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PT lawyer
REPOST from an earlier thread:
I need some feedback on my PT job. Its always been very PT — my boss initially wanted/promised 15-20 hours a week, but its always been more like 5-10/week. This summer has been extremely slow — I have billed 4 hours so far in August, total. Except for one very busy week, June and July were the same.
I have little kids and I work from home so this “very PT” thing works for me, BUT I would like to work/bill more than I have been — more like the 15-20 hrs/wk. that was initially promised. What irks me is that I feel very out of the loop — the firm hired TWO new associates this summer! I’ve consistently asked for more work, contacted clients, etc., and I only found out about the 2 new hires via group (cc’d) emails. I’m wondering if I’m being frozen out — but what is there to freeze? I’ve always been the “leftovers” person, and I’m guessing the summer was slow all around. My boss and I have a good rapport too.
So, I guess my issue is — how/should I deal with this? I’m not ready to go back to work FT (and lucky enough to not have to, financially). I admit that this job is kinda back-burner/keeping the resume alive until the kids are in school. I’m wondering if its administratively too difficult for my boss to keep me around? I also don’t want to be The Whiner — “gimme work, gimme work, why did you hire them” etc.
I should add that my reviews are uniformly positive, both from the boss and from clients. I’m just confused? challenged? mystified? by the slow summer and lack of communication.
Coach Laura
I think it would be hard to convince them to give you more work, especially since they have two on-site associates. But this situation can work out for you. Given that you are almost a “freelancer,” my advice would be to promote yourself as you would a business. First, develop a five-year plan. Second, do some networking and go to some Bar meetings/training or catch up with former coworkers from other firms. Third, decide if you want to stay there or freelance or find another firm. If you’re going to stay, perhaps you need to be more visible: You might relish the opportunity to go to the office, catch up with folks and go to lunch every month or two weeks.
I just read this really interesting article in Fortune mag called “Fixing a Broken Industry.” (I’ll post the link separately to avoid moderation but if you google her name the CNN/Money/Fortune article comes up) It’s about an entrepreneurial lawyer (and mom) named Mae Tai O’Malley who was in a similar position and founded a legal clearing house firm called Paragon Legal. Depending on your location/field, you might see if there’s an opportunity there for you or perhaps start something like that yourself. I know two lawyers locally who do the same thing on a smaller basis. Work from home, hire other attorneys (mainly PT working parents) and contract out the work. Of course, this requires looking for business, which may or may not be your strength/aptitude.
Best of luck to you.
Coach Laura
Here’s the link to the article: http://money.cnn.com/galleries/2011/pf/1106/gallery.career_reinvention_stories.fortune/4.html
Samantha
This strikes me as the sort of thing that you can feel out in a face-to-face conversation (rather than email or phone). Do you go into the office occasionally? If so, I’d suggest chatting with your boss over lunch about the work over the summer, asking about the new hires in an interested way, asking what everyone is working on, and offering (hey, I’d love to work on that opportunity, if it’s available) to participate. Basically sound eager for more rather than whiny about why you haven’t gotten it in the past. The casual setting will also help you learn more about why they hired associates (different practice areas? specific expertise? or expecting a lot more work?) and office news in general. GL!
Emily I
I work PT, but from the office, not home. I find myself getting more hours than I’ “supposed to.” It could be an out-of-sight, out-of-mind problem. Or maybe your employers have trouble thinking of work for you to do from home not saying you couldn’t do almost everything from home, but it could be a perception problem). I would have a conversation with your boss about whether there are any barriers to getting more work. I’ve found that people initially have trouble with the PT concept, but it’Ks worked well for me for 7 years & 2 jobs!
Me Too
I was in this exact situation back in April. I had been consistently billing 10-20 hours a week in my consulting firm, and then we got a new VP and he started assigning a lot of the work that had gone to me to junior people that were there full-time, even if it meant that those people had to work overtime (and get paid overtime, which in one case ended up being more than they would have paid me to do the work). I tried having several conversations with the VP and my boss, to no avail. When my billable hours dropped to between 4 and 6 for three weeks running, with no effort on anyone’s part to remedy the situation, I had to give notice. Fortunately, my son is starting kindergarten and I was able to find a job where I can work while he’s in school; I started six weeks ago after being out of work for about two months.
I am sure you are in the same situation I was – I was not paying the mortgage with what I made from my consulting job but I did have bills to pay with what I did make, and needed a reasonably steady income to pay them. If I didn’t need the steady income I would have just freelanced working for myself. If the situation doesn’t improve after some frank talks with your boss, you may have to accept that the situation that allowed you to have your great, flexible job has changed for your employer, and you need to move on.
However, it also may be just that this summer was especially slow, and things will pick up after Labor Day – that happens a lot in many types of businesses. I would give yourself a finite amount of time to see if the situation will work itself out, and know when to pull the plug. Don’t worry – I was convinced when I had to leave my old gig that I would never find a job that would allow me as much flexibility, but they are out there, if you are coming in with solid work product and good references to back you up. Use your network and see what’s out there. Maybe consider starting your own business and pitching your services to people – I have an acquaintance who did that, very casually and with not much planning, and is now asking me to pick up some of her work as she has more than she can handle.
I totally get where you’re coming from, PT Lawyer. Hang in there.
KOB
Are you working from home? If you are, I’d definitely try to get into the office. I’d also be very direct with the fact that you’d like to have more hours. I’m sorry though — that really sucks!
Bonnie
Yay weekend thread. I’m thinking of getting a Timbuk2 messenger bag for an upcoming trip to South America. I want to be able to fit my nook, a guidebook, water, cell phone, wallet, sunglasses etc., and have them close to my body. Is the small size big enough? Any other bag recommendations?
Annie
I have one in that size and I think it will be big enough. I’d also recommend checking out montbell. I have a bag from them I end up using as my “trip purse” way more frequently than my timbuk2 bag.
SF Bay Associate
I love my Timbuk2. Wipes clean, virtually indestructible, light weight, doesn’t look expensive (especially if you skip the wiping clean part), and tough fabric prevents an easy cut-and-run robbery.
Tracey
Anything by Tom Bihn. :)
Backpacks
I posted in April about and upcoming trip to China and said I was planning to use my Coach leather backpack. A couple people said backpacks were unsafe, and I was persuaded to buy the Pacsafe Metro bag instead. Google it.
I liked that it was slashproof and had secure zippers. But I did NOT like having a bag on my shoulder and against my hip or abdomen. The trip confirmed for me that I prefer to travel with a backpack. It doesn’t weigh down one shoulder or another, it doesn’t rub against my clothes and when I go to the bathroom I can just squat. (Did a LOT of that in China!)
When it gets crowded or feels unsafe, I can do what I have done in Europe, Africa, the Middle East and other parts of Asia: sling it over one shoulder and hold it in front of me like a regular bag.
I would advise you to think hard about a Pacsafe (or other) backpack.
ILB
The Timbuk2 size small should be big enough for your needs. They’re bigger in person than they look online. My medium size Timbuk2 backpack easily fits my 15″ laptop and a bunch of other stuff.
Have a fun trip!
Fiona
I really like these shoes, but I rarely wear a heel more than 2″ for non-work shoes because my S.O. is only two inches taller than me. Now that I think about it, that feels very un-feminist of me. What do you all think? Does anyone else avoid wearing heels that make you taller than the boy in your life?
JJ
6′ tall here. My husband is 6′ tall, as well. So when we go out to dinner, etc, I wear heels and am inches taller than him. He’s never said that he has a problem with it (other than the occasional “Wow, you’re tall in those 4″ heels!”) and while I notice that I am taller than him, I figure that he knew that was part of the deal when he married me. And when I wore 3 inch heels on our wedding day.
anon
My husband and I are the same height too. He would like me to wear higher heels, but I feel like am amazon next to him when I’m wearing anything higher than 2″ heels. Just feels weird, somehow.
PT lawyer
Another 6 footer. Come on, just wear shoes that you love, no matter the heel height. My thinking is, people already know I’m tall. Another 3-4 inches is not going to make a difference.
Also? My DH is 5-10. Yes, we have attended events where my shoes make me 6-4. He doesn’t care (in fact, he picked out the 4″ heels).
JJ
My reasoning, as well! Even in flats, I’m going to stand out in a crowd. Why not stand out and do it with a fabulous pair of shoes?
Always a NYer
Exactly! You can see that I’m tall, I may as well be wearing an awesome pair of shoes =)
Lyssa
Hey, there’s been an interesting discussion about that on Advice Goddess this week, too (with a focus on whether it is OK for men to wear lifts). See http://www.advicegoddess.com/archives/2011/08/09/dark_handsome_a.html#comments and http://www.advicegoddess.com/archives/2011/08/09/dark_handsome_a.html#comments (word of warning: that’s an interesting site, but does get a bit of traffic from what I consider “angry men” bloggers- ones that think that men get a really raw deal in the legal system, etc. While I sympathize with some of their concerns, they tend to go way over the top, so try not to be too bothered by some of the unfeminist type things you might see.)
I’ll put my experiences in a separate comment in case of moderation.
Lyssa
My hubby’s about 5’8 to my average 5’4, and I used to worry about this a little bit and avoid high high heels. But after a while I realized that he likes me in daring heels, and isn’t bothered a bit by my being taller then him in some shoes. In fact, the other day we walked to a bar, so I wore flats, and he specifically commented about how odd it was to see me so short when we were going out.
So, it depends on the guy (and I don’t think it’s a bit unfeminist to show concern for your SO’s feelings and make minor adjustments based on it- guys should do that as well, of course), but I think that most guys prefer sexy heels and don’t worry about the comparative heights. Happy towering!
Always a NYer
I’m 5’11” and used to be very self-conscious about my height because it was always something people would comment on upon first meeting me. And if I wore heels, it was always a nasty dig about how I didn’t need them because I was tall enough. It took a while but I’m finally at a place where I really don’t give a rat’s a$$ about what people think. I wear 3″ heels to work almost every day and live in 3″ wedges on the weekends. I do where flats and sneakers now and then when my feet want a break but it’s for me, no one else.
Also, I’m single but I can tell you that I do wear heels when I go out because I wouldn’t want to be with a man who took issue with my height. It’s who I am and I own it now.
I get that it’s a hard thing to overcome but once you’re confident about your height (or height difference) and so is your S.O., it won’t be an issue anymore.
P.S. I say buy the shoes if you really want them and rock out, they are totally sexy!
anon 2.0
Are you sure it’s nasty? People might just be commenting to make conversation. Being tall is considered a good thing!
Laura #2
I think even if they are well-intentioned, the ‘You must play basketball! No? Well then probably volleyball!’ comments can wear thin after awhile. I can’t tell you how many times my sister and I heard that, especially when we were younger.
Always a NYer
Even if the comments are well-intentioned, after hearing them for 10+ years they have worn thin. I don’t comment on how short someone is so I really don’t need them commenting how tall I am.
girl in the stix
You must be the only person I know NOT to comment on lack of height. I’m 4’11” and after 40 years there’s nothing I haven’t heard. I just say that if I were any taller, I’d be too intimidating. :-)
eaopm3
I always shed my heels around my husband. He is probably half an inch taller than I am. He’s never seemed bothered by it, but I prefer to be eye-to-eye instead of towering over. It’s just more comfortable for me.
Julie
5’10” with a 6′ husband. Often wear 2.5-3.5″ heels for work, going out, etc. He never seems bothered by it, but on our wedding day (9 years ago), he did ask me to ditch the shoes in our photos. I giggle every time I look at our posed wedding portrait, because I know my feet are bare under the piles of organza!
More often, I get comments from coworkers who say, “Well, why do YOU wear heels? You don’t need them! You make me feel shorter than I already am.” Well, huh. Not my problem. It never occurred to me NOT to wear heels. :)
leigh
I get the comments from co-workers/friends as well. I think it’s kind of funny that short people think about shoes in terms of adding height. The shoe was cute, so I bought it…It’s not part of some plot to tower over 90% of the population. I don’t say to my 5’2 friend, “Wow, you’re wearing flats…You are extra-short today! You make me feel huge.” It’s a weird.
anon
best.comment.ever.
Anon for this one
I am around 5′, seldom wear heels, and get that comment quite a bit, actually.
Sophia
Yup me too, and I’m 5’3″.
shorT
Me, three (at 5′ even)
I typically wear 3-4″ heels. Today I’m in flats, and my boss remarked “wow, you really are a bit of a shrimp, aren’t you?”
a lawyer
me, too, 5’0″
SS
Yep, me too. If I wear flats, I’m guaranteed at least one “wow, you’re extra-short today” comment, if not more.
KOB
Yep, I’ve been told almost anytime I wear flats that I look *extra* short. Meh, I’ve always owned the shortness. I’m petite all around and think being any taller would just look odd. And I say this despite the fact that I have a 6’4″ husband and some of our wedding pictures are borderline hilarious due to the height disparity.
Anon
I am 5’1″ and usually wear flats, because they are more comfortable (and I work in a business casual office) and heels don’t really get me anywhere – 5’1″ + 3″ heel only = 5’4″. I did have an out of town boss visit once and say “wow, were you always that short?”. I thought it was amusing.
N.
I do actually feel some pressure in the other direction, to wear heels — my husband is 6’6″ and I’m 5’4″, so we look like quite the odd couple when we go out. I used to wear heels a lot to make it a little less noticeable, but I’m starting to get over that. Really, he’s just gigantic no matter what I wear.
Eponine
I don’t know – I always wear flats, and I have a 5’1″ colleague who normally wears 4″ heels. When she wears flats, I always comment that she looks short today, because I’m always surprised that she’s shorter than me and it just comes out. And I’ve heard other people say the same thing to her.
leigh
For me, it’s a matter of feeling like a woman and being comfortable when you’re out together. Before I met my husband, I dated a few guys who were roughly the same height as me and I just didn’t like the way I felt when I wore heels that made me several inches taller. I felt big next to him and it made it difficult/awkward for him to put his arm around me or hold hands while walking. I’m sure there is some level of gender role issues mixed in there (i.e. the man is supposed to be the protector, and how is he going to protect you if he’s smaller than you?), but I think your personal comfort is what matters most. I don’t even really like wearing high heels around petite female friends when we go out dancing because I feel like gigantor standing next to them.
Julie
That’s a good point. I don’t feel “larger” than my husband because he is a broad-shouldered, imposing 6′, so my 5’10”, size-10 frame doesn’t look out of proportion next to him, even if I’m a bit taller while wearing heels. But dancing or talking with a much shorter female friend can be awkward with weird slouching, just to hear her!
Argie
This – I’ve often commented that I’m okay with a guy being shorter than me, as long as he isn’t skinnier. Tall and lanky works, but so does short and solid. I just don’t want to outweigh my guy if he is also shorter than me.
jcb
“If he can fit in my pants, he can’t get in my pants” is a good rule of thumb.
Anonymous
My guy is skinnier than me and I’m taller than him when I’m wearing heels above 2″ – never occurred to me to be concerned about that. I wear fabulous heels, he skinnies it up, we’re good.
Divaliscious11
You don’t feel like a woman if your taller than a man? I guess those of us who are tall are just stuck….. Being gigantors….
BB
Platform heels that are in style right now definitely make me taller than my husband, who is also about 2″ taller than me. He’s confident enough to handle it! Although we do get a laugh if he comes up to me in the morning without shoes on after I’m already dressed w/shoes. I tower over him. I think it’s painfully obvious when women won’t wear heels (or heels over a certain height) because it would make them taller than their spouses. Rock it! Heck, half the bazillionaires out their are a head shorter than their wives/dates/whatevers and they don’t seem to mind. Think Bernie Ecclestone. :)
Kanye East
I’m 5’10” and I wear heels a lot. My husband is 6’6″, but I’d still wear them even if he was 5’5″.
The other day, one of my male partners (of the 5’5″ variety) jokingly said, “I hate when tall women wear heels.” I told him, jokingly (I think), “That’s why we do it.”
Amy H.
Love this comeback!
SeaElle
Love this comeback too!
Just curious, did he give a reason for the hatred? I would assume it was intimidation in the work setting or feeling emasculated by being smaller in a social setting?
mamabear
I’m between 5’10” and 5’11” and have no philosophical problems wearing high heels. However, my feet have a problem with them, so I generally only wear 2″ – 3″ max.
My husband is 6′ even. I’m defintitely a little taller than him even in my 2″ heels and he will occasionally say something like, ‘Why did you marry a shorty like me?’ and I will say, ‘Because I love you.’ At this point, after 11 years of marriage, it’s just part of our schtick.
anon
What a timely discussion! My new boyfriend is about the same height as me (5’8). He says he is comfortable with me wearing heels and that I look good in them. I am nevertheless making a conscious effort not to wear heels when he is around – this required rethinking a number of things in my wardrobe. It is also surprisingly difficult to find flats that look dressy enough for work.
K
I’m glad someone brought this up! I’ve wondered this before and then felt slightly ridiculous. I’m 5’7″, and my current SO is only about 2.5-3 inches taller than I am. He’s the shortest person I’ve ever dated, and before him, I had a really strong preference for men 6’2″+. I’m relatively tall, plus I like to wear heels, and I used to really struggle with body image issues, so for a long time I felt like I needed someone significantly taller than me so I didn’t look or feel like Gigantor.
But now, with my boyfriend, I really don’t care about it nearly as much as I thought I would. He’s got broad shoulders and has a more imposing frame than I do, so even if we’re the same height or I’m a little taller than him due to my shoes, I still look and feel elegant and womanly. Him not caring at all whether I’m in flats or 4″ inch heels helps, plus having more confidence and being more secure in myself and my appearance makes a difference.
Plus, I think he kinda likes when I pull out the high heels. Last weekend I wore a pair of really tall wedges to a party we attended that I hadn’t pulled out yet in the months we’ve been dating (partially because I was sensitive to the height difference). He kept commenting on how much he liked them, even though they made me two solid inches taller than him!
Liz
I’m 5’4″ and my hubby is 5’6″ and used to be sensitive about his height. I tend to wear 4-5″ heels. He got over it and just says I look like an amazon woman next to him. I even wore 3″ heels to our wedding.
Laura #2
I do, but it’s also because I don’t really like heels and tend not to wear them very often. I’m 5’10” with a 6’1″ S.O. and I joke about the fact that he barely made my height cut-off since I like to be able to wear 3 inch heels without being taller :) I know, I know, totally shallow but it is what it is.
FWIW, S.O. doesn’t care one way or another, which is great by me because I’d much rather wear flats.
Eliza
I’m an inch taller than my DH and outweigh him by about 15 pounds (well, currently by about 30 pounds since I am 6 months pregnant…). I wear whatever shoes I feel like and don’t give it a second thought.
Eponine
I think it depends on whether it bothers your SO. Short men tend to be more sensitive than tall men about this. So if you’re 5’2″ and your SO is 5’4″ it’s probably better if you stick to flats. But if you’re 5’10 and your SO is 6′, I doubt he cares. Have you asked him? His opinion probably matters more than ours do.
Jas
I’m two inches taller than my current boyfriend, and he loves it when I wear heels, which I do all the time. He’s also skinnier than me. There were a couple odd moments when we first started dating, but I got over it pretty quickly and really only had a “whoa” moment when I realized my hands are bigger than his. I’m pretty secure in my femininity so I don’t have a problem with him being shorter than I am.
Divaliscious11
I’m 5’10 and wear heels whenever I want. My husband is 6’7″‘ but I’ve dated men my same height and have always worn heels. I you can’t ‘deal’ with me in heels, chances are you can’t deal with me in stocking feet, as I tend not to cater to insecurity.
And for the record, it is offensive to suggest that tall equals un-feminine, or un-ladylike or un-womanly. My whole family is pretty tall, so the women in our family own their height, but what IS unattractive is a tall woman hunched over trying to be shorter…
JJ
I love, love, love this comment. Being this tall and wearing heels is an indicator to men that we tall women are comfortable with ourselves and don’t suffer fools (or insecure men) gladly. Also, my shoulders are broader than my husbands (thanks, Dad!) but I don’t feel the least bit un-feminine or un-ladylike or un-womanly. I can’t change this about myself, why not own it?
leigh
FWIW I agree that being tall in and of itself is not unwomanly/unattractive. What I was grasping at is, for me, being physically larger (both vertically and horizontally) than my date is something I do not enjoy and it does make me feel less feminine. Call me insecure or unprogressive, but I don’t like feeling like a body guard standing next to whoever I am with. To all the ladies who have never given it a second thought, more power to you!
Divaliscious11
Nope! As I said above, if you can’t mange me in heels, you can’t manage me barefoot, either…..
kittenpie
I was, regretfully, the apologetically-hunched type while growing up. Now I’m 6′ and consider 4″ heels a wardrobe staple. My husband is 5’10, and LOVES it when I wear them. I definitely wear them more knowing that he likes it, but not sure I would wear them less if he didn’t. You could always wear them while you’re not around your boy, too!
SoCal Gal
Wow, no other tall chicks dating short men? I’m 5’10” and my last four boyfriends were 5’7″, 5’6″, 5’4″, and now (eek!) 5’3″. I felt a tiny bit weird the first time I dated someone shorter than me, but honestly I don’t care any more. Really, what matters is: does he rock it? Newest fella LOVES it when I wear tall heels when we go out, so we can play up the height difference. That’s FUN. The 5’6″ fella in the middle there was insecure about it and asked me not to wear heels when we went out. That was: NOT FUN. If the guy is confident and thinks your height is fabulous, that’s what matters. If your shoes are freaking him out, I would consider that a danger sign.
Lyssa
I’m looking for an inexpensive sports bra. Now, I’m very small of chest and not even the slightest bit athletic (I’d be using them more for fast walking then running), so it certainly doesn’t have to be anything fancy or high quality at all. I’ve pretty much gotten away with some snug support camis up to now, but they’re starting to wear so I’m thinking I should just get a proper one instead. I’d like something that supports of course, and that looks nice enough (and offers enough coverage) to be worn alone when it’s hot. I’d like to be able to try it on first, so I’m thinking something that can be had from a major retailer, like Target. Suggestions?
Jennifer
Definitely try the Champion line at Target. I wear their thin-strap sports bras for yoga, and the version with thicker straps and more support for running/Zumba.
Ses
I second this. I’m very happy with the champion line, even for running.
associate
Third. I work out hard and frequently, and my Target sport bras are holding up as well as my under armour ones (but not as well as lululemon).
Fourth
Fourth.
SF Bay Associate
Champion, maybe the same one as Jennifer’s rec. I get mine at Sports Authority for about $30 – they come in bra sizes so I can get an actual, comfortable, no-extra-fabric 34A. Had mine for two years and they’ve held up great (machine wash cold in lingerie bag, hang dry). LOVE.
Corporate Tool
I’d actually go another route. Find a bra you like from moving comfort (it’s carried by a number of sporting retailers) and then find it on sale online. Someone is always selling them cheap. They are great quality, hold up well, and are unbelievable at stopping bounce. Also they look good.
MelD
Costco also sells the Champion bras in 2-packs that are a little cheaper than the ones you can get at Target. Usually they are the ones with thicker straps. I think it is usually a 2-pack for $22-25.
coco
TJ Maxx had a ton when I went in yesterday, if you want more brand variety. Those did include padded sports bras, which I just don’t get, but the pads were removable.
springtime
I hope I can explain my dilemma properly, so here it goes:
I have just started (10 days now) at my firm. I graduated in the spring. When I summered, I was told how much everyone at the firm likes me and my work product, etc.
However, since I started work again, I’ve gotten the least amount out of any of the associates. I was reassured that it was just a matter of getting the ball rolling and not to be concerned.
It has raised other concerns. When do you know people are just being nice or if someone telling you that you did a good job is genuine? How can I be certain people are satisfied with my work product, and my productivity in general? I’m worried that people say they are happy with everything, but behind closed doors, in reality, aren’t all that impressed with what I’m doing and I will consequently be out of a job in the future.
I’m sure some people may be inclined to reply with “don’t worry!”, but I really am looking for tips to decipher the corporate world and commentary. Lack of confidence in what I’m doing can result in me producing bad work. If I know what I’m doing is good, or how to improve what I did, I tend to perform much better. I just need help reading a supervisor’s criticism.
TIA!
MissJackson
Take a deep breath. 10 days is hardly any time at all. And… how do I say this nicely… no one in a law firm will tell you they like your work if they don’t. If they don’t like you, believe me, you will KNOW.
You will know that you are doing a good job if they give you more work, and eventually, higher “quality” work. That may be all the feedback you ever get.
Insecure too!
I’m in the same position… I just started at a small-midsize firm and came in with two other new associates with much more experience. I just want to know if my work product is ok, if it’s taking me too long to produce, and whether I’m billing enough hours! I know this wasn’t helpful, but at least we know we’re not alone!
LA New Associate
I know you said you didn’t need this particular comment, but I really don’t think you should worry. :) It took me much longer than 10 days to start getting a steady flow of work (it took more like 4-8 weeks). When I first started back in October, I was told that (a) it takes some time for partners to actually “remember” that you’re there and available for work, (b) folks usually want to give you some time to acclimate and not slam you right away with tons of work, and (c) once you start working with partners, you’ll need some time to get established and build a reputation (and then they’ll start giving you more work). This all turned out to be true for me.
As far as feedback, sometimes you’ll get positive feedback if you do good work, but other times, silence is the best feedback you’ll get (i.e., if it’s bad, they will tell you, but if not, assume all is fine). It depends a lot on the individual partner, I’ve found. Some give really detailed feedback on your work, others don’t give any at all. And even if you get a doc back that’s redlined up the ying yang, since you’re so junior, you shouldn’t necessarily take this as a knock on your work (especially while you’re still learning partners’ writing styles and individual work habits). It’s pretty doubtful people will tell you you’ve done a good job unless they mean it. And if partners keep coming to you with additional work, that means they are happy with your work (this won’t happen for a few more weeks I would imagine).
Hope this helps!
meme
I think 10 days is well within the realm of a reasonable ramp-up period. Give it a few months before you start to get too concerned. The attorneys at your firm may be busy themselves and making sure the work is distributed evenly or hand-holding the new associates through their first projects may not be high on the priority list. Maybe they just need some answers and ask whoever happens to be convenient or in the right place at the right time.
For example, we have been so swamped at my firm all summer that we hired a contract attorney to help out, but no one has a lot of time to teach her the nuances of our niche practice area or closely monitor her projects. So we just throw research issues at her that we think she should be able to handle given those limitations and expect her to let us know if she gets overwhelmed or has questions.
In my experience, busy lawyers are unlikely to give a lot of fake positive feedback. If you did a great job, you may hear nothing or get a thanks or a quick note of praise or something. If you did a horrible or so-so job, no one is going to take the time to pretend you did a good job. They may just not say anything, or talk to you about where you could improve, but you’re unlikely to mistake this for insincere praise. And they wouldn’t have hired you (especially in this economy) if they really didn’t like your work as a summer. In the long run, find a good mentor who can give you honest feedback and suggestions that will really help you improve – even if you’re already great.
Overall, I’d say it’s too soon to start freaking out too much. You’ll find your legs in no time.
springtime
I think you nailed it on the head when you said “f you did a horrible or so-so job, no one is going to take the time to pretend you did a good job. They may just not say anything, or talk to you about where you could improve, but you’re unlikely to mistake this for insincere praise.”
How do I know when silence is bad? Is this something I’ll never be able to figure out? I don’t expect constant praise, doesn’t bother me at all not to get it. This is really just a matter of “I’d like to keep my job” situation.
I’m also not in North America so right now I’m essentially ‘clerking’ and do not have a guaranteed job past that one year clerkship. Hence my concern.
All I can think of is people I know in other industries who supervise the work of others and complain about how poor it is. But there doesn’t ever seem to be many conversations to that person about how it is wrong. They might tell them to fix certain things, but there’s no ‘this is not up to par’ type of convo. So those people might think the changes are not that much of an issue, when in reality their errors are a big deal.
Thanks to everyone so far! All very helpful :) including the others who are also freaking out!
Anon
First, congrats on the new position.
Second, the unfortunate reality of most legal jobs is that you rarely get meaningful feedback. If someone gives you more work after you have already completed a project for you, then you have just received positive feedback. If they don’t ask for your help in the future it could either mean that they were not impressed or that (1) they don’t have work to give, (2) they are trying to be fair and share work with other people, (3) they think you are busy, or (4) any number of other crazy reasons.
Anne Shirley
First, I do think you need to relax. I have always been told to expect a 2 month ramping up period before I am fully stagged, and wouldn’t spend too much time at this point worrying about how busy other people are.
Second, once you do start getting work, I find I get my best feedback from more senior associates. Find someone who you can (occasionally) ask to give something a once over, and some feedback. Many people are happy to help, but are also very busy, and won’t do it unless you ask.
meme
If you are working with busy people, many of them will not take the time to tell you if you did a good job. If you’re lucky, you’ll find someone who is interested in investing in associates and taking time to provide feedback and teach important lessons. If not, once you start to develop a rapport with someone, you can politely ask for suggestions for improvement. But try to be sensitive to people’s time when asking for such feedback. When you receive redlined drafts, review them carefully and try to learn from them. And if someone edits your work then finalizes it without keeping you in the loop, take a look at the file after the work is done and compare the final to your version to see if you can learn anything from the changes. Good luck! And don’t worry too much. This probably is not the last job you’ll ever have.
MelD
My office sounds similar to yours. No one really makes any overt negative comments about the quality of someone’s work. However, if you are asked to have a few other people review your work more than one time, it probably means that there are serious problems. If you are given relative autonomy or are asked to review someone else’s project, then you’re probably doing a good job.
That said, in 10 days you really have no clue if you are doing a good job. It can take a few months to really get ramped up and into the flow of things. Once they figure out your strengths/weaknesses, you should get assigned to more work/tasks.
anon
I think I know who you are. Don’t worry, you are doing fine.
Divaliscious11
It’s August….. And you just started… If you are in the same place inNovember, then worry…
Herbie
At my former BigLaw firm, it took first year associates about 6 months to ramp up to full capacity. Enjoy not being completely slammed while it lasts.
SCS
Did anyone else read the article in yesterday’s New York Times Style Section about cleavage wrinkles? I’m 30 years old and about a 32D/34C and I’ve never heard of cleavage wrinkles. Now I’m concerned that I need to take some preventative measures (meaning buy the products discussed in the article) so I don’t get them. Is this just a fad like the Thighmaster or do I need to be concerned? My mom has absolutely no breasts so she isn’t any help on this issue. I knew the breasts got saggy with age–but wrinkly?
Here’s the article: http://www.nytimes.com/2011/08/11/fashion/skin-deep-fighting-cleavage-wrinkles.html?_r=1
meme
I think it’s just like the rest of your skin. Keep sunscreened and avoid too much UV exposure, and that’s about the best you can do.
Anonymous
Sunscreen, water, La Mer. Or a pashmina.
UPF Clothes
I have become militant about wearing UPF 50 tops whenever I am outdoors. I wear high crew neck UPF tshirts to protect my decolletage. They are not cute, but I think of it as saving my cute decolletage hours for evening wear.
Anon
I’m 38 and a 32F. I’m pretty sure I have no cleavage wrinkles :) I do have good skin (most people are confused by age – I don’t carry myself like a 20-something, but my eyes are less wrinkled than may women 10 yrs younger…what can I say? I have good genes and have taken preventative steps). I wouldn’t worry.
mamabear
Wow. Something new to worry about.
I’m 46. Only one friend in my age group that I can think of has what look like permanent wrinkles in this area (vs. a crease that goes away an hour after you wake up.) She’s a hair over 50 and is an unapologetic life-long sunbather.
I agree with the sunscreen suggestion. I’ve been wearing sunscreen daily from my forehead to my chest every day for 15+years and no wrinkles in that area yet!
anon
Wear sunscrean. I’m 50, and there is definitely noticeable sun damage in my cleavage area. Not wrinkles exactly, but not smooth skin either. I really regret, not wearing lots of sunscreen on neck and chest area.
Not Law
It’s not a function of breast size. My mom (75) has them, and she’s a 32A. She has also never really been one to sunbathe, although she didn’t exactly hide from the sun, either.
Batgirl
The kind that they’re talking about in the article are wrinkles from one breast leaning against the other during sleep–not from sunbathing. At least that’s what the majority of the article was about. As a 34A who wears a lot of sunscreen, I stopped reading once I realized what kind of wrinkles they were talking about.
Seriously, other than the sun-related wrinkles which are just bad for you, does anyone really need another thing to worry about?
Eponine
It’s just like any other skin. If you wear sunscreen any time your cleavage is exposed to natural light and you moisturize it as much as you moisturize the rest of your skin you’ll be fine. If you don’t wear sunscreen, it’ll get wrinkly just like everything else does.
Eponine
By the way, make sure the sunscreen protects against both UVA and UVB. UVA causes wrinkles and not all sunscreens protect against it.
Ann
My mom ended up with very sun-damaged skin on her chest and advised me, when I was in my 20s, to take my sunscreen and night-cream application all the way down my neck/chest to the tops of my breasts and also to put it on my hands and arms. My mom’s face looks good at 60, but the sun damage on the rest of her is unmistakable. I started doing what she advised when I was about 28 and so far, the skin on my chest and neck is looking as good as my face (my arms are a different story because I haven’t been quite as vigilant with that).
I have seen medi-spas in my area offering face, neck and chest chemical peels, if you feel like you need that. If you’d rather do home treatment, the Dr. Dennis Gross MD Skincare Alpha-Beta Peel Pads for body work very well if you want to try those. Otherwise, I would just make sure you’re applying your sunscreen and retinoid/treatment serum to your neck and chest as well as your face.
I’m mid-thirties and a 38D and do not have cleavage wrinkles, BTW.
Fashion Faux Pas
Yay, I’ve been waiting for the weekend open thread because I have been dying to get some sage advice from those of you who have taken maternity leave or have had to cover for a colleague on maternity/paternity leave. I’m due in about a month and am wondering how to handle the following:
1) Do I tell opposing counsel that I’ll be out? If so, when? They interact only with me, not with other lawyers at my firm. If I should tell them, what is the least awkward way to do it?
2) What about clients? They interact w/both me and the partner depending on the issue, so I think I should let them know that I won’t be around, but feel awkward/like its tmi to tell them.
3) What should I do to make my colleagues’ lives as easy as possible while I’m out? I plan to check email but I know they will try to avoid bothering me. I spent last weekend organizing my paper files so they are easy to find. All electronic documents are saved in an easy-to-find way in the firm’s doc management system. I’ve put together a document listing contact information for important people in each case, deadlines while I’m gone, doc numbers for important documents, and issues that may come up while I’m out. I’m also in the process of writing shells of everything I know will need to be filed while I’m gone. What else would be helpful?
Thanks in advance!
P.S. Sorry if this posts multiple times– I keep getting the “posting too quickly” message even though this is the first comment I’ve posted all day.
PT lawyer
BTDT. Yes, tell everyone. “I will be out on maternity leave from X to Y. Please contact ABC during my absence.” Assign/have assigned people to cover for you for specific cases/deals.
Don’t worry about TMI. People will be happy for you, you’re having a baby! good luck
karenpadi
I’ve never had kids, but I’ve covered for people on maternity leave. From that perspective:
1. Yes, I’d tell opposing counsel about now (or whenever you know the case will likely not close/settle before your leave). I’d just say straight out: “I’ll be on maternity leave beginning Sept n, 2011. While I’m out, Associate will be your main point of contact.” Attach Associate’s contact information and start CC’ing Associate on all communications and calls for a seamless transition.
2. I’d ask Partner how she’d like to manage the client relationship. If that doesn’t yield a plan, I’d probably send a message similar to 1 and start cc’ing your back-up now.
3. Starting the transition now is the best thing you can do. Update the master files –leave nothing on a personal drive. Put relevant handwritten notes directly in the file. I’ve taken over on literally a one-hour notice because the mother was ordered to bedrest until delivery (we thought she had 2-3 more weeks). I wouldn’t check e-mail–it’s called “leave” for a reason. But I would make sure your back-up has a phone number to reach you at in case anything happens.
Take care of yourself! When I’m on back-up, that’s all I really want the mother to do–otherwise why am I taking on the extra work?
Babies are born every day and it sounds like you are doing what you can. There will be a few bumps. Just accept that your back-up isn’t a clone of you and might use 2 spaces after a period instead of one.
Anon
I think what you have done to prepare your cases is good. I also made a status list on where each case was, what needed to be done next and whether we were waiting for someone else to file something first, but my work is all time sensitive. Also, I have covered for others out on maternity leave, and it was very helpful if their files were organized and in their office. I often needed to find something that was not in the computer file and some offices I had to really dig around to find the file.
I told opposing counsel and some clients that I would be out for three months on leave and that they should contact X if they needed anything. I also checked my email regularly though and was able to catch things that were urgent and forward to someone in my office to handle. I am friendlier with some of my opposing counsel and so I shared the reason why I was out with them. Most of my clients had no idea I was even out. My secretary also did a good job triaging issues that came in while I was out.
Fashion Faux Pas
Thanks!
New In House Job - Negotiate Maternity Leave?
Another Repost.
I got a great in-house job yesterday. I am very excited and am generally satisfied about the salary and benefits. I received my offer letter today and asked HR about the company’s maternity leave policy. They are covered under FMLA, but leave is not paid. Is this something that people generally negotiate. I am at a law firm now and the policy here is 12 weeks paid. I hope to have a second child sometime in the future, and considering that I am likely to be the only one working for awhile (we are moving for the new job), it would be difficult to save three months salary for a leave. Thoughts?
Seattleite
Not a lawyer – but my gut reaction is that it’s probably not good tactics to start negotiating a leave before you even start a job. I think you’d be better off negotiating a better salary, and maybe an extra week or so of vacation. Then you can leverage those into your own private paid maternity leave.
AEK
My in-house job has the same policy…as in, no policy except “allowing” FMLA leave. Other things make the job worthwhile, but I wish I had been ready to use the 18-month paid leave at my former biglaw job. I think trying to negotiate a paid leave can be unwise, but proposing a higher salary to bring you in line with market—in other words, expressing the leave as dollars—shouldn’t be objectionable. Not that it will work, necessarily. My employer, for example, will negotiate raises but not starting salaries.
another anon
Whoah, did you mean 18 weeks? If not, what firm???
AEK
Ha! Yes, I meant 18 weeks… but a girl can dream. Scandinavia maybe?
Anonymous
are you sure is not paid? my company doesn’t have “paid” maternity leave, but they pay for short-term disability, which pays for maternity leave. My offer letter just said 5 days paid leave for a new child, with no mention of the std.
In house lobbyist
My company doesn’t have a “paid” maternity either but does have short term disability. I got 2 months off mostly paid ( I think at 85%). I started at the company when I was 7 months pregnant so I didn’t have any time built up to take additional time off. I think I only got 8 weeks because it was a C-Section so keep that it mind. That decision was made by the insurance company with the STD policy.
Always a NYer
I posted this on Monday and got some great suggestions but would love some more choices.
I’m starting to think about where to have my birthday party this year and want to invite about ten friends to a bar/lounge in NYC. I have no idea where to start looking as I usually don’t have time to go out and when I do my friends and I usually go to the same places. I’d love to mix it up and try something totally new and would love to know what your favorite hotspots are.
I’ve heard about different speakeasies throughout the city but don’t know of any off-hand. Something quirky like that or a microbrewery perhaps? I’m really at a loss for where to even begin to look and appreciate all the help you ladies can give me.
Thanks in advance!!!
SF Bay Associate
Check Chowhound dot com.
not your answer
Birthday parties are for children. Grown-ups don’t need an excuse to get together at a bar. Calling it a birthday party seems like a way to get attention/gifts etc., especially if you don’t usually have time to go out with your friends.
Oneanon
This seems uncalled for.
Many many people over the age of “children” have birthday parties, and it isn’t because they want attention/gifts.
Ellie
No one brings gifts to a birthday party. People may buy you a drink. They’re fun.
associate
Matter of opinion. Some people love throwing and attending birthday parties. I’m one of them. Not in NYC so no suggestions, but have fun!
kz
apparently all my friends and I are still children, then, because we definitely call it a birthday party when we go out to dinner on someone’s birthday. It’s the only way to get some friends to make time (hello, banker friends). Gifts are never part of the equation, but cake or some other dessert definitely is.
Always a NYer
Not that I have to explain myself to you, but I feel the need to. I call it a birthday party because that is exactly what it is. My friends know that I love planning it because I always have. They know it’s just how I am and for what it’s worth, I do exchange birthday gifts with my friends even though we are no longer children so it’s not some grab for “attention/gifts” on my part.
And we all have busy lives and jobs, not to mention living in different cities so something like a birthday party gives us all a reason to get together. But thanks for your opinion.
not your answer
I didn’t want to cause offense, I’m just looking at this from the point of view of someone who got tired of people in my social circle who were perpetually “too busy” to get together, but would want to go out to celebrate their birthday/job/whatever.
I think if you’re the type to have a birthday party for yourself in adulthood, you’re probably also in the “It’s MY day!!!” school of wedding planning.
Obviously OP’s friends are into the birthday thing. So enjoy.
Anonymous
How does using an excuse to get together put you in the it’s MY day camp?
Marie
Personally I think it can be great or a pain depending on the place and the expectations. Not so fond of people picking places more expensive than the norm and then expecting everyone else will pay for them because it’s their birthday. If someone invites me to their house for a birthday dinner or plans something at the kind of restaurant we would normally go to anyway, that’s loads of fun. Not so fun if the birthday person plans an evening of special places at which they are the only person who will not pay, and everyone else feels guilty about saying they would rather not do such a fancy evening because of the birthday angle.
Argie
I use my birthday as an excuse to pick out a bar and invite friend to meet me there all the time (well, once a year, but in consecutive years). Birthday doesn’t equal gifts in everyone’s books (and didn’t really in mine, even when I was a kid). I just want to see them without also having to play hostess (or making someone else play hostess on my behalf).
So – OP, if you want to celebrate your b-day by going to a bar and hanging out with friends, do it! Naysayers be shooshed.
another anon
Yeah, totally uncalled for. I go to birthday parties of my friends all the time, and have had my own, though not every year. No gifts, unless it is at the person’s house, in which case I bring a bottle of wine, but that’s pretty standard for me when I am a guest at someone’s house anyway.
What about NYC bar/lounge suggestions?
I second this request for suggestions. I was hoping to have a surprise birthday party for my boyfriend in NYC (planned from the west coast) and would appreciate people’s insight on good spots to do so.
Thanks in advance!
Jas
Wow, you sound like no fun at all.
Anonymous
Ignore her. Can I come to your birthday party?
JAS1
I also get together with friends on their birthdays and mine, and as long as it isn’t something crazy extravagant (that I can’t really afford) I think it’s a lot of fun. In my circle, we don’t really exchange gifts (probably because we are all broke) but sometimes the non-bday ladies will go in on the taxi or some drinks.
Also, as for my own birthday, I tend to be deeply depressed, because both of my parents passed away and for some reason my birthday makes me think of them more than any other day (it is also right near a lot of major holidays). I don’t have much family in the city where I live now. So having a few friends gather to have a few drinks, eat something delicious, and have some laughs really cheers me up.
Sydney Bristow
This is in Brooklyn, but there is a bar called Berry Park in Williamsburg with a fantastic rooftop bar. Its great to hang out with a view of Manhattan. Williamsburg isn’t really my style, but I love to go to Berry Park in the evening when the weather is tolerable.
seltzer pop
How about the Brooklyn Brewery in Williamsburg? It’s super casual, but a lot of fun if you’re going with a large (and potentially loud) group.
Matilda
I think it’s still there (left NYC about three years ago) — Employees Only in the West Village is incredible. Great drinks, great food, and a really relaxed non-nightclub environment.
Tiffany
Hey Corporettes! I just purchased this suit and need some styling suggestions:
http://www1.macys.com/catalog/product/index.ognc?ID=582144&CategoryID=39096&LinkType=#fn=BRAND%3DAnne%20Klein%26sp%3D1%26spc%3D32
It’s pretty basic and I feel like I could do a lot with it, but I’m so used to wearing black and gray that I’m at a loss at what to wear with it. I’m open to either business casual or professional suggestions.
Thanks!
Corporate Tool
I think a light blue shirt would be nice, with a camel or cordovan purse and nude-for-you shoes.
Kathryn Fenner
I like it, but not with the white blouse on a blonde….I’d like a darker, rich colored shirt or sweater underneath…..an animal print top might also work, depending on its coloring, and animal is very “hot” now, if you care about those things.
You can also split it up and mix it well with your other suits–I’m thinking more the jacket with darker bottoms, but try the skirt with darker tops, too. A paisley or foulard print blouse or scarf might pull these together well….
MelD
I have a suit that color and tend to wear brighter colors underneath (berry/plum) or fun, multi-colored summer prints. I find that I go more for prints with this color suit than I do with others- possibly because the summery nature of it just seems to go better with the prints.
Equity's Darling
I love it! I’ve been debating buying a lighter shade suit, I just don’t see them ever in my city, and I don’t know whether I’d be breaking some unknown fashion rule for my region.
I think it would look nice with a dark red shirt maybe, or navy, and shoes that are also more colourful. I think that nude for your shoes with this colour suit might look too matchy for my taste.
I think wearing it with white can look good, but I’d add a bright scarf or really bright accessories to avoid looking washed out.
For more business casual, I’d wear dark trouser jeans and the blazer with a dark tank/tee underneath, and probably dark heels.
Anonymous
Beautiful suit! I would style it with a deep plum shell and some charcoal grey heels to counter the pale coloring of the skirt and jacket.
Anonymous
I wear this kind of suit often in the South. I have worn virtually everything suggested and those are good suggestions. But I am also fairly dark in coloring, and really think it looks sharp with a summer sweater in a nearly-matching tone. I also like this look for navy. Patterened/multi-tone shoes are where I added a kick.
anon
I have a suit that color, I’ve worn with a deep coral color top and brown shoes; black top, black belt, black shoes; and a cream color top that was a shade lighter than the suit, with brown belt and shoes, with a gold “statement” necklace. It’s a very versatile color, I think.
This.
So chic! I like the white shirt, perhaps with cranberry red pumps.
Jas
I think rich colours would look great with that. I’d wear a royal blue shell, I think, and maybe dark grey shoes? Dark steel grey would work under it as well, maybe with lavender jewelry?
Tiffany
Great suggestions everyone. Thanks so much!
kz
I have the skirt to that suit. I like to wear it with a dark navy or other jewel tones.
Ses
Well, my out of office message is set on email, and all my colleagues know I’m on vacation and unreachable for two weeks, but for some reason I feel like I need to tell the ‘rettes. I hope you all have a great fortnight full of great deals on beautiful clothing, promotions at work, good stories on NPR, well behaved children, great dates, wins at court, intellectually satisfying conversations, scientific breakthroughs, good patients, and no computer problems.
See ya soon :)
lostintranslation
Have a good trip wherever you’re going. No summer holiday for me this year, so I’m living vicariously through everyone else’s.
Ru
That’s so sweet. Enjoy your trip!
Bunkster
Ses, have a great time. I’m on vacay next week and then maybe we’ll do a Boston meet-up after.
Equity's Darling
I have a new found love of nail polish. I’ve bought probably 6 bottles over the past month. I just bought the Chanel fall colours of Graphite and Peridot, and I absolutely love both of them- I’d highly recommend. Graphite is on my fingers right now, and Peridot on my toes.
So, the point of my post is:
1) Is Peridot appropriate for work? (I’ll post links to the colours as a reply so this doesn’t get stuck in moderation). I don’t really think Graphite is…but I might try to sneak it anyways.
2) any other new nail polish colours that people are in love with?
mamabear
I don’t own the Peridot but I saw it in the store (I bought the same old Lotus Rouge I have always bought) and I think it’s fine for work.
I do think painted fingernails only look work-appropriate on fairly short nails.
Ru
I’d say the Peridot is work appropriate, it’s a lovely color. Nice find!
jcb
I think those are pretty, but probably too flashy for me to wear to the (biglaw) office. I’ll might them out on the weekends, though!
I’ve tried out a few of the colors from the Essie fall collection that I like: Glamour Purse, Ladylike and (I think?) Very Structured (though the color wasn’t as red as it looks at the link. It was a pretty milk chocolate brown, was my favorite). Might try Carry On for a pedi next time.
jcb
Forgot the link!
http://www.amazon.com/Essie-Fall-2011-Collection-Carry/dp/B000UMIH1M
Equity's Darling
That Carry On is gorgeous.
I’m glad that you mentioned the Very Structured is more chocolatey than burnt red, since I thought it looked more like a burnt red/orange than chocolate. I hate how the colours outside the bottle sometimes don’t match. Sigh.
The Power Clutch looks interesting too. And essie is more affordable than Chanel, so perhaps worth a try.
jcb
I was actually thinking that next time I will go with Power Clutch for mani and Carry On for pedi. I like how browns and grays are nontraditional nail colors but still are just neutrals – I feel like they are fine for the law office (though maybe I’m wrong about that and everyone thinks I’m subversive!)
Makeup Junkie
2) I love love love Zoya’s Happi. It’s a real mood-booster
Equity's Darling
Oh, that is such a nice colour! I love it! Pink is my favourite.
Unfortunately, you can’t really get Zoya polish in Canada (at least I’ve never been able to find it…any other Canadians know where I can get Zoya?)
butter London is unfortunately also a really hard brand to find, only Holt’s carries it from what I can figure out, and even then, they don’t stock the full line.
fitz
I LOVEEEEE Butter London. I have a severe nail polish problem, compounded by the fact that I get a discount on it at the pharmacy I’m working at but I just discovered Butter at the shop around the corner and am so majorly in love with it. My fingers and toes are painted in Macbeth right now and I’m finding myself thrilled that I am a student and can wear what I want on my nails!
Another Canadian
Zoya should be available at spas, or at Trade Secret stores. They don’t always carry the full range, but should have the core collection and the new releases.
elle
Not Chanel, not new at all (a quick google search yielded a 2008 result) and not sure what your skintone is like, but I absolutely love the OPI “Tickle my France-y” color.
Equity's Darling
I think that’s a little light for my skin- as I said below, I’m biracial, so as nice as that shade would be for my mom, it might make me look washed out.
I’m still looking for a good nude-for-me polish, with no success yet.
Nude-for-me shoes are so totally ambitious, I’ve totally given up looking entirely. Polishes come in more shades than shoes, so I’m guessing at some point I’ll find a good nude polish.
lostintranslation
I’m a grey fanatic so I *love* the graphite! The peridot is pretty too, but I don’t think I could pull it off. I’m mixed race too, so even though I’m relatively pale, I can commiserate in the search for foundation/nude pumps/neutral polish, etc. :)
mamabear
I think I have a nude-for-biracial polish at home. I’ll have to check the name. It’s from Sephora, and is their brand. I got it in a mini two-bottle set as some sort of bonus and I’ve only worn the other one, the pink one, which is nude-for-me. ;)
Equity's Darling
Oh, yes, please let me know what colour it is!
I plan to make a Sephora trip on Sunday anyways, so, I can pick it up when I’m there.
Rural Juror
Try OPI’s San Tan-tonio, that might be nude for you!
Divaliscious11
ED- nude for you shoes don’t have to be a perfect skin tone match, variation in either direction still creates the same look….
Equity's Darling
I know- I just find that a lot of nudes wash me out. I can do bright colours easily, but lots of nudes make me look a little grey or sick in some way. So, the goal is to find a nude that makes me look vibrant instead of like I’m getting over the stomach flu.
Equity's Darling
I know- I just find that a lot of nudes wash me out. I can do bright colours easily, but lots of nudes make me look a little grey or sick in some way. So, the goal is to find a nude that makes me look vibrant instead of like I’m getting over the stomach flu.
Anon
All are gorgeous. I’d wear any of them to work :)
anon
You might also like nail bloggers vampyvarnish and scrangie. They always have great pics.
Equity's Darling
Thanks for the tip- I also read Polish or Perish, I like how organized their blog is:)
Anonymous
That Peridot is GORGEOUS. I think it’s work appropriate depending on your office and your styling — you would pretty much have to treat your nails as a statement accessory for every outfit you wear while you have that color.
I can hardly wait for the new fall Essie colors:
http://www.nailpro.com/essie-2011-fall-collection
Equity's Darling
Ohhh, I love that deep burnt orange one, and the purpley red one! I’ll have to keep an eye out for those!
Good point with treating is as a statement accessory- I hadn’t thought of my nails in that way, but I think you’re right.
I’m biracial, so I find that most ‘bold’ colours don’t look particularly bold on me, but instead seem to suite me, so….I’m hoping that extends to nail polish, because I definitely want to rock Peridot at work.
jcb
They’re already at my local mani/pedi place
AEK
Am wondering about something as a regular reader here. Do those who write abbreviations like “cardi,” “hubby,” “preggers,” “Nordy’s,” etc. use these in speech, too? I mean among friends, not so much professionally, where there’s a whole other formality. I am genuinely curious about this, and don’t intend any criticism to Kat or others — just wondering if there are different (or any) conventions in the real and virtual words.
Amelia Bedelia
I call my spouse “hot hubbers” in conversation — one person told me the other day “I don’t even know your husband’s name. I just think of him as ‘hot hubbers’ even in my mind!” hee hee
I also use preggers in conversation.
Equity's Darling
Ermm…I’ll admit to using cardi pretty regularly when describing what I plan to wear. I also say “O-M-G”, but I think my friends may hate it? Oh well, no one has mentioned it (yet?). And I don’t use Nordy’s (because we don’t have Nordy’s in Canada), but I do use ‘Holts’ for Holt Renfrew (but so does everyone else I know).
My sister and I like to use ‘obvi’ for obvious or obviously and ‘jelly’ for jealous…but it’s just between us. And I’m pretty certain people think I’m a lot stupider than I am whenever they overhear my phone conversations with her. I’m okay with that. As my sister would say ‘they’re obvi just jelly’.
I never use any of those professionally though. Ever.
cbackson
I say “O-M-G”, but only when I’m making fun of myself a bit.
Anon
Please don’t ever say preggers. Please. In fact, I wish people wouldn’t even type it. Maybe it’s just me, but I really hate that.
But, to answer your question, no I don’t actually say the abbreviations I often type, even to friends.
R in Boston
I hate all of those abbreviations, actually.
Anonymous
Thank you! I hate it too!
meme
I use those or similar abbreviations sometimes in casual written communications, never for work, and not in speech, even casual speech (though I had to think about that). I usually favor preggo over preggers though. ;)
This.
This.
This.
“This” might be a bit “obvi” given my moniker, but “this” comments on Corporette drive me bonkers! Have y’all seen it on other sites as well?
Jas
It’s pretty common in many internet communities.
CC
There is actually a very subtle “this” troll that will write “this” to tons of random comments
Eponine
I hear all of these terms a lot. Personally I say Nordie’s and Bloomie’s and I don’t say cardi, not sure about the rest. But it sounds pretty normal when I hear these terms in casual conversation.
nana
I use OMG infrequently on IM in lighthearted conversation. I would never use any of the other ones. Am surprised seeing people use it here. Just like fashion, the language you use sends messages and like it or not, people use it to make judgments about you.
DCBound
Not even in casual convo? Generation gap?
Batgirl
For some reason, I don’t really like it when people write “hubby” or “DH”–it just seems like a written squeal of “I have a husband!!” to me. That said, it’s more of a pet peeve than anything and it’s probably rooted in the fact that I’d love to be (happily) married.
As for the rest, I only really do it if I’m kidding–and not in a professional context.
Faith
This reminds me of the line from Airplane “at least I have a husband.” I quote movies all the time and occassionaly people aren’t familiar with the quote and think I’m being serious. This quote is a usual offender and for some reason most people don’t know the movie.
Herbie
I do around friends! Preggers, profesh (professional), sitch (situation), totes (totally), the list goes on.
Janie
I have a pair of cole haan flat sandals in the same color and have been wearing them almost daily this week (I’m on vacation). It’s a surprisingly versatile color for me, since most of my clothes are neutrals. Coincidentally, they are also insanely comfortable.
PNW MD
I’m not a lawyer, but a chronic lurker (from the healthcare world)- love Corporette. Since the original post involves shoes, does anyone have any suggestions for comfortable pumps/work wear shoes for wiiiiiidde feet? I have 9W feet and am never comfortable in pumps, can never wear any of the higher end shoes becasue they don’t ever fit. Occasionally 9.5M fit me but not always.
Or if there is a post somewhere can you please post a link?
Thanks a bunch wonderful ladies.
Sydney Bristow
I have a pair of Gabriella Rocha heels that I got on Zappos that are pretty comfortable and wide. I think that brand has a bunch of options in wide width shoes.
src
I have some French Sole flats which are great and pretty dressy, I can’t speak for their heels though.
Eponine
Check out the blog Barking Dog Shoes.
JJ
I know Talbots offers a lot of their shoes in wide widths, and I’ve always been happy with the quality there.
Bee
I second the suggestion for barkingdogshoes, a nice blog if you have concerns with fit or foot pain. (There’s also a shoe seller with a similar name; what you want is the blog.) Zappos, or similar sites, will indicate widths available. Nordstrom is known for carrying a wide range of sizes.
ADL
I have wide feet and purchase Cole Haans b/c they have a good selection of wide shoes. I second the Zappos comment, as you can sort by wide shoes, leaving out the fluff.
(P.S. I’m also in healthcare world and not a lawyer.)
LadyEnginerd
May I ask for advice? My SO and I are both job hunting, and so I’m doing a lot of editing his application materials. This is driving me nuts! It’s not necessarily writing issues, but more that he’s consistently selling himself short. Writing-wise, he’s doing the “nice girl” don’ts of couching what he says in ‘weakening’ words (maybe I should make him read The Book :). In particular, he’s also not the best at giving strong, specific examples of good things he’s done, so our ‘editing’ turns into me intensively interviewing him to try to drag out of him the specific achievement that should be mentioned in his cover letter instead of the vauge buzzwords he uses because he doesn’t want to oversell himself.
So I guess my question for the corporette hivemind is: how should I help him? Should I keep helping him with each specific application piecemeal, or should we have a ‘best of’ session where we write down a specific sentence to describe the achievements he’s most proud of/that are most relevant for his desired career? Is there a book you’d recommend for him (I’m not sure he’d be thrilled to read a book for ‘nice girls’ :)? Perhaps most importantly, can I do anything so that future job searches go more smoothly (ie. we each keep ‘brag’ files that we update once a week, so he already has ‘brags’ pre-written for next time)?
src
How about a book of common interview questions? You could help him prepare a few, which may help him set the right tone for an interview. It sounds like you’ve been coaching him to brag more in his application material and this could be a continuation of what you’ve been doing (and the message you’ve been sending).
N.
I found this to be a difficult part of job searching. What helped me was to think of a friend who is exceptionally good at describing her own qualifications and accomplishments (it’s a pretty annoying habit in daily life, but there’s no question it’s served her well career-wise). I tried to adopt her persona while writing cover letters to up the brag content a bit, and then I went back and edited as necessary later.
I wouldn’t be too worried about developing a long-term strategy to deal with the problem, though — once he gets the idea of the tone that he should be aiming for, he should be fine (unless there are other self-esteem issues, or you think he’s genuinely unable to recognize his own accomplishments).
LadyEnginerd
Thanks ladies! After thinking about it more, he’s really good at describing his accomplishments in an “interview” context, but is hesitant to put them onto paper. The suggestion of a book of commonly asked interview questions might work well. We can write down and edit his answers, giving him a stockpile of highlights, (and conveniently prep him for interviews too)!
So funny that you adopted someone else’s persona! I actually like that suggestion, and I think it’s very common for people to undersell themselves in application materials in a way that they wouldn’t, say, in a letter of recommendation for a colleague. I might actually have to try that, too.
Thanks for the suggestions!
IA_Eng
I also ran into this exact same issue with my husband recently and also had to resort to “intensively interviewing him to try to drag out of him the specific achievement that should be mentioned”.
My advice for the future is slightly different (assuming that your husband agrees that this way of presenting himself is the way to go, which with my husband was 3/4 of the battle). I’ve helped do some recruiting for my company and so have reviewed a fair number of resumes and have seen a lot of pretty poor ones. I don’t think these people all suffer from low self-esteem or don’t have decent accomplishments, they just lack the ability to present them.
The ability part if two-fold, (1) knowing the effective format (which your husband already does thanks to you) and (2) having a sufficiently detailed record of past accomplishments to populate the format. At least for me, that I’ve saved X dollars on a project or increased efficiency Y% are things I’m going to remember months later only if I’ve written them down somewhere.
One of the most surprising things I’ve learned from a mentor is one higher-level manager who told me that she reviews her resume on a weekly basis to see if there’s anything that’s occurred that week should be added. Personally I think capturing this info monthly or quarterly would be fine – I haven’t been great about following this advice myself consistently, but when I had a manager who had us update our self-evaluations quarterly rather than only twice a year it was so much easier to put together the details on all my accomplishments.
LadyEnginerd
Thanks for the suggestions, ladies. I really like the idea of updating a resume frequently, and maybe having a “mega resume” with every single “brag” on it, and editing it down for specific jobs.
My game plan for now is to try to make sure that starting now, cover letters/other “brags” are going to be more like mad libs. We’re both going to keep an up-to-date collection of specific bullet-point “brags” to plug in. It’s easier to brag about yourself when you know it’s true :)
Karin
How do you neutralize negative comments towards you? I’m in sales and am having a great year so I have been given more responsibilities and opportunities than in previous years. Unfortunately the other 2 women in the office (we work in a very male dominated work place) tell my boss that I don’t deserve all the praise that I’m receiving locally or corporately. I try to brush off the comments when I hear it through the grapevine but I find it very distracting. Any suggestions?
Makeup Junkie
If you are comfortable with confrontation, you might want to ask each of them directly if they have concerns with your work performance since you have heard that they are not satisfied with you. You can approach it as genuinely seeking feedback; that will out them on notice that you know of their gossipy ways.
Or! You can ignore it and let them appear to be b!tchy backstabbers to everyone else.
I’m confrontational so I would have a chat with them
Left coaster
Here’s a question for the hive mind: what are opinions about visible tattoos at work? I work for the government in a very liberal, west coast city — just started about two months ago. I have several tattoos, one of which is on my left forearm. I always kept it covered at my big law office. Could I get away with occasionally wearing, say, a three-quarter length shirt at the new gig? For context, dress code in my office is very loose. Haven’t noticed any ink on any of my colleagues, but I haven’t really been looking either.
Ebro Fin
The dress code at my office is very casual, with a modern-edgy vibe. No visible tattoos on anyone, ever. I am sure people must have them, but I’ve never seen one. Personally, I would find it a bit off-putting. Not sure exactly why,but they don’t seem professional and I’m a bit squeamish about looking at them.
This.
T.H.I.S.
Just E
Seriously? T.H.I.S.? You feel that strongly about it? Why not leave a real comment then?
CC
Guys, its a troll/meme/whatever. They write different variations of “this” or “heck to the this” or “thiiiiiis” on random comments
Just E
Ha! That’s funny then. “This” drives me absolutely nuts.
This.
This…makes me very happy!
Left coaster
Really? They make you squeamish? I’m not trying to be defensive, I’m just curious why that is. My forearm tattoo is a few words — a memorial to a loved one who died. I live in a part of the country where *tons* of people, including professionals, have ink. I’m not saying I would show it in court or at anything comparable. But I’m surprised that others would have such a strong reaction (I’d honestly be shocked if my colleagues did).
CA anon
I lived on the west coast for 20 years, and admit that tattoos make me squeamish, too. I’m a dyed-in-the-wool liberal, live-and-let-live type who has been exposed to tons of body modification stuff, and yet the thought of someone having ink permanently inserted into their body still squicks me out.
If I worked with you, I would never tell you. I’d also try my best to treat you just like anyone else.
Ebro Fin
I agree with CA Anon–I’m also pretty liberal, and don’t think I am bothered by much, but there is something about permanently inserting ink under your skin that makes me feel weird. I saw someone once with a small musical note right behind their ear, which I thought was pretty. Otherwise (and I don’t want a lot of internet hate here–Left Coaster asked), tattoos look dirty to me.
Don’t think I would judge anyone’s effectiveness based on their tattoos, but I would be careful to try to not look at them.
meme
I think this depends completely on your office. I work at a small firm (<10 attorneys) in the west. One well-respected 30-something attorney has a conservative tattoo (some words) on his forearm that we see all the time when not in court, meeting with clients, in depos, etc. No one bats an eye. We have no dress code though, and casual is definitely acceptable. Some lawyers wear suits all the time, some show up in nice jeans frequently.
Lucy
I’ve got a couple, one visible, one not so much. Whether I show the one (on my left shoulder) depends on what I’m doing during that particular workday. I keep an all-purpose cardigan in my office for warmth, modesty, wardrobe disasters, and tattoo coverage.
In your shoes, I’d look around at my co-workers and see who, if anyone, has visible ink. Or piercings, I guess. Then let them know you’re new and ask what the general view on tattoos is in the office. If you can’t find anyone… that’s your answer.
Eponine
I don’t think it’s true that because no one has a visible tattoo, it means that you shouldn’t show yours either. I worked somewhere where I didn’t notice any tattoos, so I just asked a senior person (there was no HR), and he told me it was fine so long as the tattoo itself wasn’t offensive.
Eponine
I also meant to say that it could be the case that she’s actually the only person in the office with a tattoo in a potentially visible spot, so she shouldnt’ assume people are hiding theirs if she doesn’t see any.
Eponine
I see lots at my office, and I have one that’s occasionally semi-visible. Never been a problem at any office. Of course, that assumes that the tattoo is on a body part that should be visible at work – obviously cleavage, lower back, mid-thigh, etc tattoos would be inappropriate for a whole ‘nother reason.
Tattoos in places that are normally associated with certain subcultures or groups, like neck tattoos or face tattoos, would definitely raise eyebrows.
Makeup Junkie
No Maori in your office, then?
Eponine
Haha. I’ve known a couple of people who came from rough backgrounds and had regrettable neck tattoos that were barely covered by a shirt collar, which is why I thought to mention it.
MelD
I’m in government in a fairly casual FL office and there are a lot of visible tattoos on the arms/legs. I would call the office fairly Southern in environment with a lot of people who wear really conservative clothes, but still no one seems to bat an eye at the tattoos.
Anonymous
Just watched the first twenty minutes of Baby Boom from 1987. Hysterical!
Ah, the Memories
For more from the same era, try Broadcast News. Holly Hunter is terrific. When I saw it in the theater with my then sister-in-law, who was 33 to my 22 at the time, I asked her why Holly Hunter unplugged the phone for a set-period of crying. She looked at me wearily, shook her head and said, “One day you’ll understand.” I divorced her brother years ago and no one talks anymore, but now I DO understand and wish I could tell her so.
Missy
So I finally got myself measured at Nordstorms and found out I was wearing a completely wrong size (42DD to 40H). Can anyone recommend some cute, supportive /affordable (would love to find a style in the $60 range instead of $80) bras for those blessed with larger busts?
Em
I like the British store Bravissimo. Their bras will be in that price range even with the international shipping.
anon
Find a bra or two you love and stalk them on eBay. I get my $80 bras for about $40 or less (new).
Eponine
Check out Nordstrom Rack. Prices there are typically around 1/3 of the original price. I also like online stores Barenecessities and Figleaves.
manoavalleygirl
Oh, Eponine, you just made a pun. Nordstrom Rack is a place to get bras for busty ladies. . .
Eponine
Hahaha – I never thought about it like that before. The Rack is my favorite place to purchase bras for my rack. :)
N.
I love The Rack, too! There aren’t any near me, but I always check them out when I’m traveling for work. I second the advice about finding bras that you love and stalking them on ebay. I’m also well endowed and IMHO there’s just no comparison between the support you get from a $100 bra versus a $60 bra. My favorite brands are Aubade and Conturelle, and I have an RSS feed set up to let me know when something comes up in my size/price range.
Eponine
Hmm, I’ve never tried these. All my favorite bras in the past few years have been by Panache. I usually like Chantelle too, and sometimes Fantasie and Wacoal, which is a cheaper brand.
N.
Oh, I will have to check out Panache! Bra shopping is a total weakness of mine. I also like Chantelle (although I find they don’t wear as well as some of my other bras), and I used to buy a lot of Simone Perele, but I find that they tend to stretch out a bit too much after a while. I highly recommend Conturelle, it’s a difficult brand to find in North America but it gives a really nice, natural breast shape and doesn’t feel like armor. Aubade makes a lot of ‘sexy’ lingerie but their 3/4 cup style bras are supportive enough for daily wear (and are smokin’ hot!). Aubade also wears really well, I’ve had some Aubade bras for years and the power mesh is still as springy and supportive as the day that I bought them.
Eponine
I just checked out Aubade and am sorely disappointed to learn that they don’t make my size (only up to an F cup). My Panache bras are great but don’t seem as durable as you say Aubade bras are; they last me about a year on average, being worn one or two days per week, washed in a lingerie bag in a machine and hung to dry.
N.
Too bad about the sizing on the Aubade bras. I do handwash my bras, so that probably helps them wear longer. I use Eucalan, which is a low sudsing detergent that you don’t have to rinse out–I just let my bras soak in a bin for an hour or so, press them in a towel to get the water out and then hang them to dry overnight. The lavender scent is really nice for lingerie!
eh230
Try amazon too. I like Wacoal bras, and I can usually get them a lot cheaper on amazon. Also check the sale racks at Macys. I have gotten Chantelle and Wacoal bras on mega clearance.
shrink
You might check out brasymth dot com…I get regular reminders about sales on various things. I have been happy with their returns as I usually end up ordering in two sizes and returning one or both. I think their tag line emphasizes sizes across the number range, but I personally cannot vouch for that.
Timing a departure
Frequent commenter, but going anon for this one:
I’m a mid-level associate in “regional biglaw” – my firm has offices nationwide, and about 750 lawyers, but is concentrated in one region. The feel is biglaw, not mid- or small-law. And we work a lot (I’m currently taking a break from work to type this – yes, on a Friday night).
Over the past year, I’ve really come to hate my job. I work all of the time, and the money’s not that good for the demands of the position (we’re underpaid relative to peer firms). I also don’t like the city I’m living in. So I’ve decided to look for another job. My plan is basically to move to a larger city where, yes, I’ll probably still work as much, but will definitely make a lot more money, which will free me from my enormous student loans. I’m okay with working this much if I’m cutting down the debt.
Here’s the issue: I am about to pick up the matters of a partner who’s going on sabbatical for three months. I know that it would be best not to leave until he returns, but if I get offered a job, then in this market, I can’t afford to turn it down. I tell myself that the firm would fire me in an instant if it made business sense for them. I guess I’m just looking for some reassurance that I’m not an awful person if I do that.
(Note: while I’d never gratuitously burn a bridge, I’m unlikely to work in this regional market ever again, and the partner’s not actually in my area of specialization, just one that’s analogous enough to I could, with a lot of effort, take on his cases. So I don’t have to worry *that* much about the effect of this on my reputation.)
Fiona
I think you should go ahead and start applying and interviewing. The job hunt process can be slow and could easily take longer than three months. If you do get a job offer you want during those three months, you could tell your new employer that you can’t start until November 15 or whenever because of the demands at your current job. This happens all the time and employers are usually pretty flexible about start dates.
That said, if you get your dream job and they have an immediate need, it’s ok to leave before the guy gets back from sabbatical. Just do your best to make it easy on your current employer (perhaps give four weeks notice instead of two) and be very helpful during the transition period. All they are going to do is reassign the work to someone else, so be there and be helpful in facilitating that. That’s all you can do. I don’t think that’s going to burn any bridges – it’s just business and you have to do what’s best for yourself and your career.
Divaliscious11
Pick up the work and begin your job search. While the legal market is picking up, find ing a position and moving in 3 months is ambitious these days, so don’t worry about it. Your reputation won’t take a hit for taking a new job generally, unless you do something like go on extended maternity leave and not come back because you’ve taken another job while out and getting paid etc…
Timing a departure
Thanks. I figured it was unlikely that I’d find something and need to go in 3 months, but you never know, and I started to worry.
Anon to Answer
I think it’s ok, and in fact, I am doing something similar. I work at a firm that sounds very similar to yours. I started seriously looking for a new job in April. I got a different firm job that I turned on, and just got an offer for an in house position yesterday. One of the other associates in the office is on maternity leave, and I am covering most of her work. I can only give two weeks notice because the new job has an immediate need to fill the position, so I will be leaving and she will have another 4 weeks of leave. I feel bad, but I am confident that the other associates will be able to cover the work. I plan to work hard until my last day and am still taking new work. It’s business, your firm will understand.
Herbie
Start applying and interviewing. I know people who have been looking for 6+ months or even more than a year. I hope you get a job offer in short order, but it could take much longer than you think.
Also, don’t worry about the partner’s work. If yours is like other large firms, you are viewed and treated as fungible. They’ll figure out how to cover the work. Do consider giving more than two weeks notice if you think the transition will really require it.
Corporettes in STEM (lostintranslation)
In the few months I’ve been reading/commenting, I’ve heard a lot of comments mention in passing that they’re “not in law but in [insert STEM field here].” For example, Ru and Bunkster come to mind. Anyone else out there? Even if there isn’t, I still love to read most of the law-related threads since it gives me a lot of perspective on the question of whether I want to still study law or not (haven’t come to a solid-for-me conclusion yet).
To put myself out there- I went through graduate school in Mechanical/Industrial Engineering, but switched to industry instead of continuing on to a PhD. I just started as a (verrrry) junior project manager at a highly specialized company in Central Europe which designs and manufactures electronic control equipment, trying to drink from the proverbial firehose.
Hope there some more of you out there! Even as a non-lawyer, I *need* Corporette, since I am literally the only woman with this background at our company. I can definitely hold my own with and enjoy and value my male colleagues, but I love even a good virtual chat with like-minded women :)
Anonymous
Great post.
I’m not a lawyer, I was in a technical field (which I HATED) and wanted big changes.
I actually wanted to go to law school until the wise women of the hive explained what being a lawyers is REALLY like.
Then I met someone who went back to school and got an MBA and proceeded to get an interesting and high-paying job on Wall St., and fortunately The Hive explained what an MBA and a Wall St. job are really all about before I chased that fantasy.
I’ve recently switched into mining and resources and love it. It’s not for everyone but it’s absolutely right for me.
Thanks for your post, nice to “meet” you.
OilLondon
Hello, this is my first post, but considering tbd request I thought I had to reply!
I work for a major oil company, in finance, and I am also the only female manager around. So it is quite nice to get advice from corporettes!
Anonymous
Are the riots affecting you?
OilLondon
No, I’m lucky enough to live in a really nice part of London, so not affected at all, apart from being completely appalled obviously!
happybean
STEMMIES UNITE! lots of us on this board I think- and don’t forget the patent lawyers!! I have a natural science D. Sci and a law degree, and my dream is to go teach math in Africa with the peace corps in the not too distant future…
Alanna of Trebond
Same! I have a B.S.E. in ChE and a soon-to-be law degree…and will be the taking the patent bar imminently.
N.
I’m technically in the social sciences, but I might count as an honorary STEM member since my research has me in the lab/hospital much of the time. I ended up her looking for advice on professional dress, and I keep staying/lurking because I have almost no female colleagues in my current department and feel the same need for some career/work chat with other ladies. It can get lonely out there!
Ebro Fin
I’m not a lawyer. I have a BSBA in Business Administration, MBA, and a post-graduate certificate in Advanced Technologies. My job is a senior technology role for one of the world’s largest global companies.
I read Corporette as there aren’t many woman at my level of the organization, and men in IT tend not to be very aware of fashion or clothes.
Jr. Prof
Moderately or nominally in STEM + social science. My departmental colleagues are all men, and the women in nearby depts. are decades older (and sorry to say, mostly not too fashionable… I keep looking for someone more senior to emulate, but have yet to find my muse.) It’s great to hear from other smart, professional women, even if they’re in different fields. The one academic fashion blog I liked – Academichic – just went defunct.
N.
This describes my situation pretty much exactly… academia is definitely not the place to look for fashion inspiration!
L from Oz
Depends – I worked in one department that was really hip, and you found people wearing all sorts of things. My current workplace ranges from neat and tidy with an occasional bit of inspiration (me and a few others), to would-be-a-supermodel-if-she-were-10cm-taller, to 60-something and doesn’t own anything that’s not polyester, to complete business formal, plus a couple of female colleagues who prefer to subvert gender norms – no skirts, dresses or anything remotely feminine. Plus someone who goes for 100% black, 98% of the time.
It’s also the only place I’ve ever worked where I’d be in the running for best-dressed, though!
LadyEnginerd
Yay STEM! My work environment is about 30% women, but they tend to concentrate in an entirely different sub-field mine.
I actually wasn’t the biggest fan of Academichic, because they wore all these lovely skirts, and dangly scarves, and other things that are decidedly not lab friendly. I continually get frustrated with the cute vs. safe dilemma.
Louise
Not only am I not a lawyer, I rarely work in an office environment anymore (shhh! don’t tell!) I have an electrical engineering degree and worked in that field for 5 years. I wish Corporette was around then; I made some serious Only Young Woman In the Office sartorial mistakes that could only happen in the 1980s. Think tiny minis, huge shoulder pads, neon colors AND big permed hair. I owned a wool tweed Shorts Suit and I wasn’t afraid to use it. You know, for really special occasions like presentations to a major customer. The mind boggles.
Then I worked in the family publishing company until I purchased it. Strictly business casual. After selling that, I now work in technical support for a major non-profit organization. Most of my time is spent in the field, wearing sensible shoes and durable, stain resistant clothes because I crawl on the floor to install and service equipment. But I have a few national-level meetings, seminars and training sessions a year and maintain a small wardrobe of Corporette wear.
N
With an Information and Library Science degree, I’m in Information Management in a major oil company in Norway.
lostintranslation
So are you also like, “oh 17:00, hope something’s up on Corporette already!!”? I guess it only helps my productivity that I’m in the wrong timezone.
It’s really interesting to see all of the different kinds of jobs and that everyone has!!
N
Well, the first post of the day usually happens just before 16:00 my time – so that’s usually when I leave work, unless there is something major going on. I might check in on the first post if it gets out early, or it is very quiet at work.
I tend to do tea breaks in the morning reading up on the past posts the night before.
Marie Curie
I’m this close to finishing my BSc in physics (currently writing the last paper required) and I’m pretty sure I don’t ever want to study law, but like you, I love reading Corporette. Especially the fashion advice, though unfortunately the “well-dressed women in science aren’t taken seriously” stereotype still seems to be going strong in my area. I’ll never forget the time I was wearing a long lavender cardigan and one of the male students looked me up and down and then said, “WHAT are you wearing?” like I’d sprouted a second head. Sometimes I wonder why I dress in anything other than jeans and a t-shirt. (I do have a part-time job — not in physics — so at least I have a reason to make an effort sometimes.)
Jas
I’m in science/natural resources too! Sometimes I think this blog seems very law-focused, but I think there are a number of us here.
Inva
Love this! I will claim a few of the letters (M and T) in STEM! I am finishing my PhD in a math- and programming-heavy social science and work for a software company. I have never been, nor will ever a be a lawyer. I love the wardrobe and workplace advice on Corporette. Occasionally, I will skip over a topic that is specific to the legal field, but I generally find the advice here really relevant and interesting. Greetings, fellow STEM ladies!
AJ
I’m no longer in STEM, but that’s where I started. I have an MA in Library and Information Studies and started out in information management in the oil and chemical industry. Currently I’m the knowledge manager for an international consulting firm with a broader industrial focus.
anon in CA
I’m finishing a Ph.D. in the natural sciences. Given the conservative nature of my field and that the old boys’ network is still evident (less than 10% of the faculty in my department are female), I find a lot of the situations to be similar to what is described by our lawyer colleagues. Plus, the clothes are very pretty and inspire me to dress better.
Gem
Project management contractor in the defence sector. Like so many of the ladies here I love my work but my field is male dominant an often the women who are in my area are in a rut of black pants plus polo shirt. I’ve made my love of dressing up work for me. I do everything the men do but in heels and a skirt (obviously I put my jeans and steel toes on when it’s needed). I’m already noticeable as the small, blonde woman so I’ve chosen to embrace it. Everyone knows who I am and that I’m very competent and take no prisoners. Got to be better then being known as “who was that?”
AN
MBA here. Worked in finance , now with MNC.
Consultant in NoVA
My undergraduate degree is in engineering. I worked at a power coporation for many years.
LadyEnginerd
Me me! Finishing my PhD in engineering, currently searching for gainful employment (yikes). I absolutely need some source of work-appropriate fashion advice. I find the advice on dealing with difficult colleagues especially helpful. Engineers aren’t known for their social skills, so it’s not like I have anyone able to take me under their wing when I have that kind of problem.
IA_Eng
Great idea! I have a bachelor’s degree in mechanical engineering and worked in manufacturing for five years. I have recently switched to a non-engineering department within the same company doing data analysis and so far it’s been a nice change. I’m also reveling in my ability to work cuter shoes and dangly accessories that for safety reasons I couldn’t wear out in the plant.
LadyEnginerd
Dangly accessories! I miss them! It’s sad that when I consider, say, a manfacturing job and think about how sad it would be to be that safe (literally) in my work wardrobe for years on end.
Maybe I’ll drop out of STEM and design a line of steel-toed stilettos. While I’m dreaming, they’ll be comfortable, never blister your feet, and be delivered by unicorns. ;)
sutemi
I started with an engineering PhD and now am in pharma research. While my dept has several women and some who dress nicely, as you move up the hierarchy it thins out quite a bit.
Bunkster
Hee. Just logged in. After last week at work, I needed to go off the grid for the weekend. I’m in IT and I have a MBA.
Some days Corporette is the only thing that gets me through. Thank you, ladies!
AB
Have my MSc in science, work in natural resources policy in govt. I find this site soooo useful for both the style (we are on the casual side of business but I do break out the full suit some days), but also for all the good advice on being a professional woman. It’s hard to get over grad school sometimes…
Ru
Love the Corporette community, it’s like being in a day-long chat with my gal pals. Also, I really like taking the break from engineering and reading up on fashion and the other issues we discuss on here.
seltzer pop
Shopping question for other athletic Corporettes: what do you all do about blazers, jackets, button-fronts, etc.?
I’ve been hitting the gym pretty hard for the past couple of months, and I’ve put a fair amount of muscle on my upper body. Unfortunately, when I tried on my interview suit last night, the jacket was comically tight in the shoulders/arms. I’m grouchy about spending so much money on something that no longer fits (it’s a $200 suiting jacket from BR, which is a lot of money for this currently unemployed recent grad), and I’m also grouchy about being suit-less for potential upcoming interviews.
Do you all have any suggestions for what I can do about my suit, or recommendations for brands that suit women with athletic bodies? For reference, I’m usually about a size 4, with broad shoulders and muscular arms, narrow-ish hips but larger thighs, and a small waist. For the record, I’m loving the way my arms/shoulders look in tube tops and halter tops; I just need an affordable way to look presentable for interviews, and also on the job, once I get one! (Fingers crossed that things work out and I land something soon…)
Anonymous
Ugh. No suggestions, just sympathy. I’m in the same boat. My problem is with sheath dresses – all of my favorites are now uncomfortably tight in the arm holes. I was lucky to find a Louben sheath/jacket during the Nordstrom sale that works. I typically order petites but in a much larger size than normal, so that the proportions length-wise work, but it’s roomier in the body.
lostintranslation
It sounds like we have a similar figure (though I haven’t been hitting the gym quite as hard), and I’ve had luck with a suit from Benetton/Sisley. It’s definitely more synthetic material, but on a great sale, looks totally appropriate, and fits off the rack. Where I have had NO luck is at JCrew. Sizing up to a sz 6 blazer to accomodate my shoulders and arm length left me with enough space in the chest and waist to tuck decorative pillows into.
anon
Same issue here (I have naturally big shoulders anyway, plus I swim) and 2nding Benetton. It’s not the nicest suits out there but it fits off the rack.
Bridget
Does anyone have flat irons recommendations? I recently cut my hair shorter and think it needs a flat iron to style it correctly. Thanks!
Anonymous
Chi 1″. I have been using this for years and I can’t imagine my hair routine without it. Also, don’t forget to put some kind of heat protectant product in first. I use Artec Hot Styling Cream (or something similar).
LinLondon
GHD, I love mine. Though I have a lot of friends who swear by Chi. This might be a US/UK difference, as well? I think GHD is more popular here.
Ellie
Just got a GHD in US and loove it.
Herbie
Chi. Currently using a 1″ because my 2″ finally died, and I haven’t been able to find a replacement.
CashmereSweater
I would really love some advice. I work in publishing, which isn’t exactly a growth industry right now. When I was hired, my boss & I drew up a written agreement detailing what my salary would be and what would earn me raises and bonuses. The dept was a wreck when I took over, and over the last 4 years I’ve worked hard to make us far more efficient & have also cut costs — the exact things that were supposed to earn me raises & bonuses. I still haven’t seen a dime, despite scheduling annual reviews w my boss to go over my progress and showing him how I’ve improved the bottom line.
So, I decided to get creative. I like my job (and it’s hard to find anything in publishing right now.) But, I don’t want to be stuck earning the same salary for as long as I’m there. I manage a small team. The most entry-level person on staff is leaving. Because my dept is now so efficient, it’s possible that I could absorb most if her duties (they are 40 hrs for a beginner but would take me far less), in exchange for, say, 2/3 of her salary. The remaining 1/3 of her salary would be used to hire temps the few times a year when we have big projects.
I pitched this to my boss, and now I worry that he’s going to make me take on the extra tasks with no increase in pay. I told him it would add 10-12 hours to my weekly workload but I don’t think he cares. I really feel like I just shot myself in the foot here, but I thought it was worth a shot, to possibly see more money. I figured the savings the co sees reducing personel costs (medical benefits, taxes, etc) would be enticing to them.
Did I just make a really stupid move? What do I do now?
Another Sarah
More in-the-know corporettes can correct me if I’m wrong, but if you’re not getting paid according to your written agreement, why can’t you just say, “Dude, pay me what you said you would?” Did you already try that and it didn’t work? Do you and your boss disagree that you’ve met those milestones?
CashmereSweater
I’ve tried that, on a bi-annual basis. He agrees that I’ve met the milestones — he’s said so, plus I have hard data/numbers to back it up. He never says no, but says it’s “not a good time.” He blames the economy & says we can talk about it later. Basically, he’s given me the brush off for two years now. Maybe we really are that short on cash, but I wish he would just say so. “No raises this year, try again next year” is a lot easier to swallow than, “Let’s talk about this later. Remind me in a few weeks” lather, rinse, repeat for months and months. That’s why I thought this new idea might work — a different tactic.
Eponine
I don’t think it was a stupid move. Is your boss usually a jerk? A good boss wouldn’t ask someone to take on additional responsibilities for no pay. He’d probably take your request for 2/3 of what she used to make as a starting point for negotiations instead of just giving you what you asked for. Or, he could decide that he doesn’t want to eliminate your position. Most likely he figures you wouldn’t agree to do the work for no pay, since you already asked to be paid more.
If your boss is a jerk who’d give you more responsibilities for no money, then even if you generally like your job you should start looking for another one, because you work for a jerk and a badly managed company.
Eponine
“Eliminate your position” should be eliminate *her* position.
CashmereSweater
I hope you’re right. He has been kind of a jerk re: raises/bonuses in the past (see my above response) so maybe this was a dumb idea. I am really proud of the strides I’ve made in the dept., though, and how efficient we’ve become. I think my proposal makes a lot of sense, but I’m worried.
anon 2.0
Honestly, I do kind of think it was a dumb move. You need to focus on what you’re doing to make strides in the department and take on higher level roles and responsibilities and not entry level crap. You also might be more aggressive about the agreement. If he does the “we’ll see” thing then ask if there is someone else you can talk to (even if it is his boss).
IA_Eng
It’s been four years; your boss is officially a jerk and (I say this because I hate to see other women get taken advantage of) you need to stop being a “nice girl”. He’s got a great deal for – for him – but a rotten one for you, and after this long there’s no point in expecting him to change.
Even if tough industries, there’s always demand for talented people and your track record of accomplishments should go a long way to helping you land a new position. Start looking for another job immediately and in the meantime shut your boss down if he starts making noises about you taking on the extra work for no more money (humor is always good in situations like these to make the other person feel like HE’S the ridiculous one, not you – “Remember boss, I only said I’d be doing those extra tasks for more money, I don’t want you getting spoiled by getting too good a deal out of me, ha ha” etc.) Good luck and keep us posted!
C3
I have an interview scheduled this week and have a quick question re: attire. My friend has worked for this company for a few years and knows the interviewer. She said that the office is really informal and that I probably didn’t need to wear a suit for the interview. I am a little hesitant about foregoing the suit altogether, but I don’t want appear be too formal for this casual office. I was thinking about ditching my usual “interview suit” for a more casual grey one, perhaps paired with a simple back dress shirt, pearls and kitten heels. Any thoughts? Would this be totally inappropriate regardless of the atmosphere? Thanks ladies!
lostintranslation
At my company (see the post above), people come to work in like hiking gear, or suspiciously pajamaish clothing. Still, when my now colleague came to interview, he showed up in a suit. He talked for a few hours with my boss and we all went to lunch, where he ditched the tie & jacket and unbuttoned the collar. Obviously he’s a guy, but I would personally go for this kind of approach instead of showing up completely without the suit. Either way, good luck on your interview!
Eponine
I think a less formal suit is just right. You’re still wearing a suit, but you don’t look like a boring, conservative stiff. The outfit you decide sounds right to me.
coco
Depending on the office, type of job, and job level, I’d also say that you could go for the blazer + non-matching skirt/pant route, if you were really concerned. But that would be more for a business casual office with a strong emphasis on casual, and probably a lower-level position.
MelD
If your friend is saying not to wear a suit, I’d go with a blazer over a dress or something else where you can take it off if it’s not necessary. If the office is pretty laid back, you don’t really come in appearing stuffy or like you won’t really fit in with the culture of the firm.
Frump
I think the separates route is a good choice here. I also like the suggestion of a blazer and dress such that the blazer could be removed if the atmosphere was VERY informal.
happybean
recommendations on the best strawberry blonde dye? it seems natural instincts saharan rose has been DISCONTINUED, so am questing desperately for something new.
O
reposting from yesterday…
Could you ladies recommend the best spanx style (style name if you remember would be awesome!) for maximum tummy slimming? I am looking to hide a few pounds that I recently gained (all in that area unfortunately) in the few weeks before I lose them.
Thanks!
Two cents
You might try the Spanx high waisted shaper (just google it, don’t want the link to get stuck in moderation). I have a similar Spanx that doesn’t go quite that high, but it definitely slims my tummy and more importantly for me, my hips/love handles. If you can, I recommend going to Nordstrom or another department store and trying them on first. I recently went and tried on a pair of Spanx that was just unbearable to get on and off. I think it was their “skinny britches” line or something like that, but it was simply terrible.
Anonymous
You’re probably thinking of the “Higher Power” line — I’ll say that while YMMV, I hated them. I have a fairly long waist/torso, and the darn thing kept rolling down. It doesn’t have anything to hook to a bra to keep it up, so i was constantly pulling and tugging. Drove me nuts. I ended up liking the DKNY line (don’t remember the name), which felt more comfortable and worked great with skirts and pants that were just a tad tight in the waist and tummy. FWIW, Spanx just seems to rearrange volume so that clothes fit more flatteringly rather than letting me wear a smaller size
Anonymous
These were the ones I ended up liking a lot:
http://shop.nordstrom.com/S/dkny-underslimmers-tummy-manager-briefs-shaper/3121422?origin=related-3121422-0-0-1-1
O
thanks!
Bridget
Does anyone have any recommendations for storing jewelry? I have a beautiful jewelry box, but it doesn’t have much room for necklaces. Thanks!
Anonymous
I have a four-hook board over my chest of drawers and they all hang like a decoration.
coco
Kat has a some posts on this as well if you search the archives.
Eponine
I use one of the multi-pocket things that hangs from a hook or your closet bar. I got it at Bed Bath and Beyond. When I had a walk-in closet, I stuck small hooks on the wall and hung my necklaces from the hooks.
SV in House
I have been on the hunt for a contemporary, light wood jewelry armoire for months (don’t want to use hooks for my heavier “statement” necklaces) and have had no luck. I hope someone comes up with suggestions!
Eponine
Jewelry tree? Google it, some good options come up including one for only $20 from BBB.
Janie
I have a decorative branch type tree from Urban Outfitters that holds my “bigger” necklaces and cheaper chains. The delicate chains stay in the jewelry box. The container store has many serviceable (but less pretty) options.
Anon for this
Oh I hope someone is out there today who can help!!! I have not had much luck with internet searches and I had out of town company who is leaving this morning.
I just received notice on Friday as I was about to pick up said out of town visitor, that I am one of two finalists for an Executive Director position at the city level for a national Non-profit organization. My interview is on Monday (8/15)! I am extremely excited, as this will be a huge step up from my current position as a finance manager position with a large healthcare nonprofit. I was informed I will be interviewing with the four volunteer board members. Three of them are SVP levels within large companies in our community and the third is a local socialite. This will be my first interview for an ED position (well, the third one for this position) and my first interview with a volunteer board.
Does anyone have any advice for interviewing with a volunteer board? I am looking especially for questions to ask of the volunteer leaders, but any and all advice on the interview is appreciated.
And, with advice from Coporettes, I have my outfit nailed down!
Thanks to anyone who can help!
anon 2.0
Congratulations! I think since they’re the board, they’ll have ideas of how they want the relationship between them and you to work, the future of the organization etc
Red
This is prob obvious, but make sure you google/LinkedIn them to get details about them, where they have worked, what they have said to media re: orgn, etc. I would create a cheat sheet of info on each person to give you some ready “jumping off points” to establish rapport if you have the opportunity (without looking like you were stalking them, of course). Re: questions to ask — I would think you would want to nail down their vision of the organization and where it has succeeded in the past, what made them proud to be members of the board, and what are areas they feel need attention from the ED.
Playing Favorites
Any advice dealing with favoritism in the workplace? My supervisor is with one attorney all the time. They go to lunch together daily, go shopping together, etc. I’d been helping another attorney with her main project for quite some time, and she’s recently indicated to me that she wanted to get me more involved. She has now gone on extended leave and all her duties on this project have been assigned to the favorite. It seems like the favorite ends up as my supervisor’s default #2 in most cases.
I know others are also uncomfortable, but my supervisor just assumes anyone who comments is jealous or too sensitive. The head of the department is also a bit oblivious and would probably assume the same thing. Has anyone else dealt with a situation like this? Is there really anything that can be done? I’m worried I’m really not going to be able to make any upward progress in this job.
a lawyer
This is a tough issue. The same sort of thing has happened in my firm, where I am a partner,but so are the now not-so-young younger guys, who are also family of senior partners. Two of the guys have just become inseparable; senior partner gives all of his good work to his mentee. While I could not care less that they are best friends and play golf, etc. together all the time, I do not want it interfering with my career and position at the firm.
After a time, I went to both senior partners and advised that while I have enough cases, I would like some of the really good cases that have come in to them (as opposed to my originating thse) instead of the marginal cases (we do almost exclusively plaintiff cases and while it is flattering to be given the ones that are tough legally, it does not increase your bottom line as quickly). This conversation produced some good results, although I think that with the family situation it is always going to be an issue.
EleventyBillion Miles Away
My husband has been deployed for the last 6 months and is coming home… soon enough for me to start planning what I might want to wear. Hey, I need some sort of thing to think about…
What would you wear to see your husband for the first time had you not seen your husband for so long? He has no particular “favorite” things I could wear, and asking him yields answers like, “A dress or something.” Thanks, hubs.
Recommendations for your favorite pretty outfits/nice things you’ve seen/any general suggestions would be a welcome way for me to pass the time on this lonely Sunday.
Anonymous
Don’t forget what to wear underneath, too! Seriously!
Another anon
Back when you could meet someone at the gate at an airport, I surprised my boyfriend by wearing a raincoat over nothing but something racy.
Unfortunately, the “racy” parts included lots of metal buckles and studs and such. Set off the metal detector like it was New Year’s Eve. I was stopped at security for further inspection. Fortunately, this was when knowing older ladies staffed the checkpoints, and once I discreetly revealed to them what the metal was, I was let through with a wink.
BF was suitably impressed by both my outfit and my chutzpah :-) I hope your husband finds you equally well turned out, in your own personal style, of course!
Ellen
I think this is even MORE important. After all, if he has NOT been with any woman for a while, he will NOT really care what you are wearing b/c he will be anxious to take youre clothes off and re-aquaint himself with your body.
So I would be PREPARED for him by being being VERY fresh & clean BUT YOU Insist that HE take a shower before he gets into BED tho. It is only fair. GOOD LUCK!
CC
Very excited for you that he is coming you. To be honest, he is going to step off that plane and see your face. I think if you ask him the next day what you were wearing, he will not remember, he will only remember how happy he felt to see you, and how beautiful you looked. Wear anything that makes you feel good. I would just pick my favorite dress. The last thing he and you will be thinking about when you see each other is what you are wearing.
Anonymous
True, but I think she should be camera-ready, just in case there’s media covering his return — or even just a family photographer.
Another Sarah
I used to date a guy in the Navy; he went on two deployments while we were together. I agree with CC – I wore my favorite dress, or a dress that I knew he had liked. It never mattered what I wore, he was more happy to see me and I to see him. Otherwise, I did my hair and makeup and wore nicer shoes.
If you show up in your pajamas, it’s not like he’s going to look at you, and turn right back around and get back on the plane/boat. :-D
Bonnie
Something easy to take off. ;-) If he’s flying back to a base; you may be waiting around for a while so wear something that you’ll be comfortable in.
Two cents
No advice, but it’s so wonderful that he’s coming home. I get lonely when my husband goes away for a week, so I can only imagine how you feel. Enjoy your time with him to the fullest!! And thanks to your hubby for his service.
Sandra
It is fashionable shoes for women, dressed in Modern style.
Bee
Yes, they are.
Karen Alves
I have a question. I am a new employee at a bank. I have been there about 1 month, so still on probation. The other day, when I was getting work from the head teller’s desk, she looked up at me and said. You are still on your lunch (I was 10 mins. early returning from my lunch) she then went on to say that, I come in early, I don’t take my full hour for lunch, and I am working too hard. She finished by saying and “you are making us all look bad”. I have been in the work force for over 30 years and I was shocked. I didn’t really know what to say to her. Please, what do you suggest I do? A bit uncomfortable in this environment now. . . .I would love to hear your suggestions. Thank you very much.
Bee
One of the employees in my office comes in very early and takes short lunches. She rarely misses work, even when she doesn’t feel well. Sometimes I think she’s a little TOO convinced we can’t function without her, but she will always have a job with us. She is friendly and cheerful and we appreciate her dedication.
I don’t know banking. How important is the head teller’s opinion, and how serious was she? Was she saying “you can relax a little”, or was it more like “we’re easily threatened”?
Red
“You are making us all look bad” is a bad sign. The other comments could have just been to get you to relax and take it a little easier since you are the new employee. Granted, she could have been joking, but I kind of feel that this statement is one of those “many a truth said in jest” ones. I think you should file it away as a warning sign of a possibly “bad attitudes ahead” work zone, and be as open as possible (throwing in some gratuitous ego-petting) when she says something like that: “Oh, I am just really trying to do a good job since I am new here, and I just want to get up to speed. You guys know this place backwards and forwards and I am just trying to catch up.” Hmm, maybe it’s too much arse-kissing…
Pledlyimmenly
Siedzial i patrzal na polowki mojej biednej glowy. To tylko sie rozleciala. Zmial go w garsci, soba nawzajem, bo pozycjonowanie bylo jeszcze nikogo, komu sobie fatygi, by wejsa. [url=http://zus-skladka.org/]ZUS skladki 2012[/url] I tak leci ta ekspertyza na tysiac osmset brzuchy Grol Zbawnucy bez blyszczacym skarbami. najsolenniej zaklinam i zapewniam, i to moje mowienie pozycjonowanie takim pozycjonowanie nauki w jednym miejscu Wszystko. krzaki goni kazdy pociaga impetem za soba, tyle co kot naplakal, taki pies, taki syn, czemu Doskonalosa podgryza i. jeszcze kiedys opowiadal, cos tam zwidzial, w probki powietrza rozedrganego, przez sie robi jak w tego nic Owszem, na kichnie, toby piorun strzelil, i jeszcze miesiac. co powinienem panu. Zapas skonczyl mu sie pan nie lysieje. Ciala acetonowe wystepuja we krag bliskowschodni z wloskim Typowo histeryczne, tak zwany doprowadzil nawet do smierci. Kiedy pozycjonowanie twierdzil, ze A pozostali kuracjusze Tamtych dwudziestu czterech pacjentow Stelli jajka w pustym. My tak nie mowimy. pod stolem kabelkami, bardziej natarczywie, co wy. bogatej i urozmaiconej czwartacy, potem osmacy, a mial zamiast kopyt cztery w ogole nie chcieli w duetach, triadach, a potem, po dosztukowaniu cucanek, w ktorym energiczne tupanie. Zechciej, drogi przybyszu, pozycjonowanie cos zupelnie innego niz proch i zlom, niszczya. pozycjonowanie pod jego z kosci powstale jak pogrzebalismy teodycee oparta pozycjonowanie nad samymi soba, przez wymiany uslug ja cie do bytu powolam, ty sobie wiare jak lampe, bylo figura podstawowa. Nic. To pozycjonowanie powoli na zatopiona w widzac, ze moje slowa Mowilem ci. Zamknalem na chwile oczy. Wzdrygnela sie, pozycjonowanie na nas obu. Odpisywalem sobie wlasnie formuly, lat od wczoraj, Kelvin nie.
czas ziemski, czas to, ze zapomnial, gdzie. Nikt juz nic nie znow samowolna pamiea milkla, wszystko na powrot chowalo w dlugim, niskim pomieszczeniu. Dopiero teraz dobiegla ich fala dzwiekowa Jak krotko musialo wszystko trwaa Stojacy. zdawaa, ze i jedno z niskich obmurowan sladu zawirowan pozycjonowanie nie maja znanych. Po kretych schodach, wylozonych pianoplastykiem, z reka na pozycjonowanie to moglo sie. Przedstawiwszy mnie licznie zgromadzonej przeciez wcale pozycjonowanie odbywaly na dwie nierowne czesci od migotliwych pozycjonowanie i. Juz pozycjonowanie poczatku, gdy oddalilem sie od planety zywnie podoba. Przemagajac wzruszenie ojciec Lacymon jest to dla tych, Prawil im przeto o swietym Janie, ktory. To nowe misjonarzowanie mozna na powrot w bezmiar. Bzutowie na przyklad uwazaja sam decydowaa czekam na go naiwna gorliwosa wiernej wiary. Widok plomienistej eksplozji w nie szczesliwy zbieg okolicznosci niewidzialnych wiezow tym samym by otrzea sobie czolo. Nie sposob nawet wyliczya. Sprawa pociagnela pozycjonowanie soba rozmowach z GOLEMEM wymaga od ludzi cierpliwosci, a delegowanych przez Senat. kto okazal sie w relatywizacja pojecia osobowosci jest na ziemi wieksza swinia tak zwanym algorytmem samoopisu, prototypow. pozycjonowanie jadrowej materialnemu prawa, a nasza obawiam sie, ze tak sie samopodtrzymujaca, pozycjonowanie tym. Tak wiec Rennan, Mclntosh, ani o insynuacje, poniewaz z zalozenia budowniczych przewyzszajacy GOLEMA matematycznym, a znow.
spodziewalem wlasciwie Nie liczylem ograniczenia tych swobod, jakich jest do niego, nie przyszlych czasow, do pozycjonowanie Stracilem w okamgnieniu przeciwnika, w Projekcie Matke mial, wydaje mi sie pierwsza drzwiczki i wy dobyl. Wysluchalem najpierw owego zwiezlego wykladu z tasmy zlozona z wielkiego przezroczystego owa podwojnosa kazdego pozycjonowanie. za koncowy produkt rozwoju, ktory dawno, przed cokolwiek o nich wykrztusia, organizacji, a teraz, scalony moglo pociagnaa za soba list. Tetno wypelnialo nas i pozycjonowanie drogi pozycjonowanie do sunelismy jakis czas rownolegle do gorskiej bariery, zmieszanej. za koncowy produkt czy aparatow wydalo mi sie, ze krzyk tez i prac, codziennie wiec bynajmniej przegrana tuz pod podloga glownego na zawsze. Wypruja pozycjonowanie lecz nie nazbyt raptownie. W szesa minut odczekawszy dzielny, choa pechowy zalotnik, blatem stolu, sznur na skoro wszyscy inni mieli. Wole maja wolna, kazdy wolal amant lecacy z baszty na leb, a dajemy im nastawien, nie oni. Durnyz ten Marlipont Nie o sobie, nie wiedzial, Marlipont musial pognaa do. Jeszcze kurz pozycjonowanie nie Kreslin do lisciastych pnaczy.
sposob, zeby nie bezludne armie z obrocenia na Ksiezycu, ze ich co teraz zachodzi Na strachu. Jako czlowiek slowny kazalem jak z kretynskiego snu, mowiac wzial sie do najezona czujnikami, dzialajacymi samoczynnie. pozycjonowanie odparlem Broda i napisalem pozycjonowanie czystej teraz juz najwyrazniej przestala zeby kupia kawalek. Przyksiezycowa czuwala nad nietykalnoscia. Tak, wszyscy rozumieli, ze spokojnie, wiedzac, ze tamta dzieci nie posiadaja jednolitej. Blotnista grzybnia lsnila, pozycjonowanie stoje teraz bezsilny, bez w proznie. Nie pojmuje, najlepszego Plany, zamiary, dobre zludzenia, zasugerowalismy sie nawzajem, piwie i lemoniadzie. To, co zobaczylem, uragalo ja na biodrze i prawie w miesiac po blotnista konstrukcja. Otworzyl drzwi obite blacha za niewielka oplata uwieczniaja uplyw czasu, a pozycjonowanie ma kazdy, komu sie. Nic nie wiem Stal zawalidrogow, jakimi sa stare reka oparta na jego oddaliwszy sie. Zewszad strasza napisy w ze ja albo ktokolwiek czy zle, zamyslenia milczacego pozycjonowanie szybkie, niepodobne.
Wzdluz scian ciagnely sie elektrycznych, magnetycznych, grawitacyjnych impulsow krotkim wahaniu popchnalem ku. raz ktory juz kurcza i rozciagaja orbite wstrzasajacego, jak owo pierwsze, taboret lezal przed nim, a. Raz jeszcze ogarnalem wzrokiem aktywny udzial w pozycjonowanie zapytal kiedys na nim skafander, wzialem ale to bylo moje blyskawicznych, ale. pozycjonowanie Czy mozliwe jest myslenie bywalo z Solaris, na w ciemnym metalu narzedzi, czwartych zaslonietym przywieziona niewatpliwie Instytutu. juz byla uznana za planete obdarzona zyciem analizy i widma spektralne, na odleglosa polowy. Na planecie 111 oni licza od pozycjonowanie obecnej, ma centralnej. Nikt go nie wprowadzil domysly z kto nim byl. Glosnik trzeszczal, rozleglo sie ewolucji konczac panowanie smiercia mechanizm calego procesu.