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Our daily workwear reports suggest one piece of work-appropriate attire in a range of prices.
I bookmarked this top from Rohe and I cannot stop coming back to look at it. Is it the accordion pleats? The balloon sleeves? The chintz fabric? All of the above. It’s not going to be for everyone, but if it’s for you, it’s very much for you.
I don’t know if I would wear this on a regular basis, but I’m still pretty tempted to buy it, frame it, and put it in my living room as an art piece!
The top is $450 at Neiman Marcus and comes in U.S. sizes 2–10.
This more affordable option from Rebecca Taylor is $195.
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Sales of note for 11.5.24
- Nordstrom – Fall sale, up to 50% off!
- Ann Taylor – Extra 40% off sale
- Banana Republic Factory – 50% off everything + extra 25% off with your GAP Inc. credit card
- Bloomingdales is offering gift cards ($20-$1200) when you spend between $100-$4000+. The promotion ends 11/10, and the gift cards expire 12/24.
- Boden – 10% off new styles with code; free shipping over $75
- Eloquii – Fall clearance event, up to 85% off
- J.Crew – 40% off fall favorites; prices as marked
- J.Crew Factory – Up to 60% off everything + 60% off clearance
- Lo & Sons – Fall Sale, up to 35% off
- M.M.LaFleur – Save 25% sitewide
- Neiman Marcus – New sale, up to 50% off
- Spanx – Lots of workwear on sale, some up to 70% off
- Talbots – Buy one, get one – 50% off everything!
- White House Black Market – Holiday style event, take 25% off your entire purchase
Sales of note for 11.5.24
- Nordstrom – Fall sale, up to 50% off!
- Ann Taylor – Extra 40% off sale
- Banana Republic Factory – 50% off everything + extra 25% off with your GAP Inc. credit card
- Bloomingdales is offering gift cards ($20-$1200) when you spend between $100-$4000+. The promotion ends 11/10, and the gift cards expire 12/24.
- Boden – 10% off new styles with code; free shipping over $75
- Eloquii – Fall clearance event, up to 85% off
- J.Crew – 40% off fall favorites; prices as marked
- J.Crew Factory – Up to 60% off everything + 60% off clearance
- Lo & Sons – Fall Sale, up to 35% off
- M.M.LaFleur – Save 25% sitewide
- Neiman Marcus – New sale, up to 50% off
- Spanx – Lots of workwear on sale, some up to 70% off
- Talbots – Buy one, get one – 50% off everything!
- White House Black Market – Holiday style event, take 25% off your entire purchase
And some of our latest threadjacks here at Corporette (reader questions and commentary) — see more here!
Some of our latest threadjacks include:
- What to say to friends and family who threaten to not vote?
- What boots do you expect to wear this fall and winter?
- What beauty treatments do you do on a regular basis to look polished?
- Can I skip the annual family event my workplace holds, even if I'm a manager?
- What small steps can I take today to get myself a little more “together” and not feel so frazzled all of the time?
- The oldest daughter is America's social safety net — change my mind…
- What have you lost your taste for as you've aged?
- Tell me about your favorite adventure travels…
Anon
Any recommendations for pillow inserts for bed shams? Since they’re decorative and I won’t actually be sleeping on them, is there any reason to spend extra on something nicer? Or can I just pick up a two-pack of down or down-alternative from Costco, TJ Maxx, Ikea, etc.?
Cat
Ikea’s work great but they are extra great and plump if you buy 2 per sham.
Anon
Any 2 pack will do.
Anon
Target has some plump $10 pillows.
anon
They also have $4 pillows. I grabbed a couple yesterday for a rarely used guest bedroom
Anonymous
I buy new pillows to sleep on and put my old pillows into the shams.
Lindy
I have a wood bench that I use as a seat in my WFH setup. I think that the varnish on it might be breaking down — it just seems to be a bit sticky sometimes (that isn’t from something spilled on it — likely a combo of sunscreen + bug spray + lotion + humidity from me (seasonal residue from dog walking)). At any rate, it’s mahogany, so I don’t want to ruin it. For a Labor Day project, can I lightly sand and spray with something like spar varnish as a possible way to fix or make better / not ruin it?
MagicUnicorn
If the finish is breaking down, you will have better luck removing it completely and refinishing than you will attempting to sand (which could become a gummy mess) and spraying more on top.
Curious
Ignorant here but having the same issue with a table. How do you remove the finish?
MagicUnicorn
Link to follow; Bob Villa has a good overview of options.
MagicUnicorn
https://www.bobvila.com/articles/how-to-remove-varnish/
Curious
Thank you!!!
Curious
(also, I love that the answer is basically always Bob Vila)
Halloween Q
We are looking at an outdoor walk-by Halloween with card tables set up with grab-and-go treats up by the sidewalk. [It is early, but we think that schools will shut down soon after they start and we’ll have a neighborhood of sad kids again.] I want to dress up this year. Is there a good Etsy or other place where I can get a *good* adult-sized Joan of Arc costume? It doesn’t need to be s*xy Joan, just something that I can add some subtle flames to the bottom of and move around in comfortably and watch all of the cute kids go by while I drink a beer from my front steps.
anonshmanon
No advice on the costume but our neighborhood did this last year and it was a total hit, for the kids and the adults.
Anonymous
Our neighborhood did this even before the pandemic–people would set up their outdoor firepits in their driveways and toast s’mores while handing out candy. We get so many trick-or-treaters that it is just too difficult to keep answering the door every minute and a half.
anon
I did this with a group of friends last year, and it was really fun. I’m debating whether to do it again this year. What’s holding me back is that I missed out on trick-or-treating with my youngest (7 y.o.). DH took her around last year while I handed out candy. I’m definitely feeling the passage of time a lot lately.
Anon
Are you looking for armor? For decent quality it may be more cost effective to rent something from a costume shop. My city has a few store that cater to local theaters (college or otherwise) and they rent costumes out. Might be something to consider unless you want to visit a Renne fair in costume later.
Anonymous
No armor. I was thinking a long white gown with a red cross on it and a bad wig (like from The Messenger), maybe a shield (but maybe not). I had thought chainmail, but the flames would work better on a gown.
Anonymous
This may be more work than you want to do but…
I’d get a white caftan from etsy, cut a red cross from felt and attach it with fabric tape or pins or something. A shield can be made with cardboard and paint. It can be tricky getting a large enough flat piece of cardboard but if you put an appeal on your community’s facebook you may find someone who recently got a refrigerator or something.
Anon
Try medieval collectibles for a long gown or tunic. They also have some chain mail pieces ranging from more affordable neck cowls to full mail shirts.
Maybe decorate around your foldable chair on the driveway with cardboard flames and just add a Red Cross to the tunic?
Halloween Q
Reposting with my correct handle :)
No armor. I was thinking a long white gown with a red cross on it and a bad wig (like from The Messenger), maybe a shield (but maybe not). I had thought chainmail, but the flames would work better on a gown.
Mclawyer
I’ve had good luck at getting adult costumes from my local Salvation Army type store (here in RI it’s called savers)
what
Not sure the kids in my neighborhood would quite get the portrayal of a woman being burned at the stake, beer or no beer.
Anon
Doesn’t sound like that’s the point, though, so who cares.
Anonymous
Search for Knight Crusader, Tabard with Cross or Templar Knight costume to get a white men’s tunic with red cross.
You can get something like this if you want to splurge: https://www.etsy.com/no-en/listing/384374334/new-medieval-renaissance-elizabethan?ref=shop_home_recs_1&sca=1
Flame leggings and fairy lights underneath? Or fire LED tutu if you want to be fancy?
https://www.etsy.com/no-en/listing/770806175/fire-led-tutuflame-skirtsewn-in-satin?ref=shop_home_recs_1&pro=1
London (formerly NY) CPA
Warning on tops like this: they look great the first time you wear them, but those knife pleats are a nightmare to launder. I find that they sadly never look anywhere near as good after washing/ironing. Even my dry cleaner couldnt get them to look right.
Anon
I get the impression that this is the sort of thing you wear only for special occasions and treat like a costume—spray with vodka, never wash.
Ribena
I love the fact that they’re described as harmonica pleats. My inner 9 year old wonders if they make music!
pugsnbourbon
It’s fascinating – harmonicas don’t have pleats! I wonder why they used that term.
Ribena
Maybe someone got harmonicas and accordions mixed up?
Anon
That’s what I’m thinking.
Yet when they said harmonica pleats, I knew exactly what they meant!
Anonymous
I think they meant the pleats from a harmonium which has an accordion-like back
Senior Attorney
As we were discussing last week, apparently words have lost their meaning in the garment-description context.
Curious
Covfefe.
Anon
As I am a yarn crafts person, don’t even get me started on how they use the words knit and crochet!
(Apparently anything with holes in it = crochet)
Masks
Help me find a replacement for my favorite masks. I have been wearing the Proper Cloth everyday masks, which are a hybrid of the pleated and “ninja” style masks. They have a center seam as well as pleats that are gathered together at the sides, and they come in a small size meant to fit women’s faces. They fit my face without gaps and don’t collapse into my mouth. I can even get through an entire choir rehearsal in them. Proper Cloth has been sold out of the small size in cotton fabric for months. Can anyone recommend something similar in a women’s size? I tried the Athleta masks, which didn’t gap, but the soft fabric got sucked in to my mouth with every breath.
Anon
Have you considered disposal medical masks?
Anonymous
Too big–they leak out the sides no matter what hacks I try.
NYNY
Tom Binh makes a mask that’s supposed to be good for singing. Not sure if it’s in stock, but it’s worth checking out. I’ve never tried their masks, but their bags are well-made.
emeralds
These have adjustable ear loops not the ninja set-up, but Vera Bradley’s masks are the same shape and made of a pretty stiff cotton, and are the only ones I’ve found that fit my face properly. Can’t speak to the singing aspect, though.
Anonymous
Baggu masks!! I love them
Elegant Giraffe
Amy Kuschel.
Anon
Cosign–I just lovelovelovelove my Amy Kuschel masks. They’re so worth it. So comfy, so adjustable and they come in multiple fact sizes!
Anon for this
I have been seeing a guy for about 2 months. We have not been sexually active. This weekend, he told me that he has HSV-2 (genit*l herpes). He is on meds to reduce possible transmission. Got it from an ex who cheated on him.
He made clear that we can go as slow as I want and that he is happy to discuss and answer any questions once I’ve thought about it, if I want to continue the relationship. He sent me articles from the CDC and other sources, and I plan to reach out to my doctor with questions too.
I really like this guy and plan to keep seeing him. I genuinely appreciate the way he has approached this so openly and honestly, and that he trusts me enough with this.
Hive, have any of you been in a monogamous relationship where your partner has this (or something similar) and can share your experience with me? Are there any questions I should be asking him to learn more? Anything I should consider / keep in mind?
Anon for this
Husband has it (got from an ex before me), is on medication to reduce flares/possible transmission, and it’s rarely been an issue. He might have a flare a couple times a year during times of huge stress or other illness, but that’s it. I have not contracted it from him. We simply avoid activity during a flare. It seemed like a huge deal when we found out and he was first diagnosed, but it really isn’t once you get your brain around it.
Anonymous
Honestly over half of sexually active people have this I would use condoms same as any new relationship and enjoy.
Anon
It’s common, but in the US it’s closer to 16% and condoms are good to use but may not prevent transmission because it can occur in areas that condoms do not cover. It sounds like this guy is taking medication to lower the risk of transmission, though.
Anon
I don’t have any experience with this but it seems like a good sign that he is being upfront about it, sent you more info to read and is willing to talk more! I would go as slow as you want to and definitely figure out what you need to do to protect yourself. Good luck!
Anonymous
Yeah I mean it really isn’t a big deal. Obviously use protection but understand that it isn’t 100% – just like anything else involving PIV. There are always risks. If you’re not a v*rgin youve almost certainly hooked up with someone who has that or something else. It sounds like he’s doing all the right things, the only thing that gives me pause is him blaming a cheating ex. In reality he can’t know where or when he got it. You can be a carrier for a long time without symptoms. I’m very sorry he was cheated on but something about couching his status that way raises my hackles.
Anon
Unless he actually knows? I wouldn’t assume he cannot trace this.
OP
For a variety of reasons (including the ex being his ex wife, had been tested specifically wary in marriage, etc), he does know this. This was also part of a larger discussion re past relationships, where we may be headed, etc. I agree it could be a red flag, but is not here.
And thank you to all who have posted! It certainly seems like something with a huge stigma around it, but when you actually read about what it is, it’s not a huge deal.
Anon now
My ex-H had it, disclosed it when we were first dating. We were pretty careful, abstaining during outbreaks; I eventually got it but not until we’d been together for 21 years!
I also take daily antivirals to make sure I don’t have an outbreak. My gyn told me the chances of passing on the virus when there is no active outbreak is quite low, and when on antiviral meds it is vanishingly low.
anon
I noticed someone recently posted about weight loss/diet plans, etc (specifically costs) and would like to hear if anyone else has had a similar journey.
Me: 47, no children but about 40 rounds of IVF across 10 years (yes, 40 – they kept telling us we were close, one more round, we had and lost several transfers. we have exceptional coverage plus spent a great deal of money out of pocket – a very expensive heartbreak) which included a few years of estrogen supplements that I didn’t tolerate well. I had to have several fibroid removals, one fibroid was larger than a grapefruit.
I used to have hyperthyroid but now am hypothyroid, on Armour (90mg). I am 5’7″, and went from 150 to 250 in the last decade. I don’t eat a lot of food as I feel full quickly and have little interest in it. No matter the amount of exercise, I stay at the same number. Every few months, my weight will increase by 7ish pounds, literally overnight (I weigh mornings and evenings). I assume I am estrogen dominant and glucose resistant, having read some of Dr Sara Gottfried’s work over the weekend.
Any similar experiences on weight (IVF, age, or both)? I appreciate your replies.
anon
OP: clarification:: just looking for any experiences/success in losing the age, IVF or perimenopausal weight, not a diagnosis
Anonymous
No “loss” to share, but can relate to perimenopausal gain (and hypothyroidism runs in my family, so this is probably a reminder to me to get tested again b/c we often go from subclinical to really having it as we age even if we don’t have it at birth; I am one of those people who is still always freezing). At any rate, as I age, I am more and more struck that my body is not owned by my willpower. It is also governed by genes, hormones, etc., and all of that is much more in control than 20s me wanted to let on. It is humbling. I can only control some things, like what I eat and whether I am active (a challenge for the past 1.5 years, more than usual), so I try to be “good at X” and not just pine for the days of weighing X-whatever.
Anon
+1 to the humbling power of genetics. I look exactly like the women in my family, shape-wise more than face-wise, no matter what I do.
NeglectedHeels
Hi OP, this sounds really hard. My advice doesn’t address all your concerns but is just a thought. I used to work as a dietitian and many many people would tell me they didn’t eat a lot or couldn’t lose weight despite restricting calories. Studies have shown that people are not good at recalling their dietary intake and if thinking retrospectively often dramatically underestimate the calories they are getting. I would recommend you get a calorie tracking app such as myfitnesspal or loseit or even paper and pencil and track every calorie you eat for a week. This can be helpful to see if you are correct about your calorie intake or if there are easy ways you can decrease your calorie intake. Warning that calorie tracking can be very triggering for those with a history of eating disorders and should be avoided!!! But for most folks it can be a helpful source of information to get you started.
Veronica Mars
You can watch the show “Secret Eaters” on Youtube for more of this. It’s great at helping people be more realistic about what they’re eating.
anon
a very thoughtful comment, thank you. I’ve been tracking by paper but will switch to an app. I don’t have a history of eating disorders but it is a good call out as others often absorb advice on these replies.
I was looking for advice such as this, not costs (for clarity, I just noticed that someone recently posted about costs, I was hoping for stories of weight loss over 45 or after IVF).
thanks to all for replies.
Anonymous
Honestly I think you need to speak to a medical profession. This is clearly a very specific situation. You don’t need to hear how much Noom costs.
Veronica Mars
I agree. Given your history and current meds, I’d ask the doctor what diet and nutrition program would be best, and go from there.
anon
This.
anon
OP: thanks all. I have been tracking calories for some time but will try to find a new Dr (current Dr just says ‘weight watchers’ everytime even though I bring a food and sleep log, nutritionist says I eat too little {I can go under 1k calories a day easily unless I notice and make a protein shake}). Any recommendations for NYC/NJ Drs and nutritionists or someone who does virtual visits?)
Anon
No specific recommendations but you will probably want a registered dietitian. Eatright.org has a search feature if you can’t find any local recs. It might also be something to ask your endocrinologist about, if you have one. For what its worth, I was going to RD appointments with my mother who has estrogen dominance among many other issues and the advice was generally to follow low carb or low gi diets.
Anon
Ok at your height and weight eating under 1k calories per day is really, really unhealthy and will cause your metabolism to slow down in response. Agree talk to your doctor and nutritionist but finding out your TDEE, weighing and tracking your food seriously, and doing strength training can help you evaluate your actual caloric needs. In the short term you are likely to *gain* weight by eating a healthy minimum but doing strength training alongside will help your body readjust its metabolism.
Anon
No advice although it sounds like it is a medical issue if you are already exercising and watching what you eat. I am assuming you are working with your doctor with your weight loss efforts? Really just wanted to send you hugs and positive vibes because this all sounds so hard. Hang in there! I hope that you can find some answers. I am sure that this is very worrisome and frustrating.
Anonymous
May I suggest a endocrinologist/specialist in weight loss? You will need panels to discover if other endocrine issues at play (sadly having autoimmune endocrine issues in one respect predisposes you to others) and to fine-tune your thyroid meds to range that is right for you (it is very very hard to lose weight if hypothyroid. I am very sorry re the IVF and wish you the best of luck.
Anon
It sounds like you’re asking about the weight and getting “weight watchers” back as a response. Could you ask about insulin resistance and glucose tolerance testing? The glucose tolerance test, when I had it done, made it very clear that I was having blood sugar issues and would need to cut back on carbs quite a lot.
Still just thinking of my own health history: Do you know if your thyroid dose is optimized? My doctors kept me on about 60mg of Armour for a long time as my TSH crept up towards 3. So many of my symptoms improved when I happened to see a different doctor one day, and she decided to increase my dose. I pretty consistently feel best with my TSH around 1. Apparently it’s common with combination therapy that TSH on adequate treatment is a bit lower in the range.
Finally, does your GI system work pretty well? I had a lot of symptoms that I considered manageable enough, but when I saw an actual gastroenterologist, I was diagnosed with hypochlorhydria (probably from anti-parietal cell antibodies that are fairly common in Hashimoto’s patients) and gastroparesis (cause unknown, but I guess it’s more common in autoimmune patients and patients with hypermobility, and I have both). Most doctors associate gastroparesis with weight loss, but there’s a subset of gastroparesis patients who struggle significantly with weight gain even on calorie restricted diets. Feeling full soon after eating is a classic symptom, so I think it would be very reasonable to ask about.
If it’s possible you need a slightly more optimal thyroid dose, or a safe, gentle prokinetic (some doctors think there are no alternatives to Reglan, but it’s not true!), or a diet that lowers insulin and blood glucose levels, I think it’s too soon for weight watchers, but it sounds like you need to have a longer conversation with your doctor.
anon
Have you visited a chinese medicine doctor? And and functional medicine doctor? I would encourage you to get those perspectives. To me this is something very very different than overeating – gaining 7 pounds overnight indicates to me that something is going haywire in your internal balance/regulation. My chinese medicine doctor was much better at addressing this kind of issues than my western doctors.
And….condolences on all the IVF…I’ve been down that road, too, and it’s so so hard.
Anon
I really, really like Nicole Holovach and recommend working with her. She is a registered dietician and provides services virtually. She specializes in working with women who have fertility/hormonal issues, and is a no-nonsense and knowledgeable resource. Her session package is not cheap – but she will provide you with invoices that you can submit to your insurance for out of network reimbursement which helps with cost.
https://wholehealthrd.com/
Trixie
I have no similar story to share, but maybe this is helpful. After medically induced weight gain 25 years ago, I decided maybe medically induced weight loss was in order. I found my way to a doctor who specializes in weight loss medications. Over 18 months I lost 30 pounds using Saxenda and phentermine. I tracked what I ate, added in morning fasting, and finally had success. I still reduced what I ate, and there is no magic, but it was so much easier than in the past and I could stick with it. Best wishes,
Stephanie
I agree with this comment. Ozempic/Wegovy has been life changing for me. I will say that my family doctor was very understanding and I’m not sure I would say the same about yours. You sound like a person who has it all together and I’m sure with the proper support you will be able to get to where you want to be! Good luck and best wishes.
Anonymous
I would try a different doctor. It sounds like yours is blaming the weight on you rather than trying to help you find a solution.
Anon
OP here. Thank you for the suggestions and comments. I’m going to look into what you’ve mentioned.
Yes current dr just says WW even though calorie log shows high activity, low sleep and then sudden weird weight gain.
I’ll post again with progress.
Nudibranch
As a fellow hypothyroid person with weight issues, you need to talk to an endocrinologist, not seek help from the internet or a nutritionist. Your thyroid and related issues are driving your weight gain and you may need your meds adjusted. This helped me. However the only time I’ve been able to consistently lose weight was by sticking to a 1200 net calorie/day diet and exercising ferociously. I was also taken a pretty high amount of synthroid for my body weight. You can’t really compare your body weight issues to others who do not have thyroid problems because your body is different and so is your metabolism.
If you’re unsatisfied with your endocrinologist and the advice you’re getting, maybe get a second opinion? I’d stay away from family doctors or nutritionists at this time because they don’t have the experience or knowledge to get you the help and medical fine-tuning you need. Telling you to go to Weight Watchers and track your calories has never helped me. I don’t appreciate the shaming displayed above from those who’ve not experienced metabolic disorders.
Also, beware menopause which has thrown an additional wrench in my works. Still not sure how that is going to work out and what weight my body will hopefully settle into!
Nudibranch
Also, the only luck I’ve had along with the 1200 calorie/day intake has been restricting myself to very low carbs–i.e. fruit, vegetables and lean proteins over all. My only cheats were 50-cal chocolate squares and coffee creamer. I’ve been told (and experience) that overall calorie restriction does not work as well. It’s best to restrict calories while majorly limiting carbs.
Anonymous
I’m 44 and have been fighting a losing battle with weight (up up up) for years… and I just started losing (only 5 lbs yet). Have you tried increasing your fiber? I kept seeing perimenopausal women needed more fiber so I increased it and increased it (do it slowly) and now regularly get 30-40g a day. Add veggies to everything, chia pudding, air popped popcorn, avocado…
AZCPA
Slightly younger (40) but was long term in the same boat of staying the same weight or gaining not matter what I ate or how much I exercised. I dedicatedly tracked using several programs including WW, MyFitnessPal, and a couple of different apps provided by my insurance. We even played with my thyroid meds (I am hypothyroid as well).
Finally, due to mild IBS that was slowly getting progressively worse, I ended up having every blood and stool test under the sun. Found several vitamin deficiencies, and treated the IBS both with ongoing medication Bentyl) and hypnotherapy. And now I’m slowly losing weight 1/2 – 1 lb a week). Obviously your situation may be different, but a holistic blood workup might be a good starting point.
Coach Laura
I used to have 5-7 pound swings weekly and gain weight without an appropriate increase in calories. I thought it was hormones (maybe part of it was) but when I was diagnosed with celiac and stopped eating wheat/gluten, those swings magically stopped (age 50). I mention this because many celiacs have problems with glucose and about 50% of adult celiacs are overweight at diagnosis (as opposed to children, who are invariably underweight and malnourished). Some people with glucose intolerance are unable to tolerate simple carbs and white wheat flour is the biggest offender (other than plain sugar).
My suggestion would be to try low carb, if you haven’t already, and cut out gluten. You can’t cut out gluten for just a week, try 2 months. Eat simple food – meats, vegetables, fruits, nuts, eggs, small amounts of beans, maybe some brown rice or quinoa. Not necessary to go full keto or paleo or Atkins. Don’t add in gluten free bread products because they are invariably simple carbs. Some people can be gluten intolerant without being celiac, so you can do this without a doctor or being diagnosed. It may help, may not. But that is my experience.
Anon
OP
Oh this is interesting. Because I don’t have much of an appetite this is no problem. I went without gluten sugar caffeine alcohol or anything premade for 10 months before. Then work and caregiving got hectic. It didn’t help but it can’t hurt.
Anonymous
Check out The fasting method — a program designed by Dr Jason Fung and Megan Ramos. Focused on reversing insulin resistance.
Anon
Does anyone use a filtering shower head that they recommend? Do they actually work? My apartment has *really* hard water and I feel like it’s affecting my hair and skin in the shower – can’t get shampoo to suds up as well, dry/red skin, etc.
I’m new to Indianapolis and have never had hard water before, so open to any other hard water related tips! LemiShine seems to really help in my dishwasher, and I got a PUR filter for drinking water. Since it’s an apartment, I can’t install a water softener.
Anon
I have a Sprite shower head with a filter and it seems to work ok.
pugsnbourbon
Welcome to Indy! The hard water IS really bad. We have a filter – I can’t remember what kind but I’ll check when I get home.
Anon
I live in a suburb of Minneapolis where the water is similarly extremely hard. We just installed this filter yesterday and I’m already a huge fan – just for the improved water pressure alone! https://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/B07MCV6JCL?psc=1&ref=ppx_pop_mob_b_asin_title
Curious
I sound like a broken record, but Wardrobe Oxygen recently reviewed one she loves.
anon
This top is very Moira Rose.
anonshmanon
This would make me feel like the accordion come to life that didn’t get any lines in Beauty and the Beast.
Senior Attorney
Hah!
Vicky Austin
Immediately thought of her.
Anonymous
+1. Not for real life.
anon
That’s what it is! I was trying to place it.
anon
Does anyone actually enjoy the experience of being in charge of things? I’m a new partner at my firm, and I felt this way as a manager as well- everyone wants something from you, you’re always at fault for someone not being 100% happy, and nothing is ever enough for anyone. I’m a super high performer, have a lot of ppl who enjoy working with me etc, so I don’t think this is reflective of my ability to actually manage things, I think it’s just a function of being in charge of stuff. Does anyone actually enjoy the experience of being in charge of things, or does it just beat not being in charge (also money, power, etc etc). I do enjoy being able to have the impact that I want on things vs leaving it up to others’ judgment. Just want to get a sense of how others feel.
Anonymous
Yes I love it!
Anon
+1
Curious
+1. But I also have probably 7 years of experience managing and made lots of mistakes early on. It’s gotten a lot more fun as I’ve gotten more skilled.
Cat
Some people are far happier in an “individual contributor” role vs. a manager role. In the law firm context it’s even weirder because the traits that make a successful “legal advice giver” only overlap in part (IMHO a sense of practicality and expectation-setting) with those that make a successful manager.
Veronica Mars
It depends on the project, but I’d say that I love it. In my circumstance it’s because 1) I have deep experience in what I’m doing, and know what we need to do 2) I have authority to make decisions and carry them through 3) I know management has my back if people are being unreasonable 4) I know I can always shut down something that’s going nowhere. Without that combination, I think it would be too high stress.
anon OP
Yeah this resonates. I do really like it I think, I am just a little tired of everyone always being unhappy and whiny about dumb things.
anon
agree on many points here.
before times, people used to complain about the taste of the filtered water provided in the $XX-$XXX M dollar renovated buildings.
also note that I agree not being in charge is more stressful, but few talk about the issues you raised (someone always not happy) in mgmt.
Cora
I love being in charge of things. I like feeling like I have some control, or even some small impact over a process, and I accept that not every one is going to be happy ever so I don’t let that bother me. Even in a situation where I am not officially in charge I take charge (as long as that would not be stepping on anyones toes). I perform better in management vs. individual contributor positions. I like meetings and being interactive and having a view of the whole playing field.
anon
Oh, I feel this to my core. I have been a manager for 3-ish years now, and it was a big adjustment for all the reasons you mentioned. There are times when I honestly hate being in charge because it’s impossible to please everyone, and being made to feel “wrong” is one of my weak spots. What gets me through is knowing that while I’m not perfect by any means, I’m good at what I do and know how to manage things well. And people seek my expertise, so my team must be doing something right! The money is fine, but I’m in the public sector so not pulling down big bucks by any means. Power, meh. That’s absolutely the wrong reason to go into people management.
Anon
Yep, I do. It’s ok if it’s not your thing. Just be humble and open about it – very few things worse than a leader who won’t admit shortcomings.
Anonymous
I go back and forth on this. I definitely like being a partner better than an associate. As a junior associate, I was always getting dumped on with emergency assignments that were only emergencies because those above me had procrastinated on them for so long. I would have little to do all week and then a mountain of work late nights and all weekend, especially over holidays. Being a mid level was a little better because I could anticipate work flow, but I was still at the mercy of those above me for things like signing off on filings, which they always wait until the last possible second (at midnight) to do. Being a senior associate was a little better but it was hard to get other associates to prioritize “my” work because they had deadlines for partners. As a partner I get a little more respect and a little less pushback from all sides. Writing this out, I think procrastination is a problem among litigators and if people at all levels managed their time more reasonably then all our lives would be better for it.
Anon
No, I hate it. I abhor telling people what to do, having them come to me with their problems, etc. I always felt like screaming “everybody leave me alone!” I moved from management back to individual contributor and am so much happier. I don’t really care about power at all, and the additional money wasn’t worth it to me.
Sfbiz
+1
It’s funny but all of my family is like this. Part of it is ingrained behavioral traits/preferences.
My parents/siblings are super bright and were stellar in their various careers. All of them were pushed early into high management/director type positions in their academic/biz/law fields, and all of them disliked it strongly. Sometimes they actually made less $ in the top jobs, because they made more with overtime (and less stress?) in their prior individual contributor position.
And in general, a leading role often is spending more time in meetings and using different management skills. And if you went to NASA to work as a nuclear physicist, maybe you actually want to do nuclear physics and NOT manage other people who do it.
Like I have a sibling who essentially runs a tech start-up in Silicon Valley, but hates the job because he actually wants to do the tech. And he’s like one of the best in the world at the tech.
Senior Attorney
This is my husband. He is the senior of only two partners at his firm and says “I just want to go in my office and do my work” when everybody is coming to him with questions and problems.
I, on the other hand, love being in charge and will happily tell people what to do all day long!
anon
I love it but it’s not for everyone. One of the biggest problems with many offices is that the best performers are often “promoted” to managers when it’s actually an entirely different skill set. Just because you’re good at the substantive work a group is doing doesn’t mean you’ll be a good manager (and the opposite is also true – I think the best managers actually are not the most talented substantively). The idea that being a manager should be a gold star or a reward for excellent work leads to many bad managers. Managers should be hired for their managerial skills not due to their ability to complete the tasks they will be managing. I think everyone would be a lot happier if offices functioned this way.
Vicky Austin
You know, I’m speaking from the very early career years in which I still am, and in which I have always been an individual contributor type, but I did really enjoy being in charge of things in my college years – student elections, an annual awards banquet. Delegating was something I had to learn, but as a lifelong perfectionist/people-pleaser/person whose self-worth got tied to accomplishing things alone very early in my life, it was the perfect time and place to learn that particular lesson. And I went to such a weird, commutery school that I genuinely was having to “manage” actual adults 10-15 years older than me in both of those contexts. I enjoyed the logistical challenges. I enjoyed the people I worked with most of the time. I enjoyed being the face of something and having people ask me questions to which I knew the answers (see above re: people-pleaser!). And I enjoyed the freedom to suggest things and have people take them seriously, even if they didn’t pan out.
MechanicalKeyboard
I LOVE being and charge and perform better as a manager vs an individual contributor. I find focusing on the deliverables of a whole team a lot less stressful than focusing solely on my own deliverables. Yeah, people whine and complain about dumb things but some of that can me managed away or ignored.
anon OP
yeah, this is true of me too. I was generally performing on the higher side of average as an individual contributor but didn’t really start to excel until I took on leadership roles/ I really do enjoy basically everything else about my role (as I think about it and read these responses) and don’t think individual contributor is the fit for me. That said, I also feel a bit more weighed down by the burden of other people and their feelings and issues than I could. Is the answer just to address them as needed and not care so much?
Curious
Yes. Some of a manager’s job is to “play counselor,” but mostly in the sense that you give people a place to be heard, set reasonable expectations for what is or is not actionable, and direct people in need of more help to your EAP. For what it’s worth, my experience has been that employees’ ability to manage their emotion increases with tenure, so as I’ve had the privilege of managing more senior employees, the emotional challenges have become less wearing and more engaging (e.g., how do we work together through COVID burnout vs. I’m mad about what person X said).
anon OP
Thanks. Yeah I have also noticed what you said about emotional challenges becoming less wearing and more engaging now that I’m no longer a frontline manager. The things that have recently worn me down were times when I had to fill in for one of my managers in a crisis and their juniors were perhaps not always the best behaved. Took a lot of energy for me to deal with, especially since now my number of total team members I oversee is so much higher. Hopefully this doesn’t happen as often moving forward.
Curious
Yes. Flexing that way (and working with the most junior staff) is tiring, because the type of training and monitoring you need to do is different, and the sheer hour commitment is higher. Here’s hoping things go back to more normal (do you have it in your power to increase the chances of that?) and you get a chance to recover.
Curious
You’ll also get a sense over time about what you can do (give a person a bit of a break because it turns out their spouse is struggling after a death in the family, help them find the EAP, support any requests for leave) and what you can’t (permanently relax standards for that employee). Seeing the patterns helps it become less stressful and personal, though I think a good manager will always care :).
Anon
I liked being a manager and having a team of 6, and I was good at it – all team members consistently gave positive feedback for my managerial ability. However, doing it for 3 years under adverse circumstances amid staff cutbacks and low morale due to major reorganizations was exhausting. Honestly, leaving that was a huge relief and I don’t feel the need to go back, at least not right now.(Currently in a new, individual contributor role at a much smaller company).
Anonymous
There are some things I like about being in charge, like being able to push back against unreasonable client expectations instead of having to deliver on unreasonable promises that someone else made. It is exhausting, though, and what really gets to me is having to be in charge of everything at work and at home. I would really like to come home and have someone else be responsible for making everything happen.
At my first choir rehearsal since the shutdown the director asked “how are you” and my response was, “I am so glad to be someplace where I am not in charge!” He seemed puzzled.
Senior Attorney
Oh, my. This resonates with me down to my shoes.
Anonymous
I sometimes tell my husband that I can’t make any more decisions for the rest of the day when I get home if it has been one of “those” days. I leave dinner plans up to him, which sometimes means he just orders pizza haha, but I don’t care as long as I didn’t have to figure it out.
Anon
I managed a restaurant before I went to law school. I had a “professional” but boring job and was going into the restaurant several nights a week to bake their desserts. Then I got hired to manage the restaurant. I hated it. I learned an important lesson for me – that I hate managing people. “Not managing people” has been a life goal ever since.
Anon
I have a beautiful wool blanket draped over a straw basket. I went to use the blanket yesterday and it looks like it’s been eaten by moth larvae! It’s gross and I’m so mad at myself for not taking better care of these things. What do it do? Do I take the blanket to the dry cleaner? How do I get the moth larvae off of the basket? (They look like baking yeast all over part of the basket.)
Anon
I personally would probably toss the basket, but I have major issues with bug (I once woke up in a fancy hotel with bed bugs crawling all over me, and ever since then, bugs really really freak me out). I’d get a new basket and add a cedar stick (or get a cedar basket…if those are a thing). Mothballs smell so bad and are toxic to pets, so I’d go the cedar route.
Anonymous
You can kill them by putting it in one of those zip vacuum bags and then putting it in a hot car in the sun. But then it needs to go to dry-cleaner and maybe a reweaver after that. Moths/larvae are attracted to anything like body oils / sweat / lotion residue, so it is vital that even if you stretch items between wearings, that you at some point clean and store things in airtight containers. I lost something precious to moths once and since then it has been constant vigilance on wool items.
Anonymous
You throw them out. The blanket is full of holes that will not be repairable. The basket is a little breeding ground that will ruin everything else in your house. Borax the living daylights out of everything in the room where this stuff was located and hope it didn’t spread. If this was in a closet then look very closely at everything in the closet and take dry clean only stuff to the dry cleaners. Just be sure to tell them it was exposed to moths so they know to keep it separate from other clothes. You’ll have to pay more because it’ll go in its own load.
Anon
+1 – sometimes things are ruined and you throw them away.
Anon
All of this. The blanket is not salvageable. The basket is not salvageable. Even if you keep these items and somehow (somehow) get rid of the infestation, you will never be able to look at the items and not think about how gross it was to find the larvae all over the place. Just throw out both items and replace them. Only exception is if these are treasured family heirlooms or something. And in that case I would take the blanket to a professional cleaner for advice, and then call an exterminator.
Anonymous
I would toss both, or you’re basically asking for full infestation and ruining more things if it hasn’t happened already—and it can take years to track down and get rid of every moth-loving surface once they start. This is something where you throw out now or you will end up throwing out a ton later. If it were as easy as heat or cold (I’ve never had luck with either, then moth balls wouldn’t be such a thing. )
Anonymous
Stick the blanket in the freezer for at least 3 days to kill larvae.
Check your closets – if the basket was that bad, they have probably found your sweaters as well.
LaurenB
Talk to me about Ilse Jacobsen shoes (it’s a very specific look). Someone whose fashion opinion I respect said they are very dated (they “had a moment” pre-Covid). Yet I unearthed a pair in good condition in my closet that for whatever reason I just hadn’t gotten a lot of wear from. I know I shouldn’t care, but what say you all? Yay or nay?
Anonymous
Not my look (at any point), but I wouldn’t bat an eye if someone else wore them.
MechanicalKeyboard
I’ve only seen them during a night of wine-induced QVC watching – if that helps you determine their cool factor.
Senior Attorney
I wouldn’t wear them because I think they look old-ladyish and I am an actual old lady and not inclined to lean into that aesthetic. If I were young I might (but probably not) feel differently.
NYNY
I love me some ugly shoes, so I say yes, but it has to look intentional. If your look skews preppy, the shoes don’t look right. But with something more artsy or edgy, they’re great.
Anon
Rant: why does there seem to be literally no thought out into return to office policies? I have seen 47 variations of various return policies and it appears no thought has gone into any of them. Policies treating all staff/groups the same (why? Just because one group needs to be physically there, why does everyone? Or just because one group can do their job entirely remotely, that doesn’t mean that everyone can?), arbitrary policies about number of days in the office (if you can work from home 3 out of 10 days, why do you need to be in the other 7, what is happening those 7 days? If everyone picks their own 7 days and everyone is in on different days, what is the point of being in at all?), start dates picked from thin air (after Labor Day because…? January 1? What do we think will be different at any of these goal posts?).
I don’t really have a point but I guess question for the group, if you were designing a return to office plan, what would it look like and why?
Anonymous
Hi. As your local employment lawyer, I assure you that 100% of my clients have put a lot of thought into their policies. No none of them are perfect or suit anyone’s needs but it’s absurd to say they are not done with thought just because you disagree about the thoughts they prioritize.
Anon
Please then enlighten us with what employers are prioritizing because it seems that among my group of friends who are in a wide range of industries, no one is happy with the plans and no one understands how/why the plans were designed.
Also, not every company consults an employment attorney. The fact that you’re involved in your clients plans shows that they are more thoughtful than many.
Anonymous
A lot of people running companies actually want all their employees back in person all the time. A lot of the weird 3 days out of 10 policies are because someone talked them into having some flexibility. Obviously not every company consults an employment attorney but they are thinking about it. You just don’t like their thoughts.
Anon
That’s actually support for what I view as thoughtless. Accommodating flexibility when you don’t want it and without thinking through how it will work feels thoughtless to me. I may disagree with a company that wants 100% return to office but at least I can understand the thought process
Anonymous
Well if you want to call a company thinking about it and deciding on something you don’t like thoughtless, you’re wrong. Words have meaning and it literally is not thoughtless.
Anon.
+1 I work in risk consulting and one of our business units is assisting clients with this. Hard agree that a ton of thought is going in to this. Very much a case of you can’t please everyone, some of my team members are desperate to return and some terrified.
anon
I’d love to see us give people the choice on wfh full time versus not but understand that also comes at a price (closing locations, the WFH/invisibility tax).
maybe a more interesting question: schools prepare us to accept a factory like atmosphere (see history of education and changes when factories started to become a standard). will we use this giant pause to rethink how life could be?Not advocating that all of us going back to farming, but how we might work in a decentralised fashion, or is that too radical? Some large employers have already said all will work from home instead of RTO…..
Doodles
Yep. Also an employment lawyer. Have drafted many back to work policies and all are different. Clients have different needs and there are so many factors to consider beyond each employee’s wishes (which are not aligned across the board anyway). They all certainly put “thought” into their policies. The result is different. Can’t please everyone. My own firm is going back two days a week (specific two days; not choice of days) and will schedule social events and work meetings on those days. Of course no one will be at my office door taking attendance. Many attorneys travel or have court commitments, etc, and will not come in on those specific days. I’m personally very happy with this policy. I had intended to go back 2X a week anyway and am fine with the specific days. Now I know that, generally, I will see most of my practice group when I’m in the office. Before, Joe may have been in Mondays and Wednesdays while Susie was Thursdays and Fridays.
Anonymous
I would not make anybody return to the office right now. It’s totally delusional to me that these companies with inflated senses of their own self/importance think that the world won’t survive if they don’t have butts-in-seat during Delta. The only good policy IMO is full flexibility for as long as it takes (no arbitrary “by December” deadlines) with an official recommendation to stay home, capacity limits, proof of vaccination required, and masking required.
Anon
Gently, it sounds like you might just be frustrated with having to go back to working in the office, which is totally understandable. Any date chosen is going to be a date picked out of thin air, right? Unless COVID is eradicated, you could say “why” to any date. I would say the 3 out of 10 days is to limit the amount of people in the office at the same time, as well as help folks ease back in – if there were more rules or a schedule around that, things would get complicated, it would be hard to enforce, teams would get jealous of other teams, etc. if the company’s goal is to get everyone back in the office (as opposed to companies who are transitioning some of it’s workforce to staying WFH).
If it helps, I felt this same way when I went back into the office in June 2020. I was really angry (especially since the pandemic was raging then, and there was not yet a vaccine), but honestly, after 3 weeks I was totally used to it. Now when I work from home, I feel like I can’t get as much done, and go in on days that I could stay home.
Anon
Nope. I actually don’t have official mandatory return date (and we have committed to not until at least 2022) and have gone in voluntarily multiple times. My frustration is that the policies being floated actually do not make any sense once they are even slightly pressure tested. To me, the point of being in person is to have meetings and collaborate which doesn’t work if everyone picks their own schedule or there are safety restrictions in place that make it impossible for certain groups to meet. I’d actually love to be back in person for some things. But when I go in and am sitting in my office on a conference call with others in their offices, how is that better or different than all/some of us doing that from home?
I am convinced this is all driven by real estate costs.
anon
(note: large, global company, not law)
I feel like many of these policies are driven by the need to justify office building costs. many of us are happy WFH but we’re forced into returning even if our teams and stakeholders are in other offices for “culture”. We’ve been fine for nearly 2 years – what’s the big? My boss is really keen to get back to office but he has a shared office at home, 3 kids, dog and nanny – he just likes being seen and having a break from home. I have a much better setup (my own office on another floor, quiet time to be productive instead of cavernous open space) plus I’m high risk, as are my family members although we’re all vaccinated, I have worries about breakthrough cases for over 85 family members if I bring it home.
Having vented along with you, our RTO planning includes mandatory disclosure of vaccination (which I feel is intrusive) so they can plan the max numbers of people to come back. Even though schools are opening and quickly closing here with high rates, the drum beat on RTO continues. Since we spent many millions on a new complex, the return seems to focus on justifying those costs. Inclusion and collaboration are up since WFH on our teams.
Curious if others found the same on Inclusion and collaboration?
Ribena
Collaboration within my team is up but with other teams is way down. I feel like I have no idea what’s going on in other parts of the org anymore.
anon
Yep, same. It is much, much harder to keep an eye on the big picture.
Anonymous
So take steps to find out. A problem in my organization is “I feel like collaboration has suffered” and then the unspoken part is “but I’ve never taken any steps to remedy that!” What have you tried?
Halloween Q
Gently, I have done my part in all things. More than my share. Problems should not be 100% on me to fix.
Anonymous
On inclusion and collaboration, it turns out that a lot of people who think they’re good at WFH actually aren’t. Just because an employee likes something doesn’t mean they’re doing a good job. I’m sure their days probably do have less stress, because apparently they need to feel like someone was looking over their shoulder (even if that’s not true) to stay focused and motivated. Others are great at wfh and it’s really frustrating that their increased productivity gets minimized because of the employees who are in la la land all day – who also seem to be the ones clamoring the loudest about continuing to WFH.
Anonymous
I think this is the elephant in the room. Two years ago, people were just doing their best during what we thought was an acute crisis and I think management was just impressed that people were trying and it made no sense to say anything but “wow we’re all doing great.” I’m looking around and I think for the most part everyone I work with is less available, engaged and knowledgeable. The work is suffering and management is kinda of terrified to say anything. I think a lot of the people saying they’re good at watching their kids all day and catching up on work after midnight are actually producing sub par work and it’s taboo to say.
No Face
I think another elephant in the room is that the first phase of the pandemic burned out huge numbers of people, and that many employees sincerely do not care about their careers/roles as much as they did in 2019. Plus, the fact that cases jumped up again means that burned-out employees are going to be even more burned out.
I’m not sure how an employer solves that issue; remote or back in the office is almost a red herring.
anon
+ 1 million to No Face. I think all the WFH/RTO is getting mixed in with a giant shift in attitudes towards work and general burnout. Not to mention how different WFH looks in the middle of a pandemic versus normally (and I think that cuts both ways…WFH is certainly easier if you don’t have kids trying to do zoom school while you’re home…WFH may feel more isolating if you are not used to social distancing). I think there are a lot of valid questions to be asked about WFH but it’s really hard to separate out what WFH is responsible for versus what the pandemic is responsible for.
Anon
I think people are burned out in office too though. The majority of my team was forced back into office, and it definitely hasn’t helped.
Curious
Agree. At least 50% of my team is dealing with burnout or other mental health issues due to the pandemic, and we aren’t
in healthcare or otherwise pandemic-adjacent. It makes management tricky.
Anonymous
We never closed, but had liberal WFH and then reopened. Back to liberal WFH but with the caveat that NO ONE can come in now unless vaccinated. My home was wretched for WFH (never envisioned or wanted, frankly), so I am grateful to have an office to get to when it is too loud or I’m tired of having to work from a bedroom, etc. I am liking the “must get shot” thing (and hoping it doesn’t put people off from getting shots though).
Anon
honestly, my plan two months ago would be very different than the plan i’d create now since most policies were initially created based on the idea that vaccinated people could not spread covid, but the Delta variant has changed that. i think if you are going to have people back in the office, you need required masks and a testing program in place. but really i think the safest thing would be to continue with WFH as much as possible, particularly for people who are immunocompromised, live with someone who is immunocompromised or live with a population who cannot yet be vaccinated
anon
+1
I see that the NYT just published a story that all NYC education employees are under vaccination mandate with no teat out option. This seems like it would trigger lawsuits from the 145-150k employees……
Anonymous
Why? The law is very clear that vaccination can be required, NYC has not said they will refuse to at least engage in an interactive process to determine if people with medical or religious objections can be accommodated, and the teachers Union supports it.
I’m sure some crazies will try but I doubt there will be widespread lawsuits.
Anon
It’s perfectly legal.
Anonymous
Why? What right do they have to not be vaccinated against a communjcable disease for which there is an approved vaccine? The right to contaminate the air? The right to threaten the health and safety of others (surreptitiously if that intrusive question about vac status is also nixed)? The right to threaten the livelihoods of others who wish to safely and consistently return to work? Which “right” will they be suing to protect? I am not saying people have to get vaccinated to live in the state or country. I am just saying they can live small lives mostly in their homes, shopping and eating in the limited places where the lack of mandates is advertised if they want to do that.
PolyD
Apparently a lot of “religions” let you opt out of anything that is for the common good.
And then there are the people who have perverted the idea of My body, my choice, except only for vaccines, not abortions. Funny thing is, if I have an abortion, my neighbor doesn’t miscarry. If I spread COVID to her because I’m not vaccinated, she very well might.
Halloween Q
Well, when the Pope says to get your shots and people generally get tetanus and other shots, I am seeing a lot of picking and choosing with this shot.
Curious
PolyD I was just thinking this about abortions.
Senior Counsel
Mandatory vaccinations have been the law since 1905. And in that case is was the government mandating it for all residents with no opt outs. I am not sure that would pass muster today but government and employers can absolutely and legally make vaccinations mandatory.
That won’t stop the crazies from suing – but is probably cheaper than the hundreds of worker compensation claims they would otherwise be dealing with.
anonshmanon
Strange why you would think that every last education employee in NYC is looking to sue about this, when 60-70% of Americans are for vaccine mandates, depending on the context of the question. That’s a pretty solid margin of support, which is only expected to be higher in an urban place like NYC.
No Problem
Global medium-ish company here. We are being extremely thoughtful and deliberate about our RTO plans. For in-office days, it depends entirely on your role. Facilities/building engineer? You need to be in 5 days a week. The majority of the professional staff? A couple days a week is fine. And those days should be coordinated among the team so that people actually see each other, and hopefully those are the days when you schedule most of your meetings and do some in person collaboration. Then your WFH time can be more focused on independent work.
Note that we did just push back our start of RTO from September to TBD due to delta. We have a lot of people that are really looking forward to going back to the office (live in smaller homes/with families or roommates, prefer their desk setup at the office, find that their work has suffered with less in-person interaction, etc.), so they are pretty bummed. Others hate the office or spend a lot of time on client sites, so they have less reason to want to go in or to need to go in.
I think the WFH has been especially tricky for new hires because there’s a certain amount of company culture that is so much easier to pick up on in the office (water cooler chats, chats in the hallway, being able to stop by someone’s office, etc.). Most of our new hires have done great, but I’m not sure how it will really work for them in the long term.
I also agree that some of the push to RTO has to do with real estate expenditures. The company is spending a ton of money on office space, so we might as well use it. However, the vast majority of us have been able to do our jobs just fine remotely and our company is very focused on health and safety for all employees and their families, so they are being cautious despite the “wasted” money on real estate. We also will have a vaccine mandate, which I’m very happy for and most of my colleagues wanted as well.
anon
This sounds like an incredibly thoughtful policy! I really wish my office would take this type of approach. Currently it seems like a battle between those who never want to return and those who want butts in seats 5 days a week, with neither side willing to compromise or listen to the merits of the other.
No Problem
Keep in mind that it hasn’t been put into practice yet. So we don’t really know how it will shake out. That’s just how we’re hoping it will work!
anon
I strongly disagree that zero thought is being put into these policies. This is a case where you truly cannot please everyone. There are people who wanted a full return a year ago. There are people who never want to return. Hybrid is an option, but that’s requiring technology upgrades across the board that take both time and money.
If your organization is being clear about what’s required, even if you disagree with parts of it, consider yourself fortunate.
Anonymous
Curious, what technological upgrades are required for hybrid? Huge tech upgrades were required to let everyone go remote. But now that they are, what additional upgrades would be needed for a hybrid environment?
Ribena
In our case, it’s involving improving the tech in meeting rooms so it’s easier to have a meeting where some people are there in person and others are joining remotely. Previously they just had spider phones which often didn’t work.
Anon
Those costs are mostly if not totally offset by the saving of heating and cooling costs of having the remote people and their computers working in the office.
anon
Yes, our meeting room tech is sketchy. Some rooms work great, others don’t. And more meeting spaces are being booked for remote collaboration.
anonshmanon
I noticed another logistical snag that with hybrid when recently, I spent one whole day in the office with an office mate. It used to be that you go to a conference room to have meetings or to your office for focused work. In hybrid, you might have an in-person meeting in the morning, and two zoom meetings in the afternoon. Do you book the conference room for that? I ended up putting on headphones because my office mate had a (sorta private) zoom meeting with a report opposite me, and I didn’t want to eavesdrop. I get that places with cubicles have had this problem for longer, but for my office environment it’s another thing that’s changing that you need to consider.
Anon
I have a team of teams. I have been hearing they are overloaded from them and from management support for mental health but the dial keeps cranking up on expectations.
Seperately, I think you can tell if people are working or not but the output and results so why not manage like that?
Best buy used to have ROWE which meant they measured results only not face time hours
Anon
I’ve always wanted a dog, I now have an opportunity to get one, and I’m freaking out about the decision. I’m mid 30s, single, moderate depression/anxiety (pandemic made that worse), live in a quieter part of a big city, and had dogs growing up. I’ll eventually go back to working in an office 30 min from home three days a week but I’m not sure when that will be. So, I’ll have to figure out a dog walker for those days. I’ve always said I want a bigger life – husband, house, kids, dog, and now that I have a chance to have a piece of that, I’m overwhelmed with anxiety. I’m talking to my therapist later this week but I may have to decide on this before then. Sometime I wish I could just make decisions like a normal person, sigh. Any advice?
anon
you sound like a thoughtful person (planning support after going back to office, giving time to decide on something that is/should be a very long term commitment {instead of dumping a dog to a shelter}, etc) – what’s not normal person about that?
also, why the rush to choose this week before therapy?
what about some research, talking to breeders and owners of the dogs on your top 3 list?
also, be gentle with yourself : )
OP
Thank you for this kind response. I’ve already done a lot of research on responsible breeders (golden retriever), and one of the breeders I’ve been talking to unexpectedly had a family drop off of her list for her current litter and is offering the puppy to me. The timing would be good since I’m almost certainly wfh full time for the next few months while the dog is a true puppy, which wouldn’t be the case if I wait for the next litter. It’s just a much bigger commitment than I feel like I ever ever made before!
Senior Attorney
When I was thinking about trying for a baby, my mom said “if everybody waited until they felt completely ready, nobody would ever have babies.” For some reason I found that comforting and I went ahead and had a baby and it was great. Maybe it applies to puppies, too?
Anon
Totally. Congratulations on your puppy, OP! Now is the time because the puppy is here.
Anonymous
You sound like you’ll be a responsible and able dog owner. Best of luck!
When it comes to this particular puppy, make sure that you talk to the breeder about the personality and quirks of this particular puppy. You want a great match for you and your lifestyle, not the first one available. If this is a super, super energetic one very suited to lots of kids rushing around, you might be exhausted by your dog even though you love it.
Since you had dogs growing up you already know what you think of as normal dog behavior and temperament, and what you have been missing or want to be different, and this is all good information to use in a conversation with the breeder about this particular puppy.
Anonymous
Dog walker is easy to figure out. My only hesitation for you would be if you travel a lot and will need to board the dog regularly, because that gets really expensive/ logistically complicated.
Not sure about your particular anxieties, but I’d recommend signing up for a weekly training class or hiring a trainer to visit weekly for the first 3+ months.
Aside from that–get the dog! DH and I got our dog when I was struggling with period of miscarriage and depression several years ago and our sweet pup was exactly what I needed.
Emma
Hi! I have anxiety and we got a puppy about a year ago. It was my decision, I was super excited, but then as we got closer to the time my anxiety took over and my mind went all over the place: the dog would be horrible, the neighbors would complain, we would be horrible owners and the dog would sustain some sort of life threatening injury, etc etc. This was 100% my anxiety talking. The dog was challenging as a puppy (mostly biting and chewing things), but is a total sweetheart and has done wonders for my mental health (walks, love, easy distanced socializing with other dog owners). The only thing is I’m really happy I was WFH when he was a puppy since he required constant supervision – I’ll be sending him to daycare when I go back into work part time.
emeralds
+1, this is your anxiety talking.
I will also say, as someone who is anxious and has periodically struggled with depression…both of those things are better for me with a dog, than without one.
OP
Thank you! This sounds like exactly what I’m going through. The thought of having no good “off ramp” if I continue freaking out and any of those bad things happen is whats getting to me, I think.
Anonymous
The “off ramp” is doggie day care!
Anon
Just do it. Dogs are magical and add so much to your life. Always choose the life broadening option. In big cities, there’s a ton of resources – walkers, day care, etc. and getting one while you can still be home is the perfect time if there ever was one. My only regret in life is not getting dogs sooner.
Anonymous
Just go get a dog.
Anon
You’re going to make it work and it will be worth it! I felt a similar way about getting a pet, and it was hands down the best decision I’ve ever made.
Anon
No experience with dogs but I have similar anxiety about making my life “bigger” — I related to what you said about that so much! I recently had a similar anxiety issue about getting a car and I’m glad I took the plunge! Good luck!
Anon
When I was planning to get a dog, one of the things that really helped my anxiety was to build my “village.” I found a couple of veterinary clinics nearby, a couple of dogwalking services that were highly rated that served my area, a couple of boarding locations nearby AND a couple of people who would come and stay at my house with her (via Rover). Just putting some puzzle pieces together really helped me to feel better about getting a dog as a single person – knowing that I had a fall back in place if I needed to go out of town suddenly for work or a family emergency, etc.
But, I agree with the above posters. Get a dog. They are wonderful. I got my girl almost 8 years ago as a single woman living in the city – I’m now a married lady with a baby and another dog, and she’s been with me through it all. She’s old now, and slowing down. But she’s one of the best decisions I ever made.
national_anthem
I am a little late so I hope you see this, but I see a lot of myself in your comment. I put off getting a dog for a long time because I was worried that I wasn’t going to be able to provide a dog with the best life possible, which was mostly due to what I will characterize as “reasonable but solvable concerns” like the ones you mention (working full time, traveling occasionally, etc.). I finally ended up getting my pup when I lived with a boyfriend who had a very different work schedule (plus we had a house with a yard), so the idea of having an additional person to help allowed me get past some of those things that I was anxious about…. but turns out, the boyfriend was not even remotely helpful, I absolutely did everything for the dog, and it wasn’t actually that hard (plus she was so sweet and loving it was totally worth it). The relationship, on the other hand, fell apart for a variety of reasons (like him not being an equal partner in that and other areas of life). I moved out, took the dog, and we now live in an apartment and are leading our best lives. While it can feel overwhelming before you do it, once you have the dog you figure out how to make it work. Also, once I had the dog it became way easier to find the solutions to those solvable problems – I have a coffee shop near me that allows dogs, my dog and I get coffee there regularly on our walks, and now the barista who has gotten to know my dog through our visits is my go-to dog-sitter or dog-walker.
I second the recommendations for some training (helpful for both you and the dog) and I also think it’s important during these times to make sure the dog gets used to being left alone sometimes. I got my pup before the pandemic, so she was used to me going to work, and although she absolutely loves work from home (and is asleep on my feet as I type this), I do make sure to leave her alone on a semi-regular basis so that she remembers that is just something that happens sometimes won’t freak out if and when when I do have to go back to work full-time.
I will also say that having my dog has been such an absolute joy, especially during the pandemic – it is so helpful to wake every morning to a sweet little creature who is just overjoyed that we get to spend another day together! I also have depression and anxiety, and I think my dog has been super helpful for both of those things. Am I good at just going out for a walk when it would be good for me to move a little bit and get some fresh air? Absolutely not. Will I do that type of thing to make sure my dog is happy? Absolutely. I completely understand the anxiety that you have about this, reasonable and perhaps less reasonable (once I had made the decision to get my pup but before she came home, I spent some time googling “what if my dog hates me” because I got really anxious that she wouldn’t be happy living with me? In retrospect, absurd. This dog loves me to the end of the earth), but you sound like a responsible person who would give a dog a lovely home.
Anon
What about fostering a dog? That will let you try it out for a month or two with no risk
Cl
+1 to fostering, which can easily be adoption if it works out. The shelters are full of perfect amazing dogs. I would also recommend getting maybe a 1-2 year old that’s already housebroken, because puppies are heaven but mainly they’re truly hell. Lastly, a mutt will have less health issues than purebred. Win win if you ask me.
Anonymous
I jumped in getting my first dog at 51 on my own. No regrets. He is a huge blessing in my life.
Totally agree with building a village around you. Find a vet you like (eg mine has multiple vets on staff with one available until 10 pm for consults and Saturday appointments). My pup goes to daycare two mornings a week and runs in each morning. Arrange for a couple of dog walkers, etc.
He was a lot of work as a puppy, but so much fun too.
anon
Anxiety is a persistent issue for me, and lately it’s been especially bad. Like, heart-racing-as-soon-as-I-wake-up bad. Or having trouble falling asleep even if I’ve been tired all day. I have talked to my doctor and we’re working on a medication adjustment, but I need to figure out some short-term coping strategies to bring down my fight-or-flight response a bit. I’m already exercising daily, including hard exercise at least 3 times a week. Any fantastic ideas? My biggest sources of stress aren’t going away anytime soon, so I need to figure out how to deal.
Anonymous
Meditation.
Curious
Specifically, the guided meditations from The Meditation Podcast. The binaural beat technology they use sounds woo but it cuts through my anxiety like nothing else.
Anon
I am having increased anxiety too. Can I ask what kind of a doctor you are seeing – is it a primary care doctor or someone more specialized? I don’t have a therapist but I do have a doctor that I see for wellness visits (I was assuming they couldn’t prescribe anything for this). Thanks and good luck to you!
Anon
Not the OP, but yes, your PCP can prescribe anxiety and depression meds.
Veronica Mars
I recommend (as I always do) the Anxieties and Phobias workbook by Dr. Bourne; it includes every medically sound way to handle anxiety. I’d flip through it and see what tactics you haven’t yet tried, and see if they work. For your situation I’d jump to the diet and nutrition section and see if limiting caffeine if helpful.
Anon
Yoga or guided meditation. I also started listening to positive affirmation podcasts in the morning – each one is about 3 minutes long, you can pick what the affirmation is about (confidence, anxiety, worry, attractiveness, leadership, etc. etc.) and I can’t believe how much it really helps! The one I like is called Affirmation Babe (not crazy about the name, but the woman’s voice and selection of affirmation topics are really great!), and she had one for anxiety that I’ve used and liked.
anon
I will check out those podcasts. Thanks!
Anon
Sorry to hear that, this happens to me too and it sucks. What helps me: meditation, breathing exercises, and increased exercise. 3 days a week is good but if you can, try stepping it up to daily for the meantime. Google “vagus nerve reset”, there’s lots of exercises that help activate the vagus nerve- my favorite is singing.
emeralds
Here are my go-tos, focused around sleep since that tends to be a cascading issue for me: Yoga with Adriene’s bedtime yoga practices. No phone usage within an hour of bedtime and waking up. Read a slightly boring physical book in bed. Nighttime baths. Chamomile tea. CBD gummies or transdermal cream–I keep some in my nightstand for when I get the 3am anxiety wakeups.
Others: Get outside for a brisk walks twice a day, even if it’s just around the block. Super strict limits on social media–set a timer for 10-15 minutes before you touch Twitter/etc. Breathing exercises (google for ideas…my brain likes box breathing).
Marshmallow
Difficult yoga. I also have significant anxiety and exercise is my preferred coping mechanism. There’s something about a challenging yoga class that takes me out of my mind in a way that a tough spin class or a more relaxed yoga class just doesn’t. I need the combination of physically challenging to the point where I can’t think much about other things, plus the breath awareness and focus on balance from yoga.
Curious
Yes! Or rock climbing. Uses your whole brain, no room left to worry.
Anonymous
+1 to rock climbing. Horseback riding has the same effect for me. The key is a sport where you will literally fall on your face and hurt yourself if you don’t focus 100%.
Anon
I also struggle (and suffer!) with physical anxiety like you describe. I second the daily exercise – (hard cardio/heavy lifting). Walking generally doesn’t do it for me, but in a pinch push-ups can help. When you wake up, try to have a good routine that includes some stretching or meditation. Then vagus nerve stimulation in the acute moments – Google & see what options sound good to you. Even humming can help. Sending a hug; going through life with physical anxiety is tough
Curious
Oh! Also. Do you know the ice trick? Run cold water on your wrists or put an ice pack on your neck when anxiety is too far gone for reasoning. It triggers a drowning response that slows things down enough that you can start to use breathing / logic techniques to de escalate further.
Anonymous
I have seen some age gap relationship questions on here and have worked up the guts to ask one of my own: I’m late 40s, my boyfriend is early 30s. My friends have been surprised but other than a couple jokes, very supportive. We’ve been together over a year now and I am starting to feel like I should be introducing him to my family. My family doesn’t even know I’ve been dating – covid has kept us apart and I got divorced a couple years ago so no one is really pushing me to date. He’s a great guy, treats me well, has a job and steady income, and we’re the same on big stuff including kids. I think I am scared my family will judge him and me because I would, if I’m being very honest, probably judge someone in this big of a gap. I’m not sure if I would judge if he were older and I younger, but here we are. Any tips or good stories from people who successfully overcame the fear of introducing a partner to family? Any way I should “prep” them before they meet him?
Anon
I stopped making it a big deal to introduce people I was dating to my family. For a long time it was only “someone special,” and then I kept having to explain breakups and I hated it. So I started bringing whoever I was seeing around to the point where family stopped caring. When I brought my now husband home, hardly anyone paid attention to him and it was quite fun when we shocked them by eloping a few months later. Point being, have fun, it’s your life and as soon as you treat your life as yours your family will too. Bring the guy home for approval is something to leave behind in high school.
Senior Attorney
I think this is great advice.
And also? Yay for you and your guy!!
Anonymous
I wouldn’t bring it up. Tbh they might not even notice, once everyone is over ~30 I don’t think people really care about or notice their or others’ ages.
Funny anecdote. I’m in my late 30s. I mentioned to a friend (who’s the same age as me) that a mutual friend is retiring from the military soon because he passed his 20 years. She exclaimed, oh I didn’t know he was that much older than us! I pointed out that he enlisted at 18, but even if he’d joined after college…. I could see the math happening behind her eyes before she changed her tune to, oh I didn’t realize we were that old!
hobbies
Hi Hive, I’m not sure if I’m lame or normal, but I’ve had some conversations lately where I felt pretty lame. I’m dating/looking for a partner and also in a graduate program that involves a lot of networking. The topic of hobbies keeps coming up, and I feel like I flounder in every conversation. I enjoy jigsaw puzzles, reading, delicious food, and the occasional hike. I am not a social butterfly and can’t drink for health reasons, and I find that puts a damper on dating or can be awkward if networking is in a bar-like setting (less so now, but it’s coming back in my field). Am I just boring? I would describe myself as someone who enjoys many activities but doesn’t have those key things that I’ll keep going back to again and again with a passion. For example, in recent years, I’ve tried axe throwing, kayaking, paint by number, and traveled to a few new places (before covid of course). I had fun doing each but it’s not something I seek out every week or every month. Even with the “hobbies” I listed earlier, I’m not a great cook, I read only ~20 books/year and they’re not intellectual heavy hitters, so I’m no expert in those things. They’re simply things I can enjoy. I was fine with this and I never felt like hobbies required a threshold of expertise to be enjoyed, but reactions I get in dating and networking conversations make me wonder if I’m wrong here. Should I even list these things on my dating app profile? How can I find hobbies I’m passionate about so that I’m more interesting?
Anon
You are who you are. The sooner you own that, the better things will be for you, whether you end up partnered up or not. You’re just fine being you.
~Signed,
A voracious reader of stuff that may or may not interest anyone else, enjoys crochet and growing orchids and hell with anyone who has a problem with that.
Anonymous
You are not lame or boring! It’s perfectly normal to have solitary hobbies – honestly I think a lot more people than you realize have these hobbies – but I do notice people being into “trendy” hobbies to come up with something to talk about.
anon
You are not “just boring”! Small talk is REALLY hard, and so is the elevator speech- even more so in dating terms. Perhaps try meetups where there is an activity- particularly one you don’t need to be good at. pottery, painting classes (the paint by step where everyone is good!), kickball league, escape room- find something you are interested in. When there is an activity, there is not as much pressure to be interesting. Joining groups, or activity dating sites, or something more structured may help you feel more comfortable in the moment and provide conversation pieces.
No one is very interesting distilled down to a few words of text, esp in COVID, but you are so much more than that!
Curious
Lol maybe it’s just that I work in tech, but most people I socialize with could talk to you for an hour about jigsaw puzzles, good food, books, and the occasional hike :):). Those are great hobbies!
hobbies
Ha good to know. When I list my hobbies, I get follow up questions where it becomes clear I’m not an expert. For example, I’ll mention a recent book release I’m excited to get to and the response is dismissive because it’s “chick lit,” or a question about my hiking adventures, and I haven’t done of the big ones or been to any popular national parks, so then I’m not a real hiker. For dating, I think 11:36’s response about framing and just being confident about what I enjoy makes sense and it also tells me that men who dismiss my interests that way aren’t right for me. But it happens in networking conversations too, where small talk includes questions about summer adventures. It wears on me after a while and makes me feel like an imposter in my own life.
Curious
Ugh. I felt like that in Chicago when I didn’t have a pet or a baby, didn’t follow any sports closely or play recreationally, and didn’t brew beer. Sometimes it’s just finding your people. Seattle tech has been that for me — instant friend groups. No tips, just solidarity.
Anon
If I were networking with assholes, it would grate on me, too. This is not a “you” problem. People who act dismissive because you’re not hardcore enough at *whatever* are assholes.
Anon
This a thousand times. There is always someone more hardcore; you either appreciate that people have actual hobbies or you’re just being a jerk. “Oh you run marathons… my son does triathlons” = actual thing said to me prior to interrogation as to why I don’t do a tri.
Anon
I think you’re framing things badly. Why not try saying “Oh I love trying new things. In recent years, I’ve tried axe throwing, kayaking, paint by number, and travelled to a few new places. What do you enjoy? I’m always looking for suggestions for new things to try. ”
If someone said that to me I’d think they were always doing tonnes of interesting things (because it sounds like you are!). I think your problem is confidence, not that you’re not a passionate, interesting person.
Anon
Agree wholeheartedly with this!
Senior Attorney
Agree! You are selling yourself short, OP!
Sunshine
I think I’m a lot like you. I love to read non-fiction, exercise, try new stuff (like I went to a new-to-me scuplture garden last week), travel (back when we did that), and meet friends for walks or coffee dates, but I don’t have hobbies in the way people generally think of that word. When in the situations you describe, I also phrase my interests as Anon at 11:36 described and then throw the topic back on the other person. Makes the conversation pretty easy.
pugsnbourbon
You don’t sound boring at all! It sounds like you enjoy trying new things even if they don’t end up being your jam.
Was there anything you really enjoyed doing as a kid that you could try again as an adult? I picked up linocut printing a few years ago after doing it in a high school art class and it’s been a lot of fun.
Volunteering ticks a lot of boxes for me, too.
Anon
Here’s what I enjoy in life:
– Reading books, mostly fluffy nonfiction books like celebrity memoirs, books about the history of Hollywood, “pop history” books that aren’t too dense/detailed, etc.
– Watching movies but I don’t like anything depressing – a good comedy or action movie is always good with me
– Watching TV mystery shows, but nothing gory (helloooo, Miss Fisher’s Murder Mysteries!)
– Sitting in my backyard and drinking a cocktail and watching the wild birds at the birdbath
– Eating at reasonably-priced restaurants that have nice patios
– Taking naps
– Occasionally going on a hike, by which I mean walking less than 5 miles up a not-very-steep well-traveled trail at a leisurely pace. Bonus if we can stop midway through and have a granola bar and some tea as a break from our not-very-strenuous outing.
I am pretty much the world’s most boring human being, but guess what? I found another one just like me! He is the world’s second-most-boring human being and he likes all the things I like, with an occasional easy-to-moderate bike ride thrown in (which I have learned to enjoy also). One of my aunts has been all over the world climbing mountains and rafting raging rivers and doing sea kayaking and “bikepacking” trips and a whole lot of other stuff that sounds really interesting but also like stuff I would have to pretend to enjoy doing. She found another one just like her; she and her wife go on all these great adventures together while my husband and I just keep hitting the “Yes, I Am Still Watching” button on Netflix. I firmly believe that no matter what your interests are (and what your energy level is) there are people out there who are your people and like what you like. You don’t need to make yourself over into a “more interesting” person that is not really who you are; you just need to find your people.
Senior Attorney
THIS ALL DAY.
hobbies
This is heartening to read, thanks. I’m think I’m between you and your aunt in terms of out of the house adventures/energy level. The not drinking seems to affect a lot for me because it’s so ubiquitous in social and professional networking contexts. I have no problem with friends drinking around me, but I’d rather not have every first date at a brewery. When I’ve suggested an alternative location, it hasn’t gone that well. Similarly, in my grad program, social outings revolve around drinking at night, so I come across as a homebody, which I can be, but it’s more so that the newest brewery in town is not my motivation to leave the house, but a new Vietnamese restaurant definitely is. I don’t need to connect with everyone, but I’ve recently started to feel I’m too boring to connect with *anyone* so I appreciate the reminder it just takes one person who gets you.
anon
So I think it’s really weird that potential dates aren’t into non-brewery locations. What’s that about? I love breweries and such, but I completely recognize they aren’t everyone’s jam! I have several friends who don’t drink, and it’s seriously NBD. I enjoy their company all the same.
Anon
So, I read your comment above about how people dismiss your engagement with the stuff you do like and participate in. That sucks, but I will say that something I learned way too late in life is that standing by what you like is something that sets you apart from other people, and can become a distinguishing factor in its own way. You didn’t say how old you are, but I very much remember in my younger years feeling like my interests were way too fluffy and non-serious compared to other people’s interests. I’m dating myself, but an example is when the movie Requiem for a Dream came out, I had a group of friends at that time who raved about how “profound” it was and how it “depicted how life really was” and blah blah blah, while meantime I thought watching that movie was torturous and once I saw it I definitely had no desire to see it again. I would watch Almost Famous or Bring it On (two other movies from that same year) any day over Requiem for a Dream, and thus I was made to feel superficial and dilettantish. It took me a few years to realize, I’m fine being called superficial and dilettantish. I like what I like; deal with it or don’t. I like music that sounds like music, and I like movies that don’t make me want to slit my wrists, and I like books that have a happy ending and not too many footnotes. You can like hiking at whatever level you do it at; you are not a “lesser” enthusiast because you haven’t hiked the Zion Narrows during monsoon season, or whatever. Anyone who tries to make you feel less-than because your interests aren’t as “deep” as their interests is doing it because they’re still figuring out their identity, or because putting other people down makes them feel superior. There is this tendency people have to get into this ever-escalating one-upmanship game of “oh, that’s cute that you like river rafting but if you haven’t rafted (insert incredibly dangerous river in foreign country here) you really haven’t experienced TRUE rafting,” etc. etc. and it’s all BS. Don’t get caught up in that; find people who are secure enough in themselves to like what they like, and let you like what you like.
Seventh Sister
As someone who likes art-house-y movies, to me it’s a preference no more valid or less valid than liking romantic comedies (my mom) or superhero movies (my daughter). It’s just a genre, albeit one that seems to attract more snobs than other movie genres. Being interested in and/or able to sit through the original Solaris or Eyes Wide Shut or whatever doesn’t make you a better person than someone who loves Clueless. I also think it’s a fair bit easier to make a sad movie or a scary movie than a funny movie, and comedies like Mean Girls or Wayne’s World or Steel Magnolias are more durable (and to my mind, more relevant) than some dreck like Crash or A Beautiful Mind, both best picture winners.
anon
we would be best friends.
hobbies
:)
ALT
As someone who had a 15 minute convo with my neighbor yesterday about houseplants and correctly identified his sole plant based only off of his very non-technical description, I don’t think there is anything wrong with your hobbies or interests.
The people meant to be in your life will be in your life, regardless of you have “cool” hobbies or not. Is there a way you can deepen your involvement in one of your hobbies? Maybe a jigsaw of the month club? (No idea if that’s a thing).
Delicious food is a great dating interest—everyone has to eat, so it’s an easy date to say hey I am interested in XYZ new restaurant, do you want to go check it out? Or there might be a food festival that’s coming to town and spending a couple hours trying the different versions of waffles or whatever is a fun date.
I also assume that people who list things on their dating profiles like windsurfing or traveling or anything that is “extreme” either 1) are not constantly doing those things 2) probably are not expert in them or 3) use them as a crutch for not having much of a personality, kind of the joke that CrossFit people only talk about CrossFit and that’s their entire personality.
Anon
I don’t think this makes you boring! Enjoying your life doesn’t necessarily mean squeezing every last second out if it. I enjoy many of the same things and I don’t think they’ve ever helped me at all in networking or finding a partner, but I still do them, and wouldn’t feel “lame” about it. I think you’re putting too much pressure to have like, an “elevator pitch” about yourself. Remember that dating and networking is also going to be about compatibility of personality and not just of shared interests. If you’re getting poor reactions in conversation then I would suggest maybe thinking about aspects of the hobbies that you can use to lead off further discussion more easily (i.e., your last hike you did at a new park in adjacent city, “Have you ever been out there yourself?”, or you get your book recommendations from friend A, but she has terrible taste in movies – “Do you have friends like that?”) The other thing is that you don’t necessarily need to be more passionate, but more – happy and content and confident in your own lifestyle. There’s a Jane Austen quote: “An engaged woman is always more agreeable than a disengaged. She is satisfied with herself. Her cares are over, and she feels that she may exert all her powers of pleasing without suspicion.” Basically – trying to connect with people is hard! There are some people who have the gift of talking easily with strangers, but most of us have to work at it to be good at it, and we’re not going to be successful each time. Be easier on yourself.
national_anthem
Honestly you sound like a fun person I’d totally be friends with. I have mostly low key hobbies (like reading and baking) but love trying new things with people, and I consider that a hobby in itself. If you tell someone about the activities you do, like you did in the post, and someone doesn’t think you sound fun – they’re just not for you and that’s fine. It’s not a you problem!
That said, if you feel like you want to reframe the way this comes across to people, I would write yourself a little script that describes this in an upbeat way (so, I love trying new things as a hobby, not I don’t have any set hobbies) – “I do a lot of reading and eating delicious food, but I really love trying new things! Some of my recent favorite activities have been axe throwing and kayaking. Do you have any unique hobbies you’d recommend I try?”
Also, small talk is awkward. When I worked at my first office job, people would make small talk about the weekend, and I felt like my weekends were either not office appropriate (early 20s drunkenness) or super boring (reading and eating). Before going in to work Monday morning I would pick one specific thing that I had done over the weekend that I would say if someone asked about the weekend, and that really helped – even if I didn’t have an exciting weekend, I could say “my weekend was good, I tried a new recipe for sourdough pancakes and they were delicious!” and that was a better conversational response that “my weekend was fine, I didn’t do much, just hug out.”
Anonymous
Tips on managing people who say yes but mean no? I have a couple of associates who are lovely people and they do fine work (when they get it done) but they are constantly taking on more than they’re going to complete in time. One problem is that they’re not putting in the hours. They don’t work more than 8 hours a day or over the weekend. I don’t get to discipline them so there’s nothing I can do about it. I would be fine if they would be honest with me about whether they can meet deadlines but 1) I can’t tell based on their hours that they’re too busy and 2) I get a lot of pushback from the firm when I ask for more people because their hours are low. I’m assuming they’ve been told not to say no to work.
I always give them early deadlines because I know they’re not going to meet it, but they will blow deadline after deadline after deadline until I end up having to do the whole assignment myself. If I push them to give me something by X day then they’ll give me unfinished work. I check in with them every day about their progress and they insist all is well but then blow the deadline, or if they actually turn in work then I can see they were not honest about their progress. I’m a little bit at my wits end. Is there something else I can do?
Anon
I’ve had this happen. Usually the issue is that they’re hungry/eager to please, or intimidated to say no. At an assignment/project outset, I meet with them and say “I’ve set X as the deadline. How does that sound/fit in with your current workload?” they usually say it will be fine. Then I say “If you don’t think this is an achievable deadline, that’s fine – I just need to know so that I can plan accordingly, and protect our reputation to the client (or whoever). Are you sure this will work before we move forward with this date?” Giving them the out, and stressing that the deadline impacts our outward perception (and hinges on next steps) usually helps them open up and be transparent. After a few times of doing this, they are now more honest about timeframes.
Anonymous
Reply to them and copy their supervising partner: Jane, this is unfinished. Please revise and get this to me tomorrow. Kevin, I’m disappointed you did not get me this work on time and did not communicate ahead of time you would have issues.
Anon
Yes I agree to this. I suspect they’d be working harder if the deadlines they were blowing were for partners. I’d copy in partners and, if necessary, flag their low hours as well.
OP
I’m a partner.
Anonymous
I’m a partner.
Rutabaga
That’s b*tchy. Even if you are a partner, there are Very Important Partners and Dramatic Partners and I hate when people drop a project and don’t bother to mention it and then to sh*t work. My only remedy, since we just do not fire people, is to never give out work to that person again and note “I can’t work with Stellan because he ignores my project’s deadlines and takes on other assignments without notice or discussion.” Then I have to find another person, but it’s not like I had a reliable person to start with.
Anonymous
Thanks for clarifying. If you’re a partner why don’t you get to discipline them? How do performance management problems get handled in your firm?
anonshmanon
Sounds a bit like you are working with kids, but I am assuming these are adults, who have obtained degrees etc. Can you sit down with them 1 on 1, and ask them the same thing? “You keep creating this outcome which is unacceptable, can you help me understand what is going on?” Is there an option to ask other people and give those associates a wide berth? Naive question since I am not in law: do they still get to bill time if they have not produced anything for you?
anon
I think that it’s not about people who say yes and mean no. It’s people who blow deadlines. Have you given them straightforward feedback on this? How many hours they work isn’t your issue -the fact that they’re not meeting commitments or giving you unfinished work is. Even if you can’t “discipline” them, you can for sure tell them that this is unacceptable and ask them why it’s happening.
OP
Oh yeah every time. “I’m sorry I know that wasn’t ok/wasn’t my best work, I got really busy with X, I’ll do better next time!” And then they don’t do better next time. I’ve also told them you cannot procrastinate until the day before this is due and then tell me oh sorry I got an urgent assignment and that took priority. I’m giving stuff to you with enough lead time to get it done and to do a good job. Please start on it when I give it to you. That’s also why we have daily check ins when I ask you how it’s going – because I expect you to be working on it. When you tell me, yes it’s going great, but yo I haven’t actually started it, you are actually not being honest with me.
No Face
With this info, it sounds like they are not invested in their role at the firm and you just cannot rely on them.
Anon for this one
So… if they’re billing 160/mo (8hrs/day without working weekends) + your standard NB time for BD, etc. while working from home and in a pandemic + all of the other stressors right now like childcare, are they really not working very hard ? I’m regional Biglaw so maybe it’s different but that’s meeting target and I would say working fairly hard. Maybe not “Making partner” hard but still not “these associates are lying slackers who slack” hard which is what your post reads like.
Is there a firm/culture issue at play? If your associates don’t have a way to tell partners “I can’t do this in the time frame you’ve suggested” without getting yelled at or told that they need to bend the laws of time and space, you’re going to end up with this situation. If it’s multiple associates you’re working with,are you (or your group?) the common denominator? If you’re understaffed and work is coming in from all directions , the partner with the habit of making up arbitrary deadlines is probably going to get the work delayed.
In terms of practical steps, I find the associates I work with respond well to knowing (a) the deadline for me so that I have time to review it and do a turn before (b) the client’s deadline. Tell them straight out that if they can’t do it, that’s fine but you need to know by a certain date and if something else comes up for them, talk to the other partners assigning them work.
Now if you have a 180+ billable hour requirement a month and they’re not meeting it and not getting work done, I guess that’s another question but it’s more of a “when do you fire them” question. The market for laterals is crazy right now though so might be hard to replace them.
Anon
She said they are working, not billing, 8 hours a day. She also said their hours are low.
Of course the lateral market is crazy – a solid decade of failure to hire and train new grads caused talented people to not go to law school and those who went often did not get the training they need. The OP did not cause this, but she is suffering the fallout.
OP
This read is correct, they are working 8 hours a day, they’re billing more like 5-6 hours a day and then telling me they didn’t have time to do the assignment that should’ve taken 2 days and I gave them a week to finish. The low billable hours are why I’m getting pushback when I ask for someone else instead.
Anon
Honestly–I see these people on message boards. They say things like, “How little can I do in biglaw and not get fired.”
It’s time for you to sit them down and tell them that behavior like this is career-threatening, at least at your firm. Like an actual stern talk. Not a “haha I said this last time but now I mean it” talk. A stern talk. It doesn’t matter if you can’t personally fire them. You can write them a scathing review that says, “we addressed this on this date, this date, this date and this date. I cannot in good conscience recommend we keep Jane at Firm.”
Last–ask yourself if you’re the partner they don’t want to work for because of your practice area, how you act, or how your clients are. It’s possible they’re doing this intentionally to goad you into not using them again, because they actually don’t want to work for you.
I’m sorry if all of this is harsh.
Anonymous
Does anyone have a recommendation for a reasonably-priced alpha hydroxy body lotion that also contains at least some sunscreen? Or am I asking too much of this kind of product? Neutrogena has one for the face, but I’m not finding one for the body.
Anonymous
And really any hydroxy – alpha, beta, whatever.
Anon
I’ve seen AHA lotions and I’ve seen body sunscreens but never combined. Can you layer?
Anon
As a scientist, though not someone with any particular expertise in this field, I think you’re asking too much. Different active ingredients are stable under different conditions and when you design a lotion to be ideal as a sunscreen, you’re potentially compromising the conditions that would make it ideal as something else. In addition to that, there’s a relatively small market for people who want those products combined, so not that many companies will bother developing a product like that. Just buy the best of each of these products, don’t try to combine them.
Anonymous
I think you’re not seeing these products because it’s better to use your AHA products at night when your skin is not going to be exposed to the sun.
AZCPA
I’d think you’d want these to be separate – AHAs at night and sunscreen in the morning.
Anon
Any recommendations for Botox in the Metro Detroit area? I’d prefer a medical office rather than a med spa. I’ve gone to the BOYD office in Birmingham and had a good experience but found their prices a bit high for my needs. I just need the basic 11’s and crows feet injections.
Anon
I’ve had what seems like countless friends go to Beauty Culture at Square Lake and Telegraph and every single person had been happy with the experience. I know you said you didn’t want Med Spa though — so I will say a different friend of mine went to Pinnacle Dermatology on Woodward in Birmingham and was pleased. I finally got up the guts to check out injectibles and then found out the next week I was pregnant, go figure.
Anon
Congrats on the bun in the oven! Those two places are near me so I’ll check them out.
Anon
My husband is considering going on 80% time next year. He will be a 5th year in big law. We have significant assets in a LCOL city and can comfortably afford it but more important have a 2 and 4 year old that we’d love for him to see more. We don’t know if this is a permanent situation or try for a few years and understand that partner track will take longer (but he’s not set on being a big deal partner, just trying to not burn out and keep this job going without it taking over your life). Any thoughts or things we need to consider? He understands he will still have 60 hour weeks but is hoping reduced hours will allow him to turn down work at times.
anon
This will vary a lot by firm and practice area. FWIW in my experience seeing others do this 80% schedule means 80% pay and like 90-95% work.
Anon
Do not do this. 80% at a law firm is a pay cut without a responsibility reduction and it still puts you on the path outta there despite the feel good hours reduction expectation. It’s something that associates think is a good idea and it’s terrible for them. If the firm is “too much,” start a job search. There are other firms with lower hours expectations overall, in-house jobs (I’ve commented before on this subtle point that people miss – those aren’t less overall hours but they’re more manageable because they’re work hours not billable hours), etc.
anon
80% time is still 60 hours a week? That seems really unworkable and not worth spending the political capital on. Is job searching an option?
Anonymous
Is there a reason he’s working not 80% now? Like projects spill over weekends, projects take the time they take, understaffed, etc. Each of those IMO has a different answer. My work comes in chunks, so I’m often 150% busy or 0% busy, and I can’t just say I will work X hours a week (but I can get away with 0 hours a week when 0 is needed and not feel a need to refill my plate). It helps that I’m not in the corporate group — those people work mad hours when M&A deals need to close and private equity seems to be on an even nuttier schedule.
Cat
Don’t do it. You end up having like 95% of the unpredictability at 80% of the pay.
You might get a little flexibility to turn down a major new project if you have a full plate, but you still have no idea if you’re going to end up on an urgent thing for one of your active projects.
Anonymous
No don’t do this. Like someone else said, the firm will pay him less but no one will expect him to work less. Especially if he’s not set on making partner, just accept fewer assignments and understand his lower hours might mean he gets pushed out in a couple of years. Invest in spending time with the community and networking so he can transition to a role he’s happy with.
And sorry to say, and it’s super sexist, but especially as a man this isn’t going to go well. Men are barely able to take the parental leave they’re entitled to without burning bridges with partners of both sexes. I wouldn’t do 80% as a woman but I REALLY wouldn’t do 80% as a man. Ymmv though maybe he’s in a firm that actually respects men as parents.
No Face
A man at my former large firm actually took a few weeks off for parental leave and other men were very, very loud about how stupid they thought it was. He left the firm soon after.
MechanicalKeyboard
Yuck! I’m not in law but everything I hear about Big Law culture sounds so weird and melodramatic.
Halloween Q
It’s more that the model works when everyone works over 100% of what is required and everyone is on standby all the time (so no need to be like a hospital where you are paying 3 shifts of people for three shifts of coverage). You pay one person 190 to start and expect them to figure it out as they go and if they do, they just pile it on. You wouldn’t want these people flying planes or doing surgery (so consider that for high-stakes work — hopefully someone is reviewing all this b/c your 400th hour of billable work in a month is not a quality hour).
No Face
“Weird and melodramatic” describes many law firms. I have worked at several large firms, from small to large. My current small firm is the first time I felt like everyone was normal and reasonable.
Cornellian
Is he transactional or litigation? or something else?
OP
Litigation. The culture is quite nice as we aren’t on the coasts but it’s hard to justify working these hours if you don’t need the money and it’s not your identity or something. Seems like the in house jobs are like $100k VS $400k as a 5th year big law, so it’s a much more significant paycut which has been harder to swallow
Anon
This will destroy his credibility, and will have very little impact on his quality of life (except the pay cut) and predictability of schedule.
If you can afford the pay cut he should look at moving firms or going in house.
No Face
This question comes up frequently on the moms version of this place, and the answer is always the same.
Instead of officially going 80% now, he needs to set boundaries (say no to work, etc) and apply for other jobs.
Anon
My advice is that your husband should find a job with better hours. If your city does not have many law firms, look to in house or permanent remote.
Anon
I am going to be the contrarian here. It can work AT THE RIGHT FIRM. My firm allows people to cut down to 80% with an accompanying reduction in pay and billable hours. The people who do it are mostly parents, but we have at least two men who have done it (one short term to deal with a parent with cancer and one permanently to leave him time for his triathlon training). One of my friends with two kids has done it and says it is great. She works hard enough to meet her billable target. Sometimes that still means long days/weeks, but if she is way over she basically checks out for the last two weeks of the year.
It can also be a disaster for all the reasons people have outlined above. I would explore whether anyone else at his firm has done it and what the results were.
Cat
So I responded above but think your response supports the general thrust.
If your husband’s goal is to achieve some semblance of day-to-day predictable time with his kids, like being reliably available for dinner and bath and bedtime, 80% is not going to solve that problem, because if you’re on a hot deal or case, you’re on a hot deal or case, you’re not peacing out and saying “sorry I’ll look at that in the morning because I’m part time.”
It’s not going to solve the problem that a planned vacation can be work-bombed.
It’s not going to change client expectations on turnaround time.
It *may* give you some easier months where you feel emboldened to turn down work.
Cat
Adding. If your husband wants to try this anyway, may I suggest he cuts the deal that he gets “trued up” if he ends up billing at or above the 100% target.
Op
Thank you, yes his firm already has a true up policy in place automatically. He knows he won’t be available every night but just wants the slow periods to actually be slow rather than feeling pressured to always be billing to hit the targets.
Rutabaga
And I will say: don’t hit the targets. I’m not saying miss them by a ton, but see how life feels just doing 90%.
anon
+1 I’ve seen this work at a firm that wasn’t particularly family-friendly. I think it depends on the practice area immediate colleagues/partners–it can work well in one group and not in another at the same firm. As you said, it doesn’t get you out of the occasional 60 hour week, but it does get you generally more time.
Anon
I would definitely not do this. The formal lean-out almost never works out to the employee’s advantage for all the reasons noted. I would just not meet the targets and start setting limits. There’s nothing stopping him from turning down work now without a formal arrangement. In this market, no one is firing mid-senior level associates. I can almost guarantee that nothing will happen if he bills 90% for a few years if the work itself is good. People coast in big law all the time. Meanwhile, network to go to a smaller firm or inhouse (pay cut is often not as dramatic as $100 v 400 if you account for benefits and stock).
OP
He was told by a senior partner talking about someone else going on reduced hours that they prefer a formal arrangement VS coasting because the coaster looks like they aren’t a team player?
Anon
Of course management prefers the formal situation, it cuts costs! And gives them a build on excuse to pass someone over or lay off if it comes to that. I don’t see how an associate wins here
Anonymous
I was on an 85% schedule from my 3rd year at a law firm until I made partner. It was the only way I managed to stay in BigLaw during the early years with young children and I’m always glad that I did it. There were times when I was working harder than anyone else (and I got trued up for those times), but there were also times when things would be slow and I’d just take the slowdown without feeling pressure to find more work. It took me a few extra years to make partner and bonus calculations were wonky for years. But I am so glad I did it. There are plenty of associates who can just work less, but in my experience, the firm is interested in whether you are meeting or exceeding expectations and those associates who are just turning down work without a formal arrangement in place are not viewed favorably.
Anon
This may sound odd but I am interested in having a plethora of different health tests done, beyond a regular physical. Partially motivated by curiousity, partially because of legitmate health concerns (a chronic condition + vague crappy other symptoms with unknown cause). I have 2 questions for anyone who is experienced in this type of thing: 1. Is there any particular testing you found super useful? I’ve seen GeneSight testing recomomended a bunch here. I’m already doing a microbiome test; 2. To what extent should I go through my GP for this? Is it normal to make an appointment and have a list of tests I want done? There’s lots of direct to consumer home tests but that can get pricey. TIA!
Sarabeth
I’d look for a functional medicine doctor if your GP isn’t willing to order all the testing you want. You may need to pay out of pocket for the appointment, but it will be cheaper than a ton of DTC tests.
Anon
People on another board I frequent are talking about women who name their daughters after themselves. (Example Big Kathy, Kathy Hilton’s mom)
Men have been named after their fathers for ages. I cannot tell you how many John Jr, Jack, Joey iii etc boys I grew up with. But if a woman does it it’s shamefully egotistical?
Anon
Agree, it’s ridiculous. My brother is named after my mom! (Think Robert, Roberta.)
anon
I mean, it’s egotistical for men to do it, too.
Anon
C’mon, no one bats an eye when men do it.
Rutabaga
I judge. Like there are other names and what does that say to son #2? Either go George Forman with naming all kids after you or go home. But I don’t want to see Jimmy Vance XII on anything. That’s XI too many!
Anon
You are laughing, but one of my previous managers had two sons and they both got their first name after father. So they were “Peter” father, “Peter” as son #1 and “Peter” as son #2. Needless to say, each son was given a nickname which was used by the family members. It was weird and confusing, but whatever, their choice.
Cat
I know a couple who decided to stop the namesake when their firstborn, a boy, would have been a VI. They decided they didn’t want any further generations to feel the pressure to (a) have a boy, and (b) continue the streak.
Anonymous
I personally think it’s egotistical of all genders and socioeconomic staus. But I think society sees it as a positive for rich men and negative for anyone else.
Anonymous
Not sure if it’s just my area (English people in eastern Canada) but it seems like a hundred years ago it was just as popular to do this for women as men. There’s at least 3-4 generations in my family tree where there is a daughter named after the mom. Often a nickname was noted on the headstone of the younger. It seems to have died out in the 1940s. And was mostly one generation vs. like Ellen IV or something.
LaurenB
Ha! My mother has the same name as her mother but goes by a diminutive that starts with a different letter (think mother is Elizabeth and daughter is Betty, though those aren’t the actual names). Her father, meanwhile, was a Jr to his father. I’m glad we have no such traditions any more! I married a Jewish man (Ashkenazi) so in that tradition you don’t typically name someone the same name as a living parent or grandparent.
ollie
My MIL is the oldest child and is named after her mom, and her brother (second-oldest) is named after their dad. Totally not weird.
Anonymous
Unpopular opinion : I hate it either way. It’s impractical and egotistical. I know the kind of man that insists that his son be named after him and I’m not itching to meet the female equivalent. I also think it’s creepy when the mom insists the kid be named after her husband, like they somehow aren’t connected enough as child and parent?
Anon
Cultural/depends on social circle. In some, it’s seen as a lovely way to honor.
LaurenB
It makes for all kinds of faux drama on AITA because people seem to think it’s a crime when their grown children don’t name their own children after themselves (the grandparents). It’s so odd.
Anon
One of my girlfriends is named after a soap opera heroine (her mom was hooked on soaps when she was pregnant) so after a lifetime of explaining where her name came from, she was so happy to have a son with a man who was a II and name her son III
Anon
Agree that it is perfectly fine for women to do it. And hard disagree that there is anything wrong with men doing it.
In my family we have six generations of men with the same name. It has multiple iterations. Not the one we use but as an example: Jonathan can be Jonathan, Jack and Jon. And the middle name can be William, Will or Bill. (We do not do “y” nicknames for boys or girls; my father thinks they are juvenile.) If VI does not have kids or does not have a boy, that is fine. But it is a lovely family tradition and neither my father (IV) nor my brother minded (V) (obviously since they kept it going; VI is too young to have an opinion!)
Fun fact: III (Grandfather) is “Trey”.
Anon
I find it weird when it gets beyond III. Of course that might be just me being salty – I would have loved to name a kid after my dad, but my brother got first dibs (even having kids later) because he’s a III and he wanted to use it for IV.
Anon
A lot of Southern men go by their middle names, especially when their fathers have the same first name. Men have gone by “Jr.”, both formally and informally (see, Indiana Jones) to distinguish themselves from their fathers.
A woman naming her daughter after herself would have to develop a way to distinguish her daughter. Some names lend themselves to this – Elizabeth the elder is Lizzy and her daughter Elizabeth is Beth. Problematically, since many women have throwaway middle names, the middle-name solution does not work. Women’s nicknames can get over-cute; what is appropriate for a little girl may be annoying and inappropriate as she ages.
Anon
My great grandmother’s middle name was my grandmother’s first name. My grandmother’s first name was my mother’s middle name. My mother’s first name is also my first name, but I have been known exclusively by my middle name since birth. There is commonality and I love the feeling of connection, but no two people used the same name.
anon
I think its egotistical when men do it but obviously the fact is that opinion is rarely vocalized when men do it and often when women do it because of sexism.
Lorelei
I think it’s totally fine, and best if your daughter can have a nickname. My daughter is Rory.