ByElizabeth Hours Updated
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Thursday’s Workwear Report: Silk Flutter-Sleeve Top in Leopard

Our daily workwear reports suggest one piece of work-appropriate attire in a range of prices. This blouse is a fun way to do leopard print without going too far overboard. As a child of the ’90s, I always worry about veering into Peg Bundy or Fran Fine territory! The tie-neck can be left loose or tied, as shown in the photo. It’s made of silk, which makes it a great choice for these steamy summer days. I would wear it tucked into a pencil skirt to balance the proportions of the flutter sleeves. The blouse is $110 and available in sizes XXS–L at J.Crew. (Unfortunately, XL and XXL have sold out.) Silk Flutter-Sleeve Top in Leopard Two plus-size options are from Vince Camuto and 1.State, both at Nordstrom. This post contains affiliate links and Corporette® may earn commissions for purchases made through links in this post. For more details see here. Thank you so much for your support! Curious for more? Check out some of our great recent posts: Seen a great piece you’d like to recommend? Please e-mail tps@corporette.com. (edited)

Sales of note for 12.3.24 (lots of Cyber Monday deals extended, usually until 12/3 at midnight)

And some of our latest threadjacks here at Corporette (reader questions and commentary) — see more here!

Some of our latest threadjacks include:

260 Comments

  1. To the person who suggested super thin socks for my AGL sneaker question yesterday — thank you! I was trying them on with my normal cotton ankle socks. It was pressure on the side of my pinkie toe, not pressure “down” from the top of the shoe, that was giving me trouble — the 2mm difference in sock volume fixed it!

  2. I got a balayage at a highly reccd and $ local salon yesterday. I feel like it looks like a dye job I could have done myself (too orange!). Can I go back and ask them to do something? If I do, will I have to pay for it? I already spent 250 on this and would be upset to through more money after good. Has anyone had a good result from asking them to fix it? Specific wording beyond crying and saying I feel like I had an accident with sun-in appreciated.
    This was a real treat and splurge that I haven’t done in 15 years and now I feel like I look like a clown. Help!

    1. You can ask them to use a toner on your hair to “tone down” the orange without covering up your balayage that you paid so dearly for. This is a semi permanent dye that may need to be repeated every month or so.

    2. Can you articulate what’s wrong with it? If they’ve done it wrong they should fix it free of charge.

        1. OP, I actually think it looks great and quite well done as it is pretty well distributed. But you have to live with it. I would suggest waiting a week so you wash it a few times (it does fade a tiny bit) and get used to it and then if you still do not like it, go and get a toner put in.

        2. I think it looks good in the photo – definitely not splotchy! You’re probably not used to it. If you don’t like the color, you should definitely go back to the salon and have them tone it so it’s a cooler shade. I also agree that you might want to live with it for a week and see how the color looks after you’ve washed your hair a few times.

        3. I do see it’s a little brassy, I would ask for them to tone it to a cooler shade. They’ll probably add purple and you can use a purple shampoo at home if the toner wears off. Should be an easy fix.

        5. I actually think it looks great. That “splotchy” feeling might be related to the natural fall of your curls, which often fall differently everyday. Part of the beauty is the change! It doesn’t look orange at all to me but rather caramel. But if it is too orange for you, ask for a toner and that will get you to a more cool tone.

        7. OP- I have similar color brown hair and got balayage this year too. Mine is much cooler toned, similar to Audrina Patrige’s. I’m not a hair color expert but I think toner will help.

        8. It’s definitely too brassy. Balayage shouldn’t have that stark contrast between the light and dark colours.

      2. Thanks guys- you are all making me feel better about it. I’ll wait a couple days and see how I feel (also seeing a bunch of girlfriends this weekend so they can tell me what they think irl).

        1. If you ultimately do determine you want it toned down, you can ask for a “gloss” which should take down any brassiness and adjust the color. Any time I have been unhappy at my salon, they fix it for free but if for some reason you wind up having to pay, a gloss in my area is $35, so the price might be worth peace of mind.

    3. “Hello, I had balyage done at your salon yesterday with stylist. Looking at it in natural light, it is not what we had talked about; it’s so orange I feel like a clown. When can I come in for the correction? I think it might need a tone.”

      Normally they’ll do this for free. This is also an easy fix – they’re gonna tone it with an all over ‘tint’ that takes out some of the orange. They fix this often!

      1. The “like a clown” seems unnecessary – if you’re hoping they’ll do you a favor (fix it for free), it’s better to be nice I think. Just say it’s not what you had talked about it and you’d like a correction.

        1. Agreed. Maybe “it’s so orange that it does not look natural with my coloring” ?

          1. If you just say “it’s orange” that’s enough to convey the problem. You don’t need to explain why orange is not the color you were going for.

        2. Yes, I agree with this. Try to leave the emotions out of it and state the problem neutrally and how you want them to solve it.
          “While the color looked fine in the salon yesterday, it looks brassy and orange today. I would like to come in for a correction.”

    4. Yes, I’ve done this before when my colour didn’t turn out right and they fixed it for free.

    5. I had something similar with a colorist at Mario Triccoci and they fixed it for free. A toner will definitely help dull it. If you find it getting too brassy again (mine usually does a month or two after I get mine colored just due to our awful water, I highly recommend using a bluing shampoo like blue mulva).

    6. Agree that you need toner if you feel it is too orange. That should be a pretty easy fix. It’ll just sit in your hair for a while and then they’ll wash it out. But a bit of a head’s up…I have very similar hair color-wise, and sometimes when the toner goes in I feel like it really minimizes the color variation. I mean that’s the point, but you can get too much of a good thing, I guess.

      1. Adding that if you have dark hair and lighten it, having it become brassy and orange is incredibly common and doesn’t necessarily reflect on the colorist or salon. It’s just about how your hair reacts to the particular formula. They’re totally used to it and won’t blink an eye if you call and ask for the orange to be toned. Next time, if you choose to keep going, they’ll adjust the formula and/or automatically add some toner when they wash the color out.

    7. Oh yikes, if you pay $250 and don’t love the result you are completely justified in calling the salon (or emailing, if it’s an option) and telling them you’re not happy with your new color, a good salon will offer to fix it for free.
      I did this having spent a lot less, it was just a haircut that was maybe $50, and I emailed the salon and said I was unhappy with my hair (and honestly, I was unhappy with the stylist too, her attitude towards short hair wasn’t great), and they not only had me come in for a free correction, they booked me with a senior stylist.

        1. Even rarer than unicorns. I had to grow my pixie out when we moved because I couldn’t find someone who could cut it right. I had it cut short again three years ago when I just couldn’t stand daily blowouts any longer and it still isn’t quite right after I’ve tried half a dozen stylists including the pixie specialist at the highest-rated salon in the city.

        2. Yep. Hence why I stay with my stylist even though scheduling my appointments is a PITA that requires me to take some vacation time to accommodate. I love my short hair but so many stylists just do not know how to do it in a way that doesn’t look either a) frumpy or b) like my high school gym teacher styled it.

        3. I was going to a guy for awhile who was fine and then, inexplicably, he decided to take a VERY LARGE chunk out of the middle of my bangs.It literally looked like a toddler had chopped off my hair, and it took months to grow out. There was very little ability to like, sweep my bangs differently to avoid it.

    8. Buy a bottle of Goldwell purple shampoo and use it a couple of days in a row and see if that tones it down. (It is not meant for daily use, but you can continue to use it semi-weekly or weekly going forward.)

  3. OP, I did not see your original query (I have been very busy this week), but am glad your issue is satisfied. I can concur with the need to be careful with thick socks which puts pressure on my toes. Because of my years of wearing 4″ heels, I developed pain in my pinky toes b/c of the pressure and my perceived need back then to be at eye level with men. So once I was given the choice by my podiatrist to either give up wearing 4″ heels every day, and my ideal to look men on an eye-to-eye, basis, I chose to stop with the heels exept when I was in court, dating or rainmaking. So now I wear 2″ heels or my Nike Airs,I feel alot better, and even tho Dad says I look dumpy since I am not that svelte, I say FOOEY to that! And in your case, congratulations for finding a solution. Hopefully, you will be able to keep pain free with your own solution! YAY!!

  4. Seeking the group wisdom here. I am trying to cook more to be a bit healthier but don’t really have a ton of time to spend on the kitchen so hoping to lean on my instant pot/slow cooker more. My staples are currently chili and salsa chicken but am looking for a few more easy, yummy and healthy(ish) recipes I can throw into the mix. Bonus points for true dump/set it and forget it recipes. I am overwhelmed by the options on the internet and don’t trust Pinterest since so many people pin things without trying them. Hoping you ladies have some good go to recipes I can add to the rotation! Thanks!

    1. Mississippi mud roast with either beef or pork – you can skip the butter and it is still just as good. Fat all melted off and then you have shredded meat for salads or tacos.

    2. There are a bunch of slow cooker pulled pork recipes online. I don’t have a specific recipe to recommend because I combine elements of different ones and change up the seasoning depending on what I’m using the pork for: tacos, bbq sandwiches, different types of bowls, etc.

    3. I use mine to cook brown rice and have realised that whole green or brown lentils cook in the same time, which makes it easy to do mujadara. I’ve been known to leave out the sauteed onions and it’s still tasty. Veggie-lite, but a quick side salad is easy enough.

      Frozen corn/lima beans/green beans also cook in the same time, so you can throw a handful of those over the rice with something like a dash of cumin and some tomato paste to make a simplified version of Mexican rice. Either sautee some chicken breast while it’s cooking or shred a rotisserie chicken and you can easily have a few days of healthy dinners.

    4. I put chicken breasts in with a few tablespoons of water, salt, and pepper. High for 3-4 hours. Then use the meat for salads, tacos, chicken salad, etc.

    5. There is a recipe site that I think Instant Pot paid some bloggers to do for advertising (pressurecookrecipes), but it’s actually very good. Leans more towards Asian food as the bloggers are from Hong Kong, but everything I’ve tried from it has worked well.

      Serious Eats has great pressure cooker recipes. You may need to adjust for your Instant Pot as some of the older ones were written with a stove top one in mind, but in my experience, most of the timings still work fine. The Colombian chicken stew is SOOOO easy (like 4 ingredients) and turns out great.

      1. Thanks! I feel like when you google recipes there are 1000 listicles but no way of knowing if any of the recipes are good or not. I hate Pinterest for this type of stuff because the recipes with the highest search results are the ones that are pinned the most but so many people pin stuff they never actually try

    6. I know you’re probably looking to move away from chili, but I love making healthy chili with ground turkey and lots of kidney beans, chickpeas, carrots, jalapenos, and corn. I’d also love to try making chana masala in my slow cooker, the only thing holding me back is feeling like I need a food processor to make a paste out of the garlic, tomatoes, onions, and ginger.
      I used to make “veggie” jambalaya in my rice cooker – brown rice, red beans, celery, and chopped grape tomatoes with some chicken stock and creole seasoning. You could make it vegetarian with veggie stock but I haven’t found one I like.

    7. For the crock pot:

      Pulled pork – Your favorite BBQ sauce, Dr. Pepper, and pork, and then set it and forget it. You can also use it for pulled chicken.

      Mushroom chicken – 1 can of cream of mushroom soup, fresh mushrooms, and some chicken breasts.

      Changing up the salsa for salsa chicken – pineapple salsa or the like.

      Italian chicken – A few tablespoons of chicken broth, some Italian dressing, and chicken.

      I also make some other easy meals that do not involve the crockpot. I don’t like vegetables in the crock pot, so I either roast them or cook them in a skillet in a big batch and save the leftovers so I have them for other meals, omelette add ins, etc.

      A few of my meals that take <30 minutes – I make a big batch so I can have a few meals or repurpose some of the ingredients for lunch.

      – Cut up various vegetables and roast them. While roasting, cook chicken or other meat in a pan. For cooking the meat, I either cook it in olive oil with a spice blend, or I cook it in vegetable oil and make some kind of tastier chicken. I usually dip the chicken in egg, dip it in flour, and then dip it in a healthier pre-made of sauce (I am partial to all kinds of Asian sauces – so green chile paste, etc.).

      – Cook bacon in a skillet, cook veggies in the bacon grease, add some eggs.

      – Make pasta. While pasta is boiling, cook sausage in a pan. Cook a vegetable in the sausage grease. Then cook an egg until it is soft in the remaining grease. Add vegetable, sausage, and soft egg to pasta with some parmesan cheese. The egg and parmesan cheese combine to make a sauce.

    8. Serious Eats for pressure cooker recipes. And also for the great scientific explanation of why pressure cookers are much better than slow cookers :)

    9. I’ve posted about this cook book here once before, but I will again because I love it that much–it’s called Slow Cook Modern, and every recipe in it needs at least 8 hours in the crock pot, which is useful if you’re looking to turn it on in the morning and come home to dinner being ready.

  5. Elizabeth, I also love this top, and tho you are a few years younger then me, I also remember the clotheing from the Nanny. Fran Dresher looked so cute back then, though I could never wear her clotheing — her tuchus was so much smaller then mine, and she was NOT trying to cultivate cleints like me; tho Frank would claim I could get more new business if I dressed like her. I think Peg Bundy also was cute, but she was taller then I ever was, so her tuchus did not stand out as much as mine would if I wore super tight short pencil skirts or tights! Dad says that in some Eastern European venues, women with big tuchuses like mine are actively pursued b/c they are perceived to be able to carry their fetuses to term w/o complications. Tho I do NOT want to go to Eastern Europe, I can only hope that I will find a guy HERE who thinks this soon, so I can be married and have a baby b/f it is to late for me. FOOEY!

  6. I’ve applied for a credit card that I now realize I don’t want, can I cancel the application (haven’t been approved yet) without harming my credit?

    1. AFAIK what brings your rating down is not the process of applying, but the credit check they do on you in the process. I.e. When the credit bureau gets hit with a credit report check, they record it to your file and that brings the score down regardless of whether you cancel, get approved, or wtv. After you do get a card, there are other factors in play like your limit utilisation ratio, your payment behaviour, etc. which could over time affect your credit positively or negatively. If you cancel, the only impact is that credit report request. After a certain period they don’t count it any more (they count number of requests in a particular period).

      I would say if you have made no applications for credit in the past couple of years and are not planning to soon, the impact will be minimal. If they already hit the bureau with a credit report request, canceling won’t help but it won’t hurt either. (And they probably already did, as this is automatic I believe when you submit your application, depending onthe software they are using).

      Source: have worked with credit risk team at a bank and know something of their process, but am not an expert myself.

  7. I read a tip on a blog about how instead of getting everything done by Sunday so you can start your week off right, you should do it by Friday so you can enjoy your weekend and still start the week off right. This would include things like laundry and grocery shopping. I am kind of intrigued by the idea because I have been resent to you that my weeke I read a tip on a blog about how instead of getting everything done by Sunday so you can start your week off right, you should do it by Friday so you can enjoy your weekend and still start the week off right. This would include things like laundry and grocery shopping. I am kind of intrigued by the idea because I have been resenting that my chores seem to expand to fill the weekend, leaving little time for fun. If I could cram everything into work nights when I’ve already wasted a day at work anyway, I could at least use the weekend for whatever I want. I would really like to hit Sunday night feeling like I actually did an amazing trip or tried something new instead of congratulating myself for doing laundry.

    Has anyone had success with this approach? What do you do on the weekends that made you interested in it?

    1. I do laundry on Friday nights and submit the online grocery order. Saturday morning is fold laundry while kids eat breakfast/watch cartoons then farmer’s market. Then stop at lake to feed the ducks that shares a parking lot with the grocery store where I pick up the online order and anything extra I forgot to order on Friday. That leaves later part of Saturday afternoon for family stuff and Saturday night for date night and all day Sunday for church and family/outdoor time. I don’t meal prep though. Not sure how meal prepping on Friday would work.

    2. For me it depends on the chore / errand as well as how social you are during the week.

      I’m not a crazy cleaner by any stretch but I will do light chores during the week (laundry, vacuuming, etc). I live and work downtown so running errands after work is also easy enough. However, I either go to workout classes or I socialize most nights after work. If I had to choose, I’d rather socialize mid week and do chores on Sunday.

    4. Yes, with the caveat that I have flex hours so can work M-Th and take Fridays off. Most Fridays are devoted to all the outside the house stuff – grocery shopping, Target run, go to Home Depot for stuff etc. This way I can spend Saturday/Sunday doing whatever home improvement work that comes up instead of fighting the crowds. We also live in a beach town and traffic is much worse on weekends in the summer, so a quick trip anywhere takes more time.
      This way we get to spend time relaxing as a family on weekends. It’s nice to get the have-to-do stuff out of the way so we have time for the want-to-do.

    5. Yep, DH and I do this, but throughout the week. Sometimes there are lingering tasks on a Friday evening right after work, like the dreaded folding and stowing of clean laundry, but then we’re footloose and fancy free for the remainder of the weekend. I do all of the grocery shopping and 90% of the meal prepping M-Th (occasional lunch prep on a Sunday evening while making dinner), DH does the cleaning during the week. Laundry gets done through the week.

      Caveats to this: we are dinks, we have two small low maintenance dogs (ie no long hikes or grooming needed), we work close to home, and home is a small, uncluttered townhouse with an HOA that does our yardwork. So. ymmv.

    6. Definitely! Stealing 30-60 minutes from each weeknight frees up weekend time to go day-tripping, go for long bike rides, indulgent brunch, etc.

      -Laundry – start a load of wash immediately when you wake up, then before work, switch it to the dryer or hanging rack.
      -Errands – do 1 or 2 at lunch or on your way home. Stores that offer order-ahead pickup (Target, many grocery stores, etc) save a ton of time and impulse shopping.
      -Cleaning – keeping things tidy as you go means less “ahh my place is a disaster” later. Wipe down the bathroom counter while you’re brushing your teeth, give the kitchen counters a wipe every time you do dishes, etc.
      -Cooking – whenever you’re making a weeknight meal, make sure you make enough to get at least one night of leftovers out of it, ideally more

      The only chores we do on weekends are vacuuming, any deeper cleaning needs (defrosting the freezer, wiping baseboards, mopping), and occasional batch cooking, so we do sometimes spend a morning doing those items.

    7. A big key for me is to not sit down when I get home from work but immediately start doing a chore. So my typical workday is leave work, walk the dog, go to the gym, cook dinner, with a stop at the grocery store either on the way home from work or from the gym, depending on which store I want to go to. No kids, and our house gets cleaned once a month, and I still manage to relax for at least 2 hours a night if that’s what I want.
      Fun things I do on weekends instead of chores: lakehouse weekends in the summer, football tailgates & games in the fall. I didn’t live with my husband until we got married, and we used to live an hour apart, so I was motivated to do all of my chores during the week, because either I was at his place all weekend, or he was at mine and I didn’t want to spend our time together doing boring stuff.

      1. Just curious – what time do you leave work, how long is your commute and when do you go to bed?
        I feel like even pre-kids this would have been ambitious for me (I could have done it without gym, but gym eats up an hour on average so I feel like I’d be eating way late after getting home/walking dog, esp. with a trip to the store), but I wonder if I am not utilizing my time as well as I could.

        1. Commute is around 20 minutes to go from door to desk, so I wake up at 7, leave the house by 7:35, work from 8-4:30 (in finance), typically am out of the house for the gym by 6. My gym schedule varies, I’m in a slump of not wanting to lift weights so it takes an hour door to door (gym is 1.5 miles away), but I used to do a lifting program where it would take me up to 2 hours. I live in the Midwest so my commutes are pretty short.
          I meal prep frequently, so that helps immensely, so I can grocery shop one day and eat leftovers, then cook on a rest day. That way each day I at most will do 2 out of the 3 – grocery shop, gym, and cook. I try to go to bed by 11 pm. Writing out my grocery lists & recipes (when I’m at work), along with multiple grocery trips cuts down my shopping time and decreases my food waste. Hope this helps!

    8. I grocery shop and meal prep on Sunday. Doing it on Friday would mean the food is in the fridge for an extra two days before I eat it. Which means I’d have to freeze and thaw any meats or other freezable perishables that I’ll use from like Tuesday on. Salads, roasted veggies, other prepped veggies have an extra two days to wilt or oxidize or go bad, which means I have to do another round of prep on like Wednesday. It really defeats the whole purpose of meal prep on the weekends.

      Doing everything on Sunday also means I can double up chores and catching up with far flung family and friends. If I’m going to be home talking to my mom and siblings anyway, then I can throw in a load of laundry, tidy the house, and maybe chop some veggies at the same time. It’s no more time efficient to do laundry on Friday night when I’m going to be home bound for a couple of hours on Sunday anyway.

      1. I’m the OP and I actually really hate meal prep because it takes valuable time that I want to spend on my hobbies. So many people have recommended it to me, but my resentment flares so high when I’m stuck in the kitchen for hours on one of my only two days off work. I’ve been aiming for super quick meals that I can do in 30 mins or less on weeknights instead. It’s cool if it works for you though!

        1. Same. I actually enjoy meal prep during the winter months when I’m stuck in the house anyway. But in the summer, when I can be at the pool or lake on a Sunday afternoon? Nah, not happening. It means we do a LOT of quick dinners in the summer.

        2. Also don’t love the idea of meal prep but have always made 2-3 meals that have leftovers that are easy to reheat like a pasta casserole or to use in another recipe- like a roasted chicken or crock pot pot roast or pulled chicken for tacos. Same idea I guess

        3. I think meal prep is super easy if you are cool with eating the same things every day and do things like crockpot chicken, steamable veggies (dressed up with coconut oil and Everything But the Bagel seasoning from TJ’s), and microwavable rice from Trader Joe’s.

          All of the above keep well for at least a work week.

    9. I travel M-Th and the weeks I do laundry on Thurs night as soon as I get home, instead of Sunday, my weekend is so much better. Sometimes I’ll even pack for the following week that evening too. It goes a lot faster and makes my whole weekend more enjoyable to know that those two big tasks (both of which I hate) are done.

      1. This is a good tip. I travel a ton for work and always put off the laundry because I just don’t want to look at my suitcase when I get home. Laundry and repacking right away could help me dread the return trip the next week much less

    10. My favorite weeks are the ones where I do my laundry on Friday evening. That’s DH and my low energy night during the weekend– either delivery or takeout dinner, laundry and a movie or tv show. DH starts the laundry and will get up to flip the loads, and I stay up as late as I need to fold laundry and put it all away, since I can sleep a bit later on Saturdays. The remainder of my errands I don’t view as chores the same way as laundry, so I don’t mind sneaking them in during the week or weekend afternoons. Food shopping is the only thing I always save for Sunday early evening, since I feel like otherwise my lettuce gets soggy by Thursday’s lunch.

    11. I do a lot of stuff on Thursday actually with the same line of thinking … I spent all day at work, so just slog through the evening so that my weekends are spent doing fun things.

      Here is what works for me:

      I order pizza that night so I don’t have to cook. (Plus I’m tired by Thurs)

      Laundry – I organize the laundry on Wednesday night (sort and bring to laundry room), and throw in the first load before I leave for work on Thursday. As soon as I get home on Thursday evening, I throw the washed load into the dryer and start on the next load. I dry and fold late at night while watching television after the kids are in bed.

      Meal Planning – I do this at lunch on Thurs and place an Instacart order for a small delivery on Friday evening (to get through the weekend) and larger order on Sunday morning (for the next week).

      1. I do very similar things–Friday is takeout night, although lately “takeout”= cheerios for dinner, which lets me get a jump on cleaning the kitchen. And I have been writing the weekly menu and doing some of the shopping Thursday and Friday night because I can hit farmstands and farmers markets. I haven’t found any way around the need to cook on Sunday, because I just don’t like to prep lunches very far in advance.

        1. I’ve started just eating dinner leftovers for lunch the next day. It cuts down on meal prep. My kids get fed at daycare, so I imagine I’ll have to start making lunches when they go into school this year.

      2. Same on meal planning on Thursday and Sunday! I commented here a while back about “routinizing” tasks, and one thing that’s really stuck is doing a pre-weekend meal plan. I do an instacart order on Thursdays so we’re not scrambling over the weekend to eat out. Bigger shop on Sunday and then prepare some inputs to meals.

    12. I finally realized that getting a jump start on laundry on Friday nights helped a lot. I’ve been trying to order my groceries on Fridays but TBH, I’ve been less successful with that. I do most of my cleaning tasks during the week (and hire biweekly help for deep cleaning).

    13. I’m not consistent about it, but it really does make the weekend better if I do things like a mid-week load of laundry, mop on Thursday night, and vacuum on Fridays. There are still some chores to do on the weekend, but I feel like I have a good start on cleaning.

    14. I try to keep up with things during the week so the weekend isn’t one big slog. My husband cooks, and 2-3 nights per week, while he cooks, I go through the mail, unload and load the dishwasher, and maybe turn over some laundry. After dinner, I do the dinner dishes and start the dishwasher while he gets Kiddo in pajamas and brushing teeth. We run the robot vacuum almost every day, so we also have to get things off the floor.

      Then, most weekends, there’s a balance of work and play. Fridays at lunch, my husband and I meet to go over logistics and plans for the weekend and to make a meal plan and grocery list for the next week (but we also keep a running list as we run out of stuff). Then during the weekend, we do a large grocery run and a project or two around the house or in the yard. The rest of the weekend is filled with seeing family or friends or taking the kid to birthday parties or on some family outing.

    15. My SO doesn’t work Fridays, so he takes care of the bulk of the chores and loves grocery shopping.

      Before he was in this role, we blocked a bit of time off every day (about 20ish or so minutes) to do “chores.” For actual house cleaning, we’d do it on Sunday nights for a certain time block. We listened to music or podcasts.

      Other things that help us: I am a natural purger–it’s super cathartic for me to donate or throw something out, but still did KonMari to our house, which helped a ton with husbands stuff. Having less stuff = cleaner/nicer feeling home–things like having minimal stuff on the counters, everything having a place where you always put it back after using, etc.

      What made a huge difference for us enjoying the weekend and getting actual rest (see earlier conversation from this week), is having a day, Saturday for us, entirely blocked off for resting and doing lovely things. We unplug and disconnect. It’s partly inspired by our faith, but also a little by “secular Sabbath.” When I have a whole day off, I don’t mind working a little to get everything done on Sundays.

  8. Did not know JCrew made silk shirts! Yay! Still a little too pricey for me, but I’ll add it to my watch for final sales, coupons, etc.

    Can anyone give suggestions for sizing? Are the talls truly taller scale or just adding fabric on the hem?

    1. JCrew sizing is a frustrating mess. I can easily be one of three sizes. A top like this will probably fit as intended in my smallest size. In their silk button-down shirts I tend to be the middle size to accommodate my chest and shoulders, but sometimes the largest… cotton button-downs usually the largest.

      Tall items have longer sleeves as well as torso length.

      If you live-chat or call them, you can get exact measurements of each piece.

    3. J.Crew silk shirts are… fine. The silk is not as nice as some other brands. Frankly, I prefer the silk from Uniqlo if you aren’t going high end.

      1. Yeah, I don’t like their silk. It feels sticky to me and feels like it snags on my fingers if I just run my fingertips on it (I don’t have terribly coarse hands).

    4. I size up one for silk shirts, because I machine wash them (cold water, gentle cycle) and they shrink a little bit.

      The long sleeve tall shirts – yes to both longer torsos and longer sleeves. I get them for the longer sleeves, personally.

        1. Why would you make the garment wider as you are making it longer? That defeats the entire purpose of tall sizes–same width, longer proportions.

          1. JCrew doesn’t adjust all of the proportions in their tall clothing that some other brands do. When you’re 6’+ you’re typically going to need a slight different shoulder cut, lower waistline, lower knees, etc. Same applies to petite – petite sizes will have narrower shoulders, different tapers, etc. Waist/bust/hip sizes are still standard and aren’t adjusted. It probably wouldn’t matter much in a shirt like the one posted, but if you’re buying a coat or button front shirt it matters a lot. I have to size up for those in JCrew talls because the arm placement isn’t adjusted, but I wouldn’t in other brands because they change the arm positioning instead of just the sleeve length. It’s why some people like me would be a small in a shirt like the one posted but a large in a different style.

  9. Commiseration? I have planned to get a lot of projects done this week, but ended up needing to be out M-W for a serious medical issue (no electronic devices in my hospital room). I’m cleared to work a half day today and a half day tomorrow, then rest all weekend and half to three-quarter days next week. I’m overwhelmed thinking of how to delegate everything/wrap things up. Work is somewhat understanding, but the two partners I work with most are saying things like “Take all the time/rest you need” and “I need Project XYZ tomorrow.”

    1. Tell them no. “Boss, I am not going to be able to do xyz until date due to my medical condition.” And then don’t do it.

    2. Take the understanding partner at her word and just tackle the most pressing items for the demanding one. If that’s still too much, tell the demanding partner now, don’t wait, and see if he can reprioritize for you.

      1. I think it’s two partners who are saying both “take all the time you need” and ‘get me this project ASAP.” Not one understanding partner and one demanding partner. Sadly, partners talking out of both sides of their mouths is pretty common in Big Law.

    3. Perhaps this is a chance to “sponsor” colleagues who deserve a chance to show off their skills? If project XYZ does indeed need to be done by tomorrow, and it’s not just a case of the partner making up unnecessary deadlines, instead of just saying “no, sorry, sick” you could tell the partner that you “really liked Sarah’s work on project ABC, and you’ll see if she’s able to contribute to XYZ”. Best case, the project gets done on time, you get credit for managing the situation well, and Sarah gets some exposure for which she will be grateful to you in the long run.

    4. This happened to me in biglaw. Tell them immediately you cannot so that they can re-assign and then tell them when you are back and able again. Unfortunately, I got the same “double speak” anyway when I was in the emergency room and the next day home from the hospital began looking for a job.

    5. Your health is more important than your job. If you don’t take care of your health, you will not be able to work and you’ll lose/have to leave your job anyway. P.S., even BigLaw firms have to follow labor law about accommodating medical needs/disabilities and they have to follow their own written policies about medical leave.
      I know this sounds easier than it is, but I think some degree of polite bluntness is called for here. “I know you need X by Y date. As you know, I was in the hospital earlier this week and I have written orders from my doctor (get these if you don’t have them) about how much I am able to work over the next few days. Given my medical restrictions, I won’t be able to complete what you’re asking for. However, I am happy to help you transition the work to someone else so they can complete it during my medical absence.”
      Don’t apologize and don’t equivocate. I am sure you did not ask for this to happen to you and if you could have avoided this situation, you would have. Don’t frame it apologetically like “I really don’t feel like I need to be on half days, so sorry this is happening, etc.” Frame it as, my doctor has given these instructions and made it clear this is what is necessary for my health. And do what you need to do to take care of yourself.
      I don’t know if you are younger/earlier in your career, but take it from an Old: when you don’t take time to heal when it’s needed , you go into serious debt borrowing time and energy from the future, when your smaller health problems will start to creep up on you and then need serious intervention. If your work is not understanding about this issue you need to find a new employer.

    6. It sounds like you are in law and at a big firm and my recommendation is not to do any half days – use your half day tomorrow to delegate things to others and then take next week off to recover from your illness. I’m not sure what your practice area is, but I find that most are not conducive to working part time/a few days. From a reputation perspective, if you work half days, when people look back on it and just remember “how unavailable you were” (which is ridiculous – you are sick!). But if you take the week off and get coverage, people will look back on it as just the time you were sick.

      I would go to the partner I am closest with “I am dealing with a serious medical condition. I am cleared to work [X] hours per day, which I plan to use to keep up with emails. Given my current [workload][case load] I will need someone to cover [X, Y, and Z] matters this weekend and next week. Can we figure out a plan for next week?”

    7. I find the more explicit you are with them about your inability to work, the more receptive people are. Tell them “MY HOSPITAL ROOM DOES NOT ALLOW ELECTRONICS SO I CANNOT WORK AND MY DOCTOR THINKS I MIGHT RELAPSE UNLESS I FULLY REST AND DON’T WORK UNTIL X DATE WHEN I AM CLEARED” . The physical inability to work is what really does it for most unreasonable partners and they realize how serious your illness is when you mention a hospital stay and respect it.

      1. One of the higher-ups at my (nonprofit, legal aid) office once showed up TO AN ATTORNEY’S HOSPITAL ROOM to yell at her for not doing something that ten other people could have handled. The woman had just been diagnosed with cancer and she quit on the spot, in her hospital room.

    8. I will happily commiserate. I’m in small law instead of big law though. My boss is so nice and understanding about me being out of the office but does not offer any other staff to pick up my case load during that time. I’m in a weird situation where I may be adopting a child soon with little notice and will be out a couple of months on parental leave related to that process. When that almost happened sooner than anticipated, I was completely panicked because I had important client deadlines and no one to hand them off to.

      It’s easy to say that’s a firm problem or a boss problem but at the end of the day it is my law license, my clients and my reputation that suffer if I just let the balls all drop. We now sat down and made a transition plan for during that time, including possibly farming out some parts to a friend at a different firm because there is literally no one here with the time to pick up my slack.

      Our big plan though is to just continue out deadlines when I need to go on leave. I’m in a state where opposing counsels and judges are good with this. The few cases where a continuance would hurt my clients are the ones where we would engage outside help.

      It sounds like you are in a different situation though and your work should be able to be reassigned. I’d suggest saying that while you may be able to work some remotely, you don’t know yet how much that will be so you can’t be staffed on anything with a deadline in the next few weeks but you are happy to work on more long term projects as you are able.

  10. I have a gift card for $200 to MM LaFleur. I’m a rectangle shape with large bust but no waist to speak of, long-torso and above-average height. I’d like to try to stay close to $200 – any recommendations of items that you’d recommend from them in this price range?

    1. How fun! I would try their pants or skirts. Their tops tend to run really small in the shoulders and chest.

    2. Same shape here except smaller bust. The only MMLF dress I haven’t had to have tailored is the Annie because the fit-and-flare silhouette works even when the waist hits too high. With tailoring, I love the Lydia, the Rachel, and the Shirley. The Etsuko doesn’t work on me, but with a larger bust you might have better luck.

      You can filter for tall-friendly sizes.

    4. If you’re willing to kick in more money, the Hailey dress would be great for your shape and height.

  11. For those of you that moved from law practice to government relations, what spurred the move for you and how do you like it? I’m an attorney in a boutique firm that has some government relations work (and I had a pre-law school government relations-adjacent career). I know and understand the work – and enjoy it. I might have an opportunity to move into a full-time GR role in my niche industry. I know the issues, policy, laws, and players very well already, so would just be shifting the type of work I do for this industry.

    For those of you that made similar switches, what inspired you to do so? How do you like it? Anything unexpected?

    I think I’m struggling with the idea of “giving up” a traditional legal practice, but this position could be very cool.

    1. I have a JD, but I’ve never practiced. My only legal practice experience has been internships during law school and the pro bono work I do now. I’ve always had an interest in gov’t (high school, college major, college internships), but I fell into it after law school when there was an open position. I thought I’d do estates work in law school, but found a position with the state legislature. I eventually transitioned to GR. I’m in DC now and do GR for a boutique firm. Sure, the associates get paid more than I do, but I work 9-5 and am never stressed about anything.

      The actual advocacy work is interesting. Most of our clients have their own GR teams, so they bring us in on technical matters where the regular corporate GR teams would be out of their depth. I work closely with the key committee staffers in our jurisdiction. That said, Congress moves s l o w l y. People in this field have been trying to get certain provisions into law for over a decade – I’ve been working on certain provisions for three years. With Congress as dysfunctional as it is, we try to work things through the agencies and WH for our clients, as well…though that sometimes doesn’t work either with the state of things. I haven’t had a legislative win worth talking about in a couple years – lots of trying to get little riders on big bills because Congress just isn’t legislating. But it’s still fun and I really like it.

    2. Like the poster above, I didn’t really work in a law firm beyond doing clinics in law school and internships during the summer and the year after. At my company, I am in regulatory compliance, but I do a fair amount of GR (my company is in the news DAILY, and it’s usually not flattering). I absolutely love it. I love working with our government counterparts and actually know them better at this point than a of my co-workers. There are times when things are high stress and we are under the microscope, but generally, everyone has a good working relationship. I also struggle with the fact that I’ve never really done “real law” but do feel like I could potentially get back to it if I wanted to (but it would take a lot of planning and starting at the bottom). Also, while I make a very good salary (higher than most regular people and higher than my gov attorney friends), it’s not big law money, and never will be unless I become a VP in my group (and this is at a very big company). I feel like the standard day to day is mostly less stressful than being an attorney (my husband was in big law for many years) and has been really accommodating for having a family. Sometimes it can be a bit boring and routine, but I’d personally rather have that than 80 hr weeks. I do like the travel that I do and having an associated expense account… but ymmv with that one.

    3. OP here – thanks both.

      For the first poster, I’m in DC too. This would be a more state-focused job (typical for our industry), but some supporting of federal efforts too. I know the state players well, so that’s definitely my comfort zone anyway.

      Second poster, I do a lot of regulatory compliance work now in my practice, so I’m familiar with that side of things as well, and I think that’s part of why I’m an attractive candidate. Also, while I’m in practice now, I’m not getting paid big law money (but putting in close to big law hours), so I’m sort of hoping to have more normal working hours even if it is a slight pay cut. Money is always nice, but I’m hitting that point where I’d rather have my time.

      1. Im poster 2- don’t know if you’ll read this but I’m in dc too – I do state mostly (for a different state) and some, but much less, fed. I’m in gas if that is your field and you want to talk :).

    4. If you are looking for normal working hours then Government relations is not it. There are a lot of post dinner drinks, evening receptions, and weekend fundraisers to attend.

      1. I feel like this mostly applies if you are a contract lobbyist working for clients. I’m in house for a company and there are occasional night events and fundraisers but mostly I hire contract lobbyist for their political connections so I don’t have keep it up. I have 6 states so there is no way I can have those personal relationships everywhere.

    5. I went from state lawyer in a regulated industry to law from and now in house. I do strictly government relations work now. I also worried about giving up being a lawyer but it has been great. Most people in my line of work are lawyers and honestly it is nice to push some things off to “Legal” for not as much fun work. Things get crazy half is the year but otherwise I have great work like balance even though I travel a fair amount.

  12. Does anyone use an automatic wet food feeder for their pets? Does it work well and does the food stay fresh enough?

    I’m thinking of getting one for my cat for when we are away during weekends. The one I’m looking at has an ice pack that goes in the bottom, but I’m kind of wary of how “fresh” it can actually keep things? I only really need it to give her food for about over a 24 hour period. I get a cat sitter if we leave her for longer (and she can also eat dry food, but vet says wet food is preferable).

    1. I just leave dry food. Sure he prefers wet food but it’s totally safe and fine to skip a day of wet food from time to time. I mean, your cat might try to eat your soul, but it’s fine.

      2. I have that feeder. But I’ve only used dry food in it for my cats who regularly eat wet food. I’ve also put in a piece of frozen (previously cooked) chicken. By the time it thaws, the cats have a nice dinner. (They get chicken once or twice a month when I’m home.)

    2. I sometimes leave my cat for ~2 days without a cat sitter. I leave the first full day’s worth of food out, and then leave a second day’s worth of wet food completely frozen out at the same time. The second day’s wet food defrosts over the first day and then is ready to eat the second day. This works really well for me. Cats also have a very hearty digestive system in general, so I would be fine with using the automatic wet food feeder with just an ice pack that you mentioned over a ~2 day period as well.

    3. Isn’t this food already room temperature the way it’s held? If so, I’m positive an ice pack that can survive for 24-48 hrs is perfectly fine, especially if it’s in an otherwise clean closed container (assuming it is so your cat can’t get to it).

    4. I have tried it, and it is great for attracting ants. I now only give wet food when I can immediately clean up after they’re finished eating.

  13. Another cat food question – my cat freaking loves her new urinary diet dry food that the vet recommended, but now she won’t eat her wet food (which she previously ate consistently). Does anyone have an irresistible wet food to recommend? Also, is this worth asking the vet about?

    1. They have wet food that is for u/t & it’s pretty yummy based on cats I’ve had… But, you could also try mixing the special dry food she loves with the wet. I did this with my cats when they didn’t eat dry and it worked well.

      1. Mine scoops up the wet dry blend with his paw, so he can eat around the hated dry food. It’s so messy but an impressive effort.

        1. My dog also prefers wet to dry and he will remove single pieces of food at a time, lick off the wet food, and place the dry food to the side. Sometimes he eats it as dessert.

    2. My cats went on the U/T diet when we found that the male had crystals. We started both the U/T dry and the U/T wet (I think there’s a chicken flavor and a salmon flavor). Our cats wolf down all three. The U/T wet is definitely more expensive than the Friskies we had been giving them, but it’s probably healthier and it helps address the urinary issues further. I do think you’re smart to find a way to get them to eat the wet because our vet says the male needs the water from the food to help with his urination, too. Another thing? we give the dry plus split part of a wet can in the morning and they only get wet in the evening. You might try that.

      1. +1 my cats are obsessed with the u/t wet food, which is good because ours only comes in one flavor…

    3. Hands down, my fussy cat’s very favourite wet food is Delectables Squeeze Ups by Hartz. She loves tuna, so we always get her the tuna one. Sometimes we give it to her from the tube and sometimes we squeeze it onto a plate. It has ruined our kitty for all other wet food.
      I realize it’s probably not the best food for her. Our cat eats dry food most of the time and only has wet food on weekends as a treat, so we give her the one she likes…

      She also likes the tuna “Bisque” from the same brand. She definitely favours broths or sauces… for normal wet food, she’ll just lick off the sauce and leave the meat behind.

    4. Does the dry food have a wet food counterpart? Maybe ask the vet for an Rx for a wet food too. My cat has a special urinary diet (Hill’s, I think) and they have wet and dry versions. Also, and you might already be doing this, make sure kitty is drinking a lot of water especially if she’s no longer eating wet food. I got my cat a pet water fountain and he seems to drink a lot more water now.

  14. Piggybacking on the pet questions – our cats p e e d on the floor under our TP holder while we were on vacation and we didn’t find it until we got back (the catsitter didn’t look there I think). The TP holder had a felt bottom and now there is a dark brown stain on the wood floor where it soaked in. Any magical tips for getting it out? Or am I going to have to sand it off and restain the wood?

    1. First, use an enzymatic cleaner to get rid of any smells that might have soaked in the wood. Sand it, use an enzymatic cleaner again, let that dry, and re-stain.
      And next time, close the doors to any room you don’t want the cat in. We basically section off our entire home except for the main living room when we leave.

    2. We had this happen. We used Nature’s Miracle and while it cleaned it, there was still a stain from the pee. Still is. I think you’re going to have to sand and re-stain. Ours is smack in the middle of the living room (where a cat bed was) so we haven’t bitten the bullet to re-stain the entire room yet.

      1. Thanks, I figured that would be it. At least it’s a small room (bathroom)! I already used the nature’s miracle with a magic eraser and it didn’t do anything for the color.

  15. Can anyone who went from government to private practice as a more senior litigator tell me about their experiences? I’m in one of the few areas where this is possible (AUSA) and currently have several firms interested in me. It seems like a good time to go (I have a decade of experience as an AUSA) and firms in my city appear particularly eager about women and POC candidates right now (I’m a WOC). I’m about 15 years out of law school and in a medium-sized city. My main concern is the shift in workload, but none of these firms are biglaw (more like mid-law) so I don’t expect biglaw-type hours (of course, I know I will likely be working much more than I did in government, but I don’t have 9-5 hours now anyway, and I’m at a point in my career where I’d like to make more money). thanks for any info/insights!

    1. We had a couple of senior AUSAs join my biglaw firm. In my experience, the thing they found most difficult was the business development aspect of private practice. I would ask a lot of questions about how the firms picture you fitting within the existing practice, what resources and help they provide for business development, and what the expectation is for building a book of business.

      1. book of business is a good one – not something i’ll naturally be good at, so I’ll need to think about that. Thank you!

    2. Do you know anyone who works at the firms you’re considering? Or who used to work at those firms? Ime midlaw is a curious animal. Some firms will work you just as hard as biglaw but will pay a lot less. Others are much more reasonable. Additionally, if the firms are competitors, they should all pay about the same. I’d be wary of outliers.

      1. I don’t, but a few alums from my law school are partners there, so I am thinking about reaching out to them. I don’t know much about midlaw, so you’re right, I need to investigate further.

    3. No personal experience with this but when I was in Big Law, I had several colleagues who made the jump from AUSA to the firm. Couple of things to think about:

      1. Push for being made partner but know that it is not a guarantee. At my firm, even the senior AUSAs came in as counsel, and were then elevated (or not) to partner a few years after. And if you’re a partner, you’re not only a lawyer but a manager of other lawyers. I personally would not enjoy that at all, but others would.

      2. Understand that you are going to have way less autonomy than what you have now and way less court appearances, if any. Might be different in mid law but my friend who was an AUSA said that the biggest con to a firm was the hierarchy and that he missed being the first chair in court.

      Have you been at a firm before? Now that I’m a govt attorney, I can never imagine going back to a firm because the work is so much more interesting and challenging in govt. But I definitely understand the draw to make more money — there is no comparison to private practice.

      1. this is helpful, thanks. I was at a firm for a few years right out of law school, so only as a very junior associate (obviously very different from where I am now in my career). I will definitely miss the autonomy – i hate being micromanaged and my current job basically has none of that (my supervisor is great and leaves me to do my thing). But the money is just horrendous, I have $$$ loans to pay off and childcare is not cheap. Did the colleagues who did that at your old firm seem happy overall?

        1. The one I knew was not happy, and has since moved to another (smaller) firm. I think part of the issue is that my old firm didn’t make him partner, notwithstanding he had more trial experience than most of them. I would imagine that at a smaller firm, he is getting more court experience. He’s also a partner at the new firm.

        2. How horrendous is the money? I’m at a smaller firm now and am thinking of applying to be a AUSA.

        3. I’d ask what types of clients they service, what the day to day case load/work load is like, and how many matters you could expect to be staffed on at a time. Do they have fewer, high paying clients? If so, you’ll probably have to deal with more hierarchy and micromanagement stuff. If they have lots of smaller or mid-sized clients, you’ll probably have more freedom. There are exceptions, of course, but it’s been a pretty good rule of thumb ime.

          It might be helpful to ask what kind of experience the senior associates are getting. You’ll be quite a bit ahead of them but it doesn’t hurt to ask.

  17. Does anyone have a nontoxic cleaning wipe they really like? I would like to start wiping down my desk at the end of the day but don’t necessarily need a disinfecting wipe … seems kinda overkill. I just want something that gets rid of the grime that inevitably builds up (and would get me in the habit of picking up my desk every night).

    1. A vinegar and water solution should do it. I’ve seen sprays in the grocery store, so I bet there are wipes, too. I just hate wipes b/c they seem to cost so much more.

    2. What about a microfiber cloth and some kind of Mrs. Meyers-like cleaning spray? Less wasteful, too.

      1. Spraying a cleaning solution might bother her coworkers, depending on the desk setup (if she has her own office, fine, but in a cubicle or open office it might be an issue). Unless she sprays it directly into the cloth, which might be okay.

    3. Do you actually need something damp or just a dry dusting cloth? Water on a washcloth is about as non-toxic as you can get.

      1. I use waterwipes on my babies… it would probably work for what you are looking for. For around the house I always use just water on a rag. I’m a clean freak, and the only time I do more than this is if someone is actually sick in our house (then I bleach everything down).

  19. How do you know (or how did you know) that you were ready to leave law? I’m 14 years out of school. I’ve done biglaw for 8-9 years (liked it a lot) and government for 4.5 years (like it fine but much less than biglaw). A lot of the time now I feel like if I never did document review or wrote a brief or took a deposition, I’d be just fine. I feel ready to move on. Yet in the back of my head — I know how our industry is, if you leave, that’s it you are not coming back; mostly because you interview with old man partners at firms or in gov’t who will look at you and say — you left law to start a business or take a business job, ok you’re a flake, rejected; that’s at least what 90%+ of the people I’ve worked with who have positions of power in law firms or government are like (they don’t say it — they just skip those resumes, roll their eyes, or if they do call the person in for an interview — they don’t take anything the person says seriously). So the finality of it is weighing on me.

    If you left law — how did you know it was time? Regrets? If you want to say how you made a move/what you moved to, that’d be great.

    1. I’m also 14 years out, and I feel you on thinking, “man, if I never have to answer discovery again, it would be awesome,” but what’s missing from your question is what you are thinking of doing next. And frankly it is that piece that is also missing for me and why I keep going. I mean, yeah, I would love to chuck it all and become a personal trainer or something, but that would mean a drastic change for my family and my marriage. And ultimately, I don’t think I would be happy in that long term, it just sounds good on nights when I’m wiped out.

      1. +1

        Also, although I believe it is more difficult to get back into law after you’ve left, and you may not be able to get back in at the level you were before you left, I’ve seen it done.

    2. Do you really not want to be a lawyer anymore? It sounds like you just don’t like working for the government and want to go back to a firm, not leave legal practice.

      To answer your direct question, I left law after 7 years of practice to do marketing/communications in a niche field related to my undergraduate major. I went to law school to practice in a particular field (also related to my undergrad degree). I did that for 6 years, mostly in Big Law, and enjoyed the work, although I was definitely burned out hours-wise by the end. I ended up having to move to a much smaller city for my husband’s career, and my niche legal field does’t exist here. To have any hope of doing the kind of work I want to do, I’d have to commute to the larger city 80 miles away, and that just didn’t seem compatible with the life I wanted (including a family, but honestly even without kids I don’t think I want to spend that much of my life commuting). I did briefly join the largest law firm in my small city (it has ~25 attorneys, to give you a sense of what a “large law firm” is in these parts) and really hated it: the work, the culture, the people, everything. It was clear to me after living in my current city for a while that, in addition to the fact that my legal specialty just doesn’t exist here, the bar is almost entirely old white men who are not very welcoming to people who don’t look like them (I am none of the above). We couldn’t move (without my husband totally abandoning his career, which he loves) so I began exploring options outside of law and stumbled into this field.

      I don’t really have regrets. I like my new field. It was a big paycut but we can afford it (LCOL area, husband makes a good salary) and comes with much better benefits (generous retirement match, way more PTO). Work-life balance is obviously way better (hours are officially 9-5 and I don’t even have to be in the office that much as long as I get my work done). I don’t regret my legal career either – it was a fun way to spend my 20s and early 30s and I made and saved a bunch of money. I think my decision to leave law baffles people, and I get that, but when I explain that I went to law school to do one thing and, to be a lawyer here, I would have to do something totally different, then they get it a bit more. And yes, the finality is scary. My license is still active but I think it would be next to impossible for me to go back at this point.

      1. Side note: it’s odd, and kind of sad, how hard it is to be a two-career couple in a smaller city. In many ways, it should be easier – shorter commutes, lower COL, shorter hours. But it’s tough to find jobs for both people.

        1. It’s unfortunately not even that easy in big cities. My husband and I have circled through NYC, Boston, DC & LA/SF… and if one of us gets a great job opportunity, the other has to step back (and we’ve been extremely lucky that our jobs have allowed us to telecommute when we’ve moved- but that definitely makes it difficult to get promoted).

      2. This is not aimed at the poster directly, because everyone is entitled to their own choices, but the prevalence of this narrative makes me so sad and angry – woman has a niche career that she loved, moved to a smaller place for her husband’s job (which he loves), cannot move without husband abandoning career that he loves…and so woman changes careers. Why in 2019 do so many of us continue to be the ones to sacrifice our career ambitions in favour of a man’s career choice????

        1. Because 9 times out of 10 the woman’s career has already been derailed by pregnancy, maternity leave, nursing, sick kids, dealing with school and day camp, etc. She is exhausted and demoralized and doesn’t feel like she’s accomplished everything she could have/should have. So she makes the decision to prioritize her husband’s career, because at least he’s gotten farther than she has. It’s not fair, but that’s the way it will be until men can start gestating babies.

          3. I have been thinking about this a lot because we just had kid #2 and are trying decide our next moves in life. So many things are stacked against women in general, so why put money and effort behind a horse with a handicap, vs one that is expected to win…? I think at a certain point we start to place those bets for our husbands, even at our own expense. It’s not fair and I’m really angry about it at this current moment in my life (even with a great husband who totally understands the issue and supports me and my job 100%).

          4. It isn’t even just the babies though. Even women who don’t have kids get demoralized–we constantly get passed over, learn to question ourselves at every turn, accept less pay. After 15 years of doors closing and opportunities and compensation being given to to others, it just seems to make sense to let the husband’s career be prioritized. I mean, that is what happens anyway. I can’t fight it.

        2. Even with this disclaimer, it’s hard not to take this comment as an attack on my choices. My husband has a career – not military but similar – where he has no control over where he goes and he can’t move without leaving his career completely. I wasn’t forced to leave law, I chose to, because I couldn’t have my dream legal career in this city. That’s very different than being forced out of the profession. And I never loved being a lawyer. I liked it. It was a job I mostly enjoyed that paid well. My husband LOVES his career. Like, never wants to retire, will work until the day he drops dead, loves it. Regardless of gender, it isn’t logical for a spouse who loves their chosen career to abandon it completely (not just take a less desirable or lower paying job, but completely walk away from their career and advanced degree) so the other spouse can pursue a career they like ok and aren’t sure they will stay in for life.
          You have no idea about the specifics of our situation and its hurtful that you chose to attack me as anti-feminist.

          1. I am truly sorry you have decided to take it as a personal attack on your choice despite my specific note that it was not – your post was simply one in a long list. This happens all the time, I read about it here and in real life all the time and I am deeply frustrated by it.

            As for the other post, I also do not accept that it will continue this way until men have children. It will continue this way until women refuse to accept it any more. I have a kid, so it is not like I have no sense of what it entails. Pregnancy does not, in and of itself, derail a career. What does is tacitly accepting that we are the #1 sick call, school call etc. and not demanding that our partners step up.

            Although my husband is listed as the first point of contact for our school, they always, always call me. I read that RBG had this problem and told the school that the child had another parent, so I did just that. They still call me first because women’s own internalized misogyny is just as pervasive.

          2. It’s not internalized misogyny, it’s biology. My husband didn’t have to grow the baby in his body, throw up multiple times a day, give birth, take several months off to recover, then continue pumping and nursing in the middle of the night for a full year. I don’t know how “demanding that our partners step up” could possibly fix that.

          3. I mean, your post was literally saying “No offense…[something offensive]” and “sorry you decided to take it that way” is a total non-apology. You made the inference – without knowing any details about my situation – that I was part of a pattern of women sacrificing career ambitions because they believe men’s careers are paramount. Dual career marriages almost always involve sacrifices on the part of someone unless you’re both in fields where you can find a job anywhere (teacher, nurse, etc) or you can afford to and choose to live in a major city like NYC that has every kind of career imaginable. If you have two successful careers and a great marriage and nobody has ever made any sacrifices, congrats, but you are truly a unicorn, whether you know it or not.
            Fwiw, among the straight couples I know don’t see a dominant pattern of the woman sacrificing for the man at all. In many cases, the couple takes turns moving/sacrificing for each other (which might be an option for us if law didn’t have so much of a “once you’re out, you’re out” attitude, btw). And I know several couples (including many of my husband’s female colleagues) where the husband made career sacrifices for the wife because it was the wife’s career that was the inflexible one.
            On the pregnancy point, you live in Canada, so I think it’s kind of naive to profess to know how pregnancy/motherhood impact a woman’s career in the US. It’s not as simple as demanding our partners step up – working mothers in the US face very real workplace discrimination.

          4. Okay, but sometimes people make choices that actually aren’t feminist (looking at you everybody who changed their names) and you know what? It’s real life, nobody is perfect 100% of the time. You don’t need to take it personally when somebody, particularly a stranger on the internet, points out that something isn’t ideal.

          5. It’s not an attack on you and it is not offensive to recognize that your narrative, as you have described it yourself in your post, follows a pattern and to express frustration with that pattern. None of the additions details you provided changes that. And we don’t have to know every detail about you and your husband to have that frustration.

        3. I moved for my husband’s job for exactly one reason: he was 100% ready to abandon his tenure-track position to move almost a thousand miles away for me. (We met and dated long distance.) Had he not been ready to do so and eagerly looking to move for me, even at great sacrifice to himself, I never would have even thought about leaving my city.

          1. Disclaimer: you have no idea how many people assume I moved because I lack a Y chromosome, or my career is less important than his is, or I had nothing really going on in my home city.

          2. Anon at 2:23, I an an attorney for a fortune 500 company, who moved for my husband’s job, and kept my job and telecommute and travel constantly for this very high stakes job… and people often behave as if I’m a SAHM and my job isn’t worthwhile. It drives me freaking bananas. My friend’s husband who we all went to law school with constantly gas lights my very in depth- 8+ year knowledge- in my field because he has 1 case tangentially related and it takes everything in me to not rip his head off every time he opens his mouth.

          3. I’m the Anon at 2:20 and 2:23… and I hear you. I out-earn my husband by a lot, even after taking a pay cut, and people act like it’s a cute little hobby.

            They also act like moving and uprooting my life was no big deal, and I’m honestly ready to tell them if that’s the case, then maybe my husband and I can just move back to my hometown.

        4. Maybe I’m not 100% overachieving to be here but if either my husband or I had to leave our high stress careers for us to live in the same place, I would much rather be the person taking on the new easier career. I like my job enough but if one of us HAD to do something different, sign me up. I’m not going to voluntarily leave my legal field to make less money where we are right now but 10 years down the line the plan is to move to where everyone in his field goes to retire (teach at an academy) and I plan to pack up and move with him. I probably won’t practice law in that new state and I’ll probably find something else to do like opening a mediation firm. I’m really looking forward to being able to scale back. I may have initially seen it as a sacrifice but now I see it as a goal I can’t wait to hit.

          Also, the reason my husband wouldn’t just quit is after those last few years at the academy, he gets a pension which is a huge part of our retirement plan.

        5. My SO left his dream job to move to our city for my dream job at a midlaw firm. It was hard, brought a lot of tension, and left him out of the market for a few years. He took a corporate job that was very good, but definitely not at all what he wanted to do.

          It’s been a few years and we now finally both have jobs we love!! However, I’m not sure this is different in the sense that one of us really had to sacrifice, circling back to the point that it is hard to do two careers at the same speed. That made me sad for my husband, so I am STOKED he is finally in a dream job.

      3. NTMS- You keep saying “refuse to accept it” as if that’s enough. It’s not just our partner’s behavior that might need to change. Sure I can demand that he do day care pick up, but I can’t necessarily demand changes in the behavior or choices of many other influential people. There are infinite opportunities for sexism to derail or slow a career– it’s not usually one thing, it’s cumulative. How are we supposed to refuse to accept the reality of sexism? I’m supposed to stomp my foot and tell my employer that I “refuse to accept” his biases that lead to him giving a male associate a high profile matter because I have a 1 year old? How do I “refuse to accept” the fact that husband had career advancement beyond what I had because of mat leave? I get what you’re saying, on a global scale, but on an individual scale, it’s just not realistic to say “oh, this narrative is going to play out until women refuse to accept it, you could have/should have changed the way it worked out for you particularly by refusing to accept it.” Your implication that women are tacitly accepting sexism is insulting.

        1. Yep. The comment above about the handicapped horse resonated for me. We are all handicapped horses–the deck is stacked against us, whether we have kids or not. It is so much easier to let the husband’s career be the dominant one. The track is wide open for him.

          1. I agree, but the weird thing is that it doesn’t always help our husbands to have this situation.

            My husband loves his job – prestigious, hard to get, low pay, amazing hours. He could leave for another role that would pay better, but there would be limited (read: no) advancement in pay and it would entail moves around the country every few years. The best thing that can happen for our household’s financial health is for my career to take off. But I swear, it never occurs to these sexist POSs that they might be harming *an actual man* when they pull crap on me.

    3. Is it that you are sick of litigation or that you are sick of law? The things you complained about are things I no longer have to deal with (or at least very rarely deal with) doing government enforcement work. There are a ton of different types of legal jobs out there, and I would consider if you want to be in a more legal advisor role before you just leave the profession. This would leave the door open to returning to litigation down the road if desired.

      I would feel differently about this if you had expressed interest in doing something else, but it just sounds like you are sick of litigation.

    4. I left a traditional government attorney position for an in-house compliance position, JD preferred. I’m not in the legal department, but my company values my law degree and pays for my license each year as well as CLE. I LOVE IT! I’m making way more money that I ever did as an attorney for the govt. In fact, my bonus for last year was more than my starting salary as a govt attorney (we had a very good year!) I still feel like I’m doing legal work, but when it’s time for the tough call to be made, someone in the Legal Dept. makes the call. The in-house attorneys have told me repeatedly how much they appreciate me and they know that when I send them something, rarely do they disagree or change something. I really feel like I have the best of both worlds.

      1. +1, wrote about this above, but I’m also in compliance. I LOVE it. I make more than a lot of my attorney friends, except for those in big-law. Negatives is that it can be a little more slow paced, but that’s perfect for me at this moment in my life.

  20. Fun travel question — my husband and I are traveling to Ireland in a few months. We’re in our late 20s. We like eating and drinking and being outside. Any tips for must-see cities, restaurants, hotels, attractions, etc?? Thanks!!

    1. Can you be a bit more specific – like how long you are staying and if you will have a car? Ireland is small but not that small…

      1. Sure! We’re planning to be there for 1 week. We are down to rent a car if that’s the best way to get to the places we want to go, but we don’t really have an itinerary yet.

      2. If you want to see a bit of a mix of city and country, I would absolutely get a car. Depending on flights, in a week you could do a couple of days in Dublin, a couple of days up the North then down through Sligo to Galway and back to Dublin. Or across then down the west coast is also a great option. It really depends on what you are into.

        My own personal things I have loved in Ireland centre quite heavily on political/historical – the Book of Kells at Trinity in Dublin, the tour of Kilmainham Gaol, Milltown Cemetary in Belfast, and the Dublin Garden of Remembrance. For outdoor sights, the Giant’s Causeway in the North and the rope bridge nearby are stunning and the Aran Islands (just off Galway) are also wondrously beautiful.

        1. Galway is sort of set up as a tourist area so if you’re downtown you’ll figure it out. I do recommend buying an Aran sweater or blanket there if you can swing it.

    3. We did the Cliffs of Moher and the Killarney Day Tour. Both are very touristy, but the scenery is amazing. We were able to stop and have a falconry lesson at the home of a couple who do animal rescues. Google Animal Magic, its outside of Limerick. Limerick doesn’t have much of a reason to stop for sight seeing, but the Buttery has amazing breakfasts.

      You could fly into/out of Dublin or Shannon, so you don’t need to cross the country twice

  21. I few weeks (or maybe a month?) ago I asked for sheet suggestions – thank you so much to whoever suggested Brooklinen! Love the sheets and they’re holding up so well (luxe sateen). This hive is amazing!

  22. My partner has some anxiety issues that have gone untreated forever. Sometimes they rear up and cause major conflict between us (e.g., we have some minor work done in our house and he wants to vacate for a week, which not only is $$$ but will also result in someone (me, b/c I feel like he refuses to be a competent grownup when it cuts into leisure time) having to pack for the kids and they figure out how to do wash in a laundromat somewhere (in addition to dealing with summer camps and the job I have managed not to loose).

    “There could be chemicals” sounds like he is really getting close to tinfoil hat society. There are chemicals everywhere. Every day. Living by “what ifs” and “you don’t know that it IS safe” is no way to live. Me getting frustrated with how he is managing his mental health and ballparking risks by saying “that is the anxiety talking and it being unreasonable” did not go over so well.

    When it spills over into our lives, I do care and want to battle it back. I also don’t want our kids to get any sort of a complex re germs / chemicals / or anything else that he has a complex about. [FWIW, he is also the sort of guy who doesn’t ever just have a headache, it must be an inoperable and fatal brain tumor.] He seemed normal enough earlier in our relationship, but it seems like any small amount of change will throw him into a panic. I can’t make him seek treatment, so how do I manage this sort of steering from the rear?

    1. Therapy for yourself. Tell him that because he will not go to therapy to address his issues, you are starting therapy to seek advice on how to communicate with him regarding his anxiety issues.

    2. Refuse to go. “No, me and the kids are not moving. If you want to leave, leave. I know you don’t like it when I bring up your anxiety, but this isn’t how I am going to life my life or raise our kids, so if you won’t treat it, we need to go to marriage counseling.”

      1. dude – let him take the kids! if he’s going to be weird about the chemtrails in your house, let him handle life in the hotel for that week.

        1. Sure, let him take the kids, but also let him coordinate and handle everything involved with that.

    3. Not sure if it will help you with the current problem but there is a short article on NPRs website about dealing with a partner that has anxiety. They specifically say that you shouldn’t change too much to accommodate your partners anxiety (i.e. moving out of the house). I recommend reading it just so that you don’t feel guilty or be made out to be the bad guy for not giving into your husbands anxiety .

      1. I am not OP. I just went and read that article, and its suggestions can only be helpful if your partner has the self-awareness to have at least an intellectual understanding that his anxiety is out of proportion. Mine refuses to acknowledge that his anxiety is abnormal and instead insists that I go along with all of his ridiculous demands (never deviate from a plan because a plan is a firm commitment, pay for everything in advance even when paying a portion afterwards would give us more leverage with the contractor/orthodontist/etc., make costly and unnecessary home repairs, etc.). When I push back, he accuses ME of having anxiety.

        1. Don’t do it. Or just get a divorce. Honestly. How much of your life are you going to give up to him.

        2. This sounds a bit like a lot of things (maybe it is) — the rigidity of ASD1 or somewhere else on the autism spectrum, some OCD, etc.

          Mine wanted to go skydiving right before I had major surgery. Um, NO. I need you here to take me to/fro and help listen to the doctor when I am loopy. You need to not be even possibly compromised right before then. BUT he will worry about germs and chemicals and cancer. Only used one kind of soap (but is shampoo flexible yay!). Then smoke. I give up.

    4. This sounds a bit like a lot of things (maybe it is) — the rigidity of ASD1 or somewhere else on the autism spectrum, some OCD, etc.

      Mine wanted to go skydiving right before I had major surgery. Um, NO. I need you here to take me to/fro and help listen to the doctor when I am loopy. You need to not be even possibly compromised right before then. BUT he will worry about germs and chemicals and cancer. Only used one kind of soap (but is shampoo flexible yay!). Then smoke. I give up.

  23. DC-area ideas sought: My 28-year-old son is pursuing a master’s degree in the area. He has a few friends in DC but I can tell he’s lonely. Ideas for ways to meet like-minded people (not necessarily to date)? He’s interested in public policy and politically liberal, so joining one of the Dem presidential campaigns seems like one idea, but I wondered what the wisdom of the hive might be here. Thank you!

    1. Gently…if he is 28 does he really want or need you to manage this for him?

      1. I appreciate the “gently”. What other responses don’t consider (and to be fair, I didn’t bring it up in my original post) is that my son has some real anxiety issues and yes, still needs parental support around feeling like he can move forward sometimes, with social and other issues. So I was just looking for ideas, not judgement.

        1. Time to let him figure it out for himself or else he never will. He’s almost 30!

          1. Is my memory failing me, or have the women here asked similar questions about making friends after college, in a new city, after being a mom, etc?

        2. It sounds like you are trying to have some educated options in your back pocket in case it comes up in conversation and are not smother-mothering him. I wish you and him both the best!

      2. I agree that it’s time for your son to manage these issues on his own. Anxiety is a real beast (I know from personal experience), but getting through it and improving it MUST be self-driven.

    2. My 13-year-old would be deeply offended if I suggested ways for her to make friends. I can’t even imagine how poorly this would go over with a 28-year-old.

    3. There’s tons of events and lectures he can attend around the city and its universities, thinktanks, the Hill, etc. He could try reaching out to his undergrad alumni group or being more involved in his Masters program. Depending on specific hobbies, there’s always Meetup.com. If he’s in a program and/or interns/works, he’s bound to eventually make more friends and I really wouldn’t be worried. DC is a very easy place to meet people. It’s a harder place to keep people though because it’s a transient city and eventually most of your friends from your 20s move.

      1. Profs and Pints! They have a Facebook group – people give lectures on various topics at a couple of bars in DC. I don’t know how great that would be to meet people, but it’s fun and a nice way to get out.

        Smithsonian has a young adult membership and lots of activities. I think the Corcoran might, too.

        Yeah, a 28-year-old doesn’t need his mom to help with his social life, but I am choosing to read this as, A friend moved to DC, I know DC people post here, any fun social activities I can pass on to him/her?

        1. There were a lot of groups that organized hikes like the Billy Goat Trail. And because you’re doing an activity, you don’t just sit there being socially awkward.

      2. Thank you. I really appreciate your kindness in replying. My son is resourceful and may be doing some of these things, but I just wanted some ideas to have in case the topic came up.

    4. I’m in DC and a lot of my more athletic friends were part of pick up sports leagues and running clubs and made tons of friends. If he is at all athletic (I’m not, so truly understand if he’s not ), that would be a good thing for him to meet people.

    5. I’m in the DC area. Most 20-somethings make new friends at work/school or sports leagues. DC Fray is really popular with young professionals, even people who are not particularly sport-driven seem to have a good time.
      Another thing that I’ve seen work wonders (especially for anxious folks) is a regular volunteer shift. This helps people feel like they are actively taking part in the community, not just living in it.

    6. Hi –
      Just a few ideas, I live outside DC in Arlington:
      DC Fray (I see people your son’s age out in their bright T shirts and they always seem happy)
      Washington Area Bicyclist Association
      The local Unitarian Universalist Church — they tend to have after-service coffee hours where the newcomers are invited to take a certain-colored mug to indicate they want someone to talk to them, or
      The events at 6th and I (synagogue)
      The embassies will have language lessons and events
      The Mom’s Organic Market chain lists volunteer opportunities for the environmentally-conscious on its website
      Hang in there, mom. :)

  24. Do you have any suggestions for a good night time eye cream? I’m in my mid30s and have been getting away with samples (lancome, clarins) but it’s time to bite the bullet and buy some. I’ve been looking at clinique “all about eyes” but haven’t used clinique products before. Clarins is usually my go-to (although I did buy their night time eye cream once and didn’t like it at all).

    1. I like Bobby Brown’s eye cream because it’s very hydrating. All depends what you need your eye cream to do for you. I’ve switched around brands before and nothing is life changing; often corrector/concealer does a better job of cleaning up any darkness I have which is my only other concern.

    2. Go to Sephora and get them to make you some samples, try them all, and buy the one you like best. I like It Cosmetics Bye Bye Undereye. I did not think All About Eyes did much.

    3. I normally love Clinique but really do not care for any of their eye creams. They feel “spongy” and don’t seem to absorb.

  25. May have to post again later, but can someone gut check whether I am being overly paranoid:

    My husband bought us tickets to go to a comedy show in a city 2.5 hours away from ours. We are going with another couple – his friends, who I have never met. They are driving us as we don’t own a car. The show is part of a comedy festival and does not start until 10:30pm. The couple driving us insists they need to drive home afterwards right away – that is, embark on a 2.5 hour drive at 1am. The highway between the two cities in question is unlit and rural (risk of animals like deer). I do not know the friends and cannot be certain they are safe drivers/will be happy to not drink prior to the drive. I know that accident risk is much much higher at night (from fatigue, other impaired drivers, etc).

    I am thinking about putting my foot down that if husband and I cannot stay over in a hotel and catch a train back the next morning (sans couple who wants to drive home right away), I do not want to go. I know that he should respect my wishes, but am I being overly paranoid about this or does anyone else feel like enjoyment of the show will be hampered by the looming drive and that taking on overnight driving is not wise if it can be avoided?

    1. I think your safety concerns are valid, and this also sounds positively miserable. I would totally insist on staying overnight. If your husband doesn’t want to get a hotel, he can go without you.

    2. 100% agree with you. If the other couple wants to drive back, they can but you and your husband should not. I mean you know nothing of this couple’s drinking habits. Some people if they have to drive home will NOT drink even one drink the whole night; some people OTOH will say — oh I’m not driving for 2.5 hours, I can have a few now and just stop — and you won’t know this until it’s already happening at the show! Plus are they used to be awake and focused and driving from 1-3:30 AM normally? I know lots of people say — NBD — I stay up late all the time. Well staying up late in your own home watching TV or reading requires slightly less focus than driving 70 mph at a time when your body may be used to sleeping.

      Late late night driving like this scares me. Even if you/this couple are 100% perfect — no drinking, wide awake — you know there are others on the road who’ve made questionable decisions re alcohol and rest AND everyone speeds at that hour way more than normal because they expect no one else is on the road AND depending on what highway often there are many many big trucks as all the Targets and grocery stores of the world have deliveries coming in at night. That combination frightens me.

      Tell the other couple you’re not comfortable driving back with them or tell a white lie that you and husband are going to stay in a hotel and explore the next day and then come back. If it’s a major city, you surely can get an Uber/taxi from the comedy show to a hotel and then can rent a car to drive back to your home the next day.

    3. Setting aside the fact that going to a comedy show 2.5 hours away that starts well past my bedtime is my personal hell, I would definitely insist on staying overnight.

      1. Your bedtime is before 10:30? Are you 11? Or are you a surgeon who has to be in the operating room at 5 am?

        1. A lot of us adults have to be up before 5 a.m. My 12-year-old’s bedtime is later than mine.

        2. Umm…I’m in my early 30s and my bedtime is 9:30-10PM. So yeah…personal hell too.

        3. Yes, my bedtime is 9:00-9:30 and I have never been happier (or healthier). You might want to consider that people have health issues that affect their sleep needs before you go down that catty road.

        4. I’ve got many colleagues in law and finance who go to sleep at 10 and wake at 5, because of market opening in a different time zone or children. This doesn’t seem that odd to me?

        5. Ironically, you sound like you could use more sleep.
          Signed,
          33 yo with a 9:30-10pm bedtime most nights.

          1. ha! agreed. 40 year old with a 930 to 10 pm bedtime. This trip (to a comedy club 2.5 hrs away) sounds miserable.

        6. 29, spouse and I wind down for bed by 9:30 every weeknight and are lights out by 10:05. Up at 6 or slightly earlier most days. I’m so over people who don’t sleep and think it’s cool, I’ve never felt more clarity and less anxiety than when I have great sleep hygiene.

        8. Uh, yeah, morning people are a real thing. I start work at 6am. If I’m awake after 9:30pm, something weird is going on.

        10. Um, or we like sleep? And want to be in bed early? Or go to an early workout class?

          You sound like you may need a little more sleep.

          1. I’m lovin’ all of these happy, sufficiently rested people who go to bed early like me! I’m in bed by 9:30 except on the rarest of occasions. Nothing good ever happens past 10pm.

    4. Even if it was the safest drive in the world, doing a 2.5 hr drive at 1am sounds super not fun. What’s the downside to staying overnight in a hotel and checking out a new brunch place before grabbing a train back the next day? Turns a comedy show into a fun mini-getaway.

    5. Regardless of paranoia, I think going to an evening event 2.5 hours away definitely warrants staying overnight. Why don’t you make a mini-vacation out of it? If not, I wouldn’t go because tbh a comedy show that far away with people I’ve never met does not in any way sound fun.

    6. Are you confusing the drive time and the show time? I highly doubt a comedy show would last 2.5 hours – 1-1.5 hours would be more common, so you might be embarking on the drive home before midnight. I agree it’s fine to insist on staying over either way though.

      1. No I am not confusing them. The show is part of a comedy festival of international renown and there are multiple headliners. The tickets specify the show will be 2.5 hours without intermission.

    7. Even if the drive home could be guaranteed to be 100% safe this plan sounds miserable. Can you rent your own car and stay over so that you’re not stuck with the other couple?

    8. Well you are quite judgmental of their choices (really, you think driving at night is *that* bad??) but you don’t need to do what they’re doing! If you want to spend the night there, spend the night there! There is nothing wrong with that, although I’d try to tone down the judgment when communicating this with the other couple. Although really it sounds like you just don’t want to go at all, and maybe that’s the conversation you should be having with your husband instead.

      1. This is not about my being judgmental of their choices – different people have different risk tolerances and that is perfectly normal. I also know how to tactfully communicate with other adults, so offending them is not my concern. I am just asking whether anyone else would share my safety concerns or whether this is “tinfoil hat” territory.

    9. My husband and I did something like this once, only we were the drivers. The show was 3.5 hours away and we were able to get out of there by 11:30. We were in our mid-twenties at the time, and not at a bedtime-before-11:00pm stage of our lives. It was the most hair-raising thing I’ve ever done and we swore we would never do it again. Even good, responsible drivers who have not been drinking could easily struggle with a middle-of-the-night drive. We were absolutely terrified most of the way home because we were SO TIRED. The last hour was absolutely brutal. Book yourselves a hotel room and get home the next day. You will be so much more relaxed!

    10. If it were me, I wouldn’t go unless we were staying the night. Sounds like this would probably mean renting a car too. Otherwise, unnecessarily risky.

    11. I think this is insane, and I literally made a bet with my husband that I could safely make a 950 mile drive, no overnights, after running a half marathon. (I won, easy.)

      Even someone as… energetic as I am says “no effing way.”

    12. It sounds unpleasant because of the long day, but not dangerous. People drive on highways at night all the time. :). A stretch of highway without street lights is no big deal. If you don’t want to drive back late i’d spin it as though you didn’t want the long day rather than that you’re scared of deer.

      1. Right. This sounds exhausting and unfun (I’m another person who is often in bed before 10 pm) and the alcohol factor would concern me too since you don’t know them at all. But saying “I’m scared about driving at 1 am because the highway isn’t well lit” makes you sound really paranoid.

    13. I agree with everyone else but wanted to add – I wouldn’t ride with them on the way there if you’re staying in a hotel, I see too many problems with that. They’re running late so you don’t get to check in/drop off your bags before the show, then you have to deal with it at 1 am. Or they’re annoyed because now they have to leave much earlier than expected. Or they have to now make two detours (picking you up and dropping you off). I would just meet them for a drink or something before the show.

      But yeah no my days of getting home at 3:30 am (at the earliest! what about time to use the restroom, reconvene, walk to the car, sit in traffic leaving the venue? so probably more like 4 am? later?) are long gone.

    14. I personally wouldn’t do this because I don’t think it would be a fun way to enjoy the evening and it’s also way past my bedtime. But there is definitely some paranoia to the night driving concern. Maybe it’s your own inexperience with driving that’s coming through, but night driving isn’t this hazardous even in a rural area.

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