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Updated: Jul 16, 2021 298 Comments · by

Frugal Friday’s Workwear Report: Cap-Sleeve Blouse

The Personal Shopper (TPS) | ·

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Our daily workwear reports suggest one piece of work-appropriate attire in a range of prices.

Nordstrom’s Halogen brand is one my favorites for inexpensive, classic-looking work basics. This deep blue, cap-sleeve blouse isn’t necessarily the most exciting of purchases, but I can think of five different outfits I could build with it, just using what’s in my closet right now.

The slightly boxy fit means that you’ve got plenty of room to tuck it into a pencil skirt or trousers, but you could also leave it untucked with skinny pants and a blazer for a more casual look.

The top is $49 at Nordstrom and comes in sizes XXS–XXL. It also comes in two other solid colors (light blue and light pink) and four prints. Sizes 1X–3X are available in the pictured color as well as black, white, and eight prints.

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Sales of note for 9.10.24

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About Elizabeth

Elizabeth is a 30-something lawyer living on the East Coast. She spent seven years as a Biglaw associate in NYC, three years as a partner at a medium-sized firm, and is now in-house counsel for a large company. She loves Diet Coke, '90s sitcoms, and dresses with pockets.

Comments

  1. anon

    What exactly is a bridal shower and as a guest what do I wear or do there? My cousin (whos ~28ish) is having one and somehow I’ve made it to my mid 30s by never having gone to one of these. I know I’m supposed to bring a gift, but what else? what do I wear? We’re in Texas outside of Houston if it matters.

    • Anon

      You wear a floral sundress or a jumpsuit, you show up with a tasteful gift and drink mimosas and make small talk. There might be weird games, but just… smile and nod and giggle.

      There are weird variations on bridal showers (themed parties, some where you get the sizes of the bride’s underpinnings so you can buy them for her… which still seems weird to me but might be regional) but your garden variety bridal shower has champagne and food and cupcakes.

    • Anonymous

      They vary a lot by social circle and region, but the ones I’ve been to . . .
      Have finger food and mixing and mingling. Sometimes alcohol if that’s the group’s thing.
      The gifts are often bought from a registry or theme.
      There are often some type of games or get-to-know-the-bride activity, or a chance to say good things to the bride.
      The guests watch the bride open the gifts.
      More mixing and mingling and food.

      Dress code varies by social group and region. I’d go with “festive casual.”

    • Anon

      I’m from the northeast and my friends/ relatives are laid back people but my experience has been:

      Generally wear a sundress or similar outfit.

      Lots of finger foods/appetizers with some alcohol but not a heavy drinking event. (I’ve only been to one with a full meal)

      There’s usually some activity – either a game, a craft to make for the bride, etc. I generally hate these but they’re part of the event.

      If it’s a gift shower (yes I’ve been to giftless showers. Yes the point of a shower is the gift), you’ll watch the bride open the gifts. Someone might make a bouquet with the ribbons from the gifts. Everyone ooh’s and ah’s.

    • Aunt Jamesina

      In addition to the rest of this advice, bring a gift from the registry if there is one (likely indicated on the invitation).

    • anon OP

      Thanks all! Are there similar rules to a wedding where I’m not supposed to wear white/anything too revealing?

      • anon

        Is this real? Of course you can wear white. You’re not supposed to wear white to a wedding because the bride wears white…that’s not happening here. As to revealing, I mean it’s probably a family party with people of all ages so maybe don’t let your b00bs hang out for grandma and great aunt Edna to see?

        • Anonymous

          The current trend is for the bride to wear white to all pre-wedding events. Multiple showers, engagement party, rehearsal dinner, etc.

          • LaurenB

            The “bride wears white to everything” may be the current trend, but it seems rather twee (kind of along the lines of live-laugh-love decor), and anyway, that doesn’t mean that guests at all those pre-wedding events can’t wear white. She doesn’t own the patent on the color white. As for too revealing — why would you be wearing something revealing to a bridal shower, which is essentially a ladies’ luncheon, in the first place? It’s not a nightclub.

        • Anon

          Don’t say is this real? I’m in my fifties now but by the time I was 25 I still hadn’t been to a wedding or a shower of any sort, unless you count being a flower girl when I was 4. I remember having no idea what to do when I finally did get invited.

          For instance, I didn’t know to buy from the registry for the shower – I thought that was just for the wedding – which was more difficult then – you had to go to a physical store and ask them to look up the registry. So I bought things I just thought the bride would like. One time I think I bought my friend the bride a nice sweater.

          I look back on it and shake my head. I really could have used an advice board like this at the time!

      • Bonnie Kate

        Yes, I wouldn’t wear white or anything too revealing. Agree with all of the advice above on “festive casual”; a sundress or similar summery jumpsuit would work well.

        Tons of oohing and ahhing. At least it’s better than a baby shower, which as a childfree person I find truly mind-numbing.

        • Lash and brow tint/dye

          Both are mind-numbing. I made a decision years ago to only attend absolute command performance events. For all but that handful of people, I am out of town.

          • Bonnie Kate

            At the last baby shower I attended, I made that commitment to myself as well. At bridal showers at least the gifts are occasionally interesting to me personally. The baby shower gifts are so, so boring and occasionally absurd that the items even exist (I’m looking at you pacifier wipes).

          • Anonymous

            I hate showers of any kind with a deep hot passion, but as a single, childless woman, I have come to treat them as what they usually are — going away parties for friends, which I will always attend.

          • Anon

            “…going away parties for friends…” LOL, and sob. Because this is too often so true.

          • Anon

            Agreed. Once my own child was out of the baby stage I had no interest in babies or their accoutrements. I will go, I’ve even hosted a few, but baby showers aren’t high on my list of “ooh, can’t wait to go to that” events.

          • Glug glug

            I don’t, as long as there is booze. I’m not a wine mom stereotype except for showers. Please let me guzzle some average wine while I have a babysitter!

          • Of Counsel

            Just as the voice of the other side – in case anyone is worried that all of their guests secretly hated their showers – I love baby and bridal showers. I just really enjoy the whole process. I like seeing people so happy; I enjoy meeting friends/family of the guest of honor that I did not already know. In the case of family, it is a great chance to meet the in-laws. I like the girly food and the mimosas (for bridal showers).

            I mean not when it is the third bridal shower I have attended for this same family member with terrible taste in men or the baby food tasting ones – but in general.

      • Anon

        Just don’t wear white to be safe – people can debate all they want, but for wedding related events, white is the bride’s color, so leave it to her.

        If you wear evening/bodycon type stuff you will also feel out of place. Save that for the bachelorette.

        Agree with others to wear something daytime related but nice. Think church clothes.

        • LaurenB

          I went to a wedding pre-Covid where I wore an absolutely gorgeous Iro white silk blouse and black pencil skirt (it was the right level of formality for this event). I guarantee no one mistook me for the bride. Just like “no black at a wedding” was a stupid rule for us Olds, I’m not going to abdicate wearing the color white to pre-wedding events either. I won’t go out of my way to wear white, but I won’t trust myself in knots to avoid it either.

    • Anonymous

      One aspect I have not seen mentioned is that typically gifts at a bridal shower are gifts for the bride herself vs. gifts for the couple. I am sure that like everything, this is not a hard and fast rule.

      • Anon.

        Hmm, I think this is regional and/or dated. I suppose 90% of the gifts I received we’re kitchen or housewares, so 30 years ago that was “for the bride” versus the couple. But my husband uses kitchen gear and bath towels too….

      • Anon

        This must be regional or friend-specific because it’s not my experience (unless the invitation specifically says it’s a lingerie shower or something like that). Most showers I go to have a lot of dishes, towels, kitchen stuff, etc., that is more for setting up the household.

        • Bonnie Kate

          Same. Several bridal showers I’ve went to have even had the groom involved because he was also receiving the items for his house.

          My grandmother did give me a nighty that was specific for me. That was honestly very hilarious and made us all laugh until I cried when I held it up, because it was see through and I’m not sure she realized that it was. She was Mormon and very much the grandmother-type, not the type of grandmother who gives risqué clothing. Oh I miss her.

          • Aunt Jamesina

            Aww! A friend of mine who grew up LDS received a couple of lingerie items from church members at her shower, so perhaps it’s more common in that circle?

          • LaurenB

            Friends threw a shower for me that included my husband-to-be – the theme was “round the clock” and each attendee was supposed to bring something related to the time of day that they were assigned (of course, it wasn’t a big deal if they didn’t do that). Our friends were invited as couples, and since I was the first one of our group of friends to get married, it made it more comfortable. This was in the late 1980s. I’ve certainly heard of couples showers after that. Nothing new.

          • Anon

            I have also been to LDS showers where revealing underthings were given. They do not believe in s*x outside marriage but there was a lot of good natured talk about “keeping him happy.” (Which ALMOST made up for the lack of alcohol or coffee!)

          • anon

            The only lingerie shower I’ve ever attended was for a teenage girl from a large and very devout Catholic family (they attended a Traditional Latin Mass parish). It kind of makes sense that it would be a thing in communities that strongly discourage s*x before marriage, because in that context the wedding is (presumably) an initiation into s*xual maturity in a way it no longer is in most of America, I think.

          • Bonnie Kate

            Hahaha I love the other LDS shower stories and so interesting that that is a thing, and I think you’re right that it’s because you’re not suppose to garden before marriage so getting married opens that door. I grew up LDS but left the church as soon as I went to college (luckily am not bitter about it, unlike so many other ex-mormons understandably are); with so much of my close family still LDS I enjoy LDS cultural stories quite a bit.

          • Vicky Austin

            Lingerie showers also very much a thing in my super-evangelical, sex belongs between a married man and woman family. In fact, my aunt has been a Mega Prude around me my whole life, and then when my husband and I happened to run into her at the airport the day after our wedding, she pulled me aside to tell me to drink cranberry juice.

      • Aunt Jamesina

        I’m in the Chicago area and have never once been to a shower like this, and many are now coed. Showers are generally registry items for the couple, and maybe Aunt Edna gives a giant crystal vase and grandma makes a special handmade quilt or something. Lingerie and small bride-specific items are given at the bachelorette party (if at all).

      • LaurenB

        I think that’s dated advice from the old days. The party-throwers may *choose* to have a theme that is all-bride (like a lingerie shower) but there’s absolutely nothing inappropriate about providing gifts for the couple / household, such as kitchenware or towels or linens.

      • Anonymous

        I guess I’m in the minority, but I would follow this unless the groom is also attending the shower. I’m not sure why the groom should get a gift at a party he didn’t even attend. That said, if there’s a registry that you have been directed to in connection with the shower, get something from the registry or a gc to where she’s registered.

        • Aunt Jamesina

          In the US, showers are generally gifts for the married couple unless otherwise indicated, whether the groom attends or not (and some weddings don’t have a groom!).

        • LaurenB

          If Jane and Joe are getting married, and they’ve registered for a blender, a crockpot and some kitchen linens, you’re still getting Jane a gift if you buy her the blender, the crockpot or the kitchen linens. Just because Joe will also use them as well doesn’t make it less of a gift for Jane.

          • LaurenB

            At many bridal showers I’ve been to, the groom shows up at the very end, all the women coo over him, etc and he helps carry away the shower gifts and makes nice-nice with Aunt Edna. I have never been to a shower for a same-sex couple so I can’t comment on that either way.

    • Also Anon

      What else do you think you’d need to bring? Unless it’s labeled as a potluck, I wouldn’t worry about bringing any food or drinks to share, although you could always check with the person organizing the shower if it’s at someone’s house and you’re unsure. For the most part, you just need a gift, a card, and a positive attitude.

      I’d wear something similar to what you’d wear to a nice Sunday brunch with family; bridal showers often include the bride’s mom, maybe grandmother or aunts as well as friends, sisters, and cousins; sometimes guys are present as well, jack n jill showers are increasingly common.

  2. Love and hate in SF

    Should I move out to the suburbs? Most people I know make the decision based on kids. I don’t have kids. I love walking.

    But by some miracle most of my neighbors in my very dense building has gone on vacation on the same time. Which means I’ve never had such quiet and it is freaking glorious.

    I live in SF so buying a single family home is out of reach. I can maybe do it in the East Bay. But I’m not going crazy at the noise and not walking over poop and not afraid of getting stabbed I still love the city.

    Anyone else made the move and ended up happier than staying?

    • Anonymous

      Suburbs can mean a lot of things. I grew up in a village-sort of town that was generally walkable (some things within .5 mile; everything was within 1 mile generally) and as a kid that was awesome. Car-dependent would have been awful. As an adult, I have gravitated towards the same thing — not true city living or giant-subdivision suburbia, but somewhere with sidewalks where I can walk to a store or restaurant or some sort of place (currently, ice cream store, little grocery that makes good sandwiches, some non-fancy restaurants, a drug store, and a nail place). I’m happy there. I would not personally like a place where I had to get in my (broiling in the sun) car and drive every where and getting a garage would either be too much $ or further out still.

      • TO No-Longer-Junior

        I completely second this comment – it really depends on what you mean by suburbs. My husband and I left the downtown core of our city for a less dense area where there are still small neighbourhood pubs/restaurants/cafes and we are not dependent on a car to get everywhere, but we get way more space and quiet and peace than we had in a condo smack in the heart of downtown. We have zero regrets with our choice to move. I’ve heard these types of neighbourhoods referred to as ‘urban suburbs’ and to me that’s an apt description. Perhaps that would suit you?

        • Anon

          Yes! I’ve already identified a handful of towns I’ll move to when I leave the city and Thryre all walkable. I refuse to live a car only existence

    • Cb

      Oof I wouldn’t trade SF for the East Bay (as an east bay kid / college student who lived in SF as an adult). But it’s been 10 years since I moved abroad so who knows.

    • Depends on the person

      I think look at the decision based on a variety of factors. There are several pros and cons. I’ll tell you that my spouse and I moved to the ‘burbs with the plan to have a kid (and build equity, which wasn’t doable in the city on our salaries at the time). Though we did eventually have a child, and financially the decision to get onto the property ladder worked out well, it was weird living in the suburbs without a kid. It felt like we had all the inconveniences without utilizing the perks (like kid-friendly activities and such).

      Pros to owning in the ‘burbs:
      -More affordable property, which allows you to build wealth
      -Generally more quiet, safe, and convenient (e.g. plenty of non-crowded grocery stores, etc.)
      -More calm weekends
      -You have more space

      Cons:
      -Commute
      -Might be boring
      -Could be isolating if all your friends are somewhere else, but might not be the case
      -Home maintenance, but as someone who has tackled this more in our new house (thanks again, equity from first home :) ), it’s not too bad

      Maybe talk to a realtor and look at some places, just to feel out options?

    • Anonymous

      It’s a really bad time to buy, Covid and WFH have driven up prices in the burbs. I would wait at least a year.

    • Anon

      I’m not very familiar with housing options in the Bay Area, but can you seek out something that’s a compromise between a dense apartment building and a single-family home? For example, a townhouse or carriage house/above-garage apartment? Where I live in Boston, there are also many three-unit multi-family homes in which each floor is a single unit. So each apartment is essentially the entire floor of a house. Not sure if there are similar options in the Bay Area, though.

    • Anonymous

      Yes, I did this to get away from the rampant crime in Berkeley and feces in SF and am happier, but am also looking to relocate out of state for family reasons. For now, we pay less than $2400 a month for a large two bedroom with parking and laundry in a nice area where we feel safe. I would particularly recommend the East Bay if you are outdoorsy and can WFH, but I commuted back to the city pre-pandemic. It wasn’t ideal but can be done. Can you say more about your priorities?

    • Anon

      A lot of suburbs are all about driving; walks are just for exercise or pleasure, and it can be culturally perceived as strange to do errands on foot even when it’s possible. If you love walking, I’d try for a quieter place in the city (whether a quieter block or just a building with much better insulation).

      • Anonymous

        Huh? That is definitely not universally true. People walk for errands in my East Bay suburb all the time and even if it was “perceived” as weird, who cares?

      • pugsnbourbon

        I think this is true for some suburbs but not all. I live in the Midwest, and most of the newer burbs are definitely not walk-friendly. The older, closer-in ones usually have a “core” that’s somewhat more walkable.

    • DC pandas

      I grew up in the East Bay (Pleasanton) surrounded by walking trails & bike paths. The east bay ‘burbs are generally fairly quiet and occasionally bland town, but the combination of easy trips with BART and safety might be what you’re looking for.

    • anon

      Yes! But of course it’s all location dependent. I moved out of the “city” (more like small town but it is the state capitol) and into the suburbs and I LOVE IT. Nothing walks off my porch, there is no crime that I can find, my neighbors are friendly, my neighborhood is quiet, everyone walks their dogs . . . it’s delightful. I moved into a neighbhorhood of smaller homes that were built in the 1950s and we have a mix of the original owners who are the retirees and younger families. It’s a great mix IMO. Plus, my taxes are SO MUCH LOWER.

    • Anonymous

      There was a thread here a few weeks ago about how the suburbs aren’t really as quiet as you’d expect. If you’re not buying a SFH, you’re still going to hear people you share a wall with. You’ll also hear people mowing their lawns/blowing leaves, someone is always doing a long and noisy house project like replacing their roof or building their deck, and people feel entitled to let their dogs bark outside all day and night.

      All that said, I prefer living in the burbs. I like open spaces. I want to be able to walk outside and not come within arm’s reach of another person unless I want to. I want plenty of space in my house. I want to park in my garage and walk right inside my house; I don’t want lug around my work/gym stuff especially in bad weather, or never know where I have to parallel park, or dig out my car when it snows. I also don’t want to be house poor; I value the financial freedom that comes with having a low housing expenses. But I also can’t walk to any bars or restaurants easily. Getting together with friends takes some planning, and I get left out of impromptu hangouts with my friends who all live within a few blocks of each other. It can be lonely. It’s all about trade offs.

    • Anonymous

      I don’t know enough about SF but is there something in between? I felt similarly to you in NYC and moved to Brooklyn. Picked a neighborhood with good subway access to Manhattan and it’s own bars and restaurants. But it’s much quieter/more residential than Manhattan. Is there an equivalent? Maybe that’s what the Easy Bay is, ha, I just don’t know.

    • Anon

      Where do you live in SF? I’m in the Richmond district by the park and it’s glorious – long walks in the park, close to the ocean, it’s another world within SF. There’s also the Sunset for a similar vibe.

        • sf chic

          +1
          I actually lived in Cole Valley and loved it too. It was my peaceful “suburb” a couple blocks from the park and the Haight. Could easily walk/bike/train to almost everything I needed, and had to drive to some of the hospitals because of my crazy work hours, but it worked out well.

          All of my relatives live scattered in Silicon Valley further south/east and I would never want to live there. I am single.

          • Anon

            Hey, I live in Cole Valley! I love it – it feels like a little village within the city, and I know my neighbors and love the community. For me it’s the best compromise between city and suburban living. (Biggest downside is that it’s $$$$$)

    • Senior Attorney

      My kid is grown and gone. When I got divorced some years ago I rented an apartment right downtown and I loved it — I could walk everywhere including work, the movies, dining, shopping. I had a great view from my balcony, I loved being able to just pick up the phone for the maintenance guys if anything went wrong.

      But. I missed easy parking, I missed having a yard, I missed the quiet, and I just missed having my own SFH. So I moved five miles out and was happier than right downtown. Then I got married and moved a bit further out and still happier than staying.

      Note: When I say “right downtown” I mean “right downtown” in my largish city that is a suburb of Los Angeles. Now I am in a smaller adjacent suburb of that large suburb. Under no circumstances would I move to a far suburb.

    • Calrayo

      It depends where you want to move – I live in Oakland, and love my neighborhood for walking my dog. There are grocery stores and restaurants within walking distance, as well. I’m a few minutes (or a couple of BART stops) from downtown Oakland and its bars and nightlife. Walnut Creek, Orinda, Lafayette, etc have radically different weather and to me at least feel more like what I think of as suburbs (I grew up in the greater Sacramento area and they feel more like that – your neighborhood might be nice for walking but you kind of need to drive for groceries and other things). Berkeley’s pretty pricey, but Albany, El Cerrito, Richmond, parts of Oakland, and San Leandro are more affordable and still on BART lines if you need to commute into SF. Good luck!

    • Anon

      I’m in Berkeley so it’s sort of in between the city and the suburbs. I feel like in most suburbs you have to drive everywhere – the grocery store, restaurants, etc – but I live in a neighborhood where I can walk to everything I need – tons of restaurants, a movie theater, the post office, shops, hair salons… all that stuff. So it feels more urban than living in, say, Danville.

      Why don’t you start going to some open houses on Sunday just to see what’s out there? If you pick up the Sunday chronicle, they’ll list all the open houses. Generally they’re open 2-4 or 2-5 so you can hit a small handful if you stick to one town at a time.

  3. Anonymous

    How does Title 9 sizing run? I am usually an Athleta S or M, North Face M, and am an Ann Taylor size 10. I can’t try on locally and am not sure if this is a sporty brand for just fit people (in which case, I’m a L) or run more like North Face / Athleta. I like that they have happy colors right now.

    • 2muchathleisure

      Are you looking at their house brand, or one of the brands they sell? I have a pair of Prana Halle pants in a 10, and found their Clamber shorts a similar size (and would wear Athleta M). Kuhl on the other hand assumes more hip than I have (as does Athleta non-legging pants)

    • Anonymous

      They carry a lot of products made by other companies–and it can be hard to tell from their descriptions–so it may vary by item.

    • Anonymous

      I find a lot of the brands they sell, including their house brand, to run curvy and rather large. Which doesn’t really work on me as a person with an “athletic” (no curves) figure.

  4. Anonymous

    I moved into a place that has no full-length mirrors in it (just shorter mirrors above the vanities) and after a year at home, I’m realizing that I can’t get a true read on how my work clothes look on me now that we’re going back to the office. This is a nicer place than my prior ones (which had a mirrored shower door or nail-on mirror somewhere in a bathroom or closet door. I’ve always wanted a mirrored ballet barre set up and have a wall I could do that on, but that may be a little extra (and any handyman worth using seems very busy for small projects right now). Just by a cheap mirror from Target and prop it somewhere? A cousin has a standing mirror, but she told me it was a bit of a pet hazard with their dog and now that I have a puppy a crashing mirror would not be good.

    • Anon

      Get one of the mirrors that hangs over a door. They’re a dime a dozen now that we’re in back-to-college season.

    • Anon

      I put one of those mirrors with over the door hooks on the inside of my closet door and it’s great. Only thing is that it would swing when I opened the door which was annoying so I put the sticky velcro things that are for hanging posters to the bottom. Probably not the most high end option but it works.

    • AnonATL

      I have one of the $5 target ones. When I need it, I pull it out, prop it against the dresser and then put it back in my closet.
      My pup did paw at it and smash it to a million pieces once. Which is why it lives in my closet when not in use.

    • Anon

      I have this standing mirror: https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0038FFWJ8/

      It’s nothing fancy, but I bought it 7 or 8 years ago and it’s held up across several moves and looks fine enough for the price (it was a little cheaper when I bought it). I’ve usually had it in a large walk-in closet or corner of my bedroom, but it seems pretty sturdy and I have never had any issues with it tipping over.

    • Anon

      I would get an inexpensive full length mirror and mount it to the back of a closet door.

    • Bonnie Kate

      I love full length mirrors. The last rental we lived in was so small but had three mirror mounted on doors and it was just the best. When we moved into our new house a few months ago and had none, I decided very quickly I needed on ASAP and bought the below target one because it was big and available at the local store. So I have this one mounted on the wall between our bathroom and closet: https://www.target.com/p/24-34-x-68-34-rectangle-leaner-floor-mirror-silver-threshold-8482/-/A-50296750#lnk=sametab

      And then a couple weeks ago I won a $1000 raffle, and decided to buy this oversized West Elm mirror (with shipping ti brings it to just under $1000) – I have a perfect wall for it that’s seen from our great room. When we were building I envisioned a big mirror there and I can’t wait for this to be delivered on Monday: https://www.westelm.com/products/metal-frame-oversized-floor-mirror-h3370/?pkey=cfloor-mirrors

    • Ribena

      IKEA do standing mirrors with somewhere to hang clothing hangers on the reverse – they are pretty sturdy. I think ‘valet mirrors’ is the term?

    • Senior Attorney

      Don’t prop it because if you lean it back it will stretch out your reflection, which is nice in the moment but then you get a rude shock when you look at a mirror that is mounted straight. I agree an over-the-door mirror is what’s called for here.

  5. IPL

    Has anyone tried IPL for skin conditions? Rosacea, acne, hyperpigmentation, etc? I want to try it but I’ve heard scary stories about awful side effects.

    • editor

      I am having this next week; wish I could help. That said, I am not wary at all. I’ve had a few things burned or zapped or frozen off my face before (different places, a few derms and a couple aestheticians did it). This time it’ll be a day-spa kind of place (chosen for location.)

      Honestly, I can’t wait and only regret that I HAD to wait an extra 10 days for having had a course of antibiotics too recently.

    • London (formerly NY) CPA

      I had it done once. Side effects were fine. My face was very red and felt hot for about an hour afterwards and then calmed down. The only weird thing I noticed was the beauty marks on my face got very dark (almost black) afterwards and crusted over. But they were back to normal within a week I think. I had to be very strict about hats and sunscreen for about a week afterwards. I didn’t notice any improvement in my skin, although I know they say you need multiple treatments, but I just couldn’t deal with the hassle so never went back.

    • Anon

      I’m in the middle of a series of BBL (broadband light, not Brazilian b*tt lift) which is like IPL’s big sister. I have rosacea on my cheeks, nose, and chest – the chest is an unusual place to have it but here we are.

      It is effective. My redness is reduced after one session, and a couple of tiny brown spots I had turned dark brown and flaked off. I was redder for a couple of days after the treatment but nothing I couldn’t cover with a tinted moisturizer, and it wasn’t sore. I will have two more treatments, a month apart for each.

      I have not heard of scary side effects so can’t comment on that, but IPL has been the standard treatment for rosacea for many many years, so I wouldn’t be too worried about it.

      • Sunshine71

        +1, also did BBL for mild type 1 rosacea. It was amazingly helpful, even more than I had hoped, with no side effects. I also had small hyperpigmentation spot that flaked off. I only had one session of BBL over a year ago and my skin still looks better. I would do it again in a heartbeat.

        • Anon in LA Area

          Me too — been doing IPL every three years for 10 years (rosacea, broken capillaries and sun damage) very very light skin. I’m in the middle of BBL and found it was a better result. I plan to do my chest this year (which I have never done before). I LOVE it but think it works on light skin better (at least IPL not sure BBL).

  6. Dog whistles

    Hello wise ladies, I’m looking for a resource! I very intentionally do not subject myself to conservative/Republican media and view points. But lately on this blog I’ve noticed seemingly innocuous things (like buying American) are being called out as dog whistles. Is there a master list for this sort of stuff? I don’t want to accidentally cause an incident, but I’m also not willing to change my media habits so some sort of a reference material would be ideal.

    • anonshmanon

      Again, the thread a few weeks ago specifically referenced “Buy ‘Murican” with a whole nutty kind of patriotism-connotation. Nobody was judging people who buy American made products.

      • anon

        Yeah this is a weird post. There are people that will read weird intentions into small things but they are not the majority of people. Many people will read intentions into way over the top things like “buy ‘murican’ or something like that. Someone saying, I prefer to buy american made products is not going to raise an eyebrow because there could be about a hundred different reasons why someone may prefer to buy american (sure maybe some weird conservaitve viewpoint, but also plenty of people prefer to support the local economy, don’t like buying products made overseas because it can be harder to know if workers are being treated well, it’s more environmentally friendly to buy things made locally, etc.)

        Just because one person on the internet may make a claim that something is a dog whistle doesn’t mean that’s actually the case. Similarly, it’s weird to conflate an extreme post/viewpoint (‘murica, number one always) with an action that is not really tied to that at all (prefer to buy american made products).

        • Anon

          Just a data point: I buy American (or European) whenever possible because our environmental regulations are more stringent, and a lot of pollution overseas << less pollution here. It kind of sketches me out to pollute third world countries so I can have cheap consumer goods. Likewise, I hate what China is subjecting ethnic and religious minorities to, and I want ro support local economies. I'm a Republican and my Republican husband has the same reasoning.

          • Anon

            It’s funny how Dems here don’t see how outrageous pollution in the East w/less here but troubling economic conditions for the working class and poor is seen as virtuous. Reveals how ingrained white supremacy is in the upper class left, and how in denial they are about it.

          • Anon

            Hey Anon at 2:04, if you’re going to try to snark at people and feel smug and virtuous about “owning the libs” on a women’s fashion blog, it would be helpful to post something that actually makes some kind of sense. As it stands, what you wrote is not any kind of an “own,” and I think your Trumper friends would not be proud of you. D- effort, try again tomorrow maybe.

          • Anon

            Anon at 4:58…It doesn’t make sense to you because you are ignorant. And apparently, very politically oriented. My comments reflect reality and my observations about human nature and not partisanship. I feel terrible that you made it to this blog, and were apparently formally educated, but remain to be so…unsophisticated…when it comes to what is going on around you. You may even put the fat, toothless Walmart rednecks to shame.

    • anon

      So you want a list of innocent activities that have been labeled by some random strangers as being problematic? And you plan to change your way of life because of that? You truly will avoid buying certain products, eating at certain restaurants, watching movies with certain actors, etc just because other people say so?

      • Dog whistles

        I won’t change my actions at all no, but it will change the way I talk about them, if I talk about them at all. For example I will still buy American made (and Canadian made, European made etc) but in conversation I’ll frame it as what it really is supporting environmental regulations and worker rights. I’m just trying not to offend people or get into accidental confrontations from a simple lack of understanding.

        • Anon

          You’re overly concerned about this. The “rules” change all the time and are sometimes different for different groups of people. Be aware and be polite. If you offend someone, just apologize and say you didn’t know. This sounds like anxiety talking, to me. Remember, you can’t make everyone happy. You’re not a taco.

        • anon

          If this is something you actually care about you need to take the effort to educate yourself. I get that you don’t want to consume unpleasant media, but if you want to avoid confrontations based on lack of understanding.. you need to make the effort to understand. You can’t expect to be spoon fed scripts– you’re not going to understand the issues if you don’t think critical about it. These issues aren’t as simple as avoiding little sound bites. There is no universally agreed upon list of Condemned Phrases And Dog Whistles, 2021 Edition.

        • Anon

          Actually, there should be more awareness around these issues. But here we are trying to stifle our cultural bigotry.

    • Anon

      I don’t think so, because it’s incredibly regional in a lot of cases. In my city, I would generally be advised to live “north of the interstate” which is a euphemism/dog-whistle for the more well-to-do, white area of town. Obviously that’s not the case in other cities.
      As far as buying American being a dog whistle, I hadn’t heard that either, and I do try and buy local, wherever possible.

      • Senior Attorney

        I hadn’t heard that, either. I largely live in a blue bubble and most of my friends and I are all about buying American for a variety of reasons.

    • Anonymous

      No, you don’t need to do this. Speak how you want to speak. Be respectful of others. Be wary of others that tell you you have committed a crime with your ordinary, commonplace words.

    • Anonymous

      You would be better off exposing yourself to a wide spectrum of viewpoints in order to fully understand the context of discussions than reviewing a list of ways “super-woke” people announce their wokeness by twisting language to infer ill intent.

    • Dog whistles to avoid at all costs

      1. Women
      2. Female
      3. Biology
      4. Sexism
      5. Homosexuality
      6. Heterosexuality
      7. Science
      8. Male violence

      • Anon

        I know you’re being sarcastic, but men who refer to women as “females” are generally getting that from red pill/inception type communities and it is indeed a dog whistle.

        • anon

          That’s not entirely true. Men are generally clueless about this. I have encountered plenty of well-meaning men who say females and who have no problem switching terms when I explain why it’s women and not females. None of these particular men are involved in these types of communities, they just have not been given a reason to care for whatever reason. Yes, I KNOW, but it is what it is.

          • No Problem

            Men who have been in the military may also be predisposed to use female/male vs. woman/man. Same as chow vs. food/lunch/dinner, vehicle vs. car, weapon vs. gun, etc.

            But female is also an incel thing.

            And there is a nonzero overlap between former military and current incel.

          • Anon

            Military use of “female”to mean “women” is both 100% commonplace AND frequently has some learned misogyny behind it because of the military culture. Not always- women veterans I know have said that they just didn’t realize how weird it was to always be called “females” in the military, but there’s certainly a misogynistic edge to it with some veterans or active duty men. I worked with a veteran last summer who called women females primarily when he was saying things that were misogynistic. “Females trying to get themselves out of the military by crying rape is a big problem, you know.” “My experience was that females said they were hurt a lot more often, it got them out of PT. I don’t mean to say that females are weak, they just couldn’t always cut it.” Etc.

          • Anon

            I just know it has been my personal loved experience that when a man starts off a sentence with “females” I place of “women”, 99% of the time it is going to be followed with some misogynistic rant about females and never anything neutral.

            Especially online.

          • Anon

            I have noticed that when men talk about “females” in a non-medical context, they are doing so in a derogatory way, as if we are a different species.

    • Dog whistles

      Thanks for your help all. I was hoping there would be something akin to “don’t talk about money, gardening, or politics” but alas it appears no such thing exists. Hopefully things get better as the pandemic slows and life resumes.

      • anonshmanon

        I think the art is to both keep an open mind/not feel attacked if someone points out how some terminology you use has connotations that you were unaware of, but also follow it up by your own learning, so that you don’t end up buffeted like a plastic bag in the many opinions rushing past at 70mph, but make informed decisions about language that you use.

    • Anon for This

      I am not aware of such a list but to the posters telling OP not to worry, I suspect the issue is far broader than “Buy American”. For example, someone posted about “safe” neighborhoods a few weeks ago and someone (or maybe multiple someones) jumped on her on the claim that was racist. (And the Robin DiAngelo style of racial awareness does in fact hold that any discussions of relative safety of neighborhoods is inherently racist – although I suppose she might make an exception for majority white areas.)

      Remember a few years ago when someone on the internet decided Hawaiian shirts were a symbol of white supremacy?

      OP – in real life almost nobody is going to be offended by these types of things and I would try to be kind and not worry about it. The hyper sensitivity is mostly a social media phenomenon. Although I make it a practice to post absolutely anything that could be remotely considered controversial anonymously because things on line do have a tendency to blow up.

      • anon

        Yeah, I am by no means a reactionary of any stripe, but I no longer post anything online relating to s*x/gender politics, anything even remotely related to race, any political opinion, anything about crime in my city (which is out of control – there was a violent carjacking outside my office during rush hour yesterday), etc. because it feels like the risk of putting a foot wrong is so high and the downsides are also so high.

        Like, I used to be very active on Twitter, but when I realized I was afraid to even air the opinion that I don’t think student loan forgiveness should be our policy priority as a nation given what else we have to deal with, I stopped using it.

        • Anonymous

          I get you. (See the discussion above where a commenter suggested that casual use of the term “female” indicates alliance with or at least influence from incels.) But this is not healthy for our society.

          • Anon

            People are responding with their experiences with men using the term. Why do you need to assume what they’re saying happened didn’t happen? Or is it just not “healthy for our society” to object to misogyny.

          • Anonymous

            The poster said that use of the term “female” *generally* indicates incel. Then there are anecdotes of people’s individual experiences, posted after my comment. My comment stems from a desire for people to feel comfortable to talk more, not less, about misogyny and gender issues (and other issues, as well, but specifically that one).

          • anon

            But the counter to that is a lot of people know men (and women) who use the term “female” without being terrible people. Between my family members who are military or ex-military and my family members who are in the medical field, I know a lot of people who say female. And that does not even get into people who are deliberately drawing a distinction between biological sex and gender (which tends to overlap with medical people).

            Just are turning off a huge group of people with the language policing and they are people who might otherwise be allies. And this goes for a lot of subjects.

          • Anonymous

            Serious question. Do you legitimately think making comments this advances your cause?

    • Anon

      Buy “American”? Like Etsy or the farmer’s market? That’s MAGA now? So hard to keep up.

    • Purple

      It’s your decision and your life. I subject myself to these viewpoints because I want to know what people who I’d normally disagree with are saying and how they are framing issues. I don’t see how we can speak to “the other” if we don’t even understand their nomenclature of point of view (even if we disagree). This applies to general policy issues though, not blatant hate speech. I stick to podcasts though, because all cable news is about clickbait, ratings, and ad revenue. I think our discourse would be better if all people tried to really listen to differing POVs and hear where people are coming from. There are plenty of aholes but plenty of decent or well-meaning people too.

  7. Cb

    Friday good news?

    I got a job interview! It would be logistically complicated and my best work pal also got shortlisted but we’ve acknowledged the weirdness / crappiness of the academic job market and wished each other well.

    And I am going to cycle to the beach, meet my husband and kiddo, and eat fish and chips tonight, before tackling the preparations tomorrow.

    What is cheering you up these days?

    • No Face

      When I change my eating/exercise habits for the better, my body shape changes way before my weight. My b o o b s are now a full cup size smaller and I lost a few inches from my gut! Very happy my body decided to reduce those areas first. My weight is exactly the same, but I don’t care.

      I also had an excellent moms-only trip and it seriously refreshed me. I feel better than I have in years!

      • Anon

        Similarly, I suspected that dairy was negatively affecting my gut and cut it out for a week and I feel much better. I’m actually pretty disappointed because I looooove dairy! But feeling better is pretty great too.

      • pugsnbourbon

        Ha – I was thinking that the bright side of my recent weight gain is that my b00bs look better than ever!

        • No Problem

          Same! I’ve always been and always will be a pear no matter my size or weight, but moving from an A cup to a B cup has done wonders to balance me out even as my hips have also gotten bigger. I actually fill out the tops of dresses that are big enough to fit over my hips!

          • No Face

            My journey has been from H+ cup to DDD, so I am getting more balanced from the other direction!

    • Senior Attorney

      Yay for the interview! Good luck!

      I’m happy it’s Friday and Hubby and I are going on a long weekend getaway next Thursday.

    • Anon

      I changed out my bed linens to a new color and it makes me happy when I walk into my bedroom.

      Work wise I finished a project I absolutely hated!

    • ArenKay

      Good luck CB! Really hoping you get this job.

      I am finishing a task today that was dumped on me with no warning and no time to prep. Really looking forward to a cool drink on the deck afterwards to ease into the weekend.

    • Anon

      Good luck with the interview! For me: (1) I cleaned out my linen closet this week and it makes me so happy to look inside it now; and (2) I tried on pre-COVID jeans that I hadn’t worn in 18 months and they still fit, yahoo!

  8. Wool Blankets

    What’s the best way to store 100% wool blankets? I have two Hudson Bay Point blankets, and don’t know if it’s better to store them in a breathable blanket bag made out of fabric (like this: https://www.ikea.com/us/en/p/lackisar-storage-case-90460926/) or an airtight plastic storage bin (like this: https://www.containerstore.com/s/storage/plastic-bins-baskets/clear-weathertight-totes/12d?productId=10026213).

    I was initially leaning towards the breathable fabric bag, but the plastic bin would probably be better for keeping out pests like clothes moths. I’ve never had an issue with clothes moths, but I know they love wool, which the blankets are made out of.

    • Anonymous

      I keep mine in a storage bin with cedar chips and moth traps. I’d rather be triple safe than ruin an heirloom.

    • Anonymous

      I had a sudden moth problem some years back, and it was miserable. Ended up having to store all my wool (even blends) in the freezer to kill moth egg/larvae, and throwing away furniture with wool fabric.

      I had no idea how bad they could be before seeing all my nice wool clothes and blankets damaged.

    • Anonymous

      I think the most important thing you can do to safeguard them is to clean them before storing – that will help kill any moth eggs.

      • Anon

        It will also make them less attractive to moth larvae. They’re attracted to body oils left behind on clothing and other woolen items.

  9. Cat

    In search of recommendations for workout tanks with built-in shelf bra — these used to be easy to find, but since the current trend is the “strappy workout bra + loose tank” look, it’s gotten harder.

    Average size chest and this is for low-impact exercise (biking or walking), so not seeking or wanting anything industrial strength.

    • Anonymous

      H&M normally has one or two models.
      Uniqlo has cotton ones, if you want something more like normal clothes for walking.

    • Vicky Austin

      I’ve had my eye on the PowerSoft Strappy Shelf Bra Tank Top at Old Navy. (Also I totally hear you on this – I hate loose tanks for working out and for some reason that’s all anyone seems to be selling.)

      • Cat

        Thank you – this looks perfect! Aside from not liking to buy two pieces instead of one, the drapey tanks look awful on me – without a waistline I look like a total blob. I like that the straps of that one are on-trend with the bra look.

  10. Anon

    I appologize in advance for asking a question that’s so #2020, but I’m going hiking tomorrow and wondering if I should wear (running) leggings or (running) shorts. High is supposed to be in the low-mid-80s. My hiking pants that zip off into shorts no longer fit…

    • Anon

      Shortly, unless chafing will be a concern (but could use Body Glide or other product if so.)

    • anne-on

      I think it comes down to personal preference. I don’t find leggings add a lot of ‘warmth’ for me, and I love having the additional coverage from bugs/brush/sun, but I am also super duper pale, allergic to some local plants, live in the northeast (yay ticks) so if those aren’t a concern for you I could see shorts being cooler. Hiking in low to mid 80’s will definitely result in sweatiness!

      • No Problem

        I agree with all these reasons. Team leggings for sure. But if not, lots of sunscreen and bug repellant, careful avoidance of brush, and a thorough tick check afterwards.

    • Anonymous

      If your leggings don’t have some sort of ventilation (mesh, holes), wear shorts. Esp if it’s a muggy area like the mid-Atlantic.

    • Anonymous

      No one can answer this question for you. What kind of trail are you hiking? What are your preferences? How long are you going for? What time of day? Answer those questions yourself, consider protection from the sun, and go for it.

    • Anon

      Are you going hiking in an area with a high tick population or presence of Lyme disease? If so, go for the leggings.

    • Anonymous

      shorts with high socks and lots of bug spray, and thoroughly check for ticks when you get back.

    • Anon

      I’d go team neither. I’d wear super light and loose pants. Target sells some. This lets you get circulation and is a lot cooler than leggings. I also would wear ankle length or capri so that I can pull socks up when I need extra coverage (possible poison ivy) but can keep the socks down when I don’t need it.

    • Anon

      I’m in the land of poison Ivy and ticks and im still very much team shorts. I hate getting hot when I workout!

  11. Anon

    I hate wearing shorts. Please recommend casual summer alternatives? I’m good with Lululemon tennis skirts or Capri length leggings for exercise but I’m stumped for Capri length pants that aren’t too 1999. Jeans are a little too hot for the hottest July days… suggestions?

    • Anonymous

      Wear linen or cotton pants. If they are lightweight or flowy, they don’t need to be capri-length to be cool. There are also dresses.

    • anonymous

      I wear dresses. I like the jersey swing dresses from Old Navy. Also t-shirt dresses.

    • Anonymous

      Trousers made from seersucker or muslin (gauze) cotton are great for summer. Very thin, 100 % cotton, or cotton and linen blends.

      Have seen them at places like COS, &Other stories and Brooks Brothers.

    • Anonymous

      made well Hudson pants. I got these for visiting India and wanting to be respectful and more covered up despite the heat and humidity and found them really breezy and comfy

    • Halle

      Other thank work out clothes, I only wear dresses in the summer. If chub rub is an issue (like it is for me), I LOVE Jockey slip shorts. So light weight, not compression (so comfortable) and no chub rub.

    • anon

      I recently bought Athleta’s studio wide leg pant for this reason, and I liked them. They are loose and lightweight.

    • Anon

      Agree with all the linen pants suggestions. On the hottest days you’ll find me in a loose linen too (with loose sleeves because being covered is actually more cooling than baking your skin in the sun) and linen pants. Do I look like I belong on an ashram? Yes. Do I care? No.

  12. former DTLArette

    A rare poster coming back to say: I just wanted to send some love into the Hiverse for Senior Attorney, who not only mailed me a wedding card and gift this week but also sent some Icelandic candy our way :) You are a gem of a person, and I am so glad this site brought us together as friends.

    To all of those who wonder what she’s like in person: she’s even better than you think :)

    • Explorette

      That’s so sweet! It’s very cool to see friendships created from this site. I have benefited from Senior Attorney’s wise advice through the years and appreciate her greatly! Congrats on the wedding and love to you both!

    • Lobby-est

      Wow, that’s great! Remember when Cat did a survey a few years back asking if we’d attend a Corporette conference? I was a “yes” because I’d love to meet the helpful, kind, and wise woman whose wisdom and outlook has helped me so much over the past few years. Senior Attorney – you are wonderful.

    • Kelsey

      Yes, Senior Attorney and her sound advice is what keeps me coming back to thissite!

    • Anon

      Wow! I have never met SA but love and respect her from afar :) I feel your excitement.

  13. Anonymous

    I want to put a green streak in my blonde hair but am nervous about it showing at work (starting a new job soon in a leadership role). Is there a way to do this so that you can essentially part/style your hair to hide it? I don’t have very thick hair and the color difference will be big.

    • anonshmanon

      look at hidden rainbow hair. Very pinterest-y, but if you just do one color, it’s way less maintenance. I don’t know that it will be completely invisible, but just not obvious. FWIW, I always appreciate when leadership at my org pushes the envelope a bit, or otherwise signals that they are actual humans.

    • Anonymous

      I think you have to accept that it’s likely to show. It’s better if it looks deliberate anyway. So I’d either embrace it or wait a bit until you get a better sense of new office’s norms. I’m in a creative industry in an urban setting, and a lot of coworkers have tattoos and nose rings. But I can tell you that the highest leadership is much more conservative, especially behind closed doors (one even pushed for a “no leggings”rule in our dress code, even though you’ve got a bunch of folks in jeans and sneakers). If I were advising someone on career advancement, I’d suggest waiting until folks get to know you first and you can better read the room. (Even if it isn’t anti-bright colored hair, you may feed into a bias that you’re too young for a lot of responsibility. I know no one wants to hear this–but it’s the reality in some offices. There’s a lot of judgment on new hires and ridiculously closed-mindedness out there, even if it’s not fair.)

      • Anonymous

        This is exactly my worry/thought process…so thank you for stating it. And I’m not in a creative industry but also not super conservative.

    • Anonymous

      I’ve seen people put the streak underneath their hair (the rainbow under thing mentioned below). Or do a dip dye where they just dye the last 1-3 inches of their hair a fun color. Then they wear their hair in a bun to work.

    • Anon

      I have black hair and work in house as a corpoarte lawyer in a pretty conservative company. I have had blue streaks in my hair. I think my situation was different because the blue blended in pretty well. However, my advice is that if you are going to do this you need a top notch colorist. This is not a home dye situation (not that you are suggesting that). You can get away with a lot if it’s done well.

      • sf chic

        I saw the most beautiful deep purple blended into black hair. Yes, it really matters which colors/colorist etc..

    • Cat

      Ha, I commented below. Oppos-te of hysteria here. I’d wishlisted 6 things, and 5 of them were sold out before I could even shop, so… sad trombone here.

      • Anon

        I didn’t have a huge wishlist, but most was sold out. I couldn’t be bothered to order the minor items that are still in stock. Freed from the tyranny of the NSale!

    • Anon

      What does this say about me that I looked at this for a solid 60 seconds thinking, ‘Why would there be a hysteria on babies going through withdrawal?’

      (Because to me, NAS = Neonatal Abstinence Syndrome.)

      …that post makes so much more sense when I realized it meant Nordstrom Anniversary Sale.

      • Anonymous

        Hehe. I actually googled NAS to get an idea of what it was – and got a lot more confused. Not until I saw Cat’s post later that I understood what the post was about. :D

        On topic, I remember a lot more fuss about this sale in previous years, but always with a this-year-it’s-not-as-good-as-before current.

    • busybee

      Last year the NAS annoyed me because every single Instagram influencer posted about it incessantly. This year I actually had a few things I would have liked to get, but the sale annoyed me because 1. Most of the items I wanted were not part of the sale and 2. 3/4 things on my wishlist are sold out. I generally really like Nordstrom but I’m totally over the NAS.

    • Anon

      I bought a couple of things through a makeup artist I know who works there, so I was able to get them set aside before they sold out. But I didn’t buy a single piece of clothing this year. I bought a down comforter, which is not sold out, and a bunch of the supergoop sunscreen sets, many of which did sell out so I’m glad I went through her.

      It feels so grown up to be buying a comforter and sunscreen instead of the nearly complete fall wardrobe I used to buy, but I work from home now and here we are.

  15. Anonymous

    Dumb financial question! I understand that with FIRE, you invest a large amount of money in index funds and sell less than 4% of the value of the investment to live off of. Does that work in a microcosm? For instance, if I invested $100,000, could I withdraw $4,000 a year and not touch the principal?

    Caveat, I have been investing for retirement for YEARS, but have literally never sold any funds. Big law means I’ve not been faced with cash flow issues since I started with the firm. However, I t’s been buy and hold (or rebalance) forever. I was thinking about how I could set myself up to pay large insurance bills annually once I leave big law (disability insurance is worth it but so pricey) and started thinking about selling instead of just buying at Vanguard.

    • Anonymous

      Have you considered an HSA as an investment vehicle? Maybe research one of those and whether it is available to you.

    • No Problem

      If the market goes up at least 4% per year, yes that would work. In reality you’re going to have up years and down years, so you may have times when you dip below the $100k principal, and others when you get far above it.

      And I think the idea with FIRE (for many if not most people, anyway) is to have multiple streams of income such that you no longer have to work a full time job but earn enough to pay your expenses. That could include owning real estate that you rent out that is cash flow positive, freelancing a little here and there when you feel like it, earnings from an Etsy store or other similar business, and yes investments in the market.

      • Anon

        This is where I feel like I get confused between FIRE and “downscaled living,” because a lot of people who say they practice FIRE and are “retired,” really are not, they work as much or more than I do. They just don’t have a 9-5 day job.

        My husband has a friend from college that by some FIRE definitions has functionally been “retired” since they were 24 years old, because he never went out and got a day job. He’s cobbled together a living from freelance writing, doing woodworking jobs for people, selling things he finds on the side of the road or at thrift stores on eBay, working on fishing boats in Alaska for a season at a time, and now he has income-producing real-estate. He was never interested in the 9-5 lifestyle and never lived it. I would say he probably makes less than $35k a year (in a good year), is single/no kids at 50, and is happy as a clam but I doubt he has savings, and I know he doesn’t have health insurance, even through the exchange. So is he “retired” or is he just a minimalist?

        • Aunt Jamesina

          If he’s reliant on his income to cover his expenses, then he definitely isn’t. I think where it gets murkier is when you have people (like Mr Money Mustache or Frugalwoods) who don’t need their income to cover their expenses, but continue to work. In their case, I think it’s more like “I could retire but choose to work”, but I don’t have that big of an issue with saying they’re retired. On a smaller scale, my mom is retired with a pension, but works a part-time job because she likes it and and it gives her some extra fun money. I consider her retired.

    • Anonymous

      Theoretically yes. But if you have a cash cushion that lets you vary how much you take out every year, you’re more likely to be successful — i.e. you can withdraw nothing or only 1-2% if the market does badly that year. Look up variable withdrawal rates. You might want to also consider dividend funds — I’m not an expert at this but some people in the FIRE community swear by them.

    • anon a mouse

      Theoretically yes, but don’t forget to think about the tax implications when estimating what you will actually net from your sales. Also if you withdraw literally what you gain, you run the risk of having down years where you can’t withdraw anything. I’ve seen some rules of thumb to withdraw 75% of gains or even less than that in really good years so you give yourself a buffer for the bad years.

    • Anon

      It’s based on historical returns. If you withdrew 4% every year without consideration as to whether it was an up year or a down year, you’d come out even or ahead over every historical horizon they tested. You need to do it over several years to make it work. If you had invested up until 2008 and then decided to withdraw only in 2009 that would be a different story but generally it works.

    • PistachioLemon

      Also, don’t forget that you can turn off the “automatically reinvest dividends” and that would get you ~1.36% (pre-tax) of your stock portfolio (that’s the S&P %) each year.

  16. Cat

    Can I just gripe for a minute? All but 1 of the things in my NAS wish list were sold out already *yesterday.* I’ll check back periodically for restocks since there is one thing in particular I want for an upcoming trip, but overall I’m just feeling disappointed in the brand…

    • Anon

      I think many people going back into the office and clothing manufacturers haven’t caught up. Ann Taylor was almost sold out of huge numbers of work appropriate dresses. Brooks Brothers just transitioned to this FILA collaboration and now everyone is is buying work appropriate attire. Same with Nordstrom.

      • Anonymous

        Idk I think it’s a different problem when things are sold out before the sale is even open to cardholders (at least, those who spend less than $5k/year). I’m also annoyed at the inflated spend required to reach a new level of cardholder benefits. It used to be like $2k/year got you to a higher level, now it’s $5k. Ridiculous.

      • Cat

        FWIW, absolutely 0% of my wish list was officewear. Earrings, dress, jeans, leggings, bral-tt-.

    • AES

      I was surprised to be able to order most of the stuff I wanted this am. The one thing I didn’t get was a shirt-jacket that I really don’t need anyway. Several things that I ordered are now listed as sold out, so I am keeping my fingers crossed that my orders don’t get cancelled.

  17. anna y. mous

    Any recommendations for a place to buy interesting, preferably asymmetrical, statement earrings? Prefer yellow gold, price range <$200.

  18. anon

    Hi! Going on a beach vacay soon and I’ve been bad about reading. I’d love some recs on beach reads, please. Thanks!

      • anon

        Adding to the TJR love, Daisy Jones and the Six goes down easily but sticks with you. Also recently read and liked Imposter Syndrome by Kathy Wang (Silicon Valley spy thriller that also satirizes gender politics in tech in a very satisfying way).

    • Ribena

      Emily Henry’s newest is excellent. Also Robinne Lee’s The Idea Of You which is thinly veiled Harry Styles fanfiction.

    • Anonymous

      Beach Read by Emily Henry
      Anything by Jasmine Guillory (you could start with the first book in her series – the Wedding Date)
      Worth the Wait by Doree Shafrir
      Such a Fun Age by Kiley Reid
      One True Loves by Taylor Jenkins Read
      Red White and Royal Blue
      The American Royals series

    • Anon

      One to Watch by Kate Stayman-London
      The House in the Cerulean Sea by TJ Klune
      Nine Perfect Strangers by Liane Moriarty (the premise is ridic but I LOL’d multiple times, and the show coming this Fall looks great!)

      • Senior Attorney

        I think anything by Liane Moriarty would be a great beach read! I blew through her entire oeuvre after watching Big Little Lies on HBO.

        • Anon

          Yes! Loved Big Little Lies, the book and the show. I think they should definitely make The Husband’s Secret into a show, but I’m so stoked for Nine Perfect Strangers because the show looks almost like it will be better than the book.

    • Vicky Austin

      I absolutely TORE through Ruth Ware’s One by One. It’s set in the Alps, so disregard if that’s antithetical to your idea of a beach read, but man I could not put it down. Once you start you will absolutely have to finish it!

      • anonymous

        I love all of Ruth Ware’s book. Riley Sager is also good for mystery/thriller.

        Recently finished A Court of Thorns and Roses from Sarah J. Mass

          • Vicky Austin

            That’s funny, SA, I could have sworn I heard about it from your post on a book rec thread! Oh well, hope you both enjoy!

      • Saguaro

        I just read Mayumi and the Sea of Happiness by Jennifer Tseng, and it reminded me a bit of Eleanor Oliphant is Completely Fine. It was a weird book and a weird subject, but I liked it!

    • Anon

      I’ll also recommend Nine Perfect Strangers and Red White and Royal Blue (but I HATED the second book by this author that just came out). For more of a thriller, I just finished Falling, written by a former flight attendant and thought it was pretty entertaining, but don’t read if you’re a nervous flier. I also liked The Plot.

    • Ribena

      Oooh! Anything by Laura Wood but especially Under A Dancing Star which is set in 1930s Tuscany.

        • Ribena

          If you like Laura Wood, Eva Ibbotson’s novels are similarly swoop-y and swoon-y. Laura however has the advantage of being very much alive – her next comes out in October.

    • Anon

      If I can tag onto this, I would also like recommendations. I like novels with a little bit of smut, but literary smut, not bad-writing smut. Would love recommendations for those!

      • Ribena

        I will always recommend Red White & Royal Blue!

        There’s also Charlotte by Helen Moffett (only a little smut but very well written), and I enjoyed Spoiler Alert by Olivia Dade (lots of smut)

  19. Anonymous

    You guys, my most recent ex-bf (from pre-pandemic days) is getting married this weekend. I’m sitting here having a pity party at work, not because I want him per se, but more because I am so jealous that he gets to get married while I have never been more single and lonely. As I close in on 40, I feel like I missed my window to meet someone and have a family. It’s so unfair that everyone else has found someone to love them. I’m not even sure what I’m asking here… just putting it out into the universe in hopes that acknowledging my unhappiness will help somehow?

    • anon

      I really understand these feelings as someone who was single for virtually all of her thirties. Let yourself have your sad feelings for long enough to let you fully admit the crappiness of the situation, without dragging you into a sad-shower-crying spiral, and then do something that you truly love. Something that doesn’t give you the “this is fun but would be more fun with a partner” feeling – something that you can fully enjoy as who you are and where you are right now.

      There are lots of people with stories here of meeting their person and starting families at your age or later (I’m one of them), but I know it doesn’t help when it hasn’t happened for you.

      • Anonymous

        Out of curiosity, what are some of the “this is fun but would be more fun with a partner” things you enjoy?

        • ANON

          Travel, shows, museums, walks in the park, going out to dinner. Many things.

    • Anon

      I’m 36 and feeling the same way…like my chance is coming to end. I could kick myself for not dating more seriously in my 20s.

      • Anon

        I feel this strongly, I would like to tell my 27 year old self to get serious about meeting more people.

        While I go through periods of sadness, I try (emphasis on try) to also focus on what I like about my life now. Flexibility to travel, eat the food I want, and spend time with friends even those are married with kids (rocking auntie over here).

        Know that you have company in this sense of loss

      • Anonymous

        I’m 43 and met my spouse at 36, was very lucky and had a baby at 40. I also wish I had dated more in my 20s. Here’s what I wish I had done differently in my 30s: I wish I had frozen some eggs and some embryos. In my 30s I felt like it would be selfish to have a baby on my own. I no longer think so, for a variety of reasons (including that the pressure I felt to get coupled led me to make questionable relationship decisions).

    • Alice

      You should be happy that you are not marrying him because he strung you out and took advantage of you during your most fertile years. Now that you are closing out on 40, all is not lost. You can still find a guy to date, mate and marry, tho you may have to go a little older, and consider men who have already married and divorced (with our without kids). I recommend you go to your local pastor and ask him/her if there are eligible men in the congregation that you could meet. I am sure that he/she will be able to recommend someone (if not him/her self). Good luck to you!

    • Anon

      Hugs. You should do something fun or indulgent. Also, take a long shower and wash that man (who you don’t want anyway) right out of your hair. He is not for you. After indulging yourself for a day, a weekend, a week, whatever you decide, put it behind you and live your best life. If you want kids and a husband, it is still possible (I adopted at 38 and married at 42).

  20. Anon

    Random push as I try to stay cool in this heat wave; wear the shorts/ wear the swimsuit. Visible veins, stretch marks, scars? Too damn hot to stay covered up (unless that’s what is truly your preference.) Loving Athleta Farallon shorts and a basic Lands End Tugless Tank.

  21. Anon

    I am the poster who was looking for a more voluminous crossbody bag a couple of weeks ago. I ordered and returned the Cuyana double loop bag – it was a gorgeous bag and I love my totes from them, but the strap wasn’t long enough on me (tall and large) to be a cross body.

    I ended up ordering the mini crossbody tote from Portland Leathergoods. I actually saw it on an ad on Instagram (here’s a case where the targeted ads really knew what I was looking for!) and I got some kind of discount code for signing up for email.

    I like it. I got sort of a darker tanned leather color in Honey. It’s a good neutral and goes with all the colors I wear. I like the size of it. The leather is sturdy. It’s not as luxurious as the Cuyana but it seems like it will last a long time, and was about 1/3 of the price. And it’s long enough to be a crossbody on the longest strap setting. Overall I’m really happy with it!

    Thanks for all your suggestions!!

  22. Anonymous

    Beauty Qs I’m sure have been discussed a million times:

    1) Does anyone have lash extensions, and how do you like them?
    + Do you still wear mascara while you have them?
    + If you wear mascara or eyeliner, do you find it difficult to remove your eye makeup with them?
    + Do you feel the urge to pick at them or do you forget they are there?

    2) What are some lesser known beauty services that have made your morning routine easier that you’ve tried? Has anyone done permanent lip color or “blushing”?

    • Cat

      Not extensions, but I started using Revitalash last year, and it has made a fabulous difference in my lashes. They were average length and fairly straight, now they are long with a slight curl up to them. Bonus is you don’t have to baby them the way you do extensions, and a tube lasts a *long* time once you’re happy with the length and convert to maintenance mode.

      I still wear mascara but I did actual before and after pics (closed eyes, no mascara) and the difference is noticeable, several more mm’s in length.

    • CHL

      I know this is not exactly what you asked, I just had my second lash lift and tint on the advice of this board and I am super into it. I have stick straight lashes and hooded eyes and it makes such a difference. I still wear mascara. The lady recommended using micellar water to remove make up and that has been fantastic.

    • Meara

      Not sure you’ll see this but I have gotten lash extensions a few times. I love them, except for the price! For starters you should be able to get a Groupon or something for the initial appointment to be cheaper, but then you have to go every 3 weeks or so to keep it looking good. That said, I normally don’t wear mascara much because I feel like I just end up with it smearing by the end of the night, and with extensions every time I look in the mirror I’m all “oh pretty!” I don’t wear mascara on top (zero need) and sometimes wear less eye makeup than I normally would too, because I don’t feel like I “need” it as much.

  23. Anonymous

    Does anyone know what the difference is between the True & Co. bralettes sold on Nordstrom versus Target? I have some of the Target ones, and they are wonderful. From Target they are $23, and Nordstrom $49. I haven’t tried one of the Nordstrom ones, but I can’t tell the difference just based on the descriptions. Links below to what look to me like two identical products..

    https://www.target.com/p/true—co–true-everybody-women-s-v-neck-bra—black-xl/-/A-54201613

    https://www.nordstrom.com/s/true-co-true-body-v-neck-bralette/6204991?origin=category-personalizedsort&breadcrumb=Home%2FWomen%2FClothing%2FLingerie%2C%20Hosiery%20%26%20Shapewear%2FBras%20%26%20Bralettes&color=653

    • Cat

      I’ve tried both! They look very similar, it’s true. The material feels a little different in person. If you’re happy with the fit and longevity of the Target ones, no need to go to the next tier. As a data point, I’ve gotten probably 30 weeks’ wear out of my Nordie’s True since March 2020, and the fabric just started to tear at the opening where the removable cups are inserted in the last few weeks. I picked up the Target one more recently so not sure if it will have a similar life expectancy.

  24. Anonymous

    Any recommendations for how to actually reach to a divorce/family attorney? I’m trying to help my friend get someone for her custody situation in Charlotte, NC. She’s left voicemails, submit a blurb about her situation with contact info on firm sites, and sent some emails. It’s been a week and she hasn’t heard from anyone.

      • Anon

        Sorry, I missed the part about voice mails. I’d not bother with the other forms of communication (or non-coummunication) and keep calling.

        • Anon at 3:58

          Sorry for the slightly snarky reply– I saw your response here when I posted mine!

          And I agree that it’s a good idea to keep calling. If you have a friend who you can name as a referral, that can sometimes help get a call back as well.

      • Anon

        OP said she’s left voicemails, which I think means she’s used the phone…

    • Kelsey

      She needs to get a referral from another lawyer that she knows. Lawyers are much more likely to respond when it’s not a cold call but a referral from another lawyer (this same concept works for doctors too). So, ask any lawyer friends, a lawyer mom from her kids’ schools, etc. for a referral to a divorce lawyer. They should all know at least 1 person practicing in this area.

  25. Anonymous

    I can’t seem to keep my face moisturized no matter what I do. I currently use a moisturizing toner and a moisturizing cream (including a sleep mask at night), and I’ll often have to reapply the night moisturizing mask again an hour after my nightcare skin routine right before I go to bed. No matter how moist my face prep is in the morning, my foundation still has dry patches within a couple hours (and the issue is not the foundation or setting routine). There’s certain patches of my face that just always want to become dry and patchy again.

    What’s the solution? Do I need to start integrating an oil into my routine? Is there a super duper moisturizing serum that’s going to solve this? Do I need both an oil *and* a serum? I know the issue is not my cleanser, moisturizer, toner, or makeup products and routine, all of which I have done a lot of research on and experimenting with different products.

    • Anon

      You say you know that you know that none of your products are the issue, but how do you know this? I have extremely sensitive skin and one of the reactions I get to a lot of products, including a lot of moisturizers, is just patches of dry peeling skin. My skin actually looks best when I use absolutely nothing on it other that a very mild cleanser in the shower each morning, followed by a little moisturizer. Every time I deviate from this, I end up with bad reactions, even with products that are supposed to be mild and free of potentially irritating ingredients.

    • Beans

      Have you been to a dermatologist? I get these patches and my dermatologist diagnosed it as some sort of dermatitis, prescribed a cream, and it cleared up within about a week. I still get the patches on occasion, use the cream, and it clears up. I’d be careful about adding another product without seeing a dermatologist.

    • Anon

      It could be your foundation. You also might want to add a hydrating serum like hyaluronic acid.

    • Anonymous

      I’m very very sensitive to alcohol in any form. I thought for years I had dry skin but I was just abusing my face. Even ‘gentle’ products often have alcohol as a preservative, I switched to a local company without any alcohols and it’s worlds better.

    • No Problem

      Are you exfoliating at all? You can’t moisturize dead skin, you have to remove it. I know that physical exfoliation is pooh poohed, but I find that applying my face wash with a soft wet washcloth instead of my fingers a few times a week makes a big difference in how dry my face is and how many flaky patches I get.

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