, so I have lots of fish recipes and some vegetarian recipes in my repertoire, but I’m always looking for more. What are your favorite plant based recipes, especially ones that can fill up a hungry man who does physical labor all day?
anne-on
I really like this one – very cozy, and super super easy.
https://smittenkitchen.com/2013/07/one-pan-farro-with-tomatoes/
I HATE quinoa, so farro is my main course grain of choice. Does he have a preference? I find it easier to build out meals when I know what will/won’t be tolerated (in my house chickpeas are a yes, white beans are a no, Farro>Quinoa, and Freekeh is yummy too!).
anan
I love this recipe too! It is so easy and flexible for add ins. We throw in a can or two of beans (either cannelloni or chick peas), and sometimes a bunch of spinach or other greens towards the end.
Flats Only
Can you make sure the dishes you already make include extra sources of protein besides fish (beans, lentils, egg whites, etc.), and up the portion sizes, especially for carbs? My hungry hungry hubby also does physical labor all day. I cook the same things I used to, but increased the portion sizes so that he’s filled up. A man who does physical works needs way more food than a “health conscious” woman. Instead of a 2-egg-white omelet with vegetables in the morning make it 4 egg whites on a bagel with a slice of low fat cheese.
Anon
Not a recipe, but as a long time vegetarian, my main tip for people who find veggie meals leave them hungry is to make sure you include enough healthy fat- olive oil, avocado, nuts, etc. make a big difference in making sure I feel full, much more than protein. I like dishes with peanut sauce, or add some extra nuts on top, add avocado to Mexican dishes or sandwiches, etc.
Anon
Also, pesto makes a nice fatty sauce, sandwich spread or dressing. I often make a vegan pesto with arugula, walnuts, olive oil, and nutritional yeast, but lots of herb and nut combos work and would be good on fish or white beans or chickpeas with pasta and veggies.
Anon
Wait! How is pesto (olive oil, basil, pine nuts) not vegan?
Anon
Pesto usually has parmesan cheese in it. I just sub nutritional yeast for the parmesan, but you could probably omit it or just use the cheese and have it not be vegan. Nutritional yeast sounds scary, but it just means it’s not the kind of yeast you use to make bread. It adds the same umami flavor that parmesan does so it’s a good substitute to add a little more depth to the herbs and nuts (along with garlic and salt). I also like cilantro and walnuts and obviously the classic basil and pine nuts. Walnuts are just cheaper than pine nuts and since I don’t currently have any basil growing at home, I can more reliably buy good arugula than good basil. All of it freezes well in ice cube trays so I always have some on hand to add to a sandwich or pizza or whatever.
Mal
Usually pesto has cheese.
Anonymous
Pesto often has Parmesan in it!
Booties
That’s great that you are doing this! It will help.
But don’t be hard on yourselves if his cholesterol is still quite high. Much of this is determined by genetics, especially if he has very high cholesterol. He will likely needs meds soon to get it under control. And that’s ok.
Horse Crazy
Yeah, we think it’s probably genetic, and he is going to get meds. But we also figure it can’t hurt us or the planet to be a little more plant-based :)
Anonymous
My DH is a LEO and also vegan, man needs a lot of food. Some of our staple recipes:
– lentil or chickpea Indian curry
– thai tofu curry
– tofu fried rice/stir fry
– pasta of all sorts, gnocchi, lasagna etc
– bean burritos/tacos/enchiladas/tostadas
– lentil sloppy Joe’s
– bean burgers
– falafel wraps
Anon
At first, I wondered what his zodiac sign had to do with his appetite. Then I hardened back to my criminal law days: law enforcement officer.
amberwitch
Thanks for translating:) I thought the same (astrology and appetite sounds like the name of a blog)
Anon
Black beans and rice (brown rice is my choice) with a sautéed mild fish filet. Cook the fish simply and easily with a little salt and a generous amount of black pepper and squeeze a lime wedge over it when it’s done. Extras or garnishes if desired: avocado slices, mango slices, salsa, thin slices of jalapeño, coarsely chopped cilantro. Sometimes I go the from scratch route on black beans and sometimes I just open a can, drain it, and heat them with a little bit of salsa and a pinch of cumin mixed in.
Mal
This is a great veggie chili I’ve made multiple times: https://pickyeaterblog.com/the-best-vegetarian-chili-ever/
anan
We are the same- Husband has high cholesterol so we are also cutting back on meat and dairy. We eat a lot of Indian food (Fresh India by Meera Sodha is a recent obsession). Also we eat a lot of tofu mostly stir fry, but I also make a “ground beef” tofu crumble and use that to replace meat in Banh Mi bowls.
anan
Also wanted to add- it took a couple weeks for my husband (big midwestern meat and potatoes bred guy) to adjust to less meat in our diet. The first few weeks he was always hungry after dinner, but now he is very sated on smaller meatless meals, and even periodically eating meat makes him feel “gross.” He does have a desk job, so it might not be the same for your active husband, but I do think there is a period of adjustment for your body to recalibrate it’s expectation of what “full” feels like.
Anon
Is there any chance it’s not diet-based high cholesterol? If you have the gene for it, diet may not help much and you may really need a statin. Half of our family has the gene and while a spouse may eat the exact same or worse, often their cholesterol is <180 and the other person's is shockingly high. Same food. Same table.
Anon
OP’s question was nothing about her husband’s diagnosis; just recipe recommendations. Why must you go and assume something completely different?
Horse Crazy
There definitely is a good chance it’s not just diet based, but we figure it’s healthier for us and the planet to be more plant-based anyway :)
anon
So I’ve come to the realization that I am terrible about letting myself have fun. How do I fix this? Even something as simple as watching a TV show the moment I feel like it, I put off until a more convenient time that never comes. It’s gotten worse after becoming a parent, but if I’m honest about it, it’s not really my husband or kids’ fault. I have been like this my entire adult life to some extent. A few examples:
– I want to watch trash TV. But this chore needs to be done, this kid wants to spend time with me, DH doesn’t like this show.
– Hmm, I’d like to read this book. But what if I don’t like it and I’ve wasted my precious, limited free time? Also, my book-reading time cuts into the time I could be doing other things.
– A latte sounds really good right now. But it’s $5-6, I could make something at home, and I don’t want to have to explain why I left the house just to get a coffee. (To be clear, my DH wouldn’t care, but it would turn into a bunch of commentary from the peanut gallery that kills the enjoyment and/or kids asking for treats of their own.)
– I’m in the mood to listen to MY music. But if I turn it on, I will have three people chiming in, “What are you listening to? How long do we have to listen to this?”
– Going kayaking sounds fun right now. But it’ll take me 20 minutes to load up the boat, plus then I have to drive there and unload, and is it really worth all that effort on a weeknight?!
– I’d really like to listen to a podcast while I’m doing laundry. But if I put in my earbuds, I will be interrupted, so is it even worth it?
HOW DO I STOP DOING THIS TO MYSELF? I am pragmatic to a fault. A counselor once told me that it didn’t seem like I reserved a lot of room for fun. I rolled my eyes at the time, but now that I’m home all the time, I’m really seeing it and thinking it’s a problem.
Anonymous
You need to go start reading the blog The Happy Talent. She has tons of great posts about making the most of the time you have, prioritizing adventures, developing skills to do things like traveling alone, becoming more playful as an adult, and much more. It REALLY helped me a few years ago and it sounds like the perfect blog for you. Start with this post: http://www.thehappytalent.com/blog/everythings-always-worth-it-reclaiming-the-fifteen-minutes
anon
Thank you — this sounds like a good place to start.
Happy Brain
You’re not alone; I’m this way too. The rationalizations I can come up with for not just sitting and watching an hour of TV; you’d think I was considering doing something evil.
I was listening to Terry Gross’s interview with Sanjay Gupta. He said something along the lines of, your brain’s reason for being is first, to keep you alive, but after that to make you happy, to bring you as an individual joy. (You can find the transcript by searching Sanjay Gupta happy brain.) That struck a chord with me.
Following this thread with interest.
Anon
Set aside an hour a few days a week where you give yourself permission to do whatever you want. Chores/kids/whatever will always be there and you’ll never have time for fun if you put it off until everything is done. Instead, tell yourself that you’re taking 1 hour to do xyz and that when that hour is up, you’ll go back to your responsibilities
Anonymous
In my observation, the feeling that having fun is too much work/too expensive/not worthwhile is usually a sign of depression.
BeenThatGuy
Have you thought about reading/watching/listening to Brene Brown? She has very interesting theories on what she refers to as “thwarting joy”. Some of the things you mention could point to this behavior.
Anonymous
Re. lattes, I solved this by buying an espresso machine and teaching my kid to use it. If I make myself a latte she still wants one, but on the other hand sometimes she will make them both herself.
pugsnbourbon
Second to mowing the lawn, this is the strongest argument for having children.
TK
Oh, I laughed out loud at this comment! And have started to research machines and kid latte teaching videos
Anon
A lot of this seems like the people around you need to learn to shut up, stop complaining, and let you do you every once in a while.
Anon
+1
And your husband needs to respect your boundaries when you need me time.
Mal
Maybe one small thing you could do it practice giving into your whims…the latte, the book. Sounds like to fear what MIGHT happen or how you might feel after you do it. Maybe once you try these things a few times, you’ll figure out that the consequences you feared didn’t happen, or weren’t as bad as you thought hey would be. Exposure therapy, in essence. For example, I used to get really nervous talking on the phone when I was younger. After having to do it for work I got over my perceived fears. If mean, if you sit down, read a few pages and find them boring, you can pick up another book!
Also, give yourself permission to tell family that your busy doing a thing for you, and to give you time to yourself!
CPA Lady
I straight up tell my family “I’m allowed to have fun/have friends/have a life too” if they start complaining about me taking time or doing something for myself. I don’t want my daughter to learn that fathers and children get to do what they want, but moms aren’t allowed to be fully human. I’m not on this earth to be everyone’s maid and make sure everyone else is happy all the time at the detriment of myself. I’m here to be kind to people, get a few things done, and enjoy myself as much as I can. The end.
It’s not all or nothing. Just start small. Go get that coffee and tell everyone to shut it if they have a problem with it. Just try the kayaking thing once or twice. Listen to the podcast. There’s a pause button on your earbuds and you can hit it if someone interrupts you. Or you can tell them to go away and leave you alone because you’re listening to a podcast and you want to concentrate. It’s going to feel weird at first, but it’s worth doing. Children benefit from a happy mother. Also if you start reading a book and you aren’t enjoying it, you don’t have to finish it. There’s not a law. The book police are not coming to lock you up for not finishing a boring book. You can always have a make up a rule for yourself like if you’re not into it by three chapters in you can quit reading.
anonshmanon
This is what I was going to say, too. OP, you seem to be very motivated by responsibility. You always find something that seems more important than indulging. But if you are teaching your kids a pattern of mom’s interests always come last’, there is a high chance that they will approach adult life the same way. You can try to reframe it in your head as ‘it’s good for the kids to learn that moms/adults are complete humans with interests of their own besides taking care of the kids and the house’ and then ‘having fun’ turns into a teachable moment.
anon
I know; you’re both absolutely right. And I completely agree in theory but struggle putting it into practice.
anonshmanon
practice is the key word here! It’s not any easier than learning any new habit! The first few times when the kids complain about your music choice, it’ll be difficult to ignore them. But it gets better!!
anon
Not OP but thank you for this. I needed to read this
Anon
Where does everyone put clothes that have been worn, but aren’t dirty? Growing up I had a chair in my room that collected such items. Now as an adult, there is no such spot. Asking because my husband refuses to put these clothing items into the laundry hamper, because they’re not dirty, but also won’t put them back in the closet/dresser because they’re not clean. So they are on the floor constantly, and it drives me insane. Looking for a compromise solution, somewhere he can put these items that is not the floor.
franklina
Separate section of closet, extendable over-the-door rack, freestanding clothes rack. Somewhere it can air for a bit.
Lily
Hooks on the back of the bathroom or bedroom door (or in a walk-in closet if you have one)? Put a chair or clothes horse or bench in your bedroom for this purpose?
Anonymous
We call these half-dirties. If you don’t have space to designate just for them, hang them over the edge of the hamper so they don’t fall in with the dirty clothes and get stinky.
No Face
Hooks galore!
Anon
Getting a chair is the easiest solution honestly. People on this board have complicated solutions for themselves involving different drawers, hangers turned a certain way, etc, but it’s unlikely your husband will adopt and adhere to one of these methods if he’s happy with the floor.
Senior Attorney
Hooks are great. Or if he wants to be fancy, get him a valet stand.
Anon
When I was growing up, my dad had a piece of furniture called a “valet” that was exactly for this. I would assume these still exist?
Anon
I feel like we have these posts a lot and they always amuse me. If I wear something and don’t think it’s dirty enough to need laundering, it goes back folded in my drawers or hung in the closet like everything else. If it’s too dirty for that to make sense, then it needs laundering. I don’t understand this in between. I didn’t know this was even a debated thing until I saw it on this board.
Anon
Same!
Mal
Sam here! I don’t have room to have an in-between spot either, so back into the closet/drawer it goes!
Shananana
I have a couple hooks on the wall in my closet for this. I also have a friend who uses one of those hanging closet things with the cubbies that works well for her.
Anon
I let them air out and then I put them back in the drawer
Anonymous
In the laundry pile, honestly.
Anon
I keep a separate drawer. Using the closet does not work for me because most of what I rewear is sweaters, and they get ruined on hangers.
Anon
If they’re clean enough not to be laundry, they get put away.
anon
That’s my approach. I like to think I’m a pretty clean person, but maybe this makes me gross? I dunno.
Cat
1. Hooks on the back of the door
2. Separate stretch of closet rod
3. Pretty coat rack in the bedroom (Pottery Barn had several last time I looked)
4. My last preference because it’s still a pile of stuff – get The Chair.
Anonymous
Buy a chair
anon
Get a set of hooks for your room or closet.
anon
My Ikea floor length mirror with a hanging bar behind it. They have several options to choose from.
Anon
I use a short (laundry) basket that fits under the bed.
Anon
On a hanger on a hook in my bedroom or folded on top of a low dresser at the foot of my bed. On Sundays (laundry day) I decide which items really should just go into the laundry or are clean enough to go back into the closet. Only hanging things get put back into the closet. Folded things never get put back into drawers.
I try to wear my hand knit wool socks twice because I don’t have 7 pairs and I have dry, non-sweaty feet. But they all go into the laundry Sunday because I don’t want to run out, like, Tuesday.
Anon
My husband is a federal employee and has to go to an in-person training event six weeks from now. Spouses are highly encouraged to attend. It’s halfway across the country and plane tickets and hotel rooms are provided. I so want to go because I can tack on a visit to relatives I haven’t seen in years, but this is bonkers, right? It’s a week of seminars in a hotel ballroom. I’m sure everyone would be masked, but so far as I know, the attendees won’t be widely vaccinated (vaccinated on whatever their normal priority would be, so assuming the attendees are mostly healthy-ish adults, it’ll be a while yet). Yeah, this is kinda crazy, right?
Anonymous
It’s not “kinda crazy.” It’s full-blown insanity and neither of you should go.
Anonymous
This is great advice. He should quit now and start looking for something better.
Anon
I am on the mid-risk level appetite relative to this board, and even I think this is bonkers.
No Face
Yep, bonkers.
Anonymous
It is bonkers for you or your husband to attend.
I can’t imagine that many federal agencies will be requiring or even permitting employee travel in six weeks when we are hitting another peak from the UK variant of the virus. Most of the feds I work with are still WFH for the foreseeable future. The only federal employee I know who’s traveling right now is with the State Department.
anon
this. My federal agency has all but eliminated travel. No more relocations, even if it means that hiring processes are delayed indefinitely. Not even field trips out of our county any more.
Anon
My husband is also a fed and had been booked for pandemic travel under the Trump administration. The travel was cancelled just days before the event. I think under the current administration this stuff is definitely going to be cancelled.
At the same time though, I recognize there are issues with some certifications that cannot be renewed remotely like firearms training. My husband’s agency allowed a lot of stuff to lapse during the pandemic that’s more optional certification and is qualifying on firearms locally instead of traveling for it.
Anon
somehow get word to Fauci and he will have the event canceled…this literally sounds bananas. also and no offense, but why are my tax dollars paying for a spouse to fly halfway across the country in the middle of a pandemic?
anonshmanon
Interesting question. I can’t think of many cases where I’d be ok with tax dollars going to such a purpose. Maybe military families, ambassadors’ families, first and second family.
AnonATL
Allow me to tell you the story of my husband who is in the Army Reserves and just had to have duty a few weeks ago to do inventory of all things…
It took all of 2 days for someone in his unit to test positive and everyone to be sent home. They are all within short driving distance so no flying all over but still. I was super peeved when he came home to me and the baby with that news and we had to quarantine and get tested.
We are fine and tested negative, but it was so unnecessarily dumb.
Anon
Bonkers.
Anonymous
Crazy. Honestly always crazy. Why would spouses be invited or encouraged to attend? What nonsense agency is this?
Cat
I’m not as risk-averse as many here (i.e., have flown in the past 10 months) and think the idea of an in-person conference is absolutely ridiculous right now. Why the eff are my tax dollars subsidizing this ish?
anon
Definitely crazy. I’m a fed employee and our division is still putting travels off. We have to get permission if we need to travel, and it’s only for “mission critical” things (and in my line of work that’s all outdoors). Training have all been canceled or moved online. I can’t imagine why any training that’s happening in a ballroom can’t be done virtually. It’s just going to be a bunch of powerpoint slides isn’t it?
Anon
B O N K E R S
CBD
Has anyone tried Equilibria CBD and can comment on their experience? I’ve only tried CBD capsules once before (10 mg) from a different brand. I only tried them a few times, but they don’t seem to really help with my anxiety or sleep. I’m considering the Equilibria daily drops, but the products seem kind of pricey (perhaps I’m off base here) when I’m not sure whether they’ll work. The website also suggests that CBD needs to be taken daily in order to start to have an effect, but I was hoping I could take the drops on an as-needed basis, on higher anxiety days. Thoughts?
Anonymous
Yeah it’s expensive snake oil
Anon
If you’re in a state where it’s legal, I’d just go for the real thing. I don’t find CBD to do anything at all.
anon
There was a review done on Wardrobe Oxygen. Link in reply.
anon
Equilibria review
https://www.wardrobeoxygen.com/honest-equilibria-cbd-review-from-a-skeptic/
Anonymous
I’ve read so many blogger Equilibria reviews. They honestly all sound the same to me and follow a pretty clear pattern. Pretty hard for me to take any of them seriously, unfortunately.
go for it
Lunchtime poll: If your office transitioned to WFH is your company offering an internet stipend? If so, if you would share how much $
Anon
We’ve gotten two $500 allowances for home office supplies – whatever we wanted to use the money for – desks, printers, chairs, etc.
Boutique firm doing very, VERY well in pandemic-adjacent field of law.
Anonymous
we are not going to be WFH forever, probably more like 2 days in the office/3 days out post pandemic. But for pandemic times they gave us $400 one time to use on supplies etc. Luckily we had fancy fiber internet anyway bc DH is a freelancer video editor and needs fast internet for his work. I ended up buying a nice standing desk and fatigue mat with the money. ~5000 employee public company
Cat
Yes, not sure if there is a limit (surely someone has tested it by upgrading to the fastest possible?), but ours costs between $50-$60 a month and is reimbursed.
Anonymous
Govt employee that moved to WFH in March and no stipend or funds for internet or anything else.
Anon
+1 Stipends like this definitely don’t exist in government.
Horse Crazy
Haha for real.
Anon
This. Also buying my own legal pads, pens, printer ink, etc. And I think that’s ok. My state has worked very hard to protect jobs and compensation, for which I am grateful. I also save on commuting expenses, so this is roughly equal. I am so appreciative that my state has made good decisions about having all who can work from home do so. The last thing I would do is rock the boat by nickel and dime-ing.
anon
Yes, this.
Anonymous
+1 -I work for a nonprofit theater. I’m just lucky to have a job. Also 5% pay cut and no chance of being repaid, 5 week furlough coming up soon. My boss is apparently going to go through this entire pandemic using only a tablet (no actual computer) to run the organization, so the idea of them paying for me to get the tech I need seems far-fetched.
anon
govt contractor, no stipend, but once they determined this was going to last at least 18 months, they put procedures in place to get us ergonomic equipment and office supplies. Working within govt regulations has been amusing. I can get printer cartridges, but had to buy my own printer. We have motorized sit/stand desks at work, but couldn’t take them home or buy new ones. However, we were allowed to buy regular desks and sit/stand modifiers.
Anon
No stipends from my former firm (I was laid off during the pandemic) but they’re financially troubled and also only very begrudgingly let people work from home when the state required it. People were allowed to go into the office and take their monitors and office chairs if they wanted them, but no way were they going to let you furnish your home office on their dime. Nor would they consider paying for internet. Because it was a huge favor that they were allowing you to work from home (even through required by law)