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Our daily workwear reports suggest one piece of work-appropriate attire in a range of prices.
Diane von Furstenburg’s recent collaboration with Target has spurred some discussion online about whether the wrap dress is a “dated” look in 2024. For my two cents, the look is a classic, but in a post-2020 world, everyone is a bit more casual, so there are just fewer situations in which a wrap dress feels appropriate.
Fortunately, if you are a wrap-dress-lover who happens to work in a formal office, that seems like one of the few remaining places where the dress will shine. I love this midi-length silhouette from DvF for a slightly more updated look.
The dress is $398 and comes in sizes S–XXL.
With a different style but also a fun orange print (and a lower price) is this dress from AllSaints that's $169 in straight sizes at Nordstrom.
Sales of note for 8.30.24
- Nordstrom – Summer Sale, save up to 60%
- Ann Taylor – 30% off full-price purchase; $99 jackets, dresses & shoes; extra 50% off sale
- Banana Republic Factory – 50-70% off everything + extra 20% off
- Bergdorf Goodman – Final Days Designer Sale, up to 75% off; extra 20% off sale
- Boden – 20% off
- Brooks Brothers – Extra 25% off clearance
- Eloquii – Up to 60% off everything; extra 60% off all sale
- J.Crew – 40% off sitewide; extra 60% off sale styles
- J.Crew Factory – Extra 20% off orders $125+; extra 60% off clearance; 60%-70% off 100s of styles
- Lo & Sons – Summer sale, up to 50% off (ends 9/2)
- Madewell – Extra 40% off sale; extra 50% off select denim; 25% off fall essentials
- M.M.LaFleur – Save 25% sitewide
- Rothy's – End of season sale, up to 50% off
- Spanx – Lots of workwear in the big sale, some up to 70% off
- Talbots – 25% off regular-price purchase; 70% off clearance
- White House Black Market – Up to 70% off sale
NYC recs
I know folks often recommend particular sites in NYC, but I’m looking for the best ways to find out current/one-off activities….newsletter, websites, Instagram account? thanks!
Anonymous
Katie Romero has a tiktok and IG account – lots of fun little of-the-moment things.
Just Me
Some of the IG accts I browse for unusual places and things to do are “secret_nyc” and “nyclovesnyc”.
Anon
Looking for mother of groom dress for early October wedding. Like: long length, short or cap sleeves, v-neck or other open neck/not high neck, deep jewel tone blue or purple, lighter fabrics (not heavy lace or beading, brocades or large volume fabric), column or sheath. I’m a size 8-10 with dark hair. What I don’t like: the muddy, earth tones, matronly looks with heavy fabrics. Not finding what I like at Nordstrom…please help or give recs.
Notinstafamous
What about reformation? They have some nice options! Links to follow.
Notinstafamous
https://www.thereformation.com/products/daniela-silk-dress/1314260.html
https://www.thereformation.com/products/nayeli-dress/1315035.html
https://www.thereformation.com/products/ezria-dress/1314702.html
Anon
A little low cut for Mom at a wedding, no?
Anonymous
LOL I’d say.
Jules
The second one doesn’t seem inappropriate necessarily, it would depend on how it fits the OP. But a friend of mine was all but falling out of her MOB dress at her daughter’s wedding, the pictures are kind of shocking, so yeah, too low-cut would be bad.
Anon
I had good luck at Macys online for recent MOB and MOG dresses. I ordered several and then returned to the store. I gave up on cap sleeves and got a wrap.
anon
Tadashi Shoji?
Anon
My mom wore a beautiful Tadashi Shoji brocade dress for my wedding so I second this! Marchesa Note also has some options that would work well, link to follow
Anon
Beautiful
Anon
https://www.theoutnet.com/en-us/shop/product/marchesa-notte/dresses/midi-dress/sequined-tulle-midi-dress/1647597329104539
Senior Attorney
Oof! That’s gorgeous!
Anon
Insert “I want that” gif here.
Anon
Dillards or dillards.com . Regional southern chains do MOB/MOG very, very well.
Anon
Good idea!
Cat
Take a look at Rickie Freeman for Teri Jon (NM carries it for sure) – lovely options that are both short and long, sleeves and no.
Anon
Op here thx for the lead!
Anon
I’d wear this
https://ullajohnson.com/collections/dresses/products/letty-dress-jadeite-green
Work Phone
Love that color!
Anon
Yes! Op here…that’s what I am looking for!
Anonymous
I would check out the options on Rent the Runway
Anon
I’m glad you like it OP! Recommender here. FWIW, I have never regretted an Ulla dress purchase, they’re my most worn dresses in my closet. I also usually end up altering the necklines a little as they tend to be cut low. They’re perfect with a little nip tuck.
emeralds
That dress is stunning.
Anonymous
Holy Hannah that is gorgeous.
Anon
Wow! How does Ulla Johnson sizing run? Am now down a rabbit hole of secondhand dresses, the prints are stunning
Anon
OP recommender here, I’d say they’re TTS but a little on the smaller side of “true.” I usually size up and alter a bit (I’m big busted and the lower cuts are too low for me).
Work Phone
What about sequins? I found this for the wedding guest poster below, but it might work for you (unless it’s too light): https://tinyurl.com/522aprma
Anon
my mom wore this to my sister’s wedding and generally the dresses made by this brand are very lightweight
https://www.saksfifthavenue.com/product/teri-jon-by-rickie-freeman-off-the-shoulder-metallic-jacquard-gown-0424726121991.html?dwvar_0424726121991_color=SAPPHIRE
Anon
Yes! OP here thank you!
anonchicago
Check out Alex Evenings line at Dillards. My mom’s MoB dress had similar features and that’s where she found several options a few years ago.
This might fit your criteria: https://www.dillards.com/p/alex-evenings-matte-jersey-cowl-neck-pleated-long-gown/509325223
NY CPA
Adrianna Papell is my go to for long formal dresses. I also recently got a gorgeous magenta dress from Ralph Lauren. L1nks to follow.
NY CPA
https://www.adriannapapell.com/collections/long-mother-of-the-bride-dresses/products/beaded-blouson-mermaid-gown-with-sheer-dolman-sleeves-in-dusty-emerald-ap1e210622
https://www.adriannapapell.com/collections/long-mother-of-the-bride-dresses/products/chiffon-and-crepe-mermaid-gown-in-hunter-ap1e208559
https://www.adriannapapell.com/collections/long-mother-of-the-bride-dresses/products/hand-beaded-blouson-long-gown-with-flutter-sleeves-in-french-blue-ap1e209547
https://www.adriannapapell.com/collections/long-mother-of-the-bride-dresses/products/beaded-mermaid-gown-with-dolman-sleeves-in-ultra-blue-ap1e210884
https://www.adriannapapell.com/collections/long-mother-of-the-bride-dresses/products/stretch-knit-crepe-long-faux-wrap-mermaid-gown-in-rich-royal-ap1e210421
https://www.adriannapapell.com/collections/long-mother-of-the-bride-dresses/products/one-shoulder-draped-jersey-gown-with-floral-sequin-accents-in-brilliant-sapphire-ap1e211115
https://www.adriannapapell.com/collections/long-mother-of-the-bride-dresses/products/stardust-pleated-draped-one-shoulder-gown-in-brilliant-sapphire-ap1e208794
https://www.adriannapapell.com/collections/long-mother-of-the-bride-dresses/products/one-shoulder-long-satin-crepe-mermaid-gown-in-wild-orchid-ap1e209309
Cat
I think they can be styled in a modern way, but part of the reason they don’t feel super current is the migration away from clothes that are annoying to wear. Wrap dresses are the equivalent of a pinchy underwire bra as you go about your day – if you’re not wearing a cami, making sure the neckline behaves. If you are wearing a cami (required for everyone but the model it seems), it starts bunching up under the dress. You either have to add a slip or hold the skirt down in the slightest of breezes. Yes, you can try the safety pin trick to prevent a serious wardrobe malfunction, but getting that to look truly hidden is another headache of fussing with the placement.
Slipping on a pretty blouse and pants is SO much easier!
Anon
Yup…I just donated a couple dresses that had a wrap top because of the wardrobe malfunction issue. I liked the dresses, but not enough to keep them.
PolyD
I like the faux wrap dresses, where it kind of looks like a wrap dress but everything is fastened down. The neckline and a fitted waist work well for me.
Anon
Faux wraps are the best wraps. Or ones that have decorative frog closings all the way around (maybe not a daytime look).
Anon
+1 on the faux wraps. They suit my shape well. I don’t really wear them to work anymore, but I have a few that are cute brunch/church/date night options that I’m holding onto. And no wardrobe malfunctions or fussing with the safety pins.
Anon
Big busted girl here so I understand why, but I cannot stand the look of an obviously pinnned point at the bustline of a wrap dress. It just breaks up the line and drape and creates an awkward shape. I know it’s hard to find a dress to fit the girls, but the pin is ugly.
Anon
+1!
California
I will be the voice of dissent and say that I actually like this version. Agree that the wrap from 10-15 years ago looks dated but the longer midi length updates this for me in a way that I like. Would wear.
Anon
I would wear this shape dress in a faux wrap and a more rosacea-friendly color.
anon
Yep. I flat-out refuse to wear stuff like this anymore. I cannot stand having to constantly rearrange my clothes.
Anon
There’s a migration away from uncomfortable clothing but the death of skinny jeans makes clothing more annoying across the board. Now I need multiple versions of my pants hemmed for different heel heights, staying on top of laundry is more important, if I don’t wear a fitted top I look sloppy or heavy…I miss the days of jeans requiring zero thought.
anon
And the move to looser, slightly cropped jeans (which is what all the fashion-forward people are doing in my ‘burb) is deeply, deeply unflattering on some of us. I don’t need to look skinny, but this ain’t cute. I feel all kinds of frumpy and lumpy in a way that I haven’t in years. I swear, the current trend patterns, combined with perimenopause, are contributing to some mild body dysmorphia. I hate how everything looks.
PolyD
Yeah. I like the cropped pants look because it ameliorates some of the hem and shoe issues as mentioned above. But everything else is harder! It is much more difficult to find tops that work. And talk about fussy clothing! Tucking shirts into pants is one of the most fussy things around! Making sure it’s tucked neatly, not leaving bulges, or trying to make sure that the button placket doesn’t stick out at the bottom leaving you with a nice little point above your waist. A wrap dress is less work!
Between menopausal body shape changes and just not getting dressed that often (I am still mostly teleworking) it takes a lot more mental effort to get dressed these days!
anon
YES! Tucking is such a pain.
Anon
I see so much denim straining across stomachs and/or butts. I wouldn’t have thought skinny jeans would be kinder cuts, but it seems that current denim is strangling our midsections. Rise? Cut? Non-stretch fabric? We should all just go up a few sizes because some pants look to be painful — we have come too far to go back to wedgies and camel-toe.
anon
True story, it took me several tries to realize that high-waisted jeans were causing digestive issues and stomach pain. Took me a bizarrely long time to figure out I was only having these issues when I wore high-rise pants. And I swear to you, they were the correct size and still had some wiggle room in the waist.
Anon
To be honest, I’m skipping it. At least so far. I’m fine with straight legs (not skinny) for now.
Eliza
Same. I don’t have the bandwidth anymore for jeans in a variety of lengths to accommodate different shoes. And if it isn’t flattering, I’m not wearing it.
Anon
The collar and the print & colour of the featured dress look dated, and not in a fun retro way. I think pants are generally just more trendy and practical these days.
Anon
Agree that pants are current, but now that we are officially having warm weather, I am itching to ditch them. My only caveat, which rules out sheath dresses and requires a longer hem, is that they can’t show the outlines of my anti-chub-rub shorts. I love pants but I am so tired of my cold-weather clothes.
Anon
Warm weather means it’s time for wide leg linen pants. Certainly that’s more comfortable than chub rub shorts and a dress.
Anon
I’m wearing some right now!
Anonymous
Most people’s lets don’t run together.
Anon
Based on my observations, this is very much not true. The people who look like Twiggy with no thigh contact are few and far between.
Moose
I think it’s a common problem that people haven’t talked about openly until recently – mine have rubbed together since I was in middle school, at every size.
Anonymous
Linen often looks sloppy. I’d much rather put on slip shorts and a dress. I also think dresses are a little more versatile/forgiving with level of formality. I can take them on a work trip and just as easily wear to a casual or more formal dinner, attend a conference session and then go sightseeing, etc.
Anon
My lovely cleaning lady just brought me a large assortment of pastries for the end of Ramadan. Is an end of Ramadan bonus appropriate? Or is that tacky? I want to reciprocate in some way because she’s very sweet and I don’t have any freshly baked goods, but I could throw in a bit of extra cash. We also give a year end bonus FYI.
Anon
(in case it wasn’t clear – we don’t celebrate Ramadan, she does. I mentioned once that I love Moroccan pastries and she remembered and brought me some).
Anon
I think it’s odd to give her cash as a quid pro quo. She gave you a small, consumable gift. It’s not a big deal. Just accept it gracefully and tell her how much you enjoyed them.
Anonymous
I don’t know anything about Ramadan so I can’t answer that, but if I’d been the one bringing you the pastries, I really, really wouldn’t want you giving me money in return. Just let me “be your equal” and do something nice for you because I’m a nice person. Just one person’s response; social norms and your cleaning lady might say differently.
Anon OP
That definitely crossed my mind. I didn’t mean to be quite so transactional though – I’m not saying “oh thanks for the pastries here is some cash”, I’m saying “I know this is a special time for you, here is a little extra for you and your family”. But maybe it comes off wrong which is why I’m wondering. Also I think the end of Ramadan has passed since I only see her every 2 weeks, so maybe it’s too late.
An.On.
Maybe reciprocate if you ever have a similar baked good event – cookie swap at Christmas, cupcakes from a birthday, bread if you bake at home, etc. Doesn’t have to be now, just let her know you made or have extras and you wanted to share with her since you loved her pastries so much. It can be nice to hear that the recipient is still thinking about the gift even months later.
Anon
Forgive the religious butchering here… My best friend is a Muslim immigrant and we’ve learned from each other.
Ramadan is equivalent to our Christmas on the scale of Big Deals. Lots of visiting friends and relatives, big feasts, gift giving, and new clothes. Getting a new outfit is one of the big things; gift giving in the Christmas sense (i.e., piles of possibly unneeded stuff), less so.
She was just sharing the holiday with you the way anyone might share their holiday baked goods. There’s no expectation of return.
If you could give her a paid holiday next year, that would be very well received I imagine. There’s SO much cooking and cleaning and prepping that goes on for a major holiday, especially one where the main activity is visiting others at their home!
Anon
A paid holiday for a cleaning lady seems really excessive. That’s something you do for a nanny or someone who works for you five days a week. Not someone who cleans your house every other week.
PolyD
Maybe instead ask if she wants some flexibility around what days she comes in during Ramadan?
Anon
But if everyone has this idea, she would never get a paid day off. A day off to get ready for her holiday just means she doesn’t get paid. People do it for sure – I’ve given my housecleaners paid holidays – just told them not to come, sent the money anyway, said happy holiday.
AP
Ummm what? You have to assume (unless you specifically know otherwise) that a cleaning person has a full time schedule, yet if they work for themselves (or perhaps even if they do not), they don’t have paid vacation. At least I’ve never heard of a cleaning person having paid vacation built into their agreements with clients. We typically give our AMAZING cleaning lady duo (mother and daughter) off with pay when we’re on vacation and also at the holidays.
Babs
I’m Muslim and I would say just thank her warmly and tell her how much you enjoyed it, leave out the cash. In a different scenario, I bring desserts to my non-Muslim neighbors for Eid. I wouldn’t expect anything in return, but I like them and like to spread my celebration. I’m guessing she’s coming at this with the same intention.
Anon
I finally mustered up the courage to get back on the Hinge… and I was laid off. I feel so embarrassed. When do I bring it up? Should I take a break from dating until my job situation is more secure? That could take months. Any tips for how to navigate this when dating?
Anon.
Is there a reason why you shouldn’t date when you got laid off??
I think you should be dating if you want to. If the job question comes up on a date, I would mention which industry you’re in, what your role or skills are… I think the general vibes you get from your date will determine whether you want to share the fact you’re currently not employed.
The way I see it, dating would be an additional chance to forge new relationships – who knows, you might not find a partner but someone might work in a relevant job area, or vice versa, maybe you’ll find a great partner who can support you and take your mind off the job stress.
Anon
I would just say “oh I’m a data processor” and if they ask where you work, you can either say “megacorp” or if you want to share a bit say “I was at megacorp but I actually was laid off recently”. Normal people understand that this is a thing and will react with empathy. If your date doesn’t, that’s a red flag. FYI I met my husband while he was in between jobs and I was doing well. I’m glad I didn’t let that stop me because (1) he’s great, and (2) not that it matters but he got another job shortly after and is now a lot more successful that I am career wise.
Anon
Normal people don’t lie on a date and they talk about what they do. OP, this isn’t something to be embarrassed about. Go forth and date but be honest about whatever is going on with you. The right person for you will love the actual you.
anon
unless your being laid off impacts you so financially that you can’t pay for a date or a new outfit or whatever, i would not worry about it. People follow your lead, if you are cool about it they will be too. Which for what it is worth is generally my experience with every aspect of internet dating. without embarassment share your red flags early and like they’re no big deal.
California
Why can’t you say “I’m a lawyer. I’m currently between jobs”?
Anonymous
This. This is a perfectly fine response to friends and strangers and potential romantic partners and yes interviewers and recruiters
Anonymous
I would emphasize your severance package, assuming you got one. “My company had layoffs but fortunately my severance package allows me flexibility to get the best position for me and not just the first thing I can find.”
Anon
That seems like a weird level of disclosure for a hinge profile or an early date
Anonymous
Oh yeah I wouldn’t put it on my profile, I would say that if I was asked about my job on a first date. My style is to be pretty open so ymmv. On my profile, I’d put my profession assuming I’m planning to stay in the same field. I don’t think it’s dishonest to say “lawyer” even if I’m not current employed; I’m still a lawyer.
Sasha
Don’t worry about it! If it comes up, be breezy–“Oh I work in X field, I was a Y role at Z company but actually was laid off recently” Make conversation around whether you plan to stay in the same field or move to something else. If the other person offers condolences, accept them and blow past it. The key is to not show any intense emotions around it–act as though you are totally confident that you’ll have a new role soon and are looking forward to the next thing. Confidence in one’s work ability is what’s attractive! I’ve been on plenty of dates where the roles were reversed–it’s only awkward if you mope about it at length and talk about how nervous you are, etc.
This all only applies to early dates–if things get more serious with any of your prospects, of course you can get more emotional and vulnerable with them about your actual feelings.
anon88
+1
Anon
I met my husband on Bumble (no luck on Hinge, few matches), and I definitely didn’t lead with my employer. I put a very generic job title and employer on my profile itself (attorney at public interest firm), and I didn’t tell matches where I worked until after several dates.
Senior Attorney
“I’m actually between jobs right now. Looking for the perfect thing and enjoying the time off.”
Senior Attorney
And on your profile if there’s a field for your job, you just fill in your generic career description: “Teapot designer.”
Anon
+1 this. Some of these suggestions are so bizarre.
You can absolutely date after you got laid off. Layoffs happen. People understand that. If a date told me they had been laid off, I’d ask what ideally they were looking for next, etc., because I would be genuinely curious, not turned off.
Anonymous
I feel like this is a bigger deal if you’re dating someone looking to you for financial stability — hopefully that isn’t many people!
RiskedCredit
I am so frustrated and need some advice on what to expect.
Turns out my divorce was t final. My lawyer sent me notice of the default hearing which is to tomorrow. I asked and was told it’s just a formality. I’m confused because I see lots of different things online.
There is nothing I want more than to be divorced from my ex husband. The MSA was signed and notorized in 2022. He represented himself. I have a zoom link and I will be showing up.
What should I expect?
Anon
Can you ask your attorney what questions you are likely to be asked and what themes you should follow in your answers?
RiskedCredit
I asked and he blew me off with ‘they won’t ask much’ and ‘it’s just a formality. Don’t worry’.
I’m worried. If it was a formality I wouldn’t have a zoom link.
Anon
Call your lawyer back, this isn’t a question for the internet.
Anon
+1 you need to speak to your lawyer and if he can’t answer this question to your satisfaction maybe you should get a new lawyer.
Anon
Why wouldn’t you have a zoom link if it wasn’t a formality? That doesn’t make sense.
Anon
Some states offer pretty good online self-help resources on their family law court websites. You might check there.
Anon
My concern is did your attorney drop the ball on finalizing your divorce. I’d ask another divorce attorney in your area if possible.
Anon
+1
Anon
In my jurisdiction, it is a quick formality – usually 5 to 10 minutes — where the party seeking default is sworn in and asked some basic questions (either by his or her attorney or the judicial officer) to establish the court has jurisdiction, that any orders related to children are in the best interests of the children, and whether the orders related to property and debt are fair and equitable. If you don’t understand a question, ask for clarification.
Senior Attorney
If it’s a default hearing, it probably really is just a formality. In California, the judge will ask you “Had you been a resident of California for six months when you filed the petition for dissolution?” “Has the marriage irretrievably broken down?” “Would counseling or assistance from the court help to repair the marriage?” (This is a trick question: The answer is NO. The answers to the other questionsa are YES.) “Are you asking the court to dissolve your marriage?” You answer the questions and the court grants the judgment of dissolution on the terms you requested in your petition for dissolution because, in a default proceeding, the other party did not appear (thereby agreeing to whatever you and the court decide to do).
marise
An MSA is usually not enough to finalize divorce. It could be the judge wants to voire dire you to establish that you/husband were residents of the state at the time the divorce was filed. These jurisdictional requirements are just questions asked and then the judge signs off on the judgment. So it is likely nothing. But understandably, frustrating since this should have been taken care of last year. And, your attorney should be able to answer this question so you aren’t forced to play the guessing game and turn to strangers to get answers to your case.
Lobby-est
Just wanted to say that I’m sorry you’re going through this. It sounds like a nightmare to get the notice and then get little help from your lawyer. Maybe the silver lining is that after tomorrow you feel that same sense of relief you got when you first divorced this guy. Onward! Wishing you all the best
Alyssa
Any recommendations for article or sayings or something for a first time manager? I need like a mantra or something to help me feel more confident. I used to read Marcus Aurelius every day before my big4 job – something affirmation-y like that.
Anon
Who/what are you managing? One assistant or a team of 12 SMEs?
Alyssa
7 SMEs
Anon
Not quite a mantra, but I like the Harvard business review management tip of the day newsletter. It gives some good basics, practical advice. A couple of mantras I do have depending on situation.. courage over comfort, clarity is kindness, trust the team
Cat
https://www.askamanager.org/2023/01/advice-for-new-managers.html
Walnut
The best manager I’ve ever had was committed to building her emotional intelligence. Richard Hua has some content that might be a good starting point: https://www.richardhua.co/formanagers.html
Anonymous
Always remember that your job is to make sure your people have everything they need to do their jobs well. You are there to serve them, not the other way round.
CMS
Manager Tools podcast. Start with the Hall of Fame casts.
Nina
If anyone is in the mood for vicarious shopping – I’m looking for a wedding guest dress and just not finding anything I like. Size 8/10, under $200 ideally, 34DDD. Floor length formal. Any color is okay really, but darker skin/brown hair/brown eyes. Lighter pinks looks really good on me. A lot of the options I see are deep v necks or otherwise wouldn’t be flattering to a larger bust. I’ve mainly looked at Reformation and Lulus so far – probably need to go a little higher end.
Anonymous
Are any Reformation dresses actually good for larger busts? I laughed when I saw someone describe Gen Z as “being tricked by Reformation into thinking a stick-on bra is feminism” — all the dresses do seem to require a stick-on bra or bra tape.
Anon
Stick on bras are way more comfortable than any strapless I’ve tried but I do not have a large bust.
Anon
Your note about not being large busted is correct. My larger cup means those things just look like saggy little boobs hats on me
Nina
No they are not. At least none of the ones I saw in store. They were also all very flimsy and just not flattering for anyone at all vaguely curvy.
Anon
They’re like the opposite of good for larger busts.
Anon
Unless they’ve drastically changed their sizing, I’d say no. Nothing from Reformation has ever worked for me.
Anon
FWIW, I always have deep V-necks altered to hit a bit higher. The trick is just sizing up so you have some extra fabric to work with.
Work Phone
If the wedding is soon (spring/summer): https://tinyurl.com/ye23wcs9
Sweetheart neckline, bra friendly: https://tinyurl.com/2pwkxdbn
Peachy sequins: https://tinyurl.com/522aprma
Work Phone
Ah shoot I missed your budget. Disregard the sequins.
k-t
As a 32G / 34F size 8-ish, I totally get your challenge. I don’t have specific dresses to share, but I have had luck with Ralph Lauren (their website still carries petites, which is sometimes better for me), Eliza J, Tadashi Shoji, Tahari. I generally buy from Nordstrom, sometimes Bloomies or Saks. These designers are often on sale for under $200. I haven’t tried any on, but the Alfred Sung dresses look like they have enough structure and modest enough necklines to allow for a supportive bra underneath. And if you need to do strapless, the Wacoal Red Carpet is a classic for a reason. Good luck!
Senior Attorney
I’m a similar shape and size adn was coming to recommend Eliza J. Absolutely agree that Tadashi Shoji and Tahari and great, too! Also agree with the poster who alters the v-necks to be less plunging.
Anon
Adrianna Papell available at nordstroms is close to 200, some are under/over.
Senior Attorney
Oh, yes — that’s another brand I like.
Moose
This looks like a great option – can wear a regular bra with it:
https://www.anthropologie.com/shop/bhldn-blake-square-neck-stretch-crepe-gown?category=dresses-maxi-midi&color=060&type=STANDARD&quantity=1
ALT
Honestly I’m a bit larger than you are (size 12, 10 on a good day) and I got a dress for a recent wedding from Grace Karin on Amazon that is SO flattering! It’s a high neck satin wrap dress which sounds like it would be the opposite but it’s draped in the right spots and is very comfortable. The fabric is also a nice satin and not a cheap satin.
Anonymous
Low stakes question for today (ha): what do you think the meaning of life is?
Anon
Loving God and serving others.
I spent quality time at a silent retreat (and eight months of existential crisis, ha) to figure that one out.
If you’re not of the religious persuasion, delete the reference to a deity and change “serving” to “helping.”
The world would be a much better place if we had more of this in whatever flavor suits you ❤️
Anon
Agree with this.
Anon
There isn’t one. I think the idea of it having to mean something is made up by humans.
Anon
+1. Fully agree. However! That doesn’t stop me from treating people with respect, volunteering, donating to charity, and otherwise trying to behave like a good member of society.
Anon
We are (possibly) the only mammals who could come up with such a concept. There’s meaning there, but I don’t know what it is.
Anon
Agreed.
anon
To love well; to be a kind, conscientious person who works to improve things rather than tear down (or be a leech); to find happiness and meaning in the small things and the actual contours of your life circumstances.
Anon.
I love this.
Jules
Beautifully said.
Anon
42 :)
Anonymous
+42
Anon
This made me smile!
Seventh Sister
Love this. Also anytime anyone talks about the end of the world, I just think to myself, “so long, and thanks for all the fish.”
NaoNao
Bit of a tautology but it’s…figuring out or attempting to figure out the meaning, that’s what gives it meaning!
Vicky Austin
“Mostly listening, some jokes.” – John Green, in response to this question.
Anon
Randomness
Anon
Love. Not necessarily romantic love
Senior Attorney
Connection with other people; trying to leave the world a bit better than you found it.
Work Phone
Look for opportunities to do good, try new things, love a lot and have fun.
(agree with others that there’s no capital-M Meaning, but the search for meaning is the point! You get to decide that for yourself).
Anon
It’s like camping – leave the place better than you found it.
Anon
I think of life as an RPG game. I try to make it an enjoyable experience and to not take things too seriously. Because in the end we’ll all get a blinking “game over” and none of it would’ve really mattered. Of course I try not scr3w other people over for my own gains etc etc but I’m not sure if I believe I’m here to do good per se.
California
We have a few days off from school with elementary age kids and want to get away somewhere driving distance from Berkeley/SF. Current plan is to be in Berkeley for 1-2 days and then have another 2-4 days that require a plan. Something easy and relaxing but also fun. Specific places to stay welcome!
Anon
The Mendocino coast is nice this time of year.
Anon
Russian River!
Anon
I would probably go to Yosemite or spring skiing in Tahoe. Yosemite Valley Lodge is overpriced but so conveniently located.
Anon
Yosemite in April is a very different experience than Yosemite in summer. A lot of roads and trails will be closed due to snow. There are some lower elevation hikes you can do, particularly towards the end of the month, but definitely research before you go and make sure you’re going to be happy with what you can see.
A lot of the ski resorts in Tahoe closed this past weekend, and more will close this coming weekend. I don’t think there will be much spring skiing after the 21st.
Anon
Good points, but there are a lot of benefits to Yosemite in spring too – namely waterfalls. There is a ton of stuff to explore in the valley at any time of year.
Anon
IMO the sweet spot is late May and early June when the roads are open and the waterfalls are still very fall.
Anon
*full
Anonymous
Point Reyes! Rosie the Riveter National Park in Richmond! Oakland Museum!
anon
Asilomar is a lovely place to stay with kids that age! Beach, Point Pinos Lighthouse, Monterey Bay Aquarium (buy a membership to bypass entrance lines), Point Lobos, Monterey State Historic Park (tour is free if you have a 4th grader who has printed the free Explorer Pass), and more.
For Yosemite, Rush Creek Lodge has a game room that is super fun for that age.
Anon
We’re in Berkeley. We usually make a road trip down to Pismo Beach for a couple nights then a few nights in Santa Barbara, with a stop in Solvang along the way. Kids love it.
Senior Attorney
And don’t forget to visit Hearst Castle! I first visited as a kid and loved it then and love it now. Have lunch at Linn’s Fruit Bin in Cambria.
Senior Attorney
Reply in mod for obscure reasons, but: Hearst Castle.
Anon
I have still never been to Hearst Castle! I remember showing up there as a kid with my family on one of our Pismo trips, then my dad was told he had to buy tickets ahead of time and he was big mad. Haha.
My husband has been and absolutely loved it. Someday. :)
I will put this on the list of things that CA natives haven’t done that people visiting CA from elsewhere do. I’ve still never been to Alcatraz!
Senior Attorney
Alcatraz is great, too! Definitely recommend checking out both of those places while your kids are still young!
Anon in sf
I’m a life long Bay Area girl – and have never been to Hearst castle!
I have though been to Alcatraz
Me
I’m low-level angry and hurt. I have a friend of about 10 years who I have emotionally supported for years through life’s ups and downs (divorce, job losses, struggles with children, breakups with girlfriends, etc.). He’s commented on what a great friend I’ve been many times, and he’s right. My mom died about six months ago, and we were very close. The loss has been absolutely crushing. He also became friends with my mom in the last few years of her life.
My friend hasn’t shown up at all – and my standard is low: periodic texts to ask how I’m doing or a memory he had of her or that he was thinking about her or me. Nothing. I’ve seen him a few times since her death and we are part of a group of friends that texts frequently and, again, nothing there either.
I suppose I’m screaming into the void here. And what I need to walk away with is this isn’t the two-sided friendship that I assumed it was. He is in another life crisis with a job loss and a girlfriend relationship going sideways. And I’m just not inspired now to reach out at all. I’m pretty done right now.
Anon
He’s probably the kind of person who’s on the narcissistic side and can’t handle your crisis plus his. This is a take people as you find them issue, some people will never be there for you but can fill other needs.
Anon
+1
Anon
I’m sorry. This is so, so common and so frustrating. When I’ve been through similar, I’ve had well-meaning friends try to tell me that I should just forgive (despite receiving no apology) and move on because some people “struggle with tough situations.” Nah. Being a friend requires showing up for people in their time of need, not to mention reciprocity. If you don’t know what to say, figure it out. Google it, ask loved ones, figure it tf out.
Word to the wise, he’ll probably reach out in two months and say “hey we should hang out, haven’t seen you in a while.”
Senior Attorney
100% he will absolutely do this.
annanon
I’m so sorry for your loss. If you haven’t yet decided you’re done with this friendship I would think of some specific things you’d like him to do and plainly ask for them. That kind of personality may not know how to show up for others. That may be because he’s always the one being supported, or maybe because he’s narcissistic, maybe he assumes you’re getting the support you need from others because it sounds like your dynamic with him has established a pattern where you support him. It’s possible he won’t follow through on your asks and then you’ll know with certainty that he acts selfishly and you can decide from there what to do. But I would start with directly asking for support in specific ways, for example tell him you need to vent for X minutes on the phone or in person, or ask him to grab lunch with you because you’re feeling crushed and need to get out of the house, or ask him to text you in the morning for the next few days to check in on how you’re doing. I get that he is letting you down and you don’t want to have to teach him how to be a good friend to you. The ideal friend will see you’re hurting and be proactive in supporting you. Maybe this will be a learning experience for him that will bring your friendship into better balance. And I mean this gently and it’s something I’ve needed to learn as someone who is often supporting others – maybe this will help you get better at asking for support up front when you need it.
anon
I have a friend from childhood that I’ve come to the realization is like this. It really hurt and took a while to accept. What you’re feeling seems pretty normal and I’m sorry this is happening to you.
Me
Thank you all for your comments. I feel seen.
Anon
This friend sounds like an emotional vampire. You need to stop being his free therapist, because your friendship with him is absolutely not a two-way street. I’m so sorry about your loss.
Anon
FWIW I’ve had to drop two friendships along the course of my life for a similar reason. I started to realize we weren’t connecting for mutual reasons but for me to be free emotional support for the other person.
As one example, my son went through a significant health crisis as a preschooler, I met usual friend for lunch as I was holding back tears, and she changed the subject back to herself.
Senior Attorney
This may be sexist, but my first thought is “Ugh. Men.”
Me
Thanks for the laugh! I think humor improves almost every situation. And I’d usually totally agree, except the level at which my husband has shown up for me has blown me away – and I’ve told him as much. I’m extremely fortunate to have had his support. But as to the rest of the men? Yes, UGH. Men!
Anonja
I am your friend. I was clueless about this stuff, didn’t really know what to do, had good intentions that I never acted upon, etc. Then my son died. So many people were so, so kind to me. I’ll never forget that. I get it now, and I’m much more aware and sensitive to people who are grieving.
Anon
I am so very sorry for your loss.
Nudibranch
Experiencing loss yourself and experiencing how others react is a ‘growing up’ experience. Sometimes I think I need a script to know what to say. And being on the receiving end was eye-opening. Hopefully I now can use that ‘script’ and know what to say to others who’re experiencing loss.
And sometime, just showing up, being there is helpful too. It doesn’t always need to be eloquent.
Anon
I’m going through a similar… ummm… adjustment with somebody I thought of as one of my closest friends. I’ll spare you the details, but I can share a bit about how I’m processing what feels like a major loss. I’ve decided against bringing this up for now, since I’m not in a place to deal with whatever her reactions may be. In the meantime, I’m quiety recalibrating my expectations, and paying a lot of attention to how she responds and what I can count on her for. I’ve defined the problem ***for now*** as “maybe I had illusions about this relationship,” and if so it serves me to understand what it is today. The next step would be adjusting on what terms I’d be willing to maintain the relationship, as I see it now. In the not so distant future, I may consider how to address all of this with the person, but for now I’m focusing on taking care of myself. None of it feels good… Sorry you’re having to deal with it as you are also grieving the loss of your mother!
Kinda Want to Be Anon For This
This is a marital “gardening” question. Help me with opportunities or ideas I’m missing?
My husband and I have been married almost 17 years. Great marriage, we love each other, we’re attracted to each other, we have three kids in elementary/middle school, life is good.
Except . . . we cannot seem to get it together to garden. To be fair, I hd an injury three months ago that required surgery and rehab so it was off the table for a few months and now I’m ready. But it was an issue before then too.
Our kids stay up later and by the time they go to bed we still have things to do and then my husband is exhausted (I am more of a night owl). Our oldest gets up early so the morning is out. We might have the chance on days we bother WFH I just have to be more proactive.
Ladies with older kids who don’t leave free time in the early evenings but are not old enough to be out and about doing their own thing: when do you and your partner fit in physical intimacy???
Anon
Weekend mornings. Lock the door and “sleep in,” my kids don’t get early anymore.
OP
I should have added—we don’t have a bedroom door to lock. Our bedroom is in the attic and thus separate from the kids’ rooms but we have just a turn in the stairs for privacy, no actual door. Then again we are on the road to an addition which will give us a door so these ideas will help then!
Anonymous
Get a door!!!
Anonymous
Are they coming into your space unannounced though? If so, tell them to knock it off.
Anon
I’m sorry to say, that’s a dumb arrangement for an intimate relationship with your husband. Get a door, even a makeshift one. Don’t wait for a remodel. Everyone deserves some privacy and an intimate life.
Senior Attorney
Or at the very least, a “Do Not Disturb” sign at the foot of the stairs, and make it clear that you really really mean it.
Anon
This sounds like a big part of the problem tbh
Nesprin
If absolutely nothing else, a barn door kit will give you a door that can be closed.
Anon
Elementary & older kids don’t need to be observed every waking moment. Can you train them to get themselves ready for bed while you close & lock your bedroom door?
Anon
I think I’d feel weird about partaking in these activities while my kids are still up, no?
Anon
+1 – i would not feel comfortable of kids are still awake due to the layout of our house.
Anon
You kind of have to when kids get older and don’t sleep as much.
Anonymous
Yeah, I feel weird about it when the kids are home at all, even if they are supposedly asleep, because our house is tiny and all the bedrooms are on the same floor. I thought this was why parents liked sleepovers and weekends at grandma’s and summer camp.
Anonymous
Can you send them to a sleepover? Ask their best friends’ parents
Tell them it’s for a date night
anon
I want to validate that this stage in life is, um, challenging for intimacy. It was honestly easier when the kids were younger and went to bed earlier. We try to take advantage of times where the kids are downstairs watching a movie, or out of the house at a friend’s house.
anon
do you guys work remote ever and are your kids in school? we try to make it work during the day on those days.
OP
Thanks for the “I’m not alone” help.
anon
It’s a frustrating situation. We’re still very attracted to each other and would like to be intimate more often. Maybe our kids are outliers (though I doubt it), but they are still up in our business even though they’re older! It’s not that they can’t fend for themselves, but when we’re all home, they are eager to chat and be a part of things. I think that’s a good thing overall, though it makes it challenging as a couple.
So, yeah. Playdates and sleepovers. Lock the door if and when you can. If the mood randomly strikes, take it, even if you’re both exhausted.
Anon
Time to draw some boundaries with kids. They can understand that Mom and Dad need time alone.
Anon
Agreed to it not being so simple, nor an issue of just drawing boundaries with kids. We also have kids who are around a lot and want to be with us. Both of my older kids save up all their chatting time for bedtime, and that’s when they want to have deep chats with me. I’m not inclined to shut down that line of communication as they are getting older.
I also firmly believe having boundaries means you tell your child to stay in their room after a certain time so you can watch TV or chat with your husband, not so you can be intimate. Speaking from experience, it’s deeply disturbing as a child if you know what your parents are up, e.g., a “do not disturb” sign or something similar, and an older kid is going to know what’s up. If you are able to sneak away unnoticed, fine, but a child really shouldn’t have awareness of what’s going on. As a parent, it also would be tremendously difficult for me to enjoy it if I knew the kids could walk up the stairs at any time.
With similarly aged kids, we have a standing Friday lunch date, or my husband will go into the office later after the kids get the bus. Ask for carpooling help to weekend activities. Schedule play dates.
Anonymous
Can you be more proactive about the time slot of “when they go to bed we still have things to do”? Can some of those things be done in the morning or at other times? Or can you add “gardening” to your list of things to do? You make sure those other things get done in that time slot. Isn’t gardening and the state of your marriage as important — or more important — than any of those other things?
Anon
Yes, to validate, we have the same issue. It was way easier when kids were little!! But the way we’ve done it (haha) is to 1) plan it 2) just stay up a little later and 3) not get sucked into work/chores on those nights. That also means not the night we have meetings until 9 PM. And yes, wfh overlap (again scheduled and blocked out on calendar) and also when kids are out of house for sleepovers/play dates.
Anonymous
Yes
Be a little flirty earlier in the evening and make sure it’s on the agenda as something you both look forward to
NYCer
+1. When we are at home, we almost exclusively have sex at night after the kids are sleeping. Yes, I don’t get as much household stuff done on those days, but so be it.
Anon
That is a good point. Sometimes your relationship has to be the priority. The laundry can wait a day.
RiskedCredit
You have to be opportunistic and double task. When I was married, he would jump in the shower. If you park in your garage after shopping, have him help bring in the bags. The kids never help so the door to the house had a bolt I had added so they couldn’t walk in. Weekend mornings for something in bed and longer.
It was tough for us because two children wake at 5am and the third child stays up until 9/10pm. It’s super annoying.
LawDawg
Date night that includes renting a hotel room. DH and I would rent a local hotel room (at a nice place…but keeping the price reasonable) and spend a few hours. It wasn’t the cheapest way to do things, but it gave us complete privacy and made for a special evening. Sometimes we would just check out via the app in the morning even though we left the night before. Other times, we would go back and have breakfast there as a family. The kids saw it as a treat and we were just taking advantage of what we had already paid for.
Anon
Also validating that it’s hard. Mine are younger (early elementary) but the easiest time for us is when they sleep over at the grandparents’ house which is thankfully a weekly occurrence. I assume with older kids they might sleep at a friend’s house but I can see how it would be harder to coordinate so all three are gone at the same time.
Jennifer
We exchanged playdates with another couple in our neighborhood with kids our age, sometimes once a month sometimes twice a month through the elementary school years. When we hosted the kids, they went to movies, plays, dinner – typical dates. When they hosted the kids, we ordered takeout and had our house to ourselves for gardening. Otherwise, we did a lot of showering together to conserve water.
anon
We have a standard one day a week plan where we both come home directly after school drop off in the morning. We’d like to make it happen more often, but at least we have that set of other times don’t work out. By the time my kid goes to bed at 9:30, I’m exhausted and just want to go to bed myself.
Anonymous
You have things to do every single night? Just don’t do the things. Plan not to do other things one night a week. You do have to actually make it a priority. It is more important than the dishes.
Anon
This
Vicky Austin
I was recently reading a memoir and the narrator remembered her parents taking Sunday afternoons after church to hang out in their bedroom, door shut, kids not allowed to bother them. Once in a while they’d see their dad come out to get a couple glasses of wine and then go back in.
Previous generations of parenting left a lot to be desired, but maybe there’s something in just…setting this boundary and keeping it.
Maybe set the kids up with a movie marathon and snacks of a weekend afternoon and then sneak away?
Anon
This is what we do. We never outgrew “quiet time” on weekend afternoons. The kids get to play their video games, we “nap” in our bedroom. Growing up my parents let us eat sugary candy and watch TV only on Saturday mornings so they could sleep in and presumably more.
Anonymous
I’ve never understood people who feel like they can’t garden when their kids are in the house or awake. If the kids hear their parents gardening then oh well. Be grossed out all you want how do you think you got here. It’s your effing house do what you want.
Anonymous
Because we are modest and private?
Anon
I don’t know how modest and private OP can really be given that she has no bedroom door!
Anon
If everyone felt this way, every kid would be an only child.
Anon
No, lots of people are saying you do it when they’re asleep. Especially with little kids they need way more sleep than adults do.
Anonymous
Yeah I guess fundamentally I don’t get being that modest or private around people who you created and fed with your privates? Like kid you’ve already got all my body’s got to give. You can deal with me having fun. If the most traumatic thing that happens in your childhood is knowing your parents still have the hots for each other then I think we did a pretty good job.
anon
Good for you, not for me.
Anon
All I would ask is that you be respectful of your kids if you notice they are uncomfortable with this, and don’t blow discomfort off as “I fed you, I saw you nekkid as a baby, so I can make decisions about your comfort levels with my physical activities,” even if they don’t come out and say clearly that they are uncomfortable. It’s not a great look to override a kid’s obvious discomfort about physical or sexual boundaries. I have had therapy for this exact issue, can confirm it’s recognized as trauma. Not as bad as so many things, but not great either.
Anon
I responded above. I grew up with parents who had this mentality, and it messed me up. My dad, especially, thought it was healthy for the kids to know that he and my mother’s relationship was “thriving.” I hated it, and I have a really weird relationship with being super private about s e x now. Just saying. Especially as a teen girl, it disturbed me endlessly to think of my father, especially, as a s e x u a l being. Despite him being a good dad, I held him at arms length during puberty, and I know this was a big reason why. I wish they would have been more discrete — and nothing overtly inappropriate, just being aware that it was happening and hearing jokes/comments about it. I now over correct with being hyper aware and closeted about it.
Anon
I think that’s a you issue. No one is saying have srx on the living room couch while the kids are running around. They’re saying you don’t have to wait until the kids are out of the house to have an intimate life.
Anon
ha! You are exactly correct — I literally just said that. It IS a me issue, and it’s an issue I got from parents who were too open about sex, so tread cautiously! We could hear them in the house, and they frequently joked about it. I hated it. It made me deeply uncomfortable. I did not know how to articulate that fact to them when I was a pre-teen and young teen, but it did. It still does. So now, I have older kids AND a good sex life AND my older kids are unaware that I have a good life sex life. We have sex after they leave for school (and older kids leave super early, so that’s always been a consistently good time, or during lunch dates if we can both WFH, or when they are both out of the house for sports or activities).
Anon
Interesting to me that you seem to harbor resentment against your father for this behavior and not your mother. “I held him at arms length during puberty”. Why not mom? Genuinely curious to understand as a parent myself who enjoys lots of gardening with my husband, although we do not vocalize it to our teen kids.
Anon
Appreciate the genuine inquiry Anon @ 4:51, so I will do my best to answer. it’s a tricky answer, and so proceed with caution.
I think it had a lot to do with the fact that at the time I was learning about what happens to a man’s body during the actual act of sex, my only reference point was my parents, who were so open and honest about having sex and you could hear it in the house. So I guess it was hard not to visualize what I was just learning about happening to my dad because I clearly knew it was happening, and then, honestly, the visualizations became intrusive thoughts — I didn’t want them, but I couldn’t stop them. Tough to separate my own desire to be a sexual person having a sexual encounter without having unwanted thoughts. Around the same time, I also became very uncomfortable with physical affection from him because “ugh what if a [natural, normal thing] happens when I hug him,” which again, just made me feel AWFUL and gross. It was just — I wanted to think about these things happening to and with a guy, but my parents should not have been part of any of those thoughts. Like I said, a tricky answer, and so many kids have so much worse, but also, like, not great and extremely avoidable.
Anon
Adding that, of course, I never ever shared any of this with my dad or mom — just a lot of the “gross” ‘eww” etc. when it came up that is pretty typical. My dad did seem to really resent that I stopped hugging him or being physically affection with him as I got older, but I never could or did tell him why. Also adding that my mom seemed to “get it,” but my dad never really stopped joking about it. We otherwise had, and still have, a great relationship, but I really, really, really wished they would have picked up on my discomfort or respected my requests to cut it out.
Anon
Thanks for the explanation. Makes complete sense.
anon
Yeah I’m okay with a little kissing, hand holding / arm around each other, and G rated cuddling or comments in front of my kids and that’s it. I’m no prude, but I think anything more is too much.
We have a weekly date nights and outside of that have no problem telling our kids to run along and play because we’re having couple time, but it’s not for gardening. It’s for things like having a glass of wine on the deck with conversation that’s not interrupted by kids. Our conversation might get flirty, but that’s it until kids are in bed.
Anonymous
Exactly this. Parents need to maintain some dignity and decorum to avoid messing up their kids. And not just around “gardening.”
Anon
I agree with you. My parents were really upfront that there was a half hour each night when I couldn’t disturb them. I was well aware of what it was from about the age of 10 or so. I also heard… a lot (small house and our bedrooms shared a wall). I don’t gave trauma or anything but I think they could have been a lot more discrete.
Anon
I don’t think this is the right way! I have a lot of younger siblings and still have zero idea where they came from, haha. That’s preferable to me.
Anon Today
We are in a similar boat. Our solution – scheduled gardening. We have a standing date every Wednesday and Saturday. If there is a conflict, it’s ok to tell the other that you need to skip, but we try our best not to do that. Happens immediately after kid 1 (10) goes to bed while kid 2 (14) is showering/getting ready for bed and so no longer needs us.
Anonymous
When the kids are out for the evening. Obviously more difficult if you have multiple kids who may not all go out at the same time.
Anon
Do you have a babysitter or grandparent who could take the kids out of the house for an activity or movie or whatever? Then you guys stay home and have time to yourselves.
Anon
I’ve got to say, I’m just not in the mood if the kids are up. Weekend mornings are time to get stuff done. I’d rather stay up later on a weekend night till after the kids go to bed. I wfh regularly while DH doesn’t, so the idea of gardening on the rare occasion he can stay home feels like an invasion of my space. When my head is in work mode, then I don’t want to be gettin’ busy. I think I compartmentalize a lot and can’t switch gears all that easily.
Anon
Yeah I have a mental block over doing it when kids are home and awake or during WFH. I could hypothetically do it but I wouldn’t be into it so it wouldn’t really meet my needs.
Being rushed, needing to be quiet, and / or needing to quickly switch gears afterwards is not conducive to a good time for me.
Vicky Austin
Yeah, I’m surprised this isn’t coming up more.
Anon
I mean, I too felt this way. But my life is so busy that there is never time unless I make myself switch headspaces and just do it. It seems trite but it really is fake it till you make it. How I wish for spontaneity and relaxed mornings in bed…but it’s just not happening, at least not outside of kid free vacations, so I have really had to work at it. I think it’s really important to my marriage, so I do it, and I always end up having fun so it’s a positive reinforcement.
Anon
There was a discussion on Friday about how at a SLAC you have advisors and they meet with students fairly regularly and no one falls through the cracks because the SLAC is invested in your success. My mind was blown — I have never gone to a school like this even though I always considered my small undergraduate-focused State U undergrad to be SLAC-ish except for the price. But I guess not (and maybe in this sense you get what you pay for)? If SLACs (or maybe the most selective ones) are like this, was it hard to pivot in graduate school or work where it’s all on you with no help navigating?
[I have kids and already in our city I’m amazed at the support and services at private schools vs the sink-or-swim imposed on our very under-resourced public schools. Next year, I will have a freshman at a public high school that is larger than what most SLACs are. It feels like salmon swimming upstream combined with a rugby scrum. Most parents shrug and if their kid isn’t eaten alive (some are and get pulled out to the Catholic high school, which seems to be in between the extremes), they will ultimately be better off in the long run b/c State U will just be more of the same.]
Anon
Don’t all colleges have advisors?
Anon
Yes, but the amount of contact you have with the advisor can vary a lot.
Anon
At the flagship R1s in my state, advising is a foot in the door type job with a huge workload and crappy pay. People leave for other student affairs jobs in the university as soon as they are able, usually before any institutional knowledge is built or passed along. It’s been a persistent problem for decades.
Anon
I guess I might not understand, but how much advising do students really need? What classes to take, dropping classes, what to do if they need help scheduling, and ? Does it really matter if the advisors aren’t there long term? Maybe I don’t get what “falling through the cracks” means. If you are really worried about yoru kid succeeding though, maybe it would be a good idea not to rush into college.
Anon
I think it depends on how thorny a thicket of bureaucracy the institution has created to begin with. For example, it may not be possible to graduate in four years if your major has prerequisites that aren’t offered regularly or that fill up too fast for every student to have a spot. But there may be elaborate workarounds that advising knows how to arrange.
Anon
At my large state university , students complain that advisors give them the wrong information about course requirements, to the point where it’s not uncommon to have to take an extra semester to graduate. That’s a pretty expensive consequence of treating your employees badly, though obviously students are ultimately responsible (I agree with the post above that advisors are paid terribly and don’t stay in the job long, plus any mistakes are exacerbated by how hard it is to get into classes more generally).
Anon
Yes, because requirements change more often than they should, new advisors aren’t as quick with all they back end systems and majors can have hundreds of students, and there’s definitely institutional knowledge at play with things like which faculty are more amenable to adding an extra student or two over a cap, or which prerequisites can maybe be taken as a coreq, which classrooms are more roomy (again, some caps are a little more flexible than others), etc.
No one wants to scramble their last semester because a course that’s required for graduation suddenly isn’t available. A solid advising team prevents these late in the game “aw crap” moments. It’s a behind the scenes role that few appreciate when things are going well.
Anon, too.
It matters because taking the wrong classes could cost thousands of dollars and result in delayed graduation. When the advisors are brand new, they often make mistakes because they don’t know more than anyone else about prerequisites for certain classes.
Anon
So the advisors aren’t professors — something I learned at Today years old.
To any student: if possible, do a thesis. That will get you a competent adult and their attention.
Anon
I went to NYU a couple of decades ago, and I know there was someone listed as an “advisor” on something, but I never once met or spoke with that person. I wouldn’t have even known where to find them!
My spouse blamed their advisor for them not graduating on time because they missed a requirement and I was shocked. I just sat down with the course catalog book that has all the requirements in the front and went through them and figured it out.
Anon
The “advisor” role depends on the school. At the state flagship university I work at now, advisors are staff who don’t do anything except serve as advisors. At my fancy private college they were professors and advising was only a tiny part of their job responsibility compared to research and teaching.
Anon
It’s not just a problem at public universities. I went to MIT and met my advisor once a semester at most and it was just for him to sign a form with my classes on it. We spoke for less than 5 minutes each time. When I was a senior he said “your grades aren’t good enough for grad school in this field” but offered zero guidance about what else I could possibly do.
There were other ways in which MIT was more hands-on and supportive of its undergrad students than large public universities, but advising was not it. At least not 20 years ago when I went.
Anon
Sure, there are always advisors. But in my experience at a larger top-20 private university, they weren’t helpful whatsoever. The professors just weren’t that focused on undergraduate education, and the “advising” appointment was a check-the-box exercise. When I applied to law school (4 years post-graduation), I couldn’t get a meaningful recommendation from a professor – hadn’t developed a close enough connection. This was partly my fault, but the environment didn’t facilitate it.
Anon
My small state U had the chair of the chemistry department teach the freshman seminar. I have a feeling that this is not the norm in a R1 or R2 type school. Maybe you get a grad student and 500 students? I know my nephew was an engineering major at a R1/R2 type school and the kids all had to fend for themselves doing problem sets and figuring it out since the grad students who taught them were mainly there for their own degrees and helping freshman was just a time cost for them.
Anon
I know some kids who were good at math and science in their small town high schools who got lost with not being warned about the rigor from day 1 for their engineering program and quitting it after struggling for bad grades and were communications majors or something else where they weren’t getting steamrolled. IDK if more close advising would help, but I’ve seen it with so many kids. OTOH, my understanding of SLACs is that they don’t typically have engineering programs (unless Lehigh is a SLAC — I know people who have done well in engineering from there).
Anon
It is common at fancy private R1s but not large state schools. I had recitation taught by Nobel laureates more than once. But honestly I’m not sure it was a good thing? A grad student would have been less of an a-hole and probably would have put more effort into preparing for the class.
Anonymous
Nope. I went to a top-ranked public university where there was no academic advising at all. You were entirely on your own to figure out how to fulfill the requirements.
Anon
I am sorry but you have got to get a handle on your college hyperfixation and anxiety. You’ve explored all topics and angles here already. Yes, I’ll collapse the thread. But you might benefit from someone telling you this is too much.
Anonymous
Yes agreed. It is constant rambling anxiety. You need help.
Anon
I think that’s kind of exaggerated. There’s often more faculty attention at smaller colleges, and elite private colleges (both small and large) generally have very high graduation rates compared to State Us. But it’s definitely still possible to fall through the cracks at a fancy college. And there are ways to get a more personalized experience at a bigger college, like doing research with a professor or being part of an honors college or learning community at a State U.
Fwiw my high school was also larger than a SLAC and I refused to even consider them for that reason even though my mom went to one and loved it. I was a shy kid who wasn’t assertive about seeking out teachers and professors, and I had a fine experience in high school and a great experience in college. The vast majority of kids will do fine at larger schools. Unless your kids have some special needs or you have some reason to think they won’t be ok in a bigger school I wouldn’t worry about it too much.
Mantra Magic
I work in higher ed and there has been a trend toward “intrusive advising” during the past few years to keep students from falling through the cracks. Some public universities are able to do this depending on how their are resourced. I wouldn’t assume all SLACs are like this but I’m sure many are. Graduate school does take a fair amount of self direction so you have a good point about the transition being potentially difficult. That said, the transition is difficult for lots of reasons, not just advising. And some graduate programs do have proactive advisors that reach out to students to make sure they are on the right track. It depends on the type and size of the graduate program. There is no one size fits all.
Anon
A friend (through grandparental funds) sends her dyslexic kid to a private school where he has per-class tutors in some areas. Each day, the teacher reaches out to the tutor who tutors on whatever is needed for the day and then circles up with the mom. This is in a high school. I am envious of the supports (but to the other point: the rest of life is not like this).
anon
This was very hard to follow. I guess if you want your kid to get lots of hand-holding, then yes, look for a school that does that. But what does your kid think? There’s something to be said for not letting kids fall through the cracks, but they absolutely will not get that kind of personalized attention post-college, so that’s something to be aware of. The motivation to succeed has to come from the student, not the parent.
Anon
I’m not sure about pivoting; I was pretty self directed before going to a SLAC (my mom never went to college, my dad wasn’t involved in my education, and the local public school wasn’t academically serious, so I spent high school taking distance courses in order to meet requirements to apply to a good college to begin with!). The support from my SLAC also didn’t end upon graduating (some of the services like career services were still accessible, but also some of my department’s professors became lifelong mentors and cheerleaders for my graduating class and presumably for other students as well).
Cat
how much advising does your kid actually need? Are they self-motivated or no? I had advisors in HS and college and they basically just rubber-stamped my own plans (approving AP courseload in HS, confirming in college that I wasn’t accidentally not taking a class that would be a prereq to keep my major on track).
If you want your kid to have advisors to mitigate YOUR anxiety that they’re staying on track, that’s a different problem.
Anon
+1 – your kid will figure it out. This is all part of growing up. My parents had absolutely no involvement in my college course selection or satisfying requirements at my R1 and I did just fine. Nor were they involved in my high school class selection. If your child needs additional support, address it at the time when it becomes necessary (ie after they run into an actual problem ). The world will not end.
Anonymous
That works with typical kids but not the ones with ADHD, anxiety, etc. who create giant unfixable messes through avoidance. These kids need proactive non-parental guidance to teach them to be functional adults.
Anon
The OP didn’t say her kid had any particular executive functioning issues. FWIW, I have ADHD and part of what made me learn to scaffold the heck out of my life was screwing stuff up where it didn’t really matter in the long run but was uncomfortable in thr short term. Obviously you as a parent want to step in before it is a giant unfixable mess, but there is a big space between letting them fail out of college deeply in debt and worrying about college advising when said kid is a freshman in high school (which to me indicates a forthcoming level of handholding that may not even be necessary).
Anon
At my university (5k ish undergrads), department chairs were students’ advisors. We had to meet with them at least once a semester; we were not allowed to register for classes until we met with them to make sure we were making progress towards our degree. I never needed an override but I know they could provide them for various reasons like if a class you needed was full they could add an extra seat to the class for you.
I guess I just assumed that every school operated this was but TIL!
anon
I work at an R1 institution, and all this varies even by college and department! Some of the colleges have advising centers that are staffed with professionals who focus just on advising. This is true for arts and sciences, and business, and several others. Other colleges have the model that you’re describing, where you’re assigned to a faculty adviser or department chair to make sure you’re taking the right classes in the right order, and can offer guidance on which electives might be best for your career path. That seems to happen more often with engineering, journalism, and other disciplines that have a clear vocation in mind.
OP: All this to say, is that advising is highly highly highly variable, even within the same institution.
Anonymous
My SLAC was not like that at all.
Seventh Sister
Heavy hands-on advising wasn’t common at my SLAC in the 90s. I remember having to go to a dean once or twice for “big” issues – switching a class on an emergency basis after add/drop, applying to do an honors thesis a bit late, but stuff like graduation or major requirements were pretty DIY (though you might get a letter as a sophomore or junior reminding you to take a required class).
Anon
I didn’t go to a SLAC at all, and honestly do not remember having an advisor in that sense. I think I met with the head of the department for my major once at some point to confirm that I had all the required credits to graduate with that major. I had professors who I got to know and who gave advice, but there wasn’t anything official or enforced. And it was fine? The requirements for my major were all listed online, so I chose my courses accordingly. I think my mom helped me read the course catalog before my first semester, and after that I had it pretty figured out and spoke to other students about it. I’m sure there are some people who benefit from more support, but just a counterpoint, this isn’t something I feel I was missing and I had a great college (and law school) experience. I wouldn’t worry about this unless your kid(s) need extra support in that way.
Anon
Same at a small state U (not the top-level SLACs). That said, it’s not like I’m going to not get a history or English degree because I took United States history before European history or Shakespeare after the Bronte seminar. I think in other majors (nursing? accounting?) it may matter a whole lot more, to the point of needing a 5th year or one of those BA-to-RN programs. Maybe also math and the hard sciences? In Chemistry there is a sequence. And our business school was weird in not letter you double-major outside of the business school or even have non-majors take classes because of some weird block scheduling thing that they did.
I should have focused more on not getting summer jobs in retail, but I think our career services focused more on post-college employment and eventually I just stumbled into the “you don’t get if you don’t ask” school of thought with shooting as high as wasn’t laughable with crafting my own summer internship (while working as a babysitter nights/weekends to fund it).
Anonymous
It’s not necessarily about formal advising. Many SLACs have “freshman experience” programs where they teach the kids how to be college students, require them to attend office hours, etc. Timid or anxious kids can benefit from being required to practice these skills. I worked at a SLAC where professors would reach out to students proactively to offer assistance if there was an issue or if the student seemed to need career or grad school planning guidance. All of the SLACs my daughter visited also touted their success in placing students in internships, and some of them had programs requiring students to work with the career center regularly. These programs may not be useful for self-motivated, assertive students who can figure things out for themselves, but less aggressive kids who get overwhelmed and avoid dealing with this stuff on their own can really benefit from structured programs as well as from a general culture of faculty outreach.
Anon
None of this is really unique to SLACs and applies to the Ivies and other very selective private universities just as much if not more. What you describe is more of a fancy private college thing (parents expect to see some return for their $$), not a small college thing.
Anonymous
TL:DR – by going to small schools, I was basically raised to always seek out my advisors. So I don’t fall thought the cracks because I don’t let it happen.
I went to a SLAC (Davidson College. I graduated over 10 years ago, so it might have changed). I had an official advisor (at first rather randomly assigned when entered, then my chosen advisors within the department of my major). I was not a science major, but I took a lot of science class with one prof that I liked, so she became an unofficial advisor, as I would go to her office hours for help on more complicated concepts at first and then just liked her as a person. When my mom ended up in the hospital for a week rather suddenly and I had to fly home immediately, I emailed her and my academic advisor and they both helped to communicate with my other professors. A lot of this was self driven and just who I already was – I went to a small boarding school for HS and had an advisor there and it was standard to have a meal with your advisor at least once every two weeks (this was a separate person from you college/post grad advisor). The self directed part of it was that when I had questions in college, I went to the professor’s office hours, without hesitation (I was used to this from my high school). I figured they’re the ones teaching the class (no TAs except for 101 level languages classes at my college), so they’re the ones that have the answers to the tests/will be grading the papers.
I the went to a law school that was smaller in size. I went to office hours frequently. This had two reactions. First, the law profs immediately guessed I had gone to a SLAC, as they said those are the law students that most frequently show up to office hours. Second, kids who had gone to big universities in my 1L section were sort of amazed I did this – basically said they couldn’t fathom going to office hours, ever. They’d never done that in 4 years of undergrad or even considered it. I’ll say that the most difficult time in my career is when I worked for a partner that said “I don’t like answering questions.” (The specific reasons I ended up working for this person would out me immediately). After hearing that, I immediately started looking for a new job.
Anon
I’m a professor at a SLAC. Happy to answer anything, but….what’s the question here? [I didn’t read the Friday thread.] To speak very generally, SLACs tend to be better equipped to provide advising with regularity, just because of numbers. But individual departments at bigger schools can do that, too. There is a move for faculty and advisers to act in loco parentis at many places, so that faculty and advisers become more like counselors (and I don’t think that’s a good thing, for what it’s worth).
Depends on your kid, on the specific SLAC, etc — but sometimes I’ve found that our SLAC kids are surprised/dismayed at less hand-holding once away from the SLAC, whether in graduate school or a job. But again, that depends on all sorts of factors, including maturity, the helicopter-level of the parents, privilege, etc.
Like I said, happy to answer any questions. But please let me say here: there’s no one-rule of colleges, and there’s no secrets to unlock. Please, please try not to over-think colleges at this stage (or any stage) — it will not be great for you or your kid, and it won’t help in the long run.
anon
I went to a SLAC (Davidson). I graduated almost 20 years ago, so no idea what it’s like now. We each had an advisor that we were randomly assigned to, and we met twice per semester (beginning and middle). Once we declared our majors, we were able to approach a specific professor and ask them to be our advisor. We still only met formally twice per semester, but they gave more recommendations on coursework, summer programs or jobs, study abroad programs, etc.
BUT I had all the support you’re describing from professors whom I just got to know. I have so many examples of professors who encouraged me to push myself academically, who helped with plans for graduate studies, who gave good life advice, who checked up on me after a tragedy in my city, who invited groups of students and former students into their homes, etc. I don’t know that I would have “fallen through the cracks” at a larger school, but I certainly benefited and grew from the support I had. And to be fair, it was very easy to get recommendations.
I worked for a couple of years before going to law school at a T14 school. I didn’t find it difficult to pivot at law school (though of course, the 1L curriculum is set for you). Academically, I did well. In hindsight, I would have given myself more opportunities if I’d pushed myself to do law review or moot court or clinics and if I’d been more intentional about making connections with professors. But I took my classes, clerked over the summer, and graduated with a law firm job in the city I wanted to live in, so it worked out.
Anonymous
I am finding it interesting that two people who both attended Davidson posted here. I think the undergraduate enrollment there is under 2000 students, so OP, maybe that’s a school to look at for your child(ren).
Anonymous
You need to delegate the college search to your spouse and/or a private college counselor. You are too anxious and are making too many assumptions and are going to box your poor kid into a limited future.
anon
Not sure how this happened, but I realized this weekend that I have no bras that work with tank tops. I hate bra straps showing, I cannot do it, it’s not a cute look. Any favorite racerback options for a 36D? I don’t need an underwire, but I do need some shaping.
Cat
I find racerback styles never actually work with the neckline either – they get too close to the neck and so then they’re showing that way instead of over the shoulders. Can you try using a paper clip with a regular bra?
anon
I’d be willing to look for something with narrower shoulders, but a paper clip seems like a malfunction (or stabbing) waiting to happen.
go for it
I bought a little fabric contraption from etsy that snaps onto the straps then into itself.
I think its called a bra converter.
Anonymous
I’m a 38G and just wear cheap sports bras for this, like the Avia brand at Walmart.
Anon
I don’t wear tank tops that don’t work with the bras I have.
Anon
Who has good t-shirts right now? I need new ones and I’m striking out. Madewell’s are cut short and wide, Gap’s are kind of thin and see through, and the Caslon ones all have little pockets that are halfway under my armpit.
Anon
The LL Bean Pima cotton tees are pretty good.
anon88
Abercrombie, of all places!
Anon
Piggybacking because I was coming to ask about the JCrew Factory shirts. I have a stripped one and a “graphic” one in my cart right now and am trying to either dump them or buy them.
Anon
I ordered a couple of tee public women’s tees recently with a graphic design relative to my interests, and I am pleasantly surprised at the quality of the tee. The tees are “women’s cut” and the fabric is soft and nice.
Anonymous
Gap modern T’s are thick
Anon
+1 The ones specifically labeled modern are thick, smooth cotton. They’re great. The white isn’t see through either. They come in short and long sleeved and different necklines. Downside is the limited colours.
Anon
They used to be all cotton. No longer.
Anon
Try Uniqlo supima. Alas, no v-neck this year in women’s.
anon.
This is my new jam too. I have 4 of them with different necklines and colors.
Gail the Goldfish
Talbots is usually good for basic t-shirts. Their sleeve lengths can be weird, but they usually have at least one neckline option with normal length short sleeves. Sometimes J.Jill, though their color options are usually pretty small.
Jamie
Any ideas where to buy plus size v-neck t-shirts that have print (no stripes, no grey or tan or other basic neutrals) I like some cuts from Lane Bryant but find them usually inconsistent in sizing or too thin. Torrid’s options are good, thick material but usually too long. I’m looking for the sweet spot between not cropped and not tunic length. TIA for suggestions.
anon
Depending on how tall you are, you might have luck at Ulla Popken. They list the lengths on all their tees, which helps because their different lines aren’t all cut the same.
Anonymous
I like Eddie Bauer tShirts. I order the tall size because I’m long waisted ( vs tall).
Anon
I like the Everlane cotton crew. It’s not boxy or cropped, miracle of miracles. They’re all I buy now.
anon
Does anyone ever feel like even though you have nice clothes, you are always somehow getting it wrong for the occasion? Case in point: I went to my kid’s school carnival last week. I wore nice jeans, cute sneakers, a pink utility jacket, and a navy-striped tee. I looked fine but I was overdressed. The other moms were in nice athleisure or school spirit clothes. The occasions vary, but this happens a lot. I dress up for drinks with friends, and they’re in much more casual clothes. Or conversely, I dress way down, and that’s when others decide to look cute. Maybe this shouldn’t matter, but it makes me feel so self-conscious! It also drives me to shop more than I should, thinking that THIS is the item that will help me get it right.
anon
I think some of this sounds like you’re self conscious. I can tell you as a mom that what you wore to the carnival was totally appropriate. the fact that other moms wore something else doesn’t change that. In a group there is always a range from dressy to not dressy and I think that’s even more true post covid where nowhere has dress requirements anymore. Not to get shrinky but is it possible that you’re not that comfortable at these schools functions? that you feel like the other moms are a group you are not a part of? I really only hyper focus on what i’m wearing when i’m not comfortable.
Anon
At kid activities, if I’m “working” at them, I may go more casual. But if I’m just attending the same event, I may be cuter or in less wash-and-wear items. I’m often working for an hour and then attending, so skewing more school-spirit wear or play clothes that can get face paint on them or hit with snow-cone syrup, etc.
anon
Ooof, you’re hitting some uncomfortable truths here. Yes, I often feel like I’m on the outside looking in, and I am not super comfortable at school functions.
anon
I never was either and I’m generally a pretty social person, always has friends. I attribute my outsiderness as a mom to the fact i’m divorced and moved to my town once my kids were in school so missed the earlier preschool years when the moms stay and hang out and i don’t have a husband who coaches with the other dads. Regardless though, might i make a few suggestions? 1) I find it easier to vibe with one person than a group, is there any one mom that you like or feel more of a connection to? maybe try to cultivate that? 2) you don’t need to go these events if they stress you out, maybe send your kids dad or send your kid with a friend and just skip it. My older son is a junior in high school and every year i have dragged myself to the parents event for the grade (and worried a lot about what to wear to it) and this year i just absolved myself from going. very liberating.
anon
I’m an introvert and still manage to have deep friendships, so I don’t know what my issue is! Part of it is that it’s hard both to meet other parents or spend enough time together to build any meaningful relationship. The parents I see most often are the ones at the before/aftercare pickup, which isn’t a time for chatting. The school parents that I’m friendly with are people I know from non-school settings or are friends of friends. There’s also a sizeable age gap between my kids, so the parents I know from my older kid’s activities and younger years (when it was easier to meet people) are definitely not going to elementary school carnivals anymore. It’s essentially starting over with a brand new set of parents. So, yeah, I have always felt like a weird interloper at school events, and I basically suck it up for my kids.
Anon
Yup. Your outfit sounds great and I’m sure the other moms thought you looked cute even if they weren’t as dressed up.
Anon
Your outfit sounded completely casual and appropriate. I think people wear whatever these days, so if you want to look cute then wear your cute stuff! Whenever I go to events with other parents the outfit really seem to run the gamut of formality. I was at a toddler birthday party yesterday at one of those bounce house venues. The moms were wearing everything from athleisure to a fancy jumpsuit with pearl encrusted heels.
Anon
Perhaps you’re overthinking it. Jeans are casual and your outfit for the carnival sounds fine as does the other women in athleisure. I think there is such a wide variety of what goes these days. If you were going to a wedding or a work event that would be different. I also like to dress up more than others and I just joke that I don’t get out much since I’m 100% WFH these days. As long as you look clean and groomed, no one will care! If you are really concerned just text a friend and ask what she’s wearing.
Betsy
Well, some of the moms in athleisure were probably looking at your outfit (which sounds very cute) and wishing they had dressed similarly! I think the key here isn’t always “getting it right” for the occasion – it’s figuring out how to have confidence in the level that you dressed to. If you’re wearing the cute outfit and feeling yourself, you’re coming across completely differently than if you’re wearing the cute outfit and wishing you were blending in wearing athleisure.
anon
Yeah, you’re absolutely right. And I did feel cute when I left the house, so hopefully I managed to keep that vibe going, haha.
Anon
It doesn’t sound like you were off in your formality for the event but more like you just have a different style preference (preppy v. athleisure) than the other moms do.
Anon
This. At least it’s what I tell myself. :)
anon88
I always do this too. I went to a concert recently at a “cool” punkish venue where they were doing a live score of a wes anderson movie. I dressed up like I was going to a concert, but everyone else was wearing like, sweaters and jeans. One weird thing that sometimes helps is thinking of my friend who always nails the dress code and thinking: what would she wear? Somehow that helps me more than thinking “what should I wear?”
Anon
I’m always inappropriately dressed. Doesn’t help that my sisters-in-law are both uber stylish and model thin.
Anon
You’re probably overthinking the carnival outfit. But in general it helps if your clothing fits well, is in good condition, and you pay attention to accessories. Jeans you got tailored, a black t-shirt that’s in good shape, clean sneakers, and a cute purse will look miles ahead of old jeans that no longer fit properly, a shirt that’s starting to sag, dirty sneakers, and a purse that doesn’t quite match. Bring a cute jacket you can ditch if you feel overdressed.
Anonymous
One trick that helps me is to think “what do I wish I’d worn?” And then put that outfit in my closet. Another is just to own it. I’ll never ever be a women who wears athleisure. I have cute workout clothes that I’ll wear for an errand or to the bus stop if that’s what my schedule requires but it’s not the day’s outfit because no matter how much lululemon costs walking around like that makes me feel crummy. It’s not my jam. Also reading this makes me think you’re kinda new to this every day style thing. It’s a journey. Your outfit sounds cute. Just keep working on it if style is important to you. You’ll get better at picking out things that make you feel great. The effort is worth it.
Anonymous
I suspect the athleisure-wearing moms would have liked to be wearing what you picked but have kind of “given up.”
Anonymous
I suspect the athleisure-wearing moms would have liked to be wearing what you picked but have kind of “given up.”
anon
have to disagree. very expensive athleisure wear is hardly giving up. Most of the moms i know who wear it all the time are in great shape, one of the reasons i tend to wear real pants is i don’t love how my tush looks in leggings.
Anonymous
I am pretty often slightly overdressed (similar to your example of the Carnival) but I never think about it! I like my style, I work from home so no one ever gets to see what I wear, and when I go out (even if just to the playground) I enjoy wearing something fun that I enjoy. And I don’t personally enjoy athleisure most of the time! You sound appropriately dressed for these occasions.
Also, this is common enough that there are regularly TikTok trends centered around showing up somewhere with your friends and each person is dressed like they are going to a different event. So you are certainly not alone.
Anonon
Just roll with it. Your outfit sounds perfectly fine in the scenario you described and even if someone thinks your over dressed, so what? The worst thing they’ll think is that “damn that girl always looks put together.” Besides, confidence carries a lot so if you like your outfit otherwise you’ll pull it off.
Anon
Sounds like you looked nice l, not that you were massively overdressed. It’s not like you showed up in a ballgown. I’m sure no one noticed. It’s always good in my opinion to be well dressed for confidence reasons.
Anon
Your outfit sounds fine. It’s not like you were wearing a ballgown – jeans, sneakers and a striped top is still casual. I’m on team no athleisure except at the gym (not a judgement on others! I just don’t like it) so I always wear something like jeans and a sweater or a cute dress at gatherings where some of the people might be dressed more casual, and I don’t give it a second thought. On the flip side, I wore what I thought was a cute but edgy outfit to an event that turned out to be really formal (everyone one was essentially in a suit), and I felt a little embarrassed but then decided to own it and not care. It happens to everyone, and anyone who is obsessing about it is not my problem.
Anonymous
I feel like athleisure is way too common everywhere — if you have a full face of makeup on you should have real pants on. #sorrynotsorry
BUT: then i wonder if this is like in the 90s when my grandmother and mother wore “slacks” everywhere and never ever wore jeans? am i that lady now?
Anon
I don’t care if I’m that lady now.
Eliza
I am too.
Senior Attorney
Your outfit sounds perfect. Many many years ago I had a colleague who said “I’m pretty much always the most dressed-up person everywhere I go, and I’m okay with that.” I adopted that as my own motto and it has served me very well over the years. So I am Team Own It.
Anon
This is me. I love it. I feel great when I get dressed up and I DGAF what anyone else is wearing. I want people to be comfortable and if that means athleisure for them and sequined shorts for me, then that’s great!
Own your style OP. That outfit sounds cute!
Seventh Sister
I always feel slightly out of place at school functions. If I dress casually, there’s always someone (a teacher, the principal, another parent) that is all dressed up and I feel like a heel. If I’m all dressed up, someone *has* to ask if I cam straight from work (which is not always true). I’ve just decided to wear what I like and embrace my inner preppy b*tch. For years, I feel like I was trying to make myself more approachable, and now I’m like, if my clean button-down and loafers offend you, then oh well.
Anonymous
Same! I have a wonderful but typical suburban mom life. After the gym I’m picking an outfit that can I feel good wearing in a moderately nice restaurant if that’s where my day goes. Some women wear gym clothes to brunch but I’d feel awful doing that. No one looks good in clothes that make them uncomfortable. Too casual makes me uncomfortable.
Anon
You were wearing the most casual of casual clothes, you were not overdressed.
Anon
No? I think OP’s outfit was totally fine and there’s nothing wrong with being a little more dressed up than others, but what she described is not “the most casual of casual.” Athleisure and school spiritwear are definitely both more casual.
Anonymous
Random quotes about dressing well:
– dress like you have somewhere better to be later
– dress like you might bump into your childhood frenemy on your errand
Anonymous
I think your discomfort comes not from the level of formality but from the frump factor. If you were wearing an olive green utility jacket in a washed cotton fabric the look would be much more effortless and current and would blend in better. A pink jacket is more of a preppy or Kohl’s look depending on the jacket.
Anon
Jeez, this is a rude comment.
anon
How to deal with a friend you may have outgrown? I’ve had a friend for 15 yrs. We’d spend hours on the phone rehashing what the person either was dating meant when he texted something or said something or dealing with breakups. Lots of bonding through that. Now, I’m happily in a calm relationship which began when she’d been ghosted by a guy of many years. He reemerged 2 months ago with a bizarre story. She believes and is all in with him. I think he’ll hurt her again and also don’t want to spend 4 hrs rehashing texts. She thinks I’m harsh on her beloved and I don’t want to go rounds anymore now that my life is calm. I honor the history and also don’t want the drama. About once a month, she circles back to tell me how great he is and her examples are “the bar is on the floor for men.”
Anon
This is when I’d just swiffer the floor or fold laundry. OTOH, a therapist would charge her and stop after 45 minutes.
Anon
I’d be pretty upset if my friend got into a relationship and then just dropped me because her life is settled. I agree that this guy sounds like he is only going to hurt her again but as a friend, you should still be there for her in some capacity. Just because you no longer want to discuss dating and the drama, doesn’t mean you shouldn’t care about what’s going on in your friend’s life because that’s where she is! It’s like the smug married people who no longer have time for it. You only don’t want the drama because you don’t have to personally deal with it anymore and if you were in her shoes, you’d be happy to dissect every text. Others may disagree, but you don’t sound like a very good friend IMO.
Anon
+1
Agree
Anon
+2. You are not acting like a good friend.
Cat
I get that the drama is exhausting but you are coming off super smug married here.
Anon
Yeah, as a married person myself, I agree.
Anonymous
Set a limit for complaining. Stick to 20 minutes and that’s it.
I had a friend like this and sadly we’re no longer friends. When I was single and dating I never spent anywhere near as much time as she did questioning and analyzing and complaining, but I put up with it because I had so few friends who could relate. When I settled down I was happy to rehash her dates but I don’t want to keep hearing about the guy that’s shown himself to be a POS over and over again. In her case, she was dating a married man with small kids and trying to convince him to leave his wife. I couldn’t listen to her whine about how her efforts to break apart a family weren’t working. I don’t want to give advice about what she could do better to break up a family. Before that, she had dated a drug addict and a guy who maybe (habitually) hit her but she was (habitually) too drunk to remember how she got all those bruises so she couldn’t hold it against him right??? I tried the 20 minute thing but she wouldn’t stick to it. I wish I’d cut the friendship off sooner. You don’t have to wait until your friend demonstrates that she is morally bankrupt to fade away from a friendship that is draining to you.
Anon
I think that friend’s situation is a lot different than OP’s friend’s situation. OP comes across a lot more like “I used to have dating drama like you but I’m superior to you now.”
Anon
I had a friend who took somebody back after months of complaining non-stop to me and other people about how hurt she was that he dropped her. Once she got back together with him, it was clear she was uncomfortable interacting with those of us who’d supported her through the break-up. I told myself that she knew what we thought, and she wasn’t interested in hearing about it. So I basically took a position of “you do you,” and when her relationship came up I said “I’m sure you know what’s right for you,” and left it at that. I have no clue what I would do if it goes badly, but I’ve made a note to future me to remember this go-around…
exterior house painting
I am finally getting around to painting the exterior wood of my house. Trim/windows/doors/porch etc..
Any tips?
My painters just clarified that I need to purchase all of the paints/primer myself. I was surprised, as I thought that would buy and I would reimburse, as that’s what we did when they did the stucco last fall. But this time they said no…. you choose/buy all yourself.
I am not handy, and know nothing about paints.
Any recs for choosing paints yourself? I want to be cost effective, but do it right.
The painters have given me almost no advice. “Sherwin Williams is good”. There is a Sherwin Williams and a Benjamin Moore store in surrounding areas, and Home Depot type places. I had assumed that a paint store would be very pricey.
I live in outside of Chicago in a modest stucco/wood house.
Anon
Frankly, I’d hire different painters. I’ve never had to buy it myself and don’t care to learn about primers, etc. I’ve chosen the colors of course, so I’d be prepared to do that.
Work Phone
Yeah that’s super odd – I’ve hired both commercial and residential painters and they’ve always supplied paint. They have accounts with the big suppliers and usually get better pricing.
Anon
Ditto. Just had my house painted last summer.
Anonymous
+1
Senior Attorney
+1 part of what you are paying for should be them supplying the… supplies.
Anon
Each paint brand has levels of paint. For exterior, I think it pays to go to the more expensive lines. Also, SW seems to give contractors in my area significant discounts. They can all be good. SW’s site had (has?) a feature where you can upload your house’s picture and play around with coloring different areas in their shades (which any brand can duplicate). My house’s outside is a SW color and inside we use a lot of a BM color in a trim and if they know what brand/color, they just mix it up like it’s their own color.
exterior house painting
Thanks for these helpful thoughts.
Do you have any idea what line of SW paint you used?
What part of the country are you in?
Anon
I also have never purchased the paint, and that sounds a little sketchy, like your painter’s credit is so bad that the paint stores will not let him buy on credit. Professional painters get a better price at SW than walk-in customers, so this could be a significant $$ issue. HD paint is garbage, by the way. Go with SW. I don’t know anything about BM.
Did your painter tell you how much paint to buy? (It is also significantly less expensive if you buy in 5 gallon buckets.)
Anon
In my last city, it was common for the customer to buy the paint. Painters had been burned too many times by customers changing their mind or not liking the finished color, “But it’s what the painters recommended”
exterior house painting
Thanks to both of you.
In my area, the pricey painters will of course buy everything for you. But the more cost effective painters say its up to you – you buy or we will.
exterior house painting
Thanks for the SW rec. The painter told me about how much I will need, but I still need to make my final decision on what color goes where.
Anon
You need new painters.
Anon
That’s weird. I hired professional painters, and one of the advantages of that is they get a contractor discount at really good paint stores. Me going to Home Depot and buying Behr or whatever is no substitute – paint’s not as good and it’s more expensive.
Anon
Sherwin Williams runs 30% off sales constantly so I would look for one. I used them for my exterior paint and was very happy. They can advise you on which formulation you need for exterior. Have you chosen the color? I always bring home a ton of paint chips and check them in all different lights throughout the day.
Anon
SW’s 30% off sales are not as good as the contractor’s price. Source: a SW manager.
Anon
Maybe if her contractor has an account there she can pay but buy under his account? Not sure if that would work, just an idea.
Anon
Thanks folks. I’m in a different financial class than most of you…. I am working with someone who does the painting for the house flippers and who actually works for the pricey construction company during the busy season. He is starting his own business on the side. He did a fantastic job on the stucco, and he is eager for more business in my area.
He just doesn’t want to deal with the details…. “Call me when everything is ready”.
I will go to the Sherwin Williams store tomorrow to see what’s offered. But yeah, I can tell this is where I will wind up spending more $$ unfortunately. Too bad….. there is a Sherwin Williams sale 25% off that ends today…. but I’m not ready to choose colors yet.
It’s just that there are a lot of different types of paint to choose from, and I have some metal things to paint and a deck to stain so that’s a bit beyond my expertise. I’ll ask around….
Anon
I’m the OP…
Anon
I can see why it’s disappointing that this is not a full service situation. One way to look at it is that painters may be tempted to go with the cheapest paint, if that’s not specified in the contract. So you have an opportunity to do slightly (or a lot) better. In my experience, a Sherwin Williams or Benjamin Moore store in a nice neighborhood might be able to advise you on the various quality levels, as well as do a price comparison if you know the quantities.
If you’d rather not take this on, you can probably find other painters who do offer full service. It might still be worth specifying quality level in the contract – especially for exterior paint in an area with weather extremes like Chicago’s.
Anon
Is there a name for the thought pattern where you’re always planning ahead for worst-case scenarios? It’s not ‘catastrophising’ because I rationally know that bad things aren’t likely to actually happen and I don’t have a lot of anxiety, generally – but I did have a rough upbringing and as and I adult I have now thought about and made at least mental plans for what happens if my husband dies suddenly, what happens if my kids get cancer, what happens if the house burns down in the middle of the night … and on everyday things I almost always have a Plan A, Plan B, Plan C – I’m not strongly attached to my Plan A, but I enjoy the process thinking thinking through how to pivot if necessary. It was kind of a survival skill I picked up from a chaotic childhood.
Anon
I do this and it’s a symptom of my anxiety. One reaction to anxiety is research and planning. One thing my therapist has me do is specifically not act when my anxiety is telling me to act (ie, not googling cancer symptoms) but to wait and be in the moment. If it is a real issue that can, in fact, be acted upon (ie schedule a checkup with my physician ) I can do it at a planned time. Even though you are not researching, it sounds like this might be similar. (And you say it’s not catastrophizing, but it still might be, I’m not a pro – you just aren’t spiraling but are planning. You are still letting anxiety control your thoughts.)
Seattle Freeze
For me, this is one way anxiety manifests, and it absolutely came from a traumatic childhood in which I did actually need to be prepared for bad things that happened all the time. I called it (and justified it as) constructive pessimism, and in some ways it was helpful to have planned for the worst (though I turned out to be imagining and planning different “worsts” than the ones that actually occurred in adulthood).
However. Eventually I found the right antidepressant that also shut off most of the anxious perseverating and worry that had been in the background my whole life. And now instead of planning in my head for the worst *all the time* I can take action instead.
If you find yourself thinking of these things when you’d rather not be, try writing out the plans, or even dictating them to a voice recorder. This helps solve the planning/action itch, and seeing or hearing them helps to figure out if they’re things you really need to do something about.
Anon
I do a bit of this, but have always approached it as giving myself options. I’ve known (and in my younger days, bee one) too many people trapped in horrible jobs, with crappy husbands, in a town they hate, etc and do what I can to prevent it happening again. It’s served me well.
KS IT Chick
Worst-first thinking? In a former life, it was how I had to operate. What is the worst possible outcome of a decision and how do I prevent it? Repeat ad nauseum.
It took leaving the job and counseling to have it not be the way I function. I still get unreasonably anxious over some things, but it isn’t how I live my life now.
Anonymous
Ha this is what my therapist told me to do to help my anxiety. Let’s say the worst does happen, what would you do? You would handle it. I don’t think it’s a bad thing to have a plan A, B, and C; it’s when plans Z, AA, BB still aren’t enough that you should consider therapy.
HFB
a lot of ppl are saying this is a form of anxiety, but this is actually how i soothe my anxiety! knowing i have a plan if something goes wrong, and knowing i’ve thought carefully about “what’s the worst that could happen?” makes scary things less scary.
Sasha
Not to armchair diagnose but if the act of planning soothes your anxiety, it may be a symptom of OCD (per my therapist, so take with a grain of salt). Obsession = worst case scenario, compulsion = creating a plan to avoid or handle. The compulsion soothes the obsession and makes you feel better. My issue became that I would get obsessed with ridiculous worst case scenarios (i.e. Being forced by some malevolent person to choose a family member to d*e) and if I wasn’t able to come up with a satisfactory plan to handle that ridiculous scenario, I would spiral.
Anon
That’s what i thought too (I posted above). But soothing anxiety is not the same as addressing the root cause. There’s also a difference between in the moment saying “what’s the worst that could happen? I would be ok if that happened” taking 10-15 seconds, sitting with the discomfort, and moving on or planning out options A,B, and C for each concern that is taking significant time and is being revisited, to a point that it’s disruptive.
Anon
What you’re describing is literally catastrophizing scenario planning! It’s how my ADHD and anxiety show up.
Sasha
I have this same issue and my therapist attributes it to OCD. We do a lot of exposure therapy for it which has been helpful. My issue was that if I was in a situation where I couldn’t identify a good Plan B, C, etc., I would get extremely anxious and distressed, no matter how farfetched the scenario I was worried about was. If that’s not happening for you, this could just be a result of your personality and can be a real asset! But if it’s creating distress, might be work talking about in therapy.
Anon
I don’t think they pathologize things that aren’t a problem. So if it were making you miserable, there might be a name, but if it’s fine, then it’s just “planning ahead for various scenarios”?
Anon
Yes, this is anxiety and catastrophizing. Think of the opportunity cost – what are you missing in life in the time you’re spending gaming out bad scenarios?
Cat
the line between being prepared and giving yourself options, and borrowing trouble, is not always clear. stressing over increasingly-unlikely scenarios when you want to be doing something else? something to work on. thinking in a non-intrusive way about estate planning or your medical coverage in case of a worst case scenario? seems normal and prepared.
Anon
Haha that is anxiety.
Anonymous
There is a book that calls this “constructive pessimism.” I do this and find that it increases resilience and reduces stress because I am always ready to pivot when necessary. I am the one who calls the ambulance in an emergency, grabs the fire extinguisher when the grill catches fire (and knows how to use it), finds a new flight when there’s an delay, etc. My husband, on the other hand, does not make contingency plans. He is always anxious about anxious what will happen if plan A doesn’t work out, and freezes in an emergency.
Anon
Catastrophizing is the term, I think. You imagine worst-case scenarios so when they happen (as they sometimes did in your childhood) you can be practically (and more importantly for the inner child, emotionally) prepared.
BeenThatGuy
This is very common after having a chaotic childhood. My therapist taught me that this type of response was a survival technique I had to learn has a child in order to survive (functioning alcoholic father). But now that I was an adult, the response no longer served me. Basically, my “toolbox” needed to be filled with other tools for coping, rather that coming up with back up plans for my back up plans. Always needing to be in control was/is my big issue.
Anon
I am reading a book on life in a Medieval Castle that points out that private real estate ownership by commoners was not a think in England (or the continent) initially after the Norman Conquest. Mind blown. IDK why I thought otherwise, but does anyone know of a good legal history book of how people came to own real property throughout the world? I feel like all of a sudden I know nothing (and yet I live with teens who Know Everything).
Anonymous
Not a source but I feel like a lot of it came much later when the Industrial Revolution were starting – people were abandoning farms as they got less profitable and so that was when I think they started allowing farmers to buy the land.
I know that land ownership was part of the appeal of moving out west — my ancestors moved from russia to south dakota for the free land. They had also moved from Germany to Russia for the free land around 1918; Catherine the Great didn’t want to abolish serfdom but wanted people to work the land so she gave it to the Germans.
https://library.ndsu.edu/grhc/research-history/history-germans-russia#
Germans from Russia
How random to see another German from Russia on this page! My family has the same story, except moving to North Dakota.
Anon
You betcha.
Anonymous
woot!
Now I want some chislic
Wow I’m a third German/Russian with South Dakotan roots on here :)
Anonymous
This is pretty fundamental to the entire feudal system, the renaissance, and ultimately the revolutionary war. The whole idea is that the crown owns everything and grants land to the king’s BFFs aka the lords. The lords’ continued ownership of that land is at the pleasure of the crown. Land and titles could be taken away willy nilly. That system gave rise to the Magna Carta (gross oversimplification here) outlining the respective rights and duties of the lords and crown. The commoners had absolutely no property rights or ability to obtain property rights. The rise of the mercantile class flush with cash (and no real property) led to the popularization of banking most famously in Italy. The influx of cash led to investments in the arts, subject to the authority of the church, which led to the renaissance (can’t stress enough that I’m vastly oversimplifying). When the European powers started to colonize, they spread their concept of property rights, or rather lack of property rights for anyone but the crown/church. They enforced this through the genocide of indigenous peoples and the redistribution of their land to the crown’s favorites. The power centers were too remote from their colonies to effectively manage them, the colonies rebelled, and the old system of property rights was largely disbanded, except for the genocide bit which continued for centuries. Welcome to my (coffee) drunk history.
Still today, in much of the UK and some places in the US, it is impossible to buy real property outright, you can purchase a lease of a max of 99 years, sometimes from an individual/family sometimes from a guild (more common in the US).
Anon
This is wild. What is the bar exam equivalent like in the UK? I’d almost like to watch the BarBri classes on it.
Anon
I went to law school in Canada and remember learning about fee tail estates, even though it’s not a thing I’ve ever encountered in the wild!
Anon
Have encountered the fee tail in . . . Downton Abbey. Where it was practically a co-star.
Anonymous
Where in the Us?
Anonymous
There are still some guilds in the original 13 colonies. Some of the guilds predate the country.
Anonymous
My parents have this arrangement for their retirement home–it’s on Jekyll Island, GA, which is technically all a state-owned park. It’s 99 year land lease, though you own the house (yea, how you own the house but not the land, I don’t know). My parents’ take was “we’ll be dead when the lease runs out, so that’s your problem.”
Anon, too.
The concept of private property led to the freedoms we have in the US. I would start with googling from fuedalism to private property and read some articles from both a right wing and Marxist perspectives. Here is one I found: https://fee.org/articles/private-property-and-government-under-the-constitution/
Anonymous
Yes, Marxist political thought is fascinating on this issue. The communist manifesto, the good earth, Mao Zedong by Jonathan Spence, gentleman of Moscow, totalitarianism by Hannah Arendt, shah of shahs, and kite runner would be an interesting reading list with some very different perspectives across different geographies. I tried to alternate serious as not as serious books to an extent.
Anon
Land by Simon Winchester is a popular nonfiction book that talks about this. It wasn’t my favorite of his books and I don’t know if it totally succeeded in taking on a pretty fraught topic, but it was a fairly easy read if you just want an overview of the subject.
anon
+1 This is the book you are looking for.
Former Historian
This is a very broad question! Are you primarily interested in the development of laws related to land ownership in the post-Roman west or in other times and places? You are being given a lot of information on feudalism, which makes sense but in its classic form, that existed in a relatively limited time and place.
Also, even within feudalism there was enormous variation between countries and over time. (Feudalism is kind of like capitalism in that respect.) So that (for example) the rights of vassals and castellans in 14th Century England was really different than 10th Century France. Any particular areas of interest? Are you more interested in the development of western feudalism or the transition to capitalism? Or just in the development of laws related to private ownership of land?
An.On.
It’s not legal history about land ownership specifically, but Bill Bryson’s At Home is a very interesting look at why/how (UK) houses came to be the way they are and there’s a fair amount of historical background trvia and tracking the change in use in habits for the domestic sphere over the last several centuries.
Vicky Austin
Tomorrow is my firm’s post-tax season holiday! The morning is taken up with random chores and kid’s pediatrician appointment, but the afternoon will be mine for a few hours. I’m gonna leave the house, but I don’t want to spend too much. What would you do?
Cat
I always feel better for having gone outside – if weather is nice of course. long bike ride? botanic garden visit? restaurant with a great patio to get lunch? if not – leisurely library visit? museum that you’ve been wanting to check out but never quite fit in on weekends w a baby?
Anon
Go to a movie or get a pedicure.
Work Phone
How’s the weather where you are? It’s around 70 and sunny where I am, which is perfect for eating a sweet treat outside.
Senior Attorney
Mani/pedi and/or lunch/coffee with a friend.
Walnut
Botanical garden is my go to or some sort of city public space with great places to loiter for a bit and just be. Maybe bring a kindle to read or a notepad to do some journaling?
Anon
Congrats to you and other accountants on being done with tax season!! When I had a baby that age and found myself with a few hours of kid free time, I loved to get a pedicure and/or spend time reading in a coffeeshop. Personally I would not do the botanical gardens or something like that that’s pretty easy to do with a baby in a stroller.
Anonymous
If you could order a suit to arrive in time for a Big Hearing in state court, and you wanted to feel awesome but also like you would get a lot of mileage out of your new suit, and you are a size 16 inverted triangle shape, what suit (and top!) would you get? Budget <$500, ideally <$300.
Anon
I get the most wear out of a navy blue Ann Taylor suit. It’s the seasonless stretch fabric I think. Easy to wear and looks professional.
Anon
My black Ann Taylor and charcoal gray Ann Taylor suits get the most wear. The suit jackets that I bought at the most recent sale are machine washable, which is a huge plus for me. I’ve really been liking the sleeveless shells from Calvin Klein for tops under a suit jacket. Yes, it doesn’t have sleeves, but I won’t be taking off my jacket during the court proceeding, and since it is machine washable, I’m less worried about needing the protection of some form of sleeve on my underarms.
Anonymous
Talbots? Honestly I always have to get suits tailored so it’s not a thing I can get with a quick turnaround.
anon
+1 to Talbots, since you can try a bunch of sizes
Anonymous
I’m loving how quickly comments are showing up today! Thanks, Kat!
Blow Dry vs Air Dry
I am almost 40 and have had thinning hair since puberty. I’m not bald, but my part is wider than most. I’ve been able to maintain the same level of volume for a while so most of what I shed grows back. I’ve been to several doctors and they don’t have an explanation for it. Topical treatments make my scalp itch. My hair is curly but looks fuller when I blow dry it straight, so I have been blow drying it a couple times a week for the past two decades. There is always a lot of hair on the blow dry brush, probably more than most people shed. Lately I have been wearing my hair curly and letting it air dry. I thought this would be healthier for my hair, but it seems like I shed even more now. I have to wash my hair more often, and I comb it in the shower with a wide tooth comb. I try to be very gentle and douse my hair with conditioner and detangler before combing, but by the end there is a lot of hair over the shower drain. Should I go back to blow drying? Or should I change my technique?
hair loss
Have you seen a dermatologist who specializes in hair yet? There are very few that are really knowledgeable.
Are you know of an age where your hormone levels could be changing? That is often an age and trigger for several types of inherited/autoimmune as well as hormonal hair loss.
So if you really think you are shedding more
Do you have a good hairdresser? If so, I would have a thoughtful conversation about what is really the best hairstyle for you so that you can preserve your hair.
I have a few types of hair loss, and I wash it less, never blow dry, use very gentle shampoos/detanglers, am careful not to pull it back tight in ponytails and take the Costco hair/nail/skin multivitamin. I also corrected my anemia (taking iron), which worsened my shedding, made sure I am not vitamin D/folate/B12 deficient, and am using hair dermatologist treatments that have helped my hairloss (minoxidil/finasteride).
anon
I do not have thinning hair but do have curly hair. You probably aren’t shedding more with it curly, but when it sheds it gets caught in the rest of the hair versus falling out on furniture, etc. So it just seems like it’s shedding more.
Anon
I second the recommendation to see a dermatologist if you haven’t already. Mine was really helpful. I have also had thinning hair since my early 20s. Minoxidil works. The foam is available over the counter, but it also comes in tablet form and for that, you need a prescription. I switched from foam to oral minoxidil and the transition was seamless. When you first start, be patient. It took a very long time before I stared to see results with the foam. On technique, can you skip the wide tooth comb in the shower?
anon
Is it smug married to let over-dramatic friends go a bit once you leave that phase of life? Comments earlier on that person’s post says yes. At the same time, I see it as how I no longer go partying looking to date and play once I found my partner. I don’t judge them for their process but I don’t fit in there anymore and it’d be odd to try. I think it’s one thing to shift focus away from that and stay friends but I struggle with that person being told they are smug or a bad friend if they are no longer wanting to spend hours for an indefinite period rehashing a terrible guy’s behavior in general, even if the catalyst for this is that she found a calm relationship.
Anon
Sounds like you’re generalizing about all single people based on the behavior of one of your friends, which I would definitely say counts as smug married!
Anon
If you don’t want to be friends with unmarried women, don’t be friends with unmarried women. No one makes you fill out paperwork to justify your decisions.
Now, if a knot in your stomach tells you that you’re being a Smug Married, you can listen to that and figure out how to adapt your friendships and boundaries, or you can ignore the knot and look for affirmation.
Anon
So should single friends drop their friends who want to discuss wedding planning, pregnancy or selecting a daycare? If you are friends solely based on shared life circumstances then sure drop them when yours changes. But those are not deep friendships in my opinion. You don’t really care about these people if you’re willing to drop them like that. In my friend groups, we all talk about our lives regardless of whether we are in the same place and respectfully listen and respond. It’s really not that hard to be a good friend. I have friends who are single, engaged and planning a wedding and married for several years with a child in the suburbs.
Anonymous
It’s not smug married to let some distance grow between yourself and friends who are on different life paths and have less in common with you, but it would be smug married to tell them that their guy problems are causing you to step back from your friendship. If pressed, you can say that you feel you’re on different paths or whatever without it sounding like “I figured my s—- out and you didn’t”.
Anon
I’m going to push back on that – “different life paths” don’t always stay different, as life is long. And friendships with people outside your same exact life path, especially if you have a long history, can be the most valuable of all. Figuring your s—- out is not a permanent status, and I know I don’t want to be the type of person who thinks of friendship only as a one way street, where friends support me when my life is rough but I distance myself when they need more support.
Anonymous
You’re not a bad friend for setting reasonable boundaries. You’re a bad friend if you drop people who have spent years supporting you through a difficult season of life the minute you’re doing better.
I commented in the other thread about my friend who went after the married dude. I’m sure she tells her friends that I dropped her when I got married. That’s not the whole story at all and if she had any capacity for honesty she would know that. I didnt stop talking to her because she’s single and I’m married, it was because I strenuously disagreed with how she was living her life.
Anon
She probably doesn’t talk about you as much as you talk about her.
Anonymous
Social media suggests otherwise. But thanks for the random barb I guess?
Anon
If you’re a real friend, you care about what’s going on in your friends’ lives. You don’t sound like you do. Maybe sit with that for a while and honestly think about why you’re so smug, yeah I said it, about your own life.
Anonymous
+1
Senior Attorney
From my perspective as a Very Old Person, I think friendships have seasons. One of my best friends at the moment is somebody I went to high school with, but we were out of contact for … what? 30 years? there in the middle when our lives just diverged, geographically and career-wise and every other way. Not every friend has to be an hours-on-the-phone friend, all the time.
Anon
If your friend listened to you when you were struggling with the ups and downs of dating and now you feel like she’s being “overdramatic” for doing the same thing, that makes one of you sound bad and its not your friend. And the stereotypical Smug Married is someone who thinks they will be in the honeymoon phase forever – all of my married friends have had seasons where they needed support from friends, including single friends, who could listen for hours rehashing a husband’s bad behavior. Tread carefully here.
Senior Attorney
Ooh, such a good point!
Anon
As someone who is filing for divorce like this week, THIS.
Absocks
Een prachtige jurk! Ik draag het hele jaar door soortgelijke, en als ze in één kleur zijn, draag ik een panty met patroon om de hele outfit een beetje karakter te geven.