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Our daily workwear reports suggest one piece of work-appropriate attire in a range of prices.
Maybe I’m influenced by the still-lingering holiday spirit, but I’m feeling drawn to this beautiful evergreen-colored top. I like that it’s simple, except for a slight ruffle at the sleeves. I would wear this with a gray blazer, black pants, and black booties. It would also look great with leggings and a long cardigan on the weekends.
The shirt is $49.50 full price but comes down to $24.75 when you add it to your cart, and it's available in sizes XXS–L. (Unfortunately, the XL and XXL are sold out.) It also comes in crimson, which has petite and plus sizes available. Puff-Sleeve Blouse
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Sales of note for 10.10.24
- Nordstrom – Extra 25% off clearance (through 10/14); there's a lot from reader favorites like Boss, FARM Rio, Marc Fisher LTD, AGL, and more. Plus: free 2-day shipping, and cardmembers earn 6x points per dollar (3X the points on beauty).
- Ann Taylor – Extra 50% off sale (ends 10/12)
- Banana Republic Factory – Up to 50% off everything plus extra 25% off your $125+ purchase
- Boden – 10% off new styles with code; free shipping over $75
- Eloquii – Extra 50% off a lot of sale items, with code
- J.Crew – 40% off sitewide
- J.Crew Factory – 50% off entire site, plus extra 25% off orders $150+
- Lo & Sons – Fall Sale, up to 35% off
- M.M.LaFleur – Save 25% sitewide
- Neiman Marcus – Sale on sale, up to 85% off
- Spanx – Lots of workwear on sale, some up to 70% off
- Talbots – 50% off 2+ markdowns
- Target – Circle week, deals on 1000s of items
- White House Black Market – Buy one, get one – 50% off full price styles
And some of our latest threadjacks here at Corporette (reader questions and commentary) — see more here!
Some of our latest threadjacks include:
- What to say to friends and family who threaten to not vote?
- What boots do you expect to wear this fall and winter?
- What beauty treatments do you do on a regular basis to look polished?
- Can I skip the annual family event my workplace holds, even if I'm a manager?
- What small steps can I take today to get myself a little more “together” and not feel so frazzled all of the time?
- The oldest daughter is America's social safety net — change my mind…
- What have you lost your taste for as you've aged?
- Tell me about your favorite adventure travels…
Harper's Ferry
Has anyone been to Harper’s Ferry in the winter (January/February) and would you recommend it?
Anon
I mean, are you talking about a day trip from the DC area? If the weather’s good, go for it.
Anon
I mean, when I lived in DC there was a warm February day so we went to go hike. Nothing planned though.
Anon Lawyer
My family got a VRBO house there over Christmas one year. It was charming. Not a ton to do but pretty surroundings and if the weather is ok you can go hiking.
Ellen
Elizabeth, Happy New Year! Am I the only one at work today? I hope not, but if so, YAY to the HIVE for taking the day off! We will all be working by Monday, tho.
BTW, I think this blouse is cute, and the price is right. Since it is 100% polyester, you should know that some of us tend to sweat more then others, and 100% polyester does not breath the same way that cotton does, and at least in my case, I can become a little overheated after walking 2 miles, and need to have a change ready @ work, including a bra, so that I do not go through the day smelling funny. My ex used to kid me that I would get all worked up even w/o leaving the apartement, and you will see once you are my age, that we tend to want to avoid hotter and warmer fabrics.
Anonymous
Work wear goals for the year? I’m basically a schlub. I wear whatever fits and is clean and it’s often not great. Like, appropriate for the office and all, but not great. I’d love to gradually turn this around in 2020 but absolutely not by scrapping everything and spending a fortune buying all new. Looking for slow and steady steps to change.
Katie
I think my goal is to buy less (I bought a LOT of new things in 2019), and to make sure that all my pieces are well-maintained. That I stay on top of getting my heel tips replaced as needed and polishing scuffs, pre-treating any stains from coffee spills, and using a sweater shaver to remove pills from fabric. Maybe this is an easy place to start?
Anonymous
You’ve defined how you dress as “schlubby” and “not great.” What I’m not hearing is how you WANT to look. I’d start by defining “great.” If you could picture yourself going to work looking “great” in what you’re wearing, what is your outfit like? How would you describe it?
Anonymous
Ohhh excellent question. I have no idea but figuring that out would be a good start.
anon a mouse
Last year I realized that I was getting a little too comfortable in my clothes and felt schlubby. I made an effort to lay out clothes the night before and be thoughtful about accessories. In my case, I didn’t need many new clothes, but I picked up a few new scarves, statement earrings, and better shoes. I feel more put together when my accessory game is on point.
Anon
By schlubby do you mean not polished? Or your clothes are worn out/don’t fit – that’s what I picture when schlubby.
Anonymous
All of the above.
Anon
Over the past year, I’ve started taking a quick photo in the work bathroom when I’m wearing an outfit that I particularly like or makes me feel good. I’ve moved these to an album on my phone and when I go back and look at the photos, I can clearly see patterns of which pieces I like best and am wearing more often, which has helped both with buying more of those types of items (I love colorful blazers with deep pockets) and fewer “aspirational” items that it turns out I’m not actually wearing.
Senior Attorney
I took outfit photos for years. It’s super helpful on those days when you’re feeling uninspired — you can copy something that you really rocked in the past.
Anon
I don’t need any more clothes. I just want to maintain what I actually have. I’ve noticed a lot of clothes, specifically my black cardigans, end up looking old or faded quicker than expected. Any tips? Should I just spend a lot on dry cleaning?
Go for it
If you are washing them, turn inside out, use a sweater bag, woolite for darks, air dry.
Sounds like a lot, yet so worth it.
Anon
Thanks! I’ve never heard of a sweater bag. I should invest in woolite for dark.
Anon
Don’t put your clothes in the dryer. I have a drying rack I use for about 75% of my clothes.
pugsnbourbon
If you have hard water, try not to have hard water :(
RIP my black jeans.
Housecounsel
I just spend a lot on dry cleaning my sweaters.
Anon
The Laundress has a great Cashmere/wool detergent. I use it on all my sweaters rather than dry cleaning them. Haven’t lost one to shrinkage/fading yet! https://www.thelaundress.com/wool-and-cashmere-shampoo-and-spray-duo.html?gclid=EAIaIQobChMIvtDnwp7o5gIVIeeGCh3-xA_zEAQYASABEgL37_D_BwE.
CountC
To get the items that are a little too big (very nice hand-me-downs from a neighbor) tailored to fit!
Anon
I did a one time purge of my items one by one to reduce my wardrobe size by getting rid of things that 1) I really didn’t like and only kept because I’d spent money on it, 2) weren’t in good shape, and 3) grossly out of style by my standards (talking A line dresses and patterned shirts from nearly 10 years ago). You need room to put the items that you buy new and they’ll look like trash if paired with the shclubby items you don’t like. This reduced my wardrobe by about 1/2 but left more than enough clothes to wear on a weekly basis. After that I’ve just been super thoughtful about what I bring in. Every item goes through these questions “Do I love this or is it just the sale”, “what is the likelihood of it fitting me and will I absolutely get it tailored if it doesn’t”, and “is the price worth the amount of wear I’ll get out of it”. If the answers aren’t “Love this”, “Yes”, and “Yes”, then it stays unpurchased.
On the replenishing part, are you in need of styling help? For my fashion challenged friends (I’m the “ask her because she is stylish” friend) I always say run with the “one closet two color schemes” theme of mix and match basics that fit well. I am more adventurous with casual clothes but with work there are two color schemes – cool toned neutrals that all go together (blacks, navy, grey, white) and warm or earth toned neutrals that all go together (camels, dark browns, olive greens, and wine red). I can literally grab any combination of colors together that go in a theme and it works. I stay away from patterns as they tend to age like milk.
Anon.
Using what I have in my closet and strategically replacing items where needed. To start I have already planned to do 3 two-hour slots: 1 for business clothes, 1 for leisure clothes, and 2 hours to donate/recycle.
anon
If I buy anything new, I want to be really strategic about it: it needs to replace something that’s worn out, or it needs to be something that makes me feel great. I’ve grown tired of buying workwear that’s fine but not very … inspiring, for lack of a better word. I’ve also moved up into a leadership role and feel like I should be dressing up a notch or two beyond what I manage on most days. (But g*d, most blazers feel like straight jackets after a few hours and I’ve yet to find a swacket that doesn’t make me look frumpy.)
A few years ago, I limited my color palette, which helped a lot. I also realized that while I’m drawn to patterns, I get tired of them quickly. That alone changed my work wardrobe pretty significantly.
anon
Picking out outfits for the whole week on Sunday helps me when I am starting to just throw on whatever is acceptable and clean. If I am pairing separates I haven’t worn together before (or recently), I will actually try them on together on Sunday to make sure it works. Picking things out in advance also helps me wear more of what is in my closet, and not just a few staples that are easy and versatile (at the last minute, I will just grab constantly grab black pants and whatever plain top I see because, hey, that’s easy!).
Anon
My goal is to transition more to casual separates and save my more business-y getups for external meetings. I need to find more pants and wear more pants-based outfits. I’ve already ordered like 8 pairs of pants in post Xmas sales and am ready to start trying on and returning those that don’t work.
anonymous
My goal is to not buy more clothes or shoes and to wear more of the clothes I already have. I work in an extremely casual workplace and I tend to default to black ponte knit leggings, knit shirt and a cardigan. I can wear jeans every day so I’d like to pull out my jeans more often.
Anon
Can you make a work uniform? That way you’ll always look put together but don’t have to spend a ton of time getting ready or worrying about what’s clean. I work in a casual office and wear jeans or pull on pants with a sweater in the winter or a blouse + cardigan in the summer. It makes shopping easy, too, because I can just pick up more colors of my favorite blouses and sweaters during end of season sales to replace items that are worn out.
Anonymous
this has been the biggest game changer for me. Skinny pants/jeans + nice blouse + flats. In the winter, i sub in a sweater and ankle boots. I stick to limited color choices (gray is my favorite neutral, no black near my face). i focus on the jeans/pants at the start of the season, and add in the tops as i see things that i like. dresses just do not look good on me (however, skirts and tops work ok when needed). the best way to not look “meh” is to figure out what uniform works for you, and then buy the right pieces.
Anon
Look up the Vivienne Files Common Wardrobe. It’s basically a set of 12 basics that you use as the foundation of your wardrobe. Then you can sprinkle in other pieces here and there to add color or personality or variety.
I’d go through your closet and try to find those 12 pieces. Make a list of what you don’t have at all, and buy those. Eventually you can focus on upgrading what you already have to better quality or fit. She has a ton of examples of the 12 pieces – some with warmer tones, some cooler toned, some black-based, some gray-based, etc, so you can find one that works for you.
In the meantime, go through the rest of your wardrobe and pair it down to just what works to add color/ personality/ variety to the Common Wardrobe. She suggests “French 5” which means for each season, you focus on 5 accessory pieces (like an additional top or cute dress or scarf or whatever) in a cohesive color scheme. Depending on what you have, you might already have one or two sets of French 5.
Box up everything else or put it in a separate area of your closet. Save it for 3 months while you try out this system and see if it’s for you. Then you can donate or resell or recycle.
Now that I have my common wardrobe and ~4 French 5 sets, I focus on replacing items that have worn out and upgrading items to better quality or fit. I’ve also bought some duplicates of certain oft-used Common pieces to help extend time between laundry. So I have maybe 35-40 work pieces in my closet, ~25 of which are used for the current season, which GREATLY reduces the amount of time it takes for me to pull together a professional look.
Anonymous
I would start 3 piles, keep, repair and donate, and start making my way through my closet. I keep everything that fits, do a run to the tailor for repairs and alterations, and donate anything in good shape that never really fit. Then try making outfits with what is left, which should be pieces that fit and are in good repair. If you find you have gaps, then make a list of what you need.
Anon
Sephora fans – tell me about in store skincare services, are the good/useful? It looks like they offer a 30 minute free version of a hydra facial with a $75 purchase. Should I go for it next time I need to stock up? Feels a bit weird to get a facial outside of a spa/with someone who isn’t really trained in facials.
Anon
If you need to make some purchases that would equal $75, definitely get it done. I don’t know if I’d go out of my way and buy lipsticks and blushes that I didn’t “need” because at that point, I’d rather get a 60 minute facial for around $90-110 (extractions!). But I save up some of my larger purchases and maybe add on a travel sized something for my purse if I’m only like $15 away from getting the perk facial. You can tell them products you’ve wanted to try and your skin concerns and they’ll pull things based off of that. And it does feel like a good little refresher for me being in NYC.
Anokha
I did the Hydra Facial and I loved it. There’s something so oddly satisfying about seeing the gunk they pull out. I don’t think it’s a replacement for a full facial (see: extractions), but it’s not a bad one-off!
anon
Is there any makeup or treatment that can really get you smooth, glowing skin when you are late 30s and have melasma/freckles and the normal aging issues? Am I wasting my money by continuing to pursue this dream? Any recommendations? I will pay more but I get tired of trying thing after thing.
Anonymous
No. You can treat the melasma with sunscreen and it will fade with time, you can treat wrinkles with retinol, but these are going to be slow incremental changes. You’re not going to get the smooth glowing skin of a twenty year old.
Anon09
I’m 43. I’ve got melasma that appeared with pregnancy (or maybe just coincidentally with age?) and despite regular sunscreen use remains. It’s age. My derm said I could get laser, but that it would probably come back. She also said that I have the skin of a younger person despite my mental hang up on the melasma. I do wear make up (work, special occasions), but I’d like the right to age gracefully too. Without feeling like a weirdo for not wearing make up to do kid stuff, or not pursuing the illusion of youth. I live in NYC and my parents were hippies, so I have no trouble finding likeminded people in my own territory. But, man, I just spent a week in Texas with the in-laws. I’m definitely the weirdo in that group for my make up-challenged, botox-less, retinol-less ways.
Anon
I’m really surprised your dermatologist didn’t give you a retin-A prescription while you were there. Can you call back and ask for one? It’s going to be so much more effective than an OTC retinol. (I would almost say don’t bother with the retinol – it takes at least 6 months of building up to give you a mild retinoid experience). Worst case get some from Curology.
If you want the laser, get the laser. I’ve done it a few times for broken capillaries and I’ve been pleased. Don’t beat yourself up about wanting to look better.
ElisaR
i love my prescription retinol….. game changer (i’m 42)
Cat mom
You can wear a lot of makeup that will look that way from afar or in pictures but up close it will be clear you have a lot of makeup on. The clinique highlighting stick is great for giving you that shine above the cheek bones but up close it is clear it is makeup even if you blend well.
anonymous
You could talk to a dermatologist of esthetician. Microdermabrasion is one treatment that comes to mind.
Katie
I know there’s a laser treatment called “Clear and Brilliant” that’s supposed to help address discoloration, acne scarring, and I’d imagine it works on melasma as well. It’s not cheap and takes multiple treatments to be truly effective, but if you’re really serious about achieving this goal, it might be the right move.
anne-on
Depends on how much money and effort you want to spend on this. I had the lovely ‘mask of pregnancy’ melasma on my forehead and some leftover red acne marks and the only thing that worked for that was lasers though your derm would probably advise you on peels vs. lasers.
If you aren’t willing to do that, or would like to take baby steps first, I’d start with actives (retinol/AHAs/niacinimide/azealic acid), and a GOOD sunscreen every single day. If you try to assume your foundation is enough (it isn’t) AND you’re using actives to peel your skin you’re just going to wind up with more sun damage.
freckles
I fit this description and get compliments with the It! Cosmetics CC+ and with their Bye Bye Foundation (both are around $40). I don’t use powder in the winter, but use a setting spray in the summer. I still have issues with under eyes, since they are purpleish and all concealers seem to make them look really crepe-y. I also use the Hada Labo moisturizing gel-cream (not exact name) ($32) and it really does help with plumping up thin-looking skin. My derm also just froze off a couple of melasma spots and they look so much better after 2 weeks ($120). She also told me to get the Skinceuticals vit C + serum, but I haven’t pulled the trigger yet ($168).
EM84
I had some good experience with improving my skin tone and texture with 2% salicylic acid lotion from Paula’s Choice and with a 10% AHA & BHA Peeling from the same brand. I also use a good moisturizer (Physiogel) and SPF50 everyday. However, I had to start Retin A treatment because of cystic acne fee weeks ago and that made a huge difference to not only my acne, but also skin tone, texture and tonus. I also noticed some small wrinkles to disappear and my skin in general is glowing (I assume it is a result kf skin being very smooth and taught). I had little side effects (initial mild redness, itching and mild peeling), but it disappeared after a week. I now use moisturizer and SPF in the morning and in the evening, I apply a thin layer of Retin A over think layer of moisturizer.
I would recommend googling Dr Dray’s video on how to treat melasma. But if you haven’t tried Retin A yet, I would give it a chance. My only regret is that I waited so long to start the treatment – my skin now looks the best it had in 35 years.
freckles
Second the Dr Dray rec. I’ve learned so much from her! that’s where I learned about the Hada Labo, and also to never towel dry your face!
Anon
Ok but she’s a bit cray, no?
EM84
I had to get over her communication style, but the content she produces and the quality of information is very good.
Anon
Second the 2% salicylic acid lotion from Paula’s Choice. It’s made a huge difference in my skin!
Anon
No makeup will reverse aging, and makeup opaque enough to cover very dark spots is rarely going to be luminous. Focus on skin health and appearance (someone above mentioned various treatments of retinol, lasers, peels, etc.).
Certain brands have good products that produce a blurring effect, primarily through primers, foundations and concealers with small particle additions that scatter light, and “illuminating” cream toppers or powders. I’d recommend to start a good primer and a blurring finishing powder like Laura Mercier’s
Anonymous
Recommend the Ole Henriksen Get Luminous set.
Anon
I’m 42. I was really dissatisfied with my skin texture last year and made some changes that I feel made a difference. As someone else said, our skin is never going to look like a 20-year-olds again because we’re not 20 years old any more (thank goodness, in my case). I started using Curology and once I got past the peeling phase, tretinoin really helped my skin texture. I also use one of those red-light masks you see on Instagram once a week (supposedly good for building collagen); I take hair, skin and nails gummies daily (Nature’s Bounty) and once a month I use Philosophy’s Microdelivery Peel (I don’t use my Curology prescription the same week I do the peel). I am also really, really careful about sunscreen, especially because my husband and I ride bikes on the weekends. I use a 50 spf on rides and put another moisturizer on top to make sure my skin doesn’t get burned or chapped.
The other thing you might try is looking at your moisturizer. I had avoided facial oils because after many years of having acne, I automatically assumed that oil = breakouts. I hadn’t figured out that my skin was different and no longer reacted to oils the same way. I use facial oils on nights where I don’t use the Curology (Acure makes a good marula oil, and I really like the Avalon Organics Intense Defense Antioxidant oil – it’s my go-to right now). Skin changes with age and needs more moisture as we get older; my old routine was more focused on preventing acne (which thankfully isn’t as much of a problem any more) than preventing wrinkles, and it showed.
LJ
The only thing that has helped my melasma is prescription strength hydroquinone used with tretenoin (sp?). I cycle on and off it every three months and use sunscreen every single day and reapply if I’m actually outside. I’ve heard some types of lasers will make melasma worse so be sure to research this if you go that route.
alexa
I have a job where I am doing important work that aligns well with my skill set and interests and pays well. However the hours are absurdly long, on weekends as well. It is not in the city I would prefer to be in, but I am only a few hours away by car or a convenient Amtrak. I get along well with my grandboss and coworkers, not so much with my immediate boss. I don’t work closely with her – I see her once or twice a week.
Overall I think this is a good job, and it is giving me the opportunity to make good connections. I can also take time off fairly easily, and went on an international trip with family over Christmas.
I get anxiety that makes it difficult for me to leave my house on time each morning. My office is flexible about start times so there aren’t job issues here. I’m okay with doing the work (like doing small tasks or answering emails at home) and usually okay once I’m at the office. Transitions for me in general are hard – from work to the gym to back home, leaving the house in the mornings on weekends etc.
I’ve been to a therapist and taken meds before. My issues weren’t exactly the same but a lot of the things the therapist said then do help. I have decent insurance and called therapists in the city I was in, but didn’t have much luck actually making an appointment because of scheduling. I would be interested in some type of virtual / telehealth counseling, but I’m not sure about if my insurance covers it.
I’m feeling this acutely today, but I don’t know if part of it is post vacation blues. I just have to get through today and then we get the weekend again at least.
Anonymous
Yes, get through today. If you can, work on not taking any of this too seriously today. Let yourself off the hook for today, knowing you have plenty of time to figure this out.
Make an appointment with your former therapist, or with any therapist. Don’t worry about the expense or insurance — your job pays well, and you can afford a few sessions with a non-insurance therapist and then you can switch if you need to. You’re worth it.
That’s your task for today. That, and getting out the door to work. That’s all you need to do.
You can do this!
Hugs.
Anonymous
Really the only solution here is to try harder to get the mental health care you need. Start with your primary care doctor if you can’t get an appointment with a psychiatrist.
Ellen
Yes, my sister used to have panic attacks over issues that were more in her mind then real. She used to think in high school that she was unattractive b/c some guy was not interested in her when she was interested in him. Then, she thought she was dumb b/c she did not get into the colleges her friends did. Once in college, she thought she would never be a mom b/c all of the guys were not interested in more then having s-x with her (I also have this situation to this day), and finally, she was so nervous when she was getting married that she had an poopie accident at the country club and needed to get changed b/f the ceremony could go on. She has a regular therapist and did have some pills prescribed each time afterward that seemed to do the trick, but over time, she needed to go back for a new script. She still sees the therapist even tho I think she has most everything a woman her age could ever want. I think you should do the same and you too will be fine!
anne-on
Do you have a GP? I raised the issue of my (I thought well controlled) anxiety with mine in late 2019 and she started me on a low dose of meds. First one didn’t work well, now on generic wellbutrin and dear lord, it is quite literally the BEST decision I made all year. I feel like me again. I was ‘coping’ with my anxiety but it took so much out of me and left so much less energy/mental space for the things I wanted to devote myself too.
I’d urge you to try something – there is a huge stigma around medication and really, mental health IS physical health. If you’d take medication for an illness you should be open to it for other things as well – it can help so so much.
alexa
I was actually on Wellbutrin in the past and it worked great but I stopped taking it (with doctors permission). Maybe it’s time to restart . I actually still have a lot of pills left over from that prescription.
Anon
If you have Aetna, they offer telecounseling through their telehealth service. It was something like $80 per session on my terrible, no copays before the deductible plan last year.
Anon
It sounds like you are at the point to start looking if there are other, better jobs out there.
Anon
How often do you get a new headshot? I don’t look that different overall, but I’ve changed my hair slightly and my current one is also 4 years old.
Anon
After 10 years or more or after drastic physical changes (i.e. went from long black hair to very short blonde, nose job that really changed your face, removal of a strongly identifying birthmark, etc.).
anon
Around every 3-4 years
Senior Attorney
I’d say if you are thinking you need a new one, you probably do.
Anon
Happy New Year! I might post again next week if there aren’t that many of us around…but…does anyone have a favorite girl’s trip they have gone on that they would recommend? As specific of a recommendation with regards to which exact resorts etc. would be the most helpful. Thank you in advance!!
More details: we are a group in our very early 40s, living in various parts of the US. While we tend to get a little boozy when we are all together, I think we are hoping to take it down just a notch from, say, a Vegas/Nashville/New Orleans (but not somewhere we will be frowned upon when we inevitably get a little giggly at the hotel bar!). I would love somewhere with hiking/outdoorsy options. Ideally would be a direct flight for most, and even more ideally would like to not have to rent cars (although we could disregard both of those for the right option). Would prefer resorts/hotels over Airbnbs for this specific trip for a variety of reasons. Probably on the higher end of mid-range, but not all-out fancy pants so everyone can hopefully afford to come. Open to the time of year. (This list comes across as very bossy, ha! But hopefully helps narrow down ideas?). Thanks again!
Anonymous
Puerto Rico. Tons of lovely resorts and great parks to explore.
C2
+1000 to Puerto Rico – I’d recommend doing a couple nights in old town San Juan and then transfer to a resort in whatever area speaks to you.
OP
Thank you! I’m coming from the West Coast, so the Caribbean is a little far for me personally for the scope of this trip. (Most of the other ladies are not on the West Coast, so an East Coast-ish destination is fine, but the Caribbean is just beyond my limit for this).
rosie
Agree. I think a lot of the resorts offer shuttles do outdoorsy things like the rainforest and snorkeling (years ago we did a fun daysail on a catamaran out of Fajardo — we drove a rental car there but everyone else took vans from San Juan & it was fun, just a day eating and drinking on the boat and going to different places to get in the water). No car rental won’t necessarily get you middle of nowhere, totally alone on a trail, but I think you can get a good amount of outside activity time without a car.
anne-on
I’d say Miami (especially if anyone is coming from somewhere cold!). Great food, lots of options for hotels at various price points and it’s such a diverse city you can literally do just about everything. Paddle boarding/Swimming/Nature walks/bike riding/etc. There are also a ton of fitness studios – I’ve enjoyed doing group classes for things like rock climbing/aerial yoga/salsa dancing/reformer pilates/etc. on girls trips.
Anon
Outdoorsy and not wanting to rent cars is a tough combo. Maybe SF?
Anonymous
Oddly also Costa Rica. Huge network of tourist shuttle vans, zero need to rent your own car.
Allie
Portland Maine
Katie
Portland is amazing for craft beer, and I’d also suggest Burlington, VT!
Anon
You won’t get outdoorsy/hiking without renting a car, sorry – how do you think you’ll get to a trail? At the very least you’ll need a day rental for the outdoor adventure part.
Otherwise I’d recommend Denver or Sedona.
Cat
The hiking-outdoor AND no rental cars seems challenging. Most places that have beautiful landscapes aren’t exactly Ub3r-distance from the airport.
Asheville, NC is popular for this type of getaway among my southern friends but not sure how convenient it would be if you’re not within a few hours’ drive already.
Charleston is also a super popular girl-trip destination, but you’d need to get out of town for the outdoorsy aspects.
Finger Lakes? (Not sure where you’d fly into for this, though – Buffalo?)
Montreal? (You can enjoy plenty of winter fun downtown)
Naples (FL) – a more chill vibe than Miami but plenty of restaurants and beach activities
OP
Thanks! I’m intrigued by the Montreal idea. Any places you have stayed that you would recommend?
Cat
We stayed in an Airbnb a few blocks north of the Sherbrooke subway station and loved the neighborhood (we were on the edge of the Plateau neighborhood and it’s a mix of residential and shops and restaurants, but the metro made it really easy to get around).
Nan
I was going to suggest Asheville as well. Montreal is also a great idea!
Anon
I love Asheville but I think it’s a tough place to go without a car. The Blue Ridge Parkway scenery is so beautiful and you need a car for that. There are also places like the Omni with nice views/spa/drink that you need a car to reach. I suppose you could stay at the Omni but then you’d miss out on all the good food in downtown Asheville.
NYCer
No rental cars and outdoorsy seems somewhat challenging. I am not sure what time of year you are hoping to go, but here are some suggestions, not all fitting your criteria:
Laguna Beach, CA (Surf & Sand and the Montage are both great hotels – Laguna has the beach of course, but also surprisingly nice hiking)
Vail, CO (there is an airport in Vail/Eagle that has direct flights from some U.S. cities – I have enjoyed staying at the Lodge at Vail and Tivoli Lodge)
Jackson Hole, WY (I have only stayed at the Aman and the Four Seasons, which are both very expensive, but Jackson is AMAZING in the summer for outdoors activities)
Miami, FL (1 Hotel South Beach is a fun hotel for a group)
Turks & Caicos (I have stayed at / loved the Gansvoort, but I think that any of the hotels on Grace Bay would be fine)
I also think the recommendations from an earlier poster for Montreal and Naples, FL are great.
Anon
Not OP, but tell me more about Jackson Hole in the summer. I don’t ski, so it’s never really been on my radar but this post made me curious.
NYCer
Jackson is just absolutely spectacular in the summer. There are great hikes in Grand Teton National Park – some are quite challenging, some are manageable, but the scenery is beautiful regardless. You can also access high-elevation trails at Jackson Hole Mountain resort (this is the ski resort) via the aerial tram that runs all summer. Beyond hiking, doing a river float on the Snake River is also lots of fun. There is also whitewater rafting if you are interested in more adventurous water activities, as well as mountain biking, horseback riding, fly fishing (more fun that it sounds for a couple hours!), etc. You can obviously drive to Yellowstone fairly easily if you’re interested in that too.
OP
Thank you so much for all of the specifics! Very helpful. At first read through Vail & Jackson Hole sound most intriguing to me for this specific trip, I will look more into.
(And it sounds like you have been to Montreal? Any specific hotels you like there?).
NYCer
We stayed at Hotel Le St James! Definitely recommend it.
Never too many shoes...
Nice choice. Le Germain is also lovely.
anne-on
Vail village is gorgeous (4 Seasons is totally amazing there) but it’s easily a 2 hour drive from the airport. There are a TON of shuttle options (independent and via the hotels) but it adds a lot of time to a long weekend type trip.
NYCer
I have flown into Eagle Vail regional airport (direct flight from NYC even) and it is 30-40 min to Vail village. Agreed that Denver to Vail is a long drive.
Em
Denver checks all your boxes and it’s right in the middle of the country. Plenty of outdoorsy options, public transportation (although you would need to taxi/uber from the airport), and nice hotel options. No one is going to judge you for low-key drunkenness.
Parfait
There’s a train from the airport.
Pogo
Napa?
You have to rent a car and drive from SF but it’s not really that bad. I did a girl’s trip to Indian Springs and the spa is lovely, there is a shuttle to vineyards for getting tipsy, and the houses you can rent (depending on size of your group) made it nice that we could all relax on the patio or in front of the fire together (I think we had an outdoor fire pit too) rather than being in separate rooms. It was very much the type of crowd I think you’re thinking – no kids, no partying, no families, etc. I don’t think there were many dining options on the property, but it’s in town so we seamless’d dinner a few times. I think we also did Ad Hoc one night for dinner, with the rental car.
Anon
I would recommend renting a car for a Napa trip, but you don’t have to. There are shuttles/limos that will take you from SFO to Napa.
Housecounsel
I came to say Napa, too. It’s even cheaper to fly into Oakland than SF. You’ll have to get yourself from the airport to your hotel or rental house but there are drivers available for going to wineries. You can spa if you like and the dining options are phenomenal.
Anon
yea i think the no rental cars + outdoorsy seems tough, unless you go to a place where you do everything there, like a resort in Sedona, AZ. Park City in the summer is also a great option (basically any ski area in the summer is a great option, but you will likely have to rent a car)
Anonymous
Santa Fe. But you’ll need to rent a car.
Anonymous
What about Minneapolis? Easy public transportation from the airport to your hotel to parks to hike in? It may be a tacky frivolous spectacle, but the hotels attached to the Mall of America tend to have spas and such.
Anon
I haven’t been personally, but have heard good things about Park City and it would be accessible/outdoorsy without the need for a car.
anon
Park City is great in the summer. I’m sure there are shuttles from the SLC airport. If you stay right in town, it has everything you’re looking for.
Anon
Park City has tons of outdoor options without a car, especially if you’re willing to take public transportation (which, in Park City, means a bus) or rent bikes. You can get to Park City from the Salt Lake airport by shuttle in less than an hour. Salt Lake might also be an option – it’s *right* up against the mountains so there are several hikes within a few blocks of light rail stops (and a lot more options if you take the bus or pay for a cheap Uber). It’s also at a significantly lower elevation than Park City if you’re worried about adjusting to the altitude (but if you’re going in July, definitely go to Park City where it will be in the low 80s instead of the mid 90s).
While Utah generally can be uptight about alcohol, in Park City and Salt Lake City proper there are plenty of places to drink and no one has a problem with it unless you get fall down Vegas drunk or wander onto Temple Square while noticeably inebriated.
Anonymous
1. Naples Florida – Naples Beach and Golf resort. Recommend.
2. Finger Lakes – can also fly into Syracuse or Rochester (or even Ithaca)
Lobby-est
The Breakers in Palm Beach. Gorgeous location on beach, museums and shopping in walking distance, great bars and restaurants just a short Lyft away, and a notoriously crazy bar on site. Our annual girls trip there is awesome.
OP
Thank you all, these are fantastic! I am definitely going to look into several of these suggestions.
Another anonymous judge
I’m late to this but would also highly recommend Banff, Alberta. Banff has great public transit that runs to various hiking trails, or ski shuttles from every hotel in town. You could stay in the town of Canmore slightly more economically in an Air BnB, or stay in Banff itself at the Rimrock Resort, the Fairmont Banff Springs (more pricey than it’s worth possibly), or any number of other lovely hotels in town. You could fly in to Calgary and there are shuttles to Banff about 90 minutes away.
ElisaR
we just did Charleston and it was a great trip! Lots of yum food, warm weather, walkable city, beautiful architecture some fun drinks but nothing too crazy.
Anonotice
I’ve been offered a job with greater opportunity for growth and a healthy raise. Great news, but new job wants me to give two weeks notice and start immediately. Problem – – at my current job I am co-lead on a huge project that goes live at the beginning of March, and will run through May.
My spouse is firmly in support of me getting out of current job ASAP. There are some horrible management practices at current job and I am underpaid, overworked, and under appreciated.
Further complicating factor, new job is closely entwined with current job so I will see my former coworkers on a weekly, if not daily basis. I do like some of my current coworkers and don’t want to leave them in the lurch.
For now, the new job is asking me to work out the notice issue and get back to them.
I haven’t told my current job because I know that certain people will go through the roof and I am not looking forward to it. I would like to have a firm decision and script in mind before I give notice. I’m leaning towards giving only 2 weeks notice – but feel guilty about it.
anon
I know it’s easier said than done but don’t feel guilty. Your employer doesn’t care about you (no employer ever really does) so do what’s best for you. Give your two weeks and get that salary bump. Congrats on the new job!
Anon
You don’t owe loyalty or more time to a job you hate. If they can’t manage losing you suddenly, that’s poor project management on the job part. Give two weeks, transition as much as you can, and honestly you’ll see your coworkers enough to give them information they may not know here and there. They have two months, they’ll be fine. Move on you owe terrible job nothing.
Anonymous
Unless you have a contractual or statutory obligation to give more notice, give two weeks’ notice today. Your husband is right and you are wrong.
anon
Don’t feel guilty. Does current employer feel guilty that you are underpaid, overworked and under appreciated? No, they don’t. I know the guilt you’re feeling about is toward your co-workers, but they work for the same current employer who is abusing you, they should understand. If current employer needs more than 2 weeks, current employer should have you under contract.
Ellen
I think we both know the right answer. Follow your heart and to heck with the old ungrateful employer. For once, your spouse is right. Go. A.S.A.P., and you will feel much better. YAY!
anne-on
Give the 2 weeks notice, what new company is asking for is very typical and reasonable. Sound like you’ve got a little bit of stockholm syndrome. Your company will survive. It is a job, and you’ve already indicated that they don’t treat you well enough to give them extra leeway. Your coworkers may be upset, and that stinks, but that is the fault of the company for not adequately staffing – not something you can (or should) take on yourself to ameliorate. Plus – do you really want to alienate new job for one you dislike so much?!?
Anon
They’ll deal. Employees leave in the middle of big projects all the time. 2 weeks notice is fine.
Anonymous
What everyone else has already said. The company existed before you and will exist after you.
Anon
“Hi Boss, I have some news and I hope you’ll be excited for me: I’ve been given a great opportunity to grow the skills I’ve learned here/move into a management role/whatever. I want to help wrap up my work here and am giving two weeks notice. My last day will be X and I will do x, y and z to wrap up/transition my work.” Then stop and answer questions. Repeat these statements. Be positive. Sound helpful that you are willing to work hard to transition your work well over two weeks.
March is plenty of time to give another coworker the opportunity to step up and shine. If you stay but your heart isn’t in it, you take away a development opportunity for a coworker/friend and the whole team limps along with you on a project you don’t really care about.
Anonymous
Oh my god no don’t say this. Just quit without all the nonsense palaver.
anon
What exactly is the problem. This is perfectly concise, with some politeness strewn in.
Anon
Uhh, no, being polite is generally considered professional and helpful for not burning bridges.
Nan
+10000
Cat
Give the 2 weeks, maybe 3 if you want to be particularly accommodating due to the future overlap. This happens all the time.
Go for it
I give you permission to feel the guilt and do it anyway. Rest assured they’d feel no such guilt about letting you go.
anon
As someone who similarly feels Stockholm syndrome to a $h1tty job , LEAVE. Always easier said than done though. Good luck!
Anon
They may be upset, but they will get over it. People leave jobs; it happens. If you give notice now, at the beginning of January, they will have time to either hire someone or shuffle people around so the major project that starts in March will get staffed. If they don’t do that, it’s not your problem. It’s helpful to remember in these situations that if the tables were turned and they were laying you off, that would happen with zero notice – you would get told and go pack your things and be done the same day. You don’t owe them anything – you have been engaged in a fair trade of your labor for their dollars that gets squared up every payday. Take some deep breaths, give your notice, smile and be gracious (even if it’s not deserved or they act like jerks) and put your energy into what you’re going to do in the new opportunity. Congrats on the new job!!
Anon
Leave, leave, leave. You don’t owe them anything. Employees resign and are hired all the time and your job would get rid of you in a heartbeat if it would help the bottom line.
Anon
I stayed in a toxic work environment for too long in part because of a huge project that I was leading and didn’t want to dump on my (very nice) coworkers.
That was a mistake. It’s management’s job to be able to plan for contingencies – that’s why they get paid more. It’s the company’s hob to not underpay or overwork people such that they want to leave; failing to do so can result in a key employee leaving at a bad time.
Pogo
This happens all the time. They’ll survive.
Anon
This happens all the time. They’ll survive.
Anon
If your job had to lay you off, they really wouldn’t think twice about it. Do what is beat for you. Give your notice, help get things squared away as much as possible in those two weeks and celebrate your new job!
Anon
Interview question for you wise ladies. I’m a senior associate looking to leave my firm. I have an interview on Saturday with a firm (weekend chosen due to scheduling conflicts). It will be at a coffee shop. I would normally wear a suit to an interview, but honestly, a suit might be a bit much for Saturday coffee, and I don’t want to look like I’m out of touch with social norms. Should I wear a suit? Something else? I have a good bit of options in workwear, including several dresses. What would you do? In the South/Southeast if that matters.
Anon
It sounds like it’s a casual getting to know you meeting. I’d do slacks, work shirt and structured cardigan or casual blazer (think Going Out Blazer) or sheath and casual blazer. I think going business casual, no jeans is warranted here. It is much better to be overdressed than under.
Anonymous
A dress.
SC
I would wear a dress and blazer if you’re comfortable in that. I agree that a suit at a coffee shop on a Saturday morning is a bit much.
The original Scarlett
I would personally wear jeans and a blouse with flats – nice weekend not a suit. I think the coffee shop and weekend angle takes you far out of the interviewing norms for clothes.
NYCer
What is your weather like this weekend? Would a casual-leaning dress look out of place? (I am not sure if you are somewhere in the south where it is 65+ degrees, or somewhere where it is 50 degrees…) If it is too cold for a dress, I would probably wear nicer pants – dark wash or gray jeans or something like that – and a blouse or cashmere sweater and flats.
Anon
Thanks ladies. I’m glad I asked. I was so torn between the traditional wisdom of a suit and my gut instinct that it was just too much for this type of meeting. Good to know my gut wasn’t off base here. I think I’ll go with a nice wrap dress and ankle books, adding tights depending on the weather!
"The skirt" at Nordstrom
Does anyone know if “the skirt” (Nordstrom Halogen seamed pencil skirt) is gone for good or just becomes available intermittently. I love it; it’s currently not available; and I just can’t remember if we discussed its status. Thanks!
Anon
I thought it had been gone for a long time?
Anonymous
I have a couple I haven’t worn in a while. If you’re a size 8, you’re welcome to them.
"The skirt" at Nordstrom
Thanks! Unfortunately, I don’t wear that size.
Coach Laura
They still have “The Skirt” at Nordstrom, although this year’s version is below the knee a bit and they haven’t had the “seamed” part for a few years. Still ponte and still a pencil skirt.
Anon
NYCers and frequent travelers to NYC, hoping for some advice here. We are taking a family trip to NYC in late March. The cheapest and most direct flight option is a flight that leaves from our nearest major airport at midnight and arrives in NYC at 6:30 a.m. Neither my husband or I sleep very well on planes. We absolutely positively cannot check-in early to the hotel we’ll be staying at for the trip (we checked). Are there hotels that would allow us to check in around 7 and sleep a bit before leaving to check in to our regular hotel after 4 p.m. that day? It doesn’t bother us to pay for a “night” in a hotel we’re not going to use all of. I see there are hotels in NYC that allow 24-hour check-in but never having used that before, I am not sure how it works. Advice is appreciated – thanks!
Anon
You don’t need a special hotel, you can just book the night before you arrival at your regular hotel and tell the hotel you won’t be arriving until 7 am. I do this regularly when traveling to Europe from the US.
BeenThatGuy
+1 This is how you do it.
Nan
Agree, but I’d be sure to ask for late check out. I wouldn’t want to check in at 7:30 or 8 and have to be out by 12.
Anon
That’s why it’s better to book the same hotel for all the nights. Then they won’t be checking out.
NYCer
Presumably it would just be the hotel that they are staying at for the duration of the trip. That way, you don’t have to check out the same day and switch hotels. (At least that is how I have always done it.)
rosie
The suggestion is to extend the existing hotel reservation, so should be same room and everything. Just need to make sure the hotel knows you’ll be checking in late (since technically check in would be the afternoon prior to OP’s arrival) so they don’t give away the room.
Nan
Ohhh I completely misunderstood. I assumed she meant there was no availability at that hotel the night before (which was why they couldn’t book an early check in.).
NYCer
+2. This is the most reliable option.
Pogo
You have to be careful that they don’t give away your room when you don’t show up, though. But yes, do this.
DCR
I’ve done this dozens of times, and never had them give away my room.
The only time I checked into a hotel where they didn’t have a room for me, I arrived around midnight and the hotel knew they had overbooked. They ended up upgrading me to the four seasons, do I considered it a win.
Anon
My parents did this (accidentally – they just booked the room for the wrong dates) and the hotel gave away their room when they didn’t show up. It was in Asia, not the US, but I would still definitely recommend contacting the hotel. Most hotels will be fine with you paying and not showing up until the following morning, but the fine print usually says they can give away the room sometime between 10 pm and midnight if you don’t show and haven’t given them notice that you’ll be arriving later than that.
pugsnbourbon
+1. Call them to say you’ll be arriving very late/early. We had business guests arrive late (between 11 and midnight) to an overbooked hotel and their room had been given away. I’m sure it doesn’t happen often, but I’ll invest a 5 minute phone call to make sure it doesn’t.
Anon
Yes absolutely call and tell them you’ll be arriving at 6:30am or whatever, and say it to a person, don’t just put it on your mobile check-in. I do this a lot with red eye flights. But I have also had my room given away when I wasn’t there by 2am.
Anon
I read this tip in an article about doing red-eyes with kids and it changed my life. Yes, I know you have to be pretty privileged to even consider this. But for those who can afford it, it’s wonderful.
Anon
And we can afford it, which is awesome! Thanks to those who shared this tip.
Anonymous
Don’t take that terrible flight and then pay for an extra night at a hotel.
Anon
This is why you don’t take the absolute cheapest flight. If you’re fine paying for a hotel you won’t be using for long, why aren’t you fine paying for a more expensive but better flight?
Anon
This is also the only flight that is nonstop vs. putting us through more than one connection or a 3-hour layover – not everyone lives near a major airport with multiple direct connections to NYC. The other halfway decent flights are $200 more per person – and $600+ is more than it looks like a night in a hotel will end up costing us. Pro tips: 1. You know what they say about assumptions making you look like an a**? 2. Other people also know how to use Google Flights and do math. Happy New Year to you too.
Anon
Geez, don’t post here if you don’t want advice then.
Anon
I mean it’s not really advice because that ship has probably sailed by now. Your advice boils down to “book a different flight” which doesn’t answer the question of, “this is the flight I booked, would this option work”
Anon
I’ve gotten great advice, just not from Anon at 11:25 who assumed a lot and posted a snarky (and unhelpful/unsubstantive, which is worse) response without asking questions – which is what I’ve come to expect from some posters here, so I wasn’t surprised. I very much appreciate the feedback and suggestions I’ve gotten from everyone else!
anon
Not the person in this thread to whom you are responding, but you didn’t say you had already booked the flight.
Anon
OMG, you never said you already booked the flight. The suggestion was to book a better-timed flight, which is valid and helpful. Get over yourself.
Anonymous
She did not say the flight was already booked. No one has been rude on this thread except the OP.
Anon
Yikes, hope your 2020 isn’t as grumpy as this.
Anon
Better flight costs $200 more per person
Extra night in hotel for four people on the cheaper end could be $250 per night
$200 x 4 people = $800
1 night in hotel = $250
$800 > $250
Use your noodle. Not everyone is made of money.
Anonymous
Oh come on don’t ask for advice and then be rudely defensive about it
Anon
OP here – this wasn’t me responding at 11:49 but the logic is sound, down to the suggestion that people “use their noodle.” This is exactly the math that we looked at when we planned the trip. It’s not that people don’t want advice. It’s that people don’t want to see snotty comments that don’t offer substantive help, and were really only posted so the poster feels superior and gets to feel awesome about making someone else look stupid or feel bad. I don’t know why this is so difficult – if people are just posting to vent their feelings and have nothing useful to offer the discussion, they should go take a walk or do some deep breathing or something. This isn’t Reddit. Figure it out.
Anonymous
People. Did. Offer. Advice.
Book a different flight is good advice.
Anonymous
“People. Did. Offer. Advice.
Book a different flight is good advice.”
Yep, people sure did offer advice to the OP. I mean, you didn’t, and the rude people who always have to start something here didn’t, but other people did. I’m glad the OP got the info she needed despite the negative Nellies who seem to sit here waiting to pounce and pick a fight with someone.
Anon
Wow you’re being an ass.
Anon
I mean, if a better time cost $100+ per ticket, and it’s a family of four, then a hotel room might still be cheaper than the overall flight increase.
Anon
She never said it was a family of four. She only mentioned “family trip” and “my husband and I.” Getting tired of posters who don’t post context (such as the other flights being SIGNIFICANTLY more expensive and worse) and then snap at anyone who recommends an approach based on the limited information provided.
Anonymous
People “snap” because they get rude answers to simple questions from people intentionally trying to make them look like idiots, when in fact the responder is the idiot for assuming and not asking questions. It’s not surprising that people respond to rudeness with rudeness. It is surprising (to me at least) you’re offended by it. Don’t dish it out if you can’t take it.
rosie
She said it was the cheapest and most direct option. So is the problem that she didn’t say it was SIGNIFICANTLY so? I mean, I did think about the fact that maybe it would just be easier to book a different flight, but that wasn’t the question asked. Everyone has different tolerances for early flights versus stopovers and that kind of thing. Of course you cannot prevent answers to the question you did not ask, it just seems so mundane to double down on wanting OP to consider booking a different flight to the extent commenters apparently do.
Anon
Nobody is doubling down except OP, who seems weirdly particular about the kinds of answers she finds acceptable.
anne-on
If you don’t want to pay for the hotel the night before (which I do when traveling red eye international on business) you can also look into paying for a good lounge access at the airport. The ability to shower, change your clothes, eat breakfast, and then drop bags at the hotel before sightseeing would be 100% worth it to me. Not sure which airport you’re flying into but JFK has the better lounges. OR your hotel may allow you ‘spa/gym’ access and you can shower and change there – that’s less common in NY unless you’re staying at a higher end hotel though.
Anon
Great suggestion, thanks!
Anon
Hilton hotels sometimes offer a day rate for the situation you’re describing. On the website or app, just list your check in and check out dates as the same and the options will appear.
Anon
I think the day use rate lets you check in at 10 or 11 am, so they couldn’t go there immediately.
Ms B
This blouse is cute for under my assortment of black tweeds and there are a couple others for sale at Loft that I also like.
Cusp size petite here, normally wearing an XL petite or either 16 women’s petite (blouses) or an X or 1X women’s petite (knits) at Talbots (depends on cut). Does anyone know if a XXL petite at Loft should work out, or do I just have to order and expect to return?
Anonymous
I think it’ll work. I’m a solid 18/1X in tops (large chest, heavy arms, narrow shoulders, and small waist) and find that Loft runs larger than Talbots (not a petite though). I can sometimes wear a straight sizes XL at Loft.
SF
Over the knee boots? Is it too late for me to buy some stuart weitzman’s or will I still get to wear them for a few days. Based in LA, fwiw.
SF
*a few years
NOLA
I bought a pair on clearance at Rack over the summer and I’ve worn them a lot. I thought about buying a pair in black (the ones I have are a kind of dark tan) but resisted because I don’t know how much I’ll wear them.
Anonymous
on sale at neiman marcus rn if you go for it. I think its not a very current look at the moment, but will almost certainly be back sooner or later.
Anon
Are you a pirate? Then yes you will get years of use.
Senior Attorney
I’m in LA and literally never see OTK boots here, fwiw.
Resume Q
Is it worth the resume space to list an old volunteer gig doing translation, vs a line stating fluency in a second language? Applying for a legal job where I would be speaking to clients in that language sometimes.
Anon
Mention it in the cover letter.
waffles
I would definitely include the volunteer gig in either the cover letter or resume. “Fluency” can mean different things to different people (I’ve had a bad experience with this when hiring in the past), so something tangible which demonstrates the extent of your fluency would be valuable. Especially if you could be using the language skill in the job you’re applying to.
T*ts Mcgee
I’ve been a 32D for a long time–they’ve always been large on my small-boned frame (5’2″, 112 lbs for reference), but they’ve had a certain amount of buoyancy. Recently, though, I feel they’ve gotten a bit larger and less buoyant, with the result that they look a bit mumsy and frumpy (on me only! other people the same size may look wonderful).
I don’t have back pain or any of the other signs that a reduction is medically indicated, I just kind of…want smaller breasts. I know reduction is a serious operation–my mother, who’s 30 years older than me, just had it earlier this year. She warns against it until medically indicated, but I can’t quite picture dragging these things around for a few more decades! I’m looking for input from other women who were in a similar situation–what did you do? How did you decide? And how did things turn out after you made a decision (for or against) surgery? Thanks.
Anonymous
Have you tried better bras?
Cat mom
Just posting to say I love your user name and it has been a joking nickname with my friends since Anchorman came out since I’m a 32G. It’s even my name bowling or playing trivia LOL. I’ve also considered a reduction but I’m 5’7″ so they don’t look quite as giant on me. I’m not ready to pull the trigger but everyone I know who has is glad they did.
anon
I would recommend looking into getting properly-fitted bras. 32 is not the smallest band size, and at 5″2, 112# it sounds like you’re quite petite, and might need a 28 or 30 band. I recommend going to reddit “a bra that fits” and using the calculator to find the right size. It won’t solve all the issues, but you could reduce your dislike of your look/shape/whatever by being in the proper size bra. They will look more buoyant and less frumpy in the right size.
Anon
I would go in for a consultation with a good plastic surgeon. There might be other options (like a lift, rather than a reduction) that could get you an improvement without the reduction, if that makes sense.
DCR
I looked into it in my mid 20s, and ultimately decided against it at that time.I knew I wanted to have children and the risk that I wouldn’t be able to breast-feed was too high for me. Maybe your past that stage, or don’t want kids or don’t care about breast-feeding, or maybe the technology has improved in the last 10 years, but it might be something to consider.
Since then, I’ve gained some weight and they seem more proportional, so it’s not really something i’m considering anymore
Anon
I’m 5’8, 32DD and about your frame size pre-pregnancy. Get a better bra, most likely a 30DD instead of a 32D. My chest starts to look frumpy when my bras wear out or when I wore a 34D; going down a band size and up a cup size helped immensely.
No Problem
I never understand this advice to go down in band size. Like, I’m wearing a 34 because I can barely clasp a 32 on the loosest setting and if I do manage it all my skin/fat is bulging out of the top and bottom of the band. The 34 is comfortably snug (such as one of these contraptions can ever be comfortable) and doesn’t slide around. In your case, was the 34 really loose on you? Were you overflowing the cups? How did the 32 fit in comparison?
I went to the local Nordies to get a new strapless when my 32A got too tight on me and asked the lady to find me a 34A to try on. She looks at me and says, no, you’re a 32B. Well, no, I’m actually wearing a padded bra that still has room in the cups and my 32 band is squeezing the daylights out of me. No really, try it, I’m an expert on bra sizing! I try it, way too tight in the band and way too big in the cups. The woman is very perplexed and does not bring me a 34A to try on. I leave and try on a 34A at Macy’s that fits great.
anon
Have had the same experience. I was a 34B a few years ago, but something has shifted in the last few years because that size feels like a vice grip — despite what any measurement says. Somebody suggested I needed a 34C … uh, no. There is air where my b**bs should be. The only time in my life when I was a legit C is when I was pregnant and/or nursing. Figured out all by myself that a 36B is what I need! (/sarcasm)
anon
Personally, I was sized into the standard bra matrix at 34D, and when I finally got around to sizing myself, was a 30F. I would tell you that I knew things weren’t perfect with my bras, but when I went to the stores and would try on sizes, 34D is what fit! In 10 years, 2 pregnancies, and 60+ lbs of changing weight, I’ve been everything from a 28 to 34 band, and from E to GG cup sizes.
I’m not saying that you would have the same experience as I did, however, you could do a quick test – turn your best-fitting bra around and put the cups down (clasp in front where the band normally sits, cups down and around back). Check out how the band itself feels without interference from the chest. If it’s still tight, great! If not, it’s probably not the right size. You may have to then play with cup shape and size, etc, to get the best fit.
RE your Nordies experience, especially with strapless, those things are TIGHT! You could measure the unstretched/stretched band size and see how big it is compared to your rib cage circumference. Strapless bras can run very small in the band because they’re trying to get compression right. Anecdotally, I can wear many/most of my standard bras as strapless just by tucking in the straps, because they are snugly fitting and carry about 90% of the weight.
I don’t want this to come across as smug or knowing yourself better than you do — your own experiences are as valid as mine. Just my 2 c!
CostAccountant
Turning the band around to test how the band feels is an excellent idea – thanks!
Anonymous
I would try a better bra first. For reference, I’m 5’10”, about 155lbs and I wear a 30D. Try a 28 or 30 band size and possibly an E or higher cup.
Anon for This
Echoing the comments about getting professionally fitted – I’m 5’3” and was a 32 band when I was a good 10-15 lbs heavier than you, so there’s a chance you may get a better fit from a smaller band size. In times when I’ve worn the wrong size, it’s made a huge difference to how I look and feel when I got fitted and started wearing the right size again. (And I usually look less busty and more proportional in clothes after the switch.)
I’m several cup sizes bigger than you and have seriously considered a reduction despite also not having any actual back pain or other medical indications for the procedure. I’ve even saved up all the money for it since I don’t think insurance will cover it, and have been sitting on the decision for a long time, but I ultimately haven’t scheduled a consultation yet.
Senior Attorney
All I have to say is this: whatever recovery time your cosmetic surgeon tells you (for any procedure), double it.
Anon3
I feel your pain. 30DD to DDD on 5’1”, 98 lb frame. Surgery is a very radical solution. Reduction is a much more serious operation than enhancement. I reiterate the recommendation for better bra. Panache and Fantasie and even Wacoal have worked for me. The girls should be sitting just above the half point between your shoulder and your elbow — this will help your clothes fit better, make you look slimmer and is generally accomplished by having the right band size. Buoyancy should be achieved by your bra, not au naturale (assuming you’re not a teenager). I too fantasize about what it would be like to be smaller up top. When I was first BF’ing after giving birth, I was a 32H. So I know it could be worse. Also, since having kids, I like to wear a soft cup bra (generally a sports bra) while I’m in my PJ’s/sleeping. I’m just more comfortable and the lack of buoyancy (?) doesn’t bother me when others are around (DH, kids, houseguests).
Anonymous
Meeting my 26 y.o brother’s girlfriend for the first time this weekend and I wanted to give her some sort of cute gift that is thoughtful but not too much (they have dated for over a year, I live out of town and was home for just the holidays) Any idea what 24-26 ladies would appreciate for such a scenario?
I thought of a scented candle but I might be thinking in my age bracket (30s):
Anonymous
No need to give a gift!
Anon
Something consumable that is a specialty from your local home town?
Anon
It’s a nice gesture but it might make her feel bad that she doesn’t have a gift for you? I’ve only ever been the girlfriend in this scenario and it would have made me feel awkward to receive a physical gift from someone I just met and don’t have a gift for. Being friendly and welcoming is by far the best gift you can give her. If you really want to give them something of monetary value, can you treat them to a meal or drink?
OP
+1
When I was 24-26 yo, a drink bought for me would be much more appreciated than a candle.
Anon
Sorry not OP for this :)
Anon
So, is this a late holiday present or a new year’s present? Or is this a “happy I’m meeting you for the first time” present? If it’s the latter, I gotta say, in the girlfriend’s place I would be weirded out a little. They’re not engaged and so it’s not like you’re “welcoming her to the family” or whatever. I also get really uncomfortable in situations where people give me gifts but I don’t have a gift for them. I feel awkward getting gifts from people I don’t know well. Gifting is not everyone’s love language.
If it’s a late holiday present I think something small would be okay – I personally don’t love candles as there are only approximately 4 of the 80 million candle scents out there that I can stand. Could your brother give you some guidance as to what she likes? A gift card to a store she loves is always a great present. I would also give your brother a gift so the girlfriend doesn’t feel singled out.
Anon
This. I would be very weirded out, “holiday present” or not. My now ILs were very over bearing/gift giving all the time/super eager to meet and please me at all times. Honestly, it’s exhausting, and has been since day 1. OP is no where near that point, but as the recipient of the effort, only a year into the relationship especially, it’s just…. odd. Buy them a drink and call it a day.
Cat
Unless you are staying with your brother & gf (in which case a host-hostess gift is great), I’d just treat them to a round of drinks or lunch or something. A physical gift just to say hello feels a little Too Much to me.
Anon
Yea definitely no physical gift. It sucks to get a gift and not have something to give. But a few rounds of drinks.
Anon OP
Hi All,
I am the OP for this and thank you for helping me with the decision. It was not my idea to get her something, she actually got me somethong (insider info from my brother) so I am the one reciprocating.
My brother said she likes choclate so I will go along with the advice of getting something consumable.
Traveller
My company has had really nice company/team shirts & jackets made, and was handing them out yesterday….. however only men’s sizes were made. I don’t care about “feminine” styles, but I have hips and a waist and there is no chance that any of the mens sizes fit my body even though I am smaller than most men (ie if I take the size that fits my hips, I’m drowning in the rest).
I took a size Small shirt, as I am an experienced sewer and I think I can alter it to fit (re-do sleeves/shoulders, take in waist), but I had to turn down the jacket, which was the nicer of the two garments. The garments are just a perk & not needed for any kind of event (ie they are not a uniform)
Our department is less than 5% women. This really reminds me how much of an outsider I am here…..is this something I should let go & move on? Or should I speak up?
Anonymous
Absolutely speak up- next time, please make sure to order these in women’s sizes as well.
Pogo
This stuff bothers me too, and when it happened recently at my company I did bring it up with the marketing person in charge (who was in fact, a woman herself). They definitely blew me off but it felt better to vent and *maybe* next time they will think? I also reached out to the other women first to complain/commiserate and assure myself that I wasn’t crazy (they agreed the “women’s options” for this company swag were ugly af).
The marketing people really never answered my question of “why can’t we have the same options as the men, but cut for women”. Which seems like the easiest, most fair option.
At a friend’s company the International Women’s Day shirts were all men’s shirts. Which I found extra ironic.
Anon
Womens-fit sizes often run pretty small and not bigger than an XL, so as a size 14/16 woman I wouldn’t be able to fit into a women’s sized shirt like that. A mens size t-shirt is much easier and makes everyone comfortable – you don’t have to worry about squeezing into a too small womens shirt and don’t feel weird if you’re wearing a mens t-shirt because you’re not the only woman wearing the mens shirt.
Traveller
There are only 2 women in the department – we are both Women’s medium or small. Something ill-fitting will just hang in the closet unworn.
anon
well, as the OP just mentioned, men’s shirts _don’t_ make everyone more comfortable. The curvier you are, the more ridiculous a men’s shirt will look on you.
780
I’ve actually had the opposite experience is a size 14. The extra large women’s will fit me fine, but the men’s shirts don’t fit – in order to get over my hips I am literally drowning in an XL men’s shirt and look like a kid playing dress-up. There’s no reason they couldn’t have ordered one in shirts for those women who wanted them.
No Problem
Agreed. I’m a women’s small, so a women’s-fit size small will generally fit ok. A men’s small will probably be ok or tolerably big in the shoulders and chest, but be enormous in the waist and won’t fit over my hips, in addition to being at least 6-8 inches too long in the body and with ridiculously big sleeves (I’m picturing a short sleeved polo or tee). If the number of women is relatively small, no reason they couldn’t have polled y’all before doing the order to see if you wanted a women’s size or were ok with picking from the men’s. The printing company certainly doesn’t care.
waffles
Mens’s shirts don’t make me feel comfortable at all. They are either super tight across the hips or gigantic on top. Your assumption (that men’s shirts suit *everyone*) is really flawed.
Anon
I didn’t say *everyone* – I just meant unisex sizing, especially for t-shirts, is easier for most
anon
whether it was you or a different anon@12:22, it literally says ‘A mens size t-shirt is much easier and makes everyone comfortable’.
Anon
My company at least ordered women’s sizes, but from a brand that thinks that a woman who wears a large (size 12 on their scale) is also 6 feet tall with skinny hips. So the items does not fit at all. Ugh.
Anon
Yep. They ordered “team shirts” for our whole division and based on the size charts provided, I ordered an XL, which is a size up from what I normally wear in tops. When the shirt arrived I could not wear it – I have a large bust and a proportionally small waist and I looked like T*ts McGee, which I feel like doesn’t really enhance my professional appearance and reputation at work. It was a polo shirt and I could barely get the buttons to button. Every other woman with cup size larger than A (or who was a size 14 or larger) had the same problem. We couldn’t send them back so none of the women wear the team shirts, and the men took the position of, if the women don’t have to wear them we won’t either. It was a gigantic waste of money.
Anonymous
I have never heard of corporate-logo clothing that was offered in anything but “unisex” (men’s) sizes, or that fit or flattered anyone, male or female.
Anon
This. It’s a little unfair to describe this as a preference for men over women. There are unisex t-shirts (which are generally a little baggy and not super flattering on anyone) and then there are shirts made specifically for women that are much more fitted and look great on some women but don’t fit other women at all. Fwiw, I’ve never found a “woman’s shirt” that fits me correctly. I’m not flat but not super curvy, on the tall side but definitely quite a bit shorter (5’7″) than the average man.
pugsnbourbon
That hasn’t been my experience. There’s tons of companies that offer logo printing and embroidery with men’s, women’s, plus and big/tall sizing. If the company had “really nice” jackets and shirts made, I can almost guarantee they had the option to order women’s sizes. They just chose not to.
OP, I’d speak up.
Pogo
I think the majority of companies now offer women’s cuts – look at the associates in Target next time you’re there, are the women wearing size S men’s polo shirts? No, they’re wearing women’s polo shirts in the appropriate size. My company always offers women’s “options” but they’re usually not equivalent to the men’s (like one year our shirts were see-through and a cheaper material than the men’s, for example). To me this signals that they put less investment/effort into the women’s apparel because there are fewer of us.
Anon
Say something. Best option is for the company to order fitted and loose sizes – some men like a slimmer fit, too.
Last vs this
Low stakes pedantic question for a Friday: Assume you’re talking to someone in December 2019, if they say “I went there last June,” do you assume they mean June 2018 or June 2019? What if they said “this June”?
Having a mild disagreement with a friend. When I hear “last June” I think June 2018. “This June” = June 2019. She thinks “last June” = June 2019 and “this June” = June 2020.
Anon
Oh my BFF and I argue about this all the time. I agree with you. My BFF agrees with your friend.
Anon
Totally agree with your friend. Last = in the past, but within a year. This = in the future, but within a year.
Anonymous
“Last June” is the last one that happened in the past. “This June” is the next one coming up.
Anon
+1
Cat
+2
Although — if the person is saying they WENT — whether they say “last June” or “this June” or “this past June” is all June 2019 to me!
DCR
+1
Almak
+1
Anonymous
+1
Anonymous
This.
Last June = June 2019
This past June = June 2019
The June before last = June 2018
This June = June 2020
Next June = June 2020
Anon
If you’re in 2019, I agree with you. In 2020, I’m with your friend.
Anon
+1 to this!
Anon
I agree with your friend.
Anonymous
You are very very extremely wrong.
Anon
I wonder if this is regional to some degree. When I got to college very far from where I grew up, I learned that to most people “next weekend” means the weekend following the upcoming weekend. Eg., if you say on Monday “I’m doing XYZ next weekend” you mean not the upcoming weekend, but the one after that, and if you want to talk about the Saturday that is five days away, you have to say “this weekend.” I always thought “next weekend” meant the next weekend that was on the calendar, ie. on Monday you could say “next weekend” and it means the Saturday five days away.
Anon
Actually, that’s a good point. I noticed in Texas, there are street signs posted a couple hundred yards in advance of an intersection, but well within sight of the traffic light. The signs read, “Next intersection, XYZ Blvd,” so I always thought they were telling me that the next – second – traffic light was XYZ, NOT that THIS intersection that I’m basically already in is XYZ Blvd. My family’s from the NE and I grew up in the SE.
Never too many shoes...
Team friend all the way. This June is upcoming. Last June is 2019. This past June is also 2019.
Anon
In the exact scenario described, I would assume that both “last June” and “this June” refer to June 2019. Once we got a bit closer to June 2020, “this June” becomes June 2020 – perhaps in late January?
Anon
I caused a mix up once when, on a Friday, I said something was happening “next Tuesday” meaning the next Tuesday in the calendar, and she took it as Tuesday a week later. Language is hard. Specify dates rather than relying on words like this or next.
Anon
I’m thinking about next steps as a lawyer and wondering if anyone’s made a transition into financial/corporate/strategic communications. What was that job transition like? How has your background been helpful? Was anything totally brand new? And, most of all, work/life balance? Does it exist in a field that’s still client service? We’re TTC and I’m not sure how many more all nighters I can handle…
Anon
Also lol, that last point is meant more as, I don’t want to be pregnant and pull all nighters still! Not to be construed any other way hahaha
Anon
Is there something about corporate communications that particularly appeals to you? Many lawyers don’t regularly pull all-nighters – they aren’t the norm in-house, in the government and even in some law firms. My general advice on career changes is that you should be moving towards something, not just running away from something. Sounds like you should explore different jobs as a lawyer before you give up on being a lawyer completely.
Anon
Thanks! I’m also talking to others about moving to a smaller firm or going in-house (and also working with a recruiter to lateral), but I figure I should really think about a variety of options for post-biglaw life. Corporate communications sounds interesting to me (as someone who doesn’t know too much about the field yet) as someone who previously has experience in journalism (in college way back when, all of my internships were communications/PR), and I love reading/writing and working with clients and, frankly, as a corporate attorney, I’m not sure I want to continue working on drafting agreements. I am good at thinking about how things work together and focusing on the details, but I find it more enjoyable to think about big picture issues. I’m tired of being in M&A and having anxiety about my life. I know many people who’ve gone in-house and enjoyed it there, so that’s definitely an option I’m looking into as well. Thanks for flagging!