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Our daily TPS reports suggest one piece of work-appropriate attire in a range of prices. We are lovng this dress on sale at Zappos (they seem to have a number of dresses on sale today, for some reason). Love the sleeves, the flattering v-neck, and the subtle pinstriping. It's marked to $97.24 (was $142) at Zappos, and available (as of this morn) in sizes 4-16. Tahari by ASL – CS Pinstripe Bi-Stretch with Self Belt (Navy/White) – Apparel Seen a great piece you'd like to recommend? Please e-mail editor@corporette.com with “TPS” in the subject line. (L-2)Sales of note for 10.24.24
- Nordstrom – Fall sale, up to 50% off!
- Ann Taylor – Friends of Ann Event, 30% off! Suits are included in the 30% off!
- Banana Republic Factory – 40-60% off everything, and redeem Stylecash!
- Boden – 10% off new styles with code; free shipping over $75
- Eloquii – Extra 50% off a lot of sale items, with code
- J.Crew – Friends & Family event, 30% off sitewide.
- J.Crew Factory – 40% off everything
- Lo & Sons – Fall Sale, up to 35% off
- M.M.LaFleur – Save 25% sitewide
- Neiman Marcus – Up to 30% off on new arrivals
- Spanx – Lots of workwear on sale, some up to 70% off
- Talbots – 40% off entire purchase, plus free shipping no minimum
- White House Black Market – Buy more, save more; buy 3+ get an extra 50% off
And some of our latest threadjacks here at Corporette (reader questions and commentary) — see more here!
Some of our latest threadjacks include:
- What to say to friends and family who threaten to not vote?
- What boots do you expect to wear this fall and winter?
- What beauty treatments do you do on a regular basis to look polished?
- Can I skip the annual family event my workplace holds, even if I'm a manager?
- What small steps can I take today to get myself a little more “together” and not feel so frazzled all of the time?
- The oldest daughter is America's social safety net — change my mind…
- What have you lost your taste for as you've aged?
- Tell me about your favorite adventure travels…
N
It looks a bit boxy in the bust area to me – would help to see it on a real person and not the mannequin to see how it falls.
Also not a fan when they have to zinch in the waist with a visible belt on the doll.
housecounsel
I think this dress definitely has possibilities, but I wish there were a matching jacket.
housecounsel
Threadjack . . . getting dressed this morning I realized I am in dire need of white button-down shirts for days when I want to look super-conservative and lawyerly in my pinstriped suits. Where can I buy really good quality white button-downs that will fit my obnoxiously hourglass figure?
lawDJ
http://www.tmlewin.co.uk. I buy their “fitted” shirts and they are wonderful for an hourglass figure. At 34DD I wear a size 10 in their shirts. Note that I don’t mean the “tailored fitted” shirt, I mean the ones that have a seam running up and down on the left and right in the back and front of their shirts. You usually have to pay for shipping and returns but it’s totally worth it to me.
E
I love TM Lewin! They are literally the only shop in this city (as far as I’ve been able to look) who sell women’s shirts.
Veronica
Thomas Pink’s stretch slim fit (I know, it’s weird) shirts actually close over my DDs without gaping between the buttons, and as a nice bonus still look new after a year of hard wear and multiple washings.
The bad news is they cost $180 a pop. Yipes.
Eponine
Get the no-iron ones from Lands End for $40 (often on sale) and get them tailored to fit your waist if they’re too boxy for your hourglass figure. These shirts are great quality, really crisp even after many washes, and even with $20 for tailoring you’ll come out ahead of what you’d have paid for other brands. I swear by them.
ERP
housecounsel – get your white button down from brooks brothers. IMHO they are the best!
anon
I love to BB no-irons. Wear to work and wear on weekends with khakis or jeans (alone or with cardigans.) they’re a fabulous crisp look.
fresh jd
I have Banana Republic no-irons and they are good too (and cheaper than BB).
M
I’m a 34F and BB fitted non-iron in 10 fits great
Bonnie
Definitely Brooks Brothers. They’re usually 2 for $149. They come out of the drier looking like they’ve been dry cleaned. In my experience, they’ve held up much better than Banana Republic button downs.
Parisienne
Wow – I do love this dress. Would also love it with a plain navy blazer. I would buy it if I were sure it was washable – which I think it probably is. Truly a year round dress. The pin stripes add a touch of wit.
EM
HAPPY NEW YEAR!
Eponine
Gut yontif!
C2
Does anyone have a go-to brand/style of blazer they can recommend to wear with sleeveless and cap-sleeved work dresses? The suit jackets I have (mostly AT/Anne Klein/Jones NY, i.e. not great quality) always seem “off”. I know this will vary by body type (I am short-waisted so some of my trouble is that the buttons don’t cinch at my natural waist), but I’d love to hear if anyone has found a particularly versatile jacket, in any price range.
Me too
Great question, I would love some recommendation as well. From what I can tell, the best types of jackets to wear over dresses are a bit shorter and very fitted. I have never found anything that I really like, so I end up wearing a cardigan instead.
AIMS
I have a black blazer from Benetton from ages ago that works well (I think), though I can’t say its perfect. I think what makes it work for me is that its slightly longer than my other jackets and it has very narrow lapels & is very simple, so it never distracts from the dress.
My instinct when looking for jackets to match w/dresses was always to go for shorter, almost cropped jackets but I find that does not look right at all. Fwiw, I am about 5’3/5’4 & a fairly standard hourglass shape.
Emily I
My favorite, favorite basic black blazer to go over anything is one I got in college from my mom – more than a dozen years ago. It’s in great shape and still stylish (three button, high-ish stance, not too long). The bad part – it was from Casual Corner, which is now kaput! I hope I can get a few more years out of it…
Anon for Today
Threadjack: I got into a car accident, it was my fault, and I feel like the village idiot. I was thinking about the million things I had to do when I got to work. Thank God no one was hurt, but just the hassle that the other driver has to go through, I feel so bad for him. This is my first and I’m taking it a little hard, I guess.
B
Oh I’m so sorry. This happened to me years ago…I felt so awful I couldn’t stop crying lol — and I am NOT someone who cries.
All you can do is learn from it:/
Midori
I did this for the first time in my life yesterday! Was on my way to court in an unfamiliar neighborhood and rear-ended a girl’s brand spanking new car. She had bought it _the day before_. I felt (and still feel) TERRIBLE. I guess my only consolation is that I’m human, and it happens to most people at least once. I’m trying to take it as a wake-up call–increase following distance and pay attention to the road, for goodness’ sake! It could have been so much worse!
Midori
Supreme irony, btw: I was on my way to court to represent a police department in a car accident case when I rear-ended the girl. The investigating officer asked me for my business card after he wrote me a ticket. :-O
fresh jd
Is this you, Midori? Just kidding (I think).
http://abovethelaw.com/2010/09/lawyer-of-the-day-anne-bremneri-represent-seattle-police-you-cant-arrest-me/
RR
It happens. Speaking as someone who was in a fairly bad accident that was someone else’s fault, I think people are understanding. The guy who rear-ended me (hard, knocking me into the car in front of me and totaling my car) had insurance and was apologetic. We all make mistakes. No one was killed or seriously hurt and you have insurance. Just learn from it and move on. :)
Lawgirl
Sorry about the accident, @Anon For the Day. I’m always a jittery, crying mess after accidents, even if they’re fender-benders. Waiting for the police, exchanging insurance info, having other drivers gawk at your stupidity, ugh. Blessings that you are safe and the driver wasn’t harmed.
Eponine
Thanks for not being a jerk about it! I’ve been in two accidents that weren’t my fault and both times the other driver was a jerk. I got into one that was my fault as a teenager and I was nice about it, and so was the girl I hit. Don’t worry about it too much. You’re human and accidents happen.
RKS
EXACTLY. If you caused it and you’re apologetic, then the person will likely be much nicer about the whole thing. I’ve been involved in 3 fender-benders in the last year, twice rear-ended by someone behind me, and once came out to my parked car to find someone else’s car smacked into mine. The ones where the people were nice were SO much easier — and in both fender-benders, I let them slide because the damage was minor and the person was so nice. The car sliding into my parked car … wow the guy was a complete a$$, and made the whole thing worse. We most certainly pursued that one to the max (it also involved more damage).
surrounded by lawyers
Hang in there. I know how it is. I rear-ended someone once when I had my teenage sister and a dear friend in the car with me, and man did I feel awful about it. I felt I had risked harm to everyone involved–though in fact nobody was hurt.
Don’t beat yourself up. Just do your best on the road and, as has been said, be grateful it wasn’t worse.
eplawyer
It happens. Just be honest with your insurance company and move forward?
You’re not in Boston are you and drive a minvan?
Anon
HA! Nice :)
I’ve spent waaay too much time this morning checking and double-checking my fantasy lineup.
EG
The most important thing is to be apologetic and honest–especially with your insurance company. This March, someone rear ended me while I was stopped at a red light. I was on my way to see my Dad, who was very ill, and I ended up just sobbing by the side of the road! My Dad did pass away the next morning, and I missed seeing him that last time, even though he wouldn’t have known I was there.
The most upsetting part was that the other driver lied, and said she was coming from a different direction and I clipped her–even though she got a ticket and I did not! Our two insurance companies got in an argument, and I ended up paying my deductible to get my car fixed. It got settled in the end, it was her fault and I got my money back, but it was a really stressful experience at a really bad time.
So, Anon for Today, don’t feel too badly–stuff happens and as long as you handle it OK, people know it could easily have been them!
Anon
I am so sorry about the loss of your father, and the added stress of a car accident at that stressful and sad time.
SF Bay Associate
Agree with the others. It happens. I’m glad you and the other person(s) are ok. I’ve been in one accident, years ago, and I was at fault. I was upset about a guy and totally distracted, and sideswiped someone. I was beyond hysterical by the time we got to the shoulder, but the man I hit (and his I suspect boyfriend/husband) could not have been nicer. He calmed me down, said they were both ok but because there was damage to his car, we needed to exchange insurance. I still remember his kindness and patience and am grateful.
But when you talk to your insurance company, be sure to tell them you were obeying all traffic laws if you can. I think I told my insurance I was going about 70mph, which was actually on the slow side for the freeway I was on. Stupid, pre-law school. I should have said like 64, especially since I really could have been going 64 (I don’t remember much from the accident). Your insurance is not going to investigate that closely and there’s no reason to volunteer you were breaking any laws if you aren’t sure you were.
Also, I would like to give a shout-out for my insurance – USAA, available to those who have served, their kids, and their grandkids (thanks grandpa). I have never dealt with nicer, more courteous, and thoughtful insurance agents than with USAA. Shocking, I know. If any of you are eligible, I *highly* recommend looking into it. I pay less than my SO does to State Farm, and get way better coverage. After good experience with USAA insurance, I switched my banking to them too and couldn’t be happier.
SF Bay Associate
Reading EG’s new comment, just to be clear, I am not advocating outright lies :). You know which direction you were coming from, that you were at fault, etc. But exactly how fast you were going? I wasn’t sure of that, and I regret guessing in my disfavor.
MPC
Agree about USAA! I don’t have car insurance through them (because I don’t drive and therefore have no car to insure), but I’ve been banking with them since I was a kid (thanks, Dad). Their online banking is super convenient– I can deposit checks at home using my scanner!
a lawyer
Sorry to disagree, but I think that many loyal USAA customers on the Gulf Coast would seriously disagree about USAA after Katrina. Many faithful USAA customers were appalled and could not believe that they now needed lawyers (eeek!) to sue.
Anon
I know you want to go back in time and make things different! It can be hard to let go and move on. The insurance will take care of it, be happy that things are ok, nothing else you can do. I was in one last year, sort of a 50-50 at-fault, and I obsessed over it for at least a month, which accomplished absolutely nothing.
Amy
Oh no, I am so sorry to hear that. It is such a shock the first time you have an accident. My first accident is loooong in the past but I still remember how awful I felt (mine was also my fault). The most important thing is that no one was hurt. That right there is something positive to take from the situation.
You can only beat yourself up about it so much. Accidents happen, that’s why we buy auto insurance. If you have a busy day ahead, just try to put it out of your mind and focus on the tasks at hand. Give yourself some time tonight to feel bad about it, and then move on tomorrow. I am sorry and hope there is a relaxing bubble bath in your future. :)
Anon for Today
Thanks for all your supportive comments – exactly what I needed to hear. I’m feeling much better now but still want to send the person a gift certification for a fab dinner after it’s all over.
anony atty
A sweet and thoughtful idea, but please check with an attorney before you do that. It can used as evidence in a lawsuit. Even if they all seem fine now (thankfully), maybe three months down the road, the other driver gets a twinge-y back and starts thinking you might be a good source of funds. Hopefully not, but you never know…
Perhaps a very anonymous gift certificate, or, preferably, a donation to the charity of your choice will help you feel better about your karma (no pun intended). But really, as the others have said, these things happen, and you’ll feel less badly each day. Your insurance will make it right with the other driver. That’s what you pay for insurance.
eplawyer
Would have loved this but for the material. Polyester/viscose.
I have a jewelry question for ya’all. I have a lot of grey suits now (my closet looks like a freaking storm cloud). My question is do I wear silver or gold jewelry with them. I have both so that is not a problem. I just feel silver would blend into the grey too much. But I am not sure gold is right either. Opinions ladies?
E3
I tend to wear silver or pearls with my gray, but I’d also be interested in what others have to say!
ceb
I agree . . . PEARLS! But if you go with a metal, I think cool silver tones look best with grey.
AIMS
I’m wearing gray today (skirt and short sleeved cashmere sweater) with gold earings! I think it actually looks kind of funky & modern — a bit unexpected and yet still obviously conservative. I like pearls and gray, but then I always feel like a stepford wife when I do that — so classic that it’s a little too “too” for me. Gray doesn’t work well with all gold but some small delicate stuff looks really nice in my opinion. I wouldn’t write it off.
Midori
Gold can look very very cool with gray. As you say, it totally depends on the shades and styling, but I’ve both seen and done that look to (IMO) great effect.
eplawyer
Of course, Pearls. And I am a pearl kinda of gal. Have no idea why that never crossed my mind.
Anon L
I have olive skin and black hair, and I prefer gold jewelery with my grays for the most part, particularly if the shade of gray is one that might make me look a little sallow…the gold warms my skintone back up.
Anonymous
I like pearls with gray, but also have a silver/crystal necklace that I like with gray suits
Samantha
Why not add some color to it with a coral or turquoise necklace rather than plain silver or gold? I’m all for bright colored jewelry!
If I had to choose between silver and gold jewelry, I’d pick silver to remain low-key and businesslike, or gold to stand out and look more bold and assertive. If I had a client meeting, then maybe toned-down silver, and if it was a relaxed sort of day then gold.
ct
I recently bought a turquoise necklace and it goes really well with gray.
Eponine
Meh. It’s like an amalgam of trends in business attire. Dress? Check. Pinstripes? Check. Cowl neck? Check. Belt? Check. Ugly? Check… all it needs is to be styled with some open-toe booties and we’re good to go.
I do like Tahari ASL though. Great quality and often on sale.
Midori
Cowl neck? Same dress?
Eponine
Yeah. Look closely – it’s pretty clearly a cowl on my screen.
fresh jd
Thank you! I was waiting for someone to finally comment on the PINSTRIPE COWLNECK! And it’s polyester blend. It’s something I would expect in the Junior’s section made by XOXO or Rampage. Bizarre-o is the word that comes to mind.
Midori
Ah, I see it now. Wasn’t showing up well on my screen. Hmm. Yeah, I’m not sure what to think of that. I’d have to see it in person, I think.
housecounsel
FYI, I have the dress and jacket pictured in the Anne Klein ad on the right of this page, and it is pretty awesome.
Random question: I love David Yurman jewelry. Do you think it ages a woman, or is overdone/overworn like an obnoxiously logo’d bag?
E3
I don’t see the Anne Klein ad. This has happened a number of other times when people have mentioned specific content in ads they’re seeing here. I suspect they rotate, so links to specific products would be helpful. :)
K
I don’t think it’s overdone/overworn. IMO it can seem a bit like a costume on a woman in her 20s or early 30s unless she wears it all the time (i.e., no switching things up with more delicate/bohemian/whatever designs) and tends to a preppy or conservative style.
AIMS
I am not sure I agree that it has to be worn all the time — I mean, if I see you on Tuesday in my DY earings, are you going to know that on Wed. I wore my “bohemian” bangles and danglies?
I actually like the idea of DY — and any other jewelry/accessories — worn in unexpected ways, i.e., pearls with non-preppy outfits, a gold rolex watch with a funky long dress, etc. So I wouldn’t say that it’s looks costume-y on non-conservative or non-preppry dressers — if anything, to me, that look would seem much more like a uniform!
As to the OP’s specific 2 questions — 1) I see it DY so many young women (and the company makes kids jewelry, too!) that it has honestly never occured to me that it could be aging (unless you wear everything coordinating at once, but that has nothing to do w/DY); and 2) Yes, it is a bit overworn like a logo bag (at least in the NY tristate area) — but jewelry is a personal choice. I wouldn’t let that stop me from wearing something I loved . . . I would just add some other accessories to make the look unique.
Ms B
I love my Yurman pieces because they are not only classy and classic, they are durable and well worth the pricing, especially if you purchase at one of the outlets. (Many props to the fabulous Jean at the Vegas outlet!!!) I have broken lots of jewelry at the office in my day, but all of my Yurman pieces have held up great (some for many years) and they look practically new after a good cleaning at my favorite local jeweler.
In terms of aging, I think it depends what pieces you pick. A simple box chain, a basic cable ring or bracelet, or small two-tone cable crossover earrings are neutral pieces that can be worn by ages sixteen to sixty. I especially like the multi-sized pearl bracelets and necklaces because they are both fun and conservative and can be flipped to show the unique two-tone cable clasps. (The multi-sized white pearl bracelets make good bat mitzvah gifts.) Yurman men’s pieces like the sea urchin cufflinks or the small dog tag with a unusual stone also can add fun to an outfit.
On the other hand, the mosaic and confetti bracelets, the extra-large Renaissance bracelets and rings, the ultra-chunky bejeweled chokers with enhancers, the triple strands of large silver beads and some of the diamante pieces say “senior partner’s wife at the firm dinner” to me. It’s all about what you pick . . .
MM
Kat, I love you blog and think you do a great job, but … Maybe I’m biased because I can’t wear skirts to work, but it seems like the blog features a very large ratio of dresses versus pants/shirts options. At my office, I don’t think the women really wear dresses that often at all. How about the rest of the Corporettes? How often do you wear dresses? Would anyone else appreciate more posts regarding blouses, shirts, and pants?
lawyer
I second this comment (including the part about Kat doing a great job and loving the blog!). I would love some snappy pants outfits. I realize this might be more difficult because it will be difficult for Kat to find an entire outfit she wants to endorse – dresses are shown as and often worn as standalones, whereas for a pants outfit Kat would have to find a picture of slacks and a cardi/blazer together that she wants to post . . . but I’d appreciate it nonetheless.
Anonymous Today
I agree that skirts and dresses seem to be featured more often, but I don’t mind as I wear skirts and dresses every Monday-Thursday (and some Fridays). I suspect that it has something to do with the fact that pants are more basic. Of course there are different styles and different specific pairs, but there is only so much variety in work-appropriate pants, whereas there is more variety is work-appropriate dresses.
s-p-s
Because I’m so comfortable in them, I wear dresses almost every day – as to my female biglaw colleagues, a few wear dresses just about every day, while most of the others wear them once or twice a week. Usually I wear a blazer – as to an earlier question about blazers with dresses, I find that a belted or fitted blazer works best.
JuliaBee
I never, ever have worn a dress to work. And very very rarely a skirt. Don’t know why, just is not as comfortable for me. I would second (third?) the request for more pants-based outfits (that are not suits). Thanks!
fresh jd
I think Kat has referenced before that her preference skews towards skirts.
In the summer, I can’t wear anything but skirts. NYC is a humid crowded sardine can in the summer and pants just make me sweaty and sticky.
associate
Is this a personal preference or a rule at work? Just curious b/c I interviewed somewhere that prohibited skirts and I thought it was a bizzare rule ever.
MM
I can’t wear skirts for religious reasons (well, I can’t wear skirts that expose my calves anyway, and so that rules out all professional-looking skirts as far as I can tell). The other women in my office all can wear skirts/dresses, but I just don’t think they do very often for some reason.
E
Please do not think I am being rude or insensitive — this is a question asked with true curiousity. Could you wear knee high boots and a skirt that goes just below the knee, so that your knee is completely covered, as are your calves? Or is that look not modest enough for your beliefs? I find it very interesting how women who keep frum/modest for religious reasons reinterpret trends and styles to meet their religious beliefs. It would be an interesting guest post, for sure!
Midori
Huh. That’s really interesting. I went to a religious college that _required_ women to wear dresses and skirts because pants were too “masculine.” It’s fascinating to me how modesty is interpreted by different people.
Now I wear pants most of the time because they’re more comfortable to me, and much easier to move in without worrying about whether the cloth is coming with me!
MM
@Midori, I do think long skirts are generally considered more modest, by most religions including mine (Muslim) — I think the reason has to do with preventing any focus on your behind (like you get with a pair of well-tailored pants!). But my personal rule is to just ‘be covered’, so I’m fine with any pair of dress slacks and below-elbow shirt. I haven’t seen a professional-looking long skirt since Rachel Green’s heyday on Friends in the 1990s, so until that trend comes back …
@E, absolutely no offense taken at all. I’m always up for suggestions and happy to answer questions. I personally am fine with the knee-skirts and knee-boots — love the look in fact — though I try to keep the knee-boots in the less va-va-voom category so I don’t feel like I’m defeating the whole point. I wore this to work a few times a couple of years ago and have since chickened out thinking that it’s not appropriate for my Biglaw office … Happy to have you tell me to pull it out again for work!
Ms B
I wear low-heeled riding-type boots (I am presently coveting the Burberry two-tone boot) and “boot skirts” that go to mid-calf with tailored jackets, a cashmere turtleneck twin set, a belted long cardigan, or a cashmere turtleneck with a cashmere shawl (pinned and belted) throughout the winters at a conservative Midwest firm. I have never gotten a single remark on those outfits from my “old coot” partners, let alone a raised eyebrow — and these are guys that do not hesitate to give me trouble about my favorite pink suit or a blouse I have with poet sleeves.
@MM, I say break out the boot skirts this winter!
Anonymous
Happily, long skirts are super hot in both high- and hipster- fashion now… perhaps they’ll be coming ’round to the workplace again soon. I don’t have a preference for skirt length (though I wear a skirt or dress daily) but adore options, gradations, and personality. Variety = spice of life, etc.
Amy H.
I don’t think I’ve ever worn a dress to work. I do have a basic black A-line that I wear with boots in the fall/winter. Being in SF, I don’t have any summer heat issues . . . we needed heavy coats most of this past August. Yipes.
I really need to expand my work wardrobe to include work dresses, I suppose. Today’s posted dress is not the dress that will motivate me to do that, though.
Amy H.
Sorry; that was meant to be “basic black A-line skirt. . . .”
divaliscious11
I wear dress 3 out of 5 days a week…..
Bonnie
I primarily wear skirts and dresses all year long. For me, it’s not about formality or anything like that, I’m just more comfortable in them. Even in the winter, it is easier for me to wear a skirt with tights and boots than deal with figuring out how to make my commuting flats work with pant hems designed for heels.
a lawyer
Agreed. I rarely wear skirts/dresses in the summer b/c I can hardly bring myself to wear a dress without pantyhose and in the deep south it is too hot for that!
Also would ask for more petite clothing. I love many of the clothes featured here but unless it is a very snug tee-type top, I must have a petite size.
Anonymous
Skirts or, especially, dresses every day. Easy… (perhaps lazy…)
housecounsel
Link is below. Not bad for $138.99 (and no, I am not a secret Anne Klein plant for Kat!)
http://www.anneklein.com/Two-Piece-Dress-Suit/90310456,default,pd.html?cgid=90330697&itemNum=11&variantSizeClass=&variantColor=JJ4QGXX
Amy H.
I like this a lot! (Just not with those shoes the model is wearing.)
Midori
Word. Those shoes were my first thought when I saw the outfit.
Louise
Pretty suit, but the description that it “screams sophistication” cracked me up. Isn’t the essence of sophistication the antithesis of screaming?
Suze
Yes!!! Whispering (a la Jackie O, almost) = sophistication. Screaming = snooki.
RoadWarriorette
I like this dress, but as always with dresses I would need to try it on.
My ad was for an Ann Taylor dress that looked almost exactly the same as this one!! Unfortunately I did not click on it and now it is gone. Lame.
Should I email HR again?
Threadjack: I interviewed at dream firm about three weeks ago for dream position. The firm does hiring largely by referral only, so if you get a referral and you are interviewed, it’s generally likely that a job offer will result at some point. My initial feedback from HR about 2 days after the interview was very positive, and the HR representitive told me that the team members were “wanting to move forward with an offer,” but the rep said nonetheless she didn’t want to say so officially as she was waiting on confirmation, etc.
Well, turns out it’s been three weeks and I’ve not really heard anything from HR, except for the 2-3 times I’ve emailed the rep to ask if there are any updates as to the decision/time line/etc. I’ve been told most recently that many of the deciding team members have been on vacation and I could expect to hear some details Tuesday or Wednesday of this week. Well… nothing came, it’s now Thursday, and I am left wondering what to do.
Do I email the HR rep again and ask for another update/time frame information/etc.? I am unemployed right now and so it’s sort of a big deal whether or not this hiring process is going to take weeks/months/half a year/etc. I don’t mind waiting for the process, but I am also sort of tired of being told I’ll hear something on X day, then on Y day, then on Z day and then hearing nothing. What should I do? Is another email justified here? If so, what can I say?
Eponine
If they said Tuesday or Wednesday of this week, wait until Monday afternoon of next week and then call.
CFM
I agree with this, I would wait until Monday, even though I know its hard! Best of luck!
SuzyQ
If it were me, I would probably not call HR. They may be in the process of interviewing other people, they might be undecided on the offer, or making a decision on your pay package, etc. but either way, I don’t think your calling them will help accelerate things in a positive direction for you. They might even get annoyed or feel more inclined to reject you if they have someone else in mind but are keeping you as their back-up. However, if you have another job offer (esp. an exploding offer) or some positive news to report to them, you should feel free to contact them with that. I have been in your shoes (laid-off and looking) and I know it totally sucks. I had very positive feedback from callback interviews (one law firm and an in-house job) and both ended up getting back to me with rejections at least 2 months later. In the end, things somehow end up working out because in retrospect, those were really *not* the dream jobs I took them to be (I’ve heard stories from people who’ve left those places). Instead, I took a job for less pay at a smaller no-name firm and it has turned out to be my real dream job and I am so glad I did not get those offers. Good luck!
michelle
I know it’s hard, but you have to remember that time goes MUCH more slowly for the one seeking the job than it does for the company – schedules to coordinate, competing priorities, and weeks can go by despite the best intentions. Unless it affects your behavior (you have another offer, or are heading out of town) don’t over-contact; it signals desperation at worst or high maintenance at least. I agree with others that giving them a good time window (50% more time than they indicated?) and then a call/email to reiterate your interest, ask if there is any further info you can provide and/or get an update on expected timing to hear is reasonable. The fact that they’ve been communicating with you is a good sign; in my experience companies avoid speaking to you and send a letter if they have decided not to hire.
Anon
You’ve already emailed them 2-3 times and it’s only been 3 weeks (not to mention end of summer/vacation season/Labor Day holiday)? Be very careful before you find yourself with no offer. You are coming off as desperate and annoying. (I mean that with honesty, not to be mean.) If any candidate we interviewed did this, my department would never hire them. On more than one occassion, I’ve seen a candidate with a great resume and interview blow it because of their behavior after the fact.
Decisions are never made “on time” or on the candidate’s time table. People are always on travel, on vacation, in court, dealing with the latest and greatest crisis, and can be just too busy to deal with hiring decisions.
I know you need the job, but right now, you need to come across as a professional. Just be patient. Best of luck!
Midori
I do think it’s fair to let them know if you’re considering another offer, though. I had this situation when I was hunting. I needed to give an answer to an offer at one firm, but I was waiting waiting waiting waiting to hear back from another. I was also staring at bar deadlines and the hiring decision determined which state I took the bar in. If any of these factors are true for you, it’s not unreasonable to explain why timing is sensitive for you and hope they’ll be considerate of that.
Should I email HR again?
I appreciate the advice, but I am not quite sure emailing two times (I checked my records and it’s been twice) is “desperate.” After the interview, I was told I would definitely hear something either the day after the next. I didn’t, and so I emailed I think 4 days after the interview/2 days after I was told I would hear something. I got a broad update from my recruiter/HR rep at that time and then emailed the same person over a week later for a time line update. This is when I was told I’d hear something Tuesday or Wednesday of this week. So… while I totally understand where you’re coming from as to not seem too over eager, I hardly think “desperate” is the right way to describe my inquiries, especially when I have been merely following up on information that HR/the recruiters have told me. I also don’t know if it makes a difference, but this is a huge company with over 50,000 employees, and I’ve read and heard from multiple sources that if you just never check in with your recruiter, you might easily get lost in the bureaucratic shuffle of things, so for what it’s worth, this isn’t a situation where it’s a super small firm and everybody in the whole firm is reading my emails, judging every word, etc.
I think I will heed others’ advice and wait until Monday and email the recruiter then because I feel I’m within my rights to at least be asking about/trying to verify the time line. I don’t think this is desperate because honestly I’m just trying to get information. If this decision/hiring process is something that’s going to take months, I sort of need to know because it affects my livelihood (how I spend savings, how actively I pursue my other leads, etc.), and I don’t think it’s “desperate” to just try to get a straight answer as to roughly how long the decision process might take. I’m glad I wasn’t interviewing for your firm, though, where just wanting this sort of information would anger everybody to the point of rejection. Eeek.
Anon
I thought it was going to be your 4th email in 3 weeks so I take back my previous observation.
FYI…I do not work for a firm. I work in the US in-house legal department of one of the largest manufacturing companies in Europe (about 50,000 employees.) We absolutely know what emails candidates send to HR because HR breathes down our necks to give them answers. Just know that with large companies it can take months and HR might not even know when they’ll get a decision from the decision makers. It’s not uncommon to tell HR that we’ll get around to it next week and come to find out you have a new corporate president or that half the legal team is called overseas for debt restructuring or to sell off a few companies. (This happens more often than I care to think about.)
Also, I agree that it seems perfectly reasonable to request information about time tables, but that’s from your perspective. Don’t assume it’s reasonable to the decision maker(s) on the inside. For what it’s worth, I don’t make the decisions to toss the resumes. That’s up to my boss. While he may sound like an a$$, I’m just saying that one person’s “reasonable” is another person’s “annoying”. Hopefully, my boss (or someone like him) isn’t the one making your hiring decision.
Suze
This is pretty old school, and may not be appropriate…I think fresh jd’s experience downthread may be indicative of the effects of an oversupplied market in a down economy…but, can you call someone? As in, whoever was your initial/best contact – if you had a good enough vibe with them, maybe a phone call instead of an email (which I know is the standard and perceived ‘least intrusive communication mo, but which sort of ‘demands’ circulation to half the world and might turn itself into seeming ‘desperate’). Good luck in any event – hang in there!
fresh jd
Yes, in hindsight I think a phone call would be better. Exactly as Suze said, I think our generation is loath to call anyone because it feels like pestering or bothersome, whereas an email can be answered at the recipient’s leisure. I think the consequence though is that emails inspire more anxiety in people, since everyone is struggling with a full inbox and the email from the interviewee is what ends up more bothersome, rather than a quick phone call that resolves the issue on the spot.
a lawyer
I agree with Anon. I know it is hard, but too many emails could be a real negative. I have an acquaintance for whom I wrote a letter of recommendation earlier this summer, and she sent me copies of some fo her followup emails to the hiring person, after the fact for my information. I had some doubts about the number of post-interview contacts she made, but it was all done by the time I knew about it, and she did not ask for my advice. At any rate, she did not get the job, although she would have absolutely been wonderful in it. I cannot imagine that she was not the best candidate!
People get busy, people go out of town, other crises with more priority insert themselves. People do not like to be nagged: although I know that is not how you mean it, it may be how they perceive it.
If I have a potential case I am reviewing and am later than I anticipated getting back to potential clients for whatever reason (waiting on medicals in med mal case or report from expert, or just had unexpected motion to respond to), if I am on the fence about the case and then get lots of calls from potential clients that make me think they are going to be high maintenance, that may be the deciding factor in my punting the case. This is different from a job search, but these lessons in how others perceive us do carry over.
I agree 100 percent that a phone call later next week would be better.
Good luck.
Has to be said...
“Hi First Date, oh I mean HR Rep, I had a wonderful date, oops interview. I thought we really had a wonderful conversation. You said you’d call me the next day, I mean, get back to me on Tuesday or Wednesday and I haven’t heard from you yet. I was just wondering when I should expect to hear from you. Are you going to call me? I kind of need to know because I’m thinking of going on a date with someone else from match.com this weekend, but if you’re available I’d rather go out with you. Please call me.”
Yeah, there’s no email you can write that doesn’t sound desperate. Make a phone call. Also, you don’t “need to know” when they are going to get back to you. You just want to know. Don’t confuse the two. Why would you not continue to budget your savings and actively pursue other leads while this decision is being made?
(And you had me rolling on the floor laughing with the “it’s within my rights” and “I need to know” talk. This is the attitude that will get you into big trouble. Listen to yourself. ‘I need to know and I’m going to make them tell me.’ What rights do you think you have after one inteview? You have no rights. They don’t have to tell you anything and they don’t care if you “need to know”.)
fresh jd
A thousand times THIS! I think “Has to be said…” put this important lesson into a useful and humorous perspective. I just wish I had read this thread before I learned this lesson the hard way!
Should I email HR again?
Thank you for the rather rude reply. There are probably more polite ways to say what you said, just as others have. But, for what it’s worth, what I was trying to convey about the ‘need to know’ situation was more that in my situation, knowing how long the process may take has a pretty direct and serious affect on my lifestyle. Sure, I can continue to budget and pursue other leads, but savings and money are finite, as are leads and contacts. Being unemployed for 1 month is VERY different than being unemployed for 6, which is different than being unemployed for a year, and it would be nice/ideal to have a broad idea of the time frame this offer might be coming on. Again, planning to live on savings, etc. for 1 month is different than planning for 6 months is different than planning for a year or any period of time where one might be needing to make severe and serious life style changes to accomodate the unemployment. Similarly, there are only so many good contacts and leads to nurse- why would I want to abuse my contacts’ generosity with their referrals/pursue everything I can pursue with them/make them do favors for me if there is a chance that those favors will go unutilized? The worst situation to be in would be to call in every favor I could and get people to go out of their way for me, only to tell them, thanks, but no thanks. That’s probably just as harmful, since contacts might see me as “crying wolf” if I were to turn down any good opportunity they had worked to develop for me and be less inclined to help in the future. Of course, if this offer falls through/it were seeming like the time frame were going to be quite long, calling in those sorts of favors would probably be useful, but there is probably a period of time to wait before starting to call in those types of favors. Do you understand what I’m trying to say?
Sure, I get that nobody needs to tell me anything (to be fair nobody in life really needs to do anything at all, period dot), but I was just trying to make the point that this is a little more serious of an issue than me just being annoying and antsy, and if HR knows something about this process taking X months, it would be NICE and ideal if there were a way to ask about that timeline and have the information. Or, in other words, I was trying to say that I don’t think it’s theoretically unreasonable to want a simple question answered about the potential timeline, especially if HR knows as much. Why not just let me know? Why is it such an awkward and apparently offensive situation to want to know?
fresh jd
I am stuck in a similar situation: I was in the final stages of interviewing at Co. X, and was in the beginning stages of interviewing at Co. Y (which I preferred). Two days after interviewing at Co. Y (which had told me that the next step is to meet the head of Co. Y, and that they’ll contact me to schedule after Labor Day), I got an offer from Co. X with a week to respond. Everyone told me to email Co. Y with this news and sort of ask if I can expedite the second interview, or something to this effect. Even though I had just recently emailed them a thank-you follow-up email, I again emailed the interviewer and cc:ed the coordinating HR director with news of the pending job offer. They have not responded to me since. I guess I either came on too strong or they may have thought it was an attempt to pit the employers against each other. In any case, I had to just go with Co. X, with whom I had the offer in hand. I don’t know for sure that Co. Y would’ve certainly made an offer, but they did act as though were “wanting to move forward with an offer” after I had met with the main executive. I can’t help but think I played it wrong by emailing them again.
I know it’s not quite the same situation, but I guess my point is that you have to be very cautious with communications during the interviewing process, no matter how bright the outlook or how confident you were about how the interview went. Think more than twice about when, what and how often you write them. In these times, employers are just looking for reasons to narrow the pool of candidates.
Forestgirl
Threadjack–I’m looking for flat or low heeled black boots to wear with dresses and skirts, but I can’t seem to find any that look right–they all seem to me to be too chunky, “motorcycle,” etc. Anyone have suggestions on what style of flat boot will look right with skirts?
Lynette
Have you tried Piperlime? They give you the option of searching through boots according to how high you want your heel and I’m seeing tons of sleeker options.
Forestgirl
Thanks, I’ll take a look.
Midori
Target does too. I know, not top of the line, but the Merona ones fit surprisingly comfortably (on me, anyway). I have a narrow foot, if that’s relevant.
Jess
Did you check out Biviel or La Canadienne? If you can find them on sale – they’re both great brands!
Forestgirl
I’ll check them out, thanks!
Anonymous
And Born or Born Crown… I get a new pair of flat Born boots every year and am Always, always super happy with the new and the collection of ‘old’ that hold up forever, high quality, real-world styling, comfy (arch support). I order a half size smaller than ‘true’ size. Shop around for best prices or coupons… always something to knock $ off. Love the Born.
Ms. Basil E. Frankweiler
I need a winter coat and have found one that looks promising, the problem is it’s online and there is absolutely no way for me to try it before paying for shipping. So my question to you ladies is how do you ascertain how durable a coat will be when purchasing online? Are there any specific words you look for or anything of that nature? This is the coat for reference http://bit.ly/b5XfGm. Thank you all in advance.
KelliJ
I always look for any indications as to how warm it is and how it fits. I like LLBean because they actually give you a temperature rating on some of their winter coats as well as some indication as to how it fits. I posted a link for reference.
http://www.llbean.com/llb/shop/51488?pi=887594&subrnd=0&feat=61707-ppxsrr1
CFM
I have a question for those of you who have used a housecleaning service. I have one coming to my apartment for the first time. I am leaving the key at the concierge for them. My question is, do I tip? And if I do, do I leave it in the apartment? and just tip regardless of whether it ends up being a good job or not? Or tip if I use them again? Thanks for any help ladies!
anon
Tip 15-20%. Leave it there. If they do a bad job, don’t hire them again.
KelliJ
Is this a one time cleaning or something you’re having done every week/2 weeks/etc? I have my house cleaned every 2 weeks and don’t tip. If it was a one time event, I probably would tip.
CFM
Just a one time event
Anonymous
I used a housecleaning service a couple of days before the parents/in-laws were coming into town, and when I inquired about tipping, the company manager explained that it is “generous but not expected,” and further added that the cleaners get paid much better than waiters/waitresses.
When I explained that I still wanted to leave SOMETHING, she told me to leave it in a sealed envelope on the dining table or kitchen counter with a “thank you” written on top.
Anonymous Today
I have nothing new to add, but I wanted to chime in and say that, since it’s a one-time thing, tipping is probably a good idea, but, as Anonymous said, it’s not expected and the employees are not paid a “tipped employees” salary, like a server would be. Because of this, I think a 10% or so tip is more in line with what most people would do.
If it winds up becoming a regular thing, I would skip the tips and give a bonus once or twice yearly instead.
CFM
Thanks everyone!
UnSub
Many of you will gasp in horror, but I am looking for a pair of red dress pants. My closet is a sea of blue, grey, brown and black and I’d like a pop of red to wear with a black and white jacket that I recently purchased. They need to be *nice* pants, not skinny or denim or cropped or cargo or anything other than nice, fitted, straight leg trousers in wool or wool blend. Any idea? Thanks much.
kjf
Are you looking for lipstick red or more toward the maroon color scheme? And, no, I am not gasping in horror because it makes me want to create the same outfit. I might even want to pair it with the red pumps with silver heels from yesterday’s post.
Anon On This One
I’m looking for a pretty red, red if that makes any sense. Not maroon if I can help it. And I *loved* those pumps, by the way.
UnSub
Whoops – that’s me. Have I just outed myself?
sgb
I got a beautiful pair of dark red, straight leg, wool, side zip trousers from Talbots. I love them, and just recently lost enough weight to work them back into my wardrobe :)
UnSub
That’s just what I’m looking for, but I see nothing on the Talbots website this season. Sigh….
Legally Brunette
I can’t help with red pants, but I have a beautiful red wool skirt from the Classiques line at Nordstrom that I bought last year and love. It makes me happy to wear that bright pop of color during the winter especially when the weather is so gloomy.
Here’s a red skirt that someone else on this site recommended. It’s not wool though, in case you are particular about fabric:
http://shop.nordstrom.com/s/3096683?origin=related-3096683-0-0-1
kjf
If you are “lucky” enough to be a plus size I found this pair for you. The price is right.
UnSub
I’d love to see the link when you have a sec. Thanks!
kjf
Sorry…
http://www.avenue.com/Product.aspx?PfId=181960&ProductTypeId=1&affiliate_id=017&affiliate_location_id=013&mr:trackingCode=A7596688-D698-DF11-931F-0019B9C2BEFD&mr:referralID=NA
M
The dress is very good for the office chic style. Pair it with a red or yellow cardigan, low black heels. Or with gray or purple jacket.
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Mens suit
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