Suit of the Week: Hugo Boss

226 Comments

1. Hey wise hive,

   A friend of mine recently received a settlement in a harassment action against her employer during mediation. Upon receiving her attorney’s final bill she was blown away to discover that her attorney charged her almost five times what the attorney estimated she would charge for the mediation. (The attorney was drinking alcohol during the Zoom mediation and settled for far less than she estimated she would get.) The hours listed on the bill are pretty obviously inflated (55 hours for a mediation brief which my friend practically wrote herself–it copied and pasted the text of a very detailed summary my friend had provided to the attorney). What can she do? Should she even bother complaining? The attorney held back the amount of her exorbitant legal bill from the settlement money so she doesn’t know if there is a way to even get it back. This is in California. Not in the legal world so would appreciate any advice. Thank you.

   1. Did she get an itemized bill? I would definitely bring it up to the attorney. She likely can file a grievance over the amount bill. At least in Texas, the grievance process is a pain for attorneys to respond to so she might get some money back if the attorney doesn’t want the hassle of responding. But I’d definitely recommend that she contact the attorney about the bill before she threatens to file a grievance.

      1. Thank you for responding! She did contact the attorney but the attorney won’t reduce the bill or explain why the bill was so much.

   2. OP, the way this post reads, it sounds like the attorney agreed to a settlement without her consent. Am I reading that right?

      1. Thank you for responding! No, my friend consented, and she’s not thrilled with the settlement amount but it is what it is. That’s not her concern as much as the attorney’s bill–the huge amount of legal fees that went 5x over the attorney’s estimate, and the inflation of hours on the bill.

      2. It sounds to me like the friend agreed to the settlement but had either not agreed on a fee arrangement with the attorney before the settlement occurred or did not anticipate that the fees would be as high as they were.

         OP, your friend probably has the option of filing a complaint with the state bar. Under the rules of professional responsibility in my jurisdiction (and most others, I believe), an attorney’s fee has to be reasonable.

         1. Thanks. My friend had an hourly fee agreement with the attorney but the attorney gave her a written estimate of what it would cost to get through mediation. The bill she received was 5 times higher than the written estimate.

   3. First step is to bring it up to her attorney. When people question my bills, I often discount them as a professional courtesy. If she didn’t authorize the settlement, that’s a different story. Many Bar associations have fee dispute services too.

      As far as the alcohol, is your friend sure that’s what was in the glass? My friend uses stemless wine glasses as her everyday glasses and realized people thought she was drinking wine when she wasn’t.

      If her attorney really was drunk, she can file an ethics complaint but that doesn’t get her money.

      If she didn’t authorize the settlement she should talk to a malpractice attorney.

      1. Thank you. The attorney was pretty open about it being wine in the glass, and at one point in the mediation requested that one of her assistants bring her gin, apparently.

         I have now discovered that my friend disputed the bill with the attorney and she refused to budge on the amount owed. Thank you for letting me know about the fee dispute service, I’ll have her look into that.

      2. I think that your freind should show the attorney these posts on Corporette, as another explotative variation of the #metoo movement.

         If he doesn’t refund her some money, then she could show this to the bar association. All to often, pretty women get objectivized — after all, that is how she got a settlement from her boss, but then the attorney also thought that he could dip into her recovery and charge her, even tho he was drinking, b/c it was his chance to think he was a BMOZ (Big Man on Zoom) who could tell his freinds he had a pretty woman who paid him and didn’t complain. FOOEY on men like this one. Why is it that men continue to do this to us? We should NOT stand for this any more. DOUBEL FOOEY!

         1. I’m so thrilled to finally get an Ellen response! But unfortunately, the lawyer is a woman, so FOOEY. She also refuses to answer any questions about the bill.

   4. Did she have a retainer letter?

      1. Yes, she had an hourly fee agreement letter (nonrefundable “processing fee” and all!).

   5. Either the state bar or the local bar will provide a resource for her (your friend) to challenge the fee (look on their websites – I know my major city’s bar has this option and it’s handled as an informal arbitration). The fee thing is frustrating, but in and of itself, it could just be a bad estimate given at mediation. It’s not unusual to think you’ve spent only a small amount of time on a case, only to have it all come in much higher in the end and once other attorneys are included, etc. Maybe I’m just being too generous to the attorney though. That said, if she was really drinking during mediation, that is a much bigger issue. That should warrant a report to the bar.

      1. Thanks for responding–at some point if the fees were ballooning wouldn’t the attorney inform the client that the fees were exceeding the written estimate? I understand a few thousand dollars but the final bill was five times what the estimate was, and the estimate in itself wasn’t cheap.

   6. Just curious…. and I am certainly not a lawyer….

      Typically, with the settlements that my family have been involved with (eg. a car accident) the lawyer kept 1/3 of the final settlement.

      Is the fee the lawyer charged more than 1/3 of the settlement?

      I would definitely follow the good advice you have been given on this thread and would file a grievance etc…

      1. It sounds like that the OP signed a retainer to pay by the hour and not a contingency agreement as you are describing (where the lawyer takes a percentage of the recovery).

      2. Thanks for responding! She had an hourly fee agreement with the attorney, not a contingency fee agreement where the attorney keeps a percentage of the settlement. It certainly seems that a grievance is warranted here based on what other attorneys are saying.

   7. The drinking is ridiculous and unacceptable. The only question i have is whether your friend was a difficult client. Did the lawyer prepare a mediation brief, she rejected it, and then forces a lot off changes? Did your friend call the lawyer a lot thinking she was getting free hand-holding or to micromanage the work? It sounds like the lawyer’s bill is inappropriate, but I would want to close the door on that.

      1. Thanks for responding! She was not a difficult client and did not call the attorney often or force a lot of changes. In fact she wrote most of the mediation brief herself–the attorney’s staff copied and pasted directly from a memo of facts she wrote to the attorney at the start of the case. That’s why she is so flabbergasted at the bill.

2. I know that some of you are all up on reading new research on coronavirus. I have been just overwhelmed with stuff and feel like I have fallen behind (meanwhile: gearing up for homeschooline 2.0). Send me links of stuff I should have read already!

   1. https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/archive/2020/07/scourge-hygiene-theater/614599/

      1. I love this: “As long as people wear masks and don’t lick one another, New York’s subway-germ panic seems irrational.”

         1. But they still have to worry about the lack of air circulation, though

            1. Yeah, this article is cute but totally missed the point. If gyms need to be shutdown, so does the Muni.

            2. Maybe gyms don’t need to be shut down. They just were.

         2. You can’t guarantee people will wear masks and not lick each other – at least not in San Francisco. BART is like another world.

            1. You also can’t guarantee they won’t use the street as a latrine.

      2. Also, anything on the Atlantic by Ed Yong is well researched and well reasoned and oft-retweeted from medical experts and scientists on my twitter feed.

   2. if MLB can’t reopen safely how can schools:
      https://vitals.lifehacker.com/if-we-cant-open-sports-what-hope-is-there-for-opening-1844521031

      we can end it in 4-6 weeks if we wanted to:
      https://coronavirus.medium.com/we-can-eliminate-covid-19-if-we-want-to-64abc91ccc1c

      lasting damage/persistent symptoms
      https://abc7chicago.com/covid-symptoms-19-coronavirus-signs-and/6337918/
      https://www.statnews.com/2020/07/27/covid19-concerns-about-lasting-heart-damage/

   3. Breakdown of why the current testing strategy is failing and an alternative solution that will actually help.
      https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h7Sv_pS8MgQ

3. Back to calorie consumption – if I’m doing IF and watching my carbs, 900 calories keeps me really satiated. Sometimes I have a spoonful of peanut butter even if I’m not hungry so MFP doesn’t yell at me (pushing me to 1100 or so). Thoughts? Is this a sign of a wrecked metabolism, and if so what should I read?

   1. This is not something the internet can diagnose for you. Talk to a doctor or nutritionist.

   2. This post is a sign you need a therapist.

      1. Yup. Hardcore.

   3. Please can you at least try to pretend to care that bragging on the internet that you’re surviving on 900 calories a day just fine is hugely problematic to people who have struggled with eating disorders?

   4. Even if your metabolism wasn’t wrecked, eating like this would do it. Get a therapist.

   5. You’re not counting your calories accurately, plus what everybody else has said.

4. Based on my mis-spent youth, I thought that adult women liked Celine Dion (like really loved it; so much that they’d all do their long skating programs to “It’s all coming back to me now,” which is a song that doesn’t make any sense b/c songs about amnesia aren’t romantic at all, really). And I thought they liked Lifetime, “Television for Women,” which maybe is true for someone, somewhere, but the women I know like detective shows and Breaking Bad and Dexter and Mindhunter and Ozark. Is there a world out there of women like this? As an adult, the world is just radically different than I thought from my former daytime and ice-dancing TV watching (and I just rewatched something on YouTube on skating, which brought it all back).

   What else are things that you all find really different than you expected?

   1. I love this question! Sounds like I have an older frame of reference than you do, but I really expected more aprons.

      1. This made me chuckle. Same.

      2. Ha! Come to my house! I’m all about the aprons!

   2. I thought adults new more things and had things worked out but I feel like it is all the same…same personalities, level of understanding and temperaments in adult bodies.

   3. I would do my long program to “Total Eclipse of the Heart.” I didn’t have cable growing up, so I never saw any video that Bonnie Tyler may have made. But I thought it could be something straight out of (hangs head in shame) Flowers in the Attic. As an adult, I watched the movie version of FITA and OMG it was so, so, so beyond awful. I think it was the one thing I watched on Lifetime, TBH.

      1. https://www.dailymotion.com/video/x7ad03q

         Best Bonnie Tyler video :)

         1. That is a strong eyeliner game. Like it would balance out a mask. So timely!

         2. There are a lot more sports featured in that than I would have imagined. Like a LOT of sports. And dancing ninjas! It’s like did Bollywood make this?

         3. Oh, wow. How did I never see this before? It’s like a committee threw out ideas and used ALL of them.

            1. And then there’s a Hogwarts-ish part at the end. Before it randomly gets creepy but Bonnie just seems confused. Her hair seems so amazingly thick.

   4. Broadly, that so many things that I just thought happened but now know you actually you have to do them yourself. And not things like “you need to save money, you need to pay your bills, if you don’t buy food and cook, you won’t have anything to eat.” That, I knew. It’s more of things like planning vacations, making sure you have an occasion and season appropriate wardrobe, finding decent people to help with home repair/maintenance stuff… somewhat frivolous stuff. I’ve mentioned it before on this board, but I find planning vacations incredibly stressful, but I really enjoy the act of traveling and going to new places. We traveled everywhere as kids, and I just thought it happened. And I just thought your house came with a list of people that would help take care of it. Not a live in staff or anything, and people you had to pay, but that you didn’t have to solicit all these recommendations, and then of course they would show up and charge you what you expected to be charged. I always knew about having to do regular home maintenance, I just wasn’t aware of the amount of effort and research that goes into everything home related.

      1. I’m with you on this. Every time there’s something new (to me) I have to do to my house the hardest part is figuring out who is the right person to do it.

         1. And also, figuring out *what* actually needs to be done and does it really need to happen now or at some point in the future?

            1. Yes! I wish there was an annual checkup for my house the way there is for a car.

   5. I thought that I would magically develop a sense for interior design when I hit 30. I truly do not understand how anyone picks paint / wallpaper / fabrics / furniture / art in a way that goes together.

      1. Same!

      2. Lol, see my paint post below. I frequently think “Whyyyyy am I so bad at this?!”

      3. I thought this would happen for my fashion sense!

      4. Yeeees. I CAN do it, but man this is something that takes a lot of time and effort (same with dressing myself appropriately, honestly).

   6. I would do my long program to Mad World (the Donnie Darko version), and the judges would be too paralyzed by existential angst to score me.

      1. I would watch that!

   7. In my fantasy world I’d skate pairs, not ice dance, and our free skate would be John Legend’s All of Me.

      In real life, I was once an adult singles skater and my program music was a tango. I miss skating.

   8. I thought I would feel “mature” and “grown up” all the time, which I guess would be some version of serious and self-composed. I don’t. I do silly, playful, and careless things all the time, talk in funny voices and baby talk to my dogs, and don’t take myself (or others) very seriously much of the time. I take my work seriously and think I am an emotionally healthy person with good relationship skills nonetheless. That just doesn’t make me feel “grown up” in the ways I expected.

   9. I thought that “day to night” looks in women’s magazines would be relevant to me one day. As an introvert outdoorsy person, I spend 99% of nights at home with my husband or in a tent or traveling. I don’t even own heels or a sheath dress I could wear to the office.

      1. As an extrovert in a city, I also have no need for day to night outfits. In the before times, I usually had plans on weeknights and I just wore what I wore to work?

      2. I have done “night” makeup exactly 0 times in my life. Aside from people who like makeup as a hobby or are in show biz, I don’t even understand why anyone would do it.

   10. Are you high? This post is bizarre. Hi. I’m an adult woman. I enjoy me some Celine Dion and I watch lifetime movies. Turns out there’s a great big beautiful world of adult women out there.

       1. When Celine was in Vegas, who was it going to her shows? I wonder about this and Mariah Carey — these people have gobs of fans, yet I know none of them.

          1. As a 34-year-old woman, it was me. I was seeing Celine in Vegas.

             As a kid, I would do interpretive dances to Celine Dion songs in the front yard. We all have our things.

             1. Celine has a really strong shoe game (and her feet must never get tired) and a very good performer’s fashion sense. I have never seen a Canadian go so completely native to the Vegas milieu. I am impressed.

                The music still is not my jam though.

             2. Celine is from Quebec and therefore was already part-Vegas.

             3. I did not realize that about Quebec. What else don’t I know about Canada?!

   11. I think I real believed that true beauty came from the inside. Then I started dating.

       1. Can you tell us more about this? I’m curious if you’re not finding inner beauty attractive enough to date, or the dating world is overall very shallow, or what.

       2. I’m being a little flip here but to be honest I think I mean a little of both. It was a tough realization for me that how you present yourself to the world can dramatically change how the world reacts to you. (I especially noticed that, after losing ~30 lb, I was considered both more attractive AND more competent at work.) Also, yes, I went on dates for whom I felt no spark; I always wondered if I would have felt one if they were better groomed/dressed etc.

   12. Also I don’t think I have even once walked hurriedly through the house in a LBD while fixing my necklace and telling the babysitter that there were snacks in the fridge.

       1. Oh, I thought it was your earring;-)

       2. Bwahahahaha same.

       3. I’ve never been to a cocktail party. As a kid I assumed adults went to one about once or twice a month.

          1. I’ve been to exactly one. It was an “ironic” cocktail party when I was about 24 and it was hosted and attended by a bunch of us baby grownups. I fully expected that within a couple years I would be going to lots of real ones.

          2. I think the only cocktail parties that I’ve been to are at business seminars, and you don’t get to wear the cute cocktail dresses that are marketed for such functions. It was very disappointing when I first realized that!

             1. Yeah, this– I have been to lots of work “cocktail parties” (read: seminars, recruiting events) and certainly some drinks and snacks types of events with friends that were more cocktail than house parties, but I have not gotten to wear the wonderful wardrobe that younger me thought would come with these!

   13. Have yall seen the meme that says, “I thought there’d be more quicksand?” Haha, it cracks me up because quicksand was in practically every cartoon and movie I watched as a kid.

       I definitely thought I’d go swanning about to evening affairs in glamorous outfits. I even live in DC as an adult, just like teen me thought I would! But OMG, after a day of work, the only thing I want to do is go veg out in comfy clothes. It has to be something pretty spectacular for me to agree to be “on” and in nice clothes outside of work hours ha. I’ve only been to one embassy event and a couple Kennedy events in all the years I’ve lived here.

   14. I thought I would have to live in the suburbs and be a SAHM homeschooling as many children as my body would push out while obeying my husband and rarely interacting with anyone my own age.

       I am so f-ing thrilled that in the real adult world there are other options. I love my job and live in a city apartment by myself and talk to other adults 10x more than I interact with children.

   15. I thought I would know how to go places without a map.

       My parents used to drive us all over New England for vacations, they knew how to get to all the relevant places in surrounding towns (movie theaters, DMV, etc) without ever checking directions, even if it was somewhere we’d never been before.

       (And my skating song would totally be As I Lay Me Down by Sophie B. Hawkins)

   16. I thought I would just feel like a grown-up. I am 37 years old, married, three kids, a lawyer, have a mortgage, etc. all the things that make me an adult, but when something happens I still feel like someone else surely should handle this?? I am constantly shocked that nope, I am the adult here and I have to handle it haha.

       1. Hahaha same! Especially now that I have teenagers. With the sorts of trouble my son has been into (I’ll spare you), I’ve looked over my shoulder for someone else to handle it…because surely it can’t just be me.

5. This blog needs a whole separate diet page.

   1. Hi, I’m 5’6″ and 110 lbs. I am currently eating air and hope. What can I do to lose that last 5 lbs of chub? Ugh ugh ugh. I’m over it. And yes, I scroll past. But it is so annoying.

      1. Same here. I scroll past and collapse, but it’s so annoying and tiring to even read those first posts opening up the conversation. I hate diet culture so much and wish it could be separated out completely for those who insist on discussing it ad nauseam and/or justifying disordered eating/obsessing over IF schedules/hyper-analyzing caloric content/acting like losing five pounds in a pandemic is a priority/etc. This is where a forum style would work better for this site; those who want to start threads about diets could do it away from all the other threads.

      2. “I eat less than a Syrian refugee and am clinically underweight but my tightest jeans didn’t fit today. Help!”

      3. Seriously. I do not have a history of disordered eating, but I deliberately do not seek out this type of information because I find it *very* bad for my mental health.

      4. Amen! I hate seeing this and it’s triggering to see it pop up constantly. Are y’all really just eating 900 calories a day in an 8 hour window??

         1. I thought the same. I would pass out!

         2. Sorry, but someone eating 900 calories per day cannot engage in high-intensity, difficult, focused work. Ain’t no rainmaking biglaw partners eating 900 calories a day. This is the patriarchy keeping us down. F that noise.

            1. Forget work – no one who is enjoying all that life has to offer is eating 900 calories a day. That (and the time it takes to plan it/obsess about is) is not a joyful existence.

            2. Disagree. I stick to 1200 calories and so do a lot of my friends with amazing careers. You can be thin and successful.

            3. This comment is so uncalled for. I would rather be thin than a fat “rainmaking biglaw partner”

            4. “This comment is so uncalled for. I would rather be thin than a fat “rainmaking biglaw partner””

               And I would rather be fat than be you and have to live your life every day so…

            5. That is so rude.

            6. Not you, American Girl. The anon right above me. Being fat is not the end of the world – plenty of us lead excellent lives.

            7. No. It’s not rude. It’s accurate. You lack reading comprehension. I didn’t say you can’t be thin and successful, come on. There are *obviously* beautiful, thin, fit women who are also successful. What I DID say is that you can’t *eat 900 calories a day* and engage in difficult, focused work — and I stand by that. Your brain cannot function at a sufficiently high level at only 900 calories a day, not to mention how much mental space it takes away from everything else in your life to limit your caloric intake to 900 calories a day. The commenter who says they would rather be “thin” than be a “fat rainmaking partner” — assuming you’re not a troll, that’s such rude comment, not to mention a false dichotomy. Who said anything about being fat? For heaven’s sake, I’m not even saying that people shouldn’t diet or calorie count! But if you are starving yourself by eating 900 calories a day — which is an absolutely miniscule amount of food — I’m sorry, but your performance will absolutely suffer. You will be hungry, and fatigued, have headaches, and unable to focus. Men don’t sabotage their careers this way, and I wish women wouldn’t either.

            8. Ahh, thanks for clarifying Never too many shoes. I was admittedly sad when I thought that you thought my post was rude, because you’re such a thoughtful voice on here and I like your posts! And yes, I agree with your point about the fat-shaming.

   2. Agreed! I’m glad I wasn’t the only one who was annoyed to see yet another IF post. Agree too forum style would be better as the comments are getting super repetitive…

   3. Agreed. There is a pandemic raging on. If I want some Oreos, I’m eating them.

   4. Yes please! It would be so great to share advice about nutrition and fitness without people screaming “YOU NEED THERAPY” all the time. Shame that the body positivity movement doesn’t actually include all shapes and sizes.

      1. Oh go eat a cookie skinny

      2. Nutrition & fitness ≠ diet culture

         1. Nor does “body positivity” = “tell me it’s okay to starve myself.”

         2. I agree but those posts get shouted down too.

      3. There’s something about people posting height, weight and calorie counts that is grating. And yes, therapy can help. Lots of comments about nutrition and fitness go unnoticed.

   5. OMG! I had this exact thought while driving to work today, obviously not even looking at the site. Of course everyone can collapse replies or scroll past, but I’d love a separate page that I could proceed to never visit. “Corporette Diets”?

      1. + 1 in this, I don’t go looking for and don’t want to hear thinspo on a page for professional women.

   6. This is a blog for professional women and a lot of professional women struggle with nutrition/exercise/weight

      1. My nutritional education was as nonexistent as my sex education. It’s a struggle. I’m not convinced calorie counting and getting advice from unqualified internet strangers is helpful, though.

         1. There are plenty of diet blogs, forums, etc. out there for people to use other than this blog–no need to coopt what used to be a fairly novel and nice blog for women who have serious careers into IF content only. The comments on this site have turned the site from “Corporette, for overachieving chicks” into “Corporette..for judgy dieters.”

            1. It’s a fashion blog tho.

      2. A lot of professional women struggle with nutrition/exercise/weight/eating disorders/anxiety disorders.

         1. Love the doubling down Anonymous at 5:36 p.m. on “that’s what I said previously” –it’s almost entirely cut and paste from 4:45 p.m. My point was that there are different places to do diet research, venting, getting support, etc. OTHER THAN this blog, especially given that SO many of us are fatigued by the constant dieting posts. The sheer volume of dieting posts has subsumed any “career” focus of this blog, which can normally be summed up in the comments as: a) posts on intermittent fasting,and b) advice on online dating profiles.

6. I’m apparently looking for a unicorn shelf. Any takers for online shopping? I’m looking for a floor shelf for the corner of my bathroom, next to the toilet. There is only enough room between the toilet and wall for something 9 inches wide. It doesn’t need to be tall either – a few feet tall would be good. I wanted an elegant corner shelf made of marble or glass, but I can’t find something small enough. I‘d settle for something made of wood as long as it’s white. I’d also settle for a square shelf (so, not corner style). I really hate the wired metal bathroom shelf types. Any ideas?

   1. There aren’t many options that narrow – have you considered mounting something higher on the wall (corner or not)?

   2. This one comes in white: https://www.wayfair.com/furniture/pdp/17-stories-lundquist-corner-bookcase-w002714816.html?piid=538058502

   3. What if you just did floating shelves? You might have to DIY (or maybe find a crafty woodworker on Etsy to do something custom for you?) All you’d need is a square of wood/MDF and some brackets … mount them in the corners at the heights you want.

   4. https://theyamazakihome.com/collections/toilet-organizers

7. Thank you and PSA: The black knit Loft dress with pockets that was recommended here last week is down to $19 from $70. I ordered one and it’s a bit short but extremely comfortable.
   https://www.loft.com/lou-grey-signature-softblend-drawstring-pocket-tee-dress/524946?skuId=29892754&defaultColor=2222&prodId=524946

   1. Oooh I like! I’ve never ordered from Loft before and also don’t really know what size I am in general anymore. I used to be a small in things, but I’m leaning toward medium now. Is Loft similar to other brands?

      1. In my experience, Loft runs large. I’m usually a small top/size 6 pant there when I’m solidly medium/8-10 pant everywhere else.

8. Is it just me or would you be surprised (now) to have Akeelah and the Bee as suggested viewing in your school (public, SEUS)? I know it supposed to be a triumphant story of a girl being raised by a single mom in a rough neighborhood (the bee is a spelling bee). But I’ve seen the movie and the play and it is just so casually stereotypical about the asian characters (maybe they assume they will be given a pass b/c every other character is black or hispanic). [N.b., Lauren Sanchez, of Jeff Bezos affair fame, makes a cameo in the movie.] 4th/5th grade kids usually see it in play form (sans parents — I didn’t know how asian characters were treated when I signed older kid’s permission slip and I don’t believe that this was ever conveyed to parents). I wish they could find a better thing, like Hidden Figures or something positive vs positive at the expense of others.

   1. There is so much that’s great about that movie that I would let them watch it and point out the aspects you find objectionable.

      1. I know! It is a great movie — IDK why they felt that they also had to add in so many objectionable asian stereotypes. It would have been a good movie with plenty of drama without them. Sometimes I just want to watch movies without having to get all teacher-y or cringe. Too much to ask?

         1. I don’t think so! It’s definitely an unnecessary addition. I guess that you let the kids watch it and point out that that is wrong, but I also haven’t seen it for a while so I don’t remember exactly what the stereotypes shown were.

      2. I point out stereotypes all the time when we’re watching movies and tv shows with my kids. Maybe they are just humoring me, but they don’t really seem to mind.

   2. Also in the SEUS. I would be surprised, but for the opposite reason.

   3. I wouldn’t be surprised to have that movie be suggested viewing in my kids’ urban Southern CA public school given the rating and the topic (the spelling bee is big in our diverse district). That said, I’ve never watched either the play or the movie. Can you suggest Hidden Figures instead?

   4. Hidden figures is focused around a white savior complex. I haven’t seen akeelah and the bee but I’m not sure hidden figures is the solution.

9. New neighbors just moved into the house next door. (We have been here since March in Suburbia.)

   I glanced up while fixing my lunch to see one of them showering. The window is frosted so it wasn’t seeing Everything, but it was definitely clear which of them it was and what he was doing.

   For obvious reasons, we haven’t met them yet. Should we go tell them and have that be the first interaction, or should we not say anything unless we get to know them? Both seem to be fraught with the potential for significant awkwardness.

   Obviously, not high stakes but one of those things about suburban life I wasn’t completely prepared for!

   1. Lordy — I think that it may be time for a note left for them b/c silence for decades would be worse (and who knows what you could be subject to that they’d prefer to be private).

      “Dear lovely new neighbors,
      Perhaps the pictures in the listing did not adequately show this, but the shower window is not truly opaque.
      Kind regards,
      Chick from next door”

      It is so awkward, but in this case, saying nothing would be bad, especially if they turn out to be nice people that you like (or even very active people, in that way) or even just frequent shower users.

      1. Omg no that is so weird. Just ignore it and let them figure it out one day or wait until you’re friendly enough to mention it casually.

         1. But after you’ve been watching a show for a while? That seems worse. Like I could never be friends with people that I knew had seen that stuff (even though I’d understand the awkwardness in staying quiet). “Tonya, it looks like you’re waxing again!” — I hear Eugene Levy’s voice saying something like this while my ears cringe.

            1. You’re making this even weirder. It would be fine to say, 4 months from now, “hey Betty, I was in the kitchen the other day and happened to look up and see Tom’s head and shoulders getting out of the shower. Even though I hadn’t noticed anything before then, figured I’d let you know just in case!”

            2. Don’t watch them shower seems the pretty obvious answer here.

            3. Anon@ 3:36, I would love not to. It just was a bit of a surprise as I was heating up pizza that the window wasn’t as opaque as anyone obviously expected!

   2. Why do you need to say anything? The window is frosted. Just ignore it.

      1. Apparently not frosted enough. Yikes! And it appears to be a fairly public window :(

   3. Idk, can the whole neighborhood see in or just you? How revealing is it really (you know what’s going on in there, but can you really see them naked?) Consider engaging in the polite fiction that the window is opaque for the rest of your lives.

      1. +1 Some of this is under your control, OP, and that’s whether or not you spend a lot of your time watching your neighbors shower.

      2. Just us, unless someone is walking by on the sidewalk in front of our houses. It was clear which of them it was (male pattern baldness was visible); we could see to the waist. Had it been his female partner, I would guess that I would have seen her breasts.

         My DH said “we’re getting a new sliding glass door next week” so we shouldn’t say anything and afterwards just keep the blinds closed in it. The previous neighbors had a roller shade in that window that they took with them when they moved. I suspect that it hasn’t occurred to the new owners that there is an issue with the opacity of the frosting.

         1. If you could see my form and, um, shaded areas when walking on the sidewalk, I’d wanna know! Bring over treats from a local bakery, introduce yourselves, and mention with a laugh that the window isn’t quite as opaque as they had thought and they might want to investigate it themselves.

            1. Yes! And that the previous owners had a blind.

            2. Agree with both of these.

               ….and check out your own windows in case there is the same problem in your own house.

         2. If it were me I would want to know. But I would probably lie and say “oh I saw you in the bathroom, you weren’t doing anything and I didn’t see anything but you might want to know when you’re taking a shower people might be able to see you”.

   4. Invite the wife over for coffee while the husband is showering.

      1. OMG too horrifying

      2. You are an evil genius, Anonymous 3:49 p.m. [cackles]

   5. I wouldn’t say anything because it’s frosted, which to me is nbd.

      1. I get how it may be NBD to the viewer. But what about the presumed-unwitting viewees? They may have strong feelings about this, especially the woman.

         1. this is all interesting to me! my MO in life is to never close blinds. Changing in my bedroom, bathroom, shower, etc. lights on, off, night, day, etc. (my husband is the opposite)

            I’m sure I’ve got neighbs who can see me, but presumed-unwitting viewees are not and have never been my concern. If a neighbor (male or female) came to tell me they could see me, I’d probably give it the old “Bless your heart”.
            I don’t get off on it… I just… don’t care?

            1. I am also that (Canadian) neighbour. I like the light coming in and I just am not that modest about a potential glimpse through the window. If the sight of my rack is your thrill of the day, well I will just consider it my good deed.

         2. Lol unless he’s standing on a stool waggling it at you I think I’d keep silent! I guess I would say to avert your eyes if you don’t like looking. On a more serious note, it’s possible that they just haven’t gotten around to getting shades yet.

10. I don’t know if I’m totally late to the game but I have been re-discovering the joys of bar soap during stay at home. I got a few dr bronners bar soaps for hand washing early on because they’re pretty moisturizing, and I JUST realized you can also get solid bar dish soap!! I just suds it up with my regular sponge on a soap try but it is actually fabulous and I’m a little annoyed we pre-bought a whole bunch of liquid dish soap we will need to get through before it’s just solid dish soap. Now I’m looking into solid shampoo bars too….

    1. I actually use Bronner’s bar soap to wash dishes!

       Nice! We’ve been switching over to non-plastic alternatives for beauty and household products as mush as possible in my house, and here are my faves after two years of trial and error:
       Dr. Bronner’s bar soap for hand washing dishes and laundry stains
       Bar None shampoo and conditioner (good bar conditioner is impossible to find, this is far and away my favorite)
       Argan oil from Trader Joe’s for body moisturizer
       The Ordinary’s rosehip oil for my face
       Meow Meow Tweet’s rose and clay face soap

       1. Also Trader Joes just started carrying a shampoo bar that I’m interested in trying

11. Does anybody have any experience working with temp agencies to obtain admin staff? Specifically temp-to-hire for a bilingual position. I’m wonder things like how well the agencies screen candidates in general, how well they screen for language abilities, how payment is usually structured, and a general sense of whether firms who have worked with temp agencies have had a good experience.

12. What’s the best new-to-you recipe or food item you’ve tried during the pandemic?

    for me it might be the homechef turkey meatloaf — never been a big meatloaf fan but i’m craving it.

    1. Ohh, good thread topic! Samin Nosrat’s simple tomato sauce… I used to use Marcella Hazan’s recipe, but this has supplanted it

    2. It’s super easy and not anything fancy, but we LOVED the Budget Bytes Maple Dijon Chicken.

       1. And you didn’t ask about cocktails, but we made Negronis the other night and they were easy and delish: equal parts gin, sweet vermouth, and Campari, up, garnished with a twist of orange.

          1. I cannot think of Negronis without thinking of the fantastic piece from (sadly now-defunct) The Awl called “Negroni Season.” I am not even sure when Negroni “season” falls in the year, but that essay makes me laugh so hard tears run down my cheeks every time I read it.

             1. OMG that was amazing.

                “I’m, like, all UP in the NEGRONIS!”

    3. I found a cocktail called “Old Man and the Sea” in a magazine this summer (Country Living?) and my husband has tweaked it and made it his own and it is SO GOOD. We’ve been drinking it all summer.

       2 oz white rum (lime rum if you can get, NBD if not)
       2 oz lime juice
       2 oz grapefruit juice
       4 oz coconut water
       Dash of salt

       1. That sounds so delicious!

       2. Oooh I love all things grapefruit! I’ll be giving this a try for sure.

          Very basic, but the pizza crust recipe from Sally’s Baking Addiction is pretty good. I’ve made two big batches since yeast reappeared and it also freezes well.

    4. Bread cheese! No actual bread, just cheese, and you can cut it jnto cubes and grill it in cheese and veggie skewers. Bonus, the bricks of cheese are good for, like, ever… we just had some with an expiration date of Dec 2020. Pretty sure I bought it in May or June.
       Also, a glug of amaro in a flavored bubbly water is delightful and light enough that I don’t need a nap.

    5. Jarred shakshuka. Life changing.

13. I know many people are avid gardeners on here; I need to buy some shade perennials for my yard. Can you all recommend some good websites to purchase from? For bulbs, I’ve gone with Old House Gardens and Brent & Becky’s (thank you all for those recommendations!) but they have a limited selection of shade plants. I’m looking for some other options. Thank you for any suggestions.

    1. Why would you buy this online? Go to your local garden store.

       1. +1 I’ve had very uneven experiences with buying plants and bulbs online. I try to order almost everything else online, but it definitely pays to go to your local garden center for plants.

    2. You’re definitely best off at a local nursery, the online stores I’ve looked at were more expensive. If you want to share your location I can recommend one if we’re in the same area.

    3. I’ve had good results with longfield-gardens.com.

       1. For medical reasons, I’ve been advised to avoid going out as much as possible. We have everything delivered and only go to necessary medical appointments. So going to a local garden center, as much as I love ours, is not an option right now.

          1. We actually do have one local nursery that is online shopping only, they drop off at your door. Others do curbside pickup. But I guess it is highly variable.

       2. Longfield Gardens is excellent. I know the owners, great people.

          1. Oh, that makes me feel good :) (I’m the one who posted.) I’ve been pleased with the product and it’s great to hear that the owners are good people :)

             1. I want to thank the person who mentioned that their local center delivers. I called a few of our local centers, and one of them has started delivering due to the pandemic. So that was really helpful!

14. I posted a few days ago asking for paint recs (thanks so much to everyone who chimed in!), but could use more help. Walls are yellow, trim is glossy white. I want to paint the walls but not the trim (doing it myself – otherwise I’d have a crew paint everything). 1) Is this an exercise in futility? Should I just paint everything? 2) How do I go about choosing a wall color? I have six samplize stickers and they’re all beautiful but none of them scream “this is your color!” 3) Do I need to pick a grey-white or blue-white instead of a stark white? I’ve been puttering around Houzz but all the white on white houses seem classier than mine, lol.

    1. I would just be careful not to go whiter on the walls than the trim, because it could make your trim look dirty.

    2. What style is your home? I think houses that are all white are boring, but it works better in some than others.

       1. Traditional, I guess? It’s a two story, the main living room has a vaulted ceiling, built in bookshelves, floor to ceiling windows, mosaic hardwood floors and a river rock fireplace. So everything is very warm toned. Maybe I should consider a tan instead of white. I just really like white.

          1. If it’s traditional, I think this blogger would be a good one for you to check out. She has other posts about paint colors too: https://laurelberninteriors.com/2020/06/28/my-20-all-time-favorite-benjamin-moore-paint-colors/

    3. I’d go with a color that’s obviously different than the white trim. It could still be a light color, but something like a light blue or grey or beige. Otherwise, you’ll want to either match the color of your trim exactly or repaint the trim.

    4. Don’t paint your trim the same color and gloss as your walls! Even if you’re painting your walls the same white as your trim, walls should generally be no glossier than an eggshell finish, and trim tends to look best in a semi-gloss finish. Tape the trim off. This will take a significant amount of time, but painting is far more about the prep work than the painting itself.
       I generally buy the sample pots of the paint in my selected colors (usually about four), then once I decide I like one, I use up that sample pot to paint as much of the wall as possible so I can better visualize it before committing to a gallon or more of that paint. I’ve left swatches on my walls for a month while I decide what I like best, because once a room is freshly painted I’m not likely to paint it all over again unless I really hate it. If you’ve lived with the swatches and don’t really like any of them, try a couple more colors.

       TBH, I think the Samplize money is better spent on actual paint samples if you’re certain an area is going to be re-painted. I think the only time they can make sense is if you aren’t sure if you want to repaint a surface and don’t have access to the original paint to cover up the sample swatch.

    5. We went with a cool white on the walls and a more white-white semi-gloss for trim (er, we’re going to. At the moment, the trim is primed.) There’s just enough contrast that it doesn’t look like the trim is supposed to match.

15. I don’t know what to do. I’m 5’4, 148 lbs and still up 15+ lbs from my pre-pregnancy weight. I eat 1,500-1,800 calories a day (maybe, I don’t count them). I really enjoy food, and the occasional drink. I’m definitely not thin anymore but my doctor doesn’t seem concerned about my weight. Most concerningly, my husband and toddler seem to love me exactly the way I am.

    WHAT TO DO???

    1. Eye roll

       1. Eye roll is the new “eat a muffin”

    2. But how do you feel about button down shirts?

    3. Poor attempt at satire.

    4. It’s too true. At least anyone who has time to obsess about 5 lbs during a pandemic probably isn’t dying in the hospital or dealing with a loved one suffering. I guess that’s a silver lining.

    5. Congratulations on never having had a trivial concern or asking a “stupid” question

       1. For real, this place is so vicious sometimes.

          1. Yeah, I guess it seems dumb to some people but not everyone wants to spend a thousand dollars on new clothing if they gain 10 lbs.

             1. Oh please. This is new heights of absurdity.

    6. This is getting ridiculous. I dare say every woman on this board has at one time thought “I’d like to lose 5 pounds” or “man, my eating habits have changed [for whatever reason] and I am not the size I used to be” (either bigger or smaller). Stop calling everyone out on it. If it triggers you, ignore it. But don’t pretend like people don’t think about it themselves. Or perhaps we just aren’t all perfect like you…

       1. As someone on the mommy board put it: “I regret engaging on that thread.” I only commented on the morning thread because OP is so close to my size and so obviously underweight that I was like “Wow. This girl needs to get some help.” To your point though, you can go to the mommy board and get solid, empathetic advice or commiseration re losing the last 5 pregnancy lbs. What triggers me about these posts is the over the top-ness: I’m clinically underweight, yet I’m lifting weights AND doing way too much cardio AND starving myself – what gives?? If you’re really doing those things, you need to see a professional for both your mind and your body. I’m sorry internet strangers are being mean to you but I hope that is the wake up call you need to get some help. And if you’re lying, which it kinda seems like you are because you keep doubling down on it/reposting/asking the same question a different way, you deserve the vitriol.

          1. +1 to all of this.

          2. Why is the vitriol ok though? Is it really that hard for women to support other women? Must we exemplify stereotypical catfight behavior at every opportunity? That’s what doesn’t sit right with me, no matter what the topic of discussion. If you can’t be supportive or disagree in a respectful way, please just be quiet.

    7. I know this is satire, but as someone who is struggling madly to lose pregnancy weight, this isn’t exactly as funny as you think it is. (It doesn’t really help that my husband’s family body-shamed me at week 9 and, guess what, I weigh more postpartum than I did at week 9. During my pregnancy, my husband defended his family, and defended his family, and defended his family, until I finally told him that one more word would result in divorce.)

16. So all these weight obsessed posts make me want to point out something that I think is under discussed. When we call out someone for obsessing over weight they usually argue that they aren’t vain they are just worried about their health and the increased risk being overweight would bring them. Others sometimes raise the increased cost to the healthcare system of overweight people.

    I am not overweight but currently have a running injury. My husband is in a wrist brace due to a sports injury. I was at the sports orthopedist today. I would wager to bet that athletes cost the health care system more with our sports injuries, particularly the extreme athletes. I know an ultra endurance runner that was hospitalized with kidney issues due to his running. Someone else had heart issues from running. I definitely would not be needing PT and a prescription and even possible surgery if I wasn’t a runner.

    Let’s stop the superiority complex re: our health. We certainly cost the health care system a lot too from our voluntary activities.

    1. I made the same point last week or the week before on yet another “fat people hurt the system” screed. Unless you’re coming down hard on endurance athletes who sprain their ankles, people who drive more than they should and cause expensive accidents and unhealthy pollution, women who drink more than they should, or literally anyone who does anything at all in life, then you’re discriminating against fat people when you single them out for “costing the system more,” as if all fat people are a diabetes-laden monolith who don’t deserve health care. If you want to talk about how the public health system can promote health and wellness, especially for low-SES people, I’m all ears – but the “blame the fatties” crowd never seems to want to.

    2. This is nonsense and you need to learn the difference between anecdotes and data.

       A few ultra-endurance athletes may need more health care because there are overtraining risks and risks to the heart and kidneys. That hardly means that going out for an evening run is somehow stressing the health care system, and, moreover, such stress on the health care system means we can’t talk about weight.

    3. Yup. As soon as you break down that argument it falls apart.

    4. I’m overweight so I know my own costs add to this, but athletes are not the problem or even more than a small problem in the US. Obesity has a huge impact on medical costs and lost employee hours.

       Quote from article: Obesity-related medical care costs in the United States, in 2008 dollars, were an estimated $147 billion. Annual nationwide productivity costs of obesity-related absenteeism range between $3.38 billion ($79 per obese individual) and $6.38 billion ($132 per individual with obesity). (Not sure why a current CDC site uses 2008 data. ) https://www.cdc.gov/obesity/adult/causes.html

       Quote: Looking ahead, researchers have estimated that by 2030, if obesity trends continue unchecked, obesity-related medical costs alone could rise by $48 to $66 billion a year in the U.S. https://www.hsph.harvard.edu/obesity-prevention-source/obesity-consequences/economic/

       https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5359159/

       https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2891924/

       1. It’s not just athletes. Parents, drinkers, smokers, poor people, rich people, people with chronic conditions, stressed people, and babies all cost more. Where does this game end? We keep blaming stigmatized populations for rising costs instead of investing in public health and demanding an end to our for-profit health system?

       2. I appreciate you taking the time to present data rather than just opinions.

       3. +1 the diet obsession on this board doesn’t sit right with me nor is fat shaming a solution, but let’s not pretend the US’s obesity problem doesn’t cost the healthcare system a ton of money. We have terrible nutrition as a country (and that doesn’t extend to just those who are overweight).

          All that said, we know diets don’t really work long term so we need to come up with a better solution than just telling overweight people they’re the problem.

          1. Yes, I totally agree that fat shaming isn’t a solution. I’ve been overweight (but not obese) for my entire life, following in the footsteps of my obese grandmother and overweight mother. I have lymphoma that is currently incurable. It’s possible that I wouldn’t have gotten lymphoma at age 60 if I hadn’t been overweight all my life. Or drank alcohol. Or been stressed by being a working mom. I wouldn’t have cost my insurance company $150,000 in treatments just in 2019. I may need a cutting edge CAR-T treatment to cure me in the future… $500,000-$1,000,000. If it comes after I’m 65, it may be paid by Medicare, so the whole country is paying for it. Maybe by then the cost will only be $300,000 or maybe Medicare will deny it.

             Sure, I knew for the past 25 years that being at an unhealthy weight was a risk for cancer. But I didn’t know that when I was 20. Maybe I thought 3-4x a week cardio would help, maybe it kept me from getting brest cancer. Maybe I’ll still get b-cancer. My dad and two of my three brothers have had cancer – maybe I had the gene all along and nothing would have helped. There are so many variables.

             The funny thing about people who say that obese people at higher risk for covid brought it on themselves. I know many obese people who are worried about it. But if, for example, they’re destined to get covid in November, even if they ate 1000/calories a day from now til then, they’d still likely be overweight and/or obese. Even if they had bariatric surgery this week, they’d still be at risk by then.

             Those are my ramblings for today.

       4. This is so silly. Of course having a health issue is expensive. But we don’t cancer shame people for the cancers caused by our industrial society and we should not fat shame people for the weight problems caused in part by our industrial society and in part by modern medications. Instead lobby for a safer set of environmental conditions.

       5. Great, now post data on how to successfully treat obesity. Oh that’s right, you can’t. Diets don’t work and we have limited medication options. So let’s not shame people for having a virtually untreatable condition. And let’s really not shame low income families who live in food deserts for making poor choices. The classist and racist aspect of the fat shaming discussion really bother me.

          1. I never fat shamed anyone. Exactly the opposite. I was just posting info about how much obesity costs and then posted that it was unrealistic to expect people to lose weight and also wrong to blame them for obesity or its effects.

17. I’m looking to refinance but having trouble getting close to any of the rates I’ve seen recently in comments. If you’ve refinanced recently, gotten a good rate, and been pleased with the process, would you mind sharing what lender you used? Thanks!

    1. I would recommend you shop around a bit and keep asking. We ended up going with a small local lender and had to lock in on a good day to get our rate. Wells Fargo had quoted us figures that were .5% higher. (So we went with 2.6% on a 15 but were quoted 3.15% by Wells)

    2. Navy Federal

    3. I bought recently (so slightly different from a re-fi) and used Pen(tagon) Federal, but I think this is a situation where your broker may matter more than an individual lender.
       Also–don’t be afraid to talk to more than one broker at a time to shop what you get. This honestly never occurred to me, and it should have, but we–fiance and I–just did it when we bought our new house, each using brokers we’d individually used before. In the end, the brokers were bidding against each other, leaving us in a really good position.

    4. Ladera Lending (loan officer was Mike Halik). Got a good rate on a refi and it was super easy and painless.

       1. Thank you all! Navy Fed Credit Union has great rates but is adding .75% for refinancing a non-NFCU mortgage. But I’ll check out Ladera and Pentagon Federal. And keep shopping around. If anyone else has suggestions, I welcome them too.

    5. Late but S&T Bank – mid-atlantic bank.

       1. Thanks, much!

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