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Wednesday’s Workwear Report: Tweed Blazer

Black double button two front pockets. blazer

Our daily workwear reports suggest one piece of work-appropriate attire in a range of prices.

Mango is absolutely crushing the blazer game this season, and this double-breasted tweed number is one of the best. I’m loving the slightly longer length, which looks very cool with the model’s slouchy jeans. As a non-model who works with a bunch of men who find most fashion deeply confusing, I’d probably opt for a slimmer cut pant, but you do you.

The blazer is $129 at Mango and comes in sizes XXS–4X. It also comes in fuchsia.

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Sales of note for 12.5

366 Comments

  1. Does anyone have a tasteful shawl / blanket / wrap suggestion that I can use in my office? Finance, business casual trending formal (a lot of MMLF and sheath dresses from me). I’m in Boston and dress for the weather decently well but we just moved to new office space and it’s downright frigid at all times. Willing to pay for something that is aesthetically pleasing (my office is in a main travel area with glass walls) and warm. TY!

    1. Can you get a space heater? I used a heater in my office in BOS all the time and found it better than a blanket.

      1. I do, despite them being technically outlawed, and it’s not packing the punch I need on this new office space. Maybe they dial back the AC setting sometime soon, but we were told to not expect the temp to rise substantially. Our building is in the process of being majorly renovated and it’s only like 20% occupied, so I’ve concluded they’re running HVAC at not normal levels until it’s more occupied.

      2. Not the OP but illegal for me and a fire hazard. I spent so much time thinking I had a fever because I was freezing. Nope: I sit under a blower that is 12 feel above my head, so out of tampering reach.

    2. Following! A jardigan never cut it in my office and I swear my hands get stiff from the cold. Currently using a thick fleece but want something that looks sharp vs comical.

      1. Fingerless gloves. Looks a little ridiculous but makes a huge difference, and they’re easy to pop on and off.

        1. No offense, but it is insane that you have to deal with this and makes me never want to work anywhere but home ever again.

    3. Two things:
      -J. Crew has some nice pashmina/wrap type things, including in cashmere.
      -I received a giant cardigan from my MIL for Christmas that was from Liz Claiborne (which I think is a JCP brand). It’s one of the ones that can be belted and buttoned so it looks polished (like a sweater blazer), but it’s also so enormous that you can huddle in it like a blanket. I’ll go see if I can find an example.

    4. White & Warren has a beautiful cashmere wrap. Might be included in the Shopbop sale – it often is.

      1. Other suggestion – I’m sure other stores offer similar items but Lilly Pulitzer has short (waist length) poncho-style cashmere toppers. They’re offered in neutral colors in addition to the bright pinks etc. you would expect.

      2. +1. I use a White + Warren cashmere wrap for this purpose. It is huge and can be used like a blanket. I also always bring it with me for airplane travel. They come in lots of pretty colors.

      3. +1 on the White & Warren travel wrap. It’s lightweight, but really warm, and it looks luxurious in person.

    5. A heating pad to sit on would help a lot. My only suggestion is to get something made out of synthetic fabrics; the soft cashmere or wool wraps may shed onto your clothes.

    6. I have a few of these from previous seasons (when, in full disclosure, they weren’t partially recycled) and I love them.

      https://www.nordstrom.com/s/nordstrom-recycled-cashmere-scarf/5872577?origin=keywordsearch-personalizedsort&breadcrumb=Home%2FAll%20Results&color=938

      I keep one in my travel bag at all time, because I freeze on planes. The only reason I’ve had multiples is that I left one on a plane and I tore a big hole in a second getting it caught on something on a plane. Usually they go on clearance at some point if you aren’t picky about the color.

      1. I would like this but with a faux fur lining on one side. I just get SO COLD at work because I am not moving around enough. Would wearing one of those pelt-like couch throws be too much?

    7. Pottery Barn blankets are super popular at my office. The knit ones are for fall and the ones with the fuzzy lining are for winter. Business formal but downright freezing office as old buildings take a while to heat up when fronts roll in.

    8. If you’re not vegan, a genuine sheepskin is really good at holding your body heat. You could sit on it or drape it over the back of your chair.

    9. I got one of those under desk cycles, and one benefit is that they keep me just warm enough. I also have a heated foot warmer. Otherwise, fingerless gloves to go with whatever you get.

    11. Get a cashmere wrap. It’s noticeably warmer than other fabrics.

      Budget option: Uniqlo

  2. I LOVE Mango. Will check out their blazers. I know it’s fast fashion, but I have 3 dresses from there I purchased in 2019 and they are absolute workhorses.

    1. Does Mango run small? Macy’s carries them but I can’t figure out the sizing (no stores close to try on in person).

      1. I don’t think they run that small, maybe a size or half size smaller than Loft, at least for tops and dresses (haven’t tried pants). They have free shipping and returns and I’ve had very good luck using their system, it works very smoothly.

      2. They’re not as generously cut through the torso. I used to wear a lot of Mango because their large sizes worked if you were tall and skinny. Maybe more like an H&M size vs a Loft.

    2. I also love Mango, though it’s very much like Zara for me in that some of their blouses are terrible (really depends on the fabric) but their blazers and coats are consistently good. Also like Zara, they cut small in the shoulders—great for me because I am narrow of shoulder, but worth noting in case that could be a fit issue.

  3. Has anyone tried the Skims brand? I am looking for a bandeau-style bra and they had one that looks like what I need and is a reasonable price. Some of their wireless tank bra looked good too. I WFH home these days and dress pretty casually so I just need some basic support.

    1. Yes, and the two pieces I have bought are excellent. Other friends have also had the same experience.

      A Kardashian nailed this one, it’s true.

      2. agree — the Skims and Good American stuff I’ve tried has all been quality. I didn’t like the bandeau bra but I’m DDD+ so it would’ve been a miracle if I did.

    2. Have not tried but that’s only because I refuse to give that trashy family any of my money. There must be another brand out there with similar products

      1. As someone with a big hip to waist ratio I love Good American jeans. I also got a Skims hoodie because the cropped style is the perfect length for my short torso. I don’t care for that family but I’m not going to turn my nose up at clothes that miraculously fit me! Those brands are also size and skin tone inclusive.

    3. I don’t have personal experience with Skims but I do with Yitty. I highly recommend Yitty. They have any similar items to Skims. The price point is better and the quality is great! Plus inclusive sizing, if that matters to you.

    4. This sounds like YE’s version of ripping of a Kardashian brand. I take it that Yitty is not related to Ye?

    5. I can’t comment on the shapewear but I bought my teen daughter the cushy robe from that line and it is sooo nice.

    1. Depends on the event, everything from sneakers to heels to tall boots. Only thing that looks weird to my eye is ankle booties. But I’ve seen others pull that off too.

    2. Now? Sandals or pointed toe flats. Humidity is down but it’s still 85 out.

      Later, would wear flat knee high boots.

  5. In case anyone is in need of a minor chuckle- I just checked the trade in value of my 2016 iPhone SE, which I use as a work phone, and I’m in line to earn a whole £17 from it!
    That made me laugh almost as much as realising that POTUS and FLOTUS using the Beast on Monday meant they had to sit much further back than they otherwise would

    1. Also on Monday: who knew that Romania has a Tsar?! I did not. Also, is it awkward when you invite the head of state and also the royal family of a country who is now in exile (but you are friends with them or related to them)? Who gets the better seat? Also, I understand that there were Questions re whether the CP of Denmark got a +1.

      1. It seemed like the various royal families whether European or Middle Eastern were seat opposite King Charles – like facing the British royal family and then the political leaders were on the same side as the British royal family but further back.

        Big goof up with the Foreign Office on the Danish invite. It was supposed to be a maximum of two royal family members per country but the Queen is widowed so they included the Crown Prince as her escort but they accidentally invite and had to uninvite the Crown Princess (his wife). I think they should have left it at 3 and found room. But I suppose then all the other royal families would be upset that they only had 2 spots. The protocol arrangements for all this must have been such a challenge.

        1. But 4 people from Spain came? I get that no one likes Juan Carlos, but no one turned him away.

          1. He came as friend (or relative?) of the Queen. He isn’t the Spanish he’s of state. I don’t think he even lives in Spain anymore.

            The current King and Queen of Spain were the Spanish state representatives. They and the Spanish govt actual asked JC not to come.

        2. Crown Princess Mary seems pretty laid-back, but also fun. She’s Australian! She met some guy in a bar that turned out to be an actual prince! She married him! Hopefully she wasn’t too disappointed and decided to do something fun, like gardening or riding a bicycle (I assume these are the chief recreational hobbies permitted in Denmark based on watching Borgen).

      2. They didn’t. Romania had kings. Bulgaria had a Tsar (Saxe-Coburg family, like Queen Elizabeth). The last king of Romania was a childhood friend (and first cousin once removed) of Prince Philip, and he attended their wedding in 1947. His daughter Margareta is the current claimant to the non-existant throne.

    2. Did using the Beast affect the seating? I thought they just respected the Queen’s request that the resident Heads of State for all the Commonwealth countries (whether Presidents or Governors General) be seated the closest because she was the head of the Commonwealth?

      1. There was a traffic snafu and the President’s route was blocked off – that’s why they were late.

      1. That’s US English! Refers to the heavily up-armored car that drives the US President around.

          1. No, he was supposed to be in the bus with the other world leaders. But the US government insisted that he have his own vehicle (the Beast)

          2. All the other presidents, kings, various world leaders took the high security buses provided by the British govt. Biden was the only leader given an exemption.

  6. So I kind of need to work this out in my own head, but I wonder if anyone else is in the same position and has worked out their thoughts and emotions better than I have.

    My father is a “Palm Beach Republican.” Grandchild of Jewish immigrants, grew up poor/working class, successful via charm and grit versus education. In general touch with reality – wouldn’t dispute Biden winning the election, Covid is real / vaccinates and masks, etc. Does not hold “cultural MAGA” values — last touched a gun when he served in Vietnam, fine with gay marriage, might internally not “get” a trans person but would never be anything other than polite, pro-choice but not terribly worked up about restrictions because he could afford to fly loved ones (insert eyeroll from his daughters and granddaughters). Has sophisticated, urbane tastes and would *never* aspire to or relate to or present himself like the people we see at MAGA rallies or on Jan 6. However, I walked in on him watching Fox News, expressed my shock, and only then I found out he voted for DJT both times, which appalled and upset me. Now, this isn’t a topic of conversation he would ever bring up, and I know his own point of view is “we all have different views, I can go to dinner with someone who votes differently from me, let’s all talk about golf or movies or the grandkids.” And yeah, I guess there is some truth to that – but I’m afraid he’d vote for DJT or DeSantis in 2024, and this isn’t like the past where a vote for Dem vs Rep was about disagreement on policies – this, to me, gets to bigger questions of good versus evil and democracy versus fascism and caring about things other than what affects my own pocketbook (which is his main driver). He knows I “disapprove” of him watching Fox, but he doesn’t engage – he would just make sure to change the channel to golf if I walked in the room and not say anything. He is non-confrontative by nature, and a pleasant person – he doesn’t “take bait.” I know there is really nothing I can do, but it’s just personally upsetting – I love the man, and in some respects it’s harder because I *can’t* write him off as a QAnon nutcase. But I’m seriously concerned about the Fox News watching as I think it is slowly warping his view of the world. I just think I need help coping with these emotions, and I *want* to engage him, but I just don’t think it’s going to change anything.

    1. It seems like it hasn’t gotten to his internal compass though. FWIW, I listed to a lot of things I’m not 100% (or even 50% on board with) and it’s listening not being programmed. I do know some people who are prime cult bait though— so desperate for validation that they accept the orthodoxy with no questions or deviation allowed. That doesn’t sound like what you described.

      1. I listen to and read a lot of things I don’t agree with at all, but I find FOX News specifically is really, really grating to listen to while resisting the programming.

    2. Your father is fine. He sounds like a decent man in all respects (from your description).

      Counseling for you. Politics has obviously deranged your psyche in a very unhealthy way.

      1. Agreed. Such a weird post. What is the end goal? Do you want to cut off contact with your father (who sounds like a very decent person) because he watches a channel you don’t like?

        1. Why would she not? I don’t let anyone who voted for DJT near my kids. They know he is an anti- democratic misogynist.

          It’s only a political disagreement or difference if both sides fundamentally believe that the US should be a democracy. DJT clearly and expressly does not. He tried to overturn a valid election.

      2. I almost feel envious of your innocence, but watching FOX news can definitely slowly warp people’s views of the world.

        It’s great this hasn’t happened yet, but after seeing it happen to so many previously reasonable older people, I understand feeling concerned about the possibility.

        1. I understand being concerned about it. My parents are sort of “Palm Beach Republicans” and complain that many of their friends spent the entire pandemic watching Fox News and have turned into MAGA extremists. (My parents have actually become more liberal.) But what is OP actually going to do about it? She can’t control what her father watches, or what his political viewpoints are. He clearly doesn’t want to engage, so what’s to be gained by forcing him to?

          2. And also my aunt, uncle, cousin and her husband, who were previously all about Bernie and Jill Stein lol

            But I still agree with the other posters that he sounds like it hasn’t seeped into personality issues. He sounds like a classic republican and a genteel man, so hopefully that stays the case.

      3. Agree that your father sounds like a very decent man. I’m sad for you that you are willing to judge him so harshly for what you’ve described as very reasonable views. Please don’t damage your relationship with your dad over your unwarranted feelings of superiority.

        2. It is not “reasonable” to be the grandchild of immigrants who came over here with nothing but the clothes on their backs, and then not care about current immigrants who are no different except that they speak Spanish rather than Italian or Yiddish.

      5. Are you … like, not aware that Fox News is based on a bunch of downright lies? This isn’t a discussion of watching ABC vs NBC or something. Haven’t you heard of enough people out there who went down the Fox to Breitbart to InfoWars to QAnon rabbit hole to be concerned? Fox is the gateway drug. It’s an alternate reality, which is to say it’s not reality at all.

    3. Seems you’ve met my dad and a lot of other republicans. I figure we all get equal votes so mine cancels his out. Would I like it otherwise? Sure, but it’s not worth losing relationships over.

    4. Can you challenge him to watch other international news sources – like BBC World News? Fox News is generally regarded as not a fact based news sources in other countries.

      If you think it would help, I can find the link to the video from before the last election where a Holocaust survivor from Austria talks about how the rhetoric in the US is increasingly like what she recalls as a girl in the pre- WW2 period. Dehumanizing language able anyone who isn’t straight/white etc.

      On the ‘flying his daughters/granddaughters’ to safety – that option has passed or is starting to close in many circumstances. There will be consequences if they return to the state, and they may not be able to leave state to seek alternative care. Further, in many cases, there simply isn’t time. You need to be treated immediately at the nearest hospital if you have an incomplete miscarriage and sepsis. There are plenty of stories of the horrible experiences women have had and where leaving the state was not an option.

      1. My spouse is an ob-gyn. I’m fully aware of the consequences of abortion laws. That part bothers me specifically because yeah, all of us in our family have the financial ability to fly our daughters to wherever but that’s not the freakin’ point, it’s not about *us* specifically, and that’s what grates. It’s the selfishness of not concerning oneself with the issue because one can buy one’s way out of it.

        1. I think you’re not going to win on getting him to care about non family members – maybe focus on him caring about how DJT and his ilk will hurt your family

      1. Except that DJT was a much better friend to Israel than most recent presidents. I hate to give him the high ground here.

        At any rate, I hope DJT stays away from 2024. And that Newsome shuts up about him (Newsome) running if Biden doesn’t.

        3. Are you seriously trying to say that DJT doesn’t have many supporters who are anti-Semitic? Not just January 6th but many of his rallies have tons of people with anti-Semitic or neo nazi symbolism.

          The support of Israel plays well with extreme right Christians who want the Middle East in Christian hands and view Israel as an acceptable vassal state.

          1. And that’s part of my point – if you are watching Fox News, you really don’t see a lot of the Nazi symbolism associated with watching coverage of January 6. The portrayal comes across as “oh, some people were really overinvested in DJT and got themselves worked up and went too far, but those are the outliers and there are bad actors on both sides.” It’s not an accurate portrayal of what happened, and DJT’s role in stirring it up is downplayed. Similarly, the Mar-a-Lago raid is portrayed as a dispute over the equivalent of overdue library books as opposed to a serious breach of handling of classified material. Why should this complete fanciful portrayal of things, passed off as “news,” not concern me?

          2. Yeah, do people not know that the reason the far right supports Israel is because they believe Christ is going to return and Jews are all going to convert to Christianity? It’s…. not because they’re supportive of the Jewish people having a place to practice their own religion.
            https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christian_Zionism

          3. I thought it was that the evangelicals support Israel because they think the unrest in the Middle East is going to bring about the end of days and the rapture?

        5. You can’t be a friend to Israel when your supporters are antisemites. One Jan. 6 rioter just got convicted. He was wearing an Auschwitz t-shirt.

          1. They do love Trump in Israel. We had (liberal) Jewish friends who lived there for a while post-2016 and it was really horrifying to hear how much support he has over there. So I think describing him as a friend of Israel is kind of fair. But most Jewish Americans hate him and definitely he doesn’t care that many of his supporters are anti-Semites.

          2. Sadly, anti-Semites are a bipartisan group. It’s not a correct argument to say that if someone vile agrees with me then I must be wrong.

          3. Come on. Of course he can’t control who votes for him but he dog whistles to them constantly and makes it very clear he’s happy to have their support. When you say there were “very fine people on both sides” at a Nazi march you can’t act shocked that people call you anti-Semitic. I’m sure there are some rabid anti-Semites out there who love Biden and Romney and Obama and Bush but nobody talked about it because they weren’t out there egging them on the way Trump was.

    6. My parents are this way (except Chicago and not Jewish). I’m not sure they voted for Trump both times, but hated Hillary and feared Biden would be “a socialist.” I think because they came of age in the Rockefeller Republican era, they don’t quite get how crazy the GOP has become. My sister and I have tried to tell them about Q Anon, etc., and they haven’t really heard of it, or if they do, it’s just politics background noise that “both sides” do. I don’t think they watch Fox News all the time, but I’m sure they do sometimes. Rush Limbaugh dying was a great thing, because I’m pretty sure my dad listened to that.

      My mom seems to be turning away from the GOP because she hates how they are pushing religion so much. I don’t know that she’ll vote for a Dem, but apparently has considered it, according to my sister who is local. My mom basically hates talking about politics, so we just don’t really engage. With my dad, we sometimes talk about specific problems and solutions without talking about political party, and sometimes I gently insert that, well, that is a problem that Obama tried to solve by doing X.

      I think I gave them a copy of the book The Fifth Risk, which is a really good description of some government functions and while it does call out the boneheaded things the Trump admin did, also talks about missteps by Obama and Bush II. It’s an interesting read and I think might help people understand a little more about how the government really works, beyond political posturing, which I think is important.

      So this was kind of TLDR and will probably end up in mod for some reason I can’t fathom, but I just wanted to say you’re not alone. My sister and I struggle with this, because my parents are decent people but they sure have some blind spots. At least they live in a blue county in a blue state, so it doesn’t feel quite so fraught.

    7. He’s a competent adult man. He gets to watch the tv he wants. He treats you with respect idk why it’s hard to do the same.

    8. I’m surprised you’re just learning this. Regardless, yes, I spent time in 2016 being upset by my nearly exactly the same situation with my dad. But in the end, he’s just as entitled to his vote as I am to mine and I just let it go. I see it as the problem with a two party system, it forces picking an extreme side. Would I prefer he tilt left, sure, but it’s his prerogative to tilt right. There’s plenty of reasonable people in the middle despite what the media tell you.

      1. But there are something like 50-75% of the population in the middle with literally nowhere to go. At least in 2016, that explained so many third party votes on each side for me. Those choices weren’t even really there in 2020.

        I hold my nose pretty hard when I deal in National races. Local ones are one-party but there are choices to be made in primaries. We have a big 9/11 denier who polls very well (Southern city, D party is generally not full of crazies but they exist and are reliable voters for this woman).

        1. Exactly my point. The media paints everyone as either a MAGA racist or a woke AOC/Sanders leftist. Many are in the middle and have to choose. As the nose holding tilts in both directions.

          2. But Democratic candidates who win primaries are middle of the road. Voting in the general election for a moderate Dem isn’t holding your nose. Voting for that same person in the primary (so they get through to the general) isn’t holding your nose, either.

          3. No one is forcing you to vote for Sanders in the primary. He hasn’t won a primary and hasn’t been a general candidate.

          4. I think the problem here is that you see these as equal/opposite. A world where violence decides elections (the MAGA goal) is not the same as a world where everyone gets healthcare (the “woke” position).

        1. I get it. He’s decided the QAnon/MAGA crowd isn’t a dealbreaker for him. It’s upsetting.

          1. OTOH, if I switch from R to D, I am abandoning my party to the crazies. We need two functional-ish parties and I’m not going to let the crazies get mine if I can help it. If you are in the middle 50% of voters, I think you want me to stay where I am. My primary votes are probably more important now than before.

          2. 1205 I don’t think she would mind if her father kept his party affiliation, voted for a moderate in the primary and then voted for a non-maga candidate in the general. In other words: keep your affiliation just don’t vote for dangerous extremists.

          3. It’s great to talk about moderate Republicans, but that ship has sailed. There’s no such thing. The worst offenses of the woke/AOC crowd are that they get tiresome over pronouns and nomenclature and want everyone to have basic healthcare. The worst offenses of the QAnon/MAGA crowd are that they are fully willing to subvert democracy using violence if necessary, and are in thrall to a cult leader with a long history of business fraud and deceit. There’s no “both sides” here.

          4. That’s exactly what would upset me too.

            Not to mention what has happened to the Supreme Court.

        2. It’s not she’s upset with him for being a moderate Republican. Like the GOP has even dumped Liz Cheney. The GOP is verging on anti- democratic. They haven’t even supported a full investigation of January 6. They are not content for voters to decide elections. it’s not like a disagreement on fiscal policy, tax law or defence spending

          1. This. It’s not about taxes. It’s not even about abortions, which is much more heated but still a policy issue. The GOP is anti-Democratic conspiracy theorists, full stop.

    9. No answers but fwiw I think you nailed the perspective of a lot of country club republicans. My dad is of a similar background and only by the grace of the fact that he comes from a long line of the only Jewish family in town, and always felt like an ethnic “other” does he vote Democrat.
      Take this with a grain of salt, (I majored in American studies and actually think critical race theory and feminist theory are really helpful lenses for looking at things) but I think the “charm and grit” successful baby boomers understand instinctively that they might not have gotten as far if they’d have had to compete with people of color or women. I think that’s why they don’t mind and may even favor structural racism/sexism/inequality and not harbor hate for individual poc and women. The television he’s watching is very good at reinforcing this belief, but it didn’t plant it. I know a lot for these men and I fundamentally believe that their self
      image is wrapped up in a belief that they made it on their own merit in a world that was basically fair. I understand that it’s damaging to that image to admit they were lucky or benefited from an unfair system, this doesn’t change their beliefs but it leds me to pity rather than anger.

      1. Totally agree with this middle paragraph, and I know a lot of older white men who vote Democratic but I think still feel this way. Everything in terms of elite educational and professional attainment is much more competitive than it was when they were coming up, and the financial climate (wages, cost of education/health care/housing etc) is much more difficult. It’s not comfortable for them to admit that they didn’t necessarily earn their stature, or would not if they were competing for it again today.

        I think of this issue too when women who have had abortions talk about everything they’ve been able to achieve due to not being forced to give birth. When men don’t want to compete with women, this is a feature and not a bug of the loss of reproductive rights.

        1. IDK — giving birth is like the least part of parenting. Parenting a kid as the likely sole or primary parent has to be what is meant but why is that never said? Pregnancy and birth are the easiest parts of parenthood. The next 18+ years are why we aren’t running the world —it’s the daily hamster wheel that gets us.

          1. 1. I’ll take parenting a first grader over pregnancy and giving birth any day, so we’ll disagree there.

            2. For most women forced to give birth against their will, parenthood will ensue. (The right lives in world where all unwanted children will be immediately placed in a household of Christians and become faithful servants of their preferred god, but that’s not what happens generally.) And I imagine most unwanted pregnancies do not involve committed and capable fathers, but that’s just a hunch.

            3. To your point, I’ve always thought the emphasis on nursing babies in this country is at least on some level to establish a lopsided parenting from the get go.

          2. That’s true. Probably people don’t emphasize that because opponents will be like “well you should have just given the kid up for adoption if you didn’t want it.” But I have read that that’s the least popular option in an unwanted pregnancy. If women are forced to carry babies to term, they generally want to keep them, which yes, is the bigger burden in terms of responsibilities or goals in life.

    10. My parents are much less conservative than they used to be. Part of that is having gay/queer/tr@ns children and in-laws, but it’s also been a lot of conversations. My dad and I email each other news articles – would that be a way to engage him? I’ve pushed back on some things he’s sent and had good discussions that way.

    11. I mean I’m this way except I don’t watch Fox, nor do I watch much other news either though I do get it from WSJ. But on the views you mentioned, I agreed with every single one. I won’t change my mind at half his age so I’m not sure why you think a 70 or 80 year old will. Is your problem that he has different views than you and you’d never think that because look he’s a good guy not a MAGA guy giving the Nazi salute? I’ve been saying it for the last six years on this board and everyone shuts it down as – you don’t get it. But there’s a lot of us out there like him, including your friends and neighbors. We’d vote for DeSantis but aren’t MAGA at all. Largely it’s because we vote our financial interests and non stop fiscal stimulus into an inflationary economy and student loan repayment is not it. If he’s watching Fox at your house and you don’t like it, you can say that but you overall won’t change his views, he’ll just nod politely and vote how he wants.

      1. The only difference between DeSantis and Trump is that DeSantis makes the message a little more palatable. He, and his policies, are just as cruel, just as shortsighted and just as retrograde as Trump. Don’t fool yourself.
        Signed,
        A Floridian

      2. No, he wouldn’t watch Fox at my house because it wouldn’t be on. He watches it at his own house but would quickly change the channel if we enter the room, like he thinks he’s pulling one over on us. Regarding DeSantis – You don’t ever stop to think that maybe there are bigger things at play than your own pocketbook? You see the cruelty and the Trumpy publicity stunts and you think “yep, this is my man”? Wow.

      3. yes, there are a lot of people like you who care more about their financial interests than anything else. obviously you are entitled to your opinion, but in my mind that makes you incredibly selfish and probably not someone i share values with. i’d rather be less well off and live in a country without racist, sexist leadership

        2. I agree. If we had been friends (11:24) and I found out you felt this way, I’d be distancing from you right now. There’s more at stake than your personal financial interests.

      4. Voting for DeSantis is very MAGA and racist. He literally removes Democrats from office who were duly elected in local elections because he does not agree with them. Don’t kid yourself about him.

    12. I sort of think you either view other people’s children as you do your children or you don’t. I don’t really know what to do with the people who don’t view other people’s children as they do theirs anymore. It just feels like a brutal mindset to me at this point. So, sadly, I’d say do nothing.

      1. That’s very interesting and I’ve never heard it said that way. I kind of agree. I don’t view others’ kids as mine and simply am not as interested in them getting ahead as mine or at the expense of me and mine, and you’re right, nothing will change that.

        1. I mean Jesus said it as ‘love thy neighbor’ but I get that most people prefer to be Christian in name but not in action. Every go fund me for a child who need healthcare or every buzzfeed post that compares what we call a school lunch in the US to the rest of the world shows us how we really feel about other people’s children in this country.

          1. Hate to break it to you but lots of non-Christians also feel like Anon at 11:45. I’m non-Christian, relatively liberal (definite D) and still don’t view other people’s children the same as mine… I know that falls short of some pro-social ideal but it’s the truth

        2. And so you are probably not gutted by recent immigration policy or Flint’s water. My guess is, it’s not that you don’t think it’s important, it’s that you just don’t find it centrally important. I do find those things centrally important, though they don’t affect me, but I was also raised in the community mindset that you should care for other’s babies as your own.

        3. No the person you’re responding to, but I think the zero sum mindset is really important here too. I think when we all do better we all do better. You think others doing better hurts you and yours.

          I think this is also why we’re socially segregated to some extent. I don’t like being friends with people who think like this.

        5. 1145 here – FWIW yes I do believe it’s a zero sum game. In a world with limited resources, sorry I have to look out for my family first and other social issues like immigrants being flown to Mass and whether that’s cruel is just not my first or even hundredth priority.

          1. I also look out for my family first, which is why I eagerly learn as much as I can about what is best for them. It’s not might-makes-right fascism. A world that’s safer for vulnerable people is safer for anyone in my family who finds themselves vulnerable too.

          2. Except that the fact clearly show that when those limited resources are used for the betterment of the population as a whole, the standard of living for everyone is higher. The population is happier and more peaceful (lower crime). There are a million international surveys by non-governmental organizations that demonstrate this. USA doesn’t crack the top 10 and rarely the top 20.

            It’s always amusing to me that Americans seem to think they have a high standard of living.

          3. That 615k he spent on the flight could have gone to a lot more productive uses IN FLORIDA than the petty, vindictive little stunt that you’re apparently okay with. You’re not even voting for your financial interests if you’re okay with it.

      2. I’m always curious what people mean by viewing other people’s children as their own children. I want all kids to have good educations, safe housing, food to eat, etc., but my own relationship with my own kids is personal and specific. I’m not going to do their homework for them, but I still remind them to do their homework even though I know they go to school with kids who don’t get those reminders. While I want all public schools to overflow with funds and staff members (and try to vote that way), I send them to our highly-ranked, zoned public schools instead of having them attend a struggling school that’s about the same distance away. Even when I know my own kids’ limitations, I’m still going to assume (most of the time) that they have an explanation for their imperfect behavior.

        1. I think it’s a Kantian ethics thing (rooted in misogyny against mothers who were seen as showing an animal favoritism towards their own children). I think it would be ridiculous and inhumane if anyone truly treated their own child like any other child on earth (also people don’t all want the same things for themselves or their families). But I don’t subscribe to the zero sum view either.

          1. I’m sort of a “why not both?” type of person (as opposed to believing everything is zero sum). But sometimes the implementation of equity initiatives is badly planned and leads to everyone in the (wide) middle getting a crappier experience while nothing really changes for the people at the tippy-top.

            For instance, if there is a concern that the accelerated high school math classes are not representative of the school population (i.e., mostly rich white kids), the solution ought to be figuring out how to encourage nonwhite kids to take those classes, not switch all math classes to general math instruction and drop calculus. Also you could maybe talk to the parents of the high school kids who don’t take accelerated math, and ask them why their kid isn’t enrolled in those classes. The answer might be a racist teacher or a complex admissions process that favors white parents with paperwork skills, but the answer also might be that the kid only wants to apply to an open-enrollment junior college and doesn’t need an advanced math class.

    13. Rather than focus on Fox News, I would focus on expanding his sources of news so he is not only watching and listening to Fox News. Podcasts are great for this. I find “hey, dad, I listened to this driving to work and thought you might enjoy it” with a mix of news and other stuff overall works well. Plus, it gives you something to talk about. You can also gift him an Economist or NYT subscription for the holidays. As to Fox News specifically, there is a variety of content on it (not all of which is terrible), so it really depends on what he is watching. Just, like let’s be honest among friends, MSNBC is also not the greatest source of “news” (and I say that as someone who watched a ton of it starting say in about 2016).

      1. I agree with you on MSNBC. I think it’s the Fox-equivalent and I wouldn’t watch it either. My news sources are (in no particular order) ABC/CBS/NBC, CNN, NYTimes, WaPo and WSJ.

    14. For close family members with strongly held views I can’t change, we have an unstated understanding of don’t ask, don’t tell.

      I don’t have a lot of close family members and knowing too much about their views would seriously damage our relationship.

      I focus my political efforts on less emotionally fraught, higher return activities like writing letters through Vote Forward and donating to campaigns.

    15. I follow a podcast that could be of interest to you. Check out “Majority 54” with Jason Kander and Ravi Gupta. https://www.wondermedianetwork.com/originals/majority-54

      They often talk about how progressives can find arguments (and common ground) to persuade conservative friends and family members. To the extent you are interested in engaging your dad in conversation about his opinions, this could be helpful.

    16. So you want to censor your father’s television? He sounds like a normal person who shares different beliefs than you, and you need to accept that. The world isn’t your echo chamber and people are allowed to think differently than you.

    17. I’ll bite.

      I’m conservative. I used to work in some distinctly liberal environments as a teenager/twenty-something. I was once kicking back with other staff members and someone was having a political rant and calling conservatives all sorts of nasty names. I finally said something like “Jesus Christ” and walked out. Someone else (not the ranter) almost immediately followed me to say, “Hey, that wasn’t what they meant.”

      Except that it was. They just didn’t know the object of their rancor was in the room. And that’s rankled ever since. I’m sorry you had to confront the fact that you have thought/said disparaging things about and othered, it turns out, your own father. I know it’s uncomfortable. But, as is true in many other contexts, please don’t let this discomfort blind you from the work that it indicates should be done.

      1. If you are conservative, you are a nasty though.
        Anyone who would rather worry about their stock performance than care if Black people get gunned down by cops or women die because they can’t get a septic pregnancy removed is a literal psychopath; it’s a shame to realize how many of you are out there.

        2. Unfortunate of you to assume that someone posting on a blog dedicated to professional women has no concept of nuance; further unfortunate that you magicked up three frankly vile opinions and a diagnosis for me based on two words of my original post. Bye.

          1. oh, I’m sorry – yet another conservative victimized by their own views. So sad. Life must be so hard for you.

        1. Agree. My immediate reaction was “oh I love Vicky and that surprises me; I want to learn more.”

          3. I read it more as “thanks for showing us who you really are” and… I have to agree. I don’t like name calling and I agree Roxie’s comments can be off-putting but I’m not ashamed in the slightest to admit I automatically lose all my respect for anyone who voted for Trump and particularly anyone who continues to support him and people in his mold after January 6th. It’s a moral failing of the highest order to support people who tried to overthrow the results of a free election and stormed our capitol building.
            Simply holding conservative policy views is of course a different story, but since the whole thread was about Trump support I took her statement as support for that movement and I was disappointed to see it.

    18. Personally, I think open and respectful discussions are the way to go, especially if you have a good relationship. I would talk to him about why you feel so strongly about DJT and the likes and why you are concerned about misinformation on Fox. Of course he is entitled to his own opinions, but the open and respectful exchange of ideas is so important. I worry that we are all so scared of confrontation that politics are only discussed behind a keyboard or fed to us one-way from media sources.

      1. Don’t let the opportunity to have non-heated discussions about your Dad’s lifetime of experiences that shaped his political views and how your experiences have shaped yours. I vote wildly different than my parents, but we’ve had great front porch conversations over the past decade. They’ve shared more and more detail the older I get.

        More time connecting and leaning in with a low stakes environment has shown some interesting perspective. The goal isn’t to change minds, but to appreciate the spectrum of life experience.

    19. My father subscribed me to the wall street journal. Turnabout is fair play, so I signed him up for the new york times.

    20. I’m a GenXer, and the last time one of my parents voted for the same guy as me, the guy was Bill Clinton. I *know* my dad voted for DJT and I am in denial about my mom’s likely vote. They have loved Fox News since its inception, though they are good enough not to turn it on when I visit and have basically stopped talking about current events with me (probably since my dad tried to talk to me about AOC and I’m like, “I’m so glad you found your new Hillary! This must be really exciting for you!”). It used to upset me more, but time and talk therapy helped me have a better (if more distant) relationship with my parents. I do try and praise them enthusiastically for developing interests/hobbies that are not watching cable television news, and weirdly, having the WSJ delivered helps them re-focus on actual news stories/world events.

      1. The WSJ has opinion/editorial content that has drifted rightward the last few years, but it’s at least thoughtful and grounded in facts, even if people disagree in good faith over the interpretation of the facts.

        1. Yeah, I definitely think the editorials are super right-y (I tend to read them for fun when I go to their house), but the news stories aren’t all Pretty Missing White Woman, Homeless Guy Burns Down LA, or AOC’s Outfit Destroys Democracy. It does seem to help.

    21. Have you asked him what he likes about Fox News? That might be a place to start a conversation.

    22. I’m kind of surprised by these responses. Occasional Fox News watching isn’t that big a deal but I would not have been able to maintain a relationship with my father if he’d voted for Trump. He’s a Jewish never-Trump ex-Republican who very reluctantly voted for Hillary after much coercing on the part of me and my mom and happily voted for Biden and will now no longer even consider voting for any Republican for state or national office. Like you, I feel there’s a huge difference between voting for Romney because you want lower taxes and don’t care if he guts some social services, and voting for a man like DJT who is openly racist, has called Nazis “very fine people” and is attacking the foundations of our democracy by denying the results of a free election. People who support Trump just aren’t people I want to have in my life; our values are too different.

    23. I’ve had several thoughts but here is the final one. I think what’s most upsetting is that for a lot of us is that the values that our parents are demonstrating and supporting- here ending American democracy, let’s be honest- are not the values that we learned from them and that is really tough. So I emphasize with you Lauren B. I’m sure at one time your father was a person who would be disgusted at the idea of candidate using violence to overturn an election and the fact that you still are that kind of person is, to some extent, proof of that.

      1. This. At DH’s alma mater in Europe there was a recent academic panel on whether the US would continue to be classified as a democracy in 25 years and the majority of the speakers thought it would not be. Other countries have changed from democratically elected to non-democratically elected governments and the US is exhibiting many signs in that direction.

    24. I dont think the watching Fox is the problem here.
      I think voting DJT twice is the problem. I am in a similar boat and I would focus my energies on getting him to move away from DJT, rather than move away from the Republican Party. The second would be a much more difficult goal, plus there are parts of Repub ideology that I (as a Californian hippie) can kinda sorta see eye to eye with. So I would keep the focus on DJT’s fraud, undermining of democracy, harassment of women, etc

  7. Does anyone have a thick nighttime moisturize that they love for winter? I used First Aid Beauty Ultra Repair Cream last year but didn’t love it. I live in a very cold place and like something rich and thick in the winter. Thanks!

    2. I’m the same and have had trouble finding the right thing since we lost Kiehl’s Rosa Arctica. Try Farmacy Honey Halo!

      1. +1 to Vanicream in the tub. I used it on my face when I had a dry patch near my eye and it was very effective.

      2. This. Or Cerave cream.

        Both are affordable so I basically bathe myself in it every night.

        2. Vanicream lotion is saving my sensitive skin right now. I will switch to the cream when it gets colder.

          And what a deal compared to Drunk Elephant and the Tatcha I’d been using. The Vanicream is just as good if not better.

    4. When I lived in the frozen tundra, I loved Olay Active Hydrating Skin Cream (the pink stuff). A good thick layer never clogged my pores and felt rich but still light. I still love it for dry Texas weather.

    5. The Neutrogena Deep Moisture Night Cream. It used to be my occasional winter cream, but now it’s what I put on top of my RetinA every other night.

    7. I sometimes just use a thin layer of Aquaphor. There’s a word for it that’s escaping me. It feels very nice.

        1. Yes I do this too (am not a kid tho). I usually focus it on my driest areas, which tend to be the apples of my cheeks, the tip of my nose, and the outer corners of my eye area.

    8. For feet I like Burts Bees coconut foot creme. I slather it on before bed then go to sleep wearing socks. It doesn’t smell like coconut, it’s more like a minty rosemary fragrance. I keep a pump bottle of Nivea unscented lotion by every sink during the winter and apply it after washing my hands, doing the dishes, etc.

    9. Agree with the recs for Vanicream. If your skin likes squalane, Biossance makes a very nice cream (they have two moisturizers, a gel and a cream, and you want the cream.)

    10. My favorite is still the yellow one from Clinique, but now that I live in a gentler climate I usually use Vanicream.

  8. My household income is above $230k. My husband and I are both maxing out our 401ks, and we invest about $14k/year separately. I don’t feel like we spend crazy amounts of money, although we have done a fair amount of traveling this year. But despite saving what I would consider a relatively high amount, our net worth is basically flat from a year ago. Is this because the market has been performing so poorly? Do we need to take a harder look at our spending (likely)?

    And from a spending standpoint, any tips for cutting back? Our largest expense seems to be food & dining (frequently over $2k) but with our busy schedules it’s hard to avoid eating out multiple times per week.

    1. Yes. I’m down about $26k in what was my ~$300k portfolio a year ago (outside of retirement — I haven’t checked those accounts for my own sanity). I’ve been saving cash this year so I haven’t contributed to this, so I know its entirely market movement. As long as your horizon is reasonably long, think of it as you are buying stocks on sale.

    2. well inflation is up and the market has been tumultuous.

      If you want to cut spending, look at where you mindlessly spend without feeling like you’re getting your money’s worth. If it’s random ‘I’m hungry let’s order takeout’ then stock your fridge or freezer with super easy options that mean you don’t need to make much effort to avoid restaurant prices. Think prepared frozen meals (pizzas, Amy’s, etc), precut veggies and hummus if you want a light snacky dinner, batch-cooked things that you only have to remove from the freezer in the morning and thaw (like making a lasagna and freezing it in meal-sized portions).

    3. How much do you have in stocks? Every 100k you have invested will be down about 20k for the year, so that will probably outweigh your savings. You can certainly take a look at your spending, but if your net worth isn’t going up right now, you don’t necessarily have a problem.

    4. Yes to looking at spending. We also max out our 401(k)s and save and give aggressively, but a couple of months ago, I realized we have substantially less cash on hand than in previous years. It makes sense–my savings and charitable contributions have not changed because they are automatic, but our grocery bill had crept up 40%; daily lunches out were up about 50%; gas was crazy; utilities were up. So I just started reviewing everything I spend on. I cut out some streaming services, changed our internet provider, changed our phone plan, started bringing my lunch to work and cut out one restaurant meal/week (no more Sunday brunch after church), cut out Steak Sunday (filet mignon every Sunday night at home), etc. Nothing was too small be be reviewed. I joined a warehouse club for $8 during a special so I could buy gas and a handful of other things from them. Anyway, after all of that, our bank balance is back on its way up. I still miss Steak Sunday, though.

      1. Steak has been on sale recently. We’ve gotten pretty good prices on flank steak and NY strips. The long-term droughts have been forcing ranchers to slaughter their herds, temporarily increasing beef supplies and reducing prices. Of course, long-term, beef prices will be much higher.

      2. This does not seem crazy to me, particularly if there are kids involved. Our family of 3 is in the neighborhood of $1,500 in a very LCOL area. And it’s not mostly on restaurants or takeout. We typically spend about $300 at the grocery store every week. In fact I think these days there are plenty of takeout options that would actually save us money (a pizza that feeds our whole family is $20 and ingredients for a dinner at home cost much more) but we eat homemade because we can afford it and having takeout all the time isn’t healthy.

    5. Two thousand a month on takeout and food? Get one of those meal subscription services – it’s expensive compared to completely homemade but is half the price of eating out.

      1. not the OP but interested – last time I got the meal subscription services it came with a thousand tiny ingredients you needed to prep, like it would come with a carrot and instructions to chop it finely. is there one where they just send you the meal mostly packaged? i was also thinking of looking at local meal prep options.

        1. We used cookunity for a while, which was all prepped and just heat to serve. It definitely took the planning out of things, and was mostly fine, but I found the meals to be very protein heavy and lacking in veggies (I couldn’t order the veg option because of allergies, but didn’t love that the omnivore options were like 70% protein serving and 30% vegetables). But we generally liked it more than say a frozen pizza or other quick options.

      2. Prepared ingredients from a grocery take zero time. Our grocer had good roast chicken.

    6. It’s most likely the market being down this year. Like the poster above said, if you have a reasonably long timeframe, think of your current investments as buying stocks on sale. And just keep perspective–the stock market will fluctuate many times over your career, but you don’t “lose” or “make” money until you sell. Your net worth figure just is just a snapshot.

      I’ve never found food and dining to be an “easy” place to cut spending. It almost always involves big changes to habits and schedules. And with inflation, my family has been making pretty dramatic changes to the way we eat just to keep our grocery bill even. If you specifically want to target takeout, I’d recommend trying out grocery store takeaway meals, frozen meals, and meal kits. They’re more expensive than buying off the shelf and making from scratch, but about half the price of takeout.

    7. This flatline is an effect of the markets being down.
      If you had $100k in your 401(k) at the end of last year, this would have gone down by 20%, to $80k. Your 2022 contribution max of $20.5k in this year would have just “replenished” that loss, but it wouldn’t have grown in value.

      On the other hand, if you automatically invest in stocks/ETFs, you can now buy more units for the same amount of cash, so in the long run, once the market picks up again, you will benefit from the lower market prices.

    8. my net worth is down massively from last year, from $4 to $3.5. especially since i’ve got a lot in tech stocks… they’re all at their 52-week lows.

    11. I think this is just because of the market. I don’t really worry about the growth of my retirement accounts beyond maxing them out. They will grow over time even if they have years with losses.

  9. I manage a small team – just me and 1 other person.
    There is a procedure we do that is industry standard. On larger teams / companies this is done in a very meticulous, strict, well-documented way. It’s not a legal or compliance thing, more of an organization thing
    Before I joined my company didn’t do it at all, and I haven’t been as strict about it here as I would be somewhere else. However, my direct report specifically said that he wants to be better at doing the above procedure.

    Basically, I’m more than happy to train him on the most proper way to do this thing, but I feel bad about nitpicking. It’s not nitpicking really, its just very exact – I can’t accept something if things aren’t worded a certain way, if anything is formatted differently etc etc
    It is also to his benefit to learn this format. So it’s all good, but I can’t get over the feeling that I’m being like micromanaging or something. Or stricter than I normally would or historically have been with him.

    1. I think you can just be upfront about it – “Tom, you said you wanted to get better at this and we both know how detailed this process is! We’ll probably have to go through a few revisions to get it right. Let’s put a couple meetings on our calendars to stay on track.” or something like that. You don’t have to apologize or call it micromanaging, because it’s not.

    2. You say in larger companies, this is done in a meticulous way, and you demand specific wording and formatting. Those things are not in and of itself problems. If the procedure requires this level of detail to be effective, then you can convey that to your staff, and hold them to that. However, are those things actually required? Just because they were done this way at previous places you worked, doesn’t necessarily mean anything. Some people thrive on routine checklists and then act as if deviating from the checklist will lead to less effective results when it’s really just their strong preference.

      1. See, this is the reaction I’m trying to avoid. It is done industry wide, its not just a preference. If he ever switches jobs to a bigger company it will be odd that he doesn’t know this. The specific wording and formatting is just very standard (not my preference), it may be annoying in the beginning but its not once you get used to it. And you’ve definitely read news stories that happened because someone at a bigger company thought this procedure wasn’t important or didn’t have to be followed strictly.

        1. in that case, just go ahead and require it. Are you getting pushback from your staffer? Maybe acknowledge that this is different from how things have been running at your company, but this is an industry standard, which exists for good reasons and this knowledge will also serve her if she goes to work somewhere else.

        2. Then that is the language I would use – “All large companies follow this detailed procedure, and in this industry, you are expected to know it. If your career ever takes you to a larger company, I want you to be good at this.”

          I assume you’re talking about something like Sarbanes-Oxley compliance?

    3. One question – is this something YOU have to train him on? Or are there CPE credits/courses available for him to take? Maybe this comes from my husband and I learning it from our kid, but sometimes it’s best to hire a pro/take a class and make them the one to do the training. Bonus – you can then frame it as ‘this is something standard in our industry that I thin kwould benefit your career, so I’m going to find budget to get you trained/certified’ (it also won’t take nearly as much of your time this way – you can schedule check in calls, discuss questions, but you aren’t trying to train him plus do your day job).

      1. It can’t completely be outsourced like that. I sent him some reading materials etc but its really something that you learn by doing on the job. I am going to get him training on an adjacent topic that will help.

  10. Lawyers: I need something a long the line of closely-held corporations for dummies. My practice involves more and more of these (shareholder disputes), and I need more background on the basics, especially with respect to stocks and buy-sell agreements. I’m attending all the CLEs I can find, but am hoping for something like a book/hornbook/great courses/MOOC. TIA

    2. Closely held corporations are going to be harder because of all the variants. I’d find someone in your firm who’s got a lot of experience or external if your firm lacks it and just ask a lot of questions.

    3. I’d see if practical law has any materials on this; I always find their info excellent and, well, practical.

    4. Sometimes lexology and jdsupra have law firm guides on subjects like this. I would look there.

      Strafford also has some good CLEs on corporate topics that are a bit niche like this.

  11. I’m going to a multi-day conference in about a week and a half. I’d been hoping the weather was going to cool down before then, but alas, the forecast says it’s going to be in the mid-90s. We’ve been instructed to “dress for walking” and bring water, and there will be multiple tours of outdoors work sites.

    What do I wear? My default would be a light-colored solid T-shirt, my nicer shorts/skirts, and hiking boots, and bring a crossbody bag for water, but I thought I’d ask for advice.

    1. I don;t know your industry or the usual dress codes, but I would wear a linen shirt, which to me is dressier than a t shirt, does not stick to my torso as I sweat, and can cover my arms if the sun is intense. Then, nice shorts if that is ok, otherwise a flowy skirt, and maybe hiking shoes with low cut socks. Do you need a hat? and sunglasses, of course. As an alternative to linen shirts, Columbia and other outdoors companies make shirts that are good for the sun and heat, and are also great for hiking, etc. Look on the river site for such shirts.

    2. I’d do a shirtdress and sneakers. Banana has some cute linen ones. I wouldn’t see it like a hike, if it’s a conference it’s many different fitness levels and going to be more about the intersection of polish and comfort.

      1. +1. OP, it is not clear what industry you’re in, but in the work context, I wouldn’t expect that “dress for walking” means shorts and hiking boots.

    3. For work sites, do you need protective clothing? If that’s the case, you may want a pair of lightweight pants (hiking pants?) with your T-shirt.

    4. I would wear a “dressy” t-shirt (not a workout t-shirt) and nicer shorts or skirt, and clean sneakers. Not hiking boots.

    5. I wouldn’t wear hiking boots unless it’s at a site with shoe requirements. I’ve been to industrial sites where boots with heels were mandatory and people did wear hiking-type boots along with work boots. Otherwise a sneaker or a comfy oxford would probably work. Would also avoid shorts as they are very casual. Have fun at the conference!

    6. I would avoid shorts for a professional conference. Wearing lightweight cotton pants is not going to make you noticeably hotter than wearing shorts. I think a linen top with cotton pants or the linen shirt dress idea (with some nice wicking shorts underneath to prevent sweaty thigh chafing) is your best bet.

    7. I would take “dress for walking” to mean sneakers as opposed to high heels or dress shoes. Not hiking boots. I’d wear a swing dress or nice shirt and skirt plus sneakers, as long as the work sites don’t require protective footwear.

  12. I’m looking for more dresses like this for work. I’m 5’1, so I need a length between 34 and 36 inches. Preferable neutral patterns. I’d like a silky material, not T-shirt material. Has anyone seen any more options like this one at other retailers? Thanks in advance.

    MSK Short Sleeve Shift Dress at Pennys

    https://www.jcpenney.com/p/msk-short-sleeve-shift-dress/ppr5008228123?pTmplType=regular&catId=SearchResults&searchTerm=MSK+Short+Sleeve+Shift+Dress&productGridView=medium&urlState=brand%3Dmsk%26item_type%3Dshift%2Bdresses%26product_type%3Ddresses&badge=fewleft

    1. It’s more t-shirt-like, but check out the Daily Ritual Women’s Supersoft Terry Relaxed Fit Short Sleeve Puff Sleeve Dress on Am@zon. Based on the pics of the model and the reviews, it should be a good length for you.

  13. Has anyone found a sweater tank/ cardigan set that works for them and isn’t a ton of money? I like the trend but don’t want to spend a lot on something that will probably be out of style next year.

    1. Are you looking for something work appropriate or for lounging at home? For lounging, Aerie had some items last time I checked.

    3. There was an Old Navy one on here a couple weeks ago that I was covering. Charly Goss-approved too (for those who were recommending her recently!)

  14. Anyone have a ReMarkable or Supernote e-pen tablet? Do you love it or hate it? Opinions on either?

    1. I have a ReMarkable. I thought I was going to love it, but …

      The interface is odd. Too touchy in some ways, not responsive enough in others. I find it so difficult to navigate between documents and pages.

      Each actual “page” is quite small and takes only about half the information that an average notebook does, and I don’t like having my notes spread so broadly across pages. Makes it harder to scan the big picture, especially given the above.

      I’ve given up using it, and that is saying a lot because I invested $700 in it.

    2. I have a ReMarkable. I love it. My brain is more organized when I use it, therefore my life is more organized. I don’t even take advantage of all of its features, but I still use it daily.

      1. What’s the subscription all about? Do you find it necessary? As silly as it is, that’s the thing holding me back.

    3. A former boss/friend of mine has had a Remarkable tablet since their kickstarter days and absolutely loves it.

  15. Have you had any close relatives join a cult? If so, were they able to break free? Did you try interventions? I know we say to let the adults make their own bad decisions and not drive them away. This young woman is very lonely, wants to be liked, can’t see her own worth, and has gotten in with some people who think very black and white and seem to be programming her and trying to cut her off from wrong-thinking loved ones. It doesn’t need to be a cult, strictly-speaking, but falling under the sway of a charismatic older person who is very strict and strident and limiting. I guess a lot of abusive relationships are like that.

    1. Yes. The person was able to break free on their own. But it was scary to see how an intelligent person could be influenced by someone who was not, in this case, evil, but was certainly crazy.

    2. A lot of my relatives are OK with Trump Christians and we all grew up to varying degrees in the, at the time, just forming conservative Christian Evangelic@l movement. This movement has now fomented into MAG@ and other extremist factions. I’m willing to say CE is a cult and my family members are part of it. I got out. Some of the others did as well. The rest stay because it benefits them in some way- place of belonging, sense of purpose in recreating the perfect nuclear family (at least on the surface), sense of being right where people like me are wrong, etc. They are both people, loved ones, my relatives living their lives as best they know how but also exercising political and religious action that hurt others. The last person they would listen to is me because I am no longer ‘in the club’. It’s strange to think about this as I’m interacting with them. It’s very motivating for me personally to try to embrace all the grey of life and exercise faith or spiritual and political actions that help others. Be an example if they ever care to see it.

      1. +1 to CE being a cult. As a matter of fact, many years ago, I ended a tumultuous 2 year relationship with a man who joined an evangelic@l cult. He was invited to a service by a new “friend”, came home, and declared he now a Christian and giving himself to Jesus. That was the straw that broke the camels back in our relationship. I jokingly tell my friends that I was #dumpedforjesus.

    3. Yes, had both an aunt and uncle (two of parent’s siblings, not a married couple) join a cult (someone claiming to be Jesus, lots of crimes) and both eventually leave. They were in it for decades and the cult prevented me from being close to them. They both eventually left but it really changed their lives (prevented education / ability to get work, hurt family relationships) and took probably a decade to recover. Unfortunately, I don’t think there is a lot you can do besides try to be there for them, if and when they decide to leave. Definitely read up on deprogamming and how to interact with people in cults.

      Also, a cousin was heading toward the Q path until Jan 6th shook them out of it. My family seems cult-prone, if that is a thing.

  16. Yes, had both an aunt and uncle (two of parent’s siblings, not a married couple) join a cult (someone claiming to be Jesus, lots of crimes) and both eventually leave. They were in it for decades and the cult prevented me from being close to them. They both eventually left but it really changed their lives (prevented education / ability to get work, hurt family relationships) and took probably a decade to recover. Unfortunately, I don’t think there is a lot you can do besides try to be there for them, if and when they decide to leave. Definitely read up on deprogamming and how to interact with people in cults.

    Also, a cousin was heading toward the Q path until Jan 6th shook them out of it. My family seems cult-prone, if that is a thing.

    3. 60ish hours. I do not feel overloaded, though. My deadlines are reasonable enough that I feel busy but not overloaded.

  17. I’ll be in Florence solo before a friend arrives. Does anyone have recommendations for a casual restaurant in the Uffizi area?

    Unfortunately the weather will be consistently rainy which makes some planned day trips a bit less appealing. Do you have any recommendations for indoor off the beaten tracks sites we can substitute? TIA

    1. My restaurant recommendations are all way out of date, but a fun indoor activity that isn’t in all the guide books (or at least wasn’t when I last went) is that there is a room under a trap door in San Lorenzo where Michelangelo hid out when the Pope was trying to get him to come back to Rome and finish the Sistine Chapel. He basically doodled on the walls while he was waiting and it’s fun to see. When I last went the guard tried to tell me repeatedly that the room didn’t exist; if they do this to you, just insist that it does and they’ll let you down there.

      1. maybe there are extenuating circumstances, but the whiff of ‘American tourist harassing a security guard into letting them go somewhere that is not generally open to the visiting public’ is quite strong here.

        1. I think the extenuating circumstances is that a lot of things work this way in Italy, and usually Americans err on the side of failing to negotiate where another Italian would?

        2. Nah, it is definitely open to the public. If your Italian is good enough that you can do the full conversation in Italian rather than starting in English, they’ll generally let you right in. It’s been open to the public for decades; the security guards just like giving shit to tourists (American or otherwise).

    2. We really enjoyed Auditore, which is right around the corner from the Uffizi. The pasta, especially the cacio e pepe, is great.

      For indoor things, it seems like a lot of people skip the Galileo museum and we thought that was interesting.

    3. I don’t recall how close these are to the Uffizi but Osteria Santo Spirito has incredible truffle cheese gnocchi and indoor seating. There’s no room to eat indoors but All’Antico Vinaio has to-go sandwiches that I think about years later. Have fun!

      1. The line at All’Antico Vinaio was an hour long most of the time when we were there in March of this year. But there are a lot of other panini places on the same block that were great. My husband eventually got AAV at an off peak time and said it wasn’t even the best panini he had in Florence.

  18. Attorneys who have attended arbitration before FINRA: is this an occasion for full suit or is sheath + blazer more appropriate? Arbitration will be held mid-October in NYC if that makes a difference. Thanks!

    1. Either but I’d skew formal, dark colors or matching with the sheath and blazer combo.

    2. Either but I’d vote for suit. Mediations and arbitrations in NYC have always been as formal as court IME.

    3. I wear full suits for these. I’m also old and tend to err on the side of formality, so take that for what it’s worth.

    4. I have attended an arbitration (not FINRA) in NYC, in the fall, and I wore a full suit.

  19. Venting that I paid out of pocket to get my blood drawn this week to check if I was ever vaccinated for polio. The first part of my vent is that my dysfunctional parents may or may not have vaccinated me and I have no medical records from childhood (this is after calling the health departments of three states I lived in as a young child to see if there might be any school-related records). The second part of the vent is that my parents failure to take care of medical issues from 0-18 has cost me quite a lot of money as an adult. The third part of the vent is that I even have to think about polio circulating in New York City because of anti vaxers.

    1. NYC especially. Our state has hippy antivax pockets and they get recurring measles outbreaks. And never learn from that.

      1. I’m in Berkeley (CA) and my kid got whooping cough before she was done with her vaccinations. It was a “mild” case because she was partially vaccinated, but if that was mild I would absolutely hate to see severe. It was the worst, she coughed so hard she had broken blood vessels around her eyes and she was only 15 months, and I have all the rage for anti vaxxers, whether of the right or left wing variety. These diseases should be extinct by now.

    2. That’s super frustrating.

      Did your insurance say why it’s not covering the titers? I’ve had a ton of titers done, some at my request and one prior to a procedure, and insurance always covered it.

      1. Probably they would have, but I am on an extended work stay somewhere else (intl) at the moment and want to clarify this before I return to NYC.

    3. It frustrates me that healthcare systems are obliged to record and keep all kinds of information under the ACA, but as for the actual patients, they can still trash our records after a number of years. My childhood vaccination records are gone too, and I never had any chance to access them as a legal adult.

    5. I am also the victim of my parents medical neglect, it sucks and costs so much time and money to rectify. (I previously posted about having to undergo surgery due to their negligence)

    6. My husband had to get the MMR as his parents didn’t get him vaccinated for some reason? Now they say it was of the autism study but a) he was born in 1980, long before the discredited study and b) surprise, he has an autism diagnosis.

  20. Looking for inspiration to get me through a rough patch at work and on the home front. Husband has been traveling, leaving me to manage kids and dogs solo with very little outside help for more than a month, and work is on fire at the same time. Need something to look forward to. To that end, I am considering: 1) 1-2 nights away solo, somewhere driving distance from DC this fall. Just somewhere beautiful and quiet where nobody will need me to drive them anywhere or to pick up dog pop and maybe I can get a massage; and 2) a 3-4 night trip to Iceland in January with husband as part of a celebration of a milestone birthday. I know there’s been a lot of Iceland discussion and tips here, but hard to find them all. Should I work with a travel agent? Any other tips? Just hoping to chase some Northern Lights and see beautiful scenery, but will need to be a quick trip because of limited childcare options.

    1. I love the Iceland idea, and could be wrong, but I think it might be prohibitively cold in January. Depending on where you are, what about a short trip to Paris? It’s always a good idea.

      1. Not OP, and I’ve never been to Iceland or Paris in January, but I suspect the weather isn’t actually all that different. At least to me, it would be a lot more appealing to lean in to winter and celebrate it in Iceland than slog through winter in Paris.

          1. Yes! Went to Iceland in mid-Jan. It was beautiful and if you’re prepared with the right clothes, the weather is not an issue. I wore my ski pants and warm boots to do a lot of the walking around both in town and at the tourist destinations. It was colder that week in NYC.

        2. Paris is pretty bleak in January. I lived there for years and it is not the loveliest month plus it’s after all the gorgeous Christmas stuff has come down. I’d vote something warm. Caribbean is lovely that time of year or South America / Australia.

      2. Iceland doesn’t actually get that cold, comparatively, because of the gulf stream. Likewise, it also doesn’t get very warm in the summer. It does get windy though! Be aware that the northern lights are always a gamble because you need both clear skies and solar activity. January only gets like 5-7 hours of daylight per day so it’s not the ideal time for other sightseeing – though Iceland is incredibly beautiful. If you’re shooting for the possibility of northern lights I’d actually go in March, because then at least you have longer days for sightseeing if you don’t get them, but enough hours of darkness to actually see them (whereas for late spring/summer/early fall it doesn’t really get dark enough).

      3. I did a milestone birthday in Iceland in January and it is lovely but dark. The right clothing is what helps. I also did an Iceland trip in March prior to that and that was the coldest I’ve ever been. I would never turn down the trip to Iceland.

    2. For DC getaways, consider Charlottesville (I recently stayed at the Farmhouse at Veritas, a B&B on a winery, and it was very secluded and beautiful and breakfast was delicious! You can also do their wine pairing dinner. Closer to town you could stay at the Oakhurst Inn or the Boar’s Head) or St. Michael’s (the Inn at Perry Cabin has a spa, you can walk around the town and then curl up by the river with a book).

      Hang in there! Work crunch and managing the homefront solo is no joke.

    3. I always work with a travel agent because I just can’t keep track of everything plus my agent produces an amazing online itinerary that is super easy to use. Call Fatima at First Ticket Travel — she’s in So Cal but I’ve only ever communicated with her by email: freep@firsttickettravel.com.

      I love Iceland but I was there in summer. Keep in mind t hat in winter it will not only be very cold, but it will be dark all the time so not sure how well you’ll be able to see that beautiful scenery.

  21. Punchline: what chores do your teenagers do around the house regularly?
    Background: I’m remarried for 3 years and came into the marriage with two young teenage children. We have one baby together. My husband often voices frustration that my kids don’t do enough around the house to help. I’ve asked him exactly what he wants them to do but he doesn’t have an answer. He gets frustrated with the clutter around the house but most of it comes from him, me and our baby. The big kids generally keep their stuff to their rooms. They are with us every other week but are at our house almost everyday after school while they wait for their dad to get off work during his weeks. Both kids will do what we ask them to when we ask them to do a specific job (dishes, clean your bathroom, vacuum upstairs) but they don’t have regular chores. We have someone clean every two weeks. We have two dogs that were my husbands prior to our marriage, and he wants the kids to walk them. However, he rarely walks them so I said I’m unwilling to ask them to do something that he himself doesn’t do regularly. The kids and I will fill in when he doesn’t have time but we’re not taking it on as “our jobs” until he does.
    What chores do your teenagers have, especially those of you with split custody?

    1. I would think that walking the dogs is a fine chore. The fact that your husband doesn’t do it often has an upside: it meaningfully contributes and gets something does that isn’t normally done. Bonus – they understand that having a dog means the dog gets walked.

      Are the kids old enough to be involved in the discussion of which chores they can do? IMHO, it helps kids to think about everything that goes into running a household, rather than have a set of tasks assigned to them.

      1. except their stepfather brought the dogs into the marriage, which i think makes it a bit more complicated than that

    2. I think this is a lot more complicated than a typical chores conversation. I’d be worried about your kids feelings around fairness and I’d start with talking to your husband about other solutions here like a dog walker or house cleaner. If the kids aren’t causing the problems, you’re dancing in Cinderella territory.

      1. I’d be inclined to agree with this. Your husband’s expectations don’t seem realistic.

        I’d make one exception: I begged to have a daily dog-walking chore as a middle schooler and it was denied because my parents worried about my safety. If it’s safe and the kids want to do it, and your husband can refrain from acting entitled if they miss a day or something, then I’d let that one go.

      2. Yea, I feel like there’s a lot more going on here.

        But to answer your question, and know that my parents ran a very tight ship, our job was homework and our extra curricular obligations first and foremost. We were also expected to make our beds daily, put our laundry away and generally keep tidy our rooms and any areas we go in to, but no lengthy, recurring “chores”. Heck, I accidentally bleached a lot of clothes that weren’t mine when I was about 14 and that was the end of me / any kid in the house doing their own laundry. No vacuuming on the regular – we’d do it when asked but no regular expectation. Didn’t have a pet, but I do make my 4 yo feed the dog every morning, so that feels reasonable enough (but maybe not for a part-time resident).

        I do wonder if being a part time resident makes routine harder to establish if it’s anything beyond the normal “clean up after yourselves” kind of thing, especially at that age? Maybe someone else who has lived that can chime in.

      3. Yup. I was married to a guy like this only worse and I urge you not to sell out your kids to placate your husband. Maybe transitioning one or two of those “they will do it if we ask” chores to “regular assigned jobs” would help?

    3. I’d start by asking the kids what they’d like to do. Walking the dogs after school might be appealing compared to other options. Give them a list of options and have them pick a few, but don’t go overboard. If you have cleaners, they take care of their own stuff, and they only live there part time, then I don’t think they need a huge list of tasks.

    4. My parents didn’t give us a lot of set chores but we were generally expected to help out with things.

      Standing chores were to set and clear the table each night, keep our rooms clean, take the trash out on Sundays/bring the cans back on Mondays and clean our shared bathroom (which in a 2 bath house was also the public bathroom). So maybe 10 mins a day for the table and 30 minutes total for the rest of the week ?

      On occasion we helped with other house work and yard work – maybe another 30 mins a week average (some weeks nothing, some weeks vacuuming the living room for 5 minutes, some weeks raking the yard for a few hours).

      We both played varsity sports, took AP classes, and were presidents of clubs so we didn’t have a ton of free time as kids. I think my parents did a good job of balancing us having a life and having responsibilities. Like, I was always allowed to have a car to go out on a Friday or Saturday night but I had to drop my younger brother off wherever he was going before I went out.

      We had to have summer jobs but we didn’t have to work during the school year. But, my brother caddied and I babysat so we did work year round but both had jobs where we set our schedules. We both got “real” summer jobs (lifeguarding and at a deli) for the first time summer going into senior year and had just worked the caddy/babysitting jobs before that.

      So, I think assigning the teens to keep they own bedrooms and bathroom clean and help out with a few all-family things (setting / clearing table, vacuuming a room once a week, whatever) is totally fine but they should not be taking care of the dog or cleaning up after other people. They can do little things to help out with the baby but anything major should be a choice and should be paid (like if they’re just home and watching tv – can you watch your sister for 20 mins I’m running to the store is fine, but if you want them to babysit for 4 hours on a Friday night pay them).

      1. +1 to all of this. I had a SAHM so she handled most heavy cleaning, and I had a really busy schedule between school, difficult classes, extracurriculars, and a part-time job during the school year.

        I was expected to keep my own room picked up, dust & vacuum it once a week, get my own laundry sorted into the family bins daily, when home for dinner would help set & clear table and dry dishes, and would pitch in on bigger tasks like when our zillions of trees generated hours of raking.

      2. Thank you- this is helpful and along the lines of what I was thinking. They do set and clear the table, but I’d like to ask them to help with the garbage (to which they contribute every week), tidy up bathrooms or vacuum between cleans, so no more than an hour total a week.
        I should add- they are paid everytime they are asked to babysit the baby (which is rare, maybe once a month) and we generally try to time it when the baby is asleep.

        1. That sounds like a good plan, OP. Keep resisting the urge to sell out your kids to placate your husband!

    5. Our kids put their book bags on their desks and their lunch boxes in the kitchen drawer (emptied) and empty the dishwasher. DH loads the dishwasher. They also feed the dog and walk the dog BUT those chores were their choice as a part of the decision to get a dog. DH did not want a dog and has no dog related chores.

      He needs to not complain about them in front of them and not complain to you unless he has specific chores he wants to suggest to you that they be assigned. Honestly it sounds like he is unhappy about not living alone. More stuff and mess is part of having kids/babies/dogs.

      They should not have to walk the dogs. They did not ask for the dogs.

    6. Wrong question. Why did you marry a lazy bum who won’t walk his own dogs and hates your kids?

        2. Seriously? He’s trying to make your kids walk the dogs that he is too lazy to walk himself and you don’t think he has a problematic attitude?

      2. This is the question you should be asking. Your husband being a slob and asking your kids to clean up is going to go over like a lead balloon. If you want kids who actually talk to you as adults, you put your foot down right now with your husband.

      4. +1…I was trying to find a polite way of saying basically this. The dog thing especially irks me since it sounds like getting the dogs was totally his decision. If so he should be the one to walk them the majority of the time.

    7. Mine is elementary but I also have split custody. Her chores are basically cleaning up after herself type stuff (putting away shoes and backpack, putting away toys and clothes every evening, etc), and also helping clear & clean the table after dinner. She’s responsible for them every day that she’s at my house. I do think it makes sense to give the kids some structure around their chores — like they have to clean the bathroom and vacuum every weekend they are at your house and load or unload the dishwasher every day they are there, for example. But as long as they don’t make a mess in the common areas, take care of their own spaces, and help with household stuff that’s for everyone (i.e. dinner related things), I don’t see an issue.

    8. We didn’t have cleaners growing up and started doing chores pretty young – think setting the table, sweeping the floor after dinner, loading the dishwasher, etc.

      Other chores we did as teens: vacuum the house and car, clean out the refrigerator, water the outdoor plants, laundry (this was my domain and I got extra allowance for it), empty all the trash cans and take to the curb, dusting/swiffering. We also packed our own school lunches and put away the groceries. My dad mopped and cleaned the bathrooms because no one else could do it to his standards.

    9. I think the problem is your bad husband.

      But as a teenager I did laundry, cleaned up after dinner, and often did something to start dinner going. And that’s it! I’ve literally never been as busy as in high school, I was either in school or activities or doing homework nearly every minute of the day.

      1. This. I did my own laundry, but between work, sports, and studying, I was home so little that I didn’t even help with meals. I usually made my own (only vegetarian in the family), packed sandwiches, or got food at work or with friends. I cleaned up after myself, earned enough to pay for everything I was buying, and stayed out of trouble, and I think that was enough. I did more chores when I was younger, though.

    10. I don’t think I understand where husband’s expectations are coming from. My dad treated teens like they should just take chores off his plate (like it sounds like is happening here with things like “dog walking” or clutter created by entirely other people) as opposed to generally pitching in, and it really wasn’t a healthy dynamic. It sounds like they’re already pitching in, which to me is what matters (especially in a house where they only sleep every other week, which I think makes this all a bit more delicate).

      1. I don’t want to pile on too hard, but essentially this. My boomer parents (and my husbands) apparently had kids as a way to get out of housework based on the ridiculous amount of chores we were assigned starting at very young ages. I’m not talking about cleaning up our rooms/clearing the table – I started cooking for the entire family at 12 and my mom fired the cleaners as that was now ‘our’ job (not my dad or brother’s though). My school vacations were dedicated to deep cleaning (washing an entire house worth of windows/washing down walls and floors with boiling water and soap poweder, hauling bedspreads and pillows to the laundromat and then line drying them, dusting every slat of the blinds by hand, etc.) Of course this was all ‘womens work’ and my brother/dad did none of it. Don’t be those types of parents.

        1. Oh god, we did this too except my brothers also had to help. My parents just phoned it in once we were in middle school.

        2. Wow, yes – this was my experience too. I was given a miniature broom and mop when I was in kindergarten and was trained from that age. Trips home from college and law school were spent deep cleaning the house I no longer lived in. I don’t visit often these days.

          OP, my advice is just make sure that your kids are at home in the house you live in. If your house is no longer their house, it will irreparably harm your relationship.

    11. The fact that they are your step-daughters definitely complicates things, and it should be on your husband to communicate with them and come up with chores. Especially since you’re fine with what they’re doing.

      I have to be honest that I don’t understand about the dogs. They’re family dogs. Is there a reason dog walking has to be your husband’s job? How do his kids feel about doing it? Could the job be rotated among the 3 of them (or 4 of you), or could they do it during the weeks they stay with you overnight? It just doesn’t seem unreasonable that he wants them to help walk the dogs.

      My parents didn’t make me do much of anything outside of school work, extracurriculars, and keeping my room clean. Later, I wished I’d been taught to do my own laundry and to cook a bit.

      3. I think you misread; these are OP’s daughters and the husband’s stepdaughters. And the dogs are the husband’s dogs. Or did I misread?

        1. Oops, hit reply too fast. To add… Since they are only with you every other week, I would lean into their chores being related to their own spaces. Keeping their own rooms tidy, cleaning up mess in common area that they created, etc. I don’t think tasking them dog walking is an inherently a bad idea, but only works in these circumstances if the girls like the dogs and are interested in doing it. Maybe you could give them a small weekly allowance if they walk the dogs X number of days?

          In regards to overall tidiness, could you consider upping your cleaning service to weekly?

        2. Yeah… this does sound like there’s some Cinderella potential here as a previous commenter noted.

    12. One way to start would be to find a project to work on together, like scanning and organizing photos and documents, taking old electronics to be recycled, or finding clothes and other items to donate—that way it feels more like a project and less like a chore. I think the most successful chores are ones you do together or ones that you regularly model for them, and assigning them tasks the adults don’t regularly do might cause resentment.

    13. My 17 year old is in charge of her room and bathroom (picking up, we have a cleaning person) and does her own laundry. She pitches in with cooking and dog walking when asked and will run errands. I think your issue is more of a stepparent dynamic/ relationship issue than a real chores issue.

    14. If you’re in good terms with your ex, could you agree that they’ll do the same chore at both houses? The combo of your new husband wanting them to do more + new baby would make me a little wary and I’d also keep an eye out for any potential Cinderella situation*

      By having the same chores at both houses it feels more”fair” and less “I now have to do xyz bc my stepdad is a jerk and there’s a new baby to steal mom’s attention”. Also, If they’re in the “every Wednesday I vacuum the living room, regardless of where I am” mindset then it will (eventually , they are teenagers after all!) become routine abc will require fewer reminders to do it – less nagging will definitely help with avoiding the Cinderella situation too.

      I always feel that balancing teenager chores can be tricky: you want them to be responsible and learn that we’re all responsible for upkeep of the household, you want them to learn good habits and skills, they’re likely already busy with school, sports, and activities but you also want them to have plenty of time for having fun and letting loose.

      Generally, I’m of the mind that they should be taking care of their own things (keeping their bedroom and bathroom clean enough, doing laundry) and 1-2 things that contribute to the family (set/clear the table each night, take out the trash, mow the lawn every other week, help cook dinner one night a week, sweep the kitchen once a week). Family chores shouldn’t take tooo much time but should establish the idea that everyone who lives here has to help out.

      Also, whenever there is more to be done everyone should chip in equally. So, if it’s leaf collection everyone goes out and rakes. Everyone helps get the house together before hosting Thanksgiving.

      As parents, you and your husband should still be doing the lions share but the kids can absolutely help out!

      1. This is a really good idea. Kid A vaccums the kitchen and living room on Monday regardless of which house they are at. Kid B vaccums kitchen and living room on Thursday regardless of which house they are at.

    15. I don’t understand about the dog walking. He isn’t walking the dog regularly now, but he also won’t be walking the dog regularly because the teens would be doing it. Do you mean they would split walking the dog regularly? He’s not doing it now and the teens doing it means he won’t be doing it anyway.

      If he’s frustrated with something tell him he needs to come up with solutions or stop bringing it up until he does.

    17. I agree there are other dynamics here (I also live half time with a kid that isn’t mine, and it is NOT easy so I may feel more for your husband than others replying here) but the bottom line is your teens have no regular chores it seems? Yes, that should be changed and you should be the one in charge of making it happen.

      But your husband should walk his own damn dog for chrissakes.

    18. I think this is a complicated situation, but here is what my daughter did before leaving for college: all care for her cats (three feedings a day, daily litter care, changing litter twice a week, monthly meds), clearing the table and emptying the dishwasher, folding laundry, mowing/weed whacking the lawn, taking trash and recycling to the curb weekly, as well as random chores as we needed help. When her sport was in season, there was more flexibility.

    19. My 14 yo is responsible for keeping her room tidy & dusted, taking out the bathroom trash, unloading the dishwasher and feeding the dog. She also makes her own breakfasts and lunches. She’s always willing to help when asked, but she doesn’t “see an opportunity” and pitch in. Although, she has tidied the living room and kitchen on days when she’s been alone at the house.

      The big question that comes up for me is, is this the house your daughters grew up in or is it a “new” house that may not (yet) really feel like their home? If I were a young teenager in my step-father’s house or a new joint home, I might feel hesitant to “over step”? Especially on days when I wasn’t actually “living” there.

    20. I can’t comment on the blended family aspect but can detail what my slightly younger kids do.
      11 year old: deep cleans bathrooms probably once a month, vacuums occasionally, details car quarterly, does her own laundry and assists in putting away younger sibling’s clothes, deep cleans/full gut job of the playroom quarterly.
      8 Year old: loads and unloads dishwasher ~ 5 times per week, sets the table ~ 5 times per week, occasionally asked to wipe down a grubby toilet, maintenance cleans the playroom
      6 year old: loads dishwasher, clears table, tidies toys and maintenance cleans playroom
      3 year old: clears table (she should and could do more but probably gets babied since there are five other people around)

      1. Oh, I also hate clutter so there bookbags and shoes have to be put away upon returning home from school. Likewise, they don’t leave things lying around.

    21. I have two teenagers and one pre-teen. The oldest is my child from a previous relationship. They have to do the following chores:
      –the younger two have to load and unload the dishwasher everyday. They can choose how to divide this up themselves. Sometimes that means they unload and load together, sometimes it means one unloads and the other loads. If they fight about it, I will come up with a division that they don’t like lol.
      –the oldest has to sweep and mop the floors downstairs twice a week
      –everyone is responsible for their own laundry and cleaning their rooms. both must be done by Sunday evening.
      –we have three cats and each is responsible for one of the cats feeding, litter box, and cleaning bowls.
      –they are jointly responsible for cleaning their bathroom. must be done by Sunday. They can usually divide this up amongst themselves, but if there is fighting, I will assign tasks.
      –younger two have to take trash and recycle out daily, take carts down and up every week.
      –oldest has to help younger two with homework before I get home if they have any they need help with. She also has to do some driving around of younger two.

  22. I was the person who posted yesterday afternoon about wanting to own a business in 10 years and what I need to do in my 40s to get there in my 50s including an industry switch and whether it was too late.

    While I’ll take any other advice, just wanted to say thanks to those who responded esp Coach Laura – seems like I’m already nearing step 4 of that plan and just need to talk to more people in the new industry until I decide to take the leap.

  23. I agree with this. But to the specific question, my kids (oldest is 13) will do things when asked (and they are very regularly asked), but their only consistent chore is taking the dogs out in the morning on weekends. But no custody issues and they are our dogs, so very different.

  24. I don’t know if my issue is specific to being a dutiful Asian daughter, but I feel like there are enough Asian daughters (or Oldest Daughters. Or just daughters) on this board that they might commiserate or be able to give me perspective or box text to get out of this situation. Or just tell me to lump it.
    Months ago, my cousin planned a trip to come visit us to help celebrate my daughter’s birthday. A month or so after that, my mother also planned a trip to visit us, fully knowing that Cousin would also be here. We only have one guest room. My parents live on a different coast, but they have a house about a mile from us (they rent out the upper level and live in the bottom level while visiting us for extended periods of time- think a month or two). I asked Mom if she was going to be staying at her own house, reminding her that Cousin would also be here, and Mom said that she wanted to stay with us because she hasn’t seen the grandkids in four months, plus she has work to do and her house doesn’t have internet. So now I don’t have a good place to put Cousin. I think Cousin will end up staying in the kids’ room and the kids’ will bunk in my room with me and Husband, which will mean no sleep for anyone. (Although the Husband jokingly says that he will just go stay at Mom’s house.) Cousin is mid-thirties and I feel like asking her to sleep in the bottom bunk of the kids’ room is kind of silly, but I feel like I have to let the Elder in the family have the nice guest room. Also this kind of room sharing/switching is what we did as a children, so it’s probably not a big deal for Cousin.
    I know the straight forward solution is to ask my mother to please stay at her own house, but the dutiful Asian daughter feels like Mom will consider this disrespectful and I will be the negligent Asian daughter and that our house will again be deigned not big enough. (Our house is 2100 sq ft with four bedrooms).
    Sigh. It’s such a minor irritation, but it’s taking up a lot of brain space today…

    1. Ask mom if you can put cousin in mom’s house? And get a mobile hotspot so cousin has the internet.

    2. Why don’t you put Cousin in Mom’s house? I would be surprised if she didn’t prefer that to the bottom bunk.

    4. Possibly dumb question – can your cousin stay at your parent’s nearby house?

    5. I mean you can grow up and set a boundary any time! Or keep being a door mat and chalk it up to culture.

    6. can you put cousin in your parents’ house? as you said it’s only a mile from yours..

    8. Dutiful daughter – tell mom your house is full and cousin asked to stay there first. She can figure this out. Take the initiative here, be respectful but firm, and ask the person causing the issue to come up with a solution.

      OR if they all insist on staying with you, Mom gets the bottom bunk.

      “Mom, as you know Cousin will already be here in the guest room. Are you happy to stay in the kids’ room or would you rather stay at your own house?”

      You can do this!! (From another oldest child)

      1. +1. It sounds like a lot of this is in Eldest Daughter’s head (probably informed by past experience, but still in your head). Your mom judging you shouldn’t control your entire life. Also – you’re ASSUMING she will harbor these judgments and orienting yourself according to things you’re putting in her mouth.

        I’m an eldest daughter, and I’d get way more flack in my family for putting a guest out because I bumped her to let my mom have the room. Unless your mom is insisting the Elder gets the nicest room even if it’s last minute and displacing someone who’d planned a trip around it, I don’t think there is any reason to make that decision yourself. Let your mom say that explicitly if it’s what she thinks is necessary. But right now it sounds like you’re putting everyone in a difficult and unpleasant situation (kids, husband, cousin) to accommodate your own anxieties about setting boundaries with your mom or God forbid being judged by her. It doesn’t really even sound like you’re accommodating your mom so much as your own fear of her.

    9. Personally, I’d offer Cousin the mom’s house OR insist that you don’t have space at yours. It’s an easy message: “Cousin is staying with us and planned her trip around this assumption. We could insist she sleep in a bunk bed in the kids’ room, but I feel bad about doing that. If it’s really that important, we can insist she do so, but I can make sure you see the grandkids as much as possible even when staying in your home.”

      I get that it’s really hard to set boundaries with parents, but at a certain point they don’t have the same level of control it may feel that they do. If she thinks you’re “negligent,” it honestly doesn’t really matter if you aren’t actually being negligent. She thinks your house is too small? Oh well. She isn’t the final arbiter of whether or not you (or your life) is a enough. You’re allowed to set boundaries and not allow her judgment to control your life.

      Also – these boundaries get easier to set over time. Her tenuous narratives will likely become exhausting even to her if they aren’t working the same way. Right now, acting like you’re negligent has power in that it allows her to control your behavior. If it stops having that power, it will potentially become a less attractive thing to harp on.

    10. As an oldest Asian daughter – get over it. You’re willing to make your husband, children, and cousin uncomfortable and invade their space simply because your mother might consider it disrespectful if you ask that she stay at her own house a mile away? Spoiler alert – anything you do will always be “disrespectful.” Your house will never be “big enough.” Your mom will always be disappointed. You need to live your life on your own terms because nothing will ever make her happy. It’s one thing to contort yourself to meet all her unspoken expectations, but now you are forcing your husband, children, and grown adult cousin to sacrifice their privacy and comfort just so your mom maybe hopefully won’t complain or say something, even though you know she always will. There is no winning this game, so draw your boundaries and keep them firm. You have your own family to protect, and giving in now will just set an awful precedent to the point where your children will begin to resent it whenever relatives visit and they are forced to cater to their every whim on the basis of birth order. Do you really want to model subservience to your children this way?

      1. +1,000,000,000,000. You’re in control of your own life. You can’t let your anticipatory anxiety of her judgment make you someone who is unfair to other family members.

    11. Clearly, some adult(s) should stay at your mom’s house. You could set the boundary with your mom or offer it to your cousin. Or you and your husband could take your mom’s house and have a romantic night away from the kids :-) Your mom apparently wants to see the grandkids until the moment they fall asleep and the moment they wake up anyways.

    12. As an Asian daughter, I say this with love…some of this is on you. You have to break the cycle of guilt, shame and weirdness. Tell mom no. It will be better for everybody involved.

    13. Are your cousin and mom close enough to share the guestroom? As another Asian, I’ve shared a room and bed with my aunts before. Whenever we have large gatherings it’s expected that people will huddle in one house and sleeping arrangements involve sharing beds, using the couch, and even the floor. But if they can’t share rooms, just tell mom “the guestroom is already taken by cousin, sorry.” It would drive me bonkers if someone, parents or not, decide to come stay at my house without first discussing it with me.

    14. I’m an Asian, elder daughter.

      Give Mom two options…

      Either change her dates
      Or
      Sleep in her own house.

  25. Personally, I’d offer Cousin the mom’s house OR insist that you don’t have space at yours. It’s an easy message: “Cousin is staying with us and planned her trip around this assumption. We could insist she sleep in a bunk bed in the kids’ room, but I feel bad about doing that. If it’s really that important, we can insist she do so, but I can make sure you see the grandkids as much as possible even when staying in your home.”

    I get that it’s really hard to set boundaries with parents, but at a certain point they don’t have the same level of control it may feel that they do. If she thinks you’re “negligent,” it honestly doesn’t really matter if you aren’t actually being negligent. She thinks your house is too small? Oh well. She isn’t the final arbiter of whether or not you (or your life) is a enough. You’re allowed to set boundaries and not allow her judgment to control your life.

    Also – these boundaries get easier to set over time. Her tenuous narratives will likely become exhausting even to her if they aren’t working the same way. Right now, acting like you’re negligent has power in that it allows her to control your behavior. If it stops having that power, it will potentially become a less attractive thing to harp on.

  26. I’m sort of a “why not both?” type of person (as opposed to believing everything is zero sum). But sometimes the implementation of equity initiatives is badly planned and leads to everyone in the (wide) middle getting a crappier experience while nothing really changes for the people at the tippy-top.

    For instance, if there is a concern that the accelerated high school math classes are not representative of the school population (i.e., mostly rich white kids), the solution ought to be figuring out how to encourage nonwhite kids to take those classes, not switch all math classes to general math instruction and drop calculus. Also you could maybe talk to the parents of the high school kids who don’t take accelerated math, and ask them why their kid isn’t enrolled in those classes. The answer might be a racist teacher or a complex admissions process that favors white parents with paperwork skills, but the answer also might be that the kid only wants to apply to an open-enrollment junior college and doesn’t need an advanced math class.

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