Weekend Open Thread

173 Comments

1. How much should we worry about “silent majorities” who stay quiet about certain issues, but then vote in line with their actual preferences? It seems plausible that there are some specialized issues where silent majorities come into play, but in an age where Trump can literally say anything, including “stand back and stand by” and no one seems to care, is it really true that there are things you “just can’t say out loud”? Or is it that the right is emboldened to say anything now, but the left isn’t? I have no idea what to make of any political polling these days.

   1. I think in 2016 there were a lot of people who voted for Trump but were afraid to say so to pollsters (or to their friends/family). I hope (?) that’s less true now, since he won and supporting him is no longer something people feel secretive about. One thing that’s better now is that Joe Biden crosses the 50 percent mark in many polls, which Hillary never did. Even though they’re the same margin, 51-47 is a much better lead than 48-44, because it means even if the undecided voters all break for the candidate who appears to be losing it won’t change the result.

   2. It’s cold comfort, but I think the 2016 secret Trump voters were mostly misogynists, and they don’t have the same issue with Biden. (Looking at all you, “I can’t put my finger on what I don’t like about Hillary” dudes…)

      Also, there were moderate Rs who voted for Trump because they thought the institution would keep him from going off the rails. Now they formed the Lincoln Project.

      I really hope I’m right. This is why I don’t sleep.

      1. My understanding is that none of the Lincoln Project guys (except George Conway I guess) actually voted for Trump the first time. Same with the ex-Rs I know in real life, including my father. They all left the party in 2016 and most of them even voted for Hillary. I don’t really think there’s been a lot of Republican defection post-2016, unfortunately.

         1. Although I agree with you that there are some misogynistic men who stayed home or voted for McMullin or Gary Johnson who are likely to vote for Biden now. I think Biden is definitely picking up a larger share of disaffected Republicans than Hillary did because of sexism, I just don’t think there are a lot of people who actually voted for Trump in 2016 who’ve changed their minds about him.

            1. Aren’t those same people going to be worried about Harris with an old president?

            2. It’s more unconscious bias than anything. These aren’t people saying “I don’t want a woman for president” (those people do exist! But they’re not who I’m taking about). These are the guys who just didn’t like Hillary for reasons they couldn’t describe. And no it doesn’t seem to be an issue, because Harris is second in command. A woman assisting a man is much more palatable to people than a woman leading. Sure there’s a possibility she’ll be president but they’re not voting for a woman to lead. It matters.

            3. I am a registered Republican who voted for McMullin in 2016 and am voting for Biden this time around. The change in my vote isn’t due to misogyny, but because I think Biden seems acceptably moderate and I didn’t think the same about Hillary. I also thought Trump was an idiot and an a**hole in 2016, but was hopeful someone would confiscate his phone and that he would listen to his advisors. Obviously, it didn’t turn out that way. I live in a deep, deep blue state so my vote doesn’t matter either way FWIW.

         2. Anon @ 3:05PM I disagree — I am personally witnessing a lot of R defection in my swing state (WI). Including my own husband (and no I don’t want to get into it — 2016 was not a good year for us). This really isn’t about policy anymore…it’s starting to boil down to human decency.

            1. It was about human decency in 2016 too.

            2. Yes. It was about human decency in 2016. We warned the rest of you. But no, couldn’t possibly listen to the coastal elite OR the blue collar workers who got screwed in Trump’s business dealings. Thanks, rest of the country.

            3. In the defense of the people who voted for Trump in 2016, the Republican Party has a history of surrounding their nominees with experienced staff. People probably assumed that the Pence pick and the pre-announcement of qualified advisors meant Trump would do the same. Instead, he burned that script.

   3. I’m really worried about. I think a lot more people are racist than we care to admit and Trump’s pleas to “protect the suburbs” really resonate with them. Those same people think the police are their friends and are aghast at the idea of defunding the police, and don’t even really understand what the movement means. They just think they won’t be able to call 911 when a black guy from the city crawls in their bedroom window. That is what these people are afraid of. Those people are voting Trump out of fear, but not telling their friend and families about it.

      1. Edit to add – not telling their friends and families because they know it is racist and racism is bad yet they are still scared.

      2. That’s interesting that you bring up that example because I think there are actually a lot of liberals with fairly nuanced views on policing and public safety, but I’ve definitely noticed (in my personal life) that these people are afraid to challenge “abolish the police.” There’s a lot of middle ground between “I’m afraid of black people and love police” and “I want to get rid of the police entirely.”

         1. +1 on this. Social media has been taken over by a minority of loud voices in support of extreme policies. I think NYT lost it’s credibility by listening just to them. It’s like the primaries where one of the reporters at another New York outlet had to apologize for getting it wrong, mistaking the loud enthusiasm at Bernie events for a groundswell of support for his positions. The Warren and Sanders results show that is not the case.

   4. Yes because when living through the “woke wars” in my area, if you ever say anything out of step with the deepest liberal ideals, you will be attacked as a racist, misogynist, xenophobe, etc., etc. Eventually, you get tired of the constant battle and just shut your mouth and roll your eyes.
      That being said, I’m personally voting for Biden (the first Democrat I’ve ever voted for in my life; I usually vote for republicans or third party candidates) because of how disgusted I personally am with Trump. But I can understand how there could be a big group of people who remain silent and continue to vote for Trump.

      1. Most Trump voters don’t live in areas with “woke wars”, they live in areas where it is very much ok to espouse all kinds of racist and sexist ideas, especially if you call those ideas religious beliefs. There are people in every ideological group, including progressivism, who are super intense and quick to judge others for not being perfectly “woke” (or “pious”, “constitutional”, “loyal”, “pro-life”, “intellectual”, etc.). I’m sorry you’re having to deal with some of them. But I don’t think a localized cluster of tone policing progressives is having any discernable impact on the silent majority, especially in a country where our president is openly misogynistic and refuses to decry white supremacy.

         1. I don’t think that’s really true – everyone is saying that the suburbs of major cities, especially suburban white women, is going to be the key to this election, and I definitely feel like there’s a lot of woke war tension in these areas. Definitely Trump’s most diehard supporters are in rural areas where it’s common to be openly racist and sexist, but he needs votes from people outside his core base to win.

            1. This!

            2. I think there is definitely woke war tension too, especially on social issues. We need to find ways to meet in the middle and not let cancel culture rule the day.

            3. The phrase I like is “the woke need to make room for the waking.” In some areas, I’m woke. In some, I’m waking. And in some, I just don’t agree with the progressive position.

               But none of this a reason to believe that people who don’t even believe that systematic racism exists are turned off by disagreements amongst liberals.

            4. +1 million.

            5. I like “the woke need to make room for the waking,” but in some cases, the woke need to make room for dissent. I actually have seen some woke people do really well on the education side of things, but the dark side is that some assume that anyone who disagrees is uneducated rather than merely in possession of a different opinion. I once had somebody send me some really basic 101 articles on a social issue that shall remain unnamed, but all I could do was scoff because I arrived at my different opinion after 6-7 years of pretty intense reading and reflection.

   5. I think QAnon types are deliberately lying because they feel misleading polls helped Trump win last time. Hopefully there aren’t enough of them to matter, though it sure does not seem that way on social media.

      1. Those social media accounts are all fake, I wouldn’t read too much into that.

         1. I’m thinking exclusively of people I know personally who like and repost stuff from those accounts! I worry more about the followers.

   6. I don’t know about silent minorities being a huge factor, but I do think that some liberals need to step back and appreciate when progress is being made, even if it’s not perfect. It’s a real turn-off to, say, create an amazing new program that will deliver food to hungry people in your county, but then get criticized because the proposal didn’t center homeless non-binary disabled immigrant WOC on every page. However, I do think that the people who are THAT extreme are mostly just Twitter warriors – the issue is that sometimes they yell the loudest. I wish we could find a way to bridge the advocacy gap between them and your typical, average person who cares about others and wants to do the right thing. I think it would help end the “woke wars” if we could all just assume good intentions and appreciate progress.

      1. I agree with this completely.

   7. I’m hoping that PA and AZ got Biden and lock it in for him. Biden is from Scranton, PA and McCain came out in support of Biden. FL and TX will still go to Trump.

      1. Biden could take Texas. It’s not a guarantee but they’re tied in the polls.

         1. I would be thrilled if he took Texas but I really think it unlikely.

         2. They’re not tied in the polls in Texas. Trump is leading by an average of 5 points. Texas is a state where Democrats typically outperform their polls, but it’s very much a long shot.

      2. Texas, yes. I think he has a good shot at Florida.

   8. The enthusiasm gap is epic and the polls are polling registered voters. The hard-core anti-Trump people are in California and New York. There are literally spontaneous Trump dance parties in city streets.

      1. Most polls try to poll “likely” voters. I’m not saying it’s perfect but it’s definitely not as simple as just polling all registered voters. I’m not sure I really buy that there’s an enthusiasm gap. I’m in a Rust Belt swing state and while there is still strong Trump support in the rural areas, the suburbs are fired up to vote for Biden in a way that they weren’t for Hillary. I’ve also noticed that many rural houses that had Trump signs in 2016 now have signs for our Republican governor and congressional candidates but no Trump signs. Maybe I’m reading too much into that, but I feel like enthusiasm for Trump is lower here than it was in 2016. Just because a small minority is loud doesn’t mean that’s the majority opinion.

         1. It’s good to hear enthusiasm for Biden exists somewhere. There seems to be none in the swing state where I live. It’s “Trump” or “not Trump.” Enthusiasm for voting also seems to be low.

            1. No MAGA hats or Trump signs in my suburban Chicago area. Not to say there aren’t Trump supporters, but not highly public.

            2. I mean, I think many Biden voters are more enthusiastic about getting Trump out than about Biden himself. But I don’t think that matters as long as they’re enthusiastic about voting.

2. I’m 5’3. I have a pair of OTK boots- black, flat, faux suede. I rarely wear them because I haven’t found a way to make them look relatively classy. I think on taller women maybe it works better? I might have tried to wear them to the office once or twice (ah the nostalgic days of dressing up to go into the office) with black tights and a sweater dress or similar type of vibe and it just didn’t feel right. I’m not willing to say it can’t be done, but it doesn’t work on me.

   1. I’m 5’2, and I’ve never felt that OTK boots are right for me. I have a friend who is 6′ even, and she can rock the OTK boots!

   2. +1 While I don’t own a pair, I have tried them on, and at 5’4 I can’t find a way to make them look good with my style. I would love it if these boots ended under the knee – then, they would work perfectly with my winter skirts and sweaters while keeping my legs warm. I have one older boot that hits at the knee – equestrian style I guess, and it just works best for me. I will be stalking la cannadienne’s this winter, but since they are so warm, I want them tall (but not over the knee).

   3. I’m 5’4 and also not a fan of OTK boots. I did have a pair of flat ones that felt not too bad, but honestly I just never loved them and donated them last spring. They seemed bulky with jeans and a little inappropriate with short skirts.
      Speaking of boot heights – there was a thread about what boot length is current. I know consensus is that booties or biker boots were in and equestrian style knee-highs were out, but I feel like I’m seeing a lot of higher boots with midi dresses in a kind of 70s-80s revival this fall. What are people’s thought on this? I am currently wearing sneakers and leggings, so it’s not a pressing need or anything, but I do like taller boots in general and am wondering if they are back on trend?

      1. I chimed in on that conservation yesterday and I am thinking riding boots might be trending back “in.” 2 different high-end shoe companies I subscribe to emails from BOTH sent emails in the past 24 hours advertising riding boots.

         1. Equestrian boots and to the knee 70s boots are trending back in, so if you have them from the last round, dust them off and wear them with midi length dresses and skirts.

         2. I had riding boots as a high school student b/c I rode horses in Muttontown every weekend and I had to dress the part at the club. I personally wore them only at the stabels b/c they were very tight on my legs and I did not like it. I think that if you are very skinny and have muscular legs, you can get away wearing them around town, but if you don’t, then they can be agony! Rosa was abel to wear them for years, and it was only recently, after her 4th child, did her legs get to chunky to wear them. Ed doesn’t care b/c she still looks good, even with chunky legs. I can only imagine what my legs would look like after 4 kids!

   4. Jean on Extra Petite wears them, and I don’t think she is more than 5’0″ or so. Check out her posts for styling ideas? I don’t own any.

      1. I feel like Jean on Extra Petite is just a magical person who can wear anything and make it look good.

         1. Yes.

         2. Jean is proportioned like a tall slim model, just scaled down. Much different from sort-of-petite me, who is proportioned like a soccer player.

         3. I think Jean is a rare example of a fairly long legged short person, and the way clothes look on her is closer to the way that they look on a model instead of the way they look on most short people.

      2. I did actually just look this up because I was curious how she pulled it off. Unfortunately for me (bc mine are black), I think her best looks are the casual ones with brown/gray boots and black leggings. Even she isn’t pulling off the black OTK boots with dresses/skirts, in my opinion. Now I wish I had brown/gray ones.

      3. There is a tremendous difference in wearing something for a picture and having it look good and wearing it all day.

         1. This. I think Jean is gorgeous and tailors/styles her clothes just about perfectly, BUT she definitely knows her camera angles and making something look good in a photo isn’t the same as making it look good in person.

            1. She is also skinny so it offsets her lack of height. Proportions matter a lot.

   5. Ariana Grande is the queen of OTK boots and she is only 5’3 (as am I). I don’t do the sweatshirt with no pants look like she does, but I do Spanx leggings + long (butt covering) sweater with them and I like it.

      1. OP of this comment coming to add – I gained 30 pounds in the last year with the pandemic, a breakup, and a new medicine, and my two pairs of OTK boots sadly don’t fit anymore. So pay attention to the leg measurements if anyone is considering ordering.

      2. I think Ariana Grande looks ridiculous in those boots. Like a preschooler playing dress up.

      3. I’m the 5’2 poster above who can’t make OTK boots work. I think Ariana Grande looks cute in her OTK boots–but she wears much, much shorter skirts than I’m comfortable wearing in my everyday life. AG’s shorter skirt (or just sweatshirt) gives a better proportion with the OTK boots. If I wore them plus a skirt that I felt comfortable in, there wouldn’t be enough skin between the hem of the skirt and the boots to make the proportions look right.

   6. As with midi skirts, I think your torso-to-inseam proportion is a major aspect of this. I’m all body and no leg, so OTK makes me look like a human Puss in Boots. Not cute.

      1. lolllll this describes my body type perfectly. I’m sticking with either riding boots (with skirts or leggings, not jeans). Booties aren’t great on me either since they break up the leg too much, so I’m ignoring that trend entirely.

   7. In my experience you can buy brand new OTK boots cheaply at all kinds of consignment and
      resale stores probably because people can’t make them work. So check those before buying new.

   8. I’m 5’2″ and love my OTK boots! I wear them like I would any other boot, but my favorite is with jeggings and a front-tucked sweater to define my waist. I wore them once to work with black tights and a sweater dress, but mine are light colored and I felt out of place – super cute weekend outfit though!

   9. I am close to your height and I agree…I think they look a little too “trying to be sexy,” at least on me.

   10. OTK do and always will read Julia Roberts in Pretty Woman (aka hooker shoes) to me.

       1. +1. I can’t think of them as anything other than a hooker look or perhaps a stage / costume look.

          1. +1 Glad this trend is on it’s way out, it induced too many bad styling decisions.

       2. Those boots were mid-thigh. Boots that just barely go over the knee are a very different look.

   11. I’m 5’4” and my mom calls me “puss in boots” when I wear them, so I think she’d agree that they don’t work on my proportions. But I think i look as adorable as a cat playing dress up, so I rock them and tell myself she’s just jealous that I’m short and stylish and have fun boots.

       1. Many OTK boot styles make everyone look like Puss in Boots. Only the ones that are skin-tight at the top without an obvious cuff can avoid it.

3. I’m looking for large, quality ceramic mugs that won’t break the bank. Ideally, a set of 4. Here’s the part that I can’t seem to find – large handles. I don’t think of myself as someone who has large hands, but my current mugs have handles that are too small and are uncomfortable. I can’t fit all of my fingers into it comfortably without also touching the hot mug.

   1. I don’t know how fancy you are looking but I just got some nice mugs from Target that are generous in size and have comfortably-sized handles. The brand is Opalhouse. I went with the animal series (camel and peacock designs) but they have a large line of options.

   2. https://www.lowes.com/pd/Trademark-Innovations-Big-Giant-Coffee-Cup-Mug-by-Trademark-Innovations/1002703052?

   3. I love my Jamber mug: https://www.jamber.com/pages/shop

   4. Look up a company called Jars from France. My one mug from them feels expensive in my hands.

   5. Definitely hit up some thrift stores. That’s where I get my oversized mugs.

4. I had wanted to do the “wait until 8” thing and get my kid a phone in 8th grade, but coronavirus lockdown changed that (along with not having a home phone) and kiddo has limited use of an iPhone when home alone and for a set amount each day to text friends. Our schools have been closed since March.

   On my Insta, I am friends with a lot of moms of kids in their grade — 6th grade, the beginning of middle school. I am getting “you might know” notifications that the kids themselves are now on Insta. That seems really young to me — like the world is full of creepy older strangers and you are 11.

   I had wanted to keep kiddo away from the FOMO that is social media (especially since from pics these kids are routinely getting together and going out), now doubly so that they don’t get out much.

   What do similarly-aged kids do in your areas? I am really torn between wanting to give kiddo something that is “keeping up with people you’d like to see again” and feeling like kiddo is missing out on what the cool kids are doing. FWIW, I generally like and respect the parents of most of these kids (the others I don’t really know well), so maybe I’m the outlier?

   1. We refused to let our daughter use Instagram until she was 13 and old enough not to violate the user agreement. We were actually going to hold out longer, but we relented because of the pandemic. The “popular” kids just use Instagram to show off and make people feel left out. For example, my daughter’s former best friend (good riddance!) had a party and posted photos of “me with my 20 BFFs!” Her real friends hardly ever touch it. All the genuine interaction is happening via text, some Google thing (hangouts?), FaceTime, and Nintendo.

   2. This might not be popular but my general experience with social media was that once a critical mass of kids in your kid’s social circle start using something, stopping your kid from doing it is hard (not impossible – just really hard).

      If you decide to try, let them know the rules and that you will be enforcing. Set the parental controls but do not count on those since almost all of my daughter’s friends somehow figured out a way around those. Them be sure that any app they download to their phone syncs to yours. That will let you know if they download a prohibited app. That is not a 100% solution since they can use their browser but it is a start. Be sure as well that any photograph they take on the phone syncs to your phone. Then start taking custody of the phone every night before bed (a good idea anyway) and checking browser history and usage.

      The alternative (which is what I did but mine was 13) is walk them through creating a profile, explain the rules (which in my case including no posting a picture of another person without explicit permission, no posting pictures of yourself unless you are fully dressed in a way that would be appropriate for school, no posting pictures from your bedroom, and strict privacy settings), make sure they friend you/give you access, and let them lose in the world. We never had a problem but mine was not that into social media (although now that she is in college she is a Snap Chat fiend; they use it instead of texting).

      Eleven is very young so I would be inclined to go with option #1 but again see the critical mass comment above.

   3. I taught middle school a couple of years ago, and many parents of 5th/6th graders encouraged group texts with friends/classmates (often from a tablet or wifi-only phone that the parent monitors) as a way to stave off Instagram and other social media that could include people they don’t know. They also encouraged kids to use their school email accounts, which automatically blocked communication with anyone outside of the school domain.

      Some parents also used (fb) Messenger Kids, though that’s not as useful if the kid’s friends aren’t already on there. Marco Polo was a popular alternative to Snapchat since the videos don’t automatically disappear. Social media restricted to the family computer or parents’ phones was another thing people did to try to allow contact without completely giving up supervision.

      The next step seemed to be a private Instagram account, logged onto from a parent’s phone (or parent’s + kid’s), with clear rules about appropriate use and parental monitoring. Parents who tried to ban all social media, especially once the kids were actively asking for it and most of their friends were on it, ended up with students who had all kinds of secret accounts.

      Things I busted middle schoolers who were “not allowed” any form of social media doing:
      -using the social features of school-approved programs, like email and Docs, to goof off with friends during school
      -using Google Sheets to hold massive, coordinated group chats at night with a cover sheet that looks like homework. This gets around internet blockers and can be deleted afterwards (it was honestly pretty impressive)
      -staying off of the major social networking platforms to technically follow the rules, but getting into forums and obscure platforms that were less secure and had more adult weirdos in them
      -using in-game chats that their parents didn’t know about
      -downloading new apps that didn’t look like social media for the social features (usually things like games as opposed to fake calculator apps or whatever)
      -having social media accounts anyway, often on a friend’s device so that their own phone looked clean
      -having decoy parent-approved accounts and then finstas or other accounts they used for real
      -accessing secret accounts from alternate user profiles, private browsers, or in one case a virtual pc run in a sandbox so that the main computer looks clean
      -following all the parents’ rules about not being allowed on Snapchat and Instagram, but then never asking or talking about other social media platforms so they could sign up without technically disobeying mom and dad

      1. omg this is amazing

      2. OK, the list of caught-doings is straight up impressive. I honestly just got by on the sheer fact that my parents didn’t know what Twitter was.

      3. I’m impressed by kids’ creativity. I’m terrified for my own child.

         I’ve always had the mentality that kids are going to find a way. I remember when my friends’ parents tried to use parental controls to block MTV. Every single person found a way around those parental controls and watched anyways. The more things change…

   4. My kids had a phone at the start of middle school because they were walking to and from school. They didn’t have social media until about age 13 but it was Instagram, locked down setting. Like a private profile, no public, and only friends she knew in real life

      1. Absolutely not saying this is your kid, but I remember a friend telling me with all seriousness that her daughter only had one social media account and how carefully Mom monitored it.

         And then my daughter (who was neither prudish nor a tattle-tale) came to tell my that friend’s daughter was posting all kinds of inappropriate pictures of herself and my daughter was concerned that some “like gross old guy” would see them and reach out to her. Turned out she had multiple accounts and managed to get them all in under Mom’s radar.

         They were 13.

   5. Omg this whole thread makes me not want to have kids so I don’t have to deal with this

      1. Our parents were considered successful if they managed to get us to age 18 alive and not in prison. Now I have to figure out how to allow my ninth-grader the appropriate amount of on-line freedom while preventing her from destroying the rest of her life by accidentally or ill-advisedly posting the wrong thing.

   6. But to be honest, the real social media for kids that age is tik tok. Facebook is for grandparents and Instagram, while still cool, is not as cool as tik tok.

      1. Why is there a tik tok? If just for sharing short videos, can’t you do that on the other platforms? Or is it just that it’s where your parents aren’t?

         1. I really like tik tok. It’s just a different and more fun format than Instagram. Anyway, it is what it is, as POTUS would say. The kids like it and us saying why not just use Instagram isn’t going to change anything.

5. Do attractive fake flowers exist? We live in Texas so summers are very hot and everything basically dies (not to mention we have no interest in spending time outside watering in the summers). But our yard is very visible from many rooms in our house, so having flowers would be enjoyable. We would like to permanently install fake flowers and not have them look like they came from grandma’s house in 1950. Any recs?

   1. I haven’t seen this attempted before (to my knowledge), but it seems like they’d fade in the sun.

      1. I would guess you could get them treated with a UV protector just like you can with fabrics? But I’m not an expert.

   2. I have never heard of outdoor fake flowers. Look into plants that are adapted to your zone.

   3. They do fade in the sun. And they’re plastic, so they’re bad for the environment. Look into xeriscaping for low water plants that are adapted to your area. For example, lantana is a prolific bloomer that doesn’t bat an eye at 100° temps. There are lots more.

      1. I planted Lantana here in the desert southwest for the first time this year and it went bananas. Mine is the yellow and red variety, it’s very attractive, and all we had to do is put it where the drip system could water it three times a week. Did nothing otherwise and I practically have a lantana hedge.

   4. No, not for outside use. Look into Xeriscaping, desert landscape design and/or flowering plants common in Australia. Many plants are coming to mind that will thrive in your climate…

   5. Fake outdoor flowers is a strong no from me. Instead maybe look at native plants or install a drip irrigation system that can work on a timer (easy to diy, it’s just a hose you lay down on the flower bed.)

   6. Can you get cacti or some other plants that thrive in heat or low water environments?

   7. Artificial shrubs, ornamental trees that have been UV treated do exist. They’re sometimes used in open-air malls, shopping districts, and some theme parks. I know Autograph Foliage is one retailer, others probably exist. Of all the options, I think the flowering plants look the most fake, unfortunately.
      I second the folks above to look into xeriscaping, hardscaping, etc.

   8. Why would you do this? Climate-appropriate landscaping would be much more attractive.

   9. The realest looking fake flowers I ever had were white hydrangeas, but I didn’t have them outside. It was a phase I went through. I’m very over unnecessary dust collectors now.

   10. Nope. Not for outside use. Hideous.

   11. My sister lives in Austin and worked with a landscaper so that something is in bloom year round. I think in the winter months it’s red berries (holly type if not technically holly) so not technically a bloom, but still color. & googled and there’s lots out there about this so I encourage you to read up.

       Agree with a prior poster that a drip watering line is ridiculously easy to DIY. I have drip watering everywhere for water conservation reasons and I did it all by myself with very few, very fixable problems.

6. Update from awkward

   Guy who showed up drunk to my volunteer thing has been fired. Am assuming he was drunk at work prior to showing up to the volunteer thing.

   Anyway, thanks for the advice all. Hopefully he’s okay.

   1. Wowzers. That’s too bad.

   2. Right call, and I hope he can get the help he needs.

7. My husband decided to grow a beard and mustache during this work from home period. I hate it and have made jokes and comments to this effect to him, our friends, and family. I can’t help it, it’s so awful because he does next to nothing to groom it. We’ve barely kissed in the past few months, I’m so grossed out by it. However, on the flip side, I would be very hurt if he repeatedly made negative comments about my appearance. Should I lay off and try to accept it?

   1. I would say “Honey, I really don’t like kissing you with that mustache and beard. It’s prickly and scratchy and it makes what should be really fun just…not. I can’t tell you what to do with your appearance, but I wanted to let you know that I think it’s impacting our intimacy and I miss spontaneous kissing.” Don’t mention that you think it looks awful.

      1. Husband “Honey, I really don’t like having s*x with you now that you have gained the Covid 15 lbs, the extra weight makes it uncomfortable on my back. It’s making what should be fun just…not. I can;t tell you what to do with your appearance but I wanted to let you know that I think it’s impacting our intimacy.”

         So we would be good with that?

         1. I think hair and weight are quite different, the former is much easier to change and much more of a choice. I think a better analogy would be a guy not liking his wife’s hairstyle and I don’t think most people would flip out about a guy expressing a preference for long hair or something like that. I certainly wouldn’t. My husband doesn’t care about my hair, but if he did I would be willing to wear it how he liked it.

         2. Nope, bad analogy, never ok with picking on a spouse’s body size.

   2. Maybe talk to him directly instead of joking about it (especially to friends and family!). You have to acknowledge that it’s his decision and not something you can control, but you can honestly tell him how you feel about it and then accept whatever he decides to do with that information.

   3. Yeah, if you haven’t come right out and said you don’t like it and you think it’s a turnoff, you need to do that. And then if he decides to keep it anyway, I think you get to have one further conversation about how you’d prefer he groom it. And after that, alas, I think you have to keep your mouth shut.

      1. +1. Raise your preference without being insulting and then let it go. And I’ve been there. My husband does this from time to time. Last time I was pregnant he decided to not shave until the baby came for “good luck” and also, I think, because how could I object to that? It was awful. He looked ridiculous and also, yes, it was gross. By the end, he had a full beard and ladies he work with were pestering him about when he was going to shave it. So I feel your pain. But you are right, if the tables were turned, you would be rightfully annoyed if he kept harping on something like this. I cut my hair short once and my husband said he didn’t care for it, preferred my hair longer (which I already knew but did it anyway because I don’t make all my beauty/fashion decisions based on his preferences) but that was it, he didn’t bring it up constantly.

      2. Senior Attorney is ALWAYS on the mark. It is best to be up front about it with him, b/c beards and mustaches are generally dirty, and can harbor bacteria from food eaten the night or week before. If you present it as a health issue, he will understand why you do not want to kiss him. By the same token, I have found that men who do not shave often are hiding a weak chin or some other imperfection. Tell him you know what he looks like so that there is no need for him to cover his face. Dad said Lebron James now has a beard that makes him look Rabinical! I laughed so hard but when I saw him on TV playing basketball, I agreed! If your husband does not want to lok Rabinical, he should shave it off quickly!

   4. One, definitely stop making jokes about it to your friends and family. Why do you think that will make him want to get rid of it more?? Two, I would definitely talk to him about grooming/keeping it cleaner – that’s a reasonable ask. But definitely lay off the jokes. My SO would be so hurt if I was joking to our friends and family about his physical appearance, and so would I. It’s not the way to get what you want.

      1. Also…my SO has a mustache and goatee, and he washes them along with his hair in the shower (I think with a 2-in-1 shampoo/conditioner?), which keeps them clean and also softer, so that it’s not painful when he kisses me. Maybe you could suggest that?

         1. Yes, I think it’s fair to ask for a washing regimen, and you can also give him some beard oil to soften it. I agree to drop the jokes and say something seriously, once, if he doesn’t already know how you feel and why.

   5. His body, his decision. How would you feel if he made remarks about your hair, clothes, gaining weight, etc.

      1. I’d say it’s not quite the same. When I started dating my husband, he was clean-shaven and had short hair. He’s always wanted long hair, but his parents wouldn’t let him grow it out and I don’t really like long hair on men. A decade into our marriage, his hair is below his shoulders, and has been for years now. It’s not my favorite look, but it’s clean and healthy and he loves it. But I draw a pretty hard line on the facial hair because it’s scratchy and irritates my skin. Every so often he decides he wants to experiment with growing it out and every single time I end up with a red neck/cheeks and just don’t want to kiss or snuggle. I’m not trying to be mean, it literally irritates my skin for days and kills the mood for physical intimacy. He’s not that set on it and he can’t really grow a proper beard anyways, so he keeps his face shaved. As for comments about her hair, I also have long hair, which he loves. He prefers that I wear my hair down, especially if there’s not particular reason for it to be pulled back. A benign example is going on a road trip, and I put my hair in a ponytail or a clip to wash my face and then just leave it when we get in the car. He’ll ask me to take my hair down. Not in a controlling way, but he likes to run his fingers through my hair and likes how I look with my hair down. So I think choosing to do things that are attractive to your partner, sharing what you like, etc. is not always a controlling or rude thing. Yes, make compromises if it’s a huge deal to your partner, like my husband’s long hair. And in his case, if he wants to be physically close to me, shaving is going to make that much more enjoyable for both of us. Weight is a whole different conversation, but I don’t think wanting your partner not to have facial hair that makes you itch when you kiss is unreasonable.

         1. I think it’s more of the jokes to friends and family that is the problem. How would you feel if that was happening? I’d be hurt, for sure.

            1. 100% the jokes are not cool, and I think she needs to address it with him privately. But I don’t think talking about how someone wears their hair is a bodily autonomy issue or the same as weight.

   6. It sounds like maybe grooming is the most important thing. Has he ever grown out his facial hair before? He might have next to no knowledge about how to maintain or groom facial hair.

      You might have to accept that he wants facial hair for now, and yeah, try not making fun of it (it’s obviously not working, if you wanted to shame him into shaving), but it’s fair to tell him that you would find the facial hair more attractive if he groomed it properly. Does he need help shaping and maintaining? Getting beard oil? Washing and keeping it soft? How is he with other products? if he’s not at all into grooming, you probably have less chance of success, but he might just not know that there are steps to proper maintenance.

   7. So my husband grew a covid beard and mustache and is keeping it. It’s not my favorite. My covid weight gain may not be his favorite, but he’s keeping me. And I’m keeping him.

      His beard tickles me when he’s just trimmed it and the ends are poky and sharp. It tickles less as it goes a little and the ends turn very slightly under (you wouldn’t be able to see this, but there’s a definite difference in how it feels.)

      For some reason he has a lot more gray in his beard than in his hair so that’s part of the reason I don’t like it – I don’t think it “goes” with the rest of him. But he wanted to stop shaving every day and how can I blame him for that?

      When his beard pokes or tickles me I tell him so and we just stop that activity.

8. In the spirit of sharing happy news, I’m getting married tomorrow!
   Like so many 2020 couples, we had to scrap our original plan. A restaurant buy-out for about 50 on the West Coast turned into a 12-guest, masked gathering in our SEUS backyard with no one from outside our local area, plus another 200-ish tuning in on Zoom. We’re so sad our parents and siblings–none of whom are local–won’t be here, but the beauty of it is that we’ve actually been able to include more people thanks to Zoom. We have loved ones tuning in from literally all around the world! And we tried to make it participatory for people who won’t be here. We asked people to make and send us luminaria that we’ll light tomorrow, and we have more than 100! My flower-girl niece will throw petals from a state away, and we sent our moms and grandmothers bouquets to match mine. His parents even bought themselves a wedding cake.

   1. Aww this is beautiful. Congratulations!! Thank you for sharing!!

   2. Congrats!! That sounds so lovely and I hope you have a perfect day!

   3. That’s so sweet! Enjoy!

   4. Congratulations, Maude! I love how you’ve included people who are far away.

   5. Oh, congratulations! This is so lovely!

   6. I am so happy for you, Maudie. Truly, from the bottom of my heart.

   7. Congratulations!!! As a fellow Covid bride-to-be, I am so happy to read your lovely news. I hope your celebration tomorrow exceeds all of your expectations.

   8. This sounds so sweet and lovely! It will be a great story for your family one day! In fact, I think it’d be a great story for some of the museums who are documenting life during Covid (Atlanta history museum, NY historical society, I’m sure there are many others). Congratulations!

   9. Actually it’s not a good idea to have a wedding in a pandemic –

      Completely kidding. If ever a pandemic wedding sounds responsible and still fun, yours does. Have a wonderful day!

   10. What wonderful news! Enjoy!!

   11. One of my cousins has canceled her fall wedding due to Covid and I LOVE the idea of buying a wedding cake to celebrate from afar. The bakery that made mine sells by the slice so maybe we’ll record a toast, eat some cake and send her the video.

       Congrats on your wedding! It sounds lovely!

   12. Beautiful. This makes my heart happy!

   13. That is really lovely, especially the family bouquets and cakes. You are off to a beautiful start.

   14. Congratulations! This is such a lovely story and sounds like it will be a beautiful event!

   15. Congratulations, I’m totally smiling reading this!! Have a wonderful wedding day!!

   16. So happy for you and wishing you a wonderful day. Congratulations!!!

9. I thought that this was cool when I was a kid and now it seems so, so, so soviet. Like it could have been on The Americans. Does this exist anymore now that the USSR is back to being Russia? The little girls doing it seemed so stoic and other-worldly cool in the clips I’d see as a kid.

   1. It definitely still exists and is still an Olympic sport. It is much less popular than artistic (regular) gymnastics in the US, but there are clubs in many metro areas. It remains extremely popular in many parts of Europe.

      1. I’ve been watching “Dark” (a German series) and there seems to be an after school rhythmic gymnastics club at their school in the scenes that take place in the 1980s and the present. There are a few places that hold classes in it in my large city, mostly run by Eastern European emigres.

   2. Yes it exists. It’s still an Olympic sport that many counties including the US participate in. What a weird question.

   3. It definitely exists and Vladimir Putin’s long-time mistress is a rhythmic gymnast. The jokes, they write themselves. It is in the Olympics!

      1. In Soviet Russia, gymnastics rhythm you…

10. Thanks to everyone for the ideas regarding my new driveway on Wednesday. I wanted to share the results, since the way things went down was a learning experience for me.

    As suggested, I rented a PO box. After filling out the paperwork, showing multiple forms of ID, getting keys, and paying for the year, only THEN did the clerk give me a change-of-address form and tell me that it is required and non-optional.

    So, I am not allowed to maintain the use of my street address while also having this PO Box. I will get absolutely no mail to my house for the next year, everything will be forwarded to the PO box. This is NOT what I intended–I wanted a separate address to use for FedEx and UPS drivers; forwarding within the postal system is completely irrelevant to me. But it’s done, and it’s nonrefundable.

    I have friends and family who were able to have a completely separate box, so I don’t know if this is a new rule, or if different towns have different rules. I also don’t have any recourse if a service refuses to deliver to a PO box–I expected to be able to get a full street address, which I’ve known people were able to do.

    Meaning

    Jane Doe
    123 Post Office Road #456
    City State USA

    as opposed to just

    Jane Doe
    PO Box 456
    City State USA

    So, this has been a strange and wild ride, and will be a giant PITA for the next 365 days. Hope this helps anyone who might want to obscure their address for whatever reason, and is thinking of using a PO Box to do so.

    1. Wow, that sounds terrible! Can you just do another change of address form and change it back? You’ll still have the PO box because it’s already registered for the year, right?

    2. That’s incredibly irritating, and I would honestly just get your packages delivered to the office or a friend’s.

    3. I literally just googled PO boxes USPS and you can see from the form that you can get a refund. First three months are non-refundable but I wouldn’t trust the clerk’s word that you are stuck with this for a year. I also don’t see how they prevent you from using your mailing address? Just continue to fill in that address when you want it delivered to your house and the PO box number when you want it delivered to the PO box.

       1. They can’t prevent anyone from writing my address on a package, they just won’t deliver to the house. Anything sent to my mailing address will be forwarded to the PO Box.

          I am thinking about going to the next town over and asking some questions, you are right about not necessarily trusting the local clerk. Maybe this is an issue because my post office is so small and lacking in resources; I’m at the edge of a semi-rural area.

          1. I have a post office box AND receive mail at home, no problem. If you submitted an address change from your home address to the new post office box, then your mail will all be forwarded to the post office box. If you rent a post office box and do not make an address change through the post office, you should be able to continue to receive mail at both home and the box. You can notify individual billing offices or businesses if you want them to change from your home address to your post office box. I love the set up with getting all financial mail to the post office box (less risk) and I love recycling lots of junk mail before it crosses the threshold to my house.

    4. https://about.usps.com/forms/ps1093.pdf

       Form necessary to change it back is specified.

    5. Thank you for the heads up! This makes no sense to me. I’ve had a P.O. box for years for professional reasons and haven’t had to have my personal mail forwarded to the P.O. box. What about people who get a P.O. box because they don’t trust the people they’re living with/are preparing to leave an abusive spouse? Or sole proprietors who are using the box for their business only?

       Maybe the clerk didn’t understand the rules? It’d be worth checking in with your local postmaster.

    6. I live in a city, so ymmv, but both UPS and FedEx have services available that allow you to receive mail and packages at their stores, complete with a street address so that you don’t have to worry about PO Box addresses being excluded from delivery options. Since they are private companies, it doesn’t affect your actual address and USPS won’t force you to forward anything.

       1. You don’t even have to have the package shipped to the store. You just go to the tracking page and have them hold the package at the store instead of delivering. It’s free with FedEx; not sure whether you have to pay the annual fee for UPS MyChoice to hold packages at the store.

    7. Well of course you can’t have your UPS and FedEx mail delivered to a post office box! You really should have thought that one through. You’re going to have the exact same problem when you order things, because you will still need to use your street address and FedEx and UPS will still be delivering to your home.

       1. I was told you can get one with a “real” address, as I mentioned above. I know people who have done it, though not in my zip code. That is what I was trying to do. I am aware that many places won’t deliver to one directly listed as being a PO box.

    8. For what it’s worth, when I moved to my current house 20 years ago I learned that we were required to get a post office box because we were close enough to our small town’s post office that mail would not be delivered to our address. I have come to love having a PO box, and you may too. There is a recycling bin at the post office, and I thin my mail by dumping all the junk mail in that bin. We skip picking up the mail for a few days at a time and it’s fine. Vacations (well, when we had those) are easy because the mail is automatically tended to. The big plus of a PO box is that the risk of people stealing your mail or using it to do identity fraud plummets.

       YMMV, and I understand how frustrating your experience sounds…but maybe (?) you’ll have the conversion experience I had?

11. I loathe wallpaper, but I have a ton of blank walls and no fine art budget (or even wallpaper budget — dang, that stuff is expensive!!!). I was thinking of getting wallpaper samples or sheets, which are more budget friendly, and putting in a frame and hanging on a wall (so if I get tired, I can put something else in the frame vs having to take down wallpaper or pay to wallpaper an accent wall or room).

    Yes? No?

    I seem to live where people have very “done” houses and yet I am really content with my decades-old post-college stuff. And apparently, a love of surfaces and a need to feel like I will get my deposit back (and yet: I own this place).

    1. You can starch fabric to your wall. It’s really cheap and great for an accent wall. Apartment Therapy has tutorials.

       I would probably buy enormous canvases and paint something abstract on them (or staple patterned fabric to them) before I tried framing wallpaper samples. I feel like the wallpaper samples are going to be too small to have the effect you want.

       1. I like these ideas. Wallpaper samples are smallish so you’d need to hang a grouping, which I agree is a bit different.

          Don’t overlook mirrors (cheap antique frame + cheap, lightweight mirror).

    2. Why not? This is what I did in my first apartment, and I really enjoyed it! The cheapest furniture on Craigslist at the time was Victorian style, so the apartment had a colorful, neo Victorian vibe that was trendy at the time, and the wallpaper samples were gorgeous even though I wouldn’t actually wallpaper a whole room. I have reused the frames over the years although they were cheap. (That landlord was 100% okay with holes filled in with toothpaste so long as he couldn’t see them–or that’s what he told me, and I got my deposit back!)

       As another low cost idea, the largest wall hanging I have is a photo I found on Flickr. I asked the photographer whether prints were for sale, and he sold me a high definition copy of the digital file at a low price. I printed it at Costco, and I hung it in an Ikea frame. Obviously it’s key that I loved the photo, and it’s not colorful so I don’t know what the print quality would be if it were or whether it would go as well with a minimalist frame, but it’s what I wanted.

       1. +1. I’ve had to fill large walls but 5 foot wide paintings are not in the budget. 5 foot wide canvas prints are, however, especially with a black Friday sale. Tons of lovely photography out there, but for that size, pick something with a very high resolution. The Hubble space telescope makes very high-res beautiful images of the stars, which are all in the public domain.

    3. I say go for it! It’s super low commitment and risk. Have fun!

    4. If you are shopping in-person, look at Goodwill!

    5. Sheets of wallpaper are like 24″ x 36″, so that may work for framing.

       Also, you can buy a whole role of Schumacher wallpaper which I think is a preferred brand by spendy people at Wayfair. Who cares if it is from last year or an odd lot if it is pretty?

    6. Two ideas for you. My large multi canvas abstract oil painting is something I saw on Craigslist and was painted by a woman who just paints as a hobby and sold it for the cost of the canvases to make room in her home. I love it and have moved twice with it. My friend went on some police department website where they sell stolen goods that have not been claimed during the required time period and the she bought a beautiful painting from there. There are gems to be found at every thrift store and estate sale – art does not have to be pricey.

    7. Go for it! Also, consider your textiles. I have at various times hung a small handwoven rug, a vintage kimono, and a small antique quilt.

       1. Yes for textiles, for reasonably priced wall art. One room of my house has very high ceilings and huge wall spaces, as a result. I have an old, graphic crazy quilt hung from a curtain rod on one wall, wonderful for the space. In another room, I have an old, worn Turkish rug, runner-type dimensions, hung between two sets of windows on a 2-story wall of windows. Both items cost far, far less than framing alone would have run for similarly sized pieces.

12. The Banana Republic Factory is having a great sale (plus 60% off reduced clearance price and free shipping), and unlike most clearance sales, they have a bunch of sizes left!

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