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Updated: Nov 1, 2018 105 Comments · by

Coffee Break

Coffee Break | · ·

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Comments

  1. Lawgirl

    If I paid this much for a stripey scarf, I’d keep the price tag on in full display. — Cheap-to-the-Core-Lawgirl (represent!).

  3. Looking

    Ladies, I have a threadjack. I am applying for a job that is looking for current 3Ls. They want a salary requirement statement in the cover letter. I am really interested in this job so I don’t want to screw this up! Do I have to give a specific number? Can I just say in line with industry standards?

    Thank you in advance!

    • eaopm3

      Ask your career services department at the law school. I had the same dilemma and I went to them, they gave me the average salary range for the geographical and legal area in which I was applying and I was very comforted to have the info. GL!

      • Looking

        Unfortunately it’s not a “legal” job per se. It is sort of related but is considered more of an alternative career path with a JD. Also, our OCS is extremely… how should I say this… well, they’re not very helpful. I’ve had so many bad experiences with them that I don’t even bother with them anymore.

        • JessC

          Try http://www.salary.com. It allows you to search by job (and specialties and experience within that specific career) and geographical location. I’ve found them to be a tad bit high (at least in my market), so keep that in mind.

        • EC

          I feel like there is a resource called the Book of Lists that generally lists salary ranges for jobs in a certain area…your Career Center should at least know where to locate that. Otherwise, does your school also have a business school? See if you can get the information through their career services.

          Also, lots of job postings have salary ranges that are taken off when they hit law school posting sites (no idea why) – see if you can find the original job post or a recruiter also trying to fill the same position, and get some information that way.

      • Good luck!

        I’ve found glassdoor.com and other similar sites very helpful for locating the correct salary range.

      • AIMS

        You can always just say “salary negotiable” & leave off this tangle for later.
        Unless it’s very explicit that no application will be considered without a salary statement, I would say this is sufficient in most cases.

    • Eponine

      In my experience no one ever actually says what salary they want. Just say your salary requirement is negotiable.

  4. Janie

    Help!

    I’m a 2L looking for a summer internship. I had an offer that I was considering and then turned down. While I was considering the offer, I had emailed one of my top choice employers explaining that I had another offer with a deadline, etc, etc. I haven’t heard back. The employer probably got a million and a half applications, and unfortunately, the timing was such that I had sent the email a day before their application deadline (my original application was submitted at the beginning of the application period.) They specifically said to limit communications to email, so that was why I did that rather than call. But given the volume of emails I’m sure they were getting, it’s possible that the email was just lost.

    My instinct is to send a second email saying that I turned down the other offer and continue to be interested in this opportunity. Am I right? Is there anything else that I can do or should do? Should I include a second copy of my application materials in the email or is that obnoxious?

    • Ann

      Out of curiosity – what made you turn down the first offer without another offer in-hand?

      • Janie

        It was a very, very, very hard decision. The job turned out to not be exactly what I had in mind when I applied, and while the difference was slight, it was a big deal for me and my long term goals. In the end, I realized that the things I wanted to be doing are still possibilities and I do have a backup that I would be happy with. I took a chance, and it’s very scary in this economy, but I hope it works out for the best.

        • AnonymousFRA

          “…while the difference was slight, it was a big deal for me and my long term goals.”

          This makes sense – thanks for the quick explanation!

        • Ann

          I totally understand what you’re saying. Sounds like you made the right decision for you, which is always important. :)

      • AnonymousFRA

        I’m curious as well.

        I’m not sure that “I have another offer with a deadline” will help much when you are still in the preliminary consideration pile of applications. I think this card only really works if you’ve already made it through a few rounds of interviews and are waiting to hear back as to whether you will be offered the position and legitimately need to know quickly if you got it. But I could be wrong.

        I would not contact them again. And I definitely wouldn’t tell them that you turned down the other offer and continue to be interested because, even if you turning down the other offer had absolutely nothing to do with whether or not you get this job and was strictly for other, non-related reasons, the natural assumption will be that you are telling them you turned down the other offer FOR this job. Which could come across as either presumptuous, or desperate to get their attention.

        • Lawgirl

          I’d ping them with another email (“Hi Recruiting Manager, I’m following up on my earlier email of (date). I’m still very much interested in this opportunity. Hugs & kisses, -Janie”). Meanwhile, I’d be working that “backup gig”: stat!

        • Lola

          AnonymousFRA is exactly right – if they haven’t contacted you about even an interview, the fact that you had another offer and let it go seems presumptuous.

          You’ll just have to sit tight. And if nothing happens with this place, then, well, that’s part of the risk you took.

  5. Very Upset Anon

    Threadjack: Regular reader/commenter here, but am going anonymous because I have a very specific problem and am in major need of advice.

    I’m a May 2010 law school grad who had a hell of a time finding a job. Just recently I accepted a job at a real estate law firm which currently does the vast majority of its work in the foreclosure market. I’m in a state that has had some, *ahem*, problems and questionable practices in its foreclosures business. So much so that the state Attorney General instituted formal investigations against a few firms last year.
    I was very hestitant about getting involved in the foreclosure market, but based on my personal research, talking to a couple former classmates at the firm, and talking to the partners during the interview, I developed the very strong impression that this firm was entirely legitimate.
    An article ran in today’s paper stating that the state’s Attorney General has started some new investigations – including the firm that I’ll be working at. This isn’t yet a formal investigation – the firm (along with a couple others) were sent “letters of inquiry” stating that there have been complaints of “unfair, deceptive, and unconscionable practices” by the firm and asked to turn over various documents (which none of the firms have at this point responded to).
    Needless to say, I am freaking out. I’ve been unemployed for quite a while and I need this job. I was hesitant to get involved in this line of work because I didn’t want to risk having a “foreclosure mill” on my resume. I’m not sure what to do in light of this information and I’m rather upset about it. Am I overreacting to this?
    Any advice as to what I should/how I should I handle this? Try to talk to the higher-ups at the firm to get their side? Just forget about it? Treat this position as temporary and keep looking for work? Jump ship now in case it gets worse?

    • Nonnymous

      To put it in perspecitive, look at the major banks that were doing business with Madoff. If they offered you a job, would you turn them down based on this?

      You have no involvement with teh investigation, you have no idea if it will amount to anything.

      Just chill. You haven’t even started work yet. Maybe it’ll clear up in a week.

    • Calm Down

      It sounds like you are totally overreacting.

      This is going to sound really cynical, but this is what I have lived since Fall 2008. One of my main cases is defending one of the institutions that’s involved in all this economic downturn. Several state AGs have instituted formal investigations against the client – obviously something went very wrong somewhere (or somewheres) in the mortgage industry and it’s the government’s job to figure out what happened and who is to blame because the public expects that SOMEONE is to blame for all of this. And there may very well be someone to blame, but there may not be, which the public wouldn’t like.

      Investigations aren’t actually filing charges. Your state AG is probably doing the same thing the ones I am dealing with are. The complaint/investigation language is standard – it doesn’t necessarily mean that there’s any truth behind it. It just sounds intimidating and looks sexy when the papers pull the publicly accessible complaint. And then the AG looks to the paper’s readers (i.e. voters) like the AG is Doing Something About the Foreclosure Crisis, which helps the AG get re-elected in the future.

      The firm hasn’t responded to document requests because any number of legitimate reasons. Like they negotiated an extension and didn’t see the need to inform you. Like they are consulting with malpractice counsel. Like they are doing real work instead of responding to a random investigation letter. Or, like they are being shady. You are new to practice, new to the firm, and you really don’t know what the reason is. Don’t jump to conclusions.

      It’s also not necessarily a big deal if the state files charges. A public entity filed charges against my client and is going to settle for ultimately peanuts because they don’t have anything. They needed to file suit because it looks good and makes the public think that Something is Being Done, but if I’ve learned anything from this crisis, it’s that “wrong” and “illegal” are two different things, sad to say. Only one of those is the basis for a lawsuit.

      And don’t worry about the paper. One of the things I have noticed in working on this case for the past several years is how slanted all papers are, in one direction or another. Papers need to sell papers, and exciting/dramatic stories sell papers.

      You should do nothing. If you are comfortable with one of the partners at your firm, and they seem like they are in a good mood, you could mention something casually like gosh these articles are really negative and see where that conversation leads. You should not jump ship – as I have tried to explain, these “investigations” may be totally baseless. And obviously, keep your opinions to yourself in real life. Do not discuss any part of your work, even in general terms, with friends or family – people have very strong feelings about this very high profile crisis and you may inadvertently say something that violates confidentiality or privilege as you are being attacked for being part of this machine.

      If it turns out that the investigation leads to a suit with legit claims, well, then you should start looking. If you have personal knowledge that the firm is doing something unethical, find a new job. If you’re just worried about the scaremongering tactics of this AG and the papers, forget it for now.

    • EC

      I would second the commenters counseling you not to to jump ship, since I think it’s a bit premature. Lawyers are often investigated when they have shady clients, but it doesn’t mean the lawyers are shady. It also might not be a firm-wide investigation, but only an investigation of a single lawyer. Is there anyone you can talk with before you start to get some additional clarification?

      But I’d also add that you should be very, very careful about signing documents or making public representations on behalf of your firm at least for the first year you’re there. I have a few friends who went to work for small firms operating in foreclosure or criminal defense areas, and while they got tons of independence, they are also asked to take on responsibility that they were not prepared to assume, and sometimes suspected that this was an intentional move by a partner to separate said partner from a shady task. Don’t sign any document unless you know the case very well and have been involved in the negotiations; don’t appear in court on a case that you don’t know well. And if you notice anything shady once you start, find a new job.

    • Very Upset Anon

      Thanks a bunch for the perspective, everyone – in particular “Calm Down” at 5:24 for sharing your particular experiences. Sometimes, one needs the proverbial smack in the head to be reminded to take a deep breath and keep a little perspective.
      You’re all right in that I don’t know the full story and that it should give it time to develop before I make any decisions. And, more importantly, I don’t know how this will all turn out down the road.

      So…, *deep breath* thanks again!

    • Lyssa

      I completely get why you’re freaking out and (as a 2009 grad who also had a hell of a time with the job market) completely sympathize. That said, I think you’re OK at this point. I would guess that, in the climate you’re describing, as much as there are foreclosure mills, there are “complaint mills”, that is, folks seeing an opportunity to complain and jumping on it, legit or not.

      Just keep your eyes open, and you should be fine.

    • Another Sarah

      I used to work at the state AG’s office. We sent “inquiry” letters all the time. It’s not that it doesn’t mean anything, but look at it this way: They have to check EVERYTHING. If they don’t, and it gets out that they didn’t, they’ll get blasted for not checking EVERYTHING. If the firm is as reputable as it seems, forget about it.

  6. Engaged, but ...

    How does one respond to snide comments that are judgey-compliments-in-disguise?

    I just got engaged. I’m very excited :) The thing is: the ring he bought me is … large. I never hold out my hand and show the ring unprompted, but people ask to see it when they hear I’m engaged and/or it’s eye-catching even when I’m not holding my hand out. I’ve had numerous people, when they look at it, instead of saying “How pretty” or something truly nice, they say “Wow! That’s big!” It’s *not* a compliment. And one coworker came by expressly because she “had to see the big diamond everyone’s talking about.”

    I softly suggested to my fiance when he proposed that maybe we should downgrade, because I did not expect/want this. But that’s a no-go. So I guess I’m destined to be judged as obnoxious and showy. It’s frustrating. How can I graciously respond to non-compliments? I feel very awkward, and since the engagement is new I’m worried I will continue to receive such non-compliments.

    • kz

      1) Congrats!

      2) I’m not sure about this, but maybe you could make it clear it wasn’t your choice. Maybe respond “My fiance picked it out all by himself!” or something like that that seems like it means “doesn’t he have such good taste” (because I’m sure it’s lovely, if large) but also subtly gets in “and I had absolutely no say in this, so don’t judge.”

      • Anonymous

        I agree with congrats. I think just don’t say anything that sounds defensive, because… why should you be defensive? Why should you be depricating? Why be anything but delighted to be marrying the man you love, who so *obviously* loves you.

        Life is full of snarkers. Some passive-aggressive, some jealous, some sweet and well-intentioned but clueless, maybe not self-aware, not raised to think of words impact on others. (“Is that all you’re gonna eat?” “Gee, that must be nice…”) Don’t let em snark on this super duper happy parade. They’re them. Be you. Say something true, eliding their whole deal.

        Something you feel:
        “We’re so happy.”
        “It makes me feel so good knowing he picked it out/designed it thinking of me”
        “I love thinking of our daughter or son inheriting it someday”
        “I feel so lucky every time I see it.”
        “I can’t wait to be his wife”
        etc.

        Enjoy your engagement and your marriage. Enjoy your ring, enjoy eachother.

        • Engaged, but ...

          This does seem like a good tactic. So far, I swear, I’ve said “Thanks … I guess.” And somewhat sarcastically.

      • Anonymous

        I’m the same poster as below. I see the reasoning behind kz’s #2, but I’m going to respectfully say I don’t think it’s a great idea. You’re announcing that you’re going to marry this man, and simultaneously implying “I don’t agree with his choice, but I had no say in it, try not to associate me as a person with this ring that he gave me.” Just seems like an uncomfortable way to launch a married life, and also kind of a vote of no-confidence on the fiance, rather than really explanining to him why the ring is making you uncomfortable, and presenting a united front to the rest of the world.

    • NYC

      Haters gonna hate. It doesn’t sound as though the ring makes you uncomfortable, just the reaction it prompts in other people. You can’t change that (unless you change the ring). You just have to keep your head held high and let them hate. You don’t have to apologize for your ring or explain it. Just say thanks and move on.

      Also, congratulations!

      • Ann

        Agree with the “haters gotta hate” sentiment. That’s what’s going on and it’s not your problem, nor is it your responsibility to fix it. Don’t scapegoat your fiance and say the ring was his idea – after all, if you had been that opposed, you could have refused it and asked for a different one, yes? You like the ring and it was a gift from the heart and it’s fine. If it was me, I would probably say, with a completely straight face, “Thanks so much…he sold a kidney to get it for me, but I think it was worth it, don’t you?” If you can’t make people be nice, you might as well have fun with them.

    • Anonymous

      I think the problem here is that you agree with the non-complimenters: you yourself think the ring is too much. You say that you didn’t “want” it. And you’re supposed to wear it for the rest of your life? Even without these kinds of comments, I don’t think that’s fair to you.

      I’m not sure what “no-go” means regarding the conversation you had with your fiance, but if I were you I would have the conversation again. If you loved the ring and thought it was great, then I’d try to think of something you could say to these people. But you don’t–you’re embarassed by your own engagement ring. Not much of a way to celebrate, IMO. Get a ring you like, and be 100% happy.

      • Anonymous

        I have to agree with this comment, maybe you are reading that into what they say because you believe it. If you are getting married you should be able to have this conversation with your fiance.

      • Engaged, but ...

        So, I gave my fiance a number of options of styles I liked. He managed to choose my absolute favorite … with the bigger stone. So it really is beautiful and exactly what I wanted in other respects. Maybe I just need to get used to it?

        My fiance is very proud to have given me this particular diamond; it makes his eyes shine to talk about it. He is so happy when he looks at it. It hurt me to try to tell him I don’t like it. And, in the end, I decided that it is truly gorgeous, even if not what I expected. I hope to grow into it, so to speak.

        • Bonnie

          Give it some time. It takes a while to get used to wearing something so expensive.

        • Batgirl

          Do you plan to wear it with your wedding band every day? I have some friends who wear their blingy engagement rings on special occasions and their simpler wedding bands on every day occasions. That could be an option.

          • Laura #2

            Agreed. And, there’s nothing saying that you have to keep your ring in its current form forever. I know people who’ve combined their engagement and wedding rings (I think this used to be more popular than it is now) or re-done their rings at a significant anniversary.

            In any case, it sounds like you have a beautiful ring and no reason to feel self-conscious. Congrats on your engagement!

        • UnSub

          First, congratulation and I wish you many, many happy years.

          When we got engaged, the MOMD (man of my dreams) gave me a multi-diamond ring that was once his mom’s. It is a beautiful piece, but was kind of a lot for me at that age and at that time. EVERYONE noticed it – in the supermarket, at the drug store, at work, at the gym, everywhere I went it was a “thing”. I was planning to take it apart and make earrings and a smaller ring, but my mom talked me out of it.

          When we got married, I stopped wearing the ring and just wore my plain gold wedding ring. A couple of years later my mom asked me what I was saving it for and told me to take it out of the safe deposit box and enjoy it. I started wearing it every day and about a month later (okay, maybe it was 3 months) I noticed that no one had asked me about the ring for a while. In fact, *I* barely noticed the ring and I think that was the magic.

          All this to say – give it a couple of months. You’ll get used to it and suddenly no one will notice the ring anymore and happiness will reign. You will grow into it. Good luck.

        • Marie

          Also, please realize, people really only pay attention to your engagement ring right after you get engaged. Mine was not particularly big, but everyone was having a look and trying to estimate the size and what-not when it was new and we were sharing the news. That was 6 years ago, and I don’t think a single person has commented since. It’s a newly engaged thing, once they aren’t focusing on the engagement they probably won’t focus on the ring either.

          • somewherecold

            Exactly. I don’t have a particularly big ring, either, but as soon as people found out I was engaged, their eyes went right to my left hand (made me stop crossing my arms across my chest).

        • Anonymous

          You will grow into it! My ring isn’t very big but it was super shiny when it was brand new. I couldn’t stop looking at it, and neither could anyone else. I do polish it occasionally but with some wear, I think it’s much less blingy and more mine. If it’s uncomfortable to wear or really inappropriate for your lifestyle for some reason, then maybe consider a trade in but give it a little time first.

        • An

          Enjoy it then! People with small diamonds want to trade up. You are lucky o have your face setting with a larger stone. Just enjoy it.

      • kz

        For the sake of argument, I’m going to take the opposite side here: Her fiance picked out the ring for her and obviously he thought it was a good choice and (I’m guessing) was excited about giving it to her. Do you really want to crush his feelings because it’s not exactly what you wanted? “Aw, we’re engaged! But I hate this ring you gave me. Pick another.” Perhaps the ring had some sentimental value to her fiance. Perhaps it was a family heirloom. I can see a lot of reasons for not demanding another ring. Sometimes husbands/boyfriends get gifts we aren’t thrilled about but we wear them anyway because you can tell they were excited to pick them out and give them to you and you don’t want to hurt their feelings by complaining about it. Yes, an engagement ring is a little different because it’s something you wear every day, but I’m sure it’s really a lovely ring and people will get used to it and you’ll be glad you have it. (also, i feel like a large diamond is something you “grow into.” People don’t seem to feel the need to comment about large diamonds on older women, but I’ve definitely heard comments about younger women with large diamonds. Maybe that’s just me.)

        And while I understand the posters who say don’t try to distance yourself from his decision, I don’t think it’s the most horrible thing in the world to do. He’s your fiance, not you. You aren’t going to agree with all his decisions, and I don’t see anything wrong with other people realizing that. You’re individual people who have separate opinions, but you’re getting married, so clearly you agree on a lot of things. Just not diamond size.

        (having said all that, I personally would probably push him to try to get a new ring if I truly wasn’t comfortable with what I had. But I can totally understand not wanting to push the issue and at the same time not wanting to associate yourself with his decision.)

        • Anonymous

          I’m the Anon that this comment is responding to. KZ, now that I’ve seen more of what the OP says I generally agree with what you say here. By my initial reading it sounded like she was truly uncomfortable and felt stuck with this ring, and I was picturing something way over the top. But more details show that isn’t really the case. So yeah, it sounds like a matter of growing into the ring/getting used to wearing it, and dealing with comments as she sees fit.

        • Laura #2

          “People don’t seem to feel the need to comment about large diamonds on older women, but I’ve definitely heard comments about younger women with large diamonds. Maybe that’s just me.”

          Nope, not just you. I’ve heard plenty of those comments as well. I do think older women can get away with more bling-y jewelry than younger women can. Sometimes I think it has to do with the perceived need to “earn” the right to wear certain jewelry–the thought being that a big, clearly expensive ring/necklace/what-have-you rewards the hard work of, say, a 40 year marriage.

          • Dee

            If you’re really young, it can look like it was bought with Mom and Dad’s money. I have to admit that I don’t particularly like big diamonds for aesthetic/ostentatious-related reasons , but I also think that a lot of people use big engagement rings as a “see how much he loves me?/see how big my penis is?” kinda thing. I hate it when girls announce an engagement by holding out or posting photos of a big ring–just cheapens it all.

            Clearly that’s not your deal so it’s a bit unfair b/c people will tend to assume it is when they see it.

    • Ida

      I mean, it is a compliment. I think you are being too sensitive, unless there are other reasons you think you are being judged as obnoxious and showy. You don’t get to pick the exact phrasing of how people compliment. Things people value in a ring are sparkle and size, so if they say it has a positive attribute, its a compliment. I understand feeling awkward, I would too, but they mean it well so just say thank you.

      • Engaged, but ...

        I agree that it could be a compliment, and I wouldn’t always take it personally. But the tone of voice has made quite clear it was not a compliment in a number of cases. And, it’s an awkward compliment to receive even when given sincerely. A response of “Thanks” to “Big!” feels like saying “Glad you appreciate how much money my fiance spent!” Erg.

        • Batgirl

          You could respond to the “big” comments with “well, it’s a bit bigger than I expected–gonna take some getting used to–but I do love it.”

        • RP

          I’d say something like “this ring ain’t the only thing that’s big…” and make a hand gesture like you are indicating the size of a huge penis. Too much?
          ;)

        • Eponine

          Instead of “thanks” I’d say “Fiance has great taste!” and leave it at that.

        • Lola

          Why not just smile when they say “Big!” Or like, “Yeah,” and then a big smile. You don’t need to agree or disagree.

        • balancing act

          People are funny when others get engaged. Those people are jerks, jealous or both. Could you respond with something like “The ring is nice, but I am so excited to spend my life with him!” to change the subject to your engagement versus the ring. Your fiance is clearly pleased that he picked out a design you wanted and upgraded the diamond, so let him enjoy that too. You will absolutely get used to it. My ring looked huge when we got engaged and now I’m all “this old thing?”. I promise you won’t notice it after awhile (unless it’s like 5 carats or something, which it probably isn’t)..

          • AEK

            I love this suggestion to say that you like the ring but are even more excited about getting married.

      • Engaged, but ...

        BTW, love the name Ida. (If it’s your real name rather than a handle,) kudos to your parents.

    • govvie

      Congrats! Wow, there are some “interesting” (tactless) people out there. You could do what I (try to) do when someone does/says something that irritates: smile and slough it off right there, and internally make it into a comic one-liner. Makes for a good chuckle to yourself, at least.

      • somewherecold

        Congratulations!

        I think it is generally weird and tactless when people hear that you are engaged and immediately want to know how big/sparkly/etc. the ring is. Say something to get the focus back on how happy you are to actually be engaged because you are marrying someone wonderful, not because you get to have something shiny.

        Also, I agree with some of the previous commenters that if this ring is actually something you don’t like, you should address that as a separate issue. Does looking at your ring on your finger make you happy? If it’s not what you want, I really think you should bring it up with your fiance again. I have no idea if you can return or exchange a diamond. Maybe you could make the diamond into a necklace if you cannot return the diamond. If you like the setting, maybe you can get a smaller diamond put in the ring in a similar style setting.

    • Arachna

      I’m sorry, you’ve just got to appreciate how gorgeous your ring is and ignore it. I have kind of the opposite issue – no one has ever said anything snide… but not a single person at work gave a single compliment when I showed them the ring (after they requested). Even when we were doing exchange showings (there was a tiny rash of engagements) and I said “it’s beautiful” or “it’s gorgeous” which… I thought was the only appropriate and standard thing to say when you ask to see someone’s ring, no one said a single damn thing ! My ring isn’t small IMO but it’s smaller than lawyers in biglaw in NYC wear. Shrug. I love it, I think it’s perfect. I picked it so I have a slight advantage over you but just think how nice it is that your fiance wanted to get you someone as nice as possible. Also, plenty of people don’t wear engegement rings on a regular basis after the wedding but only the wedding band, that’s always an option.

    • AIMS

      Maybe you are reading too much into this?
      I suppose it depends on how big “big” is & where you work, but honestly I think most people mean it as a compliment & aren’t judging. Or, at least if they are judging, they’re not doing it any more than if you told them you’re honeymooning somewhere fancy or having a wedding at a location X or whatever else.
      I will say that one easy solution is to not wear the ring in situations where you feel judged. I have a friend who works in an agency where she deals with a lot of really poor families; she chooses not to wear her (also rather large) ring to work because she feels uncomfortable doing so. There’s nothing wrong with that if that’s your situation.

    • MHU

      Congratulations! How about saying something like “I wasn’t sure about such an extravagent stone, but my fiancee insisted.” Hopefully, it underlines that your fiancee wanted to do something really nice for you. I got some really good advice on this board once which I’ll repeat now: some people just can’t help themselves. If they weren’t complaining your ring is too big, they’d be complaining that it is too small.

      • Dee

        Yuck, I think that just sounds like you’re bragging or equating your fiance’s love with his buying power.

        • Jay

          Agree….that just continues the conversation in the direction she doesn’t want by highlighting how ostentatious it is.

        • MelD

          Or that the fiance is some sort of control freak who thinks he can buy off his future wife by getting her shiny things. Just saying “Thank you” and moving on doesn’t give people any more fuel for the fire.

    • EC

      First off, *hugs* and congrats! I’ve been there – when my (now) husband and I started talking about getting engaged, I very pointedly told him the maximum carat size I wanted. He ignored my request, and got a much larger diamond that was made to look even larger by the setting (which I had picked out, not realizing how much it would amplify the rock). I resented the ring SO MUCH (I couldn’t put my hand in my pocket and had to switch to wearing mittens when I was wearing the ring), but I knew he was very proud of his choice and that he’d be really upset if I told him I didn’t like it.

      Somehow, as the wedding got close, I found that I didn’t really care anymore. I suspect that my hatred of the engagement ring was actually a manifestation of how nervous I was about planning the wedding? Or maybe the fact that it had a year of patina and grime on it made it not so obviously new, and therefore not so noticeable to everyone? And now that I wear a wedding ring, nobody ever comments on the engagement ring. So hang in there, it will get better.

      My best advice is to make sure that it fits snugly enough that it doesn’t pull itself off your finger (this was a big problem for me), and just learn to ignore the people who make judgmental comments. Also remember that some (many) guys actually consider it a compliment to tell a woman how big her engagement ring is (which is probably why your guy bought the bigger rock in the first place), so enjoy those comments!

    • Eponine

      Just make sure you aren’t a bridezilla in the slightest, don’t talk about your wedding much at work, and maybe when you’re married if it still bothers you, you can wear only your wedding ring and not your engagement ring in the office. Honestly – don’t risk having a fight with your fiance about the very nice ring he bought you just because your coworkers are being jerks. It’s their problem, not yours. Congratulations!

    • Daphne

      I would really just say “thanks!” with a smile and leave it at that. To me personally, any kind of downplaying it with “oh, it’s not what I wanted, but he surprised me,” etc., sounds like false modesty, even if it is actual modesty.

      And if someone blurts out that it’s Big in a way that makes you feel awkward, I’d recommend just smiling and accepting it, and pretending like you don’t notice the undertone.

      (We can also file this one under First World Problems).

    • Bonnie

      On a random note, don’t forget to get a rider on your homeowner’s policy to cover that ring.

    • Engaged, but

      Thank you so much to everyone for the helpful comments. I’m already feeling a lot better about my ability to “grow into” my ring, get used to it, and handle the criticism graciously and without letting it weigh me down. I’m so excited about the engagement, and just sad that the symbol of it was causing me grief. But your advice and encouragement has been helpful. I hope that I can move on and worry about real problems. As this really is so shallow. I’m sort of embarrassed to have been upset. Thanks for understanding.

      • Jade Moon

        One more thing. I also had a large engagement ring, and the issue wasn’t the compliments. The ring itself really bothered me when I was typing, doing chores, etc. It banged against my other fingers even tho the fit was fine. I took it off constantly.

        Past tense. Because I left it somewhere and it got stolen. Now I wear a plain gold band.

        So, see how it works with you. If it’s really uncomfortable, you might want to leave it at home and just wear your wedding band.

    • Alias Terry

      First, congratulations!

      And second, sorry some people with poor social skills are trying to rain on your parade. Please do not let pettiness spoil something incredibly wonderful.

      It is in extreme questionable taste to say something like what you are hearing. That reflects poorly on the people who said it, not you. I suspect major jealously is the culprit.

      Can you respond the the non-compliments with just a deadpan look? Or say something, “It IS nice, isn’t it?” or perhaps simply tell them that you are engaged to a man who loves you very much.

    • Lizadoo

      Give yourself some time to get used to it. It takes a bit. I remember hiding my hand in my pocket in line at the movie theater because I felt like my e-ring was just SO ostentatious. Now, 5+ years later, I still think it’s lovely, but it’s just part of me.

      And whenever I get awkward compliments on the ring, I always just say an effusive “thank you,” and leave it at that.

    • divaliscious11

      Don’t let other people’s issues put a damper on your happiness. All the crap you describe is envy or some other personal issue that is not yours. Show it and say what I do – he loves me a LOT and wants everyone to know it!

      diva with a big rock

  7. NYC

    OK, just a little corporette coffee break chatter…I was at a lunch conference today at a big corporation. I wore a pant suit and most of the other women were in some form of business/biz casual. But there was one woman in four inch patent stiletto booties and a tight black dress that went to her mid-thigh and had a cut out across the chest. The dress had a zipper that went all the way down the back. She looked gorgeous…for a nightclub. I thought to myself, the corporettes will love this!!

    • govvie

      Were Stacy and Clinton in the background, with cameras, ready to pounce? That’s too funny.

      • MM

        I have to admit … I love Clinton and Stacy. That show is oddly addictive. It almost makes me want to develop a schlumpy wardrobe so they will come rescue me with $5000 and lots of compliments about how I’m cute even though I have some extra weight around my tummy.

    • Res Ipsa

      I’ll add another story.
      With wind chill today, it feels like 25F. And yet, I saw two different women today, dressed very nicely for work, skirts, heels, etc., but with bare legs. Eek! i know we can disagree about whether pantyhose is in/out/mandatory, but for goodness sake, wear some tights! I felt cold just looking at their poor legs!

      • alhambra

        this shocks me too. I wear skirts unless it gets below 15 degrees, but I’m wearing my woolly tights and I’m STILL freezing. I don’t know what these girls are thinking.

        • Bonnie

          One of my co-workers did the same thing but then I realized that she drives to work and parks in our building so she’s never outside.

          • AIMS

            I really think bare legs in cold climates in cold weather looks incredibly silly. But I do wear skirts a lot in winter, no matter how cold. I usually wear thick tights & I wear very warm knee high boots on the commute. This feels warmer to me than pants most times. Just another perspective.

        • Nonny

          Me too. I *need* woolly tights at least through March, and I don’t even live in a particularly cold region (just a wet one).

      • coco

        Haha, I am also in shock every time I see bare legs in the winter. It makes me cold just thinking about it, and they generally look miserable as well. Maybe if they looked happy and not frozen…

      • Alias Terry

        What about sleeveless tops in the dead of winter? That also strikes me as odd but I see it all the time. Ditto with sweaters for winter paired with sandals.

        • Lynnet

          I think the sleeveless tops is different because they can be easily covered with a coat/sweater when you go outside. While I suppose people could cover their bare legs with snow pants, but it’s less likely.

        • MelD

          My building has offices with wall-to-wall windows that are freezing in the morning and sweltering when the sun is going down- so I can see wanting a sleeveless shirt for afternoon wear under a blazer or cardigan. There are lots of people who just have hot feet. I am in FL and know many women who will only wear closed toe shoes if it is cold and rainy out.

  8. kng

    I just wanted to throw out a public service announcement for my love of yummie tummie layering tees. I’m always on the verge of suggesting them to posters, but I usually read the threads late and I don’t anyone ever sees them once a new post is up.
    I wear them under sweaters (another suggestion to the poster from earlier today) and shift dresses to add sleeves, length, etc. and they are super slimming and add no bulk. i have 2 in black – v neck short sleeves and v neck long sleeves and I have been wearing them constantly for 3 winters now (and still going strong). they launder super well too

    • eaopm3

      On the opposite end, I have one and don’t like it at all. It does not agree with my shape (smaller waist, wider hips, a little tummy pooch, small chested). It just never stays in place. It crawls up throughout the day and I cannot get comfortable. FWIW, I think that women who are built a little straighter through the middle than I am or who have a larger bust might have better luck.

  9. Mountain Girl

    Another threadjack: I need to update my phone and spent some time this afternoon in the shop trying out various phones. I have been using a BB so that has a keypad and the touch screen is new to me. I was having an exceptionally difficult time typing with my fingernails. They aren’t super long by any means and I realize that you can’t use the nail as a stylus but I was just really struggling to get anything other than gibberish typed. Will I adapt or should I just update my Blackberry?

    • BB user

      Get a Blackberry Torch. It has a touch screen and a slide-out keypad, so while you’re adjusting to the touch screen, you’ll still have the keypad option. Plus it’s a Blackberry, so you’re already familiar with how it works.

    • AIMS

      I think you’ll adapt unless you have very long nails. I adapted to my iphone very quick. You just have to slightly alter the angle at which your fingertips hit the screen. Now “regular” keypads bug me!
      FYI: you have 14 days to return any phone/rescind any contract so if you still hate it after you buy it, just return (but please double check that this is the case first! I know it always has been for me with TMobile, Sprint & AT&T but def check!)

      • somewherecold

        I think Verizon is 30 days, but you have to pay a restocking fee (maybe $35). I have a Droid Incredible (switched from a bberry) and it didn’t take too long to get used to. I found that having feedback when I type makes it a lot easier–the phone vibrates a little when I type each letter. I think I type differently on the Droid than I did on my bberry, but I also use it way more, because I find it much more user-friendly than the bberry I had. Definitely try something and return it if you don’t like it in the allowed time…much better than being stuck for 2 years, or however long until you can upgrade.

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