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Anonymous
How can I help a friend who says she has postpartum depression? She is a new mom, baby is 4 months old now and she says she is very attached to him. She also started a new job working 50 hour weeks and is not sleeping well. She says the only thing that brings her joy is baby. She says she loves baby more than husband.
I am NOT a mom, and therefore am not sure how best to help.. are her feelings typical? I have heard postpartum issues are very serious for moms and want to be a good friend to her. I have already suggested she talk to our employers free EAP as a starting point, dropped off food several times, and listen to her whenever she calls.
A
Very typical. The surge of protective feelings towards the baby are causing her to say this. I’m a mum to a 10yo and 15yo and I think of it this way….
I’d die for my husband. I’d kill to keep my kids from harm.
nuqotw
+1, very typical. I was shocked at the surge of protective feelings towards each baby. Even though the rational part of me knew that my spouse was gentle, careful, loved the baby just like I did, remembered to support the baby’s head every time, etc etc there was a monster in me that thought (and unfortunately sometimes said in so many words) BE CAREFUL THE BABY IS FRAGILE WHAT IS THE MATTER WITH YOU?!
That said, even if it’s very normal, it wasn’t easy on me or my spouse, I went to the doctor, tripped some criterion on the postpartum depression survey they gave me, they treated accordingly, and I settled down with time and treatment.
Seventh Sister
Yeah, I feel the same way, and it was really surprising to me. Not the feeling of “I’d die for somebody I love that much,” but the, “if you try to hurt my kid I will rip you limb from limb and bury you in a shallow grave.”
Anne-on
I’d ask again over on the moms page but this sounds totally normal and being back at work full time with a 4 month old is HARD. I was home till nearly 6 months and it didn’t feel long enough. At 4 months, the baby may well be going through a sleep regression so she’s probably tired and stressed from that alone. I would have happily murdered my (lovely and supportive) husband many times when my baby was small – you’re sleep deprived, your hormones are a mess, you are super bonded with your baby but also often touched out at the end of the day and your partner asking questions/trying to connect with you is just one more ‘to do’ item on your list.
I’d keep doing what you’re doing – offer to come over and play with the baby/run a load of laundry so she has a break/drop off food and check in as much as you’re able. You’re a good friend for asking this!
Anonymous
Honestly I don’t think you’re well situated to help. Idk why you’re skeptical like this? She says she’s depressed? She is depressed. She says she’s attached to her baby? She is very attached! Send food send flowers listen.
H13
You are already doing some lovely things. I had PPD after both my kids and went back to work after 9 weeks with the first and 3 months with the second. It is HARD. Encouraging her to find a good therapist and see her doctor (PCP, OB, midwife, anyone) is really important. I was resistant to going on meds after my first but it helped and I didn’t hesitate the second time.
The sleep deprivation is like torture. With my second I was able to hire a night nurse a few times to help me get sleep. It was expensive but I looked at it as a gift to myself. If that isn’t on the table, there might be more equitable ways to share nights with her partner. Again, as a first time mom I felt like I had to do it all myself and really wish I had cut myself some slack. Does she have a group of mom friends? My friends really got me through these stages and the many more to come.
You are a good friend. A listening ear and food go a long way. This is the longest shortest time for her and, thankfully, won’t last forever.
Ellen
Rosa was like this with her first child. She was a total mess and I did not know where to look or what got into her other then postpartem depression so I told Mom and Dad and they got to get their freind who lived in Mount Kisco to visit with her every day during the first 3 weeks and they went up to stay with her on weekends. They also got her Nora, a live-in Nanny (more of a Doula, since Nora was then about 60 years old) to keep things moving — cooking, cleaning, attending to the baby, etc. Rosa pulled out of it with all of the help. She clearly figured it out b/c she had 3 more kids with Ed before she stopped a few years ago. So I recommend family, live in help and the aid of local freinds when you are not there yourself to help. YAY!!!
Anonamoma
Keep encouraging your friend to see a therapist and/or any doctor to consider medication for PPD. I did not get official treatment for PPD until my baby was 5 months old and I really wish I would have taken that step sooner because it made a WORLD of difference.
Emma
As the mom of a 4 month old I would say normal. My kid is going through sleep regression and I’m barely sleeping. I’m still on mat leave and can’t imagine functioning in a normal job, let alone a demanding one. I’m also dealing with intense anxiety about the baby and the intensity of the bond can overwhelm everything else. I think you can just try to be there for her, and ask her how you can support her. I really enjoy when my childless friends come over for a cup of coffee and a chat. It doesn’t matter if they want to hold the baby or aren’t that comfortable, it’s nice to have the company and sense of normalcy.
Anon
She may be having scary thoughts that she is not sharing. I know because that happened to me. I was in psychosis. Try to get her to a doctor.
Seventh Sister
Sleep deprivation is miserable, and I have never been so close to strangling my husband as when I’d be up half the night with a baby and he’d grump around the next morning telling me how tired he was from not getting enough sleep. Dude, read the room.
Unfortunately I think this kind of thing is typical, but she might benefit from talking to a doctor about options like therapy or medication. You’re a good friend! But she doesn’t have to do this alone or just with you.
Anon
Yep. It’s been 9 years and I still remember the night I had to literally STEP OVER my husband who had fallen asleep on the floor to tend to the crying baby, whose cries he was apparently sleeping through. That, plus breastfeeding – your entire life is dictated by 3-hours segments of about to feed, feeding, and listening/watching for when the baby needs to eat again is all consuming – you are so conscious of everything you eat, you have to decide whether or not there’s enough time between feeding to take a shower – it’s just a lot. It’s easy to feel resentful of a partner and hard for a partner to understand the all-consuming mental and physical toll of birthing another human that you’re also feeding to keep alive.
Are all thoughts during this time always rational? Nope. Will it pass? Yes. Does this delve into serious depression / psychosis territory for some? Absolutely. I’d tell you friend she can call you any time day or night. And I’d also go visit and do things around the house to help – dishes, laundry, bring or make a few meals.
anon
For any common postpartum issue, including postpartum depression, the OB is a great first call. A competent OB can diagnose and formulate an initial treatment plan. The OB should know of some therapists who are good at helping with postpartum depression in her community. With a new baby and a new 50 hour a week job, I wouldn’t waste time with an EAP–the OB + whomever the OB recommends will likely be much more effective.
If she hasn’t started with the OB, you can offer to help with logistics (making the appointment, providing childcare, or whatever is needed) with this step and with the next step (first couple of therapy appointments, if recommended by the OB).
Providing meals and a listening ear is kind and a great thing to do for any new parent, especially when they have health issues.
Curious
+1, agree, though if the OB *isn’t* up on this for some reason, EAP might be a fallback. But I honestly might ask a midwives’ group or doula or other OB first.
Anonamoma
I called my doctor around 4.5 mo pp because I was very depressed and had gotten to a breaking point where I knew I needed help asap. I was told that since it had been 4.5 mo I was no longer “postpartum” and they refused to see me. That was devastating. I definitely cried for an unreasonable amount of time after that phone call. I did end up getting help from my primary care and felt 10000% better after starting meds.
Clementine
Any work wins lately?
I just got an acceptance for my hardest to fill open position. This is a team lead role which required a specific skill set; however, I’ve been dealing with bureaucratic nonsense for the past year. After more than a full year of doubling this position (which is a full time job!) on top of my own job, I was able to hire somebody great.
Anon
I own a very small boutique law firm. Our Very Big Client is engaged in a Very Big Transaction. VBC hired Very Big Law Firm for the deal, but we are doing due diligence on our area of expertise and have identified some material issues that have gone to the very top of VBC management. Our counterpart on opposing counsel’s deal team looks like an idiot; we look very competent in comparison, and VBC has noticed. It’s a win for SmallLaw.
Curious
This is awesome!
Ellen
Kudo’s to you! In my firm, also a small boutique, we really don’t have to many big law comepetitor’s like you do. The really big WC defense firms are down South, where there is more shanagans going on between the claimants, their lawyers and doctors who get paid for trying to push fake claims. Although I’ve defended a few times in remote cases as a pro hack vice, I prefer to stay local where I know all of the judges here, who also like me for knowing what I do and do well. I remember a case I dealt with near Pitsburgh where I had to deal with a cute attorney who looked like Robert Redford did in ‘The Way we Were” that the female judge was really ga-ga over. I could not get much of an argument in edge-wize for my cleint b/c I think the judge was also jealous of me and my Birkin bag. When I told the manageing partner about it, he said he knew of the plaintiff’s firm and was not surprised they sent that guy in to woo the judge. So I know now to stick to my roots here in NYC where I know what to expect. FOOEY on remote lawyering! Not for me!
Anon
I was approached about an internal move by a very senior person. I’m very excited about the opportunity. It’s not official/final yet but I have no reason to think it won’t happen – just waiting for the call that it’s a done deal.
Vicky Austin
After both I and my bosses noted in my review that I was feeling underutilized, I was given some new assignments to tackle. I busted them both out perfectly with almost no assistance. Feeling damn good about that!
Curious
Oh, I’m so glad!
Vicky Austin
Thank you for all your encouragement and that six weeks/six months rule of thumb! I’m really glad I hung on!
Hootster
What is this rule of thumb?
Vicky Austin
That every new job gives you a hard time, crisis even, at 6 weeks in and 6 months in. It’s just part of the learning curve as you come to understand all you have yet to figure out! So, in the absence of other red flags, it’s normal.
Curious
Also true for every new semester and city, in my experience. I’m so glad you’re getting over the hump!
Cb
I had a good progression review on Monday – they were impressed that I had 4 publications last year – and told me just to keep doing what I’m doing. I need to write a monograph but that doesn’t matter for probation. Hoping when the panel takes place, they’ll recommend me for an early end to probation (3 years in the UK).
Curious
Oh holy cow! When is the panel?
Cb
April! It’s a weird process, you send in your docs and they review and then email you in July.
I need to get a job closer to home at some point but I’m ok for now.
Anon
Well done. I am so proud of you!
Anon
A very small win this week for me! I have a very experienced, very intelligent coworker who manages another team that we work closely with on certain data improvement projects. I find him intimidating because of his experience, knowledge, and how straight forward he can be. Even though he’s a very nice person and very focused on these collaborative projects.
The last meeting I had with him, I botched by not being prepared with a good summary of my use case and the ask. But this week I met with him, was prepared with a summary and the ask for the project, and had a successful meeting! Small, but it felt good to walk away with everyone on board with the project and buy in on the next steps and timeline.
Curious
Congratulations!
Marketiere
I start a new job on Monday that is a huge step forward in my career! On top of that, I’m being included in a Napa Valley trip my first week. I’ve never been to the area and dress code is wine country casual. Any suggestions? We have both indoor and outdoor events.
Anon
This time of year it will be cool there. Napa’s on the dress it up side of things because of all the tourism, people tend to wear outfits. That said, you’ll see a lot of jeans and designer sneakers too, just more put together and not sloppy. I’d look at Varley for some casual stuff, Jenni Kayne, if it were warmer, Sue Sartor.
Anon
Agree. Most people who live in California are pretty casual. Dress in layers for unpredictable weather but don’t try to dress like an influencer.
Bring along a nicer outfit for dinner.
Nesprin
Wine country casual is sneakers and your most interesting jeans and maybe a nicer top or sweater. Its cold out here now though- wear layered sweaters
anon
I heard that I actually could make partner this year. I wasn’t expecting it until next.
Anon
I reviewed a proposed transaction. My portion of the review passed with no problems, but I suggested a deeper look into an another area. There are serious concerns and the big bosses have acknowledged that my flag saved their butts. I won’t get credit at the highest level, of course, because that would require someone to admit that the review in the problem area was remiss before I flagged it, but insiders know.
Anon
I have been told that I will be getting more involved in an area of our business that I’m excited to get into. AND it has been hinted (wink/nod) that I’m being promoted this cycle. YAY!
Stuttgart?
My family is considering a one-year detail through my current job in Stuttgart, Germany. Anyone lived there, by any chance?
I have googled extensively but most online comments are from tourists, and the consensus seems to be “not the most exciting place to visit.” But I have seen a few posts saying that while it’s not exciting to visit, it’s actually a very nice place to live. Looking for anyone with experience as we consider this potentially exciting opportunity. Thanks!
anon
Extremely car centric compared to other places in Germany, cute historic city center and cultural stuff. The people in that area have very particular(imo judgy) ideas about how things are supposed to be done (neighbors policing where you store bikes, garbage bins, hang dry the laundry, that everyone takes turns cleaning the communal stairwell, when you mow the lawn, get up early and work hard), and they are stereotyped as the frugal people.
Anon.
As a native German, but not living in Stuttgart, I agree with all of the stereotypes.
anon
I realized this all sounds really negative, so I want to add that the regional food is great, and going for one year might just be short enough to enjoy all the nice historical stuff (like the big wine festival, that is actually fun), without getting too fed up with narrow minded provincial neighbors. Agree with others that it’s very easy to visit other places from there.
Seafinch
I think those things are pretty universal in all of Germany. Having lived near Stuttgart and in Hamburg, it was worse in Hamburg but the neighbour policing is pretty common everywhere, in my experience. I always say the Germans (who I adore) use regulations and rules as a stick to beat you.
London (formerly NY) CPA
Highly recommend searching FB for any expat groups specific to Stuttgart or Americans in Germany or something along those lines. Also recommend (but hate the name of…) the more general FB group Two Fat Expats, which is a great resource, and suggest you ask your question there.
Anonymous
no specific experience but DH is from the region (Stuttgart is one of the airports we fly into depending on where flights are cheapest). That area is very centrally located. Easy weekend trips by air or train to France, Italy, Austria etc.
Anon
I’ve had several colleagues take up 1 year roles at our company’s HQ in Germany. I know with my employer they typically provide a relocation service to help with finding temporary housing, moving services, schools/daycare, language classes, etc. One colleague in particular relocated her elementary aged kids and she really loved it. She said they had a great time. The hardest part she said was figuring out what to do with their house in the US while they were gone. And finding a way for someone to take care of their dog for a year. Relocating pets into Germany is not fun.
Also, if Stuttgart itself does not seem like a super exciting, the train system in Germany is really efficient. I wouldn’t get too caught up that it’s the only place you’d spend time in while in Germany.
Seafinch
I have lived in Germany twice as an adult and absolutely loved it. I would absolutely jump at this chance especially if you have at all decent relocation services. I lived in Freiburg which is in the same “province” as Stuttgart. It is SO central and accessible for excellent weekend excursions, you are basically at the intersection of of France and Switzerland, right on the borders of Italy and Austria and can be at the Med in four hours. It was fantastic. I love German food and shopping. It’s also the best weather in all of Germany (though we spent two years in rainy Hamburg which did not remotely bother me).
Vicky Austin
You make me want to move to Stuttgart with this description!
Seafinch
It wouldn’t be my first choice but the location is killer and there are so many benefits. I absolutely left part of my heart in Hamburg. The canals, the seaside, the posh neighbourhoods. We could get a future posting to the German/Dutch border or Berlin and even though neither would compare, I would jump at the chance which would cost us money and be logistically challenging with a whack of kids.
Anonymous
It wouldn’t matter to me whether it was exciting to visit. In the US I have lived in several locations that people would never choose to visit for a vacation, but the life I’ve led there has been good and rich. Personally, unless the location is actively terrible or is somehow harmful for your family, I wouldn’t turn down a chance to spend a year living in a different country.
Anon
+1 Also a year is so short. Even if you don’t like it, it will be a great adventure! I think I would move anywhere in the EU for a year, except maybe Malta, because of the lack of abortion access even if your life is in danger.
Senior Attorney
I have no advice but I really want you to go on my favorite show, House Hunters International!
Anon
I used to watch that on the plane when I was traveling every week. My absolute favorites are the Americans used to living in a McMansion and are looking for the same in a European city center for no more than $3000/month.
Senior Attorney
Right? And it must have ginormous American-sized appliances!
Anon
Where’s the laundry room?
Senior Attorney
Where’s the DRYER???
Hypatia
There’s no … air… conditioning?!
pugsnbourbon
Oh my gosh my wife and I are on a HHI kick right now and it’s so fun!
Anon
I live in Berlin, so I can’t speak to Stuttgart specifically, but can say 1. This is a great opportunity for your family – expand the horizons, have a new enriching experience, etc. 2. Germany is particular and just be prepared that there will be red tape in a way you’re not used to. For example, to open a bank account you need an address, and to have an address you need to be ‘registered’ (an admin procedure at a local govt office – burgeramt). You also can’t officially start work without being ‘registered’. But in order to get an apartment, you often need a German bank account and German credit history (SCHUFA). So this gets a little convoluted and ideally your company will provide an apartment and help facilitate all of the German-language red tape. 3. Do you have kids? Depending on age, they might benefit from attending an international school – great to have a mix of English and German, sliding into a full-on German school without the language background would be extremely tough.
Germany has a very high quality of life, higher in many ways (transit, safety, parks, cost of healthcare) than the US for middle-upper middle class. Getting around to the rest of Europe is tantalizingly easy by car or inexpensive flight.
Anonymous
OP here- thank you all! This community is so helpful. Will try to remember to chime in on one of the update posts in a few months.
And senior attorney, I’m game! Although we would be coming from a very HCOL city, so I think anywhere but Tokyo we will be pleasantly surprised by how much apartment our money gets us. But maybe our amazement at the outdoor space and second bathrooms would make for good viewing?
Anon
Has anyone read Jessica Simpson’s new short story? Any guesses who the very famous movie actor is that she dated back in the day after her divorce?
Anne-on
Online gossip sleuths seem to have landed on Marky Mark, which fits with the ‘big movie star then/now’ who would (feasibly) be super into fitness and know her trainer as well as being sleazy enough to have her as a side chick.
Her memoir was great and I’m looking forward to reading this new piece! I came away from her book feeling so sad for her – the purity/diet culture when she was a young star really messed with her head badly. Good for her/her mom for starting her company and insisting on having a true say in the production and seat at the table, she doesn’t get enough credit for being a HUGE business success.
A
Tom Cruise would be my guess. Or Leo.
Anon
I immediately thought of Leo, but Jessica is 6 years older than me and I think for people her age Marky Mark was a much bigger deal than Leo. She was already 17 when Titanic came out, and I think he was more popular with the middle school set than with high school seniors. Also she was 25-26 when she had the fling with this guy, so already too old for Leo!
Vicky Austin
LOL true!
Anon
It’s Mark Wahlburg. The teenage crush bit fits (she was born in 1980 so the perfect age for a Marky Mark crush) and he was wearing jeans and a t-shirt at the 2001 VMAs like she said.
Vicky Austin
A+ sleuthery, I love this.
anon
Mark Wahlburg is a class A @$$hole. I am just always surprised that no one seems to notice or care.
Anon
And he has a “spiritual advisor” like she said.
Anon
How was the book? I listened to her other book and actually enjoyed it as a memoir.
Anon
It’s just an essay about this one hook-up. It has pretty bad reviews on Amazon.
Anon
I downloaded it for free from Amazon but haven’t read it yet. I do love to read gossipy things like this so I plan to read it soon!
More Sleep Would Be Nice
OMG – I need to read this.
For anyone who hasn’t read it and likes celebrity memoirs, I cannot recommend her autobio enough. What the industry (and often family members) do to young talent (Jessica, Britney, Mariah, Whitney, and many others) is structural and awful. I love that she was so open and honest about everything.
anon
I loved it, too. And my gosh, the teen celebrities of the 90s-early 00s were treated horribly.
Anonymous
You need to the podcast “Cerebrity Memoir Book Club”. It’s great!
Inside of a dog
Therapist rec in far NW suburbs of Chicago?
Good morning!
This is a long shot but I have a nephew in need of a therapist to help with anxiety and depression. Ideally in the Barrington / Crystal Lake area. Thank you very much for any help!
A
For the poster who was considering going grey.
I’m in my late forties and used the pandemic to go gray. I have layered hair that now is just below my shoulders. The worst period is the 6-9 months mark, and updos are your friend. Make sure hair isn’t frizzy. What helped me were non formaldehyde keratin treatments. You do you.
You’ll often be surprised that you have fewer greys than you thought you’d have. Mine look lovely now and I’m never going back to dyeing them. I get loads of compliments. It helps that I look 10 years younger than my age and that I have great skin. Also, I wear bright colours and a strong lip.
Whatever you decide, good luck.
Pep
I also used the pandemic to go grey. The first months are the hardest. I’m completely grown out now and I’ve been stunned by the compliments – especially from young women. The thing with grey hair is the cut; if you have a current cut the grey hair works somehow – it’s just another color. I did need to adjust my makeup to avoid looking washed out: brow color and lip color make all the difference.
Anon
+1
Never do women my age stop me (40s/50s), but young women from teens to 30s compliment my hair color regularly. Many of them even ask me “how I did it”… assuming it is dyed as some very young women in my area dye it grey themselves! And then the over 70 crowd that still dye their hair also walk up to me with the silly “good for you!” comment. I met an older woman who had season tickets to the ballet next to me and we talked during the performance breaks. And when the lights went on and we walked out to the natural light together and she saw my hair clearly she was stunned. When she returned the next season, she returned with her natural white hair. Honestly, she looked so much better. Not all dye jobs are as flattering as we think. I found it was extremely expensive to have a flattering, complex color treatments ongoing every 4 weeks. You really can’t hide the cheats either.
I fortunately have dark full brows that helps balance it out, and if I remember, I wear a bit of lip color when I go out.
Shocking to me, my hair is long now (still working from home…) and I get many more compliments than when it was pixie short. I have always assumed now that I am grey I have to go short, but part of me is starting to wonder….
JM
I always hear that as you age your coloring washes out and bright colors look harsh. Maybe that’s dependent on what you were before; ie Winters can still wear brights?
Anon
I am a winter and I have always preferred the dark jewel tones to brights. This continues to be true with my natural, silver-streaked dark hair. Think burgundy and deepest aubergine instead of red and purple.
Anon
Yes, same for me. It can be very hard finding the right shades to compliment, and unfortunately it is hard to find colorfast clothing that doesn’t fade. I wash everything as if it is a delicate, and never put things in the dryer.
anon
I’m the OP from yesterday, and thank you for the advice! I do keep my hair in a polished style that’s already on the shorter side, which would hopefully make things look intentional. Still pondering whether I’m ready to make that leap, or what my cutoff even is.
anon
Anybody have a specific rec for c b d for sleep?
Anon
Camino, but they’re only sold at a dispensary. The Martha Stewart ones are also pretty good, less powerful but they taste good.
Anon
Georgia Hemp Company makes great softgels and gummies that have completely changed my sleep.
In-House in Houston
I have a great rec and you can buy them online! Try Vena CBD. They have two different products – restful night and lights out. They have pills and gummies. The “lights out” will really put you in coma….so you probably want to try restful night first. I love these products and I don’t wake up with any kind of hangover. Try Jeff30 and you might get a discount…I’m not sure if they’re still honoring that code. Good luck!
anon
CBD MD. If you sign up for emails they usually have discount codes. I’ve been using them for a couple of years now. A lot of influencers talk about Equilibria. I tried it for a bit, but I like the gummies better from CBD MD.
tess
Piggybacking – Anyone with experience using c b d specifically for menopause sleep problems?
Anon
Can you buy CDB if you’re state hasn’t legalized cannabis? I see some of these products have 5 mg THC, so not sure about the legality. My sister has a lot of trouble sleeping, so I’m curious if she could try any of these products and have them shipped to her.
anon
Yes, I live in Ohio and get CBD shipped to me. Also Delta9, which has THC. I posted above about ordering from CBD MD.
Anonymous
wyld cbd and cbn elderberry gummies!! these have markedly improved my sleep
Anon
I like Wyld as well, no thc. Restful nights.
Healthy I Guess
Looking for some input on an interpersonal issue with my DH. I’ve been having some health problems lately, not enough that I’ve become a burden but my household contributions have definitely declined to about 50/50 vs their usual 80/20. I had my final follow up with the doctor yesterday, my DH asked about it and offered to drive me, I assumed it was because he was concerned about my wellbeing. Well the news was good, the doctor said I’m pretty much good to go, which was a huge relief. Less than 6 hours after the good news DH ambushed me with a conversation which was basically ‘now that we know you aren’t dying, here are all the things I hate about you and problems with our relationship’. I’m not saying the conversation was unwarranted but it really felt callous to not even give me a full day of happiness and now it seems like him being helpful in the morning was just to assuage his own guilt for the clearly pre-planned confrontation. I just feel so tricked and manipulated. I would have happily had the relationship conversation in a day or two and with some advanced warning, but it just all seemed so malicious and calculated the way he handled it. idk venting into the void I guess. Or maybe I’m in the wrong? He didn’t really take care of me when I was sick, he would just order take out, and most of the usual cleaning and planning just stopped.
Anon
Based on what you’ve written here, I wouldn’t assume he was planning all day just to be a jerk. And it sounds like you’re feeling defensive, because you’re not arguing with what he said, just when he said it. He probably did not handle his own frustrations well, and that is worth calling out and having a conversation with him about. Actually just sounds like you need a lot more communication in general.
Anne-on
Unfortunately this is so, so common with male partners when their wives get sick. I would also be furious and would get into both individual and couples therapy ASAP. If this is what he’s like when you’re sick for a short period of time when you’re both younger I wouldn’t want to see what he’s like when something more serious happens or if you have children together. I also bet he’d be horrified if YOU wouldn’t nurse him without complaining.
pugsnbourbon
First – so glad you got good news from the Dr.
Second – whoa. Why are you doing 80% of the household work in the first place? Is it typical for your husband to bottle things up and then unload on you like he did? Does he show any kind of awareness that ordering pizza =/ taking care of your sick partner?
Last – are his complaints about you and the relationship actually valid? BC it sounds like he’s pretty selfish and callous.
ELS
Yeah, this is how I took it too, Pugs. It sounds like OP’s husband was salty about having to do half the housework when usually OP is doing the vast majority, and the second he thought she was not actively dying, he wanted to complain and put everything back on her.
Maybe it’s more than that, but it doesn’t really sound like it from what was posted. I would be livid if I were OP, and not just because of the timing and unloading.
Anonymous
+1
Vicky Austin
I’m glad you got a clean bill of health, and sorry that now you’re faced with a new, sad set of problems. I don’t have any advice, just sympathy.
Senior Attorney
Same. I still remember the day I finally realized that my former husband was just not, deep down, a good person. I’m so sorry, OP.
Anon
i’m not saying what he did was right, but i could see myself potentially doing the same wrong thing in the reverse situation. like there have been times when i have stuff bottled up inside that I want to talk to DH about, sometimes they have to do with him, sometimes other things, but generally not like ‘fun’ topics, and if we haven’t had a chance to really talk in a while, which does happen since he has a Big job, i work too, we have two small kids, etc. that sometimes when the opportunity does present itself, it’s like opening of the floodgates. it is something i am working on. i actually think you’re in the right, but also wanted to offer a perspective of where it may be coming from. but yes – an 80/20 split, unless he works 4x as many hours as you, that is another challenge. Glad you are healthy!
Healthy I Guess
We both work 35 h/week jobs and have equal salaries
Anonymous
Long time spousal caregiver here, and I know many. It is really common for the “well spouse” – your husband – to kind of melt down when their partner gets good news after a health event (a good scan, being able to leave the hospital after a lengthy stay, etc.). A lot of things that he probably bottled up during this period now feel safe to say because you are better. (you probably wouldn’t have had a lot of sympathy if he were bringing up all these concerns while you were sick ). You are on a different journey than he is here. You feel good about your health being restored, and he feels like now maybe he can process what he went through.
Curious
This feels like the charitable explanation, if OP is inclined to one. TBH, I didn’t cry about having cancer until I got my first clean scan. Emotions are weird.
OP, FWIW, my husband and I really struggled with chore distribution and emotional swings when I was sick. A lot of my therapy now is processing how much he shut down (in our case, he focused on work and me and for a brief, dark time, didn’t have much left over for our precious child). You have a right to feel your feelings and to be mad at the awful timing on this, but my instinct is to say this is a symptom of overall how scary this time has been, and to have hope that it can be redeemed. Our balance of labor today is better than it’s ever been, probably 60-40, and my sickness actually helped us to learn to talk about it and make that true.
Solidarity. This stuff sucks.
Anon
Something like this happened to me and blindsided me. It never happened again. And my husband kept up with more than his fair share of household chores as I dealt with lingering symptoms. I decided actions speak louder than words and took it as a sign of how stressed he had been.
However my husband did actually take care of me! He also worried a lot more about my health than I did… I definitely had not realized how much scarier it all was for him than it honestly was for me.
Anonymous
Don’t lose sight of WHAT he said because of HOW it was said. It was poor timing from DH. But if you allow yourself to derail the conversation and go down this path of thinking unkind things about him because of the timing, you’re going to lose your relationship. It sounds like you have valid complaints about him too. Express them! By all means talk about how to talk, hire a counselor to help walk you through it. Just don’t allow your knee jerk defensiveness to rule the day here.
Anon
Do you usually do 80 and fell to 20? I am unclear on you usual/diminished contributions vs. His usual/increased contributions. In going with you, was he being thoughtful or looking for his “out” from increased contributions and feeling like he could not address relationship concerns?
Healthy I Guess
I usually do 80, and it fell to 50 while I was sick. His increase from 20 to 50 wasn’t really additional responsibilities so much as me doing less which made his proportion more and him ordering take out.
Anonymous
Men leave women who are sick. Ask any oncology nurse. He’s telling you that if you are not there to do nearly all of the work, he will not be an equal partner, he will not step up, and he will leave you. Go to therapy alone to talk this through or talk to your bestie. But I think you need to really really think about whether this is a person you can trust and rely on and whether this marriage is one you want to continue.
Anonymous
+1
Anon
Your husband needs a reality check. Unless he works vastly more hours than you do, you should be roughly 50/50 with household contributions. (I work longer hours than DH and do about 40%-45% of the housework.) If he’s working longer hours such that he can’t help out concretely when his wife is sick, he needs to throw money at the problem. If he’s working crazy hours and not making enough to hire a housekeeper when you’re sick, he should be looking for a new job.
theguvnah
You’re not in the wrong at all. It sounds like at best, he handled this absolutely terribly. At worst, he is one of many men who would leave their wives after a serious diagnosis which studies show men are much more likely to do than women.
If your partner can’t take care of you when you’re sick, what is even the point of having a partner?? What is he bringing to the table?
Anonymous
Can we get more details on this conversation and what he asked for? I can’t tell if he really said “these are things I hate about you,ect.” Or whether it was actually about chores.
I’m glad you’re doing better, but if it were about chores I’d probably take serious health problems as a sign to do less. Can you start a conversation about outsourcing some of your responsibilities?
Healthy I Guess
His complaints were partially chore related, shamefully I’ve only mustered the energy to clean the bathroom 1-2 times/month since I’ve gotten sick about 4 months ago. Some of them were more social like that I wasn’t being enough of a cheerleader for him.
anon
Ummmm… I only clean my bathroom 1-2 times/month, if I’m lucky.
I am starting to really worry about your marriage.
I am relieved about your medical good news, but agree with others that your relationship needs some re-evaluation, and likely couples counseling if you aren’t able to talk to him about why this is f-cked up.
anon
same! OP, you are focusing on the timing of this when the content seems a bigger issue to me! He has the audacity to complain about you not doing vastly more unpaid labor while you were dealing with a serious health issue?? Does he have opposable thumbs? Then he can clean.
“I’m glad you brought this up, dear husband, as it became really obvious during the last months that the home chores are distributed way too unevenly and while I was out of commission, things piled up a lot. Obviously going back to the way things were is not sustainable, do you have any thoughts on that?”
A
Girl, you need to brush up your reading comprehension. The posters are appalled that your husband isn’t doing 50/50 in normal times. No one is expecting you to do more than 50 when you’re well. And 20/30 when you’re sick is stellar!
Anon
Girl, you’ve got a clean bill of health. Now it’s time to lose the parasite. This guy sounds like an all-around POS.
Anonymous
This.
Anon
My husband and I finally did some couples counseling. We found it really helpful, and both wished we hadn’t waited so long. I felt huge resentment over the uneven allocation of all the work involved in managing our household. To this day, I’d say my husband is most content when the split is 70/30 and feels like he’s “doing everything” if it gets to 50/50. This is notwithstanding the fact that both of us work full-time in equally demanding jobs. It’s frustrating.
Betsy
Therapy for both of you. A scary health situation is hard, and so is caretaking for an unwell spouse. Probably neither of you are at your best. Maybe this is a situation where you’re seeing his true colors, but I think there’s also a good chance that you’ve both been through something hard and it’s time to spend some time recovering emotionally.
Anon
+1
Anon
I’m so sorry you’re going through all this.
My partner is a good man who loves me and values me, but isn’t very nurturing. We struggle when I’m physically incapacitated. All of my advice is coming from this perspective, but I agree with the above commenters that the first question is this: is your husband a good husband who’s going through a rough time or is he not a good husband? I think only you can answer that one.
I’ve also had to acknowledge that I’m difficult when physically incapacitated. I want to be babied. It’s hard for me to be sympathetic of my partner’s stress when I feel like I have it worse. I’ve had to realize that I can’t expect him to work full time and pick up the full load of a family. Balls need to be dropped (such as making dinners and cleaning), and frankly he gets the right to decide what balls they are.
My favorite quote about marriage is that it’s equal when both people think they’re doing 60% of the work. So I’m curious about your 80/20 and 50/50 split. Is that true?
So basically, this is a scenario I could easily see myself and my partner in. For me, I’d need to suck it up, view it as a bid for attention/companionship and acknowledge my partner’s pain. And once we repaired mention that the timing and delivery weren’t the best.
Good luck!
theguvnah
Honestly tragic to read on this thread how much bs women put up with from the man who is supposed to be your partner. This is what you want to model to your daughters?
Healthy I Guess
Honestly the responses weren’t what I was expecting them to be, I figured doing 50/50 while I was sick was still pulling my weight but apparently not.
pugsnbourbon
Your husband is treating you really, really poorly. You were SICK. He can clean a bathroom. He’s a grown adult, not a junior high quarterback – he doesn’t need you to be his cheerleader all the time. You do not need to put up with this. I wouldn’t go to couples therapy with him but I’d get some sessions on my own.
Nesprin
Nope, we’re all mad because he should have been doing 50/50 all along and dropped to 80 him/20you when you were sick. You are pulling far far far more than your weight and have been all along.
Trish
We are missing the employed
Labor Division. Is he working all the time and you don’t?
Healthy I Guess
As posted above we both work 35h/week jobs and have nearly identical salaries
Trish
I missed that. Some people are clean freaks who expect everything to be done to their impossibly high standards. I think some of the women who do most of the work to keep the house and home going are in that category. That said, a lot of us are happy with 1 -2 times a month cleaning the bathroom. It doesn’t sound like you expect the house to be squeaky clean. Therefore, your DH really needs to step up.
Anon
Yay that you’re getting better! That is good news!
Reading this post has left me baffled, though. Is the pre-illness division of labor something that you are ok with? If so, fine. If not, then this would be a good time to do a course correction. Couples counseling might help you two to communicate through this, because the way you’ve described your interaction sounds like your husband wants “free labor and a p***y” (gross and cynical description, I know). I hope it’s not that bleak. Good luck.
Anonymous
I agree with the poster who said you need to figure out whether this is really just a timing/communication issue or also a bad husband issue. But I just want to commiserate with the timing part. This was a long time ago, but it stuck with me — When I finished the bar exam, my boyfriend at the time surprised me in the parking lot. I thought it was an unexpected, maybe even unwelcome, but well-intended gesture from someone excited to celebrate with me. Unbeknownst to him, I believed completely that I had failed and was not feeling all that celebratory, just very tired and a bit relieved, but the gesture still seemed kind. We drove back to my apartment to get ready to go out since he seemed to want to. It was pouring and cold. I was standing in the rain and hadn’t even gotten up the outside stairs to the apartment before I was met with the words “Thank G-d that is over. Now we can focus on me.” While it is true that he had focused a lot of time and attention on me in the weeks prior (things I had not asked for), and I had also focused on me during that period, I did not appreciate that timing at all.
Anon
I’m glad you didn’t stay with that person. Any grown, independent, healthy adult who believes the focus should be on them – and would openly say so! – instead of on others who are in greater need, on the partnership, etc. has more issues than I would care to deal with for any length of time.
anoanoanom
Just a vent – I am newly in a role where I am constantly bombarded by b2b sales people via email, linked in, phone when they can find it, which is already annoying, but now someone just send me a teams message trying to solicit me. Are you kidding me?! I am buried in work the last thing I need is for them to find one more avenue to bother me.
I guess related – those of you who also deal with it how do you respond? Ignore? Polite no? Unease the rage you are feeling at the rest of your life via email?
Anon
Teams cold caller gets the last option.
Anonymous
My admin has a standard message to send out for me, thanking them for their interest in working with us, but stating that we believe our needs are met at this time.
pugsnbourbon
I …. didn’t even realize you could cold-call someone via Teams. Oh god.
Anon8
We don’t use teams at my company but I get tons of LinkedIn and email salespeople. I delete the moment I determine it’s a sales pitch.
Anon
I would rip the Teams person a new one.
Anon
(And being a bit of a jerk, there’s a 10% chance that I would find their manager via LinkedIn and have a conversation about how incredibly inappropriate that is.)
Trish
We are missing the employed
Labor Division. Is he working all the time and you don’t?
Anonymous
Respond to each email saying you are not interested and to remove your email from their list. It’s tempting to ignore, but you’ll just get another 2 or 3 emails then as their marketing workflows want them to continue to try to nurture business from you. Asking to remove you should keep you out of the next rotation in a few months when the nurture campaign starts again as they try to assess if you might be open to buying from them at that point.
Anonymous
I always feel like that only confirms that there is an actual person at the address though!
Anon
Hahaha no, I just block the email (or the person, if it’s on LinkedIn). If the person is particularly annoying or intrusive, I make sure to submit their email address to my cybersecurity team’s “spam killer” tool and then I will never, ever hear from them again – and neither will anyone else in my company.
Anon
I started my own business in 2020 and registered with the small business administration as a woman-owned business. Big mistake. There are soooo many companies that just pull names off that list and solicit them to death.
I now have a very active spam filter on my work email but if you go that route, you still have to check your spam folder religiously, because the filter has accidentally caught some legit emails from my clients.
Anon
I usually just ignore them, but lately I’ve been getting emails from a company that is adamant that their autonomous security security robots would totally change my life and I kinda want to make them come to my office and do a product demo so I can force their sales person to listen to me make dalek jokes they’ve heard 8 million times before. I would also make them write down my feedback about adding functions like a net gun and a tranq dart shooter.
Curious
Thank you for the laugh!
Anon
I also get a lot of LinkedIn messages and email…but also blind phone calls! It is super annoying. I’ve told the admins to better screen before putting a call through to me. I’ve had 2 this week, where people are clearly in a call center in another country, trying to sell me some software I don’t need or want.
Anonymous
As a partner in a small law firm, I get bombarded. My response is: I am not the person who handles this (true) and I am so removed from management that I cannot even direct you to the right person (false).
Business formal maternity pants
Morning, ladies. Does anyone have any recommendations for business formal maternity pants? I am not looking for a suit, just pants of quality material that I can wear with a variety of blazers I already have. Everything I see seems to be made poorly and of really thin, bad material. Aaaahhhhhh. Thank you!
Anon
Look on Poshmark for the Loft maternity pants of a few years ago. I got mine in late 2018 and they looked fantastic, and I’m not even a pants person.
Anom
7-10 years ago when I was in your shoes, that didn’t exist at reasonable price points. And even more difficult when you’re petite. Dresses are easier because there’s more forgiveness in sizing. A LBD is useful to wear with your blazers. Maternity clothes are the worst.
Anonymous
These aren’t maternity but maybe worth looking into because of the elastic waist? I just bought the Eileen Fisher silk double crepe single pleat wide leg pull on pants. When I looked for them, they were sold out a lot of places but Dillards had them on sale.
Marketiere
I had some maternity pants from GAP that were amazing. They held up well over my last trimester and I was able to wear them after for a while too.
Anonymous
Gap, or from a few years ago, Loft or Theory. (Yes, Theory made maternity pants!) Seraphine also. There’s a roundup on CorporetteMoms.
Anon
I buy Talbot’s bi-stretch trousers new with tags on ebay. I’m going to be sad when I can’t find them any more, but there currently seems to be a good supply.
Cora
What is your definition of long vs. short hair?
My hair is usually pretty long – bra strap to waist length. The other day I cut it to 1-2 inches below my shoulders, which is pretty short for me.
Then I was talking to a coworker whose hair had grown to the same length, and she was saying her hair was “so long”! We were talking about the exact same length.
Liza
I think in any sort of professional hair-styling guidance/analysis, anything past shoulder length is defined as “long.”
Cat
+1
pugsnbourbon
Agree, but it’s also down to personal perception and what you’re used to. In my case, my hair is “so long” when I start looking like the bad guy from No Country For Old Men.
Anonymous
This. Below the shoulder is what I think of as ‘long’ hair.
Anon
Long hair is below the shoulders, maybe by a few inches. Medium is around shoulder length, touching or closer to the ears. Short is shorter than medium. :) Waist length seems to be its own category (super long, Crystal Gayle, etc.).
Anon
Agree with this. I usually have my hair cut in something like a long bob, and the standard chin length to me is medium length. There are bobs that qualify as short but they usually involve some layering at the nape of the neck as the line of the bob in back is shorter than the natural hairline. To me, “short” hair always involves some sort of layering.
Long is past shoulder length. In fact, mine is getting there.
Not that Anne the other Anne
Long is past the waist, medium is shoulders to waist, short is shoulders to chin, really short is chin length or less.
However, I can sit on my hair, so I may have a skewed perspective on that. :)
Senior Attorney
You definitely have a skewed perspective. I agree with the majority here that “long” is anything below the shoulders.
theguvnah
Long hair is shoulders or beyond. Hair past the waist is just Duggar style.
Anon
+1
Using this poster’s criteria, I know no one with long hair. Which is not correct.
But we all tend to have a skewed perspective based on our own experience! ;)
Anon
I used to have hip-length hair and sometimes miss it. It now is mid-back, and I think it’s somewhere between medium and long. Two inches shorter would be very close to medium.
Anon
Do you wear your hair up for work? I can’t imagine hair you can sit on is coming across well in a professional setting.
pugsnbourbon
Why not?
Anon
See Duggar style above.
Anon
I think it’s in the eye of the beholder! As an adult, my hair has been hip length and has been chin length. Right now it’s collarbone length which feels long because I’ve been wearing it shoulder length or a little shorter for the past few years
nuqotw
My hair is currently waist-length but I have had it buzzed down in the past. My hair starts to feel long to me if I can pull it up into a full pony tail.
Cora
My hair is short to me because I tried to put it into a braid and it didn’t stay (partially bc of layers), so I approve of that measurement!
anon_needs_a_break
how are there so many of you with waist-length hair?
Are you all deeply religious? I’ve literally never had a friend with hair that long – I’ve actually barely even seen it in the real world, not since the days of seeing Crystal Gale on my tv as a kid in the 80s.
Is this a regional thing? I’m legitimately confused!
nuqotw
I like my hair really short or really long. It was short-ish in early 2020 and I was considering whether to cut it or grow it. Then suddenly the only way to get my hair cut was to do it myself…and I just didn’t.
anon
Such a judgemental and unnecessary comment!
Anon
That was my reaction too, honestly. I haven’t seen anyone with waist length hair in an office in 20 years.
Anon
Most people I know consider your hair “long” if it goes past your shoulders, and that’s my salon’s definition too (there’s a price difference between long and short hair), so I think your co-worker is in the majority.
startup lawyer
If you can make a bun you have long hair. if the pony tail is a stub, it’s medium. no ponytail is short
what makes an heirloom?
How do you decide if something is an heirloom?
My in-laws are going to (fingers crossed) be downsizing and they have SO MUCH STUFF. For them, everything has sentimental value. I am not a stuff person. They know this. DH and I have talked a bit about how we might limit what they try to give us, which is really important to me.
I keep thinking, however, about what qualifies as a family heirloom or something you keep because of familial history. I get the things that have sentimental value, things of monetary value, etc. But what about the other stuff?
For example, my MIL showed me a beautiful handmade tablecloth that her aunt tatted and that my MIL has never use. I will never use it. It is incredible but is it important? I don’t want to just store it for another generation. Do we accept it and then give it away if she can’t bear to? I am trying to get out in front of this a bit but I know it is all coming.
Vicky Austin
I’ve mentioned this before, but my theory about heirlooms is that they’re only special with the memories of the person associated still attached. My dad, for example, treasured his grandmother’s milking bench, but we didn’t baby it (it was the backyard dog brushing station!) and eventually it gave up the ghost. Since we didn’t know his grandmother, he was fine letting it go after it got some further use. It sounds like you didn’t know your MIL’s aunt; it’s too bad, because MIL could have gotten a lot of joy out of using her aunt’s tablecloth for family meals. I don’t think you have any obligation to keep such a thing, especially if you won’t use it either.
Anon
This is exactly the opposite of how I feel; the heirlooms mean more to me when they connect me to someone I otherwise have no connection to, with whom my life never overlapped.
Anon
I think your husband should get more, but not all, of a say in deciding what things from his own family are worth keeping.
Anon
+1
Liza
I think the concept of a family heirloom has become a bit outdated. A century ago, when consumer goods were very expensive to make, family heirlooms such as tablecloths or dressers were actually an asset, because they were a sign of luxury and would have been expensive to replace. For better or worse, as decent tablecloths are now available at Ikea for $20 or at Goodwill for even less, that’s no longer the case, and they no longer have monetary value. The only things I would consider an heirloom are things that are super-personal such as photographs or journals.
I wouldn’t accept it then give it away while your MIL is still living. If you can explain that you don’t want it, maybe it would work for her to give the items away on Facebook marketplace – that way she knows they are going to someone who actually wants them and will use them, and won’t end up in the bulk bins at Goodwill for example. Also, does your husband have extended family who might want them? A female cousin who knew the tatting-aunt or is a descendant might appreciate the items. Finally, I think it’s fine to hold firm that you don’t want certain items, and if your in-laws can’t bear to give them away to anyone but you and DH, they should get a tiny storage unit to keep everything in.
Also, I get that they’re downsizing, but a tablecloth takes up very little space. Typically I think of downsizing in terms of needing to get rid of big things like furniture, primarily. Does their new place have a closet where they could store a few bins or boxes of sentimental items?
what makes an heirloom?
We were just having a similar conversation with our kids about what heirloom used to mean vs. now. It really has changed. I wouldn’t give anything away that we had accepted while they are living. They are in their 80s and I hope they continue to live well for many more years but we are talking about A LOT of stuff. Their primary residence easily has enough furniture for two homes and they have a second, enormous residence filled to the brim. I’ve never seen anyone with this much table linen.
Great point about making sure they include extended family in the offerings. Every single thing seems to hold a memory or potential future usage. I’ve offered to find someone to help with the process since they are out of state but they’ve refused.
Anne-on
With this amount of furniture are there younger extended family members who might benefit from pieces as they are starting out? I would have loved being gifted higher quality pieces of furniture as a 20-something, it is SO expensive to furnish a place!
Anon
+1000
I was low income / student for all of my 20s and early 30s. When I really could have used furniture I asked about an old but sturdy wood dresser that had been my grandmothers and now just sat in a random corner of a random over crowded with furniture room of my parent’s house – empty. My brother said…. “but that’s an heirloom!!!”. ???? Ok…. so I bought someone else’s old used dresser. Now my parents are gone and my brothers want NOTHING from the entire house, I am here to clean it out and am very annoyed. So we’ll wind up giving all the furniture away to a furniture bank. Because of course it has no substantial value, and now I have no space for it.
It is actually extremely cathartic giving away my parents things. I am fortunate enough to have the time to search for places online that would need. There are organizations everywhere that are happy to receiving things as donations, and then you can have a tax deduction and be doing a good thing. Everything from their piano to their book collections (some are going to their Universities and Museums and are valuable!), to all of the consumables to food banks or women’s shelters, to all the furniture and odds and ends to furniture banks, bicycles and bike supplies to a non-profit bike shop that refurbishes bikes and gives to kids and more. The only stuff that will be less welcomed are the traditional “heirlooms” that were passed down to my mother from her mother – linens, china, silver. My mother left them in boxes in her basement her whole adult life, keeping them out of ?duty? But now I will pass them on, and will probably give away on Freecycle.
Anon
+1
My grandfathers both died in my early 20s (both grandmothers were already dead). Im now in my late 20s and very piece of furniture I have except my sofa is from one of the grandfathers. It saved me SO MUCH money when I didn’t have it and it is so nice to have pieces that remind me of them.
Anon
I’m in my 50s and I welcomed a few pieces of my 80 something mother’s furniture into my home when she downsized. The 40 year old sofas she had in her living room, and used very sparingly, are so much nicer quality than what I was previously using (and which were getting shabby). OTOH, a lot of my mother’s furniture was either very worn or dated – think dressers with shallow, unfunctional drawers that just wouldn’t work in my house.
Anon
I’ll take all the tablecloths and napkins, lol.
Anonymous
We went with taking it, having an informal agreement with the other donee kids to check and see if they or their kids wanted bits of it, and then slowly deciding what we wanted to use, sell or donate. The kids and their families collectively ended up keeping and using more than we thought we would. But, we all live in the burbs and near each other, and we have enough room to have a pile of extra stuff for a while.
Anonymous
I have decided that the best gift I can give my MIL is the gift of unburdening her of her stuff, physically and emotionally. She’s an only child who has all her parents things that she can’t bear to part with. DH is an only child. I’ve started encouraging MIL to send us ALL THE THINGS and let her know we’ll decide what we can use and pass on the rest. Spoiler: we pass on 99.5% of it to the trash or Goodwill. This isn’t a secret, but it’s also something MIL cannot bring herself to do. I also have allocated a corner of my attic to things we don’t have any use for but it would crush MIL to have given away in her lifetime (see: the rocking chair she was nursed in and nursed DH in that is giant and hideous and has caning coming out, a painting her grandmother painted, DH’s box of eagle scout memorabilia, etc)
I’ve started showing my kids some of the stuff, letting them enjoy it for a bit, take pictures (always share with MIL!) and then donate. Recent examples include 3 full boxes of scarves, hats (and plastic hair covers!), and gloves in very use condition from MIL’s mother. MIL saved hats that DH wore to Disney World in like 1986. They are trash. But my kids had fun putting them on one afternoon before we dumped them!
Anonymous
I think you need to step out of this. This doesn’t seem like your primary decision to make since any sentimental connection would naturally be your husband’s. The bigger issue is your need to feel like you should be controlling this. You seem far too comfortable judging them. Their decision on whether to downsize should not have you crossing your fingers.
If there is something specific that you would find meaningful, fine. But otherwise, not your call. Arrange storage if you need to. If there is something he doesn’t feel strongly about that they want you to take (tablecloth), politely decline. They may have a friend or more distant family member who would be excited to receive it. Don’t just accept it and toss it.
Anon
She is not judging their decision to downsize, but is dreading the choice she will have to make when that stuff is offered to their household: either refuse and risk offending them, or take it but compromise on her own desire and preference for less stuff.
Anonymous
“My in-laws are going to (fingers crossed) be downsizing and they have SO MUCH STUFF.”
That’s literally judgment. Nothing to be crossing fingers over.
She also didn’t say anything about her husband’s views and described the type of person she is in contrast to them but said nothing about him. Not sure why she assumes she should be the one calling the shots on this.
I’d talk with husband about a designated amount of stuff to keep or store (rather than individual judgments on each thing) and then leave it to him and his family to decide what comes or goes since any sentiment is naturally there.
Anonymous
Your home isn’t a museum dedicated to his family. If you don’t actively like it and want to use it or have it, don’t take it in.
Anon
If you can get away with it, I suggest that together with your husband decide the volume of items, like maybe 2 boxes, 3 boxes, etc and you can have the MIL decide what is the most important after you’ve selected the items that you want/will use.
Senior Attorney
OMG we have SO MUCH STUFF, some of which is from my parents. Like, three sets of sterling silver flatware, four sets of fine china plus several sets of casual dishes, every kind of drinking vessel you can imagine, more art than we can hang on the walls. I will say we actually use it (had a sit down dinner party for 16 over the weekend), but I have long been reconciled to the fact that it’ll be sold for pennies on the dollar at our estate sale or tossed in a dumpster when we go. I think it’s unreasonable for anybody to saddle the next generation with the care of a bunch of stuff that the next generation doesn’t want.
Fun fact, though, regarding furniture: My husband just closed his law office and managed to find good homes for all the high-quality furniture including nice side chairs, console and occasional tables, and a dining set they were using in the conference room. The desks were built in but we have very nice desk chairs in our home office now.
anonshmanon
side question: do you have a giant dinner table that seats 16? Is it like Downton Abbey?
Senior Attorney
Haha, I wish. No, we used our regular dinner table and turned it at right angles from how it usually, and snuggled up a Home Depot collapsible plastic table beside it. Rented 12 Chiavari chairs (the small gold bamboo-looking ones you see at weddings) and put 7 at the regular table, 5 at the other table (one more on the outside than on the inside of each table, if that makes sense), and our regular dining chairs at the head and foot of each table. It was snug but we all fit!
Anon
IMHO, an heirloom is something that can be expected to survive beyond the generation to which it is given. My family has some furniture that is 150 years old and beautiful, lamps with real gold leaf on them, a 19th century umbrella stand, lots of Art Deco jewelry, cabinets full of Waterford and Wedgewood.
Some day, hopefully, my mother will bequeath it to me (benefits of being the only child, I guess), and I’ll bequeath it to my kid.
I just wouldn’t put that in the same category as the stuff that will be falling apart in 30 years. I will likely keep some linens and then use them; they fall apart when they fall apart. Things like books straddle the line: I expect to give my certified autographed books to my kid some day, and any classics that are in good shape would be worth keeping. Strongly suspect that most of my library will end up in a bin.
If your MIL has never used the tablecloth, it shouldn’t be given to another generation to store – one generation of storage is enough. Donate it to a museum and if a museum doesn’t want it, what’s the point? I’m not trying to be a huge snob here; the issue is that you shouldn’t pass things along that two generations have stuffed into a cabinet. Use it – and if the “incredible” (not scare quotes, being serious) tablecloth gets wrecked with pasta stains and Thanksgiving gravy, at least it didn’t rot on a shelf. If you’re truly never going to use it, not because you’re scared to, toss it.
Anon
I would never give away something like that tablecloth. You don’t have to use everything. Your children or their children will probably include at least one person who is awe-struck by it. I would consider that an heirloom.
Having tried my hand at tatting, I know how much labor doing a whole tablecloth would be!
Don’t lie to her by taking things like this from her insinuating you’re going to keep them, and then just throw them away. Give her the chance to either give it to another relative who would appreciate it or keep it herself.
Anonymous
it’s an heirloom when it’s passed down intentionally to someone who wants it and has memories or family stories attached to it. Heirlooms also tend to be high quality items and are often of monetary value.
Since this is your husband’s family, it’s him that gets the final say on what gets accepted.
Anon
What your kids think they will want in their 20s might be very different when you die and they are in their 50s. If you have space and can afford it, KEEP IT. Or, as others have said, find a cousin. I only have a son so I gave my grandmother’s doll to a cousin who has granddaughters. She paid for the shipping.
Anon
Your MIL sounds like my mom. She’s given me “family heirlooms” that I don’t need. For instance, she recently gave me a table from my grandparents. It was easier to take it than say no, but it was too large for my space. I told her I’d sell it or give it away. She got upset about it, so I compromised and said I’d move it into my basement storage. I figure I’ll get rid of it in a year or two after she forgets.
She definitely tried guilting me (yes, unhealthy, that’s a separate conversation). “But it’s an antique! But it’s a family heirloom!” Ok…and you didn’t want it! I don’t need to want something, that she doesn’t even want, just because my grandparents bought it. I do think there’s an element of thinking that everything old is somehow valuable. I looked online. Similar tables go for $100. It’s not valuable despite being 75 years old.
Anon
Yes, I think that folks don’t realize that while old furniture from your family may include “antiques”, they are not necessarily valuable antiques. I keep family items out of sentimentality or because I like them. I actually took quite a bit of my grandparent’s lovely antique wood furniture and had it refinished. These antiques are never going to be sold – they are to be used/enjoyed. I spent much more $ refinishing them than they are worth, but they are gorgeous and functional and conversation pieces. And I am surrounded by touches of my grandparents, who I loved.
Anon
Yeah I definitely have family members who think my home is a storage space for their crap that they are emotionally attached to.
Meanwhile I’m all “break the cycle of crap!” If we buy something inexpensive but functional, we use it until it wears out and then it gets thrown away without fanfare.
If we buy quality, it’s something that is a straight faced heirloom or at least meant to be used for thirty years (like my kid’s bedroom furniture – nice enough he can take it to his first apartment, easy, and he’s only 3).
The ultimate end of everything is the landfill; the only question is how it gets there. Once you (general you) understand that, your spending, crap accumulation, and emotional attachments will change.
Anon
The best solution for heirlooms you don’t want to keep is to take a high-quality photo of them, save any family lore about them in the cloud, and then donate.
Anon
Anyone watch the Pamela Anderson show on NF? I thought it was good, but I feel very sad for her (which I suspect was the point of the show).
Sara
What happens with friend groups when people start having kids?
Right now some friends are married, some are not, but generally people still hang out together. I can’t imagine this staying the same if someone has kids thoguh. For example, last weekend a friend had a birthday party at home. It was pretty tame, food and alcohol but not too much, but the conversation topics was not necessarily kid-friendly and frankly I think a little kid would have gotten bored there. Later that weekend a few friends met at an outdoor-ish bar that you could bring a kid too, but again the kid would get bored and its just not really a kid-friendly environment.
Do you just . .. stop having hangouts like this? Maybe its better if multiple people have kids? There was nothing that specifically made the bday party not kid-friendly but one of the hosts did get drunk, it was loud. My parents did a lot of things with us (went on day trips, out to restaurants, on vacation) and there were single adult friends/family around who would do things that both adults and children would enjoy (parks, summer fair, more casual restaurant) but my mom never did something like a “girls night” until I was much older.
I’m just pondering this and figured this would be a good place to do so.
Liza
It becomes a natural transition. The first couple to have a baby either brings the baby, gets a babysitter, or stops attending events that aren’t kid-friendly. Once everyone has kids, the events tend to include them because that’s just easier for folks.
Anonymous
People hire babysitters?
It depends on how social you are now. My parents had a standing Saturday night sitter and went out every Saturday night. DH and I are more homebodies but we still go out on the regular – just a bit harder to do stuff spontaneously if we are both going to attend without the kids.
Anon
I have a toddler and am in this friends group. One other couple with young children, 4 other couples without children (2 not by choice which makes it extra rough). My default is to not bring the kid- which means babysitter, one parent goes and one stays home, or we both don’t go. There are occasions where it’s explicitly stated the kids are okay to bring and we do. It definitely changes the dynamic though- a lot of attention/energy goes to keeping the toddlers alive and entertained.
Anon
Just cuz people start having kids doesn’t mean the kids will always be there. As someone with kids, sometimes I hang out with my friends (with or without kids) with them, and a lot of times I leave the kids home with a sitter or their father for a girls night. It may take a little more planning, but I wouldn’t assume that kid-free socializing stops entirely for years after having kids.
Anon
I mean… it changes. To be fair, the dynamics in your friend group may change even before someone has kids. I know in my local friend group from my 20s, we had a few people move, then someone joined who didn’t get along with another couple, etc., so they dropped us, etc. The dynamics just change over time.
Everything with kids comes in seasons. With older kids, my understanding is that you just do kid-centric activities or hang out with other families with kids. It is also easier to get a babysitter when the kids are older. I have a toddler and am in this friend group, and it’s just hard. Our friends have started trying to plan hangouts around us and pick something they think is kid-friendly that just isn’t. Normally, we either get a sitter or just one of us goes to the adult function and the other stays at home. Or we take separate cars so one of us can leave early with kiddo. I mean it’s just hard, but we frankly try to make an effort to go to things we are invited to and are normally happy when we go. Sometimes, we also host people at our house so that we can control the environment a bit more.
Anonymous
Ages ~1-6 are tough with groups like that. Infants that aren’t really walking yet are pretty portable. You put them in a spot and they sort of stay there. Toddlers that are running around (or particularly zoomy crawling babies) are tough. But by the time they’re old enough to watch movies or play video games, you just kind of let them do that. Plop the kids in the game room and the adults proceed with their drinking and adult conversations. The kids do not care what you’re talking about.
anon
I think the answer here depends a lot on whether this is a group of couple friends or a group of singles and also how old you all are. If this is a group made up of couples, I have seen kids integrate more easily into that, particularly if it’s oriented around an activity (like if this is a triathlon club) or more than one couple has kids around the same time. If it’s a group of singles, I think your biggest change is not going to be people having kids, it’s going to be people getting married.
In general, people who tend to have large friend groups that all kind of do things together will find that changes when people start getting married (and the spouse takes priority over the friend group) and then changes significantly when kids enter the picture. The center of gravity of relationships tends to slowly shift from a group of friends towards the family as people pair off and have children.
Cora
In my group I’ve interestingly found that the serious partners / spouses don’t change the dynamic that much. My group is pretty outgoing and we’re all planners, so maybe the spouses tend to just join in?
Anon
I think my case is different because right now, each of my separate friend groups only has one couple with a kid. For my main friend group, which is one that my husband and I share, that mostly means when we do stuff we’re hanging out at the house of the people with kids. They don’t mind that we always end up over there, and they live pretty close so we don’t mind either. It’s the only way we can all hang out past 7:30/8pm after bedtime. I think things will change significantly once we have kids, because that will no longer be the default option.
Anon
+1. My joint friend group is 4 married couples and one single person (and whoever he’s dating). The first couple to have kids 10 years ago ended up hosting a lot at their house so that we could hang out after bedtime. Then the other three couples had kids in the next year or two so the kids now range from 2 to 10. We all have two to three. We have lots of daytime get togethers and early dinners at each others’ houses or local restaurants (leave by 8). We also sign our kids up for activities together and take vacations together. And we also get babysitters or have our parents watch the kids pretty often. Like this weekend — tonight I have a work dinner with my spouse (so babysitter), tomorrow night he has a guy’s night (I’m home with kids / I have ladies night next weekend), and Saturday night we have a date night to the theater (grandparents babysit). We also have swim lessons, soccer, a kids birthday party (of our friends’ kid), and a kids play date during the day time hours this weekend. It really depends on your social circle. I find that people who were generally social before kids will find ways to continue that, while those that weren’t that social will find ways to retreat and be 100% kid-centric (I see one of my once bffs, who is local, once or twice a year now because she is only focused on her kids but we talk often).
Anonymous
You just make it work.
The One
When and how did you know your partner/ spouse was The One? Looking for some love stories!
Cb
I don’t know if I had that moment? I just really grew to love my now husband, we had shared values and goals, and could see a really lovely, happy future together. He says he fell in love immediately when I walked into the office with a big smile and a short skirt.
Not quite as scandalous – I was a PhD student doing a temp job, and I maintain my skirt wasn’t that short + I had black tights on.
Anon
When I realized that I had never laughed or smiled as much as he did compared to my entire life up to that point. I also realized how at peace (not anxious) I was and how naturally he fit into my life.
Liza
I didn’t consciously realize it at the time, but it was hugely significant that our first date was not awkward (and lasted for about six hours) when basically every other date I’d gone on up to that point had been. I thought I was just an awkward person – well, maybe I am, but DH somehow got us past it! :)
Vicky Austin
I met my husband in college, literal hours after turning in my study abroad paperwork. We had a few months of dating, and then I went to live in another country for a year. We fell hard and fast despite that, and I remember asking him if he was really okay with dating while I was gone. As I recall, he said, “What are you going to do, not go? This is so important to you. I’ll be here when you get back.”
Melt. And of course, he was!
Anon
I don’t believe in The One. But here’s a story. About 3 months after we started dating, when we were newly in BF-GF territory, my husband’s parents had to unexpectedly put down their dog that he was very attached to. He visited his parents and stayed over night at least every other weekend (they were a couple of hours away), and he and this dog adored each other. He came over afterwards to my place and just cried, and then talked to his parents on the phone and cried some more (it was a weekday so not realistic to go to his parents that night). The fact that he was so attached to this dog, and that he was able to be so emotionally open with me and with his parents, really won me over.
anon
I think my spouse is A One, not The One, but I’ve also been married more than once. I had a big “he’s the one” moment with my first husband, but with my second, we were just friends who gradually became more than friends.
nuqotw
I must have been pretty confident because we were already engaged…but I went through a terrible personal event and was assaulted in the middle of our engagement and he just was there and comforted me.
pugsnbourbon
Whenever I thought about the future, she was there :)
My mom has a good one. She traveled a lot for work and realized she kept thinking, “oh, I wish [Dad] were here to see this” or “I can’t wait to tell [Dad] about this.”
Senior Attorney
I don’t know about “The One,” but this is how we decided to get married: We were in love and had been dating exclusively quite happily for almost two years, spending most nights together at one of our two houses, when a mutual friend died suddenly after a short bout with cancer. All of a sudden “we have all the time in the world” turned into “maybe we don’t have all the time in the world after all,” and we were engaged a couple of weeks later and six months after that we were married.
Anon
Pretty much on the first date, and I had A LOT of first dates. I told him I loved him three weeks later and he very quickly told me he felt the same. (Yes, I had no qualms about going first.). We have been married for 20+ years now.
Anon
We were sitting across the table from each other on our first date. This was a blind date, so it was maybe 30 minutes after we met each other for the first time. I just knew. He figured it out a week later. Engaged on our tenth date, I think, and married less than a year after that.
anon
Anyone else finding that they’re really lonely? Slowly, it seems like my friendships have slowly fizzled out, despite my efforts to keep them going. Nobody wants to go out, hang out, anything. At least people used to give reasons (busy with kid thing!) Now I’m lucky if I get a text back even acknowledging that I’ve invited them to do a thing. I became closer with a group of girlfriends during the pandemic (lots of group texts, zooms, socially distanced driveway hangouts), and now I’m wondering if it was just a period of bonding over the terribleness of the pandemic. Because now that life is back to normal, our friendships don’t seem to fit. And that hurts a lot. Even more so because my husband is still hanging out with their husbands. Clearly, I need to branch out into other social groups but that is so much easier said than done. It makes me wonder if I’m the problem, if I’m really the boring person I fear that I am — like what am I not bringing to the table here?
Anonymous
The bit about your husband still hanging out with their husbands is odd. Have you tried to host a game night or dinner or some other gathering at your house? Or some couples event? The winter doldrums are hitting a lot of people hard. Maybe people would be happy to do something that someone ELSE plans.
Anon
I feel this way fairly often. I try to make new friends, but I only have two old friends that I’ve known for 10 plus years. All my other friends feel more like acquaintances. I will say it seems like women pick up more of the household work so their husbands end up having more free time to socialize. I wouldn’t take it personally but I would try to make more friends!
Anne-on
Do they have kids and you don’t? I’m noticing that parents with kids (especially those in sports) are FULLY back on the practices/games/tournament schedule and it’s hard to get in touch with them. I’d definitely offer to host them or maybe just put it out there – say that you miss them and you’d love to see them again but it seems like they’re busy and ask what would work on their end – quick calls? weeknight hangouts? etc.
anon
We all have kids.
Anon
Same age or different ages? I have a toddler and find that it’s easy to incorporate him into friend time – he can come along for volleyball (DH and I take turns sitting off to the side and playing with him), game night, meals out, but I think older kids would be bored by that.
Anon
My old friend group with friends I thought were ride or die has fizzled to a text here and there. One person from that group still wants to get together with me, and we’ve added a third person we both know, so that’s a new friend group. And I made a new friend over the pandemic, and I’ve hung out with her 1:1 as well as with groups of people she knows.
I connect with lots of people by text though, and that helps with the feelings of isolation. I have friends I rarely see that I text every day. Some people are just not texters and some are.
Anonymous
Favorite bourbon mixed drinks? Preferably can be made in big batches, and people (ahem me) can add seltzer or whatever if they want to tone it down. Thanks!
Ribena
Smitten kitchen has a bourbon lemonade which is delicious!
Josie P
Or her boulevardier – I linked to it but in m 0 d – you can search ;)
pugsnbourbon
Manhattans are decently easy to make in bulk. Some distilleries sell bottled ones which I’ve found to be pretty good.
My wife really likes bourbon + soda water and some flavored bitters. I swap the soda for an ice cube :)
Josie P
Boulevardier
https://smittenkitchen.com/2018/01/boulevardier/
Or old fashioneds!
Senior Attorney
I love an old fashioned: Buurbon, simple syrup, bitters, more bourbon!
Senior Attorney
I really like a nice whiskey sour, or a New York sour, which is a whiskey sour with a bit of red wine floating on top — very pretty!
MagicUnicorn
Mint juleps are lovely with some fizzy water.
Anonymous
or Sprite.
Anon
Old fashioneds
Manhattans
Bourbon with juice – lemonade, a 2:1 cranberry:lemonade, and blackberry all work well.
Bourbon side cars
DO YOUR MATH. When a drink recipe indicates that it should be shaken or stirred, it is not just to chill it; it also dilutes the drink. Shaken drinks dilute more than those poured over ice and stirred. If you pour room temperature bourbon into a punch bowl or pitcher, add lots of ice, and let it sit, it will be too dilute. If you chill the bourbon and add the mixers, it may be too strong.
Anon
My grandmother’s bourbon slushes. When I was young (but legal drinking age) and would visit her on a hot day, she would pull these out of the freezer and sit with me and drink one. It made me feel like I had crossed some magical bridge to adulthood, which is entertaining because I literally never saw anyone in my family (including my grandmother) ever consume an alcoholic drink in this way. A glass of wine at dinner, yes; a beer at a barbecue, sure— never a one on one drink like the ones I shared with my grandmother
Anon
I should mention that she was well into her eighties at the time.
Anon
I like to make a mason jar of manhattans and keep it in the freezer, and pour it into a glass with ice and/or soda.
Anon
This is probably petty, but my job just hired someone to do the same job as me who has no experience and a bachelor’s degree in a totally unrelated field. I’m overworked and I know I should be grateful that there will be less on my plate now, but I’m almost 10 years into this role with a relevant advanced degree, and it’s hard not to feel like them hiring this person with essentially no education or experience is devaluing my hard-earned expertise (to be fair, my feelings are probably colored by the fact that I’ve felt undervalued and unappreciated here even before this person came along).
Monday
I’ve had a similar experience and felt a similar reaction. In my case, it helped me realize that people at my level were hard to find, thus my employer was settling for less to fill the roles. Once I started applying elsewhere, sure enough, I found myself in demand. Just wondering if this might be the case for you too…and if you feel undervalued maybe you don’t want to be there anymore anyway.
Anon
I’ve been applying for a while now without so much as a screening interview, which is definitely compounding my frustration. I’m very limited geographically for family reasons and there aren’t many fully remote jobs and those that exist are very competitive. I’m also in a field where a lot of people work freelance or on short term contracts, so anything full-time with benefits is going to have a zillion applicants.
Anon
From the other angle, my daughter was hired as a tech writer with no experience, but that was unusual for her company who really needed to fill the role and she (and her engineering degree) were in the right place at the right time. I wouldn’t take it personally except, as you say, you already feel that you are not valued, which probably means you should be looking elsewhere.
OP
So my situation is actually pretty similar to your daughter’s. I got into the field tangentially but I had unique things in my background that were relevant to the job, so even if I wasn’t a perfect fit on paper, I had relevant skills that translated to a ability to do the work. The new hire seems to have no relevant background, and the degree and job are much more disparate that engineering and technical writing, which seems like a pretty logical transition to me. It’s more like hiring someone with a fashion degree for an engineering job. It’s not that I think people can’t learn on the job or that people with non-traditional backgrounds can never be a good fit, it’s more just that for years I’ve gotten the vibe that my bosses think literally anyone could do my job and now they seem to be testing that theory.
Liza
It’s not clear from your post – how does your 10 years of experience and advanced degree make you better able to do the job? The new person will have a ramp up period of course, but in, say, 6 months to a year, what will you bring to the role that this new person doesn’t?
Anonymous
Any chance there is a personal connection? I’d also be wary. Some companies do this to get someone younger and cheaper in.
Anon
Some of the time a candidate has the right soft skills and charisma to win a job over someone with more relevant skills. Give them a chance before you cr@p on them.
Anonymous
Some of the time a candidate has the right soft skills and charisma to win a job over someone with more relevant skills. Give them a chance before you cr@p on them.
Anon
Unless there’s a tv reviewer who has seen all the episodes on this site, I don’t think anyone here can answer that yet. I feel the same way as you, was iffy on the first two episodes, liked the third. Not sure how I’ll feel about the show overall until more episodes have aired. If you want to watch it, watch it, and decide for yourself, or take the safer approach and wait until reviews for the whole season come out.
Anon
Yes! I also hated The Walking Dead, but I’ve been loving The Last Of Us.
Episode 3 (the most recent one) made me and everyone I know ugly cry. It was one of the best episodes of any show I’ve seen in forever, and there was a zombie on screen for about 5 seconds the whole ep.
Seventh Sister
I’m sort of ambivalent about zombies – hated The Walking Dead but loved 28 Days later. While I adore Pedro Pascal, I was reluctant because there really haven’t been many good screen adaptations of video games. But this is good, really good. The narrative is well-constructed and it’s a lot more of, “how do people create a functional post-zombie society” than jump scares with zombies. His Texas accent gets a little thick sometimes (yes, I know he lived there) but honestly, I’d watch that man read the phone book. Also the rest of the casting is great – an age-appropriate woman partner! Or two! A teenager that looks like a kid! Ron Swanson! I’d try it out.
Seventh Sister
Also I like that it’s set in post-apocalyptic Boston (at least for now), but in the third episode there are actual mountains which is mildly hilarious. They don’t have that kind of mountain near Newton, silly!
Anon
Reposting because I’m stuck in mod, which seems slow today: Unless there’s a tv reviewer who has seen all the episodes, I don’t think anyone here can answer that yet. I feel the same way as you, was iffy on the first two episodes, liked the third. Not sure how I’ll feel about the show overall until more episodes have aired. If you want to watch it, watch it, and decide for yourself, or take the safer approach and wait until reviews for the whole season come out.
Also, at least the first two episodes did have a lot of the things I don’t like about zombie shows: lots of jump scares and general grossness. There’s clearly more to the show than that, but those things really take away my ability to enjoy the show, which is why I’m still on the fence about whether I’ll like it overall. If every episode was like the third, I’d be all in, but I don’t think that’s a representative episode.
Senior Attorney
Sure, give it a try! If you don’t like the first episode or two, I feel like you could just watch and enjoy Episode 3 as a stand-alone, perfect little mini movie. OMG I cried so hard!!
Lily
I like zombie movies, at least the ones I think are well done/somewhat cerebral. I loved 28 days later, World War Z, and I Am Legend. I initially liked Walking Dead, but it got boring fast for me (I think there are a ton of seasons, I probably only watched 1, maybe 2).
I am loving Last of Us. And episode 3 was amaaaazing. Plus it has Armand from White Lotus!!!
Seventh Sister
I had read the book World War Z before I saw the movie, and was super disappointed! And I’m not that person who always likes the book better than the movie (the book usually is better but American Psycho and The Weight of Water are better movies than books). I kind of wish they would to a World War Z TV series because the book is so complicated and interesting.
Anon
I’m pretty meh/anxious about zombies (Train to Busan gave me such bad anxiety dreams that I didn’t finish it). I’ve only seen the first (very long!) episode, but the human story in The Last of Us was compelling enough to hold my interest.
anon
Does anyone have Nisolo shoes? Do you like them? Someone recommended them for work appropriate sneakers the other day and they look gorgeous. I’m about to pull the trigger and just want to hear what experience others have had with the brand.
ALT
I have two pairs and love them! They are very comfortable. The leather does get easily scratched/scuffed, but I haven’t tried oiling either of my pairs. I have a pair of oxfords that my cat chewed the laces of so I haven’t worn them in a while and I have a pair of sandals that I wear literally all the time in the warm months.
I think sizing runs a bit small…I was between a 7 and. 7.5 on the sandals and ended up going with a 7.5. Returns are easy!
I’m so tempted by their 5 for 5 program but I do NOT need any more shoes…
Emma
I have the Chelsea boots and really like them! They fit a little narrow but look nice.
roxie
I ordered a gorgeous pair of sandals from them, and they were painful even just to try on (the stiffest leather ever!) so I returned them.
Anon
I live near their shop, so I have several pairs of their shoes and have tried on a lot more. Their shoes do tend to run narrow. Reviews on their website are normally pretty accurate about sizing. I have only tried on one pair of their shoes (some sandals) where the sizing was just totally inconsistent. The shoes I’ve gotten from them have all been very good quality and look nice.
Lise
I have the huarache sandals and the lug sole Chelsea boots, and love both. The sandals are in great shape still after two full summers. I’ve only had the boots for a few weeks so I can’t speak to how they will hold up, but they were comfortable for long walks right out of the box.
Curious
I love the huaraches for look and feel, but they do have very little support; I can’t walk more than a mile or so without feeling it.
Anon
Help me brainstorm a late March Friday/Saturday in NYC? I have a work trip with obligations ending early Friday afternoon, and plan to extend by a day. I love museums (especially with docent-led tours), classical music, one-of-a-kind stores, gardens, and hole in the wall restaurants that surprisingly serve the best [whatever] you’ve ever had. I’ll be staying in the financial district for the work portion but don’t mind moving hotels on Friday for easier access to cool stuff.
startup lawyer
grab a drink at Saga
Senior Attorney
The Tenement Museum tours are great — highly recommend.
Anonymous
+1. They have so many different tours, you could literally do three of them back-to-back and have no overlap past the initial 5-minute introduction to the museum.
NYCer
Have you spent time in NYC before? If you have not, and you like museums, I would probably go to either The Met or MoMA. I always enjoy the Frick and Neue Galerie as well, but I would probably only recommend those if you’ve already been to the other two. You can check the schedule of the NY Philharmonic to see if there is a concert the night you are here. Lincoln Center is beautiful.
Anon
You and I have similar interests.
I also recommend the Frick (I love the intimate private museums) and the Tenement museum.
I’m a violinist. If you enjoy chamber music – go across to see Bargemusic… literally on a floating barge with a beautiful view of Manhattan in Brooklyn. Either before or after the concert, get a slice of pizza from one of the best local pizza places (Grimaldi’s) nearby the Bargemusic, sit by the water and eat it. Dress well! Or make a reservation at the River Cafe and enjoy that view after the concert.
Laser hair removal
Does anyone have the Tria laser device and can provide their comments on it? Or if they have a different laser hair removal that they particularly like. Considering investing in one. Also wondering if they ever go on sale? Thanks!
Anon too
I’m on week 8 of using the SmoothSkin IPL device. 12 weeks is the recommended time for the first full “course.” I am seeing a very real difference in the lower legs and bikini line, which is where I’m using it now. I don’t expect perfect permanent results, but I’m shaving less and my legs in particular feel very smooth for a lot longer. The stubble on my thighs is now a very marked contrast. If I end up using it once or twice a month, as advertised, and get to ditch the regular shaving, it will be good enough for me. Fair skin/dark hair, don’t hate shaving enough to make time for multiple laser visits.
Anon
Second year in private practice. I am really busy but many cases are court appointed so I don’t have cash. I do, however, have sufficient personal savings to give my firm a loan and my husband’s income can pay our mortgage. Contemplating hiring a part-time paralegal to help me with the idea that the cash from court appointed lawyers will come later. Any ideas?
Anonymous
Are you out of your mind? Don’t Loan your firm money.
Anon
I’m not a criminal defense lawyer but this seems nuts to me. Why are you working for free? If you can’t get paid for these cases (I thought lawyers were paid by the state for court appointed cases?) then you’re essentially volunteering your time. Volunteering is great, but don’t sink your own money into it.
Anon
I don’t get paid until the case closes and that can be a year or more for serious cases.
Anon
DO NOT DO THIS.
Anon
Court appointed usually means paid by the government. Did you somehow *agree* to work for free? Don’t!
Curious
Sounds like she has receivables but they’re not due yet, hence the lack of cash. Frequent small business problem. I’d try a small business loan, first.
Trish
Thank you, Curious. That’s a good idea. I have have had at least 45K expected in flat fees and these cases have been pending a year. I could take
More if I had more help. How did people think I was working for free. My private cases pay my currently small salary but I need an assistant.
Anon
I’m so exhausted by gun violence. I live in Northern VA and work in DC and what happened on the metro yesterday is weighing heavily on me. We have also had an increase in armed carjackings in my area recently (we’ve had 5 in just a few short weeks). I’m not an irrational person but it feels like anyone, anywhere, can potentially walk up to me and point a gun at my head. This fear isn’t unjustifiable considering it’s happening all the time! How does this end? I’m so hopeless about it all. I have no ties to this area and hate my job so I’m honestly considering leaving.
Anon
Hey – just a big hug. I don’t think there’s anywhere great on this in the US right now until we get federal gun laws in check. I also know crime in bigger cities is up – I’m sure posters here who work as ADAs/in criminal justice can comment further on the why. One of my friends in Brookland had car stolen while she ran inside on an errand.
I used to live in NoVA and worked in D.C. and then MD. I moved to my home (red) state where people love guns, so even the cover of a blue city/county (where I live) is limited. I can’t say I feel more/less safer. When touring the local public schools, I hate that the first thing I ask and look for is the entry/exit point(s) and how well they are guarded.
anonymous
I’m curious how federal gun laws would be more effective in preventing this than the DC gun laws (which were apparently violated by the perpetrator). I’m generally very progressive on guns and certainly support gun safety laws generally, but this seems to be a little misplaced on this story.
Anon
Good point. You know, I don’t know the solution. I usually come back to federal gun laws as cover all which isn’t right, but there has to be some SOME difference it would make…right? Right?
Leatty
Because states near DC have lax gun laws (e.g., Virginia).
Monday
Also totally exhausted and feeling powerless about it. I’ve lived in 3 different major cities and always relied on public transit, so it’s devastating to hear how unsafe it’s become.
Anon
Just chiming in to say ditto. I’m in Alex. It’s safe in my affluent neighborhood, but I worry SO MUCH about my immigrant friend who works as a Lyft driver. Someone could shoot him any time, for any reason, and he has 6 young children!
Guns are just everywhere and nothing happens because of awful, selfish red state views. My husband is an avid outdoorsman, and there’s a giant gun safe in our basement, but there’s a huge difference between his hunting shotgun and semi-automatic weapons and handguns and it makes me so MAD that political stakeholders can’t and won’t make that distinction for the good of society.
Anon
At this point I think the only thing we can do is vote. We all know who is pro gun control and who doesn’t care.
Anon
But DC has been run by Dems for decades and has strong gun control laws. It’s obviously not helping.
Leatty
But Virginia doesn’t, so DC laws can only do so much.
Anon
The DC metro shooter was a DC resident. I’m not sure how Virginia is relevant
Lily
Are you willfully ignorant? Someone can buy a gun in VA and be in DC in 5 mins. Just like someone in Indiana can buy a gun and be in Chicago in 5 mins. People can travel freely from state to state in this country. The only thing that will help is federal legislation, because the only borders that are enforced in terms of guns at all are country borders, not state borders.
Curious
Just go over the border and get a gun. Most of the guns in Chicago are from Indiana.
Anon
You’re acting like there’s a big wall around each city or state with different gun laws. 2:04. That’s a facile argument.
We need national gun control, just like every other civilized nation on Earth.
Z
Tbh, it’s happening everywhere. Last year my friend, who lives in a very nice area of our city, was carjacked outside her apartment building at gunpoint by a group of 4 guys – the youngest was 14, the oldest was 22. They stole it for a joyride and were caught driving it not even 48 hours later. I rationally know that violent crime is generally not random, and you generally know what areas are considered higher crime than others. But you want to be safe getting out of your car outside your place. I wasn’t worried about it before that happened to her, now I feel like I need to be ultra-aware of who is around me every time I go out.
Anonymous
Ugh, with you. Sounds like we live in the same NOVA neighborhood with the carjackings. We’ve been trying to buy here for several months and this latest string is really making me question that decision.
Anon
Seeking advice on raising a bilingual child. I only speak one language (English), while my husband and his family are native Russian speakers who are fluent in English. They usually speak English to each other in front of me, but I know when I’m not there or on the phone they speak Russian. We have a newborn, and my in laws are our only childcare. They’re amazing and spend at least 25 hours per week with our baby. They mostly speak Russian to the baby. Will this have any impact on her learning to speak? I would love for her to be fluent in Russian, but not if it’s interfering with learning English first.
nuqotw
It will be fine. She will grow up speaking both.
Nesprin
Yep! My 6yr old niece is bilingual- she started speaking English a few months late, but now natters on in multiple languages. I cannot imagine taking away half her heritage to get her speaking English earlier.
Vicky Austin
Actually, if you want to raise your kids bilingually, this is one of the recommended approaches – have one parent or a caregiver speak exclusively in one language, and the other parents/caregivers in another. Your baby will do great and her English will not suffer.
Anon
Yes this is exactly how you’re supposed to raise bilingual children.
Anon
That’s awesome! Bilingual children can take a little longer to speak but it’s not a developmental delay, no harm. They’re just learning more.
Curious
+1. Our kiddo is learning English and Spanish, and her early language milestones were slower, but now she’s got more words than most kids her age. Also, Russian is so good for the brain! I learned in college. Envious of bilingual babies.
ANon
even if she learns Russian first, she will still speak English. Chances are she’ll learn both at the same time and speak a combo, not sure how to combine Russian + English into a word like Spanglish, but something like that!
Lulu
This won’t hurt at all, it’ll be great for her. As a toddler she might confuse a few words but
Anonymous
You speak English they speak Russian shell
Learn both. No need to worry about the order.
Seventh Sister
My adorable toddler neighbor speaks mostly Russian at home and is learning English at preschool. She seems to understand everything (smart little miss!) and talks earnestly to me in both. It’s super cute and we get along great.
Seventh Sister
I know it’s just developmental but I like to imagine that she thinks that all moms speak Russian and English like her mom, so she talks to me in Russian and English.
Anon.
My husband and I are both German and live in the States. We speak German at home, English in all social settings, and kid (7 yrs old) speaks both English and German fluently.
Bilingual upbringing didn’t interfere with language learning. Kid mixed some English words into German and vice versa, and sometimes there are “false friends” were the word is the same but means different things (for example “sensible”/”sensitive”, or “handy” in German for mobile phone), but this was a phase and it’s not a big deal.
There was never confusion when to speak in which language, kids are incredible at siwtching according to context.
You have an amazing opportunity with family being native speakers. We are deliberately spending summer vacations in Germany with extended family because our kid’s German vocabulary benefits being exposed to more native speakers for a period of time.
Cat
this is actually the recommended way to have a bilingual child. Jean of Extra Pet!te talked about how they’re intentionally raising their kids bilingual English and Mandarin.
Anon987
I first learnt to speak in my mother tongue, and learnt English and Swahili a little later just before going to pre-school. In high school I took French classes and today I speak 4 languages, and will sometimes converse in 2 or 3 at the same time depending on who I am speaking to. In short let your child learn both languages.
NYCer
My husband only speaks French to our kids, and they both learned English just fine. This is a positive, not a negative, and the best way to raise a bilingual child. Do not give it one second of worry.
Anon
You (and all other non-Russian speakers) should only speak to her in English and your husband and his family should only speak to her in Russian. This is how much bilingual kids are raised to be fluent in both languages
Anon
She may learn to speak a bit later but once she does, it will come out beautifully in both languages. Even small babies (personal experience here) know to speak Russian to the grandparents and English to the parents. My cousin speaks English to his kids and his wife exclusively speaks to them in Greek, even as babies they would respond to each in the right language and never get confused. You are lucky!
Get your inlaws to not switch to English as the kid gets older (mine did, to my kids’ detriment as they have forgotten the other language now).
Anonymous
I’m a neurologist.
To grow up bilingual is a wonderful thing for brain development, and an incredible gift to give your children. It is a relatively easy, absolutely pain-free way for your children to learn a new language. It will never be as easy for them to learn as it is when they are their youngest. It was also lead to an incredible bond with their extended paternal family. It is so good for the brain that preliminary studies show that it will delay the onset of dementia late in life!
I absolutely recommend to all of my friends who are fortunate enough to be bilingual to give their children this gift. My only friend who did not now regrets not doing it. She was living with her husband in Manhattan at the time, was incredibly status conscious and worried that her child might not get into the right preschool (!) if her spoken English skills were at all delayed by growing up bilingual. Of course, this was ridiculous, and in fact her child being bilingual would have been seen as a bonus by that psychotic pre-school that required the parents write multiple essays for admission.
Where I live, there are multiple immersion pre-schools that are very difficult to get in to. One for Spanish immersion and one for Mandarin.
The hardest part will be for you, actually! Do you speak Russian? If not, your kids may use Russian as a little bit of a secret language at times! You may want to learn Russian too. Sadly, some kids will push back on the 2nd language as they get older, but are less likely to do this if the extended family live nearby and continue to speak Russian. Many of my bilingual friends would travel back to the “home country” in summers growing up, and had wonderful experiences. If your spouse is from the current day Russia, that may or may not be possible or desired. But no one can argue that Russia does not have a rich and amazing culture/arts/history that are worth knowing.
The woman who cleans our house is from a small Baltic country and I strong encouraged her to give her grandchildren the gift of her native language. She was so surprised when I told her this was a good thing. She thought that now they were in the US, they should “only learn English”. I told her what I told you, and she was thrilled. Her husband actually raised the grandchildren, speaking only their native tongue. The children are now 3 and 6, and fluent in both languages. It has given their family so much joy.
Seventh Sister
I’m so glad you could encourage her! I’m a GenX who went to college with a number of first-generation immigrants who (according to them) couldn’t really speak their parent’s native language (e.g., Mandarin, Hindi, Spanish). In the 1970s/80s, a lot of parents were actively discouraged from teaching their kids their native language, or even speaking that language at home, because it was thought learning two languages would impair their kid’s ability to speak English. I’m so glad we’ve moved past that type of thinking.
Anan
I’m so glad you could encourage her! I’m a GenX who went to college with a number of first-generation immigrants who (according to them) couldn’t really speak their parent’s native language (e.g., Mandarin, Hindi, Spanish). In the 1970s/80s, a lot of parents were actively discouraged from teaching their kids their native language, or even speaking that language at home, because it was thought learning two languages would impair their kid’s ability to speak English. I’m so glad we’ve moved past that type of thinking.
Anonymous
your kid will be fine. I learned to speak Chinese at home and English at Pre-K at the same time and today I speak both fluently without “foreign” sounding accents. the only issue my parents recall was that initially I had trouble pronuncing the hard “g” sound in both languages and the ped basically told them the problem would solve itself by the time I went to kindergarten and the ped was correct.
I have other friends who learned to speak Chinese, Japanese, and English all the same time as a toddler and they have no issues today as adults.
it would probably help if you learned a bit of Russian if you’re haven’t already, bc as a kid learns to speak two languages they do tend to mash up the languages at time like ” I want toy [whatever toy is in Russian or non English language]”, which is normal in language development.
Anon
There’s tons of research on this, and bilingual upbringing doesn’t hurt English language acquisition in any meaningful way.
Hi
Please be supportive of this. English will be the dominant language regardless so you have nothing to worry about. I’m trying to teach my young toddler my foreign language and are met with similar concerns from American family, and it’s frustrating. This is one of the greatest gifts you can give your child.
Anon
Even if she picks up Russian first, it will be fine. You’re living in the US, so it’s impossible for your child not to learn English unless you worked very hard to keep them in Russian-only environments. Our friends are bilingual English and Spanish and spoke only Spanish to their child at home. He didn’t really speak English very well until he was 3 or so, but then he started preschool and picked it up immediately. My daughter has also had a bunch of preschool classmates raised in homes where they only spoke Chinese and the kids learned English quickly at school.
Anon
Several of my friends are raising bilingual kids — usually under similar circumstances, where the primary caregivers speak a non-English language. In each of the cases, the kids started speaking a little later and mixed up languages a lot at first. All these kids are now early elementary and speak both languages fluently. Go for it and don’t start worrying if the kid is speaking later or mixing things up at first. Also use this as an opportunity to pick up some basic Russian! I’m a Russian speaker and my Russian BFF’s husband has gotten pretty good at it after learning a few words or phrases at a time to speak to his in-laws. He can’t have a full conversation (and can’t read or write) but he can communicate many everyday things with pretty good grammar and pronunciation.
A
Not at all. She will grow up bilingual.
– someone who was fluent in 4 languages by the age of 10
Anon
A friend of mine is from South America and speaks fluent Spanish; he married a white girl from Massachusetts who also speaks fluent Spanish. They’ve switched between Spanish and English since their kids were born and now both of their kids are fluently bilingual. No difficulties in either language. It’s pretty awesome, TBH.
Hollis
Friend/neighbor broke her shoulder in a ski accident and is basically bedridden. I offered to bring a homemade meal, but I’m stuck in analysis-paralysis. She has a husband and 2 teenagers. I was thinking of making mac n cheese in a disposable pan and adding a bagged salad mix and a Tate’s choco chip cookies. But then, I’m thinking I should have some kind of protein, but I’m not a fan of rotisserie chicken (too salty for me) and I don’t think anything fried tastes that well if reheated. She is local and I can make something else instead (chicken fajitas or chili or a lasagna). Any suggestions on what to take to a family you don’t know that well (and you don’t want to ask a million questions to them either)?
Seventh Sister
If they eat meat, grocery store fried chicken is really tasty even if it’s not the healthiest. And it tastes good cold. Maybe do that with some mashed potatoes, mac and cheese, and a salad?
pugsnbourbon
You’re not kidding. Back in high school I worked at Kroger and sometimes made the fried chicken – people lost their MINDS for that stuff. And it keeps decently well.
Seventh Sister
It was my best trick for preschool potluck. People love it.
Vicky Austin
Mac n cheese, bagged salad and cookies sounds awesome. I bet the teenagers will be thrilled. And when you take it over, ask what else they like to eat for next time. Shoulders are complicated and she’ll probably be stuck in bed for some time.
Anon
I would make a big spinach lasagna, which is both yummy and easy to reheat leftovers. Another thought is turkey chili, with toppings, which also works well if reheated.
Anonymous
Lasagna is always the answer to easy comfort food. That said, a tray of cold cuts and rolls from a good deli is probably best if they don’t know you well enough to know what your kitchen looks like. I know a lot People don’t trust other people’s cooking.
Senior Attorney
One thing I’ve made in those situations that’s been a big hit is pork chops baked on top of boxed or homemade scalloped potatoes. That said, I would love you forever if you brought me mac n cheese, salad, and cookies.
Anon
Baked pasta-lasagna, baked ziti, etc. Mac & cheese and a salad is not enough.
Anon
Isn’t lasagna basically mac and cheese and salad, together?
Does the salad need to be hot?
Anon
I make Ina’s lasagna in this situation.
NYCer
I think anything you take will be appreciated, but I don’t necessarily think that mac and cheese would be the best option for a family of two adults and two teenagers. If there were preschool aged kids, I would give mac and cheese a resounding yes. But with older kids and adults, I would do lasagna or a hearty soup. I also like rotisserie chicken from certain places, so would be happy that as well.
Anonymous
I love greek for this kind of thing – grilled/baked chicken, romaine lettuce, hummus, tzatziki, pitas, and any other fixings you want. But seriously, unless they have food restrictions, almost anything will be more than appreciated in this situation.
Anon
Bring something she can eat with a spoon using one hand.
Anon
Inspired by the thread earlier this morning – how common/likely is the post-partum experience she described? Has anyone had a GOOD experience in the newborn/infant stage? Or at least, they knew it was going to be hard work and it was but they weren’t soulcrushingly depressed? My husband and I are thinking about trying to conceive in a few months and I’m very nervous about that phase. I would likely proactively restart therapy in pregnancy, but would be interested in hearing any other tips, guidance, or personal experiences.
Anon
I am not sure therapy will help. I had a glowing pregnancy – happy all the time, no sickness, gorgeous skin and hair. I really think the drop in pregnancy hormones is what caused my psychosis. I was worried I would hurt my baby in scary violent ways – like something (devil?) might jump inside of me and I would have to fight it off. I didn’t want my mother to touch him. But, if ANYONE had asked me if I was having scary thoughts, I would have said yes and then I would have gotten anti-psychotic medicine. I think there is more education now than 23 years ago, but make sure your husband, family, and doctor know the signs in case you need medication. By the way, the thoughts and feelings magically went away after 2 months and motherhood has been great ever since.
Anon
How scary. I’m so sorry you experienced that.
How are you doing now?
In retrospect, I believe my SIL had your experience. Unfortunately, she was from a cultural background where mental health was not supported and she never received appropriate care. The end result has been devastating for the family.
Anon
I am fine and so is my marriage and baby. Looking back, I realized that I experienced what it feels like to be mentally ill. And it was bad enough that I was afraid to have another baby.
Anon
I adopted and I still experienced depression when when I became a mother. Clearly my child was actively wanted, but the change in my life and the lack of sleep took a huge toll. I have so much sympathy for new mothers who have all of that plus the physical recovery from pregnancy and childbirth, as well as hormonal adjustments (and often facing the additional challenges of breastfeeding).
Anon
I had a great postpartum experience. I skew anxious/worrywart in general and I think going in with low expectations helped, but I had a pretty easy recovery from birth (despite a third degree tear) and I had a baby who slept through the night early (<6 weeks) so the sleep deprivation was so much less of a big deal than I anticipated . I think sleep is a HUGE factor. I felt borderline psychotic in the hospital when I didn't sleep for about 48-72 between my induced labor and being woken up every hour to attempt breastfeeding or be checked by a nurse…I get why they do this, but it was really really hard on me to not get any sleep. Once I got home and could sleep in my own bed and my husband and mom could help with baby care, things got much easier.
A supportive partner is probably the best thing you can have, and the second best thing is money to outsource household tasks or potentially bring in a night nurse if you have a poor sleeper. Family help like grandparents also helps. My parents were here for two weeks and although they were (understandably) off duty overnight, they did a lot for our house, pets and baby during the day, which made it much easier on me and DH. But I was also surprised by how well we coped when they left, and my husband had also gone back to work by that point.
Also give yourself permission to formula feed or combo feed if breastfeeding doesn't come easily to you, or round the clock breastfeeding is making you too sleep-deprived. Breastmilk definitely has benefits that formula doesn't, but formula isn't poison. My ped likes to say "it's the presence of breastmilk that matters, not the absence of formula." My kid was huge and came out of the womb starving and I didn't have much milk in the beginning (very common, especially for first time moms) and after a few miserable days of trying to avoid formula and listening to baby cry nearly non-stop we gave in and started giving her those pre-made 2 oz bottles and everything got better instantly – my kid stopped crying all the time because she was full, so she could sleep, thus I could sleep. Combo feeding is the best of both worlds, imo – baby gets breastmilk, but dad and other caregivers can give bottles and take overnight feedings. My milk came in within a week and her diet from then on was 95% breastmilk, but we continued topping her off with a small formula bottle before bed, which may have been a factor in her sleeping through the night so early. Several of my friends struggled a lot more than I did in the newborn days, and I think their determination to exclusively breastfeed was a big factor.
Curious
+1 to all of this, except we waited a little longer for the formula top-off (why?!) and kept up 1-2 night feeds til she was 5 months. Breastfeeding felt AMAZING to me. I’ve never felt so un-anxious.
Man I want another baby. Just got to get a little stronger first.
Anonymous
I hated every moment of being pregnant. With my second I was definitely mildly PPD. She was a tough baby and it was a LOT. But I went ahead and had a 3rd and now they are all older.
That is to say, it’s not a picnic for everyone but it’s a phase of life. PPD is a spectrum. A good partner/support network is really important!
Senior Attorney
I hated being pregnant but I loved having a newborn, even though she didn’t sleep through the night for 11 months and three weeks. BABIES ARE SO SWEET!!
Senior Attorney
And yeah, I moved heaven and earth to exclusively breastfeed/pump, and if I had it to do over again I would’ve been way more relaxed about formula.
Anon
It depends on the baby. I had postpartum depression after one of three. It’s an absolutely the hormones but sleep deprivation put me over the edge. She just didn’t sleep. She was “colicky”, and not from 4-7pm (what they call the witching hour) but all day every day. We tried everything. But ultimately the sun came out around 3 months – just in time to go back to work! – and she has been a great kid ever since, about to turn 22 years old.
I have never been so exhausted in my life as I was when she was a newborn, but in the long run it was the blink of an eye. At least I was younger then and could handle it.
(For the post partum depression, talk therapy helped and I didn’t end up on meds. They were there if I needed them but breastfeeding was basically the only nice moment I had with my daughter and I didn’t want to give it up.)
Anon
Exhaustion is common – kid needs to eat every few hours, so someone is going to do that, and that person (or persons) is going to be tire. And no one is at their best when they’re exhausted.
But I had a good post partum experience. Granted, I had a planned c-section, it was pre-covid so I had grandparents available to help my partner and I, we had good insurance, secure jobs with paid leave, no other pets or kids as distractions … so I was super tired and occasionally angry or resentful at my husband but I also have some of the best memories of my life in those early days of being a parent. Though he irritated me at times, my love and respect for my husband expanded exponentially when I saw him jumping in and trying to figure out the baby stuff right along with me. How are these diapers supposed to work? Which option from the sleep sounds CD is the best? How do you swaddle? Our giggling and wonder and love for our new little family was a truly blessed time.
Throw money at these problems to make them better
I had a rough time, but it would have helped if I realized that having a new baby is one of the toughest things in life and it’s well worth spending money on support even if I wasn’t certain that I’d end up really, really needing it.
In particular, I would have:
1) either exclusively formula fed or arranged for my community’s excellent community-based lactation consultant to come help me in the hospital (I gave birth at a world-class academic medical center, but the lactation consultants were mediocre), before we had problems
2) arranged for a night nanny before I gave birth. By the time I was desperate for one, I was too sleep-deprived to arrange for one. Plus, the experienced night nannies in my community tend to be booked out 6 months or so ahead of time.
3) made appointments with my OB as soon as I had a problem, not waiting to see if things would get better
Anon
I’ll be the good experience. I had my daughter at age 40 and I have a history of mild anxiety. Mostly treated with therapy and once was on lexapro.
My postpartum was fine. Honestly once I stopped trying to breastfeed it was pretty magical. My baby napped well and I even did a few little projects around the house. Went on walks and took the baby places including restaurants where she slept. Pre covid obviously.
My husband was involved and split up getting up nights with me so I slept enough. Personally once I let go of the pressure to breastfeed things were pretty smooth.
Anonymous
I think that you’re smart to think about this now. I had an incredibly easy pregnancy. I found that the sleep deprivation set of my stress anxiety like nothing else. Also, something that I struggled with was that I went from working, where I work with great people and we’re a very collaborative group and talk almost all day and I know what I’m doing, to being at home, by myself, and having no clue what I was doing. I didn’t anticipate how hard that would be. Once I started getting out of the house for mommy and me exercise classes or scheduling lunches with people I was much better.
Anon
I had crippling insomnia while pregnant, which, in conjunction with the hormones, caused perinatal depression.
I felt better once I delivered; the Fay after giving birth, it was like my mind was my own again. I had bouts of depression for about ten months, mostly a day or two at a time. Sleep deprivation is awful.
There is a formula shortage now, which just makes me ache for new moms. Without any recrimination, I had my baby in the night nursery in the hospital so I could sleep. Watching the bassinet being wheeled back in the morning was amazing, so it wasn’t lack of bonding or anything. We combo fed, which meant my husband could let me sleep when my body was giving out from exhaustion. I slept better after giving birth than before (maternity leave meant I could sleep until 10 am, and I fell back asleep rather quickly after night feedings).
PPD is no joke and the best thing you can do is to sleep, be healthy, and reach out for help. New moms are bombarded with messages about how happy they are supposed to be, but that exhaustion and those hormones can crush people. I don’t wish my perinatal depression on anyone (except people who say it doesn’t exist).
Anon
I think it is very common for every delivering mom to have baby blues that coincide with the hormone fluctuation after birth. I remember staying in bed all day long basically crying the whole time (Day 5). But then it was great. Not easy – physically and mentally grueling. I have a hard time being bad at things and there’s an adjustment period as you learn how to be a mom to your child. Otoh, one night during a diaper change the kid literally pooped a fountain that shot 3 feet and hit the wall, and my husband and I could not stop hysterically laughing. The phrase all joy and no fun resonates for that period for me.
Lily
We had a very similar experience with our first newborn. It got all over the curtains and missed our faces by a milimeter. We called it the “turbo sh*ts.” It was the best laugh I’ve ever had.
startup lawyer
I had a perfectly smooth pregnancy and chill labor and delivery. My recovery took no time but i was very anxious the whole time. I couldnt’ be alone with the baby for 6 months. I leaned a lot on my husband who cut back on work to stay with us.
Bette
I had a pretty positive post-partum experience. It was a little lonely because we were in the early stages of COVID, pre-vaccine, but I did not experience PPD (and I had some risk factors making me a high candidate for it). Some of it is just luck (including that my partner had a very generous work schedule/paternity leave and therefore was very engaged at home) but a few things that I think helped, that you may be able to control:
(1) The #1 priority in our household was making sure both parents got as close to 8 hours of sleep as possible. Often that meant the house was a wreck and laundry went undone, or we ate weird meals at weird times, or that one of us slept in the guest room while the other stayed with the baby, and for several weeks it meant that I went right back to bed after morning feedings and didn’t actually “get up” until 11 am but we both intentionally committed to doing whatever it took to give each other those sleep hours and that helped SO MUCH.
(2) Let go of expectations and embrace imperfection. Using formula instead of killing yourself to EBF, be ok with eating unbalanced/convenient meals, not feeling like every waking minute with the baby needs to be about enrichment, feel ok about using baby’s awake time to take care of household needs so that you can use naptime to take care of yourself, etc.
(3) If you don’t already feel like you have a fair and equitable division of household labor with your spouse, NOW IS THE TIME to get that all out on the table and work through it.
(4) Based off observations of my immediate friends, those who gave birth in winter months (cold, lonely, not much daylight) were much more prone to depression than those who gave birth in the spring or summer. Not to mention the stress of keeping a newborn healthy in the midst of cold and flu season. You can’t always control the timing when you are TTC but after observing that, we really tried to time our second pregnancy so the baby would be due in warmer weather.
Anon
I agree with all of this, especially #1. We have friends who had the bad luck to grow babies that never sleep and they literally sleep in shifts, like of them gets 8 pm to 4 am and the other gets 4 am to noon.
I will say I had a winter baby and a great postpartum experience, although we were cautious about germs and didn’t really go anywhere in public indoors until she’d had her 2 month vaccines (and this was pre-Covid). Also it depends where you live, but late winter and late summer typically have about the same amount of daylight. In my area, the days are about the same length in February as September, even though the latter has much better weather in much of the US. Plus babies are so much more fun when they hit 3 months or so, and I loved having that smiley, cooing baby stage be over the summer. YMMV.
Anon
I had a great postpartum experience. I work with new moms a lot so was very aware of the challenges but didn’t fully realize how much JOY there is in having a child. I love my daughter so, so much. It’s like all my other loves are stars and she’s the sun. There’s nothing sweeter than my sleeping baby cuddled against my chest. I love being a working Mom. I love caring only for myself for hours at a time, not being touched, not truly being needed. And I also miss her so much and am so happy to be back with her when the day is over. She’s 18 months old now and it feels like the newborn period went by in a flash.
It’s hard and it’s great.
Lily
PPD is very common, but still, most women don’t get PPD. So chances are you will not have it, but you should be prepared to know the symptoms. Of course, if you already have depression or anxiety, you are higher risk for PPD or PPA. Try to find an OBGYN who will support you if you want to continue taking your depression or anxiety meds during pregnancy.
I’ve had two kids and had a great post-partum experience. I know some people who had PPD, but most people I know did not. That’s not to say it isn’t hard. Everyone will cry at some point when they have a newborn for some reason or other. Baby isn’t latching, you’re exhausted, baby is crying and nothing is working to soothe her, you’re in pain from delivery, etc. Feeling exhausted and overwhelmed at the beginning doesn’t mean you have PPD.
Anon
I had a good postpartum experience three times, although with the first, the physical demands were much harder than I expected for longer than I expected. My first baby was and is an intense personality, and it was really hard to get through the first few months of sleeplessness, breastfeeding demands, and deal with my difficult boss when I went back to work at 3 months. Even though I was a completely depleted zombie for the first 6-9 months, I didn’t have ppd and remember knowing it would get easier and I was smitten with my demanding baby. The next two babies were much more easy-going (and sleepy, thanks god!), and my work situation was better.
Echoing Senior Attorney here: if I could go back in time, I would *definitely* give myself a break on the breastfeeding (hungriest baby in the world, and I barely produced enough milk; I was pumping all the time, breastfeeding all the time, and still waking up at 3am to pump at eight months in; too much!)
Wishing you an easy conception, pregnancy, labor, and first few years!!
Seafinch
I’m pregnant with my fifth so you can probably guess how I find having a newborn. I hesitate to even post this but since there are examples of us out there maybe it’s worth saying. My best friend was the same and my mom was, too. I find it bucolic. I love every minute and really enjoy it. I’m Canadian and have incredible mat leave, which undoubtedly helps. I don’t suffer from exhaustion and I enjoy being home with them all and being a temporary SAHM for the time period (I am also happy to go back to work but I take a year so it’s not comparable to the US). I don’t find it really hard work but I also really enjoy homemaking and I definitely have never been depressed.
I don’t leave the house that much with a small baby. I like nesting and prefer them to have their fixed routines (which they set, I don’t). I think our biggest hack is that I nurse the baby one last time after supper and then I go to bed alone. This can occur anywhere from 1900 to 2100. Usually closer to 2000. I then sleep for a few hours. My husband nestles the baby in his arms and binge watches a series and brings the baby to me for its next feed, usually around midnight. So I get a solid chunk of sleep and then nurse the baby and sleep with it until the next feed in early morning. My husband goes to bed around midnight and gets a shortish night but a solid few hours. He doesn’t get up with baby again. Other than that I just hold them a lot and bask in it.
Anonymous
I have had three kids. After the first, I felt overwhelmed, but not depressed. I struggled with breastfeeding her, but switched to formula and felt fine about it. She did not sleep well, but other than being tired of course, I did not feel bad. After my second, I was a mess. I cried all the time. When I went back to work I felt like I was abandoning him. I struggled with breastfeeding him, but we eventually got the hang of it. I had started a new job and felt exhausted. He was a terrible sleeper. It was a very hard time. I think i probably should have seen the dr. but it felt too hard. My third (we knew we wanted a third, but did not meticulously plan like we did the other two) I had a little bit more time off of work, she breastfed fine from day 1, and she was a good sleeper. I did not feel bad like I did after having my son. I honestly love them all the same and they were all so wanted and we were so excited for each of them. Something about the hormones I guess made the postpartum time after my son feel awful. My husband was doing 100% of everything all the time after all three kids, so it wasn’t that I didn’t have enough support or anything like that. Basically, PPD happens regardless of circumstances, but can be treated and should be made a priority to do so!
SMC-San Diego
So here is the deal.
I had my daughter as a single mother by choice (assisted reproduction). After the first eight weeks, I was on my own 75% of the time and always at night. Despite all of that, I had a great postpartum experience through difficulties nursing in the beginning, raw nips, a case of mastitis at 5 weeks, and going back to work full time as an attorney at 4 months with no live-in help and a baby who made up for not seeing me during the day by wanting to be awake all night. I adored my baby and was determined to enjoy every second.
To be super clear, I am not claiming to be some sort of super-star parent. I had a relatively easy baby and parents eager to help. I had a lot of experience with cranky babies (at 20 I took care of a relative for 3 months because he cried ALL THE TIME and his mom could not deal). I handle sleep deprivation relatively well. What I am saying is that my experience was not this morning’s poster’s experience, which will not be your experience. Your experience will belong to you. Comparisons are not helpful. All I can recommend is alerting your doctor to a history of depression because that is a medical issue you cannot prepare for, making sure you have a lactation consultant on stand-by if you want to nurse, set up whatever help you can, and remembering that infancy is very, very short and a the privilege of caring for your baby is just that.
Vicky Austin
Today’s AAM post…I’m making popcorn.
Vicky Austin
https://www.askamanager.org/2023/02/im-unprofessional-and-not-detail-oriented-but-i-still-need-to-earn-a-living.html
Anon
Yikes on bikes! Thanks for the link, but now I won’t get any work done this afternoon…..
Liza
This person seems to be asking for suggestions of jobs where it’s acceptable to make sexually inappropriate comments… I’m kind of surprised Alison’s response didn’t advise that this is (or should be) a null set.
Vicky Austin
Oh, my god, I thought you meant the ill-advised “take your pants off!” remark and was about to defend the writer, and then I read that paragraph again. !!!!!!
Anon
Omg
anon
Haha, seriously. I read the letter and it seems like LW is living in some dream world expecting a high paying job where they can exist without boundaries. And there are some comments saying it’s ableism to expect the LW to act appropriately in a work environment!
Liza
Yea this entire letter seems like an April Fool’s Joke. The entire premise of AAM is that there are professional norms and behaviors and teaching people how to navigate them. This would be like if someone wrote in and was like, “I manage a team and want to discriminate against my employees who are a different race from me, but I know this is illegal. Any suggestions?”, and Alison just threw it out to the readers for thoughts.
Anon
This person honestly needs to find a job in a quirky underfunded granola-crunchy nonprofit, in a smaller city, run by the original founder, where there are like three employees total and all that matters is that she can get some amount of work done in a given workday. She won’t have to really produce anything of substance because the nonprofit doesn’t have to actually do anything to continue to get funding; the founder will just keep applying for grants and then beg her rich friends for money. I have seen quirky people absolutely THRIVE in that type of environment. I mean, honestly – she could just move to Santa Fe, or Pueblo, Colorado, or Missoula, Montana and probably do great.
eeeeeks!!!
Request for suggestions– I have a work event coming up this weekend. It’s a cocktail party before a black tie event. We’ve been asked to dress more upscale, ‘creative business.’
I don’t have anything that fits anymore — I was just going to wear a navy blue cocktail dress, or a purple cocktail dress, but they either don’t fit or are so old the zippers are getting stuck in ruching.
Any suggestions for a 14 on bottom, 12 on top pear? Something I can get in 2 days? Many thanks for any ideas, hopefully under $150. Bonus if I can wear more places, so maybe an LBD?
Liza
To be clear, you’re not actually going to the black tie event, just the party, so the attire you’re seeking is cocktail?
I like this one from WHBM, see if you can do curbside pickup to get it fast: https://www.whitehouseblackmarket.com/store/product/lace+sleeve+shift+dress/570337371?color=001&catId=cat11679473
eeeeks!!
Yes, exactly! And that one is PERFECT.
Thank you so much!
Anon
Anthropologie Maeve Open Backed Dress if the open back is acceptable? It’s absolutely stunning on and incredibly flattering.
eeeeks!!
oh, this one is stunning, thanks for the idea. This one may be a little too va-va-voom for a work event, but it is gorgeous!!
pugsnbourbon
Sounds like you can have some fun with this outfit.
Bright pink jumpsuit – https://www.macys.com/shop/product/inc-international-concepts-womens-surplice-neck-tie-waist-jumpsuit-created-for-macys?ID=14906319&CategoryID=50684&sizes=WOMEN_REGULAR_SIZE_T!!12%2C%20L;;14%2C%20XL
I’m liking the 70s vibe from this one: https://www.macys.com/shop/product/guess-womens-pleated-woven-faux-wrap-v-neck-maxi-dress?ID=14844694&CategoryID=5449
Versatile and on-sale: https://www.macys.com/shop/product/sam-edelman-womens-high-neck-sleeveless-chiffon-dress?ID=14845139&CategoryID=5449
Fun twist on an LBD: https://www.macys.com/shop/product/dkny-printed-faux-wrap-dress?ID=14392559&CategoryID=5449
eeeeks!!
These are so awesome, thank you!!!
Anon
Would love to get input on a birthday gift idea for my best friend from law school. We have a gift-giving tradition. She is mid-40s, in-house lawyer, has two teenagers, no hobbies except for going to kids’ sporting events, and she has a car commute. In the past, she has loved (and I’ve seen her personally wear/use) the following gifts that I have sent to her: patagonia better sweater, patagonia nanopuff jacket, Fossil tote bag (this is her primary purse), and athletic zip-up and t-shirts for working out (she doesn’t work out that much but has a home gym set-up). She returned a button down shirt I got for her and a blue nile pearl necklace.
I was thinking about maybe getting her:
A. a Mambe waterproof hooded blanket (I have one) to use at soccer games, but it may be too practical
B. Vuori joggers for when she’s at home – she’s always wearing jeans at home, so might be a good alternative, or
C. Upgrading the Fossil tote to something like Cuyana, but she uses all of the inside pockets and I don’t love the idea of weighing down a leather tote with an additional “thing” to make it more organized.
Budget is in $100-200 range – she is very practical and never spends money on herself so I like to get her nice/upgraded things that she would not typically buy for herself.
Liza
Going with the theme of the previous gifts that seemed to work well, what about a puffy vest? I feel like that’s something you can never have too many of…
NYCer
I think the Vuori joggers and a top is a good idea. You can get both for under $200.
I am a bit younger, but I would also be happy to receive “nicer” pajamas (by nicer, I mean something like Lake or Eberjey) or a gift certificate for a massage.
Anon
+1
I think the Vuori joggers will be a revelation for her, if she is still just wearing jeans at home. And she can easily enjoy wearing them to the kid’s sports games.
What a lovely friend tradition! I am the only person in my family who buys gifts for others, and what a delight it would be to have one friend who cared and knew me well that exchanged presents!
Anon
I like this idea as well!
Anon
Ember mug
An.On.
How about a Yeti of some kind? She can bring hot/cold drinks to the games. It’s lower than your budget, but you could combine with another gift.