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Workwear Hall of Fame: Max & Mia Cardigan

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I've often sung the praises of my circle cardigan from Barefoot Dreams — the brand's sweaters are insanely soft, machine washable, and warm but breathable, AND they have pockets. I have multiples from Barefoot Dreams and, honestly, no regrets about it.

As some readers have noted, though, there's a great dupe to be found from Max & Mia, which you can find sometimes at Costco and, it looks like, all the time at Amazon. Nice.

I have one of these also — the Max & Mia cardigan is an excellent dupe for Barefoot Dreams if you're on a hunt for something more affordable. The fabric is slightly thinner, and there's a slightly smoother feel to the fabric also — I would say the Barefoot Dreams ones are thicker and more luxurious. But for a slouchy, loungey cardigan, the Max & Mia is a great find.

You can find it at Amazon (and sometimes at Costco) for $17–$69. (The ones at Costco right now are NOT dupes for Barefoot Dreams, but they're still a super soft jersey/t-shirt material.)

Some of our other favorite cardigans for lounging include…

Sales of note for 3/21/25:

  • Nordstrom – Spring sale, up to 50% off: Free People, AllSaints, AG, and more
  • Ann Taylor – 25% off suiting + 25% off tops & sweaters + extra 50% off sale
  • Banana Republic Factory – 40% off everything + extra 20% off
  • Eloquii – $39+ dresses & jumpsuits + up to 50% off everything else
  • J.Crew – 25% off select linen & cashmere + up to 50% off select styles + extra 40% off sale
  • J.Crew Factory – Friends & Family Sale: Extra 15% off your purchase + extra 50% off clearance + 50-60% off spring faves
  • M.M.LaFleur – Flash Sale: Get the Ultimate Jardigan for $198 on sale; use code CORPORETTE15 for 15% off
  • Spanx – Lots of workwear on sale, some up to 70% off
  • Talbots – Buy 1 get 1 50% off everything, includes markdowns

Sales of note for 3/21/25:

  • Nordstrom – Spring sale, up to 50% off: Free People, AllSaints, AG, and more
  • Ann Taylor – 25% off suiting + 25% off tops & sweaters + extra 50% off sale
  • Banana Republic Factory – 40% off everything + extra 20% off
  • Eloquii – $39+ dresses & jumpsuits + up to 50% off everything else
  • J.Crew – 25% off select linen & cashmere + up to 50% off select styles + extra 40% off sale
  • J.Crew Factory – Friends & Family Sale: Extra 15% off your purchase + extra 50% off clearance + 50-60% off spring faves
  • M.M.LaFleur – Flash Sale: Get the Ultimate Jardigan for $198 on sale; use code CORPORETTE15 for 15% off
  • Spanx – Lots of workwear on sale, some up to 70% off
  • Talbots – Buy 1 get 1 50% off everything, includes markdowns

And some of our latest threadjacks here at Corporette (reader questions and commentary) — see more here!

Some of our latest threadjacks include:

125 Comments

  1. Wearing this sweater right now. It is definitely more rust and not nearly as red as this image shows.

    3. I have evangelized this item of clothing on here before. I have it in black and the rust color. Also love how soft and comfortable it is.

  2. Any shopping recommendations? I am looking for a washable purse, but none of the Rothy’s ones work in terms or size. I need one big enough to fit a clutch-style wallet and phones, but not enormous tote size. Budget up to $300.

    1. My go-to for washable purses is lesportsac. There are a million sizes and patterns.

  3. Who wants to do some virtual shopping for me? I am going to an outdoor wedding reception in May. We’re in the Midwest, so it could be 80 degrees or 50. Based on the invites, it seems like a casual affair — definitely not formal at all — but dress codes are getting harder every year to decipher! Bonus points if this is something I could wear to other dressy summer events, assuming they happen. I’d prefer to stay under $100 if I can, just because I don’t expect this to be anything I wear often.

    The last time I bought a dress for a fall outdoor wedding/indoor reception (a soft, elevated — or so I thought — sweater dress from WHBM), I feel like I missed the mark entirely and felt self-conscious because it wasn’t very festive. At least I wasn’t horribly uncomfortable, though.

    I have missed special events during the pandemic but I HAVE NOT MISSED finding attire for them. Such a drain.

      1. Okay – I don’t know about you, but the first post-covid wedding I attend, I’m going to show OUT. So that influenced some of my picks.
        Big print, fun colors, love the pleats: https://tjmaxx.tjx.com/store/jump/product/Tie-Neck-Pleated-Skirt-Midi-Dress/1000636205?cs=PDP&rrec=true
        Simple, sexy. Cold? https://tjmaxx.tjx.com/store/jump/product/women-clothing-dresses-cocktail-dresses/Rita-Square-Neck-Midi-Dress/1000655068?colorId=NS1003520&pos=1:24&N=1762182941
        Statement sleeves! Badgely Mischka for $100! https://tjmaxx.tjx.com/store/jump/product/women-clothing-dresses-cocktail-dresses/Off-The-Shoulder-Puff-Sleeve-Floral-Cocktail-Dress/1000650956?colorId=NS1003538&pos=1:28&N=1762182941
        Obligatory jumpsuit: https://tjmaxx.tjx.com/store/jump/product/women-clothing-dresses-jumpsuits-rompers/Bessie-Crepe-Wide-Leg-Jumpsuit/1000642637?colorId=NS1945871&pos=1:64&N=717539276

      2. I’m drawn to sheaths because of the simplicity. Not super into lots of fussy details, nothing low-cut (much to DH’s chagrin, but too bad). Some fit and flare are okay, as long as they don’t extend too far and look girlish, if that makes sense. For colors, I like pinks and blues. Prefer navy over black.

        1. Okay – a little more streamlined/simple/elegant then?
          Love this jumpsuit, I think it’s elegant: https://www.nordstromrack.com/s/eliza-j-sleeveless-jumpsuit/5607886?color=PEACOCK
          Similar color, different neckline: https://www.nordstromrack.com/s/maggy-london-chris-cap-sleeve-jumpsuit/n3509749?color=DARK%20TEAL
          Still on that teal game: https://www.nordstromrack.com/s/sharagano-sleeveless-scalloped-lace-dress/n2123535?color=WENDY%20TEAL
          Lace sheath, also in navy: https://www.nordstromrack.com/s/alexia-admor-kendall-lace-cap-sleeve-sheath-dress/n3289323?color=PINK%20BERRY
          Fit and flare, sweetheart neckline: https://www.nordstromrack.com/s/cupcakes-and-cashmere-soft-crepe-tie-dress/n3344509?color=VIBRANT%20FU

          1. I like all these picks! Sadly, the jumpsuit is sold out. But I really like those lace dresses.

          2. I am a big fan of jumpsuits, but outdoor weddings often have portable toilets. That combination does not work well for me.

    2. I feel like this is the kind of thing I would get at Boden, which has dresses that are nice enough to wear to weddings but in fun prints that can feel more casual.

      https://www.bodenusa.com/en-us/kitty-midi-shirt-dress-sapling-painted-foliage/sty-w0705-grn?cat=C1_S2_G4

      https://www.bodenusa.com/en-us/mischa-belted-dress-sapling-scallop-row/sty-w0588-grn?cat=C1_S2_G4

      These are all above your price point but you might get more wear out of them if they are okay for your work.

      1. I was also going to recommend Boden. One of their maxi/midi dresses with a pair of wedges:

        https://www.bodenusa.com/en-us/katherine-midi-dress-forest-folk-meadow/sty-w0328-grn?cat=C2_S2_G389

        https://www.bodenusa.com/en-us/eda-jersey-tiered-dress-cherry-red-and-summit-stripe/sty-j0808-bbl

        https://www.bodenusa.com/en-us/eleanor-jersey-midi-dress-navy-exotic-escape/sty-j0806-nav

        https://www.bodenusa.com/en-us/josephine-midi-dress-milkshake-pressed-bloom-large/sty-w0689-pnk?cat=C1_S2_G4

          2. I’ll disagree – I think op meant to link to the pink one, which I think looks early spring. (I think May is late spring though!) But the link is going to the gray dress, which is not springy at all!

        3. The dress is cuter and more festive/spring-like in the “milkshake” color. But the sleeves will not be nice if it’s 80 debrees.

    4. If it were 50 degrees, I’d wear a lovely coat a la the Duchess of Cambridge.

      1. Yes this. Look up her periwinkle coat from Jane Troughton – wear it over a light gray dress for a versatile look no matter the weather.

        Another option is a graphic dress. I like this green floral from Lulus – you could add a longer coat or wrap if it ends up being too chilly for the dress. https://www.lulus.com/products/floral-dressed-up-dark-green-floral-print-midi-dress/704052.html?utm_source=google&utm_medium=cpc&utm_campaign=%5BADL%5D%20%5BPLA%5D%20Dresses%20-%20%7BG%7D&utm_term=R683761%20GREEN%2FWHITE2&utm_content=114873399806_490166967514&s_kwcid=AL%217824%213%21490166967514%21%21%21g%21363493748535%21&gclid=Cj0KCQiA4feBBhC9ARIsABp_nbXM-KlpSU_aVX7nmD4mxM6a8pqErjSOMJsJ2rfhxlzLzm-O5KQuirEaAojbEALw_wcB

    5. If none of the Boden suggestions work out, try Vince Camuto dresses at Macys or Nordstrom

    6. Hobbs or Ted Baker are my go-to selections for dresses like this. I also like Wayf and some of the more formal dresses at Anthropologie. Gal Meets Glam used to fit the bill and be sold at Nordstrom, but I don’t know if it’s sold anymore. I think your price point is a little lower than the options below but some aren’t that much higher and I’ve found these types of dresses to be relatively easy to wear again – they’re not overly trendy or ever really “in-style” so they’re not really ever out of style.

      Some selections I think are pretty (and could be layered with a jacket or overcoat if cold)
      https://www.bloomingdales.com/shop/product/hobbs-london-sarah-floral-print-sash-waist-midi-dress?ID=3602991&CategoryID=1001351

      https://www.bloomingdales.com/shop/product/hobbs-london-celeste-pleated-floral-midi-dress?ID=3410998&CategoryID=1001351

      https://www.bloomingdales.com/shop/product/hobbs-london-blossom-silk-midi-dress?ID=3574706&CategoryID=1001351

      https://www.bloomingdales.com/shop/product/ted-baker-magieyy-elderflower-notch-detail-bodycon-dress?ID=3805862&CategoryID=1002442

      https://www.bloomingdales.com/shop/product/ted-baker-jasmine-floral-print-belted-dress?ID=3775423&CategoryID=1002442

  4. Does anyone have a good resource for journaling prompts? Interested in life design, losing weight, less drinking, better parenting, more mindful living, gratitude, and time management.

    2. I am using Michelle Obama’s “Becoming” journal which has really interesting prompts in it.

  6. On the lighthearted end of the spectrum of problems, a makeup suggestion and a request for recommendations

    1) recommendation: buy sample or travel sized mascaras, only. It will make sure you don’t use a mascara longer than two to three months, and you’re less likely to have to deal with a crusty dried out tube at the end of its life

    2) does anyone sell really good, well pigmented duo eyeshadows? I really just need two shades – a matte peachy pink, and a coordinating shimmer. The big eyeshadow palettes sold now are just wasteful for me. My favorite formula is too faced but they don’t seem to make duos.

    1. For #2, I always liked the Clinique duos, but IDK how pigmented you’re looking for.

    2. Anastasia Beverly Hills lets you create your own palette. They come in magnetized singles and you can buy a magnetic case (which has four slots). I like one particular color, so I buy that color for two of the slots and then two darker colors for the other two slots. When one of the shadows runs out, you can just toss that little tin and replace the color in the palette with anything you want.

      Here are the singles:
      https://www.sephora.com/product/eye-shadow-singles-P404832?icid2=products%20grid:p404832&skuId=1790922

      Here is the case:
      https://www.sephora.com/product/empty-4-well-refillable-eye-palette-P406575

      1. Thank you. How’s the formula? Do they go on smooth and creamy? Do you find they blend well?

        1. I mean idk about creamy? Not sure what you mean there, as they are powders, so I don’t that I would describe them as creamy? But yes, I find that they blend well, and last all day. I usually do baby cakes with buon fresco in the crease.

          1. For me, a creamy shadow is one that when you put it on with a flat laydown brush, it forms an even layer that feels somewhat thick, and powder doesn’t fall out everywhere.

            There are some shadows that lay down well in a creamy fashion but don’t blend well.

            I’ve had issues with MAC powders being sort of sheer and patchy in spots, and there is lots of fallout under my eyes. I would describe these as dry and non-creamy.

            I do know they’re both powders, it’s just something about how the powders are put together and pigmented that makes a difference.

          2. Ok, got it. Then I would say this is creamier than the MAC shadows. I switched from MAC to Anastasia Beverly Hills and like it better.

      2. +1 on this palette. I’m normally the type to prefer singles or duos but duos seem to be hard to find these days, so I went with this palette and don’t regret it. Besides being very pigmented I do think the formula blends well, though I will say I occasionally get a little “dust” under the eye when I first apply. It cleans up easily though so not an issue.

    4. Could I interest you in an eye shadow trio? I like Smashbox Photo Edit Eyeshadow Trio. For your colors I recommend “screen shot,” which is nectar, cinnamon toast, roast (in person these look like a matte peachy pink, shimmery taupe/gold and shimmery burgundy).

      1. ooh, I can live with three and I like that one is double size and two are smaller. How’s the formula?

        1. I would say the formula is smooth and well-pigmented (not too thin) also blends easily … but I must admit mine are a few years old so hopefully the formulation hasn’t changed.

    5. If MAC has colors you like, they sell the individual pans (not in cases). You could then just put them in a little makeup case.

  7. i live in Houston. And I am so angry – the Governor of TX basically just announced, no more statewide covid rules. Restaurants at 100% capacity, no more mask mandate. the state is so far behind in terms of vaccine rates. i just hate living in a place where people don’t take this seriously. i would move, but we are stuck here for DH’s job. Plus honestly in Houston, if Abbott would give the local governments a bit more power, things would probably be better. it almost makes me feel like i need to stay home more.

    1. Same. My friends and I are furious and are already trying to figure out how we can only frequent establishments that continue to have the mask mandate and avoid people that decide to go hog wild over the relaxed restrictions. Plus we’re about to see a fairly crazy spike here if folks go back to life as normal…ugh.

      1. And what if everyone rushes to vacation in Texas due to the lack of restrictions there?

      1. +1. We can’t have nice things – and we don’t deserve them. Our selfishness as a nation has predictable consequences and it sucks.

        1. Well, no, not as a nation. Some states, and many people in all states, are continuing to focus through until the end. Your state may not be being cautious, but let’s not call the rest of the nation selfish.

          1. Really? Point to one actual “second wave” vs traveling hotspots that popped up around the country.

          2. TX is one of the top three states for deaths – and will probably be number 1 by June.

          3. Um, have you looked at the national graphs for November through January? Massive peak.

        2. Yes and 500,000+ People died in the US. At some point you become like a Holocaust denier if you continue down this path.

    3. I’m thoroughly disgusted as well. Number were finally going down, people were for the most part following mask mandates, and the thing is EVERYTHING WAS ALREADY AND HAS BEEN FOR MONTHS ALL THE WAY OPEN – Stores, restaurants and gyms have been operating at normal capacity because the building capacity is always lower than typical number of guests. Removing the mask mandate is basically marching people to death. What always upsets me is this old disabled man somehow can’t relate to older and chronically ill and disabled people who are the most vulnerable, or the people that will become disabled because of covid. And to spit in the face of everyone that cares, disallowing county and city level mandates is pretty absurd. I’m really hoping the cities sue the state over the removal of the mandate.

      1. it is also a total f u to Biden, who asked people to mask up for his first 100 days in office. i wish i could move! DH and I started house hunting last week, we looked at a house and across the street was a house with a ‘we love trump’ sign, and the house next door had a ‘black lives matter’ sign. i can imagine those neighbors get along really well

        1. Ha, we’ve got BLM and rainbow flags and the house two doors down put their Trump sign back up on Jan 6th. I still pick up my dog’s p00p when she goes in his yard, but it’s a struggle every time.

          1. How can you tell the difference between your dog’s poop and their signs? No offense meant to your dog…

      2. So if everything was already all hte way open, why does it matter? I actually don’t think this is going to make much of a difference at all. I think most of the spread is happening by people socializing indoors at home, which will continue among the same people who are alreayd being careless. I am someone who is very careful, and not because of the mask mandate. I assume that everyone will continue to be basically as careful or not as they were before. Plus businesses can still require masks, and I’m sure HEB, Walmart, etc. will. I really think this is much ado about nothing. Plus the vaccine numbers are breaking records in Texas every day. We are not way behind. We have been allocated less than our fair share per capita from the feds, but we are doing a great job getting them into arms.

        1. No you aren’t. You’ve only used less than 80% of your allocation. You’ve fallen dramatically behind.

          1. My understanding ( and I just confirmed via Google) is that our usage of allocated doses was very good until the winter storm and is now in the process of recovering. And facts on the ground in my life is that everyone qualified is starting to get appointments.

        2. When you assume you make an a** out of u and me. Businesses don’t have any teeth behind a mask mandate and many won’t require it (especially if corporate says not to). And way more people than you think only do exactly what they’re told and don’t think any further to what they should do versus what they have to do. Innocent people who are wearing mask will now be exposed to dumb anti-maskers and young people will pack but to gut in clubs spreading even more.
          I’m sorry, I question your intelligence if you think people will do the right thing with no mask mandate. Conservatives have shown that time and time again on pretty much every subject.

    5. Not in Texas but this is so annoying because it will definitely create yet another variant. More spread equals more variants. Argh!

        1. I don’t get why facepalm? The more the virus spreads, the more it replicates, which means more opportunity for mutations, which mean increased chance of a new variant(s). Basic science, people.

          1. +1 million. Are people really so science illiterate that they don’t
            know that more spread results in more variants? That’s like high school level virology.

    6. So instead of getting the power grid fixed, we’re going to be encouraged, allowed, and otherwise spurred on by the “freedumb” rally cry to gather in large groups, without masks on. What could possibly go wrong?
      No doubt Cruz will take a break from planning his next vacation or recovering from the CPAC bender to tweet in some support for Abbot’s decision.

      I am an extremely frustrated Texan right now.

    8. There is a reason he made this announcement in Lubbock not Dallas, Austin, Houston, San Antonio. I loved his quote about “more knowledge of how to manage the spread of the virus.” — pretty much everything he just undid. And the county judges can take action if the hospitalization rate goes back up, but they can’t impose a mask mandate or fines. Yeah, that will work. He is horrible.

    9. Today, Texas isn’t cornering the market on dumb. California is lifting restrictions as well.

  8. If at first mask-ne wasn’t enough, now I think I’m getting breakouts from wearing hats due to it being winter. Pretty soon, no patch of skin will be untouched by blemishes. I’ve got on-camera zooms today (but on WebEx and Google’s zoom service — can anyone tell me quickly about blurring filters on them? I am good on zoom (or making myself a cat), but not these other services.

    HATE 2021 ALMOST AS MUCH AS 2020 (BUT GIVE IT TIME . . .)

  9. I need tips on being assertive when angry and not getting so frustrated I cry. This is not a common problem for me but when I’m completely at my wit’s end, that’s when the tears come.

    Short version of the conversation I’m anticipating. I’m an attorney. A former assistant screwed up some files. The records are a mess and we don’t know what we do and don’t have. My new assistant is supposed to fix it. These are truly admin tasks. She does not have time in her regular day to do it and needs OT to do it. The firm has been refusing to grant OT. Months have passed and the task isn’t done because she can’t find time to do it. Firm has suggested other work arounds, none of which have been sufficient apparently. I suspect the firm is going to do the same thing in our upcoming meeting and suggest other solutions that to date have not worked, either because new assistant won’t give up control of the file or because it is really as messy as she says. New assistant justifiably wants to do this work herself so she knows where everything is going forward.

    What I need is for the firm to just grant the OT. Eight hours of her overtime is likely less than one hour of my billable rate. They’ve already told me they don’t want me spending my time fixing these.

    I need to hold firm and not cry when they tell me for the 100th time I need to find another solution to get this done that works for my assistant and her other work that doesn’t take up attorney time. I need firm, assertive, justifiably angry but not emotional or inappropriately angry. I feel like this is a situation where a male attorney would just yell and shit would get done.

    1. So this is where I’ve learned to ask forgiveness and not permission. Just have your assistant do the work and charge her time. Will someone say something? Maybe, maybe not. If they do, it needed to get done and don’t spend a lot of time apologizing or explaining. Unless your firm is going to fold over a few hours of OT, don’t sweat it and just do it.

      2. Same. I would explicitly approve the overtime for my assistant and have her get it done. If someone pushed back, I would say that going this long without the file in order is a malpractice risk that I am not willing to take. I tried it the firm’s way and the firm’s way didn’t work.

    2. This actually does seem like a sitch where yelling would get it done.

      What does your assistant do during the day that you couldn’t just tell her to put up an out of office, ignore everything else to do that day and fix your files? If any other attorney questions her, tell her to send them to you. No overtime needed.

      *full disclosure i also operate on the ASK FORGIVENESS (maybe if needed) NOT PERMISSION principle, so YMMV.

    3. Tell your assistant to get it done! Reorganizing one file is not something that requires overtime. She just needs to get it done.

      1. Whether it requires overtime depends on how bad it is. I’ve had one bad assistant. After she was fired, it took an astonishing amount of time and effort to fix the files.

        1. Yes. And it also depends on the size of the file and the other demands on the assistant’s time. If this is a substantial matter and she is also answering to other attorneys, especially if they are also busy and some or all are superior to OP, then dedicating a day or two to concentrate on OP’s apparently very messy file is virtually impossible. Some tasks are best not performed piecemeal, too, and reorganizing a big, messy file is often one of them.

        1. Lol- she’s an attorney who needs a thing done and I’m guessing has spent more hours trying to solve this problem than it’d take to fix. I’m on team just have your assistant do the thing.

          Insisting on solving problems is never uppity and quite frankly any time someone uses the word “uppity” my sexism alarm goes off (see also “nasty”, “bossy”, “emotional”)

          1. Nah lawyers here think they’re sooooo much better than assistants or admins and it’s really problematic. Everyone pretends to be woke except when it actually comes down to respecting those below them in the org chart.

          3. Hey Anon, no one is saying that she ‘s “better” than her admin assistant. It’s just that different people’s time has different value, and if this is a task an admin can do, it is silly for her to spend her time doing it. Surely you know this.

        2. OP here – I’m in this situation because I’ve been expressly told by my boss that I cannot spend my time on this so doing it myself is not an option. I was actually trying to go to bat for my assistant to make her job easier by getting her the OT she wants so she can get the job done. I’m not sure how that makes me uppity?

    4. If you have the clout, I would say that you’re going to ask your assistant to devote two full afternoons solely to this file, and another assistant needs to cover any other work directed to your assistant. Seriously, if the firm can’t spare her for 8 hours–basically one sick day–they need to approve OT or hire more staff.

    5. I think the question is actually about how not to get teary when you’re frustrated.

      1) try to unburden yourself of the frustration and be less emotionally invested in it. This is not entirely on your shoulders. If, in this case, it’s the firm that is screwed because they won’t pay for 8 measly extra hours, then at some point you adopt a “not my circus, not my monkeys” attitude. Do your day job, assistant does her day job, and Oh Well, this problem doesn’t get fixed until management is actually affected by the problem.

      2) if you can, move the communication solely to email. Lay out a logical case, a cost, a consequence (in $) if the cost isn’t authorized. Again, move on from emotional attachment to it.

      3) if you must speak face to face about it, don’t do it when you’re boiling about it. take a breath, take a walk, write your points down and practice saying them, and then prepare yourself to receive an answer you don’t like. Do not bring how you feel (mad, sad, frustrated) into any of it. Just the facts, ma’am.

      4) if you feel teary while talking, end the conversation. Take deep breaths through your nose and listen to the end of whatever the other person is saying, but don’t say more than, I have to go now or I will send you an email, or think about it and let me know – something like that. Have this escape plan at the ready.

      I am someone who gets teary when I’m mad so I totally sympathize with you, but in this situation, you can’t go with sympathy or hope for empathy. You need cold hard facts and a steely, neutral way of delivering them.

    6. This is a very late reply, and I hope you’ll see it. I have read that if you pinch the skin between your finger and first finger – like the webbing, almost – it will stop you from crying or at least prevent you from crying

  10. Anyone else have a pet peeve about correct use of email chains and subject lines? I’ve been waiting for a draft of something from an associate. I followed up twice yesterday/last night to ask where it was. No response. This morning, he says he emailed it to me before 5 yesterday, didn’t I get it. I look back through my email and sure enough it’s there. He forwarded an email chain between us and opposing counsel and attached the draft to that email. The discussion with opposing counsel has nothing to do with the draft. This stuff drives me NUTS. Do not use an email chain with opposing counsel to send something internally that is confidential/privileged. Too easy to accidentally loop opposing back in. Also stick to one subject matter per email chain! It’s not hard to start a fresh email! Argh!

    1. My pet peeve is when an email is sent to a bunch of people without clear indication of who needs to do what or why some of them were included. I’m in-house and often CCed unnecessarily on things “people think I should know” – frankly it just takes time away from what I actually need to be doing as I skim the email and can’t figure out what the heck I’m supposed to do with that information.
      Here, honestly… are you maybe feeling defensive cuz you followed up on something that was in your inbox already? It sounds like you have very specific expecations about emails that he may not be aware of. It’s annoying that he sent it to you weirdly (and you’re certainly entitled to have an opinion and dictate how it should be done going forward when he does work for you), but it sounds like he got it to you on time (if not ideally).

    2. Yeah, this is not a thing I have noticed or thought about in the past, so I am not certain it is well-known etiquette. That said, just tell your associate how you want communications to look, so that you are happy, relevant emails don’t get overlooked, and there isn’t a risk of copying opposing counsel. Frankly, the email string issue wouldn’t register to me at all, but the multiple emails he didn’t respond to would be a different story…

    3. No but I hate when people use virtual meeting invites to reply all and discuss something entirely separate.

  11. We’ve talked a bit on this board about how some friends you ghost you for no reason. I have a friend from college (who lives on the opposite coast) who did exactly that about 4-5 years ago. I reached out to her to see if she was going to a mutual friend’s wedding, and no response. I’ve called her on multiple birthdays and random other days, and no response. No e-mails, nothing, but because I’m on her x-mas card mailing list, I did learn that she had a second child, which I wouldn’t have known about otherwise.

    I kept wondering if I had done something or said something wrong for her to cut me out of her life, but then I spoke with a few other friends from college and everyone had the same story about her, so I figured it wasn’t personal and maybe she just doesn’t feel like keeping in touch with college friends. I called her a few days ago and left her another birthday voicemail. This time, she called me back the next day and she was chatty patty and never acknowledged the fact that she did not respond to my e-mails or texts or voicemails for 4-5 years. She did tell me that both of her parents had cancer (different types) but both are in remission and doing well and living active lives, so I’m thinking that that may have played a role.

    We were having a good conversation and she acted like we’re back on track as friends (e.g., she told me she’d call me again in a few weeks), so I didn’t bring up the long silence, but it was in the back of my mind. If you were in my shoes, would you have said something to her? At some point, should I ask her what happened there or is there no point in having that discussion (I don’t need an apology)? Also, when I see our other friends from college (1 lives really closeby and our kids have activities together), should I mention that I’m back in touch with this friend and she seems to be doing okay, or just not say anything unless the topic comes up organically?

    1. It depends on whether you want to be real friends or facebook friends. Like, if you were having trouble in your relationship, would you confide in her? If so, I don’t think you can really continue the friendship without addressing the elephant in the room.

      But if Facebook/christmas card/may run into each other maybe once a year, then I would just keep it superficial and breezy.

  12. So…my pharmaceutical company has allowed me to work from home all year, and I’ve worked hard and motivated my small team to get a ton done. Management has published a letter for all employees to use saying, “Im an essential worker”. It qualifies us to get vaccinated starting Wed anywhere in my state that we can find. It’s accurate and important for our manufacturing facility workers but I’m WFH. Should I wait for my Vac group to open, or grab that letter and employee badge and get my ass vaccinated? I don’t live with anyone high risk.

    1. If you are qualified according to whatever criteria your state has, then just go get the vaccine already. Don’t be a martyr. It’s most important to get shots in arms. If you were faking a letter, that would be one thing, but you’re not.

      1. The letter is just for all company employees though, and by my state’s rules im not eligible because i wfh. Lol I haven’t been in the office since March 13 2020!

        1. So what? Your pharmaceutical company is obviously an important / essential business, and just because you’re not actually on the factory floor manufacturing the product doesn’t mean that you aren’t important to that endeavor. A pharmaceutical company still needs accountants, HR people, IT people, marketing people, lawyers, whatever other functions in order to run.

    2. It’s your turn. Get your shot. I’m someone who gets upset about line skipping but you’re not doing that. It’s your turn according to the rules.

      1. The catch is, the letter is “designed” for the manufacturing people at my computer who must go in to work- and statewide yes they’re recently eligible. But we’re probably a month plus out from ppl who work at pharma but WFH. By my state’s definitions, because i WFH I’m not eligible.

        1. Just get the vaccine already! The sooner you get it, the faster the line moves for those of us at the far end. I may not be eligible for quite some time and I would rather you have it now even if you don’t fit the exact intent, than you not have it. You being vaccinated is one small increase in the protection for the rest of us.

          1. thanks you’re right. we were all shocked to see the email at the end of the day and it’s taken me some time to process and think it through. It’s a tad sketchy -but hopefully we all get our chance soon. Good luck getting yours too!

        2. I am quite sure your pharmaceutical company is quite aware that many functions are working from home, and still elected to give you all a letter “allowing” you to get the vaccination.

  13. I’m in a similar position, but it feels a bit more fraught to me. Employer says to say that we work in person, even though we’ve been WFH, because we would normally work in person and there’s a prospect of returning to in-person work. But the form also asks if my job has to be done in person. So am I really supposed to say both that I am working in person when I’m technically not, and also that I need to work in person, when I’ve been WFH for a year?

    1. Maybe you’re my coworker lol- you explained it better but this is my situation exactly. I told my team to just get it- but some live with high risk ppl or have a minor medical condition etc etc.

  14. I actually do have some medical conditions of concern, including one of significant concern. I honestly feel a little strange about qualifying for a vaccine because of my WFH job before qualifying because of my diagnoses? I feel like I’m at very low risk of exposure so long as I’m at home, socially distancing, so I thought other people with risk factors should be ahead of me in line. But no matter how essential they say I am, I’m also at home and socially distancing while WFH. Also, I don’t particularly want to go back in to the office too soon, since I do have those conditions to worry about. At least on a karmic level, I feel like if I say that my job must be done in person, it will come back to bite me.

    1. I do fear Karma! But I’m reading today’s news and it really seems vaccines are going to speed up for everyone in the US. I think you should get it ASAP. You never know what event might happen that you’d need to be in a more high risk situation suddenly, and it would be great that you were more protected. Do something especially kind to work on your karma, and get your vaccine, that’s what I’m planning now!

      1. I think for every job where you can currently WFH but work is saying that you can get it, it is very likely that sometime soon that same workplace will say “okay and now everyone come back in!” I wouldn’t sit at home waiting to get my shot. These decisions are inherently arbitrary because lines have to be drawn somewhere. If you are eligible to get it, please just get it and move on. Help someone else navigate the appointments or pick up groceries for the unvaccinated once you are protected, if you’re concerned about karma. Volunteer somewhere. Leave your house. Support a local restaurant. Don’t be a martyr. There is a lot you can do besides sit at home.

    2. My state won’t open the next phase until a certain percentage of the current phase are vaxxed. So please go get the vax. I have pre-existing conditions and badly want my vax, but my phase won’t open until essential workers are vaxxed.

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