Wednesday’s Workwear Report: One-Button Blazer

397 Comments

1. I know linen will inevitably wrinkle but is there any way to stop it from stretching out a lot over the day? I just got some nice linen pants from Eileen Fisher. When I put them on in the morning they fit great, maybe very slightly snug. By the end of the day the butt was so stretched out it looked like there was room for two of me in there. I’ve always heard linen pants are a summer staple, but are people only wearing them when they will not be sitting? Or is there some trick to them not doubling in size over the course of a day spent sitting?

   1. It’s part of the look. Linen is slouchy.

   2. I buy them tight, but yes they do expand. I have the Old Navy with the elastic waist.
      Currently looking for linen skirts with the optimistic hope that they will not develop diaper butt too :/

      1. Alas, I am here to report that skirts also get the butt sag. Some of the “stretch linen” which is blended with lycra seems to hold its shape better.

   3. This was also my experience, and I never wear it anymore. I never wore linen for all day wear in the past either – like, I might put on an outfit for an afternoon wedding or brunch or a summer evening outing etc… But know that the outfit life is only a few hours.

   4. In my experience linen is not great for a tailored look – the best pieces are meant to start and stay relaxed. I love to wear it, but broken up with other pieces – wide leg linen pant with a fitted top, or slim pant with blousy top, or go full easy breezy with a dress paired with show with clean lines.

      1. This. Buying it snug is the wrong direction because it will stress the fabric and make it bag oddly. Do a loose flowing cut and it doesn’t change when you sit (except getting a few wrinkles which is fine)

   5. I think you have to buy linen in flowy shapes that allow for sitting without putting stress on the fabric. Wide leg pants with plenty of drape should allow room to sit out stretching out. Luckily wide-leg, drapey pants are in fashion these days.

      1. What shirts are people wearing IRL with loose linen or gauze pants?? I would like to avoid the early-2000s look of tight black crop top (I know it’s in, but doesn’t work for me in this stage). Any other options between super boxy short linen shirts (which I see my friends wearing but cannot make work for me long-torsoe’d tall thin self) and tight crop tops??

         1. With flowy linen pants I am wearing plain old tees and tanks, with a front tuck if the top is not very fitted.

            1. +1

               Fitted top. Loose very flowy pants.

            2. Usually a linen button down because I have fully embraced the coastal grandma aesthetic.

         2. Split neck sleeveless shirts. Might not be the most trendy look but they cover my tall self and they look nice with flowy linen pants.

         3. Tees and tanks

   6. I love linen. I’m often head to toe linen in the summer. But it’s not a work look for me.

      Your pants are behaving the way they’re supposed to.

2. What do you do each week to work out, and if you’re someone who works out “a lot,” how did you get to that point? I generally go climbing (indoors) one or two days a week, then do Caroline Girvan YouTube videos one or two days a week, and don’t tend to work out on the weekends unless I go for a hike. I have a friend who’s super in shape– five a.m. workouts at the gym five days a week, yoga and long hikes on the weekend, has run a half marathon without training, goes for twenty mile day hikes… how do you get from a very casually active person to a serious athlete?

   1. All of the people I know who are ‘serious’ about working out have basically made it their main ‘hobby’ as well as combining it with some form of community OR do it as ‘work’ in some way (PTs who coach classes on the side kind of thing). One of my good mom friends runs marathons, but that is basically her only hobby – she doesn’t read a ton, doesn’t have a ton of ‘me time’ (hair appointments/nails/massages/drinks with friends/etc) as almost all of her spare time is dedicated to training. My husband does seasonal hobbies (skiing/tennis/golf) plus the gym and treats the exercise as both his social outlet (more for golf/tennis) and a mental health need (gym visits). We schedule those as a family, and he’s proactively chosen places that have flexible class times, virtual options, and then will clear any evening/weekend activities with me to ensure it isn’t clashing with family or other obligations.
      If you’re married/partnered I think it also requires a serious discussion of how to make the hobby fit with budgeting goals as well as family time/obligations – it’s not cool to unilaterally decide you’re going to do long training runs every weekend and skip family time for example.

      1. Seconding this – I run as a semi-serious hobby and it’s also a good chunk of my socializing. And it takes a decent amount of planning, some financial investment, and constant communication with my spouse to enable my athletic pursuits to fit into our family schedule.
         But OP, it’s also worth probing *why* you want to go from casually-active person to serious athlete. Is your casual fitness setup not serving your physical or mental health needs? Are you looking for a non-career sort of achievement pathway? Do you just want to be super-fit and ready for any adventure (say if your friend calls and says ‘Let’s go hike the Grand Canyon rim-to-rim in six weeks’ you want to be ready for it)?

         1. Yeah, I’ve just always wanted to be the type of person who’s up for any adventure and fit enough to be able to jump into something without a ton of training beforehand. I’ve always been in okay shape, but never in that ~outdoor adventure athlete~ shape that several of my friends are in. Making a point to do more social workouts seems like a good step in that direction.

            1. If you want to be that person, you should just say yes to stuff. It’s ok to suck at things. I mean I probably wouldn’t run a half marathon with no training, but the people who do jump into those things probably already run regularly. They just aren’t on a super special half marathon training plan. At the lower end, most out of shape people could successfully complete a 5k. It might not feel great while you’re doing it, and you won’t impress anyone with your time, but you can get it done.

            2. Honestly, that’s 99% mental once you’ve reached a certain base level of fitness. I have several friends who have the fitness who will say no to anything out of their comfort zones.

            3. +1 anon at 10:17. I am pretty fit and have run 50ks with no training (even without running at all for four weeks prior). I will go to the climbing gym anytime someone asks, hiking – same, running, walking, cycling – yep, let’s do it! I don’t care if things are out of my physical range because I know I am a regular person, not a pro athlete and that I am going to be mediocre at a lot of stuff! It’s so mental vs physical. Your brain will stop you from doing so much of what your body is capable of if you let it!

               FWIW, my regular routine is OTF 4 times a week, yoga one or two times a week, horseback riding twice a week, cycling/hiking/climbing at random.

      2. +1 to this. I will also say as one of those people that falls into the category of being very active, a lot of is it genetic. I recognize my ability to easily build strength/endurance has a huge genetic preloading (extended family has Olympians and professional athletes), that coupled with us all probably self-medicating undiagnosed ADHD with a lot of physical activity.

         1. The genetics angle is a good point. I have a chronic progressive degenerative joint issue (whew, that’s a mouthful!) that began as a late teen and has/will limit my ability to do certain exercises as well as an unrealted health issue (POTS) that means I simply can’t do hugely demanding aerobic activities for long periods of time without feeling awful. I ‘look’ healthy and have gotten used to explaining that nope I don’t do tennis/ski/pickelball but I’ll happily do a reasonable hike/yoga/barre/pilates/neighborhood walks/HIIT with breaks/etc. I’m definitely envious of those without physical restrictions but more in a ‘gee that must be nice’ way vs. a serious case of being sad/mad/angry about it.

         2. Yes, to the genetics. My side of the family was never athletic (dad was a librarian) but my son never stops moving at age 24. In addition to the gym, he does intramural sports 2-3 nights a week, climbs regularly and says yes to every activity. I imagine this will continue throughout his life.

   2. I do stuff. Manually. Walk places. Ride my bike places. Do my own yardwork. Lift the big things that need lifting. etc, etc. When I don’t have time to “work out”, that gives me a baseline of fitness that allows me to build pretty quickly when I do actually want to train for something. Just putting away your car keys for a few days a week will go a long way toward your goal.
      When I do have time to train, the key is small, incremental increases and to never increase intensity and distance (or weight & reps if that’s your thing) at the same time. As I’ve gotten older (45 now), I’m more cautious about being gradual with increases, but it still comes back reasonably quickly.

   3. I wouldn’t call myself “super in shape,” but I am mid-50s and still basically the same size and shape I was in college (but much stronger) and can do whatever I want in terms of active vacations, work around the house etc.

      My husband and I exercise together. Three days a week run; two days a week HIIT and hand weight intervals; one day a week yoga video. Since the pandemic, we do it together alone (ie no gym or other people) very early every morning except Sunday. I doubt I would be so dedicated if I were trying to do this alone. It is nice together time to talk about our days, current events, plans for the future, whatever. Our intention is that it keeps us healthy as we age.

   4. I have to spend a lot on an unlimited class membership, where I’ll feel guilty if I skip for no good reason. I’ve had seasons where I am able to follow a lifting program on my own and be motivated that way, but it’s very structured, I can’t go in without a plan. But I do my best, and try my hardest, if I’m in a class setting and the class is “expensive” (~$150ish a month). I fully believe that you have to find what you like as a workout, and what works best for you. DH doesn’t need classes or an expensive gym to motivate himself, which I admire.

   5. Most of the adults I’ve known who are what it seems like you mean by “serious athletes” (as opposed to regular exercisers in good shape and/or people who are good at a recreational sport) are obsessed with exercise and diet to an unhealthy degree. That’s really what it takes to be in the kind of shape where you can just run 13.1 miles or hike 20 miles without training specifically for the event, to have that characteristic stringy appearance, etc.

      1. Yup this is also my experience.

      2. Yeah, and that’s so unappealing to me!

      3. It really isn’t. There is a lot of disordered behavior in the community, but it’s not necessary in order to perform at a high level.

         1. I don’t think OP is just talking about performing at a high level, though. It sounds like she admires the obsessive behavior and wants to establish that “discipline.”

            1. OP here, and no, lol. I just want to be ready to go on adventures when I’m invited.

            2. OP You can. Just say yes and go do it!

            3. You can be active without having a strict regimen. Just *do* things! You become active by being active.

      4. Love how we can’t rag on anyone for being obese but totally fine to rag on people for being fit. It’s like people are so used to seeing the 66% of this country that is obese or overweight, they forget what a normal fit body looks like.

         DH might be ‘stringy’ to you but running is crucial to his mental health and his BMI is well within the healthy range.

         1. Thank you. I can say this as a relatively competitive runner: it’s not at all true. Very few people are unhealthy, obsessed, or “stringy,” even those who are great at the sport. Lean, yes, stringy, no.

            1. I am that sort of recreational athlete that OP describes, and my BMI is ‘obese’ level! (Partly because BMI is BS and one of my main activities is power lifting, but still… I am definitely not stringy lol.)

               As for how to do it, I think the best answer to what OP wants is probably to just make time to walk a lot – a normal part of my day is a morning and afternoon walk. I usually work out in the evening, right after work, but if I’m not doing that I will usually go on a 3rd walk. If you add that to the rest of what you describe, you will very likely have that ‘ready for anything’ level of fitness you’re aiming for.

            2. Thanks 11:15 anon! This is really helpful.

         2. thank you for saying that. it is not necessary obsessive to exercise and eat to support fitness and health.

         3. That’s absolutely it. People of normal healthy weight are called “stringy” or other negative names simply because Americans are used to seeing obese people. Totally warped perception.

         4. mostly people coping to justify their own lifestyles, which seems unnecessary given that the majority of people in the US are now overweight. There’s nothing to justify IMO

      5. Disagree on hiking 20 miles. I am 50ish and a serious desk worker for decades. If you aren’t carrying a 30 pound pack or going very vertical, it is a whole day of walking or something done in a weekend, but it is not something heroic. My exercise is walking a large dog a few miles a day at a New Yorker’s waking speed but with frequent stops. And living in a 2-story house.

         1. +1 that you neither have to be in incredible shape nor do you have to train a ton for a 20 mile hike. It’s challenging, for sure, but doable.

         2. I’ve walked over 10 miles partying in New Orleans multiple times, pretty sure I could walk 20 miles sober tomorrow.

            1. I laughed way too hard at this.

            2. And that too in sneakers (not high heels).

         3. yeah I’m a pretty big couch potato but I walked 20 miles spontaneously on a trip a few years ago. It was really not that hard. As a point of reference, I do not think I could run a mile under 10 minutes if you had a gun to my head. But walking at a slow pace I can do pretty much indefinitely…

      6. So fit and underweight = unhealthy but fit and overweight = BMI is garbage and overweight people can be healthy. Makes lots of sense.

         1. Huh?

            1. Her point is obvious and I cracked up laughing.

      7. I don’t agree that this is true. I have, as have several of my friends, run half marathons either without training or by barely training. I don’t live in an area with much hiking but take every other year national park hiking trips and have done 15-18 mile hikes without training (so I imagine I could do 20).

         My BMI is overweight and has been for 4 years. I only started lifting and focusing on protein 6 months ago so 3.5 of those years of being overweight is was due to fat not muscle.

         While I’ve recently started thinking about nutrition, I still have ice cream almost every night, go out for drinks with friends several days a week, eat Doritos and burgers and fries.

      8. Agree with this. And if they’re married, or have kids, the workouts take priority over the family, which is super effed up, if you ask me.

         1. I dated this dude. I felt like I was his side piece and his running was his main squeeze.

         2. Ha, agree, I have an older child now who also enjoys playing tennis so that’s easy enough to do together. I have mom friends who’s husbands golf and dissappeared for a full round once or twice(!!) a weekend when the kids were very small. It was always a complaint/fight and I simple couldn’t understand how the dads felt they were entitled to just dip out on 4-8 hours of family time every weekend!

         3. It’s ok to work out if you have a family and kids! I can run a half marathon or hike 20 miles. I exercise for maybe 5 hours a week. Sometimes I hike with my family or jog while my kid rides a bike on a trail. It’s totally ok for me to do those things without my kids, though. I don’t think it’s mentally healthy to never be able to do anything for yourself.

            1. I totally agree. I think it’s much healthier to spend a decent amount of time on your own fitness each week (not just a snatched 10 mins here or there).

            2. 5 hours a week is fine. It’s the 3-hour long runs or rides, the golf outings, the two-a-day workouts, the refusal to schedule workouts around family obligations, etc. that are problematic.

            3. Pretty sure golf outings are an excuse to day drink rather than be adventurous or achieve a high level of fitness. l don’t see how taking 3 hours to yourself on a Saturday means you can no longer be married, care for children, cook, or have friends. It’s not true. The mom-shaming is really not cool. You may not want to ever spend 3 hours running and that’s fine, but people who choose to do that aren’t horrible people.

            4. Something else to point out: runners of the not-pro variety can schedule their long runs around family obligations. We have a toddler. I do long runs on Saturday mornings when he’s either asleep or vegging out with DH and watching Paw Patrol. Sometimes I go out when he naps. Other parents do Sunday long runs or get up at 5 am when the rest of the family is asleep. A lot of moms will drop their kids at baseball practice and use that hour to get in a workout.

         4. Yeah, god forbid anybody have a hobby or that two married people have an agreement you don’t like! You and the person you’re replying to sound jealous or something. It’s weird to be so viscerally negative about something that’s just different from the way you live your life.

         5. Good grief. You wouldn’t say that it’s unhealthy and effed up for a woman to spend time with her friends, get a massage or a facial, or take away from family time for weekly manicures.

            The jealousy on this thread is astonishing.

            1. I don’t know any moms who get massages, facials, or weekly manicures.

            2. Yeah, I don’t know any mom who gets weekly manicures or facials or massages. I don’t think exercise is worse than any other hobby, but it can be more time-consuming than a lot of things, and having one parent absent for a large chunk of the weekend can be tough, especially with little kids. My husband is very involved and equal parent but he’s also a serious athlete who plays a sport on both weekend afternoons and it was hard on our marriage once we had kids, and is a major factor in why didn’t have a second child (because being solo with a 3 year old is a lot easier than being solo with a 3 year old and a newborn).

      9. This is just so not true, especially not if you’re only talking about a half marathon or a 20 mile hike! And that appearance you’re talking about comes down to genetics.

         1. yeah, DH trained for his first marathon last year and it took over his schedule in a way that became somewhat disruptive to the rest of our lives (including work, socializing and one on one time, and we don’t even have kid or other big responsibilities). But staying fit enough for a half is much more manageable!

            1. This is a problem with your husband’s schedule, not parents who run marathons. I train 5-7 hours per week and run 2 marathons a year, plus other races. The only time it cuts into my family life is at most an hour on some Saturday mornings when my kids happen to awake before I get back from my long run. Races turn into family time. We have taken family trips for racing and the kids legit enjoy being at the finish line, to the point that I don’t want to do a destination race with friends because the kids would be sad to miss it.

            2. Sure, my husband is definitely not a morning person, so workouts have to fit in on evenings and weekends. What you are describing may work great for your family, but it sounds like you have been doing this for a while and are used to it. If one were to make this a new habit, the contrast to regular couch potato life is absolutely there. Something has to give.

            3. +1 to “I run a lot”’s comment. My kid loves destination races and hanging out at finish line parties.

            4. Anonshmanon I weirdly feel like it’s easier to fit it in now that I have kids. I’m not a morning person but now I wake up at 5 or 6 AM so hey, I have the whole morning right there. Before kids I would enjoy lazing around but seeing how kids make that impossible, I’m taking what opportunities I can get.

   6. I do workout videos on Fitness Blender. I joined FB Plus and usually follow one of their workout programs. I work out 4-5 days a week. I WFH so I do it in the morning before starting work. I went from not working out a all to get to this point over the course of a few years. I am not interested in working out every day of the week or running marathons.. Sounds like your friend is really into it, but that doesn’t mean you have to be. If you are happy with your level of fitness, then I don’t think you need to change anything.

   7. I’m not someone who works out “a lot” but I’ve had seasons of being pretty active and I’ve found the best way is to just make it part of your routine and never vary. I take the same classes every week and usually prepay them so I can’t cancel without losing the money. I pick things I generally enjoy so I’m looking forward to it, and I don’t schedule other things at those times unless it’s a very special occasion. I also have a dog who needs walks so I take a long walk or gentle jog every day irrespective of the weather.

   8. A few reasons:

      – I found what I love to do around home, mountain biking, and it’s no problem getting motivated. It’s something I grew up doing with my father and rekindling something that once brought joy makes me happy. Risk and adventure are key values for me.
      – I get outside every single day, rain or shine, even if it’s just for the neighborhood walk.
      – I spend enough money to support the things I really love. I bought a good bike, I got good camping gear, and I have a great pair of skis. These enable me to go and have the most fun possible.
      – I am realistic with myself. I hate the elliptical and indoor cycling so I don’t try to force myself to do them anymore.
      – I injured my back rock climbing and have dealt with lower back pain ever since. I have to at least walk every single day and do physical therapy exercises to maintain it. I seem to have been hit with an unusually bad case and it takes concerted maintenance effort now.
      – I like who I am when I go on adventures in the outdoors with my husband and best friends.

      1. Also, after reading the other comments about disordered eating, I want to mention that my BMI is on the higher end of overweight and that I don’t diet. It took a long time for me to get to that point, but intuitive eating has been a real godsend that has increased my enjoyment of the outdoors because I properly fuel my adventures and can enjoy the post-backpacking burger and fries with abandon. My body seems happy and I’m happy. That said, I wouldn’t be able to do a marathon on short notice and that’s OK.

         1. I am another person who works out a lot but also eats intuitively and my BMI is on the higher end of overweight (and always has been – I am the same size and weight I was at 20 years old, but that’s always been a larger size/higher weight than many people are).

            I don’t work out to be thinner or meet someone’s beauty ideal; I do it because I love working out and being outdoors, and I want to be able to do what I want to do in the outdoors, as long as I can. My usual schedule is: gym Sunday evening (and in good weather, I go to the gym in addition to doing a hike or bike ride in the morning); home workouts (I usually do short HIIT or kettlebell videos) Tuesday and Thursday; gym Friday, some kind of outdoor thing on Saturday, even if it’s just walking the dogs on our nearest hiking trail, or going to the pool for a swim. I don’t have joint problems other than in the knee I injured playing softball in high school (ruptured meniscus). I can lift anything I need to lift, for the most part, and go as far as I want to go when I’m hiking or cycling. Could I run a marathon with minimal training? No, but I hate running so would never run a marathon regardless. For me, exercise is a release, a relief and a huge contributor to me having good mental health and lower stress levels. That means I am healthier person, overall. The key, for me, is doing things I love and not things I have to force myself to do. Or holding myself to someone else’s standard of fitness, or appearance. I live my life for me, not based on what other people do or think. It’s pretty freeing; more folks should try it.

            1. I am Anon at 11:18 and just want to add: I work full-time, am married, and have one child. I actually started doing more outdoor activities when our son was younger and got old enough to hike and ride bikes. He now goes to the gym with my husband and I on Sunday nights, and then goes additional days by himself. It was not easy when he was little, to get workouts in, but I will say – we had an excellent daycare at the gym we went to, at a Jewish Community Center, and it did not harm him at all to be in the daycare for an hour on a Saturday morning while my husband and I worked out. Throughout his childhood we had bike seats, jogging strollers, a bike trailer (and then a “trailing bike” that attached to my husband’s bike), so we could take him with us when we went out. As a result, our kid is athletic and healthy and has a natural affinity for being active, which I think is a great thing to seed into kids, if you can, since being active helps people stay healthier over the long term. Also: going for a family bike ride is cheaper than going to the zoo, museum or amusement park for the eleventy-billionth time.

   9. I think it depends a lot on your background too. I’m not quite like this, but I am close, but I am a former D1 athlete as are all of my friends / relatives who work out all of the time. The mentality of being fit, working out, following a workout plan, watching what we eat (to fuel ourselves, not for weight loss) is pretty ingrained in us. My friends who casually workout were not college athletes (though most, but not all, were high school athletes). Likewise, my parents (in their 60s) and aunts and uncles (in their 70s) are active, so I grew up surrounded by people who were fit and active. For example, my mom can kick my butt in quite a few athletic pursuits, my aunt and uncle bike 20 miles a day, 3x a week, my other uncle plays competitive basketball 2x a week and lifts and runs 2x a week. My grandfather played tennis and lifted weekly until his late 80s.

      For me it’s partially social, partially a hobby, and partially something I do for myself. I also love a challenge so a hard race or an outdoor workout in bad weather brings me a lot of job (I like type 2 fun). I love working out outdoors, it brings me a lot of joy. Also, most of my friends are active so I have a standing running date with one friend and standing lifting date with another friend. I compete in a variety of races, and frequently (but not always) race with friends. Another close friend of mine is a soccer teammate (rec league,but competitive. I’m one of the few who didn’t play soccer in college … because I played a different sport).

      I appreciate the accountability of a class or a workout scheduled with a friend. I never skip those, but I do sometimes skip workouts by myself. It’s also so important to choose activities that you enjoy. If you don’t like running, don’t force yourself to run. I love the activities I do (or at least the races I do and thus I need to train for them).

      As for what I do and when I do it: on Mondays I do a long run with a friend (usually with dinner afterwards), Tuesdays lift with a friend at 7AM, on Wednesdays I usually do a quick lift and then go to yoga with a friend after work (with drinks after), on Thursdays I play soccer after work. I usually take Fridays off, or do a quick lift or spin at home. On weekends I sometimes take off or I do a “hobby” that is a workout: long bike ride or run on a trail, play tennis with my mom, hike, kayaking. That’s when I’m not training for something; I also compete in trail runs, triathlons,and half marathons so will shift my training a little (but honestly, not a ton) to accomodate training plans.

      My Monday, Tuesdays, and Thursdays are non-negotiable for me. Pretty much everything else is flexible: Do I have social plans instead? Am I tired and want to sleep in? I also walk 25 minutes to and from work 4 days a week, so even on days I”m not working out I”m still getting steps in. I have friends who sacrifice their social life for training, but that will never be me.

      I’ve recently started also watching what I eat (I’ve always been a healthy eater but now focusing on protein) and trying to be better about recovery (stretching, adding in yoga).

      I”m also just a generally active person (which I definitely got from my family). I meet up with a friend for a walk as frequently as I meet up with a friend for a drink. I don’t really enjoy watching TV so I spend my free time being active. I own a car, but live in a walkable city so I walk literally everywhere I go if it’s under an hour walk.

      FWIW, I’m late 20s and single with no pets or children. Job is reasonably demanding but less so than my last job. Job pays enough that I have money to join a gym that offers classes and register for races (not cheap!), but not enough that I can really train how I’d like to or have the equipment I’d really like.

      1. Thanks for sharing– this is all super interesting. I come from an unathletic family, with about half of them being obese, and it’s helpful to recognize where my sense of “normal” comes from. And I was raised with this mentality of not pushing myself too hard. Like, if I ran yesterday I can’t possibly run again today, because I ~need~ to rest. I think just acknowledging this is helpful to shifting to a mindset that it’s good and healthy to push yourself out of your comfort zone; maybe that’s what I need to be able to shift to a higher gear athletically.

   10. I was really into going to a gym with tons of workout classes, or back in the day, class pass. I went to one most days when I was childless, and sometimes warmed up before with a jog or some cardio. I also did some races with friends and coworkers. On nice days I’d bike to the park to picnic and read. It was a lot of fun and I was in incredible shape. I think to be a “serious” athlete you have to find things you enjoy, it’s a lifestyle. But with a higher level of fitness it becomes fun to see what your body can do.

       1. “But with a higher level of fitness it becomes fun to see what your body can do.”

          Absolutely. I will add to this that with a higher level of skill, it becomes fun to see what your body can do. It’s amazing to me that a regular person like myself, not someone who is extraordinarily gifted athletically, can hurtle down a frozen mountain on flat sticks strapped to my feet. What a gift to be able to have that experience.

       2. Another +1 to your last sentence. I love when someone warns me “that’s heavy” and then I pick it up easily. MAN does that feel good.

       3. I totally agree that it’s so fun to push yourself and see what you can do!

          And Anon 10:11, +100 to what a gift this is. I’m quite thankful to have a body and a life that lets me push myself. I have definitely looked down and thanked my legs for being able to carry me through a hard workout. I don’t take this for granted and thus like to make the most of this gift by getting out there and getting after it.

   11. I think people who are incredibly fit, regardless of BMI, weight, etc, make it their life! Cutting out socializing with friends, reading, watching tv, cooking, etc. Training becomes their only hobby and it can be really tough to maintain relationships. People will cut things out for a few months to train for a marathon but then resume their normal lifestyles once it’s over. If you want to get in this type of shape, you have to make these sacrifices. Personally, I’m not willing to do that and probably wouldn’t be in a relationship with someone who did.

       1. I disagree but I guess it also depends on what we all mean by “very fit”. I am fairly fit (run half marathons and sprint triathlons) but have friends who are “very fit” (marathons, century rides, olympic triathlons) and I’d say most people spend 5-10 hours a week training or working out (I literally just went on to their strava profiles to calculate). Two of these friends have qualified and run the Boston Marathon, so they’re training hard.

          They still have time to date, socialize with friends, take care of a dog, cook, read, watch TV, lie on the couch and veg. A few of them even have demanding jobs, for example one is a medical resident and another is a med student and they are managing to do this.

          FWIW, I train ~ 5-6 hours a week, work full time, am in grad school part time and also still have time to socialize, date, cook, read / watch TV / veg out, and sleep 8 hours a night. I wish I could train more, but I can’t right now so I settle for this.

          1. Ok well then put my in my place and teach me your ways lol idk how people do it!

             1. Not the person above. I train for about four to five hours a week.

                What made my life easier: getting out the door as fast as possible. Don’t waste time whining about the workout, doomscrolling, reading my running books to plan the workout, trying to find clothes for the workout. To the latter point: buy a lot of shorts, t shirts, and sports bras. Always have something clean. Just throw it on and get out the door.

                There are 168 hours in a week. Fitness takes up about 3% of those.

             2. Here’s a pretty basic, popular guide on how to train for a marathon as a beginner: https://www.halhigdon.com/training-programs/marathon-training/novice-1-marathon/

                You’re working out for 4 days a week. The first week would take about 2.5 hours if you run a 10 minute mile, which is not fast. I think the peak week with the most mileage is maybe about 7 hours a week, but if you want to be generous say 10. It might feel like you’re running for a thousand hours on some of those longer runs, but in terms of actual time spent it’s not a crazy time commitment.

             3. My commute is 40 minutes on the bike per day. Other errands are another maybe 1-2 hours per week. That’s nearly 5 hours of fairly high intensity (there are lots of hills where I live) without any workouts just for the sake of working out. Right now I don’t have time for exercise just for exercise’s sake, but I *do* have to get from point a to point b.
                Don’t start by commuting on bike/foot every day. Start with one day, then two and so on.

       2. Lol you can be really fit and still have time to watch tv and have friends. Why does everybody here think you can’t?

          1. +1 marathon training is about 10 hours a week, if that. That leaves plenty of time for most people to have social lives, spend time with family and have other hobbies.

          2. Seriously. I am very fit and I have an incredibly full life outside of working out.

          3. I think some people get more energy the more they work out. I’ve experienced this before so I know what it feels like, but for most of my adult life, even when exercising regularly, each time I worked out it left me completely exhausted, literally too tired to even watch TV. So it was always a decision between being in shape and having a life; I simply didn’t have the energy to do both.

             1. I have WAY more energy when I work out than when I don’t. A couple months back, I got hip tendonitis and had to do a three-week “total rest” regimen to rehab – my doctor did not want me doing anything exercise-wise, other than PT. I felt so sluggish and exhausted being out of my normal routine, it was shocking to me. I was so glad to be able to get back to working out when my hip got better.

                My husband and I are mid-40s/early-50s and we have seen this for ourselves: mobility is use-it-or-lose-it. My parents have stayed active and they’re doing great and are very healthy in their early 70s; they walk 5 miles several times a week and can still go for pretty lengthy hikes on the trails near their house. My husband’s mom never exercised, and by the time she was in her mid-70s she was housebound and needed a walker. The less you do, the less you are capable of doing, to the point that then basic mobility becomes a challenge. Even walking around the block for 15 or 30 minutes a day is better than absolutely nothing.

             2. It makes sense to me that if exercise makes people feel better and not worse, then they’d keep up with it better!

                Can you understand that some people have the reverse experience where the sluggishness and exhaustion happens when we workout consistently, but that we feel a lot more energy when we workout less?

                Walking 15-30 minutes a day is basic mobility and not a workout in my book.

             3. I get way more energy during my day and am less sluggish but I am absolutely exhausted by bedtime, which means that I can’t do as many things later in the evening. Even on weekends, staying up “late” is a no-go for me. When out with friends I’m always among the first to leave the bar as a result, which I don’t love.

             4. I’m the same way.

             5. +1000 to use it or lose it. I was always surprised that people post here about their parents in their 70s having mobility problems or not being able to babysit grandkids. Aside from bad luck, genetics, or medical issues like cancer every 70 something I know is able to do quite a bit physically (play tennis, go on 10-15 mile bike rides, hike) whereas here people post about parents in their 70s unable to live daily life

             6. I thought I was the only one who experienced this!!

             7. I think it’s a lot of genetics, medical conditions, and also access to good healthcare (not just “any” healthcare). My grandparents saw doctors, but they were not fabulous and dropped a lot of balls! I’m getting vastly better treatment for the same conditions that run in the family (and it’s not as though it’s new treatments that didn’t exist back then either). Where I’m from, it stood out when people were active in their sixties or seventies, and many symptoms and complaints were blamed on “aging” as if that were a complete explanation and people shouldn’t expect to age in good health. I was amazed when I went to college that many people had healthy, active grandparents!

                My grandparents definitely exercised more than I do over the course of their lives (active, working class work vs. office job work, lots of kids vs. none, etc.), but my life is easier and I’m aging much better so far.

       3. it is possible to make training social. tons of running and cycling group programs. socialization does not mean sitting on the couch or eating.

   12. I normally work out six days a week depending on what program I am doing. I would consider myself somewhere in the middle of “serious” and “casual”. I look quite fit and am regarded by many friends and peers as being “into” fitness but I only dedicate 30-45 minutes a day (Sweat App) with two or three cycles of 75 Hard per year which add another 45 minutes per day in the form of a walk/ski/run. I just had a baby so am doing nothing right now but dying to get back. I just fit it in whenever I can and that can look like a lot of different things. When in the office three days a week, I would do it during lunch (in the Army so this is institutionalized), sometimes I plan/organize supper but hand it over to my husband to execute and do it while he cooks, sometimes I just do it all after supper or when kids go to bed. With a newborn, I will start to do one weight workout while he naps in two weeks. After about a month I will start a 75 Hard and do one walk or cycle at night in addition to the weights.

       I have always been into fitness and active (also job requirement) but three years ago I decided to make it a more prominent, entrenched priority and started the Sweat App and followed the original program for one year without missing a work out and now it is just a fact of life like laundry. I just do it. But it has to be easy and flexible as our family grows and the oldest get more into competitive sports. I can’t make it an entire hobby or have to make appointment times at a gym etc.

       1. I mean 75hard is literally toxic. Do you but it’s straight up disordered

          1. I think the guy is hilariously cheesy and silly but getting off your butt twice a day, going outside, and watching what you eat is not disordered. I feel great doing it a few times a year and have done it for a few years now. (Mind you, I don’t take pictures etc so Tony whatever his name is probably would not approve). But it basically means I go out for a walk a day so it’s really not a big deal!

       2. Congrats on the baby!!!

          1. Thank you! He is a little darling!

          2. +1! Welcome baby Seafinch!

       3. We’re at different life stages and it sounds like we do different stuff, but I totally +1 making physical activity a fact of life like laundry or brushing your teeth. It’s just part of what I do on a daily basis. For some context, I’ve always been pretty active and was a competitive athlete in high school, but not college.

          I go through phases where I train more like a serious athlete, like the last time I did a marathon, but most of the time I’m happy with being generally active and fit–some type of workout five-ish days a week on top of a few miles of dog walking, some type of physical activity the other two-ish days (long walks with the dog, restorative yoga, gentle hack out on the horsie). If I’m tired or have plans, I’ll skip a workout. I can certainly hike 20 miles in a day and were I not rehabbing a running injury, I would run enough that I could hop in a half marathon at a whim.

          Honestly, I really enjoy pushing myself to see what my body can do, and I’m a much happier person if I’m working out regularly. But I have no interest in sustaining the amount of mental, emotional, and physical energy it takes for me to feel like a “serious” athlete on a long-term basis. When I was marathon training, that was more like: run six days a week, at least three sessions of strength training, and at least two sessions of restorative yoga, which meant I was doubling up a few days a week. If I have a goal that requires me to train like that, I’ll do it, but I don’t currently have the desire…and I’m injured anyway so I couldn’t even if I wanted to :)

   13. Your friend sounds like somebody who has a good level of fitness but also is just willing to say yes to things and willing to be uncomfortable. If you’re truly running a half marathon with no training, you’re gonna have a bad time. It will hurt. Same with the hike. It is doable. You will be sore. The people here who think this level of fitness is disordered or that you couldn’t even have time to have friends are out of their minds and/or have no idea what is actually required to do those things.

       1. You make a great point about being willing to say yes and being willing to hurt (not as in become injured, but to be temporarily uncomfortable).

          I ran my first half marathon with very limited training. Basically I had been running 3 miles 3 days a week 6 months prior to the race but then spent the 4 months leading up to the race doing literally nothing due to a sprained ankle and then a crazy busy period at work. I did the half and it hurt like heck while I was running / a day or two after but it was so rewarding knowing I finished it.

          I went into the race knowing it wouldn’t be pretty and that I’d likely have to walk some (which I did!), but I wanted to try anyways. I even knew I might have to drop out and DNF and I was okay with that outcome too. I’d rather have jumped in and tried it and come up short than have not tried at all. I knew if I tried, it’d be very uncomfortable and I was okay with that too.

          If you’re generally fit + okay with jumping in, saying yes and going with it + okay with discomfort + are okay with having to walk or have a plan if you legitimately can’t finish you’ll generally be fine.

       2. Yeah thanks for this! Very good point, the friend in question is tough as nails, and is always down for type 2 fun. Sounds like I just need to say yes to more things and not be so afraid of bringing up the rear.

       3. I am the one who commented about disordered behavior and I am thinking of the people I have known who were capable of just going out and running a half-marathon *without* being miserable. One of them had completed an Ironman and did two multi-hour workouts a day. Another was constantly skipping work for long bike rides, could not talk about anything but exercise, and used to criticize me for eating a salad with an avocado and nuts on it for lunch. I have known more folks like this, and nearly all of them have been men.

          Being fit enough to slog miserably through a half-marathon is something different, but that didn’t seem like what OP was asking.

          1. I’m nowhere near as intense as the two people you mention, and if I’m at my preferred level of running fitness I can easily hop in a half marathon and not slog through it, although I won’t be anywhere near my PR time. My preferred level of running fitness = long run of 8-10 miles on the weekend, 2 4-ish mile weekday runs, and a 6-ish mile weekday run. I like running and have a certain level of natural aptitude for it, so that’s an easy schedule for me to maintain paired with a couple of days a week of strength training and restorative yoga. I definitely talk about more than exercise and eat a lot of avocados and peanut butter (and also Klondike bars) (to say nothing of the wine). I think your sample isn’t necessarily as representative as you think it is, Anonymous.

          2. Yeah, that’s obviously disordered and any actual athlete knows that they need to appropriately fuel their body and nuts and avocados are an excellent way to get necessary healthy fats and a salad as a meal without fat and protein would never be adequate.

             My friends and I frequently share tips to ensure we’re getting enough of the nutrients we need for our workouts. I aim for 100g of protein a day, and that takes a lot of work so we all share tips on how to get there.

             I have friends who run 50ish miles a weeks when they aren’t actively training for things and thus could up and run a half marathon without hurting. They are definitely eating plenty of avocado, cheese, nuts, and other calorically dense foods in addition to proteins, fruits and veggies, and whole grains. But, they’re also having dessert and wine and fries too! Most people who also run 50 miles a week eat similarly.

   14. OP, based on reading your replies here I say to just go for it! It sounds like you already have a great base-level fitness and if you want to increase your training that’s great but I’d bet you can hang with your friends when they invite you to fun adventures as is.

       Of the friends I do this stuff with, I”m usually the “least fit” and no one cares if I have to take a breather or can’t quite keep up. They’re usually just happy to have another friend to go with!

       Also, you’d be surprised at how well the training you do translates. You can probably hang with them pretty well given your current fitness levels! For example, I bike on flat (next to a river, so very very flat) paved / gravel trail. I went mountain biking with a friend, despite never biking on terrain or hills, and was able to keep up decently well. I hadn’t skied since high school and went with a few friends this winter and while I stayed on greens and blues, they were happy to stay with me and enjoy the day (even if they normally ski on blacks).

       My hiking friends don’t work out much, so I”m the fitter friend there. I’m happy to either go at their pace or go ahead and loop back to them. I’m just happy to have a friend to hike with!

   15. +1 for genetics. My husband has more than once run a marathon with virtually no training (think one run a week for two or three months). He can skip all exercise for a year or more and then go out and run 5 miles. He does not understand why it takes me months of training to be able to run 3 miles without walking, and why that training usually results in a case of bronchitis.

       1. Yup. My husband is a former DI distance runner. He ran his first marathon in 3:40-something. His longest training run was eight miles.

          I was proud of him but I also wanted to punt him off a dock.

          1. LOL. You just described my brother and my feelings about him perfectly.

   16. I am single & have no kids, so I can afford to spend 1hour every day on sports/working out. I walk to & from the office and then add a work out of choice every day. Weekends, I either do hiking or long walk one day and a workout the other day. I do things that need minimal prep and I have all equipment at home: spinning, weight training, yoga, core training. I used to run (did several half-marathons, marathons, ultras) and had daily runs either alone or with friends.
       I think key is to have activities that you really enjoy and can do easily. If I had to go to gym, I would have 10 excuses every day. But having all needed at home eliminates that barrier. I also “invested” in yearly Les Mills on-demand subscription, so I don’t have to create my workouts, I just follow a virtual class. But key is – I enjoy the activities and am disciplined and have the luxury of having an hour for working out every day.

   17. To answer your actual question rather than just getting irked at some of these responses: I decided that I wanted to be an active person. I was previously very unhealthy. About 12 years ago, I decided I just didn’t want to be sedentary, waking up every morning to go to a job I didn’t care about so I learned to love it. I started running before work and I signed up for a half marathon. You get to decide who you want to be! I run 35 – 50 miles a week depending on the time of year and where I am at in my training cycle. I have 2 kids, a happy family, I work full-time, and I still read a lot of books. :) I don’t watch TV and I don’t work insane hours.

       1. “you get to decide who you want to be” is so great. Thank you!

   18. I try to make it as low-preparation and low-time consumption as possible. For example, the gym is a 20 minute walk from my house, but actually going to the gym adds at least an hour onto working out (40 min there and back, 20 min showering at the gym, not to mention preparing my gym bag because there is no way to store things like shampoo and shower shoes at my gym). If I jog and do weights, that’s 2-2.5 hours. That means Saturday and Sunday are the realistic days I can go.
       So I am much more likely to go for a quick jog before or after work, which requires no prep time. Sometimes I even do a quick weight routine first thing still in my pajamas (you can do a lot with 8 lb dumbbells).
       I don’t think you get from casual to serious athlete without actually putting in the time (and being realistic that the time can mean HOURS).

   19. Atomic Habits – change what are tasks or activities into part of your identity. I’m not a person who works out a lot, I’m a fit and healthy person.

       I’m one of those 10-hr a week people (running Boston on Monday!) – I train with my speedy husband and it’s part of something we do together. We meal prep on Sundays, drinking wine and singing along to Jimmy Buffet radio. Hanging out with the kids we might go for a bike ride, or practice lacrosse, or go for a run together.

       Running and training makes me feel great in my (43yo) body and clears my mind. I do not remotely feel like I’ve missed something or have no time for “things I enjoy”. So to answer OP’s question, it’s part of who you are.

       1. GOOD LUCK on Monday!!! Have fun!

3. Help me build a capsule wardrobe for business trips! I’m starting a new job which is majority remote but with about 2 months total of in person trips. Most trips will be 2-3 weeks at max. For those trips I’ll have to dress somewhat business formal, and I literally don’t own any business clothes that fit me right now.

   What should I get? The trips are to a pretty warm climate

   – A light colored suit
   – I have some slacks, but need more tops
   – 2-3 work dresses
   – I can’t do heels, but some type of work shoes

   1. What will the laundry situation be during those trips? I’ve seen advice to start by building a library of 7 outfits and just revolving those, but the number – and composition – of those will depend on the laundry situation. Eg I’m a sweaty person so would be doing exclusively skirts and dresses because I can wash the shorts that go underneath in hotel sinks.

   2. I don’t travel to *this* extent for work, but I do enough (and internationally) that I have a capsule down pat. I travel carryon only, and use an Away Carry On (the regular small size), or sometimes the Away Daily Carry On.

      Choose a color scheme that works for you, your location, and the frequency of laundry you’ll be able to do (…light colored suit might not last long!). I’m navy, ivory, and olive green. Sometimes the navy becomes black, depends on the trip.

      Minimize the number of pieces so that choices are easy and packing is a breeze. If you can make it work, dresses plus blazer(s) or jardigan(s) minimize need for pieces. If you’re a separates person, think in layers and columns of color to make it easy. I usually do 3 pairs of lightweight but nice pants (pull on) with simple blouses that match each so that it ends up looking a little like a jumpsuit…cover that with a blazer or jardigan and a simple accessory and it’s good.

      1 or 2 casual items, like a pair of jeans for evenings or sidequests, go with all the tops and blazers and shoes.

      Shoes are the hard part for me, and are so personal to each of us. What works for me is the Rothys almond loafer in a neutral color (a taupe) or the core color of my capsule (navy), and a pair of Vionic pointy toe flats in a reptile skin that works with my capsule (happens to be a charcoal/ivory/blackish snakeskin). That plus a pair of cute but comfy sneaks to travel in–Cole Haan grandpro topspins work for me!–and I’m good.

      Safe and stylish travels!

      1. I like all these ideas! Definitely going to lean into dresses and blazers/jardigans. I have a lot of red/pink and its my favorite color – what are some good neutrals with that?

         1. Camel, grey, navy, and white all go with red and pink (camel TBD for shade of pink).

         2. You’ll get more mileage out of red or pink on a trip and doing the rest as neutrals. It’s harder to pair a red blouse and pink pants or pink blosue and pink pants over several days than say a natural with either or two neutrals together. I’d focus on keeping to as many neutrals as you can–like gray, olive and black or navy can usually mix better with each other well or as a solid.

      2. I used to be a road warrior. I used to come home on the weekends though. But my travel clothing was pretty much the same as PomPom describes. I didn’t usually pack casual clothes though because there was never casual time. Sneakers and workout stuff took up too much room in my roller, and I was 100% carry on, all the time.

         Since at the time I mostly wore skirts, I traveled in a nice but stretchy pair of pants (Eileen Fisher) and packed two skirts in my chosen neutrals – black and charcoal for winters/wearing tights, lighter gray and navy for summer. I had tops/blouses that I could mix and match with the skirts. Then a couple of soft jackets like a sweater blazer. If I was taking a “hard” blazer, I wore it on the flight. I wore a pair of shoes that worked with everything and packed one pair. One pair of pajamas, one pair of flip flops to be worn as slippers or fire escape shoes – yes, it happens regularly! (Not actual fire, but actual fire alarm.) I had a full makeup and skincare case that lived in my suitcase, as well as toothbrush, toothpaste, floss, and some basic medications like Aleve and heartburn chewables. Feminine products. I didn’t want to have to remember to pack any of these because I inevitably forgot some so these were dedicated travel items.

         You can re-wear your base neutrals! Change the top, mix and match, and no one will ever nigive.

   3. Depends on what you mean by somewhat formal, if you’re actually talking formal, that’s a lot harder. I pack for long trips with a a bunch of coordinating neutrals. I like pointed toe flats for a polished look, and I also wear sneakers a lot with slacks and a blazer. Basically gurranimals for adults.

      1. It’s not lawyer-business-formal, but it should still involve blazers and work dresses like what you get from Banana Republic etc

   4. I take jersey dresses to any work conference. They don’t wrinkle in transit, and it’s a one item and done outfit. They also transition nicely from conference sessions to HH/dinner events.

   5. I used to travel a lot in very warm climates (Southeast Asia). My “uniform” consisted of knit synthetic v-neck 3/4 sleeve faux-wrap dresses with a jackety top (jardigan, swing jacket, linen-ish jacket, etc.) or just solo, or sometimes with a pashmina-like wrap. I also would pack/wear ponte knit sleeveless sheath dresses with a jacket/jardigan on top. Sandals with a block heel, especially platformy sandals were acceptable (and could save my feet if a tropical thunderstorm flooded the sidewalks). (I always brought a folding umbrella and a pair of flip flops in my tote if I need to slip off my regular shoes/sandals to save them from the flooding.) Peep-toe sling-back heels also worked well. Definitely pack some “play clothes” and slippers or loafers or flip flops for hanging around the hotel room comfortably. You don’t want to be stuck with either a confining work outfit or your sleep wear, even if you are ordering in room service.

4. What advice would you give a newly engaged couple just starting to look at wedding venues? What did you love or regret about your own venue?

   1. 1. It will drive the mood of your whole wedding – do you want preppy country club? Urban chic? How does your vision for your own look work with the mood of the venue?
      2. You should have a rough sense of your guest count as most places have minimums. Also you don’t want the space to feel either too empty or overcrowded.
      3. What we loved about our venue – we married in warm weather and the space was indoor-outdoor, with the dance floor outdoors. If you wanted to dance and party, you could, but if you wanted to sit and chat with relatives, there were lots of areas to do that away from the noise. (This was one of our must-haves since I have always disliked being trapped in a booming ballroom and barely able to talk to my grandparents at a wedding!)

   2. I made a spreadsheet with about two dozen venues. It included:
      Room rental/venue cost
      Food and beverage minimums
      How alcohol is priced (per person vs per drink)
      Per person food costs
      Maximum number of guests
      Other restrictions

      I used that to estimate the cost of the venue. I eliminated ones that were just too expensive. Then I looked at the ones that were the best value – low minimums, great venue, great food, drinks priced per person (about half of our guests didn’t drink alcohol). One venue came out on top and that’s the one we ended up going with.

      Let budget drive these decisions unless someone is telling the couple that the sky is the limit. Otherwise, you get into the situation of “falling in love with a dream venue” and going into debt for it. Don’t even set foot on the property until you have determined it is within budget.

      1. What I loved: everything!! It is gorgeous (some movies are filmed there). The food was fantastic. They did a dessert table in addition to the cake, had a mimosa bar, and the buffet had something like fifteen options for people.

         Main regret: one particular “experience” upgrade that I didn’t go with.

   3. How hands-on do you want to be? I had no clue what I was doing and chose a venue that doesn’t provide anything–not even the tables. The more full-service the venue is, the less work for you.

      1. I’ll tack on to this:

         – Some people think getting a “shell only” venue and bringing in their own suppliers will automatically be cheaper than going with a full-service venue, and that’s not necessarily true. My best friend went this route and ended up spending more than the full-service venue she looked at would have charged her, as well as spending WAY more time finding vendors and getting contracts done, etc. When she interviewed vendors, she kept getting sucked into buying the more-expensive food, the top-shelf liquor, the more-expensive cake, the nicer flowers, the nicer tablecloths and rental chairs, etc. Plus, each vendor charges separate tax and service fees. All-in, the full-service place would have been cheaper, and saved her a lot of time and effort.

         – OP, if you’re a busy person and you’re not hiring a planner, even if the full-service venue is more expensive, it may be worth it. My BFF nearly had a meltdown the week before her wedding trying to coordinate all the vendors. Some had worked the same events together for years and had beefs that she got pulled into; some turned out to be flaky, etc. She very much wished she had either A. just gone with the full-service venue or B. hired a planner to wrangle all of this, because dealing with a complicated wedding on top of a busy, high-travel, full-time job nearly broke her.

         1. I did a full service venue. Honestly I don’t think it really cost all that much more – the venue fee is basically what covers chairs, tables, linens, clean up, etc.

   4. My biggest piece of advice is that you can’t look at venues until you have a (mostly) accurate guest headcount. You also need to decide beforehand what you want the venue to offer – do you need ceremony space? Do you want a dance floor? Do you want a separate space for cocktails? Do you want a bridal suite for getting ready on site?
      Once you make those decisions then I’d make a spreadsheet and begin searching for venues in your target location via a place like the knot. I did this on my lunch hour and would call up the 10-12 places I thought would be a fit. Ask them what their availability in your target dates is (some places will simply be booked up for 1-2 years out), what their per plate cost is and any food& beverage minimums, what their packages include, what their site rental fee is (if any), if they required me to work with their vendors or if we were free to bring in their own, what was provided via the venue (tables/chairs/plates/silverware/a day of planner/etc.) and what we had to bring in.
      I would also ask them to send me their event rentals booklet – with seating plans, sample menus, and pricing. I didn’t go see anything until I had all of that information – no point in falling in love with a place that wouldn’t fit all of our guests or had a miniscule dance floor as we wanted a band and lots of dancing!

   5. I regret selecting a venue in a vacation destination on a holiday weekend. Most of the guests had to travel to get there, and hotels were already booked. If you expect a lot of out of town guests, consider having the wedding at the hotel. As a guest I prefer those weddings where I don’t have to travel too far from the hotel to the wedding venue, especially if there are a lot of events for the wedding weekend.

   6. We wanted to be outdoors during a nice time of year, and let that plus price be out main guide. The main thing, in my opinion, is to nail down what is important to you, plus budget + size of wedding, then look for places. I agree with others that you don’t want to look at bunch of places you can’t even afford, because you’ll be comparing them to the more budget options, which might have been fine before you had them in your head.
      If you are flexible, think outside the box. We ended up looking for venues at a lake I had spent a lot of time at as a kid and found something lovely. Because it was more rural everything was cheaper. But there was some travel time for attendees from the main city. But it worked out beautifully.

   7. Know your actual budget for venue — only look at places in your budget.

      1. This applies to all things in your wedding. Do not even try on dresses outside of your budget. Don’t look at flowers outside of your budget. There are infinite upgrades and you’ll just be unhappy with what you choose if you look at pricier things.

   8. Lots of great advice here. Three things I haven’t seen mentioned:
      1) How much does the venue handle versus you have to bring in? My wedding venue provided almost nothing, so I had to bring in separate vendors for catering, bar, linens, flowers, pretty lighting, sound system, etc. (and was priced accordingly). We had a wedding planner who handled these details, both in helping us select the vendors and in managing them leading up and day of. It was 100% worth it to have the help.

      2) I intended to live in the city in which I married long term, and got married at a popular community venue. I love that I pass by where I got married often and get to go there on occasion with my kids for various civic/community events.

      3) What kinds of extreme weather might your location have at that time of year and is your venue equipped to handle it? If any of the people who you would be really sad if they couldn’t make it are more vulnerable to illness, can your venue be adapted to make it lower risk (high quality air filtration, ability to have the event outside/inside with lots of open windows, etc)?

   9. Save the money and elope to Vegas! My honest advice, and what I did. :)

   10. I had a church wedding in a city where I did not reside, and my only regret was how inhospitable some of the churches were to an out-of-towner. The priest that married me was fine though, and the church was very pretty.

       A relative made it possible for me to use their country club for the reception.

       I loved the food and open bar, that they were complete pros who handled everything, and that it wasn’t any more expensive than other options that would have required me to hire a separate planner. People could sit near the dance floor and the band, or they wander off to sofas elsewhere or go outside and sit there.

       I didn’t love the general country club decor (there were still paintings of fox hunters on horses, which makes me laugh), but it was also nice not to have to decorate. I was involved in a lot of aspects of my ceremony and especially the music and flowers and everything that happened at the church, so it was nice to have a reception venue that didn’t need a lot of work.

       1. You shouldn’t have been surprised about the churches being hospitable, IMO. They’re not event venues, they’re places of worship for their parishioners. It’s very common that they don’t want to host people who aren’t their parishioners, or at least that parishioners come first.

          My experience with this is that there’s an extremely gorgeous rustic church near where we vacation, and you have to be a practicing member of the parish with regular attendance to even be considered for a wedding there. Otherwise they’d be weddings 24/7, which is not why they exist.

          1. No, they were straight up terrible. I was a practicing member with regular attendance at my home parish, but it would have been silly to ask all my guests to travel to a place where I lived, but where none of either of our families lived! They offer their churches for services (it’s not free! neither was pre-Cana for that matter!), so I was going through the existing system. It’s not like I was just asking for some special favor.

             If they had said “we don’t have availability,” I wouldn’t be complaining. Instead it was like they wanted to gatekeep a sacrament and make a separate determination of whether I was worthy to get married at all (like was I living in sin? no? then how I could I really know if I was ready to be married? wouldn’t I just get divorced after going through the stress of living together for the first time?). It was very ridiculous and they came across as hostile to marriage in general.

             Like I said I found a good church with a priest who was an ordinary human being, but I didn’t forget the places that treated me like I had already done something wrong by getting engaged in the first place.

   11. Set the budget in stone *before* you go looking, and *only* look at locations within that budget, no matter what anyone tells you. You do not want to start your marriage by going into debt to pay for the wedding.
       Decide what kind of look you want, and how hands on you want to be. You’ll need to know a ballpark guest number and what kind of food service (buffet or plated).
       Be willing to be a bit flexible in order to stay in within your budget…and don’t overlook those less than television worthy places, we had a fantastic experience with a smaller venue that fit our budget, so much so that a sibling chose the same venue a couple of years later.

   12. Are you being asked to provide advice? If not, then say nothing.

   13. Decide what is important to you and what is less important. For us, open bar was important (WASP marrying WASP and plenty of family infighting/divorced parent drama). Food, cake, etc., less important. I loved that ours was smallish and intimate but had a lot of different places for people to hang out (historic house) and wasn’t very far from the church. It was also pretty on its own so we didn’t need to bring in a bunch of decorations or flowers, etc.

   14. Please think about what you want your out of town guests to deal with. Airports, rental cars, transportation to/from venue if you expect a boozy crowd. Flying half way Aron d the country, just to have to rent a car and drive 90minutes to the hotel that is then another 20 from the venue….it’s a choice that is hard for a lot to make.

       1. Yes this!! If you’re providing a shuttle consider how far the hotel is from the venue *on a bus at the time of the wedding.* I attended a wedding that was 30 minutes away by car (not ideal) but 45 minutes by bus (torture). The venue was at the top of a dark, winding mountain road so the drive took much longer by bus.

   15. Read a lot of reviews or better yet talk to actual brides that have held their weddings there. There were several negative reviews about our venue I dismissed as bridezillas, but it turned out the venue owners were nuts. My wedding was beautiful but they contacted us for months asking for more money that we hadn’t agreed to, ultimately took us to civil court, and lost.

   16. If you can swing it, have a day-of coordinator if not a wedding planner. There were a couple things that went sideways at our wedding and were smoothed over perfectly but we did not find out about them until the next day. It was so nice that myself, my husband and my parents did not have to deal with putting out fires and could focus on being in the moment and sharing that special day with our guests.

       Our space had lots of different areas, indoor and outdoor. Plenty of parking. Enough bathrooms.

       Our planner was also able to get us cheaper rates on linens, chair, tableware rental etc. It was so worth spending the money on her – so much less stress, and her and her team were amazing. She would have made any space work beautifully.

5. For those of you without kids, how do you vote on school levys that increase taxes? We are child-free by choice and live in a suburb with lots of kids. In the past 20 years that we have lived here, the town has grown a lot. In just the past five years, there have been four new apartment complexes developed and now a new housing development is being built. With all these new families moving into town, there is a need to put more money into the schools.

   1. Also childless by choice. I vote consistent with my belief that our country desperately needs a better educated electorate and workforce. These are the people who will be running the world when I am old/retired/need help. They need to be able to tell truth from fiction, do science and math, work productive jobs, contribute to society.

      1. +1. I now have stepkids, but even before, this was how I felt on this issue.

      2. I agree. I have a kid but this was me prior to being a mom, too.

      3. Agreed. Healthier, happier children lead to a better society.

      4. Yup. I have a kid now but this was my attitude pre-kid (and I wasn’t sure I was going to have kids at all, so it wasn’t based on my future hypothetical kid).

      5. +1

   2. I voted no on a new school in my town because it is mostly younger professionals without kids, most people with kids eventually move to the suburbs and the town’s proposal for a new school included things like an ice rink and new pool. I’m not paying for that and it didn’t pass. If I lived in the suburbs then I would accept that the main reason people move there is for their kids. I’m in a more urban commuter town right outside of NYC. It’s not very kid friendly and therefore, it makes sense for me to live here. Suburbs are all about the kids.

      1. I’m a parent and I agree with you. Pouring money into schools doesn’t always make sense. What is the money going toward? My school district had a similar proposal a few years ago with over-the-top amenities that would not have improved education. I voted no.

         1. If it was for more teachers or to pay teachers more, I would have voted in favor of it. I went to a very good school in the suburbs and we didn’t have a pool or ice rink! I think it was just a money grab from the politicians and developers.

            1. Or people fund construction and never fund maintenance and it’s just such a giant waste of money. Also, costs money to rip up when you need to move classroom trailers in b/c your actual school is too small.

         2. Me too. An ice rink seems really over-the-top, though you could talk me into a pool pretty easily tbh.

            In our town, the school board wants to do EVERYTHING but improve the facilities, like workforce housing and 100% sustainable everything, it’s apparently a MAGA position to ask for a new coat of paint or some non-rusted out gates.I wish more schools had pools.I live in Southern California and there is a really dangerous number of people who can’t swim because lots of schools don’t have pools and they don’t do swimming in PE. Our school uses the town pool so swimming isn’t required for K-12 kids. It’s appalling. Even my crap-ass public school district in rural MD (the kind of place that’s too racist to have a public pool) mandated swimming lessons for all high school freshmen.

            1. There was nothing I hated more in high school than once a year swimming class in gym. I had it first period most years. Hell on earth.

   3. The the schools hood or a hot mess? My district has been a cluster over the past decade to the point where I am voting against school bonds for the first time ever (eg they want more money for magnet schools but eliminated busses to magnet schools, causing many families who would be hurt the most to leave magnet programs even if they were already high school juniors). If there is an exodus to charter schools or to the next county over, the elected school board has earned that. Rotten at the top makes it bad for all, which has consequences for our city but we need a cold reboot at this point not more bad ideas. I hope it is the start of a come to Jesus moment for them.

      1. Please also make sure to support well-qualified school board candidates. Merely voting against funding won’t get under-qualified school board members to do a better job.

         My community tends to vote for under-qualified school board members, some of whom view it as stepping stone to elected positions they actually want. They tend to be good campaigners, might have a nice resume, and say things in line with community values, but aren’t willing or able to do an adequate job of oversight of the school system.

         Many parents can’t vote (aren’t citizens or live in neighboring cities), so we really need non-parents to take a hard look at candidates–there’s often a less polished, less well-funded candidate who really knows the schools who would do a better job than the slick candidates.

         1. This is what happens in my town, too. People vote on mailers and feelings and we wind up with people who couldn’t oversee a ham sandwich.

         2. Yes, this!

   4. I am childfree. I basically always vote yes on increasing taxes for schools. Well-funded schools benefit the community as a whole and many schools are very underfunded as it is.

      1. But it’s so much more than funding. Our board could throw all of its money around on bad ideas and contract buyouts and being on the losing side of so much Title 9 litigation (they can’t protect girls from being assaulted at school and are largely indifferent when that happens, so the parents basically just go on the news and sue b/c nothing else is productive).

         1. And voting no helps that how? Bad situations usually get worse without resources instead of better—sometimes that’s why leadership is hard.

         2. Ok? You’re free to vote however you like

         3. But how do we prevent that without enough funding for small class sizes and a decent workload for teachers/social workers so that misconduct isn’t missed, or worse, swept under the rug because the organization can’t afford to lose a staff member?

         4. This … seems like a different problem entirely.

   5. I always vote in favor of increasing the amount of money I pay in taxes on schools. I don’t have kids but I would like to and I would like the schools to be good and good schools are the main thing that increase my property value.

   6. I think it’s your responsibility to think of yourself and your community when voting on these kinds of things. If you have chosen to live in an area with lots of kids, you can’t be hostile to them. In addition, keep in mind kids are people, people that you have to live around long term – investing in good programs and schools for them will likely positively impact your life, especially in relation to the tax burden (assuming it’s a reasonable tax burden).

   7. I vote for them. It’s the least I can do to support public schools. Wish I could do more. Sprawl is such a huge environmental and equity problem. The solution is more density in existing built-up places. To make that reality, we need to create affordable places families want to live and that includes solid public schools.

   8. Cf by choice and I always vote to improve the schools or whatever, even if it costs me more. Always. I have the means to do so, and I don’t view my taxes as a literal quid pro quo.

   9. Depends. Good schools help my property values but not everything is worth voting for.

      1. Do you ever think beyond your own interests? That seems pretty myopic.

         1. No. And it’s none of your business.

            1. This reply is really funny to me because it doubles down on the point at Anon 12:04 was making. It actually IS other people’s business when someone votes in a way that says ‘to heck with everyone and everything else, what I care about is ME’. Because this attitude winds up affecting everyone else, when everyone stops remembering they live in a society, and that your choices often don’t affect you alone.

   10. I always vote yes. A school levy that passed when I was in middle school totally transformed our district, allowing us to build a much larger, better-equipped high school. Trying to pay it forward.

   11. When I was a DINK, I voted in favor of school levies most of the time. The exception was if they were throwing in amenities that really weren’t needed. I believe very strongly that a growing community has to make those investments if they want a school system that’s functional.

   12. I am childfree by choice. I live in a popular suburb of a huge city that has a mix of incomes and good schools. Property taxes are very high. But I still absolutely vote for all of the school programs. There are few things more important for society. They help maintain property values. And how can you not do what’s best for the kids?

       BUT…..

       I posted before that our public high school now wants $100 million dollars. $100 million. To update their athletic facilities. Pools. Fields etc… And the school 2 miles away doesn’t have enough money for…. paper…. for teachers to copy hand-outs for the kids.

       THAT gave me pause.

   13. Thanks for the feedback, everyone. My mom has been a teacher for 25 years and I’ve learned from her how challenging it can be. I am planning to vote for it. I researched the levy and they are planning on utilizing the levy for hiring more teachers and basic operating costs.

       1. so glad you were able to find more information! Sometimes I see these things proposed on the ballot and there is hardly any detail available!

   14. I’m childfree by choice, and I believe that an educated populace is good for everyone. Also, I received a free public school education; why shouldn’t all kids have the same?

   15. Of course I vote yes! Educating the next generation is the most important civic duty we have! Yes, including other people’s kids. Who do you think is going to pay for your healthcare / social security in your retirement? It’s important to have an educated society and workforce.

   16. I have kids but can’t vote (not a citizen). Please vote on issues along your values, even if you aren’t directly concerned.
       In many states (many of them red), there is now legislation that strengthens charter schools/vouchers, which takes away money from public schools. We need to counteract this.

   17. I will always vote for money for education, and I am child free.

6. I think I am liking cropped flares for the same reason I came around to skinny jeans: they seem to work with any flat shoe (I am not a heels person). But how are you all doing hems and footwear for non-cropped flares? I cannot figure this out. Advice, please! Otherwise, I may hem or take in to make them modest boot cuts in the leg.

   1. Back in the day, I wore flares with a bit of a heel and the back of the pant was just a little bit off the ground. Maybe 1/2 an inch or so? I had multiple pairs of pants that I had hemmed for different heel heights. I will post a link in a separate reply, but there is a post on awellstyledlife dot com about hemming lengths for different pants.

      1. Link – https://awellstyledlife.com/tips-for-pants-hemming-length/

   2. you hem them for the shoes you intend to wear them with, and they should be close to grazing the floor at the heel regardless of the type of shoe.

   3. If you’re not a heels person, I’m not sure I understand the dilemma. Usually when people can’t are stuck on the hem lengths of their full-length flares, it’s because they can’t figure out whether to have them hemmed to wear with flats or to have them hemmed for heels. But in your case, wouldn’t you just have your full-length flares hemmed to work with your flats?

      Or is it that you don’t know where the hem should fall? Current lengths are full-length (as close to the ground as if practical), or grazing the top of the foot so the whole shoe is showing, or ankle length.

      1. To my eye, delicate flats or chunky loafers work when you are showing some ankle (skinnies or cropped flares). They don’t seem to work with voluminous pants that are full-length. But IDK what does. I think maybe “giant shoes on a platform” is the right answer, 70s-style.

         1. I can’t wear heels and I still wear flares/wide legs. I’d say mine are about 1” off the ground in the back.

   4. For full length flares, if it is a big flare, I’ve been doing a big shoes – thing clunky 70s sandal or substantial wedge. More moderate flares have been the ubiquitous 3inch pointy toe colored pump. Avoiding hemming out by adjusting the heel height.

   5. I haven’t bought any new flares, but in the Y2K era, I generally wore them with chunky heels. (I would kill to still have my fave block-heeled loafers from that time!) But you don’t have to do heels. The hem should be close to the floor without actually brushing it, and you want the toe of your shoe poking out. Point-toe flats would work well, for example.

7. Anyone have experience/success with treating sensory processing disorder relating to food? For them, not for their children. It’s at the point where I can’t eat a lot of conference food (I can do fine if I can pick off a menu/buffet, but a lot in my field do “here is The Dinner, if you put down a food requirement you get Other Dinner” with no choice) and I want to know if there’s anything I can do to at least get to the point where I can eat it without puking.

   1. Have you experimented with different food preparations? One of my kids has a sensory processing disorder related to food and a lot of trial and error helped us sus out a wider range of foods that he is comfortable with and help him learn how to modify foods with condiments to suit his tastes. Like mashed potatoes with tons of pepper or rice with ketchup or roast sauages with tons of dijon mustard but never ketchup (I think these are gross but he loves them). Think like wine tasting except with different foods. Spagettini works for him but he hates the denseness of farfalle. We’ve worked out enough options that there’s usually something at most school and family events that he can have/make work. Can you try out different ways of eating some of the conference foods on your down time? Eat a solid snack before the meal and just focus on eating one or two things of the Dinner. No one expects you to clean your plate.

      And be open to the idea that you’ll learn to like something if the quality or preparation method is different. You’re never too old to learn to like new foods. I hated espresso and olives until I went to Greece when I was 29 and just tried them every day and I’m obsessed with olives now – turns out I didn’t dislike olives, I just disliked green olives and cheap kalamata olives. I eat the good kalamata ones by the bucket full. I also like espresso now. I also hated broccoli until DH pointed out that boiled broccoli is gross so of course I hated it – when he roasts it with olive oil I love it.

   2. I like the advice above. My issues are related to chronic nausea, so they are a bit different than some other people’s sensory issues, but I agree that using condiments can be helpful. I have issues with bitterness and certain odors, so if I can cover that up, it helps. I find that roasting veggies and lots of acids (vinegar, lemon, ketchup, anything else tomato based) helps makes things more palatable. You’ll have to figure out your own tricks for your specific sensitivities.

   3. I just don’t almost any of that conference food! And I don’t have a sensory processing disorder, I just don’t like it. I will pick at it, or just eat the bread and salad, or whatever, and make sure I eat in advance. I don’t really like meat and the vegetarian options are often mediocre. Is there a reason you feel like you have to eat the food?

   4. I will say I hate it when people here diagnose everyone with anxiety. But you’re describing anxiety, at least about barfing. I’d treat that.

      Meanwhile, have food in your room/bag that’s something you can eat, like a granola bar, and then just pick at your food at the dinner. No one will notice.

   5. Thanks for the comments! To clarify somewhat, the main issue is with raw lettuce – the mention of throwing up is not a joke or exaggeration, it has literally happened. Not in several years, admittedly, but that’s because I learned to stop eating it when I started feeling sick. It is extremely popular as a catering choice around here, for whatever reason. I’ve literally been served a salad course that was an intact eighth of a head of iceberg lettuce with blue cheese on it. So this isn’t something where I can control the quality, style, or preparation method. I get the food the conference organizers decided on. (I do fine when I can control the style/preparation method – for me, most veggies can go tolerably in curry or stir-fry.)

      Failing that, given that my options are “raw lettuce” (or other stuff that triggers similar reactions) or “energy bar”, it looks like consensus is to go with the energy bar. Thanks.

      1. An aversion specifically to raw vegetables can be endocrine. I would discuss w/a doctor.

      2. I can’t do lettuce and a lot of other things (colon cancer survivor). It sounds easy to say eat beforehand but can be tough when you go from session to cocktail hour to dinner and even harder to get offsite. If I can’t get out for cocktail hour to eat, I will sometimes order room service for a late hour in advance. Before a conference starts, I also usually fly in a little early to make a stop at a Walgreens (or better a grocery) for some safe snacks.I’m lucky that peanut butter and bread or crackers is usually an option somewhere and most hotels will make an omelette any time of day,

8. if you have leather, faux leather, or wax-coated pants, how are you cleaning or storing them for the warmer months?

9. i am looking for a water bottle that fits the following requirements:
   – fits in a car cup holder
   – can throw in purse without spilling
   -has straw

   1. Just bought a Simple Modern 24 oz one so it can fit in a cupholder, and like it so far

      1. I’ve bought a couple Simple Modern tumblers and am really happy with the quality. I’m still kicking myself for leaving one behind at a work event.

      2. Question: where are those manufactured?

         1. Order info says China

            1. Thanks. Boo. They said they are opening up a facility in Oklahoma and I was hoping to find some not-China made versions of leakproof water bottles.

      3. wouldn’t this spill everywhere if thrown in a purse?

   2. My Contigo water bottle fits that description – I got mine as a conference giveaway, but a quick look at the river site has the same one available for purchase. Look for one with the lid lock feature.

      1. fits in cup holder in car?

         1. My non-straw Contigos all do!

   3. I have a 21 oz hydroflask that has been going for five or six years now. It does fit in ky cup holder, though I bought the straw top separately. I like having a straw lid too so I just replace the lids on my water bottles with straw lids if they don’t already come with them.

10. I am struggling a lot with my body image right now. I gained 20 pounds during Covid lockdowns, which is unheard of for me, and I still haven’t been able to lose the weight. And I have tried … and keep failing. Throw in a major surgery in mid-2022 and the start of perimenopause, and my body doesn’t feel like my own anymore. Shopping is not fun, and nothing fits how I expect it to. I’m a solid 14 now, sometimes a 16 in pants, compared to the 10-12 that I’ve been my entire adult life. My doctor isn’t particularly concerned, just says to do what I can to eat healthy and exercise, which I have done and continue to do. My DH says that I look great, but I feel so bad about myself. Meanwhile, he can make tiny adjustments to his diet and lose 10 pounds in 2 months. I have been cutting calories and have lost a whole 3 pounds in two months. Like is it even worth the effort at that point?

    I don’t even know what I’m looking for anymore. Should I try to lose weight, or accept that this is where my 43-year-old body wants to be? In any case, how do I start feeling better about my body? Would working with a dietician help?

    1. Oh, the one benefit of my new body: I have legit boobs now, so that’s exciting?

       1. ha ha… you are me. The b00bs are great though, aren’t they?

          I was also fortunate my whole life, and maintained a pretty consistent weight/shape until perimenopause. And then within a year my previously pear shaped body completely changed. New belly. Even bigger butt. And even though it wasn’t a huge amount of weight, everything popped with cellulite. Ugh. Genetics. Even when I was a gangly thin teenager, I had cellulite, but now it is everywhere. Even in my very slender arms. Crazy.

          For me, trying to get in a little more exercise helps – just trying to walk more, starting some yoga (which helps the other perimenopausal symptoms too, for me), and a little weight training (handweights for a few minute routine). And also, I had to admit that I was a little sloppy in my eating habits, and I could “get away” with that when I was younger. Not so now. So I have gotten more systematic about what I eat, buying any fresh healthy food I love at all times and keeping well stocked, and trying to eat more protein in general (important for aging) and hydrating well. But I don’t deprive myself. Life is short. Food is life!! I mean, you probably know what you should be doing (higher protein, lots of fresh fruits and veg, less carbs, fat is not bad and can be filling, whole grains if you carb crave, cut down eating after dinner), but if you want a nutritionist visit for ideas… sure. But sometimes just changing one thing at a time, slowly is easier to maintain.

          But finally, I am also slowly accepting that this is my body as I am aging. Hormones are working against me! And there are actually good sides – Less periods, new b00bs! And I am trying to figure out how to dress in a more comfortable/flattering way for me. That is hard too. At least the world isn’t forcing us to wear heels anymore.

          At least be glad your hair isn’t falling out! Ah, perimenopause….

       2. My sister’s kind of disgusting ex used to say the “t1tty fairy” had visited whenever she was pregnant or gained weight. He was gross but it was kinda funny.

    2. I think there is something to be said for getting older and accepting the changes that happen to your body.

       1. Right. Which sort of makes me feel even worse. Why am I being so vain about this? I have a healthy, functional body. Shouldn’t that be enough? But no, I’m fixated on the changes that feel somewhat outside my control.

          1. Maybe those are things to discuss with a therapist? Also, it may be good to get a physical and bloodwork done to make sure there aren’t other issues. Any changes you make have to be sustainable in the long term, so maybe that is something to discuss with a dietician. And you may have to accept that the weight will just come off more slowly at this point.

             1. I don’t know…. with the stressors of midlife/perimenopause/body changes/society ignoring older women/pressure to dye your hair and tear off every stray body hair etc.. it is pretty normal to have some insecurities about this period of life. If you don’t, you are fortunate and are in a more secure life/job/family situation than most of us.

          2. I would like to recommend the podcast Everything Is Fine. It’s excellent for this feeling, and listening has really helped me shift how I see myself/what I am thinking about changes in my body. The podcast is really warm and funny and they have some great guests!

       2. Buy a whole new wardrobe! Seriously — set an overall budget with your husband and then have fun with it. Work with a stylist or a free personal shopper tied to a store if you’d like. Wearing clothes that you like and feel good in makes all the difference.

          1. +1 to this!

             1. Save the great pieces, but +1M to rebuying select items. I went up 1-2 sizes between perimenopause and COVID and some surgeries. I am trying to be a “better” version of my current shape, it fits and starts. But it’s amazing how well you look in clothes that fit your current body. It is such a mood booster. I’ve settled into a “good-ish” +1 size to my prior size and have only the best items in a spare closet. The rest? They weren’t all that great, so it’s just my foolish vanity getting in the way of my better self-presentation. There is nothing wrong — this is life progressing and my not wanting to not be cast as the ingenue (even though my grandmother was a grandmother at my age; she dressed well and was very chic and that is what I need to keep in my mind as I go through this).

    3. Please don’t give up, keep up the effort. I’m 39 and it is hard to keep the weight off compared to my 20s. I just keep at it and try to stay disciplined. When I have an off day and drink/eat too much, I just try to do better the next. My partner can lose weight fast too, maybe it has something to with him having more muscle so he burns calories faster than me. I’m rooting for you!

    4. No advice but I feel ya. 38 and perimenopause seems to be hitting hard. The last few years I’ve gained 5+ pounds per year, and I feel uncomfortable and unhealthy even though BMI says I’m just at the cusp of overweight now. I’ve added in a lot of exercise and have been trying to make better food choices but all it does is slow the gain.. I can’t lose anything. It’s very frustrating.

       1. +1. 42 and perimenopause. Gaining a few pounds each year over the last few years, despite regular exercise and better food choices. I’m pescatarian and get most of my calories from legumes, whole grains, and Omega-3-heavy fats, so there’s not a lot of excess fat or calories to safely cut from my diet. No thyroid issues and bloodwork is good. It’s frustrating, and I struggle between wanting to stop the gain and appreciating that this is just how my body is.

    5. Have you gotten your thyroid checked? I am hypothyroid and I (1) can’t eat as much as ‘normal’ people and (2) have to take a pill every day, but once I understood (1) I was better able to regulate.

       1. Thyroids are also weird because there’s a wide range of “normal” and it can be tough to get doctors to agree to medicate you if you’re in the range, even if you’re below your own natural baseline. I have Graves’ disease which appeared in my early 30s when I was newly postpartum, and I became hyperthyroid and treated with meds. I’m off the meds now, but I’m now at the hypo end of the normal range and gaining weight steadily, and doctors won’t do anything because I’m “in normal range.” But I suspect my pre-diagnosis baseline was a LOT higher, since I had a really fast metabolism before getting sick with Graves.

    6. Putting food aside, what is your exercise regime look like? If you haven’t done any weight training, may I suggest you start there? I find it helps me feel amazing even if the scale doesn’t move.
       I know they say you lose weight in the kitchen but I think we learn to love our bodies through movement.

    7. I’m 42 and gave birth three years ago. It just takes a LOT more than it used to to lose weight. Be patient and keep at it, and make sure to build muscle.

    8. 56 here and I absolutely understand. I can only speak from my own experience which is that I gained 30 pounds over the last 3 years (menopause + pandemic eating and drinking my feelings + new job with a lot of stress eating). I was unhappy with my body and flirting with being clinically obese. And 30 pounds now would have been 50 by the time I was 60 at the rate I was going and my family has a long and horrible history with weight-related health issues. I am working on it and currently down 15 pounds. I am committed to getting back to where I was in 2020. I will not be skinny – or even slim – but I will be back in a healthy weight range and I was happy with my body at that point.

       You have two choices. You can accept that the body you have now is your (wonderful) body, buy new clothes and move forward. You say your doctor is not concerned so that would be a perfectly valid decision. OR You can figure out what you need to do to lose weight. For me that was low carb (not Keto and not crazy strict; I still go out for dinner once a week with my BFF and we kill a bottle of wine I just don’t drink or eat carbs at home). For you it might be something else. I would highly recommend medical counseling here – tests for thyroid or other medical issues followed by a consult with a registered dietician.
       Good luck!

       1. ETA: There is a third way but it is what I recommend you avoid. I kept looking at myself in the mirror and trying to wear too tight clothes from my closet and being unhappy and self-loathing – which I then buried in wine and carbs, which meant I gained more weight and was even more unhappy. Accept yourself or change yourself (with medical help as needed). The middle way is where the misery lies.

       2. Or, a little of both. It’s entirely possible to accept that your body may be heavier than you’d like, but still work to lose a little weight/firm things up/be healthier.

          I’m 55 and am heavier than I want to be. I don’t hate my body, but I sure liked it better about 5 years ago. I try to be aware of what I eat, exercise (some HIIT workouts with weights, walks) regularly, but also I don’t let myself do a lot of negative self-talk. And I bought new pants because life is way too short to wear uncomfortable, unattractive pants!

    9. It sounds like you gained something like 20 pounds over about 2 years. At your current weight loss rate, you are on schedule to lose the weight you gained over about the same interval that you gained it. Slow and steady wins the race! Also, acknowledge that you are at an age where many women experience weight gain even without a pandemic. You are doing what you need to do to make yourself comfortable with the skin you are in.

    10. hey! I have been dealing with something similar recently. I second the suggestions to get new clothes that fit and feel comfortable — I would add that are in style as well (so that it feels like an upgrade, not just like you’re buying the same old jeans you had 5 years ago and feeling bad that the size is bigger). With different styles, sizing is often different, so having a bigger number size can feel less stressful. That being said, if there’s something you love that’s now too tight, I would recommend buying the same item in a larger size — Poshmark is great for this.

        I would also suggest following some body positive instagram accounts — I like Katie Sturino. I also have benefited from having more larger-sized influencers on my feed; right now I like “Curvy in Vienna” and “Diana Dares” (The latter is not really work appropriate but super cute).

        Hang in there!

    11. 3 pounds in 2 months is actually good weight loss. It helps to make other goals. My primary goal is getting stronger and faster. The benefit is that I look and feel amazing, even though I still weigh more than I did before the pandemic. In other words, eating protein and veggies to fuel my intense feels great while starving myself and watching the scale feels crappy.

    12. Yes it is worth losing 3 pounds in 2 months! Losing weight slowly is the only way to keep it off. You should lose weight no faster than you gained it. I’m on the same journey right now, but I have far more than 20 lbs to lose. Keep on keeping on!

        1. Losing one pound per month is sustainable — not so rapid that your body goes into “starvation” mode. After all, it took you a couple of years to gain the 20 pounds, so plan on taking a couple of years to lose 20 pounds. Most weight loss comes from not eating, not from exercise, although building muscle helps raise your metabolism. Skip a meal here and there or just sup chicken broth as a meal replacement (unless you have a health reason not to, fasting is usually harmless in moderation), drink lots of liquids, cut back on bread, pasta, potatoes, and rice, take a 30 minute walk a day, and tell yourself when tempted by cookies/cake/ice cream that you’ll have those snacks some other day, later.

    13. I’m at a similar point and while I have good body image days and bad body image days, a few things have helped:

        1.Remembering that all women’s sizing is random at some level, even sometimes within brands. An XS in one brand is an M at some other brand. The important thing is that something fits – this is especially helpful for me as I have Audrey Hepburn shoulders and a Sophia Loren rear end.Related: the reason Famous People look so fabulous is that someone is tailoring every.single.thing that goes on their body in public.

        2. Looking at my family members. I tend to take after my mom’s family, and all of the women in her family start out as fragile little skinny things as twenty somethings and gain weight around the middle sometime in their 30s and/or 40s. No matter what I do, there is no getting around some of that tbh. My dad’s mom was skinny, but she was one of those skinny people who never, ever exercised and didn’t really take in non-alcohol calories. It was just the way she was shaped.

        3. I try not to compare myself to my husband’s weight loss success, ever. He’s from solid Pennsylvania Dutch stock with a side of rural Polish peasant, and that man can STILL cut out coffee creamer and lose 20 pounds.

        4. New clothes help – styles change and bodies change over time!

        5. I did see a dietician at one point, which helped but it was also a pretty intense diet. You need to find someone you “click” with about that stuff. And you get one life, I’m not giving up bread. I’m a GenX who doesn’t smoke, barely drinks, and doesn’t have a motorcycle. Bread is all I have left.

    14. If you feel better about your body as it is right now, you may find that losing weight gets easier. So, go buy clothes and have them tailored to fit well.

    15. I am in my late 30s and gained 50 pounds in my last pregnancy. I tried to eat healthy and exercise but the last 20 pounds would not budge until I started using a calorie counting app. Once I started tracking, I immediately started losing weight and could make much more informed decisions about how much to eat. Even though I ate more than what was in my calorie budget, I still lost weight quickly. It was very empowering not to feel stuck! I no longer track calories but it’s helpful to know more about portion sizes and healthy go-tos based on the experience. I used Lose It.

11. Is there a website where you can personalize Nalgenes? We had a bunch of unique ones but the kids have lost enough that I’m about to get ones personalized so they can keep up with what is theirs better (and stop stealing mine).

    1. Etsy.

12. Has anyone tried Sargasso & Grey shoes? I’m looking for a magical unicorn size, 10.5W, in work shoes. If you have any other recs that would be great too!

13. I just read this article from NYT “Is There Life After Influencing?” (title rather than link given to avoid mod) and thought the commenters here would also find it interesting.
    I’ve heard of influencers trying to go back to a “normal/stable” job when the brand deals and such dry up, but this focused on a woman who wanted to leave Influencer life because of how she felt it negatively impacting her health and stress. I know some influencers can make the big bucks and that it’s a popular trend to have someone share “GRWM” or “day in the life.” I have a friend who used money from Instagram influencing to help pay for medical school and has since stopped posting once she got into residency and no longer had the time, but that’s my only IRL knowledge and it didn’t sound like a seismic shift in her life to no longer be an instagram personality.
    Curious for those who make hiring decisions: how would you view the candidacy of someone who applied to work with you after previously being a full-time influencer?

    1. I’m 45 so there wasn’t any social media in high school or college. I find the whole world of influencing rather fascinating and I’m curious to see how this plays out in the long term. It’s a strange thing to post your life online and make money from it. People make so many mean comments and there are so many snark sites, I imagine it has to be affecting these people psychologically. I wonder if there will be some point where the influencer bubble will burst.

       I don’t do hiring, but I wouldn’t care of someone had this background as long as they are competent at the job they were hired for.

    2. Assuming the job they want makes sense (marketing?) I’d probably check out their insta to see how their work ethic applied in their previous career. There’s plenty of people who seem to be coasting on their luck from a decade ago and seem to spend more time talking about how stressed they are than actually… steaming their free clothes and going somewhere interesting to wear them, while others take more effort with sponsored posts.

    3. I’d 100% hire a former influencer in marketing or social. Indeed, we do.

       1. OP here, that makes total sense! My job is so unrelated to those things, so that wasn’t on my mind when I posted, but it tracks that if they were able to boost their own brand successfully and manage multiple social media platforms and all that for their own success, that there’s transferrable skills to do doing similar things for an employer.

    4. Unless I worked in marketing or advertising, I’d want the person to tell me a d*mn good story as to why she’d benefit my very very different field (a goal: to be invisible). Like the person likely flamed out or ran that business into the ground if it is a line item on their resume and they are looking for a very different W-2 job.

    5. It would be a serious negative for me as a hiring manager. First of all, I don’t get the impression that many influencers have the education or skills necessary to do the job for which I hire (master’s degree or Ph.D. plus actual experience required). Second, if I did get a candidate who had been an influencer to finance grad school or something like that, it would create a strong presumption that the person was too egotistical and grabby to be successful at this job (we also have this problem with Ph.D.s who went straight through and have never had a real job).

       1. interesting! Can you elaborate on the egotistical perception? If the social media account was relatively tasteful and uncontroversial, I’d be inclined to think that it showed a lot of initiative and creativity to find a way to lessen the financial burdens of grad school. (perhaps I’m biased because my graduate education cost an arm and a leg…)

    6. I actually admire people who have the guts to go out on their own and try to make their own business work, even if it doesn’t work out long-term. My experience is that ex-entrepreneurs are very independent, self-managing, organized and creative. They don’t always love working in a team, and they don’t do well with micromanagement, but that isn’t a dealbreaker for every position. I have a side hustle and I know how hard it is to constantly beat the bushes and try to get work and keep a consistent income flow – I completely respect that people get exhausted with that, and may want to just get a job and have a steady paycheck, after awhile. As long as the “influencer” hadn’t done stupid or problematic stuff that could blow back on the company, I wouldn’t have any problem hiring an ex-influencer for a regular job.

       1. I had a very successful side hustle for many years (tutoring). Pulled in maybe $7k to $10k a year. I ran it like a business, which often confused people. If I got a request for a student who lived 20 minutes away, I would often turn it down – my effective hourly rate would go to hell and I would also have a hard time serving my local students if I needed to meet two students in the same night. In a word of mouth business, I’m better off focusing my attentions locally, and I hated getting into the position of “okay I’ll take on this student who lives far away and then two of their friends who live near them want help.” Ugh. Then people would be all “it’s more money! Why are you turning it down?” Not really.

          I am an in house attorney and definitely think the lessons translate over.

    7. I hire for essentially project management jobs, so there might be a fit there. Unfortunately I wouldn’t know how to assess achievements in the influencer field. If you tell me you got 50k followers and x amount of brand deal revenue, I don’t know if that’s mediocre or shows hard work/skill.

    8. I have a former work colleague (small trade magazine, fresh out of college) who is an influencer. Her writing is just so-so, if not actually bad. But she nabbed a senior-level marketing position at a large consumer brand. Never would have gotten that otherwise. She also now teaches a social media course at a nearby college–again, no way at the stage of her career that would have otherwise happened. So I actually see the experience has helped her make HUGE career strides. She is a far more competitive candidate because of it (was part of what landed her the job at the trade magazine even). I also think her consistency and willingness to hustle is a big part of her success. That said, I was (semi) joking with an old school friend that who knew we should have filmed ourselves getting dressed in our underwear instead of pursuing a master’s degree in journalism. GRWM indeed.

    9. I know more failed wannabe influencers than successful ones. I think it’s as rare as hen’s teeth (to quote my grandma) to actually make it as an influencer. Given that, I don’t see this as a huge economic wave, all the influencers returning to normal jobs, because there just aren’t that many successful ones.

14. A co-worker that I really like working with (at my same level) but don’t know very well personally is getting married this week and will be out of the office until next Wednesday. I want to get her something congratulatory for when she returns. What do you recommend?

    1. Take her out to lunch? Or a drink after work?

       Since it sounds like you weren’t invited to the wedding, and the wedding is over, a traditional gift seems a bit off.

    2. It’s such a lovely thought that you can’t miss with anything. I usually pick from a list of bubbles, flowers, vintage cocktail glasses, restaurant GC, and a card. People will have lots of opinions on all these but I really don’t think you can miss by being thoughtful where you don’t need to be.

    3. can you google her and find her registry? There might be something small still left to purchase. Otherwise I’d take her out for drinks!

       1. Alternately, a gift card to the store where she’s registered (maybe she only got 11 bowls out of 12, or something)

    4. If going out to lunch feels out of place (you said you don’t know her well). A nice flower arrangement on her desk when she comes back seems like a good option.

    5. I’d have the group/team get her flowers, a bottle of champagne if appropriate, or a gift card. Nothing too personal or expensive.

15. How much do you drink/what do you consider “okay”? My new-ish BF drinks significantly more than I do–1-2 drinks per night, more on weekends for him and really only on weekends for me. He rarely gets drunk and seems to be fine skipping days, so I’m inclined to think it’s NBD, but my friend was horrified.

    1. I don’t think that’s unreasonable.

    2. that may be a bit heavier than is truly recommended but def not ‘horrified’ territory IMHO

    3. I would consider that heavy drinking and it probably wouldn’t be something I would be comfortable with, but many people would be.

       1. +1

          This is where I fall.

          How old are you both?

          In my 20’s, some of my friends were like you/your boyfriend, but after that it was much less common in my world. And in this day and age, knowing what we do about alcohol, it’s not a great idea. And drinking that much – both of you – I wonder who is driving when you go out? Or maybe you are in NYC and never drive.

          1. I wouldn’t assume anyone is even going anywhere based on the above, much less thinking of driving themselves… based on my urban friend group, it is not at all uncommon to be sipping something at home while prepping dinner or watching a show after.

             1. OP: Bingo. We’re in NYC so no cars to drive in the first place

          2. Op here: I’m mid twenties, he’s early thirties

       2. +2. I am sure lots of people would be fine with this, but I am a light drinker at this point of my life, and this would be way too much for me.

          Caveat, I am married with 2 kids and nearly 40, so clearly in a different life stage. That said, it still would have been too much for me when I was 30. But I wouldn’t classify it as horrifying.

       3. Same, but I’m a very light drinker (like, “glass of champagne at a wedding and sampling local wines while traveling” light) so it’s more of a lifestyle incompatibility than a judgment.

    4. Your horrified friend seems like the outlier to me. Is she very sheltered?

       1. Sometimes people have interesting hang ups. I had a BF once who wasn’t sheltered at all, would definitely have a couple of drinks when going out, and he and his mom both hid their smoking from each other. But he was aghast when my family opened a bottle of wine for things like a nice Thanksgiving meal, during the daytime. For some reason that was uncomfortable for him.

          1. I think a very large number of people have someone in the family who is an alcoholic or some sort of substance use disorder. It is pretty common. And there’s a lot of genetics involved, so some folks are higher risk even with “social drinking”. And alcohol can be a variable in family conflicts/divorces. It sensitizes folks. It leaves scars. I certainly know children of alcoholics who never will touch alcohol.

             Alcohol caused big issues in my extended family in the older generations – many medical problems linked to long term alcohol use (liver issues, cancers etc..), or just sad things like having a fall after drinking too much wine at dinner/at night. Not a big deal when you are 25! But if you are 60, it could be life changing and cause an brain bleed – happened to an uncle, and he was never the same. I certainly can’t handle my drink as well with age. My rich WASP-y relatives still drink a bottle of wine+ with every dinner until they slur their words. They don’t even notice it.

             And sadly, one of my close relatives uses alcohol for self-medication of their anxiety. I’m worried for him.

          2. My grandmother was like that – visibly uncomfortable with anyone drinking in her presence, whether it was opening a bottle of wine at Easter or having a drink with a restaurant meal. My mom would placate grandma about this – took the liquor bottles off the sideboard and hid them when grandma visited, wouldn’t have a cocktail even if my dad had mixed up a pitcher of Tom Collinses (he was from a very three-martini-lunch-type family).

             My best guess it was a religious culture issue. She’d grown up in a tiny dry town in a dry county, and her church as a kid was described to me as “sort-of Mennonite,” no bonnets but very strict about dress and behavior. Maybe she saw drinking as something men did in a saloon in a “rough” place? I rarely encounter people like this as an adult (even the LDS we know are pretty laid back), but I am empathetic.

    5. Sounds normal. As you get older you drink less so I’d factor your age in too. I’d be unconcerned based on what you describe.

       1. I really don’t think it’s normal. I’m not saying I’m horrified like the friend, but I wouldn’t characterize it as normal at all.

          1. Same. One to two drinks every night is not normal to me.

          2. How is this not normal when the recommended weekly limit for men is 14 drinks per week?

             1. In the same way that most Americans diets are way out of whack with nutritional recommendations unless you think only like 5% of the population is normal because they are meeting daily recommendations for servings of fruits and vegetables and fiber, not exceeding fat or sugar suggested limits and limiting processed food. The same way that it’s normal for Americans to get way less than the recommended amount of sleep.

             2. The CDC says most adults do not consume alcohol daily, which means that it’s not normal if your definition of normal is what most people do.

             3. Anon at 2:48, your example is literally the opposite of what I’m saying. The amount this man is drinking is IN LINE with guidelines – people who aren’t sleeping enough or are eating way more sugar than recommended guidelines are…not following guidelines. Anon @ 5:01 has a point about “normal” but what this man is doing would be perfectly acceptable by my doctor’s standards.

             4. The CDC definition of “drink” is really small – 5 ounces of wine, an ounce of hard alcohol, etc. It’s very easy to consume 2-3 “drinks” in a single glass.
                Also the CDC doesn’t “recommend” 14 drinks/week for men. It says any man drinking 15+ drinks/week is drinking heavily, but that’s not the same thing as suggesting 14 is the appropriate amount.
                “To help Americans move toward a healthy dietary pattern and minimize risks associated with drinking, adults of legal drinking age can choose not to drink or to drink in moderation by limiting intakes to 2 drinks or less in a day for men and 1 drink or less in a day for women, on days when alcohol is consumed.” The last clause is important – it’s saying don’t have more than 2 drinks in one day regardless of how often you drink (e.g., don’t have 6 drinks one day and say it’s ok because you didn’t drink the rest of the week). It’s not saying you can have up to 2 drinks every day and be fine. Every doctor I’ve ever seen would tell this guy to drink less.
                I don’t think that necessarily makes his habit a problem – as you noted many Americans don’t confirm to guidelines around exercise and sugar. But I think it’s very misleading to characterize this as healthy. Even small amounts of alcohol have been linked to a whole bunch of health problems and clearly the more you drink the more unhealthy it is.

    6. for a guy in his 20s or 30s, especially one not married or a dad, this feels pretty normal to me. Maybe a little much but certainly not horrifying!

    7. It’s not healthy by medical standards. In the sense that it’s not good for your body, not necessarily that it’s an addiction. That would be too often for my comfort, but we all get to make different decisions about our tolerances.

       1. This amount, assuming 1-2 is standard drinks and not large pours, and more isn’t that much more, is more of a concern from a health perspective than an addiction perspective for me. Also assuming no other dangerous behavior, like driving after drinking and an ability to have fun without drinking.

          If it were just a friend, I consider health choices like this none of my business. I wouldn’t want to live with someone who drinks this much, though.

          1. Yeah, you hit the nail on the head for me with your last paragraph.

       2. I agree. He’s not getting drunk, shirking responsibilities, or physically dependent. But I see daily drinking as an unhealthy habit. That’s a lot of calories and alcohol isn’t great for your body in general. If he needs alcohol to decompress at the end of the day then he should find healthier outlets for his stress (going for a walk after work, some other ritual or hobby). FWIW I’m late twenties and have 2-3 drinks on weekend nights and maybe 1 drink during the week.

    8. I would consider that normal. In Europe.

       1. True. Good point.

    9. I know I drink more than I should, but I probably drink 4-7 nights a week (depending on the week) and how much I drink depends on what I’m doing.

       If I’m home I might have a glass of wine or a beer while cooking or with dinner. Usually just 1 drink on these nights.

       I go to happy hour or dinner with a friend a few times a week. Mostly 2 drinks (wine or beer), sometimes 1 and sometimes 3.

       On a weekend if I’m at a house party / a wedding / a weekend away with friends / some sort of celebration / day drinking on a weekend I’ll drink more though it’s usually over several hours. I generally average 1 drink an hour at these types of things which gets me tipsy but not drunk.

       I’ve done Dry January and other prolonged periods of sobriety before no problem. I usually have a 3-8 day period a month I’m on call for work and either can’t drink at all or can only have 1 drink and that’s fine.

       90% of the time I only drink beer, hard seltzer or wine. I like margaritas or the occasional cocktail that I’ll get when out with friends but don’t drink mixed drinks, shots, or straight liquor.

       I get tipsy maybe once a week or less and drunk almost never, while several of my friends drink less frequently than I do but get drunk weekly or monthly.

       To me, your boyfriend’s drinking seems totally fine.

       1. Yeah I think this is the tricky place a lot of us find ourselves in. You’re not an alcoholic. Your drinking isn’t causing problems in your life. Which is great! But at the end of the day you’re drinking a lot more than recommended and at an unhealthy level.

          1. Anon 11:27 here. To be honest I don’t even view this as tricky. I’m in my 20s, all of my friends live a short walk away and bars are also walking distance, I’m going on a lot of “let’s grab a drink” first dates. I’m totally fine with the level of drinking in my life even though it’s more than recommended.

             In a few years my situation in life will change and I will drink less. My friends and I will settle down, move to the suburbs, buy houses, have kids. We won’t have the time or life situation to meet up for an impromptu drink and we won’t be walking distance to everything. The seemingly constant housewarmings, engagement parties, bachelorettes, and weddings will slow down.

             I absolutely love the situation of life that I’m in and want to take advantage of it while I can.

             1. I totally agree with this. When I was in my twenties and lived in a city this was pretty similar to my life. It never created an issue or a problem in my work or personal life or otherwise. I look back fondly at those times!

                Now that I’m older and live in the suburbs and have kids, drinking doesn’t really appeal to me and I maybe drink twice a month on a date night or out with friends. I guess part of me laments not taking better care of my body by drinking less but I dont have any worse feelings about my drinking habits in my 20s than my awful diet that included a lot of processed food and not enough vegetables or my basically non existent exercise habits. If I could do my twenties again I’d probably mostly keep the booze but eat more nutritious food and lift weights regularly instead of haphazardly attending cardio based fitness classes.

                I agree with the poster that said Americans are weirdly puritanical about drinking.

       2. I used to drink the way you do now. I stopped because I don’t go out as much and because I now have rosacea and the alcohol makes me flush. Sometimes. Not always. I wish I knew exactly why.

          But I’m here to tell you that it was never a problem, it never developed into a problem, and I think Americans can be very puritanical and absolute about things. I spent some time in France and what you’re describing is completely normal there.

    10. I used to drink that much and at the time I did not feel like it was a problem. But now that I don’t drink regularly, it seems like a lot. I started to feel like I was craving it and “needed” it to relax at the end of the day and I didn’t like feeling like that so I quit. I also have a family history of alcoholism and so was worried about it getting out of control.

        1. I was thinking similarly. The amount itself while not ideal, wouldn’t be an issue for me. The daily habit might. Will he veto going to a restaurant or activity if the venue doesn’t serve alcohol, or make a big deal if you run out of booze at home? Anything indicating that he has trouble going without for a day or a few, is a red flag. And so is any way he pressures you or others to drink more.

        2. I was thinking similarly. The amount itself while not ideal, wouldn’t be an issue for me. The daily habit might. Will he veto going to a restaurant or activity if the venue doesn’t serve alcohol, or make a big deal if you run out of booze at home? Anything indicating that he has trouble going without for a day or a few, is a red flag. And so is any way he pressures you or others to drink more.
           But those issues are not a given, imo.

    11. This would be normal to me and my group of friends. For reference, we are 40s+.

        1. Same, although I am the sober one because I DO have a problematic relationship with alcohol. Most of my friends have a glass of wine or a beer with dinner each night. This is NBD at all to me.

        2. Same. I’m curious about all the people who say “I would not be comfortable with that.” What, exactly, are you uncomfortable with? I am a 112 pound woman, and if I had a glass of wine, I guarantee you would never know it–I’m not slurring, lurching, acting a fool, etc. I would understand if there were some sort of negative consequence, but barring that, if the effect is the same as having a Coke every night, I don’t see what’s objectionable. Unless you’re worried about the health effects–in which case I’d want to see the receipts on just how clean you eat, how many minutes of hard exercise you do per week, etc., in order to assess whether or not you have the high ground here.

        3. Yes another 40s+ suburban with kids here to say this is normal to me and my group of friends. A glass of wine sipped over dinner nightly (or a beer with pizza on Friday nights) and maybe a drink or two more while at a party or event on a weekend. Rarely getting even tipsy and even more rare to be drunk.

    12. I think it’s OK – not peak healthiness, but fine. And that’s OK! We all have habits that aren’t perfect. If y’all are younger, I imagine this will evolve over time to drinking less. The main thing for me is, can you talk about drinking in a productive way? If you see the drinking evolving into dangerous territory, can it be discussed? Does he care about your feelings with stuff like this?
        This is similar-ish territory, I think, to dating a smoker or . We all know that long-term, it’s not good for you, but you have to know what YOU are ok with. Someone who has a history of alcohol abuse may think this is a dealbreaker. You may think it’s fine. That’s ok!

    13. I agree that this is technically too much by health standards (and indeed may be unusual when looking population-wide at habits of Americans). However, this amount of drinking is very very common among my social circle of upper-middle income millennials. A glass or two of wine or beer at night at home and several drinks while out for dinner or with friends on the weekend would be completely fine with me. I have had times in my life where I drank that much and definitely did NOT consider it to be a problem. At the same time, I’d want to see that drinking was not a “need.” In my circle, it’s totally normal for someone not to drink on a given day due to health, work/life business, etc. Generally I think folks slow down drinking in general with age, having kids, or getting healthier as a whole. (Exception: all those runners who “run to drink beer.”)

    14. I think the people calling this normal are lawyers. IME daily drinking is normal for lawyers and certain people of my parents’ generation, but not for most working adults.

        1. Anon 11:27 here. I already discussed my drinking habits above, which are in line with many of my friends’ habits.

           We’re late 20s, no lawyers, most of us don’t have crazy or overly demanding jobs (engineers, accountants, programmers, project managers, city planners ), with the exception of the few who work for the Big 4.

           It just seems the norm in our “late 20s, big city” lives.

        2. This s1te has a lot of very heavy drinkers. I know no one who drinks like this, and I lived in major cities in my 20s. That doesn’t mean it’s “wrong” but I do think it’s unusual.

        3. Not a lawyer, and only have one acquaintance who is (although my husband’s father and brother are both lawyers) and this level of drinking is also very normal in my friend group. Early 30s suburb-dwellers, most without kids. Based on conversations I’ve had at work, I have reason to believe that most of my coworkers who drink also consume a similar amount of alcohol. I am in the Midwest, for what it’s worth. I do think people tend to drink more here vs the coasts, in general.

    15. I don’t think that’s a ton.

    16. Alcohol consumption is just weirdly skewed. Lots of people don’t drink at all, while more than half of alcohol is consumed by just 10% of Americans. According to this, 70% of Americans drink no more than 2 drinks per week, and your boyfriend would be in roughly the 90th percentile:

        https://arg.org/news/drinking-norms-in-the-us/

    17. I think the best way to think of it is if drinking is interfering with your life. Different people have different tolerances so someone who drinks less might find it interferes while someone who drinks more may not. Personally, I think if your main source of fun involves alcohol/you don’t feel like you can have fun without a drink, that might be worth reevaluating your relationship with alcohol. But that’s just me.

    18. I don’t think what you describe is all that abnormal if the person is an extrovert who is meeting up with folks a few times a week. (For context, I have a drink a few times a year and my husband doesn’t drink.)

        I think the bigger issue is how you feel about it. I tend to work most weeknights or do chores. So being with someone who was pretty social most nights would be a dealbreaker for me at this life stage whether alcohol was involved or not. If I had few work commitments and a pretty active friend group like I did when I was in my 20s, it would be NBD. (Assuming the person wasn’t drunk frequently or had problems going sober for a few days, as you describe.)

16. So this is my Do The Thing task that I’ve been putting off: I need to go retrieve an envelope that has emergency contact information and a house key from a friend I’m no longer really friends with. There was no big blow-up or anything; we used to be pretty close, and then through the pandemic we dropped out of touch and now really aren’t in contact any more. She lives in my neighborhood, so about six years back we thought it would be good for her to have our emergency info and a key to our house in case something ever happened while we were out of town (or to us, while we were on vacation). But it feels weird for her to have it, given that I feel like we barely know them now. I would not want for her to have to step in and help our family if something did happen to us, and so I don’t want her to have the envelope any more; I plan to give it to my aunt and her wife, who live in town (and who we see pretty regularly).

    I’m struggling with how to make the request. Do I send her a text message and just say – hey, I need to pick up that envelope we gave you a few years back with our key in it? And then go pick it up? I am worried about having to make awkward small talk when I see her (side note: sometimes I feel like half my choices have been driven by trying to avoid awkward small talk). Like I said, there’s no bad blood, but it’s weird for me to see this person who used to be one of my closest friends, and the last time I saw her was a year ago and then I make this request out of the blue and she has to deal with it. Can I send my husband to go pick up the envelope, which feels like a cop-out and makes the situation even weirder, but takes the burden off of me to deal with it? (He’s much less neurotic about these types of interactions.) I know people here are good with scripts and how to frame requests. Any help you can offer is appreciated.

    1. “hey, I need to pick up that envelope we gave you a few years back with our key in it? And then go pick it up?”

       Yes you do exactly this. Don’t overthink. If she is there just say “hi, thanks, gotta run”. Don’t send your husband unless he comes with you like you’re going out to eat together right after (which is also a good excuse for “gotta run”).

    2. I mean, do you have to take it away? Why not just make a duplicate of the key for your aunt?

       If you feel weird having a key just ‘out there’ I get it but it doesn’t seem particularly unsafe here. If you feel strongly I’d probably say “hey we were refreshing our emergency contacts – we now have family in town who can do that for us so we can unburden you from The Envelope! Mind if I swing by to grab it?”

       1. +1

       2. I think this phrasing is really good.

       3. +1 I’m such a lazy person and this is obviously a huge mental hurdle for you… I just wouldn’t do it.

          I’d add that I am an excessively unworried person, so I would legit never give it a second thought that she has a key and someone’s phone number…. so take my position with a grain of salt. Do you think she’d break into your house? I also throw keys away a lot anyway, I probably would have thrown yours away by now if I was her :D I know I’m a bad person

       4. cosign. I think this is something that you can just let go.

    3. This is weird. Just make your aunt a new key. You don’t need to pick this up or do this at all.

    4. Just change your locks. It’s relatively inexpensive (just did a whole single family home in an VVHCOL area for $250) and a lot easier.

       1. +1

       2. I too would just change the locks.

       3. That’s super avoidant. I think OP can use her big girl words rather than paying $250+ so she doesn’t have to.

          OP your former friend doesn’t need a long rambling explanation from you. Just ask if you can pick up your key sometime soon. Period.

       4. I wouldn’t spend $250 to change my locks because I’m afraid of approaching a former friend. I would either make a copy to give to aunt or let it go. She probably forgot all about the key and didn’t want to be weird by giving it back. I’d let this one go and just spend the $10 (or however much it is) to feta a new key made.

    5. You don’t need a script, you literally just typed the words you need to say. But I’d first ask if she even still has it/remembers where it is. Six years is a long time to keep track of an envelope.

    6. I was going to suggest a white lie “we need the spare key for our new cleaning person”, but you could of course just make another key.

       1. Or even just “Hey, I lost my spare key and haven’t found time to make a fresh copy. Any chance you still have The Envelope? If so, can I swing by tonight to retrieve it?”

    7. Thanks for the replies thus far.

       So the envelope doesn’t just have the key in it, it also has the passcode to the filing cabinet where we keep our will and list of financial accounts (and the note with the passcode says “this is where our wills/account lists are”) photocopies of our passport info pages (you know how you’re supposed to leave copies of your passport info page at home or with someone in case you lose your passport when you’re abroad? We made copies and kept one set and gave her the other set) and it also has a list of phone numbers she can call in case of an emergency. I don’t know why I am worried about her having this info – if she was going to break into our house or steal our identities, I’m sure she would have done it by now – but having that information “out there” just bothers me. It is comforting to hear that this is probably something I can just let go, and also that she may not even have kept track of the envelope. I do worry about – what if her house gets broken into and someone finds the envelope with our stuff in it? But that’s probably not enough of a concern to warrant me reaching out to her and getting the envelope back. Appreciate everyone’s input.

       1. Would it be possible to ask her to mail it all to you when she has a chance?

       2. How about asking her to drop it in your mailbox when convenient or leave on your porch?

       3. You probably should have thought about those security issues before you gave it to her. Would you have felt differently about a potential break in when you were still actively friends with her?

          1. Thanks for chiming in with the abrasive and unhelpful take we were all waiting for! Lol

17. My Outlook just updated and now there is an emoji button right next to the reply/reply all/forward buttons. I’m worried I will accidentally “thumbs up” when I am trying to start a reply message and for the life of me I can’t figure out how to disable this feature. Has anybody figured out how to turn this off?

    1. I work with a ton of Italians who are VPs and SVPs in our company and they all regularly use emojis particularly the blushing smiley. I’m not what the connotations of blushing smiley are in Italian; maybe I’ll ask someday.

       1. This is ridiculous. Italians do not use certain emojis more than others.

          1. Oh so you’re saying this person’s lived experience is invalid because of your opinion?

          2. I work at an international company with a very large branch in italy and I work with a large number of italians. I don’t know why but a few specific people keep using this face in emails – 😊
             they also use ciao and dears to start emails.
             it’s not something i mind. They’re all nice guys (they are all guys)

          3. I’ve spent a lot of time in Italy and exchanged emails and texts with a number of different Italian people. They do use emojis in more formal contexts than Americans do IMO.

       2. For me it’s the laughing-but-also-sweating emoji. That’s … how I feel all the time lol.

          OP, I have no idea how to disable it and I wish Outlook would stop with these weird updates.

          1. Mine is the red face with wide open eyes. It’s a dual function “I’m embarrassed” and “I can’t believe she said that,” which my sister and I use a lot in a side text whenever the family group text goes off the rails (which is often.)

             1. Now I’m seeing if I can use it here, like the poster above did – 😳

18. What is the appropriate amount for a b mitzvah gift? Family is in norther NJ and I grew up with the dad. Is $50 too little? $75? I don’t want to go too high bc I don’t want to set unreasonable expectations for him to gift to my kids in a few years. (I know the multiples of $18 tradition, but looking for ball park).

    1. I give $54 usually but I’m in the Midwest – assume NYC/NJ is much more.

    2. Is the whole family invited or just a child?

       1. While family. The kids don’t really know each other. The relationship is me and the dad. My parents will be there too. For my cousin’s daughters and my nieces I’ve spent about $100 on physical gifts. Not sure if $100 is too much here. Not that I mind spending the money bc I’m thrilled for my friend to have his son reach this milestone, just don’t want to look like the a-hole bc I spent too much.

          1. I’d probably give around $50 a person. I try to cover the plate for all of these types of events.

          2. is this like a commuter town in northern NJ bc I’d say $100 is too little and you’d look cheap

    3. I gave $532 recently from my husband and myself for a Northern NJ b mitzvah. Was held at a a caterer’s in Livingston.

    4. NNJ here. When my son was in the B Mitzvah circuit, he gave $54. But that’s him going alone. You’d have to adjust appropriately if attending with your family.

    5. I would do $108 in this circumstance.

    6. the whole family is going? at least $72, but probably $180. My parents are going to my sister’s niece’s bat mitzvah (like her husband’s sister’s daughter) this coming weekend in a suburb of nyc and was told by friends in the know to give $360. (my parents live in the DC area)

    7. I would say in the $150-$250 range if the whole family is invited to the party as well as the service.

19. When I set up my out of office responder for parental leave, should I call it that? I work in a conservative industry with both internal stakeholders (where I wouldn’t hesitate to say “parental leave”) and external stakeholders who may email me without knowing the reason for my absence. Also, I’m planning to keep my return date a bit vague, since I won’t know for sure until baby is born. Is that okay?

    Any other last-minute advice for ramping down/coverage planning? I have five weeks left and can’t believe how much I have left to do!

    1. I think writing down parental leave makes sense. (If you’re in the US) I think that would also help ring a bell that you’re most likely out on some sort of FMLA protective leave and so you really won’t be responding to emails, etc.

       Last time I was out on a leave, I kept an active log of projects I’m working on, projects I’m aware of, tasks I have queued up, etc. I kept that on an internal shared drive. So if I did leave unexpectedly, the information was there and available for my manager and team members to find.

       1. Agree with all of this, particularly to be prepared that you may be out unexpectedly and with little warning. I went out with basically no notice around week 37.5, so was really happy I had prepped beforehand.
          For me, bulletpoints of key contacts, key deadlines, and current status were incredibly helpful, like below:

          – Jones v. Smith
          – client contact with contact info
          – opposing counsel with contact info
          – upcoming deadlines
          – last thing that happened
          – (if not already clear) where to find all the key info, or attached if easy to do so.

          I also agree to say parental leave as people will undersatnd you’re truly off line and not wait for your return. Make sure you have a contact for them to go to in the OOO message (assistant? practice group head? etc.) if they don’t know where to direct their message.

    2. If you have outlook you can set up 2 replies for internal and external, but in your situation I’d probably set the same for both. I set up my internal as parental leave with a vague “I’ll return mid-month” timeline. My external one was much more vague but that’s because I don’t have much external contact given my role. I assumed given my age and gender everyone would know what a 12 week leave would be for so I might as well name it.

20. I know we have convo after convo after convo about Ozempic and others over the past week or so, but I am considering trying them and I have a really basic question. I am considering trying those meds and how do I get them? I don’t really have a PCP because I keep moving and just not staying with one doc long-term, but I just made an appointment with someone. Can I just ask about it with them? Can they prescribe it or is it a specialist? I’m obese and I think I would be a candidate.

    1. This is exactly what the PCP is for, so you are absolutely doing the right thing by making the appointment with someone and asking. I move a lot too and hate finding a new doc. Good for you to get that started.

    2. PCP is the way to go. Good luck!!

    3. I see an Endocrinologist 4 times a year and she wrote my script for me (for weight loss, not T2D). Currently down 50 pounds in 5 months. It’s a true miracle drug. Finally obesity is being treated like a disease and not the plight of the lazy.

    4. This is exactly what you should do. You should do some research on your own as well before you go. Ozempic is not approved for weight loss. The weight loss version of it is Wegovy. Most doctors are not going to prescribe Ozempic just for weight loss. Med spas might. Don’t go that route. There is also Saxenda (which I am on), which is the oldest approved injection and daily, and Mounjaro. Mounjaro is the newest and is not approved for weight loss only yet. You should determine which, if any, of these are covered by your insurance first. They are each usually $1000+ per month without a prescription. I got my prescription for Saxenda from my gyno, but my PCP agreed that it was something that I should try. I do have appointments every three months to check my weight to make sure I’m losing as it is required for my insurance to continue to cover it.

21. Wow – just read through the morning thread and was surprised by the amount of negativity and jealousy! I just want to say that believing things like “you can’t be dedicated to fitness without ruining your life and family” seem like the kind of thought pattern that comes from wanting to justify inactivity, but ultimately inhibits you from developing the kind of lifestyle that you may want. It’s absolutely possible to get more active and fit and have it be healthily integrated into your life. You don’t have to cling to such negative beliefs in order to justify your inactivity – a more healthy approach may be, “I don’t do these things now, but I have the capacity to do them if I so choose.”

    This goes for being a kinder person, losing weight, having healthier relationships, dating, or anything else. You don’t have to decide anyone who has something you don’t must be miserable in order to make yourself feel better…

    1. I’ve tried it both ways. I know I have the capacity to be dedicated to fitness. I also know how it affects the rest of my life. What more do you want from me?

       1. Not the OP, but based on your tone what I want from you is to not extrapolate your experience to be everyone’s experience. “You can’t be dedicated to fitness without ruining your life and family” is just patently false, even if that may be your personal experience.

          1. Then I guess we agree! I just want people not to extrapolate their experience to everyone else.

       2. I’m sorry that taking a couple hours to yourself on a weekend seriously effed up your life, but your case is not the norm.

          1. There’s a difference between being a casual fitness enthusiast who works out 4-6 hours a week and being super athletic. I don’t think it was particularly negative but more realistic. I think of actors preparing for a physically intense role where they workout 4-8 hours a day. That’s obviously not realistic for most.

             1. Literally no one was talking about working out 4-8 hours daily.

       3. I’m convinced that everyone must be comparing apples to oranges in that conversation.

          I would call my friends and I really committed to fitness. Some things we do include: running marathons (including 2 friends who have BQ’d several times), 10 mile trail races, Olympic triathlons, 20 mile mountain bike races.

          No one trains more than 10 hours a week, which I don’t see as being in contrast with having a personal life or doing things besides training.

          Maybe people think 10-15 hours a week is excessive or maybe people know anomalies who train 30 hours a week and we’re all just discussing different things?

    2. FWIW I 100% agree with you, but I had no desire to wade in too deeply on that thread. I don’t know that there’s a way to get this message across to people who are set on being unreceptive.

       1. There really isn’t. Some people are just determined that it’s impossible to be active. l ‘Dedicated to fitness’ can mean a full day of activity every weekend or it can mean a 15 minute yoga video every day. There are a billion ways to be active. And physical activity is good for everyone irrespective of their body size. It’s good for mental and physical health. Has nothing to do with what size pants someone wears.

          1. 15 minutes of yoga every day doesn’t mean “dedicated to fitness” in my mind and also doesn’t produce someone who looks fit (and yes people’s perception of my fitness have a lot to do with my pants size).

             Maybe we were all just talking past each other if people were imagining such different fitness routines and outcomes!

             1. Doing physical activity every single day is dedication. Who cares if someone looks big or small? Maybe try to be a little less judgy?

             2. Looking fit (as measured by pant size) has almost nothing to do with being fit. Pant size is mostly about amount of body fat and It’s all about nutrition.

                In my mind doing something daily means you are committed to it.

          2. 15 min of yoga was not what the poster was asking about though. She said she wanted to be an athlete level of fitness.

    3. This. DH and I take turns having weekend mornings ‘off’ until 11am. I sleep in until 10am and then have a minispa time at home for an hour. I’ll do a yoga video here or there throughout the week. He gets up at 7am and runs for 3 hours. Also runs for 2 hours twice a week after kids are in bed in the evenings. I watch home reno shows or read. Doesn’t impact my life in the least. We eat breakfast as a family 5/7 mornings and dinner 6/7 evenings (weekly date night) unless something crazy is happening at work. It’s not hard to integrate intense exercise if that’s what floats your boat. People are not living their healthy lives at anyone.

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