Weekend Open Thread

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Dec. 2020 Update: There's a very similar version of this in the 2020 Nordstrom Half-Yearly Sale for $34.

Something on your mind? Chat about it here.

I nearly included this $48 sweater in our cashmere sweater roundup because, while it is NOT cashmere, it is one of the softest sweaters I've ever had.

I can't give a full report yet because I haven't washed it (do note that the instructions are “hand wash cold” — not what I expected from something described as fleece), and I've only worn it a few times.

Still, it's so, so soft that I have to fight the urge to wear it all the time. I'd say it runs a bit big (although I'm 5'4″ and maybe should have gotten the petite), is long enough to wear with skinny jeans, and is my new favorite.

There are a ton of sizes and colors at Nordstrom, where it's available for $48. Gibson ‘Yummy Fleece' High/Low V-Neck Pullover

Sales of note for 1/31/25:

  • Ann Taylor – Suiting Event – 30% off suiting + 30% off tops
  • Nordstrom – Cashmere on sale; AllSaints, Free People, Nike, Tory Burch, and Vince up to 60%; beauty deals up to 25% off
  • Banana Republic Factory – 50% off everything + extra 20 off your $100+ purchase
  • Boden – 15% off new season styles
  • Eloquii – 60% off 100s of styles
  • J.Crew – Up to 40% off winter layers
  • J.Crew Factory – 50% off sweaters and pants
  • Rothy's – Final Few: Up to 40% off last-chance styles
  • Spanx – Lots of workwear on sale, some up to 70% off
  • Talbots – End of season clearance, extra 70% off markdown tops + extra 60% off all other markdowns

And some of our latest threadjacks here at Corporette (reader questions and commentary) — see more here!

Some of our latest threadjacks include:

277 Comments

  1. Is this warm? Like really, really warm? I’m desperately looking for very warm shirts that are not frumpy. I hate this thin sweater trend.

    1. Doubt it. It doesn’t tuck in or have ribbing around the waist so you’ll still get a draft coming up the backside.

      1. And doesn’t cover the back of the neck. I’m usually not very warm if the back of my neck is exposed.

      2. Hmm, neither the back of the neck or the backside really tend to bother me – I’m cold if my arms aren’t well covered by something very warm. Funny how that works differently. Guess the search continues.

    2. I own this and find it really warm actually. It’s sort of fleece-y on the inside, which makes it cosier than it may appear. Definitely runs big, but in a cute way (I think).

  2. My sister is getting married and my son is in the wedding party. I need to find an outfit for him, her only requirement is that he wear a Navy Blazer. Any advice on how to style this for a trendy, outdoor NYC wedding in May? I was leaning towards lots of color – colored pants + dress shirt + bowtie? But can’t seem to think of specific colors or outfits. Help?

    1. Check out the post Easter clearance.

      A college friend had her 3 year kid ring bearer in khakis, a green shirt, pink bow tie and suspenders. I also think purple and green are nice. I’m
      Personally partial to khakis with navy blazers.

      How old is the kid? Khaki pants, white shirt, navy blazer, fun bow tie plus suspenders and/or a hat would look great in pictures and be easy to re-wear.

        1. Thanks! Just got my son a First Communion suit, shirt, tie and shoes for $65! He’ll only wear it for the hour mass and pics, so I’m trying to not feel too guilty!

    2. How old is your son?

      I saw a men’s suit combo in a Brooks Brothers window with navy blazer, dusty pink pants and a shirt with those two colors.

  3. Hotel recommendations for Istanbul and Cairo? Staying 3-4 days in each city. Budget is not a concern, but proximity to tourist sites and food is :) thanks!

    1. For Istanbul, World Heritage Hotel in Sultanahmet is fantastic. I also loved Hotel Empress Zoe. Each is 5 minutes walk to Hagia Sophia, Blue Mosque, Topkapi Palace, Spice Bazaar etc and maybe 15 minutes walk to the Grand Bazaar. One thing to note though – Sultanahmet is extremely touristy and busy, especially in the summer. Last time I was in Istanbul (in May/June last year) I rented an apartment in Galata and really enjoyed being able to get away from the crowds, but if you’re visiting in the winter you should be ok staying in Sultanahmet.

    2. We LOVED Hotel Amira in Istanbul. It’s in Sultanahmet, and the staff recommendations were worth their weight in gold.

  4. Tips for an 8+ hour flight with a one-year old? Husband will be flying with me. We did not book a seat for hr and she doesn’t sit still for 8 minutes let alone 8 hours!

    1. Hopefully your flight is overnight? As you’ve not booked a seat, they flight attendants will insist on her being in the bassinet that they provide except for meal times. I suggest you keep her up the whole day before your flight (no naps) so that she is ready to sleep on the plane.

      1. This hasn’t been my experience at all (flown many times with both kiddos under 1). I kept my kid on me the whole time. Perhaps it may be different for an international flight?

        Check out the moms’ page today. There was a discussion about how to entertain a 2 year old on a plane. You may need to nix some of the suggestions but many will work.

      2. Wait, what? Are you in the U.S.? Flight attendants do not always provide a bassinet nor do they require the baby to stay in it. They are called lap children for a reason. They sit in your lap. Even for take off / landing. You only get a bassinet in the bulkhead on international flights. At least that is my experience flying.

        1. Not to mention, it is highly unlikely that even a small 1 year old child would fit in the bassinets that I’ve seen on the international flights. They are meant for small infants.

        2. This. I’ve had my 5 month old on 8 flights so far, no bassinet in sight. He was on me / husband the whole time. (Hi everyone! I’m back from maternity leave!)

      3. You’re allowed to have a kid under a certain age sitting on your lap. I think you might be thinking of a pet….those have to stay in their carrier.

      4. ???

        I have taken at east 30 plane trips with children under 2 and never heard of this bassinet thing

        1. Nope, this is definitely A Thing — we flew British Airways to Europe last month and reserved a bassinet in advance. You sit in a bulkhead seat and there’s a fold-down platform that comes out of the wall in front of you. BA’s special-for-the-flight bassinet attached to it and voila! A place for baby to sleep.

    2. I know a lot of moms are concerned about appropriate “screen time” these days, but I say an 8 hour flight is time to bust out the ipad and headphones. Don’t try to drug her with Benadryl, for a lot of kids it makes them hyper not sleepy.

      1. With a one year old, this is super rough because they are old enough to want to move around; but not old enough to watch a movie for a couple of hours. If the flight is a time of day she might sleep, I would suggest bringing Benadryl (test it in advance to be sure it does not make her hyper; as noted it has that effect on some kids). Also LOTS of small toys that will get you 20-30 minutes: stickers, art supplies, mini-M&Ms (sort by color is a fun game with these), healthy snacks, videos (they will be short, but 30 minutes will feel like a great break by hour 5 unless she will sleep).

        One more note- I flew a lot with my daughter with no assigned seat and never had the flight attendant offer much less insist on a bassinet. That might be location specific.

        1. No, definitely not a movie for that age, but a bunch of short episodes of something like Peppa Pig or Caillou are great for a one year old. Lots of colours and constant movement on screen will keep her attention. (Former childcare worker who is an expert in children’s TV here!)

          1. Yes. Lots of short shows, headphones. I once sat on a 4-hour flight next to a family that did not pay for their child’s seat and did not bring anything to entertain him. They were terribly unprepared. It was like seeing those people who try to cradle their cat or dog like a baby and the thing just squirms to get out the whole time. Kids that age want to move and need to be stimulated (or asleep) for that long. Otherwise, child will climb all over you, try to eat others’ food, try to see what’s on others’ screens, etc.

      2. Agree that movies won’t hold a 1 year old’s attention, but there may be apps/games that will. The duck duck moose apps are great for that age group!

    3. helpful for us while traveling with a very mobile and wiggly 10 month old with zero attention span: some interesting wind-up toys (MINUTES of fascination at a time!); new small toy cars; cheerios; getting up and walking up and down the aisle; random dog toy; books; extra diaper changes just to pass the time. Best was making friends with the slightly older babies seated near us (2 year olds, really), who were SO FASCINATED with our baby and our baby’s toys – and our baby was equally fascinated with them. Baby was decidedly too young for the baby apps we downloaded in case of emergency. Hopefully a 1 year old has a slightly longer attention span!

    4. One year olds on airplanes are pretty much the worst. They are too young to really be interested in the iPad and too old to sit still. Having done this many times, I suggest:

      -Wine or Xanax
      -Lots of walking up and down the aisle
      -Try to get them to take at least one long nap to break it up. I get mine really comfy against my chest and try to make it as dark as possible
      -Bring some baggies of snacks and finger foods to entertain them
      -Stickers and other small toys

      I am not sure what that other person is talking about re the bassinet, that is not a U.S. regulation I have ever encountered in my flights with lap infants.
      Good luck!

      1. Hehe, I’m sure you meant wine or xanax for the parent (+ one million, slight buzz helps a lot!). But now i’ve got a great mental image of my one year old sipping a glass of rose and gazing out the plane window.

  5. Career day fashion question:

    So my school’s career fair is coming up, and I’m in a bit of a dilemma over what to wear. For reference, I’m South Asian, apple-shaped, and in graduate school in Northern California, at a ‘professional’ school rather than one that awards PhDs.

    Option #1: candy apple red sheath, black blazer, statement necklace + diamond studs.

    Option #2: black skirt + jacket, patterned blouse, pearls.

    My school’s career office isn’t much help beyond, ‘Don’t show up in shorts or a miniskirt!’ so any help would be appreciated.

  6. Soccer sign ups are here, and I really want my husband to step up and assume responsibility for the whole thing. Handle signups, get all the information, arrange his schedule to take our daughter to practice, and be the lead parent on this.

    He wants our daughter in soccer, so I told him it was fine with me IF he’d step up and take it over. (The way I handle all other kid activities and sports.) I don’t like soccer. I played soccer mom last season and sorry, it’s not my thing. I hated it.

    He sounded baffled by this and said over and over again that he has an 1-1/2 commute and can’t possibly get her to practice on weeknights. I’m feeling guilty, like I’m being a selfish person for refusing to handle ALL THE PRACTICES. Because I’m more local I get stuck with all the kid pickups, all the dinner prep, all the house stuff. I just can’t take it anymore and want him to step up. Am I being realistic?

    1. If he’s so eager to have daughter be in soccer, then he needs to step up and take responsibility. Also, does your daughter want to be in soccer? If she’s already in other sports and activities, it’s not going to be the end of the world if she’s not in soccer.

    2. Yes and no. I think you can ask him to handle all sign-ups, do more around the house, do meal prep since all of those tasks have some flexibility in when they can be done. Asking him to consistently leave work at 3:30 to make a post-5 pm soccer practice might be harder. Can he look at getting her someone to car-pool with and/or get out of work early on a few days to make practice? If she can find a ride to soccer, is she old enough where the parents don’t sit through practice and someone can just pick her up when she is done? Does she like soccer this much?

    3. Where’s your daughter in all of this? Does she even want to play soccer? Does she want to play soccer more than you don’t want to drive her to practice?

      In an ideal world, you’re not being unreasonable, but if I’m remembering my own childhood correctly, “evening” practices start at 5 or 6 – if that’s the case, I’m kind of with your husband, in that I don’t see how he can realistically make that work with a 90 minute commute. Any chance you could give him the numbers of other team parents and tell him he’s free to try to set up a carpool for your daughter (or is she still little enough to need a parent at practice)? Alternatively, would you be willing to do weeknight practices only, on the condition that he handle every other aspect of soccer?

      Last thing – is there any chance there’s some other thing he can take off your plate – like, maybe it’s not realistic for him to do soccer, but maybe he could take over ballet or karate or weekend science classes or whatever, so you have the bandwidth to accommodate soccer? Or are your kid(s) just plain in too many activities? Could you scale everyone back overall?

      1. She’s 5, she loved soccer, and she wants to play again. She’s also in dance and our 10 year old is in multiple dance classes that I handle during the week/weekends. She wants to play again, but she’s 5. She also wants a Shopkin birthday cake with real shopkins baked in it and to marry her dad, so…

        The “evening” practice starts are 5:30 which I even ran late to, so I get that this is probably impossible for him to do. But I hated standing there on the field for an hour, heels sinking into the dirt, dying to get home and start on homework/dinner or feeling guilty because I ran out of work at 4:45 while my team stays until 5:45 wrapping up projects.

        1. Ummm martyr much? Why you wearing your heels to this? Why be there the whole hour? Why can’t he do dinner those nights?

          1. I’m wearing heels because I’m coming straight from work and typically forgot to grab other shoes. There’s no time to stop at home and change. I head straight to daycare, dress her in her soccer gear, and then head to the field. We barely make it or we’re late.

            I stay for the whole hour because 5 is too young to drop off, and the fields are swarming with kids/parents.

          2. Can you send her soccer clothes to daycare and tell her to change into them before you get there? Then you only have to slip in shin guards and tie cleats when you get there. We save some time this way. Dinner on these nights is the easiest thing we can make, often take-out or pbj.
            -signed, fellow mom of soccer obsessed 5 year old.
            Now that we have done soccer for a season and know some other kids at his school who play, I am going to see if some of the other parents want to arrange a pick-up carpool. I think we are just now getting to the age where one adult can get a couple of kids to the right field, etc.

        2. Honestly, I would say that you’re justified in deciding no soccer this year. Sure, she loved it, but is the impact on your stress, family life, etc. worth it? I doubt she will be scarred for life by not playing soccer this year and it sounds pretty miserable for you.

        3. If your 5 year old daughter loves soccer and wants to play, I think it would be great if you and your husband could figure out a way to make that happen (the way you’re figuring out a way to make dance class happen). Maybe you handle weekday soccer practices/dance classes and your husband can handle dinner on the nights you’re at practice, and then your husband can handle the weekend dance classes/soccer practices (if any) when commuting isn’t a factor.

          If you’re looking for permission to take your daughter out of soccer, you don’t need it from us. But for my 2 cents, I think it would be a shame to miss it because you have to remember a change of shoes. It’s definitely possible to throw a pair of flats and your book/iPad in with her soccer gear so you’re not as miserable during practices.

          1. Or get in the habit of only commuting in flats and leaving all your heels at work like everyone else.

          2. My dear Anonymous, I say this with kind intent- “everyone” does not leave their work shoes at work. I would need a shoe closet in my office! I suspect that many of us who drive to work do so in our work shoes. OP doesn’t say that she is a car driving commuter, but her post sounds to me like she is. Flats, flip flops or some running shoes in the trunk are a smart idea for anyone who drives because you never know when you might need to come out of those dress shoes for practical reasons.

          3. This. And you don’t have to stand outside and watch practice the whole time. Many, many parents bring a chair, sit in their car, etc. and get additional reading/work done while kiddo is practicing. Put flats or old sneakers in your car so you don’t have to worry about remembering them.

        4. if this is the routine, on soccer nights, Dad needs to make dinner. If you’re at practice, he can take dinner. That gives him a little extra time on the commute side.

          Would also suggest you keep soccer practice shoes in the car (boots, sneakers, $9,99 flats from payless, whatever), along with a chair.

    4. “DH, I feel like I’m pulling all the weight on something YOU consider a priority and that is frustrating for me because it makes me feel like you value your time more than mine.”
      “I can take kiddo to half of the practices, so let me know which ones you’ll need me to cover” or “I can handle practices if you take care of dinner”. Or “Other Kids’s Mom might do a drop-off, if you do a pick-up”

    5. We do sports / activities that are at/near school (elementary) where either school handles the transition onsite or I’d be picking them up anyway, so no extra trips. I really want to work in swim lessons (we quit for about 8 months but am in a city with lots of pools, so more about water safety than athletics). I hate to give up a weekend, but we (children included) are feeling maxed out on the weeks and have been enjoying when things are cancelled on account of weather / snow days / etc.

      My vote is Weekend Soccer so y’all can share the burden on your schedules. Or doing Suboptimal Soccer if it is schedule-friendly. While making sure siblings are given activities / lessons equitably.

    6. He wants her to play soccer so he should be responsible for taking her given how much else you do. Possible alternative is for him to hire a local high school student to take your daughter? He should have to do the work associated with arranging that though.

    7. Is this what you want your marriage to be? Setting him up for failure by insisting he take on a task you know he can’t do? Just say no to soccer if you don’t want to do it instead of causing all this fuss.

      Is he generally a good and decent father and husband?

      1. yeah – I don’t know how much she’s getting out of soccer now that she can’t also get in a couple years. If it’s this hard on the schedule, skip organized soccer and have dad and daughter do drills in the yard on the weekend.

          1. Maybe a nanny or babysitter can deal with some of this stuff, and your husband can hire and manage (set expectations, monitor behavior, pay on time and reconcile with your finance set up) – or hire a cleaner, or a cook, or have your kids be more self sufficient – ride share or buses or entertain themselves with a ball outside your home while you cook/clean etc

        1. +1 to this.

          How many times a week is soccer? I might, miiiiiight be willing to do it for a 5 year old for 1 night a week and no out of town games. Maybe a Tuesday-Thursday kind of thing. Otherwise, nope. Soccer eats your life, and I don’t enjoy it enough to care. That’s why I push indoor activities like karate :-) Although I suspect my youngest will want to do soccer, and I’m willing to try it if he asks – but I’m not going to suggest it to him.

          Can you look around and see if there is some kind of more casual soccer league? Our town has a once a week, drop in soccer program for kids ages 4-6. No games, no pressure – just kicking a ball around. Or could you compromise with a soccer camp this summer?

          Are there other families at the same daycare rushing to the same soccer practices? If so, could you switch off carpooling (although I know that involves having spare boosters, etc)? Or could you hire a college age student to pick her up and take her to soccer and then bring her home?

          Can you drop dance during soccer season, or tell her she has to pick between dance and soccer? Or are her dance classes at the same time as the older sister anyway?

          Last, get to know some of the other parents and consider swapping off who stands by and watches the practice and who goes and sits in their nice warm car with their phone or laptop. And keep a pair of spare shoes in your car.

          But yes, this sounds like a much bigger picture question of who is the primary parent and household manager and how you are going to handle this kind of thing going forward – because it’s only going to get worse as the kids get older. Is dad’s 1.5 hour commute total or each way? I just don’t see that is going to be sustainable long term without either you cutting way back on your work schedule or outsourcing to either an afterschool/drive to activities nanny and/or outsourcing dinner cooking.

    8. I would expect Mr. Kitten to handle the stuff or else no soccer for the Kitten family this year. It’s an optional activity so if he doesn’t want to do it, it just won’t get done.

      1. Soccer nanny! hire someone to pick her up, take her to weekday practices, and bring her home. Husband can do the hiring.

        1. This is the best idea if you absolutely must do organized sport. Or see if any other kids in her class want to join and carpool.

    9. I just don’t see the benefit of after school sports and stressed parents. My husband worked at home when my son was little. He came home from school and played outside with his friends until dinner. Kids get more exercise playing than they do in organized sports anyway. I am tired just thinking about doing what you are talking about! No way.

      1. Same. I have family members that have this lifestyle and it seems horrible. It dominates everything about their lives, and the kids don’t even seem to like the sport as much anymore. Meanwhile, there are kids who play casual kickball games in my neighborhood when the weather is nice, and they look like they are having the time of their lives. And just one parent is with them, while all the other parents are taking care of other things.

        I would stick to just one activity per kid. If soccer is important to her and DH, and carpools/after school care don’t work, then DH needs to handle everything at home on those nights – dinner, bedtime, etc. I just don’t see how overburdening one parent does any good for the marriage or the kid.

  7. Just looking for commiseration/sympathy: My DH has been battling severe depression for a long time (severe depression for about 5 years, coinciding with the birth of our first child). Two years ago, he sought help and the past year has been so good. The last two weeks I have watched him slipping away and it breaks my heart and makes me so angry with the depression. He has a therapist (that he is seeing tomorrow) and is on medication (max dosages). I also have my own therapist, primarily to help me cope with his depression. While cognitively I understand what is going on, it is still tough to watch your friend and partner disappear into the fog, and I have no idea how to explain his behavior to our kids. At least therapy has helped me set boundaries for myself and the kids. Just hoping that he can pull back up in a relatively short period of time. Have any of you been on either side of this and know of things that were helpful to say, do or read?

    1. I have depression and sometimes I can tell when I’m slipping further into oblivion. If it’s possible, can you get him to take a walk with you or similar easy exercise? He’s probably not going to want to do it, but I know exercise, in conjunction with therapy and meds, is crucial, but it’s hard to think rationally when I’m feeling depressed.

      Is he also seeing a psychiatrist who prescribes the meds? Maybe it’s time for a reevaluation, if he’s truly feeling this horrible.

      I’m so sorry you and your kids are going through this.

    2. Glad he is seeing his therapist. Does he have a separate psychiatrist prescribing the meds? Obviously they aren’t working. Sometimes you have to change meds over time. Needs another appointment for that. Quickly.

      Buy a happy light for him.

      Love the idea of getting outside.. walk in the sun… exercise.

      Keep seeing your therapist. Look at your local NAMI website. Maybe a support group for spouses/family members would be helpful for you.

      Sorry it is so hard… Hang in there.

    3. Hugs–this is so tough, especially when the kids are old enough to notice what’s going on. I second the suggestion to get him outside for a walk. Sunlight and exercise are both helpful. With my spouse, I also find it useful to pack him a lunch to help maintain a healthy meal routine, get him to agree to perform simple household tasks that aren’t overwhelming (e.g., can you please help me out by folding this one basket of laundry while I do this other thing?), and ask his parents and siblings to call him for a chat. And I put on music he likes instead of the news.

    4. Mr. Kitten had this happen and they switched him to a different anti-depressant. He had been depressed, got help, went on meds, was doing better, and then slipped back under again. He was actually over the max dosage on his first meds, and they put him on a different med, and he is back to being a total delight. Switching meds is rough and scary though – because they inevitably don’t transition smoothly and you’re already in a not-good space, but I’m so happy that he is now on meds that work for him.

  8. Granted I am only 5’4, but I feel like so many tops, this sweater included, are made so freaking LONG these days. Tops that aren’t supposed to be tunics are still tunic-length. I just bought a bunch of new blouses for work and if I don’t want to tuck them in all the time, I’ll have to get them altered. Maybe I’m crazy but I really don’t think the hem of a sweater should be past your butt.

    1. Yes! I am 5’2 and I used to be able to wear regular tops, no problem. Now I always try to buy petite-sized tops. When you are already short and then your top comes down to mid-thigh, you look like a child!

    2. Uh – that’s where I like the hem of my sweater if I’m wearing skinny jeans. And I’ve got 6 inches on you.

      I usually run into the opposite problem – that “tunic” or “dress” is more like a long-ish shirt on me.

    3. Lol, but also, women who are 5’10” are relieved that tops are finally long enough!

      1. This–there was a period in there where I could only buy tunics or risk showing my belly button.

    4. As someone who is 5’9″ and long wasted, I could not agree more… I can finally buy shirts that cover my stomach! I need to buy all the things before this trend ends.

    5. I’m 5’7″ and short waisted, so I totally feel your pain. I’ve given up and have everything tailored… work blouses, casual shirts… It sucks.

  9. Sooo, does anybody know how corporate IT works as far as tracking all my ‘r e t t e site visits? Haha

    I visit this lovely page daily on my phone, not my work computer. I’m signed onto our guest wireless anonymously through my phone so as not to kill data, though my work email is on here, so I’m not sure how anonymous I am. Is there somebody tracking my usage and I’m going to get a stern talking to someday or do IT people not have time for that?

    Shameful admission – it’s our slow time and I have nothing going on at work, so I’m pretty constantly refreshing this page. And Pinterest. And FB.

    1. I figure most IT depts don’t have time to care as long as your higher ups don’t come to them and say “so anon hasn’t been getting her work done consistently and I want to check her internet history.”

      I’m an attorney so we’re pretty much left alone, but I figure if IT cared they’d be banging down my door by now, as I read a lot of reproductive justice news on my breaks, and those articles contain a lot of IT trigger words. No attys in my firm care about what they do online.

      But, technically, they do have the right to track literally ever move you make on your computer.

      1. The customized ads on my computer think I am a drug addict based on my work-related reading and searching.

        1. I used to get a kick out of watching the customized ads in my gmail change based on whatever I was researching/ gchatting about. For a while gmail gave me alternating ads for predator drone/war machine manufacturers (international law research) and wildlife infestation removal companies (guy I was dating nicknamed me “squirrel”).

          Swing and a miss, gmail.

    2. In house attorney. I was told my company has tracked this before, but it was in VERY rare situations (like when an employee was literally getting nothing done and they wanted to verify that it was because they were on the internet all day….and they were). In most reasonable companies, if you are getting your work done, they aren’t going to micromanage what you do online. But yes, they do have the right.

      1. I also am an attorney, and I told the manageing partner that I am on the INTERNET, and specificeally this sight b/c I need to keep up with legal and fashion trend’s so that I can have a better track record in court. He agreed that I do well in Manhattan with his freind, the judge, but not so well elsewhere, like Brookelyn and Queen’s. FOOEY b/c there I am just average, mabye 65% win and 35% loose. The manageing partner thinks I can do better if I can schmooze more with the clerk’s and the judges there, but it is DIFICULT b/c I do NOT know those peeople and onley show up mabye once every 2 week’s or so.

        So I get alot of tip’s from the HIVE that I tell the manageing partner, and he has NO probelem with me shoppeing on the web, tho I usueally just comparison shop b/f I buy. That saves HIM and the firm money b/c I am a smart shopper. He also knows I go to Marie Claire and other websites to learn about other tips that will help me become a more allureing personality, b/c he knows that being married will be good for me, at least until I start haveing babie’s!

        The teck guy knows all of the website’s I visit, and I know he watches me b/c he can literaly take over my machine to clean it out from where he sits.

        So for those in the hive, be careful NOT to go to sites that your manageing partner does NOT want you to. YAY!!!

    3. totally depends on your company. Our company is hardcore about tracking. They tell us, though. I am very friendly with the head of sysadmin and he runs a report of all websites visited by employees etc. This site isn’t something he’d probe into, they are more concerned with sending files to personal emails, downloading viruses, etc.

    4. I asked a law enforcement officer who specializes in forensic cell phone exams, cell phone tracking, and the like, for pretty much the same reason you’re asking us here. If understand you correctly you are using a personal device that is using your office’s wifi. He told me that it is possible to see what devices are logged into the wifi but that there is no information on what the internet activity is. So, it might show that “ANP’s iPhone” was active on the wifi network, but it doesn’t have information about whether ANP’s iPhone was into her work email, personal email, the Brooks Brothers site, kitten videos or what.

      1. That’s not true in many cases – this is not posting over an encrypted connection and whether or not he can see traffic depends on how the network is being monitored. Even when traffic is encrypted over SSL, sometimes your company will have a device that will decrypt it and it will only go encrypted from the company’s network outward, not from your device to the other monitoring device, so they can see the traffic anyway. Plus, if the forensics guy couldn’t figure out how to decrypt current traffic to see what you could be doing at a particular point in time (maybe he was talking about seeing records of past traffic, which your company may not keep?) I would assume he is not qualified for his job, which is scary.

  10. Just wanted to share a shopping win – I popped into TK Maxx on my way home this afternoon and got a Boden work wear dress for £10! It’s not my favourite colour (it’s a dark coral I guess) but for that price I don’t mind! I’ve put on weight since my internship so most of my professional clothes don’t fit at the moment.

  11. I’d love to hear any success stories from people who stopped eating dinner on the couch and actually use a dining room table. I’ve been married for several years and we defaulted to eating dinner on the couch at some point. Now we tend to eat on the couch and then watch tv for hours and not get up and actually do anything in the evening. DH is fine with this. It makes me feel lazy, but it’s also hard for me to leave the comfortable couch to go do chores or go to the gym or something. I really feel like eating at the table would be easier for it to feel like a temporary location instead of settling in for the night.

    And yes, typing it out, I know exactly that the thing to do is just start serving dinner at the table, but we trade off cooking and serving. When I bring it up, DH acknowledges my feelings but he sees nothing wrong with eating on the couch (he grew up this way!) and I’m going to have to be the driving force in changing it. I really don’t want any future kids to eat dinner on the couch.

    I will also welcome commiseration.

    1. Could you start cooking really messy/ bitty dinners that are easier to eat at a table?

    2. I totally get where you’re coming from on this. Dinner is served at the table the nights you cook it. Once that’s a pattern, you can start working on your husband’s nights, if you’re still feeling strongly about it after the compromise position has been in place for a while.

      1. And I will say, FWIW, that I’m okay with dinner on the couch sometimes. But when/if kids enter the picture for me, a family dinner at the table, with no phones or TV, is non-negotiable unless there’s a scheduling conflict.

        1. This! My husband and I ate on the couch for 10 years and then had kids. We have been eating at a table for 5 years now and prefer it now. Although the nights the kids are at the grandparents, we totally eat on the couch and love it!

    3. If you want to eat at the table, just go sit at the table. Eventually, he will probably join you. When you make dinner, set the table and sit at it.

    4. We ate like this for 10 years plus, until our son got too big for a high chair (yeah, we had the high chair beside the couch at dinner). He was able to sit at a chair, but too small to really reach the coffee table from the couch, plus he wouldn’t stay put, so it was really impractical to try to eat at the couch then, so now we eat at the table every night.

      So, it might just work itself out when you have kids. We do still watch TV while we eat, I admit, but we usually watch Jeopardy, so it’s educational, right?

    5. A noble goal. Don’t be so hard on yourself. Many do this. But I completely agree the couch + TV is like quicksand, and this is not a good habit for growing kids…. or even us tired adults!. There is a lot of good parenting that goes on at the dinner table. For some families, that is the only time you are all together in a typical day… listening to each other, talking to each other, for the kids to listen how ADULTS talk to and treat each other…. So important. So it would be great to get out of this rut before you have kids.

      Start with turning on the radio when you are making dinner, instead of the TV. Listen to podcasts/NPR news/favorite music instead of bad TV. Maybe you make dinner together, with a glass of wine, so it is a nice bonding activity. Or at least, serve dinner at the table your nights.

      It will be a very hard habit to break, and it’s really terrible to teach it to your kids. It also trains them to eat mindlessly, staring at the TV, without enjoying food and responding to food dues (ex. I’m full….) in a healthy way.

    6. Get a dog that is tall enough to jump on the couch but not tall enough to reach the table. Eating on the couch is now a recipe for getting my dinner stolen by an excitable terrier :-)

    7. Well…my dining table has turned into my sewing table, so no “success” here in that regard. But then it’s just me, and it means I do that much more sewing.

    8. Next time you cook and serve dinner, set the table and put the food there. Then sit down and eat there.

      I think your real question is “how do I keep myself from CHOOSING to sit on the couch,” or “how do i motivate myself to want to eat at the table” and that’s something you are just going to have to decide to do.

    9. As an opposing view — how about on the nights he cooks, you set the table while he is cooking, so that when he is done, you can sit down together? Perhaps add in a “Can I get you a glass of wine/ beer/ soda/ his preference?” so it’s a treat and not a chore for him.

      1. I was going to suggest this too – actually setting the table will be a step in the right direction. And what about setting a bowl/salad plate for part of it too? Or a wine glass and water glass? Something that makes it actually easier to eat at the table than to wrangle from the couch. (NB – this suggestion should only be taken if have a dishwasher)

        Another thought – tapas, tacos, something that requires assembly and stuff from little dishes.

      2. +1. I also like to “decorate” my table– I have placemats that I love, and I occasionally pick up flowers and put them on a vase on the table– it makes it feel like a place I want to be. If you pick up flowers regularly enough, they stop being “special occasion” treats and are just part of your beautiful house. Some people might think this is a waste of money, but it doesn’t have to be expensive. Every time I go into Trader Joe’s, I just pick up a bouquet– they have lots of cheap ones. My summer CSA also has a “flower share” that we get in addition to the veggies we get, but that’s really more because I really love fresh flowers.

    10. I convince DH to eat at the table by telling him that I haven’t seen him all day and would prefer talking during dinner instead of watching tv. Now it’s become a nice ritual and more of a habit, at least when we cook. When we eat at the table, we’re much more likely to do the dishes after dinner and to read or do something more productive than watching tv the rest of the evening.

  12. Is anyone here dealing with the care of young children AND elderly relatives? (Bonus if said elderly relatives live in a different state.) I have two toddlers and just started having to take over affairs from relatives who have no kids of their own and live across the country. It’s emotionally agonizing, logistically nightmarish (spent 3 hours today on phone trying to get access to a bank account crucial to paying one relative’s nursing home fees), and frustrating on so many levels. Some days I feel I can barely care for my children, and the added responsibility for these relatives (whom I love dearly) feels crushing. Anyone here in a similar boat? Just need to feel less alone.

    1. In case you don’t get other responses, I’ll chime in. . . no kids, but fully disabled husband (i.e., needs caregivers)and FT “Corporette style” job (with good hours). Not easy. Count on feeling alone and find a support group if you can – online ones are available.

    2. You are in the sandwich generation phase. Really tough. No way around it.Happening to many as we have kids older. But thank you for doing the right thing and caring for them. Not everyone does. You are a wonderful person.

    3. It is just.brutal.

      It is hardest in the beginning when you are trying to sort through the logistics. I strongly recommend off loading as much as possible to others. You find a local accountant/elder care lawyer/caregiver for hire/social worker or even hire a private case manager if you can find one. You use your loved one’s funds to pay for these things. And assign specific tasks to relatives if they aren’t stepping up to the plate to help.

      Of note, when my mother was managing my grandfather’s finances from out of state she hired the “lovely lawyer” who took care of all the assisted living residents from my grandfather’s church. This guy robbed people blind and became governor of a small east coast state…. I kid you not. So someone has to keep some eyes on this, but if possible try to not have it be you.

      Do you have other family you can assist? Were relatives very poor planners and are just dropping this in your lap? What exactly do you feel is your responsibility?

      1. +1 to hiring a local accountant if at all possible and if the money is there for that. Call the nursing home and ask, I bet they already have residents that do that. Or see if there is a senior center or agency on aging that can help. When my husband’s great aunt had only my MIL and us left for support, she hired a local accountant and it was so nice to have someone else handle it, especially since then he handled her taxes, etc in addition to her day-to-day bills.

        I have young children, and my father and father-in-law are in their mid-60s and starting to fall apart (physically for my father, mentally and physically for my FIL). My poor mother is in her early 60s, just retired last year and is juggling helping my sister with her infant, me with my young kids, my father with his ongoing issues and her own mother who is in her 80s and starting to have more and more domino effect health issues. I try to step in and help my mother as much as possible and not to lean on her to help me with my kids so much (but she won’t let me STOP her caring for them altogether because she likes that it gives her an excuse to spend time with them and get out of the house).

        What is crazy is that just 5 years ago I never would have guessed that either my father or father in law would have needed so much support so quickly.

        You are not alone, juggling caring for others is super tough. Since you are the closest relative, it might be worth looking at your state’s policies to see if you would be eligible to take FMLA if you needed to travel to your aunt for a medical emergency.

      2. Thanks, mood and everyone else. I feel for each and every one of you. Prior to becoming a parent, I feel like I lived a fairy tale, with little responsibility except for myself. And now, it feels like all my energy is being eaten up by taking care of others, with little to no appreciation or help.
        Mood, to answer your questions: I have an older sibling who should share some of this burden, but sibling lives overseas so it comes to me to do what needs doing. My elderly aunt has dementia and has lived in a facility for a number of years. Her husband used to visit her frequently and take care of all the paperwork required for Medicaid funding, but in the past year suffered a minor stroke and several falls, and it is clear that his mental faculties are no longer what they were. When my aunt’s dementia got to the point where she needed trained care, I advised my uncle to get a financial planner and elder care lawyer, who drew up powers of attorney for this situation. However, acting on those POAs is very tough when you can’t go to the bank in person, or to the state Medicaid office, or the nursing home, or what have you. My uncle recently suffered an infection that affected his personality and he refused to speak to me on the phone for a while, and told the hospital where he was not to talk to me. It was terrible to have to beg for information from nurses and staff who were just trying to protect their patient’s privacy, but at the expense of his only relative not knowing where he was or what condition he was in.
        Sorry, I’m just blabbering on at this point. I meant to say that my relatives did plan ahead but being a continent away means that taking over those responsibilities requires a lot of time, which I’m already short on due to work and family. I work parttime from home (not a dreaded MLMer, promise!) and take care of the kids and it is nearly impossible to travel under these conditions.
        Anyway. I’m sorry for the sob story. Thank you, everyone who got this far. Strength and courage to us all.

        1. I hear you. Very rough. You’re not blabbering. These things are very stressful. Nevermind how many mistakes occur, how much time you are left waiting on hold with phone calls, how many times you have to explain yourself again and again…. Sometimes I have trouble holding it together.

          Does it appear your uncle is en route to join your aunt in the nursing home?

          It is fortunate you are working from home. Try to see if you can devote a certain chunk of time for awhile on this. Maybe 30 min every day for awhile and have a checklist. Avoid mondays and fridays for making your phone calls,. First thing in the morning is usually the best time to contact people. As things stabilize, decrease the number of days of making calls, but still check in regularly.

          Is there one ally in their city that can help you? Perhaps the lawyer/financial planner? I would also ask to speak to the patient advociate (or equivalent) at the Nursing Home and explain the situation and ask if they know how similar families are assisting with these issues from out of state. Perhaps they can also recommend a social worker/case manager that you can coordinate with/hire if needed.

          Try to get copies of the POA’s on file at the Nursing Home, the local hospitals, health insurance companies, bank etc..? This is a good first step. Perhaps even call the lawyer/financial planner to assist with this. Then you are “in the computer” so to speak, and it helps the next time. However, many hospitals are disorganized and don’t even have a “place” in their computer systems to store this info. So you keep a copy of the POA documents in a file on your computer and a hard copy in your home, and you get used to faxing/emailing frequently.

          Figure out a job that your overseas sib can do via computer. Phones/email work overseas too, and they can do some of the things you are doing.

          Consider a one time trip, maybe with your older sib, to get things in order. Can your husband’s parents/relatives help with childcare for a brief trip, or could you even hire out for a period? If need be, have your Uncle/Aunt’s estate pay for it. It may seem stressful to contemplate this, but it is amazing how a short trip can get a lot done. Also realize that if your Uncle needs to move to the Nursing Home, the Nursing Home will have people they work with that can assist with organizing the move so you don’t have to.

          It is overwhelming at times. Making a checklist helps me. And you just slowly start going through the list.

          You are actually fortunate that it sounds like there is some organization here, and that POAs are in place and some professionals have been hired, and that Medicaid has been applied for. Awesome. You don’t have to fill in all the gaps overnight. One check box at a time….

          1. Thank you, mood improving, for taking the time to write out such good suggestions. My uncle is close to needing assisted living. He is already in a senior living type residence and the people there have been incredible about helping. He can move into the associated assisted living residence when he wants (though I need to make sure his income and savings will be enough for that and my aunt).

            I helped my uncle when my aunt needed to be placed in a facility, but he was the primary person and on the ground. Now I’m the primary person and far from where they live. But he was a good planner and set up many things in advance. So this is a better situation than many, I’m sure. It’s just compounded by distance, trying to take care of toddlers, etc. And the guilt, of course. For not being there, for not moving them closer to me (their state is one of the few where Medicaid covers my aunt’s facility; it would bankrupt us to have to pay for similar facility in my state). For getting angry and frustrated. As everyone has written, it is so very, very hard.

            Thank you and everyone again for helping me feel less alone.

    4. Yep! But the elder care situation has been going on for a long time, so we don’t have the “set up” time suck that you are going through. But now we have a 5 month old, and MIL has definitely turned my husband into her surrogate spouse. (Example: MIL: I hear rats. Husband: so call an exterminator. MIL: but I want to talk to you about it some more. Husband: I have to go to work…)

      MIL is fully capable of picking up the phone and hiring an exterminator, so there’s that. But we are working on hiring an accountant and getting an outside agency to help her out, because she is FIL’s full time caregiver. I’m finding that outsourcing is really the only way to go.

      1. Please…. give your MIL a break. She is probably physically and mentally exhausted, caring for her FIL alone. She is crying out for help. Obviously her husband, who should be her partner, should be helping and cannot. This is a rough transition.

        Some empathy please…..

    5. This is going to sound horrible, but this is a big part of the reason I’m not having kids. I am an only child, no family in the US, lone living parent lives in the US and has cancer. I can barely cope with BigLaw and parent now, no clue how I could add kids to the mix. Much commiseration.

      1. Hey there anon for this. I am in a bad situation, single parent with various challenges, zero family to help etc., but honestly I cant’ imagine what I’d do for joy and love and laughs without my kid. I had no idea what it would bring. Yes it is insanely, insanely hard at times. But I’d rather go down this way than coast like i was before… life with her is just immensely better. My parent has cancer. It sucks. But bringing kiddo to see her, when we can, is a huge priority and seeing her joy makes everything worthwhile. And I focus extremely hard on trying to improve my quality of life- I’m not giving up on figuring out ways to make it not this hard. I wasn’t going to have kids, and 100% support that decision for anyone who makes it. Just wanted to share perspective of someone who did a 180 on that, conditions blew up, far from ideal, full time corporate but not enough to have nanny etc.. and I’d still choose her in a heartbeat. :) I do think it may be taking years off my life, but luckily I lived very fully all along.

        1. “…it may be taking years off my life, but luckily I lived very fully all along.” –> This is such a wonderful perspective. I also try to remember that I benefited from my aunt and uncle’s care and love when I was younger, and now I get to show how much that meant to me. In calmer moments, it helps.

          1. Totally agree. I honestly feel like i was given so much, got to do so much, I am happy to help others now. I traveled all around, got to do advanced degrees and neat jobs, was young and in love, etc. Now of course great if more awesome stuff happens, but if I can give back and love my girl and others it’s plenty. Sadly most of the men I meet are the opposite: they feel repressed and ready to do everything in 40s that I did in 20s. But that’s another topic. ;)

          2. You have such a fantastic attitude. It is inspiring. I have gotten to experience so much and yet I still want more! I want to be more like you.

    6. Yes, in our house, though our kids are older. We both work; an aide from an agency comes daily while we are away.
      The elderly relative has dementia but is in remarkably stable condition healthwise, due to medications. Has been living with us for 3 years and the situation may continue for years longer.
      Years.

      1. It is amazing that you are keeping your relative home with you. It tears my heart to remember how, years ago, my aunt begged and begged us to take her home, out of the facility she entered after some violent acts toward my uncle. You are amazing. Strength and courage.

    7. Yes, and it is hard. My mom pass last summer and I miss her dearly. But lately I have started to feel more relaxed and I feel guilty because I know it is because the stress of her aging is no longer on me.

    8. Yes, I have three kids and we are caring for my mother. It is utterly exhausting, yet so stressful that I cannot sleep. Hire help if you or your relative have the funds.

  13. I’m going to have one full year between my current job and starting graduate school. Since I still have bills that I’m going to have to pay, I would like to work for that year and not in my current field of work. What sort of job should I consider? Other than retail, I’m not sure what other industry hires for such a short term (if asked directly in an interview, I don’t want to have to lie and say I am planning on working for more than a year). Help? It doesn’t have to pay a lot, just enough to cover the bills. If it’s interesting, that’s a plus, of course!

    1. Forgot to mention – whatever the job, I need it to be flexible in terms of my being able to take time off for interviews for schools. So, ideally part time.

      1. How many programs are you applying to? I only took a few days to visit/interview at my top school choices.

        1. A lot – I want as many opportunities to visit schools and determine the right fit, so I’d rather put in an investment of time upfront.

    2. What about signing up with a temp agency or looking for a temporary contract? That would seem to fit the bill nicely.

      1. What sort of temp agency? I’m not really interested in my current type of work so I wouldn’t want to temp in that.

        1. I graduated from law school I 2009 and my class was deferred at my firm. I temped with Kelly and worked as a receptionist.

        2. I worked with a staffing agency that placed in HR, administrative, and other assorted office roles. There are reputable and non-reputable agencies out there, so I would ask if they can give you a representative sampling of some of the companies where they have placed temps to gauge their reputation. I’d also do a Google search to see what is out there on the web about them.

        3. You could probably just look for basic admin work – I doubt it’ll pay as much as you’re used to (since it sounds like you were far enough into a career to have an actual “industry,” and temp admin is generally more entry-level), but if it’s just a job to pay the bills until school starts, it’ll probably be fine.

      2. +1 When I have had various breaks (between bar exam and starting at the firm, between permanent jobs, etc.), I contact the temp agency where I am “registered” and let them know I am available and what I am open to doing (most anything over $X). If you are college educated and have a decent track record, it’s highly likely they will start calling you immediately. Sometimes the work is boring, but sometimes it’s not. You also get to meet a lot of new people and be exposed to companies and industries that you otherwise might not be exposed to. I have always enjoyed it, but you have to have the attitude that no job is below you. Yes I have a law degree, no I don’t care that this job is data entry for three days.

    3. How about tutoring? Many tutoring places look for part time tutors and you’ll know your schedule and sometimes they can get people to substitute for you if you’re going to be out (like for your interview days).

    4. Have you thought about teaching abroad? I did a 1 yr program where you teach English as a foreign language to high school students before law school. BA or BS in any field required, but no education training necessary. I’ve seen programs in Europe and Asia. The pay wasn’t bad.

    5. When I did this (I graduated from my undergrad before i knew whether I’d gotten into med school so I wasn’t sure if I was looking for a summer job or a 16 month job) I literally sat down with newspapers and job-search sites and just looked through the jobs available in my small town. I applied for all kinds of random stuff. I really wanted to do something interesting and different and just explore a bit before I settled into my defined career path.

      I ended up working in community access for children with disabilities by day, and bartended on weekends. It was great!

  14. Ideas for fun indoor activities (besides the obvious one, although that’s on the agenda too…) that husband and I can do this frigid weekend? Preferably that don’t involve leaving the house? It’s supposed to feel like -27 in Boston and we need some serious recharging (movies, binge watching Transparent) and also some fun that doesn’t involve a screen. Thanks!

    1. Jigsaw puzzle, cooking some elaborate meals, tackling a small home project, editing/organizing photos, reading books.

      1. I second the cooking and maybe an elaborate dessert/baking endeavor. And/or make bread.

        Also what about a yoga video or something that raises your body temps?

        1. Oooh, yes. Plus wine! This Bostonian might do just the same with her DH!

          Also on the agenda is unpacking/organizing a closet that has become a pit since we moved in way too many months ago, reading a book – paper & print book!, and doing an at-home workout. After that and cooking we’re going to binge watch Netflix, too.

    2. We’ve done pictionary and charades, which are always fun. Also, find fun couples questions lists online and run through those.

    3. I am probably the only one, but I’m kind of looking forward to walking around a bit in the frigid-ness :) I love cold weather, not for weeks on end like the last 2 years, but I’ve been craving real cold a bit so far this year!

      1. Yeah, no. When the windchills are in the -20, it’s not so much a walk outside as a waddle from being bundled up. +20 F, I might understand, but not -20.

        This is nose-hair freezing, hurts to breathe, eye-watering, burns your skin kind of cold. Though, I’m assuming the sun will be out.

    4. Not a fun activity, but we are planning to deal with our taxes when we are trapped in the house this weekend.

      Playing a looong board game like Monopoly is another fun suggestion

    1. Hotels: Montelucia; Phoenician; Westin Kierland; Four Seasons; or try VRBO – tons of people rent out their houses.

      Eat: Depends on where you stay. I love Arcadia Farms in Old Town Scottsdale. Go up to Cave Creek if you have a car – very cute cowboy vibe – eat at El Encanto.

    2. Was just there for a conference.
      Stayed at JW Marriott Camelback Inn. Very nice.
      Best restaurant was Fuego Bistro. Kind of a hidden gem but so worth it.

  15. Is anyone prepared in case of a disaster? My dad isn’t what I’d call a “prepper” but he seems to be getting close. He sent me his super detailed plan that covers all sorts of contingencies. We’ve thought through some things and have a stash of food, water, batteries, a hand crank radio, solar chargers, etc. I think the most important thing we have is that we plan to meet back at our apartment if something happens and then decide how to proceed. We also have a plan in place to relay messages if possible through our parents in case we can not reach each other directly because local cell calls can’t get through.

    I’m finding it difficult to try and figure out other things for our plan because we live in NYC in a small apartment. We won’t be able to do a bunch of the things my dad is doing in the suburbs because we just don’t have the space or specific things (i.e. propane tanks for a camp stove) are not allowed within NYC.

    What kind of plan do you have in place?

    1. In Canada so YMMV – general advice (govt) here is to be able to take care of yourself for 72 hours after the disaster as that is often how long it takes to get emergency services in place. That can be as simple as keeping a tote with extra blankets, candles/matches and some canned food+ can opener, bottled water and knowing where your important documents are in case you need to leave your house quickly.

    2. I have every intention of putting together an emergency kit, but talk about procrastination – I live in the Northeast and have wanted to do this ever since Hurricane Sandy :)

      I do plan to pack a backpack with essential supplies like a first aid kit, food, water sterilizing pen, etc. for myself and my husband. I also want to keep our bikes pumped up and ready to go since I figure we can go a lot farther on those than on foot. We are likely moving to CA and will have to reconsider for the earthquake and/or tsunami risks – I’m originally from CA and vividly remember having earthquake emergency kits all through elementary school.

      I also want to have a better plan in place for meet-ups, emergency cash supply, etc. Why am I procrastinating on something so important??

      1. ETA: One thing I do think is really important is being able to rely on non-electric and non-gas modes of transportation in case of an emergency. I cringe when I read about emergency plans that are completely dependent on a full tank of gas or a working subway. Be prepared to use your feet or bike and make sure you can carry/run with your essentials. You don’t want to be lugging a trash can behind you because you thought you’d be able to throw it in your truck. Backpacks are the way to go.

        1. On this note, I was always trained to have a mini emergency kit in the car — not for escaping a natural disaster but for a car emergency like a flat tire, running out of gas, spinning off the road in icy roads, etc. Kit includes sneakers/snow boats, scraper, blankets, flashlights, candle/matches, flares, water, granola bars, bandaids, disinfectant, etc.

          1. + a million to shoes. I was flabbergasted by the number of women stranded in their cars in Atlanta’s snowpocalypse because they’d worn heels that day and had no sneakers/boots etc in the trunk for emergencies.

          2. This reminds me that I keep meaning to stash my old pair of sneakers at my office. The thought of getting down 40+ flights of stairs in dress shoes frightens me. An old boss brought it up in our orientation meeting because she vividly remembers evacuating the building during 9/11 in heels.

      2. I live in LA (obviously). I have two separate disaster plans:

        1 – something happens (aka earthquake) and there isn’t electricity / gas and I have to stay home for several days. (Terrible earthquake + riots does not seem out of the realm of possibility…) I have a stockpile of food and water (for human and pets) that will last around a week. I could probably survive a full month off the food in the house, but only several days of water. (Figuring a gallon per person per day.) I also have a small camp stove and also some stuff like duct tape, extra batteries, candles, etc.

        2 – something happens (aka earthquake) and we are supposed to evacuate. Part of my “emergency closet” is a packed backpack with food (human and pet), some water, first aid kit, copies of important documents, etc etc. What preppers would call a “bug out bag”. Do I think I’m going to need to grab that bag and run away down the street? No. But I’m glad I’ve thought through everything in there ahead of time – I think that if I were trying to pack it on the fly, I would probably wind up evacuating with, like, three socks, an orange marker and one granola bar. I also have a similar backpack already in the trunk of my car, in case disaster strikes when I’m not home.

        FWIW, I also live in an apartment and can’t have a fully stocked bunker of stuff. But all the stuff listed just takes up one corner of a closet. The water takes up the most space but is probably the most crucial. Also, I have a hand crank flashlight / radio combo that has a USB charge port.

    3. No, I think that seems a little excessive for me. I don’t have much anxiety about natural disasters and short of some type of war or surprise massive bombing in my city, I don’t think I will need to have a camp stove, water sterilization tablets, etc packed up so I can be ready to go with no warning. I make sure I have food, etc, if there is some type of weather event, but I don’t think I really need to do much else. If I need to go somewhere, I can pack a bag. If I don’t have time to do that, I guess I’m dead anyway so what does it matter?

      1. You may need to walk on foot to a Red Cross center or emergency shelter. You wouldn’t want to have to pack a bag at the last second in the stress of the moment (especially if you were in a partially collapsed building or something), but it’s not really an “I’m dead anyway” situation.

    4. My husband and I have a zombie apocalypse emergency plan. I wish I were joking.

    5. Wow. I have to say that I have never once given this a second thought….Can I just ask exactly what you foresee happening that will require running with all your gear and important documents?

      1. I live in earthquake country. Also we have serious wildfires here. So we have a couple of months of food stored up, about 50 gallons worth of water, things like that. My husband would be responsible for getting power back on to his clients, so taking off and staying at a hotel somewhere wouldn’t be an option – we’d need to stay close for his clients. So we also have a generator that can run the fridge / freezer.

        Anything can happen – natural disaster, fire….windstorm…random contamination of your water supply upstream…our power was out for 5 days once just from a windstorm. We ran the generator and we were fine.

        It is a good idea to have more than just the 72 hours or whatever FEMA requires. Certainly if there was a big earthquake, it could take longer than that just to get the roads passable again.

        1. Same here- I lived through the Northridge quake and my parents house gets evacuated yearly because of fires– water, food, jacket, shoes, blankets, flashlights are the minimum.
          Also, always try to keep your gas tank full…I’m not as great with that one, but it’s a very good idea.

      2. My parents are in the PNW. His list includes earthquake, wildfires, and other natural disasters (including a major asteroid strike that he admits has a very low likelihood of happening in our lifetime), war or terrorism (EMP, nuclear war, dirty bomb) and cyberattacks.

        Big on my list would be earthquake, hurricane, and terrorist attack. We’ve been well prepared for the short term things we’ve experienced like Sandy. I’d like to get prepared for something that could happen suddenly or would potentially have a longer period of time that we’d need supplies for as well as a plan in place in case we can’t stay at our apartment.

    6. We have bottled water and these handy backpack emergency kits. And we have flashlights. We have a carrier for the cat. We don’t have a muzzle for the dog (these are recommended if you have to go to a shelter). I have friends outside the city and we usually keep the car with gas in it. We live in DC so we have a plan of where to meet if we can’t go the direction of our apartment.

      http://www.amazon.com/Ready-America-70280-Emergency-2-Person/dp/B000FJQQVI

    7. I am in San Francisco so we have a backpaack with earthquake supplies: flashlight, batteries, reflective blankets, food, copies of documents, extra cash (small denominations).

    8. For minor issues – food, water, flashlights, med kits, etc.

      For if the sh#t really hits the fan – a lot of 9 and 223.

    9. I keep a lantern/flashlights plus batteries and a weather radio on hand. If there is some natural disaster that may knock out power for a few days predicted, I’ll make sure I have cash and a tank of gas (because if power’s out, the gas pumps and credit card readers aren’t working) and some water/food, but it’s not something I keep on hand. I keep a copy of important identification documents in my safe deposit box, but that’s more for if I lose them rather than them getting destroy in some natural disaster. Where I live, we don’t tend to have major natural disasters that would requiring planning too far in advance–snow storms, hurricanes, and potential floods you know are coming, we don’t get earthquakes, and with a tornado, you can’t really do much to prepare for that other than knowing where your windowless room/basement is… My town’s not exactly a desirable terrorism target, and I don’t think the zombie apocalypse is happening any time soon, so I figure that’s probably good enough for expected disasters. The only major disaster I’ve experienced was growing up, my town had a major flood due to a tropical depression and we had no fresh running water for a month (flooded and severely messed up the water treatment plant).

    10. In addition to the above, we have a stash of ~$500 in small bills in our earthquake backpacks, just in case ATMs aren’t working.

    11. I have a pretty extensive prep plan. I call it my Zombie Apocalypse Plan. I grew up military, so there’s a bit of overpreparedness that sticks with you.

      In my car, I keep supplies that you might need/want for a car-ride emergency when you can’t be reached for up to 24 hours – space blankets, poncho, TP, basic first aid kit, meal bars, water, candles and matches, shovel and cardboard (for getting off ice). In the house, I keep my camping supplies packed with BOB of a few extras in some pouches – documents, extra clothes, extra batteries, radio, etc.

      In case of any really world-changing emergencies, the plan is to get to a parent’s isolated cabin, where we could basically live off the grid.

    12. We are in MA. We have a rubbermaid tote in our basement that has bottled water (2 gal) and 12 water bottles, 3 cans of dogfood, a spare dog leash, a laminated copy of our dog’s rabies vaccination, canned food and canopener, flashlight, batteries, solar charger and $50 cash. I think there was baby food in there when we had a baby that couldn’t eat normal food. In each of our cars, we have shovels, 10 or so diapers/wipes, some shelf stable snacks (but not canned food), blankets, and a 24 pack of bottled water that is more full than not (we drink from it and replace as needed). I also have photos of our licenses, SSNs, and critical medical records [mostly just the dog’s rabies vacc but I have my toddler’s recent shots there too] all stored on google cloud.

      We also have a ton of bottled water in the garage and firewood stacked in the yard (we have 2 fireplaces that are use-able [regularly cleaned] but never used, a small generator that can power a fridge and one other thing [space heater, charger, whatever], and 2 gas cans full (used for lawnmower but kept full for emergencies).

      We have a plan to meet back up, but we also have a “everyone gets evacuated before we can get to our meetup place” meet up place that is about 20 miles from where we live, away from the city, vaguely near the state’s emergency mgmt bunker and not near flood-able lands.

      1. We have a dog muzzle too and a chest harness. I forgot about that but our dog is skittish and heavy so we wanted to be able to handle him easily in a scary situation.

    13. Well, Amazon seems to know something we don’t know, so definitely start getting prepared for the zombie apocalypse and check out Section 57.10 in their new terms of use:

      https://aws.amazon.com/service-terms/

      57.10 Acceptable Use; Safety-Critical Systems. […] However, this restriction will not apply in the event of the occurrence (certified by the United States Centers for Disease Control or successor body) of a widespread viral infection transmitted via bites or contact with bodily fluids that causes human corpses to reanimate and seek to consume living human flesh, blood, brain or nerve tissue and is likely to result in the fall of organized civilization.

    14. I grew up with a mother who didn’t believe in too many canned beans, so I always have some shelf stable food around. I like camping, so I always have water purification systems available. (For many years, I also had a boyfriend who always had a few thousand in cash hidden in a boot somewhere, and a plan to liberate/steal a boat from its Hudson River dock, so I generally spent many years well prepared.)

      Now, I keep my extra sneakers (whichever ones I’ve recently stopped running in) in my trunk, a disaster preparation backpack kit I buy online (because I also keep meaning to prepare one, but never do), and my passport/cash with me. Assuming I am in my city, I can always make it on foot to my home, and I have enough supplies on hand to survive any event I might want to survive. I have no interest in living like a character from “The Road,” so my preparation has boundaries.

    15. I live in the deep South and have experienced personally one weather emergency (an ice storm) that left the city without water for about three days and my house without electricity for 21 days. I know, I know, but I’m the last house on a dead end street, and even though I live right in the middle of a town of about 18,000, that’s what happened.

      I also went to the Miss. Coast and volunteered three weeks after Katrina. So, a couple of years ago when the Miss. River was in danger of flooding or breaching the levee, I gathered what I needed in case of quick evacuation: enough cat carriers for each cat (only two), cat food, water, important papers, a car full of gasoline and pickup with four wheel drive also ready to go (just in case), laptop, and lots of peanut butter and bread.

      For non-evacuation crises, I keep flashlights fully charged, oil lamps and oil, propane lamps and propane, which will also work for the grill, and a couple of gallons of water. Living without electricity for 21 days teaches you what you really need. Immediately after the ice storm, there was no propane within a three hour drive. Stores could not open the first few days, gasoline pumps could not run without electricity and when they did open, lines were miles long and they limited how much you could put in your car, atms did not work, plus the roads were impassable due to limbs, trees, utility poles, and transformers blocking every road. You get the picture, and we learned how totally dependent we were on electricity!

  16. Banana Republic — they had a “Martin” pant that was basically a straight legged pant (not skinny or wide, and probably like mid-rise on the waist) that was perfect for me for a suit. Now I’m seeing in stores that they don’t have that one but rather they have the Logan, Ryan, and Avery. Please tell me that one of these replaces the Martin? As BR is the only place where I can get a suit that fits and looks good on me.

    1. I always thought the Martin’s were a bit on the wide side. I feel like the Logan isn’t exactly new (I swear I have a pair of Logans from about 3 years ago), and found those to be on the straight but slim-ish side. Probably the only one of the 3 I’d consider buying since I’m tired of the cold ankle trend (can’t wear those for a good 7 months of the year).

    2. OMG they got rid of the Martin? That was my go-to as well. Wasn’t that their “forever classic”? BR you’re killin’ me…

      1. BR has been seriously going downhill in the last year! Everything classic is being discontinued, and a lot of their current stuff has weird patterns and ruffles and fits. Bummer.

    3. Your option are the Ryan or the Logan. The other two are cropped/ankle length (Sloan; Avery) which I suspect you don’t want for a business suit unless your office is really casual. The Ryan is midrise, straight leg, but with a slimmer/narrower fit. The Logan is described as a trouser pant — straight fit, trouser leg. I assume the Logan replaces the Martin but I don’t know bc I haven’t tried one on yet — I don’t know how/where the waist falls. I’m hoping they just slapped a new name on the Martin and that was that.

      1. I always though the difference between the Martin and the Jackson had more to do with how it fit through the hips…but it’s been awhile since I wore either.

  17. I have a friend whose dad (probably in his late 70s) was recently and suddenly diagnosed with Stage 4 cancer. She lives in DC and her parents are in California, so she has flown out there and been there for the last month. I check in via email every 4-8 days, asking how he is, how she/family is, and letting her know that she’s free to respond but doesn’t have to. What else do I say?? I feel like I’m saying the same thing every time. Things have gotten rough now bc he started chemo — he was more “ok” a week or two ago when they were still working on a diagnosis but now with chemo he is very weak and declining and she sounds REALLY worried/scared (of course). I know there’s nothing I can do — but what to say? Or not to say?

    1. Just contacting her regularly is perfect. Just listen. Ask how he is. Then ask how she is. Let her vent. She can’t vent to her family the way she needs to, so it is great she can vent to you. Remind her to sleep. Remind her to eat. Remind her to take a walk outside, in the sun, once a day.

      Tell her you are sorry this is so hard. Tell her you thinking about her, and that she is a good daughter. Send her father a card and tell him how much your friend means to you and that he must be something special to have raised such lovely and caring daughter. Tell him that you are thinking about him.

      You are a very good friend.

      Don’t say…. “Have you thought about hospice”? Don’t say…. “sometimes its all for the best”. Don’t answer questions that haven’t been asked. Just listen.

  18. There’s been a lot of financial talk here lately so hopefully people are still in the mood for it on a Friday afternoon — how do you resist the urge to SAVE SAVE SAVE? I know the salary coming in, I max out the 401k and have liquid savings beyond that every month, and then obviously pay my bills. Yet I’ve fallen into this routine where I don’t want to spend any more beyond my bills — i.e. on fun, vacations etc. Part of it is that I was in biglaw for 8-9 yrs, didn’t make partner and lost my job and was out of work for 12+ months. But I have been back at work (at a lower salary but also in a lower cost of living city) for 9 months. With the job loss, I knew it was coming so I had saved up for it, and now I am back on track with 9 months of working again. And yet I feel like I’m being a bit too frugal bc now I have that fear of — I don’t know what’ll happen in life, I have to save everything I can. My parents have pointed out that I’m doing this, but I noticed it myself bc I was on a business trip last week in Florida and I had an afternoon to myself on the weekend so I hit the beach and cute little town and was SO happy and refreshed in just 3-5 hrs. And now I’m thinking (and my parents are saving) — spend some money, go on vacations, enjoy your life, and don’t live in this “save every last dime” mentality just bc you lost one job at one point in your career. How do I get past this?

    1. 1. Pick a week.
      2. Tell your boss you will be taking vacation days that week (and get boss’s approval, obvs.).
      3. Once vacation week is approved, open laptop.
      4. Go to JetBlue.com.
      5. Click on “Getaways.”
      6. Look at their available deals from your city.
      7. Pick one.
      8. Click “book now.”
      9. Go on vacation.

      1. ETA: What I was trying to accomplish here is, this doesn’t have to be some big sweeping self-discovery thing – just book the d@mn vacation. Not everything has to be a psychological crisis, you know?

        1. OP here — I realize HOW one books a vacation, but thanks that was super helpful. So let me clarify my question — how do you know when you are saving “enough” and thus can have some disposable expenditure? Is there a target that people try to meet? Is it just saying — I will go on vacation (to a concert; on a roadtrip etc.) x number of times per yr unless something drastic happens? Is it some other metric? It’s not a psychological crisis but a financial planning question.

          1. Where do you want to go? What do you want to see? How much time can you take off? How much will that cost if I do the budget route, How much will that cost if I splurge on a hotel?

            Start squirreling away money until you hit you expected costs + 10-25%.

          2. I’ll be honest, it doesn’t sound like a financial planning question to me, it sounds to me like you have developed a lot of anxiety around spending money in general (not spending anything beyond your bills? I mean, do you shop, do you go out to eat, do you ever buy yourself something nice?). Vacation does not have to be some big giant expense that has to be “financially planned” – pick a place you want to go, figure out how much you’re willing to spend to go there, then, assuming you have the money without affecting your ability to pay your bills, book the trip and go.

          3. I’m going to chime in here on the side of saving on a plan. I say that b/c I am 58 years old and am about to take early retirement. I’ve worked hard all my life and also came into the practice of law at a good time and have done well financially, or I would not be taking this step. I’m single and have no real financial responsibilities in terms of children, although I have helped my niece and nephew substantially.

            All that said, I wish I had really had a better savings PLAN. I saved, invested, etc. but I did not have a set plan as to how much I should/could save. I’m not a big spender, but once I quit paying off student loans, I took vacations once or twice a year (time was the real problem, as I worked long, long hours). But it is also easy to fritter a lot of money on little things.

            Having a financial advisor who can put together a plan for how much you need to save to be able to have “x” income after you retire I think would be a really good motivator, plus give you the peace of mind not to be a miser and to enjoy life while you are working and before retirement.

    2. Make fun/vacation part of your budget/saving plan. Save FOR a vacation, and then take it, knowing that is the purpose of having that money. Set a dollar amount for your various saving accounts (e-fund, rainy day accounts) based on their purposes (6 months of fixed expenses, money for the year’s worth of car insurance), so you know you’ve hit the goal and it’s “ok” to spend money over that amount.

      If it feels like you are just endlessly saving without a goal, it can seem like an unachievable goal you’ll never reach.

      1. This is what I’d suggest. Add a line item to your monthly budget to funnel money into a specific travel savings account. Saving with a purpose seems like it could help.

        This weekend I’d make a big list of all the places I want to go, rank them in order of what sounds best right now, set up an auto transfer of $x (maybe $250) each month, then when you have enough to easily afford trip #1 on your list go ahead and book it.

    3. I think it just takes time, honestly. I was unemployed for a year after law school and when I finally landed a job (in Big Law, so it paid very well), it took me about a year before spending money on non-essential items didn’t give me anxiety.

    4. I get it. I have been there.

      You need an objective third party’s professional opinion on how much to save. Talk to three financial planners, lay out your income, expenses, employment situation, and long term goals. Get their opinions on two things: 1) how much you should have in your emergency fund and 2) what percent of your take-home pay you should save, and where you should put that money.

      Compare all three opinions and select the most conservative. Follow that advice for six months. AND (this is important!) three months into this, book an appointment with a therapist for 14 weeks in the future.

      Then, at. the six month mark, stop and assess. If, after six months of following your most conservative financial planner’s advice, you still feel underlying panic at spending money on ‘non-essentials,’ then go to that therapy appointment. If you find yourself feeling secure and OK with money, cancel the appointment.

      Good luck.

  19. I need some help ladies if anyone has any relevant advice or experience (Warning wall of text…)

    I’m a fourth year Biglaw (AmLaw 100) associate. I graduated from a top law school and this is always what I wanted, or so I thought.

    I hate Biglaw and I can’t stand the pressure any more. First I thought I would be working in Biglaw forever. Then I told myself I would only do it until my debt was paid off. Now I don’t even care about paying off my student loans because staying here will cost me my sanity.

    I know I need to make a change and go to a smaller firm, or a boutique one or even in house if I can swing it and that’s not the thing I’m finding difficult. I know the market is tough but I’m confident enough in my credentials that I will find something if I try.

    This is going to sound so shallow but I am terrified at the thought of living on less money. My parents weren’t super rich but they were definitely above middle class. They were well off enough that they were able to pay for my undergrad and I only needed to take out loans for law school because they were retiring and I didn’t want to cost them that dream or delay it.

    I have family and friends who make way less money than me and they aren’t dirt poor or anything. I don’t think I’m more important because I make more money but I’m amazed that they are happy and everything. I know I have an issue with equating money and happiness and I need to get over it for my sanity.

    My family and I all live in a HCoL area. My cousin lives on a year 1/5th of what I make, and half of what a bonus would be for me. I mean yes she lives in a small apartment, takes the bus and doesn’t travel like I could do if I have time but she is happy and I want that too. I don’t know how she can live on that salary without living on the street. I feel poor sometimes even though I know it’s far from the truth.

    I know I need to get over my fear of making a change and making less money and that it’s all my own issue. The job hunting will be easy, it’s all the other stuff I’m scared off. I cry myself to sleep at night because if work I don’t want to do that anymore. If anyone has any advice or experience with this I would appreciate hearing it.

    1. I’m afraid you might be in for some harsh answers – but in this case the answer is simple, and I mean this with all kindness: You will be happier on a lower salary in a good job than you are right now.

    2. Have you read the Mr Money Mustache blog? Check that out. You need a super huge shift in your thinking about what it means to be “rich” and what it means to be “poor.”

    3. I think you are very self-aware and having a bit of an existential crisis. You grew up rich. (If your parents paid for your undergraduate education, unless you are over 45 years old, they’re rich.) And you are used to living with a certain standard. That’s fine. The question is, can you see a life for yourself below that standard, or will you feel like a failure? I think it’s a tough question many of us have faced. I certainly face it, and I decided I want the money. But if you hate your job, it seems hardly worth it.

      1. I won’t feel like a failure or unimportant if I make less, I fear not having for things. I know this sounds shallow but I have never needed to plan or save for anything, the money has always been there. I could go shopping, go on a vacation, buy some jewelry etc. It was shock to have to make payments on my loans when I first got a job because I had always been able to get everything I wanted because the money was there. I fear the shock factor x 1000 if I take a job for less pay.

        (Also I’m sorry if I came off as shallow in my original post. I don’t pity people who make less than me or think they aren’t valuable people, I just feel like it’s weird how they can live on less and not freak out like I am. I also know this is my issue to work on.)

        1. In-house money or small-firm money is far (faaaaaaaaaar) from hand-to-mouth living. What “things” are you buying that you’re afraid to not be able to buy anymore? I mean, you sound like a nice person, and I can understand why you’re having an issue with this (because it sounds like you’ve literally never had to budget ever in your life for anything), but honestly? “Buy whatever I want whenever I feel like it” is not the normal state of affairs for most people. Most people have to budget. Would I like to be able to waltz into Neiman’s and just buy whatever for the fun of it? Sure. But is my life any worse because I can’t? Not in any way that actually matters.

          Look at it this way – unlimited access to things, unlimited purchasing power, unlimited stuff – where has it gotten you? Has your money bought you any happiness? Scaling back your lifestyle and your spending to have a job that doesn’t make you cry yourself to sleep is basically you “buying” back your chance at happiness.

          Practically speaking, you should start working on living on a budget now, before you make the job switch. It’s actually not that different than going on a diet – start by tracking all of the money you spend for a month or two. What are your bills? What else are you spending on? What are you saving? Figure out where you money is going. Once you know that, start figuring out where you can scale back without affecting your quality of life. Which of your expenditures are actually making your life happier vs. which ones are you making just because? Once you’ve decided where you actually want your money to go, start scaling back in other places. Basically, start practicing living on a smaller salary now, while you still have the large salary to fall back on if you mess up, and once you get into the habit of being mindful about your money, the idea of making less will scare you less.

        2. Maybe I can shed some light on this, if in a slightly different context. When I was married my former husband and I had a big combined income and ridiculously low housing costs. We were able to take great vacations, buy pretty much whatever we wanted, and felt pretty darn rich ( it’s not single person Big Law rich). And I was miserable.

          Now it’s just me, making a big income but with my housing costs. I have to budget. I can’t buy whatever I want. I am able to take one big vacation a year, but I have to plan and save for it. I worry about money from time to time. And you know what? I am ridiculously happy. I stayed in my marriage for years because I thought I couldn’t afford to get divorced. And now that I’m on the other side my only regret is that I waited so long.

          I posted about it on the site when I was thinking about leaving but worried about the money, and somebody suggested thinking about it in terms of “emotional dollars.” I found that to be a useful concept at the time, and I still do.

          Having less money takes some getting used to, but being miserable for the sake of having a lot of money is totally, totally not worth it. Your happiness is what’s important. Don’t let fear hold you back.

          1. Gah. High housing costs, not my housing costs. Well, my high housing costs, I guess. Miss the edit function.

    4. I’m also a little worried you’re going to get some harsh responses, so I’ll pipe up with an understanding one.

      I’m a senior associate in biglaw contemplating an in-house move which (best case scenario) will probably reduce my earnings by 33%+. I had a period of “How can I possibly do this????” since the reduction takes me back to what I was earning several years ago. I then took a very close look at my finances and budget to get an idea of where my money is going and what can be cut. E.g., moving from a more convenient/more expensive childcare option to a less convenient/less expensive option; stopping additional money that is going into investments that we don’t need critically at this stage; recognizing that actually getting a 401k match (when I’ve never had one at a law firm!) will actually help offset some of the changes. It is definitely daunting, but having a game plan was huge for me.

      Good luck!

      1. I’ll chime in with another perspective. Yes, big law horrible. But the terror of lower money can be horrible too. For example, I had sudden divorce, after many years of being lawyer non-big law. We were very comfortable. Suddenly my income wasn’t enough to pay for life + kid + crisis. Not easy to monetize now to double or triple pay. Can’t move to a cheap town in Kansas- stuck in my pricey city due to custody situation. Cut expenses where could, working on passive income streams, working full time, and parenting. The money part is very stressful! To do it again, I”d have maximized earning early, socked as much as humanly possible away, and THEN only THEN quit. I truly know what the tradeoffs are, and they are awful. But, you lose the ability to leverage your earning power when you step off the track many times. My story is divorce-related, but it opened my eyes to what you hear about many ,many people: one crisis away from bankruptcy. Throw in a medical situation, unemployment, and a few legal motions and you can quickly be, really, a few hundred grand in the hole. I’m not, but I could be. It’s terrifying. I could be homeless. It’s no joke. There is no backstop. So weigh things carefully. One option: stuff like in-house. That’s sort of what I do, the money is less but it is not too bad… though I am majorly focused on how to make more now, ideally in business for myself. The lifestyle is good at least.

        Examples: in the past year, I had major unexpected home maintenance costs ($20k range type stuff), car problems (kept paying, finally got a new one, paid for that), legal costs (holy crap, I never understood why people hate us til I got $40k bills for 2 weeks of bad work)… and my company did demotions/stopped paying bonuses. Nope, these numbers don’t add up to my salary, way over it on top of basic costs. I don’t eat out, I don’t have cable, bla bla, life in US is expensive. Being able to make money is a good thing because it can mean security in crazy times. I have been giving stuff to a local tent city in my area with several women and kids/babies living outside. Some of their stories are not that far off from mine- I can see how the cliff happens.

        So I don’t have any advice on big law, because I could not do it just on the hours and the nature of the atmosphere- but want to legitimize your thoughts about not making a good income being scary. It is. Yes, people do it, and many of them struggle at times. The ones who are loving it (and I have been there) may not have huge challenges crop up, or they may, which quickly shift the state into one of extreme stress. Guess what else happens when you don’t have money? Things snowball. You can’t fix the car til next check, so it dies while you are on your way to an important meeting, so you get fired; you don’t repair that thing, so it goes totally bust rather than clunky; stuff like this. It is real. You don’t hire people to offload some of the burden at home in yard etc., so you get ill too often from being overtaxed, which then perpetuates cycle of not being able to perform such that you can make more money. Not every broke person has this stuff happen but I’ve been SHOCKED by how quickly it can, once I started noticing and feeling impacts myself. Money is a form of self-care and insurance no matter how tough to get it.

    5. Why be so abstract about this? What do you make as a 4th yr — 200-250k? I seem to recall it’s somewhere around there but I’ve been out of biglaw for a few yrs, so I don’t recall exactly. Why compare yourself to people making 1/4 of that who have a 2 hr commute by bus and go on vacation once in 5 yrs? Do you really think if you go inhouse or boutique, you’ll be making 50-60k trying to manage life in NYC or SF or whatever high cost city you’re in?

      I’m not criticizing you — I’m a former biglaw senior associate who also puts a lot of focus on money and being able to buy what I want, take a last minute vacation etc. — and I don’t understand people who take HUGE salary cuts to go be AUSAs or non profit attys or whatever bc it’ll make them “happy” bc to me every job has its downsides and its BS and I’d rather be in one that at least affords me the lifestyle I want.

      So if I were you, I’d sit down and look back at your expenses for the last 2 yrs and see what you’re spending — not only rent, utilities etc. but once you factor in shopping, vacations etc. How much do you need coming in to keep your spending at that level? And then use that to inform you of the choices to pursue that get you to where you “need” to be monetarily (whether anyone else thinks you need 2 vacations a yr or not). What I found as a senior associate was that while I was spending freely on anything I wanted, I was still WELL below my salary + bonus level, so I knew I could take a sizeable cut w/o altering my lifestyle. Hopefully the same ends up being true for you and you aren’t in a golden handcuffs kind of situation. If you are — you are ONLY a 4th yr. There’s plenty of time to (i) up your savings A LOT in your current job; or (ii) look for another biglaw job bc you may find a different mix of work and people more tolerable at least for a few more yrs.

    6. You sort of remind me of the blonde from 2 broke girls. It might be really good for you to totally reset your standards/expectations. But I think the easiest way to do that would be to find your new job, and adjust your spending according to your new salary. Maybe try to start cutting back now so you can save up a little cushion (and pay down more of your loans) while you are job hunting… Like, if your lease is up find a more modest apartment, stop buying new clothes/shoes for a while. Try to think about what actually makes you happy, and why. Is it the idea of being poor that bothers you, or does it just seem that terrible to live in a small apartment and shop at a thrift store? (Are you the 4th year who was so worried because her cousin took the non-profit job?)

    7. Honestly I have family members like you they aren’t what I’m would describe as good people, they value stuff way to much and they don’t value time enough. It drives me bonkers that they put so much emphasis on what is essentially mess, because let’s be real materialistic people aren’t exactly minimal and organized. I like having the time to go to a museum, my family members work during museum hours and thus can never go. I like that during holidays I don’t need to check my email. The stuff doesn’t make them happy that’s why they keep buying more, they have a giant void in their life. It looks like you have that void too, do you have passions, hobbies, pets, a spouse? Those things are fulfilling, a closet of designer clothes is not.

    8. I also think you need some concrete planning to figure out how you are currently living and what a job change might bring. Have you never seriously considered an item’s price? Are you driving a Lamborghini, spending $2000 a night on hotel rooms, and wearing $10,000 suits? If not, then you have an idea of what it means to live within your means. And your means can change. You have to figure out what it is you value, and whether the “shock value” is worth it.

      I gave up more than 60% of my income to leave Biglaw. It was a big change — not because I grew up with money, but because I didn’t and my family thought it was insane to do so. But I knew that I could live, and well, on less; no one else in my family had ever made as much as I made as a first year associate, much less a fifth year. But not hating my job and doing something meaningful was worth it.

      Money buys security, absolutely — Anon for this makes that clear. But caring for a child is different than worrying about paying for a vacation guilt free. You need to do the (hard) work of looking at your spending, your budget, and figure out what your priorities are. It can be done.

      1. My point though is that planning for 1-2 years down the road can be shortsighted. You don’t know what might happen in out years that is outside your control, and giving up earning power is a big deal. I’m not suggesting staying miserable, just giving earnings weight. While my situation is not ideal, it is insanely better than the many, many women who were SAHMs and got divorced and are now dependent without a career. Granted, many often enjoyed and still enjoy better quality of life than me (generalization but I see it a lot), but no way would I want to be without options to earn my own income. Sadly with law as everyone knows we get off the wheel and you become hardly employable almost immediately because there is such a long line of people behind you. I’m shifting to entrepreneurial stuff to try to have more control over all of it. Good luck to all- not easy stuff!

  20. I don’t often post, but I wouldn’t mind a little positive energy/virtual hugs. I don’t know if this will out me, but so be it.

    I’ve been pursuing a dissolution of my domestic partnership pro se, hoping to gain some financial comfort to help me recover from all the support I provided over ten years. He still won’t agree but submitted nothing in support of his allegations that we were never more than room-mates. Mind-boggling. I can continue through the settlement conference phase pro se but will probably have to retain counsel thereafter. It just sucks that he can continue to lie and lie in the face of so much evidence!

    Ladies, protect yourselves! Don’t be a chump! Don’t sacrifice your self, your sanity or your future! Stand up for yourselves! Keep records! I’m an educated, intelligent person, yet I too was taken in. Just… dunno. Be strong. Love yourself more than you love any one else. Always.

    1. Hi Celia, sorry to hear, but isn’t it better that he’s claiming to have been nothing more than roommates if you supported him over 10 years (unless you provided the support that allowed him to become an lucrative dr and now he’s screwing you over…

  21. I have a family situation that I could really use some advice on, and with so many people here being in the law field I think it will be helpful to me.

    I come from a family of lawyers. They all work in Biglaw or at other really prestigious firms/positions. I’m in my final year of law school and they expecting that I will take a job in Biglaw once I graduate. The thing is I don’t want to.

    I’m not trying to bash anyone who works in Biglaw or at a firm but it is not for me. I don’t ever care if I make partner or make 6 figures. I want to work for social services agency/charity as an advocate or in a DA’s office. My family will not be happy with this, especially my parents. I went to school on a scholarship and I’m financially independent from them and I know it’s my life and I have to live it, but I do want to have a good relationship with my family.

    How can I tell them? This may seem like such a petty, first world problem but I gave been stressing about it for months. My parents have talked for years about me working at a firm and making partner.

      1. My cousin’s are all male so it’s doubtful. Did someone post somewhere else about their cousin not wanting to join a Biglaw firm after she graduates from law school?

    1. They will get over it. Seriously.

      This is growing up. You can do it.

      And way to go. I’m proud of you.

      1. +1. I think the most valuable lesson my dad ever taught me was to have the sense of self and commitment to do whatever I wanted in life and not be beholden to convention or to other people’s expectations. As I get older I’m starting to understand how hard that is and also how valuable it is. This is hard but it’ll be so, so worth it in the end.

        Also, yay you :)

    2. If they love you, and I’m going to just guess and say hat even if they disapprove, your parents do love and care about you, then they will accept it eventually and get used to it. I made the switch from a high prestige ibanking job (I was approaching a total mental breakdown) to a policy job (1/2 of the salary, but still 70k and very livable EVEN in SF) and couldn’t be happier. I finally could start cooking my own meals and getting some exercise and lost 40 lbs and am finally ‘healthy’ at my annual check ups. I had time to date and have a partner now. I got a cat and I love it. My parents were really really displeased at this change but they did eventually accept it and support me now (it took about 2 years). HAve faith!!

    3. Apply to jobs you want and big law jobs. The market is tough! I know a couple of people in big law because they didn’t get public interest jobs. Those jobs are competitive!

      As for your parents, you have to live your life whether they accept it or not. You can’t control their thoughts or reactions.

      1. Sunny has good advice.

        You can always apply to non-profit/govt/ etc later on in your career (and many of them prefer biglaw experience and training) but going to biglaw isn’t always as easy after 3L year.

        For my Asian parents, all it took was a few suicidal/ill/burnt out high-achievers and their own experiences with high expectations from their own parents to allow me to do whatever I want.

        Do what you want but do it knowing that you’re doing it for you! Enjoy 3L!

  22. I have a professional conference in San Francisco at the end of this month. Sheath dresses and pencil skirts ok for this? I’m coming from the Midwest and could use some advice on dressing professionally in CA.

    Also, any independent school r e t t e s going to NAIS, by chance, and want to meet up?

    1. I can’t speak to what is standard at your specific conference, but what you describe is more than fine for SF generally.

  23. Just a vent.

    I am a first year associate and I work in Biglaw. I grew up in Kentucky in the poorest place in the United States. I didn’t know anyone who was above the poverty line and my family, like most lived on government benefits. Our roof was a tarp. Badly anyone went to school past Grade 9 or 10 and the graduation rate was abysmal. Having more than one kid before the age of 18 was normal and the average household income is something like $12,000 a year or less.

    My husband is also a lawyer but he comes from a rich family. I am tired of him, his family and others I work with complaining about being poor because they can’t afford to buy a third vacation home, or their engagement ring only cost $100,000, or because they had to downgrade the size of their yacht. My first paycheck was more than my family had in a year sometimes and my salary even as a first year is more than 12 times that. One of the partners at my firm told me he understood what it was like to be poor because when his dad got fired from being the CEO of one company they had to downgrade the Rolls Royce to a Mercedes and only take a 2 week vacation each month, until he got hired as a CEO somewhere else.

    I feel so out of place sometimes because it seems like everyone else came from rich families and there are secret codes and languages that I don’t understand. I almost hyperventilated when I spent $50 on a pair of shoes and $100 on a suit. I had a needs based scholarship but I lived like a pauper because I literally had no other money when I was a student. I get so intimidated at business lunches and company events but I am working on reminding myself that I earned my job and I belong there.

    Today my husband told me about a traumatic event in his childhood: When he was 16 he only got a BMW and a Lamborghini for his birthday while a few of his friends had those plus some other expensive car that I didn’t even recognize the name of. I just want to scream at these people that they have no idea about poverty and their complaining about being poor makes them seem ignorant. They (including my husband’s family) are for the most part lovely people but they are so clueless.

    Vent over. Thank you if you read this.

  24. Just a vent.

    I’m a first year Biglaw associate. I grew up in Kentucky in the poorest place in America. Growing up I didn’t know anyone above the poverty line. My family, like mostly everyone else, was on government benefits. We had a tarp for a roof. Most people dropped out of school by grade 9 or 10 and the graduation rate was abysmal. It was common and normal to have more than one kid before you were 18. I never saw a doctor or went to a dentist. The average income for a family was something like less than $12,000 a year.

    My husband, also a lawyer at a different firm, comes from a family with money. I am tired of my husband, his family, and people I work with complaining that they are poor because they can’t afford a third vacation home, or their engagement ring only cost $50,000, or they had to downgrade the size of their yacht. My first paycheck was more than my family had in a whole year sometimes. My annual salary is over 12 times and $100 on my first suit. I went through my schooling on a needs based scholarship and I had to live like a pauper because although I had a room, food, tuition and books and I literally had no money for anything else.

    One of the partners at my work was telling me about how he was poor once when he was a kid because his dad got fired from his CEO job. They had to downgrade their Rolls Royce to a Mercedes and could only vacation for 2 days weeks out of the month. My husband has told me that a traumatic childhood moment for him was that for his 16th birthday he only got a BMW and a Lamborghini and he had friends who got both of those plus another expensive car whose name I can’t remember.

    I feel so out of place and like the people with money have their own secret codes and languages that I don’t understand. I get so intimidated at business lunches and work events and I have to remind myself that I earned my job and I have a right to be there too. My husband, his family and my co-workers (for the most part) are lovely people and have been nothing but nice, welcoming and non-judgmental to me. But sometimes when they complain about being poor for stuff like this I want to scream at them and tell them they sound ignorant and have no idea what true poverty is. I know it’s out of ignorance and maliciousness but it still drives me crazy.

    Vent over. Thanks if you read it.

  25. Just a vent.

    I’m a first year Biglaw associate. I grew up in Kentucky in the poorest place in America. Growing up I didn’t know anyone above the poverty line. My family, like mostly everyone else, was on government benefits. We had a tarp for a roof. Most people dropped out of school by grade 9 or 10 and the graduation rate was abysmal. It was common and normal to have more than one kid before you were 18. I never saw a doctor or went to a dentist. The average income for a family was something like less than $12,000 a year.

    My husband, also a lawyer at a different firm, comes from a family with money. I am tired of my husband, his family, and people I work with complaining that they are poor because they can’t afford a third vacation home, or their engagement ring only cost $50,000, or they had to downgrade the size of their yacht. My first paycheck was more than my family had in a whole year sometimes. My annual salary is over 12 times and $100 on my first suit. I went through my schooling on a needs based scholarship and I had to live like a pauper because although I had a room, food, tuition and books and I literally had no money for anything else.

    One of the partners at my work was telling me about how he was poor once when he was a kid because his dad got fired from his CEO job. They had to downgrade their Rolls Royce to a Mercedes and could only vacation for 2 days weeks out of the month. My husband has told me that a traumatic childhood moment for him was that for his 16th birthday he only got a BMW and a Lamborghini and he had friends who got both of those plus another expensive car whose name I can’t remember.

    I feel so out of place and like the people with money have their own secret codes and languages that I don’t understand. I get so intimidated at business lunches and work events and I have to remind myself that I earned my job and I have a right to be there too. My husband, his family and my co-workers (for the most part) are lovely people and have been nothing but nice, welcoming and non-judgmental to me. But sometimes when they complain about being poor for stuff like this I want to scream at them and tell them they sound ignorant and have no idea what true poverty is. I know it’s out of ignorance and maliciousness but it still drives me crazy.

    Vent over. Thanks if you read it.

    1. I understand. My parents climbed the social ladder as I was a kid. This resulted in me going to the wealthiest highschool in my area, even though I was far from wealthy. My peers in highschool all got cars, their parents paid tuition, and eventually said parents gave them jobs (or coerced clients to give them jobs). I haven’t been afforded any of those luxuries and I had to claw my way to a livable salary. They honestly just don’t get it, it’s frustrating when they really think they earn the salary that mommy and daddy pays them, or that they must have a new car every single year. It takes every fiber of my being not to scream at them when they post some conservative rhetoric about how the poor just need to work harder when they have never had to work rather have only been handed things.

  26. This sounds troll-y, like someone imagining how ‘rich people’ talk. But on the off chance that you’re real and being genuine, here are my thoughts.

    Don’t say anything. Don’t try to compete in the poverty olympics. You’ll win, but you’ll come out of it worse than you were before you involved your family of origin. Nod, murmer sympathy, and change the subject.

    And if business lunches etc make you nervous because you weren’t socialized in that environment as a young person, hire an etiquette teacher. Like networking or public speaking, these social skills can be learned. Some people learn them implictly in their homes, some learn them explicitly from experts. It’s not a ‘secret language’ of the rich. It’s a second language for you. Second languages can be learned.

  27. Hi, it’s me again. The one who’s husband wants to move out.

    My therapist says it’s not about me. He is focused on the negatives to justify his position. I’m torn apart for my daughter who is 19 months old and of course for myself and the hopes and dreams he and I had. I know I will recover ok but what about her? I have to have a good relationship with him for her sake. Taking the high road will be hard. Anyway, that is all.

    Thank you for listening.

    1. Your therapist is wise.

      One day at a time.

      Honestly, it will be easier on your daughter that this is happening so early in her life. Growing up with her father in another home will be easier for her, because it is what she has always known. She wont have a memory of these hard months.

      You have a good head on your shoulders. You can do this.

      1. Thank you for responding and for saying that. I will try my hardest to focus on the positives and not the negatives.

      2. Sorry Anon I don’t agree that it will be necessarily easier since the kid doesn’t know anything else- it’s hard, hard hard no matter what, no need to characterize or minimize it. People said that to me and they were wrong and it was offensive. Sad anon, mine did similar, left month she was born. Wish I’d cut cord soon as realized he was doing it, got taken advantage of badly in the interim months. It is hard. But I’ve been dating fr or a few years, my kid is doing well on the whole, and there is no one I’d least rather be with than him so it is what it is. Expect long waves of frustrating feelings. Tough questions from kid earlier than you think (mine started at 3, about marriage history, houses, etc, she cries at night about it confused, it is heartwrenching. But we fill our days with joy and build community and fight hard for our present and future. I have more empathy and awareness of others’ tough situations than I ever did.

        When mine said that to therapist, he’d already secretly gotten a lawyer and apartment.. beware them trying to roll it out to you slowly.

        1. I was the kid in a scenario like this. I think my parent (the one who raised me) would say I asked a lot of tough questions at a young age, cried about whether we’d be okay financially (I was 3-6 when this happened), and all sorts of things that I’m sure were heartbreaking for said parent. But I did grow up, and things changed a lot over time. When I look back on things now, I’m glad they happened the way they did, and I am truly better for it in most ways. I know that doesn’t allay parental guilt, but your daughter is still very young, and there’s a long road from here to adulthood. There’s a LOT of time for this to play out and for both of you to mature and grow together through it.

          I’m sorry you’re hurting, but you will make it through this and so will she. In a few years you’ll feel like you’re looking at a whole new reality. Hang in there!

          1. Also, I think it was better for me that my whole life became a sh*tstorm when I was so young. I was confused and a little lonely for a while, but I think it made much more mature and resilient in the end. The experience itself as well as my parent’s candor about life’s problems and how to get through them I think gets most of the credit for me being able to make healthy decisions and have a fairly drama free life as an adult.

            There are positives here, but that doesn’t make your pain any less significant or difficult to get through.

  28. Does anyone have suggestions for helpful websites/other that they’ve used for freelance or temp work in marketing? Former marketer at Big Law.
    Thank you!

  29. Anyone else stuck inside and super bored? I’m single and love being around people so maybe a touch of the loneliness feelings this weekend too…

  30. I got a tear in a brand new down coat from lands end. Any suggestions for fixing it? It’s not super big and it’s on the back.

    1. I bet they will take it back or repair it. They have great customer service so it’s worth reaching out to them even if you feel like the tear was your fault.

      1. +1 Like super service. I’m pretty sure my mom got something fixed from them after she had it for about 3 years.

  31. Does anyone have recommendations for seamless silk camis or wool tights? I live in Minnesota and am looking for layers to wear under dresses and pants that won’t make me look puffy.

    1. Shape wear camis are not silk, but they are very warm. I wear my “Yummie” brand ones as long underwear.

  32. Wondering what watch people have and love. I’m wavering between everything from seiko to cartier

    1. I honestly love my Citizen Eco-Drive. The style I got is the perfect balance between dressy and sporty, it has never needed repair, and I never have to change the battery.

    2. I have a Fossil and I love it. Looking at Skagen for something sleeker for my next one though.

    3. I really like watches, although I don’t have a super fancy one. Are you looking for a work-appropriate watch? I have a MK rose gold one that is a workhorse, a grey cheapy Nine West one that is cute but won’t last long, a black Fossil one, and a delicate but casual one from Daniel Wellington (changeable straps FTW). They all keep time fine and look sharp.

  33. This didn’t scream brunch/baby shower to me. I think it would work if you kept the other elements of the outfit more tailored. For a more formal setting — but not for big meetings, court, etc. — I would wear a sharply tailored jacket in black and white check or graphic or a subdued color such as gray, maybe a steel blue-gray, maybe a scarf, and more conservative shoes. For business casual, I would wear a more structured cardigan and again stay away from pastels or flowery prints.

    This is all theoretical, though; the first time I wore a white dress, it would be covered in ink and coffee splats before lunch.

  34. I’d say it runs a bit big (although I’m 5’4″ and maybe should have gotten the petite), is long enough to wear with skinny jeans, and is my new favorite. Where did you get this information?

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