This post may contain affiliate links and Corporette® may earn commissions for purchases made through links in this post. As an Amazon Associate, I earn from qualifying purchases.
For busy working women, the suit is often the easiest outfit to throw on in the morning. In general, this feature is not about interview suits for women, which should be as classic and basic as you get — instead, this feature is about the slightly different suit that is fashionable, yet professional.
Linen season is almost upon us, and J.Crew has this super cute stretch linen option in several colors, including white, black, beige, and this lovely pink. (There are also some animal print options but I don't believe those are available in stretch linen.) The pants are wide crops and (depending on color) come in regular, petite, and tall sizes, with some colors available up to size 24. This is the kind of suit that looks like a great suit for a creative office, and the pieces break down into really versatile work separates.
The blazer is $178 and the pants are $89.50, but take 40% off your purchase today only with code POPUP. (Oooh, Nordstrom has the suit too and they just marked the blazer down to $100.)
This post contains affiliate links and Corporette® may earn commissions for purchases made through links in this post. For more details see here. Thank you so much for your support!
Sales of note for 9.10.24
- Nordstrom – Summer Sale, save up to 60%
- Ann Taylor – 30% off your purchase
- Banana Republic Factory – Up to 50% off everything + extra 20% off
- Bergdorf Goodman – Save up to 40% on new markdowns
- Boden – 15% off new styles
- Eloquii – $29 and up select styles; up to 50% off everything else
- J.Crew – Up to 50% off wear-to-work styles; extra 30% off sale styles
- J.Crew Factory – 40-60% off everything; extra 60% off clearance
- Lo & Sons – Warehouse sale, up to 70% off
- M.M.LaFleur – Save 25% sitewide
- Spanx – Lots of workwear on sale, some up to 70% off
- Talbots – BOGO 50% everything, includes markdowns
- White House Black Market – 30% off new arrivals
Some of our latest posts here at Corporette…
And some of our latest threadjacks here at Corporette (reader questions and commentary) — see more here!
Some of our latest threadjacks include:
- What to say to friends and family who threaten to not vote?
- What boots do you expect to wear this fall and winter?
- What beauty treatments do you do on a regular basis to look polished?
- Can I skip the annual family event my workplace holds, even if I'm a manager?
- What small steps can I take today to get myself a little more “together” and not feel so frazzled all of the time?
- The oldest daughter is America's social safety net — change my mind…
- What have you lost your taste for as you've aged?
- Tell me about your favorite adventure travels…
Inspired by Hermione
Oh my god. Love. The pants are a possibility. I don’t wear blazers enough to justify it. As much as I would like a pink suit.
anon
Funny, my thought was, “Oh dear god…”
Anon
I have a pink suit that is even brighter than this one and I love it. I rock it so hard.
Anonymous
My Indian friends insist that hot pink is a neutral and I am so here for that.
Rainbow Hair
You sound awesome – let’s be friends! (Is it a skirt suit or a pantsuit?! What’s the blazer like?)
OMG the leopard jacket comes with matching shorts! I could wear that with opaque black tights and booties and be the very best version of myself.
Anon
Ha, I’ve long thought you’d be an awesome friend, Rainbow Hair! The blazer is cut like a pretty traditional suiting blazer, which makes it even more awesome, IMO. It’s a pantsuit, I’m not a big skirt suit person myself.
And I totally agree about the leopard print shorts suit. I would wear that out!
Mpls
BR had a hot pink suit (jacket + Logan pants) couple years back. I got both, but have yet to wear them together. Have totally worn them separately.
Anononon
I jsut went to buy that leopard shorts set and the shorts are out of stock in my size which makes me super sad. I don’t love the jacket enough to buy it by itself.
Anon
I tried on this jacket in the store the other day and LOVED it. I try not to pay over $100 for any blazer (top markdown stalker here), but this one was such a gorgeous color that it might be worth it.
Anonymous
I’m totally on Team Post-Jenna-Lyons J.Crew. They have a really terrific selection of sheath dresses for work right now. I wear tall sizes, and I have bought 8 of the sheath dress styles currently on their website in multiple colors because they are all so great and I have such a hard time finding work dresses that are long enough. My closet feels like Christmas right now.
Anonymous
Isn’t it interesting that as much as people thought her leaving would kill the company, the clothes have actually gotten better and more accessible to the average person? It’s like they rediscovered their true identity.
Anonymous
I always thought she had destroyed the company and was glad when she left.
emeralds
How is J. Crew quality in the post-Jenna Lyons era? I stopped buying J. Crew after I had multiple wool pieces shrink egregiously at the dry cleaner, but maybe it’s time to reconsider.
Delta Dawn
Same– I quit buying J.Crew after the hem fell out of a skirt while I was wearing it, then I had to strong-arm them into replacing the skirt, then the hem fell out of the replacement skirt while I was wearing it. I’m not sure I’ll ever forgive them, but has the quality improved?
Anonymous
Anon above- caveat that I haven’t done significant laundering on a lot of the new sheath dresses yet, but the ones I’ve had for 1-2 years that have had significant wear put on them have held up great so far.
anon
What platters of appetizers or snacks have you enjoyed or been impressed with? I enjoy being responsible for the refreshers that come out a few hours after dinner when we have people over, but I’m running out of ideas. Recent hits were veggies+hummus, and feta/olives/cucumbers. I could do something more indulgent, but I’m more likely to buy fancy things than bake them ;).
Anonymous
After dinner?!?
Pippin
Breakfast – 7am.
Second breakfast – 9 am.
Elevenses – 11 am.
Lunch – 1 pm.
Afternoon tea – 3pm.
Dinner – 6 pm.
Supper – 9 pm.
Merry
This is my meal schedule.
Samwise
Just don’t serve Lembas bread…
Ms B
You forgot midnight buffet.
Strider
“Hobbits.” mutter mutter.
Anonymous
Elevenses, I never know what to call it. It has a name now. Thank you.
AnonInfinity
This was my thought! I want to come over!
My guests usually just snack on dessert or bring the apps back out if people get munchy. I usually do cheese/salami/veggies/hummus for apps.
Anonymous
hahaha I’m from the rural south and dinner is what we eat around lunchtime. Supper is what everyone else calls dinner (how to avoid confusion? “Supper club” is not something you’d go to at noon.).
AnonInfinity
I grew up in the rural south, and my family uses “dinner” and “supper” the same way you do. I long ago switched because I moved and didn’t want to explain to everyone what I was talking about. I read that this happens because “dinner” is used to describe the largest meal of the day, which was often lunch in farming communities. I know in my family, we always had a decent sized breakfast and large lunch, then often vegetables and cornbread or similar for the evening meal.
OP
Guess I never thought about it being strange! This started out as a they make dinner/we make dessert deal, with another couple we see regularly. But I guess at some point my desserts -> fruit & cheese plates -> savory.
Anonymous
I would do dessert. Idk why people would want savory snacks after dinner.
Fringe
I adore savory grabbable finger-food snacks after dinner. Sweets can be nice but I’m more consistently in the mood for savory foods and they don’t usually leave me feeling as gross/bloated afterwards. There’s also more variety in savory foods (usually).
NOLA
How about caprese skewers?
NOLA
https://www.stuckonsweet.com/caprese-salad-skewers/
Anonymous
What about a cheese board? A few different types of cheeses, some dried or fresh fruit, nuts and crackers/bread.
Anon
Yesss!
Anon
Anything with smoked salmon always impresses me. Also anything with bacon (like bacon-wrapped dates).
Anonymous
Bacon-wrapped dates stuffed with bleu cheese are the appetizer I can’t say no to. But they’re a pain to make yourself, so maybe buy if you go with that one!
Marinated and roasted nuts are delicious, a little unusual, and not too difficult.
Anonymous
Trader Joe’s used to have frozen stuffed dates that came out pretty good.
Anonymous
So, I’m always on board for late night popcorn. I’d look at making some popcorn on the stove and/or with an air popper (in advance) and then research some gourmet toppings for a popcorn bar.
As an aside, we had popcorn served at our wedding reception around 9:30-10:00 (I can’t remember what time dinner was – 6:30ish?), and it was a HUGE hit. Everyone thanked us for having some food later in the evening. One guest in particular (a college’s friends parent) was about to head out, saw there was food, got a second wind, and stayed a few hours longer partying.
Anon
I love pretty much all of Trader Joe’s frozen apps for this purpose. They are great because you can just put them in the oven and resume socializing and then 20-30 minutes later they’re done.
OP
Any in particular? No TJ here, unfortunately.
anon
You’re my hero– “refreshers” sounds so much better than “welp, just ate a few hours ago and look at me eating again; I have the same feeding schedule as an infant.”
SC
My husband makes grilled cheese as a late-night snack at our house :-)
Anon
Baked brie! My friends do this thing where they basically spread some delicious jam on top of a small wheel of Brie, wrap the whole thing in philo dough and bake it. It is magical.
Horse Crazy
Somewhat related to the post about cutting down on buying new clothes – can anyone recommend a good thrift shop that sells nice work clothes in the SF Bay Area, preferably SF/Peninsula/South Bay/Monterey Bay area? Thanks!
Poppies
The Junior League has “The Shop” in Menlo Park – I’d start there.
Thred-Up has a brick and mortar store in Los Gatos?
There’s also a place in Saratoga – The Edge maybe?
I think the GWs are gone now (the “high end” Goodwills).
There are a few cute consignment places in Carmel/Monterey but I don’t know about being work appropriate…
Anonymous
There are consignment stores in Los Altos, and the Cancer Society store.
Lobbyist
I’m a big fan of ThredUp, if you know your brands and sizes and filter for excellent condition.
Anon
The leopard print suit comes with shorts. Kat, April Fool’s Day is next week.
Rainbow Hair
Gah I really think I would kill in that ‘suit.’
But I also think I would kill in this …
https://www.fashionnova.com/products/long-hours-blazer-romper-black-combo?
… so like, no one listen to me!
I guess sl*tty menswear tweaked for gals is my jam right now.
Anon
*You* might kill it in that suit; my friends would have me committed.
My 2019 sartorial goal is to acquire one piece of leopard or cheetah print clothing. One.
Anon
My one perfect animal print piece was chiffon leopard print scarf/wrap in shades of gray and black. It was awesome and it went with everything. It was very large but sheer and super lightweight. I left it on a plane and have never been able to find such a perfect scarf again. If anyone is up for a shopping challenge this is mine!!
nutella
LV made one years ago in cashmere-silk blend that is exactly what you are describing. Just checked 0nline and only see it in tan, but if you can stomach the price, it may be in store, otherwise, ebay!
Anon
Thanks Nutella! I think mine was from TJ Maxx but I do miss it so maybe an upgrade is in order
Better not leave it on a plane tho!
anonypotamus
this is just polyester, but looks large and lightweight and comes in the color combo you are looking for!
https://shop.nordstrom.com/s/bp-leopard-print-oblong-scarf/4945123?origin=category-personalizedsort&breadcrumb=Home%2FWomen%2FAccessories%2FScarves%20%26%20Wraps&color=blue%20brown%20multi
late 40s blues
I’m in my late 40s. For me, that has been mild female problems (perpetual bleeding, polyp discovery, surgery, continued bleeding, BCP roulette, statis; duration 6 months total), foot problems (duration 5 months; cost included going to an all-flats shoe wardrobe to the tune of 4 pairs of neutral shoes for office and home), and now ENT-doctor problems (6 months, just ended; now up 2 dress sizes due to meds, inactivity, sinuses only feeling better when actively chewing or drinking). Ugh.
I know I’m lucky (even at increased weight, still good BMI, good blood sugar, good blood pressure) and maybe I’ll get my groove back. But I feel like a shell of myself — I’ve been so miserable lately that it’s hard to imagine living a full life again, being active, getting my old body back (have vanity milestones to meet and 50 is fast approaching).
Give it the good old college try? Throw in the towel? I feel like I need some inspirational workout tunes (which are OK to include heavy metal) and some “you go do it, girls” because I just am exhausted and sick of being sick.
Anon
If this were me, I would plan a fun trip around a big fitness goal, ex., destination marathon. Then your fitness is about training for the event, not about vanity milestones or frustration with your changing body.
Anonymous
Good idea! I have a family 5K to run in a month (!!!), but my kids do a lot of walking, so I think I will be OK. But maybe I should treat that as a jumping-off point . . .
Anon
Not the OP, but I LOVE this idea! (Except not a marathon, thank you :) But a 10k would be doable!)
Anon
It’s fun! You get to think about your trip every time you train!
Anonymous
My yoga teacher is 75 years old and she’s better than me. She’s my role model for active living keeping a person young. Find activities that you enjoy and do them regularly. You wouldn’t give up on vegetables or healthy eating because you’re approaching 50 so don’t give up on an active lifestyle. Some of DH’s kayaking buddies are 60+ and one guy is on his second artifical hip. They look 20 years younger than my parents who are a similar age but much more sedentary lifestyle.
Anon
I would focus your goal on being active instead of looking a certain way. Find things you enjoy doing and set goals. For me, I enjoy hiking and live somewhere with tons of mountains. My goal is one of the big ones and I’m enjoying doing the smaller ones working up to it. It motivates me to walk in the evenings so I have the stamina to do my weekend hikes and so I don’t end up with weekend warrior injuries. Focusing on how I look always leaves me miserable. When I’m being active I just feel like I look better regardless of whether I do or not.
Also, make sure your goals are attainable. Don’t measure yourself against people that are outliers. My husband is insanely fit. I actually went to a cardiologist because I thought I was having heart problems due to the shortness of breath and racing heart I had doing certain exercises with my husband. Turned out, I’m perfectly healthy and husband is super weird for not having a high heart rate short of breath at the level he exercises.
I also have realized that with the injuries I’ve sustained over the years, I’m not likely to be a runner again. Running causes me more problems than it’s worth. Instead of giving up, I’ve turned to biking and the aforementioned hiking and yoga. Play your strengths!
Hello from early 50's
Acknowledging it will take time, but if you could find a not-intense class with other nice, low-key people, you might be able to make it a habit. For me it was Iyengar yoga. I’ve been in the same Level 1-2 class for more than a year and love it because the other people there are around my age and are kind and supportive.
Re: the polyps, are you sure not fibroids? I had those and they made me bleed horribly; led to an early hysterectomy for which I’m v. grateful. You’ll get there. Be gentle with yourself.
As for the music, Joseph’s Burn the White Flag, or Florence and the Machine’s Dog Days are Over. Or some Stevie Nicks — Stand Back.
Fishie
AC/DC: Thunderstruck, Shoot to Thrill, TNT
Marylin Manson: Beautiful People
They Might Be Giants: Ana Ng, Birdhouse in Your Soul
Motley Crue: Kickstart my Heart, Dr. Feelgood
Led Zeppelin: Rock and Roll, Houses of the Holy
Metallica: Enter Sandman
Lenny Kravitz: Are You Gonna Go My Way
This playlist should do the trick. Good luck! You can do it!
ToS
Remember this is the time that estrogen is shifting, so that might be playing with your mood, so read solid information on menopause and hit up your health care professionals for data and advice.
Oh, and music, maestro?
Melissa Etheridge All American Girl
Peter Gabriel Big Time
Janelle Monae Dance Apocalyptic, Tightrope
Lianne La Havas Is Your Love Big Enough
Blackfoot Train, Train
If you like Talking Heads Angelique Kidjo’s Remain in Light is a wonderfully percussive remake
Beyonce Flawless, Freedom, Run the World
Cake – The Distance
Queen – Don’t Stop Me Now
Heart and Pat Benatar have some up-tempo rock as well.
Law mama
That sounds exhausting. For me, I’m most active when I focus on making plans with friends other than drinks or coffee – that often ends up being a big hike or walk, spin class, dance class, or meeting up for a spin. Finding ways to be active that you enjoy will be more sustainable than trying to exercise, I bet.
Anonymous
Late but here’s some more songs to consider — prob more classic rock than metal:
Wolfmother / Woman
Alice Cooper / No More Mr Nice Guy
Fleetwood Mac / Tusk
Fleetwood Mac / Little Lies
Styx / Mr. Roboto
Iggy Pop / The Passenger
Guns n Roses / Welcome to the Jungle
Stevie Nicks / Stand Back
Rolling Stones / Paint it Black
Def Leppard / Rocket
U2/Sunday Bloody Sunday
Patti Smith / Gloria
Patti Smith / Pissing in a River
Patti Smith / Free Money
David Bowie / Suffragette City
PJ Harvey / No Girl So Sweet
PJ Harvey / Who the F__
Queen / Fight from the Inside
Journey / Separate Ways
Pat Benatar / Heartbreaker
Pat Benatar / Invincible
Gorky Park / Bang
Gorky Park / My Generation
Gorky Park / Moscow Calling
Not classic rock or metal but you might enjoy the angry rock vibe
Gang of Four / Damaged Goods
Ramones / Judy is a punk
Ramones / I don’t care
Yeah Yeah Yeahs / Phenomena
Yeah Yeah Yeahs / Miles Away
Le Tigre / TKO
Le Tigre / The The Empty
Le Tigre / Deceptacon
Gossip / Yr Mangled Heart
Gossip / Standing in the Way of Control
Gossip / Spare Me from the Mold
Madonna / B__ I’m Madonna
Pink / So What
Santigold / Go!
M.I.A. / Pull up the People
Sparklehorse / Pig
The Smiths / Miserable Lie
Lobbyist
49 here. Joined Stronger U over 6 months ago and am down 10 lbs and holding and in better shape than I’ve been in years. They give you a coach who tells you how much to eat each day of protein, carbs and fat, and you track it and send it in to coach on a weekly basis. Within those parameters you pick what you eat, which I need because I eat out and at events all the time. The combination of accountability and flexibility has helped me.
Anonymous
Anon for this — ever look at your retirement savings or even your savings generally and feel like — how am I going to keep doing this; I’ve been working for years, shouldn’t I be further along? Doesn’t help that every retirement planning board or site geared to UMC professionals is filled with 38 year olds who have 800k in retirement already. Often those are the stats for married couples so us singletons just can’t match that – yet buying a house etc isn’t any cheaper if you’re single. I don’t discuss this IRL but I can’t help but notice that I’m surrounded by women whose 120-175k jobs are merely for extra savings/funding hobbies and vacations, as they rely on husbands bringing home 250 or 300k. At 28 I didn’t feel like this – probably because there was a LONG way to go until retirement and I wasn’t burnt out so I couldn’t even conceive a time I wouldn’t want to work. Now at 38 it’s like – barely 25 years left and TBH I don’t want to have to work 25 more years though I don’t see how there will be options. Just me or anyone else feel this?
Anonymous
FWIW, when I was single I think it was easier to live low on the hog. When you are married, it seems that a much more “respectable” lifestyle creeps in (probably the dang registries with their china and fancy things). Like I couch surfed through vacations as a singleton and now husband fusses when I don’t get spendy for the suite (don’t worry, we rarely travel these days b/c we have so much dang work travel; time at home is a luxury).
Anonymous
this is absurd and such an insult–hey, because you are single, you can afford to “live low on the hog.” AS if your life doesn’t actually matter until you are married.
to the OP, yes, it sucks–married people have such an advantage. that is why i don’t get super stressed when i see those stats, or hear people on this site talk about their net worth. My numbers are never going to look like that, because I don’t have a husband’s salary to include.
Anon
Nobody is saying your life doesn’t matter until you get married. But the OP is arguing that single people are at a financial disadvantage. It’s fair to point out that married people, especially those with kids, tend to have a lot more expenses, which cancels out a lot of the financial benefits of sharing a home.
anon
But what other expenses do married people have that singles don’t? That doesn’t make sense, unless you assume that for some reason single people just have lower standards for their lives than married people do. The only thing that sort of makes sense is kids, but we all know that single parents exist and not every married couple has kids.
Anon
LOL what? What expenses do married people need to have that single people don’t? Not talking about kids, obviously. (And you don’t have to be married to have those expenses.)
Anon
I think what she’s saying is that the lifestyle creep affects both people’s preferences. If one person (when single) would put money towards nicer housing, and the other would put it towards nicer vacations and cars, you can wind up with the couple spending extra on all three things.
I’m not sure that cancels out the entire effects of matrimony, however…..
anon
That just sounds like your husband’s preferences, not being a couple. Plus, you can split rent with your husband, which probably makes up for living low on the hog. Also, I strongly question your assumption that single people can/do live less respectable lifestyles than married people. I think you’re just thinking of younger people.
Anon
+1 This isn’t a Married thing, this is a Your Husband thing.
Anon
I think the point is that everyone has things they want to splurge on and other areas where they are willing to save. When you’re coupled, it’s very unlikely these areas will line up exactly, and you’ll most likely be splurging on everything you want, as well as everything your partner wants. Travel is obviously just one example, but this is a real thing I’ve seen with lots of couples.
ATL rette
Ugh YES. I make less than 50k and I sometimes feel like I’ll be working until I die. I’m 29! I envy all of the women on this board who have insane paychecks and can easily afford to max out retirement, since I’m trying to build my emergency fund, pay off debt and save for retirement as well on solely my income. It’s seriously stressful.
No real help, other than I feel your pain. I’m tired of having all of my bonuses or tax refunds go to savings/not fun stuff like retirement savings.
Anon
Read about FIRE – Financially Independent, Retire Early. There are some great financial blogs where it is easy to learn from. Also look up ESI Money – he has lot of interviews with millionaires who made less and still went on to become millionaires.
Take up a side hustle / part time job or side business. It’s worth it.
Anon
Preach, sister. I’ll be in my mid/late 20’s with all my law school debt when I graduate this coming December. I don’t want to do traditional legal work/litigation, and all the jobs that truly get my excited (communications/PR mixed with policy work) will see a huge difference from my friends who are signing their offers from law firms….but one day we will get there!
AnonMidwest
Oh my, yes. I think often about all of the expenses that get split with two salaries for the married couples that I have to manage alone. It makes the saving that much more important for me and at the same time seems like a hole I’ll never dig out of.
*you are not alone
Anon
I completely understand and feel the same way sometimes. I have a few married friends who always complain about money, and I’m always thinking “how are you struggling?” The wife makes the same as me, the husband makes more than me, and their house costs the same – shouldn’t you be rolling in money?
Anonymous
They complain to have something to talk about. Really, trust me, they are not complaining. They are just focused on themselves….
Anonymous
Exactly. When people complain about this kind of thing — VERY common among DC government attorney couples because they ONLY make 300-350k combined — I put that in the category of #blessed. They are complain-bragging about their latest trip for spring break and how it’s sooooo exhausting to travel at Christmas and then again at spring break in April and then their June vacay is right around the corner.
Anon
I have lots of thoughts on this! First of all, these women with 120-175K jobs are not the norm. Their husbands are REALLY not the norm. It’s easy to feel like they are, but only 5% of women in the US make over 100K. So you are spending time in some very rarefied circles.
It helped me a lot to opt out of those circles a bit and fill some of my time with activities and hobbies that weren’t exclusively catering to a six-figure/upwardly mobile/multiple masters degree group. For example, I’ve noticed a lot of my friends who are like this (myself included until very recently) “volunteer” by serving on various boards for nonprofits. This is obviously important work and I would never disparage anyone for doing it, but it’s also ultimately about raising more money and asking friends for money… which can leave you feeling poor all over again. Volunteering somewhere like a food pantry, a refugee center, a health clinic, or tutoring or mentoring in an underserved area not only makes a real difference, but it remove the money aspect from the table. You’re just like every other person who’s serving at the soup kitchen or tutoring a kid or helping a refugee get settled. It forces you to connect with the humanity of others—both other volunteers and those who need your help—as people instead of as income earners.
I know it sounds really silly and reductive to be like, “go get some new friends,” but I think that could broadening your social circle could change your sense of what is enough. When I hang out with certain friends, I always feel like I don’t have enough. They go to expensive plays every other week, dine on tasting menus on a regular basis, order multiple cocktails without a second thought, and always have the latest in luggage and home goods and electronics. I love them, but I got tired of feeling like I couldn’t spend time with them without paying $100 for the privilege. I’m just as happy to sit for hours over a latte, walk in the park, or host people for brunch. Same quality time, but much cheaper. Fortunately, most of them are willing to meet me in the middle for less pricey activities. But in the meantime, I made other friends who are more like me, focused on simpler pleasures and less consumed with the rat race and all the fancy trappings of it.
I am also single and late 30s, and while I agree that it can be annoying to have to cover everything on your own, one of the great things about it is that you call all the shots. You have complete control over your spending. I’ve heard lots of stories about overspending or secret spending husbands driving families into debt, unemployed husbands that the wives have to support, and so on. Find some peace in the fact that if you wanted to, you could change jobs or apartments on a whim, sell your car, get a second job, decide to freelance, and you don’t have to check in with anyone else. That gives you some freedom that married people don’t have.
Sorry, I went on a major tangent. I totally sympathize with your feelings and I don’t mean to minimize them at all, but I do think changing how you look at things might help you feel more empowered about everything you do have and can change.
Anon
This is really great advice.
Absolutely agree on the stats, when you’re the “poorest” one at the table, it can be hard to remember that you’re doing better than 95% of the population. I definitely find myself having to recalibrate expectations a lot when I’m spending time with wealthier friends
There are definitely benefits to having two incomes but there is also a lot of risk/loss of independence and control that comes with that.
Rainbow Hair
I like this thoughtful comment. One of my IRL friends also posts on here, and we talk sometimes about how weird it is to feel ‘poor’ or whatever compared to the folks on this board, when we are both objectively doing really well, compared to the world, or even our neighborhoods.
anon
Where does your less than 5% of women in the country make less than $100K? Is that accurate? Where is your stat from?
Been There
I think it’s that less than 5% of women make MORE than $100k.
Here’s one source: https://graphics.wsj.com/what-percent/
anon
yes, that’s what I meant…thank you….your source is for 2014, but ok…..
Anon
But most people don’t have kids while they’re single. The cost of kids (I’m not talking about, like, diapers but rather daycare and college) far exceeds any savings married people get from sharing a home. So either you’ll eventually get married and reap the financial benefits, or you won’t and will remain childfree, which will be a huge net positive (financially).
no stop
Wow so great my consolation prize for never find a partner is never having a family to spend money on. Also, I do not think your math is accurate.
Anon
Well you’re the one who said you were broke because you don’t have a partner…just pointing out that if you had a partner and wanted kids, you would be even more broke.
Anonymous
daycare for two kids is more than my mortgage payment every month
anon
and how long will they be in day care v. the intended duration of your partnership?
Anon
Did you want answers to your questions or did you just want people to feel sorry for you?
Anon
“Wow so great my consolation prize for never find a partner is never having a family to spend money on.”
Hug?
I’ll be thinking of you and will happily cheer you on through bad dates and good dates, if you need someone to do that.
Anon
+1 kids and related expenses are the category killer
anon
What about those of us who don’t want kids but do want to get married?
eh
Then you obviously won’t have kid related expenses. What are you asking? This is very “why wasn’t I consulted”… not everything is about everyone.
Anon
expect that some of us do have kids alone. So then we get killed on both ends – never got to have the DINK lifestyle and have to cover the cost of kids on our single income
And I’m pretty sure your math is wrong. There is no way that I would be spending $150k a year on a kid, even with a partner.
Anon
I mean yes but most people also don’t have both partners earning $150k plus. It’s a very small percentage of the population that earns that much. And even smaller when you have both partners earning that much. And Both partners are earning that much, they probably have two very demanding jobs and need to pay two full time nannies or full time nanny plus daycare which can easily creep north of $90-120k just on childcare and not including any other expenses.
Anonymous
This. I make 120K, DH about the same and we have three kids. The second salary covers daycare, extra-circulars, education savings fund, extra household help, higher vacation costs to visit DH’s family every year and a family vacation every two years. The other salary covers the mortgage and the bills and the cars. We’d have a lot of extra $$ if we were DINK. Either of us could afford the same house if we were single.
Anon
I think this really depends on location and field. I don’t know any attorneys in NYC, DC, Chicago, or LA that don’t make at least $150k. (granted I’m 10 years out of school, so I don’t know any recent grads in their first job) I’m in DC, so I know tons of two-attorney couples where both work in government in 40-hr a week jobs and make $150k each. And they are basically rolling in money compared to me.
And the couples I know from my Midwest hometown make less, but the cost of living is so much lower, that they still do so much better than me.
Anonymous
So if all the DC couples are doing better than you because of 2 incomes and Midwest couples are doing better than you due to lower COL — why not move? You could be going great in the Midwest by your logic, no? Because you wouldn’t need 300k.
Anon
Anon at 4:45 I’m sure those couples exist but two couples earning 150k with 40 hour work weeks is definitely not at all the norm. The average government employee makes like 85k. And not everyone is lucky enough to get a government job, let alone two. And the median salary for Americans is like 50k.
I have a hard time feeling sorry for someone who is objectively making a lot of money just because she doesn’t have an ADDITIONAL multiple six figure income by being married.
Anon
I know a lot of people that spend close to $100k/year on childcare. And that’s post-tax money, so it would translate to maybe $130k pre-tax. No, the average American does not spend that much on childcare, but the average American also doesn’t earn $130k.
anon
Yes. Yes I feel this so hard.
Anon for this
Not the OP.
Yes, I feel you. I know there are other expenses that come into play when you’re married, but it sometimes just seems so unfair that not only have I not met my partner, I have to pay so much more to maintain the standard of living I would have with two incomes.
Anon
Eh I’m married and outearn my husband. Yes his income is definitely helpful for our goals but our money is not just mine and we spend a lot of money on things I wouldn’t do if I were single.
I think the fact that many married couples keep their finances separate speaks to the fact that it’s not always all sunshine to have an extra income. You also have the risk that something happens to them, they take on crazy debt, they have an expensive emergency.
Unless you live in a place like NY or SF I don’t really buy the saving on rent point. You could live with roommates. Unless you’re splitting a one bedroom as a couple, I’m not sure how much the splitting is real.
Anonymous
Really – roommates at age 38 for a high earning professional? And why do you think there aren’t DINKS living in one bedrooms in SF or NYC? Where do you think they’re living?
Anon
Ok so you’re too good for a roommate because you think you make too much money for that. Most of the financial benefits of marriage are split housing costs. I was pointing out there are other ways to get that benefit without the marriage tax penalties and added risk of commingled finances.
Sorry that you’re objectively doing so well and are annoyed that you have friends doing even better?
Anon
Just on the housing thing. I’m married with kids but my escape fantasy is living alone and I always think I’d live in much smaller house, almost a cottage, in the center of town where I could walk to everything. It would easily come in under half the price of the family home I have now.
Anonymous
What Narnia is this that has an affordable cottage in the center of town?
Been There
I was wondering that. I posted below, but I recently made this switch, and one-bedrooms apartments in areas where I feel comfortable walking to everything are not that much less than the house I had in one of those walkable neighborhoods.
Anon
Berkeley. I check out realtor dot com all the time. I would be able to get this for less than half the price of my 3000 sq ft Berkeley house that is not downtown.
Anon
Wow your home must be worth $3M+ because a “cottage” in downtown Berkeley is well over a million.
Anonymous
Sounds like you’re a high earner but it’s 1 high income, not 2. In that same boat so when I read personal finance articles where people my age (38) are sitting on 800k in retirement, my target is 400k – that’s all I can expect of myself with one income. And remind myself that the average retirement account for someone age 60-70 is something like 150k. Sure the race to 2 million would be easier with a partner but don’t lose perspective — you’re doing great even compared to most COUPLES in the US even in places like NYC or SF. It’s just hard to keep it in perspective (for me too) when 99% of the people I see daily are DC lawyers groaning about how they are just middle income at 300-350k because they and their husband are both government.
Anon
So much this.
Anonymous
I too feel this hard. I am just starting my career, but already, being surrounded by friends who live with their partners is a becoming a huge source of resentment. I’m not even at the point of thinking about retirement – for me it’s trying to pay off my student loans while paying for my living expenses on my own, watching my friends who split rent/own homes with their partner/are financially supported by their partner be able to be so much more carefree than I (most of them have already paid off the law school debt that I anticipate will take me YEARS to pay off), simply because I am single and they are not. The singles tax is real folks.
Anon for this
And yet there are so many married ladies here trying to dispute it…
anon
I am shocked by how many married women (or maybe just one or two rude commenters) are invested in disputing this, in response to what was a pretty unobtrusive post asking just for shared experiences/commiseration.
Anon
I personally found the OPs post obnoxious. I don’t dispute the single tax but it’s sorta grating to have someone who is making so much money complain about her finances when she’s making more on her own than most married couples make together
Anon
I make a lot more than my husband. If I were single I’d have a lot more money for luxuries or savings. Yes of course there’s some savings to being married but not every expense can be split so some expenses are double (we both still need to eat). For example, if I were single I’d live in a studio in a much fancier building for less than we pay in rent. I could also go on fancier trips, the hotel cost is “split” but the plane tickets are not. Just a few examples. Don’t assume every couple is one where the man earns more/the same.
Anonymous
It doesn’t matter if the man earns more/the same…the difference and where the disadvantage arises is that there are two incomes to draw from rather than one.
Been There
+1,000,000
I far outearned my ex-husband, but I definitely don’t have as much money to save or spend on fun stuff now that we’re divorced. Yeah, I sold my house, but an apartment where I felt safe as a single woman isn’t thaaaat much cheaper than our one-family home in a nice neighborhood. My phone plan is much more than half what we were paying for a family plan. I had to up my disability and long term care insurance because I wouldn’t have another income to help if I ever become disabled. Etc.
We were DINKS, and I know kids add another dimension in. But my experience certainly echos OP. I have been working on lifestyle changes like Anon at 3:54 points out, and that has helped tremendously.
Anon
Not when the extra expenses of the other person exceeds the “extra” salary.
Is it Friday yet?
+1
Being able to split rent (plus all the incidentals mentioned by Been There) would more than make up for the cost of plane tickets and food for a second person. Also there is an element of choice – no one forces you to marry someone with a lower income. On the other hand, there is no way to simply choose not to be single.
Anon
Friday I don’t understand the element of choice. If you chose to not marry all the low income people aren’t you sorta choosing to not get married? Like yes you’re not choosing to not be single but if you reject every person not making a certain amount of money your sorta are as you’re vastly limiting your options.
Is it Friday yet?
I’m not saying that you shouldn’t date/marry lower income people, not at all. But if you get married to someone lower income, you are voluntarily and knowingly making potential trade-offs for what should be a net gain. Willingness to date someone lower income (or otherwise having broad standards) does not = instant partner.
Anon
On the flip side, you don’t have to worry about a spouse losing their job and not actually job searching for long stretches of time like the poster below or the poster from a few weeks ago whose spouse had run up a significant amount of debt while unemployed. So there’s that.
anon
And the flip side of that is that singles don’t have anyone to rely on if they lose their job or struggle to find work out of school. I strongly prioritized building up an emergency fund, which was MUCH larger than a lot of partnered people’s at the start of their careers, and that money could have gone to student loans, down payments, etc. It snowballs- student loan interest accumulates and you don’t pay the loan off as efficiently, years that pass without owning property are years that pass without building equity. Obviously marriages can present financial liabilities, especially when one partner f’s up, but having a second income to rely on especially when you’re just getting started allows you to pull ahead in the game. Its delusional to pretend that two incomes doesn’t mean far more buying power/stability than one.
HSAL
Thanks to whoever recommended Ruth Ware during a recent round of book suggestions. It’s might have even been a few people. I’ve been devouring them. So good!
Boden
I’m not the poster from this morning’s thread but also looking to place a Boden order, so if you have a discount code, please do share!
Related: I was surprised to hear that, in Boden’s birthplace – the UK – the brand is not considered to be particularly stylish and is made fun of for being “mumsy” (I’m cringing too, but that’s the word used). I don’t own anything from Boden (yet) but really like the look of a lot of their offerings. Either they’ve made improvements in recent years and don’t deserve the reputation or I’m not very fashion forward (possible).
Lana Del Raygun
I love Boden! They’re, like, Modcloth for grownups, I guess? And a better outlet for my irrepressible “buy another striped shirt every time I pass Old Navy” itch.
Talbots
I’m not surprised. I think Talbots has the same reputation (albeit being much lower end price wise). I didn’t shop there for years assuming it was really for 50+ ladies, and come to find out they have some really good business casual pieces that are a high quality at that price point and that aren’t any different stylistically than what is sold at Ann Taylor. Now it’s my go to.
Anonymous
Yes it’s cute but definitely mumsy.
Anonymous
IDK — it is not the same mumsy, and Boden’s mumsy a good mumsy.
I saw someone in my work lobby today in a great tan sweater, tan shoes, and frayed-hem white jeans. To me, it looked very “French woman rocking the elegant basics,” but real actual French women may definitely differ!
Anon
I can send you one. It requires an email address, can you post a burner email?
I love Boden and have several of their dresses – and I definitely wouldn’t say I look mumsy! (At least I hope not!)
Anon
I also think they really modernized their offerings in the past few years, and at the same time pushed hard to enter the US market. I grew up in Europe (not the UK but Boden was available) and it definitely had a mumsy vibe, but then they started a huge campaign with bloggers and introduced some more fun and modern designs. I think they were successful and own several Boden pieces, but it can be really hard to change that image, particularly in the Uk since they have been there for so long.
Houda
Yes, it has that reputation. Especially when mums buy their outfits then go downstairs and buy their kids’ outfits. I never shop there and don’t know anyone in my circle who does. But then again, they think of Reiss as upscale when it’s mostly synthetics…
Anon
Funny. I love Boden, especially for work dresses.
Anonymous
Spurred by the conversation this morning based on whether women under-dress compared to men when men are wearing suits: do you consider a structured dress (with or without sleeves) to be equivalent to a suit in terms of formality?
For example:
I think this one definitely: https://thefoldlondon.com/product/arlington-dress-dark-green-wool-jersey/
And maybe this one too, but not as definitively?https://www.brooksbrothers.com/Geometric-Jacquard-Sheath-Dress/WX00492,default,pd.html?dwvar_WX00492_Color=MULT&contentpos=19&cgid=0317
Anonymous
I personally don’t. I think a structured dress plus a blazer is enough to be comparable to a guy in a suit.
Anonymous
I think they can be equivalent, especially with sleeves but neither of these dresses quite hit the mark for me. The first is too vavavoom, and the second’s print is too loud.
Anonymous
The fold, absolutely. The brooks brothers, polo and khakis
Anon
I agree on the green one (and holy cow, is that gorgeous!), mostly because it has a suit-like top. I don’t think that the second one would be formal enough to be the equivalent of a suit unless you added a structured blazer. So, I guess my basic test would be “Could you reasonably add a blazer? If so, you need one for it to be the equivalent of a suit.”
Anonymous
I say absolutely not. I think a dress and jacket, in a suiting fabric are equivalent, but not just a structured dress, no matter how gorgeous. (Because I do love that first one, but is not something I would wear when required to wear a suit, like to court.)
Anon
I love the Claire Underwood vibe of that first one though!
kk
I think the second one is great if the men are wearing suits with no ties, collars unbuttoned. I’d wear a jacket with it, to get to suit level.
Unemployment Woes
I posted yesterday about my husband who has been long-term unemployed and miserable. We talked about it last night, and I truly believe he believes he is trying the best he can and is not intending to take advantage of me. (Doesn’t mean I am still not angry, particularly with the vast amount of options I have given him – not working and being a house husband, switching fields, going back to school, etc.)
He told me that he would have been homeless if we were not married because he cannot find work. I don’t think he was exaggerating. I guess I just don’t get it and I find this incredibly concerning. If I got laid off and needed to pay bills/rent, despite being a lawyer, I would just find things like waitressing or retail jobs or tutoring the LSAT or whatever to fill the gap until I found a job in my field. I feel like his mentality about work is very odd and I am at a loss of what to do. He isn’t really agreeing to go to therapy (although he said he would think about it). Would it be going off the deep end to schedule an appointment with a marital counselor, tell him he has to go, and then just go and hope he shows up? I question whether we need marital counseling or if he needs his own therapy.
Also, ultimatums. I don’t know what ultimatum to come up with. Anything I come up with results in me being harmed too. If I say he has to get A job by X date, or I won’t pay his portion of bills or student loans anymore, it is going to impact my credit and cause me a ton of stress. If I say he has to get a job by X date or I am leaving, I would no doubt owe a ton of alimony if we got divorced, I don’t want to leave him because our relationship is otherwise great, and I am now concerned he would be homeless/otherwise self-destructive. If I dial it back and say we can’t do anything fun like go out to brunch or go on vacation until he finds a job, then I don’t get to do those fun things either. It is not like he is spending any unnecessary money now, so it isn’t like I can tell him to restrict his personal spending. Gah.
Anonymous
Go back and say “I’m signing us up for marital counseling because I want this marriage to work, and I don’t know how to fix this without help.” Although if you’re ok with a house husband I don’t get the rage. Isn’t that what youve got?
Anon
Honestly, if you haven’t been unemployed yourself, you don’t know how soul-sucking it is and how NOT helpful it is for people to stay “if I were you, I would just work at Starbucks!” When you think that a real job in your field might be just under the corner and then you get disappointed again and again (but there’s always that glimmer of hope so you keep trying…), it’s really rough to hear “you should’ve just flipped burgers at McDonald’s this whole time.” People who are unemployed already feel like sh*t and suggesting that they’re lazy or deadweight to the marriage is just kicking them when they’re done. I get that you’re upset about the situation, and that’s fine, but I’m not seeing much empathy for your partner here. Why don’t you start with that and see if it helps conversations be more productive?
Anonymous
She posted yesterday that he’s been unemployed for a long time and only applying for ‘stretch jobs’. At a certain point, one has to work at Starbucks regardless of the ego hit.
Is it Friday yet?
+1
He sounds depressed, which so affects what “doing your best” means. The “I’d be homeless” think screams catastrophizing. And how does he respond to an ultimatum? He doesn’t actually have control of when he gets hired, so saying he has get a job by X date may very well just be setting him up to fail. IME, I was unemployed for 14 months, and applying for jobs and getting rejections, hearing nothing, and getting ghosted by employers was so bleak that I felt like nothing I did made a difference. I got a job bartending for some money and something to do and had to quit because I kept crying behind the bar (to be fair, my mother died during this time as well, which was a major addition to my misery, but I was acutely unhappy to feel like I was wasting my law degree).
Therapy is probably a good first step here.
Is it Friday yet?
But also, yeah, the stretch jobs thing is BS, he should be applying to everything remotely reasonable.
Anon
Yeah, an ultimatum is cruel. “You need a job by April 15 or I’m divorcing you!” Oh, I need a job ASAP?? I never realized that would be ideal! I’ve been unemployed for up to seven months (post-recession) and if my partner had said that to me when I was desperately trying to find any job in my field and trying to avoid crying daily, I would have been the one dumping him instead.
Anon
I’m one of the pro ultimatum people and this is not what I was thinking. More of “if you haven’t found a job by x date, you need to start applying to more reasonable jobs”. The unemployment isn’t unreasonable to me, the lack of willing to take anything less than the “perfect” job is what’s unacceptable to me. I’ve been in this situation, my husband and I had a plan. For x months he’d only look at y type jobs, then after that for z months he’d apply to a broader set and after that he’d take anything even part time. If you’re a couple with shared finances your unemployment isn’t all about you. I think the part that sticks with me here is the OPs husband seemed to unilaterally decide he was only going to apply for specific jobs. That’s not how a partnership is supposed to work.
Unemployment Woes
The problem with this is that it is so vague. What are more reasonable jobs? I don’t even understand the categories. I am not in the same field, as he loves to remind me.
Anon
I mean sure you can throw your hands up and say I can’t do anything. But I’m sure there are things you could come up with if you tried.
What I can tell you based on your additional comments below is that your husband isn’t going to magically change on his own. He’s been this way for ten years, he’s shown you over and over again who he is. Either learn to live with that, work with him in therapy to change that or cut your losses and move on. This won’t get better on its own
Anon
I’m so sorry. Talk to a divorce lawyer to get the information on alimony and what steps you can take to protect yourself financially in case this ends poorly.
I would explain to him what you did here, it’s not really acceptable for him to say he can’t find work. That’s obviously ridiculous. Would he seriously let himself become homeless before taking on a retail job? If so, girl run.
I know you don’t want to leave what seems like a good relationship but is it really *that* good when you feel taken advantage of, when you’re pulling all of the weight, when you’re the one making sacrifices, and when he refuses to do literally anything (getting a job that isn’t his dream job and going to therapy are not huge requests). It doesn’t seem like he is going to change any time soon, so yes ultimatums s*ck and divorce s*cks but so does spending the next twenty years resenting your spouse and sacrificing your dreams to let your spouse be a couch potato.
Anon
Are you sure you’d owe alimony in your state? Child support yes, if you have children, but it doesn’t sound like you do. I’d still give him an ultimatum for getting a job and be firm about it.
It sounds like he is an absolute master at manipulating you – maybe he can get a job in some kind of manipulation field.
Yes, get the appointment for counseling and go on your own if he won’t go with you.
Anonymous
You need to go to marital counselling. It’s ridiculous that he thinks he would rather be homeless than work at Starbucks.
It is unlikely that you would have to pay alimony for an extended period. Long alimony payouts are generally where one party has given up their career to stay home and raise the children and support the other partner. It is not to support someone who can’t be bothered to get a job that they view as ‘below them’.
You may need to accept that this is just who he is. He is not interested in working and is unlikely to seek work if you continue to support him.
Anonymous
I think an ultimatum is a bad idea in this situation anyway.
Would you consider getting therapy?
I’ve recommended this here before, but in a difficult situation with a family member who was struggling, I went through a DBT skills training workshop. I learned that some of my most obviously reasonable and correct courses of action, as well as some of my most generous and benevolent compromises, were actually counterproductive. I also saw an individual therapist who worked with me on a plan for me. I know talking about “boundaries” can feel cliche, but it really helped in the difficult situation to get clarity.
Anon
I guess I’m a little confused – if you’re fine with him being a house husband, what’s the problem? That’s essentially what he’s doing, right? I understand not being ok with this option, but you say you are.
Consult a divorce lawyer to know for sure, but I doubt you would owe alimony. The idea of a wealthy spouse maintaining an ex-spouse indefinitely/until remarriage is outdated. Today, divorce courts have mostly switched over to child support only, which goes to the child and ends when the child reaches some stated age like 18.
Anonymous
If I remember from previous posts – he did not want to take on house husband duties like being responsible for maintaining house/doing cooking/shopping etc and they are currently still spliting those duties because he is purportedly occupied with job hunting during the day.
Anon
Ah ok. I agree it’s not fair for him to want to split chores 50-50 if he’s staying home and not looking for work, and they don’t have kids. I know a lot of people with stay at home spouses who divide chores pretty equally, but they have young kids and the stay at home spouse’s primary job is parenting (and they’re saving the family a boatload on childcare costs, which is a form of income).
Anon
I don’t know of any state that has done away with alimony all together. Mine has rehabilitative alimony which means she would still be carrying him until he found suitable employment.
Anon
Texas has never had alimony, actually. We have other forms of compensation that mimic it (short-term support payments) but it is a point of pride for some Texans that alimony is just not a thing here. Yet, we also have community property, which is to be divided as is “just and right” in a divorce (almost always 50/50 or maybe 48/52).
Unemployment Woes
I am not 100% sure on alimony, but I am in a community property state and literally everything I have was acquired after marriage so I think I am screwed either way. Plus I don’t really want a divorce.
Anon
I think my advice is different than it would be in a circumstance where you needed the money. You say you would be fine with him being a house husband. The issue it appears is that you feel deceived or feel like he could get a job if he really wanted one. What if you asked him to take on all household duties while he is home until he gets a job? That way he can feel like he is contributing and it will take some load off of you. Basically, be a house husband looking for work. Would he agree to that? He’d do the cooking, cleaning, laundry, shopping, car maintenance, pet appointments if you have any all the stuff stay at home wives do.
SC
+1. I was unemployed for 6 months. My spouse was working, and we could just barely pay the bills and had a substantial emergency fund. I wouldn’t say that I only applied for stretch jobs, but I only applied to good jobs at my skill level. Even so, after a few weeks of polishing resumes, looking for a good job in a niche area in a small city just doesn’t take that many hours per week.
In the meantime, I did all the housework and all the childcare before and after daycare. (Since I was job hunting, I didn’t want to lose our daycare spot.) It’s really not difficult at all to fill a day on cleaning, cooking, yard work, running errands. I also took on several large projects and managed our rental property.
Anon
Your husband is acting like a lot of unemployed people act, which is a way that is completely understandable and also completely counterproductive.
The problem with trying to find a temporary job while you are looking for a permanent job is that you’re in a bind. It can be hard to convince an employer to hire you when everyone knows you might leave really soon, and you then have to explain to the potential employers why you’re ditching out on this job you have now. (Believe it or not, this is why legal doc review is actually a good thing. You get a decent salary while you job hunt, the doc review people do not care when you leave, and every employer understands why you don’t want to stay with doc review.) You are also “overqualified” for a lot of jobs, and then, not being employed, underqualified for the ones you are looking for.
Then there’s the issue of what unemployment does for one’s confidence.
It’s easy for people who have been employed to say “Just get a job, any job,” but there’s always the feeling that you’re shooting yourself in the foot.
Anon
I agree with all this except the poster said yesterday this had been a long period of unemployment and that he was only applying for “stretch” jobs. The fact that he also said he’d be homeless rather than taking a non-stretch job is off.
I also think once your partner has raised this as a problem, you need to consider your family as well as your feelings.
Unemployment Woes
Thanks for the replies again – agree an ultimatum just isn’t going to work.
And sorry if I seem to lack empathy – I am just frustrated out of my mind. He has had multiple long stretches of unemployment and makes both of us miserable during those periods. I am just completely over being emotionally supportive, particularly while I am being passive aggressively blamed for his problems. When he is working, he invariably hates his job and complains endlessly about it. He seems to think all jobs he has/interviews for are beneath him – he is rarely happy about an interview request, and just complains about “the role.” So that isn’t great either, and it feels like he is being super selfish. During these times of unemployment, we have to put everything on hold so we can focus 100% on him finding a job, I continually worry I will have to quit my long-term lucrative job to move for his, and then he invariably hates whatever he gets. I have put up with this for over a decade.
So being a house husband and what he is doing now is not at all the the same thing. As a house husband, he would not look for work, be content with not working, pursue volunteering or interests or whatever he fancies, and take on the lion’s share of domestic tasks. Or go back to school, or whatever. I don’t really care as long as he is happy. Now he spends 8-12 hours a day applying/interviewing for jobs, and has been doing this over a year this time, and is just simply miserable. Maybe I am nuts, but I would rather have a happy house husband than a miserable looking for work/working husband – and I would likely be happier too because I wouldn’t be constantly stressed about him losing his job and entering this same cycle. We’d have to make the some of the same financial sacrifices we make now, but we could live on my income with proper planning. And we would know what our financial future would look like if I were the sole earner and we could plan for it, and could then pull the trigger on things like getting me a new car to replace mine that is literally falling apart, and buy a home that I have been saving years and years for. We don’t feel comfortable doing that now due to the uncertainty surrounding his work. We’re also pretty old (40s) so it would almost be like early retirement for him in reality, and then we could finally have some stability.
Anon
I mean this in the kindest way possible, but why do you want to stay married to this man? This sounds really miserable. I realize you are venting but if this is truly how you feel and there aren’t really big really great positive things you aren’t sharing here about your relationship (which there totally may be and you’re just venting!), this does not sound like a marriage I would want to stay in without a promise that he would go to counseling to work through some of these feelings together.
Anon
There are a lot of things that don’t make sense here. How is he possibly spending 8-12 hours/day job-hunting, yet he’s only applying to a select few jobs? If he’s that choosy about jobs, he’s probably only finding a couple positions a week at most that he wants to apply to. Applying to a job shouldn’t take more than a few hours. He should have lots of time for hobbies/volunteering, plus lots of housework. I’d want to know more about what he’s doing all day for starters.
Unemployment Woes
He is applying to, on average, about a half-dozen jobs a week. He says the most time consuming part is finding the jobs and whittling down the list to what he feels is appropriate. Maybe he is too slow at doing this, but I have no reason not to believe him?
He has also spent a lot of time on interview prep – in my view too much, but I don’t want to tell him that and mess up his prep/confidence. Several of the jobs he interviewed for also required things like a one hour mock presentation on a business strategy – that takes time to assemble. Others had long written exams, including one where he had to fly to their HQ to take the exam and one that was online, but was a four hour exam. Both seemed to require a lot of studying (maybe too much again). One position he interviewed for put him through EIGHT rounds of interviews and didn’t hire him. I don’t know what to tell him – I am not in his field, so I can’t really give advice. But it just shouldn’t be this hard to get a job. These are good jobs he is applying for, but they are not super high paying, so I don’t get why the interview process is so arduous, or if it really is. I hate to think this, but I have wondered for a while if he is lying to me about the processes. But I don’t know who to ask or how to figure that out.
Anonymous
Ask us! What field is it? What job does he want?
Anon
I’m one of the people who thought you lacked empathy, but I see more where you’re coming from with this greater context. I second what one of the other posters is saying – it seems odd that he’s spending 8-12 hours job searching, but not finding anything to apply to. I know that when I was in the depths of my job search and there was nothing to apply to, it took an hour tops to figure that out and I stayed on top of the housework, etc. (although I’ll admit that situational depression can make it REALLY hard to take care of those kinds of things). Is there a chance that depression is making him sit and stare at the computer looking for jobs, but not in a productive way? Either way, I think counseling is a good next step and I wish you the best in dealing with a tough situation. It really does sound hard and I hope things improve.
Anonymous
If he is miserable at every job he has tried why would his house husband job be any different ? He has shown you who he is for over a decade. That will not change as the common denominator across the jobs and periods of unemployment is him. If you stay, you are accepting that the next ten years will look like the last ten. The fact that he does not want to go to therapy shows that he does not think anything is wrong and he has no interest in change.
Anon
+1 millio
Anon
Honestly? I think that you should give him an ultimatum that he needs to go to counseling with you and take it seriously, or you’ll file for divorce. The job stuff is bad, but survivable. The way he is interacting with you about it is not ok.
Yes, you’ll lose half the joint assets. But if he won’t show up to counseling to try to work through this with you…is there really a choice?
Plus one
I am so sorry. This sounds very tough. Everyone on this board recommends therapy, so that’s what I did last year for problems with DH, and it actually improved things quite a bit. I started with therapy myself through my employee EAP plan, and the therapist helped me see things needed to change or I needed to leave. I had some very difficult convos with DH who decided going to therapy himself was better than losing me ( we’re older too, and the idea of therapy was Very foreign to both of us). It actually helped us both a lot. He resolved some deep personal issues and learned to understand and manage emotions better, and we got better at communicating. It wasn’t easy and it helped that he found a therapist he liked and trusted. He is happier now as am I. I’d recommend starting here! Best of luck to you.
Triangle Pose
I’m sorry you are dealing with this. I dont have anything helpful to say, so, please try to take care of your self. You say you’re focusing 100% on him, don’t! You need to take care of you.
Anon
How do you reply to a post interview follow up email?
We interviewed someone, thought he was a great candidate, but not the best fit since his niche interest isn’t exactly what our (also niche) firm does. I think HR or my boss will let him know. But he’s sent a follow up thank you email to me, and while I was an interviewer, I’m not the ultimate hiring manager.
Thoughts?
Anon
Don’t respond. It’s unnecessary and will give him false hope, since you’re not hiring him. If you feel you have to respond, a simple “Thanks for your note, I enjoyed meeting you too.”
Anon
As an applicant who got rejected a lot (albeit in law school/during OCI), the majority of my thank you/follow up emails were ignored (and I got responses from firms that had ignored me). As an interviewer, I usually don’t bother responding just as a matter of time and it doesn’t really correlate either way when it comes to how I feel about a candidate. So there’s no harm in ignoring it or responding back politely but in a non-committal way.
Anonymous
No response is necessary right now, especially if you aren’t the hiring manager or in charge of controlling the communications. I’ve gotten a few responses to thank you emails I sent after interviews, but it was pretty clear that they wanted to make an offer. Otherwise, it feels a little like false hope.
Anon OP
Thanks all. No response it is.
Anon
You don’t need to respond to a thank you note, whether it was by email or not.
NOLA
I just got a survey from Vince Camuto (the company, obv) and it was all about my opinions about tall boots with 1 inch heels (like all riding boot styles). I thought those were out? I mean, I don’t wear them much at all anymore. With my weight loss, all of my boots were way too big, and I only replaced the tall boots with heels, which I wear with dresses and skirts in the winter.
Anon
I wore my black boots with black tights pretty extensively this winter. But I do think the tall boots plus jeggings look is out, as well as the tall brown boots with bare legs and dresses for early fall look.
Maybe that’s what they want to check on? Consumer sentiment?
NOLA
Not sure. It was a lot about details (buckles, studs, laces, etc.). Some of them were pretty frumpy looking – a fairly sturdy looking shoe part with a skinny-ish upper. I didn’t like them at all. Some were more classic riding boot styles, but with studs or straps and I liked them fine.
Cat
I wear black flat riding boots still, but no longer over jeans. I like them with black tights and a black pencil skirt, or over black leggings with a long sweater.
NOLA
Okay, that makes sense. I think I have one pair of suede riding boots that I wore once, but I just don’t wear flat boots with jeans or leggings much, and I don’t wear anything flat with a skirt. I feel like my legs look stubby (although I think that look is fine).
Anon
I only wore my riding boots as snow boots/rainboots this year really. So I hauled them out for inclement weather, but otherwise they got zero wear.
Jules
Maybe it wasn’t Vince Camuto but a disguised fetishist?
Anonymous
I think they have been out so long they are about to cycle back in, but the ones I have seen for Fall have a more 70s look rather than the paddock look.